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[Assistant] The bathrooms are typically on two sides of the building. The windows are these kind of weird office windows. They are not set up for living. They can be converted, but it is a massively expensive undertaking.


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[Assistant] And really the only reason somebody would undertake it is if they lost so much money on office rents falling so far that they eventually decided they really had no other option.


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[Assistant] It is definitely easy to overstate it. And I should note that the city has come back a lot from where it was, say, a year ago. It remains the national laggard, as Emma said. But maybe instead of thinking about how they can attract the next set of companies,


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[Assistant] They'll start thinking about how to fix some of those affordable housing problems.


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[Assistant] And so even though it's going to be a really difficult period, even though there's going to be plunging tax revenue and all sorts of questions about how to deal with these buildings, I think that the opportunity to kind of


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[Assistant] In a sense, getting the chance to solve those problems is what's going to create the next thriving city.


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[Assistant] The Silicon Valley tech boom has boosted San Francisco's economy, but it has also pushed housing costs sky high.


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[Assistant] High rents. The average apartment rental is now $3400 a month, the highest in the country.


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[Assistant] But nothing, nothing right now suggests they were related to China's spy balloon program or that there were surveillance vehicles from other, any other country.


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[Assistant] If any object presents a threat to the safety and security of the American people, I will take it down.


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[Assistant] I have today declared that the coronavirus presents a public health emergency in the United States.


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[Assistant] The United States government will implement temporary measures to increase our abilities to detect and contain the coronavirus proactively and aggressively.


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[Assistant] Benzenhurst, Brooklyn, 1985. Before the hit on Paul.


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[Assistant] Benzenhurst, Brooklyn, 1985. Before the hit on Paul.


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[Assistant] There is just one little itty bitty teeny tiny problem with the governor's idea. It's illegal.


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[Assistant] Uhm, my name is Olga Brezul and I'm 40 years old.


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[Assistant] I'm currently based in Vienna because, as you know, Ukraine is still under shelling and I gave a promise to my husband that I will protect our daughter. She's nine years old. Her name is Zakharia.


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[Assistant] And he asked me to stay for a while somewhere in a safe place.


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[Assistant] We were kids, we were 23 years old, and as usual you need some time to understand that this guy is good for you, yeah? But like I was really surprised that we have so many common favorite things. I mean music, film, books, uh, art.


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[Assistant] Can you imagine your job before the war? Uhm, I'm actually film curator. I've organized film festival. And Vyta, he was a film editor on different artistic films. And actually it was a quite strong blue for us. It's like our, uhm, uhm, how to say it?


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[Assistant] But it's not like that point of history when he can wait and to hesitate.


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[Assistant] And we met in Rivne. I came from Vienna. We spent together three days and it was a very happy moment in my life because I took my daughter and it was actually our last meeting.


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[Assistant] To cry during these three days, like because you don't know when you will have, this meeting will happen again.


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[Assistant] A desire to catch this feeling of our normal life before the Russian invasion.


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[Assistant] Teenagers and among all this normal reality, you and your husband in a military form.


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[Assistant] And only the sounds of sirens somehow remind you that it's war, right?


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[Assistant] But he told me that, uh, he's trying to be strong, that he's really...


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[Assistant] Believe that he will come back home, that he will hold me in Zaharia, that I should believe that he will come back.


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[Assistant] And sometimes he even apologized that he can't support me at this moment, that he had to be on the war.


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[Assistant] He never told me anything about the chance of his death.


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[Assistant] He always told me that he will come back and he promised me that everything will be okay in future, that I have to believe in this.


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[Assistant] And didn't receive anything. And during the whole day I was sending him messages, Peter, please send me this plus, just something, tell me because you do not answer me. And I had this terrible feeling that maybe something happened.


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[Assistant] Because he, I even can say that he died because of this, uh, missile attack.


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[Assistant] When I got this call, it was maybe the most terrible and terrifying call in my life. I had also to tell this news.


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[Assistant] The 17 year anniversary. And now I will never have New Year anymore.


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[Assistant] And, uh, next day I got this, uh, message.


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[Assistant] When Vita was on the front line on the...


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[Assistant] Was right to go to the frontline and to defend Ukraine and that he...


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[Assistant] Asks Sasha to tell me that Peter loves me because he can't send this message to me in order not to...


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[Assistant] Make me panic, you know, because he still all the time try to create the atmosphere that he will come back.


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[Assistant] Conducting what ended up being a 13 hour search of his personal home in Wilmington, Delaware.


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[Assistant] Literally combing through every nook and cranny and every room and office and garage and closet looking for any indication of additional classified documents that might have been there improperly and in fact, they did find them.


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[Assistant] And for those keeping count, this is now the fifth time in about let's say three months that classified documents have been found in President Biden's possession in places where they just shouldn't be.


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[Assistant] Absolutely, and the amazing thing is what has ended up transpiring is exactly what they had hoped to head off when they discussed how to handle the discovery of these documents at the very beginning of this situation.


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[Assistant] Right, so there's been a lot of reporting about this over the last couple of weeks. What we had decided was that we would look at a very specific period of time as this has all developed. And that is what we found to be the 68 days between when the first set of documents were discovered in early November of last year.


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[Assistant] And in essence, what we found was that the president and a very, very small circle of legal and political advisors had decided that they could


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[Assistant] Settle the matter quickly and quietly if they were super cooperative with the Department of Justice at every turn. Answer every question the investigators might want. Really everything they could do to stand in contrast to the way former President Trump had handled a similar investigation into classified documents.


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[Assistant] What the Biden administration thought was if they did the opposite, they cooperate fully with the department.


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[Assistant] Right, but it turned out that they committed a series of miscalculations. They miscalculated how many documents would ultimately be found.


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[Assistant] They miscalculated the way the Department of Justice would respond, and ultimately they miscalculated the way in which people would see President Biden's handling of documents versus President Trump's.


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[Assistant] They did immediately send the documents to the National Archives which keeps these kinds of government papers. The National Archives informed the Department of Justice.


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[Assistant] But it wasn't until about November 9th or 10th that the Justice Department then gets back in touch with the President's lawyers.


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[Assistant] And the decision was, we're going to completely cooperate, but we're going to be quiet. We are not going to make anything about this public.


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[Assistant] Yeah, a natural moment to tell the public and something pretty significant, especially in the light of the investigation that was going on to his predecessor, right? So it's hard to imagine that at that moment they didn't at least have a sense of the importance that this could be.


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[Assistant] So their explanation now of those early decisions was that they essentially were trying to follow scrupulously all of the


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[Assistant] And tried to explain what had happened in the president's actions. Folks at the Justice Department would see that.


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[Assistant] Right. I mean, it does, to a degree. I mean, there's no question that Department of Justice prefers to do these kinds of investigations quietly. It makes it easier to find the right people to talk to. They don't have to compete with the swirl of news every day.


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[Assistant] But at the end of the day, the White House had to make that decision themselves. Are they going to inform the public? Because it's ultimately a public relations call to make, and that was the one they made, to stay silent.


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[Assistant] Right, they could have done that in November and they chose not to.


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[Assistant] So the next moment comes just before Christmas on December 20th, the president's lawyers having


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[Assistant] We hoped that the Justice Department would say, hey, we finished our inquiry, this is nothing, we're gonna go away, and that hasn't happened. The Justice Department is still looking into the case. And the President's lawyers decide, you know what, it's probably time to search


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[Assistant] The president and those same aides decide we're gonna continue with our strategy. Cooperation and silence. We're not gonna tell the public.


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[Assistant] Well, so we don't have a real clear picture about who said what during that period, but what we do know is that much of the White House was cut out of even knowing what was going on at that point. So the broader kind of White House public relations machine that we all know, the communications staff, the press,


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[Assistant] Secretary and her staff, nobody knew what was going on at this point and so there was much less opportunity for that kind of full debate about what should be done and what they should say.


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[Assistant] And that ultimately comes back to be a problem for them when on January 9th...


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[Assistant] That does confirm that report from CBS but the White House confirms only the narrow report from CBS about that initial


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[Assistant] You can't stop these things from becoming a big media story, and yet they tried.


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[Assistant] Right. And in this case, the 68 days of silence, uh, has not worked out the way they'd hoped.


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[Assistant] Well, so everything that the president and the top aides around him had hoped wouldn't happen, well that happens pretty quickly.


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[Assistant] So, a few days later on January 11th, there are more news reports that leak out, this time about the discovery of that second trove of documents back in December.


