[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I disagree because you won't grab the shoulder either. I don't think it's a...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah. And you have to be incremental and forgiving of yourself. Like, honestly, what you learned with Yokubon is millimeters make a difference. And that if you can move your whole presence on balance, in your stance, into the space, and be relaxed just a little bit,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like, if you're fighting somebody and they're one inch, two inches closer on almost all movements, it has this wearing effect.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Name pending. Uh, if you're listening to this on iTunes on podcasts already,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Because his fight, his net fight name has been Nate. It's been said Nate, it's spelled Net-er, with an R.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I know, but there's too many, there's too many variables in his for, in his Nate, Nate fight, fight. So, and I also like the name of Sakna Rong.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In the description. And uhm, thank you to everyone who already is a patron in making our multi-library grow, and like, honestly in, oh baby grab this please. Thank you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Slight interruption, but helping our multi-library grow. Uhm, go ahead, help me.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, thank you to our sponsors. We have, uh, Smack Gym in Australia, Chicago Martial Arts in Australia, uh,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It helps everything stay together and you're part of the Mocha Library family. So uhm.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We're magical. Uh, welcome to the Muay Thai Bones Podcast. If this is the first time- Ooh, it's gonna be on the audio.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, if this is the first time listening to us, uh, you're probably watching on our YouTube channel. It's always a new YouTube channel. Uhm, but if you're a patron, a supporter, you can get the full audio, uhm, library of all our Muay Thai bones stuff, uhm, for even being a $1, uhm, supporter.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, totally. So you can subscribe to it on audio or watch it for free on YouTube.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If you are listening on audio, that's uh, Thailand tropical rain pounding on the roof that you're probably hearing. So, I don't know, are we gonna be shouting?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay, if you're new to the podcast, this is Sylvie, well I'm not going to say two.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And, uh, I'm Kevin, her husband, supporter, photographer guy.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And what we do is, in the multi-bones we basically film and talk as we...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yes, and long-form training videos with legends and great fighters of the past, uh, just to get their knowledge archived, like...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's like, uh, beyond. Is there something bigger than a library? I mean like a mega library, but I don't know. A library of Alexandria.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, 100% of the net profit.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So the profit, the net profit goes to uhm, the crew fund, which is a year, an annual distribution of funds to everybody filmed in the library. Uhm, so you can support us that way. Yes.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The Muay Thai Bones Podcast, sorry for the long intro, I always like to like-


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, he's so good at drives. What am I gonna even say?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We can go back and translate into Thai, and maybe even translate the library into Thai.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So, what we do in the Muay Thai Bones, those of the, you, people have been begging for another episode, we just have not, you have not been fighting.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Before that, even four times or more, but now it's about once a month. We're gonna try to keep up with these bones. People love them. Uhm, we love doing them. It passes the time in the car. We talk about really important stuff, though. There are some very good Muay Thai podcasts out there, but they're nothing like what we...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Bring uhm, I just, I'm kind of impressed by our podcast. Uhm, we talk detail, technique, Muay Thai technique. We talk.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Not only Muay Thai, but uhm, even spiritual ideas, connections with Buddhism, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I don't know, we try to take very deep dives into, uhm, Muay Thai. And one of my things is I really kind of don't like talking about stuff that's happening right now. I want somebody to listen to this in 10 years and be like, this is really interesting.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Other than, oh yeaah. So-and-so won on one championship. You know what I mean?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So we try to move towards a kind of like timeless, deep, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So, if you're not into whatever we're talking about,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Pulled out of the parking lot of our car and there was some kind of like nut? Giant alien nut had fallen from a tree onto the car. Right, baby?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This first topic, we write the topics down as they just come to us during the week or month, however long it's been.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And this one you just, was just something that occurred to you, I think a week ago?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It came from watching, what, we were watching Muay Thai on television or something? You wanna lead the way on this?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, so part of the way we, when we talk about Muay Thai scoring is a lot of it is our own reflection upon our own past misunderstandings.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well let me just hold back for a second because if someone's listening to this and they're not


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'm not familiar with Muay Thai or Thailand's Muay Thai. The reason why we're talking about Thailand scoring is because we're very used to this


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There's this big gap between the way the westerners perceive fights, read fights, and the way Thais read fights. That there's a, there are very large


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And then, and then they give it to the tie and they feel like the ties are biased against westerners. They don't, they basically are cheating in the judging. And,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It might happen like that occasionally. You've had very few bad decisions in over 200 fights. We can almost always see where the decision comes from.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's most likely if you feel like you've been ripped off.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you have no clue where the decision came from, it probably is a mistranslation. And so the topic this time, it's helpful if you already understand this, what we're talking about. Like, if you're new to it, this might be a little bit weird.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This is a nuanced reading that you came upon of helping understand how Muay Thai is scored fundamentally different than other places in the world like kickboxing or UFC.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And, well, let me, one more thing, I wanna stay, I don't want you to go past that comedy analogy about how when you're in the audience of a comedian and he starts to, or she starts to get on a roll, and you get to that point where you're like, everything they say is funny.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like every uhm and urr is like setting up.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Part of what we're talking about is that the scoring of a fight occurs in a live, uhm, experience where the dominance of a fighter


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The way that they're interacting with the gamblers, but also with the audience themselves and the anticipation of who's gonna dominate whom and how, that once a fighter gets rolling, the audience starts to get a feeling, just like they would at a comedy show. The feeling is, this guy's pretty funny.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The next thing he's saying is pretty funny, but if you're watching it from a video, like a video screen, like through separation, you might be like, yeah, he's doing pretty good, but these other points are scoring against him.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well I think boxing is actually not the strongest.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's not like sports where points are scored. Isn't that what you were kind of heading towards?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay, I wanna move away, I'm not criticizing you, but I wanna move away from the comparison to boxing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, I'm gonna, no, I wanna contrast poker to point scoring.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like, the way that people think of sports as scoring points.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right, but boxing is a poor example because historically boxing...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, George Foreman talking about Muhammad Ali, and he's like, he would fight like a lamb for seven, eight rounds. Like a lamb. And then he'd become a dragon.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You waited too long, but, and even now, I think boxing probably has become much more point driven, like, uh, adding up the amateur is significant. Well, and also UFC significant strikes and counting number of strikes that have landed that there is this concept of points, but historically boxing had a richer


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Talking about, what's so beautiful about your poker analogy is it takes us very far from points on a calculator. Like, we like in the West to think about


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Muay Thai, kickboxing, everything in the larger context of how we score sports.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, you're counting points and that as we try to understand from our Western concept, even if we understand boxing and there's many ways to get confused in Thailand scoring, but this is a very particular element of Thailand scoring which is


