[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He was like straight up at 12 years old, like drawing inverted crosses on things. Which to me, I'm pretty sure, and like if you hear his background a little bit, you can hear he was into like metal music, like Ozzy Osbourne and shit. That was on CD covers. Yeah. So I don't think that was like really,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] To be honest, I don't think that was an indicator of what he was capable of later in life. I think it was like, he liked the music, he saw the imagery, that's probably what everybody's like. He was a Satanist when he was 12.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But then we have some, some stuff that points to him actually being a Satanist when he was younger. Such as? Like I said, he was intrigued by like dark shit at a pretty young age, but he went bad with it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like he was into dark shit when he was younger. So of course this was gonna happen. No one cares. Right. Like he was into metal and all the things that they tried to point to in the West Memphis Three case, like they wore black. He did this.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But he was more interested not like, you look at the West Memphis 3 case for example, it's just like a really good example of the satanic panic kind of thing. Oh yeah. Which by the way, quick side note, anybody watching Stranger Things,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Thank you for telling me that Eddie's character is based off of Damien from the West Memphis Three because holy shit, I can't watch it the same anymore. Like I was already invested, but now I'm like, I loved Eddie. And I was like, now I feel validated for loving Eddie. I didn't realize that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's great, everybody go watch Stranger Things if you hadn't, and to everybody who's been tagging me telling me about Eddie's character being connected to that, thank you, cause I had no idea. Very cool. And I am watching it in a whole different light now.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But yea, go look at that. So, so yea, they kinda pointed, I look at the West Memphis 3 cases like, those were kids that sure, maybe they got in a little trouble in their like tiny little, you know, Arkansas town where you get in trouble for everything.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But they weren't like hurting people, they weren't killing people, they weren't sacrificing animals, they were wearing black and listening to metal. Right. Like that's all, and they were into like horror movies, and they got pegged as like satanists.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But it seems like Mark Goodwin when he was younger, he wasn't into all that kind of side of it. The music, the horror movies, the aesthetic, all that stuff.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He really wanted to gain power over people. Like he wanted Satan's power, he wanted to sell his soul. Yea, like he was interested in the dark shit that like, the satanic panic like tries to latch onto. He was not into it for like aesthetic.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, he had read a lot of books about satanic worship and he had formed his own like meathead ideas that like ritual sacrifices and murder.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] First of all, that wow, you're 15. Second of all, that is the stupidest name for a cult I have ever heard in my life. It is so on the fucking nose. Right, like be different. So on the nose. Oh hey, we're Satan's disciples. I know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If Satan was in the room, he'd be like, that's what you came up with? That's all you got?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's hilarious. It explains exactly what we're all about. And it's creative. And it's scary.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It is. Yeah, I get it. But yeah, Satan's disciples, no. No, thank you. Uhm, so this little cult had, it started off with about six people between the ages of 12, he was 15 by the way. Weird. Between the ages of 12 and 35. The fuck? Yeah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Not sure why a 35 year old was hanging out with 12 year olds and 15 year olds.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well apparently they would meet and perform rituals in old barns and abandoned cemeteries and in forests, anywhere that's spooky-ooky and seems right on the nose for a Satanist cult.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, there's probably a zillion other ones. They probably don't really even do so, to be quite honest. Right, well that's the thing. Rituals are probably not really part of it, to be quite honest, but I'm not sure. It just seems very like...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's, it's all, we talk about this all the time, that like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know, every religion that like gets that like stereotype placed on them of what people think that religion is, and Satanism is no different.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And it's usually not right. Like not true, not correct. It's just what is put out there in the media or in, you know, popular culture, whatever. Satanism just happens to have gotten like a real bad rap for like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Ever. It's just like what people think it is. It's too many generalizations. It is. We generalize too many things in general. General.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] See how meta that was? We are generalizing too much in general. I feel like it's just like the world is generalizing people and things and ideas. Generalizing is losing all meaning in my head. In general. It really is. I won't get too far into that. Stop it. Don't worry.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But either way, they're doing all these rituals, ba ba ba. Goodwin was obviously the leader and would act like the high priest of the cults. Oh, he was so fancy. He loves his power and authority. Now the group would sacrifice animals for the rituals. Oh, fuck off. More than once a week, according to this. Jesus.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now for example, in this trigger warning for Ash too, to be quite honest.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I am going to talk, I'm not going to go into detail, don't worry, but I'm just going to mention an animal that was killed here. So trigger warning.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] For example, one of the rituals included killing a cat and then putting its blood into fancy goblets and they all drank it to summon demons to do their bidding.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Thank you, all of the above. Yeah, like get out of here.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I never understand this like we're trying to summon demons to do our bidding.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'm not summoning anybody to do my shit for me. No you're not. I could never hand over-


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Control to a demon for them to do what I need. I'll get it done.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But no, they are stupid and they want, you know, demons to come out and do shit for them, which is just like, okay.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now Goodwin also said that members of the cult wore black robes because, meow, metal. Yeah. Uh, but the women in the group were not allowed to wear robes. Lame. They had to wear black lingerie or had to be just naked.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Fuck right off with that. That's what I'm saying. Like, Mark, get the fuck out of here.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now they later said, weirdly, they had a lot of trouble getting women to join the group. I wonder why. I can't imagine why.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They were like, yeah, women are just like a little scard of satanism. No, I think we're just like done with being objectified. Like bro, I think it's you and your weird band of predators that scared them off and not the satanism part, but like, okay. Whatever you want to think. Sure.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Anyways, Goodwin said that there would always be a huge orgy and everyone would dance around while the satanic chorus sang.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I believe it. For sure. I think all of that happened. Absolutely. For sure. Now Goodwin said that he actually left the satanic disciples at one point.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, we all agree, Mark. But you said he had killed other people before? No, that was Jimmy. Oh, okay.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But Mark ends up being part of like a very bad thing where someone dies, and it's like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Mark, where was that energy in 1991? Where was that?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He's a conundrum. Now, the brothers, Keith and David Lawrence are up next, I'll tell you about them. Keith Lawrence was a Satanist for a while, but his brother David, who was three years older than him, was not at all.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] David tried to say that that, you know, heavy metal was what brought Keith into Satanism. That was his whole thing, because once again,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's how this all starts. Pop culture made me do it. Pop culture made me do it. It's not me being a shitty person. Uh, but you know, I'm gonna call bullshit on that. Apparently though, Keith did take music very seriously and really


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Probably was influenced because of his own mind and mind and not the actual lyrics or music of himself. He just liked music, so of course. He was also big into reading tons of book about Satan, tons of book.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Just tons of books about Satan. That, you know, many books.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He read tons of books about Satanism and he really dove head first into it once he started. So he just got really interested in it, which would be fine if he just got interested in it, wanted to learn about it, wanted to do whatever.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But David said that once Keith got really into this, his personality changed drastically.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He said he became a more hateful, more aggressive person. He said he hated everybody and everything around him, and he would do things like simply to get people upset. He liked upsetting people.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You, you seem like you're making very good choices, so I'm gonna go ahead and go with you on this. Yeah, your threats have changed my, my, my mind. So as you can see, Keith is having some issues with the whole Satanism thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] His person- I don't think it has anything to do with Satanism to be quite honest. I think it has to do with Keith being like a problem child.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And David, his brother, did love his brother a lot, even though he didn't understand the Satanism thing, and he had chased him around this fucking kitchen with a kitchen knife.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, David loved his brother and he did spend up, like, when he came back from school, he spent a lot of time with him. He didn't stop hanging out with him.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, like keep him on the straight and narrow, and he was quoted as saying that he hung around with Keith.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And this is like both funny and sad, the way he quotes this. He said he hung around with Keith the most because he was the only member of his family to treat him with respect. David said that, but then he was quoted as saying, quote, a satanic brother.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So Keith and David met Mark Goodwin.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And they, yeaah, they came into each other's lives. They bonded, they ended up working together, so that's how they met. Okay. Uhm, and they immediately bonded over Satanism and Keith and Goodwin actually, cause remember Keith is the brother that's bonding over Satanism.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] David just kinda goes along with his brother. He's like, trying to support it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And they said quote, if we're gonna do this, let's do it to the full extent and sign with our souls. That's what they were quoted as saying later of like, that's why we did it. Okay. They would do seances and rituals and all other manner of hokey shit that they believed was part of this whole thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I just love that they're like, let's, if we're gonna do it, let's do it right, let's sign with our souls, man. And I'm like, are you supposed to have one?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Give our souls to Satan. But apparently they had them and then they signed with their souls. So that's why they are like blood brothers now. It's really a lot. And I also wonder like, did this happen in front of David? Was David just standing there being like, cool.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Good luck, I guess. I wonder how he felt about this whole shebang. Probably wasn't psyched. So now the Lawrence Brothers and Goodwin.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Are both at odds with their own respective families because


