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[Assistant] Biennemy, Florist, those are all people of color. I think that, uhm, uh, Brian Florist actually-


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[Assistant] I love it. I saw the headline. I didn't, I didn't go too deep.


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[Assistant] Dan Quinn? Dan Quinn, yes. Kellamore, yeaah. I'm sort of soured on Kellamore because I feel like Dan Quinn had a much better year than Kellamore did.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But yeaah, my point was that it could be a run on, um, on minority coaching hires, um, for the head coaching jobs, cause there's so many out there now that are young and making a name for themselves. Leslie Frazier's still out there. He's...


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[Assistant] It was part of my conversation of minority hiring, my potentially being.


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[Assistant] Dennis Allen, oh right, Dennis Allen, cause Pete Carmichael has been OC'd there forever.


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[Assistant] Who's to the DC for? Cincinnati.


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[Assistant] Oh, right. I knew that. I said the name sign of America. I didn't place it right. Yeah. No, that's right. Fair enough.


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[Assistant] No, I saw his name, but I got distracted. Yep, he's uhm, he's no longer with the giants though.


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[Assistant] 43 minutes, 20 minutes on my kids and music, 20 minutes on rambling.


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[Assistant] I think the other question is, does he want to coach the NFL?


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[Assistant] But wait, as the Panthers coach or as the Baylor coach?


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[Assistant] As the Baylor coach. They haven't been coached in the same number of years.


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[Assistant] It was 2019. Robert Salas has only been there one year though, right? No, it was, no. This is Robert Salas' third year? Yeaah. Who's his quarterback in year one? Sam Darnold. Oh gosh. Man, I repressed a lot.


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[Assistant] You might be right, yea, so COVID was his first year. I can't keep up. Okay. But my point is that Matt ruled...


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[Assistant] Or you work for an organization where the owner, as you so eloquently put it, isn't David Tepper.


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[Assistant] I remember that now, yeaah. I did, I totally forgot that solid was going into year three.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I love how if you turn a certain direction, you disappear. If only your wife had that, that ability in real life to make you disappear. Uh, yeah, I don't care. Um, the logistical challenge is going to be that we're going to be in Nashville for two days and pretty tight turnaround. So we have to figure out how to balance the work stuff with the stupidity of me getting a tattoo.


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[Assistant] I, dude, I am totally fine live streaming this and I'm totally fine, uh, doing it in Nashville. But as, as has happened in the past and Debo can attest, you're not the most reliable of people. So if we plan something for 6 PM on a Wednesday,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you have some friends in town that you need to see, it'll be, you know, audio see you later from Brenton. And that's, that's not amazing.


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[Assistant] By the way, unlike you, when people give me money, I don't bail. I typically feel beholden to- I GAVE YOU MONEY! No, no, I mean, like, in previous examples. I'm doing it. What are we talking about?


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[Assistant] I don't care. Even if you bring Dane there and you have the most expensive camera we have at CBS, it doesn't matter to me. He should be looking at my arm. We're actually having a set built in the tattoo studio.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I would just suggest you bring the uh, the wide angle lens to get my, my pythons in frame. But other than that, you guys are good to go.


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[Assistant] I mean, it's like I say all the time, like you got me doing a hit with Danny Connell. That's one thing. Let me stand next to Breach where I'm at two feet tall and he is, and you know, that's, you gotta know you're.


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[Assistant] No, how does Robbie disappear? Like he runs behind the door or something? He just ducks down.


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[Assistant] No, he might say yes, that would be a bigger crime than him doing that joke.


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[Assistant] I'm going to look at real quick, uhm, Anthony Munoz's playing way.


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[Assistant] Yeah, he came out with the great Jim Breach. So Anthony Munoz played at 278.


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[Assistant] He's, he's a good. Oh, 278. Oh, I see. Oh, I see. You're saying he's light too. He's good. 25, 35, 40 pounds lighter than what you would see from tackles now. I remember watching him in the early eighties along with Jim breach and Ken Anderson. Um, Chris Collins worth was on those teams.


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[Assistant] Uhm, and you know, I obviously know who he was, but I do wonder if the lack of girth would hurt him. Like JJ Watt is the slouch. JJ Watt is 300 pounds. I mean, maybe a better chance against TJ Watt, who's closer to 55 to 60 or whatever.


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[Assistant] Uhm, Larry Allen, let's see what Larry Allen, I think Larry Allen, he was big.


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[Assistant] Reggie White, how tall was Reggie White? 6'5, 300. So he's basically JJ Watt size. And better than JJ Watt.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Larry Allen was a, uh, high-waisted too, so he wa- he was like a high se-


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[Assistant] There were, uhm, there's speculation that during the Super Bowl that they lost to the Patriots that, uhm,


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[Assistant] Aaron Donnell was playing at about 265-ish, which seems incredibly light, but he's also not 6 feet away where he's listed. He's closer to 5'10", I think. I don't think any of that matters. Uh, so to pull a Brinson recency effect, I'm going with Aaron Donnell and JJ Watt.


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[Assistant] So how many, let's see, how many reps do you, let's say you get five reps each, each matchup.


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[Assistant] Yogo is for like losers. No, I get it. I think there there's more understanding of how to.


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[Assistant] Maybe it's Lamar Jackson who's now going to get more than Kyler Murray because the Ravens and Lamar have not come to terms and I won't point fingers at who's fault it is, but they're, they have yet to sign anything. So maybe something goes not the way they hoped.


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[Assistant] But who's the quarterback? I'm, I'm hard pressed to find someone like, um, Lamar I mentioned just off the, off the cuff, but Aaron Rodgers is going to retire if he does anything. Kurt Cousins, does that inspire any sort of confidence if you, if you move on from him? Jimmy G will end up somewhere.


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[Assistant] Tom Brady, he'll either stay or go. Drew Brees is done. Uh, Marcus Mariota, he'll be out of a job in a month or whatever when they get to go to Desmond Ritter. Uhm, but I got nothing. Like maybe Ryan Tannehill?


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[Assistant] But that would be a situation where it's not a Russ Wilson situation. It's a situation where it's more like a Sam Darnold situation. He's trying to go.


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[Assistant] I think this could happen and the compensation might be a little too much, you can tell me. Justin Herbert to the Steelers for a fourth round pick.


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[Assistant] And this quarterback class should on paper be better than the one we just had.


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[Assistant] Yeah, so I don't even know who the court, like this year was clearly crazy with Russ Wilson and who else moved. Uh, Matt Ryan moved. Carson Wentz, if you want to throw him in there.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, it's not, I don't think there will be no movement of any top 10 quarterback like there was with Russ Wilson or Matt Ryan.


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[Assistant] Alright quickly, we do one more, would you rather, take 10 seconds, here we go. I'm sure Devo's got things to do. So this, this says would you rather run across a field, I'm going to define what this field is. So let's assume the field is the length, sideline to sideline, not end zone to end zone, sideline to sideline of a football field.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] One sideline of football field to the other. Okay. From the, between the goal line and the 20 is how big this field is. Okay. So 20 yards wide and whatever the distance is.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Or three landmines. Or you have to like pick your nose or shake your hand for the rest of the thing. Or three landmines.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So landmines will obviously blow your, your body into several people. Oh, it's, you can't see the landmines. Correct. I mean, that's a good one.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] 10 square feet is 5 by 2. 5 feet by 2 feet. That's one in each 5 by 2. So you'll probably have to double up, because there's not enough square footage, is there?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So, four by two, we'll say. There's a rattlesnake in every four foot by two foot area, there's a rattlesnake. Oof. Alright, so that of three landmines, what do you want to do?


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[Assistant] Are you sure it's, is it? It doesn't matter. You know what it looks like. That's why I painted the picture for you.


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[Assistant] That's the point. If I said the football field, excuse me, I mean, that's different. That's why I had to narrow it down a little bit. Devo, while his brain or the hamster's working, what are you doing?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, you don't fall down and stop. It just hurts really bad. You think it might be a drill and it might get you up.


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[Assistant] No, absolutely, but I'm saying like it's not literally on a football field and they can go to the 50 yard line if they want to. They have to stay, there's going to be walls where they can't go outside.


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[Assistant] I think you can stay there as long as you want, because the longer you stand there, the more petrified you're going to be thinking about whatever option you chose.


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[Assistant] You're gonna get bit four or five, six times maybe, and you'll have an hour to get the antidote.


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[Assistant] The issue though, if when you do get bit by a rattlesnake or a poisonous snake, you shouldn't run because then it speeds up the poison get into your heart. So that's also a consideration. So if you get bit, you can't freak out and you can't move fast. You have to move slower. So that does cause me to reconsider.


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[Assistant] What'd he say about uh, Munoz and what? He didn't say, he just...