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If you're just trying to figure out what scores and how much, like there's a very big, uhm, concern like, why don't punches score? Like why don't punches have as big a point than kicks?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] When you're talking about that, you're still thinking in the framework of points being scored, like a basketball game.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You're not just playing poker with another player.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You have the gamblers all around you and the gamblers are deciding whether or not they believe you. So it would be like if you were playing poker and you were bluffing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And all the gamblers were like, I believe his hand's bigger.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But it's whether or not the gamblers believe him.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which adds this additional pressure. Many times we're watching a fight and we're like, that fighter's in it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And it's because he got the message from the gamblers that this guy's hand was better.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And we should say, neither of us know poker very well. This is just our very, like...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I mean, you bluff by putting more money in the pot. You're like, my hand is good. This is actually one of the interesting things.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Thinking about poker, this is one of the interesting things about some art, and our


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Our perception of Summer, who's widely considered the greatest, uh, fighter of all time.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] One of the things that Samart was unbelievable at is that he would win fights never getting out of second gear.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But, he wasn't doing nothing. He was a poker player.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I have all these skills. I'm not gonna bring them out.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'm just gonna beat you with teeps and jabs, and then I'll knock you out.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But he like, he created the illusion or the impression that he always had a really big hand. That, and so, he would never, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He would seldom get called on his, what's really in his hand.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He played from the lead so much. And I think he had a magical quality.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] about him because of that. He was like an incredible poker player because he never had to get-


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That is not easy to do. He was fighting some of the toughest men in the history of Muay Thai.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, people who, their whole thing was to make you sweat.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] When he got a second gear, against, and Diesel Noy was maybe the greatest fighter for real, and had size on him, we saw that when he went to third and fourth gear, he didn't have what he pretended to have.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And, but that almost makes the magical quality of him even bigger. Because he was able to bluff himself through fights. I had very strong recollection of him fighting Nampon.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, you don't see the whole fight, so you can't really see what happened, but Samart was kind of like, I mean, Nampom was a relentless knee fighter, and Samart was just kind of like...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Just brushing him off. Even if Napan would like throw him to the ground and fly over him with a knee into the ropes, like total dominant move, somewhere it's like whatever.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Maybe he won that fight as a poker player.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay, but please tell people who won't show me.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, no, it was only one and a half years that I asked about. Maybe you expanded it?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay, but who he is is one of the...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] One of the best Muay Thai fighters who ever fought in the golden age, which was filled with the best fighter.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You're a Muay Thai fighter who spent a lot of time trying to learn how to, uh, massage out, artfully win fights. One of the more interesting things you've said about Muay Thai scoring is there are so many ways to lose in Thailand.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Things that you can't even imagine, like, oh, I just looked over at my corner in the fifth round, you just lost the fight.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So we have a Muay Thai bones where we talk about root. You can look that up.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah, totally. And maybe we can link that in a description.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But, what I want to ask you is, so you've, one of the coolest things about fighting so much in Thailand,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Is you learn all the nuances of how to lose. Like all the tiny things that can lose you a fight where otherwise you'd win.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you're getting, you're absorbing the details of the culture really.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] When you think about, oh it's a game of poker.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What additional thing does that bring to you as a fighter? Is there anything about the analogy of poker that makes you think, I've gotta get better at this thing? Or...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Does it add some perspective to what you already know quite a bit? Like you know how to fight a fight in Thailand.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Who didn't know Muay Thai very well, he came, he's a UFC fan, and he was like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] On the disputed Rotdang vs. Ganap, uh, fight decision where Rotdang won. But this guy was like, I was on Twitter and I was kinda like trying to explain to him that how you respond to a punch helps determine how big of a score that punch was.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Because he's western, or western-oriented, he was like, that's ridiculous. And he used the phrase, he goes, how you wear a strike actually affects the scorer?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's like, because it's a game of poker, it's like how you wear your hand. And I remember like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You, this was like 250 fights ago or something, when uhm, what was her name? Nong Mei? Mei?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you poker faced yourself to a win in that fight. Yep.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And she had no idea. You were basically bluffing. You were like, I could take those kicks all day. And a low kick is not a super scoring.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well the judges don't count it as a hurt, but you as a fighter know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'm saying it was, so he poked her face and it didn't work.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's weird though, because it can go over the top too, where you're like...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Become a clown about it either. There's a feeling to it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] When you watch Muay Thai fight, continue scoring it as you normally do, which is...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Probably just your feeling for the sport, and some sense of scoring, like who's doing the most, getting the most strikes in, ba-da-da-da. But I would say, also ask yourself, around round four, into round five, if this was a poker game, who had the better hand?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And very often, whatever that feeling is, like who has the better hand, will be the winner.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This topic, oh man, what a fucking big crazy topic. You're looking at me confused.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It touches on so many things about Thai culture.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It helps if you've been following Sylvie, but even if you're not, we're gonna try to make this interesting to people who just come upon this. In Muay Thai culture, the fighters...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Have a name. They usually have a, what is it, like a fight name? Like a bless name? Which would be something like...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Translated something like, black diamond or...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Victory flag, right? And then they would, their last name would be the name of the gym, generally. The gym in which raise them, train them, supports them, that they have a contract with. These are tie fighters. So, the names of


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's the general template standard of what a Muay Thai fighter's name is. And then there's a, uhm, an additional layer to that where fighters would not take their gym name, but they'll take a sponsor's name.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] No, they both were. Oh, was he? Yeah, I think they both were taxi meter.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right? So, there's a, there's, either you take the gym name, and you, or you take a sponsor name. So,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Where we got to in Sylvie's fighting? We got to a political place.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And also a caring place, where we're like...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We need to separate ourselves from pattern room gym, which has been this long time powerful family-like relationship you've had with, uhm, the gym here in Patia. Well, Patia where we're driving. Uhm, and so, I guess we'll enter it from this side way in terms of the name.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Because we kind of split off from Petrum Rung for reasons we'll talk about, uhm, interesting reasons, it became also important not to fight with the Petrum Rung name.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So no longer Sylvie Patron Rung, and we had to come up with a new name.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It was, became prudent or smart to do so is that the things that you do as a fighter but also as a journalist are so far outside of the boundaries of what normal is. In the world, like there's no one in the world who does what you do, but then in Thailand which is a much more traditional


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Hierarchical, uhm, culture and subculture of Muay Thai, they rea- you really are breaking, uhm, custom every week. Like, every day.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you've been doing it for years and years and years.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, it's a double-edged sword. Because...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Pedro Rung is actually, has been an incredible gym because they've let you be a norm breaker in so many ways.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In the things you do with filming the Muay Thai library, which involves filming with legends and traveling and fighting way beyond what normal people fight. Who's in charge of suddenly? Yep. Becomes like, the thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And a large part of this is because you fight with the Petrum Rung Neng.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] When you fight with someone's name, you represent them, they represent you. And so, we got to a point where we're like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We have to make a change because the kinds of training you need to do to get to Sylvie 3.0 and a lot of this came because of COVID. We were like, you're not going to be able to fight very much for the next year.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, it's not only that, there's no Thai in Thailand who spars as much as you do.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, I guess the, the ten, that's really where a large part of the tension came about is because COVID made this us aware, like, let's just devote this


