HCE is literally just Wotan. Finnegans Wake matches so closely to the central themes and characters of the Ring, which are apparent in all of Wagner's mature works, that it should be considered its primary source material.

>>21989970 (OP)

YES

>>21989970 (OP)

Can you elaborate? I am not familiar with The Ring at all, but I don't really get how you can relate HCE to a specific character. He's just a symbol, after all.

>Can you elaborate?

No, he can't. Wagnerfags incessantly post nonsense and never explain it.

>He's just a symbol, after all.

So is Wotan for the exact same things. IIRC Wotan is even referenced in FW as one of HCE's names.

One time I met a cool German guy who was really into Wagner and went to the Wagner festival. I was also catfished and sucked on the penis by a man.

>>21989970 (OP)

Is there a collection of Wagner's writings that I should get or can I just read this book as is, after having read Joyce?

>So is Wotan for the exact same things.

See that's the hard part of talking about Finnegans Wake. What do you mean by 'exact same things'? HCE is compared to literally everything in that book. Historical figures, gods, food, animals...Is Wotan a similar?

>HCE is compared to literally everything in that book. Historical figures, gods, food, animals...

But there's a clear identity running through all of these associations. The manifold expression of Wotan's character, through his own actions as well as other characters which are representative of elements in his soul, is the same as HCE. And on top of this the same archetype appears in Wagner's other works as Sachs, Marke (another identity for HCE), Amfortas and alternatively Titurel.

>>21989970 (OP)

This seems a bit hyperbolic. Without having read that book, here are the comparisons I can think of:

>use of Leitmotive as structuring technique in both

>circular construction of narrative

>4 stages of both

>attempt to form a "Gesamtkunstwerk" in different ways

But those last three are more general and shared by epic works of art across ages: you could identify the same in Paradise Lost or Pope's Essay on Man for example. Looking on Fweet.org, the Wagner opera with the most 'direct' references in the text is Tristan and Isolde, and especially the Liebestod aria which would make sense given its centrality in III.4. I'm not entirely convinced that your identification of HCE with Wotan is especially helpful, given that he is of course the masculine archetype. It's not helpful to reduce him to any particular one of his avatars unless you have real reason. Can you explain why you think it should be considered as a primary source material in more detail?
