[03:22] <pitti> Good morning
[03:22] <pitti> xnox: thanks, will review today
[03:23] <Unit193> Howdy.
[08:48] <mardy> Chipaca: hi! The libraries for Online Accounts are libaccounts-qt > libaccounts-glib (for enumerating account)
[08:49] <mardy> Chipaca: for performing the authentication, libsignon-qt5 and libsignon-glib
[08:49] <Chipaca> mardy: hi! and those allow me to oauth-sign a url?
[08:49]  * Chipaca looks it up
[08:49] <mardy> Chipaca: the OAuth 1.0a signature? Nope, they just get you the token
[08:50] <Chipaca> mardy: they give you the token? excellent
[08:50] <Chipaca> (i can do the signing myself :) )
[08:50] <mardy> Chipaca: however, if you are after UbuntuOne, I've some bad news
[08:50] <Chipaca> mardy: tell me more
[08:50] <Chipaca> mardy: specifically, i need the u1 token
[08:50] <mardy> Chipaca: the U1 account plugin is not using Online Accounts for OAuth, it's just using it for storing the password
[08:51] <mardy> Chipaca: maybe it also stores the token, I'm not sure
[08:51] <mardy> Chipaca: you'd better talk to the U1 guys, to know what they store in the account
[08:51] <Chipaca> the "password" should be a dict that includes the token, or a string in a known format
[08:51] <Chipaca> mardy: will do
[08:51] <mardy> Chipaca: yes, that's possible
[08:52] <Chipaca> mardy: where can i find the api docs of libaccounts-glib?
[08:53] <Chipaca> is this the google one that's on code.google.com?
[08:53] <Chipaca> libaccounts-glib-doc
[10:22] <michagogo> Chipaca, mardy: there's also the *tiny* little detail that U1 is going away next week...
[10:23] <cjwatson> Only some parts of U1 are going away, not including the SSO parts
[10:25] <michagogo> Ah, didn't know the Ubuntu SSO was considered part of U1
[10:30] <darkxst> michagogo, SSO was moved into U1 a while ago
[10:36] <cjwatson> michagogo: Well, my point is that account handling (SSO or not) doesn't go away just because file services are shutting down
[10:37] <michagogo> cjwatson: of course
[10:37] <michagogo> I just didn't know that SSO had been rebranded as part of U1
[10:37] <michagogo> And I've been hearing about "U1 is going away", so...
[11:04] <rbasak> Is /usr/share/distro-info/ubuntu.csv OK for other packages to read directly, or should they go via the distro-info command?
[11:04] <rbasak> I ask because juju reads ubuntu.csv directly.
[11:21] <pitti> Laney: thanks! Jenkins Fixed - utopic-adt-friends 20
[11:21] <Laney> pitti: always a good mail to get ;)
[11:22] <pitti> Laney: while I have you in the mood for autopkgtests: would you mind ignoring the "kazoo" test failure? (blocking python-defaults)
[11:22] <pitti> it almost always fails on i386
[11:23] <pitti> i. e. horribly flaky test
[11:23] <pitti> I already retried it like 5 times
[11:23] <Laney> pitti: could do, have you analysed it at all?
[11:23] <pitti> http://d-jenkins.ubuntu-ci:8080/view/Utopic/view/AutoPkgTest/job/utopic-adt-kazoo/ARCH=i386,label=adt/13/console
[11:23] <pitti> Laney: not really; ^ gets a ton of "connection refused" errors
[11:23] <Laney> okay
[11:23] <Laney> well, looks like zul added them originally
[11:24] <pitti> (no idea what kazoo actually is)
[11:24] <Laney> perhaps he would like to take a look :)
[11:24] <pitti> the test seems to be an ubuntu specifism
[11:24] <pitti> it's not in debian
[11:24] <Laney> will skip for now
[11:24] <pitti> zul: that'd be nice, yes
[11:24] <pitti> (and while you are at it, the flaky nut test :) )
[11:25]  * Laney coughs
[11:29] <siretart> infinity: (or anyone else from the release team): What do you guys think about starting the libav10 transition in utopic now? https://release.debian.org/transitions/html/libav10.html
[11:30] <siretart> TBH, I don't think that many of the remaining packages will get actually fixed, but rather removed from testing for now
[11:31] <siretart> visp and jitsi havve pending NMUs, and that's it
[11:31] <siretart> Logan_: ^^
[12:14] <zbenjamin> tedg: ping
[12:23] <Chipaca> michagogo: U1 *files* is going away next week.
[12:23] <michagogo> Chipaca: Thanks, I got that now.
[12:23] <Chipaca> michagogo: ah, i see you've already been browbeat over it
[12:23] <Chipaca> sorry to belabour
[12:24] <cjwatson> I had been rather hoping to educate rather than browbeat :-)
[12:24] <cjwatson> Maybe "clarify"
[12:27] <michagogo> cjwatson: no worries :-)
[12:27] <michagogo> Is U1 just cloud and logon?
[12:27] <michagogo> Or, just logon now?
[12:27] <michagogo> Or do other things also happen under the name?
[12:27] <cjwatson> There's at least U1DB as well
[12:28] <cjwatson> https://one.ubuntu.com/help/faq/what-is-happening-and-when/ mentions several continuing services, though not all of those are part of U1 (e.g. Launchpad and Landscape aren't)
[12:29]  * michagogo googles U1DB and Ubuntu Pay
[12:45] <mvo> pitti: hm, shouldn't apport-cli -c /var/crash/_usr_bin_unity8.1001.crash give me a url or something? it prints a "." and exists for me only
[12:45] <davmor2> mvo: I've seen that too
[12:46] <mvo> davmor2: I really want to report this crash :)
[12:46] <davmor2> mvo: you can do it manually :)
[12:46] <pitti> mvo: is that on trusty?
[12:47] <mvo> pitti: utopic
[12:47] <mvo> from today
[12:47] <pitti> mvo: err, irrelevant, we didn't enable LP yet in utopic
[12:47] <pitti> mvo: yes, we currently only report to errors.u.c. (which you don't really "see")
[12:47] <pitti> mvo: if you want to enable LP bugs, comment out this in /etc/apport/crashdb.conf:
[12:47] <pitti> 'problem_types': ['Bug', 'Package'],
[12:48] <mvo> pitti: thanks! that helps. now it reports that the file is corrupted :/ (EOFError('Compressed file ended before the end-of-stream marker was reached',)). oh well
[12:49] <davmor2> mvo: sadtrombone.com
[13:09] <shadeslayer> jono: ping
[13:10] <shadeslayer> jono: any news on the donations report?
[13:17] <Chipaca> xnox: ping
[13:18] <xnox> Chipaca: hi!
[13:18] <Chipaca> xnox: hi! i'm looking at libnih, wondering how to go from lp:libnih to ./configure && make, and your name comes up a lot in debian/changelog :)
[13:19] <jono> shadeslayer, mhall119 is releasing it
[13:19] <xnox> Chipaca: lp:libnih is stale and no longer in use.
[13:19] <Chipaca> xnox: oh! where is libnih living now?
[13:19] <xnox> Chipaca: best bet to start from lp:ubuntu/libnih -> apt-get build-dep libnih; autoreconf -f -i; ./configure; make
[13:20] <Chipaca> xnox: seriously it's only maintained in ubuntu:libnih?
[13:20] <Chipaca> ok...
[13:20] <shadeslayer> jono: cool :)
[13:20] <xnox> Chipaca: libnih has multiple forks at the moment =) there is https://github.com/keybuk/libnih then there is mine work, and ubuntu & debian are diverged a bit.
[13:20] <Chipaca> xnox: that sounds ideal :-/
[13:21] <Chipaca> goes well with the lib's name, though
[13:21] <xnox> Chipaca: it's very stable, thus needs no maintainance. there is only like ~8-10 patches difference between ubuntu and keybuk's upstream
[13:21] <apachelogger> lol
[13:21] <Chipaca> xnox: I might be about to introduce another patch :D
[13:21] <xnox> Chipaca: best bet bzr branch lp:ubuntu/libnih; apt-get build-dep libnih; autoreconf -f -i; ./configure; make
[13:22] <Chipaca> xnox: yup, done that, thanks
[13:22] <xnox> Chipaca: well, i will most likely to be reviewing it for inclusion and i did forward all patches to keybuk.
[13:22] <Chipaca> xnox: i was missing the -f -i
[13:23] <Chipaca> xnox: how do i run the tests?
[13:24] <xnox> Chipaca: make check
[13:24] <Chipaca> ok
[13:24]  * mvo wonders if it would be worth adding a HACKING file to libnih with the paste of this irc conversation
[13:25] <xnox> Chipaca: the tests, are excessive =)
[13:25] <xnox> mvo: it's all covered in upstart cookbook =)
[13:25] <Laney> needs moar autogen.sh
[13:25] <Chipaca> mvo: there is a HACKING file
[13:25] <Chipaca> mvo: it is not illuminating :)
[13:25] <xnox> Chipaca: illumination quick how-to to libnih is in http://people.canonical.com/~jhunt/presentations/uds-r/2012-10-31/upstart-development.pdf
[13:25] <Chipaca> it is very good, mind you. Exactly what I need. Except for this conversation.
[13:26] <mvo> xnox: maybe the HACKING file should point to the cookbook then :) ?
[13:26] <xnox> Chipaca: and http://upstart.ubuntu.com/cookbook/#nih
[13:26] <Chipaca> um. to be honest, if you point me to the upstart cookbook when all i want to use is a bit of libnih, i'll run away screaming
[13:27] <xnox> Chipaca: i've also tried to publish docs at http://libnih.la/ but they are incomplete.
[13:27] <xnox> Chipaca: best to read code comments, as all functions methods etc. are documented extensively.
[13:27] <Chipaca> I found the libnih.la docs, they were good enough for my use :)
[13:27] <xnox> =))))))))))))))))
[13:27] <Chipaca> (wrapping libnih-dbus to use it from push)
[13:28] <xnox> nice.
[13:28] <xnox> I love that .la is country domain for Laos, they market it as ".la means local to Los Angeles"
[13:28] <xnox> but i want to start the trend for library docs instead =)
[13:29] <Laney> somalia is better :)
[13:29]  * Laney looks for .dll
[13:29] <Chipaca> this is for use from go, so .la ftw
[13:29] <ogra_> heh
[13:29]  * Chipaca runs away
[13:29] <xnox> Laney: ha, somalia does look good!
[13:30] <ogra_> we should have the next sprint there
[13:30] <ogra_> :)
[13:33] <xnox> ogra_: nah, Tokyo =))))) and get Sony to sponsor us =)
[13:35] <ogra_> xnox, oh, i wouldnt mind that !!!
[14:13] <hallyn> is there a definitive (per-release?) list of install preseed keys that work? i.e. passwd/make-user Boolean true\npasswd/username string ubuntu\n (plus pwd) seems to be ignored...
[14:14] <cjwatson> hallyn: That's just bad syntax, not bad keys
[14:14] <cjwatson> d-i passwd/make-user boolean true
[14:14] <cjwatson> d-i passwd/username string ubuntu
[14:15] <cjwatson> The installation guide has details on the useful settings
[14:15] <hallyn> cjwatson: yes i have that
[14:16] <hallyn> full preseed:  http://paste.ubuntu.com/7501590/
[14:17] <cjwatson> To debug anything I'd need to see the installer syslog, preferably from an installation with DEBCONF_DEBUG=developer so that I get a full debconf trace
[14:17] <hallyn> cjwatson: where do i set that?  kernel command line?
[14:17] <cjwatson> yes
[14:18] <hallyn> cjwatson: thanks, i'll get that at some point and if it's not obvious to me i'll get back to you.  hopefully it'll be obvious to me :)
[14:19] <hallyn> actually i'll just restart this install.
[14:20] <hallyn> logs will be in newly installed host under /var/log/intaller.log or somesuch?
[14:20] <cjwatson> hallyn: /var/log/installer/syslog
[14:20] <cjwatson> hallyn: (note that this is a trace in a similar way that strace is a trace, that is it will include confidential information such as passwords)
[14:21] <hallyn> s'ok, password is usually 'none' or 'ubuntu' as these are firealled test installs :)
[14:21] <hallyn> thanks cjwatson
[14:47] <nobuto_> Could someone in SRU team take a look at bug 1309885 ?
