[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Because retail, paying 100%, I'm not saying that's bad, I'm not saying that, but 10% off, let's face it, that's 10%.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, yeaah, onit.com slash jaco. Also, if you're in the mood to support this podcast for any reason, uhm.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's what it's called, referral fee. Nice. Easy way to support. Or if you like the shirts that, uhm, that we make. Wanna wear one or two? Buy one of those. Boom.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Jujitsu is a long, repetitive grind. That said, there are occasional highlights, aha moments, submissions you're proud of, your personal legends, quote unquote, or maybe key embarrassments. What are some of those for each of you?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, mine was way more, uh, it was a lot shorter. So me and, um, me and Cake Nuts, Navy Seal, one of my best friends, we went, um, down to, remember when Dean had that spot? It was like a half a spot. Yep. Yep.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Side mount, rear naked choke. I knew that. I didn't know how to really function in any of those positions, but I knew what they were. And I knew how to be in them and stuff. So that was it. I thought I was a pretty solid athlete. I was like 225, solid.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, this is my first time actually rolling with Dean, but he had, he was the teacher, you know, it's like a small group of, and, um, so I was like, Oh shoot, I'm, you know, Dean, that was one in his height when he, he was coming off his ADCC win. He had a super fight that year against, um, John Jack. Yeah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So uhm, he was the man, you know. So I was like, oh, I'm gonna roll with Dean. But uhm, so I maybe outweighed him by, you know, I don't know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So I roll in right one, he, you know how you kinda, we didn't start standing up, he kinda sat down in front of me and you just start to slowly roll, he just, he grabbed me and...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now it's called when you lock up with someone, right? You understand that that's what it's called. But when we locked up, when he grabbed me, that's the moment I realized, oh yeah, that's that probability of me catching him is literally at this point zero. Literally just right when he grabbed me, I was like, oh man, just the way he was and.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It just, you didn't feel like you could just do anything, and then of course he beat me up, and uhm, it's funny, when Cake Nuts rolled with him, remember that thing, and he did it in ADCC, I think he got just solo.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You get into a certain position, he gets kinda under you, and then he picks you up and stands up and walks around with you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So he did that to cake nuts, and then when I rolled with him again, he did that to me. But with me, he grabbed me and he went...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Bam, bam, and bash me against the wall. Not hard, just playful.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Just to show me again that, you know, the chance of me actually doing anything or having any control over this whole experience was zero.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So that's, that's that aha moment that I was like, okay, this jiu-jitsu thing is way more because I was bigger than him. I knew I could lift more weights than him. I know that, you know, at this point, but it didn't matter at all. So that's, yeah, that's when I realized that jiu-jitsu is a lot more powerful.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's funny that that happens a lot of the time where you'll develop just through whether it be this kind of thing where you trained and then they leave and they come back kind of thing or someone who hangs around you develop that little sense of competition. It usually happens with a guy who's close to you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right. Yeah. And if they're on the, if your little training buddies on that bus. Oh yeah. Yes. Very, very hard to catch.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He noticed that I had an opportunity to do it. It was just a small thing. It's a bit, it's, it's hard to explain without, you know, doing it, but he did that. But it was just a matter of, instead of moving your hips the natural way that you always want to do, you just twist them the other way and it breaks a certain grip that he can control you with. But yeah, so it is so true. What about, um, like, uh, you know, some embarrassments?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, I think- yeah, and embarrass I think is a strong term because that's true. I mean, I don't think I've ever been.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah bro, you tested it the other day, cause you have a thing and whatever do you, but you wear, uh, cotton shirts a lot of the time when you, so after rolling for a while, that cotton shirt is like a, like being waterboarded in certain positions. And you were waterboarding me the other day. And, but man, ain't no factor, no vote.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, and again, it's not to any real significant degree. It's more just like a fun kind of competition thing that you have with certain people. And you're like, yeah, I'm gonna top that guy one day.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It will be a grind though, if you have this specific mindset, which, which can be common. Uhm, and sometimes your mind can go in and out of it, where if your, if your goals are predicated on like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you can fall in and out of that sometimes too, because it kinda depends on your environment. If everyone's thinking like that, or if they're even vocal about it, you know, you can't help but kinda maybe feel that and be like, maybe that's kinda the thing, you know?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Man, I didn't even know that there, cause when I started I was going with Dean, so it was all no-gi. So I didn't really know really about belts. And Jimmy, remember Jimmy? He was like, hey, come to class tomorrow.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, we have promotions, so be sure to come. And I was like, oh, that's cool. I thought he meant promotions like some brands were coming in to promote their products and stuff. So it would be a fun time. So I was like, oh yeah, that's cool. He's like, yeah, so come.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I was like, Oh yeah, I guess, right. You get belts, right. But I was just training and competing. And I think that that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I learned like a, I mean, I think as a white belt, if you're into it, you learn the most at that time because you're going from zero up to like, you know, the learning curve. Yeah, it's more steep for sure.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] A lot, I don't want to say most or all or nothing, but you have a lot of legit set weapons. Now you just gotta know how to use them. Now you gotta start learning how to use them.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yep, absolutely true. And yeaah, and that's a weird one cause I-


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In my experience anyway, uhm, I've seen they're like polar opposites as far as that kind of personality, the guy who'll get a belt and disappear.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Or the guy who will get a belt, and the day he gets his belt, he's like...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like he's been training for six months when you weren't looking or something, just in that one day, cause I think it's a mental thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, the belt thing is, and it's easier said than done, I think, especially if you're in a certain environment or a certain type of person, but, um, but if, if at all possible, don't think about the belt. Don't think about your belt. I think that's the... Think about the knowledge.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, that'll be the one way to get into this little realm of thinking jiu-jitsu is a long, repetitive grind. Guaranteed, I'm not saying that's why, but I'm saying that is a good way to think like that. Definite factor. Yes, big time, big time. Next question.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, we were, I was talking with Greg and Tim today about, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If someone's the opposite, they're on the outside. He's like, heck yeah. Like a Conor McGregor, like I'm the, you know, I'm the greatest. I'm going to beat him. My timing is dope and all this stuff and how good I am.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Um, but on the inside, when it comes down, when no one's looking, when it's time to train, he's learning from everyone. Some guy, a white belt gives a, gives them a tip. He considers that tip, is this going to help me? You know? So he's, his humility allows him to learn from everybody and you know, he ends up being.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] More successful, uhm, because of that humility, you know? And that's like the internal humility.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know how uhm, you know some people they're like, hey, I'm uhm, I'm not cocky, I'm confident.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I don't think I've ever heard you, and I've known you for 10 years I think. Maybe 8 years or so. I don't think I've ever heard you say, yeah I tapped that guy out. I don't think I've ever heard you say that. Maybe if I asked you, no, no, I can't even, I can't really like picture you saying that, yeah I tapped, or I tapped him out.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah, that was kind of wild. You know what's strange? That was really strange to you, but although I would maybe, I'm not saying I would never do that, I might do that as a joke, you know, but uhm, man.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Ultimately, deploy their children into the world and the parallels.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, and then, I think that that's a good move. Not getting too deep into specific things about how you specifically parent, because they're like, is there even such thing as perfect parenting? Everyone's


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Potentially, yes. So yeaah, that depends. And, and I think that the, the uhm, back to what you were saying about like some, even some adults don't know the consequences of your actions. That's, that goes on in the front of your brain here. And that's the last part to develop as a human being. It's the last part of your brain. That's why.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's why, like, teenage boys especially, right? Teenage 16, 17, 18, they get equipped with basically all the hardware, but the software, the part that controls it is all jammed up. So they're physically strong, they got hormones, they got a driver's license probably, they have rights now, right? So they go off and they're just pshhh.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It helps, uhm, determine, okay, this act, this consequence is gonna come along with this specific action is underdeveloped. And on average, and it gives, you know, it's give or take, but on average it,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So yeaah, that probably explains why dealing with teenagers becomes harder because they have all this hardware and the software is still trying to be updated. Uhm, but back to the perfect parent thing, there's no real perfect parent. People want different things for their kid and everyone's different, everyone has different philosophies. Do I spank them? Do I not spank them? I read this, I read that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So the outcome is going to be different and those different outcomes are going to appeal to different people. So it's basically like if you have a specific outcome that you want your kid to have, it's going to be determined by a bunch of things. But I think in my, in my experience and both being a parent and


