[13:03] <Brainstorm> Updates for Bangladesh: +1140 cases (now 1.6 million), +7 deaths (now 28097), +23435 tests (now 11.6 million, 4.9% positive) since 16 hours ago


[17:41] <grantbow> pleia2: looks like the g575 is more than $100 more than it was when on sale at Fry's. Were you looking at the s205?
[17:44] <pleia2> grantbow: nah, the X120e
[17:44] <pleia2> http://www.frys.com/product/6976007?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG
[17:45] <Faqtotum> checking out netbooks?
[19:29] <gua-uds> hmm gotta make a key
[19:47] <grantbow> Faqtotum: yes, laptops for $300-$400 ish that support kvm like the sale ones Fry's used to have. I should look for cheap or donated desktops that support kvm for testing too.
[19:48] <Faqtotum> will there be a list of them posted somewhere?
[19:49] <grantbow> just kicking around ideas. The ones we talked about so far are the Lenovo models G575, X120 and S205
[19:49] <grantbow> prices change so fast a list gets outdated fast
[19:50] <Faqtotum> ah
[20:42] <grantbow> price competition is brutal and lots of LUGers are quite price sensitive


[02:00] <diddledan> https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/commandline/2017/01/04/rumors-of-cmds-death-have-been-greatly-exaggerated/
[02:00] <diddledan> they don't mention that Windows itself cannot boot if cmd's infrastructure was removed
[02:02] <zmoylan-pi> they've said that since 90s
[02:17] <zmoylan-pi> they even tried to push that you couldn't remove internet explorer from windows
[02:33] <diddledan> watching an episode of "person of interest" the ai has calculated a chance of survival of 2.7% but still selected that option rather than carry-on calculating further scenarios
[03:59] <diddledan> https://twitter.com/find_evil/status/816846566799470593
[05:37] <diddledan> lasers solve everything: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-38510344
[09:38] <JamesTait> Good morning all! Happy Thursday, and happy Bird Day! 🐦
[09:41] <foobarry> happy bird day to you?
[09:59] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[09:59] <SuperMat1> good day
[10:05] <brobostigon> hi
[10:06] <foobarry> https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/10542519
[10:06] <foobarry> troll score 8/10
[10:09] <evildespot> You'd need a leading close quote, Shirley
[10:10] <foobarry> obviously the result of a drunken pub convo over xmas
[10:11] <evildespot> involving the word "hilarious"
[10:43] <TwistedLucidity> foobarry: The owner was explaining the prank on Reddit a few days ago
[10:45] <TwistedLucidity> Another example http://i.imgur.com/00ir7fQ.png
[10:46] <evildespot> That one would actually work (assuming injection of unescaped user input)
[10:48] <TwistedLucidity> Here is the thread https://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/5l47yy/someone_registered_drop_table_companies_ltd_in/dbsumjs/
[11:00] <foobarry> does anyone use smokeping? running it from a docker container and not sure how to increase the freuqnecy
[11:05] <foobarry> ah, think i've got it
[11:06] <foobarry> when there's no vim/nano/emacs on the dock so you have the use sed to edit a file :(
[11:21] <evildespot> At the risk of causing an argument (with which I will not engage :) ) a Docker container for something you can trivially apt-get install with virtually no dependencies may be a bit heavyweight
[11:30] <foobarry> not true, smokeping installs a web server
[11:31] <foobarry> since it creates rrdtool type graphs etc
[11:36] <evildespot> it only Recommends that, IIRC
[11:36] <foobarry> thats how i want to use it, so a container is perfect
[11:36] <foobarry> also, containers for everything!
[11:36] <evildespot> as you wish
[11:36] <evildespot> but then you need to learn how to edit files in containers without expecting your favourite editor to be in the container
[11:37] <evildespot> because that's not how containers (are supposed to) work
[12:52] <foobarry> that depends
[13:00] <Gargoyle> Anyone got any thoughts on why my Chrome no longer opens links from other apps (Doesn't seem to matter which app). Chrome launches or opens a new window, but the address bar is just blank.
[13:01] <foobarry> rebooted or killed backgruond chrome processes?
[13:01] <Gargoyle> Yeah. It's been doing this for a few weeks now.
[13:03] <Gargoyle> This is the tail of syslog while clicking a link in slack. https://gist.github.com/gargoyle/d033dbae04b9b1442c171bcacf4d5d6a
[13:04] <foobarry> http://askubuntu.com/questions/689449/external-links-are-opened-as-blank-tabs-in-new-browser-window-in-chrome
[13:04] <foobarry> ?
[13:05] <Gargoyle> If only I could just click that link! :P
[13:07] <Gargoyle> Sweet, it worked. Nice find. Thanks
[13:07] <foobarry> yay
[13:07] <Gargoyle> Seems something to do with trying to add Google Hangouts changed the entries in there.
[14:13] <foobarry> i have a markdown file than when exported to html, looks wonderful in the browser, but when exported to PDF, looks like a page printed from netscape in 1996, big text, etc
[14:14] <foobarry> how do i get it to print or pdf a bit more nicely?
[14:15] <foobarry> the html has a single centralised column that looks nicer
[14:23] <foobarry> oh, pandoc does it nicely
[14:43] <diddledan> frak
[14:44] <diddledan> turkey has had another attack
[14:44] <diddledan> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-38517847
[14:45] <TwistedLucidity> That's arrests over the New Year attack, no?
[14:45] <foobarry> yes. unless diddledan has been in a man cave
[14:46] <diddledan> I really feel for the Turkish population because they're a country divided between east and west so they have the west's progressive society combined with the push-back from the extremists who reside in the east
[14:47] <diddledan> sorry the BBC tweeted the wrong link: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-38521549
[14:47] <TwistedLucidity> Erdogan also appears to be a bit of a nutter
[14:48] <diddledan> well there is that
[15:02] <SebthreeBQM10HD> hi
[15:09] <TwistedLucidity> 'lo
[15:09] <SebthreeBQM10HD> TwistedLucidity, hi
[15:09] <SebthreeBQM10HD> how do I change the file system of a USB stick, using a UBuntu Live ?
