[13:07] <maxolase1squad> zoopster: Have you seen this game? http://www.savage2.com/en/main.php
[13:37] <itnet7> maxolase1squad: I love that game
[13:46] <zoopster> maxolase1squad: yes...they are on my list, but haven't responded to me yet...need to revisit again
[13:51] <maxolase1squad> Seems to good of a game to not be in the Software Center.
[13:51] <maxolase1squad> s/to/too
[13:52] <itnet7> I really enjoyed playing it, hopefully they'll respond
[17:41] <bluebomber> I think the Software Center should integrate with the Indie Bundles (Humble Indie Bundle, Indie Royale) somehow. Maybe put up a huge promotional banner when they're happening.
[17:43] <maxolase1squad> bluebomber: At UDS there was talk about the ability to have similar integration.  e.g. buying Oil Rush in SC would generate you a key that could be used with the Oil Rush downloaded from their website, and also the ability to use keys purchased from the vendor on the software downloaded from SC.
[17:44] <bluebomber> Neat. Let it be so.
[17:45] <bluebomber> Is SC flexible enough to allow pay-what-you-want in addition to gratis/non-gratis pricing structures?
[17:45] <maxolase1squad> No, but that was also discussed.
[17:45] <maxolase1squad> Free software games are already shipable in SC, but not with a pay-what-you like scheme.
[17:51] <bluebomber> Hmmm. Well at least the devs have some well-cut-out work in front of them.
[17:51] <bluebomber> Later!
[20:41] <LiveFromApple> Hello
[20:41] <LiveFromApple> It's gova
[20:43] <LiveFromApple> itnet7: ping
[20:43] <LiveFromApple> My phone is low on battery so I can't really text. If anything Ill contact you when I get home later. unless its urgent


[00:10] <GrueMaster> Is anyone here testing the armel release images?
[00:40] <rbelem> GrueMaster, did you test the images? i dont have how to test, since my device is only an old beagleboard :'(
[00:41] <GrueMaster> I'll start on them soon.  Will do desktop first, as mobile is still a tech preview (iirc).
[00:43] <rbelem> GrueMaster, oki np :-)
[00:43] <rbelem> GrueMaster, it is tech preview
[00:45] <rbelem> GrueMaster, in 11.10 it will left the tech preview status :-D
[00:45] <GrueMaster> Excellent!
[00:46] <GrueMaster> On a side note, in 11.10, we will be looking at adding hardware pack capabilities for people using the SOC on unsupported hardware (i.e. n900, Blaze, etc).
[00:47] <GrueMaster> The only things that should really be swapped are platform specific x-loader & u-boot, and maybe specific deb packages like your n900 support deb.
[00:48] <rbelem> groovy :-D
[00:48] <ScottK> It'd be nice for there to be more clarity about what the Ubuntu kernel will and won't support.  n900 is using the Linaro kernel because it was our understanding that the Ubuntu arm kernel would only support omap4 this cycle.
[00:57] <GrueMaster> ScottK: Yea, there was a major disconnect that got straightened out at the Rally.
[00:58] <ScottK> Then when we found out, it was too late since the porting work was already done.
[00:58] <GrueMaster> The reason we can't use linaro kernels is there won't be any SRU updates.
[00:58] <ScottK> Exactly why I'd prefer we weren't.
[00:58] <GrueMaster> I take it you have hw specific patches in the kernel?
[00:59] <ScottK> I don't recall how he did it, if it's a hwpack or a code copy, but it's based on linaro.
[01:00] <ScottK> I haven't tested it on n900 since I gave mine away to the guy doing the kernel work so he'd have the target hardware.
[01:03] <GrueMaster> So why does the mobile image keep bouncing from a rootfs only to a full SD image and back?
[01:04] <ScottK> No idea.
[01:21] <rbelem> GrueMaster, it is better to have a rootfs than an image with fixed image size
[01:22] <GrueMaster> The image resizes on first boot.
[01:22] <rbelem> GrueMaster, how?
[01:23] <GrueMaster> We have a tool that gets inserted into the initramfs on the boot partition.  On first boot, it looks at the SD card and resizes the rootfs to fill it.  It also reformats to boot partition ot match the chs for the SD card used.
[01:23] <GrueMaster> The scripts are part of jasper-initramfs.
[01:23] <rbelem> :-O
[01:23] <rbelem> I didn't know about that
[01:24] <GrueMaster> You and I discussed this during beta 1 & beta 2.
[01:24] <GrueMaster> :P
[01:26] <rbelem> i think i misundestood what you said :'(
[01:27] <GrueMaster> The idea is the buildd generates a rootfs, then the post-build in d-i generates a 2+G SD image with that and a vfat boot partition that contains the bootloader & kernel.
[01:28] <GrueMaster> Then the user can just dd to an SD card and boot.  Pretty painless.
[01:30] <rbelem> do we have how to change the partition scheme?
[01:30] <GrueMaster> We've been doing this since Maverick.  I'm surprised you didn't know that.
[01:30] <rbelem> :'(
[01:32] <rbelem> GrueMaster, well... let's use that next release
[01:33] <rbelem> GrueMaster, are you going t uds?
[01:33] <rbelem> *to
[01:34] <GrueMaster> Yes.  Only reason I missed UDS-N was at UDS-M, I had to get permission for vacation for a Cruise my wife was planning.  After she bought our tickets, they announced the date for UDS-N in Orlando.
[01:34] <GrueMaster> Are you going?    We'll share the load.  :P
[01:36] <rbelem> eheheh :-D
[04:18] <c2tarun> apachelogger: ping
[04:52] <ScottK> maco: Will galley need an SRU to go with the new kdebindings or is it good as built with just the SRU?
[04:53] <ScottK> (for bindings)
[05:01] <maco> ScottK: no-change rebuild
[05:02] <ScottK> You ought to be able to go ahead and upload it now for it's own SRU.
[05:07] <maco> ok
[05:08]  * maco wonders if she should make a more-useful manpage at the same time
[05:10] <valorie> that is one of the best sentences I have ever heard a developer utter
[05:10] <valorie> maco ++
[05:10] <ScottK> ok?
[05:10] <ScottK> Or am I lacking context?
[05:10] <maco> ScottK: the part about the manpage :P
[05:12] <maco> right now its like "hi, im a manpage, because debian says i need to exist"
[05:12] <ScottK> It should to better than that.
[05:12] <maco> but should probably have info about acquiring lesson files...as this bug i have sitting in debian tells me
[07:26] <jussi> in case any of you didnt see it: Just as a heads-up for KDE developers, the current release plan for KDE SC 4.7 has Thursday 28 April as the deadline to have desired features added to the 4.7 Feature Plan, otherwise they have to wait for the next release.
[08:11] <valorie> eek, I just volunteered to do a session Introducing Kubuntu in Open Week
[08:43] <agateau> Riddell: morning, sorry I left before reading your last messages yesterday evening,
[08:44] <agateau> Riddell: thanks for the upload! It is going to be a bit complicated to write a test case for the bug though, but will see what we can do
[08:48] <jussi> hrm, where do I find qt4-linguist in maverick?
[09:18] <bigbrovar-sgs> hi guys, i have been having issues with my kubuntu natty install. mainly after a while it refuses to hangs at boot. had this problem on 32bit, then i switched to 64 bit and i am having the same issues. it just hangs at but and nothing else reponds.  when i even try to use safe mode. it hangs at safe mode console menu.
[09:19] <valorie> bigbrovar-sgs: have you tried asking in #ubuntu+1 ?
[09:19] <valorie> they are the natty specialists
[09:21] <bigbrovar-sgs> my machine is an hp probook 4420s, core i5 with intel arrandale chip
[09:21] <bigbrovar-sgs> ok i will head over there thanks
[09:46] <apachelogger> c2tarun: pogo
[10:20] <Riddell> agateau: by test case I don't mean a formalied unit test, just "run unity-2d, notice that memory isn't being eaten up" would do
[10:20] <Riddell> it already has a test case in the patch anyway
[10:21] <agateau> Riddell: ok, we're all set then
[10:21] <steveire> Riddell: There's a wetab blog that keeps appearing on platen kde
[10:21] <steveire> planet
[10:21] <bambee> morning
[10:21] <steveire> If we remove the feed will that stop until the author fixes it?
[10:34] <c2tarun> apachelogger: if I want to look into any project related to phonon for SoK, can you please tell me from where should I start my research to prepare report?
[10:37] <Riddell> steveire: wetab blog?
[10:38] <Riddell> oh, saigkill
[10:44] <steveire> Yeah
[10:44] <steveire> I talked to sysadmin
[10:44] <steveire> I think bcooksley is handling it
[10:44] <Riddell> he just sent out a grumpy e-mail
[10:44] <steveire> Going to email him or somethng
[10:45] <steveire> who bcooksley?
[10:45] <apachelogger> c2tarun: talk to kde game developers or amarok/dragon/kaffeine/tomahawk developers
[10:45] <apachelogger> ask them for what they are missing in phonon
[10:46] <apachelogger> or what they dislike partcularly
[10:46] <apachelogger> then write a proposal to fix that ^^
[11:27] <Riddell> rbelem: ping, doing any testing of kubuntu mobile?
[14:16] <Riddell> all new DVDs to test
[15:48] <GrueMaster> Riddell: Did the armel images get respun as well?
[15:58] <Riddell> GrueMaster: nope
[15:59] <Riddell> GrueMaster: although kubuntu mobile images could do with being tested (boot only, no install needed)
[15:59] <GrueMaster> Ok.  Wanted to make sure before I dove in.
[15:59] <ryanakca> ScottK: Will do as soon as I find the passwords
[16:09] <c2tarun> which is the best voip framework for kubuntu?
[16:39] <GrueMaster> Why do the mobile armel images keep changing?  While I haven't tested since Beta 2, dailies have been complete preinstalled images until 20110425, when they reverted back to rootfs only.
[16:45] <GrueMaster> See http://paste.ubuntu.com/599850/ to know what I am referring to.
[16:45] <GrueMaster> The images with the x86 boot sector are ready to run.
[16:53] <rbelem> Riddell, i will test today the image in the n900
[17:15] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: ping
[17:46] <c2tarun> anybody here familiar with application development using Qt4Telepathy?
[18:01] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: ping
[18:07] <GrueMaster> rbelem: plasma-mobile.desktop is still not in /usr/share/autostart.
[18:08] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: syn
[18:09] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: hey, I want to make a VoIP plugin for kontact using telepathy, is it possible?
[18:09] <shadeslayer> wot
[18:09] <shadeslayer> oh
[18:09] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: SoK ?
[18:10] <Riddell> GrueMaster: it shouldn't be, it should be in /usr/share/kubuntu-mobile-default-settings/ and $KDEDIRS set
[18:10] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: Yup :)
[18:10] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: best to ask telepathy guys in #kde-telepathy if someone is not working on that already
[18:10] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: well, noone proposed that project in GSoC. So I thought of taking it to SoK
[18:11] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: yeah, but someone *might* have proposed it in the GSoC proposals and might not have made it
[18:11] <GrueMaster> Riddell: Well, unless it is moved as I noted, it fails to start.
[18:11] <shadeslayer> ( altho afaik .. no one proposed it, but you can never be too sure ^_^ )
[18:12] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: but still no one got it :) thats is I am sure ;)
[18:12] <GrueMaster> As the images sit now, there are too many failures to go forward without a lot of intervention.
[18:13] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: I asked valorie and she said to write a report and submit it, I was doing my research on asterisk when I found about telepathy. I heard on channel once that you are doing something on telepathy, so I pinged you
[18:14] <shadeslayer> yeah i've worked on a couple of bug fixes for telepathy, nothing major tho :)
[18:14] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: + I saw a video presentation given by McQueen and he told that VoIP applications can be build using telepathy.