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Having parents, so to speak, uhm, is consistency. Like if you could, if you have a message or, you know, some kind of discipline that you're imposing or some kind of just idea that you want to, you want to stick with your kids.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Be consistent on it. Don't, you know, don't say, hey, no jumping on the bed one day. And then the next day you don't feel you're lazy or tired or whatever. And you don't say, hey, don't jump on the bed because they're going to be like, oh, well, is this the day I can jump on the bed or is it not? I want to jump on the bed when you're not looking, guess what I'm going to be doing?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Cause I know that's not when you're sitting, but if you're no jumping on the bed, no jumping on the bed, they're just gonna say, okay, there's no jumping on the bed. Cause they're gonna be influenced by somebody. They're gonna get rules and how do I act? How do I be? What do I say? What don't I say? They're gonna get that from somebody.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And if you're all inconsistent, you might as well just be noise on the TV that comes on sometimes. If you're inconsistent with it, they're gonna get it from, I don't know, someone who's more consistent. That could be the neighbor, that could be TV, that could be the kid that they look up to in school, who's not very smart.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Or maybe it's smart, I don't know, there's a teacher, you know, the drug dealer, whoever, they're gonna get it from somewhere. So I think if you be consistent, they'll get it from you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And the more things that you, that are conducive to their success, in whatever, whatever you consider success, the more, or success, the more consistency you display in regards to those things. Cause you know the outcome. You know the outcome that they want. You know that if they act a certain way, it's going to facilitate this certain outcome. You know that. Or you should. I hope, I hope you do.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So if you just remain consistent on those issues to shape that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, that's true, and so much has to do with their environment. In fact, it's, it's, yeah, so much has to do with their environment, so.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Where each kid, like listen, okay, you have four kids, right? The first,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Kid coming, you know, coming into the world and boom.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yep, that's it. And I'm not even saying necessarily I'm not gonna go into the psychology part of it, I'm just saying boom, that's a different experience altogether.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Being the second kid, same thing. He has that one kid and then all these little kids behind him, you know, so it's just, you're just right out the gate. You're a different person, you know, so that's where you're going to see all these crazy different personalities. We were born, we were raised in the same house, same parents. My parents were the same the whole time, but just starting out, it's like you ever, you ever, you ever see prices, right? That game.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you can kind of, I forget if you can control it or not, but yeah, so as a parent, you can control the board, but there's so many different little things that it can hit and go this way. So if you're consistent and just consistently push one direction, it'll tend to go, but then all this, all these other factors are in play that you can't control. So.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Next question. So what do you think about CrossFit?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, the CrossFit undeniably what it, what it did is took working out and some CrossFit workouts can be hard. I did CrossFit for a little bit and uhm, even for someone who's like in pretty good shape, like they can be hard and what an element of CrossFit that I'm not sure.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, so what it did was it turned it into, now it's a sport, it's a straight up sport now. And really all it is is exercising. The sport of exercising, and who the guy who wins the CrossFit Games, what's he called? The fitness guy, right? So it brought fitness into this more of an activity.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In a CrossFit situation and they're going to be yelling supporting you and it's way easier to stick with a workout.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I mean, like you said, there's, there's already some of these, but they're like, okay, bodybuilding and you know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] From time to time, yeaah. All of them have straight up, uhm, you know, protein Greg. Yeaah. Uhm, he's a trainer and he's at the Balboa one. Big, full on. Greg, you wanna get your CrossFit on? You can go to 24 hour fitness. Of course it's more crowded. It's not crowded. It's different. The culture is different. Right. Which is a big part of CrossFit as well, but.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Facility wise, oh yea, bumpers all up in there.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, see, and like I was saying, that's kinda why you can't really just talk about something, because there's actually, if you want to quantify the parenting questions, there's infinity. Parenting question. There's no end to the parenting question. Because it's just so ambiguous, I don't even know, like really, what is...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Even then mistakes, like what does that mean? You know, I mean, of course, you know, mistakes if you go too extreme, but because really successful or I don't say successful, but really driven people, people who are just, you know, how you get somebody who's really driven. Yes, I do.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's usually, usually because some need, some during development wasn't fulfilled. And I'm not saying, you can't even say it's a bad thing because as a result, they're driven because psychologically it's like a need that needs to be fulfilled. So since that little cup.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Being a navy seal, jujitsu champion, you know, whatever it may be, but, but typically, and I'm saying every single time, I'm sure there's exceptions or maybe there's not exceptions. I don't know, but nonetheless, you can usually find some need that went unfulfilled somewhere.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] For people who are super driven. So if you made a mistake, parenting is, was that really a mistake?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, yeaah, so you figure if they're not in jail or, or super addicted to like drugs or something like this or, or then you can say, okay, I'm, I think, I think in my opinion, I'm within the confines of being a successful.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah, you mentioned how uhm, how you don't-


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like if you don't listen and you know how, how you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right, that's facebook.com slash choco podcast.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's true. Uh, for the Facebook thing too, uhm, we don't really post that much on there, but what we do post and will post is gonna be like quality stuff. It won't be just like, you know, just a bunch of stuff for quantity content. Yeaah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah, Facebook and Facebook's always changing as well. But in, in regards to them, uhm.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, I think the Twitter is easier, just like how you said, because it's just super simple. Boom, boom, boom. Yeah, but either way, they're both great.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] On it dot com slash Jaco, that's where you get your 10% off your supplements and their supplements are so good man. Like you, and I'm not super into supplements, that's a thing, but the ones that I take and you, you


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's hard to tell the difference a lot of times between brands, but you can tell the difference with these brands. And like the worry bar, for example.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, so consider the warrior bar is like, yeah, way better. It's like beef jerky, but...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But yeah, that's super awesome. Anyway, so anyway, that my point is the stuff on audit is, is good and you get 10% off. So that's like a no brainer. Um, yeah, audit.com slash Jocko. There you go. And then the Amazon click through you go to the podcast website, which is, uh,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, to say we use PayPal real simple, but, uh, but it's on there. Nonetheless, you know, for everyone that does that, man, it's so cool to be like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The, when you, what you mentioned about bravery, just how you were talking with, um, Sam Harris about it, where bravery is only present if you are scared of something. Because if you're not scared of it, you're not being brave to overcome anything or to go, you know, to do any kind of activity that's, um, you know, that, that you're scared of. So the very.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Is it, cause they were like uhm, it's like they weren't scared to die at all, like you didn't.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] As far as actual bravery goes though, so would you consider that?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like let's say K2 guys are gonna go, go do some, let's say an MMA fight, right? And one guy's just really scared of.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, so it could kind of be looked at as uhm, just, just the act itself, whatever act, if it's understood as being.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right. Or maybe just to overcome or do something that's understood generally as being scary.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Just cause it's not scary to you, you're still being just as brave. You are. But yeah, I think, yeah. And I guess in a real black and white terms, it's like, if you're not scared of this activity you're doing and you do it and you're not scared of it, then you're not being brave. And that's just generally speaking.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah. So what if some guy's jumping out for the first time and he's scared and he overcomes that fear and jumps out? He is being brave. Yeah. Right. So yeah, that's kind of the point. Yeah. So if I go outside and check the mail, I'm not being brave. No, you're not being brave. But what if there's like a tiger or something out there and I really need that mail?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah, so it's more like the comfort of battle, so.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What about when you travel, you go first class, meanwhile you send your team and coach.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, there's so many justifiable reasons in business, like, and I think you would go along with that too.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Or how you mentioned what he's talking about where it can be categorized as being recognizable, you know, so there's a lot of things, even stuff outside of just uniform that a CEO, how he presents himself, that'll keep him recognizable for all these reasons. But I'm sure, I'm sure most of the time, no one's perfect where they're gonna, they're gonna start doing it just cause


