[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I came home like bench, benching, like whatever four plates a side is, deadlifting, like I was like huge. We looked, looked awesome. What did you weigh? 240 or something crazy like that. And, and then I tried to get behind my sniper rifle because I was not operating as a sniper, right? And I was like, Oh God. Okay. Couldn't too big. Tried, tried rucking through my rucksack on and tried to go up a hill. Oh my God.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Oh my god. So I had to slim back down. I realized, I'm like, oh, being a meathead is not conducive to being a sniper.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, so I always try to tailor my body around being a sniper. Especially after that. And uhm, but now...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, like I said, I'm gonna be 40 in January. It's gonna be 10 year anniversary getting blown up in January. And I...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Wanted to quit drinking, I needed a new goal to move towards, so I said, I'm gonna get into bodybuilding. And if you know anything about bodybuilding, I don't want to look like Phil Heath.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I want to look like, uh, Arnold when he was in the seventies. Sixty-three. When they still looked human. So you picked a realistic goal.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] My, my view on that stuff is if it gets you to where you wanna be and you're not hurting anybody, who cares? Right? It's your body, do whatever you want with it. Uhm, so, but, but,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] For bodybuilding, you look good. So I'm doing the physique class, which means you wear board shorts and you don't necessarily have a routine, but they tell you how to pose. Like they, like I, we want to see your abs. We want to see your glutes, whatever, whatever. So you kind of just stand a certain way. And, uh, and I take direction well.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right? I'll be on the parade square basically. So, you look good, but you're not really good for much.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you're in that condition. So I want the picture of me with a six pack. I'll be 40. I'll have a glass of water. It'll all go away.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Um, and then I'll celebrate the 10 year anniversary of getting blown up and at least I'll know that I've got like somewhat of the type of body I used to have back.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay, all that being said, my training now is being directed by my buddy Nick. And I do whatever he tells me. And right now it's...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Chest and arms one day, back and shoulders another day, and legs another day. No.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I do a hack squat. Okay. There you go. You know, you know the machine? Yeah. So I recently discovered it like in the last six weeks, I discovered this machine hack squat. Um, before I was doing leg press and, uh,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's made all the difference. So I, you know, slap as much weight on it as I can stand and I just squat.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Cause it's almost like a squat. It's pretty close, but I'm supportive.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So my wife's Atlanta's noticed a firmer ass. There you go. Things like that, you know? And so anyway, my, my, my routine is just that. And you know, the food is I'm a big baby when it comes to food. Um, I've never eaten my vegetables and I don't care what Nick says or what my mommy used to say. I'm not going to eat them. That's what my food eats. Um,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, I'm a meat and potatoes guy, pretty much. Uhm, and that's about it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I don't care what anyone tells, oh come on you just gotta try it. I'm not, I'm not trying it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Without any spices or sauces on it like I asked for, and the plain potato I want next to it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, Atlanta makes fun of me because my favorite ice cream is vanilla. I'm like, my life is exciting enough. I don't need no strawberry sprinkle bubble gum ice cream. Let's bring my vanilla, maybe a brownie on the side.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He's a proponent of the old school bodybuilding where you never want to be in ketosis? Really?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But he's a bodybuilder. We're going to, I want to get him to relook at the physique stuff. Yeah. Because you know, if you read Arnold's new update, modern book on bodybuilding or encyclopedia of bodybuilding, which he rewrote in the nineties, they still went by the whole fuel, the muscle with the carb thing, right? But they looked amazing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But they also, but in the book he says he didn't really, they didn't really know what they were, like their effect. They knew they helped. Oh. But they didn't have it down to a science.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And that's great and good for them. Amazing. But I, I can't, I need to lose weight to be on prosthetics. Like I can't be putting on that kind of weight. So Nick's thing is, um, ketosis is bad because you risk losing muscle mass and that's kind of counter to the whole bodybuilding thing. So.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, I'm not that big yet at all, but I mean, we're still, we got till November.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] As long as it's, you know, it'll probably be a protein heavy, uh, with the normal carbs, rice and potato, sweet potato, stuff like that, like a little bit of olive oil and coconut oil and stuff.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But this is my thing, this is after the bodybuilding, yes. That's how I eat anyway. I do love me some pasta though. And Alan and I will crush a pizza. Like, oh yeaah. That's our thing, Friday night, we get a pizza, we rent a movie on iTunes, you know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, but my, my general rule for myself is that it's, it's, it's usually a high protein, like low carb diet. And if, and I like to eat, like if I'm not eating, I, I like to be taking like a shake or something like every three or four hours or.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, I did uhm, I did a 48 hour, but I had coffee.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Oh, it's fine. I felt fine. I like, I had a little bit of tightness for a bit, but like whatever, like in the stomach.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Have the dichotomy in your mind of if I was a caveman, I'd be fine. But then you realize it's 2016 and why are you depriving yourself of something or why aren't you taking full advantage of the, of the technology available to you, whether it's protein shakes or, or, or supplements like on it. I feel like, you know what I mean?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I was picking my kids up from school yesterday and I was sitting in the office waiting for them to come down.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And then there's this young fella sitting over there by the next to the principal's office eating his lunch.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I assume cause he can't be trusted around other kids at lunch or something. I don't know what the deal is.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He pulled a Twinkie out of his lunch. I almost fell over.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like my mom would read the ingredients on stuff and be like, Oh, there's way too much sugar in this shit. I got Coco puffs for my birthday. My parents. Oh, I was, I was like crispies and corn flakes the rest of the time. Thank you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] No, my mom was on top of that stuff. And I have that too, like, there's sugar in like a loaf of bread now.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I give my daughters a two slice sandwich. That's like.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] 12 grams of sugar, if they eat the whole thing. I'm like, why is there sugar in the bread?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Makes what kind of stuff at home? So to trick myself into thinking I'm having a treat, right? I got, I get my Blendtec. I'll put coconut milk in, sugar free, cause you gotta actually search for that one.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Anyway, so, uh, put my coconut milk in. Uh, I throw in a couple scoops of protein. I throw in a couple scoops of, uh, organic sugar-free peanut butter, which you gotta search out again. Did you know they take the peanut oil out of peanut butter now?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So now you gotta search out real peanut butter. Thanks. Thanks world. Anyway.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So I put in a couple scoops of real peanut butter that I get at the bulk barn, and uhm, and a cup, a scoop of glutamine, but, uh,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] When I, and then I ice it, right, and then I spin it up and it's kinda like a shake, like a milkshake.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Immediately. You don't, but you do. And you do it. Yeah. Right.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It takes longer to eat the dark chocolate I find as well. Don't you find that? It stays in your mouth longer, the taste.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] How have I not heard this on your podcast before? Why Onnit coconut oil by the way? I love Onnit, been using Onnit before it was called Onnit, but why their coconut oil?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah. So, uh, whoever asked about nutrition, it's, um, ah, you know, one thing I will.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay, well Jocko, uhm, the other thing, my guts got destroyed by the antibiotics in my recovery. And it took me...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Figuring it out on my own, like, why was I constantly having, like, uhm, diarrhea? Why was I constantly not, like, just an upset stomach? And then I started re- Okay, what causes it? Do I have IBS or blah blah blah?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Oh no, I was on six months worth of antibiotics. Killed everything in your gut. And then I've had, I've had staph infections, like I had a year, one year where I had like four staph infections in my stumps in a row.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And it just like, you know, it just hammers because I was getting sick and like, so I'm like, what's wrong? And then I really, oh, okay, so.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now every morning, I like, I keep a bottle of kombucha in the fridge. Every morning, I just shake it up, take a swig. I have a probiotic pill that I take with that swig. And that's made a huge difference. And, and I'm always seeking out different ways to keep the, the, the gut flora happy. You know, so like apple cider vinegar,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, apple cider vinegar and kombucha and the probiotics, those three additions have made a huge difference, uh, in my, in my system, like my immune system alone. And then I, like, I just started jacking massive amounts of vitamin D, E and C into my body.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And then I've, I've kept a real close eye on, like so as a kid, like, you know, when we were eating lunch, I didn't want onions or mushrooms.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I found out later as an adult, well I'm actually slightly allergic to them. So whatever your body tells you, pay real close attention.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, because nothing will screw with your gains or your workout routine more than feeling like shit, right? And, and so if you eat something and you feel like shit after, you know, pay attention to that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Because that can take a lot of energy away from your workout and just from your day.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, like you go rolling to work with a headache because you ate something that you're actually allergic to. Like that can really mess with your mood. So I pay super- that's- so one of the reasons why I'm such a basic eater


