What The F*ck Happened To Dating In College?

I’m sorry, but when the fuck did “dating” disappear?

I have a friend who just got back on the market. She’s super classy, and she’s kind of with this new guy. They’ve had a few (non-sexual) sleepovers, but she wants him to take her on an actual date before she gives it all up. Not unreasonable, right? But we were talking the other day and I actually heard myself say to her, “You can’t expect too much from a guy in college. Sex comes first, a date comes way later, and only if he really likes you.” LIKE REALLY? Wtf.

Girls – and boys – we seriously need to get our shit together.

Is it really too ball-busting to ask a guy to drop $6.75 on you at Chipotle after an hour (or five minutes, let’s be honest) of a semi-drunk hookup? Or wrong to expect the boy who so consistently texts you each Saturday at 2:39 a.m. to allocate one precious evening for a dinner date? HELL. NO.

I just don’t understand today’s collegiate standards. Dating has completely disappeared, and girls jokingly refer to a “walk of shame” as a “stride of pride.” Umm, I’m calling bullshit. Please show me one girl who looks proud on that lonely walk home, with obviously smeared mascara, messy bedroom hair, and eyes focused on the concrete ground.

And while we’re on the subject, when did girls become sluts, or teases, or skanks for going out to dinner with one boy on Friday night, and then to a movie with another on Saturday? How is that worse than sleeping with two different guys in one weekend, something that is becoming an increasingly common phenomenon on college campuses nationwide?

When romance wasn’t more confusing than a cumulative exam, A.K.A. when people were actually normal, you didn’t have to completely commit to one guy until he asked you to “go steady.” Until then, all else was fair game. Nowadays, that’s unheard of. Modern romantic tactics are much more sneaky and difficult to understand.

Did the boy you hooked up with two weeks ago just send you a casual, “What’s up” text? Does that mean you’re like, talking now? How long should you wait to text him back? Is it okay to double-text if he doesn’t answer within 10 minutes? Does “Heyy” or “Heyyy” sound better? Is an emoji too much? What about two emojis?

Fucking. Stop.

Unless that “What’s up” text is followed by a sincere, “What are you doing tonight? Let’s grab dinner together” text, he’s absolutely no concern of yours. What’s the point of pining over a douche bag? Gather up your precious self-respect and MOVE. ON. We girls can do so much better, and your 30-year-old self will thank you for it.

When you like a boy and that boy likes you, it shouldn’t be complicated. If (and hopefully when) you find that special person, the relationship should flow naturally. Fuck the mind games, fuck the booty calls, fuck him! (Just not literally.) But hey, if you’re all about the casual sex then I’m not here to stop you – I’m just telling you to get a clue.

Feature Image via Flickr: Thomas Leuthard


  1. There should be a guy version to this, because all i see is a girl talking mostly about guys. Females do as much things as we do. One thing you are right about tho is that both girl and guys needs to stop that bs and get their shit together.

    • the reason that traditional dating has disappeared is because traditional marriage has disappeared.

      as all women have now had numerous one-night stands, instead of waiting for that one knight, why would you want to be the knight who has to pay for what others got for free when it was younger, hotter, tighter, and forty pounds lighter?

      and by pay, i mean you have to give up your time, your energy, your future salary in the form of child support and alimony, and your children. you will have to pay for your x-wife’s new lingerie for the biker boy she once banged for free, but now buys beer for with your money, via the alimony you must send her under threat of incarceration.


      helloz class! da professorsz is herez and we gonnaz talkz about some GREAT BOOKS 4 MENZ lzozolzol


      GBFM ECONOMICZ MAXIM # 1: A woman’s courtship value is equal or less than the lowest price she ever gave her pussy away for. lzolzoz



      After a woman has had a one-night stand
      or given her pussy for free
      her courtship value
      is 0.
      or less than 0.

      As why would you want to be the guy
      who pays for what others got when it was younger hotter tighter
      forty pounds lighter
      for freeee?


      After a woman passes 25, whence she has generally been buttcocked numerous times and desouled, her courtship value is negative. It is the woman, who is now wired fiat bernanke cash and allowed to excel in fiat bernanke programs that drug up and dumb down boyz while deocntsructing da GREAT BOOKS 4 MENZ and creating far more debt than wealth while bankruping the West morally amnd moneetarily, who must pay the man so as to court him.

      For a 25 year old multi-buttocked, desouled, bernankifed woman represents a huge risk to a man’s livelihood, his time, his conscience, his soul, his future earnings, and his general well-being. And the man must be compensated justly so as to have to court a woman over 25 who has been buttcocked and deousled and converted by the cenrta; bankerz into a vehicle of welath transfer lzozlz so dey could convert their masisve fiat debt into physical property by leveraging a woman’s sexuality for prviate profit gains while placing all teh risksz on good menz zlozzllz.


      • You’re a complete asshole. Women are not an object like cars. Our value doesn’t depreciate after we’ve been “used”. Our whole goal in life is not to stay pure in the hopes that some shallow man only concerned with our physical wealth will marry us. We have just as much right to do whatever we want as men, and if you think differently, good luck finding a loving, life-long relationship dickhead.

      • > Our value doesn’t depreciate after we’ve been “used”.


        Denial ——> You are here

        > We have just as much right to do whatever we want as men

        Of course you do. And you will also deal with the consequence of doing whatever you want. The main consequence of having promiscuous sex is that your value depreciates.

      • So if a guy told you he had sex with 70 girls, would his value still be the same as a guy that has only had sex with 3 girls?? Whether you like it or not the guy is right, there is nothing chauvinistic about that.

      • Saying one human being is more valuable than another is disgusting. Everyone has their choices and their standards and their experiences. Saying someone is less of a human because they have more experience? Or because they have lesser standards? Maybe those people just don’t expect a lot from the world because they don’t have any reason to believe it has a better half. Maybe they have met people who make them see the worst in others.

        Your comments are dehumanizing and pathetic. Pull your head out of your ass and maybe you’ll see that there is more a girl can offer for your life than her vagina. Or maybe you’ll realize that no woman needs a man who acts like you do, when there are men who actually offer respect.

        We get out of the world what we put into it.

      • > Saying one human being is more valuable than another is disgusting.


        > Everyone has their choices and their standards and their experiences.

        So deal with the consequences of your choices, standards, and experiences. The consequence is that most normal men will not see you as marriage material.

      • you are just a bitter little boy, who made some bad decisions and has to pay for them now, because he obviously was after looks, and chased some gold digging slut, though i’d be surprised you could even make a penny with your attitude.

      • Never married, never intend to marry. Gold digger or not. Hahahaha.

        I am a divorce lawyer though.

      • @Reggie,

        They have done it with plenty success in the last 30 years.

        Things are changing though.

      • Hahaha well as a guy i have had sex with over a hundred women, yet i found the one girl that i love most in the world and she has had sex once, so what does that say about me, what does that say about her?? I do agree though that maybe she could find someone who isn as much as a man whore as me but she fell in love with me for who i am, not my past experiences, so idk i just believe your view point is incredibly narrow minded but then again it is your view point not mine.

      • Right! Every time I have sex with an inexperienced man he turns into a damned stalker…which kind of blows her point away—I’m non-monogamous/serially monogamous and have been known to be dating 2 or people in the same time period, but the majority of the men I get involved with PROPOSE MARRIAGE. (I guess I’m just that good!) I’ve had every shaped diamond except heart and cushion cut, and most men (of course I don’t get involved with “conservatives” anymore since they tend to be the inexperienced-turned-stalker type) seem to value skills in bed over anything else. I’m FINE having a “relationship” that is sex based, he doesn’t have to spend money and neither do I, we can just agree to have a good time and then not be bothered by the typical relationship BS. The world needs to “get it” that young people–and a few of us old folks–just aren’t into trying to force a lifetime of happiness out of something that is so miserable for the majority of couples (marriage/coupledom). More power to the people who are willing to make such a huge sacrifice of themselves, but I for one and THRILLED that the world is moving in this direction. We need to get back in balance and biblical marriage and all its tenets are exactly WHAT tipped that balance to begin with.

      • I would much prefer to have sex with a man who had had sex with 70 women rather than one who had only slept with 3. People’s sexual abilities improve with experience, and that’s about it. Your genitals don’t like, rot and fall out.

      • Ew. And this is the mindset that the article is referring to. How many people can you give your body away to before it becomes public property? Absolutely cringe-worthy.

      • What makes you think anyone would be as obsessed about it as you? And, for that matter, what makes you think this guy thinks that men who sleep around are valueless? I’d be surprised to learn that he did.

      • Can I just say, that as a woman who has never had sex, and never will until I’m married, that I don’t think his value would ‘depreciate’. His value is the same as any human, and that value to me is not measurable.
        Now that doesn’t mean that I’d be ready to tie the knot with him. Sexual promiscuity at that level could be an indication that he may have some issues I’m not prepared to handle, or that our moral standards don’t align. But if that doesn’t mean he doesn’t hold value; it just means that I wouldn’t want to marry him. I may not want to marry one with an ideology different from mine concerning a different issue, like religion or politics, but that doesn’t decrease a persons’ value.
        And who knows, maybe he’s changed since then and we get along great. Fine then.
        (I have to say though, I appreciate that you phrased the question in a way to steer away from the idea that a woman’s worth is only based on her ‘sexual purity’, and make us reflect on what we’d think if the situation was reversed. Plus, it has a much more respectful tone! Also, sorry for so many words in one post!!!)

      • Is he a chauvinistic pig because he’s right, or because he is referring to you and you know it?

      • Because he’s a douche. He is neither right, nor does this apply to me and yet he’s still a chauvinistic pig.

      • Does that mean for every girl you bang your value is down? if you want to marry and have sex with a virgin, you better be a virgin yourself.

        Your value as a partner when from ok to none. Have fun being alone to rest of your life.

      • Men typically have to invest something to have sex with a woman. Attract them, game them, spend money and resources on them. If a girl gives it up for free to hundreds of men, not only do we find that instinctually repulsive for LTR(with good reasons), but it doesn’t make sense to men to have to pay/marry up for something that is given up for cheap to other men. It’s almost an insult. Generally women tend to claim they like men who can get more women, because usually that requires status, ability etc. They are attracted to that. How many women have you heard shame a man because he doesn’t get pussy or because he is a virgin? Quite a lot, and it’s due to instincts. Our mating patterns are amoral, but that’s how it is.

      • that’s stupid. a women’s value doesn’t depreciate with sex. It’s a group mentality. Let’s supposed that a women was a virgin. A guy can easily say, well that girl is easier to lay so lets go for her and skip the virgin. Also, she could just lie so where is the value in that. In the end it is a group mentality, you can look at it like business. Also a man doesn’t look more attractive when he lays alot of women, he looks like an asshole. If you want out of this game, it’s so simple. Just date good people and be done. It’s kind of like supply and demand. There are alot of good people out there. And it doesn’t matter if you suddenly decide that you once were sexually open to now wanting to be with one only. That is completely ok and works out very well. People just want to know that you won’t cheat, you will make a good mother/father and that you have added value to yourself with education and experience. The reason any logical person won’t “pay” is because they give for free, not because of previous experience. Think of escorts, they get 2000$/hr. And experience only appreciates. So no. If you meet a women who has had alot of experience but now says she wants only one and wants to feel special, and she has “real value” things like a bachelors degree and a good moral set and a kind/gentle personality. Then yeah, a guy will marry her. Pretty quick too. Probably even more so than a virgin women, because experience appreciates. The guy will know she likes sex which is pretty important…. No smart man will ever give up a beautiful, smart, kind, gentle and good women.

      • Jesus H Christ. Bro. C’mon, bro. Bro. Seriously, bro?

        When I take a girl out and buy her dinner, I’m not paying for her vagina. I’m paying for her burrito. And her time. And to show her I appreciate that she was willing to spend her dinner with me instead of someone else. Its not a business transaction, its a gift. I’m not doing because I might get lucky later. I’m doing it because I want to.

        Its called being a gentleman.

        And when I do sleep with a woman, the last thing on my mind is the other guys she’s been with. Why in the fucking world would I give two shits about that? If you only think about women as objects, and you assign them “value” like you can look them up in some Kelly Bluebook catalog, you’re going about it wrong. God damn, I shouldn’t even have to type that sentence. You’re disgusting. Ahhhhhh. BRO!!!!! Get it together, bro!

        But I’m guessing I’m not gonna change your mind. Good luck. I’m hoping you find what you’re looking for. I hear you can get a real steal on ebay these days.

      • @DougFunny

        THANK YOU! I’ve been reading through this chain like I was watching a train wreck that I couldn’t take my eyes off of. I had about lost faith in all of humanity, especially the men. I can’t believe this many people are involved in this argument – it’s literally making me feel sick to my stomach…

        The value of a person is not based on, nor does it decrease or increase, with the amount of people one has sex with. “If you only think about women as objects, and you assign them “value” like you can look them up in some Kelly Bluebook catalog, you’re going about it wrong.” <–fabulous statement.

        If more men had your mindset, maybe women would stop trying to find their value through meaningless sex and realize they have inherent value as human beings – everyone does.

        You are awesome. Your comments make me happy. Please continue being a gentleman and showing the world that people like you still exist.

      • Yeah, and your date will give you an awkward hug and a peck on the cheek. Then she’ll go home, wear sexy lingerie, and call her bad boy booty call who will fuck her brains out.


      • You are fucking rad. Thank you for being a voice of reason amongst the disgusting show of misogyny going on up in here.

      • So since you like to pamper because “you want to”. you would be fine if you keep dating her but she would be fucking other guys, right?

        the last thing on your mind is other guys she had been, but on her mind she is comparing you to the other guys she had been with. lol (I know that from experience, I’d psychoanalyze them).

      • Okay what your saying makes sense. And I couldn’t agree with you more. But we also have to put into Perspective what we are talking about here I am freshman college student finishing off my first year. I am also a frat man. I have seen girls that have been bounced around Greek row like the guys were playing beer pong. Do I find these girls less attractive at first? But If one happens to catch me then so be it is not going to say no just because she has been with a lot of guys. The amount of guys a girl is with is not the deciding factor but if we are honest is a factor in dating a girl.

      • Yes, DougFunny, thank you so much for restoring a bit of my faith in men. I can’t even believe this discussion has gone on this far regarding a human’s “value,” but unfortunately I haven’t been able to look away (like a horrible accident or something). Apparently, this debate has brought out the most pigheaded men on the internet…or you’re all just trolls. Our value isn’t based on our sex lives. If you’re taking a woman out just with the hope of gettin’ some later, you don’t deserve her, whether you buy her McDonald’s or a fucking lobster dinner.

        I don’t consider myself a feminist, but I don’t understand why women get named so quickly like this and many men so easily get away with doing whatever they want. If our “value” goes down, what happens to yours when you sleep with a bunch of girls? And can all you men on here tell me you don’t have quite a track record yourselves? Bet not.

        Oh, and DasItMane –“Generally women tend to claim they like men who can get more women, because usually that requires status, ability etc.” How many women do you know and talk to? Have you done a sociological study or something? Because according to that, most women are shallow. Which is funny, because from reading the men’s comments on here, I would say “generally,” most men are shallow. Luckily, I know that’s not true, thanks to some awesome guy friends I have and my wonderful boyfriend who is the opposite of you. And I know plenty of women who would respect a man who’s still a virgin and who do not go after men purely based on looks, money, status, etc.

        And getting back to what this article was actually about, I like the writer’s point. I don’t believe she’s suggesting just sleeping around with every guy you’re slightly attracted to. She’s just saying to go out with different people and get to know them, and in doing that you’ll find what you’re looking for in an LTR. The title of the article is “What the Fuck Happened to DATING in College,” and her point is not to sleep around with every guy who wants some but won’t even spend some time getting to know her first.

      • It’s bullshit that women prefer a man who’s got high numbers, if anything I find that offputting! I was involved with someone who turned out to be a serial womaniser and that behaviour is very offputting and it’s more than just the number of women. Like someone else on this thread mentioned, it indicates other issues and with this guy I was somewhat involved with he most definitely has A LOT of issues that he is conveniently avoiding like the plague. It’s one thing if it’s their past but another thing if they are continuing to screw around like that. What I have a problem with is men who take advantage of women or treat them badly in their self-serving path of pleasure. That’s just not on.

      • Thank you, Doug Funny. And I second what Jodobean said. The comment about the ‘train wreck’ is exactly how I was feeling. But this just proves that there ARE people out there who like to still think above the waist. Much appreciation. 🙂

      • Thank god there are still some gentlemen left 🙂 It’s sad that your attitude is so commended because it really should be the norm however it’s more of the exception

      • This is true though.. If guys sleep around their value depreciates also.. He’s not picking on girls he’s stating facts…. If you’re a “good” girl who isn’t sleeping around and is looking for a meaningful relationship do you really think you’re gonna go after the man whore who’s banged thirty chicks along with two of your best friends?? Come on get real and quit applying that everything being said is sexist.. It is a two way street!

      • Except most men don’t sleep around because women are the choosers of sex. Men have to put in large amounts of work just to have sex with a female; a female can have sex anytime she wants which is why it hinders her value if she does it so much with random people. A male, however, cannot .

      • I think you are grossly underestimating some members of your gender(men)… I know plenty of guys at college who sleep around and don’t have to put a bit of effort into it. I think that having sex “just for fun” or casually or even one nighters is reflective of both parties not just the girl.

        I also think that the number of people someone sleeps with is irrelevant in a relationship that actually matters. When I get serious with someone I don’t disclose my ‘count’ because its irrelevant to the situation and frankly I don’t want to know his either. If I like someone then the number of partners they have had, high or low, would not change that (cases of STD’s and such are different but generally speaking)..


        Bull. A guy cannot walk into a bar and have sex with any girl he wants unless he’s Brad Pitt. Any average looking girl can walk into a bar and have sex with any guy she wants.


        Its irrelevant to you but its not irrelevant to most intelligent men. Nobody wants to pay for something that other guys got for free. Nobody wants to marry a slut.


        Of course you don’t disclose your count because any smart man would see huge red flags if you told him the truth about your notch count.

      • Unless they outright tell you how are you going to know how many partners your gf/bf has had?

        So from what I gather here (some) men only see value in women for sex. So much so that the number of partners she’s had is more important than her life itself. A woman has no other qualities, values, or interests that would make her desirable as a mate other than the number of partners she’s had.

        I’m glad to see more evolved men like @DougFunny are out there. They give me hope for the future.


        I usually assume a woman has had 40 to 50 partners. That seems about the average. Sure, a nice girl who’s only been with 2 or 3 guys gets shafted by my assumption but her, I am playing for myself. Not her.


        More evolved as in a loser who’ll pay for your shit after you are done having “fun” in your party days? LOL. I’d rather be a caveman!

      • sorry ladies but I kinda agree with the guys, sleeping around does lower a girls value because that is supposed to be a gift given to one guy that has earned it and deserved it, so just giving it out so easily makes you not seem worth the venture for a guy to work hard to court you and then put a ring on it. If there is anything my dad taught me was don’t sleep around because guys will look at you as a slut, he told me he valued my mother for her morals and that she didn’t bend her standards for nobody and that a guy would value the same in me and so far what he has told me has been true, even though I have yet to find the one guy to marry yet any guy I have dated and I haven’t put out as treated me with nothing but respect and we actually got to know each other on a deeper level. However I do believe that if a girl is in the cycle of being into sex, that sometimes even if they want to they don’t think they can stop because they now have a reputation, but that isn’t true I believe any girl can stop and make a vow and follow through to no longer put out until marriage and if someone says oh I heard you did it before you can basically tell them that was then and this is now and the future and it’s not happening ever again, and you can earn more of your value and respect back because you are finally respecting yourself.

      • Your comment really is messed up, especially as your a woman. Maybe if women stopped calling women sluts then things would be very different and men would look at woment different. Women and men don’t have a “value” because they are not object, they are people. It cannot be depreciated or raised, especially based on these standards. Why is it ok for men to have sex but not women? I’m so sick of this argument and watching people defend themselves from people when it’s nobosdy’s business but their own.

      • @Megan


        Just because you stop calling a spade a spade, doesn’t mean it stops being a spade. The world will still see it as a spade.


        Stop being so naive.

        > Why is it ok for men to have sex but not women?

        Nobody is stopping you from having plenty of sex. Most comments only point out that there are consequences to being promiscuous, Of course the consequences vary for men and women and of course you need to deal with the consequences.

      • So what does that say about your value? Clearly you have negative value because your a douchebag.

      • The truth serum always has value to people who aren’t afraid of the truth and want to find it.

        If you hate the truth or are ashamed of it, you will hate the truth serum as well.

      • Although I don’t like the way some men are talking on this board, @megan, it doesn’t what they’re saying isn’t true. Most women don’t find it appalling that a guy has slept with a lot of women, would find it strange to date a man who is a virgin. It is because of the reasons that have been stated. It’s not difficult for women to find a guy to sleep with. In fact, most days we are just saying no to some guy. It is more work for men to find someone to sleep with, or at least it used to be.

        Now guys are not dating nor getting married because women take whatever they can get. Now, most college girls and grown women are only a phone call away, sorry a text away. The guys don’t even have to call. All a guy has to do is text 10 women at the same time and at least 1 will respond. Women go out with guys at the last minute, they ask men out and they buy them gifts, they are men’s beck and call, they drive to men’s homes and deliver the goods, like a pizza boy delivers pizza, without the guy having to do a single thing. Women are so desperate for company and that they will take whatever crums men offer them, so this is what they get. They think that to keep the guy interested they have to have sex with them on the 1st, 2nd or 3rd date, that’s if they even get a date.

        The problem now a days is that most women are not expecting or demanding much before they give their bodies away, so guys don’t do much anymore.

        Expect more and you get more. I used to accept crums and I got treated like crap. Now, I sit back and let the guys do the work. I get dressed up, I go out I have a great time doing the things that I enjoy, but I don’t chase after guys. I let them come to me. If I go to a bar or a party, I no longer spend all my time chasing after guys that are probably not interested in me. Instead I have fun and the guys that actually think I look good, approach me and ask me for my number. I don’t bother calling or texting guys. I let them text me. I don’t answer every silly little text message, because if a guy really likes me he’ll get some balls and actually call and ask me out on a date. I don’t accept invitations to “hang out” and I don’t spend 2 or 3 hours on the phone. If a guy wants me to spend 3 hours of my life talking to him, then he should at least invite me to dinner and talk to me face to face. Now I’m dating, going out on actual dates, and getting treated like gold. And I’m not sleeping with anyone. No one gets the goods, unless I’m in a committed long term relationship with them. Now dating is fun and my biggest problem is picking which guy I want to be in a committed relationship with. It’s a great problem to have.

      • – “We have just as much right to do whatever we want as men”

        You do indeed doll, and we have just as much right to decide the consequences of your attitudes towards us. See when feminism shifted focus from civil rights to todays third-wave sociosexual war on men feminism you didn’t expect what success would mean!
        You indeed managed to strip men of entitlement in a social and sexual context. You indeed managed to make men more responsible for managing their sociosexual lot in life and never ever depend on someone else but themselves if they want to improve it.

        However the unintended consequence (for your gender) is that we no longer accept any sociosexual responsibility because there is no reason to carry it in todays “equal” SMP/MMP. Basically freeing yourselves of sociosexual and moral “oppression” in favour of absolute individual freedom also meant you freed men of the same!

        You do indeed have absolute right to carry yourself through the modern SMP/MMP any way you want. But in return so do we, we simply don’t accept anything less. You don’t owe us anything, we don’t owe you anything. The fact you don’t like what we’re saying about you doesn’t mean jack shit to us and it’s about time you deal with it just like you tell men to deal with it when they don’t like your views on todays SMP/MMP.

        There is no problem, you are the problem because you don’t like it and want us to change it all for you. The only one that can solve the problem that is you, is you. Good luck with that. 🙂

      • Its not even about that, its that after all the guys woman sleep with, lets say shes had 10 one night stands since college. She gave herself to those guys, any one of them could have made her theirs, there is an intrinsic value system and a guy doesnt feel like you, himself or a relationship with you is special in any way, life isnt like the movies, there are consequences for your actions. Theres nothing special about giving it up to a guy you met in the park or library. I wouldnt feel like a girl tjats been with 15 guys is a special girl and its not by an act of god were “talking” because obviously any good looking guy who tries could also. You might not value yourself or value an authentic relationship,but guys do.
        Thats all I got to say about that

      • Look Lindsay, if you women weren’t objects and had some self respect, then you wouldnt allow yourselves to be used (like objects) for sex by every frekin guy who comes around…by doing so, you devalue yourselves!
        then ya, your worth technically speaking, and as sad as it is… “decreases”

      • “you wouldnt allow yourselves to be used (like objects) for sex by every frekin guy who comes around”

        Hey, guess what? Women like sex just as much as men, and choosing to have sex with someone does not mean a woman is letting herself be used like an object. Do you consider every woman you sleep with to be the equivalent of a masturbatory device? Good luck finding someone who’s willing to be in a relationship with you if that’s how you view women.

      • As much as I disagree with this troll, it is not without merit to note how men and women often view their prospective partners given age and number of sexual partners and the quality of said partners. For instance, I’ve only slept with eleven different women, during a third date about a year ago, the topic came up and I said eleven to which she replied “that many? I’ve only been with one person.”

        Her tone immediately changed and so did her interest. Nevermind that they were all people I’d been in a year or more relationship with (which was the next question). Considering her sudden tone change and disinterest in me (as well as what her friend had told me), my value had suddenly depreciated due to the number of people I’ve slept with.

        As much as people seem to get all up in arms about the very thought of one person being more “valuable” than another, it seems like we all place value on the people we know and meet; we break them down into catagories and subconciously rank them, assign them a number.

        Quick test: Is there anybody in your circle of friends or even family that you don’t enjoy hanging out with? That person you avoid contact with unless you have to. Well, congratulations, you’ve just places a value on a person based on your own personal biases.

        And personal biases can be anything from something they like to the number of partners they had. It doesn’t make it right, but it’s not inherently a bad thing.

      • could this be the same lzozlzozlozl that has graced the boards over at the chateau de roissy? could it be?

      • This is one of the saddest things I’ve ever read. Do you really only value a woman by the potential for sex? I’d like to hope that in today’s day and age, when you’re marrying someone, you’re marrying them because they help make you a better person and you want to share all of the important facets of your life together, INCLUDING money. If you’re only looking at marriage as a straight transaction, even with the very strong realities of women possessing their own jobs, careers, and dreams, then you’re either looking for an extremely outdated woman/relationship, or you need to get your head out of the 1950’s and start treating the people around you with respect. To judge a woman’s value by the relations she’s had is beyond crass – it’s repulsive. I sincerely hope that you were somehow kidding, otherwise your entire argument has been demeaning and pathetic.

      • Brittnay my dear child, he’s not the one stuck in the 1950’s. You are the one stuck in the 1980’s and 1990’s.

        If you think the modern man marries for money, you are sadly mistaken. If he isn’t paying alimony or child support, all a man needs to live a comfortable life is about $30,000 to $40,000 a year. So if I am making $100,000 the remaining $70,000 goes straight to my asset column.

        The whole American dream of having a life long job at the big firm, a McMansion with a white picket fence, 3 cars, a wife and 3 kids is past its expiration date in 2014.

        A modern man, such as myself, is an entrepreneur with no company loyalties, rakes in $50,000 one year and $800,000 the next year, lives in a one bedroom apartment with minimalist decor, has casual sex with numerous women, travels for pleasure, and has no interest in marrying you or raising your kids or giving away half of his assets and future income to you in a divorce.

      • $100,000 goes to $55,000? What country do you live in? In the US, I pay $22,000 in taxes on $100,000.

      • are you sure about that @Dave from new castle? because my 100K went to 60, and i am single man no writeoffs

      • Of course you have to account for taxes.

        Let’s say it’ll be $40,000 not $70,000.

        My point still stands.

      • If you’re paying more than 35% tax on 100k you’re doing it wrong and you probably need to fire your financial adviser and tax accountant (or hire one because you have no idea what you’re doing)

      • Well in Canada 40-45% is a good rate on 100k, especially Ontario. Why isn’t this article posted in a tax blog? Let’s get to the bottom of this issue!

      • As long as you’re only sleeping with women who have the same intention of not being into long term relationships and marriage and you’re not being a disrespectful asshole, I can’t say I see a problem with being a free person. The problem is when men see this life view as an excuse to use random women just for what he can get out of sex and refuses to do the bare minimum in bed. A lot of women, especially young career women, aren’t looking for a marriage, they’re just looking for a guy who can give a good shag, and actually care if the woman gets to finish too. Just because a woman isn’t your girlfriend doesn’t mean sex isn’t a responsibility.


        I don’t see any problem with that. Stop being so judgmental with your puritanical views on sex.

      • ahaha I’m sure you pay for it with dollars. It’s funny though because prostitution is way cheaper than marriage, and it’s mutually beneficial. It’s alot better than going after girls that are looking for marriage and then being hurt. That’s just morally wrong to lie to someone.

      • That’s the problem, a lot of women think they just want sex from a guy, but after having casual sex, it’s often never really casual for the women. She expects a guy she had random sex with to care about her feelings or care about her. Look at all the miserable women in Fwb relationships. If you want to go out on a date with a guy, then don’t accept “hang out invitations” don’t have sex with him until you know him better. Expect more and you get more.

      • Where in my argument did I say that the modern man married for money? You obviously misread me, starting with how to even spell my name. My argument was based on the fact that money is not/should not be the basis for a marriage anymore, as plenty of women and men are perfectly capable and desirous of supporting themselves. Before you respond to an argument, you should try reading all of the person’s points first.

        You’re absolutely right on one point – the traditional American dream, with the man supporting a woman fiscally, is no longer sought out by the majority of the population. What you seem to be missing is that it’s no longer sought out by the majority in the cases of men AND women. However, if a person wants to base choosing a life partner based on the number of sexual partners they’ve had, aka their “courtship value” as was the argument of the initial post I responded to, and therefore sees women as only a monetary gain to their lifestyle that “depreciates” with the number of people she’s been with, now, that’s what I find an abysmal reason to base a relationship off of. We agree – a marriage shouldn’t be based around money anymore, and both parties of a partnership should have equal capability of supporting themselves.

        However, you seem to be advocating for no marriage at all, which is perfectly fine. It just isn’t an applicable argument against the case I was trying to make.

