[06:05] <pitti> Good morning
[07:37] <mlankhorst> morning
[09:37] <mpt> m4n1sh, great job so far!
[09:39] <ogra_> seb128, hey, doe the image suffice for you guys ?
[09:40] <ogra_> *does
[09:40] <Laney> the daily?
[09:41] <ogra_> no, th daily is dead, thats why i put a "last-good-image" subdir in place (and mailed seb about it)
[09:41] <Laney> ah
[09:41] <Laney> got a link?
[09:41] <ogra_> its not as "good" as the name suggests though ... but it at least boots you into the installer
[09:41] <Laney> nm, found
[09:42] <ogra_> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-preinstalled/last-good-image/
[09:42] <ogra_> make sure to always hold the device in portrait mode .... else it starts drawing the installer windows offscreen
[09:42] <Laney> I have one here from 31/1 that worked IIRC
[09:43] <ogra_> and if you dont want to reboot multiple times to make the onboard focus work, better attach a kbd during install
[09:43] <ogra_> after installl all is fine
[09:44] <ogra_> the actual brekage we have is super wierd though ... and i cant really find if its lightdm's, upstarts or ubiquity-dm's fault :/
[09:44] <seb128> ogra_, thanks, I got the email, that's useful to have this image for the people who need to reinstall their tablet
[09:44] <ogra_> yeah
[09:44] <seb128> ogra_, sorry you had to spend your w.e on that :-(
[09:44] <ogra_> if you have raring already, better just upgrade though
[09:45] <ogra_> seb128, well, at least i had a fun birthday due to it :P
[09:45] <seb128> "fun"
[09:45] <ogra_> heh
[09:45]  * Laney is trying xnox's flashing thingy
[09:45] <seb128> ogra_, happy birthday btw! ;-)
[09:45] <ogra_> heh, thanks :)
[09:46] <ogra_> so what i found is that there seems to be a /tmp/.X0-lock (and there is actually an X process in the processlist) that prevents ubiquity-dm from starting ... i have no clue where that process comes from
[09:47] <ogra_> and indeed beyond some pam warnings from lightdm not a single log has any info
[09:47] <xnox> ogra_: \o/ thanks for last-good-image
[09:47] <ogra_> xnox, well, its not as good as you woulld think :)
[09:47] <xnox> Laney: =) usb-creator? --fastboot cause the user-job is not in place.
[09:48]  * ogra_ did a test install and it was really painful, none of the ubiquity fixes are in there
[09:48] <Laney> what?
[09:48] <Laney> ps. are you here?
[09:49] <xnox> "* Laney is trying xnox's flashing thingy" as in usb-creator that may or may not pop-up for you depending how recent usb-creator is for you.
[09:49] <xnox> Laney: I woke up late, so started working from home.
[09:49] <xnox> I am pondering to show up at lunch time tough.
[09:49]  * xnox ...though(?!)
[09:49] <Laney> it did pop up
[09:49] <xnox> good =)
[09:49] <Laney> the time remaining never updates
[09:50] <ogra_> xnox, but it uses the current/ image, no ?
[09:50] <Laney> that or 'Flashing user partition' has hung
[09:51] <xnox> ogra_: usb-creator doesn't download, so one has to pick/download/generate image oneself =)
[09:51] <Laney> i think this isn't going to finish
[09:51] <xnox> Laney: fastboot gives no progress indication so it's all fake =)
[09:51] <ogra_> ok
[09:52] <Laney> how long does it usually take?
[09:52] <ogra_> not more than 2min if i do it manually
[09:52] <xnox> Laney: does it pulse? (3 minutes usually. 5 minutes safe)
[09:52] <Laney> it's pulsing yeah
[09:52] <xnox> so it should be still flashing. you should get a pop up soon saying it's rebooting.
[09:53] <xnox> and then the installer will be unpacking the tarball.
[09:53] <xnox> ogra_: did plymouth fit into initramfs yet? cause I am thinking to show purple screen & feed unpacking tarball progress as plymouth messages with % updates if we can.
[09:54] <Laney> been way more than 5 minutes
[09:54]  * Laney does it manually :P
[09:55] <xnox> (unplugging the tablet half way through may get it stuck =/ )
[10:12] <TheMuso> RAOF: Pulse problem fixed, puls dpeneds on libpulse0 harder now, should hit the mirrors soonish.
[10:12] <TheMuso> Thanks for the report.
[10:14] <czajkowski> TheMuso: what pulse problem, curious as having woeful issues all weekend, where I have to stab and do the deathly dance of killall to pulseaudio each time to play any file.
[10:15] <TheMuso> czajkowski: What version of Ubuntu are you running? This is fo rarring, there was a slight issue with an internal pulse lib and package upgrading for raring and pulse 3.
[10:16] <czajkowski> TheMuso: yup raring
[10:17] <TheMuso> czajkowski: Ok, I don't think this will fix your issue, but please wait for pulseaudio 1:3.0-0ubuntu2 to be installed, file a bug, and plesae get a log from PulseAudio showing whats going on, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PulseAudio/Log.
[10:18] <czajkowski> nods will do thanks
[10:25] <ogra_> xnox, no, and it wont i fear, unless our kernel binary loses 2 of ots 4MB
[10:26] <xnox> *sigh*
[10:29] <ogra_> (or if plymouth itself goes on a diet, that one option i still wanted to look at)
[10:29] <ogra_> *thats
[10:29] <ogra_> for now though i need to find the issues with ubiquity-dm
[10:35] <m4n1sh> mpt: i guess Stefano "cando" Candori gets a lot of praise too :)
[10:35] <m4n1sh> plus diagnostic tab is still broken. Need to work on it
[10:37] <mpt> m4n1sh, I could give you a list of small visual glitches to fix, if you like, or maybe would you prefer to leave that until later
[10:38] <mpt> Looking at the Gnome Privacy stuff now
[10:38] <mpt> Last time I looked at it I couldn't understand what any of the settings were for
[10:47] <m4n1sh> mpt: tell me. Let me know
[10:47] <mpt> m4n1sh, I'm in meetings right now, but I'll e-mail you (unless there's an appropriate list to mail instead)
[10:47] <m4n1sh> you would have to think how to merge the gnome3 privacy/sharing stuff here. I can't figure out much on that. Not very good at UI things
[10:48] <m4n1sh> mpt: okay. not an issue. after you are done
[10:49] <m4n1sh> mpt: when done, you can send it to:  me -at- manishsinha -dot- net
[10:49] <mpt> ok
[10:50] <m4n1sh> is there anyone who can review a software sources merge proposal? I can't find mvo for a long time?
[10:52] <xnox> m4n1sh: URL?
[10:52] <m4n1sh> https://code.launchpad.net/~manishsinha/software-properties/fix-874766-updates-tab-failed-auth/+merge/148924
[10:53] <m4n1sh> xnox: ^
[10:54] <xnox> m4n1sh: looks simple enough, added to my todo list to follow up later.
[10:56] <m4n1sh> xnox: I want to do the same for other drop downs too. maybe  i can do that too
[11:01] <seb128> desrt,
[11:01] <seb128> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-preinstalled/last-good-image/
[11:01] <seb128> then instructions on
[11:01] <seb128> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Nexus7/Installation#Manually_Installing_Ubuntu_13.04_on_Nexus_7
[11:01] <mpt> m4n1sh, has the 3.8 Privacy stuff changed since <http://afaikblog.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/privacy.png>?
[11:02] <mpt> And is there an explanation of each of those options anywhere?
[11:02] <m4n1sh> mpt: any idea what that "usage and history" is about?
[11:02] <mpt> m4n1sh, no. :-)
[11:02] <mpt> It's a mysterious design.
[11:02] <m4n1sh> and what does diagnostic mean? what kind of error reporting daemon does gnome have? am I missing something
[11:03] <mpt> There's some wireframes at <https://live.gnome.org/Design/SystemSettings/Privacy#Tentative_Guidelines>
[11:04] <m4n1sh> whatever the changes needed for ubuntu privacy would have to be done for 13.10
[11:04] <desrt> seb128: got it, thanks
[11:04] <desrt> seb128: what did we miss this morning, anyway?
[11:05] <seb128> coffee?
[11:05] <m4n1sh> mpt: maybe I'll add ricotz PPA to see what is there in privacy of gnome 3.8
[11:05] <mpt> m4n1sh, LOL, "Location Services" is the name of a framework on iOS. They've copied it directly even though Gnome's framework has a different name.
[11:06] <mpt> (geoclue, right?)
[11:06] <m4n1sh> oh yeah. Didn't they deprecate geoclue in favour of something else?
[11:06] <mpt> don't know
[11:06] <m4n1sh> or did they deprecate something for geoclue. don't remember
[11:12] <ogra_> desrt, better make sure to always stay in portrait and have a kbd attached, else the install is painful
[11:13] <desrt> noted
[11:13]  * desrt is sitting at the 'preparing the root file system...' screen for a while now
[11:14] <ogra_> (the saddest part is that the current image has all xonx' fixes once i get the installer to run and works just flawless)
[11:14] <ogra_> *xnox
[11:15] <xnox> well, there are still some things to do =)
[11:17] <seb128> hum
[11:17] <seb128> adb is giving me a "error: device offline"
[11:17] <seb128> did anyone got that before?
[11:19] <xnox> seb128: did you have latest android update on the nexus7, it know requires to authenticate each machine you want to adb from.
[11:19] <xnox> by saying yes in the popup.
[11:19] <xnox> ?
[11:20] <seb128> xnox, hum, no prompt that I can see
[11:21] <seb128> xnox, it's running android 4.2.2 yes
[11:22] <xnox> first activate developer mode with 7x tap on the info item (or whatever it was) and then enable usb-debugging and then upon connecting a popup should appear on android.
[11:23] <seb128> xnox, how "connecting"?
[11:23] <seb128> I did enable the usb debugging, I can browse the mtp mount with nautilus
[11:23] <cyphermox> so is everyone just having major issues flashing and installing on the devices?
[11:24] <cyphermox> I'm reading backlog, saw desrt's and seb128's comments
[11:24] <seb128> cyphermox, current daily is broken, see the email I sent to the team this morning
[11:24] <cyphermox> ah
[11:24] <cyphermox> didn't get that far yet
[11:31] <desrt> ogra_: so onscreen keyboard in the installer is pretty flaky...
[11:31] <desrt> is this what you were talking about?
[11:31] <ogra_> desrt, yes
[11:32] <ogra_> it works randomly after a few reboots, but i would really recommend to use a real kbd
[11:32] <desrt> i did :)
[11:32] <ogra_> good :)
[11:32] <ogra_> after install all should be fine
[11:33] <xnox> ogra_: please seed oem-config-slideshow-ubuntu onto the image (if we have space) it's very pretty =)
[11:34] <ogra_> we dont have any space ... in fact we are 2M above the specced 660M already
[11:34] <ogra_> will do once i switched to xz though
[11:34] <ogra_> that should given us plenty of space back
[11:35] <ogra_> but is lower prio than finding out why ubiquity-dm misbehaves so badly indeed
[11:36] <xnox> ogra_: i currently blame the new accessibility framework upload. =)
[11:37] <seb128> xnox, internet suggests I need adb 1.0.31 for the secure stuff from android 4.2.2
[11:38]  * desrt upgrades
[11:39] <xnox> seb128: argh. ok. Adding to my list to update asap.
