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                     Is there a guide for new developers?
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                     I constantly see many posters wanting to make new games, but many don't know how to start. Is there a guide on this site to help me (and others like me) who want to start development?
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                     For example, what is the best engine to use for beginners with no programming knowledge?
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                     I don't remember seeing a guide here, but it is such a grey area with so many different paths you could take.
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                     <br/>
                     I think a new developer needs to
                     <br/>
                     1. Decide what type of game he/she wants to make. Keep it simple and don't be not too ambitious.
                     <br/>
                     2. Find a suitable game engine to suit the game.
                     <br/>
                     3. Do lots of tutorials!
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Another path would be to work with others, having someone do the artwork, story, or programming.
                     <br/>
                     Maybe a collaborative project page on this site??
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                     I've gone through the threads and people here seem to think Ren'py is the place to start.
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                     Then you look at the beginners' manual for that engine (and youtube tutorials) and it's gibberish. The guide is written for coders. The introduction mentions scripts, logic lines, blocks, etc...like a beginner is supposed to know what those phrases mean. It's like trying to teach someone how to write in Russian by talking to them in Russian.
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                     Is there actually a "start" here point or is the consensus in the community that "if you don't know, I can't help you."
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                     I've never used Ren'py but i know the pain of poorly documented software!
                     <br/>
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                     gamefromscratch.com covers lots of different engines, even ones that work more visually than code.
                     <br/>
                     And has pretty good getting started section.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Edit
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Link
                     <br/>
                     <a class="link link--external" href="http://www.gamefromscratch.com/post/2014/09/16/GameFromScratch-Guide-to-Getting-Kids-Started-in-Game-Development.aspx" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      GameFromScratch Guide to Getting Kids Started in Game Development
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="89tasker · Sep 19, 2017 at 1:09 PM" data-lb-id="post-202247">
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                        I've never used Ren'py but i know the pain of poorly documented software!
                        <br/>
                        gamefromscratch.com covers lots of different engines, even ones that work more visually than code.
                        <br/>
                        And has pretty good getting started section.
                        <br/>
                        Edit
                        <br/>
                        Link
                        <br/>
                        <a class="link link--external" href="http://www.gamefromscratch.com/post/2014/09/16/GameFromScratch-Guide-to-Getting-Kids-Started-in-Game-Development.aspx" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                         GameFromScratch Guide to Getting Kids Started in Game Development
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                     </blockquote>
                     I've gone through a lot of "beginner's guides" and there is always one constant: they go from being simple to complicated really fast. Usually by neglecting to explain steps they forgot only coders know how to do.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     example:
                     <br/>
                     <div class="bbCodeSpoiler">
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                         step 1: break a twig off that tree
                         <br/>
                         step 2: remove the bark
                         <br/>
                         step 3: peel the bark into strips
                         <br/>
                         step 4: twist the strips together to form a rope
                         <br/>
                         step 5: tie the rope to the BOAT
                         <br/>
                         <br/>
                         Coder: That's how you build a boat from scratch.
                         <br/>
                         Me: wtf?!
                        </div>
                       </div>
                      </div>
                     </div>
                     <br/>
                     I like that guide.
                     <br/>
                     And since Renp'y has a foundation in the Python programming language, I also found this:
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.codecademy.com/learn/learn-python" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Learn Python
                     </a>
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                        89tasker said:
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                        Coder: That's how you build a boat from scratch.
                        <br/>
                        Me: wtf?!
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                     lol, I do know what your saying, I'm learning Blender (3d modelling) at the moment and it feels the same way.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Is Ren'py development all done in code? If so I can see how getting started would be a steep learning curve.
                     <br/>
                     Python is a good language to learn, it was the first language my Uni introduced to all the new programming students. And was a good basis for learning other languages. Just stick with it and it'll all start to make sense.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I use Unity and i'm loving it, it allows you to create something visually. You just drag and drop 2d/3d models into a scene, add some lights and camera... then add coded scripts to make it all work. While I have a programming background i've had to learn about 3d modelling, texturing and lighting and it has taken me months to get my head around it.
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                     For me, the guide you're looking for don't exist because it can't exist.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Take cooking by example. There isn't a site where you can learn how to cook, from scratch without a single knowledge in cooking, a full luxurious wedding dinner for 100. For to achieve this you must start by learning the basis of cooking, the technical words and concepts, and so on. Then when it's done, why not the said wedding dinner.
