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   Tech Talk Thread Hardware for  Rendering | F95zone
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I'll use the cpu then to render which slows down your machine and renders will take longer:(

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                     I started this question about hardware in the
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://f95zone.com/threads/big-brother-fan-art.3950/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Big Brother - Fan Art
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                     -section and some guys felt disturbed.
                     <br/>
                     So I collected that tech talk and post it here as a starter in quotes.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
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                            Max Headroom said:
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                            One dumb question to you:
                            <br/>
                            when I dl all that posted setting files and the rendering program (Daz 8?), what and how long does it take till I can produce such pictures?
                            <br/>
                            Can you give me some hints how to start? Only to produce some nice pics and to "fool around" with the girls. I don't think that I ever become such an artist like you.
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                            Rich said:
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                            Daz Studio 4.9 - daz3d.com.  Well, you can drop figures into a scene and press "render" in just a couple of minutes.  Posing, lighting and composition are the harder parts, and there's no way to learn that other than to start doing it.  How long it takes to produce "nice" pics depends on how much time you put into experimenting and learning.
                            <br/>
                            <br/>
                            I know that's a non-answer, but it's about the best I can give you.  Using these programs is a learned skill, just like anything else.
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                            Max Headroom said:
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                            That's what I nearly exspected. :biggrin:
                            <br/>
                            I know learning by doing... the same old song. :biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:
                            <br/>
                            <br/>
                            So what does I need "physically" for a girl-pic at the beginning, let us say a pic of Lisa at the pool?
                            <br/>
                            The prg and which pattern else?
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                            And then just fooling around with the prg like every other fu... software and hardware?
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                            celtic1138 said:
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                            Start slow. Pick a model that you like. From the game Alice and Lisa are probably the easiest to begin with. I posted materials for both their skins in the Art Assets thread. Load up the skin. You'll find loads of poses for daz that you can buy (or find elsewhere
                            <img alt=":)" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite667" data-shortname=":)" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Smile    :)"/>
                            ), they are a good place to start. It can be a little tricky posing models in Daz so if you use a set pose you'll find it easier to get a good result in the beginning. It's even a good idea to start with a set pose and then modify it to your liking.
                            <br/>
                            <br/>
                            Next you need to do the lighting. Daz iray engine is a physical based light system, so light behaves like real light and it's often best to think of iray lighting in those terms. Again you can find lighting sets to get you started, they are a good way to learn how things work.
                            <br/>
                            <br/>
                            It can seem a little daunting at first but if you try it out you'll find it's not all that difficult to get good results. I've only been using Daz (rr any rendering program) since Feb/March of this year so it doesn't take long to get going if you put in a little time.
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                            You'll get the program on Daz3d.com... it's free... Most of the assets you can get in the Assets thread here.
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                            For best results you need a computer with an nvidia graphics card.
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                            I'm happy that it has a graphics card at all!
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                                ATI Radeon HD 3600
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                            celtic1138 said:
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                            I'll use the cpu then to render which slows down your machine and renders will take longer
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                            Max Headroom said:
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                            It has an Intel Core 2 Quad CPU Q6600 2.40GHz and 4 G RAM running Vista 64B.
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                            Yes I know... it is 10 years old but till now enough for me.
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                            micmitja said:
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                            I suggest you to leave rendering to other ppl before you burn your computer down, can scroll back some pages and see how burnout computer card looks like.
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                            a1fox3 said:
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                            Your going to burn that thing up doing this kind of application.
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                            Max Headroom said:
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                            Really? So hard to render a bit?
                            <img alt=":eek:" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite675" data-shortname=":eek:" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Eek!    :eek:"/>
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                            OK what is the
                            <b>
                             MUST HAVE
                            </b>
                            (not the minimum) to get some rendering fun and I will buy me a new "calculator" next time.
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                            a1fox3 said:
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                            That depends on what you can afford.
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                            Most fun for little money. (as usual)
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                            I have no clue what 's on the market and how much.
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                            Let me explain like that: a knight fresh out of time from medieval needs a sports car, which would you recommend?
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                            a1fox3 said:
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                            At min. intel 3Ghz quad core with as much ram the mother board can handle up to 32Gb with at least GTX 1060 at min. (1080 would be great though.) Extra case cooling fans.
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                            celtic1138 said:
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                            You really need to have an nvidia card with at least 4gb of ram. But I would recommend something with a nvidia geforce gtx1060 or better. The more system ram the better... the larger the scene and the more characters you want to use will require higher ram... I'd recommend 16GB+. You also want a multi-core processor... 2ghz or better. Hard drive will have a little effect but it not too big a deal.
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                            Were very close on this but I would go with 3Gz instead of 2Ghz.
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                            Rich said:
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                            If you're rendering via GPU, the CPU speed doesn't make a ton of difference.  Some, yes, but not a ton.
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                            Max Headroom said:
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                            Ohh fu.... when I go to Amzon (quick check) I see ~20 different models for GTX 1080... Bad when you are out of business  buying hardware for 10 years...
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                            What is the difference between GPU &amp; CPU rendering? In the results I ask for.
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                            a1fox3 said:
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                            True if it was only for doing rendering but if use for regular computer also then the faster it is the better.
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                            celtic1138 said:
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                            GPU rendering is much, much quicker, it also won't slow down your whole computer. If you are in anyway serious about doing any Iray rendering it's a must.
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                            Max Headroom said:
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                            So with GPU-rendering the GPU does the rendering while I still can use the computer for... maybe chatting with you f.e.?
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                            BTW this last pics aren't with your "new" Alice, or and does the new need more GPU power?
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                            celtic1138 said:
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                            Yeah, the GPU does the bulk of the rendering. I'm currently rendering and have no slow down at all on other non gpu specific applications.
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                            The recent renders are done to match the newer spider scenes from the game so they use my regular Alice skin (the more real skin would look wrong with standard Max also). It doesn't render particularly more slowly, I'll do something  more with it at some point though.
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                            penecultor said:
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                            Don't even try dude, i was using an AMD gaming pc with 2 gtx 750ti for my first renders and it exploded after 2 days rendering non stop, seriously dude, don't try.
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                            Now i'm using an old 4790k 4,4ghz with a 970 (1080 coming today)  and it takes time to render(1h20min render) but the temperature is fking nice.
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                            Techn0magier said:
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                            <a class="username" data-user-id="219571" data-username="@Max Headroom" data-xf-init="member-tooltip" href="https://f95zone.to/members/219571/">
                             @Max Headroom
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                            . Yes the Hardware seems to be an Issue, but let me tell you. Just for fun., you don't need the Monsters, the others tell you about.
                            <br/>
                            The Graphic card for axample. If you use it exclusivly for rendering a GTX 750Ti or a 960 will work for cheap money. You can conect a monitor on a second card or an on board solution. That is, what I'm doing, when I want to do smth else. Same with actual RAM. The problem here isn't DAZ. It is mainly the OS you use. As soon as you use Win10 you will need at least 16 GB, but with a lower version like Win7 or 8 you can get away with 8 Gigs. But didn't expect grainfree 4K images. XD I use a Machine that was build mainly for skyrim and Sims4 since. And it works just fine for me, as a render machine as well. I do the nice stuff, when I'm not at home or in the night, so I can do the higher quality stuff too. And as soon as you discover blender, things will change again.
                            <br/>
                            A friend of mine, sneezes at Gaming PCs like Alienware, b/c she needs at least 16GB VRam for some "simple" animations done in Blender.
                            <img alt=";)" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite668" data-shortname=";)" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Wink    ;)"/>
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                            polywog said:
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                            CPUs can render 24/7  it's GPUs that need to be replaced every few months.
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                            ADD fans to your case.  "Positive air flow"   some people think leaving the side cover off the computer lets it cool.
                            <br/>
                            that air is just sitting getting hot, it's not carrying the heat away.  Air flow works best with the cover on, so the air travels across the gpus
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                            <a href="https://f95zone.to/attachments/25111/" target="_blank">
                             View attachment 25111
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                            micmitja said:
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                            Yeah i prefer that my gpu last longer than just few month so i avoid doing that
                            <img alt=":)" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite667" data-shortname=":)" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Smile    :)"/>
                            . But yes all depend on heat management better it is longer it last. Good cleaning and time down.
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                            cusa said:
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                            fan art forum or tech talk?
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                            micmitja said:
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                            Both depend on a need. Why asking ?
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                            polywog said:
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                            Actually good that you mentioned "time down"
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                            warm up before rendering.  cool down between, but don't go cold   hot/cold causes expansion contraction stresses
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                            <a class="link link--external" href="http://www.electronicdesign.com/boards/how-minimize-component-thermal-overstress-failures-part-2" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                             How To Minimize Component Thermal Overstress Failures (Part 2)
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                            Sorry but till I find a tech talk forum with people use this stuff in that manner...
                            <br/>
                            So why should not asking the guys at work?
                            <br/>
                            <br/>
                            Maybe I should better opened a own thread...
                            <br/>
                            <br/>
                            Sorry again
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                            polywog said:
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                            Don't apologize.  This thread is about fan art, and what it takes to make it.  Just ignore the trolls who can't read.
                            <br/>
                            Tech talk, mod suggestions, and spiders, is what make these images possible.  For those who just want to see the pics, download the game mods.
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                     Nevertheless I collect this talk and post it here for other newbees like me.
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                     I hope you find this talk as useful as me.
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                       PLs help to keep the threads clean,
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                       before posting a single "Thanks" and causing an Alert. THX
                       <br/>
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                        I started this question about hardware in the
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                         Big Brother - Fan Art
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                        -section and some guys felt disturbed.
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                        So I collected that tech talk and post it here as a starter in quotes.
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                        Never the less I collect this talk and post it here for other newbees like me.
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                        I hope you find this talk as useful as me.
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                     You worry too much polywog gave you good answer to that. There is good chance that this thread will get deleted anyway. Some ppl are just lazy and don't want to read.
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                        micmitja said:
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                        You worry too much polywog gave you good answer to that. There is good chance that this thread will get deleted anyway. Some ppl are just lazy and don't want to read.
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                     Deleted? Why? Too much quotes in one post or what?
                     <br/>
                     It takes me 1/2 hour to filter them out...
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                       PLs help to keep the threads clean,
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                       before posting a single "Thanks" and causing an Alert. THX
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                      If your system runs not right  -  call:
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                        Deleted? Why? Too much quotes in one post or what?
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                        It takes me 1/2 hour to filter them out...
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                     Nope, because usually unnecessary threads get deleted.
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                     oO Don't worry. So let's talk tech.
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                     Do you prefere a secondary card for rendering or do you guys use, the same card as for the monitor? And in addition, IRay allows the support of multiple NVidia Cards any experience with that either?
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                    My fav unfinished games:  Summertime Saga, Photo Hunt, Love&amp;Sex: Second Base
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                    My fav finished games: Man of the House, Soldiers Live, Sisterly Lust, MIST
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                     Clutter the mods call it.
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                     The only thing you need to know about rendering images is the older your hardware the slower it will be and there is a chance you will burn out your rig.
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                     It's happened before to folk.
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                        Gomly1980 said:
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                        Threads do tend to get deleted if they don't have a purpose and while it may serve you it's not a thread that's needed.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        Clutter the mods call it.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        The only thing you need to know about rendering images is the older your hardware the slower it will be and there is a chance you will burn out your rig.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        It's happened before to folk.