[11:41] <ogra_> xnox, well, one of lightdm or ubiquity-dm is firing up an X server it doesnt attach to, then if ubiquity-dm starts (or respawns, not sure) there is the lock file that prevents it from starting ... if i hack around long enough i can get u-dm starting without issues though
[11:41] <ogra_> i doubt thats a11y related
[11:42] <ogra_> its eithetrt lightdm having become a lot faster and not respecting that u-dm wants to start, or upstart not respecting the "start on starting lightdm" in oem-configs start script or its u-dm itself failing on the first start and trying to respawn on the same display
[11:45] <TheMuso> Well we actually no longer need to explicitly load at-spi in ubiquity-dm any more, GTK should be able to do that when we use it, given that it uses libatk-bridge, which does the needed work of bringing up at-spi if its not yet running.
[11:45] <TheMuso> Before we do that though, I'd better test to see if things still work proplery in the install environment.
[11:46] <ogra_> TheMuso, well, could it cause ubiquity-dm to crash ?
[11:46] <TheMuso> With that code removed.
[11:46] <TheMuso> ogra_: I wouldn't think so... That code has been there for quite a while now, at leas tthe at-spi code that is.
[11:46] <ogra_> right
[11:54] <m4n1sh> mvo: ping
[11:58] <m4n1sh> mvo: when you are free, can you have a look into the merge proposal on software-properties ?
[12:39] <m4n1sh> is egg-list-box packaged for raring? can't find one. Or does it even have a release? Can't find neither the package nor a release
[12:39] <kenvandine> m4n1sh, i think there are some apps that have embedded it
[12:39] <kenvandine> like empathy
[12:39] <attente> seb128:
[12:39] <attente> https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/gtk/gtk2-item-factory-separators
[12:40] <attente> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=694077
[12:40] <ubot2> Gnome bug 694077 in general "GtkItemFactory doesn't make GtkSeparatorMenuItems" [Minor,Unconfirmed]
[12:40] <seb128> attente, thanks
[12:40] <m4n1sh> kenvandine: means egg-list-box is part of empathy, but not as a separate package and dependent on it?
[12:41] <kenvandine> m4n1sh, yeah
[12:41] <kenvandine> i haven't seen it separate yet
[12:41] <m4n1sh> kenvandine: and the one on gnome git does not work. the trunk is broken
[12:42] <m4n1sh> Makefile.am:99: HAVE_INTROSPECTION does not appear in AM_CONDITIONAL
[12:42] <m4n1sh> Makefile.am: installing `./depcomp'
[12:42] <m4n1sh> autoreconf: automake failed with exit status: 1
[13:21] <vibhav> Where will notfications genertaed using libnotify appear?
[15:29] <seb128> mterry, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-manager/+bug/1129191
[15:29] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1129191 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "some updates can't be checked from the main list" [Undecided,New]
[15:29] <mterry> seb128, awesome.  Problems with my fix now though
[15:29] <mterry> seb128, I'll get this fixed right after I theme the screensaver prompt to look nicer
[16:06] <qengho> chrisccoulson: If you want to try building chromium beta, which I have not tried yet on armhf, try what's in my beta ppa: https://launchpad.net/~cmiller/+archive/chromium-browser-beta-daily/+packages
[16:24] <mterry> attente, bug 595615 is all I can find
[16:24] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 595615 in AppMenu GTK+ "emacs has special menus and entries" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/595615
[16:25] <mterry> attente, that sounds familiar to me, but doesn't seem to have been fixed by me (despite me putting the blacklist in).  So I'm not sure there isn't another bug that I fixed with that blacklisting...  Of course, I didn't link my commit to a bug, because I'm a darned fool
[16:35] <mterry> attente, and https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/appmenu-gtk/blacklist-emacs/+merge/57934
[16:47] <mdeslaur> desrt: your "a warning about glib" blog post says you want to know if something breaks...pygtk is apparently broken. bug 1103170, bug 1102960
[16:47] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1103170 in meld (Ubuntu) "meld crashed with TypeError in <lambda>(): <HistoryFileEntry object at 0x1e58960 (HistoryFileEntry at 0x1f08540)>: unknown signal name: changed" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1103170
[16:47] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1102960 in dia (Ubuntu) "dia crashes on startup" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1102960
[16:47] <desrt> mdeslaur: we know about pygtk
[16:47] <desrt> mdeslaur: solution is to upgrade pygtk....
[16:47] <desrt> pitti: right?
[16:47] <pitti> desrt: well, the real solution is to port stuff to gtk 3 and GI :)
[16:48] <mdeslaur> doesn't seem to be any recent commits in pygtk that would fix that
[16:48] <pitti> desrt: as I just said in #u-devel, I guess it's possible to fix pygtk
[16:48] <desrt> are the old gtk static bindings broken by the glib change?
[16:48] <pitti> but no idea how much effort that is
[16:48] <desrt> if they are and you can't fix it we'll have to back out the change :/
[16:49] <pitti> I'd much rather not do that
[16:50] <desrt> pitti: is it the same code?
[16:51] <pitti> desrt: no idea; I guess it's completely different; conceptually simpler, but structurally harder as the change is probably needed in a lot of different places
[16:51] <pitti> but that's just a hunch
[16:52] <desrt> unfortunately "port to gtk3" is not a viable suggestion
[16:52] <mterry> jdstrand, your recent merge for data/guest-session.apparmor_abstraction into lightdm is missing some files
[16:52] <pitti> so we need the spirit of http://git.gnome.org/browse/pygobject/commit/?id=efcb0f9fd applied to pygtk
[16:54] <desrt> pitti: did i ever tell you that this is a beautiful commit?
[16:55] <pitti> desrt: I don't think so :) but it's just some technical jibberjabber, nothing particularly æsthetically pleasing :)
[16:55] <desrt> pitti: it's a thing of beauty.
[16:56] <desrt> and the world could use more beauty
[16:56] <desrt> ;)
[16:56] <pitti> in my book, http://git.gnome.org/browse/pygobject/commit/?id=15e717 is a beautiful commit :)
[16:57] <pitti> (789 removals, 161 additions)
[17:00] <desrt> pitti: so what form do you take bribes in?
[17:00] <desrt> and/or who else could i bother?
[17:01] <pitti> desrt: mostly a matter of finding time to fix it
[17:02] <pitti> desrt: potential victims are me or jdahlin; there might be some other former pygtk maintainers as well, of course
[17:04] <pitti> need to leave, time for Taekwondo
[17:04] <pitti> please file a bug and assign, lest I forget
[17:17] <desrt> mdeslaur: ^
[17:31] <mdeslaur> desrt, pitti: bug 1129309
[17:31] <desrt> mdeslaur: probably should be upstream against pygtk
[17:31] <mdeslaur> ah, yes, I'll file one
[17:35] <mdeslaur> desrt, pitti: upstream bugzilla #694108
[17:35] <desrt> mdeslaur: thanks
[17:35] <desrt> seb128: ^
[17:35] <seb128> desrt, mdeslaur: thanks
[17:44] <desrt> RAOF: hey.  got a second again?
[17:45] <czajkowski> Laney: if you're looking for a nice curry place, head up towards london bridge and right beside borough market on the left is a tiny place, but does nice foods
[17:46] <Laney> czajkowski: good info
[17:46] <Laney> got a name?
[17:47] <RAOF> desrt: Not so much, but could spare some cycles on IRC?
[17:47] <czajkowski> Laney: it;s the only one, it's opposite a small newsagent and Reed HR
[17:47] <Laney> aye
[17:47] <desrt> RAOF: ./X11/extensions/XI2proto.h:typedef xXIBarrierEvent xXIBarrierHitEvent;
[17:47] <Laney> when are you up?
[17:48] <desrt> what's up with 'x'?
[17:48] <RAOF> Crazy namespacing thing.
[17:48] <desrt> how do i get the version without leading 'x'?
[17:50] <RAOF> desrt: XInput2.h
[17:50] <desrt> where do i get this?
[17:51] <RAOF> libXi-dev, from memory?
[17:51] <desrt> the one i have has no mention of XIBarrier
[17:51] <desrt> ya... that's indeed where it comes from
[17:52] <RAOF> desrt: Ah, right. You want the shiny new version, in canonical-x/staging.
[17:52] <czajkowski> Laney: not gonna make it up this week, super busy and climbing walls
[17:53] <czajkowski> sorry :(
[17:53] <Laney> climbing... walls?
[17:53] <RAOF> desrt: https://launchpad.net/~canonical-x/+archive/x-staging
[17:53] <RAOF> desrt: Warning: will break your Unity ☺
[20:59] <pitti> mdeslaur: thanks
[21:00] <mdeslaur> pitti: thanks!


[00:18] <tonyyarusso> kermit: Metro State
[00:19] <kermit> tonyyarusso: how do you pay for it? i was thinking of going.
[00:27] <tonyyarusso> kermit: My parents do.  But, it's dirt cheap anyway, so it wouldn't be hard for anyone to.
[00:28] <kermit> if there's still time left to work full time too it's cheap
[00:30] <mr_steve> kermit: fwiw, I'm in school right now and paying nothing. Grants and loans, all the way
[00:31] <kermit> mr_steve: enough to only have to work part time?
[00:32] <kermit> mr_steve: er, you mean you have grants and loans that pay for school and living expenses?
[00:33] <mr_steve> kermit: If I wanted to, I could afford an apartment with my leftover money. I got a subsidized loan for $7900 for this semester
[00:34] <mr_steve> and my classes were already paid by grants, so only about 1,000 of that is going to the school, I get a check for the rest
[00:35] <kermit> you could live on $14k/yr ?
[00:35] <Takyoji> So I take it that Launchpad doesn't store images, or something?
[00:36] <kermit> i dont think i could live on less than $40k no matter how hard i tried
[00:36] <Takyoji> or were the images just not submitted?
[00:36] <mr_steve> kermit: I've never made more than 12k/yr in my life
[00:36]  * Takyoji annoys tonyyarusso again
[00:41] <tonyyarusso> kermit: School costs about $7000 per year all-inclusive.  You can easily make that part-time.
[00:41] <tonyyarusso> kermit: Saint Paul College was half that.
[00:42] <kermit> tonyyarusso: i'd have to work full time to support myself though
[00:42] <kermit> unless grants or loans were a lot more
[00:42] <tonyyarusso> kermit: but you'd be eligible for financial aid.
[00:42] <kermit> can you get 50k/yr of student loans?
[00:42] <kermit> or less and work part time?
[00:43] <kermit> or much less and work full time?
[00:43] <tonyyarusso> uh, if you need 50k just to support yourself, you're doing it wrong
[00:43] <_diablo> tonyyarusso: lolz
[00:43] <kermit> 43k plus the tuition of 7k
[00:43] <kermit> i havent lived on less than 50 in a decade
[00:43] <kermit> can you work full time and still go to school?
[00:44] <tonyyarusso> Takyoji: huh wuh?
[00:44] <kermit> or get loans for living expenses?
[00:44] <tonyyarusso> and yes to both probably
[00:44] <_diablo> kermit: it's tough. Not a fun experience
[00:45] <Takyoji> It's missing some files of which I added to it
[00:45] <kermit> _diablo: full time and school?   i bet
[00:45] <kermit> i'm not sure where to start with the school thing.. google for 'college' and just start reading? heh
[00:45] <_diablo> kermit: yeah, I couldn't do it.
[00:46] <kermit> so i'd have to do part time work and get a lot of loans and grants
[00:46] <_diablo> kermit: do you want to go to a local school on the uber cheap or do you wanna do a 4 year university with dorms and everything?
[00:46] <tonyyarusso> Takyoji: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Eubuntu-minnesota/ubuntu-drupal-theme/minnesota-patches/download/head%3A/iconbuycd.png-20090602010204-69572pizg5q9112i-43/icon-buycd.png - images are there.
[00:47] <kermit> i'm comfortable where i live now, and it's close to several schools
[00:47] <tonyyarusso> Takyoji: what files?