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I think that's crazy how that was like such a prominent idea back then. Yeah. Cause like growing up and I don't know, I just never heard about that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, and so how you bring up that example where if you say, Hey, can we record a podcast on Saturday? Technically you just, that's a yes or no question. Like, yes, we can. Like we're, we have that ability. That's a no. You didn't schedule anything technically. You said, so I could have taken it either way, you know?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Oh yeaah, I didn't know we were actually going to do it. You just said, you know, uhm, when I first started getting more, more hiring clients, it was immediately noticeable that that was a common thing. They'd always follow up with, with an email right after and help so much.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, in the creative world, that's a really, really significant thing to just say what you want and then let that person do it. Cause if you have some creative vision.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, and that's the, yeah, that's the way to go. I don't micromanage. No, I don't micromanage. Especially in the creative field. Well, I don't know. I'm sure it's equally as applicable everywhere.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, it kind of seems like that it would be just like any other exercise, right? You're exercising your discipline. So, and I don't know, but maybe this is what that means when they say your willpower wears down. Let's say.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But, you know, as far as the pay off, uh, you know, it's like basically, so if I test my willpower, I'm just saying throughout the span of a day or however many hours when you start to get hungry. So.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You do that, you let your hunger go on for even more, that's your willpower wearing down, wearing down. But, let's say you stuck to it, boom, and you stuck to it that day, then the next day...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You have experience going that far in your hunger and you will be stronger and know how to deal with it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah. So to compare that to like a workout, right? So let's say I, I do a hard, um, set of, I don't know, pushups.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Less strong on that second set and I do another set. I keep testing it, but the next day or the next week.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So the workout, the fatigue is that temporary fatigue, then you recover from it and then you're stronger in that way.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I noticed that and I actually brought it up to you remember last, just last week or whatever when we rolled and I was like, there's something that I noticed about you that, um, and that was that in the scramble, you won't just settle and hang out in my guard.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You don't even accept the garden. He talks about a long time ago before, but it was really, for whatever reason, just really prevalent that day that yeah, in the scramble.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, scramble goes on for, let's say, a longer time. Let's say the scramble goes on for six seconds, right? It's a pretty long scramble.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It seems like you still wouldn't, you wouldn't even stop the scramble until you're beyond the guard, you know? Yeaah, you won't just hang out with me, I'll sit right in that guard and get my rest on.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah, unless they have questions or something like that. Yeah, if you've got a question, that's what I'm saying.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Let's say there's a meeting of 10 guys and let's say three, four guys are discussing stuff and maybe they're trying to solve this problem that they specifically have. And then the other few guys, they feel compelled to want to be contributing to the meeting. So they say just more of the stuff that's so unnecessary, just so they can have something to say in the meeting.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] First question. My understanding is that it doesn't fare well against knives and multiple attackers compared to something like krav maga, muay thai, boxing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I heard the guy where he'll be like, hey, what's that jujitsu, whatever. And then I don't know, you show them or you explain it and they'll be like, oh, well, I'll just, I'll, I just gouge your eyes out right here. Or I just, um, you know, I don't know, strike your throat or something like this, right? So take the eye gouging option.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You don't have to be trained to eye gouge, so we both, well, eye gouge each other, like if you, if we're gonna go eye gouging,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, exactly. So I was like, okay, well, what's the pressure point though? So I was like, okay, do the pressure point on me. I won't even like fight you back. And he did the one like here by the neck. And I was like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Not only does that not really hurt that much right now, if, if we're in any kind of fight situation, I don't even think I would even notice that though. So he was like, oh yeah, yeah, we'll let me get this one. And he did one like behind me here and then my ribs, same exact thing. It's, yeah, it's more sensitive for sure. But it's not going to stop anybody, man. Yeah, it's, it simply does not work. But the Jiu-Jitsu, if you know Jiu-Jitsu,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You can still do all those things if you want to do it, but you don't even have to. Yeah. Cause you're going to put them to sleep.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah, and I would say even, in my opinion, more accurately, jiu-jitsu will help you or it'll give you the ability to control the fight.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Sure. So you can, like if you, jujitsu, you're not gonna...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Learn how to throw like a sick left hook or nothing like that. You're not going to learn that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, but you'll control the fight where if you want to punch someone, you'll be in the perfect position to punch them. No matter how much punching training you have, you can have no punching training.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You can just, I don't know, just throw your fist at them in whatever capacity. It'll be way more effective when you know jujitsu. And that goes for any other, one of these moves that people say they'll do. If you do jujitsu on them, you're the one going to control the fight. I've tried all those people have come to me.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It might work, like, you know, the risk ones, if you sit there and let them do it and be like, okay, yeah, that hurt.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, and that's kind of the point where it's a, yeah, I say, yeah, it might work if you let them do it, but that's the thing. You don't let them do it. So ultimately,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's a big deal that I didn't even think about where just having someone in, in girls especially, or just people who aren't used to confrontation. Man, when you get in a fight.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which one was the one with Art Jimerson with the one glove?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That was one, okay. So, he got mounted and tapped. And man, that's a perfect example. He didn't get...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They know mount escape so good where they hope they get mounted so they can get on top.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, and then so you compare those two sides of the spectrum? Jujitsu.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Next. Next question. Can you expand on how to appropriately effectively and tactfully lead up the chain of command in a profession that's considered to be very paramilitary?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] My line of work sometimes works against us limiting ideas and ways of doing things.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Hi guys, how about on a podcast you talk about what is the essential equipment for a home gym?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So when you say, make sure it's legit, why is that? So you don't- so it doesn't break while you're using it? Basically?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Especially when you kind of start with kind of one thing and you slowly just add on. And essential.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's kind of a complex question anyway to begin with and you did say for you, right? So it depends on what.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right? I would assume that as well. But it's not necessarily a fact.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, essential equipment, right? I would say that...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yes, it depends on what you, what results you want. So if you just want to be a bodybuilder with, with big muscles.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's not about completing the list, so I was gonna elaborate a little bit more, but...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Is if you work out at home, especially this, these kinds of workouts, you get more of a testosterone boost if you work out at a, at a public gym, like at a 24 hour fitness or CrossFit gym or something. Which one gives you more?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I don't know, it's this weird, some guy did an experiment a long time ago where, uhm, I don't know how long ago, but he did an experiment where he found out all these little things that you can do in front of people that'll boost your testosterone. One was, uhm, like drive a car, like a certain kind of car, and if you do it in front of people,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So, if you, and not only do you get that, you get, um, psychological, mental priming as well. So when you walk in the gym, like the CrossFit gym,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] All the smells, the sounds and all that basically primes your mind and your physiology for a workout. So.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I don't think it would, it would replace the actually being there. Just that part of it. I'm not saying home gyms are junk. I'm not saying that at all.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I love it. Yeah, see, and that's part of it as well, so uhm.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The whole reason, the whole reason I set up a home gym was so I don't have to make that drive to the...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It depends on who you are. Yeah, it'll backfire. Like for example, I'll be like, hey, I, I don't have to.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's a lack of discipline. Yeah, it can be. And if you're looking for helpers for that discipline, a home gym, it could go either way, man.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah. I like how, you know how your home gym is kinda separate?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay, podcast question. Uh, how does it feel to do Tim Ferriss podcast, Joe Rogan podcast and get thousands of followers listening to your podcast, uh, reading your book, et cetera? Do you worry that some of your fans place you on a pedestal and engage in hero worship?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You just, you be you, you, and that's all you're going to do is be you. You're not trying to live up to anyone's expectation. That's, that was never a goal of yours. No. So if someone has an expectation, since that's not your goal, how can you worry about it? You're going to continue to be you and.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And some of this stuff, people may have heard before, but someone like you who's done what you've done and think the way you think and do what you do right now, you're the perfect medium for that, for that information to get passed on to someone, you know?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, when you're a teenager or something, your dad tells you to do something, your mom tells you to do something, you're like, yeah, fuck that. But then when you go, then you go to your friend's house and then like, he tells you to do the exact same thing and you're like, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, it just, it takes that same message, but from someone who you can, for lack of a better way of putting it, someone you can accept it from.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And so all your messages are perfectly in line with who you are, so they're so, like, you're so eager to accept them, you know? So, like, how you post, you know, online you'll post a picture of your watch every morning in your kind of the workout setting and stuff like that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you're kind of your message, uhm, more or less is get up every morning and get your work done, get a workout in whatever and then you're doing it and there's the proof right there.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So if you're just some dude who's like, yeah, work out every day and you don't do it, then it's like, eh, it's gonna be harder, harder to accept. So.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] People will get those messages and they'll internalize them way more readily from someone like you given the messages that you're sending. That's one. Two, the whole broadcasting yourself.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's totally understandable for someone like you in that it's good that you kinda got your...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I kinda got turned on to the notion that it's more, you have really good messages and good content that will improve people in their life, whether it be older people, younger people, girls, guys, everything.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This is, especially like a podcast situation or even like certain online profiles and stuff, there are good ways to get that information out that people need, man. Like to improve themselves, like if you're in a neighborhood or an environment with a bunch of people improving themselves, that's gonna be a good neighborhood. And if they have the means to improve themselves,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'm telling you. So I'm saying, broadcasting yourself.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yes, and there's a guy who's a teacher. Posts.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He's a teacher. He posted good on his classroom door. Yea, on his classroom door. Man, and so now he's, yea.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Abuse it, quote unquote. Um, but you know, like if you went, I don't know, like on the highway and, and all you saw was people speeding, reckless driving, it still doesn't change the fact that you, you still want to drive on the highway because you have something to do. You know, um, your, your, your pursuit is different, but yeah, there's going to be everyone. The other weird thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay, last question. Jocko, what motivates you? I heard you mention the man in the cave. Can you go deeper on this? What motivates me?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, there it is. Then you, then you got the, you got the donation thing too, right? Yes. We're asking for it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's brought out more, huh? No doubt about it. No doubt about it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, you know, they hear the big, uh,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's a good one. You just make that up? I did just make it up.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which is why it leads to freedom.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] When you think about that, like, the engineers in Warzone, right, it's not like, compared to like an MMA fight, right, the cut man, where he's like, facilitating all these things, giving water, whatever, but that's between rounds, he's not part of the fight. The engineer guys, they're straight up, yeaah, they're gonna get hit, but here's the thing, they're not there specifically to fight.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They're there to do some other stuff, so it's like, man, they can get blindsided, like all that stuff.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The Germans thought they were rolling light, you know, you know, hey, let's roll light. And Americans were like, nah, we're going ADCC style right now.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, it's strange. It's almost like you can look at them in both ways, cause on one hand, they're just regular guys, but when you see them in action kind of thing, you're like, oh dang, they're getting at their warriors, you know? It's true. I mean, I don't know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, I mean, how can you not just cower in the first corner you see, really, you know, when you compare it to everyday life? Man.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I mean, I hate to, I don't hate to, but I can't help but compare it to Saving Private Right and that movie, right? And there's a part where they indicate that everyone's been trying to guess.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like yeaah, this is back in the, yeaah, you know, back in the, and then he's like, yeaah, I'm a school teacher and all this stuff, all this like normal stuff. And then meanwhile, as the movie kind of progressed, you see him in action. It's like, dang, for a school teacher, these guys are, you know, they're really getting the job done.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah man, seeing that exactly where, if, let's say you didn't know their job outside of the, you know, the battle, and you see them, you're like, dang, these guys are straight up, this is their thing, this is what their, their primary career is, you know? That's what it seems like.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, and go and just be straight up effective. Yup. Not like they're there like, timid, you know, cause I'm, hey, I'm just here for 14 months, back home, I'm, you know, I work at offices, whatever, they're like, nope. Watch me work.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, pretty much alright, and you can see the difference in the way they- Man, this one in particular really, to me anyway, really, really delivered with the descriptions and stuff, and it was like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I don't know how he compa- where he compares, like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And a lot of writers do this, and when you can do it good, it's really powerful, where, uh, like for example, the, uh, he talked about the, uh, the one plane that I think he got hit, or it was crashing, and he compared it to, he said it was a spear, a light lit spear with a smoke trail, and you can see exactly what that looks like, you know,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, speaking of interwebs, and awesome, by the way.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Let's talk about supplements as we do a lot of the time at this time. So on it, right? Best supplements. We all know that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Even though we already know that, that is a big deal because of the nature of just supplement companies in general. So, rest assured on it, best one. That's it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] On its supplement, you can get 10% off because of the Jocko link, which is on it.com slash Jocko 10% off. Boom. Supplement your wallet a little bit. Supplement your, your body and.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In your mind? Alphabrain. Alphabrain. For sure.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But, notably k, I'm gonna admit something, I didn't take krill oil.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Until when? Until recently. So, remember, okay, in the spirit of extreme ownership, apparently I was not clear enough to you about the fact that I wanted it from you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, I wasn't just wondering, I kinda wanted some. Anyway, I'll admit, I didn't take that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'm not, I'm not this guy who's, like, has all these nagging joint pains when I go work out. Cause really, that's really when I think, okay, do I have joint pain? No, no, no, I work out good, hard, I roll jujitsu, I do a lot of stuff, I don't have joint pain. But here's the thing, I do have joint pain. When I wake up in the morning,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And the thing is, like I said, when you're, like when I think of, when someone says, do you have joint pain? I'm thinking when I work out, that's it. I don't think like, you know, other time, unless they're asking specifically. So like my daughter, she's three and a half now. She's kind of like a bigger three and a half too. And she comes, runs up.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] She's 40 pounds, she jumps on the back, I'm like, oooooh, I gotta focus. Really? I gotta focus on like my, yeah, just because of the stiffness. Not necessarily pain, but just like stiff. You know how like if you just didn't warm up at all, you can't just jump. It's like that feeling. And then recently my ankle got jacked up one day. Oh, that's right. And I have like, I think there's torn ligaments, so.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, you know, but it had already been jacked, by the way. So it got footlocked and then it like inflamed it. So...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now I gotta walk downstairs with this girl on my back.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's a little bit of a challenge, yeaah, but I take the krill oil, not the first day, not even the second day, but it was maybe a few days later. She jumps on my back. I'm still working out hard by the way, so it's not like, oh, you recovered. She jumps on my back. I'm like, dang, I feel solid. I can go like, when I stand up, I'm like, boom, popping up. Noticeably.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Reduced. Still there, my ankle's still there. Even right now, it's still. But bro, this was like, I would say maybe four or five days. And this is when I know it, I was like, dang, this is, this is good.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, and that, like I said, that main, and here, my wife's dad was like telling her, long, this is years ago, saying, no, krill oil, no, not fish oil, fish oil was good, krill oil is that, and I'm like, krill, I look up krill, it's the trim, like, oh, sweet, it's joint pain, it's all this stuff or whatever, and like I said, even back then, right now, same thing, when I work, I don't have joint pain.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Maybe if I have a strain or something, but that's not a joint pain. General, you know, so I'm like, all right, good for you. Knock yourself out with a cruel oil when I need it. And then I'm going to come on. Maybe I'll ask you about some stuff. So, you know, I see it and it's cool. Good. But this is the first time I really like, all right, I get, I got you the cruel. Now you get there.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What else? Warrior bars. I think warrior bars are made out of buffalo meat. They are. They are, yes they are. We never said that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which must have some glorious properties to make you stronger. Well, yeaah, but uhm, nonetheless, to me, that makes it even more awesome. Not cause, I mean, not for any specific reason other than maybe novelty, but it's still pretty dope, in my opinion. Uhm, so, still tastes really good.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's meal replacement. Someone asked me on Twitter, hey do you, you know, what meal replacement or protein shakes or whatever would you recommend if any? I said none.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'm driving a, I don't know, airplane or something for a long time. Something.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Eat two of them. That's a big filler. They're pretty big too. They're like, they're not messing around and they're good. That's the thing. Like remember back in the day, the, the, you know, the, the bars. Not even back then, even right now, you eat one of those like, oh, all right, I see where you're going. Whether you're trying to make it like a candy bar or you're trying to, it's not like that at all. This is good.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Anyway, don't worry Barcelli. Another way you can support the podcast in the event of you being in the mood to support the podcast is next time you shop at amazon.com.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Click through one of our links. It's like a passive way. Actively, aggressively efficient way to support. And super easy. It doesn't cost you anything. You click through, you do your shopping. Boom. It's like we get like a little referral thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, in a way, it's almost like a collective, like, hey.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, so it's like this weird like circle almost, you know, they, you know, they buy from Amazon, we're like, hey, go to Amazon, but go through us, and Amazon's like, hey, thanks for buying, thanks for sending them. We're supporting Amazon. Whether it be books or whatever, Docte, all this stuff. Because we're making people want to buy.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, that's gonna be solid there. That is solid currently, that's solid. But yeah, the Amazon, anyway, yeah, support that way. Uhm, like I always say, a big part of that, or a big, not issue, but a thing in there, is remembering to do it. If you wanna do this, remembering to do it. So, we do have what's called a trooper.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] All it is, you go, you, you download it. It's basically you click on it. Samson Trooper or Trooper Tool Chrome extension. Click on it, accept it. It's on your thing. It automatically does it for you. From here on out. It's dope. It's like a little official thing to bring it up. So solid.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We- we're trying to update, I've been talking to him. We're trying to update it for-


