[02:51] -SwissBot:#xubuntu-devel- ::xubuntu-seed:: desktop: Drop dependency adwaita-icon-theme-full @ http://git.launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/ubuntu-seeds/+git/xubuntu/commit/?id=4cd79836183b5465e785fc694ea748eee5ce6e94 (by Sean Davis)
[03:04] <bluesabre> Related to https://hexchat.github.io/news/2.16.2.html ... should we drop hexchat in noble?
[03:05] <bluesabre> Also of note, thunderbird may be switching to snap-by-default in noble: https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/thunderbird-beta-snap-built-from-source-call-for-testing-and-next-steps-for-noble/42294
[03:07] <bluesabre> Flutter installer progress continues... we now have our installer on snapcraft. Going to hopefully test and get some bug reports submitted this week. https://snapcraft.io/xubuntu-installer
[03:25] <bluesabre> Will https://gitlab.xfce.org/xfce/xfce4-settings/-/tags/xfce4-settings-4.18.4 be packaged in debian, or should we just pull it in for Xubuntu?
[04:35] <JackFrost> #2
[04:36] <JackFrost> I couldn't remember if we needed -settings or -session. :P


[00:34] <guiverc> ack & happy to krytarik (ML)
[00:43] <krytarik> guiverc: So I'll add you to the owner lists of ubuntu-news@ and ubuntu-news-team@ when I'm next logged in to them.. you can PM me your preferred email address for this, while I'll PM you the shared passwords..


[05:40] <NCommander> wgrant: ping?
[05:42] <wgrant> NCommander: Hi
[05:42] <NCommander> wgrant: so I was trying to use the raw-installer custom upload to publish squashfs into installer-arch into the dist folder
[05:42] <NCommander> Obviously it didn't work, and since you've noticed it, I suspect I broke something else in LP
[05:43] <wgrant> Yaeh
[05:43] <wgrant> If you're going to commit such evil, perhaps give us a headsup first :)
[05:43] <wgrant> raw-installer is barely tested to work in PPAs at all, let alone at that scale.
[05:44]  * NCommander gulps
[05:44] <NCommander> What did I hose >.>;
[05:45] <NCommander> (raw-installer generally works with d-i, guess I broke the world somewhat more)
[05:47] <wgrant> NCommander: https://oops.canonical.com/oops.py/?oopsid=OOPS-8a6501691b7c6ada250ac4ab32b1ee69
[05:47] <ubot5`> https://lp-oops.canonical.com/oops.py/?oopsid=8a6501691b7c6ada250ac4ab32b1ee69
[05:48] <wgrant> NCommander: I'm not quite sure why it's crashing like that, but it's probably something evil in your tarball
[05:48] <NCommander> wgrant: oh, that was the first one
[05:49] <NCommander> The code is hardcoded to attempt to try and extract installer-$ARCH
[05:49] <NCommander> FIrst attempt had livecd-$ARCH, and I thought it merely published nothing
[05:49] <NCommander> THe second attempt had the folder right, and then nothing showed up so I ran away quickly :-)
[05:51]  * NCommander decides it *might* be easier to setup a local LP instance to test and abuse this less I bring the wrath of the Soyuz devs upon me
[05:51] <StevenK> NCommander: All three Soyuz devs share a timezone now, too ....
[05:51] <NCommander> but fortunately, there an ocean away from me; gives me plenty of time to hide :-)
[05:51] <bigjools>  =:o
[05:51] <NCommander> *their
[05:53] <NCommander> Might be easier to simply implement a new custom upload type but I think it might cause someone to maul me
[05:58] <StevenK> NCommander: Still in AKL?
[05:58] <NCommander> Migrated back to OR after a check engine light and other concerns forced me to call it quits
[05:58]  * NCommander did accomplish everything on the TODO list except the Dempster Highway
[05:59] <NCommander> more annoyingly, the error codes cleared themselves once I was about halfway back to Oregon, but I have that nasty feeling I'm looking at transmission failure sooner rather than later
[06:01]  * StevenK rejects NCommander's uploads with prejudice.
[06:02] <StevenK> NCommander: What do you drive?
[06:02]  * NCommander hasn't uploaded anything to the archive in awhile
[06:02] <NCommander> StevenK: 2007 Hyundai Tucson
[06:02] <NCommander> 2WD, but it gets excellent mileage and is decent on washboard roads (and arctic tundra)
[06:03] <StevenK> NCommander: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subaru_Legacy_%28fifth_generation%29 is what Sarah and I drive.
[06:03] <NCommander> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyundai_Tucson - me
[06:03] <StevenK> Yeah, I found that already
[06:03] <NCommander> Hilariously, in NYC, when I park the damn thing, I get the compact discount, and the SUV surcharge
[06:03] <StevenK> NCommander: Your PPA uploads are what I rejected.
[06:04] <NCommander> Wait, what?
[06:04] <NCommander> What queue did they end up in?
[06:04] <StevenK> ACCEPTED
[06:04] <NCommander> ...
[06:04] <NCommander> I *really* broke LP
[06:04] <StevenK> PPA uploads are automatically accepted
[06:04] <wgrant> And crashing doesn't autoreject
[06:05] <wgrant> Since it usually indicates an LP bug.
[06:05] <StevenK> Right
[06:05] <NCommander> So LP got stuck in an infinite loop?
[06:05] <StevenK> It will try and process the queue, hit your upload, crash and die.
[06:05] <wgrant> It tried to reprocess them a couple of hundred times yesterday
[06:05] <wgrant> Just makes things a bit slower.
[06:06] <StevenK> Oh, that's right, it will just skip your PPA
[06:06] <StevenK> NCommander: Auto or manual?
[06:06] <NCommander> auto unfortunately
[06:06] <StevenK> Hah
[06:06] <NCommander> Parents wouldn't co-sign the loan unless it was something they could drive
[06:06] <StevenK> NCommander: Said Legacy (which is sold in .au as 'Liberty') is 6 speed manual 4WD
[06:07] <NCommander> Bah
[06:07] <NCommander> Damn you and your stickshift
[06:07] <ScottK> Wait.
[06:07] <StevenK> NCommander: If you tried to drive it, you'd end up banging your hand into the door handle from muscle memory
[06:07] <ScottK> You took and automatic to Alaska?
[06:08] <NCommander> ScottK: semi-automatic
[06:08] <StevenK> ScottK: He's brave and/or stupid.
[06:08] <NCommander> P-R-N-D-1-2-3-4
[06:08] <NCommander> (with 1-4 being sequential)
[06:08] <NCommander> so I can gear down/up like a stick but no clutch :-/
[06:08] <ScottK> That's an automatic.
[06:09] <NCommander> http://goo.gl/maps/m2YDl - (route I drove going up)
[06:10] <StevenK> "This route crosses through Canada."
[06:10] <StevenK> Hahaa
[06:10] <StevenK> You pretty much have no choice, though?
[06:10] <ScottK> It's that or a boat.
[06:10] <StevenK> Right
[06:11] <StevenK> No so much fun driving on a boat
[06:11] <bigjools> that's a long way
[06:11] <ScottK> Depends on how big it is and how many people are walking around on the vehicle deck.
[06:12] <NCommander> THere is the Alaska Martime System from Bellingham, WA to southern Alaska
[06:12] <NCommander> But the prices make an international business class fair look cheap
[06:17] <NCommander> wgrant: honest opinion, if I wanted to build livefs's on the buildds would you say the 'raw-installer' custom upload is approiate, or I should create a new one (or some pre-existing one somewhere)? (I think raw-installer does some managing of the "current" directory in installer-*)
[06:18] <wgrant> NCommander: I'd create a new one. Do they even need to be published to the archive?