[18:15] <shadeslayer> yep
[18:15] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: Can you please direct me to some tutorial or development manual on telepathy
[18:15] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: there's the "How to build telepathy KDE" page
[18:15] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: you could start off by suggesting a new name ^_^
[18:16] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: yeah thats a good idea :) and one more help please, can you tell me what is the difference b/w Qt programming and Kde programming language?
[18:17] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: well.. you can sort of visualize that graphically ... KDE is built on the Qt toolkit
[18:17] <shadeslayer> and loads of the Qt functions have been modified/overloaded to fit KDE's needs
[18:18] <shadeslayer> Riddell:  apachelogger: ^^ anything i should add to that?
[18:19] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: I mean what is the difference between http://techbase.kde.org/Development/Tutorials#Introduction_To_KDE_4_Programming and Qt?
[18:20] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: different classes
[18:21] <shadeslayer> visually they look pretty much the same
[18:21] <shadeslayer> but, if you look at the included classes, those differ by a huge amount
[18:22] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: yup, there are differences. The problem is kontact is in this kde- prgramming language. Is it possible to make a plugin for it in Qt?
[18:22] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: an in hello world program, prerequisites include Qt O_O
[18:23] <c2tarun> /s/an/and
[18:23] <shadeslayer> well .. if you implement it via DBus ...sure ... not entirely sure how it's going to be implemented
[18:23] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: where?
[18:24] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: well I was reading about telepathy and D-Bus first time, but what I thought is I'll make a plugin using telepathy development and it will take care of messing with D-Bus. am I wrong?
[18:24] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: did you read what D-Bus is?
[18:25] <shadeslayer> it's not *that* easy :PO
[18:25] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: yup, just the introductory part
[18:25] <shadeslayer> s/O/
[18:25] <c2tarun> :(
[18:25] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: right, so explain it to me ....
[18:25] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: s/functions/classes
[18:25] <shadeslayer> right ^^
[18:26] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: dbus is a system for interprocess communication.
[18:26] <apachelogger> KDE just adds a desktop integration focus to Qt
[18:26] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: by a long shot, do you happen to have a presentation of sorts on the 802.11 standard?
[18:26] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: presentation?
[18:26] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: yes, a slideshow etc
[18:27] <apachelogger> nopes
[18:27] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: right, and what do you understand by IPC?
[18:27] <shadeslayer> :S
[18:27] <apachelogger> plus you would not want slides from me anyway
[18:27]  * shadeslayer looks at ieee
[18:27] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: whai?
[18:27] <apachelogger> there are no more than 5 of them evar and they contain no more then 3 useful words :P
[18:27] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: interprocess communication, how can two processes on same or different machines can send messages to each other.
[18:28] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: " ... on different machines ... " that's RPC
[18:28] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: lemme guess, Phonon, Webkit and Pink
[18:28]  * apachelogger notes that communication is not just sending but processing too, which makes things fun :P
[18:28] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: aye
[18:28] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: that actually sums up my fosdem presentation
[18:28] <apachelogger> fun
[18:28] <apachelogger> :D
[18:29] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: well may be I am wrong but, its written somewhere that dbus can be used for processes on different system, if there is no encryption involved
[18:29] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: oh that must have been fun
[18:30]  * apachelogger also points out that RPC is a special version of IPC
[18:30] <shadeslayer> yep
[18:30] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: more awesomer version of IPC
[18:31] <apachelogger> generally speaking IPC is also when you use a pipe in a shell
[18:31] <apachelogger> whereby stdin/stdout provide the IPC framework
[18:31] <shadeslayer> didja see the patch with QtDBus peer to peer support?
[18:31] <apachelogger> no
[18:31] <shadeslayer> didja hear about it?
[18:31] <apachelogger> no
[18:31] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: you're getting old
[18:31]  * apachelogger was watching .prn ever since he won gsoc
[18:32] <apachelogger> that is why I am already half way done and you are not :P
[18:32] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: hmm.... in short this is not as easy as I thought :(
[18:32] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: nope :)
[18:32] <c2tarun> god :( I need a mentor who can at least tell me what to look for ;(
[18:32] <apachelogger> RPC dbus?
[18:33] <c2tarun> apachelogger: what?
[18:33] <apachelogger> nvm
[18:34] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: does your team of awesome have a name already?
[18:34] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: quite like ... File transfers without a google server
[18:34]  * c2tarun shooting at nothing :(
[18:34] <apachelogger> mine still did not reply :(
[18:34] <shadeslayer> aw
[18:34] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: #kde-telepathy i tell you
[18:34] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: wanna swap? :P
[18:34] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: mine is too busy fiddling around names
[18:35] <apachelogger> you cannot be too busy to find silly names
[18:35] <shadeslayer> they came up with Kryptonite and stuff
[18:35] <apachelogger> then again I already found the siliest of them all
[18:35] <apachelogger> Oo
[18:35] <apachelogger> G
[18:35] <apachelogger> kde cheeseballs ftw!
[18:35] <apachelogger> c2tarun: http://community.kde.org/GSoC/2011/Ideas
[18:35] <apachelogger> c2tarun: http://community.kde.org/GSoC/2010/Ideas
[18:35] <apachelogger> c2tarun: http://techbase.kde.org/index.php?title=Projects/Summer_of_Code/2009/Ideas
[18:35] <c2tarun> apachelogger: I took one from there only :(
[18:35] <c2tarun> 2010?
[18:35]  * c2tarun looking
[18:36] <apachelogger> c2tarun: http://techbase.kde.org/index.php?title=Projects/Summer_of_Code/2008/Ideas
[18:36] <apachelogger> c2tarun: http://techbase.kde.org/index.php?title=Projects/Summer_of_Code/2007/Ideas
[18:36] <c2tarun> hmm.......
[18:36] <c2tarun> apachelogger: got it :/ I gotta dive in history
[18:36] <apachelogger> if you cannot find inspiration there I fear we might have a problem
[18:37] <c2tarun> apachelogger: inspiration cannot substitute lack of knowledge :(
[18:37] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: what are your Komrades working on?
[18:37] <apachelogger> c2tarun: you just need to find the right scope fo rhte inspiration :P
[18:38]  * apachelogger starts writing phonon head0rs
[18:38] <c2tarun> apachelogger: an idol will help a lot ;)
[18:39] <apachelogger> I hear apachelogger has a fan club
[18:40] <c2tarun> :D :D :D
[18:40] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: good question .... i don't remember
[18:41] <shadeslayer> Mercurial plugin for dolphin
[18:41] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: there are very few guys in kde-telepathy, can you please tell me what should I ask? "How can I build a VoIP plugin using telepathy?" <-- is this good?
[18:41] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: you are not very good at community bonding, are you? :P
[18:41] <shadeslayer> and the other on working on plasma educational desktop
[18:41] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: more like .. i have too much coursework piled up that makes me forget
[18:42] <apachelogger> oh, yeah, the excuse paradigm
[18:42] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: more details would go a long way in helping people out how to help you
[18:42] <apachelogger> http://aplg.kollide.net/tmp/output.mkv ole!
[18:42] <c2tarun> hmm....
[18:42]  * shadeslayer wgets
[18:43] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: if I remove telepathy out of picture can I just implement this plugin via D-Bus?
[18:44] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: i think you *only* need to deal with DBus and Kontact
[18:44] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: that is one hell of help :) thanks a lot
[18:45] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: look at the dbus interface of telepathy kde and what it offers
[18:45]  * shadeslayer is yet to look at it
[18:45] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: unlike Western countries, they give us shitloads of coursework here :(
[18:46] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: still I think I should read about dbus first. knowing it better will help me in understanding the working of telepathy (I guess)
[18:46] <shadeslayer> i mean like ... assignments that run into 40 pages which have to be written by hand
[18:46] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: yep
[18:46] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: thanks :)
[18:46] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: clearly you should have studied in the empire of west then
[18:46] <shadeslayer> *nod*
[18:46] <apachelogger> now
[18:46] <apachelogger> by hand
[18:46] <apachelogger> like
[18:46] <apachelogger> by friggin hand?
[18:46] <apachelogger> with pencil and stuff?
[18:47] <shadeslayer> pen and stuff
[18:47] <shadeslayer> yes
[18:47]  * apachelogger blinks
[18:47] <apachelogger> and you are sure you are studying computer science?
[18:47] <shadeslayer> no .. i'm studying Electronics
[18:47] <apachelogger> oh
[18:47] <apachelogger> that makes sense then
[18:47] <shadeslayer> what
[18:47] <shadeslayer> how?
[18:47] <bambee> lol
[18:48] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: but CSE students don't have it easy as well
[18:48] <apachelogger> around here one also needs to write a shitload of stuff by hand if studying electronics
[18:48] <shadeslayer> pretty much the same stuff over there too
[18:48] <shadeslayer> ouch
[18:48]  * shadeslayer goes back to IEEE 802.11 n
[18:48] <apachelogger> in computer science at my university there are like 5 courses that have assignments with hand writing stuff
[18:49] <apachelogger> everything else is the digital0rizer
[18:51]  * bambee still does not understand why exams are not on machines... it's silly
[18:51] <bambee> (for computer science)
[19:11] <livcd> Is kde compiled using a SSP ?
[19:18] <apachelogger> livcd: please define SSP
[19:19] <livcd> apachelogger: with what flag is KDE (and his parts) compiled...like -fstack-protector or -all
[19:20] <maco> stack smashing prevention
[19:20] <livcd> protector
[19:20] <livcd> :P
[19:20] <maco> i found someone actually breaking the acronym down into words on the 2nd page of my googling
[19:21] <maco> livcd: do you mean something like a canary?
[19:21] <apachelogger> livcd: I believe all of ubuntu defaults ot stack smashing protection
[19:21] <yofel> according to gccs manpage -fstack-protector is on by default in ubuntu, -all isn't from what I see
[19:21] <apachelogger> maco: SSP has about 5000 meanings
[19:22] <apachelogger> at least 1k of them are computing related :P
[19:22] <maco> multimedia.cx/eggs/heroic-defender-of-the-stack/ says prevention :P
[19:22] <livcd> some parts are not protected
[19:22] <livcd> like
[19:22] <livcd> firefox parts
[19:22] <livcd> they want to have it fast
[19:22] <apachelogger> they *need* to have it fast because the software is already insanely slow as it is :P
[19:23] <livcd> security > usability
[19:23] <livcd> for me :)
[19:24] <apachelogger> well, it is about usability in the most original meaning :P
[19:24] <livcd> i was asking for friend cuz he wants to use replace thunderbird by kmail
[19:24] <apachelogger> I'd imagine firefox not being usable (as in not at all) with stack protection :P
[19:24] <livcd> bah
[19:24] <maco> livcd: i know a stack canary is used all over ubuntu
[19:25] <apachelogger> well, I don't recall us unsetting stack protection
[19:25] <maco> there's also an #ubuntu-security channel
[19:25] <livcd> i dont like when im thinking about something and then i write half of text
[19:25] <apachelogger> so considering it is default for gcc, all of KDE is stack protected on ubuntu
[19:25] <maco> oh look a 404
[19:25] <micahg> maco: should fwd to #ubuntu-hardened
[19:25] <livcd> thought k/ubuntu are different projects
[19:26] <maco> micahg: the 404 i was looking at was http://www.ubuntu.com/usn/server/features/security
[19:26] <livcd> different packages creators
[19:26] <apachelogger> livcd: they are not
[19:26] <apachelogger> they are different products
[19:26] <apachelogger> made by the same community
[19:26] <maco> livcd: we use the same build servers, same archives, etc.
