[10:42] <sagaci> hi, I've just downloaded the latest base pack translation, I notice there's a couple of languages, such as en@shaw, en_US@piglation,
[10:42] <sagaci> ca@valencia, en@boldquot - what are these, extra branches?


[01:07] <theShirbiny> Hi everyone
[09:28] <Kilos> hellooo africa
[09:29] <elacheche> o/
[11:56] <Kilos> yay algeria just approved me in their launchpad
[11:56] <Kilos> only took about 8 months
[12:27] <craigbrash> not bad hey
[21:48] <elacheche> o/
[22:10] <craigbrash> happy new year all


[01:56] <thumper> what ever happened to webapp integration with the sound menu?
[01:56] <thumper> like spotify?
[07:51] <didrocks> morning
[08:16] <pitti> Noskcaj: if the version you branched off in the PPA is the same as in vivid, and you used distro-compatible version numbers, we can sync the sources; otherwise needs merges/uploads
[08:19] <pitti> Noskcaj: upower synced; it'll stay in -proposed until the transition is done
[08:22] <seb128> hey pitti
[08:22] <seb128> good morning desktopers
[08:24] <pitti> hey seb128
[08:31] <seb128> pitti, did we decide to start the upower transition?
[08:31] <pitti> seb128: well, it was started long ago, and Noskcaj has everything ready in his PPA? I don't see why not?
[08:31] <pitti> and so does Debian
[08:31] <seb128> pitti, not sure, we decided to not go for it before utopic because the xubuntu team was unhappy about it
[08:32] <seb128> but I didn't follow the details/what problem it created for them
[08:32] <seb128> I just know they reached to the release team to have the ffe refused
[08:32] <pitti> seb128: the only long-time blocker was indicator-power, but Charles ported it recently
[08:32] <seb128> oh well, it's a start of cycle, we can figure out the remaining bits
[08:32] <pitti> yes, because it was too close to release indeed
[08:32] <pitti> so let's not slip it again :)
[08:33] <seb128> I'm just a bit worried about piling too many transitions at the same time in proposed
[08:33] <seb128> because they interact and we end up with months of untangling before being able to get anything through then
[08:34] <seb128> reading backlog
[08:34] <seb128> Noskcaj, gtk "transition"? I do hope the new GTK is not ABI incompatible/doesn't require a transition
[08:34] <pitti> seb128: well, as it stands the old upower makes things more complicated wrt. merging from Debian or updating to new upstream versions, so I think it's one of the first that we should do
[08:34] <pitti> it's all ready, after all
[08:35] <seb128> k
[08:35] <seb128> well, some of the transitions are already in proposed by autosyncs
[08:35] <seb128> so we don't get to decide to start or not those
[08:35] <seb128> anyway, let's see how it goes
[08:36] <seb128> reading backlog still
[08:37] <seb128> didrocks, @qtcreator on unity8/mir, bregma had a look previous cycle and know what is not working iirc
[08:37] <seb128> so maybe check with him first
[08:37] <seb128> it might spare some work
[08:37] <didrocks> seb128: oh sure, will do :)
[08:37] <didrocks> thanks
[08:37] <seb128> yw
[08:38] <seb128> didrocks, http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2014/04/17/%23ubuntu-desktop.html#t14:56
[08:39] <didrocks> thx
[08:39] <seb128> "bregma	hey tedg I'm trying to run Qt Creator in my Unity 8 Desktop Preview session but it apparent fails because its subprocesses are not allowed to connect or something, what's the best approach to analysing that problem"
[08:39]  * didrocks opens
[08:40] <willcooke> morning
[08:40] <seb128> hey willcooke
[08:40] <seb128> willcooke, ^ btw, about qtcreator
[08:40] <willcooke> ah, cool
[08:41] <seb128> so it's rather a process management issue, if the problem is still the same one
[08:41] <seb128> not a rendering one
[08:41] <willcooke> hmmmm
[08:41] <willcooke> that sounds complicated
[08:42] <didrocks> yeah, seems that we depend on the API team :/
[08:42] <didrocks> and they want to know if they implement that using upstart or systemd
[08:42] <pitti> Noskcaj: you don't have distro compatible version numbers there (quite rightfully for a PPA), so that'll need uploads; also, several of the gnome-* are in bzr
[08:42] <pitti> Noskcaj: also some merges with newer versions
[08:46] <seb128> I've an appointment at 10, need to go, back a bit later (going to have some shifted hours in the evening to compensate)
[08:47] <willcooke> seb128, catch you later
[09:03] <Laney> morning
[09:03] <Laney> darkxst: The problem was that new clutter-1.0 had Breaks on the current mutter
[09:13] <Noskcaj> seb128, Just the random visual stuff that always breaks
[09:14] <Noskcaj> pitti, That's the utopic stuff, i wasn't sure if i should re-do it in PPA.
[09:14] <pitti> Noskcaj: nah, let's just upload it to vidid now
[09:14] <pitti> vivid, too
[09:14] <Noskcaj> ok
[09:14] <Noskcaj> I'll make a heap of MPs in the next few days then
[09:17] <Noskcaj> need sleep for now though
[09:20] <xnox> seb128: Laney: i think we need to discuss ssh/gpg agents for the default desktop. I'm getting complaints, after re-enabling gnome-keyring by default via SRU.
[09:44] <Laney> hi xnox, got some time off? ;-)
[09:44] <Laney> what are the complaints?
[09:45] <Laney> I have swapped this problem out of my brain state I'm afraid
[09:46] <xnox> Laney: gnome-keyring's ssh/gpg agents are subpar compared to openssh/gnupg agents.
[09:46] <xnox> Laney: it can't handle eliptic curve keys, keys that are protected by a better encryption algorithms, smartcards, ssh certificates, etc.
[09:46] <Laney> what happens without upstart?
[09:47] <xnox> Laney: but, it's still the default via xdg autostart, and it's now default for ssh/gpg with upstart.
[09:47] <xnox> in xdg autostart it's .desktop file per component (secrects, pkcs11, ssh, gpg), in upstart it's a single job.
[09:47] <Laney> I guess before people could just untick it in the startup applications thing?
[09:47] <Laney> or is it being non split the problem?
[09:48] <xnox> yes. and the untick doesn't migrate to upstart job overrides.
[09:48] <Laney> is it lack of UI?
[09:48] <Laney> don't understand really
[09:48] <xnox> and the upstart job is unsplit so one can't start pkcs11/secrets by gnome-keyring, without it also taking over ssh/gpg agents.
[09:48] <xnox> and yeah, there is no UI for it.
[09:49] <xnox> (and the xdg autostart override is not honored by the upstart job)
[09:49] <Laney> upstart job parsing .desktop file? :)
[09:49] <xnox> can the UI ticks/unticks be queried somehow? cause i think upstart job shouldn't run if it was disabled.
[09:50] <xnox> and we should split gnome-keyring uptart job into 4 components - keyring, pkcs11, gpg, ssh - just like xdg autostart desktop files are split
[09:50] <Laney> it puts a desktop file in .config/ somewhere with Hidden=true, so you could read that
[09:51] <xnox> what about giving up on keyring's ssh & gpg agents all together?
[09:51] <Laney> don't think so
[09:51] <xnox> and only use gnome-keyring for secrets & pkcs11.
[09:51] <xnox> cause it can unlock/save the ssh/gpg passwords, right?
[09:52] <Laney> I guess I'm a simple ssh key user but it works well enough for me
[09:52] <xnox> Laney: any idea what gnome-keyring's pkcs11 component does?
[09:54] <Laney> smart card support isn't it?
[09:58] <seb128> back
[09:58] <seb128> Laney, hey, wie gehts?
[10:00] <darkxst> Laney, ok, I didnt see that
[10:00] <Laney> hey seb128, doing good thanks, went to a ska show last night :-o
[10:00] <Laney> then got SOAKED on the way back
[10:01] <seb128> "ska"?
[10:01] <Laney> no waterproofs
[10:01]  * seb128 googles and learn a new thing
[10:01] <darkxst> Laney, but landing new clutter with current mutter is trivial
[10:01] <seb128> Laney, better to get soaked on the way back than on the way there...
[10:01] <Laney> darkxst: maybe, but it's better for you to do it than me
[10:01] <Laney> I didn't know if you can have new mutter and old gnome-shell
[10:02] <darkxst> Laney, no you can't do that
[10:02] <Laney> so then you have to upgrade gnome-shell which requires gtk
[10:02] <darkxst> but new clutter with old mutter will work
[10:02] <Laney> if you drop the breaks?
[10:02] <Laney> why are they there then?
[10:03] <Laney> seb128: yep, but if it was raining when I left I would have taken the waterproof stuff :p
[10:03] <Laney> some guy standing outside a pub laughed quite a lot at me
[10:03] <darkxst> yes, for api/abi break, which there was a minor one
[10:03] <darkxst> I suppose
[10:04] <Laney> anyway, this can wait until next week to do it properly
[10:05] <Laney> did we get a rebased mir patch for gtk 3.14 yet?
[10:05] <darkxst> Laney, yes next week is fine
[10:06] <darkxst> Laney,  I think we will need upower and maybe gnome-desktop before we can land gnome-shell 3.14 ;(
[10:07] <Laney> upower is happening or going to happen
[10:07] <pitti> darkxst: new upower is in -proposed, we need to upload Noskcaj's PPA changes now
[10:07] <Laney> is g-desktop hard?
