[00:26] <jasoncwarner_> morning everyone! Release week...and to kick that off, a video ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-_yaPof1Vs&feature=youtu.be&t=28m48s (Linux Action Show talking Ubuntu 12.04...figured you all might like to see it)
[00:34]  * TheMuso downloads the videsos.
[00:34] <TheMuso> video even.
[00:54] <bryceh> jasoncwarner_, sounds like the onboard keyboard could rock with a few configuration tweaks
[00:54] <jasoncwarner_> bryceh: yeah, caught that as well. :)
[01:57] <TheMuso> I think with some design team help, onboard could really be our on-screen keyboard for everything.
[01:57] <TheMuso> It was designed for a11y as its primary use case, but its flexible enough to be used for everything else I think.
[02:04] <jbicha> it's ridiculously more functional than the caribou thing GNOME Shell is including
[02:04] <Sarvatt> TheMuso: does it really need some kind of design team feedback to make it bigger by default? :)
[02:05] <TheMuso> Sarvatt: I dunno.
[02:05] <TheMuso> jbicha: But thats early in development, and targetting specialized assistive hardware for people who can't even use a mouse.
[02:08] <Sarvatt> from that video i got that it was too small by default and should be taking up the horizontal resoltion of the screen by default but its not
[02:09] <TheMuso> Right.
[02:10] <jbicha> TheMuso: the caribou developer got busy and stopped coding it, it's an interesting framework but it needs a lot more work for the frontend to be usable
[02:14] <TheMuso> jbicha: Ah ok, I am not really following its development.
[03:25] <lifeless> what would cause applications to not be found via the dash ?
[03:25] <lifeless> the application lens is installed
[03:25] <lifeless> a clean profile works.
[03:41] <Jacky> lifeless: improperly formed .desktop files.
[03:41] <lifeless> Jacky: how does one diagnose this ?
[03:42] <Jacky> Well, how I would go about doing would be looking at a desktop file for an application that does appear under /usr/share/applications and comparing it to a .desktop for an application that you'd like to see but don't.
[03:43] <lifeless> Jacky: My question was ambiguous
[03:43] <lifeless> Jacky: *nothing* appears.
[03:43] <Jacky> O.O
[03:43] <lifeless> So not, what causes a specific app to not appear.
[03:43] <lifeless> What causes no applications to be found.
[03:43] <Jacky> blame read access!
[03:46] <Jacky> Hmm, need to peek into code for that one..
[04:04] <pitti> Good morning
[04:04] <pitti> Laney: oh, it's fine for x-x-i-s to ship the workaround as well; I really meant to say "a pm-utils *script* workaround", the packaging doesn't matter uch
[04:04] <pitti> much
[04:32] <pitti> RAOF: hey Chris, how are you?
[04:33] <RAOF> Hey pitti.  Good!   I'm fine thanks ;) catching up on the email backlog. Nothing worrying so far. We are in a good shape for 12.04 LTS I guess :)
[05:18] <jasoncwarner_> :)
[05:18] <didrocks> jasoncwarner_: and you? How was your week-end?
[05:18] <didrocks> guten morgen pitti
[05:18] <jasoncwarner_> didrocks: good, thanks...just trying to cram as much family time in before two weeks away
[05:18] <jasoncwarner_> didrocks: you know the deal ;)
[05:18] <didrocks> jasoncwarner_: heh, indeed ;)
[05:18] <RAOF> Hey didrocks, jasoncwarner_!
[05:19] <RAOF> I am not particularly disappointed to not be going to the PS sprint before UDS :)
[05:27] <jasoncwarner_> RAOF: yeah, rub it in ;)
[05:28] <didrocks> hey RAOF, back on real tea area? ;)
[05:36] <RAOF> Yup!
[05:36] <RAOF> Back with my teapot and kettle!
[05:41] <pitti> jasoncwarner_: watching your video ATM :)
[05:42] <un1c0rn> morning
[05:51]  * bryceh waves
[05:52]  * un1c0rn waves
[08:06] <seb128> hey
[08:08] <Laney> pitti: cheers. I just couldn't figure it out. I'll try and sort it out for -proposed then.
[08:09] <pitti> hey seb128, ca va?
[08:10] <seb128> hey pitti, ca va bien !
[08:10] <seb128> pitti, et toi ? t'as passé un bon w.e ?
[08:11] <pitti> seb128: had a nice weekend indeed
[08:11]  * didrocks waited on an answer in French
[08:11] <pitti> some gardening on Saturday when it was sunny
[08:11] <didrocks> how disappointed! :)
[08:11] <pitti> pah
[08:11] <seb128> lol
[08:11] <seb128> sunny, lucky you
[08:11] <seb128> we had an hour rain,sun alternance cycle during most of the w.e
[08:12] <pitti> seb128: so you went to the election when it was sunny? :-)
[08:12] <pitti> how did that go anyway
[08:12] <seb128> oh it's raining, oh that stopped, oh it's raining again
[08:12] <didrocks> seb128: was not bad in Lyon (well, even if we were walking outside in the 15 minutes of the week when rains was horrible)
[08:12] <pitti> ah, so Hollande won, quite expectedly
[08:12] <didrocks> week-end*
[08:12] <didrocks> pitti: well, won, was round 1 :)
[08:13] <seb128> pitti, it was only the first round, Hollande (left wing) first, Sarkozy second
[08:13] <didrocks> still waiting on the second round, but he's in a good position
[08:13] <seb128> 28.5% - 27 %
[08:14] <seb128> pitti, the vote is rather a pro-against Sarkozy that anything else, Hollande fails to really "convince" or to get people excited, his main strength is to not be Sarkozy
[08:14] <seb128> which is a bit of a weird situation
[08:14] <seb128> but, oh, well...
[08:14] <pitti> seb128: yeah, that's pretty much what Zeit and Spiegel wrote, too
[08:32] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[08:33] <didrocks> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
[08:33] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, pretty good thanks. how are you?
[08:33] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm great, thanks!
[08:37] <seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, had a good w.e?
[08:38] <chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, not too bad thanks. got the car back :)
[08:38] <chrisccoulson> how about you?
[08:38] <seb128> chrisccoulson, how is Ruby? did she got over her cold ?
[08:38] <chrisccoulson> seb128, she's starting to get better now, thanks
[08:38] <seb128> chrisccoulson, I had a good w.e, some house cleaning, watching the tennis semi-final and final on TV, went to vote ;-)
[08:39] <seb128> though we have a lame weather for over a week
[08:39] <chrisccoulson> heh, i saw the result of the voting was quite interesting ;)
[08:39] <seb128> "interesting"
[08:39] <seb128> it's a boring election :p
[08:41] <seb128> chrisccoulson, the election feels like a bit a pro or against Sarkozy pool, and with the current situation in France and Europe there is not a lot any of them can do differently once he will be in charge anyway
[08:44] <chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i imagine that's what it will be like here in a few weeks when we have our local elections ;)
[08:46] <tjaalton> slomo: duh, thanks for fixing the -bad build-deps and for the upload :)
[08:48] <chrisccoulson> does anyone else keep seeing odd styling issues with the global menu?
[08:48] <chrisccoulson> i keep hovering over items that change padding when hovered
[08:48] <chrisccoulson> and some items end up with a white border on hover
[08:49] <seb128> chrisccoulson, is that specific to appmenu? I think I saw bugs report about that in i.e nautilus
[08:49] <chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i've only seen it in the global menu. i noticed it with firefox, but i've also seen it with gedit now as well
[08:49] <seb128> chrisccoulson, I don't see it here atm trying over a few menus, but I wonder if that could be a GTK bog
[08:49] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm not sure
[08:49] <chrisccoulson> or maybe a theme bug
[08:50] <seb128> chrisccoulson, can you try if i.e nautilus context menus do it?
[08:50] <chrisccoulson> i haven't noticed it in any context menus yet
[08:50] <seb128> does it do it often for you?
[08:50] <seb128> do you mouse or keyboard navigate?
[08:51] <seb128> chrisccoulson, we got some bugs like https://launchpadlibrarian.net/100766825/Nautilus%20graphical%20bug.png
[08:51] <seb128> though I never saw once of those here
[08:52] <htorque> chrisccoulson: i've seen that too, i think that started after the gtk update
[08:52] <chrisccoulson> seb128, i've not seen that specific issue in the screenshot, although it might be related
[08:52] <htorque> also happens in nautilus' bread crumb navigation: http://img.xrmb2.net/images/268789.png
[08:53] <seb128> htorque, "the gtk update", which one? there was not only one gtk update this cycle :p
[08:54] <htorque> if only i knew, i was just remembering that UF thread: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1947328
[08:58] <seb128> chrisccoulson, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+bug/981084/+attachment/3061122/+files/nautilus.mp4
[08:58] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 981084 in nautilus "variable button's height" [Low,Invalid]
[08:58] <seb128> chrisccoulson, is that the same?
[08:59] <chrisccoulson> seb128, i'll check shortly. i need to pop out quickly to take the hire car back
[08:59] <seb128> chrisccoulson, see you ;-)
[09:06] <rickspencer3> bonjour seb128
[09:06] <seb128> rickspencer3, bonjour ! ca va ?
[09:08] <rickspencer3> seb128,  ca va bien
[09:08] <rickspencer3> exceptement, juis imprisoné dans chez didrocks
[09:09] <seb128> rickspencer3, tu fais le "release sprint" chez Didier ? ;-)
[09:09] <ogra_> you are locked into diders house ?
[09:10] <ogra_> (or is my french that bad ?)
[09:10] <rickspencer3> ogra_, oui, c'est vrai
[09:10] <ogra_> haha
[09:11] <rickspencer3> seb128, oui, le quickly sprint, en fait
[09:11] <seb128> hehe
[09:11] <rickspencer3> haha, en fait, l'ordinator de didrocks ne marche pas
[09:12] <rickspencer3> je puex dire que je vuex, et didrocks ne peux pas s'plaindre
[09:12] <rickspencer3> seb128, how is precise looking for you today?
[09:13]  * rickspencer3 enables proposed
[09:18] <seb128> rickspencer3, today precise is looking great ;-)
[09:19] <seb128> i.e I didn't see anything that concerns me so far
[09:19] <rickspencer3> SHIP!
[09:19] <seb128> hehe
[09:19] <seb128> getting there! ;-)
[09:23] <xclaesse> I was wondering, is there already plans about systemd for precise+1 ?
[09:23] <xclaesse> are there strong pros/cons? or is that open to discussion in UDS?
[09:24] <seb128> it will be discussed at UDS I guess
[09:24] <seb128> they are strongs pro and con yes
[09:25] <seb128> including cost of a migration, benefit of changing (most users don't care about init, that's some that should just work for them), the fact that systemd bundles lot of things with it, etc
[09:29] <xclaesse> seb128, ok, thanks :)
[09:40] <slomo> tjaalton: np
[09:41] <xclaesse> seb128, any idea why git started saying:
[09:41] <xclaesse> perl: warning: Setting locale failed.
[09:41] <xclaesse> perl: warning: Please check that your locale settings:
[09:41] <seb128> because your locale is incorrectly configured?
[09:41] <xclaesse> why is it suddenly incorrect?
[09:41] <xclaesse> and how to fix it? :p
[09:41] <seb128> dunno, it's your config?
[09:42] <seb128> echo $LC_ALL $LANG $LANGUAGE?
[09:42] <xclaesse> $ echo $LC_ALL $LANG $LANGUAGE
[09:42] <xclaesse> fr_FR.UTF-8 fr:en
[09:43] <seb128> locale -a?
[09:43] <seb128> do you get any details about those warnings?
[09:43] <xclaesse> seb128, http://pastebin.com/sq9ZEnc3
[09:44] <xclaesse> seb128, complete git message: http://pastebin.com/ByLTDrFL
[09:45] <seb128>         LC_ALL = (unset),
[09:45] <seb128> xclaesse, does it work better if you "export LC_ALL=fr_FR.UTF-8"?
[09:45]  * xclaesse suspects again a conflict between gnome-control-center and ubuntu's language stuff
[09:45] <seb128> could be
[09:46] <seb128> there is a reason we hide it by default in favor of language selector ;-)
[09:46] <xclaesse> seb128, with that export it works, yes
[09:46] <seb128> ok
[09:46] <seb128> well check your .profile .pam_environment etc
[09:46] <seb128> or try running language-selector and dnd french at the top
[09:48] <xclaesse> seb128, was already on top, clicked "apply the the whole system" and that seems to fixed it
[09:48] <seb128> ok, good
[10:28] <chrisccoulson> seb128, that video is exactly the same thing i see with the global menu btw
[10:28] <seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, so I would blame GTK
[10:28] <seb128> chrisccoulson, maybe reopen that bug and reassign to GTK?
