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[Assistant] And I think they were looking at him to be the guy that kind of like, whoa, he's our weapon gadget, explosive plays, reverses, can catch a slant and go 60 yards. And man, it'll be dangerous if you double Terry McCorran and you leave him one on one and all that type of stuff.


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[Assistant] So one of those guys will show up, eh, gotta show up. Diyami or him, I'll go with Curtis Samuel just because he's been paid a lot of money and has yet to really be healthy or contribute the way I think they expected him to. Uh, he's the guy to watch. Can he show some of that explosive nature that we saw him have in Carolina, you know, uh, you know, a few years ago.


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[Assistant] Well, we know they love Alabama defense lineman there. I would think that he is the


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[Assistant] In the future replacement for Doron Payne, who's coming up on his last year of his contract, right? So this is almost like, hey, I don't know, we can't pay Jonathan Allen a hundred million and Doron Payne big money. So they got this guy coming up the ranks and I did like him.


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[Assistant] I did. I mean, he's a hell of a football player. He's gonna play a lot. And I think he is one guy to watch. You know, does he give them confidence to move on from Doron Payne? And so on. I mean, between him and, you know, Brian Robinson in Alabama, I'm interested to see him. But yea, that's a good one for you to watch for sure.


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[Assistant] He did not have a great year. Their defense was disappointing. In fact I would say their defense was one of the more disappointing units in all of football last year.


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[Assistant] Especially when they came off the playoff run the year before, where they were dominant in some games. Last year, we only saw two, three games where I went, oh, okay, this is the Washington team I remember on this side of the ball. It was few and far between for them this year.


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[Assistant] Well, I'm interested to see it. There's some things with him mechanically and things like that that I can't buy onto to know if he has a real starting quarterback chance to be that guy one day. Uhm, so we'll see, but I do want to see how he looks.


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[Assistant] This is last year because of COVID, but extremely talented and


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[Assistant] He made some good plays last year. He lit up some plays too. He's a young player. He messed up and you know, the Saints, they asked a lot of their corners. They don't always like, it's no free pass there in New Orleans, the corners. They put some pressure on those guys.


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[Assistant] That is a good one. I like where you're at there at room court. I mean, yeaah, you'd like, you know, him to take that next little step. You get him and Marchand Latimore, you start to go, oh shit, they got something going there in the secondary. It ain't gonna be easy to get open with that defensive line and everything they got.


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[Assistant] I'm looking at a lave though. Here's the one where I'm going with the first rounder. I am. Hey, Michael Thomas. Hey, I know what he is. He's gonna catch a lot of balls. He's gonna be consistent. Not gonna be a ton of explosive plays.


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[Assistant] You know, Jarvis Landry, same thing. Great route runner, a lot of intermediate catches, all that. They need a guy that can scare the shit out of you, like we talk about. And I think Olavi can be that guy. I do. So I'm interested to see how that goes. And to me, that'll go a long way with a team that's got a good old line. You know, they should be able to run the ball a little bit.


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[Assistant] But now you have a legit deep threat in Olave, and a guy that can do it all, don't get me wrong, but I think out of all the guys they have there, he's the guy that can really scare people down the middle, outside the numbers, win those type of one-on-one matchups with, you know, three rockets up his ass. He's the one I look at. Can he be what I think he can be? And if he can,


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[Assistant] He got put in a little different spot from the year previous to that. It's like they gave Garrett Wilson


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[Assistant] But I liked him the most. I liked him more than Garrett Wilson. You did, yes. I did. And uhm, yeah, we'll see. The Ohio State guys, I know I was a little different than the rest of the world.


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[Assistant] Uhm, but, but yeaah, I got my eye on him. Because if he does turn out to be what they think he is, and they traded up there to get him at pick eleven,


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[Assistant] Then, damn, watch out for the Saints. You know, the Saints, the Saints D, their team's real. It's just gonna be about Jameis and that passing game, sorry.


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[Assistant] Yeah, yeah. I mean, hey, me and Martin, you know, he's definitely, he's, he's their ass kicker on the inside. He is. And he's a fun watch. Uh, so I, I hear you with that. And Davenport's another one where you just go...


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[Assistant] Hey, I mean, they traded up in the first round against this guy. Is he ever gonna like, you know, show us something to where we go, oh, that's worthy of that. And he's a real force off the edge. He hasn't been able to stay healthy. Every time I feel like he's getting in a groove, something happens to him and then he, you know, is out of the groove. So, uh, we'll see, but that's still, that defensive line is real over there in New Orleans.


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[Assistant] And that was Albert Wilson. Yeah, Albert Wilson, who's a nice little addition to their football team as far as like maybe a guy that can really help us that third, fourth receiver.


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[Assistant] And throwing the ball looks like 45, 50 yards in the air. We'll see, I mean,


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[Assistant] I know that they were taken back by Mon's talent when they first got there, this new staff. They were all a little bit like, whoa.


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[Assistant] You know, we liked the way Thrib, we didn't realize his arm was quite like this. Did they not listen to the podcast? Well, I know, apparently not. And if they want to learn something, they better, okay? But, uh, I, I think, you know, his physical tools have opened some eyes there.


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[Assistant] Yeah, I don't expect them to get a whole lot of, you know, chances regular season wise, but I am interested to see.


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[Assistant] You know, what he brings to the table, uh, in that department. But I think ultimately, you know, this is one where you just gotta go, I go to like,


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[Assistant] Hey, they sucked in this one area last year, and they gotta get better. And they sucked on defense. In all areas, really. But passing game specifically. I mean, when they played some good quarterbacks with some good offenses, they got torn up. And I'm gonna go with the second rounder in Andrew Bruce from Clemson. Andrew Bruce Jr.


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[Assistant] Tremendous explosion, tremendous tackler, tremendous straight ahead speed.


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[Assistant] And, you know, maybe a little reckless with footwork and things, a little raw that way, slips too much, all of that. But man, the pure physical ability is real to where, you know, corner is an issue for their team and they need someone that can like,


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[Assistant] You know, show up and shut down some receivers at time when you talk about a defensive line too that's not necessarily like, oh, we can just rush forward and get after them all game long. You know, they're not that type of team. They're going to have to take some chances that way. And can he be kind of a man to man island type corner and make some plays for them? You know, Patrick Peterson, it's, it's coming to an end.


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[Assistant] You know, when you look at the rest of the secondary, I know the safety's okay. I love Lewis seeing how they drafted in the end of the first round. I know he's the lookout with Harrison Smith, but I look at the true cover guys to be the real issue, and that's where Andrew Booth Jr. comes into play for me.


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[Assistant] Tried to loft it up, not the greatest there, but hey, Seen, Seen, I can't wait to see what Seen does. Seen's one of those guys that you're just gonna get...


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[Assistant] He's gonna be Must Watch TV. Cause he is just, he's really good in coverage. But man, the way he hits and brings it on, man, it's, it's, I think he's gonna be one of those guys where it's gonna be, even though he's a rival in your division, you're gonna be like, man, it's hard not to like that guy and respect the way he plays.


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[Assistant] You're probably right. He might be, no, he might be one of those guys. He might. He's a little bit of a headhunter for sure.


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[Assistant] Yeah, I mean, Johnny's got rid of him a few years ago. He's still a damn good player.


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[Assistant] He is. I mean, he's, he's, you know, one of the better space eaters in all of football. He can two gap and even for a big guy like he is, he's got enough athleticism to be like disruptive and, and you know, crease a gap there and cause some issues. So they're, they're a team that's, um, you know,


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[Assistant] Not a lot of standout players on the defensive side of the ball. You got Harrison Smith. You got Kendricks. We know that. They do got Cesaria Smith now, which is nice. And we'll see where, you know, Daniil Hunter is.


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[Assistant] Uh, as far as that's concerned and, and what kind of player or what he's like after, you know, the neck concerns and all of that. Um, but yeah, they, they got their ass tore up in the run game last year too. It's one of the worst defenses in football. So I'm not, you know, Dalvin and Booth, they got to show up.


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[Assistant] Like I, hey listen, I'm not saying our buddy's wrong here. I wanna see Rondale more too. But I'm not so concerned about their weapons in their past game to where I go, oh my gosh, if this guy doesn't turn out, they're gonna be fucked. They're not gonna be good enough. So, I think he does to our, Swish B, uh, to his point, he's got a chance to be like,


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[Assistant] There's one guy that just jumps out to me, maybe more than the rest.


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[Assistant] And they have some like, you know, maybe another corner that you want to go, okay, you know, what can they do there? I'm messing with Marco Wilson, who did a pretty good job. I thought he was a rookie. Let's see if he takes the next step. But the freak in the middle, I think the pressure's on him. Isaiah Simmons.


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[Assistant] That's to me the guy that did not play up to expectations last year. Started getting taken off the field.


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[Assistant] They got rid of, uh, Hicks, who now is in Minnesota, linebacker, and I think this is a year. Let's, let's watch.


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[Assistant] He's got to prove him. He's in a little bit of a prove it year here. Yeah, you're athletic. We know you can run sideline to sideline and all that. Can you take on blocks? Can you fill gaps? Can you take on a block and get off it and make a tackle? That's what we got to see from Isaiah Simmons. So he's kind of the guy that I think I'll be watching here in preseason.