[10:07] <pitti> Laney: ^
[10:07] <Laney> cool
[10:07] <pitti> we should do this quickly to reduce delta from debian and unblock other transitions
[10:08] <seb128> Laney, I think larsu's vcs had that "rbeased", read it applies/build, unsure it works
[10:08] <Laney> didn't when I looked
[10:08] <Laney> maybe it does now?
[10:08] <seb128> didn't work?
[10:09] <seb128> where did you try? unity8 desktop?
[10:09] <Laney> was disabled
[10:09] <seb128> hum
[10:09] <darkxst> Laney, I think gnome-desktop should be pretty straight forward this time
[10:09] <Laney> yeah it is
[10:09] <seb128> k, dunno then
[10:09] <Laney> I thought desrt was doing it, might be wrong
[10:09] <seb128> Lars said it applies/builds
[10:10] <seb128> iirc
[10:10] <seb128> but he's not here this week
[10:10] <seb128> that can wait monday imho
[10:10] <darkxst> I'm also working on gnome-session merge, which is a little tangled trying to revert old dialogs]
[10:10] <Laney> darkxst: mitya57 / Alberts work upstream doesn't help?
[10:11] <darkxst> Laney, how far have they got? it only helps if they stop using the gnome-session dialogs
[10:11] <Laney> I thought that was the point
[10:11] <seb128> "they"?
[10:12] <seb128> is that gnome-panel?
[10:12] <Laney> yep
[10:12] <seb128> do we care about gnome-session sessions not using gnome-shell/unity/gnome-panel?
[10:12] <seb128> is there any of those in use?
[10:12] <Laney> does that exist?
[10:12] <seb128> like running gnome with cairodock or something
[10:12] <seb128> instead of panel
[10:12] <seb128> dunno, that's what I'm asking
[10:13] <darkxst> seb128, gnome-panel has its own dialogs, but they are not used for keyboard shortcuts, last time I checked
[10:14] <Laney> I would check with thowe two
[10:14] <seb128> bah, packages.ubuntu.com is buggy/incomplete
[10:14] <Laney> before doing any complex reverts or whatever
[10:16] <seb128> wasn't p.u.c able to look for packages containing a directory, like /usr/share/gnome-session/sessions/ ?
[10:18] <darkxst> Laney, will do, I kind of stopped once I saw how tangled it was anyway
[10:29] <seb128> happyaron, hey, did you see my fcitx error yesterday?
[10:32] <seb128> happyaron, bug #1387382
[10:55] <pitti> seb128, Laney, Noskcaj: starting to upload some upower transition bits now, if that's ok?
[10:56] <pitti> (with merging/pushing to bzr, etc.)
[10:56] <pitti> e. g. gnome-applets is now a fakesync
[10:57] <Laney> fine by me
[10:57] <Laney> thanks for helping!
[10:57] <pitti> I'm doing -proposed cleanup today anyway, so I might just as well :)
[10:57] <pitti> and this has been lingering far too long
[10:58] <Laney> we planned to do it at the start of this cycle
[11:25] <Laney> hey didrocks, CI train question ;-)
[11:25] <Laney> if I have a branch with a tagged (uploaded) revision and another commit on top
[11:25] <Laney> can CI train figure this out?
[11:26] <Laney> i.e. will it notice the extra commit and let me upload it?
[11:40] <pitti> darkxst, Noskcaj: gnome-session would need heavy backport patching for upower (in https://launchpad.net/~noskcaj/+archive/ubuntu/upower/+packages); do you actually want to do this, or rather just update to 3.14?
[11:43] <pitti> seb128, Laney: unity-control-center/settings-daemon are in a "magic" bzr; is this supposed to go through CI train, or normal commit/push?
[11:43] <pitti> .../dput?
[11:44] <Laney> pitti: ci train, but dput if you want, I don't mind
[11:44] <pitti> and one makes up a new sensible version number?
[11:44] <Laney> just commit/tag/push to the branch
[11:44] <Laney> just ubuntu2 is fine
[11:44] <pitti> 14.10.0+14.10.20140922 would be quite wrong, though
[11:44] <pitti> (obvious how to bump, of course)
[11:45] <Laney> I don't know how the upstream upstream part is generated
[11:45] <Laney> but they're 1.0 so you can just edit the source
[11:53] <didrocks> Laney: CI train will always take latest branch content
[11:54] <didrocks> so yeah, it will notice this extra commit and let you upload it
[11:54] <pitti> so I build the orig.tar.gz from everything except debian/, I suppose?
[11:54] <Laney> pitti: just bzr bd -S should do it
[11:55] <didrocks> yeah, it's in splitmode
[11:55] <Laney> or you can drive the train if you want, all core-devs should have permission
[11:55]  * willcooke . . o ( tickets please )
[11:56] <didrocks> willcooke: on my original airplane vision, there are some tickets concepts :)
[11:56]  * pitti hides in the toilet
[11:56] <Laney> is there status and upgrades?
[11:56] <Laney> and lost baggage?
[11:56] <Laney> :P
[11:56] <didrocks> pitti: no smoking please!
[11:57] <willcooke> is there a white zone which is for the loading and unloading of passengers only?
[11:57] <pitti> didrocks: je ne fume jamais !
[11:57] <didrocks> Laney: well, now, I would implement business class at least ;)
[11:57] <willcooke> :D
[11:58] <Laney> that's called being a core-dev
[11:58]  * Laney breezes right through all of the checks
[11:58] <didrocks> heh
[12:02] <pitti> Laney: oh, I see https://code.launchpad.net/~laney/ubuntu-system-settings/upower0.99/+merge/230988 ; that never landed, is that broken, or needs an ack, or it was just forgotten?
[12:03] <Laney> the last two
[12:05] <darkxst> pitti, not entirely sure what what you are talking about gnome-session, but I will have g-s 3.14 ready soon enough
[12:06] <pitti> darkxst: for the upower transition; applying the patches to 3.8 is a bit hackish IMHO
[12:06] <pitti> darkxst: it's in the PPA, but I figure you'd rather want to upgrade to 3.14 anyway?
[12:07] <darkxst> pitti, gnome-session is at 3.9.90ish in that archives no?
[12:07] <pitti> darkxst: right, that's what I meant (not 3.8)
[12:08] <pitti> Laney: oh sorry, unity-system-settings != unity-control-center :)
[12:08] <Laney> ITYM ubuntu-system-settings
[12:09] <darkxst> pitti, and yes we should just go with 3.14 straight up, if possible
[12:09] <pitti> darkxst: OK, so I'll leave those two bits of bug 1330037 to you and Noskcaj?
[12:12] <darkxst> pitti, I wont have time to look until the weekend, but ok
[12:12] <pitti> darkxst: that sounds fine
[12:14] <darkxst> pitti, ok
[12:15]  * darkxst must sleep now
[12:16] <Laney> night!
[12:23] <didrocks> willcooke: Laney: seb128: so, I have the ubuntu desktop next image booted here, I have the password prompt asking me for a password, empty or "ubuntu" doesn't work
[12:23] <didrocks> seb128: is it the thing we saw together and so, the blank password doesn't really work under Qt?
[12:25] <didrocks> hum, updated to "ubuntu" in a tty and still doesn't work
[12:26] <didrocks> weren't we supposed to autolog in that live image?
[12:26] <seb128> didrocks, just go to a vt and change the passwd
[12:26] <didrocks> 13:25:11  didrocks | hum, updated to "ubuntu" in a tty and still doesn't work
[12:26] <didrocks> seb128: ^
[12:26] <seb128> didrocks, or edit https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/unity8/drop-workaround-empty-pwd-login/+merge/239401 by hand
[12:27] <seb128> didrocks, it's one line to delete
[12:27] <seb128> didrocks, we do autologin, you get the unity8 lock screen
[12:27] <seb128> and we don't use "no password"
[12:27] <seb128> we use the empty password set as a passwd
[12:27] <seb128> remember, that's what you helped me with in washington ;-)
[12:28] <didrocks> hence my 13:23:49  didrocks | seb128: is it the thing we saw together and so, the blank password doesn't really work under Qt?
[12:28] <didrocks> so yeah, I do remember about it :)
[12:28] <didrocks> it's still weird to have that prompt, even with empty password
[12:28] <seb128> didrocks, try deleting the line from that mr ^
[12:28] <didrocks> and that it doesn't work if you passwd
[12:28] <didrocks> yeah, doing that (restarting, it hanged)
[12:29] <seb128> didrocks, well, prompt is normal, because from a pam viewpoint you have a password
[12:29] <seb128> the text just happens to be the empty string
[12:29] <seb128> still unsure why the livecd guys did that
[12:29] <seb128> rather than using passwd -d
[12:30] <didrocks> seb128: unity8 isn't an upstart job?
[12:30] <seb128> it is
[12:30]  * didrocks can't sudo restart unity8
[12:30] <seb128> no sudo
[12:30] <seb128> it's an user job
[12:30] <didrocks> unknown job as well (from a tty)
[12:31] <seb128> same user?