[06:18] <NCommander> wgrant: I was thinking a PPA would do the trick
[06:19] <wgrant> NCommander: I'd go with something like translations-static, where you pull the files down through the API
[06:20] <NCommander> wgrant: infinity was working on modifying LP that buildd-* could accept a job from ubuntu-cdimage, but my mental thought was it isn't hard to generate it via PPA. I did need a little bit of voodoo though to get livecd.sh to run in a PPA
[06:20]  * NCommander was trying to figure out a proof of concept before I broke the world
[06:21] <ScottK> Interesting concept of time you have.
[06:21] <ScottK> "Before"
[06:21] <NCommander> then when we need to respin a squashfs, nusaken can generate the stub source package, fire it into a PPA, and poke liblaunchpad to see "has it built yet?" then download
[06:21] <StevenK> ScottK: NCommander saying he broke the world was a common occurance on the Ubuntu Mobile weekly calls.
[06:22] <ScottK> You'd think he'd have learned by now.
[06:22]  * NCommander upgraded from breaking the world to merely breaking davidm
[06:22] <StevenK> NCommander: ITYM nusakan
[06:22] <NCommander> but, just for the record, you guys suck :-P
[06:23] <ScottK> NCommander: We aren't the one that drove to Alaska with an automatic transmission.
[06:24] <NCommander> eh, that's not the crazist thing I ever did
[06:24] <ScottK> Color me not surprised.
[06:24]  * NCommander only notes now that he's digging himself deeper
[06:24] <StevenK> NCommander: Dig up, stupid.
[06:24] <ScottK> Or at the very least stop.
[06:27] <NCommander> WIth friends like you, who the heck needs enemies :-P
[06:28]  * ScottK misread that last word at first and thougth things had taken a seriously weird turn.
[06:30]  * NCommander doesn't want to know what ScottK read
[06:30] <ScottK> For once, you're right.
[06:31] <bigjools> haha
[06:31] <StevenK> I can guess, and I don't like it.
[06:33] <bigjools> ok, how do I get vi in busybox
[06:33] <NCommander> bigjools: its a compile time option
[06:33] <bigjools> arse
[06:33] <NCommander> bigjools: its possible its there but no symlink
[06:33] <bigjools> doesn't help with my current busybox shell then!
[06:34] <NCommander> try busybox vi
[06:34] <bigjools> applet not found
[06:34] <NCommander> I believe ed is standard in busybox though
[06:34] <bigjools> not in this one!
[06:34] <NCommander> bigjools: what are you trying to fix?
[06:34]  * NCommander *might* have a statically linked busybox handy
[06:35] <bigjools> I am booting off a usb stick so I can edit the password file a box
[06:35] <bigjools> on a*
[06:35] <NCommander> Oh
[06:35] <NCommander> That's easier
[06:35] <NCommander> chroot *mnt directory* /bin/bash
[06:35] <NCommander> export TERM=vt100
[06:35] <NCommander> nano /etc/passwd
[06:35] <bigjools> I wonder if in-target will work
[06:35] <wgrant> bigjools: Why not just use GRUB to do that?
[06:36] <wgrant> This isn't Windows :)
[06:36]  * NCommander rather do it from an EFI shell :-P
[06:36] <bigjools> that assumes that I can get into grub
[06:36] <bigjools> got away with no editor
[06:37] <NCommander> is the file malformed or just forgotten password?
[06:37] <bigjools> chroot did it, why did I not do that earlier when I thought of it ...
[06:37] <bigjools> it's a maas-installed juju node where something went wrong in cloud-init
[06:38] <bigjools> thx for tip NCommander
[06:39]  * NCommander would hope that a juju wouldn't bring pain and destruction to innocent installation
[06:39] <NCommander> ^s
[06:39] <ScottK> Interesting theory.
[06:39] <bigjools> well it's supposed to add an ssh key... but failed
[06:40] <NCommander> .... How do you go from add an ssh key to OMG BROKEN /etc/passwd O_O;
[06:40] <bigjools> it's not broken
[06:40] <cody-somerville> Why do you want to upload the squashfs to an archive instead of to the librarian?
[06:40] <bigjools> I am addingt a password
[06:40] <bigjools> so I can ssh in
[06:40]  * cody-somerville is still baffled that you guys want to use launchpad buildds instead of using openstack cloud + juju or whatever.
[06:41] <NCommander> cody-somerville: mostly because I didn't consider uploading to librarian.
[06:41] <NCommander> cody-somerville: generally speaking, I rather used tried and tested tools for critical infrastructure until they've had some time to bake :-)
[06:42] <NCommander> Also, openstack is very x86 only ATM
[06:43] <cody-somerville> I'm not sure how the new code you're writing to add support for this in Launchpad is tried and tested vs. OpenStack
[06:44] <cody-somerville> and IIUC, Linaro 'cross-builds' their ARM images on x86 (but I might be mistaken on that)
[06:44] <cody-somerville> Plus, there is also MAAS.
[06:44] <NCommander> cody-somerville: only new code I'm writing is a publishing method into Launchpad. In addition, I don't want to spawn multiple sets of infrastructure we have to maintain
[06:45] <cody-somerville> lol. Tell me about it. If you guys do implement this, I'm going to have to add support to Offspring to be able to use the launchpad buildd farm
[06:45] <cody-somerville> not looking forward to that
[06:45] <NCommander> As it stands we have to maintain a seperate set of buildds for live images, and another (much larger) set for package builds. OpenStack doesn't really solve the problem I want to solve
[06:47] <cody-somerville> That's a fair point.
[06:47] <NCommander> In addition, then the machiens used for liveFS builds can migrate into the builder pool, and add more ARM and PowerPC hardware
[06:49] <bigjools> of course it helps if I didn't try and ssh into the BMC
[06:54] <NCommander> cody-somerville: actually, I don't want to publish to librarian. Being able to simply wget squashfs's makes life easier when I'm tinkering with a local CD image build vs. having to deal with launchpadlib
[06:55] <cody-somerville> Files in the librarian are wgetable
[06:55]  * NCommander has found that while its generally trivial to put something in librarian, it was my experience that getting things out are more difficult
[06:55] <NCommander> cody-somerville: yes, on some impossible-to-remember URL which changes each time a new file is uploaded
[06:56] <cody-somerville> you don't want a unique filename for each squashfs build you do?
[06:56] <NCommander> We don't currently do it. SUppose if I'm already burning the existing livecd code to the ground, might as well implement it in a slightly smarter manner
[06:57] <NCommander> other thing I need to figure out if is there is a saner way to actually get the correct privelleges to call livecd.sh (it doesn't like fakeroot :-))
[06:59] <StevenK> NCommander: If you have the LFA, it's pretty easy. :-)
[07:01] <NCommander> LFA?
[07:01] <StevenK> LibraryFileAlias
[07:01] <NCommander> er
[07:02] <NCommander> I meant on the buildds themselves
[07:02]  * NCommander was not happy with his workaround to make livecd.sh go
[07:02] <NCommander> s/was/is/g
[09:19] <dholbach> hiya
[09:19] <dholbach> I was wondering if anyone was looking into https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/1031764 right now
[09:19] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1031764 in Launchpad itself "timeout on code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches" [Critical,Triaged]
[09:25] <wgrant> dholbach: Bug #1029642 is probably the one you actually care about
[09:25] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1029642 in Launchpad itself "ScopedCollection:CollectionResource:#branch_merge_proposal-page-resource (landing candidates) dying from late evaluation of security rules" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1029642
[09:25] <dholbach> aha!
