[14:56] <Scars> Hi, is this a place where I can ask about getting started with the ubuntu distributed development?
[15:00] <rbasak> o/
[15:00] <rbasak> bzr-based UDD is dead
[15:00] <rbasak> The server team (my team) has been working on a git-based replacement.
[15:00] <rbasak> We hang out in #ubuntu-devel or #ubuntu-server.
[15:00] <Scars> ok thx


[02:21] <xubuntu39i> hi
[17:47] <Arthur_D> hi, I'm having a weird issue where the keys on my netbook are constantly outputting the numbers and symbols in blue under its primary function, and I have no idea how to turn it off. It works fine before logging in but after logging in, J becomes 1, K becomes 2, etc
[17:48] <Arthur_D> so I'm obviously typing this on another computer
[17:50] <glitchd_> Arthur_D, i would try plugging in a usb keyboard and see if the same function persists
[17:58] <Arthur_D> plugging in a USB keyboard works fine, but I can't go around lugging a huge external keyboard, then the usefulness of a netbook kinda diminishes
[18:04] <Arthur_D> found the culprit
[18:04] <Arthur_D> somehow managed to turn on Num Lock
[23:15] <SomeDude> Hello!
[23:47] <Arthur_D> Hi
[23:47] <Arthur_D> Hmm wrong channel


[16:59] <thedac> o/
[17:00] <gnuoy> o/
[17:00] <jamespage> o/
[17:00] <icey> op/
[17:00] <cargonza> o/
[17:00] <gnuoy> tinwood, beisner, coreycb, ddellav today?
[17:00] <gnuoy> #startmeeting openstack-charms-meeting
[17:00] <meetingology> Meeting started Wed Jun  8 17:00:48 2016 UTC.  The chair is gnuoy. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[17:00] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[17:00] <beisner> o/
[17:00] <gnuoy> #topic Review ACTION points from previous meeting
[17:00] <ddellav> o/
[17:01] <gnuoy> #subtopic gnuoy Talk to stub about moving his leadership layer into core
[17:01] <tinwood> o/
[17:01] <gnuoy> This is less relevant as I went a different path
[17:01] <gnuoy> I ended up gating things like db_sync on leadership down in the layer itself rather than in the top handler
[17:02] <gnuoy> I'll close that action
[17:02] <gnuoy> #subtopic gnuoy review 16.07 deliverables
[17:02] <gnuoy> I'll defer this again until we're closer to the date
[17:02] <gnuoy> #subtopic jamespage update on relicensing of charms
[17:02] <gnuoy> He is going to contact people outside of Canonical who have contributed to the charms and ask if they are happy if the licensing of the charm moves from GPL v3 to Apache-2.0. This is so that our charms comply with the licensing policy for OpenStack big-tent projects
[17:02] <gnuoy> #link http://governance.openstack.org/reference/licensing.html
[17:02] <jamespage> ok
[17:02] <jamespage> I've sent email to openstack-dev with intent; and emailed contributors outside of canonical directly to ask them to respond on the ML thread
[17:03] <gnuoy> excellent, thank you
[17:03] <gnuoy> #topic Moving communication Upstream
[17:03] <gnuoy> We're currently pushing communication to upstream channels. So, we'll be creating a new openstack-charms IRC channel on freenode and moving email discussions about charm operation and charm development to the OpenStack mailing lists.
[17:03] <gnuoy> In addition we'll be pushing to update our documentation, both in the charms and various web pages.
[17:04] <jamespage> we should probably move this meeting to an openstack-meeting channel as well?
[17:04] <gnuoy> Emails the OpenStack mailing lists should have [charm] at the start of their subject line
[17:04] <gnuoy> jamespage, +1
[17:04] <jamespage> gnuoy, are you ok to take an action to make that happen?
[17:04] <beisner> #link http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
[17:04] <gnuoy> #action gnuoy move meeting to openstack-meeting channel
[17:04] <meetingology> ACTION: gnuoy move meeting to openstack-meeting channel
[17:04] <tinwood> We tend to have most conversations on irc.  When do they/should they move to he ML?
[17:05] <beisner> jamespage, gnuoy - meeting time slots on the 2 (or 3) openstack-meeting channels is pretty tight.   some projects use their own channel, and that can be an ok option i think.
[17:05] <gnuoy> tinwood, I don't think we should move conversations to a mailing list
[17:05] <jamespage> that's a good question - I think when its something design oriented or significant
[17:05] <jamespage> ML
[17:05] <jamespage> otherwise general chat still in irc imhp
[17:05] <gnuoy> +1
[17:05] <tinwood> sounds good
[17:05] <gnuoy> beisner, ok, thanks for the heads up
[17:05] <beisner> +1 irc for day to day convos
[17:05] <jamespage> I proposed a rename of the openvswitch-odl charm - that's probably a good example
[17:06] <beisner> indeed
[17:06]  * gnuoy needs to fiddle with email filters
[17:06] <tinwood> So things that have knock on effects, etc.
[17:06] <gnuoy> #topic State of Development for next Charm Release
[17:07] <gnuoy> Most of the HA code in the OpenStack layers has now landed, so OpenstackCharms built on top of the Openstack Layers should be able to easily enable service HA. Work continues on DNS HA, Barbican and workload status management in the OpenStack layers. anyone, want to add anything?
[17:07] <jamespage> how are we with CI progress beisner?
[17:08] <beisner> we're now adding a repo-info on the fly just ahead of push and publish to the charmstore
[17:08] <beisner> that will allow users / triagers to determine exactly where a cs: revno came from
[17:08] <jamespage> \o/
[17:09] <beisner> those files should never live in the charm source repos - only ever in a built/published artifact
[17:09] <beisner> example:  https://jujucharms.com/tempest/
[17:09] <gnuoy> thanks beisner
[17:09] <beisner> next up is injecting the build step into the existing CI, which I plan to have tactically in place this week.
[17:09] <gnuoy> tip top
[17:09] <thedac> nice
[17:10] <beisner> we'll have some things to adjust i'm sure, but the basic commit -> build -> test -> publish flow should be good
[17:10] <gnuoy> #topic Release Bugs
[17:10] <gnuoy> #link https://goo.gl/HJjORI
[17:10] <gnuoy> I haven't gone through them in the last week but will be looking through again tomorrow. If anyone has anytime to look as well that would be great.
[17:10] <gnuoy> We're one up on last week I think, so not exactly an avalanche, although I think jamespage has done some work
[17:11] <gnuoy> #topic Open Discussion
[17:11] <gnuoy> Anyone got anything OpenStack charm related to get off their chests?
