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   Daz 3D Licenses for Games | F95zone
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Which licenses should I buy to use it in a game?

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Which licenses should I buy to use it in a game?

I know that the folks from Lessons of Passion use Daz, but I'm not sure if they pay any money for the license of the assets. Can anyone explain..." property="og:description"/>
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Which licenses should I buy to use it in a game?

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              Daz 3D Licenses for Games
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                     Hi everyone, so I'm looking into creating my own adult game and I'm curious about Daz's Licenses.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Which licenses should I buy to use it in a game?
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I know that the folks from Lessons of Passion use Daz, but I'm not sure if they pay any money for the license of the assets. Can anyone explain this to me?
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Also, I would post my game here and on Patreon.
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                     you only buy the license if you are making a realtime 3d game and you would have to put those assets into the game files themselves. if you're just making an RPGmaker or Visual novel and are just going to use renders you don't need a license.
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                     I see. I read something about a game license. That was replaced by that Interactive License, right?
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                     So, if I make a game with "pictures" rendered from Daz3D I don't need to pay for a license? Even if I use a game engine like Unity or Unreal for that?
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                     you don't need a license if you're just using renders.  regardless of engine.
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                     I'm just getting started with playing with DAZ3D so I'm no expert, but I think I see some misinformation in this thread. You need to buy a license to use any asset in a game you are releasing to the public. If you are releasing a real time 3D game were the assets have to be included in the game so your engine can create images on the fly, there is a different more expensive license you need to buy.
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                     No.
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                     <br/>
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.daz3d.com/interactive-license-info" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      https://www.daz3d.com/interactive-license-info
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                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Technicallly when you purchase the assets, you're paying for the standard license.  And of course downloading them off f95 is piracy and therefore you haven't paid that, so you "shouldn't" sell a game made with said downloads. But there is no other license to use renders.  Just the interactive license for when the assets are bundled up in the game files where someone could go in and rip them out.
                     <br/>
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                     So you don't need any extra license if you're selling a game with just renders, a comic or an animated video.
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                     You guys are talking about paid assets. But, does the same applies for free assets? Like Daz Originals?
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="OhWee · Apr 25, 2018 at 4:33 AM" data-lb-id="post-689274">
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                     I'll go ahead and share the long form on this issue:
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     The interactive licenses were the result of a bunch of people asking for them.  A fair number of people were asking about using the actual daz 3d model meshes  in games (unreal engine, etc.), and the deal was that you had to contact the content creator individually (on the side), but for the products that Daz owned exclusively, you had permission.  This was confusing for people.  People didn't understand why there wasn't a licensing regime that was easier to use, hence the 'standard interactive license' addon thing was finally hammered out.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Among other things, it had been pointed out that a couple of other places on the net sold you 'full rights' to use the product, and Daz was a bit behind the times...
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     So it was a long time coming
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     ---
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     These licenses do NOT apply to people that are selling 2d representations of the characters they own.  Most assets bought on Daz and a couple of other places are intended for this purpose.  Example, making a book cover for a novel or comic (this certainly has been allowed since I started using Daz/started reading about this issue), and this 'usage right' has been reiterated several times by the mods at the Daz forum.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     On a related note, there was a question as to whether you could generate a 3d model (using a 3d printer) using a Daz asset.  As I remember, this shook out that as long as you printed it just for yourself on your own equipment that you were 'ok' but if you offered the physical 3d model for resale, this crossed into licensing territory.  I think, but really don't know if the interactive license also covers this situation (haven't checked, this hasn't been an issue for me as I haven't tried printing any 3d models yet/don't own a 3d printer), but it's been a nagging issue as well.  Note that Daz now has an addon product that facilitates the creation of printed 3d models.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     So short form, any 2d art/2d representation that you generate using all/almost all purchased Daz assets is fine/no additional license required, but any usage of the 3d model itself inside a game (say unreal engine), etc. is crossing over into extended licensing territory.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     NOTE THAT some freebies (from Renderosity, ShareCG, etc.) have their own usage rights spelled out.  Some are fine for personal use, others allow commercial or unlimited use, so if you are concerned about such things, definitely check the usage rights of any such freebies that you download.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     And, of course, any so called 'free downloads' that you may find on the various bucaneer forums/download sites... well if it's for sale somewhere, and you didn't buy it, well you are already in trouble on the usage front if it comes into question.
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                     you should get your info Stickied, as its something that will be asked over again...
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                     If i can give you advice
                     <a class="username" data-user-id="323924" data-username="@GeneralZero" data-xf-init="member-tooltip" href="https://f95zone.to/members/323924/">
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                     then create a brand for youself so long. Create a Patreon page, Twitter, Discord account etc.. even though you have nothing to show. Get the word out so long. THAT IS IF YOU ARE SERIOUS about creating a game.
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                     IF it's just fiddling around then do not worry.
