[05:52] <barrydk> Good morning everyone
[05:59] <Kilos> hi barrydk  mazal  and all others
[05:59] <pieter2627> morning barrydk
[05:59] <pieter2627> hi Kilos
[05:59] <Kilos> hi pieter2627
[06:40] <pieter2627> oh Kilos, i read the guide, and like gremble said it is geared more to the organizer - although it does give one an idea of things that will need helpers
[06:41] <Kilos> oh
[06:42] <Kilos> we will have to hear more from inetpro  about the matter as i have no idea on what is needed and from who, pity kmf couldnt stay at the last meet to discuss it more
[06:47] <mazal> Morning everyone
[06:52] <inetpro> guys, just talk to him at https://twitter.com/kmf or https://www.facebook.com/karlfischer or https://plus.google.com/+KarlFischer
[06:53] <inetpro> good mornings
[06:53] <inetpro> you might even find his email address there
[06:54] <pieter2627> morning mazal & inetpro
[06:54] <inetpro> or just start a discussion on our mailing list, I'm sure he's even subscribed there
[06:55] <pieter2627> mailing list discussion seems good so that all are in the loop
[07:53] <Kilos> hi TinuvaMac
[07:56] <Kilos> morning superfly  inetpro
[07:59] <superfly> hi Kilos, TinuvaMac, pieter2627, inetpro, mazal
[08:00] <pieter2627> hi superfly
[08:01] <TinuvaMac> morning gents
[08:24] <mazal> Morning superfly, pieter2627, TinuvaMac
[08:24] <mazal> and who else did I miss ?
[08:47] <inetpro> mazal: me and many others :-)
[08:48] <Kilos> lol
[08:48] <mazal> Morning inetpro and many other :)
[08:48] <Kilos> dont ever miss the pro mazal
[08:48] <mazal> He's too undercover , always miss him
[08:48] <Kilos> h is a master lurker and smirker
[08:48] <Kilos> s/h/he
[08:49] <inetpro> ai!
[08:49] <mazal> What is a smirker ?
[08:49] <superfly> don't you worry, I'm watching him
[08:50]  * inetpro hides in the corner of the screen
[08:51] <Kilos> iirc a smirk is one of those know better smiles
[08:51] <Kilos> one that says im not blind im just ignoring you
[08:51] <mazal> Ah
[08:52] <inetpro> hmm...
[08:52] <Kilos> but actually he gets rather busy at times so he is forgiven
[08:52] <inetpro> Kilos must be thinking inetpro knows it all
[08:52]  * Kilos waves to inetpro
[08:52] <inetpro> thanks Kilos
[08:53] <Kilos> pro and fly are my favourites backstops when all else fails
[08:53] <mazal> Maaz did you learn to cook steak yet
[08:53] <mazal> Maaz
[08:53] <mazal> Maaz !!!!
[08:53] <mazal> Maaz is also a smirker it seems :P
[08:53] <Kilos> hes gone again
[08:53] <Kilos> oh no
[08:53] <Kilos> Maaz  ping
[08:53] <Maaz> Kilos: pong
[08:54] <Kilos> lol ya he is just ignoring you
[08:56] <Kilos> hmm... slot working
[08:56] <Kilos> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Membership/Boards#A22:00
[09:42] <Kilos> hi drussell  hows things there
[09:42] <drussell> Kilos: good! how's you? Happy Friday!
[09:42] <Kilos> good ty
[09:57] <magespawn> good day all
[09:59] <Kilos> hi my magespawn
[10:24] <mazal> Yum , now that was a lekker breakfast
[10:43]  * Padroni waves
[10:44]  * Kilos waves back
[10:46] <inetpro> hmm.... mazal has breakfast for lunch?
[10:46] <inetpro> hi Padroni
[10:46] <Kilos> lol
[10:46] <Padroni> hi
[10:46] <Padroni> long time
[10:47] <Kilos> ya where you been
[10:47] <Padroni> been so busy at work :/
[10:47] <Kilos> aw
[10:47] <inetpro> ai!
[10:47] <mazal> inetpro: yep , never too late for breakfast ;)
[12:38] <inetpro> Kilos: why so quiet?
[12:39] <inetpro> it's Friday after all
[12:42] <Kilos> hmm...
[12:43] <Kilos> well everyone is so busy
[12:43] <Kilos> and ive been looking at the html stuff again
[12:44] <Kilos> that link in my new site where the link to africa site is, i was thinking of making that link in large text
[12:44] <stickyboy> systemd++
[12:44] <Kilos> you like it sticks?
[12:45] <Kilos> just if it must be em or stronge yet
[12:45] <stickyboy> Kilos: Yah, I really like systemd.
[12:45] <stickyboy> Replacing cron jobs with systemd timers... w00t.
[12:50] <inetpro> hmm...
[13:27] <stickyboy> inetpro: you no approve? :P
[13:28] <Kilos> haha
[13:29] <stickyboy> Also, systemd has an NTP client. No need for ntpd (which provides a client AND a server) on a desktop (or most servers really).
[13:41] <inetpro> stickyboy: ai!
[13:43] <inetpro> stickyboy: so how do you do the server side for an internal ntpd server?
[13:49] <stickyboy> inetpro: Oh, this is for where I only want to use network time.
[13:49] <stickyboy> For providing NTP services you definitely need to use ntpd. :P
[13:50] <inetpro> ok
[13:52] <inetpro> it's about time that something as basic as the time is synchronised by default on any device
[13:52] <stickyboy> inetpro: Yah, indeed.
[13:53] <stickyboy> Without having the side effect of running ntp for the whole world to access on UDP 123.
[13:53] <stickyboy> (unless of course that is your intention!)
[13:53] <inetpro> exactly
[13:54]  * inetpro will have to look into the cron thing
[13:54] <inetpro> stickyboy: thanks for highlighting that
[13:57] <stickyboy> inetpro: I was just setting up my new Arch box and noticed systemd can do a lot of the things.
[13:57] <stickyboy> Like, I was setting up my usual cron job for system backups (rsync to USB disk).
[13:58] <stickyboy> And I realized systemd has timers... and they're more flexible than cron.
[13:58] <inetpro> interesting
[13:59] <inetpro> unfortunately  'systemd flies in the face of the Unix philosophy: "do one thing and do it well," representing a complex collection of dozens of binaries'
[14:14] <magespawn> inetpro but then you only have to look in one place, is that not a better way?
[14:17] <Kilos> wb Padroni
[14:17] <Kilos> oh 2 of you now
[14:18] <Kilos> hard day tail dragging
[14:21] <magespawn> home time chat later
[18:08] <Kilos> hmm...
[18:40] <inetpro> Maaz: hmm...
[18:40] <Maaz> hmm... is often used to try make others believe one is actually thinking
[18:41] <Kilos> hehe
[18:41] <Kilos> yup just sitting, not thinking as well
[18:41] <Kilos> too cold
[18:42] <inetpro> so do we have any winners in the chess game yet?
[18:42] <Kilos> nope
[18:42] <inetpro> ai!
[18:44]  * inetpro hoping that the community will be the winner
[18:44] <Kilos> yeah
[18:44] <Kilos> i want kubuntu
[18:45] <Kilos> 16.04
[18:50] <Kilos> inetpro  did you see my lekker hackegotchi ?
[18:50] <Kilos> hackergotchi
[18:51] <inetpro> uh, have you seen mine?
[18:51] <Kilos> my dogter slim ne
[18:51] <Kilos> nono where is yours
[18:52] <inetpro> https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/731268272/inetpro_400x400.jpeg
[18:52] <Kilos> heehee mooi man
[18:52] <Kilos> but those drawing things arent the true you
[18:53] <inetpro> it's just another Avatar
[18:53] <Kilos> and you dont even wear a hat
[18:53] <inetpro> :-)
[18:53] <Kilos> hahaha
[18:54] <inetpro> just a personal icon
[18:54] <inetpro> nothing special about it
[18:54] <Kilos> yeah i know but someone has to rag you
[18:55] <Kilos> otherwise you get too parmantig
[18:55] <inetpro> ai!
[19:00] <Kilos> night all. sleep tight
[19:00] <inetpro> hmm...
[19:16] <stickyboy> I want more systemd in my life.
[19:16] <stickyboy> I do I do
[19:26] <inetpro> stickyboy: why?
[19:26] <inetpro> hi alphad
[19:26] <alphad> hi inetpro
[19:29] <inetpro> alphad: how are you doing on this Friday evening?
[19:41] <inetpro> stickyboy: what else have you found that is so magic?
[19:47] <stickyboy> inetpro: systemd timers are cool.
[19:47] <stickyboy> inetpro: Also, I learned how to setup network bridges in pure systemd.
[19:47] <stickyboy> inetpro: Also, systemd-nspawn is amazing... fuck docker.
[19:48] <stickyboy> inetpro: Also, systemd-timesyncd is simple replacement for client-only ntp
[19:48] <inetpro> stickyboy: sounds interesting, have you blogged about it yet? :-)
[19:48] <stickyboy> inetpro: Also, systemd unit files are way better than shell scripts for daemons.
