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[Assistant] Doctors were called in. Great men who rolled up to my door in easy carriages with fine horses and gaudy servants. They were at her bedside for weeks.


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[Assistant] They had a great meeting and consulted together in low and solemn voices in another room. One, the cleverest and most celebrated among them, took me aside and bidding me prepare for the worst, told me, me, the madman, that my wife was mad.


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[Assistant] A few days after, they told me I must place her under some restraint. I must provide a keeper for her. Aye!


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[Assistant] I went into the open fields where none could hear me and laughed till the air resounded with my shouts. She died next day. The white headed old man followed her to the grave.


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[Assistant] And the proud brothers dropped a tear over the insensible corpse of her whose sufferings they had regarded in her lifetime with muscles of iron.


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[Assistant] All this was food for my secret mirth, and I laughed behind the white handkerchief which I held up to my face as we rode home till the tears came into my eyes. But though I had carried my object and killed her,


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[Assistant] For now I mix up realities with my dreams and having so much to do and being always hurried here have no time to separate the two from some strange confusion in which they get involved, I remember how I let it out at last.


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[Assistant] Only there are long galleries here with many doors. I don't think I could find my way along them. And even if I could, I know there are iron gates below which they keep locked and barred. They know what a clever madman I have been and they're proud to have me here to show. Let me see. Yes, I have been out.


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[Assistant] For I knew what he little thought, and I gloried in the knowledge.


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[Assistant] That the light of madness gleamed from them like fire. We sat in silence for a few minutes. He spoke at last.


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[Assistant] Coupling together many circumstances which had at first escaped his observation, he thought I had not treated her well. He wished to know whether he was right in inferring that I meant to cast an approach upon her memory and a disrespect upon her family.


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[Assistant] It was due to the uniform he wore to demand this explanation. This man had a commission in the army


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[Assistant] I saw the sudden change that came upon him beneath my gaze. He was a bold man, but the colour faded from his face.


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[Assistant] I turned aside with one blow the chair he hurled at me in his terror and closed with him. And with a heavy crash we rolled upon the floor together. It was a fine struggle that.


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[Assistant] And the moon steals in, in rays which only serve to show the dark corners about me.


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[Assistant] And that silent figure in its old corner, when I lie awake,


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[Assistant] I can sometimes hear strange shrieks and cries from distant parts of this large place. What they are I know not


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[Assistant] Listening to the music of my iron chain.


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[Assistant] At the end of the manuscript was written, in another hand, this note. The unhappy man whose ravings are recorded above.


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[Assistant] The thoughtless riot, dissipation and debauchery of his younger days produced fever and delirium. The first effects of the latter was the strange delusion


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[Assistant] founded upon a well-known medical theory, strongly contended for by some and as strongly contested by others,


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[Assistant] That an hereditary madness existed in his family. This produced a settled gloom, which in time developed a morbid insanity, and finally terminated in raving madness.


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[Assistant] It is only matter of wonder to those who were acquainted with the vices of his early career that his passions, when no longer controlled by reason,


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[Assistant] Mr. Pickwick's candle was just expiring in the socket as he concluded the perusal of the old clergyman's manuscript.


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[Assistant] And when the light went suddenly out, without any previous flicker by way of warning, it communicated a very considerable start to his excited frame. Hastily throwing off such articles of clothing as he had put on when he rose from his uneasy bed,


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[Assistant] And casting a fearful glance around, he once more scrambled hastily between the sheets and soon fell fast asleep.


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[Assistant] The sun was shining brilliantly into his chamber when he awoke and the morning was far advanced.


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[Assistant] And being fortunate enough to secure places on the outside of a coach, arrived in London in sound health and spirits on that same afternoon.


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[Assistant] As any reference to that most important undertaking demands a separate chapter, we may devote the few lines which remain at the close of this


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[Assistant] That none of the 17 could make anything of it, but that all the 17 agreed it was very extraordinary.


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[Assistant] Mr. Blotten, indeed, and the name will be doomed to the undying contempt of those who cultivate the mysterious and the sublime. Mr. Blotten, we say, with the doubt and caveling peculiar to vulgar minds,


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[Assistant] Presumed to state a view of the case as degrading is ridiculous.


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[Assistant] But solemnly denied the antiquity of the inscription inasmuch as he represented it to have been rudely carved by himself in an idle mood and to display letters intended to bear neither more nor less than the simple construction of Bill Stump's His Mark.


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[Assistant] And that Mr Stamps, being little in the habit of original composition, and more accustomed to be guided by the sound of words than by the strict rules of orthography, had omitted the concluding L of his Christian name. The Pickwick Club?


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[Assistant] As might have been expected from so enlightened an institution, received this statement with the contempt it deserved.


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[Assistant] Expelled the presumptuous and ill-conditioned Blotton and voted Mr. Pickwick a pair of gold spectacles in token of their confidence and approbation. In return for which,


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[Assistant] Mr. Pickwick caused a portrait of himself to be painted and hung up in the club room. Mr. Blotten


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[Assistant] And thus commenced that celebrated scientific discussion so well known to all men as the Pickwick controversy.


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[Assistant] But this base attempt to injure Mr. Pickwick recoiled above the head of its columnius author.


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[Assistant] The 17 learned societies unanimously voted the presumptuous Blotton an ignorant meddler.


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[Assistant] And to this day, the stone remains an illegible monument of Mr. Pickwick's greatness and a lasting trophy to the littleness of his enemies.


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[Assistant] That evening, when Matthew came into the kitchen, he saw that his sister was crying. What's the matter? He asked surprised. You haven't cried since... Well, I can't remember when.


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[Assistant] I'll miss her when she goes away. When she goes to Queens, you mean? Yes, but she can come home at weekends on the train.


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[Assistant] The Avonlea boys and girls had to go to Charlottetown to take their examinations. Oh, I do hope that I've done well.


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[Assistant] Until Diana, when she arrived back at Green Gables.


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[Assistant] The examinations were very difficult.


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[Assistant] And I've got to wait for three weeks before I know. Three weeks! I'll die! Anne wanted to do better than Gilbert. But she also wanted to do well for Matthew and Marilla. That was very important to her.


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[Assistant] Diana was the first to hear the news. She ran into the kitchen at Green Gables and shouted, Look, Anne! It's in Father's newspaper! You're first! With Gilbert!


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[Assistant] Out of all the students on the island. Oh, how wonderful.


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[Assistant] Anne took the paper with shaking hands.


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[Assistant] And saw her name at the top of the list of 200. She could not speak. Well now, I knew it, said Matthew with a warm smile. You've done well, I must say, Anne, said Marilla, who was secretly very pleased. For the next three weeks, Anne and Marilla were very busy.


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[Assistant] Anne needed new dresses to take to Charlottetown.


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[Assistant] She put on one of her new dresses to show Matthew. Marilla watched the happy young face.


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[Assistant] She remembered the strange, thin little child with her sad eyes who arrived at Green Gables five years ago, and she started crying quietly. Marilla, why are you crying? asked Anne.


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[Assistant] Milton Friedman for example acts as both an economist and a columnist.


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[Assistant] His theories have a tremendous influence on ordinary US citizens, as well as on the shaping of US government policy.


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[Assistant] Friedman and others like him have made such laudable accomplishments fundamentally.


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[Assistant] Because of the attitude they adopt towards academic learning,


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[Assistant] In no way they believe. Can scholars' work be separated from reality?


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[Assistant] Indifference towards real-life problems means the loss of scholarly conscience.


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[Assistant] A frustration to public expectation and an ill spending of taxpayers' hard-earned money.


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[Assistant] Two may take contact with reality and stay competitive academically.


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[Assistant] Whoever can keep abreast of the latest development in a given field or actually initiate such results is the best professor on campus. In a country like the US, if one lacks the right attitude, he or she will hardly have a future.


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[Assistant] Likewise, textbooks are revised or totally changed on a regular basis.


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[Assistant] As stipulated by the US Department of Education, a textbook must be reprinted at least once per three years.


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[Assistant] In US universities, one semester typically lasts three months.


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[Assistant] Any teaching materials issued at the beginning of a previous term might become outdated during this one.


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[Assistant] Pick up whichever textbook you please, and you will find no old wine in the new bottle.


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[Assistant] Instead, you will come across up-to-date fieldwork results and groundbreaking theories there.


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[Assistant] Professors seldom repeat what the book already says.


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[Assistant] They usually only deliver what is not covered in the book.


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[Assistant] Explain really difficult points and present the outcomes of recent exploration.


