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[Assistant] Easy throws should be slam dunk completions where it's not even close to being a completion.


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[Assistant] So that's what scares me, let alone, like I said, it's been a little bit of a one read and run.


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[Assistant] Uh, type of quarterback play from him, and that's where it's less than Sam Darnold. I really look at fields as being like someone you would want, I think somewhere between the 20s and 32s. I would want them, like I talked about a little, in a position where,


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[Assistant] He could sit behind somebody for a year. You know, that's where I did bring up Pittsburgh with Big Ben.


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[Assistant] Yeah, you know, any place that just, he doesn't have to be thrust in and expected to carry the team with his right arm, or decision making.


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[Assistant] From everything I know, I mean listen, I think this kid's capable of, of, you know,


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[Assistant] Showing progress as a pocket passer and doing those things. Hey, play it at Ohio State.


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[Assistant] First guy was open a lot. They throw to a lot of open spaces. You know, they kinda just protect and say, hey, you figured it out. I don't really know if he knows past protections like I talked about. There's too many times where I saw certain blitzes.


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[Assistant] And he didn't know he was hot until he saw, well, the guy's three feet from me and nobody blocked him. I better try to find a way to get the ball out of it. He's raw that way. So you'd want him in that type of scenario, at least in my opinion. That's why I say Pittsburgh, where it's like, okay, we're coming to the end with Big Ben. You know, he can learn.


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[Assistant] From Big Ben and how you approach the NFL season and maybe fix some of those, you know, physical issues as far as the technique issues and become a more polished passer.


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[Assistant] They can be fixed. It's gonna take tremendous reps and repetition. It's not the kind of thing where you're just gonna go, this is where to me, like, knowing the guy and the pro day are gonna be really big. I wanna see it the pro day.


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[Assistant] You know, we're, I'm gonna move you around. I'm gonna wear you out a little bit. I wanna see if you could stay within these mechanics. Cause yea, you could probably cheat them and fool people for 45 or 50 throws. If that's all you're thinking about.


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[Assistant] You start digging the tire, get them worn out. Let me just see, is he working on these? Did he recognize them and okay? Now he's recognized them and let me see how he puts it all together.


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[Assistant] He's a natural thrower, so he can fix these issues. But it's not something where I look at and I expect it just to be like gone and done with by the time training camp comes around.


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[Assistant] People that I think could really, like, stay on it, fix it, know what they're talking about, things like that. Yeah, I think it's like seven, eight guys in the whole week. Six to eight. Yeah, it's somewhere in that range. Isn't that something? Yes, because...


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[Assistant] You know, again, the NFL, you got a lot of quarterback coaches and everything that really don't know how to throw. They're too prideful that now they have this job that they don't try to go out and never really learn from anybody.


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[Assistant] They don't because it's a, I'm supposed to be an NFL coach. I'm supposed to know. I don't want to tell anybody I don't know. Oh, well, I don't know. That's what Bill Belichick's done all these years. He's, he's just acted like he knows it all and that's how he got so good. That's where so many coaches, you know, failed in my opinion. You're not supposed to know everything.


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[Assistant] Learn more. And yes, there's lack of those guys in the NFL.


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[Assistant] There's some things here like we talked about with his legs and his base, right? And just keeping it shoulder width apart, not letting his feet come close together, right? I mean, can I stand up Kristen at all or do any of that? You think you could tilt that up today?


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[Assistant] Alright, well, either way, you know, let me get my feet in the screen, but just like, hey, just a basic start for him is just to stay here, right? Just stay in this, this manner, right? Oh, look at this. Just stay here. And like, you talked about, you brought it up the first thing you noticed, you know,


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[Assistant] Okay, that's the first thing a coach is gonna have to do with Justin Fields, no matter where it is. Hey, when we throw, we want the feet right here all the time. Doesn't matter where you throw. It can't go, oh, now we're over here, let me bring them back together and do this. Like, there's no way. There's way too many moving parts you're never gonna be able to. So, that's...


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[Assistant] A pretty fairly easy fix as long as people can stay on that.


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[Assistant] And then there's gonna be the other aspect of course of tying the upper body together with it.


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[Assistant] You know, first off, this gets too floppy like we talked about.


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[Assistant] And that's okay to have a flexible arm, but it can't just be all flexible arm by itself. At some point, there's gotta be a little bit of the body to go along with it. If you're just locking the front shoulder in, which he will do at times, he just locks it there and then just makes it all about this.


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[Assistant] You're not going to be consistent that way either. So you're going to have to take, it's going to be somebody that's going to have to stay on them and know what they're talking about a little bit to fix that issue.


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[Assistant] Quarterbacks' heads don't go like this as they throw the football. They don't do that, right? If you watch Rodgers or Brady, like it might be this right there, okay, it's about as far as it's gonna go, right? But so many times they're, oh my gosh, somebody's right here in my pocket and they gotta go, huh!


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[Assistant] And you didn't move at all. You stayed there because you were on that back foot as you're talking about. Right. And now you have the ability to crank and torque and let me just do it right like that. That's what makes like Zach Wilson. That's why I love him. That's why I like Rodgers in my homes. They can be here and oh people around them and they can be


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[Assistant] And they could both feet off the ground or do whatever throw they want. Uhm, and in this draft, you know, that's Zach Wilson.


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[Assistant] Mon can do that, Mac Jones is phenomenal.


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[Assistant] Trevor Lawrence, who does get a little too much body movement himself at times with his lower legs a little. You said he stood up a little bit too. He can be like this, where he's a backbender, right, and he just kinda falls out of it and does that.


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[Assistant] He still throws so many good balls, even though it's the wrong way at times. And he can be a little bit of a long strider. Not that his body goes really forward with it, but it is a long strider where there's a little bit of a moving part.


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[Assistant] But here's the thing where I go like Trevor Lawrence I know can fix it is like I saw so many throws where Trevor Lawrence had


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[Assistant] Like people in his face and now he couldn't step into it and like use his longer motion and he would do things the right way and he could still throw it with incredible pace and power and that to me shows me he can fix that pretty easily.


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[Assistant] Trey Lance's throwing is not up to Josh Allen. It's not. Not even close. No. Josh Allen's arm is like one of those where you go, it was like watching Mahomes or Brett Favre for the first time. You were like, what, is that serious, that throw? Like, holy cow.


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[Assistant] You know, no, Trey Lance is a little bit more mechanical. He doesn't throw the ball as much and do any of that. I like Trey Lance. I like a lot of like the traits he brings. There's no doubt. In fact, like I've said last week, I think he's a little bit more of a consistent thrower than Justin Fields is.


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[Assistant] And it's really... One game in over a year. One game in over a year, and the year before that, I mean, you got games where he throws it 14, 15 times. It's just... And it's a very easy...


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[Assistant] College offense where I go, listen, the NFL is not going to be like this.


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[Assistant] The running is hard to gauge a little at times because he is got unbelievable acceleration and explosion, but you're also like, okay, that guy's never going to be in a training camp in the NFL, you know, or couldn't even play for a major division one college team too. So it is a little tough that way.


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[Assistant] To compare it to Josh Allen, yeaah, I'm sorry, there's really no comparison there. You know, Josh Allen had...


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[Assistant] Like, woah, look at this guy, look at some of the throws he's making, doing that type of stuff. He's 240 pounds. They were putting the whole game on him, and they were dropping back every throw, and doing those type of things, and yeaah. I know it was a little crazy and raw, but they weren't good. I mean, they were the worst pass-protecting offensive line.


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[Assistant] That year, out of any of the major quarterbacks coming out, he had nobody talented at receiver.


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[Assistant] There wasn't people open. He played in horrible weather conditions. So that led to this narrative that, you know, he was of course not accurate and all those type of things. Yeah, we've, we've hit all that, but no, I can't say Trey Lance is on the level of a Josh Allen, uh, comparing them, but I like things about Trey Lance for sure.


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[Assistant] I mean, there's no way he's going to the Carolina Panthers at 8. There's no way. They're gonna run the Joe Burrow offense with the guy?


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[Assistant] We can't expect him to play for us this year. You know, I'm not sure if we're gonna, you know, we'll be lucky if he can play for us next year. We gotta, we gotta see where this goes. We don't really know.


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[Assistant] So that's to me is where he's a second round prick where we gotta get him used to NFL life and going through reads and drop back pass offense and doing all that type of stuff.


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[Assistant] Like, no, this is not a guy that's NFL ready. This is a guy, he's gonna have to groom, be groomed a little bit in all aspects of his play.


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[Assistant] You know, just because it just, it makes too much sense. They are a team that wants to dice you up with a drop back pass game. Here's a guy that's been coached.


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[Assistant] You know, and a pretty damn good pro-style offense and Nick Saban and Sarkeesian looking all over him, right? To where I go, okay, that makes sense. You know, he knows how to make decisions. He knows how to slide and make the throws in the pocket. That's what Carolina wants.


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[Assistant] Plus, he's got more talent than Teddy Bridgewater. I mean, he's a way better thrower, he's got even a stronger arm, everything about it. Right. So, to me, with McCaffrey and, you know, Robbie Anderson and DJ Moore,


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[Assistant] You know, those two right there, and who knows who they get as a third receiver, Curtis Samuels, a free agent, I just go, that to me screams Mac Jones, uh, to be that guy to run that offense.