[00:47] <tonyyarusso> College is such a waste of time.  I could be learning if I didn't have class.
[00:48] <_diablo> kermit: just google "twin city" colleges. Two of my roommates just started at MCTC and I'm sure they'd be cool if you wanted to email them and ask some questions. They looked around a lot.
[00:48] <_diablo> tonyyarusso: that piece of paper is expensive, but probably worth it
[00:48] <kermit> my roomate goes to mctc, but he gets money from sourcse i cant
[00:48] <tonyyarusso> _diablo: Only because someone decided it is.  There's no real value to it.
[00:49] <tonyyarusso> I would be a far more worthwhile employee in the future if I took this time to learn on my own.
[00:49] <_diablo> tonyyarusso: I agree. but it has been decided.
[00:50] <kermit> _diablo: and just call the different schools directly and see what plans they can come up with?
[00:50] <tonyyarusso> kermit: a couple of decades ago a guy invented things called "web sites".
[00:50] <tonyyarusso> Schools have their programs all listed online.
[00:50] <h00k> http://doc.tuxisalive.com/api/python/
[00:51] <h00k> er, wrong button.
[00:51] <h00k> sorry.
[00:51]  * _diablo is ashamed of h00k
[00:51] <tonyyarusso> oh man, this professor is actually covering reasonable material, but she sounds like a late-night FM DJ.  I might pass out.  :S
[00:51] <kermit> tonyyarusso: mctc's website says to call them :P
[00:51] <tonyyarusso> granted, it's still not material that I don't yet know.
[00:52] <tonyyarusso> kermit: That's ridiculous...
[00:52] <kermit> tonyyarusso: there's very little information on their website
[00:52] <mr_steve> kermit: That's true, a lot of it is hard to find
[00:52] <tonyyarusso> kermit: uh, http://www.minneapolis.edu/academics/careerprograms.cfm ?
[00:52] <mr_steve> The course catalog has a lot of info tho, I know it's online somewhere
[00:52] <kermit> tonyyarusso: the theme of universities is to make information and knowledge  obscure so you're forced to go through their archaic channels.  that's their job security.
[00:53] <tonyyarusso> pretty much
[00:53] <mr_steve> whoo time to hibernate the machine and take a break. frickin 3 1/2 hour class tonight...
[00:54] <_diablo> yeah, i'm sitting in stats now lol
[00:54] <tonyyarusso> I'm in "Law and the Legal Process"
[00:55] <tonyyarusso> but I have a netbook and three batteries, so I'm good to go
[00:55] <tonyyarusso> sadly I don't have a spare battery for me.  NEED DINNER
[00:55] <_diablo> lol, I just always sit near a wall-plug.
[00:56] <tonyyarusso> I don't think most of my classrooms even have them, except for up front by the presenter's area
[00:57] <_diablo> ah, this is why I love being an econ major at UMN. All our desks have 2 plugs in them. <3 new buildings
[00:57] <_diablo> thanks taxpayers
[01:03] <h00k> tonyyarusso: http://ubuntu-wisconsin.org
[01:03] <kermit> _diablo: how far into econ are you?
[01:04] <_diablo> kermit: I'm graduating in May with a minor in stats and a BA in econ. But I have all the math base for a BS
[01:05] <kermit> _diablo: are you familiar with interdisciplinary engineering?
[01:06] <_diablo> kermit: as a major or what? I mean, I can guess from the name what it is, but no, I've never heard of it before.
[01:07] <kermit> _diablo: any engineering?
[01:07] <tonyyarusso> h00k: WHEEEE
[01:07] <_diablo> kermit: I haven't, but my best friend is an aeronautics engineer and two of my roommates are in engineering (one ME and the other EE)
[01:07] <_diablo> so I'm moderately familiar with the field ;)
[01:08] <h00k> tonyyarusso: do you mind if..er...I perhaps borrow some verbage from your homepage?
[01:08] <_diablo> well, gtg, nice talking to y'all, bbiab
[01:10] <h00k> tonyyarusso: Holy Crap
[01:12] <mr_steve> note to self: hibernate doesn't work on lucid...
[01:14] <tonyyarusso> h00k: It's freely licensed.
[01:14] <h00k> tonyyarusso: I suppose, but I may not exactly do that, that's sorta corny
[01:14] <tonyyarusso> h00k: derivative works are okay too ;)
[01:14] <h00k> tonyyarusso: :D
[01:16] <tonyyarusso> Takyoji: I'm pondering whether our theme could be widened a bit - there's blank space on the sides even on my netbook, which clearly isn't necessary.
[01:16]  * tonyyarusso doesn't remember if it's pixel-based or percentage-based - should look
[01:23] <Takyoji> It's pixel-based
[01:24] <tonyyarusso> mmk
[01:29] <tonyyarusso> Takyoji: where is the line determining the actual width?
[01:30]  * tonyyarusso is attacking with webdev extensions in firefox
[01:32] <Takyoji> It actually seems to be in the HTML itself rather than the CSS file
[01:32] <Takyoji> page.tpl.php
[01:33] <Takyoji> Handled by the function pagewidth()
[01:34] <Takyoji> I think it's declared in theme-settings.php
[01:34] <tonyyarusso> huh, interesting
[01:36] <Takyoji> The function is declared in template.php
[01:37] <Takyoji> But the setting itself is in theme-settings.php
[01:37] <Takyoji> In $defaults['wrapper_width']
[01:38] <tonyyarusso> Suhweet
[01:38] <tonyyarusso> That was easy
[02:23] <tonyyarusso> Takyoji: LOOKYLOOKY!  http://ubuntu-minnesota.org/node/9
[02:24] <tonyyarusso> Takyoji: Also, the main page!
[02:37] <Takyoji> Did you make an edit to the formatting of lists?
[02:38] <Takyoji> (because I fixed that as well; thus I should probably get your modifications before I commit
[02:44] <tonyyarusso> hah, yeah, I did.  And pushed it.
[02:44] <tonyyarusso> I just added a " 1em" to a line.
[02:44] <tonyyarusso> you can do a diff on style.css between revision 149 and 150 to see where.
[03:28] <Takyoji> Finally committed the change
[03:33] <Takyoji> I believe the commit has to be approved
[03:42]  * Takyoji bugs tonyyarusso more.
[03:42] <Takyoji> So anything else needed?
[04:17] <h00k> Bah, the udheader module is broken
[04:58] <tonyyarusso> h00k: the part about ( expecting { ?  Or something else?
[04:59] <h00k> It complained about something on line 2xxx
[04:59] <h00k> I forget.
[05:00] <tonyyarusso> Odd.  Works For Me I think.  Pastebin the error when you have a chance.
[05:01] <tonyyarusso> Takyoji: I don't see about a commit awaiting approval...
[05:01] <h00k> tonyyarusso: will do
[05:05] <Takyoji> Actually I think I must have only committed it to my system; I believe I was supposed to PUSH the change to the Launchpad repository
[05:06] <Takyoji> of which I guess I'll do tomorrow, since I'm leaving for the night
[16:35] <_diablo> mr_steve, what is the location? I'll have a brown backpack.
[16:39] <_diablo> mr_steve, alrighty, I'm heading out. text me the location plz<PHONE_NUMBER>
[17:20] <mr_steve> I really shoulda checked if there was Wifi at the coffeeshop for ubuntu hour
[17:21] <_diablo> uh oh...
[17:21] <_diablo> mr_steve: btw, I'm bringing my old laptop which is currently sans OS. We can install it, that might be interesting enough for people to ask about
[17:22] <mr_steve> awesome.  :( I hopefully have a distro on here so I can flash it...
[17:23] <mr_steve> I've got a thumb drive with UNR...
[17:23]  * tonyyarusso has blank CDs, and ISO image, and a burner, but is in east St. Paul
[17:24] <mr_steve> Oh, I could wipe it and put plain Ubuntu on it, if your machine boots USB...?
[17:24] <_diablo> tonyyarusso: I have those things too, but they're like 10 blocks north and I'm going straight from class to the coffee place
[17:24] <_diablo> mr_steve: yeah, that's what I was planning on doing too
[17:24] <tonyyarusso> What's it worth to you guys to get me to drive over?  :P
[17:25] <_diablo> mr_steve: do you have an image there? all I have is mint, backtrack, mandriva, suse, and fedora :(
[17:25] <mr_steve> I can download an image while I'm still on MCTC's fast connection here
[17:25] <_diablo> tonyyarusso: hahaha, this is just the opening one to get our foot in the door, we probs don't need it this first week :) but if you're around, feel free!
[17:25] <_diablo> mr_steve: if you could, I'd appreciate it. I'll also do so.
[17:25] <_diablo> 64 bit 9.10 if possible pl0x.
[17:26] <mr_steve> I think this is definitely going to be kkind of a dry run, but that's alright
[17:26] <mr_steve> _diablo: I know you were interested in learning about a few random things I've mentioned, too. Although I forget exactly what
[17:27] <tonyyarusso> _diablo: I'm not actually around, but I'm not busy later either.
[17:28] <tonyyarusso> So does this coffee shop *not* have wifi, or you just aren't sure?
[17:28] <mr_steve> Oh wow I was being sarcastic when I referred to MCTC's connection as fast, but I'm pulling 2MB/s o_O
[17:28] <mr_steve> tonyyarusso: not sure
[17:28] <mr_steve> I've never been there before, and the website doesn't say
[17:28] <tonyyarusso> Have a phone?
[17:29] <tonyyarusso> _diablo: 64 bit on a netbook?
[17:29] <mr_steve> Although I bet the area is pretty well saturated with open APs.
[17:29] <_diablo> mr_steve: basic commad line stuff
[17:29] <_diablo> tonyyarusso:<PHONE_NUMBER>
[17:29] <mr_steve> I don't have a phone, no. And I'm the one with the netbook, _diablo's got some kind of laptop
[17:29] <_diablo> tonyyarusso: nah, 64 bit on an old 17 inch asus
[17:30] <tonyyarusso> _diablo: I meant, could you use said phone to call the coffee shop and ask.
[17:30] <_diablo> tonyyarusso: in class :(
[17:30] <tonyyarusso> ah, same
[17:30] <mr_steve> I figure if we get there and they don't have wifi we can just deal with it, or go to one of the dozen or so neighboring coffeeshops
[17:31] <_diablo> mr_steve: I agree with the whole leaving thing :)
[17:31] <tonyyarusso> fair point
[17:31] <tonyyarusso> _diablo: ya really, what kind of coffee shop doesn't have wifi in 2010?!
[17:31] <mr_steve> yeah, really. They're pretty rare these days
[17:32] <mr_steve> Some of 'em have crap wifi, port 80 only, etc, but eh
[17:32] <tonyyarusso> Starbucks has had it for years, but it wasn't free.
[17:32] <tonyyarusso> and yeah, Caribou has closed ports :(
[17:32] <tonyyarusso> Bruegger's is open though.
[17:32] <mr_steve> I gotta look into openvpn over DNS
[17:32] <mr_steve> Although I hear it's godawful slow.. and I can't even get basic OpenVPN working, so far
[17:33] <_diablo> starbuck is sorta open now
[17:33] <_diablo> as long as you use a giftcard
[17:33] <_diablo> not great, but better
[17:33]  * _diablo buys a $5 gift card and uses it to buy a cup of coffee worth 4.96 once a month to keep wifi free
[17:33] <mr_steve> ugh my connection just slowed way down. I wonder if they've got adaptive throttling here
[17:34] <mr_steve> oh nevermind, there it goes
[17:34] <_diablo> probably. I'm at about 90 KB/s here
[17:35] <mr_steve> I'm killing my battery with this, too. Only 4hrs life remaining :)
[17:35] <mr_steve> But it's done, Ubuntu 9.10 64-bit ISO is downloaded
[17:35] <_diablo> mr_steve: really? already?
