[16:13] <hans__> has the 18.04 kernel version been decided yet?
[16:19] <dax> hans__: last i heard, the plan was 4.15
[17:24] <hans__> dax, weird, is there a "no upstream lts kernels" policy or something? because 4.14 is the longest lts kernel ever with 6 years upstream support, while 4.15 is a regular release, and they did something similar for ubuntu 16.04 too
[17:39] <dax> hans__: Ubuntu's kernel team supports whichever kernel it picks without regard to the kernel LTS policy
[17:39] <dax> so it's not so much "no upstream lts kernels" as much as it's "we don't care whether it's an lts kernel"
[17:40] <hans__> hmm ok


[00:50] <cxo> How do you clone just the last revision of the repository?
[00:55] <mkanat> cxo: I think you might want bzr checkout --lightweight
[01:11] <spiv> lifeless: I suppose you saw the mail about setUpClass on python-dev?
[01:11] <mwhudson> spiv: that dull thumping sound is robert's head meeting the wall, i think
[01:11] <spiv> mwhudson: good good
[01:18] <lifeless> spiv: fuzzyman mailed  me directly
[01:18] <lifeless> spiv: I'm getting out of sprint backlog at the moment though
[01:31] <mwhudson> lifeless: the fix for https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/513432 should be deployed now, do you have a simple recipe to verify?
[01:34] <james_w> mwhudson: create a local 2a repo, branch an older format in to it
[01:34] <mwhudson> james_w: ok, happens for every such attempt?
[01:35] <james_w> I think so
[01:35] <james_w> trying with the project I saw someone hit the problem with
[01:35] <mwhudson> it seems to be fixed then
[01:36] <james_w> yeah
[01:36] <lifeless> mwhudson: that should verify it, yes.
[01:36] <mwhudson> lifeless: ta
[01:36] <lifeless> mwhudson: and just to be sure, you did preserve the other hotfix we had ?
[01:37] <mwhudson> lifeless: the thread safety one?
[01:37] <mwhudson> lifeless: yes
[01:37] <mwhudson> (though the server in question _hasn't_ been rolled out to yet, so it still has a cowboy afaik)
[01:38] <lifeless> cool
[01:42] <poolie> mwhudson, thanks for that
[01:43] <mwhudson> poolie: np, it still seemed to take about a week longer than it should
[01:43] <RenatoSilva> lifeless: I have no idea of what "Show hits as a diff " means
[01:43] <poolie> i wasn't going t omention that :)
[01:43] <RenatoSilva> lifeless: and I can't get the problem with "Show revisions whose diff contains the search string"
[01:44] <RenatoSilva> lifeless: and mainly, how they relate to each other
[01:47] <lifeless> well, if you stay on irc for more than 60 seconds we can talk about it :)]
[01:47] <lifeless>  /rant
[02:33] <poolie> mwhudson, i added a bzrlib.initialize which you asked for
[02:33] <poolie> so you should give me a review :)
[03:03] <RAOF> Is there any way that bzr could preserve the rich-root status of a branch when branching from a non-rich-root branch into a rich-root repository?
[03:04] <RAOF> Now that 2a is the default repository, I tend to accidentally trap my changes into a rich-root situation and then pushing back to lp fails.
[03:25] <RAOF> Alternatively, how can I easily rescue a series of changes from a rich-root repository?
[03:27] <lifeless> RAOF: ideally get the other end to upgrade
[03:27] <lifeless> failing that for x in revno: bzr diff
[03:27] <RAOF> :(
[03:28] <lifeless> in principle rebase can do it
[03:28] <lifeless> there is a certain amount of '
[03:28] <lifeless> exercise for the reader
[03:28] <lifeless> '
[03:28] <lifeless> involved
[03:28] <RAOF> Would it be possible to somehow keep the non-rich-root status of a branch pulled into a rich-root repository?  This is a significant cause of friction I've run into.
[03:28] <lifeless> RAOF: not in the current repositories, not
[03:28] <lifeless> *no*
[03:29] <RAOF> But in future?
[03:29] <lifeless> its code, anything is possible.
[03:29] <lifeless> I don't expect anyone to do the heavy (and its fairly heavy I think) lifting involved
[03:29] <lifeless> we could make branch error unless given a flag
[03:29] <RAOF> Right.  That's what I wanted; an evaluation of whether it's worth filing a bug.
[03:29] <lifeless> though I'm not sure that that is a good idea
[03:30] <lifeless> RAOF: file a bug, we can gather 'affected by' counts ;P
[03:33] <RAOF> Looks like it's bug #506556
[03:34] <lifeless> me too it then :)
[03:35] <RAOF> Have done.
[08:11] <gerard_> morning
[08:23]  * vila waves@gerard_
[08:27] <vila> gerard_: I'm reviewing your patch
[08:27]  * emmajane waves.
[08:27] <vila> gerard_: out of curiosity, what editor are you using ?
[08:28] <emmajane> I've just had someone ask me about syncing upstream source with downstream plugins. Maybe like svn vendor branches? I know I've seen this asked about on the mailing list loads but I can't figure out where in the docs the answer is... it's not just tagging releases, is it?
[08:28] <vila> emmajane: weird, you were here during my late evening and you still here in my early morning, don't you ever sleep ??? :D
[08:28] <emmajane> vila, I'm in NZ. :)
[08:28] <emmajane> vila, It's 2130 here.
[08:28] <vila> emmajane: right, so we are both working far too late in the evening ;D
[08:29] <emmajane> :)
[08:30] <vila> upstream source and downstream plugins, the first is singular the second plural, are you talking about branches in both cases ?
[08:30] <emmajane> they're writing a plugin that needs to be synced with the upstream source.
[08:31] <mkanat> emmajane: That's a pretty standard DVCS case, it sounds like to me.
[08:31] <emmajane> yah.
[08:31] <vila> the upstream source is a plugin too or more than just the plugin ?
[08:31] <mkanat> emmajane: You just want to merge from upstream into downstream, right?
[08:31] <emmajane> mkanat, and know which version of the plugin applies to what upstream version of the full code base.
[08:31] <mkanat> emmajane: cd /local/checkout; bzr merge bzr://path/toupstream
[08:32] <mkanat> emmajane: Well, that's more a code decision than a VCS decision.
[08:32] <vila> emmajane: you don't strictly need to track the upstream version as long as you can merge
[08:32] <mkanat> emmajane: But if you do merge --remember, it remembers where you last merged from.
[08:32] <vila> it remembers at the first merge
[08:32] <emmajane> mkanat, so it would know that bug fix #3 applies to upstream release 4.0alpha?
[08:33] <mkanat> emmajane: What would know?
[08:33] <vila> --remember can be used to change afterwards
[08:33] <emmajane> it == the plugin that's being written.
[08:33] <mkanat> emmajane: If you check it in to that branch....
[08:33] <mkanat> emmajane: I assume you'd have different branches for the different upstream versions.
[08:34] <emmajane> ahh, right. so just a new branch for each version of upstream?
[08:34] <emmajane> yah
[08:34] <mkanat> emmajane: Yeah.
[08:34]  * emmajane nods
[08:34] <emmajane> http://wiki.bazaar.canonical.com/TrackingUpstream is that page what i'm looking for?
[08:34] <emmajane> I think I'm trying to make it harder than it is? :)
[08:34] <mkanat> emmajane: That's certainly possible. :-) It's very simple. :-)
[08:35] <mkanat> Anyhow, I'm off to bed. :-) Night all!
[08:35] <gerard_> vila: good :)
[08:35] <gerard_> vila: geany
[08:35] <gerard_> did it do weird stuff?
[08:36] <vila> gerard_: can you configure it to avoid leaving spaces at end of lines ?
[08:36] <gerard_> vila: yeah, no problem
[08:36] <vila> gerard_: not a big deal, but we try to get rid of these damn spaces :D
[08:37] <gerard_> invisible characters are annoying anyway
[08:38] <gerard_> a few days ago I had some trouble with a non breaking space char that was messing up search and replace :p
[09:13] <vila> gerard_: my gut feeling is that jam mentioned more cases than your tests covers, should I dig deeper or can you quickly confirm ?
[09:18]  * bialix waves heloo all
[09:18] <vila> hi bialix
[09:18] <bialix> bonjour vila!
[09:20] <bialix> hello davidstrauss, how's drupal dvcs contest going?
[09:21] <bialix> hi jelmer
[09:21] <gerard_> vila: yeah, he mentions one more
[09:21] <davidstrauss> bialix: Well enough. The debate for Drupal is turning out quite different from the one for most projects.
[09:22] <jelmer> HI bialix
[09:22] <gerard_> to be honest, I didn't check that one
[09:22] <gerard_> but I have a good feeling about it ;)
[09:22] <bialix> davidstrauss: that's good
[09:23] <vila> gerard_: good, I'm cleaning up some details and I let you know where to get an updated branch so you can build on it if that's fine with you
[09:23] <davidstrauss> bialix: I'm glad to see that it hasn't devolved into another silly performance contest. Just because performance gives easy objective numbers doesn't mean it's a good way to decide.
[09:23] <bialix> right
[09:24] <gerard_> vila: what do you mean with "build on it"?
[09:24] <vila> gerard_: more concretely, I'm looking into rewriting test_update_checkout_prevent_double_merge such as it's less verbose, you could then reuse the same tricks for further tests
[09:25] <gerard_> vila: ah ok, so you are cleaning it up and then showing me how it should have been in the first place? ;)
[09:25] <vila> gerard_: err, I meant test_update_remove_commit
[09:25] <bialix> it was funny (for me) to read comments about drupal contest in hg mailing list: there seems enough people who hate bzr for some reason so they're happy to see git in winners only because it's not bzr. crazy
[09:26] <vila> gerard_: hehe, not exactly, I prefer to view that as a gentle nudge in *improving* your tests :D
[09:26] <gerard_> vila: yeah, the test_update_remove_commit is really verbose :)
[09:26] <vila> gerard_: the way we write the tests is constantly evolving which means there are many bad examples in the existing ones and the good examples are hard to find
[09:27] <gerard_> I noticed
[09:28] <vila> test_update_remove_commit, especially because there is no conflicts, is a perfect candidate for using branchbuilder and can even become a whitebox test (which are far easier to debug than blackbox ones)
[09:28] <vila> and also faster
[09:30] <vila> hmm, good and bad are a bit rude, I meant old and new of course :D
[09:30] <vila> or rather new and old or bad and good whatever...
