[10:13]  * gorilla is up for a new UPS... The power here is awful for computers!
[10:22] <gggs> gorilla: how did you kill a UPS?
[10:24] <gorilla> gggs: no, I think the battery is just had it. but I'm confident enough to replace the battery. I have been considering something a little bigger.
[10:25] <gggs> what sort of UPS is it?
[10:25] <gorilla> A cheapie generic type unit.. 700VA from memory.
[10:26] <gorilla> err. 650VA.
[10:31] <gggs> that's not too bad, 10-15mins
[10:33] <gorilla> yeah. :-) I guess I could get a second opinion on it.. replacing the battery is the cheaper option
[10:36] <gggs> sealed lead-acid, yea? I've still got an APC UPS I'd had for 10+ years, they seem to last a while
[10:38] <gorilla> yeah.. SLA. I can get a compatible battery for less than a sixth of a new UPS.
[10:42] <gggs> <$40?
[10:42] <gorilla> yeah.. $30.
[10:44] <gorilla> but a little better capacity. :-)
[10:50] <gggs> sounds like a no-brainer, do you need another UPS?
[10:53] <gorilla> gggs: I think I'll replace the battery... especially as i just got the old one out. 12v across terminals with no load.
[10:58] <gggs> sounds normal
[11:00] <gorilla> yeah.. but going from 100% down to 3 % in less than 10 second isn't. I couldn't get multimeter leads across the battery when it was in place.
[11:03] <gggs> you could make your own load (car stereo etc) but it sounds like it's obviously dead
[11:03] <gorilla> Yep.. and I'm not that confident around circuits that are partially at mains potential.
[11:05] <gggs> for sure, you'd only want to test the individual battery
[11:06] <gorilla> yep.. getting 365V DC across a multimeter that's expecting 20V DC could be ugly.
[11:19] <gggs> probably blow up the multimeter but probably not yourself
[11:23] <gggs> ...probably :)
[11:48] <gorilla> gggs: hehe.. I'll pass all the same :-)
[14:13] <madlatvian> hi
[14:14] <sagaci> hi
[14:15] <madlatvian> what happening
[14:17] <sagaci> not much


[03:20] <EchoPhyber83> Hello, I'm looking for information on creating or editing a driver to make my pcie tv tuner card to work.
[11:05] <dmainou> Hi I am a new user of mythbuntu. I have a very simple question. What is the root password for mysql?
[17:07] <Keithamus> Does anyone in here have a successful LTSP Lucid Lynx Mythbuntu install? I'm having difficulty with nvidia drivers.


[03:13] <aroman> What's ROOTMISMATCH?
[07:21] <OrangePeel> * dannyLopez (~danny@unaffiliated/dannylopez) has joined #ubuntu
[07:21] <OrangePeel> How do I remove a folder from UbuntuOne Cload. An entire folder is synced to Ubuntu one.
[07:23] <OrangePeel> How do I remove a folder from UbuntuOne Cload. An entire folder is synced to Ubuntu one.
[11:20] <duanedesign> morning  all
[11:20] <duanedesign> Orange Peel hello
[22:01] <benste> hi what was the url of the edge version of u1musicstore - tried to purchase something but ended with a white page with a small lock icon on the bottom when trying to pay for the music
[22:04] <benste> could someone explain me this error ?
[22:04] <benste> or at least try to do so
[22:06] <benste> is my message submited to the IRC channel ??
[22:08] <benste> someone here ?
[22:53] <Arachon> Hullo?
[22:56]  * Arachon talks to himself
[23:17] <kklimonda> hmm, honk
[23:17] <kklimonda> u1sdtool --status returns description: processing queues
[23:17] <kklimonda> but both --waiting-m and --waiting-c returns nothing
[23:17] <kklimonda> and logs are empty


[00:39] <davechen1y> http://edition.cnn.com/2015/09/14/travel/aso-volcano-erupts-japan-flights/index.html
[00:39] <davechen1y> welp, i guess we're not going to be sprinting in japan
[00:54] <perrito666> well prices will most likely plummet, we might
[01:08]  * perrito666 works a bit more to procastinate writing tests for his personal projects
[03:26] <mwhudson> jam, rogpeppe: it's "in progress" in the distro sense of the word
[03:27] <mwhudson> i'm not sure when the fix will hit trusty-updates
[03:27] <mwhudson> treat this as an opportunity to learn and go ask a distro person :-)
[03:27] <mwhudson> (i'll do the same tomorrow when i'm working again)
[04:36] <mup> Bug # changed: 1493887, 1494356, 1494441, 1494864, 1494913
[08:07] <mfoord> morning all
[08:08] <anastasiamac> mfoord: or night :D
[08:08] <mfoord> anastasiamac: o/
[08:08] <mfoord> anastasiamac: it's always morning on the internet...
[08:08] <anastasiamac> :)
[09:22]  * dimitern rebooting
[09:53] <mfoord> fwereade: if I create a new error, ErrNoAddress, does that belong better in network or in errors
[09:53] <mfoord> fwereade: my guess is errors alongside all the others
[09:54] <fwereade> mfoord, heh, I am desperately ambivalent there :(
[09:54] <mfoord> fwereade: hehe, cool - thanks
[09:56] <fwereade> mfoord, I do worry that the error types in errors tend to become functionally useless re: detecting specific scenarios, because they often and up getting used in more and more contexts and having their meaning diluted
[09:56] <mfoord> fwereade: interesting
[09:57] <fwereade> mfoord, NotFound, for example, now means so many things that you'd be crazy to take any potentially-destructive action based on encountering one
[09:57] <mfoord> right
[09:57] <mfoord> NoAddress seems pretty specific, but then perhaps that's more of an argument for putting it in the network specific package
[09:58] <fwereade> mfoord, indeed :)
[09:58] <mfoord> returning an ErrNoAddress from machine.PublicAddress() now causes 20 unit test failures in the state package
[09:58] <fwereade> mfoord, ouch
[09:58] <mfoord> so I'm still not sure it's a good idea... looking at how easy to fix they are
[09:58] <mfoord> most of those places were *probably* checking for an empty address anyway, so it shouldn't be too much work
[09:59] <mfoord> they certainly *should* have been
[09:59] <fwereade> mfoord, right, how many of my comments are actually addrssable is very much a judgment call, and you're right there by the code
[09:59] <mfoord> yup, thanks
[10:29] <natefinch> dammit... upgraded to vivid and it broke my ethernet :/
[10:37] <natefinch> god, I miss trusty
[12:49] <mup> Bug #1495952 opened: Return specific error cause when trying to add existing services or relations <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1495952>
[12:52] <mup> Bug #1495952 changed: Return specific error cause when trying to add existing services or relations <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1495952>
[12:59] <frankban> perrito666: could you please take a look at http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/2633/ ? thanks!
