[02:34] <rob> oh, shes gone..
[02:58] <ajmitch> she?
[03:00] <_ion> She's really a he.
[03:00] <ajmitch> right
[03:04] <fbond|away> hmm
[03:08] <jmg> what does "assignee" mean in specs?
[03:08] <jmg> is that the person assigned to do the work?
[03:09] <zul> i believe so
[03:10] <jmg> i thought paris was only talking about specs that had the author in attendance
[03:11] <linuxmonkey> paris is talking about any specs that matter to my knowledge
[03:11] <jmg> grr
[03:11] <jmg> i should have applied for sponsorship
[03:12] <jmg> my specs been hijacked and assigned to someone else
[03:14] <zul> oh well
[03:17] <jmg> meh
[03:46] <Hobbsee> morning all
[03:47] <ajmitch> afternoon
[03:48] <Mithrandir> hi Hobbsee
[03:48] <Mithrandir> also hi ajmitch
[03:49] <Hobbsee> not quite noon here yet :P
[03:49] <Hobbsee> hey Mithrandir, how are you diong?
[03:49] <Mithrandir> slightly tipsy, blogging about my day before going to bed.
[03:49] <Hobbsee> hehe
[03:49] <Mithrandir> also trying to find if Karianne has sent me any mails or not.
[03:49] <ajmitch> hello Mithrandir
[03:49] <Hobbsee> the blog is at?
[03:50] <Mithrandir> http://err.no/personal/blog
[03:50] <Mithrandir> that's the "everything I feel like blogging about" blog
[03:50] <Mithrandir> it has some categories which are put onto planets and suchs
[03:50] <Mithrandir> -s
[03:50] <Mithrandir> but not all of it
[04:02] <Hawkwind> Hey there Hobbsee
[04:02] <Hobbsee> hi Hawkwind
[04:02] <Mithrandir> zleeep
[04:02] <zul> and sober up
[04:02] <Hawkwind> Hobbsee: I made the leap to Kubuntu as my main OS today :)
[04:03] <Hobbsee> Hawkwind: yay!
[04:04] <Hawkwind> I'm still trying to get everything setup from the old OS
[04:04] <Hobbsee> nice :)
[04:05] <Hawkwind> But having issues :(
[04:05] <Hawkwind> I can't seem to bring up a GUI editor for something like /etc/ssh/sshd_config
[04:05] <Hawkwind> I've tried kwrite, gedit and others, and it tells me it can't connect to the X server
[04:07] <Hobbsee> ouch
[04:13] <antinobody> hey folks
[04:15] <Hobbsee> hi antinobody
[04:18] <antinobody> Hey Hobbsee
[04:19] <antinobody> it only took me like three hours to sign the code of conduct
[04:19] <antinobody> You don't happen to know how to get a pgp-key from one computer onto another?
[04:20] <linuxmonkey> copy your .gnupg folder
[04:20] <Hobbsee> copy the /.gnupg folder across
[04:20] <Hobbsee> ~/.gnupg, that is
[04:20] <linuxmonkey> wassup Hobbsee
[04:20] <Hobbsee> not a lot, thinking about breakfast
[04:20] <zul> right im off to bed..
[04:21] <antinobody> hello and goodnight zul
[04:21] <antinobody> gracas Hobbsee
[04:21] <antinobody> y linuxmonkey
[04:47] <rob> Hobbsee, pong
[04:47] <Hobbsee> rob: back where i pinged you, Toadstool was asking something about dolphin.  thought it might have related to you.
[04:47] <rob> oh, probably :)
[04:48] <rob> what did he want?
[04:51] <Hobbsee> i think it was something about uploading a new version?
[04:51] <rob> oh, I appear to have uploaded the wrong package to revu
[04:51] <rob> fixing now
[04:52] <rob> must have been day dreaming when I uploaded that
[05:00] <Hobbsee> hehe
[05:00] <Toadstool> re
[05:00] <Toadstool> rob: hi :)
[05:00] <rob> hi Toadstool
[05:00] <Toadstool> and hi Hobbsee too
[05:00] <Hobbsee> hey Toadstool
[05:01] <Toadstool> rob: did you upload the latest version of your package?
[05:02] <rob> uploading now
[05:02] <rob> oh,
[05:02] <rob> Uploading via ftp dolphin_0.5.1-0ubuntu1.dsc: Error '553 Could not create file.' during ftp transfer of dolphin_0.5.1-0ubuntu1.dsc
[05:02] <rob> someone will have to remove that first
[05:03] <Toadstool> hmm... you can force a new version with a particular command line switch iirc
[05:03] <Toadstool> like -f :)
[05:03] <rob> I thought that was -f, which I'm using
[05:04] <Toadstool> ok...
[05:04] <rob> but still get that error
[05:04] <Hobbsee> ask an admin to fix it?
[05:04] <Toadstool> yep
[05:04] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: likes fixing such things
[05:04] <rob> umm yeah :)
[05:04] <Toadstool> ping siretart or ajmitch ;)
[05:04] <rob> ^
[05:04] <ajmitch> what now?
[05:04] <Hobbsee> hehe
[05:05] <rob> can you please delete dolphin_0.5.1-0ubuntu1.dsc
[05:05] <ajmitch> people who break uploads...
[05:05] <Hobbsee> i thought that was my job!
[05:05] <Hobbsee> breaking things.
[05:05] <ajmitch> fixed now
[05:06] <rob> thank you ajmitch :)
[05:06] <Toadstool> Hobbsee: we all know you can break things but you're far better at getting new stuff in universe afaik ;)
[05:06] <Hobbsee> haha
[05:06] <Hobbsee> new stuff?  no
[05:07] <Toadstool> heh
[05:07] <rob> didn't do a debian RFC/ITP?
[05:07] <rob> ah
[05:07] <rob> s/RFC/RFP
[05:09] <rob> Toadstool, its uploaded now, might take a few minutes to appear in revu though
[05:10] <Toadstool> yep, thanks ;)
[05:10] <Toadstool> ok, looks like it didn't take that much time
[05:10] <rob> are you going to review it?
[05:11] <Toadstool> yep
[05:11] <rob> nice :)
[05:12] <Toadstool> rob: I don't think this is a Debian native package... could you please upload it with dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa?
[05:12] <rob> oh, debuild/pbuild no good?
[05:12] <Toadstool> nope
[05:13] <rob> hmm, I'm sure that was what is in the Ubuntu packaging guide
[05:13] <rob> but ok
[05:13] <Toadstool> you need to have the upstream tarball in the root directory
[05:13] <Toadstool> following the package_version.orig.tar.gz scheme
[05:15] <rob> so this is right?: dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa -k'Robert Stoffers' && sudo pbuilder-dapper build ../*.dsc
[05:17] <Toadstool> yeah but forget about the pbuilder stuff (for the moment) and copy the source tarball (using the package_version.orig.tar.gz scheme) in your source directory first
[05:19] <Toadstool> rob: in debian/control description also please forget the dot at the end of the first line and use the latest debian policy version (which is <IP_ADDRESS> now)
[05:19] <rob> wow that changes quick
[05:19] <Toadstool> :)
[05:19] <ajmitch> Toadstool: 3.7.2 is sufficient
[05:20] <Toadstool> ajmitch: well, for NEW packages, I think that the latest policy is the best choice :)
[05:20] <ajmitch> the 4th digit is for minor changes only, not policy changes
[05:20] <ajmitch> so you only ever need the 1st 3 digits
[05:20] <Toadstool> I know that this is only typo changes
[05:21] <Hobbsee> rob: you can do the building and testing etc in the pbuilder, then run it thru dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa at the end, if you like - tha'ts what i do
[05:25] <rob> hmm
[05:28] <Hobbsee> * :)
[05:28] <Hobbsee> it works.
