[11:28] <zequence> Could someone please approve above (ubuntustudio-meta). We can't build our ISOs without it
[16:02] <bdmurray> Could somebody fully phase ubuntu-release-upgrader for vivid?
[16:10] <flexiondotorg> bdmurray, Just out of interest, what does that mean?
[16:11] <rbasak> flexiondotorg: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PhasedUpdates
[16:11] <flexiondotorg> rbasak, Thanks.
[16:11]  * flexiondotorg reads...
[16:11] <bdmurray> flexiondotorg: SRUs go through a phased update process and sometimes there are false positives.
[16:12] <bdmurray> http://www.murraytwins.com/blog/?p=127 that's a better explanation of how things really work
[16:16] <infinity> bdmurray: I have the technology.  I can make it happen.
[16:16] <infinity> bdmurray: When is your cronjob going to run?  I don't want to collide and disappear it.
[16:16] <flexiondotorg> bdmurray, Thanks for the educational materials.
[16:19] <infinity> bdmurray: Oh, it's at 0 right now, so I guess it was halted, and the cronjob won't touch it?
[16:19] <infinity> bdmurray: Confirm/deny? :P
[16:21] <bdmurray> infinity: The cronjob would only touch it if problem d2dd8d went away which it won't.
[16:21] <bdmurray> infinity: and the job runs as ubuntu-archive on snakefruit I think every 8 hours
[16:24] <infinity> bdmurray: Oh, that bin just collects every failure of do-release-upgrade due to dpkg exiting?  Ick.  Does anyone actually look at those to pick out the real bugs?
[16:24] <infinity> bdmurray: Also, phased to 100%.
[16:26] <bdmurray> Yes. No. Thanks!
[16:28] <infinity> bdmurray: Do we trap enough info in those cases to actually examine and *find* the real bugs, assuming someone has the time to do so?
[16:28] <infinity> bdmurray: The only I looked at just had the dpkg exit code, no useful logs, but maybe I wasn't looking in the right place.
[16:29] <bdmurray> infinity: Nope, and that's probably the real issue.
[16:30] <bdmurray> infinity: I'll dig into it a bit.
[16:31] <infinity> bdmurray: Cool.  I suspect the real issue will be a matter of time, but without any debugging info to work from, there's little motivation to even find time to look. :P
[16:32] <bdmurray> It'd also be better if we buckets with real counts to figure out where the actual problem lies.
[19:19] <tdaitx> doko, are you ok removing libecap3 from -proposed so I can ask someone to sponsor libecap2 gcc5 from LP: #1504200? the current squid 3.3 only works with with libecap2 (0.20), it does not work with libecap3 (1.0)
[19:20] <tdaitx> doko, this way we can at least fix squid 3.3 FTBFS... and I also have an update for it from 3.3.8 to 3.3.14
[20:02] <slangasek> bdmurray: your latest MP seems to have the sssd commit in it
[20:03] <bdmurray> slangasek: Ah, okay. Fixing.
[20:07] <bdmurray> Could we have a wily-updates milestone?
[20:33] <doko> tdaitx, done, should be published in about 45 minutes
[20:37] <tdaitx> doko, thanks!
[21:15] <slangasek> bdmurray: done
[22:33] <bdmurray> slangasek: What was done?
[22:36]  * bdmurray figures out wily-updates was added
[22:36] <slangasek> yes that :)


[04:12] <vpa1977> Hi, would it be possible to retry regressions for node-registry-url. The tests pass when run against local vm.
[04:12] <vpa1977> https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/request.cgi?release=lunar&arch=amd64&package=node-package-json&trigger=node-package-json%2F8.1.0-5&trigger=node-registry-url%2F6.0.1-1
[04:12] <vpa1977> https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/request.cgi?release=lunar&arch=arm64&package=node-package-json&trigger=node-package-json%2F8.1.0-5&trigger=node-registry-url%2F6.0.1-1
[04:12] <vpa1977> https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/request.cgi?release=lunar&arch=armhf&package=node-package-json&trigger=node-package-json%2F8.1.0-5&trigger=node-registry-url%2F6.0.1-1
[04:12] <vpa1977> https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/request.cgi?release=lunar&arch=s390x&package=node-package-json&trigger=node-package-json%2F8.1.0-5&trigger=node-registry-url%2F6.0.1-1
[04:12] <vpa1977> Thank you!!!
[04:22] <mwhudson> vpa1977: done
[07:50] <zhsj> hi, could someone ./retry-autopkgtest-regressions --blocks golang-golang-x-tools ? i think the vim-youcompleteme tests are very flaky. but not sure why it runs better on ci.debian.n
[07:56] <ginggs> zhsj: .
[07:59] <zhsj> ginggs: btw why./retry-autopkgtest-regressions --blocked-by vim-youcompleteme shows nothing. python3-defaults is also blocked by it (but due to badpkg).
[08:01] <ginggs> zhsj: either queued or running.  in this case running https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/running#pkg-vim-youcompleteme
[08:04] <zhsj> 👀
[08:09] <zhsj> ha, the queue only has s390x jobs. i think i could feed some amd64/arm64 jobs now.
[08:10] <zhsj> ginggs: could you also ./retry-autopkgtest-regressions --blocks {golang-github-vmware-govmomi,golang-golang-x-net}
[08:12] <zhsj> ginggs: and grep -v package=golang-golang-x-tools, only the version in proposed may pass.
[08:15] <ginggs> zhsj: .
[08:15] <zhsj> ginggs: thx
[11:23] <nteodosio> Can I please have these four Chromium autopkgtests triggered? https://termbin.com/3aibz
[13:42] <ginggs> nteodosio: looking...
[13:43] <ginggs> nteodosio: .
[13:43] <nteodosio> Thank you, ginggs.
[13:47] <ginggs> coreycb: f.y.i. there's a new jinja2 in debian fixing debian bug #1025808
[13:47] -ubottu:#ubuntu-devel- Debian bug 1025808 in python3-jinja2 "python3-jinja2: Bug in jinja2 template macros causes ansible problems" [Serious, Open] https://bugs.debian.org/1025808
[13:48] <ginggs> and that needs plastex updated to 2.1-4
[14:20] <hallyn> is there a package that'll give me the libdbus-1 manpages as manpages?  dbus-1-doc just has html versions.  i want to be able to "man dbus_pending_call_block"
[15:41] <zhsj> hallyn: looking at the existing man3 files, either -doc or -dev. (apt-file search -l /usr/share/man/man3/|grep -- -doc|wc -l -> 116)
[15:43] <zhsj> (oh i misread your question, i thought you want to know where to install man3 pages)
[16:06] <Eickmeyer> Odd behavior in the Edubuntu seed. Despite having the chromium snap seeded, it's not being picked-up.
[16:09] <ogra> define "not being picked up" IIRC the actual seeding happens on first boot and it should only dump the snap file in place during build (but not install or actually seed it)
[16:12] <hallyn> zhsj: yeah well maybe the answer is to just make and install from source
[16:15] <zhsj> hallyn: if upstream provides the man pages, the maintainer should include them.
[16:15] <Eickmeyer> ogra: It's not being installed.
[16:15] <Eickmeyer> ogra: The idea is that it should be like firefox. We want both.
[16:17] <Eickmeyer> build logs show it's not even being attempted.
[16:20] <Eickmeyer> In Studio we have Firefox and Freeshow, and they behave correctly, so I'm not sure what's going on or if it's specific to Edubuntu.
[16:51] <liushuyu> Hi, can someone help me re-try some autopkgtests? The links follow:
[16:51] <liushuyu> https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/request.cgi?release=lunar&arch=arm64&package=meson&trigger=rustc/1.67.1%2Bdfsg0ubuntu1-0ubuntu2
[16:51] <liushuyu> https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/request.cgi?release=lunar&arch=ppc64el&package=meson&trigger=rustc/1.67.1%2Bdfsg0ubuntu1-0ubuntu2
[16:51] <liushuyu> https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/request.cgi?release=lunar&arch=s390x&package=meson&trigger=rustc/1.67.1%2Bdfsg0ubuntu1-0ubuntu2
[16:51] <liushuyu> -- end of links. Thank you!
[16:55] <zhsj> and `./retry-autopkgtest-regressions --blocks zip` too, all the failures are `kind: install`.
[16:56] <liushuyu> Is there an issue with the autopkgtest cloud runners or the internal archive recently?
[17:06] <ginggs> liushuyu[m]: zhsj: looking
[17:07] <ginggs> .
 "liushuyu: zhsj: looking" <- Thank you!
[19:10] <hallyn> zhsj: eh, looking closer, the manpages i want do not exist there.
[20:52] <ahasenack> RAOF: hi, how can I accept a package from rejected, when there are multiple versions in rejected?
[20:52] <ahasenack> with the cmdline tool
[20:53] <ahasenack> ah, --version
[20:53] <ahasenack> it's not in the --help output
[20:54] <ahasenack> sorry, it obviously is in the --help output


[03:27] <ScottK> ^^^ is just rejected so it doesn't get inadvertently accepted before I get my testing questions answered.
[03:51] <ScottK> And an FFe reviewed.
[08:33] <Laney> blerg, need to remember to pass --source to queue
[08:50] <apw> ^ bug fix only update to ensure thermald runs correctly in the face of sysfs bits being late to the party
[09:18] <rbasak> cjwatson: reuploaded bcache-tools. Thanks for the review.
[09:20] <cjwatson> rbasak: ta
[09:24] <cjwatson> zul: Um I just noticed that python-nova.flex contains no useful files.  Please can you run packages through sbuild before uploading them?
[10:23] <apw> ^ fix for vbox VMs failing to reach lightdm
[10:27] <knome> \o/
[10:41] <mlankhorst> oh for the love of god..
[10:42] <mlankhorst> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mesa/+bug/1374131 seems that it needs libgl1-mesa-dri installed
[10:42] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1374131 in mesa (Ubuntu) "qtcreator-plugin autopkgtest fails on AMD64 mesa mesa_10.3.0" [Critical,Confirmed]
[11:11] <ogra_> can someone approve phablet-tools and ubuntu-touch-meta ?
[11:12] <ogra_> (i thought there is a bot that does it)
[11:12] <ogra_> Laney, i assume you justified with the right people that it is ok to add another font to the seed (while we are just trying to only drop bits to make space)
[11:12] <cjwatson> 10:57 -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted phablet-tools [sync] (utopic-proposed) [1.1+14.10.20140929-0ubuntu1]
[11:12] <ogra_> oh
[11:13] <Laney> ogra_: are you telling me off?
[11:13] <ogra_> missed that
[11:13] <cjwatson> And I'm not sure how ubuntu-touch-meta can possibly be accepted given that 1.187 is already in the archive.
[11:13] <cjwatson> rejecting
[11:13] <ogra_> Laney, no, i was wondering if you talked to pmcgowan and slangasek ... who work on shrinking the image :)
[11:14] <ogra_> hmm
[11:14] <ogra_> why didnt i see it on -cahnges then
[11:14] <cjwatson> Please use "pull-lp-source ubuntu-touch-meta" as your starting point for uploads
[11:14] <Laney> I didn't justify with anybody, go ahead and revert if you want. Seems like a valid enough request to me.