[10:30] <chrisccoulson> seb128, ok, i've reopened that now
[10:31] <chrisccoulson> maybe i'll try and debug that once i've handled firefox 12 release stuff ;)
[10:33] <seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks
[11:41] <Sweetshark> pitti: so what is the timing for a zero-dayish SRU for libreoffice fixing bug 958384, bug 950825, bug 841696, bug 984893, bug 975430, bug 973134, bug 527938. package is currently building, so local testing should be trough ~today. bug 975430 is the critical one.
[11:41] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 958384 in libreoffice "Libre office default style settings are poor." [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/958384
[11:41] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 950825 in libreoffice "LibreOffice quicklists are not translated" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/950825
[11:41] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 841696 in libreoffice "LibreOffice should depend on libreoffice-gtk" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/841696
[11:42] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 984893 in libreoffice "Typo in LO Base desktop file: zn_CN" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/984893
[11:42] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 975430 in libreoffice ""Find" crashes the program (dup-of: 975503)" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/975430
[11:42] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 975503 in df-libreoffice ""Find" crashes Libreoffice (GTK)" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/975503
[11:57] <pitti> Sweetshark: there's no pre-defined plan for this; as soon as it's uploaded, built, and verified
[12:00] <Sweetshark> pitti: k, just making sure that there are no hidden minefields along the way. ;)
[12:25] <kklimonda> pitti: are you still experimenting with systemd? ;)
[12:36] <pitti> kklimonda: not at the moment, why?
[12:39] <kklimonda> pitti: I'm curious how well does it work on Ubuntu currently and how much work is "left" - I just saw your repo, but no updates since 4.IV so I was wondering if you're still interested in it.
[12:39] <pitti> kklimonda: I have actually run my main workstation with these packages for about two days
[12:40] <pitti> kklimonda: so mostly, moving the scripts from ubuntu-systemd-units to their actual packages
[12:40] <pitti> kklimonda: and going over all existing upstart jobs and provide counterparts
[12:41] <pitti> kklimonda: however, it has been discussed internally quite extensively, and it seems we'll keep upstart
[12:41] <kklimonda> argh
[12:41] <kklimonda> pitti: for 12.10 or forever?
[12:41] <pitti> the systemd init portion will still be packaged, but separately (universe package I guess)
[12:41] <pitti> we'll need the systemd source either way for udev and the extra d-bus APIs for gnome
[12:41] <kklimonda> yeah, I know
[12:42] <pitti> kklimonda: "forever" is a strong word, but it seems "for the time being"
[12:42] <kklimonda> I was hoping that the fact that more and more userspace tools are depending on systemd would nudge you forward
[12:42] <seb128> kklimonda, why "argh"?
[12:42] <seb128> kklimonda, they don't depend on the init part so much
[12:42] <seb128> they mostly use the dbus services
[12:43] <kklimonda> seb128: I think systemd has some nice features, but the main argument is that I'd like to see less divergence between us and Fedora/RHEL - not even for desktop, but for servers
[12:47] <seb128> kklimonda, yeah, tricky, we have an init system we are mostly happy with, and not changing init system and having to deal with migrations is something everybody prefers, i.e maintainers, admins, users
[12:49] <kklimonda> pitti: Also, I don't like the fact that it's been discussed "internally" as it affects the entire distribution. I know that canonical is maintaining upstart and most of the related packages in ubuntu, but it would be nice if this discussion (which has resurfaced at least twice in the last 12 months) has been done on ubuntu-devel@ just to keep the rest of us in the loop.
[12:54] <seb128> kklimonda, it will likely be discussed for the project at UDS, a discussion barely make a position taken by the project
[12:56] <seb128> kklimonda, but bottom line is that Canonical doesn't believe it's the right choice it will not spent resources pushing forward that transition, it doesn't mean it can't happen but it would require somebody to step up and convince of a credible plan etc to get it done
[12:57] <seb128> kklimonda, well anyway no made decision, it's just where things seem to be leaning for people who discussed it
[12:57] <kklimonda> seb128: if the discussion doesn't happen on ubuntu-devel@ it's really hard to know what's happening
[12:57] <seb128> kklimonda, well I guess it will be discussed at UDS and then a summary and follow up will be sent on the list
[12:57] <kklimonda> fair point
[12:57] <seb128> kklimonda, do you suggest it should be done the other way around, lists before UDS?
[12:58] <seb128> I've no strong opinion either way...
[12:58] <seb128> but UDS tend to be better to avoid out of control discussions
[12:58] <seb128> discuss in small group first, see if some sort of consensus is showing
[12:58] <kklimonda> seb128: yes, but it's really hard to keep track of what's happening at the UDS
[12:58] <seb128> then extend to the discussion
[13:00] <kklimonda> there has been quite a few new projects made by Canonical recently that has not been discussed with community beforehand, but developed in a tight group. Stuff like MASS, Ubuntu Orchestra etc.
[13:02] <kklimonda> maybe I'm just becoming grumpy because I don't like the cloud ;)
[13:03] <pitti> right, I started it internally to avoid a huge waterfall thread that we already had on teh same topic a year ago
[13:04] <pitti> I mostly wanted to get a "feel" for how the other teams think about it
[13:04] <pitti> that doesn't replace an official discussion, of course
[13:04] <pitti> but I started this discussion three times already, one of these publically
[13:04] <pitti> and I am so not going to start it again :)
[13:04] <kklimonda> I guess what I'm trying to say is that if you keep discussion internal then, if the new CoC gets accepted in its current form, you'll be able to just say "we've made the decision, deal with it"
[13:07] <kklimonda> pitti: right, discussions about systemd vs rest of the world seem to quickly degenerate into chaos (like the last thread on debian-devel ML)
[13:33] <chrisccoulson> wtf @ https://launchpadlibrarian.net/102904364/buildlog_ubuntu-precise-armel.firefox_12.0%2Bbuild1-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS>_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz :/
[14:02] <seb128> chrisccoulson, typo "im" -> "in"?
[14:03] <chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, the line actually reads "nsIDOMSVGPathSegMovetoRel createSVGPathSegMovetoRel(in float v, in float y);" in the package
[14:03] <chrisccoulson> but "nsIDOMSVGPathSegMovetoRel createSVGPathSegMovetoRel(in flnat v, im elnat y);" on that build :/
[14:04] <seb128> local corruption? does a retry do the same?
[14:04] <chrisccoulson> seb128, i haven't tried yet
[14:06] <seb128> "Quantal Quetzal"
[14:06]  * seb128 googles english words
[14:06] <kklimonda> quetzal is apparently a parrot of some kind
[14:06] <seb128> oh, a bird
[14:06] <seb128> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:ResplendentQuetzal.jpg
[14:08] <smspillaz> DAMMIT
[14:09] <smspillaz> I was hoping for something
[14:09] <smspillaz> Questionable
[14:12] <didrocks> rickspencer3 and didrocks 1 - gir webkit 0 \o/
[14:12] <rickspencer3> an infinite number of monkeys pounding a keyboard will eventually make the developer-extras work
[14:13] <didrocks> :-)
[14:26]  * mterry misses having updates available in the morning
[14:26] <ogra_> use PPAs :P
[14:30] <didrocks> hey ogra_ ;)
[14:30] <didrocks> ogra_: sil2100 got in touch with you about compiz?
[14:31] <ogra_> didrocks, yes, linaro and i are waiting for the ping to start updating all branches and the patch
[14:31] <didrocks> excellent :)
[14:31] <ogra_> well ...
[14:31] <didrocks> at least, we can change now a hack with a proper change ;)
[14:31] <didrocks> (that is upstream)
[14:32]  * ogra_ must admit he isnt thrilled losing another day pre-release that should better go into testing
[14:32] <ogra_> but thats life i guess
[14:32] <didrocks> ogra_: well, depends on when you want the SRU to be released?
[14:32] <didrocks> as it will postpone it
[14:33] <chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, it looks like other armel builders have successfully past the point at which that build failed
[14:33] <chrisccoulson> it's pretty worrying that the builds suffer from local corruption though :/
[14:34] <seb128> chrisccoulson, indeed, maybe mention it to #is
[14:34] <chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, will do. i mentioned it on #launchpad too, but nobody responded there
[14:35] <pitti> kklimonda: so I suppose http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/1121 is the upstart announcement, too
[14:36] <chrisccoulson> ok, mentioned on #is
[14:36] <chrisccoulson> pitti, oh, i'd not read that yet
[14:36] <seb128> let's see how much troll that will start
[14:40] <chrisccoulson> heh
[14:48] <kklimonda> pitti: apparently, oh well - we'll just get back to it in another 2 years ;)
[14:49] <mdeslaur> kklimonda: systemd will be it's own operating system by then :)
[14:50] <ogra_> lol
[14:50] <ogra_> lennartOS
[14:50] <mdeslaur> hehe
[14:50] <kklimonda> mdeslaur: that's not an argument against it though as long as it does everything well
[14:50] <hadess> 'lo
[14:50] <hadess> can somebody help me understand why this isn't getting i18n'ed:
[14:50] <hadess> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=671088
[14:50] <ubot2> Gnome bug 671088 in Movie player "Update desktop file to support Unity" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
[14:50] <ogra_> lennartOS will do avahi OOTB and play back sounds though :)
[14:51] <hadess> and why the instructions that were originally published in whatever blog it was didn't include instructions on adding i18n properly?
[14:52]  * pitti summons mhall119 here
[14:53] <pitti> hadess: that certainly shoudl be _Name indeed, it's already a desktop.in after all
[14:53] <hadess> pitti, right, i'm just disappointed that nobody was checking those changes before getting submitted
[14:53] <hadess> and that basics like i18n would get left out
[14:54] <mhall119> hey pitti
[14:54] <hadess> mhall119, we're talking about https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=671088
[14:54] <ubot2> Gnome bug 671088 in Movie player "Update desktop file to support Unity" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
[14:54] <pitti> hey mhall119; hadess is asking about the unity quicklist patch in gnome bug 671088
[14:54] <pitti> hadess: at least the gnome-utils example it refers to (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/LauncherAPI?action=AttachFile&do=view&target=02_add_unity_quicklist_support.patch) DTRT
[14:55] <pitti> so, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/LauncherAPI#Quicklists should certainly point out to use .desktop.in, _Name, and adding it to po/POTFILES.in
[14:55] <mhall119> looks like that's using the old way, not the new spec
[14:56] <hadess> mhall119, and it would be great to have a reasoning behind the additions themselves
[14:56] <hadess> mhall119, all the functionality that the reporter wants to add is things already accessible via mpris
[14:56] <mhall119> hadess: the reason for the quicklist actions?
[14:57] <hadess> why fullscreen, why play/pause?
[14:57] <hadess> it would offer play even when nothing was loaded for example, that doesn't strike me as a good idea
[14:57] <mhall119> hadess: it's probably to match similar quicklist controls for other media programs
[14:57] <chrisccoulson> the quicklist entries also make absolutely no sense when totem isn't open :/
[14:58] <chrisccoulson> which is exactly the reason that i continually reject patches to add "Toggle Private Browsing" to firefox ;)
[14:58] <mhall119> I suppose for media players without a media library it doesn't work
[14:58] <mhall119> but for like rhythmbox and banshee it did
[14:58] <hadess> mhall119, if i'm the first one to complain about those problems, maybe the other media programs should be more careful :)
[14:59] <mhall119> hadess: like I said, it made sense for other media programs
[14:59] <hadess> why mute?
[14:59] <mhall119> why  not mute?
[15:00] <hadess> because you already have a mute button on your keyboard, or available in the top right of your screen
[15:00] <seb128> hadess, if you plan to commit any of those list items please let me know before, I've a patch to upstream as well to not break the .desktop (the actions don't play nicely with the way totem append the mimetype list at the end of the .desktop)
[15:00] <hadess> seb128, yeah, that wouldn't work too well indeed
[15:00] <seb128> hadess, I did plan to upstream it in the next week once precise is out, I got some backlog
[15:01] <mhall119> hadess: but there's not nececssarily anything wrong with putting it in the quicklist either (except again, it makes no sense when the app isn't running)
[15:01] <hadess> mhall119, it's part of the UI offered by the application, i think it should at least be as good as what else we would offer
[15:02] <hadess> mhall119, otherwise it's just a hack, and i'd rather not include it
[15:02] <mhall119> I agree that for Totem, these don't make sense as static quicklist actions
[15:03] <mhall119> they would be more appropriate as runtime actions
[15:03] <hadess> what would be interesting is implementing this using mpris for players that support it
[15:04] <mhall119> you can add it to the launcher using DBusMenu
[15:04] <hadess> dbusmenu?
[15:04] <hadess> did somebody trample on the dbus namespace?
[15:05] <mhall119> http://developer.ubuntu.com/api/ubuntu-12.04/c/dbusmenu/
[15:05] <hadess> we already use the app menu in 3.5, but ubuntu users wouldn't know, as you still ship 3.0...
[15:05] <hadess> mhall119, yep, not your namespace...