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They're getting worse and worse, like they're not being, they're not being good boys, okay, and they're having a lot of problems with their parents and their families. They're not keeping it in check. Yeah, and they just want to keep worshipping the devil, but they need, they need to get like more steady jobs because they were just taking like jobs every which way.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Because you know, the devil may be totally giving them all the power in the universe and shit, but he's not going to spot them a 20 for rent. So they decided to get jobs together with this traveling.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like we also need to buy food and pay rent, so like, let's do this together. What is the creepiest job we could all take together? Carnival. It is. They really know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So while doing this, they decided they wanted to start a brand new cult, because...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Cults. Okay. So they recruited Jimmy Lee Penick in Brownstown because he was working the carnival circuit. So this is just a bunch of carnies ready to stamp some pentagrams on their heads and have an orgy for Satan.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, so yeaah, you know, just a bunch of carnies got together and they were like, Satan? Yeaah? Okay, cult time. So during all of this, they're working at the carnival.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yep. Okay. And Tony is unfortunately our victim here. Oh no. Tony was only 21 at the time.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He was interested in Satanism. He was looking for dudes to hang out with. He was kinda like marching to the beat of his own drum. He just wanted like bros to dude out with. So,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] His name was William Anthony Tony Ault. Like I said, he was born July 2nd, 1970 in a small town, in the small town of Rochester, Indiana.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Alright, so there you go, Tony. Mhm, I get it. And Tony, he just feels like he was like a guy who just like needed...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He just needed like the right group to take him in, you know? His parents were Shirley and Gerald.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They divorced at one point, but uhm, the mother Shirley had remarried Robert Ault and that's where he took his last name. He had a sister Angela and a brother Charles. He was into like weird shit. He was just like into the occult. He was interested in it. He really, I think it was just one of those things where it's like, you know, this is almost like it probably to him.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Looked at first, like, you know, like just like something like D&D. Something that they're into, they get together, they do it. Yeaah. It's something that bonds them together. It's a built in group of friends. You're all interested in weird dark shit.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now, he had started working for the poor, uh, the Poor John's Carnival Company, which is the one that they all found themselves working for at one point. Okay. Cause again, it's always carnival season somewhere, so they were, they were moving around to a bunch of them, but they ended up at this one.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So he met them in September of 1991 on DeKalb County Fairgrounds and again, he was only 21 years old. A baby. A baby.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So he expressed to them, he heard them talking, he like kinda got to know them a little bit, and he expressed to them that he was like, you know, I would like to join your cult.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Sounds kinda fun. He was very interested in this stuff, and also, again, he was like, I really just want some friends to hang with, so like, can I join?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And you know, we all want that. Of course. We all want that. But for some reason, they were not interested in him becoming part of the cult. Really?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, you know what, he was like a really great guy, and like, we shouldn't have done what we did.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So it's like they admit that this is like a really good guy and I do wonder if the- initially they were like, yeah you don't belong because you're actually a like good person and we're shitty people. Okay.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You, we don't want you here because we don't want to hang out with a good person. I wonder if that's part of it. They could tell he was a good person. Probably. So in September, again, he's like, he's like, I want to join your call. They're like, no, no.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And he's like, come on, like I want, I want to join your cult. Yeah, like just let me join. So in September, he approaches them and tells them, you know, I want to be part of everything. They keep telling them no. And the thing is,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He finally was like, well listen, uh, I know something. I know something pretty big.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay. He knew something that could take these fuckers down. Oh, uh oh. And he decided this was his end to the cult.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which is not great. So somehow he knew that in August of that same year.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] An 18 year old guy named Andrew Lee Wright was murdered in Ohio by having his throat slit. Jesus. He was murdered in an Ohio field and his body was dumped on the turnpike. He was also a carnival worker, this guy.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Apparently Andrew had been killed because he had been speaking about Penick committing another crime in Ohio before that. Uh oh. Well.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He also knew that this is what Tony knew. Tony was like, I know that someone by the name of Keith Lawrence.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And someone by the name of Jimmy Penick are responsible for this murder of Andrew Lee Wright.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay. This is a bad plan from all sides. Unfortunately, like any way you turn this puzzle,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's not gonna, it's not gonna work. It's wrong. Wrong answers everywhere, like.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He seems like he was desperate. He seems like he desperately just wanted to be in a group. Mhm.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] When this kind of thing is never a good way to get somebody to, to let you into a group or to like, you don't want to hang out with these people. No, you definitely don't. And I don't think Tony truly wanted to either. I think he just wanted a group and he didn't know how bad these guys were. I really don't.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So of course at first they're like, fine, you can be part of the group.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But there's like a huge initiation process and there's a ritual and there's probably, you know, some like orgy involved and you have to make sure you don't tell anyone about this. Okay. Because shit's about to get real.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So don't tell anyone that you are becoming part of this cult. Don't even tell people that this cult exists. That's the only way that you're ever going to become one of us. And he was like, okay.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, he's like, I don't want to talk about it anyway. So September 25th, 1991, they asked a friend of the cult.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which is like a friend of the pod, but really scary, I would assume. Cause like literally it's like friend of the cult. Uhm, this woman's name was Brenda Ferguson to help them with this whole thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Of course they didn't really tell her what they were doing. That's the thing. They weren't like, hey Brenda, we want to do something terrible to this guy. Can you help us out?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They said that they were initiating Tony into their satanic church, and that they needed her help to scope out a really good secluded place that has like satanic vibes, but also might be really good for a picture after.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It had to be a mix of broken down cemetery and picturesque view.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know? Like that's what they were looking at. Not an easy task. Beautifully said. But you know what, who better than Brenda to do this? I trust Brenda for that. Who doesn't? So everybody can trust a Brenda. So the carnival is shutting down for the day. All the rides are over, the lights are slowly turning off, the creeps are slinking out of their booths to do all manner of dark shit.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'm totally kidding. They were probably just completely normal people who are just going home after a hard day's work. Yeah, they're definitely just going home for a beer. That's all what we just pictured, but like in reality they were all just like, wow.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Great, great job everybody, see you tomorrow. Now, except for these assholes. These were the ones slinking off to do some bad shit. So now everything's over, they work their hard day, Brenda picks them all up in her car, she picks up Jimmy, Mark, Keith, David, and Tony.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So Brenda had found the perfect place. She had done her job.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It was the secluded farm outside of Auburn, um, Auburn Farms. And farms are perfect for a ritual. Oh, of course. They're all like, this is what we need, they're spooky, but you know, they're necessary, they can, they can be picturesque, they've got everything. And they're super secluded usually.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's the thing, and I feel bad because Brenda did a good job with the location if it was what they were planning on doing, which was some like spooky, spooky ritual not involving any kind of sacrifice or anything like she'd done, she'd found a great location for that. And I feel bad because I think she thought