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[Assistant] Huge embarrassment for the Biden administration. Makes them look like what they had done, which was hold back information.


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[Assistant] Then the following day, January 12th, the Department of Justice comes out.


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[Assistant] Attorney General Merrick Garland says, look, we've been investigating President Biden and these documents.


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[Assistant] But now we're going to be appointing a special counsel to look into this. It's a much more formal investigation to what happened. It's a move that is often done when the attorney general feels like there's so much politics swirling around a case like this that you need somebody much more independent to conduct the investigation.


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[Assistant] How seriously the Department of Justice would take a case like this and they miscalculated that there would ever be a world in which the Department of Justice could just look the other way in Biden's case while simultaneously investigating President Trump.


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[Assistant] Yes, and from there things got even worse for President Biden a couple of days later on January 14th.


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[Assistant] The lawyers for the president found even more documents, uh, during a search of the president's library, uh, just adding to both the substantive total number of documents that had been found and to the sense of a kind of drip, drip, drip in which the president and his team don't look like they're being forthcoming.


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[Assistant] Yeah, much of that remains opaque at this point. We don't know details about what the documents actually are, why they are classified, what level of classification that have been stamped on them. The president's personal lawyer said over the weekend that investigators had seized six more items on Friday.


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[Assistant] So we know that there were many fewer documents found in President Biden's possession than there were down at Mar-a-Lago in President Trump's possession.


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[Assistant] President Trump, the documents were obviously from his presidency, which were much more recent.


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[Assistant] Right. You know, but, but in the end, no matter what level of classification and no matter how old they are, there are documents that should be handled properly and are going to be important to the Justice Department no matter what.


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[Assistant] I mean look, the folks that we've talked to inside the White House discuss this as a sort of long term versus short term strategy.


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[Assistant] Yes, in the immediate days and weeks, fingers are being pointed, a lot of media attention being paid to this in a way they would obviously have preferred to avoid, but they argue that in the long run, it will be


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[Assistant] The sharpest distinction they could with how former President Donald Trump handled it will ultimately end up to be a really good PR move as well.


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[Assistant] They will be seen as having made the proper choices to cooperate, uh, even if that meant that they took a PR hit, whereas the former president, Mr. Trump, will have been seen to be taking a different path.


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[Assistant] I think that what it does reveal about this White House is how they see themselves.


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[Assistant] The president sees himself as one of the good guys, coming into office after President Trump. And I think ultimately that sense of self governs how President Biden and his top aides, how they behave and how they behaved in this case.


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[Assistant] You know, I think they really thought that given that view of themselves, that the justice department, the investigators, ultimately the public, when they found out, we're going to essentially shrug and say, you know, this is a kind of minor infraction, a minor incident and let's move on.


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[Assistant] It's gonna be a tremendous thing for the American people. It's gonna be fantastic for the economy.


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[Assistant] Look Cory, it's a beautiful morning here in Utah. It is. Yeaah, we both get to see the same sunrise. Yeaah, that's amazing. Yeaah.


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[Assistant] The only thing I had was a little bit of dryness for a while.


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[Assistant] My left eye is still perfect. When I go to the optometrist, he's like, I cannot believe how good your left eye is.


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[Assistant] In Utah right now. You did bring your bow, so. I did. You should be getting practiced up, or are you just carrying it around? I'm just carrying it.


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[Assistant] Talking to me. Yeah, I sure wish I'd be... I see every once in a while you do these sweepstakes to win a haunt and I'm like, well yeaah.


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[Assistant] If you become a member or renew or upgrade, starting September 1st, I think it'll run through October 31st, uh,


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[Assistant] Yeah, it's fun just hanging out at these events, telling stories and hearing everybody's stories.


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[Assistant] Yeah, so, but anyhow, uh, between all the emails I read this morning that came in through the Elk Talk podcast and then questions at events like this, uh,


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[Assistant] Okay, and how long does your archery season run? Through September 30th. I think Colorado this year is like September 2nd through...


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[Assistant] And then they always ask me calling questions. I'm like, why are you asking me? Ask Cory. Go find him. He's over at the prime tent over there.


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[Assistant] Yeah, it was hot up there, but, uh, you know, I'm coming to your lovely state of Idaho.


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[Assistant] Yeah, that's the plan, but I've been doing a lot of e-scouting. And actually, when we, when I flew out of Bozeman yesterday, I flew right over there, and I'm like, well.


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[Assistant] Yeah, I'll check that out. So, I mean, obviously I'll do a lot of calling, but...


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[Assistant] In Montana anyhow, you know, not too far away from where I'll be hunting.


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[Assistant] Most of the calling you do early in the season like that don't expect a lot of responses and expect a lot out to come in quiet and silent. Is that your experience also?


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[Assistant] Tell people from about late August to maybe September 10th or 12th.


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[Assistant] We're talking about going from early season to peak rut in two weeks maybe. That is the most rapid transition in the life of a bull elk of any two week period in the whole year.


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[Assistant] Maybe they'll come in here to water. If you can find a wallow or just through tracks, you can see places where they're watering. But, you know, I'm going to be so well watered.


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[Assistant] If that's indicative of what the antler growth is like in Arizona and New Mexico and Utah and Nevada. Yep. Hold on folks. Could be some records.


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[Assistant] Pretty excited to have a late rifle tag in Arizona this year. Looking at that as like, oh my goodness. I mean, yeah, those every year, those commissioner, governor, whatever tags, they do end up getting the best of the best because they, you know, usually have people out all the time, but still.


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[Assistant] He remembers from last fall. Bet he's had a sweet eye for me. Or maybe Fred isn't over there. Maybe Fred is in his unit and just keeps whooping on him. He's like, you know what, I'm going over here. Tom's not as tough as Fred.


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[Assistant] I don't know, it makes you wonder, right, the randomness of that of where they go and what they do and why some of them go this way and some of the bowls go a different direction.


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[Assistant] Really be, their location is really driven by the forage. Maybe you're seeing some water sources and stuff, but just know if you're keeping an eye on a group of bulls.


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[Assistant] Too many times, and this is a question that somebody had, uh, if you think elk are coming in silent, how long do you stay somewhere once you call? Because I got ants in my pants and a lot of times if one does come in, they've come in silent.


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[Assistant] I should have known that. How many times am I going to have to mess this up before I pay attention? So.


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[Assistant] Yeah, your peak rut. You're in for a treat. Yeah. Uh, so, uh, the place that, how it works in Kentucky is,


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[Assistant] That felt great, but just don't know if there's gonna be a lot of people in there.


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[Assistant] So, that'll be fun and then after that I switched to my old comfort zone of rifle hunting.


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[Assistant] I'd say in the West anymore, it seems like, until about September 20th, it can be cooking.


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[Assistant] Cause they, they just show up and already this month in Montana.


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[Assistant] I hope it never happens. I just don't need that, that headache, but you gotta be prepared for it. And uh, that's why like, you know, about mid November, there's enough snow and cold that it's like, alright.


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[Assistant] Marking my days. I'm like alright. And I went out there and no one had rented this cabin yet. And you could rent that day and it lets you I think rent.


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[Assistant] Nevada starts her first come first serve with Montana just issued her.


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[Assistant] Hand it out, I don't know what you'd call it, the priority list. In other words, here's where you're at in line. And for the out tags every year, we, we usually have return tags where if you're in the three hundreds, most years you're going to be in the running.


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[Assistant] So, trying to think, I don't think Wyoming has one of those systems.


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[Assistant] I'm not sure what Arizona does if there's return tags. Why anyone would return an Arizona tag, I don't know. I know Utah has an alternate system where they just keep going to the next person on the list because in 2014 that's how I got an archery tag in Utah.


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[Assistant] Well, I'm, I check, yeaah, I want to be on the alternate list for every one of them. If there's an out tag, uh,


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[Assistant] So, it's kinda late in the game right now for people if they don't have a tag. It's like, mmm.


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[Assistant] You know, you're the ones who voted for it. You should have maybe decided, is anyone going to give us any wolves? You can have them, but where are you going to get them? But no, if you guys want some grizzly bears, we got it. We'll send you three or four hundred of those. Just tell us where we are.


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[Assistant] He's gotta be getting frustrated with his attorneys or embarrassed by him because now the 10th Circuit said, you can't appeal this because you left one thing hanging out there that you didn't address. That's this, there was a waypoint that was shown to be on his land.


