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tv   Cross Talk  RT  July 26, 2021 7:30pm-8:01pm EDT

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i'll never forget the battle over the que versus lined controversy that turned into world war when the color versus color atrocities were exposed. so kids wouldn't learn british pronunciations. i'm pretty sure the revolutionary war was about something slightly more than that. so it was so bad to saying your please, and thank you. i think it's rather lovely, but i would, i wouldn't tie, being in the homeland of peppa pig news for this. i was doing this again. it's for the nice the for all of you out there that regret not being around the soviet union at the time with their collapse. you know, a lot of the blood histology about that lot of interesting things. math time was there writing in the journal. anyway, they get to have that experience today right here in the good old usa
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the, the, me ah, ah, ah ah, we welcome the cross talk, they're all things considered. peter, the bill, the bike administration, tells us the world faces the start choice between democracy and authoritarianism. is this make any sense? the balance of power in the world system is moving to multiple energy and it's not defined. why ideological preferences dangerously. washington continues to claim it has the right to define what is the legitimate world or i
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discuss these issues and more. i'm joined by my guess, george m u l e. in budapest, he's a podcast, or as a gaggle which can be found on youtube and locals. and here in moscow were joined by dmitri bob and she's a political analyst and editor. it's me, internet media project. gentleman cross up rules and effect, that means you can jump in anytime you want. appreciate it. okay, let's go to your 1st the in budapest year, it's really quite interesting. the bite administration, endlessly talked about diversity, diversity diversity, and we see it in their politics domestically and now we see it since they, i'd been to the administration pushing diversity into the international system. which actually is really quite contradictory because diversity, in least nominally, is about having differences. but i think what we see here with the bio administration is an extreme form universalism. and there covering it up under
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diversity because it's either or, i mean, it isn't returned to the cold war, but we are returning to a cold war paradigm. it is democracy versus authoritarianism. and in that ideological mindset, a kind to make sense. but in the real world, it doesn't make any sense at all. go ahead. george. it doesn't make any sense. so there is really the difference between the diversity at home and the superficial difference because of when the, by the ministration. ologist talk about diversity, they don't actually really mean to be or view opinions. they mean they've got a monolithic view, the, well, they mean, you know, the superficial acid, you know, the color of the skin, what gender sexual orientation is. but that's just the monolithic worldview. you want to get into the bike ration, you have to subscribe to a set of doctrines,
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so they're not going to have a bus the bus to abuse in the administrator. and i think that now they look on the world that the rest of the world have to follow this monolithic, logical mindset. now of course, it's bringing them into compensation of his name with the rival. great. but it's also bringing them into conversation with countries that normally would be on their side. so when the obama administration goes through obama, so when to kenya, towards the end of his administration, he started lecturing them about gay rights. so he was getting ready to welcome its favorite song, you know, the most, the most famous canyon in the well. and what is, even when he goes to start lecturing them about agonized, like in your when you're seeing the right now when the by you,
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which is a very involved by in this vision is getting itself in call with countries that are normally on their side in poland to the great great freedom fighters again, communism and early please be worship during the call. got 3 trans. yeah. and now they're, you know, demonized. why? because they're not subscribing to the western ideological moment. i lost count the number of times george used the word side, meaning choosing signs. again, this is the thing to do with diversity. it is actually a 0 sum game. and what's really quite remarkable is that russia and china are demonized as being authoritarian. but even if you accept that proposition, russia, china are not proposing that makes the promotion an extension of authoritarian powers. there's no evidence about whatsoever. so this is an idea what you will
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struggle coming just from one side. the use the word side again go ahead. the ma, where you are quite cried. i think george was quite trying to fight in the examples of poland and hungary as country is, which just didn't fit the morally that i want to go monolith or the west. and it was interesting that president, do know, full and rosa for because he's southern said just a few days ago that i would you go constraints imposed by the european union? i in fact then there, you know, what you can constraints that were imposed by the soviet union. and the other were an example of gas done. i mean that the idea that you should educate goals before boys, you know, it just didn't go down and have good stuff and he couldn't, but there is no so, so, i mean, 20 years, the longest, warren american history americans are leaving,
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they're going to some and i don't hear a war the self criticism. what did we do or all, it's all about. the table are guns, you know, they're uneducated, you know, they are unable to. so it's the same story. again. i told you said the board 0 sum game and all the sites is very important because, you know, we are trying to find out why is the situation so bad in europe? i mean, it's no worse than a 1989 or even in 1987. why did it happen? well, because of george beep, right? you're writing his article. it's a big wall, the importer, somebody most in american foreign policy article, published in the national interest. in fact, clinton even clinton and george bush, it was more so supported universally from instead of diversity. that was there. i mean, i remember how clinton many times came to law school with his wife lecturing russians