[05:28] <Gloubiboulga> hello MOTU World
[05:28] <rob> hi Gloubiboulga
[05:28] <Toadstool> hi Gloubiboulga
[05:28] <antinobody> hello Gloubiboulba
[05:28] <antinobody> hello Gloubiboulga
[05:29] <Gloubiboulga> hi rob, hi antinobody
[05:29] <Hobbsee> hi Gloubiboulga
[05:29] <Gloubiboulga> Toadstool, already awake, or not yet gone to bed ? :)
[05:29] <Toadstool> Gloubiboulga: wow...this is really early :)
[05:29] <Toadstool> not yet gone to bed
[05:29] <Gloubiboulga> hey Hobbsee :)
[05:29] <Toadstool> working on SLiM ;)
[05:30] <Hobbsee> hehe, fun
[05:30] <Gloubiboulga> Toadstool, I guess you've triage bugs during the night :p
[05:30] <Hobbsee> Toadstool: where are you?
[05:30] <Gloubiboulga> triaged*
[05:30] <Toadstool> Hobbsee: France :)
[05:30] <Hobbsee> Toadstool: ah. is that where you usually live, or you're just there for the conference?
[05:31] <Toadstool> Hobbsee: I'm French but about to leave and work in California for a year
[05:31] <Hobbsee> nice!
[05:31] <Toadstool> indeed :)
[05:31] <rob> ok, uploading again
[05:32] <Toadstool> cool rob
[05:33] <rob> ok done
[05:33] <rob> it didn't appear to upload the orig.tar.gz though, should it?
[05:34] <Gloubiboulga> if you upload on REVU the .orig should be there
[05:34] <Toadstool> +1
[05:34] <rob> ok, maybe it just didn't say it
[05:34] <Toadstool> pdebuild doesn't add the orig.tar.gz file by default
[05:35] <Toadstool> (I once had the same problem :))
[05:35] <rob> ok its appeared now (the orig.tar.gz is listed on the revu page
[05:35] <rob> is that sufficient, or am I missing something?
[05:36] <Toadstool> I must be missing something 'cause I don't have the upstream tarball...
[05:38] <rob> the orig.tar.gz is in the same directory as the tar.gz from upstream and the source. files and .dsc file, is that correct?
[05:39] <Toadstool> rob: yep, you're right
[05:41] <Hobbsee> rob: did you get a .diff.gz file too?
[05:41] <rob> yes
[05:41] <Gloubiboulga> I think you should have a MOTU school session about "how do I create a source package" :)
[05:41] <Hobbsee> hehe
[05:41] <Toadstool> :)
[05:41] <Hobbsee> yeah, we need some more of them - they're useful.
[05:42] <ajmitch> Gloubiboulga: you can run it
[05:42] <Toadstool> yep
[05:42] <Gloubiboulga> ajmitch, yes :)
[05:42] <rob> what is the difference between .orig.tar.gz and the upstream .tar.gz other the the file name?
[05:42] <Toadstool> the file name ;)
[05:42] <rob> so why have both?
[05:43] <rob> dolphin_0.5.2-0ubuntu1.diff.gz
[05:44] <ajmitch> Gloubiboulga: just set a time & date, write up something & do it
[05:45] <rob> sigh, I'm not seeing any other packages in revu that have the tar.gz listed, just the orig.tar.gz (which mine is)
[05:45] <rob> woah, what happen there (just reloaded the page)?
[05:47] <Gloubiboulga> ajmitch, I will, I just have to find when the best time & date are ;)
[05:47] <Gloubiboulga> bbiab
[05:47] <Toadstool> Gloubiboulga: "the best time & date are" <-- as soon as possible? :)
[05:52] <Toadstool> anyone who wants to review slim? (http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2491)
[05:53] <Toadstool> :)
[05:53] <rob> ok, I'm not sure what happen with that last upload to revu, but this one should be better (uploading now)
[05:56] <nexu> Gloubiboulga: lol sorry for not getting back to you
[05:57] <nexu> Gloubiboulga: i wanted to learn how to make a package myself so i went to searching how to fix it
[05:57] <nexu> Gloubiboulga: i fixed it eventually
[05:58] <nictuku> hi
[05:58] <nictuku> if a user reported a problem in a wrong package, can I just change that?
[05:59] <Toadstool> 6am...time to go to bed I suppose :)
[05:59] <Toadstool> g'night everybody
[06:00] <nexu> haha
[06:00] <nexu> same here
[06:00] <Hobbsee> nictuku: yep
[06:01] <Hobbsee> nictuku: just reassign it to the correct source package - you certainly used to be able to do that
[06:03] <nictuku> ok. #50815 phpldapadmin -> php4 - for php4-ldap
[06:03] <nictuku> php4-ldap is in php4, right?
[06:03] <nictuku> checked with apt-cache show php4-ldap |grep Source
[06:04] <Hobbsee> looks to be in php4, yep
[06:04] <Hobbsee> bug 50815
[06:04] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 50815 in php4 "doesn't work with apache2, i.e. http://localhost/phpldapadmin fails" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/50815
[06:05] <chillywilly> bah
[06:06] <chillywilly> upgrading this amd4 server to dapper and the lvm2 package is broken
[06:06] <Hobbsee> nictuku: ah hang on.  is it a phpldapadmin bug, or a php4-ldap bug?
[06:06] <chillywilly> amd64
[06:06] <nictuku> Hobbsee, reported as phpldapadmin, but it *would* be a bug in php4-ldap
[06:06] <nictuku> works for me, anyway
[06:06] <bockman> crimsun, any luck with that openvpn bug? (bug #45827)
[06:06] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 45827 in openvpn "openvpn old security problems (Breezy)" [Medium,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/45827
[06:06] <chillywilly> dpkg: error processing /var/cache/apt/archives/lvm2_2.02.02-1ubuntu1_amd64.deb (--unpack):
[06:07] <chillywilly> subprocess pre-installation script returned error exit status 10
[06:07] <Hobbsee> nictuku: the binary package hint is wrong, but it's listed in the right source location
[06:07] <nictuku> Hobbsee, it is because i fixed it
[06:08] <Hobbsee> ah
[06:08] <nictuku> Hobbsee, it was listed in phpldapadmin
[06:08] <nictuku> :-)
[06:08] <Hobbsee> right - didnt realise you'd changed it :P
[06:09] <bluefoxicy> mmm.