[14:48] <nobuto_> ^ it looks like ready to be released to me, but it stalls in SRU process.
[14:58] <hallyn> cjwatson: hm, http://paste.ubuntu.com/7501714/  what is GET vs METAGET
[14:59] <cjwatson> man debconf-devel
[14:59] <hallyn> thx
[15:00]  * hallyn goes to manpages.ubuntu.com for that one
[15:04] <cjwatson> hallyn: This seems to be a partial log and is missing some important parts
[15:04] <cjwatson> So I can't debug it
[15:04] <cjwatson> In particular it's missing the bit where the preseed file is applied
[15:11] <hallyn> sorry thought that was the important parts, uploading the whole thing,
[15:11] <hallyn> http://paste.ubuntu.com/7501768/
[16:39] <jodh> bdmurray: dude, you *rock*! (bug 1068060)
[16:41] <bdmurray> jodh: fix released actually ;-)
[16:54] <xnox> doko: some of the gcc-4.9 build-failures are of the pattern of generating undefined references in c++ code. of strange nature, e.g. desctructor having undefined reference to it's class....
[16:54] <xnox> http://paste.ubuntu.com/7502150/
[16:55] <xnox> what's going on?
[16:59] <ogra_> xnox, happy to have you in the diskspace warning meeting next week :)
[16:59] <ogra_> if you want to
[17:01] <xnox> ogra_: we have tried like 4 or 5 times to get "plymouth on mir" session no stop and notify user early in the boot that e.g. battery is critically low, or disk space is full.
[17:01] <xnox> ogra_: but we have never managed to have that session.
[17:01] <xnox> ogra_: any idea what's the bootsplash story is?
[17:02] <ogra_> xnox, i think that plan is on ice for now
[17:02] <xnox> (as in current state)
[17:02] <xnox> ogra_: so, i cannot have any graphics as root & read-only ?
[17:02] <ogra_> xnox, we will use the unity-system-compositor splash
[17:02] <ogra_> which will land with the split greeter mterry is working on
[17:02] <xnox> ogra_: can that start as root & read-only?!
[17:02] <xnox> mterry: i guess ^
[17:02] <ogra_> it runs as root but only after the container
[17:03] <mterry> ogra_, no, the splash will land separately now
[17:03] <ogra_> (a bit late, i know, but thats the current plan)
[17:03] <ogra_> mterry, ugh
[17:03] <ogra_> why is that ?
[17:03] <mterry> ogra_, to reduce the amount of design signoff needed for the split landing
[17:04] <ogra_> hmpf
[17:04] <ogra_> we need it to work on low-battery mode and various other bits :
[17:04] <ogra_> :(
[17:04] <mterry> bbl
[17:05] <ogra_> xnox, as for readonly ... yeah, it only needs to be able to create a socket in /tmp
[17:07] <ogra_> xnox, for the low diskspace issue i think we should port what we have on desktop already (if thats not hard bound to nautilus or so) and have a popup if you are at something like 98% for $HOME though
[17:07] <ogra_> that shouldnt need any splash screen implementation
[17:08] <xnox> ogra_: sockets should not use /tmp
[17:08] <ogra_> tell that to the Mir people :)
[17:08] <xnox> nor predictable names.
[17:08] <ogra_> not my socket
[17:09] <ogra_> root@ubuntu-phablet:~# ls -l /tmp/mir_socket
[17:09] <ogra_> srwxrwxrwx 1 root root 0 May 22 13:20 /tmp/mir_socket
[17:09] <mdeslaur> gah!
[17:09] <ogra_> should probably not be 666
[17:09] <ogra_> :)
[17:09]  * mdeslaur prepares tar and feathers
[17:09] <ogra_> but please in #ubuntu-mir
[17:09] <xnox> mdeslaur: thanks.... =)
[17:10] <ogra_> i'm just the messenger
[17:10] <xnox> mdeslaur: i think i had a bug filed saying that "linux abstract sockets" should be used instead.
[17:10] <xnox> mdeslaur: e.g. like upstart.
[17:10] <ogra_> i thinnk you even started a mail discussion, no ?
[17:10] <ogra_> (unless i was subscribed to the bug i seem to remember that)
[17:11] <xnox> mdeslaur: ogra_: https://code.launchpad.net/~afrantzis/mir/abstract-host-connection/+merge/216290 ?!
[17:11] <ogra_> xnox, merged into mir/devel
[17:11] <xnox> or maybe that's unrelated.
[17:11] <ogra_> not trunk
[17:11] <ogra_> they use staging branches
[17:12] <ogra_> so it might land at some point when devel gets synced
[17:12] <xnox> ogra_: https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bug/1299101/comments/4
[17:12] <ogra_> mdeslaur, we need to go through the udev rules next week too ... since we just import the android permissions in there
[17:13] <mdeslaur> ogra_: that would be good, yes
[17:13] <mdeslaur> xnox: do you have a link to the bug you filed?
[17:13] <xnox> mdeslaur: i don't see it fixed. THere was https://lists.launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone/msg06672.html and https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity8/+bug/1285215 but it was worked around with removing stale file.
[17:14] <xnox> mdeslaur: cause mir itself doesn't remove stale file socket before trying to bind....
[17:14] <xnox> mdeslaur: so i don't think there is any bug. Can you please file something critical?
[17:14] <xnox> mdeslaur: cause clearly, my voice was not heard at the time.
[17:15] <mdeslaur> jdstrand: since you have a phone to look at, could you please file a bug for /tmp/mir_socket?
[17:15]  * ogra_ hopes that the mir team is at least there next week
[17:16] <ogra_> kgunn, ^^ are you guys at the sprint next week ?
[17:16] <jdstrand> I thought there was a bug about that
[17:17] <kgunn> ogra_: we will be there....
[17:17] <jdstrand> and that it was fixed
[17:17] <kgunn> yes...thot it was fixed also
[17:17] <ogra_> kgunn, awesome :)
[17:17] <ogra_> kgunn, it is in the devel branch
[17:17] <ogra_> likely not landed yet
[17:17] <xnox> doko: actually it looks like a real under-linkage.
[17:18] <kgunn> ogra_: true...
[17:18] <kgunn> hmm...thot it got promoted
[17:18]  * kgunn goes to dig
[17:18] <ogra_> and we're not in a hurry :)
[17:19] <ogra_> (semi TRAINCON-0 atm ... so dont sweat it ... )
[17:26] <jdstrand> interestingly, the 1.1 apparmor policy doesn't allow access to /tmp/mir_socket
[17:26] <jdstrand> this was bug #1236912
[17:28] <jdstrand> apps seem to be functioning fine without it. I wonder if I should remove the rule for /{,var/}run/user/*/mir_socket
[17:28] <jdstrand> kgunn: thoughts? ^
[17:29] <kgunn> jdstrand: we do still use that for the system compositor and all our demo apps where the server runs as root
[17:30] <jdstrand> but apps themselves don't actually need it?
[17:31] <jdstrand> clearly not, but I'd like confirmation before I remove it
[17:32] <jdstrand> kgunn: ^
[17:32] <kgunn> ogra_: cmiiw, but looks like we released into utopic at r1573...see https://code.launchpad.net/~mir-team/mir/utopic r1185
[17:32] <kgunn> and that branch above you mentioned was at r1568
[17:32] <kgunn> on devel
[17:33] <kgunn> jdstrand: right...apps running on unity8 in touch as mir clients, would not need /tmp/mir_socket
[17:33] <ogra_> kgunn, hmm, i still see /tmp/mir_socket on image 43
[17:33] <ogra_> kgunn, but mir 0.1.9 is installed
[17:34] <kgunn> ogra_: see my converstation with jdstrand
[17:34] <ogra_> was that only for the session Mir instead of unity-system-compositor ?
[17:34] <kgunn> right
[17:34] <ogra_> ah
[17:34]  * ogra_ sees the backlog :)
[17:35] <kgunn> and i do know that we fully clean up stale sockets for all "handle-able" shutdowns, sigstops etc...but crashes may be a diff matter
[17:35] <jdstrand> ogra_: would native GL applications on Mir need it? eg, a gl game?
[17:35] <jdstrand> sorry, kgunn ^
[17:35]  * jdstrand has a note in the policy about that
[17:35] <kgunn> jdstrand: only in test instance, like where we run our demo code...(hang on)
[17:35] <ogra_> yeah ... i wouldnt be able to answer how native EGL apps would run with Mir
[17:36] <ogra_> :)
[17:36] <ogra_> i would expect actual native apps to link directly with libGLES or so though
[17:36] <kgunn> jdstrand: see the "running mir natively" section of http://unity.ubuntu.com/mir/using_mir_on_pc.html
[17:36] <ogra_> and not care about Mir at all
[17:37] <kgunn> jdstrand: oh i think i get what you mean...
[17:38] <kgunn> jdstrand: duh, yeah...so any "native mir" client will need to have a socket
[17:38] <jdstrand> right
[17:38] <kgunn> in the case of unity8 we're hiding that behind platform-api is my guess
[17:38] <jdstrand> ok, so I'll keep that
[17:38] <kgunn> all those sockets will be in some <something>/usr/ dir
[17:38] <ogra_> kgunn, but if i i.e. port an android gamme that natively uses GLES to ubuntu, would i have to involve Mir at all ? thats handled on the lib level, no ?
[17:39] <ogra_> (or SDL games )
[17:39] <kgunn> ogra_: is your android port to Qt? or native mir ?
[17:39] <jdstrand> kgunn: you said mir_socket was moved out of /tmp, did it go to XDG_RUNTIME_DIR like the bug suggests?
[17:40] <ogra_> kgunn, well, something like openarena for example ... would that have to be integrated with Mir at all ?
[17:40] <kgunn> jdstrand: for the session server yes...so there are 2 mir server, 1 is the "systemcompositor" which is at root, owned by the unity-system-compositor
[17:40] <jdstrand> I can confirm the existence of /tmp/mir_socketand the non-existence of /run/user/32011/mir_socket on r43
[17:40] <kgunn> the second server, is the unity8 owned server for the session
[17:41] <kgunn> ogra_: so SDL is a layer that would "take care" of the socket in that case, and for openarena...that runs on X...so xmir layer takes care of that
[17:42] <kgunn> ogra_: only in the instance where there is no abstraction layer between the app and the mir client api would there need to be awareness of a mir socket
[17:42] <jdstrand> an SDL game would still need the access since the lib would be in process
[17:42] <ogra_> i think openarena directly uses GL/GLES calls even on X
[17:42] <kgunn> ogra_: GL/GLES is kinda unrelated to the socket on mir...
[17:42] <jdstrand> the developer may not have to know about it, but the process would
[17:42] <kgunn> yes jdstrand right
[17:42] <ogra_> <- not a GLES guy ... just curious
[17:43] <kgunn> ogra_: no worries :)
[17:43] <kgunn> i know..gfx guys are weird
[17:43] <ogra_> haha
[17:44] <jdstrand> kgunn: so, was this change supposed to be in r43? I have 0.1.9+14.10.20140430.1-0ubuntu1 installed but still see /tmp/mir_socket
[17:44] <jdstrand> (this is on mako)
[17:44] <ogra_> jdstrand, the change was only for the session socket
[17:44] <jdstrand> but the session socket isn't in /run/user/32011 either
[17:44] <ogra_> se in $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR, there is another socket
[17:44] <jdstrand> or is it abstract now?
[17:45] <ogra_> or at least should be
[17:45] <jdstrand> nope
[17:45] <jdstrand> not with r43 in the emulator
[17:45] <ogra_> root@ubuntu-phablet:~# ls -l /run/user/32011/mir_socket
[17:45] <ogra_> srwxrwxr-x 1 phablet phablet 0 May 22 13:20 /run/user/32011/mir_socket
[17:45] <ogra_> thats what i have on 39
[17:46] <ogra_> not really abstract
[17:46] <jdstrand> no
[17:46] <jdstrand> weird, I don't have it on the emulator
[17:46] <ogra_> i wonder why you wouldnt have it on the emulator
[17:46] <ogra_> rsalveti, ??