                     <br/>
                     It's the same for game development. It's not coding, it's a particular form of coding. You don't write a game like you write a client-server application or a multimedia player. If someone try to learn a a coding language, its paradigms and concepts, coding paradigms and concepts, gaming paradigms and concepts, a game engine paradigms and concepts, all in one, I'm not sure that this person will still want to do it after the first day.
                     <br/>
                     Not only it's too many information, but the explanation would be full of digressions. Just an example, the possible few first lesson of the guide you search, let's say for ren'py :
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     [ren'py is a suit of lines of code]
                     <br/>
                     [oops, must say that a line of code is]
                     <br/>
                     [oops, must talk about instructions, functions and variables]
                     <br/>
                     [oops, must talk about the immutability of python variables]
                     <br/>
                     [alright, back to the difference between instructions, functions and variables]
                     <br/>
                     [back to the line of code]
                     <br/>
                     [oops, must talk about python paradigm for code formatting]
                     <br/>
                     [back to the line of code again]
                     <br/>
                     [congratulation, after ten pages you know that ren'py is a suit of lines of code]
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Obviously it's cartoonish, but not untrue. I said it, it's like learning how to cook. If you don't know how to correctly cook fishes, don't expect to be able to cook a whole stingray for the wedding of your son. You still can try, but... well, take a look at the games here and the number of bugs in some of them.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     So, first identify the language used by the game engine you want to learn, and learn this language. There's tons of sites for this, from total novice to already confirmed coder. Then, after two/three weeks you'll know enough and can switch to the game engine particularities and language variations. It will take more time before your "hello, world" code in unity/ren'py/whatever, but it will also save you a lot of time. This just because now you don't just know what to do, but also why you do it. And when you know "why", then "how" is never far away.
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                    Ren'py:
                    <a class="link link--external" href="https://f95zone.com/threads/5676/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                     Track variables
                    </a>
                    -
                    <a class="link link--external" href="https://f95zone.com/threads/16011/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                     Save compatibiliy
                    </a>
                    -
                    <a class="link link--internal" href="https://f95zone.to/threads/125005/">
                     Track labels
                    </a>
                    <span style="color: rgb(41, 105, 176)">
                     Updated
                    </span>
                    <br/>
                    <a class="link link--internal" href="https://f95zone.to/threads/99929/">
                     Write a dynamic Ren'Py game
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="89tasker · Sep 20, 2017 at 8:57 PM" data-lb-id="post-204258">
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                        anne O'nymous said:
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                        For me, the guide you're looking for don't exist because it can't exist.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        [congratulation, after ten pages you know that ren'py is a suit of lines of code]
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                     The first person to write those ten pages (and the thousands after it) will be a millionaire.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     The coding world is a language without a dictionary. I bet people were saying the same thing to Webster. "what? an entire book just explaining the meaning of words? but.. but... don't you have to know words already to read it?"
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                         What I find interesting is a lot guides start out simple and the author gets impatient. So many guides take the time to explain the simple things; like walking the reader through programing how to display a simple line of text.
                         <br/>
                         <br/>
                         PRINT tells the program to display it on the screen.... got it noob?
                         <br/>
                         <br/>
                         ...but then a paragraph or two later they start throwing words like FUNCTIONS, ARRAY, LIBRARIES, BLOCKS etc casually into the explanation like we're supposed to immediately know what they mean at first mention.
                         <br/>
                         <br/>
                         Now that I've taught you guys how to count to ten, we're going to work on solving some differential equations!
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                     <br/>
                     A general question: how do coders learn how to do it if it can't be taught without already knowing it?
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="anne O'nymous · Sep 20, 2017 at 11:55 PM" data-lb-id="post-204508">
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                        89tasker said:
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                        A general question: how do coders learn how to do it if it can't be taught without already knowing it?
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                     Because, unlike what you said, it's not a world without dictionaries, there's even
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://scratch.mit.edu/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      coloring books
                     </a>
                     in this world. My first program was in Logo in the middle of the 80's ; basically, you wrote instructions that will move a turtle in the screen for to draw what's in your mind. Honestly I don't remember the title of the book I read at this time, but it was something like, "Logo for full noobiez brats who don't even know what a keyboard is, lol !". And there's still books like this, and even now sites like this.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     This said, what you seem to fail to understand, is that all this is NOT about coding ; and it's probably because English isn't my natural language so, sometimes, I fail to correctly express my thoughts.
                     <br/>
                     Take ren'py by example. It's NOT a programming language, it's a game engine ; the son of a programming language and a descriptive language. And it's the same for Unity, Game Maker and the others. Even the more descriptive ones, like Unity can be, need knowledge in coding if you want to go further than the basis.