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[Assistant] This stands in sharp contrast to the situation in Chinese universities.


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[Assistant] Where textbooks can remain unchanged for a dozen years, and teachers give lectures from decades old notes. In the latter case,


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[Assistant] Classroom instruction has become a matter of sheer mechanical operation.


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[Assistant] Everybody knows what it means to vanquish the old and reach out for the new. If you want to scale new heights you must first attack your old self. The earlier and harder you do so, the better.


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[Assistant] After all, receiving vicious blows from oneself is more endurable than being cuddled by other people or by the ruthless reality of life.


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[Assistant] Long cherished desire for me to have you and finally it's worked out. I remember among our first discussions,


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[Assistant] We had in Mirarod temple, you told me how you were introduced to Krishna Consciousness and your journey. It is quite inspiring and since then I have been observing how under your stewardship the Mirarod temple has


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[Assistant] We have progressed in almost, you could say, all dimensions of Krishna Consciousness. We have had many, many wonderful temples growing, but along with the temple, you had vigorous youth activities, you had vigorous children's activities. I think in children's activities, education, dimension for children, the temple is a pioneer. And of course, personally, I've seen how deeply absorbed you are in Shastra, and I always appreciate your


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[Assistant] Insightful and candid explanation of scriptures. So and, uh, Bhakti Shastri, Bhakti Vaibhav, even the Chandarvas, which you are teaching. So it's, you have, the Prabhupada said that we need Brahmanas with a Kshatriya spirit.


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[Assistant] So we did, we teachers as well as managers. So in many ways, I've seen that you have been able to embody that blend in a very effective way. So thank you very much for joining today. And I thought that


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[Assistant] We could discuss broadly on the topic of how our movement has evolved.


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[Assistant] Over the last 4-5 decades, since Prabhupada started it, established in India, and especially in the 2-3 decades that we have been actively involved in the movement.


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[Assistant] So maybe you could start with briefly your story and how you came to the services that you are doing currently. That will give some personal context to the discussion.


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[Assistant] What you said is actually echoes my thoughts and experiences. Not in that sense that I am doing a lot of intellectual service, but it is true that, uh,


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[Assistant] The intellect, those who are intellectually oriented often they don't get much nourishment and then they go away as you rightly said.


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[Assistant] Uh, has caught attention among people because it is not scripted.


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[Assistant] And, uh, one of the, in those who do podcasts expertly, one of them say that, even in secular world, they say that nobody can actually wear a mask for a two hour discussion. Five minutes, ten minutes, fifteen minutes, you can put on a mask.


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[Assistant] So in that sense, uh, the philosophical and the human.


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[Assistant] Both come out in these podcasts and basically I started this when the pandemic started.


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[Assistant] Appreciation, and a very, I would say precise appreciation.


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[Assistant] Not that I am doing it, but there is a need and I can play some small part in it. Please continue, your answer.


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[Assistant] We are talking about the concept of destiny and how that struck you so powerfully. And that is a radical concept. It almost goes completely against the ethos of the world.


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[Assistant] So, so you were in your first second year, how many years were you in college before you decided to join?


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[Assistant] Okay, so this was you said 90s roughly, sorry I missed the date.


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[Assistant] Okay, and then when did you come to, when and how did you come to Meera Road and become the leader here?


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[Assistant] So basically we can say that we have seen our movement evolve quite a bit.


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[Assistant] Of course we can say that the evolution has started a little earlier than what we joined.


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[Assistant] But I see, recently I was talking to one devotee, he used an interesting phrasing. He said, we have ISKCON 1.0, ISKCON 2.0 and ISKCON 3.0.


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[Assistant] So 1.0 is during Prabhupada's times.


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[Assistant] And Prabhupada was leading directly. Then, and then after Prabhupada departed and when Prabhupada's disciples were the prominent members and the prominent leaders of the movement, that's his con 2.0.


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[Assistant] And now we are moving from 2.0 gradually toward 3.0 where more and more


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[Assistant] You know, Prabhupada's disciples are retiring or leaving the world.


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[Assistant] And more and more responsibly for leadership is...


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[Assistant] Falling on the Prabhupada Grand Disciples. Somewhere in between. But apart from that generational change,


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[Assistant] There has also been, uh, demographic change.


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[Assistant] In the sense that during Prabhupada's times, at least in the West,


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[Assistant] Almost every member of our movement meant that they were full-time members. Even in their grahastha, they were living in the temples.


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[Assistant] And in India, if you consider there were


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[Assistant] Two broad categories of members. There were the Western devotees. Most of the dedicated followers of Prabhupada during Prabhupada's time were Western devotees.


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[Assistant] And they were just, they were full-time members and they were life members who were


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[Assistant] Who were in their own way culturally appreciative and dedicated to service, but they were not dedicated sadhakas in the way is expected in this con. Or what we, so in one sense we can say these two levels were there.


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[Assistant] The full-time devotees and the life members.


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[Assistant] But over the years what has happened is that the life members, they are still there, they are cultivating but they are not a very prominent


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[Assistant] Which has become the most prominent part of the movement now. In the west at least more than 95% of the devotees are congregations. Less than maybe 3-4% are brahmacharis.


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[Assistant] And ISKCON in India, it might be a little more, maybe 5-10%, but 90% is the congregation.


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[Assistant] They are going to have their families, their careers and still be dedicated devotees.


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[Assistant] Significant change, in one sense we can say we are in uncharted territory.


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[Assistant] Because during Prabhupada's times, the life member cultivation was basically just, uh, give them some, have some talks with them, go to their house, have some prasad, maybe give them books and get the contribution from them.


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[Assistant] And full-time devotees was a complete dedicated sadhana. But how to cultivate congregation


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[Assistant] So how do, so I presume you must also experience this.


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[Assistant] Transition and since you have been leading a community, so maybe you can share your thoughts about


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[Assistant] How this transition, you have observed it and what does it imply?


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[Assistant] Sorry to interrupt you. Ravindra Saroop Prabhu makes a very nice point. He says how the whole concept of congregation development and congregation cultivation developed, uh, originated. So he says that


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[Assistant] Sometimes devotees would preach quite forcefully, you know, this material world is a place of distress and you just give it up and join the temple.


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[Assistant] And Indians who had gone from India to America, they had basically gone for better prospects materially. They had absolutely, very few of them had the intention of renouncing their world and family.


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[Assistant] If some person, if some of their relatives, if some person on the street had asked them, do you, which group do you belong to?


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[Assistant] Are you connected with any religious groups? They said we are Hare Krishnas, we are Iskcon devotees. But he said if somebody had asked us, we would have said they are not Iskcon devotees.


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[Assistant] So, basically, I had a podcast with Madhavan and Prabhu from Krishnakathamrat Bindu. So, on this topic of who is a member of ISKCON. So, it is almost like a extendable term. We can't reduce it to one category. So, what you are saying that just because somebody is


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[Assistant] Actually, if I may interrupt you, just share a few thoughts about what you said about these four stages.


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[Assistant] I had not thought about it in these terms, but what had struck me is that, like you mentioned about teaching, like you not going out.


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[Assistant] You don't have to go out directly. So it struck me that I have seen some devotees with all due respect to them. They say that if you are not going out in the streets, what preaching are you doing?


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[Assistant] Well, it is what we are meant to do, but ultimately, okay, after we go out and do Sankirtan,


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[Assistant] So the temple has to be maintained and then as you said that the teaching education has to be done. So.


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[Assistant] It, we could, we could get caught completely in one of these slots. It's not that Sankirtan is not important. All of them are, we could say, are important in their own place. But if we reduce our movement to only one, then it could become a problem.


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[Assistant] I had a talk with Vaisheshika Prabhu, very good podcast. So he is, he is so focused on book distribution.


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[Assistant] And he is inspiring the world all over devotees for book distribution. But at the same time, he has a very systematic plan for cultivating devotees. And in America, one of the most, I would say, flourishing communities is the Silicon Valley community.


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[Assistant] So we could say that each of these stages has its importance, but we can't fix it only on one stage. Like say if we focus only on temple construction.


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[Assistant] And then we neglect Harinam, we neglect cultivating devotees, then it could be a problem.


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[Assistant] In many ways, as we are becoming a congregation based movement, we have gone through the first three stages.


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[Assistant] But we could say that more or less there is already something of a system in place to take care of them.


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[Assistant] Because at that place, where people are so busy rushing around to get so many people to come, but the point is well taken that


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[Assistant] You could do book distribution not just by talking one to one people but by giving a talk which inspires people. Amazing.