[19:48] <stickyboy> inetpro: Eventually. :P
[19:48] <stickyboy> The systemd-timers are easy to blog about, I'll do that this weekend.
[19:49] <pieter2627> stickyboy: what improvements do see in nspawn that beat docker - me also saw and only skimmed it the other day?
[19:50] <pieter2627> then there is also rocket
[19:53] <stickyboy> pieter2627: Well, let me rewind. systemd-nspawn isn't supposed to be a docker killer.
[19:53] <stickyboy> It's for simple containers.
[19:54] <stickyboy> And for like, developing systemd.
[19:54] <stickyboy> :)
[19:54] <stickyboy> As you can imagine developing an init system on real hardware is really annoying
[19:55] <stickyboy> Regarding docker, I just can't figure out how to use it for anything in production yet. I deploy stuff with ansible, I manage "machines" which have firewalls and packages etc... not sure how to use containers yet.
[19:56] <stickyboy> CoreOS scares me. etcd, fleet, JSON API all teh things, etc.
[19:56] <stickyboy> Amazing potential... but I don't have those kinds of apps or infrastructure.
[19:56] <stickyboy> Container performance is enticing though. VMs blow. :D
[19:58] <pieter2627> i also only started using docker 3-4 weeks ago - home server also 'crashed' and decided to redo the services using docker to learn it
[19:58] <stickyboy> Container security sucks too :D
[19:58] <pieter2627> VMs are too resource hungry for me
[19:58] <stickyboy> So it's "LOL". :P
[20:00] <pieter2627> yea that too, mine only binds on the internal interface... if that even helps
[20:00] <stickyboy> CoreOS has a better website than Docker. Those fonts, that color scheme. <3
[20:00] <pieter2627> haha
[20:00] <stickyboy> pieter2627: It's more about breaking out of the container than network stuff.
[20:01] <pieter2627> meaning??
[20:01] <stickyboy> I brought up a CoreOS cluster last year... kinda cool. But I don't work on that level yet.
[20:02] <stickyboy> pieter2627: Containers are supposed to be contained, isolated from the host OS. But they're not quite there yet.
[20:02] <stickyboy> Accessing the host. Accessing other containers.
[20:03] <pieter2627> too hard or to easy
[20:03] <stickyboy> Too easy to break out of container.
[20:04] <pieter2627> yes that does seem to be an issue
[20:04] <pieter2627> isn't LXC a bit more contained - don't know much about it either
[20:05] <stickyboy> Well they're all using the kernel's LXC.
[20:05] <stickyboy> I think LXC itself just isn't there yet, security wise.
[20:05] <stickyboy> Containers are fast though... man.
[20:05] <pieter2627> yea so the kernel is still 'open'
[20:06] <pieter2627> massively, for development they are great - can have a web server up in secs
[20:06] <stickyboy> I don't know specifics though; I just see infosec guys laughing about container security on twitter sometimes.
[20:06] <stickyboy> I gotta read more.
[20:06] <stickyboy> pieter2627: Totally
[20:07] <pieter2627> i also see the 'clever' peeps moaning in blog posts, but don't know enough to understand half of it
[20:07] <stickyboy> True
[20:08] <stickyboy> Aight, I gotta hit the sack. I spent 4 hours tonight fighting with SELinux.
[20:08] <pieter2627> same here, see you guys tomorrow (maybe)
[20:08] <stickyboy> Peace
[20:16] <inetpro> good night ...


[06:25] <mapp> morning all
[06:27]  * zmoylan-pi looks at watch... what time do you call this? :-)
[06:30] <mapp> just home from work:P
[07:19] <MooDoo> morning all
[07:38] <mapps> narcos is so good
[07:38] <mapps> almost finished e4
[08:07] <davmor2> Morning all
[08:11] <MooDoo> morning davmor2
[08:19] <davmor2> MooDoo: I got "forget you" stuck in my head this morning
[08:19] <foobarry> replaces it with "fix you"
[08:20] <MooDoo> :)
[08:20] <davmor2> foobarry: no that's the developers job I tend to "break you"
[08:25] <knightwise> hey peeps
[08:26] <davmor2> morning knightwise
[08:26] <davmor2> morning czajkowski
[08:26] <czajkowski> davmor2: howdy
[08:27] <knightwise> hey davmor2 czajkowski
[08:29]  * knightwise remembers he needs to update his ubuntu phone
[08:54] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Guacamole Day! 😃
[08:57] <davmor2> JamesTait: http://holysmokesbatman.com/tracks/holy-guacamole.html
[09:01] <JamesTait> davmor2, it doesn't need to be holy. Just good, fresh guacamole will do.
[09:12] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[09:15] <bashrc> morning
[09:16] <MooDoo> morning brobostigon
[09:18] <brobostigon> morning MooDoo
[13:19] <selinuxium> Hi all, Having a problam with an init.d script for an acient peice of odbc layer the work system uses. If I trigger the start command outside of scritp it works fine... But if I use the service to start it... Not so... Any ideas?
[13:19] <selinuxium> http://paste.ubuntu.com/12426680/
[13:49] <davmor2> JamesTait: Hang your head in shame, Yesterday was the 20th anniversary of the initial release of hackers and you gave us happy dot day ;)
[13:50] <daftykins> :D
[13:51] <JamesTait> davmor2, yeah, but "Happy Dot Day" is a bit less verbose than "Happy 20th Anniversary of the Release of the Movie Hackers".
[13:51] <davmor2> JamesTait: Happy Movie Hackers Day
[13:52] <JamesTait> I don't hack movies.
[13:57] <daftykins> Crash & Burn
[13:57] <leecowdrey_>  IMHO must admit most films/TV programmes are not worth the "hack"
[13:59] <Azelphur> Whelp this is gonna hurt my wallet, in one hour I'm going to buy 4 4k 40" monitors.
[13:59] <Azelphur> $2,123 >.<
[13:59] <daftykins> D:
[13:59] <daftykins> i hope they're IPS for that low
[13:59] <mapps> what the hell is going on
[13:59] <Azelphur> daftykins: www.ebay.co.uk/itm/191682277542
[14:00] <Azelphur> got a deal out of him since I'm buying 4
[14:00] <popey> oooh
[14:00] <Myrtti> Mr. Robot
[14:00] <popey> + VAT
[14:00] <mapps> bray properties,agents for apartment we were in for a year sent an email saying we need to get electric and water reconnected else we get £100 admin fee 85£ harge..WE'VE MOVED OUT..who leaves eectric and water connected when they've moved
[14:00] <Azelphur> popey: yea if customs nabs me I'll probably have an extra ~£300 to pay :<
[14:00] <popey> I doubt my laptop can even drive that display :)
[14:00] <popey> let alone 2
[14:00] <mapps> so they can 'clean' ...you have to get it cutoff to get connected elsewhere
[14:00] <mapps> argh
[14:00] <Azelphur> popey: putting 3 on my main PC (GTX 980) and one for the gf to use
[14:01] <popey> you're generous :)
[14:01] <Azelphur> amusingly £350 for a 40" TV is actually a very good price, and it's all round better than any TV I'm gonna buy anyway for her use case
[14:01] <popey> 40" is huge for a desktop monitor tho
[14:01] <Azelphur> popey: well, it's going in the office and we'll hook her xbox up to it and she can watch TV on it and stuff, want her to have something to do while she's here and I'm working :)
[14:01] <popey> nice
[14:02] <popey> great for that!
[14:02] <Azelphur> Indeed, and hook my laptop up to it too (GTX 970M) I imagine it could probably just about drive some 4k gaming
[14:02] <bashrc> a 40" monitor?
[14:03] <Azelphur> bashrc: 4 of them :P
[14:03] <bashrc> that would be great for flight simulators
[14:03] <Azelphur> hehe
[14:04] <popey> yeah!
[14:08] <daftykins> doesn't really answer my questions that ebay page, ah well
[14:09] <Azelphur> daftykins: maybe https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o553bTyFElQ will?
[14:09] <Azelphur> (Tek Syndicate \o/)
[14:10] <daftykins> eh, effort :)
[14:10] <Azelphur> hehe
[14:40] <Myrtti> my XPS 13 9333 really hates the 3.19.0-29 kernel, it seems
[14:40] <Myrtti> or something that's happened in the past few days updates
[14:40] <daftykins> seen tonnes of folk have issues with -29, over in #ubuntu
[14:41] <daftykins> seems one to be avoided :>
[14:41] <popey> Azelphur: that was an interesting video, pretty amazing display for the price
[14:41] <Azelphur> popey: indeed, I'm hyped :)
[14:42] <popey> heh
[14:42] <popey> i keep looking at my desk and thinking "I wonder if I could fit one on here"
[14:42] <Myrtti> I've rebooted twice today because laptop has just died
[14:42] <Myrtti> and returning from suspend, wifi is turned off
[14:42] <Azelphur> popey: haha
[14:51] <daftykins> i just caved and watched the vid too XD
[14:51] <daftykins> i'm fortunate though, i own no equipment that'd drive that res :P
[14:52] <popey> yeah, me either
[16:20] <awilkins> Another sinkhole in the Mancunian Way
[16:20] <awilkins> I drove over that bit on Sunday
[16:28] <diddledan> awilkins: yey
[16:28] <diddledan> awilkins: bumpy bumpy
[16:29] <diddledan> is it a full-on sinkhole or more a pothole?