[12:31] <didrocks> ubuntu-desktop-next@
[12:31] <Laney> you won't be in the upstart session there
[12:31] <seb128> you need to export the right env
[12:31] <seb128> easier to sig9 unity8
[12:33] <didrocks> seb128: doesn't really restart after a sigkill
[12:33] <seb128> weird
[12:33] <didrocks> ok, rebooting then
[12:34] <didrocks> hoping that the key is persistent :)
[12:38] <didrocks> humok, not persistent and unity8 definitively doesn't restart after a sigkill. Let me try an installation on that machine…
[12:38] <seb128> didrocks, I usually sudo restart lightdm
[12:38] <seb128> that for sure work
[12:38] <didrocks> ah, the whole login…
[12:39] <seb128> yes
[12:39] <didrocks> ok, doing
[12:39] <seb128> well, it works on utopuc
[12:39] <seb128> utopic even
[12:39] <seb128> didn't try vivid yet
[12:39] <didrocks> I will tell you if this works with vivid :)
[12:40] <didrocks> however, booting is quite unreliable…
[12:41] <seb128> :-/
[12:41] <seb128> usb stick issue you think?
[12:42] <didrocks> really unsure, worked well with other live recently, never got a glinch
[12:43] <didrocks> ok, restarting lightdm works and I can log in
[12:46] <seb128> great
[12:46] <seb128> now we just need to nag Saviq to get that one liner unity8 change in vivid
[12:46] <seb128> that shouldn't be blocker by rtm
[12:47] <Saviq> seb128, yeah, will do
[12:47] <seb128> Saviq, thanks
[12:48] <Saviq> seb128, I've one vivid landing that I just ACKed (sync with rtm really)
[12:48] <seb128> Saviq, it doesn't include that change though?
[12:48] <Saviq> seb128, not yet
[12:48] <seb128> :-(
[12:48] <Saviq> seb128, I need to get a clean-ish slate first
[12:48] <seb128> it's a one liner and safe, shame it takes so much effort to get it landed :/
[12:49] <seb128> it doesn't even impact codepath used on the phone
[12:49] <Saviq> seb128, well, it's not that one that takes so much effort, it's everything else that got out of sync between vivid and rtm
[12:49] <Saviq> seb128, yeah, which is why it won't land in rtm at all
[12:49] <seb128> well, you could have batched with whatever else was in there
[12:49] <seb128> it's not going to conflict with rtm work
[12:49] <Saviq> seb128, except I already have like 30 branches in there
[12:49] <seb128> so it should apply fine on whatever you upload to vivid
[12:50] <seb128> k, anyway just being grumpy about desktop-next login being buggy since july
[12:50] <seb128> sorry for the ranting
[12:50] <Saviq> seb128, it'll happen, really, it will, I just couldn't land that silo yesterday 'cause we had a different issue
[12:50] <seb128> I just wish desktop would get some attention
[12:50] <Saviq> seb128, well now, bug was only filed in september
[12:50] <seb128> Saviq, k, thanks
[12:51] <Saviq> seb128, MP is ap since when, a week?
[12:51] <seb128> Saviq, yeah, I discussed it a couple of times with mterry and others
[12:51] <seb128> Saviq, right, I did look at fixing because nobody was looking at it since <ages>
[12:51] <Saviq> seb128, it's not like we're trying to ignore that actively
[12:51] <seb128> but I guess I could have looked earlier, I'm as much to blame as others
[12:51] <Saviq> seb128, we're basically excluded from what happens in desktop-next
[12:52] <seb128> Saviq, well, it's more than we let land things that regress the desktop and then don't bother trying to sort out the regressions
[12:52] <seb128> Saviq, we need the test plans to account for desktop-next
[12:52] <seb128> and stop the line when we bug this one
[12:53] <didrocks> argh, I have no way to disable the touchscreen on Mir
[12:53] <didrocks> and this hardware gives random inputs, so I needed on X to disable it
[12:53] <seb128> didrocks, we don't have any on unity7/xorg either I think
[12:54] <didrocks> seb128: xinput
[12:54] <seb128> oh, right, I though you mean GUI
[12:54] <didrocks> and then toggle the correct property
[12:54] <didrocks> no
[12:54] <didrocks> just want to disable it whatever
[12:54] <seb128> k
[12:54] <didrocks> here, my mouse is moving randomely
[12:54] <didrocks> clicking
[12:54] <didrocks> not really nice to experiment…
[12:54] <seb128> on what device did you install it?
[12:54] <didrocks> XT2
[12:55] <seb128> oh, so you have a test laptop :-) does that have bt?
[12:55] <didrocks> it doesn't
[12:55] <seb128> I see
[12:55] <didrocks> it claims it has one, but doesnt' work
[12:55] <didrocks> tried with fedora/ubuntu
[12:55] <didrocks> but yeah, the unity8 image isn't usable at all if I can't turn off the wrongly touch screen :(
[12:55] <seb128> if you are going to work on bluetooth I guess it would be worst expensing a stick
[12:56] <didrocks> seb128: well, seems priority changes, so not sure yet, but yeah, it would make sense
[12:56] <seb128> :-(
[12:56] <seb128> did you ask on the mir channel about turning off touch?
[12:56] <didrocks> not yet, will try
[12:56] <didrocks> have few hope though
[12:57] <seb128> I first had to create some text file for the touch screen to work on the latitude
[12:57] <seb128> not sure if they moved away from those description
[12:57] <didrocks> seb128: how would you try starting any random .desktop file?
[12:57]  * didrocks goes on #mir
[12:57] <seb128> if they didn't you might be able to delete a file to make it stop work
[12:58] <seb128> didrocks, X-Ubuntu-Touch=true in the .desktop and restart the session
[12:58] <seb128> (or maybe just the dash process is enough, or a lens)
[12:58] <seb128> that makes the .desktop listed in the dash
[12:58] <seb128> I can run gedit like that
[12:58] <didrocks> ok, let's try
[12:59] <didrocks> seb128: perfect, thanks! :)
[13:00] <didrocks> so, confirming Qtcreator is quite, unusable
[13:01] <didrocks> can't even switch back to it clicking to the .desktop file
[13:02] <seb128> didrocks, can you right swipe back to it?
[13:02] <desrt> good morning
[13:02] <didrocks> yeah, this is working
[13:02] <didrocks> morning desrt
[13:03] <desrt> Laney: what am i supposed to have been doing?
[13:03] <seb128> hey desrt, how are you?
[13:03] <desrt> sleepy :)
[13:03] <pitti> hey desrt
[13:04] <desrt> pitti: good morning
[13:04] <seb128> desrt, rebasing the gtk-mir patch on current stable gtk I think
[13:04] <desrt> oh.  i did that and pastebinned it to larsu
[13:04] <desrt> it was pretty simple -- only had one conflict in configure.ac
[13:04] <seb128> who is off this week
[13:04] <desrt> i can do it again
[13:04] <seb128> so maybe he did it but didn't push his work
[13:04] <seb128> don't bother
[13:05] <seb128> that can wait monday for Lars to be back
[13:05] <desrt> sure
[13:06]  * desrt acquires coffee
[13:06] <Laney> I was just saying that I thought it did happen
[13:07]  * didrocks waits for an answer on #ubuntu-mir…
[13:07] <seb128> didrocks, east is sleeping, u.k is eating, u.s is sleeping, not the best time of the day ;-)
[13:08] <didrocks> seb128: let's see if they will reply when being back
[13:08] <seb128> yeah
[13:08] <didrocks> I'm afraid from past experience though :)
[13:09] <didrocks> ok, great, I have a name to bother now :)
[13:09] <seb128> didrocks, see :-)
[13:09] <seb128> I was going to suggest racarr as well
[13:09] <seb128> nice to see you got a reply though
[13:09] <didrocks> yeah, things are changing with years :)
[13:13] <desrt> seb128: us may be sleeping, but .ca is drinking coffee
[13:25] <didrocks> interesting, the tty was in fr, and unity8 used US layout
[13:26] <didrocks> I guess we'll have quite a lot of such bugs…
[13:28] <seb128> "input" under Mir is not something that got lot of work yet, that's on the list for this cycle though
[13:30]  * didrocks waits on tedg to get up now! :)
[13:32] <ChrisTownsend> seb128: Hey, I was reading the backlog here and noticed some discussion about https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/unity8/drop-workaround-empty-pwd-login/+merge/239401 which is linked to bug #1360307.  I think that bug is slightly different than what your fix is addressing.
[13:33] <seb128> ChrisTownsend, hey, shrug
[13:33] <ChrisTownsend> seb128: Correct me if I'm wrong, but your fix doesn't get rid of the unity-greeter prompt at that point, right?  It only accepts an empty password, right?
[13:33] <seb128> ChrisTownsend, did you open another one for "can't log in from unity8 log screen"?
[13:33] <seb128> ChrisTownsend, no, it doesn't but I though your bug was about the "can't get to the session"
[13:33] <ChrisTownsend> seb128: Hmm, I don't remember.  Let me go look around.
[13:33] <seb128> feel free to change for another one
[13:34] <ChrisTownsend> seb128: Ok, if I didn't then I'll create one.  But thanks a bunch for fixing that!
[13:34] <seb128> ChrisTownsend, thanks
[13:34] <seb128> yw!
[13:35] <desrt> so i did some research last night
[13:36] <desrt> looks like halifax has a few good hotels with lots of conference space
[13:37] <desrt> it also has (relatively short) direct flights from london and frankfurt
[13:40] <willcooke> hummm. Do we need a GStreamer sink for Mir?
[13:40] <desrt> "doesn't _really_ work like that"
[13:41] <willcooke> k
[13:41] <willcooke> :)
[13:41] <ogra_> desrt, well ...