[09:26] <dholbach> wgrant, so is this a problem somewhere else as well? or just in the ~ubuntu-branches MP list?
[09:26] <wgrant> dholbach: It's slow globally, but has only significant affected ~ubuntu-branches and a U1 thing, from what I've seen.
[09:27] <dholbach> ok, that's good to know - thanks a bunch
[09:27] <wgrant> It will hopefully be fixed soon.
[09:29] <dholbach> awesome
[09:29] <dholbach> thanks wgrant
[12:49] <vila> weird issue with packages copied from one ppa to another: the target ppa was empty to start with and after the copy there is no Release.gpg in the target ppa
[12:49] <vila> known issue ? Should I file a bug ?
[16:45] <jonrafkind> I am trying to add a .desktop file to an existing package (that I didn't originally make). It uses cdbs in the rules file. I tried just putting blah.desktop in the debian/ directory but that wasn't enough. How can I make sure the .desktop file gets installed with the package?
[17:52] <george_e> I know this is an odd question but... when creating a recipe, can I omit the base branch and _just_ have two nested branches?
[17:52] <george_e> Is that even possible?
[17:52] <dobey> george_e: you can't nest a branch if you don't have something to nest it into
[17:53] <dobey> why would you want to do that anyway?
[17:54] <george_e> Well... I have one nested branch for the Debian packaging.
[17:54] <george_e> ...and I was wondering if the code could be nested in a directory as well.
[17:55] <george_e> So the uploaded .tar.gz would look something like this: ./debian ./the_code
[17:55] <george_e> The Debian packaging would be aware that the code is in a separate directory.
[17:56] <george_e> I guess it does sound a little strange. I'll explain a little further:
[17:56] <george_e> So I've got some Debian packaging that generates two binary packages - and each needs a separate source tree.
[18:03] <dobey> no, that's really not how you should handle the packaging. the debian/ dir should be nested under the top level dir of the source tree
[18:03] <dobey> why are you building two different sources in the same packaging?
[18:27] <haseeb> hi i am getting the following http://pastebin.com/p9AXugEq
[18:28] <haseeb> config file http://pastebin.com/rrsEEmMC
[18:48] <dobey> haseeb: has nothing to do with launchpad or bzr really, but it is a general ssh issue. you need to fix the file permissions on ~/.ssh and ~/.ssh/config
[18:50] <dobey> and your config is wrong; you'd need "Host bazaar.launchpad.net" and you can omit the "HostName" under that. also you don't need configure ssh to configure your lp hostname for bzr; you should do "bzr lp-login" instead
[18:51] <haseeb> ok
[18:55] <haseeb> dobey,  same error
[18:57] <dobey> you still need to fix the file permissions on them then
[18:58] <dobey> or just delete it if that's the only thing in the .ssh/config file
[19:03] <george_e> dobey: Sorry, I was away for a few minutes there. I'm not really building two source packages - since the source tree is identical in both cases (I'm nesting the same branch in two places). The reason I'm doing this is because I'm building the library for two architectures.
[19:04] <george_e> Note that this is NOT the same as specifying Architecture: Any in the debian/control file.
[19:04] <george_e> ...because I am not building Linux / Unix binaries.
[19:04] <dobey> what are you trying to do exactly?
[19:04] <george_e> I am using Mingw-w64 to build Windows binaries.
[19:05] <george_e> (Sorry if this really is confusing.)
[19:05] <dobey> you probably don't want to use launchpad recipes to do that
[19:05] <george_e> So my plan was to have the Debian directory and two identical source trees.
[19:05] <dobey> or debian packaging
[19:05] <george_e> One for 32-bit Windows and one for 64-bit.
[19:05] <george_e> dobey: I do - because the files are used for cross-compiling.
[19:06] <george_e> I'm not building _executables_.
[19:06] <george_e> I'm building the .lib / .a files that the executables use.
[19:06] <dobey> launchpad recipes are for building debian packages for use on Ubuntu via a PPA
[19:06] <george_e> Exactly.
[19:06] <george_e> That's what I'm doing.
[19:06] <dobey> Windows is not Ubuntu and doesn't use PPAs
[19:07] <george_e> The packages contain files that go in /usr/i686... and /usr/x86_64.
[19:07] <george_e> dobey: Other distros do this. Example: http://rpm.pbone.net/index.php3?stat=26&dist=84&size=46569&name=mingw64-zlib-static-1.2.5-10.fc17.noarch.rpm
[19:07] <george_e> Those packages just contain the files that Mingw-w64 produces.
[19:08] <george_e> I'm not trying to stuff Windows applications into a Debian package.
[19:08] <george_e> These packages are just the development files that are used to produce them.
[19:09] <dobey> and mingw-w64 builds win64 binaries on i386 ubuntu?
[19:09] <george_e> Yes.
[19:09] <george_e> That's why the packages produced are architecture-independent.
[19:10] <george_e> The Mingw-w64 compiler can produce 32 and 64-bit Windows executables from both a 32 and 64-bit Ubuntu installation.
[19:10] <dobey> well, you don't need multiple source trees and everything nested separately
[19:11] <dobey> you need a more complex deiban/rules file
[19:11] <george_e> What else can I do?
[19:11] <george_e> dobey: Ah, okay.
[19:11] <george_e> How would that work?
[19:11] <dobey> in much the same way that some C extensions to Python are built for multiple python versions, for example
[19:11] <george_e> Would you like to see what I have so far?
[19:11] <george_e> I have a branch on LP.
[19:12] <dobey> or make your packaging branch the main tree, and nest everything else
[19:12] <dobey> depending on how the thing you're building actually configures/builds itself
[19:12] <george_e> Currently, the debian/rules here only builds for 32-bit Windows - http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~george-edison55/win-cross/zlib-debian/files
[19:13] <george_e> dobey: That was something I had considered (making the Debian branch the main one).
[19:17] <dobey> i'm not sure exactly how to do what you want, but something like http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntuone-control-tower/dirspec/packaging-dailies/view/head:/rules (how python3 and python2.7 packages are built from same source), might work for you
[19:18] <george_e> dobey: Okay, thanks. I have done some packaging before for Python modules that generate both Py2k and Py3k packages.
[19:18] <george_e> ...so hopefully something like that will work.
[19:19] <george_e> Maybe the Makefile will let me specify a directory for object / binary files.
[19:24] <dobey> george_e: it doesn't matter really, since install for one should get called before building the other anyway
[19:24] <dobey> george_e: unless you want to fix it to allow building both at the same time
[19:24] <george_e> Ah, so then I just need to run 'make clean' between the two then?
[19:25] <george_e> I guess I need to read up more on how dh_build works.
[19:25] <dobey> well, dh_auto_clean should be getting run between each build, yes
[19:25] <dobey> so you can use override_dh_auto_clean to remove any extra files you need to remove, as is done in that py3k example i showed
[19:26] <george_e> Right.
[19:26] <george_e> One last question... I assume override_dh_auto_build will be called once for each package.
[19:26] <george_e> How do I know which one is getting built?
[19:27] <dobey> i'm not sure. i don't think dh provides any magic for it automatically, so you'll probably have to do some extra stuff to tell it which one to build
[19:27] <george_e> Thanks for helping me out.
[20:59] <svuorela> so. I can't create a account (I don't receive any emails, my mailserver isn't contacted), when using the 'forgot password' functionality I end up with a OOPS ID and something wrong. When trying to use the SSO support they are amazingly unhelpful. What does one do?