[16:29] <diddledan> :-p
[16:37] <awilkins> http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/mancunian-way-hole-more-misery-10061622
[16:37] <awilkins> That photo is the original hole though
[16:42] <diddledan> oh wow, it really is a full-on sinkhole!
[16:42] <diddledan> that's amazeballs
[16:43] <awilkins> If you look at the Google Streetview pictures, they were taken the month before it opened up
[16:43] <awilkins> You can see the cracks forming in the road
[16:50] <shauno> so google broke manchester?
[16:57] <mapps> what is going on with my internet;[
[16:58] <davmor2> mapps: wibble
[16:58] <mapps> its super bad today
[16:58] <mapps> slow and oing down loads
[17:03] <davmor2> mapps: wibble
[17:04] <davmor2> mapps: without knowing the network you are on/the issues you are having it's kinda hard to judge
[18:14] <shauno> uff.  nothing more annoying than a server that doesn't finish shutting down
[18:17] <zmoylan-pi> shutting down a windows system to run for a bus only for it to say installing updates? :-)
[18:26] <shauno> nah, ubuntu saying it's stopping kvm and then ... ?
[18:27] <zmoylan-pi> copying files on windows and it stops at 99% for eternity
[18:49] <daftykins> you'd have to be quite the idiot with Windows to not know how to control updates :)
[18:49] <zmoylan-pi> well with w10 consumer version the choice is made for you
[18:50] <daftykins> not quite, still get prompted when you want to restart
[18:50] <daftykins> so another bit of FUD spreading there Mr. zmoylan-pi :P
[18:50] <zmoylan-pi> deciding when to restart makes all the difference :-)
[18:51] <daftykins> yep invalidates your above claim
[18:51] <daftykins> but prior versions still had far greater control
[18:52] <daftykins> of course we haven't even touched on dependency hell and package messes the likes of #ubuntu get themselves into :D
[18:52] <zmoylan-pi> prior version had better controls.  but most people left if on auto and found their systems brought down w10 update even if they never planned to install it
[18:52] <daftykins> but i can be reasonable there, accepting it's mostly new users fiddling with PPAs
[18:53] <zmoylan-pi> but after managing the dll hell of windows dependency hell on linux is a picnic :-D
[18:53] <daftykins> yeah see that claim is currently wordly very dangerously online, articles try to make out like it's doing it regardless - but actually if you read through the article carefully like i did, you see that the person did still run through the wizard and sign up to get the update
[18:54] <zmoylan-pi> i didn't
[18:54] <daftykins> which again is just clickbait
[18:57] <daftykins> now here's a real concern we can all get behind...
[18:57] <daftykins> can't believe i saw mince pies in the supermarket!
[18:59] <foobarry> is it possible to copy wii dvds? my skyward sword occasionally fails to read
[19:00] <foobarry> wnat to save it before more damage occurs
[19:00] <davmor2> foobarry: if it will read you can surely just dd the /dev/sr0
[19:01] <daftykins> i thought they inverted the disc read, from outside to in?
[19:02] <daftykins> if it's already started playing up you're probably knackered
[19:03] <foobarry> there's some scratches
[19:04] <zmoylan-pi> and i've seen the selection boxes appear in supermarkets too but it is now 100 days to christmas i think
[19:04] <daftykins> :(
[19:05] <zmoylan-pi> so once halloween/guy fawkes* is over the crimbo carols will be blasted at you 24x7 *delete as applicable
[19:09] <foobarry> Wii discs are not exactly DVDs. Nintendo uses a special format that is based on the DVD specifications called RVL-006, most PC DVD drives cannot read this format.
[19:09] <foobarry> quote from interwebs
[19:09] <foobarry> n addition to this the original Wii discs usually have a BCA mark on the inner ring of each disc, e.g. a bar code. This BCA mark cannot be reproduced by a DVD writer and the Wii appears to read out this bar code. If the code is not present on the disc, the Wii won't accept the inserted media.
[19:09] <zmoylan-pi> most... so some can?
[19:10] <daftykins> well i mean you're not going to be able to copy a Wii game disc regardless without modifying your console :)
[19:19] <davmor2> foobarry: http://www.ubuntugeek.com/wii-backup-fusion-simply-to-use-backup-solution-for-your-wii-games.html you can look into this I guess
[19:23] <ali1234> willcooke: i just read your blog post and wiki page about the "big bug scrub"
[19:23] <ali1234> i think abusing the "opinion" status to mark low priority bugs is going to rub people the wrong way
[19:24] <willcooke> ali1234, where am I abusing it?
[19:25] <ali1234> "As part of the big bug clear up for 16.04 this bug is being marked as  Opinion.  While this bug is affecting you, and potentially others, we do  not consider it a priority for work and so it won't get fixed by us."
[19:25] <ali1234> you acknowledge that it is a bug which affects someone, but then mark it opinion anyway
[19:26] <willcooke> ali1234, good call, let me fix that
[19:26] <ali1234> i mean there's a whole "importance" field for that, it seems like a better fit to me
[19:32] <diddledan> evenin
[19:32] <popey> pip pip
[19:35]  * brobostigon just found a jem, metallica's black album.
[19:37] <ali1234> brobostigon: it's the trning point where they went from being good to being terrible
[19:37] <ali1234> many consider it their last good album, and many consider it the first bad one
[19:38] <brobostigon> i agree, i think its their best.
[19:38] <ali1234> it's certainly their most popular and well known
[19:38] <brobostigon> that as well.
[19:39] <brobostigon> for example. my opinion is, piper at the gates of dawn, is pink floyds best work, but by no means is it their most popular nor most well known.
[19:40] <willcooke> ali1234, fixed, or at least made more accurate
[19:41] <ali1234> willcooke: better, thanks
[19:41] <willcooke> ali1234, thanks for the feedback
[19:46] <popey> hey willcooke bug 1118648 is probably a dupe of that one you and I saw in London
[19:47]  * popey marks dupe
[19:47] <popey> of a bug I also filed :)
[19:49]  * brobostigon is also on his first week of not having any tobacco, and just using his nicotine vaporiser on orders of his gf.
[19:50] <popey> robo-fags ftw
[19:50] <brobostigon> that they are, yes.
[19:51] <diddledan> the world is craycray: http://www.standwithahmed.com/
[19:52] <daftykins> well, 'murica specially ;)
[19:54] <brobostigon> so they have odd rules in the US as to?
[20:00] <popey> existing
[20:03] <brobostigon> ah,
[20:03] <mapps> hi
[20:04] <daftykins> lo
[20:04] <mapps> gibraltar is so backwards
[20:04] <mapps>  moving out so we cutoff electric and water estate agents say they want it recomected else we get a fine
[20:04] <mapps> they want it connected for 'cleaning'
[20:05] <mapps> when you move out you ALWAYS get utilities cut off so its not in your name..no?
[20:06] <ali1234> you don't get it dosconnected, you just inform the electric company you are moving out and ask for a final bill
[20:06] <daftykins> just take values and call with final personally
[20:06] <mapps> well
[20:06] <mapps> when i moved in i had to get it 'connected'
[20:06] <mapps> and pai £60 for electric an £30 for water
[20:07] <mapps> and im moving tomorrow right and i took the previous tenants forms for disconnection and i had to pay again to be reconnected
[20:07] <mapps> thats how they do it here it seems
[20:07] <ali1234> one time i lived in a rented flat with a pre pay gas meter
[20:07] <ali1234> when we moved in the landlord gave us the card
[20:07] <ali1234> few days later the gas man came and read the meter, which it turned out had like £100 of debt on it
[20:08] <ali1234> told us to "just pay it" and we'd get a refund when the account was switched over to our name
[20:08] <ali1234> luckily i didn't believe a word of it
[20:08] <ali1234> 6 months later they switched it over, no refund
[20:08] <mapps> and the girl moved out monday..form said cutoff date 14th september (monday) my start date 17Th, i handed our forms in to disconnect our old place on 17th - and they say we were meant to leave it connected, surely this is utter garbage -- look at what i said..i had to pay to be connected when we moved in and i had to pay for the new place
[20:09] <ali1234> but luckily i had refused to put any money on the thing after we found out how much debt their was, so they only owed us like £10
[20:09] <ali1234> did have to go 6 months without gas though
[20:09] <mapps> what a pain
[20:09] <ali1234> we got a camping stove
[20:09] <mapps> people always lie and scam
[20:09] <ali1234> it was actually cheaper to buy the cans of gas than to put money on the meter
[20:09] <mapps> but seriously see the above when we moved here we paid to get elec/water connected after prev tenant moved..and again i had to pay for new apartment
[20:10] <shauno> we had an odd one when they figured out I'd been paying upstairs' electricity, and he'd been paying mine
[20:10] <mapps> so why would we leave it on when we moved?
