[19:42] <devuser> Does anybody konw how to set a password for the live session user? or how to prevent on a nice way, that user-setup-apply sets %admin ALL=(ALL) ALL to sudoers? thx
[19:44] <devuser> Does anybody konw how to set a password for the live session user? or how to prevent on a nice way, that user-setup-apply sets %admin ALL=(ALL) ALL to sudoers? thx


[20:04] <mup> PR snapcraft#2729 opened: snaps: if snap is installed, don't check is_valid() <Created by cjp256> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/2729>


[05:44] <pragomer> sorry, but I cannot find an ubuntu 18.04 lubuntu-next iso. could you help me?
 @pragomer, That's because it wasn't released.
[05:48] <pragomer> oh ok, then sorry for a (relativly) stupid question ;-)   any hint when it will be?
[05:49] <pragomer> do you have a download location for 17.10 then for me?
[05:50] <tsimonq2> pragomer: 18.10 uses it by default.
[05:51] <tsimonq2> All other versions of Lubuntu with LXQt are unavailable and undsupported.
[05:51] <tsimonq2> *unsupported
[05:51] <pragomer> oh ok, I see
[05:51] <pragomer> looking forward to lubuntu-next 18.10
[05:51] <tsimonq2> You mean, Lubuntu 18.10. :)
[05:55] <JohnDoe_71Rus> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/rFXYCcfx4q/ sorry fo some russian but i think you can see problem. lubuntu 18.04 lxqt netinstall
 @JohnDoe_71Rus, Not supported
[05:59] <JohnDoe_71Rus> but why it in repos?
[06:02] <JohnDoe_71Rus> https://packages.ubuntu.com/bionic/lubuntu-qt-desktop
 Because it was there for testing
 We don't support it
[11:39] <quxgyver> I seem to have two bluetooth managers in Lubuntu. It's kind of confusing.
[11:39] <quxgyver> I have "Manage Bluetooth Devices" in my system tray, which is visible by default.
[11:40] <quxgyver> Then I have "Bluetooth Manager" which is accessible via start menu > preferences
[11:40] <quxgyver> And when I open it, I get another bluetooth icon in my system tray, which is identical to the aforementioned one.
[11:40] <quxgyver> Except functionally Bluetooth Manager seems a lot more feature rich.
[11:40] <quxgyver> Anyone experienced the same thing?
[12:30] <quxgyver> Answer me. I demand justice.
[12:30] <quxgyver> Speak up.
[12:32] <quxgyver> Stallman's blessings upon the person who can help me.
[12:32] <diogenes_> quxgyver, pray to Saint iGNUssius
[12:39] <quxgyver> gates' curse upon anyone who willingly leaves me to suffer from my bluetooth issues
[12:40] <quxgyver> billby's groping hand
[12:40] <quxgyver> upon you.
[12:46] <diogenes_> what's your bt issue?
[12:55] <quxgyver> I'm just wondering why I have two BT icons
[12:55] <quxgyver> when I open "Bluetooth Manager" via the start menu
[12:56] <diogenes_> one is probably blueberry and another one is blueman
[12:56] <quxgyver> and if they're part of the same software or two different managers that just happen to seamlessly manage the same hardware without conflict
[12:56] <quxgyver> Alright. Does that mean that I can remove one of them without issue?
[12:59] <JohnDoe_71Rus> you can find more programs to work with bluetooth. and each can have its own icon in the tray
[12:59] <quxgyver> Hm you were right. When I click "help" it identifies itself as "blueman-applet"
[12:59] <quxgyver> though the other one doesnt really have any identifying info
[12:59] <quxgyver> no about section or anything
[13:00] <quxgyver> JohnDoe_71Rus: What happens if you uninstall one of them tho?
[13:00] <quxgyver> Do they all interface with the same BT software and driver under the hood?
[13:01] <JohnDoe_71Rus> nothing
[13:01] <quxgyver> So could I technically remove all BT managers and still have BT work?
[13:01] <JohnDoe_71Rus> try it
[13:02] <JohnDoe_71Rus> you can install back anytime
[13:04] <quxgyver> Well I can't find any package that contains "blueb" so I guess the other icon isn't from blueberry.
[13:04] <quxgyver> How can I identify it?
[13:05] <JohnDoe_71Rus> think one is blueman-applet and other is lxpanel applet
[13:06] <quxgyver> So can I remove the lxpanel applet somehow, and make blueman the default icon (it doesn't show up by default)?
[13:07] <quxgyver> I mean I guess I could remove the lxpanel applet via gui
[13:07] <quxgyver> but will that uninstall it, or merely hide it?
[13:08] <quxgyver> and how can I make blueman autostart in its place?
[13:08] <JohnDoe_71Rus> quxgyver: right mouse click on BT icon
[13:09] <JohnDoe_71Rus> http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-BCClJtLuK9g/U0_He2cGG3I/AAAAAAAASTQ/G3tFNoBYeg4/s1600/lubuntu1404-lxsession-default-apps_2.png add to autostart
[13:28] <quxgyver> well that worked like a charm
[13:28] <quxgyver> thanks for the explanations as well as the solution
[13:28] <quxgyver> stallman's blessing upon you


[03:35] <cyberanger> quiet night here
[03:39] <chibihogoshino> its been quiet in here lately
[03:44] <cyberanger> hope it doesn
[03:44] <cyberanger> t stay that way
[03:48] <chibihogoshino> 19 people .. it should be a little more active
[03:48] <chibihogoshino> have you watched katz at all ?
[03:49] <chibihogoshino> cyberanger: ^^
[03:50] <cyberanger> no
[03:51] <chibihogoshino> oh
[03:51] <chibihogoshino> he is still broadcasting
[03:51] <chibihogoshino> every day since the tsunami happened
[03:54] <cyberanger> I get the feeling that's not a mainstream news source then
[03:54] <chibihogoshino> lol.. no
[03:54] <chibihogoshino> he is translating the japanese news
[03:57] <cyberanger> ah
[03:57] <cyberanger> that explains that
[04:04] <chibihogoshino> he is doing a great job .. i just wish he could get back to his normal show.
[04:05] <cyberanger> I get translations from mainstream, raw feeds, satellite photos
[04:05] <cyberanger> guess that's part of why
[04:07] <chibihogoshino> its behind and not always right
[04:13] <cyberanger> http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/03/21/tanks-deploy-in-yemen-capital-as-top-general-defects/
[04:13] <cyberanger> what's behind and not always right?
[04:16] <chibihogoshino> thats not news from japan tho
[04:17] <cyberanger> chibihogoshino: yeah, I know, I've gotta follow the Middle East too
[04:17] <chibihogoshino> oh
[04:17] <cyberanger> and that's one that's not really hit the mainstream much
[04:18] <cyberanger> I follow everything, right now that
[04:18] <cyberanger> s here, japan, middle east and canada
[04:18]  * cyberanger still hasn't gotten used to all his different keyboards
[04:19] <chibihogoshino>  different ?
[04:20] <cyberanger> esp the netbook, but yeah, netbook, laptop, desktop (and a few different boards) and smartphone
[04:21] <cyberanger> and this one hasn't been used alot lately
[04:21] <chibihogoshino> heh. damn
[04:22] <chibihogoshino> you could get a usb switch
[04:35] <cyberanger> chibihogoshino: for what?
[04:36] <cyberanger> hey Kurisu_Yamato
[04:36] <chibihogoshino> use the same keyboard for all the computers
[04:41] <cyberanger> chibihogoshino: not doable
[04:42] <cyberanger> desktop is PS/2
[04:42] <cyberanger> and netbook to laptop are hardwired
[04:42] <cyberanger> and it's the netbook and laptop really throwing the curveball
[04:42] <cyberanger> 42% to 98% to a multimedia full size
[04:43] <cyberanger> (lest I forget the smartphone, all thumbs there, but I'm used to that now)
[04:43] <cyberanger> nothing usb really
[04:44] <chibihogoshino> you can use usb on a laptop .. the desktop dosnt have a usb port ?
[04:51] <cyberanger> has one, my boards are ps/2
[04:51] <cyberanger> and why carry a keyboard and a laptop
[04:51] <cyberanger> or bulky keyboard and slim netbook
[04:56] <chibihogoshino> heh.. i was thinking .. using them all in the same room
[04:59] <cyberanger> yeah, I don't work that way
[05:00] <cyberanger> too much desire for mobility to sit still for only three computers
[05:00] <cyberanger> (if you can call a netbook a computer)
[05:02] <Kurisu_Yamato> oh hi guys. Sorry, a little busy on some other channels, I always autojoin this one... Hope things are going well. ANd yes, I think you can call a netbook a computer, as it has the normal guts and such. :D
[05:04] <cyberanger> while I disagree on calling it normal, underpowered guts and such I'll settle for ;-)
[05:04] <chibihogoshino> its great for basic things
[05:09] <cyberanger> and some niches
[05:10] <cyberanger> but this is more underpowered than most
[05:10] <cyberanger> Asus EEE 2G surf
[05:33] <Kurisu_Yamato> I mean normal as in it isn't a tabletPC, ipad, or whatever. XD
[05:37] <cyberanger> right, just soldered on RAM and SSD
[12:00] <wrst> anyone around this morning familiar with using xrandr commands?
[14:53] <chris4585> http://www.webupd8.org/2011/03/ubuntu-software-center-lets-you-test.html
[16:39] <wrst> hey chris4585
[17:24] <starsprout> heheh...never update when your hard disk is full :-o
[17:25] <starsprout> however my trusty boot disk helped me empty trash, then I could blindly type "sudo apt-get update" and -whew!- hooray
[21:02] <vychune> o/
[21:44] <chibihogoshino> vychune dosnt stay long


[02:29] <jonathan1104> hi everyone
[15:17] <JerryNJ> need some help with LTSP
[15:17] <JerryNJ> apparently dhcpd is running and shouldnt be
[15:17] <JerryNJ> anyone might be able to help?


[00:23] <HERM3S> any Xorg gurus home?
[00:33] <tomreyn> your best place for support is #ubuntu and then there is /topic
[00:44] <HERM3S> I was told to come here
[00:44] <HERM3S> I did submit a bug as well tomreyn
[00:45] <tomreyn> oh sorry then, i guess you'll just need to be patienct then.
[00:46] <tomreyn> i don't rmeember seeing the bug report url / id, though.
[00:46] <HERM3S> yep, seems that way
[22:16] <HERM3S> any xOrg gurus home?


[18:31] <youngbin_> Hello :) How things are going with reviewing some legal stuffs before giving some access to UbuCon Asia organizers for Indico?