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[Assistant] So they added that as part of the original case and then they said, well, we, we, you know, let's just ignore that. Well, the 10th circuit has said, you can't just ignore that. You got to decide, are you dropping that or not dropping that? And, uh, so,


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[Assistant] You're about to hand it to you. You got summary judgment issued against you. So that's never good. I mean, summary judgment is, that's like, we don't need, you don't even need a jury. Here are the facts. Let the judge apply the law and the judge said, Mr. Landowner, you


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[Assistant] Other judges might listen and say, yeah, for right now, that's what we agree with, but they don't have to.


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[Assistant] All of those are federal laws, and they go through the federal courts, and there's a reason the Ninth Circuit is based in San Francisco. There's a reason why a lot of these cases, the


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[Assistant] Other side, the plaintiff won it in the ninth circuit. The ninth circuit is known to be


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[Assistant] The Supreme Court's like, you people, what are you guys out there smoking in the Ninth Circuit? Uh, but that, you know, a lot of people get mad, oh damn, feds, you know, the feds as well. Like in the case of Grizzly Bear delisting,


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[Assistant] The U of S Fish and Wildlife Service has three times now.


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[Assistant] De-listed grizzly bears. The federal scientists and biologists are like, there's enough of them, please. There's too many of them. Take them over states. We want Montana, Idaho, and Wyoming to take over management of these. And they get sued. And they end up in federal court.


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[Assistant] And, uh, through some whatever little piece that they can find, they find a judge who says, yeah, we agree with you that this delisting ruling is null and void until some, until you can prove otherwise.


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[Assistant] Well everyone gets mad. Oh they're damn feds. It is not.


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[Assistant] Uh, just know your frustrations shouldn't be focused on the biologist or the federal US Fish and Wildlife.


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[Assistant] We're just telling you that with a 95% confidence, we can tell you there's at least that many.


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[Assistant] We're stuck with them. It's the reality of our time, so we have to sort out, okay, how do we support conservation and habitat and other things that...


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[Assistant] An hour ago, Cory, and I'm- And talked to hundreds of people yesterday, and-


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[Assistant] Get your feet in shape. Because your feet are what's gonna get you where you need to go. You show me a guy who shows up with his feet already calloused and in shape and the muscles in his ankles and calves and knees ready for side heeling and down heeling and up heeling.


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[Assistant] That hunter's gonna kill some elk. You get me some hyper...


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[Assistant] You're bound to kill an elk. You probably need, don't dare sleep in a wall tent. Oh yeaah. Well come and tear your tent up. That's right. The sounds of it.


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[Assistant] He is definitely a user. When it gets hot like this and I get dehydrated, I just, water is great, but I gotta, I need more than just water.


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[Assistant] Talk about it. Yea, Jake sent us an email and I'm like, I'm sure Corey will take care of this. Oh, did he send us an email?


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[Assistant] Yeah, I took the stairs and Cory's like, well, I better take, if you're taking them, I better take them too. And I thought he's.


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[Assistant] Yeah, I looked, I've got 1300 unread emails that I got to take care of. The good part is more than half of them I'm sure should have went into my spam bin, but.


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[Assistant] Other than that, I've been shooting my bow. Arm doing good? Yea. Amazing how many people come up and ask me.


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[Assistant] I've been doing so much traveling this summer with events like this. I love doing them, but it...


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[Assistant] It gets in the way of getting my work done. My wife would say, well no, you get in your way to getting your work done.


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[Assistant] I feel like I put myself on the spot by trying to teach something. It's like, you really gotta think this stuff through. You do. You know, and the questions came up of, okay, and this was one that I'd be interested in. I said I wish Cory was here to answer this. Which is kind of a default way of saying, alright, maybe I'm making this up.


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[Assistant] I'm not making it up, I'm just telling people how I do it, but that means I don't have a lot of confidence in how I do it. They're like, you know, a lot of times, Elk are moving away from you.


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[Assistant] And, you know, you're two or three bowls and you just can't ever get that.


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[Assistant] That real vocal bowl to come back and I'm like, yup, that's true. Because usually he's, if you're hearing two or three bowls.


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[Assistant] It's usually one bull pushing a group of cows. Might be only three cows or it might be a dozen cows. And he's got a couple guys trying to take him away from him.


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[Assistant] He's gonna turn around and come back to you. Right. I'm like, so you just gotta kinda satisfy yourself that you're probably not gonna catch him, but those other two guys, they've probably got themselves worked up into a frenzy here, so maybe work on those two. And do them.


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[Assistant] And I explained, I said, you know, the reason, there's a couple of reasons why he's heading uphill in the morning. One.


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[Assistant] And take them to their bed. And this is a part that...


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[Assistant] I think we as humans don't give enough credit to is these elk live on that mountain or in that foothill country, wherever it is.


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[Assistant] A warm day with the thermal coming up, but a slightly northwest wind. They know exactly where to go bad.


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[Assistant] If you go over here and I go over there and you go down there and he goes up here, we got it pretty well covered. We're gonna need to see or smell it. And so, we as humans, I think,


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[Assistant] And they're gonna take a different path to get there. Yeah. And if it's, if the thermals might stay the same, but if the prevailing is out of the southwest versus the north,


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[Assistant] Yeaah. So, at that thing, the questions you get are very specific to scenarios.


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[Assistant] They cause me to think a lot, and I wonder if the scenario they're explaining is really the scenario I'm understanding.


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[Assistant] If you want to pick up some tips.


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[Assistant] Well, if you only watched an hour a day between now and when the archery season starts, I don't know if you'd get through the University of Alconning.


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[Assistant] So go out to OutdoorClass.com because the University of Outcoming, that's where you get it now. Plus you get all the other outdoor class stuff.


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[Assistant] Elk Talk podcast, it saves them 20. Elk Talk. Yep. Elk Talk. Elk Talk promo code. Saved you 20%. Yeah. I think something like that. Uh, but, and then you've also got a bunch of other calling stuff. Yeah. On outdoor class.


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[Assistant] Anyhow, this, we get a lot of these questions and I know people sound like I'm trying to...


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[Assistant] Well, I think we've covered a few topics. Yeah. And, uh, hopefully people keep sending in more of them. Yep. And, uh, hopefully they're getting ready for, for hunting season.


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[Assistant] I think it's his way of saying, Marcus has a sheep tag and he's been hiking since he found out about that in early mid-May.


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[Assistant] I don't wanna, as Michael's saying, I don't wanna have to follow Marcus. I'd rather follow you. That's a very smart decision on Michael's part. So. Just make him pay.


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[Assistant] Guilty. Yep. Well folks, thanks for being here. I hope you have as much fun as we do every day. You know, I often say that I'm the luckiest guy on the planet and my job is to get up every day and prove it. There you go. I like that. You don't prove it by whining and sniveling. You just gotta get up smiling.


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[Assistant] The goal is, what little you and I know about elk hunting, we


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[Assistant] The Elk Talk Podcast is brought to you by the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation, ensuring the future of elk, other wildlife, their habitat, and our hunting heritage. To become a member, go to rmef.org.


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[Assistant] The podcast is also brought to you by Gerber, uh, go to gerbergear.com and learn about the knives, the vital, the big game vital, the gauge premium, all the things that we use when we're out in the woods and not just knives, but also some really cool multi tools that they have.


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[Assistant] WorkDoc Podcast is also brought to you by GoHunt.com. Uh, go to GoHunt.com and sign up for the Insider. The Insider is changing how hunts and hunting information are found. No doubt about that.


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[Assistant] Use promo code ALKTOCK and when you do, when you sign up for the insider, you're going to get $50 of store credit, mad money, in their gear shop.


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[Assistant] Uh, Corey and I, we're, we lucked out and when we got in touch with you, you sent us your, your elk management plan for you guys running on a 15 year plan. We'll touch on a lot of that, but before we get into that,


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[Assistant] Can you give us the background of how in the heck you guys pulled it off in a state with as much private land, as much agriculture as you have, that you now have


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[Assistant] I don't know, 10, 12, 14 thousand elk. You probably don't want to tell how many elk you really have. You might have someone say you got too many.


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[Assistant] That makes sense, I never thought about it that way. Didn't they come from a multitude


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[Assistant] How hard is it to transport alco from Oregon or Utah or somewhere? I mean, it seems like you throw them in a horse trailer and they gotta get out and stretch and water and take care of their business once in a while.