[17:35] <_diablo> via torrent?
[17:36] <mr_steve> Nah, straight http. Averaging 2-2.5MB/sec
[17:36] <_diablo> mr_steve: yup. that'll do it
[17:36] <_diablo> cool, I'll stop my DL then
[17:37] <tonyyarusso> I still want to know what netbook you have that you plan to run a 64-bit OS on.
[17:38] <_diablo> tonyyarusso: I need the 64 bit
[17:38] <_diablo> it's not a netbook
[17:38] <_diablo> 17" asus
[17:38] <tonyyarusso> _diablo: oh, ok
[17:38] <tonyyarusso> oh, mr_steve was the one with the netbook
[17:40] <mr_steve> Of course my connection had to drop right after I said that. At least my wireless driver hasn't crashed since the Lucid upgrade
[17:40] <Obsidian1723> Living on the edge there eh?
[17:40] <mr_steve> Yup. I updated to see if Lucid would fix my wireless, and apparently it did
[17:41] <mr_steve> Used to be anytime the card had to re-associate, I'd get a kernel oops and have to force a reboot
[17:42] <_diablo> mr_steve: wow. that sucks. which NB is this?
[17:43] <mr_steve> It's the acer aspire one AOD250, it's got ath9k wireless
[17:43] <mr_steve> all kinds of problems I never had with the ath5k in my laptop
[17:44] <_diablo> ahhh, fair enough
[17:45] <_diablo> I think my big asus has a funky atheros card too, so we'll see about that
[17:45] <mr_steve> ah wtf.. irssi just decided to open a second connection to freenode. weird
[17:47] <mr_steve> eh I think I'm gonna shut down here and save some battery until
[17:47] <Obsidian1723> I wont upgrade until 10.04.1LTS...
[17:47] <mr_steve> I get to the coffeeplace
[17:47] <Obsidian1723> Is there a way to roll back from gub2 to grub?
[17:48] <mr_steve> I'll be there at 12:30 or so, I'll be the dude swearing at the little blue netbook
[17:48] <_diablo> Obsidian1723: not that I know of without reinstalling OS. I think it's non-reversible from the message when I installed it
[17:48] <_diablo> mr_steve: sounds good
[17:49] <Obsidian1723> tx diablo. Im not a fan of grub2.
[17:49] <Obsidian1723> or 9.10
[17:50] <tonyyarusso> _diablo: where are you guys going?
[17:50] <_diablo> Obsidian1723: really? what's your impression of grub2? I usually use Lilo when I have a choice, so I don't really know
[17:50] <tonyyarusso> lilo?  Really?  interesting.
[17:51] <_diablo> tonyyarusso: 430 1st st N, Ambrosia coffee
[17:51] <_diablo> tonyyarusso: yeah, holdover from my time on slackware. I loved it.
[17:51] <_diablo> but I don't bother to change it on big distros
[17:52] <_diablo> if it don't broek...
[17:57] <Obsidian1723> diablo, well, grub2 is a clusterf*ck really. It's a mess to edit and work with compared to grub. For that matter, Ubuntu 8.04x is still the best recent OS, 8.01 and 9.10 are disasters, 9.04 is ok.
[17:57] <Obsidian1723> I really only use LTS releases and not until the first point release
[18:00] <_diablo> I liked 9.04. But only because CrunchBang made it pretty :)
[18:01] <tonyyarusso> 9.10 is actually working pretty okay for me.
[18:01] <tonyyarusso> the console bell issue is my only gripe, and that's fixed in lucid
[18:02] <_diablo> tonyyarusso: I mean, I'd be running 9.10 with 10.04 packages if I had it on my main. that's what my netbook is doing
[18:03] <_diablo> I really dislike the look that ubuntu is taking now though :-/
[18:05] <Obsidian1723> yah'
[18:05] <_diablo> well, i'm off to ubuntu hour, ttyl
[18:06] <Obsidian1723> Ubuntu Hour???
[18:07] <h00k> yay Ubuntu Hour!
[18:14] <Obsidian1723> what is that and where at?
[18:22] <h00k> Ubuntu Hour is: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Hour
[18:35]  * Obsidian1723 brb new kernel loaded. Gotta reboot.
[18:46] <h00k> tonyyarusso: ...I...have an idea.
[18:47] <h00k> ...holy crap this could be awesome.
[18:47] <h00k> It'd involve collaboration with Ubuntu Minnesota and Ubuntu Wisconsin
[18:49] <h00k> and...
[18:49] <h00k> heh. So, there's a commercial contest from the Linux Foundation: http://video.linuxfoundation.org/contest/we-are-linux-superbowl-ad-contest and I was thinking we could work together between LoCo's and put together some sort of commercial.
[18:50] <h00k> The style that I was thinking would be a behind-the-scenes of us making the actual commercial, (someone composing music, drawing something with the gimp, video editing with some video editor), etc
[18:50] <h00k> and somehow advertize that the whole thing was put together with Free Software and Linux
[18:51] <h00k> if we don't win, we still had a blast doing it and could use it
[19:03] <Obsidian1723> I know I've mentioned this before, but have you guys considered working with FGTC? We may b e duplicating efforts here.
[19:04] <Obsidian1723> #fgtc on here.. We could cross promote.
[19:06] <h00k> what is this?
[19:08] <Obsidian1723> Free Geek Twein Cities
[19:08] <Obsidian1723> Twin
[19:08] <Obsidian1723> We take PCs, refurb them, put Ubuntu on them, give them to people for free.
[19:09] <Obsidian1723> Based on the national Free Geek from Portland, WA freegeek.org our site is freegeektwincities.org
[19:49] <tonyyarusso> h00k: stop the presses!
[19:49]  * tonyyarusso tries actually reading the idea
[19:49]  * h00k stops
[19:50] <tonyyarusso> Obsidian1723: yes, and I told you to add them to a wiki page :)
[19:50] <Obsidian1723> hey tony
[19:51] <tonyyarusso> h00k: it would be cool if it can be done, yes.  I know I don't have any graphic/video skills, but someone must.
[19:51] <h00k> things like OpenShot, Pitivi, etc, can be used
[19:52] <h00k> Brittany is pretty good with Pitivi, actually
[19:52] <tonyyarusso> Obsidian1723: right, but we need to know who we can work with first before drafting a plan of how.  You can bring it up on the mailing list as well.
[19:52] <h00k> sgtd and I were throwing ideas back and forth about drum-tracks with Hydrogen, exigraff can piano, we could make a nice background track
[19:52] <tonyyarusso> And why are you using /notices ?
[19:54] <h00k> who?
[19:55] <tonyyarusso> Obsidian1723 is.
[19:56] <tonyyarusso> maybe he just has a messed-up client
[19:56] <h00k> ah, ah.
[19:57] <Obsidian1723> will do on the list
[21:26] <Takyoji> So had some more idears
[21:27] <Takyoji> So I had some more idears*
[21:27] <Takyoji> Regardless of not being an approved group; we should still provide ShipIt in some form
[21:28] <Takyoji> On our own basis
[21:28] <Takyoji> and paying for the discs; I would certainly be willing to purchase discs to give freely
[22:56] <Takyoji> So to "triage" a bug just means to prioritize it, and?


[05:16] <willcooke> o/
[05:17] <willcooke> Blargh.  Jet lag is back, plus I have a head cold.  Might keep a low profile this morning
[05:19] <duflu> Hi willcooke. <something> morning then
[05:19] <willcooke> :D
[05:20] <duflu> You almost made morning in Australia, which is obviously wrong
[05:20] <duflu> Although right given that was your previous timezone
[05:23] <willcooke> heh
[05:23] <willcooke> Its going to be a quiet day today anyway I think, public hol in much of Europe
[05:24] <duflu> That's good. I need to duck out in a while anyway
[05:29] <duflu> Damn. We released a gstreamer1.0-vaapi that doesn't work in Xorg for Intel GPUs
[05:29] <duflu> It worked the last time I tested it before release
[05:29] <duflu> Obviously not recently enough
[05:30] <willcooke> oh
[05:30] <willcooke> I didnt notice, shows how much I use that then
[05:51] <duflu> I use 'mpv' if I need to play a video now. Although even when totem is working it's still not smooth. I suspect when more smoothness fixes have landed in mutter I'll be able to backport some to legacy clutter to help totem
[05:52] <willcooke> is there a fix for gstreamer1.0-vaapi?
[05:53] <duflu> Not that I know of. Although that package seems to work fine via gst-play-1.0 so I am not sure that is the right package
[05:54] <duflu> I also don't remember all the related parameters to gst-play-1.0 to answer that question better right now
[06:06] <willcooke> np
[06:54] <duflu> I forgot how much I hate gstreamer
[06:55] <duflu> But I am finding some answers
[07:45] <marcustomlinson> morning duflu willcooke
[07:46] <duflu> Morning marcustomlinson
[07:50] <willcooke> hi marcustomlinson
[08:00] <Laney> yeehaw
[08:04] <marcustomlinson> howdy Laney!
[08:08] <Laney> hey marcustomlinson
[08:08] <Laney> how you getting on?
[08:09] <marcustomlinson> Yeah alright thanks, getting the hang of the release processes. LibreOffice is a bit of a beast so a decent project to learn from
[08:10] <marcustomlinson> Just a bit of a beast though :P I realise there are much worse
[08:10] <Laney> yes it is /o\
[08:13] <willcooke> marcustomlinson, Laney:  I'm under the weather today so will be afk a bit.  (In bed with my laptop atm.)
[08:14] <Laney> as you were
[08:14] <Laney> (netflix?)
[08:14] <Laney> FFS that update-manager stealing focus thing just happened again
[08:14] <duflu> Morning Laney
[08:14] <marcustomlinson> get better willcooke
[08:15] <Laney> 👋 duflu
[08:16] <Laney> I wonder if the Android list of emoji aliases is free software
[08:16] <Laney> would be good to feed that to Characters
[08:23] <duflu> In the future there will be no letters
[08:55] <erGoline> Hi! I'm trying Wayland on Ubuntu, it works fine but I'm getting a strange bug: some installed apps are not present in the applications drawer and are not even displayed in the search too. Any help, please?
[08:55] <duflu> erGoline, does the problem happen with any built-in apps or just some you installed yourself?
[08:58] <erGoline> duflu, I detected the problem with some apps installed by myself, I don't know if this hits other system apps
[08:58] <erGoline>  This apply to random apps, for example Telegram Desktop or Sublime Text (but Sublime Merge is here with no problems). I noticed that even the terminal "subl" command is missing, so probably is a path problem.
[09:04] <erGoline> duflu, I don't know if it could be related, but I use zsh
[09:05] <duflu> Maybe ignore the terminal shell. Focus on the graphical shell only
[09:06] <duflu> Although... is the problem applicable to snaps only?
[09:06] <duflu> Or do you see it with apps installed as debs too?
[09:06] <erGoline> I point out the shell because I cannot find Sublime Text in the drawer *and* subl, the related terminal command
[09:06] <duflu> Sounds like some kind of snap mount is missing
[09:07]  * duflu doesn't know about such things
[09:07] <duflu> jamesh, ?
[09:08] <jamesh> erGoline: first things first: if you open a shell and type "echo $XDG_DATA_DIRS", does it show /var/lib/snapd/desktop/applications ?
[09:08] <erGoline> The two missing apps have beeen installed via Gnome Software (with snap)
[09:08] <jamesh> in the overall list of directories
[09:09] <erGoline> jamesh, empty!
