[08:34] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- jamespage, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3534 Needs rebuild due to higher version at destination (bionic/ceph). Ready to build (bionic/dpdk, bionic/openvswitch)
[10:53] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- rbalint, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3797 Preparing packages
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[20:46] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- rbalint, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3798 Generating diffs
[20:47] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- rbalint, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3798 Release pocket (eoan/gvfs, eoan/kodi, eoan/mpd, eoan/qemu, eoan/vlc). Successfully built (eoan/libnfs)


[02:18] <AtomicSpark> oh hi
[02:18] <jjesse> oh hi back
[02:18] <AtomicSpark> did the ubuntu update server project ever get started?
[02:20] <jjesse> dont' knwo
[02:20] <AtomicSpark> hmm. well if one had many ubuntu clients, would be nice to have them point to your local server. like how microsoft does wsus or whatever.
[02:20] <jjesse> agreed, but i wouldn't be the best person to help out
[02:22] <AtomicSpark> well ubuntu is working on network policies "tool kit". so many it will get better in time.
[02:24] <AtomicSpark> maybe the new policies plus openldap server, it could be a good replacement for AD.
[03:03] <Kamping_Kaiser> AtomicSpark, past an httpd server + local mirror, what would you expect the update server to do?
[03:08] <AtomicSpark> well i'm just seeing if i can cut down on bandwidth. other then that a server that could know what the clients need and update them (not just security fixes) would be nice.
[03:09] <AtomicSpark> i could just write a cron script to update the computer, but that would tell me if/when/how it was updated.
[04:40] <AtomicSpark> !troll
[04:40] <AtomicSpark> :|
[06:34] <reya276> anyone in?
[06:35] <Kamping_Kaiser> !anyone
[06:36] <reya276> Kamping_Kaiser: having an issue with postfix
[06:36] <reya276> I upgraded to hardy and postfix is not working
[06:37] <reya276> so I set out to reinstalling and reconfiguring following this guide https://help.ubuntu.com/community/PostfixBasicSetupHowto but things are not working like it did before
[06:38] <Kamping_Kaiser> what does "Not working" mean?
[06:40] <reya276> meaning that when I create a user by doing sudo useradd -m -s /bin/bash <username> it does not at the Maildir since I instructed postfix to do so
[06:41] <Kamping_Kaiser> any errors?
[06:41]  * Kamping_Kaiser didnt realise postfix made maildirs
[06:41]  * Kamping_Kaiser afk.
[08:39] <pteague> ok, i don't think this is good - "The ext3 file system creation in partition #2 of SCSI1 (0,0,0) (sda) failed."
[09:35] <mathiaz> zul: re bug 176015 - have you looked into the debian package ?
[09:36] <mathiaz> zul: I've synced the package for intrepid, and there is an updated patch in Debian.
[09:36] <mathiaz> zul: it may be worth looking into the debian package.
[09:39] <zul> mathiaz: no I took the patch from the mailing list in the bug report but I can do that as well
[09:50] <kraut> moin
[09:55] <mathiaz> zul: It's probably the same patch.
[09:55]  * delcoyote hi
[09:55] <zul> mathiaz: basically it is
[09:56] <zul> I just have to update the bug report with the new patch
[12:10] <chalcedony> HELP! I upgraded from Feisty to Gutsy with "do-release-upgrade", it finished Gutsy and restarted, I got the gui screen and tried to update aptitude, 0 % upgraded etc. I tried running "do-release-upgrade" but got an error: System Error: E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages. I told someone that I could not open a file to paste the error into. He misunderstood me, he told me to do control+alt+f(1-9) and coltrol+alt+f
[12:15] <Kamping_Kaiser> GUI? doesnt sound like a server question to me
[12:19] <chalcedony> Kamping_Kaiser i'd ask the president if he were here.
[12:21]  * Kamping_Kaiser doesnt get it
[12:33] <royalshelter> hi, there, can anyone help me with my wireless settings? I have installed gnome-core, but how can I get to internet via wireless?
[12:36] <royalshelter> hi
[12:51] <soren> royalshelter: Ask in #ubuntu.
[13:12] <Kamping_Kaiser> is my ubuntu mirror lacking Packages.gz because ubuntu no longer uses it?
[13:12] <Kamping_Kaiser> or is my mirror bust?
[13:14] <Kamping_Kaiser> looks like my mirror. wonder if its a debmirror option... hm.
[13:51] <nyarla> any chance to see the debian openSSL update applied to dapper? seems critical as far as security is concerned (http://lists.debian.org/debian-security-announce/2008/msg00152.html)
[13:51] <Deeps> dapper isn't affected
[13:51] <nyarla> I know hardy was patched a few days ago
[13:52] <Deeps> hardy was affected, dapper isn't
[13:52] <Deeps> http://www.ubuntu.com/usn/usn-612-1
[13:52] <nyarla> good, thanks
[13:52] <Deeps> that said
[13:52] <Deeps> if you're using any kind of key based authentication on your dapper system
[13:52] <Kamping_Kaiser> not *directly* affected
[13:53] <Deeps> if any of those keys were generated on an affected system
[13:53] <Deeps> then those keys are to be considerred compromised and need to be regenerated
[13:54] <nyarla> i use ssh, apache, postfix/docevot, vsftp, freenx all with SSL configured
[13:54] <nyarla> i dont catch it. If the openssl in dapper doent need update, why would i have to recreate all the keys?
[13:55] <Kamping_Kaiser> did you read what Deeps said ? :|
[13:55] <Kamping_Kaiser> if you use keybaed auth and have a key from an affected system that key needs to be considred compromised
[13:56] <nyarla> ok ok sorry, I read too fast.My own keys are clean then, i'll watch for foreign ones
[13:58] <Kamping_Kaiser> interesting point.