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="Rich · Apr 25, 2018 at 11:08 PM" data-lb-id="post-691123">
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                     - A minor correction, not that it really matters.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     "Back when," there was a Daz Game Developer License.  If you were going to embed meshes, etc., of Daz Originals in your Unity/Unreal/whatever, you needed to buy that - the rights to embed didn't come along with the asset itself.  But that was a one-time purchase - if you had bought the game developer license, you could embed any Daz Original item.  Some of the other PA's also offered similar "buy it once and you're good" Game Developer Licenses in parallel.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     This has since been scrapped and replaced by the asset-by-asset "Interactive License."  So now, to (legally) embed an item, you need the Interactive License for each individual item that you embed, as you correctly stated.  One of Daz's comments was that "well, if you only want to embed one item, this is cheaper for developers."  True, but for the vast majority of people I've heard comment, it ended up being more expensive.  (Why is this not surprising? LOL)  Fortunately, Daz grandfathered all the people who bought the older license.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     But, as you also correctly stated, any
                     <u>
                      <b>
                       <i>
                        2D
                       </i>
                      </b>
                     </u>
                     representation made from assets purchased on the Daz store are legal for any use.  That includes animations that give the appearance of 3D motion, but are composed solely of 2D images.  (There are one or two exceptions associated with
                     <u>
                      really
                     </u>
                     old assets, but those assets clearly state that on their pages.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     As you also correctly stated, this concept doesn't automatically transfer to assets purchased on other stores - you have to review their license terms individually.
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="OhWee · Apr 25, 2018 at 11:22 PM" data-lb-id="post-691147">
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                        Rich said:
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                        - A minor correction, not that it really matters.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        "Back when," there was a Daz Game Developer License.  If you were going to embed meshes, etc., of Daz Originals in your Unity/Unreal/whatever, you needed to buy that - the rights to embed didn't come along with the asset itself.  But that was a one-time purchase - if you had bought the game developer license, you could embed any Daz Original item.  Some of the other PA's also offered similar "buy it once and you're good" Game Developer Licenses in parallel.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        This has since been scrapped and replaced by the asset-by-asset "Interactive License."  So now, to (legally) embed an item, you need the Interactive License for each individual item that you embed, as you correctly stated.  One of Daz's comments was that "well, if you only want to embed one item, this is cheaper for developers."  True, but for the vast majority of people I've heard comment, it ended up being more expensive.  (Why is this not surprising? LOL)  Fortunately, Daz grandfathered all the people who bought the older license.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        But, as you also correctly stated, any
                        <u>
                         <b>
                          <i>
                           2D
                          </i>
                         </b>
                        </u>
                        representation made from assets purchased on the Daz store are legal for any use.  That includes animations that give the appearance of 3D motion, but are composed solely of 2D images.  (There are one or two exceptions associated with
                        <u>
                         really
                        </u>
                        old assets, but those assets clearly state that on their pages.)
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        As you also correctly stated, this concept doesn't automatically transfer to assets purchased on other stores - you have to review their license terms individually.
                       </div>
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                     </blockquote>
                     Thanks Rich, it's an important clarification on the history.  I'm newer to Daz, so I hit this issue mid-stream.  I was just paraphrasing the various disucssions over the last year as I remembered them from memory, and didn't remember all the details r.e. why Daz Originals were included but not other products.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Thank you very much for the additional clarification.  Of course, as has been pointed out a few times in this thread, the licensing regime has changed to include the interactive licenses for the PA's that choose to offer them now.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     And  (to reiterate), as far as the question at hand is concerned (as you point out), we've covered that.  2D renders are fine/do not require additional licensing if bought from the Daz store and a couple of other places.  Of course, products that you may find elsewhere may have their own licensing terms (personal use only, etc.) so (as has been pointed out a few times) it's good to check the readmes on any freebies you may find.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Again, thanks for sharing that additional clarification, Rich!
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="Rich · Apr 26, 2018 at 6:10 AM" data-lb-id="post-692211">
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                        didn't remember all the details r.e. why Daz Originals were included but not other products.
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                     That one's really simple - just a question of who owns the rights.  Daz could provide the license for theirs, but other vendors might or might now.  The PA's retain the copyright to the assets, even if sold thru the Daz store.  In fact, there have been several PA's who've pulled their products off Daz's store and headed elsewhere.  Daz is just acting as a middleman for them.
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                        Of course, as has been pointed out a few times in this thread, the licensing regime has changed to include the interactive licenses for the PA's that choose to offer them now.
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                     There were actually a few PA's that offered game licenses previously - they were kind of "rogue products."  My take on this (and it's just a guess) is that Daz decided to make it easier for PA's to offer an interactive license at the time they decided to take the new product-by-product route.  I'm betting it's a checkbox for the PA when they submit the product to Daz - "do you want to offer an interactive license, and if so, for how much?"
                     <br/>
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                     Again, it's just a guess, but if you go back some years, the game engines really couldn't easily cope with models as detailed as the Daz ones (even Genesis or M4/V4).  With the increased power of machines and the engines, this is something that's probably only really reached the consciousness of Daz and the PA community over the past year or two.
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                        If i can give you advice
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                        then create a brand for youself so long. Create a Patreon page, Twitter, Discord account etc.. even though you have nothing to show. Get the word out so long. THAT IS IF YOU ARE SERIOUS about creating a game.
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                        IF it's just fiddling around then do not worry.