[19:32] <wxl> sgclark: do you know why i can't attend our session?
[19:33] <sgclark> wxl: umm wut?
[19:33] <wxl> sgclark: usually at the header there's several links: attend, blueprint, subscribe
[19:33] <wxl> sgclark: i only see blueprint
[19:34] <wxl> sgclark: btw i really really really really really thank you for offering to present
[19:34] <sgclark> wxl: I will have to CC you with the nice fella that has been helping me with UOS.  I just can't promise I will be any good at it.
[19:38] <wxl> sgclark: ahahahahh well no worries, i can take it over
[19:38] <sgclark> wxl: I definately cannot come up  with content though. I am trying to figure out hours to slee as it is
[19:38] <sgclark> sleep*
[19:38] <wxl> sgclark: yeah well i think that's what we talked about. i just hand you a slideshow.
[19:38] <sgclark> wxl: maybe we can both present?
[19:38] <wxl> sgclark: sure we could do that
[19:39] <wxl> i'll just tear the slideshow in half :)
[19:39] <sgclark> wxl: ok let's both then
[19:39] <wxl> sgclark: seriously though if you can't get enough sleep, there's no need to attend
[19:39] <wxl> sgclark: i'm going to re-assign the talk to me
[19:40] <sgclark> wxl: oh I want to attend :) this is very important to me. I just took on a project for KDE that is a bit above my head lol.
[19:40] <wxl> sgclark: ok well i'm probably just freaking out for nothing. looking at my schedule i can't see why i can't do it
[19:41] <sgclark> wxl: I CC'd you on an email to a very knowledgable fella that has been helping me
[19:42] <wxl> sgclark: well i just opened the url in a new browser and i can attend there. it must be because it's a blueprint i'm subscribed to that attend is not an option
[19:42] <wxl> sgclark: the whole two ways to make a session is confusing!
[19:42] <sgclark> wxl: yeah, I failed utterly as a track lead, nothing worked :(
[19:42] <wxl> sgclark: anyways, here's what i think we should do for our own sanity: i'll take the responsibility to do the talk and if you want to show up and help out great
[19:43] <wxl> sgclark: that way i don't have to figure out how to dissect things for the two of us and that way you don't have to feel the pressure to do anything XD
[19:43] <sgclark> wxl: I will be there
[19:43] <wxl> sgclark: i can't wait :)
[19:43] <sgclark> wxl: :)


[00:05] <blue_anna> how would I build just the drivers in /usr/src/linux-source-2.6.32/drivers/media/video/em28xx
[00:09] <blue_anna> I only see .o objects in the Makefile, no .ko's
[00:13] <blue_anna> anyone here just now?
[00:24] <blue_anna> anyone ever build a kernel module from inside the kernel source tree?
[01:06] <blue_anna> blue_anna: make M=dir modules
[01:06] <blue_anna> blue_anna: oo thanks
[08:04] <fqh> Hi, can nvidia driver be used under custom compiled kernel?
[08:28] <maks_> use nouveau fqh
[08:29] <fqh> nouveau seems be in kernel source.
[13:34] <cao> does the kernel 2.6.34-5.12 (from ppa) include the latest (20th of may merged to mainline) pcie hotplug patches?
[13:36] <Kano> apw: CONFIG_SND_PCM_OSS is not set?
[13:36] <Kano> why did you disable the oss emulation?
[13:38] <Kano> # CONFIG_SND_MIXER_OSS is not set
[13:38] <Kano> # CONFIG_SND_PCM_OSS is not set
[13:38] <Kano> # CONFIG_SND_SEQUENCER_OSS is not set
[13:38] <Kano> i would enable those...
[13:39] <pgraner-afk> Kano: they are deprecated and they were disabled on upstreams recommendation
[13:40] <Kano> thats stupid for old games
[13:48] <pgraner-afk> Kano: its not stupid, the rest of the userspace support is not there yet that will allow the older games to work. see the blueprint [1] or https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/579300   [1] https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/kernel-maverick-config-review
[13:48] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 579300 in linux (Ubuntu) "Please disable CONFIG_SOUND_OSS* and CONFIG_SND_*OSS* (affects: 2)" [Wishlist,Fix released]
[13:51] <apw> Kano, those are disabled to allow userspace to emulate them instead, its possible that is not yet in place
[13:51] <Kano> that does not work well
[13:52] <apw> you are welcome to change it in your config, the plan currently is to use userspace emulation.  if there are issues we'll find out in testing
[13:53] <Kano> kanotix users have problems because of it, will change it of course
[14:18] <parren> I'm bothered by slow resume times on my MacBook Pro seemingly due to the battery driver. Likely a problem related to VirtualBox having trouble with sporadic hangs of Windows clients unless you remove the ACPI driver from the Windows client. See https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pm-utils/+bug/575180.
[14:18] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 575180 in pm-utils (Ubuntu) "PM: resume of drv:battery dev:PNP0C0A:00 complete after 59348.072 msecs (affects: 2) (heat: 12)" [Undecided,New]
[14:18] <parren> Does anyone have a pointer as to how I could contribute to getting the root of this?
[16:31] <crimsun> cnd: Intel+Sigmatel/IDT isn't affected
[16:32] <crimsun> aren't, rather


[10:08] <akxwi_dave> Howdo all..
[11:26] <knome> good day
[11:34] <akxwi_dave> morning
[12:58] <flocculant> good day
[12:59] <knome> hullo flocculant
[12:59] <flocculant> hi knome :)
[13:04] <flocculant> knome: how much use would it be for team to know when test calls are going out? I can see it being helpful for people who fix and upload stuff
[13:04] <knome> guess it could be useful to have some kind of communication
[13:04] <knome> so that developers would have time to fix bugs they intend to before testing
[13:04] <flocculant> I enabled the calendar output on the qa trello board this morning so I get that in tbird - but perhaps we could add it to the team calendar
[13:04] <knome> or do syncs or whatever
[13:05] <knome> otoh, i don't know if that would make much of a difference - if they don't have time, they don't
[13:05] <knome> yeah, we can do that
[13:05] <knome> i just got to figure out how then...
[13:05] <flocculant> though trello's not specific on what app is being tested
[13:05] <knome> yeah
[13:06] <flocculant> https://trello.com/calendar/55b334f9c60b8b8c3d8238ce/52a3757d214733820a0023ea/887155a22b2671cc23503acf0ad18dca.ics
[13:06] <knome> let's see...
[13:06] <flocculant> is the iCal feed
[13:15] <knome> flocculant, should show up in the tracker now :)
[13:15] <flocculant> knome: thank you :)
[13:16] <knome> np
[13:16] <knome> happy with the color?
[13:16] <flocculant> yea
[13:16] <knome> good
[13:16] <flocculant> just glad it's not red :p
[13:16] <knome> :D
[13:17] <flocculant> knome: did you catch any of the rambling discussion krytarik and I got into the other day about the cont docs?
[13:17] <flocculant> which can in fact be boiled down to 1 statement and 1 question :D
[13:18] <knome> i looked at it briefly but haven't read it throughout
[13:18] <flocculant> well then simply :)
[13:19] <flocculant> A team lead should get sign-off/review opportunity on a page that concerns them.
[13:19] <knome> yep
[13:19] <flocculant> Any reason why these pages need to have Xubuntu all over them?
[13:19] <flocculant> :)
[13:19]  * knome shrugs
[13:19] <knome> part of that is that the content is mostly copied from other sources
[13:19] <flocculant> probably the qa ones are fullest - mostly copied from elsewhere :)
[13:19] <flocculant> yea :)
[13:20] <knome> so no readon
[13:20] <knome> *reason
[13:20] <knome> and for the review part
[13:20] <knome> the MP review system can be used for other kind of reviews than technical
[13:20] <flocculant> yea
[13:20] <knome> so just push it in through an MP unless you have talked with the appropriate team lead
[13:21] <flocculant> yep
[13:21] <knome> so far i've just pushed things in without asking, because as said, it's just copies from other sources
[13:21] <flocculant> yea I know
[13:21] <flocculant> just looking ahead some
[13:21] <knome> yep
[13:21] <knome> same thing as alwyas
[13:21] <flocculant> :)
[13:21] <knome> sigh, always*
[13:22] <flocculant> heh
[13:22] <knome> team leads lead their team, no soloing
[13:22] <flocculant> I wouldn't for instance notice an MP there unless I had done it myself
[13:22] <knome> of course not, since you aren't a reviewer
[13:23] <flocculant> so perhaps team lead added as reviewer of changes concerning them
[13:23] <flocculant> anyway - as always it'll come out in the wash :)
[13:23] <knome> our team is so small that i don't think this is even a sensible discusson in some sense, but if i see a change that concerns QA that i know that isn't ran through you, be sure i'll poke you
[13:24] <knome> and i expect slickyma1ter to do the exact same thing
[13:24] <flocculant> yep that works of course
[13:24] <knome> if a non-team member pushes an MP, then it's weird enough anyway
[13:24] <flocculant> yea
[13:24] <flocculant> I agree the team is small and we all talk to each other anyway
[13:26] <flocculant> btw - I subscribed to that fop bug - not likely to be too much of an issue now for anyone no pdf's, but if it's still dying in 3 months
[13:27] <knome> the new fop is landing sooner or later
[13:27] <knome> it's in proposed and FTBFS, but it's on its way
[13:27] <knome> once the versions match, the pdfs will build again
[13:28] <flocculant> yea I know
[13:28] <knome> but yeah, good to track it
[13:28] <knome> the bug can be even added to our blueprints
[13:28] <flocculant> was just thinking that
[13:29] <flocculant> then I can stop marking the mail unread :p
[13:29] <knome> yup :P
[13:29] <flocculant> done :)
[13:30] <flocculant> then undone and redone somewhere else :)
[13:31] <knome> heh
[13:31] <flocculant> added it to the doc bp rather than the bug one
[13:31] <knome> yes, probably appropriate that way
[13:31] <knome> but ultimately - who cares ;)
[13:31] <flocculant> yep
[13:32] <knome> it's true what simon said - i've used LP less now that we have the tracker
[13:32] <flocculant> same
[13:32] <knome> the old tracker couldn't exactly do that
[13:32] <flocculant> one bookmark instead of 7 or 8 for a start :)
[13:32] <knome> there were still situations when it was easier to look at LP
[13:32] <knome> heh, yeah
[13:33] <knome> i wouldn't even need a bookmark
[13:33] <flocculant> well me neither now - tr in the url bar will bring it up first :)
[13:35] <knome> location bar -> tr -> most used link
[13:35] <flocculant> that's what I meant :)
[13:35] <knome> see #xubuntu-offtopic and my lag whine
[13:35] <knome> :P
[13:47] <flocculant> they'll show up eventually with dates
[14:25] <flocculant> welcome back akxwi_dave :)
[14:35] <akxwi_dave> afternoon flocculant
[14:36] <akxwi_dave> well thats another stupid windows server that went stupid due to an update...
[14:36] <flocculant> ooops
[14:39] <akxwi_dave> tell me.. luckily they are all virtual servers and snapshots.. so didn't take too long to sort out.
[14:39] <flocculant> :)
[14:42] <flocculant> akxwi_dave: I replied
[14:46] <akxwi_dave> cheers flocculant
[14:46] <akxwi_dave> just about to send the email to the dev list
[14:47] <flocculant> excellent :)
[14:48] <akxwi_dave> and sent :-)
[14:50] <flocculant> cool - did the poll thing :)
[14:51] <akxwi_dave> cheers.. though i'd better answer it as well
[14:52] <flocculant> akxwi_dave: maybe add that people can join the channel easily via the tracker IRC tab
[14:54] <flocculant> we've had 9 people join the testers lp group this cycle
[14:57] <flocculant> akxwi_dave: well that's good we can both be there any time :p
[15:01] <flocculant> akxwi_dave: not sure if I said, but I added you to the QA trello thing - so you can do whatever there
[15:02] <akxwi_dave> thx,  thats good 9 new testers...
[15:16] <akxwi_dave> What is it with Windows Servers today.. The SQL servers just thrown a wobbly, seriously some one needs to write a Legal Practice Management System for Linux.
[15:28] <flocculant> akxwi_dave: I forwarded the session mail to users
[15:30] <akxwi_dave> thx
[15:43] <flocculant> akxwi_dave: not sure about mailing the testers LP page about how to test :)
[15:48] <akxwi_dave> ;-)
[16:20] <akxwi_dave> thx
[16:23] <SwissBot> feed xubuntu-docs had 4 updates, showing the latest 3
[16:24] <flocculant> wut?
[16:24] <flocculant> why does that keep repeating old stuff ... unless because I use the same branch name *shrug*
[16:25] <flocculant> akxwi_dave: nice one from zleap :)
[16:36] <akxwi_dave> time to go.. cya all later
[16:37] <flocculant> cya :)
[20:10] <dkessel> i think i forgot to thank bluesabre for enabling gtk3 builds of mousepad in the ppa; thank you, bluesabre :)
[20:10] <dkessel> it enabled me to get started on an autopilot. now i only have to fight bugs and missing features in the testing tools to get the manual test implemented as an automatic one...
[20:47] <flocculant> dkessel: that's the first positive thing I've heard about our apps :)
[21:09] <knome> well i can tell a lot of positive things about our apps
[21:09] <knome> negative too, though..
[21:10] <flocculant> I can tell lots of negative in relation to autotesting - nice to see something positive
[21:17] <knome> ;)
[22:13] <ochosi> late evening all
[22:21] <ochosi> what's new?
[22:22] <knome> everything that is not old
[22:22] <knome> (ta-dahhhh!)
[23:57] <bluesabre> hey everyone
[23:57] <bluesabre> dkessel: np
[23:57] <Unit193> bluesabre: My KY weirdo!
[23:57] <bluesabre> :D
[23:57] <knome> hullo bluesabre
[23:58] <bluesabre> hey Unit193, knome