[17:11] <gnuoy> anyone got anything on their mind?
[17:11] <beisner> src dirs are still on my mind
[17:12] <gnuoy> in a good way?
[17:12] <beisner> ;-)
[17:12] <tinwood> Like or dislike
[17:12] <beisner> i may have waffled on ya
[17:12] <beisner> let's discuss in more detail in day 2 day though.  proceeding to support both methods (vanilla layers, and the proposed src charm model)
[17:12] <thedac> ha!
[17:13] <gnuoy> kk
[17:13] <thedac> FWIW I lean toward no src dir
[17:13] <tinwood> splitter
[17:13] <beisner> i'd like to see us list the distinct benefits of doing it really
[17:13]  * tinwood is sorry
[17:14] <beisner> other than it feels/looks better, naturally :)
[17:14] <gnuoy> yes, it does
[17:14] <tinwood> I'll add to the design doc on CI some points.
[17:14] <gnuoy> feels/looks better, I mean
[17:15] <beisner> from a devex perspective, having another method could be confusing
[17:15] <beisner> take the cephs
[17:15] <beisner> ceph-osd and ceph-mon are to be vanilla layers.  buildable as a charm and consumable as a layer.
[17:15] <beisner> but the ceph layer would be  src charm, with a diff dir structure
[17:15] <beisner> ie ceph layer not intended to be reconsumed as a layer
[17:16] <tinwood> Should the ceph-osd/ceph-mon be layers AND charms?
[17:16] <beisner> that's a good question.  the *can* be.   should they?
[17:16] <tinwood> i.e. another 'thing' that trivally consumes the ceph-osd layer to be the charm.
[17:17] <beisner> so charm-layer-ceph-osd with the guts, and a thin wrapper in charm-ceph-osd?
[17:17] <tinwood> possibly, although even that feels like a hack.
[17:17] <beisner> with the latter being a src charm
[17:18] <beisner> i think it's one or the other isn't it?
[17:18] <tinwood> yes
[17:19] <gnuoy> I don't feel that strongly tbh. I like the src dir because it means that files which are only used to build the charm do not pollute the built charm but *shrug*
[17:20] <thedac> My arguments against src dir are 1) We are artificially introducing the concept of "top layer"  2) Theoretical future need to consume "top layer" as a middle layer (cephs good example) 3) The developers of reactive and the first reactive charms don't use a src dir
[17:20] <beisner> i agree with that aesthetic benefit entirely
[17:20] <thedac> But I am certainly open to debate
[17:20] <gnuoy> I think point 2 could be argued both ways tbh
[17:21] <thedac> I am just publicly committing to my argument :)
[17:21] <gnuoy> If we don't want a top layer to be consuable the src dir is a good way to distinguish it.
[17:21] <gnuoy> I find the argument that the src charm is a layer a bit force tbh
[17:21] <beisner> it feels a bit like building a thing but then saying:  you can't extend or re-use it for some other currently unimagined purpose.
[17:22] <thedac> And my point is how can we know for certain now that some point in the future we will not want/have to consume a "top" layer again the cephs are good examples
[17:22] <tinwood> I'm not overly attached either way.
[17:23] <jamespage> I don't think using the src directory now precludes us from moving a charm to be a layer later...
[17:23] <beisner> true, git mv ftw
[17:23] <jamespage> at least that way we are making a explicit decision that a charm is now consumable as a layer...
[17:24] <thedac> That is the strongest point for src dir. That we are explicitly stating it is NOT supported as a layer
[17:24] <gnuoy> jamespage, please review the etiquette guidelines (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/OpenStackCharmsMeeting)
[17:24] <beisner> lolz
[17:25] <jamespage> ..
[17:25] <jamespage> oops lol
[17:25] <beisner> roflcopters
[17:25] <thedac> heh
[17:25] <gnuoy> Ok, I think we should plough on with the src dir but retain the right to change our minds
[17:25]  * tinwood lol
[17:25] <jamespage> +1
[17:26]  * thedac falls in line
[17:26] <jamespage> can we have a official vote on that?
[17:26] <tinwood> how do we vote?
[17:26] <gnuoy> we can but I don't know the meeting bot commans
[17:26] <gnuoy> * commands
[17:26] <jamespage> #vote
[17:26] <jamespage> #vote <subject>
[17:26] <coreycb> o/
[17:26] <jamespage> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology
[17:26] <gnuoy> #vote Having a src dir in top layer charms
[17:26] <meetingology> Please vote on: Having a src dir in top layer charms
[17:26] <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (for private voting, private message me with 'vote +1/-1/+0 #channelname)
[17:27] <jamespage> +1
[17:27] <meetingology> +1 received from jamespage
[17:27] <icey> +0
[17:27] <meetingology> +0 received from icey
[17:27] <thedac> +0
[17:27] <meetingology> +0 received from thedac
[17:27] <gnuoy> #voters all
[17:27] <meetingology> Everyone can now vote
[17:27] <tinwood> +1
[17:27] <meetingology> +1 received from tinwood
[17:27] <coreycb> +0
[17:27] <meetingology> +0 received from coreycb
[17:27] <beisner> yes, happy to pave the ci for both to 'just work' -- i only hold back for the future questions: "you did what?"
[17:27] <gnuoy> +1
[17:27] <meetingology> +1 received from gnuoy
[17:27] <beisner> +0
[17:27] <meetingology> +0 received from beisner
[17:28] <gnuoy> #votesrequired 3
[17:28] <meetingology> votes now need 3 to be passed
[17:28] <gnuoy> argh, I think we're done
[17:28] <gnuoy> #endvote
[17:28] <meetingology> Voting ended on: Having a src dir in top layer charms
[17:28] <meetingology> Votes for:3 Votes against:0 Abstentions:4
[17:28] <meetingology> Motion carried
[17:28] <jamespage> \o/
[17:28] <tinwood> \o/
[17:28] <thedac> :)
[17:28] <gnuoy> #topic Announce next meeting date, time and chair
[17:28] <gnuoy> jamespage, you#re down for next week, can you managed that, I know its late in the UK?
[17:29] <gnuoy> if not you can always swap I guess
[17:29] <gnuoy> Date 2016-06-15, same time, same place
[17:29] <beisner> comedians here today, jeez!
[17:29] <jamespage> I can
[17:29] <gnuoy> #endmeeting
[17:29] <meetingology> Meeting ended Wed Jun  8 17:29:24 2016 UTC.
