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Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » Yhwach Vs Current Naruto

Prime Yhwach/EoS Yhwach will almost definitely be stronger. Until then, as taichokage says, it's way too early.

For now, we can only say that he's at least slightly stronger than Yammamoto (he has control over his bankai and was able to stomp a shikai Yamma).

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » Strongest DBZ character current Naruto could defeat?

@DBZ_universe: I leave for 6 days, I come back and previously respectable members have lost their minds.

@Dream: I know right, or using Gremmy's meteor feat and scaling it to country level...oh wait, except that's accepted by almost everyone. I am not pulling calculations out of my ass or anything, but the blast on the scan is clearly at least country level.

And no, feats>statements. Take Itachi's statement early in the series, for instance. Last time I checked, he stated that both of them would die if they were to face each other (note that he didn't know about his sage mode). Yet he displayed multiple feats that would give him the edge over base Jiraiya throughout the manga- guess which one I'm going with? I have no doubt a city was destroyed, but the fact is they showed the blast and it covered a far greater area than an average city.

If it's not too much trouble, could you post the scan/extract for the city statement?

@Low said:

@619locust said:


On topic:

Given current feats, anyone up to (not) Majin Buu Saga is fair game for the top tairs of Naruto.

@Low: what? Are you saying Naruto can match Frieza and Cell? he can' if I get a medical condition from trying to process how ridiculous that statement is I'm gonna have to sue you

sue me then. lol This is my opinion on it. I'm in no way saying anyone in Naruto can survive a Kamehameha level planet buster. I'm just saying the speed/physical strength/durability hype is just too much to accept. Naruto, Madara, Obito and Hogoromo, these four atomizes anyone from the series up to Majin Buu saga otherwise.

Was about to offer you a proper response, but it's taken me this long to realise that you're either trolling or have no clue what you're talking about (shame on me, I'm getting slower). I can't take anyone seriously who would suggest that the likes of Naruto or Obito could compete with Freiza (let alone Cell). You realise that the Ginyu Force could beat the 4 you just mentioned, right?

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » Bills and Whis vs Omega Shenron and Super 17

Super 17 was killed by base Goku, Omega Shenron blew up a city. Hooray for feats :D

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » Which Naruto characters can defeat Raditz?

@Low: There you go again, 'Nappa is city level'. Whatever you say dude.

Given that all characters involved in this are bloodlusted, the only people who I think could beat Raditz 1v1 are Kaguya and the Rikudo Sennin (based on hype), and maybe Madara at his best. Raditz can fly, has at least as much DC as about 99% of the Naruto cast and, in my mind, is still faster than any of them.

As for people bringing up Nappa, don't kid yourselves: he'd still solo anyone in Naruto (unless Kaguya starts flipping casual continent level attacks next chapter).

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » Itachi Uchiha vs Byakuya Kuchiki (With Specifications)

@Redmonkeyssj4: My bad, I keep forgetting that Kenpachi still counts as a captain (he's more like a force of nature at this point).

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » Strongest DBZ character current Naruto could defeat?

@DBZ_universe said:


That was my reaction, what the hell are people smoking suggesting his DC is below country-level?

@Dream said:

@nishi99: Again, an official source for DBZ, the Daizenshuu, confirmed that the feat in question destroyed a city, not a country. Just because there's a big burst of light from the Earth seen from space doesn't necessarily make it bigger in destructive scope.

And to anyone planning to make assumptions: no, I don't think city-busting is Nappa's best destructive capability.

Scans>>>>statements. And ok, let's say it was a city. I guess there are some cities in the DBZ verse bigger than most countries, then.

@Low said:

@nishi99: Uhhhh...I'm done here. In manga states city, hyped to country+...

Manga shows country+, morons attempt to deny it.

Seems the Naruto hype has begun to overboil, which is a shame. Fun fact, Nappa could still solo both Naruto and Sasuke with ease.

Current Naruto? I'm sure he could beat the farmer. He could beat the BoS versions of any of the Z fighters bar Goku. I'd put him a bit under BoS Piccolo/Goku.

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » Lucy vs Sakura

@Gabriel_Logan said:

Lucy wins and with few difficulty Sakura it is strong but she if it is a real Glass Cannon, Lucy has demonstrated that it can support a great Dammage, so it is not a glass cannon for anything.

