[00:08] <jbondhus> Hi.
[00:08] <jbondhus> I'm having a problem with nfs on my server.
[00:10] <jbondhus> Is anyone here familiar with nfs?
[00:11] <jbondhus> Hello?
[00:11] <EvilResistance> you should usually explain the problem :/
[00:11] <EvilResistance> in order to get help
[00:11] <EvilResistance> then if anyone has experience they'll respond
[00:11] <jbondhus> Ok, sorry I was waiting to see if there was anyone here.
[00:11] <EvilResistance> alternatively, #ubuntu
[00:13] <jbondhus> The server is running Ubuntu 11.04 server. The client, which is running Mac OS X is not recognizing the files and folders on the NFS mount. Here are the settings on the server and client.
[00:13] <jbondhus> SERVER SETTINGS:
[00:13] <jbondhus> Export Folder:
[00:13] <jbondhus> Export Folder Owner:
[00:13] <jbondhus> jon:80 (me and admin group)
[00:13] <jbondhus> Export Folder Permissions:
[00:13] <jbondhus> -rwxrwxrwx
[00:13] <jbondhus> Export Options:
[00:13] <jbondhus> CLIENT SETTINGS:
[00:13] <jbondhus> Remote NFS URL
[00:13] <jbondhus> nfs://<IP_ADDRESS>/jbondhus
[00:13] <jbondhus> Mount Location
[00:13] <jbondhus> Advanced Mount Parameters
[00:13] <jbondhus> None
[00:13] <EvilResistance> stop
[00:13] <EvilResistance> pastebin
[00:13] <EvilResistance> !pastebin
[00:14] <jbondhus> Ok, here's the URL, sorry, i'm new to IRC.
[00:14] <jbondhus> http://paste.ubuntu.com/730553/
[00:16] <RoyK> jbondhus: the OS X NFS stack is somewhat sloppy, using netatalk works better
[00:17] <jbondhus> How do I use that?
[00:18] <jbondhus> The reason I'm using NFS is because it's the fastest protocol.
[00:23] <jbondhus> I have to make NFS work.
[00:26] <RoyK> jbondhus: apt-get install netatalk
[00:26] <jbondhus> On the server?
[00:26] <RoyK> NFS might be a bit faster, but you won't notice the difference in most circumstances
[00:26] <RoyK> yes
[00:27] <jbondhus> You know what, does ubuntu use afp?
[00:27] <jbondhus> Can it support it as a client?
[00:27] <RoyK> ubuntu supports AFP
[00:28] <RoyK> I really doubt using AFP as a client from ubuntu will be the best choice
[00:28] <jbondhus> My other laptop uses ubuntu and my main one uses Mac OS X, and the Server runs Ubuntu server. It has to be compatible with them all.
[00:28] <RoyK> but the file ownership will be in sync whether you use afp or nfs or smb or whatever
[00:29] <jbondhus> But smb is slower, and AFP is more compatible with mac os x.
[00:30] <RoyK> I use AFP for my mac and NFS for unices and SMB for windoze
[00:30] <twb> For a heterogeneous environment Samba will be the least painful
[00:30] <twb> MAYBE NFS if you have OS X and Linux, but I wouldn't want to bet on it
[00:30] <jbondhus> Well I have to have it shared. I found a great article on how to set up AFP on ubuntu.
[00:31] <RoyK> twb: mixing AFP and NFS works well
[00:31] <RoyK> it's just file ownership and modes after all
[00:31] <jbondhus> NFS had permissions problems. Check that, HAS permissions problems. I'm just going to purge the nfs packages and rm -rf the export. That way I can start with a clean slate instead of having a junk folder that's chowned to nobody.
[00:31] <twb> RoyK: I was assuming you didn't want the hassle or maintaining two whole network fs stacks
[00:31] <jbondhus> I think I'm going to go with AFP. It sounds the most painless.
[00:31] <twb> jbondhus: well, unless you're going to run kerberized CIFS, NFSv4 or AFS, you are going to have permissions issues.
[00:32] <twb> Unkerberized network filesystems simply do not enforce access restrictions.
[00:32] <jbondhus> What do you mean by unkerberized? I haven't heard that term before?
[00:32] <ersi> Meaning you don't have kerberos authentication setup
[00:32] <RoyK> without Kerberos
[00:32] <jbondhus> Ok, that makes more sense.
[00:35] <jbondhus> Is AFS the same thing as AFP?
[00:36] <RoyK> !afs
[00:36] <jbondhus> What?
[00:36] <RoyK> afs is andrew file system, not really compatible with AFP, which is apple file protocol
[00:36] <RoyK> !afp
[00:37] <RoyK> this bot is too stupid
[00:37] <jbondhus> Ok, nevermind then.
[00:40] <jbondhus> Bye.
[00:40] <twb> Indeed; not compatible at all, completely separate protocol :P
[00:41] <twb> I only mentioned AFS because it's kerberized; I wouldn't recommend it for anyone that isn't a university
[00:41] <ersi> He just logged off.
[00:41] <twb> ersi: I was speaking for the benefit of lurkers :P
[00:42] <ersi> 'k. :-)
[01:19] <yaboo> stupid issue got two data four port pci-e cards, and when I boot the disks connected to them change address, can I lock in the address
[01:21] <twb> yaboo: sorry, are these ethernet cards or sata cards?
[01:21] <yaboo> twb sata cards
[01:21] <twb> So what address is changing, the pseudo-SCSI bus address?
[01:21] <yaboo> four port, both cards have disks connected to them
[01:22] <yaboo> two, e.g. on one boot disk is /dev/sdc, next boot it is /dev/sdg
[01:22] <yaboo> and boot after that its back to /dev/sdc
[01:22] <yaboo> trying to do software raid
[01:23] <twb> yaboo: that is how disks work.  It is only chance that you have never had this problem until now
[01:23] <twb> yaboo: to use software raid, just refer to the array by its UUID rather than by the device names of its array nodes
[01:24] <yaboo> twb so disks will change address during boot
[01:24] <twb> Yes
[01:24] <yaboo> twb, sort of stupid even using the disks  normally means I cannot put them in stab, because next boot its changed id
[01:25] <twb> yaboo: fstab also supports UUIDs
[01:25] <yaboo> two I understand, can I just lock the disks down
[01:25] <twb> I doubt it
[01:25] <yaboo> ok
[01:25] <twb> If I had to guess I would say its because you have two identical cards, so they are more likely to race
[01:26] <yaboo> two yes they are the same cards
[01:26] <twb> But in theory it could happen on any hardware, and the Right Thing is to use UUIDs
[01:26] <yaboo> ok
[01:26] <twb> If you're installing Ubuntu it usually should use UUIDs by default
[01:27] <yaboo> twb, thats cool, but when I reboot the array now comes as /dev/md127 and fails to mount, even using uuid
[01:28] <twb> I do not know why that is.
[01:28] <yaboo> that is???
[01:28] <twb> Did you update /etc/fstab and /etc/mdadm.conf and run update-initramfs -u -k all?
[01:28] <yaboo> no
[01:28] <twb> Do so.
[01:29] <yaboo> so update /etc/fstab with the uuid and the /etc/mdadm/mdadm.conf then run update-initramfs -u -k all?
[01:29] <twb> OK, pastebin your current fstab and mdadm.conf
[01:29] <yaboo> ok
[01:30] <qman__> yeah, UUID by default was nailed down years ago
[01:30] <qman__> I remember dealing with it in 5.10
[01:30] <twb> When was the sg transition?
[01:30] <twb> qman__: ^^
[01:30] <qman__> well, dealing with this problem
[01:30] <twb> qman__: I'd have said more like 2007, but whatever.
[01:31] <qman__> in any case, long enough
[01:31] <twb> qman__: I expect he's just following an ancient howto or something
[01:32] <yaboo> twb http://pastebin.com/DSgqZ4xh
[01:33] <twb> yaboo: you have no arrays in mdadm.conf
[01:33] <twb> yaboo: you need something along the lines of this:
[01:33] <twb> A
[01:33] <twb> ARRAY /dev/md0 level=raid1 num-devices=3 UUID=aaebe741:68a1b213:7234de3b:cd66fef8
[01:34] <yaboo> two ok, seems I am following a old how to then
[01:34] <twb> You can get the UUID by doing mdadm --detail /dev/md127 or so
[01:34] <yaboo> change raid=6 for me I guess
[01:34] <qman__> also, my fstab doesn't use that UUID format for the array
[01:34] <qman__> it uses the same format as the rest of the disks
[01:35] <twb> Yes, in fstab it would look like this:
[01:35] <twb> UUID=58d2c859-912a-4937-bbb4-d9f9edd16232 /boot ext2 noatime,nodev,nosuid,noexec,ro,sync 0 2
[01:35] <twb> Note the UUIDs will be different -- mdadm takes the *array* UUID; fstab takes the *filesystem* UUID.
[01:35] <twb> The filesystem UUID can be gained with "blkid /dev/md127" or "tune2fs -l /dev/md127"
[01:36] <twb> yaboo: also you seem to have the root filesystem in fstab defined twice
[01:36] <yaboo> ok
[01:36] <qman__> yeah, that's a big problem
[01:36] <twb> In future, you should check the date on the howto before you follow it :-)
[01:37] <qman__> while the concepts haven't changed much, the little things have
[01:40] <yaboo> two change my line to RRAY /dev/md0 level=raid6 num-devices=6 UUID 8c4113cd:9dee4f90:bc191129:c5bc8b2a       /home/storage   ext4    errors=remount-ro       0       1
[01:40] <yaboo> RRAY /dev/md0 level=raid6 num-devices=6 UUID 8c4113cd:9dee4f90:bc191129:c5bc8b2a       /home/storage   ext4    errors=remount-ro       0       1
[01:40] <yaboo> two changed my line too ARRAY /dev/md0 level=raid6 num-devices=6 UUID 8c4113cd:9dee4f90:bc191129:c5bc8b2a	/home/storage	ext4	errors=remount-ro	0	1
[01:40] <yaboo> is this correct
[01:41] <twb> My name is "twb" not "two"
[01:45] <yaboo> sorry twb
[01:46] <yaboo> is this correct syntax or not
[01:47] <qman__> that is not correct
[01:48] <qman__> the ARRAY bit goes in mdadm.conf, the /home/storage blah blah belongs in fstab
[01:51] <yaboo> ok have to wait till server reboots
[02:32] <KoolaidJunkie> Hello Everyone.
[02:32] <KoolaidJunkie> I was wondering if there was someone that could help me with a External Harddrive mounting issue
[02:36] <twb> !ask
[03:42] <keithclark> I have my router, a speedtouch 516, and a router, a DLink DIR-615.  I am having a problem with port forwarding.  It is now working.  I seem to be having an issue with the modem.  It sees my router as <IP_ADDRESS>, where my router's address is actually <IP_ADDRESS>.  Not sure what the issue is here.
[03:45] <twb> Unless your router or modem is running Ubuntu, that sounds like a problem for your router/modem vendor, not us
[04:06] <keithclark> Maybe a bad modem?
[04:18] <twb> All modems are bad modems
[04:31] <keithclark> Bridge mode versus PPP mode maybe the issue with the modem?
[07:50] <chenbing> have installed debian squeeze xfce4,seems no kernal source ,I mean there is no /usr/local/linux directory.how to apt-get it ?
[07:53]  * greppy looks at the channel name
[11:19] <runasand> hey, I downloaded ubuntu-10.04-server-cloudimg-i386.tar.gz and SHA256SUMS.gpg from https://uec-images.ubuntu.com/releases/10.04/release/, but I get a bad signature when I try to verify. Any idea what's up?
[11:23] <ikonia> runasand: sounds like a corrupt source or corruption in transit
[11:23] <ikonia> runasand: (or the image has been updated and the signature hasn't)
[11:24] <runasand> ikonia: ok, so it's not just me doing it wrong. The checksum in SHA256SUMS matches, so that's something.
[11:24] <runasand> ikonia: any idea who I should poke to have the signature updated?
[11:25] <ikonia> a good question,
[11:25] <ikonia> I don't know who maintains that stuff, at one point I didn't even think it was official
[11:26] <runasand> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-on-ec2 seems like the best place
[11:26] <runasand> ikonia: hah, ok, the FAQ actually points users to this IRC channel :)
[11:26] <ikonia> I'm sure that is correct, I just don't use those image, so have never really got involved
[11:29] <runasand> ikonia: heh, figured it out, seems like I was just doing it wrong :)
[11:30] <ikonia> explain ?