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[Assistant] Merriam's elk genetics in there, cause you lost all your eastern elk genetics, right, in the 1800s or whatever?


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[Assistant] That one you shot in Alaska, Cory, looking at the video of that, that's like the biggest, that thing looked like, you ever seen a wood tick swelled up on a summer bear? You know, they're all grey, they've got so much, they've ingested so much blood, they've just got these little feeler fingers out there.


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[Assistant] That's what your bull elk in Alaska look like. Those Kentucky ones sound like another kind of wood tick on a summer bear.


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[Assistant] So, now as that successional process continues,


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[Assistant] Is, is a controlled burn feasible in the dense areas of the east? Like, I mean, it's a common tool out here in the west, but we don't have the population densities and we have different landscapes.


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[Assistant] Yeaah. That it exists and now I'll just go out on the BLM or the forest service and you get to your part of the world, Gabe, and it's like, alright, we don't have that luxury, so how do we get creative? We can wish for a different reality, but here's the reality we're dealing with. And, uh, that's interesting.


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[Assistant] So does that represent an opportunity for you where you can come in and say, Hey, you have this property. Times are kind of tough in your industry. Here's some ways we can work with you to.


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[Assistant] Maybe get more utility out of the property for lack of a better way of saying it.


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[Assistant] Oh man, I must be sending you the wrong $10 bill with my application.


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[Assistant] Isn't your deadline April 30th? April 30th, so come on. I'm just going to lie and say isn't your deadline June 4th?


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[Assistant] I would pick a Kentucky out. I'm hoping someday my $10 bill, uh, uh, you guys stream it online and I went for my name and it's.


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[Assistant] Don't develop some of these elaborate point schemes that the West has come up with. They're nothing but a house of cards, tilted in the favor of old gray-haired farts like me. And, uh, if Kentucky goes to a point system of any sort, I'm going to take back all the good things I've said about you, Gabe.


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[Assistant] So when, when you, uh, have this much private, uh, land, do you end up with a lot of conflicts, causes now that, you know, you got this robust elk herd? Are you ending up with having to address conflicts more than you thought about what you thought, some you didn't see coming?


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[Assistant] Move out within that recovery zone? Are there some areas that are still unoccupied?


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[Assistant] You've got elk everywhere. Do you dare tell the world how many elk you've got?


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[Assistant] Gabe, you guys have been kind of the seed stock for a lot of other relocations and augmentation of


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[Assistant] Some of the Easter now occurred and I wonder if people realize how important your


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[Assistant] CWD exempt or whatever you'd call it, non-CWD status is for the importance of having a disease-free L-Curd for the purposes of augmenting other populations.


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[Assistant] There's nothing in terms of wildlife restoration, relocation, translocation in my lifetime that even comes close to what you guys did in Kentucky.


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[Assistant] And what it's created. And I think about that, okay, I'm 57 years old and the last half century plus, this is the most remarkable wildlife project undertaken and completed in the last half century, at least probably longer.


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[Assistant] It's, uh, it's, for me anyhow, it's remarkable and it's a compliment to your agency, to all the states that helped out, the non-profit groups, the citizen volunteers, and if ever there's conservation in action, uh,


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[Assistant] Go read the Kentucky story or go watch the videos about the Kentucky story.


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[Assistant] I'll ask it for them. These, your elk in Kentucky, do they have the normal, uh, cycle of, you know, breeding, estrus, calving that we see out here where everything is probably going to peak?


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[Assistant] You know, plus or minus a few days of mid September and the calving peak, it's going to be, you know, late May, early June.


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[Assistant] Well Cory, you gotta promise me this, if you ever draw an out tag in Kentucky, you'll let me come along and just be the camp cook or something.


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[Assistant] I just hate to deprive you of the chance to come and, you know, call in a big bull elk in Kentucky.


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[Assistant] Uh, get a better use of your land and, and share this resource, uh, will make it worth your while, uh, and the public benefits because, you know, in a place with that much private land, how else, what else would you do?


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[Assistant] So do you guys have any state wildlife management areas that, I mean, I know you said you only have like a few thousand acres of needed land. Do you have other properties that you lease or you can otherwise? We do.


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[Assistant] Well, that's too bad, because now that the Land and Water Conservation Fund is fully funded and fully appropriated to the tune of $900 million, I think we need to start nominating some Kentucky projects for that funding.


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[Assistant] Well, rumor has it that you guys are working on one of those to the tune of 55,000 acres. Am I allowed to? I mean, am I?


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[Assistant] Unbelievable in my head because I know how hard it would be to do 55,000 acres in the vast west landscapes. And then you put that.


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[Assistant] Yeah, so that's, I think it's a testament to your agency thinking about these things and being creative. And, uh, when you talk to agency people, a lot of folks are like, oh, those folks in Kentucky, they're, they're thinking about stuff. They're, they're not afraid to experiment. And I think the results you guys have.


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[Assistant] And what you can show for your work on a very complicated public-private ownership, mostly private.


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[Assistant] Uh, supports the position of respect that your peers in the agency world have for what you guys have accomplished.


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[Assistant] What's the future of elk look like, or management of elk, whatever you want to talk about. You know, it's always hard to predict what's over the horizon a year or two or five years, but you must have some idea of what's coming down the pipe.


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[Assistant] That puts a lot of value on what how it represents and how much they're contributing to this state.


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[Assistant] You know, Gabe, one of these episodes gets about 50,000 downloads in the first week, so you've probably got 50,000 new applicants. Awesome.


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[Assistant] We're going to get blamed, Cory, if the number of applicants goes anywhere north of 100,000, which you said it was last year, Gabe.


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[Assistant] Okay, so if it breaks the hundred, Gauri and I are gonna get all the grief over that.


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[Assistant] Well, one other part to this is you've mentioned RMEF quite a few times and I'm sure there's been plenty of partners that helped out. Uh, Corey and I are big advocates for being members of RMEF. Uh, is it fair to say RMEF was one of the critical forces behind the


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[Assistant] The effort to, to help you guys get to where you are today.


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[Assistant] You know, I think RMEF at times gets criticism. Why are you messing around with elk in the east? Well, this is why.


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[Assistant] Because it's such a highlight event. It's the right thing to do. It creates vested interest in wild things that people maybe had


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[Assistant] I would have never dreamed that as a young person, that we'd have as many elk across the landscape, not just in terms of number, but in terms of different locations, as we do today.


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[Assistant] Well, we're grateful and fortunate for all the people who have had their shoulder to the wheel for


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[Assistant] More than just the 25 years at Elk have been on your landscape. You know, there's a lot of planning and coordination and, uh, you know, building support.


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[Assistant] Uh, before that ever happened and here we are the beneficiaries of it. I think that's, that's always been remarkable to me is how in the hunting world there is this view of the next generation and the next generation and it,


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[Assistant] For me, it goes back to when I read about Roosevelt and all of his speeches. He'd talk about those yet in the womb of time or, you know, the hunter yet unborn and, uh,


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[Assistant] There's going to be people 30 years from now chasing elk in Kentucky who were those hunters in the womb of time.


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[Assistant] Well Gabe, I, uh, you know, I got a pretty busy fall this year, but you know, I could probably clean that slate a little bit if, uh, if you needed some help packing your elk out or something. Okay, alright.


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[Assistant] Corey is, if you join the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation at rmef.org, Corey will not call for you, but he promises you'll shoot more elk this year. Or maybe not this year.


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[Assistant] Welcome to the Elk Talk Podcast with Randy Newberg and Corey Jacobson presented by the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation.


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[Assistant] The Oak Dock Podcast is also brought to you


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[Assistant] And with that, Cory, we are ready to get into it. Let's jump into it.


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[Assistant] Welcome to the Elk Talk Podcast with Randy Newberg and Corey Jacobson presented by the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation.


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[Assistant] And with that, Cory, we are ready to get into it. Let's jump into it.


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[Assistant] I mean I, I've got a couple of buddies that, uh,


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[Assistant] The Elk Talk Podcast is brought to you by the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation, ensuring the future of elk, other wildlife, their habitat, and our hunting heritage. To become a member, go to rmef.org.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The podcast is also brought to you by Gerber, uh, go to gerbergear.com and learn about the knives, the vital, the big game vital, the gated premium, all the things that we use when we're out in the woods and not just knives but also some really cool multi tools that they have.


