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[Assistant] During the reign of Commodus, he mostly kept his head down, and despite being accused of involvement in one of the various plots against the Emperor's life, he was acquitted and wound up serving as provincial governor in Dithynia, and then later succeeded Pertinax as proconsul of Africa.


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[Assistant] He was back in Rome and enjoying the life of a wealthy aristocrat during the last year of Commodus' reign. However much a wealthy aristocrat could enjoy his life with Commodus' mad whims hanging over his head all the time.


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[Assistant] And was finally, as I said, enjoying a nice dinner when Pertnax was murdered.


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[Assistant] Before the sun rose the next morning, he was in the Imperial Palace and likely wondering if the night's events had been a strange dream.


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[Assistant] It was time for the Praetorians to initiate the final phase of their brilliant plan. Kick back and live like kings.


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[Assistant] But this final phase was premised on the assumption that there would be no repercussions for the double crime of murdering Pertnax and selling off the throne.


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[Assistant] This was, as you can imagine, as faulty an assumption as there has ever been in the long history of faulty assumptions.


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[Assistant] In the full light of day, the magnitude of how faulty that assumption was became all too clear.


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[Assistant] When Julianas traveled through the streets, he was hissed at and booed at by the people who called him names and pelted him with rocks.


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[Assistant] The Senate, with swords in their faces, had agreed to honor his claim to the throne.


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[Assistant] But to a man, they now reviled Julianas and considered his residence in the Imperial Palace a mockery.


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[Assistant] If Pertinax's mistake had been ignoring the Praetorians, Julianis's crime was in paying them exclusive attention.


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[Assistant] Because outside the couple of thousand members of the guard, no one else supported him.


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[Assistant] And there was a lot more men in the provincial armies than there were in the urban cohorts. If you catch my drift.


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[Assistant] None of the governors out in the provinces had any intention of offering fealty to this imperial imposter.


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[Assistant] And the three most powerful, Septimius Severus in Pannonia, Claudius Albinus in Britain, and Paschinius Niger in Syria, will each further intend not only to brush aside Julianus and his ridiculous claims to the throne, but to step in and take power for themselves.


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[Assistant] So the Praetorians had pulled off the perfect crime. They had murdered an emperor and replaced him with a man whose only claim to the throne was that he had promised to pay them all a boatload of cash. Yep, they were set for life and nothing could touch them.


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[Assistant] They were, after all, the Praetorian Guard. THE Praetorian Guard.


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[Assistant] While Commodus reigned, the various cabals of corrupt imperial officials who came and went over the years had wielded near absolute power over the people, and the Praetorians had been the iron hand keeping them all in line.


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[Assistant] So perhaps the last 12 years had made the guard a bit myopic.


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[Assistant] What they were forgetting was that commonists had paid enough attention to the provincial legions that they never really considered rebellion.


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[Assistant] Plus, he was the son of Marcus Aurelius, who was the son of Antoninus, who was the son of Hadrian, who was the son of Trajan. The legitimacy of his rule was never really in question.


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[Assistant] In their hubris, the Praetorians had missed the fact that killing Pertinax and putting Julianus in power meant that all bets were now off.


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[Assistant] Word spread quickly about what had happened to Pertinax and what had happened after he was dead.


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[Assistant] The leading governors across the empire, each on their own initiative, refused to recognize Julianas as a lawful emperor, and instead, simply got down to the business of deciding who they wanted to replace Julianas with.


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[Assistant] Coincidentally, the answer each one of them came up with was the same. Me.


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[Assistant] In April 193, Claudius Albinus, Septimius Severus, and Paschinius Niger, each stood at the head of their armies, and, vowing to revenge the murder of Pertinax and restore dignity to the empire, they were each hailed emperor by their assembled troops.


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[Assistant] Well, technically Albinus refused the title Emperor, but the effect was the same.


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[Assistant] This meant that unless they could come to some sort of agreement with one another, this trifecta of pretenders meant only one thing. A civil war.


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[Assistant] And I don't want to give anything away, but guess what? They don't really come to an agreement with one another.


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[Assistant] As quickly as word reached the legionary camps that Julianus was emperor, word came back to Julianus that, yeah right, wanna bet?


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[Assistant] But having mortgaged a great deal of his honor in buying the Imperial Throne.


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[Assistant] Julianis was not prepared to just give it up at the first sign of trouble.


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[Assistant] He was an experienced commander and administrator. Now was the time to muster all that experience and fight to keep what he had paid for.


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[Assistant] He rightly concluded that Niger and albinus were too far away to pose an immediate threat. But Septimius Severus in Pannonia? That right there was most definitely an immediate threat.


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[Assistant] The discipline of the Danube legions and the quality of the Roman roads meant that if he wanted to, Severus could march his army to the gates of Rome in a matter of weeks. Severus had to be neutralized immediately.


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[Assistant] So for the crime of treason against the new emperor, Julianus, again with armed soldiers literally standing over the Senate's shoulders, induced the body to declare Severus a public enemy and pass a sentence of death against the rogue general.


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[Assistant] He knew, just as Julianus knew, that he was the closest of the provincial generals to Rome.


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[Assistant] If he moved fast, he would be able to beat albinus and niger to the punch, and, invoking the old possession is nine tenths of the law thing,


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[Assistant] Dare them to challenge him, not Julianis, for control of the Capitol.


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[Assistant] Plus, once Julianas the dishonorable usurper was ousted, and our beloved Pertinax avenged, a lot of the rhetorical wind would go out of their arguments.


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[Assistant] Gibbon estimated that with the prize of supreme power in sight and that Severus pushed his troops to the limit and marks them at a clip of about 20 miles a day toward Rome.


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[Assistant] As he was on the move, Severus had a Machiavellian brainstorm.


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[Assistant] His next closest rival, geographically speaking, was albinus up in Britain.


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[Assistant] Albinus was an excellent commander and the British legions, while lacking some of the prestige of Severus's Danube troops, was still a formidable army.


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[Assistant] There was little doubt though, that in the end, Paschinius Niger, who would be able to muster the full resources of the rich eastern empire, would prove to be Severus's more formidable opponent.


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[Assistant] So Severus sent a note up to Albinus, who was also by the way the youngest of the three.


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[Assistant] Promising that if Albinus backs Severus' emperor, Severus would name Albinus Caesar, effectively making him the heir apparent.


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[Assistant] Albinus, in part because it satisfied his personal ambition, but also in part because aligning with Severus would head off civil war, agreed to the terms, and just like that, Septimius Severus had locked up the whole western empire.


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[Assistant] Whether he was aware of these further developments is unknown, but it didn't really matter.


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[Assistant] So, still scrambling for any means of survival.


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[Assistant] He sent a group of senators north to convince the Pannonian troops with a bundle of carrots and sticks that they ought to abandon their leader's cause.


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[Assistant] However, doubting that the delegation would have much of an effect.


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[Assistant] Julianas also sent some hand-picked men on a secret mission to just assassinate Severus and be done with him.


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[Assistant] By hook or crook, Severus had to be stopped before he reached Rome, or else Julianus was doomed.


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[Assistant] While he waited to hear how his various missions turned out, he set what men he had, that is, the Praetorians and the urban cohorts,


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[Assistant] To work fortifying the city and drilling for battle to keep their minds from dwelling on the fact that they were all probably dead men.


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[Assistant] Severus passed into Italy without meeting any resistance and occupied Ravenna, home of the Imperial fleet, simply by showing up and announcing that he was now occupying Ravenna.


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[Assistant] With eventual victory all but assured, Severus was finally met by the various delegation sent by Julianas to talk him out of it, or kill him, or whatever.


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[Assistant] The assassination squad was detected long before it got close to Severus, and failed to penetrate the general's outer circle, let alone his inner one.


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[Assistant] The senators, though, were allowed to meet the general and make their case.


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[Assistant] Far from convincing Severus to abandon his cause or the troops to abandon Severus, the group heard what Severus had to say.


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[Assistant] Namely, that Julianas did not stand a chance and that he was about to become emperor, they immediately switched sides.


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[Assistant] The desperate Julianas then ordered a token force north to try to halt the incoming Pannonian legions, but they were brushed aside with hardly a fight.


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[Assistant] The only notable thing about the skirmish is that it was the first time Romans had fought Romans in 124 years. It would not, by any means, be the last.


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[Assistant] As he continued south, towns and cities threw their doors open to Severus and hailed him emperor.