[20:10] <mapps> ll
[20:10] <ali1234> well you're in gib so the law probably doesn't apply to them, or they think it doesn't
[20:10] <mapps> lol
[20:10] <ali1234> hence they do whatever they can get away with
[20:10] <mapps> how was that shauno
[20:10] <mapps> yep
[20:10] <ali1234> i had another landlord pull a funny trick
[20:10] <shauno> the leccy co's 'solution' was to charge me everything I should have paid in 18 months, but promised me I'd get what I paid against the wrong account back later
[20:11] <ali1234> actually now i think about it, it was the same landlord
[20:12] <ali1234> the house was advertised at a weekly rent "plus 1 month deposit"
[20:12] <ali1234> and the way he calculated the monthly deposit was to wait not, it was monthly rent plus 1 month deposit
[20:14] <ali1234> oh i don't remember what it was exactly but it boiled down to taking the monthly rent, dividing by 4 to get the weekly rent, multiplying by 52 to get yearly rent, and then dividing by 12 to get the deposit.
[20:14] <ali1234> which is of course about 8% more
[20:15] <mapps> lol
[20:15] <mapps> so many peope up to little tricks
[20:15] <ali1234> i didn't let him get away with that either
[20:15] <ali1234> he also wanted 12 months of post dated cheques
[20:15] <mapps> thing is with this case with my estate agent, if i had t pay fees to get connected when i move in, why are they shocked i got it disconnecte? AND the girl moving out got it cutoff an i got it connected and paid again?
[20:16] <mapps> so it's the normal thing ? if they made me get it connected when i moved in here..and its not like im the first person there...loads lived there before..same with new place getting that connected
[20:16] <ali1234> there is no "normal"
[20:16] <mapps> gah sick of gibraltar being so useless
[20:16] <popey> when i moved out of rented accomodation you just note the numbers on the meter and tell the company.
[20:16] <ali1234> if you were in the UK there's people you can complain to about this kind of stuff
[20:16] <popey> mind you, that was wales
[20:17] <ali1234> i always had to produce final bills to get my deposit back
[20:17] <shauno> the impression I get of most the med, is that if you're not bribing someone, you're doing it wrong.  and will continue to do it wrong, even if you follow instructions
[20:17] <ali1234> one time it took me nearly a year to get a final bill from the water company because of a dispute, which once again i did not let them get away with
[20:17] <ali1234> i think i've told that story before though so i won't bore everyone
[20:18] <mapps> yea everything is slow here
[20:18] <mapps> tediously slow
[20:18] <mapps> parcel from the uk of mine sat at the post office in 'clearing' for a week
[20:18] <mapps> absolute nonsense its obviously been scanned etc when it left the uk
[20:19] <mapps> my bank account where it's taken 5 months and still haven't got it..but they said it's all sorted now...we shall see
[20:20] <shauno> I almost feel sorry for the water company.  they would have had no idea what they were getting into, when they tried to argue technicalities with ali1234 ;)
[20:20] <daftykins> i'd be wary about putting anything in an account that good :D
[20:20] <daftykins> shauno: :D
[20:20] <daftykins> ali1234: aww i haven't heard that one i don't think :D
[20:20] <ali1234> they said they read my meter, but couldn't tell me where my meter actually was
[20:21] <zmoylan-pi> does water meter use rfid?
[20:21] <daftykins> ooh that's a sneaky one
[20:21] <ali1234> and they said i used about 10x as much water as a normal family would, when i lived alone
[20:23] <ali1234> zmoylan-pi: this was about 10 years ago, so maybe. they did claim that the meter was inside the property, in a location that didn't actually exist
[20:24] <ali1234> they were like "our records show the meter is under the stairs" when it was a flat
[20:24] <zmoylan-pi> doesn't mean there weren't stairs or remains of stairs if house had been converted to flats
[20:25] <ali1234> sure, but that's not my problem :)
[20:25] <zmoylan-pi> my brother used to run drains unblocking business.  the amount of times he found people had concreted over access points...
[20:25] <ali1234> i had the ground floor too
[20:25] <mapps> daftykins id be wary getting my wages into this jok gib bank..everyone else gets paid..im stil waiting 'oh sorry we have a backlog' lol
[20:26] <ali1234> i scoured the whole place inside and out and could not find a meter
[20:27] <zmoylan-pi> they can be in odd places that people don't think to look.  but landlord should have been able to tell you
[20:27] <daftykins> :>
[20:27] <ali1234> yeah he didn't know anything about a meter either
[20:27] <ali1234> i don't think i have ever lived in a house with a water meter
[20:28] <zmoylan-pi> then ask a neighbour.  seeing were there's are might have helped
[20:28] <zmoylan-pi> *their's
[20:28] <ali1234> the eople in the upstairs flat also claimed to not have a meter
[20:28] <daftykins> sounds like a water co trying to make a quick few bob from a lack of dispute
[20:29] <zmoylan-pi> sounds like it
[20:29] <daftykins> i've got fixed rates here based on my properties TRP value, i've heard some people that convert to meters end up paying more
[20:29] <ali1234> nah... probably just a computer snafu
[20:29] <daftykins> i pay about £105 a quarter
[20:31] <shauno> I'm meant to be getting a meter, I think.  but I've had no mail about it, and I'm not inclined to phone them and ask if they want money
[20:33] <zmoylan-pi> they try not to warn you in ireland when in case the protesters appear
[20:33] <mapps> having a meter works out better for single occpants i think?
[20:33] <ali1234> probably, when it works properly
[20:35] <shauno> well, we're transitioning from not paying charges at all, to meters.  so there really is no 'better'
[20:39] <Azelphur> Hmm, I'm trying to update Ubuntu 15.04 server edition running inside libvirt, it's hanging at "Found memtest86+ image: /memtest86.bin" during the update. Any ideas?
[20:40] <ali1234> that's the grub install script
[20:40] <ali1234> it's probably looking for a physical disk partition
[20:40] <Azelphur> indeed
[20:41] <ali1234> so just skip it
[20:41] <Azelphur> how?
[20:41] <ali1234> no idea
[20:41] <Azelphur> just kill the grub processes?
[20:41] <Azelphur> I think I'll give that a go, hopefully it'll continue the upgrade and I can always fix grub if it breaks.
[20:42] <ali1234> so i've got a question about libvirt actually
[20:42] <daftykins> server non-LTS! for shame :)
[20:42] <ali1234> i need to build and run a <IP_ADDRESS> kernel on a headless server which is on the other end of the internet
[20:42] <ali1234> i need to do that because i need the ext3 48 bit patch set to access a weird filesystem image which is 1TB
[20:43] <mapps> cor narcos is so good
[20:43] <mapps> 2 eps left.il have finished it tonight
[20:43] <ali1234> i don't want to install that kernel natively for obvious reasons
[20:43] <mapps> :D
[20:43] <ali1234> so what's the best way to set up a VM with that kernel when i only have ssh access?
[20:44] <Azelphur> ali1234: virt-manager is really easy, it can connect to a remote server over SSH and provides a piss-easy graphical way to control libvirt, I use it.
[20:44] <ali1234> interesting, i'll check it out
[20:44] <mapps> i recommend narcos to everyone, decent show..and i watch loads of tv;p
[20:48]  * daftykins noticed :D
[21:37] <zmoylan-pi> and some one seems to be flogging the idea of 8k tvs today
[21:42] <diddledan> \o/
[21:42] <diddledan> moar pixies!
[21:46] <zmoylan-pi> you can spot every hair sticking out of newsreaders nose
[22:07] <Azelphur> so going back to my original issue, any ideas folks? https://dpaste.de/3mky it's just hanging.
[22:07] <Azelphur> completely unusable apt :(
[22:15] <Azelphur> aha, workaround, GRUB_DISABLE_OS_PROBER=true in /etc/default/grub :)
[22:40] <daftykins> must be something it was seeing that it didn't like?


[04:41] <lotuspsychje> good morning to all
[05:21] <lordievader> Good morning
[10:46] <BluesKaj> Hi folks
[11:35] <lordievader> Hey BluesKaj, how are you doing?
[11:39] <BluesKaj> hi lordievader, fine here, and you?
[11:42] <lordievader> Doing good here.
[11:42] <lordievader> Anything happening today on your end?
[11:46] <BluesKaj> oh not much to do with linux, just some yardwork later
[11:49] <lordievader> Also important ;)
[11:50] <BluesKaj> yeah, the neverending tasks :-)
[14:13] <lotuspsychje> afternoon to all
[14:14] <BluesKaj> hey lotuspsychje
[14:14] <lotuspsychje> hey there BluesKaj
[14:15] <lordievader> Hey lotuspsychje
[14:15] <lordievader> How are you?
[14:15] <lotuspsychje> hey lordievader
[14:15] <lotuspsychje> great here, what about yourself lordievader ?