[11:15] <cjwatson> ogra_: anyway, https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/utopic-changes/2014-September/010878.html
[11:15] <ogra_> Laney, right, to me too ... we can still remove it if someone complains ... that was simply the reason why i didnt merge it yet
[11:15] <ogra_> cjwatson, yeah, i see it now
[11:15] <Laney> Nobody even responded to the request at all
[11:15] <cjwatson> ... but it makes ubuntu-touch/i386 uninstallable apparently
[11:15] <ogra_> hmm
[11:17] <cjwatson>  libqt5gui5-gles : Conflicts: libqt5gui5 but 5.3.0+dfsg-2ubuntu6 is to be installed
[11:17] <cjwatson>  libqt5quick5-gles : Conflicts: libqt5quick5 but 5.3.0-3ubuntu12 is to be installed
[11:18] <cjwatson> because signon-apparmor-extension needs to be built against -gles on !armhf, I think?
[11:18] <ogra_> oh, fun
[11:18] <cjwatson> possibly
[11:18] <ogra_> yeah
[11:18] <cjwatson> oh, no, it's the sdk-libs changes
[11:20] <ogra_> so that needs arch specific differentiation i guess
[11:20] <cjwatson> yup, will sort it out
[11:20] <ogra_> thanks
[11:21] <cjwatson> ogra_: does http://paste.ubuntu.com/8454630/ look right in terms of the package organisation?
[11:22] <ogra_> cjwatson, it does, are these two enough ?
[11:22] <cjwatson> the others there don't have -gles variants
[11:22] <ogra_> k
[11:23] <cjwatson> Laney: it would be nice if you could have merged your branch into trunk when you noticed the divergence, rather than merging trunk into your branch and then pushing that over the top of trunk
[11:23] <cjwatson> produces confusing bzr log :-/
[11:24] <Laney> mmm, apols, can overwrite if you like?
[11:24] <cjwatson> if you could then now might be a good time, yeah
[11:29] <Laney> cjwatson: try that
[11:31] <cjwatson> Laney: thanks
[11:31] <cjwatson> ogra_: committed, if you want to redo a 1.188 upload with a fresh seed update
[12:23] <mlankhorst> cjwatson: hey I've fixed the dependency issue of mesa, shall I re-upload?
[12:26] <cjwatson> mlankhorst: I know nothing about this beyond people having asked me about it the other day and me redirecting them
[12:26] <cjwatson> Do what seems appropriate :)
[12:27] <mlankhorst> I've found the root cause at least
[12:28] <mlankhorst> it being that it was working by pure chance before. :P
[12:31] <mlankhorst>  DISPLAY=:0 glxinfo
[12:31] <mlankhorst> name of display: :0
[12:31] <mlankhorst> Error: couldn't find RGB GLX visual or fbconfig
[12:31] <mlankhorst> oops
[12:31] <mlankhorst> didn't mean to copy paste
[13:49] <Laney> It'd be nice if someone could review gnome-desktop3 - it's a small transition that we want to do quickly
[14:15] <cjwatson> infinity,slangasek: openssl and grub2 reviews from unapproved would be lovely when you're around.
[14:20] <ogra_> that package name could need a few more "s" in it :P
[14:37] <jamespage> ^^ that keystone upload does a variety of good things and should unblock all of the pending oslo.* packages stuck in proposed on failing autopkgtests
[14:40] <mlankhorst> same for mesa, i promise it won't break qtbase-opensource-src this time. :D
[14:41] <cjwatson> reviewing
[15:01] <Laney> is it possible to get the signer of a queue item?
[15:01] <Laney> Don't see anything on package_upload
[15:04] <ScottK> For mesa it's not the known stuff I worry about.
[15:09] <jamespage> thanks cjwatson
[15:32] <Riddell> anyone know what's wrong with okular? it seems the main blocker to KDE SC 4.14.1 bits getting in the archive but I can't see a failure in jenkins http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html
[15:34] <rbasak> Riddell: https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Utopic/view/AutoPkgTest/job/utopic-adt-okular/lastBuild/? shows as failed to me.
[15:34] <Laney> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Utopic/view/AutoPkgTest/job/utopic-adt-okular/lastBuild/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/artifact/results/testsuite-stdout
[15:34] <Laney> That's faily
[15:37] <Riddell> ah hah, I was looking at the "log" file
[15:37] <Riddell> thanks Laney
[15:38] <Laney> it's in there, you just have to look harder
[15:38] <Laney> 'testsuite' has its output before 'acc'
[15:40] <Riddell> ah yes, still getting my head around this autopkgtest stuff
[15:51] <zul> ^^^ the nova-compute-flex makes it installable and fixes races with cgmanager
[16:29] <infinity> cjwatson: I assume you're using the word "review" very loosely in the openssl case.
[16:29] <infinity> cjwatson: "Yes, your rainbow tables all look correct, I re-calculated them on a napkin."
[16:32] <cjwatson> infinity: right :)  that took me roughly a day of resolving merges on two monitors
[16:32] <cjwatson> infinity: I ended up importing the current package state into git temporarily so that I could cherry-pick the requested series from upstream and then compare that against the rolled-up patch I'd been given to make sure I'd resolved conflicts correctly ...
[16:33] <infinity> cjwatson: Well, not matching theirs doesn't imply you're the one that did it wrong. :P
[16:34] <infinity> cjwatson: But if both ended up the same, that has some implication that you're both equally smart or equally unlucky.
[16:34] <infinity> cjwatson: So, yeah, more of a verbal review, then.  Did yours, indeed, match theirs in the end?
[16:35] <infinity> cjwatson: And this is building with full testsuite goodness and no obvious regressions?
[16:35] <cjwatson> close enough.  there were a few bits where they'd pulled unnecessary bits of other patches, and I went with my own resolution.  I'd made one or two mistakes which I found that way and corrected.
[16:35] <infinity> cjwatson: And, how can we test the POWER8 stuff (can I build it on a P7 host, and run a testsuite on P8 and watch for bogons?)
[16:35] <cjwatson> I built on amd64/powerpc/ppc64el and the test suites passed
[16:36] <cjwatson> I trust that the last is true but don't have one to test on :)
[16:36] <infinity> Sure, but building on ppc64el probably means POWER7, which would skip any P8-optimised bits.
[16:36] <infinity> So, how can we test on P8?  I think we should, since that's the whole point of the upload.
[16:38] <cjwatson> Fair question.  I think: build source package on p7, rsync built tree to p8, run 'make test'
[16:38] <cjwatson> Do I have access to one I've forgotten about?
[16:39] <infinity> cjwatson: Kay.  That sounds reasonable.  Want to spin up a test tree on kelsey, and I'll do the second bit when I find a host to slap a chroot on?
[16:39] <infinity> cjwatson: You might have access to a few, though what state any of them are in is the more interesting question.
[16:41] <cjwatson> infinity: OK, (re-)building on kelsey01
[17:03] <cjwatson> infinity: kelsey01:~cjwatson/openssl-1.0.1f/
[17:04] <infinity> cjwatson: Ta.
[17:07] <dobey> uploads to seeded packages are ok now as long as they don't break feature/ui/string freeze, right?
[17:12] <cjwatson> Yes, they're just held for manual review
[17:15] <dobey> ok
[17:19] <cjwatson> infinity: I take it it passed?
[17:56] <infinity> cjwatson: Nah, I was on a call with our fearless leader.
[17:59] <cjwatson> infinity: Oh.  Somebody accepted it.
[18:00] <infinity> Oh.  Indeed somebody did.
[18:00] <infinity> I wonder how they "reviewed" it.
[18:00] <infinity> Anyone want to confess to accepting that openssl upload? :P
[18:11] <infinity> cjwatson: I guess no one's fessing up.  I'll test it anyway in a bit.
[18:11] <infinity> (I wish someone had finished that queue auditing feature...)
[18:14] <cjwatson> Thanks
[18:14] <bdmurray> cjwatson: slangasek ran change-override for aptdaemon but there is no information about that here - https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/trusty/amd64/aptdaemon. Any ideas?
[18:14] <cjwatson> bdmurray: That's where it would've appeared
[18:14] <cjwatson> So need to know what he did
[18:15] <cjwatson> (Assuming he did a binary override in the correct suite including that architecture ...)
[18:15] <infinity> bdmurray: Ran change-override to what end?
[18:15] <bdmurray> infinity: to fully phased the update
[18:15] <bdmurray> 18:09 <slangasek> $ change-override -z 100 -s  trusty-updates aptdaemon
[18:15] <infinity> Looks fully phased to me.
[18:15] <cjwatson> Then that worked fine
[18:16] <cjwatson> phase 100 shows empty in that column
[18:16] <infinity> Empty... What Colin said.
[18:16] <infinity> Small UI bug that could be filed, perhaps.
[18:18] <infinity> Er, of course, that should have been -S aptdaemon, to phase all the binaries from the source.
[18:18] <infinity> Oh, I say that, but python3-aptdaemon also looks phased.
[18:18] <infinity> So maybe slangasek did them individually.
[18:18] <infinity> slangasek: ^?
[18:19] <bdmurray> I understand that empty means 100%, the timing is particularly confusing
[18:19] <bdmurray> 17:08:15 ... 0% of users
[18:20] <bdmurray> 17:08:14 ... empty
[18:20] <slangasek> infinity: I mistakenly did it without -S the first time around, then went back and used -S on a second pass when bdmurray called my attention back to it
[18:20] <infinity> bdmurray: That's the date it was deleted/superseded, not the date it was set to 0%
[18:20] <infinity> slangasek: Ahh, kay.
[18:20] <infinity> bdmurray: The history output is a bit confusing in that regard, I agree.
[18:22] <slangasek> cjwatson, infinity: I accepted the openssl upload, as cjwatson highlighted both of us and infinity did not tell me he was claiming it :)
[18:22] <infinity> slangasek: Oh.  Backscroll had me waffling about unreviewability and that it should be tested first.
[18:22] <slangasek> infinity: yep; didn't see that until now
[18:23] <slangasek> so, well, feel free to continue testing
[18:23] <infinity> slangasek: But I assume you pored over all the assembly and recalculated the rainbow tables by hand, so we're good. ;)
[18:23] <slangasek> I'll say that's what I did, sure
[18:23] <infinity> :)
[18:28] <infinity> bdmurray: Hrm.  Is it an lpapi bug or sru-review bug that it seems to pick up the wrong diff for a package that's been uploaded, rejected, and reuploaded with the same version?
[18:29] <bdmurray> infinity: which package?
[18:30] <infinity> bdmurray: flash-kernel, it's picking the debdiff from rejected.
[18:31] <bdmurray> infinity: it uses the debdiff in launchpad so - https://launchpadlibrarian.net/186070966/flash-kernel_3.0~rc.4ubuntu49.3_3.0~rc.4ubuntu49.4.diff.gz
[18:31] <infinity> bdmurray: But that's not the diff I'm getting.
[18:31] <infinity> bdmurray: Does it cache locally?
[18:31] <bdmurray> infinity: nope, I'll take a look
[18:33] <infinity> bdmurray: ... And now I do get that diff.  WTF?
[18:33] <infinity> bdmurray: Does it fall back to other queues if unapproved doesn't have a diff yet, maybe?
[18:35] <bdmurray> infinity: no, but there is a --queue option
[18:35] <infinity> bdmurray: Which I wasn't uding, since it defaults to unapproved.
[18:35] <infinity> s/uding/using/
[20:56] <hallyn> hi, bugs 1374622, 1374617 and 1374612 fix the inability to migrate VMs from p->t.  The latter two require FFE for u.  The second is a new package with only 4 pxe roms.
