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If the names and addresses of the employees are not available , are not provided by the employer , as I have indicated earlier , where some members of that particular bargaining unit may be employed in their own homes , for example , or outside of the particular isolated work area where they can be easily identified , then it seems reasonable to request this amendment that would allow for that list of names to be provided to the union by the employer to allow for the most accurate communication possible to determine the wishes and the will of those employees . With respect to its employees , the Province of Manitoba takes the position that the salaries should be affordable in the context of taxpayers ' ability to pay - - I would hope we can all agree on that principle - - be within a reasonable range of pay levels for comparable positions in Manitoba , compensate individuals in relation to their responsibilities at a level that attracts and retains competent employees - - we have had no difficulty in getting people wanting to be provincial judges ; I think members are aware of the numbers of individuals that are interested in being provincial judges - - reflect economic realities in Manitoba . Since not all members of a workplace are members of the union , it only seems reasonable to suggest that the union have access to the names and addresses of those people to ascertain , since those people also pay dues , what their will is with respect to the use of those dues . I would inquire , Mr. Minister , whether you have any opening remarks at this time . I am canvassing the principal players to see if it would be appropriate for the minister or the critic to have any opening remarks . From 1939 he was Professor of English at Gonzaga University and his reflections on everything from golf to satanism were published in almost all the intellectual and literary journals of the English-speaking world , including frequent appearances in these pages . If it is not the intent of the government to have some confidentiality in here , then the only conclusion that I can draw is that they want this information to be used by some individual or individuals intent on discrediting that particular labour organization . If the case goes forward , a prolonged period of discovery will follow , which could produce some very interesting evidence , including the videotapes and still photos taken by the ATF photographers during the raid , the plans for the raid , the FBI 's plans for use of CS gas , the logs of observers during the gassing and the fire , and other information that was not admitted at the criminal trial . Mr. Mackintosh : Well , I guess the remarks from the member for The Maples ( Kowalski ) just shows how ridiculous this process is becoming without some government initiative here , but the member for The Maples should darn well withdraw any remarks that he impugns to this side . Some of them could be , in fact , working out of their own homes but still be members of a particular bargaining unit ; and , if we are going to have requirements of the labour organizations to do certain surveys of their members with respect to the use of dues for political purposes , it only seems fair and reasonable that the names and addresses of the employees affected be made available to allow for the most accurate consultation process to take place . I have already explained to all of you why I think that is unreasonable , unfair and obviously an added significant cost to the taxpayers of Manitoba where individuals going back prior to 1992 who accepted these positions under certain arrangements knowing what the compensation was , knowing what the pension was at that particular point in time . The Establishment Clause serves that purpose only to the extent that it advances the free-exercise rights of individuals ; when disestablishment is invoked to burden free-exercise rights , it undermines the very Constitution of which it is a part . I do not want to in any way curtail you , and if you would wish to make your remarks first , I would certainly recognize you to proceed . Honourable Minister , do you have any opening remarks ? Mr. Reid : In this provision in this amendment that I am proposing here , Mr. Chairperson , it changes in the fact that the employer in this case or the government in most of these cases will determine the names of the employees that would be required to work to maintain essential services , and we heard one of the presentations here this evening spelling out very clearly for the government and for the committee members that there should be a removal of the names component , that there was no opposition to determining that there are job classifications that need to be filled , but I think the objection was that the specific names of individuals to do that work , that power was being left in the hands of the government to determine specific people .