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[Assistant] So now you give the example of 100 rupee includes others. So what you are saying is, if we engage devotees according to their nature,


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[Assistant] Then, then all the other things will also happen. Those who are inspired will do Harinam. Those who are that inclination, that Swabhava.


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[Assistant] So you were mentioning earlier that the idea of an ashram is misunderstood. I interrupted you at that time. You would like to elaborate that?


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[Assistant] Yeah, you know what happens is, sorry again to echo your thoughts or reiterate, there are, there are like, one of the challenges in communication is that,


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[Assistant] Uh, terms don't always have objective meanings.


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[Assistant] That there is a particular term, when I am using it, I have a particular meaning in mind. And when somebody else hears it or uses it, they have another meaning in mind.


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[Assistant] So, if we look at it from the perspective of, uh,


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[Assistant] The Bhagavad Gita, it's quite clear that Varanashram means engagement, as you said, uh, according to Swabhava. And Krishna says, you cannot give up your Swabhava. In fact, there are only two verses in the Gita which Krishna repeats twice. One is Man-Manabhava, and the other is Shrayaan Swadharmo Viguna. That you just cannot work, cannot not work according to your nature.


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[Assistant] So, this brings us to, again to elaborate on an earlier point, you made that. In the past,


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[Assistant] That in the past, we thought that surrender means that rejecting our nature.


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[Assistant] That our nature is just the body. You are not the body, so you are not your body's nature also. And you should just do what you are told to do. But that is extremely difficult. And then what happens is, because of that,


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[Assistant] Many times there is, uh, there is some, there is a higher taste which comes by the practice of bhakti.


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[Assistant] So which is, uh, we could say higher spiritual taste, higher bhakti taste we can say, but


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[Assistant] And so if somebody is a painter, they really get immense joy in painting.


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[Assistant] And what happens is, for us to stay on the path of virtue,


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[Assistant] We also need this taste because that higher bhakti taste takes a good amount of time to come. We will need a significant amount of purification.


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[Assistant] So to sustain us on that journey, this higher Dharmic taste is also required. And we can say if we are deprived of that taste,


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[Assistant] Sometimes that leads to so much dissatisfaction, so much distress that we can't even perceive the higher bhakti taste.


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[Assistant] That because we are still, theoretically I am not the body, I am the soul. But even Krishna, I am perceiving through my body-mind machine only.


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[Assistant] So if my body-mind machine is totally disharmonious, then it will be very difficult to pursue Krishna also.


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[Assistant] So, so that definition of surrender, that reject your nature, that is the evidence of your surrender.


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[Assistant] That has alienated, I feel, lot of devotees and it has made bhakti more difficult than it needs to be.


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[Assistant] Generally we think of Mayavad as considering the spiritual reality to be like a amorphous oneness.


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[Assistant] But we can say that even at the material reality, if we equate it as a oneness,


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[Assistant] We sometimes say that that person is just not sincere enough, not serious enough, just fell into Maya. But to some extent it is also.


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[Assistant] To some extent, do you see this already happening?


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[Assistant] In terms of, uh, in our movement of how we engage devotees, I can say that myself as a Brahmachari,


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[Assistant] You know, uh, over the years, I, by Krishna's mercy, have found space.


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[Assistant] I can say that 20 years ago, if I had tried to do a podcast like this, he says, what are you doing? Wasting your time and wasting somebody else's time. Just go and do something tangible.


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[Assistant] You know, go and distribute some books or as you said, collect some, uh, collect some Lakshmi for Krishna.


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[Assistant] So in one sense that providing devotees space for their service, it has started happening to some extent. But what are your thoughts about this?


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[Assistant] That if we don't do this, we will actually lie, drive devotees away. So it is, so now, uh, two things come in mind that, uh, how do we help people understand their nature? And to some extent,


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[Assistant] I have encountered devotees, uh, who were, who had kids who, I mean devotees who had children who grew up in Gurukuls and they were told


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[Assistant] I know two devotees, they were told that you are a Brahmana, and all day they were meant to memorize verses.


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[Assistant] And these kids said that this was like the most miserable time of our life.


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[Assistant] And this is the, we basically, I can say that I have Vaishya mentality.


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[Assistant] I like to do things and I like to earn and I like to share.


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[Assistant] So, there is this possibility of misdiagnosing also. So,


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[Assistant] Maybe it is not today as important to like class, classify people into these four categories as to basically find how best they can serve.


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[Assistant] So the principle is not just the categorization, but the compatible engagement.


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[Assistant] And within the, within the ambit of services that are there in the movement, within their interests, where we can find, where we can find an engagement for them, that would be a contemporary application of Varanashram. Does that make sense to you?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, there are so many points you have made. I feel this, this itself could be entirely different podcast on its own about how to determine, how to determine Varna in today's world.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And maybe we can have a podcast on that in future, but right now just this point that often when the varanas are presented as hierarchical


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Then they become, uhm, are presented only as hierarchical, then they become, on one side there is always a possibility that


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Some people will exploit others, but even if there is no exploitation, there is a visceral negative reaction. Because you know, it seems discriminatory. So, so what you are saying is, from the individual's perspective,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In one sense, it is true that, okay, somebody is more inclined for, when Brahminical person may be more inclined for spiritual knowledge and spirituality. But in terms of the worldly, from the world's perspective, this is more of, uh, more of compatibility than hierarchy. In that sense, you are saying that it does not higher or lower. Am I understanding right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, I appreciate how you, uh, bring, uh, such vivid.


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[Assistant] Contrasts that drive home the point so emphatically.


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[Assistant] So both are thinking of money, but one is doing it according to their varna and one is actually not.


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[Assistant] In one sense, the Brahmana thinking about Dakshina is, uh,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Is actually going according and not so much according to their Swabha and they will be doing a disservice a little bit over there. More than a little bit.


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[Assistant] So, so, so, actually the earlier point also which you mentioned.


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[Assistant] You know, Bhagavatam is quite clear about this, you know, like Varsalai Viparad, Vishatagunaita, Aadarvindanabha. That a Brahmana who is turned away from Krishna cannot deliver himself.


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[Assistant] Whereas even, uh, Swapacha who is devoted to Krishna can deliver the entire dynasty.


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[Assistant] So then the purpose of Arun Ashram, if we think of this, it is not so much to create a hierarchy as to provide engagement to people.


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[Assistant] An implicit sense of hierarchy because Brahmanas are highly respected.


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[Assistant] Kshatriyas, they are highly respected. In fact we also have Kshatriyas. The world will respect somebody who has political power. But those who have political power respect the Brahmanas.


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[Assistant] So doesn't that signify that the brahmana varna is considered higher and other varna are considered lower?


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[Assistant] There are so many points which are coming in and I am wondering which direction to take this now.


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[Assistant] So the thing is that, I also noticed this when I used to go to villages, the culture of respect was there.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now there might be, the hierarchy was, the hierarchy might be there, like the somebody like, even the boss and the servant, but that does not mean the boss would disrespect or exploit the servant.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Is, uh, is meant for discrimination exploitation. That is, that is like, that is the very leftist view of the world. That is left always is against hierarchy.


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[Assistant] And even in the west, there was, there were hierarchies which were exploitative and there were many hierarchies which were not exploitative also. So the idea is that, so this way of looking at the world has become quite mainstream.


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[Assistant] In terms of society, that's why Varanasi should, like I was talking with devotees, some devotees in the West.


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[Assistant] Is that it can be very easily equated with the cost system.


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[Assistant] And in the West, the car system is considered to be such a great social evil.


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[Assistant] If people misunderstand or misrepresent what we are saying and they say that ISKCON wants to establish a caste system all over the world.


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[Assistant] That could devastate our outreach, our reputation, our public perception.


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[Assistant] So but what you are saying is that, uh, that this, the caste system as this, there might have been some, there was some discrimination also, but the purpose of an ashram


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah, this is, generally we don't use the word jati much. Yeaah, we don't use the word jati much in our movement. And that's why we equate varana with jati sometimes.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's, that's so true. So we can say that we as a movement, uh, first of all, for our own devotees, we need to


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[Assistant] Engage them and then we could say this could also apply to the broader community, broader world also.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, in the West, uh, I was one temple, so they use two words. They use the word congregation and the community.


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[Assistant] And uh, the congregation is more or less committed grahastha devotees and community is the broader, broader society who is, uh, who is of interest to us and who has some interest in us. They may, they may be our well-wishers. They're basically favorable.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So do you see this in one sense? I had asked this question already and you said without doing this we cannot, we will not be able to sustain our movement. So there are two things now.


