[05:56] <kkathman> yeah thats a good thing, but thats a hard sell for small biz, because routers do the same thing for $60
[05:57] <pussfeller> I notice in the few times I have gotten someone to use linux, they blame me if things aren't perfect
[05:57] <kkathman> if you could combine a small Linux box to be a firewall, print server and file server, thats a better sell for the $200-300 you'd need to put it in
[05:58] <LeeJunFan> kkathman: not really. I haven't seen any $60 boxes that can do caching, _good_ traffic control, traffic monitoring, virus scanning as an e-mail gateway, squid caching, etc...
[05:58] <LeeJunFan> Man I'm tired still - I mentioned caching twice :)
[05:58] <kkathman> pussfeller: well, as much as we poo poo Microsoft Windows, they have done a good job of brainwashing...the interface is familiar, schools teach it from the Kindergarten years on up, colleges make it mandatory...blah blah
[05:58] <pussfeller> LeeJunFan, but thats like klingon to most companies
[05:59] <pussfeller> LeeJunFan, they don't KNOW they need that stuff and what it can do for them
[05:59] <Bicchi> i just installed kubuntu and using kde. in the menu i see a kynaptic option to get software and also synaptic. i thought that kynaptic was the kde version of synaptic. if so, why do i also have synaptic installed.
[05:59] <kkathman> of all the things Microsoft is, one of them is NOT dumb or stupid.
[05:59] <pussfeller> i would argue that point...
[05:59] <kkathman> lol
[05:59] <LeeJunFan> pussfeller: yeah, you don't tell them what you are doing behind the scenes, you just tell them it'll give them the ability to know what's going on on their network, protect them from viruses, etc..
[05:59] <chavo> Bicchi, kynaptic is still in development and has less features
[06:00] <Bicchi> chavo: so i can use synaptic instead.
[06:00] <chavo> Bicchi, I always use synaptic here
[06:00] <pussfeller> Bicchi, use synaptic or the command line right now till kynaptic gets fleshed out
[06:00] <kkathman> argue all you want, but there is pretty strong evidence that the've done alot of things right :)
[06:00] <Bicchi> chavo: why do we need 2 versions.
[06:00] <chavo> Bicchi, someone felt like writing a qt version.
[06:01] <kkathman> I hate that they are a one install does all...and its bloated and intricate and all kinds of bad...but people DO use it and its not gonna go away anytime in my lifetime
[06:01] <kkathman> lol
[06:01] <Bicchi> pussfeller: so synaptic can download just as kynaptic. it allready knows that i use kde and will only bring software for the kde environment.
[06:01] <LeeJunFan> kkathman: well, they've done the smart thing, not the right thing. There is a difference. Because money is their driving motivation rather than quality of product.
[06:01] <kkathman> LeeJunFan: not many consumers give a crap about how the code is written to be brutally honest
[06:01] <kkathman> only us geeks do :)
[06:02] <Bicchi> chavo: so both (synaptic and kynaptic) have the same avaliable packages for download?
[06:02] <kkathman> the average consumer wants to check their email, write documents, do spreadsheets and send email
[06:02] <LeeJunFan> kkathman: I'm not talking about the code itself, but what you can accomplish with windows, it's like getting a weeble wobble to run a marathon.
[06:03] <LeeJunFan> But a weeble wobble is easy enough for even the dumbest person to use.
[06:03] <kkathman> LeeJunFan: I dont disagree.
[06:03] <LeeJunFan> kkathman: I know, I'm just saying that's what microsoft did smart. By being stupid. :)
[06:04] <kkathman> LeeJunFan: but, again, I fail to see on a consistent basis, where, from the desktop outward, that Linux is an easier environment for the average person...I LOVE it, but my wife or my 88 yr-old dad couldnt use it
[06:05] <kkathman> they arent stupid, there are ALOT of very smart people at Microsoft...their philosophy kinda sucks, but the people arent dumb
[06:06] <pussfeller> linux isn't easier thats for sure
[06:06] <kkathman> I sell enterprise software to large companies for a living, and guess what, Linux is piecemeal around, but NO one would use it to run a mission critical application set.
[06:06] <LeeJunFan> Exactly, eventually both linux and humankind will evolve to the point where they work well together. Only a couple hundred years ago most people would have thought the telephone was magical and complicated. Now everyone understands the basics of how it works.
[06:06] <kkathman> pussfeller: and thats the pivot point right now isnt it?  Greater acceptance WILL come, and there have been terrific strides in just a few years :)
[06:07] <pussfeller> thats very true, the desktop has come a million miles in just the last 2 years
[06:07] <pussfeller> my kid runs kubuntu and has no problems with it... the only issue we have revoloves around sound....
[06:08] <pussfeller> but I set it up for him.... thats the thing
[06:08] <kkathman> pussfeller:  I can remember just like 5 or 6 years ago, as savvy as I am, installing Linux meant first reading all my hardware manuals, getting all those parameters and going through a VERY cryptic install
[06:08] <LeeJunFan> Think of what the average person knows compared to what was common knowledge only a hundred or so years ago. We all learn how wings create lift in grade school, etc...
[06:08] <pussfeller> LeeJunFan, mankind has lost a lot of common knowledge in the past hundred years too
[06:09] <LeeJunFan> pussfeller: that's very true too. Very few people could live off the land if their lives depended on it also.
[06:09] <pussfeller> i should say common sense
[06:09] <kkathman> LeeJunFan: correct and what needs to happen, is that somewhere along the line, the Microsoft bias needs to be broken. But in all honesty, as long as M$ rules the desktop, its not in the best interest of our children to teach them otherwise, because thats the "standard" and they should know it :)
[06:09] <kkathman> its a bit of a cycle
[06:10] <pussfeller> nah, MS can't control the desktop forever
[06:10] <kkathman> and thats why when M$ displaced Apple as the education leader in schools, they won a major part of the war
[06:10] <pussfeller> I don't think MS can survive in a non controlling environment
[06:11] <pussfeller> apple stopped growing for awhile, didn't it
[06:11] <pussfeller> I mean, they stopped being competitive
[06:11] <pussfeller> its only been recently that they have kinda bounced back
[06:11] <kkathman> pussfeller:  well there's nothing that would help computing more than a really solid OS that is easy to install and runs with very little problems for the average person.  Linux is the only serious player for that right now
[06:12] <kkathman> Apple has gone in a completely different direction, you are right
[06:12] <pussfeller> kkathman, do you see people with sp2 still having the spyware problems?
[06:12] <kkathman> Google poses the biggest threat to Microsoft right now, and with that diversion, Linux can make up some ground
[06:13] <kkathman> pussfeller:  not if they have the MS Antispyware software
[06:13] <pussfeller> so it does work
[06:13] <kkathman> yeah actually its pretty freakin good
[06:13] <kkathman> I run it and our company (the 3rd largest IT company in the world) has it on every desktop
[06:13] <kkathman> and laptop
[06:14] <pussfeller> does it take care of cws
[06:14] <kkathman> cws>
[06:14] <KaiL> 3rd largest IT..?
[06:14] <KaiL> IBM?
[06:14] <kkathman> no
[06:14] <pussfeller> cool web search
[06:14] <pussfeller> thats the bitch of the bunch
[06:14] <kkathman> 1) IBM  2) HP  3) Fujitsu
[06:14] <KaiL> HP?
[06:14] <KaiL> ah, ok ;)
[06:15] <KaiL> I guess, you use FSC Laptops then?
[06:15] <kkathman> hehe nope..I have an IBM Thinkpad T42
[06:15] <pussfeller> heh i have seen like 300 entries in the hklm startups from that crap
[06:15] <kkathman> but all our sales reps have Fujitsu laptops
[06:15] <pussfeller> i was appaled... I didn't think someone could ever do something like that even accidently
[06:16] <kkathman> pussfeller: I dont see it on my machine, I'll put it that way
[06:16] <KaiL> interesting, if even the own techs don't have the own hardware ;)
[06:16] <KaiL> as I don't find IBM harddisks in IBM laptops *g*
[06:17] <kkathman> KaiL: there's a reason KaiL ... the Fujitsu laptops are beautiful and very good...but Im a pre-sales tech.. that needs to run about 20 servers on my laptop to demo my software and its 3rd parts hookins
[06:17] <kkathman> KaiL:  IBM uses Fujitsu hdds alot :)
[06:17] <KaiL> and that's too much work for an FSC laptop? ;)
[06:18] <kkathman> my laptop has 2gb memory, Oracle RDBMS, plus a bevvy of other servers..Fujitsu just doesnt make a laptop big enough or rugged enough for our job.
[06:19] <kkathman> in fact, they are contemplating now, beginning with our next release, having us carry TWO laptops...one server (prolly Linux !!) on one, and our standard everyday pc and client on a Fujistu laptop
[06:20] <kkathman> thats gonna suck to carry around
[06:20] <kkathman> and pull out at security in airports
[06:21] <KaiL> at least you always have something for client/server :)
[06:22] <kkathman> yeah
[06:22] <kkathman> hopefully we can find a single box that will do all of it
[06:22] <KaiL> ever tried a java server with "only 512MiB RAM"?
[06:22] <pussfeller> woot my fx0 card just got here so now I can start playing with asterisk
[06:22] <kkathman> thats one reason I got back into learning more about Linux so that I could manage my own server if/when we got it
[06:23] <kkathman> KaiL: ugh..java
[06:23] <pussfeller> java has gtg
[06:23] <KaiL> "gtg"?
[06:23] <pussfeller> got to go
[06:23] <KaiL> ah
[06:23] <kkathman> Ive never seen a java app that didnt take forever to run
[06:23] <KaiL> "write once, debug everywhere"
[06:23] <kkathman> haha
[06:24] <kkathman> Im not a huge proponent of OO anyway
[06:24] <Kisain> hello
[06:24] <pussfeller> interpreted languages are the future
[06:24] <kkathman> and Java is one reason why
[06:24] <Kisain> sorry had some trouble with my network
[06:24] <KaiL> we got a Samsong P35 (1.6GHz, 512MiB) rto be unusable with..........
