BY ERIC ZORN | E-mail | About | RSS

« It's over, Dan | Main | Save the goober »

Friday, February 14, 2014

Open thread: The Weeks in Review


Connected to Chicago (.mp3 file, right click to download) WLS-AM 890. Host Bill Cameron with Lynn Sweet of the Sun-Times, and Eric Zorn of the Tribune: Treasurer Dan Rutherford's troubles and the state of the GOP primary race, which the panel seems ready to call as a victory for Bruce Rauner. New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie comes to Chicago and strikes Bill as "a survivor." Is it too early to write him off for 2016? A minimum-wage hike looks to be in the works in Washington and Springfield.

Chicago Newsroom CAN TV: Host Ken Davis is joined by Mick Dumke (Chicago Reader) and Steve Edwards (Institute of Politics at the University of Chicago). They discuss the Republican race for Illinois governor and discuss whether conceal-and-carry laws are necessary to keep people safe. You may subscribe to the audio version of the Chicago Newsroom podcast on iTunes

CapitolView, WSEC-TV Springfield. Host Bernie Schoenburg (State Journal-Register) and guests Kent Redfield (University of Illinois Springfield) and Bruce Rushton (IL Times) discuss the latest news regarding the IL Republican Gubernatorial Primary and how Gov. Quinn will handle the budget..

Chicago Tonight: The Week in Review (WTTW-Ch. 11. Guest host, Eddie Arruza.Panel - David Greising, Reuters Midwest Bureau Chief - Maudlyne Ihejirika of the Chicago Sun-Times - Mary Ann Ahern of NBC 5 - Dan McGrath, a contributing sports columnist to the Chicago Sun-Times. More twists and turns in the Republican gubernatorial race. Candidate Dan Rutherford faces sexual harassment allegations, Bruce Rauner leads in the polls, and State Sen. Bill Brady is the only candidate to attend New Jersey Governor Chris Christie’s address to the Economic Club of Chicago. Mayor Emanuel criticized for raising some Taste of Chicago ticket prices. Also, Martin Oberman takes over as newly elected Metra Board Chairman. Michael Sam sends shockwaves through the sports world: the SEC defensive player of the year and NFL prospect announces he’s gay.



So an interesting anecdote regarding minimum wage and unemployment:
I've been in Oregon all week for work, the state with the highest minimum wage (or among them at least, I think it's #1 but not 100% sure); all gas stations here are full service, likely in an effort reduce unemployment (new jersey does this too, or at least used to) so gas stations are forced to pay almost $10/hr for someone to do a task that is completely unnecessary as everyone is more than capable of pumping their own gas... Yet somehow gas prices here are fairly low at just under $3/gallon...

The moral? Don't go into the gas station business in the state of Oregon? I'm guessing the margins here are much worse than in other states... Anyone here know anything about the gas station industry? Insight would be appreciated.

Oh, and happy valentine's day everyone!

@Bruce L: Our gas prices are high due to the oxygenation requirements to lower air pollution.
Oregon isn't required to have that.
Neither is NW Indiana, as the feds appear to believe that the air on the west side of State Line Ave. between Chicago & Hammond doesn't cross over that surveyor created boundary.

Happy Valentine's Day Bruce and Garry.

I almost moved to Oregon in the late 90's. One thing that turned me off was the constant need for planning everything in Portland and, at least what I encountered, was a giant need for the "government to fix that". Fix it yourself! I do not recall them not having self service pumps, but maybe I was in Washington when I got gas.


There is more than one factor that goes into the price of gasoline and the Texaco man in the white shirt and hat pumping your gas and checking your oil is just one of them.

MOPerina, unless it was just thinking about moving to Oregon that gave you gas!

Haha, LizH. I am also a big scaredy-cat when it comes to bridges and black ice and Portland has both. White knuckle driving would be the norm for me!

Oregon itself is gorgeous.

The latest number are that 3.3 million people have signed-up for ObamaCare.

How many of those are on Medicaid?

How many are now on ObamaCare due to Obamacare cancelling their previous policy?