[17:46] <kgunn> jdstrand: ogra_ ...feeling like i may not be doing the greatest in answering, can we move to #ubuntu-mir ?
[17:46]  * rsalveti reading
[17:47] <ogra_> probably because it uses GLES forwarding ... not sure why that would affect the session socket though
[17:49] <rsalveti> ogra_: you should have it on the emulator as well
[17:49] <rsalveti> make sure it's the same image
[17:49] <rsalveti> ogra_: and the gl game shouldn't need to know mir, libsdl would need to talk mir though
[17:50] <rsalveti> let me download latest image on the emulator and check
[17:51] <jdstrand> oh, haha
[17:51] <jdstrand> rsalveti: nm
[17:51] <jdstrand> unity8 wasn't running here
[17:51] <jdstrand> ok, so session socket missing mystery solved
[17:53] <ogra_> rsalveti, well, i'm on 39 looking at flo
[17:53] <ogra_> lets move to the mir channel though
[17:54] <ogra_> rsalveti, right, thats what i thought, GL/GLES games just link directly and bypass the display-server
[17:54] <ogra_> thats the amount of hlaf knowledge i collected over the years :)
[17:54] <ogra_> (why dont we have an openarena click package yet btw ? :P)
[17:55] <rsalveti> right, but we need to change libsdl to support mir
[17:55] <rsalveti> not sure if that was done already
[17:56] <ogra_> it was apparently
[17:56] <ogra_> a while ago
[17:57] <ogra_> there were even demos on G+
[17:57] <ogra_> iirc bregma forwarded something
[17:57] <ogra_> (proper upstreamed even)
[18:04] <rsalveti> ogra_: cool, then it should be fine :-)
[18:07] <dobey> infinity: hi. i need to bump the version again to replace the current package in -proposed right?
[18:50] <bregma> just FYI, libSDL2 (not SDl 1.2) works on native Mir out of the box in Ubuntu 14.04 and later...  the lib needs to know what the native window system is to get an EGL context, so if it the app does its own GLX calls it won't work on Mir but if it relies on SDL, it'll be fine
[18:50] <bregma> it needs the environment variable for the socket defined, just like X needs DISPLAY defined
[18:50] <bregma> and if it's libSDL1.2, no joy anyway
[18:51] <ogra_> yeah, we have a guy who wants to experiment with it ... slvn was the nick i think
[18:51] <ogra_> he didnt get far because upstart-app-launch was broken though ... LD_LIBRARY_PATH didnt get set properly so he couldnt ship the lib
[18:52] <ogra_> (that was fixed today ... looking forward to see some SDL fancyness in click apps)
[19:34] <smoser> hey all. i'm just thinking what woudl be the easiest / most preferred way to block net-device-added events from bringing up networking until after cloud-init-local had run.
[19:35] <smoser> those are emitted by udev, and consumed by network-interface.conf
[19:39] <dobey> infinity: ping
[20:28] <dobey> hmm :-/
[23:46] <infinity> dobey: Sorry, I've been out sick all day.  Yes, you need to bump the version.


[07:10] <lordievader> Good morning
 @Kris Tjan, If you're patient, careful, and do your research well, you can actually fix such errors without risk to your data, but prolly easier to boot from a Linux LiveDVD and back up your important data to an external drive and then reinstall.  Fixing broken boot (on ANY operating system) does require some skills and knowledge (and as mentioned, patience and caution).
 If done right, the reinstall might not even touch your data (depending on how the system was initially set up, and how you go about the reinstall).
[07:35] <lordievader> Like blooalien says, start by salvaging data through a live-usb/cd. Then you can figure out what the problem is.
[07:39] <lordievader> How did you create the live dvd?
[07:40] <lordievader> (Live-usb drives are typically easier, as you can reuse the one if things go wrong)
[08:12] <lordievader> How did you burn it, just the iso, or the contents of the iso?
[09:21] <lordievader> Putting the iso on disc directly will not work 😉 hence the question.
 (Photo, 1280x960) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/BCNsXexL/file_23142.jpg hi, I was trying to make work a hard disk with no success, I made the mistake to try to mount it on the mount point "/home/disk2" and then rebooted the computer. Now the system isn't loading anymore and I get to emergency mode. Any help would be appreciated
 (Photo, 1280x960) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/IqXpi8ys/file_23143.jpg
 I tried rebooting the system with and without the hard disk but the problem persists
 after the line "a start job is running for /dev/sdb2" the computer goes to emergency mode
[11:12] <tomreyn> !emergency | salvaconnome
[11:12] <tomreyn> !recovery | salvaconnome
[11:15] <lordievader> salvaconnome That looks like your disk is broken.
 yeah but the disk I was trying to mount is not the Kubuntu disk
[11:21] <lordievader> I'd say the Kubuntu drive is broken.
[11:21] <lordievader> Start a live-usb and run `smartctl -a` on the drive (possibly after installing the `smartmontools` package)
 I'm trying to load the Recovery Mode now, now is doing some disk control (it may take some time since the computer have many disks actually)
 (Photo, 1280x720) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/LcgOTvfJ/file_23146.jpg
 haha that's funny
 @lordievader, will try thanks
 okay I did a "smartctl -a" on the drive after installing smartmontools
 now what?
[12:36] <lordievader> Can you share the output?
[12:36] <lordievader> !paste
 https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/3s55c6mn4S/
 I tried to reboot in recovery mode again with only the system hard disk attached and it says this
 (Photo, 1280x960) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/H7w0U9k0/file_23154.jpg
 a start job is running for /dev/sdb2
 and then it breaks to half emergency mode half recovery mode without letting me use recovery mode
 but the weird thing is that there is no sdb2 so why is waiting for it to start?
[12:50] <lordievader> sda is showing three pending sectors... and a few errors during smart tests. I'd replace it if I were you.
[12:50] <lordievader> Is sdb2 still defined in `/etc/fstab`?
 how do I do that?
[12:50] <lordievader> Do what?
 both things
[12:51] <lordievader> Replacing a disk is a physical action. Buy a new one, connect both, transfer data, remove old  one.
 replace pending sectors
 ah ok
[12:51] <lordievader> `grep sdb /etc/fstab` will show you if it is still referred to
 then the second one lol
 grep: /etc/: Is a directory … grep: fstab: No such file or directory
 or do I have to do this in emergency mode?
[12:54] <lordievader> `/etc/fstab` contains no spaces.
 I tried the commands on the liveusb now
[12:54] <lordievader> In that case you need to check the `/etc/fstab` from the "Kubuntu" drive.
 do I have to mount all the partitions of the disk?
 im a n00b for this kind of problems I have no idea of what I have to do
 how do I remove this bastards
 Hello everyone!  I would like to know if any of you have encountered problems with sharing the screen via Chrome and using 2 monitors simultaneously.  I have been for several months that every time I share my screen, I share both monitors as if it were one.
 that-s the output of sdb /etc/fstab
 sorry daniel but I-ve never used that option
[13:06] <BluesKaj> Howdy all
[13:07] <lordievader> salvaconnome: Yes, you have to mount the root partition of your Kubuntu install.
 yeah I figured that out, I then edited the fstab file and commented the lines I believe are wrong, trying a reboot now
 yes it worked, thank you so much for your patience and help lordievader, you're a life saver
 I know this computer needs a new hard drive but I needed to make it work for now
[13:16] <lordievader> No problem 😉
[22:00] <oerheks> sure
[22:00] <oerheks> !usb
[22:01] <oerheks> rufus is preferred
[22:36]  * keithzg-M vaguely remembers there being a bug open for using `dd` in WSL, though it looks like it's still open and very unlikely to ever be resolved: https://github.com/microsoft/WSL/issues/689  Maybe with WSL2?
[22:37] <keithzg-M> One can also purportedly use Cygwin's `dd`. I mean it's definitely a better plan to just use Rufus or other such native tools, but :D
[23:25] <mparillo> And Rufus has dd mode.]
[23:25] <mparillo> What I have not tried is dd in WSL
[23:26] <mparillo> keithzg-M: Do you know anything about WSL2?
[23:28] <mparillo> Pretty much all I do with WSL is zsync and perl
[23:49] <keithzg-M> mparillo: dd definitely won't work in WSL since there's no actual block device access, WSL2 is actually using the CPU hardware virtualization extensions so miiiiight work? Although I'm not sure it's even out yet.


[06:23] <elfy> good morning jibel :)
[12:18] <elfy> so RC is built today balloons
[12:18] <elfy> oh good lord
[12:18] <elfy> was 5 minutes ago
[12:19] <elfy> now Final is ready for testing ...
[12:20] <elfy> blaming stgraber and Riddell for confusing me with that :D
[13:34] <balloons> woot, builds are going to be on time
[13:59] <senan> balloons, hi .. finally it worked :)
[14:06] <balloons> senan, I had trouble running it without that package, the konsole-plugin
[14:07] <senan> balloons, After adding the ppa, installed everything you mentioned..all is well :)
[14:07] <balloons> senan, hehe, great
[14:07] <senan> balloons, so whats next ?
[14:08] <senan> balloons, how do I enter commands in that >
[14:08] <senan> ?
[14:09] <balloons> senan, so the next step is to update the tests to support the UI change. Let me find the MP
[14:10] <senan> balloons, I'll be back after dinner :)
[14:10] <balloons> senan, https://code.launchpad.net/~flscogna/ubuntu-terminal-app/uri-and-tabs/+merge/237353
[14:11] <balloons> senan, so in trunk the tests work and pass of course, but that MP changes the UI layout. The developer could use some help in changing the tests as well
[15:57] <elfy> balloons: I got completely confused by it all - I now assume your post to mean "Once the pre-testing RC/Final phase is over - the end of the week/weekend will see it released"
[15:57] <balloons> elfy, now I'm confused :)
[15:57] <elfy> We're just about a week away from the first RC images for utopic hitting the image tracker.
[15:57] <elfy> you said that
[15:58] <elfy> no we're not - we're not even getting one - the first final image was there today :)
[15:58] <elfy> anyway - not important
[18:18] <dkessel> balloons, elfy: do you guys want to set some "importances" for the iso tracker bugs? about 50% of the bugs have no importance set...
[18:19] <wxl> dkessel: waiting for my application to bugcontrol to be approved and then i'd be happy to help :)
[18:19] <elfy> 99% of them would be non-Xubuntu I would guess and nothing to do with me
[18:21] <wxl> oh so xubuntu is only 1% flawed, huh? ;)
[18:21] <elfy> no - not at all - only about 5 people have reported via tracker :(
[18:21] <wxl> yeah well i know that feeling :(
[18:21] <elfy> so - 98% aren't X/L/ubuntu :p
[18:22] <wxl> heheheh
[18:22] <wxl> althugh kylin appears to produce about 90% of them, 80% of which aren't in any sort of western language at all :)
[18:22] <elfy> lol
[18:23] <elfy> dkessel: other than vbox issues - afaik only one Xubuntu iso bug - and that's appearances only
[18:24] <elfy> though I am sure that on the 24th loads of people will find loads of bugs - too late by months
[18:24] <wxl> dkessel: you might want to send something out to the bugsquad if you really want something to happen generally
[18:25] <balloons> dkessel, bugs for the tool or bugs from testing?
[18:26] <dkessel> balloons: bugs for the tool. I forgot the link: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-qa-website/+bugs?orderby=importance
[18:28] <balloons> dkessel, in that case yes indeed there is importance. knome elfy , can you link the the pad you made?
[18:28]  * balloons looks for it
[18:32]  * elfy lost that
[18:33] <elfy> but frankly they should all be high imo
[18:33] <wxl> anything that negatively impacts our ability to do testing should be high
[18:34] <wxl> however, better reporting tools, for the sake of being honest, i'd call medium
[18:35] <elfy> balloons: found it :) http://pad.ubuntu.com/trackers
[18:35] <balloons> dkessel, there you are ^^
[18:37] <elfy> wxl: the thing is I would have guessed (and guess it is) that fixing one will make the rest a bit simpler
[18:41] <elfy> dkessel: and I can't set importance by the way - not important enough for that :)
[18:41] <dkessel> oh ok
[18:42] <elfy> bugsquad I guess - not getting involved in that
[18:44] <wxl> bugcontrol
[18:44] <wxl> bugsquad can't set importance
[18:44] <dkessel> If I were to start on working on any of this in my "qa tracker hacking week", then I would order bugs by importance and then... add a favicon to the page? ;)
[18:44] <wxl> it's the little subteam of bugsquad that can
[18:44] <wxl> ooh qa tracker hacking week
[18:44] <wxl> i likes the sound of that!!!