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                     The only thing I learned about computers in about 100 years is ONE thing:
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                      The newer the OS is so much more slower is the machine!
                     </b>
                     <br/>
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                     New OS are dreck. Scripted like popcorn and with features no one really needs but drag the system.
                     <br/>
                     Ohhh I want I could run DOS 6.0 on a machine from now!!! Small, tiny, clean...
                     <br/>
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                     But we are going off topic in the first posts...
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                       PLs help to keep the threads clean,
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                     My setup has dual GTX 1080's.  Yes, I splurged.  Seriously so.  But it renders
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                     well.  One of them has the monitor plugged into it, so there's a small performance degradation to the rendering, but it's not a big deal.  Since the renders run in the GPU, there isn't a significant effect on the rest of the machine's performance - I can browse, etc., etc. without noticing it.  But I usually run my renders in a batch overnight anyway.  Does rather warm the room up, of course... LOL
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                     well i don't know...but i think you can pass from a program to another ....in some alchemical way of course....
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                     maybe you can avoid the risk of a cpu/gpu burn...
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                     I use Daz3D 4.9, rendering with one "Titan X" (12GB non-pascal) video-card. {I have a LOT of large scenes and Daz is rather bloated with crap, when it comes time to render. Most 12GB scenes actually get reduced to about 4-8GB in the video-card, but if Daz thinks 12GB won't fit, it will simply fallback to CPU rendering, never even trying the GPU. Unless you setup a render-batch.}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Time to render a 4K scene, with just one model and adequate lighting, with minimal reflections and atmosphere... About 2-minutes to 24-hours... It's all about how much quality you want, in the end. Poor lighting leads to grainy shadows, but rendering 2x larger, if possible, nearly kills that. Well, after you do a noise-reduction and then resize it back to half-size, which is actually 100% of what you originally wanted.
                     <br/>
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                     I use dual monitors (Had three, but got tired of moving my mouse across all three screens) One uses the CPU's Intel-Video and the other uses the same Titan-X that I render with. I would comment about rendering and "using the computer at the same time", except I don't use the computer while rendering often. Daz is the hog, not the rendering, when rendering. (Rendering is threaded and independent of CPU actions, when it happens, when rendering with a GPU.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     However, Daz likes to monitor the whole process, which is what the treads are doing, when using the GPU to render. Total overkill. (There are ways to reduce that bloated overhead.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Even when rendering on CPU, you can simply remove one processor (virtual-core), from Daz's grasp, and your computer runs nearly normal. As normal as it would run, with only one core running everything. (Computers spend 98% of the time doing nothing, ... fast!)
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                        My setup has dual GTX 1080's.  Yes, I splurged.  Seriously so.  But it renders
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                        well.  One of them has the monitor plugged into it, so there's a small performance degradation to the rendering, but it's not a big deal.  Since the renders run in the GPU, there isn't a significant effect on the rest of the machine's performance - I can browse, etc., etc. without noticing it.  But I usually run my renders in a batch overnight anyway.  Does rather warm the room up, of course... LOL
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                     people say that video card from rendering the images lose their quality for several months . what you say is true or not. what is better dual GTX 1080 for $ 2,000 or RAISEN TR4 for $ 2,000 to render as you think .thank you ask for my English it's Google
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                        people say that video card from rendering the images lose their quality for several months . what you say is true or not. what is better dual GTX 1080 for $ 2,000 or RAISEN TR4 for $ 2,000 to render as you think .thank you ask for my English it's Google
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                     I believe you are asking if video cards degrade over time and while the answer is technically yes its an imperceptably small amount where max over clock will go down a touch due to circuit degradation however this is about a 1% or less over say a year or two where most "losses" are to it being outpaced by newer models.  As for whats better 2 1080 ti or 2 vega 56/64s I'd say for rendering and compute loads are where the vegas shine. Only problems are you will want either after market cooled cards or do a hybrid ala gamers nexus. Keep in mind your system will need a 1000W+ PSU as these things are thirsty oced under load.  As far as cpu rendering I believe a high end threadripper will render a bit better on quality it just depends on your program.
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                     Threads rarely get deleted. The only time we delete posts is when it's derailing the discussion, eg; discussing sport in a game thread.
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                     However, the "Programming and Development" category is a better fit for this discussion, as rendering isn't exclusively limited to BB, moving it there.
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                        I believe you are asking if video cards degrade over time and while the answer is technically yes its an imperceptably small amount where max over clock will go down a touch due to circuit degradation however this is about a 1% or less over say a year or two where most "losses" are to it being outpaced by newer models.  As for whats better 2 1080 ti or 2 vega 56/64s I'd say for rendering and compute loads are where the vegas shine. Only problems are you will want either after market cooled cards or do a hybrid ala gamers nexus. Keep in mind your system will need a 1000W+ PSU as these things are thirsty oced under load.
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                     Part of doing this "properly" is making sure that your cards aren't being stressed out thermally too badly while you're rendering.  When I started this, the first few times I kept a close eye on them with GPU-Z.  With the on-board fans and the case cooling, they were staying well within their temperature specs.  And the ones I bought were the Founders Edition from Geforce - they have a good rep for building cards that don't crap out.
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                     But yes, GPU's used this way are current hogs, so you have to make sure you have enough power supply.
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                        As far as cpu rendering I believe a high end threadripper will render a bit better on quality it just depends on your program.
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                     That may very well vary by program.  In the case of Daz Studio, my understanding is that the Iray implementation uses the exact same algorithms whether you're rending with GPU vs CPU, so there should be no quality difference if the two are rendered to the same endpoint.  That may not be the case with all 3D programs...
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                     Again a dumb question I'm really a noob in this matter:
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                     I have (as I said before) a Intel Core 2 Quad CPU Q6600 2.40GHz with 4G RAM 64-bit. When I upgrade the RAM why should this computer not be sufficiant to render some pics with CPU?
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                     OK the graphic card is lousy I know so don't talk about that.
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                     I don't want to render a lot only some pics to test and learn for the beginning.
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                     Haha I was already looking at GPU-Z on my 1060GTX 6 GB this morning before you wrote about it, Rich. I started a render and then took a look at the sensor info in GPU-Z. Good news: the temp slowly ramped up until it stabilized at 64C, fan speed likewise until 40%, power remained stable at 65% of TDP, and perfcap is due to VRel which is normal. Everything is nominal. I'm satisfied it's not going to burn out and now I'm not going to worry about it.
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                        Again a dumb question I'm really a noob in this matter:
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                        I have (as I said before) a Intel Core 2 Quad CPU Q6600 2.40GHz with 4G RAM 64-bit. When I upgrade the RAM why should this computer not be sufficiant to render some pics with CPU?
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                        OK the graphic card is lousy I know so don't talk about that.
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                        I don't want to render a lot only some pics to test and learn for the beginning.
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                     The CPU will render fine, but slowly. It's true Iray is agnostic which means it's the same on GPU or CPU, so the quality of the final image should be the same, provided the max time setting in Daz is long enough for CPU to reach the target convergence that GPU would be able to hit much sooner.
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                     So it's ONLY a question how FAST I want the picture 1 hour or 1 day?
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                     BTW how long need a render in the quality of BB in average on faster computer (like Rich's for example)?
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="NoesisAndNoema · Oct 8, 2017 at 5:50 PM" data-lb-id="post-236794">
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                     When it comes to Daz3D and nVidia-IRay, in relation to CPU and GPU...
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     For GPU, you will hardly be "stressed-out". My card barely runs above 50% wattage/amps, when overclocked, processing renderings. It uses just the "Cuda-cores", which is what makes it faster than CPU rendering. (Graphics-cards only get taxed when playing games, because games use EVERY component in the GPU, for Direct-X processing. Cuda is, mostly, only used for Phys-X processing. Making 3D things collide. When rendering "Rays", it is calculating where beams collide onto a surface, not just lighting-up a pre-burned graphic, like video-games do, for high-FPS speed tricks.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     When it comes to CPU rendering, having insufficient RAM will result in a failure to render and Daz3D crashing. (Only ever seen if one item, itself, is larger than your max available RAM, or you have hit your virtual-memory limit. Keeping in mind that 64-bit systems use twice the memory-space of 32-bit systems. 4GB on a 64-bit system is essentially equal to 2GB in a 32-bit system. Not to mention that each 64-bit program version tends to consume more memory when running.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     For CPU rendering, it is the number of cores/threads, which is the largest determining factor in render-speeds. (Parallel processing)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Having a 1GHz CPU with 32 cores is 32x faster than a 3GHz CPU with only one core, for rendering. The math is complex, but not that complex... It is just long math, which finishes faster than the time it takes to read the data from RAM. This is ALSO why GPU's running GDDR5 are better than regulated and core-speed-locked system RAM at slower speeds and at only DDR3 limits.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     When it comes to degrading, your CPU will die about 75% faster, even with the best cooling, as opposed to the untaxed GPU rendering. Your CPU will run 100%, throttling itself to sustain safe levels of heat dissipation, whether you have 1 or 60 cores.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     By the way, a 60 core processor doesn't come close to matching 3000+ cuda-cores, in 1 Titan-X, for rendering speed.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     However, if you render with something other than nVidia-IRay... The tables may turn. IRay is NOT the only rendering-engine out there. That is just what Daz3D uses, for free, to replace the outdated OpenGL rendering-engine, 3DeLight, which is still included with Daz3D. That is CPU-only... They don't use Cuda-Cores for that rendering-engine.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Plus, Titan-X's are a LOT cheaper than 60-core CPU's and the motherboards needed to run them.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     NOTE: Titan-X is the ONLY video-card with 12GB that is one solid chunk of memory. The other cards with 12GB are actually (6GB one core)+(6GB second core). Thus, they have a 6GB scene-limit for GPU rendering. They can NOT share that memory as one large chunk. And, stupidly, nVidia refuses to simply use system RAM as a swap, unless you pay big bucks for them to release that forced limitation. (They want you to buy the super-expensive 24GB cards instead.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     nVidia Tesla P40 24GB video-cards... $11,000.00+
                     <br/>
                     Link:
                     <a class="link link--external" href="http://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/accessories/apd/489-bbco?cid=308990&amp;st=&amp;gclid=EAIaIQobChMI7rLo3-Pg1gIVWJN-Ch03kwVxEAQYASABEgLlxvD_BwE&amp;lid=5841086&amp;VEN1=snCnmXt2o,51918710868,901pdb6671,c,,489-BBCO&amp;VEN2=,&amp;dgc=st&amp;dgseg=dhs&amp;acd=1230980731501410&amp;VEN3=114603805402650450" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Dell Video-card Tesla P40
                     </a>
                     <br/>
                     It only has 3840 CUDA Cores... Not much more than the Titan-X... Which sells for about $400.00 Used, each. (That would be about 27 Titan-X's, which would be 81000 Cuda-cores. For that same price as one Tesla-P40 card with only 3840 cuda-cores.)
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                     Copying a post from the BB Fan Art thread I made, asking for help.
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                        At min. intel 3Ghz quad core with as much ram the mother board can handle up to 32Gb with at least GTX 1060 at min. (1080 would be great though.) Extra case cooling fans.