      • You seem to be missing a critical element in this argument. Women are the more valuable gender in the SMP. Your gender is the sexual gatekeeper. If men had their druthers, we’d copulate with every hottie we see on the spot. For evidence of this behavior look at the gay community where over half of homosexual males admit to having more than 500 lifetime sexual partners and are ~40 times more likely to have HIV and Syphilis. If men had it there way, sexual hedonism would be rampant.

        With financial freedom, you seem to think that a woman now has license to indulge her proclivities without consequence. That assumption is patently false. Men find value in a woman that makes prudent decisions regarding her reproductive habits. We care not what her earning potential is, her ability to do nearly any number of other tasks, or where she got her degree.

        Outside of her physical appearance, the single most important factor in determining the suitability of a long term mate is her femininity. Your gender doesn’t seem to understand that we realize how easy it is for you to have sex with multiple partners. When a woman behaves like a man she is signalling that her femininity has been bankrupted. Men understand that appearances diminish, however femininity should not. No man with options will agree to more than a short tryst with such a woman.

      • Well all the guys out there that don’t value women, used they brain more than the average men, but always remember that is not about them, is about her,and that’s how they going to get her to not value herself by know more about her and how she value her own self and use what they know about her to get her, so women values is not in men action and how he treat her but in how she treat herself even if you she had million sexual partners.

      • The “femininity” you refer to is a leftover from times, when social status and inheritance where solely based on who your father was. Times, when the reputation of the mother or wife was the main proof of social value for all members of the family.

        If you think prudency is a warranty for loyalty, I respectfully disagree. And when I as a woman behave “like a man”, as you say, I doesn’t mean my femininity has been “bankrupted”, it means that I feel free to make my own choices, just like you do. Your choice of language really does say a lot about you… “suitability”… bah. Who wants to live suitable. But I do agree on your point with the gays.

        I think, that now that women can support themselves, a lot has changed. Unfortunately, a lot of men, and some women too, are still stuck in old role models. I’d say that men are brought to a conflict with this old role model. They have to decide whether they can accept a free woman, one that is a free as them, or not. Because, you know, “your gender doesn’t seem to understand”, that we know how easy it is for you to have sex, too, and that we want just the same. Double standard is tricky, huh.

      • Once again, take a trophy you narcissistic asshole, you probably just replied to some 17 year old on the internet in like Georgia. I really REALLY hope you’re feeling awesome about yourself right now. Wow. 7 incher. Much impress.

      • I find 17 year old girls really cute. Only have to wait 1 more year before they pop out of that oven, all legally ready for me and smelling delicious!

      • I like how they are “ready for you” as if their preferences and choices don’t matter, only yours.

      • omg has everyone lost touch in the point of marriage and love? not everything about money like my god! no wonder you can’t find a good women or be happy in a loving relationship, you base it off all of the wrong things and obviously didn’t work hard enough at it.

      • Would you like a trophy or something? If that what you were going for when you decided to post your life story on some article written by a college girl on the internet? Wow. Much impress.

      • Yes I would like a trophy. It better be nice and shiny with a name plaque engraved on it.

      • “Do you really only value a woman by the potential for sex?”….Do women only value a man by the size of his bank account?

      • Last time I checked, the majority of us don’t give a shit about your bank account because we’re more than capable of attaining a job and taking care of ourselves thank you very much.

        As for the men that get dumped because they supposedly “don’t make enough money and that shitty woman they were dating is just looking for someone to take care of her,” that woman actually dumped you because one of 3 reasons: (a) You don’t know how to manage your money, it makes you appear like a 16yr old child (b) she straight up didn’t like you, nothing you can do about that or (c) you’re right, she’s a shitty person and just looking for money.

        90% of girls are dumping the guy for the first 2 reasons. 10% are not very kind human beings and do the third. To assume that we only value men by their bank account size would be just as narrow-minded as assuming that all men are chauvinists and are only interested in our potential value through sex. We should be empowering BOTH men and women to break these gender stereotypes, not buying into them.

        Pretty sure a man would want nothing to do with a women who explicitly stated to him that “she’s super concerned about how large his bank account is.” In the same way, I wouldn’t give the time of day to any man who told me he was weighing my value as a person based on my previous sexual encounters…

        There’s a shitty 10% side to every gender. That doesn’t mean we should apply that 10% to everyone though.


        Is that why you sue for alimony and child support?

        No strong independent women who don’t need no man in family courts, eh? LOL.

      • Women do sue for alimony and child support, but that’s incredibly irrelevant. Besides the fact that there are women who pay both alimony and child support (I have an uncle who receives alimony from his ex-wife because he was out of work for a number of years and she financially supported him, for example), you have failed to take into account the context of why these laws exist.

        In the case of child support, it is difficult in today’s world to financially support children without two incomes. So if you get sued for child support, that’s because it’s your child, too, and there is no reason that it should be completely on the woman to support someone who is also supposed to be your responsibility.

        The case of alimony is slightly more complicated. It exists historically because it was not (and is still not, in some demographics) socially accepted that women should have careers of their own. Instead, they were expected to just be housewives and live off of the husband’s salary. Since women weren’t making their own money because of the patriarchal values that constricted them to their home, if a couple was getting divorced for one reason or another, the woman would have no way of supporting herself because for so long she was forced to depend on her husband. Hence, alimony.

        The debate about whether or not maintaining the practice of distributing alimony is a good thing is extensive and frankly inconsequential to the original topic. However, you should know that the only reason both alimony and child support laws came into existence in the first place is to protect women from the patriarchy and misogynists like you.

      • > Women do sue for alimony and child support, but that’s incredibly irrelevant.

        So any fact that breaks down your argument is irrelevant? Hahahaha.

        No wonder I don’t take women seriously.

      • Maybe if you took women seriously you would pay attention to the points they were making so you could actually form any kind of valid argument. Honestly, I hope for your sake your blatant sexism and misogyny is clouding your judgment. Otherwise you have proven yourself to be completely biased, presumptuous, ignorant, and blind to the overwhelming privilege in society you were given from birth by having a penis. It truly is no wonder you don’t take women seriously. The second you did, you would realize that every human being is born with the same capacity for thought and intelligence. It’s society that tells us to think of ourselves differently based on which function our bodies serve in procreation. Nothing about your gender determines how smart you are. But if it helps you sleep at night to think your penis makes you smarter than me, then by all means keep thinking within the limited scope society allows you. It won’t have any effect on the millions of women who have surpassed you intellectually.

      • No sweetie, that Masters degree in Underwater Basket Weaving does not make you smarter than me.

      • Men sue for that shit too! There are assholes on both sides of the fence.
        This whole argument is funny.

      • LMAO. I’m sorry for all you dudes who are so convinced that all women are out for is to marry a big bank account. They’re out there, sure. But really? Come on. We DO actually care about stuff other than purses and hurting men’s big frail egos, or whatever you think it is that our lives revolve around.

      • Many women and many men do understand that, just as many women and men may not. But what people have to understand is that everyone views sex and its meaning differently. Just because one person takes sex more casually than another doesn’t invalidate their views nor does it make them “depreciated” or no longer valuable. My argument rests on the feeling that you can’t judge a woman (or a man) based solely on the number of partners they have had, or the fact that they have had partners at all. If you are holding yourself and your potential partner to a religious or moral standard of abstinence before marriage, that’s one thing – you’re basing your relations on the moral decisions you want to make and share with said partner. But that doesn’t make another’s decision to share in sex with another person a bad decision, nor does it mean that a woman should be held to the standard of refraining from sex while a man is allowed to have sex without the social stigma. To ignore that there is a social stigma for women would be folly, but it’s the job of everyone to work towards a place where that social stigma could be gone.
        Case in point – sex does matter, sex does have meaning, but sex having meaning doesn’t mean that you have to not have it in order for that meaning to be there. Amazingly enough, just talking with another person about their sexual encounters and their reasons behind them would be much more enlightening as to what they took away from the experience and the meaning that they invested in it instead of the mere “number” of partners they’ve been with.

      • Brittany, you can’t be that dense. There is a double standard. It exists because no matter what, men and women are different; we were born that way and it is how nature intended. The nature of the man is to procreate and spread his seed as much as he can. The nature of woman is to selectively find a partner with the best genes to bare children. We are fucking machines, you are the gate keepers. No matter how much you women try, those things will never change. Men, like myself, who are educated and have future prospects do not want to marry the town whore. What can you not understand about that?? We don’t want to marry a slut who has fucked 50 guys already. So, in all reality, we would like to fuck this slut but not marry her, because her value is diminished. What man wants to settle down with an ole skank? Not me and not the other men in here. Wake up dumbass, no one self-respecting man wants to be tied down with a loose sloppy vagina. Plus a girl with loose morals can stay out on the street for all I care.

      • If you honestly think that a woman’s vagina becomes loose the more guys she has sex with you are an idiot. Think of this: a woman of 20 who has sex with three different guys a month would be labelled a “slut” based on your standards and thus have a loose vagina. Now take a woman of 20 who marries young, is a virgin until she’s married andhas sex three times a week, far more times a month than the “slut”. Is her vagina “loose and sloppy”?
        Women’s vaginas are strong and aren’t shaped by your penises, no matter how important and life changing you may think your penises are.

      • Oh God. He didn’t mean it literally. Sloppy was used as a metaphor.

      • That is BS, I know people of both genders for whom sex has no meaning and people of both genders for whom it does. Your understanding of human anatomy is hilarious, though.

      • Congratulations for using your biological history as an excuse for poor behavior and standards that you would find abhorrent if they were applied to you. You’re right, there is a double-standard, but this double standard is culturally based and has been cultivated for only the past 10,000 years. If you opened up a textbook that had anything to do with humanity before the Agricultural Revolution, you’d learn that monogamous pairing, and the institution of marriage or of women as “gate keepers”, is a highly Westernized ideal that’s been crafted as a way for men to codify or explain their jealousy over women and as an explanation as to why they are entitled to suppress a woman’s sexuality.
        Our biological tendencies don’t have to be representative of our behavior, and to consciously and willingly hold a double standard just because you’re “a fucking machine” seems to me to be a terrible foundation for your own self-worth.
        Also, there is a significant difference between someone being a “whore” and someone being open to multiple sexual experiences. While the ideas are used interchangeably, namely by short-sighted people, a person can have multiple sexual experiences throughout the course of their life without thinking of sex as a casual encounter.
        Even more importantly, sex can be a casual encounter, and there honestly should be nothing wrong with that. I’m sorry that you evaluate a woman’s worth merely on the number of sexual partners she has had. But it’s time to get real – women no longer need you and your income in order to support themselves and their children. They no longer need to ensure that the man they have sex with is a keeper because there are many methods out there to prevent pregnancy.
        Who you wish to marry and the standards you hold her to are completely up to you. It’s unfortunate that you wish to perpetuate this idea of a double standard, something that I whole-heartedly believe can be overcome with enough conscious work by our populace. But you should never assume that just because a woman has had more than one sexual partner that she’s a “slut” or is undeserving of being considered a real person. Ideas like that are what dehumanize women and make this world a difficult place to live in.

        I appreciate your input and your insight, but I do wish that you’d address me in a more intelligent manner. Calling someone unintelligent because their ideals and beliefs don’t match up with yours is a serious logical fallacy.

      • I appreciate your comment and I agree. Thanks for being so eloquent and prospective, I could not have put it as well as you did.

      • I am so saddened by this reply. I’m so saddened by this whole string of replies. To say its the nature of men to procreate and spread his seed as much as he can, meaning you have as much sex as you possibly can, and in the same reply, you say you don’t want to marry the town whore (which really seems to be you). You don’t want to f*#& a woman who has slept with 50 men, but your value doesn’t diminish because you’ve slept with hundreds of women (spread your seed as much as you can, you say). What makes you think a woman wants to settle down with an old whoremonger who has f*#$ed so much his dick is stretched out and dangling down to his feet, covered in herpes, crabs, and whatever else STD you have caught in your years of whoremongering, & who can’t get it up anymore because of overuse. It is NOT the nature of men to procreate and spread his seed. THAT is the nature of ANIMALS. And not even all animals do that. F*#$ing machines and gatekeepers? Where are you from? Would you say this to your mother, grandmother, or any woman you love, IF you’re capable of love? You’re not only demeaning women, but you’re demeaning men and painting a pretty ugly picture of men who truly have nothing but good intentions and want meaning and companionship in their lives. You REALLY don’t have to worry about being tied down by a woman. No one would want you once they find out what you’re really like, and you can’t hide it forever. All you education, success and money will mean absolutely nothing when you’re laying when you’re laying on your death bed, with no one around you but that nurse with the cold bed pan wearing three pairs of rubber gloves because he/she is afraid to touch your dick in fear of all your diseases you caught during your seed spreading. None of it will matter when you die, and there is no one to claim your body. It won’t matter, because there will be no one who cared about you enough to even remember you the day after you die. A persons value doesn’t come from how many people they have slept with. A persons worth doesn’t come from their education & success. It comes from who they are on the inside, what they give to the world from their heart, not their dick or bank account! You’re seriously a very sad, ugly hearted, worthless man.

      • Are you saddened by the string of replies because you know they apply to you and you are disappointed that men today are no longer willing to get shamed into marrying sluts?

      • Wow, you got me there Liz. Clearly, I am jealous of my father and want to fuck my mother.

      • I’m a happily married 38 year old woman, who has only been with 2 men in her life, and both were long term relationships, one being my husband. I have a wonderful family and only added to that when met my husband and his family. I didn’t marry for money. Both of us met at the lowest points in our lives, and had common interest, have equal earnings, we’re far from well off, but we are happy with what we have. We’ve been together since I was 19 and he was 20. How many women he’s been with, I don’t. Thats not important to meIts never been important to me. We have never discussed it. Thats in the past. We are who we are now, and that is all that matters. Our lives together have been splatters with lots of great times and some harsh times, but we supported each other through it all. We had a son before we got married, who was born with a congenital heart defect who passed away at 10 months old, and while it was one of the hardest things we have ever gone through in our lives, we stuck together, supported each other, not with money or success, but with love. We went on to get married in a small ceremony, because it was all we could afford, and it was the perfect ceremony, because we were together. We’ve since had three children, one adopted, have had our arguments, fights, everything that goes along a normal relationship. We’ve gone through job losses, stay at home dad, stay at home mom, seasonal jobs that had my husband gone for three months at a time, but had wonderful times when he was home and made enough memories to last us while he was gone again. Sure, he could be like some men, and I could be like some women and cheat while were apart, but I trust him with my heart and he trust me with his heart, thats called love and what normal relationships are like. Not all women and men are like those you see on the “reality” shows. Far from it. So no, none of these apply to me or my life in general. I never shamed my husband into anything. We shared a common heartbreak after losing our son, and if we could make it through that and still be together, then we could make it through life together, and come out at the end of our lives, fully happy & proud at what we achieved together, and as individuals. I learn something new every day about myself, about my husband, my kids, and the people around me and around the world. One thing I learned while reading this string of replies and after posting my last reply, what you say, or think of me, or other women doesn’t really matter, because in the end, I know the truth of my life, and you knew absolutely nothing about me until now. And even if all this doesn’t change your mind, it still doesn’t matter, because I’m a happy but sad at times, strong but weak at times, smart but stupid at times woman who is in love with a man who has never judged me for my past, and although we may not be financially successful and as educated as you (a community college education is all we could afford to pay for by ourselves, without having any debt to pay off afterwards), we are financially stable, have a stable home for our children for ourselves, and I won’t let a cynical person like you take away any of those accomplishments from me. So while you sit there, trying to think of another cynical reply to send my way, I’m going to go kiss my kids goodnight, and crawl into bed with the love of my life and fall asleep to the sound of his snoring, which reminds me that I AM NOT alone in life. I wish you a better life then you wish for yourself. Good Night.

      • There’s something I don’t think you understand here. Sex, in this day and age, does NOT mean children. RE: Sex =/= children. We have protection now! We have premarital sex! We can hinder pregnancy! Still with me here? Good. Okay, so if sex doesn’t mean children, that means that the inherent value of sexual selection is gone. So choosing a sexual partner does not mean choosing the genetic progenitor of your child. It simply means choosing your sexual partner.

        So, now what? Who needs to find the best genetically compatible mate if there’s no children resulting? Who needs to be a ‘gate keeper’ when there’s no chance of reproduction with the ‘fuck machine’?

        Once the female wants something more than sex, she will be as choosy as she wants. But if she wants sex and sex alone, genetics aren’t what she’s considering.

        Also, seed? Really? This isn’t a fucking harlequin novel, man.

      • Not all ideas are equal. There are good ideas and bad ideas. The validity of a particular view, is the lowest standard you can apply in assessing its worthiness . Other considerations for instance, include likelihood of the re-occurrence of past destructive behaviour for a start. Take for example a person who has indiscriminately had hundreds of sexual partners. While you suggest its valid, one might see it as destructive, and seriously harmful behaviour. The line of reasoning that suggests that anything goes, creates a situation where women do not make an effort at self improvement and is the reason why the quality of women is deteriorating and men see no value in dating them. Its never occurs to women to think of ways in which they could be more valuable, and in men’s eyes have only become overly entitled, yet offering us nothing we want. The dating game used to be you met a girl you thought was everything you wanted, you treated her with care and in exchange you got something “you valued”.

      • OK… now switch it around. Not all ideas are equal. There are good ideas and bad ideas. The validity of a particular view, is the lowest standard you can apply in assessing its worthiness . Other considerations for instance, include likelihood of the recurrence of past destructive behaviour for a start. Take for example a person (Man) who has indiscriminately had hundreds of sexual partners. While you suggest its valid, one might see it as destructive, and seriously harmful behaviour. The line of reasoning that suggest that anything goes, creates a situation where men do not make an effort at self improvement and is the reason the quality of men is deteriorating and women see no value in dating them! Its never occurs to men to think of ways in which they could be more valuable, and in women’s eyes have only become overly entitled, yet offering us nothing we want. The dating game used to be you met a guy you thought was everything you wanted, you treated him with care and in exchange you got something “you valued”

        Seriously… Just think about what you are saying.

      • Honestly, I think you are completely right and I am a female. If we give our bodies to random people, why in the world would someone want us. I personally think your body is meant for your one person. If we stoop so low to just fuck random people, we don’t deserve to have one person.
        I know that college is all about ‘experimenting’, but you could do that with one guy. You and that one guy could just have threesomes or try different positions, have drunk sex. It’s still experimenting, and hopefully you won’t have to worry about as many STD’s.
        Girls/Women/Females have become so prone to blaming everything on the guy. I’m sorry, but unless you are getting raped, one night stands are YOUR FAULT TOO! Stop trying to pin it on someone else, you chose to drink, you chose to get naked. So shut the fuck up!

        This article wasn’t only about sex though, it did mention how guys don’t take women on dates. But as the author said, we don’t expect it anymore. Women need to say no unless they are getting a date. If he is really interested in more than just a booty call, he’ll do it. Man up ladies. We fought for so many years to have to have control, so fucking have it!

      • I don’t understand how you can have a threesome with one guy? Unless your saying if it’s another woman it doesn’t count?

      • This is pretty much it.
        A guy who is only looking for sex, yea, carse if your tight or not.
        but a why who wants his woman to stay with him, also takes into consideration her sleeping backround.
        if shes been with 20 guys in 3 weeks, why would I want to pursue that? Why take the chance that after a few months, i wont just be another boy toy because shes bored?
        If you are having one night stands, you’re probbly not looking for anything long lasting anyways – for both men and women.

        And you can’t generalize that for all men. Not all hot guys are douche bags, and not all “nice guys” are creeps.
        Not all hot women are sluts, and not all sheltered ones are ugly.

        But physical attraction does play a roll in dating.
        if you’re not attracted to someone, then the relationship wont be there.
        that’s not being shallow (for guys) or friend zoning (for women)

        and again, the fact that you’ve been sleeping with 3 different people in a week, does make people step back and go “how Do I know I know im not just going to be a sex toy”

        so, sex actually does have some imput on your “value” as a potential dating partner.

        someone who’s only slept with 2 people in 2 months, vs someone who’s slept with 10 people, will have a higher “value” to their name, to be more likely to go steady.

      • FINALLY a woman willing to not avert the blame and tell it like it is. Major props for this. Women need to understand exactly what you said, because if they keep pinning everything on the guys like usual, the behavior won’t stop because they won’t feel any responsibility. That victim card that a lot of people play has an expiration date.

      • FINALLY! A woman who is willing to take the side of the oppressor in order to avoid being ostracized for refusing to accept an archaic double standard!!! I was worried for a second there wouldn’t be any left after the whole women’s rights thing. Thank god sexism is alive and well!

      • We’re the oppressors for having standards on who we choose to date/marry?


      • So are you trying to say that if say someone went through a tough time, maybe after a breakup (thats a popular one) and adapted to some poor coping mechanisms.. i.e. casual sex.., that she would in fact never be deserving of having one person in the future? I’m all for owning up to mistakes and standing behind my decisions but that seems a little harsh to me.
        People change, mature, and grow up. Saying that some bad decisions made in someone’s 20’s warrants for them never to deserve anything better than that in their later life is like saying “you stole a loaf of bread when you were 12, you’re now 35 and more mature and you’re still paying for that mistake…”


        I don’t think anyone here can say who deserves what. But I can assure you that neither I nor any smart valuable guy would consider such a woman (slut/poor coping mechanism/whatever) as relationship material. She may or may not deserve a relationship in the future, She may or may not have a relationship in the future. But it won’t be with me. Or with any guy with a sense of self-worth.


        Of course you think its harsh because you realize that you are one of those sluts/women with poor coping mechanism.

        > People change, mature, and grow up.

        People hardly change. Their priorities change. When sluts realize that they are getting old, losing their looks, and hotshot men are no longer attracted to them, they change their priority to lock down some loser via relationships/pregnancies/marriages. That’s not changing or maturing or growing up, That’s just a change in priorities.

        > Saying that some bad decisions made in someone’s 20′s warrants for them never to deserve anything better than that in their later life is like saying “you stole a loaf of bread when you were 12, you’re now 35 and more mature and you’re still paying for that mistake…”

        This is a stupid analogy. Besides, criminal records haunt you pretty much forever.

      • Excuse me, sir? You seem to be lost in the wrong time. Would you like a ride back to the early 1800s? Perhaps 1811?

      • Its funny how most the guys I know would probably sleep with a girl they find attractive within an hour of meeting her if the opportunity came up and women are apparently hoes with no value if they decide they want to have a one-night stand maybe once maybe more than once… Guys are the easiest gender to get with so stop calling us hoes. Men think its cool to fuck a hundred girls but they want to marry a virgin fuck you. Your an idiot. You obviously can’t develop a real relationship with a woman that would want to be committed to you because you clearly have no respect for them.

      • Good points but all I see here are comments on physical human capital. I think it may be fair to say that intellectual human capital only appreciates over time, thereby offsetting some of the negative effects of physical depreciation.

        I also think that if a man needs to be compensated for spending his time with a, “25 year old multi-buttocked, desouled, bernankifed woman” the woman should also be compensated for the risk she takes by staying with a man of equal disamenities.

      • If you want to use that logic (which is extremely intrinsically flawed by the way) then you’d have to apply the same logic to a man’s worth. Let’s say a man who has slept with 9 women before (this is the average number of sexual partners a man has) wants to pursue a woman who has only slept with 4 (this is the average number of sexual partners a woman has) then that would make his worth more negative than hers. Therefore, he must compensate the difference by paying the price (of time, energy, dates, etc.)

        You wouldn’t trade a 2011 Camry for a 1999 Camry without an extra cost to make up the difference would you? Well according to your horrible philosophy, the same principles apply.

        Therefore, if sexually activity dictates an individuals worth, then women are worth at least twice that of men (on average)

        Another way to determine the worth of men versus women is to consider the supply and demand principle. Here is some simple economics for you- when the supply is high and the demand is low, the value decreases. In contrast, when the supply is low and the demand is high, the value increases. Newsflash- this still principle applies to used products also. Most people with basic observation skills realize that for the most part, the demand for women is high and the supply tends to be low. This makes women highly valuable. Men, however, are in great supply which decreases the demand. This makes men much less valuable.

        However, if you are smart (which you clearly are not) then you will realize that each person’s worth is based on so much more than sexual activity.

        Each human is a unique, one of kind individual. No two are the same. This alone makes each human’s worth priceless. Even you, who clearly needs to re-evaluate your perspective and respect for women, are valuable because there is no one quite like you.

      • You’re not comparing apples to apples. Men have a different rubric by which we are evaluated. Logic is never “extremely intrinsically flawed,” however its application might be – as is the case with your analysis.

        If you are going to use the principle of supply and demand, it would be wise to consider the role substitutes play in affecting the demand of a good.

        Women with low notch counts are in extremely high demand for courtship ceteris paribus. Part of that courtship entails sexual interaction in exchange for exclusivity, resources et al. Your high notch count slut is a perfectly adequate substitute for the sexual interaction part of that transaction, however nobody with any real options is going to acquiesce to courtship demands from a tramp. You have conflated sex and courtship.

      • What, exactly, is this “different rubric” by which you are “evaluated?” And what makes it fair for men to be held to a different standard than women?

        I’m not necessarily even trying to be condescending, though I get the feeling that I most likely will disagree with you- I’m genuinely curious as to what your rationale is.

      • Men are evaluated more heavily on their overall status. Whether that status is derived via being attractive, successful, famous, etc, or some combination of those traits is irrelevant to a degree. The underlying premise is that in order for men to realize a high value in the SMP they must also project those things, i.e. they must have charisma.

        Firstly, the male standard is far more harsh than the female standard. Your gender has to do 3 things to attract and keep mates:

        1. Stay slim
        2. Don’t be promiscuous
        3. Be kind

        That list involves very little effort. Even the gym part isn’t fair for males – in order for a male to get what is considered a “hot” body requires years of meticulous dieting and a maniacal intensity in the gym; whereas a woman only needs to hit the elliptical for 35 minutes after work and avoid too many bagels after she done at the bars. Every guy in the world wishes it could be so easy.

        You’re implicitly advocating that the second criterion should be removed from the list because it is not on the list of traits that are used to evaluate men. I will explain to you why men are so skeptical of sluts.

        The first thing to consider is that in the SMP men are price takers when it comes to sex. I.e. they do not determine the conditions under which consensual intercourse will occur – which is the crux of this whole article and corresponding dialog. If you ladies decided to collude and hold out on the sex then men would be forced to court you. Why that doesn’t happen is a different story for another time.

        Conversely, men DO determine the conditions under which commitment will occur. Furthermore, with the advent of no-fault divorce and exorbitant alimony and child support payments there is a very strong disincentive structure in place for a man to commit to marriage.

        If you were a man today and you were about to make a decision about whether to commit, what criteria would you use to evaluate the suitability of your mate? To men, words do not mean much. We typically evaluate individuals by what they do, not by what they say. So when Susie Rottencrotch tells a man that “she’s not like that anymore,” it can only mean one of two things to a man:

        1. She’s lying
        2. He doesn’t turn her on enough for her to be like that anymore.

        Either way it doesn’t end well for her.

        Actions have consequences and those actions are what will be scrutinized, not the rationalizing diatribe that accompanies such behavior. We have a choice in this stuff too and that choice matters just as much as yours. Because our choice has been relegated to later on in the transaction does not mean its not important – otherwise this article wouldn’t be here.

      • I just wanted to say that I really appreciate how much your comment sounds like the argument from the Princess Bride where they’re trying to decide which cup the poison is in. Also, I’m frightened by how much your response resonates with the last two years in Business School I have under my belt.

        But since I feel like I need to comment on how idiotic everyone else sounds, and it seems as though there’s a few ladies in here that are okay with bashing “promiscuity” (Otherwise known as the norm for men in this society), maybe for moral reasons, maybe for their own insecurities, who knows.. but I think it’s sort of silly that women and men here are acting as though it’s a one size fits all equation here. Well! She slept with 10 guys in the last two months, so she’s way above the one who slept with 2 guys in the last two months! But wait, was that second one in a committed relationship with 1 person and then slept with the other the day after they parted ways? Or even during the relationship?

        Could it be that there are ladies out there that are fed up with having to go to a party and be interested in a guy? And decide that they are attracted to this person and would like to partake in casual, protected, consensual intercourse? WHOA! I can’t even imagine what that would be like… because I’m a lady with such pure thoughts! How dare I assist in your playing out of your good time without feeling badly about it after and being put down for my interests and emotions.

        Please, I implore you, read up on slut shaming and the use of the words you decide to inflict on people around you, hetero or homo. Cause they’re like, not detrimental or anything. I’m all about women empowering each other, and this is kinda sad to see the ladies here bashing other ladies for their actions. If they’re not rooted in malicious groundings, what exactly does it matter?

      • “Slut shaming”

        You can’t shame a slut. Sluts have no shame. Hahahaha

      • Right, because they make a conscious decision to engage in casual sex despite society’s efforts to shame them for it. You can’t shame me for engaging in casual sex or being a “slut” because your opinion means nothing to me. Rather than your ignorance and the tightness of my vagina, I’m relying on my intelligence, charm, wit, humor, compassion, loyalty, honesty, and personality to draw my self worth from.

      • Aww that’s cute. Is that what you plan on telling your 7 cats when you cry your old self to sleep alone?

      • I wish I could say anything to comfort you… Obviously there is a lot of hurt behind your words. I hope you’ll meet the right girl some day and that you wont scare her with suspicion, because then I would be you with the pets

      • But it is okay for you to go and have 1 night stand with a women and your totally 100% clean? It goes both ways.

      • 1. Most women can take care of themselves, we don’t need a guy to take care of us. So we aren’t marrying for money. 2. Marriage is about companionship not sex. It’s not a transaction, it’s enjoying eachothers company.

        I’m so lucky to have a boyfriend that respects me as a person and doesn’t view women as sex objects like you.

      • Ok I get the idea of wanting an unused woman… but I wonder. Are you unused? For the record I am actually a 26 year old woman, who is still a virgin, very successful, about to get married, and I don’t want a piece of trash boy that has been used. I didn’t let myself fall for the “Boys can do want they want” Crap. You are just as trashy as a used male as a multi buttocked woman.