[14:16] <lordievader> Doing good here too :)
[14:16] <lordievader> Going to order some ram this evening :D
[14:17] <lordievader> Way too often that I run into the limit.
[14:19] <lotuspsychje> lol
[14:19] <lotuspsychje> lordievader: what brand are you getting?
[14:20] <lotuspsychje> kingston?
[14:20] <lordievader> https://azerty.nl/product/corsair/508195/vengeance-ddr3-16-gb--2-x-8-gb
[14:20] <lotuspsychje> lets c
[14:20] <lotuspsychje> nice deal lordievader
[14:21] <lotuspsychje> mobo supports how much?
[14:21] <lordievader> Bumps it up to 24Gb.
[14:22] <lordievader> 32Gb max: https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/P67SC43.html#hero-specification
[14:22] <lotuspsychje> nice
[14:22] <lotuspsychje> lordievader: does your system have ssd too?
[14:22] <lordievader> Since a week or so, yes.
[14:22] <lordievader> Had one from a previous laptop left around.
[14:23] <lordievader> After a while I put it in the server.
[14:23] <lotuspsychje> oh
[14:23] <lotuspsychje> would rocknroll with new ram :p
[14:23] <lordievader> Yeah, no worries with ram capping the vm's :D
[14:24] <lotuspsychje> :p
[14:24] <lordievader> So many things are ram hungry these days.
[14:25] <lotuspsychje> certainly for power users like you lordievader :P
[14:26] <lordievader> Perhaps...
[14:27] <lotuspsychje> i still got 2gig ram in all my boxes here
[14:27] <lotuspsychje> suits my needs with ssd
[14:27] <lordievader> 2G O.o
[14:27] <lotuspsychje> lol
[14:27] <lordievader> How do you live that way?
[14:27] <lotuspsychje> ssd power
[14:28] <lordievader> Yes, but open one browser and you are swapping.
[14:29] <lotuspsychje> i tweaked system a bit
[14:29] <lotuspsychje> swappiness, preload, FF cache= 0
[14:29] <lordievader> Could you pastebin your 'sudo sysctl vm' output?
[14:29] <lotuspsychje> starting up programs etc
[14:31] <lotuspsychje> lordievader: https://hastebin.com/uqewuwavan.hs
[14:32] <lotuspsychje> lordievader: bad?
[14:32] <lordievader> If you notice slow dir listing once the machine is swapping you might consider setting vm.vfs_cache_pressure to 50.
[14:32] <lordievader> And you may want to reduce the vm.min_free_kbytes setting.
[14:33] <lotuspsychje> allright
[18:45] <jim__> hello ?
[20:34] <Bashing-om> Rainy Thursday here . Good to be irc'n :)
[20:34] <Bashing-om> Location: Heber Springs, AR ~ Cond: 90°F (32°C), Haze ~ Atmo: 55%, 6.0 mi (9.7 km), 30.03 in (1017 mb) ~ Wind: 9 mph (14 km/h), W, N/A°F (N/A°C) ~ Time: 15:15


[01:15] <vychune> hey guys got a question
[01:18] <chibihogoshino> vychune: do you still have one ?
[01:18] <vychune> new one lol
[01:19] <chibihogoshino> what is it
[01:19] <vychune> im getting a destination host unreachable error
[01:19] <chibihogoshino> for what site ?
[01:20] <vychune> i cant see what im pinging witch is a comp
[01:20] <vychune> but it see me but cant access me
[01:21] <chibihogoshino> are they on the same network ?
[01:21] <vychune> yes
[01:21] <chibihogoshino> connected to the same router ?
[01:21] <vychune> tracert says its not even getting of my system
[01:23] <chibihogoshino> wifi or ethernet ?
[01:24] <vychune> wifi
[01:24] <vychune> hotspot
[01:25] <chibihogoshino> did you reset the route ?
[01:25] <chibihogoshino> are the gateways the same ?
[01:25] <vychune> nope
[01:26] <vychune> yes
[01:26] <chibihogoshino> heh
[01:26] <chibihogoshino> netmask
[01:26] <chibihogoshino> ?
[01:27] <vychune> <IP_ADDRESS>
[01:27] <chibihogoshino> both the same ?
[01:27] <vychune> yep
[01:27] <chibihogoshino> are they running a firewall ?
[01:29] <vychune> not anymore
[01:29] <vychune> lol
[01:30] <chibihogoshino> ahh
[01:30] <chibihogoshino> so that was it ?
[01:31] <vychune> nope
[01:31] <chibihogoshino> hmm
[01:32] <vychune> gtg i gotta clock out
[01:32] <chibihogoshino> peace
[01:32] <vychune> thanks man
[01:32] <chibihogoshino> n/p sorry i couldnt help
[02:58] <linuxman410> wrst u here
[11:21] <chibihogoshino> anyone having problems with the internet ?
[11:58] <cyberanger> chibihogoshino: like what?
[11:58] <chibihogoshino> i have a ping time of around 9000ms
[11:59] <cyberanger> pinging what?
[11:59] <chibihogoshino> but its internal too.. so i think i have something up with the network
[11:59] <chibihogoshino> google is 9000ms
[11:59] <chibihogoshino> <IP_ADDRESS> is 4000ms
[11:59] <cyberanger> I was seeing something odd with youtube, lan here is fine
[12:00] <chibihogoshino> im getting around 4% packet loss with the lan
[12:02] <cyberanger> something in your lan is the issue for sure
[12:02] <cyberanger> but maryville charter might be having issues
[12:03] <cyberanger> or something upstream in the metro knoxville area
[12:03] <cyberanger> but your numbers are way above that for your lan
[12:04] <chibihogoshino> yeah 4000ms is a bit long
[12:04] <chibihogoshino> i turned on qos so that might help if someone is downloading
[12:04] <chibihogoshino> reset the router and it seams better now
[12:06] <cyberanger> can you try youtube?
[12:06] <cyberanger> my issue was mutiple pages loading way too slow
[12:07] <cyberanger> and youtube made it clear it wasn't realistic, since i've had it load faster at 512k and less
[12:07] <chibihogoshino> its around 126k
[12:08] <cyberanger> your connectin , is that normal
[12:08] <chibihogoshino> yeah
[12:08] <chibihogoshino> it never goes that fast
[12:08] <chibihogoshino> goes must faster than 150 - 200k
[12:08] <chibihogoshino> much
[12:09] <cyberanger> (for the time of day, err night, it was going slower than usual, and when I said 512k, I meant my celluar cards)
[12:09] <cyberanger> and the line here, 6mbps is minimum plan
[12:09] <chibihogoshino> ah
[12:10] <cyberanger> I'm the only one in the neighbourhood I'd bet up then
[12:11] <chibihogoshino> did you check ?
[12:12] <cyberanger> and I've seen much better connections here at christmas, whole family on and I'm the heavy user
[12:12] <cyberanger> sorta checked, small neighbourhood, predictable routines
[12:13] <chibihogoshino> maybe they turned on extra routers
[12:14] <cyberanger> they being charter?
[12:15] <chibihogoshino> yeah
[12:15] <cyberanger> that makes no sense, in terms of downgrading the quality
[12:16] <chibihogoshino> i meant around xmas
[12:16] <cyberanger> this is rual for 20 miles, quality is consistant
[12:17] <cyberanger> if they did any upgrades, they'd keep them in place
[12:17] <chibihogoshino> i guess
[12:20] <cyberanger> well, this area seems to be expanding some over the years
[12:21] <cyberanger> cable gets replaced or patched often enough, I'd bet they'd be near capicaty
[12:21] <cyberanger> not to metion, an upgrade for a holiday alone isn't smart for someone charter's size
[12:22] <cyberanger> we had family in town, but others were out of town with family, more or less balances out
[12:22] <chibihogoshino> ah ..yeah didnt think about people leaving
[12:26] <cyberanger> might need to check the gear here, but lan seems fine
[12:26] <cyberanger> perhaps the old modem
[12:33] <wrst> good morning :)
[12:34] <chibihogoshino> morning wrst
[12:43] <wrst> how are you doing chibihogoshino?
[12:44] <chibihogoshino> ok
[12:45] <wrst> good!
[12:49] <chibihogoshino> anyone know anyone that would want a film processor ?
[13:40] <cyberanger> chibihogoshino: 35mm
[13:40] <cyberanger> ?
[13:41] <chibihogoshino> 35 - 220
[13:41] <chibihogoshino> the way its made it can do anything
[13:45] <cyberanger> shame, i knew  somebody last year
[13:45] <cyberanger> too late now
[13:49] <chibihogoshino> ah
[13:49] <chibihogoshino> its free
[13:51] <chibihogoshino> that sucked ..
[14:05] <cyberanger> chibihogoshino: until I'm back south in early march, I'll not even be able to offer
[14:06] <chibihogoshino> no prob ..
[14:06] <chibihogoshino> i just dont want to have to throw it out if i have to move
[14:08] <vychune> o/
[14:08] <chibihogoshino> eh ?
[14:08] <vychune> morning
[14:10] <chibihogoshino> moring
[14:12] <vychune> err morning?