[06:10] <rob> hmm
[06:10] <chillywilly> well I just commented out the preinst script ;P
[06:10] <bluefoxicy> Hobbsee:  anything interesting going on in Ubuntu?  :)
[06:10] <rob> I'm not sure that its me stuffing this up, I think revu might be doing something funky
[06:10] <bluefoxicy> Hobbsee:  (good articles are selling for $150, maybe I can make some money...)
[06:10] <rob> its listing an old version, 0.5.1, but I'm uploading 0.5.2
[06:10] <Hobbsee> bluefoxicy: sure, a conference ending.
[06:11] <bluefoxicy> conference?
[06:12] <Hobbsee> bluefoxicy: developers conference, in paris
[06:12] <Hobbsee> it ended last night paris time, i believe
[06:13] <bluefoxicy> ah
[06:14] <antinobody> Last...oh, right, it's Saturday where you are
[06:14] <bluefoxicy> Hobbsee:  no new revolutionary features in Edgy?  Major security improvements (I just may write about stack protection if it goes into full mode, or if I can get an official statement...), major performance boosts (too bad we can't use direct linking)?
[06:15] <Hobbsee> antinobody: it's about 6am in paris too, so it was last night there too
[06:15] <antinobody> Right, but it's about 9pm Friday here, and that's what I meant
[06:16] <antinobody> I should learn how to merge...
[06:16] <antinobody> Does anyone know what determines what Debian package we'll move to for Edgy?
[06:17] <Hobbsee> antinobody: the one in debian unstable, and we have to check if none of the ubuntu patches are still needed
[06:18] <Hobbsee> bluefoxicy: i wouldnt know - but the specs on launchpad would - they should be mostly filled in now.
[06:19] <bluefoxicy> cool.
[06:19] <antinobody> Hobbsee:  right, that makes sense.  I'll go practice now, who should I talk to when I've gotten the hang of it, who will have use of me
[06:19] <antinobody> ?
[06:19] <rob> here's my output when uploading: http://www.mypastebin.com/?code=1062691471
[06:20] <Hobbsee> antinobody: hmmm..  any of the MOTU's, i believe. i'm not sure how they're marking a package being done or not - kde has a list of items and whether they've been synced or not
[06:20] <rob> I'm thinking revu is rejecting it somehow
[06:21] <ajmitch> rob: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2493
[06:21] <ajmitch> it's not - the id changes for each upload
[06:22] <rob> ok
[06:22] <antinobody> Hobbsee:  Where might one find this list?
[06:23] <Hobbsee> antinobody: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuEdgyPackageUpdates
[06:24] <rob> is everything there now?
[06:24] <Hobbsee> but there's going to be a whole long universe one too - and most MOTU's wont upload kde stuff
[06:24] <Hobbsee> rob: looks like it to me
[06:24] <rob> thank god, thought I was going nuts then
[06:25] <rob> the only errors I'm getting is saying that edgy is a bad distribution and standards-version <IP_ADDRESS> is too new, is this ok to ignore?
[06:25] <ajmitch> yes
[06:26] <rob> ok, thanks ajmitch
[06:27] <rob> hopefully I haven't missed anything now
[06:27] <antinobody> Hobbsee:  gracas otra vez
[06:28] <Hobbsee> antinobody: what are the last two words?
[06:32] <antinobody> otra vez manys another time, but it's the Spanish equivalent of "again"
[06:32] <antinobody> many --> means
[06:32] <antinobody> Lo siento
[06:32] <Hobbsee> ah
[06:32] <Hobbsee> i see :)
[06:33] <antinobody> I need to be more creative though, next time you help me, I'll come up with something overly flowering to say to in thanks
[06:33] <Hobbsee> hehe
[06:34] <antinobody> like gracas chica que sabe todo
[06:45] <Hobbsee> antinobody: then i'd have to go to mighty babelfish :P
[06:48] <antinobody> Hobbsee:  Well, I mean, you could just ASK what I said, but babelfish is an option
[06:48] <antinobody> albeit, not the best option in the world
[06:48] <Hobbsee> antinobody: that is true.  that's hwat i usually do
[06:49] <antinobody> did you figure out what the last one what?
[06:49] <antinobody> err was?
[06:49] <antinobody> I need to stop typoing
[06:49] <Hobbsee> nope
[06:49] <raphink> you could also learn spanish
[06:50] <antinobody> he's right, it's not that hard
[06:50] <raphink> it's a language that is spoken worldwide
[06:50] <raphink> and always useful to know
[06:50] <antinobody> although raphink had the advantage of a latin-based first language
[06:50] <raphink> Hobbsee: antinobody said "thank you girl who knows everything"
[06:50] <Hobbsee> ah :)
[06:50] <raphink> antinobody: that's right, but I didn't only learn latin languages afterwards ;)
[06:50] <Hobbsee> gracas small that knows everything was the babelfish translation
[06:51] <antinobody> small?
[06:51] <raphink> proof is I know english ;)
[06:51] <antinobody> true
[06:51] <raphink> small?
[06:51] <raphink> chica means girl
[06:51] <antinobody> yeah it does, it sure as hell doesn't mean small...
[06:52] <raphink> small is pequena
[06:52] <antinobody> or poco
[06:52] <Hobbsee> well that's what i thought, as a chick is a girl, so...
[06:52] <raphink> in that case
[06:52] <antinobody> well, that's little, to be precise
[06:52] <raphink> antinobody: poco is few/little
[06:52] <raphink> Hobbsee: well thought
[06:52] <raphink> Hobbsee: but although a chick is a maid, a chicken is not a maiden
[06:52] <raphink> :p
[06:53] <Hobbsee> hehe
[06:53] <antinobody> clever
[06:53] <raphink> or I totally misunderstand english ;)
[06:54] <raphink> pom pom pom
[06:54] <Hobbsee> well, a maid is someone who cleans things, it doesnt only just refer to a female or a woman
[06:55] <raphink> ah
[06:55] <antinobody> Ok, new question.  What does one do if, when merging, the dapper version is say 3 (as in the xcdroast example), but the debian archives only have say 3.1
[06:55] <antinobody> to be precise 3ubuntu1
[06:56] <raphink> ...
[06:56] <raphink> can't be
[06:56] <antinobody> yea, maid in reference to a woman has actually fallen out of use
[06:56] <antinobody> but tis
[06:56] <raphink> debian version can't be 3ubuntu1
[06:56] <antinobody> ...no that's the dapper
[06:56] <antinobody> the debian is 3.1
[06:56] <Gloubiboulga> "debian archives only have say 3.1" raphink ;)
[06:56] <raphink> unless you mean ubuntu version = 3ubuntu1
[06:56] <raphink> and debian = 3.1
[06:56] <raphink> right?
[06:56] <antinobody> s
[06:57] <raphink> Gloubiboulga: ah toi aussi t lev  ctheure l?
[06:57] <Gloubiboulga> raphink, si senior
[06:57] <raphink> antinobody: then it depends if the changes made in 3ubuntu1 from 3 have to be applied to 3.1 again
[06:57] <raphink> if it's the case, then you merge into 3.1ubuntu1
[06:58] <raphink> otherwise you request a sync of 3.1, if 3.1 builds fine in edgy without a change
[06:58] <raphink> Gloubiboulga: porque?