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[Assistant] Go to GoHaunt.com and sign up for the Insider. The Insider is changing how haunts and hunting information are found. No doubt about that. Use promo code ALKTOCK and when you do, when you sign up for the Insider, you're going to get $50 of store credit, mad money, in their gear shop.


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[Assistant] Hey Cory, how are you doing in Idaho today? I am doing wonderful. How are things in Montana? Are you in Montana?


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[Assistant] I'm in Montana, I got back from Alaska, uh, sleeping in a wet soggy tent for, well, it almost looked like I was doing a Corey and Donnie Elk Hunt, other than.


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[Assistant] We didn't have a big elk to carry off the mountain. Nobody in our camp was passing world class sized kidney stones.


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[Assistant] But we flew over the island of your Alaska Elk Hunt on our way out to this island and


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[Assistant] I asked the pilot, Doug, I'm like, you ever fly any elk hunters in over to that island?


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[Assistant] He's like, those elk are just way the hell up there, he said. And there's only this little lake he can get in and out of. You better have your stuff dialed in if you're going to do that.


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[Assistant] So, uh, that was his answer as to how many elk hunters he flies into that island. He said that's an exercise. He said, I've lived here all my life. He said, I grew up right in the shadow of that.


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[Assistant] And then he smiled and said something to the fact that, boy, I bet you that was a lot of fun.


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[Assistant] Uh, yeaah. I think if you would have called him to fly you in, you might have had to look for a new pilot. Yeaah. I think he would have declined your opportunity for business.


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[Assistant] Yeah, have you heard from many people who applied for that tag this year who said, Cory, what should I do?


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[Assistant] Well, uh, Colorado Elk results came out. I did a live event, uh, Tuesday night.


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[Assistant] And someone asked me, hey, did you or Cory draw elk in Colorado? And I said, yeah, Cory did. And then I'm like, oops, I don't know if I was supposed to say that.


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[Assistant] And fortunately one of the live event members two minutes later said, oh no, Corey posted on his Instagram or something. You're good. I'm like, boy, I don't.


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[Assistant] I don't want to be that guy who no one can trust with the, you know, important information. So I, I was a little worried there, but I...


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[Assistant] Not that I need to see your e-scouting plan, but it ought to make for an interesting e-scouting plan when you got elk that are


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[Assistant] 18 points Cory, that's, you know, you add up what that cost each year to build the point or, you know, the last few years we've had to buy the non-resident, what do they call it, the minimum license or something like that. Yeah, small game license. Yeah, a hundred bucks a point now in essence for Elk, so.


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[Assistant] In addition to your tag costs and your time and everything you're going to put into that, 18 years of being diligent, that's, uh, that's an investment you've made.


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[Assistant] Be those that we got. And one of the first questions was, I'm going to Colorado archery over the counter because I didn't draw. What week should I go? Should I go during the muzzleloader season? Should I? It's like, go whenever you feel is best.


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[Assistant] So, are these elk going to be migratory or non-migratory elk? Do you know?


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[Assistant] Yeah, because, you know, with all this drought stuff, you referred to it, but these elk on say, more arid country like Colorado might have in some of these areas, those elk disperse horizontally


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[Assistant] All of a sudden you'll have forage everywhere and they, they won't be in these tight little pockets and high densities like in a drought year. All of a sudden they'll be dispersed everywhere because they can take advantage of, of habitat pretty much equally across the landscape. And so.


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[Assistant] It'll be interesting to see what happens between now and your hunt and how you, how you pull that off.


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[Assistant] I don't think I've done a good enough job in my explanation of things to emphasize that when you're hunting the rifle seasons of post-rut and late season,


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[Assistant] Whereas when you're hunting or e-scouting for


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[Assistant] Pre-rut, peak-rut. It's kinda like here are general areas.


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[Assistant] I kinda knew that. But I just wanted to make sure that the audience understood that, uh, it's not like this is a friends and family sorta sweepstakes.


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[Assistant] Okay, I'm, I'm all about firearms. I mean, if, if there's a, people will email me, hey, should I buy a new rifle? I got this new tag or this tag I drew this year. And my first answer always is,


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[Assistant] That's just how it goes, you know. So, uh, Colorado is...


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[Assistant] If ever there's a time when hunting pressure, if you're going to learn about using hunting pressure to your advantage, go to one of the Colorado over the counter hunts. Boy, isn't that the truth.


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[Assistant] You will quickly learn how to use hunting pressure to your advantage, but every year there are people who go there and figure it out. So I never want to discourage anyone from doing it.


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[Assistant] We've, we've been down there, I think we filmed that hunt.


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[Assistant] If ever there's a haunt where I, you know, you often have heard me say you gotta have your opening day plan and then your rest of the season plan because when the shooting starts things change. Yup.


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[Assistant] To discuss and evaluate the allocation of resident and non-resident tags.


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[Assistant] I'm like, you know, I don't mind having some non-residents here, but do we have to have, you know, I think in some of the over count, over the counter hunts over half of the hunters are non-residents. Wow. Yeah. And so I think even with, uh, the, uh,


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[Assistant] So for some species, I think it's 20%. For some species, I think it's 35%, which is super generous because your state and my state.


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[Assistant] So it's kind of the track record and the trend lines you can look to.


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[Assistant] So that's about where Colorado was and when people talk about point creep.


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[Assistant] Two weeks ago, they threw out, kinda came out of left field, uh,


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[Assistant] This 9010 for Deer Alkan Antelope.


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[Assistant] If you are so inclined folks, you might want to politely and professionally


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[Assistant] You know, whatever they do with the non-resident 90-10 or leave it as 80-20 wherever they're at, you know, at 84-16. And if you don't like the idea of half or I think the number's been bouncing around 40 to 50% of the non-resident tags would go through outfitters.


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[Assistant] Here's the other thing that I, I track this stuff and when I post it out on my forum, I'm always surprised at how people are like, what? And here's what it is. Wyoming had 150,000 non-residents.


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[Assistant] In their elk system between those who applied this year with no points and those who have points. There's 150,000 non-residents.


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[Assistant] So in a state that gives away 7,250 non-resident out-tags by statute, you don't have to be


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[Assistant] A mechanical engineer like Cory or an accountant like Randy to do the math and say, well, there's still, okay, let's say they,


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[Assistant] 150,000, 7200 of them drew this year. So that leaves 140, let's round it to 143,000 people still in the Wyoming system.


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[Assistant] At 7250 tags a year, there's 19 years worth of people in the Wyoming system right now.


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[Assistant] And the overwhelming majority of them aren't even applying, they're just buying points. Yeaah.


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[Assistant] Yeah, so my point is pay attention folks to the actual number of point buyers.


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[Assistant] And a lot of these people have been in it, kind of like, you know, you said you've been buying points in Colorado for 18 years and this is the first time you applied.


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[Assistant] That is what you're seeing in Wyoming. A huge number of these double-digit point holders aren't even applying, so they're not showing up in last year's draw results.


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[Assistant] So don't be surprised when these people have been in it for 15, 17, you know, this year it'll be, well after this year's Draw the Max will be 17 points. When those people jump off the sidelines,


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[Assistant] Don't be surprised because they've been there for a long time. You just haven't been looking at them. And, uh, so, and then if they change things in Wyoming, they


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[Assistant] Yeah, and so we get 16% of the limited entry tags and then anything needed to get up to the 70, 250 gets thrown in the pot as general tags. Gotcha.


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[Assistant] But they're changing that. They're this task force I'm talking about. I think they already passed the idea to get rid of the Wyoming general tag and they're going to make it a region type tag like we have for deer. Like, you know, if you apply for region A for deer, you're up in those units in the northeast corner. If you apply for


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[Assistant] So it sounds like they're gonna switch the non-resident tag to that.


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[Assistant] And they're the non-resident general tag, and they're going to get rid of the cap of $7,250.


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[Assistant] And it's just going to be whatever number of tags each region is supposed to have, general tags. So.


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[Assistant] Which is why I am not a big fan of holding on to points.


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[Assistant] Yeah, I suspect there's a lot of people who sucker their spouse into moving to Wyoming and after the first winter it's, there's a for sale sign out on the.


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[Assistant] Out on the new house. But you know what the Wyoming listeners are saying right now? They're like, you hear that?


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[Assistant] Now, I don't, you know, wherever people end up, it's just a reality that the Intermountain West is having a huge population boom.


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[Assistant] That increase in hunting by, by residents.


