[00:12] <cyberanger> hard to say which
[00:12] <cyberanger> maybe both
[00:12]  * cyberanger just finished watching the social network
[03:33] <wrst> how was it cyberanger?
[03:41] <cyberanger> well, it was intresting
[03:42] <cyberanger> I liked the fact they metioned linux tools in reasonable ways
[03:42] <cyberanger> and kept it to linux too
[03:43] <cyberanger> not to metion the inner bits that was intresting, metioning the race in london, watched live on facebook
[03:44] <wrst> cool cyberanger, well off to bed i go see you tomorrow!
[03:46] <cyberanger> wrst: see ya
[04:19] <exodus_ms> What ever happened to binarymutant?
[04:19] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: hard to say
[04:20] <cyberanger> similar to you I suppose
[04:20] <cyberanger> circumstances got in the way
[04:20] <exodus_ms> The last I was on here regularly was prolly a year ago
[04:20] <exodus_ms> Ah, gotcha
[04:20] <cyberanger> your case you came back, his case idk
[04:21] <exodus_ms> Yeah, I had to take a break. Put my focus on other things
[04:21] <cyberanger> yeah, he had some issues between him and his ISP (and I could assume his wallet same as my own for awhile, mainly feb to july)
[04:22] <jfenn2199> Evening all
[04:22] <cyberanger> I meant like I did feb to july
[04:22] <cyberanger> hey jfenn2199
[04:22] <exodus_ms> Evening jfenn2199
[04:23] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: I was on most nights, hung out at hotspots and such, the word addicted comes to mind, all three of us had bigger fish to fry
[04:23] <exodus_ms> I still don't have internet at home. Using my phone atm
[04:23] <cyberanger> and another word comes to mind, stubborn, I was too stubborn to let lack of a good connection stop me
[04:23] <jfenn2199> How goes cyberanger and exodus_ms (long time no see)
[04:23] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: can't blame you, I'd do the same here, and probally will again
[04:24] <cyberanger> jfenn2199: reasonable
[04:24] <cyberanger> messing with tor
[04:24] <exodus_ms> Pretty good. At work still, bout 30 more mins to go :)
[04:24] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: I thought you couldn't use it at work
[04:24] <cyberanger> work still is out at arnold right?
[04:25] <jfenn2199> Sounds good I've been out for 5 hours if you don't count the public transit commute
[04:25] <exodus_ms> Using my phone
[04:26] <exodus_ms> cyberanger I still work at AEDC, using my phone to chat
[04:26] <cyberanger> jfenn2199: I would
[04:26] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: suprised they let you
[04:27] <cyberanger> guess you've got some weaker policies than others I know
[04:28] <cyberanger> fear of a roving bug threats I guess
[04:28] <jfenn2199> At my work we're not supposed to be on our phones but since I got all but one person to get an Android phone even my manager is always on his
[04:28] <cyberanger> lol
[04:29] <jfenn2199> It was funny after I got mine every 3 months someone else was getting one
[04:29] <jfenn2199> I'm about to upgrade to an Epic
[04:29] <cyberanger> I'm gonna just upgrade the software of mine for now
[04:29] <cyberanger> gingerbread
[04:30] <cyberanger> I still want to get a Nokia N900
[04:30] <jfenn2199> Well the moment I don't think will handle froyo and sprint let's me get a new one every year so why not
[04:30] <jfenn2199> Symbian?
[04:31] <jfenn2199> (Sorry don't feel like going to google)
[04:31] <cyberanger> no, was Maemo
[04:31] <jfenn2199> Ok
[04:31] <cyberanger> well, I guess still is, but I can dev it for Meego
[04:31] <cyberanger> or stick froyo on it too
[04:32] <jfenn2199> That's nice
[04:33] <jfenn2199> I'm just stuck to Samsung after the Moment this phone has been super durable
[04:34] <jfenn2199> I've litterally dropped it so hard that the battery cover flies off and I just pick it up put the cover on and go right back to what I was doing
[04:38] <cyberanger> the HTC Desire Z is that sturdy
[04:40] <jfenn2199> Yeah I don't like SenseUI though
[04:43] <cyberanger> oh, well, that's nice it's all software
[04:43] <cyberanger> here it's branded as the T-Mobile G2, pretty much stock
[04:43] <cyberanger> and that's really what I have (I just prefer it's htc name)
[04:44] <cyberanger> and I don't use the stock build
[04:44] <cyberanger> I use a root and dev cyogenmod build
[05:08] <jfenn2199> Sorry phone died
[05:32] <jfenn2199> Wb exodus_ms
[05:32] <exodus_ms> thanks jfenn2199
[05:33] <exodus_ms> a little easier on my computer to chat
[05:33] <jfenn2199> Haha I hear that
[05:33] <jfenn2199> It's still another month till I have access back at the house
[05:34] <exodus_ms> right now im tethered to my phone, got about a .5s lag
[05:34] <jfenn2199> Yeah I need to root this one
[05:35] <exodus_ms> i didnt need to root my phone to tether
[05:35] <jfenn2199> Newer one with an extra bill or....?
[05:35] <exodus_ms> not sure what ya mean?
[05:36] <exodus_ms> using an app called easyThether.
[05:36] <jfenn2199> Ok that's what I was wondering
[05:37] <exodus_ms> everything goes thru my data plan (unlimited)
[05:37] <jfenn2199> Is it available on 2.1?
[05:38] <exodus_ms> http://www.mobile-stream.com/easytether/android.html
[05:38] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: cool they let you hang onto your phone at ADEC
[05:38] <cyberanger> some guys in similar places, they can't
[05:39] <exodus_ms> cyberanger, yeah, but there are places I cant take it.
[05:39] <cyberanger> I'd assume a roving bug fear, podslurping and so on
[05:39] <cyberanger> ah, per area
[05:39] <exodus_ms> you have to drop it off before you enter
[05:40] <cyberanger> for those places I just use a nokia 2320, dumb can't do anything device
[05:40] <cyberanger> out of concern of something happening to my smartphone
[05:40] <exodus_ms> brb, my pup needs to go outside...
[05:42] <jfenn2199> Ugh since I don't have a usb cabel I'll have to wait until I'm at a hotspot to use it :-/
[05:43] <jfenn2199> *cable
[05:47] <exodus_ms> jfenn2199, im confused
[05:50] <exodus_ms> if you had a hotspot to use, you wouldnt need your phone to tether to?
[05:50] <jfenn2199> Oh it says I need to install something on the computer I could dl it to the phone and transfer it to the machine but I've lost my usb cable so I can't transfer it
[05:50] <exodus_ms> ah, gotcha. yes, there is a deb pkg you need to dl
[05:52] <exodus_ms> yeah, and you would need the cable anyway to tether
[05:52] <jfenn2199> Ahhhh
[05:52] <jfenn2199> So no ad_hoc
[05:53] <exodus_ms> i know nothing about networking, i just connect and use :)
[05:53] <exodus_ms> sorry
[05:54] <jfenn2199> It's cool
[05:54] <exodus_ms> but why would you need ad_hoc if you have bluetooth? or am i totally off
[05:57] <exodus_ms> or is ad_hoc and bluetooth the same thing?
[05:57] <exodus_ms> cyberanger, what smartphone are you using?
[05:58] <jfenn2199> I may be using the wrong terminology but wifi to wifi
[05:59] <cyberanger> I have a T-Mobile G2
[05:59] <exodus_ms> sorry you guys, i got a serious lag over here
[06:00] <cyberanger> want to also grab a Nokia N900
[06:00] <exodus_ms> i keep dropping off the 3g to 1x...
[06:00] <cyberanger> as for ad-hoc wifi, there are some advanages
[06:00] <cyberanger> same with bluetooth
[06:01] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: it's fine, I remember using 20kbps link
[06:01] <exodus_ms> cyberanger, whats the cl chat program?
[06:01] <exodus_ms> I cant remember
[06:02] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: there are some things that can be done to lessen the bandwidth pain too
[06:02] <cyberanger> command line chat program for irc?
[06:02] <cyberanger> irssi, weechat, common two
[06:02] <exodus_ms> irssi, thats it, thanks
[06:03] <exodus_ms> do you think it would run any faster (bandwidth) than xchat?
[06:03] <cyberanger> for im, finch (or use bitlbee which is an im to irc gateway, and use another)
[06:03] <exodus_ms> na, I just want irc
[06:04] <cyberanger> bandwidth alone, no, but it can help indirectly
[06:05] <exodus_ms> what can I do about the bandwidth?
[06:05] <exodus_ms> using xchat
[06:05] <cyberanger> which was kinda weird, I saw programs lighter on cpu and ram actually speed up when bandwidth was the issue
[06:06] <cyberanger> even when bandwidth didn't change
[06:06] <exodus_ms> cyberanger, just curious. where are you seeing me connecting from?
[06:08] <cyberanger> the main thing I did was setup a local dns server and squid proxy, which ensured that as much traffic wasn't requested twice
[06:08] <cyberanger> view the same image on facebook, request the same ubuntu package, no point downloading it twice
[06:08] <cyberanger> sorry I've got lag here too, tor expirement
[06:08] <exodus_ms> ah man, see there, you get all crazy. I dont have internet dude!
[06:09] <cyberanger> 68.sub-174-252-154.myvzw.com
[06:09] <exodus_ms> if I had internet coming into my apt i could do something like that maybe
[06:09] <cyberanger> that's not crazy,or at least not crazy dependant on internet
[06:10] <exodus_ms> i was just curious, for some reason i get routed thru north carolina at times
[06:10] <cyberanger> ah, that's understandable with verizon's setups
[06:11] <exodus_ms> i was just under the impression that irc was light on bandwidth. just text being transfered back and forth
[06:11] <cyberanger> the above I metioned, was due how I operated
[06:11] <cyberanger> worse than you, 20kbps iden
[06:11] <cyberanger> and it really helped
[06:12] <exodus_ms> cool
[06:12] <cyberanger> irc is light, but also real time
[06:12] <cyberanger> 1987 there wasn't alot around
[06:12] <cyberanger> same in the 92 august coup or the 1992 gulf war
[06:12] <cyberanger> irc's biggest days
[06:13] <exodus_ms> ok, irc is light but real time.... thats what im saying, were using something that was good for dial up, so why cant i get decent speed thru 3g?
[06:13] <cyberanger> but due to everyone having better links now, it shows more defined
[06:13] <cyberanger> high latency, no low bandwidth
[06:13] <cyberanger> that's the issue
[06:14] <exodus_ms> ok
[06:14] <cyberanger> satellite internet is the same, high bandwidth, but higher latency
[06:14] <cyberanger> and thus your great on bandwidth compared to dial-up, but dial up had lower latency
[06:15] <exodus_ms> ah
[06:15] <exodus_ms> i see said the blind man
[06:15] <cyberanger> since each msg is a packet, latency is it's travel time
[06:16] <cyberanger> bandwidth is the size of the packet or packet stream
[06:16] <cyberanger> streaming music on pandora can be cached, buffered, nobody notices the latency
[06:16] <exodus_ms> so, if there were more folks in this discussion, i would see greater latency?
[06:17] <chris4585> exodus_ms, I get a latency of 15 seconds sometimes on IRC but I don't really notice the lag with few people in a conversation
[06:17] <cyberanger> hard to say, if your truely on 3g there, not dropping below to 2.5g or older
[06:17] <cyberanger> you shouldn't
[06:17] <cyberanger> chris4585: is on hughesnet, he also understands it
[06:17] <chris4585> my lag right now is 1.3 seconds right now, thats only twice as large as cell phones really
[06:17] <exodus_ms> im showing 3g with all bars :)
[06:18] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: I think it'd be the same, until the channel size really jumps
[06:18] <chris4585> things usually just take longer to start, egg youtube, but once started its all good
[06:18] <cyberanger> it's a per packet phenomenon
[06:18] <cyberanger> more chatter, more packets
[06:19] <cyberanger> and the way celluar routes, the more tricks
[06:19] <exodus_ms> chris4585, i see that in pandora like cyberanger mentioned, it kicked me off the other day for not having a fast enough connection :/
[06:19] <chris4585> yeah it sucks
[06:19] <chris4585> hughesnet has really good speeds after hours though
[06:20] <chris4585> or if its a really clear sky
[06:20] <cyberanger> what I was metioning in pandora, was more of how it doesn't break up due to a few packets lost
[06:20] <cyberanger> but miss enough it'll suffer
[06:20] <exodus_ms> someone around my apt has wifi called "virusplace" its unprotected, great signal but Im not so sure i should connect to it ;)
[06:20] <cyberanger> but latency isn't the issue
[06:21] <cyberanger> awesome psyop ssid
[06:21] <exodus_ms> but why leave it passwd unprotected?