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[Assistant] It's not necessarily, the season of the number happens a real thing. Yeaah. You know, for a young guy who's just learning the position, they're not having played the position for a year, that's not good. The most important thing is, is getting reps, getting out there, getting thrown in, doing all those things. He wasn't even asked to do that when he was playing football two years ago. You know, they wanted to run first.


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[Assistant] You know, a lot of the times it was look at one guy and then you run. Or here's a play action pass and we've designed it just for this one guy to get open and now you throw to that one guy. So, uh, I'm more not necessarily concerned with the competition. Listen, I like


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[Assistant] You know, uh, Carson Wentz coming out and Josh Allen, like we've talked about and those type of guys. So where I don't get totally obsessed with that. It's more about the style of play and just, you know, the projection of he's not ready for the NFL and what's going to be expected to, expected of him there.


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[Assistant] Uhm, Trash didn't do more with less. Trash has pits, the other receiver is going to be number one, is it not first round pick two. So it's, it's, you could say it's every bit as good, if not better than, than Alabama this year. Good points. Okay, so that's the first thing we're going to hit on.


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[Assistant] His arm is not better than Mac Jones. It's not even the same planet. It's not the same planet. I'm not trying to be a jerk here, but I'm gonna be a jerk. I'm sorry. He's, yes, it's, it's, the throwing is all over the place. Yes, he's bigger. He's not even close to the athlete Mac Jones is. You know, Kyle Trask doesn't move well.


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[Assistant] Dan Mullins found 90 million ways to throw fades up the sidelines for Kyle Trask because that was the only throw he can consistently make.


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[Assistant] That's really all it was. They found more ways to run wheel routes, slot wheel, fade, double move, fade, so he could basically throw the ball to the same spot the whole season. That's really what they did.


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[Assistant] So, it's not a good athlete. You know, obviously it's the knee issue. It's way below NFL average arm. It's below NFL average accuracy. So, none of that. You know, again, he's not on the level of Mac Jones.


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[Assistant] And I don't, I hate being negative, but I just know, well I know, because I know, I know those, I got this question a lot. It's again, here's, it's Florida, it's the hype machine. They won, how could it not be him? His stats were good. I don't know.


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[Assistant] I mean, first off, if it was that great, maybe they would have played them more in the bowl game, and they wouldn't have been putting another guy in there. Okay? So that just tells you a little bit, alright? And I'm not trying to judge off of that too harshly, alright? But at the same time, no.


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[Assistant] I would be surprised if Kyle Trash gets picked in the first four rounds of the draft. No, I think he is a down the line draft prospect. There is nothing elite about his game. And you're being disrespectful to say that he's similar to Mac Jones.


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[Assistant] I can't say that I have, no. And you know, again, it's still early. Like even with some of the coaches are just getting into it. The coaches are really just getting, I got more feedback from like scouts and things like that because they're already in it and they've been in it.


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[Assistant] You know, coaches, yes, are just starting to dive in.


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[Assistant] Hey, I haven't really watched him yet. I've seen a little. What would you, what'd you think, right? So it wasn't like they were going like, hey, I disagree or I agree that he does this and this. Yeah, like you said, most teams have just gotten done with free agency and how they want to attack that. And now you're seeing the coaches start to dive into the draft.


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[Assistant] Or even, I don't really look at his second round. I think what Davis, Davis Mills is, he's really polished. Like, knows how to play the position.


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[Assistant] You know, good, solid arm, but now, you know, it's, it's just, it's NFL average, maybe a little bit above that. It's really NFL average.


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[Assistant] He does have some size. He's a better athlete than I expected, or at least what I saw on TV a little last year. But yea, to me he's more of a middle round pick.


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[Assistant] By a team to go, hey, this guy could be a really good backup for a long time. And you know what? If we formulate the right thing around him, I don't know, he could maybe be our starter one day. That's to me what he is along that range. So I really like him, but I think like after the first six, he's the next guy.


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[Assistant] But unlike the first six, who all have elite traits, like they all have something elite about their game where I go, that's elite enough to me to go, I think they're in the first round talent conversation. I don't think he has that. And that's where I think he's kind of that, that third or fourth round type of guy. Let's go to your old school, Texas.


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[Assistant] Ellinger. Ellinger. Yes, right. I've heard both. You know, I hope I'm right.


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[Assistant] His running is not going to translate to the NFL. It's not, it's not that special. I mean, if he runs and lowers his shoulder the way he did in college football in the Big 12, he's not going to last long because he's not a real, real big guy. To me, I look at him as more of a


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[Assistant] You know, again, I think it's going to be a late, later in the draft type of guy to where, you know, maybe a team like Baltimore, maybe once a guy like that who can, hey, he can run the ball a little bit. If the guy's open, he'll hit it, but the throwing is just less than it's a slow delivery.


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[Assistant] It's a way below NFL average arm. And to me, yes, he's a down the hill, down the line type of guy.


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[Assistant] Newman has some high-end talent. Now like, there's a few things that like, first off,


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[Assistant] I, you know, I don't know, I haven't, it sounded like, you know, he lost the job at Georgia, right, and transferred to go to Wake Forest. And then Wake Forest said you're gonna have to compete to get the job back again, and he said the hell with it, I'm going to the NFL. I don't love that story right there. Okay, I don't love that.


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[Assistant] He is built like a freak of nature, and I say that respectively. I mean, he is. As soon as you turn on the film, you go, whoa, look at those arms and that shoulder, and the running is real.


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[Assistant] His, you know, his arm is he could throw it through a wall when he threw it, but he could also miss the wall is what I worry about. It's just really raw that way. So he to me is a total project, you know, from that standpoint, you know, and again, I don't think that's a


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[Assistant] And he can be our third stringer for now, and he's got some things about him that maybe he could be something two or three years from now. That's to me the kind of guy Newman is.


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[Assistant] But his physical attributes do pop off the screen. Sources say Ellinger. Ellinger, it is Ellinger. I choked, yes. Pete, thank you. Sammy the Bull, that's what he is. I mean, he was. I got more respect for that kid. Played hard, right? Played tough, clutch. I mean, I loved watching him.


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[Assistant] Right, that's good, good. I like that, that's a real listener. You're right, James Morgan had some elite traits last year, where when you saw the throwing, you went, whoa, okay. You know, again, that's, that's the kind of guy where, Pete, where did James Morgan get drafted last year? Fifth round, something like that?


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[Assistant] Fourth round, right? That's the kind of guy you take in the fourth round. To me, it's the guy where you go, wait, at worst he could be a backup.


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[Assistant] But yet there's something here where I go, maybe we could really catch something special here, right? I don't know if I see that guy right now. I don't know if I do. You know, I talked about Davis Mills, but I know what he is.


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[Assistant] He's gonna be a guy that's gonna run an offense and take what's there to be had and do those type of things. You know, after that, you get into Ian Book.


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[Assistant] Who, again, I like Ian Book, he's well-schooled, played at Notre Dame, throws spirals, got control of the football, got a pretty good arm. I think he's the next guy in the conversation, you know? Uhm, let me see, Felipe Franks, out of, uh, Arkansas.


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[Assistant] Right, he's got, you know, to me that's maybe another guy, like I would go Davis Mills, Ian Book, Felipe Franks. Those are the guys that I expect to come off after the board, I think, after those main guys. And, and you know, there's still some down the line guys I need to look at. I haven't gotten through like 20 deep. I think I'm like 15 deep or something like that.


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[Assistant] Well yeaah, and I gotta start moving on to other positions in the draft too. So I will go back and look at some other guys later down the line.


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[Assistant] But to me, those are the guys that jumped off as compared to the Ellinger or, you know, uh, the Bushell guy at SMU. Uhm, who else am I missing? Yeah, when we talked about Kyle Trask and all of that.


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[Assistant] I look at those three as being next. Like Felipe Franks, it's slow delivery, it's an average arm, but he is big and he's a pretty good athlete. He's a pretty good athlete. I was shocked to see for 6'6", for him to move the way he did. I think those are the next guys in line for me.


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[Assistant] Okay, and Big Phil, we'll have him on. I know Big Phil's just kind of diving into the college quarterbacks and stuff like that. I don't know how far in he is. I know he had watched Trevor Lawrence really, really closely.


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[Assistant] Yeah, oh, he is. He's gonna watch them all. He just, he kinda just getting started himself here. So, uh, yeah, we'll see where it goes. But we'll have him on Wednesday. We hit everything today. If you got more questions, keep hitting me up.


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[Assistant] Certainly, we're just gonna continue to dive more and more into these topics. We're gonna get into free agency here, too, as we go, and then we're gonna kinda dive back into the draft just to give everybody a little precursor to where this is all going. I think, like, Pete, right, we're gonna start hitting wide receiver rankings and things like that towards the end of the month.


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[Assistant] Uh, and then we'll start to go position by position and we'll hit them that way, but you the man. Thanks for driving the ship today. Hope everybody was happy there. Hope I didn't get too pissed or pissy about some of those questions, you know me? We don't want everybody too happy. I know, you know, I'm just trying to give answers and...