[06:24] <Kisain> router failed
[06:24] <kkathman> pussfeller: funny how technology just seems to cycle itself with new names
[06:24] <Kisain> :(
[06:24] <KaiL> ...a server for hangman-game written in Java
[06:25] <KaiL> I bet in C++ that won't be any relevant background activity
[06:25] <Kisain> how do i host my own ftp on kubuntu?
[06:25] <pussfeller> well, it jsut seems to me in my limeted coding experiences. that stuff like ruby or python is soooo much easier to learn... and what with faster machines coming along... theres less and less reason to do stuff at a low level
[06:25] <pussfeller> thats a totally uninformed opinon
[06:26] <kkathman> Kisain: you'll need to get an FTP hosting software pkg
[06:26] <Kisain> where form?
[06:26] <kkathman> try apt-cache search ftp
[06:26] <Kisain> from*
[06:26] <kkathman> look there
[06:26] <Kisain> um what about in syn?
[06:26] <pussfeller> Kisain, you are trying to run an ftp server?
[06:27] <Kisain> i don't even have a program yet lol
[06:27] <pussfeller> theres pureftpd and proftp are probably what you wanna look at
[06:27] <Kisain> nice
[06:30] <kkathman> hey pussfeller  do you have any probs exchanging files through DCC?
[06:34] <KaiL> nice, my WLAN just lost it's connection....
[06:37] <Kisain> hey i'm using the mouse odometer how do i move it to the lower left hand corner?
[06:38] <Kisain> it won't move
[06:38] <kkathman> welcome back pussfeller :)
[06:38] <Kisain> whazzup kkathman?
[06:38] <Cowlike-away> kisain, can you use <left-alt>drag?
[06:39] <kkathman> Kisain: right click on it and see if there is an option to "unlock" the fixed position
[06:39] <kkathman> yo Cowlike wassup?
[06:39] <Kisain> nope theres not :/
[06:39] <Kisain> and i can't move it that way weard
[06:39] <Cowlike> hi mkkath
[06:39] <Cowlike> kisain, hover your mouse over the window and try <alt> drag
[06:40] <Cowlike> hold down alt and try to move with mouse
[06:40] <Kisain> never mind it worked lol
[06:40] <Kisain> had no idea lol
[06:40] <Kisain> man can't waite to get my linux books
[06:40] <Kisain> theres so much i have to learn
[06:41] <Kisain> i'm gonna set this ftp server up to share my apps and mp3's
[06:41] <Cowlike> kisain, best part is all the online resources too, and all the helpful folks on irc
[06:41] <Kisain> as soon as i figure out how :/ lol
[06:41] <Kisain> yea it rocks
[06:41] <Kisain> it's nice havin user to user help......
[06:41] <Cowlike> errrr uhhh well actually the best part is having a stable, low-cost solid system :)
[06:42] <Kisain> much more evective than some dude on the other end of the telly who can't speak english
[06:42] <pussfeller> that was odd my gateway just rebooted spontaneously
[06:42] <Kisain> :P
[06:42] <Kisain> ewwww
[06:43] <kkathman> hey pussfeller do you have any probs doing DCC file transfers? I cant seem to connect to anyone, but Im sure its a port issue with my firewall
[06:43] <Cowlike> kisain, you're better off starting with learning ssh (and scp) rather than setting up ftp
[06:43] <kkathman> wondering what the defaults are for DCC
[06:43] <kkathman> I know you can set them, but if no one sets them, what are the ports?
[06:43] <Cowlike> kkathman, you using a router?
[06:43] <Kisain> ok where's a good place to learn this stuff?
[06:43] <kkathman> Cowlike: sure..NAT router
[06:43] <pussfeller> kkathman, i can't remember
[06:44] <Cowlike> kkathman, i had same problem... pretty sure you need to forward SOME port through the router to your ip... don't know which though  :O
[06:44] <kkathman> i know its an issue of port forwarding
[06:44] <pussfeller> iptables should handle that stuff tho without having to open a port iirc
[06:44] <kkathman> yeah thats just it...in Konversation, you can set the outgoing and incomming ports
[06:44] <kkathman> but lets say no one does that...what does it use?
[06:44] <Cowlike> kkathman, the OReilly book on SSH is very good. but then again there are MANY online resources too, just google it
[06:44] <kkathman> thats the bite
[06:44] <Cowlike> oops, i mean kisain
[06:45] <kkathman> lol
[06:45] <pussfeller> yes, i have used dcc to get a bunch of stuff under this setup.
[06:45] <Kisain> yes?
[06:45] <kkathman> pussfeller:  can you go to your settings, DCC and see if you have hard set those ports?
[06:45] <pussfeller> and I have no port set up to forward any dcc
[06:45] <Cowlike> kisain, the program "scp" is what you want for file transfers. part of the ssh suite
[06:45] <Kisain> ok how do i lean how to do this for n00bs
[06:45] <pussfeller> kkathman, no ports set in xchat
[06:45] <kkathman> pussfeller: weird ok..thats odd
[06:46] <kkathman> you didnt port forward or anything eh?
[06:46] <Kisain> see i'm thinking that there might be some sorta how to you know
[06:46] <Cowlike> kisain, probably want to get the book. it steps you through EVERYTHING in great detail. not sure of a really good noob-oriented online tutorial
[06:46] <Kisain> i know absolutly nothing of linux
[06:46] <Cowlike> must be one though
[06:46] <kkathman> I remember on my windows box I had to port forward, but under mIRC it told you what the defaults were
[06:46] <Kisain> i had to stumble my way through it's way of doing things
[06:46] <kkathman> and 99% of windows IRC users implement mIRC
[06:47] <maros> mIRC is cool :)
[06:47] <Cowlike> kkathman, under prefs for konversation, you can enable specific ports
[06:47] <maros> I miss mIRC
[06:47] <Cowlike> i'm looking at it now, the DCC section
[06:47] <maros> you know.. you could tile windows in mIRC, you can't do that in x-chat
[06:48] <maros> tiling windows could make you follow multiple convos in multiple channels all in the same screen
[06:48] <Cowlike> maros, that bugs me too. wish i could "tear off" a tab
[06:48] <Cowlike> prolly should request that from the konversation maintainers
[06:49] <maros> I prolly should
[06:49] <maros> i'm also prolly lazy
[06:50] <maros> which do you prolly think I will do?
[06:50] <maros> :)
[06:50] <Cowlike> haha
[06:50] <Cowlike> shorthand, i'm prolly pretty lazy
[06:51] <maros> I wish KDE enabled mouse gestures
[06:51] <maros> and just with one mouse gesture
[06:51] <maros> I could file a bug report
[06:51] <maros> or a suggestion
[06:51] <maros> ;)
[06:51] <Cowlike> lol
[06:51] <Cowlike> i just gesture by throwing my mouse at the wall when i get mad enough
[06:51] <woodefec> hello
[06:51] <kkathman> Cowlike:  yes I know, so I guess if I want to exchange something with someone, I just tell them to set their parms to mine
[06:51] <woodefec> how is kubuntu like?>
[06:51] <maros> woodefec, PERFECTO!
[06:52] <kkathman> woodefec: I would suggest that you install hoary final first, then apt-get install kubuntu-desktop, instead of just installing kubuntu
[06:52] <Cowlike> kkathman: i don't know the details of how DCC works but i was wondering about that. the protocol might specify that the dcc initiator passes the return port to talk on. i don't know
[06:52] <Cowlike> kkathman, in which case, it just works on whatever you set it to
[06:53] <kkathman> Cowlike:  well I have alot of experience with IRC at least on Windows, and the common port exchanges are in a typical range
[06:53] <Cowlike> kkathman, but of course, the request coming in would need a common port to get started :)
[06:53] <kkathman> I think its like the 5000's for send and 8000s for receive I'd have to go back and check
[06:54] <kkathman> But in mIRC (the common win client) those ranges are set by default. So all you have to do is open those port ranges and forward to your local IP
[06:55] <Cowlike> kkathman, then it would probably be fine if you just did the same for konversation
[06:55] <pussfeller> kkathman, my dcc recieves are working fine, other than ones that require mirc comands to connect to a certain port
[06:55] <kkathman> Cowlike: yeah, but I'd like to know what those defaults are..thats my point...I guess I could assume they are the same, but I hate assuming
[06:56] <Cowlike> kkathman, i know what you mean but i'm clueless too
[06:56] <Cowlike> 11:54]  <Info> Offering DCC Chat connection to kkathman on port 40941...
[06:56] <kkathman> pussfeller:  usually what happens, or has been happening, is that I'll try to send to you, you'll get my send okk...but then you have to, by protocol, send an ACK msg back to start my send..its that ACK that I never get back
[06:56] <Cowlike> hmmm
[06:57] <kkathman> [11:57]  <Info> Establishing DCC Chat connection to Cowlike (<IP_ADDRESS>:40941)...
[06:57] <kkathman> [11:57]  <Info> Looking for host <IP_ADDRESS>...
[06:57] <kkathman> [11:57]  <Info> Host found, connecting...
[06:57] <kkathman> [11:57]  <Error> Connection broken, error code 15.
[06:57] <kkathman> Cowlike: see I need to forward that port
[06:57] <kkathman> Cowlike did you hard set that port?
[06:57] <kkathman> or was that the default?
[06:58] <Cowlike> kkathman, didn't set anything. just tried to do dcc chat and that's waht came up
[06:58] <kkathman> ok hold on a sec
[06:58] <pussfeller> USE_IRC=1                         # Enable support for the IRC-protocol
[06:58] <Cowlike> no, the problem is on my end
[06:58] <pussfeller> thats in my scripts
[06:58] <Cowlike> i'm accepting on 40941 but don't have an opening for that port
[06:58] <pussfeller> kkathman, send me a file
[06:59] <pussfeller> theres an irc iptables module you need loaded, or turned on in proc
[06:59] <kkathman> Cowlike..now try again
 Offering DCC Chat connection to kkathman on port 40943...