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                     Thank you for the advice. I definitely will. And I'm serious about it. I just haven't figured a name for my account and the game is still early in development. But, once the name is chosen I'll definitely create a Patreon Page, Twitter and Discord account. Also a Thread here with the game for people to critic the shit out of it and allow me to improve the game!! LOL
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                     What i've done is asked a few guys on here that i trust to review what i have so far and it's been very good responses. They gave me good idea's on how to improve certain scenes but overall they were impressed. Advice can either brake you or make you. So always be prepared for the worst and if it's the worst then decide what you going to do about it. Fall flat and give up or carry on.
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                     ABOVE ALL, if do not have fun making the game then you are going to hate doing it later on...
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                        Thank you for the advice. I definitely will. And I'm serious about it. I just haven't figured a name for my account and the game is still early in development. But, once the name is chosen I'll definitely create a Patreon Page, Twitter and Discord account. Also a Thread here with the game for people to critic the shit out of it and allow me to improve the game!! LOL
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                     I'm sorry if I'm not understanding this, but this whole standard license issue vs what I see en masse being produced by enthusiastic aspiring game creators every day just doesn't seem to add up to me.
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                     If I understand this correctly, RenPy VN games using prerendered DazStudio still images using premade assets from the DAZ3D Store require the game dev to purchase at least the standard license for every single asset he ends up using in the final product, right? Is every dev like that, who's asking for donations on Patreon seriously buying every single asset he uses, even the cheaper standard license ones just for the renders?
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                     That must cost hundreds if not thousands of dollars just to get started on a simple home setting game judging by the prices in the DAZ store and I'm thinking of way crazier ideas that would cost way more. Just a single figure with a few clothes and accessories seem to be on an average $10 for older submissions. The new ones over $100.
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                     What's the precedent on the asset creators taking legal action over this kind of use? Have there been examples of asset providers suing pirate VN makers?
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                     I want to make a game too but doing it fully legally just seems way too expensive to be worth it, if I only wanted to use already existing assets. And eventually I'd buy most of the stuff I end up using in the actual final product (although I might pirate hundreds of other stuff that would never make it in the final product just to see what's available).
                     <br/>
                     This seems like such an inefficient system if all the legal claims and copyrights on the DAZ store are at all enforced. I'm guessing that in reality they're not enforced considering the sheer amount of startup projects I see, but I'm such an eternal pessimist that this really makes me want to just forget about my ambitions of making games and stick to my soul crushing dayjob. I'm afraid that I'd be the first one to be made an example of for this. Being forced to pay thousands of dollars worth of stuff before my project could take off would ruin me.
                     <br/>
                     I would only be able to pay for them if I could use and (semi-)monetize them for free first through donations.
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                     Or is it only possible because these game are mostly monetised through Patreon and not through direct sales?
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                        spjjipsinsfn said:
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                        I'm sorry if I'm not understanding this, but this whole standard license issue vs what I see en masse being produced by enthusiastic aspiring game creators every day just doesn't seem to add up to me.
                        <br/>
                        If I understand this correctly, RenPy VN games using prerendered DazStudio still images using premade assets from the DAZ3D Store require the game dev to purchase at least the standard license for every single asset he ends up using in the final product, right? Is every dev like that, who's asking for donations on Patreon seriously buying every single asset he uses, even the cheaper standard license ones just for the renders?
                        <br/>
                        That must cost hundreds if not thousands of dollars just to get started on a simple home setting game judging by the prices in the DAZ store and I'm thinking of way crazier ideas that would cost way more. Just a single figure with a few clothes and accessories seem to be on an average $10 for older submissions. The new ones over $100.
                        <br/>
                        What's the precedent on the asset creators taking legal action over this kind of use? Have there been examples of asset providers suing pirate VN makers?
                        <br/>
                        I want to make a game too but doing it fully legally just seems way too expensive to be worth it, if I only wanted to use already existing assets. And eventually I'd buy most of the stuff I end up using in the actual final product (although I might pirate hundreds of other stuff that would never make it in the final product just to see what's available).
                        <br/>
                        This seems like such an inefficient system if all the legal claims and copyrights on the DAZ store are at all enforced. I'm guessing that in reality they're not enforced considering the sheer amount of startup projects I see, but I'm such an eternal pessimist that this really makes me want to just forget about my ambitions of making games and stick to my soul crushing dayjob. I'm afraid that I'd be the first one to be made an example of for this. Being forced to pay thousands of dollars worth of stuff before my project could take off would ruin me.
                        <br/>
                        I would only be able to pay for them if I could use and (semi-)monetize them for free first through donations.
                        <br/>
                        Or is it only possible because these game are mostly monetised through Patreon and not through direct sales?
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                     I'll take another stab at this.  Feel free to bring more clarity to any points I may gloss over, F95 collectrive!
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     OK, so the interactive licenses are for using the 3D model meshes themselves inside of a game engine, etc., NOT for 2D renders that you generate using Daz Studio (and a few other rendering engines as I understand, say Octane).  As an example, porting a Daz model into Unreal Engine would require an interactive license, but just rendering a pic of said model does not.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     <i>
                      <span style="font-size: 12px">
                       3D printing also falls under this category, as you are exporting the mesh itself from Daz, but there are product solutions that address this.  So if you want to say print out that sexy gal as a resin model, and paint her, yeah that's a different thing.  I've read where doing such 3d printing just for yourself is fine, but if you go to sell those figures, yeah that's additional licensing territory, not sure what the TOS says on that.  I'm also not sure where the 3D printing solutions offered by Daz fall on the 'sell printed 3D model commercially' issue, so I won't say either way.
