[□ | □ | □]
[□=□ | □ | □]
[!□ | □ | □]
Mr. Reid : I believe , Mr. Chairperson , this will allow for some fairness to prevail under the application process so that there would not be undue influence exerted by either party with respect to the certification process and to allow the employees themselves to hear both sides in the certification application , and that is why we have raised this amendment . Mr. Sale : Mr. Chairperson , with the advice of the clerk , I think that we have to proceed in the procedurally correct manner . It does not deal with control of assets other than control of securities , and in the context of Bill 67 , the relevance would be that the securities referred to would be shares either of MTS or of an affiliate . Since not all members of a workplace are members of the union , it only seems reasonable to suggest that the union have access to the names and addresses of those people to ascertain , since those people also pay dues , what their will is with respect to the use of those dues . They could shift them either among themselves or to others , with permission . There is the issues of the pension and there is the issues of salaries . So what is the wish of the committee , that we read all of them into the record and then pass them singly ? Mr. Reid : Mr. Chairperson , presenters who came before this committee last week indicated to this committee that there are times when the employers or the labour organization take certain steps to instruct people who are under their care , control and responsibility , but knowing that human personalities and human nature and people are able to make their own decisions independent of these two bodies , it seems to be reasonable to expect that there should be some counsel that could be afforded by both the employer and the labour organizations to what is and what is not proper conduct . The member for St. Johns ( Mr. Mackintosh ) refers to the adjustments to MLAs , and I think he knows , if he does not , I will remind him , that there was all-party agreement of the Liberals , the NDP and the Conservatives on a process , agreement that they would be adopted by the Legislature subsequent to the election , and that is exactly what happened , based on an all-party agreement of all parties . The fidelity of the objective presentation enhances the depth and transformative quality of the response . So what we are requesting here is that that information be made available to the employee through the union , and that if there are any problems that may be encountered with respect to some of the information , that employee can request that information be received from the board . I support the motion for an additional reason , besides what the minister has stated and what Mr. Benson stated in his dissenting report , and that is at some point in a jurisdiction like Manitoba where you are going to increase the rate of remuneration paid to anybody , even an independent judiciary , to a degree which is perceived to be unfair and out of step with other players and essential players in a democracy , whether it be professors who claim , and rightly so , academic freedom , whether it be teachers who claim they need respect and they need a sense of worth to be able to teach properly , all of these being fundamental parts of democracy , but if you are out of step with what is perceived generally to be fair , you can bring disrepute on the very institution and the very freedom that you stand for. I simply suggested , do you think that I would go to these types of lengths when the government could in fact take the bill , if that was truly their motivation , and abolish Rand Formula . That is why I asked this Minister of Labour the question : What changes are you contemplating ? The first part , it is clear to me that if there is a subsidiary relationship , if I am understanding " ( b ) " correctly , this pertains to a situation where a company , let us say , Northern Telecom , who is a big vendor of telecommunications products , has two independent subsidiaries which themselves are not related - - in other words , Northern Tel either owns or controls two separate companies , neither of which has a beneficial ownership relationship between them . In the book as a whole , Germain Grisez has once again shown how faith seeking understanding , when done by someone of great faith and great understanding , is the most impressive of all human efforts . They also looked at the Canadian comparisons , which showed that the judges in Manitoba were , next to Newfoundland , the lowest paid in all of Canada . Needless to say , the actual positions of most Catholics do not correspond precisely to either of these two types . So , for the member to continue suggesting these kinds of things , there is nothing that I can do to change his mind , but I think that I will have to continue respectfully to disagree with his version of the facts . Mr. Desjarlais basically , while not agreeing , did not seem to think that these were radical proposals .