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[Assistant] One is from the institutional leadership perspective that they need to provide devotees the space.


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[Assistant] And that is sometimes difficult because the leaders also have a lot of pressure from their leaders to achieve certain goals, to achieve certain targets.


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[Assistant] The perspective from the leaders.


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[Assistant] So any thoughts on this, that what we, how can we go about or how do we deal with this challenge?


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[Assistant] It's like, if I can't engage you, that doesn't mean that you are devotionally useless.


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[Assistant] My project is not possible for me to engage, but there will be other projects which can be found out and maybe as you said, if there's networking.


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[Assistant] Then you can, uh, then we can ourselves connect somebody with some, connect a devotee with somebody else. I think that also requires, uh, non possessive mentality in one sense.


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[Assistant] Because it is again with the numbers game that, oh you know, I made this person a devotee.


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[Assistant] And then if this person is going away somewhere else, then that person will not come in my track record of how many people I brought to for initiation or I made into devotees or whatever.


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[Assistant] Okay, so that's two. And of course I would say that possessive is not always bad also. It can be, but in one sense the possessive mentality, what might seem as a possessive mentality could also be a protective mentality.


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[Assistant] That maybe, you know, this devotee goes over there who will take care of that devotee or whatever. But if there is good networking, then it is definitely possible.


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[Assistant] So that, so naturally, but it's like, if somebody would have some specific talent, then it's relatively easier. Okay. You know, you have this talent, you, you, you get training from this person and then that, uh, that works out quite well.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So the last part is that we are maturing, not diluting. That's a beautiful point. So engaging people according to nature.


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[Assistant] The important point is not obedience, but the important point is actually helping people grow.


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[Assistant] Sometimes we generally ask this question.


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[Assistant] What brought, how did you come to Krishna Consciousness? But there is another question we rarely ask. What keeps you in Krishna Consciousness?


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[Assistant] Because there are so many reasons why a person may get frustrated, disheartened.


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[Assistant] And even lose faith. Not lose faith in Krishna, but lose faith in other things to connect with Krishna.


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[Assistant] So one of the things that will keep us is if we have this engagement and then the higher taste that comes through engagement.


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[Assistant] Just maybe a couple of questions and then we'll stop. I mean, maybe I can have future podcasts also. Now, I do see to some extent at least, uh,


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[Assistant] You know, Burujan Pro started the MI, VIHE and then MIHE has started and then many other educational forums have started.


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[Assistant] And devotees who want to study and devotees who want to teach.


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[Assistant] From a devotee's perspective, so we talked from, I earlier talked from the leader's perspective, said that leaders need to network better and then responsibly hand over people to one, people whom they can't engage to somebody else. Now from the individual's perspective, how does one decide whether


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Actually this service is not compatible for me.


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[Assistant] Or is it just, uh, because the mind is always restless and the mind will always find some reason to complain.


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[Assistant] Or when is it just due to because of the fickle nature of the mind?


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[Assistant] So when should a, to summarize this, when should a devotee think that, okay, now I have to...


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[Assistant] Actually maybe astrology is something which we can discuss more separately.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] With respect to astrology, I have studied a little bit, I won't say that I have studied in detail. What I find is that there are two extremes with respect to astrology also. One is that the skeptical attitude which rejects it completely.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] As it doesn't, not necessarily as devotees will say that it's superstitious, uh, not people who don't have any faith in Shastra, they may say superstitious.


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[Assistant] But devotees may say that, oh, today astrologers are not good and it doesn't work and things like that. They may be skeptical. But the other extreme is that astrology can sometimes become like a


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[Assistant] So astrology can become another excuse for not taking responsibility for one's life.


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[Assistant] Ultimately, we cannot, if I understand what you are saying rightly also, that astrology is an important resource for us to take responsible decisions.


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[Assistant] We cannot, we cannot make the astrologer like another, another version of our Diksha Guru. That your word is the absolute authority and I'll follow it. So the astrology also.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Beautiful. So what has happened is if I understand, uh, when you're speaking this, it struck me when you're talking about your childhood or your growing experiences.


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[Assistant] Maybe we could explore that also in the future a little bit more. But it seems that when the elements of traditional culture are taken in isolation,


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[Assistant] So whether it is, like, we look at Varanashram and we take the isolation and equate it to the caste system.


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[Assistant] In one sense, interact with those who have lived it or those who are living it to understand how this is to be applied.


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[Assistant] So, ehm, one last question and maybe we can conclude.


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[Assistant] Unless you, do you have some more points to speak about what, whatever we have discussed if something is not addressed? Okay.


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[Assistant] We have, we are talking from the temple leader's perspective and the individual's perspective. And so with respect to the individual's perspective,


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[Assistant] We have to grow, if I understood rightly that, we have to, we have to grow spiritually and that means eventually,


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[Assistant] From our perspective, what exactly is the cause of my restlessness?


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[Assistant] So, there also to some extent, even Prabhupada in Nectar of Instruction introduction says that once you come to the mode of goodness, then how to advance further will be revealed. So to some extent even the sadhaka,


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[Assistant] What, what my nature is and what is just fickling change, fickle change, fleeting changes of the mind.


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[Assistant] So any, any point, point is about, about this, about how the sadhkas can maybe come to sattva or better recognise their nature.


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[Assistant] So again, we are to some extent in uncharted territory and we can't have packed answers for this.


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[Assistant] So, I think this acknowledgement of complexity is in one sense a sign of humility.


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[Assistant] We, we try to advance very, very simplistic answers to complex issues.


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[Assistant] And then anybody who doesn't accept the simplistic answers, we say that you are not faithful. Just have faith. So the world is a complex place and we have to


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[Assistant] You have to consider it. It's not that we have immediate solutions. Even Prabhupada, I read a letter recently. Prabhupada wrote to Simti Moraraji. I am experimenting in various ways how to attract these western people to Krishna. So Prabhupada's purpose of getting people to Krishna was fixed.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Generally toward the end of the podcast, I tried to summarize. We discussed a lot of things. I'm not sure how much I can summarize, but I'll try to do that in a few minutes. And then if there are some things which you would like to add as concluding words, we can do that.


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[Assistant] So broadly we discussed today about the needs, addressing the evolving needs of a devotee community.


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[Assistant] Uh, through Varanashram. That was the overall thread. So you started your spiritual journey, you talked about your spiritual journey starting with that.


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[Assistant] Concept of destiny, happiness is fixed, happiness will also be fixed and then...


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[Assistant] How you get to, uh, after ping?


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[Assistant] Meera road and then that's where your services emerge afterwards. Then we started discussing about the transition in our movement. So how we have become a prominently congregation based movement now and instead of simple,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Simply thinking of this terms of say, just geographical location, relocation of devotees from inside the temple to outside. It's, it can also be seen as a natural development of where we are moving towards Varnashram.


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[Assistant] So the four stages, Sankirtan, Initiation, Temple Construction and Varanashram. So Varanashram, so these four can be parallelly happening.


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[Assistant] But if we focus on Varanashram, all the remaining will also happen because devotees will be engaged according to their uh, nature and you made a powerful point that projects don't run based on, based on, big projects don't happen simply based on a large number of devotees.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They happen based on enthusiastic devotees acting according to their Swabhava.


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[Assistant] So, that was, and then, but if you do the, so the first is like a, the Varanashram is like the,


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[Assistant] So now Varanashram doesn't simply mean, doesn't mean going to a village and living like that. It means basically compatible engagement.


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[Assistant] Providing everyone service according to what they, what is, according to what is basically their nature. And if this doesn't happen, then devotees will be dissatisfied.


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[Assistant] And that, we could say that dissatisfaction from incompatibility with their nature will overshadow whatever spiritual taste they might get and that may cause them to go away from bhakti. So,


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[Assistant] Then over generations, the varanas also become clearer. And then we discussed, in the present situation, what can leaders do?


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[Assistant] That if we can't, if somebody has a particular nature that we can't engage, instead of making them feel guilty or rejecting them,


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[Assistant] Uh, or making them that say that you have to, you have to surrender and surrender doesn't mean giving up your nature but we can have a network of leaders and somebody else can be


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[Assistant] Who can engage such a devotee that can be respectfully, carefully handed over? Just like a father hands over a daughter to another family.


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[Assistant] Who feel the need for space? That seeking space should not be done in the mood of rebellion because ultimately rebellion is not going to help us advance spiritually. But through careful introspection, gradually we can find a way in which we can engage ourselves.