[09:10] <Laney> snapd needs a user environment generator - the environment setup doesn't work in all cases currently
[09:10] <jamesh> erGoline: that is surprising: it should be set when you log in.
[09:11] <jamesh> erGoline: is there anything unusual about your setup?  Different user shell, customised method of starting the desktop, etc?
[09:11] <duflu> jamesh, zsh
[09:15] <jamesh> snapd relies on a file in /etc/profile.d being sourced during login to add to XDG_DATA_DIRS.  I guess either the default zshrc isn't doing that, or a user zshrc is overriding whatever does that?
[09:17] <erGoline> jamesh, I use zsh, nothing fancy, all installed in the standard way
[09:18] <erGoline> jamesh, I think yo are right, someone is having a similar problem: https://github.com/Sarcasm/zuko
[09:19] <jamesh> erGoline: yep.  Just checked the bug list and found https://bugs.launchpad.net/snapd/+bug/1775340 (with close to a year of inactivity)
[09:19] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1775340 in snapd "Make snapd zsh aware" [Medium,Triaged]
[09:19] <duflu> Also bug 1640514
[09:19] <ubot5`> bug 1640514 in snapd (Ubuntu Xenial) "/snap/bin is not added to the PATH when using zsh" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1640514
[09:22] <duflu> erGoline, I think that's a conclusion for now. Please subscribe to the above two bugs
[09:26] <erGoline> Ok thanks!
[09:27] <duflu> Sorry it's not a fix. But we at least found the right pages for the problem :)
[09:28] <jamesh> Laney: would a systemd environment generator actually help for processes not started by the user systemd instance?
[09:28] <jamesh> (e.g. gnome-shell?)
[09:28] <erGoline> duflu, yes this is the right path, I'm going to investigate, thank you again :)
[09:29] <jamesh> or is this something that will help once everything is started by systemd? :-)
[09:43] <jamesh> erGoline: one other thing to check: is /snap/bin on $PATH in your shell?
[09:44] <jamesh> if so, it might indicate /usr/lib/environment.d/990-snapd.conf is being applied even though the /etc/profile.d bits are ignored
[09:44] <erGoline> jamesh, duflu, this solution solves the problem :) https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/snapd/+bug/1640514/comments/18
[09:44] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1640514 in snapd (Ubuntu Xenial) "/snap/bin is not added to the PATH when using zsh" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[09:46] <erGoline> jamesh, yes, /snap/bin is in the $PATH
[09:46] <jamesh> okay, so that's an environment.d based solution again.  Good
[09:46] <jamesh> (not zsh specific)
[09:48] <Laney> jamesh: it works, but I can't remember exactly why; maybe gnome-session retrieves the environment from logind or similar
[09:48] <jamesh> Laney: that sounds familiar, yeah.
[09:48] <Laney> sorry for the delay, my desktop locked up
[09:49] <Laney> May 01 10:25:06 raleigh.local kernel: BUG: unable to handle kernel paging request at<PHONE_NUMBER>01f38a
[09:49] <Laney> May 01 10:25:06 raleigh.local kernel: #PF error: [normal kernel read fault]
[09:51] <jamesh> Laney: the bit I remembered was /etc/X11/Xsession.d/95dbus_update-activation-env, but that's doing the opposite: stuffing a snapshot of the env into dbus/systemd
[09:51] <jamesh> maybe pam_systemd is doing the environment setup?
[09:53] <Laney> don't think it's that, because it does not work for VT sessions
[09:53] <Laney> annoyingly
[09:57] <jamesh> maybe something is doing roughly the equivalent of "export $(systemctl --user show-environment)" somewhere
[09:57] <Laney> yup
[09:58] <Laney> environment handling is one of the rough parts of the 'user' concept I think
[09:58] <Laney> like how I SSH to my laptop and things like the GPG agent happen inside the GNOME session rather than the SSH session
[09:59] <jamesh> no one runs an ssh daemon on a desktop system though :-)
[10:00] <Laney> 😈
[10:01] <jamesh> erGoline: I'll see if I can push that environment.d thing upstream for snapd.  You shouldn't need any user specific hacks just because you changed the default shell.
[10:01] <erGoline> jamesh, thanks!
[10:02] <Laney> might want to look at what flatpak's done
[10:03] <Laney> they've got it in a few different places, but each time checking to not add dupes, basically
[10:18] <erGoline> Some suggestion on the best gesture manager? I'm checking https://gitlab.com/cunidev/gestures
[10:35] <Laney> Trevinho: mutter/shell srus uploaded, a couple of bugs in there need SRUifying though
[10:36] <Laney> bug #1813716 has tasks for shell - should they be deleted?
[10:36] <ubot5`> bug 1813716 in mutter (Ubuntu Eoan) "gnome-shell crashed with SIGSEGV in meta_x11_display_get_xdisplay → detach_pixmap → meta_surface_actor_x11_dispose → g_object_unref → ObjectInstance → → release_native_object" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1813716


[00:07] <sinzui> StevenK: mumble?
[00:07] <jcsackett> sinzui: mp is finally up. https://code.launchpad.net/~jcsackett/launchpad/picker-patcher-picked-a-patch-of-personpickers/+merge/64094
[00:13] <lifeless> bac: if you're still around, bug 794802 is addressed on qastaging
[00:13] <_mup_> Bug #794802: many bug activities timing out due to contention on bugsummary <canonical-losa-lp> <regression> <timeout> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/794802 >
[00:33] <StevenK> https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/408698
[00:33] <_mup_> Bug #408698: Search when reporting a bug fails when spaces are used <lp-bugs> <package> <package-picker> <vocabulary> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/408698 >
[00:33] <StevenK> https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/376671
[00:38] <sinzui> StevenK: I agree that th use case for 408698  is fixed. mark it as release
[00:38] <sinzui> s
[00:38] <sinzui> d
[01:34] <bac> hi lifeless
[01:35] <bac> lifeless: do you cowboy the fix for bug 794802 to qastaging b/c the bug branch does not show that it has been deployed
[01:35] <_mup_> Bug #794802: many bug activities timing out due to contention on bugsummary <canonical-losa-lp> <regression> <timeout> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/794802 >
[01:35] <bac> s/do you/did you
[01:35] <lifeless> bac: yeah, its live
[01:35] <bac> lifeless: darn
[01:35] <lifeless> cowboy of the year
[01:35] <lifeless> it wasn't when you were qaing
[01:35] <bac> lifeless: my QA is still failing
[01:36] <bac> i just tried
[01:36] <lifeless> ah
[01:36] <lifeless> on qastaging ?
[01:36] <bac> yes
[01:36] <lifeless> timeout? what statement is timing out ?
[01:36] <bac> OOPS-1987QASTAGING7
[01:36] <bac> just happened so it
[01:37] <bac> will be a while before it shows up
[01:39] <bac> lifeless:  my OOPS from earlier today is https://lp-oops.canonical.com/oops.py/?oopsid=1986QASTAGING120
[01:40] <lifeless> bac: yeah, that not biug 794802
[01:40] <bac> lifeless: i'll prepare a rollback
[01:41] <lifeless> what was the change you made ?
[01:42] <lifeless> found it
[01:42] <wgrant> findSimilarBugs timeouts aren't exactly uncommon...
[01:42] <wgrant> I'm not sure bac's change is relevant here.
[01:42] <lifeless> yeah
[01:42] <lifeless> thats what I want to assess
[01:42] <lifeless> gaaarh lint fixes
[01:42]  * lifeless still looking for the actual change
[01:43] <lifeless> bac: don't rollback
[01:43] <StevenK> sinzui: Ready when you're back.
[01:43] <lifeless> bac: the actual issue - a security error - is fixed
[01:43] <wgrant> Yeah, this is unrelated, assuming that it's the hunk starting at line 82 of the MP diff.
[01:44] <lifeless> bac: this remaining issue wasn't introduced by your change.
[01:44] <bac> ok
[01:45] <lifeless> pre existing condition; like the old guy that goes into the doctor complaining that other people smell bad
[01:45] <bac> lifeless: how do you want me to mark that bug?
[01:45] <lifeless> doctor removes wax from his ear, and can hear is own flatulence
[01:45] <lifeless> boom-tish
[01:45] <bac> qa-smell-old-guy
[01:45] <lifeless> bac: I think its qa-ok
[01:46] <bac> lifeless: done
[02:03] <poolie> spiv, did your failing-faster twisted get released, or can it get into lp?
[02:03] <poolie> re https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/740759
[02:03] <_mup_> Bug #740759: creating bzrdir on launchpad is slow (BzrDirFormat.initialize_ex_1.16) <codehosting-ssh> <hpss> <lp-code> <performance> <Launchpad itself:In Progress by jameinel> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/740759 >
[02:06] <spiv> poolie: I think it's been on LP for a while
[02:07] <spiv> Hmm, maybe not, just the workaround branch.
[02:15] <sinzui> StevenK: I am looking at createBug in model.bug
[02:19] <lifeless> ok, it could have been worse - * 1548 Time Outs
[05:05] <jtv> hi wallyworld_ — I'm afraid I'm not well today
[05:10] <poolie> hi wallyworld_
[05:18] <poolie> get well soon jtv
[05:18] <jtv> thanks
[06:42] <wallyworld_> jtv: hi, sorry to hear that
[06:42] <wallyworld_> hi poolie
[06:44] <wallyworld_> jtv: there's only been one or two reviews posted and they were taken so nothing for you to check so far anyway
[07:18] <adeuring> good morning
[07:56] <cody-somerville> Hey. I was going to land https://code.launchpad.net/~timrchavez/launchpad/set_ppa_private_from_api_724740-2/+merge/63950 but I notice some benign changes to utilities/sourcedeps.cache (looks like maybe a script regenerated it?). I assume I should ask timrc to get rid of that cruft before I land?
[07:57] <lifeless> its fine
[07:57] <lifeless> the cache is well, a cache.
[07:58] <cody-somerville> alrighty, I'll go ahead and land it then.
[08:04] <StevenK> cody-somerville: If you could suggest to Tim in future that he uses self.assertIs(<something>, None) or self.assertIsNot(<something>, None) when comparing to None?
[08:05] <cody-somerville> StevenK, Sure thing. I'll pass that on in our next standup.
[08:42] <jtv> cody-somerville, StevenK: in launchpad we pass the expected value first, actual value second.
[08:51] <lifeless> or assertThat(thing, Is(None))
[08:51] <cody-somerville> Has anyone else noticed how signing into the AWS Management Console defaults to the S3 tab, incurring you a list operation (which of course gets rounded up and you get charged atleast a cent that month even if all you did was login to the management console).
[08:55] <cody-somerville> How long does the test suite take to run these days on ec2?
[08:56] <jtv> I would say about 4 hours.  Wild guess.
[10:00]  * StevenK kicks buildbot until pieces fall off.
[11:44] <LPCIBot> Project windmill-devel build #198: STILL FAILING in 1 hr 6 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill-devel/198/
[11:51] <lifeless> night everyone
[12:56] <bigjools> hello, is anyone feeling brave enough to review an 800 line soyuz branch?
[12:57] <bigjools> adeuring? :)
[13:15] <adeuring> bigjools: sure, but let me first have a lunch break :)
[13:49] <Ursinha> conferencing system is nice, but only for the first five minutes
[13:49] <Ursinha> matsubara, jml, want to join me there?
[13:49] <jml> oh hi
[13:50] <Ursinha> *conferencing system music
[13:52] <jml> matsubara: is that you?
[13:56] <benji> Ursinha: we should write a script to pull new on-hold music from http://freemusicarchive.org every day
[13:57] <jml> or some kind of U1 streaming thing.