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's cause I've learned that that's how I feel best and I function best when I have minimum sub, like minimum like additions to like, you know, when you, when you go to the get breakfast, right? Nothing better than bacon and eggs in the morning.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Until they bring your home fries and they're covered with paprika, Montreal, spice shit all over them. And I'm like, why would you do that to my potatoes? Potatoes are delicious with a little bit of bread, butter and salt. Oh, they come like that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Can I have some without it? Ooh, yeah. Okay. You know what? Keep your potatoes. Um, because I've learned that if I have that go in my system, I'll spend a good half hour on the can and that's time I don't can't afford.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So if anyone is like, you know, when you're, the big part of your routine is, is the fact that you have to have the energy and like, just not feel like shit when you, when you go into the gym. So that's why.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's why they came out with the, the yogurt a few years ago, the, uh, whatever it was called.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, and I don't know, there was that yogurt and they started selling it because it'll replenish your, your good flora. Yeah. Whatever, whatever. Yeah, uhm.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, I talked about the doubt I had answering that second question.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If you don't have any doubt, I'm gonna be real suspect of you as a person. So, do we all have doubts? Hey folks, sorry to break it to you. Jocko occasionally has doubts. He'll never admit it. Right? But.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Doubts are part of being human, and if you're not doubting yourself, you're not challenging yourself either. I believe. This is just what I think.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So I try to approach my doubts head on unflinching.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, did I have doubt the third time I got sent into battle school? Yeah, big time, but.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Put on the best uniform, put on, you know, get in the best shape, polish your boots to the highest standard, be prepared to get shit on, and, and, and bulldog your way through.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And smile while you're eating that shit sandwich, you know? Like the doubt is...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You ever heard the, like, you ever talk to someone and they talk about what they want, they really want to be doing? Okay, so I have a buddy of mine, he's a cop, but he really wants to sell t-shirts.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And he's like, yeah, well, you know, I'm just waiting. There's, you know, there's a time, there's a time. He even made a t-shirt for me and he's probably gonna listen to this and he knows who he is. And bro, I told you this at the time. He said, let's sign a contract for 12 months. And this, I'm like, you know what? Um, six months tops and you know, if that, he's like, why? Well, what's the matter? I'm like, well, I just, I just don't think you're going to, this is it. This is where you are. He's like, why? And I'm like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Cause you're not putting the effort, like you're a cop, you're not a t-shirt seller. And he, he, you see, he's doubting himself to, to take that leap. You know, did I have a doubt when I put my name in for the election? Hell yeah, I did. I've never been a politician. I was a gunfighter. I was a sniper, but I deal with doubt by dealing with the situation.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Because I want to know that I can...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] A get through the, through it, and if I fail, I fail. That's...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Hey man, I fail all the time. I failed, uh, reading your book. You know, I failed making it to the airport in time yesterday, but.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I have doubt all the time, but I also have enough confidence in myself that I'm willing to try almost anything.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I don't know if that's really the question that was asked, but the answer is the same because


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Fear is the thing that holds you back from almost anything in your life.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Was I nervous when I put my hand up to volunteer to go on Sniper Course? Hell yeaah I was. But where did I want to be? I wanted to be on Sniper Course.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, was I nervous the first time I was in charge of a sniper team going into combat?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh huh, but guess what, there is nowhere else I wanted to be.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, doubt is your, doubt is your mind telling you, you know, to think about the things you need to think about anyway. Right? Like the doubt is there for a reason. It's a self-preservation mechanism. And you need to use that doubt to put,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The thoughts in your mind to visualize the successful outcome. Like we talked about earlier. Visualization.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, I, I picture failure all the time and then I picture how will I deal with it. You know, doubt.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Doubt to me is just a question to ponder. And then move on. You know. So that's how I do it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's the paperback right there, paperback. And also one of the coolest pictures ever taken of me.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yes, they do. I love that one. I find that one good for when you're traveling.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, I forget what it was called, but Audrey, cause he was on Rogan, right, like years ago, before they started on it, and he had these two supplements, cause Aubrey used to like to party.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I believe. And it was meant to like roll onto the next day. And you take it when you're hungover. And I started, I ordered it and cause when, when I was very sluggish and all that from the stuff, from my addiction and just, you know, the whole immune, like I was looking for anything. So anyway, that's why I started using it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] M I T I C and the Jodi Mitik podcast will start being posted on iTunes. If not today, then very short. That's right. And today being, what are we Saturday? This goes up one Tuesday. We're going to be listening


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Just thanks everybody. You know, this is a real honor for me to share the same space as someone as, as incredible as you, uh, Jocko and Echo. Meeting you has been a pleasure.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's, uh, my continued seek, you know, I, I have a thing I call it, I seek knowledge. You know, I'm seeking the knowledge to continue to grow as a human.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And learn, keep, continue to learn who I am and it's experiences like this that make it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That make it happen, make it possible, and just thanks man. This is, this has been awesome.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, cause deep down, could you kind of recognize the value that this is, this is somehow valuable in my goal. But man, if you're there against your will and they're like, do this or whatever, I don't even want to be.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right, is that kinda like how, how you said uhm, something about your kids? Like if I'm helping them on their home?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's real clear there, when you show them some results, they'll, you know, they'll, back to that, remember that movie, The Boiler Room I brought up before? Yeah, yeah. So he said, he mentioned something along those lines where he's like, show them a small return, and they'll, I don't know, I forget what he said, like they'll,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Give you their firstborn or something like that. Same thing. You show them just a little bit of results. Like, uhm, like Karate Kid. Remember Karate Kid? When he's making them.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah, he's making him do that. He's making him sand the floor, paint the fence, all this stuff. He's mad. But he starts off with a little bit of trust in him. You know, cause he, he saw him. You know, he's a karate guy. And then when he saw the results, he was like, oh man, Mr. Miyagi. He was real loyal to him. Same thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] When you tell your kids, go brush your teeth when they're young, you know. Go brush your teeth.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Do you want your teeth to rot out? They'll say no.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yes, when they take it personal. That's pretty much it when they take it personal. Like he stepped to me. He didn't step to like the order or the, you know, the little scenario that I painted. He stepped to me with it. Unacceptable. Ego.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay, uh, ways you can support this podcast and at the same time support yourself, which is just as important in my opinion.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Supplementation. Honest supplements are the best ones by far, the only ones I take.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, only ones I take. Only ones you take. I recommend AlphaBrain.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Fast results are better than slow results. No, but sometimes you need delayed results for, you know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Anyway, uhm, wear your bars as well, I would recommend. Do yourself that favor, big favor. Uhm, you can get 10% off.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, but it's like a meal suite. You know how like you eat like a teriyaki chicken, how that's sweet. Yeah. But it's, it's good. Oh, bro. I'll tell you what you do. You know, you, you say, just keep a box of worry bar on it has this thing called stay on it. And it's like a, you know, the recurring one with