[13:01] <frobware> dooferlad, are you in the webex conference?
[13:04] <dooferlad> frobware: I have the java thing loaded. Failed on the phone bit
[13:05] <frobware> dooferlad, I dialled in too. Odd.
[13:07] <mup> Bug #1495952 opened: Return specific error cause when trying to add existing services or relations <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1495952>
[13:07] <dooferlad> frobware: got it :-|
[13:08] <voidspace> dooferlad: do you have a hangout sharing your screen?
[13:09] <voidspace> dooferlad: the java icedtea plugin is just hanging for me
[13:09] <frobware> voidspace, it would be a silent movie
[13:09] <voidspace> ah...
[13:09] <dooferlad> voidspace: no, but you can dial in and look at the presentation. Slides are in the meeting invite
[13:10] <voidspace> dooferlad: frobware: dialling in
[13:34] <frobware> voidspace, dooferlad: the amount of (my) data they want to own is scary.
[13:34] <dooferlad> frobware: yea, they just want to watch your every move including what you eat. Nice.
[13:42] <voidspace> frobware: dooferlad: :-)
[13:52] <frobware> dimitern, want to sync up w.r.t to subnet/zones?
[13:52] <mup> Bug #1495978 opened: Juju does not deploy CentOS images in LXC <centos> <containers> <juju> <lxc> <system> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1495978>
[13:53] <dimitern> frobware, yeah - in ~7m (at the hour) ?
[13:57]  * fwereade will be back for a bit sometime this evening, but has a doctor's appointment in an inconvenient place
[13:57] <fwereade> ping me if you need me and I'll see them later
[13:58] <perrito666> fwereade: good luck
[13:58] <mup> Bug #1495978 changed: Juju does not deploy CentOS images in LXC <centos> <containers> <juju> <lxc> <system> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1495978>
[13:58] <perrito666> btw, "doctor's appointment in an inconvenient place" is a beautiful euphemism for a proctologist
[14:00] <natefinch> haha
[14:00] <dimitern> frobware, let's use the standup HO?
[14:01] <natefinch> perrito666: like the back of a volkswagon?
[14:02] <frobware> dimitern, in there now...
[14:03] <dimitern> frobware, coming
[14:04] <mup> Bug #1495978 opened: Juju does not deploy CentOS images in LXC <centos> <containers> <juju> <lxc> <system> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1495978>
[14:07] <mup> Bug #1495978 changed: Juju does not deploy CentOS images in LXC <centos> <containers> <juju> <lxc> <system> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1495978>
[14:10] <mup> Bug #1495978 opened: Juju does not deploy CentOS images in LXC <centos> <containers> <juju> <lxc> <system> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1495978>
[14:28] <rogpeppe> dimitern: fancy a review? http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/2656/
[14:35] <rogpeppe> or anyone else please? It's been almost 24 hours and I'd really like one review from someone in juju-core. http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/2656/
[14:37] <rogpeppe> perrito666: (you're OCR, right?)
[14:38] <anastasiamac> rogpeppe: perrito666 was OCR last week instead of me (but it's Wed 1am my time now)
[14:38] <rogpeppe> anastasiamac: ok, np
[14:38] <anastasiamac> rogpeppe: sorry i did not get to ur PR - was delaing with a blocker ;(
[14:39] <rogpeppe> anastasiamac: that's good - the blockers are a pain! :)
[14:39] <anastasiamac> rogpeppe: if noone will have a look, i rpomise to look at it in about 9hrs :D
[14:39] <anastasiamac> promise*
[14:39] <mgz> that sounds like the correct order, as rog can't land his branch till master is unblocked anyway
[14:39] <rogpeppe> anastasiamac: thanks for the offer :)
[14:40] <rogpeppe> mgz: the problem is that i'm trying to coordinate upstream branches and if this gets rejected then it's a right merge pain
[14:44] <natefinch> rogpeppe: ship it
[14:44] <rogpeppe> natefinch: ta!
[14:44] <natefinch> rogpeppe: welcome :)
[14:46] <perrito666> rogpeppe: sorry I was at the console, I can review your patch anyway :D
[14:46] <perrito666> or instead nate did it
[14:46] <perrito666> :p
[14:46] <rogpeppe> perrito666: "at the console" - wow, you're using a mainframe?
[14:50] <perrito666> rogpeppe: oh ffs, one cannot translate directly :p
[14:50] <perrito666> I was paying attention at my terminal emulator (which incidentally is konsole, almost the same)
[15:06] <katco> ericsnow: hey, looks like we need to ping mgz re: bug 1495681 sooner rather than later. can you handle that?
[15:06] <mup> Bug #1495681: quickstart delployments broken in 1.24 <blocker> <ci> <quickstart> <regression> <juju-core:Invalid> <juju-core 1.24:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1495681>
[15:06] <ericsnow> katco: sure
[15:07] <katco> ericsnow: ty
[15:12] <alexisb> ericsnow, please work with mgz on any questions regarding test results
[15:12] <ericsnow> alexisb: will do
[15:13] <ericsnow> mgz: ping
[15:22] <mgz> ericsnow: sorry, waving hands at people, I am around to help
[15:22] <ericsnow> mgz: thanks
[15:24] <mgz> ericsnow: so, we have three changes on 1.24 with the regression, none of which jump out at me as the cause
[15:25] <ericsnow> mgz: from what I can see initially, the config-get hook command isn't working right (or something related to it)
[15:26] <mup> Bug #1468815 changed: Upgrade fails moving syslog config files "invalid argument" <ci> <regression> <upgrade-juju> <juju-core:Fix Released> <juju-core 1.24:Fix Released by ericsnowcurrently> <juju-core 1.25:Fix Released> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1468815>
[15:26] <mup> Bug #1496016 opened: jujud uses too much memory <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496016>
[15:26] <ericsnow> mgz: bb38bf13c00283f572f05139428961b259275079 is pretty closely related
[15:27] <ericsnow> mgz: I meant 629fc0507c4b61be93fd79453244cb8fc853f413
[15:27] <ericsnow> natefinch: ^^^
[15:29] <natefinch> hmm
[15:29] <mgz> ericsnow: so, we have a couple of options then
[15:29] <mgz> can build 1.24 locally with that change removed, run the test locally, see if it passes
[15:29] <mgz> then just back out the change for releases
[15:30] <katco> mgz: i don't think we can release 1.24.6 w/o that fix
[15:30] <katco> mgz: it is for a major vendor
[15:33] <mgz> the other option means getting the fix fixed :)
[15:34] <katco> mgz: either way, sounds like first step is testing w/ that fix reverted? meanwhile ericsnow can continue examining the error?