                     <br/>
                     Have a look at
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://f95zone.com/threads/buttons-wont-move.5080/#post-200318" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      this answer
                     </a>
                     and
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://f95zone.com/threads/general-flag-question.5116/#post-203189" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      this one
                     </a>
                     . In both I tried to explain the problem as clearly as possible, but they talk about two radically different topics ; and still they both talk about ren'py. In a way, in the first I talk about painting, and in the second I talk about mechanical. Because it's what a game engine is: a tool for to create mechanical painting.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     What you search is a doc which teach you about mechanical and in the same time about painting... Isn't it asking too much ? The doc you're looking for  must have these three parts :
                     <br/>
                     1) You know nothing about coding, so I'll teach you coding.
                     <br/>
                     2) You know nothing about python, so I'll teach you python.
                     <br/>
                     3) Alright, now I can teach you ren'py.
                     <br/>
                     Now the question is, why do you expect for the same person to wrote all the parts ?
                     <br/>
                     There's already tons of pages which cover the parts 1 and 2, why write about them again ? Especially since the fact that you are able to teach about a game engine doesn't mean that you know enough for to teach about the language it use, and even more about coding.
                     <br/>
                     I probably can teach a lot about ren'py, but don't expect me to teach you about python. I learned enough for to use it with ren'py, and even for to mess with it, but that's all. As for coding, I said it, I started more than 30 years ago. My knowledge is valid but outdated, plus I'm a Perl guy, I love my unlimited freedom and now have a lot of really bad habits ; especially seen by a python user. But still, yes, I can teach about ren'py.
                     <br/>
                     And it's the same for anybody. The guys behind the Unreal engine are great coders, but I'm sure that they'll suck as much as me if they attempt to teach about coding. Still they can teach you all you want about their engine.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     There's no shortcut, you can't learn about a game engine without first learning about coding and about the programming language used by the game engine. That's all. I'm sorry if it don't reach your expectation, but it's like that, it's just not possible do to all the parts in the same time.
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                    Ren'py:
                    <a class="link link--external" href="https://f95zone.com/threads/5676/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                     Track variables
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                    -
                    <a class="link link--external" href="https://f95zone.com/threads/16011/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                     Save compatibiliy
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                    -
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                     Track labels
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                    <span style="color: rgb(41, 105, 176)">
                     Updated
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                    <br/>
                    <a class="link link--internal" href="https://f95zone.to/threads/99929/">
                     Write a dynamic Ren'Py game
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="junkanon · Sep 21, 2017 at 12:22 AM" data-lb-id="post-204557">
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                        89tasker said:
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                        how do coders learn how to do it if it can't be taught without already knowing it?
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                     From a person that's majoring in Computer Science and that has worked with gaming before: You do what you're told until you understand what the fuck you've done.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     There are a lot of leaps of faith in the common approach to teaching coding, and it happens because the alternative is both boring and overwhelming. To know how some things are done in a language is kind of easy, you just copy/paste some lines and it's ready. To know why those lines work is a completely different thing, because the reasons come from a train of thought that's being developed since Ada Lovelace wrote an algorithm, before computers existed. Therefore people usually make you do stuff and then, when you have some more theory under your belt, they explain some of the stuff used. Somethings are never explained and you have to find out why they work for yourself, if you really want to.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Game developing (well done and optimized, etc) is hard because:
                     <br/>
                     - Those who want to learn how to code must learn a particular way of thinking, and this way of thinking isn't natural to most people. It takes logic and problem-solving to a whole new level. It's about breaking a thought in a series of steps that the computer need to follow for it to work.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - Those who want to learn how to code
                     <i>
                      <b>
                       games
                      </b>
                     </i>
                     must learn how to take that way of thinking to a very complex environment, where people do thing you don't expect with reasons you can't understand messing with variables you didn't think were possible to tinker with, learning how to deal with simulating physics, dealing with images, sounds, etc, and using other people's codes (well documented or not). It's hard, defying and sometimes frustating. But it can be done, with patience and hard work, and the results pay off.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     There's a guy that's writting a whole game in C, from the very beginning. He is building his engines, debugger tools, etc. He started in 2014. we're in 2017 and he isn't done yet.
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://hero.handmade.network/episodes" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Here
                     </a>
                     is his website.
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                        1) You know nothing about coding, so I'll teach you coding..
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                     Part 1 is what I've been asking for.... Everyone seems to be pushing straight into languages. We need to find a guide to build the foundation first. What are libraries? tools? What's with using underscore so much? What does # do? Why so many indentations? Is WHITESPACE the same as a regular space ?