[15:05] <seb128> hadess, well, new versions dropped non clutter support :-(
[15:05] <mhall119> yeah, the app menu will be integrated with the window menu in the future, but not the quicklist afaik
[15:06] <seb128> hadess, Debian is looking into what to do as well, either distro patching xv support back in or something
[15:06] <hadess> seb128, good luck with that...
[15:06] <seb128> Josselin did stuff like that before ;-)
[15:07] <seb128> hadess, but anyway, we will update next cycle
[15:07] <seb128> we just didn't want to take on a clutter requirement for that LTS, it too soon for some hardware,drivers
[15:07] <hadess> seb128, i'm sure, i'm also pretty sure that he'll have a hard time doing that in the near future
[15:07] <seb128> I guess it's the same for Debian
[15:07] <hadess> debian has options for which init system to use
[15:07] <hadess> i don't consider that sane
[15:08] <hadess> it's not even a sane upstream for ubuntu imo
[15:09] <seb128> hadess, well anyway sorry that we stayed behind on totem versions, that's going to resolve itself soon
[15:10] <ogra_> (once you make clutter work on arm :P )
[15:12] <hadess> ogra_, i'm pretty sure clutter works on arm
[15:13] <ogra_> hadess, without 3D supporting drivers  ?
[15:13] <ogra_> (which are by license not shippable on any images)
[15:13] <hadess> that's a different problem
[15:13] <hadess> it works on arm
[15:13] <ogra_> sure
[15:14] <hadess> the lack of 3D drivers on ARM is a bigger problem that's probably not going to move very far if we keep implementing 2D fallbacks
[15:14] <ogra_> what i really dont like is to not have any 2D fallbacks anymore recently
[15:15] <ogra_> and that doesnt just apply to arm
[15:15] <hadess> (or don't move to wayland and share the drivers with android)
[15:15] <ogra_> that doesnt change the license
[15:15] <hadess> ogra_, it might actually
[15:16] <hadess> there's certainly movement in that direction
[15:16] <ogra_> the licenses the android builds use are the same ones ... its just that android is usually shipped by a vendor
[15:16] <ogra_> who has a license agreement
[15:16] <hadess> ogra_, well, it's 2012, and we can't create modern UIs using the technologies we were using, in any case
[15:16] <ogra_> which free distros cant
[15:16] <hadess> ogra_, i'm talking about movement from the hw makers
[15:17] <ogra_> i doubt that imagination will easily move any time soon
[15:17] <hadess> neither will nvidia make their drivers free any time soon
[15:17] <ogra_> and they own 80% of the arm market (and poulsbo)
[15:18] <ogra_> but they at least provide licenses that make their binaries shippable in images
[15:18] <ogra_> anyway, i think we get offtopic for this channel :)
[15:18] <hadess> you can wait for things to change, or you can drive the change
[15:19] <ogra_> with a soldering iron ? ;)
[15:23] <mhall119> that might work
[15:24] <chrisccoulson> g'ah, ffs, am i going to get a working build today? https://launchpadlibrarian.net/102910534/buildlog_ubuntu-precise-armel.firefox_12.0%2Bbuild1-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS>_CHROOTWAIT.txt.gz
[15:24] <ogra_> chrisccoulson, ffs ? firefox special ? :)
[15:24] <chrisccoulson> oh, that's the builder that failed last time with local corruption
[15:25] <chrisccoulson> seems it's well and truly screwed now
[15:25] <chrisccoulson> ogra_, oh, much less polite than that ;)
[15:26] <ogra_> yeah, i just thought i should post a family friendly explanation to an ubuntu channel :)
[15:30] <mhall119> ogra_: family friendly sake?
[15:30] <ogra_> heh
[15:31] <smspillaz> for families' sanity
[15:34] <mdeslaur> didrocks: I can now reliably reproduce bug #939228
[15:34] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 939228 in compiz "Windows randomly changing workspaces" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/939228
[15:35] <ogra_> didrocks, did Łukasz give you any ETA when he wants to land the fix in the tree ? i still dont see a commit and it will take a few hours to update the gles stuff
[15:36] <kklimonda> mdeslaur: sounds somewhat related to bug 969546
[15:36] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 969546 in unity "windows moving between workspaces" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/969546
[15:36] <seb128> kklimonda, yeah, it seems similar to your issue that I never managed to trigger here ;-)
[15:38] <seb128> I can trigger it as well now with the steps mdeslaur's described
[15:38] <seb128> it's a bug for smspillaz ;-)
[15:39] <mdeslaur> smspillaz: free uds beer if you fix my pet-peeve bug :)
[15:39] <kklimonda> it's not on a list! ;)
[15:39] <didrocks> ogra_: no, and I'm in a sprint FYI ;) can you ping him? I think he got the branch
[15:39] <ogra_> its om the beer list :)
[15:39] <mdeslaur> smspillaz: unless you caused it, in which case you owe _me_ a beer :)
[15:39] <ogra_> didrocks, well, he pinged me this afternoon and vamished off the face of the earth
[15:39] <didrocks> urgh
[15:40] <didrocks> no, I have not any other info :/
[15:40] <ogra_> at least i cant find him anywhere
[15:40] <ogra_> ok, then it has to wait for tomorrow
[15:40] <ogra_> didrocks, thanks ! go back sprinting around rickspencer3 :)
[15:43] <smspillaz> mdeslaur: I haven't touched the workspace code in a long time. However, I know of a condition which can happen with multiple monitors which might cause windows to shift around incorrectly that I intent to get to this week.
[15:44] <smspillaz> mdeslaur: however, I'm doing some uni assignments right now, so I can't do it right away
[15:44] <smspillaz> mdeslaur: also if you buy me a beer at UDS, you'll probably be in contravention of the law :P
[15:44] <mdeslaur> smspillaz: I don't have multiple monitors
[15:45] <seb128> smspillaz, it's a multiple viewport,workspace thing, and it happens in GNOME classic session as well (i.e not unity only)
[15:45] <smspillaz> mdeslaur: hmm, ok. I don't know if this will help, but there is a race condition when moving windows which will be fixed in an SRU. I've got a ppa up for some work I've been doing to eliminate that, try ppa:smspillaz/compiz to see if it helps
[15:45] <mdeslaur> smspillaz: ok, I'll try that when I get a minute
[15:45] <smspillaz> in other news, have you tried testing ppa:smspillaz/compiz ? I heard its cool
[15:45] <mdeslaur> smspillaz: oh,  I was talking about root beer :)_
[15:45] <smspillaz> oh maaaan
[15:45] <smspillaz> I would do anything for a rootbeer
[15:46] <mdeslaur> hehe
[15:46] <smspillaz> you can't get that in australia
[15:46] <seb128> what's up in the world
[15:46] <smspillaz> seb128: you can't get dr pepper here either
[15:46] <seb128> seems like you can't get real fanta in Canada either
[15:46] <seb128> not sure about in .au
[15:46] <smspillaz> apparantly the two big retail chains tried to sell it back in 1997 it was a "commercial failure"
[15:47] <mhall119> australia sounds like a terrible place
[15:47] <smspillaz> we fix our snake problems with spiders
[15:47] <mdeslaur> smspillaz: yeah, but you have vegemite :)
[15:47] <smspillaz> *shudder*
[15:47] <mhall119> lol
[15:51] <smspillaz> ahhh this one
[15:51] <smspillaz> mdeslaur: yeah that ppa won't fix it
[15:51] <smspillaz> I'll have a look into it later this week
[15:51] <smspillaz> thanks for letting me know
[15:52] <mdeslaur> smspillaz: awesome, thanks!
[16:11] <mvo> seb128: did anything change recently in gtk+ that could cause a GtkTreeView.set_model() performance problem? or that might have broken fixed-height mode? I see bug #986186 in software-center and there it takes ~14s on my fast box to call set_model(model) with a model that contains 37k entries
[16:11] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 986186 in software-center "software center stop working when I select system software for a long time" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/986186
[16:12] <seb128> mvo, define recently, this cycle?
[16:12] <mvo> seb128: last couple of weeks?
[16:12] <mvo> seb128: I don't know when it started :/
[16:12] <mvo> seb128: I will have to find a oneiric box to test
[16:13] <mvo> seb128: meh, dinner call :/ I will read scrollback
[16:13] <seb128> mvo, in any case I don't know how any recent change
[16:13] <seb128> mvo, could be around https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=670882
[16:13] <ubot2> Gnome bug 670882 in GtkTreeView "Shouldn't select another row when the current one is deleted in single selection mode" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
[16:13] <seb128> mvo, like gtk started generating extra events when the model change if you have a view using it
[16:14] <seb128> mvo, but that shouldn't impact on set_model()
[16:14] <mvo> seb128: right
[16:19]  * didrocks waves good evening
[16:54] <mvo> seb128: lets talk more tomorrow, but this looks like a regression, on oneiric its (much) faster AFAICT
[17:03] <chrisccoulson> phew, i'm worn out now
[17:04] <pitti> chrisccoulson: beer o'clock?
[17:11] <chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, no, just finished exercising. beer isn't until later ;)
[17:17] <chrisccoulson> woah, my new phone is huge!
[17:18] <ogra_> does it come with a callbox ?
[17:18] <chrisccoulson> heh
[17:18] <chrisccoulson> why would i want one of those? it's not like i'm actually going to make calls on it ;)
[17:18] <chrisccoulson> it's just for playing angry birds
[17:18] <ogra_> lol
[17:19] <pitti> good night everyone!
[17:19] <chrisccoulson> good night pitti
[18:31] <mterry> Why oh why is 7zip so highly rated in the software-center?  Isn't it basically redundant in a default install?
[18:32] <mterry> Guh, also Guake.  Seems so techy to be one of the top 12 recommended apps
[18:33] <jcastro> mterry: look up ccsm. :-/
[18:33] <mterry> ccsm search gives nothing, but I found it anyway.  Odd search result.  Needs a keyword
[18:34] <mterry> jcastro, 4/5 isn't so bad.  But Guake has 5/5!
[18:35] <mterry> And 7zip!  5/5 makes me think AAA title, not a compression tool
[18:35]  * mterry unleashes his botnet to upvote deja-dup
[18:41] <Sweetshark> 3.5.2-2ubuntu2 still builds after updates!
[18:41] <Sweetshark> \o/
[18:43] <mterry> Guh, and Guake users also often installed 7zip!  It's a cabal of techies, conspiring to make bad recommendations
[18:43]  * mterry relaxes
[18:46] <mdeslaur> but...ratings has nothing to do with popularity, it's how well a piece of software does it's job....
[18:47] <mdeslaur> why wouldn't 7zip get 5/5...it does it's job perfectly
[18:53] <mterry> mdeslaur, by that token you would rate an app that does the three 3 things it claims to well the same as an app that does those 3 plus 2 more things.  I tend to not only rate an app in a silo, but how it compares to the usefulness of other apps
[18:53] <mterry> Whoa, that needed some copyediting
[18:54] <mdeslaur> mterry: I don't believe most people would use that criteria for rating an app
[18:54] <mdeslaur> unfortunately
[18:54] <mdeslaur> which is why ratings that don't account for popularity will always show simple and specialized apps first
[18:55]  * mterry looks at ratings spec
[18:55] <mdeslaur> and the most useful apps that are the most popular most likely contain an appropriate amount of bugs vs. functionality, which means they get penalized when users hit bugs and give low ratings
[18:58] <mterry> mpt, ^ how much does the software-center take popularity into account when presenting sorted ratings?  (i.e. I was wondering whether 7zip deserves to be in our top 12)
[18:58] <mterry> Couldn't find detailed discussion on wiki spec page for RatingsAndReviews
[19:00] <seb128> mterry, do we have counts on how many users rated it?
[19:00] <seb128> and how that compared to others?
[19:01] <mterry> seb128, no.  It may be the most popular package for all I know.  But I doubt it?
[19:01] <seb128> I would think less users rated a zip utility than an application
[19:01] <seb128> mterry, well you have the number of reviews at least
[19:01] <mterry> seb128, same for guake.  Do that many users really install it?
[19:01]  * mterry doesn't understand people
[19:01] <mterry> Not that guake is bad, just... top 12?
[19:02] <mterry> I'm not even sure what 7zip does that the default-installed file-roller doesn't
[19:02] <seb128> mterry, it supports extra formats
[19:02] <seb128> does it mean our userbase is still well geeky?
[19:03] <seb128> mterry, for the record none of those show in french top rating
[19:03] <mterry> seb128, why are people handing out 5/5s like candy for a couple formats.  Silly users
[19:03] <seb128> but wth, first one in the list is gparted
[19:03] <mterry> seb128, yar.  That one at least is an actual app.