[20:56] <ubot2> bug 1374622 in libvirt (Ubuntu Trusty) "Support migration from 12.04" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1374622
[20:56] <ubot2> bug 1374617 in Ubuntu Trusty "[FFE] New package: ipxe-precise" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1374617
[20:56] <ubot2> bug 1374612 in qemu (Ubuntu Trusty) "[FFE] add pc-1.0-precise machine type" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1374612
[21:02] <infinity> hallyn: How is this meant to work to the user without excessive documentation?
[21:02] <infinity> hallyn: If their old machines were pc-1.0, starting them on trusty won't magically use pc-1.0-precise, I assume.  Will it fail to boot gracefully with an error telling them what to do?
[21:04] <infinity> hallyn: And once it's migrated, does it become "pc-1.0" again and use the new ipxe ROMs, or are they stuck as pc-1.0-precise forever?
[21:04] <infinity> I'm a bit fuzzy on how this works.
[21:05] <hallyn> infinity: once they've migrated to trusty, it'll be called pc-1.0-precise
[21:06] <hallyn> then they can edit the machine type to be something newer if they like
[21:06] <infinity> Can't that be handled transparently, then?
[21:06] <hallyn> but yes, the switch to pc-1.0-precise wont' be automatic.  they have to set a libvirt flag
[21:06] <hallyn> which part
[21:06] <infinity> Well, with any luck, all of it.
[21:07] <infinity> So, AIUI, we need to go from precise/1.0 to trusty/1.0-precise to trusty/1.0, cause you stop in the middle, you're still using ipxe-precise, which we don't want to keep forever, yes?
[21:07] <hallyn> no.  because pc-1.0 means two different things.  so we are introducing pc-1.0-precise to refer to one of them, and using the libvirt flag to tell libvirt which to use
[21:07] <infinity> s/cause you/cause if you/
[21:08] <hallyn> it's ok to use pc-1.0-precise at least as long as precise is supported
[21:08] <hallyn> and realistically we'll probably never get rid of it.
[21:08] <infinity> So, I guess I have two questions.  1) if we can move from trusty/1.0-precise to trusty/1.0, why can't we move from precise/1.0 to trusty/1.0, and 2) can we make either step more automatic?
[21:08] <hallyn> just as the default machine type in trusty is now caled 'pc-i440fx-trusty
[21:09] <hallyn> 1) is false.  ou'd move to something newer ,not to 1.0
[21:09] <hallyn> 2) we can't make it more automatic bc there is no way to tell which pc-1.0 they are sending us.
[21:09] <infinity> Err, whatever, ignore my terminology.
[21:09] <infinity> But you can move from trusty/1.0-precise to trusty/pc-i440fx-trusty then, right?
[21:09] <hallyn> while it is shut down, yes
[21:10] <infinity> What happens when I try to migrate precise to trusty today?
[21:10] <hallyn> one of the proposed packages is to make pc-1.0-precise the default in precise to cut down on the amount by which this happens now
[21:10] <hallyn> it simply fails
[21:11] <infinity> Is it a detectable failure?
[21:11] <infinity> Or completely nonsensical?
[21:11] <hallyn> not complete nonsensical.  it's detectable if yo uknow what to look for
[21:12] <infinity> Okay, so if it's detectable, it's automatable.
[21:12] <hallyn> it'll complain about memory segments not being the same or somesuch
[21:12] <hallyn> at what level though.  some ppl are doing qemu migration by hand.  there yo ubasically get no feedback at the source site, other than that the vm kept running instead of stopping
[21:13] <hallyn> some are using libvirt.  we coudl indeed try to fix it automatically there, but it would not be simple.  the destination would have to detect it, then tell the source to restart
[21:13] <hallyn> the ipxe-precise package would be needed regardless,
[21:15] <hallyn> for qemu users really it can't be automaticed more tha nit is - you specify the target machine type with 'qemu -M pc-1.0-precise', jsuts as you would otherwise do 'qemu -M pc-1.0'.  you have to specify it regardless.
[21:15] <infinity> hallyn: Right, not disputing the need for the new package, just thinking that we can do better than "oh, yeah, that failed because you need to read obscure doc X".
[21:16] <infinity> hallyn: For qemu, it could still be trapped, I'd think.  If -M pc-1.0 runs into the memory segment consistency issue, can we not do some checksums, compare to our other ipxe on disk, go "oh, no, we need that one", and reboot with that machine type?
[21:16] <hallyn> we have discussed making the fallback to the pc-1.0-precise the default;  that would throw users who were using 'pc-1.0' in trusty (which some would say would be their own fault, but i think that's not quite true)
[21:16] <infinity> hallyn: Thus eliminating the need for people or tools to specify -precise at all, we just twiddle it.
[21:17] <hallyn> rharper: ^ got a job for you :)
[21:17] <rharper> hallyn: sup
[21:17] <hallyn> infinity: it may be possible
[21:17] <hallyn> i'm not sure we can restart at that level
[21:17] <hallyn> sure we can always re-exec ourselves :)
[21:17] <infinity> It's all just a userspace program, you can restart at any level.
[21:17] <infinity> You just need some cleverness.
[21:17] <hallyn> do we want cleverness in an sru?
[21:18] <infinity> I'd rather cleverness than something that technically fixes the issue but is hard to discover.
[21:18] <hallyn> so yeah, it should be possible.  detect an old vga size paired with pc-1.0, then re-exec ourselves with "-M pc-1.0-precise"
[21:18] <infinity> At worst, I'd like it to be able to detect the issue and print "you probably want -M pc-1.0-precise", but once we've gone that far trapping it, a bit more clever to JDTRT might be the best option.
[21:18] <rharper> hallyn: if I'm reading backscroll right, neither qemu nor libvirt are the right place to "detect" which type to be used
[21:19] <hallyn> then what is?
[21:19] <infinity> qemu seems like the ideal lowest common denominator.
[21:19] <infinity> It's the only one that knows something's broken.
[21:19] <hallyn> if we *could* have qemu just re-exec itself, then libvirt wouldn't need to do anything
[21:19] <rharper> at the end of the day, folks without a higher level management tool which makes migration and machine type decisions (versus taking hte defaults which is what both do) it's going to be trouble getting it "right"
[21:20] <hallyn> infinity: so to be clear the machine type as such is not passed from source to destination
[21:20] <rharper> not sure I follow the re-exec -- when migration fails you retain the original qemu -- and IIUC folks don't want to actually have to reboot/restart their qemu VM
[21:20] <hallyn> rharper: re-exec the destination
[21:20] <rharper> who?
[21:20] <hallyn> and somehow signal the source to restart :)
[21:20] <hallyn> itself
[21:20] <rharper> no one is reexecting in the qemu case
[21:20] <rharper> libvirt *could* but that's just a guess
[21:20] <rharper> and what if migration fails for some other reason
[21:20] <hallyn> qemu could do it itself.
[21:20] <rharper> no way to know that it should do that
[21:21] <infinity> What if it fails for "some other reason'?
[21:21] <infinity> I don't care about some other reason.
[21:21] <infinity> I'm specifically curious about "pc-1.0" failing due to this specific issue.
[21:21] <hallyn> detect that vgasize is that of pc-1.0-precise while m-t is pc-1.0.  D oit only in that case
[21:21] <rharper> how long do you want and how many times do we want qemu to keep rexecing itself ?
[21:21] <hallyn> infinity: but i still don't know how we could tell the source qemu to re-start migration
[21:21] <infinity> Which should be entirely solvable by detecting the situation and swithcing to pc-1.0-precise.
[21:21] <rharper> this all seems crazy hacky
[21:22] <hallyn> rharper: agreed, but the goal of something easier ofr the user to discover is laudible
[21:22] <rharper> scan some part of the incoming migration data, some how track these parts in some state (or write it out) so it can recall what happened the last N times we re-exec'ed ourselves ?
[21:23] <hallyn> rharper: yup, write out what we've read so far, re-exec ourselves with -m pc-1.0-precise;  if we're already exec'd with that we just fail
[21:23] <infinity> hallyn: So, the problem here is that qemu itself is also doing the migration?  This isn't fed to it by some higher level tool?  (I'm mostly ignorant to how this works).
[21:23] <rharper> that sounds like a really bad idea w.r.t keep state, how to handle if the file is still around, or if it contains bogus data, or ...
[21:23] <hallyn> infinity: right, the two qemu processes do it with a'migrate' API
[21:23] <hallyn> rharper: it works for upstart :)
[21:23] <infinity> And who triggers the migration?  Source or destination?
[21:23] <rharper> qemu can't migrate itself -- it always requires a third party to initiate migration
[21:23] <hallyn> both :)
[21:24] <rharper> neither
[21:24] <rharper> mgmt
[21:24] <hallyn> destination is started with "-incoming tcp:<IP_ADDRESS>:5555"
[21:24] <hallyn> source is told "migrate tcp:a.b.c.d:5555"
[21:24] <rharper> management application ( most likely libvirt ) is issued a migration command to the source (with the destination URL);
[21:25] <rharper> and mgmt app does as hallyn describes under the covers;
[21:25] <infinity> Okay, but once it's started, the destination knows the source, as it has an open TCP connection to it.
[21:25] <hallyn> and qemu does the migration :P
[21:25] <hallyn> yup
[21:25] <infinity> So, no need to save temp files or other ugliness.
[21:25] <rharper> we can't modify the migration protocol
[21:25] <infinity> You detect the bad memory segment, and restart the source migration.
[21:26] <rharper> source doesn't retain any state w.r.t migration succeeding or failing, the mgmt application can/could
[21:26] <hallyn> infinity: if we make that kind of change, supporting/backporting future CVEs until 2019 is gonna hurt
[21:26] <infinity> Bleh.  Maybe.
[21:26] <infinity> I just see limited value in non-discoverable ways to work around bugs.
[21:26] <hallyn> well lemme put it another way - i don't believe any 'ordinary user' is going to migrate vms from P->T
[21:27] <infinity> And "we documented it somewhere, really" isn't discoverable.
[21:27] <hallyn> we saw limited value in supporting this at all, but ablight needed it enough that he wrote the patches himself to fix it.  his own site is done entirely with thie rown mgmt toold
[21:27] <rharper> honestly, the easiest fix I'd say for 99% of folks is to shutdown your Precise VM, modify the machine type to pc-1.0-precise
[21:27] <rharper> and then we're all good
[21:27] <rharper> or offline migration to trusty
[21:27] <hallyn> agreed.  this is mainly for ppl who have tons of customers not willing to shut down
[21:27] <infinity> rharper: sure, but those people need to be told to do that.
[21:28] <hallyn> but we can't predict how they're using this.  if they're using netcat to a qemu monitor socket they won't see any info we try to hand them
[21:28] <infinity> Anyhow, I'm not saying magic is a blocker for this, I'm just examining if there are better ways.
[21:28] <rharper> indeed;  I don't think there is an easy package-specific place to do this...
[21:29] <hallyn> so right now what happens is - they try to migrate, it fails.  the question is, is there any better way - other than release notes and/or a lp bug - to let them know that hey they can re-try it like this
[21:29] <infinity> I'm more concerned about if this will come up again between 14.04 and 16.04, etc.
