[02:08] <sudobash> so can i get xubuntu to work on a mac 233 256 mb ram?
[02:31] <BunnyRevolution> sudo, prolly
[02:31] <BunnyRevolution> sudobash: , prolly
[03:26] <fivehorizons> Can anyone tell me how to disable my wireless card, so my wired connection will initiate on startup instead of wireless?
[03:27] <Tu13es> haha, I was just going to ask the same question
[03:29] <fivehorizons> haha
[03:29] <fivehorizons> hopefully someone will have an answer.....cant find anything on google
[03:35] <fivehorizons> I have another noob question. When I set up Xubuntu it asked me for a username and password to set the system up. I used jashmore as my username. The password I gave automatically got set as my root pass also. So, when I log in, I am using my root password. Is this bad?
[03:41] <sudobash> potentially....
[03:41] <sudobash> but too tired
[03:42] <fivehorizons> ?
[04:03] <cleokat> need help ;-0
[04:07] <inazad> cleokat, what
[04:07] <inazad> which prob ?
[04:08] <inazad> cleokat, ?
[04:18] <VTBuc> hey
[04:18] <VTBuc> i'm having some trouble with abiword, can anyone here help?
[04:21] <cleokat> yup yup
[04:21] <cleokat> sorry
[04:22] <cleokat> Most beginer, you can have, I just installed xubuntu and the resolution is bad
[04:22] <cleokat> the best option I have is 800X600
[04:26] <Stroganoff> i've created an ubuntu install script based on icewm, if you're interested: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=4626969
[04:30] <fivehorizons> Anyone know how to disable wireless connection starting on startup??
[04:34] <cleokat> How can I get better than 800X600 screen resolution?
[04:35] <Stroganoff> cleokat: sudo dpkg-reconfigure -phigh xserver-xorg
[04:51] <fivehorizons> Can I get some help pleae?
[04:55] <inazad> yes
[04:55] <inazad> I can help you
[04:56] <fivehorizons> hey
[04:56] <fivehorizons> im trying to find a way to disable my wireless connection so it doesnt start up during startup
[04:56] <inazad> fivehorizons, hmm try "sudo network-admin"
[04:56] <fivehorizons> or to at least make sure my wired connection takes precedent over my wireless
[04:57] <inazad> do you have network-manager installed ?
[04:58] <fivehorizons> not sure, i think so
[04:58] <inazad> which manager do u have ? XFCE ?
[04:58] <fivehorizons> yeah
[04:58] <inazad> k
[04:59] <inazad> can I see your desktop ? printcreen ?
[04:59] <inazad> anyway
[04:59] <inazad> type in a shell --> "sudo network-admin"
[05:00] <fivehorizons> ok, it brings up a windows with Network Settings at the top
[05:00] <fivehorizons> it lists Wireless Connection, Wired Connection, and Modem Connection
[05:02] <inazad> k
[05:02] <inazad> does it have - in the box ?
[05:03] <fivehorizons> does it have what in the box?
[05:03] <inazad> You have a square before Wireles Connection and Wired connection...
[05:03] <inazad> a checkbox
[05:03] <inazad> its a - ?
[05:04] <fivehorizons> Right now, the Wired Connection has the check and the Wireless has nothing
[05:04] <inazad> ok
[05:04] <inazad> so
[05:04] <inazad> do Apply
[05:04] <inazad> or OK
[05:04] <inazad> and in the shell
[05:05] <inazad> do "sudo /etc/init.d/networking restart"
[05:05] <inazad> and then "ping yahoo.ca" to know if u have the net
[05:07] <fivehorizons> should it be downloading a lot of packets?
[05:09] <fivehorizons> The internet is working
[05:10] <fivehorizons> So when i restart, will the wired connection take precedent over the wireless now?
[05:24] <cleokat> thanks for the help, wouhou!
[06:57] <Rolcol> How do I change the system font size on xubuntu?
[09:33] <Muhammad_Saad> Hello, I have a question related to Edubuntu. I hope I can get an answer here.
[09:33] <Muhammad_Saad> Should I ask?
[09:34] <coldhak> don't ask to ask, just ask :/
[09:35] <coldhak> #ubuntu might have more answers though
[09:37] <Muhammad_Saad> I had requested Edubuntu CD from the free shipping service. It seems like the CD does not contain any educational applications and I will have to install them manually. What is the reason?
[09:38] <Muhammad_Saad> I have searched the CD but could not find a single one.
[09:46] <Muhammad_Saad> Nobody knows?
[13:11] <ere4si> hi all :)
[13:38] <prin> Hello! My "Startbar" / "Task manager-thing" has disappeared completely from one boot to another. I just turned it off, and everything was fine, and then I turned it on again, and the bar was missing.
[13:39] <prin> Is there some way to get it back as it was? Or, alternatively, where can I find the cfg file to delete/return to default ?
[13:46] <prin> Hi! I'm running xubuntu, and my "Startbar" / "Task manager-thing" has disappeared completely from one boot to another. I just turned it off, and everything was fine, and then I turned it on again, and the bar was missing. Is there some way to get it back as it was? Or, alternatively, where can I find the cfg file to delete/return to default ?
[13:46] <prin> Whoops.
[13:46] <prin> Sorry about the repeat.
[13:46] <prin> Was copypasting.
[13:47] <ere4si> hehe
[13:48] <prin> Where could it have gone ?
[13:49] <ere4si> if you right click the panel you can add it back
[13:49] <prin> No no, the entire panel has gone.
[13:49] <prin> Just forgot the name of it... and I couldn't click the name to check :/
[13:49] <ere4si> so there is no panel at all - top or bottom?
[13:50] <prin> No, nothing.
[13:50] <ere4si> the panel is the strip across the top
[13:50] <prin> Yeah, or the bottom or the sides - right ?
[13:51] <prin> "Where the apps go to rest when you put them down"
[13:51] <ere4si> :)
[13:52] <prin> Nothing there
[13:55] <ere4si> TheSheep: ?
[13:56] <TheSheep> ere4si: ?
[13:56] <TheSheep> prin: press alt+f2 and type xfce4-panel
[13:56] <ere4si> TheSheep: how do we get a panel back for prin ?
[13:56] <prin> Right, how do I run a terminal without the panel? I'm finguring I could just run the panel from the terminal
[13:57] <prin> Yay!
[13:57] <prin> And then make sure to "Save Session" when I reboot, yeah ?
[13:57] <TheSheep> prin: I thin just saving the new panel configuration is enough
[13:57] <prin> Thank you so much
[13:57] <TheSheep> I may be mistaken though
[14:01] <ablomen> yeah TheSheep is right, session saving is only for open apps etc
[14:56] <silentmind> is it possible to reorder the items on the taskbar?
[17:34] <chewit> i need help tweaking my pc, what processes could i get rid of which are running in the background
[17:34] <chewit> using system monitor
[17:36] <zoredache> all the services are doing something useful... but I suspect the first one I would get rid of is avahi
[17:37] <BunnyRevolution> what does avahi do?
[17:37] <zoredache> bonjuer networking...
[17:37] <zoredache> aka multicast dns
[17:37] <chewit> is it releated to the network manager
[17:38] <zoredache> somewhat, but I am pretty sure you can use network manager without it
[17:38] <chewit> i was also using BUM, the only things i disabled was NVIDIA drivers and laptop untilties
[17:39] <zoredache> if you don't need to print or create pdfs you can get rid of cups...
[17:40] <chewit> oh rite, well i need that
[17:40] <zoredache> !lowmem
[17:40] <ubotu> For installing on low memory systems, this page has useful information: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/LowMemorySystems.  See also https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/SystemRequirements.
[17:41] <zoredache> that might have some hints, but it isn't entirely related to what you asked
[17:41] <chewit> rite thanks
[17:43] <chewit> there really isn't alot ram difference between Ubuntu & Xubuntu, but i suppose, Xubuntu has managed to stay around the 128mb mark, but Ubuntu has not
[17:44] <zoredache> while a low memory system is part of the goals of xubuntu it isn't the only goal.  Trying to have a useable system is also important.  Which means adding other things
[17:46] <zoredache> Deciding where to draw the line of useability vs performance is very challenging.  The default choices are probably not right for everyone.  But with some work you can make it fit your needs
[18:32] <taza> err:wgl:X11DRV_wglShareLists Could not share display lists, context already created !
[18:32] <taza> DRM_I830_CMDBUFFER: -22
[18:33] <taza> I get something like that with a Windows soft that SHOULD work (under wine) and an intel card. Tips?
[18:33] <taza> The windows soft tries to use OpenGL, this much I know
[18:37] <taza> And oh, it also may cause random crashes. <3
[18:41] <TheSheep> taza: maybe try asking on #wine
[18:42] <taza> TheSheep: To me that sounds like a driver problem actually.
[19:00] <emdash> here's a puzzel: why does the size of the system font change when I switch between the free and non-free ATI drivers?
[19:00] <emdash> in particular, the non-free font size is larger
[19:02] <emdash> errr
[19:02] <emdash> smaller
[19:03] <emdash> window deocrations, buttons, icons, all keep their size; however, a terminl window large enough to be an 80x24 display with the non-free drivers is only about 70x20 with the free drivers
[19:09] <Ben_Cs> hello
[19:09] <cody-somerville> Hello
[19:09] <Ben_Cs> is TheSheep here?
[19:10] <Ben_Cs> in second thought cody-somerville i fancy you might know
[19:10] <cody-somerville> :)
[19:10] <Ben_Cs> is hardy going to have fusesmb preconfigured for windows network?
[19:16] <Ben_Cs> ?
[19:17] <cody-somerville> No
[19:20] <Ben_Cs> cody-somerville: why not?
[19:20] <cody-somerville> No one did it.
[19:21] <Ben_Cs> that's pitty. This is why i moved from the loved xubuntu to linux mint xfce. When reinstalled xubuntu several times had to reinstall network by editing files mostly each time.
[19:25] <even> anyone uses sabayon and/or pessulus with xfce?!
[19:42] <even> how can i customize xfce desktop to all users ?
[19:43] <cody-somerville> even, You can modify /etc/xdg/xfce4 files
[19:43] <cody-somerville> They're the default
[19:44] <even> cody-somerville: hm, so, where i modify the themes ?
[19:45] <cody-somerville> /usr/share/themes
[19:46] <taza> What would be my problem if I get
[19:47] <taza> err:wgl:X11DRV_wglShareLists Could not share display lists, context already created !
[19:47] <taza> DRM_I830_CMDBUFFER: -22
[19:47] <taza> (It's a wine program I feel has trouble with the intel display card. Arrgh.)
[19:52] <zoredache> !ubotu
[19:53] <ubotu> I am ubotu, all-knowing infobot. You can browse my brain at http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi - Usage info: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBots
[19:59] <taza> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mesa/+bug/149260
[19:59] <taza> This looks like my problem.
[19:59] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 149260 in mesa "wine-git/google earth crashes with DRM_I830_CMDBUFFER: -22 on Thinkpad X60" [High,In progress]
[20:00] <taza> Anyone know how I could dodge it?