[15:10] <SebthreeBQM10HD> or how do I cut a big video file into smaller parts
[15:10] <TwistedLucidity> http://askubuntu.com/questions/68809/how-to-format-a-usb-or-external-drive#69129
[15:11] <SebthreeBQM10HD> TwistedLucidity, yeah got big video files that are over 4GB
[15:11] <TwistedLucidity> Unless it's FAT32, it's have thought it would be fine
[15:11] <SebthreeBQM10HD> so doesn't really work pr9perlly trying to put that on fat
[15:11] <SebthreeBQM10HD> TwistedLucidity, yep that's the issue,  the external hard disk is fat  whatever
[15:11] <SebthreeBQM10HD> my 8GB usb sticks are fat32 as well
[15:11] <TwistedLucidity> Do you need to use it on Windows?
[15:12] <SebthreeBQM10HD> probably not with the right codec installed for sound
[15:12] <SebthreeBQM10HD> otherwise it's just images
[15:12] <SebthreeBQM10HD> I did thinik this to, I either go NTFS or I  could try Ext4 or something
[15:12] <TwistedLucidity> As you don't need Windows support; Ext4 and fahgeddaboutit
[15:13] <SebthreeBQM10HD> right but I still got to format the usb.  opening up gparted wasn't much good, ant just makek a partion, but right let's have a look at the link
[15:14] <SebthreeBQM10HD> TwistedLucidity, it did copy mostly to fat32, but then  coudlt tell wasn't going to finnish
[15:14] <SebthreeBQM10HD> TwistedLucidity, I have the pain of re installing WIndows as the next thing to do with the computer as well uh!
[15:14] <SebthreeBQM10HD> and upgrading things back to WIndows 10
[15:14] <SebthreeBQM10HD> before any Linux  installs happen
[15:14] <SebthreeBQM10HD> TwistedLucidity, planning on quad booing as well :d
[15:15] <SebthreeBQM10HD> Windows plus three Linux distros
[15:15] <TwistedLucidity> You can use NTFS, but IIRC there are performance issues with that on GNU/Linux.
[15:15] <TwistedLucidity> Or were; not checked in a l-o-n-g time
[15:15] <TwistedLucidity> I would thing Gparted would do it to. Just set the format after creating the single, whole-USB patition
[15:16] <TwistedLucidity> No idea how well Windows 10 plays with others; never used it
[15:16] <SebthreeBQM10HD> TwistedLucidity, I think NTFS is ok, unless the partion isn't shut down properly
[15:16] <SebthreeBQM10HD> then may not mount properly with Linux
[15:16] <SebthreeBQM10HD> that's what I remember from before
[15:16] <SebthreeBQM10HD> yeah having to open up Windows again, and clsoing down properly, so would detect in LINUX
[15:35] <MoBeats> [15:12:36]  TwistedLucidity:	As you don't need Windows support; Ext4 and fahgeddaboutit
[16:37] <diddledan> https://youtu.be/ySdaJbgO5gc
[18:44] <brobostigon> new job started today, woop, :)
[18:45] <popey> congrats
[18:45] <popey> how did it go?
[18:47] <brobostigon> it went well, walked around my supervisor ost of the afternoon, picking up inforation, no realy work done to be honest.
[18:47] <brobostigon> walked behind, i should say.
[18:51] <brobostigon> well, we did bring out some stock and organised it, but that was about it.
[19:05] <brobostigon> a toy shop, :)
[21:14] <foobarry> \o/
[21:15] <daftykins> \o/ what are we celebrating / stretching for? :D
[21:15] <foobarry> do they sell scale models?
[21:15] <foobarry> brobostigon?
[21:15] <brobostigon> foobarry: yes?
[21:15] <brobostigon> yes,
[21:16] <foobarry> :)
[21:16] <brobostigon> :)
[21:16] <foobarry> then it's the best kind
[21:16] <daftykins> one porsch model lego set please
[21:16] <daftykins> *Porsche
[21:16] <foobarry> also i think knex better than lego for kids
[21:16] <foobarry> my son is really enjoying actually making stuff creatively
[21:17] <foobarry> and not losing bespoke pieces all the time
[21:17]  * brobostigon was a maccano boy.
[21:20] <foobarry> i guess knex is the closest thing nowadays
[21:22] <brobostigon> fair point.
[21:22] <daftykins> mmm i had the rollercoaster
[21:22] <daftykins> i never made anything custom though, just followed instructions and then i was done :P
[21:23] <foobarry> meccano?
[21:23] <foobarry> or knew
[21:23] <foobarry> x
[21:23] <daftykins> knex rollercoaster, i only have very vague memories of meccano as if perhaps i never owned a model o0 not sure
[21:24] <foobarry> there's some knex models that are a bit 2D, that lend themselves to being made in 3D quite easily
[21:24] <daftykins> but every single variant i just followed instructions
[21:24] <foobarry> some knex kits have 40 models you can make
[21:25] <foobarry> so the 2D flat car could be replicated and then some joining pieces to the 2 parts to make a 3d car
[21:25] <brobostigon> whereas with maccano, you can make anything, you arent fixed.
[22:05] <daftykins> c'mon BBC, release the 4K blu-ray Planet Earth II :)
[22:06] <daftykins> https://www.amazon.co.uk/Planet-Earth-Blu-ray-Region-Free/dp/B01M629REH/ only 1080p right now
[22:43] <zmoylan-pi> they'll wait till people are clamouring for the 8k release before releasing the 4k version :-)
[22:45] <daftykins> heh
[22:46] <zmoylan-pi> and it'll be released on laserdisc :-P
[22:48] <daftykins> i'll hold out for the VHS
[22:49] <zmoylan-pi> and not the superior betamax version?
[22:49] <daftykins> that'd require a player
[22:49] <zmoylan-pi> or vcd...
[22:49] <daftykins> oof
[22:50] <daftykins> at leasy if i buy the client a 4K title i can keep the bluray version from inside :D
[22:50] <zmoylan-pi> squished down to a 100 megs per episode... :-P
[22:56] <daftykins> the 4K BD player's firmware update is 132MB!