        That is pretty gross too…

        So my point is, Don’t judge others. Their choices and yours are just that. Theirs and yours. If you don’t want a “used female” Stop making used females. If you enjoy sex and live freely with your ideas. Great! Enjoy. My choices were mine. And others were theirs. So what?

      • > Are you unused?

        The value of a man depends on standards set by women. So if you think a virgin man is better than so be it. But from my experience, women by and large prefer sexually experienced men where as men by and large prefer virginal women. That’s why you see virgin shaming for men and slut shaming for women.

      • What is with your grammar and language? Did you find your education in the trash or what?
        Ok, so what I got from this discussion is- the more partners a woman had, the more men are compared to, which makes it a matter of self-esteem, raising questions such as size of penis, sexual performance, satisfaction, and so on.

        Get real, come on! It’s also about intimacy, and trust, and freedom, experience, and the joy of being close to somebody. And, if for any reason it is considered as a gift, that is supposed to be rare, then in relation to LOVE, because romantic love is (supposed to be) rare. So, what I read from some posts here, is, that you are disappointed romantics who are cinical about love and have self esteem issues that make them feel helpless and without power. Power, you try to gain back from the women, who make “the choice”, by posing judgement on them and setting other standards for men.
        Also, taking the hetereosexual example, how can men be promiscious without women? Where would all these men find their experience if there weren’t women who live out their sensual desires?

        Btw, I don’t care what you say. As long as I am not in a relationship, that we both agreed to be monogamous, I will sleep with whomever I feel like. I base my value on how good I was at following MY expectations on life, and not somebody elses. The approval of anyone won’t make me happy, whereas my own approval will, as long as I live.

        For all those who say that this prejudices against women are not going to change: we went from matriarchy to patriarchy, so why not go back to the middle and try for a balanced situation. Everything can happen, the world was claimed to be flat once, too!

      • So by your own account *A woman is only worth what she gives her pussy away for * you’re just looking for the most expensive slut out there. Now follow your logic along with me. A 25 year old woman has sex with 5 guys but she liked all of those guys so she gave her all to them for free including sex. Her 25 year old friend says fuck love I want money. At this point she has also only slept with 5 guys but she charges them $1000 a piece. Your can’t find love ass meets both of these women when you and them are 40 an woman has slept with 15 men she thought would work out while woman b has slept with $50 for $$$ so far. Your obviously going to pick woman b right since her pussy is worth $50,000 at this point? It will only appreciate in value since she’s never given it away for free and never will except for you of course.

    • You can’t blame the girl who wrote this, or women in general, for there not being a guy version of this. If you feel so strongly about it, then write about it! All people do these days is play the blame game and take no responsibility. If you want to see something done, then do it yourself! Women can’t write this from a guys point of view, because we aren’t guys! What else is she suppose to talk about other then guys and how they treat her and the women she knows. So sit your ass down, AND WRITE AWAY!!

  2. I have given up with traditional dating. because every girl will eventually just blow me off or just want to be friends. So why waste my money? The last girl that i tried to date, went on 4 or 5 dates took it very slow. We only kissed and we pretty much only ever talked about what we wanted out of a relationship. Then she just texts me saying shes not attracted to me and doesn’t really want to see me anymore…..

    • fag, if you don’t fuck by the 3rd date max. get out, she will friendzone you or worse string you along for more free meals

      • THIRD date? If you don’t get laid within an hour of meeting her, you’re wasting your time, you pussy.

      • If you aren’t having sex before you’ve even swapped names, then she’s a fucking cocktease

      • if you haven’t banged her and at least one of her hot friends 3 hours after meeting, you’re obviously gay…..that’s just science

      • Here is what I don’t understand:

        Men, you complain that women are devaluing themselves by sleeping with multiple men and then disregard women who don’t sleep with you immediately. Maybe part of the problem is that the women who you deem worthy of marriage, your ruling out immediately because they don’t give you the instant sexual gratification you desire and then the women who do, you deem unworthy of marriage. You can’t have it both ways.

        You brag about conquests and then shame the women you sleep with. If all women stayed as chaste as you desired for marriage, who would you sleep with? This makes no sense. Is the only purpose of marriage sexual gratification? I thought it was also about mutual support and friendship. If you base a marriage solely on sexual passion, you’re guaranteed a divorce. Passion is fickle.

        Also, if you truly believed that women being promiscuous devalues them, you wouldn’t sleep with them out of wedlock if you weren’t a complete asshole. Your devaluing someone elses future wife, someones daughter, someones mother. You must fucking hate women if your lifes goal is to devalue as many women as you possibly can by fucking them.

      • Thank you for this. I am 22-year-old womam and unlike a lot of people who have commented on this article, I am still in college. I am still figuring out what it means to live in a modern world with old values but different priorities. I don’t want to get married at this point, but I only recently lost my virginity….because I lack experience and am intimidated by the people who have 10 times the experience I have had. And I have had 1 relationships that ended prematurely because I did not want to sleep with him a month into it…..I have also not had positive sexual experiences until recently.

        I have been sexually assaulted…..and it makes it 10 times harder for me to open up to any guy. I took the initiative to lose my virginity because I wanted a positive sexual experience…despite not being in a relationship. Well, the sex was awful and embarassing for me because I had no clue what I was doing, but he at least was kind about it and accepting and did not push me any further than I wanted to go. We are definitely not going to have any kind of relationship; I think it is a mutual feeling.

        Let’s be honest….men and women my age don’t usually want to date someone with 0 sexual experience. Sex for the sake of sex is a waste of time unless it’s good. I know it is 10 times better when you actually care about the person you are with. The awkward sexual situations become funny instead of weird. You can actually tell each other what you like.

        I figure is better to have some sexual experience than none. Am I going to have to lie about it, so that people don’t think I am weird? Probably. But it will also make it easier for me to navigate the world of dating and hook-ups and friendships with some kind of idea of what it means to have sex.

      • Its not like I am the only guy she’s sleeping with and if I didn’t sleep with her, her value would remain intact. Shes already banged two dozen other guys before I even meet her. She’s already devalued.

        Whether she sleeps with 49 guys (excluding me) or 50 guys (including me). Its not a big difference.

        So I might as well be one of the 50 guys that fuck her. LOL.

    • Ugh, right?? She should at LEAST give you a handy after that many dates. Honestly the proper bargaining value of five dates is a couple blowjobs and some good fucking, no speaking allowed, but I mean is it soo bad to expect just a handy? It’s not like you’re an unreasonable guy or anything. And god FORBID she want to still be friends, as if you have time to hang out with some chick who’s not fucking you. Blegh, you’re totally right, dating sucks dude.

      • This guy never said he was trying to get sex out of this girl.

        Instead he got dumped after 4 – 5 dates.

        Whereas the guy who pressures for sex on the first date finds out right away if the girl is into him, or if she’s just going to be a waste of time.

        And, no, I don’t want to be friends with a girl I was attracted to and wanted to take out on dates who wants to be just “friends”. I already have lots of friends, including female friends.

      • I am saving sex for marriage. If guy pressures me for sex on the first date, it just won’t work out due to very different values.

      • More power to you, it is one of those things that can ruin your relationship with anyone. If that’s all they’re interested in and not you, you are wasting your time.

      • And you, miss, having discovered the only thing that actually works.

        If more girls would be like you, then guys like me wouldn’t have to feel like losers for not pressuring for sex on the first date, and knowing that many guys before me have done so–and succeeded.

        You will be happy in life.

      • I was sexually assaulted as a young girl, so even if I really like a guy, it takes me weeks if not months to feel physically safe enough for sexual contact. If a guy were to pressure me into sex on the first date, it wouldn’t work out even if having intimate contact in the future was something that I wasn’t opposed to.

        If someone isn’t willing to respect my boundaries and wait until I feel safe and comfortable with them, then I don’t see why I would want to be in a relationship with them.

      • I hope you tell the guys you date about your sexual assault. How are they supposed to know they should respect your boundaries, if you don’t tell the the boundaries exist in the first place?

      • Um shouldn’t you always respect a girls boundaries regardless of any history of sexual assault?

      • If a girl won’t let you have sex with her “soon,” it should not put her into the friend category or “wasting your time” category. If you need sex right away to see value in a relationship then you are delusional. Why would you want a girl who just gives it up? Do you like the idea of falling in love with someone knowing that 10 men know exactly what she looks like naked? Do you like the idea of the person you want to spend your life with having 10 chances to get HIV? If you want a set sex to money ratio, go look for a real prostitute instead of tricking women into thinking you actually care about them.

      • If a girl isn’t having sex with me soon, I will put her into “wasting my time” category for two reasons.

        1) I could find someone else who will sleep with me without wasting my time.
        2) She’s slept with other guys before. She did it soon enough. If she’s not doing it with me, it basically means she’s not attracted to me. Why should I even bother with someone not attracted to me?

        > Why would you want a girl who just gives it up?

        Pretty much every girl “gave it up” in her past without even knowing the guy’s name. So why not with me? She’s just a waste of time.


        Don’t really believe in “love”. Also, I am sure more than 10 men know how she looks like naked. That’s true for an average girl.


        Hookers are expensive.

      • I am disgusted at all the comments made. Perhaps why they want to be a friends is because you are looking at them as a sex object. You do something nice, they are expected to perform some sexual favor. That is degrading and means that you do not value her as a woman. You are looking for sexual gratification, in which case you should not be complaining about not finding a relationship because you are looking for a hooker.

      • You, and the poster you replied to, are putting words in OP’s mouth. What he’s saying is that trying to put in effort, doing things the right way, yields no results, ie, a continuing relationship. Did he say he was pushing for sex? Doesn’t look like it to me. Heck, I would LOVE to meet a guy who was willing to go on four dates with me without attempting to stick his dick in my mouth.

        People like you are the problem, not this guy. People like you, conflating male desire for a relationship with sexual objectification, are the problem. People like you are the reason why guys like this get discouraged, and adopt a “I might as well enjoy the buffet” attitude.

      • Thank you, Cynthia.

        I used to put in the effort to do this. I’d like to still be able to put in the effort with a quality girl, and not have to deal with pressuring for sex early in the relationship.

        Unfortunately, doing that takes me nowhere, even with so-called “nice” girls.

        The only thing that will make things better is if more girls act like you and actually (a) stop giving up sex on the first date, and (b) stop rejecting guys who don’t push for sex on the first, or 3rd, or 5th date.

      • This depends on the type of girl you’re going for.
        for the most part, “drop dead sexy ass girls” who’s able to pick any “drop dead sexy ass guy” that’s going after them, probably isn’t looking for someone steady.

        Im not saying you’re ugly, or the girls you’ve been going after are super models.
        I was talking to my girlfriend for about 2 weeks before sex was even brought up, and 4 months before we actually had sex.

        It all depends on the person you’re looking for.
        If a girl rejects you after the 3rd or 4th date, its not because you didn’t pressure for sex. its because she simply she wasn’t attracted to you, either mentally or physically.
        it has nothing to do with “being a nice guy” or “not pressuring for sex”
        using the “im a nice guy, so girls don’t want me” is bullshit.
        the girl your going after doesn’t want you, because you’re not a hunk, who’s an arrogant asshole, who is a show off, and a man whore. – the type of people shes use to having go after her.

        and if she doesn’t like you, then shes probably not your type either, because shed probably get bored of you, and go after someone else who’s better eye candy then you.

        If you truly are a nice guy, you dont have to keep complaining about girls friend zoning you because you’re a nice guy.
        you’re either going after bitches, who just want to party and fuck,
        or simply, the girl isint attracted to you.
        it doesnt mean you’re a pussy for not pressuring sex.
        it means… she wasnt attracted to you.

        and if you truly are a “nice guy” and keep it up, you’ll find a respectable women who will be everything you wanted and more.

      • I second this. But all the commonplace a-holes get butthurt over these kinds of comments. They want everyone to fail in exactly the same way they do, I think.

      • Damn, this is the best way a woman should think. Truly understands the male desire. To us, sex is just as important in a relationship as is communication. Just because we want to appreciate your body and beauty by bumping uglies, doesn’t mean we’re automatically objectifying you as a gratification tool.

      • If we had legal prostitution like in the netherlands, you bet your sweet ass, that no guy will be paying for a date, Western women are only worth their youth, so why waste money, for a less than 50% chance at sex, when it is guranteed.

      • Amen. I Am not familiar with these kind of opinions, and the values I read throughout the article and the comments are absolutly shocking! What kind of game is love and marriage in this society? In my society you can have sex with absolutly who you want, be with you want and do what you want. And the dating rules are not different between male and female. Get this, the ones who bother to read my comment: THE BOYS ARE NOT SUPPOSE TO PAY FOR THE WOMAN. He can, and it is seen a nice gesture from time to time, but it is never a must in my culture. I earn my own fucking money. And I’m so glad I live in a society which sees me for me, and not for my love strategies.
        Best regards from Norway

      • Your not listening! Its not about who pays. Its about guys who have no respect for women at all and women who complain but then keep this vicious cycle going. A guy who truly likes you isn’t going to call u up at 2 in the morning and only 2 in the morning every weekend. A guy who respects you is going to take you out in public and spend time with you somewhat sober we there the date is a romantic dinner or a free outdoor concert. Women are always willing to shrug off “guy” behavior but then play the angry femmenist. Hold up your end of the bargain ladies! To respect you he needs to see you respect yourself. All that aside I have nothing against A healthy one night stand just don’t expect him to be your next serious boyfriend…

      • You’re naive. Girls never really mean it when they say they just want to be friends. At best, they never want to see you again. At worst, they want to use you as an emotional tampon.

    • I’m sorry the last lady didn’t work out, but don’t give up, bro! What if the next girl is worth your time and you ruin the relationship you’ve been looking for? Relationships aren’t easy, whether you take the traditional route or the fast lane, but if you want something to last, your best bet is to stay traditional; I’ve seen many other blogs about girls wishing for traditional men, such as yourself. Keep looking man, she IS out there, searching for someone willing to just spend time with her as a friend AND a boyfriend. Show her you value her person more than the pleasure she can give you. Be a man and fight for what you really want because she’s worth it and you owe the best to yourself.
      I’m rooting for you, dude. Fight on.

      • Right? that’s what they would end up telling him. Girls THINK they want a traditional guy, but they don’t Because a lot of times, they don’t know what the fuck they want, which is not a traditional guy.

      • You can’t just generalize people like that. In addition, things in life do not come easy. That includes relationships. You need a lot of patience to find that person perfect for you. Yes, it’s difficult and it’s annoying; but not everything is going to be handed to you like that. Some people are lucky finding someone right away and some people have to wait. It’s life.

      • Yeah. All girls want the traditional guy once they have ridden all the others – the biker guy, the athletic guy, the black guy, the artsy guy, the rich guy, etc etc.

        I know that the list is long and you as the traditional guy are all the way at the bottom, but one of those “ladies” are bound to go through their list sooner or later.

        Nothing stops you from being a friend to one of these women. All women riding the carousel need beta orbiters and emotional tampons like you to unload their feelings onto and to give them a shoulder to cry on, after a hard ride by one of the alphas.

        I mean, there’s nothing that gives you more pleasure than listening to one of those girls talk about how some guy is such a jerk and how many yards of dong she has sampled. Just don’t get discouraged when you ask, why she keeps riding them, and she comforts you with being “such a nice guy” line.

        Meanwhile, don’t stop showing them your “value”, by taking them out to free dinners and movies. Those girls will respect you for being a good beta provider and not having any game and balls to ask anything in return. Remember, like he said, that relationships are not easy and you as the guy have to do all the work.

        Once those “ladies” are in their late 30s, are done riding the carousel, and have become single mothers by one of the alphas they failed to entrap in marriage, you get to MARRY THEM. This is when you cash in all your chips by being a good stepfather to one of their alpha bastards.

        So keep on being that nice guy and keep on being yourself. I’m sure you’ll find that perfect unicorn one day.

      • ^Best reply right here, by Dr. Killpatient. You know what killed “dating” in its older, more traditionalist form? Feminism. Now, these girls have to sleep in the bed that feminism made for them, and which they so eagerly accepted and embraced.

        These women think it’s bad now? Just WAIT until more and more men begin to awaken in a snowballing effect of turning these worthless American women down for the trash they are, demanding dates but riding cocks on the carousel all the way into their thirties, when they finally hit The Wall, and then having the NERVE to ask for some “decent guy”(a beta orbiter she can abuse and exploit) to marry her feminist-ed, entitled, princess-complex ass, even after all they do is turn down nice guys until they hit that wall.

        No, OP, you DON’T get dates. You get exactly what women have demanded for three decades. EQUALITY.

        You are now men in women’s bodies, you had better start getting with the program, and fucking like men, because that’s exactly what you demanded.

      • Wow just what women do you know? I think it is kind of funny that you are talking about this considering that if those are the types of girls you know that says something about you, just as much as it does about them. All these supposed women who “ride cocks up into their 30’s” definitely indicates quite a bit about who you are as a person if those are the only female you either know or associate yourself with. I agree feminism has impacted the idea of “dating” but just as much as the females perspective has changed, so has the males. Honestly I think that people believe it is this way due to the influence of media. Don’t blame everything on feminists it is only a portion of females that you can actually claim as feminists. Also I think you have quite a few misconceptions about feminism. NOT ALL FEMINISTS ARE HARDCORE MAN HATERS. Look i am not telling you that you are wrong in all accounts, the principles of marriage have changed in recent years. If you are this negative about women though it must mean you have experienced something to back up your statements. I feel bad for you, and want to remind you that not all females are like that. Also not all Americans are “trashy, sluts” and there are non-American women who are. You should never generalize because that will put you in plenty of awkward and miserable situations, I think that it is both men and women’s fault that dating has morphed into something entirely different. Never say that the nice guy doesn’t win because in many cases they do.

      • I think you are probably a feminist yourself, but you make a few good points, the most poignant of which is that men have morphed also, and second, that my statements are backed by experience.

        It is for just the reason you mentioned, that men have also changed, that I do not associate with most men beyond an acquaintance or associate level. However, I’m not attracted to men, so they do not figure into my comments regarding dating and feminism.

        And two, yes, my experience with women HAS been with precisely the kind of women I am describing, and that is why I have stopped dating, BECAUSE I do not the women I date to say something about me, if these are the kinds of women I am going to continually meet and date, because they only ever turn out this way once they drop the “normal” facade. I would be willing to bet that most women ARE exactly as I’ve described, but that most of them know how to hide their exploitative, abusive tendencies behind such a facade as permits them to move about in society without raising alarms.

        I do not want the “cock carousel girls”, but these are what most women reveal themselves to be, after you’ve (I’ve) gotten to know them beyond an acquaintance level. So, I quit. I would rather go without, in abstinence. Women reflecting poorly on me? No thanks, not interested.

        Now, a few of your points:

        “just as much as the females perspective has changed, so has the males”
        It sure does, which is why I don’t like most of them, either. However, they also don’t figure into deep physiological and psychological drives like women do, so they’re far easier to avoid altogether.

        “Honestly I think that people believe it is this way due to the influence of media.”
        Yes, the media is minsandrist, which is to say that it continually derides and belittles men. This is a most visible feminist victory.

        “Don’t blame everything on feminists it is only a portion of females that you can actually claim as feminists.”
        Of course not. Most men ruin everything for the few who are truly autonomous and individualist by kowtowing and caving in to the demands of feminist women, and will do anything to fuck women, even to their own and other men’s detriment. Men will fuck women even if it feeds a princess entitlement complex borne of feminism. Most men are dumb animals easily led to their own slaughter…………at the hands of women.

        No, but mainstream feminism is directed by the doctrines that are about hating, killing, castrating, and reducing the population of men. I have facts and sources to back this up.

        “not all females are like that.”
        Newsflash for you: all women ARE like that, by degrees, and all men are EXACTLY what women wish they weren’t. Most men also deserve exactly what they get for continually pussy-begging and white-knighting for the vagooner. FUCK most men. Let them burn.

        Fair, but nothing could be more awkward than a feminist society.
        Women wanted to change dating, so feminism said they were sexually liberated and just as capable of hookup culture as men. Once they got what they asked for, men (the pussy-beggars) took advantage of it and almost never settled down or went long-term. Once feminists got exactly what they asked for, they cried about it and asked where all the good men had gone, why men weren’t settling down and marrying or taking responsibility, why men entered into the so-called “extended adolescence”. The good men went exactly where feminism told them to………into non-existence; feminism says that men are not good.

        No matter how many laws or how much “progress” feminism forces upon men, they will never be happy, and will call for only more change, because women’s unhappiness is never their fault. Only men are responsible.

        Feminism and suffragism are based on lies, told often enough that everyone believes them. Women were never oppressed as a class based on gender, when similar numbers of men weren’t also “oppressed”.

        “Never say that the nice guy doesn’t win because in many cases they do.”
        I don’t believe this. I have never seen it.

      • Wow this person is absolutely right and just put everything I thought about women into words. You’re my hero.

      • Feminism is the belief that men and women should have equal rights. Whenever a marginalized group asks for more rights, the privileged always fear that their rights will be taken away. This fear isn’t based in reality. I don’t hate men, I just don’t want to be seen as inferior simply because I have tits.

      • Blah blah blah, you yap as if feminism is still the underdog.

        Accept the new reality Mary Sue. Feminism has won. Feminism is the establishment now. Feminism is “the man”.

      • That’s not even insulting. What, I’m supposed to believe that you’re NOT an idiot? You don’t even have an argument to make. Fuck outta here.

      • I’ll have to agree with you about something. I’m a 21 yo woman looking for a serious relationship. BUT, every single married woman from my family keep saying “you’re so young for a serious relationship, enjoy until you’re 30” dude wtf, am I supposed to sleep around for 9 years AND THEN look for prince charming????
        Dunno about america, but here in Brasil relationships are doomed. It’s hard to find somebody who’s looking for something more, and when you realize, you’re also playing the game.

      • lolz I was wondering where the Red Pill’s were. I imagine you all jerking off in your moms’ basements to fantasies of the women who turned you down in life being beaten. Luckily for women, only a small minority of men think this way and the millions of good ones understand what is actually important in a partner. Sorry it bothers you women are working on their careers in their 20s and getting married in their 30s. Oh wait, no I’m not sorry 😉

      • And “the biker guy, the athletic guy, the black guy (…seriously?), the artsy guy, the rich guy” are equated with “can’t _possibly_ be traditional, nice guys”?

        For every type/grouping of people, there are jerky people and nice people.

        Maybe instead of getting to know the girl whining (you could be exaggerating what she is complaining about or how upset she really is), maybe get to know her boyfriend… maybe you’ll learn how to be the perfect balance between “nice & traditional” and “cool & attractive”.

        Unless she’s complaining of abuse, in which the truly nice thing (chivalrous AND feminist… they aren’t always in conflict) to do is to get her a counselor and/or support line.

      • 100% Truth, Dr Killpatient. Besides, I’m a black, athletic, artistic semi-affluent guy (don’t own a bike though)—but I also lean more towards traditional. Sure, I’ve had my share of women wanting to “hook-up” FOR the experience of being with someone like me while not expecting a relationship.

        When they realize the “D” ain’t no joke, THEN sh*t gets serious. They want a relationship all of a sudden. I won’t pin it all on the ladies, but damn it… they play games. We’re very blunt and straight forward creatures.

        Women invented the chase. If you want to change the way men value you, change the way you value yourselves (and the women around you). In other words, don’t hang around skanks. Someone alluded to it being the way of “Western girls”. They have a very valid point, while I’ll also admit that there are many foreigners that are suspect as well, our culture here in the States sell sex. Our generation has bought into it. We have a show called “16 and Pregnant” for gods sake and one of the hugest female stars is a Kardashian that f*cked an entertainer on video to get famous.

        Women, the male sex drive is not a game. Don’t underestimate it. Its not to say that we’re beyond commitment and responsibility, but as long as there is a woman willing to put out for minimal effort, a man will proposition 1,000 women until that one ruins it for you all, especially now that the “hook-up” is a cultural norm.

      • Wait… Why in the hell is the “Black Guy” a different category than the others? Like what? they can’t be the norm. I’m not playing devil’s advocate here, that’s just racist as hell man, it may seem subtle but it is.

      • That’s my boy! I’m really happy to see you haven’t lost that empty, false sense of self confidence I drilled into you every night back when I was trying to deal with your mother cheating on me again. Don’t let those women see your soft side! Keep it up champ, and remember- The brand makes the man, not the other way around!







        So keep on being that nice guy. I’m sure you’ll find that perfect unicorn one day.

    • You went on 4-5 dates and it didn’t work out.



      Just because you went on a few dates with someone and “only kissed” doesn’t mean you are entitled to sex or a wedding. Move on and find a girl who likes you after 4-5 dates. The point of traditional dating is to find ONE GOOD SERIOUS RELATIONSHIP and MARRIAGE. Not a bajillion hookups.

    • I will tell you what it is that might have made her say that. Half these comments that sound horrible aren’t all that wrong, but they aren’t right either.

      Speaking from experience, when a man asks me out I take great consideration in his personality. I like a man who treats me well, but he can’t be SUBMISSIVE. Girls don’t want men to bow to their feet and do everything they say. They want someone to challenge them mentally. It’s just sad to watch. You need to be your own man, but not some douche.

      Mentally, females want a male who can protect them and their young, so a submissive guy becomes unattractive pretty quickly. You need to be assertive, but not overwhelming and pushy.

      If the date goes well, move in for a kiss. If it continues to go well the next date, give her more passion. Third date, kiss her passionately and run your hands up and down her body, get her blood flowing, you don’t have to have sex. She might have lost interest if it didn’t seem like you were really showing any. Make HER want YOU. You wanna be the only thing she thinks about that night.

      I have never heard any of my friends say a guy is just a free meal. Relationships are hard and you have to keep trying. One of my guy friends is very submissive and he has a hard time keeping a woman’s interest, he gives her everything she wants and submits to her every whim, just to be dropped at the snap of her fingers. To a woman, a man that submits instead of testing her, gets boring really quick.

      • And when did the woman start having zero responsibility in fostering a RELATIONSHIP?
        Relationship capitalized because it does in fact mean two people not a man and an object.

        You’re objectifying yourselves by placing yourself on a pedestal as something to be won over by aggressive moves and sharp looks. Maybe if women actually gave being reasonable and making advances of their own they might actually end up with what they want, hmm?

      • I never said sharp looks, I’m saying that she was obviously interested at first if they went out on many dates. Women don’t say “well at least he’s a free meal” unless it’s the first date, if she wasn’t interested then she would have said enough by the second or third.

        And I quote “one of my guy friends is very submissive and has a hard time keeping a woman’s interest, he gives her everything she wants and submits to her every whim, just to be dropped at the snap of her fingers” implying that he shouldn’t and doesn’t have to put her on a pedestal! More over, it’s not a good idea! She’ll never be satisfied and you’ll get the boot in the end.

        And just so you know! Men aren’t the only ones who have to foster a relationship! I’m always the first to apologize in an argument. I’m not the first to text in the morning because I let him sleep in, I always make sure our relationship is on a good ground and that we are both happy.

        I’m not putting myself on a pedestal, when my boyfriend and I got together, I set up the date, paid for the whole thing, made the first move, and if he didn’t give a little back, I would have dropped him for the assumption he wasn’t interested. All I’m saying is be a man, she was more than likely waiting for him to give her a little passion.

      • This is a very good point 🙂 when someone labels themselves a ‘nice guy’ I dont automatically thing of this but it is true. You can be too nice in a certain sense; women are often attracted to men who are KIND but ALSO assertive and confident. That is not to say that less confident guys cant get women. But, if you dont have that confidence, it’s important not to overcompensate. Open the door for her; dont throw your coat over a puddle.


    Gives it up? Sex is something that is shared between two people. Women don’t “give up sex.” You should keep your outdated, patriarchal views about sex to yourself. You probably hate the fact that women are no longer oppressed and are sexually liberated to have sex with anyone they actually like.


    So you think you are owed money/gifts after sex? Hello. The dark ages called. They want their sexism back.

    If you posted this anonymously, I’d have thought you were a creepy, fedora-wearing, permavirgin, neckbeard loser who never left his mom’s basement.

    • Haha! Of all the names I’ve ever been called, “a creepy, fedora-wearing, permavirgin, neckbeard loser” is a definite first. Thanks for the laugh!

      You certainly have a way with your witty insults.

      • Seriously though, he does have a point. Your writing seems to betray a certain prejudice toward somewhat dated gender roles in courtship. Men pursue and prove themselves, women attract select.

        If your friend wants an actual date with this guy, she should tell out outright: “Hey, let’s go to dinner tonight. It’ll even be my treat.” If he agrees, then she gets exactly what she wants. If he doesn’t, then she knows all she needs to know about where she stands in his world. In the 21st century we cannot continue to demand the old fashioned gender role duties of old, while simultaneously hoping to build a world of greater equality between genders.

        So to answer your question…where has dating gone? It’s largely disappeared. But probably not for the reasons that you might be inclined to first think. The reason dating is disappearing is because as a society we have made only a half assed effort to modernize and achieve gender equality. We’ve gained some ground in the sense that it’s become more acceptable for women to embrace and express their sexuality with far less judgment than was the case a couple decades ago. But we’ve not gained anywhere near enough ground to eliminate the stereotypical “male” duties that continue to be expected. The result is that dating has turned into women meeting men on the same level sexually, but still holding back and waiting for men to live up to their “duty” romantically. That is, most women continue to sit back and wait for a man to ask her out, expect a man to treat her to a date, etc. But modernized men are just as unwilling to fill this old fashioned prejudice as modern women are of filling old fashioned prejudices about women.



        Somebody sould fucking reflect on this.

      • As a woman who does expect guys to be the one to ask me out and the one to pay for dates (at least early on and certainly before we are exclusive) it’s not about getting things in exchange for sex. What we are demanding isn’t “treats” or “payments” for past or future sexual favors. What we are demanding is some indication that they respect us enough to spend time with us outside of their dorm room and where they are likely to be seen by the community at large. There are certainly other ways to show your respect but honestly the easiest and quickest test is whether they ask you out on dates. I think this is why women and girls continue to see guys asking them out as the indicator of a guy respecting them, because the guys who do respect us happen to also be the guys who ask us out, even if they don’t spend any money. From what I’ve seen going to a free event or hiking or really anything other than “hanging out” or “watching” a movie on their couch is counted as a gentlemanly maneuver.