[20:00] <jham> I just tried installing the 8.04 beta and somehow got the fonts to draw so small I can't read anything while I was trying to get my monitor resolution set properly
[20:00] <jham> Anyone know how to reset the font sizes (and also how to properly configure X for my monitor using the NVidia drivers)?
[20:02] <even> cody-somerville: no, i want make some theme default.
[20:05] <silentmind> thunar keeps opening files in the background, can I change it so they when they are opened they appear in the foreground?
[20:12] <zoredache> ubotu, what is your problem the last few days??  Is someone abusing you?
[20:21]  * Stroganoff slaps ubotu around a bit with a large trout
[20:42] <dr_dasos> i've been searching around but keep finding gnome stuff, is there a way to have different wallpapers per desktop in xfce?
[20:43] <zoredache> I am pretty sure there is...
[20:43] <zoredache> when you right click on the desktop you don't see an option so set a wallpaper per screen?
[20:44] <dr_dasos> not when i tried it earlier
[20:44] <zoredache> or are you talking about different workspaces
[20:44] <dr_dasos> yes, i guess workspaces
[20:44] <dr_dasos> how you have 4 default ones
[20:45] <zoredache> ah... you can easily have different backgroud per monitor  when you have a multi-monitor setup..
[20:45] <dr_dasos> i normally split my workspaces by what i'm doing, chat/IM, websurfing, etc, I'd like to have different wallpapers so theres another visual difference
[20:46] <taza> Okay
[20:46] <taza> If I want both evince and amarok with minimum depedency problems, what should I get?
[20:47] <zoredache> get evince and amarok
[20:47] <taza> (some other document viewer & music player?)
[20:47] <zoredache> apt-get install evince amarok
[20:47] <taza> zoredache: On *xubuntu*?
[20:47] <zoredache> dr_dasos: everything I read seems to say that wallpaper per workspace isn't possible on xfce
[20:48] <zoredache> taza: sure
[20:48] <dr_dasos> zoredache, ok, thanks, just wanted to know if i should stop wasting my time looking for a hidden option
[20:48] <taza> zoredache: I just said "with minimum dependency problems"
[20:48] <taza> I have 4gb of space
[20:49] <taza> The 150 megs worth of friends they'd bring... *shudder*
[20:49] <zoredache> is that space it asks for when you try to do a apt-get install evince amarok?
[20:50] <zoredache> on my system it only wants 42mb
[20:50] <zoredache> anyway if you want to install a kde application you are going to have to have the kde libraries installed.  There really is nothing you can do to change that
[20:51] <taza> zoredache: False.
[20:51] <taza> Are you on Hardy btw?
[20:52] <taza> 8.04 appears to be better packaged than 7.10
[20:52] <zoredache> oh, and what do you think you could do to change it?  Compiling it static wouldn't do much useful...
[20:52] <taza> zoredache: I don't think AmaroK is really dependant on "kamera" even if the ubuntu devs claim so
[20:53] <zoredache> taza: the package that you get from them is dependant on it... if you want one that isn't you would probably have to build it yourself
[20:53] <taza> zoredache: yeah, I know. It's pretty much exactly what I don't want to do
[20:54] <taza> I just wish ubuntu developers had brains
[20:54] <taza> I guess that's why they've accomplished so much. By totally and utterly ignoring even a shed of common sense.
[20:54] <zoredache> how do they not have brains?
[20:54] <taza> zoredache: Look at the 7.10 OpenOffice depedencies
[20:54] <taza> SOMEONE wasn't thinking there.
[20:54] <zoredache> they make choices based on what the majority of the users want
[20:55] <zoredache> the majority of the users these days have computers with large hard drives
[20:55] <taza> The majority of users don't want idiotic packaging decisions.
[20:55] <taza> And really, just go look at it.
[20:55] <taza> It's a mistake by someone who doesn
[20:55] <taza> doesn't really grasp the concept of "dependency"
[20:56] <taza> And/or was both high AND drunk while packaging
[20:56] <zoredache> taza: if you are so opinionated why aren't you submitted patches and bugs with suggested fixes?
[20:57] <zoredache> and the openoffice depends looks fine to me...
[20:57] <taza> zoredache: Because just having the competency and motive does not equal to having sufficient resources.
[20:57] <taza> And are you using 8.04?
[20:57] <zoredache> no, gutsy
[20:57] <taza> Obv you know zilch about packaging as well then.
[20:57] <taza> Because those are *out of this world*
[20:58] <taza> (note that I mean both ways - what openoffice is dependant upon and what is dependant upon it)
[20:58] <taza> Ah, gah, damn maxa.
[20:58] <taza> ESPECIALLY what packages are dependant upon openoffice
[21:00] <taza> Well, I'll give a hint.
[21:00] <taza> language-support-en is dependant on openoffice's translation
[21:00] <taza> ... and what is depedant on language-support-en?
[21:01] <taza> If you guessed "a lot of stuff that really shouldn't", you'd be perfectly right.
[21:01] <zoredache> so your complaint isn't about open office, but one of the open office components...
[21:01] <taza> No, my complaint is about the packaging of ubuntu.
[21:02] <taza> Y'see, these problems just don't exist on Debian.
[21:03] <zoredache> if you like Debian's packaging better why are you using xubuntu?
[21:03] <taza> I should know, I've used Debian for a long, long time. I'm using Xubuntu because of the recent packaging and hardware
[21:03] <taza> And because the Fedora rollup for my hardware is well, incomplete.
[21:04] <taza> * recent packages
[21:04] <taza> Not such a big fan of a system that is supposed to crash either, as I'd experience with Sid.
[21:06] <TheSheep> taza: install evince-gtk, it has less dependencies
[21:06] <taza> TheSheep: Anything like that for AmaroK?
[21:07] <TheSheep> taza: exaile
[21:07] <taza> Is that AmaroK in new clothes or a whole different player?
[21:08] <TheSheep> taza: a whole different player
[21:08] <taza> Looks good anyway
[21:08] <TheSheep> taza: amarok is a kkde app and cannot be easily divorced from it
[21:08] <taza> Hoo, 10mb
[21:08] <TheSheep> kde
[21:09] <TheSheep> ehehe
[21:09] <taza> TheSheep: Yeah, but Ubuntu packages every single other KDE app with it
[21:09] <taza> I want AmaroK and it wants me to get AmaroK with every single possible extra package and a few gnome packages too
[21:09] <TheSheep> taza: say, do you have installing recommended packages enabled?
[21:09] <taza> Not sure.
[21:09] <TheSheep> taza: because that will pull in a lot of cruft
[21:10] <taza> Where do I check?
[21:10] <taza> I have a default install AFAIK, but this is a custom distro so not sure
[21:10] <TheSheep> taza: in synaptics preferences there is a checkbox 'consider recommended packages as dependencies'
[21:11] <taza> Where do I check with the commandline?
[21:11] <taza> I can't handle all this GUI nonsense
[21:11] <taza> I mean, I use Aptitude anyway
[21:11] <TheSheep> taza: /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/*
[21:12] <TheSheep> taza: I don't know where aptitude keeps it
[21:12] <taza> I have a feeling aptitude doesn't try to be "smart" like that
[21:13] <zoredache> see the --with-recommends option in the manpage...
[21:13] <taza> I mean, yeah, ubuntu overall is bloaty, but still. There's some debian underpinnings in there.
[21:13] <Ben_Cs> TheSheep: is xubuntu going to have fusesmb preconfigured sometime? It's really frustrating to make all those steps and reboots each time i reinstall the system, to configure then net....
[21:13] <taza> A fully working debian install is... 400mb. A fully working ubuntu install... 2gb. And that's with Xubuntu
[21:14] <TheSheep> taza: it is bloaty, that's one of its design goals
[21:14] <TheSheep> taza: try archlinux or gentoo if you want something slim
[21:14] <taza> TheSheep: Hiring idiots, bloating for no good reason? :P
[21:14] <taza> TheSheep: Special hardware, only ubuntu has decent guides for it
[21:14] <TheSheep> taza: do better if you like
[21:14] <TheSheep> taza: calling names isn't going to help you in any way, you are aware of that?
[21:14] <taza> Doing better than the guy who packaged openoffice with english language support? :p
[21:15] <taza> TheSheep: I don't care tbh.
[21:15] <TheSheep> taza: then you are just trolling here?>
[21:15] <taza> TheSheep: Asking for lighter software and helping with config?
[21:16] <TheSheep> taza: no, the other part
[21:16] <taza> I'm not just trolling and I presume I won't find a) ubuntu devs who can't package or b) rapid fanboys in such a smaller channel.
[21:16] <taza> So I'm just voicing my frustration.
[21:16] <TheSheep> taza: I see
[21:16] <taza> Also, xubuntu default docs are in English. Any way I can get Finnish xubuntu docs in Mozilla?
[21:17] <Ben_Cs> TheSheep: ?
[21:17] <TheSheep> taza: if they are not installed with finnish language support, then probably there are too few Finns to translate them :)
[21:18] <taza> The whole OS translates into finnish nicely, just not the starting docs. :P
[21:18] <taza> I used to fix windows systems for dad but got busy with rl
[21:18] <TheSheep> taza: most of the translations come from the ubuntu project, xubuntu is much smaller
[21:18] <taza> so I stuck him a Xubuntu Alternate Install CD and he's learning that now.
[21:18] <taza> ... better than he did Ubuntu.
[21:18] <taza> Or Windows.
[21:18] <TheSheep> less to learn
[21:18] <taza> (ubuntu had the problem of being slowww on old p2 hardware)
[21:18] <TheSheep> ah, that too
[21:20] <taza> Mabbe I should just give him a Kubuntu alternative install next time
[21:20] <taza> KDE handles slower hardware much more nicely than Gnome
[21:20] <taza> I mean, icewm ftw, but there isn't an Icewmbuntu, especially not one translated to Finnish.
[21:21] <taza> (icewm is the uncontested king of fast easy-to-learn window enviroments)
[21:22] <TheSheep> taza: there is flubuntu
[21:22] <TheSheep> or how do they call it
[21:22] <TheSheep> with fluxbox
[21:23] <taza> fluxbuntu
[21:23] <taza> Permanent RC, no translations, locales horribly broken
[21:23] <mindframe-> Fluxbuntu will release with Ubuntu 9.04 Final Failure
[21:23] <taza> I think you're being a bit excessively optimistic about that.
[21:24] <mindframe-> :)
[21:24] <taza> Yeah, fluxbuntu has the smallest footprint but it's nowhere near finished
[21:24] <TheSheep> taza: that's how it works, the bigger the project, the better support it has
[21:24] <mindframe-> fluxbox would be nice one something like an eeepc
[21:24] <taza> And they ALREADY have a nazi op in their chatroom and it's a small project.
[21:24] <taza> mindframe-: Not so much
[21:25] <mindframe-> I like it
[21:25] <TheSheep> taza: be glad the ops were away when you started your bithcing here :)
[21:25] <taza> xfce works just as well, tho I'd LOVE ion-style split windows.