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[Assistant] To see if it's like, is it just pretty and all athleticism? Or is it, you know, are you ready to play middle linebacker and get a little nitty gritty here and be what they need you to be in the middle of that defense?


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[Assistant] I mean, he's, he was top ten pick for me. He's, and I know he was just outside the top ten, but he's a freak of nature. Yeah. And...


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[Assistant] You know, other than the obvious Jalen Rieger, I think he's the guy to watch. He's the guy I'm gonna go with. I'm gonna join the


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[Assistant] We're back, we're here. We're some Patiko. Jalen Rieger, yeah, I wanna see him, but I didn't pick him because they have Quez Watkins. And I go, okay, Devontae Smith, AJ Brown.


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[Assistant] And Kez Watkins to me is good enough with Dallas Goddard. So the pressure isn't on, even though Jalen Rieger is that first round pick that we all look at. To me, it's not the guy to watch. Okay. I understand we want to watch him, but he's not the guy. Jalen hurts. Yes, obviously.


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[Assistant] It's just like I kinda said in the pregame on Thursday night at the Hall of Fame. Team's really good. I know he's gonna make some plays. But can he be...


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[Assistant] Can he beat you with his right arm when they can't dominate in the run game? And that's what I worry about. And you know, again, you saw that in our last vision of Jalen Hurst was that playoff game against the Bucs. They stopped the run game and they said, look, can you beat us? And there was people open and plays to be had and he could not take advantage of it. So that is a big question. But Jordan Davis is the guy I'm going with. Yes. I just think he's got


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[Assistant] Replacing Fletcher Cox, you know, at some point here. And I just think he has superstar potential. And for a team that maybe doesn't have that great, great pass rusher on the edge, they got some good, a lot of good.


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[Assistant] You had a guy like this in the middle who I think could be great with Javon Hargrave and then you start to go, woah. You can't run on them and they're pushing the pocket up the middle.


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[Assistant] And it has a chance, I think, to make that defense like truly, truly dominant. And I don't think there are defense that wants to blitz a lot. You know, last year I got a little frustrated with them because I thought they were a little too vanilla and didn't send enough pressure.


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[Assistant] To where, okay, if that's what you wanna do, that's cool, but then you better get some guys up front who can win their one-on-one matchups a little more consistently, and I think Jordan Davis is gonna help that.


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[Assistant] Definitely. Who knows? Yes, I mean, yeah, what's, what's, you know, that's why we're at it. I just want to, like, I'm just looking up the Eagles and their, uhm, their defensive stats last year. 220 in the pass game, 107.9 in the run game.


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[Assistant] Yeah, I would think those numbers improve. I would be shocked if the Eagles aren't in the, you know, top six, seven defenses in football almost. I think they have that.


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[Assistant] South Alabama, uhm, right? And he was, uhm, one of those guys that was, I considered him top 5-6 receiver, but, you know,


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[Assistant] Probably ultimately was 8 or 9 for me when it all came down to it.


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[Assistant] Long, you know, longer guy who has some real, like, speed. I mean, you got to see on film him catch some short routes and turn up field and run away from some people and, you know, looks like he has the potential to be a pretty good route runner. You know, again, in South Alabama, he wasn't playing the best players in the world there.


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[Assistant] They're an interesting team here from this standpoint. There's a lot of guys that I think could like qualify for, ooh, player to watch on their football team, right? And...


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[Assistant] Like, so the receiver thing is real. So Jaylen Tolbert's definitely one of the names I've written down. I don't think he's the guy I'm gonna go with here though. Uhm, you know, I also look at their first round pick in Tyler Smith from Tulsa.


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[Assistant] And I go, ooh, I'm interested to see him. Cause he was one of my favorite linemen. But if you remember, he was really raw.


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[Assistant] Like, he was a killer, and he's a great athlete. But I mean, sometimes in pass protection, he was literally doing like the karaoke drill, and I was like, woah, if he does that, it's never gonna work. So, he is important, but I'm not gonna pick him either, just because


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[Assistant] You know, their offensive line, I'd like it to be better, but it wasn't a problem. You know, I think they are overrated a little bit and people think they're more dominant than they are. Uhm, I wanna go with an edge guy on defense. That's what I wanna do.


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[Assistant] And this is where I'm a little torn between Dante Fowler and Sam Williams, who they drafted out of, uh, Ole Miss. Sam Williams is like one of these...


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[Assistant] This is a Seattle scheme, Dan Quinn. They want a guy that can get off the edge and get after the pass rusher. You know, I brought up Fowler because he's shown some ability to do that and then did not play well at all last year. So that's why I brought him up. Sam Williams is one of those guys that maybe had the best get-off.


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[Assistant] Maybe in the whole draft, uhm, I mean his first step was like through the roof explosive. The problem was if he got hit on the side or anything like that, he fell to the ground. You know, he was a little bit of a linear guy.


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[Assistant] Nah, he had never heard of that. But I do think he's gonna be in a less complicated world where they're just gonna go get wide and just run straight. We don't need you to do some of those things you did in college football. And I'm gonna have my eye on him because he has potential to be


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[Assistant] Just with the physical attributes and everything to be like, he can maybe be special. And I want to see what he looks like. And they need somebody else on that front four other than Dexter and Lawrence that, you know, again, my always my phrase is to make some plays outside the realm of the playbook.


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[Assistant] And uh, he's, he's one that I think maybe has that capability to do that.


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[Assistant] I hope he does. You know, he was a guy we talked about a lot in the draft the year before. He was one of my favorite guys too.


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[Assistant] And I think that's a good pick by you. He is a little undersized. He's a disruptor and that kind of guy. And he's perfect for this defensive scheme.


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[Assistant] Can he be consistent throwing the ball? Can he throw the ball at the appropriate pace? You know, can he throw more spirals to make it catchable?


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[Assistant] Can he take himself out of harm's way? Played twice, got hurt twice. You know, all those things. Yea, he's worth it. He's the guy to watch. You know, just see how he looks in the preseason and hopefully it looks good. I do. I will throw out what I see at Victoria's 11th there.


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[Assistant] They're another team, a little bit like with Dallas we were talking about, like, who's gonna be that other...


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[Assistant] I'm not worried about Eric Armstead, and I would think Javon Kinlaw is gonna be damn good. We'll see. And then we know Nick Bosa. Yep.


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[Assistant] Who's gonna be that other guy off the edge? You know, there's no more D. Ford. And Drake Jackson, he was...


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[Assistant] You know, an honorable mention in my defense end rankings. He's a specimen and I think another guy where you just go, ooh, you let him just go off the edge the way his body is, his explosion, power, all that. He could be that guy, uh, that, you know, could maybe take that defense to a whole nother level.


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[Assistant] One other guy I'll just throw out for food for thought is, had their second round pick from two years ago, Aaron Banks. He had no contribution to the football team out of Notre Dame last year. You know, guard was definitely one of the weaker parts in their own line.


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[Assistant] I mean, what's, I want to see what he looks like in the preseason. I haven't heard anything about him or what's going on there, but the obvious one and the one I'm going with is Trey Lance, 100%.


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[Assistant] Yeah, but they, to your point, they drafted them with what, was that pick 13 or 12 that year?


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[Assistant] I can remember talking to Kyle that year during the draft because that was the COVID year.


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[Assistant] We were both, you know, we both liked the player and it was Derek Brown and Jovan Kinlaw, right? That everybody was talking about defensive tackle. And I can just remember him going, man, I don't, you know, do you think there's any way he could fall to us there? You go, no way. I really did. I'm sure. No, I was like, you got no chance. You're going to have to do something.


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[Assistant] I thought he was. Top 8 somewhere in that range. If Carolina took him over Derrick Brown, I wouldn't have been like, oh, that's so stupid. So we'll see if he can live up to that expectation.


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[Assistant] That's the guy I got written down. You're agreeing with Mark Floyd? I am. I'm going with 2-2 Atwell. Yeah, I mean...


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[Assistant] They need somebody else. I mean, it's Cooper Cup. We know it's Alan Robinson. Fine. That's cool. I don't think they have the type of offensive line that you're just going to be able to depend on like the 49ers week in and week out where we're going to just dominate in the run game. They got to play through the pass more. I know McVeigh is always going to stay patient with the run. That's what I love about him.


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[Assistant] Who is, you know, Ben Skvornik, I like him, whatever, I don't think, I wouldn't want him as my three quite yet, as my third receiver.


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[Assistant] To me, 2-2 Atwell has the chance to be that guy, speed sweep, reverse. You know, oh, we threw a screen to him and he ran up the sidelines for, you know, a 50 yard gain. He's explosive that way. You know, they get him going with those other two guys.


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[Assistant] And then even get an OBJ back at some point, yeaah, I go, oh, watch out. I mean, that's gonna be four tough, hard matchups to deal with across the, uh, across the board there. So, yeaah, I'm pickin' 2-2 Atwell as well. And I think another guy I just want to point out that's worth watching, because yeaah, you lost Von Miller. Right? And I know they got Leonard Floyd.


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[Assistant] And we know they got Aaron Donald. And there's things to like there. But-


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[Assistant] I just want to bring up Terrell Lewis, who from Alabama a few years ago, who I think they had high expectations to be a big time pass rusher. And when he was healthy at Alabama, I thought he was one of the better pass rushers in that draft.