[21:17] <lifeless> svuorela: SSO support is where you need to go; have you used their email support system or web form or IRC ?
[21:21] <svuorela> lifeless: the web form
[21:23] <lifeless> svuorela: I suggest you try #canonical-isd on this IRC server
[21:23] <lifeless> svuorela: but first
[21:23] <lifeless> what URL are you using that has the 'forgot password' functionality on it.
[21:24] <svuorela> https://login.launchpad.net/+login
[21:27] <svuorela> lifeless: when is a appropriate timezone for heading into #canonical-isd ?
[21:27] <lifeless> now
[21:27] <lifeless> svuorela: thats definitely an ISD managed url, sorry!


[05:10] <theblazehen> Hello..
[06:38] <inetpro> good mornings
[06:51] <Kilos> sigh power out so early in the morning
[06:51] <Kilos> morning all
[06:52] <Kilos> Maaz  bazaar-tutorial
[06:52] <Maaz> http://ubuntu-za.snyman.info/bazaar-tutorial.html
[06:54] <Kilos> so whats with whatsapp forcing you to forward a message to 10 peeps or have your account deleted?
[07:01] <Kilos> http://www.hoax-slayer.com/whatsapp-new-facebook-f-logo-hoax.shtml
[07:01] <Kilos> grrr
[07:31] <Kilos> hi mazal  bushtech  inetpro  octoquad  ThatGraemeGuy
[07:31] <ThatGraemeGuy> mornings
[07:33] <bushtech> Dag
[07:34] <mazal> Morning Kilos , ThatGraemeGuy bushtech
[07:35] <mazal> Sjoe busy again today , users breaking everything
[07:35] <SubOracle> Morning everyone
[07:35] <gremble> Good morning
[07:36] <Kilos> ohi gremble  SubOracle
[07:38] <mazal> Morning SubOracle , gremble
[07:41] <octoquad> morning Kilos
[07:45] <Kilos> theblazehen  back at school?
[08:11] <charl> good morning
[08:11] <charl> Maaz: coffee on
[08:11]  * Maaz flips the salt-timer
[08:11] <Kilos> hi charl
[08:13] <charl> hi Kilos
[08:13] <charl> how are you doing
[08:13] <Kilos> ok ty and you?
[08:15] <charl> good good
[08:15] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for charl!
[08:49] <inetpro> hello Kilos
[08:49] <Kilos> hi pro SilverCode
[08:50] <Kilos> ian coming to fetch the ssd to have it changed
[08:50] <Kilos> drove me bonkers this one did
[08:50] <charl> hi inetpro
[08:50] <charl> Maaz: danke
[08:50] <Maaz> Bitteschön
[08:50] <charl> hi SilverCode
[08:51] <charl> Kilos: what happened with the ssd?
[08:51] <Kilos> it keeps going into very slow mode
[08:51] <Kilos> like a hang
[08:52] <Kilos> and refuses to take kde alongside unity
[08:52] <Kilos> so its useless to me
[08:53] <Kilos> my drives must accept anything i throw at them
[08:54] <Kilos> maybe its not wise to use second hand ssd's
[08:56] <Kilos> sad though because it was very fast while working on this pc
[09:25] <ThatGraemeGuy> you bought a second hand SSD?
[09:29] <Kilos> yip a 256 samsung for R800
[09:30] <Kilos> only after battling did i query if it was a used one
[09:34] <ThatGraemeGuy> so when 3 people with a combined 50+ years experience in the industry strongly advised you to go with crucial you just ignored us and went the cheap route?
[09:39] <Kilos> well, i was hoping , some peeps are lucky
[09:39] <Kilos> when every cent counts one does funny things at times
[09:40] <ThatGraemeGuy> guy, we saved you from throwing away money on a cpu upgrade that would've done nothing to speed up your pc
[09:41] <Kilos> but the supplier said he will replace it with another 256 or a new 64g for the same price
[09:41] <ThatGraemeGuy> i think you are sorely missing my point
[09:41] <Kilos> no man i know you okes advised the corsair
[09:41] <ThatGraemeGuy> you come asking for advice, and a significant amount of time is taken handing out advice
[09:42] <ThatGraemeGuy> then you just ignore the advice
[09:42] <ThatGraemeGuy> so really, what is the point of spending any time in future trying to be helpful?
[09:43] <Kilos> hmm...
[09:43] <Kilos> self satisfaction
[09:44] <Kilos> being able to say "I told you so"
[09:44] <Kilos> hehe
[09:44] <ThatGraemeGuy> wow
[09:44] <ThatGraemeGuy> meh guess i'm done then
[09:44] <Kilos> no man
[09:44] <Kilos> dont be like that
[09:44] <Kilos> oh my
[09:50] <Private_User> lol
[09:50] <Private_User> hi Kilos
[09:51] <Private_User> did ThatGraemeGuy get a bit peeved here?
[09:51] <Private_User> lol
[09:52] <Kilos> yeah
[09:54] <Kilos> im always upsetting him
[09:54] <Kilos> sigh
[10:41] <Kilos> hi dude42
[10:41] <dude42> hi Kilos
[10:41] <dude42> how goes
[10:41] <Kilos> good ty and you
[10:41] <dude42> good thanks
[11:14] <Kilos> hi Vince-0
[11:15] <Vince-0> haai oom
[11:42] <Kilos> hi magespawn
[11:55] <magespawn> hi Kilos
[11:58] <magespawn> quick question for the brains, i have two machines on two different networks with the same local ip address, i ssh into these machines. everytime i do i have to remove the key so that i can connect. is there a way around this? maybe have two ssh keys?
[12:28] <gremble> Can't you make the IP's static and different?
[12:29] <gremble> Or would that break too many things?
[13:01] <magespawn> gremble i would have to redo all the phones on one of the properties
[13:01] <magespawn> it is an asterisk server
[13:01] <magespawn> both
[13:05] <Kilos> inetpro  what have they made better
[13:05] <Kilos> in thub=nderbird that is
[13:05] <Kilos> thunderbird
[13:06] <Kilos> actually nm, no data to waste downloading it
[13:48] <gremble> Oh, sounds like schlept. Not the best idea then
[13:54] <magespawn> close office time, chat later all
[15:48] <Kilos> hmm...
[17:03] <magespawn> good evening
[17:36] <Kilos> hi magespawn
[17:36] <Kilos> http://mybroadband.co.za/news/broadband/116788-beware-r149-uncapped-data-sim-mtn.html
[17:52] <inetpro> hullo
[17:55] <inetpro> Kilos: 30mm
[17:58] <Symmetria> http://<IP_ADDRESS>/office2.jpg <[18:01] <Kilos> wow inetpro  we got 4mm
[18:16] <magespawn> we got some rain down here too, not sure how much though
[18:16] <magespawn> Symmetria: did not know you were in real cats too
[18:17] <charl> Symmetria: that one screen looks like a tv
[18:18] <charl> i see toilet paper present, i won't ask questions
[18:18] <Kilos> lol
[18:18] <Symmetria> charl haha quickest thing I could grab to clean up the coffee my damn cat knocked over the other day
[18:19] <Symmetria> charl, its a 4K UHD 40"
[18:19] <Symmetria> makes for a good monitor
[18:19] <Symmetria> ;p
[18:19] <charl> no need to make excuses Symmetria every good home office needs at least one toilet paper roll or a tissue box
[18:20] <Symmetria> haha man what freaks me out is that with all the cool geeky shit in my office, the first thing people look for is tissues or toilet paper :P says a lot about whats on peoples minds
[18:21] <charl> lol
[18:21] <charl> it's a stereotype ... :P
[18:21] <charl> especially because of all the geeky shit
[18:21] <magespawn> i saw the cat first, what does that say? the one thing out of place?
