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[Assistant] Remarkable old girl, Lady Millicent. We used to have great times together. Doeville, back in the twenties. I persuaded her to go in swimming at seven.


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[Assistant] Yes, I noticed that the learned council was tending to make points rather than ask questions, but I was reluctant to interfere, knowing how he resents interruption.


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[Assistant] Uhm, I'm very pleased to be here. Uh, we have a, even though it's a short history, the music that these guys have put out in the world,


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[Assistant] Help bring out some of the making of this music with you guys. Uhm, I guess I could just say about two years ago,


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[Assistant] And I was just, you know, I had this driving curiosity to find out what this was about and where it was coming from. So we met up at a Starbucks in Culver City. And, uh, I actually remember the story.


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[Assistant] And I, I hope I remember this correctly, because my memory is a little iffy.


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[Assistant] But, uh, I think we were talking about ocean eyes.


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[Assistant] And the way I remember the story, everybody knows the song, yes? Yes?


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[Assistant] Uhm, Phineas has a band called The Slightlys, and it's a band that I was also playing at KCRW, and uh, who also played School Night.


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[Assistant] And you were working on the song in your bedroom. Yeah.


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[Assistant] And, and she was singing the song, you know, she was just singing the song in the kitchen, and Finn was like, wait, whoa, whoa, whoa, wait, wait. You know, correct me if I get this wrong, but.


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[Assistant] You're like, you'd been listening, you'd heard it through the walls and you learned the song and he's like, we should record this with you. Yeah.


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[Assistant] So, when you hear the song, it's not something that you would, if you were, I mean,


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[Assistant] You know, so it became, uhm, the kind of, uhm, you know, the starting stone for that sound.


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[Assistant] And coming up with that sound, to me, even though it grew out of this organic need for this dance piece, uh, is so, I don't know, you know, it's, uhm, serendipitous the way it...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So then, uhm, so the success of that, you guys felt really good about that, and then that, I guess, led to, was it Six Feet Under, the second song? Or were there things that


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[Assistant] But we have to be fair because you guys came up in a very unique environment.


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[Assistant] What were you guys listening to growing up? You remember like the first song? I'll ask each of you guys.


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[Assistant] The first song or artist that made you go, you know, realize the power of music.


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[Assistant] Yeah, so like, if you, uhm, could go to the same question, like an early, you know, epiphany moment with music.


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[Assistant] And then the next song started to emerge.


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[Assistant] And write a song from the perspective of all these other given circumstances.


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[Assistant] So you know one of the things that I find astounding about


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[Assistant] Without any outside influence and it was such a, uhm,


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[Assistant] Confident, realized, fully realized thing. You know so often an artist


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[Assistant] Starts collecting collaborators as they, as they grow and, and, and, uh, find success.


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[Assistant] Can you speak to that, about how, you know, as these baby steps started to turn into sprints and, and the long race, you know, how


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[Assistant] How you've managed to protect what you guys are doing that's been so sacred.


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[Assistant] Looking back on all that, I didn't meet him that night when you guys played school night. I didn't know he was there. I didn't realize you guys had met that night.


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[Assistant] It's so beautiful that that was such an organic thing.


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[Assistant] What I'm witnessing here and what I felt was, was true about these guys is that


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[Assistant] You know, you've really protected that compass. There's this inner, you know, compass that we all have.


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[Assistant] And listening to that, listening to your muse or your instincts, your gut, whatever you want to call it.


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[Assistant] Is really where all this came from and where it's going to continue to come from and it's, and as things grow, I feel like


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[Assistant] Again, protecting that and, you know, shielding it from the bullshit is, is extremely important and I think a lot of times what happens along the way is people lose sight of that or they


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[Assistant] Plot, you know? So I'm, I'm commending you guys for, for just


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[Assistant] Instinctively knowing that and, and, and shielding yourselves against outside forces.


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[Assistant] Uhm, there's another collaboration I want to bring up and, uh, it's the Vince Staples. Yeaah.


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[Assistant] We've talked a bit about the songwriting and how the songs come to be written, but I think it's easy to overlook the production skills that are at work. Uhm, there's a restraint to what they're doing that


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[Assistant] Sets them apart. Yes, we see it sometimes in Lapsley and we see it in Aurora. There are other artists that are, that are maybe, uhm, you know, uh, in a similar world, but, but I think that that's, uhm,


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[Assistant] It's easy to take for granted what you guys are doing on the production side and I commend you for that. I want to talk a bit about the concept for this song and burn.


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[Assistant] And, and set it up. How did this start? And then I want to play it for everybody.


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[Assistant] Wow. Alright, so before we play it, uhm, you know, I, when I first,


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[Assistant] And so I heard every little nuance and, uh, if you guys know the song, you know what I'm talking about. There's all kinds of, uhm, little treats.


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[Assistant] Maybe break down uhm, a couple of things we should watch out for when we play it back.


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[Assistant] It's cool that you guys went back to the bathroom to do that because I guess when you were in the shower and you had that original concept you were hearing the good acoustics and...


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[Assistant] Uhm, well let's play the track. Uh, this is Ann Byrne with Vince Staples.


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[Assistant] Okay cool, uhm, I wanna have some time to take some questions from you guys, uh, so be thinking about your questions, uhm, as we get


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[Assistant] Uhm, can you, can you point to another moment perhaps aside from the thousand plays on SoundCloud where you guys started realizing


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[Assistant] Wow, this is, this is really something, like, you know, that this is, this is gonna work.


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[Assistant] I'll just say also too, it starts with a great song, obviously. Absolutely.


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[Assistant] They could have found her on Instagram or Twitter and then gone to the music and if the song didn't deliver, we wouldn't be here today. It starts with the song. That's why we're here today, right? That's why we're...


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[Assistant] Life and Death Twilight Reimagined by Stephanie Meyer. I don't own any rights to anything. Chapter 14, Mind Over Matter. Her driving was just fine, I had to admit, when she kept the speed reasonable. Like so many things, it seemed to be effortless for her. She barely looked at the road, yet the truck was always perfectly centered in her lane.


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[Assistant] Sometimes she gazed into the setting sun, which glittered off her skin in ruby-tinged shimmers.


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[Assistant] Sometimes she glanced at me, stared into my eyes, or looked down at our hands twined together.


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[Assistant] Her voice was as perfect as everything else about her, soaring an octave above the melody. She knew every line.


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[Assistant] You like 50s music? I asked. Music in the 50s was good. Much better than the 60s. Or the 70s. Ugh. She shuddered delicately. The 80s were... bearable. Are you ever gonna tell me how old you are?


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[Assistant] I wondered if my question would upset her buoyant mood, but she just smiled. Does it matter very much? No, but I wanna know everything about you.


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[Assistant] She stared straight into the sun. A minute passed. Try me, I finally said.


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[Assistant] She looked into my eyes, seeming to forget the road completely for awhile. Whatever she saw must have encouraged her.


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[Assistant] She turned to face the last blood red rays of the dying sun and sighed. I was born in Chicago in 1901. She paused and glanced at me from the corner of her eye. My face was carefully arranged, unsurprised, patient for the rest. She smiled a tiny smile and I continued. Corrine found me in a hospital in the summer of 1918. I was 17 and I was dying of the Spanish influenza. She heard my gasp and looked up into my eyes again.


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[Assistant] I don't remember it well. It was a long time ago and human memories fade


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[Assistant] She seemed lost in thought for a minute, but before I could prompt her, she went on. I do remember how it felt when Corinne saved me.


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[Assistant] It's not an easy thing, not something you could forget. Your parents? They had already died from the disease. I was alone. That's why she chose me. In all of the chaos of the epidemic, no one would ever realize I was gone. How did she save you?


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[Assistant] A few seconds passed, and when she spoke again she seemed to be choosing her words very carefully. It was difficult.


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[Assistant] Not many of us have the restraint necessary to accomplish it.


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[Assistant] It was merely very, very painful.


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[Assistant] I filed it away for later. My curiosity on the subject was hardly idle.


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[Assistant] They took him straight to the hospital morgue, though somehow his heart was still beating. So you have to be dying then? No, that's just Corinne.


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[Assistant] She would never do that to someone who had another choice. Any other choice.


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[Assistant] That she was hoping he would be, to me, what Ernest was to her. She was careful with her thoughts around me. She rolled her eyes. But he was never more than a brother. It was only two years later that he found Eleanor. He was hunting. We were in Appalachia at the time, and found a bear about to finish her off. He carried her back to Corinne more than a hundred miles, afraid he wouldn't be able to do it himself.