[23:04] <diddledan> *sadface* https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-01-04/star-trek-youtube-fan-movie-ruled-not-to-be-fair-use
[23:06] <daftykins> mmhmm
[23:06] <daftykins> they should've parodied it, then it would've been fine!
[23:11] <zmoylan-pi> they have no probs with you making fan flicks if they're non profit so he must be trying to make dosh somewhere
[23:13] <zmoylan-pi> and iirc the term tricorder has an open use that rodenberry insisted on as he just knew someone would invent a practical version someday
[23:20] <daftykins> well they claimed the fan flic makers would gain from getting jobs in the industry, hah
[23:20] <zmoylan-pi> stretching the truth a little there...
[23:24] <zmoylan-pi> i seem to remember one fan based effort was raising money online and was hoping to make a small profit so got shut down for that reason
[23:27] <daftykins> heh


[01:50] <horaceli> lool, ping
[01:55] <agoliveira> horaceli: Now it's about 3AM for him, I don't think he's around
[01:59] <horaceli> thanks, agoliveira, :-).
[07:30] <lool> horaceli: pong
[07:31] <horaceli> hi, lool
[07:31] <horaceli> good to see you
[07:31] <lool> Same here; how are you doing?
[07:31] <horaceli> I am good. thanks
[07:31] <lool> Probably quite late at your place now
[07:31] <horaceli> how are you?
[07:31] <lool> Fine
[07:31] <horaceli> not really, it is 3:13pm my time.
[07:32] <lool> Oh ok
[07:32] <horaceli> bfiller_ reported a bug on hildon-desktop-0.0.43 that home layout has some problem in 800x480 resolution
[07:33] <horaceli> and I fixed in hildon-desktop, mainly for reading current screen resolution to determine the home layout size, it might need to be integrated to hildon-desktop
[07:33] <horaceli> I have generated the patch, and will share it out soon.
[07:33] <lool> Ok; bfiller_ has another problem which I couldn't reproduce until now
[07:33] <horaceli> #2?
[07:34] <horaceli> the 2nd description under the same bug?
[07:35] <lool> I'm checking
[07:35] <lool> It's in #172426
[07:35] <lool> Ah right, it's the same bug id you worked on
[07:35] <lool> It's a bad idea to have multiple bugs described in the same report
[07:36] <lool> horaceli: Anyway, how can I help you?
[07:36] <horaceli> lool, here is the patch: http://moblin.org/repos/users/horace.li/hildon-desktop-fix-bug-172426.patch
[07:36] <horaceli> and it is generated based on latest hildon-desktop-ubuntu
[07:36] <horaceli> rev413
[07:36] <horaceli> I guess
[07:37] <lool> Okay
[07:37] <horaceli> thanks. :-)
[07:37] <horaceli> any problem, just feel free to let me know
[07:37] <lool> horaceli: Did you send it upstream?
[07:38] <horaceli> not yet.
[07:38] <StevenK> lool: I'm going to upload a new m-i-c to the PPA tonight, after I test things
[07:38] <horaceli> should I?
[07:38] <lool> horaceli: I like knowing the opinion of upstream when we merge things; they know the software well
[07:38] <horaceli> that is a good point.
[07:39] <lool> StevenK: Any particular issue I should be aware of?
[07:39] <StevenK> lool: You added the PPA without adding -updates and -security.
[07:39] <lool> StevenK: They didn't merge all changes at moblin, so it needs to be modified before upload if you take a new snapshot
[07:40] <StevenK> I'm not going to take a new snapshot.
[07:40] <lool> StevenK: Ok; I do know about this issue, didn't come to it yet
[07:40] <StevenK> lool: Ah. Looks like I'll beat you to it.
[07:41]  * StevenK is testing image builds.
[07:41] <dholbach> good morning
[07:42] <theseinfeld> doko: is there a way to use the moblin lpia binary packages at the same time with using the i386?
[07:43] <theseinfeld> doko: i cannot get the moblin-media package installed because it depends on moko which is only lpia
[07:45] <doko> theseinfeld: well, you could do so with dpkg --force-architecture, but why is moko only built on lpia?
[07:46] <lool> horaceli: Thanks for the fix BTW
[07:47] <theseinfeld> doko: if I use the apt-get upgrade it sais:
[07:47] <theseinfeld> doko: moblin-media kept back...blah blah moko which is a virtual package
[07:49] <theseinfeld> doko: I even went further and did the apt.conf.d with APT::Architecture "lpia" :)) to see if I can get it
[07:50] <theseinfeld> doko: but, is there a way that we can use both i386 and lpia moblin packages? or for every moblin.org lpia.deb we need to make a i386 package?
[07:50] <doko> no
[07:50] <doko> just build for i386
[07:51] <theseinfeld> doko, so you mean that everything that has lpia by moblin has to be redone :) great redundancy...
[16:57] <ToddBrandt> HappyCamp_laptop: you got FIOS, sweet
[16:58] <HappyCamp_laptop> Doesn't everone? ;)
[16:58] <ToddBrandt> I see comcast every once in a while
[16:58] <ToddBrandt> poor suckers
[16:59] <davidm> About  to start the meeing
[16:59] <davidm> #startmeeting
[16:59] <MootBot> Meeting started at 16:59. The chair is davidm.
[16:59] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[16:59]  * lool waves
[16:59] <davidm> Good day everyone is everyone here?
[17:00] <davidm> Missing Don I see
[17:01] <ToddBrandt> here
[17:01] <davidm> Can anyone from Intel ping Don Johnson?
[17:02] <davidm> Anyway first topic:
[17:02] <davidm> [topic] lool to take a look at bug # 172426 and see if he can reproduce it.
[17:02] <MootBot> New Topic:  lool to take a look at bug # 172426 and see if he can reproduce it.
[17:03] <davidm> lool, status?
[17:03] <lool> Didn't look
[17:04] <lool> But need to merge patch by Horace which might fix it
[17:04] <lool> So can you please carry on "lool to merge patch by Horace as an attempt to fix 172426"
[17:04] <davidm> Will do
[17:04] <robr2> good morning all
[17:05] <davidm> [action] carry over lool to take a look at bug # 172426 and see if he can reproduce it. until Dec 20th.