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[Assistant] In some ways in the field of education as an example, we discussed how already compatible surveys and compa- that forums are happening, but


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[Assistant] This understanding one's varna, it is, and moving our movement towards providing compatible engagement.


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[Assistant] This is, this will require thought and acknowledging its complexity.


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[Assistant] Is also an important sign of humility. You made a striking point that the


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Varanashram is not so much to be seen as a hierarchy.


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[Assistant] As more of compatibility. So varanaya when it is confused with jati, it becomes a big problem.


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[Assistant] And jati is by birth. We are not purporting, purporting jatiwaad at all, propagating jatiwaad at all.


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[Assistant] So, even when there was a hierarchy in society in the past, there was a lot of respect for everyone and


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[Assistant] Uh, that, every, like, that is striking. Driver saab, what you mentioned. So, everybody is respected. And that is a part of, we could say, culture also. Yes, people may have different services, but every service is valuable. No nature is itself lower.


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[Assistant] And then, just as this caste system, similarly astrology may also be misunderstood.


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[Assistant] Like somebody may make, either reject astrology as sceptically or make that the sole basis of decision making.


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[Assistant] But it is more like a weather forecast which will help us to drive more carefully and effectively.


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[Assistant] So in this way, we can all, uh, be as individuals and as individual devotees and as leaders can


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[Assistant] Very well, thank you. It was such an illuminating discussion. I look forward to having you for many more podcasts in future.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The Desire of Ages Chapter 42 Tradition


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[Assistant] The scribes and the Pharisees expecting to see Jesus at the Passover had laid a trap for him.


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[Assistant] Then came together unto him the Pharisees and certain of the scribes.


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[Assistant] And bringing the disciples more directly into conflict with the rabbis.


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[Assistant] The spies they sent to Capernaum in the early part of his ministry.


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[Assistant] The life of those who tried to observe the rabbinical requirements was one long struggle against ceremonial defilement.


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[Assistant] When the people were occupied with trifling distinctions and observances which God had not required.


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[Assistant] Thus he seeks to attract attention from the real issue. Whenever a good work is begun,


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[Assistant] Let them not be enticed into a controversy that will work only ruin of souls.


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[Assistant] He that believeth on the sun hath everlasting life and he that believeth not the sun shall not see life. And hereby we do know that we know him if we keep his commandments.


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[Assistant] He gave them an example of what they were repeatedly doing and had done just before coming in search of him.


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[Assistant] And whosoever curseth father or mother, let him die the death. But ye say.


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[Assistant] If a man shall say to his father or mother, it is Corbin, that is to say a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me, he shall be free.


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[Assistant] An undutiful child had only to pronounce the word Corbin over his property, thus devoting it to God.


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[Assistant] Thus he was at liberty, both in life and in death, to dishonor and defraud his parents, under cover of a pretended devotion to God.


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[Assistant] Never by word or deed did Jesus lessen man's obligation to present gifts and offerings to God. It was Christ who gave all the directions of the law in regard to tithes and offerings. When on earth he commended the poor woman,


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[Assistant] Well did Isaiah prophesy of you, saying, This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth and honoreth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me. But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.


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[Assistant] He declared that by placing their requirements above the divine precepts, the rabbis were setting themselves above God.


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[Assistant] The customs and traditions so highly valued by the rabbis were of this world, not from heaven. However great their authority with the people, they could not endure the testing of God.


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[Assistant] God bids us accept the word of the Eternal Father, the Lord of heaven and earth. Here alone is truth unmixed with error. David said, I have more understanding than all my teachers for thy testimonies are my meditation.


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[Assistant] It's everything to be a basketball player in OG. You know, you, you dream of it as a kid to, to play at the Supreme Court back home and to come here and play a state, a state championship game. You dream about it all through your childhood and the support we get from our community is crazy, you know, at home.


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[Assistant] There's, you can look up and there's not really an empty seat. And here you look up and there's 6,000 people here just cheering you on. So it's a great feeling to have that support from the community.


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[Assistant] And finding my teammates pretty well. I take a lot of pride, you know, rebounding and finding my teammates is one of the things that really motivate me to keep going out there and keep playing hard and I feel like we did that today and it's really paying off for us this year. I just think the leadership.


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[Assistant] I'm really working on my outside shot and definitely my handles, which, uh, we've been doing all summer and this pass off season, we definitely working on the outside shot and the dribbling, which is, uh, helped my game tremendously this year.


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[Assistant] I'm looking for a winning program and a place where I can call home is one of my main things. I want to go to a place where I feel welcomed and a place where I fit in.


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[Assistant] Grades are really important. My mom's always on me, get those grades up, get those grades up. But, uh, I want to be an engineer, so I have some pretty rigorous classes at the high school.


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[Assistant] Take a lot of time to get good grades, but it's going pretty well, I guess. Matt, it's fun to finally get an end result, and getting an end result, it's a great feeling to get that final result, and for you to be right, I like that's the best part about it.


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[Assistant] You said I'm awful, Commander. Brilliant ain't the word.


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[Assistant] Hey, wait a minute, wait a minute. Maybe you better talk so I can understand. I get awful impatient when I don't understand people. I say to these fools...


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[Assistant] I'm very tired and hungry, answered Oliver, almost crying. I've been walking for a week. A week? The magistrate's order, was it? The magistrate? What's that?


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[Assistant] A magistrate's a kind of judge, explained the surprised young gentleman.


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[Assistant] He realized Oliver did not have much experience of the world. Never mind that. You want some food, he went on. I haven't got much money, but don't worry, I'll pay.


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[Assistant] The boy helped Oliver to his feet and took him to a pub.


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[Assistant] So uhm, uh, uh,


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[Assistant] A strange boy whistled and put his arms into his pockets as far as the big coat sleeves would allow him. I suppose you want to sleep somewhere tonight don't you?


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[Assistant] He held out his other hand toward Renesmee. A request this time. Can I?


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[Assistant] I'm actually holding her so that my hands aren't free to kill you, Jacob. Maybe later. He sighed but didn't push me on it. Wise of him.


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[Assistant] Alice raced back through the door then, her hands full, and her expression promising violence. You, you, and you, she snapped, glaring at the werewolves. If you must stay, get over in the corner and commit to being there for a while. I need to see. Bella, you better give him the baby too. You'll need your arms free anyway. Jacob grinned in triumph.


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[Assistant] Undiluted fear ripped through my stomach as the enormity of what I was about to do hit me. I was going to gamble on my iffy self-control with my pure human father as the guinea pig. Edward's earlier words crashed in my ears again. Did you consider the physical pain you're putting Bella through, even if she can resist, or the emotional pain if she doesn't? I couldn't imagine the pain of failure. My breathing turned to gasps. Take her.


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[Assistant] I whispered, sliding Renesmee into Jacob's arms. He nodded, concern wrinkling his forehead. He gestured to the others, and they all went to the far corner of the room. Seth and Jake slouched on the floor at once, but Leah shook her head and pursed her lips. Am I allowed to leave? She griped. She looked uncomfortable in her human body. Wearing the same dirty t-shirt and cotton shorts she'd worn to shriek at me the other day.


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[Assistant] Her short hair sticking up in irregular tufts. Her hands were still shaking. Of course, Jake said. Stay east so you don't cross Charlie's path, Alice added. Leah didn't look at Alice.


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[Assistant] She ducked out the back door and stomped into the bushes to phase. Edward was back at my side stroking my face. You can do this. I know you can. I'll help you. We all will.


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[Assistant] I met Edward's eyes with panic screaming from my face. Was he strong enough to stop me if I made a wrong move? If I didn't believe you could handle it, we'd disappear today, this very minute. But you can, and you'll be happier if you can have Charlie in your life. I tried to slow my breathing. Alice held out her hand. There was a small white box on her palm. These will irritate your eyes. They won't hurt.


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[Assistant] But they'll cloud your vision. It's annoying. They also won't match your old color, but it's still better than bright red, right? She flipped the contact box into the air and I caught it. When did you, before you left on the honeymoon, I was prepared for several possible futures. I nodded and opened the container. I'd never worn contacts before, but it couldn't be that hard. I took the little brown quarter sphere and pressed it.


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[Assistant] Concave side in to my eye. I blinked and a film interrupted my sight. I could see through it of course, but I could also see the texture of the thin screen.


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[Assistant] My eye kept focusing on the microscopic scratches and warped sections. I see what you mean, I murmured as I stuck the other one in. I tried to not blink this time. My eye automatically wanted to dislodge the obstruction. How do I look? Edward smiled. Gorgeous, of course. Yes, yes, she always looks gorgeous. Alice finished his thought impatiently. It's better than red.