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah. Yeah. For the, for the 10% off because why pay 0% off when you can pay or pay with 10% off the price. Anyway, money.com slash Jocko. Also another way you can support this podcast is by at times when you're about to do amazon.com shopping.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Go to jocopodcast.com first. Click on the Amazon link.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah, and also at jocostore.com there's an Amazon link. So boom yeaah, buy what you're gonna buy anyway. Uh, just click through there first, you can support that way. And of course, I would say arguably the best way.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] No, that's not the best way, but a really good way to support this podcast is go to jocostore.com and get a shirt or two or a coffee mug or a bumper sticker. If you like them.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] How do you relate between SOP, which is standard operating procedures, and jiu-jitsu training? Could you say that the basics and fundamentals are the SOPs of grappling or something like drilling your specific game well?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Get good at the SOP stuff. Like I know in Jujutsu, you just get really good at it, at the SOP stuff.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But instead of practicing SOP and Jujitsu, just be mindful of SOP a lot, all the time. Be mindful of it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, it's true. So if you get good at these, uhm, standard operating procedures, and you can mine them all the time, and at the same time, like how you're saying, you exercise your creativity,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Then you can, you can stick to them, but at the same time.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You can know when to break the rules, so to speak, you know?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Actually, Jeff has this, this drill that he, he got crazy drills. I think he just thought it up on the spot too. It seemed like he did, but I don't know. But it's, it's basically,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He'll be, he'll be like, he'll, he'll yell at a position. Then you got to get to that position. Kind of the, not the fastest, like, oh, the quickest you can do it physically. It's more like the, the, with the least steps, you know? So if you're like, Hey, half guard, now do a knee bar. Now do, or he'll say a submission. He'll say a different position. He'll be like half guard. Now take his back. Now, you know, and you have to.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like how do I take you guys back from half guard and you have to kind of, you know, so it exercises, not only your creativity, but thinking fast with this, you know? So after a while you start to be like, Oh, I didn't know there was a knee bar from here with only like two steps, you know, that kind of thing. And I was like, dang, I really liked that drill. And he was like.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah, oh yeaah man, it seems like that's a 100% translation right there. Like you know that, kinda like when in doubt, go to the SOP when in doubt. You know, you're in someone's garden, he's all wild. It's like, go to SOP, mind your base, mind your posture, mind your elbows or whatever, there's like all these things that are when in doubt.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That tr- that trust is so critical, yeah? Like, so, so, are you saying build that relationship or whatever? And even at the time where it seems valuable, sure, trust, but it's times like this where that trust is gonna shine even more, you know? When you can just say to do it. You don't even have to say why to do it, cause you just know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Next question. Many vets are getting out of the military and going back to college, myself included, or to college for the first time. What advice do you have?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, it, cause, okay, you pay for college, and this is the part that I think, well, I know I just couldn't connect the dots on this. No matter how many people said it, I just couldn't connect the dots.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You're going to college. It's worth, you know, this is, it's all up to you. These people are here to give you an education and all this stuff. You can do whatever you want to do. You don't even have to choose a major right away. You can do whatever you want to do. You're going to have an education to do it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And then to me, it just didn't register. It just seemed like the same thing as high school, except no one was monitoring your grades. And there was a way, a lot more going on. So really it was the same thing. You play football.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You're one of the cool kids. There's cool parties on the, you know, and you, but the different thing, which was better than high school is you had your own place to stay.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And then, and you make your own schedule. You're like, hey, choose this class at this time, and this, and you're like, you almost, it's almost like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I remember I had this, and you know, at UH there's like, you know, there's those smaller classes and there's lecture classes.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I remember in the lecture class, it was like criminology or something happened to be taking and there was this guy, he was basically you, except a real like more nerdy type guy. And he'd be.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right in the front, not like just in the front row, right here in front of the teacher. And there's like a projector thing that he'd kinda, he's right next to that. And man, this guy, if he had a question, boom, he was on, he would monopolize the whole class. He didn't care.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I'm in there like, man, this guy is motivated. I don't know why maybe this is his major, but he is not ashamed or nothing. And so one day we had these, um, like speeches, like you have to like read up on something and then present. Yeah. Oh, I don't remember. I think I did it. Maybe I did it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I was like, damn, this guy knows, you know, he's into this thing. He gives his speech and he had, he might as well have been the teacher, this guy. And he was an older guy. He was maybe, you know, I'm like 18 years old. This guy's like probably 25 or so.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Maybe. Man, it wouldn't surprise me cause this guy was there and he was there to win. And thinking back as an older guy, man.


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[Assistant] Yeah, but man, that attitude of like, I'm gonna win, like whatever, like the test was like this, almost a way to just show off how powerful I am. Yeah.


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[Assistant] And this comes from a lack of perspective. I mean to not be able to do this or to choose not to do it or whatever. It comes from again a lack of perspective that an 18 year old would have.


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[Assistant] I call it gamification, what you're doing. I'm going to make this into a game, right? So use that, like, okay, let's say I learn about whatever, X, Y, Z. I'm going to use that, what we learned today. I'm going to use that, like, on a, like, back to a video game where, um, you know, you choose your guy or your, okay, there's this game called Super Sprint.


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[Assistant] Yeah, fully, but uhm, like, okay, there's this game called super off road. You get a truck and you race and if you win, you get these points to add.


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[Assistant] Acceleration, you get to add turbo boost, you get whatever you got to add and you only have like, so basically you're doing that. So you learn XYZ and think like boom, now I got XYZ in my little brain, you know, now I can take on the world with this XYZ I just learned.


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[Assistant] Like the trap of like, okay, but thinking about it, not as likely. Oh, partying? Just of like partying. Oh, yeah, of course they could. This new environment is just like so seductive, you know? Yeah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So you're more likely, especially when you make the decision kind of on your own to go back. Like I said, when you're 18 coming out of high school, everyone's talking to your parents are talking about it. Most likely kids around you're like, Hey, I got into this college. And if you're the guy who's not going to college, unless you have some cool other cool plan or whatever.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right, but that's like another thing, you know, like they went to the military, but what are you doing? And you're like, I better go to college then, you know, unless you're going to. So you kind of go because you're expected to go, but you don't have that clarity. Like.


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[Assistant] I'm thinking back to any party hangout situation is not serving me at all right now. At all. Not one. And I think that was like.


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[Assistant] That's what really got in the way. I think, and not partying like I was in this big party or because it wasn't the case. It was just the social scene just pulled, had way more of a draw than making it to class.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If I went, if I went back to college for, you know, if I found myself in that situation,


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[Assistant] You know how like when you train for a tournament, you know, and you're just like, yeah, guys are going and that's the last thing I want to do. I want to eat right now. I want to rest and I can't wait to get back to training so I can learn some new stuff, getting better. You know, so it's like laser focus.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, and even if it's not like focusing on the goal the whole time, you're focusing on winning that day. And winning the next day, winning this week, you know?


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[Assistant] Man, that's a valuable tool man, valuable advice as well.


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[Assistant] During the BOLC, which is Basic Officer Leader course. In the army, yea. In the army. Ranger school or other training environments without a command structure. I know you've touched on it before and said that it's probably the toughest form of leadership.


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[Assistant] But if you could discuss things that have worked well for you and any tips in these environments.


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[Assistant] When you first meet someone up here, especially guys, guys have this a lot, where if they're even close to being you, identity wise, like, you know.


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[Assistant] My enemy or my friend? I want one of them. I don't care which one, but I just got to figure out what it is. So automatically you feel sense of competition when you see a guy near you in your like environment, you know, like if you're, you go, you go to the gym or you go to jujitsu, like what happens if a new guy walks in and he's about your size and he walks into the jujitsu?


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[Assistant] Oh, don't let him be wearing a black belt.


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[Assistant] Yeah, but, let's say he rolls up to you and he's just so nice to you.


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[Assistant] And then you guys roll, he's good, he gets you whatever.


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[Assistant] Right, yes, exactly right. So boom, now that decision that you, like, on this primal level, have to make.


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[Assistant] Or not adversarial relations. Yes. Uhm, plan words obviously, but yeaah, and the key there how you're saying is you want them to make the decision that you're their friend. Yes. It's not, you're not saying you make the decision that that's your friend.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right? And yeaah, and even if you feel those, you're compelled to, to kind of have those feelings or to do something to bow up or whatever, cause maybe you are insecure, not everyone's insecure, whatever.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But yea, make them want to be friends with you. That's a good one. I don't remember that one. Okay, next question. In other words, seemingly helpless situation.


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[Assistant] So wait, what is this do you think? Is this like, is it better to be tough than smart or just in general?


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[Assistant] So what if you had to choose? And I'm gonna make the question even harder.


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[Assistant] No specific scenario. What if you had to choose? You gotta be either really smart, but not tough. Or really smart. Or really tough, but not smart. What would you choose?


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[Assistant] Yeah, and I guess I should add it just in life. Let's say, you know, really the question I was wondering is like in life, you know, God was there and he said, okay, I'm going to bestow one of these on you in just in your life. You can either have a knack for being really smart, but, but not tough at all or really tough and not be smart because it,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'm smart enough to know I'm not mentally tough or I'm not physically tough. Let me figure out a way to get met. I'll figure out a good workout program.