[00:00] <niemeyer> Haha
[00:00] <niemeyer> hazmat: Sorry about that
[00:00] <niemeyer> :)
[00:00] <hazmat> kirkland, yeah.. its something in libevent/epoll handling
[00:00] <niemeyer> kirkland: Blame linux, apparently :-(
[00:01] <SpamapS> DOH
[00:01] <SpamapS> ensemble depends on ssh
[00:01] <SpamapS> gotta love what testing in clean chroots does
[00:07] <_mup_> ensemble/trunk r333 committed by<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[00:07] <_mup_> Workaround lock up bug in tmux/epoll/whatever. [r=hazmat]
[00:07] <_mup_> Thanks a lot to Kapil and Juan for debugging this issue for hours.
[00:08] <niemeyer> negronjl: Just asked for a build in the ppa
[00:10] <kirkland> niemeyer: et al: I'm outta here... talk to you folks later
[00:10] <kirkland> niemeyer: hit me with any others you hit
[00:10] <kirkland> later
[00:10] <niemeyer> kirkland: Thanks for your help
[00:10] <SpamapS> hm.. trying to figure out the best way to include AWS creds on this jenkins box without giving away everything.
[00:10] <niemeyer> kirkland: Have a good EOW :)
[00:11] <negronjl> niemeyer: thx.  I'll work with it when I see it.  Thank you and hazmat and kirkland for working on this.
[00:54] <niemeyer> negronjl: My pleasure
[00:54] <niemeyer> negronjl: I'm glad we managed to find it
[00:54] <negronjl> niemeyer: me too :)
[00:54] <niemeyer> It's certainly going towards the obscure side :-)
[00:55] <negronjl> heheh....ensemble bugs are going towards the dark side ...lol
[00:55] <niemeyer> Worse than the problem was a friend asking on G+ "Why would you redirect stderr to /dev/null?"
[00:56] <negronjl> the more and more people start playing with ensemble's source, you'll start getting these kinds of questions more and more.... be ready :P
[00:56] <niemeyer> negronjl: Hehe :)
[01:30] <hazmat> niemeyer, afaics it is a bug in tmux, i don't really see any concrete pointers to why they think its libevent/epoll
[02:20] <niemeyer> hazmat: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=631984
[02:21] <hazmat> niemeyer, not very concrete, the author says there is a bug.. its not reported/linked to the bug anywhere..
[02:22] <niemeyer> hazmat: There's evidence that using select rather than epoll works
[02:23] <hazmat> fair enough... niemeyer have a good weekend
[02:23] <niemeyer> hazmat: Thanks dude, have a good one
[02:44] <_mup_> ensemble/fix-functional-testing r333 committed by<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[02:44] <_mup_> More robust test_bootstrap_and_connect testing
[04:16] <_mup_> ensemble/expose-cleanup r332 committed by<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[04:16] <_mup_> Delete security groups in the background
[04:17] <_mup_> ensemble/expose-cleanup r333 committed by<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[04:17] <_mup_> Removed debugging
[14:35] <_mup_> ensemble/go-formulas r7 committed by<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[14:35] <_mup_> Implemented initial metadata.yaml reading and parsing.
[14:43] <_mup_> Bug #835479 was filed: Parsing metadata.yaml is needed in Go <Ensemble:New> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/835479 >