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[Assistant] Colorado will have to put up with me next year because now I have, I think I got, I have two or three points. Uhm, two I think. Yeaah. And I'm going to try for a first season rifle hunt in Colorado. Even though it's, it's not a, you know, something where you're going to see big bulls or anything. There's just a lot fewer people in the woods. And that is, that's fine. Yeaah, because it's limited entry. So.


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[Assistant] But, uh, when are you guys in Idaho gonna draw your, your elk, deer and antelope stuff? Cause I'm, I'm waiting. You know, this is my year. I passed on moose in Idaho this year. I went back to deer, elk and antelope. Oh, did you?


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[Assistant] Well, I will be in Idaho for an outcome this year.


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[Assistant] Not of my own tag. You guys have this thing called super tags or whatever it's called? Super? Wait, is it super tag or super? Super tags, yeaah.


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[Assistant] Yeah, so my buddy of 30 some years, Scott Jones from Washoe Valley, Nevada.


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[Assistant] Drew one of your elk super tags. Wow. Yeah. That's a pretty good deal.


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[Assistant] Yeah, I knew he was having his other knee replaced and the moral of that story is don't be a mono or a mogul skier because by the time you get to 60 both knees will be replaced.


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[Assistant] He texts me while I'm at the airport in Petersburg, Alaska, like, you aren't gonna believe this.


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[Assistant] I'm kind of over-medicated today, so I hope that I understood this when they called me, but they told me that I have a super tag for Elk.


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[Assistant] Oh, yeaah. I mean, uh, so I'm gonna, wherever Scott decides to go, uh, I'll get to be in your fine state this fall.


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[Assistant] Hoping, hoping I get to pack out an elk, I'll be like, Scott, take it easy on those new knees, you need it for mogul skiing. Do you ski, Corey?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah. Well, when you get to be my age, you don't know how many seasons you got left. So why would you risk one of those few seasons you got left doing something like skiing? I mean, that's right up there with golf, you know. Except for I don't know how badly you're going to get hurt in golf.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Who was on your team? That's kind of like if you had me on a golf, a golf or something and played basketball, not a single one of my hits would be counted towards the, the score, so.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, so it sounds like a good replication of, you know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah, I'm, I've been invited to go do that, uh, Mike and, uh, what's his wife's name, uh, Keely?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, they're on the, the shooting team at Liverpool. They've been, they, they do that circuit. In fact, they're heavily involved and they're like, Randy, as much as you miss, you ought to come shoot this.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I've been home maybe a week since the first of May and my physical conditioning looks like an accountant. Man.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I know, I gotta get with it. In fact, I told my wife, cause it's, it quit raining here today. When I just home for lunch, I'm like.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In the pile of blood trailing, you got any general concepts you'd throw to that?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Alright, then we got a person that said, hey, my unit in Arizona is on fire. Will these out?


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[Assistant] Because it's, I've never seen as much vegetation in the mountains as we have right now. But if it stops raining and it gets like it did last summer, no precip in the last half of June and July and August.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What? You make it sound like that's a bad thing. Well, just, you know, it's kind of like, yeah, yeah, I'll probably do it if I'm invited, but.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, when I only have a 40 yard pan and even that, you know, it's like I gotta get my trifocals on, you know, and all you young guys are there.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Stay in there. I think you'll be punting on that one. I got a lot of room in my backyard. And if I'm not in town, you guys can have my house for the week.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'm going to pay for this, Cory. I've, I've got a Wyoming general outtake and Bo says that the spot he thinks is best for his llamas for forage and water and everything is 12 miles in. I'm like, Bo, I need a horse then. Wow. Yeah. So I don't know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But I better get my button gear. So those of you who are listening who haven't started your summer workout plan, uh, welcome to the back of the line with me.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Does bowl elk taste elkier than cow? Well.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The first kind of humorous answer is if you don't remove that evidence of sex before you throw it on the grill, yea, it probably does.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah. Well, now that I read further into this person's email, they say, is it likely that leaving too much evidence of sex, everything, including skin on, attached, contributed to the flavor of the bowl? Sounds like if he left the skin on, you just


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The guy says, hey Randy, thinking about your feed discussions from the prior two episodes, I'll share, I thought I'd share a theory with you. My theory is the only difference between a weed and a plant is intent.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I intend to find the plants elk are wanting to eat when I'm out in the woods.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I go through all these botanist web pages and Wikipedia, you know, dot dot dot, whatever Latin name it is. And so I take screenshots of that plant and I've got them on my phone. I'm like, okay, yeah, that's exactly it. This is what I'm looking for.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'm gonna find this food source. So, uh, this guy sends his email and he says he just finds weeds. That's the whole idea.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, Barclays, you know, he's, that guy is, he's got lots of goodies that, those will be nuggets for sure. So if you're interested folks, go to OutdoorClass.com, sign up.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Use promo code outtalk and that'll give you 20% off.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah. Well, it's worth a try. I mean, that's exactly right. You know, there's a lot of retailers who they don't even know what promo code they have out there. They're like, oh yeah, that's a promo code. We'll take that. Yeah. So you never know.


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[Assistant] Well, I hope people give us a bunch more comments because this time of year is when we start getting fewer comments. So if you want feedback, uh, or if folks want their question to be heard, there's a way greater chance it'll get selected in the off season because we get a lower volume of comments.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So, you wanna know the little tidbit I learned the other day?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] A partnership that included the Nature Conservancy, the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation and the Doris Duke Charitable Fund and the Conservation Fund. They got together and they bought that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Last purchase was, uh, they did one more purchase, I think in 2019.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Helps all of us, so go to rmef.org.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And become a member of the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation if you are not ready. And if you are, upgrade. What the heck? Absolutely.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay. Query guaranteed you'll kill more out. Yep. If you remember me up.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I told them, hey, let us know when that's, when you're putting the press on there because we want to let our audience know. Contribute. Do what you can. Because, uh, that's how it gets solved.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yikes. So you have an Idaho out tag and a Colorado out tag this year. As of right now, yup.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, you know, you always focus on the, hey, I have a 1% chance.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I think we've conditioned ourselves not to realize that 99 times out of 100, you aren't gonna draw. So Randy, guess what? It's gonna be...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like 20, the year 2115 before you statistically probably should draw that tag.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Anyhow, you have a great day, Corey. You do the same. Hopefully listeners will go to ElkTalkPodcast.com and give us questions. I always got to ask you that because I have too many domain names and I always forget what they are.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] No, they tell us that. Like on my YouTube channel, the crew is like, make sure and ask them to subscribe. I'm not going to ask people to subscribe. If they want to subscribe, they'll subscribe. If they want to leave me a positive comment, they'll leave me a positive comment.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I don't know. There's a reason I'm so bad at marketing and selling. I'm, oh well.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But, uh, and then I just want to make sure that nobody misses out on your University of Elk hunting sweepstakes. You know, that's a, when you're giving away that much in prizes, you know, some people can have a long face when they realize they didn't get their name in the hat. So. Yep. Yeah. No purchase necessary.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, that's kind of that legal thing, right? You gotta give everyone at least one free entry.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So they can just go there and get their entry. Now you're going to get 40,000 one free entries. You know what? That's uh, that's just great. Okay. Alright.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There you have it folks, go to Elk101.com. Hopefully you'll sign up and get all that good information that Corey's going to give you and you'll use promo code ElkDock and save some money. Absolutely. All right, Corey, you have a great day. You too. Thanks, Randy. Thanks for being here, folks.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] All elk. All the time. Only elk. Only elk. Well, it's us having conversations, so we usually go down some rabbit holes, but if you


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] How you doing Cory? I am tired of winter.


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[Assistant] I quit measuring. We've got more snow in March than any other year. Like ski hills are just going crazy with how much snow. And it's usually spring skiing this time of year can be really good because


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, snow gets soft as it melts. They're still getting powder. Like they're getting powder and it's increasing. Their base levels are increasing still at the end of March, 1st of April.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But man, the mule deer just getting hammered by the wolves, not to mention, you know, what they're going to be putting up with over the next two or three weeks here without much good feed and dwindling reserves and.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] No, we just, we don't do it either. And they, uh, you know, legislature, uh, recently introduced a bill and it's making, making its way through to set shed hunting seasons to protect wintering wildlife, uh, which we could go on a,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Rabbit hole on that that it won't work. I sent him a long letter explaining why shed seasons don't work to protect the animals because


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, the authority to be able to set a shed season if it's needed to, to protect winner in big games. So you know, when, when the legislative branch gets involved in that way and proposes things where they give fish and game tools and authority to be able to do things.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's great. That's the way it should be working. But when it comes the other way and the, the legislators are the ones who are setting and demanding shed seasons and setting the dates for it. And you know, like you said, setting the minimum number of tags that have to be sold every year. That's not, that's not biology.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But I think they fly every three years. So, you know, they'll fly for elk in a region one year and then they won't fly that region again for three years. So every three years they're doing counts to see where the objective is compared to.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What the actual population is and then if something's needed, they can adjust it. So it's not a, and every year they aren't reacting to a hard winner.