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That she was just setting them up for a really great ritual that evening. And then, so she just left and dropped them off. Yeah, thought nothing of it. And they all said she didn't know. They didn't tell her anything. They told her, initiating Tony. It's gonna be fun.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So they get in there and they have Tony lie down on the door that they have makeshifted into a satanic altar.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Once he lay on the door slash altar, they tied him up and they gagged him with a towel. It like bothers me. I'm like, at what point did he realize? I know. Like I thought about it and I was like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So it begins with Keith reading some kind of satanic spell or prayer. Who knows? Like these assholes probably just made this shit up. Of course. So this is happening and everything just kinda seems weird, but not yet completely violent. It's just weird.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And then Jimmy just whips out Keith's knife and slices from Tony's neck to his groin.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And we are talking a deep cut, like close to the Y-shaped incision that you prepare an autopsy with.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah. That takes force. Of course. Trust me, that takes force. So now that they have sliced, he's basically been sliced open. He's been eviscerated at this point.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Goodwin and the Lawrence brothers just start putting inverted crosses, like cutting them into his upper torso and abdomen.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They also just slice into him, like all over the place, and he's alive for all of this. He was still alive.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So now he is lying here bound and gagged and bleeding and sliced open and Jimmy Penick leans down into his face and asks Tony if he is ready to die. What?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Tony answered and Jimmy's response was to slice open his throat. Oh.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And he said he answered me, but I don't think he ever said what the answer was. But he said, I'm assuming it was no.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It happened so fast and the fact that he was saying he answered me is like he was alive for all of that until the very end.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, cause it's just he had, no one could ever conceive of this happening. Never. No one. Never. And that's why I truly believe


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That Tony didn't think that that maybe thought those rumors of, you know, Keith and Jimmy being murderers was, were just like rumors because they were in a satanic cult and all that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And it really does break my heart. Now they weren't done.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] After they've slit open his throat and are satisfied that he is dead, Goodwin, Keith, uhm, Lor- Keith Lawrence and Jimmy all help each other cut off Tony's head. Yeah. And they dismember him.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They cut off his hands and then they attempted to burn the dismembered pieces of his body.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They took all the remains after this and they buried them in a shallow grave in a nearby field, uh, that was like near the site of the murder. Then they just called Brenda and had her pick them up.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And here I'm wondering about what Brenda thought about them being minus one member here.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So here's the thing, I don't know about Brenda.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I don't know what and that's why I'm not gonna sit here and like pretend to know about Brenda or what she knew or what not. I know that they claim that they didn't tell her anything.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And I know that she was really not brought into this after this.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But I'm still like, Brenda, did you ask where Tony was? I mean, I would ask, maybe am I detail oriented? I don't know if I would just be like, well, I came here.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's true. That's why I don't want to like say either way with Brenda. I, obviously it makes you question, but you have no idea. And I don't want to, who knows who Brenda is.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now either way, they stopped at an Arby's and had food.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I don't either. That's the thing. It's like, that's what kills me. People love these people.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now, what's crazy too is they just kept working the carnival.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Cause nobody was, no, nothing happened. And actually ended up driving down to Florida at one point to get winter carnival jobs, because remember the carnival is in season everywhere. And they did so in Keith's van, which he called rigor mortis.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's so fucking lame. You guys are the lamest. The lamest fucks. They returned home at the end of the year, and luckily, by December,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] People at art, there was rumblings about what happened to Tony. He was missing. People were already saying, you know, I, he hung around these guys. As we know about these guys.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Keith Goodwin's own dad called police and told them that he had something to say. That's a good dad right there. He told them his son had described to him that he witnessed a murder that was part of a ritual satanic sacrifice. My god, that poor man too. Yea, having to do that. I'd be like, oh great, that's my son, that's what he does. Yea, I'd be like great.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now, Goodwin was charged with conspiracy to commit murder. Jimmy Penick was charged with aggravated murder. He basically just admitted the entire thing outright. He was like, yep.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I did it. Goodwin admitted that he had witnessed the entire thing and had lightly participated.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You are, exactly, you are fully part of that. Yup. And it's like, and you did nothing afterwards to alert anybody. Then you are fully part of that. Like Tony's body just was out there rotting for months because you didn't tell anybody about it. Consider yourself a murderer. Yeah, you piece of shit.


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[Assistant] Right, I know they actually got to have a last vacation. That makes me so angry. Now during the trial, they admitted that Keith had actually tried to cut Tony's heart out. What? Yeah, that came out. So Keith being like, I lightly participated. Yeah, please. Not a ton.


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[Assistant] Like he didn't know, or that wasn't even him. It was Goodwin who said that he lightly participated. But Keith, one of the brothers, he's, he just comes home from the Bahamas and was like, what? I don't, I didn't do anything. And they're like, no, he actually tried to cut his heart out. Like, good try.


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[Assistant] Now Goodwin and David Lawrence decided that they were going to find religion in jail. Because they think it helps.


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[Assistant] And David Lawrence actually said if he went to prison that Jesus would just freeze his soul because no man can lock that down. Yeah. Spoiler alert. That doesn't happen.


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[Assistant] So, and he said though that he regretted the whole thing because quote, that boy Tony had the right to live.


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[Assistant] And Mark Goodwin actually apologized to Shirley, Tony's mother. But she said, get fucked. Good.


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[Assistant] He said to her, Mrs. Givens, I never really knew your son. Whatever I know, I do know he was a good-hearted person. I am very ashamed of what I did to your son. And she actually yelled at him, you damn well should be. What chance does he have now? What am I supposed to feel? Sorry for you? You never should have done it.


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[Assistant] Very cool. The little you knew about him was that he was a great person.


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[Assistant] And that's just, and that's all you knew when you still decided to do this. That's adding insult to injury. It truly is.


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[Assistant] David also said that he blamed his brother, Keith, completely. And he regretted hanging out with him so much. And he said even if he had gotten out of this whole thing, he would have never spoken to him again.


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[Assistant] Jimmy Penick was 25 at the time and he ended up getting 60 years in prison. Good. He pled guilty to avoid trial and possibly the death penalty.


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[Assistant] Now he had a lot of like aggravating factors in his sentencing that were very interesting to read and I just want to tell you a couple. An aggravating factor in his sentencing was the fact that he had done it before.


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[Assistant] Because previously in August of 1991, he murdered a man in Fulton County, Iowa, cutting, also cutting his throat with a knife. So it was also the same exact way that he murdered Tony. How did he get away with that? I don't know. That's what's so crazy.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In the court documents as well, it stated that if his sentence was reduced in any way, it would quote, depreciate from the seriousness of all of this most serious classification of crimes in Indiana. Perhaps the most heinous crime ever committed in DeKalb County, Indiana.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They said that quote, the death of the victim at the hands of the defendant, Jimmy Lee Penick, was painful and torturous to the victim. And that quote, later on in the day of the murder, defendant Jimmy Lee Penick knowingly ate food purchased with money stolen from the deceased victim.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And then they reference also the planning of it, like they obviously had planned this out completely and the complete lack of remorse that was also considered.


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[Assistant] Yes, so the court found that infliction of grave injury and pain over an extended period of time is sufficient to support an aggravating factor.


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[Assistant] Now what's interesting about this, remember we're involving torture here, like pain and torture, they used a precedent for this, and this precedent was Loveless vs. The State, 1994.


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[Assistant] This is precedent set in the case of Shanda Sherr's horrific torture and murder in 1994. Now Melinda Loveless is the defendant stated there.


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[Assistant] That is wild. Cause remember this trial happened like after the Shanda Sharrett case happened. Right, right. So, Penick, like, cause the trial happened like way later than the murder is what I'm saying. Of course. Now, Penick says quote, and this is what the court said, quote, Penick's own words describe how the victim's chest and abdomen were cut open.


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[Assistant] How Goodwin tried to cut out the victim's heart before he died and how the victim remained conscious throughout this and responded to questions from the defendant.


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[Assistant] Only after defendants slit the victim's neck did the torture end.


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[Assistant] There's sufficient evidence on the record to support this aggravator. So they were like, your own fucking defendant, like, sealed his fate there. He told us everything. So what are you trying to do?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now they also tried to get rid of the aggravating factor that used the dismemberment and concealment of the body. Panic's team argued that dismemberment and concealment are basically the same thing, they're both done for the same purpose. To conceal. Okay. Yeah.


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[Assistant] But the court was like, oh, no, you idiots. They said, quote, Furthermore, we do not believe that these are the same factors, although removing and burning the hands may have been done to conceal the identity of the victim. And get ready.