[19:04] <mterry> My one regret is that I have but one vote to give for my ideals
[19:04] <seb128> well top list here is: gparted vlc geany battle_for_wesnoth audacity inkscape
[19:04] <mterry> seb128, yeah, and I bet your wesnoth is 1.8 instead of the 1.10 in the archive
[19:04] <seb128> kile hedgewars filezilla
[19:04] <seb128> mterry, indeed
[19:04] <mdeslaur> I'm not sure number of reviews is a metric...it's easier to review a small app that solved a particular problem
[19:05] <mdeslaur> ie: try to open 7z file with file-roller, doesn't work. Install 7z, file-roller can now open it. Perfect! 5/5
[19:05] <mterry> Heh.  We need to scale reviews by lines of code
[19:05] <seb128> mdeslaur, well it's a metric, deja-dup with a 4.5 score rated with 1500 users should probably be rated over debian-maintainer-tools rated by 5 users with 5 stars
[19:06]  * mterry blushes
[19:06] <seb128> (making up names and numbers)
[19:06] <seb128> but you get the idea
[19:06] <mdeslaur> seb128: yes...but even better would be how many people _installed_ it, and didn't _uninstall_ it after
[19:06] <mterry> seb128, as an aside, after inclusion in main, deja-dup dropped from 4.5 to 4.0
[19:06] <seb128> like something which is pefect for a niche is nice but probably not worth listing before something users by tons of users
[19:06] <mdeslaur> seb128: or by number of times it gets searched for in the dash
[19:06] <seb128> mdeslaur, stop trying to spy users! ;-)
[19:06] <davmor2> seb128 but deja-dup is installed by default now so why would you top-rate it for installing :D
[19:07] <mterry> I believe there are some attempts to be smart about comparing ratings.  Like, things have a different sort rating than visible rating
[19:07] <mdeslaur> seb128: hehe :)
[19:07] <mterry> But I don't know the algorithm, it's not in the wiki
[19:08] <davmor2> mdeslaur: you have to have the app installed in order to rate it
[19:08] <seb128> mterry, s-c is a fail
[19:09] <mterry> seb128, just a minor sorting fail
[19:09] <mterry> seb128, I like it for most things
[19:09] <davmor2> mterry: not sure on the algorithm for weighting see mvo or achuni for more info
[19:09] <seb128> mterry, I type "deja" in the search entry it lists "Ubuntu User 02 (Spanish Edition)"
[19:09] <seb128> mterry, I type deja-dup it lists "debug symbols for package deja-dup"
[19:09] <seb128> nothing else
[19:09] <seb128> how do I get to deja-dup to rate it?
[19:09] <mterry> seb128, I get deja-dup
[19:09] <mterry> seb128, let me look at french keywords
[19:10] <davmor2> seb128: it works fine here
[19:10] <seb128> mterry, well searching for the name should work for sure?
[19:11] <davmor2> seb128: deja dup & deja-dup both show just the deja-dup app and 1 technical item hidden
[19:11] <seb128> mterry, oh, it show when going to "installed"
[19:11] <seb128> not when in "all softwares"
[19:12] <mterry> seb128, hrm.  french keywords have "deja" in it (besides it being in the package name)
[19:12] <seb128> mterry, the 2 french users who let a comment rated it 3 stars
[19:13] <seb128> one complains that you can't see the content of a backup without restoring it
[19:13] <davmor2> seb128: http://ubuntuone.com/4oBjTpp7lJPrJwFjKYEjcR deja-dup in all software
[19:13] <seb128> the other one that can't set your backup hour
[19:13] <mterry> seb128, ah, at least those are both valid complaints.  I get the complaint that you can't restore a single file a lot (which isn't true, but it is a very hidden feature)
[19:13] <seb128> davmor2: doesn't work in french
[19:14] <davmor2> seb128: can you please file a bug for that it should
[19:14] <seb128> will check with mvo first tomorro
[19:14] <seb128> but it's not specific to deja-dup
[19:14] <seb128> like typing gedit in the "all software" category doesn't return it
[19:15] <seb128> hum
[19:15] <seb128> it works after restarting s-c
[19:16] <davmor2> seb128: as for the magazine, they use they're heads and in the keywords they drop the description so get maximum hits which in turn is fairly annoying for most people
[19:29] <mterry> The "default apps" and "removable media" parts of the "Details" system setting panel are 100% unexpected
[19:29]  * mterry is apparently grumpy today
[19:36] <jbicha> I think it's funny how Red Hat thinks their ask questions after install model is a good one
[19:36] <Sweetshark> anyone volunteering to review 15 commits for libreoffice-3.5.2-2ubuntu2: http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg-openoffice/libreoffice.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/ubuntu-precise-3.5 ?
[19:37] <seb128> mterry, there are bugs upstream and upstream about that
[19:37] <jbicha> and it's interesting that they get to push that code into gnome-control-center & gdm
[19:37] <seb128> jbicha, yeah, I was wondering if that's worth arguing or I should just ignore them, we don't use gdm anyway
[19:38] <jbicha> I figure they'll do what they want anyway
[19:38] <seb128> right
[19:38] <seb128> Sweetshark, try asking rene? ;-)
[19:38] <seb128> jbicha, btw, did you notice that "help" is listed in the dash pre-filed list in precise?
[19:38] <seb128> jbicha, the french guys are doing that as well from the desktop guide: http://guide.yoboy.fr/
[19:39] <seb128> jbicha, just to give you some motivation about working on the documentation, the efforts are appreciated even if the design team doesn't always make it looks like it ;-)
[19:40] <jbicha> seb128: where does that pre-filled list come from? because clearing the zeitgeist Privacy doesn't end up with the same result
[19:41] <seb128> jbicha, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/101280704/zeitgeist-datahub_0.8.2-1ubuntu1_0.8.2-1ubuntu2.diff.gz
[19:41] <jbicha> also, we have a soft launch of https://help.ubuntu.com/12.04/ubuntu-help/ which should pick up your browser language
[19:41] <jbicha> soft launch because there's a little more work needed & it's not linked from help.ubuntu.com yet
[19:43] <jbicha> cool, thanks for the links
[19:43] <seb128> jbicha, yw
[19:45] <Sweetshark> seb128: well, that wouldnt work, some of those commit are his own, some are Ubuntu specifics that he doesnt care about ....
[19:45] <seb128> Sweetshark, ok, I might try to have a look tomorrow but not today
[19:46] <dupondje> Any recommendations for a IDE to write GTK apps ?
[19:46] <seb128> dupondje, anjuta?
[19:47] <seb128> that's sort of the "official" GNOME IDE
[19:47] <dupondje> lets try it out
[19:47] <seb128> it's not great but mostly do the job
[19:47] <seb128> not sure there is one I would call "great"
[19:47] <seb128> that's one of things we lack :-(
[19:47] <dupondje> Eclipse + plugins isn't bettter ?
[19:47] <dupondje> :)
[19:47] <kenvandine> i've never found one i wanted to use :(
[19:48] <seb128> some people speak highly about qtcreator
[19:48] <ogra_> vi
[19:48] <ogra_> :)
[19:48] <dobey> haha anjuta
[19:48] <kenvandine> ogra_, that is what i use :)
[19:48] <seb128> well it's qt, but it's quite nice apparently
[19:48] <dobey> i think emacs is more an official GNOME IDE than anjuta is
[19:48] <seb128> gedit is ok enough
[19:48] <seb128> but it's not really an IDE
[19:48] <seb128> though there are quite some addons for integrated commands, documentations, etc
[19:49] <seb128> once configured it's quite nice to use
[19:49] <dobey> there's also monodevelop of course
[19:50] <kenvandine> oh firefox... why do you eat my memory
[19:51] <dupondje> because I change my version every 2 weeks, but do not improve? :)
[19:51] <Sweetshark> seb128: no hurry, it will build a few days afterwards anyway ;)
[19:51] <dobey> kenvandine: omnom
[19:53] <Sweetshark> seb128: having it in not too long after release would still be good. I guess, bug 975430 will collect quite a few dupes ...
[19:53] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 975430 in libreoffice ""Find" crashes the program (dup-of: 975503)" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/975430
[19:53] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 975503 in libreoffice ""Find" crashes Libreoffice (GTK)" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/975503
[20:23] <mterry> Wait.... UDS is in Oakland?  I'm flying into San Fran...  Did I do wrong?
[20:24]  * mterry wonders why he thought San Fran.  I guess the two airports are pretty close
[20:28] <jbicha> mterry: yeah they are close, you should be able to take the BART train over or something
[20:29] <micahg> ay caramba
[20:29] <jbicha> but I may not know what I'm talking about either
[20:30] <mterry> jbicha, you're right, the wiki has instructions for taking BART from both.  Good.  :)  Thought I screwed up
[20:32] <jbicha> I'm trying to figure out if it's worth going since I can only be there for Thursday & Friday
[21:18] <Chipaca> mterry: the wiki says to fly into sfo and take the bart
[21:18] <Chipaca> mterry: if you take the homer, you're way out
[21:20] <dobey> tedg: for Python testing with dbus stuff, I'd suggest using ubuntuone-dev-tools :)
[21:27] <tedg> dobey, Which do...
[21:29] <dobey> tedg: we have u1trial which is a test runner that does some extra stuff on top of twisted's trial, and a DBusTestCase, which will have u1trial automatically start a dbus daemon and validate it, for your tests to use
[21:30] <dobey> tedg: we also have a similar test case for Squid to test proxy support with, and some other useful checks and things
[21:31] <tedg> dobey, Do you manage other dbus services?  Or how do you set those up?
[21:31] <tedg> (on the new bus)
[21:33] <dobey> tedg: no, generally you fake things. it's more for unit testing and avoiding screwing up user's data, than end-to-end integration testing
[21:33] <dobey> but a lot of session services make life hard
[21:34] <tedg> dobey, Ah, okay.  Yeah.  I'm using it a bunch for validating things like dbusmenu which have a two sided interaction.
[21:34] <dobey> tedg: yeah we do stuff like that as well. we start up the dbus interface of ubuntuone-syncdaemon inside the tests, and make the dbus calls, for example
[21:35] <dobey> but there isn't really a general way to do that so much, and since it's python, loading an individual class that does that stuff is easy
[21:35] <dobey> such testing is a bit harder in languages like C :)
[21:36] <tedg> dobey, Never!  C is perfect!
[21:37] <dobey> then what do you need tests for?
[21:38] <tedg> dobey, We have a company founded by a Python-lover, so he thinks tests are useful ;-)
[23:49] <RAOF> Hey, what happened to <super><right> for half-maximisation?


[03:03] <liuxg> elopio, ping
[08:40] <zyga> good morning
[08:56] <LefterisJP> morning
[09:20] <NoiZeR> morning
[09:37] <JamesTait> Good morning all!  Happy Tuesday, and happy Australia Day! 😃
[11:02] <mvo> kgunn: hey, if I can help with updating your mir snap, please do let me know
[11:53] <asac> mvo: do i name the vmlinuz just like that in a snap or shall i append the -KERNELVERSION?
[11:53] <asac> same for system.map etcv.
[12:07] <mvo> asac: sorry, I disconnected, it has to be named vmlinux and initird.img for now, but that is a bug
[12:09] <diwic> I've defined a git URL in "parts: pulseaudio: source:", but when I run "snapcraft pull", it does not seem to download anything. Help? (I'm using 16.04 version of snapcraft.)
[12:14] <asac> mvo: vmlinux or vmlinuz?
[12:15] <mvo> asac: vmlinuz
[12:15] <mvo> asac: sorry
[12:23] <asac> mvo: can you look into this one: https://people.canonical.com/~asac/kernel-snap-example_0_amd64.snap
[12:23] <asac> and tell me beyond not appending the version is missing?
[12:23] <asac> (ignore the odd initrd name)
[12:24] <mvo> asac: sure, I check after lunch
[12:30] <diwic> found it
[12:56] <mvo> asac: from a quick look it looks great, I can give it a test in a vm next. you can use symlinks for the vmlinuz, its just needed right now so that grub can find it
[13:35] <dholbach> kyrofa: thanks for the reviews
[13:36] <dholbach> (https://github.com/ubuntu-core/snapcraft/pull/256 has the fix you were asking for)
[13:37] <kyrofa> dholbach, thanks for the fixes :)
[13:39] <kyrofa> dholbach, for what it's worth, snappy logs <package name>.<service name> doesn't seem to work for me on 15.04. Is that a 16.04 thing?
[13:39] <dholbach> https://github.com/ubuntu-core/snapcraft/pull/242 is updated now too
[13:39] <dholbach> kyrofa: this was part of the 15.04 appdev manual - let me check
[13:40] <kyrofa> dholbach, yeah sanity check me there.  Thoughts?
[13:45] <dholbach> kyrofa: what works for me in rolling/edge is: sudo snappy service logs shout (for shout.sergiusens)
[13:46] <dholbach> let me check for 15.04
[13:46] <kyrofa> dholbach, ah indeed-- but no .servicename eh?