        That said your point about women getting on the same level sexually but holding back and waiting for men romantically is well taken. I think that until we stop calling women desperate for asking a guy out or pathetic for wanting a hook up to be something more, men will continue to see women who want a relationship (or anything more than a hook up they can walk away from) wanting to be taken on dates.


        I’m calling BS on this. Why in the world would any guy take you out on a date and pay for it when you aren’t even exclusive (which means you can be hooking up with some other guy right after that date is over)?

        You are just looking for free steak dinners and bottles of wine from guys. That is so pathetic and cheap.


        Why would anyone respect you when you treat them as an option? You are so so creepy.

      • The only people calling women desperate for asking guys out is other women. The only people calling women pathetic for wanting more are other women or complete a-hole men that were probably bad decisions in the first place.

        And the reason that women want dates is to get free stuff. Don’t give me any of the respect garbage. There’s a reason that men are “expected” to pay. If all you wanted is respect you probably wouldn’t objectify yourself by becoming something to be won over with free meals. Things would be different.

      • To go along with that, I think that’s what happens evolutionary as well. In nature, one sex pursues the other and he/she/it has to be the one doing all the work. For instance, males being flashy and colorful to attract females. The peacock is a prime example of this instance. I’m not saying this is correct though. I just thought it was interesting and wanted to share a different point.

      • I agree. When I want to hang out sober (aka go on a date with a guy) I have been hooking up with, I am more than willing to split the bill. Or maybe he pays for dinner and I pay for the movie. College guys are poor too, they can’t afford to be taking girls on all these dates and paying for everything, nor should they have to.

      • > You certainly have a way with your witty insults.

        It wasn’t a compliment, genius.

        And stop eating burritos. You’ll look better without all that baby fat.

      • You call yourself a “modern day man,” but then you resort to a cruel and sexist (and untrue) comment about the author’s appearance. You can disagree with someone without resorting to ad hominen attacks. At a fundamental level, this is an article about asking for and giving respect. You are doing neither

      • Woah. Sweetheart, anyone can be a lardtub. Women, men, furries, anyone. Its unattractive and more importantly unhealthy.

      • @ModernDayMan At least she had more balls to post a picture. Not the same could be said for you. Best not to though, you’re probably some fedora wearing, lame ass who couldn’t get a date unless it was your mom.

      • You have been making some good points, but now you’re just a douche.You’re not helping convince other people to your view by that pretty awful comment.

      • This is just how angry feminists try to shame and silence men who have opinions about the women they might want to marry. They have a 151 point checklist for the man they will marry and expect his checklist to have zero.

    • Sorry but I don’t know any girls this age who have “patriarchal” views. It’s a modern day way of looking at it, which you should know since you’re such a “Modern Day Man”
      Sex isn’t exactly the special oh my gosh moment it used to be like back in the 50’s. It’s sad, but true. And yes, women do “give up sex” cause guess what, you’re not getting any unless she consents or you rape her. So tell me, how is a girl consenting to sex an outdated patriarchal view?

      And we don’t think we are owed anything after sex. But I mean come on, like she said, is it too much to take us out for like just one more half an hour. Sex makes you hungry anyway, why don’t you take out the lovely girl who just let you bang her for awhile. Or could it be, oh yeah, you’re just looking for a hook up. I guess the relationship isn’t really so important to you after all because you don’t feel like spending six extra dollars to feed you and the girl you just spent a night with. You’d rather run away than take her out on a date. She’s not even worth a six dollar burrito.

      Now what sounds more sexist to you? Fuck and dump or wanting to go on a date with the guy you just had sex with?

      • You girls go for guys who only want you for sex and you wonder why you dont get dates. I find this amazing. Here’s a tip stop going for guys who only want you for sex and start going for guys who want to date. Its really as simple as that.

      • Though I agree a lot of girls (especially the underclassmen in college, as far as I can tell) do often pine after these dudes they’ve only been drunkenly hooking up with, it’s normally (hopefully) just a phase. A couple of my good friends do still like to complain about their “fuck buddy” not asking them out or not being “faithful,” to which I say, “Yeah, you fucked after 2 hours of knowing each other…whaddya expect.”

        So while I do partially agree with you, just so you know a lot of girls do eventually realize who to go for if they want an actual relationship. Also, some girls go after dudes who just want sex cause they also just want sex. Just putting that out there – not all of them bitch about not getting asked out by their friends with benefits cause they’re cool with not dating the dude, they just want sex.


        When? After sucking 70 dicks? Hahaha. Nobody wants to drive a used up car with 200,000 miles on the odometer.

      • Hi. I have to quote selectively from your comment, but I’m just trying to answer your question honestly and help the discussion. Don’t want to put you down for adding to the discussion. Respect.

        “who just let you bang her for awhile”


        The modern idea is that both guy an girl give their consent to a heterosexual encounter, *instead of assuming the guy wants sex and so has already given implied consent*.

        Your description is outdated and even patriarchal because of the assumption that a guy is actively looking for sex and a girl is passively choosing whether to allow sex to happen. This view doesn’t allow a girl full agency or a complete sexual personality. It also generalizes about the mindset of a guy.

        I know that you are reacting to the original hypothetical situation in which a guy and girl are hooking up, but you could think again about hidden assumptions in your descriptions.

        I agree with you in one sense – I feel that hetero sex is often more physically affecting as a girl because I am the one feeling strong pressure inside my body. If that physical difference factors into the discussion, that’s something else to consider. It is a good reason for a guy to be considerate with a partner, in terms of comfort and even food as you say.

        Thanks for reading.

      • You seem to have a lot of repressed sexual and non-sexual frustration inside. Have you ever considered seeing a shrink?

      • I think your rape comment was completely unnecessary – men get raped too, statistically less often than women do but it happens to a significant degree nonetheless. Regardless, if you’re expecting a man to “take you out after you just let him bang you for awhile” maybe you shouldn’t have let him bang you in the first place if what you are looking for is an actual date. Fuck and dump doesn’t sound sexist to me at all, quite frankly, your assumption that men are the only ones who do it is what strikes me as sexist. As a woman, if I want to go out one night looking for drunken hookups that I’m never going to call, I can do that as I please and the man I sleep with shouldn’t expect a nice dinner date the next day. The same goes for women, sleep with the men who you want to sleep with, expect nothing in return because sex is sex! Why should a woman “letting a guy bang her” entitle her to something afterward? That sounds like prostitution to me.

  4. “When you like a boy and that boy likes you, it shouldn’t be that complicated” – it’s not. Have we all forgotten about “He’s just not that into you”? If a man, guy, boy – whatever you want to call him, wants to be with you he will. If he’s texting you at 2am or only on weekends, I’m sorry to say he doesn’t. Girls need to stop feeling sorry for themselves and start waiting for a man who is ready to be in a committed relationship. If a guy wants to be with you, he will move the earth to be with you & if he doesn’t he will use you when it’s convenient. Chivalry is in a guys blood, he just has to like you enough.

    • Guy who moves earth is perfect… for someone else. 100% guaranteed. Free sex elsewhere why try where its hard.

      “Chivalry is in a guys blood”
      … Just like housework is in a woman’s right??? No, it really is not in our blood. Perhaps if women gave chivalrous men a shot more men might try that, but sadly it is not the case.

  5. I like where you were going with this article! Sounds like you are really pissed off which is good in providing topical articles, but I would recommend on a bit more structure instead of filling it all in with fucks.

    Overall though, I got what you meant 🙂 I agree, the dating game is all fucked up.

  6. This whole article is just so much bullshit, woman set the terms of the dating market, you talk about ‘slut pride’ and how you shouldn’t be judged for seeing one guy one day and another the next…but that’s not how the world works, no guy wants to wine and dine a slut or someone that’s so at ease playing men off each other for things.

    The fact is sluts like you aren’t worth it, you see no problem sleeping with two guys in one weekend citing how common it is…that’s no excuse and a great reason to give you a wide berth, and you are right back in the day a woman coukld see multiple people before she went steady…note I typed see not fuck, if you are fucking multiple guys why would one lower himself to commit? he already gets the milk for free.

    To answer your question, feminism killed dating and replaced it with hook up culture which is basically, ugly girls encourage sex so guys that normally wouldn’t give them the time of day will fuck them as now there is no penalty for pre-marital sex, the problem is ugly girls win as they get something otherwise unobtainable other women get advice that will leave them wor, haggard single and un-dateable by thirty.

    And it will never go back as I mentioned earlier women make the rules…but if they were to go on a sex boycott inevitably some of the prettier and a lot of the ugly women will inevitably ‘cross the picket’ as by restricting sex to zero and suddenly it becomes a lot more valuable, classic prisoners dilemma.


    Why are you so cheap? What happened to equality for women? Why don’t you take him out on a date and buy him dinner?

    • Sorry if I gave the impression of being “cheap” as you so eloquently said.

      I actually spend money on my boyfriend all the time – we have a very balanced relationship. But maybe that’s because he doesn’t treat me like shit, or play with my feelings? Just saying.

      • I think what the commenter was trying to say was why can’t your friend, for example, ask the guy out on a date? Why is the guy being blamed for not doing so when maybe he just doesn’t know that is what she wants? Both genders in the dating/hooking up world need to start being clear with one another about what it is they want.

        Also, maybe you should stop looking at sex as something a woman “gives up”. It comes from two people, and neither the man nor woman owes the other party anything just because they had sex. If a woman wants something more than just sex, then she needs to speak up about it. As a woman, I find it a bit odd that you’re expecting guys to just magically know that the person they’re hooking up with wants something more than. Speak up and communicate! That’s the only way the mind games you wrote about will stop.

      • I think you need to stop looking at sex as something that is given up by women. Nobody owes you anything just because you had sex with them. As a woman, I find it weird that you would expect a man to just know that you want something more than sex. Why not just ask him out on a date? What is so difficult about communicating with him. Stop expecting guys to just do everything, you can initiate things as well.

      • Thank you so much for saying that. I hate when supposedly “liberated” women are actually spouting bullshit views. This article insinuates sex is something the girl is “giving up,” and the guy is “taking,” and thus the dude should really take the girl out to dinner to thank her for letting him fuck her.

        SEX IS A MUTUAL ACT (or that’s what it should be, if there’s mutual consent). Neither party owes the other if it’s just some drunk hook up. And yeah, if you want to go on a date, just ask someone on a date. Honestly.

    • Lets just flip the script here…. “Is it really ovary killing to ask a guy a girl to drop to drop $6.75 on you at Chipotle after busting your balls pleasuring her in bed for the last 2 hours? Dudes get hungry!”

  8. As a guy, I agree with you in the fact that a relationship, whether it be just the beginning of something, or more serious, shouldn’t be as shallow as it is now. If I am into a girl, I’ll ask her on a date! I just did last Saturday! Granted, I’m graduating so it’s the tail end of college for me, but I think that should be the norm.

    I think real, meaningful conversation and relationships have been diluted by today’s society, like by the problem of texting, for one example. Casual hookups being more common to the few and far between date nights should be changed. There is a lack of respect, by both guys and girls, on today’s college interaction and this won’t change, even if it should.

  9. This isn’t a generational phenom. People make the mistake of thinking their generation is so radically different than any other previous generation. From the late promiscuous sixties, through the seventies, eighties, nineties, and early 2000’s people have been sleeping with strangers and having completely casual sex. Stop acting like our generation is the downfall of all human existence. I think we romanticize the eighties through the warped lens of cinema and 16 candles. Dating has always been complicated. You’re almost always left wondering “So what does this mean now?” This article was literally about nothing and most likely written by some chick that never gets any for the sole purpose of an article quota. Next time write about something that’s actually important, like, I don’t know.. the growing tension and increasingly authoritarian policies in turkey, or the potential cost of allowing the annexation of Crimea, a sovereign territory, by Russia? Come on people.. there’s more important things than being swooned and having your dinners payed for by prince charming. Spoiler alert: he doesn’t exist. And if he did you probably don’t deserve him.

    • Dillon,

      I’m so glad you took the time out of your day to read & comment on my blog post. I know it wasn’t about the “increasingly authoritarian policies in Turkey” or Russia, but obviously you found it entertaining – as I intended it to be.

      If you’re scouring the Internet for more politically-oriented articles, I’ll suggest a link for you: http://www.cnn.com.

      Happy reading!

      • Lol. Well there is not much reason why she would know that mainstream news is bogus…Although everybody SHOULD. She is clearly not an idiot, just uninformed (as we all were once). And anyway, she made her point, which is this- a blog is just a means of expression, a reflection of the author. It does not have to report on newsworthy issues.

      • girls deserved to be treated with respect by guys, but girls also need to give guys something to respect


        those 2 sayings are a pretty good reply to your article i think…
        but from my perspective i dont want to date a girl that i met when i was drunk and banged that night, just like she probly wouldn’t want to date me…its a two way street here, and btw if a girl wants a burrito from chipotle then fuckin ask for a burrito, im not a mind reader, to sum it all up, if im drunk and bang a girl it was because i thought she was hot, not because i want to date her, now if i meet a girl ill actually LIKE ill take her out on a date at that point

    • Blah blah blah “potential cost.” I didn’t plan to comment on this article because it’s just more ‘UGH dating is so CONFUSING!’ tripe, but you’re seriously overestimating the importance of Crimea to anyone but Russia. “The sovereign territory” of Crimea was in fact gifted to Ukraine by Kruschev in 1954 as a drunken gesture of goodwill. The people who live there are Russian, and the referendum clearly indicated that they want to be part of Russia (the political cartoons are bullshit btw). The worst that can be said of Russia in this situation is that they’re ‘Indian givers,’ especially given the fact that the US’s invasion of Iraq was far less justifiable.

      What’s more, why should we give a fuck what American policymakers are worried about? They clearly don’t give a fuck about the anxieties of the general populace, they don’t even listen to us (unless you count listening to our phone calls). The least they could do is leave the Internet alone but now they want to lock that down for the ISPs and media corps too. The idea that the average American will somehow be ‘affected’ by Putin’s geopolitical maneuvers is pretty absurd. Our own government is a lot more dangerous to us as individuals, try worrying about that.

      • The referendum had heavy oversight by armed pro Russian militants and those who were against Russian annexation boycotted voting during the referendum because they considered it illegitimate, making it highly flawed and unrepresentative. This isn’t the place to discuss politics, I was just suggesting there are more important things than boo-hooing about current dating culture.

    • Only it is, because it’s a result from the disparity that feminism has caused. They encouraged sexual empowerful and “hook up” culture that destroyed dating. I understand you want to be the devil’s advocate and be right while everyone else here is wrong, but that makes you a douchebag and you’re wrong.

      • Thank you for telling me about hookup culture’s effect on dating.. but you don’t know how to argue. Simply telling someone they are a douche bag and wrong is not enough. Please explain why my statement was wrong. Do you not believe that people have been having completely casual sex with strangers since the Victorian times? Do you feel our generation is more promiscuous than previous generations? Do you not feel that dating is romanticized? Do you think dating is dead? Under what context? Do you think prince charmings with high moral standards exist and do you think they desire to be with a promiscuous individual that has gone against every single one of those morals?

      • Also, I hope you don’t think I’m actually an ass hole.. I am just playing devils advocate. I mean, I agree with you that hookup culture has had a negative impact on dating culture.. But I wouldn’t consider it dead.

  10. The girl that so eagerly just told me she had “literally the best fucking threesome” with her roommate and number 23 on the soccer team will just as quickly complain how there are no good guys in the world. Whats more, she thinks she deserves him. I mean, I just don’t understand why such a beautiful soul of an individual can’t find a decent man… I’m perplexed…

  11. All of you butt-hurt males are reading way too far into this. She is clearly stating that the dating game (note: in college) has become shaded by texting, social media and a guy’s expectation of sex upon first meeting a girl. The idea of a date is completely nonexistent among college students these days. I think this is a great article to wake up 18-22 year olds-you can’t start a relationship based on sex. Take your negativity and your favorite jar of lotion and go beat it off elsewhere; those kind of comments will never land you a decent woman.

    Overall, great job on bringing an unspoken subject to the surface in a humorous manner. Great read for any college student.

    • “you can’t start a relationship based on sex.” what the fuck, why not? Some of us women clearly state what it is we’re looking for from a guy and can have sex at the same time. You girls are asking for men to stop calling you sluts and what not, but you’re still looking at sex as something that is “given up”, and that needs to stop. If you want something more than sex then fucking speaking up, tell the guy what you’re looking for and stop blaming guys for not knowing. The dating game in college isn’t easy, I totally feel that, but at the same time women need to stop expecting men to do all the work all the time. You can ask him out on a date too you know.

    • all you butt hurt females read to far into men…we have sex with a girl because we want to have sex…not because we want to date and marry them…because if we want to do that, guess what?! we date and marry them. Not to mention dating is not gone in college, (although it seems like it is for you) its just guys have a distinction between a hot girl i want to bang, and a girl im actually interested in.

      • Here is the problem! DING DING DING! Why is it ok to classify one girl as “a hot girl I want to bang” what sets her apart from “the girl your actually interested in”? A girl who is hot and maybe enjoys sex couldn’t possibly have a great mind as well! (sarcasm) then if you were not such an asshole you could end up with a girl who is hot, fun, great at sex, AND smart. ….but oh no lets just put them in a category of *only good for drunken sex nights* a PERSON not just women should be judged only after knowing what is in their mind, not how many times they have had sex. Also I’m sorry but I think if you just had sex with someone they might deserve some conversation, gosh how fucking stupid do you have to be to even get turned on without some mental stimulation… are we cavemen? And by the way most of the comments above have made me sick. you men that look at woman like they are here for you to choose to “bang or marry” don’t flatter yourselves no one deserves the shit you will most likely put them through. stupid womanizers.

      • > lets just put them in a category of *only good for drunken sex nights*

        You sould see some of those broads in my local bar. You’ll agree we need that category.


        Shoulda, coulda, woulda. If I had wheels, I’d be a wagon.

        > no one deserves the shit you will most likely put them through.

        And yet, they keep on sleeping on. LOL.

      • The question still remains. What sets “the girl you’re actually interested in” and “the girl you want to just bang” apart? From what I can tell there is not any girls men are “actually interested in” because in this day every body is sleeping around, men included. The sad thing is girls seem to accept that, while men are (judging from what’s being said in the comments) are not okay with it. So I suppose what I’m asking is what is an acceptable female to you men? Just curious.

      • I can’t talk for every guy but most guys would agree with me.

        Things women think men care about but we don’t (solipsism):
        1) A woman’s educational qualifications
        2) A woman’s career/job/salary
        3) A woman’s personality/sense of humor

        Top 5 things men care about:

        1) Sexual history: Is she or has she ever been the town/college/city/school bicycle? Most guys prefer a virgin but a couple of long term partners is acceptable. Personally, for me, if a woman had more than 3 dicks in her she’s not marriage material. The number will be different for different guys but honestly, when you have taken 32 dicks, what’s number 33 or 34 or 68 or 107? It means nothing to you. Why should I pay for something that others got for free when she was younger, newer, and hotter?

        2) Pair bonding: You can also call this emotional history. Has she been with so many guys that she will continue to pine on the one that got away or the one that rocked her bed, etc. Its also related to the number of sexual partners she’s had. By the time she’s 25, the average woman has so many long term and short term sexual encounters that they completely lose any ability to pair bond. They have too much emotional baggage.

        3) Likeliness to divorce you: This one is simple. Will she drag me through the family courts where I will lose 95% of the time. Will she take away half my assets and future salary? Will she decide to leave for an ex or her new boy toy or some rich guy she met on vacation? Will she be loyal (Ha ha ha ha) to her husband?

        4) Physical attraction: Simple thing. Youth and beauty. If she is over 28 she’s most likely losing her looks. By the time she is 35, her eggs are dried up and any kids we may have will be retarded.

        5) Living habits: Can she keep a home or does she live like a pig? You should see the apartments some of the girls I dated lived in. Unclean dishes in the sink. Sewage in the sink. Stained toilets and bathrooms. Good lord! My bachelor apartment is a 100 times cleaner, neater, and fashionable than theirs. Can she cook for me? Hot pockets doesn’t count. Will she take over the house and relegate me to some shitty “man cave”. Why should I get relegated to the damn basement/garage in my own house that I paid for? Why should I be a serf when I can be the Lord of my own home?

        So yeah, 98% of American women fail to qualify as marriage material.

        Do a test, take a look at yourself and your friends and see where they score on the above criteria. LOL.

      • I actually agreed with all of your points before this post…#1? Really? Come on. I went through a one-night stand phase but it’s in the past and I’m simply not like that anymore. Do I regret the one night stands? Some of them, yeah. Definitely. But I can’t take them back now, they happened when I first got to college and didn’t know any better, never had “the talk,” parents never talked about “waiting,” etc. etc. For whatever reason I did sleep around and I think you should be less quick to judge someone based on that. Because if I could take it back, I would, but I didn’t know any better when I was 18 and 19 so…it’s just how things played out.

        But I do agree that if a girl, or a guy, is in the midst of sleeping around with many different partners, they’re most likely not, at the time, “marriage” or rather dating material.


        So you say. Why should I believe you when your history indicates differently? The best predictor of future behavior is past behavior.


        That’s not my problem. Ignorance is not an excuse.


        I don’t care what you think. I will judge you. So will most other guys.


        Now learn to deal with the consequences.

      • That’s it I shall now be a lesbian. Thanks for ruining my view of men. I would rather not be judged on how many dicks I’ve had. If that is my worth to a man, that’s just shallow. I mean really? Is it like “hmmph, you good virgin, I marry you now, me Tarzan you Jane, you mine.hmph.” no thanks.

      • > I would rather not be judged on how many dicks I’ve had.

        And I would like to have a $40 million yacht and a private jet.

        But the world doesn’t work on whims and wishes.

      • So what you’re saying is that personality isn’t actually a part of an effective relationship? I honestly think that is one of the most important things. I understand that back in the day, relationships were based on a women’s youth, conservative sexual life, and what their family raising skills are. But times have changed. As much as I don’t like this new society, with all of the man sluts and women whores and people relying on relationships solely for sex, one thing I do like is that everyone’s opinion can be heard.

        One of the girls I dated a year back (we are friends again) just made me realize a truth about life that I have been ignoring and overcomplicating for so long. To quote her, “I just don’t worry about stupid shit.” During our relationship I was too concentrated on impressing her and trying to “win her over”, like you say every man has to do, and ultimately that made me think of her in a completely different way. I was worried about who would think she is pretty and who would be impressed with my ability to land this girl, and it lead to my downfall with her. Now that I have realized that there’s so much bull shit that goes on in finding a partner, it’s possible for me to go back to her because now I am on the simplistic, rudimentary page that she has always been on; the stupid shit does not matter.

        Why do you think people are happy in relationships, even if they are as poor as dirt? It is not because of how good a man or woman is in bed, nor because of how much money he has. In certain relationships, yes, this can be a factor. But otherwise, in a relationship unrelated to vanity, it is solely based on how well your personalities click, and whether or not you will give each other, to, well, each other.

        THAT is why relationships fail, because too many people do not seek happiness in substance of character, they seek happiness in wealth and ability. Real men show they can lead and show they can make a woman feel like who she wants to be. They do not have to buy their way into it. Some men abuse this ability and become womanizers. Real women show they can care and show they can make a man feel like what he wants to be. (The LGBT community is exempt from this observation, obviously). Some women abuse this ability and lead on tons of men. It’s never one-sided. It’s simple and people like you overcomplicate this matter into something that it need not be; a battleground.

        Show some love, show some peace man. You make some valid points, but the way you are explaining is filled with so much derision and sarcasm.

        Just so you know, I am a Lutheran conservative man who always carries the dominance in his relationship so you cannot proclaim:


        Obviously you’re a liberal asshole who lets girls walk all over you LOL.


        Yes but what does your moral standard say about a person who has had (hypothetically speaking of course) about a PERSON(both genders included) Who sleeps with 50 others in 4 months vs another who has been with 2 in 6 months

      • Wait you mean people categorize and place people in different boxes?!?!?!?!? You mean you don’t friend some guys and fuck other guys and date other guys and ignore other guys and talk to other guys?

        or naw?


    Only if you feel comfortable with guys asking YOU the same.

    It’s college. Wider world might have a wage gap, but both genders are roughly the same amount of money in this environment. There’s absolutely no reason money should be flowing from men to women here.

  13. Call me a hippy but I completely disagree with the normal “conventions of dating”. If you feel close to someone and the feeling is mutual then a “date” is nothing more than spending time appreciating that person. Dating is some bullshit, being lovers and friends is real. Fuck societal norms

  14. Wow, is your use of profanity intended to cite credibility on your part? Sounds like you are angry at the wrong guys for not giving you the time of day, even at Chipotle. Since when is it a bad thing to not date in college? What is wrong with expressing yourself and trying new things during your 4 years on campus? Why limit yourself to one person when you can potentially meet thousands of other people? Everyone is in a hurry to find “love” and I got news for you, “Your 30 year old self” would probably be disgusted with your college boyfriends when it’s all said and done. Have fun, live a little, go on a walk of shame, nobody likes a boring prude obsessing over the fact of going on Chipotle dates.

    • “The Truth”

      There is absolutely nothing wrong with dating in college – I’m glad you agree with the whole point of my article.

      However, an issue arises when boys take advantage of girls’ emotions and just use them for sex, no strings attached. And like I said, unless a boy commits to a girl, she shouldn’t give an F.U.C.K. about him.

      • “However, an issue arises when boys take advantage of girls’ emotions and just use them for sex, no strings attached”

        An issue arises when girls take advantage of guys’ emotions and just use them for free meals, attention, and a shoulder to cry on.

        An issue arises when a girl takes advantage of a guys desires and use sex to try and obtain commitment. That’s dishonest.

      • Boys aren’t “taking advantage” of girls. A girl chooses to let a boy use her for sex, no strings attached.

        Us guys would gladly commit to you first–but I’d like to know I’m not the only guy you required to do that. I’m sure not committing if you gave it up to the last 5 guys for free without even a $6.75 burrito first.

  15. Girls are attracted to the top 20% of attractive men, regardless of age. Those men have options and have no reason to commit unless the girl is especially feminine. This is life. This is biology. Deal with it or GTFO. Or, just have sex on the first date and watch him vanish. This is your call. Women are the gatekeepers of sex, men are the gatekeepers of commitment.

  16. There is no hook-up culture. This is a myth. Girls are going for guys out of their league and getting played by a few choice men and the vast majority of men are picking up some scraps and wouldn’t dare try to follow their hearts by being romantic. That girl they would go after is currently banging a guy who has absolutely no intention of getting serious or *laugh* take her on a date. Hypergamy.

  17. Soo many things wrong with this article.

    Carefully reread what youve wrote and your own questions are answered within themselves. One example…


    The real question here is why would a guy want to allocate his time/money with a girl who still randomly hooks up with guys they hardly know ?

    Girls like that arent dating material, thats the kind of shit high school teens do. If you want to be treated like an adult, act like an adult, these are the sort of actions that get girls thinking the way they do.

    You want a guy to have a real relationship with you, to treat you properly and show care and respect ? Stop hooking up with random guys while drunk. Start taking guys that genuinely approach you more seriously instead of brushing them off as “creeps”, that “creep” is more than likely one of the few guys who might actually have a serious interest you.

    The only ones to blame here are the people who are making poor decisions and nothing more, nothing has changed if you look at the whole picture.

  18. Briagenn, as a senior in college you are absolutely right. When I ask a girl out on an actual date it’s seen as something completely out of the ordinary. Guys should be taking girls out and actually “romancing” them, but girls need to accept this concept as well.

  19. apologies for punctuation or capitalization for the following, my phone wont let me for some reason here. however, i met my girlfriend in college during my freshman year in biology class. we are now graduating seniors and had our 3 year anniversary this month. we continue a very balanced relationship without stupid traditional rules of relationships and enjoy a much more modern gender role. every person is different, every relationship is different, and every guy is different. i despise when articles mash all guys up to be pigs or sex crazed beings and women being the victims. both genders make mistakes and both have just as many douchebags in them. if youre a girl and you wanna date in college so bad, go pursue a guy. dont wait til one comes for you, this is 2014..you can ask a man out. if it doesnt work out a few times, congrats now you know what men dealt with for so long. rejection. it happens, try again. i found my girl and i plan on being with her for as long as humanly possible. the worst thing you can do is generalize a gender.

  20. From my experience women are equally to blame. I started college a very flirty but sound moral guy. I meet girls and if they showed interest and I liked them I offered a date within a week of meeting them. The problem is girls now either want to hook up and never see you or text for months before they will go on a date. No guy in college wants to put the months effort. Also, a girl that is “slutty” is easy to get in bed but no guy wants to date the that girl. So after being turned down or ignored being the good guy. I started not caring and received a LOT more attention from girls. Girls don’t want a nice guy that take them on dates. They want the exciting Hott guy they met but won’t commit. Women then complain all guys are jerks. No you friend zone us… Turn us to jerks then complain we’re not nice to you anymore. After all this, I agree a sound relationship should flow easy at first and should be started with casual dates. But largely the girls that complain about not finding nice guys do it to themselves.

    • Okay so I do agree with the points you are making but NOT on the generalized scale you are making them. YES, that does happen in college, but the same behavior is seen from men. Newsflash, there are shitty people in both genders. College is, from what I’ve seen, a time for people to be extra douchey and nonchalant with their feelings and honestly, to treat people kiiinda shitty. Is it right? No, it sucks that both girls & guys tend to lead people on in ways similar to what you’ve described. But not all girls are like this, nor are all guys. Just be more open minded, and don’t decide everyone is now like that. Eventually you’ll meet someone who doesn’t only want the douchey guy – though some girls are just like that, some aren’t and some only go through that as a phase that they soon grow out of.

  21. As a young woman who realized recently that in order to be happy, I had to take control of my actions (and my sexuality), I thank you for this. It’s spot on, and not in the least insulting.

    Clearly, this article is written for women who have yet to claim their sexuality, and guys who like that in a woman (because what insecure guy wants a woman who knows what she wants in the bedroom?).

    I’m not saying to be irresponsible. But why not have a safe fling if you feel like it? Isn’t that better than being sexually frustrated and stringing some guy along because you don’t know what you want?

  22. A wild pissed off feminist appeared!

    Listen, before you go around pointing men out as the bane of all existences, you may want to reexamine yourself for a second.