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But yeaah, that's good. Trooper tool, you don't have to remember it anymore. You remember it one time. That's all. Shop at Amazon, still support. Aggressively. Efficiently.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And of course, support by subscribing to the podcast on iTunes and YouTube.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah. That's legit. And of course, the Jocko store. Oh. I think we're, I'm not, I think, I know that we're trying, we are trying our best.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's like even in a simple t-shirt, there's multiple, multiple dimensions to it, you know? It's not just, hey, that's a cool thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The saying is important and extends way beyond what you'd expect on the surface. That goes for all the shirts. Including the rash guards. Including the rash guards. Okay, so new stuff. New stuff. Rash guards. The rash guards are good.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, it's real funny about that exact notion. When I, when we first got the first shirts in, discipline equals freedom. But on the gray one, and I get, I know that, that thing, that's, it's a my, it's a psychological thing. Yeah, it's real. Yeah, which is by the way, one of the most powerful things in your whole life, psychological. Anyway, so I put it on, I was like, yeah, I'm going to take a picture.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's out is patches for jiu-jitsu, for anything. They're just patches you can sew on. They're iron-on, but you, you sew em, sew em on, sew em on, yeaah. Uh, patches, discipline equals freedom. There is a jiu-jitsu specific patch. It says jiu-jitsu, suit, you know, discipline. Anyway, go on jakustory.com, you can see em all.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Women shirts are new. Oh wait, back to the patches real quick. So I got a recommendation for the velcro one. Which is, bro, I don't even know why I didn't, like, it didn't dot me.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Either way, they are literally in the works. Submitted.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yes, vetoed. I didn't really feel like doing the pink either, so guess what I did? The pink. Actually, I didn't do the pink, but it's in the works still. Nonetheless, they're on the way, straight up on the way of