How many of the 3.3 million have actuall paid their first premium payment?

Barry3 -- NY Times said today (though it MAY have been yesterday) that 20 percent have not paid their premiums; others have said, after talking to insurers, that 20 percent is best-case scenario. At least one insurer said they're more at 75 percent. So shave that 3.3 million!


Say it ain't so - an inflated number on ObamaCare. Next thing you know, Obamacare won't reduce the deficits either.

Looking for comments/thoughts on Wendy Davis, now running for governor of Texas. She became famous, so to speak, for filibustering the proposed legislation that, among other things, would have outlawed abortions after 20 weeks. (I know that there were a number of other restrictions that people disliked and made them oppose the bill even if they also favored that particular ban.)

So now ... she's back pedaling on the 20 weeks. In fact she's said a couple different things this week alone.

Actually, Beth, Wendy Davis was ready to vote for a bill that had certain exceptions, but then she discovered that the exceptions were vaguely or badly written so they didn't go far enough for her. She apparently is ready to vote for a bill that has the exceptions written in a way that is not too vague or confusing.

And re Obamacare, yesterday the Trib had a partial page of charts giving the % of age spread, type of plan, etc. Of course I can't find it now, but it indicated that there were more younger people applying, I think the number was around 27% now, and most new enrollees were selecting the silver plan (the most popular, I understand), meaning not Medicaid. And indications were that the number of uninsured has fallen to the lowest % in years. This number would of course include everyone, so this means that many of the people who had their coverage cancelled before now have coverage.

So another random observation...
I'm at MSP for a layover and all the food and bar orders have to be placed through a new iPad ordering system; it might be just about the most annoying thing ever! I assume it's supposed to make things easier but 90% of the customers at the bar need the bartender to come around and assist with anything you order, when it would be so much easier just to say "a pint of surly cynic ale"... Instead of a 20 second transaction the bartender has to walk around to the other side of the bar, basically enter in your order for you and then walk back around and pour your beer for you... It is honestly one of the dumbest systems I have ever seen! Each transaction takes minutes instead of seconds... And as we know, time is money :-)

Stupid is as stupid does!

But on the upside they have a fantastic beer selection :-)

Oh, and one more wrinkle to te above stupidity... They don't accept cash!!! Somehow, legal tender is not legitimate at the establishments here!!! Is that even legal?!? Seems like a lawsuit that is waiting to happen... And I'm so pissed at this place right now that I might start it!...


As customers climb the learning curve, this will become more efficient. Get used to it, especially as low skilled workers get more expensive, wait staff will be replaced.

The cash thing, you could have a case. I went to pay a $15.00 parking ticket with 1500 pennies. The village worker refused. I asked her to sign a piece a paper that I had offered to pay the ticket with legal American tender, she started counting the pennies

@ MOPerina
I really liked Portland, and Eugene for that matter, but you are right about the driving there; hilly curves and lots of inclement weather... I found the rain to actually be worse than the snow/ ice because the visibility was so bad and you couldn't even see the lane lines on the highway... And I haven't seen that big ball of fire that is rumored to shine in the sky all week... But they had really good food and really good beer, which helped in dealing with the constant dreariness... Plus, it was relatively warm and oh so verdant, which has helped to lift my spirits that have been utterly crushed during this cold and lifeless winter in Chicago... Yet somehow I can't wait to get back (but wouldn't you know; flight delayed... Aaargh!)


Stop discrediting people's preconceived notions.

Liz _ Thanks. Here are few more exerpts and articles.




Out of the 3.3 million that have signed up for Obamacare, that is just the private insurance portion. Another 6 million have signed up for Medicaid - that is they pay nothing or very little for their services.

From surveys taken, it looks like the vast majority of Obamacare enrollees buying private insurance are replacing their current insurance. That is, they are not uninsured.


Peanut Gallery,

I don't think any preconceived notions were discredited. An 80% collection rate is just poor - no private business can survive on that.

Almost 2/3 of the sign-ups are paying nothing for the service.

An age demographic needed to carry this plan is behind schedule.

Things better get better or this will be a bust

@Barry3: Some states have laws allowing government agencies to refuse more that 100 pennies when paying a bill.
I don't know which ones.

Here's a new Cadillac commercial, I would like to hear what COS members think:


And the clout never ends:
Vanecko has started serving his 60 day jail sentence.
Except he's in the McHenry County Jail, not 26th & Cal!

The crime was committed in C[r]ook County, he should be here, even if it has to be protective custody.

"Internet Trolls Really Are Horrible People: Narcissistic, Machiavellian, psychopathic, and sadistic."

Happy Valentines Day, everybody!

-- MrJM

Gas Buddy has been around a long time, but it occurred to me that some people might not be aware of it. The site provides up-to-date average gasoline prices by state and and metro area. And if you plug in your local zip code, it will give you current prices at each of your local stations


Whoa - hold on here - 1500 pennies?? That is petty insightful.


Inspired, just inspired.

Garry -- He's at the McHenry County Jail? That is just plain wrong, on every possible level.

Chris -- I posted a link that had scads of statistics on just about every point Liz was talking about. I was urging her to look at statistics that would put preconceived notions into perspective.


Government giving religious organizations federal grant money, and not offering, nay absolutely REFUSING to give non-religious non-profits access to the same program (read the actual DG board meeting minutes, you won't find that tidbit in the Tribune article), right here in Downers Grove. And not one word about the legality of it?

Standard Market in Westmont (and I assume in the coming Naperville location), doesn't take cash either. It's a grocery store that doesn't take cash. You can pay cash for your groceries in a round-about way by paying cash for a gift card at the service desk and then taking that gift card to the register.

Gas prices have large components made up of taxes, maybe taxes are lower in Oregon? You think? And not everyone can pump gas themselves, and with these federally-mandated new tire pressure monitors, it would be nice to have someone else get the road grime on their fingers while filling the tires with air all the time. And just what is wrong with service?


Links are always welcomed. However, be conscious of tendencies to only seeking information from sites that cater to their reader's personal bias.

As always, highly recommend The Economist as a good balanced source. It's capable of acknowledging both the merits and flaws of things like obamacare with a longer term perspective.


She should have made YOU count them out right in front of her to prove that you weren't trying to underpay. Then she could have signed your receipt for payment of the parking ticket.


I would have had no problem counting those pennies in front of her, I had plenty of time to spare that day.

Anita agrees to a slap on the wrist for the two now ex-cops in a sex assault case. No jail, no registration, no sex count convictions -- they plea to official misconduct.


Chris H -- Thanks for the recommendation. I'll take a look.

A Florida jury refused to convict Michael Dunn of first-degree murder, even though he pulled a gun and deliberately shot Jordan Davis for playing his music too loud at the gas station they both happened to be at. Given EZ's enthusiasm for Stand Your Ground laws, it should be very interesting to see his posts on this.

Garry and Beth,

Why so much aggro about Vanecko being in McHenry?

Assuming that no one's looking for "street justice", why would you want to pay the extra cost for protective custody? McHenry gen pop is probably worse than Cook County protective custody.

Dr. X,

My father-in-law swore by them, but I've always doubted the economics of gas finder apps like GasBuddy. Do people here use them?

Let's say your car holds 20 gallons of gas and gets 25 miles to the gallon (generous if you have an SUV) and gas averages $3/gallon. If GasBuddy can save you 10 cents per gallon, you would still need to drive less than 17 miles (round trip) out of your way to save any money. Even if you only drove 5 miles out of your way, you've only saved ~$1 on a $60 fill up or less than 2%. You can do better with a gas station loyalty card.


Michael Dunn still faces 60 years in jail on the charges he was convicted on. I anticipate a plea bargain that agrees on a longer than average sentence for these charges in exchange for dropping the retrial.

Don't construe my statement as any defense of Dunn. As I said with the GZ trial, I'm really concerned with the path we're on where we encourage armed citizens to be reckless idiots.

Would the people here who support "Stand your ground" consider supporting a revision that requires a higher standard of care for people who are armed (i.e., don't put yourself in a position that a reasonable person would consider potential provocative). It may not apply here but it's still a good idea.

Here's a few odd stories:

On Monday, President's Day, Groupon plans to honot President Alexander Hamilton. They need a history major at Groupon.

"Five New Jersey Democrats introduced a bill that would rename the sea between Japan and the Korean peninsula. Currently, the sea is known as the Sea of Japan. The bill would require “the state and all its political subdivisions, ‘to the extent practicable’” to refer to the body of water as both the “East Sea” and the “Sea of Japan.” Textbooks in New Jersey schools would have to adopt the new names starting in 2016." - I guess the bridgegate scandal has slowdown.

The Ivanpah Solar Electric Generating Station is cutting-edge solar technology and the lucky recipient of a $1.6 billion federal loan guarantee (note: the total cost of the project is $2.2 billion). It can provide electricty for 140,000 homes. The heat from the plant can reach up to 1,000 degrees. That makes any birds flying overhead more toasty than Dan Rutherford. What does green energy have against of fine-feathered friends?


Probably not. There's too much potential for shenanigans in a subjective standard like that. What is "potential provocation?" Playing loud music? Wearing a confederate flag t shirt in a black neighborhood? Wearing a pro-gay rights t shirt in that same neighborhood? Asking someone to turn his music down? Trying to take back the iPhone that someone just took from you? No, I think that leads nowhere good.


Fair point, but doesn't the Dunn case demonstrate a lot of subjective standards exist around "stand your ground".

@ Barry3
I saw an article about the Ivanpah generating station and the danger to birds from the extreme heat in Thursday's WSJ; apparently this is the unintended consequence of the solar reflecting plants... I don't think we'll see too much large scale solar power until they can make photovoltaic cells that are both cheaper and more efficient than they currently are...

On another "green" energy front, has anyone else been intrigued by the underwater "windmills" that have been featured on the GE commercials during the Olympics? Does anyone know anything about these? Are there any that are actually in existence? It seems like an innovative idea to me, but I also assume that they'd need to somehow "fence" them off so that large marine animals (whales, dolphins, porpoises, et al) don't suffer a fatal end due to getting caught in the blades (or the mills suffering from getting banged by whale shark or something)... I also imagine there are plenty of challenges to performing regular maintenance on such an apparatus; they would probably need to create a way to extract them from the water and powerful currents in order to efficiently service them...


The Dunn case demonstrates that there is a lot of subjectivity in any self-defense claim.

The law does not and can not really mandate common sense in this type of situation. Would you or I approach that particular group at a gas station and ask them to turn their music down? Of course not. We'd assume that no good would come from it (not to mention there's a fair chance that they are armed) because we use common sense. Do we really want to make it a law that people can't ask others to turn their music down? I don't think so.

Dunn was going to get the sentence he got regardless of stand your ground. He claimed he was threatened and that he believed he saw a gun. There's no way of knowing whether the former was true and I don't believe the latter. There was no separate stand your ground hearing although the jury was given instructions to consider the law. I don't think it makes a difference here.

Is stand your ground any more subjective than the alternative, which is duty to flee? In the world we live in with so much gun violence, I don't understand how duty to flee is supposed to work in many situations. Given how common it is for criminals to have guns, I think it's reasonable for a potential victim to assume that fleeing will lead to being shot in the back. I've taken some flak for this view before but I don't see why a victim can't assume that a criminal who is using physical force to steal the victim's iphone or wallet isn't going to use deadly force if he gets resistance. I also can't imagine why the law would require a person to passively allow something to be snatched from him or to hand over something upon receiving a verbal threat.

What about cases where criminal activity doesn't occur up front, e.g., a simple argument or fight that gets out of hand? Even in those cases, determining whether and when either person should or could flee is quite subjective. The bottom line is that I don't think stand your ground muddies the waters any more than they already are when someone asserts self defense.

ZORN REPLY -- I associate myself with much of this sentiment but I don't think Dunn's claims of self defense or fear of a firearm are legitimate or valid here. It would be a much more interesting case if the kid had gotten out of his car and been pounding on Dunn's car while perhaps his confederates were blocking Dunn from backing up....or something. This case looks like a fairly cut and dried instance of unjustified panic and unjustified shooting motivated to some significant degree by racial animus.
I know the law doesn't agree with me on this, but I think first-degree murder ought to be reserved for situations in which the killer planned more than a minute in advance to take someone's life or to put himself in a situation in which he might take someone's life, not cases where spur of the moment terrible decisions result in someone's death.
We probably need more degrees of murder, in other words.

@ MrJM
Great link! Thanks for that!

Leave it to the Canadians to have such profound findings (though thankfully it was not the québécois or I'd have to disregard it completely as "troll-ish" research and conclusions ;-)

Chris H -- I'm aggravated by the McHenry location because nice suburban McHenry's jail is -- I'm going to go out on a limb here! -- NOTHING like being jailed in Cook County. Nothing. He should be at 26th and California, whether he's in protective custody or not. A friend of mine's daughter ended up there (very long sad story involving illegal drugs) and my friend was terrified the whole time the daughter was there.

The situation is similar to those who get to serve time in one of the so-called "country club" minimum-security places.

And it points out once again that there's justice for schmoes and justice for the well-connected.

ChrisH -thanks for noticing! I think that tidbit bears remembering going forward. I'm pretty big on taking actions over words to determine a person's true intent.


You and I definitely live in different world. I would have no problem asking a group of teens (a.k.a. a whatever) from turning their music down. However, if they reacted the way Dunn says they did, my response, armed or not, is to get out of there. I didn't follow the testimony very closely, but it would be hard to convince me that his fear and willingness to see a non-existent shotgun wasn't based on a racist outlook emboldened by being armed.

Beth, I'm curious why you think McHenry jail is a country club and if real threats required protective custody, would Cook jail really be any scarier.


It took a couple reads before "I saw what you did there" and remember if a person is willing to kill an hour plus during the workweek to take pennies to a govt office, simple econ 101 tells us how much this person's time is worth.

ChrisH - nicely done! That is really good.


I haven't looked into gas station loyalty cards, so I can't compare. But I check GasBuddy occasionally, and I'll just note that your analysis leaves out the option of not driving out of your way at all. Say you're taking a trip -- you check a few towns to see where the cheapest gas is that you'll be passing by. If you live in Chicago, and are going to the suburbs, same thing. The gas will almost certainly be cheaper in the suburb, but a quick check can tell you which station that you might be near will be best. And even within your own town or city, it's nice to see the comparative listings at any given time. Alas, Econ 101 will tell you that it's probably not worth YOUR time, but let's not assume it's not worth anybody's. For some of us, cheapness is a hobby! ; )


Hmmm, ... I live in inner city Chicago so maybe we do live in different worlds (or maybe not; I can't recall if you've given any hints as to your general location). There are some teens I'd approach in some situations but not that particular group (aka, "honor students" - if you're up on the latest euphemisms). Does that mean I'm engaging in horrible stereotypes? Maybe but it's all about playing the odds, and no one is worse off if we don't have a forced interaction. I bet most of us whether we admit it or not deal with different groups of teens differently.

I'm not sure if I agree with your take on Dunn's state of mind. A rational person would see no good coming out of that situation. It doesn't seem that Dunn had any fear. He went out of his way to teach a group he didn't like a lesson. He saw a shotgun as a last ditch defense; not because of any fear he had. Profiling may be indicative of a racist outlook or awareness of statistical odds; in either case it's usually benign. What Dunn did is evidence of not only a racist outlook but outright racist behavior because he forced a confrontation and took it to the ultimate level. There's no excuse whatsoever for that.

BPost, ChrisH,

BTW, with regard to "that tidbit bears remembering going forward." Does this mean that youse guys think that, given the commenter's history of continuously, obnoxiously referring to J. J. Finn as "Left Lane" or "LL" ever since he made certain comments on a single thread, that folks should henceforth and always refer to him as something like "Barry1500?" Perhaps not, but karma's a bitch, no?


We do live in different neighborhood, not different worlds. And, if I have the facts right, Dunn wasn't in some suspicious inner city neighborhood. You post seems to acknowledge that circumstances and the gun users preceding actions do matter; so let's leave it at that.


I don't think I want to give him the satisfaction. If I did, I'd prefer the nickname " the pigeon" from a recent "fines lines".

ChrisH: I understand that you're not defending Dunn. It seems to me that his actual sentence, which will probably be more like 10 years, is minimal given what he did and how he did it.

It just seems to me that this is the logical extension of "Stand Your Ground" laws. If the alleged fistfight that Zimmerman says occurred was sufficient grounds for acquittal, then why not the fear of a fistfight breaking out? Heck, why not the fear of the fact that someone else might have a gun, with no evidence that they actually do?

(BTW, I'm posing these as questions, not as critiques of anything you or GregJ have written on this above).


I just saw the underwater windmill commercial. Maybe that;s something the Kennedys can live of teh coast of Mass. now.

Peanut Gallery,

"It took a couple reads before "I saw what you did there" and remember if a person is willing to kill an hour plus during the workweek to take pennies to a govt office, simple econ 101 tells us how much this person's time is worth." - That was time well spent watching the gov't bureacrat get steamed. Almost as good as schooling you in COS.

So does this mean we will see less of you?

ChrisH, - I saw that one too and thought EZ might want to include it as Land of Linkin - very apropos IMO.

Jakash - I kinda figured we get the type of response that would confirm cluelessness, so I'm with ChrisH.

ChrisH, bpost,

Yeah, I just wanted to make the comparison; I'm not actually in favor of the name game.

One does wonder, though, about the satisfaction derived from watching an innocent village worker "get steamed" by this stunt. Was that worker the person who gave him the ticket, or the person responsible for the parking regulations in the village? One also wonders whether there were others in line impacted by the needless delay caused by this transaction, but I suppose such would be of little concern, given the enjoyment to be had from sticking it to the gubmint in such original (ahem) fashion.


I envision it being kinda like the trolling equivalent of Cosplay.

Regarding the Dunn case/Stand Your Ground laws-

How about anyone that uses deadly force or nearly deadly force in a manner they perceive as justified is required to call the cops and remain present to explain the situation? That seemed one of the most awful facts of the case. He thought there was enough danger to shoot someone, but then didn't stick around to ensure the safety of anyone else. I agree with ChrisH in his concern for the idiots of the world to be emboldened by their firearms.

If anyone is going to take the law into their hands, they should at least have to see the episode to its safe conclusion.

LLFinn has said he likes the nickname as he is proud he does not drive over the speed limit even in the left hand lane.


To asnwer your questions

I don't think the person that I was paying the fine to was responsible for writing the ticket, but I'm not sure.

A higher probability that the person I was paying the fine to was not responsible for parking regulations.

There were no others in line waiting behind me while the transaction occurred.

Have you ever called a company and complained about a product or a service? Was the person you spoke to always the one responsible for manufacturing the product or providing the service or did you talk to a customer relations person?

So, based on your customer service analogy, I take it your objective was to contest the ticket or lobby for a change in the law by aggravating a low level clerk with no authority or real means to act on your behalf even if you weren't intentional abusing them? Once again, I question the value and productivity of your effort if it was anything but to be a pest.

Have you ever considered being a bit introspective about your actions here?


I'm not sure if that's such a good idea. In a lot of cases, the danger might not be over after the shot is fired or it may be unclear whether the area is safe for the person defending himself.

Strategically (not from a policy perspective), it might be a good idea to get out of there anyway. If there's a crowd and you could be identified then, sure, stick it out. If not, then do you really want to be identified and have to deal with it? Assuming you're in the right (and we're talking about clean self-defense here), why take your chances with the cops? It's not your fault the guy was trying to rob you or whatever. Put in an anonymous call and be done with it. Chances are you took out a repeat offender and the cops aren't going to care.