[13:58] <Kamping_Kaiser> wonder if/when a backport of ssh will hit dapper with the blacklist stuff
[13:59] <Deeps> 07:22:25 < evad> Oh cool, the new Debian SSH rejects authentication from broken keys
[13:59] <Deeps> dunno if that's relevant
[14:00] <Kamping_Kaiser> the new ssh in ubuntu does to. the question is if dapper gets the new ssh :)
[14:00] <Deeps> ah yes, i see new ssh update
[14:00]  * Deeps upgrades
[14:01] <nyarla> just curious : how easy would it be to break a weak key? is it just theoretical or are such tools in the wild already?
[14:02] <Kamping_Kaiser> nyarla, theres only 65,536 posable keys. for everyone.
[14:02] <Kamping_Kaiser> so 20 min~ to generate the keys, then 3x65,536 to brute the server (max)
[14:02] <Deeps> 65k? where did you get that number from?
[14:03] <Deeps> have a read through http://wiki.debian.org/SSLkeys
[14:04] <Kamping_Kaiser> Deeps, the only entropy is a 16bit pid
[14:04] <Kamping_Kaiser> i read it 2 days ago, i havent updated my reading yet
[14:04] <Kamping_Kaiser> 3 days ago now actually :|
[14:04] <Deeps> fair enough
[14:05] <Deeps> nyarla: you'll want to have a read through http://wiki.debian.org/SSLkeys to see just how serious it is
[14:05] <Deeps> although chances are you're in the clear anyway
[14:06] <Kamping_Kaiser> wow. that page is *huge* now.
[14:06] <Deeps> yeaah heh
[14:07] <Kamping_Kaiser> no one added ntp. interesting. (wonder if no one uses ntp+ssl :))
[14:07] <nyarla> readin it. What a mess :(
[14:08] <Kamping_Kaiser> i have to crash blokes. (should have done it already :])
[14:08] <Kamping_Kaiser> enjoy your reading. back in 12 hours ;)
[14:08] <Deeps> nn
[14:22] <foolano> mathiaz: http://public.warp.es/anste/
[16:02] <yoandy> Hi, how can i make postfix do a copy of a mail based on sender and recipient ("and", both at same time),
[16:04] <ivoks> copy to where?
[16:05] <ivoks> always_bcc=somebackupaccount
[16:05] <ivoks> and then do procmail rules :)
[16:05] <ivoks> bye
[16:07] <_ruben> odd .. when i install linux-xen meta package the -xen kernel isnt added to grub
[16:09] <yoandy> ivoks, mmmm that could work, but if there is a "more direct" way, i would prefer it since this will be done on a heavy traffic postfix server
[16:16] <yoandy> ivoks,
[16:17] <yoandy> ivoks,  that could work, but if there is a "direct/better performance" way, i would prefer it since this will be done on a heavy traffic postfix server
[16:24] <ivoks> you still didn't tell where do you want a copy
[16:26] <yoandy> ivoks, to other mailbox
[16:29] <ivoks> if both criterias (destination and source) are true?
[16:29] <yoandy> ivoks, yes, for example: if<EMAIL_ADDRESS>and<EMAIL_ADDRESS>then<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[16:29] <ivoks> you have to do that trough procmail
[16:29] <ivoks> user procmail as delivery agent
[16:29] <ivoks> and then create rule in /etc/procmailrc
[16:30] <ivoks> or you can use whatever delivery agent you want...
[16:31] <yoandy> ivoks, ok, let me read some doc... about delivery agents :), thanks!
[16:32] <ivoks> np
[16:38] <yoandy> ivoks, its possible using postfix builtin delivery agent?
[16:38] <ivoks> i don't know... maybe
[16:38] <yoandy> ok, lets keep reading :)
[17:11] <JustineC> Hi.  I've installed a *minimal* ubuntu for server use.  I'm coming from SysVInit-land, and upstart's a bit new ...
[17:11] <JustineC> How do I start/stop iptables?  according to apt-get, iptables is installed, but there's no entry in /etc/rc.d or /etc/init.d.
[17:13] <Deeps> iptables doesn't "run" in that sense
[17:13] <Deeps> if the module is loaded, it's running
[17:13] <Deeps> simply using the command line tool 'iptables' will ensure any required modules are loaded
[17:14] <JustineC> Deeps: so there's no ubuntu analogue of "service iptables stop"?
[17:14] <Deeps> i think ufw might be what you're looking for
[17:15] <Deeps> but to my knowledge, no, out of the box, there isnt any scripts to set/replace default firewall rules
[17:15] <Deeps> iptables-restore and iptables-save are tools that perform that general functionality
[17:16] <JustineC> Deeps I don't want to set/replace, I want to disable. E.g., as necessary to install shorewall ...
[17:16] <JustineC> AND, your suggestion: "ufw disable" does the trick.
[17:16] <JustineC> --> Firewall stopped and disabled on system startup
[17:16] <JustineC> Now I just have to figure out the docs enough so I know that I should know that ! ;-)
[17:18] <Deeps> rmmod iptables would entirely disable iptables
[17:19] <JustineC> removing the mod from the kernel, sure.  How is rmmod's "disable iptables" different from "ufw disable"?
[17:20] <Deeps> no idea, i've never uesd ufw
[17:21] <JustineC> Deeps: Ok.  It's a "big explore" then :-)
[18:09] <reya276> Can anyone help me solve an smtp authentication issue
[18:23] <reya276> how come I'm trying to connect to telnet localhost 25 and it does not work?
[18:24] <InsomniaCity> have you configured it to only listen on certain IPs? is it running?
[18:27] <reya276> I do not know
[18:27] <reya276> how can I find out
[18:27] <InsomniaCity> well, I've never done it - I'd suggest googling for a tutorial
[18:28] <InsomniaCity> or hang around here... Deeps will know all about it :)
[18:34] <giovani> reya276: which MTA are you running?
[18:34] <reya276> postfix
[18:36] <giovani> if you run "sudo netstat -ad | grep -i postfix" ... what do you get? (if it's more than 2 lines, use a pastebin service instead of pasting it to the channel
[18:36] <giovani> err
[18:37] <reya276> nothing
[18:38] <reya276> nothing came back
[18:38] <giovani> "sudo netstat -ad | grep -i 25"
[18:39] <reya276> http://www.pastebin.org/36630
[18:39] <giovani> is postfix even running ...?