[06:58] <Gloubiboulga> raphink, 'cause my girlfriend starts working  7h
[06:58] <raphink> ah right
[06:59] <raphink> good reason
[06:59] <Gloubiboulga> :)
[06:59] <raphink> for a hike
[06:59] <antinobody> The edgy version should actually be 7 or 7ubuntu1
[07:00] <antinobody> the DAPPER was 3ubuntu1
[07:00] <antinobody> and the closest debian to that is 3.1
[07:00] <antinobody> me entiendes?
[07:00] <raphink> .....
[07:00] <raphink> what is the CURRENT debian version?
[07:00] <raphink> in sid
[07:00] <antinobody> 7
[07:00] <raphink> ah rioght
[07:00] <raphink> right
[07:01] <raphink> then you have to either merge into 7ubuntu1
[07:01] <raphink> or request a sync if the merge is not necessary
[07:01] <antinobody> right...
[07:02] <antinobody> at the moment, I'm following the little example from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Merging
[07:02] <raphink> mhm
[07:02] <antinobody> and I'm at the stage where I debdiff the old ubuntu and debian versions
[07:02] <polpak> Does anyone know when the fixed version of qgo will be put in the repo? right now it just segfaults
[07:02] <polpak> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/qgo/+bug/4048
[07:02] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 4048 in qgo "[Dapper]  qgo segmentation fault" [Medium,Confirmed]
[07:02] <raphink> ok :)
[07:02] <raphink> polpak: when you provide it for example :)
[07:03] <polpak> upstream fixed the issue
[07:03] <antinobody> Does it not matter that the original debian version used for the old ubuntu isn't there?
[07:03] <raphink> ok then the package needs to be upgraded
[07:03] <raphink> antinobody: why would it matter?
[07:03] <antinobody> no s...
[07:03] <raphink> antinobody: we want to stay as close to Debian as possible
[07:03] <raphink> for how long as possible
[07:03] <raphink> for many reason
[07:03] <raphink> reasons
[07:04] <raphink> mostly because this way we don't have to maintain most packages in Universe while not having enough manpower for that
[07:04] <Gloubiboulga> polpak, the new release will certainly go into edgy, and a backport might be possible then
[07:04] <raphink> so we can concentrate on the improvements we want to add in ubuntu
[07:04] <antinobody> I know, but I like to be thorough when learning something new
[07:04] <antinobody> so I ask many unnecessary questions
[07:04] <polpak> Gloubiboulga: ergh.. even though it's just a bugfix? right now qgo is competly useless
[07:05] <antinobody> so later on, there are less mistakes
[07:05] <raphink> antinobody: not unecessary if they make sense to you
[07:05] <antinobody> precisely
[07:05] <Gloubiboulga> polpak, I understand, but for the moment we can't do more I guess
[07:06] <polpak> Gloubiboulga: I thought that bug fixes were being released for the current version?
[07:08] <Gloubiboulga> polpak, a few bug fixes go to dapper-updates, but most of them are done in the current development release (e.g. egdy now)
[07:08] <Gloubiboulga> I don't even know if universe packages can be fixed in dapper-update, can they?
[07:09] <Hobbsee> Gloubiboulga: if they're really broken, i think they can
[07:10] <polpak> well it's really broken if that helps.. ;p
[07:10] <polpak> just segfaults
[07:10] <Hobbsee> oh yeah, a segfault hehe
[07:10] <polpak> If not.. this means I am going to have to actually write that python GO client I've been trying to avoid
[07:12] <polpak> cause I can't go for 6 months w/o playing GO. ;p
[07:13] <Hobbsee> hehe
[07:14] <Gloubiboulga> well, it looks like a new release is in edgy already
[07:14] <polpak> Gloubiboulga: does it actually run ?
[07:15] <Gloubiboulga> hmm, actually no, still the same version than in dapper
[07:16] <polpak> Gloubiboulga: I think the maintainer fixed it in the CVS version, but wanted help from the ubuntu package maintainer to test it
[07:16] <polpak> at least thats what the notes say on the bug
[07:19] <Gloubiboulga> ok, I was right, 1.5 is in edgy, I'm installing it to test
[07:19] <polpak> Gloubiboulga: I can teach you to play if you want.. ;p
[07:19] <Gloubiboulga> hehe :)
[07:20] <Gloubiboulga> it still segfaults...
[07:20] <polpak> ah.. then the fix is still just in CVS
[07:20] <Gloubiboulga> I guess
[07:21] <polpak> ergh
[07:21] <polpak> guess I'm going to have to actually work for it then
[07:22] <Gloubiboulga> brb
[07:34] <antinobody> raphink or Hobbsee:  What would I do if the ubuntu version for dapper was higher than the debian unstable versions at present?  (i.e. katapult)
[07:35] <antinobody> when merging...
[07:35] <Gloubiboulga> antinobody, nothing
[07:36] <antinobody> then why is it on the KubuntuEdgyPackageUpdates list?  Is it taken care of in some other way?
[07:39] <Gloubiboulga> I don't know, I'm not a K guy, but I guess there's nothing to do about it
[07:41] <antinobody> Well, I'm just picking random packages to try and practice with.  I'm not actually going to upload any of this, I'm just learning how to merge, so I'm of some use as we start merging
[07:44] <Hobbsee> antinobody: you should probably assign that to Mez, as hes' one of the upstream maintainers of that
[07:45] <Hobbsee> hello, you
[07:45] <StevenK> Ow!
[07:46] <Hobbsee> heh
[07:46] <Hobbsee> you'll survive :P
[07:47] <StevenK> I might not. :-P
[07:47] <ajmitch> oh dear
[07:47] <ajmitch> StevenK is here
[07:47] <Hobbsee> that he is.  EVERYBODY RUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[07:47] <ajmitch> & Hobbsee is being violent again
[07:47] <Hobbsee> raphink clearly did :P
[07:47] <StevenK> If it's that bad, I can /quit
[07:47] <Hobbsee> me?  violent?  nah.
[07:49] <Hobbsee> StevenK: when are we meeting up with you?
[07:50] <StevenK> When would you like to?
[07:50] <antinobody> Hobbsee:  assign?  I'm just looking for things to practice on, I'll let other people do this "assigning" business until I know what i'm doing
[07:50] <Hobbsee> antinobody: ah okay.  well, two of katapult's writers are kubuntu devs, so that kinda makes it a special case
[07:51] <antinobody> I see
[07:51] <Hobbsee> StevenK: 5/7 sound good?  it's a wednesday
[07:51] <StevenK> Wednesday's are out, as are Tuesdays.
[07:52] <Hobbsee> thursday good?
[07:52] <Hobbsee> i had a vague memory that that was the case...
[08:43] <dsas> antinobody: Obviously everywhere means the #ubuntu-* channels. Nowhere else exists.