[21:25] <taza> I mean, xfce with split workspaces? Yes please!
[21:26] <Ben_Cs> TheSheep: no response to my question?
[21:27] <TheSheep> Ben_Cs: sorry, I must have missed it
[21:27] <TheSheep> Ben_Cs: no idea, sorry
[21:27] <TheSheep> Ben_Cs: maybe ask on the mailing list
[21:28] <zoredache> Ben_Cs: what steps are you going through to set it up?  Are the steps even generic enough that the could be doen automagically?
[21:30] <Ben_Cs> zoredache , TheSheep: i'll tell u the steps in a moment
[21:31] <TheSheep> Ben_Cs: maybe post them on the ml, really, this way you won't have to repeat yourself
[21:31] <Ben_Cs> TheSheep: i am just doing that :)
[21:32] <Ben_Cs> TheSheep: how it called, the ubuntu posting place?
[21:32] <zoredache> xubuntu-devel, or the wiki, or launchpad...
[21:33] <zoredache> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/xubuntu-devel
[21:33] <Ben_Cs>   TheSheep, zoredache: what i'm doing is: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=304131
[21:36] <TheSheep> ugh, it's unnecessarily complicated, I believe you can mount with fuse using fstab too
[21:37] <TheSheep> Ben_Cs: what happens when the windows servers are not available when you start up? Do you have to wait for timeout?
[21:37] <Ben_Cs> TheSheep: never tried it. my other pc with winXP is almost always online
[21:38] <zoredache> oh, that howto...  It sucks...  I perfer autofs plus a excutable mount-map
[21:38] <zoredache> and my mount-map script uses smbclient to go probe the netowrk..
[21:39] <zoredache> I really should document it one of these days...
[21:39] <chewit> need some help with my ati driver setup
[21:39] <TheSheep> zoredache: cool, maybe you could post it somewhere too :)
[21:39] <Ben_Cs> zoredache: yes, it'll be nice
[21:39] <TheSheep> chewit: the restricted driver manager doesn't do its job?
[21:39] <chewit> no it does
[21:40] <chewit> n't
[21:40] <chewit> currently i'm using the "ati", but i want to switch it to "radeon", but ever time i try it keeps reverting it back
[21:40] <Ben_Cs> well, thanks for letting me know, to look for easier ways.
[21:40] <Ben_Cs> i'm off
[21:40] <Ben_Cs> nighty night all
[21:40] <zoredache> Ben_Cs: check out https://svn.esd189.org/linuxdev/misc_scripts/cifs_automount/
[21:41] <TheSheep> chewit: what is exactly happening?
[21:41] <TheSheep> good night Ben_Cs
[21:41] <Ben_Cs> zoredache: will do, thanks
[21:42] <chewit> my card is an ATi Radeon 7000, i using the "ati" driver, but i want to change it to "radeon" driver, but when i do it, it reverts me back to the "ati" one. I'm using "screen & graphics" to do iy
[21:42] <chewit> it*
[21:43] <TheSheep> chewit: maybe you could use 'sudo dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg' instead, in terminal
[21:43] <chewit> ok, i will try that
[21:44] <chewit> whats 64mb in kb
[21:47] <TheSheep> chewit: you dont have to set the memory, just leave it blank
[21:48] <chewit> oh, alrdy have
[21:54] <chewit> thanks, The Sheep
[21:55] <chewit> i have the new driver enabled now :D
[21:55] <TheSheep> :)
[23:10] <mike_> sal ce faci?


[01:03] <axw> wallyworld: back, ready when you are
[02:03] <axw> wallyworld: lost you
[02:54] <anastasiamac> babbageclunk: ping?
[03:06] <wallyworld> axw: so i'm at the neighbour's house - the dick next door cut my internet cable
[03:06] <axw> wallyworld: :/
[03:06] <wallyworld> nfi how long they will take to repair it
[03:07] <axw> wallyworld: I'm instrumenting all the things. adding a prometheus collector for the mgo stats atm, have added pprof profile for sockets and sessions. about to run it and see if anything pops out
[03:07] <wallyworld> let's see
[03:08] <anastasiamac> wallyworld: what did u do to ur neighbour to have cable cut?
[03:09] <wallyworld> anastasiamac: hes a fool - he cut down a tree and let it fall across my cable - snap. lucky it missed the electrity connection
[03:12] <axw> wallyworld: I have a controller with 1 machine, 1 unit. getting ~10 mgo ops sent per second. they're not mgo/txn ops tho
[03:17] <wallyworld> interesting to see how many sasl logins
[03:17] <wallyworld> i'm looking at that atm
[03:45] <wallyworld> axw: data point https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju/+bug/1696739/comments/8
[03:45] <mup> Bug #1696739: mongodb reporting saslStart and isMaster as being slow <mongodb> <performance> <juju:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1696739>
[03:46] <axw> wallyworld: hm ok, interesting
[03:47] <wallyworld> doesn't really match with behaviour seen on site i don't think
[03:47] <axw> wallyworld: I'm seeing saslCmd ops regularly, with just 1 machine and 1 unit
[03:48] <wallyworld> hmmm
[03:48] <axw> wallyworld: also a lot of iterator start/stops
[03:49] <axw> wallyworld: that appears to be the way the txns.log watcher works
[03:49] <wallyworld> axw: in the last 10 minutes, the number of sasl logins increased by approx 130, idle system
[03:49] <axw> seems odd to start/stop watching a capped collection all the time?
[03:49] <wallyworld> yeah
[03:49] <wallyworld> same time socket login calls increased by 2000
[03:50] <wallyworld> the socket login calls are all pretty much lease and presence
[03:50] <wallyworld> and so of the 2000, 130 drop through to require a sasl login
[04:07] <wallyworld> axw: i left 2 more comments, i think we could target what presence does
[04:36] <axw> wallyworld: did you try already?
[04:36] <axw> making the presence change
[04:38] <wallyworld> axw: not yet, gathering info. i'd like to understand why there are so many cache misses; i need to read john's notes properly
[07:34] <anastasiamac> wpk: could u plz jump back into our standup?
[07:34] <anastasiamac> babbageclunk: ^^
[07:35] <wpk> I'm here
[14:29] <cory_fu_> It seems like this is from the initial AllWatcher response, which presumably includes the entire model, so I suppose it would depend on the model that you're connecting to.  But it also seems like we should consider chunking those frames; that seems like it would be safer for the controller as well
[14:29] <cory_fu_> Oops, pasted that out of order
[14:29] <cory_fu_> Regarding https://github.com/juju/python-libjuju/issues/136 I'm wondering what the maximum expected / reasonable frame size from the Juju websocket would be?  I don't feel entirely comfortable having no restriction whatsoever.
[14:43] <cmars> morning juju, can i get reviews of a model migration bugfix? https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/7478 https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/7479
[14:44] <urulama_> balloons: ^ this one is important for 2.2 :D
[14:53] <balloons> urulama_, so 2.2-rc2 is already invalidated, nice
[14:54] <urulama_> balloons: well, this got discovered yesterday during migrations testing
[18:30] <cmars> balloons, i'll merge 7478 and 7479 this afternoon after testing an actual 2.1 -> 2.2 migration
[18:33] <balloons> cmars, ty
[22:28] <cmars> whoa
[22:28] <cmars> i just migrated a model
[22:28] <cmars> what is this magic?
[22:46] <cmars> balloons, fix for LP:#1696828 has landed in 2.2, will land in develop shortly
[22:46] <mup> Bug #1696828: failure to migrate a model -- meter status "" is not valid <juju:In Progress by cmars> <juju 2.2:Fix Committed> <juju trunk:In Progress by cmars> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1696828>


[00:58] <attente> robru: possibly, i'd test it, but my system's a bit borked atm
[00:59] <attente> robru: actually looks like it well is
[00:59] <attente> thanks for the ping
[00:59] <robru> attente, no hurry, I'm using libreoffice draw instead of dia anyway ;-)
[00:59] <robru> attente, but if you get time I can help you test it
[01:00] <attente> robru, thanks for the offer, don't worry though, i'll take care of it :)
[01:01] <robru> attente, great, thanks ;-)
[05:42] <pitti> Good morning
[06:16] <darkxst> pitti, which parts of systemd are missing with the proposed logind migration?
[06:16] <darkxst> i.e does journal work? and I am guessing the system unitdir does not exist though?
[06:19] <pitti> darkxst: the init bits are missing, as well as the journal
[06:19] <pitti> darkxst: the systemd unit dir already exists, but it won't be used
[06:21] <darkxst> right, I think gnome-shell mainly just uses the session tracking, but gdm might be interesting
[06:21] <pitti> darkxst: I went through that yesterday
[06:21] <pitti> gdm is also just using logind
[06:22] <darkxst> ok cool
[06:30] <pitti> darkxst: btw, do you know about http://codesearch.debian.net/ ?
[06:30] <pitti> darkxst: this is just plain awesome to answer questions like that
[06:31] <pitti> e. g. http://codesearch.debian.net/search?q=org.freedesktop.login1+package%3Agdm3
[06:32] <Quintasan> Good morning
[07:07] <darkxst> pitti, nope hadnt seen that before, thanks :)
[07:47] <jibel> good morning
[07:49] <didrocks> salut jibel!
[07:49] <jibel> bonjour didrocks
[07:59] <m4n1sh> mvo: can you please review the software sources merge proposal?
[08:03] <chrisccoulson> ooh, this is becoming more and more regular now: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/133901866/buildlog_ubuntu-precise-i386.firefox_20.0~b4%2Bbuild1-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS>~mfn1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[08:33] <mvo> m4n1sh: checking it out now, thanks for the reminder
[08:34] <seb128> hey desktopers
[08:34] <seb128> mvo \o/ wie gehts?
[08:34] <seb128> mvo, good to see you are still around ;-)
[08:34] <mvo> seb128: can't leave my friends alone :)
[08:35] <mvo> I guess its ok to upload software-properties ? freeze and all that?
[08:36] <seb128> mvo, upload away, it might end up being in the freeze queue for a day or two but that's ok
[08:36] <mvo> hrm, bzr out of sync but looks easy enough to fix
[08:37] <mvo> seb128: cool, will do, thanks
[08:39] <seb128> mvo, doko ... not surprised
[08:41] <mvo> lol
[08:44] <seb128> mvo, some things don't change :p
[08:44] <mvo> I was thinking exactly the same ;)
[09:04] <Laney> morning
[09:37] <Laney> Anyone else finding that shutdown/restart just brings them back to lightdm instead of actually doing the action requested?
[09:38] <seb128> wfm
[09:38] <seb128> maybe a logind/ck sideeffect
[09:38] <seb128> you played with that right?
[09:39] <Laney> indeed
[09:39] <Laney> pitti: have you seen that?
[09:40] <pitti> hey Laney
[09:40] <Laney> hey
[09:40] <pitti> Laney: right, I'm fixing that right now
[09:41] <Laney> ah, excellent
[09:41] <pitti> Laney: logind currently asks systemd to switch to shutdown.target, which doesn't work without systemd
[09:41] <pitti> Laney: can you confirm you are running gnome-session from the PPA?