[19:26] <micahg> maco: thanks, I'll get someone to look at that
[19:26] <apachelogger> well, different teams within the community actually ^^
[19:26] <yofel> livcd: we share the same archive and thus the same compiler, just the shipped package set is different
[19:26] <apachelogger> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/69910117/buildlog_ubuntu-natty-i386.kde4libs_4%3A4.6.2-0ubuntu4_BUILDING.txt.gz
[19:26] <apachelogger> we do not unsest stack protection
[19:26] <livcd> Im using ubuntu only for my familiy computer
[19:27] <livcd> still learning LFS
[19:27] <apachelogger> hence all of KDE is stack protected by default
[19:27] <apachelogger> (of course I would not dare claiming that every package obeys to that)
[19:28] <micahg> maco: where's that link from?
[19:28] <livcd> apachelogger: For all the security stuff there is Ubuntu security team ...well maybe mainly Kees Cook ?
[19:28] <maco> micahg: http://www.ubuntu.com/usn/
[19:28] <micahg> maco: thanks
[19:28] <micahg> livcd: there's #ubuntu-hardened if you want to ask the security team questions
[19:29] <Riddell> to be fair on the rest of the security team there several wonderful people on it as well as Kees
[19:29] <maco> like beattie
[19:29] <maco> i usually ask beattie when i have questions
[19:29] <livcd> micahg: But they are using grsec mainly i think...and security in mainstream ubuntu is different :)
[19:29]  * apachelogger usually refreains from having questions :P
[19:30] <maco> grsec? thats only compatible with a few kernels, and only every now and then when the author catches up with upstream linux
[19:31] <livcd> maco: there are packages
[19:31] <livcd> Julien Tinnes of google i think
[19:31] <livcd> did that for ubuntu/debian
[19:40] <maco> Riddell: in oneiric, can kaccessible be installed by default? its the screenreader for kde
[19:40] <maco> apparently it now has one, it's just not at-spi compatible, so you need to run kaccessible & orca at the same time to cover all your apps
[19:41] <maco> (assuming a mix of gnome & kde, which i think is pretty common)
[19:42] <Riddell> maco: depends on disk space as ever, of course I'm not around for oneiric so it's up to those who are
[19:42] <maco> oh right
[19:42] <Riddell> maco: the Accessibility option on the CD boot screen hasn't dont anything in Kubuntu since KDE 4 came along, it would be a nice project to see if something could be done with it
[19:43] <maco> ouch
[19:43] <maco> ok
[19:43] <maco> step one would be getting kaccessible on the cd then
[19:43] <maco> as that's what's needed to make ubiquity be speakable
[19:43] <Riddell> it is?
[19:43] <Riddell> how does it do that?
[19:44] <maco> im not sure yet what other changes (if any) i'd need to make to pykde ubiquity frontend
[19:44] <maco> kaccessible is the kde screenreader
[19:44] <maco> its new in 4.6
[19:45] <maco> qt-at-spi is apparently about making a bridge so that the stuff kaccessible would read can be passed on to dbus for at-spi2 screenreaders to use
[19:45] <maco> but is not really done yet
[19:45] <maco> in the meantime, ive gotten kaccessible to read *some* stuff in kde, though i havent tried it with ubiquity yet
[19:45] <maco> it works dandily with menus, but its treatment of konsole & konqueror leaves something to be desired
[19:46] <maco> but certainly the first step to getting ubiquity to be read aloud is having something to do the reading!
[19:47] <maco> (im intending to spend a good chunk of oneiric time fixing up the pygtk frontend of ubiquity to say useful things instead of just things)
[19:49] <Riddell> maco: what do you need to do to get kaccessible to read stuff?
[19:50] <maco> Riddell: you need to have QT_ACCESSIBITY=1  in your env
[19:50] <maco> Riddell: so youd want to set that in your session startup (which some kde session startup config thingy can do but i forget what its called)
[19:50] <maco> or just do QT_ACCESSIBILITY=1 kate
[19:50] <maco> well, after starting kaccessibleapp
[19:50] <maco> which is in /usr/lib/kde4/exec/ i think?
[19:50] <maco> dpkg -L kaccessible to double check
[19:51] <maco> we'd want the accessible option in the menu to set QT_ACCESSIBLITY in the env before starting the session with ubiquity in it
[19:51] <Riddell> I think I'm missing a text-to-speach programme
[19:51] <maco> espeak?
[19:52] <maco> ok step one for testing it:  start kaccessibleapp
[19:52] <maco> you should get a little blue circle with white man in it in your tray
[19:52] <maco> see that?
[19:53] <maco> /usr/lib/kde4/libexec/kaccessibleapp  <-- oh thats the path
[19:53] <maco> if you wanted it for permanent, then you'd use the kaccessible service
[19:53] <Riddell> golly, it works
[19:54] <maco> yeah! thats why this has to go into oneiric
[19:54] <maco> but like i said, still some weirdness with konsole and konqueror
[19:54] <maco> like, it recites numbers, and i don't know why
[19:54] <maco> oh, and konqueror is not keyboard-usable afaict
[19:55] <maco> (i did "ls" and it said "42")
[19:55] <maco> (in konsole, i mean)
[19:55] <Riddell> we default to rekonq of course
[19:55] <maco> kde.org in konqueror read off a string of numbers
[19:55] <maco> i suspect in the case of ls it was telling me how many files had been output, but it didnt read their names
[19:59] <Riddell> rbelem: kubuntu mobile is waiting for your sign off on https://wiki.kubuntu.org/NattyNarwhal/ReleaseManifest
[20:00] <Riddell> Tm_Tr: powerpc really needs some love http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/
[20:07] <Tm_T> Riddell: ye, I'm fighting with hardware issues here, but I'll have some results in a few minutes
[20:23] <arpan> hi
[20:24] <arpan> can anyone help me with nvidia drivers causing this-> http://imagebin.org/150465
[20:25] <Tm_T> Riddell: live boots, apps gets launched
[20:26] <Tm_T> ...and because of apparently broken hardware (I/O errors from cdrom device) at some point I got plasma-desktop being rather unresponsive
[20:48] <Tm_K> Riddell: works, as you see
[23:05] <Riddell> Tm_T: lovely thanks
[23:37] <Riddell> rbelem: ping
[23:37] <rbelem> Riddell, pong
[23:40] <Riddell> rbelem: yo, do we have a plan to sign off the mobile images?
[23:40] <Riddell> actually, I think the arm ones are being rebuilt
[23:40] <rbelem> Riddell, yup, i'm testing the i386 right now
[23:41] <rbelem> Riddell, and will test omap3 on n900 in a couple minutes
[23:43] <Riddell> groovy, make sure you get the 20110427 image
[23:44] <Riddell> I wonder why kubuntu mobile doesn't like being run on virtualbox, I just get funny colours
[23:45] <rbelem> Riddell, me too
[23:45] <rbelem> Riddell, i'm checking that too
[23:51] <rbelem> Riddell, i dont understant why it is waiting for the enter key to be pressed so X starts
[23:52] <rbelem> Riddell, do you have an idea?
[23:53] <Riddell> mm, nope
[23:54] <Riddell> rbelem: in virtualbox or on real hardware?
[23:54] <rbelem> Riddell, /etc/default/nodm is nice
[23:54] <rbelem> Riddell, virtualbox
[23:54] <rbelem> Riddell, i will test on n900 now


[01:36] <stephen101> Nobody home? Lol
[07:21] <FourDollars> Hi, I was asking about how to generate the Debian source package from git://git.launchpad.net/~canonical-kernel/ubuntu/+source/linux-oem last week. I can generate the Debian source package now after executing `fakeroot debian/rules clean`. However the Debian source package can not be built by sbuild with some error like http://paste.ubuntu.com/26207215/.
[08:40] <apw> FourDollars, well at a most fundamental level that is actually what happens on a buildd
[08:40] <apw> FourDollars, the error that is being reported by the kernel makefiles is that your tree is dirty
[08:40] <apw> FourDollars, did you update configs in that tree for instance ?
[08:41] <apw> FourDollars, i find the kernel makefiles say that if include/config exists or something like that
[08:41] <FourDollars> apw: No, I just add my one commit and execute `fakeroot debian/rules clean` before `dpkg-buildpackage -S -us -uc`.
[08:43] <FourDollars> Never mind. Let me try it again.
[08:45] <apw> FourDollars, once yo have applied the fix, use a git clean -x -f -d on the tree, it will _remove_ everything not in version control so expect that
[08:46] <FourDollars> apw: You are right. `git clean -x -f -d` does remove more files. Thx a lot.
[08:47] <FourDollars> So the proper commands sequence will be `git clean -x -f -d`, `fakeroot debian/rules clean`, and then `dpkg-buildpackage -S -us -uc`.
[08:48] <apw> that is what i do yes
[13:37] <dupondje> There are no signed daily (or rc) kernels for ubuntu?
[13:38] <dupondje> got 'some' errors on my new device, so want to check what is resolved yet in the newest kernel
[13:46] <apw> dupondje, signed in the sense of signed for EFI secure-boot ?  no indeed
[13:46] <apw> dupondje, though i am not sure why that would prevent them being booted
[13:47] <dupondje> apw: going to try :)
[13:53] <dupondje> allright booted 4.15.0-999-generic :)
[13:59] <apw> dupondje, being unsigned means that grub hands off to the kernel in a different manner, with efi boot services closed down
[14:21] <sforshee> kees: your patch which changes the behavior of the RLIMIT_STACK hard limit across suid exec, that has broken one of our tests. The test can be fixed, but I'm wondering how confident you are that it doesn't regress any userspace stuff?
[14:31] <dupondje> apw: ok, tought uefi only accepted signed kernels
[14:38] <dupondje> but good thing, new kernel fixes all my problems :)
[14:48] <apw> dupondje, it only boots it in secure mode
[14:48] <apw> if it is signed
[17:18] <kees> sforshee: yeah, that broke a bunch of stuff, I've already gotten it reverted upstream (and it just landed in stable too)
[17:22] <sforshee> kees: ok thanks, glad I didn't try to push that kernel through then :-)


[16:29] <cmaloney> I <3 that Amazon now has prime stations
[16:29] <cmaloney> because a) it's another indication that "heavy metal" isn't covered, and b) it doesn't work under Linux.
[16:29] <cmaloney> hurray outsider!


[00:03] <jasoncwarner> TheMuso bryceh_ RAOF robert_ancell
[00:03] <RAOF> Desktop team eastern edition?
[00:03] <chrisccoulson> hi jasoncwarner!
[00:03] <jasoncwarner> ready for https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-04-12
[00:03] <RAOF> Heydi ho!
[00:03] <jasoncwarner> gah!
[00:03] <jasoncwarner> keyboard remapped :/
[00:04] <jasoncwarner> there...better
[00:04] <jasoncwarner> Hi everyon
[00:04] <bryceh_> heya
[00:04] <jasoncwarner> Alright.... :) Ready?
[00:04]  * bryceh_ digs himself out from under a pile of hybrid graphics bug reports
[00:05] <jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] X.org
[00:05] <bryceh_> was off yesterday but I gather RAOF got a few odds and ends of X bits put in
[00:06] <bryceh_> aside from that, strategy this week has been pushing bugs upstream as much as possible, so we can pull in fixes later
[00:06] <RAOF> We've got the new mesa stable release, fixing some KDE problems on radeon.
[00:06] <RAOF> And ia32-libs needs a refresh now that the 32bit dri drivers will actually work.
[00:07] <bryceh_> oh chris btw if you get a moment can you look at bugs 747246 and 757744 (which might be the same), and see if they have any relation to the Qt issue you had been investigating earlier?
[00:08] <RAOF> Also: OMG COMPIZ DEADLOCK.  Bug #754063 has been worked-around, but the underlying problem is still unknown and is triggerable, just not as easily.
[00:08] <RAOF> Those look like pretty weird bugs :)
[00:09] <jasoncwarner> Ok..all sounds good...Anything else there?
[00:09] <bryceh_> RAOF, yeah I usually don't worry much about crashes in the proprietary driver config tools
[00:10] <bryceh_> well, we're still having a lot of troubles with intel gpu lockups
[00:10] <bryceh_> but aside from continuing to push bug reports upstream not sure we can do much.