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[Assistant] As far as self-improvement and getting after it goes, whose standard should one measure themselves by?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Memory, all that stuff. Proven to work, by the way. I don't know if you knew that. You know, some supplements, they don't prove, they just say, hey, this is what's in it, that's it. These ones are proven, and you can even go on the website, look at all their research, it's cool.


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[Assistant] Anyway, OnIt.com slash Jaco, 10% off, boom. Uhm, or before you do your Amazon shopping, just remember to go to JacoPodcast.com or Jacostore.com, just click on the Amazon link.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Just like passive supporting, it's like easy, you know?


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[Assistant] Dig it. That is legit. Uhm, or if, if you like shirts and mugs and stuff, you know, if you're into that, which I know I am.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Layers to the shirts, you know, they're not just, ooh, a cool saying, or discipline equals freedom, that's it. There's like more to it, you know? It's like you're saying that you, I don't know. Anyway.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, and I, and I, I use the, uh, actually people ask me this, so it is relevant. Where, what kind of shirts do I use? I use the blended one, poly.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Too light maybe. Yeaah. Maybe. I don't know. But uhm, I, I, I figured that out and, but it's, they're dope. Anyway, they're the high quality ones. They're not the ballpark giveaway shirts. You know. Quality items. Yeah, they're good.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, but then again, if, if people think that you're gonna like respond to it, they might not be even accurate, you know?


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[Assistant] But getting a screenshot of their iTunes review, that, that's a message in and of itself that's saying, hey, I put a review on iTunes. It's not necessarily, hey, you know, your audio's too quiet, you know? It's not that. If they wanted to tell you that, they'd tell you that on Twitter. Yeah, well then, but they're at the end.


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[Assistant] Yeah, this guy, this guy I talk to all the time, Brady, he, he, he'll like shop at Amazon, and he'll be like, click, screenshot, you know.


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[Assistant] Yeah, I don't know, I, I, I do go with the, uh, mint chocolate chip milkshake.


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[Assistant] This is Jocko podcast number 27 with Echo Charles and me, Jocko Willink.


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[Assistant] I knew a simple soldier boy who grinned at life in empty joy, slept soundly through the lonesome dark and whistled early with the lark.


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[Assistant] Who cheer when soldier lads march by.


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[Assistant] The hell where youth and laughter go.


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[Assistant] Sassoon was decorated for extreme bravery.


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[Assistant] From what he'd been through while he was there, he wrote a little letter that was called finished with the war, a soldier's declaration.


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[Assistant] He came out and said, we gotta stop fighting the war like this. I'm speaking for the men that are on the front lines in the trenches being killed.


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[Assistant] He was wounded. This time by friendly fire.


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[Assistant] And while Siegfried Sassoon tells us to pray, we will never know the hell where youth and laughter go.


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[Assistant] And taking us on this voyage into darkness tonight is a man by the name of Bob Hoffman. And if you look him up, you'll see he's a very accomplished man.


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[Assistant] He was obsessed with health and fitness and he became a businessman. He was the one of the founders of the York barbell.


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[Assistant] Corporation, if you ever lifted weights in your life, you've used York barbells at some time. He's often called the father of modern weightlifting. But interestingly, what you won't find much about him is his military service.


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[Assistant] You don't see, generally, that he was awarded


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[Assistant] The Distinguished Service Cross, the Silver Star, the Purple Heart, the French Cross of War, the French Military Medal, the Italian War Cross, and the highest Belgian military award, the Order of Leopold.


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[Assistant] And he did write about it. He wrote about it in a book, which is called, I Remember the Last War. And let's go to the book.


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[Assistant] Few people have been able to learn much about what actually took place in the frontline fighting of the World War.


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[Assistant] They have often asked about the war and have found few veterans who could talk about it.


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[Assistant] One of the chief reasons for this is that they had little or nothing to tell about the war.


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[Assistant] Approximately 4 million men were in service during the war. Half of these went to France, and of these, half a million were near the front.


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[Assistant] 10 men are required behind the front to keep one man in action. Service, supply,


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[Assistant] Truck drivers, hospital workers, ambulance drivers, guards in the base ports, the replacement and casualty camps, many thousands of military police, artillery engineers, single men, aviators, mechanics, and endless more.


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[Assistant] Our division lost more men than any other former National Guard division, more men than any other organization except the first and second regular divisions.


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[Assistant] Our regiment lost more men than any other regiment of our division, our battalion, more men of any of the three battalions in our regiment and our company, more men than any other company in the battalion.


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[Assistant] Yet we had men who never saw a German who was not a prisoner.


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[Assistant] They fired and were fired at as we fought in towns, woods and hills, but seldom saw targets at which they fired.


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[Assistant] Bombs and shells were dropped on them. They suffered from gas and most of the horrors of war.


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[Assistant] They were killed, but they weren't actually at the front.


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[Assistant] We're the men who actually saw war and most of them are dead.


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[Assistant] While 125,000 American dead in France are not so many when divided among the million men who were at or near the front, it is a tremendous percentage when it is considered how few of these men were doing the fighting.


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[Assistant] More than 250 men in our company alone were killed.


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[Assistant] More than the original strength of the company lost their lives in France. They can't tell you the story.


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[Assistant] So I will tell our story. We'll try to tell you something of what happened over there.


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[Assistant] There have been more books written by other men who were better writers than I, more fitted to place what they saw upon the printed page.


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[Assistant] But I don't believe a book about America's participation in the war has been written by a man who spent days, weeks, and months in intensive fighting at or in front of the front as my comrades and I did.


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[Assistant] Glorious or beautiful about this story. I've told it as well as I could.


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[Assistant] But have been able to give you only a faint idea of the conditions we encountered during the five worst days of any unit of the American army experience in France. The five days of our battle of Fismat.


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[Assistant] You could fully appreciate its horrors only if you were there.


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[Assistant] Never was a group of men harder pressed by superior forces of the enemy or more ill-equipped to fight off those attacks than we.


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[Assistant] Proper medical attention, or the opportunity to bury the dead.


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[Assistant] Our men in that battle, the handful who held the front lines.


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[Assistant] Covered themselves with undying glory.


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[Assistant] The telling of this story will give a better idea of what we did in France than other books, than other war books I've seen. It tells the unvarnished truth about how we lived, slept, hiked, fought, and died over there.


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[Assistant] The men I'd lived with, trained with, fought with, had come to like and admire, died in the woods in France.


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[Assistant] It was only by a series of miracles, amazing escapes that I did not die to. That I am here writing this book.


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[Assistant] I was young then, 19 years of age at the time of the Battle of the Argonne. I had been too busy to live.


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[Assistant] And because I had not found what a fine place the world can be, I did not mind particularly dying.


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[Assistant] 21 years ago when we fought the battle of the Argonne, I had 32 ugly blood boils on my body from eating a diet consisting mostly of meat and bread for some weeks. Boils which made me swear more than I have all the rest of my life as I constantly scraped them on the rocky ground while digging a new hole to protect my body each time we halted. I had French itch.


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[Assistant] And copious quantities of mustard gas, ugly burns which still leave their scars.


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[Assistant] 12 bullets left their mark on my person. Or on my equipment in the first short battle. I was one of 32 men.


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[Assistant] Of our 250 strength company who marched out of the battle of Fizz May.


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[Assistant] I was the only man to return of those who followed me on five patrols that I led in one day in the Argon Forest.


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[Assistant] I hope through this book, at least partially to show the gruesome side of war, barred from the waving of flags, the bugles, bands, the cheering,


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[Assistant] Be sympathetic, but remain aloof. Be strong, prepared to protect our own country against any nation or combination of nations which may attack our homes, our democracy, our American way of living.


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[Assistant] If our country was attacked, the first hour would not pass before I would plan to enlist.


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[Assistant] And millions of other Americans would be in just as much haste to protect our wonderful country and our American way of life.


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[Assistant] How he kicks this book off, kind of burning through the intro there.


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[Assistant] I really liked the point that he made when he broke down the numbers and how many people go to war, but how many people are actually fighting. And it's a big discrepancy.


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[Assistant] There's a, it takes a lot of people to get bullets to the guy on the front line. It takes a lot of people to get that person transported to the front lines. It takes a lot of people to get to keep that person fed. It takes all kinds of logistics and support just to, just to get that guy through the door of a building where the enemy is.