[18:45] <gQuigs> heh.. I just made it into bug-control..  most of the undecided look like medium or low to me..    are their any that you know are high?
[18:45] <elfy> wxl: that then - just replace control and squad - sentiment will remain the same
[18:45] <wxl> elfy: :)
[18:46] <elfy> gQuigs: the bugs we're talking about on the tracker? they might look medium to low to you - try wanting to get information out daily and you'll soon see they're all high ;)
[18:48] <dkessel> elfy: so you would want bug 1126449 to have high importance? maybe that helps gQuigs
[18:49] <elfy> oh good lord - that's so much higher than high it's untrue ...
[18:49] <elfy> it's got so bad now I get a script is unresponsive warning with it
[18:50] <dkessel> lol
[18:50] <elfy> I'd laugh - but I use that function :(
[18:51] <gQuigs> elfy: mention that in the bug!  :)
[18:52] <gQuigs> elfy: I'm not 100% sure what report this is referring to....
[18:52] <elfy> gQuigs: go here http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/315/builds
[18:53] <elfy> just above the products in the main part of the page - not the side
[18:53] <elfy> look for See removed and superseded builds - hit that - then I'll see you in a while ;)
[18:54] <elfy> and frankly these issues aren't new - everyone involved in here with it knows what's wrong and needs sorting
[18:56] <gQuigs> elfy: oh, ok..  I'll let you too it then.. just noticed that the bug isn't actionable from someone who doesn't know that already...
[18:57] <gQuigs> heh.. pretty bad.. but did load in 1 minute for me
[18:57]  * gQuigs wish he was used to webapps being faster than that generally
[18:57] <elfy> gQuigs: I don't mean to sound despondent about these things - it's just that I am ;)
[18:59] <balloons> dkessel, you are a captive audience, and I would agree with elfy. The historical results is a big one, probably the biggest. The next has to do with the UI layout. knome actually worked on a really nice mockup with me and other a bit ago. It would be nice to have it implemented as a longer term thing
[19:01] <balloons> dkessel,
[19:01] <elfy> I'd have thought that the UI layout would be good if we could get bugs listed instead of icons at the same time
[19:02] <balloons> check it out: http://imgur.com/PT7horN
[19:02] <balloons> elfy, did you ever see this ^^?
[19:03] <dkessel> balloons: excellent - this looks much more usable then the current UI
[19:05] <elfy> balloons: no - but I rather like that :)
[19:06] <balloons> dkessel, if you pm me your email I'll send you along a thread with some more info
[19:06] <elfy> make the bugs draggable to the fail/pass dialogues and I'd be a lot happier than I am atm :)
[19:07] <balloons> elfy, I don't know why it's broken.. it works on my 'test' site
[19:07] <elfy> balloons: and I suppose that making the trackers usable for those reporting probably trumps reporting for the few
[19:08] <elfy> so - exospehere for UI importance, thermosphere for reporting - then merely high for the remainder :p
[19:09] <balloons> elfy, I would say historical reporting is a big one.. but yes, changing the UI layout is big. Those two I suspect are the big ones to get right first
[19:09] <elfy> yea - I would think the remainder would then logically suggest importance after those 2
[19:10] <elfy> I would stand on wxl's side of the fence on gathering information as easily as possible for QA teams/leads etc
[19:16] <alesage> charles, elopio asking if the transfer indicator should be visible if there's no transfer in progress
[19:16] <charles> alesage, the answer is no
[19:16] <charles> alesage, this was a recent change in design & code
[19:16] <charles> for a long time it was visible regardless of transfer status
[19:17] <alesage> charles super, similar to desktop in that way
[19:17] <charles> alesage, https://bugs.launchpad.net/indicator-transfer/+bug/1377275
[19:17] <alesage> charles thanks; elopio ^^
[19:17] <elopio> thanks
[20:41] <knome> balloons, dkessel: oi
[20:41] <elfy> evening knome
[20:42] <knome> hey elfy :)
[20:59] <balloons> knome, howdy
[21:00] <knome> got your email, and sure


[00:19] <Pici> ...
[00:26]  * jrib considers adding that for next time
[00:27] <mneptok> 0 m/s. it hit the ceiling and fell back to ground level.
[00:27]  * mneptok just tried it.
[00:27] <Pici> :D
[00:40] <usuario> my usb wont mount and my /proc/scsi/scsi is blank
[00:40] <usuario>  any advice
[00:42] <Pici> usuario: Again. This is not a support channel.  Please /join #ubuntu
[05:04] <emma> I just wanted to see what your topic looked like these days. I haven't been here in a while. :)
[05:04] <emma> Best wishes to all of you, keep up the good work.
[05:06] <elky> ugh.
[05:33] <Myrtti> MK-BB: hello!
[06:33] <jussi01> o/
[06:52] <nigelb> there is a spammer in #ubuntu-women, can someone kick/ban ?
[07:15] <Bacta> Hi
[07:16] <Bacta> Are appeals only done via the mailing list?
[07:16] <elky> !appeals
[07:17] <Bacta> I figure I'm on step 2 then
[07:17] <Bacta> Do you prefer your logs to be pastebin'd or attached as .txts?
[07:20] <elky> up to you
[07:21] <Bacta> Awesome
[07:21] <Bacta> Thanks for your help
[08:14] <bazhang> wre in -ot   trolling ##windows earlier so be aware
[08:28] <dholbach> good morning
[08:28] <ikonia> morning
[08:28] <bazhang> dholbach, hi
[08:30] <dholbach> hi bazhang, hi ikonia
[08:31] <ikonia> howdy
[08:48] <bazhang> thought it was iamrandom that did the dcc exploit
[08:49] <ikonia> mega, I need to restart my irssi client and apologies to him
[08:49] <ikonia> bazhang: thank you
[08:50] <bazhang> lanlost just got forwarded to #ubuntu-read-topic afaict
[08:51] <ikonia> I've removed the ban and sent him a very apologetic pm. I'll going to restart screen, see if that helps. Back shortly
[08:52] <ikonia> ok - lets see if that makes a differnce, if not I'll have to restart the client
[08:53] <Lanlost> Heh, I'm here again =)
[08:54] <ikonia> hello
[08:55] <Lanlost> hi, I'm going to smoke real quick actually.. unrelated =P
[08:55] <ikonia> the floodbots in #ubuntu put a ban forward on you after the dcc exploit
[08:55] <Lanlost> I'm using xchat btw
[08:55] <ikonia> (picking up from our conversation in pm)
[08:55] <ikonia> if this has happened to you before, I wonder if your client does something when someone does a dcc exploit in the channel
[08:55] <Lanlost> yeah I'm curious
[08:55] <Lanlost> you can't acutally proform this DCC exploit can you?
[08:56] <Lanlost> so I can quit all channels except for one and see what happens specifically
[08:56] <ikonia> not without causing pain to others
[08:56] <Lanlost> ^
[08:56] <ikonia> suppose we could test it in a private channel ?
[08:56] <Lanlost> yeah
[08:56] <Lanlost> but I need to smoke real quick.. 3 min
[08:56] <ikonia> no problem
[08:56] <Lanlost> im a coder so I'm interested in whats going on here
[08:56] <Lanlost> especially if it means that its a problem in xchat and hasn't been fixed then I could patch it
[08:57] <ikonia> Lanlost: shout when you're back and we'll look at this
[09:05] <Lanlost> ok back
[09:05] <Lanlost> lemme close out of the channels I'm in
[09:05] <ikonia> ok, do you want to join ##test ?
[09:06] <ikonia> ??
[09:11] <ikonia> ok so that confirms you are suseptable to dcc exploit
[09:11] <Lanlost> There we go
[09:11] <ikonia> !dcc
[09:12] <Lanlost> Now I suppose I gotta figure out if it's my router or xchat..
[09:12] <ikonia> Lanlost: have a read through that link and see if any of it applys to you
[09:12] <ikonia> I'd put money on your router
[09:12] <Lanlost> I would think plenty of people use xchat though
[09:12] <Lanlost> its a wrt54g
[09:12] <Lanlost> probably could upgrade firmware though: Firmware Version: v1.00.4
[09:13] <Lanlost> not to mention xchat package probably isnt the newest: XChat 2.8.6
[09:13] <bazhang> its the router
[09:14] <bazhang> plustax_ giving total random advice?
[09:14] <bazhang> err totally
[09:14] <Lanlost> I'm pretty sure I'm already on 8001
[09:15] <Lanlost> yeah, I am
[09:16] <mneptok> Lanlost: Linksys firmware?
[09:16] <Lanlost> are you asking what version?
[09:17] <Lanlost> Does this DCC exploit JUST cause people who are susceptible to disconnect?
[09:17] <ikonia> yes
[09:17] <Lanlost> I mean, It's not like I get it and then start sending it out myself or something
[09:17] <ikonia> no
[09:17] <Lanlost> ok, well let me check firmware stuff
[09:22] <Lanlost> was using 1.00.4
[09:22] <Lanlost> will be upgrading to current which is http://downloads.linksysbycisco.com/downloads/WRT54Gv5v6_v1.02.7_FwReleaseNotes.txt
[09:22] <Lanlost> ok brb
[09:28] <Lanlost> Alright
[09:29] <Lanlost> Can we test one more time in ##test?
[09:34] <Lanlost> ?
[09:34] <Lanlost> I don't know if I'm even here, I'm in like 5 channels and I can't see anyone talking
[09:34] <topyli> Lanlost, one two one two
[09:34] <Lanlost> ok, wow, just coinsidence
[09:35] <Lanlost> I saw that
[09:35] <Lanlost> who wants to dcc exploit me?
[09:35] <Lanlost> router has been upgraded, firmware wise
[09:36] <bazhang> Lanlost, you are in #ubuntu-read-topic now?
[09:38] <Lanlost> no..
[09:38] <Lanlost> ok, now I am
[09:38] <bazhang> Lanlost, okay, join that channel
[09:38] <Lanlost> I joined it directly
[09:38] <Lanlost> instead of trying to join #ubuntu
[09:39] <bazhang> please read the topic there and follow the instructions
[09:39] <Lanlost> I've done this before though and passed it
[09:39] <bazhang> there you go
[09:39] <bazhang> try and join #ubuntu now
[09:39] <Lanlost> I can..
[09:39] <bazhang> yep
[09:39] <Lanlost> I'm telling you. I've done this before
[09:40] <tsimpson> Lanlost: I told the bots to "think" you were a victim, so they tested you
[09:40] <tsimpson> you passed
[09:40] <Lanlost> I know this..
[09:40] <Lanlost> I typed test me as well though
[09:40] <Lanlost> This is fine and all, but I've passed before and yet was still susceptible
[09:40] <Lanlost> That's all I'm saying. I just wanted someone to do what ikonia did
[09:41] <Lanlost> Received a malformed DCC request from FloodBot2.
[09:41] <Lanlost> * Contents of packet: DCC SEND<PHONE_NUMBER>abcdef
[09:41] <Lanlost> I didn't get that from him.. He just said he was doing it and then I disconnected
[09:41] <Lanlost> which is what always happens, I never see any DCC requests when it happened in the past
[09:41] <tsimpson> the point is that the router didn't crash
[09:41] <Lanlost> First of all
[09:41] <Lanlost> It never crashed
[09:42] <Lanlost> Second of all, that doesn't mean it's fixed
[09:42] <tsimpson> well, it resets the connection
[09:42] <Myrtti> no, it disconnected you from port 6667
[09:42] <Myrtti> or whatever port it was using
[09:42] <Lanlost> I wasn't on port 6667
[09:42] <Myrtti> it didn't crash
[09:42] <Lanlost> i was on 8001..