[14:12] <vychune> lol
[14:14] <chibihogoshino> ok
[14:14] <chibihogoshino> that too
[14:14] <vychune> hows your morning going
[14:15] <chibihogoshino> meah
[14:15] <chibihogoshino> i cant find a rss script for xchat
[14:16] <vychune> why would you want one?
[14:16] <chibihogoshino> it would be nice to get notifications in the chat rather than a external program
[14:17] <vychune> hmm guess it would
[14:18] <cyberanger> chibihogoshino: that'd be a nice bit
[14:19] <cyberanger> but what if you had a rss reader with libnotify
[14:19] <chibihogoshino> i do buts annoying
[14:19] <chibihogoshino> i follow to many feeds
[14:20] <cyberanger> same here
[14:20] <cyberanger> thus I just check it for an hour a day
[14:20] <vychune> lol
[14:21] <cyberanger> and on the weekends I spend more time playing catch up
[14:21] <cyberanger> if needed
[14:21] <cyberanger> old habits, they die hard
[14:21] <chibihogoshino> getting a feed update specific to a irc channel is what im looking for
[14:22] <cyberanger> chibihogoshino: so are you wanting a bot to spit it into the channel then?
[14:22] <chibihogoshino> that could work
[14:23] <cyberanger> or a msg to you?
[14:23] <chibihogoshino> well if it was a message in the channel then everyone would see it and that would be better
[14:23] <chibihogoshino> like ubuntu updates and linux news
[14:24] <cyberanger> not if it pisses off members of the channel, thus why I asked, for clarification
[14:24] <chibihogoshino> no one would care
[14:25] <vychune> you could do something like !feed
[14:25] <cyberanger> well, different suggestion for different answer
[14:25] <cyberanger> I'd see what bots are easily able to do that
[14:26] <chibihogoshino> yeah but i cant run one
[14:26] <cyberanger> why?
[14:27] <cyberanger> you can run xchat, bot shouldn't differ
[14:27] <chibihogoshino> the only computer i have is this one and its not on all the time
[14:28] <chibihogoshino> well i guess its on allot but if i have to take it out of the house it would take the bot too
[14:28] <cyberanger> thus an xchat plugin isn't any different
[14:29] <chibihogoshino> yeah but i was looking for a local update and not message into the channel
[14:29] <cyberanger> a bit of an issue
[14:29] <cyberanger> ah
[14:29] <vychune> oh
[14:29] <chibihogoshino> i didnt even think of that till you said it
[14:31] <cyberanger> chibihogoshino: a plugin for what your needing, unlikely
[14:31] <cyberanger> since most would just use libnotify
[14:32] <vychune> go to omgubuntu and get the news ticker
[14:33] <chibihogoshino> that isnt that helpfull tho since the notifications go away
[14:33] <cyberanger> and your issue with your bot is true, but if you sidestep it, by only msg'ing you, then it'll be offline when you are
[14:33] <chibihogoshino> vychune: i have that in my rss reader
[14:33] <vychune> oh
[14:33] <chibihogoshino> im not really looking for a bot tho
[14:35] <cyberanger> chibihogoshino: I understand, just don't see many options for your exact criteria
[14:35] <cyberanger> and that is dead on
[14:35] <chibihogoshino> there is a rss thing for xchat but its in perl and i cant get it to work ..
[14:37] <chibihogoshino> ill just stick with what i have.
[14:37] <vychune> if it aint broke dont fix it
[14:38] <cyberanger> chibihogoshino: perl, ugh
[14:38] <chibihogoshino> yeah
[14:44] <Svpernova09> perl isn't too bad.
[14:44] <Svpernova09> it's like C on extasy or something
[14:44] <vychune> lol
[14:49] <wrst> wb techMiles
[14:49] <Xpistos> I am about to stick myu foot up this joomla!
[14:49] <chibihogoshino> heh
[14:50] <vychune> LOL
[14:51] <vychune> joomla is geting on my nerves too
[14:51] <cyberanger> Xpistos: I'd shoot it for you, but that'd be a waste of a bullet
[14:54] <Xpistos> A bludgeoning it is then!
[14:57] <techMiles> hey wrst. ty
[14:58] <wrst> Xpistos: ever considered drupal?
[14:58] <cyberanger> Xpistos: I'd prefer to debate it to hell, but would it follow the logic
[14:58] <cyberanger> if not, bludgoning it is
[14:58] <Xpistos> this is for a customer
[14:59] <vychune> oh god
[14:59] <vychune> lol
[15:02] <vychune> brb
[15:06] <Xpistos> wrst: do you know much about drupal
[15:06] <wrst> i have used it Xpistos, i haven however used D7, but i would say on a difficulty scale its more complicated than wordpress but less than joomla
[15:07] <Xpistos> Dude ... everything is more complicated than wordpress
[15:09] <Xpistos> wrst: We are thinking about doing a series of movie specials at Alt3red Egos instead of covering them for the main show. what do you think?
[15:09] <wrst> sounds cool Xpistos
[15:10] <wrst> yeah i guess so on the complications Xpistos :)
[15:10] <wrst> but drupal i think is pretty good but as all of them has limits
[15:11] <Xpistos> If I had any idea on how to setup drupal I would, but I don't maybe that will work for Alt3red Egos 3.0
[15:14] <wrst> Xpistos: its really easy if you want to do it in a vm
[15:15] <wrst> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Drupal  I would do the manual isntall
[15:16] <wrst> hello linuxman410
[15:16] <linuxman410> wrst hi how r u
[15:17] <wrst> pretty good linuxman410 how about you?
[15:17] <linuxman410> doing good i have five netbooks for sale ending today
[15:17] <linuxman410> and 2 desktops
[15:18] <cyberanger> going going and gone
[15:18] <linuxman410> yeah baby
[15:18] <linuxman410> cleaning house wife said too
[15:19] <linuxman410> i have about 7 towers going up in next auction all starting at .99 cents
[15:20] <linuxman410> last thing going is my shuttle waiting for parts for my mini machine to get here
[15:21] <linuxman410> then i get it together and sell shuttle
[15:22] <linuxman410> i have 2 netbooks with windows ce and one with android and 2 with linux for sale ending today
[15:22] <vychune> i want one
[15:23] <linuxman410> wrst did you and cyberanger get that
[15:23] <wrst> yes i did.... but well baby about here I am moneyless right now linuxman410 :)
[15:23] <linuxman410> vychune all of them on ebay
[15:23] <vychune> give me a link
[15:24] <linuxman410> wrst that is why i am selling them i am moneyless
[15:25] <linuxman410> http://shop.ebay.com:80/strange007/m.html vychune there is link
[15:26] <linuxman410> wrst plus i needed to clean out
[15:27] <vychune> strange007?
[15:27] <linuxman410> cyberanger what is the desktop you are running called the window manager
[15:28] <linuxman410> vychune you have a question
[15:28] <vychune> yes the nickname....why? lol
[15:28] <linuxman410> i like james bond
[15:28] <vychune> lol
[15:28] <vychune> ok
[15:29] <linuxman410> and i am a weird character myself
[15:30] <vychune> i see
[15:30] <linuxman410> i am just basically doing a clean out for extra spending money
[15:31] <linuxman410> the 701 i have owned for 4 years
[15:31] <linuxman410> it probably needs a keyboard and a battery
[15:32] <linuxman410> i used it and used it and then my daughter used it and used it
[15:33] <linuxman410> i am going to sell about 7 towers and load the rest with debian and give them away on freelinuxbox.org
[15:34] <vychune> wow
[15:34] <linuxman410> vychune i have gave away 49 desktops to date
[15:35] <vychune> cool
[15:35] <vychune> can i have one? lol
[15:35] <linuxman410> with monitors and keyboards i paid for
[15:35] <vychune> wow
[15:36] <linuxman410> i am giving away my old server it was a gateway p3 1ghz with 512 ram i run my ubuntu server on it for years it worked fine
[15:37] <vychune> cool
[15:37] <linuxman410> i have a p4 server now
[15:37] <vychune> how much for the tower?