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                        You really need to have an nvidia card with at least 4gb of ram. But I would recommend something with a nvidia geforce gtx1060 or better. The more system ram the better... the larger the scene and the more characters you want to use will require higher ram... I'd recommend 16GB+. You also want a multi-core processor... 2ghz or better. Hard drive will have a little effect but it not too big a deal.
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                     So, Black Friday deals are going to start in about a month and I need to upgrade to have that sweet iRay render speed
                     <img alt=":)" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite667" data-shortname=":)" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Smile    :)"/>
                     <br/>
                     Was hoping to get some help on what pieces I should replace.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     <b>
                      CPU
                     </b>
                     : Intel Core i5-4690 Haswell Quad-Core 3.5 GHz
                     <br/>
                     <b>
                      RAM
                     </b>
                     : 16GB DDR3 1333
                     <br/>
                     <b>
                      GPU
                     </b>
                     : MSI GeForce GTX 760 2GB GDDR5
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I know the GPU has to be upgraded. Most of the chat has focused on a 1060+ (mainly 1080) GPU. Should I aim for a 1080 as mentioned above? Also, will 16GB to 32GB make a huge difference? GPU is PCI 3.0, I can put it in my 2.0 slot and use a new GPU for rendering only.
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                        obiwan21 said:
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                        Copying a post from the BB Fan Art thread I made, asking for help.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        So, Black Friday deals are going to start in about a month and I need to upgrade to have that sweet iRay render speed
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                        Was hoping to get some help on what pieces I should replace.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        <b>
                         CPU
                        </b>
                        : Intel Core i5-4690 Haswell Quad-Core 3.5 GHz
                        <br/>
                        <b>
                         RAM
                        </b>
                        : 16GB DDR3 1333
                        <br/>
                        <b>
                         GPU
                        </b>
                        : MSI GeForce GTX 760 2GB GDDR5
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        I know the GPU has to be upgraded. Most of the chat has focused on a 1060+ (mainly 1080) GPU. Should I aim for a 1080 as mentioned above? Also, will 16GB to 32GB make a huge difference? GPU is PCI 3.0, I can put it in my 2.0 slot and use a new GPU for rendering only.
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                     You would be way better off getting the 1060 than that 760, the 1060 has min of 4 Gb ram and the 760 only 2Gb ram.
                     <br/>
                     The more video ram you have the faster it will do the job.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     As for cpu and for the same price range.
                     <br/>
                     Your:
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://ark.intel.com/products/80810/Intel-Core-i5-4690-Processor-6M-Cache-up-to-3_90-GHz" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Intel® Core™ i5-4690 Processor (6M Cache, up to 3.90 GHz) Product Specifications
                     </a>
                     <br/>
                     Better:
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://ark.intel.com/products/88188/Intel-Core-i5-6600-Processor-6M-Cache-up-to-3_90-GHz" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Intel® Core™ i5-6600 Processor (6M Cache, up to 3.90 GHz) Product Specifications
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                        I started this question about hardware ... collected that tech talk and post it here as a starter in quotes. ...
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                     Max, you may want to split the one huge spoiler you made into several smaller ones, as spoiler headline use the different user names.
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                        Copying a post from the BB Fan Art thread I made, asking for help. ...
                        <br/>
                        <b>
                         CPU
                        </b>
                        : Intel Core i5-4690 Haswell Quad-Core 3.5 GHz
                        <br/>
                        <b>
                         RAM
                        </b>
                        : 16GB DDR3 1333
                        <br/>
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                         GPU
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                        : MSI GeForce GTX 760 2GB GDDR5
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                     Newer Core i5 cpus are not that much faster, a more expensive video card will help. Maybe one 1070? Be aware you may need a better, more performant PSU in the end. 500 watts should be sufficient, keep in mind the 12 V link for extra current. Please see:
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/934921/is-my-500w-psu-enough-to-run-the-gtx1070-/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/934921/is-my-500w-psu-enough-to-run-the-gtx1070-/
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                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     If you can go for a Core i7 maybe this is an upgrade path for you later. A good 500 watts PSU should still be enough.
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                     Edit: You're also still new, so... Welcome to the F95 forum, I like to see you being active here. Nice to have you and all the other new mems. Enjoy your stay.
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                          Ren'Py Games, RPGM Games - how-to run
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                        Cirro84 said:
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                        Max, you may want to split the one huge spoiler you made into several smaller ones, as spoiler headline use the different user names.
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                     I did that in the first attempt and it looked horrible. One spoiler headline after the other repeating mostly 3 or 4 names alternatly, not really clear. I find it better how it is now.
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                        I believe if I wrote "
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="obiwan21 · Oct 9, 2017 at 8:13 AM" data-lb-id="post-238209">
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                        a1fox3 said:
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                        You would be way better off getting the 1060 than that 760, the 1060 has min of 4 Gb ram and the 760 only 2Gb ram.
                        <br/>
                        The more video ram you have the faster it will do the job.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        As for cpu and for the same price range.
                        <br/>
                        Your:
                        <a class="link link--external" href="https://ark.intel.com/products/80810/Intel-Core-i5-4690-Processor-6M-Cache-up-to-3_90-GHz" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                         Intel® Core™ i5-4690 Processor (6M Cache, up to 3.90 GHz) Product Specifications
                        </a>
                        <br/>
                        Better:
                        <a class="link link--external" href="https://ark.intel.com/products/88188/Intel-Core-i5-6600-Processor-6M-Cache-up-to-3_90-GHz" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                         Intel® Core™ i5-6600 Processor (6M Cache, up to 3.90 GHz) Product Specifications
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                     No need to splurge on a 1080? I know BF will have some deals. The current price of a 1060 could probably be the price of a 1080. But if there is nothing spectacular going from a 1060 to a 1080, then I can save money on a 1060. Also, future-proofing, if in 2 years, I wish I woulda got a 1080, then that's also a factor.
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                        Newer Core i5 cpus are not that much faster, a more expensive video card will help. Maybe one 1070? Be aware you may need a better, more performant PSU in the end. 500 watts should be sufficient, keep in mind the 12 V link for extra current. Please see:
                        <a class="link link--external" href="https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/934921/is-my-500w-psu-enough-to-run-the-gtx1070-/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                         https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/934921/is-my-500w-psu-enough-to-run-the-gtx1070-/
                        </a>
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        If you can go for a Core i7 maybe this is an upgrade path for you later. A good 500 watts PSU should still be enough.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        Edit: You're also still new, so... Welcome to the F95 forum, I like to see you being active here. Nice to have you and all the other new mems. Enjoy your stay.
                        <img alt=";)" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite668" data-shortname=";)" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Wink    ;)"/>
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                     Thanks for the welcome. Trying to be usefully active, haha.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I will keep that CPU in mind, so that if the new GPU pairs much better with a new CPU, then sure. I don't mind splurging a bit this holiday
                     <img alt=":)" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite667" data-shortname=":)" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Smile    :)"/>
                     Also, I have a 750w PSU: EVGA SuperNOVA 750 G2
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     So, my computer isn't too bad. Will look into a new i7, PSU is good, memory should hold up, and just need to see if a 1080 is worth the extra $$ compared to 1060. I know it's better, just need to see if it's worth it in terms of performance and so on.
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                     This is what i'm using right now. Cheap and pretty good imo.
                     <br/>
                     CPU:
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://ark.intel.com/products/80807/Intel-Core-i7-4790K-Processor-8M-Cache-up-to-4_40-GHz" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      i7 4790k
                     </a>
                     4.40ghz with
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Extreme-Performance-Liquid-Cooler/dp/B019EXSSBG" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Corsair Hydro Series H100i v2 Extreme
                     </a>
                     <br/>
                     Mother Board :
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.amazon.com/MSI-Z97-Intel-Gaming-Motherboard/dp/B00K8KPXUO" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      MSI Gaming 5
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                     Ram :
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.amazon.com/Kingston-Predator-1866MHz-HX318C9T2K4-16/dp/B00M7S83I4" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Kingston HyperX Predator 16Gb
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                     <br/>
                     GPU :
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.amazon.com/MSI-GTX-1080-GAMING-8G/dp/B01GXOWUDQ?th=1" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      MSI Gtx 1080
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                     <br/>
                     Case :
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.amazon.co.uk/Corsair-Titanium-Ultra-Silent-Integrated-Controller/dp/B00NJNDGFG" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Corsair Carbide Series 330R Ti.
                     </a>
                     <br/>
                     It's an old pc i was using mostly for photoshop and so on.
                     <br/>
                     16gb Ram is enough unless you're planning to use cpu rendering or load a ton of stuff in your scene.
                     <br/>
                     Like a1fox3 said, buy some extra case cooling fans.
                     <br/>
                     I just upgraded the gpu from gtx970 to gtx1080. I would recommend you a 1080, that way in the future, you could get another one and put them together.
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                     I'd recommend going with the 1080 if you can afford it, but certainly get the 1070 over the 1060, the ram difference is a big plus. You'll certainly be able to render well with any of them but GPU ram can be an issue with how much you want in  your scene so it's best to have some spare to play around with.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Low system ram will effect the daz viewport. So if you load a huge scene with lots of characters you will start to get slowdown as you try an move the camera around. I would say at a minimum you want 16gb, but memory isn't hugely expensive so there is no point in limiting yourself if you can help it.
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                     Okay.. Settled.. 1080 hunting for black friday. CPU, i will still keep an eye out, and RAM, will look into that 3rd.
                     <br/>
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                     Thanks all for the help! I have my holiday list planned out now
                     <img alt=":)" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite667" data-shortname=":)" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Smile    :)"/>
                     <br/>
                     When I was building my computer, i found this site super helpful. May be a good way for us to share our builds.
                     <br/>
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                     Current:
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://pcpartpicker.com/list/4Z9Rr7" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      PCPartPicker
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                      CPU:
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                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://pcpartpicker.com/product/r8W9TW/intel-cpu-bx80646i54690" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Intel - Core i5-4690 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor
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                      Motherboard:
                     </b>
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://pcpartpicker.com/product/mhn2FT/asrock-motherboard-h97mpro4" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      ASRock - H97M PRO4 Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard
                     </a>
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                      Memory:
                     </b>
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://pcpartpicker.com/product/XVV48d/gskill-memory-f310600cl9d16gbnt" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      G.Skill - Value Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3-1333 Memory
                     </a>
                     <br/>
                     <b>
                      Storage:
                     </b>
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://pcpartpicker.com/product/kn3RsY/samsung-internal-hard-drive-mz7te250bwbomdup" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Samsung - 840 EVO 250GB 2.5" Solid State Drive
                     </a>
                     <br/>
                     <b>
                      Video Card:
                     </b>
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://pcpartpicker.com/product/6Y3RsY/msi-video-card-n760tf2gd5oc" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      MSI - GeForce GTX 760 2GB TWIN FROZR Video Card
                     </a>
                     <br/>
                     <b>
                      Case:
                     </b>
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://pcpartpicker.com/product/FbKhP6/corsair-case-cc9011081ww" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Corsair - Carbide 400C ATX Mid Tower Case
                     </a>
                     <br/>
                     <b>
                      Power Supply:
                     </b>
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://pcpartpicker.com/product/MfJwrH/evga-power-supply-220g20750xr" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      EVGA - SuperNOVA G2 750W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply
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                         Case:
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                         Corsair - Carbide 400C ATX Mid Tower Case
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                     Why do you prefer (all) Mid Towers? I think big towers have more air to breathe or not?
