so so this uh all the examples and I think now nowadays even though uh uh, this kind of expensive for example musicals all these people still can afford it's not like one piece of ticket you know one ticket cost uh one thousand dollars okay there's too extreme


but even you know like two hundred forty eight okay I paid for it right it's kind of a pain it's very expensive but after I've gone and I really enjoyed was like, !wow! an eye opener for me and the that kind of world and how they can actually do it live


you know you have singing live there you know for me I keep I am very forgetful so if I'm good to say forget to my you know my, uh lyrics so you know all all the words and lines you know I freak out ya but I think this is wonderful and it's a totally different aspect of you know art to me


debate topic one


okay there's no such thing as bad art, I am the proposition, just art is very subjective, is uh depends on the angle you look at it


it and the perspective, and art also can be very abstract, so , what I'm emphasising is there's no such things as bad art, and it's like beauty is in the eye of the beholder


uh okay, and is very largely also uh influenced by the culture, our culture uh our background


even our age group, and uh, our education background, and uh, even , also the the


the upbringing that we go we we we we go through and also exposure we had, so , ya what my point is uh there's no bad art lah


ya, so , it depends really how you look at it, and uh ye a apiece of art can be


can be uh beautiful and in one person's eye bad in another person's eye it may, uh be a trash ya to that person so it's really really subjective


uh


K, uh I'm done, ya I have stated some pointers ya


uh okay


okay ya having heard uh what you had shared, that , you agree that it's bad art lah and you were saying that uh if if that piece of art you know doesn't


what I understand it doesn't cater to your taste, then it's like it seems uh for example you mention about graffiti that is is like ugly in your eyes, I guess


art is a form of expression, and uh, it's uh expression of the artist like ya as you say it may be uh a message that ya artist wants to uh wants to convey


or it's expression of uh his inner world or emotions or his uh trying to , stress the point something so it's uh it's really a form expression and if you put a


okay if you put uh uh uh uh uh let's say uh, a boundary to it then that there's no freedom


and then then you don't call that art and of course if the art is , ya offensive maybe in terms of


to certain race or something like that then I think uh that is also depends on the country ya where the art is displayed and, uh that the art is done so like you you mentioned about like for example the portrait of the human body ya it can be like


it seems that it is can be this it's like this daughter is uh ugly in terms of proportion or even uh, you mentioned about the colours used like uh either too dark and it's not soothing and the way it it doesn't blend


then uh it's considered as bad art that uhuh I don't agree with that because , the choice of colours and even the proportion the weight uh that art is expressed whether is in form of a


a sculpture or a painting or a a piece of pottery it really uh is what the artist wants to reflect, so it can be , depends lah depends on probably the the emotion the the uh uh kind of mood the artist wants to


to express so uh it's really really a subjective it's just like for example you look at uh antique to some it's, like my grandmother's maybe a piece of uh an old chair or something uh furniture to some it may stick to it may seem like a piece of junk


but to some is a treasure, so it's really depends uh on the perspective how you look at it, and uh there's no right or wrong to me and that's why there's no bad art ya in my viewpoint


and largely also how the person interprets the piece of art it it uh it also affects how his viewpoint, ya how he measures that piece of art so for example like uh


picasso or van gogh you know the paintings they did you know to some they're not appreciated or not , , consider maybe as a uh uh nice piece of art in those days at their uh the time they're born the time it's done but it's like after after they're


after they they are dead then it's like the painting becomes so uh precious and is greatly appreciated a worldwide, so ya it's really subjective there's no uh bad art ya


K what I'm hearing is that you make some points about imitation it's uh


considered bad art and that means you just take uh maybe a famous painting and you try to uh copy and modify it, something along the line then uh of course that is like


plagiarism already and , maybe , I would say it's not even art la so uh, I won't say, people call that art oh okay


pass pass it off as art, , uh okay


okay I get your point ya so I would say uh for example the mona lisa I I guess it's widely used it;s like as a advertising gimmicks, they sort of like uh make it comical or or at some humour to it you know by some tag line or some changes so


it it's not original so I would not say that is art lah that's not a piece art is is just uh form advertising, and , and from what you shared about uh , if the if a if a piece of art evoked uh uh uh a sense of uh uhinsult or you felt offence offended then is considered bad art right so


it's so it is that's why it depends on the person who is viewing it and what kind of uh uh, emotion this person is getting from their piece of art it differs from, uh different person to a different person so this person a may get this feeling and person B may get another feeling so uh


so what I want to summarise that is there's no bad


two debate topic two


okay, ya alright okay I'm hearing that you you propose that singaporeans


your proposition is that singaporeans appreciate that appeal of theatre dance or music in our society, , I choose to differ because uh this is only possible with uh the


government our government pushing for it our government a lot due to our government's funding sponsorship, uh that gets it going otherwise uh, I would think uh there will be uh uh


limits to to this part of appreciation, and uh yes the government is uh promoting it like and uh setting up uh, , there's a theatre school dancing schools and trying to you know even having as you as you mentioned that esplanade you know a a place to


the iconic place to hold uh arts performances etcetera ya, uh I think partly also uh this is also due to as you say commercialisation so to bringing actually


I mean the group also had to bring in money lah in a in a sense ya so uh it's still uh I will say is still there's a monetary factor involved, and , , you'll say of course you will say that if without arts and all that uh you know


you mentioned that oh life will be boring but I think besides arts and all that there are many things to enjoy too, in our life ya they are , though singapore is small we do have places to go uh nature parks


and uh well you can also spend time with uh friends or family, you know doing uh uh bonding activities and all that so , and I find that our


even the the theatre in dance and music uh for example , okay some of the theatres and all that , I've been to some performances and all that ya there are cases whereby actually


some musicals and all that their cases whereby the theatre is actually half-filled, and quite a few times I was uh upgraded my actually I bought the cheapest ticket there is uh upgraded lah just to fill up the seat in front


ya so there's still uh I would say , a lack of uh uh, appreciation of the appear of arts here, and , (pop)


and I see that if let's say uh some of the performances or or events that are free, of course there will be uh it will tend to attract lah because is free ya if you asked singaporeans to really uh pay


uh I don't uh I don't disagree that there are people who pay, but uh there s still a big portion uh singaporeans that uh they won't pay like, hundred dollars or uh uh more than fifty dollars for a ticket to watch a performance and uh unless there are a lot of freebies or as you say uh


complimentary uh ya and for example like uh because due to it COVID, you know all these events are many you know such events or or events uh didn't happen ya cancel or postpone


uh I mean I see that ya there are online streaming and all that and most of these are free actually and, some after that when they implement uh payment I don't uh really see uh the the crowd coming in


so I would say , the appreciation uh there's uh, much more room for that lah ya, eight minutes


okay ya so , I I guess singaporeans, if you are talking singaporeans uh it depends on what's the percentage lah I don't know whether there is a statistic uh done a survey done


ya I I I could only say that it only refers to a certain category of uh singaporeans that that will actually, uh fall into this ya uh category of appreciation and uh uh if you are talking singaporeans as a whole I think uh is uh


I don't really agree lah totally and you look at the arts scene here is like uh even the theatre I mean our local you are talking about our local art scene is like coming, you go you see the same old faces same feel faces like


, uh dim sum dolly you know it's like, is like you can name it lah is just this field and the productions wise uh is like uh


and , and there are not many uh arts groups lah is really uh limited, ya so I will think


that uh, there still a long way to go lah for singaporeans yeah in this area, (mmhmm) ya uh


, ya okay


okay I I defer because I feel that most singaporeans still feel that arts a waste of time as they favour other more, worthy pursuit which produce more tangible and physical results, like uh like even those graduates you know, those in, in other faculty are actually are earning more


ya, than those in the arts so uh, ya, so I I


debate topic three


the topic is the arts are a luxury and not anecessity


in the context of our society which is a singapore society, okay I , I agree totally agree that art is a luxury and is not a necessity, if you look at the in general the maslow hierarchy system okay our basic needs have to be met first


before we progress, and like self development and the top of the triangle is like when you actually uh, you know to to uh to other area like enjoying arts for for a self development that so uh in our context I would think that


uh it is not not, not that is not is , we can have arts but it's not a it's not a necessity, ya, so to uh we we I think the basic needs we must have the livelihood first I mean I mean to be practical lah in a practical society if we don't have money if you don't have uh your you know


you want to pay your bills you know to settle your life then uh, put food on table you know then arts actually come uh much much uh, I would say in terms of priority it will come uh quite far behind ya


so to to many singaporeans well arts arts is uh is a form a luxury, ya and, and of course uh we can say that you know some some in appreciating arts some uh we may not need to uh pay a high price but if you look at like


like performances those uh uh uhuh those are brought in from overseas, you know you know that look at the tickets they're very pricey it can go as high as a few hundreds or even like those concert you know by uh uh a person


by a famous pop stars and all that is like the the price is really , rocket high the price the price the price of tickets and if you talk about , unless okay the government is like


promoting like giving a free admission or you know special discounts uh then would then you see probably , there'll be more people uh uh get to enjoy ya uh appreciating uh art so uh in my view that is


is not a necessity after all ya, ya and , and also in terms of time there are people uh are out there who are working as slogging and say they don't have time


ya you know the they rather spend a time uh uh resting after a hard day work or spending time with their family, and and uh or even uh, probably doing things they want ya so