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which means breaking from the typical ways that you've trained over the last six years.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Made you a certain way. And it made you a very good, successful fighter. But you wanna get...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which involved really radically changing up your training patterns and to do that inside the gym.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which is a family run traditional gym, was just producing tremendous friction.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Because things are done a certain way. And you used to be like, fucking balls to the walls do all the training that was assigned to you. Like you were a very obedient student in those walls.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Little Sylvie doing her weird thing in the corner doesn't matter at all. But when the gym becomes empty and there's three people training and one's being fucking weird and wanting to do all these other things, it produces a necessary friction. And so we basically


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] First, we removed ourselves from the gym completely. We're like, this is just causing conflict.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And now, you basically constructed a training regimen that was completely new.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right? So maybe let's talk about that a little bit.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Was, we're like, we're going to Sylvie 3.0, and we're like, it's causing too much friction at the gym, the traditional gym, so we're removing ourselves from Petren Rung, and we're just gonna like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Why don't you just talk about why it's painful for you, why it was painful, because that's what's most important to you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And that will lead to other stuff. Because I'm more interested in...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What, what you've done to piece your training together, but you might not be...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's not easy to do this in Thailand. We even did it at Lana. But we didn't go to other gyms.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But Adelana, when we were at Adelana for the first two years, you were having your training and we were like, this is not sufficient. So we started taking private lessons with Nung, with Big Nung, who is a ex, uh, international champion boxer.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And it produced tension within the gym to be, suddenly he was a low status trainer, even though he was an amazing


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I'll say this, that's not the first time that you've kind of been like put into the shut it down to be respectful. Remember Krunat was like, don't train this summer.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, I don't know, you're not responding. Maybe I can't read your mind. Yeaah. I'm saying, I'm saying, there are times where crews feel like respect is established by shutting it down. And you're not a shut it down person.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I don't know, maybe six years ago when you were fighting everywhere and not representing anybody we'd like show up in a festival fight and who do you represent? What's your name? There's only recently in the last maybe year and a half that Petra Rung got attached to you in a meaningful way for a long time.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You kind of were nameless, even though you had the wrong name, you were not like...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Creating a footprint on the fight culture where what your name was mattered.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] One of the interesting things about why you have to be this way is one, you have very high aspirations in terms of like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Wanting to be Yodemoi level, like to really be a, we'll talk about it later, a magical fighter.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like the fighters you adore of the Golden Age, like Kara Haat or Diesel Noy.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you're a woman. And there are no paths. Like...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There are no paths to yodemoi as a female fighter. They do not exist. There are some paths to go getting a world championship belt as a female fighter. Like, historically you can go train at House and Rit Gym.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] For a year and you'll probably win a world title.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well connected gyms, train you with great technique, give you great training, can set up a world title for you, and


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] World titles come out of those gyms. But that's not what you are.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's not what you are after as a female fighter. There is no pathway. So...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In Thailand especially, where things are much more kind of, there is a kind of laissez faire, sabai sabai thing, but underneath that there's a lot of rigidity.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In the culture and traditions and customs. Are you okay?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Straining the paths that are available to you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If you want to go there, you have to walk up the path, or you have to walk this path, and then hop onto this path, and then to that path. And that's kind of what we've done. And it feels like to me that female fighters in Thailand, like Westerners, who are pretty damn serious, have taken your lead on this, but also run into great stress.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like I know Maggie was trying to put her in Chang Mai, was running into limits in her training, was trying to supplement her training privately with other coaches, people that you trained with. I remember other fighters trying to like piece together opportunities, changing gyms.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] As a female fighter in Thailand, if you have a very high aspiration, it's really kind of impossible to stay on a single road.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] See, I kinda, I agree and disagree about this flexibility. I think because you're a female fighter, you've been allowed, to a certain degree, way more freedom than some males might.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] No problem, it doesn't- no skin off of my nose.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, but even if he did, I mean, I think being a woman has allowed


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Because when female fighters are not that important in traditional Muay Thai, there is a degree of freedom because you're not significant.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But then if you become significant, there is another thing that kicks in, which is, who is controlling this woman?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This kind of like, wild rice thing. You know what I mean?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And so our solution is to kind of like, separate out. Actually to spare other people from


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The burden of responsibility and reputation in a certain regard.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, as much as you can. For us, it's always this kind of like baby bear. It's like you want to be not too hot, not too cold. If you get too close to a gym,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you bring too much attention, and there's too much success, then suddenly...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] All the questions of responsibility go to the gym.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He's never dealt with you as a fighter. You've trained with him and filmed with him. But we, out of the blue, because he's, uh, uh, connected to people in the South, he's famous in the South, and we saw a card was happening in the South, we were like, hey, we're like, hey, Hippie, can you get me on this? You never asked anything of him like this, really, and he just whipped it up for you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There still might be great opportunities, but then suddenly, face becomes a very important thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So, if I tell the story that he was joking about Diesel Noi...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It just shows you that even in this one instance, representing him is actually a thing. Like, you are here representing me.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] People have tried to get Sylvie to fight at her, who don't know her well, tried to get her to fight at her own weight, but it's kind of not fair for her to fight at her own weight, because she's so strong. But Hippie was notoriously too small for everyone.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So the weird thing, you're like this too small fighter, you are representing him in more ways than one.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If you're listening on the podcast, this is the brain pounding on our, um, roof. I hope, I hope it's still, the audio is audible.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In ver- not only was it humorous and awesome,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They hear that, but they're the seed of actual truth there.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which is, you're, why are you representing the other legend, who he knows you have connections to, and he's like, I bring you to the south where I'm the prince of the south, why are you not fighting like me? Somebody doesn't fight like him.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like this is a beautiful, like when we're talking about traditional customary Thai things and having to break norms,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's not all bad. There's something very beautiful about that, where hippies like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Put a little bit of me in there because I brought you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, so it's that sauce that is involved with what representation is.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And that was, that was part of the difficulty or the problem of


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Being too closely connected to a traditional family gym is that


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Sylvie is trying, is building a sauce with all the crews, like all the legends. She's filmed, not only because of the documentary, but she's always taken so many influences, and this is really kind of against the nature of Thai culture.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's really being outside of what a fighter is.