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                        I use Daz3D 4.9, rendering with one "Titan X" (12GB non-pascal) video-card. {I have a LOT of large scenes and Daz is rather bloated with crap, when it comes time to render. Most 12GB scenes actually get reduced to about 4-8GB in the video-card, but if Daz thinks 12GB won't fit, it will simply fallback to CPU rendering, never even trying the GPU. Unless you setup a render-batch.}
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                     OK someone else covered the issue before if you have that 'dual GPU' Titan with two blocks of memory, i.e. that it has 6 GB per core, not 12 GB for all.  Just reiterating that Daz Studio needs to load the entire scene into the memory for each GPU, so the memory doesn't stack.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     This obviously applies to multiple cards as well, with the card with the smallest amount of VRAM, etc. limiting the size of the scene that can be rendered with multiple GPUs.  You'll still get the performance boost though, which is still rather helpful.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Anyways, the reason I'm replying is to note that (for those using Windows), Windows will reserve a portion of your GPU memory for it's own uses.  This has been an ongoing issue as it seems to be a percentage of total GPU memory, not a set amount.  This means that for GPUs with larger amounts of VRAM, etc. you'll lose as much as 2 GB or more of that to Windows.
                     <br/>
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/120541/windows-10-reserving-vram-update-gtx-1080-ti/p1" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Windows 10 reserving VRAM - update GTX 1080 Ti
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                     People have been requesting a 'fix' for this for a couple of years now, but Microsoft hasn't provided one as of yet...
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                        OK someone else covered the issue before if you have that 'dual GPU' Titan with two blocks of memory, i.e. that it has 6 GB per core, not 12 GB for all.  Just reiterating that Daz Studio needs to load the entire scene into the memory for each GPU, so the memory doesn't stack.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        This obviously applies to multiple cards as well, with the card with the smallest amount of VRAM, etc. limiting the size of the scene that can be rendered with multiple GPUs.  You'll still get the performance boost though, which is still rather helpful.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        Anyways, the reason I'm replying is to note that (for those using Windows), Windows will reserve a portion of your GPU memory for it's own uses.  This has been an ongoing issue as it seems to be a percentage of total GPU memory, not a set amount.  This means that for GPUs with larger amounts of VRAM, etc. you'll lose as much as 2 GB or more of that to Windows.
                        <br/>
                        <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/120541/windows-10-reserving-vram-update-gtx-1080-ti/p1" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                         Windows 10 reserving VRAM - update GTX 1080 Ti
                        </a>
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        People have been requesting a 'fix' for this for a couple of years now, but Microsoft hasn't provided one as of yet...
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                     Another reason not to upgrade to Windows 10? I'll just keep slumming along with Windows 7...
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="OhWee · Oct 10, 2017 at 4:40 AM" data-lb-id="post-239710">
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                     Gotta luv how Microsoft's support team likes to duck the Windows 10+Nvidia VRAM issue...
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                      Windows 10 and VRam on Nvidia GTX cards
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                     Another thread (from another site) on the issue.  Several people talk about going back to 8.1 or 7...
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                     <a class="link link--external" href="http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=47&amp;t=1442985" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Windows 10 Loses 20% of VRAM | shoqman | CGSociety Forums
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                     It amazes me that Microsoft and/or Nvidia have let this issue linger since 2015...
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                     If you care about such things, this MIGHT be a good excuse to go Linux...
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                     As for Daz Studio it appears that the Linux 32 bit port works pretty well, but the 64 bit version is hit or miss...
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                     Thank you all here lightening up my darkness a little bit.
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                     As you maybe read I'm going to built a new machine. (OK I asked a colleague for help today.)
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                     What do you prefer 32 or 64 bit? Someone wrote 64 bit systems need more RAM and so I'm undecided again. :closedeyesmile:
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                        Max Headroom said:
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                        ...What do you prefer 32 or 64 bit? Someone wrote 64 bit systems need more RAM and so I'm undecided again. :closedeyesmile:
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                     Software written for 64 bits OSs (no matter what OS) takes up a little bit more storage space in general, and may take some more RAM when processed. But with normal desktop OSs only the 64 bits variants can use
                     <i>
                      more
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                     than 4 gbs of RAM satisfactorily (goes esp. for Windows). 32 bits server and workstation hardware
                     <i>
                      and
                     </i>
                     their OSs did not have that kind of difficulty.
                     <br/>
                     And storage space should not pose a problem either, given you can add tbs big HDDs or fast SSDs to your desktop, even external drives (think of backups, too).
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Go for 64 bits OS, apps you can still use as 32 bits version as long as they are stable and do the job. Also 16 gbs of RAM for a render 'workstation' (read: performant PC) is quite alright, will be supported by modern desktop OSs (OhWee mentioned Linux above).
                     <br/>
                     DAZ Studio for Linux 32 bits seems an example that you
                     <i>
                      sometimes
                     </i>
                     can / should / must choose 32 bits variants, if better working / more stable than 64 bits pendants. Godspeed Max.
                     <img alt=":)" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite667" data-shortname=":)" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Smile    :)"/>
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                     which Linux distribution may you recommend, in case you are using it?
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                    My fav unfinished games:  Summertime Saga, Photo Hunt, Love&amp;Sex: Second Base
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                        What do you prefer 32 or 64 bit? Someone wrote 64 bit systems need more RAM and so I'm undecided again. :closedeyesmile:
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                     I agree with the others... 64-bit, because it can use more than 4GB system-RAM. (All the rest would have to be done in swap-file virtual-memory.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Ignore the fact that 64-bit consumes more "space". Going to a 16GB system should be your first priority. 16GB of RAM is like $30 now. (You can live with 8GB, if you are in a pinch. Anything over 4GB is all you will "want".)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     SSD's help a LOT for loading scenes and loading the rendering buffers. However, my Daz3D object library is currently at around 3TB, and another 2TB for other stuff that is 3D related. (Backdrops, generic materials, project-renders...) Just get a reliable 4TB or 2TB drive that you can later expand.
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                     Another fun use for extra ram...
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                      AMD Radeon RAMDisk
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                     <br/>
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                     There are other ramdisk products as well, that's the one that came up in my google search.  Short form is that ramdisks are still waaaay faster than SSD's once their image loads, so they can be useful for a few things.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     The 4 GB version of Radeon Ramdisk is a free download (larger versions are in the $10-20 range), and I'm sure the other products out there come in varying sizes.
                     <br/>
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                     One of the things they talk about about in the Newegg TV video r.e. Radeon Ramdisk (just after the 17:30 mark) the  is giving each of your AAA game titles it's own ramdisk image, then pointing the ramdisk utility at whichever image relates to the game you are about to play.  If you have a game with a lot of transitional loads, ramdisks can make these a much smoother (and faster) experience.  Of course, you need to have the additional ram on hand in the first place...
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                     The other thing they talk about in another video is striping your ramdisk with an SSD or HDD to increase performance.  While an intriguing idea, I'm not sure I'd be comfortable with that.  The idea of having a more secure web browsing experience by putting stuff in volatile memory may be of interest to a few of you here, as long as you have your urls and such memorized...
                     <br/>
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                     ...
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                     I've used the 'temporary internet files cache on a ramdisk' thing before on a previous system - it does dramatically increase response times for slower websites that you visit regularly.  The RamDisk still needs to image these to another drive as a backup though to be truly useful in this regard.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I'm trying to wrap my brain around how a ramdisk might help with Daz Studio.  They do talk about productivity/content creation as something you can use a ramdisk for, but I'd be worried about making sure the drive paths are addressed correctly in that case...
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                     I didn't want a huge case. Plus, with all the open air spots and fans for intake/outake, my system is cool. I don't ever hear my fans go super speed to cool it down.
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                     So far so good I'm configuring my new machine and decided to use a GTX 1080 but wich brand? Any suggestions because there are so many different types. I thought about AMD or MSI they were good brands in the past but then there're still a lot models to choose.
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                        ...decided to use a GTX 1080 but wich brand? Any suggestions because there are so many different types.
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                     yw.
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                          Slant - 16 best GTX 1080 cards as of 2017
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                          GTX 1080 Brand? - [Solved] - Graphics Cards - Tom's Hardware
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                         (also check links at bottom)
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                     ... don't have any comparison with rendering jobs and such though.
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                     I use RAM-Drive for my internet browser-cache, my ONE game I play (whichever is the current speed-hog), and for my art-program's temp-memory. (It uses horrible UNDO storage on the slow HD otherwise.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     For Daz, I can't imagine any real gains. Unless you have a small library of objects. However, that would only speed-up how long it takes Daz to load the scene, a little. Daz has a huge database overload and horrible pre-processing, which is the time-killer.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     For rendering, it would not speed it up at all. Daz spoon-feeds images to the video-card. If it simply told the video-card where the image was, on the drive, and then let the card load it... Then we would see gains. However, Daz reads the images from RAM/Swap, once loaded. Then, when you hit render, they go through a "limits and quality" redraw. After that, Daz feeds one image at a time to the video-card, waiting for it to reply with an "Okay, it fit", before feeding it another one. (It also checks remaining space, because nVidia reformats the image into something it can use. Similar to a bitmap. Since PNG and JPG are not formats actually used internally, as they need to be formulated to create an image, and that is too slow for multiple-pass layered rendering of shaders.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     P.S. There is a trick to rendering scenes faster in Daz too...
                     <br/>
                     1: Render something once, and cancel it... BUT... Leave the rendered image up.
                     <br/>
                     2: Make your changes to the scene, as desired...
                     <br/>
                     3: Render again... (The scene is already loaded in the video-card still. I should just start rendering with the new settings.)
                     <br/>
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                     Not sure if that works when you add things to a scene. (May just push the new items, or it may decide to reload the whole thing again.) However, keeping that first rendered item up, keeps the things in memory. It assumes you will be rendering it again, with changes... Like an animation or just another "tweak". Unless you close that render window, then it assumes you are just "done", and it unloads the card memory for whatever "new" thing you are about to feed it.
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                        So far so good I'm configuring my new machine and decided to use a GTX 1080 but wich brand?
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                     I would suggest looking at actual benchmark scores for GPUmark, CUDA related... As well as user reviews of "troubles" with various brands.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Honestly, a potato is a potato, unless it is sliced into strips, sheets, shreaded or diced into small blocks... Just don't forget to add salt and ketchup.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Seriously though, the only variations are the RAM-types/speed, clock-speeds, and cooling styles.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Don't overclock, it doesn't have any real gains. (Sort-of critical for FPS games)
                     <br/>
                     RAM-type/speed is marginally significant, for renders. (Critical for FPS games)
                     <br/>
                     Cooling styles are not real important for Cuda-Rendering. (All are sufficient. Noise will be your only issue. Blowers are noisy and hard to clean. Free-air blades are quiet and tend to get less dirty. They have lower static pressure and usually have wider surface cooling area. However, they overheat your computer-case internals, due to poor venting.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     As for the rest... They all have to follow the nVidia specs to run. Most are made in the same exact place and just re-branded. The only things they can actually change is the quality of other components, and mountings. Paying 50% more for components that are 10% better than specifications, which will outlive the GPU itself, is not worth the added cost, when it moves the same amount of dirt at the end of the day, and what will kill the card is natural chip degradation after running for x-hours, at constant load.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Also, looks of the card and colorful packages should not be counted... or marketing...