I would say it's I will still uh emphasised that it's not an necessity in singapore, so what what do you have to say leah


I choose to defer because uh in maybe a necessity to a percentage of our of our population but uh


I won't say in terms of majority ya and uh , and, is not a necessity because we we we can live without it and we still survive


that if uh, if we don't have uh like as just said what is considered necessity like uh uh our livelihood or uh


or jobs ya to pay our bills and all that then uh that is considered a necessity you know we can't uh go without them, you know to carry on your life ya that for arts is you can do without and you still can survive and go on your life ya


and the point that is a luxury because because our as in singapore we has a high cost of living here high standard of living, so uh hence uh many people of our singaporeans actually dismiss arts lah and uh you know uh music or even piano classes art classes though they're very popular you know here because


you know parents want their children to go for all this you know just cultivate such hobbies you know to uh, to appear like that's their how to say <mandarin>you xiu yang</mandarin> or very uh


artistic in a sense so I would say is uh still a luxury here and , and also because of this that many people here also afraid to be freelancers


ya as it's not seen as a full time or a proper career ya and people still uh, look up to stand ya so, just now you mentioned about ya but our museums are free you know for singaporeans and that's that's because the government is actually promoting


you know trying to encourage uh ya to encourage our our people uh uh, and as a form of uh, I would say as a form of priviledge and concession lah for singaporeans are


ya otherwise the museums will be empty I would say you'll see tourists, uh, forking out money for that or I mean a small percentage of singaporeans still pay to go museums all that for certain uh exhibition and all that, you know this as you mentioned the CC you know sometimes uh give tickets and all that you know free tickets andthen you know for for group you know that


really really when you come to counting uh how many will actually really pay pay to go ya if there are no uh concessions and all that, yeah so uh it is still consider a a form a luxury lah in my opinion yaya


and , what else are you saying okay then what about have you see like if you talk about arts like paintings uh form of arts you know that art gallery


if you look at the art gallery in singapore right the things that they sell or the the the pieces that they sell it's inside the galleries, I mean why it is so expensive, I mean it's priced the the prices can be like thousand million so it's really a a luxury and people who actually buy them appreciate them


uh people of a certain class uh ya people of a certain uh, normally the the the I would say the rich lah ya they will go for orders and even for auctions and all that like uh


for uh those art pieces, or, you know it's it's always normally the rich will attend ya, and you see the the uh the elite lah the elite and and this people uh attending all these functions ya


ya, rich and famous as you call


ya okay uh to wrap up ya you you think that uh ya you enjoy arts and all that I mean there's no doubt I mean ya people who enjoy arts you know and , who uh


who who appreciate and all that but my point it's still a luxury lah not a necessity


part one debate topic one


so so just to confirm Jun will be uh we we're we're organising our thoughts now and then we will start the Jun will start with the proposition right


okay


okay so I I actually disagree with uh whether types different types of writings are superior to others, reason being because I feel that there are there are different type of writings that are targeted to different audience each writing have their specific impact


to that targeted uh audience so for example say there are people who like to watch the news , and they the the information that comes for the news will be the most impactful to them whereas like if someone that likes to read blog post instead of reading the news the blog post will be equally or


it'll be equally as effective to that person so I think that I don't think certain writings are more superior to others uh I just think that they are they're more relevant or more effective to their targeted uh groups


so what do you think about my point


okay I I I think I get your your point so you are trying to indicate that you know (ppc)


nowadays uh writings that are online and more accessible to to the mass public is uh is gonna be more superior than other writings right like for example say uh nowadays anybody can access uh


Facebook or even those uh news online they just have to go to like WWW dot uh straits times or CNN dot com and then they can read it, but actually I I don't agree that


even with that span or that ability to reach more people it makes it more superior, my stand is that even though they , even though they have a wider reach okay they also have some flaws to it and I'm pretty sure all of us know the flaws there are a lot of fake news nowadays on


on Facebook on on on even sometimes they have fake websites uh to to come out and show the news right a lot of these uh have, shown that you know some of these sources are not reliable and whereas if I asked you to read the physical newspaper okay that's a that's a that's a type of writing right you I'm pretty sure that you will have more confidence in that physical printout than the


the online news despite it having you know, many many shares and everything so so my point here is that I don't think that one channel is more uh or one type of writing is more superior than other I think every every type of writing has its pros and cons


and it can be outweighed and uh chosen by the the reader themself, for example say if you were to ask me I want to have a concrete evidence I want to have a printout I want to have something that I can know that


uh somebody, rubber-stamped it you know whereas like it's something online that I read on Facebook you know I I feel that that page is not very trustable then I I won't go and believe it but I know that there are people that will believe it


and I know that people who who don't trust the newspaper sources as well they will say that you know the government has uh, err vetted through all these news and it and it's not very uh, real and and and and correct sometimes you know it might be politically corrected to them but I think that each of them have their own pros and cons


and I think that there's not one type that is more superior ya


okay so actually this brings me to, something that we we have yet to touch on right so what's the definition of superior you know what what defines whether a writing is more superior to another from from what from your point uh you mentioned that what means uh what is superior means that


more people read to it therefore it's superior am I right is that is that what you are trying to put across, ya so actually to be honest to define that something is superior is also I hate to say it but something that is very subjective when it comes to writings right


for example say uh we can talk about a car, right maybe, a superior car to you is a car that goes very fast but a superior car to me is a car that is very luxurious very comfortable right so


this can be applied to writings right so for example say I I feel that in order for the article to be to be superior it has to be rubber-stamped by the government or it has to be rubber-stamped by a authorized uh source you know


for example say uh when I when it comes to movies or when it comes to to films you know I I will check the online uh website called rotten tomatoes and if rotten tomatoes thinks that it's good, I believe it but maybe to someone else


he or she doesn't care about the rotten tomatoes right he or she cares whether his or her friends have been uh prompting or like suggesting or advising them to watch it and maybe to them if ninety per cent of their friends like it


it's a good it's a good film so I think that it really boils down back to, uh subjective whether the writing and the audience is matched and you you really cannot


uh choose a superior uh type of writing if if really there is a a a way to determine whether a writing is superior, why are there so many types of writing am I right if for example say a blog post is the best type of writing uh the most effective type of writing then


why does the news still carry on why does uh you know other platforms like like you said like , those entertainment websites still still prevail why can't they just funnel all the all the writings to a blogger or a what uh Facebook to to to distribute the news why do they still want to have the news platform so I think that we we cannot say that


there is a specific type of writing that is superior we just have to say that different type of writings mean more to different people and in my opinion everything is fair ya and there's there's there's no superior writing


well actually that's a that's a very good point you know if we we don't have those at the at the I mean in a in a race if you are only a one person running then obviously we are the winner but we sometimes need you know next next


uh not so superior sources to to show that uh this particulars source is more superior lah or this particular uh writing is more superior, that's a that's a very good point yeah but you know I still I still feel that you know


it's not , I I I don't want to categorize a source as being superior, I just think that in its own ways uh it has its target audience and to me


if I if I really like this particular source I'll I'll I'll stick with it and I know that there are other people who do that as well, but you know


ultimately I feel each source has its own uh (ppc), its own strengths and its own weaknesses uh and I believe that's the reason why there's still so many types of writing like news entertainment uh reviews blogging you know uh critics and they all serve their own purpose


and without them we can't see the whole picture, you know so I think that uh that's my stand uh, maybe we can we can agree to disagree to that


uh you know you believe that there's a superior writing and I believe that, all all writings are are are born equal, no so what is your take do you think that we can agrees agree to disagree