[11:31] <runasand> basically, you fetch the sha256sum, sha256sum.gpg and the tarball, verify sha256sum with sha256sum.gpg and then check that the sha256sum for the tarball matches what's in the sha256sum file
[11:41] <air_> howdy.
[11:42] <air_> what's the use of the "backup" user autoamtically created on an ubuntu install?
[11:42] <air_> Is there any harm done if I make use of it to setup an rsync from a remote server?
[11:42] <air_> (ubuntu server, 10.04 lts)
[11:43] <air_> I was planning on doing keybased login, just wondering if I should create a new user or reuse the existing backup user.
[11:43] <air_> RoyK: you alive? :)
[12:53] <yann2> hello! Is the maitainer of puppet/facter around? I think the last upgrade in maverick broke it
[12:55] <yann2> I get this: http://pastealacon.com/29045  (worked last friday) i guess it might be because of https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/maverick/+source/facter/1.5.7-1ubuntu1.2
[12:59] <yann2> if I use the version from main instead of proposed, it works.... (sudo apt-get install facter=1.5.7-1ubuntu1)
[13:14] <soren> yann2: Can you file a bug that real quick, please?
[13:15] <yann2> will do. nice to see you around here soren :)
[13:15] <soren> cjwatson: Looks like an SRU regression ^  I forget what the exact steps are from here :-/
[13:17] <yann2> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/facter/+bug/885998  actually already reported
[13:17] <yann2> seems I was pointing at the wrong commit
[13:19] <yann2> too bad the package got pushed i -updates despite having this bug reported against it a few days ago :(
[13:21] <soren> yann2: Yes, that is quite unfortunate. :(
[13:37] <cjwatson> soren: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Regressions
[13:38] <cjwatson> adam_g: ^- regression in your facter upload to at least lucid and maverick
[13:38]  * cjwatson bumps bug 885998 to critical, though somebody who actually knows their way around facter will need to investigate
[14:09] <soren> cjwatson: Ok, thanks, I'll save that for another time (I don't suppose it'll help much at this point?).
[14:14] <cjwatson> soren: probably not, no
[15:51] <cwillu_at_work> you know how device letters start at sda, and go up through sdb, sdc, etc?
[15:51] <cwillu_at_work> I'm up to /dev/sdik :/
[15:51] <cwillu_at_work> (not a typo)
[15:51] <cwillu_at_work> (not useful either)
[16:16] <SpamapS> cwillu_at_work: indeed, its important to have something to make logical sense of those arbitrary device names
[16:16] <cwillu_at_work> SpamapS, there's a grand total of 2 drives in this system :p
[16:17] <SpamapS> cwillu_at_work: lots of hot swapping?
[16:17] <cwillu_at_work> the usb adapter I use to write out images to new drives loses its mind on a regular basis
[16:17] <cwillu_at_work> but this is new behaviour as of 3.0
[16:18] <cwillu_at_work> hmm, or is it
[16:18]  * cwillu_at_work pokes btrfs with a stickl
[16:31] <nineteen67comet> Morning all, I've been running my web server since around 2002 (most recent server since 2008). I have been given an updated machine and would like to migrate my sites over slowly. How can I tell Apache or my router (Tomato Linux WRT54GL) which site to which machine?
[16:32] <nineteen67comet> I would like to move one site at a time as I learn how to get things like I need (also moving from Wordpress to Drupal)
[16:32] <nineteen67comet> maybe Joomla?
[16:33] <xranby> nineteen67comet: if you have the sites on different subdomains then you can vome them over one by one by changing your dns entrys
[16:33] <xranby> like  joomla.mydomain.com
[16:34] <xranby> if you have the different sites as subfolders   like www.mydomain.com/joomla
[16:34] <xranby> then you need to tell the old apache to forward all requests to each subfolder to the new server
[16:34] <xranby> you could use apache mod_proxy to do this
[16:35] <nineteen67comet> Okay .. they are all base URLS (www.domainname1.com www.domainname2.com etc etc) .. so Apache can hand a site off to another machine on my network?
[16:35] <nineteen67comet> my folders are all /var/www/domain1 /var/www/domain2 /var/www/domain3 etc etc
[16:36] <xranby> by using apache mod proxy you can add      ProxyPass       /app1/  http://internal1.example.com/app1/
[16:36] <xranby> to your apache configuration configureation
[16:36] <SpamapS> nineteen67comet: right, so you probably have www.domainname1.com pointed to the IP of your old server, you should point it to the IP of your new server.
[16:36] <SpamapS> proxy is not really necessary
[16:36] <nineteen67comet> aha .. unkay .. I'll jump on mod_proxy ..
[16:36] <xranby> nineteen67comet: there are usually several ways to solve this task
[16:37] <nineteen67comet> All my URLs once they go to afraid.org they hit my router and are sent to my web server (current/old one)...
[16:37] <xranby> if each site have its own domain
[16:37] <nineteen67comet> yes
[16:37] <xranby> simply update the dns entrys
[16:37] <xranby> to make each domains ip point to the new server
[16:37] <nineteen67comet> all domains are in the same box; my ip (external) is not static so I use afraid.org as my DNS .
[16:38] <SpamapS> You can probably just copy the old configs to the new server and then just move each DNS pointer one by one.
[16:38] <SpamapS> nineteen67comet: oh you only have one real IP ?
[16:38] <nineteen67comet> SpamapS: yes ..
[16:38] <SpamapS> well thats different then!
[16:39] <nineteen67comet> my router hands off all port 80, 81, 8080, 8081 to the web server (and 21,22 etc) .. the IP is a dynamic typical home user IP ..
[16:39] <SpamapS> nineteen67comet: for that you probably want to use mod_proxy from the old server to the new.
[16:39] <nineteen67comet> okay .. I'll jump on mod_proxy ..
[16:39] <SpamapS> nineteen67comet: inside each <virtualhost> you can define a ProxyPass and ProxyPassReverse that will send all the traffic to the new server.
[16:40] <SpamapS> nineteen67comet: theres' an option you'll need so you can use your old configs on the new server...
[16:40] <nineteen67comet> Okay ..
[16:40] <SpamapS> nineteen67comet: what version of apache do you have on your old server?
[16:41] <nineteen67comet> Looking' now .. it's running Ubuntu Server 10.04.1 .. with Apache .. 2.2.14 ..
[16:42] <SpamapS> nineteen67comet: ok good
[16:42] <nineteen67comet> I put 11.10 with apache 2.2.20 on board (was going to stick with LTS but new stuff is just so shinny) ..
[16:43] <nineteen67comet> the new one has 11.10
[16:44] <SpamapS> nineteen67comet: yeah, on the 10.04 box you'll want to set ProxyPreserveHost On ...
[16:44] <nineteen67comet> K .. in there now looking ..
[16:44] <SpamapS> nineteen67comet: that way the new server will get the same Host: header so the <virtualhost> sections will work
[16:50] <nineteen67comet> For the Allow from portion of ProxyRequests .. do I put the URL that I want forwarded to? in my case www.justinsteiger.com .. seems like this one I found is for incoming Proxy control ..
[16:51] <nineteen67comet> http://httpd.apache.org/docs/2.0/mod/mod_proxy.html is the site I found on Apache .. I'm looking at the basic examples .. SpamapS
[16:52] <cemc> hi. is there any tool in ubuntu for notifying admins (by mail) when a servers gets rebooted without proper shutdown (like a power outage or reset/power switch etc) ?
[16:54] <nineteen67comet> SpamapS: and xranby thank you for the direction .. I'm going to go tinker with it all a bit and see if I can't make it work ..
[17:13] <roaksoax> SpamapS: ping
[17:15] <SpamapS> roaksoax: pong, sup!
[17:19] <roaksoax> SpamapS: just asked pitti to reject a package from oneiric's -proposed... unless you can beat him to it so I can upload a new one
[17:21] <SpamapS> roaksoax: ecryptfs-utils ?
[17:22] <roaksoax> SpamapS: redhat-cluster
[17:24] <SpamapS> roaksoax: guess pitti got it first
[17:26] <roaksoax> SpamapS: ok, thanks though ;)
[17:44] <roaksoax> zul: ping
[17:44] <roaksoax> zul: do you have the list of patches you are forwarding to cobbler?
[17:44] <zul> roaksoax: yo whats up?
[17:45] <zul> roaksoax: not handy
[17:45] <zul> actually handy
[17:45] <zul> roaksoax: https://github.com/zulcss/cobbler-oneiric
[17:45] <roaksoax> zul: may I take a look? so I can work on re-writting those that can be made less Ubuntu specific
[17:45] <zul> roaksoax: please
[17:45] <roaksoax> zul: cool thanks
[17:45] <zul> roaksoax: 2.2.2 should be coming out soon so ill rebase and upload
[17:46] <roaksoax> zul: awesome!
[17:46] <zul> roaksoax: im going to suggest we move away from the git snapshots
[17:47] <roaksoax> zul: agreed
[17:52] <roaksoax> zul: https://github.com/zulcss/cobbler-oneiric/commit/71ba77b0578c751804643695a71849fdd739da2b this commit should be separated in two commits
[17:53] <zul> roaksoax: k
[17:53] <roaksoax> zul: other than that, it looks good to me
[17:53] <roaksoax> zul: I thnk you can forward those, then rebase 2.2 to manage better the delta
[17:54] <zul> roaksoax: ack
[17:54] <roaksoax> zul: cause otherwise it might become a mess :)
[17:57] <zul> SpamapS:  you did miss something: https://github.com/zulcss/cobbler-oneiric (they are still pending)
[17:57] <SpamapS> zul: alright cool!
[18:17] <roaksoax> zul: so are we gonna propose upstream cobbler to work with us on adding ITSM concepts to cobbler systems?
[18:18] <zul> roaksoax: i dunno i havent thought about it
[18:18] <roaksoax> zul: I'll contact upstream and dig into that
[18:19] <zul> roaksoax: k
[18:22] <zetui> hello there
[18:22] <zetui> this is what i got on my ubuntu server
[18:22] <zetui> http://pastebin.com/tDS02ine
[18:23] <zetui> what i have to do ?
[20:03] <azert> hello
[20:03] <azert> there
[20:03] <azert> i got HP DL380 Proliant server G7
[20:04] <azert> from this morning i got something like this error :
[20:04] <azert> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=11425367
[20:05] <azert> [1131516.069427] ACPI Error: SMBus or IPMI write requires Buffer of length 66, found length 32 (20110112/exfield-285 )
[20:05] <azert> [1131516.069433] ACPI Error: Method parse/execution failed [\_SB_.PMI0._PMM] (Node ffff880ea888e7f8 ), AE_AML_BUFFER_LIMIT (20110112/psparse-536 )
[20:08] <pmatulis> azert: does it have an addon ipmi card or does it just use onboard ilo?
[20:11] <azert> onboard ilo
[20:11] <azert> just only
[20:12] <azert> pmatulis:
[20:13] <pmatulis> azert: i would check what acpi settings are to be found on your box, bios and os level
[20:13] <pmatulis> azert: tinker around with that for a while...
[20:14] <pmatulis> azert: and study bug #578506
[20:22] <azert> is it enough to get out the battery and replace. ?
[20:26] <azert> pmatulis:
[21:01] <randomcake> Hi, I'm running Ubuntu Server 11.10 and I'm struggling to SSH into the server, I've disabled the firewall, and still nothing, SSHd is on and listening (connecting to user@localhost works fine), but remote connections won't connect, what can I try to get it to connect?
[21:04] <hallyn> zul, hey, do you see any problems with http://people.canonical.com/~serge/l.debdiff (libvirt debdiff for precise)  - the logrotate stuff is new to me, but it does the right thing in my tests.
[21:11] <pmatulis> randomcake: see if the client can sense the open port on the server (telnet, nc, nmap)
[21:12] <pmatulis> randomcake: look at server logs (/var/log/syslog)
[21:13] <randomcake> I don't see the port as being open, and nothing is logged in syslog
[21:18] <randomcake> what should I try next pmatulis?