[09:32] <gerard_> blackbox tests are really easy to write though ;)
[09:34] <vila> gerard_: yup, you got what you paid for :D
[09:34] <gerard_> what I find interesting is that there are a lot of tests and still there are enough corner cases that are not tested
[09:57] <vila> gerard_: yeah, that just means there aren't enough tests yet, welcome to the debate, it's still open :D
[09:59] <vila> gerard_: one key argument is whether indirect tests (like blackbox ones) are enough to cover lower layers implementations (like your tests for wt._update_tree), that's precisely what I like to enhance with your submission :D
[10:00] <vila> gerard_: that's not strictly required to land your patch though, but if we can make the tests easier to write for that method...
[10:03] <gerard_> vila: easier sounds good :)
[10:47] <mvo> hm, what is the right command if bzr says my format is not compatible but bzr upgrade claims my branch format is the most recent one? http://paste.ubuntu.com/373111/ has the details
[10:49] <vila> mvo: actually, *you* use the most recent 2a format but the remote branch don't
[10:52] <mvo> vila: can I downgrade then? I do not want to upgrade the remote branch as I don't know who else is using it and with what bzr version(s)?
[10:56] <vila> mvo: you can't downgrade your branch, you had to re-create it from remote, they use different models :-/
[10:56] <vila> mvo: do you have a lot of commits there /
[10:56] <vila> mvo: do you have a lot of commits there ?
[10:57] <vila> mvo: and how did you end up there ?
[10:57] <mvo> vila: I ended up there via bzr co I think, let me check my shell history to be certain
[10:58] <vila> mvo: 'bzr info -v' will tell us about a shared repository too
[10:58] <mvo>     6  bzr co  lp:aptdaemon/0.2.x
[11:00] <vila> mvo: doing that locally gives me a 'Packs containing knits without subtree support' repo, not a 2a one
[11:00] <mvo> http://paste.ubuntu.com/373125/ <- that is the info -v output
[11:00] <mvo> bzr --version
[11:00] <mvo> Bazaar (bzr) 2.0.3
[11:01] <vila> mvo: did you 'bzr upgrade' when you wanted 'bzr update' ?
[11:02] <vila> mvo: try doing 'bzr co lp:aptdaemon/0.2.x' again and you should get a different 'bzr info -v' output
[11:02] <vila> mvo: 'bzr co' in a different place !
[11:04] <mvo> vila: right, sorry. the bzr co lp:aptdaemon/0.2.x one is the wrong line in my history, i was working with both branches and mixed them up. I don't have the trunk co in my shell history, so I guess the best workaround is to bzr co lp:aptdaemon/trunk again and just commit that. thanks for your help!
[11:05] <vila> mvo: you're welcome, feell free to come back or file a bug if you end up with such a setup
[11:05] <mvo> thanks, with the fresh checkout it works fine now
[11:05] <vila> mvo: that's not supposed to occur if you do't explicitly ask for it
[11:05] <vila> mvo: good
[11:05] <mvo> I guess I must have used bzr upgrade at some point that I just don't remember :(
[11:06] <mvo> maybe it could warn for co branches if the local and remote one become incompatible when bzr upgrade is issued?
[11:09] <vila> mvo: sounds like a good idea, care to file a bug ?
[11:10] <mvo> vila: thanks, I will do that (after lunch :)
[13:13] <gerard_> vila: did you get around to beautifying the test yet?
[13:14] <vila> gerard_: almost :D Got distracted and also ran into unsuspected complications, but the final result should be something like: http://paste.ubuntu.com/373202/
[13:18] <gerard_> vila: hmm, it sure is more compact, but hard to read when you're not used to it
[13:18] <vila> gerard_: which part ?
[13:22] <vila> gerard_: i.e. where should I add comments to make it clearer ?
[13:23] <gerard_> vila: if you haven't seen build_snapshot being used before, you have a hard time making sense of it
[13:24] <vila> gerard_: ha, yes, you need to look at branchbuilder a bit, but that far easier to build graphs than with run_bzr
[13:25] <vila> gerard_: but now we have the workingtree object and we can make far more assertions with it and more precise ones too
[13:37] <vila> gerard_: http://paste.ubuntu.com/373215/
[13:38] <vila> gerard_: http://paste.ubuntu.com/373216/ without the typo :D
[13:40] <vila> gerard_: does it make sense ? Do you think you can write other tests from that ?
[13:41] <gerard_> not quickly unless you provide some documentation for build_snapshot
[13:42] <gerard_> and I was not really planning to write more tests...
[13:43] <gerard_> that is, until I'm fixing a new bug or building a new feature
[13:43] <vila> ha, I thought you were rejoicing  about TDD yesterday, I misinterpreted that a will to write more tests :D
[13:43] <vila> gerard_: no problem, I'll write them
[13:44] <gerard_> hehe, I like it when working on something, I don't like testing in itself
[13:45] <vila> hehe, yeah, the usual "I love existing tests but... why should I add more ?" :-P
[13:48] <gerard_> vila: well, I like adding tests for existing bugs
[13:49] <gerard_> just writing tests out of the blue seems like a waste of time
[13:49] <gerard_> I feel that's the responsibility of the guy that wrote the feature in the first place
[13:49] <vila> gerard_: yeah, I agree with that, but what do you do when tests are missing then ?
[13:50] <gerard_> vila: so how do you know they are missing?
[13:50] <vila> gerard_: because I can't find them :D But I don't have any problem if you don't add them, they were missing before your patch, don't get me wrong !
[13:51] <gerard_> vila: no, seriously, how do you know what test you can't find?
[13:52] <vila> gerard_: there is no general rule, but here, I couldn't find tests for wt._update_tree() nor wt.update() only blackbox ones...
[13:53] <jelmer> vila: what's the name of the 2.1 branch? I tried to submit that cherrypick during lunch but lp kept timing out :-/
[13:53] <gerard_> vila: that's the reason they were so broken then
[13:53] <vila> gerard_: which ones ?
[13:53] <gerard_> _update_tree() mostly
[13:53] <vila> jelmer: lp:bzr/2.1 ?
[13:54] <gerard_> that -r feature was seriously not working correctly, can tell that from the code
[13:54] <vila> oh, you mean the code, I thought you were referring to the tests
[13:54] <jelmer> vila: argh, way too obvious - thanks
[13:54] <gerard_> vila: no, the tests were fine
[13:54] <vila> gerard_: you mean you identified other bugs ?
[13:54] <jelmer> vila: (I tried ~bzr/bzr/2.1 and that failed)
[13:54] <vila> jelmer: that's why you couldn't find it ;D
[13:54] <gerard_> vila: yeah, using -r to go to somewhere before you branched cannot have worked correctly
[13:54] <vila> jelmer: pfft, so last century....
[13:55] <jelmer> vila: Well, being able to look at http://code.launchpad.net/bzr would help too :-)
[13:55] <vila> jelmer: lp ooopsing again ? I can read that page without problems
[13:56] <jelmer> vila: I reproducibly get a timeout
[13:56] <vila> gerard_: you scare me there, and reinforce my feeling that your patch do more than its tests :-/
[13:56] <vila> jelmer: I can't reproduce that
[13:57] <gerard_> vila: it was using graph.find_unique_lca(revision, old_tip) to find the branch point
[13:57] <gerard_> but if revision is before the branch, that will just return revision
[13:58] <gerard_> the whole update was horribly broken (I repeat myself here)
[13:59] <gerard_> but I agree it probably needs more tests
[13:59] <vila> what do you mean 'revision is before the branch' ?
[14:00] <gerard_> if you branched at revision 2, and do update -r 1
[14:00] <vila> gerard_: oh, and by more tests I don't mean you introduced more bugs, but adding tests when you diagnose a bug guarantees that we won't regress
[14:01] <gerard_> vila: we should probably add a test that update -r will properly remove revisions
[14:01] <gerard_> just like the test that checks if it removes the commit from the branch
[14:04] <jelmer> vila: does http://code.lp.net/launchpad work for you ?
[14:06] <vila> redirected to http://www.ndparking.com/lp.net
[14:07] <vila> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/launchpad works fine
[14:08] <vila> jelmer: and http redirects to https
[15:50] <vila> jam: can I land https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~jelmer/bzr/2.1-fix-foreignrev/+merge/19008 into 2.1 ?
[15:51] <jelmer> vila: please do
[15:51] <gerard_> vila: :)
[15:52] <vila> gerard_: congratulations, your patch is landing :D
[15:52] <vila> jelmer: hello acting RM :D
[15:55] <jam> vila: sure
[15:57] <bialix> does configuration of ML has changed recently/
[15:57] <bialix> ?
[15:57]  * bialix feels blacklisyted
[15:58] <gerard_> vila: thx
[15:59] <vila> bialix: not that I know of. Why the feeling ?
[15:59] <vila> jelmer: pqm'ed
[15:59] <bialix> I can't post via gmane, 3 mails sent today, none appears
[16:00] <bialix> (maybe I've reached my limit of ... something)
[16:01] <vila> bialix: weird
[16:02] <bialix> posting to other ML via gmane was success
[16:02] <jelmer> vila, thanks!
[16:02] <bialix> indeed, weird
[16:04] <bialix> abentley: unshelve with editor works very nice, thanks!
[16:04] <abentley> bialix, you're welcome.
[16:05] <bialix> :-)
[16:07] <bialix> abentley: one minor UI thing: if I've invoked editor to work with several changes in one file then it invoked only once, that's ok; but final confirmation slightly misleading: "Shelve 2 changes?" -- and I think: "strange, I've edited the file only once".
[16:07] <abentley> bialix, I believe that means "two lines changed".
[16:08] <bialix> it's not very obvious
[16:08] <bialix> usually it the count of hunks
[16:08] <bialix> abentley: maybe "Shelve selected changes" would be more neutral
[16:09] <abentley> bialix, that could make sense.
[16:10] <bialix> abentley: also, if I've invoked "shelve --destroy" it will be nice to see more strong confirmation question: "Destroy selected changes?". but all this UI things, maybe I'm wrong
[16:11] <abentley> bialix, yes, there's always tension between providing a consistent UI and a specific UI.
[16:11] <bialix> perhaps I need dump this questions as bug report?