I I think that the the word superior should be should be replaced you know I think that it really has to be properly defined maybe a a word like


credible you know I feel that credibility is a better word than, superior or not superior you know sometimes you know uh a writing can have a fantastic english you know but actually at all the content is bullshit but then other


other types of writing might be have very simple english but all the points are very important are very critical and, ultimately the source is a credible source you know so I think that credibility is a better topic to talk about when it comes to writing uh especially in our day and age where there's so many fake news there's so many scams out there you know we really need to discuss about


how we can find or identify types of writing that are more credible uh and I think you will agree with me right


okay so we agree to disagree alright yeah that's that's great that's some very good points from you ya thanks for the debate


two debate topic two


disagree on, the foreign films in uh, or foreign TV programs on the culture and societies uh, reason being because I feel that, a a very good example is uh, is china you know they they


they they're they're very closed off to to external, external films uh or foreign films uh for a long period of time, you know, because they were afraid that it would affect the culture, but I, but over the years you can see that you know they have slowly uh or gradually allowed more more


movies more films, to to come into their uh, into their, country and their industry where they're having more and more uh hollywood films , collaborations and what not, I think that you know for


for country that is so , tight on their culture building their culture, and for them to allow it uh, it's a great evidence that, uh the impact is not as big as what we think you know because


the word culture itself is a is a very specific term, uh any any group of people that come together they can have a culture you know so for example say uh maybe we have a we have a group of friends you know we have our culture uh and our culture is to to to do this to do say socialise and


uh and what not, I don't think that, watching certain films from overseas or or TV programs would would change that, you know I think I think it has minor impacts you know like for example say uh


personally I I I like to drink uh beer but uh there are foreign films on Netflix that I love, like uh peaky blinder and all all they, do is they you know they drink a they drink whisky in a very cool way, you know but at the end of the day I feel that


it does not impact me it does not uh it it makes me, like it but, at the end of the day it doesn't affect me, you know I know that those things are on the in the films and those things are and the things that I do with my friends in my society it's a different thing


we we don't have a, a, very you know rustic looking bars in in in singapore or or even if we have it's a very small number of uh it it, and, there're there are many very famous shows or a lot like fellow money heist recently right


it I I don't see it uh affecting our culture at all, maybe it's it's a hot topic you know people are talking about it oh this show is very good you know uh they like this character the storyline is very good but at the end of the day I don't think it impacts


our culture, our culture in singapore is still that uh you know we we are multiracial, , we have a, a huge uh, variety of different cuisines


and that uh you know, singaporeans are, are very Kiasu singaporeans are, like to, queue queue in the in the in the queue you know, so those those things are singaporean culture but


I don't see any of it being impacted by foreign films, so what do you think I I I think that you know there's not enough evidence to show that, foreign films are


okay so I I I I think that you know what you what you meant, it it it makes sense but to me that, that that that word isn't culture they are looking for I feel that it's more of like a trend, for example say you know back then uh


in in in our parents' age you know they they like to go to disco tags but uh maybe people of our age they like to go to clubs, right, is that considered a culture I don't think that's a culture I think that's a that's a trend, you know when it when it comes to culture I I I'll choose to believe that you know


for example culture is, japanese they, they will like they will take off their shoes before they enter the house, you know they will sit in a certain manner and


in in in their in their times you know uh in in their culture the man always has to, uh, be the be the front and then the woman would would support from behind you know that that that kind of thing I feel that it's culture, you know


and then things that impact this kind of culture I would say that it's like for example say , as as more women's come out to start and work, okay uh they have a higher income range and then the disparities between men and women slowly


equals up, then this kind of culture will start to change or this kind of culture will will be impacted, but if you are telling me that uh, by watching films [loh] this kind of culture be affected, I I I I really would choose to disagree with it


you know, because we will be we are watching so many japanese films uh or or other country uh films from other other foreign countries you know but at the end of day when we have lunch you know you go out with your friends, uh, do you sit in the manner of their culture do you talk in a manner of their culture no we still revert back to our own


traditional uh, style am I right like, I just state a a personal example okay uh I'm I'm a cantonese so I I love to watch hong kong films I love to watch hong kong TV series


but when I, when I go I went to hong kong, I was, I had a culture shock you get it, the way that they talked, you know is completely different, the way that they they uh communicate with one another is completely different


you know it's I I I would say that despite me throughout my whole childhood I've been watching, hong kong films hong kong uh TV series everything you know I, the way that I speak in singapore it it's not like that, okay the the way that uh


I speak is still a very singaporean culture is a very uh, southeast asian culture outfit whereas when I went to hong kong I I I totally I was totally culture shocked, right, the way that they they they speak to one another is nothing like in the films


right and then the the kind of lives that they live is is also totally different , and and I feel that, that's a very good evidence you know something that has been with me since young I've been watching this kind of films for over almost fifteen years


you know and and yet, I feel that it has very little, to impact to my culture, uh it it has an impact on me you know it it it gives me an impression of how things are uh it opens my eye to to how,


things are done in hong kong but at the end of the day, , like I said you know I I was still shocked, by the by the different kind of culture we have there and the different kind of culture that is uh shown in the films, you know so


that's my thought on how how much impact the the films and the TV series have on, err the culture, I think it it does change the trends it does change uh uh your understanding of the country but, no I I don't believe it has an impact on your on your society or the culture of a society


okay I I I I think that you made a made a very good point you know uh, films create a, a a trend and trend ultimately with enough uh time, uh, it it it can ultimately become a culture right so I think that


it's it's it's this like you said this line of uh this topic is really very grey , culture, and trends and foreign films, you know, we really have to we really have to define them you know we really have to define the culture so uh for example say I I stated a few things that that seemed like culture to me like for example


, uh sitting in a certain way as japanese or speaking in certain way like a like a hong kong uh person you know, but, we we really have to define the word culture and once we have defined the word culture we can see whether uh


trends can affect, these cultures and if it can affects then I I agree with you completely you know these films will ultimately have a, impact on, an impact on the the culture, when you were speaking about it uh the thought of slavery in US came to mind you know they have been doing films talking about slavery for so long and that really ultimately created the culture uh of this uh you know


so what hatred against uh uh colored skin people you know so I think that we really have to be careful when uh we decide whether things affect our culture ya okay thanks


part three, debate topic three


okay actually to be honest I completely agree with you I myself you know my hobbies to, to watch films to watch videos to watch anything that's visual you know , and I think that you are right you know people are converging into uh


uh visual learners especially in this type of age where information is just uh so much you know if we were to pen down a video into a, a a a piece of paper with words you know, nobody would bother reading it you know but


sad to say this debate I'm I'm put in the, opposition position so I would choose to agree, lesser to to this I I I, I want to say that you know personally I


I do some reading as well you know I I have an iPad that I I I use it most of the time to to do readings it can be anything from you know a technological uh technology articles you know uh magazines uh


I even have a uh app that allows me to borrow books from the national library, I, I I feel that sometimes you know because we are looking at the words here pleasures of reading or pleasures of visual entertainment, once again I would say that it's


it's different it's it's we cannot measure it at the same in the same way, you know uh, people often like to say that you know, I want to I want to just go on a holiday uh read a good book


you know, nobody says that I want to go on a holiday and uh I want to watch a good movie, you know, it is is different you know because the when it when it comes to reading, it it it really just makes you go into your own world but whereas you know if you are watching a video you can be watching with your friends so I think that it to different people uh


it it has different pleasures , I I I know someone that uh as a friend he would, he would just take a book, sit by the pool and then he will just spend the whole day there and that beats anything that he he can do you know he he would rather do that than go for a movie with a friend or or you know even go go watch a concert or something he he'll just rather just sit by the pool alone and then just have a


have a good book to read so I think that you know, we can't really say that this, uh, we can't compete you know for example say if you ask that guy to to choose between uh entertainment and reading he will choose reading but if you ask me I'll choose entertainment anytime visual entertainment anytime so I think that once again we're not on a


the same ground we're we're on different grounds err, targeting different people so I I I think that you know there there there shouldn't even be a competition here


yeah I I agree especially the time time factor you know, because we are talking about nowadays you know time is time is more uh, is a precious entity and uh, people are understanding that and they're making out visualised


entertainment and most of the time they're, they're from these readings you know but I think that, we like you said you know I I I I don't think we should be competing these two I think that you know, we should


we should be adding on to to one another, so for example say, usually the ones that you know like boast about it boast about movies and and and whatsoever like you said the harry potter, most of the people who bother to even boast about it they will say


I've read the book I've watched the movie, you know and then and then they will go on with with with whatever they have to say so I think that actually, they're they're both sources of pleasure that we can we can get nowadays


to some extent uh, I'll I'll I'll go go again to say this that, once again they're they're they're very different things you know you you can't put them on on same or equal footing, you know uh


reading gives you a certain kind of uh, I would say uh it it lightens your mood you know, whereas I feel that you know movies itself is very uh impactful is very uh strong


so how I'll I'll, represent them is for example I would say that reading is like yoga, right and then uh visual entertainment is more like you know playing a sports so I don't think you can can say that one is better than another


you know but, the best thing is of course I I think you agree with me the best thing is to do both you know, we can play we can play football or we can play what on sundays and on monday evenings we can do yoga right so I don't think that we should compare them


and I think that we should just learn how to, enjoy both pleasures and like you said you know if reading takes up more time, we just, we have to we have to uh, , make a sacrifices and complete compromises


to to do this uh, some people like I said just now some peoples like to read more, some people like to watch movies more, so I think we should, we should agree that let everybody do both but, should you like something more just go with it


ya because I don't think that you know mass public is going to agree that uh reading is better or visual is better I think everybody has their own stand and for mine is I think that it should never be competed


okay actually I I I I thought of a point, so I I'll, the the point that I'm thinking of is that you know usually when we watch visual entertainment, it make it makes us, rather lazy


you know the, everything is already done up, you know there's no room for for imagination, you know like for example say uh, in harry potter you know, the the, the dragon looks a specific way and it's already demonstrated to us but maybe in some people's mind you know