[21:29] <Matrix3000> how do i perm remove dhcp3
[21:31] <Matrix3000> when i do an apt-get remove dhcp3-client it wants to remove ubuntu-minimal as well
[21:50] <randomcake> pmatulis, I'm getting 'no route to host' now I'm doing SSH from another linux box (was using a Windows laptop before)
[21:50] <randomcake> Matrix3000, why do you want to remove DHCP?
[21:51] <dork> randomcake: is this ssh server behind a router?
[21:52] <dork> or are you doing a local to local connection? what does your networking look like
[21:53] <randomcake> all 3 computers are inside the same local network, it's a WiFi router, and a switch (the server and my laptop are connected by WiFi)
[21:54] <randomcake> all are able to use the internet, the server is able to connect to my Linux NAS via SSH, but the NAS and laptop are unable to connect to the server
[21:55] <dork> pastebin the output ot /sbin/iptables -L
[21:55] <dork> please
[21:56] <dork> on your server w/ sshd
[22:02] <dork> randomcake: you doing that or no? i gotta go soon
[22:03] <randomcake> the internet connection seems to have gone a little odd, I can't get to the pastebin, it's empty
[22:03]  * hallyn out
[22:04] <dork> pastebin is used for you to paste the data in, apply, give me the link so i can read the output of the command i asked without you flooding the channel
[22:04] <dork> so just do /sbin/iptables -L
[22:04] <dork> cut, go to pastebin.com
[22:04] <dork> paste it in
[22:04] <dork> submit
[22:04] <dork> give me the url
[22:04] <dork> think of it as notepad or something
[22:05] <randomcake> no rules, but iptables-save does give the following: *filter\n:INPUT ACCEPT [3091:2105891]\n:FORWARD ACCEPT [0:0]\n:OUTPUT ACCEPT [2928:277972]\nCOMMIT
[22:06] <dork> it's network related whatever it is, are these both linux boxes?
[22:07] <randomcake> I'm familiar with pastebin, but I'm having trouble with new network connections
[22:07] <dork> no ip conflicts?
[22:08] <randomcake> yes, both linux boxes, I don't believe so, the IPs are all allocated by the router (with the server specifically given an IP of my choosing, but still DHCP)
[22:10] <dork> can you do a telnet to the box port 22
[22:10] <dork> see if it picks up
[22:10] <dork> if it's no route you're getting i doubt the telnet will have any different results
[22:10] <dork> what kind of router is this
[22:10] <randomcake> nope, gives 'ssh: connect to host 192.... port 22: No route to host'
[22:11] <randomcake> it's a BT HomeHub (I think the manufacturer is Thompson)
[22:11] <dork> can you pastebin ifconfig results as well as your routing table please
[22:11] <dork> can you ping the host?
[22:11] <randomcake> nope
[22:12] <dork> and the machine w/ the sshd can send and receive internet data?
[22:12] <dork> can you ping the other box from the problematic server?
[22:16] <randomcake> sorry, I'm not used to Xfce (not sure Xfce is the part I'm struggling with), I'm struggling to copy and paste from terminal :S
[22:17] <dork> hilight, copy, paste bud
[22:18] <dork> i gotta jet though, look at your router, see if you can install nmap on a working linux server and do nmap -sT ip.address.x.x and see if it sees ssh open
[22:18] <dork> it's something routing related
[22:19] <randomcake> maybe the Wifi dongle is rubbish, highly, fine, copy, fine, paste, within the same terminal seems fine, but paste elsewhere, and nothing
[22:20] <air_> well, if he get's a no route to host error, it's not very likely nmap would show any open ports.
[23:07] <CantWinn> Hello
[23:07] <RoyK> .... . .-.. .-.. ---
[23:10] <CantWinn> I work for a small company that does a lot of file share. Currently we use a program called DropBox and can be found at DropBox.com. I am looking to expand my Ubuntu knowledge by setting up a server with Ubuntu and creating a file share with permissions and user folders etc. Does Ubuntu-server handle this well?
[23:11] <randomcake> CantWinn, yes, Ubuntu Server is ideal for this
[23:12] <randomcake> CantWinn, https://help.ubuntu.com/11.04/serverguide/C/samba-fileserver.html should help you get started. You can have your logins based on a Windows server's accounts, but that would be more complicated.
[23:12] <RoyK> CantWinn: ubuntu can do all of that, but dropbox is specialized for it, using ubuntu, you can use tools like rsync to do the same
[23:13] <randomcake> it depends, are you using dropbox within a single office? or are your staff spread out?
[23:13] <CantWinn> Ok, Yeah i know DP is specialized but, when we have a lot of PDF's etc, every time someone moves computers it takes them about an hour to D/L and sync the files
[23:14] <RoyK> your average rsync -za will probably work if it's in-house
[23:14] <CantWinn> They are mostly located in the main building with a couple of very small satellite offices consisting about 5ppl ea
[23:15] <RoyK> CantWinn: what amount of data?
[23:15] <randomcake> RoyK, if it's a small company, and small office, why not a Samba share? CantWinn, is there a VPN or other tunnel connecting the offices?
[23:15] <CantWinn> VPN
[23:15] <RoyK> randomcake: depends if they're using windows or not
[23:16] <randomcake> and what sort of existing servers do you have CantWinn?
[23:16] <RoyK> CantWinn: doesn't say anything about bandwidth
[23:16] <CantWinn> We have a couple of servers that are running Windows 2008 R2 virtual servers on them.
[23:16] <randomcake> a server per site?
[23:16] <RoyK> CantWinn: samba in AD mode?
[23:16] <CantWinn> RoyK, they have a 10Mbps fiber line
[23:17] <CantWinn> RoyK, Yes
[23:17] <RoyK> ok
[23:17] <CantWinn> The clients work stations have Win7 on them
[23:17] <RoyK> CantWinn: why not bacula?
[23:17] <CantWinn> We have an older Dell PowerEdge R200 server not being used, I thought about trying to set that up and experiment
[23:17] <air_> dropbox checks the checksums of files, and avoids overloading your upstream if the file already exists at dropbox. (part of their deduplication).
[23:18] <air_> personally, i don't like the idea to share my files with the world, but it does save lots of upstream performance.
[23:19] <CantWinn> They want to get out of drop box for 2 reasons.. 1 not as secure as they like because we are a medical facility handling patient data. Number 2 is because if the internet or DP goes down we can't transfer files to where they need to go
[23:19] <CantWinn> RoyK, .. bacula?
[23:19] <air_> seriously.
[23:19] <RoyK> CantWinn: setup a backup box with some 2TB drives in RAID, sw raid should suffice well, and use bacula to back them up
[23:19] <RoyK> !bacul
[23:19] <RoyK> !bacula
[23:19] <air_> you throw patient data on dropbox?
[23:20] <RoyK> CantWinn: see bacula.org
[23:20] <CantWinn> air_, I just started here about 5 days ago.. believe me I am on this REAL fast
[23:20] <randomcake> air_, any better than rsync does? I'd consider, a server per site, rsync to each site, and at the sites access the files using Samba, letting the windows users have mounted drives
[23:21] <randomcake> or (hope this isn't against the rules!) consider the options your existing servers provide, such as Distributed File Systems in Server 2008 R2...
[23:22] <CantWinn> I think what they want and what i would like to do, is set up a file share because this is what happens: (bare with me while I type)
[23:22] <air_> randomcake: if you mean to compare dropbox to rsync, sure, you could probably get the same behavior, but you'd have to care about hard links and yourself finding duplicate files.
[23:23] <air_> randomcake: but then again, I'm against putting anything of value on to dropbox. :)
[23:23] <randomcake> yeah air_, handing anything of serious value to a 3rd party isn't something to be done lightly...
[23:24] <randomcake> no problem CantWinn, understanding your use case is our best way to give decent advice :)
[23:24] <CantWinn> Nurse scans chart, that chart gets sent to a program running RDP on the clients computer to the server, after which the file is then uploaded to DP where another person will take the scanned PDF's and import them to a splitting program, when she is done those splits go to another DP folder where some are picked up by a records person and the other if there is a RX goes to the pharmacy who has a DP for RX's
[23:25] <air_> I'd sue you for this.
[23:25] <air_> :P
[23:25] <RoyK> CantWinn: then use bacula or some other backup system which keeps the data private
[23:26] <CantWinn> RoyK, we want to.. I wanted to implement a system so they can share files into folders that users are granted permission that they can access via inhouse or VPN, then have a SQL backup offsite.. wich they currently do NOT have >:(
[23:28] <RoyK> CantWinn: for medical data, you'll need  to setup a VPN solution to make the data available off-site
[23:28] <CantWinn> *believe me when I say this is only scratching the surface of things wrong..* I haven't even gotten into: No redundant switches, No redundant DB Servers.. list grows
[23:28] <RoyK> anything else is bogus
[23:28] <randomcake> doesn't sound like any compelling reason to be using Dropbox CantWinn, was it lack of technical skills to implement a better solution that caused them to choose DB? Rather than any specific features of DropBox?
[23:29] <CantWinn> RoyK, Yeah, that's why I was wondering how Ubuntu server will handle it.. I use Desktop myself and have always enjoyed many flavours of Linux, but I have never worked with server side.
[23:29] <CantWinn> Well except RH virtual
[23:29] <RoyK> CantWinn: try bacula
[23:29] <RoyK> CantWinn: bacula can backup most OSes
[23:30] <CantWinn> randomcake, I will give you the reason.. it all boils down to $$ Management sees $600 / mon for secure online backup and freaks out apparently..
[23:30] <CantWinn> RoyK, I saved the link
[23:30] <RoyK> CantWinn: apt-get install ......
[23:31] <air_> CantWinn: explain to management what it will cost when the first patient sues you for loosing their information on dropbox.
[23:31] <CantWinn> So what would my best solution be roughly with out causing you detail grief? Old server running Ubuntu, setup for file permission shares and VPN, then implementing backula?
[23:31] <RoyK> CantWinn: bacula is a PITA for starters, the installation can be a bithard, but once it's up and running, it's rock stable
[23:31] <CantWinn> RoyK, so Backula is standalone then?
[23:32] <air_> if you are in an AD environment with access to running an extra virtual windows, why not consider running just another w2k8 for the file shares?
[23:32] <RoyK> CantWinn: can be, but it can run on any linux or unix machine
[23:32] <air_> then back it up to anything.
[23:33] <CantWinn> air_, I was wondring that too, but when I asked there was groaning's about the extra $$ for W2K8 keys.
[23:33] <CantWinn> *wondering
[23:33] <RoyK> CantWinn: bacula is a backup service, it can run on most things, with a database backend of preferabably postgresql
[23:34] <air_> CantWinn: again, just compare the costs to the damage done with current way of working.
[23:34] <CantWinn> RoyK, Ok, so bacula does sound like a good option to solve for my backup issues (which is currently a HD plugged into an external mount device) but in a quick expl how does backula help with the file share?
[23:35] <CantWinn> air_, I know that, and you know that.. remember, the rich get their by being greedy
[23:35] <CantWinn> grr *there
[23:35] <RoyK> CantWinn: bacula is a backup system, not a file sharing system
[23:35] <CantWinn> << Too many things on the go at once
[23:35] <CantWinn> RoyK,
[23:36] <CantWinn> RoyK, ok, I thought so, I have been jumping back and forth to the site
[23:36] <air_> CantWinn: the rich understand when you tell them they are fucked. I tried that on my last workplace, they told me they where insured against all things that could happen.
[23:36] <RoyK> CantWinn: for file sharing, use samba or whatever appropriate
[23:36] <air_> I gave them some nice scenarios where they would still be fscked no matter what they where insured against. :D
[23:36] <CantWinn> air_, Yeah, insurance is the blanket that most companies are hiding behind...
[23:37] <RoyK> CantWinn: whatever insurance, it won't hold your data......
[23:37] <CantWinn> Well the good news i hope is I got hired by a new director of IT here, and he's more a people person than tech, so when I told him the issues he told me he's going to get them to realize what kinda d00 d00 they are in
[23:37] <air_> and it wont hold your reputation.
[23:39] <CantWinn> air_, nope.. that's why I'm working late right now trying to come up with something I can work on.. I just need to make sure that when people update a file in the share, that it's updated so all people can use it
[23:39] <air_> if you loose customer data, get sued, got insurances to cover the legal fees, you will still make the news prime time and get a big bad reputation about being careless.