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[Assistant] Squashed bad narratives and things like that. Uhm, but hope everybody enjoyed the pod. We'll see you Wednesday. Be good. Peace out.


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[Assistant] Yo, yo, what's up? Come on, man. Subscribe on YouTube to Chris Simms Unbuttoned Podcast. I need you. Please hit the subscribe button, please.


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[Assistant] Hi, I'm Mike Tirico and thanks for watching. Make sure to hit subscribe for the latest news and highlights.


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[Assistant] So, like, I'm gonna watch this weekend. I did not fill out a bracket.


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[Assistant] Okay, yeaah, that's right, it's a football podcast, but we talk sports, we talk b-ball, alright, and I wish I didn't do my bracket, because I did it. And it looks real shitty. Hello, this is Chris Sins on Button, and this is Paul Burmeister. What's up, man?


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[Assistant] I had your Hawkeyes making like a, maybe a sweet 16, I think a final 8.


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[Assistant] Right? I mean, Big Ten Basketball, holy crapballs back then. Yeaah. I know. I mean, I'd like to, that'd be a job I'd like to have. How can I seed the NCAA tournament? I could have seeded it just as well as they did. I mean, do they feel good after that weekend going,


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[Assistant] Wait, all the teams we thought that were 1, 2, and 3 seeds got beat by a bunch of, you know, 7, 8, and 12 seeds and things like that.


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[Assistant] We do. And I don't like that aspect of my school right now. I'm not happy with them from that angle or our sports. I mean, football, basketball, I mean, we're just, we're irrelevant. So that's that. But we got a good one today. Let's talk about football. Yep. I've been watching a ton of football.


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[Assistant] Yeah, uhm, this is probably more of an intense work, right? And it's a weird year this year, too. You know, again, I'm not like...


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[Assistant] I call my friends in the NFL and go, give me your rankings or give me your time. I don't do that. I don't do any of that. I release my rankings and then.


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[Assistant] I tell my friends after, and most of my friends are like that anyways, they want to see my rankings first before we have a discussion about it, right? So uhm, but this year's weird in the fact of I like to have a list of guys, right, just a reference point, not to say that I'm going to agree with how they're listed or anything like that.


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[Assistant] But the, the lists are all over the place this year. Aren't they? They're all over the place. And that has made it even worse for me because now I don't trust it. So I'm, uh, let me watch 5 more guys. Let me watch 10 more guys. Because I've seen guys that are, I'm going, this guy's not in the top 20.


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[Assistant] Three. Like, there's no question. You know, I saw, like I told you before we started, De'Ami Brown from North Carolina. I looked at one list. He wasn't on the first page of wide receivers.


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[Assistant] Yeah, it is impossible because I could tell you since I released that rankings, I've had a lot of teams already feedback to me and go, hey, he's pretty damn good. You're right. We're, he's a first rounder. So that's that, but I, that's where it got stressed out. So it just is a never ending thing right now to where I'm going.


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[Assistant] You know, whoa, okay, let me watch a few more. Oh, man, this guy was 17th on here and he's damn good. I don't know. What's 25 look like? And it's just gone.


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[Assistant] Never ending and I got more notebooks and crap here and I'm all over the place but I'm excited about it and it's a good group as far as I like the safeties a lot. There's a lot of good safeties in this track. It's good. Corners, I think the top end group is pretty damn good.


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[Assistant] Uhm, I'm not blown away by the top end group.


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[Assistant] But, but, it, it, it, I think there's a drop-off after the top-end group. Significantly. With the safeties, I went down the line and went...


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[Assistant] I mean, man, this guy's my number eight or nine safety, but I mean, if I talked to a coach and he told me he was number five safety for them, I wouldn't go, oh, you're just so stupid. That's crazy.


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[Assistant] You know, again, go back and tell me how much impressive Yak you see, or just straight beating a guy over the top with pure speed. You know, again, he's gonna have a really good role in the NFL.


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[Assistant] And everything like that. His tape does not show 439 speed. And here's another thing we're gonna dispel here throughout this process. 439 speed at your pro day ain't 439 speed at the combine. There's a difference there. In fact, you can add a tenth


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[Assistant] Maybe a tenth, you know, .15 to that. That's the general rule. That's why a lot of guys you see every year don't run at the combine. Because, ooh, I'm a little worried about what my number might be here. Let me go to my environment now where there's human error because someone's hitting it instead of a laser.


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[Assistant] At the end, so if you see 4-3-9, that's 4-4-9. There's no doubt, that's 4-4-9. Every coach in football is gonna go, that's a tenth below that.


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[Assistant] So, uh, again, he's a real good player. I'm not trying to knock him. He's gonna have a legit role in the NFL. He's got a little inside-outside value. But he's more of an inside big slot type guy. And yeah, I just don't think it's a, he's a pure elite specimen as I'm talking about some of these other guys.


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[Assistant] Because I want Rondell Moore, the guy I saw the freshman year as a special, special player. I mean, that guy is a first round pick. The problem is the last two years of film don't show that guy because of the injuries and everything he's had to deal with there. Where'd you have him? So, I mean,


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[Assistant] As far as listing him, it was a hard list. I had nowhere in the top 7 or 8 or 9 at that point. No. You know, this is one where yea, you'd have to go through it and put him through some vigorous, you know, workouts and see where he is physically. He does have first round talent.


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[Assistant] You know, even though he ran great and if he continues to have workouts that are great, I still think after two years of being injured and being a smaller guy, there's no way he climbs back into the first round.


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[Assistant] But he could be that guy where, you know, next year we sit here and go, you know, he was picked in the third round and look, he's healthy and he's a superstar or a weapon in the NFL right now. I don't deny that anyway, but all I can do is go by the film. Listen, if I had personal workouts and got to know the guy, maybe I'd feel differently about it.


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[Assistant] But just the film in the last two years is a little too underwhelming.


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[Assistant] You know, I don't know if you've heard, but I'm kind of a big deal around here.


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[Assistant] No, it was, you know, the technique and all that was perfect, but the one thing I'll always take away from corners, and just a reminder this year, again,


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[Assistant] I want to see pure raw ability. That's what Corner is about. It's pure raw ability. Yeaah, I know Interceptions are cool, and he's got tackles, and woah, he can play zone coverage. That's great.


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[Assistant] When times get tough in the NFL and you need a, you know, big stops or your defensive players to be special, you need a guy that you can go, wait, you, you, you cover that guy who runs 4-3 wherever he goes and we'll, we'll work on all the other stuff. We can work on zone coverage and tackling and things like that.


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[Assistant] So, uh, that's where I always keep in mind with, with this. Just going, going into it. Don't get enamored with, you know, again, the headlines, the chatter.


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[Assistant] And I wanna see, this is a position specifically, I mean really, really specifically, where I gotta see raw explosiveness, you know, and not to get too carried away sometimes with technique, and this is another one too, cause I got a guy on this list who's got some underwhelming film of time, to where I go, wait,


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[Assistant] What he does and what they ask him to do in this defense, well, we could bring back Daryl Rivas, and there's gonna be some struggles here. This is not fair to do to the guy. And you gotta keep that in mind too, just like when a quarterback has nobody open. You can't bring the quarterback, you know, same thing here with the DBs. So sorry for that long answer, but.


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[Assistant] No, I mean, I think the speed, the explosiveness is the harder thing. You can teach a guy, you know, awareness with good coaching. Not that it, you know, maybe he doesn't catch up to that guy who does have great awareness in that department. But again, I'm not drafting


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[Assistant] A really good zone corner in the first round. I'm not. You're going, again, first round is about elite traits. Things that these guys do where you go, woah.


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[Assistant] You know, he's not perfect, but he's got these one or two things that are really special and like nobody else in the draft can do that. And to me, again, that's where it goes to man to man. Zone coverage is great. I'm all for zone coverage.


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[Assistant] The problem is, in big plays and big situations,


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[Assistant] Zone coverage in the NFL just ain't gonna get it done against the good offenses and good quarterbacks. We had this discussion a lot. You play zone every play against Tom Brady and Aaron Rodgers. They're gonna get into the right play and the receivers as much as they play are gonna find the hole in the zone and they're gonna pick you apart that way.


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[Assistant] You know, when you look at the really good defenses for the most part, when it becomes big time plays, or like we talked about during the season, it's a third and four and it's a must have down. You can't play zone on that.


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[Assistant] The good quarterback's a 5 yard completion, they got 75 different ways to get a 5 yard completion against zone coverage. You're gonna have to have some studs that go, no.


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[Assistant] I'm gonna get in this guy's face and you're gonna throw into a really tight, close window and I might get a hand on it and knock the ball in the air and do those type of things. That to me is what we're looking for here when we're ranking corners, uh, as far as


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[Assistant] You can do so. You're right. You're right. I wasn't sure if we were going to add who just, just off the bat. We have six for safeties. We have six for safety. Yeah. Did I mess up? Maybe, maybe I messed up and sent Pete the wrong text message. Okay. Either way, let me see your list for five and six, just so I can know, right? We're, we're going real right here. Okay. On this.