                     <img alt=":p" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite673" data-shortname=":p" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Stick out tongue    :p"/>
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     At the end of the day, it is all about the numbers... The numbers of the output, in relation to the cost of the card.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Life-span: Running 100%, my "coin miners", running for three solid years, 24/7, never died or degraded with any noticeable "benchmarked decay", or "visual decay". They were various brands, but each, even among the same brand, all ran at unique speeds and with unique limits. All were overclocked to the maximum and ran at full heat-throttle. (MSI, ZOTAC, ASUS, EVGA, and GIGABYTE) * I mined various alt-coins, not actual bitcoins. I had 1.6 Terahash miners for bitcoins.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Now I don't have a use for my 1600-Watt PSU's... Sold all the cards.
                     <img alt=":p" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite673" data-shortname=":p" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Stick out tongue    :p"/>
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                     OK, so I tried something with Daz Studio.  I assigned the temporary files, DSON Cache Files, and CMS Cluster Directory (Edit&gt;Preferences) to a Ramdisk.  It seems to be helping, but I'm not quite sure.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     What I think I'm seeing is faster browsing through the library/content/product folders, and I think that my project files are loading a bit faster (the .duf files are still on my ssd, but perhaps it's finding the location of the various parts a bit faster).  Essentially the 'scene' seems to be appearing in the viewport a bit more immediately once it is fully loaded, but that may just be my imagination.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     The CMS Directory for my install was 1.27 GB, the two other directories were much smaller.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Anyways, if you are bored, might be worth a look.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Also, IMDisk is available for free via sourceforge, and supposedly doesn't cap the ramdisk size.
                     <br/>
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://sourceforge.net/projects/imdisk-toolkit/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      ImDisk Toolkit
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                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I'm working with the Radeon Ramdisk 4 GB at the moment, so I haven't played with IMDisk as of yet.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Something else that I
                     <i>
                      finally
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                     did was to 'map out' the My Library folder into categories.  This sorts the My Library folder items similar to how the default folder is sorted under Categories, under it's own heading, to make the stuff that you load into My Library (as opposed to My Daz 3D Library) easier to find.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     This is actually pretty easy to do if you haven't done it already.
                     <br/>
                     Right Click on the My Library Folder,
                     <br/>
                     then choose Create Category from &gt; Selected Folder and Subfolders.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     It'll take a few minutes to do the sort, and Daz may seem to freeze while it's doing this, but once it's done, voila!
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                     and all others. I'm very thankful for your tips and maybe you read that I'm out of that business for over 10 years. I'm like a newborn calf at the moment and have to learn a lot. I'm just overwelmed with this mass of information and opportunities.
                     <br/>
                     I looked at the links of
                     <a class="username" data-user-id="7949" data-username="@Cirro84" data-xf-init="member-tooltip" href="https://f95zone.to/members/7949/">
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                     and most time it looks like Chinese for me.
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                     I think it will take days or weeks to decide which card, than the MB, GPU and all other stuff... x'D
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="bacchusplateau · Oct 11, 2017 at 11:51 AM" data-lb-id="post-241992">
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                        and all others. I'm very thankful for your tips and maybe you read that I'm out of that business for over 10 years. I'm like a newborn calf at the moment and have to learn a lot. I'm just overwelmed with this mass of information and opportunities.
                        <br/>
                        I looked at the links of
                        <a class="username" data-user-id="7949" data-username="@Cirro84" data-xf-init="member-tooltip" href="https://f95zone.to/members/7949/">
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                        and most time it looks like Chinese for me.
                        <img alt=":D" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite674" data-shortname=":D" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Big grin    :D"/>
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                        I think it will take days or weeks to decide which card, than the MB, GPU and all other stuff... x'D
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                     Been out of the loop for 10years+?
                     <br/>
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                     Your avatar and name says it all my friend. I'm sure you were around when phones were screwed onto the wall and you can only go as far as the cord would let you.
                     <img alt=";)" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite668" data-shortname=";)" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Wink    ;)"/>
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                     Prove the world wrong and teach this old dog some new tricks!
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                        I'm sure you were around when phones were screwed onto the wall and you can only go as far as the cord would let you.
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                     No phone... drums!:closedeyesmile:
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                     but your avatar is much older. What should I think about you?
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                     Yes I bought my current running computer about 10 years ago and with that I stopped to deal with that matter. So my knowledge is slightly "out of date". :closedeyesmile:
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                     Just google "CUDA cores", and the top (reasonably-affordable), video-cards you are thinking about...
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                     1: That is the bottom line, for speed {With iRay}. (Every second counts, when seconds turn into hours/days/weeks.)
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                     2: RAM is only the bottom-line for scene-complexity. (There are ways to make scenes less top-heavy and in a pinch, you can render things individually. Thus, the primary importance of #1)
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                     So I switched over to IMDisk, and am currently running with an 8 GB drive.  Seems to be going well so far.
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                     As I said in my previous post, I switched the Daz Studio caches over to the ramdisk.  I think it's helping more than a bit with product browsing response times.  And of course my internet temp files are now on the ramdisk.
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                        OhWee said:
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                        So I switched over to IMDisk, and ...
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                     Have you tried moving the actual database itself?
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                        NoesisAndNoema said:
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                        Have you tried moving the actual database itself?
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                     I assigned the temporary files, DSON Cache Files, and CMS Cluster Directory (Edit&gt;Preferences) to a Ramdisk.
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                     Those are the only ones I saw in the Preferences section.
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                     I'm still struggling with the graphic card:
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                     sure a 1080 but TI or not? Is the TI the higher price worth (~350 bucks) ?
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                        I'm still struggling with the graphic card:
                        <br/>
                        sure a 1080 but TI or not? Is the TI the higher price worth (~350 bucks) ?
                        <br/>
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                        Has somebody both in direct competition?
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                     Jumping from a 1080 to a 1080 Ti, yes.  The increase in performance is significant, and you'll get the extra VRAM too.  Looks like they are starting around $750 on Newegg, and I spotted this liquid/air hybrid (liquid cooling for the GPU, air cooling for the vram) for $799
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814137126&amp;cm_re=gtx_1080_ti-_-14-137-126-_-Product" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      MSI GeForce GTX 1080 Ti DirectX 12 GTX 1080 Ti SEA HAWK X 11GB 352-Bit GDDR5X PCI Express 3.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card - Newegg.com
                     </a>
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     You probably don't want to overclock, since rendering tends to punish GPUs.  Keep that in mind when picking the card (i.e. you might not want to pay extra for an overclocked version).
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     The 1080's aren't too shabby, but if you are serious about doing this rendering thing, might as well get the better card now.  The Titan Xp's are another story - almost double the price for only single digit gains in performance is probably not worth it...
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                     Does anyone knew the new minimal specs for the new dForce Simulation of DAZ 4.10?
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                        Techn0magier said:
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                        ... new minimal specs for the dForce Simulation of DAZ 4.10?
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                     According to links:
                     <br/>
                     <i>
                      ...at least
                     </i>
                     a 'Fermi' GPU (GeForce 400/500) is necessary, or newer chips ('Kepler', GeForce 600-800), plus newer / newest drivers (if possible).
                     <br/>
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                         <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/203076/daz-studio-pro-beta-version-4-10-0-101-updated" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                          Daz Studio Pro BETA - version 4.10.0.107! (*UPDATED*)
                         </a>
                         <br/>
                         <a class="link link--external" href="http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/dazstudio/4/change_log" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                          Change Log [Documentation Center]
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                     <br/>
                     The rest should still be 'common specs' for DAZ:
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                         <b>
                          <span style="font-size: 15px">
                           SYSTEM REQUIREMENTS
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                         <br/>
                         <span style="font-size: 15px">
                          <b>
                           WINDOWS®
                          </b>
                         </span>
                         <br/>
                         <b>
                          <span style="font-size: 12px">
                           32 bit
                          </span>
                         </b>
                         <br/>
                         <ul>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           Intel Dual Core
                           <i>
                            (or equivalent) or greater
                           </i>
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           1.6 GHz
                           <i>
                            (2 GHz dual core or faster recommended)
                           </i>
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           Windows 8, 7, &amp; Vista,
                           <i>
                            (Windows 8 or 7 is recommended)
                           </i>
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           1 GB RAM min
                           <i>
                            (2GB+ recommended)
                           </i>
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           1GB free hard drive space for installation
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           OpenGL 1.6 compatible graphics card with at least 128 MB RAM
                           <i>
                            (Hardware accelerated OpenGL 2.2, or higher, compatible recommended with 512MB RAM)
                           </i>
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           DirectX 9
                           <i>
                            (used for audio processing only)
                           </i>
                          </li>
                         </ul>
                         <span style="font-size: 12px">
                          <b>
                           64 bit
                          </b>
                         </span>
                         <br/>
                         <ul>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           WHQL-64 certified
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           Intel Xeon/Core 2 Duo or Quad /Core i7 or AMD Opteron/Phenom processor(s)
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                           Windows 8, 7 &amp; Vista
                           <i>
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                           2 GB RAM min
                           <i>
                            (3GB+ RAM recommended)
                           </i>
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           1GB free hard drive space
                           <i>
                            for installation
                           </i>
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           Hardware accelerated OpenGL 1.6 compatible graphics card with at least 512 MB RAM
                           <i>
                            (OpenGL 2.2, or higher, compatible recommended)
                           </i>
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           DirectX 9
                           <i>
                            (used for audio processing only)
                           </i>
                          </li>
                         </ul>
                         Notes:
                         <br/>
                         NVIDIA Iray Render Engine: 64-bit only.
                         <br/>
                         NVIDIA video card with 4GB+ VRAM recommended.
                         <br/>
                         CUDA Compute Capability 2.0 or greater required.
                         <br/>
                         <br/>
                         <span style="font-size: 15px">
                          <b>
                           MAC®
                          </b>
                         </span>
                         <br/>
                         <span style="font-size: 12px">
                          <b>
                           32 bit
                          </b>
                         </span>
                         <br/>
                         <ul>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           Intel Macintosh®
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           1.6 GHz min
                           <i>
                            (1.8 GHz or faster recommended)
                           </i>
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           Mac™ OS X 10.6 or above
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           1 GB RAM min
                           <i>
                            (2GB recommended)
                           </i>
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           1GB free hard drive space for installation
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           OpenGL 1.6 compatible graphics card with at least 128 MB RAM
                           <i>
                            (Hardware accelerated OpenGL 2.2, or higher, compatible recommended with 256MB+ RAM)
                           </i>
                          </li>
                         </ul>
                         <span style="font-size: 12px">
                          <b>
                           64 bit
                          </b>
                         </span>
                         <br/>
                         <ul>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           Intel Macintosh®
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           2.00 GHz Core 2 Duo
                           <i>
                            (2.4 GHz or faster recommended)
                           </i>
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           Mac™ OS X 10.7 or above
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           2 GB RAM min
                           <i>
                            (3GB+ recommended)
                           </i>
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           1GB free hard drive space
                           <i>
                            for installation
                           </i>
                          </li>
                          <li data-xf-list-type="ul">
                           OpenGL 1.6 compatible graphics card with at least 128 MB RAM
                           <i>
                            (Hardware accelerated OpenGL 2.2, or higher, compatible recommended with 256MB+ RAM)
                           </i>
                          </li>
                         </ul>
                         Notes:
                         <br/>
                         Daz Studio will not function installed on a UNIX partition under Mac OS X.