[21:29] <hallyn> that shouldn't, that's why we have the pc-i440fx-trusty machine type
[21:29] <hallyn> so we can do magic
[21:29] <infinity> hallyn: Release Notes are useless to communicate to users on release day, they're even worse after.
[21:29] <hallyn> we could do magic if we didn't care about 14.04 pc-1.0 users
[21:30] <infinity> hallyn: So, a special trusty machine type is a start, but I assume this still implies we might need 14.04 ROMs in 16.04?
[21:30] <infinity> hallyn: So, better magic for the users, same mess for us? :)
[21:30] <rharper> documenting on wiki and socializing the document
[21:30] <rharper> that's not the best, but better than nothing
[21:31] <hallyn> infinity: we will need old roms, yes.  fixing that is not up to us, but up to the qemu folks.  they believe it's up to distros to work that out.
[21:31] <infinity> I wonder if/how this affects non-BIOS arches.
[21:31] <infinity> OVMF, SLOF, etc.
[21:31] <hallyn> egads, for that matter, we never got qemu-slof ot compile for utopic
[21:31] <hallyn> ("that reminds me")
[21:32] <infinity> hallyn: Err, never got it to compile?
[21:32] <infinity> hallyn: Is it currently sad?
[21:32] <hallyn> correct.
[21:33] <infinity> binutils segv.  Exciting.
[21:33] <infinity> I can look at that in a bit.
[21:33] <hallyn> infinity: now the roms have to change their size to the next o(log n) or something before it matters that they changed, which odesn 'thappen much.  otherwise new roms are fine during migration.
[21:33] <hallyn> but when thta does happen, then we need to package the old roms and direct qemu to them.
[21:33] <hallyn> on the bright side, we can do that automatically
[21:33] <hallyn> (for the user, not for us)
[21:34] <infinity> This all sounds a whole like some serious design flaws. ;)
[21:34] <rharper> fwiw I do believe this is something that QEMU should address upstream, but it's not an easy thing to do
[21:35] <infinity> Alright, so I'm not happy about, but can accept "manual migration, icky forward-ported ROMs, and socializing docs", but I'd really like better answers.
[21:35] <infinity> The docs part goes away for 14.04->16.04, so that's a plus, but the rest still looks sketchy.
[21:36] <rharper> the idea of a OS or VM being bound to a machine, is very much like real hardware ... and part of real hardware (and virtual) is the BIOS/Firmware/Blob -- that ought to be something we can encapsulate (if users desire)
[21:36] <rharper> and possibly included in the payload of the VM.
[21:36] <infinity> rharper: Effectively, save the firmware blobs that the VM was started with as an nvram blob that gets reused and passed around?
[21:36] <infinity> That has the disadvantage that it's then hard to upgrade the firmware.
[21:37] <infinity> But I guess this is a case where having and eating cake might just be really hard.
[21:37] <infinity> Or impossible.
[21:39] <rharper> infinity: I think it can be worked out -- the nvram stuff already has a "writable" drive that needs to be kept with the the VM
[21:40] <rharper> no reason that we couldn't keep/load/write roms for BIOS as well -- but we need to think carefully about how to handle the permissions needed to host these VMs that can care and update their own BIOS
[21:40] <rharper> with something like qcow2 (or other metadata drive files) one could even mark out hidden partitions to hold this... but it's seriously like a qemu 3.0 sort of feature as it will cut across all of QEMU
[21:41] <hallyn> rharper: did you mention recently that you were talking about just that with qemu upstream?  What sort of venue was that, i.e. email/irc, and is there a log?
[21:41] <infinity> rharper: Yeah, that sounds rather complex and whacky.
[21:41] <rharper> hallyn: not upstream, with alex
[21:41] <rharper> hallyn: I probably have the log
[21:48] <hallyn> rharper: oh, ok, i thought you had told alex you'd been talking with upstream about something like that.  nm then
[21:56] <hallyn> infinity: so really, the libvirt patch could be tweaked so that if /etc/libivrt/qemu.conf does not have 'assume_incoming_qemukvm = 1' and machine type is pc-1.0, it spits a warning out "if migration fails, try setting that"
[21:58] <ari-tczew> do we still use subscribing to ~ubuntu-release for FFe reviews?
[22:00] <infinity> ari-tczew: Yeah.  It does hurt to poke people on IRC too, though.
[22:01] <infinity> cjwatson: Want to lob a grub2-signed at the queue too, or should I do that?
[22:02] <cjwatson> infinity: I was going to do that, yeah.
[22:38] <cjwatson> infinity: ^-
[22:40] <infinity> cjwatson: Ta.
[23:44] <xnox> infinity: Laney: poke re:FFe Bug #1372367
[23:44] <ubot2> bug 1372367 in btrfs-tools (Ubuntu Utopic) "FFe Upgrade btrfs-tools to 3.16" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1372367


[01:25] <pting> this is probably totally preference, but where would you guys mount an EBS device in amazon's EC2? a directory in /mnt or a directory in / ?
[01:26] <twb> pting: what does FHS 2.3 say?
[01:26] <twb> IIRC it says that /media is for removable media, and /mnt is for temporary sysadmin mounts.
[01:27] <twb> Personally, I would typically (ab)use /srv/<type of service> or even just /srv, since Debian Policy requires that packages leave that directory alone.
[01:29] <pting> twb, i see. thanks. i've never read the FHS docs before.. i'll read through it. thanks.
[01:29] <twb> It's only a couple of pages.
[01:30] <twb> The wikipedia article is probably easier to read, though
[01:30] <pting> cool
[03:46] <pting> how do i apt-get install mysql server without having it prompt for a root password? i'm using puppet to deploy these things and it's failing because of the password prompt
[03:51] <twb> pting: pre-seed the answer.
[03:59] <pting> twb, thanks. i couldn't seem to figure out the right term to google for
[04:00] <twb> pting: apt-get install installation-guide, read the appendices
[04:00] <twb> pting: also debconf-[gs]et-selections
[04:01] <pting> twb, awesome, thanks
[04:12] <imrazor1> Anybody here ever get Ubuntu up as a WAP/firewall/router?
[04:33] <Elad> I am trying to restart apache and am getting the following error: * Restarting web server apache2
[04:33] <Elad> (98)Address already in use: make_sock: could not bind to address <IP_ADDRESS>:80
[04:33] <Elad> no listening sockets available, shutting down
[04:33] <Elad> Unable to open logs
[04:33] <Elad>    ...fail!
[04:33] <Elad> any ideas?
[04:35] <qman__> Elad, find out what else is bound to <IP_ADDRESS>:80, use netstat or your favorite tool
[04:36] <qman__> because it also erred opening the log file, it's probably another apache process that wasn't started with the init script
[04:36] <qman__> find out what process it is and kill it off
[04:37] <Elad> when I do ps aux|grep apache, there are a couple of apache things running, should I kill them off
[04:37] <Elad> ?
[04:38] <qman__> if you don't need it running, yes
[04:38] <Elad> wow, thanks for the prod
[04:38] <qman__> then try restarting the apache process
[04:38] <Elad> I killed them and now it works
[05:02] <NDNWebmaster> good evening everyone
[05:05] <NDNWebmaster> so I am happy to be building my first ubuntu web server and was wondering if anyone had any pointers
[05:06] <NDNWebmaster> im not sure if i should try hosting my own dns or depend on a service like dyndns for that
[05:06] <NDNWebmaster> i just finished my server install..i have so far run update and upgrade
[05:07] <NDNWebmaster> also during install i let the installer install dns/lamp/openssh/apache2
[05:11] <NDNWebmaster> so no server gurus with any pieces of advice out there?
[05:29] <osmosis> NDNWebmaster, what do you want to know?
[05:30] <osmosis> NDNWebmaster, general pointers?  read docs
[05:30] <osmosis> NDNWebmaster, help.ubuntu.com/community  is your friend
[05:30] <DasEi> NDNWebmaster: crossposting.. , see topic, also
[05:30] <osmosis> NDNWebmaster, id proably go with hosted dns
[05:30] <twb> !anyone > imrazor1
[05:33] <imrazor1> Does anyone know why i get this error when starting hostapd?
[05:33] <imrazor1> Failed to create interface mon.wlan0.
[05:33] <imrazor1> nl80211 driver initialization failed.
[05:38] <pradalvr> I need to configure my phh.ini file on Ubuntu
[05:38] <pradalvr> php.ini
[05:40] <pradalvr> and i don't know how
[05:44] <leftyfb> pradalvr: you've already been given the answer in #ubuntu on EFNet even though you actually already know the answer.
[05:45] <pradalvr> leftyfb: do you have to .. you were the one who told me to come here and ask
[05:46] <pradalvr> go play with ferro
[05:46] <leftyfb> for general help with server related issues. Not ones that have already been answered.
[05:46] <pradalvr> i didnt ask in here
[05:46] <leftyfb> 12:00AM <pradalvr> this is why i need to be here... damn it .. i am getting a Could not save the file /etc/php5/apache2/php.ini.  because of permissions
[05:46] <leftyfb> 12:00AM <plytro> did you sudo edit it?
[05:46] <leftyfb> 12:00AM <leftyfb> pradalvr: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RootSudo
[05:46] <leftyfb> Jan 15 00:20:17 <pradalvr>	i tried to get my cousin to say Sudo and she cried
[05:52] <marshall> i've created a folder at /var/svn, and a group called 'devs' and added myself to it. I've changed the group for /var/svn to 'devs' and added write privileges to group on /var/svn. for some reason it says that i dont have permission to create folders in there. any idea why?
[05:54] <leftyfb> marshall: did you log out and back in after adding yourself to another group?
[05:56] <marshall> leftyfb: oh, thanks
[06:05] <pradalvr> strange how men love helping out other men.. oh well, i don't care.. I normally figure this all out on my own anyway
[06:07] <ScottK> pradalvr: I find that a remarkably odd comment.
[06:07] <pradalvr> not me
[06:09] <ScottK> We I've no idea what your gender is.  From what was copied from the other channel, I think leftyfb is right, you've had your question answered.
[06:19] <pradalvr> do i just add "bind-address = <IP_ADDRESS>" anywhere on the my.cnf?
[06:21] <ScottK> I don't know.  Sorry.
[06:22] <pradalvr> thats what i am talking about... strange
[06:22] <pradalvr> will you ever get a girlfriend? doubt it
[06:27] <cnp2001> hi
[06:28] <cnp2001> i have setup dns server on ubuntu 9.04 i need some help in regards with using dydns with the same is this the appropriate place to ask for the same
[06:29] <ScottK> pradalvr: You have probably been treated roughly in other places but that kind of unpleasantness is not appropriate here.  If you want to go talk to other women about it, I suggest you try the #ubuntu-women channel where they try and encourage women to get involved in Ubuntu.
[06:30] <ScottK> Maltreatment elsewhere does not give you the right to speak to me that way.
[06:30] <leftyfb> ScottK: she might be actually looking for help, but once she gets going she's a troll
[06:31] <ScottK> leftyfb: That's not particularly helpful either.
[06:34] <pradalvr> thank you ScottK
[06:34] <pradalvr> Btw... wants to jump up and down.. i fixed it
[06:36] <ScottK> Congratulations
[06:36] <pradalvr> thanks.. i shocked myself
[06:40] <pradalvr> all i simply asked in the other channel was... how can i configure the php.ini file using Ubuntu.. here also.. all anyone had to type was gksudo gedit /etc/php5/apache2/php.ini   in the terminal. things can not be changed by going to the file like in Microsoft..