                      </span>
                     </i>
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     So you can make and use as many 2D renders as you want, and you don't need additional licensing for those, at least with assets purchased from Daz3D and a few similar vendors/stores.  The licensing requirements may be different for other vendors/stores, but yeah Renderosity paid assets usually have similar 'usage' rights as Daz assets.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     NOW, for freebies that you may find on Renderosity and ShareCG, THOSE have a different usage rights structure.  Some allow unlimited use, others allow personal use only (so no commercial usage), and a number fall in between here.  The 'unlimited' usage is mainly for people looking to redistribute the models themselves in some fashion, so this doesn't apply to most 'game designers' that are using 2 dimensional renders that they made in Daz.  'Commercial usage OK' or 'Unlimited' is what you'd be looking for to use said freebies.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     What may be confusing you is that you'll see a number of people here mentioning the need to buy the assets themselves (through the Daz store), once they are ready to release their game.  I.E. not use pirated assets in their commercially released game.  But that's a separate issue.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
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                      <u>
                       <b>
                        So again, for stuff bought from Daz3D and similar vendors with similar usage rights, You can use the 2D renders that you generate in Daz Studio all day long in Renpy games etc., as well as sell said 2D renders if that's your thing.    No additional
                       </b>
                      </u>
                      <u>
                       <b>
                        '3D Interactive License' is needed for this.
                       </b>
                      </u>
                     </span>
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     <i>
                      It's only if you are exporting the actual 3D model into a game engine that you'll need to worry.  Renpy and similar VN engines do not have this capability in the first place, as they mainly just display pictures and animated pics.
                     </i>
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     <i>
                      So for most (all?) Renpy and RPG Maker games, yeah no 3D model meshes are being used in the Renpy engine currently (just 2D sprites/pics).  Hence, no need for a '3D interactive license'.
                     </i>
                     <br/>
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                        Animated pics are essentially a bunch of 2D renders back to back.   Hence, a series of 2D images that produce a 'moving image' is also allowed under 'standard' Daz usage rights.
                       </b>
                      </u>
                     </span>
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     <i>
                      This is different from using the actual character model ingame where you can change their pose interactively in said game.    Say importing a character into Neverwinter Nights (I'm sure there's SOME way to get a Daz model into Neverwinter, with a lot of work and a few conversions...).
                     </i>
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                     Hope this helps!
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                        Hope this helps!
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                     I appreciate that you took the time for his, but no, it didn't help.
                     <br/>
                     When I look at an entry in the DAZ3d Store there are mostly two different purchase tiers: Standard license and Interactive license. No matter how much I read the definitions on their site, it seems like that even for 2D renders I'd still need to purchase the actual rights in order to monetise it. At least that's how I interpret it. I could be completely wrong but that's what their legal definitions make it seem like.
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                     No, for 2D renders (unless the TOS has changed in the last few weeks, upon which I'm sure there'd be a shitstorm on the Daz3D forum if it had), you do NOT need 3D interactive licenses.  People have been operating under those terms for years now, and selling their 2D renders and using them in Renpy games, etc. with no issue.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     The 3D interactive licenses were added to the Daz store within the last year or so, and didn't exist before then.  Before that time for individual PA's (Paid Artists, as Daz calls them, they are the ones making the models), you had to contact each PA separately to get permission to use their models inside of a 3D game engine.  Which was a bit of a pain.  Hence, the 3D interactive license regime was eventually worked out.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     But as for two dimensional renders/works:
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     From the current
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.daz3d.com/eula" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      EULA
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                     :
                     <br/>
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                        Terms of Use. Two Dimensional Works. Subject to the terms and conditions of this Agreement, User may (i) access, use, copy and modify the Content in the creation and presentation of two-dimensional animations and renderings, (ii) incorporate two dimensional images (including two dimensional images that simulate motion of three dimensional objects) derived by User from the Content in User’s other works, and (iii) publish, market, distribute, transfer, sell or sublicense User’s two-dimensional animations, renderings and other works; provided that User may not in any case publish, market, distribute, transfer, sell or sublicense any renderings, animations, software applications, data or any other product from which any Content, or any part thereof, or any substantially similar version of the Content can be separately exported, extracted or de-compiled into any re-distributable form or format.
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                     Note the emphasis on Two Dimensional Works.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     What may be confusing you is the last line, which essentially says 'if someone exports, extracts, or de-compiles and the the actual 3D model into another program, and redistributes said model, yeah that's not allowed'.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     But, if you still aren't clear on this, yeah there's the Daz3D forum for that.  Also, you can contact Daz customer service.
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                        Note the emphasis on Two Dimensional Works.
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                     I'm so sorry for not explaining it better. I didn't mean the Interactive License but the Standard License. It's still illegal to obtain and use the files even for 2D renders if you don't buy the Standard License for them if I understand correctly.
                     <br/>
                     Even paying for the Standard License would be hundreds of dollars in a simple game.
                     <br/>
                     I'd like to buy that, but I can't afford that. Not before my potential future project is successful already.