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                     I'd recommend Python (Renpy language), the best to start programming right now imo.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Read. Learn. Read. Learn. Read a lot.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://renpy.org/doc/html/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Welcome to Ren'Py's documentation! — Ren'Py Documentation
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                     <br/>
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.python.org/doc/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Welcome to Python.org
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                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://atom.io/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      A hackable text editor for the 21st Century
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                     <br/>
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.jetbrains.com/pycharm/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      PyCharm: Python IDE for Professional Developers by JetBrains
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                     Not only that, Python is the future.
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                     is python easier than java? I tried java (know the beginner stuff) and got many tutorials(books,vids) but can't bring myself to touch them,maybe python will take less time to learn and not get "boring".
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                     Man i wasted my summer doing nothing could had learned python , maybe next year i will bookmark this
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="anne O'nymous · Sep 21, 2017 at 3:15 AM" data-lb-id="post-205011">
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                        89tasker said:
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                        I never imagined i'd get this much resistance from the simple question of "where do you start?"
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        It's like trying to get into a secret society.
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                     </blockquote>
                     Oh... Yeah, no. I understand now why nobody understood your question.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I'll try to explain you the misunderstanding, but first a warning : I'll take shortcut, and not always stick to the strict reality. What I'll say is the truth, but it seem for me that explaining the problem is, here at least, better that detailing explicitly the concept.
                     <br/>
                     So, let's go with the points you listed as example :
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - What are libraries ?
                     <br/>
                     Er... libraries for which language and, first what kind of libraries ?
                     <br/>
                     For C/C++/C# (and other but there's the most know), libraries are the parts of the language which aren't strictly instructions of this language. "If something = that", is an instruction, but "open( this file )" isn't. The last one is a function of the C libraries. It's fully a part of the official ANSI C language, but not an instruction. These libraries are always in binary form, and you'll find (almost always) natively in every OS.
                     <br/>
                     But C/C++/C# also have user defined libraries. It's the same thing, and still a different thing. The same, because like the standard ANSI C libraries, they extend the language by adding functions which will do the thing for you. Mostly you find them in source format, and they are directly include inside your future binary program... Oh, have I forgot to say that the standard ANSI C libraries can also be include directly inside your future binary... or not, it depend.
                     <br/>
                     Now there's libraries for other languages. Perl, Python, etc., all have their libraries. But they aren't named libraries, and while they are the same than these for C, they also are different.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - What's with using underscore so much?
                     <br/>
                     Er.. here again, in which language ? Oh, and first, used, but where ?
                     <br/>
                     _myVariable and my_variable are two way to use the underscore, and the reasons are completely different. The second one is just a way to write the names of variables, function, whatever can be named. It's a convention, but with no importance. Some write myVariable (camelCase), other MyVariable (PascalCase), and some my_variable (snake_case), but it change absolutely nothing ; really, nothing at all.
                     <br/>
                     The first one, it's different. Well, in fact it's also a convention, but still it's different. Well, in fact Python is the only language where it's different, but still it's different, trust me... More seriously. With modern language came the concept of "objects" and later "private variables" ; where "private" is related to the object, which mean that they literally can't be used outside of the object.
                     <br/>
                     Languages defined before this time evolved and included the notion of objects, but can't include the "private" thing. So, coders came to a convention. A variable/fonction/whatever starting with an underscore is private. Because of the way the language work, they can be used outside of the object, but the leading underscore mean, "warning, this is a private variable. Don't fuck with it ! In fact, forget that it exist, this isn't the variable you're looking for !"
                     <br/>
                     But, like I said, this is "except with Python". Python kept the convention, but work a little differently when the variable have a leading underscore. The variable can be used outside of the object, but aren't always shown and, if I remember correctly, aren't exported outside of a module (the Python form of library, except that a library can be other thing than a module).
                     <br/>
                     Python also add the double leading underscore, which have yet another meaning and don't work exactly like variable with a single leading underscore ; while they still can be used outside of the object. It also add the double leading and double trailing underscore, which is yet another thing.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - What does # do?
                     <br/>
                     This one is easy, it's the way to mark a comment. Some language (C/C++ by example) use another way to mark a comment, but I don't know a language which have another use for the "#"... Well, speaking about it, something deep in my memory tell me that there's one which use it as variable (?) introducer, but I'm not sure.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - Why so many indentations?