[13:46] <kyrofa> dholbach, that works on 15.04 as well
[13:47] <dholbach> kyrofa: I thought about it too, but thought that if we split up our docs into "what's interesting for app developers?" and "what's general/structural information?" and "what does a device builder need to know?" ... I feel it belongs in the app context
[13:47] <dholbach> kyrofa: yep - looks like it... ok, let me fix that
[13:47] <kyrofa> dholbach, good deal, you're the pro there
[13:47] <dholbach> kyrofa: but if we were to move the doc I guess that'd be fine with me too
[13:47] <dholbach> it's just how I tried to explain the situation to myself ;-)
[13:48] <kyrofa> dholbach, heh, I really just want what is most clear to developers. And you're right-- they're probably using snapcraft to make the .snap, so why not have general .snap development guides there?
[13:48] <kyrofa> dholbach, of course, once you have the syncing all done to developer.ubuntu.com, it matters less
[13:48] <dholbach> if we want, we can still go and split it up or move it elsewhere - I'm happy to do that if we have concensus
[13:49] <kyrofa> dholbach, no I'm happy with that :)
[13:49] <dholbach> cool
[13:50] <diwic> awe_, so I was wondering about the autotools plugin - two questions:
[13:50] <kyrofa> dholbach, snappy-debug has been around for a while now. Any idea when it'll actually include gdb, strace, ltrace, etc.?
[13:51] <dholbach> jdstrand: ^ do you know if this coming soon or who might be working on it?
[13:51] <diwic> awe_, 1) I have build headers installed on my local development machines, but not all dev headers are (yet) in "stage-packages".
[13:52] <diwic> awe_, this seems to have the surprising result that ./configure detects them but gcc does not?
[13:52] <awe_> hmmm, that sounds odd; probably something wrong in your Makefile.in
[13:52] <kyrofa> diwic, dev headers don't need to be in stage-packages
[13:53] <diwic> kyrofa, where should they be, then?
[13:53] <awe_> kyrofa, build-packages instead?
[13:53] <kyrofa> awe_, indeed. diwic snapcraft will use your system-installed packages for building, but you need to make sure stage-packages sets it up for run-time
[13:53] <awe_> kyrofa, nobody's ever truly explained the diff between the two.  I use build-packages for build tools ( eg. pkg-config ) and stage-packages for dev-headers
[13:54] <awe_> and I also build in a lxc container
[13:54] <awe_> that I can reset to it's initial state
[13:54] <awe_> so that I know my dependencies are correct
[13:54] <dholbach> kyrofa: thanks for the reviews - I'll check if there's any other new content to add to snapcraft :-)
[13:54] <kyrofa> diwic, so put mylib-dev in build-packages, and mylib in stage-packages
[13:55] <diwic> kyrofa, ok
[13:55] <kyrofa> dholbach, I'm loving the docs!
[13:55] <kyrofa> diwic, build-packages install on the host (and don't go into the .snap), stage-packages go into the .snap
[13:55] <awe_> kyrofa, but if you put -dev in stage-packages, it automatically pulls in the lib, and then you can just not snap the dev headers
[13:55] <diwic> 2) whenever you add or remove anything in stage- or build-packages, you have to manually remove parts/pulseaudio/state for the changes to take effect. Is this expected?
[13:56] <awe_> stage-packages only go in the snap if you tell them to...
[13:56] <awe_> diwic, did you try using snapcraft clean?
[13:56] <kyrofa> awe_, hmm... stage-packages go into the snap unless you filter them out somehow with the stage/snap keywords
[13:56] <awe_> instead?
[13:56] <awe_> kyrofa, which I'm currently doing...
[13:57] <awe_> so I guess it's a style thing
[13:57] <kyrofa> awe_, I suppose :P
[13:57] <awe_> but your approach makes sense
[13:58] <diwic> awe_, *testing* hmm, that works too, but that re-clones the git repo too
[13:58] <awe_> I'm not sure if there's a way to clean the build w/out clobbering the source(s)
[13:59] <awe_> seems like you figured out a way to cheat by manually removing the file
[14:00] <diwic> I mean, there is code to check if there's a git repo and if so update it (rather than wipe and clone), when is that code supposed to be run?
[14:01] <awe_> diwic, I'm not sure...  you could check the snapcraft source directly; it's all-python
[14:01] <diwic> awe_, already hacked it ;-)
[14:01] <awe_> ;D
[14:02] <diwic> awe_, the git server I'm working against (just as a test) didn't support --depth=1 so I had to remove that
[14:02] <kyrofa> diwic, I've never heard of that. What software is running on the server?
[14:05] <diwic> kyrofa, no idea - git://anonscm.debian.org/pkg-pulseaudio/pulseaudio.git is the URL I'm currently testing with
[14:05] <diwic> (again - might change that to something else later, this is just to get started)
[14:07] <jdstrand> dholbach: I don't, no. mvo may have more info
[14:07] <dholbach> mvo: ^ kyrofa asked earlier: snappy-debug has been around for a while now. Any idea when it'll actually include gdb, strace, ltrace, etc.?
[14:07] <dholbach> thanks jdstrand
[14:09] <diwic> awe_, 3) I was also wondering about https://github.com/ubuntu-core/snapcraft/blob/master/snapcraft/plugins/autotools.py#L85 - it ends with '--prefix=', looks weird
[14:09] <diwic> awe_, what is the prefix set to and how?
[14:09] <kyrofa> diwic, huh, looks like other people have hit that as well, and no one seems to know why. Perhaps you should use a snapshot .tar.gz from gitweb
[14:10] <kyrofa> diwic, https://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg-pulseaudio/pulseaudio.git
[14:11] <awe_> diwic, I guess it depends on how self.options.configflags is initialized
[14:11] <awe_> I'll check when I do my next build
[14:11] <awe_> I'm in the middle of a change right now
[14:11] <diwic> sure
[14:11] <awe_> that said, my builds were working fine last night
[14:12] <kyrofa> diwic, --prefix= means "no prefix". You can still set the prefix in the configflags though
[14:12] <diwic> kyrofa, ok
[14:13] <kyrofa> diwic, autotools takes the last one
[14:13] <awe_> guess that explain that; thanks kyrofa
[14:14] <kyrofa> awe_, hey, any time :)
[14:14] <diwic> kyrofa, anyhow, so now I need to add --disable-A,  --disable-B,  --disable-C etc in configflags in order for it to skip that dependency (otherwise it'll find it as it is installed on the system)
[14:15] <awe_> are you asking how to do this?
[14:15] <awe_> configflags:
[14:16] <kyrofa> diwic, yeah, should be easy with configflags
[14:16] <diwic> awe_, I'm asking whether this is actually the desired behaviour? It seems less error prone if the part being built did *not* find system-installed headers
[14:16] <awe_> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/14671891/
[14:17] <diwic> awe_, and it seems even stranger that configure finds them but not gcc
[14:17] <awe_> well.. you are running configure right?
[14:17] <awe_> again, that's probably because the Makefile.in is wrong
[14:17] <awe_> gcc only finds what you tell it
[14:18] <diwic> awe_, you have to excuse me for thinking the problem is snappy rather than Makefile.in
[14:18] <awe_> diwic, it's new, and it's changing rapidly.  It *might* be a snapcraft thing, but off the top of my head, it sounds more like a Makefile.in thing
[14:19] <diwic> awe_, based on the fact that snappy is very new and Makefile.in/pulseaudio is several years old, builds on many architectures and autogenerated by autotools
[14:19] <awe_> sure, but you'll need to dig in and see what's really happening
[14:19] <diwic> awe_, yeah
[14:19] <awe_> if it is a snapcraft bug, then please report it!  ;)-
[14:19] <awe_> I noticed yesterday that snapcraft --help seems to be broken in 2.0
[14:20]  * awe_ needs to check if that's already been filed
[14:20] <kyrofa> awe_ can you define "broken"?
[14:21] <awe_> it generates a stacktrace
[14:21] <kyrofa> awe_, *cough* sound broken
[14:21] <awe_> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/14671916/
[14:22] <kyrofa> Ah, wait I think I read about that on the mailing list. Due to a lack of locale setting or something
[14:23] <kyrofa> Definitely a bug that it's not handled in snapcraft, but you can work around it by setting your locale
[14:23] <kyrofa> awe_, ^^
[14:24] <awe_> kyrofa, thanks.  It's more of annoyance than anything else
[14:24] <awe_> but I'll give that a try
[14:24] <awe_> if/when I next need to refer to the help
[14:24] <awe_> been grokin' the source instead
[14:25] <kyrofa> awe_ are you running out of master? Or using 2.0.1 on xenial?
[14:25] <awe_> the latter
[14:28] <dholbach> kyrofa: I bet it's the “ and ” in the help text
[14:28] <awe_> kyrofa, is it possible to add a multi-line description in snapcraft.yaml?  This seems to cause grief whenever I try to do so
[14:28] <dholbach> changing them to " should probably make it work
[14:29] <kyrofa> awe_ indeed, use YAML-foo!
[14:29] <kyrofa> dholbach, brilliant! I'm trying to figure out how to UNset my locale to test :P
[14:29] <awe_> ?
[14:29] <kyrofa> awe_, heh, hold on
[14:29] <kyrofa> awe_ https://stackoverflow.com/questions/3790454/in-yaml-how-do-i-break-a-string-over-multiple-lines
[14:29] <kyrofa> awe_ does that help?
[14:30] <kyrofa> awe_ it's just YAML, so anything YAML supports, snapcraft supports
[14:30] <kgunn> so i just moved to snapcraft 2.0
[14:30] <awe_> yes, of course it appears there are nine different ways to do it!  groan
[14:30] <awe_> welcome to the party kgunn!
[14:30] <kgunn> i used to be able to muck with my snap (fka apps) files
[14:30] <kyrofa> awe_ hahaha
[14:30] <kgunn> but now i can't
[14:30]  * kgunn looks for disco ball
[14:31] <kgunn> anyone know of a trick ?
[14:31] <kyrofa> kgunn, I don't quite understand
[14:31] <kyrofa> kgunn, can you define "muck"? :P
[14:31] <kgunn> kyrofa: so i have a script a-la /snaps/app.sideload/bin/dostuff
[14:31] <kgunn> i used to just stop my service
[14:31] <kgunn> tweak it
[14:32] <kgunn> but...it just refuses to become writable
[14:32] <awe_> ah
[14:32] <awe_> probably the change in file format of the snaps
[14:32] <kyrofa> kgunn, yeah squashfs
[14:32] <kgunn> yeah figure
[14:32] <kgunn> but is there a trick to circumvent
[14:33] <awe_> yea, but you need some squashfs foo, to be able to do so.. I looked at this yesterday, and decided it wasn't worth the trouble
[14:33] <kgunn> lol
[14:33] <kyrofa> kgunn, hmm.... not that I know of I'm afraid
[14:33] <awe_> if you figure it out, please share the wealth
[14:34] <kgunn> sure :)
[14:34] <kyrofa> kgunn, I see guides for layering unionfs on top of squashfs to add write capabilities, which to me means squashfs just doesn't support writing
[14:35] <kgunn> ack
[14:35] <kyrofa> elopio, agh, sorry I'm late, got distracted
[14:39] <mvo> dholbach: no really good idea at this point, hopefully soon when the store lands support for per-architecture snap
[14:39] <awe_> kyrofa, seems on the "flow" style line wrapping methods are supported which strip any embedded new lines...
[14:39] <mvo> dholbach: snaps
[14:39] <mvo> dholbach: right now it would have to be a pretty big snap that is a bit tricky to build
[14:45] <elopio> fgimenez: ping. Could you ssh?
[14:58] <dholbach> kyrofa: ^ see what mvo said?
[15:00] <kyrofa> dholbach, yeah, good info. I'm a little worried a developer might miss the "snappy-debug only includes security right now" note and wonder why he can't use strace after reading the docs
[15:01] <kyrofa> dholbach, what do you think?
[15:03] <asac> mvo: is there the notion of a type: in snap.yamnl still?
[15:04] <asac> e.g. should snapcraft learn about type: kernel? etc.?
[15:04] <mvo> asac: yes
[15:05] <asac> mvo: did you take a look at the .sanp? i uploaded a new one
[15:06] <dholbach> kyrofa: ok, let me change it a little bit
[15:06] <asac> kyrofa: does snapcraft already allow me to use type: kernel ? e.g. in the yaml?
[15:07] <asac> ../../bin/snapcraft clean
[15:07] <asac> Issues while validating snapcraft.yaml: 'kernel' is not one of ['app']
[15:07] <asac> ok seems not
[15:07] <mvo> asac: should I test it?
[15:07]  * asac checks and adds
[15:07] <asac> mvo: well, the initrd has modules only
[15:07] <asac> beyond that is there anything missing compared from what you added?
[15:08] <mvo> asac: I think its fine, won't work right now because we don't have the generic-initrd yet, but that is something someone needs to work on soon
[15:09] <kyrofa> asac, yeah I don't think so yet
[15:09] <asac> mvo: lool is experimenting with how to concat those initrd
[15:09] <asac> in the bootloaders
[15:10] <asac> kyrofa: ok... i will incolude that in my mammoth patchset :)
[15:10] <asac> was just a scheme patch
[15:10] <mvo> asac: cool
[15:10] <mvo> asac: accoridng to apw its really just "cat initird1 initird2> initrd.img" and the kernel will DTRT
[15:11] <asac> lool: will you work on getting an indep initrd into OS snap from our builders?
