These are great pants! i sized up from my typical size 28 because i found the rise to be a little low for me. i tend to like my pants a little higher on my waist. the sa said these ran a little smaller for most. when i got home, i put them up to my size 28's and they were the same. (what woman likes to go up a size?) i purchased the black;great for work and play. i would like the holly too but i am waiting.