[07:00] <kkathman> interesting that the port changed, but I opened the range so should have worked
[07:00] <Brondoman> hello...quick question for ya'll regrading kubuntu
[07:01] <Cowlike> netstat -an |grep 40967
[07:01] <Cowlike> tcp6       0      0 :::40967                :::*                    LISTEN
[07:01] <Cowlike> problem is on MY end
[07:01] <kkathman> oh hmm
[07:01] <Cowlike> that message means i'm listening on that port
[07:01] <Cowlike> *I* need to forward thost ports
[07:01] <kkathman> ahh ok
[07:01] <kkathman> pussfeller: I'll try you
[07:01] <Cowlike> gotta run to an appt. i'll play with this later :)
[07:02] <Brondoman> I use both Kubuntu and Ubuntu..I also like the kde infrastructure better than Gnome...But, will the Kubuntu project be able to keep producing releases like Ubuntu?  Is it backed by Mr. Shuttleworth as well?  Thanks...
[07:03] <Cowlike-away> brondoman, it's the same linux... just with a different desktop
[07:03] <Cowlike-away> same packages in the repos
[07:03] <kkathman> pussfeller: I tried to DCC chat you
[07:03] <kkathman> it went out on 37452
[07:07] <pussfeller> kkathman, it failed
[07:07] <kkathman> ok
[07:07] <kkathman> well
[07:07] <kkathman> obviously something weird going on
[07:07] <kkathman> no clue...its not that technical really
[07:08] <kkathman> ports open and forwarded  the other person the same...should be ok
[07:08] <pussfeller> Brondoman, they always planned to have kde as well, they just chose gnome as the main... the kde branch is getting alot of focus among kde developers as far as I can tell
[07:10] <Bicchi> how can i get macromedia flash player installed in kubuntu. I have an amd 64?
[07:11] <Livingstone__> media:/ stop working :'(
[07:11] <Livingstone__> just after a reboot
[07:12] <KaiL> Livingstone__: any error message?
[07:13] <Livingstone__> no, just media:/ is all clear
[07:13] <KaiL> that's strange
[07:14] <KaiL> ps aux | grep hald
[07:14] <KaiL> is there a /usr/sbin/hald listed?
[07:15] <Brondoman> Cool...thanks much for the info!
[07:15] <kkathman> Bicchi: go to the macromedia page and download the player for linux
[07:16] <KaiL> kkathman: there's one for amd64 now?
[07:16] <Bicchi> kkathman: do they have a 64 bit version?
[07:16] <Bicchi> Kail: thanks
[07:16] <kkathman> Bicchi: I dont think there is a difference, but I cant speak for the 64
[07:16] <whiskers> what is the deal with getting banned....it is not my fault hoary isn't worth a crap and breezy needs to be developed
[07:17] <KaiL> whiskers: why do I feel, that I feed a troll, if I talk to you?
[07:17] <kkathman> whiskers: so who banned you? thats who you need to talk to.
[07:18] <whiskers> and everybody in the world knows this...because all they have to do is check at distrowatch.com and they can see on the left that ubuntu costs $1.99 and gentoo costs $5.97
[07:18] <whiskers> kkathman, i don't know who keeps banning me or why...i am just trying to get the stuff working in spite of all the foolish mistakes of the distributors
[07:18] <KaiL> lol, what an argument...
[07:19] <kkathman> Im thinking that you prolly know why you were banned, and just want to air it out now and Im not gonna play that game - ignore
[07:19] <KaiL> whiskers: so Windows XP must be great - over $100
[07:19] <KaiL> Bicchi: no flashplayer for amd64 :(
[07:19] <KaiL> Livingstone__: ping?
[07:19] <kkathman> lol KaiL
[07:19] <whiskers> kkathman, no i don't know....i am trying to get the basics working and everybody gets pissed off
[07:20] <KaiL> whiskers: which basics are not working?
[07:20] <KaiL> Livingstone__: is there a /usr/sbin/hald listed?
[07:20] <KaiL> ..if you type "ps aux | grep hald"
[07:20] <whiskers> KaiL, well i have rebuilt glibc with linuxthreads2 and linuxthreads_db and db and libdb4.3 and now the database stuff is working but the damn gnome help doesn't work
[07:21] <KaiL> if you won't try to rebuild everything, thinks might work much better
[07:21] <pussfeller> whiskers i find you entertaining so I hope you can keep from getting banned for good
[07:21] <whiskers> and i have included sybase,xbase,odbc, postgres, mysql, sqllite,and ldap drivers
[07:21] <amichai> kkathman: man whats up? my internet in kde is still miserably slow
[07:21] <amichai> kkathman: in gnome and xfce its great
[07:21] <whiskers> and still i get a missing DSO in gnome-help....i don't know what else to include
[07:22] <whiskers> and i also tried rebuilding gnome-help from scratch with docbook, yelp and scrollkeeper and it is still doing no good
[07:23] <whiskers> KaiL, well that is a bad attitude.
[07:23] <whiskers> plus i have the damn problem with mingnu on win98...and the damn symlinks won't work
[07:23] <KaiL> "gnome-help" was the help tool in GNOME 1.4, you know?
[07:24] <kkathman> hmm odd... wonder what browser he was using
[07:24] <whiskers> KaiL, well...why doesn't the damn thing work....what ....are you supposed to know everything about gnome without any docs
[07:24] <kkathman> prolly FF in Gnome
[07:24] <KaiL> use yelp.
[07:24] <kkathman> not many choices there
[07:25] <whiskers> KaiL, yelp doesn't work...even after recompiling everything...it still says missing DSO in glibc
[07:25] <KaiL> eh installes..
[07:26] <KaiL> and - incredible - it works!
[07:27] <KaiL> whiskers: what now..?
[07:27] <whiskers> KaiL, and the bad thing is the ambiguity of DSO....you don't know what to fix.....i have built every database driver that i know of except the commercial stuff like db2,oracle and so on.....so is it a  datasource object that is missing or because of ambiguity of DSO is it a dynamic loadable module for glibc that is missing.
[07:28] <Livingstone__> KaiL: yes
[07:28] <Livingstone__> there is
[07:28] <kkathman> yahalom: you ran off :)
[07:28] <KaiL> why don't you just use the default packages?
[07:29] <KaiL> Livingstone__: now trat
[07:29] <KaiL> ops
[07:29] <kkathman> yahalom: do you want to see if we can iron out your internet issues?
[07:29] <KaiL> Livingstone__: now that's getting really really strange....
[07:29] <whiskers> KaiL, the damn packages don't work at all...the damn hoary was built with the old libdb3....and isn't worth a shit
[07:29] <whiskers> KaiL, so everything has to be changed...and i am getting sick of it
[07:29] <KaiL> whiskers: as I said, here it works
[07:30] <KaiL> maybe libdb3 isn't that bad idea? ;)
[07:30] <whiskers> KaiL, well the only thing that works here is the database programs.....but nothing else works anymore....because nearly everything relies on gnome-help....and the damn thing is missing a DSO
[07:30] <KaiL> Livingstone__: could you try a second reboot? I have really no idea, what could went wrong there
[07:31] <KaiL> whiskers: it isn't, if you use the binaries for everything
[07:31] <whiskers> KaiL, i started with the binaries....and they are not worth a shit....nothing would work...no database program at all
[07:31] <whiskers> KaiL, so that is why i am having to rebuild everything on hoary....
[07:32] <KaiL> oh, really? interesting, like which database program?
[07:32] <whiskers> KaiL, glom would not connect...kexi would not connect...rekall would not connect....only knoda would  connect
[07:32] <whiskers> KaiL, so now i have them all connecting...but everything else is broken
[07:33] <whiskers> it was just a major screwup by ubuntu...they did not plan all the database stuff properly with their glibc and libdb builds
[07:35] <KaiL> maybe you should compile these apps with libdb3 too? ;)
[07:36] <whiskers> KaiL, fuck libdb3...i have the important stuff working on libdb4.3 for now
[07:36] <whiskers> and gllibc20050502
[07:36] <whiskers> but the rest of hoary is screwed
[07:36] <KaiL> wonderfull...
[07:36] <KaiL> a cvs glibc
[07:37] <whiskers> KaiL, well of course it is cvs....they are trying to fix the damn problems
[07:38] <whiskers> KaiL, and the damn ubuntu....made serious mistakes by precompiling a lot of stuff on the wrong libraries
[07:38] <KaiL> ah, so every stable libc around the world is "not worth a shit"?
[07:39] <whiskers> KaiL, that is why gentoo is selling for $5.97 and ubuntu for only $1.99
[07:39] <whiskers> KaiL, absolutely not....that is why there is a cvs...so the damn problems can be fixed
[07:40] <KaiL> ....and if we take you, we get some money?
[07:41] <whiskers> KaiL, i don't have any....the people collecting the money are over at distrowatch.com
[07:41] <whiskers> KaiL, just look at the left hand column
[07:42] <maros> Any sites out there similar to freshmeat?
[07:43] <kkathman> maros: KDE.org is good too
[07:43] <whiskers> kkathman, i did solve the problem with esd in the mean time
[07:43] <maros> kkathman, what do you recommend as a good news reader?
[07:43] <whiskers> kkathman, now skype and audacity work just fine with esd running
[07:43] <maros> Im gonna check out kde.org, thanks
[07:44] <whiskers> kkathman, by rerouting /dev/dsp
[07:44] <whiskers> calls
[07:44] <whiskers> kkathman, so now at least people won't have that problem
[07:45] <whiskers> kkathman, and you don't have to worry about pkill and all that crap
[07:45] <KaiL> kkathman: you miss some funny nonsence
[07:45] <KaiL> ..which I now miss too
[07:45] <whiskers> kkathman, but this gnome-help is a serious problem
[07:45] <kkathman> maros:  oh man there is a good one...and I forgot what it is...hold on
[07:45] <maros> ok :)
[07:46] <KaiL> maros: knode
[07:46] <kkathman> yes thats it
[07:46] <KaiL> which is already installed on your system (part of kontact)
[07:46] <maros> tantadada
[07:46] <maros> I'll go install it right now
[07:46] <kkathman> snownews is a decent RSS reader, but you can get RSS through Kontact
[07:46] <maros> oh wait
[07:46] <KaiL> it's only not shown in the bar on the left - duno why
[07:46] <maros> it's already installed
[07:46] <maros> :)
[07:46] <whiskers> so the ubuntu is screwed and there is still a symlink problem on win98
[07:47] <KaiL> in kontact: settings -> components
[07:47] <KaiL> there you'll just see it - set the x there and you have it.