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And humility because just cause it's not your specific opinion, doesn't mean it's, you know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] JockoStore.com. That's it. That's where they all are.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Oh wait wait, one more thing. Just a little technical thing. Okay, outside of the U.S. If you're outside of the U.S. Canada, anywhere outside of the U.S.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I put a little thing on there, cause just, as far as just the shipping process, the technical thing, uhm, for customs, they want your phone number to create the shipping label, I need your phone number.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I was in Australia, you know, a couple years ago or whatever, and uhm, met this guy Jason. He's a black belt under Hickson. And he has a- anyway, I was uhm, I was with him, doing some stuff, and he would teach me all the Australian stuff. And some I didn't know, like Too Easy, for example. Too Easy is like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah, like, all good. Yeaah, it's, it's just this real, it's kinda ambiguous, but it, you know, I love that phrase. Anyway, nonetheless, you know, you get into fun conversations with people and you email them for, for the simple stuff, for their short order. I know, I know, whatever, good.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Canadian army soldier and sniper who served in Afghanistan.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He now serves as an elected member of the Ottawa City Council.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He got second place in a show called The Amazing Race. He authored a best-selling book about his experiences. He's a husband and a dad.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Beyond all that, Jodie is a real hero.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] An absolute inspiration to anybody that knows his story. Which is what we will be talking about tonight. Welcome to the show, Jody. Thank you, Jaco. Did I miss anything?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Also with us is Echo Charles. Good evening, Echo. Good evening. Now, before we dig into your book, I wanted to start off with an excerpt of a poem.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] By Rudyard Kipling. And it's called the Young British Soldier. And I think this is a little bit appropriate since Canada is a former part of the Commonwealth of England and now part of the Commonwealth.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And while Kipling was never actually a soldier, he did.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Attend the United Service College in England, which kind of prepared young men for the army, although he never joined, but he did spend many years abroad in the British colonies. And he also lost his only son, John, in World War I, at the Battle of Loos in September of 1915.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Where there was just about a hundred thousand casualties in a matter of days and John Kipling was last seen lurching through the mud blindly, crying out in agony.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And this poem that I'm about to read a part of is not about World War I.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's about the British wars that took place.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] From the 1830s to the early 1900s in a part of the world called Afghanistan.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you're wishful to duck. Don't look nor take heed at the man that is struck. Be thankful you're living and trust to your luck. And march to your front like a soldier.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If your officer's dead and the sergeants look white, remember it's ruined to run from a fight. So take open order, lie down and sit tight and wait for supports like a soldier. Wait, wait, wait like a soldier.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, a way to get there in your book here in a minute. Your book is called Unflinching.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which the name of the first chapter is awesome because this is something that I believe is something that a lot of people have. I know I damn sure did. The first chapter is called The Soldier in the Child. And I think that describes a lot of people that joined the military.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's the thing that's in there. It's, they're born with it. You were born with it. I know I was born with it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now, your mom, how did she feel about all that?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I had two, two daughters that were young in our house and I didn't want them and I'm not gonna have them have all these Barbies. I don't even know where they came from. But they showed up at my house. And guess what? My son was born and I was all worried oh he's gonna be playing with Barbies. That kid, that kid didn't care about Barbies. He didn't care about balls. They don't even look at them. Anything that had wheels on it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So your mom had that attitude and then along came, uh, Uncle Jim.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That happens. Now, when you've got to be a teenager.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, you kinda sounded, in the book, you sound like, yes, you sound like a teenager. Yea, oh yea. And I mean, just to go here, in your book, you say, I was a loner who didn't fit in.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I still dreamt of being in the army probably because I wanted to belong to something.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And it was definitely clear I didn't belong in school.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In the book, you talked about this here, you're basically starting bootcamp. And you say, you just get your hair cut. You get your head shaved for the first time. Once the barber was done, I studied myself in his mirror. I barely recognized the young man staring back at me. The eyes were the same, but everything else was different.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I wasn't Jodie Mittick, layabout loner, high school good for nothing, another floundering adolescent with no ambition and no life plan.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That kid was lying under a pile of hair on the floor.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, you know what, one thing that, because when I was a kid, you know, I was into, this is going a little bit tangential, but I was into the hardcore scene on the East Coast. Yes. Hardcore music, that's what I grew up with. And it was like, yeah, shaved heads getting after it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] One of my, my best friend at the time, he's like, listen, you know, we're part of this where there's nowhere to hide. You can't hide behind your bangs. It's all right there. You gotta face yourself. And it also strips away.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, any kind of, I mean, hair is basically, uh, uh, what's that word? It's basically for show. I mean, that's what hair is. It has no purpose. Other than I look good. So let's just go ahead and remove that. I don't care what I look like, I'm here to win.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So yeaah, I guess that might explain my haircut in some way.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right on. Alright, so now, we get into this next section, now you're kinda learning about what the army's like. And here's some stuff that you said about it. There was a system for everything in the army. A way to stand and a way to sit. A way to dress and a way to sleep.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There's also a way to assist them for how to properly eat at the mess hall.