                         <br/>
                         NVIDIA Iray Render Engine: 64-bit only.
                         <br/>
                         NVIDIA video card with 4GB+ VRAM recommended.
                         <br/>
                         CUDA Compute Capability 2.0 or greater required.
                         <br/>
                         <br/>
                         Source:
                         <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.daz3d.com/daz_studio" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                          DAZ Studio | 3D Models and 3D Software by Daz 3D
                         </a>
                        </div>
                       </div>
                      </div>
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                          ...see my
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                     sweet thank you
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                    My fav unfinished games:  Summertime Saga, Photo Hunt, Love&amp;Sex: Second Base
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                    My fav finished games: Man of the House, Soldiers Live, Sisterly Lust, MIST
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                    <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2picMQC-9E" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
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                     When it comes to card selection... I went back to the Daz3D forums for the benchmarks.
                     <br/>
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/53771/iray-starter-scene-post-your-benchmarks/p1" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      Iray Starter Scene: Post Your Benchmarks!
                     </a>
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     1080 TI is just a fraction faster than Titan-X Maxwell. Faster times were only seen with crazy CPU core speeds and core-counts. (Some people had 6, 8, 12, 20 and 44 core consumer/server CPU's for benchmark tests.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     My simple 4-core (8-thread), CPU renders the scene in 5 minutes 6.73 seconds.
                     <br/>
                     While my Titan-X Maxwell, renders it in 2 minutes 49.69 seconds. (Without OCing my card.) 1 minutes 25.2 seconds, when pushed to thermal-max.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     However, in real scenes, my card is about 5x to 12x faster than my CPU for render-times. (Not that half-assed benchmark demo of old Daz3D crap and shaders that no-one actually uses anymore.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Titan-X Pascal was actually slower then both of those, at around the same speed as a 1070 or a 1080 GTX.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Ultimately, the 1080 TI gains speed only from the higher clock-rates, few more cuda-cores and higher voltage settings, over Titan-X. I could push my Titan-X to the same exact render-times, with a simple tweak with overclocking. However, by default and design, the 1080 TI also consumes about 30-50 more watts, per render, with only a 2% gain in speed. (That is 210watts for Titan-X Maxwell and 240-260watts when rendering with a 1080 TI. Measured at the wall, not after the CPU converts it to 12v.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Also, Titan-X Maxwell with 12GB of VRAM can be found for $500, while 1080 TI cards are still around $800 and have only 11GB of VRAM.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Rendering 1000+ HD images, that translates into paying 20-35% more for your electric bill, which will hit $300+ a month, just for rendering. So, both long-term and on initial purchase, including operating hardware to run the cards in volume... Titan-X Maxwell is still the better all-around choice. Until they actually make a new format which runs with the same cuda-cores and less power consumption, for a reasonable price.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     People seem to forget, or ignore that a 1200 watt PSU, operating at capacity, actually pulls around 1400 watts at the wall. Running batches of renders, especially for video, will sustain a constant load. Not to mention the fact that your home AC must now remove 1400 watts of heat from the air. That is 1.4 KWh + whatever it costs your AC to run, 4.4 KWh to remove the 1400 Watts of generated heat, plus your body heat and the days heat. (That is actually a savings in winter. Sort-of... Like running a 1400 Watt electric heater.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Coming from a bitcoin mining background, I am ALL TOO FAMILIAR with this. I actually moved all my computers outside, where it is more humid. Though it was 98F (37C), it was a constant 98F, which computers don't mind. Plus, since computers can't "perspire", to lose heat, the moisture helps maintain a constant manageable temperature. The humidity in the air will not condense on hot components. It also helps to absorb the heat-radiation, and remove it from the cooling-fins, better than cold dry air does. No water-cooling was ever needed, running 8x Radeon 7970's, overclocked and running 24/7 in the summer heat in Florida.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     With all of that said, I figured that I would re-post my current planned builds for a personal "render farm" computer. (This can be done a LOT cheaper, for just a remote render farm. Less RAM, cheaper CPU's, cheaper motherboards, ghetto cases, minimal hard-drive space... But, I need to use this computer as a full computer too, for setting-up renders. Thus, it is multi-purpose, render and creation.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     -------------------------------------------
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     <b>
                      <span style="font-size: 22px">
                       <span style="color: #ffff4d">
                        Computer #1 (THE WET DREAM MACHINE)
                       </span>
                      </span>
                     </b>
                     <br/>
                     - [$130] RAIJINTEK ASTERION SILVER CLASSIC, an Alu. E-ATX case
                     <br/>
                     - - * {Because this is one of the cheapest and tested cases which fits the E-ATX motherboard and 4x video-cards.}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - [$160] 1600 watt PSU
                     <br/>
                     - - * {Needs 12v for at-least (4x 6-pin), (5x 8-pin), (1x 4-pin), and (1x 4-pin-flat-connector/adapter)}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - [$410] MSI "X299 XPOWER GAMING AC" motherboard
                     <br/>
                     - - * {Needs a CPU with 44 lanes to get PCIe x8/x8/x16/x8, for 4x "Titan-X Maxwells" to run.}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - [$2090] Intel Core i9-7980XE Skylake-X 18-Core 36-Threads
                     <br/>
                     - - * {This has the 44 lanes required for running 4x Titan-X.}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - [$150] CPU liquid-cooler, 3x 120mm fans, 360mm x 120mm radiator.
                     <br/>
                     - - * {Because a liquid-cooler is a requirement for these i9 2066 CPU's}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - [$660] Crucial Technology Ballistix Tactical 64GB (4x 16GB) 3000 MT/S DDR4 SDRAM (PC4-24000)
                     <br/>
                     - - * {Because, why the fuck not!}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - [$2000] 4x Titan-X Maxwells, 12GB each of unified GDDR5 VRAM, non-SLI mode
                     <br/>
                     - - * {For a crazy total of 12288 Cuda-Cores, for rendering. Nothing-else matters but the core-count and VRAM.}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - [$440] Samsung SSD 960 EVO NVMe M.2 1TB
                     <br/>
                     - - * {This is for the greater majority of my 3D content, which I use frequently, and the OS.}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - [$150] 4TB HDD {No specific desired brand. Anything reliable.}
                     <br/>
                     - - * {This is for the archives of additional graphics and 3D content, use a lot less frequently, and swap-files.}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     <span style="color: #ff4d4d">
                      <b>
                       <u>
                        TOTAL DAMAGE: $6190 USD
                       </u>
                      </b>
                     </span>
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     -------------------------------------------
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     <b>
                      <span style="font-size: 22px">
                       <span style="color: #ffff00">
                        Computer #2 (THE DAY DREAM MACHINE)
                       </span>
                      </span>
                     </b>
                     <br/>
                     - [$100] Thermaltake Suppressor F51 Power Cover Edition E-ATX Mid Tower
                     <br/>
                     - - * {Because this is the cheapest and tested cases which fits the E-ATX motherboard and 4x video-cards.}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - [$160] 1600 watt PSU
                     <br/>
                     - - * {Needs 12v for at-least (4x 6-pin), (5x 8-pin), (1x 4-pin), and (1x 4-pin-flat-connector/adapter)}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - [$200] MSI "X99A-GODLIKE-GAMING" motherboard
                     <br/>
                     - - * {Needs a CPU with 40 lanes to get PCIe x8/x8/x0/x16/x8, for 4x "Titan-X Maxwells" to run.}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - [$435] Intel Core i7-6850K Broadwell-E 6-Core 12-Threads
                     <br/>
                     - - * {This has the 40 lanes required for running 4x Titan-X.}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - [$110] CPU liquid-cooler, 2x 120mm fans, 240mm x 120mm radiator.
                     <br/>
                     - - * {A liquid-cooler is slight luxury here.}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - [$330] Crucial Technology Ballistix Tactical 32GB (2x 16GB) 3000 MT/S DDR4 SDRAM (PC4-24000)
                     <br/>
                     - - * {Because, why the fuck not!}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - [$2000] 4x Titan-X Maxwells, 12GB each of unified GDDR5 VRAM, non-SLI mode
                     <br/>
                     - - * {For a crazy total of 12288 Cuda-Cores, for rendering. Nothing-else matters but the core-count and VRAM.}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     - [$150] 4TB HDD {No specific desired brand. Anything reliable.}
                     <br/>
                     - - * {This is for the archives of additional graphics and 3D content, use a lot less frequently, and swap-files.}
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     <u>
                      <b>
                       <span style="color: #ff4d4d">
                        TOTAL DAMAGE: $3485 USD
                       </span>
                      </b>
                     </u>
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Honestly, I am not even sure if having 8x PCIe lanes is an actual requirement for rendering. The specs usually dictate "gaming minimums" for "running in SLI", as being some kind of actual minimum requirement. I know all cards can "run" with only 1x lanes. I know, because I ran all eight of my Radeon 7970oc cards on just a 1x PCIe extender and this crappy "i7 4790", for my bitcoin miners. (This CPU only has 16 lanes.) However, I wasn't pushing 12GB of images into each card. I know that 16x is overkill, because the 8x lanes never even get "saturated", (used completely, filled with actual data being transferred).
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Better to have them all available, just in-case!
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                        When it comes to card selection... I went back to the Daz3D forums for the benchmarks. ...
                        <br/>
                        Honestly, I am not even sure if
                        <b>
                         having 8x PCIe lanes
                        </b>
                        is an actual requirement for rendering. The specs usually dictate "gaming minimums" for "running in SLI", as being some kind of actual minimum requirement. ... I know, because I ran all eight of my Radeon 7970oc cards on just a 1x PCIe extender and this crappy "i7 4790", for my bitcoin miners. ...
                        <br/>
                        I know that 16x is overkill, because the 8x lanes never even get "saturated", (used completely, filled with actual data being transferred). Better to have them all available, just in-case!
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                     Oh, coin mining you did. I see where you come from. Suffered much?? XD
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Exactly, more than 8 lanes per card really are not necessary, with such bundles you should be fine. Better use a bundle for fast M.2 SSDs I'd say. The system needs to update progress too, and transfer data from / to the cards (which is done with processing support from CPU). It's most important to 'feed' the cards well I guess. Each 8x PCIe 3.x lane bundle gives aggregated speeds of about 7.88 gt/s (8 bits at once, for 0.985 gb/s per lane) in theory, should suffice for even top tier cards.
                     <br/>
                     As matter of fact, connections through 'chipset'/'controller hub' are of roughly the same bandwidth - Intel's
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Intel_chipsets#LGA_1151" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      <b>
                       DMI 3.0
                      </b>
                     </a>
                     , with ca. 7.86 gt/s link speed in total (in theory, throughput for
                     <i>
                      both
                     </i>
                     directions), aggregated speed of about 3.93 gb/s for one transfer on
                     <i>
                      four lanes
                     </i>
                     . Not that unusual, given the link connects between CPU and chipset logic derive from techniques first introduced with PCIe, from 2004 onwards iirc. Half an eternity. Chipsets for Intel P4/EE/Core Duo/Quad (socket LGA 775) and Athlon 64/X2/FX boards (socket 939, 754) featured those new PCIe connects back then...