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on the, on the benefits of america way of life. the problem was that you projected the immature great sympathy the want to rush. so, i mean, it's just a noxious. you know, when hillary started a chance in russia before the election in 2016 when she was there, central state bill clinton never objected. even though that was basically undue. and you know what he said for many years when he was the president. so they basically impose this idea off against them. you know, instead of talking about compromise, talking about corporation in europe, it was about democratic west save in the former soviet republics from that authoritarian clark just over russia. i think that was the image or what was very well presented by glen. decent, our friend and should bend in the in crosstalk in his reach and logical on our
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teams website. as driven in bel russian culture. the headline on the article. and you look at how the situation develop basically why did we have wars in the form of the former soviet union? the main reason why people have was, is when the situation presents an opportunity for nationalists. so the 1st time that actually a saw opportunity was in the end of the soviet union when loan, too for moving, you know, in the, in soviet politics. so people are nationalists, you know, me and there isn't as you're by john f, as in georgia. just trying to the moment you know, this is the moment where we can redraw bonus or preserve, or the says they are. they started the worse if they could just jump in here. gimme a, you're absolutely historically empirically, correct. let me move over to george here. but this all was counted as being pro democracy in the west. joke and dba got a spot on you have these rabbit nationalists looking for an opportunity and then
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they, they in the west in their and their underlings in the media. they wrap it all up into some kind of, you know, fluffy, democratic thing. i mean, it wasn't had nothing to do with that whatsoever. go ahead. george. no, nothing is all across the paradigm of the law was of course you, the law in which the west deliberately deliberately misled the public about what was really going on in the slot. and so you have in croatia, rooms and openly fashioned by those open apologists for the fashion regime in world war 2, coming to power and browsing. the patriot, the rabid makers will decide which was reminiscent what they were doing in the western media. and western politician was the make. it presented into some of these are real democrats, you know, they, they, then why, because again, democracy as opposed to the terrible people in belgrade pro russian row come in,
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all these terrible this game, you know, the model to be used elsewhere. so somebody meant to be present to the game as a democrat, and then the gaining ukraine will be on the nationalist crashes, the biologist, a present that as democrats and you know, the west. and so if you tell them, well, this guy, you know, this is yara sh, you know, he's a sort of a sort of like big right? and that's the west places. so, you know, they sold these nationalist islamic in a number of days as useful goals for destroying yugoslavia and weakening, basically read in russia and presented to them as liberals and democrats. it's
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really interesting team and said, you know, again, we have this kind of false choice or false binary is that if you want more reform and democracy, you must be pro western an anti russian. i mean, why can't you be pro reform and pro democracy and still be pro russia? of course i'm talking about beer roots. ok. they're creating these artificial divisions that are, are completely unnecessary and do not exist in real life. go ahead. well, i think glen d some presented very well in his article that i mentioned last test driven in russian circus. he writes that the basically directions have to make this choice between europe and russia and in the same way ukrainians cage to make the choice. i remember how the control over association agreement with the start that it started in 2003, when president coach mart joined the joint economic space with russia. immediately
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mano the european commissioners to wiggle. he came to, you said you have a choice, you know, if you stay in the joint economic space, say good bye to that your membership, it will never be offered to you. so the ukrainians were before the same choice, the, the west is now forcing the bell russians to me and glen decent is very right that this was the reason for the conflict on the was in the former soviet union, democracy de mer. yeah, i mean it's, it's amazing. the west might forcefully 70 countries that were former soviet republics. have women, language, common history, common religion with russian by separating them from russia. the west prepares the truth for c. one was like in your grain of conflict and coming back to what they just said, you know, the 1st way will was some it was, it was in that late age is early ninety's when mountains were moving in the soviet
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union and all this could be redrawn you know, let me give you the example of georgia nationalists. they decide that the, this is the moment to take the land from the minority just from their projects from the agents. they're terrible 1st president gun. so try to do it. and she failed. and i must, there was that the west change because the west had the gods to condemn gum so they can make one when they found mr. so casually, we go to a short break break. we'll continue our discussion and some real new stay with our ah, ah, me, make sure you know board is the number t's and you merge. we don't have authority,