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[Assistant] Removal of the head had nothing to do with this. Defendant himself stated that the head was removed in order for Keith Lawrence to give the skull to a friend.


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[Assistant] No. Yes. Found that buried in a court transcript. It was never repeated in any newspaper.


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[Assistant] Fucking Jimmy Penick literally told the court, it is on record, that they took Tony's head off so Keith Lawrence could give the fucking skull to a friend. That's beyond. That is beyond.


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[Assistant] Beyond any kind of words that I can ever conjure right now, like I'm like,


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[Assistant] And you are sitting, and for his defense team to be sitting here trying, I'm like, honeys, hang up the towel. Yeah. Hang up the towel.


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[Assistant] Now Keith at the time was 20 years old. He got 50 years in prison with 20 suspended years for conspiracy to commit murder. He actually got out of prison in 2004.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And in 2006 he went back to jail for 180 days for public intoxication and then apparently was being held on bond for charges of criminal confinement and captivity.


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[Assistant] Now Mark Goodwin pled guilty to assisting a criminal and battery by means of a deadly weapon and he got eight years. That's bullshit. Thank you. Both of those.


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[Assistant] Thank you. So bullshit. And insulting. Very insulting. Like Tony's family, can you imagine? I would have been outraged. Eight years.


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[Assistant] And when he was in jail, when Mark Goodwin was in jail, he also found religion and said, everyone should be careful of the lure of Satanism and literally said, quote, look at William Alt. He was a Satanist and he didn't make it because you killed him.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Because you murdered him. It had nothing to do with him being a Satanist. You murdered him. Because you're a murderer. Because you're a torturer.


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[Assistant] And then he admitted his own fault in the other murder that started this entire thing. He said quote, I regret it because that boy had the right to live. So did Andrew.


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[Assistant] Their families put time, love, and money into those guys, and now there's no more of them. Because of you. Thank you.


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[Assistant] Cause it's like no, Tony's family just loved him. Right. Andrew's family loved him. It has nothing to do with I put time, money and all this into someone and now they got murdered and that's annoying to me. No, it's that they cared about them. It's that they are not here anymore to hug, to talk to, to joke with.


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[Assistant] Like murder is just like, oops, sorry that I ran over a nail with your car and I popped the tire. Like that's a bummer. That was a great car. And it's like, no, this is a person that you


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Ceremoniously tortured and killed.


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[Assistant] Yeah, it truly is. Like, he treats them like it's a possession. This whole thing is just a possession and not human beings that actually were taken from their families and loved ones. It's devastating. It's a really, like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It reminded me of the Fall River cult, like how gnarly that got and how just like wow, like the chaos in that.


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[Assistant] But these guys all admitted it. They all admitted to being there. A couple of them obviously tried to take themselves, like bring themselves into a like outer shell there and be like, I was just there, I didn't touch them.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But they all know what they did. Of course they did. And they all inflicted some kind of injury on Tony, and they all deserve to be in prison forever, but unfortunately.


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[Assistant] Some of them only got eight years. Yeah, like the Lawrence brothers there and Mark Goodwin, they didn't get nearly enough.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There's this TikTok going around and it's all of the contestants. They force the contestants to like scream their country name. And there's some of them that you can tell are just like nod at like Denmark is like Denmark. Like it's like, get out of here. Like they're not happy about it. And it's hard to scream. I just want to preface this. It's hard to scream daintily. So, but it gets to France.


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[Assistant] But it'll make you laugh, uhm, and you need that. And you need that. We all need that.


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[Assistant] It's about to get real. Yeah. No, we need it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Needed to get it, we needed France to get us through that. Sorry, Drew's just texting me restaurant names cause it's like 9 o'clock at night and none of us have cooked dinner. No. He's literally just going Boston Market, Chipotle, Panera. I'm like, can you calm down?


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[Assistant] A really, really sad case. It's one of those ones that starts and then


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[Assistant] I mean, oh yea, you've been. And I love Canadians. I love Canadians too. We got Johnny and Tyler. Yep. And Mikey. We got Jordan. We got Mikey. Linz. Linz isn't like full-blown Canadian, but her family is Canadian. So does that mean that Mikey's not full-blown Canadian? There's Canadian in there. I said flow. Flow-blow. Are you flow-blown Canadian? You know what? Canadians.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's another one. Another good TikTok. Alright, shut up Ash. We're out of a place of TikTok. It is. Alright, so on the evening of May 6th, 2013, Tim Bosma left his Ancaster home with two men who simply wanted to test drive the truck that he'd been advertising, uh, for sale online.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] As Tim walked out the door, he turned around and told his wife Charlene he'd be right back.


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[Assistant] But that was the last time that Charlene or anybody else would see Tim alive.


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[Assistant] Really fucked up. In a pretty short time frame, the authorities were able to apprehend Dellen, better known as Del Millard, and his henchmen, Mark Smitch, the men responsible for Bosmo's death.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] At first, Tim's murder seemed pretty straightforward. Authorities felt like this was kind of like a thrill kill, but the deeper and deeper that they dug into Millard and Smitch's relationship and separate histories, the more they realized that they weren't dealing with like an impulsive one-off murder.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Instead, they realized that this case was rooted in a full blown sinister plan that began well before Tim Bosmo's murder. Jeez. And...


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[Assistant] But first let's head back to the beginning of this. So in early May of 2013, Tim Bosma's wife Charlene posted an ad on, I think it's Kijiji.com on behalf of her husband who wanted to sell his truck. His truck was a black 2007 Dodge Power Ram.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And by the way, um, Kijiji, I think it is pretty much like the Canadian version of Craigslist. Oh, okay. But the truck had become a nuisance for the young family. It weighed over three tons and because of its size and requirement for diesel gas and like a shit ton of diesel gas,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Where it did end up getting some views, but it didn't seem like it was getting like actual interest.


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[Assistant] And Tim was starting to get frustrated with this entire process and the lack of interest. He was really just about to give up on selling his truck.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But then he got a message from somebody with a seemingly genuine interest. Me too.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This potential buyer didn't give much information in his message, but he did seem interested and he did say that he was willing to drive a very long distance, uhm, about 100 kilometers or 62 miles.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] From Toronto to the Bosma's home, like I said, in semi-rural Ancaster. If you're not familiar with this area, Ancaster is an Ontario suburb which is like an hour outside of Toronto.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So Tim and the prospective buyer agreed to meet on the evening of May 6th. Tim really wanted to make sure that the truck was in tip top condition. He was ready to sell this thing and he was really hoping that this would be his chance.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So to prep for the meeting, he washed the truck, he waxed it, he deep cleaned the interior, he vacuumed it out, like he went to town on this thing, just to make it look as good as possible. Every time I write about this truck, I can't help but get there's something about a truck out of my head. I don't even know what that is. It's like a country song. Oh. Yeah.


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[Assistant] Thanks! So kind, Prince. I'm trying, Prince. On the morning of the 6th, though, Tim hadn't heard from the previously, or seemingly previously interested buyer.


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[Assistant] And he was getting nervous about this sale falling through the cracks. He's like, Jesus Christ, like there's barely been any interest in how this is going to fall through the cracks. So he was like, I'm not going to give up yet. He sent a message to the guy saying, good morning. It's Tim. I'm working in Hamilton today. If you will, if you want to meet, or do you still want to meet at my house tonight for 7pm?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But then the potential buyer finally called or messaged a little before 7.30. I think he called to say that he was on his way and he should be arriving to the household within the hour.


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[Assistant] I hate when someone says they're gonna be somewhere at a certain time and then they're not there at a certain time. That makes me...


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[Assistant] Fucking crazy. You get ten minutes. Yeah. Ten minutes. Honestly, I get annoyed after like three. Accurate. Yeah. Can confirm.


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[Assistant] Uhm, but the buyer ended up being a guy in his mid-twenties and he did not arrive within the hour that he said he was going to. But he finally did arrive a little after 9pm. Oh, fuck him.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And he had another young man with him who was also in his mid-twenties.