[23:39] <CantWinn> yup
[23:39] <air_> explain this to the big bosses.
[23:39] <CantWinn> My director is
[23:39] <air_> they don't want to be on the news for loosing patient data.
[23:40] <RoyK> CantWinn: what are you trying to setup? a file server or a backup server?
[23:40] <CantWinn> RoyK, I NEED both
[23:40] <RoyK> CantWinn: those are two different services
[23:40] <air_> RoyK: summary. they share patient data through shared dropbox.com folders.
[23:40] <CantWinn> I'm trying to set up a local file server so they can stop using DP
[23:41] <air_> and they don't do backups.
[23:41] <air_> :D
[23:41] <CantWinn> air_, BINGO
[23:41] <air_> well, at least you have lots of things to improve here :D
[23:41] <RoyK> CantWinn: for windows, samba should do well, preferably in AD mode if you have AD at thesite
[23:41] <CantWinn> we are running AD on the main domain controller server
[23:42] <RoyK> CantWinn: for backup, bacula or something, bacula is cheap (i.e free) and can backup any unices and win2k3/winxp and forward without issues
[23:43] <CantWinn> RoyK, so with bakula running the backups I would just need to find an off site secure upload solutions then?
[23:43] <RoyK> CantWinn: with bacula, you backup things on-site, and then, you can replicate that off-site if needed
[23:44] <RoyK> CantWinn: how much data is this?
[23:44] <RoyK> a few gigs? a few terabytes?
[23:45] <CantWinn> ok, because I told them with data that they are supposed to keep until death, there needs to be an off site solution to copy to as well. because if there was ever a fire in the server room that has no A/C *groan* then they need to be able to get backups back
[23:45] <CantWinn> Not much.. rightnow about 400GB MAX.. the DB is showing about 230gb use
[23:45] <RoyK> CantWinn: tape backup, then, and an offsite storage for those
[23:46] <CantWinn> RoyK, that would require them to have a tape backup drive
[23:46] <RoyK> CantWinn: I know people doing bacula backups on tape for the full backups and disk for the differential/incremential backups
[23:46] <CantWinn> Right now I have a server running symnaptic backup to an external drive that has an internal HD loaded in it like a tape.
[23:47] <randomcake> a server room without A/C? :| tape backup can't be fully automated, surely a network backup, which is then synced offsite
[23:47] <CantWinn> connected via USB.. lol
[23:47] <randomcake> better than connected via Dropbox :P
[23:47] <CantWinn> randomcake, that's why I'm looking at uploading to secure site.. and yes you read that right.. NO A/C..
[23:47] <CantWinn> randomcake, LOL
[23:48] <RoyK> CantWinn: just setup a remote machin with some large drives as the bacula SD
[23:49] <CantWinn> RoyK, I told them to utilize their small off site offices now and put in a small server that is direct VPN to us here, that way we have our OWN off site location.. still waiting on THAT idea for a yes or no
[23:49] <RoyK> or then, just tape backup, with remote storage of the tapes
[23:50] <RoyK> CantWinn: you still would want a backup solution where you can restore from earlier backups in case someone overwrites a file and wants the old one back a week later
[23:51] <CantWinn> My ideal solution I gave them was this: On site secure version of a DP, then a dedicated backup server with VPN to off site server for backup.
[23:52] <RoyK> CantWinn: the ideal solution is to have local snapshotting and then some backup off-site
[23:52] <RoyK> CantWinn: setting up a zfs storage system will help the first part, such as openindiana
[23:53] <RoyK> the latter is simple, just a bacula server somewhere else
[23:54] <CantWinn> sorry zfs? (getting tired)
[23:54] <RoyK> CantWinn: you won't beleive how many hours we have saved by moving to ZFS storage with snapshots instead of restoring from backups......
[23:54] <RoyK> !zfs
[23:55] <RoyK> CantWinn: zfs on ubuntu is slow and not what I'd recommend - using OpenIndiana is better, but then, it's anoter OS, with other things, so it's up to you
[23:57] <air_> what about nexentastor, openfiler, etc?
[23:57] <air_> how do they stand up compared to openindiana?
[23:57] <CantWinn> So far it sounds pretty damn impressive
[23:57] <RoyK> air_: nexentastor is expensive, openfiler I don't know, but I think it's not updated as frequently as openindiana
[23:58] <air_> RoyK: IIRC nexentastor community is free up to some 18TB storage.
[23:58] <RoyK> air_: and the open nexenta isn't updated very frequently, hardly at all, according to my nexenta contact in .no
[23:59] <air_> well, yeah, that seems to be the case actually.
[23:59] <CantWinn> So instead of using ubuntu you guys think I should use AD for the file share?
[23:59] <patdk-lap> I haven't liked openfiler
[23:59] <patdk-lap> how did openfiler get zfs? last I saw it was centos based


[04:16] <efren30> i need help please i just installed ubunut everything working perfect except one thing i installed a visual effect and was working fine the windows would wobble wen i grabbed them etc.. i kept meesing around with it to get the 3-d cube and now the visual effect says none and when i try putting extra it says desktop effects could not be endab le please help and thanks.
[18:58] <superm1> evand, hmm with the latest changes to ubiquity, xfwm4 isn't starting in only-ubiquity for us
[19:04] <superm1> oh nvm its probably an issue on our end - somehow metacity is installed and its using that ;)
[19:24] <CIA-24> ubiquity: superm1 * r2528 ubiquity/debian/ (changelog control): don't hardcode dependency to metacity, instead go for virtual package x-window-manager. metacity should be chosen by Ubuntu due to the desktop seed. xfwm4 will be chosen by Mythbuntu & Xubuntu due to the desktop seeds
[19:56] <evand> ah
[19:59] <superm1> evand, do you have permissions to merge stuff into debian-cd on cdimages.ubuntu.com?
[20:10] <evand> yes
[20:10] <superm1> could you merge http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mythbuntu/debian-cd/mythbuntu-debiancd then?
[20:10] <superm1> its a few things for our alternate disk
[20:11] <evand> ok, now to remember how to do this properly
[20:12] <superm1> i'm assuming because of the mirroring system to expose the branch to the outside world it gets ugly?
[20:28] <evand> public and private branch madness.
[20:43] <evand> hrm
[20:45] <evand> superm1,  I cannot find the instructions on how to do this properly (they're probably in my saved IRC conversations, which are on a machine that I have yet to unpack), you're probably better off asking cjwatson for the time being
[20:45] <evand> sorry about that
[20:47] <superm1> evand, okay will do.
[20:47] <superm1> er anyone else that is around on the weekend that might be able to/know how to?  i'd like to test these changes at the next daily build (around 12 hours from now) since time is plentiful when not work week for me
[20:48] <evand> possibly slangasek
[20:48] <superm1> k
[20:48] <superm1> ill keep eyes out for him
[20:48] <evand> err probably


[01:28] <cyberanger> netritious: idk, lets order one and find out, amazon has them for 1500, and the shipping is insanely fas......oh uhhh yeaah
[01:57] <netritious> lol let me know when it comes in cyberanger
[02:14] <wrst> well the NSA is watching us now for sure
[02:18] <Unit193> My goodness, getting skype and pulseaudio to like each other sure is a task...
[02:19] <Unit193> wrst: Isn't there enough dislike towards the NSA and drones that this is pretty standard? ;P
[02:22] <wrst> ha ha
[02:23] <Unit193> Oh heck with that, I sure made a verbal threat to whomever wrote pulseaudio...
[02:24] <wrst> Unit193: i really have had no issues with pulse
[03:04] <Unit193> ...I think skype just took down Xorg a couple times..
[03:16] <wrst> skype = microsoft
[03:16] <wrst> can't expect much can you ? :)
[03:18] <Unit193> Meh, not sure if Skype, Xorg, or Pulseaudio.
[03:21] <wrst> could be some unholy trinity of all three conspiring to fail at once?
[03:21] <wrst> I wish there was a good alternative to skype
[03:21] <wrst> I suppose hangouts is close
[03:21] <Unit193> Indeed.
[03:21] <Omnifrog> it's a hog
[03:23] <Omnifrog> I mean, why does a video chat need 3KW of electricity to send video packets???
[03:25] <wrst> well can't say I've ever considered how much juice skype or hangouts took :)
[03:33] <Omnifrog> it's 3 KW
[03:42] <wrst> Omnifrog: how do you compute that?
[03:44] <Omnifrog> it's a highly scientific number I pulled out of my ass based to the sound the fan on my laptop makes when I am in a hangout
[03:44] <wrst> ha ha ha
[03:45] <wrst> ok i feel better now i was afraid i was really missing somethimg ☺
[03:45] <Omnifrog> yeah, 3000 watts is a bit of hyperbole
[03:57] <Omnifrog> heh, so ... while wife was busy working in the office I did this today http://imgur.com/a/8ddVO
[03:58] <Omnifrog> she was amused
[05:07] <chris4585> Omnifrog, nice tree
[19:59] <Juzzy> http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/167224-twisted-laser-vortex-breakthrough-could-lead-to-near-infinite-bandwidth-new-science
[20:04] <wrst> Juzzy: you had me at infinite bandwidth!
[20:04] <Juzzy> for sure
[20:04] <Juzzy> the application for this is incredible
[20:04] <Juzzy> no more fighting over spectrum space
[20:05] <Juzzy> i wonderif they can do the same thing using electricity
[20:06] <Juzzy> running more amps over thinner wire
[20:06] <Juzzy> probably not
[20:13] <wrst> that would be great if they could


[17:59] <MajB> Can I get a Ubuntu cloak here?
[18:00] <Pici> MajB: Hi,  Can you please post your launchpad url?
[18:00] <MajB> https://launchpad.net/~rexbouwense
[18:01] <Pici> MajB: looks good to me.  Unit193, Flannel, Tm_T, elky, hggdh ^
[18:01] <Pici> An IRCC member needs to make the request to freenode staff, so just hold on until one appears
[18:06] <Unit193> Here, poked a staffer.
[18:06] <dax> hi
[18:06] <Unit193> ...The wrong staffer.
[18:06] <dax> I AM THE BEST STAFFER
[18:06] <dax> did you poke Fuchs because if you chose Fuchs over me i might cry
[18:07] <Fuchs> aww
[18:07] <Fuchs> one should always poke Fuchs
[18:07] <Unit193> da	Nah, it was Swant. :3
[18:07] <dax> Fuchs: I bet he chose Swant over both of us
[18:07] <dax> SEE
[18:07] <MajB> I would just like a Ubuntu cloak.  https://launchpad.net/~rexbouwense
[18:07] <Fuchs> MajB: yes, yes, it has been applied!
[18:08] <Unit193> MajB: Congrats on membership, and you're all set.
[18:08] <Pici> woo
[18:08] <MajB> Thank you
[22:40] <ubot5`> daftykins called the ops in #ubuntu-discuss ()


[18:21] <ibeardslee> morning
[18:36] <Atamira> morning
[19:34] <ajmitch> morning
[19:50] <mwhudson> morning
[20:39] <chilts> morning


[09:36] <daftykins> morning gang
[09:40] <zxmpi> thursday... the nemesis of hitch hiker fans everywhere
[12:56] <davef> it's thursday morning, ugh.


[00:01] <xubuntu072> is it faster or easier or whats the reason people use it?
[00:01] <HedgeMage> I can tell you why *I* use it, but I imagine that different people have different reasons.
[00:02] <HedgeMage> * Security
[00:02] <HedgeMage> * More interface choices
[00:02] <HedgeMage> * Faster on the same hardware
[00:02] <HedgeMage> * More configurable
[00:03] <HedgeMage> * More features I care about
[00:03] <xubuntu072> do i need to reinstall all my programs if i switch?
[00:03] <HedgeMage> * More compatability with things I use on my other (non-xubuntu) Linux systems
[00:04] <HedgeMage> Most Windows programs take a lot of work to run on Linux, and have better Linux-native alternatives.  If you tell us what you regularly use, we can offer specific advice on those applications.
[00:05] <xubuntu072> photoshop, chrome, utorrent, and skype is all really, and Mudlet
[00:05] <HedgeMage> chrome and skype are already available
[00:05] <HedgeMage> utorrent has better alternatives
[00:06] <xubuntu072> okay, where do i find apps/programs for xubuntu?