[06:22] <cyberanger> I'd love to help you both optimize your connections, something I've gotten great at here
[06:22] <exodus_ms> cyberanger, you need to invest in small towers and put them in strategic places around tn
[06:22] <chris4585> exodus_ms, to allow people to connect to it? lol
[06:22] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: becuase he can, he's effectively scared you off, there is no further incentive to him to keep you off
[06:22] <cyberanger> thus why I said psyop
[06:23] <chris4585> cyberanger, that too
[06:23] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: as for small towers, I'm looking at tech that is like that
[06:23] <exodus_ms> well, im going to connect to it and dl a bunch of horse porn on his puter, and show him :p
[06:23] <cyberanger> and celluar tech, satellite too
[06:24]  * cyberanger has seriously been looking at starting an isp for small towns in highly rual areas, and learned alot of low bandwidth tricks in the process
[06:25] <exodus_ms> cyberanger, the last time we talked seriously you were working on that. i think its great bro
[06:25] <cyberanger> hehe, forgot you were here for that
[06:26] <exodus_ms> there is def a need for something like that. but its way over my head. i understand the concept but thats about it
[06:26] <cyberanger> you've been gone so long, hard to remember something ongoing for the past 7 months, if I recall
[06:27] <exodus_ms> yeah, about that time. it was around this time last year i started falling back
[06:28] <exodus_ms> i literally "unplugged" for awhile.
[06:28] <cyberanger> yeah, concept is one thing, the technical methods another, insuring the customer has no need to know how it works
[06:29] <cyberanger> that's the goal
[06:29] <cyberanger> however, if they ask, I would answer
[06:29] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: well, idk if that was a year ago, I don't recall starting an isp then, or starting my router project
[06:30] <exodus_ms> do you have an outline, proposal or plan on paper you could present to anyone?
[06:30] <cyberanger> however my networking knowlege has been there, so I might have considered it as an idea to toy with longer than I recall
[06:30] <exodus_ms> cyberanger, maybe not, but I do recall talking with you about a need for it. at the time you were traveling a bit
[06:30] <cyberanger> not atm, right now I just do it q&a
[06:31] <cyberanger> maybe you were around in june a little, in the middle of things
[06:31] <cyberanger> and I've used xmpp to chat with you too (your end was probally facebook)
[06:31] <exodus_ms> idk, i think the last time i was on here consistently was the earlier part of last year
[06:32] <cyberanger> so who knows
[06:32] <exodus_ms> at any rate, its good to be back chatting with old friends :)
[06:32] <cyberanger> indeed
[06:33] <exodus_ms> ive been so out-of-the loop. slowly getting back into it
[06:33] <cyberanger> and now that I think a little, you were around a year ago, I recall the motlaw game, same day as your christmas day parade, and you had a night shift
[06:34] <cyberanger> went to the game, root the away team, that was dec.
[06:34] <cyberanger> and I had a trip later on, into tullahoma, febuary, you were still around
[06:34] <cyberanger> but in nashville then (forget the reason)
[06:34] <cyberanger> one hell of a year for both of us
[06:35] <exodus_ms> yeah, i think i remember that. February was when i moved out
[06:35] <exodus_ms> indeed
[06:36] <exodus_ms> i just had a lot going on. I had to unplug bro. I felt a need to purge alot of things. I didnt mean to be rude to anyone
[06:36] <cyberanger> I think everyone understands
[06:36] <exodus_ms> cool
[06:36] <cyberanger> I know I do
[06:37] <exodus_ms> right on, thanks bro
[06:38] <cyberanger> wrst and I saw the departing the team launchpad email, he wondered at that time, but you had already filled some of us on the mess
[06:39] <cyberanger> and he understood, those that know bits of your nightmare really do understand that kind of stand back and think mentality you took
[06:39] <cyberanger> and I do mean that offer on tethering tweaks to help
[06:40] <cyberanger> or in chris4585's case, slightly different reason, pretty much the same tweaks
[06:40] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: it wouldn't take much to use your smartphone as a modem, and your ubuntu machine as a router
[06:42] <exodus_ms> cyberanger, the thing is, right now the setup allows incoming txt msg, calls etc to still come thru when im tethered
[06:42] <exodus_ms> granted, it usually disrupts my connection to my laptop and i have to "reconnect" when that happens
[06:43] <exodus_ms> im curious if i used my phone as a modem if i could also receive calls, txt msgs etc at the same time
[06:44]  * cyberanger remembers taking an asus eee pc with two wifi cards, connecting one to mcdonalds wifi, having the other act as an access point, and was on for 4 hours (with their stuff set to try and kick off every two hours, it was fun proving how weak that setup was)
[06:45] <cyberanger> if your tethering now fine, then yes
[06:45]  * exodus_ms just needs stuff to work... is thankful he can chat at the moment
[06:46] <cyberanger> the one bit needed is the routing bit, that's not the phone, that's the computer next to it
[06:46] <exodus_ms> what is the benefit to your proposal?
[06:46] <cyberanger> and linux kernels really excel there
[06:46] <exodus_ms> smartphone (modem) *buntu machine (router)?
[06:47] <cyberanger> pretty much
[06:47] <exodus_ms> thats what im asking, what is the benefit to that?
[06:48] <cyberanger> depends on how your setup for what I'm proposing exactly, but as for the smartphone and linux machine combo
[06:48] <cyberanger> just a way to share it's internet connection
[06:49] <cyberanger> if you have more than one machine
[06:49] <cyberanger> as for the squid proxy (one other idea) has the additional benifit of conserving bandwidth
[06:50] <cyberanger> if you head to facebook once via squid proxy, and open it later, squid has most of the images already
[06:50] <cyberanger> so you only download what squid doesn't have
[06:50] <exodus_ms> where is it stored? the cache that is?
[06:51] <cyberanger> on the ubuntu machine
[06:51] <cyberanger> that it's installed to
[06:52] <cyberanger> so if you have a desktop, and two laptops, and install squid on the desktop, then the cache is on the desktop
[06:52] <exodus_ms> but cant you setup your browser to do that already?
[06:52] <cyberanger> setup your browser to cache images?
[06:53] <exodus_ms> yes, and everything else.
[06:53] <cyberanger> depends on the browser, and most modern ones that'd be a yes
[06:53] <cyberanger> but not everything else (such as deb packages)
[06:53] <cyberanger> and text
[06:54] <cyberanger> and think of squid as a way to share caches too
[06:54] <cyberanger> as if you own 3 machines, they don't have the same cache, necessarlly
[06:54] <exodus_ms> but if you visit somewhere you have never visited before, its irrelevant right?
[06:54] <cyberanger> well, not entirely, but for the most part yes
[06:55] <cyberanger> after all, a different site might have the same image, or embedded content
[06:55] <cyberanger> like google analytics scripts
[06:56] <exodus_ms> maybe i could create a bot that scanned the internet at regular intervals and stored the relevent info on a personal server that could be used to share that cache
[06:56] <cyberanger> the idea is reduction, you'll never hit zero
[06:57] <cyberanger> but on a scale of 0-3 (say, 3 machines) if all machines get ubuntu updates, and visit facebook each day, it would be 3, but with squid, shrink to 1 or less
[06:57] <cyberanger> but not 0
[06:57] <exodus_ms> but, the larger the cache the more time it takes to search thru the archives etc etc, kinda defeats the purpose
[06:58] <cyberanger> I've had extremely large caches, and it'll purge when something is timestale
[06:58] <cyberanger> no isp can rival the speed of your lan
[06:59] <exodus_ms> i understand how it can be useful for redundancy i.e frequently visited sites etc. but what about the not so frequent?
[06:59] <cyberanger> in this case, verizon wireless is the isp, and any speed lost is minor, and gained by the fact your not needing celluar to fetch it
[07:00]  * exodus_ms misses being able to chat a scour the web at the same time...
[07:00] <cyberanger> you'd be suprised how consistant ones web browsing habits are
[07:00] <cyberanger> and not so frequent won't be too big an issue still
[07:01] <exodus_ms> social engineering def plays into effect here, but there are times i break out of habbits, just because ya know ;)
[07:01] <cyberanger> if your connection is slow, this won't slow it down needlessly
[07:02] <exodus_ms> ok, im going to open up chromim, lets see what happens
[07:02] <cyberanger> bandwidth is allways the weakest link
[07:02] <exodus_ms> *chromium
[07:02] <cyberanger> any slow down is milliseconds
[07:03] <exodus_ms> im going to clear the cache as well
[07:03] <cyberanger> and recouped by a single item added or pulled from the cache
[07:04] <exodus_ms> lag = .7s
[07:05] <cyberanger> but is that one computer? and your only one?
[07:05] <exodus_ms> so, looking at the meter i can almost anticipate when a msg will arrive here in xchat, kinda cool
[07:06] <exodus_ms> yes
[07:06] <cyberanger> and only browser?
[07:07] <cyberanger> no firefox
[07:07] <exodus_ms> no ff
[07:08] <exodus_ms> wait, ff is installed but not running. is that what you were asking?
[07:08] <exodus_ms> if it was installed
[07:08] <cyberanger> well, more your usage
[07:08] <cyberanger> you could get away with just xchat and chromium
[07:08] <cyberanger> for a month
[07:12] <cyberanger> reason I'm asking is to define normal usage
[07:12] <cyberanger> to compare to vz's expectations and plus areas to optimize
[07:13] <cyberanger> dns, http, irc
[07:13] <exodus_ms> thats about it ^
[07:14] <cyberanger> maybe also ntp, but for a laptop, there can be another way to deal with that, or ignore it
[07:14] <exodus_ms> if i had a regular dedicated line for my apt, it would be different
[07:14] <cyberanger> but you don't need one
[07:14] <exodus_ms> ntp? what for?
[07:14] <cyberanger> however, what would you change
[07:15] <cyberanger> ntp, network time protocall, something I expect is going on in the backround
[07:15] <cyberanger> it's traffic, gotta count it
[07:15] <exodus_ms> yeah, thats why i was asking why i would us/need it?
[07:15] <exodus_ms> *use
[07:16] <cyberanger> well, you probally already are, and it's a give away that you are tethering
[07:16] <cyberanger> since the phone doesn't use ntp via vz's data network
[07:16] <chris4585> speedtest before 2am http://www.speedtest.net/result/1110696045.png
[07:16] <cyberanger> the celluar base station sends it the time
[07:16] <chris4585> speedtest after 2am http://www.speedtest.net/result/1110709125.png
[07:17] <cyberanger> chris4585: no fap throttling for it
[07:18] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: as for why it's used, more accurate than the interal clock
[07:18] <chris4585> oh god if I was under fap it would be awful, the test would take 20mins to complete
[07:18] <cyberanger> the internal clock drifts alot
[07:18] <cyberanger> chris4585: not to metion the speed couldn't be that high, they drop to 56k or less
[07:19] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: I'm looking at it as if I was hughesnet, verizon, charter, whoever
[07:19] <cyberanger> looking at all usage
[07:19] <cyberanger> and that's important if your tethering
[07:21] <exodus_ms> is it a bad thing that you know im tethering? you mentioned it was a give away that i was
[07:22] <cyberanger> the nice thing about android, one can explain away some of the signs, such as using a different dns server (I use opennic, and one of my websites is www.zachgibbens.geek, a opennic only site)
[07:22] <cyberanger> but if they have a policy against excessive data and tethering, it's a bit worse
[07:22] <cyberanger> they often turn a blind eye, to a point
[07:23] <cyberanger> ntp traffic is a sign I'd look for that screams tethering
[07:23] <exodus_ms> gotcha
[07:23] <cyberanger> but if my traffic stays low (and your case it will, if that's all your doing) it's pointless to cry foul
[07:25] <cyberanger> it used to be that ssh traffic was a give away, but not anymore, using a different dns server was (that one can be explained too, but that's not as clear cut)
[07:25] <cyberanger> it's gotten to the point where the amount of traffic is the only thing that pisses them off
[07:26] <exodus_ms> why do they care? man, it pisses me off.
[07:26] <cyberanger> much to my disappointment (it's no fun tricking a blind guy into looking for gullibule on the celing)
[07:27] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: are they charging you an arm and a leg?
[07:27] <exodus_ms> it would be different if i were downloading a ton of crap and eating up bandwidth, but they want to nickle and dime every freaking packet
[07:27] <cyberanger> they want both legs
[07:27] <cyberanger> greed
[07:27] <cyberanger> well, they've moved away from nickel and diming like they did
[07:28] <exodus_ms> cyberanger, not at the moment, i have an unlimited data package, one flat monthly rate
[07:28] <cyberanger> tethering is a sign of high usage, in theroy
[07:29] <cyberanger> and what they care about is when one guy tests the defination of unlimited
[07:30] <exodus_ms> im not trying to test anyone, i just want access to what should be a no-cost venture in the first place
[07:30] <cyberanger> on virgin mobile I did just that (knowing I paid cash and they had no data on me, thus the worst thing they could do is kill service and I'd just act like a new customer)
[07:30] <cyberanger> grabbed 10g in under 48 hours
[07:31] <cyberanger> when at the time 5gb was the cap for contract services with everyone but t-mobile
[07:31] <cyberanger> t-mo had a soft cap of 10g and then throttle
[07:32] <exodus_ms> www.zachgibbens.geek <-- not site?