[00:10] <RAOF> We also got a new X server, which mostly just contained a bunch of memory leak fixes.
[00:10] <jasoncwarner> RAOF: nothing breaking, I trust?
[00:10] <RAOF> bryceh_: Sarvatt had an -intel commit which apparently should fix a bunch of those hangs.
[00:11] <bryceh_> RAOF, yeah I saw it... basically a "we give up, lets shut off the crashy bits" patch ;-)
[00:11] <RAOF> Ah, the joys of intel hardware.
[00:11] <bryceh_> but I think esp. with intel we need to validate the patches before we consider them real fixes
[00:12] <RAOF> jasoncwarner: Nothing that appeared dangerous.
[00:12] <bryceh_> too many patches have been coming down which don't fix the bugs...
[00:12] <bryceh_> also, I mentioned hybrid graphics...
[00:12] <jasoncwarner> Ok...if nothing else for x (why does X always feel like we could talk forever about it? :) )... [TOPIC] AOB
[00:12] <jasoncwarner> bryceh_: oh yeah
[00:12] <jasoncwarner> what about those?
[00:13] <bryceh_> we don't support hybrid graphics switching (nor does upstream or AFAIK any vendors), but there's clearly some building expectations that it works
[00:13] <bryceh_> it's a hard nut to crack
[00:13] <TheMuso> More and more notebooks are shipping with hybrid GPU setups now.
[00:13] <RAOF> Doesn't the new fglrx actually have some support for hybrid switching?
[00:13]  * bryceh_ nods
[00:14] <RAOF> Buy me an ati/intel laptop and I'll help airled get that working :)
[00:14] <bryceh_> RAOF, phoronix rumors are all I can find
[00:14]  * RAOF is looking into buying an ati/intel laptop *anyway*
[00:15] <bryceh_> that's probably a very good idea
[00:15] <bryceh_> RAOF, why don't you ping tgardner and see if he has any dell hybrid gfx models and if so if he could lend you one for this?
[00:15] <broder> does hybrid switching mean dynamically switching while x is running, or just doing the moral equivalent of vga_switcheroo?
[00:16] <RAOF> broder: vga_switcheroo.
[00:16] <bryceh_> broder, no we're a LONG way from dynamic switching
[00:16] <broder> that's what i thought, just checking :)
[00:16] <bryceh_> in fact X may never be able to do that
[00:16] <TheMuso> Now that doesn't surprise me.
[00:16] <RAOF> Airled's on it.  It may be sooner than you think.
[00:16] <jasoncwarner> bryceh_: would wayland be able to support something like that, theoretically?
[00:16] <TheMuso> Another case for wayland.
[00:16] <broder> i had been assuming that i needed to wait for wayland to get real dynamic switching
[00:17] <bryceh_> typical issue is someone installs -fglrx on an intel/ati system, reboots, and still -intel gets loaded (and fails due to glx conflicts)
[00:17] <bryceh_> jasoncwarner, theoretically, if you assume proprietary drivers gain wayland support ;-)
[00:17] <RAOF> bryceh_: I'm pretty sure that fglrx now co-exists (by means of magical hax!) with intel, and allows you to switch between them.
[00:17] <RAOF> Restarting X inbetween, obviously.
[00:18] <jasoncwarner> Ok...anythign else, or should we move to AOB?
[00:18] <broder> bryceh_: could we fix this by just not writing an xorg.conf for fglrx and nvidia-*?
[00:18] <broder> (now that X can auto-probe both of those)
[00:19] <bryceh_> jasoncwarner, nope, we can follow up on hybrid graphics elsewhere
[00:19] <jasoncwarner> Aight...anything for AOB (I just had one thing)
[00:19] <jasoncwarner> Well then, mine.... :)
[00:19] <jasoncwarner> RAOF: any word on that 10% CPU usage from banshee front?
[00:20] <RAOF> jasoncwarner: Oh, yeah.  I got a patch which drops that by 50%; it's upstream and in pkg-cli git, but I failed at uploading it before the beta2 freeze.
[00:21] <jasoncwarner> ah, ok...thanks1
[00:21] <jasoncwarner> !
[00:21] <RAOF> (I uploaded it, but launchpad rejected it, apparently because I fail at dpkg-source 3.0)
[00:22] <jasoncwarner> thanks, man...cool...
[00:22] <jasoncwarner> well then, anything else?
[00:22] <jasoncwarner> if not, thanks everyone!
[00:22] <TheMuso> thanks
[00:22] <jasoncwarner> [END MEETING]
[00:22] <RAOF> Ta
[00:24] <bryceh_> broder, just omitting the xorg.conf is not sufficient since you have kernel modesetting and framebuffer driver loading stuff going on as well; I think it requires some tweaks at the plumbing layer
[00:25] <broder> bryceh_: kms shouldn't be an issue. fglrx drops in an /etc/modprobe.d file, but it only blacklists radeon, so if intel is still hooked up, it'll still get loaded and kms'd
[00:25] <broder> if you omit the xorg.conf, the only remaining issues i know of are the nvidia logo and the libGL swap
[00:26] <broder> and the logo you could deal with with a small enhancement to the auto-discovery patch
[00:35] <highvoltage> windows app store screenshot: http://www.winrumors.com/windows-8-windows-app-store-screenshots-leak/
[00:36] <highvoltage> nice thing is that they seemed to have copied more from Software Center than the Mac App store :)
[00:55] <mdeslaur> Uhm...is someone working on this? bug 759305
[01:57] <JanC> highvoltage: those screenshots are supposedly fake  ;)
[02:35] <highvoltage> JanC: ah :)
[03:01] <jbicha> hi, I've got a very simple patch for the gnome3 ppa and I need some help submitting it
[03:50] <micahg> jbicha: file a bug and subscribe the team I guess?
[07:44] <didrocks> good morning
[08:06] <pitti> Good morning
[08:06] <Sweetshark> Good morning all!
[08:06] <pitti> hey Sweetshark
[08:07] <Sweetshark> pitti: heya.
[08:08]  * Sweetshark again had X/compiz/unity freezes yesterday evening. but just a freeze, not a crash, so no crashreports about it.
[08:09] <RAOF> Sweetshark: Mouse works, cursor changes appropriately, but no window updates?
[08:09] <Sweetshark> I have the suspicion it it somewhat related to the tray icons of claws-mail and mumble ....
[08:10] <Sweetshark> RAOF: yes.
[08:11] <RAOF> Sweetshark: Then I probably know what's happening (but not *why*, or exactly *where*, or how to fix it :()
[08:14] <glatzor> morning mvo
[08:15] <Sweetshark> RAOF: I know that feeling: "Dear user, could you do whatever you do to make it crash and stop right before the crash (which you have no indicator to predict) and gdb the product for the rest of the ride?"
[08:15] <RAOF> Sweetshark: Oh, no.  If it's the bug I'm thinking of I can reproduce it *at will*
[08:16] <mvo> good morning glatzor!
[08:16] <mvo> glatzor: the upload is still in the frozen queue btw
[08:17] <glatzor> no problem
[08:17] <RAOF> It's just all sorts of awkward - the *problem* is that X isn't responding to a reply on *one* of compiz' 3 display connections that's raised in response to an even on one of its *other* X connections, and then everything just waits for an event that will never arrive.
[08:18] <glatzor> mvo, your trainee seems to be very motivated :)
[08:18] <mvo> glatzor: have you seen this bug about the crash in ProvideMedium (#755655) its a bit confusing
[08:18] <mvo> glatzor: absolutely
[08:18] <mvo> glatzor: best intern ever (so far at least ;)
[08:19] <Sweetshark> RAOF: hmmm.
[08:19] <mvo> glatzor: I need to motivate him to update aptdaemon and look at the open bugs next
[08:22] <seb128> hello desktopers
[08:28] <seb128> hey pitti, did we get new iso to test?
[08:28] <pitti> hey seb128
[08:28] <pitti> seb128: yes, over night
[08:31] <glatzor> seb128, could you please translate LP #755655?
[08:32] <seb128> glatzor, it says that s-c asked for the natty dvd and bugged when he put the dvd in
[08:32] <seb128> didrocks, bug #746028 is for you btw
[08:34] <didrocks> seb128: let me have a try
[08:34] <didrocks> so, I'm changing gimping my current wallpaper
[08:34] <pitti> bonjour didrocks
[08:35] <pitti> didrocks: feeling better today?
[08:35] <seb128> didrocks, is something supposed to be updating the copy on session start if the master image is newer?
[08:35] <didrocks> pitti: hey pitti! yeah, the evening helped me to get rid of this not strong, but annoying headache, thanks! :)
[08:36] <didrocks> seb128: even not on start, there is an inotify on it
[08:36] <seb128> didrocks, well inotify works only if that user is logged in
[08:36] <seb128> what for non current users?
[08:37] <didrocks> I'm completely sure it worked for karmic -> lucid -> maverick
[08:37] <didrocks> seb128: the check is at start IIRC
[08:37] <didrocks> let me first try there
[08:37] <seb128> ok
[08:38] <seb128> well it worked from the case where we added it, not sure if we ever tried the upgrade case with one image copied?
[08:38] <didrocks> seb128: I tried it
[08:38] <didrocks> for gdm and the current user
[08:38] <didrocks> why on earth unity-2d is copying every single system files :/
[08:40] <robert_ancell> pitti, hey, I did the shotwell update and opened bugs etc.  Should I upload it so it's in the queue?
[08:40] <pitti> robert_ancell: sounds good
[08:40] <pitti> robert_ancell: hey, good evening
[08:40] <didrocks> seb128: I edit it on gimp and it works, the cache is refreshed and the new background is shown
[08:40] <didrocks> let me see gdm again
[08:41] <seb128> didrocks, ok, well the bug got confirmed by several users
[08:41] <seb128> robert_ancell, hey
[08:41] <seb128> robert_ancell, you have a weird way to update packages!
[08:41] <robert_ancell> hi all
[08:41] <robert_ancell> seb128, ?
[08:42] <didrocks> seb128: for edubuntu, isn't it?
[08:42] <robert_ancell> oh, my list
[08:42] <pitti> yeah, I was just reading robert_ancell's response to the branch thread
[08:42] <seb128> robert_ancell, debchkout source; dch -v version; bzr bd-do
[08:42] <seb128> robert_ancell, bzr bd-do will download the upstream tarball for you, unpack the source with the debian dir and put you in the unpacked source
[08:42] <didrocks> seb128: did you confirm it?
[08:42] <seb128> you don't have to download anything or copy any debian dir around
[08:43] <seb128> didrocks, no I didn't try but edubuntu should not be any different?
[08:43] <didrocks> seb128: I don't know, anyway, the main case is working…
[08:43] <didrocks> they should do something special
[08:43] <seb128> didrocks, ok thanks for checking
[08:44] <didrocks> seb128: I'll answer on it and subscribe
[08:44] <seb128> didrocks, thanks!
[08:44] <robert_ancell> seb128, hmm, that certainly is easier
[08:46] <robert_ancell> anyway, gtg, later all!
[08:47] <seb128> see you
[08:47] <didrocks> seb128: yeah, confirmed that if the timestamp of the new image is < to the old one, it won't refresh
[08:47] <didrocks> seb128: maybe that's it for edubuntu wallpaper?
[08:48] <ricotz> pitti, good morning, could you look at this bug, it will also solve the needed rebuild against the newer gio-sharp - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/docky/+bug/757140 - http://people.ubuntu.com/~ricotz/docky/
[08:48] <didrocks> (well != rather)
[08:48] <seb128> why would the timestamp be older though?
[08:49] <didrocks> seb128: yeah, no idea… either that or a setting (name) change case, let's wait what they would answer
[08:59] <seb128> pitti, bug #707592 got a new duplicate, bug #759031
[08:59] <seb128> pitti, should the old one be reopen in such cases?