[09:41] <pitti> Laney: raring's should talk to ConsoleKit
[09:41] <Laney> yes, 3pitti1
[09:41] <pitti> Laney: I'll add a fallback to "shutdown" and pm-utils
[09:41] <pitti> systemd drops pm-utils completely, but I think that ought to be discussed first, so I'll add it back
[09:49] <Laney> probably for the best
[10:00] <pitti> ah, that's working nicely
[10:42] <m4n1sh> mvo: this merge req https://code.launchpad.net/~manishsinha/software-properties/add-update-after-repo-add/+merge/150185
[11:09] <pitti> Laney: FYI, updated systemd is in the PPA now
[11:09] <pitti> Laney: that should work with shutdown, reboot, suspend, hibernate
[11:09] <Laney> cool, I'll try it when it gets published
[11:09] <pitti> it is
[11:09] <Laney> ;)
[11:12] <Laney> so it is! /me dist-upgrades
[11:14] <pitti> I'm not sure if dist-upgrading will restart logind properly; can you have a look while you are at it?
[11:14] <pitti> (i. e. at the output, whether you see some upstart message about restarting logind)
[11:14] <pitti> Laney: ^
[11:14] <Laney> I don't see anything like that
[11:15] <pitti> ah, indeed
[11:15] <pitti> Laney: so "sudo restart systemd-logind" it is for you
[11:15] <pitti>         dh_installinit --no-start --name systemd-logind --upstart-only
[11:15] <pitti> that might have something to do with it :)
[11:18] <Laney> seems to restart me properly \o/
[11:25] <pitti> Laney: fixed my local package to auto-restart logind on upgrades now
[11:25] <pitti> Laney: I also tested suspend, that works, too
[11:25] <pitti> Laney: btw, do you have consolekit installed still?
[11:26] <Laney> yes; I thought I'd run as it will be in the transition period
[11:26] <pitti> right
[11:26] <pitti> Laney: does user switchign work for you?
[11:26] <pitti> (from the indicator)
[11:26]  * Laney tries
[11:27] <pitti> I have consolekit purged to see the fallout, and the options went away
[11:27] <pitti> locking screen and clicking "switch user" there, works
[11:27] <Laney> yes, seems to
[11:27] <pitti> I suppose the indicator talks to CK directly; so that's on my list to port
[11:27] <Laney> to guest account and back
[11:27] <Laney> loginctl lists four sessions now
[11:27] <Laney> three with seats
[11:27] <pitti> Laney: thanks; so that makes another undeclared dependency :) but at least it's on the "to port list" in the spec
[11:28] <pitti> Laney: you, lightdm, and guest?
[11:28] <Laney> yes - guest twice (once with seat, once without)
[11:28] <pitti> the others should be in state "closing", if you run "loginctl show-session c2"
[11:28] <pitti> on the actual session numbber, of course
[11:28] <Laney> yes
[11:28] <pitti> ok
[11:29] <Laney> well, one closing one online
[11:29] <pitti> that doesn't directly hurt, but it's a bit of a wart (on my list, but I want to fix actual regressions first)
[11:29] <Laney> ooer
[11:29] <pitti> "ooer"?
[11:29] <Laney> if I switch back to guest again I'm asked for its password
[11:29] <pitti> oh, your guest session is running still?
[11:29] <Laney> yes, I user switched back to laney
[11:30] <Laney> perhaps that's a pre-existing bug
[11:30] <pitti> Laney: yeah, didn't transition gnome-screensaver yet (I think that's it)
[11:30] <seb128> Laney, oh, you uploaded indicator-weather, can I complain to you about how broken that package is? :p
[11:30] <Laney> no :P
[11:30] <pitti> but either way, I'll see how things communicate there; I guess gnome-session stops telling CK about "switchign user" as we already migrated that
[11:30] <seb128> :-(
[11:30] <Laney> I added a session job to make its breakage less onerous
[11:31] <seb128> I wonder how it made it to the archive
[11:31] <seb128> the postinst is doing stuff like
[11:31] <seb128> xdg-icon-resource install --theme hicolor --novendor --size 22 /usr/share/indicator-weather/media/icon.png weather-indicator
[11:31] <seb128> wth
[11:31] <Laney> O_O
[11:31] <seb128> yeah, wth!
[11:31] <seb128> echo "Fixing incomplete weather icons..."
[11:31] <seb128> if [ ! -e "/usr/share/icons/gnome/22x22/status/weather-clouds.png" ] && \
[11:31] <seb128>     [ !  -L "/usr/share/icons/gnome/22x22/status/weather-clouds.png" ]; then
[11:31] <seb128>     ln -s /usr/share/icons/gnome/22x22/status/weather-few-clouds.png /usr/share/icons/gnome/22x22/status/weather-clouds.png
[11:31] <seb128>
[11:31] <seb128> ...
[11:31] <Laney> quick, find out who sponsored it originally!
[11:32]  * Laney didn't look into the maintainer scripts
[11:32] <Laney> I just thought it would be an interesting case for a job as it tends to randomly crash
[11:32] <seb128> https://launchpad.net/~andrewsomething
[11:33] <seb128> seems to be responsible for those postinst hacks
[11:33] <seb128> Laney, yeah, I like the upstart job idea, I don't like the postinst in there :p
[11:33] <seb128> it was added in https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-weather/11.04.10+repack-0ubuntu1
[11:34]  * seb128 goes to nuke that postinst and file some bugs
[11:38]  * Laney eyes the guest account's indicator-datetime and gsd gobbling a core each
[11:41] <seb128> Laney, cross ppas is going to be fun
[11:42] <seb128> Laney, ubuntu-desktop has versions of those made to use systemd-services rather than the old g-s-d's interface (which is dropped in the same ppa)
[11:42] <Laney> yeah ...
[11:42] <Laney> do I have ubuntu-desktop?
[11:42] <seb128> Laney, if you got g-s-d from logind's ppa it will probably break stuff
[11:42] <seb128> Laney, dpkg -l | grep gnome-settings-daemon?
[11:42] <Laney> I should probably disable some of this stuff :p
[11:42] <Laney> doing
[11:42] <seb128> Laney, dpkg -l | grep indicator-datetime?
[11:42] <seb128> shrug
[11:42] <Laney> it was a rhetorical question really
[11:43] <seb128> the indicator-weather do a "ln -s /usr/share/bla /usr/share/bla"
[11:43] <Laney> archive versinos of both of those
[11:43] <seb128> e.g symlink on itself
[11:43] <seb128> head -> desk
[11:43] <seb128> Laney, ok, dunno then, but it's likely to bite a few people, I hope we can get the MIR reviewed soon and stuff to land in the archive
[11:44] <Laney> both bts have g_main_context_find_source_by_id at the top
[11:45] <Laney> anyway I have some weird system so I won't worry too much until this stuff lands properly
[11:50] <Laney> ah
[11:50] <Laney> some apparmor denials in dmesg
[11:50] <Laney> [ 1884.171060] type=1400 audit(1363089002.042:1468943): apparmor="DENIED" operation="mkdir" parent=4087 profile="/usr/lib/lightdm/lightdm/lightdm-guest-session-wrapper" name="/run/user/123/dconf/" pid=4656 comm="indicator-datet" requested_mask="c" denied_mask="c" fsuid=123 ouid=123
[11:50] <pitti> Laney: yep, jsut fixed upstream
[11:50] <pitti> (in lightdm)
[11:50] <Laney> how timely
[11:51] <pitti> Laney: the BP has a work item for logind support for lightdm user switching now, so at least that's recorded, too
[11:52] <pitti> (it had before, but I clarified it)
[13:10] <pitti> Laney: FYI, if you change something in debian/control.in, you should run debclean
[13:10] <pitti> Laney: (just changing g-control-center deps, and your "Remove Recommends on gnome-online-accounts" is only becoming active now)
[13:36] <xnox> seb128: is there a new icon for the "Software & Updates" (aka software-sources ?!)
[13:36] <seb128> xnox, not that I know, you can try asking JohnLea
[13:44] <ogra_`> xnox, there was a discussion mpt triggered on the ubuntu-art ML
[13:45] <ogra_`> (not sure what the outcome was though)
[13:45] <ogra_`> something about parachutes :)
[13:45]  * xnox slowly backs away....
[13:45] <xnox> ... it's just an icon, it's sole purpose is to be pretty
[13:46] <ogra_`> parachutes can be pretty :)
[14:03] <xnox> pitti: gnome-power-manager the ver. string used is 3.6.0-1svn1 is that on purpose or accidental?
[14:05] <pitti> xnox: on purpose, as I committed the fix to debian svn and then uploaded that
[14:05] <pitti> xnox: i. e. that shouldn't stop autosyncs, and shoudl be an indication that the next debian upload doesn't need merging
[14:06] <xnox> pitti: right, well I'm about to spoil the fun with a -ubuntu1 https://code.launchpad.net/~dedunumax/ubuntu/raring/gnome-power-manager/bug-923292/+merge/148190
[14:07] <xnox> it's a trivial patch, not accepted upstream yet, but it's part of papercuts project.
[14:07] <xnox> trivial fixes to improve usability.
[14:07] <Laney> pitti: really? I don't see the dep here
[14:07] <Laney> I probably forgot to commit it though ...
[14:08] <pitti> xnox: well, it wasn't sent upstream :)
[14:08] <pitti> xnox: perhaps you could attach the patch https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=678115 while you're at it?
[14:08] <ubot2> Gnome bug 678115 in gnome-power-statistics "ctrl+w/ctrl+q shortcut for closing power statistics not working" [Minor,Unconfirmed]
[14:08] <xnox> yeah, i was about to do that.
[14:08] <pitti> Laney: ah, that could be it
[14:08] <Laney> like I guess I edited control.in; bzr bd -S (which runs clean); test; upload
[14:08] <Laney> so control never got updated in the vcs
[14:09] <Laney> that's one bit of the gnome team's workflow that I don't like
[14:10] <pitti> yeah, I trained myself to run debclean whenever I change control.in
[14:11]  * Laney nods
[14:15]  * xnox likes how update-maintainer learned to update *both* control.in and control
[14:39] <mterry> dobey, why are there two software center desktop files now?  They both are showing up in the dash
[14:39] <dobey> mterry: i have no idea. i didn't add any
[14:40] <mterry> dobey, OK, will bzr blame this :)
[14:41] <dobey> mterry: hrmm, looks like both the ubuntu branded one, and the unbranded one, are installed
[14:41] <mterry> mvo, ^
[14:41] <mterry> dobey, that would be fine, but they should have OnlyShowIn or NoDisplay or something so only one is shown at a time
[14:42] <dobey> hrmm
[14:43] <dobey> mterry: what version of software-center do you have installed?
[14:43] <mterry> dobey, 5.5.5-0ubuntu1
[14:43] <mvo> I'm on my way to the train, I can check in ~1h or so if the problem is still there
[14:44] <Laney> yeah I see that too
[14:45] <dobey> weird, ok
[14:47] <dobey> mterry: file a bug and assign to me (or assign to me if one is already filed)?