[00:06] <HedgeMage> photoshop has a Linux-native counterpart called GIMP, but many artists I know still run Photoshop using WINE or a Windows virtual machine or Crossover Office.
[00:06] <HedgeMage> I'm not sure what mudlet is -- a MUD/MUSH/etc client maybe?
[00:06] <xubuntu072> okay
[00:06] <xubuntu072> yep!
[00:06] <HedgeMage> xubuntu072: Xubuntu comes with a "software center" installed, and you can browse software through there
[00:07] <HedgeMage> xubuntu072: There are about three dozen MUD clients to choose from, pick one you like :)
[00:07] <xubuntu072> aha okay :)
[00:07] <xubuntu072> will installing it delete everything i have saved?
[00:07] <HedgeMage> That depends on what option you choose during install.  I'd make good backups just in case.
[00:08] <HedgeMage> You *can* dual-boot Windows 8 and Xubuntu, but it's kind of a pain in the ass (one of my work machines has this set-up)
[00:08] <HedgeMage> Dual boot means you have both installed on the same computer, and choose when you boot up whether to run Windows or Xubuntu.
[00:08] <xubuntu072> wouldn't dual-boosting be hard on the comp?
[00:08] <HedgeMage> It uses up a ton of hard disk space, but if you have a big hard disk it's not any harder on the computer than a single boot.
[00:09] <xubuntu072> okay, would 650-ish gb be enough
[00:09] <xubuntu072> ?
[00:09] <HedgeMage> More than enough.
[00:09] <HedgeMage> I'm pretty sure my work machine is only a half-TB or something
[00:09] <xubuntu072> aha okay, well could you help me dual-boot my comp? or should i find youtube videos or something to help?
[00:10] <HedgeMage> I think there's a guide somewhere, but it's not terribly hard.  The only gotcha I ran into was related to some encryption stuff I was messing with (I work in information security), and I solved it by not encrypting Windows since everything important is on Linux anyway.
[00:11] <HedgeMage> Basically, rule 0 is "Back everything up"
[00:11] <xubuntu072> okay
[00:11] <HedgeMage> It's rare for a dual-boot install to go bad, but when it does it nukes the data on your hard drive as often as not.
[00:11] <xubuntu072> D:
[00:11] <xubuntu072> aha now im nervous to do it :P
[00:11] <HedgeMage> IOW, less than a 1% chance it'll happen to you, but if it happens you're screwed if you don't have backups
[00:11] <HedgeMage> Meh, I haven't had one do that since 2002
[00:12] <HedgeMage> I'm just paranoid
[00:12] <HedgeMage> It comes with my job ;)
[00:12] <xubuntu072> heh i guess so!
[00:12] <xubuntu072> is there somewhere i could back stuff up for free? or should i get an ext. hard drive?
[00:12] <HedgeMage> I use an external hard disk.  I wouldn't trust a free backup service with my data.
[00:13]  * HedgeMage wonders when xubuntu072 will notice the "cautious lady" theme :P
[00:13] <xubuntu072> hehe
[00:14] <xubuntu072> how much ram do i need to run it? just thought of that
[00:14] <xubuntu072> is 8 gb enough?
[00:14] <HedgeMage> More than enough.
[00:14] <xubuntu072> heh okay
[00:14] <HedgeMage> I have 8GB on the machine I'm using now, and I can run this machine plus an Xubuntu virtual machine without trouble
[00:14] <HedgeMage> :)
[00:15] <xubuntu072> whats a virtual machine?
[00:15] <HedgeMage> Just what it sounds like...it's a pretend computer that you can install stuff on inside your real computer.
[00:15] <xubuntu072> oh
[00:15] <xubuntu072> so...why dont you just install it on your real comp?
[00:16] <xubuntu072> sorry, im probably bugging you now :P
[00:16] <HedgeMage> So, for example, the computer I'm on right now is running Funtoo Linux, but I needed to test something on Xubuntu, so I made an Xubuntu virtual machine to use for testing.  This way if the thing I'm testing explodes I don't care -- it's not messing up a real machine.
[00:16] <HedgeMage> Nah, I like you.  You ask more intelligent questions than most.
[00:17] <xubuntu072> heh okay then, and that makes sense i guess, but if it does "explode" would it ruin the machine?
[00:18] <xubuntu072> virtual machine*
[00:18] <HedgeMage> Right, but the VM isn't real...I'll just delete it and go about my business. :)
[00:18] <xubuntu072> ah
[00:18] <xubuntu072> okay
[00:18] <HedgeMage> I can even save copies -- called snapshots -- of the VM at various points in time in case I need to mess with how it was at one specific point.
[00:19] <HedgeMage> :)
[00:19] <xubuntu072> yeah that makes sense
[00:19] <xubuntu072> ok im gonna go look and see if i can find a way to dualboot, ill stay here though
[00:20] <HedgeMage> xubuntu072: make an Xubuntu boot disk, boot to it...one of the options is to leave windows on the drive and dual boot
[00:20] <HedgeMage> xubuntu072: just please make back-ups first :)
[00:20] <xubuntu072> how do i make a boot disk? :3
[00:21] <xubuntu072> just put the file i downloaded onto a disk?
[00:21] <HedgeMage> xubuntu072: go to xubuntu.org and download an image...there are also instructions there on writing it to a USB stick the right way, or burning it to CD.  I'm not sure how to do that from a Windows machine, I tend to do it from Linux or UNIX
[00:22] <xubuntu072> would the image be the torrent i downloaded while i was asking questions? 913 mbs?
[00:23] <HedgeMage> yep, it should end in .iso
[00:23] <xubuntu072> it just says its a file, no extension on it
[00:23] <xubuntu072> should i add .iso?
[00:24] <HedgeMage> that's odd
[00:24] <HedgeMage> IIRC windows doesn't always display the file extension these days, though
[00:25] <xubuntu072> i went into properties and it shows "type of file: file"
[00:25] <HedgeMage> This claims to explain burning from Windows: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BurningIsoHowto
[00:27] <xubuntu072> ok thank you! ill be back in a bit, gonna find a disk
[00:29] <HedgeMage> :)
[00:38] <xubuntu072> ok i got one and its asking me wether or not to install it like a usb(editable and deleteable) or like a dvd/cd(permenant) should i do cd?
[00:39] <xubuntu072> nvm i got it :3
[00:48] <xubuntu072> ok, so i have xubuntu burnt onto the disk, can i just restart and boot from the disk or is there something else i can do?
[00:48] <xubuntu072> have to do*
[00:49] <HedgeMage> Nope, just boot to the disk and have fun.  If you choose "try xubuntu" instead of "install xubuntu" at the first menu, it'll load you into an environment where you can connect to this channel we're chatting on and then start the installer, so you can ask questions here if you need help. :)
[00:49] <xubuntu072> so, if i install it, is that dual-booting?
[00:50] <xubuntu072> or is that overwriting windows?
[00:50] <HedgeMage> dual-booting is one of the configurations you may install
[00:50] <xubuntu072> okay
[00:50] <HedgeMage> that's why I said connecting to chat while you install might help :)
[00:50] <xubuntu072> aha yep
[00:50] <xubuntu072> ok, ill brb(hopefully :P)
[00:50] <HedgeMage> :D
[01:07] <wilsonjl3> hey hedge, you still here?
[01:07] <HedgeMage> Yep.
[01:08] <wilsonjl3> heh gotta figure out how to boot from a disk
[01:08] <HedgeMage> wilsonjl3: most computers tell you very early in the boot up what key to press to get to a boot menu
[01:09] <HedgeMage> Common ones are Esc, F11, F2, Delete, and F12 but there are others.
[01:09] <wilsonjl3> yeah i got to that but i dunno what to do from that window, it just has boot priorities
[01:09] <HedgeMage> pick the CD or USB stick you just made
[01:10]  * HedgeMage disappears, will return shortly with tea
[01:11] <wilsonjl3> it didnt have CD anywhere in the list
[01:11] <wilsonjl3> can i have tea too? :P
[01:12] <HedgeMage> Sure!
[01:12]  * HedgeMage hands out tea to the channel
[01:13] <wilsonjl3> * drinks tea
[01:13] <wilsonjl3> O.o
[01:13] <HedgeMage> Hrm...sometimes the CD is referred to as ATAPI something or called SCSI in a machine that doesn't even have a SCSI bus, or called sr0...did you see any of those?
[01:13] <HedgeMage> wilsonjl3: "/me sips her tea" produces:
[01:13]  * HedgeMage sips her tea
[01:13] <HedgeMage> :)
[01:13] <wilsonjl3> ah
[01:15] <wilsonjl3> oh! does Xubuntu have a teamviewer-type thing?
[01:16] <donkeypong> Q: What's w/ all the GNOME updates?  Does xubuntu need them, & if not can u remove &/or prevent them?  [Trusty]
[01:16]  * donkeypong sips tea ...
[01:17] <HedgeMage> wilsonjl3: I don't know what teamviewer is...could you describe it?
[01:18] <wilsonjl3> it allows me to controll another person's comp remotely
[01:19] <HedgeMage> Ahh, yes.
[01:19] <HedgeMage> I use something called VNC, but there's a built-in thing in stock Xubuntu that's easier to use IIRC.
[01:20] <wilsonjl3> okay, does the person i want to connect wiith need to have it too?
[01:24] <HedgeMage> For VNC, whichever computer is being viewed/controlled needs to have something installed, but you can give people a web-based client to connect to it from so they don't have to install anything.
[01:24] <HedgeMage> I have no idea about the other stuff.
[01:25] <Wilsonjl3_> aha ok. im trying to boot from disk now. on my smartphone here
[01:26] <Wilsonjl3_> ok i got a blue xubuntu screen and its loading i think. if i ran upstairs and made a tea would it wreck anything?
[01:26] <HedgeMage> Nope.
[01:26] <HedgeMage> Well, assuming you have a qwerty keyboard it won't
[01:27] <Wilsonjl3_> okay brb :)
[01:27] <HedgeMage> You'll miss your first chance to change to dvorak/azerty/etc and have to wait until later :)
[01:27] <Wilsonjl3_> ya i do o.o
[01:27] <HedgeMage> cool, then you're good
[01:28] <HedgeMage> However, as a dvorak typist, I'm now required to glance disapprovingly in your direction at regular intervals.  It's in the handbook. :P
[01:28] <Wilsonjl3_> dvorak? o.o
[01:28] <Wilsonjl3_> whats that
[01:29] <HedgeMage> Wilsonjl3_: It's a different keyboard layout.
[01:29] <HedgeMage> Wilsonjl3_: QWERTY was designed to slow typists down so that they would not jam their mechanical typewriters.
[01:29] <HedgeMage> Wilsonjl3_: Some people find that they type faster on a dvorak layout (which puts the most-used keys on the home row), but I chose it for another reason:
[01:30] <Wilsonjl3_> and dvorak is faster?
[01:30] <Wilsonjl3_> oh. okay
[01:30] <HedgeMage> I had horrible carpal tunnel syndrome -- to the point that the doctors wanted to do surgery on both my wrists -- and was able to get pain-free with no surgery by changing to dvorak, taking some B vitamins, and changing my writing (both switching to fountain pens and learning a better writing style)
[01:31] <HedgeMage> So, it's annoying when I have to use other people's computers, which are usually set up in qwerty, but it's worth it to not have hand and wrist pain all the time.
[01:31] <Wilsonjl3_> hmm. thats pretty awesome
[01:32] <HedgeMage> yep. :)
[01:33] <Wilsonjl3_> the keyboard thing and being able to get over it. not the carpal tunnel
[01:33] <HedgeMage> I knew what you meant. :)
[01:34] <Wilsonjl3_> aha okay :)
[01:35] <Wilsonjl3_> so if im at the wifi stage it means it worked. right? i didnt screw up?
[01:36] <HedgeMage> sounds good to me. :)
[01:36] <Wilsonjl3_> awesome
[01:36] <HedgeMage> you chose to try xubuntu rather than install, right?
[01:37] <Wilsonjl3_> no? should i have?
[01:38] <HedgeMage> meh, not that big a deal since you can talk to me here. :)
[01:38] <HedgeMage> Most of the questions should have obvious answers...what language do you speak, what time zone are you in, etc.