[09:04] <pitti> seb128: if it's clear that the previous patch didn't fix it, then yes; otherwise a new one might be better
[09:04] <seb128> pitti, do you have any preference for this one?
[09:04] <pitti> will look in a second
[09:06] <seb128> Sweetshark, bug #746375 is a crash which quite some users seem to get
[09:07] <seb128> bryceh_, RAOF, bug #748487 might be worth triaging or sending upstream since quite some users get compiz to crash on it
[09:10] <pitti> seb128: let's keep the new one for now, I'll ask Till
[09:10] <seb128> pitti, thanks
[09:10] <rodrigo_> morning
[09:11] <seb128> hey rodrigo_, how are you?
[09:12] <rodrigo_> hi seb128, I'm fine thanks
[09:13] <Sweetshark> seb128: yeah. that bug is happening in the UNO datatype wrappers, so it while the stacktrace looks the same it might actually be very different root causes.
[09:18] <seb128> Sweetshark, ok, I'm just reviewing the crash bugs which seem to concern quite some users and pinging to be sure someone review those in case that's something that should be fixed for natty
[09:25] <Sweetshark> seb128: although ...
[09:27] <Sweetshark> when opening the attached stacktrace, there are some more clues. But I would still need a scenario to reproduce this, to verify the issue.
[09:30] <seb128> Sweetshark, ok, feel free to ask questions on the bug maybe one of the subscribed users will reply ;-)
[09:32] <seb128> pitti, btw you fixed some apport "crashes" by ignoring setlocale() errors but do you know why setlocale() fails to start?
[09:33] <seb128> like bug #198758 is getting quite some similar cases recently
[09:33] <pitti> seb128: it happens if you set LANG to an invalid value, or uninstall a langpack support
[09:33] <seb128> pitti, I just want to make sure that's it's not indicating we screw locales by some way
[09:33] <pitti> seb128: one instance was that we had a regression in maverick-backports in gdm which set $LANG wrongly
[09:33] <pitti> that was fixed a day afterwards, but it caused a major influx of such bugs
[09:33] <seb128> those are 11.04 duplicates
[09:34] <seb128> I'm wondering if that's a clue that something is wrong in natty
[09:34] <pitti> hm, I got some 5 dupes on bugs like that, nothing that worried me too much yet; does above have more?
[09:34] <seb128> pitti, check the right column
[09:35] <seb128> it has a bunch yes and I've seen similar setlocale crashes on other components
[09:40] <seb128> mvo, could you check on bug #721797
[09:43] <mvo> seb128: sure
[09:43] <seb128> thanks
[09:47] <seb128> glatzor, mvo: btw aptdaemon seems to still get unicode error crash bugs it might be worth checking as well
[09:52] <seb128> mvo, bug #633003 as well
[09:52] <seb128> or bug #635893
[09:52] <seb128> kenvandine, bug #700667 is assigned to you btw
[09:53] <seb128> mvo, sorry it's often your stuff showing the python retracer logs ;-)
[09:54] <glatzor> seb128, thanks. they should be fixed with rev. 615.
[09:56] <seb128> glatzor, ok
[09:58] <mvo> seb128: no worries
[09:58] <seb128> glatzor, bug #759023 btw
[09:58] <seb128> that might be an easy to fix
[09:58] <mvo> seb128: a new aptdaemon is in the queue with a bunch of fixes from glatzor
[09:59]  * mvo hugs glatzor
[10:04] <seb128> glatzor, is bug #753829 fixed in the same commit that bug #745261
[10:04] <seb128> they are in different functions so just checking
[10:56] <chrisccoulson> pitti - is there going to be another language pack upload before final release?
[10:57] <pitti> chrisccoulson: I think yes
[10:57] <chrisccoulson> pitti - excellent. i'm going to put some new xpi's in po2xpi, with a pre-mangled maxVersion (which says 4.0.*)
[10:57] <pitti> seb128: did you sponsor ubuntu-sso-client?
[10:58] <pitti> anyway, was a double upload, I rejected one of it
[10:58] <seb128> pitti, yes, sorry about the double upload local screwing, they are identic so you can drop any of those
[11:36] <chrisccoulson> pitti, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/po2xpi/trunk/revision/60
[11:37] <pitti> chrisccoulson: refresh for final?
[11:37] <chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah. these won't break when we get a 4.0.1 release :)
[11:37] <pitti> nice!
[11:37] <pitti> chrisccoulson: pulled into langpack-o-matic
[11:37] <chrisccoulson> cool, thanks
[11:42] <davmor2> My sansa fuze isn't showing up as a music player in natty like it does in maverick it shows up as a usb mass storage device, what's the package I need to file against please.
[11:44] <pitti> davmor2: media-player-info is a good start
[11:44] <davmor2> pitti: thanks
[11:57] <czajkowski> rodrigo_: youa bout?
[11:58] <rodrigo_> czajkowski, hi
[11:58] <czajkowski> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/json-glib/+bug/756426
[11:59] <czajkowski> rodrigo_: dholbach said you might be able to help with this
[11:59] <rodrigo_> czajkowski, yes, sure
[11:59] <rodrigo_> for maverick?
[11:59] <czajkowski> aye 10.10
[12:00] <rodrigo_> czajkowski, I can submit a merge proposal for that, but we'd need someone to do the SRU
[12:00] <czajkowski> nods
[12:00] <rodrigo_> czajkowski, let me submit the branch and then we subscribe ubuntu-sru
[12:00] <czajkowski> great thanks
[12:00] <rodrigo_> seb128, pitti: that's the process, right?
[12:01] <czajkowski> ajf_: welcome
[12:01] <czajkowski> ajf_: see your bug does get looked at.
[12:01] <czajkowski> rodrigo_: thank you
[12:01] <pitti> rodrigo_: you should get it uploaded to the queue, much faster review turnaround
[12:01] <ajf_> hello, was me that submitted the bug, thanks for looking guys
[12:01] <rodrigo_> pitti, but I need someone to sponsor it
[12:01] <seb128> rodrigo_, is that a sru or a natty upload?
[12:01] <rodrigo_> seb128, a maverick sru -> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/json-glib/+bug/756426
[12:02] <seb128> ok
[12:02] <pitti> rodrigo_: as usual, as around here and/or subscribe ubuntu-sponsors
[12:02] <rodrigo_> just checked, and natty has 0.12, so should be ok
[12:02] <rodrigo_> pitti, ok
[12:02] <seb128> rodrigo_, subscribe the sponsors, I will sponsor it later if nobody else does it before
[12:03] <rodrigo_> seb128, ok, I'll prepare first the branch
[12:03] <rodrigo_> hmm, what's the correct maverick branch?
[12:03] <rodrigo_> ~ubuntu-branches.... ?
[12:04] <pitti> rodrigo_: lp:ubuntu/maverick/json-glib
[12:04] <rodrigo_> ok
[12:04] <rodrigo_> pitti, and the update is for maverick-proposed (in changelog), right?
[12:04] <pitti> ubuntu:maverick/json-glib works as well
[12:04] <pitti> rodrigo_: correct
[12:04] <rodrigo_> ok then
[12:04] <ajf_> yeah natty will be fine, it just causes a problem to apps that use it for serialisation on maverick
[12:11] <chrisccoulson> how does glib handle calling something like g_settings_get_string on a key of a different type, or one which doesn't exist?
[12:11] <chrisccoulson> does the application abort?
[12:12] <chrisccoulson> ^^desrt ;)
[12:13] <rodrigo_> ajf_, czajkowski: do you have a maverick machine?
[12:13] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: if it's one which doesn't have a schema associated, it aborts
[12:14] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, ah, i thought so. thanks
[12:14] <chrisccoulson> so, the mozilla guys are quite justified in being a little bit twitchy about this
[12:14] <czajkowski> nope mne are all natty
[12:14] <ajf_> rodrigo_: yeah I have a VM with me
[12:14] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: they are not alone :)
[12:14] <rodrigo_> ajf_, can you try building my branch, and, if possible, testing it?
[12:15] <ajf_> sure would be happy to help
[12:15] <rodrigo_> ajf_, I tried building it in natty, but it needs old packages not present
[12:15] <rodrigo_> ajf_, ok, let me push it
[12:16] <rodrigo_> ajf_, lp:~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/maverick/json-glib/fix-756426
[12:18] <seb128> didrocks, btw the french translation list is responsive, I fwd the email about the libreoffice wiki for the unity lists earlier and they translated it since
[12:18] <seb128> Sweetshark, ^
[12:18] <seb128> Sweetshark, you got french translations now for libreoffice
[12:19] <dpm> seb128, Sweetshark, could you wait for the LO upload tomorrow? Tomorrow is NonLanguagePackTranslationDeadline, and translators rely on those dates
[12:20] <didrocks> seb128: do you know who acked it?
[12:20] <seb128> didrocks, who acked what? seems bruno did the translations
[12:20] <didrocks> seb128: oh nice!
[12:20] <seb128> didrocks, there is a nicolas who replied on the list to say they conflicted with bruno on one translations and to discuss a wording choice
[12:21] <didrocks> well, at least, there is activity, nice to see that :)
[12:21] <seb128> dpm, sure, I didn't say we should upload I just pointed that we got french translations, those were still lacking
[12:22] <dpm> yeah, no worries, just making sure (in our team we haven't translated them yet :)
[12:22] <seb128> dpm, not sure your email was clear on the list btw since you fwd something with a subject easy to skip over
[12:23] <seb128> I had to fwd it with a note on the french list because it was picked up there
[12:23] <dpm> seb128, actually, that's a good point, let me re-send it with a clarification
[12:23] <seb128> because->before
[12:23] <seb128> dpm, thanks
[12:24] <Sweetshark> dpm, seb128: I will prepare a package with what I have now, and look tommorrow if there are any last minute changes on the wiki.
[12:24] <Sweetshark> LO takes ages to build ...
[12:24] <seb128> didrocks, btw just curious but what difference does the include do?
[12:25] <seb128> didrocks, i.e http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~didrocks/unity/unity-preferences/revision/1116
[12:26] <Sweetshark> would bug 751746 need a FFe?
[12:27] <pitti> Sweetshark: would be nice for coordination at least, as it will also require updates in language-selector
[12:28] <didrocks> seb128: only glib/gi18n-lib.h takes into account GETTEXT_PACKAGE IIRC for each g_dgettext call
[12:28] <dpm> thanks Sweetshark!
[12:28] <seb128> didrocks, well it's built with -DGETTEXT_PACKAGE=... so it ought to be set without include?
[12:29] <pitti> Sweetshark: as the upload will be after NonLanguagePackTranslationDeadline, we need an FFE (but won't be a problem)
[12:31] <didrocks> seb128: the issue isn't GETTEXT_PACKAGE not being set there. Look at /usr/include/glib-2.0/glib/gi18n.h and /usr/include/glib-2.0/glib/gi18n-lib.h. Only the latter reuse GETTEXT_PACKAGE at each _() usage
[12:32] <seb128> didrocks, oh right, gotcha, thanks
[12:32] <didrocks> seb128: yw :)
[12:32] <seb128> didrocks, I always find it confusing to have to do those bindtextdomain, right include, setlocale etc
[12:33] <seb128> didrocks, there should be a "set_translation(domaine, locale)" and be done ;-)
[12:33] <didrocks> seb128: agreed… and we directly see one example of the source of confusion :)
[12:33] <didrocks> seb128: right, one default which can be overriden locally
[12:34] <seb128> didrocks, ok, so I think in principle your fix is wrong but it works so that's ok ;-)
[12:34] <pitti> new ubuntup desktop CDs up for testing
[12:34] <pitti> (last one had a major ubiquity bug)
[12:35] <didrocks> seb128: we are using this header in unity as well
[12:35] <didrocks> seb128: but yeah, we should set the default domain, which we don't do (and don't need with that library)
[12:35] <seb128> didrocks, well I think the idea is that standalone softwares should use gi18n.h and setlocale()
[12:36] <seb128> didrocks, gi18n-lib is as the name indicates for lib which can't just define the domain one since they should not impact on the client code
[12:36] <Sweetshark> pitti: so the issues for 3.3.2-1ubuntu3 will be bug 740815 (has FFe), bug 720716 (needs FFe) and bug 751746 (needs FFe), while we postpone bug 756895 to O.