[16:11] <abentley> bialix, sure.  They're good questions, and I'm not sure what the right answers are.
[16:12] <bialix> ok
[16:12] <maxb> abentley: Hello. For bzrtools, do you like people to use the "Resubmit" button on MPs accepting that it disturbs the comment train, or to just comment and ping you to request re-review?   (https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~maxb/bzrtools/skip-import-.bzr in my case)
[16:12] <abentley> maxb, the latter.
[16:12] <maxb> do you consider yourself pung, or would you like an email? :-)
[16:16] <abentley> maxb, let's say I'm pung.
[16:17] <bialix> abentley: done: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/519919
[16:21] <gerard_> vila: I guess the fix will not get into 2.1?
[16:21] <gerard_> or will it?
[16:22] <vila> gerard_: I don't think so, 2.1.0final is around the corner
[16:49] <Noldorin> hi
[16:50] <Noldorin> how can i ignore all files under a certain folder in .bzrignore?
[16:54] <jelmer> Noldorin: Add 'foldername/*' to .bzrignore
[16:55] <Noldorin> jelmer, yeah, that doesn't work for some reason
[16:56] <jelmer> Noldorin: is the directory itself versioned?
[16:56] <Noldorin> yeah
[16:56] <Noldorin> if i have just '*.xap' it works
[16:56] <Noldorin> but if i have 'ClientBin/*.xap', no luck
[17:02] <Noldorin> jelmer, ?>
[17:05] <gerard_> Noldorin: how about just "ClientBin"?
[17:06] <Noldorin> gerard_, i need to actually include the folder in the repo, strangely enough, but none of the contents
[17:07]  * gerard_ wonders what the use of having an empty directory underversion control is
[17:07] <Noldorin> gerard_, it's a quirk of Visual Studio. it needs the folder to be there
[17:08] <gerard_> Noldorin: create it in a pre-build action?
[17:08] <Noldorin> gerard_, yeah, that just crossed my mind heh.
[17:08] <jelmer> Noldorin: no idea, sorry
[17:08] <Noldorin> no prob
[17:09] <Noldorin> got it sorted now. thanks guys
[17:09] <Noldorin> jelmer, oh btw. do you remember some time ago when we were looking into hacking the bzr-git/dulwich source to investigate the problem with pushing to git-hub?
[17:10] <Noldorin> i was getting somewhere actually
[17:10] <Noldorin> wondered if you had a few mins to continue with that
[17:10] <jelmer> Noldorin, sure
[17:10] <Noldorin> jelmer, i can't remember exactly where we were, but i remember confirming the path was correct
[17:14]  * bialix waves at GaryvdM
[17:14] <bialix> vila, jam: is it possible that posts from gmane blacklisted?
[17:15] <jam> bialix: I suppose it is possible, but I wouldn't think so
[17:16] <Noldorin> jelmer, is it worth upgrading from 0.4.2 to 0.4.3 for a start?
[17:16] <bialix> it seems my usual mail marked as spammer or something similar (given the answer about waiting approval I've got recently)
[17:17] <bialix> jam: http://pastebin.com/d7df6fa4b
[17:17] <bialix> jam: who can help me in such situation?
[17:18] <bialix> it seems some software on mailman server was upgraded today?
[17:19] <GaryvdM> Hi bialix
[17:19] <GaryvdM> Hi all
[17:20] <bialix> Hi Gary
[17:20] <vila> hey GaryvdM !
[17:20]  * bialix feels really blacklisted and with tag "spammer" on the back goes away in sadness: goodbye cruel world!
[17:24] <vila> bialix: could it be that your From header has changed ?
[17:24] <bialix> vila: I'm even don't understand what you're say right now.
[17:25] <bialix> I think I have not changed anything
[17:26] <bialix> my "From:" seems the same as yesterday, just my name and surname
[17:26] <vila> mails have headers and a body, the headers are (roughly) lines of the form '<header_name>: value'
[17:26] <bialix> yes, yes, vila it was silly joke
[17:27] <vila> ha :D
[17:27] <bialix> but I really have no idea how to screw this in Thunderbird
[17:27] <chx> hi. in the "which VCS to pick" http://groups.drupal.org/node/48818?page=1#comment-131203 we have a user who tried bzr on mac with not much success. can someone people help me with a nice reply?
[17:27] <bialix> chx: install bzr from installer is good answer?
[17:28] <bialix> there is only small issue with Qt
[17:28] <chx> bialix: i do not have OS X.
[17:28] <bialix> another silly joke
[17:28] <bialix> heh, I really need head to home
[17:28] <vila> chx: there is an OSX package for bzr, I don't know who is maintaining the macports one
[17:28]  * bialix waves bye all
[17:28] <chx> vila: Next try was installing the binaries for OS/X 10.6 from Canonical's website after cleaning out the Macports install.
[17:28] <chx> vila: it seems he tried.
[17:30] <vila> what's doxxx nick here ?
[17:31] <vila> BasicOSX: do you use the mac installer ?
[17:32] <GaryvdM> chx: Difficult to tell what went wrong with the installer.
[17:32] <vila> verterok: do you use the mac installer ?
[17:32] <GaryvdM> chx: Critical point: "Trying "bzr explore" from the command line in a bzr-repository failed miserably with ever more error messages piling up on my screen."
[17:32] <vila> GaryvdM:
[17:33] <GaryvdM> I installed bzr on a client
[17:33] <GaryvdM> I installed bzr on a client's mac the other day with no major issues.
[17:34] <GaryvdM> using the installer
[17:34] <vila> GaryvdM: and using bzr-explorer ?
[17:34] <RenatoSilva> verterok: hi
[17:34] <verterok> vila: hi, it's been a while since I booted into OS X :/
[17:34] <verterok> RenatoSilva: hi
[17:35] <verterok> vila: so, the answer is: not recently :)
[17:35] <RenatoSilva> verterok: did you remember if you have already added an encoding param in bzr-xmloutput?
[17:35] <jam> bigjools: I just sent it through
[17:35] <chx> GaryvdM: i do not have more info than this
[17:35] <RenatoSilva> verterok: because I remember something like this...
[17:35] <verterok> RenatoSilva: I didn't
[17:35] <jam> sorry, meant to say 'bialix'
[17:35] <bigjools> easy mistake :)
[17:35] <chx> GaryvdM: but someone chiming in from the bzr community would be nice to counter this bad experience (which obviously should not affect the choice but it will)
[17:35] <jelmer> Noldorin, yeah, upgrading is definitely useful
[17:35] <RenatoSilva> verterok: there's already branch for that?
[17:36] <jelmer> Noldorin, actually, I was assuming you were using trunk...
[17:36] <GaryvdM> vila: Yes, Bzr explorer, There is no shortcut created, but I could run it fine from the command line
[17:36] <verterok> RenatoSilva: No, there is a branch with a --encoding option for the xmlrpc-service, but that's not what we talked yesterday ;)
[17:37] <RenatoSilva> verterok: oh so it's the xml rpc, ok
[17:37] <GaryvdM> chx: He maybe did not install the qt binaries, which has to be done manualy
[17:37] <chx> GaryvdM: maybe the installer should warn ?
[17:38] <GaryvdM> chx: yes.
[17:38] <GaryvdM> I'll reply.
[17:39] <vila> hmm, the coyote is efficient...
[17:40] <chx> GaryvdM: thanks!
[17:43] <Noldorin> jelmer, heh, ok. will do so now
[17:44] <Noldorin> jelmer, getting a horrible error now :S
[17:45] <Noldorin> jelmer, never mind, that disappeared
[17:45] <Noldorin> jelmer, anyway, all upgraded now. how to proceed?
[17:48] <jelmer> Noldorin: are you running bzr-git trunk?
[17:51] <Noldorin> jelmer, 0.43 now
[17:52] <SamB_XP> what, he does releases of tht?
[17:54] <Noldorin> jelmer, upgrade to trunk?
[17:55] <jelmer> Noldorin, please do
[17:55] <Noldorin> jelmer, ok, done now :)
[17:56] <Noldorin> jelmer, same error, of course
[17:56] <Noldorin> but anyway...
[17:57] <Noldorin> which file should we start off messing with?
[17:58] <jelmer> Noldorin, I'm adding some debug code
[17:58] <Noldorin> jelmer, ah, great
[18:01] <jelmer> Noldorin, done
[18:01] <jelmer> please pull again
[18:01] <jelmer> please try again and use -Dtransport
[18:01] <jelmer> this'll write extra info to ~/.bzr.log
[18:02] <Noldorin> ok
[18:03] <jelmer> I'll be back in ~30 minutes
[18:05] <Noldorin> jelmer, ok
[18:07] <BasicOSX> vila:  no, I run bzr.dev
[18:07] <BasicOSX> (sorry for the late response)
[18:07] <vila> BasicOSX: better late than never :D And you use bzr-explorer or not ?
[18:08] <BasicOSX> not ... my roots are unix and most of my work is done on linux
[18:08] <BasicOSX> CLI server stuff
[18:09] <BasicOSX> Just taking poll? or looking for more feedback?
[18:09] <vila> BasicOSX: trying to update my mental Who's Who :D
[18:10] <BasicOSX> Then you'll need some mental floss after talking to me :-P
[18:11] <vila> jam: wt.list_files() raising OSError when trying to lstat  a non-normalized Unicode filename... rings a bell ?
[18:12] <vila> BasicOSX: Ok, I stop right now then :D
[18:14] <GaryvdM> Bla, me too
[18:15] <GaryvdM> groups.drupal.org says "Your submission has triggered the spam filter and will not be accepted."
[18:15] <fullermd> Who's who?  Me's me.
[18:16] <Noldorin> jelmer, doesn't print anything in dtransport now :S
[18:28] <jelmer> Noldorin, re
[18:28] <jelmer> Noldorin, did you try adding -Dtransport on the commandline ?
[18:28] <jelmer> Noldorin, and nothing shows up in .bzr.log ?
[18:28] <vila> jam: for WorkingTreeFormat2 that is
[18:33] <GaryvdM> Hmm. For bzr 2.1, I thought that python-testtools was only a requirement if you are going to run the test suit.
[18:34] <GaryvdM> Some commands (like update) fail if you don't have it.
[18:34] <GaryvdM> Was this intended?