[13:41] <desrt> you need a gstreamer sink for drmable video memory
[13:41] <ogra_> there are x11 sinks ... so you can take screenshots
[13:42] <desrt> ogra_: *sources
[13:42] <desrt> and this wouldn't work in mir from what i understand (for security reasons)
[13:42] <ogra_> we kind of lack the same thing for mir
[13:42] <ogra_> oh, right .. wrong term
[13:43]  * ogra_ was looking into doing screen captures locally on the phone before ... sadly you need to convert the raw data somehow
[13:43] <desrt> willcooke: in short, you're probably never going to want gstreamer talking directly to the display server, but rather displaying something that's wrapped at least a little bit by some toolkit-provided chrome (controls and such)
[13:43] <desrt> unless you want a really trivial demo output for debug/demo purposes (and indeed this exists for x11)
[13:44] <desrt> and the way that gstreamer talks to the toolkit for showing video in wayland is going to be more or less exactly the same as for mir
[13:45] <desrt> and it has more to do with the acceleration capabilities of the graphics card than it has to do with the display server
[13:48] <tedg> didrocks, ping
[13:50] <didrocks> tedg: pong
[13:50] <tedg> didrocks, You were waiting for me to wake up, but I can't figure out context.
[13:50] <didrocks> tedg: ah no worry :) some questions on what next steps we need to take to make qtcreator running on the desktop next image a reality
[13:51] <didrocks> tedg: I know you talked a little bit about it with bregma a while back
[13:51] <didrocks> I see that there are few X11 calls (mainly to raise the main window)
[13:51] <tedg> didrocks, I think that the part I was blocking on was landing the cgroups support in UAL, which we've done.
[13:51] <didrocks> but apart from multi-window managements, it seems you thought about other issues to the multi-process needs?
[13:52] <tedg> didrocks, That way Mir can detect all the process connections for an app.
[13:52] <didrocks> tedg: ok, this part is now over. and all processes are tagged for Mir to know it's part of this app
[13:52] <tedg> didrocks, I don't think that bregma is focused on Qt Desktop apps right now, they're trying to get something generic for legacy X apps.
[13:52] <bregma> the problem still happens but evidently cgroups was not the answer
[13:53] <didrocks> bregma: what was the problem you are talking about?
[13:53] <bregma> I haven't looked in to it lately, other than to check that it's still a problem
[13:53] <didrocks> the fact that one surface is displayed but doesn't receive any inputs?
[13:53] <bregma> QtCreator hangs after presenting the startup screen, witing for two subprocesses to complete
[13:54] <didrocks> how did you identify it was waiting on some subprocesses to complete?
[13:54] <didrocks> I see the same number of processes between my Xorg and Mir sessions
[13:55] <bregma> maybe there's a new problem then
[13:55] <bregma> it's the usual whack-a-mole problem getting stuff to run
[13:55] <didrocks> seems this likely won't be trivial
[13:55] <didrocks> also, I wonder why only the welcome screen is displayed
[13:55] <didrocks> not the chrome
[13:56] <didrocks> it's like it was sending the wrong surface to Mir?
[13:56] <bregma> I'll take a quick look again today, now that I've unbroken my test system again
[13:56] <didrocks> bregma: unbroken doesn't mean fixed? :)
[13:57] <didrocks> bregma: keep me posted if I can help you in any mean ;)
[13:57] <bregma> evidently you can DOS upstart with a well-crafter config file
[13:57] <didrocks> ahah
[13:57] <didrocks>  stop calling upstart within upstart! :)
[13:57] <bregma> and an SSD can full up really fast with log messages
[13:58] <didrocks> yeah ;)
[14:02] <bregma> 13158 ?        Ssl    0:01  |       \_ qtcreator
[14:02] <bregma> 13221 ?        Z      0:00  |       |   \_ [cmake] <defunct>
[14:02] <bregma> that's the problem there
[14:03] <bregma> dunno whu cmake gets run, that would require looking at code again
[14:04] <kenvandine> seb128, who takes care of ubuntu-themes these days?
[14:04] <seb128> kenvandine, you!
[14:05] <seb128> thanks for stepping up
[14:05] <seb128> ;-)
[14:05] <willcooke> attente_, pingaling
[14:05]  * kenvandine disconnects
[14:05] <seb128> kenvandine, you are looking at the indicator updated icons?
[14:05] <kenvandine> bzr says larsu has been active
[14:05] <seb128> kenvandine, I replied to Pat yesterday that I was ok taking that one
[14:05] <kenvandine> https://code.launchpad.net/~tiheum/ubuntu-themes/new-indicators/+merge/235598
[14:05] <kenvandine> seb128, great
[14:05] <seb128> but if you want to do it feel free
[14:05] <kenvandine> it doesn't merge cleanly though
[14:05] <seb128> oh? :-/
[14:05] <kenvandine> i replied on the MP
[14:06] <kenvandine> i'd rather not :)
[14:06] <seb128> tiheum, ^ known issue? you might need to rebase
[14:06] <seb128> kenvandine, thanks
[14:06] <seb128> kenvandine, well, larsu has been maintaining the desktop theme/updating for newer GTK versions
[14:06] <seb128> kenvandine, I'm fine handling those landings
[14:07] <attente_> willcooke: hi
[14:08] <kenvandine> seb128, thanks :)
[14:08] <willcooke> attente_ in the house!!
[14:09] <didrocks> bregma: what are you using? I don't see that with pstree -p -s
[14:09] <kenvandine> seb128, i'm creating a vivid landing for everything not blocked by the unity8 landing
[14:09] <kenvandine> seb128, but no free silos right now
[14:10] <didrocks> bregma: with ps axf, I see the same (2 subprocess defunct, named qtcreator), as when run on X11
[14:11] <didrocks> nice to see you back attente_!
[14:11] <didrocks> attente_: how are things in Canada? :)
[14:11] <bregma> didrocks, after a while the zombies seem to get reaped and regular Mir buffer swaps start happening, so it may be a non-problem there
[14:11] <bregma> as in, the problem is something else
[14:11] <attente_> didrocks: pretty good, how was japan?
[14:12] <didrocks> attente_: excellent! Really worthed the travel and double jetlag :)
[14:12] <didrocks> attente_: I'll show you some photos if you want at next sprint (but not all of them, 2100+ ;))
[14:13] <didrocks> at least, was nice to compare SNCF and a real train organization in a civilized country
[14:13] <attente_> wow, you photographed everything there, ha
[14:13] <didrocks> yeah, it was really really nice, and had some splendid weather
[14:13] <didrocks> even discussed with an ubuntu fan at a shrine :)
[14:14] <didrocks> bregma: it seems that a subsurface is rendered anyway, I wonder if the inputs are just not matching the surface
[14:15] <didrocks> bregma: do you think we should ask the Mir team to look at this?
[14:15] <seb128> kenvandine, excellent
[14:15] <didrocks> attente_: is it cold in Canada already?
[14:16] <bregma> didrocks, it wouldn't hurt: it may be pure Qt needs integration that's already in qt-mir or something
[14:16] <didrocks> yeah
[14:16] <attente_> didrocks: not particularly, in toronto at least
[14:17] <attente_> it's about 5 degrees i think
[14:17] <willcooke> do we have an official IRC client?
[14:17] <willcooke> s/official/default
[14:17] <bregma> didrocks, forecast is for snow on Hallowe'en  (Friday) here
[14:18]  * didrocks reads "not particularly cold" and "5" in the same sentence -> doesn't compute! :)
[14:18] <didrocks> bregma: waow, lovely ;)
[14:18] <didrocks> willcooke: we don't, but most sane people don't use xchat-gnome and rather a CLI one
[14:18] <didrocks> willcooke: the kind of people using xchat-gnome are emacs users generally btw
[14:18] <willcooke> didrocks, BUUUUUULLLLLLLLLLSHHIIIII........
[14:18] <didrocks> :p
[14:19] <willcooke> :D
[14:19] <willcooke> so I was chatting with attente_ about this
[14:19]  * seb128 doesn't feel concerned
[14:19] <willcooke> and seb128
[14:19] <willcooke> and didrocks
[14:19] <seb128> who would use emacs and xchat-gnome?
[14:19] <willcooke> well lots of people
[14:19] <seb128> crazyness ;-)
[14:19] <didrocks> seb128: isn't it? ;)
[14:19]  * mdeslaur slaps didrocks
[14:19] <willcooke> right - so we (I) think we should get XChat Gnome working on Mir
[14:20] <willcooke> the reason for that is because I assumed thats what "most people" use
[14:20] <willcooke> if that's not the case, then perhaps we shouldnt do that
[14:20] <willcooke> my gut feeling is that we should though
[14:20] <seb128> willcooke, didrocks was mostly trolling there ...
[14:20] <didrocks> yeah, I agree it's what most of people are using
[14:20] <didrocks> I was just trolling a half-french-german on the channel :)
[14:21]  * seb128 still not feeling concerned
[14:21] <seb128> :p
[14:21] <didrocks> seb128: try harder!
[14:21] <seb128> or just a bit...
[14:21] <seb128> anyway
[14:21] <seb128> yeah, xchat-gnome running on Mir would be nice
[14:21] <willcooke> the we are agreed
[14:21] <willcooke> \o/
[14:21] <didrocks> so yeah, agreed that xchat gnome is needed as part of what people using IRC are going to need
[14:22] <willcooke> ok attente_ so all that ummming and errring was for nought - looks like you've got a big job on your hands
[14:22] <willcooke> good luck
[14:22] <willcooke> wake me up when you've finished it
[14:22] <willcooke> o/
[14:22] <didrocks> "kthxbye"
[14:22] <willcooke> :D
[14:32] <tiheum> seb128: concerning the mp, how can I know what the conflicts are?