[07:47] <Bicchi> i notice that when i drag any program around the desktop the window does not get painted right away and leaves like empty areas without been drawn. How can i fix this. I have a fax computer and enough video card memory and this problem should not be there.
[07:47] <whiskers> so neither IBM approach nor MS approach is working worth a damn
[07:47] <KaiL> don't ask me, what this isn't default.....
[07:47] <maros> alt-f2 and then typed knode... and opened in a seperate window
[07:47] <KaiL> or that way :)
[07:48] <whiskers> KaiL, but if you want money...you should go ask the people at www.distrowatch.com...they are the ones collecting all the money
[07:49] <whiskers> KaiL, i am not spamming...i am not even related to distrowatch whatsoever.....i am just saying that they collect all the money.
[07:50] <whiskers> KaiL, they even get $7.97 for Redhat and Slackware....even more than gentoo
[07:52] <KaiL> Bicchi: which graphics card?
[07:52] <whiskers> KaiL, and i really don't understand that...because there is no better distro than gentoo
[07:53] <Bicchi> Kail: ATI Radeon 9800 pro. Using dualhead at the moment. same display.
[07:53] <maros> when I first opened up knode, there was a window for setting up an account... well, I closed it, then closed knode.. now I open it up again and I can't find an enabled menu item to configure knode and add a news account
[07:53] <whiskers> KaiL, all these problems on hoary would have been a piece of cake to solve on gentoo
[07:53] <KaiL> fglrx activated?
[07:53] <maros> forget what I said
[07:53] <maros> :)
[07:53] <whiskers> KaiL, it is set up to compile the latest libs first and then the programs after that
[07:53] <KaiL> maros: settings -> configure knode :)
[07:53] <KaiL> << eating
[07:54] <Bicchi> Kail: it does not matter. i have done it with fglrx and with "ati" and still the same problem.
[07:54] <Bicchi> Kail: could it be the refresh rate.
[07:55] <Bicchi> Kail: like the HorizSync and VertRefresh. in xorg.conf
[07:56] <kkathman> maros: I just set that up again, need for me to help you through it?
[07:56] <yahalom> anyone here know abotu updating dns?
[07:58] <kkathman> yahalom: should have done that if you were connected to the internet when you installed
[07:58] <yahalom> kkathman: i changed it cos i got the wrong ones
[07:58] <whiskers> well...that win98 sure pisses me off about the symlink jazz....i guess i could take the win98 compilation of postgres and pgaccess and tk/tcl and just use a separated installer for win98
[07:59] <kkathman> ok..you got them from the ISP or your router I suspect
[07:59] <whiskers> but it would have been easier if mingnu would have fixed the symlink problem on win98
[07:59] <kkathman> then set them in control center -> Internet & Network
[08:00] <yahalom> kkathman:i changed them
[08:00] <whiskers> but i did get mplayer pre7 compiled and postgres compiled for win98 in case anybody already paid for win98
[08:00] <maros> kkathman, no, thank you for asking... it seemed that I missed the configure knode option... that menu area was a blind spot... there should be a seperator above Configure KNode
[08:02] <kkathman> okie dokie..np..enjoy maros
[08:02] <whiskers> because if they already paid for win98...MS won't give their money back....so i guess we will just compile all the latest software for win98....so that people get their money's worth
[08:02] <maros> kkathman, will do :D
[08:02] <maros> Kail, what are you eating?
[08:02] <whiskers> that way they can have all the latest software for free for the win98 they already paid for.
[08:05] <whiskers> but it would be easier if they had just fixed the symlink problem on mingnu...because now we have to use a separate gnu installer
[08:05] <maros> for the past couple of days I have been using ubuntu rather than Windows... I don't know why... it's like somekind of urge to use it... I think maybe because I want to learn linux as much as possible... I don't want to be kept in the dark while the rest of the tech world are using linux
[08:07] <kkathman> maros: certainly a good plan for a technical enhancement to your skillset.  I use both systems equally at home as well as consult to those companies that have both. So, I see the pros and cons of both platforms
[08:07] <kkathman> maros: never hurts to learn something new...thats how we grow :)
[08:09] <maros> kkathman, yeah, certainly... I have downloaded the ISOs and installed three seperate versions of mandrake, 8.x, 9.x and 10.x for the past three years... I install them, use them for one to two days and then go back to Windows... but Ubuntu is the first real linux OS that i've been consistently using...
[08:10] <maros> I need to buy another computer, so one has Windows and another has Ubuntu
[08:10] <maros> it would be better than having a dual boot
[08:10] <maros> this way I can use a KVM switch and switch between both computers
[08:11] <whiskers> maros, well that is what i have....one win98 for mingnu to make sure that all linux programs are patched and free for win98....and the other a linux development computer
[08:11] <maros> maybe one day, we can have both OSs opening at the same time on the same computer, each one using a different cpu-core
[08:12] <maros> I'm falling in love with this Alloy theme (similar to java's alloy theme)
[08:12] <whiskers> maros, so that way nobody has to be suckered into that MS XP crap with all that expensive activation stuff
[08:13] <whiskers> maros, they already collected money for win98 and that is all they deserve
[08:13] <Kisain> how do i get to the cd rom through konsole?
[08:13] <Kisain> to install a game
[08:13] <Kisain> with cedega
[08:13] <maros> whiskers, win98 was cool, I was reluctant to change to XP... two years ago, I just had to.. I didn't want to be 'left-behind'
[08:13] <whiskers> maros, if you move from 98 to xp you are moving behind
[08:14] <whiskers> maros, you are going to be trapped in activation stuff and drm stuff
[08:14] <maros> winxp uses more resources, so you need a more powerful computer... thus negating its pros
[08:14] <maros> whiskers, you just wait until longhorn comes out... DRM is going to be a real problem
[08:15] <whiskers> maros, i know because MS wants more money for the same old ideas
[08:15] <Bicchi> I am experiencing ghosting when i move any open window. I have a ati radeon 9800. can anyone help.  I never applied.. but they should've looked for me!!!
[08:17] <maros> :)
[08:17] <maros> wow, this scoring thing in KNode looks very very cool
[08:20] <tetienne> hello
[08:20] <maros> hello
[08:20] <tetienne> is scribus included in knubuntu liveCD ?
[08:21] <tetienne> *Kubuntu
[08:21] <maros> I have no idea... maybe someone else here can answer that.
[08:21] <tetienne> i couldn't find a list of softwares included in the liveCD
[08:22] <KaiL> be warned: I'm back :)
[08:25] <kkathman> brb..need some food :)
[08:26] <kkathman> yum...love chips and queso :)
[08:26] <kkathman> whats scribus anyway?
[08:27] <Riddell> tetienne: scribus didn't fit I'm afraid
[08:27] <kkathman> ahh deskpage layout program
[08:27] <kkathman> its available via apt-get tho
[08:27] <tetienne> arg
[08:27] <KaiL> hi Riddell
[08:28] <KaiL> do you know, what knode isn't shown in kontact on default?
[08:28] <kkathman> Hello Riddell how goes it today?
[08:28] <tetienne> yeah yeah i know i can install it :)
[08:29] <KaiL> oh, and what about kdelibs-data? *running*
[08:29] <kkathman> good question KaiL
[08:29] <Riddell> KaiL: I've uploaded a new package to hoary-updates, but nobody seems to know what needs to happen to get it into the archive
[08:29] <KaiL> kkathman: that's why I ask them ;)
[08:30] <kkathman> KaiL: and we appreciate it :)
[08:30] <KaiL> Riddell: lol, at worst 10days...
[08:31] <KaiL> it's kdelibs-data... 3.2 then?
[08:31] <MrDrBob> I have a problem
[08:31] <KaiL> and we solve it (or try to..)
[08:31] <KaiL> so tell us :)
[08:31] <kkathman> MrDrBob: shoot
[08:31] <MrDrBob> I've just managed to get my sound working in Kubuntu 5.04
[08:32] <MrDrBob> And the system sounds work fine
[08:32] <KaiL> no shooting, we aren't in Texas
[08:32] <kkathman> lol Im in Texas tho :)
[08:32] <KaiL> danm
[08:32] <KaiL> eh, damn
[08:32] <kkathman> MrDrBob: well you are ahead of alot of people right there
[08:32] <KaiL> that explains, why you want the people to shoot first, then ask :)
[08:32] <whiskers> MrDrBob, be sure to go compile the latest esound.....it will fix the problems with skype and audacity
[08:32] <MrDrBob> But when I try to play an MP3 in, say, amaroK, or Noatun
[08:32] <MrDrBob> It's all choppy
[08:33] <KaiL> VIA onboard crap?
[08:33] <MrDrBob> I don't use skype or audacity ;)
[08:33] <Riddell> MrDrBob: install akode-mpeg
[08:33] <MrDrBob> ok
[08:33] <Riddell> and killall artsd
[08:33] <MrDrBob> KaiL: It's an SB Live! 24-bit (ca0106 driver)
[08:33] <KaiL> kkathman: your sound doesn't work?
[08:33] <kkathman> KaiL: I have the VIA on board stuff..it works fine to play music
[08:33] <whiskers> MrDrBob, be sure you are not trying to run two sound servers
[08:33] <MrDrBob> ok
[08:33] <KaiL> kkathman: you mean to make noise
[08:34] <kkathman> but its just that there is this hum when I move the mouse or a window...even if I turn the sound all the way down
[08:34] <kkathman> its definitely on-board interference Im sure
[08:34] <whiskers> kkathman, well that could be one of several problems....you might have a bad driver or you might have bad ground or bad shielding.