[12:37] <didrocks> seb128: yeah, I can set_domain then…
[12:37] <seb128> didrocks, don't bother
[12:38] <seb128> didrocks, in practice it should make any difference and even if dgettext is slower than gettext it's not in that capplet that we will see an issue ;-)
[12:38] <didrocks> seb128: heh, right :)
[12:38] <seb128> didrocks, I was rather curious to know if there is any drawbacks of using dgettext, like if it makes the translation be loaded at each call rather than only once
[12:38] <bigon> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/745540 << some ubuntu one dev around?
[12:38] <seb128> didrocks, but it's a non issue for that particular case, I'm just rather curious ;-)
[12:39] <ajf_> rodrigo_: verified it works fine, thanks :)
[12:39] <rodrigo_> ajf_, ok, submitting the merge proposal, thanks!
[12:39] <ajf_> :D
[12:40] <seb128> bigon, try asking dobey
[12:40] <pitti> Sweetshark: thanks; I just approved 720716 (quicklists), and updating 751746 (icelandic); for the latter, is the package name fixed?
[12:40] <pitti> Sweetshark: I mean "won't change" and "I can commit that to lang-sel"
[12:41] <didrocks> seb128: as I'm picky, I did rev 1118 :)
[12:41] <seb128> didrocks, ;-)
[12:42] <pitti> Sweetshark: nevermind, lang-sel is fine as it is
[12:42] <didrocks> seb128: btw, the glib documentation is quite ironic with the example including the wrong header: http://developer.gnome.org/glib/2.28/glib-I18N.html
[12:43] <seb128> didrocks, it's a library example they have (gtk)
[12:44] <didrocks> seb128: oh yeah, I got puzzled by the sypnosis :)
[12:44] <bigon> dobey: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/745540 << could you have alook at that? gnome-keyring 3.0 breaks backward compatibility
[12:44] <rodrigo_> please someone review/upload this: https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/maverick/json-glib/fix-756426/+merge/57474
[12:44] <seb128> rodrigo_, ok
[12:45] <rodrigo_> seb128, thanks
[12:46] <seb128> rodrigo_, yw
[12:46] <seb128> rodrigo_, btw can you take on some other bugs?
[12:46] <rodrigo_> seb128, yes
[12:48] <seb128> rodrigo_, I've noticed yesterday we still have work items on https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-desktop-n-gnome3 to handle some applets deprecation on upgrade
[12:48] <rodrigo_> hmm, /me looks
[12:48] <seb128> if you want to have a look to that
[12:48] <rodrigo_> yes, sure
[12:49] <seb128> rodrigo_, we stopped building some, I think gnome-applets has a list of ones to ignore so gnome-panel doesn't try to load them and display and error on first logging after upgrade
[12:49] <seb128> rodrigo_, otherwise bug #743176 might be worth checking if it's easy to backport and if the GNOME3 version fixes the issue
[12:50] <seb128> rodrigo_, bug #723841 got some affect users as well
[12:50] <seb128> rodrigo_, well random things that need work so feel free to pick any of those
[12:50] <seb128> rodrigo_, you still have the e-d-s-addressbook crash and the g-s-d race as well
[12:51] <seb128> rodrigo_, those added should be enough to keep you busy I think ;-)
[12:51] <rodrigo_> seb128, yes, debugging those with the users
[12:51] <Sweetshark> is there a way to mark bug 759704 as "patch available" without copying the patch over from the upstream bugzilla?
[12:51] <Sweetshark> meh
[12:52] <Sweetshark> is there a way to mark bug 759704 as "patch available" without copying the patch over from the upstream bugzilla?
[12:52] <pitti> Sweetshark: set it to "fix committed"?
[12:52] <pitti> "it" -> the ubuntu task
[12:53] <seb128> Sweetshark, you can also subscribe ubuntu-sponsors if what you want is it reviewed and maybe uploaded
[12:54] <Sweetshark> pitti: not debian upstream, but FSF upstream
[12:54] <rodrigo_> seb128, hmm, in https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-desktop-n-gnome3 , what work items were you referring to?
[12:55] <rodrigo_> ah, those 2:
[12:55] <rodrigo_> handle gdm user switch applet deprecation on update:
[12:55] <rodrigo_> handle tomboy applet deprecation on update:
[12:55] <rodrigo_> right?
[12:56] <seb128> rodrigo_, right
[12:56] <rodrigo_> ok
[13:01] <didrocks> pitti: so I saw the other day your comment https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/754583/comments/17 (didn't have the time to answer sooner). I think it's mpt who made some drawing and it respects it.
[13:11]  * rodrigo_ lunch
[13:32] <seb128> hum
[13:32] <seb128> could somebody check if gnome-sound-recorder works with appmenu for you?
[13:32] <Sweetshark> dpm: Im a bit unhappy about the providied translations for "Name" at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/Wanted/LibreOfficeBase and friends. I would have assumed those to be only transcripted for nonlatin alphabets and be kept as a proper name unchanged for langs using latin alphabets. Am I allowed to change that when commiting it?
[13:33] <seb128> didrocks, mterry: ?
[13:33] <Sweetshark> (well, the exception is that "LibreOffice Base" is "BrOffice Base" in pt_BR for historic reasons)
[13:34] <mterry> seb128, hi
[13:34] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - it's working here
[13:34] <seb128> hey mterry
[13:34] <seb128> hum k, doesn't work for me
[13:34] <mterry> seb128, works here too (classic gnome)
[13:34] <seb128> but I've double menus activated on my session
[13:35] <didrocks> seb128: works as well
[13:35] <seb128> not sure if that can make a difference
[13:35] <seb128> thanks for checking
[13:38] <dpm> Sweetshark, which one in particular? You mean the 'te' one in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/Wanted/LibreOfficeBase, where they've translated LibreOffice as well? If the name is not translatable due to licensing issues, we might want to add a notice to the page. As per changing it back, if necessary by all means, but I'd give a heads up to the translators who did the actual translations, as otherwise they might not be happy to get their translat
[13:38] <dpm> ions reverted without any notice
[13:40] <Ampelbein> hi there, bug 754461 got 5 duplicates since libnux 0.9.42-0ubuntu1 (which fixed it according to changelog) has been uploaded.
[13:41] <seb128> Ampelbein, it was not really fixed but it's fix commited in trunk and will be in natty tomorrow
[13:41] <Ampelbein> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nux/+bug/754461/comments/7
[13:42] <seb128> Ampelbein, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity/trunk/revision/1117
[13:42] <seb128> is the fix if you want to try it
[13:42] <Ampelbein> oh, so the upload closed the wrong bug?
[13:42] <dpm> Sweetshark, yeah, so if we're talking about 'LibreOffice', this only affects the Telugu 'te' translations, doesn't it?
[13:43] <seb128> Ampelbein, no, they though it was fixed but it was not
[13:43] <seb128> Ampelbein, it has been really fixed since
[13:43] <seb128> will land tomorrow
[13:43] <Ampelbein> ah, now I get it
[13:43] <Ampelbein> seb128: thanks.
[13:43] <seb128> tkamppeter_, hi, is the fact that system-config-printer is lacking lot of translations known?
[13:43] <Sweetshark> dpm: no 'te' is fine for me, as it is a nonlatin rendering. Someone using that local might not be able to read latin. I mean the 'de' and 'nl' translations as they are changing a "product name" "LibreOffice Base" -> "LibreOffice Datenbanken" ...
[13:45] <dpm> Sweetshark, we used to do that in OO in the original strings already (change the product name). Why is this a problem with LO (I'm not disputing it, I'm just asking)? Translators are used to translate the LO entries as they translated the OO entries, I guess
[13:45] <dpm> For the record, I was going to translate "LibreOffice Base" to "Bases de dades del LibreOffice" as well :)
[13:47] <dpm> to a Catalan user the product name won't tell him/her anything, where as that translation will let him/her know what the launcher is about
[13:48] <Sweetshark> Well, of course we can do whatever we want with the translations, but I assumed "Name" to be an abstract name that is only translated on nonlatin alphabets (or when the product name differs(, while "Generic Name" is a descriptive one.
[13:50] <Sweetshark> I just know, that I would like to have upstreamed the translations, and there I know it will cause arguments if "Name" is traslated too.
[13:50] <seb128> the issue there is that i.e gnome-panel menus display the Name=
[13:52] <seb128> dpm, pitti: we have a small issue with gnome-user-share, it was demoted by error and repromoted during the cycle but didn't get a rebuild, side effect is that it ships its translations and that rosetta has no template for it, I guess we should keep it this way for natty?
[13:53] <seb128> dpm, pitti: it seems a bit tight schedule to do a non change upload, if translations are slow to be important as is the template we might get stripped binaries and not langpacks?
[13:54] <pitti> seb128: no-change upload seems fine
[13:54] <dpm> Sweetshark, yeah, but if I'm not mistaken 'Name' is what is shown in the launcher. And many teams translate other product names anyway. I.e. the 'Calculator' in gcalc is also translated. When upstreaming the translations, who do you thik will argue? The LO developers or the LO upstream translators? Notice that some of the people that submitted the .desktop entry translations for Ubuntu are also upstream LO/OO translators
[13:55] <dpm> seb128, if it was demoted, the template had to be deactivated manually. I didn't notice it and didn't do it, so we might be in luck and it might still be in rosetta. Let me check...
[13:56] <seb128> dpm, https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/gnome-user-share
[13:56] <seb128> dpm, it was demoted in 10.10...
[13:56] <dpm> ah, in that case it won't be in natty
[13:56] <dpm> yeah
[13:56] <seb128> dpm, pitti: well are we sure that the template and the translations will be in rosetta before the next export?
[13:56] <pitti> I don't know
[13:57] <seb128> ok, so better to play safe and keep it this way? side effect is that one string comes from a distro patch and so can't be translated
[13:57] <seb128> one other option would to upload with the variable set to not have the translations stripped
[13:57] <dpm> seb128, pitti, we don't know, but the last export is in ~9 days, and as a rule of thumb imports are taking 1-2 days, so I'd assume it should work out
[13:57] <seb128> so we can get at least the translations imported?
[13:58] <seb128> dpm, should we do an upload non stripped for now and redo one stripped later if we see translation being in place on time?
[14:00] <chrisccoulson> hmmm
[14:00] <chrisccoulson> i just noticed that the greasemonkey submenu in firefox shows lots of separators
[14:00] <chrisccoulson> does anyone else see that?
[14:02] <seb128> dpm, do you need to manually approve the template if I do that?
[14:02] <seb128> chrisccoulson, confirmed
[14:03] <chrisccoulson> seb128, thanks
[14:03] <dpm> seb128, I'm not sure I follow. Is it now possible to upload the package without its translations being stripped and at the same time get the template built and imported into LP? If that is the case, yeah, I'd go for that + a latter upload when the template is imported. Yes, any new template needs to be approved manually, unfortunately, but it's a matter of seconds
[14:04] <chrisccoulson> how do we get ubottu in to our IRC channel? he seems to have gone AWOL
[14:04] <seb128> dpm, oh you have a point, what about I do a normal upload and if we see it's not going to be ready for the export I redo one without stripping monday or something?
[14:05] <seb128> chrisccoulson, we have an ubot now which does the job as well?