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[Assistant] Our routine was an endless monotonous cycle. We woke up, made our cots, folded our sleeping bags in the exact way we'd been taught.


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[Assistant] Once the tent was in shape, it was on to barracks, barrack boxes. We had to lay them out as instructed, with everything in its proper place, whether it made sense or not. We had to stand beside our kit and cots everyone perfectly still as the officer did inspection.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] At the time, I thought that so much of this discipline was overkill.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Why did we have to stand at attention when the officer was on the other side of the tent looking at some other dude's cotton kit? Why did our barracks boxes have to be identical?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It took me a couple years to figure out that the skills they were drilling into us are actually really important for a combat leader.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If you can't still stand still long enough for morning inspection, how can your commanders trust you to hold your post during a mortar barrage? How will a leader know he can count on you to be a useful soldier if you can't even follow through on an order meant to keep you and your comrades safe, even if you don't know it at the time?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] All these drills were training me to put self-discipline above my instinct to flinch or flee.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] When everything in me told me to break my posture, to stand down, I learned to obey a different order instead.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It was basic training, but I was assimilating some important skills that would later make me a better sniper.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And that's obviously why I honed in on this because you kind of captured the kind of things that they're teaching you discipline.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They're teaching you discipline and if you don't make that connection for all you young troopers out there that are getting ready to join the military, there's a purpose. There's a reason behind it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And, you know, that's part of my book is the book that I wrote with Leif. You know, one of the chapters is called Discipline Equals Freedom. There's another chapter in there. It happens to be called Cover and Move.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, we relate it to everything we do. To me, there's no other tactic. And again, I had to call this out in your book. And by the way, I'm reading your book right now.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like, should I say, okay, can you read this section? And then I thought to myself, it's gonna be different for you to hear it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you know, beyond doing what you're told, even in that paragraph, you pointed out, look the, the, the inspectors look in the other direction. You could easily break your posture.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, he's not gonna see you. He's never gonna catch you. But guess what? You held the line.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You held the line and that's what you're learning is that no matter what, no matter if people are looking or not, you're gonna do your job.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, here you go talking about covered move. In our pairs, one guy would move forward while the other guy would shoot to provide cover. The mover would yell, moving! And jump up and move forward about three steps, saying in his head, up, he sees me, down. While his partner covered him.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] At down, the mover would take cover going to ground taking up a firing position and yelling covering once in position.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you just had to break that out on your own team at work now in the civilian sector, right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's uh, it's human nature. Yeaah. That, that thread of human nature runs through, from 2500 years ago at Sun Tzu, through war, through life, through business, through the relationships that you now have with your kids. Yeaah. It's everywhere.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I started arriving on time and paying attention to lessons. In the military, you can direct your career according to your aptitudes and interests. So I decided to do the same at school. Instead of taking classes I hated, I picked ones I knew I would enjoy. My grades improved because I was doing more of what I wanted to do.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] For the first time, I had discipline and self direction.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And instead of all that energy being repressed or coming out the wrong way, I had focus. I went from being a loner and keeping to myself to becoming more outgoing and popular at school.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It really goes along. And see, I went to college after I'd been in the SEAL teams for eight years. No, sorry, ten years. So when I went to college, I was like, oh, bring it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And for the first time you, cause in civilian world when you're a kid they go, oh you gotta learn this and you don't study and next thing you know you don't really know it and then you take the test and you fail and you're like, oh I'm not smart, I'm an idiot. And the army's like, no you will learn this.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which is awesome. So then, now you still weren't active in the military, you went to get your factory work on.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So you get back, now you go full active duty, you become a soldier by profession.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay, so you don't go back in, but you are back, active duty, and now you'd think that Jodie was all super squared away now, but you weren't, were you?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah. Yeah. So I don't know why you, by the way, just so you know, you wrote this in the book that's been published. Yeah, yeah. Acting like this didn't happen now is a little bit too late. You got arrested.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, and that's the main reason why I kind of wanted to tell that. Yeah, I wanted you to talk about that because number one, like you said, it's a mistake that you made that


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, I've had that feeling too before where you're just like, okay, this is my reality now. There's no, you can't go backwards. You're cuffed.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You had, you transitioned from it. And in the book, here's how you kinda talk about that transition, cause they're gonna send you back to Meeford. What's it, Meeford?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So they're gonna send you to the battle school for another crack at it. Your third crack at it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And so they go back and forth, finally you get orders, okay, we're going to let you stay in. And now you say this, I had two choices. I could be pissed off forever and feel hard done by, or I could go back to Mefford with a new attitude and make the best of it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I could keep my head high and get off the bus with the shiniest boots, the best pressed uniform, the best laid out kit and the best attitude and be in the best shape of anybody there. And that's what you did. That's what I did. So anybody that's out there that's listening to this podcast that hit a little bump in the road, that's what you do.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You show up with the best attitude, the best shape with your head held high and you get after it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So now fast forwarding a little bit. You deploy, now you're legit part of the regiment. Yep, yep, finally. And you deploy to Kosovo, which at the time was a real world mission. I'm sure you were fired up. I know I would have been fired. I didn't go to Kosovo, but I would have been fired up to go to Kosovo because it was the only game in town.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I like this little section here, you got, you're talking about the Russians, cause you're stationed near some Russian folks and you said this, we like to think we're tough as Canadians, but it turned out this Russian unit where we're Russian airborne.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Who'd come from the fighting in Chechnya. And we've gone into some pretty deep, uh. You guys talked about Chechnya. Yea, we talked about Chechnya in here.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] These guys took things to a whole new level. They were hardcore soldiers. We would complain when our showers weren't giving us warm water. Then we'd look over to the Russian camp and see soldiers outside in minus 25 degrees, washing themselves with snow.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We're out in t-shirts cutting firewood. These guys were sleeping in World War II-era tents while we were sweating inside our heated barracks. And every morning, they'd be outside in the ball-freezing cold, running, doing chin-ups and bench-pressing big truck tires.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But, you know, nothing really of substantial events happen in Kosovo. Uhm, you get home from that and this is when you get the opportunity to go to sniper training. Which is...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, outstanding. And I thought you did a great job here of pointing out what


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] A sniper is. Cause people have little ideas in their heads about what a sniper is. And here's Jody's version of what a sniper is.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] A true sniper is someone who's willing to do pretty much anything to accomplish the mission.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The sniper has a particular mindset and shooting is actually one of the easier parts of the role.


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[Assistant] I've seen men at the rifle range who are amazing marksmen, but who would be terrible snipers because they don't have the patience.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They lack the ability to deny their own needs and to put the mission first.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] A true sniper will make himself uncomfortable just to make the shot.


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[Assistant] That is something so true, the guys think that the, that what a sniper is is someone that shoots really well.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But what if there's ants crawling and biting your eyes?