[00:00] <FFEMTcJ> hey dhillon-v10
[00:00] <dhillon-v10> FFEMTcJ, hey what's up
[00:01] <dhillon-v10> FFEMTcJ, I didn't you triage bugs
[00:01] <FFEMTcJ> tryin to
[00:01] <FFEMTcJ> lol
[00:01] <FFEMTcJ> is screenlets done upstream? if it isnt then the way it is would be fine.. just needs to be confirmed.
[00:01] <dhillon-v10> FFEMTcJ, can you help me out with that bug
[00:01] <dhillon-v10> FFEMTcJ, yah that one
[00:08] <lifeless> dhillon-v10: so that is an upstream bug tassk; the ubuntu rules for triage * do not apply * to upstreams - they may do it differently.
[00:09] <lifeless> dhillon-v10: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/screenlets is where you will find the Ubuntu tasks for screenlets.
[00:09] <dhillon-v10> lifeless, thanks :)
[00:47] <feasty> Hi there. I am looking into how to go about getting started fixing bugs for Ubuntu. Can anyone point me in the right direction to start working on fixing some bugs. I have read the wiki pages but cant seem to see where I would go to pick one up to work on. Can anyone help me please?
[00:47] <lifeless> bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu
[00:47] <lifeless> theres about 100K there to choose from
[00:48] <micahg> feasty: we do bug triage in here, not fixing
[00:48] <feasty> ah ok
[00:48] <feasty> sorry
[00:48] <micahg> hmmm
[00:48] <micahg> do we actually have a place for fixing?
[00:49] <micahg> #ubuntu-motu is probably the closest thing
[00:49] <lifeless> ubuntu-devel, ubuntu-motu
[00:49] <micahg> feasty: ^^
[00:49] <feasty> Well im a developer and was looking to help out
[00:49] <micahg> feasty: that's great!
[00:49] <lifeless> its not really offtopic for ubuntu-bugs, but the skillset of folk that hang out is different
[00:49] <feasty> I was told that fixing was a good way in ubuntu-dev channel
[00:49] <micahg> there are numerous ways to help out
[00:50] <micahg> fixing bugs, triage bugs, answering questions
[00:50] <feasty> yeah I do a lot of the helping out people with linux in general but I was really looking to program if I can.
[00:52] <micahg> feasty: ok, let's go to #ubuntu-motu
[00:52] <feasty> ok thanks
[00:53] <feasty> shall I just fire my question out in there again?
[00:54] <micahg> well, I'll talk to you over there
[00:54] <feasty> ok
[01:03] <cdavis> Would someone tell me if it appears as though I worked Bug 489726 correctly?
[01:03] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 489726 in ebox-dhcp "Can't create PID file /var/run/dhcpd.pid: Permission denied" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/489726
[01:03] <cdavis> Would someone tell me if it appears as though I worked Bug 489726 correctly?
[01:04] <cdavis> Would someone tell me if it appears as though I worked Bug 489726 correctly?
[01:04] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 489726 in ebox-dhcp "Can't create PID file /var/run/dhcpd.pid: Permission denied" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/489726
[01:04] <cdavis> sorry
[01:06] <micahg> cdavis: looks ok to me, does it work with that change?
[01:08] <cdavis> micahg: It appears to. no error in log about pid file and it creates it properly
[01:13] <micahg> well, the pid is hardcoded in a .pm file
[01:14] <micahg> I meant the pid file
[01:15] <cdavis> I was afraid it might be looking for it like that.
[01:15] <micahg> I wonder if it's an apparmor thing
[01:15] <cdavis> Yes, I believe it is apparmor blocking it
[01:16] <cdavis> I guess the other change could be to add that rule to apparmor
[01:16] <cdavis> I can work on that and see if it works
[01:16] <micahg> what's happening, is it trying to start the server?
[01:17] <cdavis> ebox is starting dhcpd from a custom init script
[01:17] <cdavis> and I thikn apparmor is blocking the creation of the pid file in /var/run
[01:17] <micahg> cdavis: why should it use a custom script in the first place?
[01:18] <micahg> yeah, I just confirmed that apparmor specifies the PID file for dhcpd3
[01:18] <cdavis> I wondered the same thing, but I don't know much about ebox
[01:19] <cdavis> so, should my concentration be on helping the person who filed the bug get it working or figuring out the correct way to fix it moving forward?
[01:20] <micahg> cdavis: depends on your goal...from a triage point of view, I think we need to figure out if this is an upstream issue or ours
[01:20] <micahg> cdavis: you can certainly mark your fix as a workaround
[01:21] <micahg> but that's not a fix
[01:21] <micahg> cdavis: to add a workaround, edit the description and clearly add a WORKAROUND section
[01:25] <cdavis> OK.
[01:25] <micahg> I'm trying to chat with the ebox people now
[01:26] <micahg> if they aren't going to use the system start script, we might need to patch the source
[01:43] <cdavis> Can I actually edit my comment or do I need to post another one?
[01:43] <micahg> cdavis: you can't edit a comment, you have to edit the description to post a workaround
[03:00] <nigel_nb> micahg: got a min?
[03:00] <nigel_nb> bug 430575, I can't understand what the user is trying to say
[03:00] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 430575 in gnome-screensaver "CTRL-ALT-L or Fn+F2 does not turn off display backlight" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/430575
[03:10] <spO> can one of you work on this bug:   https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+source/fglrx-installer/+bug/440233
[03:10] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 440233 in fglrx-installer "fglrx fails at startup because of missing amdpcsdb.default + removal leaves bad settings in Xorg.conf" [High,Confirmed]
[03:15] <micahg> hi nigel_nb
[03:15] <nigel_nb> hey micahg :)
[03:16] <micahg> spO: you should probably check with #ubuntu-x on Monday
[03:17] <micahg> nigel_nb: I think the assumption is that if the screen is black the backlight should be off
[03:17] <micahg> nigel_nb: I suggest checking b.g.o for a bug
[03:17] <nigel_nb> bgo?
[03:18] <micahg> bugzilla.gnome.org
[03:18] <nigel_nb> micahg: ah :)
[03:21] <nigel_nb> this looks like the right one
[03:21] <nigel_nb> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=541717
[03:21] <ubot4> Gnome bug 541717 in general "'Lock Screen' applet should give option to 'Power Down Screen' - useful for laptops" [Enhancement,Unconfirmed]
[03:22] <micahg> nigel_nb: looks right, you know how to add an upstream task?
[03:22] <nigel_nb> yep
[03:22] <nigel_nb> adding
[03:23] <micahg> actually not exactly but that would work
[03:25] <nigel_nb> technically, he's asking for the same thing
[03:25] <micahg> yeah, I think we should probably reassign to match upstream
[03:25] <nigel_nb> can you take a look now and let me know if i did everything right?
[03:26] <micahg> nigel_nb: I think it's actually gnome-panel
[03:26] <micahg> upstream
[03:26] <nigel_nb> not gnome-power?
[03:26] <micahg> if lock-screen is to do it, that's part of the panel
[03:29] <nigel_nb> upstream bug report mistake
[03:30] <nigel_nb> do you want me report a new bug upstream?
[03:31] <micahg> nigel_nb: nah, I can edit it
[03:31] <micahg> nigel_nb: wait, what do you mean mistake?
[03:34] <nigel_nb> the person who reported it upstream
[03:34] <nigel_nb> reported it against gnome-power
[03:34] <micahg> nigel_nb: yes, but the upstream dev moved it to gnome-panel as the lock applet should turn off the backlight
[03:35] <nigel_nb> yeah, just noticed that, then why is launchpad not recognizing it?
[03:35] <micahg> nigel_nb: LP picks upstream based on the ubuntu task
[03:35] <micahg> I"ll fix it
[03:36] <nigel_nb> :) thanks
[03:37] <micahg> nigel_nb: fixed and triaged
[03:37] <nigel_nb> thanks a lot micah :)
[03:37] <micahg> nigel_nb: thank you for finding the upstream :)
[03:38] <nigel_nb> my 2 bits ;)
[03:52] <nigel_nb> micahg: how well do u play chess?
[03:52] <micahg> nigel_nb: depends
[03:52] <micahg> why?
[03:53] <nigel_nb> bug 489754, I tried reproducing it, but I think it happens only in one case
[03:53] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 489754 in gnome-games "The GNU Chess stops working once you use Ctrl+z. It goes on thinking..." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/489754
[03:53] <nigel_nb> it happens only when u ctrl + z and then take one of the computer's pieces
[03:53] <micahg> nigel_nb: you tried on karmic?
[03:53] <nigel_nb> I could get to that situtaion only once
[03:53] <nigel_nb> yeah karmic
[03:53] <nigel_nb> since I dont play all that well...
[03:54] <micahg> nigel_nb: have you checked upstream?
[03:54] <nigel_nb> not yet
[03:54] <nigel_nb> ohh
[03:55] <nigel_nb> checking
[03:57] <nigel_nb> nothing upstream
[03:57] <nigel_nb> its a very rare bug
[03:59] <micahg> nigel_nb: gnome 596128
[03:59] <ubot4> Gnome bug 596128 in General "legal move is not recognized" [Major,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=596128
[04:00] <nigel_nb> micahg: bingo :)
[04:00] <micahg> if only bmo was so easy to search :)
[04:01] <nigel_nb> mozilla?
[04:01] <micahg> yep
[04:01] <micahg> nigel_nb: do you have a gnome upstream account?
[04:02] <nigel_nb> yep
[04:02] <nigel_nb> if I dont find one, I generally file one
[04:02] <micahg> can you post our LP bug in that upstream and mark confirmed if you can
[04:02] <micahg> actually, you probably can't mark confirmed
[04:02] <micahg> but please add our bug link so that upstream can confirm
[04:03] <nigel_nb> will do :)
[04:04] <micahg> nigel_nb: can you post the link upstream for that one you did earlier as well?
[04:04] <nigel_nb> micahg: sure.
[04:05] <nigel_nb> eh, what do I say?
[04:05] <micahg> just a link to our LP bug, like also reported in Ubuntu: bug link
[04:05] <nigel_nb> okay :)
[04:07] <nigel_nb> micahg: done.
[04:08] <micahg> nigel_nb: nice :)
[04:08] <nigel_nb> learning my way :)
[04:08] <micahg> nigel_nb: you're doing great
[04:08] <micahg> I'll mark triaged
[04:08] <micahg> nigel_nb: what importance do you think it should have?
[04:09] <nigel_nb> honestly, low
[04:09] <nigel_nb> max medium
[04:09] <micahg> I'd say medium since it's in main and there's no workaround
[04:09] <nigel_nb> but medium is overkill, it only happens when you alt+z all the time (not always then either)
[04:10] <micahg> oh, so it's unusual?
[04:10] <micahg> ok, Low then
[04:10] <nigel_nb> yeah, I've been playing chess for 1 hour
[04:10] <nigel_nb> happened only twice
[04:10] <micahg> wow, that's dedication :)
[04:10] <nigel_nb> when I alt+z'd and then eat one of the computer's pieces
[04:10] <nigel_nb> eat/ate
[04:11] <nigel_nb> hahaha, nice to triage bugs in games
[04:11] <micahg> nigel_nb: BTW, it's generally a good idea to subscribe to what you triage in case there are issues later or if the reporter has questions
[04:12] <nigel_nb> shucks.. forgot
[04:12] <micahg> nigel_nb: you're doing great1
[04:13] <nigel_nb> :)
[05:01] <nigel_nb> can someone wishlist bug 489533 for me please
[05:01] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 489533 in brasero "When adding files, Brasero should open the file dialog in the same directory as the last time a file was opened" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/489533
[05:57] <nigel_nb> wb micahg
[06:11] <micahg> nigel_nb: hi
[06:12] <nigel_nb> net split?
[06:12] <micahg> nigel_nb: no, I went somewhere
[06:12] <nigel_nb> oh ok
[06:12] <nigel_nb> can you wishlist bug 489533 for me please?
[06:14]  * micahg kicks ubot4
[06:15] <micahg> nigel_nb: LP seems down
[06:16] <nigel_nb> oh
[06:16] <nigel_nb> yeah :P
[06:16] <nigel_nb> thats when i stopped workin
[06:16] <nigel_nb> micahg: I'm thinking of helping out with motu
[06:17] <micahg> nigel_nb: cool
[06:17] <nigel_nb> how tough is the road ahead?
[06:17] <micahg> nigel_nb: depends what you want to do
[06:18] <micahg> just adding patches and updating stuff is pretty easy
[06:19] <nigel_nb> what about packaging and maintaining packages?
[06:40] <nigel_nb> launchpad is back up :)
[07:40] <micahg> nigel_nb: maintaining isn't too hard
[07:41] <nigel_nb> i'm going through the videos now, to get an idea of what needs to be done
[07:41] <micahg> nigel_nb: packaiging from scratch can be hard depending on what it is
[07:41] <nigel_nb> oh
[07:42] <micahg> nigel_nb: it can also be easy depending
[07:43] <nigel_nb> depending on the package?
[07:43] <micahg> nigel_nb: wishlist done
[07:43] <nigel_nb> thank you  :)
[07:43] <micahg> nigel_nb: some things are easier to package than others
[07:44] <nigel_nb> micahg: one step at a time thenn
[07:46] <nigel_nb> :)
[08:13] <jbicha> whenever I press Fn + F5 on my laptop, I end up crashing X
[08:14] <jbicha> I believe Fn + F5 is supposed to switch between laptop screen & an external screen
[08:17] <jbicha> I think this is part of the problem: [drm:i915_hangcheck_elapsed] *ERROR* Hangcheck timer elapsed... GPU hung
[08:18] <jbicha> what's the best way to report this bug?
[08:18] <micahg> I'm checking to see if it's reported already
[08:19] <micahg> jbicha: bug 440997
[08:19] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 440997 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[i915gm] Fn-F5 doesn't switch between inbuilt and aux display" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/440997
[08:20] <jbicha> micahg: thanks very much
[08:20] <micahg> jbicha: np
[08:20] <micahg> jbicha: you might want to comment that it is now crashing as well
[08:21] <jbicha> micahg: should I attach all those log files myself too?
[08:22] <micahg> jbicha: not unless asked, I'd just state your intel driver version
[18:36] <devtux87> Hello
[18:37] <devtux87> hi
[18:37] <LimCore> hello, Im wondering about the unusuall high reate of bugs in KDE applications in Ubuntu. Are most of them upstream, or are "we (Ubuntu developers
[18:38] <LimCore> hello, Im wondering about the unusuall high reate of bugs in KDE applications in Ubuntu. Are most of them upstream, or are "we" (Ubuntu developers) doing sometihng wrong (like shipping unsable versions)?
[18:39] <devtux87> Lime i don't think so ubuntu are buggy
[18:39] <devtux87> the errors in 80% of the hardware
[18:40] <devtux87> wich app is buggy for u?
[18:40] <LimCore> guys in #kde say ubuntu is more buggy the other distros, in terms of bugs in kde applications at least
[18:40] <LimCore> we are talking now on #kde
[18:40] <devtux87> :) im luky, im useing gnome :)
[18:40] <devtux87> *lucky
[18:40] <LimCore> well I use gnome, bug I use some kde applications
[18:41] <devtux87> well in gnome there are a lot's of bug too
[18:41] <LimCore> this "Im a kde/gnome user" thing is quite stupid imho, its like "Im user of applications written in C++ / in C / in Delphi"
[18:41] <devtux87> just see gnome commander, the hole program is seriously wrong :S
[18:41] <LimCore> I use some applications, some of them are happened to be using kde,  and this apps crash a lot:
[18:42] <LimCore> krusader - extreamly buggy, I can crash it daily
[18:42] <LimCore> kmail - very buggy
[18:42] <LimCore> ksysguard - one other example of application with bugs (small bugs, lost of settings, also crashes)
[18:42] <devtux87> krusader is better then gnome commander :) try it, please press space in any map, and you will ctach a segmentation fault
[18:42] <devtux87> :P
[18:43] <LimCore> for example, this guy seems to be sharing my pain: <Silicium> 9.10 is totally crap  <Silicium> i can report around 4 bugs per day
[18:43] <devtux87> and thats a big bug if you moveing files in another map
[18:43] <yofel> well, KDE is a bit buggy in karmic (and lucid so far), but not *that* buggy
[18:44] <LimCore> kmail was totally buggy for ever
[18:44] <devtux87> the 9.10 is not a very stable release
[18:44] <LimCore> and bugs in krusader I report since 2007. some are still not fixed fully it seems
[18:44] <yofel> well ok, that's one of the kde apps I don't use
[18:44] <devtux87> if i use hibernateing, i got a freeze
[18:44] <yofel> LimCore: lp or b.k.o?
[18:44] <LimCore> yofel: what?
[18:45] <yofel> LimCore: reported on launchpad or bugs.kde.org
[18:45] <LimCore> I report most of my bugs to pl
[18:45] <LimCore> pl
[18:45] <LimCore> lp.  Damn keyboard.
[18:45] <devtux87> :)
[18:45] <yofel> well, hibernate is forever broken here
[18:45] <devtux87> :D
[18:45] <yofel> jaunty and karmic are much better with suspend at least
[18:45] <LimCore> for me the experience is,  nowdays linuxes are less stable the windows 98
[18:46] <devtux87> if i suspend or hibernate in Hardy there is no error
[18:46] <LimCore> I mean the applications / desktops ; not the OS/kernel
[18:46] <devtux87> but i cant do in in jaunty and karmic
[18:46] <yofel> I don't think I've ever gotten a pc to wake up correctly after a hibernate
[18:46] <LimCore> yofel: I got mine afair
[18:46] <LimCore> or was it suspend to ram, not sure
[18:46] <devtux87> in the kernel there are a lots of serious bug
[18:46] <yofel> LimCore: true, sometimes I'm really reminded on Win98
[18:47] <yofel> especially with jaunty I had a lot of random hard locks with my thinkpad
[18:47] <LimCore> devtux87: they get patched quickly after discovery
[18:47] <devtux87> i have a pci wifi card, and the kernel working harmful if i connect it to the pci bus
[18:47] <LimCore> can't Ubuntu somehow improve QA
[18:48] <yofel> LimCore: well, there was some discussion about that on UDS too
[18:48] <LimCore> UDS?
[18:48] <yofel> we'll have to see what comes
[18:48] <devtux87> desktop freeze, alternate freeze, debian 5.0 freeze after loading network
[18:48] <devtux87> :S
[18:48] <yofel> LimCore: ubuntu developers summit
[18:48] <yofel> was 2 weeks ago afair
[18:48] <yofel> !uds
[18:48] <ubot4> The Ubuntu Developer Summit is being held November 16th-20th in Dallas, Texas, USA. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UDS for more information.
[18:49] <devtux87> well the system is not so good
[18:49] <devtux87> i written a c program under jaunty
[18:49] <yofel> well, kubuntu want's to report bugs rather to bugs.kde.org than lauchpad in the future
[18:49] <yofel> not enough manpower
[18:49] <devtux87> in jaunty it works well.... but in karmic, it exit by a segfault :S
[18:50] <LimCore> devtux87: what?
[18:50] <devtux87> so i turn now to lazarus, it is better
[18:50] <devtux87> i was written a program in C
[18:50] <devtux87> useing gcc
[18:50] <LimCore> do not use C fool
[18:50]  * LimCore slaps devtux87 with a modern-languages book
[18:51] <devtux87> i written it in jaunty, and it works well. then i moved to karmic, when i start my program: Segmentation falut
[18:51] <devtux87> :S
[18:51] <LimCore> writting in C is like writting in assembler sort of.  Loosing time on some low-level details
[18:51] <devtux87> *fault
[18:51] <yofel> http://www.kubuntu.org/news/timelord - if you're interested what's going to happen to kubuntu in the future
[18:51] <LimCore> devtux87: you obviously have to recompile right?
[18:51] <devtux87> i tryed
[18:51] <devtux87> but if i run the program segfault
[18:51] <devtux87> :S
[18:52] <LimCore> well.. it was quite possibly a bug in your program
[18:52] <devtux87> so i written my program again in lazarus, then it works well
[18:53] <devtux87> lazazus is like delphi, it has an fpc engine
[18:53] <LimCore> omg
[18:53] <LimCore> Pascal is so 1990's
[18:53] <yofel> well, jaunty=gcc4.3 karmic=gcc4.4, and I think 4.4 is more  strict in some cases
[18:53] <LimCore> you really have bad luck with picking languages
[18:53] <yofel> LimCore: pascal isn't that bad.
[18:53] <LimCore> whats next, visual basic? ;)
[18:54] <devtux87> maybe Visual C++ :D
[18:54] <yofel> LimCore: that's not for linux :P
[18:54] <yofel> use ADA :D
[18:54] <devtux87> lol
[18:54] <LimCore> why not use a reasonable language like C++ or perhaps D
[18:54] <devtux87> LimeCore the subsystem in ubuntu is written in C or C++ so dont complain about it :D
[18:55] <LimCore> C++ is reasonable; C is not
[18:55] <yofel> well, as long nobody want's to use java I'm happy ^^
[18:55] <devtux87> i think the kernel is written in C
[18:55] <yofel> devtux87: it is
[18:55] <LimCore> kernel and embbed are the only use-cases for C
[18:56] <LimCore> and some libs/APIs.  But not applications
[18:56] <devtux87> C are a good language if you know what going to do in it
[18:56] <devtux87> :)
[18:56] <yofel> true
[18:56] <devtux87> its a very free language!
[18:56] <LimCore> sure, a shivovel is a good building tool to build a sky scraper, if you know how to use it. And have x100 more time then needed
[18:56] <LimCore> *a shovel
[18:57] <devtux87> :)
[18:57] <devtux87> now i have to go... bye all have a nice day... :)
[18:57] <LimCore> fell freee to waste time on solving 9 memory-management problems and bugs,  per 1 actuall software feauture to implement
[22:31] <cdavis> I tested bug 490093 and I did not experience any problems. I suspect that this might be a user issue of some type but have no idea how to request more info?
[22:31] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 490093 in gnome-system-tools "Cannot change password with users-admin (gnome-system-tools)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/490093
[22:33] <micahg> hggdh: around?
[22:36] <cdavis> hmm, there might be a problem if you hit ok to get out of the user/group manager instead of hitting cancel. let me play some more
[22:36] <micahg> cdavis: I wish I had an answer
[22:48] <cdavis> micahg: I feel like bug 490093 might be a very quick fix possibly a candidate for the paper cuts?
[22:48] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 490093 in gnome-system-tools "Cannot change password with users-admin (gnome-system-tools)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/490093
[22:48] <cdavis> Have to run tho, be back in a bit
[23:08] <kklimonda> any idea what to ask for in bug 487923?
[23:08] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 487923 in transmission "bitmaps of "pause torrent" , "remove torrent" and "Properties" disapear from time to time" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/487923
[23:15] <hggdh> micahg: I am back
[23:15] <micahg> hggdh: it's ok, seems like the triager figured it out
[23:17] <hggdh> kklimonda: perhaps running from he command line and taking a screen shot?
[23:18] <hggdh> (there might be some debug messages written to stdout/stderr)
[23:19] <kklimonda> hmm, good idea
[23:23] <kklimonda> oh ffs, mutt has a built-in editor.. and I can't send mail because F10 launches gnome-terminal menu..
[23:24] <kklimonda> it was "jed"..