[08:45] <antinobody> dsas point taken, although #ubuntu seems to be no less active then usual.  #kubuntu as well
[08:45] <dsas> antinobody: That's a given, besides they don't match the pattern above :p
[08:45] <antinobody> ahh true enough
[08:46] <antinobody> #ubuntu-pdx is a lonely place.   :-P
[09:25] <antinobody> That was an odd one
[09:25] <Hobbsee> that's a very interesting ban.
[09:25] <Mithrandir> it was what /knockout decided to.
[09:25] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: hmmm...fair enough
[09:25] <antinobody> ever had a request before?
[09:25] <Hobbsee> hah, okay then
[09:25] <Hobbsee> is more effective
[09:25] <Hobbsee> i tihnk
[09:26] <Hobbsee> oh wait, this is one of those complex non-IP bans, isnt it...
[09:27] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: think we should unban him at all?
[09:30] <StevenK> My two <div>'s should not wrap around each other!
[09:30] <Hobbsee> welcome back StevenK
[09:32] <Mithrandir> Hobbsee: well, I did /knockout, not /kb.    Definitely.
[09:39] <Hobbsee> antinobody: when you end up being op'd in #ubuntu, you kinda need to know all this stuff :P
[09:41] <antinobody> Pssh, being an op would be too much work
[09:42] <antinobody> You have to fight crazy pointless wars with your fellow ops
[09:42] <antinobody> that's too much effort for me
[09:43] <Hobbsee> haha
[09:43] <Hobbsee> no...not usually.  that's just a fun past time
[09:43] <rob> chanserv?
[09:44] <Hobbsee> antinobody: i think we all got a bit trigger happy lately - one night we were having major op wars in #ubuntu-offtopic - all ops just kicking each other.  it started with me having a changed nick, and an op saying "no, you cant kick people"  "oh cant i now?  bang!"
[09:44] <Hobbsee> rob: my deop script is screwed for other people
[09:45] <antinobody> So then, you started it
[09:45] <Gloubiboulga> Hobbsee, you should triage bugs instead of kicking ops :p
[09:45] <Hobbsee> not necessarily
[09:45] <Hobbsee> Gloubiboulga: haha.  that sometimes happens too.
[09:45] <rob> hehe, I don't worry about deop scripts, no need to op :)
[09:45] <Hobbsee> rob: lucky.
[09:46] <Gloubiboulga> Hobbsee, actually, not triaging, FIXING
[09:46] <Hobbsee> nah...
[09:46] <antinobody> fixing bugs is a lot of work...
[09:46] <Gloubiboulga> true
[09:47] <Gloubiboulga> that's why I ask Hobbsee to do it :)
[09:47] <rob> ouch
[09:47] <antinobody> right, cuz he isn't busy enough
[09:48] <Hobbsee> yeah, he's just sitting around slacking, as usual.
[09:51] <antinobody> Right, while la trabajadora impresivisma del nombre Hobbsee es siempre trabajando, con su guerra
[09:52] <Hobbsee> antinobody: translation please?
[09:53] <antinobody> right, while the (really-really) impressive hard-worker named Hobbsee is always working, with her war
[09:53] <Hobbsee> haha
[09:53] <ajmitch> with her vile slander, saying that I'm a slacker
[09:54] <Hobbsee> hehe
[09:54] <antinobody> what?  Hey, being a slacker isn't so bad.  I've seemed to make a life of it.
[09:54] <ajmitch> it is when you've got code to write & packages to break
[09:54] <Hobbsee> hi Lure
[09:55] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: so have you broken more of edgy yet?
[09:55] <Lure> hi Hobbsee
[09:55] <ajmitch> haven't uploaded my breakage
[09:55] <Hobbsee> darn!  why not?
[09:56] <ajmitch> I have other stuff to get done first before I do uploads
[09:57] <Hobbsee> oh
[09:57] <Hobbsee> how sad :(
[10:03] <antinobody> Ok, momentarily back to the relatively constructive thing I was doing...
[10:04] <Hobbsee> haha
[10:04] <Hobbsee> what, before the bot abuse?
[10:04] <antinobody> When merging, is the general guideline to look for differences between the Ubuntu package and the Debian one, and try and keep the Ubuntu-unique stuff, or
[10:04] <antinobody> Hey, I just wanted to better understand ubotu
[10:05] <antinobody> He's always there, helping us, and we never try to understand the bot beneath the mask
[10:05] <antinobody> anyway
[10:05] <antinobody> or is there something I'm missing, as is usually the case (back on the merging thing)
[10:07] <cypher> i am using breezy and it has very less packages by default it seems
[10:08] <cypher> like no g++
[10:08] <cypher> no make
[10:08] <cypher> it has to be downloaded
[10:08] <cypher> why so ?
[10:08] <cypher> or did i miss it in the distro cd ?
[10:08] <dsas> cypher: It's on the distro cd but not installed by default.
[10:09] <cypher> dsas: thanks i will check it then
[10:09] <antinobody> My understanding (and you should know, it is limited) is that ubuntu is not meant to be a "developer's" distro, but an general-user distro
[10:09] <antinobody> so they felt that the developer packagers needn't be defaulted
[10:10] <dsas> cypher: (you want the build-essential packages). There's discussion over whether it should be installed by default in edgy.
[10:10] <cypher> antinobody: i dont agree.. even for a general user if he has to download source and install then what he will do ?
[10:10] <Gloubiboulga> he will install the missing packages
[10:10] <cypher> dsas: i vote for default
[10:11] <cypher> i wonder why it was not default
[10:11] <antinobody> cypher, granted, but the understanding is that many general users will be intimidated by source compiling in general, which is in my experience fairly accurate
[10:11] <antinobody> my mother doesn't even know what the word "compile" means
[10:11] <dsas> cypher: You can read the discussion here: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/sounder/2006-June/007329.html
[10:12] <cypher> antinobody: :) i agree.. but does she really use linux by her own will ?
[10:12] <cypher> dsas: thx let me read it
[10:12] <antinobody> cypher:  No, and that's what we want to change.  In fact she doesn't use linux at all.
[10:12] <antinobody> that's the point
[10:13] <antinobody> a major goal of ubuntu as a distro is to take away as much of microsofts users away from them as possible
[10:13] <Hobbsee> not really.  that's a side effect
[10:13] <antinobody> however NONE of this answers my merging question.  Where are my all-knowing developer mentors?
[10:14] <antinobody> Hobbsee, it seems to have become a goal though
[10:14] <antinobody> note bug #1
[10:14] <cypher> sorry got dc'ed
[10:14] <Hobbsee> well, yeah
[10:14] <Hobbsee> and no
[10:14] <cypher> antinobody: what is your question
[10:14] <Hobbsee> it's to make it user friendly so that everyone uses it
[10:15] <antinobody> When merging, is the general guideline to look for differences between the Ubuntu package and the Debian one, and try and keep the Ubuntu-unique stuff, or
[10:15] <ajmitch> antinobody: keep what is necessary
[10:15] <antinobody> or is there something I'm missing, as is usually the case (back on the merging thing)
[10:15] <antinobody> righto
[10:15] <antinobody> now I just have to figure out how to know what is necessary
[10:15] <antinobody> I'm looking at k3b right now
[10:16] <cypher> i am going to try and learn packaging today
[10:16] <ajmitch> that's the fun part
[10:16] <antinobody> isn't it though?
