 is the bottom line for AA which worked. I was cynical about the religious side and it did not change me too much. We did some podcasts about experiences in AA with Jon who got more involved with AA than me and we talk about things such as this and the steps and look at good and bad sides
well i tried going back to my old church recently and I stopped everything.they were very nice kind at first then they just started sounding like AA.and began controlling.i left that church when i was young.sank into addiction then went to AA.i had vowed never to try religion again but that’s all I seem to try.aa seemed very much religious to me as did NA.im all through with trying.i find that if i get drunk i hate myself.so im going to try not to get drunk.AA made me hate myself pre AA i didn’t hate my fortnightly day out in the pub.pre aa i didn’t hate myself for having a drink.what i am doing now instead is doing things that help me to stop thinking and feeling like a bad perosn for having a drink.
well so far so good.I have drunk again since the last post I had one cap full of whiskey in hot water with honey and lemon.this was the sure for flue my parents used for me when I was an infant and child.i had this hot toddy 3 times over 2 days and I had the flue and now the flue is gone. and the rest of the whiskey is still in the bottle.since i left NA in October I had one scare with the drink that was after a visit from an old timer in aa.i seemed to get drunk for a few days after that visit, the church helped stop me but didn’t keep going there.church and aa and na are all too religious for me.im convinced im not an alcoholic.as for addict yes cannabis gets out of control for me when i use it.however pre AA/NA years ago i stopped using cannabis for 7-8 yr without any anon fellowship or steps.i have stopped using it again all by myself.i think my using drinking got worse because of AA/NA and that i am triggered to use drink when im around them.i was told by an AA old-timer that everyone in AA hated me.i find that strange since they preach love.it used to bother me but it no longer bothers me.i barely knew anyone in there i didn’t meet everyone in there.so i find what this old timer told me strange.as it is i have no hate left in me towards them or their church i did at one time long ago..i used to like some of them love one or 2 of them and indifferent to the rest. and at times hated it all. now i dont have no thots or feelings to any of them or their church.i got to know in there but i dont hate,…my haters in or out of there i have found,are just people who want to be me and are jealous of me.because i can do what they wish they could do.i can control drink and stop cannabis without them. i am stronger than them.and today i have people in my life outside of the church of AA /NA who like me as i am.They dont see me the same way the people in AA/NA see me for one thing they dont care that i dont have a car or drive.and they dont see me as a people pleaser if i do something to help them or give them something material pre AA people told me i had a heart of gold and that i was a kind person.well off to my allotment garden meeting some of the people there as we all help one another out there with our gardens.planning to travel this year see some of the world and enjoy the sunshine.
I like z-truths post.i also before leaving would like to comment on the exploitation of vulnerable people.during 20yr in and out of AA/NA, I found most of those with some clean time more clean time than myself were takers.for example.on going back to NA one time I was in poverty I said I didn’t have money for bus and pot.and would sell my guitar to pay my way.one old timer 12 yr grabbed that chance and gave me 20 quid for my guitar that was near new and cost 200 quid.that’s one small example of many. one sponsor I had cost me around 700 quid in the time I knew her.she used manipulation and guilt trips on me to get that when i was new clean and in grief struck over a death of a loved one. And believed i had to do IT or die.I have heard much worse stories from some who left.I used to ponder on what step nazis ment.I no longer wonder I now know.I wouldn’t compare AA/NA to the holocaust.however many people not only nazis exploited jews and other people polish the gipsies the mentally ill.dureing the war.they took all they could from them under the threat of death.in the polish ghettos, the starving inside were took for all they had by those outside the ghetto.and those outside the ghetto were not to be seen near those inside or they were told if they were seen to be helping those inside they would die too.so the ignored the starving inside.expect when they would go near them to take from them.jews and others were told do as we say or die.they bargained for there lives with what material things they had.then after the Nazis and others took all they had they laughed as they watched them die.AA/NA, of course, is not on that scale of horror but i now understand why some people call them step natzies.And some of them do it abruptly say do it or die and get the book out and hammer folk to do it and some do it more slyly and kinder softer but in the end, they are all doing this to people telling them to do it or die its the only way.a lot of sponsors use this position of power to abuse or use those with less sober time for money or for help such as cleaning their homes for them digging their gardens and for sex.later if the person complains they will be told you did it or you’re a people pleaser.AA/NA will always blame the person who complains or stands up for themselves or is critical.they also blame you for all bad things that happened in your life to you.such as domestic violence or rape.it keeps some of the real alcoholics and addict clean most relapse.and those that have kept clean might relapse one day.or perhaps they already have since i found many to be using while in there but pretending they hadn’t used.
today I help people and give people I know things, not because I am told to or a book tells me to not because I have been guilt-tripped or manipulated to or told do as we say or die. but because I want to.pre AA no one had to teach me how to be giving or helpful that’s something I have always been.in AA/NA I was told I had been a black-hearted selfish taker all my life WRONG! then told by them to give be kind do helpful things…then told when i did i was a people pleaser who had to stop people pleasing.today I have gone back to who i was pre AA I give and help when I want to,to who I want to and consider myself a decent person.and i give and help those who do the same for me I live in a give and take world not give all you got to us do for us like it was in AA.
one more comment… this running around being of service to alcoholics addicts and giving didn’t go away overnight.after i left NA i bumped into a woman who had also left NA an alcoholic.i started trying to be of service to her and her useing addict friends doing for them supporting them giveing to them..they gave nothing in return.this woman was at first put on to me when i was in na and clean by my then sponsorwho told me i was to be friend her at the time she had actually left NA after a few meetings.she and her friends got a bit out of me but nothing i will lose sleep over.before i saw her make hand singles to her male useing addict friends and things said by one of them made me realise she was takeing the piss out of me.i have managed to get them out of my life.all on my own.AA/NA caused this.i keep away from alcoholics now both those in and out of AA and addicts.i thought i had to help these class A drug users and the alcoholic even after i left NA.it takes a while to adjust.
pre AA i did things of help at times for people some were addicts and alcoholics i also did vol work pre AA.. in AA i did things help for new commers and old timers.now i would only help people who help me..give and take..i would also help and give to some who are not alocholics or addicts like yesterday when i helped an old lady with her heavy shopping bags to get on the bus.alcoholics and addicts in or out of AA /NA i keep away from i wish them no harm but dont want to mix with them because pre AA dureing AA and after leaveing i have found them to be piss takers users and abusers and if AA and NA can help those types change then good because they need to.i have been down my allotment garden and peiople there helped me put my polly tunnel up i thanked them other days i help them.AA taught me nothing as for defects i