[15:34] <ericsnow> katco: sounds good
[15:34] <ericsnow> mgz: you'll test with that change removed?
[15:36] <natefinch> this seems quite likely to be something broken from my change... I think the problem is that the default value for settings aren't getting set
[15:36] <mgz> ericsnow: okay, I'll test that locally
[15:36] <ericsnow> natefinch: yeah, that's what I was just thinking too
[15:36] <mgz> and we'll reserve CI for testing a 1.24 with a fixed fix
[15:36] <natefinch> which is why the dict is missing the value, instead of having a default value
[15:36] <ericsnow> natefinch: you read my comment on the bug, didn't you <wink>
[15:37] <natefinch> ericsnow: nah, just read the stack trace in the log and then thought about what changes I'd made to the settings.
[15:37] <ericsnow> natefinch: :)
[15:41] <mup> Bug #1496032 opened: backups restore won't create bootstrap on GCE <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496032>
[15:47] <mup> Bug #1496032 changed: backups restore won't create bootstrap on GCE <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496032>
[15:48] <natefinch> saw a quote once from Rob Pike about working with Ken Thompson... that Ken could usually figure out a bug faster by just sitting and thinking about the code, than Rob could by running it through a debugger.
[15:52] <ericsnow> natefinch: but debuggers in the 70's were so fast! :)
[15:53] <mup> Bug #1496032 opened: backups restore won't create bootstrap on GCE <docteam> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496032>
[15:54] <perrito666> k ppl bbl
[16:08] <ericsnow> natefinch: looks like there's a semantic difference between setting the service settings directly and calling UpdateConfigSettings()...
[16:09] <ericsnow> natefinch: ...that they treat "unset" setting differently, which has a direct bearing on how defaults are applied later for each unit
[16:09] <ericsnow> s/treat//
[16:10] <natefinch> ericsnow: ug....   I hate all this implicit code that is so side-effect driven... so easy to break things that don't work in obvious, straight forward ways
[16:11] <ericsnow> natefinch: I'm double-checking that UpdateConfigSettings discards "unset" settings, which is what I expect it does
[16:28] <natefinch> ericsnow: thanks, currently wrestling with my 8 month old (harder than it sounds), so not able to do much for another 45 mins or so until my wife gets back
[16:28] <ericsnow> natefinch: np
[16:49] <cmars> fix for LP:#1495591  http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/2668/
[16:49] <mup> Bug #1495591: TestRunCommand fails on windows <blocker> <ci> <test-failure> <windows> <juju-core:In Progress by cmars> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1495591>
[16:50] <mgz> cmars: thanks
[16:52] <bogdanteleaga> cmars: that bug looks like the listener is getting closed twice(?) is that the right place to fix it?
[16:53] <mup> Bug #1449210 opened: cloudsigma index file has no data for cloud <bootstrap> <cloudsigma-provider> <tech-debt> <juju-core:Triaged by s-matyukevich> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1449210>
[16:55] <cmars> bogdanteleaga, where else is it getting closed?
[16:56] <bogdanteleaga> cmars: that's the first thought I had when I saw element not found, no idea where it could get closed
[16:56] <alexisb> dimitern, you still around?
[17:05] <cmars> bogdanteleaga, i don't think it is getting closed twice.. if it were, i'd expect to see duplicate "juju-run listener stopped" messages
[17:20] <mup> Bug # changed: 1493623, 1494121, 1494912, 1494917
[17:21] <bogdanteleaga> cmars: https://github.com/juju/juju/commit/1fbd501e88ee29456b7c471ce617877f6f1393ad#diff-7842644c47e14851e8a4649bfe2ade13R125
[17:21] <bogdanteleaga> cmars: looks like we've been ignoring them for quite a while now
[17:22] <bogdanteleaga> still doesn't seem like the right approach is to continue ignoring it
[17:26] <bogdanteleaga> cmars: I think it's worth asking natefinch about this since the error is most likely coming from inside npipe
[17:32] <cmars> natefinch, regarding above ^^, can you review http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/2668/, or advise on a better solution? thanks!
[17:33] <ericsnow> mgz: did that updated deployer test finish yet?
[17:53] <natefinch> cmars: I can look, yeah.
[17:53] <cmars> natefinch, much thanks!
[18:19] <ericsnow> mgz, sinzui: where can I find the bundle that is used for the quickstart tests?
[18:22] <rick_h_> ericsnow: it's a version of https://jujucharms.com/u/landscape/landscape-scalable/9 in their test repo.
[18:22] <ericsnow> rick_h_: thanks
[20:35] <mup> Bug #1496127 opened: [juju-log] help is poor and results are confusing <docteam> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496127>
[20:39] <natefinch> rick_h_: quickstart seems to be hard coded to use /usr/bin/jujud  rather than just using the first one in the path?
[20:40] <rick_h_> natefinch: hmm i know you can env var it but not on path list
[20:41] <rick_h_> natefinch: checking
[20:41] <thumper> rick_h_: hey
[20:42] <rick_h_> thumper: party
[20:42] <thumper> rick_h_: after saying thursdays are good (which they are generally), I can't do tomorrow
[20:42] <thumper> kid school thing to be at
[20:42] <rick_h_> thumper: ah ok
[20:42] <natefinch> thumper: tomorrow is wednesday ;)
[20:42]  * natefinch is hilarious
[20:42] <thumper> I can move the normal meeting
[20:42] <thumper> sorry
[20:42] <thumper> ugh
[20:42] <rick_h_> thumper: I've got a think fri (my thurs) but wanted to chat soon to get things in order pre-seattle if we can
[20:42] <thumper> brain futz
[20:42] <thumper> rick_h_: I have 15 minutes now
[20:43] <rick_h_> thumper: sure
[20:55] <alexisb> wallyworld, I am going to be late to the sts call
[20:57] <wwitzel3> when you add a new facade verison is there anything else besides making sure you embed the previous, register the new version, and update facadeversions?
[21:06] <wallyworld> alexisb: me too, i just got back from school drop off
[21:08] <wallyworld> niedbalski: there now
[21:08] <rick_h_> natefinch-afk: sorry for the delay, yes it doesn't look at the path list: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~juju-gui/juju-quickstart/trunk/view/head:/quickstart/platform_support.py#L117
[21:08] <rick_h_> natefinch-afk: if you'd prefer it to look there next please file a bug and can see what can be done, but that's the way it works currently.