[17:05] <MootBot> ACTION received:  carry over lool to take a look at bug # 172426 and see if he can reproduce it. until Dec 20th.
[17:05] <davidm> I spoke to Don, he will not be joining today
[17:05] <davidm> next topic
[17:05] <davidm> [topic] bspencer & Don_Johnson to clarify the process and deliverables
[17:05] <MootBot> New Topic:  bspencer & Don_Johnson to clarify the process and deliverables
[17:06] <davidm> I know that Don has a process meeting set up for tomorrow so I think this is being done.
[17:06] <davidm> bspenser is not around so I don't know if he has anymore to say on the topic.
[17:07] <davidm> So I'm going to head to the next topic unless anyone has anything else on this?
[17:07] <davidm> [topic] bspencer & horaceli to verify the ubuntu branch works
[17:07] <MootBot> New Topic:  bspencer & horaceli to verify the ubuntu branch works
[17:07] <davidm> horaceli, any input on this?
[17:08] <davidm> looks like horaceli is not around either.
[17:09] <davidm> I'll carry it over again.
[17:09] <davidm> [action] #
[17:09] <davidm> continue to hold open: bspencer & horaceli to verify the ubuntu branch works
[17:09] <davidm> #
[17:09] <MootBot> ACTION received:  #
[17:09] <davidm> continue to hold open: bspencer & horaceli to verify the ubuntu branch works
[17:09] <davidm> [action] continue to hold open: bspencer & horaceli to verify the ubuntu branch works
[17:09] <MootBot> ACTION received:  continue to hold open: bspencer & horaceli to verify the ubuntu branch works
[17:09] <mawhalen> Horace is in PRC, he is most likely asleep
[17:10] <davidm> [topic] smagoun Since my group needs it, I'll take an action item to test overriding exa for a gutsy psb backport. In progress.
[17:10] <MootBot> New Topic:  smagoun Since my group needs it, I'll take an action item to test overriding exa for a gutsy psb backport. In progress.
[17:10] <smagoun> We have a new drop of graphics drivers from Intel for our customer, I've moved on to working with those. I'll post things to the gutsy PPA if/when appropriate. We can close this issue.
[17:10] <davidm> OK, thanks smagoun it's closed then
[17:10] <davidm> mawhalen, thanks for the input on horaceli
[17:11] <davidm> [topic] amitk to update hardy ppa with drivers
[17:11] <MootBot> New Topic:  amitk to update hardy ppa with drivers
[17:11] <davidm> amitk, are you around?
[17:12] <davidm> I know he is working on that, I'll have to ping him off line, he is in India until the new year.
[17:12] <davidm> [action] davidm to ping amitk for status on #
[17:12] <davidm> update hardy ppa with drivers
[17:12] <davidm> #
[17:12] <MootBot> ACTION received:  davidm to ping amitk for status on #
[17:13] <davidm> [topic] davidm to query build team on best way to monitor the i386 builds and the LPIA builds to stay in sync
[17:13] <MootBot> New Topic:  davidm to query build team on best way to monitor the i386 builds and the LPIA builds to stay in sync
[17:13] <davidm> I'm still working this issue, Tollef and I will work this out.
[17:13] <davidm> I'm going to carry it over
[17:14] <davidm> [action] carry over, davidm to query build team on best way to monitor the i386 builds and the LPIA builds to stay in sync.
[17:14] <MootBot> ACTION received:  carry over, davidm to query build team on best way to monitor the i386 builds and the LPIA builds to stay in sync.
[17:14] <davidm> [topic] Michael Frey to post " Discuss reasons behind the decision to use acpid, custom moblin battery applet instead of using gnome-power-manager and its status bar applet" question to the list.
[17:14] <MootBot> New Topic:  Michael Frey to post " Discuss reasons behind the decision to use acpid, custom moblin battery applet instead of using gnome-power-manager and its status bar applet" question to the list.
[17:14] <ChickenCutlass> you can close this -- I had a discussion with ToddBrandt
[17:15] <davidm> OK, good enough
[17:15] <davidm> [topic] agoliveira to report next week any findings on boot speed.
[17:15] <amitk> davidm: sorry, I got distracted
[17:15] <MootBot> New Topic:  agoliveira to report next week any findings on boot speed.
[17:15] <davidm> amitk, I'll reopen the topic next then
[17:15] <smagoun_> davidm: sorry - just lost network connection here. Did you discuss monitoring LPIA builds?
[17:15] <agoliveira> Yes, I sent an email about the first findings and I had some feedback. Nothing conclusive thought but 2 items:
[17:16] <davidm> smagoun_, Yes, I'm working that will Tollef today and tomorrow, it's on my list.
[17:16] <agoliveira> 1) The Q1 lost a good deal of time detecting and loading the modules: a brick kernel might help here but would require to create one for each device.
[17:17] <agoliveira> 2) Matt noticed that the booting process is very CPU bound. We could try to reduce this usiing an all ext3 booting scheme.
[17:18] <agoliveira> Apart from that I tried to manually simplify the booting scripts but and remove usplash didn't get more than 2 or 3 seconds.
[17:18] <smagoun_> agoliveira: do you have any concrete recommendations?
[17:19] <agoliveira> smagoun_: I don't see any real easy way to really reduce boot time. One thing would be do the all ext3 boot and see what happens.
[17:19] <patm> all ext3 will conflict with the disk footprint requirements, but should be tested
[17:19] <agoliveira> patm: That's the problem.
[17:20] <davidm> Seems we need that tested now for two issues, boot speed and flash corruption
[17:20] <patm> yes
[17:20] <ChickenCutlass> smagoun_: didn't you find a problem with the console keyboard mapping taking many seconds
[17:20] <agoliveira> davidm: I don't see flash corruption as an issue. They are much more robust those days.
[17:20] <smagoun_> agoliveira: did you actually try a kernel with all modules compiled in, disabling udev, etc?
[17:21] <agoliveira> ChickenCutlass: I didn't see that. Did you noticed anything on the graph I sent?