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[Assistant] So not only had Julianas failed to stop Severus, but his rival was picking up steam and shrouding himself in something of an aura of inevitability.


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[Assistant] Panicked, Julianis sent a message north to his rival, declaring that he would be open to discussing some sort of power sharing agreement.


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[Assistant] But Severus knew what the score was, and he flatly rejected the offer.


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[Assistant] He stopped about 70 miles north of Rome in late May 193 and prepared for his final march on the city.


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[Assistant] He didn't want to take it by force, though. After all, he was about to have to lead these people, and if he wanted to stay in office longer than Julianas, he couldn't kick things off by making a bloody mess of the Capitol.


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[Assistant] So he opened negotiations to isolate Julianas and remove him from power peacefully.


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[Assistant] He started by informing the Praetorians that they would not be punished if they agreed to hand over the men who had killed Pertnax.


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[Assistant] After about 17 seconds of debate, they agreed to the terms and delivered Letus and the others to Severus's men.


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[Assistant] Not a man to beat around the bush. Severus had them all killed immediately.


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[Assistant] This show of murderous resolve convinced all the men surrounding Julianas that the time to abandon the doomed foe emperor was right about now.


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[Assistant] The Praetorians informed the Senate that they no longer supported Julianus, and on June 1st, the Senate responded by declaring Severus the Lawful Emperor and Julianus an enemy of the state.


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[Assistant] The exact circumstances of Julianis' fate are variously told, but the most common version is that the Defrock Julianis, now left miserably alone in the palace, was apprehended by a company of soldiers, marched into a private chamber, and beheaded.


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[Assistant] With Julianus deposed and both the Senate and Praetorians declaring him their sovereign, Septimius Severus became emperor of the Roman Empire.


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[Assistant] His claim to power was not totally secure, and there was still much to be done, but I don't think I'm giving anything away when I say that he will successfully outmaneuver his rivals, and in the process, found a new imperial dynasty that will rule Rome more or less uninterrupted for the next 42 years.


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[Assistant] It was, when you get right down to it, quite a feat for an obscure half-Punic, half-Roman equite from Libya.


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[Assistant] Lucius Septimius Severus had been born in 145 in the province of Africa, right at the beginning of the Golden Age of Antoninus.


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[Assistant] His father was a native, though thoroughly romanized, African of equestrian rank.


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[Assistant] Although his own immediate family was not particularly influential, his father apparently never held political office.


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[Assistant] He had two cousins back in Italy, Uncle Publius and Uncle Gaius, who would both serve as consuls during the reign of Antoninus.


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[Assistant] Gaius Septimius Severus in particular would be the bridge young Lucius used to cross over from obscurity to prominence.


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[Assistant] The details of his youth are not particularly well known, but he was educated as much as a minor provincial family could afford. And by the time he was 17, his expressed interest in making more of himself than his father had, led Uncle Gaius to recommend him to the new emperor, Marcus Aurelius.


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[Assistant] But despite the endorsement, giving some young provincial a special leg up wasn't on Marcus' to-do list at the time, and so Severus languished in his sort of limbo, waiting patiently to reach the minimum age to serve as coester, when it was hoped that Marcus would appoint him to office and simultaneously enroll him in the Senate.


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[Assistant] And this obviously did not mark him for greatness as most men destined for the purple had all these age requirements waived and had already served his consul by now.


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[Assistant] But then again, Severus wasn't aiming to be emperor. He was simply shooting for prominence.


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[Assistant] Things actually got a little bit worse for young Severus in the mid to late 160s, as he waited patiently for the expected assignment.


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[Assistant] The Antonine Plague infected Rome and Severus prudently, if a bit dejectedly, left the disease capital and returned to Africa where things were safer.


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[Assistant] He had left home with high hopes, and now he was right back where he had started, with nothing to show for it but a few wasted years.


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[Assistant] But the plague, which seemed like it might be the final nail in the coffin of whatever grand ambition Severus secretly harbored for himself,


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[Assistant] Actually turned out to be the defibrillator that brought those ambitions back to life.


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[Assistant] In addition to being a human tragedy of enormous proportions.


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[Assistant] The plague had the practical effect of creating many a vacancy in the imperial government.


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[Assistant] Just as the second Punic War, and specifically the disaster at Cannae, had cleared out most of the rising stars of the old patrician families and opened the door for men of merit wherever they might be found.


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[Assistant] So too did the Antonine Plague leave room for men who likely never would have been granted a second look had the old aristocracy not been dropping like flies.


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[Assistant] I think Pompeianus benefited from these conditions. Pertinax certainly rose higher than he otherwise would have. And young Severus, nobody provincial, would soon find his application for membership in the Senate readily granted, an important business happily heaped upon his shoulders.


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[Assistant] But even here, Severus's career progressed in fits and starts.


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[Assistant] He was assigned a proquestorship in the Spanish senatorial province of Betica, but soon after taking up the posting, his father died, forcing Severus to return home to assume the mantle of Pater Familius.


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[Assistant] The Moors invaded Spain and threw the region into crisis.


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[Assistant] The Senate handed control of Bidaka to the Emperor, and in trade, the Emperor granted the Senate authority over the island of Sardinia.


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[Assistant] So when he was ready to return to duty, Severus was redirected to the moderately hostile backwater of Sardinia, rather than the lush and wealthy coast of Spain.


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[Assistant] But Uncle Gaius still saw promise in the young man. Though it should be admitted he was not quite so young anymore.


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[Assistant] He was serious and dedicated and so when Gaius Severus was assigned the proconsulship of Africa, he picked his younger cousin to serve on his staff.


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[Assistant] In 175, the now 30 year old Severus married a local African girl, and though they were married 11 years, she would die in 186, no children resulted from the union.


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[Assistant] Around that same time, he was the recipient of Imperial favor and appointed to serve as one of the now entirely honorary Tribune of the Plebs back in Rome.


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[Assistant] For the decade that followed, he would find himself fully in the emperor's good graces, and assigned to key political and military posts across the empire, mostly in Spain and Gaul.


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[Assistant] When Commodus succeeded his father, Severus was close enough to the imperial family that Commodus trusted him without being so close that Commodus felt threatened by him.


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[Assistant] Shortly after Lucilla's failed plot to kill her brother though, Severus did temporarily fall from favor when he botched, perhaps intentionally, the job of tracking down one of the conspirators who had fled east.


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[Assistant] But this was a minor blip on Severus's now firmly established record, and before too long, he was called back into service.


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[Assistant] In 186, Severus's first wife died, and he set himself to finding a new partner.


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[Assistant] This time, one he hoped would help catapult his career to the next level.


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[Assistant] Belief in astrology and divination was as strong in the empires as it had ever been, and Severus in particular bought into the whole system completely.


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[Assistant] He was informed by some mystics that there was a woman in the east who was destined to marry a king.


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[Assistant] So Severus immediately went forth to track her down and marry her.


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[Assistant] The woman in question was a Syrian named Julia Domna, who was descended from a line of kings established by Pompey during his initial political reorganization of the East in the 60s BC.


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[Assistant] Though her family's royalty had long been stripped away, her father was a high priest in the small but important mystery religion that dedicated itself to the worship of Elagabal, god of the sun.


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[Assistant] Severus talked his way into an engagement with the woman who was destined to marry a king, and in the summer of 187, the two were wed. The marriage would prove to be a happy and fruitful one.


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[Assistant] Julia would go down as one of the more beloved empresses of all time.


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[Assistant] And apart from earning praise for her intelligence, wit, and political savvy,


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[Assistant] She was also a tireless promoter of the arts, philosophy and poetry.


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[Assistant] Though she did her best to stem the tide, her work was largely a losing battle against a Greco-Roman culture that had stagnated and felt content to worship past masters rather than cultivate their generation's own voices.


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[Assistant] Though the elder son would be known during his own life as Lucius, we know him today by the nickname that was rarely uttered in his presence, but which I'll use to refer to him from here on out, Caracalla.


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[Assistant] The feud with his younger brother Geta, the means by which he resolved said feud, and the tyrannical regime he subsequently oversaw following his father's death, would become the stuff of legend. And Caracalla provided most, but not all of the reasons we usually call the Severan dynasty, the troubled Severan dynasty.


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[Assistant] Before we move on from Severus' growing nuclear family though, I should mention that his new sister-in-law, Julia Misa, will soon become a major player in her own right.


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[Assistant] It was her young grandsons, whom we know as Elagobulus and Alexander Severus, who will round out the ill-fated Severan dynasty.