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[Assistant] Yes, and that number six is a, is a, is a corner, right? So that's where we're messed up a little bit. Okay. Okay. Marco Wilson, right?


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[Assistant] Right? This is live TV right here. That's okay. Here we go. So it doesn't matter. Markle Wilson either way. Let's just hit on him. Okay. Before we let up the graphic. He's a guy that deserves at least to be mentioned. He's number three for Florida. He's a really good corner. I mean, smooth, you know, has really good hips.


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[Assistant] You know, can move in and out of transition really well. Where he's not in the top five for me is just because there's a little bit of a lack of burst or closing on the ball as compared to maybe the top five guys we're gonna talk about here. But Marco Wilson, I'm just glad we get to talk about him a little here because I do think he deserves to be talked about in the conversation.


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[Assistant] You know, of the top corners in the draft. There's no doubt.


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[Assistant] Borderline first round talent. At the very least, I look at it and go, there's no way he's on the board past 45. It's six in round one last year. Right. So I could see that. I mean, again, guys that are elite, that can cover true elite athletes, man to man, they don't grow on trees. That's a special, special group of people. And he is one of those guys that,


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[Assistant] Was asked to do that in college and did it at a really high level, just not quite to the level of these guys. And what I think Pete got confused with is number five safety is a guy from Florida too. So maybe that got confused a little bit, but Markle Wilson, you know, I like a lot about his game.


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[Assistant] And, really, out of these top corners I'm gonna talk about, maybe has the best nickel value too. Because it's changing your direction and flipping hips is real. And, you know, wait, Kristen, why don't I just stand up right now and explain hips a little bit, just to people a little, alright? I mean, just so she can widen out here, alright?


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[Assistant] I'm gonna talk a little bit about some guys who just got greasy, really great hips, and they can do this.


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[Assistant] And flip to this, or they can be in this angle, and then it's just really natural that way. We got other guys sometimes who are, you know, it's, it's more like this, and then it's, okay, wait, I gotta go this way, okay, let me do that, and I'm more of a straight liner, right? Where we get to the top corners in this draft,


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[Assistant] You know, they can be like this and now somebody cuts this way and they're in a real good wide base and they can just open up and continue to go, right? So anybody that's wondering what hips are, that's what I'm talking about and hopefully you're watching on YouTube.


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[Assistant] Rather than just going, what the hell is Kristen doing as I'm listening right now? Uhm, so if he's a good nickel corner, does that mean he can cover the slot? Definitely. No doubt about it. And I think that's really probably, you know, he can do both. He's got the size to do both. He does. I just think there's a little lack of


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[Assistant] Top end speed and burst out of his break maybe compared to some of these other guys we're gonna talk about here in a second that just makes him number six and on the edge of a first round.


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[Assistant] He didn't play last year, so that's the great thing about this year's draft, too. It's like, wait, no, this guy didn't play? Let me go back to 2019 and watch it. It's kind of annoying, which I've talked about a little bit. But.


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[Assistant] I think the first thing I'm going to say about a Debo, that is real, like, maybe has the best ability to


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[Assistant] Get out of trans, and when I say transition, being in a backpedal, being a, okay, I'm, I'm, I'm in a sprint, and being able to stick his foot in the ground like we see great wide receivers do.


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[Assistant] And have no wasted steps. Stick the foot in the ground, the guy runs a 15 yard outroute, and he can just boom, put it in the ground.


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[Assistant] And really accelerate to the football, okay? That's where he is really special. I mean, and might be...


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[Assistant] He's on par with really the top two or three guys in the draft as far as that's concerned.


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[Assistant] I would think he'd be higher than fifth, because that's a pretty important quality. It is, it is a really important quality. Now, he has a little bit of that hip stiffness we talked about, we just talked about. He is a hair of a straight liner. Now what I do like about this guy is, if you decide to play him at free safety or something like that at some point in his career, he can do that. To me, out of all the good corners here now,


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[Assistant] This guy is a kamikaze missile. He will hit you. He comes downhill at a million miles per hour. And again, I'm not all about like tackling for corners where it's an essential thing, but there's a physicality element to his game, especially in like the short passing game, you know, screens.


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[Assistant] half back tosses where he's gonna have real value as far as that's concerned.


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[Assistant] You know, we, yeaah, we're the Steelers. Tackling is important for us at corner. We do all these zone blitzes and things like this. So we leave guys in areas where like, you gotta make the tackle. We can't have some cover corner where it's like, oh, I don't really wanna tackle him. Oh, he ran through my arm tackle, right? They don't want that.


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[Assistant] That's where I think, you know, it is really good. His ability to accelerate his...


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[Assistant] No wasted foot movement in and out of breaks and things like that is really, really special.


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[Assistant] And it's elite. I mean, it really is. And then, you know, his ability to close is real good as well.


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[Assistant] Now yeaah, like I talked about, if he has to flip his hips and do things like that, it's not as smooth as some of the other guys we're gonna get to, you know, here in a second. And really, when I broke him down, you talk about the hips a little bit being tight.


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[Assistant] And, you know, maybe a hair too aggressive. When you really watch him on film, the only time he gets beat.


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[Assistant] Was with double moves. But that's because he's so good at getting out of breaks and stuff. He's gonna drive on the ball and make a play on it.


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[Assistant] So he is amazing at closing the gap between those receivers. They make an outroute, he's in the backpedal, and he can come downhill. And like the really good corners in this draft too, this is the other thing that he does really well. He can play off or


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[Assistant] Man to man bump. Like, he can play off and be very effective that way. Where, okay, he's in a backpedal, he's backpedaling, the guy runs a curl route, and boom, he can close on it in a hurry. He's really good at that. Of course, he can bump.


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[Assistant] And turn and go because of his good straight speed, but.


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[Assistant] There is a little bit of a, there's where there's a little bit of a wasted step because of, like I say, the hips being a hair more of a straight liner. Again, I'm being picky. These are top athletes in the world. It's still really damn good. But I'm a big fan of Paulson Adibo. I hope I'm saying that correctly.


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[Assistant] No, I don't think it's, I think it's just, it's, it's, it's a plus. Not all great man to man corners are good playing off coverage. They're not. You know, you could look at almost like Marcus Peters likes to play off.


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[Assistant] He likes to, okay, you're coming at me, I got greasy hips and good feet, I don't care, I'll be able to match it and do those type of things, right? Where then there's like Marlon Humphrey.


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[Assistant] Where he might not be quite as good at that, so he gets in your face and he's gonna go, no, I'm gonna make you earn every yard of this. I like to just get there and, you know, I have a little bit more of a pure straight line speed.


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[Assistant] To where guys like Marcus Peters, who their speed's good, but it's not wow, they can protect themselves by being off a little bit too. So I don't know if teams necessarily value it any more or less. It's kind of more just like icing on the cake if they can do both, I guess is what I would say.


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[Assistant] Yeah, Aaron Robinson, like, is like, uh, uh, it's, it's, it's an intriguing film.


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[Assistant] Okay? He would be the guy I'm talking about where...


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[Assistant] He was putting some positions where I go, I don't care who you are, I don't know how you're going to succeed here. What kind of positions? Well, just being in the nickel covering the slot with no help at any time. Just like, hey, it's you against this guy.


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[Assistant] We're going to run pick plays underneath and we expect you to cover them. And it's just like, you know, yeah, there's going to be some plays where guys are going to get catches. It's just too hard. But like the pure ability again is amazing. He's one of those guys where I look at some plays and go, yeah, that guy caught it. Okay. That guy caught it. He got beat off the line of scrimmage.


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[Assistant] But holy cow, did he close the gap after he got beat.


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[Assistant] And that quarterback was lucky to get that completion in there. You know, he's a little bit of a raw specimen as far as when it comes to technique. He's just kind of doing it with pure ability. And when you get to see him play outside corner, you go,


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[Assistant] Watch out. This is a bad mamma jamma. I mean, he is. First off, he does like to tackle too. Alright? Uh, that, but, but I think he's a real island cornerback. And when you see him get to play outside and use the boundary to his advantage a little bit,


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[Assistant] Man, he's got great jam and physicality at the line of scrimmage. And then I think his speed is really what jumps out to me.


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[Assistant] You know, I think he's probably a high 4-3 guy, like NFL combine for high 4-3. You might see 4-2 at a pro day, something like that. It's that type of speed. And of course has length, that's 6'1", 193. So he should be an outside corner. He's got the ability to play inside corner. I think it was one of those things where UCF said, this is a tough position. You're the best player in our defense.


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[Assistant] So we're gonna let you do it, and good luck. Exactly right. So there's gonna be some underwhelming plays, but you gotta, you gotta look past that. It's like AJ Terrell last year.


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[Assistant] AJ Terrell from Clemson, my number 2 DB in the draft.


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[Assistant] Well, did you see Jamar Chase catch those balls in the national championship? And I said, yeah, I also saw AJ Terrell in his hip pocket. Now, yeah, he caught it. Joe Burrow made great throws. Jamar Chase is amazing.