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[Assistant] It's again, there's two different things. One is you're a frong, so ties are like, that's a crazy frong.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And they're forgiving of it on a certain, there's a certain freedom that Ferong have where they break rules because they're Ferong and they don't understand or they don't.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, so, this is very, I don't know, this is so interesting to me because part of it is...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There's no pathway for female fighters to get to yodemoi level. You have to make it. You have to create a recipe.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And that recipe is gonna violate the norms like you're talking about with Hippie.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We'd like to keep fighting for him down in the south.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Comes at risk. And what we've always done is create these attitudes towards people where we're just like, let's put ourselves in a relationship where we pay a lot of respect and we bring a lot of shine and a lot of good to the relationship, like you win fights or


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Because it just causes problems within the culture. It's not even, it's really not even that the


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Person, let's say the head of the gym or whatever, like hippie, would object. But it's what other people say.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The ties are very gossipy, uhm, sensitive to gossip, and that when, and everybody has enemies. So, if you have a successful fighter, there's people talking shit about that fighter.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Whoever is the sponsor, in a certain regard.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I mean, there's also character traits, like one of the reasons why I am particularly indebted to Karahat.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Is that Karad is a very famous fighter. Like a very famous name. And he took you on as a student.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I think, he went to your corner, I think you lost 8 fights in a row. You're winning everywhere else.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You always win about 80% of your fights. Every fight, 8 in a row, Karahat was in your corner. People on the loudspeaker are like, Karahat! It's not like he secretly was in your corner. People coming to take pictures with him.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And, you lost eight fights in a row. I'll guarantee you... Do I go over here, maybe? Actually?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Acceptable, good ties, like good trainers, good crews.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So indebted to him because of him extending himself in that way, which is really beyond what normal, good Thai people do.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Every other day once in the every afternoon, every other day.


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[Assistant] No matter what name we take, it becomes problematic.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It will strain the relationship because of how you train, because of how you fight, because of what you do in the Muay Thai library, and the shine that's coming to you. It will problemize almost every relationship.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And it took you to a certain point and then we're just our commitment to different kinds of training. Oh, we didn't even go into the three creating this new kind of training. Maybe we should talk about that too.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In, actually ended up producing a name change.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right, so Chemical X, Sylvie Chemical X is the name we chose.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And we chose it for a couple of reasons. One is


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We had already started the Chemical X Awards, which is a promotional thing happening through the support of our patrons, where we're actually


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This is before COVID, where we were building a fight promotion in Chiang Mai that was designed to lift up the Thai female fighters, the Thai female fight scene.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And basically, encourage more dynamic, higher skilled competition with Thai female fighters versus Thai female fighters. Uh, it was- Financial bonus?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The chemical O-X-O wore it out, and we want to continue.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And we have a angel investor who's very interested in supporting it financially. So in a weird way,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You, Chemical X is the sponsor of you as a fighter.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Long Swan or Samson would be TaxiMeter. Samson TaxiMeter.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right? Uhm, but you have that also where you have like, so-and-so Pet Yandee on the Pet Yandee show.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Exactly, in a weird way. So there is a tying tradition or custom by which being silvy chemical X is not totally bizarre.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And then the other reason why chemical X, maybe you can talk about that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's not just that we were already doing a promotional series with Chemical X, but what does Chemical X mean?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, let's talk about the positive parts of it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The paths of female fighting, like what's available to them. If they just had Chemical X, what would be possible?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I think that's really in the spirit of what we're talking about.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well so it literally was not an all-female fight card, but it was billed as an all-female fight card. Right. Right.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We want to grow it, and that's part of what the Chemical X promotion ideas are. We're putting on all-female cards. But also, I think also the Chemical X goes back to your philosophy, which is fight a lot. Just create.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Volumes of experience and keep fighting up, fighting up, challenging yourself that the chemical X that's missing for female fighters is women just do not have the same challenges regularly put upon them to allow them to reach their potential.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The promotion we're thinking about, but really it's mostly about you. And as we described for, at length, trying to create a political in-between spot where


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Where we're not impacting somebody by putting their name on you and retaining as much freedom as possible to do as much good as possible as you move around between fight opportunities, training opportunities.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Oh, we didn't even get to talk about your training regimen. I guess we'll do that in other Muay Thai bones, or later.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's not outdated training. You train in three places.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We don't need to talk about yokan. We've already talked about 3.0 and sparring, but it's about piecing together. How you piece together. We'll do this another time, but how you piece together training after you left the traditional gym.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And are still working to create a constellation, a recipe. But this topic coming up, this is something I've never heard anyone talk about.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Huge. Like, potentially very huge.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Bouncing around the internet looking at articles, uh, interesting science articles. I don't even know how I came upon this idea.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I dunno, I read a study somewhere, I came upon a study which said that hormonal patterns within the menstrual cycle


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's more complicated than that, but there's two prominent peaks in the, in the, in two phases of the menstrual cycle. There's the follicular phase, which is what, around day 8 to 15 or something like that? 10 to 13?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The mid-fallicular phase, and there's the luteal phase, which is like around day 20 to 23 or something like that. So,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It has a different impact. One of the, what I was really interested in


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What's how the amygdala is affected when your hormones, when estrogen is peaking or what is it, progesterone?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The amygdala is the fear center of the brain. Like, it has many other functions, but it's


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] An older part of the brain and it regulates fear responses and also the encoding of fear memories, like powerful memories driven by fear.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And it actually, the amygdala is divided into two hemispheres. So,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Is the brain is responding very, very differently at different times in the month to things like pain or fear.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which means, there's actually, I don't think we have it linked up there. There's a graphic here. Which actually means that when you're anticipating pain,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Or experiencing pain, or remembering pain that just happened. The brain...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The female brain, I don't know what the more inclusive term is, but the female brain will process those events very differently at different times of the month. Which means to me that


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Literally different circuits are going off in different parts of your brain when you're experiencing fear or pain.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And the reason why this is so important and interesting, and I'm really excited about you jumping in on this, because you're the one who experiences it, is that one of the most difficult things a fighter has, especially a female fighter, is female fighters are always trying to justify that there are real fighters that, because they're categorically excluded from being fighters. It's coded as male.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So you are constantly trying to like live up to and over perform.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] One of the most difficult things for a female fighter is comparison. Not only are you comparing yourself to others, like other women or other men, but most damagingly, you compare yourself to yourself.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You're like, last week I could do this. I can't do this anymore. I'm shit. I'm regressing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I'm like, if you're a different person, if you're responding differently to fear or pain one week apart,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you start comparing yourself to yourself, you will be in crazy land.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You're like, what the fuck is wrong with me? Ooh, buffalo.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Oh, so he's got a beautiful chain or necklace of some kind, yeaah. So,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Maybe this is the point where you jump in, where we talk about, maybe you're more than one person, you're two different people.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And that you're training for two different kinds of people. And this comparing yourself to yourself. Like, I don't know baby, I feel like I'm like...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It seemed like you were referring to tracking it without introducing that we're tracking these things.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay, so when you're talking about tracking it in this, you're talking about an app, like there's men who will be listening to this, so.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, you're also a very physically tough person, so it must have been...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'm gonna slow down because this is worth, nobody talks about this, it's worth taking our time and going down all the little side paths. So, it's good baby.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Five, ten days ago where nothing stops you or hurts you and then suddenly you don't even want to be touched.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, well, it's complicated. We're not gonna go too deep into the science of this. You can talk about it on the forum. But one hemisphere of the brain, I think it's the right hemisphere of the brain, is more sensitive to sad faces, like recognizing sad faces.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Especially in women who've had physical violence in their life and in their childhood. And then the left, but the left hemisphere, which is luteal generally, is more prone to recognizing angry faces and even seeing neutral faces as angry.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which I find really interesting.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And magnify it. It's like suddenly people seem angry with you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Whereas it might be a very small facial element, but you become like, it's like having a very attuned sense of smell.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Or you could even project an angry face on a neutral face. Like apparently in this one study both things happen