[10:16] <ajmitch> it takes a bit more than a day
[10:16] <cypher> ajmitch oh
[10:16] <cypher> any i will start
[10:16] <antinobody> entonces, vas a aqu cypher:  https://help.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html
[10:17] <antinobody> it does?
[10:17] <antinobody> I did it in a night, a while back
[10:17] <antinobody> I don't remember any of it
[10:17] <antinobody> but I did manage to patch okle
[10:17] <antinobody> it was a REALLY easy patch though
[10:17] <antinobody> I'll probably have to relearn that to merge...
[10:17] <antinobody> damn
[10:18] <antinobody> I really shouldn't swear so much, Hobbsee's just looking for a reason to kick me again, I imagine
[10:19] <Hobbsee> no, not really
[10:19] <cypher> antinobody: thanks for the url
[10:19] <antinobody> not a problem, that's the one Hobbsee gave me when I learned
[10:19] <antinobody> tis useful
[10:19] <Hobbsee> oh, and i get pinged whenever my nick or name is mentioned.  so if you want to discuss me in secret...maybe dont mention my name?
[10:20] <rob> heh
[10:20] <antinobody> heh, why would I discuss you in secret?
[10:20] <antinobody> You would know better than me if you were looking for a reason to kick me.
[10:21] <antinobody> what exactly is debian/rules written in?
[10:21] <antinobody> anyone know?
[10:21] <dsas> antinobody: it's a makefile
[10:21] <antinobody> ajmitch is probably the most likely to know that one...
[10:22] <antinobody> which is?
[10:22] <antinobody> I'm still incredibly new to probamming for linux.  Or anything for that matter
[10:22] <ajmitch> yes, as dsas said
[10:22] <antinobody> What will we do without him?
[10:22] <Hobbsee> antinobody: makefile is a language too, an evil combination of bash adn python, it think
[10:23] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: enjoy
[10:23] <antinobody> Grrr, well, I'll have to go learn what the hell that language means someday
[10:23] <antinobody> For now, I'll just guess
[10:24] <antinobody> after all, knowing takes the fun out of life
[10:24] <Lathiat> anyone here a debmirror guru?
[10:24] <Lathiat> im trying to debmirror something who's apt line goes along the lines of deb http://repo ./
[10:24] <Lathiat> debmirror doesn't seem to like not having a section
[10:25] <dsas> antinobody: I don't think there's much you need to know for packaging purposes. What you need to know is describe in the various guides.
[10:25] <dsas> Though I've not looked at anything too complex
[10:26] <antinobody> I don't know, it might be nice to have SOME idea what's what when deciding what to keep and get rid of in merges
[10:28] <dsas> unless upstream or debian has adopted the patch or make a work around then keep it. I think.
[10:28] <dsas> (easier said then done presumably)
[10:29] <antinobody> well, I'm stubborn, I'll just keep beating my head against this process till it works, as with all things
[10:44] <Gloubiboulga> oh tea, good idea
[10:55] <antinobody> tea makes me happy
[10:58] <Pupeno> Hello.
[10:58] <Pupeno> If I want to play with the installer, that is, trying to add a feature I have in my head... how should I do it ? how should I set it up ?
[10:58] <_ion> Deja vu.
[10:59] <Pupeno> mh?
[12:41] <Hobbsee> hi again all
[12:42] <antinobody> hey Hobsee
[12:42] <antinobody> Hobbsee
[12:42] <antinobody> close
[12:42] <Hobbsee> hiya
[12:42] <antinobody> I need to go to sleep
[12:42] <antinobody> nice saying seeing you again though
[12:43] <antinobody> buenas noches
[12:50] <neenaoffline> Toadstool: did you compile SLIM ?
[12:51] <Toadstool> hi everybody
[12:51] <Toadstool> neenaoffline: the package is ready
[12:51] <Hobbsee> hi Toadstool
[12:51] <neenaoffline> uploaded it to the universe ?
[12:51] <Toadstool> not yet
[12:52] <Hobbsee> neenaoffline: edgy universe, not dapper universe.
[12:52] <neenaoffline> Toadstool: okay
[12:52] <neenaoffline> edgy ??
[12:52] <Hobbsee> yeah
[12:52] <neenaoffline> next codename ?
[12:52] <DarkMageZ> yup
[12:52] <Toadstool> neenaoffline: i'm not a motu fyi :)
[12:52] <neenaoffline> Toadstool: oh !
[12:52] <Hobbsee> Toadstool: you're not?  i thought you were
[12:52] <Hobbsee> Toadstool: then again, why would you be asking for reviews if you were
[12:53] <neenaoffline> Toadstool: then where will you upload it ?
[12:53] <Toadstool> neenaoffline: i'll ask someone to review the package and sponsor the upload ;)
[12:53] <neenaoffline> Toadstool: thanks !
[12:55] <Hobbsee> neenaoffline: it cant go into dapper by now.  dapper is more or less stable.
[12:55] <DarkMageZ> me & a friend are having an issue building songbird on our ubuntu dapper boxes, the dev's run fedora and they can't replicate our issue. was wondering if someone with more skill could give it a shot :)
[12:56] <Hobbsee> DarkMageZ: got the error message in a pastebin?
[12:56] <DarkMageZ> i did, i'll repaste
[12:57] <neenaoffline> Hobbsee: I did'nt understand??
[12:58] <Toadstool> neenaoffline: the set of packages available in dapper is freezed, we can't add slim
[12:58] <Hobbsee> neenaoffline: it cant go into dapper by now.  dapper is more or less stable.  All new software, and upgrades, go into dapper+1, ie, edgy, the development release.  Sometimes they get backported for dapper.
[01:00] <Hobbsee> neenaoffline: see https://wiki.kubuntu.org/TimeBasedReleases
[01:00] <Toadstool> by the way if anyone wants to review the package... :)
[01:00] <Toadstool> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2491
[01:01] <DarkMageZ> is it just me, or is pastebin.com slow...
[01:03] <Hobbsee> DarkMageZ: it's impossibly slow.  use pastebin.ca
[01:04] <DarkMageZ> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/16363
[01:05] <Hobbsee> ouch
[01:06] <Hobbsee> DarkMageZ: can you pastebin the makefile as well please?  or give me a link to where the package is?
[01:06] <Toadstool> nice error :)
[01:06] <DarkMageZ> my thoughts exactly
[01:06] <DarkMageZ> http://publicsvn.songbirdnest.com/trac/wiki
[01:07] <Hobbsee> Toadstool: recognise the error
[01:07] <Hobbsee> oh drat, it's svn...
[01:08] <DarkMageZ> revision 999
[01:08] <DarkMageZ> (which is current)
[01:09] <DarkMageZ> it's the greatest media player tho, just wish i could get it working :)
[01:09] <_ion> Better than amarok?