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[Assistant] I'm only beginning to guess how difficult that journey was for him.


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[Assistant] She threw a pointed glance in my direction and raised our hands, still folded together to brush her cheek against my hand. But he made it. Yes. He saw something in her face that made him strong enough. And they've been together ever since. Sometimes they live separately from us, as a married couple. But the younger we pretend to be, the longer we can stay in any given place. Forks is perfect in many ways. So we all enrolled in high school. She laughed.


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[Assistant] I suppose we'll have to go to the wedding in a few years. Again. Archie and Jessamine? Archie and Jessamine are two very rare creatures.


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[Assistant] They both developed a conscience, as we refer to it, with no outside guidance. Jessamine belonged to another... family. A different kind of family. She became depressed, and she wandered on her own. Archie found her. Like me, he has certain gifts. Really, I interrupted, fascinated. But you said you were the only one who could hear people's thoughts. That's true. He knows about other things. He sees things. Things that might happen, things that are coming.


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[Assistant] But it's very subjective. The future isn't set in stone. Things change.


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[Assistant] Her jaw set when she said that and her eyes darted to my face and away so quickly that I wasn't sure if I'd only imagined it. What kinds of things does he see?


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[Assistant] He saw Jessamine and knew that she was looking for him before she knew it herself. He saw Corinne and our family, and they came together to find us.


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[Assistant] I was surprised how many of them could walk around with us all totally oblivious. My mind got caught on one word she had said, threat.


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[Assistant] It was the first time she'd ever said anything to hint that her world wasn't just dangerous for humans. It made me anxious, and I was about to ask a new question but she was already answering my first. No, not many, but most won't settle in any one place. Only those like us, who've given up hunting you people, a sly glance in my direction, can live together with humans for any length of time.


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[Assistant] We've only found one other family like ours in a small village in Alaska. We lived together for a time, but there were so many of us that we became too noticeable.


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[Assistant] Those of us who live differently tend to band together. And the others? Nomads for the most part. We've all lived that way at times. It gets tedious like anything else.


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[Assistant] But we run across the others now and then because most of us prefer the north. Why's that?


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[Assistant] We were parked in front of my house now, and she turned off the truck. The silence that followed its roar felt intense. It was very dark. There was no moon. The porch light was off so I knew my dad wasn't home yet. Did you have your eyes open this afternoon? She teased.


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[Assistant] Do you think that I could walk down the street in the sunlight without causing traffic accidents?


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[Assistant] I thought to myself that she could stop traffic even with all the- even without all the pyrotechnics.


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[Assistant] There is a reason why we chose the olympic peninsula, one of the most sunless places in the world. It's nice to be able to go outside in the day.


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[Assistant] He wouldn't believe how tired you can get of night time in 80 odd years. So that's where the legends come from. Probably. And Archie came from another family, like Jessamine? No, and that is a mystery. Archie doesn't remember his human life at all, and he doesn't know who created him. He awoke alone. Whoever made him walked away, and none of us understand why or how he could.


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[Assistant] If Archie hadn't had that other sense, if he hadn't seen Jessamine and Corinne.


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[Assistant] And known that he would someday become one of us. He probably would have turned into a total savage.


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[Assistant] There was so much to think through. So much I still wanted to ask.


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[Assistant] It was easier to say in the darkness, knowing how my voice would betray me, my hopeless addiction to her. Can't I come in? She asked. Would you like to?


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[Assistant] I couldn't picture a goddess sitting in my dad's shabby kitchen chair. Yes, if you don't mind. I smiled. I do not.


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[Assistant] I climbed out of the truck and she was already there. Then she flitted ahead and disappeared. The lights turned on inside.


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[Assistant] She met me at the door. It was so surreal to see her inside my house, framed by the boring physical details of my humdrum life.


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[Assistant] I remembered a game my mother used to play with me when I was maybe four or five. One of these things is not like the other. Did I leave that unlocked? I wondered. No, I used the key from under the eave. I hadn't thought I'd used that key in front of her. I remembered how she had found my truck key and shrugged. You're hungry, right?


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[Assistant] Trying to wrap my mind around her presence here in the middle of Mundania. Eat something, Belle. I nodded and turned to scavenge.


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[Assistant] There was lasagna leftover from last night. I put a square on a plate, changed my mind, and added the rest that was in the pan, then set the plate in the microwave. I washed the pan while the microwave revolved, filling the kitchen with the smell of tomatoes and oregano. My stomach growled again.


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[Assistant] She said, What's up? I'm going to have to do a better job in the future. I laughed. Would you possibly do better than you already do? Remember that you're human. I should have, I don't know, packed a picnic or something today. The microwave dinged and I pulled the plate out, then set it down quickly when it burned my hand. Don't worry about it. I found a fork and started eating. I was really hungry. The first bite scalded my mouth, but I kept chewing.


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[Assistant] Does that taste good? she asked. I swallowed.


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[Assistant] I'm not sure. I think I just burned my taste buds off. Tasted good yesterday. She didn't look convinced. Do you ever miss food? Ice cream? Peanut butter? She shook her head. I hardly remember food. I couldn't even tell you what my favorites were. It doesn't smell... edible now. That's kind of sad.


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[Assistant] It's not a huge sacrifice. She said it sadly, like there were other things on her mind. Sacrifices that were huge.


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[Assistant] I used the dish towel as a hot pad, and carried the plate to the table so I could sit by her. Do you miss other parts about being human? She thought about that for a second. I don't actually miss anything, because I'd have to remember it to be able to miss it. And like I said, my human life is hard to remember. But there are things I think I'd like. I suppose you could say things I was jealous of. Like what?


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[Assistant] Sleep is one. Never-ending consciousness gets tedious. I think I'd enjoy temporary oblivion. It looks interesting. I ate a few bites thinking about that. Sounds hard. What do you do all night? She hesitated, then pursed her lips. Do you mean in general?


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[Assistant] She didn't seem to like the question either. At first, I thought for the same reason.


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[Assistant] But then her eyes flashed to my face and away like she was uncomfortable. What? She made a face. Do you want a pleasant lie or a possibly disturbing truth? The truth, I said quickly, though I wasn't entirely sure. She sighed.


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[Assistant] I'll come back here after you and your father are asleep. It's sort of my routine lately. I blinked. And then I blinked again. You come here? Almost every night. Why? You're interesting when you sleep, she said casually. You talk.


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[Assistant] My mouth popped open. Heat flashed up my neck and into my face. I knew I talked in my sleep, of course. My mother teased me about it. I hadn't thought it was something I needed to worry about here.


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[Assistant] She'd been listening to me babble in my sleep from where? The window? I couldn't understand. How? How did you? Where do you? What? What did I? I couldn't find any of my thoughts. She put her hand on my cheek. The blood under her fingers. Felt burning hot next to her cold hand. Don't be upset. I didn't mean any harm. I promise I was very much in control of myself. If I thought there was any danger, I would have left immediately. I just...


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[Assistant] Wanted to be where you were. That's not what I'm worried about. What are you worried about? What did I say? She smiled. You miss your mother. When it rains, the sound makes you restless. You used to talk about home a lot. But it's less often now.


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[Assistant] Like it was easy, natural, she put her arms around my shoulders and leaned her head against my chest.


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[Assistant] Automatically, my arms came up to wrap around her to hold her there. Don't be self-conscious, she whispered. You already told me that you dream about me, remember? That's different, I knew what I was saying. If I could dream it all, it would be about you. And I'm not ashamed of it. I stroked her hair. I guessed I really didn't mind when it came down to it.


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[Assistant] It wasn't like I expected her to follow normal human rules anyway. The rules she'd made for herself seemed like enough. I'm not ashamed, I whispered. She hummed almost like a purr. Her cheek pressed over my heart.


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[Assistant] Then we both heard the sound of tires on the brick driveway, saw the headlights flash through the front windows down the hall to us. I jumped and dropped my arms as she pulled away. Do you want your father to know that I'm here? She asked. I tried to think it through quickly, uhm, another time then, and I was alone.


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[Assistant] Was my voice too agitated? I took another bite of my lasagna so I could be chewing when he came in. His footsteps sounded extra noisy after I had spent the day with Edith.


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[Assistant] Did you take all the lasagna? he asked, looking at my plate. Oh, sorry. Here, have some. No worries, Bo. I'll make myself a sandwich. Sorry. I mumbled again. Charlie banged around the kitchen, getting what he needed.