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[Assistant] Alright, Deebo, do you want snakes or landmines or are you just done?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, see? Great minds. For instance, taking the landmine and getting both legs blown off. I didn't say...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And by the way, if you step on the first landmine and it doesn't kill you, the game doesn't end. You gotta continue to go across, whether it's with your arms or the one leg you have left, just to see if you hit another one.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, I think it's gonna be like the Temple of Doom with the pit down there. I don't know if you ever saw Indiana Jones, but that's that sort of like layout. There's not a lot of walking space.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What, what do you mean? I think if you lay the snake out, let's say the snake is, what, four feet long or something?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's fine, but if you miss the landmine, you gotta go get it. And then you've thrown your shoe like 20 feet, for example, but you don't know what's between the 20 feet between you and the shoe where you have to step.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And if you just put your shoe one foot in front of you, it's gonna blow up and still, you're gonna be, you know, collateral damage as it were.


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[Assistant] Just run. No, but I mean like th-the-


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[Assistant] But if you step on them, they've been known to strike. Based on my- If you get near one, they're gonna bite you. Yeah.


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[Assistant] Okay, well that's why there are a thousand and that's why you're in a limited small space. That's the point.


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[Assistant] Is that a thing? I don't think snakes kill each other. On the rig. You don't think a rattlesnake will bite another rattlesnake? I've never seen it in the documentaries I watch.


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[Assistant] I love the fact that you're trying to math out this landmine. I mean, I would pay a lot of money to see you try to navigate three landmines.


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[Assistant] Let me ask you this. Would you rather do landmines or snakes in the dark?


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[Assistant] That is where you just sprint. Not the landmines, the snakes of the dark. You just run.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you hope for the best. I don't know if snakes can, they, they don't see so well, but I think they sense you, so maybe the dark doesn't matter to them, so they're still gonna bite you either way, but.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You don't have a little orange flag sticking out of the ground like when they put cables in the ground in your yard.


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[Assistant] Who did? Me. Yeah, you did. You, you killed it with a shovel, right? My golf club. Oh.


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[Assistant] There are no, uh, poisonous snakes in New York, cause it's generally pretty cold, but every time I see a snake, I jump. Uhm, just from growing up in the southward, you know, cotton mouse or no joke.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Oh, Copperhead. Cottonmouths are no joke either though.


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[Assistant] I dunno, I think that when you see them on television, they're like, what, this plate size or something?


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[Assistant] Take it right this way, just three dinner plates, take three dinner plates and throw them out into that area. There's no way you still have a chance to step on those.


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[Assistant] Well, you generally feel like you're risk seeking, but this, you're, you're going with the, the risk averse behavior.


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[Assistant] First of all, that's not how lamides work. I think they're, they're dropping to the ground a good distance.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Instinctively you want to run, but you have to like take deep breaths and walk as you continue to get bitten on your way to the quote unquote finish line, might be the ultimate finish line. So that's the other math you have to do, but I I'm just.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] For my purposes, when you get to the finish line, there will be an ambulance waiting for you. Although I've seen that the recovery, even when caught in time can be extremely painful and laborious and take a long time to get back to full whatever, wherever you got bit, full health.


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[Assistant] You're flying until you get, like, you know, the old Mike Tyson, everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face, then you're not flying so much.


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[Assistant] Yeah. So workers, for those bitten by rattlesnakes, 10 to 44% of those people will have lasting injuries. Something else to keep in mind. This is from the CDC.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like I'm trying to run through this rattlesnake pit and you're, I get hit in the head by your foot as it flies across the field. Cause you just got blown to smithereens.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah. Well, there you go. That, that could be you without the $20,000 prize at the end, just doing it for fun.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What about 20 snakes in the dark versus three landmines? You can't see them, but there are 20 of them.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But 20 and you can still hear the rattles will be quite disconcerting and pitch black, can't see your hands in front of your face type situation.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay. So there you go. We'll have to bring that one back for breach when he gets back from his two month long vacation.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Although he did say he'd rather sleep in jeans than wear a helmet for the rest of his life.


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[Assistant] In accordance with the general goal of our party, as determined by its 20th, 21st and 22nd congresses, which is a Leninist goal. It was is, and will be the only immutable goal in the Soviet state.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The path of Leninist principles shall be consistently and undeviatingly followed as it expresses the vital interests of the Soviet people, its hopes and aspirations as we guide the life of the party and state. This session of court is now open. Comrade Judge Milan Kadnikov presiding.


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[Assistant] It's not necessary. Your testimony is concluded. Your honor.


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[Assistant] I mean, the hell with your damn cheeseburgers and announcing that. And I mean, you're just the hardest working man in sports right now. Now you came back here to do this damn show. What a good friend you are. What a good like, you're just a professional right out of California.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Saturday evening. Yep. I tuned in. Yeah. My Aunt Wendy, you know, she's all about the horse racing in general, plus she likes you. Sure. Right? And she's, can't even see straight, she thinks you're handsome. So we're still trying to check her eyes, but so I tuned in. What a race it was. It was a good race. But thanks for coming back, man. Well, I did it from here in studio.


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[Assistant] Great call. Right? A lot of similarities there. Right? Need some big Clydesdales down there in the middle. Gotta have those big horses there. Stop the run game.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, push the pocket in the pass game. Another good group, Ahmed, that we're gonna break down today. I mean, really is. I mean, as I get down here and, you know, I got a few position groups I'm still not all the way up on here, right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] As I look at it and just go, okay, I think I got the main position groups now that everybody looks at to go like this is the, the groups this year. Quarterback, wide receiver, offensive line. Right. Defensive tackle now, add that to it. Right. We got to, we talked about DBs. There'll be a few, certainly a part of the conversation.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right, but, but man, wow, defense alignment, offense alignment, it really looks like it's a first round that's setting up to be like, like that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Other thing that jumps out to me as I get a better hold of this and.


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[Assistant] You know, again, like I haven't watched Brock Bowers and studied him yet. You know, I don't think there's any running backs in the first round. There's no linebackers or safeties I think that are in the first round conversation. So I feel like I probably have seen most of the people that are in that first round combo up to this point. You know, I do look at it and go linemen.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like extraordinaire. And I also look at it and just through that lens of like the big picture first round, right? Where I go.


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[Assistant] I'm not so sure I keep seeing all these mock drafts with like, you know, five and six receivers going in the first round. I keep coming away with it the more I watch going the main four are going in the first round. I wouldn't be sold that any of the other main four are going in the first round. I wouldn't, you know, like we talked about.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, neighbors, the two LSU kids, Odunze and Harrison Jr., they stand alone in the receiver group. There's a little bit of a drop-off after that, right? You know, I love Roman Wills, somebody, I don't think he's a first-round talent, right? I think he's a


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Top of the second, mid second, somewhere in there, probably realistically. Yeaah. Right, but I see some other names thrown out there as first round.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And that's the ones where I go, ooh, I think as we get into real football.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And the draft comes around, teams gonna go, wait, there's ten other receivers that are this close together. I'll wait til the second round. We need this de-tackle right now cause it falls off a cliff after another two are gone here. And we can't take that chance. And that's where I think we're gonna see. We've been saying that for a little while. You think the elite guys are gonna be.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Exactly right. I think so, because you just, like you said, the numbers, how good they are, there's gonna be a group every year where you go, okay, one, two, and three, four are good, but. Yeah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Five, six, seven, eight, nine, and ten have like a grade that's like .01 off each other, right? Or it's like the exact same grade except, what do you like this guy? He's tall or this one's shorter, right? We have them the same grade. So that's where, again, to your point there, I, I, I, you know, I'm be interested to see how that plays out.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, no, I think there's, I don't know about that either. I do think him and him and neighbors will be the top two receivers off the draft. Yeah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] No, you're not wrong. There's more body types, versatility.


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[Assistant] Depth at that position is part of the reason we just talked about a little bit there with the offensive line value. There's just more good defense alignment coming out in the draft every year than there are NFL offensive linemen.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, we see teams, they lose an offensive lineman. We go, oh my gosh, you know, ooh, they're in trouble. They lost an offensive lineman.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They don't have their starting five. We go that defense alignment. We go, oh, they missed this guy. Oh, they'll put in the other guy. He's, he's a freak too. I mean, it's just, it's not as hard to find that depth and what we're finding there, let alone, uh, yeah, there's a, I think the versatility of defenses and that, that, that has gone up so much where


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, I know we have the team that plays Seattle Scheme and still all that, but then you take the rest of the NFL.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like, defenses are multiple now, right? They want a guy that's like, wait, I need, on this situation, he needs to play D tackle, but two plays later from now, I need him to play D end. He's gotta be able to do both.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And then, you know, when I put him back at de-tackle, I actually need him to do two different types of de-tackle. I'd like him to be able to do like two gap and he can hold somebody up.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That yeah, there's a little bit more, you know, coloring outside the canvas as far as what we think of as detackles anymore, right? Where it's like, and when we grew up, I was just like, whoever's the biggest, strongest, unmovable guy, you put him a detackle.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now it's not always about that. Some teams go, well, I'm not worried about my guy. If he gets double teamed and they move him, so what? You know, the next play he's going to shoot this gap, get skinny and make a tackle for a five yard loss. Right? So there's different things that people are looking for. There's different skill sets along that defensive line. I don't know if I've.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I think, I think, I don't know if I've changed my evaluations to get specifically about the question a whole lot.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, I feel like I've learned more and I think it's a position where we talked before the pod. You need to know the position, a little nuance. You gotta have a little backlog of history to go.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, a good defensive tackle game sometimes can be like, he made no plays. He didn't do anything, right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He busted back in the line of scrimmage a few times, made the running back move, made the quarterback move off a spot, right?