[01:10] <DarkMageZ> _ion, depends on how u like your gui
[01:10] <DarkMageZ> _ion, i personally hate amarok
[01:10] <DarkMageZ> but i'm sure some people like it
[01:14] <Amaranth> this summer of code stuff is a blast
[01:14] <DarkMageZ> what project are u doing Amaranth?
[01:14] <Amaranth> content filtering proxy
[01:15] <DarkMageZ> using squid as the base?
[01:15] <Amaranth> nope
[01:15] <Amaranth> wrote my own
[01:15] <Amaranth> http://www.realistanew.com/2006/06/24/content-is-blocked/
[01:15] <Amaranth> with python's stdlib a proxy isn't too hard to make
[01:16] <DarkMageZ> hmm, are you able to tell it to just filter out porn sites and it will stop most of them, or do you have to manually set each one?
[01:17] <Amaranth> it does bayesian filtering
[01:17] <Amaranth> so as you teach it about porn sites it should start figuring it out and blocking them
[01:17] <Amaranth> that's what the Content Filter tab is for
[01:18] <Hobbsee> Amaranth: wow, looks nice!  if there were a windows based version, i'd recommend it to our AU government..
[01:18] <Amaranth> hehe
[01:18] <Amaranth> Hobbsee: i'm making a web frontend
[01:18] <DarkMageZ> they already wasted $80million on filtering software recently
[01:18] <Amaranth> since real servers don't have dbus and X installed
[01:18] <Hobbsee> Amaranth: that's exactly what they're talking about sticking on all our ISP's, or offering as a free download - porn filtering software.
[01:19] <Amaranth> yuck
[01:19] <Amaranth> i'd better leave a backdoor or something in mine :P
[01:19] <Hobbsee> yeah exactly
[01:19] <Hobbsee> haha
[01:19] <DarkMageZ> Hobbsee, our government has realised that ISP level filtering doesn't work
[01:19] <Amaranth> set the X-Not-A-Moron header and it lets you through
[01:19] <Hobbsee> DarkMageZ: where are you at?
[01:19] <Hobbsee> Amaranth: hehe, yeah, exactly
[01:19] <DarkMageZ> Hobbsee, nowra
[01:19] <Hobbsee> how quickly do you think kids will get thru the porn filters?
[01:20] <Hobbsee> DarkMageZ: country?
[01:20] <Amaranth> hmm
[01:20] <DarkMageZ> Hobbsee, :P 2 hours south of sydney
[01:20] <Amaranth> i suspect they won't get through mine, if someone trains it
[01:20] <Hobbsee> about one minute after $clueless adult puts them on?
[01:20] <Hobbsee> nice :)
[01:20] <DarkMageZ> lol, country =D
[01:20] <Hobbsee> Amaranth: any time you feel like making a spam filter for the @ubuntu.com email addresses, feel free :D
[01:20] <Amaranth> heh
[01:20] <Hobbsee> DarkMageZ: i thought you were from here...i wasnt sure
[01:21] <Amaranth> Hobbsee: I'm using the Robinson-Fisher algorithm just like most spam filtering software
[01:21] <DarkMageZ> i have dilutions about nowra being better known
[01:21] <Hobbsee> Amaranth: web based, or computer based, or what?
[01:21] <Amaranth> So obviously things can get through but it's not as easy.
[01:21] <Hobbsee> true
[01:21] <Hobbsee> oh, yeah, right.
[01:21] <Hobbsee> dont mind my question :P
[01:21] <Amaranth> porn sites don't usually put random crap in their pages to get through a bayesian filter, i don't think :P
[01:22] <Hobbsee> heh
[01:22] <Amaranth> I mean, you'll always find something it doesn't block with whatever level of training it's at but you can't just go to one of those anonymizer sites and get access since it filters based on the content.
[01:23] <Hobbsee> true
[01:23] <Amaranth> Something gets through, mark it as bad, it shouldn't get through anymore. :)
[01:23] <DarkMageZ> Hobbsee, did u goto the dapper drake celebration party?
[01:23] <Hobbsee> DarkMageZ: no, where was it?
[01:24] <Amaranth> btw, training just one (normal) website as bad seems to make this thing block the whole web
[01:24] <DarkMageZ> Hobbsee, somewhere in sydney, i was thinking about going, thinking of going to the edgy eft one
[01:24] <Amaranth> i mean, only training it with that one thing
[01:24] <Hobbsee> DarkMageZ: ah, fair enough - do tell, when you find out where it is.
[01:25] <Hobbsee> Amaranth: er, okay then.  guess that makes sense.
[01:25] <Amaranth> Cool, it blocks my website and slashdot but it lets the...questionable stuff through. :)
[01:25] <Hobbsee> haha
[01:25] <Amaranth> It's working in reverse. :)
[01:25] <Amaranth> Someone find ogra for me. :P
[01:25] <Hobbsee> yes, i guess one would have to be able to find said questionable material, to test out one's filter :P
[01:26] <Amaranth> Yeah...that's it....
[01:27] <Amaranth> any of you in paris?
[01:27] <Hobbsee> nope
[01:27] <Hobbsee> didnt htey alll eave?
[01:27] <Amaranth> well, yesterday was supposed to be the last da
[01:27] <Amaranth> +y
[01:27] <Hobbsee> yeah
[01:27] <Amaranth> but i think they have a launchpad meeting or something
[01:27] <Hobbsee> oh ok
[01:27] <Amaranth> oh well, when ogra gets back on monday i'll just have that much more cool stuff to show him
[01:28] <Hobbsee> :)
[01:30] <DarkMageZ> Amaranth, make sure you always leave a backdoor to get around your own filtering, cause if someone ever used it against u :P
[01:30] <Amaranth> heh
[01:30] <Amaranth> with how small the code for the filtering is that'd get found real quick :)
[01:30] <DarkMageZ> true
[01:31] <DarkMageZ> the only disadvantage of opensource
[01:31] <Amaranth> 466 lines of code
[01:31] <Amaranth> ...wow
[01:31] <Amaranth> that's tiny :P
[01:32] <Hobbsee> wow
[01:33] <Amaranth> that's python
[01:33] <Amaranth> 7.1 RSS 3.4 Writable Memory
[01:33] <Amaranth> i believe the last number is the real one
[03:05] <zul> hey
[03:05] <tseng> hi
[03:05] <zul> how is it going tseng
[03:05] <tseng> fine thanks
[03:05] <tseng> people dont really believe in AC in barcelona
[03:05] <zul> heh..
[03:06] <zul> what are you doing in barcelona
[03:06] <tseng> guadec.org
[03:06] <zul> cool
[03:08] <jpatrick> tseng: having fun there?
[03:09] <tseng> yeah
[03:09] <jpatrick> It's boiling hot in Girona
[04:00] <zakame> hi all
[04:01] <zakame> ooh new code of conduct
[04:01] <tseng> ooh?
[04:02] <zakame> heh
[04:02] <Hobbsee> what, 1.0.2?
[04:21] <zakame> lazy day?
[04:22] <kelmo> was  here ;-)
[04:28] <zul> hmmm? new coc
[04:30] <imbrandon> yup lazy day ;)
[06:46] <neenaoffline> Toadstool: done with SLIM ?