[14:10] <adeuring> bac: could you have a look at this MP: https://code.launchpad.net/~adeuring/launchpad/bug-735991/+merge/64171 ?
[14:10] <bac> adeuring: sure
[14:11] <adeuring> thanks!
[14:52] <flacoste> james_w: hi, can i request your help for qa (should take 5 mins at most)
[14:54] <james_w> flacoste, yep
[14:54] <james_w> might have to delay by 30 minutes, but I'm happy to help
[14:55] <flacoste> james_w: can you just try setting a Ubuntu official branch on qastaging
[14:55] <flacoste> james_w: just to make sure that the package-importer will continue working after my permission change is rolled up
[14:56] <flacoste> james_w: there is no hurry, so 30 mins delay is fine
[14:56] <flacoste> thanks
[14:56] <flacoste> it works for me on the ensemble distribution, but i'd like a confirmation for the Ubuntu case
[14:59] <bac> hi adeuring
[15:00] <bigjools> adeuring: did my branch scare you?
[15:00] <bac> looking at getBugSubscriberPackages i don't see how it filters based on the user
[15:03] <adeuring> bigjools: well, a bit, but I'm still reading..
[15:03] <adeuring> bac: let me check...
[15:03] <jml> gror. still haven't eaten :(
[15:04] <adeuring> bac: self.structural_subscriptions_clause . That's StructuralSubscription.subscriberID == self.id
[15:05] <bac> adeuring: it might be enlightening to change test_getBugSubscriberPackages to create other subscribed DSPs for another user
[15:05] <adeuring> bac: sure, good idea
[15:06] <bac> adeuring: thanks, i didn't see that ref to self.structural_subscriptions_clause
[15:07] <bac> adeuring: and i don't really see the benefit of it either...  saves some typing but adds confusion.  but it is an existing pattern.
[15:08] <adeuring> bac: the idea is that we want all DSP for which a structural subscription exists, i.e., things that are related to the result of structrural_subscriptions, but without calling this property
[15:09] <bac> adeuring: i understand
[15:10] <bac> my point is using self.structural_subscriptions_clause replaces a one line constraint that is obvious with a one-line property use that is not clear
[15:10] <bac> or at least easily overlooked
[15:12] <bac> adeuring: i suggest you undo that change
[15:12] <danilos> adeuring, bac: hi guys, anyone fancy reviewing some JS code? a few branches available, so feel free to pick one and make sure to claim it so somebody else doesn't do it before you guys :)
[15:12] <adeuring> bac: yeah... ok
[15:13] <bac> danilos: ok, i'll grab one when free
[15:13] <danilos> bac, cool, thanks
[15:14] <danilos> some are oversized but mostly due to tedious JS test code :/
[15:21] <bac> adeuring: approved.  a *really* nice piece of work!
[15:21] <adeuring> bac: thanks!
[15:26] <james_w> flacoste, still works
[15:26] <flacoste> james_w: awesome, thanks!
[15:31] <deryck> Hi, everyone.
[15:41] <flacoste> hey deryck
[15:57] <adeuring> bigjools: r=me
[15:57] <bigjools> adeuring: cool, thanks.  Any questions on what's going on?
[15:58] <adeuring> bigjools: I tried to figure it out by looking around in the sourceode, outside the plain diff
[15:58] <bigjools> adeuring: it's not the easiest of branches to grok
[16:02] <danilos> bac, adeuring: I am about to leave now, I'd still appreciate a review or two, but if you don't feel like doing it with me not available for questions, I won't mind; thanks again :)
[16:02] <bac> danilos, adeuring: i am about to start on https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~danilo/launchpad/bug-772754-other-subscribers-activity/+merge/64180
[16:03] <danilos> bac, cool, thanks
[16:03] <bac> danilos: is that the one i should start with?
[16:04] <danilos> bac, the best one to start with is probably -sections, then -subscribers and then -activity, but I did split them up so they could be looked at separately, so any is good
[16:04] <danilos> bac, the order of dependencies is listed in bug 772754 (i.e. earliest ones are near the top of linked branches), fwiw
[16:04] <_mup_> Bug #772754: After better-bug-notification changes, list of bug subscribers is confusing <qa-ok> <story-better-bug-notification> <Launchpad itself:In Progress by gary> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/772754 >
[16:06] <bac> danilos, adeuring: ok, i've claimed https://code.launchpad.net/~danilo/launchpad/bug-772754-other-subscribers-sections/+merge/64176
[16:06] <bac> danilos: have a good weekend
[16:09] <LPCIBot> Project devel build #794: STILL FAILING in 5 hr 43 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/devel/794/
[16:13] <adeuring> danilos: sorry, I'd like to cop out from a review. It's quite late for me, and I did not sleep that well last night.
[16:13] <danilos> adeuring, that's ok, thanks
[16:16] <LPCIBot> Project windmill-db-devel build #377: STILL FAILING in 1 hr 7 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill-db-devel/377/
[16:39] <LPCIBot> Project parallel-test build #25: STILL FAILING in 1 hr 18 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/parallel-test/25/
[16:58] <LPCIBot> Project windmill-db-devel build #378: STILL FAILING in 42 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill-db-devel/378/
[17:46] <LPCIBot> Project windmill-devel build #199: STILL FAILING in 1 hr 7 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill-devel/199/
[18:29] <LPCIBot> Project windmill-devel build #200: STILL FAILING in 42 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill-devel/200/
[19:03] <benji> bac: Will do do a pre-review of https://pastebin.canonical.com/48394/ for me?  I'm going to switch from an attribute on the exception to a marker interface and move the monkey patch from lib/lp/app/__init__.py to lib/lp_sitecustomize.py per Gary's suggestions but I wanted your opinions while I'm moving things around.
[19:04] <bac> benji: ok, just a sec?  i'm trying to finish up danilo's JS review
[19:04] <benji> absolutely, thanks
[19:13] <bac> hi benji i've read your paste
[19:14] <bac> benji: i'm confused by some terminology.  you said above you were going from an attribute on the exception to a marker interface...but that isn't what i see in the paste
[19:15] <benji> bac: sorry, I meant that the paste uses an attribute on the exception and I'm changing that to a marker interface on the exception instead
[19:16] <bac> benji: ok, so the paste is what, a first attempt that you're abandoning in favor of a marker interface?
[19:17] <benji> bac: right, but not quite abandoning, refactoring
[19:17] <bac> ok
[19:17] <bac> benji: well, what you have in the paste looks reaonsable to me
[19:17] <benji> (well, "refactoring" isn't technically the right word either, make that "reworking")
[19:17] <benji> bac: cool, thanks for looking at it for me
[19:18] <bac> benji: will it be done today?  i look forward to seeing how it morphs
[19:18] <benji> I hope it will be.
[19:28] <LPCIBot> Project windmill-devel build #201: STILL FAILING in 42 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill-devel/201/
[19:43] <gary_poster> bac, you'll see in https://code.launchpad.net/~gary/launchpad/bug553368/+merge/64108 that lifeless and I had a conversation that significantly changed the goal of the branch, but I think he'd be comfortable now with someone else--say, you--giving a code review, if you are willing and able.
[19:43] <bac> gary_poster: i'll do so now
[19:43] <gary_poster> thank you
[20:16] <bac> gary_poster: your replacement fixture has a comment that it won't work with the appserverlayer.  can you enforce that?
[20:17] <gary_poster> bac, uh, I hadn't thought of that. um....I don't remember if the layer is a global accessible sanely.  I don't think it is.  The test suite knows, I think: I can check if fixtures have access to the test suite.
[20:18] <bac> might be nice
[20:18] <bac> unclear what the failure mode currently would look like
[20:18] <bac> if it is informative then i'd say not to bother
[20:18] <bac> neat branch, though.  i'll approve it momentarily.  thanks.
[20:21] <gary_poster> bac, failure mode is that your replacement doesn't seem to work--you've replaced the view locally, but not in the other process or whatever that the appserverlayer uses, so nothing happens.  The fixture does not get access to the test class, so I don't know of a way to do it right now.
[20:21] <bac> ok
[20:21] <bac> the devs have been warned!
[20:22] <gary_poster> :-)
[20:30] <lifeless> morning
[20:31] <lifeless> gary_poster: you can check whether the layer is setup I guess, but FWIW not-working is pretty clear :)
[20:33] <gary_poster> lifeless, yeah I guess the layer itself is a global :-)  but yeah, I'm inclined to leave it
[20:35] <lifeless> and yeah, *totally* happy for another person to do the review; FWIW I agree with bac's comments
[20:36] <gary_poster> cool, changed them, pushing
[21:00] <bac> hi sinzui, can you briefly remind me of the process for unsuspending a user?
[21:00] <lifeless> statik: hi
[21:01] <lifeless> statik: how did your microservice go?
[21:01] <bac> sound like you had a tiny funeral
[21:02] <gary_poster> heh
[21:02] <gary_poster> or very small communion, wedding, etc.
[21:03] <lifeless> he was hacking on a node.js microservice based on the gpg signature checking requirements
[21:06] <lifeless> bac: http://twitter.com/#!/sstatik/status/76831129654657024
[21:08] <statik> lifeless: i have not had time to get back to it, i have vagrant building the whole machine and node.js/coffee script spitting out some boilerplate JSON, next I need to wire in some tests, a gpg layer, and connect it all together.
[21:09] <statik> lp:~statik/+junk/gpg-val
[21:09] <statik> it's probably horrible in 5 or more ways
[21:12] <lifeless> statik: http://vagrantup.com/ ?
[21:12] <lifeless> statik: I think its a great experiment
[21:13] <statik> vagrant is a gem that autobuilds a VM using virtualbox (atm, libvirt support planned) and then provisions it using chef, puppet, or bash
[21:13] <lifeless> the vagrant aspect surprises me a little but its neither here nor there
[21:13] <lifeless> statik: vagrantup.com looks like it
[21:13] <statik> yep, thats the one.
[21:14] <statik> subst vagrant for ensemble, openstack, whatever the appropriate tech is when the time comes. for now it's the only one that actually works ;)
[21:14] <statik> it automated the entire process from a raw CD install
[21:14] <lifeless> yeah
[21:15] <statik> it's only for devs though, doesn't work for managing production. it does give a nice way to try out puppet or chef recipes though, and provides a nice isolated environment to work in.
[21:15] <lifeless> I guess for me, for dev environment, we want 15-20 services on one dev laptop
[21:15] <lifeless> VM's just seem too heavyweight
[21:15] <lifeless> one VM - sure, thats how I do my dev for LP, but one-per-service, mmmm, perhaps I'm too cautious
[21:16] <lifeless> that said, the idea I have of having a network fake for each microservice means doing one VM per service would work
[21:16] <statik> well, i'm only prototyping one service :) it could easily be one VM with LXC containers inside it to wall of each individual service
[21:16] <lifeless> just need to bring the fake into different VM's
[21:17] <lifeless> and one can shutoff a VM when finished hacking on that service
[21:17] <statik> oh thats a nice idea too
[21:17] <lifeless> statik: anyhow, its a good thing to play with; we don't do nearly enough playing
[21:18] <statik> yep, my goal was to make it dead simple for someone else to bring up the experiment and poke at it without polluting their machine
[21:30] <lifeless> benji: hi
[21:31] <lifeless> benji: I'm confused by the duplicating of bug 795180 (about the subscription popup UI) onto bug 772754 (about us not showing the list of bug subscribers)
[21:33] <benji> lifeless: hmm, let me look... oh, it looks like more work is being done under the auspices of that bug than the description would suggest
[21:33] <benji> I'll now wonder out loud if my above interpretation is correct so gary_poster can verify for me.