[17:29] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2016/ubuntu-meeting.2016-06-08-17.00.moin.txt
[17:29] <beisner> thx gnuoy & thx all
[17:29] <coreycb> thanks gnuoy
[17:29] <icey> thanks!
[17:29] <thedac> thanks gnuoy
[17:29] <gnuoy> np
[17:30] <tinwood> thanks gnuoy
[17:30] <jamespage> thanks gnuoy
[17:30] <jamespage> ttfn


[04:46] <keisterstash> Hello, I'm a contributor to the netsniff-ng project and I would like to write Ubuntu documentation on it. How do I go about creating a community pages with installation instructions and examples?
[04:47] <keisterstash> this page isn't really helping me, am i missing something: https://help.ubuntu.com/community
[05:16] <Atamira> you should email the mailing list
[05:16] <Atamira> thats your best bet
[05:16] <Atamira> otherwise you might have to wait a while for a reply to your question
[05:17] <Atamira> and when i say a while, the last time anything was said in here was....nearly 3 days ago..heh
[05:18] <Atamira> uh, make that 6-7 days ago
[05:21] <keisterstash> k thx for the response
[06:11] <Flannel> keisterstash: The community section is a moin wiki, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/HelpForBeginners will get you started, with https://help.ubuntu.com/community/HelpOnEditing helping on actual markup syntax (I'm sure it's linked somewhere in the previous page)


[00:22] <cyberanger> man, why didn't I do this sooner https://help.ubuntu.com/community/InstallCDCustomization
[00:32] <wrst> cyberanger: you will be proud i'm terminal completely right now what does that do?
[00:35] <wrst> never mind cyberanger  i used links too just to make you happy
[00:58] <cyberanger> hehe
[00:58] <cyberanger> natty give you trouble?
[01:00] <wrst> natty is impossible at the moment for me, working on my desktop some
[01:01] <cyberanger> shame
[01:01] <wrst> yeah i'm sure it will get better, or i hope it does atleast
[01:14] <wrst> i'm installing arch on my desktop just in case
[01:46] <chibihogoshino> thats allot of work wrst
[01:53] <wrst> not really chibihogoshino i can have arch more or less running in a couple of hours, and i hate to have to roll back to 10.04 due to the old pacakges so just having my bases covered
[01:54] <chibihogoshino> why not just compile on top of ubuntu
[01:54] <wrst> compile what?
[01:55] <chibihogoshino> so you dont have to roll back
[01:55] <linuxman410> wrst u here
[01:55] <wrst> i'd rather not be running old packages with 10.04, and i fear natty may be a little squishy and i am not having great great luck with some parts of 10.10
[01:55] <wrst> hey linuxman410
[01:56] <linuxman410> wrst where did you get 800 meg cdr
[01:56] <wrst> didn't linuxman410 i'm using whatever stock is the 700 i guess
[01:57] <wrst> the last natty image i downloaded was 688MB but didn't do me much good as soon as i booted in i got kernel panic
[01:57] <linuxman410> i put a 700 in and tried to burn natty it said not enough room
[01:57] <wrst> which image did you download?
[01:57] <linuxman410> 32 bit
[01:58] <linuxman410> x86
[01:58] <linuxman410> it says it is 751 megs
[01:58] <wrst> you downloading the daily or the alpha linuxman410 ?
[01:59] <linuxman410> alpha
[01:59] <wrst> ok it is over sized
[01:59] <wrst> the daily builds aren't
[01:59] <wrst> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily/current/
[01:59] <linuxman410> that i what i am saying if it stays that big it will be on dvd
[01:59] <wrst> that gets you the alternate for some reason the live cd page isn't working
[02:00] <wrst> linuxman410: it won't the later images aren't that big check out the daily builds they have that fixed
[02:00] <wrst> they are releasing new images every day
[02:00] <wrst> there is a dvd download but its over a GB
[02:01] <linuxman410> so the live cd i have to burn to dvd to try out
[02:02] <wrst> if you do the alpha but if you download a daily you won't
[02:03] <linuxman410> how come last time alpha was not that big
[02:05] <wrst> there has only been one natty alpha it hink?
[02:05] <wrst> hmm that was strange
[02:07] <wrst> hey refactorcid3 :)
[02:08] <excid3|mbp> hey wrst :P
[02:08] <wrst> ha ha :)
[02:08] <wrst> good nick
[02:08] <excid3|mbp> I was fixing up a LOT of keryx code :P
[02:20] <wrst> :)
[02:50] <chibihogoshino> if you start a x program in ssh can you background it and reconnect later ?
[03:06] <wrst> chibihogoshino: that is way over my head :\
[03:06] <wrst> oh cyberanger
[06:58] <Juzzy> wtf did they move grub's menu.lst in 10.10? :/
[15:01] <wrst> cyberanger: troubles?
[15:06] <cyberanger> wrst: I'm very troubled
[15:07] <cyberanger> why do you ask?
[15:07] <wrst> just saw your disconnect... whats got you troubled?
[17:41] <cyberanger> wrst: oh, not much, just reconfiguring for SASL authentication
[17:41] <cyberanger> and it's not going smoothly
[18:05] <pace_t_zulu> chibihogoshino: ping
[18:27] <chibihogoshino> pace_t_zulu:  mmm ?
[18:28] <pace_t_zulu> chibihogoshino: nevermind ... i didn't seen that you were trying to do it with X
[18:28] <pace_t_zulu> i was going to suggest screen
[18:28] <pace_t_zulu> but that may work too
[18:28] <pace_t_zulu> for an X application
[18:29] <chibihogoshino> how would you push it into the background ?
[18:35] <wrst> cyberanger: if you are still using it shellium is back up
[18:37] <chibihogoshino> yeah. i still need to get approved for access
[18:37] <cyberanger> wrst: backup for what, SASL authentaction?
[18:38] <cyberanger> I still gotta configure shellium's clients for it (actually, scratch that, I won't be configuring that on shellum, I don't want passwords in files on that system)
[18:49] <pace_t_zulu> chibihogoshino:
[18:49] <chibihogoshino> :-)
[18:49] <pace_t_zulu> chibihogoshino: if you create a new screen session ... launch the program ... detach screen ... logout
[18:49] <pace_t_zulu> you can later login and attach the screen
[18:50] <pace_t_zulu> then you'd be back in the program...
[18:50] <pace_t_zulu> that should work... right?
[18:50] <chibihogoshino> ctl z to detach ?
[18:50] <chibihogoshino> how would you reconnect to the program in x ?