[09:42] <Myrtti> well that's new
[09:43] <Lanlost> Yeah
[09:43] <Lanlost> I set it to freenode.net port 8001 last time this happened, which was like a week ago.
[09:43] <Lanlost> I've NEVER not passed the test though and then I end up banned from #ubuntu a day or two later
[09:44] <Lanlost> I go into #ubuntu-read-topic.. don't change anything and pass the test
[09:44] <Lanlost> But whatever ikonia did, I never saw a DCC request, malformed or not and got disconnected.
[09:44] <Lanlost> It's fine .. I guess. The firmware update probably fixed it anyway. I was just curious what was going on and thats why I wanted it tested again. I'm not sure how he did it though.
[09:45] <bazhang> Lanlost, in #ubuntu or #ubuntu-offtopic
[09:45] <ikonia> Lanlost: lets test you
[09:45] <ikonia> jump into ##test
[09:45] <Lanlost> Thank you
[09:49] <Lanlost> Thanks again, every time being here has been a great experience
[09:49] <ikonia> no problem
[09:50] <Lanlost> What a strange exploit. I'll have to figure out what it's exploiting. Can't be good if people are susceptible enough to it that there has to be the -read-topic channel.
[09:51] <Lanlost> Reminds me of the android exploit that was in the original OS version released with the G1.
[09:51] <Lanlost> You could easily root your phone to upgrade it to whatever you wanted because.. .. ... every command was being forwarded to a terminal.
[09:52] <Lanlost> Apparently a guy found out when he sent a text message to his friend telling him to reboot his computer and his phone rebooted.. sigh.
[09:52] <Lanlost> Anyway, I'll stop spamming. Thanks.
[09:53] <Lanlost> er, one more thing. I never saw the exploit when you used it until the last time. I must have been disconnected before it even displayed.
[09:54] <Lanlost> Does this mean that everyone in the channel sees it when someone does it? If that's the case it would be pretty easy to see who is doing it. That's why I was asking about the priv message.
[09:55] <Lanlost> I understand this is probably not appropriate for this channel btw, that's why I was asking in #test. I'll let you go though. Thanks again
[09:57] <topyli> Lanlost, well you can join #ubuntu, and as a bonus you got around to upgrading the router :)
[09:58] <topyli> if all is well, you can part this channel. thanks for working things out!
[10:03] <Lanlost> ack, I didn't realize I didn't part it
[10:03] <Lanlost> I did a /close #ubuntu-ops and it closed one of the channels I was in again. Alright, bye
[10:07] <Myrtti> and now for something completely different: http://www.flickr.com/photos/myrtti/4364188891/
[10:22] <jussi01> Myrtti: no... just worng  :P
[10:22] <jussi01> wrong even
[10:29] <wre> "#ubuntu Cannot send to channel" help
[10:30] <wre> seems to have been resolved by itself. thanks
[10:35] <bazhang> floodbot2 got klined
[10:36] <tsimpson> yep, so did nalioth
[10:36] <bazhang> odd
[10:36] <tsimpson> the odd thing is, it's happened several times before
[10:36] <bazhang> true
[10:44] <tomaw> someone on the host joined a kline channel
[10:45] <Myrtti> charming
[10:45] <tomaw> I killed it and unklined anyway
[10:46] <gnomefreak> floodbot and nalioth do something bad?
[11:29] <elky> ugh, bacta is PM flooding me
[11:34] <Tm_T> nice
[11:36] <jussi01> elky: have you approached a freenode staffer about it?
[11:38] <elky> jussi01, considering it stopped and he's now just continuing to try convince me that ikonia should be expelled from the team because tsimpson disagreed with him on something (which is what the flood was, logs of that) i don't see it'd do much
[11:38] <elky> he started at me like this because i told him to not troll -women after proclaiming he ought to be called "trollzilla"
[11:39] <elky> i'm so over dealing with this guy.
[11:40] <jussi01> elky: then dont. if theres a problem, refer it to others.
[11:41] <ikonia> jussi01: we need something that is the opposite of appeals
[11:41] <ikonia> people like this are just becoming a long term waste of time and resource
[11:41] <elky> jussi01, the only way it's going to stop is if i put him on ignore, and that's really not something that I consider a wise thing to do for a cross-namespace troll
[12:21] <ikonia> @mark #ubuntu spellingbot wre from earlier, causing an issue in #ubuntu and #ubuntu-offtopic
[12:38] <ikonia> hello SpaceGhostC2C
[12:41] <ikonia> SpaceGhostC2C: hello ??
[12:46] <bazhang> SpaceGhostC2C, please dont idle here should you have no outstanding business, thanks
[12:57] <ikonia> SpaceGhostC2C: hello ? do you need something ?
[13:07] <bazhang> is MK-BB a loco op?
[13:07] <ikonia> don't know
[13:10] <SpaceGhostC2C> Hey. Are some people unable or not allowed to use the bot?
[13:10] <SpaceGhostC2C> ikonia, a friendly face. Do you know if some people can be ignored by the bot?
[13:10] <SpaceGhostC2C> Can you read me?
[13:10] <ikonia> yes
[13:10] <ikonia> sometimes the bot lags so it looks like it's ignoring you
[13:10] <ikonia> or if it's been used too much it ignores you
[13:11] <ikonia> eg: do !hi, then !hi, then !hi the 3rd one will get ignored
[13:11] <Pici> The second one should be ignored.
[13:11] <ikonia> ahh second, even better
[13:11] <ikonia> thank you Pici
[13:14] <Pici> SpaceGhostC2C: Anything else we can help you with today?
[13:30] <elky> um... is anyone suspicious about the newcomer to -ot at all?
[13:31] <Pici> Yes.
[13:31] <MenZa> Whichonesthat?
[13:31] <MenZa> Oh right.
[13:31] <elky> MenZa, the one that rather rhymes with an op name and says "srsbznz" or whatever
[13:32] <MenZa> Aye, aye.
[13:32] <elky> iinet is not a typical trollpit isp in .au, they're on the pricier side of things hence fewer students use them
[13:32] <Pici> Its probably a futile attempt, but I'm grepping for the host
[13:32] <MenZa> Good plan. I'm out, powercut.
[13:32] <Pici> I neeed caffiene first though.
[13:33] <elky> the exception to that rule being the prolificness of the optus which is only due to the mobile broadband network they onsell
[13:34] <ikonia> SpaceGhostC2C: I assume you don't need anything or have stepped away from the keyboard again ?
[13:36] <Pici> no grep results
[13:38] <elky> Pici, when optus hostmasks say "dyn" it really does mean dynamic
[13:38] <elky> not "oh we might change it in a month or so"
[13:38] <elky> more like "we'll change it soemtime in the next 48hrs"
[13:39] <elky> mute them?
[13:52] <Myrtti> whatthe...
[13:55] <Pici> we don't know.
[14:16] <Myrtti> i wish i knew atleast the motive behind it. is it purely to annoy me
[14:45] <Tm_T> umm, I will be mostly away some days/weeks
[14:46] <Tm_T> so see you later (: ->
[14:57] <Pici> Tm_T: have fun?
[14:59] <jpds> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Signpost/Destinations#Channel:%20#ubuntu-signpost
[14:59] <jpds> wut.
[15:00] <Pici> Never heard of it
[15:01] <Pici> I'm going to remove it from that list, also register the channel and forward to #ubuntu just in case.
[15:04] <Myrtti> oh dear
[15:04] <Myrtti> it has ubuntuguide on it
[15:22] <bazhang> MK-BB, is a loco op?
[15:23] <Myrtti> yup
[15:23] <Myrtti> south korea  iirc
[15:23] <bazhang> aha
[15:23] <Myrtti> and he is in -irc too
[15:23] <bazhang> yep
[15:24] <bazhang> just saw him in -ko
[15:24] <Myrtti> talking?
[15:24] <bazhang> nope just present
[15:29] <Myrtti> MK-BB: your issue will be handled in #ubuntu-irc, not here
[15:31] <Myrtti> whatwhere
[15:53] <Pici> @login
[15:54] <Pici> !ping
[15:56] <MenZa> @login
[16:03] <tsimpson> Pici: the Java Chat ban is not a forward it seems
[16:03] <tsimpson> it doesn't mask the IP as far as I can tell, so not sure why it's banned
[16:04] <Pici> tsimpson: Correct.  I was referring to webchat.freenode.net
[16:04] <ikonia> java chat is just banned I thought ?
[16:04] <tsimpson> I'm just thinking, do we need to keep the ban?
[16:04] <Pici> Probably not.
[16:07] <tsimpson> I've removed it
[16:23] <genii> Trying to find out what OS satepc is on is like trying to pull teeth. Probably Arch
[16:23] <bazhang> nice guess
[16:46]  * Pici sighs
[16:49] <bazhang> cmp outburst in 3,2,
[16:50] <ikonia> I want to help the guy, but at some point he has to learn the basics
[16:50] <ikonia> more so if he's charging people for this
[16:57] <Myrtti> there we go then
[16:58] <ikonia> ?
[17:00] <Pici> ikonia: fyi, ufw = Uncomplicated Firewall, not Ubuntu Firewall
[17:00] <ikonia> Pici: thank you
[17:08]  * Myrtti facepalms
[17:08] <Pici> Myrtti: Whats up?
[17:10] <Myrtti> just looking at #ubuntu while clinging to my dinner of two crackers and an indigestion med
[17:11] <ikonia> bazhang: http://www.cs.utah.edu/~jmk/simian/download.htm
[17:12] <bazhang> ikonia, I must have missed the jump from img/theme to custom compile
[17:12] <ikonia> I've untar'd it and the dependencies look pretty old for ubuntu 8.04
[17:12] <Myrtti> the discussion of what cpu he has made me almost sneeze out the tablet
[17:12] <ikonia> ubuntu 6.06 he may have got away with
[17:13] <Pici> I'm sorry to sound rude, but I don't think that hes going to be able to figure out how to use the program if he can't even compile it.
[17:13] <ikonia> he'll have to either install the older dependencies - which means more custom compiles and appliction breakage, or update the dependenceis, which as he can't navigate the file system I don't think capable of doing
[17:13] <ikonia> Pici: I %100 agree, if he'd read the "new ubuntu user guide" so he got the basics we could start moving him forward a bit
[17:13] <Myrtti> Pici: no kidding?
[17:14] <bazhang> and he has no time to read apparently, so it will have to be done step by step via irc
[17:14] <ikonia> for some reason he refuses to read anything that resolves his issues
[17:26] <Pici> MenZa, bazhang: If either of you don't like it, feel free to act on it.
[17:27] <MenZa> What are we talking about?
[17:27]  * MenZa reads up
[17:27] <bazhang> Pici, act on 'pissy' ? no problem, and not an op in that channel
[17:27] <MenZa> Pici: If I were to moderate based on my, er, own limits, I wouldn't ever be telling anyone to watch their language.
[17:28] <Pici> I personally have no problem with that word, but I know other people do.
[17:28]  * MenZa laxes a bit.
[17:28] <bazhang> I always thought it meant grouchy/grumpy
[17:28] <Pici> It does.
[17:28] <MenZa> It does.
[17:29] <Pici> I've seen people take offense at 'pissy' or 'pissed off' before.
[17:29] <MenZa> And I have no problem with it, personally
[17:29] <MenZa> I've seen people take offence to "wtf", which makes no sense to me.
[17:29]  * MenZa shrugs
[17:29] <MenZa> I'll just sit and idle unless it run out of control, in which case I'll step in
[17:29]  * MenZa gets dinner
[17:29] <bazhang> the 'f' part presumably
[17:29] <MenZa> \o
[17:29] <MenZa> Sure.
[17:30] <MenZa> But I find it silly.
[17:30] <MenZa> It just means "currently experiencing a lot of confusion"
[17:30] <MenZa> :)
[17:30] <MenZa> No,ww, dinner.
[17:30] <bazhang> weird 'o' there
[17:31] <ikonia> !install
[17:39] <bazhang> dont click the link from mao
[17:44] <Trek> is ubottu lagging today or something?