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[Assistant] Both 14 at the time of their respective ascensions, Julia Misa will wield considerable influence behind the scenes, and in her heyday, was the most powerful Roman woman the Empire had ever seen since the time of Agrippina.


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[Assistant] His family growing happily and rapidly, though what it grew into was an entirely different story.


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[Assistant] Severus finally received that bright feather political men still strove to put in their caps, despite its ultimate irrelevance, by being named Consul in 190.


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[Assistant] As you'll recall though, his console ship was even more irrelevant than most. His naming coming as it did in the middle of Kleander's scandalous list of 25 for the year.


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[Assistant] The following year, Severus was assigned to the key governorship of Pannonia, which brings us back to where we just began.


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[Assistant] The assassination of Commodus. The murder of Pertinax. The elevation of Julianis.


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[Assistant] Severus entered Rome in June 193 as the acknowledged master of the Roman Empire, king in all but name, just as the oracles had predicted.


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[Assistant] His first act was to order the disgraced Praetorian Guard to assemble unarmed on a plane outside the city walls, where they were surrounded by his own armed troops.


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[Assistant] The Praetorians were no doubt thinking that Severus' promise of no recriminations was about to be revealed as just a clever expedient, and that they were all about to pay the ultimate price for their greed and hubris, but Severus instead simply ordered them to disband. That is, the Praetorian Guard was abolished.


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[Assistant] The now former members of the Guard escaped with their lives, but found their livelihoods stripped away in an instant.


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[Assistant] In place of the old Praetorians, which had been an assembly of mostly Italian, mostly well-to-do soldiers, who treated the posting as purely ceremonial and little more than an opportunity to live high on the hog at the Empire's expense, Severus instituted a new order of Praetorians.


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[Assistant] This one would be four times as large and be made up of provincial soldiers.


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[Assistant] Rather than a social club for pampered Italians, the Guard was reconstructed to be the premier military unit in the Empire, and served as the ultimate reward for excellent service in the Legions.


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[Assistant] Promotion of the Praetorians was, in other words, now open to any soldier who earned the right.


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[Assistant] First, it further increased the distance between the citizens of Rome and their emperor.


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[Assistant] Rather than the barrier separating the two being made up of armed Italians, who at least looked like the citizens of Rome and talked like them, and were in many cases related to them, the barrier was now made up of a motley group of uncouth provincial soldiers who shared nothing in common with the citizenry of the capital.


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[Assistant] From this point on basically, no one had a cousin in the guard anymore who could, you know, bend the rules a bit now and then.


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[Assistant] The second ramification of the Praetorian reorganization was that it wound up draining away talent from the provinces.


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[Assistant] When the best soldiers are promoted up to a posting in Rome, well, they're not around to help dig trenches anymore, or lead men in battle, or generally ensure that the borders remain secure.


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[Assistant] Though only one of many factors that led to the disastrous barbarian invasions of the next century,


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[Assistant] It certainly didn't help that all the best men were stationed in Rome, rather than on the Danube, when the Goths came calling.


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[Assistant] Finally, when the old guard was disbanded, they took with them the last few Italians still serving in uniform.


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[Assistant] The Roman legions were now no longer in any sense Roman legions.


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[Assistant] From here on out, wherever you looked, you saw foreign faces under those helmets.


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[Assistant] The Romans themselves were now content to let others do the fighting for them.


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[Assistant] This abandonment of their martial heritage is high on the list of potential reasons why the Western Empire ultimately fell.


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[Assistant] But as of yet, these reorganizations were still just a glimmer in Severus's eye.


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[Assistant] He had been recognized by the Senate and the Praetorians, but so what? So had the late Didius Julianus.


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[Assistant] Paschinius Niger was still in Syria, still in control of the resources of the Eastern Empire, and still showing every indication that he was planning to become emperor himself.


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[Assistant] Claudius Albinus was temporarily sated, but Severus knew that Albinus would not be so docile when the new emperor revealed his plan to double-cross his supposed heir and instead name his sons Caracalla and Geta co-Caesars.


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[Assistant] Next week, Severus will face down his two rivals in a three-way battle for power that will finally unlock the Pandora's Box of Civil War that the Romans had successfully kept shut for 125 years.


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[Assistant] On June 1st, 193 AD, Septimius Severus was officially recognized as emperor by the Senate and people of Rome.


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[Assistant] In theory, he now controlled the whole empire, but in practice he was only master of its western half.


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[Assistant] Unlike the Danube legions and the British legions, who both at this point back Severus, the troops in Syria and Egypt recognized Paschinius Niger's claim to the throne, and would have scoffed at any attempt by Severus to order them around.


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[Assistant] There were high hopes all around though that political tensions between East and West could be resolved without bloodshed, but it was not to be.


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[Assistant] The basic fact was that Severus was convinced that he had every right to the throne, and Niger was also convinced that he had every right to the throne.


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[Assistant] Keeping the aftermath of Julianis' rise and fall bloodless meant that one of the two generals was going to have to back down and take a subordinate role to the other.


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[Assistant] Claudius Albinus had already allowed himself to be so subordinated, but neither Niger nor Severus had any intention of following his example. And so, unfortunately, civil war.


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[Assistant] But Severus was savvy about optics, as evidenced by the care he took in keeping his initial coup a bloodless one. Well, relatively bloodless. Julianus and the men who had murdered Pertinax were dead, but no one liked them anyway, so they don't really count.


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[Assistant] In all his public posturing, Severus intimated that Niger was his friend and colleague and that they couldn't possibly have any real quarrel with one another since they were such good friends and such good colleagues.


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[Assistant] Their two armies had both acted nobly in rejecting Julianus and independently hailing their leader's emperor.


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[Assistant] But now that Purtnax was avenged, it was time for them to act nobly again and reject Discord in favor of Concord.


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[Assistant] Despite his public front of hopeful hope and friendly friendship though, Severus and his lieutenants were diligently preparing for war.


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[Assistant] They well knew that, barring a miracle, the only place Severus and Niger would be able to conclusively settle the issue of who was Emperor would be on the battlefield.


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[Assistant] Thus, thirty days after he arrived in Rome, Severus ordered his forces to break camp and head east.


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[Assistant] He told the Senate and the people that he was merely on his way to tour and inspect the eastern provinces and pointedly made no mention of Niger or his rival claim to power.


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[Assistant] But those in the know knew that Severus was on his way to demand the approaching Syrian legions recognize him as their emperor or face destruction.


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[Assistant] We know basically how things are going to turn out in contests between Severus and Niger, and we'll get to the details in a second.


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[Assistant] But before we get into the particulars, I should point out that things didn't have to turn out this way.


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[Assistant] Indeed, to many at the time, the ascension and subsequent victories of Severus came as quite a shock.


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[Assistant] And see, a pretty good chunk of the political class simply assumed that the job was naturally going to pass over to Pescanius Niger.


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[Assistant] From the moment Julianus bought the throne, they expected Niger, not Severus, to be the man who would ride triumphantly into the city, cow the Praetorians, and restore order.


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[Assistant] All the Syrian governor had to do was get on his horse and ride. But then a funny thing happened.


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[Assistant] A presumed successor to Julie Honest never showed up for his coronation ceremony.


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[Assistant] There's not a ton in the historical record about Pescanius Niger.


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[Assistant] But we do know that he was born in the late 130s AD, around about the time that power was being transferred from Hadrian to Antoninus, making him the eldest of our three claimants to the throne.


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[Assistant] Like Severus, he had come from an upper middle-class family of equites, and, also like Severus, saw his career advance rapidly during that age of upward mobility made possible by the Parthian War, the Marko-Manic Wars, and the Antonine Plague.


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[Assistant] Early in Commodus' reign, he had been made a senator and then appointed to a military command in Dacia, where he served alongside Claudius Albinus and helped settle a brief Sarmatian uprising.


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[Assistant] After that, he was enough in Commodus' confidence that when the deserters war broke out in 186, it was Niger who was ordered into Gaul to put the rebel army down.


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[Assistant] Probably as a reward for his success in this endeavor, Commodus appointed Niger to the all-important governorship of Syria.


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[Assistant] Arriving in Antioch, he endeared himself to the population by taking a liberal attitude towards local custom and for encouraging the kind of games Marcus had outlawed.


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[Assistant] And endeared himself to the legions by maintaining discipline without being overly harsh or strict about anything.