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Also you should mention what you plan to avoid noise. More than 2 cards plus a performant CPU cause an amount of heat and noise nobody should underestimate, you as a miner pretty much know about these difficulties I guess? How will you handle that problem??
                     <br/>
                     Heat is one thing, you perhaps can't escape it. But I personally cannot imagine 3 or 4 video cards working together with a 100+ watts min 8-core CPU without me going up the wall after a while, no matter how 'quiet' I can build a system. If the components would all go full force on renders I'd probably want to settle down next door? A bit of space all around is a must, and I can't place the workstation somewhere enclosed. :/
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                        Oh, coin mining you did. I see where you come from. Suffered much?? XD
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                     I have made several thousands of dollars... Didn't suffer a bit. I lucked-out and spent most of it before the "Gox crash/theft".
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     My first set of bitcoin miners was 4x Radeon 7970 OC edition "reference-cooler" style cards. (Mini dust-busters.) They ran overclocked to the maximum that they could handle. The damn thing sounded like a super dust-buster, on steroids.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Then, I managed to get 4x more of those same cards with the raised super-coolers. (Two silent fans with tuned air-flow blades, blowing across a quad-piped, dual-surface heat-exchanger. They ran soooo much quieter!)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I will have no such luck with the Titans... They are all built with reference design, or water-cooling blocks. Later, I may get the water-coolers. However, rendering full-force, the fans only kick-up to half-speed, even with my high-tuned fan profile. I set the fans set to a more realistic curve, for rendering. They turn on faster and remain on longer.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     You are right, I am thinking about how to dampen the sound, in my design.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I want to build the custom case inside a window-mount AC-unit. (Gutted of the AC components.) For the noise reason, as well as for the heat reasons. 2000 watts is a lot of heat to try to remove with any home AC unit, when running for a long time.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I ran my miner in the garage, for the winter. It helped to lower our heating/electric bill, a little... (Pre-heating the hot-water lines and tank. Pre-heating the air for the dryer intake. Keeping the garage-walls and attic air warm and dry against the house. Etc...)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     For the summer, it sat out on my back porch, behind a hard-wood bar. It enjoyed the humidity, which helped the cards disperse heat better. The cards and the motherboards. (The units were open-air design, built in milk-crates.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     When it comes to the bus-lanes... I honestly only "need" 8x, only for real-time updates in Daz3D... Like this video, but faster! (Keep in mind, he is rendering, live, while recording HD video-captures.)
                     <br/>
                     <span data-s9e-mediaembed="youtube">
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                       <iframe allowfullscreen="" data-s9e-mediaembed-src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/RPX5-OQCFZM" scrolling="no" style="background:url(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/RPX5-OQCFZM/hqdefault.jpg) 50% 50% / cover">
                       </iframe>
                      </span>
                     </span>
                     <br/>
                     For comparison, this is 2x Titan-X's...
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                       <iframe allowfullscreen="" data-s9e-mediaembed-src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/5yGKy4hTZKU" scrolling="no" style="background:url(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/5yGKy4hTZKU/hqdefault.jpg) 50% 50% / cover">
                       </iframe>
                      </span>
                     </span>
                     <br/>
                     For 1x Titan-X, I can confirm that it is half as fast as the video above, for instant displays. I used that same model setup. It hangs a LOT after making ahcnges, locking-up the UI and struggling to refresh. It was tolerable, but 4x will surely be more tolerable.
                     <img alt=":p" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite673" data-shortname=":p" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Stick out tongue    :p"/>
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                     Some interesting ideas. You wrote about your garage, well - not all of us have one. You also wrote about 'humidity' and I went 'what?? You kidding?' But it could work as long as it's not a normal shed, and temps get freezing in winter time.
                     <img alt=":p" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite673" data-shortname=":p" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Stick out tongue    :p"/>
                     But going heavy-duty construction work with pre-heating water flows for cooling and stuff, just for my little workstation?? This is a bit too much atm. But I thought about this when I wrote 'did u suffer?', you proved me right. I don't wanna sit on a back porch tbh. XD
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     I found some guides on how to build a more silent gaming rig, thought I'll probably come from that angle, plus add up some card(s) and silent SSDs, and see what happens. A good case doesn't need damping I hope... Guess a big case is a win-win nonetheless, as I will be able to integrate some slowly running cooling fans and still have proper air flows inside around components. HDDs only for backups if necessary, or used with swinging damping solutions so the noise of them turning at high rpms is not carried over to the case itself.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Cool vids, that's actually sth i was looking for, for a comparison of different GPUs. Still not sure if I should go for up to 4 mid-class cards to run concurrently, or better (I guess?) up to 2 top tier cards. Am afraid up to 4 top tier is too much to handle, I don't need that much processing power. I'm not doing the new Cars movie, as they did at Pixar's with Indigo clusters back then iirc.
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                     Wanted to check back in. Got my GPU... holy crap the speed difference. Ended up getting a 1060. The extra 300$ for a 1080...
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                     Saw we are talking hardware for rendering, but didn't see a good thread for render settings.
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                     Besides this one:
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                     Looking for good render settings to match some of the top games as well as some of the great fan art.
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                     I am looking for say, full scene vs character portraits and so on.
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                    <time class="u-dt" data-date-string="Jan 8, 2018" data-time="1515362091" data-time-string="5:54 AM" datetime="2018-01-08T05:54:51+0800" dir="auto" title="Jan 8, 2018 at 5:54 AM">
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="a1fox3 · Jan 8, 2018 at 5:54 AM" data-lb-id="post-412411">
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                        obiwan21 said:
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                        Wanted to check back in. Got my GPU... holy crap the speed difference. Ended up getting a 1060. The extra 300$ for a 1080...
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        Saw we are talking hardware for rendering, but didn't see a good thread for render settings.
                        <br/>
                        Besides this one:
                        <a class="link link--external" href="https://f95zone.com/threads/iray-progressive-render-settings.2946/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                         https://f95zone.com/threads/iray-progressive-render-settings.2946/
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                        <br/>
                        Looking for good render settings to match some of the top games as well as some of the great fan art.
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        I am looking for say, full scene vs character portraits and so on.
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                         Click to expand...
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                     </blockquote>
                     Go here and look for the best looking ones and ask them what settings there using:
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://f95zone.com/threads/big-brother-fan-art.3950/page-200#post-410977" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      https://f95zone.com/threads/big-brother-fan-art.3950/page-200#post-410977
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                     I saw a thread, in the developing area, about "the best hardware for rendering in Daz3D"...
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Over the next few days, while I am wrapping-up my next release, I will be posting the "build" of the "reality machine". (As opposed to the prior posts about the "dream machines".)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Today, these parts arrived...
                     <br/>
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                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     1: ASRock X299 OC Formula Motherboard
                     <br/>
                     - This motherboard holds the "record" for fastest OC with liquid-nitrogen, or some deep cooling solution. The motherboard has all sorts of "super-cooling" hardware and software, special made for deep-cooling and overclocking. Though I am not overclocking, I may take advantage of the switches which allow me to physically turn each PCIe lane on or off, as desired. Thus, when not rendering, I can run in an "Economy mode", by disabling 3 of the four "Titan V" cards.
                     <br/>
                     - Only real reason I got this, is for the 4x double-wide GPUs to be used, without a need for riser-cables. Everything-else is a luxury and will most-likely not even be used.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     2: Intel Core i9-7980xe CPU
                     <br/>
                     - 18 cores/36 threads
                     <br/>
                     - 24.75MB cache (More room for "fast" code, for running programs)
                     <br/>
                     - Independent "clock speeds" for each core (You can use one, or more, at max speeds, without forcing all to be "hot" for no reason.)
                     <br/>
                     - 44 PCIe lanes, with the motherboard above, will give me speeds of 8x/8x/16x/8x for the four PCIe lanes. The rest go to the M.2 and SATA drive connections and various other bonus things.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     3: Corsair H100i V2 Watercooler
                     <br/>
                     - I hate the term "water cooler". It is air-cooled, with a water buffer.
                     <br/>
                     - An air-cooled solution, with or without a steam-pipe/heat-pipe, would have honestly been fine. (This was sort-of a luxury, future-potential, item.)
                     <br/>
                     - More for "steady regulation", while maintaining a quiet cooling of the CPU. It was available, so I got it. The only other decent alternative was a heat-pipe cooler with two fans and a massive heat-sink. I really don't have the space for that giant beast, and I didn't want to piss-out all that heat into the case, where it would heat-up the PSU, GPU, CPU, RAM and other shit, demanding more fans to be installed, to cool the cooler.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     4: Corsair Dominator Platinum, DDR4 2666, 64-GB @ 4x (16GB) RAM
                     <br/>
                     - The max that the CPU can manage, is 128GB. But I am using faster quad-slots. There is only one slot, per lane of memory, for higher potential speeds. There are less "traces" (wires) needed going to the CPU - RAM controller. Thus, this limits RAM to only 64GB max, for this setup.
                     <br/>
                     - Just enough to fill all four slots and max-out the RAM for this motherboard. I may end-up using some of the RAM as a mounted RAM-Drive, but not for now. The potential for overclocking is high, but again, it is not my intention to kill my hardware faster than expected, for small gains.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Parts still pending delivery...
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     A: 4x NVIDIA Titan-V cards
                     <br/>
                     - They are coming in pairs. I had to use two credit-cards to buy them, as there is a 2 card limit. Just my luck, one order was "rejected", since they don't allow preorders or "holds". Because they ran out of stock, after I got my first two ordered. Apparently, I got the last two in stock, in the USA.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     B: Antec High Current Pro, HCP-1300 Platinum, power supply
                     <br/>
                     - This 1300-watt PSU should be suitable for 4 cards, but if not, I will just get a bigger one. My Titan-X card only runs around 150w when it renders, but up to 225w when gaming. The Titan-V has a similar power profile, which can be adjusted if needed.
                     <br/>
                     - That is 1300-watts, continuous power. Peaks and actual testing, show it sustaining well over 1800-watts, at the wall, with 90% going to the devices. I will have no problem sustaining the required load for the running system, to get that 90% efficiency.)
                     <br/>
                     - My 1600 watt PSU only has 6-pin connectors. It is intended to be used as a second/assistive PSU. (This was used to power my 4-TH/s bitcoin miner, which is now a $6000 paperweight.)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     C: Anidees AI-05S-BW, ATX Mid-Tower, Silent PC Case
                     <br/>
                     - Just a decent looking case with 8 slots available for PCIe cards. (Most cases only have enough slots and room for 7 slots. It was kind-of a pain in the ass to find one with 8 slots. Though, I have no problem cutting-up metal to turn a 7-slot into an 8-slot tower.)
                     <br/>
                     - This also has a thin and shallow profile. There is no drive-bays space wasted in front of the tower. Drives go into slot-space in front of the PSU, which is mounted below the motherboard. Keeping the top free for the water-cooler radiator.
                     <br/>
                     - This will only house one normal drive, for the moment...
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     D: SAMSUNG 850 EVO 2.5" 4 TB SATA III 3D NAND SSD
                     <br/>
                     E: SAMSUNG 960 PRO M.2 2TB NVMe PCI-Express 3.0 x4 SSD
                     <br/>
                     - The 4TB SSD, for the 3D shit.
                     <br/>
                     - The M.2 2TB SSD, for the OS and programs and virtual-RAM.