[09:21] <smooji> Hi is anyone here?
[12:04] <JohnTalent> well?
[12:44] <JohnTalent> well?
[15:57] <uli> u55b80


[18:06] <pleia2> anyone about today? for xubuntu's google code-in our docs projects depend upon docs.xubuntu.org working, but it's down, no response from IS on my ticket yesterday
[18:07] <pleia2> as I expect students will want to work on this over the holidays, this is not optimal


[07:27] <alkisg> Hi, I'm trying to convert lp:sch-scripts from bzr to git. The bzr branch was lp:~ts.sch.gr/sch-scripts/trunk, but I was using `bzr pull lp:sch-scripts` to pull. For git, what's the correct origin command before pushing? `git remote add origin lp:~ts.sch.gr/sch-scripts/trunk` ?
[07:30] <alkisg> Hmm, I used this one and it worked: git remote add origin<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[07:30] <alkisg> ...although I don't understand how it managed to use the correct group name, ts.sch.gr...
[07:33] <lmiccini> hello, anybody able to help with login issues? keep getting Error ID: OOPS-XXXX. thanks.
[08:29] <alkisg> I try to create a new git recipe but I get a bzr recipe instead!
[08:29] <alkisg> https://code.launchpad.net/~ts.sch.gr/sch-scripts/+git/sch-scripts/+ref/master/+new-recipe => I see "# git-build-recipe format 0.4 deb-version {debversion}~{revtime}", I click "Create Recipe" and then I get "# bzr-builder format 0.4 deb-version {debversion}~{revtime}"!!!
[08:30]  * alkisg tries that a third time...
[08:33] <alkisg> Yup, I don't think I'm doing anything wrong there
[08:33] <alkisg> I follow the steps to create a git recipe and I'm getting a bzr recipe instead
[08:33] <alkisg> Even the recipe contents change
[08:33]  * alkisg tries with a new recipe name, in case there's something wrong with launchpad cache...
[08:35] <alkisg> Nope, I still got a bzr recipe, https://code.launchpad.net/~ts.sch.gr/+recipe/sch-scripts-proposed-git
[08:36] <alkisg> It's a regression somewhere in launchpad, I was able to create git recipes in the past
[08:36] <alkisg> Help, please? :)
[09:48] <alkisg> Ah, the bug is that it thinks that lp:sch-scripts is bzr, while if I put the whole path, lp:~ts.sch.gr/sch-scripts/+git/sch-scripts, then it realizes it's git
[09:48] <alkisg> OK, it's a viable workaround until the bug is properly fixed
[09:51] <alkisg> It's a bit annoying that it rewrites lp:~ts.sch.gr/sch-scripts/+git/sch-scripts to lp:sch-scripts and then thinks it's bzr; so I have to remember to use the correct one every time I edit the recipe
[09:51] <cjwatson> lmiccini: We can help but only if you give us the actual OOPS ID.
[09:52] <cjwatson> alkisg: https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/1623924
[09:52] <alkisg> Thank you cjwatson :)
[10:05] <lmiccini> Hi cjwatson here it is OOPS-4d2e29bd4815255869dea1f212d75b61 thank you very much
[10:19] <cjwatson> lmiccini: Thanks.  There'll be a delay, since I'm in meetings right now and then have a medical appointment
[10:20] <lmiccini> cjwatson: no worries. thanks for you help.
[14:49] <cjwatson> lmiccini: Hi, sorry for the delay.  You had an old account, and I guess you must have deleted your login.ubuntu.com account at some point and then tried to recreate it.  Do you want to keep your old Launchpad account name?
[14:52] <lmiccini> cjwatson: Hi. I'd like to keep lmiccini as userid if possible
[14:54] <cjwatson> Er
[14:54] <cjwatson> That's neither of your IDs
[16:39] <EchoFog> Hi there
[16:39] <EchoFog> Launchpad's bug report form seems to be broken: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+filebug/?no-redirect
[16:40] <EchoFog> When I try to submit a bug, I get this - Timeout error: Sorry, something just went wrong in Launchpad
[16:42] <EchoFog> Error ID: OOPS-de2c4f605598154d1fe1af3faf5977dc
[16:44] <dobey> EchoFog: you should not file a bug against ubuntu itself, but against the package in ubuntu with which you have an issue
[16:45] <EchoFog> the issue is not with a package but with the ubuntu 16.10 release itself
[16:46] <EchoFog> the root of the problem is that the lvm2 & grub-pc have been removed from the live installation image starting with 16.10 causing some configurations to fail
[16:47] <EchoFog> Everything worked fine up until 16.04
[16:48] <nacc> EchoFog: LP can have bugs and timeouts sometimes
[16:49] <EchoFog> I believe this is not a timeout issue because apparently dobey was able to see what I submitted
[16:49] <nacc> EchoFog: probably dobey was responding to the URL you used
[16:50] <EchoFog> Yeah, I guess that's possible. Although I've tried more than a couple times within last 12 hours - each time the same error
[16:52] <dobey> yeah, if you got a timeout, the bug wasn't reported i don't think
[16:52] <dobey> try reporting it against grub-pc or lvm2 instead
[16:53] <nacc> "Original error: QueryCanceledError('canceling statement due to statement timeout\n',)"
[16:53] <nacc> was the LP OOPs
[16:53] <EchoFog> but there really is not issue with those packages and it wouldn't be right
[16:54] <EchoFog> the issue is with the lubuntu release package (and most likely ubuntu too - I haven't checked)
[16:54] <nacc> EchoFog: lvm2 is specifically not seeded on lubuntu-live
[16:55] <nacc> but it is on the other -live images, i think
[16:55] <nacc>   ubuntu: daily-live.
[16:55] <nacc>   lubuntu: daily
[16:55] <EchoFog> any idea why it was removed? It was definitely included up until 16.04
[16:56] <nacc> EchoFog: you'd want to ask lubuntu
[16:56] <cjwatson> That timeout bug is something we suffer from periodically, but it generally goes away within about 10 minutes.  We haven't got to the bottom of it yet.
[16:56] <EchoFog> and it's so horribly broken on 16.10 that I'm surprised it hasn't been reported yet
[16:56] <nacc> EchoFog: grub-pc appears to be seeded
[16:57] <EchoFog> nacc: are you referring to 16.10 release or daily builds?
[16:57] <nacc> EchoFog: the daily -- i'm not sure if i can easily see what was seeded on the release ISO
[16:57] <cjwatson> For the purposes of this particular timeout bug, it doesn't make a difference what you're trying to report it against.
[16:59] <EchoFog> thanks, will keep trying launchpad form then
[17:00] <EchoFog> So this does appear to be lubuntu specific bug then. If lvm is seeded on other live builds but not lubuntu-live
[17:00] <dobey> EchoFog, nacc: both grub-pc and lvm2 are on the ISO for 16.10: http://releases.ubuntu.com/16.10/ubuntu-16.10-desktop-amd64.manifest
[17:00] <dobey> oh lubuntu? don't know about that. but then you should file a bug against lubuntu, not ubuntu :)
[17:00] <nacc> dobey: yeah, lubuntu :/
[17:00] <cjwatson> Lubuntu is a flavour of Ubuntu and its bugs are tracked in the ubuntu distribution on Launchpad.
[17:01] <nacc> yep
[17:01] <dobey> right https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lubuntu-meta
[17:02] <dobey> would be where seed bugs should go
[17:02] <cjwatson> indeed
[17:02] <EchoFog> sure enough, both packages are missing from http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/lubuntu/releases/16.10/release/lubuntu-16.10-desktop-amd64.manifest
[17:02] <dobey> EchoFog: ^^ you should file your bug against that package. hopefully the timeout has disappeared now
[17:07] <EchoFog> successfully submitted bug against lubuntu-meta. Thanks!
[20:34] <chiluk> is there a way to get e-mail notifications for all bugs that have a certain tag?
[20:40] <nacc> chiluk: i don't think so -- but that's based upon my reading of https://help.launchpad.net/Bugs/Subscriptions
[20:41] <chiluk> yeah .. that's the same conclusion I came to after reading that as well.
[20:48] <chiluk> thanks nacc
[21:17] <cjwatson> 21:11 <cjwatson> chiluk: You have to pick a target (project, distribution, etc.), but after that, go to the bugs page for the target (e.g. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu) -> Edit bug mail -> Add a subscription -> are added or changed
[21:17] <cjwatson>                  in any way (more options...) -> Bugs must match this filter (...) -> Tags
[21:17] <cjwatson> in case anyone else here was wondering
[21:18] <chiluk> ^nacc since you came to the same conclusion as I did earlier.
[21:19] <nacc> cjwatson: ah interesting
[21:20] <cjwatson> also API methods such as addBugSubscription and addBugSubscriptionFilter, though I've never tried doing anything that way
[21:21] <nacc> chiluk: thanks


 I've been out of the loop. You guys going to code camp tomorrow?
 Yep
 Yep
 Yay
 Horay!
 I tried to boot from USB ubuntu and got this message:
 You need to make a 32bit copy of Ubuntu. The one you have is 64
 This machine is too old
 I've tried downloading ubuntu in past and couldn't.  That's y i had to get this usb version from u guys in person.
 How to create a bootable USB stick on Windows | Ubuntu … https://www.ubuntu.com/download/desktop/create-a-usb-stick-on-windows
 So dunno wut else i can do to make it work. I think the reason I couldn't download any ubuntu versions was cuz the files were all too big for my slowwww wifi.
 It's really simple.  You just need to get the software, an iso, and a USB drive.  Start the program, locate the iso, and select the drive.  Then press the button and wait.
 That's a different story.
 @AdamOutler, This iso way....it doesn't require me to boot from USB drive, right?
 Use the library if your internet is that slow.
 Or McDonald's
 @AdamOutler, Ohhh yeahhh. Good idea. I'll try that, but the library computer sometimes restricts users on what they can download due to virus protection.
 @AdamOutler, Ohhh I'll try that. 😉
 I'm not trying to get rid of you.  I'm just trying to get you the quickest solution.
 I don't have time to make a usb drive and bring it anywhere.
 @AdamOutler, Oh, no. I didn't think that at all. 😉 it is the quickest and easiest solution. 😉
 @whisperit2me, But is this true? I'm only guessing. 😝
 @KMyers up for anything tonight?
 @Ivoriesablaze, Depends. What time are you guys getting out
 We're already at the Duffys
 Dunno what there is to do
 @RazPi, Hey. Sorry I fell asleep. What's up?
 Lmao!