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[Assistant] He remained happily situated in Syria until the chaos of 193 led him to pack up his things and lead his armies toward Rome.


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[Assistant] Very slowly pack up his things, and very slowly lead his armies toward Rome.


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[Assistant] Not to Rome, mind you, just toward Rome. He never would get there.


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[Assistant] The problem with Niger, and the thing that most especially led to his fall, was the fact that he did not feel the fierce urgency of now.


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[Assistant] When Septemius Severus decided to make his bid for the throne, he spent every waking moment preparing to march on Rome. And when preparations were complete, he spent every waking moment actually marching on Rome. And when he arrived, he spent every waking moment figuring out exactly how he was going to keep the power he had grabbed.


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[Assistant] Peskenius Niger, on the other hand, was far more lackadaisical about everything.


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[Assistant] Given a more vigorous response, he might have, like Vespasian before him, leveraged his position as de facto leader of the Eastern Empire into de jure leader of the whole empire.


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[Assistant] Two months had passed since the death of Julianas, and Niger was just now barely leaving Antioch.


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[Assistant] He wouldn't even make it to the Hellespont before being met by Severus's Danube legions, who, in the same amount of time, had marched from Pannonia to Rome, ousted Julianus, sat around for a bit catching their breath as Severus planned their next move, and then crossed the Adriatic, marched across Macedonia and Thrace all the way to the Hellespont.


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[Assistant] It is quite obvious then, which general was feeling said fierce urgency of now, and which was feeling the fierce urgency of whenever.


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[Assistant] Up until the very end, Severus and Niger maintained an officially friendly correspondence that pretended war was not imminent.


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[Assistant] But finally, the charade was called off when the two armies met in battle.


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[Assistant] Seeing as how it's kind of hard to pretend you have nothing but the most peaceful of intentions when you're simultaneously ordering your cavalry in to ride and hack your rival to pieces.


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[Assistant] The advance guards of both armies found each other in the province of Bithynia and fought two separate engagements in the late summer of 193, which, though too large to be considered skirmishes, were also too small to be decisive.


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[Assistant] In both fights though, Niger's eastern troops looked badly overmatched against the veteran Pannonian legions, and were beaten handily.


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[Assistant] The ascension of Niger, which at first had seemed so right, so logical, and so inevitable, was now turning out to be so very clearly a pipe dream.


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[Assistant] Winter overtook the contest though, and when the new year dawned, Severus cemented his alliance with Albinus by sharing a consulship with the British general.


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[Assistant] He further let it be known that while he was prosecuting the war in the east,


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[Assistant] Severus wasted no time trying to land the final blow against Niger when spring arrived.


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[Assistant] In the meantime, Niger had withdrawn his forces almost all the way back to Syria and had set up a fortified position near the village of Isis at a location known as the Cilician Gates, a narrow east-west passage wedged in between the southern coastline of Turkey and the sharply rising Taurus Mountains to the north.


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[Assistant] When you google the battle of Isis though, your first hits will not point you to the decisive battle between Severus and Nidir.


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[Assistant] Though the two forces were roughly equal in size. Three legions apiece, plus some auxiliaries.


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[Assistant] The Danube troops, tempered in the fires of the Marco Manic Wars, were simply superior to the Syrian troops, who had been tempered in the fires of, well, not much really.


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[Assistant] The Parthian War was already thirty years past, and as a result, none of the soldiers in the east had any real experience with any real fighting. Niger's men made a go of it,


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[Assistant] Chaos and slaughter ensued, and Niger was forced to flee the battlefield.


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[Assistant] His army now completely destroyed. The Syrian governor was apparently making for Parthia, where he hoped to find asylum, and perhaps the resources to make another bid for the throne one day.


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[Assistant] But he was caught before he reached the Euphrates and like Julianus before him, was unceremoniously beheaded.


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[Assistant] The head was sent back to Severus, who forwarded it on to the smallish but well-fortified city of Byzantium, where what was left of the Niger loyalists had holed up.


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[Assistant] Though their leader's head now sat atop a spike in front of the city gates, Niger's remaining lieutenants obstinately refused to surrender.


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[Assistant] At first, they held out simply to refuse Severus the satisfaction of victory.


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[Assistant] But eventually, they came to believe that Claudius Albinus would eventually heed the various calls for him to get into the ring, and that maybe, just maybe,


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[Assistant] They could live long enough to see Severus's head on a spike too.


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[Assistant] But after a two year holdout, famine got the better of them, and the last of Niger's soldiers finally surrendered Byzantium in 196.


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[Assistant] Severus ordered all the walls and fortifications of the city be toppled, reducing Byzantium to just another open village, which is exactly how Constantine found it more than a century later.


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[Assistant] In between the occupation and surrender of Byzantium, Severus busied himself in the east.


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[Assistant] Still hoping to maintain some thin veneer of clemency, Severus did not simply go around to the various provinces killing those leading men who had supported Niger. But he did do the next harshest thing he could think of.


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[Assistant] Anyone associated with the fallen Syrian governor, no matter how tenuously, was purged from political office and their property confiscated. The ill-gotten, but not murderously so,


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[Assistant] Gains were then directed by Severus to his faithful soldiers.


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[Assistant] The soon to be undisputed emperor had no illusions about where his power was derived from, and no desire to beat around the bush in his plans to hold on to that power.


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[Assistant] For the entirety of the Severan dynasty, starting with Severus himself.


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[Assistant] Severus's position was crystallizing, but since you can't return home to a triumph if your victory comes against your fellow Romans, literally, it was against the rules.


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[Assistant] Severus embarked on a brief campaign against the Parthians to give himself a nice foreign victory to point to.


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[Assistant] Following a series of practically non-contested victories in the Parthian borderlands beyond the Euphrates,


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[Assistant] Severus was finally confident enough in his grasp on power that he decided to drop the pretense that he was going to make Albinus' heir and announced that his young son Caracalla was now to be known as Marcus Aurelius Septimius Bossianus Antoninus and would be next in line for the throne.


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[Assistant] This news came as something of a nasty surprise to Albinus in Britain, whose support for Severus, after all, had been premised on being named Severus' heir.


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[Assistant] The announcement also put an incident from the previous year in a new light.


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[Assistant] After defeating Niger, Severus had sent a note to Albinus proclaiming the triumph.


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[Assistant] But it had also been difficult to believe, based on every other thing he had ever said or done, that Severus had been the one who ordered the attack.


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[Assistant] But now that Albinus was getting the old double cross, the random assassination attempt by some rogue soldiers took on a much more sinister light. Because Severus had obviously tried to kill him.


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[Assistant] In 196, now fully aware that he had been duped into complacency for the last two and a half years, Albinus finally accepted all that his troops wanted him to accept.


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[Assistant] He allowed himself to be hailed Imperator, kept the name Caesar, and prepared himself for war with Severus.


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[Assistant] He crossed over the English Channel into Gaul with three legions and a host of auxiliaries, the Cassius Dio estimated to be some 150,000 total men. Though, like all ancient figures, this is likely an exaggeration.


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[Assistant] He was met initially by a smaller force led by one of Severus' generals who had been tasked with halting the invasion or, at the very least, slowing it down.


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[Assistant] Albinus dispatched Severus' welcoming party with ease, though, and the setback gave some on the Severan side pause.


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[Assistant] Maybe we should come to some sort of agreement with Albinus. It turns out that fighting him isn't exactly going to be a walk in the park, you know?


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[Assistant] But Severus himself seemed undaunted and readied himself for what he was confident would be his final test.


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[Assistant] Beating Albinus meant that the Empire would be his, free and clear.


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[Assistant] Albinus was able to occupy Lugdunum, the capital of Roman Gaul, but he was unable to do the one thing he really needed to do to win.


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[Assistant] Severus now had British legions accepted, the whole of the empire behind him.


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[Assistant] There was no way Albinus would be able to match Severus's reserve of men and material.


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[Assistant] Unless he was able to convince the Rhine legions to join his cause.


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[Assistant] Thus far a non-factor in the war, the Rhine legions had remained essentially neutral, though they had leaned heavily towards Severus against Niger.


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[Assistant] Albinist hoped he could coax them into his camp, but all his entreaties were spurned, as the Rhine troops instead dug in their support for Severus, pegging him to be the eventual winner in any contest that they themselves did not get involved in.


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[Assistant] Having failed to sway the Rhine troops, Albina still persisted in his preparations for battle. But now, his mission seemed to be working itself up to be a romantic last stand, rather than a stunning victory against the growing tyranny of Severus.