the, the dragon can be really different the dragon can be really funny they can have their, own interpretation when they when they read, a novel you know and I think in some sense


some people like to, imagine things they they don't want the, the, the answers to be presented to them, , and just take it wholesale, you know , there are people who err


not only uh love to imagine maybe uh I would say that, people start making their, err, fanfic if if you know what what I mean by fanfic so it's like the the the, the fans of a specific uh writing or a a book a novel they create their own imagination of the same story


but in different ways, you know so I think that some, if if you are only there to, to gather information, you know I I agree with you visual entertainment has, everything set up for you if you we're we're just there to to gather the information but some people are


uh, like to read a fiction fiction novels, and the reason why they like fiction over non-fiction is the, the ability for them to expand the story to imagine the story in certain way and, I think by reading it


it opens the the doors to imagination whereas if you're watching a visual entertainment , it's really just set in set in stone for you there, so I think that you know, we really have to see, err


where you find your your, your pleasures, some people like like to have things handed to them but some people like to uh explore their imagination, you know , some some other things that I'm thinking about is for example say


someone that likes to draw, right, when they when they read a book, they can draw out all the things that they want, whereas I think that if you, if you put that same person through a visual entertainment


maybe they'll be rather disappointed, you know , maybe they will think that ah I could have depicted this character better and, a very good examples is, movies that are really bad like you know some movies we we we have read their books you know uh


like uh recently I I I think a a couple of years ago there's this uh, uh, movie called jack and the eh jack and the giant or something like that so basically it's a childhood story that we read that uh, uh there that there's this guy called jack and then he grew uh he bought some magic beans and it grow all the way up to the to the skies you know


and in my head I tell you that that story really, was magical in my head you know but when I saw the movie I was, , I was really disappointed I I was like ha this is this is nowhere near what I what I imagined it to be


you know so I think that sometimes, uh reading allows us to, to imagine and, let's all be honest you know imagination is one of the pleasures that uh us, as humans we enjoy, you know


just for example say imagine you you strike TOTO or you strike the lottery, you know, then you imagine go like your imagination goes wild so I think that reading is uh, reading doesn't limit it uh limit you, uh whereas I feel that sometimes uh visual entertainment limits you and that's where the pleasures


are also limited right ya so what what do you think about my point


I think you know uh to to wrap things up okay the in the question it says to what extent do we agree I think to me I agree but to a less more that uh extent but you know maybe you agree to a larger extent but I I'd I'd like to say that overall I I


I hate to say it but, in some ways err, I I won't say that it can never compete but I just think that they compete in different ways, and, they each have their pleasures they have each have their


uh, attractiveness to their own target audience and, yeah that that's really what I think should be said about this statement


(oo) (oo) part one debate topic one


yup okay so I do I do agree on types of writing being superior to others in terms of the exposure basically I'm talking about the topic on blog post that are nowadays influencers or


famous individuals can actually post a blog post and could do much more influence and it's much more much more superior than compared to writings on a newsletter or a or a proper news uh news website


so yes I do agree that certain writings, or types of writings can be superior to others


uh I do agree on your saying being but the target market the target audience on the writing but what I think is that on the writing there's that is superior is


sorry the writings that are actually superior I think that they don't really need a a target market nobody really watches, news other than the the age group that, maybe forty to forty to fifty where you are home uh retired that's where they start to you know read or read even not even read watch the news but most of the market now they're all online and even


online or or on mobile phones the writings, could be more superior because it could hit a bigger target market like you said it's a bigger target market that, could be reached instead of just


you know like a news or a, you you can just watch on the television or yeah so nowadays teenagers are also more get getting involved more into reading news on facebook or even on social media there are more exposure to this kind of writings online nowadays and


ya I just do agree that some still agree that writings are some writings or certain type of writings are still superior to the others


so I do agree that, you were saying no more one type that is you know uh superior but you just, mentioned that you need people to be confident about the writings and also you need people to be able to believe the writings so isn't that making a point that some writings are actually superior to others because if people don't believe in that and then they choose to just


give it away and give up on this type of writings anymore means they have other writings that they depend on and trust on so that writing could be more superior superior than the, false or fake writings that they choose not to believe so I do still believe that


writings are superior there are certain writings that are superior to each other example we shouldn't just talk about news right there is entertainment writings there is a lot of type of writings all kinds right so now nowadays entertainment writings is everywhere like you said


false or not there are people that write about celebrities doing this or celebrities doing that, so which information will you believe or which source do you believe so it's up to the audience right so even so example sixty per cent of the audience believe this news article more


or new york times the others it's just uh some unknown anonymous sources so this source sixty per cent of the audience believe in this source right so isn't this writing more superior than the other source that they don't believe in


kay I do agree that you said that, superior oh is actually very subjective, right so each one of us have our own opinions on what kind of writing or certain kind of writing is superior or not superior so


my which brings up a point that says okay yeah so you just think that this car is to you this car is more superior but maybe to the other person it's, not superior you know so it's very very subjective and


why I agree that there's certain types of writing is more superior is because people need like people like us we need the balance of all information, so you cannot just rely on one source and then you think that oh yeah I agree on this or like you said channel all the


all the information of funding over to one source which is effective but people will start to doubt that source because they only have one source to or once the certain type of writing, to to you know like believe


on ah so when people don't have a balance, or there's no lesser superior writings they will tend to go haywire because there in a world needs to be a balance which is the superior and non-superior so even if the people believe


oh uh I don't believe that this article is or this writing is correct or they just don't think that it's their opinion at least they can find you know find out more on both sides instead of just relying on one source that could be very superior or like to them it's like very


very believable you know doesn't mean that so people still read blogs, or still read writings online but, they still need a news to fall back on and then even for entertainment site or uh anything else or cars or advertisement they still need to go for different sources to actually judge


down to one so I just believe there's always a balance and each of your writing subjective but there are certain types of writing that will be more superior than the others


I I do agree it's a good point that is a balance but or like there's no more superior maybe you can use another word instead of superior maybe like


more important or or another term for it but there are still levels of there's so many things you can talk about what you mean by superior like what do you mean like trust or do you mean like , do I depend on it or I'm just gonna watch certain things or I'm just gonna read certain things


from this source it's very very subjective so but in terms of level or like like not financially or what but the writing there are certain writings that are still way superior


than ya I just think that there's a balance


I do agree like but in terms of you want change the word superior to credibility yes it's you can change the word to any other word as well or you can even change the writing to another thing could be ads could be it's just in a general form like what do you think


is do you think certain type is superior or not and I still choose to believe that certain writings are superior than more superior than the others but, in other terms in other meeting meaning is still the same it's maybe in terms of level that certain writings are more superior


same thanks for the debate and and


part two debate topic two


so it says to assess the impact of foreign films or foreign TV programs on the culture of your society so I do


agree but I only agree, on my own uh topic because this one is too general so I'll I will just come out yes there is I do agree there will be impact on foreign films uh on our society when uh we are exposed to foreign films or foreign TV programs because


the more you're exposed to something the more your brain learns a new thing and then, like for foreign films or foreign TV kay maybe say a cooking show or foreign cooking show you will learn western uh cuisines learn thai cuisines or we learn


all types of cuisines all around and, because of that your I want to say your society meaning my society which is in singapore itself maybe but, even if it's in other country the impact will be great because everywhere we are all trying to get things or information or learn new ideas learn new things from different TV programs or different foreign films when we see that


oh !wow! that we can actually do pasta you know or something like this there will be a very very great impact example like I would say, like there are certain countries that only limit themselves to local films and I'm pretty sure you guys will know about this but


because of that they only create their own culture their own local culture they don't know about the things outside and there's no impact on all these, foreign knowledge coming inwards so they're very kept to themselves so I believe


the impact is great on our society lah with uh with foreign films and foreign TV programs coming in and being, uh and us being exposed to all these TV programmes shows like on netflix we do learn more we do get exposed more and it starts to impact our lives


yup that's my agreement on that topic


then ya I do agree like it is honestly depending on the individual itself whether they will love like for foreign TV programmes or foreign films to impact their lives their their lives or their culture but


little did you see that actually it's already slowly an impact and it's already done, because example we can see like Kpop okay or korean makeup, girls nowadays we don't do for asian okay like for for anywhere else okay even western the whole wide world


we are slowly inputting Kpop or even K uh K dramas TV programmes where girls largely girls large percentage of them is girls, we've already already have been following their makeup routines or already have been


have been doing light makeup or the as korean said no-makeup makeup look you know it's this kind of impact is that you don't see that even I myself everyday I just realize that oh !wow! okay I didn't know that I've been doing this type of certain makeup


to you know look this way and it has been like years okay maybe say we in forty years uh down the road okay or like past the past forty years, last time girls okay like us a women like us we do makeup that are very very heavy or in the nineteen fifties or nineteen sixties our fashion wise all changed but


if we are so kept to our own culture we wouldn't you know change our our you know lifestyle or fashion or even whatever routines that you have been going through you wouldn't change but why throughout the years


it has changed gradually is because we are slowly being more exposed to, you know foreign films or foreign TV programmes and then we start to learn it starts to it doesn't have that big kind of impact straightaway it's more like a slow bleeding of an impact you know more like uh every day it's it will slowly change and then you will slowly see that