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[Assistant] And I've talked about this before too, in Iraq, there was places in Iraq where.


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[Assistant] There was bases in Iraq where it was basically like being in America. They had


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[Assistant] Restaurants and Starbucks coffee and McDonald's and Burger King and.


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[Assistant] They had pools and movie theaters. I mean it was crazy.


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[Assistant] Yes, I'm sure. And actually I shouldn't have said McDonald's. It was usually Burger King. They must have been the ones that had the deal at the time. So Burger King was there on base.


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[Assistant] And you would, we would travel though to outstations where there's some.


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[Assistant] Army unit. This is on my first appointment. We traveled to some outstation where there's some army unit living out in the middle of nowhere. Just totally desolate. Some Marine Corps unit living in the middle of nowhere. Eating MREs every day. And like, there was a group we worked with. I wish I could remember where they were to give them some credit.


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[Assistant] But they were out there, they were on one MRE a day, which MRE is meals ready to eat. It's a, it's a, not a very.


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[Assistant] Not a very good thing to live off of. And these guys were out there living off of one MRE a day. And you feel bad, you know, you go out, we stopped, I think we had to stop at their base, we had to get some information, gather some intel, they knew some targets around the area, we went and talked to them, saw how rough they were living, we went out and hit our targets, then we were driving back to our big base, you know, where we had good food and


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[Assistant] You know, internet, stuff like that. I mean, it's, it's, it's amazing how good it can be.


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[Assistant] That's what, that's what people, some people don't realize about the military is it takes a lot of support and logistics to keep the guys on the front lines on the front lines and not taking anything away from those folks that are doing that because that's a hard job. And I've talked about this before, those logistics convoys in Iraq and Afghanistan, those things were hardcore and horrible, dangerous jobs to do. And,


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[Assistant] So I'm not taking anything away, but if you want to say, okay, who went out and hunted down the enemy and got him? It's a much, much smaller group of people.


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[Assistant] Right, of people. Yeah, it's a massive, it's a massive force, but, and it's even more extreme.


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[Assistant] Because in World War I, the, the lines were very clearly drawn. I mean you had, literally had trenches in the ground. Right. And so if you weren't within range of the, of the enemy attacks, I mean maybe they could get some planes to you, but you would, you would be living relatively safe, and that's his point. And then when you get a little closer to the front lines, yeaah, you're gonna get some artillery


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[Assistant] Most of them are dead. It's a small, it's a much, it's one, it's one out of every ten soldiers that was actually going forward to attack.


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[Assistant] And most of them are dead. I mean, you could hear what he just said. They took more casualties than the strength of their, of their company was.


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[Assistant] So they had 250 guys, there was actually a thousand guys in the company because they took so many casualties.


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[Assistant] That's why World War I is so horribly disturbing and scary to me. Because like I've said before, there wasn't a tactics, your own tactical prowess wasn't gonna help you.


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[Assistant] Your, your own personal skill set wasn't really gonna help you.


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[Assistant] You were gonna get up, you were gonna charge in, and really, uh, Bob Hoffman talks about this and he was just lucky. He was a great athlete and he trained hard and he was constantly trying to make himself better. I'm sure that contributed to it all somewhat, but.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Hey, when you, when he comes off the battlefield and he'd been shot 13 times, one, you know, in the knees, his bullet holes in his canteens, he'd been just, it's just, that's just a miracle.


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[Assistant] He says, we should bend all our efforts toward becoming so strong that no other nation or coalition of nations will dare to attack us.


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[Assistant] We should build the physical strength of our manhood and womanhood, our mechanical equipment, our Navy in particular, and our army, so that we can resist any form of invasion in the future.


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[Assistant] And I put that in there because you're gonna see a pretty common theme in the way this guy lived his life, which was to be stronger, faster, better, smarter, always trying to improve himself, always trying to be the best Bob Hoffman that he could be. And obviously that's how we ended up running a giant, you know, organization for weightlifting and, and fitness.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And he actually took some heat for the way he lived sometimes and here they were.


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[Assistant] They were on the ship heading overseas, heading to France or to England. And he's talking about what it was like for him being a guy that believes in being strong and healthy and smarter and trying to improve himself. Here we go, back to the book. All sorts of men make up an army. Good, bad, and indifferent.


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[Assistant] I found myself in lots of trouble for I had been fond of study, athletics, and work when home. I didn't smoke, drink, chew, gamble, or go out with questionable women or indulge in other diversions that some consider to be manly.


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[Assistant] There were men who thought that I was a sissy because I did not have manly habits.


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[Assistant] This led to a great many fights, and I thought at one time I would have to beat every man in the company individually to prove that I wasn't a sissy.


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[Assistant] I did get enough practice that later enabled me to win the boxing championship in my body weight class of our division.


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[Assistant] This experience served me well on the Atlantic crossing, for I fought five three round fights in one day.


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[Assistant] Someone had to do it, and the job fell on me.


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[Assistant] So, he was getting, you know, for lack of a better word, picked on, cause he was a goody two shoes. And the only way he was able to stand up for himself was just to get his scrap on.


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[Assistant] Yeaah, I don't think he had, uh, the straight edge music going into his head yet that might have helped him out.


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[Assistant] So they get overseas and now I'm taking you straight into it, into them getting, him getting tasked with, with their first mission.


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[Assistant] And here we go. Was I thrilled? The front at last.


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[Assistant] When asked by our captain if I wanted to go with the platoon, I said do I want to go? That's what I've been yearning and aching for all these months.


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[Assistant] When I was just a youngster, I would read books telling how anxious soldiers were to go into action.


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[Assistant] I couldn't understand how men could desire to go out and fight and die. But it is something that grows on you.


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[Assistant] You train and expect so long that finally you become anxious to get into it. To get it over with. Time was short. We went back to our companies on the run.


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[Assistant] Our company was assembled and I briefly explained that a platoon of 58 men was to be selected and that we were to make an attack with the French at 6 o'clock that night.


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[Assistant] My words fell like a bombshell. A brief cheer went up from our company. I asked all the men who wanted to be first in action to step forward.


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[Assistant] And, like one man, the entire company stepped forward.


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[Assistant] Men who did not get to go on this trip cried real tears. A direct contrast to the lack of volunteering for dangerous missions a few months later when they had become war weary.


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[Assistant] Then they would go, if assigned to any task, no matter how dangerous, but they did not rush in.


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[Assistant] They became fatalists and said they'd go if they were chosen. They'd die if it was their turn.


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[Assistant] To the story that I tell in my retirement speech, where we had this horrible situation going on in Eastern Ramadi, and I basically said, alright, whoever wants to go and live in this worst area, put your name up on that board, and every guy put their name up on that board. And I'll tell you, this is also accurate.


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[Assistant] In the fact that you fast forward two or three months into deployment, after we'd taken casualties, after Mark had been killed, and all of a sudden guys were not...


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[Assistant] And I'll use the exact quote he uses here. They'd go to any


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[Assistant] Then I even saw that on my first deployment to Iraq. We first got up into Baghdad. Everybody wants to go on every mission. Everyone's all fired up. But as time goes by...


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[Assistant] You start saying, what are we doing this mission for? What's this mission about? Who are we going after?


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[Assistant] Fear starts to creep in. Now let's get to the assault.


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[Assistant] The French men were working like mad with their trench mortars. They kept shells continuously in the air. At three minutes to six, Sergeant Felix walked along the parapet, informing all our men that we were going over in a few moments. I urged him to keep down, not to make a target of himself, but he disregarded my advice.


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[Assistant] Finally, as our watches, which had been synchronized before the bombardment, pointed exactly to six o'clock, there were whistles and commands and climbing men leaving the trench all along the line.


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[Assistant] The gunners who had been working so desperately with the trench mortars to pave the way for us cheered and cried out to us, evidently urging us to sweep the Germans from the hill. I just couldn't understand what they said.


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[Assistant] And soon, we were in the thick of things, bullets flying merrily by this time from the German trenches, perhaps a fourth of a mile away. I was hardly out of the trench until some great force pushed me, knocking me over for a distance of perhaps 20 feet.


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[Assistant] I didn't know what had hit me, but I felt blood running down my right eye.


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[Assistant] After that knockdown, I forgot the line of combat groups, and we fought just as our ancestors had always fought. Instinctive rushing forward, stopping to shoot, rushing again, and shooting again.