[07:32] <cyberanger> I did that becuase their policy had no fine print (at the time, I got an email today saying they're gonna soft cap at 5gb and then throttle)
[07:32] <cyberanger> (starting feb 15th I think)
[07:33] <cyberanger> your not testing them, or being a heavy user, your fine
[07:34] <cyberanger> they'll see markers like ntp, but ignore them, insignificant amount
[07:34] <cyberanger> it's an opennic domain, http://www.opennicproject.org
[07:34] <cyberanger> if using opennic it'd resolve to <IP_ADDRESS>
[07:35] <cyberanger> my holy grail server of servers ;-)
[07:36] <cyberanger> .com .org .edu ICANN domains
[07:37] <exodus_ms> cool, hey bro im gonna call it a night. nice catching up with you. like always i learned alot ;)
[07:37] <cyberanger> OpenNIC want's an independant and democratic system, due to misdeeds in the current system, such as ICE seizing numerous .com's and such
[07:37] <cyberanger> exodus_ms: understand, nearly 2am there
[07:38] <cyberanger> enjoy the night, see you another one
[07:38] <exodus_ms> cyberanger, yes indeed
[13:32] <wrst> hey linuxman410
[13:32] <linuxman410> hey wrst
[13:32] <wrst> how are things going linuxman410?
[13:33] <linuxman410> going ok got my new phone yesterday
[13:34] <linuxman410> got my laptop too it would not run ubuntu 10.10 but it run xubuntu 10.10 does not make sense
[13:36] <wrst> weird linuxman410, just wouldn't start?
[13:40] <linuxman410> no it just sit there at the ubuntu screen i thought about trying mint on it
[13:42] <wrst> hmm weird, did you try an alternate install cd?
[13:42] <wrst> or did it install ? and wouldn't boot afterwards?
[13:42] <linuxman410> no i guess i can download that and try it
[13:43] <linuxman410> no it would not install from regular download media
[13:43] <wrst> lots of times that will take care of those problems or if you want the regular gnome you could just install ubuntu-desktop
[13:52] <linuxman410> wrst i tried sudo apt-get install ubuntu desktop and it said not found
[13:52] <wrst> linuxman410: shoudl be ubuntu-desktop gotta have the -
[13:53] <linuxman410> gotta it was not paying attention still early
[13:53] <wrst> i know the feeling linuxman410 :)
[13:53] <wrst> i had kubuntu installed and did that last night... wow kubuntu still pretty much stinks for me
[13:54] <linuxman410> i have always used ubuntu not xubuntu
[13:54] <wrst> i don't really get xubuntu
[13:55] <linuxman410> me either
[13:56] <wrst> yeah just i don't know just kinda strange to me
[13:56] <linuxman410> finally got natty live cd to boot but it kept crashing
[13:57] <wrst> weird
[14:13] <Xpistos> morning all
[14:13] <Xpistos> wrst
[14:15] <wrst> morning Xpistos
[14:15] <linuxman410> wrst refresh my memory how do i remove xfce-desktop
[14:15] <cyberanger> morning everyone
[14:16] <wrst> linuxman410: should be apt-get remove xfce-desktop or to remove all the config files apt-get purge
[14:16] <wrst> but i'm not positive if that will remove everything xfce
[14:16] <cyberanger> linuxman410: very carefully
[14:16] <cyberanger> and it won't
[14:17] <cyberanger> if any tool is dependant on it
[14:17] <wrst> cyberanger: i see something suggesting apt-get autoremove
[14:18] <cyberanger> ther dependancy settings are sweet for installing metapackages, not so much otherwise
[14:18] <cyberanger> autoremove is fine
[14:18] <cyberanger> just removes what isn't used
[14:19] <cyberanger> Xpistos: you should have an email later today with code you seeked
[14:19] <cyberanger> just gotta get at my machine first
[14:19] <Xpistos> cyberanger: thanks bro
[14:20] <linuxman410> wrst i tried sudo apt-get remove xfce-desktop and it says unable to locate
[14:20] <cyberanger> linuxman410: metapackage, gotta remove it's dependices
[14:20] <wrst> linuxman410: its actually xubuntu-desktop is the metapackage name
[14:21] <cyberanger> oh, that'd also help
[14:24] <linuxman410> ok i have remove xubuntu-desktop and now have ubuntu-desktop with a xubuntu splash screen and login window
[14:24] <wrst> linuxman410: i found a command
[14:24] <wrst> sudo apt-get remove a2ps abiword abiword-common abiword-plugin-grammar abiword-plugin-mathview aumix aumix-common browser-plugin-parole catfish elementary-icon-theme exaile exo-utils fortune-mod fortunes-min gdebi gdebi-core gigolo gimp gimp-data gnumeric gnumeric-common gnumeric-doc gtk2-engines-xfce gvfs-bin hal hal-info imagemagick libabiword-2.8 libaiksaurus-1.2-0c2a libaiksaurus-1.2-data libaiksaurusgtk-1.2-0c2a libbabl-0.0-0 libcdt4 libexo-0.3
[14:24] <wrst> -0 libexo-common libgdome2-0 libgdome2-cpp-smart0c2a libgegl-0.0-0 libgimp2.0 libgoffice-0.8-8 libgoffice-0.8-8-common libgraph4 libgsf-1-114 libgsf-1-common libgtkmathview0c2a libgvc5 libhal-storage1 libhal1 libilmbase6 libjpeg-progs libjpeg8 liblink-grammar4 libloudmouth1-0 libmagickcore3-extra libmng1 libnetpbm10 libopenexr6 libotr2 libots0 libpathplan4 libpsiconv6 librecode0 libsexy2 libtagc0 libthunar-vfs-1-2 libwv-1.2-3 libxcb-keysyms1 libxdot4
[14:24] <wrst>  libxfce4menu-0.1-0 libxfce4util-bin libxfce4util-common libxfce4util4 libxfcegui4-4 libxfconf-0-2 link-grammar-dictionaries-en mousepad murrine-themes netpbm orage oss-compat parole pidgin pidgin-data pidgin-libnotify pidgin-otr plymouth-theme-xubuntu-logo psutils python-cddb python-mmkeys python-mutagen ristretto smartdimmer tango-icon-theme tango-icon-theme-common thunar thunar-archive-plugin thunar-data thunar-media-tags-plugin thunar
[14:24] <wrst> -thumbnailers thunar-volman thunderbird ttf-lyx wdiff xchat xchat-common xfburn xfce-keyboard-shortcuts xfce4-appfinder xfce4-clipman xfce4-clipman-plugin xfce4-cpugraph-plugin xfce4-dict xfce4-fsguard-plugin xfce4-mailwatch-plugin xfce4-mixer xfce4-mount-plugin xfce4-netload-plugin xfce4-notes xfce4-notes-plugin xfce4-panel xfce4-places-plugin xfce4-power-manager xfce4-power-manager-data xfce4-quicklauncher-plugin xfce4-screenshooter xfce4-session
[14:24] <wrst>  xfce4-settings xfce4-smartbookmark-plugin xfce4-systemload-plugin xfce4-taskmanager xfce4-terminal xfce4-utils xfce4-verve-plugin xfce4-volumed xfce4-weather-plugin xfce4-xkb-plugin xfconf xfdesktop4 xfdesktop4-data xfprint4 xfswitch-plugin xfwm4 xfwm4-themes xscreensaver xubuntu-artwork xubuntu-default-settings xubuntu-desktop xubuntu-docs xubuntu-gdm-theme xubuntu-icon-theme xubuntu-wallpapers
[14:24] <wrst> wow sorry
[14:24] <wrst> didn't know it was that large of a command :\
[14:25] <wrst> linuxman410: from here http://www.psychocats.net/ubuntu/puregnome
[14:26] <wrst> hmm well hate he left after i flooded with that command :\
[14:29] <linuxman410> wrst when i type that lin in it says not found
[14:30] <wrst> hmm not for sure
[14:31] <wrst> linuxman410: that has worked for me before from that site
[14:31] <wrst> but who knows what could be updated etc etc and not match up with all of that
[14:38] <linuxman410> wow that just messed up whole installation so i will re install with alternative cd
[14:46] <wrst> :\
[17:25] <starspot> howdy
[17:26] <starspot> I can't get x to load after uninstalling the proprietary radeon drivers :-(
[17:26] <starspot> what do I do with the boot CD to remedy this?
[18:01] <wrst> hey exodus_ms
[18:01] <exodus_ms> hey wrst
[18:01] <wrst> starspot: you want to reinstall the radeon drivers?
[18:01] <wrst> exodus_ms: long time no see great to see you around!
[18:02] <exodus_ms> thanks wrst you too
[19:30] <chris4585> wrst, I thought you would like to see this http://www.webupd8.org/2011/01/unity-2d-qt-now-available-in-ppa-for.html
[19:33] <wrst> that is interesting chris4585, i may have to give that a try
[19:33] <chris4585> yeah the only funny thing is its using qt, but whatever if it works
[19:34] <wrst> yeah what's up with that?
[19:34] <chris4585> apparently mark is gay for qt
[19:35] <chris4585> there are other articles about the news, that was just about it getting a ppa
[19:36] <wrst> well if he is so gay for qt (love that term) why do they not use kde?
[19:36] <chris4585> I'm not really sure, I just got that from the comments on another post lol
[19:43] <wrst> kde is just so unstable for me, i would love to use it, because it looks so good but they seemed to have sacraficed functionality for looks
[20:59] <pace_t_zulu> https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2011/01/fcc-contest-seeks-more-data-better-net-neutrality
[20:59] <pace_t_zulu> cyberanger: ^
[21:05] <wrst> pace_t_zulu, cyberanger i'm not exactly on top of the net neutrality stuff what do you guys think?
[21:10] <pace_t_zulu> i am pro neutrality
[21:11] <pace_t_zulu> perhaps one day i will change my mind
[21:11] <pace_t_zulu> but i don't see that happening
[22:07] <cyberanger> pace_t_zulu: intresting, in a way
[22:07] <cyberanger> wrst: the terms flopped around in a way that makes me dislike it
[22:07] <cyberanger> I'll settle for ethical and consumer driven
[22:43] <wrst> i suppose i may not fully understand what is going on with it cyberanger
[22:44] <wrst> just did a little reading and I understand, why someone would be pro- but also shudder in fear of the fcc doing much of anything other than screwing things up
[22:44] <wrst> cyberanger: i think i willl probalby agree with you on what i have read so far
[22:45] <cyberanger> wrst: that's the fcc
[22:45] <cyberanger> and thus my comment
[22:45] <wrst> yeah i'm very much a "small government" guy so i'm not wild about regulators
[22:45] <wrst> not saying we don't need some regulation i'm not an anarchist :)
[22:46] <cyberanger> well, the fcc in it's original space made sense
[22:46] <cyberanger> try having everyone use 2.4ghz for everything
[22:47] <cyberanger> fm radio, tv, worldwide radio, celluar towers, wifi, bluetooth
[22:47] <cyberanger> no space
[22:48] <cyberanger> (illogical example, but a quick and dirty one too)
[22:48] <wrst> yes agreed like most things they get too power hungry


 NOT
[07:02] <Kilos> the trick is learning to enjoy it , then its not so bad
[07:02] <Vince-0> yeah!~ looking at starting my own company soon
[07:03] <Kilos> lol how old be ya
[07:03] <Vince-0> 25
[07:03] <Kilos> whew long way to go. what company you planning
[07:04] <Vince-0> Tech company using open source VoIP software and dev platforms for BI and BPO
[07:05] <Vince-0> pitching platforms for getting minutes to termination providers - but there is a big gap on the management systems because the traditional ones cost so much
[07:05] <Kilos> good direction
[07:06] <Vince-0> I've seen so many companies using GoAutoDial to do power dialling etc - based on Asterisk
[07:07] <Vince-0> but I've got an American master's degree Java architect on board so thats sweet
[07:07] <Kilos> yeah
[07:07] <Vince-0> my new play thing is currently Freeswitch
[07:07] <andrewlsd> Hi kilos
[07:15] <andrewlsd> Vince-0, am I correct that freeswitch is SIP router rather than a PBX?
[07:16] <andrewlsd> if not, what are key differences to Asterisk
[07:16] <Vince-0> freeswitch is very much like Asterisk feature wise - but the internals are fundamentaly different
[07:17] <Vince-0> both are reffered to as back to back SIP switches but can do many protocol types including xmpp, mumble etc
[07:17] <andrewlsd> I read about it locking channels differently
[07:17] <Vince-0> yes! the state/threading models are very different -
[07:17] <andrewlsd> To make i less prone to system lock ups
[07:17] <Vince-0> freeswitch looks to be a better bet for web app development purposes because it is all configured in xml
[07:18] <andrewlsd> K
[07:18] <Vince-0> check out FusionPBX project - awesome functionality front end for freeswitch
[07:18] <andrewlsd> Does it still support dial plans
[07:18] <Vince-0> oh yes, it even has a module to interpret asterisk dial plans
[07:18] <andrewlsd> Link to it?