    You’re making it sound here as if women should be rewarded for their time spent hooking up with a guy, or worse, should be paid through a dinner date or something of the sort before “giving it up”. Why is this the case with women? Thanks to this I see no delineation between “dating” and “prostitution”. You’re the ones who put a price tag on vaginas. Sex is a two-way street: a wholly consensual act that both men and women derive pleasure from. Stop acting as if men are morally corrupt beings who endure a bloodthirsty hunt for nothing but sex, while women are holy and reserved gate-keepers that possess it. Men aren’t the only ones who receive something out of such an interaction; women get something out of it too.

    When was the last time you heard the term “masculinist” thrown around? I would more than confidently bet that most people have never even heard of such a word, and would venture to say that it’s not frequently used because women love painting themselves into a corner as the helpless victim in most situations, thus making them feel the need to tap into the hidden resources of “Girl power!” and feminism. It seems like feminism is so prevalent because women still feel as if they’re at odds with men, when in reality, they’re really not. Women fought for centuries for equality. You have it now. You can’t live the rest of your life acting as if men are inherently evil and are continuously infringing upon your right to make your own decisions.

    You wanted to be treated the same, now act like it.

  23. I don’t understand whats so bad with this article, I mean really.

    I am a dude, I love old fashioned loud cars, motorcycles, trucks, good (grilled) food, quality beer and my classy fiancé. (side note: thanks computer, for automatically putting that weird thing on the e, because I certainly don’t know how to type it myself)

    First off, the article was fantastic.

    second, I don’t know why guys are so afraid to pay for a meal, date or whatever. Am I the only one who feels like a schmuck when I don’t? First off, the chipotle example, which seems to have pissed a bunch of guys off. Its not even $7.00… which means even if you make minimum wage (provided you have a job) you make that in less than an hour. If 7 extra dollars is worth bitching about, maybe you shouldn’t be spending you money going out to eat in the first place. This is like holding the door open, its really not that freaking hard to do, and it goes a long way in showing that you actually care about a girl. If you don’t care about her, then don’t take her on a date!

    I don’t want to hear any garbage on “beta male”. You obviously cant afford an extra 7 bucks at chipotle, which means you obviously don’t have a job, which means you’re probably between 18 and 22 and still living on mommy and daddy’s dime.

    I cant tell if a bunch of guys are joking and being ultra sarcastic, or if they REALLY are that insecure. You’ll never be happy with someone of the opposite gender if you’re that worried about what you get in return. This explains why so many relationships fail so well. People (guys and girls here, this is not gender specific) are so concerned with keeping tabs and making sure everything comes out nice and fair and perfect. NEWS FLASH! IT WONT! Not that one side is taking advantage of the other, but if you get so worried about tallying who did what, you’re missing the point of everything.

    side note: Since when did “expressing yourself” become sleeping around the block? If that’s all you have to express about yourself, then it sounds like you live a pretty narrow life.

    Interesting hypothesis that I was reading the other day, that viewing pornography increases that person’s expectations of having sex easily. With a HUGE increase in internet capacity, the adult film industry has exploded. Is it so crazy to think that people get hooked on adult videos, which teaches guys that “if shes a girl, she wants the D”. Which then leads to them getting pissed off when girls are interested in something else? I mean its really the same point that Disney teaches girls that guys are princes who are tall, dark, handsome, perfect teeth and will never do anything to upset them.

    • Thank you for a ray of light in an otherwise medieval comment discussion, Matt.

      As to your porn comment, I think that dating issues (and social issues in general) come from a variety of places and porn is just one of many. Movies, TV, social media, music, smart phones, Magazines, the News, and sexism (towards both genders) all play a role in degrading the morality of young people.

      I think if you (or your friend or any woman) really wants a traditional relationship (which is what you’re hinting at), then you’re not looking in the right places. If you’re looking for a “Traditional” guy by going to parties and having half-drunk hook-ups you’ll never find the guy you’re looking for, so don’t expect the guys you meet to be “dating” you. They’re not and they won’t. That being said if you’re looking for a guy to hook-up with, you’re spot on. If you are looking for any relationship but the guy won’t make the move, then you make the move and you’ll find out pretty quick whether he’s a keeper.

  24. That’s your problem right there.

    Respect is neither asked for nor given. It is EARNED. If one does nothing to earn respect, one does not GET respect.

  25. You have to live worthy of what you want. If you want a traditional guy, with traditional values, you best have traditional values also. No guy who has “saved it” for that right girl, will want to give it away to a girl who has ridden half the college, or had a “threesome with #23.”

    It is also incredibly hard to find a guy who has done that, especially because if he’s still a virgin in college, he’s getting made fun of, so he doesnt broadcast it.

  26. I see a lot of different points here. I don’t agree with all of them, but I do believe we are all entitled to our opinion. Personally, I’m not worried about the whole dating thing being messed up. When I do want an actual date because I legitimately like someone, I tell them, and we date. We talk. and if I like them enough somewhere between the 2nd and 4th date, I’ll have sex. It doesn’t have to be on the 3rd in can be anywhere in that range for me. If I really don’t like him then I apologize and I go. It’s no big deal to me. Through this method trying to find a guy that I can usually get along with, makes me happy, is good in bed, and overall really is perfect for me, I’ve found one. We’ve been together for 2 years. There is no “one” out there. Love is something that grows between two people who truly care for one another. It’s not gonna walk up and slap you in the face. You have to nurture it from infatuation. It takes a lot of work and and time. Sleeping around constantly or going on a bunch of celibate dates is NOT going to get you there. Follow the middle path and you’re more likely to be happy.

      • Dude, I get it. You’re pissed that you have to cough up the money. But this girl’s method is different than most. She genuinely tries to make something work with someone she is interested in before having sex, and thus, it is what we think of as the traditional form of dating. In return, she gets the the traditional gentleman treatment of having her dinner paid for, ect. That’s just how dating works.
        If you want a girl that is willing to pay for your dates, then you need to find a cougar with money. Many girls are okay with going halfsies after the first date, but they still expect that first date to be paid for.
        Unfortunately, you are going to run into girls that will take advantage of you and your free dates before cutting you loose. But if you do get stuck with a girl like this, you are looking for the wrong person. Take a step back, figure out what you actually want out of a female partner, and then target the right girl and try again.

        No one ever said dating was easy, especially on the man’s wallet

      • > But this girl’s method is different than most….Unfortunately, you are going to run into girls that will take advantage of you and your free dates before cutting you loose.

        So you want him to go searching for that unicorn? What a waste of time, effort, and money! Ain’t nobody got patience for that shit.

      • The problem with most of these comments? HUGE HUGE generalizations. Girls far and wide do not expect & assume that the first date will be paid for. I’m sure some do but it’s not like it has been hardwired into our brains.

  27. Great article, I’m a photojournalism major at Wright State and you have created quite a buzz with a simple article, well done! I love this topic and love to hear what people have to say about this topic. I hope chivalry isn’t dead, but the negative people on here have their standards far too low. Every girl deserves to be treated other than sex. Sorry for the truth people.

    • “Every girl deserves to be treated other than sex. Sorry for the truth people.”

      You wouldn’t know the truth if it bit you in the ass. No woman “deserves” to be “treated other than sex”. That privilege is earned. Pull your head out of your feministed ass.

      • So it’s okay to say that woman has to earn a man’s love, but it’s not okay to say that a man has to also earn a woman’s love? This is just getting better and better.

      • Actually, nowhere did I say that a man didn’t have to earn love. Everyone has to earn love. Feminists believe that women are exempted from having to earn anything, and that they are automatically equal to anyone. This is false.

    • No, every girl does not deserve to be treated other than sex. Sex is all most girls out there are good for. Sorry for the truth people.

    • …NOT EVERY GIRL WANTS MORE THAN SEX. Someone said she was a feminist? No, she’s not. Feminism would be recognizing both women AND men can be assholes and take advantage of people, or can mutually engage in “booty call” relationships where both parties want nothing more than enjoyable, consensual (drunk?) sex.

      Though all people in general deserve a certain level of respect, I think, not every person automatically deserves to be looked at as potential “marriage material.” And no one “deserves dinner” just for having sex. Wtf? I definitely have been with dudes that I only wanted to have sex with…guys also have been with girls they only want to have sex with. And then when you meet the right person you realize you want more than sex, and then you date. I know dating is complicated but people need to stop inserting their Puritanical values into this shit.

  28. Fuck the alpha guys hoping to pussy-lure commitment out of them. Hit 30 and realise you haven’t snagged one. Lambast all the guys you were never going to fuck for realising that and stop wasting their time on women who were never going to be attracted to them in the first place.

    Shock and dismay follows! Shaming beta morons ensues: how dare they want something out of a relationship! Sexist! Pig! Don’t you realise you are held to a different entitlement standard than the alphas! Creeeeeeep! Loser!

    You fuck the guys who have tons of choice and need not commit and use the rest as emotional tampons. There are consequences in terms of those guys looking out for their best interest? Oh my god how dare they!

    Meanwhile women have a 250 point list of what their man has to be with exactly 0 points accepted from men… well if he’s a beta that is. And they wonder why more and more of the regular Joes opt out of dating. They wonder why the alphas with so much choice feel zero incentive to commit.

    It’s OK be whatever the fuck you wanna be. But we are getting so tired of your entitlement, we are getting so tired of opting out and then having you bitch about US. You made your choice, we said “I don’t like it but fine I’ll just bow out”. But still that isn’t good enough?

    This is what you wanted, stop whining to us you don’t like the unintended consequences as if it’ll make us more positive towards you.

  29. I’m not going to go in-depth on my response but want to point out that girls throw around the words ‘clingy’ and ‘creeper’ far too often now days. If a girl is just fine with hooking up and a guy wants to ask her on a date then he’s really ‘clingy.’ I’m not going to delve too deep into this because there’s plenty of other level-headed on-topic arguments already posted (and ignored ) here but quit putting the blame entirely on men.

    • As a girl, I agree with your observation. I’ve actually had multiple discussions with friends about this and we’ve collectively come to the conclusion that dating in college is so fucked up that we don’t even know what to do when a nice guy comes along. As a senior in college, I have been on numerous dates with “nice guys” and each and every time I have ended it because “they are so nice but there’s nothing there..” And that is sad. I’ve become so used to “talking” to guys and being played with that it’s just become engrained in my head that this is what dating is supposed to look like. Again, as a senior, I’ve come to realize how dumb and fucked up that is and clearly I’ve been going after the wrong guys but that’s just the way it is, not only for me but for a lot of my friends. We come into college with this romanticized idea of all of the dating possibilities, and after dating the wrong guys I think we just get jaded and complacent. We actually become used to the idea that meeting guys in bars is a normal way to date, and that “getting some” should be the goal of the night. Say what you will about me being a slut or going after the wrong guys or whatever but I’m just being realistic and looking back at my past mistakes. I think the party culture in college, specifically those in stereotypical college towns, just ruins dating for both men and women. /endrant

  30. While I would have to agree with your base argument that dating in college is dead, there is much I have to disagree with you about. While your argument may seem a bit biased towards males (you did touch a bit on females), I can’t disagree with you on the whole “guys being douches” thing. Our colleges and universities are filled with frat boys and sorority girls who spend any free time getting drunk and looking for a quick hookup. I say “boys” and “girls” because I don’t see those individuals as mature enough to be considered adults.

    With that aside, I do agree there is an equal contribution by both genders in the ending of college dating and things are only getting worse. There are high expectations for guys to sleep with as many girls as they can thanks to alcohol and much influence for girls have on other girls that they must make themselves as appealing/revealing in order to be “picked up” by those guys. Society has become prone to accepting the norm than to be “rebellious” which only means to be yourself nowadays.

    Take a look at how trends such as popular apps or designer apparel leads people to spend tons of money in order to fit in with their friends and society. The decline of college dating is similar to this in how the idea of a quick fix on the weekends has been sold to the public as “what everybody is doing.”

    Now I’m not a journalist or anything of the like but I felt as if I need to share my own experience here. I’ve been trying to find a girlfriend ever since I ended a long distance relationship because my ex became another sorority girl who I could no longer trust to be faithful (she moved on right away as I suspected). The only problem with girls who want to date is that they’re those “wierd ones who are proud of being wierd or unattractive.” It’s not that I have high expectations or am superficial, it’s that I feel short-term relationships are a waste of time and want a long-term relationship. However, in long term relationship it’s easy to become unnattracted to your partner and that’s something I want to avoid.

    The most romantic thing I’ve seen from a friend dating was heating up some food and sitting in our dorm with a fake candle on the table (This was their anniversary and valentine’s day mind you). Don’t pity him for not having enough money to go out for a nice date because all of his money goes towards alcohol and pot. Should he had gone one or two days without smoking pot or getting drunk he could’ve taken her to a romantic dinner and a movie or something of the like. This is anything reason I believe college dating is dead. College students just aren’t romantic anymore.

    I hope to one day find my significant other but I’ve given up hope of it happening for at least another 2 years when I graduate and can surround myself with adults and not children. For now there is not much we can do but rant about it because society’s view on the subject has just become too concrete. If I’m wrong please tell me because I’d love to push things in the right direction rather than sit on my ass and accept this flawed system.

    • You probably won’t find a significant other because there is no norm in society, and all of this is just a load of crap. Everything is you make it. Giving into the pressure of alcohol? Do you lack a prefrontal cortex?

  31. i always ask a girl if she wants to go out to tropical smoothie or something when i meet them and thats too much for them, i must be really freaking ugly or something, i have the sixpack too, wtf! I asked a girl recently, if she wanted to go out and she said ok lol and never texted me back, i think girls are really shallow!

  32. Real reason is that you can’t trust these hoes …. Drunk YOUNG College Sluts damage dudes psychologically and in no way shape or form do they want to wife up a girl who was getting fucked like a horse by some random frat bro her freshman year.

  33. College dating is dead. Cute girl once told me she liked me and wanted to get to know me better. Since I love to cook I offered to make chicken cordon bleu, fresh salad with homemade dressing and scalloped potatoes from scratch as a date to get to know each other before going to party together. Blew me off, hooked up with one of my frat buddies at the party. Encouraged to do so by her friends. Definitely not all the guy’s fault that dating culture is fucked. Not the first time I’ve seen dates offered by guys get shot down for hook ups. PS, hooked up with her a year later, asked me for that dinner then, told her she fucked up and left.

  34. I really feel like while traditional dating has decreased in college, it definitely hasn’t disappeared. Especially with how much work people put in during their college years, people might not want intimacy or a boyfriend during those years. The thing is, we need to be honest with ourselves about it.

    Especially in community colleges, where there is no such thing as dorming, dating is alive and well.

    I also would love to see studies on the amount of dates that go on in college with a year by year perspective. It seems like most of the older college people (that aren’t in frats) have girlfriends or are more relationship oriented because they’re done with the party life.

    In the end I can’t be so sure that we have too much of a problem right now, though I don’t have too much experience with the much larger colleges. It seems to me at least like it’s okay not to want to date for a year or two during college, as relationships and schoolwork are tricky beasts to balance. Once people get out of college most WANT to leave behind the party life. dating should stay where it’s the most able to produce unhindered relationships, and I think that time period is definitely after college anyway

  35. You’re article automatically assumes all women want to be in a relationship when in fact some women want no strings attached sex and to never see that person again. Or do these women need a “wake up call” too? If you just tell a guy what kind of relationship you want right off the bat, guess what? You’ll get your answer!!!

    How do you know this is becoming increasingly common? What source told you that? Or did you go out and ask people?

    Also if a guy hooks up with you and then doesn’t text you for 2 weeks, he most likely thinks of you as just a booty call he’s not playing with your feelings. We just need to use a little common sense.

  36. Well, this article is based on the premise that men and women want the same at the same time but what if – wait for it- the guy that you had sex with wasn’t looking for a relationship? mindblowing, right?

  37. Haha the comments from this article cracks me up a lot . This is a simple but yet a well written and placed article.

  38. I really hope you aren’t going to school for journalism, cause this was just… crap. So much flawed reasoning. So many generalizations. Not even coherent connections between different ideas… seriously this just looks like you went on a rant and said, “Hey, other people should read this because my opinions are super important!”

  39. Why are GIRLS always the ones being lectured??? Why are we the stupid/naive/vulnerable ones? You have no hesitance in shaming the girls for waiting around for a guy yet you fail to scold the very guys who are the ones ignoring the girls or treating them like nothing or worse! How do you expect us to find dignity and move on when we can’t even find consolation through men being scolded for treating women in the college world so poorly???!

    Now THAT’S something to think about.

    • > Why are GIRLS always the ones being lectured???

      Because they are the ones complaining about “what the f*ck happened to dating in college.”

      If this article was written by a guy, most of the comments would be lecturing guys.

  40. I was actually spurred from this article I had to make a video response: http://youtu.be/TBWzdC05NzM
    I discuss my view on the subject, which is completely different. From my view, I have asked a lot of girls out on dates and they always flake early (on the spot or via text). I think it is simply the fact that these girls whine about the topic and yet deep down they have these standards for a specific buff, douchey kind of guy that they can only find during the college night life and who NEVER want anything more than a hook-up.
    To be truthfully honest, I would say a lot of the “nice guys” want the same thing but just disguise it with a date.
    Long story short: I put out the challenge at the end of the video that I would audio record myself asking out girls on dates just to show you how the real culture is about these things. They aren’t interested. Who is to say that is so wrong? Both of us have got stuff to do.

  41. Interesting article with some good points… but a few things:

    A woman choosing to have sex with a man should not be seen as her “giving it all up.” This is a terribly patriarchal, gender-discriminatory way to look at sex. And the fact that her one condition for her choosing to have sex with this man is his taking her on a date is just poor decision making by this woman… there should be so many other factors involved so yes, kind of unreasonable.

    Maybe this man just isn’t looking for something serious? I don’t think hook-up culture is wrong. But not every man – and not every woman – is like this. The way you phrase this as a man needing to “drop $6.75” on this girl after a hook-up and needing to take this woman to dinner, diminishes the TRUE need for a man to emotionally connect to his partner and treat this woman/take her out on the basis that he actually likes her. The way you say it makes it sound like he needs to just compensate her for her services.

    First of all, I don’t think dating has completely disappeared. I’m in college, I’m in a relationship myself, I know many others in a relationship. Maybe if this was backed up with some actual stats of how the number of relationships in college has significantly declined, it would be a more substantive argument. Also this “walk of shame” nonsense is a form of SLUT SHAMING. Some women just like hooking up and notions like “walk of shame” (although I’m sure it could be unpleasant for many women to have to walk home alone in the morning) shames women who choose to hook up with men for fun.

    So you’re comparing how people call women sluts for going out with two men in one weekend, with how people call women sluts for sleeping with two men in one weekend. BUT IT’S THE WOMAN’S CHOICE. This is another bit of hypocritical slut shaming. You say how women shouldn’t be called sluts in the first scenario since it’s not as bad as the second scenario. Both scenarios are FINE. It’s the woman’s decision what she does on a weekend, whether that’s going out with two men or sleeping with two men (unless she’s in an exclusive relationship, then that’s another story). Women are not sluts when they do either of the two.

    I agree that both women and men need to stop obsessing over the syntax and technicalities of texts and online messages. I agree, it’s rather ridiculous.

    Ahh.. but this is all wrong. You’re saying in this that IT’S ALL UP TO THE MAN. If the man doesn’t make the plans, he’s a douche bag? THE WOMAN HOOKED UP WITH THE MAN TOO. It was a two person act! The man (hopefully) did not force this woman to hook up with him! If this woman truly likes this man and sees a potential relationship, she should make a move. Yes it would be gathering “self-respect” to just “MOVE ON” but it would be even more self-respect to not depend so heavily on the man to make all of the plans. So terribly patriarchal.

    And finally, yes “fuck the mind games” and “fuck the booty calls.” But women should never needlessly victimize themselves in the way you described in your article. If you hate the mind games and booty calls, say something. Step up and make plans. Like I said, don’t depend so heavily on the man. And you may not be “here to stop” women from having fun with casual sex, but to tell them to “get a clue” isn’t much different. What’s with this need to force monogamy on everyone? Some women just like having fun! For the love of everything pure, no more slut-shaming, people.

  42. The question is: just like every other girl in college, how many dozens of dongs has the author had in her snatch, and why should a guy have to pay for that used up ride if so many others got free admission?

    Girls who will pogo for free aren’t worth a dime just cause they want a taste of what it’s like not to be a whore.

  43. Ugh, I am so tired of these bullshit articles. Dating isn’t dead, I go on dates all of the time. (Junior in College) I mean, it’s not rocket science… STOP JUST HOOKING UP WITH THEM if what you want to do is find someone to date. If a hookup is what your looking for fine, but don’t hook up then complain they didn’t take you on a date after you hook up. Girls like me, who won’t hook up at a bar, or a party, who when propositioned in whatever way shape or form say ummm, no not going to happen… get asked for their number, and at least half of the time, asked out on a date. Sooo, yeah.

  44. So there is, was, and always will be a lot of finger pointing as to who killed dating. As a male who recently graduated college/started grad school, I’ve made some observations i’d like to share. *Also to the people making the observation that her article makes the impression that women only want to date…The topic at hand was clearly stated in the title…I’ll leave you with your deductive reasoning skills to infer where I was going with that…*

    For one it is ignorant to assume that all men “only” want sex. However it is just as ignorant to assume we don’t want it. People are capable of wanting more than one thing, which is why relationships with anyone are complicated. Going on to discuss the difference of interests between a male and a female during college could be an entirely different topic. I’m obviously speaking from a male perspective, and technically can’t speak for women, but I can presume that they’d want sex too…

    For the most part, it would seem that college holds the last fleeting moments of “youth,” where instead of searching for a suitable partner, we spend our spare time getting wasted with like-minded people who also happen to be drunk. Why? Because it’s fun to do bad things. But really, it’s because it makes everything easier. That’s why we call it “liquid courage.” That’s not to say people don’t meet and hang out soberly, but let’s be honest…they’re in the minority. For the majority, people these days are lazy and pretty self-centered, so alcohol fits the bill.

    The level of communication is absurd these days too. It’s not that people aren’t “talking,” we’re just not talking face to face. Texting, or any form of written text lacks a certain tone or emotion that is much easier conveyed with your voice. The one, really good relationship I had during college had one problem, which is a very common problem, and it was communication; whether it was a simple misinterpretation due to texting or some form of conversation via a written medium. I’m definitely not saying texting should go away, because it won’t…but if the thought ever crosses your mind of “what the F*** is he/she talking about?” It’s not a bad idea to ask them to clarify, or better yet just call them.

    Another thing that I hate to bring up because it is an annoying topic and has to do with “our generation,” is how entitled we seem to think we are and always think our opinion is right (case in point, quite a few of the comments above). Part of the reason I dislike it is because it’s pretty god damn true. A guy will go into talking to a girl with much higher expectations of getting laid these days. I have no fucking idea why, because who the fuck are you? why should anyone drop their pants for someone at face value? I’m sure that’s not on her agenda, granted I can’t speak for women…Cause I am a man…but I’m also not an idiot.

    That being said, who the hell do you think you are, expecting a date from me? Maybe hang out with me outside of drinking occasions and form coherent sentences so that we can have a conversation. Maybe then we can figure out if we have anything in common. That way, i’m not wasting my money when I do decide it’s a good idea to go on date with you. (quick tip: guys suck, and if you actually plan on dating them, hold out past the first time and maybe even past the second time of hanging out to bone down. We’ll want you more in the long run.) P.S. it’s a two way street. You can ask us on dates too. Trust me I wouldn’t be offended, but rather impressed and flattered.

    Lastly I’d say, get really comfortable with rejection, because it’s not just beneficial with relationships but pretty much with everything in life. You thought she/he liked you? You’re wrong. Move on. That simple. I didn’t say it was easy, but maybe they weren’t worth your time anyway…or vice versa…either way, you’ll find someone else. Just be persistent in your goals, because as you get older and your interests become more refined, the people around you have much more in common with you than in high school…plus you don’t give a shit about the stupid little things anymore. Then again, Everything I just said are opinions based on observation.

    Dating isn’t dead, nor will it ever really be dead. That’s like saying people will never have relationships (I’m not saying anything about marriage because that’s an institution, and not the sole means of expressing your love for someone). People just don’t have the amount of time to spend outside of work as they used to, whether by choice or necessity. We’ll keep making it work within our respective conditions, but no need to get all hyped about it. You’re best bet is to be real person and try to seem like…or even better.. be a decent human being, because god forbid that get you anywhere in life.

    ^^^”who the hell writes this much in a comment…? what a loser”

    • Matt – you make a lot of really fair points. For whatever reason, generations are continuing to feel more and more entitled, and somehow that has transferred to the dating/hooking up realm.
      I wonder too, if a lot is from perception. For example, because of things like texting, snap chat, whatever… it’s commonly perceived that “everyone” is sexting and sending photos of themselves. And while a lot of people are, I think the perception that “everyone is doing it” makes more people feel the pressure to do it as well. If you are trying to get a guy’s attention and you think other girls are sending vag/tit pics… then you are probably going to do it as well. Now, I understand that all sounds very juvenile, but let’s be honest… in undergrad, we are still children disguised as adults. There is also a perception that everyone is hooking up and having one night stands. And once again, a lot of this is true… but not “everyone” is. However, when we think everyone is doing something… then it doesn’t make it seem as bad. We are more willing to throw our guilt away about it and do it because we think it’s common place.
      Sex is everywhere. Where it used to be a rare/scandalous thing for a teenage boy to go and buy a PlayBoy to look at naked girls… anyone can type “porn” into Google search and see anything they want to for free. When you are surrounded by that, it becomes commonplace.

      I’m not sure how a shift would be made away from the way people are thinking now… That is certainly a mystery.

  45. Some of these comments are disgusting. Likewise, while perhaps the author makes some fair points, she is generalizing.

    At least, for me, there was plenty of dating in college. (And that’s been, oh, 6 months ago?)

    I’m happy to say the plenty of young/college aged people do indeed still drink coffee, have dinner, and judge each other appropriately before heading to the bedroom.

    And of course, sometimes we dont. But I dont generally end up in relationships with those girls; Its usually not what Im looking for, and the same usually applys for them as well.

  46. I literally just don’t get what the big deal is.

    It makes me confused why people have to hate on this girl or other commenters because they posted an opinion. She wasn’t rude or hating on men, she was being humorous and having fun with the topic. There’s literally no reason to flip out or take things too literally or seriously. It confuses me that people are essentially saying, “I don’t agree because this is my opinion and you don’t know what you’re talking about…” and yet…. didn’t you just post YOUR opinion on the topic? It’s okay to disagree. But don’t be hateful. You don’t even know this girl. Seriously.

    Why do people have to have the wittiest insult and rudest comment? Or rather than poking at someone’s opinion even, they find stupid little things like, “you need to spell because spelt that word wrong stupid” or “you’re an idiot because you did such and such with punctuation.” It’s like a contest. What’s the point? Really? I believe a lot of the people who have commented are intelligent people with good ideas and thoughts, so why can’t you just have a normal conversation using your knowledge, experiences and ideas? Do you act like this in public?

    I’m sure people will hate on my comment. And I don’t want to come off like a bully, but It’s just a thought. Maybe something some should consider? (At this point it’s a lost cause. But eh. Oh well.)

    I mean, I know some people like to do it because they like to get people riled up. But still…

    Agree to disagree.

  47. Dating is dead in colleges because asking a girl out lowers your standing with her. As soon as you ask a girl out,she thinks she’s got you and she loses interest. It’s strange but the only way to keep a girl’s respect is to act selfishly and seek only sex. So long as you are acting selfishly, the girl will not think you are beneath her.

    • Wrong. You’re not going to earn any girl’s respect that way. You will simply just jog her interest is all. Everyone wants what they can’t have.

    • Wrong. You will not earn a female’s respect doing that. You will just jog her interest is all. Everyone wants what they can’t have

    • Wow you read my mind. Actually no, I hate this behaviour. Please don’t be giving out this bullshit advice because that’s NOT the way to date women who are interested.

  48. I’m a bit disturbed by the large number of guys here generalizing all girls to be nothing but confused sluts that would like to be “thanked” for their sexual services with a burrito.

    Yes, it is true, most girls are like this. They are more than willing to casually sleep around with a guy. And even better: they then they wonder why a relationship didn’t follow.

    Why do they do this? Because giving in is the easiest route. If the guy persistently attempts to initiate sex, the easiest thing to do is go along with it rather than say “no” and walk away. If you get that tingly, excited feeling in your vagina, the easiest thing to do is to satisfy that urge. If you hear a Rihanna (worst female role model ever, btw) song praising casual, dirty sex with so-and-so, the easiest thing to do is to go out and have that casual sex, rather than save yourself for prince charming.
    It’s a lot harder to say “no” when your body is telling you “yes” (and guys, don’t act like you don’t understand this). It’s a lot harder to maintain control of the situation than it is to fall into a beta position and take orders from an alpha (the guy in this case). It’s a lot harder to want to save yourself for your future husband when everyone else is doing it and when, in today’s society, it is no longer frowned upon to have a casual fuck. Just having some plain old goddamn respect for yourself in general is hard.
    And that is why most girls don’t do it. Because it is the more difficult route.

    So then, why do girls expect a relationship/reward/ect following sex? Well you need to understand that during sex, the female body releases certain hormones that cause her to bond with that partner. Strippers and prostitutes seem to be immune to this 🙂 But anywho, even if a girl had no intention of getting into a relationship beforehand, she may now want it thanks to these hormones. But of course, that’s not the whole story, and you can’t just blame it all on the hormones. Girls are more complex than that, and let’s admit, most just aren’t very bright. I hate to say this, being a girl myself, but it is true. It’s easier to be stupid than it is to do your homework, try your best in school, learn something, and acquire some common sense. So, if it’s not the hormones telling us that we all of a sudden want a relationship, my guess is that it is a lack of common sense telling us that it’s a good idea. Idk, I can’t really relate here. The best I can do is make an educated guess.