[15:37] <linuxman410> finally was able to afford one
[15:38] <linuxman410> which one
[15:38] <vychune> do you run a site from it or is it  for something lol
[15:38] <vychune> the gateway
[15:38] <vychune> *for something else (where lol came from idk)
[15:39] <linuxman410> now it was a internal server so i could ssh into it and dump my files for back up
[15:39] <vychune> oh ok
[15:40] <vychune> so how much would you like for the server? (my ebay is suspended btw)
[15:41] <linuxman410> if you mean the gateway computer let me test it out tonite after work and i will get back to u on it are you in tennessee'
[15:42] <vychune> yes memphis
[15:42] <linuxman410> vychune will you be back on tonite
[15:42] <vychune> yep
[15:42] <linuxman410> i have to go to work noww
[15:42] <vychune> oh ok
[15:43] <linuxman410> talk to u after while
[15:45] <vychune> thats gonna be cool
[15:56] <chibihogoshino> http://news.slashdot.org/story/11/02/17/1429229/Microsoft-Bans-Open-Source-From-the-Windows-Market?from=rss&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Slashdot%2Fslashdot+%28Slashdot%29
[16:16] <orias> LOL
[16:47] <wrst> http://www.thinq.co.uk/2011/2/17/microsoft-bans-open-source-marketplace/
[16:49] <chibihogoshino> heh
[16:49] <chibihogoshino> i posted a link to that from /.  a bit ago
[16:49] <chibihogoshino> ms is crazy
[16:51] <wrst> ha chibihogoshino i'm a dummy meant to post that to another channel
[16:51] <wrst> sorry about that :\
[16:51] <chibihogoshino> sorry ? n/p .. heh
[16:51] <wrst> well guess that really didn't hurt to repeat that link
[16:53] <chibihogoshino> na
[16:53] <chibihogoshino> my link was a bit mangled
[17:07] <wrst> well chibihogoshino my brain is a bit mangled
[17:08] <chibihogoshino> heh.. thats normal.
[19:43] <Xpistos> man my home server running slow
[20:16] <Xpistos> Well ain't that about a bitch - news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20110217/wl_nm/us_iraq_usa_damages
[20:16] <Xpistos> http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20110217/wl_nm/us_iraq_usa_damages
[20:30] <Xpistos> where can I go to find out which hard drive has a better rateing a Western Digital Caviar Green WD20EARS 2TB or a SAMSUNG Spinpoint F4 HD204UI 2TB
[20:50] <chibihogoshino> Xpistos: newegg
[20:51] <Xpistos> So if they are both comp then the samsung woudlbe okay since it is cheaper?
[21:01] <wrst> Xpistos: i have used that same WD drive, but in a 1.5TB version, its good but the Green drives are slow
[21:02] <Xpistos> I bought the 500gb about 3 years ago and it has been fine for me. I liked the environmenally friendly part of it
[21:05] <Xpistos> which is the better drive? http://bit.ly/ecQUih
[21:05] <Xpistos> I am buying saturday
[21:10] <Xpistos> anybody got any clues to a good cable modem for me to look at or company cause I have to scratch this ubee interactive pos and get a straight cable modem
[21:14] <wrst> Xpistos: they are great if you don't mind the slow speed, in my server thats just a file server its not huge becuase the drive is still faster than my network :)
[21:14] <Xpistos> true
[21:15] <chris4585> Narwhals http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykwqXuMPsoc&feature=youtu.be
[21:15] <chris4585> lol great video
[21:15] <Xpistos> I would actually perfer, but since I am poh
[21:15] <Xpistos> or so poor I can't afford the "R"
[21:31] <chibihogoshino> this is really interesting http://www.broadbandmap.gov/technology
[21:35] <Xpistos> what is it?
[21:35] <chibihogoshino> its a map of the use and you can overlay internet services
[21:36] <chibihogoshino> cable modem, fios, fiber etc.
[21:36] <chibihogoshino> see who has what
[21:36] <chibihogoshino> and where
[23:39] <chibihogoshino> http://gnome3.org/tryit.html
[23:39] <chibihogoshino> if anyone wants to try gnome 3 out


[20:36] <fsociety10> hello
[20:36] <fsociety10> I need help
[20:37] <wxl> fsociety10: this is not a help channel. what do you need help with?
[20:38] <fsociety10> sorry my wifi is getting disconnected
[20:38] <wxl> fsociety10: this is not a help channel. what do you need help with?


[01:14] <EvilResistance> someone might want to watch #ubuntu, there's a potential bitching fest that would cause bad language fights in channel...
[01:14] <EvilResistance> i already called the !language flag twice
[03:33] <pangolin> tonyyarusso got a live one
[03:33] <tonyyarusso> pangolin: hrm?
[03:33] <pangolin> Argos
[03:34] <pangolin> never mind, just be being silly
[03:34] <pangolin> also with Desura being out of beta we could say the linux is for games now also
[03:34] <pangolin> s/the/that/
[03:36] <tonyyarusso> !desura
[03:36] <tonyyarusso> pangolin: ?
[03:37] <pangolin> hmm let me run to the store and I'll write up a factoid when i get back
[03:55] <pangolin> !desura is <reply> Desura is an application which makes it easy to install, patch and play games on all Linux and Windows distributions. http://www.desura.com for more information.
[03:55] <pangolin> ubottu: ping
[03:56] <pangolin> what!?
[03:56] <pangolin> why didn't that take?
[03:57] <pangolin> !desura
[03:57] <pangolin> interesting
[03:58] <pangolin> ubottu: desura is <reply> Desura is an application which makes it easy to install, patch and play games on all Linux and Windows distributions. http://www.desura.com for more information.
[03:58] <pangolin> thanks
[03:58] <pangolin> tonyyarusso: is that good enough ?
[03:59] <tonyyarusso> Maybe?
[03:59] <tonyyarusso> pangolin: So, does it make it so you can play Windows games, or is it a platform for people to develop games to compete against them?
[04:00] <pangolin> it is a steam like client for linux
[04:00] <pangolin> doesn't let you play windows games
[04:01] <pangolin> least not that I am aware of
[06:37]  * elky lines up a kick
[10:19] <vibhav> What random advice?
[10:19] <Tm_T> hi vibhav
[10:19] <vibhav> I use synaptiks on my laptop
[10:19] <ikonia> 10:17 < vibhav> Reikoku: sudo apt-get install kde-config-touchpad
[10:19] <vibhav> hi Tm_T
[10:19] <ikonia> the guy isn't using kde
[10:20] <vibhav> synaptiks will still work on gnome
[10:20] <ikonia> you didn't find out what he was using, you just suggested he bascially pulls in a massive ammount of kde desktop
[10:20] <Tm_T> that
[10:20] <Tm_T> "worksforme" ):
[10:20] <vibhav> no nono
[10:21] <ikonia> you've been told about this approach many times now and the team cannot moitor the advice you give people
[10:21] <vibhav> Snaptiks is quite powerful
[10:21] <ikonia> at this time you cannot be trusted to help people properly in the channel
[10:21] <vibhav> It will still work for him
[10:21] <ikonia> vibhav: so would installing fedora....is that an option ?
[10:21] <vibhav> ikonia: Do you know his problem?
[10:21] <ikonia> yes, his touchpad isn't working how he wants for "tap" click
[10:22] <vibhav> HE wanted to disable tapping
[10:22] <ikonia> yes,
[10:22] <vibhav> And Synaptiks has an option for disabling it
[10:22] <ikonia> yes it does
[10:22] <ikonia> it also installs half of KDE
[10:22] <ikonia> so to fix his touchpad you are basically saying install KDE into the gnome desktop
[10:22] <vibhav> Which the deafault Mouse Managment softare included in Ubuntu does not have
[10:23] <vibhav> I was just asking him if he wanted to compile it , but you kicked me
[10:23] <ikonia> I'm done - I don't believe you think through the help you give people, warn people of what's going to happen and you cause more issues than you help
[10:24] <vibhav> Installing KDE wont mess up his laptop
[10:24] <ikonia> asking him if he wants to compile it ???/ so now you're installing KDE dev libraries too, sorry no
[10:24] <vibhav> I knew what I was doing
[10:24] <ikonia> I'm leaving it there. Tm_T if you want to go through this loop again, your call
[10:24] <vibhav> sigh
[10:25] <vibhav> Is not this getting lame??
[10:26] <vibhav> hello?
[10:28] <vibhav> my advice was neither wfm nor random
[10:28] <vibhav> Neither it was dangerous
[10:29] <vibhav> 15:58 <vibhav> installed?
[10:29] <vibhav> 15:59 <Reikoku> Yeah, how do I run it?
[10:29] <Tm_T> vibhav: sorry, but I think we're back to the "I'll monitor and see if you can do things right" mode
[10:30] <Tm_T> and this time, I would also like you to pay attention what I'm trying to tell you
[10:30] <vibhav> But , its working for him ;There is nothing wrong there
[10:30] <Tm_T> vibhav: and if it weren't working?
[10:30] <vibhav> Then you had a proper reason
[10:31] <Tm_T> what would he need to remove to get back to the state before installing that?
[10:32] <vibhav> Which state
[10:32] <vibhav> He is still using gnome
[10:32] <Tm_T> the state before installing synaptiks, meaning, removing all the packages he wouldn't need which were just installed
[10:34] <Tm_T> vibhav: the problem is, it did work this time, although there would have been other ways that wouldn't have involved installing half of the DE he don't use
[10:34] <Tm_T> there's just no manpower to watch after you to make sure you don't accidentally ruin someone'
[10:35] <Tm_T> 's system
[10:35] <vibhav> The point is , my advice did nothing wrong to his system
[10:36] <Tm_T> vibhav: we've had this conversation several times now, so let's just stop now
[10:37] <vibhav> cmon
[10:37] <vibhav> My advice worked , and he said he would donate $5 to any organization of my liking
[10:37] <Tm_T> and from my point of view all that is irrelevant
[10:38] <vibhav> I know
[10:38] <vibhav> But it worked
[10:38] <vibhav> This means I helped him
[10:38] <vibhav> PROPERLY
[10:38] <vibhav> And not gave any random advice
[10:38] <vibhav> Which you told me not to
[10:38] <Tm_T> no, "worksforme" is not proper way to help
[10:38] <vibhav> its NOT WFM , why dont you understand
[10:39] <vibhav> Every other touchpad management program loses its settngs on a reboot
[10:39] <Tm_T> vibhav: for example, you didn't ask if he wanted to install half of the DE he isn't using, did you?