[07:19] <Vince-0> http://www.fusionpbx.com/
[07:19] <andrewlsd> Sweet thanks
[07:20] <Vince-0> freeswitch seems waay more flexible - although asterisk 10 is just announced and I still havn't understood what exactly Asterisk SCF is
[07:22] <andrewlsd> Performance wise, does freeswitch perform better in terms of memory and cpu on same mum of calls. Or is that a bogus question?
[07:23] <Vince-0> I'd say that it does! Although I'm not sure how different the new Asterisk version's media handling has changed
[07:24] <andrewlsd> Vince-0, ta
[07:24] <Vince-0> the other thing about freeswitch is that they have demoted the IAX2 libraries to testing trunk because Digium isn't updating the open libraries
[07:25] <andrewlsd> Yeah. Lots of unhappiness with digium in forums
[07:25] <Vince-0> aah! I'm currently testing: http://wiki.freeswitch.org/wiki/Connecting_Freeswitch_And_Asterisk
[07:26] <Vince-0> in fact, I hear some key digium engineers talking about using freeswitch in front of asterisk to handle SIP type proxying where OpenSIP/SIR/Kamilio is overkill
[07:27] <andrewlsd> I saw queries about freeswitch first c/o the "mesh potato" project
[07:27] <andrewlsd> Kind of like running freeswitch in dd-wrt
[07:28] <Vince-0> yes! I've seen freeswitch for pfsense etc - nice and small
[07:28] <Vince-0> was reading about that village telco - mash potato project . very nice
[07:29] <Vince-0> still, need to put freeswitch through its paces in a production environment though. the developers are very active - currently making HA modules for FS
[07:31] <andrewlsd> do you have links for any freeswitch VM appliances for testing purposes?
[07:31] <Vince-0> hmm, not really - I was using FusionPBX ISO's in Virtualbox
[07:31] <andrewlsd> K
[07:32] <andrewlsd> Yeah will do that too, in kvm
[07:37] <Vince-0> some Freeswitch guis: http://wiki.freeswitch.org/wiki/Freeswitch_Gui
[07:39] <andrewlsd> Ta
[08:12] <Symmetria> can someone do me a favour and send a test email to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[08:13] <Symmetria> and tell me if they get an auto reply
[08:13] <Kilos> k sym
[08:14] <Kilos> on its way
[08:14] <Kilos> eish missed the audio bit
[08:15] <Kilos> hope its a small audio file
[08:15] <Kilos> Symmetria, ^^
[08:15] <Symmetria> thanks :) though LOL, I think the office email server just went down so gotta wait for that ot come back to see if you get an auto reply
[08:15] <Kilos> no reply yet
[08:15] <Symmetria> lol yeah the office dsl just went down by the looks of things
[08:16] <Kilos> oh auto
[08:16] <Kilos> eye not seeing good
[08:30] <Kilos> Symmetria, lemme know when its up again
[09:02] <superfly> morning Kilos
[09:10] <nlsthzn> o/
[09:11] <Kilos> hi nlsthzn
[09:11] <nlsthzn> Hey uncle Kilos :)
[09:31] <Kilos> hiya kbmonkey
[09:31] <nlsthzn> o/ kbmonkey ...
[09:32] <Kilos> that vnstat eats data not iftop
[09:32] <kbmonkey> hi Kilos nlsthzn
[09:32] <Kilos> used a weeks data in one day and with iftop off i saw nothing
[09:32] <Kilos> hehe
[09:33] <kbmonkey> cant be, vnstat does not open any sockets, it just monitors the /proc/net files
[09:33] <kbmonkey> that's why I use it ;)
[09:33] <kbmonkey> hows you otherwise?
[09:33] <Kilos> then i dunno but now i purged it and watching with iftop again
[09:34] <kbmonkey> did iftop report what was using your data?
[09:34] <Kilos> used 700k all morn
[09:34] <Kilos> lost 14 meg yesterday
[09:34] <kbmonkey> ouch :(
[09:34] <Kilos> no you two told me to close it
[09:34] <Kilos> lol
[09:35] <kbmonkey> no I meant you use iftop to track down the culprit, that's it's primary purpose after all
[09:35] <Kilos> yeah but it must be running at the time
[09:36] <kbmonkey> unfortunate :(
[09:36] <Kilos> np we just squeeze harder
[09:36] <kbmonkey> I take your auto updates are turned off?
[09:36] <Kilos> yes everything
[09:37] <Kilos> maybe it was one of these bad guys that use your pc to send spam or something i dunno
[09:37] <Kilos> but i have firewall and clamtk
[09:38] <Kilos> saw in the lists from linuxtips i think you can make it so your pc cant be pinged
[09:38] <superfly> anyone else remember if we did anything else this month?
[09:38] <kbmonkey> why do you have clam?
[09:38] <Kilos> dunno if i must do that
[09:38] <Kilos> in case of virusses
[09:39] <Kilos> found 2 a week back
[09:39] <Kilos> trojans
[09:39] <Kilos> but was stupid in not saving the record
[09:39] <kbmonkey> well I trust the docs, iftop warns about data usage ;)
[09:39] <kbmonkey> I can't think of any superfly
[09:40] <Kilos> yeah but im sure it doesnt use data on its own
[09:40] <kbmonkey> yes it does, unless you use the -n option
[09:41] <kbmonkey> oh check your clam update method too,
[09:41] <Kilos> ok i will do it that way then
[09:41] <kbmonkey> remember windows viruses cant affect you Kilos
[09:41] <Kilos> i just basically need to know when to go offline
[09:41] <Kilos> not my kernel but what about things like pidgin
[09:42] <Kilos> have had some funny probs with pidgin over the past 2 years
[09:42] <Kilos> needed to purge and install from scratch to get going again
[09:42] <kbmonkey> Same here, I stopped using pidgin
[09:43] <Kilos> na it the best
[09:43] <Kilos> but got bugs from msn
[09:43] <Kilos> now it seems ok last few months
[09:43] <kbmonkey> I like it's mxit support, that's neat
[09:44] <Kilos> yeah
[09:44] <Kilos> all my local fam are mxit peeps
[09:44] <kbmonkey> oh I have pidgin installed already, okay then :D
[09:44] <Kilos> lol
[09:44] <Kilos> pidgin rocks
[09:45] <Kilos> and can do otr as well
[09:45] <kbmonkey> oops, forgot my mxit pin. he he
[09:45] <Kilos> haha
[09:45] <kbmonkey> mxit don't work on my phone
[09:46] <Kilos> onna bb?
[09:46] <kbmonkey> yup
[09:46] <superfly> I haven't used mxit in years
[09:46] <kbmonkey> it did, then they changed it, then it didn't
[09:46] <Kilos> they want you to bbm the swines
[09:47] <kbmonkey> I'm racking my brain, google can't help me
[09:47] <Kilos> try a reinstall of mxit
[09:47] <kbmonkey> using python, I want to find out how to get a segment of a circle if I have an angle. phew
[09:48] <Kilos> whew
[09:48] <kbmonkey> I'm sure it's something rather simple, my trig is not that great though
[09:48]  * kbmonkey <-- no pay attention in maths class
[09:48] <Kilos> ya me too
[09:50] <superfly> kbmonkey: segment?
[09:52] <kbmonkey> or a point, but in the end I want a section of the circle
[09:52] <kbmonkey> like a slice
[09:52] <kbmonkey> like say a slice of a pizza :D
[09:53] <kbmonkey> but only the crust, a slice of the circumference... in other words
[09:54] <kbmonkey> maybe I am just googling the wrong keywords... let's try other phrases
[09:55] <Kilos> ill be back later guys.
[09:55] <Kilos> be good
[10:00] <superfly> kbmonkey: how is the segment measured?
[10:01] <kbmonkey> do you mean how long should it be?
[10:02] <superfly> you said you want the segment... I'm wondering what is used to describe that segment
[10:02] <superfly> like an angle is measured in degrees, and a line is measured in points, what is a segment measured in?
[10:02] <kbmonkey> oh
[10:03] <kbmonkey> well points, but now I think degrees will be easier
[10:04] <kbmonkey> If I have angle A, I could just get the point A-1 deg, and A+1 deg, and the segment in between will do
[10:04] <kbmonkey> that way, I can vary the segment size by just increasing +-1
[10:05] <kbmonkey> sorry I'm not sure how to explain it very well. A picture would probably explain it all
[10:11] <kbmonkey> yes that will work, thanks superfly, I just needed someone to make me think differently ;)
[11:03] <magespawn> howdy all
[11:06] <nlsthzn> o/
[11:09] <superfly> yo magespawn
[11:10] <superfly> Maaz: tell kbmonkey Well, truth be told, I was just trying to understand what you were trying to do :-D
[11:10] <Maaz> superfly: Sure, I'll tell kbmonkey on freenode
[11:24] <magespawn> hi superfly
[13:37]  * nuvolari pops in and out
[14:18] <kbmonkey> superfly I got it. I wanted to find a point on a circle by angle. I used a parametric equation for a circle. tops
[14:51] <Waceman> kbmonkey: you there?
[17:24] <nuvolari> Maaz: seen kilos
[17:24] <Maaz> nuvolari: kilos was last seen 7 hours, 28 minutes and 36 seconds ago in #ubuntu-za on freenode [2011-10-28 11:55:42 SAST], and has been offline on freenode since 2011-10-28 11:56:07 SAST
[17:44] <Kilos> evening all
[17:45] <Kilos> Maaz, coffee on
[17:45]  * Maaz puts the kettle on
[17:49] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for Kilos!
[17:52] <Kilos> Maaz, ty
[17:52] <Maaz> Enjoy Kilos
[18:28] <kbmonkey> hello Kilos
[18:29] <kbmonkey> nuvolari  o/
[18:29] <Kilos> hiya kbmonkey
[18:29] <nuvolari> o/ apie :D
[18:29] <kbmonkey> getting into python nicely tonight :)
[18:29] <nuvolari> hoe gaan dit daar by die ander see?
[18:29] <nuvolari> stuur groete vir tafelberg
[18:29] <nuvolari> en sê ek verlang
[18:30] <kbmonkey> ek sal die dassies groete stuur van durbs af!
[18:30] <Kilos> good lad , python rocks
[18:30] <nuvolari> Kilos: if it wasnt for java, you did not have any coffee from Maaz :P
[18:31] <nuvolari> maar laat ons nou nie 'n geveg oopkrap nie
[18:31] <nuvolari> :P
[18:31] <Kilos> lol i love my java
[18:31] <Kilos> with cremora and milk
[18:34] <kbmonkey> ha ha!
[18:34] <kbmonkey> yup java is tops too, but I'll leave that to the experts ;)
[18:34] <Kilos> kbmonkey, you gotta get things together for lpi hey
[18:34] <Kilos> no loafing
[18:34]  * nuvolari hides before oom Kilos does more pointing
[18:35] <kbmonkey> i know Kilos! I'm trying to learn python somewhat so I can secure a job too
[18:35] <Kilos> hehe
[18:35] <Kilos> good lad
[18:35] <Kilos> not too much holidaying and site seeing
[18:36] <nuvolari> :-/ I had F(r)U(stratio)N today learning how to work with apache lucene
[18:37] <Kilos> indian fodder
[18:37] <zeref> hurrrmmmm
[18:37] <Kilos> hey zeref
[18:37] <zeref> hi Kilos
[18:38] <nuvolari> o hi zeref
[18:38]  * nuvolari waves
[18:38] <zeref> Hi :-)
[18:38] <kbmonkey> zeref o\
[18:38] <zeref> i understand nuvolari i spend the whole day trying to install an aaplication on amazon linux
[18:38] <zeref> hi kbmonkey :-D
[18:39] <Kilos> nuvolari, do you know if one kan go to google and setup that site goodie with elinks
[18:39] <Kilos> or maybe the monkey knows
[18:39] <nuvolari> Kilos: hmm, will check quick oom
[18:39] <Kilos> he uses elinks
[18:39] <kbmonkey> i do :D
[18:39] <kbmonkey> what site goodie?
[18:40] <Kilos> nuvolari, tell him
[18:40] <nuvolari> kbmonkey: just plain google sites
[18:40] <kbmonkey> een ding van die kaap, die vrugte is so lekker!