[08:34] <KaiL> kkathman: that's the problem with the VIA hardware
[08:35] <kkathman> but, when I play music and dont move anything..its beautiful
[08:35] <buz> actually its a problem with board design
[08:35] <kkathman> buz...yeah probably
[08:35] <MrDrBob> whiskers: I'm just running ALSA and artsd
[08:35] <whiskers> kkathman, or you may even have a cheap amplifier in your speakers
[08:35] <kkathman> my mobo is an asus, but a low end...I didnt go all out on my first linux box
[08:35] <KaiL> MrDrBob: ignore whiskers.
[08:36] <buz> which one
[08:36] <MrDrBob> Riddell: Do I kill artsd permanently, or just to get akode-mpeg set up?
[08:36] <MrDrBob> KaiL: Ok.  It was to sort out dual-booting issues with XP and RH9
[08:37] <maros> must be that church bread...
[08:37] <maros> it tastes good
[08:37] <maros> :)
[08:38] <buz> actually the issue is probably because of the routing of signal lines
[08:38] <KaiL> kkathman: maybe Riddells fix helps for your system too?
[08:38] <kkathman> I think I missed that from Riddell
[08:38] <KaiL> gigabyte ga k8ns < nforce3 or 4?
[08:38] <kkathman> did he direct that to me...let me check
[08:38] <buz> nf3
[08:39] <buz> pure crap
 MrDrBob: install akode-mpeg <Riddell> and killall artsd
[08:39] <buz> got northbridge fan and a totally fucked up retention module
[08:39] <KaiL> buz: I have a Asus K8N-E Deluxe, which works perfect :)
[08:39] <buz> i swear it's the last gigabyte board i've bought
[08:39] <buz> i wanted to safe money
[08:39] <buz> there i am, i wasted it
[08:39] <kkathman> Riddell: could you tell me your fix again?
[08:39] <buz> :-((
[08:39] <buz> i'll probably get the abit now
[08:40] <KaiL> buz: do not save money on hardware - the vendors did this more than enough
[08:40] <whiskers> buz, well that shit happens to everybody....look at me...i wasted money on win98
[08:40] <buz> K8T800 probably
[08:40] <MrDrBob> kkathman: All I did from a clean Kubuntu 5.04 install to get working sound was to compile ALSA 1.0.8 and follow the instructions here: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/HdaIntelSoundHowto
[08:40] <KaiL> bah VIA
[08:40] <buz> well usually i've been lucky when saving money
[08:40] <buz> this time i got fucked over by gigabyte
[08:40] <buz> their specs on the site aren't even right
[08:40] <buz> and i still think their stupid retention module isn't according to amd's spec
[08:40] <kkathman> buz mine is a KM400A
[08:40] <KaiL> MrDrBob: normally you won't need that
[08:40] <whiskers> buz, well that shit happens...but you can always put a separate el cheapo sound card in
[08:40] <buz> ah i have one of those
[08:41] <KaiL> kkathman: K_M_400?
[08:41] <kkathman> yes
[08:41] <buz> nice for value chipsets
[08:41] <KaiL> which such a "wonderful" onboard graphics?
[08:41] <MrDrBob> lol...talking of value:
[08:41] <MrDrBob> http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=85287
[08:41] <buz> but since i have two screens, i need dual head so integrated graphics is useless for me
[08:41] <MrDrBob> You need SLI :-P
[08:41] <kkathman> Kail were you referring to the akode-mpeg?
[08:41] <KaiL> kkathman: bingo
[08:41] <buz> WTF would anyone buy SLI
[08:41] <MrDrBob> http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=85287
[08:42] <MrDrBob> Cheapy :D
[08:42] <MrDrBob> (Relatively)
[08:42] <buz> SLI is for crazy people
[08:42] <KaiL> buz: if he needs an 8-head configuration? :)
[08:42] <whiskers> buz, well i don't know...but why not try running an composite sline to one monitor and a vga to another
[08:42] <buz> can get matrox cards then
[08:42] <whiskers> buz, that way you can have two screens with no problem
[08:42] <KaiL> only have 4 heads each
[08:42] <kkathman> well I also got a tip last night that I should do this rmmod snd-via82xx; modprobe snd-via82xx dxs-support-4
[08:42] <buz> can use pci
[08:42] <KaiL> kkathman: does that help?
[08:42] <whiskers> buz, but why do you want two screens
[08:43] <MrDrBob> Technically, you can get 8 different screens using two 4-headed PCI-Express cards
[08:43] <whiskers> buz, where will you put them
[08:43] <buz> otoh, for the traders using 8 screens the hardware cost probably isn't the issue
[08:43] <KaiL> buz: as lok as you have free PCI slots :)
[08:43] <whiskers> buz, and why pay the extra electric bill for them
[08:43] <kkathman> KaiL:  havent done it yet...Im reluctant to do anything until I fully understand what that does
[08:43] <buz> but not with the gforce
[08:43] <kkathman> KaiL: can you help me understand it?
[08:43] <whiskers> buz, well i think the geforce has a composite and vga out if you want two screens
[08:43] <KaiL> it disables "VRA" :)
[08:44] <whiskers> buz, but what for...it will just run up your electric bill
[08:44] <kkathman> KaiL: and VRA is???
[08:44] <KaiL> no idea
[08:44] <kkathman> oh ok hehe
[08:44] <kkathman> so literally I type that exact thing....or do I replace the xx with something?
[08:45] <KaiL> nop
[08:46] <kkathman> KaiL: so I type it as it is..WITH the xx eh??   Do I reboot after or just try it
[08:46] <KaiL> just type that (as root btw)
[08:46] <KaiL> no reboot (that would revert the effect)
[08:47] <KaiL> you just unload that driver and load it again with the VRA disabled
[08:48] <kkathman> ok..
[08:48] <KaiL> MrDrBob: the sound didn't work without alsa 1.0.8?
[08:48] <kkathman> I wonder what happened to my volume control on my desktop?
[08:48] <kkathman> hmm
[08:49] <KaiL> they lost their mixers
[08:49] <kkathman> ok those two statements didnt do anything to fix it
[08:50] <KaiL> and the akode-mpeg?
[08:50] <kkathman> trying that now
[08:50] <kkathman> its installed...but no effect
[08:50] <kkathman> its just a noisy board I think
[08:51] <kkathman> lots of ambient noise
[08:51] <Alfred1881> hey all how can i terminate ALL the printer task, bacause there was an error , and every time i plug my printer, it takes the file 1/3 and it stops moving
[08:52] <whiskers> Alfred1881, pause printer...go to jobs and cancel
[08:52] <kkathman> oh well
[08:52] <kkathman> hehe
[08:52] <KaiL> kkathman: killall artsd
[08:52] <KaiL> then try again
[08:52] <kkathman> try what?
[08:52] <MrDrBob> KaiL: I don't know what comes with Kubuntu by default, but I compiled my own alsa kernel module, and configured it from scratch, and it worked
[08:52] <KaiL> to play a file
[08:53] <kkathman> oh I can play files fine
[08:53] <MrDrBob> Even though it hadn't done (repeatedly) in RH9 :(
[08:53] <kkathman> thats NOT the problem
[08:53] <Alfred1881> whiskers the jobs list is empty
[08:53] <whiskers> Alfred1881, how can that be if you are printing something
[08:53] <KaiL> MrDrBob: alsa 1.0.6 modules (as they are in 2.6.10) and alsa 1.0.7 userspace stuff
[08:53] <kkathman> the porblem is when I DONT play anything...all kinds of little noises happen and when I move windows...theres a hum
[08:53] <whiskers> Alfred1881, my job list shows what is being printed and what is still in queue
[08:53] <KaiL> kkathman: then get a real soundcard
[08:54] <kkathman> KaiL: well prolly not...my Win box has an Audigy so I will just keep it over there :)
[08:54] <Alfred1881> i just need the command to stop all jobs :)
[08:55] <whiskers> Alfred1881, just use gnome and go to the job list
[08:55] <whiskers> Alfred1881, in system under printing in gnome there is a printer option...bring it up and go to the job list...pause printer and cancel all jobs
[08:55] <MrDrBob> aaaaaaaargh!
[08:55] <MrDrBob> I can't find akode-mpeg with Kynaptic
[08:56] <whiskers> Alfred1881, if you click on your printer it should bring up the job list
[08:56] <KaiL> MrDrBob: enable universe in /etc/apt/sources.list
[08:56] <kkathman> MrDrBob: just sudo apt-get update,  then sudo apt-get install akode-mpeg
[08:56] <kkathman> oh and that too :)
[08:56] <MrDrBob> ook
[08:56] <KaiL> Alfred1881: kontrolcenter -> devices -> printer
[08:57] <KaiL> there you have a tab for the jobs :)
[08:57] <KaiL> ...so not...
[08:58] <MrDrBob> Now the only thing left between me and constant music is the Windows domain :(
[08:58] <MrDrBob> (All my MP3s are stored on the server, which is only accessible through a Windows 2003 domain)
[08:58] <kkathman> KaiL: if I have a CD/DVD rom burner on a samba share (windows) and I share that device, can I not access it from Linux as long as Im on the same network?
[08:59] <KaiL> kkathman: you can, but read only
[08:59] <MrDrBob> crap
[09:00] <kkathman> hmm ok... then I could not write to it?
[09:00] <MrDrBob> What's the fix for the kdelibs-data / kdenetwork thingy clash?
[09:00] <KaiL> MrDrBob: you can integrate Linux into a Windows domain
[09:00] <kkathman> what if it were the other way around KaiL ?