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[Assistant] I mean, that's our job. That, that is what hunting is used for is managing. And if they have a tough winner, then we're going to have to give up some opportunity. That's, that's our job. That's, you know, we, we say we don't need to, to be involved in the management of it. Hunting really doesn't have a need that is going to be sustainable out there. And so.


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[Assistant] We've gotta, we've gotta be okay. And it, you know, I think as long as they're using science and they're doing counts and everything, if we have to, if they come back and say, Hey, our deer population in this region, you know, the mortality on the, on the fawns is 60% this year.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You look at what that's going to do in three years. It's going to be a big, big deal. And if they don't do something right then.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, if they do something then it's going to smooth things out over the next three to five years a little better, but just letting nature manage itself and us carrying on as if nothing happened. It's, uh, that's, that's as big of a disaster as letting nature manage nature.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, let the elk migrate out into the plains like they used to, where they can use their eyes and see a wolf coming from three miles away and stay out of its way. And yeah, nature might be okay managing nature, but...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There's subdivisions and cities in those areas now in the Elker Forest, like you said, onto the very margins of that winter ground. So not, not only are they not getting the feed they need, they're up in snow, they aren't able, they don't have near as much room to roam. They're basically trapped in a drainage.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Causes them to stress and abort fetuses and now are, you know, the.


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[Assistant] It just, everything is compacted there and it's due to human encroachment where mother nature is not mother nature. She's, she's on hospice. I mean, she's in a wheelchair and she doesn't get to get out and see what she needs to be seeing and take care of things like she did before. So we have to help.


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[Assistant] Love to have no wolves. That would be ideal.


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[Assistant] But the reality is, that's never gonna happen again. I mean, they're here, they are not, we have to manage them and we can manage them to a reasonable amount, hopefully.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But as badly as I want to kill them all, that's just, it's not the reality. And so to sit there and say that, I mean, first off, how are you going to kill them all?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There's no way we can. Yeah. It's not going to happen. So that's not even a valid argument to have in the first place. Yes, we're disappointed that we have them. Yes, we recognize the effects they're having.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I complain about what I find, you know, I see all these dead deer and it's like, this is, man, this is horrible. I was here before wolves where I saw what winter kill was like. I saw, you know, we found dead deer, we found dead elk.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What we're seeing now is, especially on a heavy winter like this where the deer are concentrated, the elk are still up high enough that they aren't coming down into the bottoms all the way, but the deer are. They're just sitting ducks there. I mean, we're finding there was one day that there were six fresh dead mule deer does in a three mile stretch along the road that the wolves had killed overnight.


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[Assistant] And yeah, I mean, a pack of wolves, it doesn't take them but an hour or two to eat the substantial amount of flesh that's on a carcass there. And it's not like it's going to waste in the winter.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But that's a lot of mouths to feed and a limited resource there. And so I get upset when I see that and it's like, man, these things are hammering the deer, they're hammering the elk.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We need to do something about it while I'm out trying to do something about it and it gets frustrating because they are the hardest animal I've ever hunted.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And the teeth, I mean when you take them in, you have to, they have to tag the pelt and then they take, they extract a tooth out of it to get it aged.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I've done that with mountain lions. I've done it with bears and it's a little tool. They pop at once, twist it and the tooth comes out. It takes 15 minutes of digging and twisting and breaking off teeth for them to get a wolf tooth to come out. And that just shows you.


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[Assistant] What they're made for, I mean those teeth are made to not come out when they lock into a 600 pound animals hind quarter and hold on, a tooth is not going to break. It's there to do


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And what percentage of those members who are dedicated enough to send a check in and to be a member what's the percentage of actual volunteers who go out in the field and do some of that habitat work.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You are going out and taking from the resource. You're, you're taking something. What are you giving back?


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[Assistant] You know, if you're listening to this podcast and you're a hunter, just ask yourself the question, what are you doing to give back?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And that can be as broad and as wide ranging as you want it to be. But if you need ideas, volunteer for the Rocky Mountain Health Foundation and do something to...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Pull down old fence, go out and plant bitter brush. You know, they have projects in your area. I guarantee you can find something to do to improve habitat.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If you're in a state that allows for predator hunting, go out and spend some time hunting predators, whether it's coyotes, whether it's wolves, whether it's mountain lions, you know, whatever it is.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They have an effect on elk, and by managing them, you're giving back to the...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Go out and feel good about it. Go out and do something that's positive and impactful and makes you feel like, hey,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Or, or we could get rid of 50% of the hunters. Is that a, I mean, is that a, yeah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like to the effect of let's get rid of half of the hunters or let's add 50% more elk. I mean, that's two different ways. And you look at the net effect of both, you get rid of 50% of hunters, your voice just got cut in half. And when it comes time for somebody to stand up to stop something that we don't agree with.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, I mean, hearing you talk about it, I would hope you could, but knowing the uh, the reality of history, probably not.


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[Assistant] How many million acres of public access is there in the entire city?


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[Assistant] So state land, that's BLM, that's federal, that's everything.


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[Assistant] So you take 12% of current access away, just in one swoop there, gone. Now you're sharing the same number of people coming there and you think it's crowded now, get rid of 12% and see where those people end up.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] On the flip side, add that 12% somewhere and imagine the drainages you get to go into without hearing another bugle from another hunter.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, and then, and it's not just writing the letter, then you start getting the phone calls from them saying, Hey, explain this to me. And you know, so pretty soon you're, you're invested in it in all you can do. And like you said, it's time consuming, but.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And they say, well, yeah, that solves our problem. I just, we proposed this because that was the first thing that came to mind, but yeah, that's a great idea. We're going to go with that. One person can absolutely sway somebody's decision to change a bill or completely get rid of a bill. And.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, there's a lot of smart people out there that are opportunity and, and, you know, think in surplus and think about the future and our


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Conservation minded that you don't have to have a platform or a podcast or a website or a YouTube channel. You just need to have an idea that makes sense and you can get people to listen. Oh yeah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, the state of Idaho has been sued for not living up to that mandate of doing what makes the most profit off of the land.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Forcing them to sell land. Like they had to come up with a plan because somebody, some developer somewhere said, hey, what about this? You know, this land isn't making any money, so.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I need to talk to your wife and have her get a picture or a video clip of you out there with one arm pushing that snow blower around.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We're, uh, I keep looking at all my aerial maps, real-time aerial maps. I'm like, the snow line is so much lower this year. Not only that, but just so few faces are exposed.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But what that means is there's going to be more moisture in more places longer and that's going to create good feed. And, uh, you know, I've always said in heavy winters,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So what that's going to do is it's going to hold the cows down closer to calving season, lower elevation. And once they have their calves, they're probably not going to migrate all the way back up to their normal traditional summer grounds with those calves.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So that means that they're going to be probably a little lower in elevation this fall when the bulls come looking for them to start the rut, so.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's uh, something I always pay attention to is these longer, heavier, late winters can affect where the rut takes place. Uh, maybe this year more than, than years past. Dang. I never thought about that. Yeah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They usually don't move a whole lot once those calves are born. And you know, you take a four week old calf and migrate it 12 miles up into a new drainage. There's a lot of risk there for that calf staying alive.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like you said, that herd of 60 cows that you see on a really dry year.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Is now, you know, 12 herds of five cows in 12 different locations. And, you know, and again, to stress what you said.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] These are in areas that are not necessarily alpine elk, so more desert, you know, New Mexico, Arizona, most of Arizona, Nevada, a lot of Nevada, Utah, Southern Utah especially.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And then it's almost, yeah, eastern Montana on the plains. When, uh, when you look at the, the Alpine elk, the mountain elk, it's almost,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The reverse. Now they're going to be more concentrated because those cows aren't able to disperse into their normal summer range. So now instead of being 12 different groups of five cows, all 60 cows have their calves right there together and then don't disperse as far. So when the bulls come down, all the bulls end up in one area because all the cows are there.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Is finding feed your primary, is it, is it their primary need now? What's their primary need that time of year?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which isn't normal for a bull elk to, you know, the first week of December, usually we'd be preaching feed, feed, feed.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So you just have to find the best sanctuary, which is usually going to be the worst