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[Assistant] So that's like, that's your welcome to combat. Oh, you're all fired up? You ready to go get some? Cool, go over the top.


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[Assistant] The first thing that happens to you is you get shot, which is what happened to him. He doesn't even know it yet.


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[Assistant] All Americans have a legacy which has come to them from courageous, fighting, pioneer ancestors. The American soldier is a good soldier.


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[Assistant] He does not like to salute the brass bar unless that lieutenant has won his respect through deeds.


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[Assistant] He does not like to be regimented, turned into a mere robot. He can think and act for himself.


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[Assistant] And when a battle has passed the initial stages, he's the best soldier in the world.


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[Assistant] This is going, again, reminder, this is World War I. And I say this all the time.


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[Assistant] And I can't speak too much about people from other militaries, but clearly this was a standout thought as an American.


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[Assistant] Looking at American troops in combat. They, they're not just robots. And one of the best things about them is that they can think.


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[Assistant] Now, here come a bunch of Americans over on some Germans coming up on their trench.


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[Assistant] Perhaps the Germans were too startled at the size and evident ferocity of their antagonists to fight well for a minute. But it seemed like a group of big men who'd-


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[Assistant] Who had met a lot of boys playing soldiers.


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[Assistant] One push and the German's rifle was knocked from his hand. A long thrust and that unfortunate man had reached the end of his life.


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[Assistant] I can still see the faces of these men, their evident terror, their astonishment at the number of men who leaped at them from the grass, at the size and power of these men, their evident helplessness. There was not time for them to surrender.


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[Assistant] They had jumped up with bayoneted rifles, and in a moment or two, it was all over.


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[Assistant] Now this continues. Our advanced troops have passed me by.


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[Assistant] I could see dead Germans laying here and there. Right near me were two of them, close together. One of them was a big older man with a Prussian mustache.


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[Assistant] His hands still clasped to the point in his stomach where the bayonet had gone in and been withdrawn.


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[Assistant] The youngster lay all twisted up. He too had been bayoneted.


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[Assistant] And it seemed that his bones were broken from the strokes of the butt of a rifle.


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[Assistant] A rifle is a wicked weapon when swung by a powerful man. And there were many strong men in action that day.


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[Assistant] It's, you know, you hear about bayonet fighting.


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[Assistant] Where this is, this is looking more like a scene out of Braveheart at this point than it is looking like a modern war. People clubbing each other to death and stabbing each other at bayonet range.


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[Assistant] The Germans weren't giving out, giving up without a real struggle.


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[Assistant] But these men weren't chained, and they were fighting to the bitter, bitter death. Now that chained machine gunner, this is like a rumor.


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[Assistant] That happened that the Americans would hear because the Germans had a machine gun and it was a big heavy sort of a medium weight or heavy weight machine gun. I think it was a MG08 and it was so heavy that they put this big sling on it.


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[Assistant] And on the sling, it was made of leather, but they had to reinforce the leather with chain.


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[Assistant] And so when they would find these soldiers dead with these machine guns, and the chain would clip into their gear,


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[Assistant] The rumor was that these guys had just been chained to their machine guns. You can't leave. You're just gonna stay here and fight to the death.


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[Assistant] Our men were con- back to the book. Our men were constantly rising and falling. Some of them never to rise again.


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[Assistant] Our ranks were becoming rapidly decimated and there were few of us still going forward at this point.


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[Assistant] I have never seen an authentic list of the casualties of a company that day, but I know this. I never saw a single one of those 58 men of our company who went over the top that night again at the front.


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[Assistant] I had been hit several times. Once on the left knee, once on the right knee. Either bullet could have left me crippled for life, but both glanced off the bone, leaving only a scar which is noticeable to this day.


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[Assistant] I had a variety of feelings as these bullets struck or scratched me.


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[Assistant] The first, which hit my helmet, gave me the same sensation as if I had been pushing, as if I had been pushed by a gigantic hand. The bullets on the knees stung like I had been hit with a whip.


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[Assistant] And the bullet that cut through the arm, and the one which left its mark on my face, felt like a drop of hot water had hit me. About this time, the battle had become very hot.


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[Assistant] We fired at every enemy we could see, and they were firing from every direction. From the front, left, and right, and even from behind, because we'd gone so fast that we had not dropped the snipers who were firing at us from the trees.


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[Assistant] By the way, caught in a 360 degree field of fire after you've been shot, what, five times?


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[Assistant] We talked about lucky. Obviously, better to be lucky than good at this point.


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[Assistant] It depends where you get shot. Yeaah. It depends where those rounds hit. And I remember actually even hearing guys from, Vietnam guys from...


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[Assistant] Seals from Vietnam told me, uhm, one guy told me a story that the first time he got shot, they were out on operation, came back, he was literally heading out to the bar, actually he said he was in the bar, and he realized he was bleeding. And he looked down and he'd been shot somewhere in the abdomen. But you know, obviously it wasn't that bad, but he had been shot.


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[Assistant] You can, you can catch a bullet in the wrong place and it's game over.


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[Assistant] Or you can catch a bolt in the wrong place and it can just take you off your feet or you can catch a bolt in the wrong place and your arm won't move anymore.


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[Assistant] Or there'll be massive amounts of pain, or you can catch a bullet in the right place.


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[Assistant] And it goes through and through, it goes in and out very quickly, doesn't hit anything vital, and you know, you're just kinda lucky.


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[Assistant] It's the same thing. You're right. Sometimes it goes through and through and guys barely even notice it. Right.


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[Assistant] And sometimes if it hits the wrong spot, it hits a bone or whatever. I mean, it's, it's, it's massive pain.


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[Assistant] And it depends what it hits to. Yeaah man. It does depend what it hits. That's crazy you said it felt like hot water. That's, you know. Yeaah, actually I had a guy, one of my guys got shot.


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[Assistant] He was out, you know, firefight going on and all of a sudden he's, he feels the hot, you know, the hot.


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[Assistant] Kind of dripping down his back. Hot liquid dripping down his back. And it turned out he'd just been shot in the camel back.


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[Assistant] Well, you got a bunch of nerves in your toes. That's where you got fingernails or toenails.


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[Assistant] And again, the most important thing is where, you know,


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[Assistant] What does that, what does that bullet hit? What does that blade hit? What does it do to you? Does it hit the, does it hit a nerve or not?


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[Assistant] Alright, here we go, back to the book. The operators of machine guns of any sorts are targets for all riflemen. Their vulnerability in action gave rise to the term suicide squad. Sergeant Felix called one of the runners to bring him the gun. The runner dropped dead as he handed the gun to Felix. We advanced to the German third line trench.


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[Assistant] Fighting desperately meanwhile and driving the Germans before us. I had not reached any of them with my bayonet, but had been doing the deadly work with my rifle.


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[Assistant] As we rushed to the German trench expecting to jump down into it and fight hand to hand with the enemy, we saw that we could not do this. The trench was covered thoroughly with barbed wire so that nothing much larger than a hummingbird could get in.


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[Assistant] We lay down outside the parapet to fire at close range. Someone shouted, look out, there's a bomb.


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[Assistant] It went off, it went right off in my face, but all my parts seemed to be present immediately afterwards. I saw Felix lying there sprawled out, groping for his pistol. I said, what's the matter, Bill? He couldn't answer, but turned weakly to me.


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[Assistant] And I saw that half his face seemed to have been torn off.


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[Assistant] I picked up the automatic rifle and as I turned it into the German trench, they got up and ran back.


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[Assistant] I was the only one firing. I saw many of them drop with the 60 shots a minute I was pumping at them. So I knew I was getting enough of the enemy to make up for our men who had been killed and wounded.


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[Assistant] For a time there was nothing to shoot at, so I took stock of the situation.


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[Assistant] So far back that they were hardly more than specs, I saw tiny men in blue digging in. It must have been all of a half a mile.


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[Assistant] I knew that we should not stay out here in such an isolated post, but what were we to do?


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[Assistant] I never thought for a minute of abandoning the wounded. So there we stayed.


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[Assistant] The snipers far off in the wood were still firing at us and there was no way we could reach them or entirely escape their bullets.