Ah and before they accuse Lucy of Plot, Sakura has had mas help of the Plot that Lucy, Sakura has a great force, but it has not defeated anybody with her, Lucy can put an Uranometry squarely, without counting of that his spirits can defeat Sakura

So already you don be Hypocrites, Sakura is the queen of the Plot, do not try to justify it only for that one sees mas spectacularly to throb, though ultimately they save it to every moment,

Lucy whit Her Spirits cant be defeated, and Whit her Spirit King Sakura nop can do anything

Oh, Speed, And, What is te official Speed of Sakura? She has not demonstrated to be able to overcome the speed, Lucy could have overcome very fast assaults

I don't even...

@takashichea: Ok, didn't realise you weren't allowed to do that. Just a shame that posting actual scans is so difficult nowadays.

@taichokage: Agreed.

@Saladking: Disagree all you want, but did you not see the link I posted, or read the manga? Sakura's punch ruined everything around her, the Juubi clones were specks on it in terms of scale. Lucy's defending against multiple hits like that is laughable.

@Jgames: As far as I'm aware, the byakugo is the healing technique- the chakra focus thing gives her uber strength, not byakugo. I had assumed that this is current Sakura, so she has it active, which means we should see her pull off a mega punch or two.

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » Lucy vs Sakura

@Saladking said:

@Jinbeifan1: @Jinbeifan1 said:

@DBZ_universe: I'm not surprised by his inconsistent writing, I'll tell you that much lol

@Saladking: Pfft those explosions are as inconsistent as Trollshima's writing. A suicide bomb couldn't even kill Happy. HAPPY FOR PETE'S SAKE... I'm just disappointed by FT is all. It started out pretty good, but it's been very lack luster

That was a serious case of PIS because we saw that Jackal's explosion wiped out the entire magic council along with their headquarters and his bomb was able to knock Natsu out for a couple of chapters

Happy surviving was just PIS unless Hiro is being serious about Happy having city level durability

Nah, Happy's planet level easily, guy's gonna solo Acnologia.

@Jgames said:

Round 1:Lucy win with difficulty, her water shield did tank multi building busting explosion and is a auto shield, and has a attack that can one shot her since she doesn't have any durability feat aside from her healing and that attacked knocked out a guy that tanked several of natsu attacks, and add in more celestial spirit who can at least give her a challenge, Lucy takes it

Round 2: Lucy mega ultrastomp, auto shield and reflex to dodge sniper rifle, Lucy can easily summon the celestial king who one shot her.

Round 1: the explosion Jackal used to wipe out the council looked far stronger than the casual ones he was using against Lucy. If Sakura uses one of her mega punches, I don't see one of Lucy's shields surviving (Sakura's punch was probably at least city block level).

Mega punch > Mega bubble. Sakura's speed would also give her the advantage.

Round 2: Spirit King stomps.

@othus12 said:

@taichokage said:

Still Aqarius isn't insanely strong either unless I missed a power up for Aquarius too. This sounds interesting. May e I should continue reading.

aquarius barrier tanked a blast that knocked natsu out cold.

@SekiryuuteiDxD said:

Sakura has byakugan ok i need to read the manga

If I watched up to episode 243 in the anime what chapter do i start at

its byakugo, the technique tsunade used back at pein arc.

A blast that knocked natsu out cold...I wonder what this would do to Natsu if it hit him full on?

I agree that Lucy's gotten a lot better, but I don't see her water shield taking multiple hits like that. Sakura for round 1, Lucy for round 2.

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » kenpachi vs Sasuke

@taichokage said:

Really? Look at how beat down he was by Nnoitra before using Kendo which he also has yet to use. It was to the point where he was using cheap tactics like pretending to be dead which is very out of character for him. Granted it might be even worse now but we know he goes to extreme measures before going all out. In fact he did not resort to kendo against Ichigo and it resulted in a double KO.

I remember that he was hurt pretty badly by Noitra. I also remember that he had removed his eyepatch a fair way before he even got to that stage (the eyepatch was like him going serious, kendo was more of a last resort).