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[Assistant] But he's kinda been all over the place, and I do, I do, I'm gonna have my eye on him in the preseason too to go, wait, can he be a guy that can come off the edge and, and, you know, get, get after the quarterback a little bit?


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[Assistant] I hope so. He's got a lot of talent. I think that's a good pick by you. He was quietly one of the under the radar stars of that team last year that made them as good as they were on that side of the ball. And he is the epitome of what we're talking about here. Like really damn good. Not going to show up in the stat sheet.


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[Assistant] Can take on double teams and do that type of stuff to where Aaron Donald can be free and go crazy and beat Aaron Donald and he has some real value there.


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[Assistant] He's not healthy yet. I don't know when we're gonna see him in the preseason. So that's the only reason I didn't pick him. But, I mean, you said it right. To me, him and Jamison Williams are the two most explosive receivers in the draft.


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[Assistant] And hopefully he can get out there soon. I know Rayron Rogers has been saying a lot of good things about him to the press that he's, you know, he's mentally engaged. I saw something Roger says, he's like, he's always in his hip pocket asking him questions. So that's positive to hear, but he hasn't had a chance to go out there and do that yet. And I don't know, we'll see him pre-season.


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[Assistant] But our man Dr. Butter is, that's right. I mean, he's gotta show up.


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[Assistant] With Devonte Wyatt, their second first round pick out of Georgia. I know Quay Walker, I loved him, middle linebacker, and I took a lot of crap because people were like, what the hell can you put him over in the Kobe Dean? Well, everybody in the NFL did.


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[Assistant] He had, for me, was a top 10 pick as well, just like we were talking about Jordan Davis. There were some off the field issues that I was not aware of during the process, and that's why he fell. But, if they get him to be what I think he can be,


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[Assistant] Like, watch out for that D-line. Watch out for their defense in general. Rodney Harrison made the point, like, that was his defense to watch in the pregame. And I think when you take it all down, him and the, that was in the Chargers are the two that I go, ooh, I'm excited for the potential.


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[Assistant] They got two good corners in Jair and Stokes. The kid they, another Georgia kid. You know, safety position.


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[Assistant] Darnell Savage is a pain in the butt and hasn't been as good as he should. Adrian Amos the other safety. But then we take Rashaun Gary and Preston Smith.


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[Assistant] And, you know, we got Kenny Clark in the middle, right? And we got Devon, Devondre Campbell, who did a hell of a job last year and hopefully him and Quay Walker do that there. But you talk about, whoa, okay, wait, it's Kenny Clark and Preston Smith and Rashawn Gary. And now you add a guy that I look at and go, he's Warren Sappish in the middle of the defense.


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[Assistant] He's the guy I'm watching, cause if he's that guy, then I'm gonna go, oh shit, watch out, the receiver thing might not matter in Green Bay.


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[Assistant] If they're just efficient and run the ball, their defense might be so good that they'll be a pain in the ass and maybe win with a different style and just be an ass kickers on defense.


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[Assistant] Actually, he's a guy, I'm not gonna lie, that like, remember watching him, you know, that year. 5th round pick. Big, big, like, you know.


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[Assistant] And that will be interesting to see. That's, that to me is always the most exciting thing about this time of the year is the under the radar, offensive lineman or defensive lineman that we don't really know about, but the team knows about, and now we can see what he's got. And man, you add him to the mix and some of those names we just talked about because Jaron Reed's there too. We can't forget about that.


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[Assistant] To where that's where they might be able to win and not have to have Aaron Rodgers be perfect all the time. Which would be nice for him to not always have to carry the squad and be magical that way.


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[Assistant] He definitely does not need to. He did play a little last year. Did he? He did.


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[Assistant] You know, they didn't play him early on because I think they had some injuries to the offensive line, so they stayed away from it. Uhm, but I do believe he played a few snaps. Maybe it was preseason game number three.


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[Assistant] They, I mean, they don't have a lot of question marks on their football team, that's for sure. It's one of the best rosters in football. I know, you know, the center position.


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[Assistant] Is an obvious one now with the, you know, the recent injury and we're going to be looking at Robert Hainsey. See what he can do there. I'm not going to pick that though. Okay. I just don't feel like picking that. I don't know why. Okay. Akim Hicks.


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[Assistant] On the demons of lime being there, I'm interested to see what he looks like with a bunch of fucking badasses there in Tampa. Alright?


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[Assistant] The guy I'm gonna go with is last year's first round pick. And that's Tryon Shienka, the defense end who's gonna be replacing JPP.


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[Assistant] Uh, Joe Tryon, to me, I just, I like the way he looked last year. You know, he didn't start, he came in and spelled them and played special teams and did all that, but,


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[Assistant] I mean, if he ends up being what I've heard they think he can be, which is like a star pass rusher, just good night. I mean, gosh, Vita Vea.


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[Assistant] Shaquille Barrett, Akeem Hicks, you know, Goulston subbing for them, and then now you got Tryon Shienka coming off the edge, like good night, see you later. And that would be scary, if they can just be that team that can always apply and win with four, you know, with the creativity Todd Bowles brings to the table.


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[Assistant] He's the guy I'm gonna be looking at early on to see if he's like, he's really ready to supplant JPP and that missing void there.


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[Assistant] Uhm, no, yeaah, it's uhm, I know, that's, that's where, and Logan Hall, I mean, I mean again, it's just, there, there, you got an embarrassment of riches at, at some places, and he is one of those guys that's like,


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[Assistant] You know, oh, we're going to play him a defense end because we got to stop the run. He can play defensive tackle and be a disruptive pass rusher type. He's going to be able to fill a few different roles there. And yeah, that's a very well orchestrated roster there by Jason Light for sure.


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[Assistant] Yes. Yup, and uh, we got another one coming Wednesday. We got another one Wednesday. AFC on Wednesday, baby. And Ahmed will be here and he won't be traveling in from a baseball game.


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[Assistant] Until he'll be here in all his greatness. Uhm, what else? We're gonna maybe take a few, well, we probably won't be able to take any questions from the homies. Or do other, any other segment other than this on Wednesday.


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[Assistant] That's not. It's hard. This is a dangerous, like, formula for a guy like me, you know me, cause I can't shut my mouth and I give a lot of oohs and this and what's and that's and all that crap, but that's what I do, I'm sorry.


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[Assistant] And tune in Wednesday to see if I continue to have more willpower than Ahmed Fareed. I mean, I quit weed, he can't quit Red Bulls and Vodka, or Red Bulls, not Vodka.


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[Assistant] Okay, okay. You're allowed to though. Come to work trunk. No problem. All right everybody. I hope you enjoyed the listen. I hope we gave you a little info. I know I enjoyed the exercise. Ahmed with his D lineman to watch. Awesome. That'll be a continuing thing throughout the year.


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[Assistant] Stay safe, stay safe. We'll see you Wednesday. Keep sending in questions. We'll probably get to them next week. I'm not gonna promise them Wednesday. Uh, but, you know, first week of preseason football this week. I'm really excited for that. Get back in, get to see some of these guys. Alright everybody, be good, be safe. We'll see you Wednesday. Clap it up!


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[Assistant] Hi, I'm Mike Tirico and thanks for watching. Make sure to hit subscribe for the latest news and highlights from NBC Sports.


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[Assistant] Little gut feeling of the competitor in timing that's like, gosh, too, this does not sound good.


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[Assistant] Yeah, no, I'll try to sum it up as best I can, but pretty much I got five days after my bowl game to come home and see my family, see a couple of my friends before I ended up leaving.


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[Assistant] No, I'd stay in California for a week and train and do board work and.


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[Assistant] I went to Mobile and did the Senior Bowl with Coach Gruden and had an absolute amazing weekend down there at the Senior Bowl. Like, I mean, I really think it was like the jump start to, you know.


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[Assistant] My campaign as a possible QB to get picked up in the first round. And then after the senior bowl, you know, you go back home, you train for a couple more weeks and then you go to the combine and the combine is a whole ordeal in itself. Uh, but the combine was awesome. Uh, being able to.


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[Assistant] You know, throw and run and then meet with the teams. Obviously meeting with teams is really, really important and then still going out and throwing and.


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[Assistant] Uhm, I think the weirdest part of the combine, just a side note, is that it is just definitely quiet in there.


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[Assistant] Maybe you think about it, quarterbacks, like, we're operating in loud huddles, loud stadiums. We've never, like, we throw the ball when it's silent, very rarely. It's like that was the weirdest thing you had to get adjusted to at that combine.


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[Assistant] Oh, for sure. Cause then, you know, we all have our routines during the week and during game day. Like I gotta throw at least five, six balls before I head out.


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[Assistant] But yeaah, when you take two to three throws and get back in line and...


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[Assistant] It was definitely different, but yes, getting into a rhythm was, was not the easiest thing of the combine, but.


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[Assistant] No, I was more, so I'm just going to be myself. Yeaah. You know, I, that's just kind of who I am. Uhm, of course there's a little competitive nature in you where you'll watch and...


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[Assistant] Alright, that was a good throw. I'm going to go up there and top it. But most of the time, you know, you just kind of stay in your own zone.


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[Assistant] When we talked about it, we said run your own race. When I was running the 40, don't try to run, you know, like.


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[Assistant] Super hard because then again you'll mess yourself up, so run your own race, do your own thing, like just stay in your lane and you'll be just fine.