[18:36] <GaryvdM> vila ^
[18:39] <vila> GaryvdM: If sftp is involved you're running into bug #516183
[18:39] <vila> GaryvdM: the fix should be included in 2.1.0final but is still present in 2.1.0rc2
[18:41] <fullermd> Heh.  It's funny how two wrongs make a right.
[18:41] <jelmer> Noldorin, ?
[18:41] <fullermd> I never had a chance to run into that bug, since I yanked paramiko off my systems after the pycrypto upgrade left it bleating all the time   :p
[18:42] <GaryvdM> vila: Ok I was using sftp. So I'm not going to add testtools as a dependency to the debs in the ppa.
[18:43] <vila> jam: I'm banging my head on the failing tests for https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~vila/bzr/322767-dont-add-conflict-related-files/+merge/18858, if you could have a look during my night, I'm sure I will sleep better ;) I can't figure why using wt.list_files() *during* smart_add fails while using it after succeeds (or something like that)
[18:44] <vila> GaryvdM: testtools should be a Build Dep for bzr
[18:44] <jam> vila: ... WT.list_files() often fails because we get the offending file back in plain str form, and stuff like 'list.sort()' raises a UnicodeDecodeError trying to compare that string to others.
[18:44] <jam> but sure, I'll look at your work
[18:44] <vila> GaryvdM: i.e. something you need to build (ok, test) but not when *using* it
[18:44] <GaryvdM> vila: Ah yes.
[18:46] <vila> jam: here we fail in a call to file_kind() which calls os.lstat AFAICT with the normalized form when the not normalized form has been used on disk
[18:46] <jam> vila: well, I'm not going to try to solve Mac issues :)
[18:46] <jam> at least, not yet
[18:46] <vila> not on mac ! It's on karmix/etx3
[18:46] <vila> yeah karmic even
[18:47] <jam> hmm.... maybe we failed to remove some of the normalization code
[18:48] <vila> anyway, the mp gives a subset that includes the failing tests (they succeed without my patch ...)
[18:48]  * vila is off
[18:53] <GaryvdM> Is there something similar to a bzr checkout (aka bound branch) in git?
[18:56] <jam> GaryvdM: past experience seems to indicate no, but I haven't checked again recently
[18:57] <GaryvdM> jam: Ok, I'm going to state that in a forum.
[18:58] <jam> I believe they have 'stacking', but only for local (I don't believe you can stack across a network boundary)
[18:58] <jam> there are also some strange things you can do with env vars
[18:59] <jam> vila: in case you are still here, what is failing is that calling 'conflicts' to list what files are conflicted has to walk the whole filesystem because it has to search for .BASE, etc files.
[18:59] <jam> You change causes us to invoke '.conflicts' in a case where we didn't before
[19:00] <jam> So I think it was already broken, we just didn't know it, because we weren't calling it in those circumstances
[19:00] <jam> I would consider adding a KnownFailure for WTF2 in that case
[19:00] <jam> not worth the effort to fix, IMO
[19:02] <jam> well, I should say, fixing list_files() is worthwhile at some point, but not worth blocking your patch for
[19:33] <Noldorin> jelmer, sorry, thought you had left.
[19:33] <Noldorin> jelmer, well, let me paste you the output
[19:36] <Noldorin> http://pastebin.com/m62241839
[19:36] <Noldorin> jelmer, that's all i get
[19:38] <jelmer> re
[19:38] <jelmer> Noldorin, did you pull from trunk after I added that debug output?"
[19:42] <Noldorin> jelmer, yep
[19:44] <Noldorin> jelmer, just double check - it is up to date. what were you expecting?
[19:50] <vila> jam: passing rapidly post-lunch, ha, that makes sense and kind-of imply that Unicode is badly supported for WorkingTreeFormat2. So accepting my patch means we won't support adding files for that format, but given the big red flashing warning to upgrade from that format, I think that's acceptable.
[19:51] <jelmer> Noldorin, what revno of bzr-git do you have?
[19:51] <vila> jam: can I consider adding the expected failures  as a BB:tweak ?
[19:51] <Noldorin> jelmer, r708
[19:52] <jelmer> Noldorin, are you sure that's the version actually being loaded? using -Dtransport I get more debug output in ~/.bzr.log..
[19:53] <Noldorin> judging by the log, it is
[19:53] <Noldorin> one sec
[19:53] <jam> vila: yes
[19:54] <vila> jam: thanks, I'll sleep better :D
[19:54] <dahoste> hey #bzr.
[19:55] <Noldorin> jelmer, how can i check?
[19:55] <jelmer> Noldorin, "bzr plugins -v"
[19:57] <GaryvdM> jelmer: I want to update bzr-svn, and bzr-rebase and add bzr-git to the beta ppa. I'm not sure which is the best way to go about this.
[19:57] <GaryvdM> jelmer: E.g. One of the questions I have is for bzr-svn, should I start with lp:~bzr/bzr-svn/<ubuntu- ver>-ppa or lp:~debian-bzr-svn/bzr-svn/unstable
[19:58] <dahoste> Question: I'm trying to get some shared-repo branches exposed via wsgi+apache.  Works fine for a non-shared repo branch, but fails for a shared repo.  I get: " An attempt to access a url outside the server jail was made".   Something to do with how the transport is created.. but not sure how to tweak it to make it work.
[19:59] <dahoste> My little wsgi handler is using the make_app() function from bzrlib.transport.http.wsgi.
[19:59] <Noldorin> jelmer, erm, how do i rebuild?
[19:59] <Noldorin> i think i need to do that now
[20:00] <Peng> dahoste: Upgrade to bzr 2.1.0rc1.
[20:00] <jelmer> GaryvdM: the debian packages are on http://bzr.debian.org/pkg-bazaar/bzr-X/unstable
[20:00] <Noldorin> oh, never mind
[20:00] <Noldorin> need to add back in the hack
[20:00] <Noldorin> one sec
[20:01] <jelmer> Noldorin: there's nothing to rebuild, it's just python files
[20:01] <jelmer> GaryvdM: the packages on launchpad are outdated (mirrors/imports don't work for packaging branches yet)
[20:01] <GaryvdM> jelmer: Should I base the ppa packages on http://bzr.debian.org/pkg-bazaar/bzr-X/unstable?
[20:02] <dahoste> Peng, .... ok.  Was this a known issue, then, that is definitely fixed?  I'm not averse to implementing a more substantial wsgi handler, if that's all it takes.
[20:02] <jelmer> GaryvdM: Yeah
[20:02] <Noldorin> ok, seems i've got to update dulwich too...
[20:02] <GaryvdM> jelmer: cool
[20:02] <jelmer> Noldorin: you shouldn't have to, bzr-git trunk and bzr-git 0.4.3 require the same dulwich
[20:03] <Noldorin> jelmer, i haven't updated since 0.4.2
[20:03] <Noldorin> so yes i think i need to
[20:03] <jelmer> Noldorin, but then cloning wouldn't have worked earlier either
[20:03] <Noldorin> ok, working now
[20:03] <Noldorin> hmm
[20:03] <Peng> dahoste: Yes, it's been fixed. Bug #348308.
[20:04] <Peng> dahoste: If you don't want to upgrade bzr, you can put a simple monkeypatch in your WSGI script, but upgrading would be better...
[20:04] <Noldorin> jelmer, http://pastebin.com/m5950138d
[20:05] <Noldorin> seems to be including your debug info now :)
[20:07] <Peng> dahoste: My favorite version of the monkeypatch is http://paste.pocoo.org/show/176320/, FYI.
[20:07] <dahoste> Peng, hmm... I apologize for not seeing that.  I did search the bugs.   Weird - searching on either 'wsgi' or 'jail' doesn't bring up 348308.
[20:07] <Noldorin> jelmer, i guess the problem is where the ssh key is transported over the git connection?
[20:08] <Peng> dahoste: Don't sweat it, I never find anything searching Launchpad either. I think it excludes fixed bugs by default?
[20:09] <dahoste> Peng, cool, that should be enough to get me going.  I'm not averse to upgrading, but I'm using gentoo and avoid stepping outside of portage unless it's a security issue or something.  They've still got 2.1.0-beta4 masked.  I'll monkeypatch in the interim.
[20:11] <Peng> dahoste: OK. :)
[20:12] <dahoste> Peng, thanks for the quick info.   irc ftw, as usual.
[20:12] <Peng> dahoste: I used to have that bug number memorized, though I've started to forget it since it was fixed, since I run bzr.dev. :P
[20:13] <Noldorin> jelmer, any ideas?
[20:14] <dahoste> Peng, I'll admit I was surprised that this didn't 'just work'... figured everyone was running their repos through wsgi, and it would be well-paved for all the common scenarios.
[20:14] <jelmer> Noldorin: as far as I can tell the ssh bit works ok
[20:14] <GaryvdM> Interesting: http://upsilon.cc/~zack/stuff/img/vcstype-year.png (Graph of Debian VCS usage)
[20:15] <Peng> dahoste: For some reason, very few people use the WSGI server.
[20:15] <Peng> dahoste: If they want good performance, they just use bzr+ssh.
[20:18] <dahoste> Peng, I almost went that route.. but wanted to avoid dealing with full shell accounts.  Though I think there's a way to use a single account, not sure.  Anyway, with wsgi, I can just defer to apache to auth through ldap for write access.   I'm prepping to migrate a ton of svn repos over to bzr, and wanted to maintain as much of the auth environment as possible.
[20:19] <Peng> dahoste: Ooh, you're going to do HTTP writing too? That's probably even less common.
[20:19] <dahoste> Peng, yup.   fingers crossed.  :)
[20:21] <Noldorin> jelmer, hmm ok. so what now then?
[20:22] <GaryvdM> jelmer: When I'm done, should I push --overwrite to lp:~bzr/bzr-svn/<ubuntu-ver>-ppa?
[20:22] <jelmer> can you try adding self._path = self._path.strip("/") after the call to trace ?
[20:23] <jelmer> GaryvdM, please do
[20:23] <GaryvdM> Ok
[20:24] <Noldorin> jelmer, strangest thing is that ssh auth works perfectly for bzr/launchpad....
[20:25] <GaryvdM> ah lp:~bzr/bzr-svn/<ubuntu-ver>-ppa has allready been merged with  http://bzr.debian.org/pkg-bazaar/bzr-svn/unstable/ -- Cool
[20:32] <jelmer> Noldorin, any luck?