[06:41] <pradalvr> conversation over .. instead, i decided to give my opinion about creating a game for little girls to learn the Ubuntu command line
[06:41] <ScottK> I'm glad you worked it out.
[06:41] <ScottK> The answer was also in what was pasted.
[06:42] <pradalvr> then i was banned because my idea seemed stupid
[06:42] <ScottK> From #ubuntu?
[06:42] <pradalvr> no.. i would've had to read threw a bunch of things
[06:43] <pradalvr> yes on efnet
[06:43] <ScottK> Sometimes the help you get is like that.  I'll often give people a hint that will help them learn more than the precise answer for the precise issue.
[06:43] <ScottK> I see.
[06:43] <ScottK> You might find that idea is precisely on topic in #ubuntu-women.
[06:44] <pradalvr> why?
[06:44] <pradalvr> because women give birth and father take off
[06:44] <pradalvr> father
[06:44] <pradalvr> s
[06:44] <ScottK> Because the purpose of that project is to work on getting more inovled in Ubuntu.
[06:44] <ScottK> I think something like what you are suggesting would fit with that goal.
[06:45] <pradalvr> for the women?
[06:45] <pradalvr> and not the men
[06:45] <ScottK> There are both women and men in there, but the men that are there are supportive of their goals.
[06:45] <ScottK> It's mostly women.
[06:45] <pradalvr> smart guys
[06:45] <pradalvr> they know where to go
[06:46] <ScottK> I'd encourage you to visit.
[06:46] <pradalvr> are you there
[06:46] <ScottK> Yes
[06:50] <pradalvr> am i a troll ScottK
[06:52] <ScottK> pradalvr: You were more hostile than we like here when you arrived, but I would not go that far.
[06:52] <ScottK> Good night.
[06:52] <gnac> I still can't seem to get grub to install (9.10).  I'm getting an error that "The 'grub' package failed to install into /target/."
[06:52] <gnac> I tried grub 2 and legacy grub.
[06:52] <pradalvr> thankyou.. probably after being banned
[06:52] <gnac> twb: I don't have any LVM or raid in use.
[06:52] <twb> gnac: context, please
[06:53] <gnac> two lines up: 22:52:09 < gnac> I still cant seem to get grub to install (9.10). ...
[06:53] <twb> gnac: why are you telling me?
[06:54] <gnac> I asked this question last night, and you responded, but by that time I had called it a night.
[06:54] <gnac> 23:40:47 #ubuntu-server: < twb> gnac: one easy way would be if you confused its module auto-detection by placing /boot on LVM on RAID
[06:55] <twb> Ah.
[06:55] <twb> gnac: is the installer still running?
[06:55] <twb> gnac: if so, switch to vt2 and copy the contents of /proc/mounts somewhere, then pastebin it.
[06:56] <gnac> k one sec.
[06:57] <gnac> http://pastebin.com/d6f4e4aa7
[06:58] <gnac> fwiw, I found option in the advanced installer to let me do most of the install over ssh.  I have two ssh sessions open to the server, one the installer, one a simple shell
[07:00] <gnac> oh, I guess I take that back about the raid (on /) but I tried it last night with a monolithic non-lvm partitioning scheme and had the same problem.
[07:00] <twb> gnac: you're using ext4.  Does grub support that?
[07:04] <gnac> twb: yep, all of my other sabayon and gentoo systems are using /ext4 for /boot and /.  It didn't use to, but it has for a little while now.
[07:05] <twb> gnac: are they running the same version of grub?
[07:07] <gnac> what question does 9.10 use?  FWIW, when I did my test run last night, I let ubuntu pick the partitioning etc and it defaults to one partition on / with ext4
[07:09] <gnac> I'm using grub-0.97 here.  I tried the "legacy" (non grub 2) install as well.  both grub and grub 2 failed.
[07:12] <gnac> I could always continue without a boot loader, boot into a gentoo live cd, then install grub into the MBR from the live cd, at least to see if it works.
[07:14] <twb> gnac: grub 0.97 *is* grub legacy
[07:15] <twb> I'd be very surprised if grub legacy supports ext4 at all
[07:17] <gnac> I'm speaking to you from a computer with grub legacy and ext4 on /boot
[07:17] <twb> gnac: does tune2fs -l report that ext4 features are actually in use on that /boot?
[07:18] <twb> Also, #grub can help with grub-2
[07:18] <gnac> twb: So I should clarify, the computer I'm typing on, is a sabayon install with grub 0.97 and ext4.
[07:18] <gnac> the ubuntu-server installer failed on both grub-2 and grub install.
[07:18] <gnac> Which version of legacy grub does ubuntu server use?
[07:19] <twb> http://packages.ubuntu.com/grub-legacy
[07:19] <gnac> IIRC, my kubuntu netbook also uses grub and ext4
[07:19] <twb> http://packages.ubuntu.com/grub, maybe
[07:20] <gnac> karmic uses .97 as well
[07:24] <gnac> bah, now the installer is asking me to insert the cd again.  I never took it out.  I unmounted it and remounted it, but I cant get out of this screen.  i.e. neither <continue> or <go back> works.
[07:24] <gnac> Perhaps I'll try again tomorrow .
[08:02] <alkisg> How can I do what "language-selector" does from the command line? I.e., what are the needed packages for complete support for some language?
[08:02] <alkisg> E.g. sudo apt-get install language-pack-el language-pack-gnome-el language-pack-kde-el language-support-el openoffice.org-l10n-el
[08:02] <alkisg> (or is that kde-l10n-el instead?) Anything missing there?
[08:16] <twb> Noble: the recommended solution is KVM
[08:16] <twb> Noble: but there are lots of virtualization techniques, and most would work
[08:19] <Noble> Say I need max 3 servers
[08:19] <Noble> Could I use virtualbox
[08:19] <Noble> or is that a bad idea?
[08:21] <twb> You could use virtualbox, yes.
[08:21] <twb> However, Ubuntu recommends KVM.
[08:21] <Noble> I see. Follow me on this.
[08:22] <Noble> The host is also gonna be a workstation, for echonomical reasons.
[08:22] <Noble> Then, would virtualbox, or KVM be the best?
[08:22] <Noble> Virtualbox is not recommended because of the non GPL extensions, or is there something else?
[08:24] <twb> Well, KVM is also endorsed by Linux and (via libvirt) Red Hat.
[08:24] <twb> I personally don't approve of virtualbox because the *existence* of proprietary components indicates the project isn't committed to being a good FOSS citizen.
[08:25] <twb> It also seems oriented toward deployment on single-user-laptop rather than the headless multi-user servers I care about.
[08:26] <Noble> Do you know if its possible to import virtual machines between for instance KVM and Virtualbox?
[08:26] <Noble> twb, i see
[08:29] <simplexio> vbox is probably best when you want get virtual desktop and features needed in that
[08:30] <simplexio> when talkin about virtualizationfor server quests, then there is Xen which has lost lately to kvm
[08:31] <Noble> how will it work to connect to a deamon running on a virtual machine?
[08:32] <Noble> I'm planning to move the MS SBS 2008 install to a virtual machine
[08:32] <Noble> Is that an issue?
[08:39] <jiboumans> good morning folks
[08:45] <twb> Noble: dunno, I don't do Microsoft.
[08:45] <twb> Neither KVM nor (I think) Virtualbox will care what kind of OS is being virtualized.
[08:46] <twb> Xen, VMWare Server and OpenVZ *do* care, but I don't know if they support Microsoft products.
[08:46] <da65> I noticed on my server that the Bind dns server is not running and it will not start, any ideas?
[08:47] <twb> Of course, if your SBS server is exporting its display over RDP, you don't *need* to ever display its "local" screen, so KVM would be perfectly adequate
[08:47] <da65> having probs with websites resolving correctly so I guess this the problem
[08:47] <twb> da65: did you look at the log files?  Did you turn on debugging?
[08:48] <da65> no and not sure will take a look
[08:48] <da65> its a fresh insall
[08:48] <da65> install even
[08:48] <twb> da65: that would depend on whether resolv.conf goes through your local bind service.
[08:48] <twb> da65: bind is not installed on a fresh install
[08:49] <da65> oh, it seems to be there but will not start, from Plesk control panel
[08:49] <twb> da65: then whatever plesk gives you is not standard
[08:50] <da65> is there a command to see if it is installed
[08:50] <simplexio> isnt vbox rdp feature in binary only version?
[08:50] <twb> simplexio: if the virtualized server exports RDP, then vbox wouldn't need to do anything
[08:51] <twb> Other than bridging/NATting the network, that is
[08:51] <twb> simplexio: I suspect you're confusing that with vbox providing its own RDP service to the virtual machine's physical keyboard/video/mouse
[08:52] <twb> s/physical/emulated/
[08:52] <twb> da65: there is.
[08:53] <simplexio> yeah. i know
[08:54] <simplexio> umm.. well ( ihavent used) but vbox has "own" rdp server i think, attleast there is conf in GUI, then like we all kno you can run anything what you want in quest. so that what i meant
[09:10] <twb> Contrariwise, qemu (kvm) has the ability to display the local screen/keyboard using curses, stdio or on new ptys
[09:11] <twb> For me, that is FAR FAR better than rasterizing the 80x25 head that I'm talking to.
[09:11] <twb> (Of course, you have to fight with gfxboot and grub-pc, but this is not too difficult.)
[09:15] <Birmaan> morning
[09:25] <soren> ttx: So... A name for the team that will own the regression test build? ubuntu-server-qa?
[09:25] <ttx> ah
[09:27] <ttx> soren: yes, that sounds perfect.
[09:27]  * ttx feels uncreative today
[09:30] <soren> ttx: Hm.. I want to make it open so as many people as possible can "subscribe" to the build failure e-mails from the ppa..
[09:30] <soren> ..but membership of the team (currently) implies ability to upload to the ppa.
[09:31] <ttx> hm hm
[09:31] <ttx> so you can't get the PPA email without the ability to break everything ?
[09:31] <soren> While I don't expect anyone to add this ppa to their sources.list, it still seems undesirable.
[09:31] <soren> Perhaps I'm making a big deal out of nothing. The possible impact is miniscule, I suppose.
[09:32] <soren> ttx: Hmm... Well.. Heh.
[09:32] <soren> ttx: I /could/ change the contact e-mail for the user in the team to that of the ubuntu-server-bugs mailing list, for instance.
[09:32] <ttx> would there be a way to add some gateway as a member ?
[09:33] <ttx> right
[09:33] <soren> AFAICT, the criteria for receiving the e-mails and for being able to upload are identical.
[09:33] <soren> ...except if we do the mailing list trick.
[09:33] <ttx> I suggest we do.
[09:35] <soren> Hm, hm..
[09:35] <soren> There's still an attack vector if someone really wanted to mess with things.
[09:35] <soren> Oh, no, there's not.
[09:35] <soren> my bad.
[09:35] <soren> Well, then we don't even need the team.
[09:36] <da65> all sorted, thanks.
[09:41] <soren> ttx: Darn it.
[09:41] <soren> This is always so tricky.
[09:41] <soren> ttx: Only one user or team can have a particular e-mail set in Launchpad. ubuntu-server already has ubuntu-server-bugs as its contact e-mail, so ubuntu-server-qa can't as well.