[17:44] <ikonia> hello there trek
[17:44] <ikonia> it is lagging a little
[17:44] <bazhang> nhlpa is the chimpout fellow
[17:45] <ikonia> it's been on/off a few times today Trek
[17:45] <Trek> ah, so its a bot-side issue.
[17:45] <Trek> was wondering, thanks ikonia
[17:45] <ikonia> bazhang: are you %100 sure
[17:45] <ikonia> Trek: yeah, I've notied it a bit
[17:45] <Dominian> hrm
[17:45] <Dominian> is it PM spamming on-join again?
[17:46] <bazhang> just waiting for the flood of gnaa etc etc
[17:46] <ikonia> bazhang: I don't want to wait
[17:46] <ikonia> how confident are you ?
[17:46] <ikonia> eg: what's making you think it's him again ?
[17:47] <bazhang> the IP address
[17:47] <ikonia> Hmmm
[17:48] <ikonia> didn't we ban the ip last time he was here ?
[17:48] <ikonia> (obviously not) but I mean why didn't we ?
[17:48] <bazhang> klined after removal
[17:49] <ikonia> ah, so that's why
[17:50] <Dominian> bazhang: the IP for that user was klined at one point?
[17:51] <bazhang> Dominian, fairly close to that one, not sure of the exact address
[17:51] <Dominian> ah ok
[17:51] <bazhang> the mao fellow was much worse imo
[17:52] <bazhang> I clicked the link :/
[17:52] <Dominian> heh
[17:57] <bazhang> nhandler, just got kicked? jussi01
[17:57] <Pici> Yes.
[17:57] <bazhang> yikes
[18:11] <Myrtti> life is hard on its_me
[18:12] <bazhang> got him in PM
[18:12] <Myrtti> figured you would
[18:30] <Myrtti> whee. alabd is  back.
[18:31]  * Myrtti goes to make popcorn
[20:52] <guntbert> I'm here to defend my proposal about !here
[20:53]  * ikonia holds court
[20:53] <ikonia> just kidding
[20:53] <ikonia> what's up ?
[20:53] <bazhang> heh
[20:54] <guntbert> any questions about my proposal?
[20:54] <Myrtti> i can't see the point
[20:55] <guntbert> Myrtti: I see an increasing number of questions (mainly in #ubuntu) like: "please look at my post in <some obscure forum> or <some obscure website> and tell me how to solve"
[20:59] <jussi01> guntbert: so you are asking people to increase channel business so that you dont need to go to a website?
[20:59] <jussi01> guntbert: Im not trying to be annoying, just asking :)
[20:59] <ikonia> I do see his point, some of the tools being used are terrible
[20:59] <ikonia> one was a flash pastebin that I had to ask the guy to repost using pastebin as I couldn't get it to work
[21:00] <Myrtti> jussi01: it's graanted that if they'd give even a synopsis of the problem instead of just "omg look URL"
[21:00] <guntbert> jussi01: no - I'm only asking them to state the problem in the channel - so as not to have to visit another site just to see if I might be able/willing to help
[21:01] <Myrtti> i don't bother to go read such url, waste of time in many cases
[21:01] <ikonia> Myrtti: that's a sad truth
[21:02] <guntbert> ikonia: Myrtti: I don't think its sad - when someone wants help they should make it as easy as possible for the helper
[21:02] <ikonia> guntbert: maybe something a bit more along the lines of if you HAVE to use a pastebin, use pastebin.ubuntu.com, but give an overview in the channel
[21:03] <ikonia> jussi01: would that tie in better, in the hope that it catches on and only has to be used to start things off
[21:03] <jussi01> yeah, Id say thats probably better, sorry for my lack of contribution, Im actually a little distracted
[21:04] <Myrtti> i wouldn't mind forum links, but if there's no synopsis, there's no ay of telling can i help and it's waste of time
[21:04] <ikonia> jussi01: you'll be more distracted on friday when the post man turns up
[21:04] <jussi01> ikonia: yes, of that Im sure :D
[21:04] <Myrtti> as guntbert said
[21:04] <ikonia> Myrtti: forum links are just as bad, you have to go through 10 posts to get the actual problem
[21:04] <ikonia> guntbert: could we rework it, give an overview in the channel and if you have to paste, use pastebin.ubuntu.com ?
[21:05] <ikonia> guntbert: something along those lines, as I don't want 20 line pointless pastes in the channel, but I know where you've coming from
[21:05] <guntbert> ikonia: sounds good - I'm not too proud of my first idea
[21:05] <ikonia> nothing wrong with it, just may be better to guide them a little, more so as it's new people who don't know mostly
[21:08] <guntbert> ikonia: like: Please give at least an overview of your problem *here* (all in one line) - you will get a much greater audience. If you have to paste, please use pastebin.ubuntu.com .
[21:08] <ikonia> guntbert: that's more like what I was thinking yes
[21:09] <ikonia> guides people a little better
[21:09] <jussi01> maybe use If you have to use more than 3 lines, please ues...
[21:09] <ikonia> ok, that works
[21:09] <ikonia> guntbert: you ok ?
[21:09] <guntbert> ikonia: is ok with me :)
[21:10] <ikonia> ok, jussi01 that seems to be the deal clincer
[21:10] <ikonia> clincher
[21:10] <mneptok> i'm having a problem with IRC. please connect to Freenode and help me!
[21:11] <ikonia> problem *here* (all in one  line) - you will get a much greater audience. If you have to use more than 3 lines please use pastebin.ubuntu.com ?
[21:11] <ikonia> all happy ?
[21:12] <Myrtti> missing a comma
[21:12] <ikonia> after lines ?
[21:12] <Myrtti> i think so
[21:12] <ikonia> ooh, my cut and paste didn't work properly either
[21:13] <ikonia> it missed of the please give an overview
[21:14] <guntbert> Myrtti: I wouldn't know about a comma - I cannot set the correctly even in my own language (german)
[21:14] <guntbert> *them
[21:15] <ikonia> guntbert: I think Myrtti is right
[21:15] <ikonia> I'll attempt to re-cut and paste
[21:15] <Myrtti> isn't it paste.ubuntu.com too
[21:16] <ikonia> Please give at least an overview of your problem *here* (all in one line) - you will get a much greater audience. If you have to use more than 3 lines, please use paste.ubuntu.com
[21:16] <ikonia> hows that
[21:16] <mneptok> ikonia: please don't paste to the channel. post your paste in the Ubuntu Forums and then point us to the URL.
[21:16]  * mneptok giggles
[21:16]  * ikonia choses to ignore the troll in the corner
[21:17] <guntbert> Myrtti: both urls resolve to the same site
[21:17] <Myrtti> guntbert: one is shorter
[21:17] <guntbert> Myrtti: ok
[21:18] <ikonia> all happy with that then ?
[21:18] <guntbert> ikonia: ok with me - thx
[21:22] <Myrtti> talking of factoids
[21:23] <Myrtti> how about the pae one?
[21:23] <ikonia> guntbert: let me swap machines as this mac keyboard is driving me nuts and I'll submit it
[21:24] <guntbert> ikonia: take your time - I'm preparing to throw something else at you all right now
[21:50] <wolter> Hi, I would like to know who was responsible for my ban, and which is the reason why I am
[21:51] <guntbert> as ikonia doesn't need me to look over his shoulders, I'm gonna leave - have a nice time
[21:52] <ikonia> wolter: I think that may have been me, I remember your real name - one moment please
[21:53] <wolter> Ok
[21:54] <ikonia> wolter: be with you ASAP our tool is just being slow
[21:54] <ikonia> wolter: which channel are you banned from ?
[21:54] <wolter> #ubuntu
[21:54] <ikonia> wolter: you're in ubuntu now
[21:54] <wolter> Yes, but I cannot speak
[21:55] <wolter> And freenode says its because I'm banned
[21:55] <wolter> #ubuntu :Cannot change nickname while banned on channel
[21:55] <ikonia> ahh you've got around the ban by changing your nick
[21:55] <wolter> What do you mean?
[21:56] <ikonia> http://ubottu.com/bans.cgi?sess=decc39d30874792f9e2ab679386178c6
[21:56] <ikonia> ughh
[21:56] <ikonia> ignore that
[21:56] <ikonia>  stupid mac
[21:56] <wolter> Ok
[21:57] <wolter> Randolf is the alternative nickname I set in xchat
[21:57] <ikonia> wolter: you joined as rudolf then changed your nick once you where in the hannel
[21:57] <ikonia> randolf, yes
[21:57] <wolter> So, is that why I am banned?
[21:57] <ikonia> wolter: it appears the floodbots banned you
[21:58] <wolter> Oh
[21:58] <ikonia> your machine is open to a dcc exploit
[21:58] <ikonia> you've been banned twice and sent to a safe channel to fix your PC
[21:58] <wolter> Well, I didn't receive the warning this time, I believe I have fixed it
[21:58] <ikonia> each time it's as a result of a DCC
[21:58] <wolter> Oh, so I need to do the 'test me' thing?
[21:58] <ikonia> that's right
[21:59] <ikonia> I remember his real name too though, he did something else recently
[21:59] <ikonia> wolter: did you manage to get checked out ?
[22:00] <ikonia> wolter: hello ?
[22:00] <wolter> Hm, weird, I am being disconnected
[22:00] <wolter> Out of nowhere.. .
[22:00] <wolter> I think its every time I say 'test me' in the #ubuntu-read-topic channel
[22:00] <ikonia> wolter: you're failing the test
[22:01] <ikonia> that's why you're getting disconnected, the test is an exploit and you're failing so getting kicked off
[22:01] <wolter> oh
[22:01] <wolter> Maybe that explains why I cannot access a certain webpage
[22:01] <ikonia> doubtful
[22:01] <wolter> Do I need to factory reset my router?
[22:02] <ikonia> you ned to read the topic in the #ubuntu-read-topic channel
[22:03] <wolter> Ok
[22:03] <wolter> But my firmware is up to date. Ill try port 8001
[22:05] <wolter> I think I am getting fixed now.
[22:05] <wolter> Thanks ikonia
[22:05] <wolter> I am now unbanned.
[22:06] <ikonia> you helped your self, so no problem
[22:14] <ikonia> its_me: hello
[22:14] <its_me> hello, sir
[22:15] <ikonia> are you going to talk about your behaviour or just dodge more bans and brag about it ?
[22:17] <its_me> i dont know what are you talking about it here - and iam not here to tell you that iam sorry . as i dont see that i have said or done or behaved bad. the only thing which is bothering you all here -is that some how you are uncovered by some one simple like me .... some one who might uncover your mask and uncover your face at least in front of your self
[22:17] <its_me> dont ever thing that iam coming her to say please forgive me
[22:18] <its_me> i just wanted to show - how ever and whatever you all will kick me out - then i can come back again
[22:18] <its_me> different place
[22:18] <its_me> different name
[22:18] <its_me> and you wouldnt be able to stop it
[22:18] <its_me> this is networking
[22:18] <ikonia> ok - so your threats to ban dodge have been noted and reported to freenode staff
[22:19] <ikonia> you're welcome to leave the channel and I'll let freenode deal with you from now on
[22:19] <its_me> i dont care
[22:19] <its_me> iam not getting any support there any way
[22:19] <ikonia> ok, please leave the channel and go about your day
[22:19] <its_me> so its not a big deal for me
[22:19] <ikonia> ok, then we have nothing futher to discuss.
[22:20] <its_me> of course yes - but i have only one question as i asked to some one else here before and he couldnt answer
[22:20] <its_me> i wish you can
[22:20] <its_me> what was the OS you have used before linux in your past
[22:20] <its_me> do you have answer /
[22:20] <its_me> ?
[22:20] <ikonia> if someone else is active at this time, I'm sure they can help
[22:21] <its_me> so will you answer this question ?
[22:21] <ikonia> I'm not intrested in discussing anything other than your behaviour in here, so if you do not wish to discuss that - please leave and go about your day
[22:22] <its_me> my behaviour ???? what is your native language ?
[22:22] <its_me> are you indian?
[22:22] <ikonia> English
[22:22] <its_me> and you dont know how to type behaviour ?????