!wow! in like maybe ten years we has we have already, followed other cultures that's there's a reason why a lot of countries now a lot of our, culture style have been very mixed up already it's not really very very mixed up it's more like


so is there like a singaporean type of food or is there like you know #nasi lemak# is who's or who's in terms of food so it's more like a confusion now so I really do think that the impact is very very heavily


you know based on the foreign films or like TV programmes or even anything that is played, on the on online or anything yup that's what I think


yup I I do agree when you say like, oh ya culture is uh we still we are still kept to our own uh culture for a very long time even though we still some of the times we still are unable to get used to some of the other societies culture or


or trends or whatever but there are still impacts it's not more on how big the impact is or more it's whether there is an impact, cause, I just feel like if there is no impact from all these foreign films or or foreign TV programs like why why are we still you know like like following trends even though trends yes it's it's more like


or it's just a small small thing and it's gonna be it's not going to last you long it's just going to be there for maybe a few years and it's going to pass on but, but, this kind of thing when trend becomes


a very serious thing it starts to turn into a culture where people do it every day there are people that are very heavily impacted or maybe some people like us we watch films we watch programmes we we just oh okay !wow! interesting


and I would like to try that I would have love to try that food I would love to try that activity I to !wow! I would love to travel to this place because of this film or TV program, I can't deny that ya it's just a trend


but, you know the trend will turn into a culture of your own okay like in your society why is singapore the most travelled, to place or or in that period where crazy rich asians is going on that film why is it the most traveled place or location for tourists all around the world is because of a foreign film to them it feels like !wow! wait singapore is that rich but we're not it's not


our culture to be rich or it's just, based on a film itself so, it's not more of the impact of our culture it's more of the impact on what the films or the TV programmes does to us and, a lot of a lot of people they realise when they come into singapore they don't feel the the culture that is on the film itself so it's if I want to rephrase the whole thing it would be said as the impact


is there on the foreign films uh on the TV programmes it is there but, it doesn't necessarily have to like you know uh just, impact your culture it could have impact your trend it could have impact, what if those people that cannot travel to singapore because of the films they will just think that oh singapore culture is like this and then they will start to you know dream that !wow! okay singaporeans are like this and I want to be like them you know but that's to their understanding right I may not know whether the impact on them would be real


but for a lot of girls teenagers like us even cultures could be formed by our own group like you said and I agree and there are groups that support you know Kpop example nowadays blackpink


or that we formed a group so so so strong that it becomes a culture to you know follow their makeup on like you know it's and we want to go to korea just because of that and we follow their culture of eating of, loving whatever they do so it's not look like more of the impact like I said it's not more of the impact of the culture it's more on the impact on how it will slowly impact the trend and slowly soon turn into a culture of your own


part three debate topic three


so yes nowadays the pleasure of reading can never compete with the pleasures of, visual entertainment which I would say it's movies and uh films once again and I would agree because the once again all most of us or most percentage of the people


are actually visual learners I wouldn't say that uh you know like like the pleasures of reading wouldn't uh you know satisfy your visual uh visual learning but the thing is, you have to have a very great imagination to be able to you know enjoy the pleasures of


going through the pages and going through each lines with like uh your imagination you have to imagine each scene each uh character uh when they say their features and all that you have to have very very very great, imagination or brain power to actually go through that and a lot of times we already give up on that because it's very compared to visual entertainments or TV programmes like example harry potter I am very very confident to say that


almost almost the large a large percentage of the harry potters uh harry potter fan movie fans don't even read the book itself, but although I would say I read the book as well but the thing is people still enjoy the visual entertainment and the graphics that is going on on screen compared to you know just reading pages and pages to have to create the scenes on your own in your brain


no but okay I, I would like to agree yes the pleasures of reading all that can be very very again once again subjective and but


because that you you should see like nowadays people even your friend the guy friend that you mentioned just now that likes to read he will choose reading over visual entertainment but, I'm pretty sure he only has time for visual entertainment because reading the having to go through the pleasures of something you need to take the time to actually enjoy it


so with pleasure it comes with time and I'm pretty sure why you said people go on a holiday to read because their holiday they have all the time they want in the world but, because of nowadays you know the time the value of time it becomes it


narrows down to the point where people only can get pleasures from visual entertainment and even though we have uh we do have still have people that only fully enjoy the pleasures of reading and they don't they encourage you not to watch the movie you know before reading and


stuff but because time, is money and a lot of people don't have much time they just choose to go to the movie to get their, their pleasure satisfied and that's why it mentions she said uh pleasures of


reading can never compete you know with the pleasures of visual entertainment it's not about comparing their pleasures it's more there's more like a time thing and it's more like a, how the world is really busy right now and even though yes pleasures of reading there is newspaper people choose to read newspaper the the you know that are still newspapers going round the physically printed ones but


that as well as there are printed ones people won't you know there's still crimewatch for a reason if the you know the if reading is so you know like okay just one a very important okay like reading is very important but


there are always visual uh visualised, sources that will come out of the readings because they choose to ya they choose to let people visualise how it will be instead of reading you know so I think that


it's not more of competing with the pleasures it's more like the the the amount of pleasures they can get only you know only limits to visual entertainment ya, they agree


okay, I I understand and I agree to what you say I I'm at the generation where I love to read is the


the the yup so the generation that reads and then move on to visual entertainment but, here it says that let's let's try to also compare the pleasures of reading against the pleasures of visual entertainment to be honest if I'm gonna be doing a survey now pleasures of reading would you like reading or just visual entertainment


hundred or it'll be ninety eight like ninety eight percent of them, would have just ticked visual entertainment because it the pleasures yes there is pleasures of reading I of course I agree, there will be uh you're you're in your own world you can imagine whatever you want but


would you rather watch a marvel movie compared to just read not the comic but read you know because your eyes are so powerful you absorb like a projector you know like uh the graphics and all that nowadays there are so many


producers or graphic designers coming out and they're getting paid more and more to do highly graphic stuff or like more technologies coming up to give people the best of visual entertainment and people nowadays would rather enjoy that than just a printed book


or a printed page, is because of the production value and, I'm pretty sure people watch it not only to only enjoy the movie but I'm pretty sure some of your friends would say !whoa! like that graphic looked so real or !wow! like it looks it looks like I'm really there or like the threeD and stuff people are start starting to come up with fourD and all but why because


the market knows to hit on the demand they know that visual entertainment is, going to be the future pleasure for the people and people are coming up with VR we don't have VR at our time like when we were young nowadays people are using VR so it's very very all the things all evolves around around visual visualising uh


for people to see for people to just, get a one second look and it will be there you know instead of just a ten minute and you have to imagine a flower in a pot and then you have so many variables of like a flower in a pot instead of, just showing your picture the picture of a flower in a pot so people likes shortcuts


so I think that the pleasures of it is there you just like to see a flower with a pot instead of imagining a flower in a pot and I won't say that there's no pleasure but, the pleasure is still strongly with visual entertainment ya


I still think that the pleasures of visual entertainment will still you know will still win over the pleasures of reading because is people are lazy like you said you know and we all just want a short term entertainment and we just want it to be fast


instead of just reading people are lazy lazy yes but we're lazy and, smart so nowadays people are getting more and more smart and that's why I always I will never never never never uh think that uh reading is is not a pleasure at all it's just that uh I feel like it will compared to reading


the levels of visual entertainment will be so much higher in everyone's uh you know in everyone's opinion wise and I'm speak I'm I'm speaking as a reader but I still you know enjoy enjoy the pleasures of visual


yup I do agree and it could be pleasures could be objective and still could be chosen to each individual but I will still think that to certain extent yes I still think that visual pleasures are much higher than the pleasures of reading


so debate topic one how important is it to save plant and animal species which are in danger of extinction, so uh for me I think is important especially for diversity and with each species with each species lost is a lost opportunity to understand


uh particular animal or within the animal kingdom and I think we also have to take note that this is not because of their survivability but really because we have hunted uh them down to their deaths uh for example uh rhinoceros


so, I think it is important to uh save our plant and animal species uh mainly because of the potential that they hold in terms of, uh, the medical, , opportunities and potential that they have and also for future generations where maybe they can study the animal further so I I do think that this is both uh ethical and utilitarian problem


so ethically speaking this is denying our future generation the opportunity to be exposed or to be at least aware of, uh a particular plant or animal species and a utilitarian problem because we then do not have access or uh proper information to this particular species which might have


uh uh potential in terms of like the information that they can provide so for example , uh if like let's say we do lose uh plant species then we may not be able to understand, more into like maybe a particular medical field


so for me this is the proposition


okay so I guess I will now continue with the rebuttal you talked about how, , sorry uh I I did tap on my phone and it's still recording, okay I'll just tap on it again uh so I think human life would be intertwined with


plant and animal species so fundamentally uh plant and animals are a source of, food , so it doesn't make sense if we were to remove a part of the food chain , , there might be detrimental effects down the chain so and as being on the receiving end so for example if we were to


tiger to extinction then they will not be able to, uh you know eat food like basically hunt deers and then deers will not be able to hunt uh will not be able to like feed off like the the grass and this may actually lead like eh no the increased population of grass may then affect


uh, no the the increased population of the deer may then, destroy like the plant ecosystems uh and I think this has actually happened before where like the overpopulation of


uh omnivore uh actually destroyed like the forest because uh there were less uh hunters in the ecosystem so I think we we have to look at it from uh, that


from the stand point of like the entire food chain and not risk a domino effect where basically by removing what one particular species from the food chain we actually affect uh the entire ecosystem, so but I do hear where you're coming from especially the case of dodo bird from uh mauritius uh but I think we have to do this analysis on a case by case basis as