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[Assistant] I couldn't get into the trench so I crawled around it. Well over into the woods. Shell holes everywhere. I saw for the first time what havoc could be wrought by shell fire.


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[Assistant] The trees and bushes were shattered. Men were blown up and blown up again. They were in pieces.


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[Assistant] It would have taken a bushel basket or a GI can to have gathered up all those Germans for burial.


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[Assistant] I admit that they were the finest of soldiers. After four years of war, they fought to the death before we, before they would give up a position. They were so well trained that it was second nature with them.


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[Assistant] They had been regimented for so long that they never questioned an order, put up with all sorts of privation and suffering, and were cheerful through it all.


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[Assistant] The majority of them were in very good condition when captured. It showed they could take it.


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[Assistant] I often wondered if our own men could be as good soldiers after four years of war.


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[Assistant] Bravery is a sort of fixed quality. Something that some men have, some men have, and others do not.


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[Assistant] Only physical collapse, or death, stops the brave.


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[Assistant] Some will be brave when they must. When they, like a mother animal, are driven by the instinct of self preservation to protect their own lives or that of their offspring. A man who naturally has courage is fortunate.


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[Assistant] It is the ability to control his mind, to prepare it so that he feels nothing.


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[Assistant] Courage is the product of physical strength and mental strength combined.


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[Assistant] Proper training will make men more courageous.


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[Assistant] And certainly these Germans were courageous, physical strength and mental strength combined. That's where that courage comes from.


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[Assistant] Back to the book. I tried to do something for the wounded.


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[Assistant] They were very cold by this time suffering from loss of blood.


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[Assistant] They were lying there stripped to the waist. I reached for the canteen of one of the dead men. There were two bullet holes through mine and it was empty.


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[Assistant] Just as I turned a bullet from afar off to the left, tore through the flesh of my cheek.


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[Assistant] Had I not turned at that very instant, it would have gone through my head dead center, killing me, or sadly maiming me for life.


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[Assistant] Who lay there was just 16 years of age.


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[Assistant] He was the first of a dozen youngsters whose ages ranged from 14 to 16 who had enlisted in our company.


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[Assistant] They had lied about their actual age, enamored with the appearance of our fellows in uniform. They too wanted to be soldiers.


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[Assistant] Some of them lost their nerve before they reached the front and tried in many ways to get out of service.


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[Assistant] The Spencer Brothers, 15 and 16 years of age, were to be killed by shellfire.


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[Assistant] There was no fear in this little Italian boy. He's talking about little Voceona.


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[Assistant] He'd always been a hot tit, hothead. Wanting to fight with a knife, fork, or anything he could lay his hands on when someone antagonized him a bit.


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[Assistant] He was dashing forward with bayoneted rifle in hand so fast when the bullet which killed him, which hit him, that he lay out well on the barbed wire covering the German trench.


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[Assistant] I'm not saying anything bad about our current state in America, but I have a hard time picturing


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[Assistant] The current brood of 14, 15 and 16 year olds getting their trench warfare on.


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[Assistant] Back to the book. I crawled back and there was one of our men crying.


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[Assistant] I asked him why and he replied that so many of his friends had been killed. I told him not to worry about the killed.


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[Assistant] That we had living wounded to be concerned about to get back.


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[Assistant] That he had better go for help and stretchers and see if we could not evacuate our fellows.


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[Assistant] And that I should die as bravely as I could for my friends or country or something.


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[Assistant] So I prepared to sell my life as dearly as possible.


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[Assistant] In a surprisingly few minutes, there came a crashing through the woods, the sound of voices, and a large body of men came into view.


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[Assistant] I lay still, waited until they were close, and then jumped up pointing my automatic rifle at them and was prepared to go into action.


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[Assistant] I suppose it was very startling to have a dead man jump up, for I certainly looked dead.


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[Assistant] I pulled the trigger, and as soon as one man fell, the other alls, the others all shouted, comrade!


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[Assistant] It's like holding up a train. No one wants to be the first killed. So a crowded car permits one man to hold it up.


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[Assistant] When the Germans found that I had stopped firing, they were anxious to surrender.


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[Assistant] Their officer was as nice and polite as any head waiter in a high class restaurant.


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[Assistant] He knew a little English and understood when I told him to have his men pile the arms in one place, put their packs in another and make improvised stretchers to carry back the wounded.


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[Assistant] This all took just a few minutes, and soon, we were starting back.


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[Assistant] Tough Germans, he ended up capturing a bunch of Germans. And he actually, actually makes a funny comment here.


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[Assistant] As he was walking back with all these Germans that he had captured, a couple other guys now helped him once he got off the front lines. And he says that his award says that he had assisted in the capture of 38 Germans. And you can see he's kind of upset about that because he did it by himself. He didn't assist. He got the whole thing done.


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[Assistant] And now he ends up, because the wounds that he suffered, he ends up in the hospital.


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[Assistant] Then he starts having thoughts and explaining what it's like being in the hospital and the people that are in there with him.


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[Assistant] Youth of all nations seldom reckons the cost.


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[Assistant] They make the best soldiers because they will go out and try to die bravely for their countries as I expected and tried to do.


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[Assistant] Older men are more cautious. They have homes, perhaps families, positions. They know about life. They usually know the folly of war. They are careful. And battles are not won by being careful.


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[Assistant] The impetuous youthful soldiers are the best fighters.


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[Assistant] That's why war will always take the flower of the manhood of the nations involved. The strongest, most intelligent, most useful of men.


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[Assistant] Trying to recover from the wounds he's, he has. His wounds obviously aren't as bad as some of the other wounded that he's in there with.


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[Assistant] It was not, it was bad enough for him to die without his comrades. Who did not know when their own turn might come. Having to watch him die.


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[Assistant] The nurses would try and ease their going by telling them that they were only going to the operating room for minor treatment or to the dressing room to have their bandages changed.


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[Assistant] The fellows soon learned to observe whether the little bag which held their personal belongings, sometimes a helmet or a coat, came with them.


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[Assistant] If it remained behind, they could expect to come back. But if it too was moved, then they were sure that worse was in store for them.


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[Assistant] Some beg to be left there to die with their friends around them. Not to be placed with a lot of near corpses who are complete strangers.


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[Assistant] They constantly begged doctors and nurses, sometimes at the top of their voices, to put an end to them.


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[Assistant] It became necessary to feed these wounded and never leave a knife or a fork with them.


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[Assistant] It was hard to drive it deep enough through his chest to end his life. And he kept hitting it with his clenched fist to drive it deeper.


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[Assistant] When you have individuals that survived combat but are in such a wretched state.


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[Assistant] That soldier killed himself with a fork.


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[Assistant] You know, one of my guys, one of my buddies, Brian Job, he got blinded.


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[Assistant] In both eyes after he took a round to the, to the face.


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[Assistant] And it really does show you. I mean, I would talk to him on the phone when we were still over there and just his attitude was so


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[Assistant] Indomitable. His spirit was so strong. And I'll tell you something else. He had...


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[Assistant] Been sent to, at one point he was sent to


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[Assistant] The place where they have the guys that have had traumatic brain injuries.


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[Assistant] Who are having trouble with their thoughts and with their motor skills and guys that are in really bad shape. And when he was there, and I talked to him on the phone, he spent about a week there. And he told me, you know,


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[Assistant] Eh, I'm moving. I'm, I think, I think he'd already left. But he said...


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[Assistant] I don't need the kind of help that these guys need. I'm taking up someone's bed. So, even though he was blind,


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[Assistant] And of course he was a tough bastard, but I mean, tough bastard not, he was blind. I mean, that's a game changer, obviously.


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[Assistant] But he still looked at the guys that were wounded worse than him.


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[Assistant] I'm good, I'll be okay. I can't see, but I'm good.


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[Assistant] Then the Germans had made a drive for.


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[Assistant] For Paris and the Americans were now involved in a counterattack and


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[Assistant] Bob Hoffman is still in the hospital and now the wounded start coming in from this counter attack.


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[Assistant] The wounded that came in now were particularly serious cases. Men who had been wounded by tremendous shells.


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[Assistant] There was much screaming and anguish displayed by these sorely wounded men. Seldom was it quiet at night.


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[Assistant] There were many cases of shell shock. Men who had had their maniacal moments when they felt that they were still at the front being subjected to shell fire.