    But the way I see it, if a guy genuinely likes you for you (what I’m talking about here is personality, not just looks) and wants to have a relationship with you, he will at the very least treat you or display his genuine interest in some other way BEFORE having sex. If he doesn’t do anything like that before having sex, it’s a given that nothing should be expected from the hook-up, at least in my opinion.
    I am currently 22yo and have never been interested in casual hookups. I have always wanted a relationship that would one day hopefully lead to marriage. And so I always made sure to date a guy for quite some time before ever having sex. That way, my message was clear: I was looking for a relationship and was not interested in casual sex. If it didn’t work out after that, then it wasn’t meant to be, oh well. Yes, I could have waited until marriage, but that’s no longer practical for most people in today’s society. At the very least, this method weeded out the jerkoffs that obviously only wanted a one-time fuck. That’s not to say that I didn’t have my fair share of assholes, though, but that’s another topic.

    So what I’m trying to say is, yes, most girls are easy and typically aren’t relationship material. But there are still PLENTY of girls left out there that have some respect for themselves and refuse to sleep with guys left and right. There are smart, gifted girls out there that want to make something of themselves and make the world a better place. They are the minority, but they are there. And many of them are so gosh darn beautiful, too 🙂 So please don’t generalize all girls as being sleazy sluts that want nothing but penis and “thank-you” gifts. Just know that these girls need to be treated differently than the others. Sluts can be treated like sluts; they asked for it. But genuinely good girls need to be respected and not be spoken so harshly about. How would you like it if someone else talked shit about you for no good reason? You’d probably want to beat their ass for being an asshole

    • Aah yes. 95% of the girls give the rest a bad name.

      No sane man will develop a strategy to addresses the 5% of girls you describe. The strategy will be to deal with the 95% type. Sure, if you are one in the 5% you get a raw deal but I wouldn’t blame the guys for that.

    • Aah yes. 95% of girls give the rest a bad name!

      > Why do they do this? Because giving in is the easiest route.

      That’s bullcrap. The average girl rejects at least 10 guys to every guy she hooks up with.

    • Most girls are easy but there are plenty of girls with self respect? Nice girl you aren’t. You are disgusting saying “Sluts can be treated like sluts; they asked for it.” THEY ASKED FOR IT!? Seriously? So living the life they want means they should be marginalised and treated like shit? Aren’t you a piece of work.

  49. I would just like to say that as a man and recent college graduate I never once would think about not treating a lady how she should be properly treated. I enjoy taking girls out for dinner and being respectful, it’s my one MO really. I’m still searching for a girl that actually is looking for a guy like you talked about it in the article because they never actually seem to want one that does treat her right. Instead they like guys that treat them like crap.

  50. you must all be looking in the wrong places. How about not dating douchebags? I found my bf through a mutual hobby, and he’s 2 years and a few months older than me. we were friends for 9 months and I started dating him a week after I dumped my ex. We purposely held off having sex until we’d been dating for four months. It was difficult for BOTH of us, because I was used to getting it on the regular, and hadn’t been single for 2 years, and he’d been single for almost a year and finally had someone willing and able to sleep with him. But guess what? We waited. because we both knew it would be better once we had developed a deeper bond. And it was. All these stupid college bitches having one night stands aren’t having sex, they’re fucking. Like animals. With no emotional attachment. Just fyi, the emotional attachment part is what makes us HUMAN. So go ahead, if you want to just be animals for your twenties, but I’m thrilled to have found my perfect guy who’s willing to do anything for me and who’s my best friend when I was 20.

  51. This article is purely personal opinion. First of it goes both ways. You can complain all you want, but just the fact – you are expecting guy to buy you stuff and spend money on you in exchange for sex. With this kind of behavior you are objectifying your self. Its not a 1950’s when women only work as nurses and teachers… why don’t you ask a guy to go with you and pay for your damn self. Its not about 6.75 chipotle wrap (btw who the hell goes to chipotle for a date?) its about principle. You are EXPECTING a guy do to do stuff in exchange for your body, then you complain that he sees you strictly as a sex object. Majority of the guys (in college) aren’t looking for life partners in their 18-24s, they are experiencing life and looking for good time- not a wife!!!
    If your complaint is about the douchey guys- then start hanging out in more respectable places and not frat parties or college bars. Its like complaining that a vegetarian restaurant doesn’t serve burgers, just idiotic.

  52. #HeterosexualProblems. I’m so glad that my boyfriend and I don’t have to deal with this issue. Sometimes he takes me on dates and then sometimes I take him on dates. It’s pretty simple. 🙂

    On a side note, this was a great article that caused some great discussions between the opposite sexes. I quite enjoyed the comments.

    Keep up the good work!

  53. 1. The author is attempting to make good points so guys who are making these comments about having sex on the first date or nothing shit, shut the fuck up. You sound dumb, uncivilized, and uneducated.

    2. Instead of traditional dating, which the author, with a hint of sexisum , suggests the responsibility of commencing the dating process falls solely on guys, how about we encourage a new form of dating which holds both sexes responsible. Women are just as capable as a guy of asking someone they are interested in out on a date. Society obviously has grown out of traditional dating, hence this conversation, but lets encourage both sexes to show responsibility in there own actions. If you wan’t to date someone, ask them out/ take them on a date. It doesn’t matter if you are male or female.

  54. i am so happy that someone else doesn’t think that girls should be giving it up freely. personally i have been in multiple happy relationships without having to give anything up or compromise my morals. my boyfriend of over a year is also my best friend, he takes me out on real dates and we do all the fun and cutesy stuff couples are supposed to do, as well as just goof off and be ourselves. isn’t that what a relationship should be? i believe in getting to know a guy, dating a guy, and then after a why deciding if he’s the kind of guy you want to spend forever with. if not? out the door… if so? then you shouldn’t have to be a sex object to keep him happy, he should be happy just being with you. you should be able to enjoy each others company and save all the bedroom stuff till marriage.
    im not perfect, and im not even claiming to be remotely. i’ve done the party scene and what not and made some mistakes (including a walk of shame after spending the night on someone’s couch, alone) but the whole “let’s hook up” thing has never made any sense to me. a drunk kiss means nothing, but if the guy means something, anything at all to you, he should give you a good morning? how are you feeling? how is everything going? can i take you out? and not a “hey baby, wanna come over? i have that drink you like…”
    i partially blame girls for this for allowing guys to be treated this way, but hey, what can you do? thats what society is telling college girls to do nowadays and we are the ones that are making the decision to follow it….
    i say girls need to make a stand for themselves. if you’re not in a committed relationship, there is nothing wrong with dating around, because you haven’t made a commitment to any certain guy yet. go out with “john” on friday and “david” on saturday and heck, even “michael” on sunday if you feel like it… find that special someone who is you’re mr. right. have the decency to respect yourself enough to not just go around giving it out to everyone, because then you loose you’re self-respect and then how can you expect it from another guy?
    find mr. right, make him put a ring on it and then after he has the ring on too, give him your everything. thats how i think relationships are supposed to be.
    i appreciate others views on this as well and would like to say that i am in no way condemning those who do have sex outside of marriage, but i would encourage you to take a look at your relationship and really think about if its worth it, and encourage you to guard you heart from being hurt by mr. wrong.

  55. LOL most American college sluts aren’t even worth a Chipotle burrito. Stop acting so entitled. You really think I’m going to waste money much less my time on some whore whose probably fucked a bunch of nigger athletes? No thanks, a quick fuck is all these girls are good for.

  56. Every time I see a woman who wants to date me seriously, I think to myself: Is that the mouth I want to kiss my first born son?

    To date, the answer has always been: NO, that mouth has suck a 100 yards of cock.

  57. There’s a lot of generalizing going on, I feel like. Generalizing men and women.

    If you are a guy or a girl and want only want to have sex with a person, go for it (with consent, of course). There is nothing wrong with this being an aim, just be upfront about it.

    If you are a female and want to ask a guy out on an actual date, go for it. I’ve done it. It’s 2014. It was a great time and I didn’t feel unfeminine or anything stupid like that. I liked him, I wanted to date him, I asked him out.

    If you are a guy and want to ask a girl out for a date, go for it.

    A guy can pay for a girl and it’s nice, or a girl can pay for a guy and it’s cool too. Like I said, 2014.

    The problem is when people start thinking they are owed something.

    If I casually hook up with you, I don’t expect you to buy me a burrito (nor do I expect to be slut shamed, ladies and gents of this comment feed…) Likewise, if you buy me a burrito, it doesn’t mean you’re allowed to think I owe you sex. Guys don’t owe girls relationships just because they slept with them, just like girls don’t owe guys sex if they went on a few dates.

    People are individuals, and have individual ideas about romance vs. sex. Saying that “all guys” are slimy cause they want to sleep with a girl, or “all girls” are sad about hookups is just silly. If you want to date, find someone who wants to date. If you want to fuck, find someone who wants to fuck.

  58. Last time I checked, the girls are the ones that Friendzone the good guys and date the a-holes that would rather cheat on them than be with them.
    This is just a girls opinion who I can guarantee has no clue that there have been many guys that treated her like she meant everything in the world to them, but she treated them like dirt in the end. The single girls in college were the biggest hypocrites while I was up at a big university. They say they want a great guy who cares about them and would treat them like they are everything a girl should be…and then she goes out and screws the guy with the great body but the a-hole personality.

    Back in college there was a HS friend that I cared about deeply and I was one of the few guy friends she had that never spoke a bad word about her and treated her with more respect than any other of her guy friends. In the end, she would rather hook up with the a-hole friend who just the night before was ripping her to shreds while I was the only one defending her. Girls in college have a triangle of they can only pick two traits in a guy: Body, Kindness, Friendship…they select BODY twice.
    Not all girls are like this, but there are just as many girls who are unaware that they friendzoned the guys that would actually treat them with the respect a boyfriend would than the guys that just want to sleep around.
    There were at least a half dozen times I turned down a girl in which I had at least a 90% chance of hooking up with so that I could have that slim 1% chance of showing the girl I really liked that I cared about her….and that never worked and thank god I stopped falling for that girl because my final 3 semesters at college were great after I stopped falling for her. I got sick of being the definition of being friendzoned


      The “good guys” are often the less-than-attractive guys who are trying to get some action by acting as ‘nice’ as possible. Girls aren’t vending machines you can put ‘friendship’ and ‘nice’ coins in to receive sex.

      The entire idea of the “friendzone” is ridiculous. If you want sex, or even a date, you make that clear from the start. You don’t just get to act nice to a girl you like, become her friend, then expect that to turn into something. Imagine a girl you find quite unattractive befriends you by playing video games you like with you, watching the game with you. Sex or a relationship with her is probably the last thing on your mind, so when she comes expecting a date or a lay, you turn her down. Suddenly you find you’re out a friend who’s now going around calling you a “friendzoning dick” because of what you did. Same situation.


      Would you rather bang the bitchy but very attractive girl, or the nice and caring girl who really doesn’t get your giblets stirring? Exactly. Girls aren’t as different as you probably believe – just like you want the intelligent, caring, attractive girl, they want the same guy. It’s human nature.


      And I’ll bet she had a great time, because they were almost certainly mutually attracted physically, and she was in it for the same reason he was.


      You were the ass hole here. Not her. She knew you as a friend, and nothing more. Did you ever actually sit down and talk to her about how you felt? Did you really think she was just going to ‘catch on’ and one day profess her love to you because of how caring and dedicated you were?

      No, she lost a good friend because of a bullshit victimization complex.

  59. How many guys did you Friendzone in college who would have actually treated you with respect??? And compare that to how many guys you were willing to have one night stands with while the half dozen guys you played like a fiddle would rather be WITH you than the guys you knew wanted just one night stands?

  60. i enjoyed this so much. the only reason someone would get upset about this, is if it struck a nerve.. and then that means you felt it applied to you, in some way.

  61. So I am “that guy” I am the douche bag that sleeps with you, your sister, her little, and that other bitch in the sorority you hate. The sorority next door tells all their new members to stay away from the man whore but some how I prevail. I wasn’t always like this though, not saying its a valid excuse, but after my fiance cheated on me I took it rough and went from the being the shy introverted nerd to the fauxhawk rockin frat-star.
    After going Greek I had the ice breaker and opportunity and at a college that is predominantly men that was all I needed. So 3 more years of college and lots of fun I have always been upfront with my partners; this is a one night thing we just both want to get off, or I like you and lets see what happens. When 2 consenting adults want to have sex awesome but each party should be more upfront with the other.
    But one thing in college that is an issue we have a lot of young inexperienced and naive people. There have been many times I have walked the drunk girl looking for some vitamin D home because she just doesn’t get it, and I’m the whore? Some girls just can’t do the sex without the feelings and that is OK. Especially girls who haven’t dated much or had many real adult relationships they fall quick and let themselves put out to soon.
    Diners will not fix this, dates will not fix this. Hell those very things have made it even easier for me! I’m 25 and have a job while in college, I’m not the typical broke college student, when I take some young cute girl out to diner they view it as being wined and dined. I’m glad she feels showered in attention and is loving it. But more often than not taking a girl in college out on a date when no other guy on campus has figured it out yet makes her want you more. Hell why shouldn’t she sleep with you? You made 10 times the effort the guy she hooked up with last weekend did. This isn’t the answer, honestly young people need to wait a little bit longer and before doing the deed and get to know one another if that’s the goal.
    To the author, your what 20-21? You really don’t know but that’s how the real world works and has always worked for tens of thousands of years. But you are ahead of your peers in realizing this. This is when you can move forward and have an adult relationship. Relationships are work and you won’t get the benefits until you realize that the strong foundation needed for a lasting relationship needs to be built with out the physical stuff. I’m not saying you can’t have sex while you build that, but it makes it hard and most people can’t separate the two. Also you’re kind cute btw 😉

  62. Long comment short: This article is bad. Really bad.

    Obviously biased as tits, uninformed about the topic at hand, and narrow-minded..

    Sounds like a passive-aggressive twitter rant if the 140 character limit didn’t exist

  63. As a feminist and a crusader for social justice, i commend some of the commenters here for their sex-positive, anti-patriarchal comments in favor of the New Order. Fluidly loving, playing and rejecting patriarchal norms of traditional “courtship” and “dating”, men of today are freeing women from the oppressive bonds of matrimony and preparing them for a feminist world where hookups and polyamory are but two of the new forms of New Family.

  64. The idea that a man should take charge in a relationship is disgusting. Women don’t deserve to be taken care of and neither does a man. Its not a mans role to pay for a first date or to “win” a girl over. Chivalry should be dead, but kindness should not be. Labeling who does what in a relationship sets us all back. The idea that a man pays for dates, opens doors, and fights his woman’s battles stems from the belief that she’s too weak to do it for herself. And he does all this for what? To earn her vagina? If sex is a pleasure for both it shouldn’t be earned by one of them (however i get some people would like to withhold that for a relationship, but that doesn’t mean he has to head the relationship) As sweet as society has made all these traditions seem it, still founded in the roots that a man should be in charge. No disrespect is meant here but being kind to a woman because she is a woman is sexist. Be kind to people, not genders.

  65. The terrible things I learned from these comments: men hate women. Thank you all for letting me know. I had a gut feeling but I wasn’t positive.

    • That’s a cop out.

      But hey, great , you’ve absolved women of any accountability.

      This is why gender equality is unworkable. We can’t even have frank and honest discussion about it, because women would rather believe that all men are misogynists than accept any ( harsh, but well deserved ) criticism, or take any responsibility for the way things are.

      You want equality ? Start by taking an equal amount of responsibility.

      Also grow a spine and don’t assume that criticism = hate. Because it usually doesn’t

  66. I hope that all the male responses are not concentrated from the OU community. if so, they are the most inaccurate depiction of men and I feel sorry you women are subjected to that.

    Go on and call me “fag/pussy/queer” like the other male’s so eloquently put in their comments

    Actually, I’m none of those, I’ve been in a relationship for 3 years now with my girlfriend and its gone really well. We were acquaintances first, friends, and then a couple. The physical side followed, as it should.

    From day one, I’ve opened doors, paid for meals (we alternate now), and respected her.

    I think its how you were raised.
    For men – be respectful and polite,
    For Women (I assume) – don’t settle for a man who mistreats you

    I can tell you though, if you want to know what a man is like, look to his friends and who he associates with. If they are good people, there is a reason they are friends with him.

    A-holes associate with A-holes.

  67. Okay, so reading through a few comments I have noticed a lot of hate from both sides. In all honesty I don’t see a problem with Briagenn Adams’ original post and I do wish to state that I believe in the dating process stated originally. The bit about the focus on text messages also was rather interesting, however I do wish to state that both males and females are to blame for these recent trends in relationships. We, as men, should respect women and women should give men something to respect. Quite frankly in todays society neither of these things are happening nearly as often, which makes it hard to go back to the “traditional dating ways”. Another point I wish to make is that it shouldn’t be all about sex in general. Near the beginning of your piece, you stated “They’ve had a few (non-sexual) sleepovers, but she wants him to take her on an actual date before she gives it all up.” Why should one “actual” date change this, she shouldn’t feel like it is “giving it all up”. Why is sex seen as something only we as men want? Yes we are much more likely to fit into the stereotypes of always wanting sex but I feel like sex shouldn’t be about the woman “giving” it to the man, it should be seen as more of a gift to each other. If it is a relationship and not just some casual hook-up then sex shouldn’t be seen this way.

    As for the commenters who think that spending money on dates is “worthless” and a “waste of time” because it doesn’t always work out; is it really that hard to have to work to gain that money back? The ideology that it is a waste of money rather than an investment is why you were already doomed to not getting taken up on a second date.

    Ranting aside, I do agree with most of your article and I also think it was well written (use less profanity and more people will respect it), but sometimes the male voice has to be heard as well. Good work though and keep it up!

  68. Meh. I’m a sophomore in college and my girlfriend and I just passed the 2 year mark, and I know many of my friends who also have girlfriends/boyfriends.

    Maybe my college is just weird?

  69. Women are the ones who killed dating. Dating, courtship, and chivalry stem from an era where it was unheard of for women to sleep around with multiple men. Today’s feminist brainwashed college aged chick thinks she’s “empowered” and “liberated” by sleeping around when in fact its the total opposite. Sluts use their bodies to get with men, and by giving their bodies away to so many guys they devalue themselves. If you take away tits, ass, and her vagina what does a slut offer a man? Humor? Intelligence? Loyalty (lol)? She offers him nothing. So why would men want to take you out and spend time and money on you when all you offer is sex, which you’ll give it to him after 5 beers and a shot of Jaeger

  70. is it bad that every single thing you said in this article is present in my current “thing”. like what do i even call this thing? the only thing i haven’t done is that “walk of shame” because we both have class together in the morning and we walk together – which means i have a pile of his t-shirts stacking up in my dorm because he always gives a clean one for class the next day. (maybe i should just start wearing his tshirts when i go over so i can exchange them?) the only “walk of shame” i do is across the living room from his bedroom to the bathroom in his apartment as one of our other classmates is eating some weird ass breakfast. (they’re roomies.)

    i hate making excuses for guys, but i know he’s not all there. so i do make excuses for him. and i hate that i’m knowingly going across campus at midnight every week to go to his place where we’ll just get drunk, smoke some weed and pal around until we end up making out, cuddling and some other shit. maybe it’s just because sleeping beside him with his arms tightly around me and my head on his chest makes me feel safe and cared for. or how we say we should just skip class and lay in bed together all day as he kisses me – completely sober.

    i feel like there’s something wrong with me for letting myself continue this routine, but i can’t help but want to continue it. i just don’t know. it just sucks being attracted to a stoner – it sucks to have feelings for one and to be hooked on them.

  71. If you want to go on dates, then find someone who’s going to actually want to date you. A drunken hook-up is a drunk hook-up for a reason: because most of the time that’s all that person is looking for. Establish, maybe, before a hook-up what you’re hoping to get out of this. There are people other there, of both sexes, looking for dating and a relationship, it just sounds like you and your friends are looking in all the wrong places, and that’s nobody’s fault but your own.

  72. girls in college only want dick. I’m a nice guy who has learned it from experience and tried the dating thing only to be left in the dust feeling like poop. now when i meet a girl i only look for sex so i don’t get hurt again because sorry #notsorry but most girls are sluts

  73. I have dated two girls and went out on multiple dates. I have been cheated on by both of them bc I wouldnt sleep with them after being in a relationship. Yes I do agree with the article. I haven’t been on a date with any girl for six years am in college and finally found a girl thats worth it. She makes me smile and is everything been looking for in a girl and no sex till marriage. Guys or girls that say they cant control needing sex is a lie you can control it. We go on dates and yes I pay for food or the movie. I dont want anything sexual from it. Our relationship is great!! I wouldnt change anything. So to all the guys out there looking for relationship with a girl and not just sex there are girls that are looking for that too so dont give up! Great article makes you wonder!

  74. Article is written out of extreme bias. I have taken many girls out on dates in college, and so have my friends. Other times, the girl did not want to go on a date because she feared that would mean some kind of lingering commitment…that I would assume we were “dating.” Also, easy on the profanity if you plan on looking for a real job one day. These blogs cannot be erased from the web.

  75. This is wack as fuck there are wonderful people out there who want the same thing, its about testing your patience to wait for that person. I am in college in a loving and supportive relationship, and we met by hooking up and going OUT TO DINNER. Dating is not dead its just rare

  76. The thing about it is feminism (and the “powers” that be) have totally reversed the gender roles.

    Guys, did you know that…we are supposed to be the prize not women…GASP/Shock and Awe…I know, I know…that’s a crazy concept.

    Why do you think MLB, NBA, NFL players, Actors, Musicians etc…have soooo many groupies? It’s not bc of their sparkling personalities willingness to pay for dates and ability to “fight for the women that they want”.

    Think about it, before the advent of our “modern” dating rules (and even now if there was total anarchy…no police, state, federal government or white knights to protect women) who was the one to protect women against predators, other humans, hunt for food, build a roof over your head etc…it was men who did that.

    We all know that if an intruder came into your house at 2am it’s not going to be a women’s entitled behind picking up the 9 millimeter or baseball bat to defend their family.

    Men are the prize, we are the ones who protect you, fix things, provide for you…all women are supposed to do is help carry on our lineage and keep there legs closed that’s it.

    Women know this deep down but choose to follow the unnatural mantra of feminism that tells them somehow they are prizes to be earned…let the government collapse next week. I bet these same women who are talking all this nonsense would change their tune real fast…lol.

  77. From all the posts that I read about and comments that I have seen from various people whether it be girls or guys the most important thing that a person has to remember is that each individual person has someone special waiting for them in the end depending on the road that they choose. Sometimes that road is harder for others depending on the choices that they make but that’s the thing it is, “their” choices that brought them to the situation and they will determine how to bounce back from it. I’m not saying that one side is right and one side is wrong, everyone has their faults and the first thing to always do is accept that person for who they are.

    Regarding as how to how there are booty calls and many other ideas that can go through someone’s mind when they meet someone of interest this is a meaningless idea because there is a deeper meaning to sex than some people think. Sex is a gift that allows two people who greatly care about each other to demonstrate it and at times people take advantage of it but for the wrong reasons.

    I understand that there are faults with both guys and girls during a relationship due to maybe something that happened in a previous relationship but this does not give anyone the right to demoralize someone for that specific reason. I’ll throw it straight out there, guys in many cases are douchebags because they at times think they are invincible and can do whatever they want but that is just pitiful because these guys do not realize that having a girl to be by your side and is willing to do so much for you then that is truly a great catch.

    To finish my view on this it is pitiful to see some of the comments that some college guys would put on here due to how distasteful their comments are and how poorly their responses are as well. I honestly can not believe that people have such unjust views on the matter at hand. When I meet that one girl who will be the one (who knows maybe it’s one of the lovely ladies on here) in person and I determine that she is the one there isn’t anything that I wouldn’t do for her if she feels the same way because I would feel that she is a great catch and I will want to keep her.

    I may be judged by my response with rough comments, name calling, or anything else but all I can say is that it won’t hurt me because this is my view and I will stand by it no matter what. Whoever takes the time to read this, Stay Classy and I hope you have a great day.

  78. Just be happy. It sounds like a lot of people who commented on this post aren’t happy or secure with themselves. If that’s the case, you’ll never be happy with anyone else. You have to first fill that void, and can’t expect others to do that for you.

    Nice guys – keep being nice. Guy’s that just want the D – Keep looking for it..?1?! not sure exactly how to word that one,but you get the point. There are women out there who want the same things you want, regardless of what that is. Traditional dating isn’t for everybody, neither is hooking up.

    I think the whole idea of ‘what will I get in return’ is also a big issue in the dating scene. We are all so concerned with what we can get for ourselves instead of taking time to meet the other persons needs and make them feel special. A relationship, at least a serious relationship, isn’t supposed to be about you.

    Just some thoughts!

  79. Your friend probably can’t find a good guy because all of the good guys are probably in her friendzone. Just saying.

  80. As a male in this situation, I’ve tried. While I agree there are many guys just looking to hookup with whomever they can, not every guy is like that. Just recently I was talking with a girl , we had two non-sexual sleepovers, and when I asked to take her on a date, she virtually stopped talking to me, and told me I was taking things too fast. It’s not just guys, it’s our society as a whole. I heard somebody jokingly say once “I date after the third sex”, flipping the common “I have sex after the third date”, but it’s shocking how common his statement usually is. Pretty sad.

  81. It’s a good commentary about when people mix hook-up culture with dating. Interaction based purely on sexual desire is by no means a substitute for and will not lead to a legitimate relationship. At the same time, the article feeds the stereotype that all men are horn-dogs and it feeds the double-standard that coddles women in their immaturity and condemns men in theirs. All in all, it’s making it hard for well-meaning guys to get a date.

  82. “But hey, if you’re all about the casual sex then I’m not here to stop you – I’m just telling you to get a clue.”
    This is probably the most back-handed pseudo-sincere cop out sentence I’ve seen written on the internet recently. 100 years ago, women were not allowed to have “casual sex” or have any rights really. Thanks to many people’s life dedication to women’s right, in our modern society women have the right to choose with who and when they have sex to whichever degree they freely desire, however exercising that right labels them sluts in society’s eyes. You tell women who are sexually free and exercise their rights to “get a clue.” That is disrespectful to all women and a slap in the face to anyone that has worked throughout history to fight for women’s rights. I think it is you Ms Adams that needs to get a clue – you’re a journalist writing an editorial that gets exposure and that brings a lot of responsibility in what you write, including the subtext.

  83. No one will read this because there are way too many silly comments on this thread. But for the sake of tipping the scale just a tiny bit…

    Not all girls want relationships. Not all guys are sniffing around for noncommittal sex. Everyone is different, and the best way to navigate through the ocean of variety is to know yourself, what YOU want. You can’t change other people–no matter how much you like them, no matter how many dates you go on, or how much sex you have. You just look until you find what you like.

    I am the type of girl who likes to go on dates and get to know someone before I have sex with him. He doesn’t have to pay (although it’s a much appreciated gesture if he does.) The date is about our chemistry, his character, and his potential as a long-term partner–not about the sex or the money. Those are important to me. I tend to hold back sex until I’ve gone on a couple of dates with a guy, because that’s one indicator of whether he actually cares about me or not. That is just my personal rule, not what I believe every female in the world should abide by.

    I was once with a guy who I really, really liked. He wouldn’t go on a date with me, no matter how many times I hinted at it. I hung out with him at his place, even broke my own rule and had sex with him because I liked him so much. However, after 3 months and no date, I gave up on him and moved on. Sure, I was a little upset. Who wouldn’t be? But I accepted the fact that we were different people with different expectations from our relationships. I gave him some time, but I didn’t stick around and wait for him to change.

    The next guy I liked took me out on a date at his first opportunity, and paid. He didn’t push for sex. He was a perfect gentleman. Soon after that, he was my boyfriend, the sex was fucking awesome, and we’ve been together for over a year now. I’m so glad I had the guts to pursue what I really wanted.

    Call it “old-fashioned” or “anti-feminist” or whatever the hell you want. If you are a male and you don’t ever want to get married, fine! You won’t hear me calling you a “douche bag” or “player” or “asshole.” It just means you’re different from me, and that. Is. Fine.

    If you really want to be happy, stop the complaining and name calling. Make your own rules, and go figure it out.

  84. You can tell this is written by a ditzy college bitch because she substitutes periods for spaces every other sentence.

    Fucking. Obnoxious.

    All trolling aside, it doesn’t take a genius to figure out that most people are fucked in the head these days when it comes to romance. Teenagers have always been horny. This is nothing new. The age we live in is simply enabling them to gratify themselves instantly when it comes to pretty much anything, whether that be access to information, entertainment, socialization, or even sex. We’re living in a high-speed era, and these are the consequences. When people want something, they want it NOW.

    Honestly, I blame media and technology. Call me crazy, if you like, but it seems fully logical to me. We’ve accustomed a generation to convenience, to getting what they want when they want it, without having to exert any sort of effort whatsoever. It is entirely unhealthy. At the very least, however, it allows those who are looking for an actual relationship to have a much a much easier time sorting out like-minded individuals from all the other shitheads out there.

  85. Honestly, most girls are actually sluts(on a college campus). I have tried taking a girl on a date after we had already had sex and she basically said she would just rather have sex than date. I also tried to take a different girl out but she would just dodge that and hmu late night. So I basically learned that if they don’t want to date I’ll just plow them now and wait until I graduate to find a real woman.

  86. I am a dude and don’t get me wrong I like the casual sex. But some people on here are right. Traditional dating is out the fucking window. Ive tried many many many times. I have even asked girls straight up… How do you feel about dates? Ive gotten replies that are just “im not into dates.” or “I don’t like them.” What?!!? You mean some women who clearly are into a dude wont let him take her out for a nice casual evening?! WHY!? Even the fancy, dressed up, pick up at 8 type of dates.. and some girls just refuse and just want to sit around watching a movie.. Ive also been with girls who just want to sit around hooking up. That’s great and all but if Im trying to start a relationship. LETS GO DO SOMETHING. This also brings up the argument of girls “not finding the right guy.” How would you know if you have or not if you wont spend time with him!? Ladies.. you need to open your eyes. It isn’t always about the sex with guys. But you have to let the ones in who just want to spend some quality time with you.

  87. Most young men and women our age have a difficult time with dating because we don’t know how to communicate . When everyone hides behind social media, phones, and blogs (which I am ironically posting on now), then it makes it difficult to share emotion and love with others.

    Sadly emotion is such a slippery slope now because guys who do care are made fun of by our male peers, and women who are not used to kindness second guess it for manipulation.

    All I know is that nothing in life comes easy. Working through the struggles is what makes the reward of love that much sweeter and the strength of that bond so much tighter.