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[Assistant] Pro day. Well I went back to California after the combine for like three days, four days.


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[Assistant] And went over the pro day script with Jared and Tyree and, um, coach Palmer. Um, and then I got to come home after that and I was lucky enough to have my private quarterback coach and from Kansas city. His name is Justin Hoover go out to California with me through this whole process.


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[Assistant] It's like him and Jordan both like, they, they both worked with me.


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[Assistant] To where like it was great. We had three, we had three quarterback coaches out there. We had Jordan, we had Justin who kind of worked with me.


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[Assistant] And it was just perfect and ended up being great. And then, so I got to come home after California.


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[Assistant] Which made my life a lot easier instead of coming back to Kansas City or Columbia and not having your quarterback coach.


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[Assistant] That's just is what it is, but no, so I got to come at Kansas City in Columbia. Had to bounce back and forth because teams would come in and work you out.


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[Assistant] Then once that week got over or two weeks out over, that's when I started taking my visits and I went East coast first week.


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[Assistant] West coast, second week and then went up north the third week. So it was crazy. You know, you're catching a thousand flights.


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[Assistant] Meeting a thousand new people. You get thrown up on the board by these clubs and these teams.


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[Assistant] You're meeting GMs, you're meeting presidents, you're sitting with head coaches, you're sitting with OCs, you're sitting with quarterback coaches and, you know, I went in, you know, I went in full suited, so I was all snazzy and dressed up.


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[Assistant] 10 days, 14 flights, 10 days, something like that. It was just, it was a lot of traveling, but.


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[Assistant] Uhm, then you can imagine the teams on the west coast, quarterback team.


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[Assistant] Maybe a quarterback that, you know, used to play ball for the team, had me out and was really good.


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[Assistant] Yeah, it was, uh, it was pretty unique because it just came full circle to where he played ball.


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[Assistant] And for me to be up for that, for him to spend time sitting down with me and watching film and having me install a play like,


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[Assistant] I would honestly go with a little bit of both. Like I'm 50 50. I want to say there's team.


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[Assistant] That I exactly know what's going on. Right. But the more and more stories I hear about the draft.


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[Assistant] I don't know. I've just gotten to the point where I don't even, I'm not even going to waste stock in it. I'm just going to wait. I'm going to enjoy these last couple of days. Here's my family working out. So with Coach Hoove here and, uh, just when that day comes, I'll have my phone sitting there. Hopefully it's charged up. Hopefully I remember to plug it in at night and they can eventually call me while I'm sitting around the table.


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[Assistant] Yeah, no, it was good. It was good. I, uh, he took me to an Italian restaurant, which, uh,


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[Assistant] Which, you know, I'm, I'm a big Italian fan. I get all the garden here in Kansas City. So for me to be able to go to New York and go to like a four star, almost five star Italian restaurant. Have some veal. I had veal for the first time.


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[Assistant] And the thing at the time was like, go secure your bag. Like, I'm gonna go make my money.


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[Assistant] And I was trying to get some juice backs, like our team to the offense. So whenever we score a touchdown.


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[Assistant] You know, you could, you could have the bag, put the bag on, you secure the bag. So like that ended up being a thing to wear.


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[Assistant] Holy cow, this is actually not a bad gig, Drew. Like I kind of dig this. Everyone kind of adapted it and it just became a thing. And then we didn't score on that first half very much. Came out, that was the first play of that half. And yeah, we threw the laser and


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[Assistant] Of course we ended up losing that game and I threw a pick right at the end of the game. Right. Yes, yes, the mocking, the mocking then began, but I guess I...


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[Assistant] Uhm, I don't know, I guess someone needed to, someone needed to do it a couple more times to make themselves feel a little bigger, but uhm, it was all in fun. Uhm, whatever, I've kind of left in the past, but.


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[Assistant] I had done it enough that year, so I'm glad that they got to do it a couple of times and hope they felt good doing it. Hopefully they bring it back this year.


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[Assistant] One of the biggest knocks or critiques, so to say, on me, but uhm.


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[Assistant] Or we end up losing by like 30 or 21. Like there was never like...


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[Assistant] There was one game, I think it was against Kentucky in Arkansas, two games where it came down to the end. But it was more so it swayed with, you know, how athletic we were against the team that we were playing. So this year we came into games, at least I did, with this mentality of,


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[Assistant] You know, this game could actually come down the fourth quarter with the style of offense that we ran. So I was way okay with giving up touchdowns, giving up a couple yards to actually be in games and be more of an intender.


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[Assistant] Um, throughout our year was being able to go into fourth quarters and try to win the game. And, you know, we actually did, we, you know, we went up in South Carolina, went up against Kentucky, um, just had two, two unlucky plays to end both of those games. We go to Purdue, you know, we beat Purdue.


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[Assistant] Like I said, I'll subtract any amount of yards and any amount of touchdowns to learn what I did that year.


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[Assistant] If you want to knock me on that, go ahead and knock me. I'll gladly learn what I did and take what I did there to the next level.


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[Assistant] Oh yeaah, no, I definitely got some recruiting. Uhm, no, I started really young. My mama got me into the game of basketball.


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[Assistant] Philly but Shirley just made my way up the Kansas City pipeline to one of the best teams in Kansas City.


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[Assistant] That started my seventh and eighth grade year and stayed with that program and ended up going and


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[Assistant] Getting a couple offers, yeaah, I got an offer from, uh, Oklahoma.


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[Assistant] You were better than me. They ended up being a Final Four team.


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[Assistant] So I guess I could have been on a Final Four team, which has been kind of sick. But I'm actually happy with where I'm at right now today, believe it or not.


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[Assistant] Yeah, no, it was, uh, it was awesome. My high school career was awesome. I started for four years there, scored 1800 points and, uh, had two 21 seasons, which hadn't been done in a long time in my high school. So had a great staff around me though. I had a awesome coach. Coach Little was awesome. And then the guys around me, Blake Oliver, I'm giving a little shout out.


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[Assistant] See, exactly, that is exactly why I chose the game of football, because if someone can walk out there and shoot as good an amount of threes as me, and they've been out of the game for long, I should be doing something else with my athletic ability.


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[Assistant] I keep getting this question I never know what to answer, but I'll just go with the classic car, like I gotta get...


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[Assistant] Gotta get a car. I drive a truck that's like 11 miles through the county, and I'm kinda sick and tired of that. Okay. So, uh, I'm gonna get a car. I'm gonna get a little sports car.


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[Assistant] We played against so many. Yes, you did. But, uh, Rokon's is really, really good.


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[Assistant] But then again, like, Jamal Adams was pretty good too. Yes. We played Dak Prescott my freshman year, like, he was a killer in college and he's still a killer in the pros right now.


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[Assistant] Yeaah, well first off, I'll go ahead and say the dude played his ass off, obviously. Right. Uhm, he, uh, he took this city by storm and, you know, the way he, you know, he got to sit behind Alex, which was, I think, I mean, looking at it now, I don't know the full story, but I think it worked out pretty well for him.


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[Assistant] Then he came in here and he took the city by storm, played his butt off, got the juices back here in Kansas city. You know, I can't drive anywhere.


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[Assistant] Now the only thing left to do is to go ahead and beat him now since I can't play for him. So hoping that someday, you know, I get the opportunity to come back to Arrowhead and play him, which would be awesome. It'd be cool to be able to come back home.


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[Assistant] I grew up in Iowa City, like literally two blocks from Kinnick Stadium.


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[Assistant] This is a lot of fun. When I got the news that we got to hang out every Wednesday doing the podcast, you're a guy that loves quarterback play, can't get enough of it, could literally watch it and talk about it all day long, and I've always been kind of the same way, so I'm excited.


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[Assistant] I think in 2006 and it was a whole lot of fun. I remember being at the combine in 2005. It was me and Mike Mayock on two chairs and they're like, let's just try this out while everybody's running forties and working out. You guys just sit there and watch it on that monitor and talk about it. And we didn't have any idea if anybody would like it. If anybody watching.


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[Assistant] By the end of the weekend, they were getting our ear at the top of every hour saying, alright, you guys are gonna stay on for another hour. Alright, stay on for another hour. People are watching, people like this, and that's...


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[Assistant] There was a lot of pushback way back when, it seems like a long time ago, but there were a number of general managers that did not want us to do that. Even the NFL's own network, they didn't want us on the inside. They wanted to keep it kind of a, kind of a secret. Don't let people see. Yeaah.


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[Assistant] That is long gone. I think that was part of the allure. People knew about the combine for so long, but never got to see it. You kind of get to look behind the curtain. And even though it's, uh, it's routine now, there's an element of that now where people feel like they're looking maybe where they shouldn't be looking or they never got to look before. And now it's just taken off.


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[Assistant] Yeah, we knew we were going to talk quarterbacks as you laid it out like we're going to every Wednesday. The news came out last night that former NFL general manager Charlie Casterly got word that Kyler Murray failed to impress a number of teams in the 15 minute meeting.


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[Assistant] To me the most interesting part of this is it sheds light on what happens inside those 15 minute meetings. You can have your opinion on Kyler or Charlie all you want, but


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[Assistant] It shines a big ol' light on those 15 minutes. How important they are and what actually happens between head coach, offensive coordinator, quarterback coach, GM, and that quarterback prospect while he's there for 15 minutes.