[20:33] <Noldorin> jelmer, see my previous message
[20:33] <jelmer> Noldorin, <jelmer> can you try adding self._path = self._path.strip("/") after the call to trace ?
[20:46] <jelmer> Noldorin: any luck?
[21:03] <jelmer> Noldorin, still there?
[21:41] <Noldorin> jelmer, seems we keep missing each other.
[21:41] <Noldorin> jelmer, oh, i thought that comment was to someone else, sorry.
[21:41] <jelmer> Noldorin: can you pull from current trunk
[21:41] <Noldorin> jelmer, what file/position?
[21:41] <jelmer> Noldorin, and try again
[21:41] <Noldorin> ok
[21:42] <Noldorin> coo
[21:44] <Noldorin> jelmer,
[21:44] <Noldorin> http://pastebin.com/m1a840bb5
[21:44] <Noldorin> that's running dpush -Dtransport on the latest revision
[21:46] <Noldorin> jelmer, doesn't look any different
[21:49] <Noldorin> hmm
[21:57]  * Noldorin pings jelmer
[21:58] <jelmer> Noldorin, sorry, I'm out of ideas
[21:59] <Noldorin> hmm
[22:00] <Noldorin> jelmer, what did you expect to see in that trace?
[22:10] <poolie> good morning
[22:10] <GaryvdM> Hi poolie
[22:10] <Noldorin> jelmer, (if you were looking for anything at all)
[22:11] <poolie> hello gary
[22:12] <Peng> mwhudson: BTW, looks like my mirrored branches are happy again...
[22:12] <mwhudson> Peng: oh good
[22:13] <Peng> I guess the gremlins have been placated?
[22:18] <GaryvdM> There were lots of critical bugs in 2.1.0rc2 (that have been fixed). I think we should maybe do a rc2
[22:19] <GaryvdM> *I think we should maybe do a rc3
[22:19] <GaryvdM> Bug #515597 makes rc2 unusable
[22:21]  * mtaylor made bzr  crash...
[22:22] <mtaylor> bzr revision-info lp:~mordred/+junk/testme
[22:22] <mtaylor> gives:
[22:22] <mtaylor> bzr: ERROR: bzrlib.errors.ReadOnlyError: A write attempt was made in a read only transaction on LockableFiles(lock, file:///home/mordred/src/testme/.bzr/branch/)
[22:24] <mwhudson> revision-info is pretty weird about its arguments
[22:25] <mwhudson> mtaylor: i think what that command tries to do is number the tip of lp:~mordred/+junk/testme in the branch in your cwd
[22:25] <mtaylor> mwhudson: lovely
[22:25] <mwhudson> or something like that
[22:25] <mwhudson> yeah
[22:25] <mtaylor> mwhudson: is there a command I'm missing then that would give me the revision-id of the tip of the branch specified?
[22:26] <mwhudson> mtaylor: bzr revision-info -d lp:~mordred/+junk/testme
[22:26] <mwhudson> (i added the -d option in an extreme rage a while ago)
[22:26] <mtaylor> mwhudson: what does -d do?
[22:26] <mtaylor> awesome. rage is a good source of commands
[22:26] <mwhudson> mtaylor:
[22:26] <mwhudson>   -d ARG, --directory=ARG
[22:26] <mwhudson>                         Branch to examine, rather than the one containing the
[22:26] <mwhudson>                         working directory.
[22:26] <mtaylor> ah. heh
[22:27] <GaryvdM> jelmer: I've gotten (and upgraded) lp:~bzr/bzr-svn/karmic-ppa/ and run merge http://bzr.debian.org/pkg-bazaar/bzr-svn/unstable/
[22:28] <GaryvdM> jelmer: I'm not sure how to handel the merging of changelog
[22:28] <GaryvdM> There are some entries from debian/unstable that have been added
[22:29] <GaryvdM> jelmer: Do I keep these?
[22:33] <GaryvdM> jelmer: I think that I'm going to revert merges changes to debian/changelog, and create my entry (with version number for the ppa)
[22:59] <spiv> Good morning.
[23:44] <GaryvdM> How do I get bzr builddeb to not download the .orig.tar.gz with uscan, but to rather use the code from the branch?
[23:45] <james_w> GaryvdM: you need to use "merge-upstream" to merge the code from the branch, and pass the tarball if there is one corresponding to the release you are using
[23:46]  * GaryvdM is confused
[23:47] <GaryvdM> ah merge-upstream is a builddeb command
[23:51] <AfC> Given an arbitrary Debian package in Ubuntu, what's the bzr command to get a Bazaar branch of its sources? [is there one?]
[23:53] <james_w> bzr branch lp:ubuntu/<package>
[23:55] <GaryvdM> james_w: I cant get merge-upstream to work, but I think I have don what it does manually, so I'm not to worried.
[23:56] <igc> hi
[23:57] <igc> hi poolie, jam, garyvdm, james_w
[23:58] <GaryvdM> james_w: My org question is theoretical, because the .orig.tar.gz should be the same as the contents of the branch, but what if I have modified the code in the branch so that it differs from the .orig.tar.gz?
[23:58] <GaryvdM> Hi igc!
[23:59] <james_w> hi igc
[23:59] <james_w> GaryvdM: the way that .deb repositories work mean that you have to have a byte-for-byte identical .orig.tar.gz for versions that share the same upstream version


 I got somethin to show ya
[00:42] <seidos> who let the dogs out?
[00:43] <yax51> so I figured out how to turn my old netgear router into a switch
[00:43] <seidos> gunndawg: i'm sure you can
[00:43] <gunndawg> seidos, May I? ;)
[00:43] <yax51> :D
[00:43] <seidos> gunndawg: only if you should ;)
[00:43] <seidos> and you probably should!
[00:44]  * seidos laughs
[00:44] <seidos> absurd!
[00:44] <yax51> and you know what the dumb part was? it had nothing to do with configuration at all, I simply didn't use the WAN port like I should have and connected my internet straight into a LAN port...
[01:14] <seidos> gunndawg: how do you get the system stats on your desktop?
[01:18] <gunndawg> seidos, download "conky" and I'll send you the config file to look like mine (otherwise it looks bad)
[01:20] <seidos> gunndawg: all right.  downloaded.
[01:21] <gunndawg> ok let me pastebin the confi file, just copy/paste it into the conky config file you have now and save it
[01:21] <gunndawg> seidos, its in /etc/conky btw
[01:22] <gunndawg> http://www.ubuntu.pastebin.com/5TTfVp4M
[01:22] <seidos> gunndawg: UNKNOWN PASTE ID!
[01:23] <seidos> - Unknown paste ID, it may have expired or been deleted!
[01:23] <seidos> i got that error when i clicked
[01:23] <gunndawg> ok hang on
[01:23] <gunndawg> http://www.ubuntu.pastebin.com/CQjQ1fnp
[01:23] <seidos> no worries, i'm not in a hurry
[01:23] <gunndawg> so replace that with ur current config, save it and type conky in a terminal
[01:24] <gunndawg> then you can edit it how you want, you can change the colors, you'll see that in the config file
[01:24] <seidos> ah, i should make a symlink to it from ~/
[01:24] <seidos> so that it gets backed up
[01:24] <gunndawg> well install it and make sure it works
[01:24] <gunndawg> replace urs with mine, and run conky in term
[01:26] <seidos> yes \o\ /o/
[01:26] <gunndawg> :)
[01:26] <seidos> i should look at the config file
[01:26] <gunndawg> now you can edit the color of each thing
[01:26] <gunndawg> just look in the config
[01:26] <gunndawg> yeah
[01:26] <seidos> i think i'd prefer black text on this background
[01:26] <seidos> or, i should just change the background to black
[01:26] <gunndawg> you can easily change it to black text
[01:26] <gunndawg> in the config
[01:27] <gunndawg> just go to each section and change color to black
[01:27] <seidos> i actually would prefer a black background, but...it's not working for some reason
[01:30] <gunndawg> hmm
[01:30] <gunndawg> what part are you trying to edit
[01:32] <seidos> just trying to set the background in gnome
[01:32] <seidos> right clicking desktop, clicking background
[01:32] <seidos> change to a solid color
[01:32] <seidos> doesn't take
[01:32] <gunndawg> works fine for me
[01:32] <seidos> hmmm, maybe i'm missing something
[01:34] <gunndawg> maybe a brain cell?
[01:34] <gunndawg> ;)
[01:35] <seidos> maybe ;)
[01:35] <seidos> i tried right clicking an image, and setting it as the background, that didn't do it either.
[01:35] <seidos> but i don't really know how it does its thing
[01:35] <gunndawg> hmmm
[01:35] <gunndawg> try log out and log back in?
[01:35] <gunndawg> maybe a reboot ?
[01:37]  * seidos refuses to reboot
[01:37] <seidos> there is seeding to be done...
[01:37] <gunndawg> ah
[01:37] <seidos> and coding...even though i am presently stumped
[01:38] <gunndawg> you didnt tell me you were coding right now, what language ?
[01:38] <gunndawg> and also, seeding torrents can get you busted by certain ISP's
[01:38] <seidos> and maybe investigation as to how exactly the desktop image is set
[01:38] <seidos> python
[01:38] <gunndawg> when did you start coding in python? lol
[01:38] <seidos> gunndawg: that's sad
[01:38] <gunndawg> you didnt tell me
[01:38] <seidos> i said i was working on projecteuler
[01:38] <gunndawg> yeah but you didnt say it was in python
[01:38] <seidos> sorry, what other language would i use but python?
[01:38] <gunndawg> c, c++, shell
[01:39] <gunndawg> umm, what else
[01:39] <seidos> perl, php
[01:39] <gunndawg> sure
[01:39] <gunndawg> send me ur source
[01:39] <seidos> yeah, python is easiest for me right now
[01:39] <gunndawg> python is the easiest language out of them all, to learn
[01:40] <gunndawg> I started with it last night and already have a full blown app finished, that should tell you something
[01:40] <gunndawg> perhaps we should move this to offtopic or in private
[01:40] <seidos> gunndawg: how do you paste an entire file from vim into pastebin?  yG used to do it iirc, but not anymore
[01:41] <seidos> gunndawg: yeah, OT
[01:41] <gunndawg> seidos, if I am gonna pastebin something I usually just gedit, it
[01:41] <seidos> gunndawg: same here
[01:44] <seidos> any ideas why this doesn't work:  metta@r2d2:/etc/conky$ ln ~/conky.conf /etc/conky/conky.conf
[01:44] <seidos> ln: creating hard link `/etc/conky/conky.conf' => `/home/metta/conky.conf': Invalid cross-device link
[01:44] <Dutch70> gunndawg: not to interrupt, but what did you start with to learn python? is there a program? lessons? I'd like to learn it also.