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And it's, it's all relative. Yeah. Arizona has some nasty terrain. There's no doubt. But we aren't talking, you know, Frank Church wilderness type stuff down there. It's, you know, it's, it's manageable. Right.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, even if they're going there specifically for what you're talking about, I think it's worth that. But then all the other stuff they get is, uh, that's a bonus. And you're talking about, you know, we started the podcast talking about the winner and Wyoming cutting the Antelope tags. Uh, I heard rumor that there's an Antelope module coming out.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Your late season Remy's mule deer course. There's a couple of cooking courses. So yeah, it's, it continues to grow and become even more valuable for the same price. Plus, if you listen to this podcast, you may not get any value from the content here, but


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And when you go out and do a search on Google for promo code for this or that, you end up with all these spam sites that make you open seven coupons and you find out that the code doesn't work anyway.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now we've got a big, a big warehouse bay on the adjacent side of our office here. So it's 17 yards long and it's probably, gosh, I don't know, 16 feet wide.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You got a good, good little archery range with a big target in there and it's good. You know, and during the summer, the nice thing is it's a lot cooler in here so we can have the target in the back of the bay and then we just go out in the parking lot and shoot into the bay and can stretch it out 40 or 50 yards and go out in the sun and then come in and cool off for a minute.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We're rural enough here that the amount of traffic that goes by on a day when we're shooting our bow is pretty much zero. And if somebody does drive by, usually they stop and want to shoot their bow while we're out shooting too, so.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I can't believe that you've maintained it this long because I see what goes on in your eyes and your head when you see a grouse. And if a chicken was just the right color, I don't know if you could overcome that natural instinctual reaction to chase it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You're shooting proficiency when you shoot at a grouse. So you may, I mean, your neighbors may be okay. Yeah. I mean, that chicken may get shot at, but it might survive a few days.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Especially in a place like Kentucky or Pennsylvania or somewhere back there where...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which if anybody listening hasn't had a chance, we just released, uh, our, the video for the hunt from last year, which it is, you've got to watch it. So it's on the Elk101 YouTube channel. Uh, it's called a mile in my shoes and it's the hunt with Nico from last year. And, uh, it's phenomenal.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, if Nevada can turn around in eight days, Idaho turns it around in three to four weeks. So, I mean, that's, that's not terrible.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Two tags in Arizona, which I've drawn it twice. I've drawn archery rut tags. First time took four points and the next time took three points. And the reason why for both of them was mistakes were made.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, the first time was when the U.S. Outfitters sued the state of Arizona for discrimination of non-residents.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And the state had no choice but to issue an equal number of tags to residents and non-residents and they'd already issued the tag. So say they gave out 5,000 tags to residents and 200 to non-residents. Well, they had to make up the difference and issue all those tags. So in that second part.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Because of errors on other people's parts. So what I'm saying is maybe use that as an application strategy and just count on the state of Montana making a mistake and you just might get rewarded a tag even though you didn't deserve it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If you draw, then yeaah, you get the tag, unless it's over 10%, but.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It wasn't, she didn't feel sorry for your arm. She, uh, you won her over with the flowers. There you go, so.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I can't believe you didn't, I mean, of all the marital advice you give out and everything for me to have to give you marital advice on. Hey, you got these flowers and she knew they were for you and she was bummed about that and you didn't even think to go buy her flowers? That's, man, I'm glad I was there for you. I had your back.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Every once in a while you come up with some good stuff, but it's, uh, you know, I think we're good just giving away this free advice.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They all have a custom purpose. Yeah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So every year for your birthday, you just need a new gun that helps you sleep better. My birthday?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You get down there and pick up your new firearm. I am.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Welcome to the Elk Talk Podcast with Randy Newberg and Corey Jacobson presented by the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The goal is, what little you and I know about elk hunting, we share with people.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The Elk Talk Podcast is brought to you by the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation, ensuring the future of elk, other wildlife, their habitat, and our hunting heritage. To become a member, go to rmef.org.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The podcast is also brought to you by Gerber, uh, go to gerbergear.com and learn about the knives, the vital, the big game vital, the gauge premium, all the things that we use when we're out in the woods, and not just knives, but also some really cool multi tools that they have.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] WorkDoc Podcast is also brought to you by GoHunt.com. Uh, go to GoHunt.com and sign up for the Insider. The Insider is changing how hunts and hunting information are found. No doubt about that.


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[Assistant] Use promo code ALKTOCK and when you do, when you sign up for the insider, you're going to get $50 of store credit, mad money, in their gear shop.


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[Assistant] If I was any better, there would need to be two of me. Holy cow. Man. I thought, you know, one guy I used to work with would say, man, if I was going to be any better, I'd have to be you. I thought that's what you were going to say. Like, wait a second.


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[Assistant] I can go for a hike for an hour, hour and a half like I do in between treatments, but there's no inclines.


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[Assistant] Any place you go off asphalt or off concrete is mostly just a swamp.


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[Assistant] Yeah, and my mom, to keep herself active and busy, she knows my favorite thing in the world are her homemade oatmeal raisin cookies.


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[Assistant] I've never seen the movie Star Wars, but somebody was telling me about it. And I'm thinking I'm going to call Bo Beatty and say, Hey Bo, you said you're bringing some llamas. Bring one with a saddle that I can ride.


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[Assistant] I have never seen Star Wars, I wouldn't know Luke Mud Puppy from Princess, whatever, if they came and sat down and had coffee with me.


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[Assistant] When I knew I was coming here in early October, I called around. There's a racket for internet in the rural part of America. So I call Spectrum, who delivers the fiber to my office.


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[Assistant] And they like, oh, that's part of Herman town just outside of Duluth. You got to use this company. That's their territory. I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa, wait a second here.


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[Assistant] They're like, yeah, that's how it is. So I called that company and they're like, well, you gotta buy TV along with it.


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[Assistant] Monopolies and no competition result in. Try to get internet in rural Minnesota.


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[Assistant] You know, see what's on sale at JCPenney or whatever, that's, you know, that's the extent of how much.


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[Assistant] I just envisioned it. That's what it looks like. They must. My niece got a $150 ticket for being on her iPhone while she was driving, so I'm assuming that.


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[Assistant] Yeah, that's probably still in existence here.


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[Assistant] Yeah, I just got internet two days ago as you, as you were getting text messages of my frustration.


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[Assistant] I'm trying, so imagine I'm trying to balance taking my mom to all of her treatments. She's got, uh, radiation in the morning, chemo sandwiched in between radiation in the afternoon. So I'm trying to juggle all this. And so I call and they're like, well, someone's gotta be there tomorrow if we're gonna do it.


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[Assistant] Hey, that's what we get paid to do. He said I'm a technician just like he was. I'll fix it for you.


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[Assistant] Very cool. Now we can do podcasts. We're back in business.


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[Assistant] A lot of people who Alcon have had some pretty sketchy experiences and I think you just either encouraged them or you liberated them to talk about it without feeling like they'd get lectured for the position they were in.


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[Assistant] So with, uh, almost six weeks or whatever, eight weeks to reflect on it, you got any further thoughts about, uh, you and Donnie and John endangered your lives without maybe knowing you did?


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[Assistant] And, uh, he's, he's new to hunting. Uh, I think he's been at it for four or five years and he drew an outtag this year. Um, and he thought he was prepared and then he goes into this story of how


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[Assistant] Once he shot a bull and the weather turned on him.


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[Assistant] And he realized the task that was in front of him and how experience


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[Assistant] And as he was going through listing all the things in my head, I'm like, you know, this is kind of a good checklist of.


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[Assistant] Things to be prepared for or things maybe not to do or not, maybe I should say things not to take for granted.


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[Assistant] He talked about how his physical conditioning, uh, he'd been working out but then he had a family member that was sick for the two weeks prior to his hunt and he was primary caregiver and so he had


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Demands, if you want to call it that, the toll, the terrain and everything takes on your body differently than when you're just working out at the gym. Uh, he brought clothes with him that he thought were going to make it work, uh, but