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[Assistant] But that's the highest commendation I can give. Muddy brown. Your brown was much prettier. Keep in mind that those won't last forever. The venom in your eyes will dissolve them in a few hours. So if Charlie stays longer than that, you'll have to excuse yourself to replace them. Which is a good idea anyway because humans need bathroom breaks. She shook her head.


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[Assistant] Has been awful quiet. I ain't heard a bird chirp in a week. Too quiet. Oh, we're just imagining things.


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[Assistant] I'll bet your five beaver skins there ain't an Indian inside a twenty miles of here.


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[Assistant] Why, they were standing on each other's shoulders trying to get at us. You know what I done? No.


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[Assistant] You don't need to worry about her hair. Some Shoshone will just pick all of them.


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[Assistant] Sure, them Shoshone scalps. I got a Cheyenne and a Ute back there someplace, but they don't match very good, so I put them back behind.


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[Assistant] I was gonna have a rug made out of these, braided like, like horse hair.


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[Assistant] Well, I forgive him. It is a delicate business. Mrs Churchill rules at Enscombe, and she's a very odd-tempered woman. And his coming now depends on her being willing to spare him.


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[Assistant] I will tell you, Emma. Frank was here this morning. He came to speak to his father on a subject. To announce an attachment. Emma, Frank is engaged to Jane Fairfax.


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[Assistant] He has been secretly engaged to her since October last when they met at Weymouth. It was he who sent the piano. Emma, he was engaged to Jane Fairfax before he ever came here.


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[Assistant] It seems the engagement had to be secret. He had to deceive us all because he feared his aunt's disapproval.


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[Assistant] This has hurt me, Emma, very much. It has hurt his father, too. Some part of his conduct we cannot excuse.


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[Assistant] Uhm, other than yourself, do you mean my dear?


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[Assistant] Ah, she looks just as she should. Now, might we make our way, do you think?


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[Assistant] I entertain high hopes of our arriving at the rooms by midnight.


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[Assistant] Well no doubt you prefer him to be a brigand. As far as the man of consequence though. General Tilney of Northanger Abbey.


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[Assistant] No, indeed. Well, Catherine, we shall miss you.


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[Assistant] I should be sharp about it. These great folks don't like to be kept waiting.


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[Assistant] Can you, Ms. Moreland, be prevailed on to quit this scene of public triumph and oblige us with your company at Northanger Abbey?


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[Assistant] Miss Moreland, a thousand pardons for our late arrival. My eldest son must bear the blame. He stays on in Bath. Now, my dear Miss Moreland, I have a proposal. As it is a fine day, how should you like to travel in the curriculum with my son Henry? You will enjoy the air and be better able to see the country. It is of course entirely up to you.


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[Assistant] Well, no doubt the rooms in Mr. Allen's are exactly the true size for rational happiness.


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[Assistant] I remember years ago after your mother died. I remember when Dicey sent you away to school. And Dicey's a good woman. I've always thought highly of her and I'd like to be able to think as well of her grandchild.


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[Assistant] Ooh, I didn't know. You nice to do all that on what dice it could stand?


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[Assistant] I do not believe that any of us who knew Miss M, and most of us knew and loved her, can accept the contention that she was insane.


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[Assistant] Took the only means open to her of paying for my clam services through the provisions of her will.


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[Assistant] Your honor, this is a small country town. We've always thought that what happened here was our own private concern. This is no longer true.


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[Assistant] Now, Your Honor, we're all anxious to get to the bottom of this as quickly as possible before the temperature of this room reaches the boiling point.


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[Assistant] What was the final prison sentence imposed on my class?


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[Assistant] Now, Miss Am must have made some sort of reply if she was threatened. What were Miss Am's next words?


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[Assistant] Uh, answer the question, please. Isn't that what Miss M said?


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[Assistant] I have here a note from Dr. Joe, in which he says he's going to be delayed. On the basis of this note...


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[Assistant] Okay, good people. Check it out. Chime in. What do you think about meditation in schools? Do you think this is a good idea or is it a bad idea? We've seen some conversation in the community. Looking forward to seeing your response below. Go ahead and chime in. Let us know what you think.


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[Assistant] First you come here with a story we can't check, and you'll worm yourself in as a watchman.


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[Assistant] He is, is he? I'll give you till the count of three to come out. One, two, three.


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[Assistant] The coffin. The coffin.


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[Assistant] In which Mr Samuel Weller begins to devote his energies to the return match between himself and Mr Trotter.


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[Assistant] Which was ushered in by Mr. Pickwick's adventure with the middle-aged lady in the yellow curl papers, sat Mr. Weller Sr., preparing himself for his journey to London.


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[Assistant] He was sitting in an excellent attitude for having his portrait taken.


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[Assistant] It is very possible that at some earlier period of his career, Mr Weller's profile might have presented a bold and determined outline.


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[Assistant] But unless you took a full view of his countenance in front, it was difficult to distinguish more than the extreme tip of a very rubic and nose.


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[Assistant] His chin, for the same cause, had acquired the grave and imposing form, which is generally described by prefixing the word double to that expressive feature.


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[Assistant] And his complexion exhibited that peculiarly mottled combination of colors, which is only to be seen in gentlemen of his profession and in underdone roast beef.


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[Assistant] Round his neck he wore a crimson travelling shawl which merged into his chin by such imperceptible gradations that it was difficult to distinguish the folds of the one from the folds of the other.


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[Assistant] Over this he mounted a long waistcoat of a broad pink striped pattern, and over that again a wide skirted green coat ornamented with large brass buttons, whereof the two which garnished the waist were so far apart that no man had ever beheld them both at the same time.


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[Assistant] His hair, which was short, sleek and black, was just visible beneath the capacious brim of a low-crowned brown hat.


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[Assistant] His legs were encased in knee cord britches and painted top boots, and a copper watch chain, terminating in one seal, and a key of the same material dangled loosely from his capacious waistband.


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[Assistant] We have said that Mr Weller was engaged in preparing for his journey to London. He was taking sustenance, in fact.


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[Assistant] On the table before him stood a pot of ale, a cold round of beef,


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[Assistant] And a very respectable looking loaf, to each of which he distributed his favours in turn, with the most rigid impartiality.


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[Assistant] And nodding significantly to his parent, took a long draft by way of reply.


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[Assistant] Very good power of suction, Sammy, said Mr Weller the Elder, looking into the pots when his firstborn had set it down half empty.


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[Assistant] Yes, I dare say I should have managed to pick up a respectable living, replied Sam, applying himself to the cold beef with considerable vigour. I'm very sorry, Sammy.


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[Assistant] Said the elder, Mr. Weller, shaking up the ale by describing small circles with the pot, preparatory to drinking.


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[Assistant] I always thought up to three days ago that the names of Vella and Gammon could never come into contact, Sammy, never. Always except in the case of a widowed, of course, said Sam. Widows, Sammy.


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[Assistant] Well that's pretty well, said Sam. Besides, continued Mr Weller, not noticing the interruption, that's a very different thing.


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[Assistant] You know what the council said, Sammy, has defended the gentleman who's beat his wife with a poker whenever he got jolly. And after all, my lord, says he, it's an aimable weakness.


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[Assistant] So I says respect him widders Sammy, and so you'll save when you get as old as me. I ought to know better than I know, said Sam.


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[Assistant] In the excitement of feeling produced by this agonizing reflection, Mr. Weller rang the bell and ordered an additional pint of ale.


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[Assistant] As they always say in Turkey, when they cut the wrong man's head off. It's my innings now, Governor.


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[Assistant] And as soon as I catch his hold of this here truckner, I'll have a good'un. I hope you will Sammy, I hope you will.


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[Assistant] In honor of this toast, Mr. Weller imbibed that a draft at least two-thirds of the newly arrived pint


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[Assistant] Now it's time I was up at the office to get my veybill and see the coach loaded, for coaches' summies like guns. They requires to be loaded with very great care before they go off. At this parental and professional joke, Mr Weller Junior smiled a filial smile. His revered parent continued in a solemn tone.


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[Assistant] I'ma gonna leave you, Sanibel, my boy. And there's no telling when I shall see you again.


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[Assistant] The family name depends very much upon you, Sammyville. And I hope you'll do what's right by it.


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[Assistant] Upon all little punts of breeding, I know I may trust you as well as if it was my own self. So, I've only this here one little bit of advice to give you.