[17:21] <agoliveira> smagoun_: No, didn't have time to try that.
[17:21] <smagoun_> ChickenCutlass: yes. There's a bug somewhere in the acton project in LP. Setting the console font is done twice, it takes 4sec each time
[17:21] <ChickenCutlass> smagoun_: agoliveira that is 8 seconds -- because it is done twice on boot
[17:21] <smagoun_> agoliveira: davidm we still see disk corruption on occasion using unionfs
[17:22] <lool> If the Q1 is the reference platform, we should focus on optimizing ext3 boots; optimizing squashfs boots would be a different job
[17:22] <patm> Q1 is not the reference platform
[17:22] <agoliveira> ChickenCutlass: I'll have to check it out as I doin't remember that and I'm quite sure I would have noticed.
[17:22] <lool> Ok :)
[17:22] <patm> lool, menlow is the only target that counts
[17:22] <agoliveira> patm: Unfortunately that's what I have to use as a test base.
[17:22] <patm> I understand
[17:23] <agoliveira> That's what IO have to report for now.
[17:23] <agoliveira> s/O//
[17:23] <davidm> patm, is there any chance your team will be testing the ext3 partition sometime soon?
[17:23] <smagoun_> patm: agoliveira many optimizations will benefit both squashfs and ext3-based systems
[17:23] <ChickenCutlass> agoliveira: The bug is #141261 in LP
[17:23] <lool> patm: It's not very interesting to look at Q1 boot speeds; I understood that menlow had an even slower CPU and had storage constraints; it's quite different  :-/
[17:24] <smagoun_> davidm: I tried it at one point. It booted, which was nice. Didn't have time beyond that, we're timesharing our CB among 6 developers
[17:24] <patm> lool, it is different but I assume it shares some issues
[17:24] <agoliveira> Well, in this case, maybe someone with menlow should take care of that.
[17:24] <agoliveira> or send me one
[17:25] <patm> what smagoun_ said earlier
[17:25] <agoliveira> smagoun_: Ouch
[17:25] <smagoun_> lool: I disagree. Q1 optimizations will help the Menlow systems too
[17:25] <davidm> smagoun_, is there any chance of leaving the ext3 build as the default for a while and see if the corruption goes away and we can get a quick look at boot speed too?
[17:26] <tonyespy_> i'm with steve...the optimizations may be different, but the technique(s) used could be the same
[17:26] <lool> smagoun_: Depends if we trade disk against CPU; the Q1 has more of both
[17:26] <lool> We could well see improvements on the Q1 which are really killing the menlow or vice-versa
[17:26] <smagoun_> davidm: yes, that's reasonable. We have a tight schedule between now and the end of the year, but I'll see what I can do.
[17:26] <patm> my original point is that we ultimately need to do timing on the menlow
[17:27] <lool> +1 for patm
[17:27] <Mithrandir> lool: actually, the Q1 has at least a lower clock speed than the menlow systems.
[17:27] <lool> Mithrandir: I thought the CPU was slower on menlow
[17:27] <patm> speed  starts at 800 Mhz
[17:27] <agoliveira> which is the q1 clock
[17:28] <lool> I didn't hear about clock speeds until now, but I recall I was told it was even slower due to a more energy efficient architecture
[17:28] <smagoun_> lool: The best way to make a system go faster is do less. In nearly every case that will benefit both platforms equally.
[17:28] <lool> smagoun_: I'm not saying there are no changes that would benefit both; I'm saying we should bench the target and not infer optimizations from a non-target system
[17:28] <agoliveira> As the boot process is very cpu bound looks like the first shot would be an all ext3 boot
[17:29] <robr2> if you speed up ext3 how do you meet the storage footprint size?
[17:30] <agoliveira> robr2: One can't have it all :)
[17:30] <davidm> robr2, if ext3 makes a big difference then at least we know that squashfs is a part of the problem.
[17:30] <smagoun_> robr2: If we use ext3, we don't meet the disk footprint targets.
[17:31] <Mithrandir> smagoun_: are you sure?
[17:31] <agoliveira> I think that we can squeeze that a bit by optimizing the installed packages. There must be room to manuver there.
[17:31] <patm> the ask is for <500MB
[17:31] <robr2> at one point we did compare booting ext3 to squashfs/unionfs and there was a very small difference between the two -- but we also didn't optimize the boot for ext3 just swapped one for the other
[17:32] <davidm> smagoun_, right now we have two issues that need to be debugged, boot speed and flash corruption, ext3 testing will help with both.
[17:32] <smagoun_> Mithrandir: for our customer we're in danger of missing those targets even with squashfs right now :(
[17:32] <kyleN> < 500MB not including OOo
[17:32] <patm> you should say disk image corruption, nit just flash issue I think
[17:32] <davidm> patm, Ah, OK sorry
[17:33] <Mithrandir> s/disk image/file system/, to nitpick
[17:33] <davidm> Still testing with ext3 will provide important info for both issues.
[17:33] <davidm> patm and I just talked off line, I think we have a way around some of his bottleneck.
[17:34] <robr2> it will give you data, not sure how that will help fix the corruption issue if there's a bug in either unionfs or squashfs and you need it meet the footprint requirement
[17:34] <smagoun_> davidm: are you going to clone Mithrandir ?
[17:34] <patm> xmas present
[17:34] <kyleN> (snowing HARD)
[17:34] <Mithrandir> no snow here. :-(
[17:34] <davidm> robr2, it will at least tell us if the problem is in fact the unionfs or squashfs or not.
[17:34] <davidm> smagoun_, wish I could
[17:35] <agoliveira> *very* sunny outside :)
[17:35] <robr2> do you have a set of repeatable steps to reproduce the disk image corruption?
[17:36] <davidm> robr2 no if we did I'd have someone assigned to fix it.
[17:36] <ChickenCutlass> robr2: I can get it to happen pretty much all the time by just hard shutting the system down
[17:36] <ChickenCutlass> robr2: happens more often on the menlow system with SSD flash
[17:36] <smagoun_> robr2: no, I can't reproduce on command. It usually involves a hard power off though
[17:37] <agoliveira> So?