[18:39] <giovani> there should've been a LISTEN line there
[18:39] <reya276> I belive so
[18:40] <giovani> "ps aux | grep -i postfix"
[18:40] <reya276> http://www.pastebin.org/36631
[18:41] <giovani> oh, you know what, I bet netstat resolved the port
[18:41] <giovani> "sudo netstat -ad | grep -i smtp"
[18:42] <reya276> http://www.pastebin.org/36632
[18:43] <giovani> yup ... there it is
[18:43] <giovani> and two established connections
[18:44] <giovani> well ... assuming you did "telnet localhost 25" ... and it's not responding, I'd assume the process is b0rked, I'd restart postfix
[18:44] <cycom> hey guys, shouldn't there be something in the topic about the ssl keys?
[18:44] <giovani> sudo /etc/init.d/postfix restart
[18:44] <reya276> I have restarted postfix countless of times
[18:45] <giovani> cycom: no ops here to do so ... I'd have a hard time believing someone didn't know about it by now ... and visits this irc channel
[18:45] <reya276> krusty@krusty:~$ sudo /etc/init.d/postfix restart
[18:45] <reya276>  * Stopping Postfix Mail Transport Agent postfix                         [ OK ]
[18:45] <reya276>  * Starting Postfix Mail Transport Agent postfix                         [ OK ]
[18:45] <giovani> reya276: so ... try telneting now
[18:45] <cycom> giovani: *shrug* better safe than sorry, no?
[18:46] <giovani> cycom: yeah, if there was an op here ... we could have em do it
[18:46] <reya276> nope all I get is Trying <IP_ADDRESS>...
[18:47] <cycom> giovani: also, I was under the impression initially that it was JUST debian systems affected because every channel I was in had 'debian openssl vuln' and 'Debian users must read this!' etc.
[18:47] <cycom> I read it anyhow, and SUPRISE!
[18:47] <giovani> cycom: well ... there are very few bugs that affect debian and not ubuntu
[18:47] <giovani> considering ubuntu still relies on debian for most patches
[18:48] <cycom> giovani: newbies running ubuntu-server might not know that though ;)
[18:48] <cycom> but that's exactly why I read it.
[18:48] <giovani> cycom: well ... that's a general user education problem ... not specific to the ssl issue
[18:48] <giovani> ubuntu released a security notification
[18:48] <giovani> every admin should be subscribed
[18:49] <cycom> yeah, but like I said, doesn't help newbies, or people messing around with home server boxes that aren't subscribed
[18:49] <giovani> cycom: ... there's not a solution for that
[18:49] <giovani> agreed -- adding it to the topic here would be not a bad idea -- but it hardly comes close to solving/addressing that problem in general
[18:50] <giovani> oh ... it's on the topic in #ubuntu ... case closed
[18:50] <giovani> no "newbie" is coming to #ubuntu-server, and not #ubuntu
[18:50] <giovani> reya276: honestly, I have no idea what's going on there ... sounds like you may have some odd network config ... maybe restrictions on which ips can connect ... you could try discussing this in #postfix
[18:51] <reya276> doing so now
[18:51] <cycom> giovani: heh. you never know.  also, they might not read the whole topic
[18:51] <reya276> but telnet should work, or atleast come back with some kind of error but it just stays there
[18:51] <giovani> cycom: I think you're nit-picking now
[18:51] <giovani> reya276: not always
[18:52] <cycom> giovani: I'm in an 80x24 terminal using irssi.    I think it should be on the front page, so to speak
[18:53] <mralphabet> call cnn?
[18:53] <mralphabet> everybody panic?
[18:53] <giovani> cycom: sent out to all security mailing lists ... period
[18:54] <mralphabet> are we the nanny state?
[18:54] <giovani> any sysadmin is going to be doing daily apt-get updates
[18:54] <giovani> it'd be impossible to be separated from this issue for this long and give a shit about security
[18:55] <cycom> *sigh* so we should just assume everyone knows, and if they don't, that's their problem?
[18:56] <giovani> no ...
[18:56] <giovani> it's been broadcasted to every mailing list, it's discussed on every tech news site, it's on slashdot, it's in the topic of #ubuntu and #debian
[18:56] <giovani> that doesn't sound like "assuming everyone knows"
[18:57] <cycom> where do you see it in the topic in #debian?
[18:57] <Deeps> sounds like a good argument against making ubuntu server follow the same philosophy as the desktop
[18:57] <giovani> Deeps: what?
[18:57] <Deeps> administering servers requires a lot more clue than managing your own desktop
[18:58] <Deeps> casual desktop users dont care about being on mailing lists, reading tech sites, being on irc and/or reading topics
[18:58] <giovani> cycom: the first item: "openssl vulnerability: /msg dpkg dsa1571"
[18:58] <cycom> giovani: EXACTLY.
[18:58] <cycom> giovani: the first item.
[18:58] <mralphabet> cycom: we could require everybody register a phone number when they download ubuntu so that canonical can call you with security warnings.
[18:58] <cycom> I'm just saying, don't bury it at the end.  the more places where it's posted here, the less likely it is someone will miss it.
[18:59] <Deeps> i dunno what all the fuss, given that
[18:59] <Deeps> 18:46:01 < giovani> cycom: yeah, if there was an op here ... we could have em do it
[18:59] <giovani> cycom: I'm not arguing against putting it as the first item ... so stop bitching ... first item or last ... it's in the topic ... I think you're trying to make an argument where there's no reason for it ... first item versus last (the last is more visible to me actually) doesn't have anything to do with this
[18:59] <Deeps> no ops are around to do the relevant rask
[18:59] <cycom> I'm just concerned by the argument that 'everyone must know by now.'