                     <br/>
                     Er... in which language ? No, I'll answer directly because I understood this one : Because Python users are insane
                     <img alt=":D" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite674" data-shortname=":D" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Big grin    :D"/>
                     <br/>
                     There's some language, Python is one of them, where indentation have a major importance, while most of the language don't care at all about them.
                     <br/>
                     Here's a example of a basic function, firstly in Perl (voluntary not indented):
                     <br/>
                     <div class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--screenLimited bbCodeBlock--code">
                      <div class="bbCodeBlock-title">
                       Code:
                      </div>
                      <div class="bbCodeBlock-content" dir="ltr">
                       <pre class="bbCodeCode" data-lang="" data-xf-init="code-block" dir="ltr"><code>sub addition()
{
my res = 0
foreach( @_ )
{ res += $_; }
return a + b;
}</code></pre>
                      </div>
                     </div>
                     then in Python :
                     <br/>
                     <div class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--screenLimited bbCodeBlock--code">
                      <div class="bbCodeBlock-title">
                       Code:
                      </div>
                      <div class="bbCodeBlock-content" dir="ltr">
                       <pre class="bbCodeCode" data-lang="" data-xf-init="code-block" dir="ltr"><code>def addition( *args ):
    res = 0
    for i in args:
        res += i
    return a + b</code></pre>
                      </div>
                     </div>
                     In both example you have two blocs (an ensemble of code lines that form a single entity, but this ensemble can be a single line). In Perl, the bloc are started by a "{" and ended by a "}". In Python, you mark a bloc the ":" at the end of the line which introduce this bloc, and the bloc itself is all the line with a higher indentation that this line ; note that all the lines of a bloc MUST have exactly the same indentation.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - Is WHITESPACE the same as a regular space ?
                     <br/>
                     Yes, but no, but still yes.
                     <br/>
                     A regular space is one of the few whitespace, also name white characters. Another well know whitespace is the tabulation. So, in most of the language, tabulation and space are the same thing, but not in Python. In Python they are forbidden for indentation of the code.
                     <br/>
                     In fact it come for a problem with a long, long history. Some people indent their code with space, some other with tabulation, and these people can work on the same code. As long as the tabulation is of 8 spaces, all is great, the space indented lines and tabulation indented ones are at the same level. But if suddenly a new coder start to work for the project, and have a tabulation of 5 spaces, the lines aren't indented anymore.
                     <br/>
                     But the reason why they are forbidden in Python code is not aesthetic. It's just that what's the difference between two tabulation and 8 spaces ? Are they the same indentation or not ? Like it's the indentation which define the blocs, you need a strong knowledge here ; so, no tabulation.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     And, voila, I answered your question. But I think that you feel more confuse now that after my answers. The misunderstanding is that you think that, generally speaking, "all the language are the same" ; by example, a library is a library whatever the language. In the same times, coders know that each language is unique, even those which seem the same.
                     <br/>
                     Sorry again, but there's no way to escape it, you'll need to learn a programming language
                     <img alt=":D" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite674" data-shortname=":D" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Big grin    :D"/>
                     Don't worry, what "library" mean, why's the meaning of "#", and so on, all these questions will have their answer in the doc you'll choose. It's mandatory since the answer isn't the same for each language.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Edit: My god, my poor english skills
                     <img alt=":(" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite669" data-shortname=":(" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Frown    :("/>
                     I corrected the most obvious errors, sorry for the one I left.
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                    Ren'py:
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                     Track variables
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                     Save compatibiliy
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                     Updated
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                     Write a dynamic Ren'Py game
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                     a social media troll who spams your game everywhere, and does not respond to critics
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="junkanon · Sep 21, 2017 at 4:13 AM" data-lb-id="post-205200">
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                        EverythingButTheGirl said:
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                        is python easier than java?
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                     Usually yes, and the tutorials are more recent and more newbie-oriented.
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                        I never imagined i'd get this much resistance from the simple question of "where do you start?"
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                     The easiest way to learn the thought behind programming is through a language of your choice. Any language can do the trick, really, the thought process is the important part. That said, Python is as good a starting language as any, with the added bonus of Ren'py being written in Python.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     To offer a more substantial help, I liked the
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://udacity.com/course/intro-to-computer-science--cs101" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Intro to Computer Science
                     </a>
                     course from Udacity. It's kind of long, but the teacher is pretty good, and he explains a lot of stuff that happens behind the scenes. Also, the code you write during the course is actually useful, I used some of the stuff to write scripts for my daily job. Note: I'm talking about and linking the Open Course, which is free, not the Nanodegree, which is paid.