[21:08] <mup> Bug #1331151 opened: 'juju destroy-environment' sometimes errors <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1331151>
[21:08] <mup> Bug #1496143 opened: juju 1.24.5 no-proxy does not work as expected. <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496143>
[21:22] <wallyworld> thumper: temp fix to unblock master http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/2669/
[21:23] <katco> wallyworld: hm.. have to ask the q: is that in the spirit of blocking master?
[21:24] <wallyworld> katco: ?
[21:24] <wallyworld> it's a temp fix to unblock
[21:24] <katco> wallyworld: unblocking by skipping tests seems like it's just side-stepping the problem
[21:24] <wallyworld> katco: the functionality is dsiabled
[21:24] <katco> wallyworld: when the purpose of blocking is so that we don't layer onto broken code
[21:24] <wallyworld> so the tests need to be too
[21:24] <wwitzel3> with current master I am jsut getting this error over and over : machine-0: 2015-09-15 21:24:21 ERROR juju.worker runner.go:223 exited "toolsversionchecker": cannot update tools information: cannot get latest version: canot find available tools: no matching tools available
[21:24] <bogdanteleaga> wouldn't it be better to have something like ignore-<bug-no> when pushing rather than doing this?
[21:25] <katco> wallyworld: ah ok. makes sense
[21:25] <wwitzel3> anyone seen that before?
[21:25] <wallyworld> katco: the functionality will be fixed today - a closed mgo session - this just buys time
[21:25] <bogdanteleaga> wwitzel3: I've been getting it a lot, but I've just attributed it to "no upgrades available", but a bad error message
[21:26] <katco> wwitzel3: sorry, haven't seen it. master's in a bad way atm though
[21:29] <thumper> wallyworld: shipit
[21:30] <wallyworld> ty
[21:31] <thumper> cmars: I'm going to have to skip today
[21:47] <mgz> thumper: a selection of bugs, there are going to be some dupes in here <https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bugs?field.tag=wily>
[21:48] <thumper> mgz: ta
[21:48] <mgz> most of the test panics are one new form of panic on vivid/wily
[21:57] <mup> Bug #1496159 opened: test suite runs fail to clean up all artifacts <tech-debt> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496159>
[22:00] <cmars> thumper, k
[22:03] <mup> Bug #1496159 changed: test suite runs fail to clean up all artifacts <tech-debt> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496159>
[22:05] <sinzui> katco: thumper wallyworld alexisb: Ci will pause for at most 1 hour when a voting test fails its reties.
[22:08] <wallyworld> sinzui: 1 hour is a long time :-)
[22:08] <sinzui> wallyworld: we do need time to look at os-deployer which will trigger 1h. If the failure is in the first 2 hours of testing, there will be no delays at all
[22:10] <mgz> wallyworld: this is somewhat complicated, in practice most failures will not cause a delay to retesting
[22:10] <mgz> because it's based on time after failure, and if there are other tests ongoing, that time is used anyway
[22:10] <wallyworld> makes sense
[22:12] <mup> Bug #1467712 changed: cmd/jujud/agent: data race in test <juju-core:Fix Released> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1467712>
[22:12] <mup> Bug #1467753 changed: cmd/jujud/agent: multiple data races detected <juju-core:Fix Released> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1467753>
[22:12] <mup> Bug #1496159 opened: test suite runs fail to clean up all artifacts <tech-debt> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496159>
[22:12] <mup> Bug #1496161 opened: cmd/jujud/agent: data race detected <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496161>
[22:15] <mup> Bug #1496161 changed: cmd/jujud/agent: data race detected <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496161>
[22:15] <mup> Bug #1467712 opened: cmd/jujud/agent: data race in test <juju-core:Fix Released> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1467712>
[22:15] <mup> Bug #1467753 opened: cmd/jujud/agent: multiple data races detected <juju-core:Fix Released> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1467753>
[22:19] <wallyworld> mgz: sinzui: one fix landed, one more to go, let's hope tmac bad rec stays away, fingers crossed
[22:24] <mup> Bug #1467712 changed: cmd/jujud/agent: data race in test <juju-core:Fix Released> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1467712>
[22:24] <mup> Bug #1467753 changed: cmd/jujud/agent: multiple data races detected <juju-core:Fix Released> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1467753>
[22:24] <mup> Bug #1496161 opened: cmd/jujud/agent: data race detected <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496161>
[22:54] <mup> Bug #1496166 opened: juju ssh connects to incorrect units <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496166>
[23:54] <mup> Bug #1494947 changed: Panic keyManagerSuite.TestImportKeys on wily <ci> <intermittent-failure> <panic> <unit-tests> <wily> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1494947>
[23:54] <mup> Bug #1494948 changed: Panic charmVersionSuite.TearDownTest on wily <ci> <intermittent-failure> <panic> <unit-tests> <wily> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1494948>
[23:54] <mup> Bug #1494949 changed: Panic charmVersionSuite.TearDownTest on wily <ci> <intermittent-failure> <panic> <unit-tests> <wily> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1494949>


[08:06] <alkisg> Good morning
[09:24] <rob____> anyone on that can provide a bit of help?
[09:26] <rob____> I have the following situation: Trying to install edubuntu 10.04 to a HP DL360 G3 (cd rom only.. :( )
[09:26] <rob____> so I can't directly use the edubuntu DVD
[09:26] <alkisg> Use a usb stick instead?
[09:27] <rob____> I have a 4GB pendrive and used the "make usbdirve" option under W7
[09:27] <rob____> booting from USB end up in a kernel panic
[09:28] <rob____> are tehre alternatives in making the USB bootable?
[09:28] <rob____> I even could use booting from 3,5"flop since the server has a floppydrive....
[09:29] <alkisg> rob____: read the logs here: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/09/15/%23edubuntu.txt
[09:30] <alkisg> shazzr also had the same problem as you and booted from a live cd in order to create the edubuntu stick
[09:30] <alkisg> You can also share the edubuntu dvd via network, or even install the plain ubuntu version and add edubuntu-desktop afterwards
[09:31] <rob____> What I want is have the server as a LTSP server... and I understood edubuntu has LTSP packages included....
[09:32] <alkisg> Heh, that's the second ltsp server I see without a dvd drive :) More common than I thought!
[09:33] <rob____> old hardware.... but powerfull enough for the purpose: dual xeon 3.06 GhZ... ^^
[09:34] <alkisg> Nice. OK, either create a usb stick, or install via the network, or use the alternate cd installer and add edubuntu-desktop afterwards
[09:34] <alkisg> Any of those methods will do fine..
[09:34] <rob____> I'll try making the usb stick from within the edubuntu live environment....