[18:51] <pace_t_zulu> [ctl] + [a] ... [ctl] + [d]
[18:51] <pace_t_zulu> will detach
[18:52] <pace_t_zulu> $ screen -S myScreen
[18:52] <pace_t_zulu> ^ create a screen
[18:52] <pace_t_zulu> $ screen -x myScreen
[18:52] <pace_t_zulu> ^ reattach screen
[18:53] <pace_t_zulu> [ctl] + [z] will terminate the screen
[18:54] <chibihogoshino> hmm
[18:56] <chibihogoshino> i detach the screen and the x window is still open
[18:58] <cyberanger> and if the X server goes down, the program can too
[18:58] <cyberanger> most will at least
[19:01] <pace_t_zulu> cyberanger: same is true for local access at the desktop
[19:01] <pace_t_zulu> if the xserver goes down
[19:03] <cyberanger> yep, so chibihogoshino the screen method won't work then
[19:04] <chibihogoshino> hmm..
[19:13] <pace_t_zulu> right because you are creating the display for the xserver when you connect
[20:53] <chibihogoshino> hmm..
[20:53] <chibihogoshino> didnt know that apt-get has tab completion
[22:55] <wrst> hello starsprout
[22:55] <cyberanger> hey starsprout
[22:57] <starsprout> hi guys! happy holi-days!
[22:57] <cyberanger> you too
[22:57] <starsprout> I finally registered my _true_ identity :-)
[22:58] <starsprout> starspot is dead
[23:00] <wrst> i am saddened at is passing starsprout
[23:00] <wrst> why hello infocop411
[23:00] <wrst> speaking of other identities
[23:01] <infocop411> hehe


[13:53] <digitaloktay> hi
[13:54] <digitaloktay> thx for locobot_1, in #ubuntu-tr turkish speaking channel :)
[15:10]  * Tm_T does the happy dance as an attempt to make himself happier
[15:16]  * erUSUL gives a free hug to Tm_T ahh and a box of chocolates the killer combo for sad days ( beer helps too but can result in hangover ;P)
[15:16] <Tm_T> nah, this snow rain already cheered me up (:)
[15:16] <Tm_T> but thanks
[15:18]  * erUSUL ... everyday is like Sunday everyday is silent and grey ...
[15:21] <Tm_T> snow <3
[15:39]  * h00k gives coffee to *
[15:40] <MenZa> Thanks, h00k
[15:40] <h00k> MenZa: you owe me :)
[15:40] <MenZa> Certainly do!
[15:41] <Tm_T> ...was about to make silly joke about how MenZa owes to everyone
[15:41] <h00k> it worked!
[15:41] <MenZa> :D
[15:45]  * niko moved his ubotufr to http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-fr/ubuntu-bots/ubotufr/revision/47
[15:51] <elleuca> Hi, I would ask for IRC cloak, here is my LP profile: https://launchpad.net/~elle.uca
[15:51] <erUSUL> !nicksetup | elleuca
[15:53] <jussi> niko: VorTechS staff et al, please cloak elleuca with an ubuntu/member cloak.
[15:54]  * Tm_T huggles jussi
[15:54] <jussi> elleuca: cangrats
[15:54] <niko> jussi: done
[15:54] <jussi> niko: thanks
[15:54] <Tm_T> elleuca: cangrats!
[15:54] <jussi> lol Tm_T
[15:55] <niko> and congrats elleuca :)
[15:55] <elleuca> jussi, Tm_T, niko (and everybody) thanks :)
[15:59] <erUSUL> recieved this in #ubuntu
[15:59] <erUSUL> 16:58 <Salid> Hi :) , A new channel #Linuxers on Dalnet is formed. Away from big and rushy channels. idea to build a small  community of friends. please join. OPS NEEDED. /server irc.dal.net
[16:00] <jussi> niko: can you deal with that?
[16:01] <erUSUL> he actually waited for me to respond ... so it is not a bot :)
[16:01] <jussi> erUSUL: yeah, he was active in #u-ot not so long ago, asking about the best language to write a virus for windows...
[16:07] <BetaBrain> buon giorno gente e buona domenica
[16:08] <BetaBrain> e possibile parlare con qualcuno  in riguardo al cloack?
[16:08] <BetaBrain> cè un operatore  disponibile?
[16:10] <jussi> BetaBrain: Hi, do you understand english?
[16:11] <BetaBrain> yes litle
[16:11] <jussi> BetaBrain: are you an ubuntu member?
[16:12] <BetaBrain> yes i menmber  to #ubuntu -it / ubuntu-it-chat
[16:12] <BetaBrain> *member
[16:12] <jussi> BetaBrain: do you have a launchpad page?
[16:12] <jussi> BetaBrain: I think you are after an unaffiliated cloak. you need to join #freenode and ask there.
[16:14] <BetaBrain> ok I better inform
[16:45] <BetaBrain> thanks to all staff will see you
[21:18] <m4v> ubuntu-eu logs always screws up special chars, they aren't saved in utf8
[21:31] <kobrien> hi, how do I ask the bot for all the factoids it knows?
[21:31] <guntbert> !askthebot | kobrien
[21:32] <kobrien> thanks
[21:32] <guntbert> !gender | kobrien btw
[21:32] <m4v> kobrien: or check the factoid db in ubottu.com
[21:33] <guntbert> m4v: thx for pointing that out - I always thought the website is in this factoid too
[21:33] <kobrien> excellent, thanks
[21:35] <m4v> guntbert: the link is in !ubottu
[21:35] <guntbert> m4v: and in !brain ....


[00:00] <Riddell> CheGuevara: hi
[00:00] <Riddell> stdin: mm, ok, I'll look at that tomorrow
[00:07] <CheGuevara> hi Riddell
[00:07] <CheGuevara> did you see my results with fontconfig yesterday/
[00:07] <Riddell> CheGuevara: nope, what happened?
[00:07] <CheGuevara> installing gutsy fontconfig-config
[00:08] <CheGuevara> fixes the ugly password dots
[00:08] <Riddell> to make them anti-aliased?
[00:08] <CheGuevara> and smaller
[00:09] <CheGuevara> no idea though what exactly changed the behaviour
[00:11] <CheGuevara> let me know if u want me to debug more
[00:14] <CheGuevara> also Riddell kde4 rc 2 packages seem to install KDE 4 .desktop entries to show in KDE 3
[00:14] <CheGuevara> don't know if thats intended though
[00:30] <CheGuevara> Riddell: another observation, the dots are fine in firefox
[03:05] <limac> hey anyone knows how to get wireless on kubuntu?