[18:40] <nuvolari> *GoogleSites
[18:40] <kbmonkey> ah,
[18:40] <nuvolari> kbmonkey: *en* die wyn
[18:40] <kbmonkey> wyn++
[18:40] <kbmonkey> WINE
[18:40] <nuvolari> Kilos: it works oom
[18:40] <Kilos> lol
[18:41] <Kilos> yay i will try it then
[18:41] <Kilos> maybe
[18:41] <Kilos> my google is full
[18:41] <kbmonkey> haven't  tried google sites with elinks yet, should do, sites uses very simple styling, not much javascript or any flash
[18:41] <Kilos> gamil
[18:41] <Kilos> gmail
[18:41] <kbmonkey> your gmail is full? wow. yes i sit on 40% myself
[18:42] <Kilos> need to clear all the mail one day
[18:43] <Kilos> it eats data just to go there with ff or epiphany
[18:43] <kbmonkey> you want to make a site Kilos ?
[18:43] <Kilos> yeah so tara can put her songs there for me to wget
[18:43] <kbmonkey> I use elinks with my gmail now, the basic html gmail version, works good
[18:44] <nuvolari> kbmonkey: you should check out pine
[18:44] <nuvolari> there was something else, can't remember now
[18:44] <nuvolari> ah, alpine
[18:44] <nuvolari> :P
[18:45] <kbmonkey> sorry your net got eaten Kilos :/
[18:45] <Kilos> huh?
[18:45] <kbmonkey> ah thanks nuvolari! I tried mutt but couldn't figure out how to get my email into it :p
[18:46] <kbmonkey> i use a text music player, file manager and web browser now. lol
[18:46] <nuvolari> yeah... mutt. 'nuff said.
[18:46] <Kilos> saw an add on tv tonight. 8ta 3g data for R149
[18:46] <kbmonkey> 8ta?
[18:46] <nuvolari> kbmonkey: what file browser? (you actually use a text file browser? what's wrong with ls? :P)
[18:46] <Kilos> telkom broadband
[18:46] <kbmonkey> ha ha!
[18:46] <kbmonkey> mc
[18:47] <Kilos> and starter packs for 99c at checkers
[18:47] <kbmonkey> err, this wifi is hard to tell how much data I have left
[18:49] <Kilos> nursing data really sucks
[18:49] <kbmonkey> installing alpine, if i DC i ran out :D
[18:49] <Kilos> lol
[18:49] <kbmonkey> each time I need to reset my wifi as their portal site stops working when that happens. weird
[18:51] <nuvolari> kbmonkey: just need to figure out how to set up alpine with google authentication (application-specific passwords)
[18:52] <kbmonkey> doing that now, let's ask google
[18:53] <kbmonkey> Kilos if you want to get files, dropbox might be better
[18:53] <Kilos> where is that thing
[18:54] <Kilos> sure i saw something like that in my evolution
[18:54] <kbmonkey> and each site has a limit of 100MB
[18:54] <Kilos> some box
[18:54] <Kilos> said save to that box but didnt work
[18:54] <kbmonkey> dropbox is a website where you can 'drop' your files to share
[18:55] <kbmonkey> dropbox is similar to ubuntu one
[18:55] <Kilos> oh
[18:55] <Kilos> then its browser to get there
[18:56] <Kilos> i just need a place to wget the odd song from my brat
[18:56] <kbmonkey> not neccesary
[18:56] <kbmonkey> tara will use the site to setup an account, then give you the link which you can still wget
[18:57] <kbmonkey> any files you put in the "Public" folder in dropbox, has a link you can give your friends. It is a direct link to the file, so wget works
[18:57] <Kilos> lol she fulla like her mother
[18:57] <nuvolari> dropbog, googlesitebox, some diff :P
[18:58] <nuvolari> (wget included)
[18:58] <nuvolari> hmm. wonder how well google+ will handle that?
[18:59] <nuvolari> they talk about videos, but I wonder if they support audio
[18:59] <Kilos> and she a youtube fool so will be hard to convince her otherwise but i will try
[18:59]  * nuvolari tests
[18:59] <Kilos> google+ also eats data
[18:59] <nuvolari> Kilos: tell her youtube is not from google
[18:59] <Kilos> she isnt a google fan
[18:59] <kbmonkey> google owns youtube now
[19:00] <Kilos> i got her to open her gmail account
[19:00] <Kilos> ah
[19:00]  * Kilos hates youtube
[19:01] <Kilos> its like watching some mongrel eating your rump steak
[19:02] <kbmonkey> lol Kilos !
[19:04] <Kilos> inetpro, lewe jy nog
[19:05] <Kilos> kbmonkey, must you use a soecial command to get elinks working to set up a site at gmail
[19:06] <Kilos> do you actually log into gmail or just google
[19:06] <kbmonkey> when you logged into google, at the top are links, one called "Sites"
[19:06] <kbmonkey> or go to sites.google.com
[19:07] <Kilos> you see that in elinks?
[19:07] <nuvolari> whoot! got my alpine working
[19:07] <kbmonkey> I typed that into elinks yes
[19:07] <Kilos> what is alpine nuvolari
[19:08] <nuvolari> Kilos: a text email client oom
[19:08] <Kilos> ah ty
[19:08] <Kilos> surely with http:// in front hey
[19:09] <nuvolari> kbmonkey: I got the good stuff if you want some :P
[19:09] <nuvolari> pretty standard alpine setup, and found out how to make it remember your password
[19:09] <kbmonkey> i set mine up, seems to take, but how to I retrieve email? lol
[19:10] <kbmonkey> yes if you have a link please :D
[19:10] <nuvolari> kbmonkey: how did you set it up? I use imap
[19:10] <nuvolari> there's nothing special, just select the folder list
[19:10] <kbmonkey> imap
[19:10] <Kilos> i could never get imap working
[19:10] <nuvolari> well, it's showing everything from my inbox, I did not figure out how to reach different labels yet :P
[19:11] <kbmonkey> woot it sent an email!
[19:11] <Kilos> use that other thing
[19:11] <Kilos> pop
[19:11] <kbmonkey> need to find out how to import my address book
[19:11] <nuvolari> kbmonkey: http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/10/do_you_want_the_alpine_email_c.php
[19:12] <nuvolari> for passwords ^^
[19:13] <kbmonkey> thanks!
[19:14] <nuvolari> kbmonkey: http://studioshorts.com/blog/2009/11/using-alpine-to-check-your-emailgmail-in-linux-terminal/ going to try this for labels
[19:15] <kbmonkey> you move fast, I still can't see my inbox :p
[19:16] <Kilos> grr cant even login to tgoogle sites with elinks
[19:16] <kbmonkey> I'm logged in Kilos
[19:17] <Kilos> you know where you scroll down to sign in  and type in mail addrsss and password
[19:17] <Kilos> cant get even to password
[19:18] <kbmonkey> that's not right
[19:18] <nuvolari> bah :-/ kbmonkey what username/password do I use for sending mail? Think I'm missing something :P not the same credentials as for fetching mail
[19:19] <Kilos> where it say email i start typing msdomdonner and it open a little line with autho goody first
[19:19] <kbmonkey> Kilos does your typing enter into the box, press enter first to focus it?
[19:20] <Kilos> oh sec i see
[19:20] <Kilos> w00t that works
[19:20] <kbmonkey> nuvolari you enter Menu Setup Config and go down to SMTP
[19:20] <Kilos> ty
[19:21] <kbmonkey> and enter<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[19:21] <nuvolari> whoops, need to change my signature :P
[19:21] <Kilos> now it asks for my mobile fone number
[19:21] <Kilos> grrrr
[19:22] <nuvolari> kbmonkey: I figured it needs the application-specific password again
[19:22] <nuvolari> so it's worknig now
[19:22] <kbmonkey> skip that Kilos its just their security update thingy
[19:22] <kbmonkey> app specific password?
[19:23] <kbmonkey> ha ha it was working all along nuvolari, I just didnt realize I can Enter on the mailbox :p
[19:24] <kbmonkey> labels and all
[19:24] <Kilos> now it wants to open evince%
[19:24] <Kilos> grrr
[19:24] <Kilos> when you said skip that i hit enter
[19:24] <kbmonkey> i followed this one nuvolari https://www.cs.virginia.edu/~csadmin/wiki/index.php/Settin
[19:25] <kbmonkey> but that link you sent me for the labels is the final clue
[19:26] <Kilos> found the click here to skip this step
[19:26] <kbmonkey> :)
[19:26] <nuvolari> kbmonkey: does your labels work?
[19:27] <kbmonkey> yes
[19:27] <nuvolari> kbmonkey: the app-specific password you need to use when you enabled 2-step verification in your google account
[19:27] <kbmonkey> but you know my link, it sets up a second mail folder, that one has labels that work, but the INBOX label shows empty :p
[19:27] <kbmonkey> ooooh
[19:28] <kbmonkey> but the Gmail/All Mail label works
[19:29] <Kilos> nuvolari, do i now scroll down to create for this google site thing
[19:29] <kbmonkey> this is too cool
[19:29] <Kilos> it shows my site
[19:30] <kbmonkey> did you create one Kilos?
[19:30] <nuvolari> Kilos: hmm, not sure how the rest of the site stuffies work on elinks
[19:30] <Kilos> does it now want to topen a new site or is that the place for this 100m thingie
[19:31] <Kilos> no man i talking about my yola site i think its showing here
[19:32] <Kilos> lol it says mileyssite shared with everyone in the world
[19:32] <Kilos> but thats at yola no google?
[19:34] <kbmonkey> yola?
[19:34] <Kilos> cant scroll to create it goes past
[19:34] <Kilos> Maaz, kilos.site
[19:34] <Maaz> http://mileys-site.yolasite.com/
[19:35] <kbmonkey> thanks nuvolari for recommending alpine! you the best!
[19:35] <Kilos> dunno how that linked to google
[19:36] <Kilos> cant scroll to create or click it
[19:36] <Kilos> i give up now
[19:36] <Kilos> head thumping
[19:37] <Kilos> grr grr
[19:37] <kbmonkey> sjoe sounds like a problem Kilos
[19:38] <Kilos> lol yeah they want me to use a standard browser
[19:38] <Kilos> swines
[19:38] <nuvolari> :D got my folders worknig at last :P
[19:38] <nuvolari> no problem kbmonkey
[19:38] <nuvolari> Kilos: hang on
[19:39] <nuvolari> let me check
[19:39] <kbmonkey> via the Message [I]ndex?
[19:39] <Kilos> ok
[19:40] <nuvolari> Kilos: ok, what do yo uwant to do? I can see your site at https://sites.google.com/site/mileyssite
[19:41] <kbmonkey> il look now now Kilos
[19:41] <nuvolari> Maaz: kilos.site is http://mileys-site.yolasite.com and https://sites.google.com/site/mileyssite
[19:41] <Maaz> nuvolari: I already know stuff about kilos.site
[19:41] <nuvolari> Maaz: forget about kilos.site
[19:41] <Maaz> nuvolari: I didn't know about about kilos.site anyway
[19:41] <nuvolari> Maaz: kilos.site is http://mileys-site.yolasite.com and https://sites.google.com/site/mileyssite
[19:41] <Maaz> nuvolari: I already know stuff about kilos.site
[19:42] <Kilos> what site is that nuvolari
[19:42] <Kilos> when did i create that sight al google
[19:43] <nuvolari> Kilos: long ago :P
[19:43] <Kilos> is that a 100m site
[19:43] <Kilos> oh my
[19:43] <Kilos> pissed again
[19:43] <nuvolari> it says posted june 23, 2010
[19:43] <Kilos> too much coffee\
[19:43] <Kilos> wow
[19:43] <nuvolari> by you oom Kilos :P
[19:43] <Kilos> but cant be anything in it
[19:44] <Kilos> ok so,is that a 100m one
[19:44] <Kilos> or another website
[19:44] <nuvolari> Kilos: it's that one
[19:44] <nuvolari> the 100mb one
[19:45] <Kilos> oh are they not a new thing
[19:45] <nuvolari> how do you mean?
[19:45] <Kilos> well thats last year already
[19:45] <Kilos> is that what i must use to get tara to post songs to
[19:47] <nuvolari> Kilos: well, that is your personal one
[19:47] <nuvolari> the ideal would be that she creates her own, then give you the link to download
[19:47] <nuvolari> otherwise you can give her permission to post to your site
[19:47] <Kilos> oh cant you post to my one
[19:47] <Kilos> lol thats what i mean
[19:48] <nuvolari> ye, you just need to, say, create a special page which only certain people can see
[19:48] <nuvolari> and then allow her to modify that page
[19:48] <nuvolari> because as it is now, anyone can view stuff
[19:48] <Kilos> eish
[19:49] <Kilos> i stuck in the help and dunno how to go back
[19:50] <Kilos> thats fine if its music from her. i dont mind sharing then i dont have to give youtube links to evryone
[19:50] <nuvolari> cool
[19:50] <nuvolari> but you still need to give her permission
[19:50] <Kilos> but how do i get out of the help and go back
[19:50] <nuvolari> hmm
[19:50] <nuvolari> Kilos: in elinks?