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[Assistant] But a lot of the times if you look like at a game and go, oh, there's 60 snaps and oh, this guy had


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] 10, 12 good plays. That's like, you played awesome at D-Tackle. And a good play may be just standing up to a double team and not losing ground. And not moving, and the running back just runs into the pile and now he has nowhere to go and everybody tackles him. That's exactly right. You know, so I think that's what you gotta look for. Then the biggest thing too is, like we always talk about, what is he being asked to do?


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[Assistant] And then you have to decipher through that to go, wait, he's not going to do that in the NFL. He's going to do this. Can he do this? Can he, right? And we're going to talk about some guys like that. But you know, I do think in like in years past, there's been guys mis-evaluated because


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I think the draft community or certain people go, well that doesn't look that good. Whatever. Daron Payne is always the first one that comes to my mind. Daron Payne came out and people were like, what?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Washington's gonna take him in the top 20? He's a second round pick, and I'm, you know, and this is back at the Bleacher Report days, but I always think of him just because I go, people were, he doesn't make enough plays, he doesn't get in the backfield.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And he was never allowed to get in the backfield. He was on a part of a group at Alabama where they were so good, they were just like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Nick was like, stand them up. Don't let anybody move. We'll never be at a position against any play ever. This is the safe way for us to win the game instead of you having six or seven highlight plays, but six or seven highlight plays for them might happen too because you're just renegading, right? So you have to go wait.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] No, no, no, this guy's awesome. When he does get a chance to disrupt, he does, but it's just few and far between.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And okay, does that make work? What's he being asked? Oh, he's asking to two gap all the game along or hold his ground against a double team.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That doesn't mean you can't do the other things. Right. So you gotta make sure you find some evidence of that and try to piece it all together. And that's kind of the fun thing about the position a lot of times because this is one position where I feel like more than any in college football, people play out of position more than ever because they, because


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In the NFL where this position is great is they're going to go, we're going to put you at your position. You can just thrive and be your best. In college football they just go, well.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We just wanna get the best 11 on the field and you're the freakiest so we're gonna put you at like the toughest spot. You don't even actually get to show your skills but we think you can do that because the guy that we need to play at the position you think you're best at, there's no way he can do that. So we're gonna put you at nose tackle even though you're probably best at defense and that's what you'll be in the NFL, right? And that, if that makes sense,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, that's a big part of this, and that's why I do find it fun evaluating this position. It's one of my favorite positions.


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[Assistant] Yeaah, well, it's, it's a little bit I think goes into the versatility and the, like, no longer, defenses just don't go, we play 3-4 and we play 3-4 every play no matter what. Right? That's just, that's over. Right? So.


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[Assistant] What we had, and this also goes into versatility of defense and the freak of natures we have at the defense line right now.


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[Assistant] Dexter Lawrence can play nose tackle, it's a piece in my eye. Yeaah, he's that typical way. He's 330 pounds, right? Yeaah. He can two gap you and do that.


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[Assistant] But, at the same time, the Giants don't want to line up in that every time, and they're going, wait, he's awesome, let's move him here, because he can shoot a gap, he can be a mismatch on a guard, and do that, he can do both, let alone two, here's the other aspect of it.


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[Assistant] Like, the positions become so freaky that guys like Chris Jones now, watch Chris Jones. He lines up everywhere. He has a number of snaps every game. He plays nose tackle.


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[Assistant] So yeaah, he's not your typical what we would think of old school Jim Burr, right? Refrigerator Perry nose tackle, right?


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[Assistant] You know, these guys now, some of these de-tackles, they're so good and so freaky at so many things.


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[Assistant] It's just like, hey, this defense, yeah, we need a nose tackle, but oh, now it's second and six and it's a different variety of plays and personnel. I'd like you to move over here a little bit. I need a little more disruption, a little more weight, you know, get on the edge of the guard, do something like that. So it's not lost. It's not gone.


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[Assistant] They're still out there, right? Vita Vella is a nose tackle, right? Jalen Carter does nose tackle stuff. Jordan Davis does nose tackle stuff. They're there, but just the day of lining up there play after play after play, that's not there anymore.


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[Assistant] And you know, really like when I look at all these, these are all de-tackles still, right? Even the five and the four tech. I think for the most part, I'm still looking at.


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[Assistant] More times than not is a detackle. It's edge and then this. Yes, right. There's the, exactly right. And you know, the edge is the guy who lines up way outside the tackle or way outside the tight end.


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[Assistant] And it's all about, hey, he's coming off the edge to get after the quarterback. That's what it's all about.


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[Assistant] Even these guys at the four and five technique, if you're watching on YouTube and seeing this diagram here, you know, there, there's still more times of not being lined up at that position and going, wait, no, no, no, you gotta man up against that tackle and hold your ground and maybe two gap them, right? And those are special human beings out there at five tech.


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[Assistant] You know, Richard Seymour for the Patriots back in the day. My dad's team of Leonard Marshall, who was a freak of nature. Uhm, you know, uh,


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[Assistant] The DeForest Buckners of the world, right? These giant who go, wait, I can take big offensive tackle who's 6'7", 3'40", and I can just, me and him all day long.


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[Assistant] We're seeing the freakiest group of detackles in the history of the sport right now. Like, period.


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[Assistant] Again, Dexter Lawrence at 345, the way he moves and does that, right? I mean, that's the reason we're talking about offensive linemen, because there's just like, what? This guy's moving and running like this? Jordan Davis, like we talked about? Quinnen Williams? You know?


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[Assistant] Of a few years where I think we had Quinn and Williams one year and then Derek Brown and I think two years in a row I was like, I think it's the best defensive tackle I've ever seen.


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[Assistant] I've never seen a demon, and then last year, remember with Jalen Carter, I was the same thing. I was going, I think it's the best demon's attack I've ever seen. I mean, so that's what we're getting into.


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[Assistant] As guys of this, at this position right now, I mean, Vida Vea, again.


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[Assistant] He was not, he, Vida Veja, and you, you might remember me at that time, I was like, he's a top 10 pick. Why is he not, why is Dexter Lawrence not a top 10? Like what was it? Because I don't even think the mold had changed in the brains of the NFL people still. They were still like, wait, these are big, these are nose tackles. And then once one did it and started to push the pocket, everyone was like, wait, this guy can,


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[Assistant] Make people miss a little bit as far as pass protection and push the pocket.


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[Assistant] We worry about in the draft every year, wait, I see the skills, there's some elite stuff about them, but,


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[Assistant] You know, we came in at that time and I, I remember saying, man, he's really athletic, but man, there's a lot of plays where he's very content being blocked. And I don't know, but damn.


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[Assistant] He's 330 and he moves like that. Like I, you know, okay, I'm going to put him in the top five, right? You know, that's where he, hey, knowing the man and what makes the man and you know, like we talk about sometimes that NFL environment, does that bring out the best in the guy or does he start to whittle away and go, whoa, this isn't for me?


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[Assistant] Right? So we'll see where that goes, but I think it's up in the air about Mozzie for sure. Definitely. Uhm, yeah, and, hey, there's...


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[Assistant] At this position too, there's a little, you know, adjustment period. Maybe not for the top guys always, but really almost for all of them. It's rare you have one that just comes in and does what Jalen Carter did.


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[Assistant] Like Jalen Carter, we got to week 8 last year, and I think I was on here a few times going, he might be the best D tackle in football already. Right? I was like, he's in the combo. It's right up there with that. But we did see like, hey, Derrick Brown, it took him, we're talking about him, he's $96 million for your contract.


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[Assistant] It took him a few years. Quinen, Quinen, Quinen, Quinen Williams, he wasn't a superstar right away in year one. It was probably towards the end of year two and then year three we were like, whoa, oh my gosh, he's awesome.


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[Assistant] There is there. Again, there, there is a position where they're being asked to do a lot more.


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[Assistant] Like we talk about, the offensive line is doing way more than they ever had to deal with in college, right? I mean, we make fun of offensive lines in college because it's like, step to the left, step to the right. It's this run play, and it's this run play. That's all we got, guys. That's it. So, defensive tackles, the game's easy for them in that way in college. Now in the NFL, not only are they going, holy shit, I've never had a human like this over me, blockin' me,


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[Assistant] There's 90 million runs, they doubled me, they kicked me out, they trapped me, you know. A pulling guard came and hit me one time. Let alone, like, these guys, the offensive linemen, know how to use their hands in the NFL. I'm still a beginner in that way, so that's where I think there's a little bit of a learning curve. We'll see where it goes there.


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[Assistant] I'm a little worried about Mazzy, the other ones I'm not quite as much worried about as we go forward. Those first two are damn good though, Carter and Kalajukanski.


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[Assistant] That's exactly right. You don't let Madhubuke, Chris, you know, Chris Jones, Dexter Lawrence, Jalen Carter, Christian Wilkins got out of the building because they spent so much money on other people that they couldn't figure it out.