[09:35] <Lure> Riddell: new kdepim enterprise snapshot is in my PPA - running fine (no new regression) for POP and Disconnected IMAP for me
[09:35] <Lure> Riddell: they are in feture freeze now and will concentrate on bug fixing now
[09:35] <Lure> Riddell: [10:29] <vkrause> Bille: hi, Till and me retunred from foss.in yesterday and will concentrate on bugfixing this week
[09:36] <Lure> Riddell: would it make sense to have it also in gutsy-backports?
[09:52] <elisiano> hi everyone
[10:05] <Riddell> Lure: yeah, could do
[10:05] <Riddell> hi elisiano
[10:06] <Lure> Riddell: will you upload it for hardy?
[10:06] <Riddell> Lure: if you think it's good
[10:06] <elisiano> wow I'm excited, never talked to a famous developer, lol :)
[10:07] <Lure> Riddell: I think it is at least as good as what we already have (after 2 days of testing it myself with pop3 and disconnected imap)
[10:07] <Lure> Riddell: it would be good to get some users of scalix as this is new (I have added packaging) - I want to be sure it is properly packaged
[10:08] <Lure> elisiano: don't get scared, Riddell likes to talk with new people ;-)
[10:08]  * elisiano feels better
[10:08]  * Lure recalls how Riddell got him into fixing some bugs mysefl ;-)
[10:56] <buz> Lure: need testers of that snapshot? i only use online IMAP however
[10:56] <buz> disconnected imap reliably trashed mails for me
[11:13] <Riddell> Lure: kdepim_3.5.7enterprise20071207 ?
[11:13] <Riddell> Lure: shall we up the version to 3.5.8?
[11:13] <Riddell> or has upstream not done that
[11:14] <stdin> Riddell: I see why kdebase-runtime-bin-kde4 is trying to overwrite kdebase-bib. kwriteconfig, kdebugdialog, kstart and kreadconfig are the same name as in kdebase-bin, so the symlinks it makes in /usr/bin need a pre/suffix
[11:15] <allee> buz: create a test imap account and try disconnected imap again?
[11:15] <buz> well i could never quite reproduce it
[11:15] <allee> Lure: is imap known to be fixed or still broken?
[11:15] <buz> i just noticed that eventually, mails would vanish
[11:15] <buz> especially on crashes
[11:16] <buz> which arent that rare with kmail
[11:16] <allee> I'll try it later: Just noticed that when I sent out an meeting korganizer seem to assume that I entered the date in UTC :(
[11:17]  * allee suggests to announce kubuntu-devel meetings via ical attachment.  So this pim feature gets more testing ;)
[11:49] <Gular1> I've got a few questions about setting up an encrypted install manually  - anyone got ideas/knowledge?
[11:56] <Riddell> Gular1: user support in #ubuntu, #kubuntu
[11:58] <CheGuevara> Riddell, did you get everything i said yesterday? 'cause u magically disappeared :P
[12:17] <Lure> allee: disconnected impa works for me
[12:17] <Lure> allee: what is broken for you?
[12:18] <Gular1> Riddell: well, I do understand that, but the good folks in #kubuntu doesn't have the answer (I do try to answer a few questions there myself). Anyways, what I'd like to do is to install a encrypted (using dm-crypt and lvm) kubuntu system on a machine that already have windows on the first active partition. basically I'm just looking for directions for how I'd set up the partitioner manually, as "Guided - use entire disk and set up encrypted LVM" is n
[12:18] <Lure> Riddell: there were several merges with 3.5.8, but I did not get confirmation from #kontact people that this is now considered to be 3.5.8 based
[12:19] <Gular1> (ideally there should be an option in the installer that said "use remaining space on drive and set up encrypted system" ;)
[12:19] <Lure> buz: I am using disconnected imap on exchange 2003 and it did not loose e-mail for me for some time
[12:19] <Lure> buz: but I had it once in 3.5.5 times if I recall correctly
[12:31] <stdin> Hobbsee: don't know if you have or not, but you said to remind you to get meta-kde4 into universe, so I am
[12:31] <Hobbsee> stdin: oh, thanks!
[12:36]  * Hobbsee requests for it's demotion
[13:28] <Lure> Riddell, Hobbsee: since digikam 0.9.3-beta is already in debian/expirimental, can we use that version for merge (instead of old 0.9.2 suggested by MoM)?
[13:29] <Hobbsee> Lure: if you like.  i can't see why not
[13:30] <Lure> Hobbsee: 0.9.3 final should be released before our feature freeze, therefore it makes more sense to do merge there
[13:30] <Lure> Hobbsee: will probably look into this tonight
[13:30]  * Hobbsee nods
[14:30] <Riddell> CheGuevara: we seem to keep missing each other about this fontconfig issue
[14:32] <Riddell> stdin: do you have kdebase-bin-kde3 installed?
[14:32] <Riddell> kdebase-bin-kde3 will overlap with kdebase-runtime-bin-kde4
[14:32] <Riddell> but that should be ok
[14:33] <stdin> Riddell: kdebase-bin-kde3 doesn't exist, kdebase-bin-kde4 does but it's not installed
[14:33] <Riddell> stdin: oh, hrm
[14:34] <Riddell> stdin: I guess adding kdebase from hardy to your ppa would be the thing to do
[14:35] <stdin> ok
[15:26] <buz> Lure: that sounds about right for the time frame of my loss
[15:26] <buz> these days i just run dovecot locally :P
[15:26] <buz> kmail then fetches mails from remote imap, does spamfiltering and stores the good mails on dovecot
[15:27] <Lure> buz: I recall some disconnected imap fixes and new kde4 version even have a warning when you configure disconnected imap in which cases you may get "suprises"
[15:50] <Artemis_Fowl> hi. i am developing a KDE4 app that need root privileges in order to access some files (/boot/grub/menu.lst && /boot/grub/device.map && /etc/mtab) all of which can ba accessed only by root
[15:50] <Artemis_Fowl> which is the best way to ask for the user to insert the password using KDEsu ib?
[15:50] <Artemis_Fowl> lib*
[15:53] <Riddell> Artemis_Fowl: to run the whole app as root add X-KDE-SubstituteUID=true to the app
[15:53] <Riddell> better is running another app to do the root bits, which could be setuid root
[15:53] <Riddell> it's a #kde4-devel question anyway
[15:54] <Artemis_Fowl> first of all I just asked there but got no answer
[15:54] <Artemis_Fowl> secondly, isnt there any way to implement this task (asking root password) through my app's code?
[15:55] <Riddell> Artemis_Fowl: why would you need to?