As damaged as he was in that fight, however, it still pails in comparison to his current state. Not only has be been beaten, had his guts crushed by the space vacuum thing, but it looks as though he can barely move in his current state. As far as I remember, this is the worst condition we've ever seen Kenpachi in. He's a guy who enjoys the fight, and will balance himself so that he's in state where he can enjoy the fight. The fact that he's been reduced to being sprawled on the ground suggests there's no more he can do, then. I find it very, very hard to believe that even now, he isn't being serious. If he does just hop back up, or worse yet, do that and then pull a bankai out of his ass, then I'll admit that I'm wrong, but that would be terrible writing on Kubo's part.

Also, having awakened his zanpakto, I'm not sure the whole 'Kendo is my uber move' thing applies anymore. It looks like Kenny's going to need saving on this one (good thing Ichigo turned up).

@Ikki_Minami_ said:

@Zerogodlike: Yeah I get what you're saying, Kenpachi lose due to speed disadvantage, but Kenpachi has yet to take off his eye patch and show his Bankai. And as we know with Kubo and Kenpachi once he does that his power then should dwarf his power now imo, but it'll still take Sasuke a few good hits to take down Kenpachi due to his incredible durability.

@DevilMayhem666: Aye, I understand Yama is quite the badass XD but you do have to admit that Sasuke does not have or has not shown the sheer durability and endurance of Kenpachi, whose been stabbed in vital organs which if Naruto or Sasuke was stabbed their they'd die, also Kenpachi has greater strength then Sasuke. But I'll give this to Sasuke but it's still to early for both considering both have yet to show 100% of their true power if you get what I'm instigating in my argument.

Not only speed, go back and read the previous points. He loses due to a combination of Sasuke's speed, intelligence, hax and being a far more versatile fighter.

Also, see above, everything shown so far would indicate that Kenpachi is at his limit. Bankai? There's absolutely no proof he's awakened one, that's pure speculation, and even if he had, in his current state he can barely move, nevermind use a bankai. Sorry Kenpachi fans, was breaking through an enormous meteor and beating the strongest sternritter not good enough for you? Because that's as far as he's come at the moment, you'll have to wait a little longer if you want him to be EoS Juha Bach level or something.

Sasuke is not the one lying half-dead on the ground, barely able to move: he may have more to show. Kenpachi, apparently, does not.

I agree with you that Kenpachi has much greater endurance and strength than Sasuke, but against the things I mentioned earlier, it won't save him from losing. It will take a while, but Kenny's going down on this one.

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » Current Sasuke, Naruto, Madara Vs BOZ Piccolo and Goku

@Jgames said:

@GIRUGAMESH: at this point I would agree goku and piccolo can't one shot with physical attacks, but their speed is still outmatched everybody in naruto team and I highly doubt they won't use their energy attack if they in trouble. And one of them should be enough if not their after image and goku could also split himself to buy piccolo time. So while it would be difficult mainly because of those invisible madara which seem really random goku and piccolo will win

But as I say, team Naruto also have the element of surprise, have hax and are more versatile, plus they outnumber them.

They will probably let off a few energy attacks, but between susano and the team's firepower/durability they should be ok. I'm still willing to say that those energy attacks could give them a hard time, which is why I said the team wins 8/10. All the same, I just don't see team Z winning. Goku/Piccolo won't have that much time anyway, they're durable but after repeated susano slashes/bijuudamas/Madara powers they won't last long.

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9



@GIRUGAMESH: Goku team has enough speed advantage to blitz, but their dc at this point are not island, but a full energy attack from either person would obliterate them. Their stat are good enough where if the match get too intense he will just bust up a superkamekameha or a moon bustong energy blast from piccolo

I'm not entirely sure if the speed is that much greater, and even if it was, it's not as if Goku/Piccolo are going to one-shot them with a single punch. The team's sharingans/rinnegans, plus Sasuke's teleportation, plus the invisible rinbo shadows should help make up for a speed difference anyway.

I agree that a full powered blast from Piccolo or Goku would probably wreck team 1, but unless they're bloodlusted, I don't see them getting the chance in most cases. Team 1 just have a much wider moveset, which will keep team 2 guessing. Unless they fly up and do it right from the start, Goku/Piccolo probably won't get the chance to charge energy- they'll be too busy trying to survive the onslaught of invisible fighters, rasen-bijuudamas, PS slashes, a teleporting Sasuke and mountain-sized rocks falling from the sky.