[09:35] <rob____> thnx for the help and I go through the log you pointed to
[10:08] <rob____> hi there again....
[10:09] <rob____> Just want to inform that creating the USB install drive under ubuntu live cd works like a charm.... how come the usb creation utility under W7 dowsn't work?
[10:10] <rob____> mayby some dev can look into it, cos it will turn people off from using (ed)ubuntu when creating an install utility fails
[10:12] <rob____> anyway, i'm off building a server... ^^
[13:55] <wolfravenous> rob__: you could always switch your cd drive out for a cheap DVD drive, I can buy them around here for 15 US dollars or even if you don't want to switch out the cd because it is SCSI and the cheap DVD drives are IDE you could do the crazy thing I did.
[13:56] <wolfravenous>   I had a spare PCI slot that I put an IDE expansion card in and then took the used internal DVD laid it on top of the blade server but since server was SCSI I had to plug in an old tower PC right beside it and used power from it.
[13:57] <wolfravenous> So I had the IDE cable running from the Internal used DVD (sitting out side the server) to the PCI expansion card in the server and the power was being supplied by the old tower PC running right beside the two.  Crazy I know but it worked!!!
[14:08] <wolfravenous> if you want to see a picture of this crazy setup when I had to do it:  http://twitpic.com/2uv6dy
[14:10] <wolfravenous> I just left the DVD drive in the tower and ran the IDE cable to the IDE expansion card that was installed in the PCI slot of the SCSI server :)  hope this helps someone!!!
[14:13] <wolfravenous> I have used this trick many times to do DVD installs in systems that only have CD drives or NO optical drives at all... Just requires the PCI to IDE card and a PCI slot.... You can even pull out a network card from the PCI slot if you need to do the install then later reinstall the Net Card and set it up...
[19:09] <shazzr> Has anyone tried out Edubuntu with a SmartBoard?
[19:14] <HedgeMage> shazzr: I haven't, sorry.
[19:15] <HedgeMage> shazzr: What do you know about the interface?  With enough info, I could probably suggest a plan of attack, or at least how likely it is to work.
[19:23] <shazzr> It does work. At least on 10.04. Itching go get to sunday. :) Only bummer is that I seem to only be able to download a DVD which in turn seemes to want to fetch stuff from the internet. But there are some restrictions to what resources (websites) I can access from the computer with the smartboard, so I would really like to know if I can install 10.10 100% from a USB stick/DVD/CD?
[19:36] <HedgeMage> shazzr: You can.  You just need to copy the packages you want to the removable media.
[19:44] <shazzr> HedgeMage: So if I download the ISO on monday, and burn it on a DVD, I should be fine?
[19:45] <HedgeMage> shazzr: Well, if you want packages that aren't on the ISO you need to grab them separately and stick them on a disc or USB stick.
[19:45] <HedgeMage> shazzr: so figure out what you'll be installing ahead of time if possible :)
[19:48] <shazzr> HedgeMage: I don't need any other packages...but it is during the installtion that it sort of "hangs", and I suspect that it is because it's looking for something on the net that it can't reach.
[19:52] <HedgeMage> shazzr: You can check the install CD's boot options to see if there is a no network one (to avoid it trying to find the 'net). if not, you can just wait out the search -- eventually it should error and move on.
[20:13] <shazzr> HedgeMage: Ok. Thanks. Will try. :)


[07:26] <fairuz> helo rakan2
[15:11] <fairuz> hyperair: I saw once you were in rPi room. Do you own one?
[16:03] <fairuz> wb ejat
[18:13] <unitedpotsmokers> help
[18:13] <unitedpotsmokers> ive been fak


[01:27] <giaco> noob problem: sometimes (eg when opening video files with ffplay) window is created larger than the screen. I can maximize it, but not resize
[01:28] <wxl> what version of lubuntu?
[01:28] <giaco> is there a way to drag the window by clicking it? Or resize it by other means?
[01:28] <giaco> 18.04
[01:28] <wxl> ok let's see if we can think of a smarter way
[01:28] <wxl> BUT
[01:28] <wxl> you can hold alt, click on anywhere in the window and drag
[01:29] <giaco> oh
[01:29] <giaco> that was easy
[01:29] <giaco> I am pretty sure I tried that before, but your magical words made this possible
[01:29] <giaco> thank you wizard!
[01:32] <wxl> giaco: also try clicking on the window title bar, clicking resize and then moving in the direction of the tail of the arrow icon
 wxl I think you mean right click
[01:35] <wxl> ah yes thank you lyn
[01:37] <giaco> wxl: also thanks
[01:38] <wxl> also: alt-right click-drag
[01:38] <wxl> that does a resize
[01:39] <wxl> also you might want to try to configure some stuff yourself http://openbox.org/wiki/Help:Actions#Window_actions
[01:40] <wxl> there's the obvious Move and Resize, but MoveToEdge, GrowToEdge, GrowToFill, and ShrinkToEdge are all interesting
 (Photo, 1280x102) https://i.imgur.com/z3WkjEc.jpg I want to make lubuntu 19.10 live cd but I have problems like that. can anyone help me?
 @Mateusz Konieczny [What is your current os? … Also, note that you need a DVD or USB. CD is no longer …], sorry thats DVD-R my bad sorry
 @devikri [sorry thats DVD-R my bad sorry], is it impossible for using DVD-R to create bootable ?
[07:59] <guiverc> devikri, you can write ISO images to dvdr; however some older hardware won't boot or use certain types of DVDR media; some types of media (that used to be common; but was more expensive) used to be okay
[08:01] <guiverc> https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/how-to-burn-a-dvd-on-ubuntu/14022
[08:02] <guiverc> fyi: it mentions xfburn which is what I'd use on Lubuntu 18.04, or K3b which is what I'd use on modern Lubuntu; but you could use anythree mentioned
 @guiverc [<guiverc> fyi: it mentions xfburn which is what I'd use on Lubuntu 18.04, or K3b …], Okay thx 😊😊
 @guiverc [<guiverc> https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/how-to-burn-a-dvd-on-ubuntu/14022], execuse me, i dont know why, but my k3b stuck at 97% for more than 15 minutes,  is there any suggestions ?
[08:56] <guiverc> sorry no, it's been a long time since I burnt a dvdr/cdr ... most of my fails I recall where just bad media; using another blank usually fixed it (though some drives always fail; so after multiple failures I'd replace drive.. bad drives were hard to detect often)
 @guiverc [<guiverc> sorry no, it's been a long time since I burnt a dvdr/cdr ... most of m …], 😂😂😂 I guess I have to use a USB flash disk. simple and easy
[09:10] <sacarde> hi
[09:11] <sacarde> in lubuntu, which is the program to make screenshot?