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                     So my original post was wondering if devs all use free assets or is everybody just risking it?
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                        But, if you still aren't clear on this, yeah there's the Daz3D forum for that. Also, you can contact Daz customer service.
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                     Oh God, no. That'd be pretty much ratting on every VN dev if I happened to be correct on this and DAZ didn't realise. I don't want to get them in trouble. I like these games and I want to make my own.
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                     OK, I understand your confusion now!
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                     The Daz 'Standard License' is for using the 3D model meshes that Daz3D owns outside of DS, as opposed to the PA products that are being sold through Daz.  Yeah I know this is a bit confusing, but if it's a Daz Original, that usually means Daz owns it/has purchased the model rights from the relevant PA.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Before the 3D interactive license, yeah the 'Standard License' has been around for a while now, for the same reason that the 3D interactive license now exists.  It only covered content actually owned by Daz3D, though.  It's also intended for the use of the actual 3D models outside of the Daz rendering environment.  2D renders are still allowed under the standard EULA (which is free, and which you agree to when you install Daz).
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     At least, that's how I understand these, based on reading multiple Daz forum posts that were asking about them.
                     <a class="username" data-user-id="83870" data-username="@Rich" data-xf-init="member-tooltip" href="https://f95zone.to/members/83870/">
                      @Rich
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                     has been using Daz longer than I have, maybe he can weigh in here.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I know that forum posts aren't legally binding (well unless you can convince a court of law, that is), but there's a number of threads similar to the two I'm linking here where visual novels are mentioned.  Chohole and Chris Palermo are on the Daz payroll, at least that's my understanding from many many posts that they've made.
                     <br/>
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                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/2841061/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
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                        The Daz 'Standard License' is for using the 3D model meshes that Daz3D owns outside of DS, as opposed to the PA products that are being sold through Daz.
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                     So as long as I only "pirate" stuff that's also in the DAZ store and I only make 2D renders of them in Daz Studio/Iray, then it's prefectly legal to go nuts and "pirate" everything that I can possibly get my hands on?
                     <br/>
                     Neat. You helped a lot. Thank yo very much for your time
                     <br/>
                     Now I'll study the EUAs of other legal content provider sites to see the difference.
                     <br/>
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                     And I really mean that I'd eventually buy the models, I just couldn't get started with that right away and I need to be successful first, which isn't very likely looking at the sheer amount of failed content.
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                        So as long as I only "pirate" stuff that's also in the DAZ store and I only make 2D renders of them in Daz Studio/Iray, then it's prefectly legal to go nuts and "pirate" everything that I can possibly get my hands on?
                        <br/>
                        Neat. You helped a lot. Thank yo very much for your time
                        <br/>
                        Now I'll study the EUAs of other legal content provider sites to see the difference.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        And I really mean that I'd eventually buy the models, I just couldn't get started with that right away and I need to be successful first, which isn't very likely looking at the sheer amount of failed content.
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                     Yeah, pirating assets is a completely different issue, which has been discussed in other threads.  Using assets that you didn't acquire legally is by definition illegal (even for 2D renders), but the question is, will anyone notice, and if so, will they bother to hunt you down?
                     <br/>
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                     Which is why I shop at the Daz store, a LOT, just because.  But that's a call you'll have to make for yourself.  And, this being a bucaneer forum and all...
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                        Yeah, pirating assets is a completely different issue, which has been discussed in other threads.  Using assets that you didn't acquire legally is by definition illegal (even for 2D renders), but the question is, will anyone notice, and if so, will they bother to hunt you down?
                        <br/>
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                        Which is why I shop at the Daz store, a LOT, just because.  But that's a call you'll have to make for yourself.  And, this being a bucaneer forum and all...
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                     Sure, but then we get back to my original point. Is there a precedent of that? Has anybody ever actually gotten involved in a legal case over this? I just play these games, I don't follow the drama much, but I do know that Patreon would shut my page down at the first sign of even the slightest legal wrangling just to stay out of it.
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                        Sure, but then we get back to my original point. Is there a precedent of that? Has anybody ever actually gotten involved in a legal case over this? I just play these games, I don't follow the drama much, but I do know that Patreon would shut my page down at the first sign of even the slightest legal wrangling just to stay out of it.
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                     Well, as far as 3D assets redistribution sites (not mentioning names here), well those do occasionally disappear thanks to DMCA takedown requests and such.  As for 'individual' examples, I've not seen any specific examples mentioned personally, so I can't cite any specific examples for you.  Maybe others can cite an example.
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                     So it's a judgement call on your part.  I.E. a rather similar situation to acquiring music via other means...
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                     I'm pretty new to the DAZ thing and am not working on any game, just doing it for fun. I have a PC+ membership and have bought many assets but most of what I have is dl'd from either F95 or one of the other pirate sites. If I was ever to make a game I would definitely purchase any asset I used, even if I had been using it for free. Certainly many developers feel the same way because they often complain about how much the assets are costing them. But does everyone? I'm pretty sure there are some devs using some of their assets for free. The DAZ Studio software itself doesn't know the difference and most of the porn games here on F95 are so small time that they wouldn't even be in the radar of DAZ Productions.