[09:42] <ttx> soren: and I'm sure it's a feature, not a coincidence :)
[09:43] <soren> Screw it, I'll just let people who care join ubuntu-server-qa.
[09:43] <soren> ttx: Yeah :)
[09:46] <soren> ttx: Done. https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-server-qa open for business.
[09:47] <soren> ttx: Should I just force-add canonical-server?
[09:47] <ttx> I want a funny badge.
[09:47] <ttx> that makes sense.
[09:47] <soren> Of course you do.
[09:48] <soren> Invitation sent.
[09:48] <soren> ttx: Only you and jiboumans can accept it these days.
[09:49] <ttx> looking
[09:49]  * jiboumans pushes ttx under the bus^W^W^W^Wvolunteers ttx
[09:49] <ttx> done
[09:50] <soren> Neat.
[09:50]  * soren triggers an upload.
[09:54] <maxagaz> hi, after changing /boot/grub/menu.lst, do i need to restart grub ?
[09:55] <soren> maxagaz: "restart grub" makes very little sense. grub is the bootloader. Anything you change in its configuration will only affect the boot process.
[09:56] <maxagaz> soren, ok, so i don't need to reload anything after making change in this this file, right ?
[09:56] <soren> maxagaz: You need to reboot to see the changes in effect (such is the nature of bootloaders), but otherwise, no.
[09:57] <maxagaz> soren, thanks
[09:57] <soren> maxagaz: Sure.
[09:59]  * soren likes it when PPA buildds aren't congested
[10:04] <soren> ttx: http://people.canonical.com/~soren/autotest-results/default/results.html
[10:04]  * soren runs a larger test battery
[10:06] <ttx> cool.
[10:06]  * soren glances at uvirtbot`
[10:07] <da65> is there a ubuntu-server security alert mail list I can join, I just unsubscribed from Debian one?
[10:08] <da65> suprising how busy the Deb one was actually
[10:09] <jiboumans> soren++ sweet
[10:15] <da65> anyone running Boinc here?
[10:15] <soren> jiboumans: Making all those step files was rather tedious, but the result is pretty slick :)
[10:28] <ulaas> hi, member:what is the best way to assign eth0 name to any adapter i choose on 9.10
[10:43] <soren> ulaas: Look in /etc/udev/rules.d/70-persistent-net.rules
[10:43] <soren> ulaas: If it's not immediately obvious what to do, just ask again.
[10:44] <ulaas> soren: is it the recommended way, or a hack only?
[10:44] <soren> ulaas: It's /the/ way.
[10:45] <soren> That is the authoritative definition of the device<->name mapping.
[10:45] <ulaas> thanks
[10:45] <soren> sure.
[10:47] <soren> ttx: Yay, first build failures trickling in.
[10:47] <soren> fsvo "yay".
[10:53] <Italian_Plumber1> I want to put this controller card http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815124023 in an old machine, Pentium III, running hardy.  Will I have problems getting ubuntu to "recognize" the card?
[11:02] <soren> Italian_Plumber1: Any particular reason you want that card?
[11:02] <soren> Italian_Plumber1: If it's because it does "RAID", don't bother.
[11:03] <Italian_Plumber1> I'm looking for a card under 25, mainly.
[11:03] <DasEi> Italian_Plumber1: prbly not, but check by the chipset /compare to known working models
[11:03] <soren> Italian_Plumber1: Is it because you've used up the existing connections in the system?
[11:03] <Italian_Plumber1> raid would be nice but just an added bonus really.  I'm only getting one HD to go with it.
[11:04] <soren> That card doesn't actually do RAID.
[11:04] <Italian_Plumber1> no it's because the existing system has no SATA ports
[11:04] <soren> Ok.
[11:04] <Italian_Plumber1> it doesn't do RAID?
[11:05] <soren> If it's less than $300, there's no way it actually does RAID.
[11:05] <soren> And at $300 it would be a steal.
[11:05] <soren> They say they do RAID, but all they really do is provide a BIOSy kind of looking frontend for configuring software raid.
[11:05] <Italian_Plumber1> heh... well if I wanted RAID I'd buy a real NAS, not try to make my own with old crappy equipment
[11:06] <soren> ..and let the OS read that information to actually do the raid thing on their behalf.
[11:06] <DasEi> Italian_Plumber1: if you just want sata, get an adaptor for it
[11:06] <Italian_Plumber1> an adapter isn't a PCI controller card?
[11:06] <soren> Hardware that actually does RAID is /expensive/.
[11:07] <Italian_Plumber1> yeah I knwo we have some at work
[11:07] <soren> Italian_Plumber1: You know.. At $16 I wouldn't even bother with research. I'd just buy the thing, plug it in, and see if it worked :)
[11:08] <soren> If not, it's probably a half decent door stop.
[11:08] <DasEi> Italian_Plumber1: no, they are cheaper and you can run sata on ide with that, but check size limits of bios for that
[11:08] <Italian_Plumber1> can you point me out an example?
[11:08] <DasEi> second
[11:09] <Italian_Plumber1> cause I had no idea that kind of thing existed
[11:10] <DasEi> http://tinyurl.com/yb8m3qf
[11:15] <DasEi> http://www.rexstone.de/_detail_40947.html  ,sorry, missed a line
[11:15] <DasEi> Italian_Plumber1: ^
[11:18] <Italian_Plumber1> yeah I would guess there's a bios limit on the machine of way less than 1TB, which is the size drive I wanna put in there.
[11:21] <DasEi> Italian_Plumber1: so a card will be the better choice, bringing own bios
[11:25]  * soren lunches
[11:33] <DasEi> Italian_Plumber1: one last . if you want to boot from it, also make sure that bios is capable of scanning ( least plgnPlay option)
[11:42] <Italian_Plumber1> no I won't be booting from it
[11:46] <DasEi> so should be no problem then, for compatability : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupport
[11:46] <DasEi> Italian_Plumber1:
[12:31] <Italian_Plumber> wow.  there's only one SATA controller ther.
[12:37] <KTL2> i had a question. while formulating it i solved it. thanks. this is such a helpfull place.
[13:31] <Italian_Plumber> heh... and this will not go in my Abit BH6: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816116025
[13:32] <Parabola> sup mario
[13:32] <Italian_Plumber> what kind of expansion slot IS that? :)
[13:32] <Italian_Plumber> 'sup, half-oval
[13:32] <Parabola> :)
[13:33] <Italian_Plumber> ...er... half-ellipse
[13:33] <Italian_Plumber> sorry
[13:33] <Parabola> its quite alright
[13:33] <Parabola> its also a song by TOOL
[13:33] <Parabola> so either response is acceptable
[13:36] <zul> morning
[13:38] <Italian_Plumber> Sorry.  Anything after "Nirvana" I've never heard of :)
[13:49] <acalvo> hi
[13:49] <acalvo> which is the default charset for ubuntu 9.04 and 9.10?
[13:49] <acalvo> UTF-8?
[14:02] <Italian_Plumber> when I run the latest openssl update on my desktop ubuntu, it tells me I need to restart.  There is no corresponding notice when upgrading the server.  Is this normal?
[14:03]  * zul shoots amazon in the head
[14:04] <zul> ttx: the amazon ec2 libraries doesnt have a license file
[14:04] <BrixSat> hello
[14:05] <BrixSat> what should be the permitions of user public_html so the apache and php can create folders inside and read files
[14:09] <BrixSat> i need users to upload files to their home and if in public_html apache needs to read the files and also php and it does happens permition denied or error 505 depending on the operation
[14:23] <sommer> BrixSat: you can try giving www-data group rwx on the directory
[14:23] <BrixSat> sommer with chown?
[14:24] <sommer> chgrp is what I usually use
[14:25] <BrixSat> but if i do that will the user have access using ftp to write and read fils
[14:26] <sommer> BrixSat: sure if the user owns the directory
[14:26] <sommer> you can have different owner and group permissions
[14:26] <BrixSat> nice :D can you give me a hint on the chgrp
[14:26] <sommer> sudo chgrp www-data /home/$user/public_html, or whatever the path is
[14:27] <sommer> basically the same as a chown
[14:28] <BrixSat> You don't have permission to access /~tiago/ on this server.
[14:28] <BrixSat> :/ i have the folder to 604 should it be 755?
[14:30] <sommer> BrixSat: you might try 775
[14:31] <sommer> that'd give the owner and group rwx and world rx
[14:32] <BrixSat> and if i want to deny world to rx only owner rwx and apache rwx and others none
[14:32] <BrixSat> is it 750?
[14:32] <sommer> yep, but you want the www-data group to have write so it'd be 770
[14:33] <BrixSat> ok :)
[14:33] <BrixSat> 770 wont work
[14:33] <BrixSat> i get an error
[14:34] <BrixSat> You don't have permission to access /~tiago/
[14:34] <Parabola> do 755
[14:34] <BrixSat> ok working
[14:36] <BrixSat> but if i upload a file using ftp i can edit it using apache and php going to see permiton on ftp server
[14:43] <BrixSat> nice :D
[14:50] <BrixSat> my octal mask in proftp is 022 should i change it also to 755 ?
[14:56] <jiboumans> ttx, smoser: use (sprint) ...
[14:57] <jiboumans> ttx: bluesprint?
[14:57] <BrixSat> no it is not correct i edited /etc/adduser.conf and added the EXTRA_GROUPS= www-data but still not working new user wont be able to view its public_www
[14:59] <BrixSat> my mistake a mising permition :p
[14:59] <BrixSat> working ok now :d
[15:03] <ttx> zul:  which libraries ?
[15:04] <zul> the php libraries from amazon should I talk to chunger to get amazon to add that?
[15:19] <refnumzx> trying to upgrade to ubuntu 9.10 during the do-release-upgrade console-setup freezes everything else seems to work except for the items that depend on console-setup. ideas?
[15:38] <ttx> zul: well, asking them to license their stuff properly can't hurt
[15:38] <zul> ttx: k ill bug chunger about it when he wakes up
[15:57] <refnumzx> trying to resolve this console-setup issue.  ubuntu-minimal depends on it, and it keeps on freezing.
[16:35] <zul> mathiaz: hey did you know that mario already converted mysql to upstart?
[16:36] <mathiaz> zul: I noticed that on the BP whiteboard - that's I know it
[16:36] <mathiaz> zul: I haven't seen the upstart job (neither how mario is)
[16:37] <zul> it looks sparse but i havent tried to run mysql on lucid yet
[16:38] <zul> still running the frigging testsuite
[16:38] <genii> refnumzx: Does: locale                  show LANG and LC_CTYPE     as set to something?
[16:44] <refnumzx> genii: yupen_us.utf8
[16:51] <soren> ?!?
[16:51] <soren> jiboumans: I'm assigned to this: https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/server-lucid-puppet-etckeeper-integration
[16:52] <soren> jiboumans: Is that intentional?
[16:52] <jiboumans> ?!?!?! soren: yes
[16:52] <soren> Fascinating.
[16:55] <possumguy> hey all, is it safe to set parameters via tune2fs on a mounted filesystem?
[16:57] <dasunsru1e32> not the best idea
[16:59] <possumguy> well after asking i found a mailing list entry from the almighty Theodore Tso saying it is safe. if im not back in 5, then my filesystems are fine. :P
[17:03] <TNorbut> Need help with an ACPI issue on boot.  acpi: i/o resource piix4_smbus [0x1040-0x10471]     conflicts with acpi region smb_
[17:05] <BrixSat2> . /home/aromacri/public_html/.htaccess: Options not allowed here  --> http://pastebin.com/f672ee374
[17:07] <Jeeves_> AllowOverride
[17:20] <ivoks> hi
[17:22] <ivoks> we are aware that lucid has significant regression in postgresql performance?