[19:51] <Kilos> and how do i give permission to her and yous
[19:51] <Kilos> yip in elinks
[19:51] <nuvolari> doesn't it go back when you press left-arrow?
[19:51] <Kilos> sec
[19:51] <Kilos> ja slim seun
[19:52] <Kilos> now how do i give permissions
[19:52] <bakuman> 0_0
[19:52] <Kilos> hi bakuman
[19:52] <bakuman> hi Kilos :)
[19:53] <Kilos> ender hehe i membered
[19:53] <bakuman> haha yea, damn, cant get a thing past you :)
[19:53] <Kilos> lol thats because its not 24 hours yet
[19:54] <nuvolari> Kilos: hmm, gimme a sec, need to check
[19:54] <Kilos> k
[19:56] <nuvolari> google rocks
[19:56] <Kilos> i need to give you two and the fly and gussie permissions for now
[19:56] <nuvolari> and if my phone decides to get a life, I can verify myself :P
[19:56] <Kilos> are you using elinks nuvolari
[19:56] <Kilos> lol
[19:56] <nuvolari> ye oom, I need to be able to tell you if it's possible :P
[19:56] <nuvolari> *using elinks
[19:56] <Kilos> i dont get mail to fone as well
[19:57] <Kilos> dankie seun
[19:57] <nuvolari> I don't believe it.
[19:58] <Kilos> im at 992k data so gotta do it without too much hunting
[19:58] <nuvolari> they are awesome
[19:58] <Kilos> lol waht
[19:58] <nuvolari> I colud log in
[19:59] <nuvolari> *could
[20:00] <nuvolari> ag no :-/
[20:00] <kbmonkey> sorry guys ill see you laters :)
[20:00] <nuvolari> Kilos: it looks like you'll need to use a normal browser just to enable the permissions
[20:00] <nuvolari> cheers kbmonkey
[20:00] <Kilos> toods kbmonkey
[20:00] <nuvolari> happy alpining
[20:00] <nuvolari> :P
[20:00] <Kilos> eish
[20:00] <bakuman> so what are you guys doing?
[20:01] <nuvolari> Kilos: the permissions link is not clickable in elinks :-/
[20:01] <nuvolari> bakuman: helping uncle Kilos to get his site going
[20:01] <bakuman> oe... is there something up yet?
[20:01] <Kilos> in elinks browser bakuman
[20:03] <bakuman> why on elinks?
[20:04] <Kilos> to save data bakuman
[20:04] <Kilos> ver limited here
[20:05] <Kilos> 2m per day
[20:05] <bakuman> im not exactly with you. are you trying to view your own site with elinks, or make it elinks friendly so other people can use it?
[20:08] <Kilos> i need to use elinks to go there cause a normal browser eats data
[20:08] <bakuman> ah, is it easier thank using lynx? cause that could also work
[20:08] <Kilos> and i need to set my site there to get music from my daughter so i can wget it and not need to go to youtube
[20:09] <bakuman> cool
[20:10] <Kilos> have you heard her sing bakuman
[20:10] <bakuman> would not know who she is
[20:10] <Kilos> can you go youtube
[20:10] <bakuman> yea
[20:11] <Kilos> sec i look for the link
[20:14] <Kilos> eish i lost it somewhere i ask nuvolari
[20:14] <Kilos> nuvolari, do you have tara's youtube link please
[20:15] <nuvolari> hmm, need to have a look, hang on
[20:15] <Kilos> i lose things day to day
[20:15] <Kilos> sorry bakuman
[20:21] <bakuman> haha its fine :)
[20:21] <Kilos> she is in aus
[20:21] <Kilos> never met her yet
[20:22] <Kilos> we met on facebook near 2 years ago for the first time
[20:24] <bakuman> ah cool :)
[20:28] <Kilos> bakuman, i think this is it
[20:28] <Kilos> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmLemlIDCl0
[20:28] <Kilos> had to plug in external to find it
[20:29] <Kilos> the song to watch is I will always love you in the xfactor audition
[20:31] <Kilos> http://saveyoutube.com/watch?v=dXP2GdqYCOM
[20:31] <Kilos> or that one maybe bakuman
[20:31] <Kilos> i get lost
[20:32] <Kilos> if you have cap probs wait for nuvolari to verify
[20:32] <bakuman> haha ok :)
[20:33] <Kilos> youtube isnt shy to use data
[20:33] <Kilos> its for adsl uncapped peeps
[20:33] <nuvolari> Maaz: tara.link
[20:33] <Maaz> nuvolari: Huh?
[20:34] <nuvolari> :?
[20:34] <nuvolari> Maaz: tara.link is http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmLemlIDCl0
[20:34] <Maaz> nuvolari: I'll remember that
[20:34] <Kilos> ty nuvolari
[20:37] <Kilos> bakuman, ^^
[20:37] <Kilos> zeref, you seen my brat?
[20:44] <zeref> brat??
[20:44] <zeref> oh
[20:44] <zeref> ummmmm, no
[20:45] <Kilos> you havent got data probs hey
[20:45] <Kilos> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmLemlIDCl0
[20:45] <bakuman> telkom 8gb
[20:46] <bakuman> have 500mb for last few days
[20:46] <Kilos> eish
[20:47] <superfly> too much backlog to read this late at night
[20:47] <bakuman> haha
[20:47] <Kilos> lol
[20:47] <Kilos> hiya fly
[20:47] <Kilos> you free now
[20:47] <Kilos> or work tomorrow
[20:48] <superfly> Kilos: free, today was my last day
[20:49] <Kilos> yay
[20:49] <bakuman> i still have 1 hectic week lest
[20:49] <bakuman> *left
[20:50] <Kilos> thats good bakuman
[20:51] <bakuman> wrote today, report monday, presentation wednesday
[20:51] <bakuman> lol, top comment: She can actually smile and sing at the same time
[20:52] <Kilos> lol
[20:52] <Kilos> she can sing hey
[20:52] <bakuman> yea :)
[20:53] <Kilos> she has now entered The Voice Aus as well
[20:53] <bakuman> ok, time to clean up, i was in the roof earlier, so very dusty, cheerz
[20:54] <Kilos> cheers bakuman
[20:57] <nuvolari> Maaz: tara.link is https://sites.google.com/site/mileyssite/tara
[20:57] <Maaz> nuvolari: I already know stuff about tara.link
[20:57] <Kilos> lol
[20:57] <nuvolari> Maaz: forget tara.link
[20:57] <Maaz> nuvolari: Sure
[20:57] <nuvolari> Maaz: tara.link is https://sites.google.com/site/mileyssite/tara
[20:57] <Maaz> nuvolari: If you say so
[20:57] <nuvolari> Maaz: tara.link
[20:57] <Maaz> nuvolari: tara.link is https://sites.google.com/site/mileyssite/tara
[20:57] <nuvolari> :>
[20:57] <Kilos> dankie boetie
[20:58] <nuvolari> Kilos: ^^ piekfyn
[20:58] <nuvolari> plesier oom!
[20:58] <nuvolari> oh
[20:58] <nuvolari> lol, dit was alreeds reg
[20:58] <Kilos> lol
[20:58] <zeref> sigh
[20:59] <nuvolari> o wag nee
[20:59] <nuvolari> ok. anyway. it's done
[20:59]  * nuvolari hands zeref a glass of sugar water
[20:59] <nuvolari> what's wrong za?
[20:59] <nuvolari> er, zeref
[21:00] <Kilos> zeref, you use 8ta contract hey
[21:00] <nuvolari> Maaz: Kilos.site
[21:00] <nuvolari> Maaz: kilos.site
[21:00] <nuvolari> :?
[21:00] <Kilos> saw they doing 3g for R149
[21:00] <Maaz> http://mileys-site.yolasite.com/
[21:00] <nuvolari> maaz!
[21:01] <Maaz> http://mileys-site.yolasite.com/
[21:01] <nuvolari> ah
[21:01] <nuvolari> just being slow
[21:01] <Kilos> dunno if its contract as well or pay as you go
[21:01] <nuvolari> Maaz: forget kilos.site
[21:01] <Maaz> nuvolari: Sure
[21:01] <nuvolari> Maaz: kilos.site is http://mileys-site.yolasite.com and https://sites.google.com/site/mileyssite
[21:01] <Maaz> nuvolari: Got it
[21:01] <Kilos> well done nuvolari you are a star'
[21:02]  * nuvolari skitter
[21:02] <nuvolari> :P
[21:02] <Kilos> lol
[21:02] <nuvolari> Kilos: talking about sterre, sunday afternoon we saw Patricia Lewis on the beach :P
[21:02] <Kilos> superfly, when you going stateside
[21:03] <Kilos> she cute hey
[21:03] <Kilos> full of life
[21:03] <superfly> Kilos: we leave on Monday evening, and get there on Tuesday evening
[21:03] <nuvolari> lol if you say so oom :P
[21:03] <Kilos> enjoy every minute superfly
[21:03] <superfly> Kilos: ek sal so probeer oom
[21:03] <Kilos> nuvolari, is she fat now?
[21:04] <nuvolari> whoot! my sis is visiting form Australia from the 29th of november
[21:04] <Kilos> yay tell her bring debs with
[21:04] <nuvolari> Kilos: nope, she's just never been my kinda woman :P
[21:04] <nuvolari> shame, my ma verlang baie
[21:04] <zeref> Kilos: no
[21:04] <Kilos> only her nose is too big and she bietjie voor op die wa
[21:05] <zeref> I'm cell c :P
[21:05] <Kilos> but thats show biz
[21:05] <nuvolari> lol? her nose? I've never noticed her nose
[21:05] <zeref> nuvolari: being compiling a program and fixing errors the whole day
[21:05] <Kilos> lol
[21:06] <Kilos> jy is stout
[21:06] <Kilos> waar kyk jy dan
[21:06] <Kilos> hehe
[21:09] <superfly> nuvolari: does she have as much cleavage in real life? it's about the only thing you see when you google for "patricia lewis"...
[21:09] <superfly> :-P
[21:09] <Kilos> lol
[21:09] <Kilos> whew
[21:09] <Kilos> you naughty too
[21:09] <Kilos> look at her nose
[21:09] <Kilos> she is breast feeding a baby
[21:10] <superfly> Kilos: no, I just couldn't remember what she looks like, so I googled for her
[21:10] <Kilos> ya ya
[21:10] <superfly> and oom, breastfeeding has nothing to do with the size of a woman's bosom
[21:10] <Kilos> oh yes
[21:10] <Kilos> the get full
[21:10] <Kilos> they
[21:11] <Kilos> but she has always been well endowed
[21:11] <Kilos> cant bump her nose against the wall
[21:12] <Kilos> eish look at the time
[21:12] <Kilos> no wonder i am swaying onna chair
[21:12] <Kilos> night all. sleep tight
[21:12] <Kilos> see ya morrow
[21:15] <nuvolari> bwahahaha superfly
[21:15] <superfly> nuvolari: ?
[21:15] <nuvolari> well, nothing popped out, that I noticed
[21:15] <superfly> hahahaha
[21:16] <nuvolari> she and her hubby and the kid was out for a walk along the beach, so no bathing suit
[21:16] <superfly> nuvolari: she wears plenty form-fitting, low-cut dresses from what I see on teh Google
[21:17] <nuvolari> superfly: ya, especially for her shows
[21:17] <nuvolari> but I guess that's to take people's attention off her brain :P
[21:18] <nuvolari> I don't think there is too much in there
[21:18] <nuvolari> but I might just get in trouble for saying that
[21:18] <superfly> hahaha
[21:18]  * nuvolari rather keeps quiet
[21:20] <nuvolari> ok, bedtime
[21:20]  * nuvolari out
[21:20] <superfly> me too
[21:20] <nuvolari> o/
[21:20] <nuvolari> night superfly
[21:20] <superfly> night nuvolari
[21:20] <superfly> don't be so much of a stranger
[21:21] <nuvolari> :-/ Can't promise much. Tough weekend ahead and work coming out of my ears


[01:04] <xorgnak> woud anyone know what the discover1 package has been moved to for 10.10?
[01:07] <xorgnak> nevermind... if anyone's curious for remixes, discover1 has been depreciated to discover
[01:14] <slangasek> SpamapS: hi; still around?
[01:29] <r3d2> hey you guys. i just downloaded my first source code so i can get an idea of how linux programs are written....i picked a relatively small program, mousepad. and after i "sudo apt-get source mousepad" it seems like everything worked out
[01:29] <r3d2> but now i have 1 folder and 3 files for it
[01:30] <r3d2> mousepad.diff.gz mousepad.tarr.gs and mousepad.dsc
[01:30] <r3d2> what are all those?
[01:31] <RAOF> mousepad.dsc is some metadata about the source package, mousepad.diff.gz is the difference between the upstream source and the Ubuntu source package, and mousepad.orig.tar.gz is the original source.