  88. I just want to add some insight for you men out there. The good women might be overseen by the majority of slutty women; yes I’ll say it because I’ve been to enough college parties and to the bars in town. We are still out there!
    At my college I guarantee you 80% of the guys did show courtesy by opening doors for every single girl in the vicinity (I had one guy wait for me to walk the 50 ft to the door). BUT over half those guys were already scoping out and planning for the weekend or hump day parties to come around.

    Hopefully what everyone realizes is, “to each their own.” If you want random hookups, stds, plan B, or a baby go for it. But don’t you dare start bitching about your situation. You put yourself there and only YOU can change it. You call a man an asshole, think about why he’s that way. You want to call a woman a whore, same question. I’m going to say most people who are commenting with the negative words are jaded and older. Grow the fuck up and put your big boy/girl panties on. You want a relationship? GO AND GET ONE, but you only get what you put into it. Tell them what you want and what you expect. Communication is the only way to get what you want.

    BUT JUST THINK, if you end up having kids…what are you going to tell them about your life? Just going to leave out your 20s (the “prime” of our lives)?

  89. I totally agree with what you’re saying and I feel the same way. I’m the type of guy who hates to have a girl over and just lay there. I want to go out, try new places, explore and have a real date. I want my girlfriend to be the one I spend time with doing things we both enjoy. Not just having sex and laying in a bedroom. But nowadays that’s all anyone wants to do. I noticed that girls will throw themselves at you one night, you have that one hookup and then you text them for dinner and they aren’t interested. I’m not a bad looking guy, I work out which is my passion, and I’m in the army. It’s not like I’m a fat loser lol. I hate to say but girls today are so used to that terrible treatment that when something different comes along I think they’re scared of it. I opened the car door for a girl the other day and I thought she was going to have a heart attack. By the way go buckeyes. I’m from Ohio and love Ohio state.

  90. When exactly was college not like this? Ask your parents, it was the same way for them. Really, what you’re asking is “why isn’t college like high school?”

  91. Alright boys, listen up. If you want to optimize your notch count, listen to my advice. But first, let me tell you about girls. Yes, yes, I know not all women are like that but I don’t care because most are.

    Girls aged 16 to 25: She’s a party girl and the main thing she cares about is aesthetics. You got the face and body of an underwear model? She’ll sleep with you.

    Girls aged 25 to 29: She’s still a party girl and she will still sleep around with underwear models but now she’s also attracted to status. You got a luxury condo and drive around in a red Ferrari? She’ll sleep with you as well.

    Girls aged 30 to 35: She’s no longer a party girl and even if she wants to the underwear model will no longer sleep with her. She’s too old and ugly for him. The guy that drives that red Ferrari will only be interested in her if she’s extremely lucky. Her eggs are drying up and she is desperate to lock in a provider. So if you have a decent place to live in and are raking in a stable $70,000 annually, you are a prize.

    So now that we have a basic generalized understanding of girls, let’s talk about how to optimize the game for ourselves.

    The good looking men: You guys are like Shaq or Kobe. Sure the other guys train as hard as you but you were born lucky. You should go for the 16 to 25 year old girls. Primarily because all they are interested in is what you have to offer aka good looks.

    The average looking-high status men: You guys will not get that hot 18 year old girl. But you will get that hot 26 year old. Show her how it feels to do 0 to 60 in under 3 seconds in that Ferrari. Show her the cocktail parties. She’ll think that after all her party days, she’s sill found a rich schmuck who will pay for her luxury retirement. She ate her cake and now she’ll have it too. With sprinkles! Date multiple such girls until they turn 28/30 and then dump them. Go for the new set of 25 year old party girls. You will be their epiphany “relationship”.

    The average looking-average salary men: You guys will never get that 18 year old or the 26 year old. But you can easily get the post-epiphany girls. These are girls who realize that the underwear models don’t want them. The rich guys will not marry them. Usually, these are the girls that called you “creepy” and “loser” when she was the 18 to 25 year old. They may hit you up on facebook! They are looking for that 8 month whirlwind romance and an immediate marriage after that. Are you pulling in a decent salary? You’ll do. So yeah, give them that 8 month whirlwind romance. But do NOT marry them after that. Just dump them. Find you next post-epiphany girl. Give her the 8 months romance. Repeat till infinity.

    But whatever you do boys, bottom line is this: DO NOT PUT A RING ON THAT FINGER.

    Because only 2/4/10 years ago, she was getting railed by three guys on that frat couch. She went through 6 guys in a weekend. And she was calling you a creepy loser for asking her number while being only an average looking man.

    So in conclusion, you can have 99 problems son, but make sure that a b*tch ain’t one.

  92. Amen!! Dating is dead. You wrote exactly what I’ve been bitterly screaming about to my classes, friends, and roommate. So, thank you for sharing my thoughts and writing them with beautiful, honest, angst. 🙂

  93. This type of dating that has “no strings attached” and there is less time being made to put effort into relationships is a catalyst of two generalized reasons.

    Firstly, girls in college have problems with severity in the seriousness of a relationship… if you don’t get what I mean when I stated that lightly here is a more abrupt way to put it… Girls have some sort of chemical imbalance in this stage of their life where they are looking for a mate and want to settle down. Eagerness to get married causes short run tension in a relationship, deteriorating the happiness and inducing stress. And whether or not you believe marriage is responsibly correct in early 20’s(like 20 – 24), the fact of the matter is divorce rates go up from these young and dumb decisions.

    Secondly, education is more abundant these days and therefore doing well in school to get good grades becomes more competitive. People looking to take charge of their academic and subsequent professional career really don’t have the time to spend ample amounts of time with their bf/gf. BUT, if both parties of the relationship have similar academic/professional goals then it would work with much greater success.

  94. The ridiculously high cost of tuition and housing is but one explanation for why people cannot pay for other people on dates all the time. Sleepovers and sex (as long as not leaving one party hurt and pining) are a good alternative and are not to be viewed in a negative light. Sex is a natural phenomenon and I see no reason for it to be “taboo” in our culture as long as it’s safe and the intentions are made clear by both parties of what the arrangement is… Costly dates and romance, although fun and manageable, are not something that needs to happen or should happen.

    In short, sex is fun and does not need to be shunned as long as no one is getting hurt, which, plenty of the time, people don’t, believe it or not.

    I am in a 2.5 yr relationship, with having plenty of hookups prior. I have a taste of both lifestyles, and neither is wrong, as long as no one is hurt.

  95. The problem is a lot of girls nowadays think it’s weird or use the all too liberally used word–“creepy”–to describe any man who suggests a date before they are actually ‘dating’. They’ve got the order wrong. Dates come first and ‘dating’ comes after the first (or multiple) date, not before.

  96. Why can’t we just agree that both genders have it rough? We both wouldn’t know how to handle being the opposite sex, let’s just admit it. Just learn to appreciate one another and ignore the douchebags. 🙂

  97. Sex doesn’t have to be put up on a pedestal…being sexually compatible is essential for a loving relationship. If you’re not attracted to them don’t waste your time. I’m not saying you have to sleep with people right away, but if you want to then that’s each individuals right to do so. No one should be shamed for waiting to have sex or for having it when it feels right, even if its on the first date/random drunk night. I’ve been at both ends…I dated someone for 3 years and we never had sex. We just weren’t compatible and I always thought it would get better (Spoiler alert: it didn’t). I slept with my fiancé the first time we went out together. It felt right and I have never regretted my decision.

    Also, ladies, if you want to go on a date and the guy hasn’t asked you then ask him! Pay for the meal. Who cares. If you want to text him twice in a row, do it. Stop analyzing things and put yourself out there. Sure you might get hurt, but you should be able to be yourself while dating. If a guy is going to run because a girl sends him two messages in a row then obviously he’s not worth your time.

  98. This comment thread is full of people making sweeping generalizations about males/females. If you want to value a women for her virginity then fine, but you better hold yourself to that same standard and not sleep around either. And if you don’t, then you’re a jackass for expecting others to be one thing while you’re doing the opposite.

    Ladies, if you want to sleep around then do it. But if you act like sleeping around devalues you then people will pick up on that and reflect it. My girl Eleanor Roosevelt expressed this best when she said: “No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.” Be confident in your decisions and don’t make choices based on other people’s feelings or values. Whether you’re sleeping with a different guy every night or a virgin ’till you die, there are going to be people who disagree with your choice. But here’s the thing: it’s your body and you’re the one who has to live with the decisions you make, not anyone else, so make the decisions that make you happy. Just be safe and smart about it.

  99. Maybe your friend is looking at the wrong guys. Some guys want hook ups and some just want a legit relationship. Dating is not a lost cause. The guys that your friend is trying to date probably dont want a relationship yet. Like I said, not all guys are just looking for sex.

  100. I am a 25 year old guy. It probably sounds bad of me to say this but I could care less for a relationship. I do not find it to be an necessity to be happy in life. If one of my weekends leads to a one night stand then thats all I really need. However I was raised to good by my parents and I will treat a lady with respect no matter what. If I find a girl that is really amazing then of course I will want to pursue that and get to know her but that never happens.

  101. Here’s what happened to dating in college: Girls decided that they wanted to be ‘ratchet’ and hook up with whatever semi-attractive guy that comes along. Word gets out quickly nowadays about who’s a slut quite easily. Example: “Last night I met this pretty hot girl Nicole at bar ABC…” friend: “Nicole the blonde haired girl with big tits? Dude she’s a total slut I heard she banged that black bouncer, a homeless guy, and everyone on the baseball team!”

    Obviously, after hearing this no one wants to date a hoe. But we will hook up with you, and that’s all. We want a girl who hasn’t been stuffed more times then a Thanksgiving turkey. Sorry. There’s a fine line between being a prude and a whore. Figure it out girls.

    • Similarly, girls know who the dirty, possibly disease-infested man whores are and don’t want actually date them either. Girls don’t want a dude who’s stuck his dick into anything that is at least semi-conscious.

      There’s a fine line between being a dirty herpes-infested dick and an actually nice guy. Figure it out dude.

      Generalization generalization generalization blah blah blah

  102. it’s about the same time that we as a generation decided sex should just happen, relationships should be easy, connections should just exist instead of being worked to maintain, when the depth of a conversation between two people is.

    “How are you?”
    “BUSY, you?”

    This girl starts off with shouldn’t the guy take me out after i almost blew him? (essentially) Well because i see that you hold sex as simplistic orgasm that any guy in your drunken stupor would suffice, not as an actual connection who will motivate me to be a better person. Also why should I pay in both time and money to get the attention of a girl who last week blacked out on top of some other guys cock because they were partying and decided to have some fun. If you want a man worth a damn to give a damn about you, have something to offer that is worth the time and energy and he knows he is prepared to give. Step past the superficial lustful nature of our generation and actually look for a guy who gives a damn about you BEFORE having sex with you. Also hold yourself to that same standard. Don’t seek easy and comforting, seek a challenge and an equal who inspires you to do great things and step up your game in other aspects of your life.

    So for this and countless more reasons men just don’t see the point.

  103. I am a female college student who actually likes to go on dates, pay for herself, and wait for sex. I don’t need a man to pay my bill when I could be working just as hard as he does. It’s not necessary for him to pay and I don’t expect him to. If I am in a relationship one day he pays the next I do, it should be equal all the way. Then the issue of sex, it can wait and if he’s not willing to then he’s not worth it. I don’t believe meeting a guy I am attracted to automatically means he’s getting laid especially since I don’t know if I’m completely attracted to him until I find out what he’s like. It’s unrealistic, for me, to like someone on looks alone to have sex with them, their mind and personality are a big part of it. I want to know about what he studies, what type of movies he likes, what books he reads, what his last name is. Having sex is supposed to be an intimate thing between two people and now it’s I just met you let’s go have sex in someone else’s house when I don’t even know your full name or have your phone number. Both gender’s are at fault and we need to realize that having a boyfriend/girlfriend isn’t the worst thing in the world (which I hear very often). Partying doesn’t have to mean one night stand, being in a relationship doesn’t have to mean being trapped, and being a good guy doesn’t mean you have to wait for a girl to stop sleeping around to date you.

  104. Wow, either I’m living in another world or half the people who left comments on this post are crazy. I’m disappointed in this article and most of the comments that followed; however, reading this did make me value my relationship even more than I already do. I met my boyfriend after I finished my freshman year of college, but he worked at my parent’s business during the summer. We exchanged numbers and talked for awhile before he asked me on a date. While we were dating that summer, we spent time together, just getting to know each other and talking about what we wanted out of life and what we enjoyed about life. We decided to make our relationship exclusive at the end of that summer and have been together now for a 3 years. I lost my virginity to him and the rest is history. But I don’t consider myself traditional. I have very bold views and am a feminist, atheist, and humanitarian. If I didn’t meet my boyfriend that summer while I was under my parent’s roof, I bet I would have had numerous meaningless hook-ups later at college. College just makes it easy: there are no rules, temptations are everywhere, we are vulnerable and insecure, we act on our passions without thinking them through. I’m so thankful I met my boyfriend outside of that environment because we were able to get to know each other as human beings first, best friends second, and lovers third.

  105. I find the implication kind of maddening that it is frowned upon to sexually experiment with someone that you find attractive and are dating, even if it’s in the earlier days of that relationship. I place a lot of value on being sexually compatible with the person that I want to marry, personally. If I had ended up saving myself for marriage and had a miserable sex life with my husband, the ultimate failure of that marriage would be guaranteed.

  106. I think the majority of you all dont really understand whats happening. you are all generalizing men and women with their worst qualities. i’m a male, and i like to date! but at the same time, i like to have sex. if a woman is not cool with the idea of sex, there are more women to date/have sex with. and you females, you also are probably not going to find what you want in a man for a long time. if you do, fine with me, but im not expecting to find the girl of my dreams. basically, what im trying to say here, is that if women and men start all hating each other, who the fuck is going to pass their genes on. we need each other to procreate.

    • The girl of your dreams is currently blowing #12, #14, #16, #28 and #33 on the football team.


  107. All these comments are pretty much badgering the other gender just to show that someone has an upper hand in this subject and truth be told none of us do. No man or woman is “better” at dating or going out to have sex with as many or as little people as they can. It all boils down to, we like what we like and we take what we want. Who cares how many times someone’s had sex or why someone hasn’t had sex? Clearly, to most people sex is just some thing of gratification that a lot of people do to either pass time or feel whatever connection. There are those who are looking for a date or literal nightcap to get a relationship moving. This is why we shit like speeding dating, Jewish singles, Christian mingle or whatever else. Uncommon to popular belief, not everyone is looking to smash and dash or looking to one up the other sexual deviants of the world. For me, as a virgin, I am looking for someone who understands that I am not just going to throw out my vagina to the first penis that comes around crying love. I’m not going to get mad at my boyfriend for having sex before. What the hell does that have to do with our relationship now? The fact of the matter is we all have a preference. All I see here are generalizations created over history of gender roles or just plain ignorance and stupidity. Yes, some women love rich man. Yes, some men like to fuck everything that breathes. Yes, there ARE still virgins in the world. My boyfriend and I dated and now we’re in a serious relationship, plus we love each other. It’s not all apples and apple sauce, but you get my point.

  108. Go to art school (or anywhere that has a game design program) and your problems are solved, I swear.

    I’m 1,000% not lying about not a single hookup happening my two years there (counting all the roommates I cycled through). Girls and guys weren’t exactly “douche” or “slut” material.

  109. “We girls can do so much better, and your 30-year-old self will thank you for it.” – a 20-year-old girl

    I’m not 100% convinced that this site isn’t a parody.

    You should get content editors…and actual writers, I guess.


    I remain unconvinced that this isn’t secretly satire.

  111. My boyfriend and I did things kinda backwards. We slept together, knowing that there was something between us prior, then two weeks later we still talked (long distance) then began dating. We didn’t go on a date until a few weeks into the relationship, in part because of the distance.
    So don’t tell me or ANY OTHER WOMAN that WE are dating wrong, or that MEN are the problem. Having sex first then dating worked for us, and we’re still together after a year and three months.

  112. Can’t people just do what they fucking want? I think this is all boiling down to people calling each other whores or prudes, douchebags or creeps, for doing or not doing whom they want to “do.” Or date. You’re saving yourself for marriage? Awesome, but people who don’t do that aren’t terrible people. You openly admit to (or are in denial of) the fact that you sleep around because you’re insecure and want attention? Okay well I’m sorry but you’ll eventually figure your shit out, and in the mean while why do people care? You just enjoy casual sex? Fuckin’ awesome, but people who don’t aren’t below you.
    Sheeeesh. As someone who’s done both (had one night stands, then realized it wasn’t for me and now is with just one person), I just don’t think it’s anyone else’s business. Yeah I realized I didn’t enjoy the one night stands and do sometimes regret some of them – however, I don’t presume to know what other people may or may not think about their own one night stands, or lack thereof. I personally am much happier now that I’m in a committed relationship with someone but not everyone feels like that for all of their lives (i.e. monogamy is not for everyone from the time they hit puberty until the time they die).
    Going off of that, this article is stupid in that it assumes guys should take a girl out to dinner just because they fucked. While I’m not judging, there is an expected, assumed idea behind going home with a person for one night – aka, it will probably be a one night stand. Even if you don’t have sex, drunkenly going home together after meeting has certain expectations (aka probably not going to go out to a dinner date) than if you meet someone in your lecture and she/he asks you out. I mean come on. Neither girls, nor guys, should expect someone to “drop $6.75 at Chipotle” after a fling. It was just a fling. When I hooked up with someone for just the sex, I didn’t *want* them to take me out to dinner or breakfast or whatever. I wanted to hook up and maybe have some pillow talk so it wasn’t weird and that was all. Meanwhile, once I met someone I knew I wanted to actually date, we actually dated first before sleeping together.
    As much as it sucks, there is going to be a different set of assumptions coming from one night stands. Though I don’t think there should be so much judgment about what people do or do not do, it’s silly to pretend there aren’t different things expected from the variety of dating/hooking up situations us near-college-age people experience.
    TL;DR – Stop fucking judging other people, everyone’s different and wants different things. But also recognize the cultural standards that are in place at places like colleges or night clubs…no, your one night stand is not obligated to buy you fucking Chipotle or take you to dinner anywhere. Multiple late-night texts comes with no set of assumptions (uh, sex), and normally legit dates are not included in that.

  113. Well, when I was in college, it was less of being skanky and yes, $6.75 was pretty expensive. My date would’ve needed to like eating mac and cheese, and be okay with me doing my laundry in my bathtub.

    Also I was embarrassed with how poor I was, k? I never let anyone get too close to me. Never really had time to do much but school work during that time. If you lived near your school/on campus I guess it could be different.

  114. I find this article extremely offensive and mostly condescending. If you ascribe to “traditional romance”, that’s fine, but DO NOT, DO FUCKING NOT think you’re giving me a “clue” while you’re disrespecting the way I express being a woman.

    I don’t know what you were trying to achieve with this article, but if Facebook rant-worthy, thoughtless diatribes are considered journalism and you’re actually getting a degree for writing this shit, then I strongly question the integrity of OU.

    If you were trying to empower women, then you failed. You are attempting to impose your opinions of what you think “dating” and “romance” should look like based on your own experiences. Call all the bullshit you want about my strides of pride, I’ll keep walking them. Saying that sex is “giving it all up” literally is perpetuating the disgusting belief that my value is determined only by my lack of sexuality. Please, keep slut-shaming. It’s great. Really helps us all “gather up our precious self-respect”.

    Lastly, if you think that the definition of a good relationship “shouldn’t be complicated”, then I don’t even know what planet you’re from. Complicated is not bad. Complicated is beautiful, deep, Many of the most popular love stories from our generation have shown that (eg The Notebook?). It seems as though you feel threatened by changing social norms you don’t fully understand. Which is fine. If you like Chipotle and dates and keeping yo vagina to yourself, then that’s cool. Just don’t put down other women in the process. Thanks.

  115. If you are having sex without going on a few dates first, and getting to know the person first, then it is completely, 100%, your own fault.

    If you can’t think for yourself, and instead are taking your cues for how to be from the people around you (college), then you don’t deserve to get what you really want (sex after getting to know someone first).

    After you get out of college and out into the real world, it’s the same thing. You can either take your cues for how to be from the people around (and end up living mediocre lives like they do), or you can think for yourself and live life how you want.

  116. To be honest, sex is sex. Dating is dating. Those are 2 different things, dating does eventually lead to sex but that doesn’t mean sex leads to dating. Women need to stop requiring so much from men. I’m saying this as a female too. What the fuck happened to women wanting equality? We as women can hit men, but men can’t hit us? That’s bullshit. Just because you have a vagina it doesn’t mean that you get to sit around not get hurt when you hurt someone else act like a little princess and get everything your way. Remember women. We asked for equality and shit like that. You want equality you got it and now you’re complaining about it. Get over yourselves. This is pathetic.

  117. I’m not a fan of the message. I don’t think dating is a necessary good, and I don’t think hook ups are a necessary evil. The stride of pride is exactly that if you are comfortable with what you are doing.
    The real issue is where the author says “You can’t expect too much from a guy in college. Sex comes first, a date comes way later, and only if he really likes you.” Women shouldn’t have to think that sex is the only way to romance. If you are not comfortable with having sex, you don’t have to do it.
    Yet, the solution isn’t that men have to take women out on more dates. The solution is that women need to ask for what they want. This can range from a casual hook-up to a serious relationship, but if what they want is to date, so be it! If a man you are interested in is not willing to offer that, then walk away!
    This solution also involves men, as they should not participate in a culture that expects sex from women. They need to recognize that women do not owe them anything, and understand the fact that many women feel pressured.
    And there is my two cents!


      Translation: We are sluts but we swear its the patriarchy’s fault!

      Hahahahaha. What a load of horse crap!

  118. I think that alot of the romatic gestures are done so that they can be posted on instagram and bragged about. Oh your man bought you flowers? You immediately post a pic of them. Other girls see this other boys see this and then they follow suit. The problem is keeping up not with the kardashians but with all the other people that go to your college. If all your friends are single then you want to be single and go out and party with them. You have sex with alot of girls because that’s what they’re doing, and it’s a social norm. On the other hand you have some friends who have girlfriends. Either they are happy or they fight all the damn time. I feel like if any guy truly likes a girl then he will pay for her dates and do nice things for her. But if a guy wants a one night stand and there is a girl willing to give it to him, then he goes and bangs her. The problem in that scenario is that the girl is either ok with the one night stand or else she tries to make it into something its not. He doesn’t want to take her out and text her any more because he thought it was just a one night stand and idk she thought he liked her. There’s a miscommunication. Idk if any of this is making sense but I think if people sat down for a few minutes and thought to themselves what in the actual fuck am I doing right now? Then people would understand a little more. Next time you’re wondering why the guy is being a dick or the girl is being a slut sit down and say .. are they actually worth my time? What do I even like about this girl? Do i just want a strictly sexual relationship or do i have genuine feelings? we need to just get our shit together, collectively.

  119. have any of you read Ovid’s Art of Love??? that was written thousands of years ago and talks about all the ways to seduce dumb women and take advantage and also how to stay with the women you actually like. Nothing new people.

  120. Ignoring all the comments above, and stating for the record as possibly the only grown-up in this digital room, all I can say is YOU GO GIRL. This is a brave, absolutely nail-on-the-head commentary and I wish every young woman could read this (but perhaps without all the comments afterward …). Things have changed so much in the dating world in the last 20 years, and these changes have not benefitted either gender. Makes me sad as my own kids begin to reach the dating years. I would also add that the anonymously posted comments here are part of the same trend of over-sharing and under-thinking that plagues modern college dating.

  121. Women built the hook up culture, women perpetrate the hook up culture, and only women lose in the hook up culture. You got two choices ladies:

    1) Sleep around with a lot of men, and wind up bitter, jaded and lonely/or in a lacklustre relationship.

    2) Be a mature, soulful human being, find someone nice who treats you with respect and loves only you and have the decency to give them back that same monogamous love and respect they give you.

    Though as we’ve seen time and time again, you gals will continue to pick number 1 and then bitch and moan about the obvious consequences that no guy will waste any effort on easy women.

    Women need to stop complaining about a system they themselves are entirely responsible for. If you don’t want to get burnt stop putting your hand in the fire you dummies.

    • What is this bizarre belief that only women who only had sex with significant others can wind up happy? Most happy marriages I know involve women who experimented before marriage to find out what satisfies them. But is it fun reading the comments of bitter men who can’t get dates and jizz over imagining the women who rejected them ending up alone. Not even close to reality, but whatever helps you sleep at night, dangerous_denzel 😉

  122. “And we don’t think we are owed anything after sex.”

    *makes point*


    *immediately contradicts point*

    Do you understand yourself? or naw

  123. It really is simple economics. The supply and demand curve. Men provide the demand for sex, and women the supply. Women in the modern era have shifted the curve in men’s favor, making sex virtually free. Conversely, men are the supply for relationships, and women are the demand. However, because sex is literally so easy to find, only a fool would pay a higher price for something that’s free. You don’t see anyone paying for something that they know is cheaper somewhere else. As a result the desire to have a relationship is abated, and although it may still be there, no one wants to look like the stupid investor who’s paying a premium for a cheap commodity. It would be great to have a relationship, but the point of the matter is sex has value. Just like wealth and education and resources. Guys are looking for loyal women who will ensure that genes get passed on and children raised, and women are looking for providers with resources (whatever that may be to them). Why would a man invest time and energy run the risk of having an untrustworthy parterre.

    “Oh but the number of partners you have has nothing to do with who you are as a person”

    Bullocks. No one here believes that not even you. If you’re going to look me in the eye and tell me that past behavior is not indicative of future behavior then you’re a fool. Do you really think that your actions are so distant from your inner personality and personhood? Nothing is done in a vacuum, it’s all connected. The logical correlations I can draw from a person’s actions in all facets of life are how we make any sort of statement or judgement in order to understand someone.

    On the other side, women are upset, because they’re realizing that actions actually have consequences. Instead of shifting the course in their favor and forcing men to make investments before the men can reap profits they complain. Which is one way of tackling an issue.

    Because life is fair and it “should” be that way. No one owes you anything. No girl owes anyone sex, no guy should expect it, and vice versa. No one owes you time, attention, burritos or anything.

    Class dismissed. Bring in the hate comments.

    Let me get you started: “You’re a meanie”

  124. This really amazes me. I think mostly because the vast majority of individuals here, many provoked in all honesty, are either defensive or assigning some sort of blame to themselves as a gender or the opposite gender. For me, reading these comments reveals so much about our culture and even more about the issue at hand. From an entirely meta-cognative standpoint, no one has engaged in meaningful dialogue (certainly there have been some very insightful constructive things said here but it is either met with agreement/complements or a harsh rejection and correction). This idea that no one is willing to communicate or reason their way through the issue baffles me, therefore; I’ll give this a go and see how others respond:

    I think, for the time being, the two most relevant and appropriate questions ought be what is the goal and what can be done to achieve it? Until some kind of concrete and specifically tailored issues are agreed upon and some kind of goal is established we’re all just going to argue apples to oranges.

    In regards to the question “what is the goal?” it seems there is a large disconnect. Many comments here are quick to offer their analytic commentary regarding the issue but not really go anywhere… so what is the goal? The article itself seems to suggest the goal is to return to a more traditional concept of dating and relationships. Many comments here reject that and instead seem to suggest the goal is to maintain a more modern and progressive notion of dating and relationships. For the sake of drama, both sides seem locked in eternal struggle, neither giving credit or respect to the others perspective, destined to duke it out into the foreseeable future. I’d like to propose a third option:

    Why does one have to dominate the other? Cannot both coexist? I believe the expression is different strokes for different folks? Why does one have to dominate or (as implied) eradicate the other? From this perspective, shouldn’t the over all goal be awareness? Making both women and men aware of what they actually want and going for it? Both men and women experience physical and psychological urges and sometimes are not in a healthy or constructive place to engage in emotional intimacy–sometimes they don’t want to for a variety of reasons.Does that really make them any less of person? If that’s what they want, then I say go ape-shit.In this instance it is possible that neither partner respects the other- why does this responsibility stereotypically fall on one gender or the other? On the other hand, if physical intimacy is elevated and essential in conjunction with emotional attachment and mutual vulnerability then don’t settle for less. If both partners are in a place where they want to open up to and emotionally invest in another person fantastic. The real goal here I feel is this: Men, there are women out there who’s emotional needs are not being met. If, this makes sense to you, be aware of this. Women, if your needs are not being met, don’t settle for less. If this makes sense to you, be strong.

    If, as I’ve suggested, self-awareness is the mutual goal both sides can agree on, what then is the method to achieve this? Certainly meaningful-self reflection is an essential element, but also the advocation of personal responsibility. Not only is the individual responsible for knowing what they want, but also not compromising on it. Someone on either extreme does themselves and others a disservice when they compromise beyond what they want. Men: if you want a meaningful relationship you have a responsibility to put forth the effort to make that happen. Women: if you find the criteria for what you desire as part of your relationships are not being met, hold till you find someone who creates acceptable circumstances. Men and women: if all you want is to engage in physical self release, you have a responsibility to seek out like minded individuals and make sure no one gets hurt.

    The thing that really agitates me about the articles is the judgmental perspective from which it’s written. Men: You’re to blame for not taking women out on traditional dates. Women: You are to blame for accepting this. For some members of both genders this works- it’s actually what they want. With regards to demanding dates of men, if they don’t want to give their time, money or invest themselves in that way, they are doing a disservice to themselves and their potential partner because someone is going to end up hurt. Assigning blame to either gender or demanding things beyond what members of either gender are willing to give will not be fruitful. It seems like most comments treat men and women as singular identical entities that think, feel, and want the same things when nothing further is from the truth. Most of the present arguments operate form a black and white dichotomy failing to realize or respect he varying shades of grey in between. I vote we let go of any preconceived judgments of any gender encourage constructive self-awareness and advocate personal responsibility rather that tossing any kind of blanket accusations around.

    Obviously, I’m sure there is some disagreement with how I see and frame the issue. I encourage and look forward to constructive challenges and meaningful dialogue. Bickering gets a us nowhere: what should our goal be and how is that we should achieve it?

    P.S. I’m a dude, I’m a libertarian (which bleeds into every facet of my life and philosophy), I could count the number of girlfriends I’ve had on one hand if three fingers were cut off, and I’ve been turned down by more women than happy haunts live in Disney’s Haunted Mansion.