[14:05] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, any bot is fine :)
[14:05] <dpm> seb128, yeah, let's go for that (normal upload + fallback non-stripping upload if necessary). I think it should work out
[14:05] <chrisccoulson> we don't have any in #ubuntu-mozillateam
[14:05] <seb128> dpm, thanks
[14:06] <seb128> chrisccoulson, I had to ask on #ubuntu-devel to get it back
[14:06] <seb128> dholbach pointed to someone who made it join
[14:06] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks
[14:09] <tkamppeter> seb128, I did not know that s-c-p lacks translations, no one reported a bug about seeing untranslated text.
[14:10] <seb128> tkamppeter, do you want one? the Server, Group, View etc menus are not translated in french, nor are most of the add  printer dialog strings
[14:11] <tkamppeter> seb128, there is only a bug with a crash happeing with setlocale(), bug 748964, and Tim Waugh cannot reproduce it on Red Hat.
[14:11] <seb128> tkamppeter, like Host, Enter device URI, the serial settings
[14:11] <seb128> tkamppeter, those strings are not even on the rosetta templace
[14:12] <seb128> SMB Printer, Queue, the smb example
[14:12] <seb128> tkamppeter, do you have those translated?
[14:12] <tkamppeter> seb128, strange that no one reported a bug. 1.3.x ios in Natty for a longer tiome now.
[14:12] <tkamppeter> seb128, I use an English interface, not German.
[14:13] <seb128> tkamppeter, ok, I will open a bug
[14:14] <tkamppeter> seb128, do you know someone who is more expert on Python apps with translations who could help here?
[14:15] <seb128> tkamppeter, let me check on what the issue can be there first, those strings are not on the launchpad translation template so it could be a packaging bug
[14:18] <tkamppeter> seb128, the original "make install" produces the translations in the usual /usr/share/locale/<language>/LC_MESSAGES/system-config-printer.mo
[14:19] <seb128> right
[14:28] <dobey> bigon: ugh
[14:29] <seb128> tkamppeter, ok, I found the issue
[14:30] <seb128> tkamppeter, the .ui listed in po/POTFILES.in need to have a [type: gettext/glade] on the start of their lines
[14:30] <bigon> dobey: should use python-gnomekeyring ?
[14:30] <seb128> tkamppeter, it means basically that none of the gtkbuilder strings are translatable at the moment
[14:30] <seb128> tkamppeter, do you want me to upload a fix?
[14:30] <seb128> tkamppeter, or do you prefer a patch in a bug
[14:31] <seb128> dpm, ^ we will have 212 new strings to translate in system-config-printer once that's fixed btw
[14:33] <tkamppeter> seb128, I have uploaded system-config-printer_1.3.1+20110222-0ubuntu14 and it waits for approval (to fix several crashers), should I upload -0ubuntu15 with this fix or should we reject the current 0ubuntu14 and I upload a new 0ubuntu14 with the translation fix added? Or will you simply upload a 0ubuntu15 (you probably know much better where to insert this [type: gettext/glade]).
[14:34] <seb128> tkamppeter, let's upload a 0ubuntu15 with that fix, I can do that if you want, I will open a bug with the diff as well so you can forward it to upstream as well
[14:34] <dobey> bigon: no. we use the fd.o secrets API so we can eventually work with both keyring and kwallet, and anything else that implements it
[14:35] <seb128> no nessita today?
[14:35] <seb128> she's next on my translator complain list
[14:35] <tkamppeter> seb128, OK, then approve the 0ubuntu14 and upload the 0ubuntu15 after that. Please tell me the bug number which contains the diff for upstream.
[14:36] <seb128> tkamppeter, I will upload 0ubuntu15 they will both get in after the freeze
[14:36] <seb128> dpm, can you manually upload http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/system-config-printer.pot please?
[14:36] <seb128> dpm, it's a template that will make system-config-printer actually translatable for its gtkbuilder uis
[14:37] <bigon> dobey: ok well you could contact stefw (but he told me that the specification still (or was) a draft)
[14:39] <dobey> bigon: well we don't claim to work with gnome3 either. if keyring broke compatibility as well at that level, i'm sure there are lots of things based on 2.x that don't work with it
[14:39] <rickspencer3> pitti, seb128, everyboyd ... beta 2, word on teh street?
[14:39] <rickspencer3> didrocks, ^
[14:39] <rickspencer3> mot dans la rue?
[14:40] <didrocks> rickspencer3: le "mot de la rue" is pretty good unity side :)
[14:40] <didrocks> rickspencer3: got a common crash fixed in bamf yesterday
[14:40] <didrocks> still wait on post-beta2 to hopefully get the ccsm crash away
[14:40] <rickspencer3> didrocks, right, last upload for beta 2, unless something changed after I left
[14:41] <rickspencer3> didrocks, will we be easily able to detect crashers on Friday that are new to us for beta 2?
[14:41] <seb128> rickspencer3, desktop and unity seems solid, I didn't follow the details about the wubi and ubiquity issues
[14:41] <didrocks> rickspencer3: seems there is a respin with a new ubiquity though
[14:41] <bigon> dobey: indeed but I guess this will have to be fixed at some point :)
[14:41] <rickspencer3> in other words, will it be easy to see on Friday from the crash reports if we know about all the crashers?
[14:41] <seb128> rickspencer3, crashers yes, I do a review of the retracers log twice a day
[14:42] <rickspencer3> seb128, <3
[14:42] <seb128> rickspencer3, dx and didrocks watch the bug reports as well
[14:42] <seb128> so I think those combined give us pretty nice coverage
[14:42] <rickspencer3> seb128, well, I was wondering more at the numeric level
[14:42] <didrocks> rickspencer3: if we can get the ccsm fixes for next upload, yeah, crashers will be way more clear
[14:42] <rickspencer3> it doesn't sound automated
[14:42] <rickspencer3> but, nice work!
[14:42] <dobey> bigon: does ubuntu-sso-client 1.2.1 work btw?
[14:42] <seb128> rickspencer3, well my review tell me which bugs got duplicates since the previous review and the count
[14:42] <rickspencer3> seb128, ok, sweet
[14:43] <rickspencer3> so, people are saying that Unity/desktop is looking good
[14:43] <seb128> rickspencer3, it's pretty much automated, I run a grep sort uniq -c magic on the log and they give be a list of bugs ranked with their dup count
[14:43] <rickspencer3> seb128, have you heard about wubi and ubiquity from users and bug reports?
[14:43] <bigon> dobey: 1.2.0-0ubuntu1 here on natty
[14:44] <seb128> rickspencer3, better to check with pitti about those, I noticed they had some issues and they had to do a respin but I'm not sure where we stand exactly
[14:44] <rickspencer3> ok seb128, I was just wondering
[14:44] <seb128> ok "dunno" then ;-)
[14:44] <rickspencer3> fwiw, 11.04 is rock solid for me, and a complete joy to use
[14:45] <dpm> seb128, done: https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/system-config-printer/+imports?field.filter_status=all&field.filter_extension=pot
[14:45] <rickspencer3> some nits in applications here and there, but Ubuntu itself is crazy great for me
[14:45]  * rickspencer3 goes to test if his beamer crasher on his netbook is fixed
[14:46] <seb128> dpm, you rock thanks, could you also drop an email to the translators about it to say we are sorry about the issue and that they have some 212 strings to translate?
[14:46] <seb128> dpm, well none of them raised the issue earlier seems there is no bug about it so not sure how testing we get
[14:48] <dpm> seb128, sure, will do in a bit, btw, is this a bug in the template creation in the package, or what was it?
[14:48] <seb128> tkamppeter, ok, bug #759811
[14:49] <seb128> tkamppeter, do you want to apply and upload the patch yourself or should I do it? since you have your recent upload locally you can probably easily apply it and do a 0ubuntu15?
[14:49] <seb128> dpm, thanks, bug #759811 it was
[14:50] <seb128> dpm, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/69240103/system-config-printer.patch
[14:50] <dpm> seb128, ok, thanks
[14:50] <seb128> dpm, basically if you don't tell intltool how to parse gtkbuilder files it ignore those
[14:51] <dpm> ah, yeah, I've seen similar bugs in the past
[14:52] <seb128> dpm, the pot I gave you is generated with the fixed version and should be fine, I verified it lists Queue: and some of the strings which are obviously not translated in the current versions
[14:55] <dpm> seb128, ok, cool
[14:56] <tkamppeter> seb128, OK, I will upload it. Please approve 0ubuntu14, so that I can upload 0ubuntu15.
[14:57] <seb128> tkamppeter, no need to have it approved to have a new version on the queue they will both stay there and be accepted after beta2, thanks
[14:57] <tkamppeter> seb128, OK, and thanks for the patch.
[14:58] <seb128> tkamppeter, you're welcome
[15:45] <rodrigo_> can someone please review/merge/upload this: https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/gnome-applets/handle-deprecated-applets/+merge/57498 ?
[16:12] <seb128> rodrigo_, otp right now but I can do that after that call
[16:13] <rodrigo_> seb128, no hurry, do it when you can, thanks :-)
[16:21] <mvo> eh, so after a upgrade I now get a "your hardware is not capable of running unity, choose clasic". but when I press classic I get traditional anyway
[16:32] <seb128> mvo, you mean?
[16:34] <mvo> well, it tells me that in order to get my normal environment I need to log into classic but when I close I get classic (and the message appears never again). that is a bit odd
[16:35]  * mvo tries to find the message again for the exact wording
[16:36] <seb128> mvo, right the idea is that it sends you to classic but doesn't change your session
[16:36] <seb128> mvo, so on next login you would have unity again and the same dialog
[16:37] <seb128> until you pick classic in gdm
[16:38] <seb128> it's to avoid switching users to G
[16:38] <seb128> GNOME just because they didn't have the binary drivers on after first login
[16:41] <mvo> ok, what package generates the message? its gone now for me for some reason but when reading it first I was confused and I would like to re-read again to see if it was the message or me
[16:44] <seb128> mvo, gnome-session
[16:46] <seb128> mvo, see /usr/share/gnome-session/sessions/ubuntu.session
[16:46] <seb128> the FallbackClassicGnomeMessage key
[16:46] <seb128> Laney, do you have any clue about bug #738039 or similar?
[16:47] <mvo> thanks! well, I find the message not ideal, it tells me to choose classic to see the classic environment but then just continues and give me the classic environment. but its a really minor point, just struck me as odd
[16:47] <didrocks> there is a gconf key to make it reapparing
[16:48] <seb128> Laney, those seem to be "WARNING **: Could not load file or assembly 'Mono.Security, Version=<IP_ADDRESS>, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=0738eb9f132ed756' or one of its dependencies." and similar errors
[16:48] <seb128> lpi also has a bunch of similar bugs
[16:53] <seb128> mvo, right, I can understand that, how would you suggest improving it?
[16:54] <seb128> mvo, the dialog should perhaps say "you will be sent in the classic session but pick it on the login screen to avoid getting this dialog at every login"
[16:57] <mvo> I guess a native speaker should loo kat it :) but your version is cleaner already I thnk. I see the message only once here in my test
[16:57] <mvo> not sure if my test box is wrong (or missed a upgrade of a package or something)
[16:57] <Laney> seb128: looking
[16:59] <seb128> Laney, thanks
[17:00] <seb128> Laney, we didn't get lot of recents ones so maybe it was a breakage in natty which got fixed since?
[17:00] <seb128> didrocks, so we default to show it only once?
[17:00]  * vish wonders how kenvandine makes his hackergotchi display in evolution message header for this one » https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-doc/2011-April/015540.html
[17:01] <seb128> but right, mvo has a point, we should just say that the classic session will be used for video driver reasons
[17:01] <didrocks> seb128: yes, we do, there is a gconf key to control that behavior
[17:03] <seb128> dpm, https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/gnome-user-share/+imports
[17:04] <seb128> dpm, do you need to approve those?
