Feedback and Project Based Learning



I had my Intro to Engineering students turn in an “up to now” version of what will become their final presentation for the project we are currently working on. I wanted to write a bit about it because it is shaping up to be a very important assignment and I’m learning a lot about project based learning through it.

First, I love that the assignment requires them to think through what they’ve done so far because it is open ended. I didn’t include a rubric like I would for other assignments. So they didn’t have a checklist of what to include, they had to come up with it on their own (although they are on teams, so of course they can talk to their teammates about it). Now that I am giving feedback on the assignment, I’m getting a variety of slide decks and it’s giving me some insight into how the students see the project so far. Some are focusing just on the Inventor modeling they’ve done and less on the construction and some are the exact opposite. And with Classroom’s grading tools, I can quickly give appropriate feedback to everyone. The screenshot above shows one example where the student has a good mix of evidence, but even then there is always room for improvement. You can see in the screenshot that I am giving individual comments on slides and then an overall summary as a comment on the assignment. So it’s this assignment that’s giving me the place to help the teams process what they’ve done so far but then also guide them toward next steps.

I’ve also learned that PBL is very hectic and managing it requires deadlines like the one for this assignment. What I mean is that it is difficult to have a deadline for one specific part of the project, like 3D printing a part for their automaton, because different groups are reaching that point at different times. Some groups have laser cut, some haven’t. Some groups have consulted with their artist several times outside of class and some haven’t. So an assignment like this allows for the teams to show me what they’ve done so far and a good entry looks different for every group.

One thing we obviously need to work on is documentation of ideas. We do plenty of work practicing brainstorming and then actually brainstorming, but most slide decks I’ve seen so far have no evidence of it. It could be that they have it in their notebook and just didn’t include it in the slides and so I commented to most of them that they should include it. But for some, I think they are forgetting to document brainstormed ideas altogether and so we need to work on that. Maybe we could create a template of some sort to make it obvious that it needs to be documented? We’ll see. Always improving!!

What Are We Making Today?


Introduction to Engineering Design:







Engineering Design and Development:



Students Pay Students


That blog title sounds ridiculous! But if you’re reading this you probably see what I’m getting at here. I’ve got lots of thoughts on TpT, but nothing revolutionary that hasn’t already been said more eloquently by countless others. Make stuff because it makes you better, share the stuff so others can get better too. Seems obvious. But whatever.

This Twitter thread really got me thinking today, thanks to Val Brown for starting the conversation. The article she’s linking to is about teachers making money on Instagram by selling their stuff, mainly on TpT.  If you hadn’t seen the article or this thread, click through, scroll down, read a bit and then come back.

Reading through the replies made me think a lot of things, but the one that stuck with me today and forced me to sit down and write is this: if our students’ “jobs” are school, then aren’t grades their “pay”?  I got here because the concept of “good teaching” came up and the general convo is about teachers making more money in various ways.  So logically, why not pay more for better teaching right?  I love this concept! I get better all the time, so MONEY PLEASE!



But as soon as there’s money involved, everyone wants objectivity. And “good teaching” is not that. You can’t rubricize it! Well, you can define a few things that good teachers do and then try to tie salary to those things. But as soon as you get specific on anything you’ll just start getting a lot of that thing and less trying new things, less innovation. So circling back around to students, the same thing is true for them and their grades. The more I try to define specifically what I want to see from them in exchange for a good grade, the more I see of that thing and the less I see trying new things, less innovation. And this is harmful to kids. Not all kids learn/grow the same way, the same pace, the same amount. And so trying to box it in is futile and dangerous. That’s exactly what grades do.

So putting it all together, here’s my thoughts on both problems:

  1. We have to pay teachers. Duh.
  2. Paying more for “better” teaching is only going to get us more of the same when we know that’s not actually better teaching.
  3. Therefore, pay teachers the same reasonable salary and give them freedom to do what’s best in their classrooms without fear.
  1. We have to give students grades. (I disagree, but it’s my current reality anyway.)
  2. Paying more for “better” learning is only going to get us more of the same when we know that’s not actually better learning.
  3. Therefore, pay students the same reasonable grades and give them freedom to do what’s best in their classrooms without fear.

These positions are not revolutionary. They are simple concepts. Of course the whole thing gets derailed as soon as someone shouts “but that’s not fair!”.  Neither is what we do now, friend. Neither is what we do now. 

Prove it!


An exchange with a few students today got me really upset and so I wanted to write about it to get my thoughts out. The students were questioning their grade on a project. They both had gotten a C but *wanted* a B. The project has a rubric but the translation to a grade is subjective, so I told them that they could explain to me why they thought they should have a higher grade. It wasn’t the fact that they wanted to argue for a better grade that bothered me, it was the way they went about it. They were basically arguing that since they felt like they had worked hard on it that they should get a B. And they were really trying to make me feel like I was judging them unfairly with the grade I gave. One of them even used the term “biased”. But when we looked at the work, it was clear that they did not complete all the requirements and when we looked at the rubric, they didn’t meet many of the criteria for a successful project. So then they wanted to know *exactly* what I wanted them to do in order to get a B. And I wasn’t sure what to say at that point. It started to become clear that they were not going to do the work I wanted them to do, which is to look again at the project requirements and the rubric criteria and then improve their work until it was closer to meeting them. So we kind of left it there, I told them I would be willing to look at any additional work they put in and change the grades accordingly. But in the meantime, I went and looked at their overall GPAs (relevant detail – they are both seniors and today is their last day). I noticed that neither of their overall grades for the course would change if I made this one grade change. So I told them that and they both *immediately* said some version of “oh. well I don’t care then, nevermind.” It didn’t hit me right away but after some thought I realized that this was them admitting that they didn’t really disagree with my assessment of their work. They just didn’t like the C that came with it and this made it difficult for them to argue for a higher grade.

It is sometimes hard to pinpoint my problem with grades, but this interaction is a great example of it. I feel like the students were basically being dishonest in that they were arguing that their work was high quality and that they had tried their hardest when I don’t really think they agreed with that. If they were being honest, they would admit that they had wasted plenty of class time just chatting or looking at random videos while I wasn’t looking. And if they were being honest, they’d agree that their work did not meet the criteria from the rubric. So what is making them be dishonest?

I believe it is the fact that they feel the need to get the grade, whether or not they do the work or learn anything.

So what changes if we take the grade away? I don’t think they would’ve done *less* work than they did, and that’s the main argument I hear from other teachers – that the grades are all that’s motivating some kids. But I do think it’d remove the reason for lying in a scenario like this. With descriptive feedback only, they wouldn’t feel the need to try to guilt me into anything because it’s not a transaction the way grades are. They’re not trying to get anything out of me. The only thing to be expected of me is honest feedback and I already gave that. Of course you can disagree with feedback, and if you really do disagree, then the only thing to do is provide a counter argument – and that is what I was looking for them to give all along!

Where do the learning targets fit?







Here’s How I’m Doin Grades Now









I wanna know these four things:

  1. Are you doing your work?
  2. Is it reasonably well documented?
  3. Are you learning anything?
  4. Are you being productive in class?





Reflections 2016-11-4


Computer Science:



Reflections 2016-11-2


Computer Science:





Reflections 2016-11-1


Computer Science: 


Mini lessons included:

  • using the up arrow to retrieve the previous command
  • variable types (python assigns them for you)
  • .py files are text files

Intro to Engineering:


Reflections 2016-10-31


Introduction to Engineering:

