Totally de-converted at 72

Sent in by Jay P















Happy days!


Dedwin Hedon said...

I am a conspiracy theorist, but I think most of the things that are happening in today's society are a direct result of most Christians trying to usher in the apocalypse and make everyone believe. Everytime something happens with the world, every Christ-tosser out there claims its time for the rapture and time for us all to die.

Rich said...

If you have not read Kathrine Yurica's "The Despoiling of America" you need to. This is not a conspiracy rap, it is well documented evidence of a plan the theocrats have to take over our government. You will recognize all the players.

Hrothwulf Lauring said...

I've seen Zeitgeist and read a lot on the whole Jesus myth thing, and I just want to make sure that everyone's taking the euhemerism theory (patching together of savior figures to "invent" Jesus) with a BIG grain of salt.

There are a lot of false statements in Zeitgeist. "Horizon" does NOT come from the words "Horus has risen." Many of the "saviors" listed like Krishna (who, unlike the movie says, was NOT crucified) and Horus actually have very little in common with the Jesus legend (in fact it was Osiris who was killed and came back to life). In fact the only real similarities between Jesus and the other "savior" figures (which most of them weren't) was the miraculous birth thing and the coming back from the dead or going to Heaven thing. And in fact there are many more blatant lies used to try to substantiate the Jesus myth thing).

I'm not a Christian, but I am a historian, and the almost the entirety of the Jesus-myth part of Zeitgeist is made up of lies and unsubstantiated claims.

There are many Christian sites that of course want to debunk this theory but I found one that's not pro-Christian, but anti-conspiracy theory:

Sorry guys. But Jesus doesn't need to be an entirely made-up figure to be a hoax and a fraud.

Lupis Noctum said...

Welcome Jay!

Your post is a fine reminder of the fact that it's better late than never...

sconnor said...

Hrothwulf Lauring,

It would seem Religious Tolerance contradicts what you say about Krishna not being crucified.


In the Christian Scriptures (New Testament) Yeshua's crucifixion on a cross or stake is often referred to as being "hung on a tree:"

Acts 5:30: "The God of our fathers raised up Jesus...hanging him on a tree.
Acts 10:39: "...hanging him on a tree."
Acts 13:29: "...they took him down from the tree..."
1 Peter 2:24: "...who his own self bare our sins in his body upon the tree..." (All ASV)


Telmi said...

Welcome, Jay,

I would just like to wish you all the best in the years ahead.

And I agree with the comment from Lupis Noctum - it's better late than never.


Philip R Kreyche said...
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Philip R Kreyche said...
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Philip R Kreyche said...

Well for one, being crucified alive and having your body hung on a tree for the birds to peck at are two very different things. But neither of these are in the Krishna legend.

The tradition comes from the Mahabharatha, not the Bhagavad Gita, and the tradition is that Krishna was walking through a forest and a hunter mistook him for a deer, and shot an arrow at him and it struck him in the foot. The hunter was horrified and repented dearly of his mistake, but Krishna forgave him. Krishna was underNEATH a tree.

I can see where someone would make the mistake of connecting being pierced by something next to a tree to being pierced TO a tree, but it's just not the case.


Also, Religious Tolerance also makes the claim that Krishna descended into Hell before going to Heaven. But, since there's no Hindu concept of Hell, that's quite impossible.

- Hrothwulf

Anonymous said...

Zeitgeist is quite religious, in my opinion.

Zeitgeist has it all - the black & white worldview and the belief in beings that know everything and can do anything. The diabolically evil "men behind the curtain" in this case.

They don't seem to believe that there are such a thing as coincidences. They have found the Truth, but use lies and half-truths to support their claims. And the part about microchips is basically a classic christian conspiracy based on ideas about the number of the beast. It all seems very familiar.

MKSlusarski said...

I turned to atheism at age 8 but it wasn't until I was well into my 40's that I brought is to the forefront with the help of my best online buddy BobAthee who has helped me in more than one way. Bob is in his 70's too so it's never too late to change your point of view on religion. I can't count the ways you have helped me Bob but I thank you dearly.

Mary in Alaska

Jeff Eyges said...


Actually, that isn't quite true. The Indians, like the Buddhists, have a multi-tiered cosmology - numerous heavens above this level of reality, numerous hells below. They're described in terms that would make a Christian fundie blanch, but they aren't seen as eternal states.

What Religious Tolerance may be referring to is this: at the end of the Mahabharata, the great Indian epic, Arjuna, the protagonist, having defeated all of his enemies (with advice from Lord Krishna), faces death. He is told that, as a result of his heroism and devotion to duty, he merits heaven, whereas his family members are all in hell. He demands to be taken to hell, refusing to go to heaven without them. At that point, he is taken to heaven (by Krishna, if memory serves), along with all of his family members. In the end, his refusal to abandon them saves them all.

They might have thought it was Krishna because he features repeatedly throughout the epic, including, I think, that last bit.

I sometimes hold this story up to Christians because, like the ideal of the Bodhisattva in Buddhism, it emphasizes collective responsibility, unlike Christianity, in which salvation is a purely individual affair - "I've got mine, you get yours!"

MKSlusarski said...

I was married by a descendant of Crazy Horse here in Alaska and I can't think of a more beautiful ceremony I've ever attended even if it was my own. The Native American people are a people to be cherished and remembered as a strong, proud people.

Anonymous said...

MKSlusarski said...


Isn't it wonderful to be able to have an open mind to explore other things in life?

You are right, the Native American People should be cherished, and highly respected. It just kills me anytime some arrogant christian claims how this country was found upon christian principles when in fact it was christians who murdered and killed American Natives and stole their land in the name of their God, "Jesus".

The more I learn about the darkside of christianity the more sickened I become, and the more I do not ever want to return to it.

Raul said...

Well,that's some spirit! Don't think I'd have the guts to do something like that in your age.

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