[09:13] <kc2bez> Which version of Lubuntu sacarde ?
[09:13] <sacarde> 14.04
[09:14] <kc2bez> I am not sure. 14.04 has not been supported for some time now.
[09:14] <sacarde> or 16.04
[09:15] <kc2bez> 18.04 and 19.10 are the current supported versions.
[09:16] <sacarde> and 16.04.. not?
[09:16] <kc2bez> Correct. 16.04 is not in support.
[09:16] <guiverc> sacarde, flavors of Ubuntu have only 3 years of support; the only 16.04 still supported is Ubuntu server (no desktop), desktop (unity 7) or kylin (chinese) - all other flavors of 16.04 are EOL as 3 years have passed
[09:17] <sacarde> ah
[09:18] <guiverc> (I was talking about LTS releases ^; for non-LTS flavors are identical to Ubuntu)
[09:19] <sacarde> ok.. thanks
[09:26] <alex15> Hello. I have been using Lubuntu for a long time (more than 4 years), but in the latest release / Lubuntu 18.04 /, despite a lot of advantages, there are a couple of very unpleasant moments: Libreoffice stopped opening files located on samba resources. Moreover, letters were sent to the developers and they fixed the problem, but the maximum they
[09:26] <alex15> achieved, the files began to open for reading with the correct samba settings.Please help me solve the problem ... it has been observed for a long time, and to localize the problem - is it a file manager or something else impossible ... I have Linux Mint 18 at home and everything works fine on it.
[09:27] <alex15> Of course, you can mount the resource and that's all ... which I did, but still it needs to be fixed
[09:30] <alex15> I searched everywhere email of lubuntu support, but the mission is impossible )
[09:31] <guiverc> alex15, the latest Lubuntu is 19.10, second latest which reached EOL today was 19.04, third .... 18.04 is four releases back... Mint 18 I think is based on 16.04, pre samba wanna-cry windows problems so it's possible your issue is over vers= (anything 2017+ follows the microsoft mandated changes b/c of wannacry; 16.04 is pre-wannacry)  - but guess only
[09:35] <alex15> thanks a lot... but in the organization, where I am working, is using only LTS version... As I know, Lubuntu 19.04 will be supported only 9 months... I suppose 19.10
[09:35] <alex15> too
[09:35] <kc2bez> correct our next LTS version is 20.04
[09:37] <alex15> could you please say, how long must I wait for it?))
[09:38] <kc2bez> It will be released in April. Releases are YY.MM
[09:38] <guiverc> 20.04 means the 2020-April release; ubuntu uses a year.month format - so 18.04 means the 2018-April release of Ubuntu
[09:39] <alex15> perfect... hope samba+libreoffice problem will go away with this version of lubuntu =).
[09:43] <alex15> of course I have found, that for example if I install thunar, which is very like pcmanfm and give sftp-access to this resource - all is functioning
[09:44] <kc2bez> You can test it now (perhaps in a VM or spare computer) and file any bugs you find. That would help get any changes necessary in before release.
[09:45] <kc2bez> It is easier to get fixes in now before the release than after.
 alex15 libreoffice problem with samba was fixed? I'm using cifs now because of that
 hello guys, if some of u remember last night i asked about bios not openning. i went to the compiter shop, he just changed ram to same model and it fixed, ram had problem so bios didnt open. just saying here so it may be usefull for you too maybe.
 and now again, after new install, i cant install steam, there was a code to put on terminal to fix it. can anyone remind me that? :)
 `sudo dpkg --add-architecture i386; sudo apt update`
 still not openning, i ll try to relog
 still not openning
 what is the output of `dpkg --print-foreign-architecture` ?
 dpkg: error: unknown option --print-foreign-architecture
 sorry there should be an s on the end of that. `dpkg --print-foreign-architectures`
 i386
 a window opens that says "veryfiyng installation" than it closes
[12:34] <pseudo> problem with samba has Systemic nature. Samba and libre office Doesn't work in conjunction - PCManFM (Forms invalid paths) - GVFS - SAMBA - LibreOffice (NOT only)
 same thing happened and i fixet it with guys' help here
 I think that was me but maybe not.
 im not sure but it was tomyern or wxl
 sure im okay if u help, i would be glad ^^
 You did a `sudo apt install steam-installer` ?
 no, i used deb file from steam web site
 i could install that way to debian lxqt, i did it to see if it works there
 You may need to re-install after adding the i386 architecture
 @tbs [i could install that way to debian lxqt, i did it to see if it works there], Yes, Debian has i386 enabled.
 how can i uninstall this, i cant find steam installed at muon
 ahh u r kc2bez, i didnt mention ur name before cuz ur name s hard to remember for me:)
 You don't need to uninstall it, just `sudo apt install PATH/TO/DEB`
 yeah probably u helped me beforeİ:)
 It is probably in your `/home/Downloads` directory.
 Reading package lists... Done … Building dependency tree        … Reading state information... Done … E: Unable to locate package PATH/TO
 ahh
 u see im new :)
 No worries
 it s same
 btw i usualy use discover to install deb files
 Your username would be in between `/home/` and `Downloads` … I am a command line kind of person, I guess I am old school :)
 i wrote this sudo apt install /home/tbs/İndirilenler/steam_latest.deb
 indirilenler=downloadeds
 You can browse to it in PCmanFM-Qt if that is easier, then use Discover to re-install.
 the problem is i cant see it in installed apps
 You won't, you didn't install it from the repo.
 i did browse it on pcmanfm-qt and found its path. then copied it next to ur command like i showed you sudo apt install /home/tbs/İndirilenler/steam_latest.deb
 i dont understand what u mean if it s not this
 That should work or did you get an error.
 let me do it again
 steam-launcher is already the newest version (<IP_ADDRESS>). it says in short
 but when i check steam-launcher at muon, it seems it s not installed
 so what should i do to install steam?
 you should be able to do a `sudo apt remove steam-installer`
 Then `sudo apt install steam-installer`
 'steam-installer' kurulu değildi, dolayısıyla kaldırılmadı it says, that means it wasnt installed, so didnt uninstalled
 but i have steam now, it just doesnt open
 @@
 its name is steam-launcher maybe
 hmm, not sure, maybe
 yeah it "was" ^^ i uninstalled it
 I would try to install from the repo now. `sudo apt install steam-installer`
 im doing
 it s same...