[15:55] <Riddell> you can run kdesu something
[15:56] <Artemis_Fowl> example: the user runs the application without root password. However the app NEEDS the password in order to access this files (all it does is this)
[15:57] <Artemis_Fowl> so the app should ask for password in order to continue
[15:57] <Riddell> a process can't raise its own privilages
[15:57] <Riddell> it would need to start another app to do the root bits
[15:57] <Riddell> for example gdebi-kde runs itself as root when it needs to install the package
[15:58] <Artemis_Fowl> so you propose that I create two executable files one of which will do the root work after the first one requests her to do so?
[15:58] <Riddell> Artemis_Fowl: yes
[15:59] <Artemis_Fowl> ok. seems neat.
[16:00] <Artemis_Fowl> in all of the app's previous versions, the app re-run itself when it had no root password and was really hard to debug...
[16:01] <Riddell> Lure: uploading 4:3.5.7enterprise20071207-1ubuntu1~ppa~lure3
[16:01] <Lure> Riddell: hopefully without ~ppa~lure3 ;-)
[16:01] <Artemis_Fowl> thx. bb
[16:02] <Riddell> Lure: I thought the version number wasn't long enough so I kept that :)
[16:02] <Lure> Riddell: next time at least add ~riddell~was~here ;-)
[16:02] <Hobbsee> hahaa
[16:03] <Hobbsee> ~with~extra~long~pointy~stick~of~doom~flavoring
[16:44] <DaSkreech> Riddell: so far I've been through all the drivers for this chipset and they all freeze when I get a tooltip from the taskbar
[16:44] <DaSkreech> so it's not the driver
[16:44] <DaSkreech> I've only had one freeze not associated with a tooltip
[17:25] <DaSkreech> Hmm can the Konqueror media player play wav files?
[17:25] <jpatrick> installing libxine1-ffmpeg?
[17:29] <DaSkreech> jpatrick: no go
[17:30] <Riddell> "the Konqueror media player"?
[17:30] <Riddell> pretty much anything can play .wav files
[17:30] <DaSkreech> F9 -> Media player
[17:30] <DaSkreech> This can't
[17:30] <DaSkreech> it recognizes it as a media file
[17:30] <DaSkreech> (it doesn't throw a not a media file error) but doesn't make any attempt to play it
[17:31] <jpatrick> what kpart is it of?
[17:33] <morr> i guess amarok
[17:41] <DaSkreech> no
[17:42] <DaSkreech> Jsomething if I recall
[17:42] <DaSkreech> libarts1-mpeglib
[17:45] <CheGuevara> ping Riddell
[17:47] <Riddell> hi CheGuevara
[17:47] <CheGuevara> i finally catch you :P
[17:48] <CheGuevara> here's what i said yesterday
 fixes the ugly password dots
 to make them anti-aliased?
 and smaller
 no idea though what exactly changed the behaviour
 let me know if u want me to debug more
 also Riddell kde4 rc 2 packages seem to install KDE 4 .desktop entries to show in KDE 3
[17:48] <DaSkreech> Che!!
 don't know if thats intended though
[17:48] <CheGuevara> lol
[17:48] <CheGuevara> i am alive!
[17:48] <sebas> It is intended.
[17:49] <CheGuevara> oh right
[17:49] <CheGuevara> its just most of them don't show their icons
[17:49] <CheGuevara> so it looks fugly :P
[17:50] <sebas> Otherwise GTK apps wouldn't show up in the menu
[17:50] <Riddell> CheGuevara: so it goes back to being unable to draw the password circle character and falls back on the alternate character
[17:51] <Riddell> yes, it's intended to have KDE 4 apps in the normal menu, KDE 4 should integrate as well as anything
[17:53] <CheGuevara> Riddell: I am honestly not sure what happens exactly
[17:54] <CheGuevara> interesting question would be if its the new version of fontconfig that does it or the ubuntu patches
[17:57] <CheGuevara> looking at the change log the only relevant thing i can see is prefer "Standard Symbols L" as symbol font
[17:57] <CheGuevara> to fix #37745
[18:00] <CheGuevara> actually
[18:00] <CheGuevara> thats been there since Dapper :P
[18:04] <CheGuevara> but as I said Riddell I am not really sure which step to take next in getting to the bottom of this, so let me know
[18:07] <Riddell> I'm not sure either
[18:07] <Riddell> fontconfig is quite a mystery
[18:08] <CheGuevara> heh
[18:08] <CheGuevara> this will have to be fixed eventually though
[18:08] <CheGuevara> 'cause its a LTS release and this is a noticable reqgression
[18:08] <CheGuevara> another question would be does say GDM show the same issue
[18:09] <Riddell> let's not get too excited about LTS
[18:09] <Riddell> I doubt it does affect gtk or qt 4
[18:11] <CheGuevara> heh am not really, i like to use bleeding edge so LTS is no excitement for me :P
[18:11] <CheGuevara> i could file a bug against fontconfig and let them hanle it
[18:14] <CheGuevara> theres #174229
[18:14] <CheGuevara> not sure if its the same
[18:15] <Riddell> bug 174229
[18:15] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 174229 in fontconfig "[hardy] fonts smaller after update" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/174229
[18:16] <CheGuevara> mentions QT, but it could just be that QT 3 apps font rendering is messed for ubuntu users
[18:17] <CheGuevara> if i can figure out how to make my system actually use kdm from kde4 then i could see if its there also
[18:18] <Riddell> I doubt there's anything special about kdm, use kdialog --password
[18:18] <CheGuevara> ah
[18:18] <CheGuevara> i didn't think of that :P
[18:20] <CheGuevara> let me just install the latest updates and i'll go into kde 4
[18:35] <yevgen> Is there any issues updating to Hardy Alpha with apt-get/aptitude?
[18:35] <yevgen> Or it is better to download and install it from ISO?
[18:56] <CheGuevara> right brb
[18:58] <CheGuevara> god xchat is ugly in kde 4 :P
[18:59] <CheGuevara> yep Riddell the password dots are nice and anti-aliased in KDE 4
[19:09] <Riddell> stdin: new kde4libs, kdepimlibs, kdebase-runtime, kdebase-kde4 and kdebase-workspace in hardy
[19:09] <Riddell> also kdeedu-kde4
[19:11] <CheGuevara> in kde4-meta now in hardy?
[19:11] <Riddell> not sure where it's gone
[19:13] <CheGuevara> yep its there
[19:13] <CheGuevara> there = universe
[19:14] <CheGuevara> though https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/hardy-changes/2007-December/002995.html says main :P
[19:15] <CheGuevara> and it don't work as well
[19:15] <CheGuevara> The following packages have unmet dependencies.