I think , some species where we are hunting to, uh extinction uh currently, uh do have a larger impact, uh pending impact at least to to human life


okay so I think my uh rebuttal, uh, for this would be that we will then be risking diversity in favour of surviving so I can see where we would then prioritise like various species in terms of like maybe consumption or like based on the analysis that we get


and where we were would where we may have the possibility of, uh maybe not identifying the hidden potential, of the various species so , uh we never know like for for certain like whether the dodo bird had, maybe uh medical potential


but we will never know because the animal is no longer, uh, something that we can study, so, I think the next point which, I, will want to maybe uh bring across is that, I think at this stage as you suggested


mankind have, made like a lot of uh technological progress in the past few decades , and I think we do have the, ability to protect animal and plant species and since we have the capabilities to do so


uh we should uh continue protecting it uh irregardless of, uh, whether or not is important or not so, I think uh we can, and, we can protect the plant and animal species which are in danger of


uh extinction mainly because we have the capability to do so so, , I I would then assume that this, is therefore , very doable and at the same time, uh something important to consider


when trying to protect these species


uh so I guess my counter argument to that would be that I believe that these rural areas do make up a small portion of the problem , I think with the main consumption uh being from like the developing countries all the developed countries such as uh the the united states uh china and india so maybe let me just cite an example where


, the southeast asian countries believe that the rhino horns do bring uh on some form of good luck to them and then uh and that's why we're actually hunting, uh rhino horns and I think this problem doesn't stem from


uh uh, maybe like a rural, , population or like let's say a small tribe, in, where where the rhino suicide but it's more of, how uh countries with the financial capabilities are


are actually, uh having this uh issue and actually promoting the issues of, uh hunting plant and animal species into, extinction so, I think a proposition for this would be to uh where


these countries have the ability to do so to actually , uh, ban all these type of uh imports and also , to further educate their own community instead of educating, uh tribes or rural areas as I believe rural areas make a small portion


uh of the problem as mentioned previously, the uh, and I do believe that developed or developing countries, have the capabilities to do so, uh in terms of like the their education systems and


the, amount of governance that they have over the population so, with regards to the rural areas and tribes where they may not have access to uh I think the risks can be mitigated as long as the problem is focused on to like the major cities or or the developed countries that


have the court like are causing uh this particular problem, ya, so maybe uh with regards to like uh I think you quoted uh brazil so and then like and also, uh


how we can reach out to them I think, uh as long as there's proper governance in the majority of like the cities, uh we can avoid uh, like plant and animal species being, uh endangered, and I think one way where we can also start is probably through


uh, international pressure, uh, through a global approach to this type of uh uh government where maybe their sorry, maybe where they're not putting as much focus into saving plant and animal species and maybe reminding them about


like uh, the dangers as to, uh, driving a particular animal to extinction


okay so maybe I'll go first we're going to discuss uh debate topic two on the environmental concerns and economic growth uh cannot coexist


so I'm coming from the side of proposition, , what I'll be mainly doing is that I'll agree uh I think we should, uh, environmental concerns, and economic growth cannot coexist is because I think there's a valid point as to where environmental concerns are coming from and I think if we don't prioritise them we will not be able to


enjoy any economic growth, so I shall start uh some of the points, uh, so first and foremost I think we should first consider, and think about, (ppc) the end state


so with no proper environment , and no basically uh, uh end state to consider there's there shouldn't be any like growth that we should be able to consider so for example if like let's say we have completely destroyed


uh let's say uh, a small forest we shall not be able to expect uh anything, uh, growth related with regards to that problem and I think I would like to bring that analogy uh back to the argument where if like let's say there is


, no forest to walk around in, how are we uh expected to enjoy growth in this type of, conditions so, I do firmly believe that, , there are environmental friendly solutions


uh, out there which can also be a viable mean, where basically uh, environmental progress can coexist with economic growth if like let's say uh the opposite of environmental concerns is


uh environmental solutions, uh in in that state uh I do believe economic, both of them can coexist but I think, uh with regards to environmental concerns such as uh global warming


uh, it is very difficult to intertwine them uh together if we look at the big picture so for example, uh global warming uh do bring like destruction, to, uh various countries so for example we do see more hurricanes or like massive tsunamis


yes yes


uh no uh ya so uh ya so my proposition is that they cannot cannot coexist uh so I would like to uh continue my argument that if like let's say during the state of like uh, like global warming so if like let's say we we do see more hurricane we do see more


uh tsunamis occurring uh they do bring uh real damage to the economy uh in terms of destruction of infrastructure and whatnot so I think it's uh environmental concerns are very valid and basically uh


as long as there's environmental concerns uh it is very difficult to see, uh economic growth


okay so I guess my thoughts on, this matter would then be that it it's very difficult for let's say organisations to gain uh, focus on like driving economic growth uh when there are environmental concerns so I think we can also take a uh closer look at like let's say uh if like let's say uh a small medium business and then after that you have uh various environmental uh


let's say guidelines to follow so for example uh I think, the, where basically like let's say the carbon they produce is regulated it's very difficult to then focus on like driving profits for your company if there are uh all these concerns that uh or guidelines that you have to at least fulfill


uh, in the long run so, I think as as we talk about like the sense of being able to focus I do think that it's very difficult for it to coexist uh together so


uh it's also difficult for like said governments to actually, like bring forth, uh real change uh with regards to the environment , uh in terms of, like let's say real economic growth so


, I think the the problem is that a concern will always remain as a concern whereas uh economic growth is something that is tangible and something that uh can be worked towards so, uh, I do find it difficult when uh that these two things can coexist uh as uh economic growth will forever be prioritised over uh environmental concerns yup so uh and I think we do see this like with all the various


uh summits like environmental summits that we see where, err uh, like environmental pledges are, being delayed and whatnot so, I think as long as these environmental concerns uh basically uh economic growth and environmental concerns cannot exist as uh same conversation and I do believe that


, it requires a different approach uh with regards to balancing uh the environment and the economic growth, and also trying to understand further, uh, as to where the environmental concerns are actually really coming from and I think that is not happening as long as uh uh there's economic growth in mind


okay so for example , okay maybe maybe uh, the problem is with regards to the debate topic where my interpretation of environmental concerns and economic growth


uh slightly differ with yours, uh so maybe I'll I'll just , briefly run through, uh what I see as environmental concerns and economic growth so, I guess for me


(hmm) this particular debate topic to me, uh is, where environmental concerns are basically , topics or like, , situations or thoughts that uh various organisation or people have and economic growth is probably to me driving


uh profit and whatnot so maybe to further simplify it is that, as long as people have, these thoughts they will not be able to uh execute this, uh at least that's how I interpreted the uh this particular debate topic


and I, think uh maybe maybe you could also share with me how you interpreted uh this particular debate topic then maybe we can


okay uh then maybe we can also zoom in to the fact that it cannot coexist, so uh my interpretation is that , being not able to coexist means that they cannot do one if not for the other


so basically as long as there's these these thoughts uh we will not be able to have, uh said economic growth


okay ya so uh, since we have some time for open debate uh I think uh I actually completely agree with you that, uh, actually I I do take a little bit more of the stance of the opposition where I also do think that uh environmental concerns and economic growth can coexist


so I mean like as you mentioned uh whenever there there's these concerns than a solution will be provided by the various, uh companies such as shoulders and whatnot so, I do think it's actually uh very valid that environmental concerns and economic growth can coexist


and I think uh it existing together is actually better for, uh the various economies cause then, uh we are at least aware of the current situation or like the at least pending, uh problems that uh we have so


oh you know actually I do did find it a bit difficult uh coming from the proposition side where, I have to say that it cannot coexist but, ya so


ya I I do I do agree to uh with a lot of your point actually so, , I think I think more and more companies are also uh implementing solutions with regards to uh the various environmental concerns and I think you brought up a quite a good point with regards to the carbon capture


so I mean it's a very it's a very clear outright uh solution with regards to the growing carbon dioxide and greenhouse cases in the atmosphere like a very direct solution , uh, at the same time which, uh, nevertheless we do see