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[Assistant] I worked on eating my giant plate of food as fast as was humanly possible, while not choking to death. I was thinking about what Edith had just said, Do you want your father to know that I'm here? Which was not the same as, Do you want your father to know that I was here? In the past tense. So did that mean that she hadn't actually left? I hoped so.


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[Assistant] Sandwich in hand, Charlie sat in the chair across from me. It was hard to imagine Edith sitting in the same place just minutes ago. Charlie fit. The memory of her was like a dream that couldn't possibly have been real. How was your day? Did you get everything done that you wanted to? Uhm, not, not really. It was too... nice to stay indoors. For the fish biting? Yup. They like the good weather too.


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[Assistant] I guess you're missing that dance tonight. As intended, I said. He nodded. Sure, dancing. I get it.


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[Assistant] I told you she's dating my friend. He frowned. Well, there's lots of other fish in the sea. Not at the rate you're going. He laughed. I do my best. So you're not going out tonight? He asked again.


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[Assistant] Nowhere to go, I told him. Besides, I'm tired. I'm just gonna go to bed early again. I got up and took my plate to the sink. Aha, he said, chewing thoughtfully. None of the girls in town are your type, eh? I shrugged as I scrubbed the plate.


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[Assistant] I could feel him staring at me and I tried really hard to keep the blood out of my neck. I wasn't sure I was succeeding. Don't be too hard on a small town, he said. I know we don't have the variety of a big city. There's plenty of variety, Dad, don't worry about me. Okay, okay. None of my business anyway. He sounded kind of dejected.


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[Assistant] I sighed. Well, I'm done. I'll see you in the morning. Night, Bo.


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[Assistant] I tried to make my footsteps drag as I walked up the stairs, like I was super tired. I wondered if he brought- I wondered if he bought my bad acting. I hadn't actually lied to him or anything. I definitely wasn't planning on going out tonight. I shut my bedroom door loud enough for him to hear downstairs, then sprinted as quietly as I could to the window. I shoved it open and leaned out into the dark. I couldn't see anything, just the shadow of the treetops. Edith! I whispered, feeling completely idiotic.


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[Assistant] The quiet laughing response came from behind me. Yes.


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[Assistant] I spun around so fast I knocked a book off my desk. It fell with a thud to the floor. She was lying across my bed, hands behind her head, ankles crossed, a huge smile dimple on her face. A huge dimpled smile on her face. She looked the color of frost in the darkness. Oh! I breathed, reaching out to grab the desk for support. I'm sorry, she said. Just give me a second to restart my heart.


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[Assistant] She sat up, moving slowly like she did when she was either trying to act human or trying not to startle me, and dangled her legs over the edge of the bed. She patted the space next to her. I walked unsteadily to the bed and sat down beside her. She put her hand on mine. How's your heart? You tell me, I'm sure you hear it better than I do. She laughed quietly.


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[Assistant] We sat there for a moment in silence, both listening to my heartbeat slow. I thought about Edith in my room, and my father's suspicious questions, and my lasagna breath. Can I have a minute to be human? Certainly.


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[Assistant] I stood and then looked at her, sitting there all perfect on the edge of my bed, and I thought that maybe I was just hallucinating everything. You'll be here when I get back, right? I won't move a muscle, she promised.


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[Assistant] And then she became totally motionless, a statue again, perched on the edge of my bed.


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[Assistant] But I really hadn't been expecting guests, and then it was probably dumb to worry anyway. If she hung out here at night, she already knew what I wore to sleep.


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[Assistant] He looked at my pajamas and then made a little harumph sound in the back of the throat like he was surprised. You're heading to bed too? I asked. Yeah, I guess. I've got an early one again tomorrow. Okay, night. Yeah.


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[Assistant] I walked into my room, glad that the bed wasn't visible from where Charlie was standing, then shut the door firmly behind me. Edith hadn't moved even a fraction of an inch. I smiled and her lips twitched. She relaxed, and suddenly she was human again. Or close enough.


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[Assistant] I went back to sit next to her. She twisted to face me, pulling her legs up and crossing them.


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[Assistant] I'm not sure how I feel about that shirt, she said.


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[Assistant] Her voice was so quiet that I didn't have any worries that Charlie would hear us. I can change. She rolled her eyes. Not you wearing it. Its entire existence. She reached out and brushed her fingers across the smiling pig. My pulse spiked, but she politely ignored that. Should he be so happy to be food? I had to grin. Well, we don't know his side of the story, do we? He might have a reason to smile. She looked at me like she was doubting my sanity.


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[Assistant] I reached out to hold her hand. It felt really natural, but at the same time, I couldn't believe I was so lucky. What had I ever done deserve this? Your dad thinks he might be sneaking out, she told me. I know. Apparently I look keyed up. Are you? A little more than that, I think. Thank you for staying. It's what I wanted too. My heart started beating, not faster exactly, but stronger somehow. For some reason, I would never understand. She wanted to be with me.


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[Assistant] Then she curled up against my chest again, the way she seemed to prefer with her ear against my heart, which was reacting probably more than necessary. I folded my arms around her and pressed my lips to her hair.


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[Assistant] This, I murmured into her hair, is much easier than I thought it would be. Does it seem easy to you? It sounded like she was smiling.


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[Assistant] She angled her face up and I felt her nose trace a cold line up the side of my neck.


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[Assistant] Well, I said breathlessly. Her lips were brushing at the edge of my jaw. Seems to be easier than it was this morning, at least.


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[Assistant] I don't think that's from being cold, I told her. We looked at each other for a second in the dark.


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[Assistant] She said finally, answering my earlier question. Her hand brushed across my forearm and I felt goosebumps again. But this afternoon, I was still undecided. I'm sorry, it was unforgivable for me to behave as I did. I forgive you, I murmured. Thank you.


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[Assistant] She smiled and then was serious as she looked down at the bumps on my arm. You see, I wasn't sure if I was strong enough. She lifted my hand and pressed it to her cheeks, still looking down.


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[Assistant] And while there was still that possibility that I might be overcome, she breathed in the scent of my wrist, I was susceptible until I made up my mind that I was strong enough that there was no possibility at all that I would, that I ever could,


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[Assistant] I had never seen her struggle so hard for words. It was so human. So there's no possibility now? She looked up at me and finally smiled. Mind over matter. Sounds easy, I said, grinning so that she knew I was teasing. Rather than easy, I would say herculean, but possible. And so, in answer to your other question... Sorry, I said.


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[Assistant] She laughed quietly. Why do you apologize? It was a rhetorical question.


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[Assistant] And she went on quickly, putting a finger to my lips, just in case I felt like I needed to explain. It's not easy. And so if it is acceptable to you, I would prefer if you would follow my lead. She let her finger drop. Is that fair? Of course, I said quickly. Whatever you want. As usual, I meant that literally. If it gets to be too much, I'm sure I will be able to make myself leave. I frowned. I will make sure it's not too much.


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[Assistant] I've had the scent of you in my head all day and I've grown amazingly desensitized.


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[Assistant] If I'm away from you for any length of time, I'll have to start over again. Not quite from scratch though, I think. Never go away, I suggested.


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[Assistant] She laced her cold fingers around my wrist like a medical. And now, if you don't mind, may I borrow a blanket? It took me a second. Oh.


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[Assistant] Uhm, sure. Here. I reached behind her with my free hand and snagged the old quilt that was folded over the foot of my bed and then offered it to her. She dropped my wrist, took the blanket and shook it out, and then handed it back to me. I'd be happier if I knew you were comfortable. I'm very comfortable. Please?


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[Assistant] Quickly, I threw the quilter from my shoulders like a cape. She chuckled quietly. Not exactly what I was thinking. She was already on her feet, rearranging the blanket over my legs and pulling it all the way up to my shoulders. Before I could understand what she was doing,


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[Assistant] She had climbed onto my lap again and nestled against my chest.


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[Assistant] She left. I stroked her hair. That seemed careful. It's so strange, she said. You read about something. You hear about it in other people's minds. You watch it happen to them.


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[Assistant] And it doesn't prepare you even in the slightest for experiencing it yourself. The glory of first love. It's more than I was expecting. Much more, I agreed fervently. And other emotions too. Jealousy, for example. I thought I'd understood that one clearly.


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[Assistant] I've read about it in a hundred thousand different things, seen actors portray it in a thousand different plays and movies, listened to it in the minds around me daily.


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[Assistant] Even felt it myself in a shallow way, wishing I had what I didn't. But I was shocked. She scowled. Do you remember the day that Michaela asked you to the dance?


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[Assistant] I nodded, though that day was not the most memorable to me for a different reason.