[22:23] <its_me> its behavior  ikonia
[22:23] <ikonia> well, spelling mistake is hardly bad behavior
[22:24] <ikonia> but as I said, I'm not intererested in discussing anything with you other than your "behavior" so unless you wish to resolve that, there is nothing more to talk about
[22:24] <its_me> what about my behavior ..is it the purpose of being here to help?
[22:25] <ikonia> I'm sorry, I don't understand what you're saying
[22:25] <its_me> is it your goal to help me about my behavior here ?????
[22:25] <ikonia> hopefully
[22:26] <ikonia> just get you able to particpate in the ubuntu channel without breaking the rules
[22:26] <ikonia> and maybe get a little better help than you've been getting due to your lack of basic linux knowledge (which isn't a problem - everyone starts somewhere)
[22:26] <its_me> what rules ..... rules of you all to show off ?
[22:26] <ikonia> no, the rules of helping you to help yourself, and not talking about illegal activites
[22:27] <its_me> rules of pretending that you are the most saints on earth ?
[22:27] <ikonia> ok, I'm done now
[22:27] <ikonia> I have othing more to say to you while you play this game. good bye
[22:27] <its_me> i asked you question
[22:27] <its_me> answer me ?
[22:27] <its_me> what was your OS before linux?
[22:27] <its_me> iam not here to play game with you
[22:28] <its_me> iam not interested in you for games
[22:28] <its_me> just answer me if you have answer
[22:28] <topyli> its_me, apparently you're not interested in very constructive discussions at this time. please leave the channel and return when you feel like resolving the issue
[22:29] <its_me> resolve what ... who are you to think that iam here to ask for forgivness
[22:29] <its_me> you too answer me
[22:30] <its_me> what was your OS in the past
[23:00] <Myrtti>  oh god
[23:13] <ikonia> spaceghost is getting rude again
[23:16] <Thrae> Hi, I have read https://wiki.edubuntu.org/IRC/Guidelines , http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct , http://freenode.net/policy.shtml#offtopic , and http://freenode.net/channel_guidelines.shtml and I don't see anything barring the occasional NSFW video (except pornography), especially considering the language in the video is censored except for the word "penis". I'm new to #ubuntu-offtopic, but that's all the channel ...
[23:16] <Thrae> ... topic has as its guidelines. Specifically, Ubuntu's IRC guidelines state there is no "blanket ban on any and all mention of topics." I was instantly banned without warning by MenZa, and he says this is not proper social behavior for the Ubuntu community.
[23:17] <ikonia> Thrae: do you feel posting links about penis's is appropriate to a family channel ?
[23:18] <Thrae> ikonia: I didn't see specifically anything referring to a PG-13 rating in https://wiki.edubuntu.org/IRC/Guidelines. Considering that you need a good amount of knowledge of computers to use Ubuntu, it seems rather draconian to me to disallow any mention of humour that may or may not include genitalia.
[23:18] <ikonia> Thrae: do you see anything saying pg13 is allowed ?
[23:19] <MenZa> Thrae: I direct you to "Language and Subject"
[23:19] <ikonia> Thrae: a 5 your old child could be using the computer - does he need to see that, no
[23:19] <MenZa> "All the #ubuntu channels are visited by people whose ages vary, and whose tolerances of language and subject choice vary equally as much."
[23:19] <ikonia> Thrae: if it's not safe for work - it's not safe for ANY ubuntu channel
[23:20] <MenZa> I do believe my ban was placed early, and I do apologise for not following up in a PM. That's my flaw.
[23:20] <Thrae> I am looking at the #ubuntu-offtopic logs right now and see about 10 examples (not followed by ban and discussed heavily) of something that would offend ##politics on this network and many other networks.
[23:21] <MenZa> Joining with a link to a video, including the word "NSFW" sets off warning bells. I am merely acting upon that.
[23:21] <MenZa> !o4o
[23:21] <ikonia> Thrae: things do get missed, but I can't see anything
[23:21] <MenZa> "The topics are not banned; stating your position is ok, but trolling baiting, hostility and repitition are not."
[23:21] <Thrae> MenZa: I am well-aware of the policy, I have in front of my screen. I am !appealing.
[23:21] <MenZa> Thrae: Well, you're in the first step of your appeal already. :)
[23:21] <Myrtti> we're not omnipotent and can't be monitored all the time. We're not ##politics either, so the policies are different.
[23:22] <Thrae> If NSFW is blanket-banned then you should say it is blanket-banned.
[23:22] <Myrtti> having said that, I see I'm failing in English and need to go sleep
[23:22] <Thrae> In fact, the IRC guidelines say the exact *opposite*, that there are "...[no] blanket bans on any and all mention of these topics..."
[23:23] <MenZa> I'm trying to resolve the situation. I've admitted my flaw; if you start by admitting what *you* did wrong, then perhaps we can move forward.
[23:23] <MenZa> This is, of course, up to you.
[23:23] <Thrae> One could argue "common sense" to be "family oriented", but since when is IRC itself a "family oriented" community, let alone Freenode?
[23:23] <MenZa> Thrae: #ubuntu* is.
[23:24] <MenZa> So, how about we start resolving this?
[23:24] <Thrae> I did absolutely nothing wrong, except, apparently, I broke some unwritten rule in the very fabric of Ubuntu's social order specifically on Freenode and specifically in #ubuntu and #ubuntu-offtopic.
[23:25] <MenZa> Thrae: Use Common Sense. Be family friendly.
[23:25] <MenZa> Two key parts, both written down, you did miss.
[23:25] <MenZa> Do you agree on this, yes or no?
[23:26] <Thrae> Given that I was raised with computers and the Internet, back in the 1400 baud days, the term "family friendly" didn't even apply. In fact, there isn't even the mention of the word "family" or "[word] friendly" in your own guidelines.
[23:26] <MenZa> "All the #ubuntu channels are visited by people whose ages vary"
[23:26] <MenZa> "... and whose tolerances of language and subject choice vary equally as much."
[23:27] <MenZa> See IRC Guidelines, section "Language and Subject"
[23:27] <MenZa> And I don't care how the internet was when you started using it; I'm living in the present. As is the #ubuntu* namespace.
[23:28] <Thrae> No, I don't think this can be resolved. I will remain outside of #ubuntu and #ubuntu-offtopic forever, as your draconian, unwritten, retroactive-backpedaling rules are not for me. I put a "NSFW" tag on it. If a censored video with the word "penis" offends the Ubuntu community so, they don't need me. I thought OSS was about *FREEDOM*, not self-censorship. We should be FREE to TRY and SEE if we offend someone, and then, ...
[23:28] <Thrae> ... when someone takes offense, we deal with it.
[23:29] <MenZa> Thrae: We try to remain family friendly at all times.
[23:29] <highvoltage> Thrae: too bad you're the only one who thinks that
[23:29] <Thrae> If the ops themselves are all 5-year olds who can't handle a little, albiet childish genitalia humour, than I think you may have serious problems.
[23:30] <Thrae> The term "family friendly" is completely relative. If you want to use it so badly, why don't you *define* it in your own *guidelines*?
[23:30] <highvoltage> Thrae: if anything, your reaction in this channel is enough to make it very easy to dismiss you
[23:30] <Thrae> I used to live in Canada where topless women were allowed to walk the streets. That would be illegal here in the US. Is Canada not "family friendly"?
[23:30] <highvoltage> Thrae: if you don't want to be part of an ubuntu irc channel then so be it
[23:32] <MenZa> Thrae: Everything's relative. We'd be writing the complete works of Shakespare before we could define anything accurately.
[23:32] <Thrae> highvoltage: I am following the appeals process of dicussion on channel guideliness and what should and should not be included in them. Specifically, I am pointing out this so-called "family friendly" policy is not explicitly defined. I think I am giving constructive criticism. Or do you think I'm just trying to be a jerk?
[23:33] <Thrae> I have used Ubuntu-based systems for years and I feel betrayed by the very community that I adopted. I thought I could get some discussion here, as per https://wiki.edubuntu.org/IRC/Guidelines *explicitly* states. If you wish to ban me from even discussing what is and is not appropriate, or re-direct me to a place where it IS appropriate, please do so.
[23:34] <highvoltage> Thrae: giving constructive criticism is great. it will probably work better if you tone down a little.
[23:34] <Thrae> And to a place where criticism on the way guidelines like https://wiki.edubuntu.org/IRC/Guidelines are written, I would also appreciate that.
[23:34] <highvoltage> Thrae: doing name-calling and calling ops 5-year-old will probably not earn you much empathy
[23:35] <highvoltage> Thrae: write it to the ubuntu-irc mailing list. save it as a draft, read it the next day again and then send.
[23:36] <Thrae> highvoltage: Considering I put myself in the very same catagory admitting it was childish humour, I didn't see it as really an insult, more like a hyperbole in what I consider, really, an insane situation developing.
[23:37] <Thrae> highvoltage: Alright, I understand.
[23:37] <highvoltage> Thrae: I think you deserve the benefit of the doubt there, but toning down a bit can get you a lot further
[23:37] <Thrae> If this is not the proper place for active discussion and criticism on this particular issue, then I will leave you all and use the mailing list to address my greviences.
[23:38] <Thrae> Thank you all for your time.
[23:38] <MenZa> From the beginning, I've said resolving the issue isn't a matter of any effort. The only thing I asked was that you accept the guidelines as they were, and you'd be right back in--okay then.
[23:38]  * MenZa shrugs.
[23:38]  * highvoltage is a master de-troller
[23:38] <MenZa> Aye, I appreciate the diffusion.
[23:39] <highvoltage> thanks :)
[23:39]  * MenZa bows.
[23:59] <ikonia> that guys in about 20 other channels I'm in and never spoke in any
[23:59]  * MenZa shrugs.


[01:26] <jjesse> evenig
[02:11] <snap-l> evening
[02:33] <derekv> everyone has brackethurt
[02:33] <derekv> i went out and that was all anyone was talking about, so I came back home
[02:33] <derekv> and on the way, NPR was talking to a pschologist about the pain of loss
[02:34] <derekv> and turns out specificly, if your bracket is losing
[02:34] <derekv> i seriously have no idea wth a braket is, but I think it has to do with sports
[12:34] <snap-l> morning
[12:34] <rick_h_> morn
[13:18] <snap-l> Are we having fun yet?
[13:18] <rick_h_> TGIF
[13:18] <rick_h_> after not getting done with work until 8pm last night :/
[13:18]  * rick_h_ is sleepy...
[13:18] <snap-l> Ugh
[13:18] <snap-l> Lots to get done before the release, eh?
[13:18] <rick_h_> in project hell
[13:21] <snap-l> Folks not getthing things sorted out?
[13:21] <rick_h_> just a lot to get sorted out.
[13:21] <rick_h_> add 2hrs of phone calls to your day kind of stuff
[13:21] <rick_h_> wheeee
[13:21] <rick_h_> all good, date night on Sat so yay weekend!~
[13:25] <snap-l> woo woo
[13:26] <rick_h_> so you'll like this
[13:26] <rick_h_> a doc my wife works with was interested in my scott-e-vest travel vest
[13:26] <rick_h_> and when I showed it to her she asked "Where did you get that? The apple store?"
[13:26] <rick_h_> and my wife jumps in going "shhh, no don't say that"
[13:26] <rick_h_> <3
[13:27] <rick_h_> when did the apple store start having clothes? /me should go in one just once
[13:27] <widox> heh, I didn't get out of work ill 1am :(
[13:27] <rick_h_> widox ftw!
[13:27]  * rick_h_ bows
[13:27]  * widox sleeps on keyboard
[13:27] <rick_h_> widox: you should still be asleep
[13:27] <widox> gotta love getting tapped to help others fix their issues
[13:28] <rick_h_> yep
[13:28] <widox> tell me about it
[13:28] <widox> so yeah, slow moving this morning
[13:29] <rick_h_> yea, going to be a 'just get by' friday I think
[13:29] <_stink_> Rush fans: is it ok for me to like Fly By Night so much?  it seems like cotton candy Rush, and I should be skipping it for Subdivisions or something.  but i love it.