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[Assistant] Just you shut yourself up in your own room if you've got one, and poison yourself off that hanging zwolga. So don't have nothing to say to that. Poison yourself Sammyville me boy, poison yourself, and you'll be glad on it afterwards. With these affecting words, Mr Weller looked steadfastly on his son,


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[Assistant] In the contemplative mood which these words had awakened, Mr. Samuel Weller walked forth from the great white horse when his father had left him, and bending his steps towards St. Clement's Church, endeavoured to dissipate his melancholy by strolling among its ancient precincts.


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[Assistant] He had loitered about for some time when he found himself in a retired spot, a kind of courtyard of venerable appearance.


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[Assistant] Which he discovered had no other outlet than the turning by which he had entered. He was about retracing his steps.


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[Assistant] When he was suddenly transfixed to the spot by a sudden appearance.


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[Assistant] Mr. Samuel Weller had been staring up at the old brick houses now and then in his deep abstraction, bestowing a wink upon some healthy looking servant girl as she drew up a blind or threw open a bedroom window.


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[Assistant] When the green gate of a garden at the bottom of the yard opened,


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[Assistant] And a man, having emerged there from, closed the green gate very carefully after him, and walked briskly towards the very spot where Mr Weller was standing.


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[Assistant] Now, taking this as an isolated effect, unaccompanied by any attendant circumstances, there was nothing very extraordinary in it.


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[Assistant] It is clear, therefore, that there must have been something in the man, or in his manner, or both, to attract Mr Weller's particular notice.


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[Assistant] Whether there was or not, we must leave the reader to determine when we have faithfully recorded the behaviour of the individual in question.


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[Assistant] When the man had shut the green gate after him he walked, as we have said twice already, with a brisk pace up the courtyard.


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[Assistant] But he no sooner caught sight of Mr Wello than he faltered and stopped, as if uncertain for the moment what course to adopt.


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[Assistant] As the green gate was closed behind him, and there was no other outlet but the one in front, however, he was not long in perceiving that he must pass Mr. Samuel Weller to get away.


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[Assistant] The most extraordinary thing about the man was that he was contorting his face into the most fearful and astonishing grimaces that ever would be held.


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[Assistant] As Mr. Weller said this, the man's features assumed an unearthly twinge, perfectly hideous. He was obliged to pass very near Sam, however.


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[Assistant] The man with the horrible face looked, with the greatest surprise, up the court and down the court and in at the windows of the houses, everywhere but at Sam Weller.


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[Assistant] And took another step forward when he was brought to again by another shout.


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[Assistant] Bring them here eyes of yours back in their proper places or I'll knock them out of your heads, yeaah.


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[Assistant] Ah, replied Sam. You're already glad to see me, ain't ya? Glad! exclaimed Joe Trotter. Oh, Mr. Walker, if you had but known how much I look forward to this meeting, it is too much, Mr. Walker. I cannot bear it indeed, I cannot.


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[Assistant] And with these words, Mr Trotter burst into a regular inundation of tears, and flinging his arms around those of Mr Weller, embraced him closely in an ecstasy of joy.


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[Assistant] Get off! Cried Sam, indignant at this process, and vainly endeavouring to extricate himself from the grasp of his enthusiastic acquaintance. Get off, I tell you! What are you crying over me for, you portable engine?


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[Assistant] Because I'm so glad to see you, replied Job Trotter, gradually releasing Mr Wellard as the first symptoms of his pugnacity disappeared. Oh, Mr Walker, this is too much. Too much? Echoed Sam. I think it is too much, Raider. Now what do you got to say to me, eh? Mr Trotter made no reply, for the little pink pocket handkerchief was in full force.


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[Assistant] Bless you, Mr. Walker. Weller, I mean. A great many things of you will come away somewhere where we can talk comfortably. If you knew how I have looked for you, Mr. Weller.


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[Assistant] Where ye are indeed, I suppose, said Sam dryly. Very, very, sir, replied Mr Trotter, without moving a muscle of his face. But shake hands, Mr Weller.


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[Assistant] Sam eyed his companion for a few seconds and then, as if actuated by a sudden impulse, complied with his request.


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[Assistant] How, said Jogetrotter as they walked away, how is your dear good master? Oh, he's a worthy gentleman, Mr Weller. I hope he didn't catch cold that dreadful night, sir.


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[Assistant] Oh, I am so glad, replied Mr. Trotter. Is he sure?


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[Assistant] Is yawn? Asked Sam by way of reply. Oh yes, he's sha. And I grieved to say, Mr Weller, he's going on worse than ever. Aha, said Sam. Oh, shocking, terrible.


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[Assistant] At a boarding school, said Sam. No, not at a boarding school, replied Joe Trotter with the same sly look which Sam had noticed before. Not at a boarding school.


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[Assistant] In that house with the green gate, Mr Weller, they keep a good many servants.


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[Assistant] And from that an acquaintance sprung up between us, and I may venture to say, Mr Weller, that I am to be the Chandler. Ah.


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[Assistant] I'm a very amiable child, are you, mate? replied Sam, eyeing Joe with a side look of intense dislike.


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[Assistant] The great advantage of this, Mr Weller, continued Job, his eyes filling with tears as he spoke, will be that I shall be able


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[Assistant] At the recollection of the purity of his youthful days, Mr Trotter pulled forth the pink handkerchief and wept copiously.


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[Assistant] I can't keep my feelings down, Mr Weller, said Jobe after a short pause, to see


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[Assistant] There he was it, said Mr. Weller. To be sure it was, replied Job.


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[Assistant] Well, said Sam, as they had now arrived near the hotel.


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[Assistant] I shall be sure to come, said Job. Yes, you better, replied Sam, with a very meaning look. Or else I shall perhaps be asking after you at the other side of the green gate. And then I might cut you out, you know.


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[Assistant] I shall be sure to be with you, sir," said Mr. Trotter. And wringing Sam's hand with the utmost fervour, he walked away. Take care, Joe Trotter, take care, said Sam, looking after him.


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[Assistant] And looked after Job till he was to be seen no more. Mr Weller made the best of his way to his master's bedroom. It's all in training sir.


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[Assistant] That eh, queer customer and a melancholy chap with a black hair. Impossible, Sam.


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[Assistant] And as he assisted Mr. Pickwick to dress, he detailed the plan of action on which he proposed to enter. But when is this to be done, Sam?


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[Assistant] Inquired Mr Pickwick, all in good time, replied Sam. Whether it was done in good time or not, will be seen hereafter.


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[Assistant] Mother Teresa's open casket was carried through the crowded streets of Calcutta into an indoor arena packed with people. The service went on for hours because the leaders of each national and religious delegation were called one at a time to lay a wreath of white flowers on the funeral beer.


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[Assistant] I had lots of time to reflect on my brief but enriching relationship with Mother Teresa.


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[Assistant] We first met in February 1994 at the National Prayer Breakfast in a Washington Hotel ballroom. She had just delivered a speech against abortion, and she wanted to talk to me.


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[Assistant] Mother Teresa was unerringly direct. She disagreed with my views on a woman's right to choose and she told me so. I had the greatest respect for her opposition to abortion, but I believe that it is dangerous to give any state the power to enforce criminal penalties against women and doctors.


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[Assistant] I consider that a slippery slope to state control of reproduction, and I'd witnessed the consequences of such control in China and communist Romania.


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[Assistant] While we never agreed about abortion and birth control, Mother Teresa and I found much common ground in many other areas, including the importance of adoption. We shared the conviction that adoption was a vastly better choice than abortion for unplanned or unwanted babies.


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[Assistant] The extent of her influence was in full display at the arena in Calcutta as presidents and prime ministers knelt before her open casket.


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[Assistant] Mother Teresa left a powerful legacy and a well-equipped successor in Sister Nirmala, a fellow missionary of charity who had worked with Mother Teresa for years.


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[Assistant] After the memorial service, Sister Nirmala invited me to visit their Calcutta orphanage and asked me to a private meeting at the mother house, headquarters of their order.


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[Assistant] When I arrived, Sister Nirmala led me into a simple whitewashed room, lit only by tears of flickering devotional candles arranged against the walls. When my eyes adjusted, I saw that Mother Teresa's closed casket had been brought here to her home, where she would remain forever.


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[Assistant] The nuns formed a circle around the coffin and stood in quiet prayer. Then Sister Nirmala asked me to offer a prayer.


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[Assistant] I was taken aback and hesitated, feeling inadequate to the occasion.