                     <br/>
                     - These are also part of the "save power" concept. When not in use, and when in use, they consume less power than a platter-drive. Leaving more power for the CPU, RAM and GPU to do actual work. Also, they are cooler, by nature, without moving parts and motors.
                     <br/>
                     - The other purpose, which can be argued all day long, is for obvious speed gains. Trust me, SSDs are way faster than HDD, in every way. When working with 3D shit, which is lots of tiny files that are constantly loaded and saved, that speed matters. Not so much, when actually rendering shit, except for virtual-RAM that windows demands for Daz3D to operate. (No, having a swap-file on an SSD is not any kind of real issue anymore. These drives will outlast my lifetime of use. Other shit in them, will die, before any cells become "unavailable to be written to".)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     F: "Kill-A-Watt", power meter.
                     <br/>
                     - My friend never returned my old one, so I am getting a new one. This helps me setup the system, to ensure that the power-supply and all hardware will be... Safe to operate at expected loads, and will not be over-kill, for the PSU to manage. (I have no doubt that it will be able to sustain the high-end load of the PSU's demands for sustaining the 90% efficiency. I just don't want to push that max, or be under that "load".)
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     G: My loft-bed...
                     <br/>
                     - So I can build the system underneath it. To save space in the livingroom, where this beast sits now.
                     <br/>
                     - The bed is lofted, nearly, to the ceiling. With room underneath for the 4K 65" T.V., which I am using as a computer monitor. Also, it will have the tower, a dresser, chair and table underneath. Storage when not being used. (The chair and table pulls-out, holding the wireless mouse/keyboard, for working. So I am not sitting with my face against a giant T.V. while I work, unless I want to, for pixel-inspections.)
                     <br/>
                     - This will require a little "modification" for my use. Needs to be higher and the "table surface" has to be removed. No, I don't need the rails...
                     <img alt=":p" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite673" data-shortname=":p" src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" title="Stick out tongue    :p"/>
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                     H: 200 gallons of liquid nitrogen, and a cryogenic freezer...
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                     <br/>
                     - The bed should fit over the wide span of the window. The T.V. covering the "intake/exhaust" vents for the computer tower, when needed, in the spring/summer/fall.
                     <br/>
                     - For the winter, this bitch is our supplemental "space heater", to offset the AC/HEAT bill. (Hell, if you are going to generate heat, it might as well be heat generated from rendering porn, or actual sex... Still looking for item "I: A female crazy enough to fuck me again"... That is a whole other thread! Hardware, Yes... Software, No... Purchase, Hell-No!)
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                     did anyone have an experience with Razor Blade 15 laptop and Daz studio ?
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                     OK, so the RTX 2080 Ti reviews are out...
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                     There is a noticeable lack of rendering software benchmarks, but I did find this Blender result on hardwareluxx.de
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                     Several people on the Daz3D forum have warned that the last time Nvidia came out with a new architecture, that it was several months before support for the new cards was added to the Daz Iray suite.  And both Nvidia and Daz3D have been rather mum on the issue of Iray support, so who knows if the new cards will work out of the box, or if we get to wait for a bit before Iray support is implemented...
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="Rich · Sep 20, 2018 at 8:26 AM" data-lb-id="post-1113115">
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                        Several people on the Daz3D forum have warned that the last time Nvidia came out with a new architecture, that it was several months before support for the new cards was added to the Daz Iray suite.  And both Nvidia and Daz3D have been rather mum on the issue of Iray support, so who knows if the new cards will work out of the box, or if we get to wait for a bit before Iray support is implemented...
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                     That was definitely the case with the 10x0 series - there was a non-trivial amount of time between when those cards were released and when Daz got updated to support it.  I honestly don't remember if the delay was "card-release-to-iRay-update" or "iRay-update-to-Daz-updated-to-include-it."  (Most likely a bit of both...)
                     <br/>
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                     There are at least two possibilities:
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                       The 20x0 cards won't work until an iRay update is released by NVidia and then integrated by Daz.
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                       The 20x0 cards will work with the existing iRay as-is, but won't take advantage of the new RTX stuff.
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                     And, to be perfectly frank, I have no idea whether the new RTX stuff will actually make any difference to iRay, or whether it will only really benefit "real time ray tracing in games."  It's not out of the realm of possibility that RTX has limitations that are acceptable in the gaming world, but which don't live up to some standard that iRay demands.
                     <br/>
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                     So, we just have to "wait and see," as always.
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                     I suppose we'll hear something as soon as a Daz user tries starting up Daz with a 20xx card installed.
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                     I do find that Blender score in the Hardwareluxx.de article very impressive.  If Blender gets THAT much of an uplift jumping from a 1080 Ti to a 2080 Ti, yeah...
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                     The Titan V still has more VRAM - 12 GB of VRAM versus 11, plus it may have a workaround for the Windows 10 VRAM tax, but it just got spanked in that benchmark... by a card which is quite a bit cheaper than itself (@$1200+ vs @$3900 on Newegg)
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                       Edit: Unsurprisingly, as of this post ALL of the 2080 Ti's are currently out of stock at Newegg.  For gaming it IS a rather awesome card.
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                     Another update on the 20xx cards...
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                     It looks like 20xx cards will work with any Octane Render version that already supports Volta...
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                      https://render.otoy.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=33&amp;t=68810#p346140
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                     This MIGHT be good news for Daz users, but of course we won't actually know until someone tries it or Daz3D makes an official announcement.
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                  <div class="message-userContent lbContainer js-lbContainer" data-lb-caption-desc="Rich · Sep 21, 2018 at 2:48 AM" data-lb-id="post-1115127">
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                        OhWee said:
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                        Another update on the 20xx cards...
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        It looks like 20xx cards will work with any Octane Render version that already supports Volta...
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        <a class="link link--external" href="https://render.otoy.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=33&amp;t=68810#p346140" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                         https://render.otoy.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=33&amp;t=68810#p346140
                        </a>
                        <br/>
                        <br/>
                        This MIGHT be good news for Daz users, but of course we won't actually know until someone tries it or Daz3D makes an official announcement.
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                     </blockquote>
                     I did some reading on the tech details of the cards.  This is sheer speculation, but it sounds like the core aspects of the card may not be radically different from the 10x0 series.  So it could be that the current Daz will be able to work using thise cards, possibly with just a driver update required.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     The RTX stuff is interesting.  That clearly
                     <u>
                      won't
                     </u>
                     give you anything right out of the box, since the current iRay won't know it's there.  But what it does is hardware-accelerate the process of determining what triangle(s) "out in the world" a particular ray intersects.  Daz/iRay obviously do a good bit of that, so it's quite possible that an RTX-aware iRay would gain significant performance from RTX.  Specifically, what RTX does is provide hardware support for BVH (Bounding Volume Hierarchy) testing. (
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bounding_volume_hierarchy" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bounding_volume_hierarchy
                     </a>
                     )  But taking advantage of that implies that you program in your BVH data structure using the appropriate formats, etc., that the card wants.  So, if iRay is going to support that, there will have to be API's for doing that.  Now, possibly that's already there - I have no idea how iRay works "under the hood."  If so, and iRay update that links the external API to the internal card BVH structure could gain you that performance boost without requiring the Daz folks to rewrite how they send data to iRay.  In other words, just drop in a new iRay, and you get the benefits.  On the other hand, if this adds/changes the iRay API, then there will be an even longer delay (after the iRay update) while the Daz-gineers rework their use of iRay.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     So, bottom line - we won't know until people try it, as
                     <a class="username" data-user-id="73607" data-username="@OhWee" data-xf-init="member-tooltip" href="https://f95zone.to/members/73607/">
                      @OhWee
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                     said, but the fact that Octane works is encouraging.  It still, however, might be a multi-step process: you get performance benefits now due to more CUDA cores and faster clock/memory speeds, and then another bump if/when RTX support is added to iRay.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Or not.  LOL
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                     So, DazRawb (I think he works for Daz) acquired a RTX 2080, and took it for a spin with Daz Studio.
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     His post here:
                     <br/>
                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/3969916/#Comment_3969916" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
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                     Short form, it works (no issues that he mentioned anyways).  He used the latest beta drivers from Nvidia.  His guess is that the extra functionality isn't enabled, but he still saw a performance uplift from a 980 Ti (as Rich mentioned, more cores, higher clocks, so this makes sense).  Later discussion in the thread ballparks his bench around the performance of a 1080 Ti (remember this is a 2080, not a 2080 Ti).
                     <br/>
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                     I just checked Newegg.  2080's appear to be in stock at the moment but the 2080 Ti's have been out of stock pretty much since launch day.
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                     We have a 2080 Ti result with the Daz Iray benchmark.
                     <br/>
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                     Based on the numbers, I think it's the first (smaller) scene, not the more recent (2018) one.
                     <br/>
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                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/3977756/#Comment_3977756" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
                      https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/3977756/#Comment_3977756
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                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     For reference, a single 1080 Ti usually comes in at around 1.50 to 2 minutes or so without CPU.  The 2080Ti came in at 51 seconds without CPU...
                     <br/>
                     <br/>
                     Also, DazRAWB successfully benched/ran his 2080 in an external enclosure using a laptop with a built in 1070.  The two combined successfully, dropping his posted (eGPU) render time,
                     <br/>
                     from:
                     <br/>
                     6 minutes 10 seconds
                     <br/>
                     to:
                     <br/>
                     4 minutes 15 seconds...
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                     <a class="link link--external" href="https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/3980616/#Comment_3980616" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">
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                     <br/>
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                     Just gotta say, the thought of getting a 2080 Ti in an eGPU (with suitably sized PS), and combining it with my dual 1080 laptop...
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                     :winkytongue:
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                     I believe the difference from Pascal's launch and Turing, is that Turing is very similar to Volta:
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                      https://devblogs.nvidia.com/nvidia-turing-architecture-in-depth/
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                     So, everything was new about the 10xx, we had to be tortured for several months until a iray version supporting Pascal was released and then some time for a new Daz Studio version. I remember using the Beta version for a long time.
                     <br/>
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                     Now, with Tesla and Quadro V being around, they anticipated the changes and Daz Studio Beta 4.11 already support it (4.10 seems to hang). I'm monitoring the benchmark thread on Daz Forum, only 1 benchmark so far, hope to see more.
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                     2080 TI is too expensive, I'm interested to see comparisons between 1080 TI and 2080.
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                     If someone still reading here:
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                     what do you think about the "Gainward GeForce RTX 2070 Super Phantom GS" for rendering?
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                     I had a terrible experience with Gainward cards so I don't know.
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                     But yes RTX card are good for rendering, at least for Octane or Daz, now they both support it.
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                     From a hobbyist perspective I have nothing to complain about.
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                        I had a terrible experience with Gainward cards
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                     What kind of bad experiences? Bad performance or bad manufacturing?
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                        What kind of bad experiences? Bad performance or bad manufacturing?
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                     Bad manufacturing.
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                     Long story short, I bought 2x 970 on sales back in day, one for me, one for a friend. Good price, no performance problems at all, maybe fans a little bit loud but that's it, pretty much happy. 2 years after, both cards stopped working (random crash on bios, screen going black, BSOD, I tried everything...), not only a few days apart, but also a few days after the end of the warranty period.
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                     Could be programmed obsolescence, or a manufacturing defect in the lot. I don't know nor I care, but never again.
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