uh economic growth, , still happening for the various countries, so I think it's something that can definitely exist together, and I think (hmm), it will not hinder


and I think you you you brought up a quite a good point of like is not about how, uh difficult or how , like, less important but is whether or not it can or cannot uh coexist, so ya I think I think that's uh


my my thoughts at least uh for this open debate uh portion


so I I think the only thing that I can disagree upon is the the fact that, , at the end of the day these are all uh solutions to the concerns so basically uh we're, more of like addressing or like stating those solutions that we have but not really addressing like the other concerns that we may or may not have so for example


like let's say maybe we have, a particular uh, chemical uh, pollution that had that does not have a solution, then we're not exactly addressing


this particular environmental concerns so, uh for example we do have a solution for like let's say the carbon, carbon dioxide concern we do have a solution for renewable energy concern but we may not have a solution for other environmental concerns such as uh this particular pollutant and whatnot so I think given those type of uh situations uh environmental concerns


and ya, I at least I see it uh I see difficulty in linking uh these concerns with uh economic growth as there is currently no, uh profitable, business solution to it so maybe uh one thing I can maybe further state is


uh let's say uh nuclear waste , , the the amount of money required to actually store it or to at least clean and ensure that it doesn't pollute like the surrounding,


environment may, even be uh outweigh, like let's say the the economic growth uh from the energy consumption of nuclear waste uh for nuclear energy so, I I think I think we do have to see it on a case by case basis but otherwise I think in general


uh I do see it being able to coexist


so uh we're going to go to debate topic three uh whether is it possible to protect the environment when many countries require increasing amounts of energy to progress


uh, so as proposition I will have, to, agree that we can protect the environment uh when many countries uh require increasing amount of energy to progress, uh so this is mainly coming from, like having uh


a lot of viable, uh renewable source of energies uh to meet the increased demand so, uh for example uh, energy such as renewable energy such as solar energy


reservoirs and also, , wind energy I think are all viable means to actually power, uh the various country with the increasing amounts of energy consumption so I, think one, uh good example is that uh what china is doing with the building of


uh various solar farms and also, uh around the country and also the various wind farms along the country so I think like a simple trip, uh to inner mongolia you'll be, uh, you'll be able to see like a lot of


uh wind farms in the area uh powering like the neighbouring cities so uh and and we do know that uh china has an increasing amount of energy consumption, and I think uh they're very good template as to what


uh countries can do uh to meet the increased amount of energy consumption while still protecting the environment uh instead of like burning fossil fuels or, uh burning unrenewable energy such as coal and


whatnot ya, so I think that's my part of the argument


okay so uh maybe just to summarise on what you uh previously discussed on where basically , the the energy consumption is increasing at such a rate that uh, our efforts to protect the environment


uh, the problems associated with the increased energy consumption far outweighs uh our efforts to protect the environment and I think with regards to this particular debate topic the question is whether it is possible to do so to protect the environment


so I think uh it's actually still possible to protect the environment regardless of the increased appetite, and whatnot so, I think with uh careful, like demand like


energy demand management uh processes and I think with the right access to uh the various, let's say renewable energy technology and the right amount of resources in terms of infrastructure, and also let's say


uh funds and government support, I think it's very possible to still protect the environment and I think uh we shouldn't, discount uh, china's efforts , and I think china is uh getting there


albeit at the cost of of some various uh some areas in china where basically , renewable energy is not adopted as quickly or as progressively as the uh other uh areas so however


I do think that uh with the right amount of technology uh technological transfer and with the right amount of support from the main government uh it is still possible to basically implement the correct solutions to protect the environment uh when combating


uh the increasing amounts of energy, I I think uh a number of uh european countries actually do, uh combat this uh pretty well, and, uh actually adopting like a lot of uh measures to


uh recycle like, basically day to day objects and also like for example like plastic bags and whatnot, and, and uh I think an extreme example will also be uh japan where the recycling rate is uh pretty high for a developed nation


and I think uh it has a lot to do with uh the current mindset, of uh the population also so, , I think irregardless of uh, the uh increased consumption or increased amounts of energy


uh to progress uh it is very possible to protect the environment while, enjoying the benefits of uh such increases so uh I think how we could actually combat this is really to first implement the the right measures the right technological transfer


uh of knowledge uh the right mindset basically to, uh, encourage the citizens to, recycle, or and also to encourage the, basically less deforestation and I think uh with all these uh very viable solutions uh presented it's very difficult to say that you can't protect the environment uh with the increased amount of energy because I think there


uh there is proven examples where it is possible, to, like leave a forest untouched while still uh uh growing economically or also with regards to uh growing in terms of energy consumption so


uh, ya I think that's that is my point for uh the proposition


, so uh I think on your point of like why it hasn't been able to thence do so does


, so I I do think that we cannot deny the fact that while it hasn't been done so


these solutions are still out there and uh can still be transferred over, uh to the , various countries and uh while I do hear you that some solutions may not be acceptable uh in terms of like


, like have like even even in the singapore where basically we may not have access to a lot of green energy, uh so it's might not may not be so applicable to us but I think there are still a lot of uh viable means that we can explore just that uh we haven't had uh


the right amount of, effort to uh, explore so , I do think that there's still a lot of potential uh in terms of uh protecting the environment with the increasing


uh, energy consumption and I think, , it has a lot to do with also uh optimisation, we meet the demands of the increased uh


energy consumption and on the point of like , recycling I guess , ya it it does not really, uh


fulfill I guess the criteria where, uh, it meets the energy needs but I think it's uh something that, uh, can potentially offload in terms of like uh burning, waste and whatnot


I guess as we shift too, , the open debate


, I I I would like maybe like just like to pose a question to you as to uh why do you think uh, that, with all this current solution why is it not uh being carried out in the various countries that you


uh uh, briefly mentioned so maybe uh, particular, country that I would probably like to zoom in to is uh singapore so do you think that if let's say we do apply an island wide uh


like, solar farm uh type form of solution do you think uh we will be able to meet the increasing amount of energy uh that the city state requires


, okay so I think it seems like you have a


uh quite a good understanding of, uh solar panel so I think I just have one more uh question for this open debate uh portion it's basically uh do you think, solar panels are uh advancing fast enough to actually meet the increasing amount of energy consumption


uh (ppc) okay so if I were to uh summarise your points I think what you said is to, uh we need to conserve them for a few reasons firstly uh, medical , then for the opportunity to study them as well as well as the potential that they hold and lastly is uh sort of


like to allow our, sort of like an ethical issue to allow our future generations to, to, have access basically to this, , flora and fauna as well, so, ya I mean uh uh firstly I think


my my stance is that uh I oppose because uh, like, uh (ppc) I I feel that when it comes to saving plant and animal species I mean of course often times uh this is uh as in when when plant and animal species are are are hunted or or like killed this is done because uh there is a need to conserve human life


uh so I feel that it is always human life should always uh take priority and precedent, over any plant and animal species so , to, uh as a rebuttal to your point about uh having the opportunity to study this uh plants and animals I think even the fact is that now uh there are millions uh if not hundreds of millions of uh species that we have not documented and uh so


like like, we will never be able to fully document all uh species of plants and animals so I think uh in terms of like uh, of, of opposition I think that that that is not a a very, uh uh important point and in fact uh there have been many cases in uh history where uh animals who have been hunted to extinction did not have any sort of uh too detrimental effect on diversity at all so for example


I can't remember what what uh nationality or what island this was but I do know that uh you know the dodo birds when they were first discovered on the island uh the natives who hunted them down to extinction , uh there were firstly they did it because uh they they obviously they needed food uh


and, they didn't it's not like they did it for sport, but, even upon the extinction of these animals uh there was no very dire loss in biodiversity and in fact the, the loss of the dodo birds has not really set humans back uh in any major way so yeah I think uh


this uh sort of adds to my point about how I feel, uh human , preservation and and uh human life is definitely more important than, uh, the lives of of saving plants and animal species even if they are in uh danger of extinction


ya uh so I I so I I do , sort of uh agree partially some of your points I think uh it is true that yes uh certain animals if hunted to extinction might cause uh adverse effects on our biodiversity and thus affect uh humans which again uh my my preposition all this while has been to protect uh human life right so


in that aspect I do kind of agree and perhaps I will be taking the same position as you with this where decades ago like in the nineteen fifties however scientific uh and sort of, uh biological studies are at uh all time peak and our understanding of of uh flora and fauna and uh diversity has never been stronger so