[18:59] <giovani> that was not the argument
[19:00] <giovani> that was the final straw after 5 examples of how it's been spread
[19:00] <giovani> it was ... after all of this effort, it's likely that anyone who knows shit would know by now
[19:00] <Deeps> tbh, i dont know any 'real' server admins that weren't aware of this within hours of it hitting the debian mailing list (Assuming suitable timezone)
[19:01] <giovani> exactly ... and not many "newbie" admins are using key-based ssh authentication, which is going to be the main attack vector
[19:01] <Deeps> if you're having fun in your bedroom playing with ubuntu server and dont care to keep up to date on what's going on, you'll get hit by apt-get upgrading your stuff for you
[19:01] <giovani> AND ... everyone does apt-get updates ... and if you don't there are MAJOR problems with YOU, not with the information release
[19:02] <cycom> *shrug*
[19:02] <giovani> if we had an op here, I'd think it was a fine idea to put it in the topic ... nobody argued that point with you
[19:02] <mralphabet> cycom: I charge you with sending a personal message to everybody that joins this channel
[19:02] <cycom> I've worked with people who didn't update unless something was broken
[19:02] <giovani> cycom: then you know what? this would be a perfect life lesson for them
[19:02] <cycom> mralphabet: sure, pass the buck to someone else.  lazy bastard.
[19:02] <giovani> sometimes people refuse to ever change their behavior until it causes massive problems
[19:02] <Deeps> cycom: i've worked with crack whores too, doesn't make their way of doing things right (no really, she was a whore and she spent most of her money on blow)
[19:03] <mralphabet> hah, I'm not the one having a problem with the current state of affairs ;)
[19:03] <cycom> giovani: they got it in the form of a major outage when 20 different code revisions of cisco switch didn't talk so well with one another.
[19:03] <Deeps> there's a reason sysadmins get paid more than desktop users
[19:03] <giovani> cycom: obviously not ... because then they would be updating their system regularly, and your point would be moot
[19:04] <Deeps> you're required a suitable amount of education and clue to do the job properly
[19:04] <cycom> I didn't say they LEARNED from the lesson.
[19:04] <Deeps> and thats the fault of giovani?
[19:04] <Deeps> lol
[19:04] <cycom> Deeps: but not to get the job :)
[19:04] <cycom> Deeps: no, I didn't say it was.
[19:04] <mralphabet> then it sounds like this mythical sysadmin that hasn't heard about the problem yet is due for another life lesson.
[19:04] <Deeps> what is your point? cuz this discussion seems to have degenerated very quickly
[19:05] <Deeps> you're citing examples of how not to administer a server
[19:05] <mralphabet> Deeps: I think it degenerated long, long, long ago
[19:05] <Deeps> it's sorta like the windows desktop user not running windows update, a stateful firewall nor an anti virus
[19:05] <Deeps> and using IE5 to browse porn + crack sites
[19:05] <reya276> giovani: the folks at #postfix said I'm missing saslauthd
[19:05] <Deeps> and blaming it on #microsoft for not having it in the topic "OMG USE WU+FW+AV!"
[19:06] <giovani> reya276: and that's preventing you from opening a tcp connection?
[19:06] <reya276> giovani: so I'm trying to install it but I get an error stating package is not found
[19:06] <cycom> I'm not BLAMING anyone, I'm just citing examples of why it's a good idea to put things like this in places where everyone is nearly certain to see them
[19:07] <Deeps> and it was agreed, to a certain degree
[19:07] <cycom> but again, I was told I was nit-picking for the idea that it should be at the beginning of the topic, rather than at the end.
[19:08] <reya276> giovani: oh they said is part of Cyrus-SSL
[19:08] <Deeps> i personally dont think an irc topic is a suitable place to be learning about security vulnerabilities
[19:08] <Deeps> but then i dont give a rats ass eitherway
[19:09] <cycom> If there was a problem with your house's locks and your neighborhood was like the internet, don't you think you'd want that information first, rather than last?
[19:09] <Deeps> i think i'd want to be on the locks newsletter
[19:09] <Deeps> to ensure that i'm up to date on all manner of lock related issues
[19:10] <Deeps> i wouldn't expect it to be on a big billboard outside my house
[19:10] <Deeps> nor at the start nor the end of the billboard
[19:10] <reya276> giovani: how can I install that package "cyrus-ssl"
[19:10] <Deeps> sorry, on the big billboard in the backallie of the neighbourhood where few people dare to roam due to the freaks that reside in there
[19:10] <Deeps> backallies*
[19:11] <AtomicSpark> so we discussed yesterday about an ubuntu update server and i was suggested to look into making my own local repo mirror or something. how do i go about doing that?
[19:13] <mralphabet> reya276: how would you normally find / install a package?
[19:14] <mralphabet> AtomicSpark: apt-mirror?
[19:14] <AtomicSpark> sure something like that. so when my clients update, they all can connect to local server instead of going over the internet
[19:14] <mralphabet> http://www.howtoforge.com/local_debian_ubuntu_mirror
[19:14] <mralphabet> ^^ first link from google
[19:15] <mralphabet> uvirtbot: go fly a kite ;)
[19:15] <mralphabet> hah
[19:16] <AtomicSpark> lol
[19:16] <AtomicSpark> 25GB or space? mm ill pass.
[19:16] <reya276> ok I think I will start from scratch here, how can I delete my entire postfix setup with config files and all
[19:17] <AtomicSpark> reya276, sudo apt-get purge postfix
[19:17] <AtomicSpark> it will warn you if it cannot remove a folder. this usually only happens if you create a file, such as a backup of the default settings.
[19:18] <reya276> dpkg - warning: while removing postfix, directory `/var/lib/postfix' not empty so not removed.
[19:18] <reya276> I want to start from scratch as if I did nothing
[19:19] <reya276> because somewhere along the line I did something wrong
[19:19] <reya276> I should be able to connect to telnet localhost 25 and I can't
[19:21] <AtomicSpark> reya276, thats the error i was expecting
[19:21] <AtomicSpark> oh wait. no it isn't.
[19:21] <AtomicSpark> go to /var/lib/postfix and tell me what's in there
[19:22] <stickystyle> AtomicSpark: if 25GB is a little much for a full mirror, look into apt-proxy also.  that way you cache packages once, rather than mirror everything.