  125. I feel anyone can do what ever they like with their body. If a guy wants to sleep with 60 girls, that is his choice. If a girl wants to sleep with 50 guys it is her choice as well. Now remember you cant control how others judge you, so if that bothers you maybe you need to take some time to judge yourself. I feel as long as you are not embarrassed to someone what your number is, you shouldnt have an issue with it. I do agree that if females want equality do not set limits, like a guy? call him, you invite him out… show him you are interested as well… chances are if you chose a good guy he will pay the bill anyways. and right there you can decide if it is worth dating or sticking around… i dont understand why girls stick around a guy for 3 months “talking”…. Wake up… reality every guy is an asshole, just gotta figure out which one is worth having around. Same goes to guys, all females are crazy… just gotta move on from that… cant win them all.

  126. On this same note, why does the guy have to shell out 6.75 for food. Shouldn’t the girl be doing the same thing. Isn’t it important for equality.

  127. Girls know what they want and so do guys for that matter. Whos to say that girls are ashamed the morning after they slept with someone. They have to get home somehow and it doesnt make it a walk of shame if they wanted to do it. Calling it a walk of shame or saying we should get a clue as girls makes us look pathetic. We can do what we want and we can make our own choices. Sex does make you a slut and it certainly doesnt mean you have no self respect. Get a clue

  128. A girls “value” (date-ability if you will) does decrease if the guy knows the people she has slept with. It’s pretty easy to judge a girl if she makes a habit of sleeping with your friends. I would have a problem dating a girl who’s been with my friends. I imagine girls feel the same way to a degree.

  129. Upon reading this I realized that I had the same feelings regarding dating when I was in college. The reality is, this is the first time in many student’s lives where you have unlimited freedom and a drive to experience things that you probably will never get to experience given any other time in your life. This holds true for both guys and girls. In the “real world” people do actually date because the novelty of hookups will eventually fade and both men and women will look for a deeper sense of worth and connection. This isn’t so much a gender issue as it is the reality of your environment. I would say, try to enjoy this time of your life. It’s a great time to find yourself and build confidence in your career aspirations and your needs. This is coming from someone who really had a great college experience and is currently following their career dreams. No one who is confident in themselves will ask you about all of your past dating/hookup experience. It’s really not relevant in terms of finding someone you’re compatible with.

    • “No one who is confident in themselves will ask you about all of your past dating/hookup experience.”

      Translation: I may have sucked 4 guys off at the same time last week, but if you don’t man up and marry me and take care of my child, you are a insecure loser.

      Hahahaha. Who the fuck falls for such shitty shaming tactics these days?

      • I understand that whatever happened in your relationship must be very difficult. I feel that you have a lot of things you may need to evaluate in terms of your relationships with women (perhaps American women). Being a foreign woman myself I definitely see cultural differences in how woman go about dating. I don’t think either of them are bad or good. They just are. You will find someone that matches your own personal style. You have to keep in mind that not all women are the same, just as not all men are the same. My statement wasn’t saying to go out and sleep with a bunch of guys/ girls; but, if you do, it’s not something that matters as much as you think. Basically, be who you want to be because life is too short to care so much about what everyone else thinks.

  130. it appears to me that her only concern rests with relationships, a point that she half-assedly attempts to turn around with the final “casual sex” comment.I’m a guy, so i can tell you that men are not that god damned smart. Our agendas are not packed to the brim with a litany of ways to bang and discard women. Do we enjoy sex? Absolutely. But i guess we always made the assumption that women (for the most part) did too. This article comes across, to me at least, as radically anti-feminist in that it states that women should only interest themselves in a guy on the promise of a relationship, and anything less or more isn’t worth their time. There is a lot more to both sexes than meets the eye, and to vapidly describe men as devilish, sex-seeking drones and women as underdogs oppressed by the mighty yoke of one-night-stand is stupid to a point of intellectual irresponsibility.

  131. boys, you are all being extremely shallow. most guys would have a steady relationship with almost anyone granted that she is attractive and willing to put out while women look for a real connection. So it’s ok for men to fuck whoever they want while they don’t feel like being in a long term relationship but for a woman that’s not ok? We’re supposed to sit quiet and pretty while your stick your dick in anything. Wondering why none of your relationships work out men? ITS BECAUSE YOU BASE RELATIONSHIPS OFF OF GIRLS YOU FUCKED. So you fucked one night when you were wasted so that means your completely compatible for each other and the relationship is gonna be great because good sex means good relationships. wtf. EQUALITY FOR ALL, NO EXCEPTIONS.

  132. Interesting article… I guess you just can’t have all the freedom and do whatever you want, and meanwhile expect the other person to pay for your pleasure. You just can’t have it both ways.

  133. You’re all idiots. The obvious choice here is to just not give any actual fucks. Men do what the fuck they want, women do what the fuck they want. The less fucks the better, imo.

  134. $6.75 at Chipotle? Fuck that, this is why God invented the dollar menu! I got her a McDouble and she got in the sack!

  135. People tend to forget that regardless of your gender, age, race, even species; the purpose of sex is to reproduce. Therefore, it is not because of religion, or because of society, that you should refrain from having sex with someone. It is common sense people! First of all, if you don’t see someone as a potential partner for life, why the hell are you having sex with them? It is not natural. The reason why we date is to check if the person is right for us. It is to make sure that our potential offspring has the proper support and family structure.

    Girls, it is not empowering to have sex with 10000 different men, it is a step back. Females have a natural instinct to refrain from casual sex because obviously if they ever were to get accidentally pregnant, they would be the ones to deal with the consequences (especially without a dedicated partner). Men are more likely to have multiple partners because the consequences are much less severe.

    If you have sex with multiple people who do not mean much to you, sex loses its value and becomes exactly that: casual. It is not longer something special or something to share with your one and only. When you find the person you want to be with, you will always be comparing them to all your previous partners and will never fully be satisfied.

    • Winner winner chicken dinner.


      This is also why you do NOT marry an American woman.

      By the time an average American woman is married, she’d have had sex with anywhere between 20 to 100 guys.

      What could you share with her that she hasn’t shared with the other 20+ guys? Nothing.

      Can you be the best sex she’s ever had among a group of 5 guys? Maybe. 10 guys? Well… 20 guys? Almost improbable.

      She will eventually come to resent you for not being “all that”, pine over the guys in her past baggage (and she has plenty of that) and drag you through the family courts for a divorce.

      Do you really need all that shit in your life? Hahahaha. Only if you are a loser.

      Conclusion: Don’t Marry American Women.

    • “Girls, it is not empowering to have sex with 10000 different men, it is a step back. Females have a natural instinct to refrain from casual sex..”

      My uterus and I must have missed this “natural instinct” because I LOVE SEX. I LOVE HAVING IT. I LOVE ORGASMS. I LOVE WAKING UP IN BEDS NAKED. Sex is empowering for me. What is disempowering is people like you who attempt to tell me what it’s like to be a woman. I promise you, I have firsthand experience in this, my friend.

      I laughed at your first paragraph when you said outright that sex is not “religious” and that dating is a biological method used to ensure proper family structure. You’re operating under the unfair assumption that the only way to ensure the success of kids is through the societal definitions of family that WERE originally dictated by religion
      In your last paragraph, you still assume that sex is meanth to be “special” and only shared with one other person. That is also a byproduct of Abrahamic religions dictating your beliefs. It’s fine to be religious, just don’t assume that what has happened traditionally is the best forever. For example, lesbian parents had no place in past social norms, but now we see that (wow totally didn’t see this one coming) they can raise kids just like any other family.

      • You can have sex with a 100,000 men. Just don’t expect them to “man up” and marry you when you are 35. LOL.

  136. I had to agree with the original article, dating just doesn’t seem to exist anymore. It’s a scary, lonely place out there and I see my friends struggling to keep standards but yet not wanting to end up alone. But it doesn’t have to be that way. I’ve been with my fiancé for five years now and both of us will be entering our marriage this summer virgins. We’re not homely looking people. We just decided when we were still teenagers that we would focus on developing other parts of the relationship, the physical aspect would no doubt be there when it was appropriate. Save yourself some heartache, and don’t give it all away every time someone turns their head your way. Let’s treat each other the way we all desire our future spouses to treat men/women they are spending time with and restore some respect and dignity to marriage.

  137. I don’t really agree with this, where I went to college, all of my closest guy friends and I were simultaneously dating women in my last 2 years there. Having worked in a freshman hall for more than 3 years as well I found that most of my students were going on dates before they gave it up, especially considering the walls were paper thin and EVERYONE knew what you were doing, Maybe it has something to do with where you are attending university but I don’t think it has disappeared. However I will agree that it has declined quite a bit.

  138. This comments forum makes me want to swear lots. People can do what they want. If anything all this has taught me is have fun when you’re younger, and when you hit 23/24 and wanna settle down simply lie when the one you care about asks “How many?”.

    Great to know that in today’s society guys can do what they want, but woman become of lesser value each time they have fun with someone new.

    Takes two, cunts.

    • Do you think guys are stupid when it comes to the answer of “how many”? Every single woman lies about her number. Almost no exceptions.

      The answer of “Oh, I slept with 2/3 guys in long term committed relationships” would have fooled guys in the 80s and the 90s but this is 2014.

      My basic rule of thumb to interpret how many is this:

      If her answer is less than five, than multiply it with 10 to get the true number.

      If her answer is above 5, multiply it with 5 to get the true number.

      • How sad that you feel this way. It means that, from your perspective, there is no value in a woman who does not sleep around. Because if she does not sleep around, then she is labeled a liar, and subsequently does not exist.

      • Incidentally, nobody is implying that unicorns exist. However, since you are using it in the form of an (oddly recycled) metaphor, I will address you in a different manner. Anybody with a sense of perspective can see there are different types of people in the world. The existence of a majority, obvious or not, does not belie the existence of a minority. In fact, it requires it.

        To imply that ‘all women are the same’ is the same as saying ‘all men are the same’ which clearly is not true, based on what I know of you, and what I know of my lover.

        Perhaps you are angry at the probable (definite) existence of women who would not sleep with you, and so attempt to deny their existence entirely.

        Maybe you are wounded. Maybe you are a troll. Maybe you are just an asshole. I can’t really say. But for the relative amusement it affords me, I will egg you on with the continuation of an opposing stance.

      • Maybe I am just using a generalization so I can address 80% of women using 20% of effort instead of wasting 80% of effort addressing 20% of women.

        Dumbass. That’s the whole point of using generalizations.

      • “Anybody with a sense of perspective can see there are different types of people in the world.”

        Yes, and?




        Of course AWALT and AMALT.


        I just don’t bother with them since they are useless to me.


        This statement is infallible logic and as such cannot be refuted. A ‘majority’ cannot exist without a ‘minority’.

    • If you “simply lie” to the “one you care about”, then do you really care about him? Or are you insulting his intelligence and consider him a schmuck?

      The correct answer is the latter. So stop deluding yourself that “you care about” that naive schmuck. LOL.

    • ” A key that opens many locks is a master.
      A lock that opens for any key is useless. ”

      And you can’t really lie. A girl who has been around develops tells. Even if most guys don’t recognize them consciously, it registers.

    • As if I am stupid enough to marry an American woman and commit suicide by family court. LOL.

  139. This whole article is absolute bullshit. Dear ***** who wrote this, some of us actually WANT to have casual sex. A guy does not owe me ******* chipotle after we have a drunken hook up. I don’t owe him anything and he doesn’t owe me anything. Whoever wrote this basically wants to force guys into liking girls when they don’t want to. If he doesn’t want to date you, he doesn’t want to ******* date you. Also, it shouldn’t be called a “walk of shame” in the first place. Why would I be embarrassed? The author of this article is 100% determining the value of women by their sexual encounters and you should be ashamed of yourself.

    And dating 2 guys in one weekend IS worse than hooking up with 2 guys in a weekend. By going on dates, you’re implying you might have feelings for them, making them spend money on you and expecting their affection but also most likely expecting them to not be seeing someone else either. Bull****. At least when you have casual sex with a guy, you’re not leading him on like you are by dating different guys.

    “But hey, if you’re all about the casual sex then I’m not here to stop you – I’m just telling you to get a clue.” I do have a clue, *****. I have an amazing boyfriend. However, when we broke up for a while, I just wanted casual sex. Some of us are sane enough to be able to know that just because a guy has sex with us doesn’t mean he has to ******* marrying us. That’s great if you only want to sleep with guys you’re dating, more power to you, but stop judging and being a ***** to both guys and girls for not having the same ideas about how and when to use their genitals.

    • Anna, please take your asterisks elsewhere.

      My point was not that men should automatically take a girl out after fucking her. Of course not, that would we wildly unrealistic. My point was that girls need to stop crying over boys who make no effort to prioritize them beyond a drunken text on a Friday night.

      In the future, read more carefully.

  140. College is a time to experiment and experience. For many of us, that may mean a drunken hook-up or casual sex. The trick is being able to distinguish the intent behind the actions. Are you looking for a boyfriend? Then a drunken hook-up is most likely not an effective way to achieve this. Are you looking for casual sex or a weekend make out buddy? Then going on a date may not be the best means to the end.

    It’s important to act in accordance with your desired end-game. Sometimes we might not know what our end-game is, and that’s okay. However, if you aren’t sure what you’re hoping to get either: be honest about this, or accept the possibility that you may be hurt or hurt someone else.

    Furthermore, realize the messages your actions are sending and how they may be perceived. If you’re downtown with friends and meet someone great – someone who you’d really like to get Chipotle with – act that way. Don’t give them the impression that you’re someone to have fun, but not someone who is seriously seeking a partner. Or you initiate. “Hey I’m drunk right now, but I think you’re really great and I’d like to nurse my hangover tomorrow with you over burritos”.

    Also, let’s be real. Chipotle is like $8.90 because you’re getting the fucking guac.

  141. this is a good one..is it too much to drop 6.75! how about the guys that drop wayyyyy more then that on dates and get played and never talked to…IT’s COLLEGE..no one is thinking about romance they are thinking about how much fun and craziness can i go threw before my 4 years are up. It has been the same way since long before now. Ask your parent to tell you a college story and if they are honest, it will sound a lot like one of yours today. Girls are equally to blame as is guys.

  142. If you don’t like it then it’s YOUR responsibility to stop investing time in a guy that isn’t giving you want you want.

  143. The funny thing is – all of you are correct. We began commodifying each other hardcore when social media became a *thing*. Facebook / OkCupid / any other networking site are essentially Amazon for humans. We market ourselves, and in doing so place some inherent value on our lives, and try to package all of that together in a neat fashion that neglects all the quirks and deeper subtleties.

    Sadly, I am the guy who has only slept with 6, all but 1 of which were relationships, and as I finish up college, I stand pretty alone (and on the outside) of the general mass of people: I don’t party, I don’t club, and I don’t need to fuck someone to be happy. Funny enough, I am perfectly content with this lifestyle – who knew you didn’t have to be an animal to be happy? And I’m NOT EVEN RELIGIOUS!

    But that being said, it’s a whole lot easier to be a bro/manwhore or a slut or whatever you wish to call either gender, because that’s how you get noticed. Millions of people acting in their own self-interest leads to an entire society forgetting how to operate normally (see: Tragedy of the Commons).

    Nobody should EVER start a relationship based on the sex, because that has a deep psychological effect that isn’t going to let two people fully value each other. Sure, its been done and has been successful, but I don’t see that as the norm. You should all stop looking in clubs and bars for people as well, cause you’re likely just going to get the same “unique” person again and again. Ditch the phones for a little while and talk to your classmates about something other than a party.

    Finally, I want to comment on this whole sex –> value thing. The physical effects of sex are a point that will be argued forever and ever, but I think the EMOTIONAL side is what should be looked upon:

    If a person has sex with 20 people by age 22 (my age, for example), I look at that as someone who probably doesn’t value sex as a strong, intimate bond, and therefore conclude they probably won’t view sleeping with me that way either. This goes for men AND women. The more you add to the list, the more you make someone else have to live up to, and consequently you’ll find more disappointment, which just compounds the issue even further. Also, consider that this person now has a bunch of other people out there that all know what it’s like to be with them, and you’re stuck floating in a sea of memories of the actions all of these people engaged in. Hugely philosophical, yes, but I will never believe for a second that none of you *don’t* compare the one you’re with to all the other one’s you’ve been with, which then pits them against memories you shouldn’t even be calling forth if you’re trying to care about this person. By having sex with a lot of people, you also put your partner in the situation of maybe *having* to meet those people, which causes angst and other issues in itself.

    I’m writing a book about these things, and it’s all related to economics, which is quite sad (and yes, I have the expertise to write this, because economics / political [philosophical] economy are my fields of study).

    • Spot-on about the emotional aspect of sex. I wasnt aware there were other people who thought this way. Of course I am even more conservative than you; at 26, I have been with 3 people. All of whom I considered to be ‘the one’…I was naive. But in an ideal world, someone like me could find that ‘one person’ first. I dont see the value in sleeping around. Who says you have to be an expert in bed when you meet someone special? Better to start out without the experience, and grow together. I believe there is value in that. But in that aspect, I do feel alone.

  144. Guys don’t want to date girls who are giving up sex to guys in one night stands. Pussy isn’t everything, but sex is supposed to be something you are sharing with someone you are at least into or seeing, not some drunken moron who paid attention to you for a fucking hour. I’d be a liar if I said I haven’t had a few one night stands myself, but why would I want to work hard at something that she’s just giving up for a bunch of random dudes for nothing. Why is it all on the male counterpart? Females should be representing themselves as someone who wants to date if they actually want to be dated, not get drunkenly thrown around at frat parties. If I’m taking a girl out on Friday night and she’s going out with someone else on Saturday night, I count my losses and move on because she is a waste of my time and effort. If you want to date someone don’t mess around with others at the same time it’s pretty simple. Saw someone getting chastised above for saying that someone has a sexual value, I completely agree. I don’t want to date a girl who’s slept with countless guys, shows she has no self respect or shame, nor would I expect a girl to date me if she knew I got around a lot. You can play naive and pretend this isn’t true, but everyone thinks generally the same way about this regardless of gender. If you want to be treated with respect and taken on dates as a female, treat yourself with the respect that the male counterpart would see as the girl who’s not going to fuck before a date and is actually serious about it. It is all relative you will be treated only the way you allow yourself to be. I have no interest in females who give it up for nothing. My girlfriend made me work for months to get her to have sex with me before we were anything serious, that’s part of what made it that much more intriguing is the chase of a female who actually respects herself and has an actual personality. Not saying that’s gonna be the outcome of dating and having a sexual relationship, but if you want to date someone who doesn’t hook up with girls and never talks to them again, don’t hook up with a guy on a one night stand, pretty simple yet foreign concept it seems to me.

    • See you make a good point about women not sleeping with guys immediately if they want a relationship but that only applies if the woman has never slept with guys immediately in her past. If a girl has slept with only one or two guys and made them wait for it, then I can understand if she makes me wait for it.

      But if a girl has slept around with 20 guys in the past, some of them within an hour or two of hooking up, and then she makes me wait for it, then I consider her a complete waste of time. Because clearly she’s not attracted to me like she was to the other guys she slept with immediately.

      So we come to this strange phenomenon where (ex)sluts who have slept with 30 guys try and fake modesty and don’t want to sleep with you because they think it will make them more relationship material in your eyes. LOL.

      That’s not fooling anyone girls. If you have a vivid sexual history (like most girls do these days) and you don’t sleep with me immediately, as a modern day man I am checking out. If you are that rare unicorn that doesn’t have a vivid sexual history (maybe 5% of girls today if I am optimistic), I may wait.

      But since the unicorn is pretty much an imaginary creature in this day and age, you can just stick with rule one. If she’s not sleeping with you immediately, check out and stop wasting your time.

  145. I think what we could all agree on is who would buy the cow if they can get the milk for free….

    Unless you just got that kinda milk to give away. Than all the power to you!

  146. Two things people need to get their thick heads around: Sex does not necessarily equate to romantic interest of any profound gradation; the archaic idea that guys need to pay on first dates is sexist and demeaning.

  147. It is all about the respect you have for yourself, simply put. If you don’t have respect for yourself, chances are when you get wasted, you’re more likely to go home with that “asshole dude that doesn’t take you to dinner” or that “stupid ding dong girl that can’t have a conversation”. What those two ‘categories’ of people have in common is the lack of respect for themselves, maybe even a little self consciousness. EVERYONE has to maintain respect for themselves in order to find the right girl or guy that’ll take them to dinner (girls can pay too, this isn’t the early 1950’s anymore).
    Bottom line, if you want guys/girls to respect you, take you out to dinner, woo you (in any fashion you desire), YOU YOURSELF have to have the respect within to get it from the outside world.
    Trust me on this, I’ve been that “stupid ding dong” and i’ve went home with that “asshole dude” that did not ever take me out to dinner. You get what you give out… give respect, get respect.

    for anyone wondering, I’m just a 20 year old girl chillin on her laptop on Tuesday night, maybe going out tonight, BUT DEF NOT GETTIN IT IN

  148. Halle-fucking-lujah! You hit the nail on the head. I rarely even get approached in person anymore, not even at a bar! People contact me on FACEBOOK trying to booty-message me. I wish old fashioned dating was still a thing. I have only been on a date with someone who wasn’t my boyfriend….once. WOW

  149. So you are judging those who want to have casual sex? As a girl in college I am not looking for a boyfriend and be held down just yet, because I haven’t found someone i could be with in that way, but I do enjoy sex, and when I find someone who is mutual in that respect and we can just have casual sex and not have to worry about the whole dating thing, it works out well.
    Not everyone wants to go on dates or find a relationship in college.
    I don’t need to “Get a clue” because I know what I want and I am okay with that.
    I see what your opinion is and what you clearly want and what your friend wants, but that isn’t what everyone else wants.
    Maybe if your friend wants a date, she should just ask herself?

    Something to think about before you judge girls/boys who just want to have sex.

  150. God, after reading some of these comments I fear for our generation.

    Briagenn, you’ve nailed it. As a guy who is holding off sex for a good woman, I’ve found that they are so few and far between. I can only imagine how hard it is for women today too.

    All I’ve really seen in these comments is selfishness over sex and it’s disheartening. The only thing that keeps a relationship stable is giving to the other person, not taking from them, which basically is what this new hookup/sex-on-the-first-date culture is. It’s sad really.

    Gotta stay strong on those morals and keep looking. The couples that have gotten married that I know of all waited on sex. The people who I know that haven’t, haven’t had that luck, and can barely keep a relationship going for long.

  151. I think this all started about the same time it was common place for people to swear openly in articles. I mean if we are holding each other to higher standards, sure lets start with sex, but can we please improve our adjectives, I implore you.

    We are all in this together. 😀
    The last gentlemen,
    Joshua Camacho

  152. Tell the truth, my brother! “let’s just be friends” == “Neva eva wanna talk to yo ass again!” fucking waste of time.

  153. Tell ’em, my brother! When she says “Let’s just be friends” – it’s a crock of shit. Girls should just tell the fucking truth. You won’t hurt our feelings, we are men!

  154. You make 2 seperate points which kind of counter each other, girls need to stop pinning over douchebags, but that doesn’t mean you also can’t casually hookup with those douchebags. Just stop worrying about when/if they’ll call and what they mean. Do the same thing they do, call them if you want to fuck and aside from that ignore them unless they’re for something useful (like moving, or if he’s your weed dealer etc.). No shame in that at all, and that’s college. If you find a guy worth your time, you’ll end up going to dinner (or laser tag/GoKarts/Concert/other way cooler date) and that’s worth pursuing, but if not, don’t pay some stupid 19 dickhead from long island unless it means as little to you as it does to him.

  155. Blame it all on the social media. It has made everyone weak in terms on communication. Both sexes do it not just one or the other. BOTH.

  156. Isn’t the whole point of hook-ups no commitments? If you want him to take you seriously then take yourself seriously and wait to sleep with him until after he takes you out. Why would a guy suddenly decide to take you out if he knows he can just has to call you at 2am for sex? Guys don’t respect or want to date girls like that. Try setting some ground rules right off the bat. I have a two month rule. I make it clear no sex until you’ve dated for two months. My boyfriend of two years now agreed to that rule and I knew he was a keeper who liked me for me. If you can’t wait that long, or if he isn’t willing to, then you guys can’t expect a relationship…or Chipotle.

  157. Ever think that maybe we are de-evolving and falling back into touch with primordial instincts? I mean think about it, most mammals have more than one mate, its nature. Granted, there are a few species that do not fit this mold. Society has imbedded in us the significance of having one mate and a beginning a family. Not just screwing anything with legs to reproduce as the Darwin theory may suggest. This actually seems more in touch with these primordial instincts.

    As we become less concerned about loyalty and meaningful relationships, we are falling further and further away from the societal stigma that we need to find one, and only one, [soul] mate. I’m not saying this is a good thing, just think about it…

    Technology has allowed us to avoid in person social interactions and helped us to hide coyly behind a screen where we can display any persona of ourselves that we find acceptable. We are lazy. We’ve allowed texting and social media to replace having “in the flesh” conversations. The only time we ever met-up with one another seems to be for sexual interactions. Otherwise, its texting, poking and liking pictures online. When was the last time you actually called someone on the phone “just to talk”? Society doesn’t seem concerned with building long lasting and meaningful relationships with one another anymore. There isn’t time for that. It’s becoming more and more acceptable to sleep around and avoid actually having a connection with someone. We let it happen. Let’s be honest with ourselves, we are regressing as a race. This time next week we’ll be wearing loin clothes, grunting and rediscovering fire.

  158. I am a woman that waited for her prince, had three beautiful children and am now on my own. I don’t regret waiting a single bit, and frankly am not waiting for a new prince. They aren’t out there. There are to many egotistical men wanting for only what they want, thinking that no one, but no one will ever deserve themselves. Every time you have sex with someone that doesn’t really care about you, you’re probably having sex with a thousand other people. At 54 years old, I’m here to tell you that life isn’t about how much sex you have. In the end, you will end up alone, and I hope that you’ll be able to live with what you have created. If you decide to have kids, what are you passing down to them? Whether you realize it or not, you are passing all of this down to them. Life is not without consequences. You eventually have to pay the piper. I see it all of the time. Money can’t make you happy. My children, my family, my friends make me happy.

  159. can do whatever you want as a woman, no one is stopping you, but you can’t control what men will think of you. The fact is most of us women won’t think a man is a whore for sleeping with a bunch of women, but men just don’t feel the same way. If you are okay with that, then keep sleeping around and doing what you want. It is a free country, but people are also free to think what they want. It’s like a prostitue puts more value on her body than most women do now adays. It’s sad.

    • I believe what you are referring to is a ‘man-whore’. Not all women are blinded by ‘societal norms’. I have rejected at least a few men because of the their tendency to sleep around. I just don’t find it attractive.

  160. This was written from a victimized female perspective. If you want to go on a date with a man, you can ask him to go dinner just as much as he can ask you. It’s not the idea of “dating” that’s dead, it’s the gender-assigned roles in dating that are long gone…and personally I don’t think there is anything wrong with that.

    • So Amanda, will you also pay for the dinners? Will you continue to ask the guy out, or will you at some point want him to ask you out? If he never takes the initiative, what would you do? Would you buy the ring and propose to the guy to? Most men you do this with will think you’re desperate. Maybe not right away, maybe not even consciously, but at some level they will feel it. They may be flattered, they may say yes to your invitations, but they won’t be excited about you and they may not even understand why. You just killed the thrill of the chase. Men fall in love while they have to work to get you. They never fall for the women that is easy to get. Like it or not, that’s the way it is. Men haven’t changed. The problem is that women think they have.

  161. Men are all driven by sex. Look at it this way- when a man takes a girl on a date, he is thinking “What’s in this for me?” If he spends more money on the date, for example, a more upscale restaurant, wine to get the girl to loosen up (no pun intended), he is hoping that his chances of sleeping with her increase. We go for the low hanging fruit (drunk texts at 3 a.m.) if we think it’s attainable, but we do realize that we have to work for some women. I’m sorry but if you’re a girl who constantly gets booty called and never taken on a date, it’s not because men don’t take girls on dates anymore, it’s because Peter told Paul that he texted you late at night and you were an easy f***.

  162. This whole write up is just a bit bias, and here’s why: Imagine the perspective of a guy: This girl sleeps around with other guys and has one night stands and has a huge number count, all the power to her, she can do what she wants, THAT SAID the man would feel insulted, why do I have to pay money to take this girl out for what she gives other men freely? Am I too ugly? Is she only interested in me buying her drinks? etc.

    The truth is, one night stands affect the way people think about men and women. They are just red flags for people looking for someone serious, even if they were just in your past.

  163. Alright so I’m a nice guy, I don’t know about your post or maybe it’s the girls in your state but here I am an actual guy looking for a freaking relationship and what do I usually find? Girls that just want to be friends with benefits and I’m here trying and at the end of the day they say you’re what I’m looking for just not now…I want to have fun at this age…and I’m like so what after you’ve had sex countless times you want someone to be faithful and not mess around anymore? You think when the question comes up of how many people have you been with you look up into space to actually think about HOW MANY YOU”VE BEEN WITH? I am so afraid of this question at age 20 that I dare not ask but I hope it seriously gets better for my generation ifnot I don’t know if anyone will be married for more than a few years. Sorry for my rant but I would like to say girls can just be sluts as well, guys weren’t the only ones that made the system this way.

    • “they say you’re what I’m looking for just not now…I want to have fun at this age”

      Basically, they are not attracted enough to fuck you but they think you have the potential to be a good provider when they are done fucking the rest of the town. Do you want to take up that offer? LOL.

  164. Seeing girls go for douche bags and actually hook up like no tomorrow actually makes me sad. Especially for a guy who IS a virgin, is ATTRACTIVE, but doesn’t act like a show offy dick, who works his butt off for a girl he finds attractive physically as well as find her personality attractive, only to find out shes actually a hoe. It boggles my mind to see that these guys, these assholes hook up with a girl as easy as 1, 2, 3, like wtf, you’re a douche bag, why does she like you? I will stay a virgin and wait for that special girl, but if that girl is/was a hoe then i’m sorry but you just aren’t worth it. If there are girls out there who agree with me i would def enjoy the comments under this to know there is hope lol