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[Assistant] Right, but yeaah, it's rare to see that guy walking free agency, cause again, we're talking about humans, a lot of times they're going,


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[Assistant] Examples of what we're talking about. You don't let those guys out the door once you got them on your football team.


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[Assistant] One of my favorite guys at the Combine too. Not only like one of my favorite players to watch in the draft, but one of my favorite humans that I met in the draft process. Byron Murphy II from Texas. The Longhorns. Yes. I mean, incredible.


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[Assistant] Ball of muscle and explosion. That's what he is. You talk about muscle explosion, pliable, bendable, right? Disruption, yet can hold his ground at an incredible rate for a guy that's, you know, not the biggest defensive tackle in the world, right? All of that is amazing, right? The athleticism's amazing.


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[Assistant] So that's where I look at it right off the bat and go, wait, not only can this guy just win with pure explosion, quickness, be disruptive, do those types of things, right?


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[Assistant] You know, the next play on defense, they go, hey, wait, we need you to play shade nose and now we need you to hold your ground and don't be disruptive and don't let them move you. And he can do that too, right? Along the lines of that conversation, we were just having the versatility there. So he's awesome that way.


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[Assistant] He's awesome and one on one. He's very good and a good anchor for a guy his size against the double teams and like a Jalen Carter last year can


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[Assistant] He, he wins wrestling matches, right? Where it's like, okay, it's a stalemate and oh no, and he, oh whoa, he's on a knee and it looks like he might not, oh what? He got the guy off him and then he still made the tackle, right? That to me was very Jalen Carter-ish of last year where I'd see Time Trial go, he's on both knees and he just fought the guy off and got up and made a tackle.


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[Assistant] And that's what's incredible about this guy. He is a big ball of muscle.


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[Assistant] About that. Yeah. Okay. That, that to me, I, I just, I don't even know how that's possible. I don't know either. I don't know. Right? You watched a little. Yeah. Okay.


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[Assistant] Like, I, you know, I want to be silly and go, all the people that vote for Big 12 things, their votes need to be rescinded. Like, they gotta be rescinded. How can you watch a game of Texas and not go,


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[Assistant] Number 90's the best player on their defense. And you're gonna give it to the other guy? Just why? Cause he's big, he's the biggest person out there. That to me is like just, I don't even get it. One guy is dominating and everywhere. The other guy, you see him every now and then. Let's make him the defensive player of the year. Like what a crock of shit.


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[Assistant] You're okay. Right, right. Let alone, you know, again, to Vandrey Sweat, there's plays where you just go ahead, like to see more. You're too big and strong to be blocked that easily or you need to be that content with being blocked, right? Let's not make this a bash on Sweat. No, no, we're not. We're gonna talk about Sweat later.


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[Assistant] Talk of the body, right? I always, my first paragraph is usually just talking in the body, kinda painting that picture in my own brain, right? And, you know, just a ball of power, not sloppy, dense as hell, love his legs, legs are elite.


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[Assistant] Yeah, he's six foot, but he's high cut waist and his arm length is not bad for being, you know, six feet tall, but like,


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[Assistant] One guy is extremely explosive. Who's that guy? Oh, it's number 90, right? The get-off, the quicks, the change of direction.


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[Assistant] Right? They're off the charts for his size, right? His strength is off the charts. The bend, acceleration, like we talked about, the pliable, the fluidity of his movements is really impressive, right? Extremely, like, powerful at the point of attack.


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[Assistant] Right? Low pads, great legs, right? Can anchor in there against double teams, right? Wins in a lot of weird positions like I talked about. That to me is essential.


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[Assistant] For like, you look at good tackles in the NFL, right, you're not going to always be in a good position. Like, you know, when the tackle and guard double team every now and then, you're going to be like, woah, I'm bent over sideways.


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[Assistant] And can, how do you recover off that? Are you going to go into the ground and just get, you know, pancaked? Or are you going to be able to somehow fight it off and get back into the play a little bit? And that's, I mean, you gotta do that because you're, you're going to have a handful of plays in every NFL game that are going to be like that. He is amazing at that. His balance is unreal.


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[Assistant] Right? When you try to cut block him, go at his legs, maybe he is engaged with somebody and then somebody hits him on the side, right? Like a lineman who's going up to the second level, he stays on balance, right? He's always where he's supposed to be. He's got very good hands. He's got great instincts and eyes. He sees the ball.


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[Assistant] He sees what's going on, even as he's being blocked or double teamed, you can tell, right? He's got that...


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[Assistant] No regard for his body aspect that I like. Oh, I'm being blocked, but the guy's running through here. I'm just gonna let him, I'm gonna go out there and put my head and face in there. He's gonna hit me and I'm gonna take a big shot, but he's gonna get tackled. He's going down. He had that. So that's what I really, really loved about him.


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[Assistant] Uh, the ability to get off blocks was special as well. I mean, he can do it a lot of different ways. I loved watching him.


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[Assistant] Yeah, that's what will stop him from being a top 10 or top 12 pick in the draft. That's, that's, that's gonna end that, right? But that's why, you know, I think somewhere between 15 and 25 in that range.


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[Assistant] Right? That's when I think we see the door open up for Byron Murphy. I do. You know, he's, he's, he's a little different, right?


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[Assistant] He's not going to make some of the old school, wait, I gotta have a defensive tackle with this kind of wingspan and all that. They're not going to feel comfortable.


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[Assistant] But as we're seeing in the NFL right now, there's value with these guys, this disruption guys, right? Teams aren't just like we talk about, lining up in the same place every time. Or even if they're lining up in the same place, they're asking their guys like, hey, when he says set hut, we want you to go two gaps over. We want you to slant this way. We want you to stunt that way, right? So he's going to be really good at that. And then when I look at a two and go,


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[Assistant] He's the kind of guy where when you stunt, and we talk about this a lot of times where like,


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[Assistant] You know, the guy's being asked to slunt and stand a lot, uh, stunt and slant a lot, and he gets moved easily, and I go, well yeaah, he's being out, he's-


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[Assistant] He's told to go that way and now he's got a 320 pound man on his back. It's hard to stop, right? He's one of the few people you're going to find out there that can kind of like do that and then be like, no, I'm stopping even though you're on my back trying to push me the way I was going, right? So that's where he's damn good.


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[Assistant] Right, but yeaah, this is more along the lines of a guy we talked about in the top five from last year. It's a Kalaja Kancey. It's an Aaron Donald-ish type of football player. It's a Sheldon Rankins, who was a first-rounder out of Louisville. I think he's better than Sheldon Rankins coming out, there's no doubt about it.


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[Assistant] I think it's, it's, I think it's better than Kalaja Kancy last year, and I love Kalaja Kancy. Kalaja might have been more athletic, I think this guy's stouter and more powerful. That's where I really like him. One-on-ones versus guards, forget about it, right? He's phenomenal, right? What else, what do you want to add to that?


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[Assistant] He never loses a 1-0-1, right. It just, it's so rare. Uh, really damn good player. Like we said, I think we hit it all really when it comes to him and somehow, some way. Uhm, but, you know, can get skiddy, arm over, you know, speed to power.


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[Assistant] The power rip, right? Where he runs into somebody and like jars him back and then he rips him to the ground and goes by him, right? He can, he can avoid a blocker and go around him and make it a tackle that way. You know, got a little spin move you see in the pass rush really, you know, impressive, impressive football player. No question. The number one defensive tackle on the draft for me.


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[Assistant] We got a huge human, one of the biggest on earth. We don't want him being here. We think you're actually stronger than he is.


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[Assistant] I think that's about it, right? You know, I would like to be more specific, probably 12 to 20, 12 to 25 maybe, but right in that range, that's kind of where I would see it happening.


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[Assistant] Darius Robinson, Missouri, man. What's, how do you not like watching Darius Robinson tape? First off, the first play I'll say to our listeners and the people that send questions in, I think I saw him come off the edge and I went, oh no.


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[Assistant] Oh gosh, maybe he isn't an elite defense to end. Uh oh. I think he came off and he dominated a run play, right? And I was like, oh no, maybe he wasn't even made it. Maybe I messed up.


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[Assistant] Uh, but as I went on, no, we, we got it, right? He's a defensive tackle. This is what he is. Now again, I didn't make that determination blind, right? You know, I, I talked to people in football and I knew people in football were more valued as a D tackle than D N from, from everything I, so that's the reason I waited so long. Okay?


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[Assistant] I think it starts just with like, you wanna talk about the Greek gaudiest of bodies ever, right? That's where this starts with this guy too. You know I love Byron Murphy's body. This is a totally different body. This is like, you know, tall, long, shoulders, arms, great legs, cut up, chiseled.


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[Assistant] Like insanity in the membranity when it comes to that department, right? He gets his hands on any, he has got the most violent get off, put his hands on the shoulders of the chest of an offensive lineman and control that human being like he's a toy in the draft. He is the best in that department.


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[Assistant] Now he might not be the best as bending and pliable like a Byron Murphy, right? His game's a little bit more upright, but still.