[18:22] <Kilos> lol
[18:22] <charl> let me process this... lots of monitors, a cat and toilet paper
[18:23] <charl> you can not get more geeky than that
[18:23] <charl> who needs catpix when you have a real life one
[18:23] <charl> 100% geek approved (tm) (r)
[18:23] <Symmetria> lol I have a few cats actually :P when I moved in here, there was a stray female wandering around crying that it was hungry
[18:23] <Symmetria> so I started feeding it
[18:23] <gremble> He did get engaged if I recall correctly...
[18:23] <Symmetria> then it had kittens :P
[18:23] <magespawn> maybe a angry birds plushie or some star wars figurines?
[18:24] <Symmetria> engaged? I got married :p
[18:24] <gremble> Oh ya
[18:24] <gremble> that
[18:24] <gremble> :P
[18:24] <gremble> Who needs catpix when you have the real thing?
[18:24] <charl> marriage is good, unless if it's to your waifu
[18:24] <Symmetria> lol wifey is asleep and grumpy at me cause I told her I'd be working most of tonight
[18:27] <charl> http://<IP_ADDRESS>/office.jpg <- microsoft outlook 2013, too familiar
[18:27] <charl> and i see a mirc there:P
[18:28] <Symmetria> heh outlook works for integrated business shit
[18:28] <charl> at work we have microsoft lync and outlook
[18:28] <Symmetria> when there is a deecent opensource mail client with the same level of integration, I might use it
[18:28] <Symmetria> ;p
[18:28] <charl> unified communications and all dat
[18:29] <charl> see a person's presence right in your mail client and can make a call with one click
[18:29] <charl> i don't use outlook though i use the web interface and i use a network voip telephone
[18:29] <charl> aastra device
[18:29] <Symmetria> heh I use an ex90 on my desk at work
[18:30] <Symmetria> (telepresence unit)
[18:30] <charl> hmmm don't know it
[18:30] <Symmetria> heh cisco telepresence office unit
[18:30] <charl> asterix ?
[18:30] <Symmetria> hell no, heh, 1080p video conferencing system
[18:30] <charl> ah nice !
[18:31] <Symmetria> built in high def cameras and all that shit
[18:31] <Symmetria> basically the rolls royce of video conferencing
[18:31] <charl> ah some proprietary cisco system ?
[18:31] <charl> citrix also has some good stuff
[18:31] <Symmetria> I'd kill to have an ex90 at home but at 12 thousand dollars a pop....
[18:31] <charl> phew
[18:31] <Symmetria> charl you gotta see telepresence in a full TP room to understand it, there is nothing, nothing on the market that comes close
[18:32] <charl> interesting
[18:32] <Symmetria> a full TP room typically has 3 70" 1080p screens, and multiple cameras, when you talk in the room, the camera triangulates the sound
[18:32] <Symmetria> and focuses on the person talking
[18:32] <charl> nice
[18:32] <Symmetria> and the quality is such that I was sitting in a full TP room and someone on the remote side knocked on the door on the remote side
[18:32] <charl> cancels out noise in the background etc ?
[18:32] <Symmetria> and I turned to see who was coming into my TP room
[18:32] <Symmetria> cancels out noise and the sound is 3D
[18:33] <charl> whow
[18:33] <Symmetria> so it positions the sound in the position of the person who is talking
[18:33] <Symmetria> its a mindfuck :)
[18:33] <charl> but for that price ... you would expect it :D
[18:33] <charl> still cool though
[18:33] <Symmetria> charl heh, it uses 30mbit of bandwidth as well
[18:33] <charl> oh that's quite well optimised
[18:34] <charl> for 3x 1080p
[18:34] <Symmetria> a full and complete TP room though if you want the full setup with a total TP room with all the screens, 3D shit and everything else will run you a few hundred thousand dollars
[18:34] <magespawn> so basically unusable in most of south africa
[18:34] <Symmetria> magespawn ex90 will work, you can use an ex90 office unit at full 1080p on 5mbit bi-directional
[18:34] <Symmetria> and if you tone it down to 720p (still totally useable) you can get away with 3mbit
[18:34] <Symmetria> ;p
[18:34] <charl> yeah but that's overcompressed 1080p
[18:35] <Symmetria> charl yeah, but honestly, the quality on it is... seriously fucking amazing even at that
[18:35] <charl> well i guess if your targets are not moving then it could be
[18:35] <charl> it's different than watching a movie
[18:35] <Symmetria> the other neat thing about the ex90 is that the thing dual functions as a PC screen, and you can hit a button on the control pad and whatever was on that screen on your pc, then is presented
[18:36] <Symmetria> so you can desktop share pretty nicely
[18:36] <charl> that's handy but none of this stuff is really very new
[18:37] <charl> google had "unified communications" almost 10 years ago in gmail with google talk
[18:37] <charl> and now microsoft is making a big scene out of it like it's something special
[18:37] <charl> that's a whole different matter than conference systems though
[20:04] <magespawn> good night all
[20:07] <Kilos> sjoe
[20:07] <Kilos> night all. sleep tight


[18:53] <ger_ball> could someone point me to where i should report gpodder looking like this https://i.imgur.com/L7UVm2a.png on kubuntu 18.04? (there are actually 22 podcasts subs in that list).
[18:57] <hggdh> ger_ball: use ubuntu-bug -- ubuntu-bug gpodder, fill in the ncesary data when the bug page opens, and include the screenshot
[18:57] <ger_ball> thank you


[07:44] <jslarraz> Hey sdeziel, regarding iperf3 updates, they include fixes for different vulnerabilities as you can see from the USNs. The reasoning here is that iperf3 is a universe package and as such, security fixes are devoted to Ubuntu Pro (-esm). However, as fix for CVE-2023-38403 was already provided by Debian, we wanted to make it also available to all
[07:44] <jslarraz> Ubuntu users. In summary, the update in `-security` includes the fix for CVE-2023-38403, while the update in `-esm` include the fix for both CVE-2023-38403 and the issue published by upstream in their advisory https://downloads.es.net/pub/iperf/esnet-secadv-2023-0002.txt.asc
[07:44] -ubottu:#ubuntu-security- iperf3 before 3.14 allows peers to cause an integer overflow and heap corruption via a crafted length field. <https://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2023-38403>
[12:49] <sdeziel> jslarraz: OK thank you, I didn't notice there were another fixes (without CVEs) being bundled in the `-esm` version
[18:22] <ahasenack> hi security, apparmor question
[18:22] <ahasenack> I have "abi <abi/3.0>," in the first line of a "modern" apparmor profile
[18:22] <ahasenack> but bionic doesn´t  like that
[18:22] <ahasenack> Found unexpected character: '<'
[18:22] <ahasenack> is there a way to make it "compatible" with bionic, so I could use the same profile in all releases? Or I really have to remove it when building the package for bionic?
[18:22] <ahasenack> remove the line, I mean
[19:31] <georgiag> ahasenack: afaik you need to remove the abi line for bionic. jjohansen, can you confirm if there's any workaround?
[19:47] <jjohansen> ahasenack: to make it compatible we would need to cherry pick a patch back to bionic and do an SRU
[19:48] <jjohansen> its possible. All the patch does is ignore the ABI line so the profile can be parsed
[19:48] <ahasenack> jjohansen: and I can just remove the abi declaration for bionic, right? No need to add anything else?
[19:48] <ahasenack> to replace it?