[01:31] <r3d2> ah nice
[01:31] <r3d2> thank you
[01:31] <r3d2> that explains it all lol
[04:45] <YokoZar> what are the ways that Universe might be unchecked?
[04:45] <YokoZar> Is there an option at install, for instance?
[04:49]  * micahg thought it was disabled by default
[05:05] <vish> there is an option during which enables the restricted and multiverse repos but as micahg says nothing enables universe until user selects it
[07:21] <pitti> Good morning
[07:23] <pitti> cody-somerville: no, it isn't; apport doesn't use notifications at all; also, web browser should be opened as user indeed
[07:24] <cody-somerville> pitti, if you click links in dialogues, they open as root
[07:24] <cody-somerville> pitti, for example, the link to trying out upstream kernel
[07:24] <pitti> cody-somerville: you mean in the kernel dialogs?
[07:25] <pitti> right, that's GTK itself
[07:25] <pitti> perhaps there's a way I can override the default URL handler in GTK
[07:25] <pitti> when apport opens the browser for bug filing, it uses some tricks to go "back" to the user's account
[07:26]  * cody-somerville nods.
[07:30] <alkisg> Hi, can someone re-open LP bug #580961, as it's not fixed yet?
[07:32] <maco> alkisg: you tried it with version 6.0-4ubuntu1 in 11.04 alpha 2?
[07:33] <alkisg> maco: yes, I posted why it's broken in the bug report
[07:33] <alkisg> It looks like part of the patch is missing
[07:34] <maco> alkisg: ok, reverted to triaged
[07:35] <maco> or well...as soon as my web browser goes as bit faster....
[07:36] <alkisg> Thank you. To clarify, it's still not working, i.e. a regression from previous Ubuntu versions, I'm not asking for anything new like autodetection (like others in that bug report do ask).
[07:39] <dholbach> good morning!
[08:06] <didrocks> good morning
[08:09] <pitti> hey dholbach, bonjour didrocks
[08:12] <didrocks> hey pitti
[08:23] <dholbach> hey pitti
[08:23] <kklimonda> jdstrand: btw, the other thing you thought I was talking about is still important, but it just wasn't as important to me ;)
[08:39] <cjwatson> vish: not true, universe has been enabled by default since feisty
[08:39] <cjwatson> (not on the live CD though, but in installs)
[09:00] <vish> cjwatson: odd.. the last time i installed with natty cd it made me choose universe to install banshee..
[09:00]  * vish will check but trusts cjwatson more ;)
[09:03] <seb128> hum
[09:03] <seb128> does anybody has any clue about bug #717516?
[09:04] <seb128> slangasek, pitti, cjwatson: ^ not sure who is tracking plymouth issues nowadays, seems something to check but I'm not sure what to ask on the bug
[09:05] <cjwatson> there was a plymouth bug that soren fixed yesterday
[09:05] <cjwatson> haven't actually read that report but make sure that the user isn't using plymouth 0.8.2-2ubuntu15 or 0.8.2-2ubuntu16
[09:05] <seb128> cjwatson, he says he still get the issue on 17 in the bug
[09:06] <cjwatson> soren: did you commit your patch anywhere?  I don't see it in lp:ubuntu/plymouth
[09:12] <seb128> cjwatson, thanks, I've added a comment pointing to the bug fixed in ubuntu17 and asked some details
[09:15] <Riddell> @pilot in
[09:15] <pitti> whee, Scottish airpatchlines!
[09:17]  * dholbach hugs Riddell
[09:34] <apw> cjwatson, can you remind me  when we enabled the grub graphical handoff at the grub level?  was that after A1 ?
[09:35] <cjwatson> apw: Wed, 24 Nov 2010 13:59:55 +0000
[10:24] <soren> cjwatson: Gah, sorry.
[10:24] <soren> cjwatson: I wanted to wait until it was accepted into the archive, but got sidetracked.
[10:25] <soren> cjwatson: Pushed.
[10:31] <seb128> dholbach, did someone point already that the sponsoring queue have wrong urls for merge requests today?
[10:31] <dholbach> seb128, no, not yet
[10:31] <seb128> dholbach, it has api.launchpad.net/1.0/.... instead of "code.launchpad.net"
[10:31] <dholbach> ah yes
[10:32] <seb128> dholbach, it's likely a side effect of the fix they did yesterday after breaking things still using "edge" in their code
[10:32] <seb128> dholbach, you should probably port your code to use "production" rather than edge
[10:32] <seb128> should be trivial
[10:32] <dholbach> yes part of it was, yesterday
[10:32] <seb128> dholbach, well yesterday it just crashed, they did online patching to fix the redirect
[10:32] <seb128> but seems it's not perfect
[10:33] <dholbach> yes, I know
[10:33] <dholbach> working on it
[10:33] <seb128> dholbach, danke
[10:33] <dholbach> that's why I said "part"
[10:33] <seb128> ;-)
[10:34] <dholbach> nice, bdrung already fixed it
[10:34] <dholbach> seb128, should be fixed with next cron run
[10:35] <seb128> dholbach, excellent
[10:35] <seb128> bdrung, dholbach: thanks
[10:53] <Riddell> zul: python-django-nova packaging is GPL 2, I think canonical policy is for GPL 3
[10:54] <Riddell> zul: I've accepted but you should check that
[10:54] <soren> \o/
[11:17] <\sh> moins
[11:23] <siretart> hi \sh!
[11:30] <\sh> hey siretart...how's life?
[11:30] <siretart> \sh: not too bad, a bit stressful, but otherwise making progress. how are you and family?
[11:31] <nigelb> g40
[11:31] <nigelb> ugh, sorry
[11:35] <\sh> siretart: fine..wife is waiting in belgium, that our nice and nephew are born...and I'm still at KA and merging from netviewer to citrix online ;)
[11:36] <siretart> \sh: :-)
[11:36] <\sh> siretart: means our company just reported the closing of the deal between citrix and netviewer ;) so we are now a 100% division of them ;)
[11:38] <siretart> wow. does this relate in any way to your dc^2 project?
[11:39] <\sh> siretart: dunno...but I still have some weeks of time to think about staying with this company or to change to another company or to just leave all that behind and become self-employed (or in the worst case, hartz IV ;))
[11:40] <siretart> \sh: don't make (bad) jokes about that
[11:41] <siretart> \sh: but while I have you here, is there some installation guide or something available for dc2? I'm considering to deploy it.
[11:41] <\sh> siretart: no..I mean that...well, I have some nice job proposals
[11:41] <siretart> :-)
[11:42] <\sh> siretart: nope...but I can guide you if you want...I have to push another branch to trunk to make especially the qooxdoo frontend more usable with self deployed installations
[11:43] <\sh> and there are two other branches to switch dc² from mysql to couchdb, and to integrate some amazon ec2 management to it...it's still work in progress but hey :)
[11:43] <siretart> sure, I imagine. for a starter, the precise installation requirements would help me
[11:44] <siretart> but perhaps we should move that to a more appropriate channel ;-)
[11:44] <\sh> siretart: #dc2 ;)
[11:44] <siretart> oftc or freenode?
[11:44] <\sh> freenode
[12:15] <Riddell> cjwatson: thanks for fixing bug 705917 :)
[12:20] <cjwatson> np
[13:21] <zyga> doko_, ping
[13:31] <MadCow108> hi, when I want to backport a bugfix in a debian native package (format 3) for ubuntu, do I still use the debian/patches method or do I just directly patch the source as I would do it for debian?
[13:33] <MadCow108> the former would additionally require to add quilt to the build depends
[13:34] <cjwatson> er, a *native* package?
[13:35] <cjwatson> what does 'cat debian/source/format' say?
[13:35] <pitti> MadCow108: I'd apply inline for native packages
[13:35] <cjwatson> Debian and Ubuntu are just the same in this regard, but your question is confusingly phrased in a way which makes me think one of us is misunderstanding something
[13:36] <pitti> ITHM "3.0 (native)"?
[13:36] <MadCow108> 3.0 (native)
[13:36] <cjwatson> it's not clear, that's why I asked
[13:36] <hallyn> anyone else seeing garbled gnome-terminal text with 2.6.38-3 ?
[13:36] <cjwatson> you don't use the debian/patches method in either Debian or Ubuntu for native packages
[13:36] <cjwatson> you apply it inline, and there is no need to build-depend on quilt
[13:36]  * hallyn figures kirkland will chime in
[13:36] <MadCow108> ok
[13:36] <cjwatson> because you wouldn't be using quilt
[13:37] <MadCow108> I was just wondering as the qult method would make it a bit easier to see the differences between the debian and ubuntu version
[13:37] <cjwatson> you can see that by just diffing the packages
[13:37] <cjwatson> but no, that would involve changing from native to quilt format and we try hard not to make that sort of fundamental change to a package's format in Ubuntu
[13:37] <MadCow108> ok thanks
[13:38] <Riddell> mvo: are you going to update natty for bug 556189 ?
[13:40] <mvo> Riddell: this is just a stale status, I fix that
[13:41] <doko_> zyga: pong
[13:42] <zyga> doko_, who should I ask to debug stale pymodules cache?
[13:44] <doko_> zyga: either barry or me. could you be a bit more specific?
[13:44] <zyga> doko_, drop in to #ubuntuone please
[13:49] <zyga> doko, ralsina and me are trying to understand and debug something that seems to be stale cache of pyc files after an older installation
[13:49] <zyga> doko_, we'll file a bug and I'll ping you about it if you don't mind
[13:51] <tumbleweed> zyga: which package? It's quite possible that there are stayle .pyc files in the python path, if it was uploaded inbetween python2.7 support and python-support being updated
[13:51] <zyga> tumbleweed, this is still on maverick, and seems to be reproducible
[13:52] <zyga> tumbleweed, ralsina on #ubuntone understands more
[14:07] <asac> didrocks: master ... how painful is it to backport the current unity stuff to maverick?
[14:07] <asac> or are you guys actually maintaining a backport somewhereß
[14:07] <asac> ?
[14:07] <didrocks> asac: we stopped backporting it because it's really painful
[14:08] <didrocks> asac: you need to backport compiz and all plugins + a lot of package from the unity and appmenu world
[14:08] <didrocks> and soon, you will need the latest glib
[14:08] <asac> grr
[14:08] <asac> why are folks always jumping on the latest crack :)
[14:09] <didrocks> asac: yeah, people are crazy… :)
[14:15] <sebner> asac: because old stuff is boring ;)
[14:17] <asac> its really dog style of development ;)
[14:56] <kirkland> hallyn: kirkland reading scrollback
[14:57] <kirkland> hallyn: garbled terminal text?  no....
[15:21] <ogra> could an archive admin promote unity-2d, libqtgconf, libqtbamf and libqtdee to main ? (MIR bugs are bug #708649, bug: #708661, bug: #708659 and bug: #708658
[15:47] <pitti> ogra: yup, doing
[15:48]  * ogra hugs pitti
[15:48] <pitti> kein Problem :) *hug*
[16:08] <kirkland> pitti: hey
[16:09] <pitti> kirkland: hey Dustin, how are you?
[16:09] <kirkland> pitti: fine thanks :-)
[16:09] <kirkland> pitti: okay, so ecryptfs-utils version in lucid and maverick were identical, hence that upload was rejected
[16:09] <kirkland> pitti: how does this look:
[16:09] <kirkland> ecryptfs-utils (83-0ubuntu3.1-maverick) maverick-proposed; urgency=low
[16:10] <pitti> kirkland: ah, usually we do somehting like x.10.04 and x.10.10, but as we already have lucid, "3.1maverick" works
[16:10] <pitti> kirkland: no dash, please, as this is the separator of upstream-revision
[16:10] <kirkland> pitti: cool
[16:10] <kirkland> ecryptfs-utils (83-0ubuntu3.1maverick) maverick-proposed; urgency=low
[16:10] <kirkland> pitti: done;  re-uploading now
[16:10] <pitti> kirkland: thanks!
[16:11] <kirkland> pitti: done
[16:11] <kirkland> pitti: thanks, mate!
[16:32] <smoser> geser, bug 715818 is fixed.
[16:32] <geser> smoser: thanks
[16:32] <smoser> thank you for your help. I irresponsibly failed to credit you in changelog. for that i am sorry.
[16:32] <geser> np
[16:35] <Riddell> mterry: could bug 676512 get some MIR assignment love?
[16:35] <mterry> Riddell, I'll check
[17:34] <ogra> pitti, hmm, unity-2d doesnt show up in main yet
[17:34] <ogra> (netbook-meta update tells me its unknown)
[17:35]  * ogra thinks after
[17:35] <ogra> 3h it should be there
[17:36] <ogra> oh, its only 2h
[17:54] <RoAkSoAx> stgraber: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/dllist is empty and there are ISO's available in the tracker
[17:54] <RoAkSoAx> any ideas why?