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[Assistant] An absolute freak, right? When you talk about the first step, the quick violent hands, and then the ability to shed and just shock blockers. I mean, look at this guy. This is 285. He looks like he's a, he's got a body like a 205 pound DB has, right? I mean,


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[Assistant] But it's not bad, and then he makes up for it with the great physicality and hand strikes and he keeps legs moving on contact always. That's where he's really good.


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[Assistant] I mean he sells out, like we talk about with Byron Murphy, maybe even more in this department with Darius Robinson. Like no regard for his body, right? I'm gonna get crushed here, I don't care, I'm gonna dive in front of the moving truck and take one for the team cause we gotta get him down.


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[Assistant] Amazing. Big moment. Football? Amazing. Right? I start to go through games, Georgia, a few of the other games and late in the game, they need to play the defense. Damn, Darius Robinson shows up. He knows what time it is when it's time to make a play. Right?


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[Assistant] Yeaah, you know, I mean, he can do anything, right? He's a freak of nature. So he can do it all. His best position is going to be defensive tackle. He doesn't have the type of first step.


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[Assistant] And speed and explosion that is going to scare NFL elite tackles with like, oh no, here comes the speed rush, he's gonna go around me, right? As an edge, he used his strength more than his speed. Exactly right. It's very few plays where you see him actually get around the edge and go, oh wow, he snuck by that guy with speed, right, or using his hands. It's usually...


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[Assistant] He tries to take the offensive tackle on a magic carpet ride into the quarterbacks legs, right? I mean that's what he's trying to do.


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[Assistant] So that's where I think he is better on the edge. And then, you know, back to our chart.


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[Assistant] Yeah, if you want to look at that, like he's a, what I would call a three technique or a five technique. He'd be perfect. He's got plenty of that strength we talk about to be like, Oh what? Lane Johnson? You want to line? I'll line up right in front of you. Let's see. Let's get after it.


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[Assistant] I can hold my ground. I don't need help from anybody else. They don't need to stun me. It'll just be me and you. He's capable of that.


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[Assistant] Uh, but, but yeaah, you look at that, that four, five, and then that three, that's what he is, right? With, okay, and occasionally if you want to let him line up while outside and just use his speed and just try to crash and collapse the pocket from the outside, you'll love that too.


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[Assistant] Off the charts good, right? He's one of the safest picks in the draft, right? He's one of those guys where you just go.


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[Assistant] You know, the floor is, he's our starting 3 technique or 5 technique for like 10 years, and he's like real good, right? Like, there's no bus factor with this human being, okay?


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[Assistant] I think the, I talked about the selling out, the speed to power on the edge, the shedding the blocks, all that, right? I think when I looked at him as a football player, and if I had to throw out names here, to me he's, it's more DeForest Buckner, right? It's that guy. If you look at DeForest Buckner, right? Eric Armstead?


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[Assistant] You know, they're a little heavier in weight, but it's same arm length. They're in, it's in the ballpark. I think it's more that type of guy. You know, I did write Jadevion Clowney in a lot of ways because when he's down the edge, he looks like that. He's not as athletic as Clowney. He's more powerful than Clowney.


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[Assistant] Clowney I think was like 260-something coming out, right? This guy's a bigger human being, uh, and a little more power-based.


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[Assistant] Yeah, that, that, that's, that's right. He's, he's, he's, he's an inside guy.


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[Assistant] He is, and that's where I think he's gonna shine. You know, the Keon White thing, this is an interesting one. I actually have Keon White written down for somebody else we're gonna talk about a little later.


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[Assistant] I think he's more athletic than Keon White though, even more athletic than he is. He's a little different that way, but as we saw, Keon White had a damn good year last year for the Patriots and did a lot of good things. I can understand that comparison, but love the player, love the physicality, love the fact that there's


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[Assistant] You know, there's another one where you see SEC football, you see dominant play, he can't be blocked, and you go, he really doesn't know anything. He doesn't use his hands, he doesn't have a spin move, he does nothing. He's just doing it with his pure ability, playing hard, being tough.


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[Assistant] Uh, so yeaah, I'm excited for him. Got a chance to meet him at the, at the, uh, Super Bowl too. You did, you did talk to him. And, uh, yeaah, Super Bowl I talked to him, Combine talked to him a little bit. Uh, two times. Couldn't have been, couldn't have been a better dude. Uhm, you think he goes first round? Definitely. Definitely. I definitely think he's in the first round. Yeaah, I think like,


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[Assistant] I mean, I wouldn't be shocked. 18 to 32 is what I wrote down. I don't think, like again, don't overthink this. This is one where I look at it and go, no, no, no. 285. Ran 4.9. Right? Incredible arms.


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[Assistant] Nobody overpowers him. You know, like we talked about with Byron Murphy and you brought up, the bad plays are like stalemates. Like, it's like, there's no bad plays. The bad plays are you go, okay, tie, tie. You guys did a tie, right? That's all there is to it. Uh, he'll fit the NFL game.


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[Assistant] Here, not that there's many questions, right? But there's just like one thing you'd go, ooh, I wish they could get a little bit better at this. Or there's one part of their game that you just go, they need to work on that. But still awesome. And I still look at both of them and go, they're first round talents for my money. Yes.


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[Assistant] Duke, number 90, right? This is your, this is your athletic disruptive defensive tackle, right? That's what he is. Explosive, get off, disruption, right? You know.


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[Assistant] He's got a good looking body. He's kind of a compact defensive tackle. He's not the space eater type, right? You know, he looks like he, when you turn on the film, you see him, you go, oh, he looks like the type that's going to win causing disruption, shooting gaps, doing all that. Get off is really good. The movement is phenomenal.


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[Assistant] Right? I mean, to me it's more along the lines of Byron Murphy as far as the explosive, the bendability, right? The ability to be in a weird position, still overcome it, do all of that.


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[Assistant] That's where he is. He wins with, like, either winning with pure explosiveness, getting skinny, shooting the gap, or being so explosive that he gets on top of the linemen before they can even really get their feet in the ground and all of a sudden they're just backpedaling going backwards. That's what he really does, right? He's got very good, uh,


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[Assistant] Bull rush, right? He's got a pretty good anchor versus double teams, though this is one of the areas you'd go, hey, it needs a little work. He's not the stoutest as far as when it comes to holding his ground against double teams or maybe a bigger ta- bigger offense alignment every now and then. That's where it's not perfect and that's why we put him in with a caveat to a degree, right?


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[Assistant] Has that play hard, sell out mentality I talk about, right? He's a three technique, you know, who can do everything as far as that. Four three teams I think are gonna really like him a lot. That's kinda what jumped out at me at first. I got a few other thoughts that I wanted to hear.


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[Assistant] You can tell the game's important to them. I don't have to talk to a coach and go,


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[Assistant] Like, like Mozzie Smith, like we talked about last year, where I went, oh, there's things here where, oh, I'm not sure, right? And then we get closer to the draft and kind of hear those things and go, eh, it's effort and work and how tough he is, it is a thing. It kind of showed up on film, right? These three right here, this is like,


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[Assistant] The ones we've talked about, they love football, you can tell. They're pissed when they get blocked, they're pissed if they don't make a tackle, right? They're emotionally invested in the game and that always gives me confidence when you're watching film and evaluating that.


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[Assistant] But this is what I was talking about, see how he's great get off, he gets underneath people's body, right, gets underneath their pads, you see this a lot on film. I mean, right, this is every game. His pop, his quicks, his explosion, the lineman can't get ready and get an anchor set in the ground and all of a sudden he just takes him for a ride.


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[Assistant] So he does the same thing, right? So he's got to, what he does too is cause he can win with quicks, like on this one is a little different, cause see how he gives the little shimmy side to side as he comes off the line? So he gets the guy like, oh wait, he's gonna beat me with quicks and then all of a sudden he hits you in the chest and you're going, oh no, I was getting adjusted to go side to side.


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[Assistant] And this is the other angle. He, he is great at this. This is, he's a guy here where, listen, you know,


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[Assistant] We talk about all the things he can do, defensive line, he's a defensive tackle, but he's also a guy where like, I wrote him, he could play strong, you could go into a game and go, he's gotta play strong side DN today, right? He's gonna have to pass rush, and he's gonna have to take on the tight end, the tackle, and the running game, and do all that, but like, we're gonna play him out there. He's got enough bend and first step.


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[Assistant] And moves and things to work with there as a pure pass rusher that are really valuable. And I think it's gonna, you know, come in handy in the NFL.


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[Assistant] Well, and then what you do when you look at those games, you just look at them and go, okay, so what, Jordan Travis threw a quick over here, but like, what did that initial get off, right? Like, you could still see on a few of those plays where you go, oh, they threw it really quick. You go, well, he's in the midst of dominating that guard. That guard is going backwards. He just, he doesn't get a chance to do it, right?