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[Assistant] I was stunned by the flare of resentment, almost fury, that I had felt. I didn't recognize what it was at first. I didn't know jealousy could be so powerful, so painful. And then you refused her. And I didn't know why.


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[Assistant] It was more aggravating than usual that I couldn't just hear what you were thinking. Was there someone else? Was it simply for Jeremy's sake? I knew I had no right to care either way. I tried not to care. And then the line started forming. I groaned. She laughed.


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[Assistant] More anxious than I should be to hear what you would say to them, to try to decipher your expressions.


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[Assistant] I couldn't deny the relief I felt watching the annoyance on your face, but I couldn't be sure. I didn't know what your answer would have been if I'd asked.


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[Assistant] I knew that if I continued to ignore you, as I should, or if I left for a few years till you were gone, that someday,


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[Assistant] You would find someone you wanted, someone human like Michaela. It made me sad. And then, her voice dropped to an even quieter whisper. As you were sleeping, you said my name.


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[Assistant] You spoke so clearly at first I thought you'd woken, but you rolled over restlessly and mumbled my name once more and sighed. The emotion that coursed through me then was unnerving, staggering, and I knew I couldn't ignore you any longer. She was quiet for a moment, probably listening to the uneven pounding of my heart, but jealousy, it's so irrational.


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[Assistant] Just now when Charlie asked you about that annoying girl. That made you jealous. Really? I'm new at this.


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[Assistant] You're resurrecting the human in me and everything feels stronger because it's fresh.


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[Assistant] Honestly though, for that to bother you, after I have to hear that Royal, male model of the year, Royal, Mr. Perfect, Royal, was meant for you. Eleanor or no Eleanor, how can I compete with that?


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[Assistant] Her teeth gleamed, and her arms were over on my neck again. There's no competition. That's what I'm afraid of. Tentatively, I folded my arms around her. Is this okay? I checked. Very. She sighed happily. Of course Royal is beautiful in his own way.


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[Assistant] He could never have one tenth, no, one hundredth of the attraction you hold for me. She was serious now. Thoughtful.


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[Assistant] For almost ninety years I've walked among my kind, and yours, all the time thinking I was complete in myself, not realizing what I was seeking.


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[Assistant] And not finding anything, because you weren't alive yet.


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[Assistant] It doesn't seem fair, I whispered into her hair. I haven't had to wait at all. Why do I get off so easily?


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[Assistant] You're right, she agreed. I should make this harder for you, definitely. Her hand stroked my cheek.


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[Assistant] You only have to risk your life every second you spend with me, surely that's not much. You only have to turn your back on nature, on humanity. What is that worth? I'm not feeling deprived. She turned her face into my chest and whispered, not yet.


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[Assistant] What? I started, but then her body was suddenly motionless. I froze, but she was gone. My arms wrapped around the empty air. Lie down.


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[Assistant] I threw myself back on the bed, shaking the quilt out and then rolling on my side the way I usually slept. I heard the door crack open. Charlie was checking up on me. I breathed evenly, exaggerating the movement.


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[Assistant] A long minute passed. I listened for the door to close. Suddenly, Edith was next to me. She lifted my arm and placed it over her shoulders as she burrowed herself closer to me. You're a terrible actor. I'd say that career path is out for you.


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[Assistant] There goes my ten-year plan, I muttered. My heart was being obnoxious. She could probably feel it as well as hear it, careening around inside my ribs like it might bust one of them. She hummed a melo- She hummed a melody I didn't recognize. It reminded me of a lullaby. Then she paused. Should I sing you to sleep? Right.


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[Assistant] I laughed, like I could sleep with you here. You do it all the time, she reminded me. Not with you here, I disagreed, tightening my arm around her. You have a point. So if you don't want to sleep, what do you want to do then?


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[Assistant] Honestly, a lot of things. None of them careful. She didn't say anything. It didn't sound like she was breathing. I went on quickly.


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[Assistant] But, since I promised to be careful, what I'd like is to know more about you. Ask me anything. I could hear that she was smiling now. I sifted through my questions for the most important. Why do you do it? I asked. I still don't understand why you work so hard to resist what you are.


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[Assistant] Don't misunderstand. Of course I'm glad that you do. I've never been happier to be alive. I just don't see why you would bother in the first place. She answered slowly. That's a good question.


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[Assistant] And you're not the first one to ask it. The others, the vast majority of our kind who are quite content with our lot, they too wonder how we live. But you see, just because we've been dealt a certain hand, it doesn't mean that we can't choose to rise above.


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[Assistant] To conquer the boundaries of a destiny that none of us wanted. To try to retain whatever essential humanity we can.


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[Assistant] I laid still, feeling kind of odd. She was a better person than I would ever be.


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[Assistant] Did you fall asleep? She murmured almost silently after a few minutes. No. Is that all you were curious about? I rolled my eyes. Not quite. What else do you want to know? Why can you read minds? Why only you? And Archie, seeing the future and everything. Why does that happen? I felt her shrug under my arm. We don't really know. Kareen has a theory.


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[Assistant] She believes that we all bring something of our strongest human traits with us into the next life, where they are intensified, like our minds and our senses.


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[Assistant] Ernest brought his ability to love passionately. Eleanor brought her strength, royal his tenacity. Or you could call it pigheadedness. She chuckled. Jessamine is very interesting. She was quite charismatic in her first life, able to influence those around her to see things her way.


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[Assistant] Now she is able to manipulate the emotions of those near to her. Calm down a room of angry people, for example, or excite a lethargic crowd, conversely. It's a very subtle gift.


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[Assistant] I considered the impossibilities she described, trying to take it in. She waited patiently while I thought.


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[Assistant] So where does it all start? I mean, Corinne changed you, and then someone must have changed her, and so on. Well, where did you come from? Evolution? Creation? Couldn't we have evolved in the same way as other species? Predator and prey? Or, if you don't believe that all,


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[Assistant] This world could have just happened on its own, which is hard for me to accept myself.


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[Assistant] Is it so hard to believe that the same force that created the delicate angelfish with the shark


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[Assistant] The baby seal and the killer whale could create both our kinds together? Lemme get this straight, I'm the baby seal, right? Correct. She laughed. And her fingers brushed against my lips. Aren't you tired? It's been a rather long day. I just have a few million more questions. We have tomorrow, and the next day, and the next.


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[Assistant] A feeling of euphoria, of pure bliss filled up my chest until I thought I might explode.


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[Assistant] And that same feeling, even stronger than before, washed through me. When I could speak, I said, One more, than tonight.


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[Assistant] I keep thinking it will get less frustrating not hearing your thoughts, but it just gets worse and worse.


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[Assistant] Bad enough that you eavesdrop on my sleep talking, I muttered.


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[Assistant] Please tell me, she murmured, her velvet voice taking on that mesmerizing intensity that I could never resist. I tried. I shook my head.


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[Assistant] If you don't tell me, I'll just assume that it's something much worse than it is. She threatened.


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[Assistant] I shouldn't have brought it up, I said, then locked my teeth. Please? Again in that hypnotic voice. I sighed. You won't get, I don't know, offended? Of course not. I took a deep breath. Well, so, obviously, I don't know a lot that's true about vampires.


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[Assistant] The word slipped out accidentally. I was just thinking so hard about how to ask my question and then I realized what I'd said and I froze. Yes?


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[Assistant] She sounded normal, like the word didn't mean anything. I exhaled in relief.


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[Assistant] Okay, I mean, I just know the things you've told me, and it seems like we're pretty... different. Physically. You look human. Only better.


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[Assistant] But you don't eat or sleep, you know, you don't need the same things.


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[Assistant] Debatable on some levels, but there are certainly truths in what you're saying. What's your question?


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[Assistant] So I'm just an ordinary human guy, and you're the most beautiful girl I've ever seen, and I am just overwhelmed.


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[Assistant] I would have said that this was our second date. You're right. She laughed.


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[Assistant] Did climb into your bed, though. I believe that this makes this line of inquiry quite understandable. You still don't have to answer. I told you that you could ask me anything. She paused, and then her voice was different. Kind of normal, like a teacher lecturing. So, in the general sense, Sex and Vampires 101. We all started out human, though, and most of those human desires are still there,


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[Assistant] Very annoying for those of us who have to live with them, and even more so for the one who can read their minds.


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[Assistant] I laughed quietly and she joined in. Awkward, I murmured. You have no idea, she said darkly, and then sighed.


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[Assistant] Now in the specific sense, Sex and Vampires 102, Bow and Edith. She sighed again, more slowly this time.