[17:04] <seb128> dpm, the 5th ones is the template in that list
[17:09] <dpm> seb128, done. Let's see how long it takes to change state to Imported
[17:09] <seb128> dpm, thanks
[17:11] <seb128> dpm, https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/gnome-user-share
[17:11] <seb128> dpm, it's imported \o/
[17:13] <Sweetshark> hmmm, bug 746375 seems to cause a bamfdeamon crash.
[17:13] <dpm> seb128, oh excellent, the imports queue must have been empty, so we were in luck ;)
[17:13] <Sweetshark> (that is before crashing LO)
[17:14] <seb128> Sweetshark, did your upgrade today?
[17:14] <Sweetshark> seb128: yes
[17:14] <seb128> what bamfdaemon version do you have installed?
[17:14] <seb128> the libreoffice crash issue should have been fixed yesterday evening with 0ubuntu2
[17:15] <seb128> did you restart unity since the upgrade?
[17:15] <Sweetshark> seb128: still at ubuntu1. I will update and restart the session.
[17:16] <seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
[17:16] <seb128> Sweetshark, no need to restart the session if you don't want to, just run "unity"
[17:17] <Sweetshark> seb128: looking good
[17:18] <seb128> ok ;-)
[17:20] <kenvandine> vish, not sure... i think it just uses the face set in gnome-about-me
[17:21] <vish> kenvandine: ah! yea, messages header has the section filled for "Face: "
[17:23] <kenvandine> i keep telling people that evolution is cool :)
[17:23] <kenvandine> nobody seems to believe me though
[17:23] <vish> ;)
[17:28] <JanC> kenvandine: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gwibber/+bug/701723/comments/12 <-- I think I found the reason why gwibber doesn't work after upgrading for several people?
[17:28] <kenvandine> JanC, oh?
[17:28] <kenvandine> i was just debugging that
[17:29] <JanC> on upgrade teh backends don't (always?) get installed
[17:29] <kenvandine> yeah, that is really annoying
[17:29] <kenvandine> but
[17:29] <kenvandine> even if i remove the backends
[17:29] <kenvandine> i don't get that error
[17:29] <davmor2> kenvandine: btw  gwibber lens fantastic but why does it open the website if you click on a tweet rather than opening gwibber?
[17:29] <JanC> oh, I did get them until I installed the backends
[17:30] <kenvandine> davmor2, too late to make gwibber able to handle them
[17:30] <kenvandine> davmor2, that will come next cycle :)
[17:30] <kenvandine> JanC, humm
[17:30] <kenvandine> i removed buzz and didn't get the traceback
[17:30] <kenvandine> but... then again my buzz feed is empty
[17:30] <JanC> kenvandine: are the backends supposed to be installed on upgrade?
[17:31] <kenvandine> since i have never been able to get buzz working with my google account
[17:31] <davmor2> kenvandine: Ah man I can't wait for 11.10 are we nearly there yet ;)
[17:31] <JanC> I had an identica account
[17:31] <micahg> is there a way to debug something not launching from places or the unity launcher, but does from the cli?
[17:31] <kenvandine> JanC, no... apt doesn't install Recommends on upgrade
[17:32] <JanC> well, update-manager could do some magic, I suppose  ;)
[17:33] <kenvandine> JanC, ok, i can reproduce it if i remove other plugins
[17:34] <JanC> kenvandine: if gwibber could launch USC for missing backends that would be cool  ;)
[17:34] <JanC> but probably not possible before the release
[17:34] <kenvandine> probably too late to add a feature like that :/
[17:34] <JanC> in any case a dialog window would be immensely more useful than crashing without any feedback to the user
[17:35] <kenvandine> well i'll fix this failure
[17:35] <kenvandine> i thought i had caught them all
[17:35] <kenvandine> man i hate python-mako
[17:35] <kenvandine> those tracebacks have no relation to the actual mako templates
[17:37] <JanC> well, can't you just check for missing backends before you get that far?
[17:38] <kenvandine> it isn't that
[17:38] <kenvandine> the problem is something in the template that needs the service icon
[17:38] <kenvandine> and the icon isn't installed
[17:38] <seb128> kenvandine, new recommends should be installed on upgrade
[17:38] <kenvandine> actually, no... that isn't it
[17:38] <seb128> check with mvo
[17:38] <kenvandine> it isn't in the features list
[17:39] <seb128> though it's not new we get bugs about that
[17:39] <kenvandine> seb128, yeah... it did for me at least a couple times
[17:39] <kenvandine> but i also saw it fail
[17:39] <kenvandine> i think it might be dist-upgrade vs. upgrade vs. update-manager
[17:39] <JanC> if it matters, I have "install recommends" disabled
[17:39] <kenvandine> different behavior depending on how you get there
[17:40] <kenvandine> JanC, yeah... so it will bite you for sure
[17:40] <kenvandine> i think if you do a apt-get upgrade
[17:40] <kenvandine> you won't get them either
[17:40] <kenvandine> but it won't hold it back... so you don't get it on the next dist-upgrade
[17:41] <JanC> maybe you should have made gwibber-service a transitional package for upgrades that hard-depends on all backends (that existed in maverick)
[17:42] <JanC> but I guess it's too late for that too
[17:43] <kenvandine> during the alphas, i had hoped to get more feedback on the transition
[17:43] <kenvandine> to see how much it bit people
[17:43] <kenvandine> most users only use a couple of the services
[17:43] <JanC> I guess I don't use gwibber a lot  ;-)
[17:44] <JanC> so I just found out today
[17:44] <kenvandine> and some of the other services are rather buggy, and i would rather users not have them unless they take the trouble to install them
[17:44] <kenvandine> like buzz
[17:44] <kenvandine> JanC, well i am glad you used it today :)
[17:44] <JanC> anyway, *any* error dialog (not in the terminal, which most users don't use) is better than nothing
[17:44] <kenvandine> some users swear that buzz works in gwibber
[17:44] <kenvandine> but i have never gotten it to work!
[17:44] <JanC> lol
[17:45] <kenvandine> so i am not thrilled with supporting it :)
[17:45] <kenvandine> segphault says it is something messed up with my google account
[17:45] <kenvandine> but i have several accounts, it fails for all of them
[17:46] <kenvandine> but i have seen a screencast of it working for a user... so it must kind of work :-p
[17:49] <kenvandine> JanC, ok, i have a fix
[18:04] <dpm> hey kamstrup, all set for your appdeveloperweek session later on?
[18:08] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, how long have i been gone? i didn't realize xchat had crashed :/
[18:09] <kenvandine> chrisccoulson, looks like about 2 hours
[18:09] <kenvandine> :)
[18:09] <chrisccoulson> lol
[18:09] <chrisccoulson> oh well ;)
[18:10] <seb128> hey nessita
[18:10] <seb128> nessita, stop closing my bugs! ;-)
[18:12] <nessita> seb128: :-D
[18:12] <nessita> seb128: stop reporting known issues! :-P
[18:12] <nessita> thanks, BTW, for the bugs and the releases
[18:12] <seb128> nessita, well I checked for open bugs but you duplicates from closed bugs
[18:12] <nessita> yeah
[18:13] <seb128> nessita, I'm not really happy about the fact that those got closed without keeping any bug to track those issues still
[18:13] <seb128> nessita, I don't care much that the datas come from the server or not the fact that they are not translated is a bug somewhere and should be recorded
[18:13] <nessita> seb128: what do you suggest? I'm open to suggestions to improve the workflow
[18:13] <seb128> nessita, ;-)
[18:13] <seb128> nessita, to have a bug open against the server if needed but still there is a bug somewhere so the request is valid
[18:14] <nessita> seb128: fair enough, let me dig into the server bugs (there should be one already)
[18:14] <seb128> nessita, if there is one don't bother to search for the number I will take your word for it ;-)
[18:15] <nessita> seb128: I'm not sure, so if there isn't one I'll create one
[18:15] <seb128> nessita, or just reassign mine to the server component?
[18:16] <seb128> nessita, btw I think the splash screen thing is just weird, it doesn't look like a splash screen, it's like the dialog load show something and flicker before you have time to see what was in it
[18:17] <kenvandine> woot, someone just contributed a sina plugin to gwibber, sina is like twitter in china
[18:17] <nessita> seb128: I'm thinking possible solutions
[18:17] <kenvandine> since china blocks twitter
[18:19] <mvo> kenvandine: what is/was the problem? sorry, missed the earlier bits
[18:21] <kenvandine> mvo, now that the gwibber plugins are split out and are "Recommends"
[18:21] <kenvandine> some people don't get them on upgrade
[18:22] <mvo> kenvandine: the only time that I can see this happen if e.g. because of a arch:all vs arch:any mismatch its not availabe yet, then apt will skip the recommend
[18:22] <mvo> kenvandine: I could add magic to u-m to double check, but generally apt should just install it
[18:22] <kenvandine> mvo, it would happen on apt-get upgrade right?
[18:22] <kenvandine> dist-upgrade would pull them in
[18:23] <kenvandine> but not upgrade
[18:23] <kenvandine> right?
[18:23] <mvo> kenvandine: thats true
[18:24] <kenvandine> mvo, i think we are fine, i just fixed another bug related to having accounts for a service that isn't installed
[18:25] <mvo> ok
[18:29] <nessita> seb128: seems like there is no specific bug for the storage/service info, so I'll reopen yours and affect u1servers
[18:29] <seb128> nessita, thanks a lot!
[18:30] <nessita> thank you!
[18:41] <pitti> good night everyone, Taekwondo time
[18:43] <didrocks> pitti: enjoy!
[18:45] <didrocks> dinner time here, see you!
[19:36] <jbicha> hi, I've got a small bugfix for the gnome3 PPA if someone wants to take a look: https://code.launchpad.net/~jbicha/ubuntu/natty/gnome-control-center/fix-for-759382
[19:39] <seb128> mterry, hey
[19:39] <seb128> mterry, your valgrind instructions will not work the applet or unity will reactivate the service before valgrind starts
[19:40] <seb128> mterry, usually what I do is to gdb --pid $(pidof unity-panel-service) before
[19:40] <seb128> or under GNOME unload the applet
[19:40] <mterry> seb128, for the application service?  I don't usually see it started automatically
[19:40] <mterry> seb128, for the panel-service I agree
[19:41] <mterry> brb
[19:41] <seb128> mterry, weird, usually any indicator service is restarted when there is a renderer displaying it
[19:54] <kenvandine> kind of loving some of the inflow of new gwibber bugs this week, just wish it was a month ago :/
[19:54] <kenvandine> seems we just had a big boom of users upgrade to natty
[20:00] <cyphermox> kenvandine, I'm seeing the same re: networkmanager and 3g dongles... with it was a month ago yeah ;)
[20:01] <kenvandine> got some really useful bug reports this week... and fixes queued up :)
[20:01] <kenvandine> which is great
[20:04] <davmor2> kenvandine: a lot of people were told to try it but not install it so possibly didn't have it on long enough to try gwibber to any extent
[20:58] <dobey> rodrigo_: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/593729/
[21:03] <bcurtiswx> kenvandine, empathy is spotless, not a single new complaint..... of course I was dreaming that..
[21:04] <bcurtiswx> there's a nasty facebook certificate bug, plus the action of "save my selection" doesn't work.  Waiting for upstream to get the 2nd part of that taken care of :)
[21:06] <kenvandine> bcurtiswx, yeah... that is annoying
[21:08] <dobey> i'm sure i could come up with some complaints if you think they're lacking :)
[21:08]  * bcurtiswx hides in corner
[22:13] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, the greasmonkey menu issue is a bit of a pain
[22:14] <peteris> hi, is there from launchpad gnome3-team? Can I help with reporting bugs about PPA packages? Or it's not worth that
[23:07] <pitti> night everyone
[23:07] <seb128> 'night pitti
[23:10] <rickspencer3> 'night pitti