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[Assistant] I work with Charlie for a decade. I know how he does his homework. I know he has good sources. Uhm, so I, to me, he's a guy who's not reckless with what he puts out there. He's not careless. So maybe there is a little something to it. I mean, on the other side of the coin, if you want to say, like what I just said, maybe there's something to it.


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[Assistant] We saw him in the Super Bowl interviews somewhere between shy and unprepared. And to take that scene and to picture what happens behind closed doors and to think that person maybe didn't put himself out there in the best light in those 15 minutes, that's not that much of a stretch.


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[Assistant] Also, you know how it is this time of year, a lot of people want to be negative. They go in with these quarterback rankings thinking, I don't like this guy, give me a reason to like him. So it's a negative tone this time of year. And to think that someone didn't like him, and I know everybody likes him right now, and I think he's going to end up being the number one overall pick, and I'd love to see him do well.


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[Assistant] But to hear that there's some negativity about him right now doesn't surprise me in the abstract because this is how people want to be about a lot of quarterbacks with high rankings. They want to find reasons not to like


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[Assistant] I don't know if it's a byproduct, if I wasn't that big of a prospect when I was there 25 years ago, or if they weren't doing that 25 years ago. But I did not go up to the whiteboard and have any offensive coordinator say, okay, here's our play, here's our verbiage, now you go write it and teach it to us. I didn't go through any of that.


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[Assistant] Meet so and so in this room of the hotel at this time. So that there were a few of those, but it was more like a get to know you kind of thing. It wasn't X and O. I feel like agents have gotten so involved with the 15 minute meetings. The kids are so well coached on what to say.


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[Assistant] That the coaches have moved past that, and now they do X and O, they watch film with them to get them out of their shell, to break them down a little bit, to get past what they've been told to say.


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[Assistant] I'm not happy for Charlie or for Kyler that this is a story, but I wanted to talk about the meetings and all the conversations I had with offensive coordinators and quarterback coaches at the combine last week about what they were doing with kids now. So best story I heard from an offensive coordinator.


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[Assistant] With Patrick Mahomes a couple of years ago. Yeaah, okay. They're like, okay, how do you want to spend this 15 minutes? We love his talent on tape, we have some concerns. There was a play, and I forget who it was against, but there was a fourth in goal from the 15 yard line where he just threw it away.


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[Assistant] He did not take a shot in the end zone, didn't show awareness of the downed distance, and they said, let's get this play out. Yeaah. And the entire time, trying to figure out what he was thinking, what he was doing on this play. Right. And he didn't have a good response. They didn't like how he answered it, they didn't like his mindset, he was a little turned off that they were talking about it for so long, so.


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[Assistant] We're talking about how Kyler Murray didn't impress somebody. Patrick Mahomes, who was the guy in the NFL right now with all of his talent and how well he played. Just a couple years ago, he walked out of one of those meetings with the team saying, I don't really like that guy.


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[Assistant] So for those, uh, for everybody who can't see what we're doing on YouTube here and you're just listening, we're walking over to a, what could be called a whiteboard or a grease board, and I believe Chris is gonna, so, so- First off, I wanna call out stats for working banker hours.


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[Assistant] And so here's, here's, and I'm, we're improvising here. I'm gonna play coach, GM, whoever says, okay, I understand that, that makes sense. Protections are such a big thing right now. I know. And this is a problem a lot of coaches have with someone like, uh, Drew Locke, who for,


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[Assistant] We got a nickel guy out here. We'll get a nickel. Couple of backers in here.


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[Assistant] And just too deep, we'll go safeties, safeties, corner over here. Sure. And a corner here. Let's say.


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[Assistant] They walk up this guy, to bring him. They walk him inside here, he's gonna come this way. Protection wise, if they're not only bringing these four, if they're bringing two extra, at the snap, and you recognize that, what are you doing with your protections?


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[Assistant] How difficult it is for these prospects to have to do that because they're getting a lot of information from the sideline now and not worried about those kind of things.


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[Assistant] That kind of thing is coming with some of these kids who didn't have that sort of responsibility, the line of scrimmage, that they will draw up a play from start to finish, here's the play call, here's what you're responsible for at the line of scrimmage, here's what the tight end is doing, if this guy's coming, the running back, he's running this route, if this is happening, they erase the whole thing and say, now you teach it to me.


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[Assistant] I understand that you have some power rankings for me, and by the way, Chris and I, we were together at the Combine for not very long, kinda bumped into each other, and when I said goodbye, see you next week, I said, I know you're gonna watch some film with these guys, can I come in and watch with you? And I could tell right away that I'd asked him something he wasn't real comfortable with.


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[Assistant] So power rankings, 1 through 8, the number 8, is that significant?


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[Assistant] Do you know there are two quarterbacks starting in the NFC right now who were the eighth overall quarterback taken in their class?


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[Assistant] Both in the NFC. Until last year, they were both in the same division.


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[Assistant] The fact that he's leaning or the fact that the ball is too far up here?


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[Assistant] Here's my problem with Will Greer, and you didn't even bring it up. You tell me if I'm seeing this the wrong way. We all need to get used to quarterbacks transferring now. We all need to get used to players sitting at a bowl game. So in Will Greer's background, he transferred from Florida to West Virginia, that happens now, it's okay.


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[Assistant] I know kids are not playing in bowl games now because they want to save themselves for the NFL draft. Right. A quarterback choosing to sit out his bowl game.


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[Assistant] To keep himself ready and healthy for the NFL draft. I've got a real problem with that.


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[Assistant] How about a Twitter question about Will? Sure. Sammy would like to know how hard is it for guys like Greer to adjust to taking snaps under center at the next level? Is it simply a timing thing or do you think just harder for him to make reads and keep his eyes downfield while dropping back?


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[Assistant] You gotta get to it. I saw him play when he must have been start 47, 48-ish at the end of the season against Notre Dame and I had higher expectations than what I saw.


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[Assistant] Oh, hold on a second. Daniel Jones at six. I've seen him three, four, most less. Why, why is he only six?


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[Assistant] So you have Daniel Jones as your sixth overall quarterback. Before we move on to number five, Daniel Jones worth a pick in what round do you think?


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[Assistant] Big sucker, not to be confused with your dad, the yeaah, the big yes. All right from five. Let's move on to four. Yeah.


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[Assistant] But more important than throwing on the run, something you said a moment ago, subtle movement in the pocket. Yes, right. People confuse mobility with being able to run a 4-6 and get out there and pick up seven yards with your feet. But the fact that he was able to slide in the pocket like that, some people think that Dwayne Haskins doesn't do that very well. Yeah, I know. It matters a lot.


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[Assistant] Isn't that a nice spot to be in? I mean, if you're Ryan Finley, everybody's talking about Kyler Murray and is Drew Locke better than Dwayne Haskins or vice versa. You had low expectations going in to watch him and he surprised you. He can kind of be that guy that can sneak into the end of first round without being over scrutinized in the media for the next two months.


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[Assistant] Alright, we're gonna get to one through three of the way we're doing it here. We're gonna go three, two, one, eventually. But we have the aforementioned, the big guy, Big Phil Sims. Dad to you. Dad to me. Has joined us over the phone. Phil, are you there, pal?


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[Assistant] This baseball field and it's a diamond where there's no fence in the outfield. Yeah. Okay. Right. So we're like 500 or 600 feet away from home plate.


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[Assistant] And Phil says, oh man, these guys are gonna come out and try to kick us off. And sure enough, we see somebody from behind where the umpire was walk out to us to tell us that we can't throw there. And Phil walks up to me and I hardly knew you at this point, Phil. Phil goes,


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[Assistant] This poor guy doesn't know two things. First of all,


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[Assistant] Basically, the guy walked away saying, well, I'm gonna have to call the, you know, call the police. And Phil's like, you go ahead and call him. You go ahead and do that. Policeman came over, was like, Phil's best friend. They're high-fiving and hugging. And I think that police officer stayed and watched his workout.


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[Assistant] Talk about, you know, letting it go and trying to throw it hard. Tell, before we get into Kyler Murray, I want to hear a little bit about your workout with Bill Walsh when you're coming out of college and how hard you were trying to throw the ball and what he kept telling you.


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[Assistant] So here's my question, Phil. If, let's just say Kyler Murray, as he likely will be, is gone somewhere in the top three, if Dwayne Haskins, you like him a lot, is there at sixth, you think the Giants should take him?


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[Assistant] Strictly ability wise, it sounds like you're describing somebody who'd be worth a pick at number six.


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[Assistant] Does it bother you, Phil? Does it bother you? People describe him a lot as someone and they all, they, they heap a lot of praise on him, but the one negative is he doesn't move that well in the pocket. You can get him off his spot. He's not that nimble. He can't move from point A to point B to get himself free and clear to make that throw. Did, did you see any of that?


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[Assistant] With the two quarterbacks you've just described, Dwayne Haskins and Kyler Murray, it sounds like you like them both a lot. And I know from the way you and I have talked in the past, you don't like everybody. You go in saying, I don't like him. As you explained, give me a reason to like him. So if you had a chance to take Murray or Haskins,


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[Assistant] You were a quarterback coach. You're sitting there waiting for your rookie quarterback to come inside the building. Which one would you rather have?