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[Assistant] He didn't outclass AJ Terrell. If we're talking this is the number one best receiver in college football, this guy was right by him. So let's not forget that aspect. And I think sometimes that gets lost in translation too where they go, he lit up a catch and did this. And I'm going, the guy


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[Assistant] No, I hear you. There's, there's, you know, I try to look for teams with speed at receiver. Like, so I go to the Houston game. Houston's got some guys at receiver. We talked about one of them on the last podcast. Uhm, I'm blanking on his name. Pete, what's that damn Houston receiver? Number five.


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[Assistant] Uh, he can, he can fly, uhm, it's, it's killing me, but with his name, he can fly. Okay. Marques Stevenson, thank you, Pete. Right? I look for that kind of stuff to go, wait, wait, I know this guy can fly.


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[Assistant] He's got legit kind of like Ted Ginn type speed. Let me see what he looks like when he's matched up against him. And he's not outclassed at all. And there was a few other guys in that game too that I go, this guy can run. Whoa. You know, cause I'm watching them next to Marques Stevenson going, they're both running go-routs and they're at the same level.


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[Assistant] And yeaah, he's getting beat by a yard or two, but now the ball's in the air and he's all over it. Or he does get picked a little bit and the guy catches it.


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[Assistant] But get zero yards after that. He closed on him when the ball was in the air. So he caught it and he thinks they're thinking, well, we got a pick play and he's going to run up the sidelines. No, you got a three.


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[Assistant] I think probably more like, yea, late teens to twenties, that, that area. That kind of range. But, you know, I mean, he, you know, he really, remember, you remember like,


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[Assistant] He's a bigger, generous Jenkins. Okay, that's what I would say. That's sort of some of the movement. You remember Al Harris or the Green Bay Packers?


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[Assistant] I saw a lot of that, and maybe it's the hair, he's got this long hair that also looks like that.


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[Assistant] Uhm, but again, I think he's a guy that was a little bit played out of position because he was doing a solid for the defense and I think the talent is real and I just want to make sure I hit everything because he's a twitchy as hell.


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[Assistant] You know, he's playing the toughest position on their defense. And you know, he's great at the line of scrimmage. Like I talked about, not only just with jamming, but even mirroring guys. Like when guys are making all these moves, he cuts them off at every which way. And that is impressive too. And like I said, there's


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[Assistant] If somebody coaches him a little bit and gives him a little more technique, you know, this is a guy I go and go watch out. He's a legit NFL Island corner and be able to match up with anybody.


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[Assistant] Right, and I really like th- again, let's- I'm not trying to say th- this kid's a player. I mean, he's a player.


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[Assistant] I like this kid better than Jeffrey Akuda last year, just to tell you that, right? Okay? So, you know, there's a lot to love. And again, you know, look, 6'2", if you're watching here, 6'2", 208, 39 inch vertical, 131


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[Assistant] You know, uh, inch broad jump, 18 reps on 225, and then 442 at 208, like that's the real.


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[Assistant] You know, at your pro day, that is not a 4-4-2. That is a combine 4-5-2. It's a 4-5 for you? That's a 4-5-2. And, you know, the other thing I'll say too here is, you know,


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[Assistant] There's really not a lot to nitpick about this guy's game. You know, size, you know, really great feet. For his size, he's really good in and out of breaks like we talked about. Can stick his foot in the ground. He's got loose hips. I mean, he's got real great hips that way.


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[Assistant] The speed is, to me, a little bit, that's where he's number three for me. Okay. Again, you know, we're talking about, this guy's a baller. He is. But.


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[Assistant] You know, if I put him out on the edge against the elite wide receivers in football who can really go, let's see another Tyreex, the Odell's of the world, those kinds of guys.


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[Assistant] Yeah, I think that he's a better player than Diggs. He is. You know, maybe Diggs had a little bit better of a straight line speed, uhm, but it's not by much.


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[Assistant] But I think Sir Tan, everything he does at the line of scrimmage, again, the ability to flip his hips and do all that, the size, he's a notch above Trevon Diggs. This guy, this is a top 15 pick for sure. Right. I'm saying that. There's no doubt. He's that kind of player. So, uh, there is a difference there.


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[Assistant] Make sense within their scheme, right? They play the Seattle scheme.


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[Assistant] You know, this guy has man-to-man attributes. I don't think he's as purely physically gifted as AJ Terrell was coming out of Clemson. Again, I'm a guy that maybe overvalues the team that they just go, you take that mofo there. You take him and then we'll do other stuff over here.


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[Assistant] And that to me also was a little inkling as I look into things. You know, Surtain, they didn't always trust him on the islands against the greatest receivers. There wasn't. Alabama, there's more zone coverage on that defense than I expected as I watched through their film and stuff like that. So I think that's, that is always a little bit of a context clue to me a little bit.


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[Assistant] I feel like it was a little bit more new this year as compared to other years I've watched. You know, they've had so many good DBs come out of there and everything like that. Uhm, but, but again, I mean, he's a specimen. There's no doubt about that. He is gonna, the bigger receivers in football, he's gonna give them a legit tough time. The T. Higgins of the world.


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[Assistant] You know, who else, whatever. You guys got my drift. The bigger receivers.


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[Assistant] He's gonna be able to run with them, move with them, and not be out physicaled by them either. I just worry about the afterburners in football, the guys who can really go, the Terry McLorins, those kind of guys, the DK Metcalfs, I don't know if he can run with those guys. And that's what would bother me just a little bit when it comes to him.


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[Assistant] You're getting everything too. You know, when we had our question about zone, he understands zone. He's a good tackler. You know, there's really not a weakness to his game other than I just would like to see a little bit


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[Assistant] Thanks for listening. Yeah, exactly right. You know, who, who?


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[Assistant] Exactly. Right. Right. I didn't just, you know, when you think about the real island legit corners,


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[Assistant] You know, the receiver, you can motion them, stack them.


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[Assistant] He could be a great setup guy, he knows how to run routes, he knows how to, you know, break people's ankles, to where that, you know, gets to speed. The corner though, you can't, you can't beat that. Again, you're gonna get your ankles broken. So now when that happens, what are you gonna do after that? And that's where the pure speed comes into question. Like you're definitely, you're playing corner in the NFL, somebody's gonna break your ankles, every game.


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[Assistant] And that to me is, you know, I guess the thing that just does a hair scary about Surtain.


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[Assistant] I agree, 100%. I think that puts it in perfect, you know, perspective. Kind of surprising at number two, which is


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[Assistant] Tyson Campbell was the guy I turned on, and you know, he's my De'Ami Brown from The Receivers or whatever, but he's the guy I turned on. I just went, why is nobody talking about this guy? I mean, I don't understand it. What jumped out? I mean...


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[Assistant] First off, you know, all the things we talked about being well-schooled like Surtain, right? Surtain's great in and out of transition, stopping all those things, great hips, all that. He's got all of that stuff.


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[Assistant] But I think he's actually better at like sticking his foot in the ground and wasting less steps than, than Surtain. But the bottom, he is better at that, I don't think. He's better than that. And then the pure speed is there too. You know, they're just, they play him and you got that guy. A whole lot more.


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[Assistant] They're playing against the same dudes. There's no doubt. In fact, I'd say he's playing against worse dudes because he's got to play Alabama. Sir Tame doesn't have to play Alabama. You know? And hey listen, that's another context to that game. Right? How was it?


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[Assistant] To me, there's nobody that covered Devontae Smith better than him through the year. There's nobody. He was not outclassed by Devontae Smith. He was not outclassed by Watto. Watto has a long touchdown pass because they hit


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[Assistant] And he falls down and waddle ends up with like an 80 yard touchdown pass on a switch release and two man where him and the guy they were switching it with, they weren't on the same page. So I don't know who messed it up either way. He went inside at first and then kind of catches back up to waddle.


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[Assistant] And then as he's catching up and looking up, they hit heels and he goes down.


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[Assistant] I mean, to me, this is the guy I look for. This is, now this is the guy I want. This is a true shutdown elite corner. You know, with, with, really, again,


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[Assistant] Like Adibo, we talked about with Stanford, the ability to put his foot in the ground and drive on the ball.


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[Assistant] This guy is just as good as a Debo, except he's bigger, and he's got better hips than a Debo, as far as that's concerned. I mean, it's pretty, like, flawless. And again, you're gonna see plays against Florida, where they catch the ball for a touchdown. You know?


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[Assistant] He's in their hip pocket. They can't separate one inch. Now these are great receivers who were of course seeing the ball the whole time and they adjust and make a thing happen.


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[Assistant] Again, those are positives to me. Going like, wait, this is an elite guy that everybody's looking at. Hey, there's the tight end that everybody thinks is a top five pick. He can't get three inches of space from Tyson Campbell. Here's another receiver that's really damn good. Okay, touchdown. But I mean, he was covered like a blanket. So back up to that.


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[Assistant] And he has the physical ability to do that too. That's where I liked it when I went. That shows pretty good range. Exactly. You know, his length, for a guy that's a little more maybe slender than certain and all of that.


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[Assistant] You know, the game wasn't any less physical to him. And again, the context clues of what I said, they, they, they showed more confidence in putting him in an island than Alabama did putting Surtain in an island.


