We have heard opinions like yours for years and years, and haven't been moved yet because conservative values are self righteous and self centered, and I have complete disdain for them.  What makes you think that you have an original angle to present that would change our good, decent, liberal values?  We stopped listening long ago.  In case you have not guessed, this is a forum that is favored by progressive Catholics, because we cannot abide what trads are selling.