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[Assistant] All the sniper courses, definitely, you talk about in the book, you talk about stalking, that's something that no one, I haven't seen that movie, but no one really understands the difficulty and the challenging and the self-discipline.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's an exercise in self-discipline to crawl, you know, one meter every 10 minutes. It's hard. To get to a position where you can see your target and take the shot.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So you get done with sniper school, you spend some more time, and then September 11th happens. Game on. And the opportunity comes up.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] For you to go on deployment. Now, you'd already been through sniper school, you were a sniper, but the opportunity, there's no opportunity for a sniper to play. What they need is a driver.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, which is, which is, I mean, it's definitely a dangerous job. It's definitely a monotonous job. It's not, it's not a glorious job by any stretch.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But, and also what's rough about being a driver is you have a lot less control over your own fate. I mean, you're basically in a defensive situation. When you're driving in a convoy, you're in a defensive situation. That's all there is to it. So here you are. You're a target. Yeah, you're a target. You've been trained to be the hunter and now you get an offer to go on deployment to be the hunted as a driver. And of course, because you're


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And, like we said, there's a threat. You obviously were prepared for anything, of course.


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[Assistant] But, y-you know, there wasn't a super high threat.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The Iltus Jeeps were not designed to withstand an attack.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This fact became starkly apparent when three, three RCR guys were driving to Iltis and hit a landmine.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Two of them, Sergeant Robert Short and Corporal Rob Beerenfinger, died immediately.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And the driver, TJ Sterling, a friend of mine, survived, though he was injured.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] After the incident, TJ was brought to the hospital at Camp Warehouse. And me and another one of the guys from the regiment went to see him. This was the first time I'd seen one of our guys hit by a landmine.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In fact, it was the first time I'd seen a casualty at all.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There's always a particular odor in the hospitals around people who have suffered traumatic injuries. I remember smelling that odor, like blood, or maybe just what I thought blood smelled like.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] TJ was on a stretcher with big wheels. We'd use this kind of stretcher before in training. To me, it was a kind of prop. This thing we used for simulations. But this was not a simulation. This was the real thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] TJ was still in shock. It had taken a few hours for him to be extracted from the scene of the explosion.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Shorty and Birnfenger are gone, he said. Yeah man, we replied, we heard.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The doctors and nurses wouldn't allow it but as soon as they were out of the vicinity, we lit a cigarette for TJ and gave him a couple of drags. Ah, that's way better, thanks.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We stayed and chatted with TJ about some inconsequential things, trying to keep a fellow royal in a good state of mind.


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[Assistant] For me personally, I was learning from what was happening. Facing the reality that when things go wrong, you have to get that smell in your nostrils and look those sights right in the eye.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Sadly, a few years later, TJ ended up taking his own life.


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[Assistant] I was a pallbearer at his funeral and as I carried his coffin, I wondered if he carried guilt for being the lone survivor in that incident.


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[Assistant] Getting that smell in your nostrils and looking those sights right in the eyes. That's I think an important thing for people to remember.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Some people want to deny that it's happening. They want to hold their nose and shield their eyes from it. Wrong answer. Breathe it in.


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[Assistant] And I'll tell you, having working with, worked with a bunch of different companies in a bunch of different industries.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They run into these situations too, you know, where their company's gonna fail or there's a problem, there's, there's things go wrong. And no, you know what?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Lives are not at stake, and I say this all the time, but livelihoods are. And if you're the CEO of a company, you're gonna have to now lay off 500 people, a thousand people, three people.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And now that person's not going to be able to afford their mortgage or pay for their kids or get food on the table. That is serious business. You're ruining someone's life. And if you want to shield your eyes at that moment,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If you want to hold your nose so you don't have to smell it, you're wrong.


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[Assistant] This is, you know, we're talking about the psychological wounds that people get. Which for him were worse than his physical wounds.


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[Assistant] You know, use the word dwell, and that's a, that's a word that I use as well. I use the word dwell and I, and I, and I always say,


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[Assistant] That you gotta face these things, you gotta understand these things, you gotta actually embrace these things, you gotta bring them in but you can't dwell on them. That's right. And I think that's the key is to


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Is honestly to do what you, what you said is to breathe it in, to look it in the eye, deal with it, but don't dwell on it, don't stay


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What you gotta do is you gotta just take a step. You gotta take that step forward. You gotta, you gotta look. You gotta look it in the eyes.


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[Assistant] And make something, go in another direction, go forward.


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[Assistant] So what are you gonna do? Are you gonna let it drag you down? Are you gonna dwell on it forever? Don't. Don't do that. Man, I know. I know it gets a hold of you. I know it's a tough one.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But, deal with it. Accept that you can't change it. Accept that you're here for a reason.


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[Assistant] To do something, you have the opportunity that maybe your buddies didn't get. They didn't get. Nevermind, maybe you have an opportunity that your buddies did not get. You think they would want to have you kill yourself? No, they'd want you to live. And that's what you need to do. Yeah. Honor them.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, when I, when I decided that I was gonna try and become an officer in the SEAL teams, part of that, part of my decision,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's not like I was going to be an admiral or whatever, it's going to be like, just, and I said, you know what?


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[Assistant] I'm gonna have a cool seal platoon one day and those guys are gonna, those guys are gonna be fired up and we're gonna kick ass. Just my little world.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Just that little thing. And no matter where you are, you got that little world.


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[Assistant] Maybe like you said, maybe it's one other person, maybe it's just yourself. But you make that little part of your world a little bit better.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So I would like to go rainbows, but we're not there yet. Alright brother, hit me. So now you're.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You're coming back from Afghanistan. And, you know, you've got your girlfriend and what not. And, here we go.


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[Assistant] My first tour in Afghanistan ended a few weeks later and I headed back home. I was still haunted by all the things I had witnessed in Kabul.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Images played over and over in my head, whether it was small children begging for money, a mother holding a dead baby in the streets, or my buddy TJ bloodied up from a roadside bombing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] My girlfriend expected me to return as the same guy who had left six months earlier, but I was a different man now, a different Jodie. Everything around me looked different too.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Maybe things hadn't changed much, but I felt like I was on an alien planet.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] My girlfriend had redecorated the house, moving some of the furniture around and repainting the bedroom, and I found it upset me.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Life had gone on without me. And that fact was hard to take. People around me kept saying, what's wrong with you, Jody? You've changed. And that would make me even more upset. Not because they were wrong.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But because I thought I was the kind of soldier who could just walk it off. But few soldiers can.


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[Assistant] It takes time after a tour duty for a soldier to readjust a civilian life, and I wish I'd known that earlier.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I was expected to continue life just as I had lived it before my tour, but I couldn't. Not right away.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I couldn't step back into my normal routine as if I hadn't witnessed anything on mission.


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[Assistant] I couldn't just hop in the car and go to the grocery shopping like everything was fine.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I've always been very compartmentalized in the way I think.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right. Sometimes, probably to a detriment to, uh, my family a little bit.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And, I mean that's probably part of one of the things that-


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You've been married. I've been married for a long time. Okay. And I've always been like that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's wrong, I think, but the SEAL teams was always the biggest priority in my life. And you know people will be like, oh, family first? That was not true for me. And luckily, my wife understood that. And she didn't hold it against me. Right.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] She knew that someday, she knew the SEAL teams wasn't gonna last forever. And all you guys in the military, I'll tell you what, the military does not last forever.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And so, that's why I think I just was able to compartmentalize what, you know, a way. Right. And I would basically be almost a schizophrenic of, this is the guy that works. And this is the guy that's at home. He's dad or whatever.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And boom, I just had that really good split and I think it was beneficial to me.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And that's what happens next. So, she announced, this is back to the book here, she announced that she was leaving.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I was shocked because I didn't want to break things off. I just wanted to postpone the wedding. But for her, this was all too much. Our relationship was over. While I was certain this was the right time to get, while I wasn't certain this was the right time to get married, I was certain about one thing. I wanted to go back to Afghanistan. And this time as a sniper. And that's something that