 ş stll cant open steam
 its " verfying installation" window closing suddenly like i said before
 i ll try restart
 still same
 :(
 i try so hard, installing os is easier than steam to lubuntu 5 times :(
 I'm not sure, I have to run for a while, hopefully someone else will be along to help.
 thanks for help
 i hope someone :(
 i instaled this `sudo dpkg --add-architecture i386; sudo apt update` and now i wanna remove it to start again, how to remove?
 i could install steam
 i guess it s about creating su password and maybe suoders
 that s the differance i could see between lubuntu and debian, u guys know at lubuntu installation we dont set su password
 @tbs I installed steam in a Lubuntu virtual machine. I made a video of the process. https://send.firefox.com/download/b86fd1eccffc56e6/#dN77NXVGNpsabPDV0SjUDQ
[16:50] <bwew253tgzwhbd> oh ye i can agree that theres no su password but why is that so
[16:52] <kyabori> hi
[17:05] <bwew253tgzwhbd> is ubuntu the only distro where systemd google dns fallback virus is disabled by default
[18:14] <sirnapkin1334> this is probably a really dumb question, but if I install KDE Plasma over Lubuntu, will it have better performance than using Kubuntu?
[18:20] <bwew253tgzwhbd> no
[18:21] <bwew253tgzwhbd> u probably still have these startup programs from lubuntu even when u choose kde plasma as desktop environment
 @sirnapkin1334 [<sirnapkin1334> this is probably a really dumb question, but if I install KDE Pl …], And use plasma? Or use lubuntu?
 @kc2bez [@tbs I installed steam in a Lubuntu virtual machine. I made a video of the proce …], thanks for your work, i took a lot time from you guys again
 what i did to install steam is: 1.create su password. 2.make ur account in sudoers. 3 install steam with deb file from steam web site. this s also easy to do
[19:04] <wxl> steps 1 and 2 should be unnecessary as the default user is already in sudoers
 with only step 3 i couldnt install, the reason i do 1 and 2 is what i saw when i tried to install at debian lxqt, at debian lxqt while installing, a window like terminal opened and wanted my password, i entered my password but it wanted me to in sudoers. so that s how i found it. and it s working.
[19:06] <wxl> you use sudo to install
[19:06] <wxl> !sudo
 i dont know these as u guys. not even %10, but im telling what i saw and did. if you dont believe me u can try installing steam to debian lxqt and see yourself
[19:08] <wxl> oh i didn't realize you were talking about debian
[19:08] <wxl> yeah with debian everything's different
 dont misunderstand me pls, i trust you but i cant deny what i saw and did
[19:09] <wxl> i just assumed..... because this is not DEBIAN support :)
 i guess u dont read or understand what i wrote :)
 i dont want help about this matter anymore cuz i solved it, and i solved it with a way u guys didnt suggest, so i try to share it with you guys cuz i got so much help from you and you may help others with this
[19:11] <wxl> it's a great suggestion for debian
 yeah, also it works at lubuntu...
[19:12] <wxl> just totally unnecessary
 im sorry to distrup you and all ppl here.
[19:14] <wxl> no worries
[20:22] <blip99> hi all, how do i kill the x server on lubuntu?
[20:22] <blip99> on ubuntu it's sudo service lightdm stop
[20:22] <blip99> but looks like lubuntu dont use lightdm
[20:25] <wxl> blip99: sddm
[20:26] <blip99> wxl, thank you, but attempting to stop it says "Failed to stop ssdm.service: Unit ssdm.service not loaded."
[20:26] <wxl> blip99: you fat fingered it
[20:26] <blip99> lol
[20:26] <blip99> sorry
[20:28] <wxl> a ton
[20:28] <wxl> oops
 wxl: yeah, wrong channel xD
 Lol!


[08:20] <froud> African greetings
[08:26] <maskie> froud: morning
[08:27] <froud> maskie, Howzit
[08:28] <maskie> great ... how was you Sun City trip
[08:28] <froud> Hot 34deg but spectacular as usual
[08:28] <froud> Valley of the waves is the closest thing to abeach we have up here :-)
[08:29] <maskie> thought it might be hot ... but you had a man made sea to cool off in :)
[08:29] <froud> Yes, no blue bottles, jelly-fish, no sharks, just lots of rocks :-)
[08:30] <froud> Just kidding
[08:30] <maskie> and nice girls I presume ....
[08:30] <froud> wowawiwa, yebo
[08:31] <froud> aitch serious!
[08:37] <froud> maskie, good weather it Cape Town today? Looks like another scortcher here.
[08:38] <maskie> yes ... but the wind is blowing like hell since early this morning so not a day for the beach
[08:38] <froud> We had one hell of a storm last night, looks like its all blown out
[08:39] <maskie> typical highveld storm ??
[08:39] <froud> Skit and donner
[08:40] <froud> Now we have "African Sky Blue"
[08:40] <maskie> until later this afternoon when the next one come
[08:40] <froud> Yes, but it is good, cools the day off
[08:41] <maskie> agree .... so what you up today ....
[08:42] <froud> Think we are going to Rosebank Flea market again
[08:42] <froud> Then I will finish hacking the legalnotice.xml
[08:43] <froud> make proposal for new Documentation and Internationalization web site
[08:43] <froud> Write XSL for Docs Owner/Maintainer list
[08:43] <froud> Hmmm what else is in Bugzilla
[08:43] <maskie> sounds that you will be busy ...
[08:43] <froud> he he yes
[08:44] <froud> btw, I may have some xsls for the side project ;-)
[08:44] <froud> But I got to thinking
[08:45] <froud> why not just have a place where one can pickup anytype of xsl, like CPAN
[08:45] <froud> they dont have to be docbook specific
[08:45] <maskie> why do i have this idea that it has been tried before ....
[08:45] <sivang> froud: what side project? :)
[08:46] <sivang> greerting s:)
[08:46] <froud> maskie, really where?
[08:46] <froud> sivang, shalom.


[00:34] <dypsilon_> Hi everyone, I want to create a scriptable installation for virtualbox which starts with something absolutely minimal like "ubuntu minimal cd" and proceeds to download packages (scripted) from the net. Could you point me in the right direction?
[05:56] <sarnold> slangasek,cjwatson,infinity: I've seen a surprising number of instances of 1363519 -- bad debsums on start-stop-daemon -- alongside other, probably unrelated, bug reports -- I'm afraid this may be a symptom of a larger problem and wanted to make sure it doesn't get overlooked by accident. Since it feels like magic it seems like one for you guys :) thanks
[06:20] <jamin> what's the best way to call attention to a security bug report that you've filed on launchpad but isn't getting any response?
[06:21] <infinity> sarnold: Wow, that makes a whole lot of no sense.
[06:21] <sarnold> jamin: which bug?
[06:21] <sarnold> infinity: heh, thanks for making me feel better
[06:22] <infinity> sarnold: I can't even fathom how that would happen.