[21:35] <gary_poster> la la la
[21:35] <gary_poster> me wonders where mup is
[21:36] <lifeless> sulking?
[21:36] <gary_poster> :-)
[21:36]  * benji secretly hates mup.
[21:36] <gary_poster> hhe
[21:37] <gary_poster> heh
[21:38] <lifeless> benji: also, separately, what makes the mute text bug critical ?
[21:38] <gary_poster> lifeless, benji, yes, in order to address bug 772754 we had to address what mpt describes.  More properly, perhaps, you would say that the branches we have addressing that bug also address bug 795180.
[21:38] <_mup_> Bug #772754: After better-bug-notification changes, list of bug subscribers is confusing <qa-ok> <story-better-bug-notification> <Launchpad itself:In Progress by gary> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/772754 >
[21:39] <gary_poster> so there you are
[21:39] <benji> lifeless: it seemed like an actual bug that we (yellow) would likely do soon (being on maintenance rotation)
[21:39] <gary_poster> (you == mup)
[21:39] <lifeless> benji: ah
[21:40] <gary_poster> benji rules are if oops, regression or security, critical
[21:40] <gary_poster> otherwise high or low
[21:40] <gary_poster> this could maybe be high
[21:40] <lifeless> or operational FUBAR
[21:40] <gary_poster> yeah
[21:40] <benji> k
[21:41] <lifeless> benji: we're trying to make queue jumping work evidence based
[21:41] <lifeless> benji: high/low are whether we're planning on working on it in < 6 months or not
[21:42] <lifeless> and then folk pulling work from a bucket (critical/high/low) can choose whatever bit of work they want subject to however the squad is internally doing stuff
[21:42] <lifeless> benji: https://dev.launchpad.net/BugTriage and https://dev.launchpad.net/BugTriage/Background
[21:42] <benji> ah, I confused High and Critical
[21:50] <lifeless> benji: gary_poster: thanks; -> afk
[21:51] <LPCIBot> Yippie, build fixed!
[21:51] <LPCIBot> Project devel build #795: FIXED in 5 hr 20 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/devel/795/
[22:00] <lifeless> sinzui: hi; bug 794008 - I don't know if you noticed but one of the screenshots is from LP itself, so its both c-i-p and lp
[22:00] <_mup_> Bug #794008: Opera displays Launchpad _without text_ <opera> <Canonical SSO provider:Triaged> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/794008 >
[22:02] <soren> A bit earlier today I attempted to create a new package set. The tool I used didn't make it obvious that it wasn't archive, but rather distribution specific. Wondering why it failed I went and looked at the code implementing the packagesets.new method in the API, and I'm really having trouble spotting the bit of code the rejects my request. Can anyone provide some hints?
[22:03] <LPCIBot> Project windmill-devel build #202: STILL FAILING in 1 hr 17 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill-devel/202/
[22:04] <sinzui> lifeless: that page, with css and markup was not served my lp
[22:04] <sinzui> lifeless: so if there is a browser issue the fix will be in c-i-p
[22:04] <lifeless> sinzui: there is a broken page served by lp
[22:04] <lifeless> https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/794008/+attachment/2159063/+files/loool.png
[22:04] <_mup_> Bug #794008: Opera displays Launchpad _without text_ <opera> <Canonical SSO provider:Triaged> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/794008 >
[22:04] <lifeless> sinzui: link 2
[22:04] <lifeless> bah
[22:04] <lifeless> sinzui: comment two
[22:05] <sinzui> sorry, I did not see that one
[22:05] <sinzui> sorry
[22:05] <lifeless> sinzui: no worries; thats why I'm bringing it to your attention
[22:05] <lifeless> clearly something is wrong, and I suspect their browser
[22:05] <lifeless> but it might be something we're doing
[22:05] <sinzui> What does this mean? It does not work with Lp's or c-i-p's markup and css. They are not related anymore
[22:06] <sinzui> ha. I see the sprites render. opera had issues with that in the past
[22:06] <sinzui> ph
[22:08] <sinzui> lifeless: both lp and c-i-p must have the same font rules per UX. I wonder if the browser dies on "UbuntuBeta Regular",Ubuntu,"Bitstream Vera Sans","DejaVu Sans",Tahoma,sans-serif
[22:08] <lifeless> sinzui: yeah, I thought that was common
[22:08] <sinzui> lifeless: look at the image again. only the monospace font renders!
[22:08] <lifeless> yeah
[22:09] <sinzui> I suspect the user has messed with his fonts because sans-serif is the ultimate failover
[22:14] <sinzui> Now might be the time to switch to oneiric. I am at EOD and I have confirmed html5browser runs on both lucid and natty.
[22:18] <lifeless> \o/
[22:18] <lifeless> EOW even
[22:33] <LPCIBot> Project windmill-db-devel build #379: STILL FAILING in 1 hr 6 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill-db-devel/379/
[22:55] <LPCIBot> Project parallel-test build #26: STILL FAILING in 1 hr 4 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/parallel-test/26/
[23:40] <LPCIBot> Project windmill-devel build #203: STILL FAILING in 1 hr 6 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill-devel/203/


[00:10] <babelfish1> thanks, glad i forgot to log out :)
[00:46] <Arthur___> !help
[00:46] <Zinn> !help For a  complete list of my knowledge visit: http://www.baablogic.net/Zinn.cgi  Other available commands: !status, !about, !bug [bug_number].
[02:55] <angelo454> Hi has anyone experienced problems with mySQL? About every 3-5 boot ups it does not start.
[02:57] <tgm4883> angelo454, sounds like a race condition
[03:00] <angelo454> I have a frontend running on the same machine and I do notice that it won't find the backend and I have to restart it and it will find it the second time. What can I do to correct the race condition?
[03:01] <tgm4883> angelo454, what is the output of 'dpkg -l mythtv-backend'
[03:04] <angelo454> The response was "failed to read archive 'myth-backend' . . ." should I be root or in a certain directory?
[03:05] <tgm4883> mythtv-backend
[03:05] <tgm4883> no, you don't need to be root
[03:07] <angelo454> same response
[03:08] <tgm4883> hmm
[03:08] <tgm4883> thats odd
[03:08] <tgm4883> try it with a sudo I guess
[03:10] <angelo454> still the same response. I am running mythfilldatabase. that would not interfere with the dpkg command?
[03:10] <tgm4883> it shouldn't
[03:11] <tgm4883> sounds like dpkg might be broke for you?
[03:13] <angelo454> I have used Update Manager to get the latest MythTV version .23. Is that similar to dpkg?
[03:13] <tgm4883> are you using auto-builds?
[03:17] <angelo454> Yes, I got .23+fixes and tonight I saw there was a new build and updated to that one. I am running KnoppMyth with .22 on another machine and am working on upgrading to Mythbuntu with .23 on this machine. I found the system unstable with live TV saw I tried the .23+fixes but it did not help.
[03:35] <tgm4883> angelo454, take a look at http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1511342
[03:35] <Zinn> [ubuntuforums.org]  Backend start and udev rule race condition - Ubuntu Forums
[03:40] <angelo454> ran the command again. This time lower case L instead of upper case I (eye).
[03:40] <angelo454> Desired=Unknown/Install/Remove/Purge/Hold
[03:40] <angelo454> | Status=Not/Inst/Cfg-files/Unpacked/Failed-cfg/Half-inst/trig-aWait/Trig-pend
[03:40] <angelo454> |/ Err?=(none)/Reinst-required (Status,Err: uppercase=bad)
[03:40] <angelo454> ||/ Name           Version        Description
[03:40] <angelo454> +++-[03:40] <angelo454> un  mythtv-backend <none>         (no description available)
[03:40] <angelo454> angelo@play-myth:~$
[03:43] <angelo454> From the thread you referenced, I should have fixed it when I ran auto-builds.
[03:47] <angelo454> Sorry, I ran it from the frontend. When I run it on the backend I have 0.23.0++fixes2. This is the version I just updated to about an hour ago.
[03:52] <dewman> angelo454, you might want to use pastebin
[03:52] <dewman> =)
[03:57] <angelo454> Will it allow me to copy text from one computer to another?
[04:07] <angelo454>  I'll see what happens with this latest autobuilds version. Thanks for your help.
[11:11] <henkpoley> Current Ctrl+Alt+Del behaviour is to lock the current desktop. Is there a place to disable this ?
[11:23] <henkpoley> Ah the XFCE settings editor (a bit like regedit) has a way to set keyboard shortcuts. Removed the command from the custom ctrl alt del one, and it's fine now
[22:36] <typhoon> I know this is logged so I'll throw it in. If people have problems with firmware (dvb-fe-tda10046.fw) being uploaded then it is worth giving this a go: cd /etc/init then mv the mythbuntu script to a different name (put .old on the end) and then reboot and rename it back, then reboot again. I have had no problems since.
[22:37] <typhoon> not sure why it works but it has
[22:37] <typhoon> :)
[22:41] <typhoon> another fix: If you have a frontend on the backend server, ensure you use the network IP and not the loopback when setting up. There is a wierd bug where other frontends pick up the config from the DB and tries to get the tuner stream from localhost.
[22:43] <typhoon> if you are feeling brave connect to the mysql instance and do this: use mythconverg; update settings set data = 'xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx' where data ='<IP_ADDRESS>';
[22:43] <typhoon> change the x's for your backend IP address
[22:46] <tgm4883> typhoon, regarding the frontend on the backend server, that is not a bug, that is proper configuration
[22:46] <tgm4883> there is a difference
[22:46] <typhoon> ah, ok
[22:47] <typhoon> should have read the manual :-)
[22:47] <tgm4883> not sure why the first thing works though
[22:48] <typhoon> could be something simple as date time stamp on the script files i guess
[22:48] <typhoon> i know what causes it
[22:48] <typhoon> myth tries to send commands to the chip while the firmware is being uploaded
[22:48] <typhoon> so the chip goes nuts
[22:49] <tgm4883> but that shouldn't be fixed by doing what you are doing
[22:49] <tgm4883> if anything, it might be a race condition
[22:49] <typhoon> aye, it could be
[22:49] <typhoon> its a really odd one
[22:50] <typhoon> the other way is to stick a "sleep 10" or something in the init script but that slows boot time
[22:51] <typhoon> no-one seems to know how to actually "fix" it. it's not a problem with myth or the firmware, just the way they play together
[22:53] <typhoon> thanks for the headsup on the B/E config. might actually read through it see if i've missed anything else haha


[04:50] <AliRezaTaleghani> hello
[04:50] <AliRezaTaleghani> i use hardy,
[04:51] <AliRezaTaleghani> is their any i686-smp kernel for me?
[04:51] <AliRezaTaleghani> no idea?
[08:45] <kraut> moin
[10:17] <Ng> mjg59: so. the optical drive in the DL145 is 9.5mm where all the other HPs we have seem to be about 12mm
[10:17] <Ng> ie I have nothing to swap it out for :/
[10:42] <FXMaveric> hello
[12:10] <Ng> cking: the DL145 bios does have an option to present the SATA controller as PATA, trying that now
[12:11] <Ng> cking: doh, it's still full of fail
[12:11] <cking> Ng: bummer
[12:12] <Ng> I'll poke around the bios a little more to check there isn't anything else along those lines
[12:12] <Ng> normally that option does seem to specifically refer to AHCI, this just offers SATA/PATA
[12:13] <cking> The main problem is that the controller subsystem has changed a lot - so it's one of those corner issues where a quirk may need to be added :-(
[12:13] <elmargol> Hi if I inset my proxim wireless pccard into my laptop syslog is spammed wifi0: hardware error; resetting
[12:14] <elmargol> and i get 100% system cpu usage
[12:14] <elmargol> The same card works on my other laptop
[12:15] <Ng> cking: hmm, no other options in the main system bios
[12:15]  * Ng checks for a sata controller bios
[12:16] <cking> Ng, Annoyingly, there are some possible kernel module tweaks one could try, but I don't know how to pass them down to the module on a LiveCD.