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[Assistant] They were out of their minds and there was nothing that could be done about it.


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[Assistant] But it made it most unpleasant for the other wounded.


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[Assistant] Some of these men were blinded and had to lie for endless days with their heads covered with bandages.


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[Assistant] Some of the men were able to walk. Sprayed a leg down the aisles.


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[Assistant] I was told that their testicles had in some cases shriveled up like dry peas in a pod. They were certainly in a bad way.


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[Assistant] The softest part of your tissues, right? So your eyes, your nose, your, your testicles, like anywhere where there's moisture and softness.


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[Assistant] On the 21st of July, the doctors decide that he's fit to go back to the front. He gets on a train.


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[Assistant] Can you imagine you go, you fight this battle, you get wounded, you come back, you're watching guys come in that are severely wounded, shell shock, mustard gas.


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[Assistant] And then they say, oh, okay, by the way, now you're good to go. We're gonna send you back out to the front. Like, you think you got that million dollar wound that we talk about in a bunch of these episodes where people say, oh, I made it off the front.


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[Assistant] He goes off the front for, I don't even think it's a month, I think it's a few weeks. And now you're fit for duty again.


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[Assistant] To the front. Back to the front. Back to the meat grinder.


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[Assistant] And he goes there by train. In a surprisingly short time, at about two o'clock, we were close enough to the front that we'd started to see the dead soldiers of both armies along the way.


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[Assistant] The American soldiers had been buried hastily in holes they had dug along the road as they were advancing. But there were still many of them laying in the fields.


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[Assistant] I could see their khaki uniforms and their white faces as we passed.


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[Assistant] There are two chief reasons why a soldier feels fear.


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[Assistant] First, he will not get home to see his loved ones again. But, most of all, picturing himself in the same position as some of the dead men we saw.


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[Assistant] They lay their face up, usually in the rain, their eyes open, their faces pale and chalk-like, their gold teeth showing. That is in the beginning. After that, they are usually too horrible to think about.


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[Assistant] We buried them as fast as we could. Germans, French, and Americans alike. Get them out of sight, but not out of memory. I can remember hundreds and hundreds of dead men.


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[Assistant] I would know them now if I were to meet them in the hereafter.


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[Assistant] I could tell them where they were laying and how they were killed, whether with shellfire, gas, machine gun, or bayonet.


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[Assistant] In the beginning, we had a fear of the dead. We hated to touch them. Some of the hardest experiences of my life were taking the identification tags from my dead friends.


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[Assistant] The first dead man I touched was Philip Beketich, an Austrian baker who was with our company.


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[Assistant] I tried to save his life by carrying him through heavy enemy fire and putting him in one of the cellars of the French houses. He was shot in my arms as I carried him.


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[Assistant] A few hours later, I found time to go round and find how he was.


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[Assistant] I had to remove his identification tags and they slipped down between his collarbones and the flesh of his chest. They were held there and it took an effort to get them out.


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[Assistant] I thrilled and chilled with horror as I touched him.


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[Assistant] It was hard to touch these dead men at first. My people at home, hearing of what I was passing through, expected me to come back hard, brutal, callous, careless.


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[Assistant] But I didn't even want to take a dead mouse out of the trap when I got home.


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[Assistant] Yet over there, I buried 78 men one morning.


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[Assistant] I didn't dig the holes for them of course, but I did take their personal belongings from them to return to their people. Their rings, trinkets, letters, and identification tags.


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[Assistant] You hear these days, you know, people will talk about seeing a dead body and how that's a traumatic experience. And as a matter of fact, my son, uh, he has, he found a dead body one down on the beach and one guy fell off the cliff and by my house.


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[Assistant] But can you imagine, I mean, you're just seeing dead body after dead body after dead body after dead body after dead body after dead body. It goes on and on and on.


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[Assistant] Yeah, well obviously they had to deal with it. They had to detach from it. You couldn't. I mean, it's just like you talk to a doctor that's been in practice for a long time. Eventually they cannot get emotionally attached to every patient that they had or they would go completely insane. They wouldn't be able to do the job. And it's the same thing here. Obviously you can't get emotionally attached.


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[Assistant] To every single body that he's dealing with, but you can tell that it leaves a mark.


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[Assistant] You know, when you've got, at least we had a, we have a volunteer military service and everybody that joins up.


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[Assistant] Come to grips with the reality that that, that's what they may face. Yeah, fully.


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[Assistant] So speaking of which, back to the book here, they are, he's now just fighting. And he's with another guy named Vaughn. And Vaughn kind of pokes his head up above this barricade and starts shooting.


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[Assistant] And he's kinda looking at him thinking, that seems pretty dangerous, but he sees Vaughn getting away with it. So...


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[Assistant] He gets up there too and starts shooting and soon they're, they're firing shots and then back to the book here. But after several shots each, I suddenly saw Vaughn's helmet go sailing down over the slight hill.


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[Assistant] I looked at him and the entire top of his head was off. Apparently a dumb dumb type bullet.


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[Assistant] One in which the lead had been cut so that it would spread in the instant it struck.


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[Assistant] Tearing a terrific hole in the object it hit. Had flattened against his helmet or tin hat and had taken his, taken off his head to a level with his eyes and ears.


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[Assistant] He had been kneeling and his buttocks went back a bit, his head forward and his brains ran out there in front of me like soup from a pot. I did not fire over another wall.


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[Assistant] The sniper had his choice to pick one or the other of us. For some unknown reason he chose Vaughn. I'm here and he's gone.


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[Assistant] Von lay there for a couple days. Finally, he was carried down and stored in the room where we had the other dead piled up like logs of wood. But he had to have his own place in the corner. It was gruesome enough.


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[Assistant] The nerve strain of the constant gas attacks was severe.


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[Assistant] We were wakened up at every hour of the day and night to stand too in preparation for an attack to prepare to move on or at least put our gas masks on.


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[Assistant] And now they're getting ready to do another assault.


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[Assistant] The earth and the air constantly trembled with the force of explosions.


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[Assistant] Each flare would show us the details of No Man Land, No Man's Land, between the lines.


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[Assistant] Dead men were laying everywhere in the most grotesque positions. Some of them lay as if sound asleep.


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[Assistant] One man's head rested so comfortably on his arm that I could not believe he was dead.


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[Assistant] Others had been blown to pieces several times, and some were just arms and legs or torsos.


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[Assistant] As we finally found the men we were to relieve, we were all thoroughly sick.


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[Assistant] The ground was rotten with tear and vomiting gas. Mustard Gas 2 was all around.


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[Assistant] War is bad enough without the constant torture of gas.


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[Assistant] There was a constant cry for stretcher bearers, for the red cross, the most diabolical screaming and moaning that could be imagined.


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[Assistant] Human beings, lying helpless, no way to fight back, not knowing who would be killed by the next shell. It is hard to be brave at night.


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[Assistant] Shelling at night saps the courage from the bravest.


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[Assistant] Everyone lies there and shakes. Only the strongest can keep their right minds.


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[Assistant] It is on such nights as this that men go out of their heads.


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[Assistant] One will never know how he will behave in such an ordeal. Some men weep, others shake, some stand up nonchalantly, apparently not caring whether they get killed or wounded, some tell crude jokes, but mostly...


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[Assistant] The men dig and dig, so it is only the direct hits that will get them.


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[Assistant] Grimly enduring the torture that human beings subject each other to, not knowing who will go next.


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[Assistant] We spent five days in that place which was populated called Death Valley.


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[Assistant] I don't know whether there was any real object and staying and dying there, but we were ordered into that valley and there we stayed.


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[Assistant] There were always a few maniacs around, men who had lost their mind through shellfire and had to be overpowered and bound.


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[Assistant] Some men were buried alive and we were constantly busy digging out the live ones. Many would be smothered before we could get them out.


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[Assistant] At times we would have a group of wounded and stretcher bearers making their way up the hill. A shell would fall among them and nearly all would be killed.


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[Assistant] So many men were wounded, wounded again, and were still under fire.


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[Assistant] Sometimes we found two or three men dead together and so badly mixed up that we could not tell whether we got the right parts and the right grave or not.


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[Assistant] The men suffered and so did the horses.


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[Assistant] The horses broke away from the tree to which they were secured and galloped up through the field. One of the horses was hit in the abdomen.