[07:08] <neenaoffline> Toadstool: ping
[07:18] <neenaoffline> Toadstool: ping
[07:30] <Toadstool> neenaoffline: pong
[07:35] <neenaoffline> Toadstool: done with SLIM ?
[07:37] <Toadstool> neenaoffline: what do you mean? the source package is ready but you'll have to wait for it to be uploaded to edgy and built by the buildd...or you can build it on your own
[07:40] <carlfk> if I want to use xorg7.1  - what is the 'right way' ?
[07:40] <carlfk> dev on #xorg recommended it to solve a multi head problem
[07:41] <neenaoffline> Toadstool: was asking if you got anyone to upload it .... already built , merci !
[07:41] <neenaoffline> merci = thank you in french
[07:41] <Toadstool> neenaoffline: i'm french :)
[07:41] <neenaoffline> Toadstool: :) , Indian
[07:59] <carlfk> is there a howto describing how to upgrade an existing deb?
[08:21] <crimsun> carlfk: start with uupdate.
[08:21] <crimsun> hb, Mez|21today
[08:22] <Mez|21today> ty crimsun


[14:37] <Pendulum> AlanBell: ping
[14:43] <AlanBell> Pendulum: o/
[14:44] <Pendulum> I'm looking at personas now
[14:44] <Pendulum> one thing I was thinking about last night is that usually Personas don't actually mention the software they're for at all
[14:44] <Pendulum> they're about the computer needs and the person, not the software
[14:45] <Pendulum> (I suspect this is so they can be used universally)
[14:45] <Pendulum> would you object if I pulled out some of the specifics and put it down as a sepeare section below?
[14:45] <AlanBell> sure
[14:46] <AlanBell> as in that is fine, I won't object :)
[14:46] <Pendulum> so saying things like "he uses a screen reader" rather than "he uses Orca" and then at the bottom put a section about Ubuntu specifics (so the software he uses, etc.)
[14:46] <AlanBell> oh I see, yes that is fine
[14:47] <Pendulum> I'm working on Simon now
[14:48] <AlanBell> http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/simon
[14:49] <Pendulum> yeah, I know :)
[14:49] <AlanBell> for the benefit of others :)
[14:49] <Pendulum> I'm just thinking about how to make these more universal so they can be used together and separately as needed
[14:49] <Pendulum> I know the Gnome folks would like to be able to add them to their resources for personas, for example
[14:52] <Pendulum> did we ever discuss what we're using for license? Should we just stay with what the wiki is?
[14:53] <Pendulum> it's CC BY-SA which makes sense to me
[14:59] <AlanBell> yes a CC license makes the most sense I think
[15:05]  * Pendulum has just tweeted
[15:10] <Pendulum> I'm not quite sure I have correct wording for the part of "How to be Simon" I just edited, does someone else want to look at it?
[15:13] <AlanBell> it looks OK to me
[15:13] <Pendulum> okay
[15:13] <AlanBell> I have to go do some stuff, I will be doing more on this later on
[15:13] <Pendulum> I'm doing the Why A Challenge section and then I feel like it just needs to be proofread and it'll be good to go
[15:13] <Pendulum> so I'll move on to John when I finish Simon
[16:18] <AlanBell> hi, I am back
[16:18] <AlanBell> car is washed now
[16:19] <Pendulum> always good
[16:19] <Pendulum> I'm kinda stuck at doing any more with Simon so if you want to look it over, that one might be done :)
[16:20] <AlanBell> ok
[16:21] <AlanBell> lets put that one in a blog article and get pictures and layout right now
[16:22] <Pendulum> do you want to proofread it first?
[16:23] <Pendulum> (I know that if I try to, it won't go well)
[16:23] <AlanBell> yeah, reading through it now
[16:26] <AlanBell> looks good, Experience goals is empty, not quite sure what should go in there
[16:27] <Pendulum> just put something in
[16:28] <Pendulum> behaviours is also empty
[16:28] <Pendulum> (just noticed)
[16:32] <Pendulum> just stuck something in there too
[16:32] <Pendulum> hi brunogirin
[16:33] <brunogirin> hi Pendulum! I just dropped by to see if I could help with the persona writing
[16:33] <Pendulum> great!
[16:34] <Pendulum> we're finishing up Simon (as you can see). He's partially sighted (in the process of becoming fully blind). Feel free to jump in and make changes if you see things that need to be fixed :)
[16:36] <Pendulum> AlanBell: the accessing the menu bar in beta1 is still broken, right?
[16:36] <AlanBell> it is
[16:36] <AlanBell> well you can access it, but it is silent
[16:36] <Pendulum> (someone posted to the list so I wanted to be able to say, yes, that's a known issue)
[16:37] <AlanBell> it only reads out the shortcuts
[16:38] <Pendulum> jvesouza: Hi, I was just replying to your e-mail. The short answer is, yes, it's broken and that's a known issue.
[16:39] <Pendulum> f10 is actually accessing the menu bar, but it's not reading it out. It's only reading out the shortcuts
[16:40] <Pendulum> (information provided by AlanBell)
[16:40] <jvesouza> Pendulum: OK, thanks!
[16:41] <jvesouza> Pendulum:  At least I am not doing something wrong!
[16:41] <Pendulum> I think we're trying to get it fixed for Beta2, but I'm not sure.
[16:42] <Pendulum> (I don't code and while I remember having a conversation with Luke about it, I don't have memory of what was said for timing)
[16:44] <brunogirin> Pendulum: the Simon persona looks good to me, just corrected a minor typo :-)
[16:44] <Pendulum> oh, good. I can't proofread my own work and I can't proofread things I've read too many times (like the persona)
[16:44] <AlanBell> jvesouza: one thing that has just been done is the code to stop everything being a checkbox menu item
[16:49] <Pendulum> I just learned that Australia has it's own sign language, interesting.
[16:50] <brunogirin> all the personas so far have a condition that is either congenital or that gradually deteriorate
[16:51] <brunogirin> are there any plans to have a persona that has had a sudden change, like Jakie in diveintoaccessibility: http://diveintoaccessibility.info/day_1_jackie.html ?
[16:52] <AlanBell> we were kind of going for a minimum number of personas required to cover all the areas we wanted
[16:52] <jvesouza> Pendulum: AlanBell I will teach linux to some people in Brasil and I'd like to use ubuntu 12.04 because its accessibility.
[16:53] <AlanBell> excellent jvesouza
[16:53] <brunogirin> AlanBell: makes sense, I'm just wondering if there are specific challenges there that are not covered by the others
[16:53] <Pendulum> brunogirin: I was thinking of making Heniretta, our persona cognative impairments as someone who had traumatic brain injury (TBI)
[16:53] <Pendulum> *Henrietta
[16:55] <jvesouza> AlanBell:  All blind, including myself.
[17:20] <Pendulum> I'm giving myself a crash-course in technical universities and deaf schools in Australia
[17:27]  * Pendulum goes for a lunch break
[18:34] <Pendulum> but I'm back
[19:03] <AlanBell> hi Pendulum