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[Assistant] Then I bowed my head and thanked God for the privilege of having known this tiny forceful saintly woman during her time here on earth.


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[Assistant] I had no doubt she would be watching from heaven as each of us in our own way tried to fulfill her admonition to love God and one another.


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[Assistant] By mid September, the occasion I had dreaded for years finally arrived. Chelsea was moving to California to start her freshman year at Stanford.


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[Assistant] Our hope was that Chelsea's arrival on campus in mid-September 1997 would be as low key as possible.


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[Assistant] Although she would have 24-hour protection, the young agents assigned to her detail would look and dress like students, and they would quietly set up residence in a dorm room near Chelsea's.


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[Assistant] Chelsea, Bill and I arrived in Palo Alto on a gorgeous autumn day.


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[Assistant] We made our way to a three-story concrete dormitory that would be Chelsea's home away from home.


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[Assistant] The last minute shopping and packing had left me exhausted. And as is typical of many mothers, I went into overdrive as soon as we got inside the dorm.


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[Assistant] Chelsea's room, which she shared with another young woman, was barely big enough to accommodate bunk beds, two desks and a couple of dressers. I was on a mission, rushing around in a vain attempt to organize Chelsea's belongings.


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[Assistant] Bill, meanwhile, resembled most of the other fathers, who seemed to go into a slow motion trance the moment they set foot on campus. Bill had insisted on carrying Chelsea's luggage himself, and then armed with a miniscule wrench, he tackled the bunk bed, which Chelsea and her roommate wanted to take apart.


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[Assistant] After deducing that the bunk first needed to be turned upside down, Bill completed the task and then retreated to the window where he stood and stared out morosely, looking like a dazed boxer who had just been pummeled in the ring. By late afternoon, it was time for all the parents to leave.


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[Assistant] Freeing the students to arrange and rearrange their possessions without parental interference. Most of the other mothers and I gathered up our belongings including unused contact paper and began to make our way to the exits. After weeks of planning, shopping, packing, unpacking and organizing, we had steeled ourselves for this moment.


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[Assistant] Watching the fathers, however, I realized that they had no such preparation. Just as it was time to leave, they seemed to awaken from their collective fog, suddenly anxious over the prospect of parting from their offspring.


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[Assistant] He is known as the father of India, but throughout his life, Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi evoked mixed feelings. He was viewed alternatively as a fanatic or an eccentric, a reactionary, revolutionary, saint or messiah, or as a man who must be killed.


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[Assistant] He led a peaceful resistance movement to free India from British rule. Yet, independent India was born at an hour of brutal carnage.


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[Assistant] Amidst sectarian killings on an unprecedented scale, Gandhi risked his life to preach non-violence until his dying day.


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[Assistant] On January 30th 1948, he was killed by a Hindu nationalist with three shots fired to the chest.


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[Assistant] In 1931, Gandhi was interviewed by an American journalist.


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[Assistant] The late brother of Gandhi's assassin was jailed for almost two decades. At the time of our interview, he was 85 years old and recalled every detail of the plot.


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[Assistant] In the Indian capital Delhi, there are several sites dedicated to the memory of the man to whom the poet Tagore gave the name Mahatma, Great Soul.


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[Assistant] The Samadhi, the site where Gandhi's body was cremated on a funeral pyre of sandalwood in accordance with Hindu funeral custom. The National Gandhi Museum.


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[Assistant] And Birlauhaus, converted into a memorial museum after Gandhi was assassinated on its grounds.


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[Assistant] Everyday crowds of visitors flock there from all over the country. Bengal and Kerala, Uttar Pradesh and Manipur.


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[Assistant] Visitors remove their shoes to approach the spot where the Mahatma fell to the assassin's bullets.


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[Assistant] When Mohandas Karamchad Gandhi was born in 1869, India was firmly under Britain's imperial yoke.


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[Assistant] Like his father, he seemed destined to serve the ruling powers.


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[Assistant] His family belonged to the Bania caste, hard-working merchants from Western Gujarat state.


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[Assistant] Gandhi's marriage at the age of 13 was arranged. He and his wife Kasturba would have four children.


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[Assistant] After passing his bar exams in London, Gandhi returned to India to practice law, but soon went on to take up a short-term position in South Africa. He ended up staying for 20 years.


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[Assistant] When he returned to India in 1915, Gandhi was a changed man. The barrister had become a political activist.


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[Assistant] Trading his English suit and tie for a dhoti, the traditional dress of the Indian poor, he set out to familiarize himself with the social problems in his homeland, traveling by train across the country, always in third class.


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[Assistant] Gandhi addressed crowds in every town and village he visited. He spoke of human dignity, justice and independence.


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[Assistant] Across the country, nationalists organized bonfire protests to burn textiles imported from England.


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[Assistant] Gandhi launched his Charaka or spinning wheel movement.


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[Assistant] He declared it the patriotic duty of every Indian to spend 200 yards of cotton thread a day and to boycott textiles produced in the mills of Manchester and Liverpool.


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[Assistant] In 1930, Gandhi led the three-week Salt March, walking 358 kilometers to the village of Dandi on the Arabian Sea.


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[Assistant] Gandhi and his followers were arrested, but it was a victory for the man who Churchill contemptuously called the half-naked fakir.


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[Assistant] Gandhi's weapons were civil disobedience and non-violent resistance. The British countered with truncheons.


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[Assistant] Colonial repression was often brutal, prisons were full.


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[Assistant] Gandhi was jailed seven times for a total of four years. His protege, Jawaharlal Nehru, eight times serving nine years.


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[Assistant] Nehru, the anglicised Brahmin, well-dressed and elegant, with ideas rooted in socialism.


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[Assistant] The two men were very different, not least in their views on religion.


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[Assistant] Gandhi was deeply religious. He began each meeting with prayers.


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[Assistant] Life in India is permeated by the values of Hinduism, which assigns a person's caste on the basis of birth.


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[Assistant] But Hinduism has been traditionally regarded as a tolerant religion, not given to proselytizing.


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[Assistant] Islam had expanded under the reign of the Mughal emperors in northern India to become the country's second largest religion.


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[Assistant] In British India, Muslims accounted for a quarter of the population.


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[Assistant] After the country's partition in 1947, that number dropped to 12%.


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[Assistant] Hindus and Muslims had long enjoyed a peaceful coexistence.


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[Assistant] Until political representation was attached to religious identity.


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[Assistant] The Muslim League emerged as a political force in the 1930s with the aim of protecting the interests of Indian Muslims.


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[Assistant] But a new goal emerged. The creation, after Britain's withdrawal from India, of a Muslim nation. Pakistan, or land of the pure.


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[Assistant] The party was led by Muhammad Ali Jinnah, who'd known Gandhi for years.


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[Assistant] In 1944 Gandhi went to meet Jinnah at his private residence in Bombay.


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[Assistant] Over the course of almost three weeks, Gandhi tirelessly tried to dissuade Jinnah from his plan for a Muslim Pakistan.


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[Assistant] In 1946, the leaders of the Muslim League and Indian Congress Party met here to discuss ways to implement Gandhi's vision of a united, independent India.


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[Assistant] Nehru's knack for diplomacy failed in the face of Jinnah's intransigence. After three weeks, the talks broke down.


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[Assistant] Jinnah's call for a direct action day on August 16, 1946, in support of the demand for Pakistan, sparked an eruption of harrowing violence in Calcutta.


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[Assistant] Five thousand people were massacred and twenty thousand wounded. Most of the victims were Hindu.


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[Assistant] That led to retaliatory attacks by Hindus against Muslims elsewhere. Reprisal killings spread across northern India. Entire families were slaughtered.


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[Assistant] Some Hindus now claim their religion was too passive and lacked martial order.


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[Assistant] To them, the Hindu value of tolerance was an inexcusable weakness, which had for centuries allowed first the Mughal and then the British empires to enslave the Hindu majority.


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[Assistant] They felt the time had come for Hindus to assert themselves and for Hindu men to reclaim their prowess.


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[Assistant] He began a fast in Calcutta, which he vowed to continue until the violence stopped.


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[Assistant] In March 1947, Lord Louis Mountbatten arrived in Delhi. As the last Viceroy of India, he'd been tasked by the British Prime Minister to negotiate an exit deal with Indian leaders.


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[Assistant] Mountbatten appeared bent on hastening the end of imperial rule, and soon came to favor the option of partition.


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[Assistant] He was assisted by two Hindus and two Muslims because he himself knew nothing of India. That was why he'd been chosen to guarantee objectivity and fairness. Most of India's Muslims lived in the north.