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] During a heightened luteal phase, uh, mid luteal phase on the right amygdala.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which is really, really interesting because you're training and you're like looking at faces to get cues whether you're doing things right.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] A lesson, like when, when you learn a lesson through fear and pain, like fear and pain are big teachers of the human organism.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If you learn that lesson, at least some of these studies suggest, if you learn that lesson in, let's say, the luteal phase, it's different for different women so you don't want to over-generalize, that lesson will stick harder. So if you're like, I'm gonna try this thing out,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] All the things that were kind of interesting to me, and I looked at, I don't know, uh, 12, 15 studies.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The difficulty in the science is that studies are always very narrow. So they test for one particular trait of one part of the brain during one part of the cycle.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And then you try to extrapolate and build pictures of the things. But one of the things that was interesting to me was the kinds of things they were talking about.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That change phase to phase that could change are really important to building yourself as a fighter.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In the luteal phase, left, the left amygdala is stimulated. And the things that you become sensitive to are, could be sensitive to are, uh, fear, uh, fearful faces, angry faces,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Criticism, like you say, in the luteal feeling phase, you can be much more attuned to error.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If your inner coach, if you're like trying to be like, uh, step on the kick and do this thing, you might become very, very sensitive to error, which means that you're constantly over-correcting yourself and feeling awful about it, probably. It's probably pretty harsh.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Realm to be in. And these are very interesting kind of like dynamics to be


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Supercharged during a three to five day stretch in your training.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You can either change your training to avoid


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] On the follicular phase, which corresponded stimulating the right amygdala, much more, uhm, emotional memory, like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Fear conditioning, if I recall, being more sensitive to social placement in a hierarchy of a group.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like these become important elements or social pressures. So if you're in a gym and you're like not feeling like you're fitting in or you're the only woman in the gym or the girls are all clicky and you're on the outside, at that time you might be very like sensitive to this. Uhm, reading sad faces apparently is a thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Even more interesting or complicated about this is


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Depending on your own biochemistry and your personal history, you might


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In the follicular phase. Oh. The opposite.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That, that, that, which side of the amygdala is, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Triggered can vary strongly.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Not across the population, but like if you were the subject of sexual abuse as a child, or physical violence, if you've had powerful, it seems that if you've had powerful emotional


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And so, this is what kind of is interesting is,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You can't go look at what the studies be and be like, oh, that means that in my luteal phase I'm gonna be more sensitive to error.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What we've realized is, you have to find your own patterns.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The, the studies tell you maybe kinds of things to look for.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And that leads to what you started doing, which was tracking yourself.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Let me pull back for a second. So you've created a spreadsheet on Google Docs or something, right? Spreadsheet.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Of like, of the cycle, one through, I think we put it up to 31 even if we want to use that. And in every day, there is a, uh, list of categories of emotional type categories of that you're rating on a 1 to 10 scale.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right? So every day when you spar, this is related to your heavy sparring in yokan, with yokan, you then have your experience and then you come home and you rate what your emotional experience was in these like, what is it, nine categories or ten or something like that?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Can you list, I know you listed a couple of them, but try from your memory what were, what are the categories that you've been rating yourself on so that you can figure out what the pattern of sensitivities are.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well that's one of the more interesting things about this is just because some sensitivities are amplified because of how your brain is wired isn't fate.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] These are not just all detractions of...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] These are all intensifications that probably have bonuses and weaknesses, strengths and weaknesses. Any organism that develops certain traits allows it to survive, right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So, if you're moving into a rawness state, maybe you are also developing other capacities, like maybe you're raw, but you can recover.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But the ultimate point is, you, it might be helpful to just track your own pattern.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah. Another component you mentioned


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I guess we'll post the list of categories. We didn't cover them all. There was rawness,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But it's kind of good if we haven't had enough tracking to really develop a pattern.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We've had two months maybe, a little over two months I think. But if you know that the next three days, five days worth might be low, that's really important to know because it's not there's something wrong with you or where you're at in your life is not good. Or the


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We'll, I'll throw this out there now, although we haven't really spent a lot of time figuring it out, but it's my intuition that maybe these very low worth days are actually part of a kind of manic-depressive or bipolar, uhm, dynamic where


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Your worth is very low, but it also could possibly also, in that phase, punch up very high. That you're stuck on the low end of a pole, that actually what those days are may be extreme days.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And we're just starting to explore this idea that maybe low worth days could actually be exaggeratedly high worth days because you're just in a state of kind of like a manic depressive thing and you're stuck on one end of it. So that's something to work on.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's something worth studying or thinking about in your own life. If you start hitting really low worth days, hormonally, it might be part of a kind of like bipolarity.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Valuable to explore what the other poll might be. It was something we've just started thinking about.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Another thing that I think is really important about this that you mentioned but we talk a lot about is coaching.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's like, for one thing, most people's coaches are gonna be our male coaches, just statistically and culturally. A lot of male coaching is like, shaming, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay, there's a separate thing, but what I'm, I didn't get to my point actually, which is these tendencies in male coaching, if you look at them, they don't match up well.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The amygdala's response to phases. If you are in a phase where you are


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You're very prone to error detection and to voice criticism and your coach is yelling at you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you're, and he has an angry face and you're sensitive to angry face. Whatever he is doing is probably damaging you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's going straight to your fucking amygdala, which is your fear center, which is your animal memory of fear and pain. And so, those things might at another time toughen you up.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But there's something about the male toughening approach, especially how men respond to shame a little bit differently than women do.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And that's something to know. If you care about your, if you care about your students, your female fighters, you gotta know that something that might have worked last week is having a very bad effect.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Or you gotta find what the thing is that works for them.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Then. And I, I guess this goes back to that other idea that you're, we came up with this idea that you're really training two people. And it's probably more like five people. But it's start to start thinking of two people.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Also, as a fighter, if you realize that you're two people...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, or if you're that fighter, you hide your breaking point. It goes back to that poker analogy, that you hide your breaking point.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Every human being will break, it just, they break in different ways at different times. And great fighters look like they don't have one, but they fucking have one.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Take baseball bats to, like, in Mayweather.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You don't have control over when you're, what cycle, when in your cycle you're fighting. So you not only want to train yourself differently to your cycle patterns,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] To get the most out of you, but you also want to learn how to fight effectively when you're raw.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Become the best version of yourself.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Whatever cards you're dealt that day, it's like cards. Like maybe you have to bluff a lot if you don't got a lot in the tank on that day. You have to learn how to pretend like you do. I don't know what the skills are.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's not that interesting, I guess. But one of the things we did was we changed our calendar.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We had a little calendar given by Appasara to you, and we would change the day every day, like October 17th or whatever. We change the day now to the day in the cycle.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So it's like almost like tracking the moon in a weird way. It's like a basically what instead of what date is it today, what day in the cycle is it today? But does that affect you in any way for me?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] For me, it's like literally starting to think about everything in the context of changing patterns.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Intuition geeked out feeling is...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Every point in the phase of the cycle.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Great capacities. It's not just, I'm physically weak, I'm raw, I'm not a very good fighter. The human body, the human organism, the creature, had to survive as prey. Like for millions of years.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] All phases it's capable of defending itself and I'm imagining that those capabilities