[17:22] <jiboumans> ivoks: i'm not part of that we at least
[17:23] <jiboumans> what's going on?
[17:23] <ivoks> kernel issue
[17:23] <ivoks> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=linux_perf_regressions&num=1
[17:23] <ivoks> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=ubuntu_lucid_alpha2&num=3
[17:24] <jiboumans> sounds pretty bad -- good opportunity to file a kernel bug if we dont have one already
[17:28] <ivoks> apparently, this is the issue:
[17:28] <ivoks> http://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/torvalds/linux-2.6.git;a=commit;h=5f3481e9a80c240f169b36ea886e2325b9aeb745
[17:29] <ivoks> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=linux_perf_regressions&num=2
[17:29] <ivoks> ext4 is killing us
[17:29] <ivoks> maybe we should stay with ext3 as default for servers :)
[17:30]  * ScottK has exactly zero ext4 systems.
[17:32] <ivoks> eh, how about putting different defaults for server and desktop filesystems?
[17:37] <Sam-I-Am> i'm a fan of xfs
[17:37] <ivoks> me too
[17:37] <Sam-I-Am> been using it for 10 years now without any problems
[17:37] <Sam-I-Am> i think it was way too early for ubuntu server at least to adopt ext4 as the default
[17:46] <refnumzx> i was considering using ext4 on a media drive. what problems do we have with it?
[17:48] <refnumzx> i did a release-upgrade from jaunty to karmic console-setup is hanging on keymap install.  ubuntu-minimal and kbd are not installing because  of it. i want to be able to reboot into the new kernel.  advice? i have resarted all the consoles, made sure locale returns en-us.utf8, but no go.
[17:51] <Sam-I-Am> refnumzx: i heard it has issues with large files
[17:52] <TNorbut> Need help with an ACPI issue on boot.  acpi: i/o resource piix4_smbus [0x1040-0x10471]     conflicts with acpi region smb_
[17:52] <refnumzx> sam-i-am: large files? 2tb or 2gb?
[17:52] <Sam-I-Am> i think 500 mb
[17:53] <Sam-I-Am> although i heard that was fixed in an update, you'd need to search around the bug reports
[17:53] <refnumzx> hmm. well i don't have any files larger then that video/music. i like the snapshot features in ext4
[17:53] <ivoks> ext4?
[17:53] <ivoks> ext4 doesn't have issues with large files :)
[17:53] <zul> google is using it so everyone must use it
[17:54] <ivoks> not yet :/
[17:54] <zul> but but google!
[17:54] <ivoks> google doesn't use latest kernel probably
[17:56] <zul> ivoks: google!
[18:25] <ruben23>  hi guys, how do i mount cifs on windows client pc so i can see its share file or drive
[18:25] <ruben23> may puprpose actually is to copy a backup file form my linux server to windows client pc drive..
[18:42] <refnumzx> during an upgrade from jaunty to karmic, console-setup hangs during install. i have restarted tty1-6 and tried setup again. locales are configured properly, but it still fails.
[18:45] <genii> ruben23: Make sure smbfs is installed. Then like:  sudo mount -t cifs //x.x.x.x/sharename /local/mountpoint -o username=valid-windows-box-username         where x.x.x.x is the IP of the windows machine, sharename is what the Windows box is calling it's exported share, /local/mountpoint is the directory in your linux machine to mount the contents into, etc
[18:46] <genii> ruben23: man mount.cifs has much info on options
[18:58] <nikolaj_basher> Hi :D I have a problem with DAVical anyone who can help?? please
[19:37] <zul> mathiaz: can you look over server-lucid-improve-testcases real quick/
[19:39] <mathiaz> zul: right - what do you want feedback on?
[19:39] <zul> mathiaz: overall feedback would be good
[19:39] <mathiaz> zul: Need more feedback on Mathias ISO testcoverage?
[19:40] <zul> yep
[19:40] <mathiaz> zul: I think the list of test cases to be added is good
[19:41] <zul> sounds good to me
[19:41] <zul> thanks!
[19:44] <zul> mathiaz: can you add that to the whiteboard?
[19:44] <mathiaz> zul: sure
[19:54] <Skaag> Can LVM be used to create a Raid5 volume?
[19:54] <Skaag> or do I have to use the standard Raid physical partition?
[19:55] <neonfreon> make a regular raid device first and then lvm on top ofit
[19:55] <firekool> on ubuntu server I can not seam to install gnome-desktop get  Some index files failed to download, they have been ignored, or old ones used instead.
[19:56] <Skaag> gotcha
[19:56] <firekool> after apt-get update get a can not find package gnome-desktop
[20:00] <mjeanson> firekool: usually means your apt mirror is not responding
[20:01] <mjeanson> or you are using a version of ubuntu that is not supported anymore
[20:02] <firekool> using ubuntu 9.10 default sources list
[20:02] <Skaag> hm...
[20:02] <Skaag> I created two partitions on each of the 4 drives
[20:02] <Skaag> one uses 99% of the drive, the second 1% for swap
[20:02] <Skaag> (resulting in 7.5gb of swap per drive)
[20:03] <Skaag> I set both partitions, on all 4 drives, to be physical device for raid
[20:03] <Skaag> now I went into lvm and setup volume groups, primary using the large 4 partitions on all 4 drives
[20:03] <Skaag> and another volume group called swap, that uses the smaller 4 partitions on those drives
[20:03] <Skaag> and lvm converted those partitions to 'lvm' type
[20:04] <firekool> thanks mjeanson your hint helped me figure out the issue
[20:04] <Skaag> so they can no longer be used for raid
[20:06] <firekool> silly me put the gateway address wrong
[20:06] <mjeanson> skaag: you will have to create a raid array first with mdadm, then create a volume group on top of that
[20:06] <kirkland> jcastro: yeah, he's aliguori in #ubuntu-virt
[20:07] <Skaag> I see
[20:12] <mjeanson> skaag: an interresting read: http://advosys.ca/viewpoints/2007/04/setting-up-software-raid-in-ubuntu-server/
[20:20] <Skaag> mjeanson: I have 4 drives, and I want raid 5, would you use 3 and make the fourth a hot-spare if you were me? :-)
[20:20] <Skaag> I can afford to sacrifice the space
[20:20] <mjeanson> then I'd go for it
[20:26] <pting> so i'm using puppet to deploy mysql on an amazon ec2 instance. how do i tell apt-get to not start mysql after installing?
[20:27] <pting> hum, maybe it's in one of the in one of the preseed questions or something...
[20:27] <Skaag> no it's not
[20:27] <Skaag> maybe you can create a file in /etc/default that tells it not to start automatically
[20:28] <Skaag> but I can tell you for sure it doesn't ask whether or not to start the instance
[20:28] <Skaag> at the very least it must start it to create the debian-sys-maint user
[20:29] <pting> Skaag, doh, ya.. i think im gonna have to do some custom script... i'm basically trying to puppet deploy it, but the datadir is pointed to a directory  that first needs to be mounted, but i want to ensure the owners of the directory is mysql:mysql, but i can't ensure that cause mysql user/group hasn't been created yet without first apt-get installing heh
[20:30] <Skaag> you can create them
[20:30] <Skaag> it will use them
[20:30] <Skaag> just make sure to use the right uid/gid for it
[20:31] <pting> oh, explicitly creating them.. i see.. ya should have thought about that first
[20:31] <Skaag> then you will be sure the permissions on your mount will persist
[20:31] <pting> cool, thanks
[20:32] <Skaag> mjeanson: ok so now I have two raid devices, one is 1.5TB, another is 15GB, and they both have LVM on them
[20:33] <Skaag> now I'm stuck not knowing how to get the first one to be the / partition, and the second one to be used as swap ;-)
[20:33] <mhall119|work> good afternoon
[20:33] <Skaag> this is all in the 9.10 server installer
[20:33] <mhall119|work> so I have a 9.04 server that's been running along like a champ, but I'd like to upgrade to 9.10 for some newer packages
[20:33] <mhall119|work> in desktop, you're supposed to use update-manager for upgrading releases
[20:33] <mhall119|work> is there is a similar something for ubuntu server?
[20:34] <Skaag> do-release-upgrade
[20:35] <mhall119|work> awesome, thanks
[20:35] <mhall119|work> anything I should be aware of before doing this?
[20:35] <mjeanson> do-release-upgrade -m server
[20:35] <mhall119|work> -m?
[20:36] <mhall119|work> ah, okay
[20:36] <mhall119|work> does the sandbox stuff work?
[20:38] <mjeanson> skaag: first, I would go with only one raid device with lvm on top
[20:46] <cab938> anyone running esxi?
[20:47] <cab938> got a quick question on management
[20:52] <Skaag> mjeanson: which means it can't be the root mount point
[20:52] <Skaag> So the way to go is a small raid ext4 or ext3 partition for /
[20:52] <Skaag> then an lvm partition for /home or /var
[20:53] <sub> cab938: I'm not running ESXi currently but I have in the past, what is your question?
[20:53] <mjeanson> skaag: I tough you were adding storage to an existing server
[20:53] <Skaag> nope this is a new install :-)
[20:54] <mjeanson> skaag: then you will need a normal partition out of lvm to boot
[20:54] <Skaag> but I can boot from a raid partition right?
[20:54] <mjeanson> sure
[20:54] <Skaag> with 9.10
[20:54] <Skaag> so i'll keep that for now
[20:54] <Skaag> it's too simple a server to make it complicated
[20:54] <mjeanson> not sure about raid5, I used nly mirror
[20:54] <Skaag> I mean the job it needs to do is rather simple and non-critical
[20:55] <Skaag> well we're about to find out :-)
[20:56] <mjeanson> I don't think grub can read from a raid5 partition
[20:59] <Skaag> hm.
[20:59] <Skaag> crapola.
[20:59] <Skaag> I'm screwed then.
[21:25] <Skaag> mjeanson: right it doesn't boot from raid5 :-)
[21:32] <Skaag> mjeanson: oh, ok, it somehow booted!
[21:41] <erichammond> pting: Did you figure out how to install mysql without starting the server?
[21:43] <erichammond> pting: I point out one way to avoid this in the comments on this article: http://alestic.com/2010/01/vmbuilder-ebs-boot-ami
[21:43] <erichammond> pting: Search for policy-rc.d
[22:02] <TimoH> Hi there! I spent most of my week to one of our projects from several servers (Apple XServe & Linux) into one VMWare Server 2.0.2 VM using Ubuntu Server 9.10 Server 64bit. Everything is working now, but the file systems are not unmounting properly on shutdown. On every startup I get msgs from fsck. Not sure where to start.
[22:02] <TimoH> (gpmpf, wanted to say "to move one of our projects...")
[22:04] <TimoH> I'm not up to date on linux, having spent most of the last years solely on Mac OS X Server, so please forgive me some basic questions.
[22:06] <TimoH> Let's start with this one: I cannot find out in which file I can find the messages displayed on console during boot-up (fsck, etc.). At least I couldn't find them in /var/log/** and dmesg also doesn't include them.
[22:09] <mjeanson> timoh: there is no bootlog in ubuntu
[22:10] <TimoH> ok, not good for copy&paste...