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[Assistant] Because I would have to get too close, I guess. That would be a problem. But that's not the main problem, though. You don't know how...


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[Assistant] Well, fragile you are. I don't mean that as an insult to your manliness. Anyone human is fragile to me. I have to mind my actions. Every moment that we are together so that I don't hurt you. I could kill you quite easily simply by accident.


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[Assistant] I thought about the first few times that she had touched me, how cautiously she had moved, how much it seemed to frighten her.


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[Assistant] I can never, never afford to lose any kind of control when I'm with you.


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[Assistant] If her life were in my hands that way, would I have already killed her? I cringed at the very thought.


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[Assistant] I think I could be very distracted by you, she murmured. I am never not distracted by you.


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[Assistant] Can I ask you something now? Something potentially offensive? It's your turn.


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[Assistant] Do you have any experience with sex and humans?


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[Assistant] I was a little surprised that my face didn't go hot again. It felt natural to tell her everything. Not even a little bit. This is all firsts for me. I told you I've never felt like this about anyone before. Not even close.


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[Assistant] I know, it's just, I hear what other people think. I know that love and lust don't always keep the same company. They do for me. That's nice. We have that one thing in common at least. Oh.


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[Assistant] When she'd been talking before about how we tend to form very strong bonds, physical as well as emotional, I couldn't help but wonder if she was speaking from experience. I found that I was surprisingly relieved to know that that wasn't the case. So you do find me distracting. Indeed. She was smiling again.


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[Assistant] Would you like me to tell you the things that distract me? You don't have to.


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[Assistant] It was your eyes first. You have lovely eyes, Bo, like a sky without clouds. I've spent all my life in rainy climates, and so I often miss the sky.


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[Assistant] Not when I'm with you. Uh, thanks. She giggled. I'm not alone. Six of your ten admirers started with your eyes too. Ten?


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[Assistant] They're not all so forward as Taylor and Michaela. Do you want a list? You have options. I think you're making fun of me, and either way, there is no other option. And never would be again.


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[Assistant] Next, it was your arms. I'm very fond of your arms, Bo. This includes your shoulders and hands. She ran her hand down my arm and then back up to my shoulder, and back down to my hand again. Maybe it was your chin that was second.


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[Assistant] Her fingers touched my face like she thought that I might not know what she meant. I'm not entirely sure. It all took me quite by surprise when I realized that not only did I find you delicious, but also beautiful.


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[Assistant] My face and neck were burning. I knew it couldn't be true, but in the moment she was pretty convincing. Oh, and I didn't even mention your hair. Her fingernails combed against my scalp. Okay, now I know you're making fun. I'm truly not.


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[Assistant] Did you know that your hair is just precisely the same shade as a teak inlaid ceiling in a monastery I once stayed at? I think it would be in Cambodia now? Uh, no. I did not.


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[Assistant] Then you should sleep. I'm not sure if I can. Do you want me to leave? No! I said a little too loudly.


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[Assistant] She laughed, then began to hum that same unfamiliar lullaby. Her voice was like an angel's soft in my ear.


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[Assistant] More tired than I realized, exhausted from a day of mental and emotional stress like I had never felt before, I drifted to sleep with her cold body in my arms.


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[Assistant] By the time that horse's leg is well, that pass will be full of snow and I doubt a few folks will get out of here till spring.


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[Assistant] What's going on here, Hawk? Buffalo slaughtered half-day ride from here. Meat left to rot.


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[Assistant] I'm going to die if you do not untie my hands. I need a medicine man.


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[Assistant] Where will you go? Your husband is dead. Where will you go now?


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[Assistant] They say we should be like mountain lion. Attack all who pass through our territory.


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[Assistant] I say white man is like grizzly bear. His weapons are stronger. Mountain lion is wise. He avoids grizzly bear.


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[Assistant] Unless white men hunt buffalo for skin only, then he is no better than a dog so we eat him. Like dogs in our village.


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[Assistant] Terrible. You find me dog, I cook it for you, you will like it.


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[Assistant] You make a mistake. One day he will be back with more braves.


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[Assistant] Mrs. Carver, your baby will be coming soon. You will be better with my people.


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[Assistant] When morning wolf returns with hunting courting, we follow her.


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[Assistant] My people are hungry. The herds are smaller, getting harder to find.


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[Assistant] I go with them now. But I will return before you leave.


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[Assistant] Mrs. Carver must have friends in the East.


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[Assistant] It is home to Cheyenne. My father, my uncle, they die here. Fighting Pawnee, fighting Kaiowa. My brothers, they die fighting white men.


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[Assistant] Mr. Barkley married my cousin. Became one of us.


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[Assistant] Does Mrs. Carver wish to marry Cheyenne? Live as Cheyenne woman?


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[Assistant] I confess. Until Mrs. Carpenter leaves.


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[Assistant] Foolish. Stubborn woman.


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[Assistant] When the fighting begins between your people and my people, I will stand with the Cheyenne. I can no longer help you!


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[Assistant] I am but one voice. I do not yet sit in tribal council.


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[Assistant] My mother, I must talk to you. They say I betray my people.


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[Assistant] That is for me to ask. I live on this land. This is Cheyenne land.


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[Assistant] Hey, call me. Right in the valley of tall grass. Stay low, my mother.


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[Assistant] You should not worry. Burning Wolf will be back soon with my brothers.


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[Assistant] Thank you for, uh, your words with Andrews.


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[Assistant] We talk. He will take you to Oregon with the other wagons.


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[Assistant] You keep horses, food, trade what you need.


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[Assistant] And my people must come first in mine.


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[Assistant] And if I never see another engine around here, it'll be soon enough for me. Run them off the land is what I say. Like we should've run Red Cloud off.


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[Assistant] When I was little, there were sometimes white boys in the camp and they would have a birthday and we would make presents. They told me I must always kiss for each present.


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[Assistant] Okay. Yes, so I think, uh, those of you that know, that are nodding, you know where this is going, right? This is, uh, the Southern State Parkway Bridge to Jones Beach, a beautiful beach in New York, where, uh, if you look at this bridge, what are you seeing about this particular architecture?


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[Assistant] So this is one example of how our n-environments, constructed n-environments can limit behaviors and change composition of spaces.


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[Assistant] Doesn't have to always be this insidious. So here we're looking at, uh, the, uh, Washington DC.


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[Assistant] Here we're looking at, uh, the White House and, and the Capitol. And you can see that it, they're quite far away, one mile away. Uh, today's one mile, no, no big deal. They take Ubers back in the day, not so much, right? So here we're seeing the construction around these areas. You're also seeing this area where it used to be a swamp.


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[Assistant] So this is another example of intentional ways of constructing, uh, our environments.


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[Assistant] Here, Capitol and White House, uh, being built far away from each other to limit the, uh, executive sort of control over, over, uh, the, the legislature.


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[Assistant] The Paris streets, uh, where, how narrow they were, were allowing, uh, sort of, uh, blockades to, uh, happen, uh, during the revolution, uh, and, and that's in fact the thing that was, uh, uh, changed afterwards. So that again is, is our environments, uh, shaping our, our behaviors. Uhm, so I, uhm,


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[Assistant] I think about the, the role of the environment in, in this context, uh, in my work in general, but also in particular in today's talk. This is what we're going to be focused on.


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[Assistant] So as I said, there are two studies that are, I'm not going to be like causally trying to tell you an argument around like how environment matters, but sort of just generally being inspired by that, by that intuition.


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[Assistant] Uh, so here, uh, uh, in, uh, in my lab, we're currently working on network altering interventions to change people's social media repertoires. I will tell you what, what I mean by that in a minute. Uhm, to change those, eh, to change those environments. So I'm not going to be talking about that, uhm,


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[Assistant] Experimental, uh, work today. Instead I'm going to be talking about the work that we did, uh, before that.


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[Assistant] To inform that particular experimental study in that we'll look at the observational study, uh, uh, we, uh, we, uh, carried out to understand how these environments, social environments change organically without us inter, inter, intervening.


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[Assistant] In the second part, uh, in a shorter version of, uh, uh, the, uh, the, the, the two, I'm going to be sharing with you a game that we developed called Guessing, uh, that, uh, is aimed at building fun and engaging environments to deliver a polarization, uh, reducing interventions.


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[Assistant] So let's start with the first one, where the problematic thing that we're focused on is information exposure- misinformation exposure.


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[Assistant] Uh, okay, so, uh, password on, uh, misinformation, uhm, it-


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[Assistant] Great, great studies. A lot of them are focused on individual factors, right? So uhm,


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[Assistant] Things like selective exposure, uh, things like cognitive reflection, inattention, uh, these kinds of aspects that are leading to, uh, misinformation exposure.