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we go to the vaccine. the whole world needs to take action and be ready to people who judge governors crisis and we can do better. we should be better. everyone is contributing each in their own way. but we also know that this crisis will not go on forever. the challenge is to response has been massive. so many good people are helping us. it makes us feel very proud that we need together in hello, driven by a dreamer shaped by those in
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me i think we dare to ask me. ah oh, welcome back. across all things considered, peter, this is the home edition and to remind you were discussing some real news. ah, ah okay, let's go back to jim in moscow here. when we went to a quick break here, you want to finish up your point. go ahead. so some of the 1st wave off or so it was, was in the early ninety's, the by the 1994. the situation stabilized, you know, the tools was find in the car box, georgia for some time, stop their attacks against pardons and seconds. and then they restarted in 2008
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when saga really tried to retake. so why did you do that? why did the 2nd way we'll see more more stuff in the pharmacy region because georgia and ukraine were promised to membership in bucharest. so the nationalists decide up here it goes there. but unity again, you know, we had the opportunity in the early 90 s late eighty's for the 17 integrating. we used it, but most of the food stamps now comes the 2nd. and we've had the conflicts in car, a bar. and we have the civil war in ukraine, basically. you know, the reason was the nato expansion, you know, because need to expansion gave an impression of creating a new political reality. and given in you up and you need to enter this in the form . so again, it's create a, creating
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a choice of either or and when you have a good part of ukraine, historically, traditionally called read look towards russian errors the same. but they have to make this past with the devil, george. ok. and it is the, you know, what the, the title is, is program is ideological stability because it's ideology. all it does is great instability. yes, yes, that's it. and of course it was always the goal to scoop up. all of these are all of the countries that had been aligned with the soviet union. the was back and those weren't align, such as you saw, scoop them all up with a native and group of all of the republics of the former soviet union, also within native that was always the goal. and so, but they use this ology of freedom and democracy to present it as if somehow these countries, you know, they want to be free, russian influence, you know,
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there are to, you know, they're, they're fighting for freedom. and here we are, you know, the west coming to their assistance. but in reality, as the point though, you know, these are countries who have distinct history, distinct, the national interest of cultural relationships with russia. they don't have any interest in being scooped up within which a problem. anything else is leading them into perilous conflict in georgia and the same? what does it prove to be in ukraine? i mean, it's never been thoughtfully explained. has been you, you can want to have more transparent senior government. you want to have a government that respects rights, basic rights that are expected around the world. but you have, but to have that you have to be anti russian. it never made any sense to me whatsoever. want to change gears a little bit. you know, you said you focused on europe and i think you're absolutely right. but not
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mistaken fema russians. good relations with japan, south korea, philippines, l. street. i mean they, there are no issues there, it's only in europe. ok. but then again, when you shifted to the east, there's a top prosy versus democracy argument called class. i think that doesn't make any sense whatsoever. it's only focused on europe at this point in time. go ahead humor . well, the night the states use the same argument against china. i mean it's, it's terrible. in the last few decades, china has been many in ties with japan. you know, there was a trail april, how may meeting the president. so in japan, south korea and china just recently, things seem to be moving up, you know, looking up and now they're like just a success or chinese. so aggressive in south china, sea or chinese. so aggressive is trying to see. and they even don't look at the
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names that are actually supposed to china, but you're right. you know, i think that the problem with much deeper than just foreign policy, all the systems use certain frame. yes. so the weaknesses or the nation that the control, the not is used germans pension for collectivism and for collective sacrifice. sometimes in the same way, you know, the american authorities are using these st demand in america. america is a nation of immigrants, and people in america, melville describe the play well and he was more common. liberate the world, troy the tyrants, you know, destroy this payable way, which is a symbol of evil, right? so the authority in the united states are using it very clearly, and it's very interesting. get into your article, george, be gold. jeff k,
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you know, kennedy, i'm like, wilson was called on making the wall safe. would you more christian? can you just said make the world say for diversity? that's very, that's a very important distinction. you know? and i think at the moment in the early stages, we were very close doing you agreement between the soviet union and the united states. that would save a lot of lives and effort, you know, georgia can and wrote about it by the field because again, it was killed and you know, the people came to power. but in general, i think it should be the flow and they want to avoid another world war. we need to make the world safe for them and diversity georgia, that important thing is that for a stable, international order, all of the major stakeholders have to see the international order. it is being legitimate. but the ideology coming out of on steroids now from the,