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="greyelf · Sep 21, 2017 at 8:01 AM" data-lb-id="post-205666">
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                     I would suggest that a new game developer doesn't start with learning to code within whatever engine they choose to use, and that they instead focus on designing the type of game they want and what core functionality it will have.
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                     eg.
                     <br/>
                     1. What type of game? eg. Sim (like Fresh Start), 3D Story (like DMD), RPG with graphics (like pick one)
                     <br/>
                     2. What values will need to be tracked?
                     <br/>
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                     Next I would suggest using software to plot out at least a first draft of the story-line(s) and the scenes, this can be added to after the actual code phase of the development has commenced.
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                     I personally find using a mind-mapping tool (like Twine) can help with this part of the development because they allow you to: write the script; block out the scenes; display the graphics; and track the value of each variable as the story progresses.
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                     Once at least some of both the core functionality and story design has been done you will have a better idea of what type of game engine you will need, and can start learn how to use that engine.
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                     OK, so I'll share my experience learning RenPy.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I found a game I liked (in this case Lab Rats), but had the urge to mod it.  So I studied script.rpy for that game for a bit to find my way around the code (most people are 'archiving' their games after they work on them. Vren hasn't been doing this.  If you see .rpa files in the game folder, Unren.bat can extract the files for you).
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Anyways, after playing around with the code for a bit (and saving often and backing up older files so I had fallback points), I changed/added the stuff I wanted.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     My point here is that, if you look at how others are scripting their RenPy games, this can give you much more useful insight than the RenPy cookbooks.  Basic storytelling in RenPy actually isn't very hard, but if you are trying to do more complex interactions with variables and such, that's where the difficulty creeps in.  Fortunately, for a basic story you may not need to get very complex.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I use notepad2 for editing, although there are some nice RenPy script editors out there as well.  And you really don't need to know a lot about Python to use RenPy, although it helps, especially if you are getting 'fancy' with your code.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     And RenPy comes with a simple story/module called 'The Question', which you can use as a starting point to code your story.  Of course, if you want to do more advanced things like changing the look and feel of the interface, that's more involved, but you can work on that stuff once you've become comfortable with the basic coding procedures in RenPy.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Some things that RenPy talks about in the basic cookbooks you may not actually need.  An example being the 'emotion states' thing, where you track the emotional state of a character, and their graphic changes based on this state.  This is a cool thing, but is not something that a lot of RenPy game writers use.  They usually just set up the pose and facial expression they need in their renders.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I hope that you find this useful.  RenPy can be a lot easier to use than it looks like from the outside, and looking at good examples can be very helpful in giving you insight as to how everything works.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     And don't be afraid to ask questions.  The Lemmasoft forum is specifically set up to help people understand RenPy, although the people that answer you may 'talk over your head' sometimes.  Google is also your friend in this regard (Just put RenPy and then your question into the search parameter).
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     ----
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     As for graphics, that's a whole other story.  There are other threads that discuss the pros and cons r.e. which method/software to use for this, so I won't recap that here.  I went the Daz route...
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                        Part 1 is what I've been asking for.... Everyone seems to be pushing straight into languages. We need to find a guide to build the foundation first. What are libraries? tools? What's with using underscore so much? What does # do? Why so many indentations? Is WHITESPACE the same as a regular space ?
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                        I never imagined i'd get this much resistance from the simple question of "where do you start?"
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                        It's like trying to get into a secret society.
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                     89 -- ok, here is my short version of how to get started:
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     1.  Install Ren'Py.  You should be able to find a number of YouTube tutorials on how to do it.  If you get stuck on one of them, watch someone else's.  After you see a few different ways to tackle it, you'll get it done.
                     <br/>
                     2.  Watch a number of Ren'Py basics tutorials.  Find ones that at least think they are for the basics, the simpler the better.  Same idea though -- as you watch one person's idea of what's basic, you will get stuck.  Always.  Expect it, don't worry about it.  When that happens, don't get frustrated (again, expect it), and try watching someone else's.  After seeing similar stuff from a few different sources, you will find the answer to whatever got you stuck before.
                     <br/>
                     3.  Download someone's game and see how it's built.  For this, I'd recommend Vren's LabRats, because he is very public about making sure that all the pieces are available (none hidden or compiled) so that anyone who wants can learn from his game.  I'd actually recommend contacting him to download an earlier version if possible, as his coding gets more complex as he learns more (which is cool!).