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[Assistant] These are really important, but as I said, today we are all about the environment, that's not our focus.


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[Assistant] Environmental factors, uh, the most commonly paid attention to and studied aspect is the algorithm, right? The algorithm of these platforms that we engage with is really


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[Assistant] The, the architecture of the world that we are engaging with. So that's, that's a really sort of common...


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[Assistant] So the other environment that I think is paid less attention to, uh, in the way it's constructed is, is the environment that we build for ourselves. So this is sort of the demand factor, if you will, right? Like that, uh,


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[Assistant] Uh, but demand factor can be demand for misinformation, but it might be also the way that I, I develop my own environment and how that has implications for misinformation.


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[Assistant] Uh, so a good parallel of this in media studies, in communication, is what Kim refers to as media reportoirs.


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[Assistant] And I'll take you back to the, uh, the, uh, Robert, Robert Moses, uh, the, the architect, uh, that, that developed, uh, these bridges, uh, this, this, this story very briefly, uh, just to give you another anecdote here. So here, uh, there is a, um, um,


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[Assistant] It's very hard to tear down the bridge once it's built up, right? So that's, that's sort of the real reality of the physical world. The thing about the online world is that it's quite easy to break down that bridge.


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[Assistant] Unfollow, right? So the question is, uh, given that it's dynamic, given that things are not just being built up but also being torn down, uh, our question was can we get people to, to sort of tear down these problematic connections and, and again the question is, is it happening on its own?


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[Assistant] So we had two ques- two high level sort of sets of questions. Uh, the first one is around prevalence. So our question was how often are misinformation spreaders unfollowed? And for that we basically have two snapshots of the network, uh, and we're examining the degree to which these, uh, these edges are disappearing. And because


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[Assistant] We want to have this be in context, right? If I get a number, how will I know if that number is low or high? We also wanted to have a control group, so we wanted to understand how, uh,


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[Assistant] Uh, but uhm, as I said, our goal is also to have these interventions, uh, out in the real world. So we wanted to, uh, have some insights as to how we should shape these interventions. So we, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The second set of questions related to here is the predictors. So the question is, what predicts


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] On following misinformation spreaders, so here, uh, we're sort of limited by the things that we could get at scale from the API, but it's, uh, things around initial exposure, ideology, edge characteristics, and platform activity. Those are the aspects that we are studying.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, so related to this predictors, we had a set of hypotheses or sort of deeper, I guess, research inquiries in mind. Uh, the first set related to


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, initial exposure, like the amount of initial exposure. How does that relate to the chances that you would unfollow someone?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So uhm, we could, we saw it, it could go in one of two ways. So the first one was what we refer to as a reversion hypothesis.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You're exposed to misinformation at time t1, the more likely you are going to be to unfollow at time t2, right? So that's, uh, that's maybe the sort of the positive, uh, uh, story if we, if we see that. And this could happen for a number of different reasons, right? It could be high redundancy, the more misinformation followers, uh, misinformation spreaders you follow.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The other way this could go is, uh, sort of, uh, self-imposing, uh, misinformation exposure being self-imposing, what we refer to as the inertia hypothesis, which is that the higher exposure at time t1 is associated with lower unfollowing at time t2.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Right, so this could be again due to many reasons. It could be that high exposure at time t1 can be a consequence of selective exposure. Like you are seeking out what us, you know, researchers and fact checkers normatively decided is misinformation.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So, and, and therefore you're sort of, it's an indication that you have demand for it. And there is a sort of studies that would indicate that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So, uh, uh, that's, uh, that's one reason as to why we were expecting that. The other reason is that, uh, most misinformation that's out there tends to have a conservative leaning. So that might be also misaligned with your, uh, with your thinking and there might be another reason why you might be more likely to unfollow.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The fifth hypothesis was that there would be an interaction with, a negative interaction with conservatism and ideological strength. In that, conservative extreme people would be much less likely to unfollow compared to conservative


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, uh, sorry, uh, extreme, extreme liberals. So, uh, the interaction.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So, those were the kind of high-level questions that we had, uh, we had in mind. Uhm, just tell you a little bit about our data. I'm really masking a lot of the nitty-gritty here, but imagine so we have this network.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, and identified the people who shared them, uh, both to the URLs, tweets, and retweets, and so forth. We, uh, filtered out, uh, debunking, uh, tweets, uh, and at the end, uh, also, uh, limited our attention to, uh, spreaders that have less than 20,000 followers. So, our goal again was one, to study regular users, but two, again,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, so that gives us, uh, 5.6, uh, thousand spreaders. We collected their followers, uh, gives us these edges. Those are the edges that we really want to understand. Are they, are they disappearing? And what, which ones of those are, are disappearing?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So to study this predictor, uh, world we are living in only focused on these bold edges. Uh, we limited our attention to obviously the accounts that were existing in


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, so this gives us, uh, the, the misinformation spreader edges. As I said, we wanted to understand how that compares to a control group, and to make that be comparable, we basically fixed our analysis on the followers. So for the followers, we identify


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And alters other people that they follow, uh, that don't spread misinformation.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So these are the dotted edges. And when we are looking at this prevalence question, we're going to be comparing the bolded versus dotted edges. We couldn't do it for everyone due to API limitations. There are too many followers for whom to get


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Information. That is true. It might be that they don't know at the time. Uh, we did not limit it to the case. Maybe you could have been like they are identified in March and then in April we do that collection. So I think we did it both at the, both in March. So there might be some cases where they're not debunked, uh, uh, right away. Yeah. Great question. Uhm, okay.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So just to give you some sort of more intuition about our sample, I'll just give you some descriptive analysis. So here we're looking at the ideology of the followers, uh, in our, in our sample and how, uh, you know, the count of those.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, but you can see that also they tend to be a lot more extreme compared to, uh, our liberal sample.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We also want to understand the sort of questions around entrenchment. Like how many follow- how many misinformation spreaders a given person is following. So here we're looking at that distribution.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You can see that it's high, uh, it's right skewed. Uh, most people, that's, that's a positive finding, right? Most people follow only one misinformation spreader. So if you could intervene and break that tie, you could sort of disconnect them from this misinformation, at least the health misinformation world.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, but there are these people that are, uh, highly entrenched, uh, and it's, it's a larger, uh, subgroup for conservatives. So conservatives are, uh, following more misinformation spreaders, uh, than, than liberals. Yeah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, so for the, for these highly entrenched people, we want to understand, uh, who they are.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, we can see that, uh, they are more extreme. This is the absolute ideology, right? So, you know, both, uh, high, uh, positive and high negative values.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] If you look at the broader reciprocation rate, it actually, to us, it was astonishing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] 69% of edges to misinformation spreaders are, are reciprocated, which is quite high.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, and we see that this is actually driven by a few spreaders. So a lot, uh, a few spreaders are, seems like maybe they are, uh, engaging in maybe follow back strategies to try to keep, keep people in. And unfortunately, as we will see later on in the talk, this probably is a good strategy.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Or it could be that they are in these sort of tight-limited communities, uh, as well. Okay, so.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The results, uhm, how often are misinformation spreaders unfollowed and how does that compare to unfollowing rate of non-spreaders?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This is where we start seeing, you know, I guess unfortunate results. So here we're looking at the unfollowing rates, and obviously we have a smaller number of spreaders in our sample, so that's why we have higher variance for that group, but we can see that unfollowing rate is quite


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And unfortunately, they are stickier, those edges are stickier than connections to non-spreaders, right? So users are 31% more likely to unfollow non-misinformation spreaders than spreaders, which is an unfortunate finding here.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, the earlier studies in 2010s, turns out people were unfollowing at higher rates. Uh, even the later studies where you have like, uh, 2018 and 17, our unfollowing rates are still lower compared, uh, to, to those.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So, uh, so what we're finding is, uh, lower unfollowing rates compared to past work. And I didn't include it here, but there's a very interesting study by Kaiser et al. where they looked at people's unfollowing intentions.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So this was an experimental work where they asked people if whether they would unfollow someone who's spreading this information and they were asking questions around ideology.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's, it's not apples to apples comparison because it's a like, Likert scale. Uh, but in sort of intuitively what I would expect based on that, which was sort of people's range was at like two out of five.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And which is basically can be represented by this hypergeometric, uh, distribution. So the- the purple is what you would expect under this null model. And the red is what you expect in terms of the number of, uh, uh, actual misinformation edges that are being, uh, broken. So again,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, so now two predictors of unfollowing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, so here we use this robust logistic regression, uh, model.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, so uhm, the first thing that we're seeing is that reciprocity is the biggest predictor.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The reciprocated ties are just broken in much, much, uh, less, uh, uh, frequent ways.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's more important than ideology, which is, you know, like we, we have a really high intuition about like what, what ideology would do here. So the second important is the-