[14:33] <seb128> tiheum, just branch trunk and try to bzr merge your vcs on
[14:33] <seb128> or take you version and bzr merge lp:ubuntu-themes
[14:33] <seb128> your*
[14:38] <tiheum> seb128: sorry but what do you call vcs?
[14:38] <seb128> tiheum, your checkout of lp:ubuntu-themes with your changes
[14:39] <seb128> tiheum, if you are not fluent with bzr, the easier might be to do a fresh checkout from trunk and copy your files over again
[14:39] <seb128> or do whatever you did the first itme
[14:39] <seb128> time
[14:39] <tiheum> seb128: ok, will try
[14:39] <seb128> tiheum, don't hesitate to ask here if you have questions/issues
[14:40] <tiheum> seb128: sure (actually, I am not very fluent with bzr)
[14:40] <tiheum> thanks
[14:46] <tiheum> seb128: can I have two mp for two different branches at the same time? At the moment, there's already this one: https://code.launchpad.net/~tiheum/ubuntu-themes/suru-icons/+merge/231533
[14:47] <tiheum> ready to land since more than one month :/
[15:10] <didrocks> interesting, seems there was not (at least in my installation) sshd host key
[15:11] <willcooke> didrocks, ahh
[15:11] <willcooke> didrocks, on a desktop next install?
[15:11] <didrocks> willcooke: yeah
[15:11] <willcooke> didrocks, yeah, I noticed that too, I assume I'd done something daft
[15:11] <didrocks> I'll need to reinstall to confirm it's not a one-time bug
[15:11] <didrocks> ah, it's not one-time
[15:11] <willcooke> in the end I removed and reinstalled and it sorted it
[15:11] <didrocks> I think we have a hook on ubiquity
[15:12] <didrocks> willcooke: well, this happen on package reconfigure
[15:12] <didrocks> so dpkg-reconfigure openssh-server is enough
[15:12] <willcooke> I did a remove and an install
[15:16] <didrocks> will have a look once achieved the current debugging on qtcreator
[15:47] <happyaron> seb128: I've uploaded the fix to exp this morning, synced just now
[15:47] <happyaron> Laney: ibus was on my list after fcitx actually, but you are quicker, :)
[15:47] <Laney> I didn't upload that
[15:48] <didrocks> Mirv: hey, I'm trying to find libqt5widgets5-dbgsym, but it doesn't seem to exist?
[15:49] <happyaron> Laney: okay, that's dholbach
[15:50] <Laney> yeah I just told someone off for stealing merges ;-)
[15:51] <Mirv> didrocks: qt packages build their own debug packages, so try installing qtbase5-dbg
[15:51] <didrocks> Mirv: ok, doing that, thanks!
[15:53] <Mirv> np
[16:08] <didrocks> bregma: so that you don't waste your time: https://bugs.launchpad.net/qtmir/+bug/1387762
[16:22] <seb128> happyaron, thanks
[16:30]  * seb128 watches pitti happily skipping the CI process and commiting directly to unity-control-center ;-)
[16:30] <pitti> seb128: see scrollback from this morning, apparently that was ok?
[16:31] <seb128> pitti, I'm a bit lost to what is ok or not nowadays to be honest, I though things under CI shouldn't be manually uploaded
[16:31] <seb128> but I'm not going to complain at the same time
[16:31] <seb128> the CI way is more tedious and not always that useful
[16:31]  * desrt hits seb128 with a train
[16:31] <seb128> desrt, :p
[16:32] <pitti> anyway, I'm mostly through the transition now
[16:32] <seb128> pitti, thanks for working on that btw ;-)
[16:32]  * seb128 hugs pitti
[16:32] <pitti> required quite a number of merges, porting, etc., but darkxst really did most of the work already
[16:33] <pitti> seb128: yeah, I'm not sure why we even bother with the train for that; these packages have no autopkgtests, aren't on touch images, etc.
[16:33] <pitti> one needs to manually test them anyway
[16:33] <pitti> so I take some pride in my core-dev powers and skip all the machinery :)
[16:33] <pitti> err, I mean "no autopilot tests", but same difference
[16:34] <didrocks> if the build-deps/deps are well defined and not half of the transition is moving to the release pocket, I don't think we need to have the silo phase
[16:34] <didrocks> (especially if it's not on touch)
[16:35] <didrocks> things will happily stays in proposed while testing
[16:35] <pitti> yeah, that too
[16:35] <pitti> this is going to stay around in -proposed for a few days
[16:36] <pitti> Laney needs to land his system-settings MP, darkxst/Noskcaj their gnome-session bits, etc.
[16:36] <pitti> and they don't have CI train access
[16:36] <pitti> or I upload the backported patches if it takes too long
[16:37] <seb128> Laney has landig/CI access
[16:38] <Laney> he meant the last two
[16:38] <seb128> gnome-session isn't under CI though
[16:39] <Laney> iiiiiiiiiiindeede
[16:39] <seb128> I maybe mis-parsed the bit about CI and backporting then
[16:39]  * Laney shrugs
[16:39] <seb128> anyway, shouldn't be too difficult to land those
[16:40] <seb128> settings-rtm has its own vcs now and vivid landing are not restricted
[16:40] <pitti> so that leaves powerd
[16:41] <pitti> I'll do an MP and land that via train then, I guess
[16:41] <pitti> (and hope review will be quicker than https://code.launchpad.net/~sforshee/powerd/fix-warnings/+merge/188613 :-) )
[16:43] <didrocks> Laney: do you know of a good documentation explaining how logind works? like concepts and so on
[16:44] <Laney> like http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd/multiseat/ ?
[16:44] <didrocks> Laney: perfect! thx
[17:08] <didrocks> eod, see you tomorrow or on Monday for those swapping :)
[17:10] <pitti> seb128: I just discovered a stronger reason why the train fails here -- the builds don't seem to use -proposed
[17:10] <pitti> so we can't land that transition in a silo, but use -proposed only
[17:10] <pitti> -ECOMPLICATED!
[17:10] <seb128> pitti, I think that's by design
[17:11] <pitti> seb128: the "complicated"? :-)
[17:11] <seb128> but yeah, the way it should be done is to have the full transition in a silo
[17:11] <seb128> including upower
[17:11] <pitti> (TGIF .. almost)
[17:11] <seb128> and yeah
[17:11] <seb128> overcomplicated
[17:14] <xnox> seb128: Laney: can lightdm use a gtk2 greeter?
[17:14] <seb128> xnox, I guess so
[17:14] <seb128> why not?
[17:14] <seb128> it has qt4 and qt5 greeters
[17:14] <seb128> the interface between lightdm and the greeters is not toolkit dependent
[17:22] <desrt> pro tip: when you hear 'train' or 'silo' just stop paying attention
[17:22] <desrt> saves brain cells that way
[17:23] <Laney> THERE'S A TRAIN COMING
[17:23] <desrt> la la la
[17:30] <mitya57> seb128, darkxst: Re gnome-flashback dialogs: first, this is not in gnome-panel, but rather in a separate application (which can be used in Unity as well).
[17:31] <mitya57> Next, that app basically provides an org.gnome.Shell.something D-Bus interface that gnome-session talks to.
[17:31] <mitya57> So it does not know whether it was called from keyboard shortcut, via UI or just using "gnome-session-quit".
[17:32] <seb128> cool
[17:32] <mitya57> That application also does other useful things like drawing the wallpaper (which we currently do via Nautilus patch).
[17:33] <mitya57> Ubuntu currently has gnome-flashback 3.10, but I am going to upload 3.14 shortly (can't sync as it needs some Ubuntu-specific patches).
[17:34] <Laney> do we use any of those dialogs in unity?
[17:34] <seb128> no
[17:36] <mitya57> But anything that is not gnome-shell or Unity can use that app. So it should be safe to drop these dialogs from gnome-session.
[17:36] <seb128> desrt, in case you don't see launchpad bug pings, https://bugreports.qt-project.org/browse/QTBUG-42189 got some debugging action and a suggested patch and people would welcome you giving it a look ;-)
[17:37] <desrt> i saw that
[17:37] <desrt> not sure i have anything to say about it though
[17:39] <seb128> k, just comment saying that if you don't, so people don't think you didn't see it
[17:46] <darthbunny> anyone knows how you can enable the virtual keyboard on unity8 ?
[17:50] <seb128> bregma, you might know ^ ?
[17:50] <bregma> darthbunny, there is no automated way (yet)
[17:51] <darthbunny> hou about manually?
[17:51] <bregma> mmm, not sure, I think the keyboard designed to work on the phone is click-packaged only
[17:52] <bregma> other keyboards won't work, since they're X11 keyboards
[17:52] <seb128> click work on unity8 desktop though
[17:52] <seb128> you can install things from the click store
[17:52] <darthbunny> yup
[17:53] <seb128> so maybe it's possible to install the osk click?
[17:53] <bregma> yes, but it means I haven't tested it
[17:53] <seb128> something to add to the todolist I guess
[17:53] <darthbunny> but when I click text fields it doesn't auto-show nothing :)
[17:53] <bregma> yep
[17:54] <seb128> desrt, thanks
[17:55] <darthbunny> osk click is a package or store app?