[14:48] <mterry> dobey, let me check if it's filed
[14:48] <psivaa> seb128: pitti: Is workspaces being disabled the default setting in raring? workspace switcher is not attached to the launcher by default.
[14:49] <dobey> ah there is a bug
[14:49] <pitti> psivaa: yes, it is; you can reenable them in the control cetner
[14:49] <psivaa> pitti: ack, thank you
[14:51] <dobey> meh, and package imports being broken is a PITA.
[14:52] <mterry> dobey, point me at bug
[14:52] <dobey> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-center/+bug/1153548
[14:52] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1153548 in software-center "Two icons in Dash" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[14:52] <mterry> ah yes
[14:52] <dobey> i'll fix it
[14:52] <mterry> dobey, thanks!
[15:21] <doomlord> can anyone comment on how hard it would be to modify expo/scale plugins
[15:22] <doomlord> i have some customizations in mind , multi-level zoom for "expo" (eg show 2x2 or 3x3) and/or would like to be able to show desktop thumbnails alongside windows in "scale"
[15:22] <doomlord> does that sound difficult to do
[15:26] <robru> doomlord, are you talking about compiz plugins? Install ccsm and you can tweak compiz plugins to your hearts desire... not "officially" recommended though
[15:27] <doomlord> i'm talking modifying source
[15:28] <doomlord> these features aren't there
[15:28] <doomlord> i've got ccsm
[15:28] <robru> doomlord, then you're on your own ;-)
[15:28] <doomlord> ok i just figure someone may have dabled with the source and could comment
[15:29] <robru> doomlord, oh yeah, tons of developers on here... but I've never touched compiz source myself, just used ccsm
[15:29] <doomlord> last time i tried.. i found out that compiz & ubuntu repos are different :)
[15:29] <doomlord> couldn't get it to compile & run
[15:30] <qengho> Meeting in one hour yesno?
[15:30] <Laney> indeed
[15:30] <robru> qengho, yes I believe it's in an hour. I was in a panic to wake up just now only to discover that DST has shifted the meeting an hour forward...
[15:51] <Sweetshark> launchpad, deal with it: "finding revisions to fetch 1/598878" ...
[15:58] <czajkowski> Sweetshark: stop breaking LP :)
[16:01] <Sweetshark> czajkowski: Ill do it very tenderly!
[16:04]  * mlankhorst hands Sweetshark a tenderizer
[16:27] <doomlord> the fact i couldn't even compile compiz plugins before isn't encouraging
[16:28] <doomlord> but i was talking to someone who didn't know the differences in the ubuntu repositories
[16:28] <doomlord> There are many ways to acheive what i want
[16:30] <seb128> hey
[16:30] <seb128> it's meeting time!
[16:30] <robru> hey hey!
[16:30] <didrocks> hey!
[16:31] <seb128> Sweetshark, qengho, chrisccoulson, RAOF, didrocks, Laney, kenvandine, mlankhorst, cyphermox_, mterry, robru, tkamppeter, attente, desrt: hey
[16:31] <Laney> greetings
[16:31]  * Sweetshark reporting in.
[16:31] <seb128> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2013-03-12
[16:32]  * kenvandine waves
[16:33] <mlankhorst> g'day mate
[16:33] <robru> seb128, you are all an hour late, what is going on here? ;-)
[16:33] <qengho> Hah
[16:33] <seb128> lol
[16:33] <seb128> let's get started
[16:34] <seb128> Sweetshark, hey, anything interesting you are working on? any output for vUDS? ;-)
[16:34] <Sweetshark> seb128: 4.0.1 in raring breaking the installers. fix is in.
[16:35] <seb128> \o/ for 4.0.1 (not for breaking the installer)
[16:35] <seb128> thanks for the quick followup fix though ;-)
[16:35] <Sweetshark> output for vUDS? like the next one? I could bore you with some upstream progress ...
[16:35] <seb128> no, the one from last week
[16:35] <seb128> for those who had sessions
[16:36] <seb128> I don't think you had any on libreoffice so no worry ;-)
[16:36] <Sweetshark> other than that trying to corner the remaining unity integration issues and work on tinderboxes and more automated testing.
[16:36] <seb128> but it would be good to summarize the things decided for those who had sessions, took on new work
[16:37] <seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
[16:37] <qengho> Hello my Pretties!
[16:37] <qengho> * New stable released yesterday. Averaging about 1 every 5 days lately.
[16:37] <qengho> * chromium-browser autopkgtests. built-ins and maybe webapps!
[16:37] <qengho> * add search reporting for canonical's accountants and lawyers. Search -> $$$.
[16:37] <qengho> * armhf bugginess.
[16:37] <qengho> * will learn all I can about various webkit upstreams to prepare for packaging.
[16:37] <qengho> EOF
[16:37] <seb128> hey qengho ;-)
[16:38] <seb128> updated chromium \o/
[16:38] <seb128> good work there!
[16:38] <Sweetshark> seb128: no, vUDS had no libreoffice specifics, except for heart attack by the 15g-turns in a oiltanker that is libreoffice-packaging affected by 'lets get rolling' -- 'nah, lets keep stuff as is' ...
[16:38] <qengho> Evefry damn week.
[16:38] <seb128> they need to keep you busy... ;-)
[16:38] <seb128> qengho, thanks
[16:39] <seb128> chrisccoulson, hey
[16:39] <Laney> he got swallowed by a webkit debug build
[16:39] <chrisccoulson> hah
[16:39] <chrisccoulson> - Made a lot of progress with Chromium crashing on arm (lots of intense v8 debugging last week)
[16:39] <chrisccoulson> - Firefox / Thunderbird updates
[16:39] <chrisccoulson> - Fixed an issue where certain test harness failures in Firefox (eg, the testsuite hanging) weren't showing up as failures in Jenkins, despite skipping half of the test suite
[16:39] <chrisccoulson> - Running tests in an almost proper session now (with gnome-session, gnome-settings-daemon and a WM) - this resulted in additional failures!
[16:39] <chrisccoulson> - Cleaning up some of the monster Jenkins integration patches as well
[16:39] <chrisccoulson> EOF
[16:40] <seb128> chrisccoulson, still not at the bottom of the chromium issue?
[16:40] <seb128> that's a though one
[16:40]  * qengho weeps.
[16:41] <chrisccoulson> seb128, i've got a pretty good understanding of what's going on now, but i had to put it to one side yesterday to take care of other daily activities
[16:41] <seb128> k
[16:41] <seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks ;-)
[16:41] <seb128> good work!
[16:42] <seb128> didrocks, hey
[16:42] <didrocks> hey hey
[16:42] <didrocks> * growing tests on daily release landing and now classic maintenance of dailies with some power outage forcing to fix/workaround issues in the datacenter.
[16:42] <didrocks> * 100 scopes: strike 2, the return of the son. We are going to land it to raring. A PPA is under preparation with all this in (still moving) code. The current plan is to land those ~ 40 packages by end of next week. We'll need tester, I think kenvandine, robru and seb128 (+ popey's) help would be appreciated for installing the ppa once ready and report issues (only file and application lens will work
[16:42] <didrocks> at the beginning). Also note that we'll have to NEW them (seb128? :p) and MIR them (mterry? ;)). I'll give more info on people testing once the ppa is ready.
[16:42] <didrocks> * Adapated daily release to release to a ppa. Not as straightforward as it seems as we need to take into account that distro is a moving target as well. Preparing things to ensure that the testers are not screwed.
[16:42] <didrocks> * created WI for landing all components from where we are upstream for for kenvandine, cyphermox_, mterry, robru, and vorlon to look for. We need to have all that ready by the EOM in raring, under daily releases.
[16:42] <didrocks> adapted*
[16:43]  * Laney fears the 100 scopes landing
[16:43] <Laney> is that 100 source packages?!
[16:43] <seb128> Laney, going to be fun indeed
[16:44] <seb128> Laney, 40 packages from what didrocks just wrote
[16:44] <didrocks> Laney: no, only 40 :)
[16:44] <Laney> oh yes
[16:44] <didrocks> see, just saved 60!
[16:44] <robru> Laney, trust me, 100 new source packages is better than dozens of things packaged in a single source package. we have a situation like that with webapps and any time you want to fix one little bug in one little thing, it's a whole new giant source package mess.
[16:44] <seb128> didrocks, nice summary, lots going on ... I'm surprised the IRC server didn't kick you out for spamming ;-)
[16:44] <didrocks> seb128: yeah, I wondered at some point to write a line and then another :p
[16:45] <didrocks> Laney: btw, you just volonteered for reviewing the FFe
[16:45] <didrocks> kthxbye
[16:45] <seb128> didrocks, thanks
[16:45] <seb128> Laney, hey
[16:45] <Laney> hur hur
[16:45] <Laney> A probably incomplete list of things I worked on lately - GNOME updates (various syncs, merges and plain upstream updates) - Release management work now that Feature Freeze has started (reviewing FFes; if you think you still want to land a feature then talk to me / the release team) - vUDS & associated discussions around rolling releases
[16:45] <Laney>  - Looking at uptart in the user session and trying to write soeme sample jobs. I don't see a clear list of targets in the BP(s); will try to come up with one myself. - Trying out pitti's logind packages and finding / being confused by bugs that pitti inevitably already knew about when I got around to IRC-reporting them. :-)
[16:45] <Laney> \0
[16:45] <Laney> OH
[16:45] <Laney> irssi broke my paste, sorry
[16:46] <attente> !v
[16:46] <ubot2> Factoid 'v' not found
[16:46]  * popey quickly books holidays far away from scopes
[16:46] <didrocks> popey: toooo late, I talked to your manager ;)
[16:46] <popey> bah!
[16:46] <popey> looking forward to it.. ☺
[16:46] <popey> \o/ new stuff
[16:47] <seb128> Laney, @upstart session: yeah, we didn't really do the work to list target, I can help looking at that this week if you want
[16:47] <seb128> Laney, thanks
[16:47] <Laney> would be good
[16:47] <Laney> np
[16:47] <seb128> kenvandine, hey
[16:47] <kenvandine>  * signon-ui for Qt5 that doesn't break the desktop
[16:47] <kenvandine>    - mardy is working on webkit1 bindings for Qt5
[16:47] <kenvandine>    - I have a backported patch for qt5 that adds xembed support, I'll land that after I get some testing done
[16:47] <kenvandine>  * Gwibber/Friends
[16:47] <kenvandine>    - We really want to replace gwibber on the desktop with Friends, requires a few features to land to get the new Gwibber client fully functional (this week) then we'll request a FFe
[16:48] <kenvandine> and i'll be out tomorrow
[16:48] <kenvandine>  /done
[16:48] <seb128> enjoy the day off!