[09:00] <KaiL> MrDrBob: kdelibs-data? there: http://moba.linuxfaqs.de/kdelibs-debug.sh
[09:00] <kkathman> ahemmmmmmm  Samba
[09:00] <MrDrBob> KaiL: I know...it's just a pain
[09:00] <MrDrBob> KaiL: Thanky
[09:01] <KaiL> kkathman: same, you can't burn cds over net, as you need driect hardware access
[09:01] <kkathman> ok... well I was just hoping there was a trick somewhere
[09:01] <KaiL> MrDrBob: a fixed package is on the way [and might be ready somewhere this year *g*]
[09:02] <MrDrBob> kk
[09:02] <MrDrBob> Hmph...it wants to eat my Kubuntu CD :(
[09:03] <KaiL> as it reinstalles kcontrol, which behaves silly after the update
[09:07] <MrDrBob> LOL
[09:07] <MrDrBob> The choppiness has stopped
[09:07] <MrDrBob> But now it's playing at about 400% of normal speed
[09:08] <KaiL> that's not a bug, that's a feature - now you can hear the next covered version already today *G*
[09:08] <MrDrBob> ...
[09:09] <Kisain> omg! cs in kubuntu rocks
[09:09] <MrDrBob> CS?
[09:09] <MrDrBob> Counter Strike??
[09:09] <Kisain> i was gettin 56fps on a 16mb vid card o_0
[09:09] <Kisain> yup
[09:09] <MrDrBob> hmmm
[09:10] <MrDrBob> Can you get Steam running happily?
[09:10] <KaiL> well, CS is old and that cards too ;)
[09:10] <Kisain> the only prob was there was no sound
[09:10] <Kisain> no man cz
[09:10] <MrDrBob> Sound appears to be the topic of the day :P
[09:10] <Kisain> cs cz i mean
[09:10] <KaiL> install 'alsa-oss' for sound.
[09:10] <Kisain> how?
[09:10] <KaiL> apt-get
[09:12] <Kisain> this will do what?
[09:12] <KaiL> apt-get install alsa-oss
[09:12] <KaiL> never installed anything?
[09:12] <Kisain> i know what to do but what does it do lol
[09:12] <Kisain> what does alsa do
[09:12] <KaiL> install a wrapper for old style oss sound
[09:13] <Kisain> oh ok i get it
[09:13] <Kisain> lol
[09:13] <KaiL> alsa is "advanced linux sound architecture" (the currently used soundsystem)
[09:13] <Kisain> how come linux can't play multiple sounds from diffrent programs?
[09:13] <Kisain> nice
[09:13] <Kisain> i mean at the same time?
[09:14] <KaiL> normally eigher alsa or your card should do that
[09:14] <Kisain> like if my teamspeak is running i can't play music or hear system sounds
[09:14] <MrDrBob> How come it's playing things 4x too fast??!
[09:14] <Kisain> lol
[09:14] <KaiL> ah - that's the problem with oss: THAT can not play multiple sounds...
[09:15] <Kisain> is therea way to get linux to do that?
[09:15] <Kisain> or is it really rocket scientist hard?
[09:15] <Kisain> or can i curcumvent it buy putting a nother sound card in?
[09:16] <KaiL> start teamspeak with "artsdsp teamspeak", then it's go through the kde soundserver and so doen't block the card
[09:16] <Kisain> oh so run it from the command line?
[09:16] <KaiL> ^^ was just hoping, he quits
[09:17] <KaiL> Kisain: or modify the menu entry
[09:17] <Kisain> oh ok
[09:18] <Kisain> you rock man ^_^\
[09:18] <MrDrBob> I don't suppose anyone knows?
[09:19] <KaiL> MrDrBob: ask google :p
[09:19] <MrDrBob> Okie dokie
[09:22] <Kisain> brb
[09:26] <MrDrBob> I think this might be it
[09:26] <MrDrBob> http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-23296.html
[09:26] <error403> Is there anybody here who could talk me through compiling my kernel in a PM?  I've tried multiple times, Googled it and tried several suggestions, and still not got anywhere
[09:26] <MrDrBob> But I'm running KDE, and this was for GNOME
[09:27] <MrDrBob> I'm going to try restarting to fix the problem
[09:28] <whiskers> error403, i told you...it takes practice
[09:29] <whiskers> error403, plus some distros make it hard to compile the kernel while others make it easy
[09:29] <error403> lol
[09:29] <error403> well, im using Kubuntu
[09:29] <whiskers> error403, i haven't tried on ubuntu because i have so many other problems...but slackware and gentoo make it very easy
[09:29] <error403> and it is the ONLY distro i have never been able to compile a kernel on...
[09:30] <whiskers> error403, well there are major screwups on ubuntu...maybe they will be fixed in breezy
[09:30] <error403> hmmm
[09:30] <error403> hmmm, is that why there are Ubuntu patches for the kernel source?
[09:31] <whiskers> error403, i haven't heard of any...but usually the problem is with duplicate headers
[09:31] <whiskers> error403, you can get around this if you want to track them all down and move some out of the way
[09:31] <error403> right.....
[09:31] <whiskers> error403, but it is a major pain
[09:31] <error403> but, the problems doesnt seem to be compiling
[09:31] <error403> but booting
[09:31] <error403> it NEVER boots...
[09:31] <kkathman> well okie dokie...back again...hmm got some new work to do...always good :)
[09:31] <whiskers> error403, and there are more serious problems with ubuntu
[09:32] <error403> like?
[09:32] <whiskers> error403, like the major glibc srewups
[09:32] <error403> whiskers: would that explain compiling problems?
[09:33] <error403> whiskers: but why would it compile fine but then not boot?
[09:33] <whiskers> error403, no....i told you...if you have a problem compiling the kernel...check for inconsistent headers
[09:33] <whiskers> error403, well tell lilo or grub to load your new kernel manually
[09:33] <error403> whiskers: i tried compiling ALL linux filesystems into the kernel, and it still says unable to mount the root fs
[09:33] <error403> i do
[09:34] <error403> but it says it cannot mount the root fs on block (0,0)
[09:34] <error403> which is what everything else is booting fine from
[09:34] <whiskers> error403, what kind of hardware do you have
[09:34] <whiskers> error403, are you using raid or that sata crap
[09:34] <Kisain> thanx dude you have re established my faith in linux
[09:35] <error403> whiskers: no, im on a laptop :P
[09:35] <error403> whiskers: just a ATA100 60GB drive
[09:35] <whiskers> error403, ok...call up a virtual terminal in the kernel and make sure that some devices are being generated
[09:35] <error403> :S
[09:35] <whiskers> error403, be sure to compile the kernel with virtual terminal support
[09:36] <error403> whiskers: virtual terminal?
[09:36] <whiskers> error403, so you can work without mounting anything
[09:36] <error403> i got about the best idea ive had in ages....
[09:36] <error403> im gonna test this shit on a virtual machine... should that make a difference?
[09:36] <whiskers> error403, what is that....swich to gentoo and get rid of all these headaches
[09:37] <Kisain> gentoo is for people who have way to much time on thee hands
[09:37] <whiskers> error403, ok...look for the virtual terminal option in the kernel config....and bring up a shell once you force the kernel with lilo or grub
[09:39] <error403> whiskers: how do i get the kernel to boot and NOT try to mount file systems etc?
[09:40] <whiskers> error403, i told you...use lilo or grub to manually load the kernel into ram...then go into a virtual shell before anything is mounted and see what is going on with your devices
[09:41] <whiskers> error403, try to use mknod to manually create some devices and then see if you can access them
[09:41] <whiskers> error403, ok...it is very simple
[09:41] <error403> whiskers: where abouts is this Virtual Terminal option?
[09:42] <whiskers> error403, it is in the kernel config parameters...look for it
[09:43] <Kisain> grrrrr....wtf
[09:44] <Kisain> i was just playin cs now it can't connect to find servers :/
[09:44] <Kisain> stupid steam
[09:45] <Kisain> anyone have any ideas?
[09:46] <error403> whiskers: what command should i be using to compile?
[09:46] <error403> whiskers: im using make all modules_install install
[09:47] <whiskers> error403, i told you don't worry about the modules at first...just get you a basic kernel working...you can then go back and add modules
[09:47] <whiskers> error403, just be sure to include the minimum stuff in your kernel so you can use it
[09:47] <error403> whiskers: so what should my compile command be?
[09:48] <whiskers> make mrproper, make config, make, make install,,...don't worry about make modules and make modules-install
[09:49] <error403> ok
[09:49] <whiskers> error403, you can do all that extra crap later after you get the basics working
[09:49] <MrDrBob> Restart didn't solve anything
[09:49] <error403> whiskers: should i use the command line or X-based config?
[09:49] <MrDrBob> Although it did confirm my suspicions that something's gone wrong with my login :(
[09:49] <error403> i suppose its easier to say no to stuff on command line...
[09:49] <whiskers> error403, it should not make any difference...i always use the command line but people say it is far easier with the graphics approach
[09:51] <MrDrBob> Anyone know why for some reason I'm now not getting a graphical login?
[09:51] <MrDrBob> (It gives me a console one)
[09:51] <whiskers> error403, with the command line you get one thing at a time and you have to know what you are doing so you set consistent options....but they say with the graphical approach you can see all the config options simultaneously
[09:51] <MrDrBob> I think it's prolly something to do with how I installed my nVidia graphics driver
[09:52] <whiskers> error403, i have just never got around to using it
[09:52] <MrDrBob> Runlevels...
[09:53] <MrDrBob> I'm running in runlevel 2...that's normal isn't it?
[09:53] <whiskers> MrDrBob, usually 2-5 should be ok
[09:53] <whiskers> MrDrBob, they are the typical multiuser runlevels
[09:53] <MrDrBob> Then why aren't I getting a graphical login?
[09:53] <MrDrBob> whiskers: I can read inittab ;)
[09:54] <whiskers> MrDrBob, because your video driver is screwed
[09:54] <MrDrBob> Nope
[09:54] <MrDrBob> If I log in in the console, and type "sudo startx", X.org will run fine ;)
[09:54] <MrDrBob> I'm in it now
[09:54] <whiskers> MrDrBob, well there is more than just inittab

[09:54] <Cowlike-away> 	 <li>rc1.d - Single User Mode</li>
[09:54] <Cowlike-away> 	 <li>rc2.d - Single User Mode with Networking</li>
[09:54] <Cowlike-away> 	 <li>rc3.d - Multi-User Mode - boot up in text mode</li>
[09:54] <MrDrBob> whiskers: Go on then
[09:54] <Cowlike-away> 	 <li>rc4.d - Not yet Defined</li>
[09:54] <Cowlike-away> 	 <li>rc5.d - Multi-User Mode - boot up in X Windows</li>
[09:54] <Cowlike-away> 	 <li>rc6.d - Shutdown</li>
[09:54] <Cowlike-away> 	</ol>
[09:55] <Diablo-D3> eww html
[09:55] <MrDrBob> lol
[09:55] <MrDrBob> Runlevel 5, then?