[01:38] <HedgeMage> When you get to the disk partitioning options (I'm not sure what it's called) that is where you want to chose the option to dual boot
[01:38] <Wilsonjl3_> okay :) it says i can delete everything off or there is an option for something else. do i pick something else?
[01:39] <HedgeMage> something else if you want dual boot
[01:39] <Wilsonjl3_> okay
[01:39] <HedgeMage> I think that rather than putting the term "dual boot"which some newbies won't know, they just put a description something like "Keep windows and install xubuntu next to it"
[01:41] <Wilsonjl3_> fuck
[01:41] <Wilsonjl3_> sorry
[01:41] <HedgeMage> what?
[01:41] <Wilsonjl3_> i think i cleared it
[01:41] <HedgeMage> If so, you better have back-ups
[01:42] <HedgeMage> if you do not have back-ups this would be a good time to pull the plug out of your machine
[01:42] <Wilsonjl3_> ya i do. but i dont have windows 8 os disk. can i put old pics and stuff on xubuntu?
[01:42] <HedgeMage> yep
[01:42] <HedgeMage> that's no problem
[01:43] <Wilsonjl3_> looks like im running xubuntu :p
[01:43] <HedgeMage> If you are planning to go xubuntu-only anyway, you may as well do full disk encryption
[01:43] <HedgeMage> It's a *huge* gain in security for only minor effort, it's just above-newbie-level to set it up on a dual-boot
[01:43] <Wilsonjl3_> encryption?
[01:43] <HedgeMage> on a normal install it's a one-click option
[01:43] <HedgeMage> Yep.
[01:43] <HedgeMage> So, here's the short version of the lecture...
[01:43]  * HedgeMage gets up on her soap box
[01:43] <Wilsonjl3_> okay
[01:44] <Wilsonjl3_> sorry for swearing
[01:44] <HedgeMage> meh, we're not supposed to in here but I'm the only one awake right now and I don't care
[01:44] <HedgeMage> Anyone with physical access to your computer can read everything on it.  This is bad for desktops (which can get stolen) and worse for laptops (which can get lost or stolen or just messed with when you aren't looking in a waiting room somewhere)
[01:44] <Wilsonjl3_> ok
[01:45] <HedgeMage> When you use full-disk encryption, that means you are, in rough terms, putting the whole hard drive in a secret code that only you can read.
[01:45] <HedgeMage> Someone without the passphrase just sees useless gobbledygook
[01:45] <Wilsonjl3_> and encryption prevents this?
[01:45] <HedgeMage> Exactly.
[01:45] <Wilsonjl3_> ohhh
[01:46] <HedgeMage> So, any time your computer is powered down (if you have full-disk encryption, or FDE) it is unreadable.
[01:46] <Wilsonjl3_> can i encrypt small parts seperately?
[01:46] <HedgeMage> You can, but FDE is safer.  Here's why:
[01:47] <HedgeMage> With FDE, you don't have to worry about your programs storing temporary files in places you might not expect -- places that might not be encrypted.
[01:47] <HedgeMage> With FDE, you don't have to worry if the programs you use do encryption right, because they are in the operating system's protection all the time
[01:47] <Wilsonjl3_> yeah. can i do an fde. but then encrypt a file inside the fde that uses a different passphrase?
[01:47] <HedgeMage> yes!
[01:47] <HedgeMage> :D
[01:47] <Wilsonjl3_> aha awesome :D
[01:50] <Wilsonjl3_> so is encryption like the password to login at the start?
[01:51] <Wilsonjl3_> on my old os i mean?
[01:51] <HedgeMage> No, Windows doesn't have FDE (to my knowledge) unless you install separate software to do it.
[01:51] <HedgeMage> Your user account doesn't give you FDE.
[01:52] <HedgeMage> With FDE, when you first boot up your computer, you will need to put in the disk password or it won't start up because it can't read the disk.  Then, once it starts up, you will put in your user account password to log in.
[01:53] <Wilsonjl3_> ok i need help
[01:53] <HedgeMage> Wilsonjl3_: FYI, I just realized the time and that I have an early workout scheduled tomorrow.  I can hang out for another half-hour at most.
[01:53] <HedgeMage> Then I must sleep.
[01:53] <HedgeMage> Okay, what's up?
[01:54] <Wilsonjl3_> ok it says : a general error mounting filesystems, a maintenence shell will now be started, what do i do in this shell?
[01:55] <Wilsonjl3_> beside the command line it says root@xubuntu:~#
[01:55] <HedgeMage> That's...interesting.  Did it give no more specific error message?
[01:55] <Wilsonjl3_> no. thats all
[01:55] <HedgeMage> Okay, at precisely what point in the install did that happen?  That may give me a clue as to the type of problem.
[01:55] <Wilsonjl3_> says controll and d will terminate shell. restart the system
[01:56] <HedgeMage> Right, but we may not want to do that...let's troubleshoot first.
[01:56] <Wilsonjl3_> during the blue loading screen
[01:56]  * HedgeMage likes collecting intelligence before choosing tactics.
[01:56] <HedgeMage> Wilsonjl3_: hmm...usually it's already copying files at that point, so I'd expect that it has already installed and is trying to remount the filesystems after.
[01:57] <HedgeMage> Wilsonjl3_: but I could be guessing wrong which screen you mean, too :)
[01:57] <HedgeMage> Wilsonjl3_: Here's what I suggest:
[01:57] <Wilsonjl3_> when it starts up
[01:57] <Wilsonjl3_> what do i do then?
[01:57] <HedgeMage> Ooooh...so the install did finish and you rebooted?
[01:57]  * HedgeMage is confused
[01:57] <Wilsonjl3_> ya
[01:58] <HedgeMage> you took the CD out when you rebooted?
[01:58] <Wilsonjl3_> \me is super scared he wrecked his comp
[01:58] <HedgeMage> Relax.  I rescue worse stuff than this all the time.
[01:58] <Wilsonjl3_> it said too
[01:59] <HedgeMage> yes, you were supposed to
[01:59] <HedgeMage> I just try not to assume things I can't see when I can help it. :)
[01:59] <Wilsonjl3_> but it wouldnt start without it so i had to put it back in
[01:59] <Wilsonjl3_> okay
[01:59] <HedgeMage> Okay, so here's the thing...
[02:00] <HedgeMage> It's *really* hard for me to help on a computer I can't see if you do stuff without telling me.
[02:00] <Wilsonjl3_> okay
[02:00] <HedgeMage> If you calm down, take a deep breath, and explain things as they happen I can be more accurate in what I tell you.
[02:00] <HedgeMage> Plus, I can keep you from doing something random that breaks stuff :)
[02:01] <Wilsonjl3_> okay, sorry
[02:01] <HedgeMage> That's okay, you are learning.
[02:01] <HedgeMage> And you are MUCH nicer than the dodo in #linux earlier
[02:01] <HedgeMage> :)
[02:01] <HedgeMage> Okay, so first a couple of triage questions...
[02:02] <Wilsonjl3_> i rebooted my comp and it said to take the disk out so i did. when i tried turning back on it was just a black svreen saying i had no OS so i stuck the disk back in amd iy started loading up. during the blue screen this shell popped up
[02:02] <HedgeMage> 1) Will your job or other critical life responsibility be seriously hurt if we don't manage to fix this in the next 40 minutes and I go to bed anyway, then we pick back up tomorrow where we left off?
[02:03] <Wilsonjl3_> no.
[02:03] <HedgeMage> 2) Is this a desktop or laptop?  What make/model?  (Or did you build it yourself?)
[02:03] <Wilsonjl3_> laptop, acer aspire
[02:06] <Wilsonjl3_> any ideas?
[02:07] <Wilsonjl3_> screen just went pure white
[02:08] <Wilsonjl3_> nvm. was just a screensaver-type thing. hit a key and it went back
[02:16] <Wilsonjl3_> is it possible the stuff wasnt done instaling before i restarted it?   wasntbdone
[02:17] <HedgeMage> sorry about that
[02:17] <Wilsonjl3_> no problem
[02:17] <HedgeMage> I was distracted by a boyfriend returning home. :)
[02:17] <Wilsonjl3_> aha thats fine
[02:18] <HedgeMage> Okay, so I'm thinking it's likely one of a couple of things (there are unlikely things, too, but as the saying goes when you see hoofprints, look for horses before zebras)
[02:19] <Wilsonjl3_> mmkay. what do you suggest?
[02:20] <HedgeMage> It's possible that you clicked something during the disk partition part (when you sound like you hit something by accident) that tried to put your boot partition on a part of your disk your BIOS isn't used to booting from...this isn't a default but I don't know what you clicked so you may have changed it.
[02:20] <HedgeMage> You may have rebooted before the installer told you to, which would have caused the system not to have been marked as bootable.
[02:21] <HedgeMage> You may have your BIOS set to UEFI only and had issues with the boot due to UEFI vs Legacy mode issues
[02:21] <HedgeMage> These are the most likely things, so we're going to address them first.
[02:22] <Wilsonjl3_> i hit something else option but before i hit continue i saw that i didnt have any other os installed so i hit quit. i restarted too early i think
[02:22] <Wilsonjl3_> no i switched toblegacy mode
[02:22] <HedgeMage> We're going to start by confirming that your BIOS settings are reasonable.  Then, we'll do a re-install step-by-step so we're sure the options are right.  Those eliminate the 80% most common options.
[02:23] <Wilsonjl3_> ok tell me what tobdo
[02:24] <HedgeMage> Let's start by rebooting machine and hitting whatever button it says is for entering setup
[02:24] <HedgeMage> (often Delete, Escape, F12, or similar)
[02:25] <Wilsonjl3_> ok. do you want boot options or system controls?
[02:25] <HedgeMage> boot options first
[02:25] <Wilsonjl3_> ok
[02:25] <Wilsonjl3_> im here
[02:26] <HedgeMage> (FYI, I have about 15 min left, but we can always pick up tomorrow.  I'll be on IRC at work between meetings using the nick Hedgework, then on and off once I get home until bed)
[02:26] <Wilsonjl3_> ok
[02:26] <HedgeMage> Okay, so check that nothing says "UEFI" or "EFI"
[02:27] <Wilsonjl3_> nope
[02:27] <HedgeMage> You can UEFI boot Xubuntu, but it's not newbie-friendly and the main gain is about 15-20 seconds shaved off your boot time, so probably not worth it.
[02:27] <HedgeMage> Good.
[02:27] <HedgeMage> What disks are in your computer?
[02:27] <HedgeMage> CD drive, one hard disk, anything else?  even external hard drives or USB sticks count
[02:27] <Wilsonjl3_> just xubuntu
[02:28] <Wilsonjl3_> oh
[02:28] <Wilsonjl3_> the hdd. cd and network boot
[02:28] <Wilsonjl3_> atheros boot agent
[02:29] <HedgeMage> Okay, I advise turning network boot off until you have a bootable system.  It adds another moving part that we don't want to mess with.
[02:30] <Wilsonjl3_> how? its below the other two in boot priority atm
[02:30] <Wilsonjl3_> found it
[02:31] <Wilsonjl3_> k now what
[02:31] <HedgeMage> okay, shouldn't be if it's lower priority
[02:31] <HedgeMage> what?
[02:31] <Wilsonjl3_> i disabled network boot
[02:31] <HedgeMage> ahh ok
[02:31] <Wilsonjl3_> yup
[02:33] <HedgeMage> let's restart and boot to the CD then
[02:34] <Wilsonjl3_> okay :)
[02:34] <Wilsonjl3_> booting now
[02:35] <HedgeMage> cool
[02:35] <Wilsonjl3_> sory for bothering you
[02:35] <xubuntu328> just completing my install
[02:36] <HedgeMage> You aren't bothering me :)
[02:37] <HedgeMage> This is what I hang out here for...to help people learn. :)
[02:37] <Wilsonjl3_> keeping you away from your boyfriend then ;)
[02:38] <HedgeMage> Meh, I'm a hacker he's used to it. ;)
[02:39] <Wilsonjl3_> aha thats great
[02:39] <HedgeMage> We have a shared desk
[02:39] <HedgeMage> it's kinda cute
[02:40] <Wilsonjl3_> hehe my girlfriend just moved to a different country for uni :/
[02:40] <HedgeMage> awww
[02:40] <HedgeMage> Long-distance relationships are hard.