[01:46] <gunndawg> Dutch70, I'll show you a good series of video tutorials
[01:46] <gunndawg> seidos, I am not to sure
[01:47] <Dutch70> gunndawg: That would be great
[01:47] <gunndawg> duanedesign, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Mf0h3HphEA
[01:48] <gunndawg> he has like over 50 video tutorials so just keep following along, then he gets into wxPython tutorials which is making GUI programs
[01:48] <gunndawg> Dutch70, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Mf0h3HphEA
[01:48] <gunndawg> that link was for you, oops
[01:48] <gunndawg> but like I said, hes got like over 50 video tutorials that start small and eventually grow, then after those he moves onto creating GUI apps with python
[01:49] <Dutch70> gunndawg: lol...bookmarked, thank you very much. I'll let you get back to what you were doing now.
[01:50] <gunndawg> Dutch70, http://min.us/mveYeiq
[01:50] <gunndawg> thats a screenshot of a program I just recently finished using Python, its basically a front-end to apt commands
[01:51] <Dutch70> Nice!!! ...nice wallpaper too.
[01:51] <gunndawg> heh thx
[01:53] <Dutch70> gunndawg: ah, thank you. going to watch some videos, see ya.
[01:53] <gunndawg> Dutch70, your welcome, enjoy
[02:15] <seidos> anyone know what package i can use to open .rar files?
[02:25] <pleia2> unrar
[03:51] <dtp> can anyone explain in simple explanation how to install anything on ubuntu?
[03:53] <dtp> did that close his page or does this mean i'm still on a irc chat?
[03:53] <dtp> i guess that was the same thing but still if anyone here can still see this. please let me know
[03:54] <pleia2> dtp: you install software using the Software Center (it's in the main menu)
[03:55] <dtp> ok. sounds simple. but what if i were installing a program to run with the wine program>
[03:56] <pleia2> unfortuantely I don't use wine so I'm not too familiar with how to install programs with it
[03:57]  * seidos beeps like r2d2
[03:57] <seidos> dtp: have you tried running the setup.exe file with wine?
[03:58] <dtp> thanks. i do appreciate it though. I just produce music and recently switched to Ubuntu. Now i still want to use some of the Windows programs for the production
[03:58] <johnny77> dtp: http://wiki.winehq.org/FAQ#head-f3515230c198befe0279d32c448d9c8da63be66f
[03:58] <dtp> no. but sounds like it could work. downloading wine now.
[03:58] <dtp> thanks johnny i'll read up on it
[03:58] <johnny77> dtp: no problem
[03:59] <seidos> dtp: you may want to check winehq.org to see how the software you want to run is rated
[03:59] <dtp> check out my site(s) if you want for the help   www.myspace.com/collectivesite and www.myspace.com/tgitcotr
[04:00] <dtp> thanks. wine is almost downloaded
[04:01] <dtp> i've seen the program work on a youtube vid. seidos but i'll probably not want to lock my system up either.
[04:01] <johnny77> dtp: I agree with seidos. Windows programs are rated on winehq.org on how well they run within wine.
[04:03] <seidos> i never click myspace links
[04:03] <dtp> i have a sound cloud if your afraid of the big myspace site. lol
[04:03] <dtp> just have some of the best on myspace
[04:04] <seidos> dtp: haha afraid
[04:05] <dtp> yeah. myspace is kinda scary with all it's music and stuff.
[04:05] <seidos> i don't find it scary at all.
[04:06] <dtp> just not into myspace music then?
[04:06] <seidos> dtp: nope.  this is also really isn't a place to advertise it.
[04:07] <seidos> or...not *the* place
[04:08] <dtp> yeah. i'm not trying to. i was thanking someone for there help with the only way other than thanks that i have from being a new ubuntu user. obviously he didn't check it or like it enough to respond
[04:08] <dtp> plus he could really like music.
[04:08] <dtp> lol
[04:09] <dtp> but yes i understand it's the wrong chat to advertise on.
[04:12] <dtp> wine is taking a while to download and apply chages... is this typical?
[04:13] <seidos> dtp: you might want to try talking about music in #ubuntu-offtopic or #ubuntu-beginners-team
[04:13] <dtp> np
[04:13] <dtp> team? really?
[04:14] <seidos> dtp: maybe on a friday night.  i never had much trouble with it.  but i haven't used it in months.
[04:14] <seidos> dtp: that's what i heard
[04:14] <dtp> hmm. o.k.   maybe i could make music for some ubuntu developers.
[04:15] <dtp> i hope this downloads quicker. i have to be at the beach tomorrow. and need this computer cause i'll be there all weekend
[04:15] <dtp> and it's late and my mommy needs to tuck me in.
[04:15] <dtp> lol
[04:16] <dtp> how do i join the other irc chats and stay on this one?
[04:17] <JoeMaverickSett> dtp: /join #ubuntu-beginners-team for example
[07:49] <bioterror> hobgoblin, you can be only on one channel at time? :D
[07:49] <hobgoblin> what?
[08:03] <kaushal> Hi
[08:03] <kaushal> can someone please guide me about https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-users/2011-February/239556.html ?
[09:15] <anselmo_crowley> hi?
[09:16] <anselmo_crowley> is there anybody here?
[09:16] <CensoredBiscuit> hello anselmo_crowley
[09:16] <CensoredBiscuit> !ask | anselmo_crowley
[09:16] <ubot2> anselmo_crowley: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-)
[09:19] <anselmo_crowley> I think I messed up my sister's laptop. I already asked in the ubuntu forum but I wanted to try my luck here. She asked me to erase her Windows partition and I did but now the whole thing doesn't work. I can't start Ubuntu and when I use a LiveCD it tells me it can't access the /home partition. What can I do? (BTW is it rude or something to ask in ubuntu forum and here at the same time?)
[09:21] <kristian-aalborg> echo radiotray hold | dpkg --set-selections
[09:21] <CensoredBiscuit> anselmo_crowley: No its not considered rude
[09:21] <kristian-aalborg> is this really enough if I want a package to never be updated?
[09:22] <CensoredBiscuit> anselmo_crowley: are you burning the live cd where its bootable?
[09:23] <yofel> kristian-aalborg: usually yes, the only other thing you could do would be to add an apt pin
[09:25] <kristian-aalborg> yofel: cool
[09:29] <kristian-aalborg> I just type the name of the package - no numbers or something?
[09:35] <yofel> no, hold means stick to the current version
[09:38] <kristian-aalborg> nice
[09:39] <kristian-aalborg> I wish I'd done it before stuff broke, though ;
[09:39] <kristian-aalborg> ;)
[12:47] <JackyAlcine> hehehe bioterror.:D
[12:47] <AbhijiT> :)
[12:47] <JackyAlcine> I should have sent a part msg.
[12:48] <JackyAlcine> Noo! lol
[12:48] <AbhijiT> :P
[12:48] <JackyAlcine> Grr, I was close. ;D
[12:48] <AbhijiT> JackyAlcine, are you the one heading wintermute project?
[12:55] <duanedesign> morning all
[12:56] <AbhijiT> hi
[14:25] <earthling_> Anyone know what the unolib3 and ure updates for?  It says "the list of changes is not available yet".
[15:05] <duanedesign> earthling_: are you looking for the changelog?
[15:09] <bioterror> hi duane
[15:10]  * suprengr is sad... used 'hibernate' on 10.04 for first time today - when I got home and pressed power button... Ubuntu started from 'normal' startup, not from hibernate state.  boo! hiss!
[15:10] <bioterror> suspend ftw
[15:14] <suprengr> bioterror: FTW may refer to: Fort Worth, Texas. Amtrak code for Fort Worth Intermodal Transportation Center; IATA code for Fort Worth Meacham International Airport ... or sometimes 'For The Win' ;D
[15:14] <kumaanki> hi everyone..
[15:22] <earthling_> duanedesign, yes
[15:22] <earthling_> "There’s no page with this address in Launchpad."
[15:23] <duanedesign> the last changelog at changelogs.ubuntu.com for ure is http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/main/o/openoffice.org/openoffice.org_3.2.1-7ubuntu1.1/changelog
[15:26] <earthling_> so those updates should be there?
[15:26] <earthling_> looking
[15:28] <duanedesign> earthling_: looks like ubuntuupdates.org does not have the changes listed yet for uno-libs3 http://www.ubuntuupdates.org/packages/show/301447
[15:29] <earthling_> yeah
[15:33] <earthling_> Has their ever been a problem with installing updates? Should I just always download everything?
[15:33] <duanedesign> earthling_: you are on maverick?
[15:33] <earthling_> lucid
[15:33] <duanedesign> ok
[15:34] <duanedesign> earthling_: If you go to your Software Sources
[15:34] <duanedesign> in Lucid that might still be under System > Admministration > Software Sources
[15:35] <earthling_> ok
[15:35] <duanedesign> or in the Software Center under Edit > Software Sources
[15:35] <earthling_> I see it
[15:35] <duanedesign> earthling_: there is a Updates tab
[15:35] <earthling_> yeah
[15:36] <duanedesign> I have all 4 checked
[15:36] <duanedesign> security, updates, proposed, and backports\
[15:36] <duanedesign> if you are concerned you can do just the top 2
[15:36] <earthling_> I just have important and recommended checked
[15:36] <duanedesign> Security and Recommended
[15:37] <earthling_> yeah top 2
[15:37] <duanedesign> yep
[15:37] <duanedesign> then you are only getting the updates that are the most tested
[15:37] <earthling_> cool
[15:38] <earthling_> so you think they will get around to the changelog later?
[15:38] <earthling_> or sometimes they don't do that
[15:39] <duanedesign> earthling_: they might be using the openoffice changelog since those packages come with open office
[15:40] <earthling_> the same updates went to all the distros perhaps
[15:40] <duanedesign> earthling_: note that if you ever get a bug you can enable those bottom two software sourcees and see if there is a newer package available
[15:41] <duanedesign> but that is just a tip if toy have an issue in the future
[15:41] <duanedesign> you*
[15:42] <earthling_> ic
[15:42] <earthling_> do you always install all the updates?