[06:23] <sarnold> infinity: me neither. but I know I've seen that modified: sbin/start-stop-daemon from more than those two bug reports..
[06:23] <infinity> sarnold: All on trusty?
[06:23] <sarnold> infinity: I think so but I didn't keep track :(
[06:26] <infinity> sarnold: I wonder if there's some other misbehaving package copying around s-s-d binaries.
[06:26] <infinity> sarnold: If the claim is that installing a fresh xubuntu and then upgrading causes the issue, it should be debuggable, just... Weird
[06:28] <infinity> Don't see any obvious maintainer script weirdness here, so I guess the only option is to try to reproduce from scratch. :/
[06:29] <sarnold> :(
[06:30] <sarnold> infinity: is there an easy way to grep through all the Dependencies.txt on launchpad to look for the [modified: ] bit? it might be possible to find a few more instances and see if there's any hints
[06:32] <infinity> sarnold: Some lpapi guru might be able to help you, that wouldn't be me.
[06:32] <infinity> sarnold: I feel like bdmurray would know if it could be done.
[06:34] <sarnold> infinity: cool, thanks.
[15:05] <bdmurray> sarnold: I have a local cache of bug attachments for all the foundations packages, that I could easily search. If we did find a fair number then we could move onto searching Launchpad using the API.
[15:09] <saiarcot895> Anyone active today willing to review a sponsorhip request? https://code.launchpad.net/~saiarcot895/ubuntu/utopic/openwalnut/armhf-fixes/+merge/232879
[15:09] <saiarcot895> *sponsorship
[21:25] <tomi__> Anybody know how i can change the System Name in Systemsettings -> Details ? For Example: MyName OS
[21:28] <tomi__> Anybody know how i can change the System Name in Systemsettings -> Details ? For Example: MyName OS


[02:29] <roasted> hello!
[02:29] <roasted> do any of you folk run RAID on your home servers etc?
[02:30] <TheLordOfTime> yes, but its hardware RAID on mine :P
[02:30] <TheLordOfTime> not software RAID :P
[02:34] <roasted> meh
[02:35] <roasted> I don't think I could stomach hardware raid.
[02:35]  * TheLordOfTime points at the $2500 server box :P
[02:35] <TheLordOfTime> as i said, i run hardware raid.  :P
[02:35] <roasted> I'm considering on setting up RAID but I'm not entirely sure what to go with.
[02:36] <roasted> Some reading suggests that I can do RAID 5 with only two drives utilizing mdadm
[02:36] <roasted> which would be nice because then I can later add 2 additional drives and do 4x2TB in RAID 5
[04:01] <roasted> new plan
[04:01] <roasted> 4x2TB in RAID 10
[04:11] <ChinnoDog> waste of disk space
[04:12] <roasted> I'm fine with that, given that there's some admirable tradeoffs with performance and redundancy.
[04:13] <roasted> the more I read the more it sounds like 10 has largely taken over the point behind why a lot of people used 5
[04:13] <ChinnoDog> I never configure redundancy on home computers. I rely on my backups.
[04:13] <roasted> with the exception of the HDD space being a bit more limited with 10 vs 5
[04:13] <roasted> I have a mirror in my desktop, which is nice.
[04:13] <roasted> my server though will be running 247 and host a few different services, so having RAID would be a bonus
[04:14] <ChinnoDog> RAID 5 would be faster and give you more usable space
[04:14] <roasted> everything I read suggests RAID 5 is only faster with read.
[04:14] <roasted> whereas RAID 10 is faste rwith write
[04:14] <roasted> which, considering I'll be pushing backups to the server a lot, comes with a benefit.
[04:15] <ChinnoDog> maybe once upon a time with slow checksumming or if you had a really slow RAID controller
[04:16] <roasted> I won't be using a RAID controller.
[04:16] <roasted> I'll be using software RAID via mdadm.
[04:16] <roasted> RAID 5 pros, often faster read, more usable space. RAID 10 pros, faster write, overall decent performance, superior redundancy to RAID 5.
[04:16] <ChinnoDog> Well, unless your CPU is under 100Mhz...
[04:17] <roasted> considering I'm spending the same money for RAID 5 as I would be for RAID 10, there's no cost difference to me.
[04:17] <roasted> It's just I get 4TB usable space instead of 6TB.
[04:17] <ChinnoDog> Boot Phoronix test suite and do a benchmark
[04:17] <roasted> Which, my goal is 2TB.
[04:17] <roasted> software RAID (mdadm) hardly uses any CPU power to question it, to be honest.
[04:17] <ChinnoDog> I think you will find RAID 5 with 4 drives is faster than RAID 10
[04:18] <roasted> Well, maybe. So far I'd say 9/10 things I read suggest otherwise.
[04:18] <roasted> They do however say RAID 5 is often faster with read, but damn slow with write.
[04:19] <roasted> Some reports I'm reading are going as far as saying RAID 5 is obsolete.
[04:24] <ChinnoDog> I'd just stripe all 4. lol.
[04:24] <ChinnoDog> speed++
[04:25] <ChinnoDog> 64k block size
[04:27] <roasted> stripe all 4, as in, RAID 0 across all?
[04:30] <ChinnoDog> yup
[04:32] <roasted> well that sounds like it's asking for a nightmare :P
[10:25] <rmg51> Morning
[10:52] <JonathanD> Morning.
[11:50] <InHisName> Morning
[13:12] <teddy-dbear> Morning peoples
[16:57] <ChinnoDog> We are running low on morning.
[17:13] <InHisName> OK, here's another morning for you all
[17:14] <waltman> morning.
[17:14] <waltman> er, afternoon. close enough.
[17:15] <InHisName> So, ChinnoDog are you filled up enough with mornings?  Shall we get on with afternoons now ?
[17:25] <ChinnoDog> Yes. No more mornings for now.
[18:00] <InHisName> Good afternoon, everyone ! Bears too.
[18:34] <roasted> :D
[18:41] <InHisName> roasted: in January,  Hmmm, Is that an oxymoron ?
[23:16] <MutantTurkey> Back in Philadelphia
[23:17] <MutantTurkey> https://i3.ytimg.com/vi/P0AMe25qENo/hqdefault.jpg
[23:17] <MutantTurkey> was my atom PC
[23:17] <MutantTurkey> it didn't have a dedicated fan though, just a fan for the box, so I took off that heatsink and added two more instead
[23:20] <MutantTurkey> https://plus.google.com/photos/109367249414092517185/albums/posts/5834932779375558290
[23:20] <MutantTurkey> http://imgur.com/fNLNOD7