[19:49] <jjohansen> ahasenack: yeah, I can just drop the ABI line
[19:49] <jjohansen> or stick a comment in front of it
[19:49] <jjohansen> #
[19:51] <ahasenack> will the comment make it be ignored where the abi statement actually means something?
[19:51] <ahasenack> or is it like include vs #include
[19:51] <ahasenack> (where both actually include something)
[19:54] <jjohansen> it will be ignored
[19:54] <ahasenack> ok, so where abi makes sense, I should keep it
[19:54] <ahasenack> tl;dr really use two different profile files
[19:55] <jjohansen> we did think about supporting #abi like include but decided against it
[19:55] <ahasenack> agreed
[20:08] <jjohansen> well it seemed like a good idea at the time with only 5 year support time frames
[20:09] <jjohansen> and we had planned ahead far enough to drop the ignore abi parsing into 2.13
[20:09] <jjohansen> but now?
[20:10] <ahasenack> I meant the concept of using # for comments, except if they start with "include" :)
[20:10] <ahasenack> don't extend that to other exceptions like "abi" :)
[20:10] <jjohansen> yeah, its janky
[20:12] <jjohansen> no, where we are going is better conditionals and the ability to add some dummy parsing in policy
[20:12] <jjohansen> if !parser_supports(XXXX) {
[20:12] <jjohansen>    ignore rule=^.*,$
[20:12] <jjohansen> }
[20:13] <jjohansen> so that we can add some basic parsing to the base includes on how to ignore rule changes
[20:14] <jjohansen> it will start simple, but we need it, so we can keep policy unified
[20:14] <jjohansen> I would SRU that if I could, but the changes necessary to make the conditionals work, is too much
[20:15] <jjohansen> well maybe
[20:15] <jjohansen> we need to do something with these longer support windows
[20:15] <jjohansen> its something we will have to look at when it lands
[20:18] <ahasenack> these conditionals look like a big change
[20:18] <jjohansen> well, conditionals are actually already supported, but they are uhmm limited
[20:19] <jjohansen> so the base
[20:19] <jjohansen> if ... { }
[20:19] <ahasenack> in bionic?
[20:19] <jjohansen> is already in bionic
[20:20] <ahasenack> I still have to try to load this profile I'm working on on xenial
[20:20] <ahasenack> currently having problems launching a xenial vm
[20:20] <jjohansen> actually they are in lucid
[20:21] <ahasenack> found something funny in bionic's python3.6 because of this profile. It was denying /sbin/ldconfig when uuid was imported
[20:21] <ahasenack> and I was like huh?
[20:21] <ahasenack> so yeah, in bionic, python3 -c "import uuid" triggers ldconfig :)
[20:22] <ahasenack> would love a "if bionic" conditional :)
[20:25] <jjohansen> it exists, you can use it in the rules blocks of profiles but not with variables
[20:25] <jjohansen> if $var {
[20:25] <jjohansen> }
[20:25] <jjohansen> $var is a boolean var you define it in the preamble section like other variables
[20:25] <jjohansen> $var=false
[20:25] <jjohansen> $var=true
[20:26] <ahasenack> hm
[20:26] <ahasenack> so one way would be to generate this profile dynamically in postinst perhaps, detecting where I am, and setting var accordingly
[20:26] <ahasenack> is what you mean?
[20:27] <ahasenack> I don't suppose that var can be set dynamically based on conditions in the environment
[20:27] <jjohansen> the conditionals are capable of a bit more, but atm they can't be used in the preamble section, so not with the abi rule, around var definitions, ...
[20:28] <ahasenack> do I *need* the abi rule in later apparmor? Like focal+ all the way up to NN?
[20:28] <jjohansen> so unfortunately it won't work for abi rules, but you can use it for other rules
[20:28] <jjohansen> no its value can't be dynamic based on environment, what the parser supports, or what the kernel supports
[20:28] <jjohansen> we want to fix all that
[20:29] <jjohansen> yes, you will need the abi rule in future apparmor
[20:29] <ahasenack> ok
[20:30] <jjohansen> it is what declares the set of features the profile was built around, so adding new features in the kernel doesn't break applications with policy that hasn't been updated yet


[19:54] <Unit193>  > Ubuntu IRC Operator Team Meeting (#ubuntu-meeting on irc.freenode.net)   I'm going to presume that didn't happen.
[20:34] <Pici> if it did, I wasn't there.
[20:36] <Unit193> Oh, did you see my rsync ping btw?
[20:38] <Pici> Unit193: I forgot about it... how was that working, what user were you connecting with and do you need me to add an ssh public key to something?
[20:39] <Unit193> Pici: It was actually just using the rsync daemon on there, I had no user.  Server side, it had something to copy ubuntu.db to a new location that the rsync daemon had access to.  I was using the address rsync://ubottu.com/ubottu/ubuntu.db
[20:40] <Pici> I'll take a look when I get home then... like in an hour
[20:41] <Unit193> Great, thank you.
[20:56] <Pici> Unit193: it might be working now... I'll check again when I get home though.
[20:57] <Unit193> Well the file is there at least, so I'll stop getting errors in `mail`, danke.


[00:10] <ubotu> New bug: #73609 in ubuntu-docs (main) "monthly scrollkeeper cron job is very noisy" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/73609
[13:01] <ubotu> New bug: #208763 in ubuntu-doc "Password and Encryption Guide mentions wrong location for program" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/208763
[14:39] <mdke>  /win 12
[17:52] <sommer> mdke: hello
[17:53] <sommer> mdke: there are a bunch of spelling mistakes I missed in the Server Guide, and I wanted to check with you about committing them?
[17:53] <sommer> mdke: I haven't compiled a list yet, so I'll do that and let you know how big the impact will be
[19:26] <sommer> mdke: there are 130 lines effected in the diff
[21:11] <mdke> sommer: that would seriously affect translators. are they literally just spelling mistakes?
[21:14] <sommer> mdke: yep, spelling and capatilization of applications... on the whole they aren't that serious
[21:14] <sommer> really most are capatilizations
[21:15] <sommer> I can send you the diff if you'd like to take a look
[21:15] <mdke> sommer: what we need to do is to ensure the translators don't get affected. We can do it by committing the fix right at the end of the cycle, after translations are already imported
[21:16] <sommer> mdke: gotcha, it shouldn't affect the translations
[21:16] <mdke> don't commit it for now, in case there are any more serious fixes which we need to apply and pass on to translators
[21:16] <sommer> mdke: sure, I'll just hang onto it.
[21:17] <sommer> the original diff was from another Server Team member that didn't have time to review before the freeze
[21:17] <mdke> ok
[21:18] <sommer> mdke: thanks man
[21:18] <mdke> np. Things are looking pretty good this release
[21:18] <mdke> thanks for all your hard work
[21:19] <sommer> ya, there was still some things that didn't get documented, like iscsi, but that's because the development is still very active
[21:20] <sommer> I was thinking the other day about your comment concerning the size of the server guide, and I don't see it getting any smaller
[21:20] <sommer> is there another approach we should use for it?
[21:20] <sommer> maybe reorganize into sub-chapters or something?