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                     So I doubt there would be any concerns if you are just getting started. And when you do get around to actually paying for anything, never pay full price. There is always a sale, and I rarely buy anything without at least a 70% discount.
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                        So it's a judgement call on your part.  I.E. a rather similar situation to acquiring music via other means...
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                     I see. You helped a lot. Thank you very much for taking the time.
                     <br/>
                     I'll just risk it then. From what I can tell the worst case scenario of getting caught is that Patreon kicks me out and I have to abandon the project and then DAZ would probably stop caring. That's not too bad I guess.
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                        The DAZ Studio software itself doesn't know the difference and most of the porn games here on F95 are so small time that they wouldn't even be in the radar of DAZ Productions.
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                     Even though DAZ obviously has all the tools to stop my production long before I even launch the project, the final renders themselves are still recognisable. If the creator of an asset sees the game, recognises their product and checks up on if I bought the license for it or not, that creator would have a legitimate case against me.
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                        Even though DAZ obviously has all the tools to stop my production long before I even launch the project, the final renders themselves are still recognisable. If the creator of an asset sees the game, recognises their product and checks up on if I bought the license for it or not, that creator would have a legitimate case against me.
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                     In practice, I suspect that this would be difficult.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     FYI, according to forum posts by several of the Daz PA's, they don't get a list of the people who have purchased their products, only a count of the total number of purchases.  (I have no idea how other sites like Renderosity work.)  I suppose that if there was a legal issue involved, that information could be pulled, but I suspect that there'd have to be a reason for Daz to do it.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     In addition, connecting a Daz login (i.e. email) to a Patreon site would be problematic, since the Patreon site owner's email isn't exposed.  Even then, the Patreon site owner may not be the one who actually did the renders, since there could be a team involved, a third party from whom the renders were commissioned, etc.  So connecting those dots would also be difficult.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Finally, with the exception of "Daz Originals," Daz isn't the owner of the content - the PA is.  For most of them, Daz is just a broker, and thus it has little or no reason (or standing) to pursue possible pirates on behalf of the PA's.  Thus, the costs of any of this kind of work would have to come out of the PA's pocket.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I'm not advocating piracy - far from it.  But, to be brutally frank, the chance of legal action against a small team or single person is pretty low, since the costs are high, the challenges many, and the chance of recovering anything is small.  This is probably why you haven't heard about any examples.  I suppose that if a page was raking in thousands a month based on some
                     <u>
                      very
                     </u>
                     recognizable content an inquiry might be made, but I doubt that you'd see lawyers queuing up to take a case like that...
                     <br/>
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                     Just my opinion, of course.
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="spjjipsinsfn · Nov 26, 2018 at 10:33 PM" data-lb-id="post-1320082">
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                        In practice, I suspect that this would be difficult.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        FYI, according to forum posts by several of the Daz PA's, they don't get a list of the people who have purchased their products, only a count of the total number of purchases.  (I have no idea how other sites like Renderosity work.)  I suppose that if there was a legal issue involved, that information could be pulled, but I suspect that there'd have to be a reason for Daz to do it.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        In addition, connecting a Daz login (i.e. email) to a Patreon site would be problematic, since the Patreon site owner's email isn't exposed.  Even then, the Patreon site owner may not be the one who actually did the renders, since there could be a team involved, a third party from whom the renders were commissioned, etc.  So connecting those dots would also be difficult.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        Finally, with the exception of "Daz Originals," Daz isn't the owner of the content - the PA is.  For most of them, Daz is just a broker, and thus it has little or no reason (or standing) to pursue possible pirates on behalf of the PA's.  Thus, the costs of any of this kind of work would have to come out of the PA's pocket.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        I'm not advocating piracy - far from it.  But, to be brutally frank, the chance of legal action against a small team or single person is pretty low, since the costs are high, the challenges many, and the chance of recovering anything is small.  This is probably why you haven't heard about any examples.  I suppose that if a page was raking in thousands a month based on some
                        <u>
                         very
                        </u>
                        recognizable content an inquiry might be made, but I doubt that you'd see lawyers queuing up to take a case like that...
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        Just my opinion, of course.
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                     Thank you for the reply.
                     <br/>
                     Those are all very reasonable points, but in theory if a PA wanted to complain to Patreon, Patreon would first freeze my account and most likely just delete my account after checking on the PA's claims. Afaik they try to avoid any sort of petty legal processes like this and just kick people out if anything even remotely like this comes up because it's not worth it for Patreon to get invovled in stuff like this. In practice this is much stricter than the actual law and the legal process. It pretty much only takes a legitimate complaint and I'd be out of business. So pirate projects seem to be pretty vulnerable to me.
                     <br/>
                     But obviously by the time I'd be raking in hundreds a month I'd definitely get around to buying everything I use. It's just intimidating that I have to operate illegally to even get started. If you think of it as a business then it's pretty crazy.
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                        in theory if a PA wanted to complain to Patreon, Patreon would first freeze my account and most likely just delete my account after checking on the PA's claims. Afaik they try to avoid any sort of petty legal processes like this and just kick people out if anything even remotely like this comes up because it's not worth it for Patreon to get invovled in stuff like this.
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                     You're correct that Patreon could act this way if they chose to.  In theory, the burden of proof would be on the PA to show that you were using the content illegally.  In practice, it's not out of the realm of possibility that Patreon would just cave.