[12:17] <Ng> sata controller bios has no options
[12:17] <Ng> cking: I could at least try the options from the busybox shell
[12:18] <cking> Ng: Give me a little while and I will find some appropriate runes.
[12:19] <Ng> sure
[12:19] <Ng> I'm just going to have a quick check to see if there's an updated bios or something
[12:26] <cking> Ng: I suggest trying: options libata noacpi=1
[12:27] <Ng> cking: I'm going to try booting a gutsy alternate installer to check this definitely isn't a regression. beyond that I should hand this off to the server team - they can netboot it and yous can all get it seeing the CD drive. I don't think physical presence or actual CDs are necessary here since the issue is the thing not even being detected
[12:28] <Ng> (I will check that it netboots correctly though ;)
[12:28] <cking> Ng: OK makes sense.
[12:30] <xivulon> hi cking
[12:31] <cking> xivulon: hi there. How can I help?
[12:31] <xivulon> I believe that evand mentioned some issues with wubi and buffer i/o error
[12:31] <xivulon> I did some testing yesterday and found out the issue, but would appreciate some further help
[12:32] <cking> xivulon: good - I've been stuck trying to obtain a working XP system to experiment further.
[12:32] <xivulon> no need anymore :)
[12:32] <xivulon> this is the new problem
[12:32] <xivulon> basically wubi uses a nested filesystem, one problem is that data loss in the host filesystem (generally ntfs) may result in journal disruption in the hosted filesystem
[12:33] <xivulon> to minimize the problems, Szaka suggest to use sysctl settings that would minimize the use of cached disk data
[12:33] <cking> That makes sense
[12:33] <xivulon> what happened is that new version of the kernel (12) does not like the settings we always had
[12:34] <xivulon> and that resulted in the buffer I/O errors
[12:34] <cking> OK - any details on the settings being used?
[12:34] <xivulon> sure one sec
[12:35] <xivulon> https://bugs.launchpad.net/wubi/+bug/204133/comments/12
[12:35] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 204133 in wubi "wubi install unusable - Buffer I/O error on device loop0" [High,In progress]
[12:36] <xivulon> so first point is: I am quite sure those settings used to work in the past, and I do not know if that is any reason of concern kernel-wise
[12:37] <xivulon> second point is: what would be a reasonable/safe set of settings to use in order to minimize hardreboot problems?
[12:37] <cking> xivulon: OK I will put some effort in this afternoon to see if they work.
[12:38] <xivulon> cking thanks, please post anything you find in the bug
[12:38] <cking> xivulon: 2nd point: good question. This needs some figuring out :-)
[12:38] <xivulon> great, looking forward to that!
[12:38] <cking> xivulon: Thanks for getting it so far. I got stuck on the XP enviroment to test this out, so you've helped me a huge amount.
[12:39] <cking> ..I also got side tracked on other stuff too :-(
[12:39] <xivulon> ah that wasn't strictly necessary, provided you have an ntfs partition (virtual or not) you can test on that...
[12:39] <xivulon> I could have provided a skeleton for the rest
[12:40] <cking> xivulon: I'll keep you posted... your help has been invaluable - collect 1 free virtual beer :-)
[12:40] <xivulon> ah thank you for looking into this!
[12:41] <cking> np - it's what we are here for.
[12:41]  * cking_lunch time for food
[12:43] <Ng> cking: 7.10 fails in exactly the same way as 8.04 with the same SRST error.
[13:36] <rtg> zul: Please send a note to the kernel mailing list when you get xen patched. I won't be on IRC much today.
[13:36] <zul> rtg: sure...im doing a test build right now
[13:36] <rtg> zul: thanks
[13:40] <amitk> rtg: you in austin?
[13:41] <rtg> amitk: yep, getting ready to head out.
[15:37] <mjg59> Ng: Arse.
[15:43] <smb> zul: Are you currently working on bug 208281?
[15:43] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 208281 in iscsitarget "iscsitarget will not compile" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/208281
[15:43] <zul> smb: Im trying to get a ffe for it for the universe one but yes I was
[15:43] <zul> smb: do you want me to fix the lum one?
[15:44] <smb> zul: I was about to ask whether I should do something or what. :)
[15:45] <zul> smb: I was going to send a patch today once I fix this ebox problem :)
[15:45] <smb> zul: I guess soon enough. So I rather take care of your xen updates.
[15:46] <zul> smb: ok
[15:46] <zul> xen updates builds fine and boots fine here
[15:47] <smb> zul: Ok, thanks
[16:30] <zul> smb: got an update but just have to see if it builds
[16:31] <smb> zul: ok
[17:19] <munckfish> Hi, re ps3-kboot update. Good new is I can now get the hardy daily live to boot on PS3, however, although the install kernel boots, the graphics are all messed up.
[17:19] <munckfish> and when it reaches X it's going to a sort of messed up failsafe
[17:19] <munckfish> pseudo terms are also messed up
[17:20] <munckfish> I need to quickly work out if this is something left wrong from kboot or whether it's a new issue
[17:21] <munckfish> does anyone have any tips or links on how to debug the framebuffer graphics we use while booting up?
[17:21] <munckfish> I'm completely green to this whole part of Linux at the moment
[19:02] <infinity> Hrm, is anyone doing anything about the FTBFS of linux on all x86 arches (broken virtio configs)?
[19:03] <infinity> soren: I suppose the changelog might have you to blame...
[19:08] <amitk> infinity: it'll happen later today
[19:10] <infinity> amitk: Kay.  I was just about to kick off a rebuild test, and having the kernel FTBFS annoys me. :)
[19:10] <amitk> heh
[21:02] <IntuitiveNipple> Building the hardy git 'generic' flavour tonight I'm getting "previous or current ABI file missing" - it's building 2.6.24-16.29, is that correct (CONCURRENCY_LEVEL=4; fakeroot debian/rules  binary-generic binary-header) ?
[21:19] <amitk> IntuitiveNipple: it needs an ABI bump, will happen later today
[21:20] <IntuitiveNipple> Thanks Amit - I thought that was the case haivng looked at debian/abi/* but wanted to be sure
[21:21] <IntuitiveNipple> Didn't realise until the end of a long build... was trying to avoid starting from scratch with AUTOBUILD :)
[21:22] <amitk> IntuitiveNipple: you can add a skipabi=1 to the end to force a .deb if you want
[21:24] <IntuitiveNipple> Hmmm, I did try that but got ignored... thanks for that, I'll try it again later to see if I got it wrong somehow
[21:25] <IntuitiveNipple> ahh! I only put "skipabi", forgot the "=1" bit :p
[21:31] <sourcemaker> when I use vpn on linux... I receive the following message:  martian source, ll.. what's wrong?
[21:31] <sourcemaker> and my application does not work then
[21:39] <IntuitiveNipple> sourcemaker: A martian source is an invalid, non-routeable address... You'd be better off asking in ##linux or #ubuntu
[21:40] <sourcemaker> IntuitiveNipple: ok... thanks
[21:45] <amitk> IntuitiveNipple: thanks for the wiki update
[21:49] <IntuitiveNipple> you're welcome - I've lived on that page before so every little helps :)
[21:50] <IntuitiveNipple> The only thing I've left to work out is how to do a make-kpkg out-of-tree build
[21:52] <IntuitiveNipple> Hopefully this build will give me a pure Ubuntu kernel with the i450NX patch in so I can sign off the failed PowerEdge server
[21:55] <elmo> IntuitiveNipple: the patch in that b ug report won't work on the server I originally reported it against, though, will it?
[21:57] <IntuitiveNipple> elmo: No, but if you want to provide the dmidecode output of the server, it can be added. I didn't want to add anything I'm not 100% sure about
[21:58] <IntuitiveNipple> It'd be best to test each one - unfortunately there's not an easy way aside from building a kernel that ignore the i450nx fix entirely.
[21:58] <elmo> IntuitiveNipple: I don't have an i450 in the machine though?
[21:58] <elmo> is what I meant
[21:59] <IntuitiveNipple> Did you manage to capture a boot log ?
[22:00] <elmo> I think there's a screenshot in the bug
[22:00] <elmo> oh, yes
[22:00] <elmo> because, haha!, if you wait 30+ minutes, it eventually finds the drives
[22:00] <elmo> and you can continue the boot
[22:03] <IntuitiveNipple> I was wondering more about a full serial console log, but, looking at your screenshots the aacraid module is loading so it's possible the causes of the "Disk offlined" messages are different. I switched to bugzilla in solving the bus issue - I maybe should create another Ubuntu bug report especially for this
[22:04] <elmo> yeah, we haven't upgraded firmware yet either, to rule that out
[22:04] <elmo> IntuitiveNipple: how did you update the firmware btw?
[22:05] <IntuitiveNipple> I had some fun today - discovered the PERC2 is also a HP NetRAID 4M (Adaptec AAC364) and got one from ebay for £18!
[22:06] <IntuitiveNipple> Downloaded the Dell firmware DOS-floppy installer .exe, ran it from wine and wrote the files to the two floppies, then used them to update it
[22:06] <IntuitiveNipple> there's "afu.exe" (adaptec firmware updater) on the boot floppy
[22:07] <IntuitiveNipple> The battery on the PERC2 cache was failing and Dell don't do a replacement - got the NetRAID 4M, found a HP replacement part # on the battery, they cost US$128 minimum, so done well on that server today!
[22:09] <tormod> hi, bug #192772 could need some sponsor love before the freeze. It's assigned to Tim Gardner but he seems to hide.
[22:10] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 192772 in linux-wlan-ng "please merge linux-wlan-ng 0.2.8+svn1851+dfsg-1 from Debian main unstable" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192772
[22:16] <soren> rtg: Did you get the kernel build sorted out?
[22:17] <smb> rtg might still be in transit
[22:17] <soren> smb: In transit? Fro/to?
[22:17] <soren> from, even.
[22:18] <smb> soren: From Linux Founation
[22:18] <soren> smb: To? :)
[22:18] <soren> smb:  I thought he'd be here until tomorrow sometime.
[22:18] <smb> soren: but the build should be ok now.
[22:19] <soren> Ok. For a second I thought I was missing a patch, but looking at the changelog, it must be there already, so I'm slightly more calm now.
[22:19] <smb> soren: Hm, got the impression he was travelling today, but I might be totally wrong
[22:21] <smb> soren: We had two updates from alessio and chuck to get xen and rt building again
[22:21] <soren> smb: Alright.
[22:46] <IntuitiveNipple> elmo: I've redone the i450NX bus issue as bug #214814
[22:46] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 214814 in linux "BUG: soft lockup - CPU#0 stuck for 61s!" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/214814
[22:49] <Amaranth> tjaalton: so should i file a bug for the dh_strip stuff? I've got a report that installing from the .run file fixes the yellow/pink/etc shadows in compiz so it seems stripping the files is causing this problem
[22:49] <Amaranth> oh, you probably aren't here :P
[22:52] <elmo> IntuitiveNipple: ah, ok, thanks.  shame.  I don't suppose you want to debug by PE for me? ;-)
[22:55] <IntuitiveNipple> Well whilst I'm on a roll... want to PM me about it?
[23:09] <elmo> IntuitiveNipple: heh, I was mostly kidding - thanks though
[23:09] <IntuitiveNipple> :) It looks simply enough