[00:03] <chrisccoulson> could someone approve that please? ^^^ :-)
[00:18] <slangasek> chrisccoulson: accepted
[00:18] <chrisccoulson> slangasek, thanks
[00:18] <slangasek> ScottK: did you need someone else to wave the kde no-change builds through?
[00:39] <YokoZar> Can I get my wine1.3 upload approved?  It removes a binary package and I figure the sooner we get that out of the archive the less problems we get.
[01:04] <slangasek> YokoZar: this looks like a new upstream release that's subject to feature freeze; has this been ok'ed already by ubuntu-release?
[01:19]  * NCommander debugs antimon
[01:19] <NCommander> y
[01:20] <NCommander> why are we building an iso for mx5?
[01:20] <NCommander>  oneiric-preinstalled-desktop-armel+mx5.iso            14-Sep-2011 04:02  1.5G  Preinstalled desktop CD for Freescale i.MX5x computers (standard download)
[01:20] <NCommander> thats wrong in like 5 different ways
[01:42] <YokoZar> slangasek: Err, no, but I can vouch for it being better since I've been testing them all cycle
[01:42] <YokoZar> I'll mark the bug
[01:47] <YokoZar> fwiw I've always felt that Wine point releases generally fall under the "only bugfixes" general exception
[01:55] <stgraber> oops, seems like that update-grub call in friendly-recovery's postinst is failing quite miserably in the livefs chroots...
[01:59] <stgraber> apparently memtest86 installs fine when checking for /boot/grub/grub.cfg too, guess I'll do that too then
[02:02] <stgraber> uploaded
[02:02] <micahg> skaet: don't we get another week of being unfrozen after beta 2 before final freeze?
[02:03] <skaet> micahg, yes
[02:03]  * skaet wonders if one of her recent emails was unclear... sigh.
[02:03] <micahg> just checked, same wording was in the beta 1 freeze notice...
[02:04] <micahg> This line prompted the question: From now on,  all uploads to the archive and any user user interface
[02:04] <micahg> changes will have to be approved manually by the release team.
[02:04] <skaet> good point,  was only until beta 2 comes out.
[02:05] <skaet> when beta 2 is announced, please remind me to send something out to set the context for the last few weeks.   probably needed.
[02:07] <micahg> skaet: I will try to remember :)
[02:07] <skaet> micahg, me too.   But I suspect I'll need to be reminded.  :)
[02:09] <stgraber> would be nice to have that friendly-recovery change reviewed as soon as LP generated the diff. It's currently making livefs builds fail :(
[02:14] <skaet> stgraber, done
[02:20] <stgraber> skaet: thanks
[02:20] <stgraber> skaet: I'm guessing pretty much all the livefs failed to build?
[02:20] <skaet> stgraber, thanks for the fix. :)
[02:20] <stgraber> skaet: I'm only getting the e-mails for Edubuntu
[02:22] <skaet> stgraber: ??
[02:23] <skaet> do we have problem with one of the mail lists?
[02:24] <stgraber> no, I was just wondering if you indeed got a lot of livefs build failures in your inbox. I'm only marked as a contact for Edubuntu dvd so I never get the others.
[02:24] <skaet> I've been working through the launchpad bugs all day, and yeah there are lots of failures to worry about.
[02:25] <skaet> http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/kernel-bugs/reports/rls-mgr-o-tracking-bugs.html
[02:27] <stgraber> ouch, that's a pretty long list of foundations... I guess I'll be doing some more ubiquity bug fixing then.
[02:27] <skaet> stgraber,  yes please.
[02:27] <skaet> :)
[02:56] <ScottK> slangasek: Please feel free to wave them through, but generally I can get it, I was just away at a social engagement tonight.
[03:03] <ScottK> skaet: Now I'm confused.  IIRC, last cycle we left the queue frozen between beta 2 and final freeze.  Are you saying we're going to do it differently this time?
[03:05] <skaet> ScottK,  there's one more week right now between beta 2 and final freeze, that wasn't there in Natty
[03:07] <ScottK> Did I miss where this was discussed?
[03:08] <ScottK> If the queue is opened up, then I think that reduces the value of the Beta 2 testing since anything can get in between the two freezes.
[03:10] <skaet> ScottK, lets talk about it tomorrow in the meeting then.  If the other members of the release team agree, I'm fine with leaving it frozen,  balancing work on approving each fix, against getting as many fixes in as possible.   Bug list is rather intimidating right now.
[03:14] <infinity> I tend not to make the meetings (clashes with another meeting I have), but for the record, I'm in favour of just keeping us frozen until release at this point.  It's more work for -release and -archive, but I agree with the idea of keeping control on what gets in from here on in.
[03:15] <infinity> (Unless people reject my uploads, then I think this whole idea is madness)
[03:15] <infinity> :P
[03:15] <infinity> skaet / ScottK : --^
[03:15] <skaet> infinity, noted. :)
[03:56] <micahg> ScottK: sorry, my memory must be faulty then, I was just trying to be consistent across releases
[04:40] <ScottK> No problem. We'll get it sorted tomorrow.
[05:31] <skaet> Agenda bugs sorted for the meeting tomorrow.
[05:31] <skaet> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReleaseTeam/Meeting/2011-09-16
[05:31] <skaet> for those who want an early look at it.
[05:31]  * skaet --> zzz
[08:51] <Laney> ^ fixes an oversight I made
[09:23] <ogra_> NCommander, if you would read your backlogs regulary you would know why there is an iso for mx5 ... it was largely discussed in #ubuntu-arm when it showed up :)
[09:24] <ogra_> (and yes, its a mistake)
[09:27] <cjwatson> Laney: accepted, though I'm slightly confused why that showed up as an upload rather than a sync
[09:27] <Laney> because I did syncpackage
[09:27] <Laney> --no-lp
[09:27] <Laney> I sometimes do that when uploading to Debian and Ubuntu simultaneously otherwise I risk forgetting
[09:27] <cjwatson> ah
[09:28] <cjwatson> I make notes :)
[09:28] <Laney> yeah
[09:28] <Laney> the home → work context switch can enbadden my mind though
[09:28] <Laney> anyway, thanks
[10:28] <didrocks> cjwatson: hey, can you accept the oneconf upload please? I start to get quite some duplicate because of a crash on unavailable apps.ubuntu.com
[10:39] <cjwatson> didrocks: done
[10:40] <didrocks> cjwatson: thanks a lot :)
[10:59] <mvo_> would be good if someone could review/allow the apt upload, I'm afraid without it translationed package descriptions are broken
[12:35] <cjwatson> mvo_: accepted, thanks - sorry for the delay
[12:35] <mvo_> no worries
[12:35] <mvo_> and thanks!
[12:38] <doko> cjwatson, please have a look at gcc-4.6
[12:43] <cjwatson> mkay
[12:44] <cjwatson> you know one of these days queue diff generation will be responsive enough to be useful
[12:45] <cjwatson> doko: pleasantly readable, thanks.  accepted
[12:47] <jdstrand> skaet: hey-- I may be a few minutes late to the release meeting
[12:48] <jdstrand> skaet: I think I'll be on time, but may not
[14:16] <skaet> jdstrand,  ok, will move you to the end of the round table then, no worries.
[14:31] <lamont> fwiw, pandafarm coming offline to add two more lp-buildds to it
[14:43] <doko> cjwatson, please have a look at gcc-4.4. -9 is more or less -8ubuntu2. once that's approved, I plan to upload {gcj,gnat,gdc}-4.4 over the weekend
[14:47] <ScottK> I'd appreciate it if someone would accept kubuntu-meta.  Kubuntu dvd's won't build without it.
[14:51] <tumbleweed> skaet: I've twisted Laney's arm to represent MOTU tonight
[14:52] <Laney> please put me ~first though, because I have an important date with a pint of beer
[14:52] <skaet> thanks for the head's up tumbleweed - will put Laney on the agenda then.
[14:52] <tumbleweed> Laney: :)
[14:52] <skaet> Laney,  ok,  you can swap with jdstrand,  he's going to be late.   :)
[14:52] <nigelb> Laney: tsk
[14:52] <Laney> groovy
[14:52] <nigelb> too less :P
[14:53] <cjwatson> doko: accepted, thanks
[14:53] <Laney> nigelb: hey, the pub has a new brewery on. it's out of my hands really
[14:53] <nigelb> Laney: :)
[14:54] <lamont> and pandafarm back online, I'll be adding the other two lp-buildds $LATER (need to finish the installs on them)
[15:01] <jdstrand> skaet: I'm actually here
[15:01] <jdstrand> skaet: I did say I *might* be late ;)
[15:01] <jdstrand> skaet: but I don't mind swapping
[15:01] <skaet> :)
[15:21] <charlie-tca> cjwatson: to further add misery, Xubuntu alternate images install today
[15:22] <cjwatson> charlie-tca: that adds perplexity, but not misery
[15:23] <cjwatson> and the errors appear to have gone away from the log, too
[15:23] <charlie-tca> Oh, well, okay
[15:23] <charlie-tca> Ah, well, tomorrow is another day ;)
[15:23] <charlie-tca> This is the first day this week they worked
[15:56] <ScottK> slangasek: We're going to have to take kamoso off the dvd due to digikam as well (thus the pending kubuntu-meta upload).  I'd appreciate it if you would accept kubuntu-meta and demote kamoso as we've got an upload of it to do and need it out of main first so it doesn't get stripped.
[15:56] <slangasek> ack, poking
[15:58] <ScottK> Thanks.
[16:02] <slangasek> ScottK: all done
[16:02] <ScottK> slangasek: Thanks.
[16:03]  * Laney found out today that libproxy is a bit broken and outdated
[16:03] <Laney> do people think it's too late now to get the new upstream in? there's a minor api break and new soname that i'd need to check out
[16:03] <micahg> hi skaet, there was just a new major chromium release with security fixes, it's the default browser now for mythbuntu, lubuntu, would this be ok to get uploaded before Monday?
[16:04] <infinity> Laney: New API *and* new SOVER?  What could possibly go wrong?
[16:04] <Laney> :-)
[16:04] <ogasawara> skaet, could I get the linux-backports-modules-3.0.0-11.3 package approved in the queue.  It's only an ABI bump to match the current kernel in the archive.
[16:04] <Laney> luckily it has very few revdeps
[16:04] <Laney> basically it currently will crash your app if you are using a PAC ile
[16:04] <slangasek> heh, my interpretation of the facts is slightly different
[16:05] <slangasek> "OMG it has revdeps in main"
[16:05] <Laney> :P
[16:05] <infinity> Laney: Is the PAC fix backportable?
[16:05] <Laney> I have no idea
[16:05] <slangasek> Laney: no chance of cherry-picking the crasher fix?  (What's a PAC file?)
[16:05] <Laney> but upstream sound a bit stroppy that we are still on the 0.3.x series
[16:05] <Laney> (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libproxy/+bug/547106)
[16:05] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 547106 in libproxy (Debian) (and 1 other project) "Please upgrade libproxy to 0.4.x (affects: 6) (heat: 38)" [Unknown,New]
[16:05] <infinity> slangasek: PAC files are how many/most large corporate networks configure proxy support remotely.
[16:05] <infinity> slangasek: So, y'know, no big deal.
[16:05] <Laney> it's moved on somewhat, so I don't know how easy it would be to tease out
[16:06] <slangasek> heh
[16:07] <Laney> it does seem a rather chunky update though
[16:08] <cjwatson> ogasawara: we should definitely have the new lbm for archive consistency
[16:08] <Laney> http://paste.debian.net/130422/
[16:08] <infinity> Laney: Ugh.  This discussion goes all the way back to 2010?
[16:09] <Laney> one of Those, yes
[16:09] <cjwatson> infinity: large corporate networks and weirdos like me
[16:09] <infinity> cjwatson: Seriously?
[16:09] <cjwatson> yeah, it means I can configure my browser to auto-detect and I don't have to change proxy by hand when going between home and elsewhere
[16:10] <infinity> Laney: I think there's no question we should have upgraded to 0.4.x long ago.  I think it's unfortunate that we're discussing it this close to release. :P
[16:10] <infinity> Laney: But if you're willing to hand-massage the revdeps and take ownership of the fallout...?
[16:10] <Laney> I only found out today when a semi-angry user came onto IRC
[16:10] <cjwatson> though admittedly I sometimes turn off auto-detect on untrusted wifi anyway since I'm not convinced I want my browser executing javascript handed to me by an untrusted network
[16:10] <cjwatson> but ANYWAY