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                        In practice this is much stricter than the actual law and the legal process. It pretty much only takes a legitimate complaint and I'd be out of business. So pirate projects seem to be pretty vulnerable to me.
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                     No argument.  It would come down to what Patreon considered a "legitimate complaint."
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                        But obviously by the time I'd be raking in hundreds a month I'd definitely get around to buying everything I use. It's just intimidating that I have to operate illegally to even get started. If you think of it as a business then it's pretty crazy.
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                     Well, most "normal" businesses require a significant up-front capital outlay to get going, and this is one of the challenges for someone who's thinking of starting one.  So, this isn't (conceptually) that much different from, for example, opening a bakery.  The main difference is that the assets in question are intangible, and thus much easier to use without having paid for them.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I'm not saying there isn't a risk of this happening.  I was just opining that the chances of it happening are low, and the exposure if it did is also low.  Clearly, if one is profiting by using assets created by others, the ethical thing to do is to purchase them, not pirate them.
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                        Well, most "normal" businesses require a significant up-front capital outlay to get going, and this is one of the challenges for someone who's thinking of starting one.  So, this isn't (conceptually) that much different from, for example, opening a bakery.  The main difference is that the assets in question are intangible, and thus much easier to use without having paid for them.
                        <br/>
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                        I'm not saying there isn't a risk of this happening.  I was just opining that the chances of it happening are low, and the exposure if it did is also low.  Clearly, if one is profiting by using assets created by others, the ethical thing to do is to purchase them, not pirate them.
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                     Sure, but I'm 99% confident that most devs in this scene don't invest in every asset right away and start out illegally, thus having an advantage over somebody who'd want to do it all legitimately from the start. Not that I would be all legit right away either, I just wanted to know what I'm doing.
                     <br/>
                     But whatever. I'm repeating myself. Thank you all for the help.
                     <br/>
                     Time to gobbo it up!
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                     A lot of good info in this thread, Thanks.
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                     I wish the interactive licenses were cheaper though, seems WAY overpriced at the moment, from what i can tell it would cost around $200 in interactive licenses alone per character. plus the initial $100 for the "starter essentials license".
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                     I'm currently working on a 3D game and the only thing stopping me from publishing the alpha build is me waiting for there to be an interactive license sale that never seems to come. Without some sort of discount it just doesn't seem affordable.
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                        A lot of good info in this thread, Thanks.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        I wish the interactive licenses were cheaper though, seems WAY overpriced at the moment, from what i can tell it would cost around $200 in interactive licenses alone per character. plus the initial $100 for the "starter essentials license".
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        I'm currently working on a 3D game and the only thing stopping me from publishing the alpha build is me waiting for there to be an interactive license sale that never seems to come. Without some sort of discount it just doesn't seem affordable.
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                     </blockquote>
                     I was going to say 'buy the 'Daz owned content standard interactive license' (whatever it was called), but I see that's no longer a thing.  The Genesis base figures each have their own individual interactive licenses now...
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     So the strategy of staying with 'Daz owned content' so that you'd only need a master interactive license for said content is apparently no longer valid.  Which means that things are a LOT more expensive now with Daz owned models, as opposed to the 'older' licensing scheme...
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     But, I suppose you could just use figures used by say just the Genesis 3 starter essentials, and morph those, as opposed to say using derived figures like Victoria 7, Aiko 7, etc., and using Sickleyield's free morphs on ShareCG for your morphs so that you wouldn't have to pay extra for the Daz store interactive licenses for morph kits sold by Daz.  But yeah, I guess that they assume that if you are using the model in a 3D game, you are going to make mucho bucks...
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Which just sucks for people doing free mods for games that can use Daz models as ingame figures (as opposed to just static renders).
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                        Thank you for the advice. I definitely will. And I'm serious about it. I just haven't figured a name for my account and the game is still early in development. But, once the name is chosen I'll definitely create a Patreon Page, Twitter and Discord account. Also a Thread here with the game for people to critic the shit out of it and allow me to improve the game!! LOL
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                     You might also want to start off doing some mods first.  I've noticed that a lot of things I'm doing in Daz get much easier with practice and there's nobody complaining about missed deadlines/etc while you practice.  I'm considering trying to make my own game as well but until I buy a new rig more suitable to rendering I'm just going to stick to modding.
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                     If Daz is free, and I only use the standard G3 or G8 model in the game, should I buy some kind of license?
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                        If Daz is free, and I only use the standard G3 or G8 model in the game, should I buy some kind of license?
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                     You normally buy assets such as character models, cloths, hair and environments so that you can create the type of still image or animation you want, this is the Standard License. These images or animations you can give away or sell as you like.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     If you want to include the actual asset in something that you want to distribute then you need to buy an Interactive License. This means that if you are creating something like a 3D environment with a character moving around the screen under the players control then the character, the cloths, hair and environment are constantly being rerendered on the screen and that requires the Interactive License.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Just creating the type of static image VN most developers are doing does not require the Interactive License.
                     <br/>
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                     You can also avoid buying any type of asset if you just use the freebies given away by DAZ and all the other sources on the net, or if you create your own from scratch.