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I mean, that's something that's hard to reconcile. The feeling of just wanting to go back. I mean, that's...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Go back to Afghanistan. And this time you're going as a sniper, which is awesome. You're back in Afghanistan.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There's some heavy fighting going on now. There's some legit fighting and, and...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The Canadians are actually leading operations, which is the first time in quite some time, I think since Korea.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This one was called Operation Medusa.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This Canadian-led NATO operation was going to be different from anything we'd done so far. It was a bit of a wake-up call.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So was the fact that my buddy Jeff Walsh had been killed in friendly fire in an accident that happened in August. Clearly we were entering a high risk situation.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That didn't deter me in any way, in any way. If anything, it made my resolve stronger. I trained for this. And I was ready.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What, uh, what was the friendly fire? Was it aircraft or was it shooting?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Never point your weapon at something you do not want to destroy. Yeah. And keep your finger off the trigger. Keep your weapon on safe.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Alright, now as you guys are getting ready to go into this Operation Medusa, uh, one of the orders that comes out...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Is, if anybody gets hurt during this mission, we're gonna stop right away and take care of it. We're gonna make sure the casualties are dealt with, and then reassess the situation before moving forward.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which is, I'm sure, people that aren't in the military. When you're going on an attack.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Your, your idea is to maintain the momentum of the attack. And you take casualties along the way while you're attacking.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You keep attacking. You don't stop. You know, you're gonna take casualties. You're gonna, people are gonna get hit. Things are gonna slow you down. You don't slow down. You try and keep pushing forward. You keep pushing forward.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You've, I've said it on this podcast before, aggression will mitigate risk.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So you get aggressive, you move through the target, you get the target secure, then you can deal with the guys that are down.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Ignore em, and you can't drop off a medic here and there to handle a situation, but you're not gonna stop. I mean, literally, you know, STOP.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, and what's really, what's really, uh, to your point of you're not sure if that's what was meant, what's really important is that the main thing you want to get across to your troopers when you're going on to assault is you want the main point to be get aggressive.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's the main point that you wanna get across to them, not, hey, the main point that you're gonna take away from this is if we take casualty, stop. Yeesh. No.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We're gonna get aggressive, we're gonna finish through the target, we're gonna secure the target.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And nothing is going to stop us from doing that. I don't care what happens. That's what you want to have going into it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But you've received plenty of orders. Yes, sir. All right. Now.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We're starting it on the assault. The assault is going down.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And here we go. Up ahead, the first vehicles were closing in on the white schoolhouse. The Zettelmeyer cleared away for the lead platoon, comprising of four LAVs and a G-Wagon to take position next to the schoolhouse.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It was at this point that the Taliban decided to make their presence known by firing an anti-tank recoilless rifle round at the softest vehicle of this lead platoon, the G Wagon.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The round went right through the front windshield, causing immediate casualties.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Next, our whole soul opened up all at once. Every cannon, every coaxial machine gun was firing. Taliban were coming out of the weeds all around us, out of tunnels, windows, mouse holes. They had their head in the, they had held their powder to the last second and then it was game on.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They had the defenders advantage and they used it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Next to the schoolhouse, went nose first into a ditch and was stuck.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I was trying to listen on the radio when suddenly the troops who were sticking out of the top hatches of our LAV yelled, Holy fuck, they're right there! They let go of a burst from their C7s followed by a grenade from a rifle-mounted grenade launcher. At that moment, our artillery began raining down and air support started dropping bombs on the Taliban.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I felt helpless during all this chaos because the plan for us as snipers was to get involved only once objective rugby had been achieved.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] At that point, we would get up on the school's roof and provide cover for the bound to the next objective. But in this situation, Barry, Cash, those were your sniper teammates, Barry, Cash, and I were stuck inside the LAV right at the time when our shooting skills were needed up top.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Needed most up top. I was working the radio, doing my best to keep everyone in the vehicle informed of what was happening up ahead.


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[Assistant] Okay, we've got three wounded in action and one killed in action, I said, relaying the message that there were three wounded soldiers and one who was killed in the G-Wagon that had been hit.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Every soldier had a zap number, which would be used as an identifier in case you were wounded or killed in the field.


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[Assistant] Standard operating procedure was that if someone died in combat, you never revealed their name during the battle.


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[Assistant] At this point, we didn't know which soldier had been killed in that attack on the G-Wagon. And no one seemed to know the zap number either.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Finally, the major got on the radio, I need to know now, who the fuck just got killed. The radio crackled, and a voice came on.


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[Assistant] Rick Nolan was the soldier I had, had a brief argument with the day before. I've always felt bad that our last conversation was a little strained.


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[Assistant] Rick was a good man and a great soldier. Sitting in the front seat of that G-Wagon, he had no chance of surviving a direct rocket hit. I looked at Barry and Cash. We were all stunned into silence.


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[Assistant] No matter how much you prepare for that moment when a soldier you know becomes a casualty, there's nothing that compares to the actual feeling.


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[Assistant] On top of that, it was jarring for all of us because we just didn't expect a soldier with his level of experience and status to be the first one taken out on the mission.


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[Assistant] Reminding me, we were, I had guys out, uhm, they were clearing the sector of Ramadi, and


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Big gunfight broke out and I'm, I don't know, three or four hundred meters away. Maybe five hundred meters away, whatever it was. I can just hear gunfire, mayhem, radios. I get up to a rooftop and I'm, uhm, you know, hey, what's up?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I hear the, the element commander got on the radio.


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[Assistant] And he says, hey, we're gonna need casualty evacuation. We've got one killed and one wounded. And...


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[Assistant] I don't know, probably 20 Iraqi soldiers and 5 or 6 Seals.


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[Assistant] Finally, I just said, is it Iraqi or American? It was like the longest.


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[Assistant] Pause I've ever heard in my life. And he comes back and he says, both Iraqi.


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[Assistant] And it was like, it ain't no offense to the Iraqi, but uh, to the Iraqi soldiers, but you know, I was.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Relieved. Very relieved at that point. And you talk about that too in here how


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Somebody gets hurt or somebody gets wounded or somebody gets killed and you, you know it's one of your guys and you feel guilty when you hear the name and it's not whatever one of your, one of your better friends or whatever and that's uh,


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[Assistant] One of those strange and freaking horrible things about war.


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[Assistant] Well, I shouldn't have even said shit sandwich, I should have said, this is combat.


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[Assistant] That's it. Because, I mean, it's gonna, you go into there, you're setting up your positions, you're moving into position. The enemy hadn't really revealed himself as you said in the book, they held their powder.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you guys, you, sniper team, you guys didn't even have your body armor on.


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[Assistant] I was actually not going to bring it up, but then I circled to bring it up. You know why? Because there's somebody out there that's in the field right now that's going on some operation and they're thinking, you know what? I'd probably be better off if I didn't bring my body armor. And I'm going to tell you, bring your body armor. Bring your body armor. I did one operation that for a bunch of reasons.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Of course, ended up in a bad scenario. And the only thing I'm thinking as I have, uh, as I'm, have a gun pointed at my chest is, you're an idiot.


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[Assistant] I was gonna say, bullets don't even have names on them. They're gonna hit who they're gonna hit. And that's why combat is so, that's one of the things about combat that makes it so.


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[Assistant] So damn awful is, like you said, you can train as hard as you can train. You can make no mistakes. You can be the perfect warrior.


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[Assistant] On the perfect mission and you can still get blown up, you can still get shot and there's nothing you can do about it. I mean, I hate to say it, there's nothing you can do about it. You're getting in, you're gonna be trading lead with other people and that bullet can hit you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You end up helping collect the casualties.


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[Assistant] And now you're sitting there, you're at the, what we would call a casualty collection point. Do you use that term? Yep. We call it casualty. I don't know if you use that in here.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] CCP? Okay, so you're at the CCP, the casualty collection point, and here you go. One of the most important things in the field of battle is taking care of your dead.


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[Assistant] In fact, the creed of the royals is never leave a royal behind.


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[Assistant] Grabbed a couple of body bags and got to work with some of our other guys. We picked up Rick and zipped him into a bag.


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[Assistant] One of the other fallen officers was Frank Melish.


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[Assistant] For a second I had a bit of hope because he was on a stretcher, which meant he might have only been wounded.


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[Assistant] But once I saw Soldier's approach and check his dog tags, I knew he was gone.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] A casualty of the round that took out the Zettelmeyer.