[09:55] <Cowlike-away> run level 5 for x boot
[09:55] <MrDrBob> okie dokie
[09:55] <MrDrBob> Thanky
[09:55] <MrDrBob> I could've sworn it was originally level 2...
[09:55] <Diablo-D3> hey MrDrBob
[09:55] <Diablo-D3> you did something wrong
[09:55] <Diablo-D3> you dont sudo startx
[09:55] <Diablo-D3> you just startx
[09:55] <MrDrBob> Doesn't work
[09:55] <whiskers> MrDrBob, look in /etc/rc5.d and see what options you have set for runlevel 5 for example
[09:55] <MrDrBob> I think root has a different $PATH to me
[09:55] <Diablo-D3> sudo chmod +s /usr/X11R6/bin/xorg
[09:56] <MrDrBob> kk
[09:56] <Diablo-D3> iirc ubuntu doesnt do that for xorg
[09:56] <whiskers> MrDrBob, because there is more to it than just iniitab
[09:56] <Diablo-D3> MrDrBob: you can also try xinit
[09:56] <MrDrBob> I haven't touched that file
[09:57] <whiskers> MrDrBob, well i doubt your runlevels are the problem....try startx and see if it isn't your bad video driver
[09:57] <Diablo-D3> its a command
[09:57] <Diablo-D3> similar to startx
[09:57] <MrDrBob> I'm running in X at the moment!!
[09:57] <error403> make mrproper
[09:57] <error403> oops
[09:57] <error403> wrong window...
[09:58] <MrDrBob> We're doing kernel compilation now?
[09:58] <Diablo-D3> error403: whahah
[09:58] <Cowlike> he's not gonna get x bootup unless he uses run level 5, unless he uses non-standard init files
[09:58] <whiskers> MrDrBob, oh...well i thought you were the one who said x did not start
[09:58] <Diablo-D3> Cowlike: wrong
[09:58] <whiskers> Cowlike, he can alter his init files any way he wants to
[09:58] <Diablo-D3> I start X all the time from the console
[09:58] <MrDrBob> whiskers: X isn't starting by default at the moment, but I can start it easily and without error using "sudo startx"
[09:59] <Cowlike> i know he can but it's non-standard
[09:59] <Cowlike> hence my comment
[09:59] <Diablo-D3> how is it nonstandard?
[09:59] <whiskers> Cowlike, we don't give a shit about standards
[09:59] <MrDrBob> Cowlike: All I did to alter my init scripts was to temporarily change the runlevel to 1 so that I could install a new graphics driver without X runnign
[09:59] <Diablo-D3> MrDrBob: but you dolt, you're running as root
[09:59] <Diablo-D3> MrDrBob: I CAN HACK YOU
[09:59] <whiskers> Cowlike, that is why gentoo is so popular because it broke all the standards
[09:59] <MrDrBob> Diablo: I don't usually run as root
[09:59] <Diablo-D3> yes, but thats the effect of sudo startx
[09:59] <MrDrBob> In fact, this is the only exception ever ;)
[09:59] <MrDrBob> I know :(
[10:00] <Cowlike> diablo, read wtf the run levels mean
[10:00] <Diablo-D3> Cowlike: read wtf I'm saying
[10:00] <Cowlike> of course you can alter it
[10:00] <Diablo-D3> I have not hacked shit, and xinit still works for me.
[10:00] <Diablo-D3> I'm not sure what MrDrBob didnt do, but he should be able to do it too
[10:00] <Cowlike> no shit but you won't get graphical login
[10:00] <Diablo-D3> obviously not
[10:00] <Diablo-D3> but why would I want something silly like that?  And I still cant anything
[10:21] <smouche> kkathman, I no nothing about bash, so I can't get this to do what I want yet -
[10:21] <smouche> maybe you know how to fix this command:
[10:21] <kkathman> but Im wondering if ubuntu defaults their firewall to be active on installation?
[10:21] <smouche> if I type  figlet hello | nano hello.txt
[10:22] <kkathman> if thats the case, it could be getting past my firewall, but not the internal one :)
[10:22] <smouche> I get nano opened, with the file called hello.txt, and the figlet art spelling "hello" in the text
[10:22] <smouche> but, then nano is frozen and I can't edit or save
[10:22] <kkathman> awwww
[10:23] <smouche> I wonder what I need to add to that "figlet hello | nano hello.txt" command...
[10:23] <kkathman> hmmm got me on that one
[10:23] <MrDrBob> Cowlike: Can you send me your /etc/kde3/kdm/kdmrc file please? I think my problem lies there
[10:23] <yahalom> ok bros i lost my gnome after install kde, i assume it was just removed from my xsessions, what and where do i add? thanx
[10:23] <smouche> I guess I have to learn how to make the figlet program exit after it pipes to that file...
[10:24] <kkathman> yahalom: that would be unusual...I did not lose mine
[10:24] <kkathman> smouche that sounds about right
[10:25] <smouche> kkathman, did you ask about the firewall in #ubuntu?
[10:25] <kkathman> not yet
[10:25] <yahalom> kkathman: well it happened before
[10:25] <yahalom> kkathman: i just need to add it back to xsessions, or something
[10:26] <smouche> kkathman, would it be feasible to take your linux box off the router, and plug it directly into your - what, dsl, cable? - and check if there's a difference?
[10:27] <yahalom> kkathman: this is what u do. make gnome.desktop and move it o /usr/share/xsessions
[10:28] <yahalom> then next time when u login u can choose gnome again (As long as u have gnome on ur system)
[10:28] <whiskers> Cowlike-away, well Mr. Smartass...hoary boots into the graphical mode on runlevel2 instead of runlevel5 and so what.
[10:28] <whiskers> Cowlike-away, you asked for an example...so shove that one
[10:29] <MrDrBob> whiskers: It still doesn't boot graphically at all for me :P
[10:30] <kkathman> smouche...well I figuratively did that, but putting my local IP outside the firewall in the DMZ
[10:31] <smouche> ah, now I know what you meant by that; I see.
[10:31] <kkathman> anyway... its not the firewall smouche, theres nothing set up there
[10:32] <kkathman> so Im back to square one
[10:32] <smouche> dumb question maybe, but could your isp be blocking stuff?
[10:32] <kkathman> smouche not for direct p2p I wouldnt think
[10:32] <whiskers> MrDrBob, well hard to say because i don't know how you configured your computer compared to mine
[10:32] <whiskers> MrDrBob, but check all relevant things
[10:33] <MrDrBob> whiskers: Which would be?? I'm only really used to the RH9 boot process...the Kubuntu (Debian) one is different
[10:33] <whiskers> MrDrBob, yes every distro is a bit different ...they enjoy the freedom to be unique.
[10:34] <whiskers> MrDrBob, and they should have that freedom
[10:34] <MrDrBob> whiskers: Yeah...so what files should I be looking in??
[10:34] <kkathman> smouche let me try DCCing you if I could?
[10:34] <MrDrBob> whiskers: I'm not saying they shouldn't have freedom...freedom is good (as in beer)
[10:35] <smouche> sure kkathman
[10:36] <smouche> I'm on
[10:36] <kkathman> ok wait a sec
[10:36] <whiskers> MrDrBob, well first make sure that x works and you don't have a driver problem shutting it down...then make whatever adjustments you need to so that whatever default runlevel you choose x will be started
[10:36] <kkathman> there
[10:37] <kkathman> you see anything?
[10:37] <MrDrBob> whiskers: X works fine...but I think it might be a login manager thing that is actually the problem...I'll check
[10:37] <smouche> nothing here, kkathman
[10:38] <kkathman> crap
[10:38] <smouche> oops!
[10:38] <smouche> hang on
[10:38] <MrDrBob> whiskers: kdm is set to start in runlevels 2-5
[10:38] <kkathman> this is maddening
[10:38] <smouche> yeah, I got the request, kkathman
[10:38] <kkathman> on windows it wasnt that hard
[10:38] <smouche> sorry, I forgot to switch windows in irssi
[10:38] <whiskers> MrDrBob, well...type kdm at the command prompt and see if it comes up
[10:38] <kkathman> ohh ok let me try again
[10:38] <MrDrBob> whiskers: But I can't find a mention of X anywhere in the /etc/rd*.d/ folders
[10:38] <smouche> how do I accept that DCC kkathman?
[10:39] <kkathman> there we go
[10:39] <kkathman> uhmm...I dunno in irssi
[10:39] <MrDrBob> whiskers: kdm doesn't like being started from the prompt
[10:39] <kkathman> in Konversation you get a little box that pops up
[10:39] <whiskers> MrDrBob, well there is more to it than just inittab and rc.d folders...also notice what is in inet.d folders
[10:39] <kkathman> maybe irssi doesnt support it
[10:40] <MrDrBob> whiskers: I've only got an "xorg-common" file (relating to X) in /etc/init.d/
[10:40] <whiskers> MrDrBob, did you type kdm
[10:40] <MrDrBob> whiskers: No, I'm in X
[10:40] <whiskers> MrDrBob, well shutdown x and type kdm
[10:40] <kkathman> oh well
[10:40] <whiskers> MrDrBob, to see if kdm brings it up
[10:41] <smouche> kkathman, I just need to rtfm!
[10:41] <MrDrBob> whiskers: OK, just give me a mo ;)
[10:41] <whiskers> MrDrBob, also watch for a respawn of x in inittab
[10:41] <kkathman> smouche haha
[10:41] <kkathman> dont we all sometimes :)
[10:41] <smouche> weird, kkathman, I typed DCC and now I see "kkathman chat" - but I can't type anything more...