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[Assistant] And I'm, I'm big into that. I'm sorry. I just, that's the way I am. Did he guard, did he guard pits most of the game? He didn't guard pits most of the game. He, he stays outside against the guy. Who's the guy? I got him. Oh, he's over here. Okay. I mean, and they play some zone too. I don't want to say it's like every play.


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[Assistant] But you could tell there was a concerted effort to go like, oh no, we're playing man this play. You gotta take the best guy. Who is that best guy? Okay, you got him. Right. There is that. You know, I mean, just.


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[Assistant] of this draft. The technique is really good. They put him on an island a lot. You know, he's a better raw athlete than Surtain.


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[Assistant] The way they play him tells them a lot. The Alabama guys certainly did not outclass him or any of the other guys.


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[Assistant] You know, and I thought he has really good ball skills too. That's the other thing that I thought. I mean Sir Tain did too. I don't want to overlook any of that. But I was really impressed with like, you know, even the completions, like he sees the ball. He's trying to make a play on it at the last second, but he doesn't do it. Okay. But there's a lot of other plays where


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[Assistant] You know, he's running up the sideline, he's all over the guy, he knocks the ball down. You know, and that's where I was really impressed with, uh, Tyson Cable. I mean, to me...


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[Assistant] I mean, yes, as you know, just like, you know, last year, to me this is, he's got a little of that E.J. Henderson, except I think the game's even better than E.J. Henderson. CJ? CJ, excuse me. Uh, as far as just


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[Assistant] The polish, the aggression, the, got a little bit of the, the mojo of like, hey, I'm the man, come and do it.


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[Assistant] I think I, yeah, I do. I think I do. Yeah. You know, Henderson was a little bit of a projection, a little.


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[Assistant] Man, I wish he would show just a little bit more energy or life to a degree, but you saw too many plays where you just went, man, that's amazing coverage or look at that movement, that's special. This guy has no letdown.


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[Assistant] There's never, like, anything that I ever looked at and went, oh, I wish he just was, you know, the ability to turn and run was legit. I mean, his hips were legit, you know.


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[Assistant] I wrote even early on, I was just like, whoa, this kid in and out of transition is impressive. Like, can really stick his foot in the ground. I wrote, you know, can put his foot in the ground and drive on the ball.


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[Assistant] As good as anybody in the draft. Better than Surtain. Maybe up there with the number one guy we're gonna talk about.


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[Assistant] Yeaah, so I'm a big fan as you can tell and to me he was kind of the surprise guy of the secondary.


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[Assistant] I don't know if I've ever really evaluated a corner like this. Wow. Like, now you want to talk about corners that should be drafted in the top three? Yeah. Caleb Farley is worthy of being drafted in the top three. And didn't even play last year. Didn't play, I know. I mean, so, I mean, that stinks. That might be the only negative we talk about.


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[Assistant] I'm just, I've never seen a guy with that size move the way he does. Let's start at the top. Number one reason you're so high. Well because I've never seen a guy with his size be able to move, cut, accelerate, you know, greasy hips, all of that.


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[Assistant] I've never seen a guy. I mean, to me, it's like the film is better than Jalen Ramsey coming out a few years ago. And you know I love me some Jalen Ramsey. I mean, I love Jalen Ramsey. I got a man crush on him. So that's what I wrote. I mean, I wrote


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[Assistant] You know, and, and two, you know, it's another thing that I never hit with Campbell, like he can play off too because of that ability to kind of backpedal and put his foot in the ground and drive in the ball.


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[Assistant] You know, this kid I wrote, here's just the synopsis that he can play, he can jam or play off. He's surprisingly good in off-cut coverage. He doesn't understand leverage or, you know, where his help is.


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[Assistant] It doesn't matter. He gets it done with just pure raw ability. And then, you know, the talent is the real deal. I wrote, I don't remember a cornerback this big that can move like him. And I wrote Jalen Ramsey? And then the ability, you know, again in transition,


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[Assistant] And when I say transition for all those that are out listening, I'm just talking about, you know, backpedal, or, hey, you're running up the sideline with some guy, now he puts the brakes on, and his ability to, you know, slow down, put his foot in the ground, and then reaccelerate, that's what I mean by in and out of transition, that's what he does. I mean,


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[Assistant] That's, it's special for somebody that big. You know, he tackles, he has it all, and will be more dangerous than the NFL when he learns how to use his long arms and man-press coverage.


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[Assistant] And then I wrote, his stop start restartability, it's off the charts. It's off the charts. And his ball skills are off the charts. I mean, so when I look at all that, I just go, no, we, we wasted a lot of time on Akuda last year and everybody telling me a top five pick. This kid is a top five pick.


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[Assistant] With all of this stuff, it's about some of these other positions. And what's gonna be there are the teams themselves about what they need. You know, so, you know, the Jets have a real needed corner.


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[Assistant] Another corner after taking one of the top 20 last year? I don't know. They might value him. This kid's good enough to make you think, hey dammit, let's get two baller corners on rookie contracts.


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[Assistant] And now we can do a lot of different stuff on the defensive side of the ball. If he's there at four. Bangles, Eagles, Panthers all need those guys. And that's where I start to go into the corner conversation along with your Cowboys to go along with it too.


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[Assistant] You know, you look at a lot of the good defenses though, they do got two. You know, there, there, there is something there. I mean, we just talked about Baltimore. They got two of those guys. You know, the Patriots have two of those guys. Uhm, there's a few others that I'm going to blank out of here right now as far as the pressure is concerned, but no, I mean, uh, I, I, I was, I was, I was, I was, I was,


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[Assistant] Virginia Tech is cool, and a little bit like with Tyson Campbell too, where it's like


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[Assistant] Don't play man, and then they'll go, wait, we're gonna do something different over here. You're good, you got him, and now we're gonna do something else.


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[Assistant] Uhm, or they just played a ton of man to man. So I didn't get to see him.


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[Assistant] In the slot a lot. There was a few different times and he kind of played off and you know, kind of played it that way. There's a clip against Miami where he's playing off. The guy runs like he's playing off and again the technique is not always there so he's just kind of like


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[Assistant] Basketball defensive position and the guy runs inside and he goes a little and then he comes back on the outside on the post corner and he gets beat.


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[Assistant] But again, it's not something I looked at to go like, oh man, that's trouble there. You know, this is another guy where what's scary is how freaky good he is.


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[Assistant] And I think he's still really raw. Like he's, he's got, he gets coached a little bit and you go...


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[Assistant] Whoa, this could be scary. If he understands where the safety is, he won't jump inside here to like cut this guy off. You don't need to. There's a safety there. Don't do that.


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[Assistant] Once somebody starts to put those thoughts in his brain, he'll be, he'll be a shut down, like legit, legit corner. And you know, you talked about the Falcons at four. Maybe they will be in for a cornerback.


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[Assistant] He got, he got to play Claypool a number of snaps. I went back and watched it actually, you know, because it's, of course, that was the last year he played. How'd it look? I mean, he's right there with him. Stride for stride. There's, there's, there's no outclassing him. There's nobody gonna outclass this guy.


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[Assistant] This guy is a special, special talent. The only negative is is he didn't play football last year. I don't know the human being. I hope he worked and did all those things. But again, like I said, I'd never seen somebody 62 207 who could be that good in hips, can plant his foot in the ground and accelerate and then can just


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[Assistant] Uh, no, Robinson, excuse me, the UCF guy.


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[Assistant] Four. Four. They have three rockets up their ass. They have three rockets up. Now, I think, I think Caleb Barton and Tyson Campbell, it might be a hair more than, than Robinson, but still, they're, that, they have a little bit of a different top end speed to me than Surtain, uhm, Adibo


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[Assistant] Yeah, you know, I'm done with like, oh, I mean, you know, what are people saying? What's all that? That's again where I'm with Tyson.


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[Assistant] I think he proved he was the top safety in the draft. I think that was proven really for my money there.


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[Assistant] Well, I want guys that can like, you know, Xavier McKinney got hurt. He didn't really get to play a whole lot. So there's hard there. Julian Blackman, he started from the Colts, you know, he was their free safety. Everything that I saw on film is what I saw with the Colts. I mean,


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[Assistant] Incredible range for a smaller guy or a skinnier guy, you know, just had no care for his body.


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[Assistant] Dugger is a little bit of a projection from the small school and everything like that. And he's a little bit of a specialized type safety.


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[Assistant] But I think what I, and Ashton Davis, I like too. I mean, again, he was, he was good in coverage. I probably messed up and should have had a guy like Jeremy Chin there or something like that. Nice year, yeaah. But so, to me here too,


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[Assistant] I'm evaluating these guys on safety, and listen, some of these guys are playing nickel on their college team.


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[Assistant] You know, and it's, it's hard, but again, I think they're playing nickel because they're going, wait, this guy's so good. Let's put him by the line of scrimmage. Let's not have him dropping back in the middle of the field.


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[Assistant] Let's get him down here. He's too fast. He's too aggressive of a tackler. You know, who cares if he might not have the perfect greasy hips to cover guys? He's gonna make so many other plays in any, in so many other ways. So, I'm looking for safeties first off that are, that are all purpose. I look for the traditional safety first thing. You know, a guy, free safety, strong safety.