[02:40] <HedgeMage> One of my boyfriends is all the way in PA, and I'm in IN :/
[02:40] <Wilsonjl3_> ah were gonna skype everyday. but thats why i gotta get this fixed :p
[02:40] <HedgeMage> gotcha
[02:41] <HedgeMage> So, it booted to the CD, you picked install xubuntu, right?
[02:41] <Wilsonjl3_> one of your boyfriends? more than one? lol
[02:41] <HedgeMage> is that where we are?
[02:41] <HedgeMage> Yes, I have three.
[02:41] <HedgeMage> One lives with me, one is about an hour away, and the other is about 1k miles away.
[02:41] <Wilsonjl3_> no still blue screen loading :/
[02:41] <HedgeMage> Okay.
[02:42] <HedgeMage> Let me know when it's done or if it shows any error messages.
[02:42] <Wilsonjl3_> isnt that hard?
[02:42] <HedgeMage> The distance, or maintaining three relationships?
[02:42] <Wilsonjl3_> okay i will
[02:42] <Wilsonjl3_> maintaining 3 relationships
[02:43] <HedgeMage> Nah...at least from my perspective it's easier.  I really don't grok how monogamous people do it...that would stress me the heck out.
[02:43] <Wilsonjl3_> grok?
[02:43] <HedgeMage> sorry, Heinlein reference..."grok" means "to understand deeply and completely"
[02:44] <Wilsonjl3_> aha it is stressful sometimes. but i dont mind
[02:45] <Wilsonjl3_> it soundsblike the comp is doing the same thing over and over. is that normal?
[02:45] <HedgeMage> Wilsonjl3_: not for this long...
[02:45] <HedgeMage> hrm
[02:45] <Wilsonjl3_> hmm
[02:46] <Wilsonjl3_> what should i do?
[02:46] <HedgeMage> Okay, I am about ten minutes late getting to bed...how about we turn it off and attack it whenever you are free tomorrow?
[02:46] <HedgeMage> I want to help but if I'm tired and worried about getting up in the morning I'm not at my best anyhow.
[02:46] <Wilsonjl3_> ay npo
[02:46] <HedgeMage> also, you have a private message :)
[02:46] <Wilsonjl3_> nobproblem. goodnght
[02:47] <Wilsonjl3_> how do i check it
[02:47] <dwe08311> Never used this IRC thing before - what do I do to get started getting help for xubuntu?
[02:48] <HedgeMage> Wilsonjl3_: it varies by client, there's usually a tab or something to click
[02:48] <HedgeMage> dwe08311: just ask your question and wait for an answer :)
[02:50] <dwe08311> The old laptop I'm using only has 512mb memory.  Tried the lubuntu alternate CD - it fails when installing software (I think the downloads are failing).  So, I decided to try xubuntu.  No alternate CD, so used the mini iso.  Installs, boots, then when I select tasksel and select xubuntu (or lubuntu for that matter) it fails immediately.  I believe there is no network interface (wireless only available here), and I have no clue how t
[02:52] <dwe08311> BTW - I'm using a live boot of slackpuppy to connect here - it found the wireless and set it up ok.
[04:02] <orangerobot_> what is the name of the greeter used by xubuntu?
[04:06] <Unit193> lightdm-gtk-greeter?  Or do you mean the DM?  If so, lightdm.
[04:11] <dwe08311> Anyone with any ideas on my earlier xubuntu question?
[04:23] <orangerobot_> Unit193: hmm... i do mean greeter... what about lightdm-kde-greeter ?
[04:23] <orangerobot_> it's yet another one?
[04:24] <Unit193> Yep, search for 'lightdm greeter' and you'll see a few.  GTK and unity I know are used (Lubuntu, Xubuntu, Ubuntustudio, Ubuntu), not sure if Kubuntu uses the KDE one, and I know the razorqt one was more of an example and will be, or is deprecated in LXQt.
[04:25] <Unit193> (Or, moved to more likely.)
[04:25] <orangerobot_> hmm I see..
[04:26] <orangerobot_> i've installed lightdm onto a clean ubuntu and I have no /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf file, isn't that weird?
[04:26] <orangerobot_> i just have something called users.conf instead
[04:28] <Unit193> No, it isn't.  System installed ones go to /usr/share/lightdm/, and /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf is used to override those system settings.
[04:31] <orangerobot_> Unit193: Oh i see... it all makes sense now. Sorry for asking lighdm questions here but apparently there's another channel for it but it's only got 2 people so I thought...
[04:35] <Unit193> No problem.
[10:20] <wilsonjl3> hey hedge. you here?
[12:04] <pankaj> I have problem with adobe flash plugin for firefox. although i have installed  flashplugin-installer
[12:09] <pankaj>  I have problem with adobe flash plugin for firefox. although i have installed  flashplugin-installer
[12:23] <bosnjak> hi all
[12:23] <bosnjak> My bluetooth device doesn't seem to be active, and there is no indicator
[12:23] <bosnjak> how can i check it and turn it on? The HW switch should be the same as for WiFi, but that doesn't switch BT on, just the WiFi
[12:27] <pankaj> bosnjak , no idea
[12:29] <pankaj> ask in #ubuntu
[12:34] <pankaj> welcome aliensbrah
[13:42] <groRG> Hi Everybody
[13:43] <HedgeMage> hi, groRG
[13:43] <groRG> I've been testing the last Xubuntu 14.04 version on my old Aspire One A110, and noticed that the wifi is not working at all
[13:44] <groRG> Is this case known?
[13:44] <HedgeMage> groRG: Can you better define "not working at all" ?
[13:44] <groRG> the driver seems not to be loaded
[13:44] <groRG> the hardware is an old Atheros
[13:44] <groRG> it worked fine on the previous version, the 12.04
[13:46] <groRG> is there any big change in the way the wifi is handled?
[13:47] <HedgeMage> It's still NetworkManager based.
[13:47] <groRG> humm, but this time the Network manager doesn't see any wifi hardware
[13:48] <groRG> it reacts as if there was only the RJ45 connection available
[13:49] <HedgeMage> Okay, can you confirm via "ifconfig -a" that the system really isn't identifying it, and it's not just the nm interface being grumpy?
[13:49] <groRG> with this command the wlan0 appears, but of course without any ip
[13:50] <ali1234> that doesn't sound like a xubuntu specific problem
[13:51] <HedgeMage> groRG: Okay, so try "iwconfig" now to see if it's listed as a wireless device (given the naming, I suspect it is)
[13:51] <ali1234> those old Acers had a bios bug where the wifi could get permanently disabled. try resetting bios to defaults
[13:51] <HedgeMage> ali1234: probably not, but we're here and I am procrastinating on work emails :P
[13:52] <ali1234> and make sure you didn't flick the hardware disable switch
[13:52] <ali1234> check rfkill too
[13:53] <ali1234> HedgeMage: oh yeah i'm not complaining about offtopic or anything, just saying.
[13:53] <HedgeMage> :)
[13:53] <groRG> iwconfig still gives a wlan0
[13:54] <ali1234> xubuntu is at the end of the day just a different UI on top of ubuntu. the drivers are all the same
[13:54] <groRG> !!
[13:54] <groRG> I don't understand this time it seems to see the wifi around
[13:55] <groRG> does this command make the wlan "react" anyway?
[13:55] <ali1234> it shouldn't do
[13:55] <ali1234> sometimes it just takes a while for the wlan to see beacons
[13:55] <ali1234> if it already knows what to connect to, that should work faster
[13:56] <HedgeMage> groRG: "iwconfig" on its own just tells you status
[13:56] <ali1234> bosnjak: also you should check rfkill, it handles both bluetooth and wifi hardware and software kill switches
[13:56] <HedgeMage> groRG: However, some Atheros cards have power management independent of the system, so maybe querying it woke it up?  I thought that was only 1990s-era cards, though.
[13:56] <groRG> ok then the second test is alright, I just don't understand why the 1rst time it did react like this
[13:57] <ali1234> well network manager should be querying it all the time for access points anyway...
[13:57] <groRG> well thanks very much for your help
[13:58] <groRG> and sorry if it was not a xubuntu problem
[13:59] <ali1234> wifi is always troublesome... i try to never use it
[14:00] <groRG> I'll look at "rfkill", the next time the wifi seems ko... I wish I could avoid it too
[14:07] <HedgeMage> groRG: Don't be sorry.  I, personally, am willing to give wide latitude to polite people like you, and in favor of a much harsher policy re: booting rude/entitled ones :P
[14:45] <vegavega> Hi guys!
[14:46] <vegavega> I have been doing some research on the Firefox package for Xubuntu...
[14:46] <vegavega> Is it the same package as in the Linux Mint repo?
[14:46] <cfhowlett> vegavega no reason it should be; different distros.
[14:46] <vegavega> Because I have had Firefox crashing way too often, both on Xubuntu and Linux Mint Xfce (for my gf).
[14:46] <vegavega> Yes, but some shared packages?
[14:47] <cfhowlett> vegavega test a different browser
[14:47] <vegavega> In openSUSE I don't have a problem with Firefox crashing.
[14:47] <vegavega> And I have been talking to others, no problems for them as well.
[14:47] <vegavega> I have tried Chrome and Chromium. Both with annoying bugs.
[14:47] <vegavega> And I prefer free software and non-google products.
[14:48] <vegavega> And I don't want to go back to Firefox ESR.
[14:49] <vegavega> Could it help building it myself? The newest stable Firefox?
[15:17] <vegavega> My computer overheated or something. What can I do with the issue that my Firefox keeps crashing?
[15:18] <vegavega> Other than installing ESR edition or choosing another web browser.
[15:19] <deshipu> report a bug to Mozilla?
[15:19] <vegavega> Yeah, sure, but Firefox works fine in other distros than Xubuntu and Linux Mint Xfce for me. So I thought it could be something wrong with those packages? Since everything is working fine in openSUSE 13.1 KDE.
[15:20] <vegavega> Any others having the same issues? That Firefox closes randomly? After the last update(s) from Mozilla.
[15:22] <deshipu> try disabling and/or uninstalling some plugins
[15:23] <vegavega> I use the same plugins in openSUSE, and it is working fine. Only 3-4.
[15:23] <vegavega> And Tor is working fine.
[15:24] <vegavega> I should check the versions on both distros. Maybe it is not exactly the same version number. How can I get the Firefox version on another partition easily?
[17:53] <mdo> hello, I'm looking for a clean way to install Xubuntu to a separate disk from within a running ancient Ubuntu without burning an installer CD
[17:53] <mdo> do I have to install Ubuntu via debootstrap and simply install the xubuntu-desktop package
[17:53] <mdo> or is there a better way?
[17:54] <Hedgework> mdo: how about booting to a USB stick?
[18:24] <mdo> Hedgework: maybe, but for now I'm looking at how to do it that way. Not that it was a must but I only want to reboot into the newly installed system
[18:24] <mdo> :)
[18:25] <ali1234> yes you can use debootstrap
[18:25] <ali1234> afaik there is no other way without using an install image
[18:26] <mdo> ok, thnx, I thought there might be an installer I could use
[18:26] <ali1234> there's no simple way to do it for sure
[18:26] <ali1234> the live sessions install by copying the running system onto the target
[18:27] <ali1234> what you could maybe do is install virtualbox, make a pass through disk, install onto that disk through vbox, and then reboot to it
[18:27] <ali1234> vbox lets you pass a whole physical disk to the VM
[18:50] <wilsonjl3> you her. hedge?
[18:50] <wilsonjl3> here*
[19:01] <Hedgework> wilsonjl3: back now
[19:01] <Hedgework> :)
[19:01] <wilsonjl3> heya
[19:03] <wilsonjl3> ok so i just turned my comp on and did boot from disk and its stuck on the black screen with the rectangle and little man on the bottom
[19:05] <Hedgework> Well, that's a start. :)
[19:05] <wilsonjl3> a good one?
[19:06] <Hedgework> So, from your description it sounds like you booted, made it past the grub menu, and did not make it to the login screen, is that correct?
[19:06] <wilsonjl3> uh. it hasnt even done the blue loading screen
[19:06] <ali1234> little man on the bottom is the installer, no?