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[Assistant] So there's that. Now, like we talked about, he gets moved in the running game every now and then. They are a team, like we talked about a little bit, where they ask their guys to move and stunt a lot. Where I think you're gonna latch and go, a lot of his bad plays, I'm gonna go, this is hard. Like,


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[Assistant] I know we all want him to stop here in the gap, but they'd ask him to run really fast in this one area with a guy pushing him in that direction and we're going, no, no, you should just stop in the gap there. That's rare, right? So that's one of the things I wrote in my notes is I think you're going to see some bad plays where I'm going to go, it's not really realistic to ask him to be good in this play. That's not fair to him there, right?


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[Assistant] Again, for a guy that's not extra long and I don't look at him to be a two-gapper and all that, but when he was engaged with the guard and he saw the ball come in a certain way, man, he could throw people off or get off the block and get after the ball carrier, uh, at a really impressive rate. He really was. Loved the player.


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[Assistant] Really impressive in all areas. Very strong for his size. Uses his hands well. Gets all blocks. You know, can two gap if he needs to, but it's not ideal, right? He's a disruptive three technique.


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[Assistant] Who will be good in all areas, and I wrote down, I wrote Madobuke Kobe Turner type of, type of player in my opinion. Where it's not perfect coming out of college, but damn there's some good, and you go woo, there's really some disruptive traits here.


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[Assistant] Uhm, yeaah, I really like Dwayne Carter and I would be shocked if he doesn't end up going higher than where he's projected right now.


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[Assistant] Yes, Johnny was a good man. Yes, Johnny is the man. Johnny is the man. Now this is a different kind of guy, right? This is a little bit more of the stout, power-based type of defensive tackle. Don't want to discredit him, he's still very athletic, right?


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[Assistant] Great looking body, powerful, proportionate, right? Love his legs, not as much as Byron Murphy's, but I really do like them, right? Good athlete, but not like...


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[Assistant] Not like Carter, who we just talked about, or Murphy from Texas. This is a little different here, right? He's not quite as, uhm, explosive, not quite as bendable, and like, gonna win in weird positions, right? I think that's the big thing.


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[Assistant] He's not quite as twitchy and quick as those guys, right? But, his anchor versus double team and stuff like that can be damn good. His ability to just overpower people, you know, can be every bit as good as those guys in that department.


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[Assistant] Uh, but that's what he is. And, and then two, he was a, he was asked to two gap a lot. Unlike the other guys we talked about, he was asked a lot of the times to, hey, hold the guy up, right? Just hold them in place and then see where the ball goes and dis, disengage that way. Strong as hell, right? Really gets off the blocks well.


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[Assistant] Really can hold his ground as a run defender, right? He can play five technique, like we were talking about with Darius Robinson, where he can just be like, hey, biggest tackle, biggest man on earth, don't worry, let's go at it. Played it quite a bit, right? Well, a lot, right? Now, that's where to me, you know, he plays and can play a little high at times.


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[Assistant] A little more upright maybe than some of the guys we've talked to, talked about at this point. And that's where sometimes like,


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[Assistant] Every now and then you'll see a double team that kinda moves him and I just go, well, he just gotta learn to do it right. Like, he's not worried about it, but every now and then you see one move him because I think he's, he does play a little too tall that way. Right? Uhm.


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[Assistant] But, you know, as a run defender, there's not much you're not gonna like about him. And then, you know, still, even though I'm painting the picture of a little lesser athlete, I don't want it to be thought of as a lesser athlete. It's still a damn good athlete. I mean, his ability to kind of shuffle


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[Assistant] Sideways laterally down the line of scrimmage and follow a run while people are trying to chop lock him or get at his feet and get him out of the play. Very good in that department as well, right?


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[Assistant] So that's where I really like him. And then, you know, as a pass rusher, it's, it's pushed the pocket.


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[Assistant] You know, he does show a unique ability to kind of get on the edge of some guards and then kind of like you go, damn, he's just going to kind of speed by this guy and, you know, have a little bit of a bend and get to the quarterback. And you could see it right there. I mean, again, he's an express, he's, he's an impressive human being.


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[Assistant] There's no question about that. He's taking on Iowa right there in the middle and there's a, can we rewind that? Can we go back to that one if we possible? Cause there he was playing like the five technique that we talk about so much and I want people to watch and kind of see it, right? Oh, look at this in real time. Real time, rewinding it. He's towards the top of the screen, right? That's good. You're good right there.


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[Assistant] Right? He's the second guy from the top on the line of scrimmage. So go ahead, let him play. On the guard there. Yeaah. Or right on the, maybe a four. Right? But look, they down block him, he just throws the guy off, disengages, makes the tackle, right? You see that a lot on film. That's where he's very good at that.


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[Assistant] You know, his arms aren't ideal length for two-gapping.


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[Assistant] He does it at such a high rate that I think teams are going to ask him to do it a lot. You can see he is a powerful stout body. There's the one where you see a little bit of the bend around the edge that's rare for a guard, right? So even though he's not as loose and as pliable as some of the other guys we've talked about, as a pass rusher, there's something there to play with for sure.


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[Assistant] You know, obviously different than Darius Robinson that we talked about, but that's where I think he's a little bit different than...


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[Assistant] Carter and Byron Murphy and that I don't think you're going to get him as much and look at go, Ooh, disruption, get in the backfield, just create chaos. This'll be a little bit more of, Hey, hold your ground. Hey.


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[Assistant] Head up on this guy, just power rush him and push him into the pocket. Do that type of stuff.


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[Assistant] And I think he'll thrive there, right? You know, I talked about, there's really not a lot of negatives in his game. I thought balance and ability to anchor is not on par with Murphy. And that's, I think, just a little bit of the playing high and just being a hair stiffer than they are. Don't think he's the overall athlete the Duke and Texas kid are, right?


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[Assistant] You know, uh, he is disruptive, he's strong as hell, right? I didn't think his eyes were as good as those other guys either, right? There was games where I'd watch and go, uh,


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[Assistant] You know, I felt like those guys would get off that block and make that tackle. They would have saw it coming. There was plays in games where I went, oh, he didn't know that guy was going by him right there, or didn't really see it.


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[Assistant] You know, still, damn good football player, and I look at it, like, I wrote 25 to 40, and maybe I'm lower than the draft community, I don't really know exactly where he's at.


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[Assistant] And yeah, it's some of that, that there were, I really like this guy, yup, but he's just not quite in the class of the top three, cause of what you said. There was a little bit more negative, there wasn't quite as much disruption.


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[Assistant] And dominance that way, but of course still, we're talking about a big special human being here who's very athletic for his size and no doubt a starting defense alignment for your team, you know, in the near future here.


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[Assistant] I thought that was to me one of the things that really jumped out. You talked about the bend and getting around the edge a little bit and doing that. You know, like one of those two, like we talked about this with Dallas Turner, right? A little every now and then we go, that doesn't look that fast.


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[Assistant] But you go, damn, he's getting around this guy though. And you realize like, man, it's a big, powerful stride that covers a lot of ground that gives him the edge to kind of like turn the corner a little bit on a guard in a short area. That's pretty impressive. Alright, he's a specimen. There's not a lot of negatives about the guy. Uh, Johnny Newton, Illinois, number four.


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[Assistant] I'm embarrassed, like, and I say them in practice well, and then I, when it comes time to say it, I can't say it. I don't know, it's like amazing how I choke under the pressure there. He told everyone. Row, row, row.


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[Assistant] No, he will row your ass gently down the stream in a hurry. Not gently, not gently. He will push your ass down the stream. You better watch out. I mean...


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[Assistant] This is one of the, to me, this is why I love the evaluation processes. He's, I love turning on a guy that I haven't heard anything about, or whatever, right? Got no love, and I turn on and go, what? This guy? Who is this human being?


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[Assistant] Right? I mean that's the first thing. First off, he's got a great looking body. He's 6'4, 294. He's got 34 inch arms. He ran a 4'8, 9 at the combine. He ran a, he has a 1'6, 7'10.


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[Assistant] Right? Those are some of the good edge pass rushers. Had 1-6's, and 1-6-6, and 1- I mean, you know, not the top tier guys, but as we went down in honorable mentions, you started to get in those numbers. At 294? Right? That's incredible.


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[Assistant] He's one of those guys, Ahmed, I turned on the film and I went, wait, this is, he looks like a defensive end. Are we sure he's a defensive tackle? Like, if you told me, oh, he's 6'4, 275 and he plays the end, I would've go, yeah, okay. But then you look at it and you go, man, whoa, whoa, he's pretty dense. Damn, those are some legs. Whoa, he's 294.


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[Assistant] Great legs, love his upper body and arms, rocked up, long arms, right? Guy that again, gotta watch the film and ask yourself, he was playing out of position.


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[Assistant] Like we talked about with Byron Murphy, right, a little bit.


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[Assistant] Uh, Oro Oro Oro was playing nose tackle. Yeah. Okay. At 294, playing nose tackle. They were asking him to do the most physically, be the most physical strong guy in our defense against ACC offense lineman. And he was incredible at it.


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[Assistant] Now that's not what he's gonna be in the NFL. He's a three technique, right? But what that does show you is he has the pure power and incredible power for the coaching staff at Clemson who's seen Dexter Lawrence and those type of guys who go, you can play an house tackle like Dexter Lawrence even though he outweighs you by 50 pounds.