[13:29] <snap-l> _stink_: Any Rush is good Rush
[13:29] <snap-l> except for Rivendell
[13:29] <snap-l> You're OK to not like that. :)
[13:29] <_stink_> haha
[13:29] <_stink_> phew.
[13:29] <rick_h_> _stink_: lol
[13:30] <_stink_> rick_h_: what's 'date night' for you guys?  we never do that.
[13:30] <snap-l> _stink_: There are folks who like the early stuff over the later stuff
[13:30] <snap-l> _stink_: You need to do that
[13:31] <rick_h_> _stink_: baby sitter over at 5pm while we do dinner before my aunt's birthday party at 8pm
[13:31] <_stink_> baby sitter does bedtime?
[13:31] <rick_h_> _stink_: so it's basically asking the baby sitter to come over a little earlier than we need so we can sneak a couple of hours in for ourselves :)
[13:31] <rick_h_> _stink_: yea, the boy is easy for bed
[13:31] <_stink_> aight
[13:31] <_stink_> just getting a handle on what we might want to do
[13:32] <snap-l> Apparently HP and INtel sponsored Project Runway
[13:32] <snap-l> It's hilarious hearing them talk about how wonderful and innovative HP is
[13:33] <_stink_> is there an "HP digital accessory wall"?
[13:33] <_stink_> yes, i have seen too much of that show.
[13:33] <snap-l> They gave the designers each a HP touchpad with design software loaded on it
[13:34] <_stink_> hah
[13:34] <snap-l> And hearing them coo about how wonderful the HP is
[13:34] <_stink_> that show is a masterstroke of product placement.
[13:34] <_stink_> well
[13:34] <_stink_> maybe a cynical overreach of product placement
[13:34] <_stink_> one of those
[13:34] <snap-l> Most of them are
[13:34] <snap-l> Oh this is cynical
[13:40] <snap-l> tim gjnd saying hp touchsmart desktop is very sing songy
[13:41] <snap-l> H P Touch Smart Desk Top
[14:35] <brousch> I like adding django bookmarks to Bookie way too much
[14:35] <rick_h_> brousch: :P
[14:35] <brousch> Latest one is Django and Angular.js
[14:35] <brousch> Double rick-rile
[14:35] <rick_h_> lol
[14:36] <rick_h_> Angular, can't get away from that lately
[14:36] <brousch> I saw a talk on it and it looked interesting, but I haven't touched it yet
[15:30] <greg-g> g'morn
[15:31] <greg-g> _stink_: we have only had one "date night" which was when my parents where in town; we went out for dinner by ourselves and carrie's bike was stolen ;)
[15:31] <greg-g> _stink_: we haven't done one since :)
[15:31] <_stink_> haha
[15:31] <rick_h_> ouch
[15:31] <_stink_> they are dangerous
[15:31] <rick_h_> my aunt/uncle in VA didn't have one for 4yrs until I was staying with them one summer (long ago when I was in high school)
[15:31] <greg-g> it was pre-bedtime for Rowan, so we didn't have to worry about that
[15:31] <rick_h_> they went out for a dinner/movie, never came home
[15:32] <greg-g> :(
[15:32] <rick_h_> next day, their kids were asking where thir parents were and I Couldn't tell them
[15:32] <_stink_> yeeeikes
[15:32] <greg-g> what?!
[15:32] <rick_h_> finally, lunch time they came home in a new minivan
[15:32] <greg-g> with two more kids?
[15:32] <rick_h_> they had gone car shopping, stayued in an hotel, and came home next day with it
[15:32] <greg-g> wow
[15:32] <rick_h_> harder to do that these days with cell phones, but yea...I told them good thing they waited 4yrs to go out
[15:33] <_stink_> did you give them the parental 'why didn't you call?' lecture?
[15:33] <rick_h_> so we try hard to get out every other month at least
[15:33] <rick_h_> not let it get too crazy :)
[17:27] <rick_h_> http://thechangelog.com/big-security-release-for-postgres-coming/ :/
[17:29] <brousch> I have parents and 4 siblings in the area, so date nights are as frequent as we want
[17:29] <rick_h_> you suck!
[17:29] <rick_h_> I mean...that's interesting
[17:29] <rick_h_> my in-laws are fraile enough I'm not comfy with the boy with them :/
[17:30] <rick_h_> otherwise we'd be much better off, but oh well
[17:31] <greg-g> brousch: yeah, downside #1351 of living in SF: no family
[19:21] <snap-l> greg-g: I read jwz's DNA Lounge blog. I think you're a little low on those numbers
[19:21] <greg-g> snap-l: that wasn't the max number ;)
[19:21] <greg-g> snap-l: but I should have preceeded it with a couple 0's to make the point
[19:22] <snap-l> greg-g: Heh
[19:33] <jjesse> anyone know if there is a a way to manage the google music uploads via the command line?
[19:33] <jjesse> i would like to upload my music while at home and can SSH into my box and start the upload
[23:59] <rick_h_> please upvote my comment here. http://www.reddit.com/r/Python/comments/1b9qph/my_biggest_annoyance_with_pep8_docstrings/
[23:59] <rick_h_> I'm pissy at the moment and just false crap is extra irritating atm


[00:29] <MrPopinjay> Hey guys, how would I check which version of xwax will be in the next ubuntu studio release?
[00:44] <MrPopinjay> nobody?
[01:01] <MrPopinjay> :(
[01:25] <holstein> MrPopinjay: what is that?
[01:25] <holstein> i would say, unless its reved in debian, it wont be reved for US
[01:25] <holstein> we dont have any special repos though, so whatever ubuntu has
[01:26] <holstein> MrPopinjay: i would pop in #ubuntu+1 and see if anyone idle would look
[01:28] <MrPopinjay> I see
[01:29] <MrPopinjay> It's a vinyl emulation program
[01:29] <MrPopinjay> it's neat.
[01:29] <MrPopinjay> Just curious as to what's going on since the version currently available is VERY old.
[01:30] <holstein> MrPopinjay: what is available from the maintainer though?
[01:30] <MrPopinjay> The maintainer?
[01:31] <holstein> whoever is making it
[01:31] <MrPopinjay> You can download the source code.
[01:31] <holstein> MrPopinjay: for a much newer version?
[01:31] <MrPopinjay> Yeeeerp
[01:32] <holstein> i would try and mention it to debian
[01:32] <holstein> the multimedia team
[01:32] <MrPopinjay> Cool, cheers.
[01:33] <MrPopinjay> Right, bed for me, night!
[11:20] <HypothesisFrog> hi.
[11:22] <HypothesisFrog> hi. I'm trying to configure real time support for jack purposes, but this howto doesn't seem to be up to date for 11.04 https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuStudioPreparation#Specific_PCI_and_USB_hardware
[11:22] <HypothesisFrog> I mean this one https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuStudioPreparation#Configuring_the_real-time_access_for_.22audio.22_group_users_and_applications


[17:11] <hazmat> what's the best stable version on precise for maas?
[17:12] <hazmat> ie. which ppa?


[07:02] <dholbach> good morning
[23:27] <MrChrisDruif> pleia2; coming week I'm off for holiday. I presume the flavour meeting minutes links will be looked after while I'm gone?
[23:28] <pleia2> MrChrisDruif: yeah, I took care of it (I was traveling too, but was able to grab them real quick before I published)
[23:28] <pleia2> I figured our lack of volunteers over the weekend was due to holiday in the states and other busy spring-things :)
[23:31] <MrChrisDruif> Maybe it might be worth sending out a reminder email to the flavours that we have this section in UWN? Just a thought
[23:32] <pleia2> go for it
[23:34] <MrChrisDruif> If I've got time tomorrow I'll send it out. Otherwise I'll do it coming/next week
[23:34] <MrChrisDruif> As I only came online to say I've be off for the week =)
[23:35] <pleia2> well, welcome back :)
[23:35] <MrChrisDruif> (I should be sleeping at a time like this)
[23:36] <pleia2> hehe
[23:37] <MrChrisDruif> I don't think you understand me? I'll be going from Saturday the second to Friday the eight (6/2 - 6-8 would be the American notation I think)
[23:38] <MrChrisDruif> 6/8*
[23:40] <JoseeAntonioR> pleia2: we need to schedule the training with bkerensa
[23:40] <MrChrisDruif> So that would be the coming edition at least. I hope I'll spot all the meetings in my mail for the edition following
[23:40] <pleia2> MrChrisDruif: oooh, I see!
[23:40] <pleia2> MrChrisDruif: I thought you meant you were gone last week, sorry :)
[23:40] <pleia2> I saw edubuntu had a meeting the other day (just saw it in -meeting, don't know where they announce/recorded it)
[23:41] <pleia2> JoseeAntonioR: indeed we do
[23:41]  * pleia2 has had a long day
[23:42] <MrChrisDruif> I don't think they announced it? Or recorded it for that matter
[23:42] <MrChrisDruif> Lubuntu did have a meeting btw
[23:42] <MrChrisDruif> (and might I ask what kind of training?)
[23:42] <pleia2> maybe not, but it was http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/05/30/%23ubuntu-meeting.html#t19:01
[23:43] <pleia2> training on how the newsletter workflow works and how to publish
[23:43] <MrChrisDruif> Ah =)
[23:45] <MrChrisDruif> But I didn't get to update for previous edition, sorry about that. As always very busy week.
[23:45] <pleia2> no worries
[23:45] <MrChrisDruif> But at least I've given you a heads up for the coming edition ;-)
[23:46] <pleia2> :)
[23:48] <MrChrisDruif> Anyhow, as the clock is approaching that dreadful 2 again with the hour hand, I should really be going
[23:49] <pleia2> good night
[23:49] <MrChrisDruif> Thanks


[10:43] <KGB-2> gdm ubuntu/master 28bfac0 Sebastien Bacher debian/ changelog patches/series patches/ubuntu/gitlab_clearing_signal.patch * https://deb.li/aW6F
[10:43] <KGB-2> * debian/patches/ubuntu/gitlab_clearing_signal.patch:
[10:43] <KGB-2>   - clear signal handlers after udev settle to avoid unexpected session
[10:43] <KGB-2>     logouts, thanks Ghadi Rahme (lp: #2020641)
[10:43] -ubottu:#ubuntu-desktop- Launchpad bug 2020641 in gdm3 (Ubuntu Lunar) "Installing or removing apps through snap-store launches another gdm session" [High, In Progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2020641
[10:44] <KGB-2> gdm ubuntu/master ec6e94f Sebastien Bacher debian/changelog * releasing package gdm3 version 44.1-1ubuntu2 * https://deb.li/3u1f1
[10:48] <KGB-2> gdm tags 8a66b55 Sebastien Bacher ubuntu/42.0-1ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS> * https://deb.li/345wC
[13:03] <lissyx> seb128, do you know if https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1834436 could block you from making new build for 1804
[13:03] -ubottu:#ubuntu-desktop- Mozilla bug 1834436 in Firefox Build System "Upgrade minimum supported GCC version to 8" [--, New]
[13:15] <ricotz> lissyx, hi, there won't be another firefox deb update for 18.04, so it won't be an issue
[13:17] <seb128> lissyx, what ricotz said, bionic support date has expired so we will not publish any extra update for it
[13:18] <seb128> and also https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gcc-8 is available in bionic
[13:58] <lissyx> thx
[14:00] <KGB-2> tracker signed tags 676b4d3 Jeremy Bicha upstream/3.5.3 * Upstream version 3.5.3 * https://deb.li/J5tc
[14:00] <KGB-2> tracker pristine-tar c859c78 Jeremy Bicha tracker_3.5.3.orig.tar.xz.delta tracker_3.5.3.orig.tar.xz.id * pristine-tar data for tracker_3.5.3.orig.tar.xz * https://deb.li/38IFj
[14:18] <KGB-0> pangomm Jeremy Bicha 402066 * commented merge request !2 * https://deb.li/28xs
[14:47] <danilogondolfo> Hi folks, may I ask someone to review/sponsor this network-manager MR? https://code.launchpad.net/~danilogondolfo/network-manager/+git/ubuntu-1/+merge/443876
[14:48] <danilogondolfo> It's addressing 2 LP bugs related to the changes we've made during the netplan integration.