[19:22] <reya276> AtomicSpark: prng_exch  smtpd_scache.db  smtp_scache.db
[19:22] <AtomicSpark> stickystyle, it would make more sense if i had 100+ clients, but 3? :P
[19:23] <AtomicSpark> reya276, using smtp must of created those files. apt-get wont remove anything that's not from the original program. its a safety thing.
[19:24] <reya276> AtomicSpark: can I remove them
[19:24] <AtomicSpark> reya276, well i'm not sure what they store. i assume email.
[19:25] <reya276> AtomicSpark: at this point I don't care I just want to start from scratch
[19:26] <AtomicSpark> reya276, if i was you, i would copy them into a backup folder. just to be sure.
[19:26] <AtomicSpark> that way you can move them out of that folder and start from scratch but still have them for when you do a fresh install.
[19:26] <AtomicSpark> or something.
[19:27] <AtomicSpark> so do like "sudo mv /var/lib/postfix /var/lib/postfix.backup
[19:27] <reya276> I'm using this guide https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Postfix
[19:27] <reya276> AtomicSpark: ok done
[19:28] <reya276> AtomicSpark: how do I remove those things
[19:28] <AtomicSpark> you shouldn't have a folder called postfix in there now since you did a move.
[19:28] <AtomicSpark> technically you renamed that folder.
[19:28] <reya276> oh ok is gone
[19:29] <AtomicSpark> so now you should reinstall postfix. i would use tasksel, so it goes right into the configuration. not sure if apt-get does that.
[19:29] <reya276> Is this a good guide to follow https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Postfix
[19:30] <AtomicSpark> probably (still loading for me) there is also the official server guide https://help.ubuntu.com/8.04/serverguide/C/postfix.html
[19:31] <AtomicSpark> need to be careful with community docs. they're sometimes outdated. they should specify what version the wrote it to.
[19:31] <AtomicSpark> oh wait. it says at bottom :P
[20:43] <JustineC> I installed Hardy today.  Want to install the right kernel sources.  Which to use? "linux-source-2.6.24" or "linux-source"?
[20:45] <Centaur5> linux-source is just a dummy package that will install the newest source
[20:46] <JustineC> Centaur5 Whereas linux-source-2.6.24 provides a specific version?
[20:46] <JustineC> Which is newer (iiuc, 'linux-source)?
[20:46] <JustineC> According to apt-cache, "linux-source-2.6.24" & "linux-source"  provide "2.6.24-16.30 - linux-source-2.6 linux-source" and "<IP_ADDRESS>.18 -" respectively.
[20:46] <JustineC> (a little confused about numbering conventions)
[20:48] <Centaur5> The package with the higher number is newer
[20:50] <JustineC> Centaur5: Yes, that's obvious.  So which is "higher" ?  (2.6.24-16.30 ) or (<IP_ADDRESS>.18)?  The hyphen might make a difference.
[20:52] <Centaur5> I guess I've never seen a linux-image or source file without a hyphen. According to my sources 2.6.24-17.31 is newest.
[20:55] <JustineC> Centaur5: Assuming its a typo in the pkg info then, (linux-source-2.6.24) is the newest.  I.e., "linux-source-2.6.24" provides newer kernel source than "linux-source".
[20:55] <JustineC> i mean ((2.6.24-16.30 )
[20:56] <Centaur5> from what I understand is that linux-source will always grab the newest version which would be the linux-source-2.6.24 and then it will also update you to the newest source when a new one is released.
[20:56] <Nafallo> linux-source depends on linux-source-2.6.24, which Provides: linux-source, linux-source-2.6
[20:57] <Nafallo> linux-source will hence provide the newest kernel, as would linux-source-2.6.24
[20:58] <JustineC> Nafallo: Ok.  Despite the different "Provides" info, then, right?
[20:58] <Nafallo> linux-source depends on linux-source-2.6.24...
[20:59] <Nafallo> basically, in hardy linux-source you can install either. if you dist-upgrade to intrepid though, linux-source needs to be installed to pull in the new linux-source-$whatever
[21:00] <Nafallo> hope that helps
[21:00] <JustineC> Nafallo: Ok. Go it. Thanks.
[21:00] <reya276> Ubuntu wiki is extremely slow
[21:01] <reya276> trying to load this page and is taking for ever https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UsingTheTerminal?action=show&redirect=BasicCommands
[21:01] <reya276> every other site id working great
[21:01] <reya276> I hope nothing happened to their servers
[21:03] <Nafallo> reya276: I can replicate
[22:13] <reya276> is there anyway to create a Maildir with sub directories cur,new,tmp when you do sudo adduser <username>
[22:14] <reya276> meaming so that it creates it under the added user home dir
[22:15] <giovani> reya276: you could script that up into your own add-user script
[22:15] <giovani> do you really want to use system users as mail users? that's a less-common setup these days
[22:15] <reya276> yes because we only have like 4 employess
[22:15] <reya276> employees
[22:15] <giovani> ok
[22:16] <giovani> if it's only 4 ... then jsut do it manually
[22:16] <giovani> it's taken youmore time asking than it would've to do it :)
[22:16] <reya276> the issue is that when I create the user and then add the Maildir manually it says that the user does not own the dir
[22:17] <giovani> you need to use the chown command
[22:17] <giovani> read its manpage
[22:17] <giovani> to understand how to use it
[22:17] <giovani> in this case, "sudo chown -R user:group ./Maildir/" probably suffices
[22:22] <reya276> ok thanks
[22:22] <reya276> I was actually doing it one by one
[22:22] <reya276> chown helpdesk /home/helpdesk/Maildir/cur etc...
[22:23] <giovani> the manual has wonderful things to learn :) -- -R is your friend
[22:39] <JanC> AFAIK some mail delivery agents will create proper Maildirs for you if they don't exist too
[22:50] <reya276> E: Could not get lock /var/cache/apt/archives/lock - open (11 Resource temporarily unavailable)
[22:50] <reya276> E: Unable to lock the download directory
[22:50] <reya276> how can I fix this?