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[Assistant] Tim's wife Charlene immediately thought it was strange that the two men showed up on foot.


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[Assistant] Yeah. They said they were willing, this one of them said he was willing to make this like really long drive, but then showed up on foot. Yeah, I don't like that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And again, they really wanted to sell this truck, like that's really their main interest here. This hurts my heart.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So the three men made small talk for a few minutes, Tim gave them all the information on the truck, and before leaving the house for a test drive, he turned around to his wife and he said, I'll be right back. And that was just a little before 9.30. PM.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So Charlene, his wife, figured this would be a quick thing, just like a short trip, go down some local roads, take it on the highway, see if it's making any noises, you know the gist. So when Tim didn't return after an hour, she called his cell phone, but didn't end up getting an answer.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] She was slightly concerned, but she reminded herself that Tim was hardly a small guy. He was in really good shape, so he could certainly take care of himself if the situation where he needed to arise. Yeah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So she, that kind of soothed her soul a little bit, but then more and more time went by and she called one more time and again got no more answer. And as the evening went on, she still had heard absolutely nothing and she started to panic. And she's got a two year old at home. Oh, I'd be losing it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, so she eventually decides it's time to call the police. Like I'm not being crazy here, something clearly went wrong. Absolutely. So the next day, still no Tim.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And the Hamilton police service ended up releasing a statement to the press at 8am that morning regarding Tim's disappearance. The statement was brief, it just said 32 year old Bosma had gone missing the night before. They gave a brief description of his physical appearance.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, they asked the public to contact the Hamilton police with any information and that was really that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The statement made no mention of the test drive or the two men that Tim had left the house with the previous night.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But that was on purpose. The police wanted to keep that information close to the chest because they didn't want to alert these two suspects that they knew anything about them. Yea, that makes sense. No need to have anybody do anything stupid. Yea, that's good. That's good police work.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And the thing is, in cases where adults disappear, a lot of times the first assumption is not that they've been kidnapped or taken for any kind of nefarious purpose.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They loved having people over, they loved just being a family. And if you look up pictures, there's a picture of him like holding his baby, it will break your heart. It's gut-wrenching. He was the, he's like adorable, and he looked like the sweetest.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Well, you know, maybe there could be something there. But then at the same time, Tim's HVAC business was doing pretty well.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And he and Charlene really had no financial concerns beyond those of just like your typical young family. Yeah. To put it simply, Tim and Charlene were in a happy, stable relationship and nobody could think of any reason that Tim would just run off without telling anybody. Yeah. And it's like they have to cross all that off the list, but it seems like it was pretty easy to cross off the list here. Exactly.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So in the afternoon of May 7th, two days after Tim has gone missing, or a day, excuse me, after he's gone missing, news about his disappearance started making its way among social media.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] First it was family and friends, but then words started spreading among a larger circle.


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[Assistant] And in contrast with the police statement, the posts on Facebook were more detailed.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And of course included the fact that Tim had left the house with two young men.


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[Assistant] By that evening, the posts on Facebook and Twitter had been shared thousands of times by everyone from friends and family, celebrities, news personalities, every Tom, Dick and Harry was sharing this story.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And unfortunately, even though they had been widely shared, the social media posts and requests for information, no credible tips came from them. If anything,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I was just gonna say that happens more times than it doesn't happen. Oh yea, absolutely. It's like, cause things get put out there that aren't true, that are just rumour. Or that are true but that the authorities are not wanting to let out yet. That's the other thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But you kinda just have to trust the process. Yeaah, that's the thing, like look at the Idaho case. Yeaah, exactly, I think I say later on in this that there's another piece of this that reminds me so much of the Idaho case. Yeaah, it's like everybody was on that whole police force saying like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Always, always at the beginning of the year, I'm like, I'm gonna up my style game this year. I am gonna serve looks that I have never served before, and I know just the right place to go to serve those looks on my feet.


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[Assistant] The most comfortable shoe I have ever placed upon my footage.


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[Assistant] I have stinky feet, but guess what? The best part about Rothy's is that you can throw them in the wash machine and get rid of the stinkage. They come out looking like they just came out of the box. They're super durable, they don't lose their color in the wash, they don't get like


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Old looking or anything like that. They always look new to me.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There's flats, there's loafers, there's sneakers and more in dozens of colors and prints. For stylish and comfortable shoes, shop Rothy's. Get $20 off your first purchase at rothys.com slash morbid. That is r-o-t-h-y-s dot com slash morbid. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I usually feel like my best self when I'm showing up for other people, when I'm making time for myself, when I'm actually waking up in the morning, going to the gym, making breakfast, the whole nine.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The thing is when you're at your best, you could do great things. You can accomplish so much in one day. But sometimes life gets you bogged down and you maybe feel overwhelmed or like you're not showing up in the way that you want to. But listen, working with a therapist can help you get closer to the best version of you. When you feel empowered, you are more prepared to take on everything that life throws at you. And let me tell you, life comes at you fast. I have benefited so much from therapy, just


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Knowing that I have a space where I can go and freely talk about everything that I'm going through that week. Everything. Maybe I'm not even going through it that week, but I've gone through it in the past and I just need to let it out.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If you want to live a more empowered life, therapy can help get you there. Visit betterhelp.com slash morbid today to get 10% off your first month. That's better help H E L P dot com slash morbid.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So the next morning, when it had become clear that Tim was definitely a missing person, Hamilton police officially opened up a case into his disappearance. And this case was led by Staff Sergeant Matt Kavanaugh.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So Kavanaugh's first press briefing, it was really short and simple. He really just stuck to the facts of the case. He gave a description of Tim and the circumstances under which he disappeared, and then he went on to describe the men that he had left the house with that night saying,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The one who drove the truck was white and his mid-twenties, 6 foot 1 or 2, 170 to 180 pounds. He had light to medium short brown hair and was unshaven. He wore blue jeans, a long sleeved orange shirt, and running shoes.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The second male, the one who sat in the back, was also white in his early to mid twenties, 5 foot 9 or 10, small to medium build. He was wearing a, uh,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Rude hooded sweatshirt with the hood up mostly covering his dark hair.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I never like when somebody approaches me with their hood up.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So during this press briefing, the possibility actually of a third man being involved in Bosma's disappearance was introduced, because remember, they showed up on foot. Yeah, that's fucking weird.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Kavanaugh wouldn't really say too much about this. He would only confirm that the police were investigating two suspects described by Charlene, but users on social media had been speculating about a third man since it seemed pretty unlikely that these two just walked there. Yeaah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Kavanaugh wasn't going to speculate on the suspects, but he did tell reporters that due to the quote, unusual nature of the disappearance, the case was being assigned to the Hamilton police homicide unit and search and rescue team, along with a canine unit that had already been deployed but had not yet turned up any leads or evidence.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now at the time of the first press briefing, police believed that the two mystery men had targeted Tim because they wanted the truck. But while alerts had gone out to all of the relevant agencies in the three days since his disappearance, there was no sign of this vehicle at all.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Investigators had been able to get some data on Tim's cell phone in the hours after his disappearance, but the following day, it seemed like the phone had been turned off. Oh, oh god, this is like, I'm just thinking about how much this would


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Just kill me if I was his wife. Oh my god, it would destroy me. I don't know. I'm just thinking about her. She must be one of the strongest people on planet earth to go on after this because this entire time all I could think of was Drew. Yeah. It's awful. So in the afternoon of May 9th, Charlene,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Tim's wife went on television begging anybody with information to come forward and urging the two suspects to please release her husband.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I ask you if you see anybody that closely matches the description of these men to please call the police. My husband Tim is a loving father to our beautiful two year old girl and she needs her daddy back. His parents need their little boy back even reading this makes me want to cry.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But Charlene was incredibly well composed for somebody in her circumstances. But of course, when she mentioned her family, especially the children involved, she became upset.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Something seemed to ignite in her though after she answered that question, and she looked directly into the camera, seemingly talking to the two suspects, and told them loudly, it was just a truck. It is just a truck.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] For that woman, that wife, that mother to be in that position because these two dickheads just felt like doing this. Because that's what happened. They just wanted to do this. That makes me so angry. They didn't care about the truck, they didn't care about