[21:20] <mdke> size in itself isn't a problem, as long as the whole guide is relevant to the server edition
[21:21] <sommer> yep, it's all relevant, I was just gatehering ideas for the next release, and so fare there are several good ones
[21:22] <mdke> I was just a bit worried that sections might be being added which are not directly relevant - i thought perhaps that since jeos is its own "flavour", perhaps it should be in its own document, shipped with that flavour
[21:23] <mdke> but you reassured me
[21:23] <sommer> ah, yep I forgot that was the focus... that section may need some more thought, but I think for now it fits well
[21:24] <sommer> I was just thinking the other day that there is a bunch of scrolling necessary to see all the sections :-)
[21:26] <mdke> that's true. you may want to consider reducing the number of sections
[21:28] <sommer> heh, that may be a tough sell, I was thinking to discuss the puropose/focus of the guide at UDS, that should then help figure out how to organize things
[21:32] <mdke> I fancy you could save some space here and there
[21:32] <mdke> the networking section looks like it might be able to house a couple of other sections
[21:33] <mdke> chapters 6 and 7, for example
[21:35] <sommer> ya, chapter 6 is pretty small, but there are some ideas for additions to that chapter for the next release
[21:36] <sommer> libnss-ldap, example client application configuration, etc
[21:36] <mdke> structure doesn't depend upon size, it depends upon subject matter
[21:36] <mdke> so if things are to do with networking, they should be in the networking section, even if they are huge ;)
[21:37] <mdke> ditto jeos and the virtualisation section
[21:37] <sommer> I'm with ya, but is there a way to display more than <sect1> tags in the main ToC?
[21:38] <mdke> I don't completely understand your question, but I think the answer is "sure"
[21:39] <mdke> ah, you want deeper indexes?
[21:39] <mdke> yes, that's easy. I think it would double the amount of scrolling required though
[21:40] <mdke> also, normally the sect1 title is enough to tell you what is there, so it's a reasonable place to cut off
[21:40] <sommer> for example the libvirt-virsh section, can that be linked to the main table of contents?
[21:41] <sommer> the reason being is that it would make it easier to find specific content for what you're working on
[21:41] <sommer> not that it's terribly hard now
[21:43] <mdke> I think the best way is to keep the index manageable and ensure that the sections are clearly enough titled that it's easy to find whatever you are looking for
[21:44] <sommer> sure, that's what I was thinking as well
[21:45]  * sommer wonders how hard it would be to add some type of live search
[21:48] <mdke> what to?
[21:48] <sommer> like some blogs and other sites have, a little ajaxy live search field
[21:52] <mdke> you mean on help.u.c, the serverguide standalone html package, or yelp?
[21:53] <sommer> ya the web site
[21:54] <mdke> ah
[21:56] <mdke> yes, that would be good
[21:56] <mdke> I still haven't given up hope with moving everything to the wiki and having a single website
[21:58] <sommer> funny you should mention that, I was thinking the same thing last night :-)
[21:59] <sommer> at least for the server guide
[21:59] <mdke> the docbook<->moin project is picking up again now so you never know
[22:00] <sommer> ya, I did try it out for the bacula section, but the output was all continous
[22:00] <mdke> you can use the "tidy" program, I think I mentioned that before
[22:00] <sommer> oh, heh shoud've tried that
[22:02] <sommer> I'll bring the idea of moving to the wiki up at UDS and see what others think
[22:02] <sommer> at least the server guys
[22:02] <mdke> well, I think it's only worth moving if everything moves
[22:02] <mdke> no point having stuff in a different place
[22:03] <sommer> ya, that's a good point
[22:03] <sommer> I'll do some more testing with the docbook > moin stuff
[22:03] <sommer> and moin > docbook... heh


 @Wafficus [<Wafficus> Hi guys, how do I install fonts in Lubuntu?], If I have the font, I put them in /usr/local/share/fonts
[02:14] <lyorian> @HMollerCl @Wafficus you can also search and install them with apt
[05:35] <ball> hello hateball
[06:01] <hateball> ;d
[06:58] <GeekyGirl36> Can I just say how giddy I am to have done this!  (Yes I am a noob, only three days on Lubuntu and with help from a co-worker who nudged me in the direction I needed to go) I now have WiFi!!!  :)
[07:01] <GeekyGirl36> Okay, it is past my bedtime.  :(  Have a great night all!  :)
 @GeekyGirl36 [<GeekyGirl36> Can I just say how giddy I am to have done this!  (Yes I am a noob …], Awesome!


[12:56] <persia> Meeting in #ubuntu-meeting in 5 minutes
[14:12] <persia> davidm: You need a MID with a proper offset keyboard, and useful tactile response.
[14:17] <ogra> persia, the n810 kbd is quite good, just missing some essentials like the tab key
[14:18] <persia> ogra: Isn't it one of those that implements the silly idea that one should have the keyboard be a regular grid?
[14:18]  * persia goes and looks at images before spreading more FUD
[14:19] <persia> Yeah.  That's exactly the keyboard style that has convinced me not to make a purchase previously.
[14:19] <ogra> its a qwerty
[14:19] <ogra> but yes, in a grid layout
[14:20]  * ogra is running out of battery
[14:20] <persia> (the actual product I didn't buy for this reason was http://technabob.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/02/sharp_em_one.jpg)
[14:20] <ogra> just needs a bit of getting used to
[14:20] <persia> ogra: We can chat about foolishness in keyboard layouts adn thumb-based ergonomics another time then.  Go find some joules.
[14:21] <ogra> loic made me intrested in another smoke ... which i'll do now :P
[14:21] <ogra> bbl
[14:53] <ian_brasil> i downloaded the current image last night and the the desktop icons are still mixed up
[14:55] <ian_brasil> for instance clicking a terminal starts time and date which then hangs in kvm
[14:56] <persia> Yeah.  The launcher isn't working.  A replacement is underway: see http://people.ubuntu.com/~stevenk/IMG_2096.JPG for a screenshot of the work-in-progress
[14:56] <persia> (and yes, not having a white background might make that prettier, but that's not so critical as it actually launching the selected program)
[14:57] <persia> Apparently it's gone from being ~1800 lines of C to ~70 lines of python.
[14:58] <StevenK> It now has a black background
[14:59] <ian_brasil> cool
[14:59]  * persia failed to remember that the URL would be a highlight (x_x);
[15:07] <ian_brasil> any idea when this will be ready and intrepid images willwork?
[15:10] <persia> There was an action item to get the updated launcher into the repos at the meeting just concluded.  If they aren't in the Saturday images, they ought be in the Tuesday images. (I have little faith they will be in the weekend images)
[15:11] <ian_brasil> persia: thanks
[15:58] <tonyespy> DebbieFoghorn: which Dennis PV unit do you have right now ( SKU / SN )?
[16:21] <latouche> which window manager is used by ubuntu mobile?
[16:22] <latouche> it looks quite nice
[16:25] <persia> latouche: matchbox
[16:26] <persia> latouche: Note that matchbox itself is quite limited.  I suspect you're being impressed the envionment more generally, rather than just the WM.
[16:28] <latouche> i already tried matchbox but the screenshots i see on ubuntu website are much more beautiful
[16:28] <latouche> maybe that i need a lot of tweaking :)
[16:29] <latouche> i will probably test ubuntu mobile
[16:29] <persia> latouche: Which screenshots?
[16:29] <latouche> is there a "live cd" that i can boot from a usb key?
[16:29] <latouche> http://www.ubuntu.com/products/mobile >> here persia
[16:30] <persia> There's a live-environment USB key for intrepid, but it has several issues (like the launcher launching the wrong applications).  For hardy, there is no available live environment.
[16:31] <persia> latouche: The top screenshot is roughly accurate.  I'm not sure how the two at the bottom were generated.
[16:31] <persia> Probably some example OEM/ODM customisations of some sort (guessing by the nearby text)
[16:34] <latouche> ok
[16:36] <latouche> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-mid/intrepid/current/ >> is this one the live-environment ?
[16:38] <persia> Yep, but it's quite buggy, so be careful.