[22:50] <reya276> through teminal
[22:54] <giovani> you are running apt already
[22:54] <giovani> quit/kill the process that's runnung -- only one can at a time
[22:54] <reya276> I think so and the process did not finish
[22:54] <reya276> I do not know what is the process
[22:55] <reya276> how can I find out
[22:56] <giovani> ps aux | grep -i apt
[22:58] <reya276> root      9349  0.0  0.0   1772   480 ?        S    17:34   0:00 sh -c yes Yes | apt-get -y --force-yes -f install spamassassin 2>&1 2>/dev/null
[22:58] <reya276> root      9351  0.0  0.7  17368 14780 ?        S    17:34   0:01 apt-get -y --force-yes -f install spamassassin
[22:59] <reya276> giovani:  how in the world can you tell what is what from there
[23:00] <giovani> uh, you see that apt-get is running there
[23:00] <giovani> you shouldn't have done that
[23:00] <giovani> > /dev/null
[23:00] <reya276> ok
[23:00] <giovani> that's why you lost control
[23:00] <giovani> sudo kill -9 9349
[23:01] <reya276> ok
[23:01] <reya276> done
[23:01] <reya276> now if I try to install again I should be able to?
[23:01] <giovani> should be ... if not ... sudo kill -9 9351
[23:01] <giovani> just to make sure that got killed as well
[23:02] <reya276> ok
[23:03] <giovani> I don't know why you think you should've forced that, and sent the output to /dev/null ... who told you to run that?
[23:07] <reya276> oh I found it on a webpage
[23:08] <reya276> dude honestly I don't know jack about linux. or Ubuntu, just learning
[23:09] <reya276> so every bit of info you can throw at me would be truly appreciated
[23:09] <giovani> well ... lesson number one ... don't run random commands without first understanding what they do
[23:09] <reya276> so I got my telnet and postfix to receive email, but now having issue with the relay
[23:09] <reya276> sending out emails :-(
[23:09] <reya276> got yah
[23:29] <reya276> giovani: thanks for all your help, but I'm calling it quits for today
[23:30] <giovani> reya276: no problem ... mail servers aren't the easiest to set up -- take a break :)


[00:42] <stochastic> zequence_, are there any bug #'s or blueprints I should start to read first?
[00:43] <OvenWerk1> I don't think the 14.10 blue prints are up yet, but one of the things done was to separate trhe blueprints into cycle and long term.
[00:44] <OvenWerk1> Let me see if I can find them, I have been pretty inactive this cycle
[00:48] <OvenWerk1> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/Blueprints gives an overview
[07:13] <zequence_> stochastic: check out the wiki wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio
[07:13] <zequence_> stochastic: There's a blueprints page there
[07:13] <zequence_> Ah, right, OvenWerk1 already linked it
[07:37] <stochastic> zequence_, how is the controls update coming?
[07:38] <zequence_> stochastic: I've been rewriting it from scratch
[07:38] <stochastic> That's what I read.
[07:39] <zequence_> it's not finished yet. Haven't had the time
[07:39] <stochastic> I know the old version really wasn't doing much anymore.
[07:39] <zequence_> no. we need to SRU it. Should have been done a long time ago
[07:40] <stochastic> fair enough, we all get busy
[07:40] <zequence_> stochastic: have you had any experience with rt-kit?
[07:40] <stochastic> minimal
[07:40] <zequence_> I'm thinking if we could get jack working with that, it would probably be one of the better alternatives
[07:41] <zequence_> what other alternatives are there, that would be good for the future
[07:43]  * stochastic is just getting back into kernel stuff.
[07:43] <stochastic> Last time I loaded Ubuntu Studio it shipped a GNOME interface
[07:44] <stochastic> I'll take a look through where Controls is and what the current kernel you're shipping with is, and I'll let you know in a bit
[07:45] <zequence> stochastic: Well, if you'd like something to do, solving how to get rt privilege by just installing jackd on any Debian derived system would be a nice place to start
[07:45] <zequence> in any case, we can't use audio group
[07:46] <stochastic> no?  that's how we used to get it done
[07:46] <zequence> if nothing els, we need to create a new one
[07:46] <stochastic> security reasons?
[07:46] <zequence> audio group is used for other things too
[07:46] <zequence> yeah
[07:46] <stochastic> fair enough
[07:46] <zequence> Debian has users in audio group by default, but not Ubuntu
[07:46] <zequence> Ubuntu Studio does, for the first user
[07:47] <stochastic> So the trigger to allow RT privilege will be the installation of jackd on the system?  for every user?
[07:48] <stochastic> *in an ideal setup?
[07:49] <zequence> if we use groups, the ideal would be for the user to already be apart of the group (like, a group called "jack")
[07:49] <zequence> but, I suppose with rt-kit, one could solve that in another way
[07:50] <zequence> also, if we use groups, we should push for a change in both Debian and Ubuntu - which from what I hear, may be difficult, since they prefer not to introduce new groups.
[07:50] <zequence> but, still, not impossible
[07:51] <zequence> going to work - bbl
[07:51] <stochastic> cya
[08:45] <zequence> stochastic: We haven't really been using the blueprints this cycle so much, but they should contain some ideas
[08:50] <zequence> the problem is really that we have too few developers for the blueprints to be much use
[08:51] <stochastic> zequence, I'm likely not going to be much use for implementing anything this cycle but I'll certainly help toward rt-kit implementation for next cycle if that's okay.  I'm off to bed for the night (Vancouver timezone).
[08:52] <zequence> stochastic: This cycle is all but done, so no problem
[08:53] <stochastic> Yeah FF was long ago now.
[08:53] <zequence> considering it's and LTS, it's a shame we haven't done more, but there's always a next one
[08:54] <zequence> stochastic: gn, and great to have you back (all though I wasn't around back then)
[09:25] <zequence> stochastic: also, if you happen to any jack coding, pulseaudio-module-jack might be in a need of a little optimizing. The main issue I think is just that it eats a lot of CPU.