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[Assistant] He is really good. I mean, moves really well. You gotta watch some tape here now, because he does not get, if you just watch some games, you're gonna go, well damn, I mean, all he did was hold the guy up all game. I didn't really get to see much, or I only got to saw one or two plays of him doing something where they just unleashed him, right?


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[Assistant] But as you start to watch and you continue to watch, you start to see some of those plays and then you go, holy shit, he's really quick.


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[Assistant] And he gives guards when he given the green light to pass rush a guard or that, he gives them big issues and pass protection, right? He's got the great power we talk about, but he's got the quicks.


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[Assistant] To win that way, and he plays them off each other. Cause there's not a lot of moves in his game. He's a little bit like we talk about with Darius Robinson. It's kind of just like, I'm here and I'm going to overpower you. Right? And he does the same thing. So he gets you a little like this, and then he jams his arms in you. Ori.


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[Assistant] Off the ball. When he gets allowed to just explode.


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[Assistant] And they go, hey, don't hold the guy up, don't two gap. I mean, on contact, the guy blocking him goes backwards every time, right? He's got incredible, like a Darius Robinson, that first step explosion and his ability to shoot his hands and hit you with them, I thought were really impressive, right? You know?


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[Assistant] This is not just big strong guy, like, he showed the ability to shoot some gaps and be disruptive and do that. Again, he wasn't always asked to do that, so you don't get to see it all the time.


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[Assistant] And that's where I kept, I, you know, I started to get, run out of page here because I was like, oh man, I started to go, whoa wait, he does do this. Oh wait, he did answer this question. Oh no, like he's awesome at this.


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[Assistant] And, uh, really impressive. One of the surprises of the position for me.


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[Assistant] He definitely has the attitude, right? He's definitely got the nastiness in him for sure. You know, one of the things I wrote at the end, I wrote, you know, I bet you Joe Walt was impressed with this kid. Joe Walt got matched up against him and couldn't move him one inch, right? Not to say he dominated Joe Walt, but it was like, wait, here's your top seven pick of the draft.


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[Assistant] Here's this kid, he's not outclassed by Joe Wall at, in any way, at any way at all. Let alone, the rest of that old line, which is pretty good in there in Notre Dame, he had moments of whooping their ass a little bit. You know, like our guy at Duke did. Uhm, so, yeaah. You know, 29 benches of the bench?


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[Assistant] With 34 inch arms, I think that explains a little bit, right? The get-off, the length in the arms, like I said, he moves people backwards, right?


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[Assistant] You know, he can be disruptive. His anchor versus double teams is insanely good for his size. Again, he anchors at 294 like I see guys that are 345 sometimes. I go, well, it's, it's, he's immovable, right? Uhm, he's not as loose and as pliable as the top guys. He's a little more stiff.


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[Assistant] A little of the out of position, not totally sure exactly what he is, and then you alluded to this, or you quoted somebody, because, you know,


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[Assistant] I wrote, he doesn't have the same instincts and eyes in the backfield as the top guys have. He definitely will get into, wait, I'm gonna, you hit me and I'm gonna beat your ass. And it's like, no, no, the guy's running by you right now. Don't worry. You can beat his ass next play. Make the tackle, right? He definitely can get a little caught up in that. There's no doubt about that. You see that.


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[Assistant] That to me is like, the learning of the game, the out of the position, playing out of position, being a little stiff, not sure, not getting that evidence to go, wait, he gets to do this all the time, I got to see a ton of snaps, I know it, I'm for sure, right?


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[Assistant] The other guys, you get to see them at one spot and know for sure at a lot of the time. So there was a little of that. He was a guy that I actually wrote, reminded me of Keon White a little bit.


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[Assistant] That, that, that is who he reminded me of. But, you know, the, played out of position, one-on-one pass rush, he is awesome. Bull rush is great, right? He's got good quicks too, really good football player.


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[Assistant] Wait, coach, I play this position, but wait, you want me to do this and learn this? Oh, alright, wait, I'm just getting good at this. Oh wait, now it's third down, now you want me to go back to my position that's good? Oh wait, it's a big play, now I need to go back to the other position that's good? Oh, you need, so that's, that's hard, right, for a young guy that hasn't played football. Yep. We'll see.


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[Assistant] My money would be on, from what I see on film, as far as intensity, physicality, importance of the game, that he's gonna be a guy that's gonna thrive in the environment.


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[Assistant] 12 the highest? I think that's kind of where I would see it going, you know?


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[Assistant] Yeah, that's where I at least can see a possibility of it. Okay. Right? Hey, Jaylen Carter last year, let's not get this and forget about this. Jaylen Carter.


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[Assistant] Was the number one player in the draft. Like, Jalen Carter, if he doesn't get in the car racing thing and all of that, is going to be the number one pick in the draft last year. Everybody has to realize that. He was very special.


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[Assistant] Like we said at the top of the show, it was week three and I was going, I think he's the best team in the stock on football already, right? So that's different. There's nobody like that this year, right? Uh, but yeah, I think generally that's kind of where I look at it. 12, 14, 15, somewhere in there starts the, the Byron Murphy draft.


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[Assistant] I kinda make a top 5 as I go along, right? So I'm always like doing it. If I've watched 10, I write it down on a piece of paper when I get done with the first 10 and go, okay, here would be my top 3 or 4 from this group for sure, right? So I kinda keep a running list. The first guy, Mike Hall.


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[Assistant] From Ohio State? I liked him a lot. Damn, right? I mean, he's kind of a surprising guy, I think, when you kind of break him down.


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[Assistant] There was a time, I thought, where I was like, is this guy gonna be in my top 5, right? Is he gonna be? I mean, he was fringe, for sure. 6'3", 2.90", 33.5 inch arms, right?


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[Assistant] You know, like you're saying, bouncing off people, loose, bendable, can win in the awkward positions that we talk about, right? Right? Plays hard, great motor, right?


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[Assistant] Hodo, one of my favorite as far as disregard for his body. Like you were talking about there, you kind of emphasize that. You know, I'm big into that. You know, again, life's not going to be perfect in the NFL.


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[Assistant] You're gonna begin blocked and be in a weird position. It's gonna be third and two and Derek Henry's coming up the middle. You're gonna go out there and put your body on the line and make the tackle? Or you're gonna go, oh, that's gonna hurt.


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[Assistant] He's gonna just have to get the first down and maybe I can make a play next play. There might not be a next play. Next play, that could have been a touchdown now that you didn't dive in front of, right? Who knows? So, I'm big into that, I really am. Uh, takes on double teams, well, has, I talked about the


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[Assistant] The, uh, the balance is incredible, right? Not in the ground ever, right? That's big too. You can't be on the ground and be a defensive tackle. If you're on the ground as a defensive tackle, right? One, you're an injury liability. Two, you're probably gonna trip somebody else on your defense who's trying to make the tackle on the guy on the ball. Nobody wants the guy on the ground.


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[Assistant] Right? There's now an area voided that the coach can't, like, make up for. So that never happens, right? You know, gets knocked around like you talked about and still holds his ground. Incredible eyes in the backfield. Like, incredible. Right?


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[Assistant] He might not have a lot of wow plays, but the best thing he does is he doesn't have any bad plays. That's the thing I wrote. You know.


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[Assistant] Very consistent, reliable player, you know what you're getting, has the ability to be a real pain in the ass as a pass rusher in the NFL.


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[Assistant] Has bend, has good quicks, and good power. I really like the kid. The more I watch him, the more I really started to like him. Starting three technique in the NFL, never bad play, under the radar, really good.


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[Assistant] Definitely. That's where, you know, again, the versatility, three technique, five technique, you know, hey, line up out here, but shoot inside and now become, you're re-lining up a DN, now shoot inside and we're going to kind of have you play deep tackle, but do that. I think he could do all of that. I think he could do it at a really high level. Yeah, he was one of my, uh, you know, pleasant surprises of the process.


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[Assistant] I think I've already been hit. I think I've already, this damage has been done. I honestly think Thomas Davis is bouncing off of me right there, right? I think he's already hit me.


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[Assistant] And he's actually bouncing off. So this is the moment that you basically said goodbye to your spleen. This was the moment for sure. Right. That's why I'm making that weird face. Cause I think I've, like I said, I threw the ball away. I was throwing the ball away. I knew Thomas Davis was coming. I was going to kind of throw and right and turn my shoulder and take the hit.


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[Assistant] But as I got extended to throw the ball, Jenkins got me from behind.


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[Assistant] And I ended up getting even more stretched out to where yeaah, I'm, I'm pretty sure this is post...


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[Assistant] Thomas Davis has hit me and now is bouncing off of me. Oh yeaah. Right? You know what I mean? Uh, and that's why my face is like, awww, something got smushed in there. Yeaah. And then the next play in the huddle I was literally like,


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[Assistant] Because I couldn't, I had like the wind knocked out of me times 20. And the next play I had Michael Clayton open on third down for like a 20 yard gain. And it's like my abdomen was in spasm or something.