[19:15] <CheGuevara>   kde4: Depends: kde4-amusements (>= 1.0) but it is not going to be installed
[19:15] <CheGuevara> :P
[19:34] <stdin> Riddell: don't see a new -runtime and -workspace yet, I'm uploading the rest
[19:39] <Riddell> stdin: ok no new -runtime , -workspace I just reuploaded
[19:39] <Riddell> stdin: would you be able to upload them to your ppa as hardy as well?  I fear that universe is just too slow to build from
[19:40] <stdin> Riddell: I guess that should be simple :)
[19:43] <Riddell> stdin: kdegames-kde4 also up now
[19:43]  * stdin multi-tasks
[19:46] <bddebian> Hehya
[19:49] <ScottK> Hi there bddebian
[19:49] <bddebian> Heya ScottK
[19:51] <X2B> Hello everybody. I was here about a week ago because I had some problems concerning kmilo and surround systems. Does anyone remember me? I wrote a patch for kmilo applying to the kdeutils 3.5.8 package. If anyone is interested in it I would be happy to give it to you.
[19:54] <Riddell> X2B: what does the patch do?
[19:57] <X2B> WEll, it adds some lines so that the dcop call also applies to the rear speakers
[20:03] <CheGuevara> X2B: have you tried submiting it upstream?
[20:04] <X2B> Well, lets say that I don't know so much about how that stuff usually works... I would do whatever you want with it...
[20:08] <Riddell> CheGuevara: upstream isn't maintained and we fork it quite a bit
[20:08] <Riddell> X2B: sure, put the patch on a web server somewhere
[20:09] <X2B> And where is somewhere? I don't even know if that is a kde-devel oder kubuntu-devel issue
[20:17] <CheGuevara> oh right sorry Riddell
[20:18] <CheGuevara> X2B: DCC it to me and i'll upload it on my server if u want
[20:19] <bddebian> Wow, murderous dicatators now work on Ubuntu, nice :-)
[20:19] <ScottK> bddebian: ??
[20:20] <ScottK> Oh, him?   (Godwin's law in record time) :-)
[20:23] <CheGuevara> lol comparing Che and Hitler is like comparing Bill and Linus :P
[20:23] <bddebian> Ah right, Che only locked up the gays, not gassed/burned them eh?
[20:25] <ScottK> bddebian: It's totally different.  One was successful and one wasn't.
[20:25] <CheGuevara> bddebian, we're talking about 60s here
[20:26] <CheGuevara> may be you should remember what was happening to blacks in ur own country
[20:26] <CheGuevara> :P
[20:27] <bddebian> And that makes it right?
[20:27] <CheGuevara> no
[20:27] <CheGuevara> its times
[20:27] <CheGuevara> times change
[20:27] <CheGuevara> what wasn't right once is right now
[20:27] <CheGuevara> for better or for worse
[20:28] <ScottK> Yes, but not really relevant to this case.
[20:28] <bddebian> I don't see too many people "hero worshipping" many KKK leaders
[20:28] <ScottK> IMO, Che was wrong then fighting to move things from bad to worse, but probably enough about that.
[20:28] <CheGuevara> neither is comparing a socialist revolutionary with a nazi
[20:29] <Tm_T> hmmm
[20:29] <Tm_T> CheGuevara: thanks for hilighting
[20:29] <CheGuevara> hmm?
[20:30] <Tm_T> "nazi" is in my hilight list ;)
[20:30] <CheGuevara> lol
[20:30] <stdin> yeah, and mine :p
[20:31] <CheGuevara> X2B: ur patch just arrived
[20:31] <Tm_T> that reminds me, I'm sort of collecting old DDR stuff :p
[20:33] <CheGuevara> Riddell or anyone else http://tvu.org.ru/kmilo.patch
[20:38] <ScottK> CheGuevara: Che wasn't a socialist, he was a dedicated Communist and the practical distinction between that and the other group I won't say because so many people highlight on the word is really just a matter of detail.
[20:41] <Riddell> CheGuevara: that's X2B's patch?
[20:41] <CheGuevara> true, he's a marxist
[20:41] <CheGuevara> Riddell, aye
[20:42] <CheGuevara> too bad communism is not possible in the corrent world though :P
[20:42] <CheGuevara> *current
[20:42] <stdin> Riddell: I still don't see a new -runtime, still on -1ubuntu3
[20:45] <Riddell> X2B: does this work with 2 speaker systems?
[20:45] <Riddell> stdin: no new -runtime
[20:45] <stdin> Riddell: ah, thought you said there was a new one along with -workspace
[20:47] <Riddell> stdin: I did, but I was wrong :)
[20:48] <stdin> heh, ok :) it's a good job you don't get build failure messages from ppa, because you'd be about to get a flood
[20:49] <Riddell> stdin: why?
[20:50] <stdin> just because I forgot to change one of the build-deps to use backport release
[20:50] <_StefanS_> hi..
[20:51] <_StefanS_> anyone tried that konqueror looses its association with folders ?
[20:51] <stdin> "libsoprano-dev (>= 1.98.0~rc1-1)" and it has 1.98.0~rc1-1~gutsy1~ppa1
[20:51] <_StefanS_> and I'm kinda lost at restoring it.. dpkg-reconfigure doesnt do it..
[20:52] <_StefanS_> thats on gutsy after upgrading from feisty
[20:55] <_StefanS_> really odd..
[20:56] <stdin> shouldn't dolphin be associated with directories when you upgrade > gutsy?
[20:59] <_StefanS_> well yes, but I removed it, and konqueror takes over
[20:59] <_StefanS_> it works fine on my 4 machines
[20:59] <_StefanS_> stdin: however this is a friends machine, and I dont know what  he did
[20:59] <stdin> try setting it manually, from konqueror's settings
[20:59] <stdin> !dolphin
[20:59] <ubotu> Dolphin, or more properly D3lphin, is the new default file manager for Kubuntu 7.10 Gutsy Gibbon. If you would like to make Konqueror your default file manager again, go to Konqueror - Settings menu - Configure Konqueror - File Associations and change the association for inode/directory and inode/system_directory to Konqueror at the top rather than Dolphin.
[20:59] <stdin> using those instructions it should work
[21:00] <_StefanS_> ah cool
[21:00] <_StefanS_> thanks
[21:03] <_StefanS_> stdin: somehow k3b had taken over all those associations.. dont ask me how ;)
[21:03] <stdin> well, that's not right :p
[21:06] <_StefanS_> stdin: well I wont break my head with it ;) - it works now
[21:09] <allee> Lure: about kdepim: add event to calendar.  RMB and 'sent icalender'.  When you look at the e-mail in kmail start/end time are both 1 hour off  (that's my GMT offset).  I consider this a bug. At least I've don't added event times as UTC in korganizer
[21:11] <Lure> allee: that really looks strange...