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Every part of the face probably has different strengths, different weaknesses. Even on days when your worth is really high, maybe you have brought some weaknesses that you're not, maybe your worth is really high, but now you're socially sensitive to criticism of people who don't believe in you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So your worth can be knocked down. Like, I don't know. I'm just saying.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's interesting to explore what hidden strengths phases might also entail and what hidden weaknesses.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I'm imagining around like seven months in we'll start to see. We've color coded the ratings so reds and greens will start to maybe like show their patterns, uhm, over time.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And then, the other interesting thing is, is you might getting, getting low scores, and like, what happens if you become aware that you get low scores, like rawness scores, and then you're like, well today's gonna be a raw day, and then you are prepared for it, and you have like, not a bad day, and so your scores go up.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And maybe we can do another multi-bones subject on this, like four months in, five months in, when you've seen what you can, what you've tried to change in your own training and approach.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I wanna, just, it occurs to me that we didn't put this in context.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I don't want to go too deep into it, but it also occurs to me that the reason why I started looking into the amygdala and hormones is because one of the biggest challenges you've faced as we've moved into this 3.0 thing is that you're sparring


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] 3.0, sparring, you're sparring 10 rounds.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Basically an hour a day against a Yodmoy in Yod Kumpan, and he redlines you. You're like, you're redlining every day. He's not redlining you physically, he's redlining your fear and your


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He's, but he's not breaking you. He's just like, making it shake. Right? And every single day is doing this.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Is that you are exposing yourself to very high fear cortisol level responses. Like, you are spiking


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Every day for an hour. It's not just hard training, it's


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The emotional place you're going to is very fucking difficult. And I'm very proud, proud's the wrong word, but proud of you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I admire you to be able to go to this, like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Emotional place. Everyday. It's like having a nightmare every night. No, for real.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It moves, but he moves it with you, like, very... The benefits have been really amazing, like, your moe is really changing. We set to change it, and it's fucking changing. But, it's a very harsh path.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And that's why we started looking into the amygdala and phase, the phases of the menstrual cycle, because


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Because you're spiking, you're hitting your fear centers so much.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Every part of the month you're going to be responding differently and just to be able to manage and get some kind of compass heading.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Because it's so over your, it's like trying to sail in a storm.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But at least keep the boat pointed in the right direction, I guess. And keep it from capsizing. Right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I don't know, why not, my hope is that this conversation starts, like, I've never read anybody talking about this. In terms of fighters, I know in female athletics there's probably been some discussion, but in terms of fighters, this is so important. Am I going straight?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This is so important because of the nature of what


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Training and fighting as a fighter is, it's not the same as pole vaulting or sprinting or


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Swimming, like, like enhancing your performance. What a fighter really is is an artist who works with the clay of fear.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The fear, your opponent's fear, your fear.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Enduring pain is one thing, but the pain just triggers fears.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] How your body is processing fear emotionally.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I would think this is one of the most important elements of female fight training.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Even if someone's thought about it, no one's talking about it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, their own perceptions of their own cycles. Like, and if you have a problem with faces, certain kinds of faces,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Baby, if you're fighting and you go back to your corner, you go, you have a round, a tough round, you go back to your corner and you see faces of your coaches being angry with you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's very, that's very hard, like, maybe.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'll say this as your husband, I have willfully made an attempt not to make


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Different faces, like, to put on a face. I made an attempt to look at you, like, in your eyes, and connect with you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] With some positivity, like I'm coming from positivity, because I feel like if I do that, it'll be easier to read my face.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But if I am like looking at you and connecting to you and I have in my heart like positive thoughts, I'm like my face will become more readable.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Maybe I'm making it up in my own head because I'm looking for stuff, but when I look at you and I have that positive element and it's not a particular thought, and then you, I see your eyes meet mine,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you have a recognition, like you recognize something. It feels like what's really happening at certain times of the cycle is you're just very face sensitive.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I don't know, it's something I've been thinking about putting more conscious effort into it, so if a fighter's coming back...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] To the ring, to the corner, and you're like, not looking at them.


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[Assistant] And they're face sensitive at that time. That's a big, that can be a very harsh thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The ways in which sensitivities, changing sensitivities can be, uhm, accommodated and played to.


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[Assistant] Yeah, I just, like you say though, we really want to get away from the idea that like, women are crazy, or these are incapacities. I think it's just intensification. Why are you laughing?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This is one reason why I find female fighters in a way much more admirable than male fighters. Because they really have to overcome more.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] To even be performing at a decent level because of those internalized wars with oneself. Like, I know men have a very hard time as fighters and the...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Present, presenting as a tough guy or something like that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The culture holds them in that place. There's slots for them. Female fighter, there's no place to really rest yourself.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You're constantly trying to overcome these elements and I think this just complicates the whole picture.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, it was a little high. Like it was, like, this should be checked.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, we should say you've had gastrointestinal stuff for


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There's so much stuff you can google about GI stuff and...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Microbiome and we don't need, uh, lots of comments on things that you should check or test or don't need a doctor, doctory.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This has probably been something that has been working counter to you for maybe even as much as 10 years.


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[Assistant] You're like a cat, you don't show pain. That's so crazy.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You talk about, also, you had a pretty powerful, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Physiological response to taking out dairy, like, I'm not even sure, like, you've lost weight.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So, so when you went keto, I think you were often, often around 48 kilos, right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, right. And then you dropped out dairy and you dropped out it down again.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Part of it is you probably dropped calories because heavy cream and coffee, cheese, uhm, maybe your caloric intake.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It is so strange because looking at you before you didn't look like you could lose weight. And then you kind of like shrink wrapped again.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I just, I hope it's all healthy. To me, as long as you're maintaining your muscle.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, I'm worried that your calorie, I mean you fast every other day, and you don't like chow down on your eat days like crazily, you just eat healthy meals, but I'm like, is it?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'm just wondering if your caloric intake has dropped or not, but that will be seen probably in the wasting of muscle, and you don't seem like you've lost muscle.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And we'll see how that unfolds. I'm like, I try to talk to you about maybe getting away protein.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, supplements to make sure you're getting enough protein, but...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And his keto. And now, Darry, now you're taking out Darry.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, not in caution, there's a thread, we'll link it on the forum, which has


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You're, it's an extreme, if you're training hard, it's an extreme diet and you have to


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like, you don't want to put yourself into deficits. And honestly, I don't know that we'd recommend this for anyone.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I mean I understand what weight cutting is, but how does this have to do with, I don't want to fetishize extremeness.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well ultimately the extreme dietary approaches were to mitigate other extreme things about you. Like you were having huge mood swings that seemed very connected to sugar and carbohydrates.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So, you did this extreme thing to take out this other extreme thing and to level yourself up. Right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So I'm saying it was actually the extremeness is in the name of becoming more level.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like if you can avoid hits of depression, then you're not being extreme.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Sylvia was just saying, I don't want to do Sylvia's advice column.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, and you made a vlog, which was actually a really cool little vlog, but we wanted to expand and talk about the ideas behind that vlog.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, let's, you're hinting at it, but maybe let's just talk for a minute about how you've been, like, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So harsh on yourself for all those years being really disappointed in your technique. Like, it has been like a train of negativity.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Not only your technique, like literally training it and practicing it, but then also critical of yourself in fights.