[16:48] <seb128> kenvandine, thanks
[16:48] <seb128> mlankhorst, hey
[16:48] <mlankhorst> touch bug https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=56578 - xorg 1.14 input testing, plymouth/kernel/lightdm/xorg-server race nailing with help of tjaalton
[16:48] <ubot2> Freedesktop bug 56578 in Server/Input/Core "race condition with active/passive grabs when opening menus with touch" [Normal,Assigned]
[16:48] <mlankhorst> and trying to make unbind for drm work correctly
[16:49] <mlankhorst> ^D
[16:50] <seb128> mlankhorst, thanks
[16:50] <seb128> cyphermox_, hey
[16:51] <cyphermox_> hey!
[16:51] <cyphermox_> so just now been fixing up two MIRs for a merge that hasn't landed yet for indicator-session (bugfix)
[16:51] <cyphermox_> spent part of last week fixing up patches for upstream inclusion, they all got landed, for nm-applet
[16:52] <cyphermox_> updated nm/nm-applet on raring, left with the vpn plugins to updates but will need FFE
[16:52] <cyphermox_> other than that, blocked on a hug libcolumbus transition for which code isn't quite ready.
[16:52] <cyphermox_> \x00
[16:52] <cyphermox_> hug=hud
[16:52] <mterry> boo
[16:52] <seb128> ok
[16:52] <mterry> hoped for a pkg called hug
[16:52] <seb128> lol
[16:52] <seb128> cyphermox_, thanks
[16:52] <cyphermox_> there's hugin
[16:52] <Laney> Maintainer: Daniel Holbach
[16:53] <mterry> heh
[16:53] <seb128> ;-)
[16:53] <cyphermox_> oh, nice :)
[16:53] <seb128> mterry, hey
[16:53] <mterry> - Light week between vUDS and a day off
[16:53] <mterry> - Some MIR work
[16:53] <mterry> - Filed branch for start of LightDM support in phablet greeter, waiting a review and me adding tests
[16:53] <mterry> EOF
[16:53] <seb128> mterry, thanks
[16:53] <seb128> robru, hey
[16:53] <robru> hey hey!
[16:54] <robru> * implemented since_id= for twitter, vastly reducing bandwidth usage by avoiding redownloading duplicate tweets, also fixed a bug where friends was re-notifying heinously stale tweets
[16:54] <robru> * bring up dbus interface earlier during init, solving some dbus timeout issues
[16:54] <robru> * vast reduction in complexity of db schema, making it way easier for consumers of friends to filter the db based on common criteria (this will make facebook and twitter phone apps much simpler)
[16:54] <robru> * added GPS location info to db schema, allowing us to leverage location data provided to us by social networks. currently only implemented for foursquare but I intend to add facebook soon.
[16:54] <robru> * put together a sweet flowchart of the friends stack architecture: http://ubuntuone.com/2W6HSyoN9tWUcAZL0k7Z1f (btw Sweetshark, used libreoffice draw for this, pretty slick tool! I used to use Dia but Draw is way nicer).
[16:54] <robru> ^D
[16:54] <seb128> nice
[16:54] <seb128> robru, thanks
[16:54] <seb128> tkamppeter, hey
[16:55] <tkamppeter> UDS session about printing: Mobile with reduced, driverless (support for IPP Everywhere/CUPS Raster, PDF, PS, PCL) printing stack, Poppler as only renderer, no GS, if possible daemons on-demand, print dialog in Touch SDK
[16:55] <tkamppeter> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/client-1303-printing-stack-with-mobile-in-mind
[16:55] <tkamppeter> system-config-printer: Printer driver auto-download working correctly from both GNOME's own printer setup tool and the system-config-printer GUI
[16:55] <tkamppeter> Updates for Feature Freeze: HPLIP 3.13.3, foo2zjs 20130306, foomatic-db 20130308, cups-filters 1.0.30, QPDF 4.0.1. Planned is also Ghostscript 9.07, waiting for update of LCMS, see LP: #1126427, also CUPS 1.6.2 to fix LP: #1069671
[16:55] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1126427 in lcms2 (Ubuntu) "LCMS2 needs multi-threading fixes to work with the new Ghostscript 9.07" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1126427
[16:55] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1069671 in cups (Ubuntu Quantal) "no print queues displayed in pure client mode" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1069671
[16:56] <tkamppeter> Had to rush in all new versions due to real existance of FF instead of RR came on short notice.
[16:56] <tkamppeter> One day after UDS.
[16:56] <seb128> tkamppeter, lot of good work there
[16:56] <seb128> yeah, it has been an issue for several of us
[16:57] <tkamppeter> And still not ready, GS and CUPS still to come, but CUPS is a bug fix release, so not related to FF.
[16:57] <seb128> tkamppeter, we should discuss, at some point this week, on whether we want to keep the GNOME printing panel or go back to system-config-printer for raring
[16:57] <seb128> I will ping you about it tomorrow
[16:57] <seb128> (need to run into another meeting that this one)
[16:58] <seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
[16:58] <seb128> attente, hey
[16:58] <attente> seb128, hey
[16:58] <attente> not much from me, spent the last week fighting with autopilot, getting integration tests into unity-gtk-module, and doing a bit more rhythmbox profiling
[16:58] <attente> just going to fix a unity-gtk-module bug robru pointed out to me last night, but afterwards planning to switch focus to the ibus indicator
[16:58] <attente> EOF
[16:58] <seb128> \o/
[16:58] <tkamppeter> seb128, for me seems that s-c-p gets another cycle, as there is no GUI to share the local printers for getting accessed byu remote machines.
[16:58] <seb128> attente, nice coincidence, I planned to talk to you about the keyboard indicators today, to see if you would be interested working on those
[16:59] <seb128> attente, let's chat about it a bit later
[16:59] <tkamppeter> Receiving shares (at least Bonjour from CUPS 1.6.1 servers) is always on currently.
[16:59] <attente> seb128, sure
[16:59] <seb128> tkamppeter, yeah, I think we should go back to s-c-p as well
[16:59] <seb128> attente, thanks
[16:59] <seb128> desrt, hey
[17:00] <seb128> not desrt it seems
[17:00] <seb128> so me
[17:00] <seb128> - hosted a client track for vUDS
[17:00] <seb128> which took some 2 days
[17:00] <seb128> - updated some icons for design (which involved some patching and migrations)
[17:01] <seb128> - some desktop updates
[17:01] <seb128> - tested the systemd-services transition, filed a FFe for it
[17:01] <seb128> - looked at some bugs, SRU
[17:01] <seb128> - tried to update our blueprints, postponed some work, still way behind the trendline
[17:02] <ivanka> hey didrocks
[17:02] <seb128> especially after vUDS and getting some new specs

[17:02] <ivanka> didrocks, how do I see blueprint bits that are assigned to me?
[17:02] <desrt> seb128: hi
[17:02] <desrt> sorry.  was mid-rebase :)
[17:02] <seb128> ivanka, launchpad.net/~/+upcomingwork
[17:02] <seb128> ivanka, https://launchpad.net/~seb128/+upcomingwork
[17:02] <seb128> ups
[17:02] <seb128> ivanka, https://launchpad.net/~/+upcomingwork
[17:03] <didrocks> ivanka: you probably want to see the WI assigned to you as well: http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-raring/u/ivanka.html (well 1 WI it seems)
[17:03] <seb128> desrt, no worry ... we do team round and summary of what we did in the week ;-)
[17:03] <ivanka> cheers seb128 and didrocks
[17:03] <desrt> seb128: let me know if you want to come back to me :)
[17:03] <seb128> desrt, please go ahead, we were just done
[17:03] <seb128> I was last and just finished my update
[17:04] <desrt> did a lot of small items related to the datetime stuff
[17:04] <desrt> did a systemd upstream patch to add the CanNTP property, did one for our (old) version of systemd too
[17:04] <desrt> also patched upstream g-c-c to use this property
[17:04] <desrt> did some MIR paperwork
[17:04] <desrt> and started on writing the service for the dconf security proxy stuff (for app confinement)
[17:05] <desrt> just working on some glib stuff now (fixing test failures noted by pitti's jenkins stuff)
[17:05] <desrt> (eof)
[17:05] <seb128> desrt, thanks
[17:06] <seb128> desrt, speaking about glib, you missed the recent release rounds it seems, is that wanted? ;-)
[17:06] <seb128> current tarball is almost a month old
[17:06] <desrt> seb128: mclasen and i fight over who does the releases sometimes :p
[17:06] <desrt> but thanks for noticing.  i'll do one soon.
[17:06] <seb128> thanks
[17:06] <seb128> ok, any other topic from anyone?
[17:06] <seb128> comments/questions/...?
[17:06] <desrt> seb128: gtk 3.8 for 13.4?
[17:07] <seb128> desrt, nop, missed that shot
[17:07] <desrt> fair enough
[17:07] <desrt> got the new harfbuzz/pango stuff though, right?
[17:07] <seb128> we are past FFe and I can't see a reason to push for it
[17:07] <seb128> yes
[17:07] <desrt> good
[17:07] <seb128> new glib as well
[17:07] <desrt> that will be a big memory win
[17:07] <seb128> new GTK would have been nice, but it has still some known regressions not fixed
[17:07] <desrt> theme stuff mostly, right?
[17:08] <seb128> no, dnd (due to the clock work), screensaver turning your screen white
[17:08] <seb128> the current tarball makes gedit segfault when you scroll (that's fixed in git though)
[17:08] <desrt> neat.
[17:08] <desrt> ya... enough reasons to wait :)
[17:09] <seb128> right
[17:09]  * desrt has been tracking rawhide... some things are kinda sketchy there
[17:09] <seb128> other comments? ;-)
[17:09] <cyphermox_> about rawhide? j/k
[17:09] <didrocks> robru: mterry: cyphermox_: think about starting on the touch apps packaging for raring
[17:10] <didrocks> ask me anything if you see the WI don't make sense :)
[17:10] <cyphermox_> didrocks: is the hud stuff ready?
[17:10] <robru> didrocks, yes, I have some questions
[17:10] <didrocks> cyphermox_: not yet, but please, feel free to check directly with tedg
[17:10] <didrocks> robru: sure?
[17:10] <robru> didrocks, but I'm not awake yet. how much longer will you be online for?
[17:11] <didrocks> robru: I give you 50 minutes for a good coffee! :)
[17:11] <robru> didrocks, hehe, yeah. let me just think up some questions then I will ask
[17:11] <didrocks> sure ;)
[17:13] <seb128> ok, meeting wrap I guess, thanks everyone
[17:13] <didrocks> thanks
[17:14] <Laney> thanks \o/
[17:14] <desrt> seb128: so FFe is approved
[17:14] <desrt> does this mean you're going to start landing the changeset?
[17:15] <desrt> or are we waiting for jbicha to do testing?
[17:16] <seb128> desrt, we are waiting for
[17:16] <seb128> 1- the MIR to be acked
[17:16] <seb128> 2- the beta1 freeze to end (that's this week)
[17:16] <seb128> 3- then we can upload
[17:17] <Laney> you can still upload
[17:17] <Laney> everything critical ought to be blocked from migration
[17:17] <desrt> seb128: MIR was acked, no?