[15:42] <earthling_> recommended
[15:42] <earthling_> I don't want to slow down my system too
[15:44] <duanedesign> earthling_: yes, definetly if you are only doing the Important and Recommended
[15:45] <duanedesign> those you should always install. Security updates and such are very inportant
[15:45] <JackyAlcine> Gah, I get pinged everytime duanedesign says something.
[15:45] <duanedesign> :)
[15:45] <duanedesign> something
[15:46] <duanedesign> <.<  >,>
[15:46] <JackyAlcine> Lol, I fixed it :p
[15:50] <johnny77> Does the window manager handle right-click menus in applications?
[15:52] <geirha> johnny77: No.
[15:53] <greenage39> Hi am new here, i cant access my web cam, pls can any1 help?
[15:54] <earthling_> Are you guys using maverick, how do you like it?
[15:55] <greenage39> yes maverick is awesome
[15:56] <earthling_> hi greenage39, I'm new too
[15:56] <greenage39> am using it rite now,
[15:56] <earthling_> were you using lucid awhile?
[15:56] <greenage39> then i wld say welcome earthling
[15:56] <earthling_> thx
[15:57] <greenage39> yes i did
[15:57] <johnny77> geirha: What controls it then? It seems intermittently I loose the ability to right-click in the programs I have open.
[15:57] <earthling_> cool
[15:58] <earthling_> greenage39, is it a new webcam?
[15:58] <geirha> johnny77: That would be whatever library is used by the program. A typical gnome application will be using libgtk+
[15:59] <greenage39> nu! its my in built
[15:59] <greenage39> okies i think i jst solved it
[15:59] <earthling_> ok good
[16:00] <greenage39> it working now
[16:00] <johnny77> geirha: So more than one program could use the same library?
[16:00] <greenage39> do u use skype?
[16:00] <earthling_> I haven't tried skype on ubuntu
[16:00] <earthling_> it works well?
[16:01] <greenage39> i think its good but i havent been able to use the video call yet
[16:01] <geirha> johnny77: Yes.
[16:02] <geirha> johnny77: Open a terminal and run   tail -f ~/.xsession-errors    then try to reproduce the problem you're mentioning, and see if any useful error messages appear in the tail output.
[16:06] <earthling_> bbl thanks duanedesign
[16:06] <johnny77> geirha: ok, I'll take a look at it in a few minutes. I've never been able to reproduce it. It just happend then in a few minutes goes away.
[16:08] <geirha> johnny77: Ah, well next time it happens. Open the ~/.xsession-errors file and look at the last few lines. It may have some clues about what went wrong.
[16:20] <johnny77> geirha: Does the xsession-errors continuous or does it start fresh at each login?
[16:36] <geirha> johnny77: Not entirely sure, but I believe it's truncated each time you log in.
[16:38] <ravee> Hey guys! I have a well functioning 10.10 installation (that was originally a 9.10 and then updated) and i have only an old network mapping in my fstba. I dont have a mount entry for my / or my swap. Anyone know if something is changed in 10.10 or something?
[16:38] <ravee> fstab*
[16:42] <ravee> brb, reboot
[16:46] <ravee> Anyone have any thought regardin my fstab? Its really only one entry and that is that single network share
[16:47] <ravee> i wnat to know wher there entrys for my / and swap are :)
[16:52] <geirha> They should be in /etc/fstab. If they're not there, they're nowhere :P
[16:52] <geirha> Is your swap even mounted?  swapon -s
[16:53] <charliemac> bioterror, i'm trying to reformat that fat partition to ntfs using the disk utility but it can't do it...  :|
[16:53] <bioterror> umount? and then try again
[16:54] <geirha> charliemac: It's best to do that in Windows really. In Windows you can convert FAT to NTFS without losing the files.
[16:54] <charliemac> ok well it says error unmounting; operation failed: only root can unmount?
[16:55] <bioterror> use the force!
[16:55] <charliemac> lol nice.  I tried it in windows, too but it was also unsuccessful
[16:55] <charliemac> Let me switch to windows, brb
[16:59] <geirha> ravee: You really should add entries for / and swap in your /etc/fstab.
[17:01] <ravee> geirha: sure but i was interested in knowing how that even can work
[17:02] <geirha> ravee: Well, your swap is most likely not mounted. The system will work without swap.
[17:03] <geirha> your / partition is mounted by the kernel at the early stage of the boot. Once it has that mounted, it will later read /etc/fstab and remount / with the options specified there, and mount all the other entries.
[17:04] <geirha> I'd expect / to still be mounted readonly though, but I've never actually tested with a blank /etc/fstab. It might remount / anyway, even if it's not in fstab.
[17:04] <geirha> Here's three lines from my fstab: http://pastebin.com/fydVcgj1
[17:05] <geirha> You need to change the UUIDs to match your filesystems of course, and possibly change ext3 if you are using a different filesystem.
[17:05] <geirha> sudo blkid /dev/sda1   etc. will give you the relevant information.
[17:07] <ravee> geirha: the / is not mounted as read only actually
[17:07] <ravee> but how can it be mounted without entrys in the fstab? isnt that the explicitly point of fstab?
[17:08] <ravee> if i do a mount -l i see that / is mounted beutifully as ext4 with rw
[17:10] <ravee> Geirha: you are right, the swap is not mounted actually (well not very surprising that one haven't noted that)
[17:11] <charliemac> Ok, so I'm in windows trying to reformat an empty, shared fat partition to ntfs. Should I enable compression?  I'd guess that would be a yes...
[17:11] <seidos> charliemac: i think there is a speed hit to compression.  not sure by how much.
[17:11] <charliemac> So clicking no wouldn't hurt?
[17:12] <seidos> charliemac: not if you have plenty of space
[17:12] <seidos> charliemac: compression will give you extra space, at the expense of speed.  that is all.
[17:12] <charliemac> Ububntu says 18 GB, windows says 16.9gb
[17:13] <ravee> the ntfs compression in wondows is actually slowing down, only use if you got little space avail imo
[17:13] <ravee> windows*
[17:13] <charliemac> ravee: ^
[17:13] <ravee> ^?
[17:16] <ravee> here is a coparison between uncompressed and compressed if needed http://directedge.us/content/to-compress-or-not-to-compress-part-ii
[17:16] <geirha> ravee: In order to read /etc/fstab, it must mount the filesystem where /etc/fstab is located.
[17:16] <charliemac> ravee: Ububntu says 18 GB, windows says 16.9gb
[17:16] <seidos> charliemac: this is interesting.  says it where?  can you get a screenshot?  or paste in pastebin?
[17:17] <geirha> charliemac: In newer Ubuntus, 18GB means 18 * 1000 * 1000 * 1000 bytes. In Windows, 18 GB means 18 * 1024 * 1024 * 1024
[17:17] <ravee> geirha, yeah ofc i didnt think about that. So then it actually manages to automount it in rw mode. I think ill manually fix my fstab ;)
[17:17] <charliemac> geirha: Ok, that makes sense.
[17:18] <ravee> geriha, thanks for the help :)
[17:18] <geirha> charliemac: Some more info on the matter: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UnitsPolicy
[17:19] <geirha> ravee: np. :)
[17:20] <charliemac> bioterror: I'm in windows trying to reformat an empty, shared fat partition to ntfs. Would I want to do a quick format or not?
[17:20] <bioterror> charliemac, quicky quicky!
[17:20] <charliemac> Actually, either way it gave me an error message lol
[17:21] <bioterror> charliemac, as I've kids, we tend to like quicky with my wife
[17:21] <bioterror> ;D
[17:21] <charliemac> Gotcha ;)
[17:21] <bioterror> is your memstick okay?
[17:21] <ravee> quick just destroys the info about the data, its good enough for if you know that the disk is ok i should think
[17:22] <charliemac> Should I use a memstick?  I don't have one on me, but if I need extra space I have an ipod
[17:23] <charliemac> "Windows cannot format this drive.  Quit any disk utilities or other programs that are using this dirve, and make sure that no window is displaying the contents of the drive."
[17:24] <ravee> do you have disk management and a format box going at the same time ore something?
[17:24] <charliemac> bioterror: to my knowledge, there is no open program doing this.
[17:24] <charliemac> ravee: i don't think so
[17:24] <ravee> do a reboot and your set
[17:24] <ravee> :)
[17:25] <charliemac> i've rebooted 6 times lol!
[17:25] <ravee> and same error on each reboot?
[17:25] <charliemac> Yes, Should I adjust the allocation unit size?
[17:27] <ravee> you would actually get that same error if you where to try to format the drive that windows was on
[17:28] <ravee> if its a physical disk and you really want it formated just boot up killdisk or dban or something and it will be done in a jiffy (unless its damaged)
[17:35] <charliemac> ravee: it's only a virtual partition, seperate from the c:/ drive
[20:26] <wmorri> Hi I am new and trying to decide which focus group I want to join, I have experience with documentation with fedora, but I have triaged bugs too. So I am not sure where to go?
[20:26] <zkriesse> wmorri: Move on over to -team
[20:26] <wmorri> ok
[20:26] <alexMocanu> Hello, everybody!
[20:27] <zkriesse> Hello alexMocanu !
[21:10] <jmarsden> ibuclaw: phillw says you have seen the same or similar issue with Lubuntu installs in virtualbox that I am seeing... would it be good to work on figuring out that issue together?
[21:12] <phillw> jmarsden: yes, I think chatting to ibuclaw would be a good idea - As I said, I don't use VB but I did see his mention of problems.
[21:13] <jmarsden> phillw: He apparently joined this channel about 9 minutes ago, so I thought he was around.  Might have been a disconnect and autoreconnect, though.
[21:13] <phillw> jmarsden: he does pick up on his pings.
[21:14] <phillw> he may be busy on the main forum or going through his mail.
[21:14] <jmarsden> OK.
[22:51] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> I have a problem installing ubuntu desktop on my cumputer.. it pops up with an error. "apt configuration problem" (an attempt to configure apt to install additional packages from the CD failed.)
[22:51] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> why does it do that?