[17:37] <robr2> i'd like to have an engineer help with this issue, can we coordinate/share info?
[17:38] <davidm> robr2 yes, for sure.
[17:38] <davidm> [action] Lexington to test ext3 for boot speed and disk image corruption as soon as an extra CB shows up.
[17:39] <MootBot> ACTION received:  Lexington to test ext3 for boot speed and disk image corruption as soon as an extra CB shows up.
[17:39] <Mithrandir> robr2: I've had some luck reproducing it by booting the system, then yanking the power cord midway through a couple of times.
[17:39] <davidm> [action] davidm to ship his cb to Lexington today overnight.
[17:39] <MootBot> ACTION received:  davidm to ship his cb to Lexington today overnight.
[17:39] <smagoun_> davidm: Thanks!!
[17:39] <patm> hohoho
[17:39] <kyleN> xmas
[17:40] <davidm> [action] Canonical to share all info with robr2 on disk image corruption as soon as available
[17:40] <MootBot> ACTION received:  Canonical to share all info with robr2 on disk image corruption as soon as available
[17:40] <robr2> is there a bug already in launchpad we could use to share info?
[17:40] <davidm> I believe there is, patm smagoun_ is it a public bug?
[17:40] <patm> robr, not really, I can create one in moblin
[17:40] <smagoun_> looking now
[17:40] <davidm> If not we can open a public one
[17:41] <robr2> we could just enter what we find in the bug there and everyone can update/monitor it as needed
[17:41] <patm> what project should it go against?
[17:42] <davidm> mobile I guess, until we can identify what is the issue
[17:42] <smagoun_> can't find a bug
[17:43] <davidm> smagoun_, kyleN don't get too excited, I'll need the unit back a some point after the new year but right now I think you can get more use from it solving this stuff.
[17:43] <davidm> Anyway so one more action to open a public bug?
[17:43] <davidm> Or is it done already :-)
[17:44] <davidm> who should open this bug?
[17:45] <davidm> smagoun_, can you since you care do it the most?
[17:45] <davidm> [action] davidm to follow up and make sure a bug is opened to share info with Intel
[17:45] <MootBot> ACTION received:  davidm to follow up and make sure a bug is opened to share info with Intel
[17:46] <patm> its private bug#141249, but we should open a new one
[17:46] <davidm> patm, yes please
[17:46] <smagoun_> davidm: sure
[17:46] <smagoun_> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/moblin-other/+bug/176178
[17:46] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 176178 in moblin-other "Filesystem corruption on hard shutdown" [Undecided,New]
[17:46] <smagoun_> just filed it
[17:46] <davidm> Good enough, have we gone as far as we can today on this topic?
[17:47] <agoliveira> This is the kind of situation that should never actually happen, but...
[17:47] <agoliveira> davidm: I guess so.
[17:47] <davidm> OK then next topic
[17:47] <davidm> [topic] robr to arrange a meeting around USB and VFAT issues. In this case all parties to this meeting are scattered around the world so someone will be inconvenienced.
[17:47] <MootBot> New Topic:  robr to arrange a meeting around USB and VFAT issues. In this case all parties to this meeting are scattered around the world so someone will be inconvenienced.
[17:48] <davidm> This happened but has been continued, robr2 is it confirmed for tomorrow or not?
[17:48] <davidm> do you know?
[17:48] <robr2> no, i don't know
[17:49] <robr2> i can send an invite out again to the team, but i need to make sure rustyl and alek are available from intel's side
[17:50] <davidm> OK, thanks, I have not heard anything more since the meeting.
[17:50] <lool> robr2: I think you can simply mail ubuntu-mobile@ when yuo have a date
[17:50] <lool> It needs not be private mail
[17:51] <davidm> [action] robr2 to check if meeting will happen tomorrow.
[17:51] <MootBot> ACTION received:  robr2 to check if meeting will happen tomorrow.
[17:51] <lool> (since the meeting is public anyway)
[17:51] <davidm> amitk, you here?
[17:51] <amitk> yup
[17:51] <davidm> ok then next topic i
[17:51] <davidm> [topic] amitk to update hardy ppa with drivers
[17:51] <MootBot> New Topic:  amitk to update hardy ppa with drivers
[17:51] <bspencer> I setup the continued USB meeting for 10am PDT
[17:52] <bspencer> Friday
[17:52] <amitk> davidm: hardy ppa?
[17:52] <davidm> OK, thanks bspencer
[17:52] <bspencer> are we agreed that it will work for those here?
[17:52] <bspencer> cause I don't want to roll out of bed at that early hour for nothing ;)
[17:52] <davidm> I have to reschedule a meeting with Don Johnson on process but
[17:53] <bspencer> silence is affirmation
[17:53] <agoliveira> bspencer: And that time would be what UTC (I'm lazy to google for it)
[17:53] <davidm> He had taken that time slot but I'll contact him after this
[17:53] <bspencer> agoliveira, +9hrs I think
[17:53] <bspencer> or close to that...maybe +8 or +10 after daylight savings
[17:53] <lool> I think it's 10
[17:53] <davidm> I think 1800
[17:54] <bspencer> fine.  see you then
[17:54] <HappyCamp_laptop> PDT is either -7 or -8
[17:54] <davidm>  amitk it was a carry over from the meeting before last week.
[17:54] <smagoun_> agoliveira: it's 4pm your time
[17:54] <Mithrandir> US/Pacific is -08:00
[17:54] <agoliveira> smagoun_: Cool. I was adding PDT to my world clock :)
[17:54] <agoliveira> smagoun_: Thanks.
[17:55] <amitk> davidm: you mean gutsy ppa though, right?
[17:55] <davidm> We have a hardy ppa to be symmetrical with gutsy ppa
[17:55] <smagoun_> (agoliveira you might want to double-check, just to be sure!)
[17:55] <lool> Hmm http://www.world-time-zones.org/zones/pacific-daylight-time.htm says -7
[17:55] <lool> I'm lost
[17:55] <davidm> So now I'm confused, amitk I think we need to go back to the old minutes and track this down.