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[Assistant] Can he fly down and make tackles? Does he have some coverage ability? And I wanna see no hesitation in your game. You're gonna play safety in the NFL. You have to be a crazy mo foe.


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[Assistant] Yeah, I do. I think as a whole, you know, you just, I came away thinking there was 10, 11, 12 safeties where I just went, man, they're really good, and they could all be starting for an NFL team next year. That was one thing I took away from this.


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[Assistant] Yeah, Sean, I mean he is your traditional safety. Free safety, strong safety, you know, has a little bit, I mean he's


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[Assistant] Balled up, little muscle, like right, and brings it. I mean brings it. That's the first thing I talk about, you know. And I think when I, you know, the big thing with safeties, I don't necessarily value the top end speed. I like top end speed.


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[Assistant] But to me, it's a position too where, you know, acceleration may be more important in a lot of ways than the top end speed. You know, unless you're gonna ask that guy to play free safety a lot and he needs to have incredible range and things like that.


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[Assistant] But to me, I think the thing that jumps out with him more than anything is he can cover, he can, he's a good free safety, you know.


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[Assistant] Hips are good, they're not great, but I think where his real value is, is whether he's a free safety or you got him a strong safety and he's playing cover three and he's seven yards, eight yards off the line of scrimmage.


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[Assistant] He's a violent hitter. He's a violent tackler. I mean, he diagnoses run plays and he's down there in the B gap right as the tail backs there. Or maybe before. And I think that's the thing I liked about him, you know, more than anything. He's more the traditional way that way. He may not be like the pure, you know, top end superstar athlete.


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[Assistant] That some of these other guys we're gonna talk about, but still, I think this is a guy that is probably gonna, probably would run a 4-5 at the combine, something like that.


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[Assistant] Bob Sanders. You remember Bob Sanders? He's not Bob Sanders. I'm not going to say he's that guy because Bob was a freak.


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[Assistant] But has a style about him that way. Or even maybe like a more compact Ray Sean Jenkins who just got a big money contract with the Jacksonville Jaguars. Uhm, but yeaah, I really like this kid. I don't know if he goes in the first round, but I think he's a top 45, top 50 pick probably overall.


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[Assistant] Yep, and let me get to his page here, because uhm,


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[Assistant] Blown away by this guy. I know everybody, you know, talked about the other safety. I know. This is the safety at that school. Just to clarify that right now. I mean...


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[Assistant] I watched him and thought, honey badger, that's really what I thought of. You know, again, like,


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[Assistant] Will knock your head off. I don't care. He's 5'8", 178, 180 pounds, somewhere around there. And people might go, oh, that's, that's small, or whatever. You know, again.


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[Assistant] Honey Badger was 5'8", 185 coming out. Don't, don't put these guys into some bigger pedestal than you think, because you've seen them on NFL Sundays and big games and all of that. No. These guys are about explosion, they're balled up muscles, and they're not giant guys.


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[Assistant] They gotta run down freaky receivers and running backs and do all those things. Fill the hole.


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[Assistant] I just came away with the guy, uhm, first off, as pure range as a free safety is concerned.


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[Assistant] Might have the best out of any. There's probably the best. I mean, he's got...


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[Assistant] Hips and ability to do that kind of stuff.


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[Assistant] They played kind of did a little bit of both. He, I mean it was always safety. He didn't really get to see him at nickel and do things like that. They play a ton of quarters coverage too, which you know in quarters coverage like allows guys the safeties to fly downhill in the run game a little bit too and have that flexibility. And that's where he's amazing. So I mean range was awesome. Hips are awesome.


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[Assistant] He is m- probably the best open field ta- uh, no, I don't wanna say the best open field tackler. He's a really good o- there's a better open field tackler, okay? He- his- his, uhm,


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[Assistant] His tackling, what I love about it, where he's awesome is, again, he shoots his gun. So...


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[Assistant] He sees the wide receiver's screen, or a toss sweep. There's not like a, oh, let me stay here behind, you know, 10 yards down field, and if he gets to me, I'll make the tackle. He goes, uh, screw you, I'm going, I'm gonna tackle the guy before he gets to the line of scrimmage. We're at loss of one.


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[Assistant] He didn't, did not get in trouble being too aggressive. Not that I saw. Now, you know, unless there was a clip that I missed, but damn, he was a guy that I watched a lot, cause I just, again, was like, woah, this guy is amazing, and, you know, let me, you know, clarify what I'm seeing here. This is, I'm really impressed.


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[Assistant] You know, can be a phenomenal free safety. What I talked about with his hips and speed, you know, he could be a real nickel corner. This is why I say honey badger. He could be a nickel corner too and match up against shifty wide receivers in the slot.


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[Assistant] So that's where I like him too, it's that versatility.


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[Assistant] But his ability to like break on the ball and accelerate, it's up there with the top two corners in the draft. I mean, that's where it's special to me. Uhm, so, you know, I wrote down Honey Badger. If anybody remembers Lamarcus Joyner from, like, about seven, eight years ago coming to Florida State, right? He was a second round pick. But to me, this guy is those guys.


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[Assistant] Maybe a hair smaller, but he's faster than both of them. I would think this guy is like...


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[Assistant] 4-4 speed, low 4-4 speed at the combine but the acceleration


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[Assistant] He's not quite as rocked up. He's a little bit more of a, uh, a thinner frame. Okay. Right? But the same aggressive nature that I like. And again, I'm into no hesitation. I mean, if you're playing safety, you gotta be willing to tackle and do those things. And here's another thing I like about the guy.


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[Assistant] He doesn't give a shit if he gets run over. He doesn't care. To me, that's big. You're playing safety. You can't have pride here. You have to save the play. That's why you're a safety. So, if the guy's gotta run you over, then so what? You know, he's gonna trip on you when he runs over you too, and he goes down. And that's where I like that aspect of his game.


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[Assistant] Those are the craziest guys I was ever on a team with. You know, those are pound for pound the toughest guys on the football team, maybe other than the running back. You know, linebackers of course are in that discussion, but they're much bigger men. Safeties are like, you know, Brian Dawkins, who I played with. You know, John Lynch, who I was with one year.


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[Assistant] You know, in their brains, they're like, I'm 6'5, 275. And you're like, no, you're not. You're 6'1, 210, and you're a psycho. And that, there has to be some sort of element. Bob Sanders was that way. Sometimes that's why it's shorter careers for these guys, because they just hit themselves out.


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[Assistant] To play that position, I do think you have to be that. He's a legit free safety.


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[Assistant] Phenomenal nickel corner flexibility to go along with it. And like I said, I thought his ability to accelerate his aggression were, were elite that way.


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[Assistant] I don't know if the size is, are people going to be scared of the 178 time frame, size frame and all that?


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[Assistant] To me, he's a borderline first round pick. I mean, again, if you, you know, I know...


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[Assistant] Honey Badger, he had the issues, so that's not a good example where people were a little scared of him. I can't even remember where he got drafted now that I think about it. I can't even remember where Honey Badger got drafted. But I would think Arderis Washington is, again, another guy I would say no way he would fall under the top 45 picks.


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[Assistant] He was third round because of the off the field stuff, right, and all that. So yeaah, I mean, I would be cool seeing this guy anywhere from 25 to 40. I think he could be in that range. I think he's a really special football player.


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[Assistant] You know, okay, wait, we have this type of safety already, so we don't need that guy or whatever. The one last thing I'll say with Ardarius Washington, there was one negative, because I don't think I hit on any negative.


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[Assistant] He can be over aggressive at his open field tackling of like, now he's a middle field safety and he flies down so aggressively that he almost gets down too far to where now there's a running back with a big hole, right?


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[Assistant] Like in that situation, hey, there's a situation where the guy hasn't got the hole and he goes like a rocket and that's where he's special. But in that situation now where the guy's through the hole and you're coming downhill, like stop a few yards shorter.


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[Assistant] So you just, and just sit there and wait. Play safe. And then play it safe and then just go make the tackle because your acceleration is off the charts good. Right. You know, that would be the only negative I found really on his film altogether.


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[Assistant] Now for number three. Yeah. Javon Holland from Oregon. Yeah.


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[Assistant] He plays Nickel the whole game. Alright? He's one of those guys where I'm talking about where I don't think


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[Assistant] I think they know he's not a true corner. I just think they go, he's too damn good. It's like Buddha Baker at Washington a few years ago, who's gonna be somewhat of my comparison here, to where they're just like, he's awesome at tackling and creating havoc.


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[Assistant] Too athletic. So let's put him here closer to the ball a little bit and make those kind of plays. And that's where Holland is like really damn good. 6'1", 196. So the size is real. It's got some square shoulders on him.


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[Assistant] Is a big time punt returner. Alright, so that says something about the athlete. Hey, you're at Oregon and they put you back to punt return.


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[Assistant] You can probably run then. I mean, Oregon's always got a little speed on their team. So I like that aspect about him. And then he's got, you know, legit physicality. Again, this is a guy I look at can be a free safety, can be the strong safety in the box.