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[Assistant] Like Septimius Severus, Claudius Albinus had been born in Africa. Though unlike Severus, Albinus was the son of a wealthy senatorial family, and was by far the most pedigreed of the three rivals for power.


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[Assistant] He earned the cognom in albina shortly after his birth in 147, but when his father commented on the boy's unusually pale skin,


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[Assistant] Though, he was not an albino per se, as it is sometimes thought.


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[Assistant] From the very beginning, he was set on a military career, and as a young man, quickly established a reputation as an excellent soldier.


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[Assistant] He served in various capacities throughout the first half of the Markomanic Wars, and was, at an early age,


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[Assistant] Promoted to the governorship of Bithynia for the year 175.


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[Assistant] That meant that he was in Bithynia when the revolt of Avidius Cassius broke out.


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[Assistant] Rather than join the other eastern provinces, Albinus withheld the single legion he controlled from Cassius, and instead remained loyal to Marcus.


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[Assistant] This endeared him to the Emperor and his son Commodus, who, you'll recall, was there during the crisis and learned quickly who was with his family and who was opposed to them.


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[Assistant] For the entirety of Commodus' reign, Albinus continued to be held in high esteem by the Emperor, and was given commands in Gaul, and then finally, the powerful governorship of Britain.


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[Assistant] Given remarks that we should not hold it against Albinus that he was so well liked by Commodus, and that sometimes, even men who usually favor the corrupt and venal, occasionally, almost by accident, favor the honest and capable, which by all estimations Albinus was,


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[Assistant] In fact, albinists actually took things a little bit further than that.


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[Assistant] In early 192, a believable rumor reached his headquarters in Britain that Commodus was dead, and in response, Albinus delivered an address to his troops, condemning the excesses and brutality of Commodus, and openly calling for a return to a republican form of government.


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[Assistant] By the time the speech was over, he had outed himself as a full-blown critic of the imperial system, and likely would have paid for the crime with his life, had not Commodus really been killed just a few months later, before the emperor could deal with his suddenly treasonous governor of Britain.


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[Assistant] Just like with Severus in Niger, the elevation of Pertinax came as welcome news to Albinus, but the elevation of Julianus did not.


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[Assistant] Perhaps in a nod to his Republican sympathies, Albinus initially refused the title Imperator and Augustus, and allowed himself to be styled merely as a lieutenant of the people.


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[Assistant] But, perhaps further revealing that some of those Republican sympathies were more rhetorical and theoretical than actual.


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[Assistant] But after Karakalla was elevated in Albinus' place, Severus was exposed as a ruthless two-faced tyrant who was not to be trusted nor followed.


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[Assistant] In Albinus's mind, it was now his duty, as the only man in a position to do something about it. To do something about Septimius Severus.


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[Assistant] In February 197, Albinus very nearly did something about it.


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[Assistant] The force Severus mustered to face down his last rival was roughly equal to that of Albinus's army.


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[Assistant] That is, Severus's army is also quoted to be at the aforementioned 150,000.


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[Assistant] Which meant that at least for this one fight, the two generals were on equal footing.


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[Assistant] The size of the two armies also meant that this was the largest legion on legion fight in the whole long history of Rome.


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[Assistant] By contrast, the Battle of Pharsalus featured a mere 30,000 troops for Caesar and maybe 60,000 for Pompey, a combined total that would have been dwarfed by a single side in this latest fight for control of the Empire.


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[Assistant] The Battle of Lugdunum had to have been an absolutely humongous affair.


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[Assistant] In contrast to the other battles won in his name, Severus decided this fight was critical enough that he needed to be there in person to lead his armies. And with Albinus personally directing his own forces, the fight turned into a slugfest between two evenly matched armies, both being led by highly intelligent commanders.


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[Assistant] Severus' left wing simultaneously fell into a trap that nearly cost Severus his life when he was caught in a chaotic retreat away from a booby trap field.


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[Assistant] But eventually, the Severans wore down Albinus' men and broke through their lines.


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[Assistant] Albinus himself fled the field and retreated back to a house in the still as of yet untaken city of Lough Dunham. But...


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[Assistant] Recognizing that the day was lost and that it was only a matter of time before he was captured and executed, Claudius Albinus committed suicide.


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[Assistant] It is reported that Severus showed no respect for Albinius's honor, and in addition to running over the discovered corpse with a cart, he chopped off the head and sent it back to Rome as a warning to anyone who dared to dream that Septimius Severus was not, in fact, the invincible and undisputed master of the world.


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[Assistant] Next time, Severus will have to deal with the consequences of his actions.


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[Assistant] A man of boundless energy who was used to immediate and unquestioned compliance with his orders suddenly found himself leading a civilian governmental apparatus that was sluggish, temperamental, and above all, boring.


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[Assistant] The life of a Roman politician is absolutely nothing like the life of a Roman general. A fact that Severus was quickly coming to understand.


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[Assistant] In pursuit of power, he had never stopped to contemplate whether the Imperial throne would prove to be a blessing or a curse.


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[Assistant] In the end he came down squarely on the side of the ladder.


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[Assistant] With no great crises left to engage him, his spirit atrophied in the face of bureaucratic minutia.


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[Assistant] Relief was supposed to be found in the cultivation of his sons, but before his very eyes, Caracalla and Geta were turning into cruel, petulant adolescents, and, worse yet, seemed to despise one another.


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[Assistant] Rather than being left satisfied that the power he had won for his family would be wielded wisely, he was left dejected, suspecting that the minute he was gone, the boys would tear each other and the empire apart.


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[Assistant] I say next time rather than next week because unfortunately I'm going to have to miss the next two Sundays.


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[Assistant] I'm headed up to Madison for an extended 4th of July vacation and all my available writing time is going to be replaced with family time.


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[Assistant] But, you might say, shouldn't that mean you're only taking one week off?


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[Assistant] Well, yes, that's what I thought too. But then I did the math, and it turns out that between everything, this one week long trip is going to knock me out for two full episodes worth of production time.


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[Assistant] But don't worry, I'll come back tanned, ready and rested, and next time, we'll delve into the back end of Severus's unhappy reign and watch his adorable little boys turn into deplorable little monsters.


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[Assistant] What's up everybody? Welcome to another episode of The Roommates, where the vibes are always immaculate. This is a PlayMaker original. Uh, today we got our guest,


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[Assistant] He's a rapper, actor, executive, chart topper, legendary Knicks fan, Fat Joe, we appreciate you pulling out to the pod, my guy.


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[Assistant] Born in Detroit, Shinola is a design brand with unwavering commitment to building products and experiences.


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[Assistant] In 2012, Chanel transformed a 12,000 square foot raw space into a state-of-the-art watch facility in Detroit.


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[Assistant] The long tradition of Detroit watchmaking is well underway.


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[Assistant] And this one is the White Hurricane. It's the sister watch to the Black Blizzard. Check this out though. It features a white dial with a double domed Sapphire crystal. The entire face of the White Hurricane glows blue in the dark.


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[Assistant] He's definitely top 3. Wow. Yeah, he's either him or Zion. Yeah.


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[Assistant] Turkish get-ups for like a hundred, a hundred twenty-five pound like kettlebells.


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[Assistant] Straight arm bruh, he was just, he was just stupid strong.


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[Assistant] I think we fit well with him. He does so much defensively that he like...


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[Assistant] It was time, he can guard point guards, like in times, he'll be guarding maxi, and then like there were other times where like he's guarding, he played Denver, he's guarding, or Houston, he's guarding like Segun or somebody in the post. So he's like, defensively is just.


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[Assistant] Dough, dough is dope. Cause I had him one year. Um, and he, and he, for, for young dudes, he's great. Cause we, I was, uh, in LA, second unit. So there'll be times where he'll have us, you know, on road games, he'll have a suite. So he'll have like the second unit. It'll be me, him, um,


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[Assistant] Depending on the big, Michael Beasley, JaVale, like, it'll just be like, KCP sometimes, uhm, he'll have us all go into his room, we'll watch film together, we'll do all the, and so it was just cool just to see,


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[Assistant] That was 2000, that was 2019. We were like, we, we actually had a, uh, a go, we were like, at the Lego, like we were solid, like we weren't great, but we were, we were straight at the beginning of the year.