[15:11] <asac> yeah
[15:11] <asac> but we prefer to not concat on disk
[15:11] <asac> but rather from bootloader
[15:11] <asac> e.g. have them load both files and just boot
[15:11] <mvo> asac: if the boorloader supports it
[15:11] <asac> thats what lool is testing now
[15:11] <mvo> asac: I think for grub thats fine and we can do that
[15:11] <asac> e.g. grub + u-boot
[15:11] <asac> think both could work
[15:11] <dholbach> kyrofa: updated - let me know if it's cleare now :)
[15:12] <lool> (I'm installing the test machine ATM)
[15:12] <asac> cool
[15:12] <mvo> asac: but uboot seems to not support it, but that is ok because for uboot we need to extract the kernel and initird anyway so we might as well do more magic
[15:12] <apw> they need to be next ot each other in memory and the right bracketing start,length passed to the kernel
[15:12] <asac> uboot allows to load to raw mem position
[15:12] <mvo> asac: trouble if of course rollback, once we combine them on disk everything becomes harder
[15:12] <asac> so trick is to just load the two files neck to neck
[15:12] <kyrofa> dholbach, ah, yeah that works :)
[15:12] <asac> yeah
[15:12] <mvo> asac: yeah, uboot is flexible enough for that
[15:12] <lool> apw: is there an easy well to tell grub / u-boot to do this, or do we need to write all the tiny scripting logic to compute the addresses and kernel args?
[15:12] <asac> uboot needs to have special boot partition anyway right?
[15:13] <asac> or can we read squshfs etc. there?
[15:13] <lool> no we cant
[15:13] <mvo> asac: it has special handling
[15:13] <lool> albeit there are patches to run grub-efi as a payload to u-boot now
[15:13] <asac> right. so arm still needs to gert files put into special place
[15:13] <apw> lool, can't say as i have ever looked at it, typically initrds are single things loaded and that sets the kernel data at the same time
[15:13] <asac> we can as well concat them when doing that
[15:13] <asac> but having them cleanly separate is surely better
[15:13] <asac> guess also for trusted boot etc.
[15:14] <asac> lool: grub allows just list of files for initrd
[15:14] <asac> i found on some blog
[15:14] <lool> apw: IIUC, the concatenation only works for init ramdisks, not initramfses; is there a big difference between the two we shoudl be worried about?
[15:14] <asac> so just initrd list of files
[15:14] <lool> asac: ah cool
[15:14] <asac> uboot you have to somewaht load first, then parse the end address
[15:15] <asac> and load second to that
[15:15] <apw> lool, it only works for the initramfs format ones, ie the cpio.gz style ones, those can be concantenated and the kernel will unpakc them all into the kernel root ramdisk before entering it
[15:16] <lool> apw: and are all kernel compression types supported, or only gz?
[15:16] <lool> is it ok if we do gz?
[15:16] <apw> lool, i believe its all of the initrd compression types which are enabled in your kernel config
[15:18] <asac> lool: http://savannah.gnu.org/bugs/?35238
[15:18] <asac> not sure how it was fixed
[15:18] <asac> but seems it got fixed
[15:20] <Sweet5hark> trying to setup a vagrant snappy image results in ssh timeout failure on "vagrant up" ...
[15:20] <asac> apw: is it very dirty (or even breaks) to ship the full modules.dep if i only have a subset of the modules (e.g. ship the full in the initrd)?
[15:22] <apw> asac, it is just a dependancy list, so i would expect that to be non-fatally "wrong"
[15:22] <qengho> Are there xenial snappy test images for download? I can't find any.
[15:22] <asac> ok here status quo ... https://github.com/asac/snapcraft/commits/kbuild-kernel-wip for those taht want to produce not-yet-booting kernel snaps
[15:22] <apw> asac, though if the device dependant parts contain nonoverlapping subsets it is not clear how you can make a correct one in the generic bit anyhow, as it does not list the non-gneeric bits
[15:22] <asac> https://github.com/asac/snapcraft/blob/kbuild-kernel-wip/examples/kernel/snapcraft.yaml
[15:23] <apw> asac, or indeed visa-versa
[15:23] <asac> apw: hmm. well its that i managed to filter the right modules out of my local build, just dont want to write code to remake a modules.dep with just that subset
[15:23] <asac> e.g. i am using it from the right tree (not the generic one)
[15:23] <asac> (if i understood your comment correctly)
[15:24] <Sweet5hark> Showing the VM in the VirtualBox UI gives me a something apparently looping a kernel boot again and again. any hints?
[15:25] <asac> utlemming: ^^
[15:25] <asac> Sweet5hark: utlemming is vagrant/vbox expert... not sure if he is around today though
[15:25] <NoiZeR> hello, im busy with compiling Boost on Ubuntu 14.04 LTS but does i need to compile it before i make a snap of it?
[15:26] <utlemming> Sweet5hark: I've seen that once before and it was the CPU.
[15:26] <utlemming> Sweet5hark: can you capture what happens immediately before reboot?
[15:29] <NoiZeR> Or can i just install boost itself on snappy?
[15:30] <Sweet5hark> utlemming: any hints on what to press to prevent the box from rebooting right away?
[15:31] <asac> NoiZeR: you can use snapcraft to pull the binaries from archive
[15:31] <asac> into your snaop
[15:35] <NoiZeR> ok do you know where the binaries are?
[15:36] <NoiZeR> asac see above
[15:36] <kyrofa> elopio, would you mind taking a look at https://github.com/ubuntu-core/snapcraft/pull/210 when you have a chance? I want one more pair of eyes
[15:37] <asac> NoiZeR: dont know if i understand your question
[15:37] <asac> do you know the ubuntu packages you want?
[15:37] <asac> i would suggest to start with making a xenial chroot, and then use apt-cache search and apt-get isntall to find what you need
[15:38] <asac> once you have the packages you can use stage-packages: field in snapcraft.yaml to ensure those get put into your snap
[15:38] <asac> alongside with your app etc.
[15:39] <NoiZeR> but i want that as framework because the C++ boost library needs to be available everywhere
[15:40] <NoiZeR> asac
[15:41] <NoiZeR> ps im a total noob on Snappy just started
[15:43] <asac> NoiZeR: if you dont need have one runtime instance (e.g. a mediating service/agent) then dont feel bad about folks including copies in their snaps for now
[15:44] <asac> make it easy to include it through having a snapcraft part etc.
[15:54] <kyrofa> elopio, travis has been failing left and right yesterday and today
[15:59] <kyrofa> elopio, hahaha, what is the standard on the copyrights? sergio told him to just make it 2016, I would have made it 2015-2016, and you said 2015, 2016
[15:59] <elopio> kyrofa: you have to put every year the file was touched. And according to the fsf, if you use the - you have to documment that usage.
[16:00] <elopio> so I prefer to use the ,
[16:00] <elopio> but of course, nobody pays attention to fsf and this is just a nit.
[16:00] <kyrofa> elopio, ah, excellent. I'll remember it!
[16:01] <asac> two years use a , ... more years use a -
[16:01] <asac> my 2c
[16:02] <elopio> asac: https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-howto.html
[16:02] <kyrofa> elopio, for your admiration: http://pasteboard.co/15kdW9WN.jpg
[16:02] <elopio> sixth paragraph
[16:03] <elopio> kyrofa: wow.
[16:04] <kyrofa> elopio, I don't need to work out for a week after that job
[16:04] <elopio> here we have cozy 23 degrees C, with no clouds in the sky.
[16:05] <elopio> kyrofa: did you do it all the way to the car?
[16:06] <kyrofa> elopio, yeah
[16:06] <elopio> I'm impressed.
[16:12] <tedg> kyrofa: http://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-magazine-monitor-30119410
[16:12] <tedg> kyrofa: I'm not saying living someplace with snow can kill you, the BBC is :-)
[16:13] <kyrofa> tedg, haha
[16:25] <mvo> JamesTait: hi, do you still need a meta/snap.yaml example snap?
[16:26] <JamesTait> mvo, I believe I have one (shout.seriusens), thank you.
[16:26]  * JamesTait can't type for toffee today.
[16:28] <JamesTait> And I've now got the documentation for the internal snappy format, so I *think* that's everything I need to get started.  But I'll shout up if I find I'm missing anything.
[16:28] <mvo> JamesTait: cool, http://people.canonical.com/~mvo/tmp/hello-world_3.0_all.snap is also one
[16:28]  * JamesTait hugs mvo.
[16:29] <JamesTait> Thank you very much - having a couple of package to test with will be a great help.
[16:29] <mvo> JamesTait: I think for you and the metadata you need its almost identical to package.yaml, name, version are the same, vendor is no more, description comes from yaml instead of readme.md
[16:29] <mvo> JamesTait: your welcome, shout if you need anything :)
[16:42] <kyrofa> Well hey there sergiusens. I figured you'd be sleeping most of today
[16:43] <asac> sergiusens: kyrofa: https://github.com/ubuntu-core/snapcraft/pull/257 is green now :)
[16:50] <sergiusens> asac, bloody timing, I added some review comments :-P
[16:51] <lool> asac: sorry took me a while to confirm, but it works
[16:51] <fgimenez> elopio, disk space seems to be ok in the last server deployed http://paste.ubuntu.com/14672859/
[16:51] <lool> asac: I cpio -i extracted snappy initrd, then split it into two dirs (moved lib/modules to a different one) then repacked
[16:52] <lool> asac: one key thing to pay attention to is that xz compression doesn't work but lzma does
[16:52] <sergiusens> kyrofa, I am super tired, but I also flew business (with a proper bed) so its not that bad
[16:52] <lool> it's very similar but not identical
[16:52] <lool> so just use "lzma" to compress
[16:52] <elopio> fgimenez: great.
[16:52] <lool> asac: I added break=top to cmdline to confirm that the initrd was fully populated, and then I completed a successful boot too
[16:52] <kyrofa> sergiusens, well take it easy today :)
[16:53] <lool> asac: next step is making sure our OS snap includes a generic initrd
[16:53] <asac> lool: you know the magic cli arguments for xz initrd packgin?
[16:53] <asac> just in case
[16:53] <asac> lool: so you could load two files from bootloader?
[16:53] <asac> and it was just one disk merged?
[16:53] <lool> asac: find . | cpio -c -H newc
[16:53] <lool> then lzma the result
[16:54] <lool> (you can pipe it directly too)
[16:54] <lool> probably better compression not to though
[16:55] <lool> asac: I used the initrd part1.img part2.img syntax you mentioned
[16:55] <lool> worked fine
[16:55] <lool> didn't try with u-boot, probably need to compute offsets myself there
[16:55] <lool> which wont be fun
[16:55] <lool> there also seems to be some alignment constraints
[16:55] <lool> apparently you can mix various types of compressions (or no compression) on the grub initrd line; not sure if this is a grub or linux thing though
[16:56] <asac> hmm. guess grub might do the uncompressing then?
[16:56] <asac> i would say its not good to mix :)
[16:56] <lool> it might be linux
[16:57] <asac> figuring that compression changes mid file? i doubt it :)
[16:57] <asac> but you newver know
[16:57] <lool> in fact, it's more likely linux as grub didn't bark at teh xz compression but linux failed to boot
[16:57] <lool> as in it panicked
[16:57] <fgimenez> elopio, i see that the build jobs are restricted by label in the config https://github.com/ubuntu-core/snappy-jenkins/blob/master/containers/jenkins-master/config/jobs/create-cloud-image-all-snaps/config.xml#L32
[16:57] <asac> yeah
[16:57] <asac> lool: so i could only use xz with funnny cli arguments
[16:57] <asac> let me find them
[16:57] <fgimenez> elopio, but not in the deployed server http://<IP_ADDRESS>:8080/job/create-cloud-image-vivid/configure
[16:57] <lool> asac: it's not midfile, linux gets the cpio header from the first piece
[16:57] <lool> it knows how long the initrd will be
[16:57] <asac> lool: xz --check=crc32 --lzma2=dict=512KiB inputfile
[16:57] <asac> thats how it works
[16:57] <lool> yeah
[16:58] <lool> lzma is simpler to type  :-)
[16:58] <asac> otherwise it always panicked for me not being able to uncompress initrd
[16:58] <asac> is it the same? no idea
[16:58] <asac>  :)
[16:58] <lool> lzma is what I used
[16:58] <lool> it's lzmo compression anyway
[16:58] <asac> rihht, but above also works
[16:58] <asac> yeah
[16:58] <asac> kind of
[16:58] <asac> something is different afaik :)
[16:58] <lool> perhaps I should test this on rpi2
[16:59] <asac> not compression, but maybe contgainer
[16:59] <asac> yeah do it
[16:59] <asac> just two uinitrds and then load it with manual address offset for now
[16:59] <lool> albeit if we're not doing squashfs loading there, there's no point in smarts to laod multiple initrds
[16:59] <lool> we dont use uinitrd AFAIK
[16:59] <asac> well, its good
[16:59] <lool> just plain initrds
[16:59] <asac> at least no need to add merge logic
[16:59] <elopio> fgimenez: that makes no sense.