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[Assistant] If you wanted to put him at nickel to be a big nickel and hey, this team runs the ball a lot and they got a bigger slot kind of guy, he can do it. He's got tightness in the hips. He's not going to be great at, you know, opening and flipping his hips and doing all that stuff. He's a little bit of that straight line guy we talk about. No, it's going to be a little bit more like, oh, I got to turn and run.


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[Assistant] And then he's gonna turn and run and take off that way, right? Just to give an example of that.


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[Assistant] You know, the way he sets the edge in the run game takes on lead blockers or just diagnoses the play and it's coming at him and he just goes, I know there's a guy to come and block me, but I'm just going to turn on the afterburners and run right by him and go blow the running back up in the backfield. You know, that's to me where I came away.


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[Assistant] He has legit downhill speed and legit physicality in his run game to me to where, that's where, you know, you gotta look at the player and go, okay yeaah, he plays nickel for Oregon. He's not a nickel corner, that's not what he is. You can get away with him there a little bit, but I think ultimately,


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[Assistant] I'm trying more times than not to find guys that are for, I want guys that are there for everybody. I'm looking at it through the traditional lens. You know, it's probably why last year I put Kyler Duggler there because I thought it was a limited safety group.


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[Assistant] I didn't love that, oh, he's a specialist, we're gonna bring him into cover tight ends, right, and do that type of stuff. That's also where, you know, Jeremy Chin is a little different. Jeremy Chin basically played linebacker last year for the Carolina Panthers. He didn't really play safety.


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[Assistant] So, that to me is a different guy, a little bit. Yeaah, this is, I think really all the guys I have in the top five


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[Assistant] Anybody who needs a safety no matter their scheme can live with these guys. No doubt about it. I mean this is, this is, you know, you could say Buddha Baker at the line of scrimmage.


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[Assistant] I could also sit here and go, he's Jimmy Ward, the first round pick for the 49ers a few years ago. Again, the same kind of thing though, free safety. Oh, we'll put him a nickel here cause he helps with the run game and he can do all that type of stuff. That's to me the kind of player he is, except he's faster and bigger than Jimmy Ward was coming out.


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[Assistant] You know, the way he runs reminded me of Devon McCourty and that's when he plays free safety a little bit and you get to see the traditional safety looks.


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[Assistant] Where I go, yeaah, it's, it's damn good. Devon McCourty got moved from corner as a first round corner because his hips weren't great. He was a little bit of like,


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[Assistant] Oh no, I need to turn and run. And then I go. That's what I do. And that's where Javon Holland is the same way. And at free safety, you can get away with being like that. You know, again, yeaah, I'd love to have a free safety that's real loose and can turn his flips that way and everything like that. But it's not as imperative at the cornerback position. Free safety, strong safety, nickel versatility.


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[Assistant] And uhm, he's a hitter. Like I said, the biggest weakness is the hips. And there's some wasted steps because he's kind of a bigger square guy up front.


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[Assistant] To where, yeaah, he's not perfect in and out of breaks and breaking in the ball and things like that. There is some wasted movement there and that's why I ultimately come back and go, no, I know he was a nickel in college, this guy is a safety in the NFL.


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[Assistant] Like, I think Holland's a first round safety, just so we say that, okay, to get that out there.


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[Assistant] This kid is definitely a first round safety. Alright, the first guy I'm going to say, does anybody pay attention to the Pro Bowl? And he might have even been all Pro this year. I know it was the Chris Simms all Pro team. This guy is Jesse Bates. Jesse Bates from the Cincinnati Bengals who came from Wake Forest a few years ago. That's who he is. Alright? And again, here's another guy that plays nickel.


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[Assistant] Alright, it's a nickel guy, but I think a lot because of the same reasons we just said with Holland. They just go, he's too damn good to have him 25 yards playing free safety all the time. And I have a question here.


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[Assistant] The hips and the tightness thing that way, you know.


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[Assistant] Unlike some of the corners we talked about and all that, again, they could be in these positions and do all this. This guy at times is like, is like, he's playing and the guy's coming out of it and there's no turning the head, it's kind of just like, oh, oh.


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[Assistant] Wait, he's gonna go that way? Oh no, he went that way, right? And that's to me not a nickel legit cover corner, right? That's not what that is. So, that's where I say he's not a corner. And he's put in those positions at the Washington defense not because of his pure, his coverage ability is good,


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[Assistant] It's not great, I think it's his tackling ability and his ability to create havoc is why he's there. You know, and that's where he was unbelievable. Again, he's the best, he probably is the best open field tackler in the whole draft.


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[Assistant] I mean, as far as the DBs are concerned, he is amazing.


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[Assistant] I mean, cause he does, he breaks down and he waits for you to commit. And then you go this way, he just goes, boom, I can accelerate and I'll tackle you. You're not going by me. And then of course he has the


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[Assistant] The physicality and the kamikaze style that I talked about with Holland or Darius Washington or even, you know, the Florida kid where if he sees a hole or anything, he's going, he's gonna, he's got no regard for his body and he's gonna take you out. And that's where


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[Assistant] I was really blown away by this guy. I mean the acceleration that he has is, is up there with like the top corners or anybody in the draft with his ability to just go come downhill or if he does break


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[Assistant] This kid excites me more than Buda. Wow. Cause you liked him too. I like Buda. There's no doubt. I mean, I really did. And Buda sometimes they got inside the box a little bit more to blitz through A gaps and B gaps and do that.


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[Assistant] You know, so I guess there's maybe a hair more of a size physicality element to Buddha.


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[Assistant] And this kid, I want to say there's more of a pure speed and acceleration element.


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[Assistant] That's better than Buddha had. But still, you know, Buddha still could accelerate pretty good. And this kid still can take on blocks pretty good and be physical that way too. I think this kid actually excites me more than Buddha. I do. And that's saying something because I think Buddha is a baller. Think he goes in the teens?


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[Assistant] Hopefully we can talk about this like three, four weeks from now and I can get


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[Assistant] I mean, I think that the guy is, he's a top 25 pick for me for sure. I mean, that's the one thing I wrote. I just, I just don't know how.


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[Assistant] You know, that's possible when you really look at him. You know, again, I wrote the acceleration is the best of all the safeties. I wrote, I think he's at the worst, his speed is low for fours, maybe high for threes.


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[Assistant] You know, let me just see, it's just some, uh, uh, you know, I wrote a Honey Badger thing and then I came to the Jesse Bats.


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[Assistant] You know, I said he has plenty of raw ability to be a nickel cornerback, you know? But the hips are the question. But everything else is wow. Alright? And he's a ball hawk. Who's physical in all areas of the game.


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[Assistant] Twitchy as hell, the side to side movements are really good just as far as like, oh I gotta go this way, oh wait, let me get over here to avoid the blocker and still get to the open field tackle. That was all real real...


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[Assistant] Cisco to me is, I mean, so you're right. The way I talk about molding is special. And you're right. I love me some molding.


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[Assistant] Cisco, first off, Cisco's faster straight away. I'm gonna say he's faster. I'm gonna say he's got better hips as a free safety and doing that type of stuff as well. Now he doesn't play that nickel position. This again, it's a traditional, it's free safety, strong safety type of stuff. But Cisco is 6 foot 209, 210.


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[Assistant] To me, this is more like Jamal Adams-ish, right? Maybe not quite as big as Jamal, but I think he beats Jamal in a race all day long.


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[Assistant] You know, so that's where I look at it. Do you trust him doing as many things? I, I, yes. I think he can do just as many things as Jamal Ken. He's, this guy to me is a really, really special talent.


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[Assistant] And I, and, and I, I wrote, I mean, I think looking on film, this guy's a 4'3 speed type of guy. I mean, it's that kind of speed. For safety, that's a big time. It's big. And a 2'09 or 2'10 and whatever that is. You know, and also,


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[Assistant] You know, again, like, some of the ranged stuff is really special. I mean, I can't even remember what game it was, if it was...


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[Assistant] You know, backpedal, okay, he's turning to his left and kind of in a side run and now the quarterback flips over to the other side and he can flip his hips and now he turns it on and goes and picks the ball off on like a post-route or something like that.


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[Assistant] That to me was really, really special. His range as a free safety, I think was the best out of anybody.


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[Assistant] You know, and that's saying something at his size too. Because...


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[Assistant] You know, his hips were every bit as good as the kid from TCU, Ardarius Washington, but that guy's way smaller. And I would say this guy's got


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[Assistant] He's faster. His speed is better. And then you talk about, you know, again,


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[Assistant] I'm into the physicality, the no hesitation, anything like that. He's a killer. He's an absolute killer, this kid.


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[Assistant] Now, it can be maybe his one issue at times. He can be a hair over aggressive that way, but not in a bad way to me at all. The ball skills. The ball skills are really damn good. They are. Now, there's a few plays on film


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[Assistant] Where he gets beat in coverage and stuff, right? But he's like playing 10 yards off, 15 yards off against a good slot receiver, a good receiver, and


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[Assistant] It's like, I just want to go, well, I don't, I don't know what you expect. Nobody's going to succeed in that position. You're going to ask a guy to just sit here 10, 15 yards off and let a receiver just run full speed right at him and he can go either way like one false move and you're done.


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[Assistant] And to me, that's, you know, again, people are gonna look at that and go, woah, you gotta be like that. And I go...