                     <br/>
                     4.  Remember that this is the kind of thing that a decent number of people make a living at and get paid for.  You're jumping in a pretty deep pool.  Doesn't mean you can't learn to swim -- of course you can!  But it does mean that to get good at it, there are tons of things to learn.
                     <br/>
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                     TL; DR -- it takes time, and persistence.
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                     Not gonna lie, I think I have learned more about Ren'Py here than I did from their own documentation.
                     <br/>
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                     Anywho, I think the cooking analogy is pretty spot on, reason being you have people that can burn water and you have people that can weave delicacies from roughly the same ingredients as hamburger helper (my american is showing)
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                     The trouble with coding and in the context of the analogy is that there is no application for the learner to understand. Like some people learn to cook in order to be able to eat, some people enjoy it but there is an analogue way of figuring out what works and what doesn't, if you mess up it tastes bad, if you succeed it is amazing. To a degree coding can be the same but it isn't as natural for most people to figure it out. I find myself learning the most by example like picking through others' code and I am a bit of a brute force person who will try again repeatedly until I get what I want to happen or I get an error message that I can decipher. Thats not as easy as figuring out what tastes bad and what tastes good most of the time.
                     <br/>
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                     Now the biggest thing I have learned with all the different languages that I "know" is that it is easier when you have someone actually there who knows what they are doing. When I learned PHP I was totally frustrated with it, then I had an engineer who works with PHP explain it to me and ironically related it to python and I started to kinda get it. It's hard to get that from books and forums, and even I still suck at pretty much most of the languages I know. The biggest thing about guides and forums is usually the knowledge is passed down by those who already know to a point that it becomes hard to relate tho the one who doesn't know. That's why adults think children are simply stupid. Unfortunately being self taught means jacking it up so much that you have a cataloged list of things you know for a fact don't work or til you get something so janky that you post it and everyone points it out and some guy tells you 5 ways to do the same thing better. Maybe your best bet is to trade notes with noobs that might have figured out an element or two that you have not and vice versa. Keep trying and keep asking, the day that you blame the guides and give up is the day that the code wins and cackles at you as you walk away.
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="anne O'nymous · Sep 21, 2017 at 2:21 PM" data-lb-id="post-206065">
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                        The biggest thing about guides and forums is usually the knowledge is passed down by those who already know to a point that it becomes hard to relate tho the one who doesn't know.
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                     In fact the problem is more psychosomething than anything else. Take what I said about '#' in my previous answer. I said that it seemed, at this time, that perhaps there was a language where '#' is used as variable prefix... Yeah, of course there's one ! It's Perl, my favorite language, the language I massively used during the twentish last years ! $#array is the last index of an array.
                     <br/>
                     If I had had to address this last index in a code yesterday, I'm sure that I wouldn't had a single hesitation. But just talking about the subject and it become a, "well perhaps that, who can really say, but I'm not really sure".
                     <br/>
                     Anyone figure out this problem the first time they try to help
                     <s>
                      the brats
                     </s>
                     their children doing their homework ; "wow, take it easy ! I'll help you, but first remember me, what's a verb ?". The more we use something, the more it stop to be knowledge for to become just a part of us. When using our native language we don't pass our time stating that, "here's the verb, and here's the subject", like we learned in school. We just do it. But when come the time to explain it, well it's not this easy.
                     <br/>
                     And the same apply for any knowledge. The more a thing is near to the basis, the easier it's to forget about it and let the reader with a big, "so what's this exactly ?". That's why, when given the choice between two authors for a subject, I choose the one who's (or was) teacher. He don't have a better knowledge, but he past time with students, and after hearing so many, "but what about that", he tend to forget less things.
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                    Ren'py:
                    <a class="link link--external" href="https://f95zone.com/threads/5676/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                     Track variables
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                     Write a dynamic Ren'Py game
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                     Oh, just looking the start and an important thing crossed my mind. There's
                     <b>
                      two
                     </b>
                     versions of python, the 2.x and the 3.x.
                     <br/>
                     While they are the same language, they aren't the same, er... language. There's few, but significant, differences between the two versions. So, even if the basis of the language are the same, using a doc/tuto for Python 3.x is not the good solution since ren'py use Python 2.x. You'll learn the basis, but quickly be confused because the result isn't exactly what shown in the doc. Or, worse, you'll not been able to understand why it don't work.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     One example:
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                       <pre class="bbCodeCode" data-lang="" data-xf-init="code-block" dir="ltr"><code>if not isinstance( variable, str ):
  variable = ""</code></pre>
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                     </div>
                     A classical, you validate that the variable have the right type, and force a default value else. Learning Python 3.x, you'll think that it's 100% correct. Using it with ren'py, it will
                     <b>
                      never
                     </b>
                     work.