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » Asura Kishin vs KIng Piccolo

@DBZ_universe: nice of you to say, and glad you agree.

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » Goku vs Dodoria

@Dream said:

@eddz99: The seventh volume of the Daizenshuu includes power levels for the characters up to the Frieza saga. Goku's base power level when he fought Nappa was 8,000 and shot up to 32,000 with Kaio-ken x 4 during his beam struggle with Vegeta.

I can't include a picture right now since I'm currently at work. But I can link you to a DBZ wiki article that includes images of the mentioned pages to the Daizenshuu containing said power levels. The images are at the bottom of the page.


Dodoria was practically crapping himself when he heard that Vegeta's power level on Namek had hit 24,000. Not to mention, Zarbon outright states that's higher than their levels (before his transformation).

Dodoria's power would probably be somewhere between 19,000-21,000 (there's probably an actual stat for it somewhere). If Goku goes right for the kill in Kaoiken x 3 (24,000), then he's got it. Otherwise, he can go for x4 and seal the deal.

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » Vegeta Vs Cell

Question: when/where was it stated that Dabura = Perfect Cell? If someone could get me a link/scan that'd be appreciated.

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » Itachi Uchiha vs Byakuya Kuchiki (With Specifications)

Kudos to the thread creator for actually putting effort in.

Based on feats, I'm not 100% on who would win this. Byakuya's stats are better than Itachi's, but if Itachi pulls out susano then the captain's in for a hard time.

All the same, I think Byakuya is fast enough to avoid Itachi's attacks, and could outlast him if need be- Itachi's biggest weakness has always been his poor stamina/chakra reserves. Throw in kido, and I'm leaning more towards the shinigami. Byakuya wins after a long, difficult fight.

Based on hype, though? Same as before, except Byakuya wins more quickly and with less difficulty. If Renji is now higher captain level after that healing pool, then Byakuya is probably the strongest captain alive.

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » kenpachi vs Sasuke

@taichokage said:

I'm with Kenpachi especially since he is still jobbing despite his state. Still rocking the eyepatch and won't use kendo. He's capable of at least more than twice the power of the meteor feat. But what can I say. Sasuke is a huge threat and could beat Zaraki. But if both were serious I think Zaraki could take him. In character he would lose. Just look at him. Those stern Ritter women aren't Sasuke level and he's getting trashed by them partly because of Gremmy, but partly because he refuses to go all out. He would lose with that mindset against Sasuke.

I have to disagree, the way it seems is that Kenpachi is getting beaten down at the moment and there's nothing he can do about it (somebody else beat me to it and said his changing basically changed the rules for his eyepatch). When it reaches the point where he's questioning if it's the end and if he's really going to die, you have to start doubting that he's been holding back. He's stopped holding back for far less in the past.

@Kurohige: HA nice. Imagine if Bach were to steal Kenny's bankai just as he's about to use it for the first time. Nevermind the sternritter, then they'd really be done for.

@Zerogodlike said:

At least we are all in agreement that ken loses This For now.

Agreed. I don't want to reiterate anything said, so I'll just say that Kenny has DC on his side, but Sasuke has intelligence, skill, hax and better defense working for him. He should take it.

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » Asura Kishin vs KIng Piccolo

@taichokage said:

Asura doesn't mind control. He messes with your mind and instills madness. That being said I think King Piccolo would win. It's hard to say what the upper limit of Asura's durability is. He wasn't really harmed bythe top tiers of his verse. All they could really do was push him back. But it's a NLF to think he could survive much more damage than was seen in his verse which King Piccolo is capable of.


If Black Star was able to repel him (at points) and survive most of his attacks, I don't see how a faster, far more powerful, more experienced opponent is going to have problems.

The way I see it, King Piccolo should be able to shrug off the Kishin's attacks without much trouble, but then get angry as he realises his attacks aren't putting down Asura. Pissed, he would then power up and fire off a blast that wipes out Asura (and probably everything else within a few miles).

Piccolo wins after getting angry and bringing out his forehead vein.