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] His family. They literally just wanted to kill someone. They just wanted to kill somebody for the thrill of it and they wanted to steal a car. My god. It's like dude, just steal the car.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Take the car. Exactly. I'm sure they would have been much rather that. Mhm, absolutely. Like she said, it's just a truck. It was just a truck. It is just a truck. Like I need, my husband is more than just my husband. He is everybody's world. And she know, and what kills me is she had to watch these men.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Later that day after she gave that press conference, everybody's hopes fell when police found out that Tim's cell phone, or excuse me, they found his cell phone in an industrial area of West Brantford, which was about 20 minutes away from the Bosma's home.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] According to Kavanaugh, the lead investigator, Tim's truck was spotted driving in downtown Brantford at 10 10 PM on the night of the disappearance.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Kavanaugh asked that all of the businesses in that area check any surveillance camera footage for any additional sightings they might find or lead to. And he was hoping that they could use that footage to trace the route that the truck had taken through town.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Something a bit more important though than the truck sighting was that investigators had managed to follow up on the other cell phone that had been used to exchange text messages and calls with Tim, like whoever this prospective buyer was.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Most of the text came from, like from that phone, came from a location, or multiple locations in Etobicoke. I hope I said that right. I looked it up and I gave myself that little phonetic spelling.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, the phone was determined though to be a burner phone. Oh. This phone was purchased for this. Yeah. This exact reason. And the owner used a fake name when they set the phone up. They used the name Lucas Bates.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Even though that was pretty disheartening, the police were able to trace other calls that had been made from that phone, and they actually found that a call had been made to another man who happened to also be selling his truck, just like Tim.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] According to the man who placed the ad, he got a message from somebody interested in the truck and they arranged to meet with this prospective buyer the day before Tim went missing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The situation was literally almost identical to Tim Bosma's experience and the man who was selling his truck was able to confirm that both men matched the descriptions that had been given to the police.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So I don't know what happened in that scenario, I don't know if they just...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But the man even added onto it saying that the taller men of the two had a tattoo on his wrist that said ambition and was framed by a box.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Had literally no ambition whatsoever. Like Dick Hickok. Yeaah. From the clutter family murders we were talking about earlier. Very similar actually, because it ends up being two men. And it's like one kind of seems to follow the other, which was similar. Yeaah, like a henchman. Always a henchman.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But the man who had the tattoo had driven. So this was a huge, a huge break.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So while Kavanaugh and the Hamilton Homicide Unit conducted their official investigation in the open, they were providing the press with regular updates. And while they were doing this, another investigation was taking place, taking place online via web sleuths.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It got real messy. Yeah. Websleuths can be a great thing, can be a fucking terrible thing. Because websites like Websleuths claim to be friendly toward law enforcement agencies and you know sometimes they even have a hand in solving cases or helping to solve cases.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But they can also be a damaging distraction, especially in situations like this one where keeping information from the public was essential.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's the thing, every case is so different in how it needs to be handled. Right, and we don't necessarily need citizen opinions on victims. Yeah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And that's exactly what happened here. Because in the case of Tim's disappearance, journalists and Brocklehurst discovered, quote, an ugly strain of commentary from members who think they know more than anyone else.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And this included a good number of users who just completely rejected the investigator's theory that the suspects were only interested in the truck and not Tim.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Can you imagine, you're dealing with the fact that he, and while this was happening, he had already died, so I hope those people feel absolutely fucking terrible. Well that's it, it's like this woman is grie- this young mother of a young child is grieving. Right.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And it's like, I don't even care. And then people, I know, it's like shut up. Jesus. People were saying Tim had been so willing to accompany these quote unquote strangers on a late night test drive, it seems like it couldn't have been strangers in the first place, he had to have known them.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Nope, he didn't. So you're wrong. They were also trying to say that he knew these people and suggesting that he was involved with some kind of like crime organization or something nefarious like that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And this time, like we were just saying, it was grueling enough for Tim's family and friends. This was the last thing that they needed to be dealing with. It's like mind your fucking business. Well that's, it's like Jesus, like...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's the thing with these kind of like areas on the internet, they can


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There's like a, there's a little ray of light where you're like, this could be great.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But we are humans and we can't handle this shit. That's the thing. We can't handle gathering anonymously in an online cyberspace and being anything but fucking assholes. And it's the truth.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We've seen it time and time and time and time again. It's like yeah, there's little rays of sunlight for sure. Absolutely. Absolutely. Great things happen online. Great things happen when people get together. But unfortunately, it can only last for so long and it can only happen in certain instances because we as humans


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] No, we can't handle it. It's like the truth. It gets ugly. It gets disgusting. It gets vicious. It gets like way out of control and then it just lives online. Right. And even if it doesn't get to the point where it's ugly and vicious and out of control, it can also just be completely unhelpful because the investigators


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But we have to have faith that they know what they're doing and we have to let them do that. Especially in the beginning of a case. It is the most crucial time in any case. That's the thing. So it's like if we're, you know, these cases that are years and years out,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And nothing's moving and everyone's getting frustrated and it seems like there's like dead end, dead end, dead end. Places like that where people are coming up with new information and giving out tips, that's when it's great. That's when it can be really great. Of course there's ugly things there too, but for the most part it can be really great.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Sure, pull your pants on and see if you can find something cool. But at the same time, this is so detrimental. That's the thing, there is a difference between being investigated, or excuse me, being interested in true crime, and completely derailing an investigation. Yeah, like getting too involved. Exactly.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And the thing is, to those people that actually knew him, not random strangers on the internet,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The idea that Tim Bosma ever had anything to do with any kind of criminal element at all was fucking absurd. His friends and family remembered him as literally quote unquote the jokester uncle and the one most likely to pull a prank.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He became one of the center points of his family, quote unquote.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Always up for a barbecue and a get together at the farm, which was the one that he and Charlene had recently purchased together. Like, he was starting to make memories at his house and host his family. He was hardworking, he was honest.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He never resembled anything like the suspicious character that he was being made out to be by these members of Websleuths.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And it wouldn't be long before their assertions that he knew the suspects would prove to be completely false.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I hope you had yucky poops. There you go. So on Saturday, May 11th, another press briefing was called at Hamilton Police Headquarters, this time to announce that an arrest had finally been made in the disappearance of Tim Bosma. I don't even know why I said finally because it didn't really take that long.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] On the previous day, Hamilton investigators had received tips from sources in both Peel and Toronto that a man named Dellen Millard was a match for the description of one of their suspects.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right down to the Ambition tattoo on his wrist. Nice. You fucking loser. Seriously.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If you have that tattoo, you're not a loser. She's a loser because it was tattooed on him, but he had literally none of it. And he's a fucking terrible piece of shit.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] On the nose. So there's that. That distinguishes between you. Yea, exactly. Totally. And so he had the tattoo, which right away they're like, fucking awesome. But then to add to that,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] According to Superintendent Dan Casella, I hope I said that right, 27 year old, 27 year old Toronto resident Dellen Millard was pulled over in Mississauga by Ontario Provincial Police and quote, uh, detained without incident on the morning of May 10th.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He had since been charged with forcible confinement and theft over $5,000 for stealing the truck.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] While detectives were really excited to announce that they had made an arrest, they were also still quick to remind the press that their main priority was finding Tim Bosma alive. And also,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Dylan Millard was just one of the suspects that they were seeking and the case was still very much ongoing. They were still searching for more evidence that would hopefully lead them to find a second suspect and they reminded the public to be diligent and on the lookout for whoever the fuck this guy was.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So the press immediately began assembling kind of a profile of Dellenmiller.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It seemed kind of strange and unusual that this young guy, he's 27 years old, was involved in what a lot of people were starting to suspect was a homicide investigation.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Dellen was the only child of, uh, Wayne Millard, and he was the heir to Millard Air, which was a charter airline that was started by his grandfather. Damn. The airline mostly catered to wealthy clients in the greater Toronto area.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, in 1999 when he was just 14 years old, Dellen actually made headlines, like he could have had an incredible future.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He set a record for being the youngest person to fly a helicopter and fixed wing plane solo in the same day. Jesus. At 14 years old. Like that's the potential that this kid had and just fucking threw it all away. Awesome.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] By the time you reach adulthood, Millard Air didn't operate a charter business anymore. Instead they switched their attention to actually building airplane hangers and flight technology. Wow.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, when Dellen's grandfather Carl died in 2006, his father Wayne took over Millard Air until he actually died six years later in 2012. In the wake of his father's death, Dellen took over Millard Air and he was actually in the process of major layoffs and cutbacks at the time of his arrest.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He was not doing a great job. I was just gonna say, shocking that he wasn't doing great. Yeah, things were gonna go to shit if he stayed in charge of this place.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] As a child he'd been described as precocious and a little spoiled, quote, with a tendency to get himself into trouble.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Characteristics that are like, not even really cute when you're little, but are way less charming in adulthood. Yeah. Grow up. Yeah. And by most accounts, he was bougie, he loved showing off his wealth, he loved the attention, he loved being in the spotlight. He was a pretentious motherfucker.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He would constantly throw parties at one of the family's hangers, which really was just an excuse to show off expensive cars, helicopters, any marker of wealth he had he wanted to show off.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And according to that journalist Ann Brocklehurst, when Dell got engaged to his girlfriend, he arranged for a photo shoot where they posed with classic planes, helicopters, and cars.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Which was clearly orchestrated to show off how fucking filthy rich he was. Absolutely. It also included quote, a variety of hairstyles and at least six different outfits.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I wore two different outfits in my engagement shoots and I thought that was extra. Wow. Yeah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I am a big believer that cats should be seen and not smelled. I mean, is there anything worse than walking into a house and just being smacked in the face with a nose full of, uh,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Cat stink? I don't even know what else to call it. But that's exactly why I use pretty litter. I even sang it for you because I love it that much. It has got the best in class, superior order control. And that's just one reason why I love it. Pretty litter crystals change color to indicate early signs of potential illness like urinary tract infections, kidney issues, and more.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Pretty litter ships free to my door in a small lightweight bag. I never run out and I don't have a massive container of litter taking up space and I don't have to lug that bulky container from a store to my car into my house down to the basement where the cats pee and poop. None of that. I freaking love pretty litter.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Something that I really didn't love about other cat litters, this is so gross, but the pee and the poop cause clumpage. But with pretty litter,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I don't have to scoop up the pee, I just have to scoop up the poo poo, and I can check out the pee and say, hey, is that color alright? You don't want people coming into your home and being hit with a nose full of cat stink. So get pretty litter today. Go to prettylitter.com slash morbid to save 20% on your first order. That's prettylitter.com slash morbid to save 20% on your first order. Prettylitter.com slash morbid.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Are you eating cause you're bored or cause you can't pass up food when it's free? If the answer is yes, don't even stress. Noom weight can help you break the cycle and change your habits for