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[Assistant] I threw it like 12 yards and skipped it to him. Like I couldn't like get my body to lean up and like, like extend.


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[Assistant] Let me say this, I told you this before the show, this was the first time


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[Assistant] Personal bias crept into my brain the whole draft, right? Cause I like the kids so much. First off, I have so much respect for his dad. I don't care that he took my spleen out or not. To be clear, personal bias, you almost put him in your top five cause you liked him so much. I like him so much. I got tremendous respect for the dad. The dad is like really,


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[Assistant] One of those guys we talk about a lot who's a great player that we all forget about because he wasn't in the Hall of Fame or not on the Super Bowl team where I go, he was like one of the best interior D linemen in football for a few years in a row.


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[Assistant] Yea, Jenkins is an amazing human being. Jenkins, I loved being around Chris Jenkins Jr. Right? He is phenomenal that way.


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[Assistant] And again, certainly a top 50 pick in the draft, definitely, but just know to me didn't merit a first round status, right? It's a lot of good, a lot of good.


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[Assistant] Right? It's consistent good. I don't know if there's ever any great or wow, right? No, so that's what I, I think you're getting, again, a guy that's very safe as far as the draft is concerned. Sure. The floor is high. I just don't know if I think the ceiling is incredibly high. We'll see where it goes. His combined numbers,


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[Assistant] Are more athletic than what you see on film at times. Right?


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[Assistant] And we'll see, maybe the MFL unlocks him a little bit or he takes it up to a new level. Really like the guy though, and again, three technique, five technique.


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[Assistant] He can play strong side defense and gonna be able to do all that type of stuff. He's bendable. He's flexible. Like we talk about the bad plays, right? They're really not bad. They're not. It's just stalemates, right? So uhm, but as far as the wow factor, maybe not on par with some of the, you know, top guys of the draft.


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[Assistant] Because, I mean, one, you said it. I mean, there's some athletic attributes that need to be brought up here. I mean, when you just, like, if you talk about, like, whoa, who's that guy that just got off the ball? Whoa, that was a disruptive play. Like, Brandon, Braden Fisk would be up there with some of the top guys on the draft.


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[Assistant] The problem is, like we always talk about, the bad is bad here, right? The bad is almost sometimes like...


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[Assistant] It's almost like Cartoon Bad, where you're like, whoa, they're like taking him on a ride down the field, and he's eight yards down the field now, right?


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[Assistant] He throws his body around, he plays hard, right? But I think the reason I can't make him a top 5 DT...


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[Assistant] Uh, is, yeaah, the inconsistency that way. I mean, you saw it. I mean, again, you don't need to watch much to go, whoa, wait, that guy just got a hold of him and he's literally six yards downfield. Or whoa, it's a double team and he's on skates, right? Alright, that's gonna scare people. He's one of these guys too, it's like,


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[Assistant] Maybe you play him on the, maybe you'll play him at five technique. Maybe you'll play him at strong side DN. He is so athletic that I think he could play literally three, four outside linebacker. Like he could do that. I would be like, he'll be fine. He'll be fine. I mean.


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[Assistant] He's not, there's lesser ones out there, you know, so that's the problem. Uhm, but he is, like, his good plays are a, they're a lot of fun to watch. That's interesting, yeaah. He's explosive and as crafty as it gets as far as just being disruptive at times.


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[Assistant] I feel like early on in the NFL, because he's top heavy, right? He doesn't have great legs, he's kind of around the belly heavy, like that kind of look, right?


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[Assistant] Right, he's got that, you know, little Fred Flintstone-ish type of like body and even running style and how he runs, right? Uhm, but yea, it's the, it's the top heavy, getting off balance, you said it, double teams, wrestling matches, they're not his best things. I think when he gets to the NFL, you gotta play him, you know, strong side defense at end.


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[Assistant] On first and second down. Let him be that guy out there.


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[Assistant] Right? Maybe he can work on his anchor, get better at some of those things, hand fighting, all that as far as a de-tackle. And then maybe on passing situations, you move him inside. Right? I think that's generally...


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[Assistant] How I would, would look at it, right? But there's no way defensive line coaches in the NFL are going to watch Braden Frisk and go, I want him to start a three technique, right? I promise you, if you do that, the team they're playing is going to run for 200 yards running right at that three technique, right? So that's where he's got some work, uh, but damn, there's some stuff you like about the explosive athlete.


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[Assistant] Right, I mean that's gonna hurt him. Let's just, let's just be sure here. Like, you know, getting a DWI three weeks before a draft.


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[Assistant] Right? When, like, it's part of the litmus test, like, don't screw up during this time of the year, right? No, no, we're watching you. Can we trust you?


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[Assistant] Can we invest money into you long term? Right? Are you gonna do the little things to be a pro?


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[Assistant] Between this and then him not weighing in at the senior bowl, right? Those are two things that everyone's gonna go, ooh, gosh, how serious he is about his game, right?


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[Assistant] You know, it's, I guess when I turned on the film and I heard Big 12 Defensive Player of the Year, right, you just think, okay, I'm going to see something pretty special here, right? This guy had heard a lot about him.


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[Assistant] I was thinking it was gonna be Vita Vaya, Sexy Dexy, right?


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[Assistant] Jordan Davis, who we talked about, it's not that. And that's why he's not in the first round conversation. Those guys were elite athletes to go along with being almost as big as Devondre Sweat, right? They were probably 345, right? He's 366, but they were different that way. This is not


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[Assistant] An elite athlete that way. This is more of your true, what we started the show off, traditional, we want a nose tackle. You sit here, you don't let anybody move you for 16 weeks in a row. Just stop the run, right? He's that guy. That's who he is, right? So.


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[Assistant] You know, there's things that you want from him a little bit more, right? I'll go into like a, you know, again, not to say he's Mozzie Smith, but there's things about the Mozzie Smith comparison since his name came up today where you'd go, yeah, there's plays where you'd go, I just, can you, I want a little more. Can you throw that guy off you? You're big and strong. You shouldn't just let him block you like that. You shouldn't


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[Assistant] That's one of the things I just, the movement of the player, there's no urgency or violence in the game. Yes. Right? There's gotta be some of that. I didn't see anger. I didn't see intensity that way, right? You know, he pushes guards, but it's not like wow, right? His get off is just, you know, average, I thought.


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[Assistant] You know, and then add that to not violent strong hands, right? There's just not a lot of domination that goes on there. Not that he loses a lot.


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[Assistant] But a true space eater, right? I wrote not in the same stratosphere as Sexy Dexy or Vita Vay or Jordan Davis, right?


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[Assistant] You know, uh, sweat is an okay mover, but doesn't have the twitching explosion those guys have. Too many plays where he's content, being blocked, not nasty, no fight. Even with double teams, you know, gets moved a little too easily at times. Right, that's where, again, I'm going, wait.


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[Assistant] Wait, this is the demons of player of the year and the guy over here has made 75 plays and nobody can move him in Byron Murphy and he didn't get demons of player of the year? I don't understand that, right? He is loose and playable. He can definitely do some two-gapping as we know, right? He is the typical guy. Is the NFL environment gonna bring his level of intensity and


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[Assistant] That's where it's gonna be really interesting to see, right? But, you know, there's, like you said, I wrote at the end, there's pieces where you go, whoa, that's really good. But then you watch another game and you go, I didn't see that the whole game. Where did that four play some Oklahoma game go?


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[Assistant] Here we are. It's Iowa State. It's like, it's nobody. There's nothing going on. What's going on? How is that be? Right? So, that's gonna be the big question about him going on. And I think then you add the DWI and the weight concerns a little bit.


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[Assistant] I think vo- like Tavandre Sweat, I think before the DWI, I would have- I wrote down 50 to 70 or 55 to 75. I think probably now you're talking about early fourth round, somewhere in there. I think he falls out of the first two days of the draft.


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[Assistant] Exactly right, exactly right. Like those other guys, that's where, like, you know, I think they missed out. Everyone just thought, oh, they'll just dominate in that game of the circle.


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[Assistant] And not that I'm patting myself on the back or whatever. I think some missed or whatever. It's just that no, no, no, they had more, right? I mean, they can rush the passer or they're athletic. They can shoot a gap every now and then do all that, let alone be dominant in that little box against double teams and all that. No, you don't see that. And, uh, you know, hopefully he can get all things straight in his life. And with that,


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[Assistant] He's a little bit like the Braden Fisk conversation we just had, right? Where you go, wait for his size and let me pull him up, right? You know, cause he's- What is it, doorless? Doorless, yea.


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[Assistant] Doralus. Brandon Doralus. He's one of those guys for whatever reason that's listed as a defensive end even though he plays more de-tackle, right? Uhm, and 6'3, 283, I mean he's extremely explosive and athletic for that, right? He moves well. The thing will be like this, it's a little bit of


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[Assistant] He's a wow inside edge, inside rusher, but not a wow edge rusher to where I go, oh wow, I mean his, you let him line up offside and him like, no, no. And then on the inside, even though he's a wow pass rusher in there and he is an athletic mover, you wouldn't trust him against a run.