Now all of that assumes that you acted prudently and not like Dunn who fired rather indiscriminately. Of course if there's a chance that someone innocent was hurt under any circumstances you should take responsibility. And it goes without saying that we all hope that someone who acts recklessly is dumb enough to hang around. Every situation is different, which is why I don't like hard and fast rules here.


I knew I wasn't getting out of the ticket. I knew I wasn't changing the town's parking regulations. I was just making a quiet protest.

I definitiely know I'm not taking personal advice from you.

So the customer service analogy to Jakash is flawed. You were harassing a person who had personally done nothing to you and you acknowledge could not help you. The closest he/she came to harming you was by working in the municipal government as a police officer that gave you a ticket. A ticket I can presume you deserved because you didn't choose to avail yourself of the constructive means of challenging the ticket.

Have a good night, Barry.

Okay, Barry, thanks for the clarification with regard to the incident in question. "Have you ever called a company and complained about a product or a service?" Yes. I assume that I've spoken to customer relations folks, who have been hired for the purpose of taking the call, in the interest of assuring that customers are satisfied with the company's products and that the products are functioning correctly.

As has been pointed out, that analogy is flawed. The village worker has not been hired to count pennies for the purpose of registering your quiet protest. Nor does it seem to me that such a protest makes much sense, as nobody expects that people are satisfied to have received a ticket. And, FWIW, I'm always considerate to the person I end up talking to, as I realize that they're not the ones who've caused whatever problem I'm having with the product. My purpose is not to see to it that that person is "steamed" by the call.

"You were harassing a person who had personally done nothing to you and you acknowledge could not help you" - And the call center person did what to the irate customer?

"A ticket I can presume you deserved because you didn't choose to avail yourself of the constructive means of challenging the ticket." - And earlier you claimed My time was worth little since I had time to pay the clerk in pennies, but you think it would have been a wise use of my time to sit in court to fight a $15.00 parking ticket?

Have a good night Chris.


There is a difference between the call cneter person and the numicipal worker - the call center person better be polite and listen to the customer's concerns or the company will lose a customer. Municipal workers don't have those concerns (although most are nice).

The village worker has been hired to receive payment of parking fines and that is what she was doing. I was paying a fine in American currency. She was getting paid for doing that or whatever her other task were that day. I' venturing a guess, she wasn't late going home that night because of my paying my fine in pennies. I voiced my complaint why I thought the parking restricting was unfair, she said she understood, but the fine is the fine.


Thanks, your arguments have been petty insightful.

Keep your day job Chris

The comments to this entry are closed.

More about Eric Zorn


•  The Tweet of the Week 2015 Compendium
•  Transition time
•  Open Thread: The Weeks In Review
•  Fine lines final four
•  Two takes on medical tokes
•  Missed it by that much
•  16 is the new 21
•  Fine lines


• `The Office'
• American Idol
• Anthony Porter Case
• Blago trial
• Books
• Chicken!
• Commenters
• Common Sense Caucus
• Current Affairs
• Film
• Fine Expressions
• Fine Shots
• Food and Drink
• Friday Night Lights
• Grey's Anatomy
• How Long Does it Take?
• Jessica Reynolds
• Mad Men
• Megan Crepeau
• Month in Review
• Obama
• Peterson case
• Predictions
• Prickly Pair Podcasts
• Race to the Slop
• Religion
• Rhubarb Patch
• Rules for commenting
• Somebody Nobody Asked
• Speaking of Sports
• Spit takes
• Sports
• Television
• The Killing
• This I No Longer Believe
• Trayvon Martin case
• Video Commentaries
• Webliographies
• Weeks in Review
• YaGotta

December 2015 posts
Sun Mon Tue Wed Thu Fri Sat
1 2 3 4 5
6 7 8 9 10 11 12
13 14 15 16 17 18 19
20 21 22 23 24 25 26
27 28 29 30 31

Browse archives

Chicago Tribune Media Group