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Good. I think that I've learned so much about my habits from Noom. I've realized, I always thought since childhood that I had to eat everything on my plate, finish it. But you don't, and I've learned that by using Noom weight.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] A deep dive into the psychology of behavior change available to buy now wherever books are sold.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Jennifer found out that he'd been cheating on her with an 18 year old named, uh, Christina. For some reason I was gonna say Corissa, even though it very much has Christina. Awesome. So Jennifer broke off the engagement and moved out of the house that they shared in Oakville. Yeah, get the fuck out of there, Jennifer. Yeah, she was like, I'm out of here.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, Oakville is another suburb just outside of Toronto. Oh, I knew that. Wow. I was gonna say four and then I said so. For so. For so.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So for most of his early twenties, Dell really just like floated through life. He never committed to any of the projects, any of the careers he'd chosen. He had made like pretty cool atten- like pretty


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He had made attempts at getting pretty cool jobs, but just never followed through. Yea. He had made attempts at 3D game design, culinary school, special effects makeup artistry, and photography. Which are all things that I'm like, how can you not get into that? Yea. How can you not just like,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And that's all such cool shit that would be super fun and so worth investing your time into, but Dell just didn't give a shit.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] By 2012, he really hadn't achieved much of anything other than spending his dad's money, uh, failing to finish whatever he started. That's pretty much it. Ambition. But- And getting a tattoo.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But still, his father Wayne continued to support his son. He really had a lot of faith in him and it's absolutely heartbreaking. Wayne hoped that Dell would eventually start taking over his role at Millard Air and


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He would just pretty much undo whatever they had done, either through laziness, or incompetence, or just completely undermining what anybody had done in the first place. He sounds like a real fuckin' peach. I just wanna like, punch him. I'm like, you're such a piece of shit.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, he cut corners and actually caused structural damage to the building just in an effort to save money that he didn't want to spend. Cool, because he wanted it for himself.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And another thing thwarting his dad's efforts to transform his son into this like CEO was the fact that Dell seemed completely disinterested in taking the time to even learn the ropes of the industry or put effort into the business at all. By the end of 2012, none of that really seemed important anymore though because Wayne Millard had died


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] By what the coroner originally believed was a self-inflicted gunshot wound to his left eye. They believed that he committed suicide.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] People accepted that for the truth and believed that his decision came from the result of all the stress he was under at work and an increasingly problematic abuse of alcohol. He was really going through it.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I don't know if it was suicide though. Just going to say that. Yeah, I don't know about that. So on May 12th, Hamilton police started searching the home and property of Dell's mother, Madeline, uh, Madeline Burns in Kleinberg, yet another suburb about 45 minutes outside of Toronto. Lots of Canadian suburbs. Yeah, all of them.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They really found nothing inside of the home, but they did impound a large trailer that was parked on the street in front of the house, and uhm, do you wanna guess what was inside that trailer? What was inside? Tim's pickup truck. Are you fucking kidding me? Nope. Right there. Just sitting right-


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In a large trailer parked in front of the home. Yep.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] No. If you are one of those people, go fuck yourself. Go fuck yourself. Like what is wrong with you? The shame on you. How do you want, like cause obviously you're taking a picture because you know that that's Tim Bosma's truck, you know that the story's circulating around Canada. Holy shit. So you sat there and you watched his wife plead for these people to bring