[09:25] <zequence> not as much now, as it's defaulting to two channels only
[10:21] <zequence> ubuntustudio-live is in the repos. Going to switch to it now
[15:05] <OvenWerk1> zequence: there is as of now no kernel in repos for 14.04
[15:05] <OvenWerk1> ISO build may take a while
[16:14] <zequence> OvenWerk1: What do you mean, no kernel?
[16:15] <zequence> OvenWerk1: Next ISO should build anytime now
[19:35] <cub> so beta2 is on the 27th. Is the iso prepared a few days before so we test it before the beta2 release?
[20:28] <zequence> cub: Testing of the Beta 2 should start anytime now. Today is Beta 2 freeze (or should have been)
[20:29] <zequence> new ISOs are out http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntustudio/dvd/current/
[20:29] <zequence> I'll give it a try tomorrow
[20:29] <zequence> We should have the new slides, but not the background


[14:58] <LocutusOfBorg> sforshee, maybe lets talk here
[15:14] <sforshee> LocutusOfBorg: ok
[15:15] <sforshee> it's less work for us to use the in-kernel drivers as they should always be compatible with whatever kernel version we're working with
[15:16] <sforshee> but as I said, if they are currently missing features it's not too much trouble to keep importing the drivers from the dkms package
[15:17] <LocutusOfBorg> in my opinion it depends on how many features you want to give users
[15:17] <LocutusOfBorg> having vbox in seeds is a trouble for me in freeze
[15:18] <LocutusOfBorg> and meh, as long as the basic screen works, people are happy without the guest stuff, specially for live session
[15:20] <sforshee> right, my position would be to keep importing them into the kernel until the in-kernel drivers provide the necessary functionality
[15:26] <LocutusOfBorg> as you wish, keeping importing them was not so trivial, due to me forgetting to prod you and vice-versa
[15:28] <sforshee> LocutusOfBorg: ok, so what exactly would be missing if we switch to the in-kernel drivers? Shared folders, anything else?
[15:28] <sforshee> if the in-kernel drivers currently do provide sufficient functionality then I'm fine with switching to them
[15:29] <sforshee> so really I'm just asking you to convince me ;-)
[15:29] <LocutusOfBorg> vboxguest vboxsf vboxvideo are provided by the guest-dkms package
[15:30] <LocutusOfBorg> probably shared clipboard and sf are the missing bits
[15:31] <LocutusOfBorg> we have also the 3d functionality in vbox-guest-x11, so you have 3d accelerated guest
[15:31] <LocutusOfBorg> but you need an additional package for it
[15:33] <sforshee> so if it is only sf and clipboard ... for installer I think we could do without those
[15:35] <sforshee> then why don't we give the in-kernel drivers a try, we'll see how it goes
[15:50] <LocutusOfBorg> sforshee, I think with bionic we are already using the in-tree kernel driver?
[15:50] <sforshee> for vboxvideo yes. It does not have the vboxguest driver, that was added in 4.16
[15:50] <LocutusOfBorg> at least we spoke wrt enabling for 18.04 or 18.10 can't remember now
[15:51] <LocutusOfBorg> wow I wasn't aware
[15:53] <sforshee> that's why I was asking, if we use the in-kernel vboxguest driver we lose the sf driver
[15:53] <LocutusOfBorg> also using the vboxvideo you lose it
[15:53] <LocutusOfBorg> so, before you were losing 2 drivers, now you lose only one
[15:54] <LocutusOfBorg> s/o/oo/g :)
[15:54] <sforshee> we can use the in-kernel vboxvideo driver with the other two from vbox-guest
[15:55] <sforshee> but vboxsf depends on exports from vboxguest which are not exported by the in-kernel driver
[15:56] <LocutusOfBorg> oh... this is a big problem then
[16:09] <LocutusOfBorg> anyhow, lots of time before 18.10 to see complains or revert decision
[16:09] <LocutusOfBorg> FWIW we have the safe fallback called "install vbox-guest* and live happy"
[16:09] <LocutusOfBorg> e.g. your vbox video passthroug 3d might not work  at all
[16:10] <LocutusOfBorg> because you don't have mesa overrided llibraries
[16:10] <LocutusOfBorg> so how can it work?
[16:10] <LocutusOfBorg> you also don't set rules to dkms created devices
[16:10] <LocutusOfBorg> look here https://sources.debian.org/src/virtualbox/5.2.12-dfsg-2/debian/virtualbox-guest-utils.init/#L62
[18:44] <Simon-> how do I download the source for 4.4.0-127.153 (on xenial)?
[18:45] <Simon-> https://packages.ubuntu.com/xenial/linux-image-4.4.0-127-generic just gives me links to 128 and 127 isn't available at that location
[18:45] <Simon-> there's a bug that has severely broken SCTP and I want to identify exactly what has changed
[18:46] <tyhicks> Simon-: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/4.4.0-127.153
[18:47] <tyhicks> Simon-: 'dget https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+archive/primary/+sourcefiles/linux/4.4.0-127.153/linux_4.4.0-127.153.dsc' would also likely work
[18:47] <tyhicks> (I've never used dget to pull down a kernel source package but use it regularly for other packages)
[18:49] <Simon-> thanks
[19:01] <Simon-> I think someone has failed to consider that AF_INET6 SCTP sockets can have AF_INET address bound to them :|
[19:01] <Simon-> sctp_inet6_cmp_addr used to be able to compare two AF_INET addresses but now they will just never match
[19:18] <Simon-> how would I get d625329b06e46bd20baf9ee40847d11982569204 applied to xenial's kernel quickly?
[19:21] <Simon-> actually I think that may not correctly compare the port :|
[19:27] <Simon-> the port happens to be in the same place in both sockaddrs, so it will work
[19:37] <Simon-> it's proposed for stable but it doesn't look like it's in there yet: https://lkml.org/lkml/2018/5/18/439
[19:47] <Simon-> it is in fact already in 4.16.10, https://cdn.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v4.x/ChangeLog-4.16.10
[19:51] <Simon-> however, this is 4.4... the fix is in 4.4.133, https://cdn.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v4.x/ChangeLog-4.4.133
[22:43] <jeremy31> jsalisbury Thanks for your time spent on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1764645


[00:37] <beaver> hello, i have question
[00:38] <beaver> okay :), can I be awarded a cloak, who distinguishes my "paternity" with my bot ubotu|packages?, for example : /founder/bot/ubuntu/ubotu-search ?