[17:55]  * amitk learns something new. The vacation was successful :)
[17:55] <HappyCamp_laptop> lool, we are on standard time right now, not daylight
[17:56] <davidm> since we are almost out of time I'll leave the carry over in place and we can see what the item was.
[17:56] <HappyCamp_laptop> PST
[17:56] <amitk> davidm: sure
[17:56] <davidm> Ok next topic
[17:56] <smagoun_> http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock is helpful for this sort of thing
[17:56] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock is helpful for this sort of thing
[17:56] <smagoun_> thanks mootbot
[17:56] <lool> Ok so -8
[17:56] <davidm> [topic] smagoun - discuss tagging moblin projects in git
[17:56] <MootBot> New Topic:  smagoun - discuss tagging moblin projects in git
[17:56] <smagoun_> I'd like the intel folks to tag their git trees when doing a release. It makes finding the source that corresponds to a given release much easier. The alternative is wading through commit diffs trying to find the SHA-1 commit ID that corresponds to a release.
[17:57] <bspencer> smagoun_, I hear your request.  Not the first time
[17:57] <bspencer> thanks for your patience :-\
[17:57] <smagoun_> Some trees are already tagged, but some - like moblin-media - aren't tagged, and the commit messages don't always announce a new release
[17:57] <bspencer> I talked to the media guys about starting this practice when I was visiting in PRC
[17:57] <HappyCamp_laptop> sounds like a good idea, we have also discussed having our guys create tarballs at release time
[17:57] <bspencer> I'll encourage them a little stronger
[17:57] <smagoun_> bspencer: thanks, I appreciate it.
[17:57] <bspencer> let me clarify my understanding
[17:57] <bspencer> after git push, you get the tag
[17:58] <bspencer> then you git tag <tag> version  (or something)
[17:58] <bspencer> then you can pull from that tag.
[17:58] <HappyCamp_laptop> bspencer: you have to push the tag too, which I think requires a flag to git push
[17:58] <smagoun_> bspencer: On your side: git commit, git tag <tag>, git push, git push --tags
[17:59] <bspencer> cool
[17:59]  * HappyCamp_laptop wonders if he can work it into the build system some how
[17:59]  * bspencer likes HappyCamp's wonderings
[17:59]  * HappyCamp_laptop but probably won't try for now
[17:59] <davidm> bspencer, are you willing to take an action on this
[17:59] <amitk> bspencer: at UDS we briefly talked about having a -commits mailing list to track activity on moblin
[18:00] <HappyCamp_laptop> We do have a commit mailing list
[18:00] <amitk> HappyCamp_laptop: you do?
[18:00] <robr2> we've had from day 1 ;-)
[18:00] <lool> HappyCamp_laptop: git-bp can tag the configured branch with the configured formatted tag and message
[18:00] <HappyCamp_laptop> Not well publicized :(
[18:00] <HappyCamp_laptop> https://www.moblin.org/mailman/listinfo/commits
[18:00] <tonyespy_> amitk: i'm on it...
[18:00] <davidm> [link] https://www.moblin.org/mailman/listinfo/commits
[18:00] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://www.moblin.org/mailman/listinfo/commits
[18:01] <bspencer> davidm, my action is a little soft because we will discuss it and start the practice, but it has no end date.  I'm happy to have the action though
[18:01] <davidm> Thanks how about just report status in next meeting?
[18:02] <bspencer> np
[18:02]  * agoliveira wants some freaking lasers...
[18:02] <agoliveira> oops
[18:02] <davidm> [action] bspencer to talk with deveopers to push get tags when making a release, and report back on status of this
[18:02] <MootBot> ACTION received:  bspencer to talk with deveopers to push get tags when making a release, and report back on status of this
[18:02] <HappyCamp_laptop> amitk: I have also emailed our web content person to add the commit mailing list to the website info.
[18:02] <davidm> OK we are out of time and there are no new items on the agenda
[18:03] <amitk> HappyCamp_laptop: thanks
[18:03] <HappyCamp_laptop> lool: I will see if I have git-bp on our systems
[18:03] <patm> davidm, can I ask about PPM ?
[18:03] <davidm> Sure go ahead
[18:03] <lool> HappyCamp_laptop: That's git-buildpackage BTW, I'm just lazy typing it without tab :)
[18:03] <patm> basic question is what is the plan and current status for integrating PPM
[18:03] <HappyCamp_laptop> k
[18:04] <patm> PPM = power policy manager
[18:04] <davidm> Ah, thanks
[18:06] <HappyCamp_laptop> patm: who was supposed to answer this question?
[18:06] <agoliveira> Even better: which question? :)
[18:06] <robr2> the right person to answer that question is rustyl
[18:07] <davidm> [topic] what is the plan and current status for integrating PPM
[18:07] <MootBot> New Topic:  what is the plan and current status for integrating PPM
[18:07]  * agoliveira is being picky about the question mark, that's all :)
[18:08]  * HappyCamp_laptop thinks agoliveira wants question marks in front of and at the end of all questions.  Wierd!
[18:08] <robr2> i know PPM is committed on moblin and in images, but i'm not sure the latest status
[18:08] <davidm> amitk, do you have any input?
[18:08] <agoliveira> HappyCamp_laptop: No, we don't speak spanish around here, as you know :)
[18:09] <kyleN> speak only geek
[18:09] <robr2> mohammed is the engineer on our side doing the work with rusty coordinating/directing the effort
[18:09] <amitk> davidm: not really. My plate has been full
[18:09] <davidm> amitk, OK, thanks
[18:10] <davidm> patm, can we send the question to rusty in email?
[18:10] <HappyCamp_laptop> agoliveira: predicted high temperatures this week in Portland: 6, 7, 6, 7, 7 in Celsius, and it is wet :(
[18:10] <davidm> [action] davidm to query rustyl on status of PPM
[18:10] <MootBot> ACTION received:  davidm to query rustyl on status of PPM
[18:11] <HappyCamp_laptop> Oregon forecast: http://www.wrh.noaa.gov/forecast/MapClick.php?site=pqr&smap=1&textField1=45.53861&textField2=-122.9596&degrees=C
[18:11] <davidm> OK unless there is anything else I'm going to close the meeting?