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[Assistant] Then you had, it was like, Playoff Rondo came out, just, he just controlled, just controlled the game, put guys into wherever they needed to be, got guys involved, just took over the game, and he, like, Bron got hurt,


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[Assistant] But then the one that really like, I felt like we probably could have stayed afloat with Rondo, but Rondo broke his hand literally at the end of the game. But like, that was like...


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[Assistant] Yeaah, I'll text him today. Yeaah? Yeaah, that's my guy, man. Good, just, love, loves basketball. Hard-nosed, like, competitive as hell too. So, it was, it was dope to see that.


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[Assistant] Yeaah. Nah, I was just gonna say, nah, I was just gonna say like, when we're young, like,


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[Assistant] I was about to say, if they have 40 wins right now, he's top 4 in MVP gold. For sure.


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[Assistant] But like, I feel like it's always different. Cause I feel like a lot of guys that have that.


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[Assistant] You got young guys that are just, that come in.


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[Assistant] Social media and all that, like you don't really, a lot of guys don't have to have that dog to have like some of their success, you know what I mean?


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[Assistant] I was like, the funniest thing, because like, obviously like, we're in Miami.


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[Assistant] Alright guys, we're gonna go through the picks that we're scrolling, where we go through the funniest tweets and picks of the week. Uhm, so we're gonna see, get it started, we're gonna see what we got. Uh, ooh, yeaah, for y'all that don't know, JB got nominated for teammate of the year award.


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[Assistant] I don't really understand, I wanna know the criteria of what goes into like, the finalist for the award, because uhm,


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[Assistant] Larry Nance for sure on there. Must've been Mikael being up there, I see that. Mikael?


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[Assistant] I feel like Pat Bev, Russell Westbrook.


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[Assistant] It was like, you know, he had a quick, quick cup of coffee in OKC, uh, with Russ, but, um, uh, you know, he wasn't shooting the ball well. Russ would go to the gym with him like after games or late, late night. So it's like having like a teammate like that, you know, yeaah.


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[Assistant] This is tough. I'll probably say he was probably a better roommate. Because...


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[Assistant] I was never dirty. Yeah, you weren't dirty. You were just mostly just like in your room.


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[Assistant] He always, he has a terrible, terrible taste in music. He always wants to get the aux.


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[Assistant] I forgot, I forgot what happened. Uh, we were talking about Saquon Barkley going to, to the Eagles and then I knew they had, uh,


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[Assistant] Travis Kelsey's brother on the team, oh they did before he retired, yeah. Uhm, and I forgot what his name was, so I said, I think I said some random, I think I said, I said Matt, and I kinda forgot what his name was, but I was just thinking like, it was a common white name, and I said Matt, and then, and then I looked up, I


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[Assistant] I don't, I don't take my shirt off. When do I take my shirt off?


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[Assistant] Of course, this is awesome. Anytime. It's a blessing, man, uh, for everyone watching. Make sure y'all, uh, continue to tune in. I got episodes coming out weekly, man. Continue to come on this ride with us, and we appreciate y'all.


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[Assistant] I mean look, certain players just like get more calls too, and it's very clear for Knicks fans that you're at that place where you should be getting those calls, no question.


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[Assistant] Every episode. Every episode. I have a thing with my S's too.


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[Assistant] Congrats, congrats on the pod. We're trying, we're trying. I think it's great, I've been listening.


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[Assistant] Yeah, I like how it's relaxed and it feels like intimate, you know, like a good way. Oh, thanks.


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[Assistant] Yeah, but it's like it's all dialed in. You got lighting set. I noticed a set when I, I haven't watched it. I like to listen to podcasts. So I haven't done the, you know, the YouTube thing, but just seeing like, you know, the clips when I see the clips, it looks very,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I like the Stepbrothers, uh, I already like the Stepbrothers art from the beginning that you're doing. It's one of my favorite movies too. So, I'm assuming it's one of your favorites.


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[Assistant] The tough guy. He seems intense. I saw him when I got to say hi to you guys before a game a couple weeks ago. He's, he seemed really intense though. Like really serious.


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[Assistant] It seems like you guys have a good relationship. I saw that video of you guys shooting the pop-a-shots and it seems like you have fun together. Yeaah.


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[Assistant] There is, there is nothing like the father son thing that like it's definitely, like I have an 18 year old son and I saw that video I saw, you know, your dad like that circulated, but he's making you just like shoot again and again and again. And I like, I would do that with my son. And like the first time I go like, okay, again, he just go off and walk away. I mean, I literally could not get him to do anything.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right, but you didn't, no, but you didn't, I mean. I didn't. And you must have also, like, since he was in the NBA, like, you had respect for what he, like, knowing you wanted to do what he does, or did, right? So you had a certain amount of like, okay, I'm gonna listen to this guy.


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[Assistant] Well yeaah, I mean it's interesting like the sports and entertainment or, you know, analogy because to a certain extent is, part of it is having to just like put in the work. But then it just gets very, like in sports it's a lot tougher I think because it becomes very binary so either you're winning or losing you're getting


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Drafted. You're not getting drafted in entertainment. It's a little more like you're doing your thing. And so, you know, my dad, he was always,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And my mom too, because they were a comedy team and they started out together as a comedy team and then, uh, they worked together a lot.


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[Assistant] He was always supportive, but I think, and I have kids who are also interested in being, uh, actors.


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[Assistant] It's such a tough business, like I think a lot of the time he was sort of like supportive but also protective. He was very overprotective, not wanting to see his kids have to go through the, you know, like all the rejection of being in show business. But he was


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But he kind of went off of my design, like I was so into it, I was so like just had a focus that I think he supported that. But he was also, uh,


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[Assistant] I could tell also that he was, like he's the type of guy, like if I got a bad review he would write a letter to the critic.


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[Assistant] You know, I mean, which is just like, you know, so embarrassing as for, for me, you know, like, but it was, came out of total just love and like really genuinely just.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, loved his kids, so uhm, he wasn't like a tough dad. He was more like, kind of the, you know, super supportive but also overprotective and,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And then, you know, when I was starting out, my parents, I would just, I would do, you know, I was kind of just trying to figure it out, you know, like I was telling you before, like, no one was hiring me as an actor, so I would, you know, try to make my own stuff with my friends or...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I a lot of times pulled my parents in to like do like a, you know, if I was making like a shorter video or something like that and they were always game to do whatever. So they were, you know, they were great that way.


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[Assistant] I think I was like, probably like eight or nine years old.


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[Assistant] And there was a movie called The Poseidon Adventure when I was a kid, which was like a disaster movie, this boat that gets into, like caught in a tidal wave and goes upside down.


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[Assistant] Everybody has to like get out of the boat. The boat's upside down. They have to make their way out to the top. And I saw that movie like 20 times in the theater.


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[Assistant] I was probably like nine years old when it came out and I just knew.


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[Assistant] Like, I wanna do that. I wanna be a movie maker. I wanna be a director. I knew I wanted to be a director. I wanted to make movies.


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[Assistant] And then I was around it with my parents, but just I kept starting making movies. My dad bought me a Super A camera, editing equipment, and I just started.


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[Assistant] You know, my parents were in comedy, so I was like, I don't want to do that. I didn't want to do what my parents did, and I felt like I wanted to be serious.


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[Assistant] And then I saw like people like Bill Murray or Steve Martin, you know, in those movies and I was like, alright, you know,


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[Assistant] I wanna, you know, I think that's funny. I wanna pursue that. Uhm.


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[Assistant] Then like I got, when I got older I was able to appreciate my parents more, I think.


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[Assistant] But uhm, it was a pretty, pretty young age. I just was like, that's all I wanna do.


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[Assistant] Yeah, I mean, that's what I'm amazed at too in sports is like you have to be so good at such a young age. Like you have to be performing at a high level at a young age with a lot of pressure.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you know, when you're starting out as an actor, like, you don't know what you're doing. And sometimes, you know, some people are great right out of the box. They, you know, they start to do well and they figure it out.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Where they have a sense of who they are, but a lot of times it takes a long time to like figure out how to...


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[Assistant] Do it, you know, and how to be good. I was bad for, I think, a long time. I did a lot of bad auditions. I really was like...


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[Assistant] You know, really, like, just not good enough to get hired until I got hired. But that's why I'm amazed that you guys, like, you have to just, you know, you have to be, by the time, what, you're like 16, 17, you have to be completely committed and be showing enough talent and discipline and all those things to get there. For me, it was,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But I knew pretty, I quit college, I didn't want to stay in college. I was very ambitious and like wanted to be making movies and acting. I was probably too impatient too.