[21:12] <Lure> allee: best to ask people in #kontact
[21:12] <allee> Lure: I'll try your latest pkg before going to #kontact ...
[21:13] <Lure> allee: I just reproduced with latest package
[21:13] <Lure> ;-)
[21:13] <allee> k
[22:06] <asc> hello :)
[22:07] <CheGuevara> hi
[22:09] <asc> ee. i forgot that i am not ubuntu user, becouse i have debian sid installed now :D but maybe it will be useful for me to come in Developer meeting at wednesday?
[22:11] <stdin> it's not a developer meeting as such, but you're welcome to join us :)
[22:11] <Tm_T> sure
[22:11] <asc> ok, thanks :)
[22:11] <asc> i thinks bug catching and packaging is interesting :)
[22:11] <asc> bye!
[22:11] <jpatrick> asc: later
[22:33] <TheFluffyOne> I've raised a bug for a small issue with System Settings on Gutsy (https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/175383) -- would anyone be kind enough to verify I'm not just being an idiot? :)
[22:33] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 175383 in kde-systemsettings "System Settings app doesn't honour icon launch settings" [Undecided,New]
[22:39] <stdin> TheFluffyOne: this has always been, I'm not 100% sure it's a bug but I guess I can confirm the behaviour
[22:56] <TheFluffyOne> stdin: Thanks. It's different behaviour to the rest of the KDE interface IMO so I'd class it as a bug, but I guess that's a matter of opinion :)
[22:57] <stdin> it's just that it's always been that way, so I'm not sure. but that behaviour is definitely there
[23:00] <TheFluffyOne> Understood. We'll see what response I get to the bug, if any :)


[00:52] <Newk> anyone successfully recovered accidental deleted files from /home/username   ...that is in ext4 filesystem ?
[00:54] <Newk> i am now getting some files back with the photorec program but its a huge amount since it gets all from /
[00:55] <Newk> and they are not stored like they where in path but all scattered amoung several recovery folders with cryptic names
[01:02] <Newk> i tried the extundelete program but it seems to fail recovering anything
[01:03] <Newk> (yes i am not running on that system root and do from a liveUSB as to not damage the data further
[01:04] <Newk> this is a pretty shitty x-mas for me.. lots of data lost from my home folder :(
[03:22] <deitarion> Does anyone know a way to alter the default mount options? The automounter is playing merry hell with various scripts on thumbdrives because some genius thought it'd make sense to mount with "showexec" so only windows executables like *.exe, *.com, *.bat get the execute bit on vfat filesystems.
[04:39] <holstein> deitarion: i would look in the file manager settings.. you just dont want automouting?
[04:40] <deitarion> holstein: No, I want automounting but I want to revert the change which added "showexec" to the default mount options for vfat filesystems.
[04:42] <deitarion> If that's not possible, I guess I'll go looking for an alternative automount backend.
[04:43] <holstein> i would just disable auto mount and mount as you want/need it to be
[04:48] <deitarion> Is it possible to change the mount options if I manually mount  via PCManFM's places sidebar? ...because even that's a hassle compared to sticking a thumbdrive in, doing something in the terminal, and then only opening a PCManFM window just to hit "eject".
[04:50] <holstein> deitarion: i like thunar... pcmanfm is open, so anything is possible...
[04:50] <deitarion> I can't stand Thunar because the devs are insistent it'll never get tabs.
[04:52] <holstein> deitarion: im just saying, i use thunar.. so i cant give you a first hand way to deal with you issue in pcmanFM.. though if there is a filemanager that does more what you are looking for by default, you might consider it
[04:53] <deitarion> PCManFM is the best possible option. Before standards left it behind, Konqueror 3.5 was superior, but Konqueror 4.x is greatly inferior. (Apparently because it's bitrotting aside from minimal support patching by the KHTML devs)
[04:55] <deitarion> I suppose I'll have to see if there's a way to feed mount options to umount (the automount backend) aside from via PCManFM and, if there isn't, replace it with something like devmon.
[04:56] <deitarion> (The guy who forked the old PCManFM 0.5.x codebase to produce SpaceFM also maintains a modular set of replacements for the udisks-centric family automounting components)
[04:57] <deitarion> s/family/family of/
[05:37] <Ahmuck> is possible to upgrade from 10.04 to 11.04 ?
[05:38] <Ahmuck> or 10.04 to 12.04 ?
[05:42] <Ahmuck> nm, tengo
[05:45] <Ahmuck> tienes canal espanola?
[05:51] <holstein> !sp | Ahmuck
[05:51] <holstein> !es
[05:52] <holstein> Ahmuck: you can upgrade from normal releases to the next one up.. and you can go from LTS to LTS... so, you can go 10.04 to 12.04
[05:52] <Ahmuck> si, entiendo
[05:52] <holstein> i always download the live CD and test anyways.. and i have my data backed up regardless.. i find it easier to just reinstall
[05:52] <Ahmuck> same here
[05:53] <Ahmuck> but i am going to try the upgrade
[05:53] <Ahmuck> i don't want to do a fresh install unless i have to
[05:53] <holstein> Ahmuck: it'll work.. i just find it easier
[05:53] <Ahmuck> looks like there is not an optiong to upgrade release by release however as there is a release missing on the download site
[05:54] <Ahmuck> so i am going from lts to lts
[05:54] <holstein> Ahmuck: well, 10.10 is EOL afaik
[05:54] <holstein> might be from supported release to supported release
[05:55] <holstein> Ahmuck: there are archives of everything and everything is open.. if you want to upgraded to 10.10, you can.. its just not likely easy.. and its EOL
[09:43] <joel2> hi, I broke my lubuntu desktop yesterday
[09:44] <joel2> so I'll go through what happens when I try to log in and what I did to break it
[09:45] <joel2> When I try to log in, the laptop monitor goes black. Even the backlight dies. I've created another user though, from which I'm able to write this. So I'm confident that the error is specific to a single user.
[09:46] <joel2> I did do some configuration just before it happened. I edited shortcuts using http://code.google.com/p/obkey/
[09:49] <joel2> Since then, the previous ~/.config/openbox/lubuntu-rc.xml has been restored, but I'm thinking there may be some other file
[09:49] <joel2> What do you think?
[15:20] <Ahmuck> i need to reset my menu bar to default
[15:20] <Ahmuck> do i delete a . file