[00:39] <beaver> my robot is recognized here : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/Bots
[00:40] <beaver> emerson tell me privately -> 04/09/19 02:36:57 <*-emerson> It depends on what the ubuntu IRC Council says, they are the only ones who can request an ubuntu/ cloak
[00:42] <beaver> I think I'm in the right place
[01:10] <beaver> i think i'm a trusted user, niko can testify
[01:11] <Unit193> The namespace has to be first, ubuntu/founder certainly isn't right.  If you'd like to apply for Ubuntu membership, we can give you the usual ubuntu/member/beaver though.
[01:14] <beaver> ok it suits me, thank you for trust
[01:15] <beaver> and sorry for my bad english
[01:21] <beaver> i have to stay on the channel ?
[01:24] <krytarik> beaver: Are you already an Ubuntu Member then?
[01:24] <krytarik> !membership
[01:25] <krytarik> If so, please link your Launchpad profile.
[01:26] <beaver> I have no launchpad page
[01:27] <beaver> I just have a profile here: https://doc.ubuntu-fr.org/users/beaver
[01:27] <beaver> oops https://doc.ubuntu-fr.org/utilisateurs/beaver (sorry)
[01:30] <beaver> no, i am not Ubuntu member
[01:31] <beaver> I am looking for a cloak, in correlation with my bot
[01:31] <beaver> if possible
[01:32] <hggdh> beaver: cloaks are provided at #freenode, not here. Ubuntu cloaks are dealt with t #ubuntu-irc (also not here)
[01:32] <beaver> ok thank you
[01:32] <hggdh> beaver: and an Ubuntu cloak is only given to Ubuntu members
[01:33] <hggdh> beaver: so your best option is to go /join #freenode, and ask there
[01:33] <beaver> my bot has a cloak ubuntu/
[16:49] <shibboleth> i am seemingly still muted in the main channel?
[16:53] <CarlFK> shibboleth: I don't know.  Did you do something to get muted?
[16:53] <shibboleth> well, i did "voice concern" about how fwupd updates were handled in bionic
[16:54] <shibboleth> like... over a week ago
[17:00] <hggdh> shibboleth: yes. And we asked you to stop, and explained why.
[17:00] <hggdh> shibboleth: multiple times, by the way
[17:00] <hggdh> shibboleth: do you understand *why* you were quieted?
[17:00] <shibboleth> you asked me to refrain from any further profanity
[17:00] <shibboleth> profanity
[17:00] <hggdh> and to keep on-topic
[17:01] <shibboleth> how was what i way saying "not" on-topic?
[17:01] <hggdh> and you did not, so I had no other option but to quiet you
[17:01] <CarlFK> shibboleth: please read  over   https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/Guidelines  (again, now.)
[17:04] <shibboleth> =i did. please point out the section pointing out that pushing questionable new features as a security update=totally not an issue and therefore not on topic?
[17:05] <CarlFK> shibboleth: both you and everyone here are volunteers.  If you can't figure it out, you won't get much help.
[17:06] <shibboleth> and how do those two sentences tie in with what happened then and now?
[17:06] <hggdh> shibboleth: there are other channels more appropriate for discussing security, or package policies. #ubuntu is for *support*
[17:07] <hggdh> shibboleth: and I *did* point you to one such channel, and sugguested you to discuss it with developers. You refused
[17:07] <shibboleth> ok, but there is hardly any activity in -hardened and -kernel
[17:08] <CarlFK>  "Recommendations from channel operators"
[17:08] <hggdh> both channels also deal with specific points. For the record, every time I asked on either I was answered.
[17:08] <shibboleth> and whenever a real issue is brought up ops are quick to refer to those, basically giving users the cable-company-runaround
[17:09] <shibboleth> "please hold" :)
[17:10] <hggdh> although I disagree, we are not, here and now, discussing if you are told to wait or not. We are, or so I expect, discussing *why* a moderator had to act
[17:11] <shibboleth> no
[17:11] <shibboleth> i get why it happened
[17:11] <shibboleth> but i'm surprised it is still the case a week later
[17:12] <hggdh> shibboleth: OK. You understand why it happened. Will you keep on-topic, and mind your language?
[17:13] <shibboleth> yes. can i kindly ask that you at least consider the urge to knee-jerk "other channel" every time you simply can't think of a good answer?=
[17:14] <CarlFK> shibboleth:  you answered my simple question with ...  "they may imply skepticism or disagreement"  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scare_quotes
[17:15] <shibboleth> fwupd and lvfs *can* be great for say dell server operators who don't run windows bare-metal
[17:16] <shibboleth> but making firmware "changes" that easy on everyone and their moms box will lead to blood and tears
[17:16] <shibboleth> and releasing the mechanism for that as a "security update" is questionable.
[17:17] <hggdh> shibboleth: and this is the wrong channel to discuss this. Again.
[17:17] <hggdh> shibboleth: anyway, I un-quieted you at #ubuntu
[17:17] <shibboleth> thanks, i noticed
[17:19] <hggdh> shibboleth: now, please keep in mind that the CoC *is* to be followed (not only at #ubuntu, but on all of the Ubuntu IRC namespace)
[17:20] <hggdh> shibboleth: is there anything else we can do for you? If not, please /part; this channel is a no-idling channel
[17:21] <shibboleth> 10-4
[23:54] <stevendale> Oh Unit193 owns TheRedQueen, was worried I'd have to welcome a new member of the op team
[23:54] <stevendale> Well congrats on making a bot Unit193
[23:54] <Unit193> Been there for years, mate.
[23:54] <stevendale> Oh it was Drone all along
[23:55]  * stevendale faints
[23:55] <Unit193> Anything we can help you with?