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Ideology, which supports our hypothesis three, that is, uh, liberals are more likely to, to unfollow, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Now to the reversion versus, uh, uh, inertial hypothesis. At the end of the day, our measures are pretty crude because those are the ones that we had access to from, uh, from, uh, the API, uh, but


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] According to the measures that we have access to, which is basically the number of spreaders that you follow and how much those spreaders are talking, which all would kind of, uh, relate to how much you're exposed to, uh, uh, misinformation, that- both of those are pointing to the version hypothesis.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So the more you follow that time t1, the more you're likely to unfollow at time t2 for each of these edges. Which is the one positive thing that we have here.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The hypothesis four, we were expecting that ideologically extreme people to unfollow, uh, less often.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We did not see that. Uh, we see a barely significant and positive effect for extremity. So, which is really sort of baffling.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, but I'll tell you a little bit more about that as we talk about the interactions. So we didn't hear high hypothesis 4 refuted, 3 supported, and we see the support for the version hypothesis.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Absolutely. Yeah, it is a huge effect. Yeah, it's like proportionally it is going from, uh, 0.3 to, yeah, 0.3 to, you know, I guess it's negative, so it's going to be 0.1 something something, yes. Absolutely. Yeah.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay, so interactions. The first one was we found this overall reversion hypothesis, like evidence for that as opposed to inertia. The question is, is that really true for a cross, uh, to, to ideolo- I was gonna say parties, but we really have ideology as our measure.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, so here we again have the marginal effect, but now separated, uh, by the conservatives and liberals. So what we're finding here is that, uh, reversion hypothesis holds separately for both liberals and conservatives. Both of the, like, everything is above zero, right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, but the effect is 1.7 times as strong for liberals. So liberals who are following more misinformation spreaders are a lot more likely to unfollow at time t- t2. Uh, but it still holds, even though the effect is small for conservatives as well.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So even the conservatives that are following a lot are, are unfollowing, uh, more, more often. Now the ideological strength.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This was masking, uh, a large partisan asymmetry between the two groups. So here we're looking at the marginal effects of, uh, extremity for conservatives and liberals separately. And now we're seeing that extreme conservatives are less likely to unfollow.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Nonsignificant positive, but in, in, in practice, if you look at them separately, extreme liberals are, are, uh, unfollowing while extreme conservatives are, are not. Uh, so this is, uh, support for hypothesis five. We're, uh, looking at the interaction. Okay, so, uh, limitations, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Many. Uh, so, uh, one, our way of identifying this information was high precision, but-


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Presumably low recall, right? We are only looking at things that Poltifact says are misinformation. Uh, we focused on regular spreaders and patterns might vary significantly for, uh, for, you know,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, still, I think, to acknowledge. Our study period is, well, weird.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We won't be able to. So, unfortunately, edits to the study in terms of data collection are pretty limited at this point because of the API limits. Uh, but just a few concluding thoughts here. Unfollowing rate is really rare. Rare compared to control group, past studies, and unfollowing intentions.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] This discrepancy between what people, what people say their intentions are versus what we are seeing in here.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, I think has important implications. One is that like hypothetical studies do not generally capture what people actually do. This is not a criticism of this great work. I think it's a great work just to know that they capture different things, right? In the same way as like surveys and, and, and, and the social media perhaps capture, capture different things. But also,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Towards their intended or at least stated goals.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So reciprocity was a really strong predictor. This again I think has implications, at least that's informing our study, uh, where we kind of wanna-


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Have our best shots. So if you want to have your best shot, maybe first approach trying to break ties that are not reciprocated.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So that's, uh, that- that's one idea.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We found stronger evidence for reverse hypothesis as opposed to inertia, but we don't know the mechanism. And again, the mechanism matters for how you intervene, right?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So the information redundancy, then you might wanna in your message remind the person that this person is just like


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Extreme conservatives are more likely to consume misinformation that we already knew from past work. What our work adds here is that we are also seeing that they are less likely to severe ties to spread misinformation and they are even less likely to severe those ties the more spreaders that they follow.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Most importantly, uhm, thanks to collaborators, Josh, who is a fantastic, uh, doctoral student. He led this work from, uh, uh, from, you know, basically, uh, start to finish. He's doing all of the, sorry, I'm getting updates. No, not updates.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The examples that we- we've seen, so we looked at some of these, uhm, spreaders and- and- and the misinformation that's being spread. There is-


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's conservatives, but there are, there are those that are coming from the, the liberal side and in fact, uh, the, the,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I didn't go into the details of our, uh, sampling strategy. If you- if you just-


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Change the world as it exists today and might be partly due to


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, now we're thinking about an environment in a sort of a different way, which is that, uh, which is, uh, we, we were thinking around this problem of polarization this time, sort of out-party hate, and how can we sort of change that world, and there are really interesting findings from, from past work in political communication as to how we do that. Our goal in this work is to


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And there are perhaps ways to fix it, right? So uhm, and there are really interesting studies here. One of them is this mega-study that's, uhm, sort of being at least


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Build up at Stanford, uh, with, uh, you know, contributions from various scholars, uhm.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, the one that is, uh, of attention, sort of our focus is, uh, is that people perceive out-party supporters to be more extreme than they are, right? Uh, so, uh,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Let's take for an example, let's look at this question. What percentage of Republicans support requiring background checks for gun purchases at private sales or gun shows? So who here thinks that's at least 20%?


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That you, uh, correct such misperceptions. This is done in lab settings. Uh, and again, our goal is change the environment.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Take people from the lab, put them in a game setting, try to deliver the same type of intervention and see what happens with that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, that appeals to wider audience. Uhm, it's, you can also design them in a way to create a wide range of interactions between, between players.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And really games create this sort of magic circle around the players where you have a different psychological and sort of social, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Mindset that you get into so that you can sort of break people away from their political identities.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We want to minimize partisan cues to take people out of their sort of, uh, uh, party ID, uh, uh, uh, thinking.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, and slow thinking, uh, we want to get people to really reflect on the information that was being provided as opposed to sort of fast actions. Uh, and we also included in-game messages.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, to, eh, to, eh, to, eh, eh, allow people to engage with, with each other in, in deep ways. So,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What's the game? The game is called, uh, guessing. Uh, guessing in a synchronized way. Uh, this is not the...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Most popular board game, but wavelength. Has anyone here played wavelength before? I see some nods. Okay.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So pairs of players are randomly matched together and play five rounds of games. In each round, two players are shown a question. They work together as a team to provide clues and guess the answer. So that's kind of the high level thing.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Let me show you like what the game looks like. So imagine, so here you, you are matched with, uh, Ali. Uh, you can see that our, our, uh, sort of icons are really sort of


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, and you're going to make a guess. You each are separately making a guess. So you slide this, uh, slider to make your guess. Uh, and, uh, in the next round, one of you is going to be a clue giver. The other one is going to be the guesser.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, so the clue giver sees this information. It sees that the right answer is 70%. Right? Now you need to give the other person just one word.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] To get them to guess 70%. And you're given this target number and you're given a scale. Hot to cold.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The reason that we want the clue to be not about the question is that again it should be less about, uh, the political knowledge when the question is about politics, but really is like devoid of that so you can think about something else.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, so if you guys- if you- if your, uh, guesser guesses something close enough, you got- you get points. And then you have- you do this like seven- five rounds, at the end of which you kind of get- get this, uh, result, uh, of how well you did overall, like your guesses and the actual number and the score that you got.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So, this is a game. We basically use this game in an experimental procedure to test how we can deliver, uh, misinformation, uh, sorry, misperception correcting interventions in this case.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So the way that we did this is we pre-registered a between-subjects MTurk experiment. So we're only asking people questions around their polarization or, you know, mediators and moderators who are interested at the very end. So we're only looking at differences between groups.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Mixed version where some of the questions are political, some are not. And fully political where all of the questions are political. Right? So uhm, we wanted to understand, you know, we didn't know if the mixed versus fully would be better because, you know, fully