I I am aware that , yes uh, uh in the past you know maybe we humans will have no idea how uh for example the the loss of dodo birds will affect the, the ecosystem perhaps we just got lucky on that case but in today's context that is certainly not the case because we have plenty of technology and plenty of understanding of uh species in the wild so it is uh definitely doable and in fact it has probably already been done that humans can uh mapped out


basically what is the impact of various species in the in in it out in the wildlife wilderness and uh also uh conduct some analysis on what would be the sort of uh problems in the ecosystem if let's say species X were to be taken out of were were to be hunted to extinction


so ya there are a lot of digital twinning sort of , uh, sort of uh systems out there in the world so now in which case uh if let's say that were to happen unfortunately like uh if, let's say tigers for example were to go into extinction we won't have a very clear idea on how the population will be affected and we can also uh sent uh uh like carry out some uh processes to mitigate the negative impacts of this


uh from happening for example is all about uh human adaptability and ingenuity which uh is currently at an all time high in terms of uh, the history of the human race so ya my my rebuttal would basically be that like again uh


, humans uh human life preservation is the most important if let's say there is a need, for human life preservation to, uh over the importance of the of the animal or plant species uh we should do it and even in fact even if we do it uh we will not get harmed as badly as what most people imagine because of these existing knowledge bases and uh sort of software err that is already in the market and ready to be used


so in essence let me summarise what you uh mention which was that, , based on your understanding of a human, , where we are at as humans are, I believe that it is very easy and very doable uh or at least doable for us to


to uh, not basically hunt these animals into extinction so I think uh it it is a fallacious statement because for animal in fact like, we if we examine we just examine all the populations that could potentially all the populations who are perhaps are located in closer vicinities to to endangered species for example such as uh the populations of africa in


in, sort of uh or in uh brazil in fact or even near the the amazon right uh these populations who are the the closest in touch with this, , endangered species uh ya so this population, , by the trends we we do know that in fact most of these populations are not quite as technologically advanced I mean if you look at the rural or even the uh sort of


, the tribal sort of uh people in in many of these areas, uh they are definitely not technologically advanced at all so , in in in fact they these people would be the ones that have the most uh, uh would probably have the most impact cause they are the closest to this uh to this


to this uh biodiversity so for us to assume that they have the ability and the technological know how to prevent such a, catastrophe uh would be uh fallacious and we can also again I suppose the counterpoint you might make is that uh we can perhaps go down and educate them and and help them and provide them the resources but again


how certain are we that these people would change their way of life and how certain are we that we can even locate, these , members and how or perhaps uh ya like how how how do we how do we not know that these people uh are doing these sort of actions for example like depleting the the forest


simply because they have to survive right so, like, ya and lastly uh even if we were to do sort of to do that , I I I'm not certain there is any like sort of uh organisation that has so much resources and would be so generous to to spend their time to just go down there and do this uh again I think


I mean after all uh full jurisdiction of this form, well, so with all the unclear structure and all the lack of resources and in fact uh these are actually, these these communities' way of life I'm not sure this is something that we can actually so easily mitigate


so uh okay so so I mean first uh I guess I'll uh respond to your point about the rhinoceros so to, to to correct uh yes to correct the one of the fact uh statements that you made actually rhinoceros' horns are not like really are seen as a source of


, food in fact they are seen as and uh have been for centuries in in uh in chinese medicine been used as a medicinal herbs right to treat various different uh ailments and things like that which again goes back to in fact one of the points you mentioned earlier in our debate about how uh these animals have medicinal


properties , right that that's that's what you mentioned previously so uh the fact is , we are by, uh, in fact like like like like, like the medicinal properties might be in fact crucial to certain communities' way of life they may not know any other form of medicine and if supposedly if they do not take this perhaps they might uh even


like succumb to illnesses so again uh that that brings me back to the point about how uh like like, like doing perhaps what you proposed might cause like communities in fact to perish from illnesses so uh next


like I believe that uh developed countries are not actually the main consumers of of exotic meats that may potentially go to extinction, so if you if you take a look at the united states like you mentioned right what are the meats they consumed chicken beef things they all farmed right so the countries that do consume more of this uh exotic meats that are in danger of extinction are from the


uh I would say probably less developed countries so how how then would your proposition work because again these countries are harder to govern they're harder much harder to regulate and there are black markets and things like that so, ya that I'm also questioning the validity of


I think I'm going to stop you there uh your position is that you, you are supposed to think that they cannot coexist you are for that right but it sounds like you, it sounds like you are arguing that you think that uh they can coexist, uh could I just


clarify what is your position


so okay uh, I I believe your your your your basically your yours your position is that ya as as what is mentioned uh environmental concerns and economic growth cannot coexist uh I am taking the uh awkward opposing view that I believe that


there are various ways that environmental concerns and economic growth can coexist right and what this means is I believe that we are it is possible for us to, uh, to to basically, uh to to care about the environment while caring about our economy so there are uh and uh there is an abundance and uh a merit of different technologies for example that uh allow for this to happen for instance


, as you mentioned uh carbon global warming so that's one example uh carbon capture uh technology has has been existing for for many years now but uh where we are in terms of uh, , this this technology is where the turning point where in fact the uh by


by capturing carbon we can even create uh economic value for, for uh various uh company so so uh in in that sense they are able to coexist let me give you one example uh there are various uh chemical or petrochemical companies uh as as you know that contribute to this


, carbon footprint problem they released a lot of , fumes and a lot of gas uh there are there is right now uh there there's many different types of recycling gas recycling technology for example which basically like for the gases that are originally considered as waste and that will go into the environment they're captured and they're refined to produce valuable


gases such as uh hydrogen and uh other different types of , like, important gases so what is actually happening here right is that we uh, we we mitigate the environmental problems we we lower the carbon footprints but at the same time additional like uh monetary value is being created for these companies and in fact the people who created the technology they also uh benefit in in essence society benefits as a whole so


there are so many examples uh where uh environmental concerns and economic growth uh can coexist such as the one that I mentioned so that's why I would uh like to challenge the uh, like like, challenge what what is your thoughts about these existing technologies haven't they already made this uh coexistence possible


super clear on what is your position so, uh like, perhaps are you able to provide any example


so so uh actually my interpretation is is in fact pretty similar to yours so ya like uh you mentioned like uh environmental concerns uh, is is like for example the idea and sort of the sort of the the concept that


we should perhaps be doing something about, uh about the environment right to reverse the negative effects that we have uh cost so that is what environmental concerns are then economic growth I don't I believe requires no definition, so, ya I mean uh did I get that uh correct


yes uh again same interpretation uh again brings brings me back to I guess my first uh example or maybe I'll give another example, of that sort of nature so uh one one example uh very commonly seen uh now is perhaps uh like algae energy uh like like energy slash water


technology so basically what happens is , like, that the environmental problem of like , like basically greenhouse gases and uh wastewater production from factories where like this is the problem so how they solve it is by uh create using algae and basically like algae because they uh they will capture the carbon uh and other harmful gases again cause they're plants and undergo photosynthesis


at the same time when they are in wastewater they have the ability to purify the water, uh as well and lastly the end result is not in fact uh a net like lost in perhaps , like like money because you do this measures cause the algae once once it goes through this uh sort of processes they are able to be used


commercially so for example that algae biofuel uh is it sells at the same price as uh uh traditional like like gasoline for example and at the same time uh algae uh pellets and whatnot are are being used as a


in in uh for for like combustible purposes things like that so, uh okay so I think this this is an example where environmental concerns which is the the feeling and the desire to want to reduce carbon emissions and carbon footprint is, coexisting with economic growth by creating a whole new sector of uh new different like basically sector of of energy creating jobs uh creating value and creating money for


for for people so uh in in that case uh that is I guess are also similar to like the first example that I mentioned about uh uh gas recycling technologies and things like that so I believe that there are uh they they definitely can coexist


uh whether or not it's easy or difficult is another question but it's not part of this question I believe it is difficult because it requires uh a fair amount of innovation it probably is , ya a fair amount of innovation probably with probably it is more accessible to


larger companies I think you brought it up as one of your points earlier about how small medium businesses may not have access to this kind of technology uh I I do agree to some extent but I think uh the this technology is being democratised now and to a greater


to, to greater extent uh I'm seeing more and more uh small medium businesses being able to get access to, technology such as for example solar technology you can see like even even in fact people's uh houses like like individual house units uh they already do have access to to to solar energy so while uh this kind of this kind of coexisting


uh happens more for large companies uh and less so for small smaller entities the the trend is on the rise


or how do you think I feel about the previous but okay ya go ahead


this is open debate right so I it you you mentioned that you agree with most of my points is there anything that in fact then you disagree with


like since you're on the the the mention of china, uh, I believe it it might be slightly fallacious as well to just uh mention on the, I suppose the the good things that china is doing no doubt china has made a, huge leaps and bounds in the renewable energy space but they are still uh the world's leading country in terms of coal usage and I'm sure as we know coal is a very is is one of the cheapest on in fact the cheapest uh energy sources


while at the same time being uh incredibly uh polluting uh having a huge carbon footprint and huge uh releasing plenty of like, uh, harmful gases like uh nitrous nitrous oxides for example so I mean , ya so so I will just like to to uh maybe go to to talk a little bit about that because


ya as we can see uh, china's uh growth in energy usage uh is the reason why they they are not able to get away from coal is uh because these uh renewable energy sort of uh, like like options are not able to