[17:56] <bregma> darthbunny, try 'apt-get install ubuntu-keyboard' and restart Unity 8
[17:56] <bregma> it might *just* work
[17:56] <darthbunny> atm I'm on the live iso
[17:56] <darthbunny> and seems installed
[17:56] <darthbunny> any chance it would work if I undock my tab?
[17:57] <bregma> ah, I see it's installed for me, too, but Unity 8 is not finding it, there must be some other magic required
[17:57] <darthbunny> I'll do a full install
[17:58] <bregma> darthbunny, I don't think undocking will help, I see errors in the log like 'UbuntuKeyboardInfo - socket error: "QLocalSocket::connectToServer: Invalid name"' so I think it needs some development work
[17:59] <bregma> some kinds of configuration that gets statically installed on the phone image perhaps
[18:00] <darthbunny> I also see there is an ubuntu-touch package
[18:00] <darthbunny> I don't suppose that would help...
[18:02] <bregma> darthbunny, ubuntu-touch is a metapackage for installing the phone image, it pulls in things that break the desktop in general
[18:03] <bregma> it's likely that there are some config files that are "seeded" in the phone image, in other words not included in and packages that get pulled in as a dependency, and keyboard support may be one of them
[18:04] <darthbunny> I see
[18:04] <darthbunny> should I report this as a bug somewhere?
[18:09] <Laney> right, I'm outta here, see you on Monday
[18:10] <seb128> Laney, enjoy your swap day and w.e!
[18:11] <Laney> cheers, will do ;-)
[18:11] <Laney> there's a halloween climbing competition or something
[18:11] <Laney> ...
[18:11] <willcooke> off too, day off tomorrow
[18:11] <willcooke> ttfn


[04:18] <senan> how do I test application launch in autopilot ?
[04:18] <senan> what assertion should I give for that ?
[04:38] <pitti_> good morning
[06:27] <DanChapman> Good Morning all :-)
[06:28] <elfy> hi DanChapman - hope all is well in kiddy land
[06:43] <elfy> DanChapman: not sure what the crack is with the bulk rename test - commented again
[06:44] <elfy> if the one in the m/list is the one that got pushed for review - I'll talk to him
[06:49] <DanChapman> elfy, if you go here and scroll down below our comments you can see slickymaster's addition https://code.launchpad.net/~slickymaster/ubuntu-manual-tests/bulk_renamer/+merge/173115
[06:50] <DanChapman> It would appear he made changes to two seperate tests. Setting manager and bulk renamer. But the settings manager was just some formatting i believe
[06:51] <elfy> the settings one shouldn't have been there - he shouldn't be working on that till my changes to it get merged
[06:51] <elfy> s/one/bit
[06:53] <elfy> ok commented :)
[06:54] <elfy> I had that issue when I started - which is why I keep each thing I'm working on seperate - not cross contamination then
[07:00] <DanChapman> elfy, yeah it can get a little confusing can't it. anyway yeah kiddy land is good thanks for asking. :-)
[07:00] <elfy> cool
[07:00] <jibel> good morning
[07:01] <DanChapman> good morning jibel
[07:02] <jibel> Hey DanChapman
[07:03] <elfy> morning jibel
[07:09] <jibel> Good morning elfy
[09:07] <slickymaster> good morning, everybody
[09:08] <obounaim> good morning
[10:34] <smartboyhw> pitti, many thanks! I will post it today (hopefully after packaging stuff)
[10:36] <pitti> smartboyhw: YW; please let me know if something reads strangely
[11:03] <xeranas_> anyone around which know how to play with autopilot? Trying to understant where comes such functions like .get_toolbar()
[11:07] <smartboyhw> Eh, DanChapman wasn't here
[13:01] <balloons> howdy everyone
[13:01] <pitti> hey balloons
[13:02] <xeranas_> anyone around which know how to play with autopilot? Trying to understant where comes such functions like .get_toolbar()
[13:08] <smartboyhw> Hey balloons
[13:08] <smartboyhw> xeranas_, hey, we now are at the autopilot tutorial session:)
[13:08] <xeranas_> smartboyhw, where>
[13:08] <smartboyhw> Wait, why is my NickServ account dropped?
[13:09] <smartboyhw> Eh, Freenode failure
[13:09] <smartboyhw> xeranas_, here
[13:09] <smartboyhw> balloons, teach me autopilot
[13:09] <smartboyhw> (LOL kidding)
[13:10] <smartboyhw> balloons, it seems like my idea is not welcomed:P
[13:12] <xeranas_> qmlpreview works terible for VM setup, I wonder it is just for me
[13:28] <balloons> ok looks like we're all coming back online now from the netsplit :-( Sorry about that. If you asked me a question odds are I missed it.
[13:28] <balloons> You might also have missed some of the introduction I posted. No worries. For anyone here for the automated testing workshop, welcome again :-)
[13:28] <smartboyhw> balloons, my question: It seems like my idea was not welcomed:P
[13:29] <balloons> smartboyhw, we can chat about that in a bit
[13:29] <balloons> don't lose hope yet :-0
[13:29] <balloons> So a quick recap.. Autopilot is the tool we're using to write automated tests. It can simulate user input and lets us test at a high level
[13:30] <balloons> the core apps are a community developed set of essential phone applications for the ubuntu touch platform
[13:30] <balloons> So to help write tests for these, you need a few things:
[13:30] <balloons> 1) an installation of raring or saucy. It can be a VM or real hardware install
[13:30] <balloons> 2) Install autopilot and the ubuntu-sdk.. It can help to install the core-apps ppa as well and the core apps packaged versions
[13:30] <balloons> 3) Learn a bit about autopilot and how the tool works
[13:31] <balloons> If you haven't yet read through http://developer.ubuntu.com/resources/cookbook/mobile/how-to-write-autopilot-tests/, do that first.
[13:31] <balloons> Ok, so I think we're caught back up for the most part. Since we lost a bit of time, I'll stop talking and start talking questions now :-) Let me know what your working on and if you might need help on something :-)
[13:32] <balloons> There's some handy questions and answers already found on this page that might help you: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/CoreApps/Testing/FAQ
[13:33] <Cecil> Do we need to install the apps to test or do they come with the bzr command?
[13:34] <balloons> Cecil, there's a ppa which let's you install all of the core apps. This is handy because you'll get any dependencies you need to run the core apps during the install
[13:35] <balloons> however, you can also run them by checking out the branch and running the qml file manually via qmlscene
[13:35] <balloons> Information on the ppa is here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/CoreApps/PPA
[13:36] <balloons> So for anyone wanting to get a setup going I would install saucy, into say a VM
[13:36] <Cecil> I have installed (and using now) saucy... will it get updates like my 13.04? (I've noticed some instability)
[13:36] <xeranas> I do not clearly understant where from comes such methods like ".get_toolbar()" is this is autopilot stuff or it depends from qml
[13:37] <balloons> Cecil, yes it will, and yes you might notice some bumps Cecil because it's development
[13:37] <balloons> xeranas, sure.. That sounds like a custom method as part of a helper class specific to that testcase. Where are you seeing this?
[13:38] <balloons> Sorry so to get back to my quick setup.. If your wanting to get started, installing raring or saucy into a vm or on real hardware
[13:38] <xeranas> I looking into test_rssreader.py as sample
[13:38] <balloons> then add the autopilot ppa and install autopilot
[13:38] <balloons> then install the ubuntu-sdk and finally the core-apps ppa
[13:39] <balloons> that should make sure you don't have any issues running autopilot or any of the core apps
[13:39] <balloons> xeranas, ok let's pull that up.
[13:41] <balloons> xeranas, right so you see something like this line: toolbar = self.main_window.get_toolbar()
[13:41] <xeranas> yes
[13:41] <balloons> that is telling you the function is coming from the main_window class -- make sense?
[13:41] <balloons> look inside the "emulators" folder and you'll see a main_window.py file which contains the details
[13:42] <balloons> many core apps utilize emulators as they are called in autopilot. It's simply a helper class with utility functions
[13:42] <balloons> here's the code for get_toolbar
[13:42] <balloons> def get_toolbar(self):
[13:42] <balloons>         return self.app.select_single("Toolbar")
[13:42] <balloons> really simple :-)
[13:42] <xeranas> never looked into emulators folders since I was thinkin that for old versions, must be missreaded somewhere
[13:43] <balloons> ahh, no worries that probably helps make sense of things :-)
[13:43] <balloons> in addition, don't neglect __init.py__ as there generally is some setup done in that file as well
[13:44] <balloons> I'm speaking of tests/autopilot/appname/tests/__init.py__
[13:44] <balloons> the same subdirectory as the testcase itself
[13:45] <balloons> you'll generally see a custom class made for the application that takes cares of launching an installed or local version and using a mouse or touch device
[13:45] <xeranas> so select_single("Toolbar"), 'Toolbar' comes from qml?
[13:45] <balloons> xeranas, yes so the "Toolbar" comes from the qml
[13:46] <balloons> let's take a look at the qml file for rss reader
[13:46] <balloons> ubuntu-rssreader-app.qml
[13:46] <balloons> you'll notice there are several qml files, which isn't uncommon for an app to have. the qml has just been split amongst them
[13:47] <balloons> each view might be it's own qml file for instance
[13:50] <balloons> so I'm looking at the current RSS reader test, and well there's not much to it :-) It's swiping the toolbar up and checking to see if it appears, but that's it
[13:51] <xeranas> there is add Feed button on toolbar, I just try to press it
[13:51] <balloons> xeranas, there's a couple reviews adding some more tests to it that are in progress :-) But you can see what's needed on the list of bugs: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-rssreader-app/+bugs?field.tag=needs-autopilot-test
[13:51] <balloons> xeranas, indeed.. what happens when you press it/
[13:53] <xeranas> currently I just playing around, just try learn about autopilot. When I feel that I can finish test some sort I will check bugs
[13:53] <balloons> Cecil, how's it going for you?