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So that was our reason as to why we had these three groups. We had a post-game survey asking about the outcome of interest, mediators and moderators. I'm not going to talk about the mediators and moderators here, I'm just going to focus on the main finding. Uh, because we had our, uh, uhm, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There are many questions that we could have chosen. We basically again went back to MTurk to try to assess the size of misperception. So we wanted to understand how, how people get the answer wrong, especially for the odd party. And we picked the questions that had the largest misperception.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So that was done before, now we found the questions for which people we think are misunderstanding the other side and those are the questions that we use. The main hypothesis was that players playing the mixed


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And fully political versions of the game will have lower out-party hostility and will show higher willingness to talk to out-party supporters compared to control version. We did not have again a hypothesis comparing the mixed and fully because again we thought there are reasons that could go, uh, could go both ways.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, the results, uh, what were the results? Unfortunately, uh, there was no main, significant main effects on reducing out-party hostility.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, and I'll be happy to talk to you about our analysis that suggests why we have the results that we have, if we have the time at the end.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, so in that there, if you look at the, the hostility that you, that you see in our group versus other studies that are looking at effective polarization, it's lower. And also they are, uh, their misunderstandings on the other side are also


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] In retrospect, we did not imagine that this would be the case, so we, uh, that's, you know, uh, future work, I guess. Uhm, but anyway, so the, the thing that was, you know, I'm an iSchool information person, so it's,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Okay, so then here again the idea was to change an environment and, uh, to make things fun, uh, so that they can scale. The asymmetry is concerning. Again, I am happy to talk more about the reasons as to why we have seen that.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Along with our undergraduate students who were- who were so helpful in- in helping us, uh, sort of design this game and test it and so forth. And again, uh, the- this time the, uh, co-advisor being, uh, Paul Vesnik. So, yeah, that's all I have. Um, thank you.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Make it such that those kinds of things are less likely to happen. So that's one thing that is like they will, uh,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There won't be as much of a, of a reaction, a negative reaction, but also again, things that just people will wanna do.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So, is your, like, cause you, like, you know.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] For you to come to the lab, for you to do that. So that, it's a thing that people want to do repeatedly and, and, and learn from. So, so that was the main goal of the, the game itself. Uhm, like, or game, using games, period.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] All of these things, there are simpler versions where you can have people just play games on their own for them to correct misperceptions and gamify this problem.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Qualitative as opposed to, by the way, the chat is disabled during the guessing part because you don't want people to be giving each other extra information. It's only sort of in the beginning, like hi, and it's more, you're sort of seeing more like positive things, like oh man, this is great, you know, cool, I thought this was fun. And I think that we did not, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Try to design, over-design that, but we have a lot of work and, uh, sort of HCI work that would say, like once you have a, put a chat thing there.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It could go in all kinds of ways, right? People could be nasty to each other, but because it's a cooperative game, we were expecting there not to be as many sort of issues there, but just like allowing people to make this be more sort of fun and interactive. So that was our goal.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] There were a thousand different analyses were run here. Uh, I don't know if we looked into this and, uh, uhm.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I actually, I don't remember. I think, I expect there not to be an effect because we tried to remove as much as possible and the clues are also not like political clues but like the scale that we're talking about.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uh, for the unfollowing, uh, uh, you know, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] What I would imagine, what we should be doing is perhaps not as, as top down as, as, uh, uh, you know, in this, in this other, other case. So.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Trying to deceive people, uh, uh, which, you know, we're, uhm,


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Not at the end, so hopefully this will, like if it's a...


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] You can if you want to. She's in there.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I know I have, but I don't wanna go.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] I wish I could have sailed her with you, Mr. Now. I bet you that was fun.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Mr. Hopkins. That's what I was fighting Steve about. Then I went up to your classroom to tell you I was sorry. And I saw you and him.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] We have a fabulous facility with quality environments for the animals.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's, it's, it's definitely uhm, it's an adjusting type of thing. You gotta adjust to it, but.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Uhm, no, obviously I'm from St. Louis and played in Kansas City, so it's a little bit of humidity out there. Obviously nothing like this, but uhm, you know, I'm kind of getting used to it, uhm, getting.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] That's my, my optimum weight is I want to be there and, and it was hard for me to get there.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] It's just the mentality, honestly. Uhm, I mean, you know, at the end of the day, you call the play and you execute it. All 32 teams do that. And so it's really a mentality. I mean, this defense has been a top defense for years and years. Uhm, having the confidence of.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Oh, it's huge. Uhm, it's, it's, it's very primary. You know, you gotta, you gotta have that cohesion along the D line because if you don't, then rush lanes get disturbed, distorted, then.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] So you gotta kinda figure that out, and I have to let my teammates know, hey, you know, you got your power noses, sitting there noses, you know, like, I would say Lindvall, Joseph, uhm, you know, guys like that, and you got more kinda athletic, can play the little three, quick moving, like Kenny Clark, people like that, so.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] When it's like this is a situation we're doing it, you know, the look come and then we own. So that's that, you know, just togetherness that I'll talk about.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] Yeaah, absolutely. This is the most team sport there is, man. It's the greatest team sport in the world, so definitely gotta have a selfless mindset.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And finally almost five months out it was clear there was no hope of going on without repairing the drive spines.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] The OOB was suddenly doing only a quarter of a light year per hour, in a volume that tested good for two.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] And things were getting worse. They would have no trouble making it to harmonious repose. But beyond that... Harmonious repose.


[User] Please transcribe this text

[Assistant] An ugly name, thought Ravna. Fem's light-hearted translation was worse. Rest in peace. In the beyond, almost everything habitable was in use. Civilizations were transient and races faded. But there were always new people moving up from below.


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[Assistant] The result was most often patchwork poly-specific systems.


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[Assistant] Young races just up from the slowness, lived on easily with the remnants of older peoples.


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[Assistant] According to the ship's library, RIP had been in the beyond for a long time.


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[Assistant] It had been continuously inhabited for at least 200 million years. Time for 10,000 species to call it home.


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[Assistant] The most recent notes showed better than 100 racial terrains.


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[Assistant] Now they were flying down the main net trunk towards R.I.P. They'd be able to listen to the news the whole way in.


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[Assistant] Harmonious repose advertised. At least one species valued external goods, specializing in ship outfitting and repair.


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[Assistant] An industrious, hard-footed race, the ad said.


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[Assistant] Eventually she saw some video. The creatures walked on ivory tusks and had a froth of short arms growing from just below their necks.


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[Assistant] The ads included net addresses of satisfied users. Too bad we can't follow up on those.


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[Assistant] Instead, Ravna sent a short message in Trisqualine, requesting generic drive replacements and listing possible methods of payment. Meantime, the bad news kept rolling in.


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[Assistant] Crypto Zero, as received by OOB Shipboard Ad Hoc, Language Path, Beloresque, Trisquiline, SJK units.


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[Assistant] Alliance forces are preparing for action against the tools of the perversion. It is time for our friends to declare themselves. At the moment, we do not need your military pledges, but in the very near future, we will need support services, including free net time. In the coming seconds, we will be watching closely to see who supports our action and who may be enslaved to the perversion.


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[Assistant] If you live with the human infestation, you have a choice. Act now with a good possibility of victory, or wait and be destroyed. Death to vermin.


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[Assistant] But there was more sympathy than conviction in his voice.


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[Assistant] We still don't know that this is more than a single loudmouth. There's no definite word of ship movements. What can they do, after all? Ravna pushed herself up from the table. Not much, I hope.


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[Assistant] There are hundreds of civilizations with small human settlements.


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[Assistant] Surely they've taken precautions since this death to vermin stuff began.


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[Assistant] By the powers, I wish I knew Saundra Kay was safe.


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[Assistant] It had been more than two years since she'd seen Lynn and her parents.


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[Assistant] Sometimes Chandra Kay seemed something from another life.


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[Assistant] On the other side of the command deck, the Scroed Riders have been working on the repair specs. Now Blue Shell rolled toward them.


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[Assistant] I do fear for the small settlements, but the humans at Sandra Kay are the driving force of that civilization. Even the name is a human one.


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[Assistant] Any attack on them would be an attack on the entire civilization. Greenstalk and I have traded there often enough, and with their commercial security forces. Only fools or bluffers would announce an invasion beforehand. Ravna thought a moment, brightened.


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[Assistant] The Dyrachymes and Lophurs would stand against any threat to humankind at Seondra K. Yeah, we're not a ghetto there.


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[Assistant] Things might be very bad for isolated humans, but Sandra K. would be okay.


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[Assistant] Bluffers. Well, it's not called the net of a million lies for nothing.


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[Assistant] She pulled her mind back from worries beyond her control.


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[Assistant] But one thing is clear, stopping at harmonious repose