[10:39] <vibhav> THATS THE POINT
[10:39] <Tm_T> vibhav: you didn't look any simpler solutions or inform your solution isn't simple, did you?
[10:40] <vibhav> 16:09 < vibhav> Every other touchpad management program loses its settngs on a  reboot
[10:41] <Tm_T> vibhav: so for both of my questions its no?
[10:41] <vibhav> I did search for some other management devices
[10:41] <Tm_T> search isn't enough
[10:42] <vibhav> and I was going to ask him about KDE
[10:42] <Tm_T> too late
[10:42] <vibhav> which he was going to install
[10:42] <Tm_T> too late
[10:42] <vibhav> but ikonia kicked me
[10:43] <Tm_T> "I was going to..." doesn't suffice
[10:44] <vibhav> What if I ask him to join and gice advice on my solution?
[10:44] <Tm_T> no
[10:44] <vibhav> I mean a testmonial?
[10:44] <Tm_T> Reikoku: hi, how can we help?
[10:44] <vibhav> My soultion worked for you Reikoku right?
[10:45] <Tm_T> irrelevant
[10:45] <Reikoku> Yeah it sorted one of my issues
[10:45] <Tm_T> Reikoku: sorry, but if there's no further help you need from us, I have to ask you to part so we can continue with vibhav without distraction, ok? (:
[10:45] <Reikoku> OK
[10:46] <vibhav> so
[10:47] <vibhav> hello?
[10:47] <Tm_T> patience
[10:47] <vibhav> ok
[10:47] <Tm_T> the problem with you (still) is that you rush to help before you even know or care to find out the whole issue, or what the consequenses could be with your suggestions which you possibly just found with search
[10:48] <Tm_T> the key here is patience
[10:48] <vibhav> He gave the exact !details of the problem
[10:49] <Tm_T> vibhav: your solution did require some questions before given, like I tried to show you a moment ago
[10:50] <vibhav> But I researched for some time , then gave him advice/solution
[10:50] <vibhav> He asked the question on 15:38
[10:50] <Tm_T> that's not enough
[10:50] <vibhav> And I gave an answer on 15:47
[10:51] <vibhav> You cant expect one to research for half an hour
[10:51] <Tm_T> ...which just means you don't know, so you don't need to help with stuff you don't know
[10:51] <Tm_T> because you can very easily cause damage
[10:51] <vibhav> don't know what??
[10:52] <vibhav> but this DID NOT cause any damage
[10:52] <Tm_T> this time
[10:52] <vibhav> but instead worked for him
[10:52] <vibhav> So you have ABSOLUTELY NO reason to ban/kick me
[10:52] <vibhav> Kick me when I gave RANDOM advice
[10:52] <vibhav> Which I used to give
[10:53] <vibhav> ikonia is simply looking for reasons to kick\ban me
[10:53] <Tm_T> "I did search for it" doesn't make it any better, even if it happens to work this time if you don't know or don't care to tell what it will do
[10:54] <vibhav> dont change the subject
[10:54] <vibhav> The point is , It Worked
[10:54] <vibhav> For him
[10:54] <Tm_T> and my point is, it doesn't matter
[10:54] <vibhav> Why?
[10:57] <Tm_T> because you don't know, don't check, or tell the consequences to the one who you are helping
[10:57] <vibhav> This time I knew the consequences
[10:57] <Tm_T> vibhav: but you didn't tell
[10:58] <vibhav> ikonia banned me before i could tell  him about it
[10:58] <Tm_T> you should have tell about it _before_ telling to install something
[10:59] <Tm_T> hence "I was going to..." is way too late
[10:59] <vibhav> But it worked for him
[11:00] <Tm_T> vibhav: please, stop saying "but it did work this time" as it's irrelevant
[11:00] <vibhav> ...
[11:01] <vibhav> you dont seem to understand it
[11:01] <Tm_T> that it did work for him, this time?
[11:01] <vibhav> I twould work for 'n' number of people , 'n' times
[11:02] <Tm_T> vibhav: and every time you fail to to check and tell what they actually do install
[11:03] <elky> vibhav, By your logic, cops shouldn't stop drunk drivers from driving while drunk unless they first crash into something.
[11:03] <elky> I don't like that logic.
[11:03] <vibhav> elky : Crashing is Damage
[11:03] <Tm_T> elky: I was thinking of someone shooting with shotgun wildly saying "I didn't shoot anyone this time"
[11:03] <vibhav> While it did not do any damage , instead it worked for him
[11:04] <elky> sometimes drunk drivers make it home, too
[11:04] <elky> that doesn't make drunk driving ok to do
[11:04] <vibhav> It would work for 'n' number of people , 'n' times
[11:04] <vibhav> repeated
[11:04] <elky> the police stop them for a reason
[11:04] <Tm_T> vibhav: your advices don't hold that quality
[11:05] <Tm_T> not even mine
[11:05] <vibhav> What if , The driver only had an unopened bottle of an alcholic beverage?
[11:05] <Tm_T> vibhav: stop
[11:05] <vibhav> This is the same situation
[11:05] <Tm_T> it is not
[11:05] <vibhav> and why?
[11:05] <elky> vibhav, these newbies are putting trust in you, you know. they trust that your advice won't also have surprises, such as most of kde, that they didn't want and may not notice until something /else/ happens.
[11:06] <vibhav> It did not have any surprises , though
[11:06] <vibhav> Reikoku has helped several people here
[11:06] <elky> did he know *beforehand* that it was going to install lots of extra stuff? Did you check that he's on a system that has space for all that?
[11:07] <vibhav> ikonia banned me before asking that
[11:07] <elky> my eeepc 701, for example, would probably have run out of disk space
[11:07] <vibhav>  ikonia banned me before asking that
[11:07] <elky> vibhav, you'd already had him install it, why were you going to ask *after*?
[11:07] <vibhav> Noo
[11:07] <elky> you need to ask that *before*
[11:07] <vibhav> 64.4 MB does not get downloaded immeadiately
[11:07] <Tm_T> vibhav: it's too late
[11:07] <Tm_T> way too late
 15:58 <vibhav> installed?
 15:59 <Reikoku> Yeah, how do I run it?
[11:08] <elky> ^that means it was too late
[11:08] <vibhav> that is exactly 58 - 47 minutes after I was banned
[11:08] <vibhav> and apt-get tells you the amount of disk space to be used and download
[11:08] <vibhav> downloaded*
[11:09] <elky> so?
[11:09] <Tm_T> vibhav: you're rolling your responsibility to the user
[11:09] <elky> and if he had space then, but after downloading a few songs he ran out of space, or he tried to install something more important than synaptiks and he couldn't because there was no space left?
[11:09] <elky> that's what we mean by other issues
[11:10] <vibhav> I PMED him about that
[11:10] <Tm_T> vibhav: it was all too late
[11:10] <vibhav> The chat text you posted earlier was all Pmed
[11:10] <elky> you're supposed to ask *BEFORE* you give the advice.
[11:10] <elky> not after
[11:10] <vibhav> okay
[11:10] <vibhav> But today it worked for this guy
[11:11] <vibhav> so it could be a warning
[11:11] <elky> you ran out of those long ago
[11:11] <Tm_T> no, you've been warned and explained multiple times before
 BTW it will instal some KDE stuff worth 250 MB too
 thats fine , I have plenty of disk space
[11:12] <Tm_T> it was too late
[11:12] <vibhav> no
[11:12] <vibhav> I pmed him about that
[11:12] <vibhav> when I was downloading the stuff
[11:12] <vibhav> he*
[11:13] <Tm_T> before giving the advice on channel?
[11:13] <vibhav> the time he was downloadind it
[11:14] <Tm_T> vibhav: ok, this ends now, it's been explained to you multiple times within last 15 minutes that's way too late, yet you try squirm out of it instead of even trying to see what's the problem here
[11:14] <vibhav> downloading*
[11:14] <vibhav> Iknowtheproblem
[11:15] <Tm_T> vibhav: and I don't believe you have anything valuable to bring to this conversation anymore, nor do I to be honest, so I'll ask you to stop now
[11:16] <vibhav> 16:45 <Reikoku> The warning was irrelevant as I have qt4 installed
[11:16] <vibhav> :)
[11:17] <vibhav>  So the downloads took about 30 seconds
[11:17] <Tm_T> oh boy...
[11:17]  * elky huggles Tm_T
[18:09]  * genii-around slides Pici a beverage of his choice
[21:16] <Pici> The ban is only a few days old too