Some time later Ivanov visits Rubashov in his cell. He tells Rubashov that every aspect of Bogrov’s execution had been orchestrated by Gletkin to weaken Rubashov’s resolve, but that he (Ivanov) knows it will have the opposite effect. Ivanov tells Rubashov that he knows Rubashov will only confess if he resists his growing urge to sentimentality and instead remains rational, “or when you have thought the whole thing to a conclusion – then, and only then, will you capitulate”. The two men have a discussion about politics and ethics. Afterwards Ivanov visits Gletkin in his office and insultingly tells him he was able to undo the damage that Gletkin’s scheme would have done.