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Her husband home, the father of her child home, and you said, yeah, let me take a picture in front of that pickup truck. You're supposed to be Canadian.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's awful. It's like in the Game of Thrones, they should do that walk. Yea, we should do that to you. Yea. Ring some bells around you. Throw some boot at ya. Give you a stupid haircut. Shame.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So while investigators searched, uh, Dell's mother's property in Kleinberg, a second team was searching his farm, which was in rural North Dumfries township, which is a small community.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] About 40 minutes from the Bosma house in Ancaster. So as they were searching this property, they actually were approached by a neighbor. He came on over and informed them that on several occasions he had seen, and this is a quote, a big redneck smoker in the woods and an excavator in the swamp on Millard's property.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So he actually led them to this wooded area behind the house and down an overgrown farmer's road and there it was. The neighbor had described it as a smoker, but what they actually found was a mobile incinerator actually intended for the use of cremating animals on this guy's property.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The investigators approached the incinerator cautiously, fully expecting to find a body inside, but they were surprised to find the inside was empty aside from ash.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So since they found nothing at the site of the incinerator, detectives asked the neighbor to take them to the site of the excavator.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] On the way to go see the excavator, which was in a swamp, they stopped in their tracks in the middle of a cornfield on the way because they discovered two large burn patches that looked as though they'd recently been cleaned up.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They could still smell some sort of accelerant in the area. This had just happened.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] When they arrived at the swampy area behind the house, it was exactly as the neighbor had described it. There was a bobcat and a partially buried excavator that also appeared to have been recently used.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The bone fragments were photographed and the images were immediately sent to Tracy Rogers, who was a forensic anthropologist at the University of Toronto.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] From what she could see in the photos, she felt very strongly that these bones were likely human, but she didn't want to say that without examining them in person.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So the next day she arrived at the farm and she actually had a group of, um, forensic anthropology students with her.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In addition to the bone fragments in the incinerator, they also found on the property what appeared to be three partially burned seatbelts and other random debris.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And after a thorough search of the property, she and her team were only able to recover 58 of the 208 bones that make up the human body. That's all that was left. The rest had been reduced to ash, obviously due to the extreme heat. That's what that's for.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So although no conclusive DNA match was able to be made because, I mean, how could they at this point?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] No identifying features had survived the fire either, but she was able to narrow down the sex and age of the victim.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's even worse that they can't even, like, you don't have anything. Like that's horrible. Because this 27 year old asshole who had literally everything, he had the world at his fingertips, just wanted a thrill.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Jump out of a fucking plane if you want a thrill. And honestly, to this guy, jump out of a fucking plane. Without your parachute.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Awful. So later that afternoon, Hamilton police called a press conference to announce their discovery. Chief Glenn DeClair told reporters, quote, it's with a heavy heart that the Hamilton police service announces the death of Ancaster resident, Tim Bosma.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] A number of searches have taken place and human remains have been located. We are convinced by the totality of the evidence that these are the remains of Tim Bosma. The evidence indicates that the remains have been burned.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So immediately they were bombed with questions from the press, including some who were probably still operating off of the rumors from web sleuths, wanted to know if Bosma had a criminal record or if he had been known to the police at all. It's like uhm, can we, can we take a minute?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Like, you're essentially suggesting that his death was the result of his own behavior, rather than the random fucking act that it was. And we just announced this, can you cool it for a second?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's ridiculous. Both Declare and lead investigator, excuse me, Kavanaugh firmly and unequivocally stated that Tim Bosma had been targeted by these killers and he had absolutely no connection to them or any other criminals.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So now that the search for Tim Bosma had come to a conclusion, the investigators were able to shift their focus to investigating the homicide. And as they did this, Del Millard, in true dickhole fashion, was refusing to cooperate with police. He literally would not talk. Cool.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] His lawyers told the press, he's facing pretty serious charges and he's executing his right to remain silent. Cool.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeah, that's because we found an incinerator on his property. Uh, I don't know what you would really have to say about that. Yeah, what could you say?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I don't know how you could look at that man's face on TV or like.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] She is a strong woman to be able to carry on, to put that that way and say, well, I have to be a mom. So like she had no choice. It's just awful.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So in addition to the evidence collected at the various addresses, uh, that were searched after Millard's arrest, detectives also started looking into his associates. And they discovered 25-year-old Mark Smitch, who matched Charlene Bosma's description of the man that had accompanied her husband Tim and Del Millard on the test drive.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And by May 22nd, he felt like they had enough information to warrant an arrest.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And both Smitch and his girlfriend Marlena were arrested while they were out just taking a walk.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] As he was being taken away in cups, Mark Smitch repeatedly shouted to his girlfriend, DON'T TELL THEM ANYTHING, BABY! DON'T TELL THEM ANYTHING, BABY!


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Are you fucking kidding me? Cause that makes you look fucking innocent. I'd be like, wow, you probably didn't do anything.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Anne Brocklehurst, my girl, that journalist, points out the unexpected arrest of Smitch, quote,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You know? We've all learned this again and again. Again and again. So Mark Smitch had actually been known to police for some time. He had a record of petty crime.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] From the moment he was arrested, people were like, insatiably curious about Mark Smitch. Among other things, he seemed like a really unlikely companion for Del Miller. The two of them just did not seem to go together at all.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] They'd grown up completely differently. While Dell was all about being a rich playboy heir to an airline, Mark Smitch was just a regular middle class guy with a pretty unremarkable life.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He'd been born in Mississauga and lived there for several years with his mother and his two sisters until the family actually had to relocate to Oakville because of Mark, and this was when he was in middle school.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He was pretty much the reason that his entire family had to uproot their lives and move in the first place because this entire move was basically in the hopes of quote, sorting Mark out. Oh, he had a lot of issues.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Unfortunately for his family though, his behavior continued on a downward spiral when he entered high school. The move really didn't do much.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He was getting into trouble on a regular basis and he actually ended up dropping out of high school his sophomore year. Which couldn't keep it together.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] After that, he kinda just drifted from like one job to another, not really great jobs, just he didn't have a lot of, it's actually exactly like the case we just did with you. It's very much like the Clutter family murders with Dick Hickok and Perry Smith.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Traveling from one menial job to the next. And he was starting to build a reputation for himself with local law enforcement as a petty criminal and a straight up nuisance. They were like, I'm so sick of dealing with this guy.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He was usually unemployed and by his early twenties, he had become a small time drug dealer who quote, when he had no supply was reduced to selling single cigarettes to students at the local high school who found him to be creepy.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Wow. So like when he couldn't get his hands on more drugs to sell, he would buy a pack of cigarettes and sell one square to high school students who


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Who found him creepy? Who found him creepy? Wow. That's uh, that's sad.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So Mark and Del met in 2008 when Mark was doing some temporary work at a friend's auto garage. This garage was one of many that Del loved to hang out around. He just, you know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Cause he's buying cars even though it's like. Just for the hell of it. Exactly. Yeah. Doing everything for the hell of it apparently. Like he didn't, all he had, ugh, I'm just so angry at this guy. I know, I hate this guy. For the first few years that they knew of each other, their relationship was really nothing more than the occasional drug deal. I think actually Mark became Dell's dealer.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But then he really wasn't a reliable dealer because he would run out a lot. Yeah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] But by 2010 or 2011, they actually started hanging out and chatting with each other on a regular basis. They'd play video games together and get high. Real winners. Cool. Ambition, right? I was just gonna say ambition. Yeah, it's all about the ambition, baby.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It was around 2011 that Del and Mark's friends started what Del referred to as missions.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] These missions were literally just spur of the moment theft of random items including, she can't talk today, Corvette rims, trees, they were just steel trees. Steel and trees? And also they once stole a concrete floor polisher from a restaurant.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Ambition. You just steal into ambition. There you go. Eventually these missions, which is what Del called them, evolved from these like impulsive acts to actually more planned out thefts and acts of vandalism, which were all orchestrated by one Del Millard.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In May of 2013, Mark, uh, was living between Del's house and Oakville in his own girlfriend's apartment. He was kind of just like couch surfing. Yeah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] One day in early May, Dell told the friend group that he wanted to steal a truck and he'd been scoping out some classified websites, and he'd even made some calls to arrange test drives. Can you imagine?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Just being like, you know what, I just, I've really been looking to steal someone else's property. I don't, it's just.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I'm the- I've really been looking to do this. I'm the heir to an airline. I have endless amounts of money. I have money to last me the rest of my life, but I want to steal a truck. Yeah, just, you know, I've been looking to steal someone else's shit.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What? You are such a loser. Such a loser. In every way. Ambition. Ambition.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Most of the guys in the group were very uninterested in going along with this specific plan. They were like, listen, I'll steal a floor polisher from a restaurant any day of the week, but not a truck. But not this.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Grand theft auto is a little bit different, so I do see that. But Mark had developed this weird sense of loyalty when it came to Del, and he agreed to accompany his friend on this particular mission.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Even calling this a mission makes me feel like a dumbass. Truly. By the time the two were ready to put their plan to action, Dell had been planning this for months. So on May 4th, they test drove a truck in Toronto, uh, and they were, this was Igor Tomoniko, I hope I said that right, his truck.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] He had been the man that police contacted when they found the cell data from Del Miller's burner phone.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And it was him who had filed an agreed statement of facts with the Hamilton police, officially identifying Mark Smitch as the passenger who had accompanied Del Millard on the test drive of his truck.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Egor is a real one. Egor! On May 24th, 2013, Del Millard and Mark Smich made their first appearance in court.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Where they were being arranged for the first degree murder of Tim Bosma. And just as they were in their daily lives, the two were a very stark contrast from one another in the courtroom.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Dell was well dressed, obviously he had the money to be. He came off as confident, he spoke loudly, quote, clearly and forcefully when responding to the judge, made eye contact when he pleaded not guilty to all of the charges.