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[Assistant] Yeaah, I'm not as much of a baseball fan anymore.


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[Assistant] Yeaah. But like when I was like 77, 78, those years, I was like going to Yankee Stadium. I was there when Reggie hit three home runs, uh, with my dad. He was storming the field at a piece of right field that I took home that was in my room for like two years.


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[Assistant] Uhm, so I was really into it for a while and then I kind of, I've gone in and out of like sports fandom over the years. Like there were times when I was really into the Knicks and then when I moved to LA, I guess I'm like


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] 1990, something like that. I kind of, I lived in LA for like 20 years and I never became a Lakers fan, but I just was more disconnected from the Knicks, especially, it was actually a really great time for the Knicks in the 90s.


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[Assistant] But I was kind of just like focusing on other stuff. And then when I moved back to New York around 2010, 2011, I was really happy to come back. And like one of the great things about coming back to New York was like, oh, I'm going to get to go to Knicks games.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I mean there were a lot of long, I mean we had Mellow and there was, you know, there were periods of time and, you know, those, those teams but.


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[Assistant] But overall it was like, you know, it's been tough sledding until you guys came along. Yeah. Well, I mean, there's like, there is, there is true, there definitely is like true excitement about the Knicks now. Um, and as you know, like a fan base that's like really so hungry for it.


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[Assistant] And I'm sure it's like all the ups and downs of that for you guys, of like having the pressure, like just like people, the intensity.


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[Assistant] Well, I think they have this emotion, cause I grew up going to Knicks games, right? My dad took me when I was a kid. Uhm, he had these friends, these two guys.


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[Assistant] Freddie Klein and Stan Ossofsky who are these season ticket holder guys who, I think one of them owned the Carnegie Deli.


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[Assistant] You're like classic New York Jewish basketball fans, you know, and they had like eighth row behind the Knicks basket. And so we would go and sit in their seats and they would yell at the refs. They knew all the refs and you know, this was like, I mean, I literally remember meeting Phil Jackson in like 1973 or something and I'm being introduced to him and I was missing a front tooth and he said, Hey, what do you want for Christmas? You two front teeth?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I just always remember that. But I was, so I was like, and I would see them yell at the refs and there was like such, you know, there was like a real connection with the Knicks. Also it was coming off of the championship, 73 championship. Uhm, and so, you know, I always was like connected to the Knicks.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And was, was a fan in the 80s when I was like 15, 16. I was a huge Bernard King fan. Uh, I saw him, I saw him score 50 once and...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, I remember that he had the back to back 50 point games and, you know, he just, he was like, he was the guy for me. And then there were some other, like, lesser known players I was really into.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But like over the years, then when I went to LA and I disconnected when I came back, it's like, you know,


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[Assistant] There's just been, always been a desire to get back to what I think the 70 and the 73 Knicks and that team was. And so,


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[Assistant] You know, it's interesting to me for you guys, because you guys are just like, having to step into that, but then when you start playing well...


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[Assistant] The excitement that's there is palpable, but then there's also the pressure, right?


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[Assistant] Yeah, well that's why you're probably able to do what you do, cause, I mean, cause I think that's what every fan is like thinking when you're watching a game and it comes down to...


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[Assistant] You know, the fourth quarter, those moments, you're just like, oh my, like, you're stuck, cause you think, like, what would I do, how do you deal with that? And obviously, like, did you ever see that movie, uhm, Free Solo, about the guy who free climbs on the rock climber?


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[Assistant] It sounds like something I've always watched. It's a documentary, I think it won best documentary a few years ago. This guy Alex Honnold who just three climbs like El Capitan with no ropes or anything.


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[Assistant] And they did like, they did a scan of his brain and there was like something missing in like his amygdala or something that like he didn't have like the


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[Assistant] That to me I think is what every fan is like always amazed with.


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[Assistant] Just cause it all happens so fast. And that's the other thing when you go to a game in person, it just, everything goes so fast. Like that's what I'm always amazed with. It's like just, it's hap- you guys are playing, like, ehm, is it even faster than college?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, I heard that. He said he wasn't like watching it on TV, he was just like being in it.


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[Assistant] And also to go so fast, I would imagine like you can't be like really, like you have to be going off of your instinct. Where you have to be going off of whatever.


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[Assistant] But I also feel like with watching you a lot, like I was saying like last night, that game, you know, like end of the first half.


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[Assistant] And then was that like, like last night guarding Jason Tatum that's more exhausting?


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[Assistant] Right, and, and, and getting back to like the social media aspect though, like, I've


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[Assistant] You know, if I, like when I have something that I've made or something and it comes out, I'm not, like I stay off of social media because I don't want to like read everybody's comments about my stuff.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But like, as a Knicks fan, like, I'm like having fun there, you know, just, and I read all the insane stuff, and it is ridiculous, cause it's impossible, like,


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[Assistant] The level of scrutiny and the level of reaction to, you know, what you guys are doing, it's like impossible to, you know, if you're really gonna like care about that because everybody has a point of view or an opinion.


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[Assistant] Uhm, but then they're also like, I think the fans, what I learned, cause I never, I don't really like Twitter, and like literally the only thing, if you like look at my Twitter feed, it's like only Nick stuff really, cause I just, it's the only thing I feel comfortable tweeting about really, is like my enthusiasm for the Knicks and for the games, and then all of a sudden I started like,


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[Assistant] You know, doing it while games are happening and, uh, and realize, oh wow, I'm kinda like live tweeting this game.


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[Assistant] And then I, and then I realized, wait a minute, like, there's people on Twitter that, like, are the other Knicks fans that are, like, ex, like, expecting me to check in. You become a Knicks fan. Yeah. And I'm so not a Twitter person. And also, like, I grew up, my dad was like,


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[Assistant] Well I don't feel, I don't feel comfortable doing it honestly cause like, I feel like


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[Assistant] I, maybe it's because of growing up, my dad, whatever, like they're, he always looked at them as like they're, these are people, like I know how hard it is what you guys do.


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[Assistant] And like, of course, every fan out there could never get out on court and do anything like that. So just that appreciation. And it's very easy to get frustrated when you see like a guy missing shots or whatever. And so, and it's very easy to go negative on Twitter, period. You know, people just express themselves in ways that they never would.


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[Assistant] In real life with people. It's the anonymous people too. Of course, you know. The one with no pictures.


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[Assistant] The level, like, I think there are fans out there that really, really love the Knicks and like, and do come from a very positive place and love their team.


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[Assistant] It has to come from a place of like appreciation for like, you guys are human beings.


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[Assistant] That, you know, are doing something that very few people can do at a level. Like just the idea of like having to shoot a foul shot in Madison Square Garden.


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[Assistant] Just pressure, right? Just like, and you have to like do it and kinda like do it at different times in the game when like the whole game could be on the line. But just that level of pressure, you know, 99.999% of people just couldn't even deal with. Even if they, even great players, I mean that's the thing, there's so many great basketball players who can't get to the level of playing in the NBA, probably I'd imagine because of the dealing, being able to deal with that level of scrutiny.


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[Assistant] Yeah, it's insane. I mean, it's, but it's not re, it's not reality to most people. I think it's, right, they're just able to like kind of go, okay, I'm just gonna vent and do my thing, but you know.


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[Assistant] It's not, to me that's not like a real appreciation of like what's actually happening.


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[Assistant] Just not see mean things people say. I mean, I love, you know, I just, I'm sensitive. Like, so I, you know, I, after 30 whatever years of doing what I do, I, you know, you just, you know, the cycle is going to happen. You're going to make your thing. You're going to put it out there. People are either going to like it or not like it.


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[Assistant] You know, go to it or not go to it, critics will have their point of view. Uhm, but it's always the same thing, but yet it's still, for me it's still the same, you know, kind of experience. Like if you're not sensitive enough to, uh,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You have to be sensitive, I think, on a certain level to do what we do, you know, to be in touch with kind of like, you know, being a person, the emotions and all that stuff.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And some people are better at it than others in terms of dealing with the, that part of it. I think I accept it, but I also know like for me, for my process, I love being in process. I love, like right now, like I'm making our show. I love going to work tomorrow, go to work, I'll be directing, you know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'm very happy doing that. Editing, putting it together.


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[Assistant] Uhm, and then finishing it, and then I have the thing that I've worked on. I'm like, okay, this is the, you know, I've done the best I could do with this project, and then it's out in the world, and then people are gonna react the way they're gonna react.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So, I kind of, it's great when people love something. I think sometimes you can get feedback, criticism that can be helpful. But, you know, you have to kind of know at a certain point what works for you in terms of how you kind of go through and do your thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like that, that was, that people responded to.