[16:59] <asac> and if they are on disk
[16:59] <asac> there migth be stuff with secure boot
[16:59] <asac> as we can validate the signatures as they were shipped
[17:00] <asac> lool: dunno... uboot needs to load initrd... thought it needs the mkimage  header
[17:00] <asac> ifg not, then even easier i guess
[17:00] <asac> maybe you can even do fatload file1 file2?
[17:00] <asac> :)
[17:00] <fgimenez> elopio, maybe we are creating the job before any slave with that label is available? that shouldn't be a problem imo...
[17:01] <elopio> fgimenez: when that happens, the job config just prints a warning.
[17:01] <lool> asac: as I said, it does not
[17:01] <asac> lool: anyway, i was hoping for your magic to make the uboot script do rthe right thing :)
[17:01] <elopio> but you can still create it. so weird...
[17:01] <lool> we dont use the mkimage headers
[17:01] <asac> e.g. address calc
[17:01] <asac> good
[17:01] <asac> but uImage?
[17:01] <lool> fatload multiple args is quite certainly incorrect as the initrds need alignment
[17:02] <lool> we dont use uimage
[17:02] <asac> really? wow :)
[17:02] <elopio> fgimenez: maybe canRoam needs to be false.
[17:02] <lool> uimage is only required for flash baked u-boot payloads; if built with the right configs, u-boot will happilly start a regular initrd
[17:02] <asac> guess that puts u-boot rquirement really high
[17:02] <asac> like 2014 crack
[17:02] <lool> just one config
[17:02] <fgimenez> elopio, the rest of things seem to be in place, once the images and packages are built we are ready to go
[17:02] <lool> it's mainly something that we need to make sure the boards enable
[17:02] <elopio> I tried manually adding the label, and that value changes
[17:03] <asac> right, which is the problem with putting sophisticated requirements on bootloaders :)
[17:03] <asac> anyway, lets give it a go
[17:03] <elopio> fgimenez: I'll made the change manually, and propose a branch for the next deploy.
[17:03] <asac> if you can figure the offset calc in uboot.scr
[17:03] <asac> you are my hero :)
[17:03] <asac> and we can go directly to making the plat-indep[ initrd in OS snap
[17:04] <lool> I wonder whether we'd be better off with using grub-efi on top of u-boot at this point
[17:05] <lool> asac: I'll try to repro on snapdragon or on rpi2 tonight, just to make sure there's no arch specific support issue there, then we can see which bootloader path we take
[17:06] <fgimenez> elopio, ok, leaving, have a great day
[17:07] <asac> lool: i dont know... feels thats even more sophisticated
[17:07] <asac> snapdragon has new uboot
[17:07] <asac> try something with old too
[17:09] <lool> asac: the thing with grub-efi is that it's a single thing to worry about enabling in u-boot, and hten we can use the same logic everywhere
[19:56] <pindonga> elopio, kudos on the xenial mp! :)
[19:56] <elopio> :D
[19:58] <pindonga> elopio, can I ask you to lobby for my MP with sergiusens ? ;-)
[20:15] <kyrofa> elopio, I'm trying to duplicate the lack of locale settings that causes snapcraft --help to barf a stacktrace on an lxc where it works fine
[20:15] <kyrofa> elopio, help?
[20:20] <kyrofa> sergiusens, you could probabyl answer that as well ^^
[20:39] <elopio> kyrofa: take a look at the new .travis.yml
[20:39] <elopio> create a lxc following the same steps, and it won't have the locales set.
[20:39] <elopio> we need utf-8 to run some unicode tests, so I changed runtests.sh to set the language.
[20:40] <elopio> remove that, run the tests, and you'll get an error.
[20:40] <kyrofa> elopio, alright, thanks :)
[20:40] <elopio> kyrofa: however, my theory is that the error came from the unicode copyright symbol on some files. That's fixed already.
[20:41] <elopio> if my theory is correct, the unicode chars from the tests won't get imported, and you'll be able to run snapcraft in ascii.
[20:41] <kyrofa> elopio, or the quotation marks (dholbach noticed those)
[20:41] <elopio> hum, I didn't see them. Great we have more eyes :)
[21:09] <kyrofa> elopio, I know you've reviewed https://github.com/ubuntu-core/snapcraft/pull/209 . Do you have a sec for a question on it?
[21:10] <elopio> kyrofa: I just took a quick look and didn't fully understand the tests. What's your question
[21:10] <elopio> ?
[21:10] <kyrofa> elopio, yeah you had a good catch there
[21:10] <kyrofa> elopio, so right now, the copy plugin follows symlinks and copies in the original file, so no symlinks end up in the .snap
[21:11] <kyrofa> elopio, his change adds the ability to do the opposite, which is copy the symlinks themselves as leave them as links, even if they point outside the .snap. I think you and I agree that's not a good idea
[21:11] <elopio> kyrofa: that would be when this PR lands, right?
[21:12] <elopio> ah right, the default is true.
[21:12] <elopio> kyrofa: yes, I would like us to help people building correct snaps.
[21:12] <kyrofa> elopio, right. Thing is: if that PR gets fixed to prevent incorrect snaps, is there any downside to using symlinks all the time? i.e. why make it an option?
[21:13] <elopio> kyrofa: hum, that question means we need a good integration test for this branch.
[21:13] <elopio> I thought that you would have a link to a file, and you want both to end up in your snap.
[21:14] <elopio> but I suppose there are times when you want to keep only the real file, and get rid of the link.
[21:14] <kyrofa> elopio, ah, I was just thinking if the symlink pointed outside of the .snap, just copy the original
[21:15] <kyrofa> elopio, since sometimes the link will be absolute
[21:15] <elopio> kyrofa: that makes sense. If the real path is outside, copy the real, not the link.
[21:16] <kyrofa> elopio, exactly. It'll take a custom copy function and some decent tests, but then we have the best of all worlds
[21:17] <elopio> kyrofa: so that would be the default, and then you can override the behaviour with follow-symlinks: true | false ?
[21:17] <kyrofa> elopio, we can support that... but can you think of any reason why a developer wouldn't want symlinks in the .snap?
[21:18] <kyrofa> elopio, I can't, which begs the question: why add the option and incur the maintenance cost?
[21:18] <elopio> kyrofa: I assumed this would be coming from an external repo that has symlinks for some reason.
[21:19] <elopio> we should ask femdom for his usecase.
[21:19] <kyrofa> Well, his use-case involves _wanting_ the symlinks. I'm asking: is there ever a reason to NOT want symlinks?
[21:19] <elopio> kyrofa: right, I'm reading it on the bug now.
[21:20] <elopio> kyrofa: I agree that your proposed solution is better than his.
[21:22] <kyrofa> elopio, I'm under the impression that we didn't have symlinks in the first place to avoid the potential dangling link and just copying the original was the quickest path to that goal. I think if we eliminate that possibility symlinks will work for everyone
[21:23] <elopio> kyrofa: what I don't like about this is that the snap repo won't have all the files it needs. It depends on the developer machine.
[21:24] <elopio> but our goal is not to have reproducible builds. So I guess that's alright.
[21:24] <kyrofa> elopio, well, only potentially, and it's that way now if the repo has symlinks pointing outside of the repo
[21:24] <kyrofa> elopio, this proposal keeps everything the way it is now unless the symlink is pointing within the .snap already
[21:24] <elopio> yes, it'll be better than it is now.
[21:25] <kyrofa> Alright, thanks for your brain! I'll mull that over a little
[21:27] <kyrofa> elopio, also, when you have a minute: https://github.com/ubuntu-core/snapcraft/pull/264
[21:46] <kyrofa> elopio, integration test failures suck
[21:47] <kyrofa> elopio, is there a way to get output from the build?
[21:48] <kyrofa> elopio, from run_snapcraft, specifically


[02:31] <sadiel> hey there! I'm trying to sync a folder in my home folder with ubuntuone. I have already opened an account, and according to the this tutorial [https://one.ubuntu.com/support/installation/] Y should see some "add this computer" button in my ubuntuone home page at my browser. But there is  no such button, and my computer is not listed in the devices synched with my account! Could I get some hits on how to get this going?
[02:37] <duanedesign> sadiel: hello
[02:38] <duanedesign> sadiel: that is a bug that has been affecting some  users. Fortunately the work around is easy
[02:39] <duanedesign> follow the three steps here and you should be good to go:
[02:39] <duanedesign> sadiel: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOne/FAQ#How%20do%20I%20add%20my%20computer?
[02:40] <sadiel> thanks duanedesing, I'll try that!
[02:41] <duanedesign> sadiel: let me know if you have any trouble
[03:00] <sadiel> Hey, that worked alright, duanedesign! Thanks a lot!
[03:43] <jdobrien> duanedesign, thank you for all the bug triaging. if a user complains about their quota being wrong, feel free to assign the bug to me. I can fix it
[03:50] <duanedesign> sure thing jdobrien  thanks
[03:57] <duanedesign> jdobrien: i'll keep an eye out on the forums as well. As Forum Staff I try and keep an eye on the Ubuntu One section of the Forums
[03:58] <jdobrien> duanedesign, thank you
[04:33] <Chipaca> jdobrien: user ajenbo's quota is still wrong
[04:34] <Chipaca> and with that, I say good night
[07:24] <Zeu5> hi i have a Pcitures folder in home folder. used to be sync, now no matter how many times i tried it just wont sync even when i did right click > sync with ubuntu one
[07:25] <duanedesign> Zeu5: hello
[07:25] <Zeu5> duanedesign: hello?
[07:25] <duanedesign> Zeu5: can you run the command:   u1sdtool --list-folders
[07:25] <Zeu5> hangon
[07:25] <duanedesign> and see if your folder is listed
[07:26] <Zeu5> yes it is lsited
[07:26] <Zeu5> duanedesign: but the folder does not display the tick sign
[07:27] <duanedesign> Zeu5: and the contents are not syncing to the cloud
[07:27] <duanedesign> Zeu5: can you run the command:   u1sdtool -s
[07:27] <Zeu5> duanedesign: yup u are right they are not syncing
[07:27] <Zeu5> hang on
[07:27] <Zeu5> queue is idle
[07:28] <Zeu5> duanedesign: queue is idle
[07:28] <duanedesign> is_connected and is_online = true
[07:28] <Zeu5> duanedesign: yes
[07:29] <duanedesign> and connection: With User With Network
[07:29] <Zeu5> is_error = false
[07:29] <Zeu5> duanedesign: yes
[07:29] <duanedesign> hmm. ok
[07:29] <Zeu5> duanedesign: connection with user with network des: processign queues connected:true error: false online :true queses: idle
[07:30] <duanedesign> can you try:     u1sdtool --waiting-content | wc -l
[07:30] <Zeu5> duanedesign: hang on
[07:30] <Zeu5> duanedesign: i think the result is 0
[07:31] <duanedesign> ok
[07:31] <Zeu5> duanedesign:  or the letter o
[07:31] <Zeu5> duanedesign:  shd be zero
[07:32] <duanedesign> lets restart the syncdaemon. run command:  u1sdtool-d ;u1sdtool -q ; u1sdtool -c
[07:33] <Zeu5> duanedesign: complete
[07:33] <duanedesign> ok
[07:33] <Zeu5> duanedesign: same thing as before
[07:33] <duanedesign> well give it a minute to do its local rescan and connect
[07:34] <duanedesign> can you look in ~/.cache/.ubuntuone/
[07:34] <Zeu5> duanedesign: i have opened up the ubuntu one preferences and looking at it .. it quickly disconnected and reconnected and in progress and quickly says competle
[07:34] <Zeu5> duanedesign: ok
[07:35] <Zeu5> duanedesign: there is a log and partials folder
[07:35] <Zeu5> duanedesign: wat to do next?
[07:35] <duanedesign> syncdaemon-exception.log
[07:35] <Zeu5> duanedesign: okie and?
[07:35] <duanedesign> is it empty?
[07:36] <Zeu5> yes
[07:36] <duanedesign> ok
[07:36] <duanedesign> try:   u1sdtool --waiting-content | wc -l
[07:37] <duanedesign> still 0
[07:38] <duanedesign> also check: u1sdtool --waiting-metadata | wc -l
[07:39] <Zeu5> duanedesign: both 0
[07:40] <duanedesign> ok now look at  ~/.cache/ubuntuone/log/syncdaemon.log
[07:40] <duanedesign> and paste the contents at http://paste.ubuntu.com
[07:40] <duanedesign> post the address when done and Ill take a look
[07:41] <Zeu5> duanedesign: http://paste.ubuntu.com/460511
[07:43] <duanedesign> Zeu5: one other thing to ttry while i look at that. run the command:  touch ~/Pictures
[07:43] <duanedesign> or whatever the folder is
[07:46] <Zeu5> okie i touched it
[07:46] <Zeu5> wat do i expect to see?