[16:11] <infinity> cjwatson: But a good idea, in theory, right? ;)
[16:11] <cjwatson> right
[16:11]  * Laney would support more apps using libproxy in the future though
[16:11] <Laney> consistent proy support, yay
[16:11] <Laney> working x keys too
[16:11] <Laney> infinity: I'll look at it over the weekend
[16:11] <cjwatson> if the new libproxy can fix my keyboard, I'm all for it :P
[16:12] <infinity> I'm kinda hoping the new libproxy can make me soup.
[16:12] <cjwatson> no, that's libsoup.  HTH
[16:12] <Laney> now I have to sample the delights of http://www.maypolebrewery.co.uk/
[16:12] <infinity> I hear they now depend on each other.
[16:12] <Laney> good day.
[16:12] <micahg> Laney: you know there's no more xulrunner, right?
[16:12] <hyperair> wait, what? no more xulrunner?
[16:13] <micahg> hyperair: we axed it about a month ago, not supportable under rapid release
[16:13] <hyperair> ah right. i knew that.
[16:13] <Laney> LALALA CAN'T HEAR YOU
[16:15] <cjwatson> argh scons
[16:16] <cjwatson> why do you have to have pointless abstraction around everything
[16:16] <infinity> I don't much care why scons does any of the things it does, but I do wonder why people use it.
[16:17] <slangasek> you used to maintain PHP, I wouldn't think you'd need to ask ;P
[16:17] <infinity> I've reformed.
[16:17] <nigelb> TO use ruby instead? ;)
[16:17] <cjwatson> infinity: I shouldn't have to say this, but it wasn't my idea
[16:17] <infinity> cjwatson: That seemed like a safe assumption to make.
[16:20] <cjwatson> I think people use it because they want to be unable to cross-compile their software without taking excessive quantities of prescription medication
[16:20] <cjwatson> but maybe that's just me
[16:21] <skaet> ogasawara, approved.
[16:23] <skaet> micahg, ok by me if the mythbuntu and lubuntu leads are comfortable picking it up.
[16:24] <skaet> gilir, ^
[16:25] <infinity> cjwatson: That's just unfair to the thousands of hard-working non-prescription drug vendors around the world who feed the rest of the Free Software world.
[16:25] <micahg> skaet: just asked superm1 in #mythbuntu-dev as well
[16:35] <gilir> skaet, micahg ok for me
[16:35] <micahg> gilir: thanks
[17:06] <Daviey> skaet: Do you know if cdimage has been fixed to not purge candidate ISO's?
[17:07] <Daviey> (aka, delete-released-images fun)
[17:07] <cjwatson> no, cdimage doesn't know what the candidates are
[17:07] <skaet> Daviey, no
[17:08] <cjwatson> we'll just have to be more alert and temporarily bump purge-days where necessary
[17:08] <skaet> Daviey, now that you're on the release team, feel free to help us figure out how to get this part a little more robust. ;)
[17:09] <Daviey> It's currently 3 days?
[17:09] <cjwatson> http://paste.ubuntu.com/690961/
[17:09] <cjwatson> I think the test is > rather than >=
[17:10] <cjwatson> we can't increase it generally right nw because we're getting uncomfortably close to disk limits again
[17:10] <cjwatson> *now
[17:15] <Daviey> cjwatson: So, one i have a candiate - would it be bad to just chmod?
[17:15] <Daviey> candidate*
[17:16] <cjwatson> I would really prefer you didn't.
[17:16] <Daviey> We've had images go awol twice now, at the hour of release.
[17:16] <cjwatson> We should have a way to nominate a candidate from a shell on antimony, which could then maintain a local file listing the candidates and purge-old-images could respect that.
[17:17] <Daviey> (One being for B1, the other for Maverick final release cloud images, for the same reason)
[17:17] <cjwatson> I have no idea whether just chmodding would (a) work or (b) cause other problems, and I don't particularly want to find out.
[17:18] <Daviey> Well yeah, that was why i was asking :)
[17:18] <Daviey> I don't mind committing to working on that issue btw.
[17:18] <cjwatson> What I'd need is a script that posts a candidate to iso.qa, given some appropriate authentication.  I can deal with integrating it into cdimage (although not for B2).
[17:19] <infinity> Having a way to mark and save candidates would be nice.  On the other hand, if you think that a new build will break your image, your candidate's a bit useless, IMO.
[17:19] <infinity> (In the sense that "we'll just ship something old because the archive is now broken" is a pretty bad place to be in)
[17:19] <cjwatson> Yep, agreed.
[17:19] <cjwatson> It's an emergency fallback.
[17:19] <infinity> Yeahp.
[17:20] <infinity> And also just to save on testing if the image actually doesn't change.  Which is valuable.
[17:20] <infinity> But I suspect things might change between now and, say, Tuesday. ;)
[17:21] <Daviey> infinity: Well, i see your point.. but we have to have a snapshot that can be QA'd.
[17:22] <infinity> Daviey: Yes, I realise that.  See above.
[17:23] <infinity> Daviey: Anyhow.  Some way to mark them would be shiny, I agree.  Bonus points if it can export a candidate manifest (maybe a dotfile) that we can pull to auto-populate the ISO tracker.
[17:23] <infinity> (Which, I guess, is the opposite direction from how cjwatson was going...)
[17:23] <infinity> And his probably makes more sense, so non-cdimage people can mark cadidates for their products.
[17:24] <Daviey> cjwatson: So, cdimage queries iso tracker to see if it shouldn't delete?
[17:24] <cjwatson> no, it should have a local copy
[17:24] <cjwatson> I don't want it reliant on network when building images
[17:24] <cjwatson> well, not that network
[17:24] <cjwatson> You can, as of now, 'export CDIMAGE_NOPURGE=1' to prevent a manual image build from purging old images
[17:24] <cjwatson> That should suffice for the time being
[17:25] <cjwatson> A candidate manifest would do if we can pull it reliably.  I'd like to have a way to push from cdimage too, but maybe that isn't reuired
[17:25] <cjwatson> *required
[17:25] <cjwatson> We can then pull it from cron or something
[17:26] <cjwatson> And just keep the last version if iso.qa is inaccessible
[17:26] <infinity> archive-team.internal seems like a good place to pull from iso.qa, and then publish to cdimage?
[17:26] <cjwatson> If you like
[17:26] <Daviey> Hmm.. iso tracker doesn't host the iso.. so what purposes does posting it there have?
[17:26] <infinity> If we don't want cdimage to be reliant on yet another sketchy remote host.
[17:26] <cjwatson> I have no idea what archive-team.internal is
[17:26] <cjwatson> Daviey: it lets people register tests
[17:27] <infinity> cjwatson: p.c.c/~u-a :)
[17:27] <cjwatson> oh right
[17:27] <cjwatson> sure
[17:27] <Daviey> cjwatson: Ah, so when we enter freeze - all builds appear on the iso tracker automagically?
[17:27] <cjwatson> Daviey: no, they're posted manually right now
[17:27] <skaet> Being able to auto-populating the ISO tracker and saving a copy that's on the ISO tracker off somewhere has a certain appeal,  and it unifies with the manifest and test results that way.
[17:27] <cjwatson> though it would help if there were a way for them to be posted automatically; it's tedious manual work right now
[17:27] <infinity> Daviey: Product owners should post their candidates to the ISO tracker (as they do now), but the difference would be that cdimage would now refuse to purge those.
[17:28] <infinity> Daviey: You fail to nominate, we might purge, not our problem? ;)
[17:28] <Daviey> cjwatson: Yes, i understood it to be manual - but you'd like it to do it for all, when we ramp up to release ?
[17:28] <cjwatson> infinity: product owners don't typically post right now
[17:28] <infinity> cjwatson: I guess a way to do one batch post at the beginning of a freeze/release cycle would be cool.
[17:28] <cjwatson> it's normally the person building the images
[17:28] <cjwatson> Daviey: in general yes
[17:28] <infinity> cjwatson: I know, I was living in a fantasy world while verbally speccing that.  Product owners should be the ones nominating candidates...
[17:29] <infinity> (In theory)
[17:29] <Daviey> infinity: I think i'm missing how them being on the iso tracker would stop it purging, if it doesn't query the remote resource?
[17:29] <Daviey> It seems two different issues?
[17:29] <cjwatson> Daviey: we should pull a manifest of candidates every so often and check that
[17:29] <cjwatson> rather than having to block while actually building the new image
[17:29] <Daviey> cjwatson: ahhh
[17:29] <infinity> Daviey: It wouldn't query during purge, obviously we'd consolidate the info and keep a local cache.
[17:30] <Daviey> does the iso tracker currently expose that data?
[17:30] <cjwatson> no idea
[17:30] <cjwatson> I mean it's on the front page and could be HTML-scraped
[17:30] <cjwatson> whether there's a more sensible mechanism, I don't know
[17:30] <stgraber> iso tracker has a parsable export
[17:30] <Daviey> The 'API' (i hate calling it that), has worked pretty well for the coud images, http://cloud-images.ubuntu.com/query/
[17:30] <cjwatson> and of course all the names the ISO tracker has for things are gratuitously different from cdimage's
[17:30] <stgraber> (not documented though :))
[17:31] <Daviey> stgraber: Have a URL handy?
[17:31] <stgraber> Daviey: yep, hang on a sec
[17:31] <cjwatson> so there would be some ridiculously tedious thing to map them into the right form, much as there is in publish-image-set
[17:31] <stgraber> Daviey: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/dllist
[17:31] <stgraber> Daviey: a bit empty at the moment
[17:32] <cjwatson> I'd have to see what it looked like with real content ...
[17:33] <stgraber> if you don't mind me adding the current daily of Edubuntu (low number of subscribers), you'll see the real content for that image
[17:34]  * cjwatson -> dinner
[17:34] <stgraber> oh, actually I can just change it in the DB for a few minutes, that way no e-mail get sent at all
[17:36] <stgraber> Daviey: look now
[17:36] <Daviey> stgraber: ah neat!
[17:37] <infinity> Oh, that's quite usable, I suspect.
[17:37] <Daviey> stgraber: Can the date stamp be added as a field?
[17:37] <cjwatson> oh, yeah, that's not bad
[17:37] <stgraber> yeah, adding stuff in there should be pretty easy, getting the changes deployed may take a while though
[17:37] <cjwatson> Daviey: cdimage wouldn't need that
[17:38] <Daviey> cjwatson: just query the hash?
[17:38] <cjwatson> it can trivially construct the URL and just compare when deciding whether to purge an image
[17:38] <cjwatson> wouldn't even need that
[17:38] <cjwatson> I suppose the hash is an option too
[17:38] <Daviey> good thinking that man.
[17:39] <cjwatson> stgraber: cool, thanks, that should actually be doable
[17:39] <cjwatson> anyway, really dinner
[17:39] <cjwatson> I can maybe have a go at that next week in my CFT
[17:40] <Daviey> Dandy.
[17:40] <Daviey> I am concerned how many beer tokens i now owe cjwatson .
[17:42] <adconrad> Grr, my co-lo machine's network is being DoSed...
[17:43] <adconrad> stgraber: Would it break anything to add a magic EOF string to that list?
[17:43] <adconrad> stgraber: So we could determine if an empty document was actually an empty list, rather than a broken webserver returning an empty document?
[17:45] <adconrad> stgraber: That would be about all that would be required to make it a robust enough thing for us to use it to do filesystem matches and purge with impunity.
[17:46] <stgraber> adconrad: I don't think anyone is actually using that page at the moment, so adding an EOF string should be fine as long as it doesn't respect the format of the other lines (so it'd likely get skipped by existing parsers, if there's any)
[17:46] <infinity> Yeah, something simple like "[17:47] <stgraber> or maybe have it return something when the list is actually empty? I think it'd actually be easier to implement (looking at the (ugly) code)
[17:47] <stgraber> so we know that if it's empty and doesn't contain the magic string, it's because something failed
[17:47] <stgraber> or are you worried of getting a partial list too?
[17:48] <infinity> Partials are a possible issue that this would solve too, yeah.
[17:48] <infinity> Mostly, this is just more discoverable, though.