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[Assistant] We'll get into that, because it is different. It is different than the way a lot of people think that you should throw the ball. You also think Landon Collins no longer a giant if it goes that way is okay.


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[Assistant] That's not what it was when your dad was playing. Take a breath. We're mainly talking quarterbacks. We are going eight through one today. We've already gone eight through four. And while you're going through your notes there, just to review, eight was Will Greer, seven Clayton Thorson.


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[Assistant] Six Daniel Jones, which I found interesting. Jared Stidham at five, Ryan Finley at four. I get the feeling from listening to Chris or Christopher, as your dad likes to say, that those two could move up here, uh, as we move on in weeks. Bringing us to tier one, three, two, and one. Yes. Who was your third quarterback?


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[Assistant] How much he impressed you? Yes. Okay, so that's number one, which makes my second points stand out to me all the more. You have him behind Drew Locke at number two. Most people have have it the other way around. Yeah, I get to so how good is Locke if you just describe Haskins good enough to be a top 10 pick. Yeah, and Haskins is not as good as your life.


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[Assistant] thing around just throwin so much, there's a lot mo than just throwing. Yes, p guys you see that could go lock and Murray, who's the


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[Assistant] And I've got one more. You just said that potentially, Haskins at three, Locke at two, you like them both so much. That could go back and forth because of either one. Could Murray potentially slip behind Locke or Haskins back to two? Or do you think this is my number one guy for the next few weeks? Book it.


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[Assistant] Got a long way to go with that. A lot of, lot of places to follow up that we didn't get to today. Let's recap the rankings there. You have three tiers.


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[Assistant] All the way up to one Kyla Murray, Drew Locke and Dwayne Haskins. Those are your top three, not only the top three.


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[Assistant] And potential top 10 picks as well. Alright, we have a miscellaneous tweet I need to get to. I need to get to my tweet section here, Chris. I've got a lot of, lot of papers. Okay, so you're gonna have to fill me in on why this is part of our, our verbiage.


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[Assistant] I talked about verbiage earlier. Nathan, I'm sorry, Nedrick would like to know, rank the quarterbacks on a scale of piss missiles to rocket wobblers.


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[Assistant] Alright, if they invite us back to roll again next week on Wednesday.


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[Assistant] Now I'm like 231, 232. I went through like phases of my career. All right. So what's up everybody? Chris Sims here, Paul Burmeister. We got the Chris Sims on Button Podcast. We're going to have, uh, we're going to do just hit.


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[Assistant] So uhm, breaking news that happened from the weekend, we're going to talk about some narratives that are, uh, surrounded or at least surrounding the draft, whether we think they're true or not true. Uhm, but get to the question is, I kind of went through like two phases.


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[Assistant] I made a James Winston decision, like maybe year one of my NFL career.


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[Assistant] Uh, because he's going up to 250 pounds this year, right? He's been talking about that because he's gonna be playing in that Bruce Arians offense. Bruce wants him to stand there and take shots to throw the guy 50 yards down the field, right?


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[Assistant] But my rookie year in the NFL, I realized, okay, I'm not going to make a living running away from people. That's not happening. And I went home on an offseason and my dad was like, yeah.


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[Assistant] Play a 240 and just, you know, put some armor on. That's, this is my dad voice for anybody out there that's listening. Put some armor on and just, just stand in there and throw that ball. You know, and I kind of went to that where, yeah, after my rookie year where I was probably 225, I said, okay, yeah, I'm going to start lifting a little heavy and went to like 235, 238.


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[Assistant] Uh, then my career got over and I went back to like the 225 range, but now I've hit 38 years old. Yeaah. Yeaah, where the metabolism is slowing down. Dude, wait till you're 48.


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[Assistant] But no, I hope you don't get sick of me. You're the nice, uh, nice, you know, you talk nice, I'm the loud mouthed Jersey guy, so it's gonna be you that gets sick of me if anything happens here.


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[Assistant] I do believe it. Uh, I believe it one because I think the love affair with Cliff Kingsbury is real on Kyler Murray. I think he knows this kid, he feels comfortable with this kid. When you start throwing out words of like,


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[Assistant] He's the number one pick in the draft and freak of nature. Those are like subliminal messages of like Clif Kingsbury, what he thinks of the guy in his mouth. And I know that was back in October, but I think between that I've heard about Clif Kingsbury talking to people about the quarterback situation and


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[Assistant] The people I know in the NFL, everyone seems to think it's Kyler Murray number one to the Arizona Cardinals. I don't know if Arizona definitely has that for sure, you know, right away, but I think it's going that way unless they get some trade offer for Josh Rosen. That's the thing.


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[Assistant] I do, I do think they're open for business, but I think it would take a really a monumental type deal. Uh, a trade that just absolutely blows them away to go, okay.


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[Assistant] We love Kyle and Murray, but this is such a, uh, you know, just an unbelievable amount of drop picks and assets that we can get here.


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[Assistant] Yeah, it is. It's hard to justify. You're gonna be giving away a number of players and people who can contribute to your team for a lot of years to come when you give away those drafts.


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[Assistant] Uh, and of course also you're losing the money of being able to have the draft younger guy. Now you're going to have to sign a free agent who's going to be more expensive. So that's where it kind of messes with the imbalance of your team or the balance of your team. Murray is special though.


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[Assistant] And that's, hey, again, if I was gonna say one thing about Kyla Murray, what I don't understand.


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[Assistant] You know, I see a lot of big boards where, okay,


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[Assistant] He's talked about as being the number 1 pick in the draft, but then when I get to top 50 big boards, he's number 8 or number 12. And that I don't understand. Where would you have him? Well, in any other year, when we're talking about a quarterback being number 1, he's the number 1 player on the board. And it's not just because of the quarterback position on this one. I mean, again.


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[Assistant] Maybe, and I understand that, but I don't understand him being so far down the road. When you're seeing a quarterback who were, you and I have played quarterback, we both I think would agree with this, we're seeing a guy where he'd go,


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[Assistant] I haven't seen too many people who can run like that in the history of the position like he can, right? Uhm, yes, I know the size is not perfect, but then...


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[Assistant] As you and I both have talked before too, the throwing is damn special too. It's really good. And then the throwing on the run is special. So to me, I feel like people are either being biased or still locked onto their preconceived notions about what he was back in October and haven't come off that.


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[Assistant] And taking for what it is right now where he's the number one player in the draft.


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[Assistant] He's your number one? He's the number one. And then, you know, the other thing that goes into this conversation with the trading out.


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[Assistant] The Rosen Market. Yea, Josh Rosen. It's the market, and who is it going to be that's going to make the play?


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[Assistant] I think, if I felt like my team was going to be a quality football team, I don't know if I would have a hard time giving away an end of the first round, middle first round pick. I think I could swallow that for a guy that you're go- You'd give up first. I think I would. I think I would.


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[Assistant] I think his value is he's every bit as good as the top three quarterbacks we talk about as Haskins, Murray, uh, and Locke. In fact, I would probably say from what I evaluated last year to this year, I think Rosen would probably be ahead of Locke and Haskins as far as if we just ranked them as they were coming out right now.


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[Assistant] Yeah, I do think. Now I don't want to give away a top 10 pick. So if you're a team like, let's just say the Miami Dolphins who are right there on the edge of the top 10, and you know their team's not going to be very good next year, and we're not expecting it to be. There's a very good chance they could be in the top 10 once again.


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[Assistant] That's one where I go, I don't know if I'm gonna trade away a future top 10 pick for Josh Rosen right now.


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[Assistant] I have had the most conversations, uh, with the Arizona Cardinals. I think they're the team that are hottest on this whole trade for Josh Rosen thing. I do think the New York Giants are involved, but from everything I've heard from people, league insiders and things like that, it does seem like the Redskins are the team that's most interested right now, at least making something happen with Josh Rosen.


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[Assistant] Yes, and pro, maybe you have to, you know, if you're sitting with the Redskins, who I believe are the 16th pick, a lot's gonna go, and what happened before us? If all three of those quarterbacks that we just talked about are gone, and now they go, damn, we don't want to take Daniel Jones at 16, okay, maybe we do need to make a move for Josh Rosen, whatever it may be, I can see that happening.


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[Assistant] I am, uh, I'm buying that. I'm not gonna just sit here and say, hands down, he's the safest pick, but he's in that conversation.


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[Assistant] His absolute worst is an 8 sack a year type of guy, or a 7 sack a year type of guy. I think that's what, at least that's what I took it as. Not necessarily that he's a slam dunk, gonna lead the NFL in sacks every year.


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[Assistant] Uh, but that's why busts happen in the top ten. And yeaah, I go Bosa, Quinan Williams, okay.


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[Assistant] I get it, but you know, again, I just look at the checklist and go, good decision maker, accurate thrower, quick release, uh, wants to stay in the pocket, and then when he gets out of the pocket, watch out.


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[Assistant] I don't have any issues with that. Again, I would have a very hard time watching Kyler Murray and thinking, oh, he'll probably just be a backup one day. I mean, I think he's a, he's a star in the league at some point. And then Devin White.


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[Assistant] Devin White's another guy I might throw in that conversation. We're gonna get to Devin White. He's on the list. You wanna save it?


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[Assistant] Well no, I'm not buying this one bit. And I mean, I don't think it shocks you. Okay, okay, yes. But Josh Allen, okay, again, one, I don't necessarily love the specimen, the athlete.