[13:53] <balloons> xeranas, certainly. If your curious check out for instance the clock or weather app. Both have some more tests already written and checked in
[13:54] <balloons> that will help a bit to see how the tests look.. when I'm learning I like tinkering with things that already work :-)
[13:55] <xeranas> did qml item must have id in order to be controlled by autopilot?
[13:56] <Cecil> Currently installing all the recommend tools! there a bunch to install. I think I may have questions on the apps because of the sub-classing they have done to "make it easier". Maybe the currency converter tutorial will help
[13:58] <balloons> xeranas, so in order for us to use an object during runtime, we can add an objectName to the qml file
[13:58] <balloons> this let's us be very specific in requesting the object we want. Otherwise we can select all the toolbars, all the buttons, all the lists, all the text fields, etc, etc. That might not help us, so being able to assign a specific name is very useful
[13:59] <balloons> Cecil, yes the subclassing in the apps might be a bit confusing (I like to keep things simple!) but it helps out tremendously once you get it.
[14:00] <balloons> there helper functions save a lot of time and grief
[14:03] <balloons> I realize the hour has passed, but don't worry I'm still here.. Keep any questions you have coming; let me know if I can help :-_)
[14:06] <xeranas> if did stuff like myToolbar = select_single("Toolbar"),  If I did once again for myToolbar like myToolbar.select_single("SubItem") If I get result, or it just works for "root" elements
[14:08] <Cecil> After adding the PPA, what are the install names for the apt-get command? Are they listed somewhere?
[14:09] <Cecil> For example: Dropping Letters is named "dropping-letters"
[14:09] <balloons> xeranas, yes that makes sense.. So you can select the toolbar, then say select a subitem from the toolbar by issuing your myToolbar.select_single("SubItem")
[14:10] <balloons> Cecil, yes indeed. They are listed in the ppa itself: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-touch-coreapps-drivers/+archive/daily?field.series_filter=saucy
[14:11] <balloons> they aren't listed as a friendly copy-paste line though if that's what your wondering
[14:11] <balloons> they need a metapackage
[14:11] <Cecil> And where does it put them? after install, I get command not found
[14:11] <balloons> and lol, there is one
[14:11] <balloons> " Install the 'touch-coreapps' metapackage to install all of the core apps at once."
[14:11] <Cecil> cool
[14:19] <Cecil> ok, that installed them all. was playing with the calendar app... so my plan is to complete the training using the currency converter, then look at the calendar app. Sound ok?
[14:28] <balloons> bug 1197911
[14:29] <balloons> aww bugbot still netsplit eh?
[15:46] <phillw> balloons: there's a scraper bot on ##phillw if you want to C & P something :)
[15:46] <smartboyhw> phillw, heh
[15:47] <phillw> smartboyhw: it's a different bot :)
[16:02] <drsaurabhsikka> hello balloons
[16:02] <balloons> good day drsaurabhsikka
[16:04] <drsaurabhsikka> i'm on saucy now
[16:04] <drsaurabhsikka> ashamed to say i had to dual boot, not knowing how to install retaining my /home folder
[16:08] <phillw> drsaurabhsikka: the session for that is to be re-scheduled :)
[16:08] <drsaurabhsikka> really. when's that?
[16:09] <phillw> it's currently To Be Announced. But it will be held some time soon :)
[16:09] <TheDrums> balloons: ^
[16:09] <drsaurabhsikka> hours days or weeks?
[16:10] <drsaurabhsikka> i'll just try and get the hang of autopilot til then
[16:10] <phillw> I'm a bit too rusty to hold it without some prep work, so dpniel is holding it https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Activities/Classroom/Saucy#Introduction_to_QA_tools
[16:10] <phillw> hopefully a matter of days :)
[16:10] <balloons> I would say days.. Dan whom I believe you met drsaurabhsikka is giving the session. that said, re-installing with /home is something your past now eh?
[16:11] <drsaurabhsikka> cool
[16:12] <drsaurabhsikka> no balloons, I'm not past that...i just take the easy way out
[16:12] <balloons> you know what I mean :-) A solved problem can stay solved for now :-) Re-opening that can of worms can be another day
[16:13] <balloons> so how's the autopilot tinkering coming along drsaurabhsikka ?
[16:13] <phillw> drsaurabhsikka: nothing wrong with sticking with what you're comfortable with. Losing your personal stuff is a nightmare I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy :)
[16:13] <drsaurabhsikka> exactly
[16:15] <drsaurabhsikka> basically it wasnt the documents i was afraid of losing, it was all these apps, like the tweaked up skype with the webcam script, and the eclipse IDE etc
[16:15] <drsaurabhsikka> i'm still reading the autopilot documentation
[16:53] <drsaurabhsikka> trying to install Qt-creator
[16:53] <drsaurabhsikka> firefox has a link to trigger apt
[16:54] <drsaurabhsikka> balloons, please help
[16:55] <balloons> drsaurabhsikka, you can sudo apt-get install ubuntu-sdk
[16:55] <drsaurabhsikka> i did that
[16:55] <balloons> that should pull qt creator and everything else
[16:55] <drsaurabhsikka> cool
[16:55] <balloons> ohh?
[16:55] <balloons> ahh.. kk
[16:55] <drsaurabhsikka> what is this pop up window asking me to choose an application for apt links?
[16:56] <balloons> firefox must want a handler for apt links? that's odd
[16:56] <balloons> it should be set to ubuntu software center
[16:56] <drsaurabhsikka> yes it used to be that way before i remember
[16:56] <drsaurabhsikka> automatically
[16:56] <drsaurabhsikka> though now, i must sift through my filesystem to find...?
[16:57] <balloons> /usr/bin/software-center
[16:58] <elfy> evening all
[16:59] <drsaurabhsikka> there are 2: the vanilla variety , and the gtk-3
[17:00] <balloons> which software-center
[17:00] <balloons> /usr/bin/software-center
[17:00] <drsaurabhsikka> /usr/bin/software-center and /usr/bin/software-center-gtk-3
[17:05] <slickymaster> good afternoon, everybody
[17:05] <slickymaster> Elfy: sorry for being such a pain in the neck
[17:06] <elfy> slickymaster: it's fine - I've all the time in the world :)
[17:07] <slickymaster> elfy: so, I think we rather are in the same wave length, regarding the way we approach the tests
[17:07] <drsaurabhsikka> hello elfy
[17:07] <elfy> we are
[17:08] <slickymaster> elfy: did you manage to get a few seconds to see if everything is ok now, with the Bulk Renamer one?
[17:08] <elfy> slickymaster: see the private window
[17:08] <elfy> hi drsaurabhsikka
[17:14] <drsaurabhsikka> ok, i just did a bzr branch for the sdk tutorials
[17:14] <drsaurabhsikka> where would i find the "tests" subfolder?
[17:15] <drsaurabhsikka> I'm reading this and trying to follow http://developer.ubuntu.com/resources/tutorials/quality/how-to-write-autopilot-tests/
[17:16] <balloons> drsaurabhsikka, gotcha
[17:17] <balloons> ohh I see they added a directory on top, I can update the tutorial to be extremly explicit :-0
[17:17] <balloons> look in getting-started, CurrencyConvertor
[17:18] <balloons> that was the root of the branch :-)
[17:19] <drsaurabhsikka> but where is the branch, on the FS?
[17:22] <balloons> ahh when you issue a bzr branch is makes a new folder in the directory you issued the command by default
[17:22] <balloons> so bzr branch lp:~nskaggs/mysupercoolbranch makes a folder called mysupercoolbranch
[17:23] <drsaurabhsikka> righto!
[17:23] <balloons> bzr branch lp:ubuntu-sdk-tutorials makes a folder called ubuntu-sdk-tutorials
[17:23] <balloons> :-)
[17:23] <drsaurabhsikka> got it
[17:24] <drsaurabhsikka> do i still have to cook the CurrencyConverter recipe?
[17:24] <balloons> nope :-)
[17:25] <drsaurabhsikka> found it!!
[17:25] <balloons> drsaurabhsikka, I updated the page to be explicit at the point :-)
[17:29] <balloons> drsaurabhsikka, ping if you encounter any other questions :-)
[17:30] <drsaurabhsikka> great thanks! So bzr is like wget
[17:32] <drsaurabhsikka> folderwise
[17:32] <balloons> bzr has versioning, so it's really a source control system
[17:32] <balloons> have you used any in the past? git? svn? cvs?
[17:41] <drsaurabhsikka> svn, 4 years ago, but that was a blind procedure
[17:41] <drsaurabhsikka> but i get the concept
[17:42] <balloons> :-) good, don't feel bogged down by it. They'll be a few commands to learn, but we can help with that. Just know it lets us share code easily :-)
[17:43] <drsaurabhsikka> sorry about the nitpicking, but the code on the same page is actually inside 2 subfolder levels below: cd ubuntu-sdk-tutorials/getting-started/CurrencyConverter/tests/autopilot/CurrencyConverter/tests/
[17:44] <drsaurabhsikka> :) i 'git' it!