[07:47] <duanedesign> ideally we would see  u1sdtool --waiting-metadata | wc -l
[07:47] <duanedesign> not be 0
[07:47] <duanedesign> and  u1sdtool -s  will not be IDLE
[07:48] <Zeu5> after i run touch and immediately followed by wc -l i still get 0
[07:51] <Zeu5> duanedesign: and -s gives me idle
[07:51] <duanedesign> Zeu5: at https://one.ubuntu.com/files/    do you see the Pictures folder?
[07:53] <Zeu5> yes i do
[07:54] <Zeu5> duanedesign: this situation only happens for my PC. on my laptop my pictures sync perfectly
[07:54] <Zeu5> duanedesign: previously my PC was fine with this as well, until recently
[07:58] <duanedesign> ok
[07:58] <duanedesign> u1sdtool --info=/home/kei/Pictures
[07:58] <duanedesign> could you please run that
[07:59] <duanedesign> should look like this http://paste.ubuntu.com/460516/
[08:01] <Zeu5> duanedesign: nope i got some keyerror message
[08:01] <Zeu5> duanedesign: do u wan me to paste it for you?
[08:02] <duanedesign> Zeu5: ok i think we are getting somewhere
[08:02] <duanedesign> Zeu5:  could you please
[08:02] <Zeu5> duanedesign: http://paste.ubuntu.com/460517
[08:03] <duanedesign> i saw this a couple of days ago. Let me grep some logs real quick
[08:03] <Zeu5> duanedesign: u are right because on my laptop i get the correct message as you described in 460516
[08:21] <Zeu5> duanedesign: alllo? are u still there?
[08:21] <duanedesign> yes
[08:21] <duanedesign> :)
[08:22] <duanedesign> i know this was mentioned the other day
[08:23] <duanedesign> i am looking for it in the logs.
[08:24] <Zeu5> duanedesign: oh thank you very much. i tot you had been disconnected
[08:37] <duanedesign> Zeu5: ok getting close
[08:37] <duanedesign> i found the log :)
[08:37] <Zeu5> duanedesign: :)
[08:37] <Zeu5> duanedesign: tat is awesome. if u can give me the link i will bookmark it incase the same situation occurs again
[08:38] <duanedesign> seems that the UDF root node info ins't in syncdaemon metadata
[08:38] <duanedesign> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/05/19/%23ubuntuone.html
[08:38] <duanedesign> Elvis is the user with the same issue as you
[08:38] <Zeu5> duanedesign: i have no idea wat you are talking about :D so how do i fix this UDF root thing?
[08:39] <duanedesign> Zeu5: was the pictures folder already present
[08:39] <duanedesign> or did U1 create it
[08:40] <Zeu5> duanedesign: i believe it was already created
[08:43] <duanedesign> Zeu5: can you run
[08:43] <duanedesign> python -c "import cPickle; print cPickle.load(open('/home/elvis/.local/share/ubuntuone/syncdaemon/vm/udfs/8/b/8/8b8c9fc3-dde8-4a1f-808c-1877effe9097', 'r'))"
[08:43] <duanedesign> nonon
[08:43] <duanedesign> sorry
[08:44] <duanedesign> python -c "import cPickle; print cPickle.load(open('/home/kei/.local/share/ubuntuone/syncdaemon/vm/udfs/8/b/8/8b8c9fc3-dde8-4a1f-808c-1877effe9097', 'r'))"
[08:47] <Zeu5> duanedesign: okie so now wat?
[08:48] <duanedesign> ok now the commadn
[08:48] <duanedesign> rm ~/.local/share/ubuntuone/syncdaemon/vm/udfs/8/b/8/8b8c9fc3-dde8-4a1f-808c-1877effe9097
[08:48] <Zeu5> duanedesign: i ve put it in my terminal so i see some instructions. i paste it for you hang on
[08:49] <Zeu5> duanedesign: http://paste.ubuntu.com/460531
[08:49] <duanedesign> Zeu5: run u1sdtool -q
[08:50] <Zeu5> duanedesign: do u wan me to run the rm first or just go straight to u1sdtool -q?
[08:50] <Zeu5> duanedesign: i ve only runned the python instruction so far
[08:50] <duanedesign> ok
[08:51] <duanedesign> so first u1sdtool -q
[08:51] <duanedesign> then
[08:51] <duanedesign> rm ~/.local/share/ubuntuone/syncdaemon/vm/udfs/8/b/8/8b8c9fc3-dde8-4a1f-808c-1877effe9097
[08:52] <Zeu5> okie the u1 syncdaemon stopped
[08:52] <duanedesign> then the rm command ^^
[08:53] <Zeu5> duanedesign: okie the rm is done
[08:53] <duanedesign> ok now
[08:53] <duanedesign> u1sdtool --start; u1sdtool -c
[08:53] <Zeu5> duanedesign: http://paste.ubuntu.com/460533
[08:54] <duanedesign> looks ok so far
[08:54] <duanedesign> lets start the syncdaemon and see what we get
[08:54] <duanedesign> u1sdtool --start; u1sdtool -c
[08:55] <duanedesign> itll take a minute or so to connect
[08:55] <Zeu5> duanedesign: hey i think its working!!
[08:55] <duanedesign> it has to scan the local disk first to check for changes
[08:55] <Zeu5> duanedesign: i have no idea how u did this
[08:55] <duanedesign> Zeu5: its a fairly new and not common bug
[08:55] <duanedesign> :P
[08:56] <Zeu5> duanedesign: and i ve no time to learn. can i just use these same instructions the enxt time this occurred?
[08:56] <duanedesign> yes the hint was the info command
[08:56] <Zeu5> duanedesign: i supposed this 8/b/8/8b8c9fc3-dde8-4a1f-808c-1877effe9097 canot be reused?
[08:56] <duanedesign> u1sdtool --info=/home/kei/Pictures
[08:57] <Zeu5> duanedesign:  inc ase it happened to another folder?
[08:57] <Zeu5> okie i am lookin at the info
[08:57] <duanedesign> ok that nimber comes from
[08:57] <duanedesign> http://paste.ubuntu.com/460511/
[08:57] <duanedesign> line 241
[08:57] <duanedesign> of your log
[08:58] <duanedesign> you can also get that number with
[08:58] <duanedesign> u1sdtool --list-folders
[08:58] <duanedesign> the format is  a/b/c/abc...
[08:58] <duanedesign> 8/b/8/8b8
[08:58] <duanedesign> does that make sense
[08:59] <Zeu5> ah i see.
[08:59] <duanedesign> it shouldnt happen again but just in case keep the link
[09:00] <duanedesign> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/05/19/%23ubuntuone.html
[09:00] <duanedesign> iths the convo between Elvis, joshua hoover, and veterok
[09:00] <Zeu5> okie thanks
[09:01] <duanedesign> Zeu5: and you can always get help here. During the day there are lots of devs on.
[09:01] <Zeu5> duanedesign: i am on +8 UTC
[09:01] <duanedesign> well 'day' in US/Europe
[09:02] <duanedesign> :)
[09:02] <Zeu5> duanedesign: so you guys are 12 hours behind?
[09:02] <Zeu5> ur time zone is -8?
[09:02] <duanedesign> I am -5
[09:02] <duanedesign> my client is always on so you can leave me a message too
[09:03] <Zeu5> hey thanks duanedesign , so what time is best to come here?
[09:03] <Zeu5> u can give me the -5 version of the timing
[09:03] <duanedesign> 13:00 - 20:00 utc
[09:03] <duanedesign> actually rye shows up in about an hour or two
[09:04] <Zeu5> duanedesign: oh i see. so for me it means around 9pm onwards
[09:04] <duanedesign> yeah its 8:00 utc
[09:04] <Zeu5> 13 + 8 = 21 hence 9pm - 4am here in +8
[09:04] <duanedesign> like i said rye and a few others get here probably 7pm your time
[09:05] <Zeu5> duanedesign: so its like 3 am for you there.. sorry.. i kept u up
[09:05] <duanedesign> no i keep odd hours :)
[09:06] <duanedesign> you can use u1sdtool --waiting-metadata | wc -l  and u1sdtool --waiting-content | wc -l
[09:06] <duanedesign> to gauge progresss
[09:06] <duanedesign> the numbers will get smaller. It will do metadata first, then content
[09:07] <duanedesign> if you take off the | wc -l it will show a verbose output of the files/data it is syncing
[09:11] <Zeu5> thanks
[09:11] <duanedesign> np
[09:11] <Zeu5> duanedesign:  i gtg. bye
[09:11] <duanedesign> cya Zeu5
[12:16] <rye> duanedesign, morning, i've been testing uploads with rate-limiting, so far setting up 10 Kbyte/s gives 10-16 kbyte upload, so for upload it looks fine
[12:16] <duanedesign> morning sir
[12:18] <duanedesign> rye: had a user this morning with the UDF that showed up in --list-folder, but --info=directory returned a key error.
[12:20] <duanedesign> rye: removing the offending metadata fixed it.
[12:26] <rye> hm
[12:29] <duanedesign> the user synced three folders. 2 of the 3 synced fine. All 3 showed up onder --list-folders
[12:29] <duanedesign> under*
[12:30] <duanedesign> but a u1sdtool --info=<path> returned  http://paste.ubuntu.com/460517/
[12:31] <duanedesign> veterok and josh helped a user with this issue back in May
[12:33] <duanedesign> rm ~/.local/share/ubuntuone/syncdaemon/vm/udfs/d/b/1/db1c87e3-d0cc-4376-8c12-48bb916cffca   fixed it.
[12:37] <duanedesign> rye: what are you using to measure upload/download speed?
[12:40] <rye> duanedesign, iptraf on a vm which has nothing else to upload/download
[13:00] <rye> duanedesign, download rate limiting works as well, hmm
[15:48] <NickL> honk
[15:48] <jdobrien> NickL, what's up?
[15:49] <NickL> hi, hope someone can help. Over the past couple of weeks when I've gone to purchase something from the u1 music store, I fill my basket, then click checkout, and it says "Connecting you to the Ubuntu One Music Store..." but just hangs there. Is that a known issue?
[15:51] <jdobrien> NickL, not that I know of
[15:51] <jdobrien> joshuahoover, ^^
[15:52] <joshuahoover> NickL: no, this is not a known issue
[15:52] <joshuahoover> NickL: do you have ubuntu one setup on your computer already?
[15:52] <NickL> joshuahoover: yes
[15:52] <joshuahoover> NickL: can you open a terminal session and run: u1sdtool --status
[15:52] <joshuahoover> NickL: and let me know what it reports
[15:53] <NickL> joshuahoover: State: QUEUE_MANAGER
[15:53] <NickL>     connection: With User With Network
[15:53] <NickL>     description: processing queues
[15:53] <NickL>     is_connected: True
[15:53] <NickL>     is_error: False
[15:53] <NickL>     is_online: True
[15:53] <NickL>     queues: IDLE
[15:53] <joshuahoover> NickL: ok, that looks fine
[15:54] <joshuahoover> NickL: if you quit rhythmbox and then start it back up, do you continue to get this problem?
[15:55] <NickL> joshuahoover: I'll try again. It's happened a few times in the past few days, but my computer may have just been suspended at night. 2 minutes.
[15:57] <NickL> joshuahoover: looks to be okay now.
[15:57] <NickL> thanks.
[15:58] <duanedesign> joshuahoover: hello
[15:59] <joshuahoover> NickL: yeah, that is a known issue, where if rhythmbox or banshee is open for a while, the store will have problems making that connection, i forgot about that one, i mis spoke before
[15:59] <joshuahoover> duanedesign: hello
[15:59] <duanedesign> joshuahoover: had someone in here early this morning with an issue that you and  veterok came across in May.
[15:59] <joshuahoover> duanedesign: what was that?
[16:00] <duanedesign> joshuahoover: it was the UDF not syncing. It was showing up with --list-folders but when you did --info=<path> you got a key error
[16:00] <duanedesign> joshuahoover: rm ~/.local/share/ubuntuone/syncdaemon/vm/udfs/8/b/8/8b8c9fc3-dde8-4a1f-808c-1877effe9097 fixed it.
[16:02] <duanedesign> joshuahoover: just wanted to mention it, just in case. Here are the logs from the original troubleshooting you and veterok did. the user is Elvis. http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/05/19/%23ubuntuone.html
[16:06] <joshuahoover> duanedesign: ok, i reviewed that chat log...i remember that now...i don't believe we (really verterok) ever found out what may be the root cause on this...he's out the rest of this week...i'm making a note to follow up on it since it's happen again
[16:11] <duanedesign> joshuahoover: here was the users original pastebin of syncdaemon.log  http://paste.ubuntu.com/460511/  and the error from u1sdtool --info=<path> http://paste.ubuntu.com/460517/
[16:12] <joshuahoover> duanedesign: thanks!