[22:53] <seidos> WiiHosting-Kaspe:  here's what i think it could be 1.  bad cd  2.  bad HD  3.  bad ram
[22:54] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> the problem is taht i use USB to install. then it must be the HDD :/
[22:55] <seidos> WiiHosting-Kaspe: no, you are forgetting *your* idea.  4.  bad liveusb
[22:55] <MrChrisDruif> WiiHosting-Kaspe: How did you create the USB?
[22:55] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> i followed the guide on ubuntu's site
[22:56] <seidos> WiiHosting-Kaspe: you're not alone it seems<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[22:56] <MrChrisDruif> WiiHosting-Kaspe: Which platform?
[22:57] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> im using windows 7 to create the USB and then install to a clean HDD on my laptop
[22:57] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> there were no problems with 10.04
[22:58] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> now i wanted to try 10.10
[22:58] <seidos> there were problems with karmic, creating liveusbs of future distros.  i was only able to get a karmic liveusb made
[22:59] <seidos> WiiHosting-Kaspe: can you try a network install?  or a cd?
[22:59] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> i dont have a CD drive :/
[23:00] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> how to web install?
[23:00] <MrChrisDruif> Hmmm...it seems Ubuntu recommends Universal USB Installer....I would recommend UnetBootin on Windows :)
[23:00] <seidos> WiiHosting-Kaspe: dunno about web install, but if you had an extra computer you could do do bootp i think it's called
[23:01] <seidos> i've done it a few times
[23:01] <seidos> well, i'm going to bow out, i don't have a windows system
[23:01] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> okay ill se what i can do here ;)
[23:02] <seidos> oh, idea!  you might be able to get a liveusb made if you're near a LUG or ubuntu user group, WiiHosting-Kaspe
[23:06] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> could it be the 64 bit version that cant work with the hardware?
[23:08] <MrChrisDruif> On what hardware were you testing WiiHosting-Kaspe?
[23:08] <seidos> MrChrisDruif: good question
[23:09] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> its an acer laptop acer aspire 6935g with an intel centrino 2 cpu.. never had problems with windows 64x
[23:11] <MrChrisDruif> Well...if the laptop has a 64bit capable CPU, than it should work no problem...I'll check your hardware specs...brb
[23:11] <seidos> that isn't entirely fair.  acer doesn't actively support linux, does it?
[23:12] <seidos> WiiHosting-Kaspe: i'm sure the issue is in the liveusb creation process
[23:12] <seidos> if i had money, that's what i would bet on
[23:18] <seidos> WiiHosting-Kaspe: do you have a link to the guide you followed for creating the liveusb?
[23:19] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> http://www.ubuntu.com/desktop/get-ubuntu/download  scroll a bit down  ;)
[23:20] <MrChrisDruif> seidos: Do we care that almost all hardware vendors don't support Linux?
[23:20] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> Have had server and desktop on it before so no problem to run linux
[23:20] <MrChrisDruif> WiiHosting-Kaspe: And like I said; Ubuntu suggests Universal USB Installer or something like that....but I HIGHLY recommend UnetBootin for Windows :D
[23:21] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> i have tried now cross fingers ;)
[23:23] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> and it runs mac osx werywell to ;)
[23:23] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> very wel*
[23:24] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> same problem as before... i used UnetBootin this time
[23:25] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> ill try with 32x then
[23:25] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> 86x sry
[23:28] <seidos> MrChrisDruif: i care.  i don't speak for everybody, though.
[23:29] <seidos> WiiHosting-Kaspe: how did you install ubuntu linux on your system in the past?
[23:29] <MrChrisDruif> seidos: I didn't mean it like that :)
[23:29] <seidos> MrChrisDruif: i think it bears repeating, but i am sensitive to the political issues surrounding it.
[23:30] <MrChrisDruif> WiiHosting-Kaspe: Was the ISO downloaded correct? Did you do checksum etc?
[23:31] <seidos> yeah, a google search hasn't shone much light on the "official" way to create an ubuntu liveusb in windows.
[23:32] <seidos> well, there's the community documentation:  https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/FromUSBStick#From Windows
[23:33] <MrChrisDruif> seidos: Ofc I would like it very much if hardware vendors would start to support Linux, but that dream is still a few years away I'm afraid :)
[23:34] <WiiHosting-Kaspe> the iso is downloaded correrct yes. in the past i used the sae program ubuntu recommends on their page / guide. but i cant remember if it was 64 or 32 bit
[23:34] <seidos> MrChrisDruif: it's even further away if it remains a secret :o
[23:35] <MrChrisDruif> Woohoo...let's keep it secret that we've got Linux running on their hardware :P........(just kidding ofc;))
[23:35] <seidos> WiiHosting-Kaspe: so you followed this link:  https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/FromUSBStick#From Windows ?  utilized "usb-creator.exe"?
[23:36] <MrChrisDruif> WiiHosting-Kaspe: A download-manager might say it's in, but it can be slightly off....alsways checksum the ISO :D
[23:36] <seidos> MrChrisDruif: yeah, i'm not sure if windows has a built in md5 checker like ubuntu linux does
[23:36] <MrChrisDruif> seidos: No, but a good one I've used many times is winmd5sum
[23:37] <seidos> MrChrisDruif: yeah, but it should be included
[23:37] <MrChrisDruif> It integrates into the mouse-menu (right-click menu)
[23:37] <seidos> i'm sure there are some out there
[23:38] <MrChrisDruif> seidos: It's not from Windows, hence it won't be included :)
[23:38] <MrChrisDruif> But you are right, Windows *should* come with something like that...
[23:38] <MrChrisDruif> Even a terminal command would be nice :P
[23:39] <MrChrisDruif> But then again....Windows *should* do so much O:-)
[23:39] <xyclo> Hi, I want to install lowlatency kernel 2.6.37 on Ubuntu Studio 10.04. I found building instructions for Gentoo and in German. Anybody knows where I can get directions in english, or a pre-compiled one??
[23:39] <Reaper50435> I need help and the kubuntu channel cant help me
[23:41] <Reaper50435> when I updated my system the laptops keyboard and mouse dont work but a usb set does,  when I login I get this: I updated my system then my keyboard and mouse doesnt work but and usb set does, then when I login I get this Warning: Cannot open ConsoleKit session: Unable to open session: The permission of the setuid helper is not correct
[23:42] <Reaper50435> what do I need to do to fix this
[23:46] <MrChrisDruif> xyclo: I've found this *WARNING* use at own risk: https://launchpad.net/~abogani/+archive/ppa
[23:47] <MrChrisDruif> Reaper50435: So when you've got a keyboard/mouse plugged in, you can't use your laptop's keyboard/mouse? And when you unplug it?
[23:49] <xyclo> thanks
[23:49] <xyclo> i have this ppa
[23:50] <xyclo> but i don't see any low latency kernel...Am i missin something?
[23:50] <xyclo> g
[23:50] <MrChrisDruif> xyclo: Adding the ppa is step one :)
[23:50] <Reaper50435> no I cant use the keyboard and mouse on the laptop but if I use a usb keyboard and mouse the usb ones work
[23:51] <MrChrisDruif> I think if you'll go to synaptic and search for lowlatency you'll find what your looking for :)
[23:51] <Reaper50435> well that might work if it was installed
[23:51] <MrChrisDruif> Reaper50435: What installed?
[23:52] <xyclo> So I thought, but I cannot find anything newer than <IP_ADDRESS>.25
[23:52] <xyclo> And that is in another rep that I found and added
[23:52] <Reaper50435> synaptic
[23:52] <MrChrisDruif> Isn't it installed by default? (I don't have a clean system :P)
[23:53] <Reaper50435> no not with kde
[23:53] <jmarsden> Reaper50435: OK, try  apt-cache search lowlatency  instead
[23:53] <MrChrisDruif> Ow, I'm using Gnome :)
[23:53] <Reaper50435> as root
[23:53] <jmarsden> as anyone.
[23:54] <jmarsden> searching does not alter your machine...
[23:54] <MrChrisDruif> It's just searching, no root required
[23:54] <MrChrisDruif> But that about synaptic was for xyclo
[23:54] <xyclo> haha, I got it thx. I'll try
[23:54] <jmarsden> Oh, oops!
[23:55] <Reaper50435> ok it didnt do anything just went back to command line
[23:55] <Reaper50435> o
[23:55] <jmarsden> Reaper50435: Sorry, I was confusing you and xyclo
[23:55] <xyclo> Well, yes, I got the same info I get on Synaptic.
[23:55] <Reaper50435> jmarsden: its ok it happens
[23:55] <MrChrisDruif> I'll try to use nicks more when I'm helping more then one :P
[23:56] <xyclo> 2.6.32 is available from a repos I found somewhere
[23:56] <xyclo> not on the default
[23:56] <xyclo> I can follow Reaper50435
[23:56] <xyclo> ,
[23:56] <jmarsden> xyclo: So what makes you think you need a more recent kernel than those provided by Ubuntu?
[23:57] <xyclo> Well, Ubuntu does not provide the Kernel
[23:57] <xyclo> It's on somebody's repository
[23:57] <xyclo> sooo,
[23:57] <xyclo> I thought I'd get it from a reliable source, and as new as possible
[23:57] <MrChrisDruif> Reaper50435: Did you try unplugging your hardware to see if you laptop hardware works after that?
[23:58] <jmarsden> So why not just use a low latency kernel that does exist?  Do you have hardware nly a very very new kernel will work with??
[23:58] <Reaper50435> yeah still not working
[23:58] <xyclo> I am, very likely, going to use it
[23:58] <xyclo> I just wanted to shop around for a newer version before I plunge :)
[23:59] <jmarsden> xyclo: Going for "latest new stuff" for no good reason is usually a source of pain in the software world.
[23:59] <xyclo> I heard somebody built the 2.6.37 low latency
[23:59] <seidos> ubuntu comes with a kernel, but you can upgrade to a new kernel, but if you do that xyclo some packages may not be binary compatible.
[23:59] <seidos> xyclo: have you checked here: http://kernel.org/


[02:54] <swj> anyone here
[12:02] <lapo> hi
[03:38] <lassegul> hi people. Whats new?
[08:38] <dilomo> hello everybody
[08:44] <dilomo> what's up with the artwork
[08:44] <dilomo> I've been at the sea for 2 months and
[08:45] <dilomo> there should be smth new over here
[08:46] <dilomo> right?