While the Indonesian band Kekal has been labeled as unblack metal, the band has distanced itself from the movement. When asked if he was bothered by the fact that the first black metal bands were against Christianity, front-man Jeff Arwadi replied: "I think you're wrong if first black metal bands were highly against Christianity. [… I dig the very first black metal bands a lot... those 80s bands like Venom, Bathory, Hellhammer/Celtic Frost, early Sodom, etc. […] By my knowledge, none of those bands were against Christianity. They only had those kind of 'satanic' image which is more like some high-school Halloween movies or parent-shocker rather than Satanism as a philosophy or ideology". Earlier in the interview he even went as far as to say that "even bands like Celtic Frost were once considered 'white-metal' from some 'true' black metal fans because the band thanked God on album thanks list, and one member wearing a cross necklace instead of inverted cross. It's a totally relative issue, depending on how 'extreme' you would go, right?" Whereas Arwadi claimed that to his knowledge, "none of those bands were against Christianity", Bathory founder Quorthon rejected Christianity in numerous interviews.