[22:10] <bogeyd6> TimoH, i got you
[22:10] <mjeanson> the best you get is /var/log/kern.log but it's only the kernel messages
[22:11] <bogeyd6> TimoH, its /var/log/boot
[22:12] <bogeyd6> TimoH, /var/log/dmesg is next
[22:12] <bogeyd6> TimoH, /var/log/fsck if related to that
[22:12] <TimoH> wait a minute, this dreaded vmware "web" console is not working nurrently... (argh)
[22:13] <guntbert> TimoH: mjeanson you can enable the boot log by editing /etc/default/bootlogd
[22:13] <bogeyd6> TimoH, you need to clear the browser cache and reopen the browser
[22:13] <bogeyd6> you are a lucky man, i just happen to be an ubuntu expert on vmware
[22:14] <TimoH> guntbert: Thanks. Changed and rebooting now.
[22:14] <guntbert> TimoH: Good luck :-)
[22:14] <mjeanson> guntbert: I'm pretty sure it's broken on hardy, not sure about newer versions
[22:15] <guntbert> mjeanson: maybe - but in newer versions it is disabled by default too - hence my hint :)
[22:17] <mjeanson> guntbert: yeah, the initscripts are provided by the initscripts package but the bootlog package doesn't exist
[22:18] <mjeanson> there are a lot of longstanding bootlog bugs in launchpad
[22:18] <guntbert> mjeanson: well in karmic there I have it
[22:20] <mjeanson> guntbert: I was reffering to hardy, good to know about karmic
[22:20] <TimoH> (have a local "emergency": daughther vomits, BRB, thx for your help)
[22:21] <bogeyd6> how polite
[22:21] <bogeyd6> we need more of that in the linux world
[22:48] <chmac> Does ext3 track the file creation time as well as the modified and accessed times?
[22:48] <chmac> Nope, found the answer... :-)
[23:23] <TimoH> ok, back in  business. anyone wants to swap memes for the last hour or so? I'm not so sure I want to keep mine...
[23:23] <TimoH> re: politeness in communities: Is it that bad in the linux universe? As mentioned before, haven't been "here" for a while....
[23:23] <TimoH> re: politeness in communities (again): If you want a real nice community, become a WebObjects developer. You'll be a bit lonesome, though.
[23:30] <mathiaz> soren: hey
[23:30] <mathiaz> soren: I'm forwarding you the emails related to puppet-etckeeper integration
[23:31] <TimoH> Ok, obviously no one from the previous conversation is online anymore. So let's try again:
[23:31] <TimoH> I installed Ubuntu Server 9.10 into a VMWare Server 2.0.2 VM.
[23:32] <TimoH> I haven't used Linux for quite a while, so I mostly went with the defaults during installation (LVN & ext4)
[23:33] <TimoH> Now that all of my apps are working fine, I have the problem, that the file systems are not unmounted cleanly on shutdown.
[23:34] <TimoH> And I have no idea where to start searching.
[23:34] <TimoH> Anyone?
[23:44] <soren> mathiaz: Thanks.
[23:46] <uvirtbot`> New bug: #508179 in mysql-dfsg-5.0 (universe) "MySQL 5.0 install error" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/508179


[21:17] <bluesabre> I'm meeting with the other flavor leads and desktop team tomorrow. Does anybody have anything they want me to bring up? Going to push for getting Xubuntu Core  official at least.
[21:47] <Unit193> Thanks. :3


[09:39] <jarnos> What to do when upgrading from 18.04 to 20.04 seems to fail. At least the dialog showing progress of upgrade is corrupted.
[09:41] <jarnos> Actually, before that I restarted upgrade that failed after this: It complained about running xscreensaver. I exited xscreensaver and disabled a systemd scrvice I had for suspending.
[09:42] <pmjdebruijn> what's the exact error?
[09:42] <jarnos> The restarted upgrade continued as partial upgrade and seemed to work for a while.
[09:42] <jarnos> I don't know. The dialog is corrupted and I don't know what it is doing.
[09:42] <pmjdebruijn> what does "corrupted" mean?
[09:43] <pmjdebruijn> but if so, run the upgrade on a terminal as opposed the GUI
[09:44] <pmjdebruijn> though, personally I prefer reinstalls as opposed to upgrades for desktop systems
[09:44] <jarnos> It does not draw its content. If I e.g. use alt-tab to switch the app on foreground and switch back, it has the content of the other app.
[09:45] <pmjdebruijn> like I said, do the upgade on the console
[09:52] <jarnos> Well, I think package management is corrupted. dpkg is in interuptable sleep. I guess it is holding back the dialog.
[09:53] <pmjdebruijn> that does not happen easily
[09:54] <pmjdebruijn> jarnos: reinstalling may very well be faster, and you end up with a clean system, as opposed trying to fix your current situation
[17:33] <hereiamsorryandh> Hello, I'm going to buy a computer and run Xubuntu on it. The CPU is Intel Pentium E5400, an old one as you see. The question is… how can I find out if Xubuntu (and Steam especially) is supported on this CPU? I googled and found out it's 64-bit, that's fine. Then I found out it (highely-likely) supports SSE. So that's also fine. The thing I
[17:33] <hereiamsorryandh> struggle is I can't or don't know how to find out if it supports CMPXCHG16B instruction (also called cx16). It is required for Steam (and maybe Chrome I guess and such things)
[17:34] <hereiamsorryandh> SSE3*
[17:37] <diogenes_> hereiamsorryandh, the best way is to boot Xubuntu live and see what works.
[17:38] <hereiamsorryandh> Hmm I hope the owner will let me do that. But I can't install Steam on Xubuntu live just to launch it to see if it works at all.
[17:38] <diogenes_> hereiamsorryandh, yes you can.
[17:40] <hereiamsorryandh> How? Without changing the files on the owner's HDD? Can I? Will 'cat /proc/cpuinfo/' work on any machine?
[17:41] <hereiamsorryandh> Without a slash in the end
[17:41] <kryten> hereiamsorryandh: https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/43539/what-do-the-flags-in-proc-cpuinfo-mean - definitely could just do this on a Live system though.
[17:41] <kryten> ..Oh, yeah! XD
[17:43] <diogenes_> hereiamsorryandh, it will install steam on live system and you will also check if wifi works and GPU and if it boots at all.
[17:43] <hereiamsorryandh> Peeeeerfect! I always thought that /proc/cpuinfo is just a file on an ALREADY INSTALLED os :D Then I was wrong
[17:43] <diogenes_> and also check the temperature.
[17:45] <hereiamsorryandh> I wonder, if I install something on live system, where will the files be stored? It's interesting…
[17:45] <diogenes_> on temporary space within USB drive.
[17:46] <diogenes_> it won't affect HDD.
[17:46] <hereiamsorryandh> Wow, just wow. It's gonna be slow tho. But it's worth it.
[17:46] <kryten> Actually, unless the medium is set up with persistency, just in RAM.
[17:49] <diogenes_> if you boot the machine and after a minute or two the temperature goes high and fans make noise, i won't buy it.
[17:52] <hereiamsorryandh> Thanks for the answers and the pieces of advice, I appreciate


[17:15] <torpor> hi
[17:16] <torpor> can someone tell me where the "ubuntu studio audio settings" panel is located in 12.04?  I'm trying to get pulse->jack audio bridging work, but for the life of me cannot find the audio settings ..
[17:17] <torpor> nobodyawake?
[20:09] <SillyTalker> i'm lookign for software that can be used to create an animation, i'm not sure how to explain what i want to do but i'll try
[20:10] <SillyTalker> ideally i would need something that allows me to use video loops, and plain images, and zoom them, move them, ...
[20:11] <SillyTalker> move a long a path maybe, thing like that
[20:11] <SillyTalker> kindof like the very basics of flash for example
[20:58] <holstein> SillyTalker: might find something online for that
[20:58] <holstein> otherwise just open a pacakge manager and try some editors
[20:59] <holstein> theres a bunch of animation tools, and video editors in the repos
[21:42] <SillyTalker> holstein, i know, i'm familiar with most of them
[21:42] <SillyTalker> dunno of anything like this :(
[21:42] <SillyTalker> but thanks anyway..


[03:35] <Solifugus> part
 Hey
 Hey guys! After thwo instances on two computers I have to ask: is there a known problem of google maps and the current firefox?
 Happened on 18.04 and 20.04.
[07:41] <tuxakadjseb> Hello world !
 @tuxakadjseb, 👋
[07:46] <Surplus88> print =" Hello World! "
[07:46] <Surplus88> i think i got it right.. lol
[08:03] <andreas_> hi
[08:03] <andreas_> hallo
[08:39] <Duality> I need some help installing Kubuntu the installer is not detecting my nvme drive
[08:39] <Duality> I have ahci selected in bios for it.
[08:39] <Duality> I have formated the drive with a gpt partition table and a ext4 partition
[08:39] <Duality> but still it won't find it.
[08:39] <Duality> I started the gui installer from the command line hoping to get some more information but nothing
[08:40] <Duality> If I select manual it shows up though
[08:42] <Duality> Oh I think i am stupid
[08:42] <Duality> I had to select Buided - use entire disk
[08:42] <Duality> then it shows up xD
[08:42] <Duality> Guided
[11:38] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[13:53] <konrados> Hi. Jeeez, how to *hibernate* kubuntu, not 'sleep' but hibernate? Nothing I found in the internet works
[13:54] <konrados> I am supposed to have `pm-hibernate` but I don't o.O
[14:00] <diogenes_> kongaloosh, do you have /swap partition?
[14:53] <andreas> hi
[14:53] <andreas> co tu slychac
[14:54] <diogenes_> !pl
[14:54] <andreas> zadnej dziewczyny
[14:55] <andreas> was ist mit DEITSCH .
[14:56] <andreas> GEHT AUCH
[14:56] <andreas> hi ubuntu....
[14:56] <andreas> hi ubottu
[14:57] <genii> !de
[14:57] <andreas> mozesz mnie pocalowac w dupüe.
[14:58] <andreas> hi ubotu co ty tu robisz jezeli moge spytac
[14:59] <andreas> hi tubootu
[14:59] <diogenes_> !ops
[14:59] <diogenes_> we got a troll.
[15:00] <andreas> sche so feithel dupel koness tegol
[15:00] <andreas> mehere sahis tweke diolen potison moliter
[15:01] <andreas> i dulop seniosit traa sefalize retolisa
[15:05] <v_> in kubuntu 20.04 i can't fix how many lines to scroll with 3 mouse button
[15:06] <v_> in my menu i dont see these options shown : "mouse wheel scrollls by"https://i.stack.imgur.com/VSwXw.png
[15:07] <v_> any help please?
[15:10] <v_> i only see this menu https://justpaste.it/50i21
 @v_, Not sure how to help as I too just discovered that the scroll by lines option is no longer configureable in System Settings on 20.04.
[15:13] <v_> weird DarinMiller as i heard this would be only available for users of plasma 5.14 and having 18.04 was not possible and recommended to upgrade ubuntu in order to be able to install it
[16:07] <gQuigs> hi there, I just wanted to make sure someone from the Kubuntu team had seen https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-cdimage/+bug/1862428 .   Downloads of Kubuntu ISO may stop working in Chrome if the change isn't made.  Just switching to https fixes it
 boot took has more time !! 1 minute