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by the ministration, is that, you know, if you do not participate in act in the international system as we deem then you weren't illegitimate after. and if you deem a major power like russia and china is not being legitimate, then the order itself cannot be legitimate because you're denying them being stakeholders. yes, and that's why the russians repeatedly emphasize the united nations charter and the united nations as a whole, as the very basis of the international system. and the reason they do is that we created this some of the security council in which the great powers given a veto. in other words, we have a mechanism in place in which way where we get into issues in which great power interests are on the line, the great right to veto. and that created these, the stability that was absent in the league of nations because it was, you know,
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you could say ok, you know, no one can do anything that will threaten the interests of soviet union rather than the one. anything that was threatening the interest of china and so on. so that was the, that was why the united nations has worked where the league of nations failed. because the great, there's nothing in it for me. i mean, i don't, i don't know and that's why what the west is talking about the rules based all the is simply on the arbitrary rules that the nato power just cobbled together at any particular moment to justify what they do. and to demonize the di, legitimize what great power like china and russia, we don't get to find the deal, is we use that the rule, and we are held to be a violation of the interesting georgia is that, remember samantha power,
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she lamented. russia's use of the veto, and it's really quite incredible i would say to samantha power, it shows the system works cuz that's how it was supposed to work with. that was a whole point. that's why they put that in the veto. they don't want to do what they, why, and the league of nations, you know, that failed. so we can't do this again. you know, if you know this, this, this in hiding behind the close of democracy. but, well, let's look at the record yugoslavia. let's look at iraq. let's look at syria afghan and span we go on and on. i mean, it's really quite incredible. there's this idea. logical of ends of his gun are very little against. okay. and in failure every single time. and we have, we have the bi ministration, actually doubling down on it and, and if you just pointed out in the 1st part of the program, no interest section whatsoever. why it didn't work. go ahead. well you're right
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them though locally did fail spectacularly in the, in libya or in again, it's obvious. but it also failed the former soviet union. i mean the idea that america george a demon it's all right. the idea that western interference can help you more chrissy is absolutely counterproductive. glenn decent shows it very well in his article at the opinion website. basically, the majority of the russians on law 40 her last or even phone. or, you know, most kids, the least popular person. they're looking for someone who could replace shackle and preserve with russia. someone like barber ego. but the west, the narrative is out in only 200 k, you know the, that's the problem with, with terry. and i would just, they have only one candidate. they have only bonds,
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wary. and you know, so that out in the cpanel and that's very productive. you know, when does economy start was working badly when you have a role in the money and outside interference is in lockets relations. and that's exactly what happens in bell or was in your brain because western influences. that's what happened in russia regarding, you know, what have don't from the political scene back in the early 9, just if there was real competition, you know, not impeded by west on the financial injections on because the west has been helping lindsay and there, he stays, there because he is the control family is my clothes, right? so, and talking about relations between conscious you said europe and asia, well basically similar processes in the europe. you know, there were 2 attitudes, one, you know, be strong against russia. the other one represented by the brand and the others,
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negotiate with russia and the brands. strategy worked in asia again, there were 2 approaches. mom, the japanese one is like stand for, you know, until you see the islands, no peace treaty. and then there was the chinese or did you negotiate? be cramped, you know, cooperate, and the chinese ovarian worked. while the japanese, you know, they just, they want, they are 60 years or 7080 years later, they just stay wherever they are. so these edge, it also doesn't work with russia and this can last word here. i mean as far as the west fixation on there was once they pick their candidate, that's what they called diversity. ok, i'm going to have to in my, one of my guests in budapest and here in moscow and i think be worth watching as he entered our phoenix. remember, ross? ah ah, ah,
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ah, is your media a reflection of reality? the world transformed what will make you feel safer? type relation for community. you're going the right way. where are you being somewhere? which direction? what is truth? what is great? in the world to corrupted, you need to this end. the join us in the depths, the will remain in the shallows. ah oh right now. there are 2000000000 people who are overweight or
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obese. if possible, to sell food that is fatty and sugary and faulty and addicted. not at the individual level. it's not individual willpower. and if we go on believing that never change that to be upcoming, that industry has been influencing very deeply. the medical and scientific establishment, ah, what's driving the reason for them it, it's corporate, me. ah, the 19 with 2 tunes and monetary paul who's was curious, we are running around the world. many can do all the risk virus bill need to be you have to balance personal choice.


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