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[Assistant] I know he had the sack production at Kentucky. I think the way he got his sacks at Kentucky though is not necessarily going to translate to the getting sacks in the NFL.


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[Assistant] To the NFL in general, I would say for one. And then for number two, the Jets are looking for a real edge pass rusher. And they're being talked about, one, as a team that's open for business, for trading down.


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[Assistant] So that tells me they don't evaluate the guy as a superstar edge pass rusher. Now you've heard me say that before. Now let me throw another thing, you know, of just connect the dots or, you know, what we've seen in recent history. I'm gonna throw two names at you here. Okay, I hear with, with, um, Josh Allen a lot. He's Anthony Barr. Okay. Well, I think that's good. That's good.


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[Assistant] Anthony Barr played defense end in college football. I mean, that's what he did. He put his hand down and we had to project him.


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[Assistant] To playing middle linebacker in the NFL. And I think when all's said and done, I think if you look back at it, Anthony Barr's a really good football player, don't get me wrong.


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[Assistant] But I would question whether he was a top 10 pick, right? Right? If I just had to go back and reevaluate it now and go, oh, okay, he's definitely a middle linebacker. I evaluate him as a top 10 pick because I thought,


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[Assistant] Okay, he can play some stand up linebacker, but he's gonna come off the edge and put his hand down and be a force in the pass rushing aspect of the football game. And he's not that. So to me that knocks you down a few spots. Vic Beasley.


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[Assistant] Yeah. Okay, there's another guy. Same thing. Play defense and okay, oh damn, he can't do anything but speed rush in the NFL. What are we gonna do with him? We're gonna stand him up a middle linebacker. And okay, yes, that's good.


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[Assistant] You're changing the position. It's a total projection right there from that. And the Jets don't necessarily need that kind of guy right now with C.J. Mosley as a middle linebacker along with Avery Williamson. They need that true edge guy and I think that's why they're in business for trading down.


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[Assistant] The three we've done, that was my favorite. That was my best one? Okay, good. Thank you. Thank you, doctor.


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[Assistant] He's a 287 nose tackle in college football. So he has moments of teams double team him and he gets moved out of there. Okay, yeaah, he's not perfect that way. So you gotta almost project him at another position. He's gotta be a three technique, play on the outside edge of a guard's shoulder or maybe play defense to end and serve down the distance.


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[Assistant] I think the three technique, he's going to be that kind of guy. Again, I want to remind everybody, Aaron Donald is awesome. Okay. I'm not trying to take away anything from Aaron Donald, but I want to bring up this fact why I pull up a stack real quick. Well, I want to look at Rams defense. Okay. So the Rams defense this year in football was


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[Assistant] 19th overall, you see them right here, right? So overall in yards or points? In yards. So they're 19th overall in yards. And where are they at in rushing? Right here. So this is where they're at in rushing. Yeah. 20th. 23rd. 23rd. Okay. Right.


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[Assistant] Certainly, I mean, it's a valid point, but all my point is, I'm trying to say, and I'm not checking away anything from Aaron Donnell, he's the best defensive player in football, I'm just saying he's not perfect.


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[Assistant] Let's not over evaluate this. Every time I turn it on, he can run by anybody that covers him. He's the biggest guy out there and he has the ability to catch a short route and break a tackle and run for 60 yards up the sideline.


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[Assistant] And, and yes, I mean, and then look at the body. So yeah, he improved his stock by showing the physical specimen that he is at the wide receiver position, what he did at the combine. And yeah, the production's not going to be perfect.


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[Assistant] But you know what else wasn't perfect? His quarterback at Ole Miss, the crappy freaking offense they played in. You know, it's not his fault the coach only taught him three routes to run his whole college career. So yes, a lot of his games are projection.


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[Assistant] One of the ones I feel pretty safe in projecting because I'm just not going to overthink some things like this. Ma'am, when you're that big and that fast...


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[Assistant] Uh, and I can turn on a game like Alabama or, or some of the other games and go, okay, here's the, oh, here's the first play of the game. I know which one he is. Right. How are his ball skills? They're very good. Yeah, there's, hey, his route running needs work. But again, for a guy that's 6'2", 228 and can run the way he can, I'm not gonna go,


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[Assistant] I don't know. I mean, this guy is so freaky. I don't know if he can run a curl route. Ooh, that might be too much to ask one of the freakiest athletes coming out on the track. So let's not overanalyze. And again, it might not be perfect next year, but because of the great speed and physicality of the player,


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[Assistant] His choppy route running, he's gonna get away with it because he's gonna scare the death DBs out of going deep like I talk about a lot.


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[Assistant] I've been, well I've been to Ames, Iowa. Okay, it's not the same. No, it's not. And I've stayed


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[Assistant] Close to Iowa City. Okay. Okay, but yeaah, you're right. Uh, gosh, I stayed, mmm, at a, I don't know. Were you hunting? No, I did not go hunting. Sorry. That's not for me. You're not going to take the bait? No, I'm not going to. No, I'm going to talk about that later.


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[Assistant] I'm gonna say, I'm really, I'm really up in the air here. I'm kinda going back and forth with my projection here.


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[Assistant] But I think overall, yes, I'd probably say T.J. Hawkinson is the better overall football player.


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[Assistant] Now does Phant maybe have a higher ceiling? Could be maybe more of a superstar in the NFL?


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[Assistant] Yes, because he has special straightaway speed. Uh, like a Jared Cook who, you know, anybody who watched the Raiders last year could catch a slant on the inside and run right up the middle of the field. That runs safeties for 60 yard touchdowns. He can do stuff like that.


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[Assistant] He's not as Evan Ingram and Jordan Reed as I thought he was, Noah fan. He's a little more of a straight-liner, not as quick as I maybe initially gave him credit for.


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[Assistant] And he's not as physical as Hawkinson. I think that's the big thing that I would just give Hawkinson the overall edge. Yes, he's not the athlete and maybe quite the specimen, but it's not too far off from where Noah Fant is. But yes, with the run blocking, and I'll tell you another thing I look at is, when he catches the ball,


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[Assistant] He's a little more willing to take and receive or even deliver out contact as compared to no offense.


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[Assistant] To where I would just give him the edge there, especially at the tight end position where I go, you're going to have to catch some balls down the middle of the field where people are going to be beaten down on you and want to tear your head off. And are you going to be able to handle that physicality? And I think Hockinson's maybe a little more set up or ready for it than Noah Phan is at this point.


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[Assistant] I think that's when you go, you know what? Okay, Hawkinson and Phan are on the board. We kind of have a guy similar to Hawkinson already. Let's see if we can hit our home run with Phan and maybe get like a Jimmy Graham, a Travis Kelsey, you know, a Jared Cook type of guy who is truly a mismatch out in the field.


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[Assistant] Putting me in this position now. I know, I know. It's tough. It is tough. I mean, again, we're talking about two awesome players, so we're not putting anyone down here.


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[Assistant] I mean, Josh, if Josh Jacobs goes in the top 20 of the draft, like I would have no problem with that. I would think Josh Jacobs goes somewhere between let's say 15 and 25 or somewhere in that range. You know, I don't think you're going to see any other running back come off the board.


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[Assistant] Until, I'm gonna say somewhere around, somewhere between 40 and 60. Yeaah. So he isn't a class of his own. Josh Jacobs is different in this aspect. One, he's an Alabama running back who doesn't have a lot of wear and tear on his body. It's amazing. I mean, to the point where I watch film at times and go,


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[Assistant] I don't know what that is, but either way, it's a good thing going forward for his career. Two, hey, I understand there's things about, oh, he's 40, he ran a 4.6 and all that. Hey, don't forget, he came off a groin injury at the end of the year, so that was something he had to deal with in training for the 40 and doing all that. Also, I think you've heard me say this.


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[Assistant] I'm a little less prone to care about it. And yes, I think he stands alone. He's a more powerful Alvin Kamara. That's what I look at him like. That's what I look at him like. And I was all over Alvin Kamara when he came out. Same thing. Didn't have enough carries either.


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[Assistant] He can. He can. From everything I've seen, he has the ability to be okay, first and second down between the tackles, third down, you know, we could put him in the slot or, you know, we'd leave him back here by a Drew Brees or whatever and we could throw a screen to him. He is really versatile, really dangerous football player.


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[Assistant] I think so. I think it's somewhere in there. Somewhere between 15 and 25, yeaah.


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[Assistant] I think that's a fair statement. I mean, I would even say, and again, the Devons per se, that combo right there, they are in a class of their own, and I think Devin White is probably even another notch up in his own class to a degree. I mean, Devin White, you heard me say earlier on,


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[Assistant] He's one of the safest picks in the draft for me. He's better than Ro Kwon Smith who came out last year in my opinion. Really? Who was a top 8 pick. Yeaah. I mean this guy's...


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[Assistant] He's like watching that kind of guy or Ruben Foster when he came out.


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[Assistant] I will not be surprised if Devin White goes in the top five or six picks of this draft. And he wouldn't be overdrafted. He would not be overdrafted. He is an every down, three down linebacker. Can cover Travis Kelsey up the seam.


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[Assistant] You know, and then can go tackle Alvin Kamara in space and then take on a, you know, a truck like Marshawn Lynch in the hole.