(For people who are going to say, 'but you can't kill Asura, he's the embodiment of fear':

1. NLF, as mentioned above

2. King Piccolo should be good to incapacitate him, which should count as a win.)

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9


@Jgames said:

Goku and piccolo stomp, either can solo

I thought it would be a long time before I defended Naruto characters against DBZ, but I'm not so sure they could at this point.

@nishi99 said:

Team Naruto wins this IMO. They got the Hax, DC & speed to put the two Z Warriors down. Only bloodlusted would the Z team have a chance.

Team Naruto certainly have the hax advantage.

But DC and speed? In my mind, DBZ still has edge here. DC is easier to make a case for, as it should be remembered that Piccolo (and by extension, Goku) can moon-bust with relative ease by this point (see Gohan oozaru scene). Even if we accept Naruto, Sasuke and Madara as country busters, they're still a ways off the DBZ fighters here. In terms of speed, I'd probably say Goku and Piccolo are a little ahead (they should be at least hypersonic++ at this point).

However, team 1 outnumbers them, and when you throw in 4 strong, invisible fighters on top of that, things are looking worse for the Z fighters. As mentioned, they also have other hax like Sasuke's rinnegan, which allows him teleportation abilities, on top of Naruto being very versatile with the 9 bijuu's chakra. All this may well be enough to make up for the gap in DC.

In my mind: if it starts/continues for too long as a close range match, team Naruto will win 8/10.

If both sides were bloodlusted, as you say, then team Z's chances would benefit, as they'd go straight for the big-guns energy attacks. In that scenario, I'd say Goku and Piccolo would take it.

Buuut, as they aren't bloodlusted, I'll say the Naruto team wins 7/10, as noted.

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » Current Madara, Sasuke, Naruto Vs Straw Hat Pirates, Whitebeard

@5th said:

Throwing in the Admirals won't even make a difference.

This, pretty much, the admirals would make it less of a stomp but the outcome would be the same.

@luthluth said:

Team 1 can solo the one piece verse


Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Battles » Might Guy vs the Bijuu

@ohgodwhy: True, 8 gates Gai was waaaay too strong. It's ridiculous to think that Gai could have accessed juubi level power whenever he wanted, especially with how many times it would have ended everything. Gates are waaay too strong.

As for this fight? Gai should have this in the bag. If Madara was able to smack the 9 bijuu around with one rinbo: hengoku then I could see Gai hits in 8 gates at least crippling them.

R1: one at a time? Gai easily. I doubt he'd even need night moth. Anyone who doubts this needs to go back and read the manga, his striking power is mad. His weakest hit (the first hit of evening elephant) was enough to form a crater and push Madara several hundred feet into the ground- the same Madara who was barely pushed back by daytime tiger.

The strongest hit of evening elephant (the fifth strike) was able to smash through Madara's black chakra shield, which would have been at least as strong as the one Juubito was going to protect himself with against 4 juubidamas (I know the front was kamuid away, but Madara was smashed straight through the back). Bottom line: a complete set of night elephant hits should be enough to at the very least cripple any of the bijuu, even Kurama. Night Gai = insta death for them.

Gai wins 10/10

R2: again, Gai should take it- 30 minutes is plenty. For anyone who says 'but bijuudamazzz', how are they going to get a chance to charge any kind of attack, much less aim it, when they are getting blitzed by evening elephants? Gai could actually follow out a nice pattern with it (land a hit on the Ichibi with the first, send the second punch at the two-tails, etc). A small target that is strong enough to severely damage them and is much, much faster than they are is going to cause problems for them. I wouldn't be surprised if Gai sent their bijuudamas back at them either, if they did get the chance, using the force of his punch.

The best option for them would to be to aim at the ground in front of them and hope to catch him in the explosion- they'd get damaged, but at least they'd wipe him out if they catch him in it. But for that to happen, Gai would have to let his guard down or ignore at least one of them for long enough for them to charge a blast.

Gai 8/10

@Justice said:

Going by the images I think 8 gates Gai can take out 9 chained up bijuu one on one and all at once, I mean they can't really move. On a serious note 8 Gates Gai should be the strongest Shinobi in Naruto right after current Naruto, Sasuke and Madara. 8 Gates is easily the 4th strongest current shinobi.

Hmm, I'm really not sure how Gai would stack up against current Naruto and Sasuke, but I think an argument can be made to at least put Gai on their level.

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