[17:26] <robru> didrocks, ok, I sent you an email with a dozen questions. ;-)
[17:27] <didrocks> robru: got it
[17:28] <kenvandine> robru,  the schema changes and the qml-friends changes, lets propose them for merging into "raring" branches so we can do reviews there
[17:28] <kenvandine> robru, and block on the FFe for landing in trunk
[17:28] <robru> kenvandine, I'm not really familiar with that process, can you elaborate a bit?
[17:29] <kenvandine> robru, branch trunk to a raring branch
[17:29] <kenvandine> then propose your branches to that instead of trunk
[17:29] <kenvandine> so we have a place to do reviews without the merger landing them in trunk
[17:29] <robru> kenvandine, so you want the branch to be lp:~super-friends/friends/raring ?
[17:29] <kenvandine> yeah
[17:29] <kenvandine> things we are queuing to land in raring, pending a FFe approval
[17:30] <kenvandine> if that gets approved, we'll merge into trunk
[17:30] <robru> kenvandine, funny, a lot of what you are telling me I was just asking didrocks about in the email I sent him ;-)
[17:30] <kenvandine> haha
[17:30] <kenvandine> i was just discussing that with him too :)
[17:30] <didrocks> yeah, you are spamming me! :)
[17:30] <robru> kenvandine, this situation has been on my mind for a few days :-P
[17:31] <kenvandine> mine too
[17:32] <robru> kenvandine, ok, raring branch created, will make new MP now
[17:32] <kenvandine> thanks
[17:33] <robru> kenvandine, ok, so if I understood you correctly then this should be what you asked for: https://code.launchpad.net/~robru/friends/simple-schema/+merge/152971
[17:34] <robru> didrocks, there are other questions in that email though ;-)
[17:35] <kenvandine> i love this:
[17:35] <kenvandine> While we're at it, why are likes being stored as a double?
[17:35] <kenvandine> That doesn't even make sense. Go home Gwibber, you're drunk.
[17:35] <robru> ;-)
[17:35] <kenvandine> haha
[17:35] <didrocks> robru: as I'm giving more info on the email, let me CC kenvandine :p
[17:36] <didrocks> answered
[17:37] <robru> didrocks, thanks
[17:37] <didrocks> yw!
[17:37] <didrocks> seeing my current state of tireness, I hope I was clear :)
[17:37] <didrocks> if not, do not hesitate to harass me :)
[17:37] <robru> harass harass!
[17:38] <didrocks> :)
[17:40] <robru> kenvandine, so that branch I just made at lp:~super-friends/friends/raring, is that equivalent to lp:friends/raring ?
[17:41] <kenvandine> no
[17:41] <robru> kenvandine, is there a way to link those? to save on typing ;-)
[18:02] <robru> kenvandine, are you reviewing my branch still?
[18:03] <kenvandine> robru, i reviewed it, just about to test it out
[18:04] <robru> kenvandine, it's good. keep an eye out for your foursquare messages, which will now be geotagged in the model ;-)
[18:05] <robru> kenvandine, when you get around to implementing that in the qml frontend, you can take the location name and linkify it to point at google.com?q=lat,long and then people can click on it to get a map. ;-)
[18:05] <kenvandine> nah... we'll just display a map in the UI :)
[18:05] <robru> kenvandine, that too ;-)
[18:06] <kenvandine> robru, you should update the changelog in your branch
[18:07] <robru> kenvandine, oh, what? I thought the autolanding did that for me.
[18:08] <kenvandine> now i am confused... i think it kind of does
[18:08] <robru> didrocks, help ^^ ;-)
[18:08] <kenvandine> didrocks has yelled at folks for not changing it
[18:09] <kenvandine> i've been updating the changelog :)
[18:09] <didrocks> hum
[18:10] <didrocks> sorry? what branch?
[18:10] <didrocks> you bumped something?
[18:10] <robru> didrocks, so I've got a massive diff I want to merge into our special raring branch we just created
[18:10] <robru> didrocks, but I didn't touch the changelog
[18:10] <robru> didrocks, am I supposed to be writing my own changelog entries?
[18:11] <robru> I mean debian/changelog
[18:13] <didrocks> robru: you are not forced to if you didn't bump the version
[18:13] <didrocks> robru: but you should link to a bug :)
[18:13] <robru> didrocks, but these are new features, they don't have bugs
[18:13] <didrocks> robru: well, if it's a new interesting feature, you should put it in the changelog then if you don't want a bug
[18:13] <robru> didrocks, ok, will do
[18:13] <didrocks> robru: it's as you wish, for important things to mention, either bug or direct writing
[18:13] <didrocks> bug will populate for you
[18:13] <didrocks> otherwise, put it yourself :)
[18:16] <robru> kenvandine, ok, pushed updated changelog with new features listed.
[18:17] <kenvandine> thanks
[18:17] <seb128> desrt, sorry, was in a meeting, no, systemd's MIR has not been approved yet, it's being reviewed by the security team
[18:18] <desrt> seb128: i meant the FFe was approved
[18:18] <desrt> i think i misunderstood what you said was pending approval
[18:18] <seb128> desrt, right, and I said we need the MIR approved before we can upload ;-)
[18:18] <seb128> e.g we need systemd-services in main
[18:19] <desrt> right
[18:19] <seb128> ok, all good ;-)
[18:35] <robru> kenvandine, ugh, just noticed my debian/changelog changes conflict with trunk, do you want me to merge it or did you do it alreayd?
[18:39] <kenvandine> i didn't
[18:39] <kenvandine> merge it from trunk
[18:39] <kenvandine> your branch is great btw!
[18:41] <robru> kenvandine, thanks. just merged and pushed
[18:41] <robru> kenvandine, I mean pushed to the same feature branch for the mp. please merge the mp ;-)
[18:54] <robru> kenvandine, I'm gonna add location support to facebook, do you want it in the same MP or should I start a new MP for that?
[18:54] <kenvandine> new one
[18:55] <kenvandine> this will get merged in a few minutes
[18:55] <robru> kenvandine, ok, great
[19:03] <achiang> cyphermox_: just kicked off an nm-applet run using your dbg packages and collecting logs
[19:03] <achiang> cyphermox_: i'll come back tomorrow after i reproduce :)
[19:04] <cyphermox_> awesome
[19:04] <cyphermox_> here today it'll never work, so I'm on something else
[19:04] <cyphermox_> will get to reproducing that bug on thursday
[19:22] <kenvandine> robru, i sent you a MP for qml-friends... not sure how you feel about reviewing Qt stuff :)
[19:44] <robru> kenvandine, great, I do want to get more into Qt ;-)
[20:09] <doomlord> do apple ptents mean 'scale' in linux has to wobble (the way it interpolates position & velocity)
[20:18] <mterry> robru, didn't you make a wiki page to list common inlining steps?  I want to check it over again
[20:19] <robru> mterry, yeah, lemme find it again
[20:20] <robru> mterry, here it is: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DailyRelease/InlinePackaging didrocks had moved it ;-)
[20:23] <mterry> robert_ancell, heyo!  I wanted to poke you about some pending reviews: https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/unity-greeter
[20:23] <robert_ancell> mterry, consider me poked
[20:23] <mterry> robert_ancell, jpds wanted us to SRU the gsettings and dbus interface ones if we could
[20:28] <robert_ancell> mterry, the ones with jenkins failure I didn't change the main status - I'll let you fix those parts
[20:29] <mterry> robert_ancell, oh, hm.  I assume they're bogus..  will check
[20:40] <mterry> fginther, for unity-greeter autolanding, I assume I need a jenkins login to restart a jenkins job?  I don't recall if I have one, but there doesn't seem to be a signup option
[20:43] <fginther> mterry, let me check
[20:43] <mterry> fginther, this is on jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com
[20:44] <fginther> mterry, jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com doesn't execute any jobs, it's basically just a viewer
[20:45] <fginther> mterry, i don't have a login there either
[20:46] <fginther> mterry, is something not merging? The usual process to retrigger autolanding is to approve the MP.
[20:46] <mterry> fginther, ah...  How is are the links that jenkins leaves in comments like "to restart this job..." supposed to work?
[20:46] <fginther> mterry, ah that.
[20:46] <mterry> fginther, oh fair.  I was just thinking I'd actually do what jenkins suggested  :)
[20:47] <mterry> robert_ancell, I no longer have permissions to set the merges Approved...  :(  But doing so will retry the jenkins runs
[20:47] <fginther> mterry, that's a bug
[20:47] <fginther> it might even have a number ...
[20:48] <robert_ancell> mterry, oh really?
[20:48] <fginther> mterry, https://bugs.launchpad.net/jenkins-launchpad-plugin/+bug/1149232
[20:48] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1149232 in jenkins-launchpad-plugin "link to retrigger a job is wrong when publishing jobs to jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com" [Undecided,New]
[20:48] <robert_ancell> mterry, oh, it's probably because you're not in the PS team right?
[20:49] <robert_ancell> mterry, I just invited the canonical desktop team, but it looks like someone has to ack that
[20:50] <seb128> robert_ancell, ok, accepted it
[20:50] <robert_ancell> mterry, try now
[20:50] <seb128> did I just sign up for extra work for our team? :p
[20:53] <robert_ancell> seb128, totally. I just unsubscribed ps :)
[21:17] <marga> desrt, you are not around, are you?
[21:17]  * marga in the wrong tz.
[21:18] <marga> Running 'sudo dconf update' is causing cinnamon to die with sigabort.  I'm trying to find out what is causing that, but with not much luck up to now.
[21:20] <marga> I get this funny message: GLib:ERROR:/build/buildd/glib2.0-2.32.3/./glib/gvariant-serialiser.c:1320:g_variant_serialised_n_children: code should not be reached
[21:20] <marga> It's always funny when something prints stuff like "this should never happen"
[21:54] <desrt> marga: hi.
[21:55] <desrt> marga: almost definitely a refcounting problem somewhere in cinnamon
[21:55] <desrt> marga: a backtrace would be very highly useful
[21:55] <desrt> marga: valgrind would probably also find the issue
[21:57] <marga> desrt, I've been struggling with the backtrace
[21:58] <marga> I have it, it's big, but gdb doesn't show anything useful when bt
[21:58] <desrt> probably you need to install some dbgsyms packages
[21:59] <marga> Maybe, but i'm used to at least seeing _something_
[21:59] <marga> In this case it's such a level of nothingness that I think something else is wrong
[21:59] <desrt> paste?
[22:00] <marga> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5609068/
[22:01] <marga> desrt, ^
[22:01] <desrt> cool
[22:01] <desrt> pretty useless
[22:01] <marga> indeed
[22:02] <marga> I think it's because it's an abort instead of segfault
[22:02] <desrt> nah... gdb is perfectly capable of getting reasonable data out of aborts
[22:02] <marga> it's aborting because glib's g_assert_not_reached ();
[22:02] <desrt> it's more likely because memory is getting trashed
[22:02] <desrt> does valgrind say anything useful?
[22:03] <marga> uhm... let's try that.