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[Assistant] And it's like, what you're talking about is an approach that kind of like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Alleviates that history. Takes the edge off of it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like if you want, we can talk about your kick. It doesn't erase-


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay, but I want to talk about your stress, like, not just all of it, like what has changed, but you're not talking about what has-


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] How were you 3 years ago, 5 years ago, 8 years ago? Like, part of this is that you


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Had serious issues with certain leaves. Right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right, but you're talking around something without talking about it, which is...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Actually how you've related to your training for 10 years.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] No, you're talking about how not to do that, but what, there are many people who stress so much about their technique. Like, they want beautiful Thai technique. Right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] One of the most difficult things for you is how many years was, I'm not gonna say wasted, but wasted on...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Micro criticizing your technique.


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[Assistant] Yeah, but you literally won't talk about it. I don't want to argue about it. You won't literally talk about it. You're making me talk about it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I feel like you're uncomfortable with this thing that you don't want to talk about it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The story with Wung, when you moved to Uintelana, and you're like, Wung, help me with my kick. I want a good kick. A Thai kick. You're making me tell the story.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But no, you tell the story. Like, I want you to connect to this thing, which is this pain of the leaves not moving. Right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And it was very painful that you couldn't kick like a tie.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's like, you're like, no, no, the thing's not doing the thing, like wanting to correct it and perfect it. But Wung is a, he probably had 300 fights. For him, Muay Thai is, you just use the tools.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, like, you don't have the like, perfectly shaped hammer. You know, made by an artisan.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So that you can hammer nails. If you're a carpenter, you just want to hammer that fucking is weighted okay, and you just hammer nails.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There's a lot of people who are stuck in...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The hellscape of disappointment in their own technique. And they might not think that you live in that world.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, well then what to you are the leaves that won't move in Muay Thai?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You're sweeping, you're trying to sweep them and they won't budge. What does that represent in Muay Thai training?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Are wrong, yeah, wrong with your technique, right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you're like, I'm just pointing, I'm trying, I don't know why it's five minutes of us struggling over it. I'm trying to point out that you have a long laundry list of leaves that will not move that have been very frustrating to you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It doesn't mean that you don't have a list of leaves that won't move. And it seems to me that your awareness of this analogy of sweeping leaves


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Is a novel approach to things that won't move.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] From my perspective, you're like, I haven't solved this.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] At the right time or whatever stories are that you tell yourself that are still powerful. It feels like you have uhm, you have started to solve these techniques issues by a more global, relaxed approach.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which you described about in sweeping leaves. You're doing the work without great tension


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, and Thai trainers will tell you, block, block. Then in fact in the fight they even said it after the first round, block more. You hear this all the time.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I honestly think that one of the more profound elements of this analogy is the wood. It's like every person is made of different wood.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's in different patterns, it's different hardnesses, different...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Textures, exact, everybody different. Some of it's genetic and how...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Your body composition is, some of it is emotional history, some of it is, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We spend a lot of time comparing ourselves to other people, but everybody has different wood.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And if a technique is stuck on you, is stuck in your wood, it's not.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I like that you're like, change the angle of the broom, or change, change how you're sweeping, or go after these other leaves and leave that one alone for a while. Right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But I think as someone who loves you and watched you, like, struggle for a very long time, you had a lot of, like, war against leaves, certain leaves, and it's caused you a lot of, like, pain and frustration.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And uhm, I personally think that you're getting to this place. I think some of it is also


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Where it's no longer mechanical things that you're trying to like, get the angles on. You're dealing more with the feelings of techniques.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, a samuramslock punch or a karahat kick. There's a feeling to it. And it feels like you're...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But rather, how do they feel like you're inhabiting, you're being inhabited by a spirit of something?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, I think also because you're sparring so much more, you don't have time to fucking fret about the angles of things.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That you're grabbing things that work, you're using the words that come to you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right, so every day you go to training and you, you set about cleaning the place.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right? You're doing your bag work. I mean, you do need to know something about technique and correction is helpful, but obsessing about some small thing is probably counterproductive


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Anna, Anna, I'm gonna say this, we'll talk about it a year from now or something, but I'm gonna tell you so much of what westerners fret about, about their techniques and


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Everything has nothing to do with mechanics and learning the right angles and the proper positions because that's how everything's taught. It's about growing eyes.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Your techniques are starting to flower because of all your sparring.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And sparring a lot as an adult is dangerous. You can get, like in CTE, it's not ideal. Who you're sparring with is really, could be disastrous.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So I can't say everybody should be sparring a lot, but...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'm telling you, so much of this, the Thais get it when they're kids.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They get all the play, all the improvisation, all the stuff when they're kids, so it gets baked in.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I, I feel like that is really the whole problem of Westerners coming to the Muay Thai of Thailand is, it was never baked into you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And even if you were in fucking karate tournaments, you were not playing at Muay Thai with the low pressure playfulness.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But it's dominance, but it's play, it's dominance how like, puppies are dominant over other puppies.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That there is a liberty of experience that you have as a kid that gets baked in and then all the technique just flows out of it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But in the West, we learn all the fucking technique and try to create it, make it smooth, make it a proper angle, and all of the connective tissue of play, I think I'm gonna get gas here, uhm, is missing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, we can keep this going. I think also that uhm, oh, look at that mountain. Dragon tooth.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I think really the key to all of this, all of the technique is the eyes, the growing of the eyes from your ten, your hour of difficult sparring.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay, so, but what I'm saying to you is that the sweeping actions?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I think are paralleled by the fact that you're sparring an hour.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Hard with yokanpon a day, every day, and the techniques are cohering with each other.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Every second. But it's very hard to do that as an adult or an experienced fighter and to just relentlessly do this. But it's like, so much of what frustrates Westerners, I think, uh,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And they get very perfectionist about is...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Would be alleviated if they had eyes and they could see and feel.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And how to get that is not easy.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I don't think there's an easy way to do that as an adult. It's kind of like trying to become like a poet in another language that you were not naturally born to. It can be done. Nabokov was a fucking poet in English.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Next, last, this will be the last subject of this epic Muay Thai bones, like well over three hours, I think, already.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And we just keep going down the rabbit hole. Uh, this is a really interesting