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                     What happens if someone uses pirated assets (clothes for example) in a VN? Can the asset creator find out if you have bought it or not?
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                        What happens if someone uses pirated assets (clothes for example) in a VN? Can the asset creator find out if you have bought it or not?
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                     The software itself doesn't know the difference between purchased or pirated assets. I am a Platinum Club member with many purchased assets but I also have lots of pirated stuff and they all work together fine. Sometimes I eventually purchase something I had pirated and the installer sees that I have it already and doesn't reinstall it, but if the asset has been updated since the pirate version was spread around, it just tells me there is an updated version ready for download.
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                     I don't have any idea of how many people actually buy stuff but unless something you use has never had anyone actually buy it, there is no way for the creator to know if it was purchased or not. Also, the likelyhood of the creator actually ever seeing your amateur creation is pretty close to zero.
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                        I was going to say 'buy the 'Daz owned content standard interactive license' (whatever it was called), but I see that's no longer a thing.  The Genesis base figures each have their own individual interactive licenses now...
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        So the strategy of staying with 'Daz owned content' so that you'd only need a master interactive license for said content is apparently no longer valid.  Which means that things are a LOT more expensive now with Daz owned models, as opposed to the 'older' licensing scheme...
                        <br/>
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                        But, I suppose you could just use figures used by say just the Genesis 3 starter essentials, and morph those, as opposed to say using derived figures like Victoria 7, Aiko 7, etc., and using Sickleyield's free morphs on ShareCG for your morphs so that you wouldn't have to pay extra for the Daz store interactive licenses for morph kits sold by Daz.  But yeah, I guess that they assume that if you are using the model in a 3D game, you are going to make mucho bucks...
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                        Which just sucks for people doing free mods for games that can use Daz models as ingame figures (as opposed to just static renders).
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                     Very usefull thread thx for info
                     <img alt=";)" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite668" data-shortname=";)" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Wink    ;)"/>
                     so in DAZ3D u need interactive license only if u gonna create a game in 3D game engine like Unreal Engine, Unity kuz these engines simulate 3D and they think you are going to make a lot of bucks xD but for Ren'py we don't need license kuz this one simulate only 2D dimension right? But how about other sources with free stuff like renderosity where usually are 2 types of license and 2nd one is licensed for non-commercial use only, Non commercial means the same like in daz that we can use their assets only in 2D like Ren'py?
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                        Very usefull thread thx for info
                        <img alt=";)" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite668" data-shortname=";)" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Wink    ;)"/>
                        so in DAZ3D u need interactive license only if u gonna create a game in 3D game engine like Unreal Engine, Unity kuz these engines simulate 3D and they think you are going to make a lot of bucks xD but for Ren'py we don't need license kuz this one simulate only 2D dimension right? But how about other sources with free stuff like renderosity where usually are 2 types of license and 2nd one is licensed for non-commercial use only, Non commercial means the same like in daz that we can use their assets only in 2D like Ren'py?
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                     Usually, if you are making sure that you are 'covering the legal bases', you probably should steer clear of any freebies that say 'non-commercial use only' or 'personal use only'.
                     <br/>
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                     You could reach out to the creator of the freebie in question if you wanted to get permission to use it in your visual novel/Renpy game, to see what fees they might have in mind for such usage.  Some creators may simply be happy with a 'thanks to so and so for letting me use their model' in your credits listing, but others may want more...
                     <br/>
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                     So this is a judgement call on your part.  The creator of the freebie in question may never notice the object in question in your VN in the first place, but that's a 'roll the dice and take your chances' sort of thing.
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                        OhWee said:
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                        Usually, if you are making sure that you are 'covering the legal bases', you probably should steer clear of any freebies that say 'non-commercial use only' or 'personal use only'.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        You could reach out to the creator of the freebie in question if you wanted to get permission to use it in your visual novel/Renpy game, to see what fees they might have in mind for such usage.  Some creators may simply be happy with a 'thanks to so and so for letting me use their model' in your credits listing, but others may want more...
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                        So this is a judgement call on your part.  The creator of the freebie in question may never notice the object in question in your VN in the first place, but that's a 'roll the dice and take your chances' sort of thing.
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                     Damn...so everytime i'm gonna download some free asset i need to call the creator and pray to him thats how is look like xD
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                        Damn...so everytime i'm gonna download some free asset i need to call the creator and pray to him xD
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                     Not all of them.  For the ones that say 'unrestricted use' or 'commercial use OK', you should be good to go to use them.  "Limited Use with Credits' is another term you may come across, if the asset you want to use has Limited Use with Credits, yeah that one is very much a judgement call...
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                     I assume that you know about ShareCG and poserdazfreebies.mirahaze.org... also, in case you may have missed it, we do have a thread where we share links to various freebies and freebie sites, with varying usage rights.
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                     And yeah, keeping track of all of those usage rights can be a pain sometimes.  I started to put the more limited ones in their own Daz sub-library so that I'd know not to use them in future renpy games and such...
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                     Yeah i know about ShareCG and yo thread thx
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                        And yeah, keeping track of all of those usage rights can be a pain sometimes. I started to put the more limited ones in their own Daz sub-library so that I'd know not to use them in future renpy games and such...
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                     So need to keep in mind maybe to sort that stuff with varying usage rights
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