                     <br/>
                     The difference is in the meaning of "str". For Python 3.x, it mean "all kind of strings", but for Python 2.x, it mean "ASCII strings only". And like ren'py tend to code all the strings of your game in unicode...
                     <br/>
                     So, at the end, your code is technically correct, every single documentations talking about Python 3.x say that it's how you must do it. But it will never work with ren'py, because a string in unicode isn't an ASCII string. And you'll start a two hours search in both your code, the doc, stackoverflow and ren'py source code, before understanding why it don't work...
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                    <a class="link link--external" href="https://f95zone.com/threads/5676/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                     Track variables
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                     Updated
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                     Write a dynamic Ren'Py game
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="TyronTheButcher · Sep 27, 2017 at 12:05 PM" data-lb-id="post-217150">
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                        To make good games you need...
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                        a writer(s)
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                        an editor
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                        an artist(s)
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                        a coder
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                        a social media troll who spams your game everywhere, and does not respond to critics
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                     pretty much what my 3dsmax/maya/3d graphics Professor in College(and everyone in those courses...and every company that does it) said or will say..Biggest problem with learning any engine, is the language. And when starting off a first game, I have to completely agree with the person I'm quoting, cause working in a team to start with, is the best way to hands on actually learn what you're trying to start off with.
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                     Hijacking the thread, currently learning ren'py and looking through Vren Lab rats and Deviant Discories from Jan the Spider (both make their codes public),i notice that Vren use init python and Jan use ren'py normal init, my question is: it is possible to use both in one script? because at some point i notice there some code easier to be written with python,and vice versa
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                        deepedia said:
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                     All ren'py games have their code public, but not all are legally freely reusable. It's not because a game is distributed with only rpa archive and rpyc files, that the author haven't put his code in public domain. In the same time, distributing unarchived rpy files doesn't mean that the author have put the code in public domain.
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                        it is possible to use both in one script?
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                     Yes. There's even the, too underrated, possibility to define your own ren'py statements.
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                    Ren'py:
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                     Track variables
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                    -
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                     Save compatibiliy
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                     Updated
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                     Write a dynamic Ren'Py game
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="Abadonna · Sep 29, 2017 at 3:35 AM" data-lb-id="post-219694">
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                     Main advice - start with something small. The smaller the better actually.
                     <br/>
                     Tools are not so important, but art is. So I would recommend to find some money for a good artist.
                     <br/>
                     Profit!
                     <img alt=":)" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite667" data-shortname=":)" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Smile    :)"/>
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                     For anyone thinking about learning Ren'Py:
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Download the SDK and run it. There are two "games" that come with the software. One of them, "The Question" is a very simple, bare bones VN that illustrates you how to do narrative text, dialogue, choices and how to show character and background art. The source code is there and for the most part it's no harder than it would be if you were writing a script for someone else to code.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     The other game is called Tutorial and is just a huge grab-bag of tricks with the games narrator describing more advanced things you might want to do, doing them and explaining how it works.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     If you want to do an open-world sandbox, rpg, trainer game with advanced AI you're still going to have a learning curve. But if you want to tell a story, and maybe track a few stats, Ren'Py is about as easy as it gets.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     [edit]
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     *ahem* SDK not SKD. As in
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.renpy.org/latest.html" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Ren'Py Standard Development Kit
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                     .
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                     I know this thread has gone kind of stale, but I thought I would share my experience.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     When I began my AS in computer programming several years ago the first language we were taught was Python. The book we studied from was
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.amazon.com/Starting-Out-Python-Tony-Gaddis/dp/0133582736/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&amp;qid=1517277440&amp;sr=8-3&amp;keywords=starting+out+with+python" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Starting out with Python by Tony Gaddis
                     </a>
                     . The book was so good that if I read the book the night before, I knew everything the teacher was going to cover the next day. It contained perfect step by step instructions that detailed what you were doing and why.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Once you learn one language, it's a breeze learning others because the logic doesn't change. From Python we easily transitioned into C++, Java, R, etc. That's the beauty of programming, once you understand how the logic works, control structures, decision trees, objects, etc, it is the same for every language. All you learn is new syntax, where to put periods and colons.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Now I haven't used python in years, but when I picked up Ren'py it all came back and everything about Ren'py, from the internal structure to the interface made perfect sense. And all because of that single book. Hope it helps. Ciao!
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