[17:50] <balloons> drsaurabhsikka, I made updates on your feedback.. not nitpicking at all
[17:50] <balloons> reload the page and see if things make sense
[17:50] <balloons> :-) you git it! I love it
[18:00] <drsaurabhsikka> i just ran autopilot on CurrConv
[18:01] <drsaurabhsikka> this is awesome stuff!!!
[18:01] <drsaurabhsikka> except that, the test Failed!
[18:01] <drsaurabhsikka> well one of them did
[18:04] <balloons> nice!
[18:04] <balloons> well, not the failure.. what failed? But yea, pretty cool stuff right?
[18:08] <sm0x-nb> Hi, i'm actually reading https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/Hardware but i'm not familiar with the Ubuntu-Wiki, how can i add my Hardware Spec.?
[18:08] <drsaurabhsikka> it is indeed. It says: Ran 2 tests in 28.967s FAILED (Failures=1)
[18:09] <drsaurabhsikka> cd ubuntu-sdk-tutorials/getting-started/CurrencyConverter
[18:09] <drsaurabhsikka> sorry
[18:10] <balloons> sm0x-nb, howdy
[18:10] <balloons> sm0x-nb, if you have a ubuntu sso login, you can edit the page and add your link to it
[18:10] <drsaurabhsikka> the fromField test seems to have failed
[18:10] <balloons> if your not sure how, we can have someone add it for you given the information
[18:11] <sm0x-nb> hi balloons, thank you :)
[18:12] <drsaurabhsikka>     self.assertThat(fromField.text, Eventually(Equals(oldFromValue)))
[18:12] <drsaurabhsikka> MismatchError: After 10.0 seconds test on TextField.text failed: String(u'2.948') != dbus.String(u'0.019558', variant_level=1)
[18:15] <balloons> weird, works perfectly for me
[18:18] <drsaurabhsikka> also this error: QObject::connect: Cannot connect QQuickShaderEffectSource:: to ShapeItem_QML_47::onImagePropertiesChanged()
[18:18] <drsaurabhsikka> the second time the window opens, the currency fields are blank
[18:18] <drsaurabhsikka> before the Clear button is pressed
[18:18] <drsaurabhsikka> could that be the prob?
[18:20] <drsaurabhsikka> the mouse on the Clear button clicks and the window closes.
[18:23] <drsaurabhsikka> if i run the clear button test alone, it runs OK
[18:24] <sm0x-nb> thanks for helping, the entry is now set. I hope it was correct. But one Question are left, whats my WikiName? And how can i change/get it?
[18:26] <balloons> sm0x-nb, ahh you can make your own wikipage
[18:26] <balloons> there's a link i can find in a minute
[18:29] <sm0x-nb> ok thanks, but it's not necessary, or? :)
[18:31] <balloons> sm0x-nb, no it's not required :-)
[18:31] <drsaurabhsikka> balloons, I'm getting stuck at the end of the tutorial page,
[18:31] <balloons> drsaurabhsikka, yea I'll look in a moment
[18:31] <drsaurabhsikka> some message about Qt Test not installed. sure ok...
[18:31] <drsaurabhsikka> thanks
[18:46] <drsaurabhsikka> balloons, i'm off to bed. i'll catch up with this exciting thing later
[18:46] <balloons> ok drsaurabhsikka sorry mate
[18:46] <drsaurabhsikka> not at all, thanks!
[18:46] <balloons> indeed.. I won't fret too much about the errors, but I'm around
[18:47] <balloons> email me if you would so I have your email just in case :-)
[18:47] <drsaurabhsikka> i will
[18:47] <balloons> thanks mate
[18:47] <balloons> enjoy!
[19:15] <adegoodyer> Hi all, I am currently executing the test-case 'Install (auto-resize) in Ubuntu Desktop amd64 for Saucy Daily'. Can anyone else confirm that this option is no longer available for selection?
[19:17] <adegoodyer> Hi all, I am currently executing the test-case 'Install (auto-resize) in Ubuntu Desktop amd64 for Saucy Daily'. Can anyone else confirm that this option is no longer available for selection?
[19:29] <balloons> adegoodyer, which option?
[19:31] <adegoodyer> balloons, You know the one where you install alongside an existing install and can drag the slider to adjust each partitions space.
[19:51] <balloons> adegoodyer, yes let me get the screenshots so I know which one your talking about :-)
[19:55] <balloons> found them :-)
[19:55] <balloons> adegoodyer, is it in here? https://plus.google.com/photos/105922848292507689403/albums/5802148812308412001?banner=pwa
[19:56] <adegoodyer> balloons, Yes, that's the one. All I see so far is this? http://imagebin.org/263526
[19:57] <adegoodyer> balloons, and I have definitely checked that there is an existing install already :o)
[19:59] <balloons> yes, that looks correct to me then
[19:59] <balloons> basically if your already installed you should get those options
[20:00] <balloons> the upgrade is a bit silly, but is allowed during the development release
[20:00] <balloons> normally you upgrade from only release to the next, and no downgrading is allowed
[20:00] <balloons> adegoodyer, I guess I'm confused as to what your not seeing or what the testcase is saying
[20:01] <balloons> which number on the testcase are you concerned about?
[20:04] <adegoodyer> balloons, Are you sure? Let me clarify, the test case was executing was the 'Install (auto-resize)' one, where you could install another Ubuntu system alongside an existing one on the same PC.
[20:05] <balloons> adegoodyer, ahh ok.. so what you expected to see was install alongside and it's not present?
[20:05] <adegoodyer> balloons, Yes that's right :o)
[20:06] <adegoodyer> balloons, like the first two images in the link you just provided
[20:07] <balloons> finally I got what you were saying
[20:07] <balloons> blame friday adegoodyer :-)
[20:08] <balloons> that is concerning that it doesn't exist.. I wonder what's going on
[20:08] <balloons> let me launch and see if it works on an older release
[20:08] <balloons> that's my guess
[20:09] <balloons> my iso is from today
[20:09]  * balloons boots up precise box
[20:09] <adegoodyer> balloons, No problem. Yes, I was thinking something similar... I have always just installed two of the same daily .iso along side each other but I would presume they have finally put a check in to halt that
[20:10] <balloons> adegoodyer, ohh noes!
[20:10] <adegoodyer> balloons, what's up??
[20:11] <balloons> lol, my precise box is borked. it didn't see any installed system
[20:11] <balloons> turns out.. it was right
[20:11] <balloons> haha
[20:11] <balloons> we'll try the raring box :-)
[20:11] <balloons> k, I see the install alongside just fine with raring install
[20:12] <adegoodyer> balloons, Haha. Just how many boxes you got there!? :o)
[20:12] <balloons> precise, raring, and saucy
[20:12] <adegoodyer> balloons, Right that's good then, just means they have places a check in then, which is actually kind of annoying lol
[20:14] <balloons> lucid got upgrade when it Eol'd to precise :-)
[20:14] <balloons> what an upgrade that was let me tell you
[20:14] <balloons> ok, so I'll try re-installing on the saucy box now
[20:16] <adegoodyer> balloons, Ha, yeah I can believe that. Ok, my money would be on that working as well now. A small pain because means two versions of Ubuntu are needed to carry out that test case from now on but no bother
[20:17] <balloons> adegoodyer, we'll see soon enough. however it's still a change and worth mentioning to ensure it was intended
[20:18] <balloons> I don't see harm in filing and asking about it assuming we confirm things
[20:21] <adegoodyer> balloons, Very true, I will file shortly and keep you posted on the outcome.
[20:22] <adegoodyer> balloons, Going to have to file a bug regardless as the tracker won;t let me fail the test else - it's clever like that :o)
[20:30] <balloons> adegoodyer, I can confirm the bug btw
[20:36] <adegoodyer> balloons, bug has now been filed :o)
[20:37] <balloons> :-)
[21:23] <qengho> Hi hi.  I'm interested in making my pbuilder run autopkgtests at the end of any build.  Has anyone done something similar before?
[21:31] <jibel> balloons, around?
[21:32] <jibel> balloons, you might be interested https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/autopilot-ubuntu-applications/
[21:33] <jibel> I started by enabling evince and will add others
[21:34] <jibel> balloons, for the details the runner for otto is here https://code.launchpad.net/~otto-dev/otto/testsuite_autopilot-ubuntu-apps
[21:38] <qengho> That the best acronym for autopkgtest is APT is kind of terrible.
[21:47] <jibel> balloons, I added all the apps from the production testsuite, it runs in less than 10min on platforms ATI and Intel.


[11:11] <tog> Hi, I am new to juju. I have installed juju (local)  on 12.04 server running in Vbox. I am sitting on a corporate network behind a proxy. When tryng to deploy MySQL I get a DNS error for store.ubuntu.com. At home (no proxy), it works like a charm :-)
[14:30] <hazmat> hmm
[14:30] <hazmat> i think we'll need http proxy support for that use case
[14:30] <hazmat> client side
[14:31] <SpamapS> hazmat: desperately
[14:31] <hazmat> SpamapS, distinct from apt proxy support
[14:31] <SpamapS> hazmat: right
[14:31] <hazmat> SpamapS, get into any bbq's this weekend?
[14:32] <SpamapS> hazmat: planning on going to one today, but wife has been having braxton hicks contractions so I am hesitant to commit to any plans. :)
[14:35] <SpamapS> hazmat: and I cooked up some tri-tip on Saturday that basically blew my mind :)
[14:35] <SpamapS> hazmat: u?