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[Assistant] He can do it all. He is phenomenal on film. Speed, athleticism, disregard for his body, which is important. I'm sorry, when you're a middle linebacker. You gotta have some of it. Yea, yea, I wanna see hesitation. You know what I mean?


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[Assistant] So yeaah, like Devon White I think is that kind of guy that could be the top 7, top 8 pick somewhere. I wouldn't even be shocked at the Giants at 6. I mean, gosh damn it, the Raiders at 4 took him. I wouldn't sit here and go, oh wow, now the Raiders have filled some of those voids at linebacker to where I don't think they need him anymore and they can go other positions.


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[Assistant] I think Bush's another 4 or 5 picks down from that. Somewhere early teens. It's not that much. No, it's not much.


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[Assistant] 14, 15, somewhere in that range, certainly could be. I mean, Devin Bush is really freakin' awesome too. They both have rockets up their butt, uh, and they both- That's a first. Yeah, they are- it's unreal how they can run. How they can go. Yeah, they're good.


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[Assistant] I mean Ren, I think he's 4-4-3, which is insane at that position.


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[Assistant] Hey, this is something I'm going to push back against. I'm just not in the Daniel Jones, I'm in the Daniel Jones, I don't see it on film camp, okay? And again, I hate to say this kind of stuff because I know Daniel Jones is a really nice kid and he's definitely an NFL quarterback and I'm, I'm, I don't want to,


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[Assistant] Yes, I have questions and Daniel Jones, I hope you prove me wrong and shit all over me and tell me I'm wrong, okay? At some point. I'm all for it. I'm always-


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[Assistant] And he truly is. I'm all, I'm rooting for it. I'm rooting for it. I really am because it's nothing personal. But yes, on film with Daniel Jones, I don't get it. I don't think he's a first round talent. What's not there that you want to be there? Well, I don't think I see special arms, special athleticism, nothing elite physically where I look at and go, okay,


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[Assistant] So if you don't have the perfect offense and system around him, what is he going to do?


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[Assistant] Will you have a successful career? Yes, but so will like ten other quarterbacks on the list too. So that's not necessarily like a positive.


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[Assistant] Uhm, but yeaah, I just don't see big time athleticism. I think it's a kind of a funky motion throwing the football. He lets his arm, as I would call, act as an independent contractor. Okay? To where, and you know a little of this, you've been in the sim school of passing to a degree, but when he throws, okay, you got me? Got me, Nicole?


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[Assistant] So, he, he doesn't get any of this, Paul, like he doesn't get any, anybody out there ever watches Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, when they're gonna throw the football, they get in this position, right? They create an opposite between their upper and lower half. Daniel Jones keeps it the same all the time.


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[Assistant] And the arm just kinda whirly bird windmills around.


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[Assistant] You're not using the lower body, you're not really using the arm as a catapult because what happens when you create opposites too, the arm now is, oh, I'm gonna twist out of this and the arm just lags behind and becomes a catapult. That's what a lot of the great quarterbacks do. He does not have that. So that bothers me. And you know what else bothers me?


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[Assistant] So we're talking about a smart quarterback who is gonna dissect defenses, but he threw for 58% completion percentage. Damn, when Josh Allen last year threw for 56%, the whole world was ready to throw him out of the first round.


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[Assistant] And his offense was not orchestrated by a offensive, NFL offensive coordinator basically, or a college guru in David Cutcliffe, who delivered these plays. So, yeaah. Again, I don't want to make it personal against Daniel Jones, I just don't see first round talent. I see more talent out of guys like Jared Stidham and Ryan Finley.


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[Assistant] Those two for sure. Let's list them. So Kyler Murray. Yea, Kyler Murray, Locke. Drew Locke. Haskins. Wayne Haskins. Yep. I would go Finley. And Jared Stidham. Right.


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[Assistant] Maybe, you're right. And I think, and again, if anybody, Clayton Dorsett, if you go out there and watch the film two years ago, you'll be a little more impressed than what you saw from last year. Pre-injury. Pre-injury. Pre-bad ACL injury. So that's where I just push back against the Daniel Jones thing there. You know, like I said, you know, guys like Jared Stidham,


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[Assistant] They have talent. Like he made me say wow a few times a game where I said whoa that was a nice athletic move and whoa that ball popped out of his hand. Finley, I said wow because I went


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[Assistant] Whoa, I mean, it's just one nice, accurate throw after another with people around him in the pocket. Whoa, this guy's big and can move like this and throw in the run? Whoa! I didn't do that with Daniel Jones. So that to me does not scream first round pick. Big thing there with him, from what I hear from everybody.


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[Assistant] It's, all the other stuff is off the charts. Which I understand, and I don't have the privy to be around him on the board and do all that.


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[Assistant] But from like my friends and people I've talked to around the NFL, it sounds like all his mental stuff is off the charts. His ability to process, the psychoanalysis, the wonder lick, he must kick ass on all of that, which is gonna make coaches feel warm and cozy at night, you know.


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[Assistant] Yeah, no, it can make up for it if it's the right system. Like, hey, listen, if he gets in a place where the offense, they can, you know, again, this is not a knock on Tom Brady, but we can watch film with certain New England games and I can go, he dropped back 30 times, he completed 27 passes, and of those 27 completions, the first guy he looked at


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[Assistant] He threw to 25 of the 27 completions. So if your ability to process, you know, your own play, the defense, what you're supposed to do with the coverage, the rules that apply there, if you can process that all quickly for a really good offense, he can be successful. But if you don't have that,


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[Assistant] I'm saying, what are you going to rely on? Because he's not going to make, oh, it's third and twelve, and we can't get something going, we need a big play from our quarterback, and we need somebody to throw a howitzer, you know, down the middle of the field to get the chains going and get some positive vibes for our team. I don't think he's the guy to do that.


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[Assistant] It's, people don't realize how special Tom Brady's arm was. You know, again, in his absolute prime, am I gonna sit here and tell you that it was as strong as Brett Favre or Aaron Rodgers? No. But it's the next group down. It's a special arm. I mean, again,


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[Assistant] You talk about the offense isn't working. How is he gonna get it done? I'll give you a perfect example. Did anybody watch, uh, Super Bowl 51 against the Atlanta Falcons? They took away all the easy bull cap throws that we see New England go. The second half, Brady had to fit into what you were saying, 20 yard comebacks on the sidelines throwing piss missiles all game long.


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[Assistant] He has, because of his length, and this happens to a lot of quarterbacks, I would throw Joe Flacco in this category, Ben Roethlisberger, because they're so big, and they can throw it with ease, and still hum it.


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[Assistant] It doesn't look right on TV at times. Right. Because it's just, oh, there's Tom, he's relaxed and throwing a 20 yard comeback.


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[Assistant] Oh, I know. Doug Kidd. Right? Yes. I had no idea. Another guy with freakishly long arms. I mean, Doug can scratch his knees without bending over.


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[Assistant] And then he has huge hands. So those, just the lever theory in general, allows him to throw the ball with less effort than maybe the, you know, normal, you know, Joey quarterback.


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[Assistant] I don't. I don't think we'll see five. I do think we'll see four. I think someone, it sounds, and again, not that I agree with it, but it sounds like someone's gonna take the bait on a Daniel Jones. Or does somebody trade up late in the first round?


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[Assistant] Yes. You think it will happen? I think it will happen. How many? Because it's the quarterback position and it gets overvalued. But I'm going to say four, excuse me while I burp right there. Yes. I'm going to say four though, uh, because it is of course just a position of such importance in this day and age in the NFL. So,


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[Assistant] Yes, I get it there, but to me, there's only three legit first round talents, and that is Murray, Locke, and Haskins. But I always say this, for guys like, you know, Daniel Jones,


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[Assistant] Or Ryan Finley or Jared Stidham, if they did creep into the first round and people go, oh, that's insane. You know, okay, that's insane.


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[Assistant] But, you know, so was drafting Blake Bortles at three. I know I'm the Blake Bortles hater of the world, but the reason I'm the hater is because I never saw a spiral or a good throw in college to where I thought it was one of the worst third picks ever in the history of the draft.


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[Assistant] If Christian Ponder, if he can go to number 10, or Jake Locker can go at number 11. Blaine Gabbard. Or Blaine Gabbard, exactly right. Or some of the guys that have been drafted over the years, those, just to name a few, then some of these other guys are certainly worthy of being late first round picks.


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[Assistant] Yeah, no, I mean, Brian Burns, uh, I look at him a lot like almost like a Leonard Floyd type guy who was drafted in the top ten by the Chicago Bears a few years ago. Except I think this guy might have a little bit more true edge pass rush value. Yeah, I had him listed as the number five edge rusher, uh, in this dra- in this draft.


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[Assistant] And I think that's, Brian Burns, I'll be interested to see how it all plays out, because I think he is a special football player, he's a special athlete.


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[Assistant] He has Ben that we talk about coming around the edge. He has a great get-off. His 10-yard split was phenomenal. It was in the 1-5 category or somewhere along there. So he has the potential to be a superstar pass rusher in the NFL. To me, he's a more talented,


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[Assistant] Daniel Hunter, who came out along those lines, these long freaky athletes who, yea, you don't always necessarily look at them in all of their physicality the way they knock people around, but yet they're strong enough to take on blocks or set the edge in the run game. And then their athleticism makes them incredibly, uh, you know, disruptive on top of that.