[10:42] <smouche> ok, I think I got it now, kkathman
[10:44] <MrDrBob> whiskers: How do you shut down X? *sounds to start n00bish*
[10:44] <whiskers> MrDrBob, well i use ctrl-alt-backspace...but be sure it is not being respawned
[10:44] <smouche> well, anyway, we had the DCC connection!
[10:45] <ZeCrazyTux> hey
[10:47] <MrDrBob> whiskers: "sudo kdm" did absolutely nothing
[10:47] <kkathman> smouche lol...want me to try again??
[10:47] <smouche> yeah
[10:47] <kkathman> ok here goes
[10:47] <kkathman> initiating
[10:48] <smouche> I'm in there, where are you?
[10:48] <kkathman> I never got the ACK back from you I guess
[10:48] <smouche> hmm, anyway, #kkathman.
[10:48] <kkathman> that seems to be the problem
[10:49] <smouche> when I typed /DCC in response to your "DCC chat from kkathman", that's what irssi gave me
[10:49] <kkathman> the ACK is coming back on some port that I dont have open I guess
[10:49] <smouche> interesting
[10:49] <kkathman> This is all very well documented in mIRC but not documented at all in Konversation
[10:50] <smouche> I'm sure it's documented to death in irssi, but I'd rather pump Tm_T for info ;)
[10:50] <kkathman> lol
[10:50] <kkathman> well its funny, NO one knows about this
[10:51] <kkathman> its like the designers of Konvo didnt wan anyone to use the feature
[10:51] <ZeCrazyTux> where are the kubuntu mirors list for apt-get ?
[10:51] <ZeCrazyTux> is*
[10:52] <smouche> ok, but kkathman, do you suppose this is somehow connected to the issue of you not showing up as online in kopete? or coincidence?
[10:53] <kkathman> smouche I have no idea...but this is DCC, which is more or less peer to peer, while yahoo, AOL are all private networks that are being hacked by GAIM, Kopete etc
[10:53] <erhan> hi all
[10:53] <kkathman> smouche gonna try it one more time...being outside the firewall
[10:54] <kkathman> did you get the notice?
[10:55] <erhan> how to get mc in kununtu ?
[10:55] <smouche> yeah, kkathman!
[10:55] <erhan> i couldnt do it with apt .is anybody know it?
[10:55] <kkathman> see that tells me its not a firewall issue
[10:55] <kkathman> cuz Im bypassing it
[10:55] <kkathman> that means its the program on my system somehow
[10:58] <smouche> well, all I can tell you is I now have op status apparently in a channel called #kkathman
[10:59] <smouche> which was created when I typed /DCC in response to your request...
[10:59] <smouche> you were showing as having joined that channel for a sec, then terminated.
[11:00] <smouche> erhan, I think mc is already part of the default installation
[11:00] <erhan> but when i type mc .it didnt get in
[11:01] <kkathman> hmmm
[11:01] <smouche> erhan- did you type it in a terminal?  if you used the run command box, it won't work
[11:01] <erhan> yea in terminal
[11:02] <smouche> strange.
[11:02] <erhan> yea same here
[11:02] <erhan> thats why i ask
[11:02] <kkathman> very odd for sure...it wasnt that hard in windows and mIRC
[11:02] <smouche> erhan, try "man mc" and see if there's a manual page for it - if so, you should have it on there
[11:04] <erhan> yea there snt
[11:04] <smouche> rats, I can't believe it, I was out all day in nasty weather, and now the sun's coming out
[11:05] <smouche> just when I wanted to take a nap.
[11:05] <kkathman> smouche since I am not "kicker intensive" I added two more desktops
[11:06] <maros> kkathman, when you switch between desktops
[11:06] <maros> why don't the windows in the taskbar disapear?
[11:06] <kkathman> smouche I'd really love to get a panel just for applications, and then let the kicker show me the running apps
[11:06] <smouche> congrats, kkathman!  My most used command is Ctrl Alt arrows for switching desktops; got 6
[11:07] <kkathman> maros:  because they want you to be able in any desktop to get to the program you want to, without having to remember which desktop it was running on
[11:07] <maros> smouche, ctrl + alt + arrows, doesn't work
[11:07] <smouche> kkathman, what I did was have a panel on top with only a taskbar (running apps) and the others for app launchers etc
[11:07] <smouche> sort of like xfce
[11:07] <maros> kkathman, oh... just thought it would be easier on the eyes, you know.. to feel the desktop is 'clean'
[11:07] <kkathman> smouche how did you accomplish that
[11:08] <Diablo-D3> ooh
[11:08] <kkathman> maros: I thought that too, but I see their reasoning
[11:08] <smouche> maros, maybe your keyboard layout is different from mine.
[11:08] <Diablo-D3> I should get around to inquiring about that adblock patch
[11:08] <maros> smouche, do you mind if I can see a screenshot of your desktop? you too kkathman? I'd really love to see them :)
[11:09] <smouche> kkathman, if you right click any panel, you can add another panel, then in "configure panel" you can position or size it however you want.
[11:09] <kkathman> smouche:  I guess I'd like to understand how you split those up that way...I assume you just create a new panel somehow, then let the kicker actually handle running apps and transfer the panel icons to the second?
[11:09] <smouche> sure maros, but I have no where to post, unless someone has a temp site handy for that?
[11:09] <maros> smouche, just a min
[11:09] <kkathman> smouche: gotcha...I'll play with that
[11:10] <maros> http://www.theimagehosting.com/
[11:10] <maros> up to 1 MB
[11:10] <smouche> um, kkathman, basically you just make the new panel, put it where you want, then add stuff to it by right clicking on it
[11:10] <erhan> brb
[11:10] <smouche> ok, maros, let me try that, thanks
[11:11] <maros> smouche, I hope it works :)
[11:11] <kkathman> smouche how did you "add a new panel"
[11:12] <kkathman> smouche did you click on the kicker to add another panel?
[11:13] <maros> smouche, you can also try http://imageshack.us/index3.php
[11:14] <maros> kkathman, how about a screenshot of your desktop? :)
[11:14] <kkathman> maros:  I will when I get it the way I like it :)
[11:14] <kkathman> :)
[11:14] <kkathman> Im just about there
[11:14] <maros> kkathman, right... you're fixing the kicker thing ;)
[11:15] <maros> Im anxiously waiting
[11:15] <maros> :)
[11:15] <kkathman> yeah Im trying to find out how to get a second panel created
[11:15] <maros> you right click the first panel
[11:15] <kkathman> I dont think that works on the kicker tho
[11:15] <maros> Add to Panel - Panel - Panel
[11:15] <maros> try it
[11:16] <kkathman> ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
[11:16] <smouche> kkathman, it's right there -- right click, and Add to panel ---> panel
[11:16] <kkathman> just didnt go far enough :)
[11:17] <kkathman> hmm I think I chose the wrong kind of panel
[11:17] <smouche> ok, maros, I registered and I'm uploading...
[11:17] <maros> kkathman is probably resizing it to tiny
[11:17] <maros> smouche, you had to register?
[11:17] <maros> http://imageshack.us/index3.php   << this one doesn't need you to register
[11:17] <kkathman> ok
[11:18] <joda> hey - quick question about network setup. I'm trying to set a static ip, gateway and  dns, but when I define it in knetworkconf, via ControlPanel, the gateway is not saved. I can ping ip adresses, but not www adresses. any idea what I'm doing wrong? or, even better, any idea how I can fix it?
[11:18] <kkathman> brb
[11:18] <joda> s
[11:20] <amichai> guys kubuntu got rid of my gnome :(
[11:20] <joda> maybe one of you can tell me which file contains the network settings?
[11:20] <Kisain> i have a question can you guys help?
[11:20] <kkathman> ok smouche its not doing what I want to do
[11:20] <smouche> rats, the .png is too big, won't let me upload.
[11:20] <maros> smouche.. just a min
[11:20] <Kisain> i have a hard drive on another system......
[11:20] <maros> I'll find a place where you can upload 1.5 megs
[11:21] <smouche> maros, sorry, I don't have time to compress these shots right now, so later...
[11:21] <Kisain> i want to create a folder on my system called storage
[11:21] <maros> smouche, alright... np
[11:21] <smouche> kkathman, whats the trouble?
[11:21] <Kisain> and i want to do it so that it's in the begining of kon
[11:21] <Kisain> where the bin boot dev folders are
[11:22] <Kisain> and i want to take all the data off of a hd thats on my network and dump it in there
[11:22] <Kisain> than network it
[11:22] <Kisain> how do i do this?
[11:22] <kkathman> smouche: what I want, is to have the kicker exclusively have the control center, apps, the tray and clock
[11:22] <smouche> yeah, so?
[11:23] <kkathman> smouche; then I want the opened apps to be on the second panel
[11:23] <smouche> just remove everything else, and there you are.
[11:23] <kkathman> but when I open an app it appears on the second AND first panel
[11:23] <smouche> kkathman, so remove from one panel, add to another.
[11:23] <smouche> it takes time
[11:23] <kkathman> yeah but try opening a new app
[11:23] <kkathman> it will be on both panels
[11:23] <smouche> you can't "move" from one panel to another, you have to build each panel from scratch
[11:23] <Kisain> can some one tell me how to do this
[11:25] <smouche> kkathman - can you im me on kopete for a sec?
[11:25] <kkathman> sure
[11:27] <Kisain> how to create and network a folder in kubuntu?
[11:27] <Kisain> and make it accessable to windows xp?
[11:29] <yahalom> no one here can explain to me why kde got rid of my gnome?
[11:30] <Bicchi> I am experiencing a lot of ghosting with my monitor. I have an ATI radeon 9800 video card with a fairly new system. I have also tried using the fglrx driver and this provides not help.
[11:31] <Bicchi> Could it be the refresh rate that i have used in my xorg.conf?
[12:00] <kkathman> ok got the kicker and taskbars lined out :)
[12:00] <kkathman> yay
[12:04] <flames> hi, if i click a mailto: link, open evolution wizard, but i prefer thunderbird, where can i change default mailto protocol application?