[16:38] <Graham70> good day room
[16:42] <latouche> thanks persia
[16:42] <persia> latouche: What hardware are you using?
[16:44] <latouche> an eee pc 701
[16:48] <persia> I suspect you'll find the interface interesting, but a little confining after a while.  There's work-in-progress to generate a flavour (Ubuntu Mobile) that's more well suited for that sort of device, but there aren't any images yet.
[16:50] <latouche> well, i'll test it and maybe install it or keep the good ideas for my current system
[16:50] <latouche> but, first, i'm going to bed
[16:51] <latouche> good night/evening/morning/...
[16:51] <persia> latouche: Have a good night.
[16:53] <latouche> thanks
[17:21] <crevette> heya
[17:21] <crevette> persia: around?
[17:26] <persia> crevette: Usually.
[17:26] <crevette> :)
[17:26] <crevette> hello
[17:26] <crevette> did you manage to merge bluez-gnome ?
[17:28] <persia> I haven't looked at it.  slytherin was chasing it last weekend, but I don't remember the results.
[17:34] <crevette> I can perhaps do it right now
[17:34] <crevette> my son is sleeping for a while
[17:34] <crevette> :)
[17:45] <persia> crevette: That would be great!  I was heading to bed, but I'll stay up to review/check/test the results.
[17:46] <crevette> ah already ? where do you live ?
[17:46] <crevette> just give the steps, and I'll do the merge
[17:47] <crevette> then I'll put the package somewhere and mail you once done
[17:47] <crevette> No sure how long my son will continue to sleep
[17:51] <persia> I live in Japan (where it's late).
[17:52] <persia> Steps are to grab the new upstream package, review the changes in the Debian package between 0.25 and 0.27 and see if there's any patches we want, review the patches we have against 0.25 to see what is already upstream, and what is still required, and then put it all together into a 0.28 source package.
[17:53] <crevette> okay
[17:53] <crevette> I'll try to do that tonight
[17:56] <persia> crevette: Good luck.  If you only finish part, but you can post your results somewhere, that could be helpful for the next person.
[17:56] <persia> I did a quick look at 0.27 vs 0.28 for Debian, and found that 0.28 was compatible with the 0.27 Debian packaging.
[18:06] <ethana2> Okay, I'm running ubuntu desktop edition combined with netbook edition
[18:07] <ethana2> i found that ubuntu netbook edition had some great tools that i now rely upon with my new ubuntu dell
[18:07] <ethana2> i was wondering if there may be any similar packages in ubuntu mobile..
[18:10] <ethana2> hmm
[18:10] <ethana2> ethan@home:~$ install ubuntu-mobile
[18:10] <ethana2> whoa, looks like i found it
[18:10] <ethana2> okay, if i install this metapackage, i'll have another session option to load from gdm, correct?
[18:11] <persia> If you're running intrepid, that should do the right thing.  If you're running hardy, you may get unexpected results.
[18:11] <ethana2> Also, will I be able to use a mouse with it?
[18:11] <ethana2> oh
[18:11] <ethana2> i'll probably be installing intrepid today with alpha 6
[18:11] <persia> For hardy, the metapackage for Ubuntu MID is confusingly named "ubuntu-mobile".  It has a different way of doing many things.
[18:12] <persia> For intrepid, this was resolved, and the ubuntu-mobile metapackage should provide a good experience for those with 7-9" devices.
[18:12] <ethana2> well i have a 14" inspiron 1420n
[18:12] <persia> I understand there are still a few bugs to be ironed out, but it should work fine with a mouse, etc.
[18:12] <ethana2> but i use window-picker-applet from ubuntu netbook and maximus
[18:12] <ethana2> oh sweet
[18:13] <persia> I find your use case surprising, but then I'm the sort of person who runs full -desktop on a 7" laptop.
[18:13] <ethana2> well the window list applet is visually noisy as heck
[18:13] <ethana2> and when i want to do one task at a time, title bars are simply a waste of space
[18:14] <ethana2> plus having the close window button in the top panel brings me more into harmony with Fitt's law
[18:14] <ethana2> ok, looks like alpha 6 hasn't gone gold yet
[18:15] <ethana2> persia: don't mind my use cases, they surprise /everyone/
[18:15] <persia> I guess.  I tend to like to have at least two windows (the thing I'm changing and the thing to which I'm referring for data).
[18:16] <ethana2> i'd love to have two side by side frames; two workspaces on one screen
[18:16]  * ethana2 shrugs
[18:16] <persia> ethana2: Of course :)  You may find ubuntu-mobile is perfect for you, despite not having the hardware expected for use with it.
[18:16] <ethana2> exactly what i'm figuring
[18:16] <persia> Yeah.  Two side-by-side is good.  If you use terminal apps a lot, and like the fullscreen model, you can do that with terminator.
[18:17] <ethana2> the thing i really love about maximus is the way it helps me work with compiz
[18:17] <ethana2> i have this..  urge to keep everything minimized
[18:17] <ethana2> ....but if i can only see one window at a time, the urge goes away and i can use the cover flow switcher
[18:18] <ethana2> (X windows don't exist when minimized and the compiz folks think it's 'hackish' to cache mipmaps)
[18:21] <persia> Interesting.  Highlighting the compiz cover flow switcher may be interesting in mobile.  I'm curious how it works from ubuntu-mobile without the netbook-remix stuff.
[18:22] <ethana2> i had to take ghex2 to my compiz binaries because of an apple patent, you know, for the genie effect
[18:22] <ethana2> ....went to the linux mint irc channel to ask them how they handled that but i didn't get a response
[18:24] <persia> I don't know anything about that.  I don't actually use compiz where I can avoid it (saves battery life for me).
[18:24] <ethana2> i turn it off for battery life also
[18:24] <ethana2> along with my wireless and screen brightness
[18:24] <ethana2> my 56 WHr battery lasts 2.5 H, which is pretty good
[18:58] <persia> crevette: I'm going to have to wish you luck.  Please post your results for however far you get, and I'll take an interested look when I return.


[16:40] <meeting> * Translation has started for English on #ubuntu-us-dc-en
 Odd... I'm not sure why this was offered as a SugarLabs channel... Musta been something I did. ;-)
 And this amazing product translates English to... English. ;-)
[16:42] <meeting> * kjcole_ on #ubuntu-us-dc-en has left


[09:29] <YoBoY> good morning
[12:14] <jako> hi
[12:15] <jako> I am looking for some s/w experience, just finished electronics college and I would like to learn some practical programming
[12:15] <jako> any1 alive
[12:15] <jako> ?
[12:16] <jakotako> any1 alive???
[12:19] <jakotako> ye
[12:19] <jakotako> i thought sko
[15:15] <paultag> dang, lame. I'm here now.
[18:17] <locodir-user> is there any technical support here ?
[18:17] <head_victim> locodir-user: technical support is usually done in #ubuntu
[18:18] <locodir-user> ok sorry to bother you


[14:09] <brousch> The Grand Rapids Information Systems Security Administration uses mailman, which emails your password to you once a month by default
[15:37] <cmaloney> brousch: I think you can turn that off as a user
[15:37] <cmaloney> at least in later versions of mailman
[16:05] <brousch> Can't turn it off the first time it happens
[16:10] <cmaloney> ugh
[18:04] <rick_h_> afternoon
[21:18] <rick_h_> cmaloney: heh, going to have to put more time into my goodreads content I guess http://mitechie.com/books
[21:46] <greg-g> brousch: don't use a real password with mailman, just let it give you one
[22:18] <brousch> Well of course, but it still send it to you plain text