[17:48] <infinity> Only returning a magic string on an empty list requires an API doc.  Returning it at the end of the list unconditionally is discoverably simple to write against.
[17:55] <stgraber> updated the DB to fix the existing netboot images in dllist
[17:56] <infinity> Why no hashes for the ARM netboots?
[17:57] <cjwatson> Daviey: I'm not :-)
[17:57] <cjwatson> infinity: doesn't much matter since cdimage isn't going to be purging those anyway
[17:57] <infinity> cjwatson: No, was just a curiosity. :)
[17:58] <stgraber> well, I'm rather wondering where the hashes for the non-arm ones come from ;)
[17:58] <infinity> Hah.
[17:58] <cjwatson> should be up a couple of levels
[17:58] <cjwatson> e.g. http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/oneiric/main/installer-i386/current/images/MD5SUMS
[17:59] <cjwatson> basically go up until you hit images/
[18:00] <infinity> Looks like that md5 is for netboot/gtk/netboot.tar.gz ... No sure how useful that is, but whatever.
[18:00] <cjwatson> it lists all of them
[18:00] <stgraber> ok, and it's using the one for "./netboot/gtk/netboot.tar.gz" instead of "netboot/mini.iso" or "netboot/netboot.tar.gz"
[18:00] <cjwatson> oh right, you mean iso.qa is using the wrong one
[18:00] <infinity> cjwatson: No, I mean on iso... Yeah.
[18:01] <stgraber> has been way too long since I wrote that code... ;)
[18:02] <infinity> stgraber: Has it fallen into "so old, it embarrasses you" or "so old, you don't understand your own black magic", or a bit of both?
[18:03] <stgraber> well, the current ISO tracker was a PHP project for one of my programming classes 4 years ago ;)
[18:03] <stgraber> so I guess, the answer would be, both ;)
[18:11] <stgraber> maybe I'll see if I can spend a bit of time of the 12.04 cycle improving the ISO tracker a bit. Upgrading it to a supported version of Drupal and getting the LP integration finally working would be a good start ;)
[18:11] <stgraber> then maybe get a basic API would be nice (did plenty of that with weblive, so easy enough to re-use for the iso tracker)
[18:12] <stgraber> that shouldn't take much more than 1 or 2 weeks of work and I guess would be useful for quite a few
[18:12] <skaet> stgraber, very useful indeed.   yes please.
[18:13] <stgraber> I'll make sure we have a blueprint for UDS. I know we discuss replacing it entirely at every UDS for the past 3 years but that still didn't happen, so maybe fixing it is a better and cheaper option ;)
[18:14] <skaet> :)   sounds good.
[18:16] <cjwatson> evolution not revolution
[18:18] <infinity> ^
[18:18] <infinity> We reinvent enough wheels around here. :P
[18:18] <nigelb> stgraber: Or rewrite in Django :-)
[18:18]  * nigelb runs fast.
[18:20] <lamont> doing a little debugging on arm, manualizing for buildd selection with anger
[18:23] <davmor2> nigelb: was that an offer to spearhead the new django version???  stgraber looks like your off the hook dude ;)
[18:24] <nigelb> davmor2: Technically, that would be ISD's job......
[18:25] <nigelb> I won't be at UDS to get to that hook anyway ;-)
[18:27] <charlie-tca> remote participation lets you have action items, too
[18:29] <nigelb> heh, I think I took enough action items last time to lsat a yar.
[18:29] <nigelb> *year
[18:42] <stgraber> well, we've been talking about a rewrite in python for the last 3 years and it's still no there. So for now I'll stick with making the php one a bit more usable ;)
[18:43] <stgraber> if ISD has time to rewrite something that covers all the current usecase, I have no problem with that ;)
[18:45] <nigelb> I love how davmor2 went totally silent there :P
[18:46] <davmor2> nigelb: Not an ISD project at all it's a QA tool and they'll like pass it back to stgraber :P
[18:46] <stgraber> davmor2: good thing I don't work for QA then ;)
[18:46] <nigelb> heh
[18:47] <nigelb> Seriously though, If I had more time I'd love to help.
[18:47] <davmor2> stgraber: I didn't say you did, I said they'd pass it back yo you ;)
[18:47] <nigelb> But alas there's only 24 hours in a day.
[18:47] <davmor2> nigelb: no there aren't there are 36 how long do you sleep man ;)
[18:48] <stgraber> anyway, I don't think 12.04 is really the time where we'd like to switch to a completely different tool, so I'll have a look at how much changes I can make by alpha-1 and hopefully then just do a few bugfixes after that.
[18:48] <stgraber> that's the tricky thing with the ISO tracker, it needs to work starting with alpha-1, not feature freeze ;)
[18:48] <nigelb> stgraber: We could spec it and target it for 12.10.
[18:49]  * nigelb ponders
[18:49] <stgraber> nigelb: I don't think it needs speccing, we already have at least 2 complete blueprints on it ;) it needs implementation
[18:50] <nigelb> stgraber: Oh. lol. Okay.
[18:50] <nigelb> I agree with you that we probably don't want to swtich before 12.04.
[18:52] <stgraber> nigelb: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/Specs/TestTracker
[18:54] <lamont> back on auto
[19:09]  * skaet --> appt,  back on later tonight.
[20:26] <infinity> cjwatson: Is there a reason you haven't shoved that curl through binary NEW for the xmlrpc-c/udeb business, or were you just hoping for a less biased set of eyes?
[21:25] <Daviey> infinity: I don't know if cjwatson saw it, i uploaded it.
[21:52] <NCommander> skaet: when do we plan to disable the crontabs? I think we're back up to full armel image building capabilities after a test last night and lamont fixed the root cause this morning
[21:53] <stgraber> I guess we at least need to let everything build tonight as all the livefs failed yesterday
[21:56] <NCommander> might be easier to just do that in manual mode TBH
[22:01] <infinity> skaet had planned to just let the dailies keep going all weekend.
[22:02] <infinity> Given that we know we're getting an influx of new GNOME suff on Monday anyway. :/
[22:05] <NCommander> oh lovely
[23:19] <skaet> infinity, NCommander - lamont has a fix for https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/851934,  we're trying to figure out least impact for deploying it.
[23:19] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 851934 in launchpad "umount-chroot fails to umount the chroot (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
[23:19] <lamont> infinity: NCommander so... the fun bug where things seem to take a minute to die...
[23:19] <lamont> I just proposed a merge (lp:~lamont/launchpad/bug-851934) that at least keeps it from killing arm boards
[23:20] <lamont> the question of the day is, do we want to roll that lp-buildd to the buildds on monday (US), or do we want to wait until after beta2
[23:20] <NCommander> skaet: ugh, what a headache :-/
[23:20] <lamont> with the attendant challenge that llvm may knock over the pandafarm
[23:23] <infinity> lamont: Assuming that loop doesn't have any syntax errors (have you at least locally tested to make sure it DTRT?), I can't see how rolling it out would do any harm.
[23:23] <infinity> lamont: Still, fixing this in the process killing script sounds saner, if we can figure out WTF is going wrong.
[23:23] <lamont> infinity: it's live on ain and shedir, and llvm built on ain
[23:24] <lamont> in terms of my work load, I'm going to let someone else take the "figure out what llvm is doing to sbuild-package" task
[23:24] <infinity> lamont: Ahh, kay.  Your merge proposal said it was untested. ;)
[23:24] <lamont> yeah - I need to update the bug
[23:25] <lamont> and actually, I pushed the branch, but I haven't actually done the merge req yet.. :*
[23:25] <infinity> lamont: I'm all for rolling it out all over then, if it's working.  But your call really.  You get to fix the world if if breaks because the patch isn't in place. ;)
[23:25] <lamont> true dat.
[23:26] <infinity> Still grumpy that this is happening at all, mind you.  I assume the bug appears on all arches, the others are just fast enough to not get hit by the race here, whatever that race may be.
[23:26] <lamont> but it's "roll out everywhere" because someone will doubtlessly go get the world current wrt package installs, just like we do all the time
[23:26] <lamont> we have only seen the bug on PANDA
[23:26] <lamont> oh, that could be
[23:26] <lamont> but haven't seen it on any other arm boards than panda
[23:26] <infinity> Yeah, doesn't mean much that it's only happened on Panda.
[23:27] <lamont> SMP+slow would be sufficient to explain that
[23:27] <infinity> Could be an SMP-specific race dealing with processes falling out of proc before closing fds, or who knows what.  Either way, it's worth someone looking into.
[23:28] <infinity> Probably worth keeping the bug open even after your patch lands, with a big "this is a workaround, not a fix" comment.
[23:28] <lamont> https://code.launchpad.net/~lamont/launchpad/bug-851934/+merge/75831 <-- comments  on the merge, if  you would?
[23:29] <lamont> "only a workaround" comment added to the bug
[23:31] <infinity> The kill script is pretty anal about not exiting until everything's (supposedly) dead, according to proc, so this is still disconcerting.
[23:33] <infinity> Given the reproducibility, though, this might be debuggable locally.  Maybe.
[23:33] <infinity> Happy birthday to me?
[23:36] <infinity> lamont: What prompted you to test with llvm-defaults and llvm-py?  Neither has been uploaded or built in ages...
[23:36] <lamont> those were the packages that doko's rebuild of oneiric/arm did that knocked over the buildds
[23:36] <infinity> Ahh.
[23:37] <lamont> at least I'm guessing that's where they came from
[23:37] <infinity> Probably.
[23:37] <infinity> That would make some sense.
[23:37] <lamont> but the packages were identified based on the logfiles of dead buildds
[23:37] <infinity> Well, defaults is a quick build.  And I'm assuming it's just the act of installing build-deps that breaks it, since the build itself doesn't seem to do much.
[23:37] <infinity> So, this might not be TOO painful to track.
[23:38] <lamont> *shrug*
[23:38]  * infinity fiddles.
[23:38] <lamont> https://launchpad.net/~lamont/+archive/non-virt/+build/2789423
[23:38] <lamont> for your package copying fun
[23:39] <infinity> It's days like today that I remember why I have a local mirror...
[23:40] <slangasek> ^^ that friendly-recovery isn't critical for beta, but it's required for friendly-recovery to be usable on cryptsetup-using systems
[23:41] <infinity> slangasek: We haven't stopped the daily cronjobs yet, if it makes a shiny new feature actually testable/usable on certain systems, I'm all for it. :P
[23:45] <skaet> :)
[23:45] <slangasek> infinity: I think friendly-recovery was broken before as well
[23:45] <slangasek> on cryptsetup
[23:45] <slangasek> it's just the first time I've tested it in a couple of years :)
[23:45] <infinity> slangasek: Not broken sounds better than broken.  But what do I know? :P
[23:45] <slangasek> :)
[23:45] <slangasek> I also have a fix so that we can get boot logs out of plymouth, after months of this being broken
[23:46] <slangasek> but waiting for the results of lightdm flicker-free before uploading
[23:47] <lamont> I must say, I like the pandas better with the stupid usb patch
[23:48] <infinity> Yeah, a whopping 20MB/s throughput feels fast after 5...
[23:48] <infinity> Sadly, it's still awfully slow. :P
[23:48] <lamont> watching mkfs run is a sure reminder
[23:57] <infinity> ...
[23:57] <infinity> I don't like this bug.
[23:58] <infinity> lamont: fuser, lsof, and walking proc/*/root (the method used by lp-buildd) find nothing using chroot/proc ... Yet, it's "busy".  \o/


[00:34] <bazhang> although gnewsense could be possibly rhyme with nuisance
[00:34] <bazhang> -be
[00:35] <bazhang> kanowener seemed like absolute troll, with the caps like nsfw etc
[00:35] <bazhang> s/like/lock
[00:36] <bazhang> new keyboard, sorry
[11:14] <bazhang> that !patience factoid seems to be formatted weirdly, nearly 7 lines that I can see
[11:18] <valorie> !patience
[11:21] <valorie> hmmm, only two lines here, bazhang
[11:21] <popey> yeah, looks fine to me.
[11:25] <bazhang> weird
[11:25] <bazhang> ok thanks valorie
[16:52] <phunyguy> !away > zy3pD_afk