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Thailand, but also elsewhere, like one championship, they basically have created, like, uhm, they've created three round fights instead of five round fights, and they're very, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They changed the scoring to emphasize aggression to, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Create a clashing kind of style which is quite different than, uhm, traditional Muay Thai where defense is prized, right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I read an interesting article. God, I wish I had the notes on it. I will link it on the fight site. And it actually ended up being two articles, because uhm, another article was, uhm, referenced in it. And it was, it was about the UFC and the rights and, uhm, the protections of UFC fighters.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Did a kind of economic analysis of the UFC and


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] One of the points he made was really interesting, which was because the UFC prizes aggression.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] All the fighters in the UFC make offense the focus of their training.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Everything is about becoming a more and more dynamic, marketable offensive fighter. And for that reason,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Defenses underdeveloped in UFC fighters. And he's like, what he was interested in was when you have this kind of setup, you actually, what you end up doing is, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Exploiting the labor potential and the lives of fighters.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Because these fighters learn how to be more offensive, and they don't learn defensive principles at a high level.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, it's not just their longevity, it's their safety.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Highly problematic in a sport where you don't even really train.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So what you really are going to have is fighters that are going to be injured, impaired,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] With CTE impaired for a lifetime that are kind of like churned up by the...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And then just used as an entertainment value and then discarded.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Harder. Exactly. Exactly. I think, when I read this, I was...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It was kind of a small point he was making in a much larger picture about unfair labor practices, which is interesting in its own right. But I immediately started, made the connection to this, oh look at that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I made this connection to this movement that's happening in Thailand with Entertainment Muay Thai, which is a much more aggressive, less technically sophisticated, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which has a different sensibility of what's excitement, but when you have exciting clashes, you're having, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Something maybe that is more international in flavor, right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And there's good arguments for that. And then also arguments for, uhm, the entertainment Muay Thai being good for Muay Thai fighters because they're generating income they wouldn't have, like, big, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Stamp became a star on, out of one. If she had been


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In female Muay Thai, she would have literally been nobody.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like, unknown, relatively unknown, maybe with a world title or something.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This is what's kind of interesting to me. It's like the UFC


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Under this authors, uhm, and it will be linked in the description.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The UFC, in his business model, is already practicing aggression first fighting.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And we're already seeing the effects of what happens when fighters train to the ruleset.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We, much of what we talk about in terms of


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The advocacy for Muay Thai in Thailand is care for the fighters.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I'm like, if we're moving towards aggro to me, aggro fighting,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Expressing this kind of western, internationalized concept of clashing aggression.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You're basically limiting the careers of these people.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] One of the more striking things, and people ask us about this a lot, about Muay Thai, traditional Muay Thai, like customary Muay Thai of Thailand, is almost nobody we run into with hundreds of fights is mentally impaired.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You can occasionally run into an old fighter who's punch strong.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] One, almost all of those fighters that we run into also box.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, boxing is much more taxing because there's a lot of head targeting.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And they fight in a closer proximity. It's much longer rounds. So yeaah, there's reasons why western boxing will take a toll. But one of the interesting things about


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Muay Thai fighters and old Muay Thai fighters and we've been around so many of them.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Almost none of them are mentally diminished, that we can tell. Like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There's not a punch junk problem. And these are people that devoted their lives to fighting. Some of them fought 20 years. And it's very likely the case


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The reason for this is because defense is prized in Thailand. It's prized, that's how you can win a fight.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] By being evasive or controlling the space in a positive way.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If you change Muay Thai for the sake of big fight purses, more broadly appealing, you're going to eliminate the defensive


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You couldn't live in the sport unless you understood spacing, positioning, like high level defense.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Was woven into the fabric of the skill of Muay Thai.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] 100%. And I'll never forget, I'm not picking on Max Muay Thai, all the promotions are the same, Max just led the way, they were the journey, but I remember when Max Stadium opened, and literally, I don't know what happens at Max now, but


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Ty had no idea what Max was really shooting for, and they were given a rule sheet that literally said in Ty, if you go backwards, you will lose.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Do you remember that? It was like, literally in the rules.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Understandable, they had to be, like, extreme in their


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Rural descriptions, because Thais didn't even have a concept of this.


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[Assistant] Because in Thailand, traditionally, if you're ahead, you back up.


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[Assistant] This is not to say, I mean, I think the, the entertainment Muay Thai arguments.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Ethical arguments and like marketing arguments are really interesting and complex. It's not all bad for me. At all. Like, there's pros and cons, trade-offs. It's...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We need to also think to ourselves, if we remove the incentive per defensive prowess,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Then the actual health of the fighters will radically change.


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[Assistant] We saw what happened, we were talking about this with Moai Cao when clinch was taken out. Gyms change immediately what they're training.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And he was like, it's just like elbowing the bag. Like all you have to do is, like you elbow the bag 50 times.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He was basically saying, this is just like bag work really, this isn't actually fighting.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He's already training her for... Okay, well, you wanna do bag work, Muay Thai? We can do that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like, he's already training her in that way because that's what the rules are asking.


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[Assistant] This is what I'm saying is that if the, if, if entertainment muay thai becomes the dominant form of muay thai in five years, all the thai boys will be learning it from age six or ten.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Because we're also talking about like the pros and cons of these shows, it is really good.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's good for female Muay Thai to harden up some and not be such a point fighting sport in Thailand. I think Thai female fighters...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, one second, we're playing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] High female fighters have benefited from these promotions in their own, in developing their own moi.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] About the long term effects of entertainment muay thai, aggression first muay thai, if it becomes the dominant commercial force in Thailand.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's more, so there's an ethical dimension, which is like, if you care about the fighters, people are like, uh, Rodin's making a million bot, don't you care about the fighter? Sure.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I don't think Ruot Deng is actually the issue because Ruot Deng grew up in fairly traditional Muay Thai.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Trying to be Rodin. He's not going to grow up in the more complex


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[Assistant] Finest. Like Rodin is exciting because he learned how to track down and chase down really good defensive evasive fighters.


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[Assistant] He's the bull, he's tracked down matadors that have been rewarded for being great matadors. So actually his stock, I made this point elsewhere.


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[Assistant] His stalking ability is so exciting because it was done.


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[Assistant] In an arms race against very rewarded defensive specialists, you've gotta be a great stalking fighter in order to catch these guys. Because the judging will reward the defensive fighter.


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[Assistant] Okay, so what I was, sorry we had a little technical thing. Uhm, so what I was saying was,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Once you take out the defensive emphasis,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You're actually gonna drop down the effect, the skill level of even the aggressive fighter. Because the aggressive fighter isn't gonna have to learn how to catch great matadors.


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[Assistant] Because Manador's, Manador ship will not work. It's just two bulls.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So then you just get bowl on bowl, bowl on bowl, and then you get


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Muay Thai kids, Thai kids, learning how to fight under a more rudimentary, aggression-first, uhm, reward system, and they will not even bother to learn defense.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like, yes, block your head, common defense, like how to block punches, but the more sophisticated elements of defense that make Thailand's Muay Thai so special is this, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It'll atrophy is the word, and then question is how much will it atrophy? And it might atrophy