[22:07] <marga> well, valgrind complained about so much stuff that it's hard to find the real one
[22:07] <desrt> ya... so start with the first one
[22:07] <desrt> this is C
[22:07] <desrt> once things start going off the rails you can't really trust anything else after that
[22:07] <desrt> ...including gdb backtraces, as it were
[22:07] <marga> yeah... But this is gtk
[22:07] <marga> valgrind always complains about gtk stuff
[22:08] <desrt> are you looking at leaks or memory errors?
[22:08] <desrt> leaks ya... but it ought not to be complaining about invalid reads/writes
[22:08] <marga> I just did a valgrind run without params
[22:08] <marga> It's complaining a lot about Conditional jump or move depends on uninitialised value(s)
[22:08] <desrt> can you paste the whole log?
[22:08] <marga> And also about invalid reads
[22:09] <marga> I don't have it all... It went over my scroll limit.  I'm going to re-run this outputting to a file
[22:09] <desrt> thanks
[22:13] <marga> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5609093/
[22:13] <marga> desrt, that's a big paste for you :)
[22:13] <desrt> the zlib ones are probably harmless
[22:13] <desrt> ==7250== Conditional jump or move depends on uninitialised value(s)
[22:13] <desrt> ==7250==    at 0x51222CF: ??? (in /usr/lib/libmuffin.so.0.0.0)
[22:13] <desrt> ==7250==    by 0xAB99258: g_settings_get_mapped (in /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libgio-2.0.so.0.3200.3)
[22:13] <desrt> ==7250==    by 0x5121CFA: meta_prefs_init (in /usr/lib/libmuffin.so.0.0.0)
[22:13] <desrt> ==7250==    by 0x511F500: meta_run (in /usr/lib/libmuffin.so.0.0.0)
[22:13] <desrt> this is the interesting one for sure
[22:14] <desrt> see if you can get dbgsyms for libmuffin and have another go at it
[22:14] <marga> Uhm, I think I'll need to rebuild it.
[22:14] <desrt> why?
[22:15] <desrt> is this something you custom-built locally?
[22:15] <marga> sort of.  It's the ppa, downloaded, built and signed
[22:15] <marga> So, it's the same code, but re-built internally, for security reasons
[22:16] <desrt> neat.
[22:16] <desrt> on one hand that seems excessively paranoid
[22:16] <marga> heh :)
[22:16] <desrt> but on the other hand it's like... if you have the resources to pull that off, why not?
[22:16] <desrt> and clearly you do
[22:16] <marga> Well, I'm going to rebuild this and everything... I hope it doesn't take long
[22:17] <mlankhorst> desrt: kind of useless if you can sneak your evil thing into the source code though ;)
[22:18] <marga> well, we are supposed to review the changes before rebuilding
[22:18] <marga> but yeah, it can go wrong.
[22:18] <mlankhorst> *cough* openssh-server
[22:19] <marga> indeed
[22:19] <marga> I was thinking the same
[22:40] <marga> Oh, how I hate cdbs...
[22:40] <marga> So, I'm rebuilding muffin, but it's getting stripped, even though I'm using the DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=nostrip,noopt, that I've always used for this.
[22:41] <marga> And finding out why means getting into this cdbs mud :-/
[22:41] <Laney> aren't they whitespace separated?
[22:41] <marga> Laney, not according to policy
[22:41] <marga> and cdbs shouldn't require them to. But I'll try that anyway.
[22:41] <Laney> you're reading a different policy to me then ;-)
[22:43] <marga> uhm, they added this whitespace thing recently, I guess.  I'm old :)
[22:43] <marga> let's try again with whitespace...
[22:44] <Laney> not that I'm saying cdbs can't be independently buggy :p
[22:44] <marga> it might be that it's not buggy, it's just a big mess
[22:44] <marga> man dh_strip says that if "nostrip" is present, it won't strip
[22:44] <marga> Why should cdbs meddle with my env options?  It really shouldn't but...
[22:45] <marga> In any case, I do hope this is it
[22:47] <marga> yay, not stripped.  Thanks Laney.
[22:47] <Laney> woot. happy debugging!
[22:47]  * Laney goes to bed
[23:00] <marga> Backtrace: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5609198/
[23:01] <marga> Valgrind: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5609202/
[23:05] <bryce> marga, install some -dbg / -dbgsym packages ;-0
[23:07] <marga> heh
[23:07] <marga> I think I found the bug
[23:07] <marga> I mean the valgrind bug
[23:07] <marga> ... I mean, I found the bug that causes valgrind to complain.
[23:08] <marga> I'm unsure if that bug is really what's causing cinnamon to misbehave, but I'm going to do some monkey patching
[23:10] <desrt> marga: pretty obvious problem here...
[23:10] <desrt>   MetaVirtualModifier mods;
[23:10] <desrt>   if (!string_value || !meta_ui_parse_modifier (string_value, &mods))
[23:10] <desrt> ...
[23:10] <desrt>   if (mods != mouse_button_mods)
[23:10] <desrt> if string_value is NULL then 'mods' will be used uninitialised
[23:11] <desrt> which it may well be because of   string_value = g_variant_get_string (value, NULL);
[23:11] <marga> I'm looking at the code and I'm disliking the whole thing
[23:11] <marga> many things done wrong.
[23:11] <desrt> the reason you see it on 'dconf update' is simple: it broadcasts that _all_ settings may have changed
[23:11] <desrt> including ones that aren't set at all
[23:11] <desrt> they have an implicit assumption here that if a key changed they should be able to read it
[23:11] <marga> desrt, didn't we fix that?
[23:11] <desrt> marga: different pieces of software can be differently affected?
[23:12] <marga> Sorry, sorry, I'm misremembering.  We fixed gconf plugin's behavior on receiving that broadcast
[23:12] <desrt> yup
[23:12] <desrt> other software can misbehave in the same way
[23:12] <marga> indeed
[23:12] <desrt> and i guess (unfortunately for you) not too many people are using 'dconf update'
[23:12] <desrt> so these types of issues are rarely found
[23:12] <marga> right
[23:12] <desrt> anyway... i don't think this is the cause of your crash
[23:12] <desrt> but probably it's a similar issue in the same code
[23:13] <marga> We will find aaaaaall the dconf update bugs.
[23:13] <desrt> ==23835==    at 0x5138AFF: button_layout_equal (/usr/local/google/home/marga/muffin/src/core/prefs.c:1247)
[23:13] <desrt> this one is way more interesting...
[23:14] <marga> that's the one that I've just "patched" (i.e. forced it to return true)
[23:14] <marga> To see if it was the cause
[23:14] <desrt> man
[23:14] <desrt> button_layout_handler is a mess of a function
[23:15] <marga> yes
[23:15] <marga> that's the one I was cringing at
[23:18] <desrt> hmm
[23:18] <desrt> this is not the problem either
[23:19] <marga> From the backtrace it seems that the problem is in the  settings_changed function, that calls: g_settings_get_value(settings, key), where settings is a GSettings object and key is "keybindings/"
[23:19] <desrt> although clearly there is yet another unrelated issue there
[23:19] <desrt> ya.  exactly.
[23:19] <marga> But that looks like a valid call to me...
[23:20] <desrt> huh.
[23:20] <desrt> you maybe found a GSettings bug here
[23:20] <desrt> it depends what the docs say
[23:20] <marga> omg
[23:20] <desrt> ...if they say anything at all
[23:21] <desrt> huh.
[23:22] <desrt> can you install the glib dbgsyms and go one more time?
[23:23] <desrt> they're part of the standard glib packaging, so hopefully you don't need to rebuild....
[23:23] <desrt> valgrind is not being helpful here.... you want the gdb backtrace
[23:23] <desrt> lolwut
[23:23] <desrt> #15 0x00007ffff1e4a541 in ?? () from /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libgio-2.0.so.0
[23:24] <desrt> #16 0x00007ffff60c21e4 in ffi_call_unix64 () from /usr/lib/libmozjs185.so.1.0
[23:24] <desrt> #17 0x00007ffff60c1c21 in ffi_call () from /usr/lib/libmozjs185.so.1.0
[23:24] <desrt> the invalid call is coming from javascript code?!
[23:24] <marga> cinnamon has some js plugins
[23:24] <marga> like the panel applets or something
[23:24] <marga> I'll look for glib debug
[23:27] <desrt> please do
[23:27] <desrt> i don't trust this backtrace identifying these as belonging to libmozjs
[23:27] <desrt> i have an extremely difficult time imagining anyone silly enough to write something to do this kind of patching of signals from JS
[23:28] <marga> heh...
[23:29] <marga> New backtrace: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5609269/
[23:29] <desrt> lovely
[23:31] <desrt> so there is at least one gsettings bug here
[23:31] <desrt> g_settings_get() should be crashing sooner
[23:31] <desrt> on a key with '/' in the name....
[23:31] <desrt> with a better assert message
[23:32] <marga> is it wrong that they key is /keybindings?
[23:32] <desrt> keybindings/
[23:32] <desrt> and yes...
[23:32] <marga> yes, that... It's wrong?
[23:32] <desrt> i'm reading the code over and over and i'm unsure how that could leak into the code
[23:32] <desrt> are you using a particularly old glib?
[23:32] <marga> precise's
[23:32] <desrt> that'll do it
[23:32] <desrt> cherry-pick this into your glib: ed492a5de2a217c08bccd4032b1122fba2f25c6f
[23:32] <desrt> that'll fix it
[23:33] <marga> 2.32.3-0ubuntu1
[23:33] <marga> Ok... Let's see if I can decipher that :)
[23:33] <desrt> ya... this fix was made in the 2.33 series
[23:33] <desrt> so this is indeed your problem
[23:34] <desrt> this actually fixes both problems: the problem of g_settings_get() rejecting sooner and the problem of the '/' getting there in the first place
[23:35] <desrt> Laney: around?
[23:35] <marga> Probably not... said going to bed almost an hour ago
[23:35] <desrt> i'm going to cherry-pick this over into the 2.32 branch upstream
[23:36] <desrt> and i'll try to find someone to SRU it tomorrow
[23:36] <marga> You know you rock, right?
[23:36] <desrt> :)
[23:36] <desrt> if you could test the patch in the meantime it would help with the SRU
[23:36] <marga> Yes, yes, I found the commit already, now trying to find how to download it
[23:37] <desrt> https://git.gnome.org/browse/glib/patch/?id=ed492a5de2a217c08bccd4032b1122fba2f25c6f
[23:39] <desrt> so it seems i did the cherry-pick at the time i made the change... and upstream release 2.32.4 already has the fix...
[23:39] <desrt> so someone just needs to package that
[23:41] <desrt> marga: did you already have a bug open about this?
[23:41] <marga> Not in launchpad
[23:41] <desrt> k.  i'll file that.
[23:41] <marga> This just hit us today, I've been debugging for about 4 hours
[23:46] <marga> rebuilding glib sure takes a long time :)
[23:46] <desrt> lots of tests
[23:46] <desrt> and i think the debian package builds several variants
[23:47] <marga> Yeah, that's likely
[23:47] <marga> Please give me the bug number, so I can chime in once this is done.
[23:49] <desrt> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1154370
[23:49] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1154370 in ubuntu "[precise SRU] crash due to improper handling of "/" in GSettings" [Undecided,New]