Johanan ben Saul asked why required that they should bring a calf (, "eglah") into a ravine. Johanan ben Saul explained that God provided that something that had not borne fruit would have its neck broken in a place that was not fertile to atone for one who would no longer be able to produce fruit. The "Gemara" asked then what the word "fruit" meant in the context of the murder victim, for if one interpreted it to mean "children," then according to that argument, the ceremony would not apply if the murder victim had been old or castrated. Therefore, the "Gemara" concluded, one must understand "fruit" to mean the performance of commandments (that the murdered person would no longer be able to fulfill).