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[Assistant] I mean, I think for me it was, uh,


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[Assistant] Well, I always had this kind of like two things going on, which was the directing and you know, writing and creating stuff and then acting. And I was kind of doing both together for a while, like when I first started out and I kind of gradually started to get work. I was on Saturday Night Live for like a really short period of time and then


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The first movie I directed was this movie Reality Bites back in like 92 and that was exciting because it was like, oh, I'm directing a movie.


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[Assistant] But I think like the first movie that I was in that people connected with, was there something about Mary?


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[Assistant] Which was like 98 and that was like the first time I was in, I'd already been working for a while and doing my thing, but that was the first movie I was in that people responded to and.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, was, ended up being a big hit. And I think that was when I was like, oh wow, this is like, this is definitely like, I guess I'm, I'm doing okay.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The bathroom creating that. Uhm, and that was, and I remember being at the premiere, my mom was sitting behind me and that scene came up and I was like, oh.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know where the next job is coming from? And then all of a sudden I was like, okay, you know, seems like people are wanting to hire me.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, cause I was trying to create, I love filming and since I was 10 years old I wanted to be a director, but then I also was trying to create my own work.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So like when no one was hiring me, I'd go off and make like a short film or make an audition tape for Saturday Night Live, which got me hired or...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, that's really how, like, I kind of started out and started doing my own thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And really, honestly, when you're making movies, you kind of have to create your own. Like, it's really like, what direction do you want to go in? And I think whether it's writing or collaborating with writers and directing, it's very much yourself, you're, you're creating it on your own. So you have to just figure out what you want to say.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Maybe it's like a little similar to like, if you're in a game where you're like, you want to be in a reactive place where you're not thinking about, for me it's like you've done the work, the preparation work for the character, you know what the scene is, you know the lines, you know what the idea of the scene is.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Where you're supposed to be as a character and then you just want to, for me, I just want to be in the moment of the scene. So it's kind of like trying to figure out a way to get comfortable with like all the cameras and, and you know, the lights and people staring at you and all of that stuff, which you have to kind of let go of and just sort of like somehow try to be


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In the moment and be connected with who you're in the scene with.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And once you're in that, like you're in that and you're connecting, you know, that's all that's there and then you're hopefully...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Reacting to what's being given to you in the circumstances and...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's your job as an actor, is to kind of like deal with all that other stuff and like figure out a way to let it go.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And it's a constant process of trying to get comfortable with that, which I think changes from scene to scene and really where you're at in your life as you go into work.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, for me as a director, that's why I like directing too. It's kind of like trying to help actors get into a place where they can give their best work and allowing them. Every actor has a different process. There's no one way to do it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So just trying to create an environment for the actors that they can.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Really be in the moment and be real and be in that place. So there's no, like I said, there's no rules, you know? Uhm, and that's, that's, that's probably the toughest thing is just kind of getting to the place where you can let everything go and just, and just allow yourself to be in the moment.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah, I mean the director is really like creating the whole experience, you know, and every director does it differently.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you have to really trust that director's vision.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's so subjective, and I wonder if that's like working with a coach where every coach has a different, you know, style, but like it's, it's very subjective. Directing is about having a point of view, so every director is going to have a, like you look at a scene and go, well I would have shot it this way, but


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This director is directing it, so I want to be a part of the way they see it because I'm trying to help them realize what they want.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's like, it's almost like you don't want to put your point of view onto what they're doing and you just want to kind of be there for them as an actor to help support their vision. And some directors are really great talking to actors. Other directors don't even talk to the actors and they just put the camera somewhere and they let you do your thing and that's part of their process is they want you to just do your thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Some directors do 50 takes, like literally 50 takes of a scene. Some directors will do like 2 takes, like, and Eastwood's known for like doing like 1 or 2 takes. Uhm, but I've worked with directors who do 50 takes too, and it's...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, and not telling you what they want. And that's because they just want to let something happen. So, I'm curious what it's like for you guys, uh, if I can change the subject. Playing, like, playing for TIBS because...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right, and you've known him, like, since you were a kid, right? For way too long.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The interesting thing to me is like now because players with social media and podcasts like


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Kind of get, sometimes get a sense of players and what they're like, but like the last bastion of mystery are the coaches. Cause you know, cause Tibbs isn't like tweeting and he's not doing a podcast. So, you know, you look at that guy, I'm like fascinated like, cause he's so, it's so,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He's so intense on the sidelines during the games. And it's like one of my most favorite things is just like reading his lips during games.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But does it, but you have to figure out how to, I mean, you know, known him, but like it's different playing for him than playing for, I don't know, who was coaching Dallas when he was Rick Carlisle? Carlisle and Jason Kidd. Right.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But have you had it like with coaches where the coach doesn't get you? Like the coach, and you have to kind of figure out how to- I've yet to be understood by a coach. Right.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But Tibbs, but Tibbs gets you, he gets you in that, you're in the rotation. You know what I mean? Like, I feel like it-


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He, from the outside it seems like either you're in the rotation or you're not in the rotation. So the players that he, you know, wants to put in the rotation are the ones that are...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But it does seem like watching the team, that everybody does seem to understand that, you know? Like when you watch what you're doing, because I don't know, I just feel like getting back to the idea of the emotional connection that fans have with the players, and I do think New York fans are really, you know, they're really connected.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What's going on? That they feel it. I was telling you that earlier, that they feel it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] When somebody's like really working hard, right? They really feel it like when you're, and a lot of times you're put in the position like when you've been shorthanded of having to do like a lot of different things, right? In terms of just, and


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like, but yet it always feels to me like everybody kind of knows, like you know what your job is on the team and when you're shorthanded you know what you have to do and I know it just feels to me like you guys are kind of in sync that way.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah, and even having to deal with like, new personnel and the trades and stuff, it feels like...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Play hard. And you'll shoot the three when you need to. You're not afraid to shoot the three. I feel like you shoot a lot of threes that need to be shot.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right, but I feel like that changes, like that's such a tough decision a lot of the time, because for what you're saying, like, you know, sometimes it is the right thing to do when


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Whoever's on the floor, they need, you know, we need a, like open shot, go for it, you know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But I do, yeaah, that's what I feel like people pick up on. It's like they, I always feel like that's what you're doing. Like trying to suss out in the moment what, what is needed.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know? Especially at a time now when it's like the team is obviously dealing with a lot of...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Injuries, so, but it always feels like you guys are, I don't know, as a fan, like, I always feel like you guys are always, like I was saying that game last night, you're always putting everything into it, and I think that's what fans appreciate, is like when you just feel like the players are just like totally just giving their all, and are smart too, and, you know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, no, that's, you definitely get that and you, and you feel like you guys are just like, have a goal.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you're serious about it, but you also have chemistry and I don't know, there's like a, it's an interesting thing because like back in the day, we didn't have that interaction with the players. And I feel like in terms of just like getting a sense of their personalities and who they are. And I feel like that really comes through now more. Uhm, and it didn't used to be like that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, it's also just very accessible, like, cause I feel like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You guys have this quality of like, an underdog team too, that never quite gets the respect that they deserve.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And the fans feel that, like the fans are so on, you know, so with you that way. We're like, come on, these guys, you know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And, and that's been a thing, a thing this season, I think, with you, you know? It's like, this guy, come on, this guy's 1A. And it's like, you know, right? But like, when somebody says something like that, like, it just lights up because people are like, so behind, you know, what you guys are doing, so.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And how much do you guys engage with that on a day to day basis?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I mean, you know, for me, like, people I'm a fan of that I've worked with are Robert De Niro, for sure. Cause just, I grew up watching his movies and being able to work with him was pretty exciting. Uhm, Will Ferrell.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'll drink a water. Yeah, I mean, Vince, like funny Vince Vaughn, there's no one, you know, it's just like such a unique tone to what he does.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah, I mean, Will Owen Wilson, you know, one of my best friends, so, he just makes me laugh. Uh, how many people is that?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, like, just he's so, I think he's just amazing, so funny, he's a great guy, most loyal guy in the world, uh, you know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Just loves what he does, and you know, anytime I'm with him, I'm enjoying that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah, I mean I just did a little thing in Anchorman, but I was yeaah, I was doing a lot of movies back then.