[18:11] <HappyCamp_laptop> +1
[18:12] <davidm> going once...........
[18:12] <davidm> going twice.......
[18:12] <davidm> gone
[18:12] <davidm> #endmeeting
[18:12] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 18:12.
[18:13] <agoliveira> HappyCamp_laptop: I can just hope for a better weather in january. In any case I already bought a heavy and water-proof jacket.
[18:14] <amitk> davidm: are we going to discuss the driver updates now?
[18:14] <sodarock_home> agoliveira: january is usually colder than December :(
[18:15] <agoliveira> sodarock_home: I hope it's at least drier or you will see a very ill-tempered version of me there.
[18:17] <Mithrandir> sodarock_home: it's 6-7°C there now?  That's nice and warm..
[18:17] <sodarock_home> LOL, I don't think agoliveira thinks so :)
[18:17] <Mithrandir> it's -9°C here now.
[18:18] <sodarock_home> Brrr
[18:18] <sodarock_home> Okay, I got to go drive into work now
[21:29] <HappyCamp> praj


[10:24] <BluesKaj_> Hiyas all
[15:54] <tgm4883> nacc: are you suggesting that 15.10 was a development release?
[15:54] <nacc> tgm4883: sorry, typo'd, still waking up :)
[15:54] <tgm4883> ok :)
[15:55] <tgm4883> I know some people do call non-lts releases dev releases, and they really shouldn't
[15:55] <nicomachus> boo. forgot to turn on my PC at home this morning. can't backup without it...
[15:56] <nacc> tgm4883: yep, it's a bad habit on my part
[15:56] <daftykins> from work o0
[15:56] <tgm4883> nicomachus: upgrade and if things go awry then restore from your normal backups?
[15:57] <nicomachus> tgm4883: it's been a couple weeks. :/
[15:58] <nicomachus> daftykins: yes from work. in my line of work, everything is owned by me. data, documents, etc. I guarantee no one else on staff has backups anywhere. but they all run windows so don't think about updating OS's or anything like htat.
[15:59] <daftykins> heh, nasty
[15:59] <daftykins> think i'd rather take in an external HDD though and have the benefit of speed
[16:00] <nicomachus> heh. the external HDD is currently plugged into my PC at home. :/
[16:01] <nicomachus> I think it's actually a faster transfer that way anyway. I have parallel gigabit on both machines, but this laptop only has USB 2.0 and the PC at home has 3.0
[16:01] <nicomachus> so max on this machine would be, what, 500 Mbps?
[16:02] <daftykins> far less, speed of the drive if it's mechanical
[16:02] <daftykins> less still if the enclosure doesn't support UASP
[16:02] <nicomachus> true. it is mechanical.
[16:03] <daftykins> i'm gonna see if i can reassemble my old graphics card without the air gap i noticed last time, hoping it's not entirely dead after all
[16:03] <daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/x6r082z849o8xzi/IMG_20160707_161300.jpg?dl=0
[16:04] <nicomachus> model/
[16:04] <nicomachus> s///?/
[16:04] <daftykins> 2GB nvidia 560Ti
[16:05] <daftykins> got the lovely new MSI nvidia 1070 8GB in my new desktop build :D
[19:07]  * tgm4883 sighs
[19:11] <daftykins> more delightful customers?
[19:15] <tgm4883> Not customers this time
[19:16] <tgm4883> I just find it so much fun when we point out that we shouldn't support something (in this instance, we shouldn't help enable a user stay on an EOL version) and the persons response (that is enabling this) is "I'm just providing unbiased facts. End of discussion"
[19:16] <tgm4883> I mean, get off yourself dude
[19:21] <daftykins> some guy is helping someone keep running EOL?
[19:22] <daftykins> that's as damaging as the ones that say lubuntu can revive a turd like a netbook :( very frustrating
[19:29] <tgm4883> yep
[21:29] <daftykins> bearing in mind the rule on support in here, has anyone used mod_evasive with apache2 before?
[21:33] <daftykins> ah nevermind :) just for reference though, i had a web server getting hammered by random IPs that kept changing - mod_evasive is kind of like an alternative to fail2ban but built into apache - it's now blocking IPs based on repeated access attempts which before were causing apache to fall over
[21:34] <Bashing-om> Heads up. the forum has problems posting .. expect our traffic load on the channel to increase .
[21:34] <daftykins> ooh dear!
[21:34] <daftykins> Bashing-om: just in time for the weekend masses ;)
[21:35] <Bashing-om> Oh Joy ! See what all you are missing .. daftykins I miss ya on the channel !
[21:37] <daftykins> :) thanks sir
[21:37] <daftykins> missing you on #squoo.sh too!
[21:39] <Bashing-om> There not a thing going on in squoo.sh; when there is .. I can and will join .. where oh where has our fearless leader got off to ?
[21:40] <daftykins> True, that - but a nice little camp for us to chat in. I'd wager he's buried under a project or two :) He did mention buying a new farm for a new build iirc
[21:41] <Bashing-om> yeah .. I can accept that building a new house ( as in domicile) will take up ALL time .
[21:43] <Bashing-om> you, me and 2 others in #squoo.sh .... pickens are slim .
[21:44] <daftykins> plus you know how much he likes to multi-task with and keep going on the back burners :D
[21:46] <Bashing-om> Then again, maybe a flood wiped out his data center ??
[21:49] <daftykins> ah he seemed to think he's pretty safe from floods i think
[21:51] <Bashing-om> Next time lotus checks in .. will have him ping TJ-; he was able once before to raise him up to provide his status .
[21:54] <daftykins> ah no i did that by dropping him an email :)
[21:55] <daftykins> could certainly check in on him again
[21:55] <Bashing-om> Ho Kay; Time to see if he is still breathing ?
[21:58] <daftykins> sure can
[22:00] <Bashing-om> when #squoo.sh channel number lights up .. will know TJ- is on !
[22:13] <daftykins> bit too engrossed in a task of my own right now though :(
[23:03] <Bashing-om> Forum is back in business :)