[17:56] <stgraber> RoAkSoAx: that's weird, let me check
[17:57] <stgraber> RoAkSoAx: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/info/5015
[17:57] <stgraber> RoAkSoAx: seems to happen with all the builds
[17:58] <stgraber> so dllist doesn't return anything as it can't get the info from cdimage
[17:59] <stgraber> RoAkSoAx: I guess that the current magic to find the right file on cdimage doesn't cover the point releases
[17:59] <RoAkSoAx> stgraber: ah I see
[18:00] <stgraber> marjo: ^
[18:16] <RoAkSoAx> Riddell: till what time are you piloting?
[18:28] <Riddell> RoAkSoAx: until I sign off :)
[18:32] <RoAkSoAx> Riddell: lol ok :)/. Let me know cause I'm up next :)
[18:33] <Riddell> RoAkSoAx: oh you can add yourself too I'm sure
[18:33] <Riddell> just do @pilot in
[18:38] <gaurav_pawaskar> hi people, I want to know.. when bug is raised .. how do we identify, which all packages are related to that bug?
[18:39] <RoAkSoAx> @pilot in
[18:52] <mdeslaur> mvo: have you got a minute? I want to update flashplugin-nonfree in hardy from v9 to v10. There is another package that some people install called "libflashsupport" that ships a library that is incompatible with v10.
[18:52] <mdeslaur> mvo: of course, even if I try to conflicts/replaces it, update-manager in hardy won't remove it
[18:52] <mdeslaur> mvo: is my only hope to ship a dummy libflashsupport update that is empty?
[18:57]  * ogra glares at bug 9068
[18:57] <ogra> mandriva uses casper ?!?
[18:59] <mdeslaur> mvo: hmm..I'll try adding a transitional package to flashplugin-nonfree
[19:00] <marjo> stgraber: I noted same to jibel; will fix in future point releases
[19:04] <cjwatson> stgraber: in the case of http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/info/5015, that should be /lucid/dvd/...
[19:04] <cjwatson> stgraber: generally, put lucid/ before the "daily", "daily-live", or "dvd" bit
[19:05]  * ogra wonders how long main promotion takes nowadays
[19:05] <ogra> publisher should have run several times now
[19:05] <cjwatson> I probably forgot to release the lock after my manual work earlier today
[19:05] <ogra> oh
[19:06] <cjwatson> released, hopefully the next run will work
[19:06] <cjwatson> sorry about that
[19:06] <ogra> thanks
[19:06] <ogra> no problem
[19:34] <kees> pitti: is /etc/default/apport's "maxsize" actually used anywhere?
[19:42] <Riddell> @pilot out
[19:52] <ari-tczew> cjwatson: lilo 23 in Debian. what's the decision?
[19:56] <cjwatson> ari-tczew: I followed up to the bug
[19:56] <ari-tczew> cjwatson: stay with 22?
[19:56]  * cjwatson wonders why he is on the hook for lilo - I'm a grub developer, I'd rather not deal with lilo
[19:57] <cjwatson> ari-tczew: are you prepared to deal with all issues that arise from upgrading?
[19:58] <cjwatson> e.g. subscribe to all lilo and lilo-installer bugs until at least the natty release
[19:58] <ari-tczew> cjwatson: guess no
[19:58] <cjwatson> then I think we ought to merge up to what was released in squeeze, and let the new version shake out in Debian for a while
[19:58] <cjwatson> that seems like a reasonable course of action to me.  do you agree?
[19:59] <cjwatson> without somebody paying attention to it in Ubuntu, I think we should be fairly conservative and stick with what we would have done if it hadn't had Ubuntu modifications - sync up to Debian import freeze
[20:00] <cjwatson> it's different when somebody has taken active ownership
[20:02] <ari-tczew> cjwatson: I agree.
[20:06] <slangasek> SpamapS: ping
[20:12] <SpamapS> slangasek: pong hey. :)
[20:12] <SpamapS> slangasek: so, the restart action..
[20:12] <slangasek> yes!
[20:13] <SpamapS> slangasek: in discussing with keybuk, he made it clear that it is intended to restart the job *without* reloading the job file.
[20:13] <slangasek> SpamapS: "it is intended" under what circumstances?
[20:13] <slangasek> I mean, that's what the 'restart' command is designed to do, right?
[20:14] <slangasek> but those are not the defined semantics of the init script interfaces
[20:14] <SpamapS> slangasek: right, it is designed to restart the job, without reloading the job config...
[20:14] <slangasek> and /lib/init/upstart-job accounts for this by calling stop && start instead of calling restart
[20:15] <slangasek> *because* we need to make sure we're forcing a reload of the job
[20:15] <SpamapS> It does.. oook.. good.
[20:15] <SpamapS> For some reason I thought it used the restart action.
[20:15] <slangasek> nah - I had this conversation with Keybuk a while ago :-)
[20:17] <SpamapS> slangasek: well glad I could occupy some of your brain-space for a few minutes. Carry on then.
[20:17] <slangasek> SpamapS: glad to help :)
[21:01] <kees> ari-tczew: nvclock> sounds fine; much easier that way.
[21:02] <ari-tczew> kees: about nbd: OK, Agreed with sync in natty+1. However, probably natty is affected by CVE and I'll prepare debdiff in CVE's bug.
[21:03] <ari-tczew> kees: about openssl: I'll _TRY_ to update d/changelog, but it seems to be hardcore to do
[21:05] <ari-tczew> kees: and now we are entering in problem: developers prefer to upload changes to archive without describe changes in details like e.g. d/rules: foo bar
[21:05] <ari-tczew> just 'foo bar' without describing changes in which files done
[21:05] <cjwatson> and that's perfectly reasonable
[21:06] <ari-tczew> cjwatson: what?
[21:06] <cjwatson> people who need that level of detail can look in a VCS - changelogs are a little bit more user-focused
[21:06] <kees> ari-tczew: nbd> yeah, the CVE fix is appreciated. I'd like to know how far back it goes, though.
[21:06] <cjwatson> while I do sometimes mention individual files in debian/changelog, I normally only describe the functional change made
[21:06] <kees> ari-tczew: openssl> yup; that's why merging can be difficult. unless you can understand and explain each change, it's not a good idea to just cargo-cult them forward.
[21:07] <kees> cjwatson: for merges, I like having the mapping.
[21:07] <cjwatson> I don't usually object when people include it, but it is in no way a requirement
[21:07] <ari-tczew> cjwatson: very very good solution! (sarcasm), now while merging contributor wastes time to looking about information changes, congrats
[21:08]  * cjwatson ignores ari-tczew in order to avoid breaching the code of conduct.
[21:08] <kees> ari-tczew: there's no need for that tone. developers each have their own preferences and time constraints.
[21:08] <ari-tczew> what breaching? I'm just telling the true
[21:09] <ari-tczew> sometimes it might hurt, though
[21:09] <kees> ari-tczew: I happen to prefer verbose merge logs, as it helps me review the work since I'm rarely a primary maintainer for packages.
[21:09] <kees> it's not a waste of time to understand the changes in a package when doing a merge.
[21:09] <ari-tczew> kees: bullshit
[21:10] <ari-tczew> I call this way an egoism
[21:10] <ari-tczew> I won't describe changes in details because someone else will do it while merging.
[21:11] <kees> I think you misunderstand the motivation.
[21:12] <kees> I happen to disagree with cjwatson's opinion on the level of detail, but that doesn't mean either of us is wrong.
[21:13] <cjwatson> for example, here's one of my changelog entries:
[21:13] <cjwatson>   * Use a separate build directory, eliminating the requirement to preserve
[21:13] <cjwatson>     some files by hand.
[21:13] <cjwatson> I don't see that that would gain anything by enumerating all the little details, and it would be a lot of noise for users.
[21:14] <ari-tczew> cjwatson: normal uses usually don't understand that specific changes
[21:14] <cjwatson> (This was a changelog entry written for Debian, but I write Debian and Ubuntu changelog entries essentially the same way and I happen to think that that's a good thing.)
[21:15] <cjwatson> People who need to know the exact details can look in a VCS, which is more convenient for that anyway.
[21:16] <kees> and I'm saying I prefer details for when package deltas get large.  e.g. lvm2 mdadm
[21:16] <ari-tczew> anyway, it's egoism
[21:18] <cjwatson> In some cases it can be useful, certainly
[21:18] <cjwatson> I just don't agree with mandating it in all cases; I've found that the cases where I need it are rare
[21:20] <ari-tczew> kees: so I have to more time for update d/changelog and I'll do it at the weekend because someone else WAS LAZY to do it appropriate
[21:21]  * ari-tczew True hurts, not breaking Code of Conduct.
[21:22] <kees> ari-tczew: you're making a judgement about cjwatson's opinions. I don't recommend doing that for anyone.
[21:23] <ari-tczew> kees: I'm just pointing what is wrong in development flow of work.
[21:24] <kees> ari-tczew: this is not a black and white issue. it's not wrong, it just makes merging later somewhat more difficult if you're unfamiliar with the package.
[21:24] <ari-tczew> but what do I know, I'm not developer with 10 years expierence
[21:25] <cjwatson> and honestly, nobody who doesn't make themselves fairly familiar with, say, grub2 is going to be able to merge it correctly anyway
[21:25] <cjwatson> so I've deliberately gone for trying to be a bit more concise there, while still describing the changes adequately to explain the differences versus Debian
[21:26] <cjwatson> not every piece of explanation needs to live in the changelog; it can often quite reasonably live elsewheree
[21:27] <cjwatson> aiming for concision in changelogs doesn't imply (in the extreme) writing comment-free ultra-obscure code just because you like it that way
[21:27] <ari-tczew> cjwatson: do I like? kees as sponsor requires it from me
[21:32] <smoser> i guess i'm missing something.
[21:32] <kees> smoser: ?
[21:32] <smoser> i bzr branch lp:ubuntu/natty/udev
[21:32] <smoser> cd udev
[21:33] <smoser> bzr bd -S ... sbuild -d natty-amd64 --arch-all ../udev_165-0ubuntu3.dsc
[21:33] <smoser> build fails unable to find linux/videodev.h:
[21:33] <ari-tczew> smoser: v4l is dead.
[21:34] <ari-tczew> smoser: you have to port package to support v4l2
[21:34] <smoser> hm.. i see i'm out of date. maybe i need to try with 166-0ubuntu1  which isn't synced yet to bzr repo
[21:35] <smoser> ari-tczew, i just want to build it. should not the above basically rebuild ?
[21:35] <poolie> hi smoser
[21:35] <ari-tczew> smoser: probably rebuild will result in FTBFS
[21:36] <smoser> hi poolie
[21:36] <ari-tczew> since linux/videodev.h is no longer supplied by linux-libc-dev
[21:52] <ari-tczew> zul: you might be interested in comments on https://code.launchpad.net/~ssalley/ubuntu/natty/likewise-open/likewise-open-fix-716615/+merge/49458
[22:06] <jdong> cjwatson: what's your opinion on the suitability of the natty patch for bug 232557 for SRU?
[22:07] <jdong> I just happened to run across a particularly horrendous occurrence of this bug leading to console-kit-daemon using close to 6GB memory
[22:08] <jdong> looks like the git patch is http://cgit.freedesktop.org/ConsoleKit/commit/?id=7b9212fa6aff55420c58f2cacd0a941762920337 from andersk
[22:52] <cjwatson> jdong: I haven't looked at the patch (not at my laptop), but your description of the problem sounds SRUable to me
[22:58] <jdong> cjwatson: *nods* Indeed the bug itself is IMO SRU-able, just the FDO bugzilla discussion worried me in that andersk seems to still express a correctness concern over the patch (e.g. a potential use-after-free)
[22:59] <jdong> but seeing how upstream accepted it into their latest release.... *shrug*
[23:00] <broder> jdong: did upstream end up taking Anders' followup _ref/_deref patch?
[23:01] <jdong> broder: I couldn't find evidence of that in git :-/ and the FDO bug didn't have any comments after that one.
[23:01] <jdong> https://bugs.freedesktop.org//show_bug.cgi?id=26227
[23:01] <broder> ugh
[23:13] <RoAkSoAx> kirkland: do you want timestamp in the logging for testdrive?
[23:14] <kirkland> RoAkSoAx: sure!
[23:28] <andersk> I posted another comment to poke upstream about that potential use-after-free.
[23:34] <jdong> andersk: thanks
[23:52] <chrisccoulson> slangasek, re bug 439007 - the retracer doesn't run on any firefox crashes now, as they all go directly upstream since lucid (using breakpad)
[23:54] <slangasek> chrisccoulson: well, that was reported pre-lucid, and anyway having them sent upstream doesn't help us any with triaging that bug report...


[08:40] <arim> hello?
[08:41] <arim> I made my usb boot ubuntu but everytime I unboot it changes aren't saved. I tried adding casper-rw file but that also didn't save. Is there another way to do that from Mac OSX?
[08:45] <arim> /