[19:08] <Hedgework> ali1234: only if he still has the install media booting, but he said he's booting to the hard disk
[19:08] <Hedgework> wilsonjl3: do me a favor please and hit Alt+F1 and see if it says anything interesting
[19:09] <wilsonjl3> nono. the cd i burned last night. ok i will
[19:09] <wilsonjl3> oh hey
[19:10] <wilsonjl3> black and white menu now
[19:10] <Hedgework> Okay, that's probably grub :)
[19:10] <Hedgework> You can hit Enter or just wait for it to boot the default :)
[19:10] <wilsonjl3> should i hit install?
[19:10] <Hedgework> ohh...hmm
[19:11] <Hedgework> Okay, you're booting to the CD...duh :)
[19:11] <Hedgework> Sorry, had skipped over that part somehow...yes, pick install
[19:11] <wilsonjl3> hehe ok
[19:11] <wilsonjl3> just hit enter on it. not doing anything yet
[19:12] <Hedgework> The CD is slower to boot than the finished system will be because it has no persistent configuration, so it has to figure our your system from scratch on each boot
[19:12] <wilsonjl3> ah okay
[19:14] <wilsonjl3> bluebloading screen now
[19:16] <wilsonjl3> if i unplugged it and took it upstairs would it screw up?
[19:23] <wilsonjl3> should it still be on this screen?
[19:24] <Hedgework> As long as you have enough battery for the move you can move
[19:24] <Hedgework> Meh, for now be patient and see what happens...it may take a few minutes if it's having trouble figuring out what's up on your HDD.
[19:25] <wilsonjl3> ok
[19:26] <Hedgework> I start a conference call in ~5 min.  I'll be "here" but there will  be bouts of focusing-on-work until it finishes :)
[19:27] <wilsonjl3> no problem.this thing is still doing its thing
[19:36] <Hedgework> still going?
[19:37] <Hedgework> if so, hit Alt+F1 and see what it says
[19:37] <wilsonjl3> yeah
[19:37] <wilsonjl3> just a blinking line
[19:41] <wilsonjl3> p
[19:41] <wilsonjl3> oh. says kernel panic not syncing
[19:42] <wilsonjl3> and panic occured. switching back to text console
[19:47] <wilsonjl3> any ideas on how to fix this?
[19:48] <Hedgework> Hrm...and this happened with the same boot disk you used the first time?
[19:49] <wilsonjl3> yeah
[19:50] <Hedgework> Have any BIOS settings changed since then?
[19:50] <wilsonjl3> nope
[19:51] <Hedgework> You said that the initial menu was black and white, not blue?
[19:52] <wilsonjl3> itbfroze and no. it was black and white
[19:53] <Hedgework> Okay, so the fact that it was black and white means that your system was trying to boot uefi mode instead of legacy mode.
[19:53] <Hedgework> Urr...wait a minute, let me check if that's true in xubuntu or just the other one I was using.
[19:53] <Hedgework> hold on :)
[19:54] <wilsonjl3> okay
[20:01] <Hedgework> sorry work needs my attention...I'll be back as soon as I can :)
[20:04] <wilsonjl3> okkk should ibturn it off again? make sure its on legacy?
[20:07] <Hedgework> go ahead, that's probably faster than waiting for me :)
[20:08] <wilsonjl3> ok
[20:08] <wilsonjl3> ya its on legacy
[20:09] <xubuntu085> quick question: can I install xubuntu off a flash drive with just the iso image?
[20:09] <Hedgework> xubuntu085: yes, but you have to properly write the .iso image to the flash drive, not just copy it as is
[20:09] <Hedgework> (i.e. don't just drop the file on the drive)
[20:09] <xubuntu085> Got you
[20:09] <xubuntu085> thank you for the input
[20:10] <Hedgework> wilsonjl3: Okay, hrm.  Do you happen to have another machine that can burn CDs so I can have you boot to a rescue disk and do some diagnostics?
[20:10] <wilsonjl3> im on the black svreen with the rectangle thing. and equals sigh. and the man thing in a circle
[20:11] <wilsonjl3> i can see if i could borrow one. yeah
[20:14] <wilsonjl3_> ok on the other pc now
[20:17] <SchrodingersScat> not sure if bug, when I lock screen then unlock, current window has to lose focus then regain focus to be acted upon.
[20:19] <Hedgework> wilsonjl3_: burning one of these to boot to would give us more tools to work with: http://www.sysresccd.org/SystemRescueCd_Homepage
[20:19] <wilsonjl3_> ok how do i burn it to my boot?
[20:20] <wilsonjl3_> and how do i download? i dont see anywhere that would let me
[20:21] <Hedgework> hold on I'll grab a more precise link
[20:21] <wilsonjl3_> sorry
[20:21] <Hedgework> https://sourceforge.net/projects/systemrescuecd/files/sysresccd-x86/4.3.0/systemrescuecd-x86-4.3.0.iso/download
[20:21] <Hedgework> No problem :)
[20:22] <wilsonjl3_> and i put this in and boot off of it?
[20:23] <Hedgework> Yep.  You can put it on a usb stick or on a cd :)
[20:24] <wilsonjl3_> okay. do i need to burn it like the xubuntu image or would drag and drop work?
[20:25] <ObrienDave> burn it. D&D will NOT work
[20:25] <wilsonjl3_> ok
[20:25] <ObrienDave> wilsonjl3, ALL .iso files MUST be burnt
[20:25] <Hedgework> yep, that
[20:26] <Hedgework> sorry I'm slow to respond, still on conference call :)
[20:26] <Hedgework> yay, work!
[20:26] <wilsonjl3_> no problem
[20:26] <wilsonjl3_> its still downloading, i have crappy internet
[20:32] <ObrienDave> wilsonjl3, get the torrent here: http://linuxtracker.org/index.php?page=torrent-details&id=388bc97e0076d69d32ffb50db6d7170945a59a9b
[20:33] <wilsonjl3_>   can i put the torrent directly onto the disk?
[20:33] <wilsonjl3_> burn it on i mean
[20:34] <ObrienDave> not the .torrent itself. you need to D/L the .iso
[20:34] <ObrienDave> do you have a torrent client?
[20:35] <wilsonjl3_> downloading utorrent onto this comp now, i had it on mine but its the one thats not working atm
[20:35] <wilsonjl3_> has no OS anymore
[20:36] <ObrienDave> o i c
[20:37] <wilsonjl3_> mmm ;(
[20:37] <wilsonjl3_> :(*
[20:38] <Hedgework> 3~whee back :)
[20:38] <wilsonjl3_> hey hedge
[20:38] <Hedgework> heya
[20:39] <wilsonjl3_> this comp is slow af
[20:39] <Hedgework> :(
[20:39] <Hedgework> still faster than having me mail you a cd :P
[20:39] <ObrienDave> slightly lol
[20:39] <wilsonjl3_> ahaha maybe
[20:40] <wilsonjl3_> its at 3.4%
[20:40] <wilsonjl3_> mailing might be faster :P
[20:40] <Hedgework> heh
[20:40] <ObrienDave> i gan guarantee you a CD in one week from my house ;P
[20:40] <ObrienDave> maybe
[20:40] <wilsonjl3_> ahaha
[20:41] <Hedgework> That's the nice thing about living with two fellow geeks...it's likely that between all of our computers, someone can make boot media...or we have some lying around...worst case scenario is begging a friend or me going in to work to do it. :P
[20:42] <wilsonjl3_> haha thats great
[20:42]  * Hedgework likes her bandwidth at work...there are up sides to being on university IT infrastructure!
[20:44]  * ObrienDave is jealous
[20:45] <wilsonjl3_> -sigh- 14.6%
[20:45] <Hedgework> wilsonjl3_: look at it this way, my drive home from work is unlikely to stall you much :P
[20:46] <wilsonjl3_> aha nope
[20:46] <wilsonjl3_> ugh this is annoying
[20:46] <ObrienDave> but you have good company to keep you amused ;P
[20:47] <wilsonjl3_> lol yes, i do have that
[20:47] <wilsonjl3_> buncha annoying kids here though that want me to go outside and have a waterfight -.-
[20:47] <Hedgework> aww
[20:48] <ObrienDave> sounds like fun
[20:48] <wilsonjl3_> aha ya but i dont wanna go outside, wanna get this done
[20:50] <wilsonjl3_> so. what do you guys do for a living?
[20:51] <Hedgework> wilsonjl3_: I am an infosec geek.
[20:51] <wilsonjl3_> whats infosec?
[20:51] <Hedgework> Information Security
[20:51] <wilsonjl3_> ohhh
[20:51] <wilsonjl3_> thats awesome actually
[20:51] <Hedgework> I like it. :D
[20:51] <ObrienDave> i'm a 40 year machinist, CNC programmer, long time techno nerd ;P
[20:52] <koegs> working at ISP > working at university :>
[20:52] <wilsonjl3_> ahaha i used a cnc router once :P
[20:52] <Hedgework> koegs: Hell no, I get better hours, more time with my kid :)
[20:52] <koegs> Hedgework: bandwith-wise :)
[20:53] <koegs> +d
[20:53] <Hedgework> koegs: oh, for that sure :)
[20:53] <ObrienDave> I do MasterCam and SolidWorks
[20:53] <wilsonjl3_> i took a design class and learned the basics of solidworks in highschool
[20:54] <koegs> besides, i am also working in the infosec-department :)
[20:54] <Hedgework> koegs: gotcha :)
[20:54] <Hedgework> koegs: which ISP?


[08:26] <Chipaca> moin moin
[08:27] <Chipaca> I'm working today, after all
[08:27] <Chipaca> but, the dell engineer will be here shortly to rip the guts out of my main laptop
[08:27] <Chipaca> if it takes more than an hour i'll use my secondary
[08:27] <Chipaca> otherwise, if i'm not on irc, telegram or signal work
[09:20] <niemeyer> Chipaca: Morning, and good luck :)
[09:20] <Chipaca> behold the majesty of all my megahertz
[10:30] <niemeyer> Chipaca: Do you know what time the guy/girl is supposed to show up?
[10:45] <niemeyer> Maybe already there? :)
[10:49] <Chipaca> niemeyer: all sorted now :)
[10:55] <niemeyer> Chipaca: Cool, no worries then.. I was going to suggest moving the standup earlier in case there was a chance of overlap
[10:55] <niemeyer> Chipaca: Btw, can we please rename it to "Charmcraft standup"?
[10:56]  * Chipaca renames it to "stand up and dance around"
[11:05] <Chipaca> brb, update needs a reboot
[11:11] <Chipaca> niemeyer: any progress on reviewing the testing harness?
[11:12] <niemeyer> Chipaca: Yeah, I was hoping to cover that today in the standup, but I now realize Jam is out today
[11:12] <niemeyer> Chipaca: The most elegant approach seems to be supporting both ends of it
[11:13] <niemeyer> Chipaca: We might have a couple of options.. one of them is having per method flags, and the other is a more global enable/disable events
[11:14] <niemeyer> Global is probably better.. not sure about what the default should be
[11:14] <niemeyer> Maybe emitting?
[11:14] <niemeyer> Also, it should likely be named emit instead of trigger, as that's what we already use everywhere
[11:15] <niemeyer> Also shorter, but that's just a bonus of consistency
[11:20] <Chipaca> :-)
[11:20] <niemeyer> Not exactly the reply I expected
[11:21] <Chipaca> >:(
[11:21] <Chipaca> better?
[11:21] <Chipaca> niemeyer: sorry, i read it as a status dump, didn't think you were actually asking me there
[11:22] <Chipaca> niemeyer: I think john was slightly in favour of not emitting by default, but i might have misunderstood. I do think there is value in both approaches, and if we can support both that is the right approach
[11:23] <niemeyer> Yeah, it seems easy to support both, and indeed it's the best of both worlds
[11:23] <Chipaca> wrt which to do by default, i don't know which would be more surprising
[11:23] <niemeyer> The problem with emitting always is that it becomes harder to create specific sequences of events
[11:23] <Chipaca> the 'set things up, now be alive, now test' seems to flow naturally
[11:23] <Chipaca> with the other approach being just to ask it to be alive before setting things up
[11:24] <Chipaca> conversely, 'refrain from emitting, set things up, start emitting, test' seems more awkward
[11:24] <Chipaca> hm
[11:25] <Chipaca> niemeyer: so the emit-by-default only makes sense if we're sure that's what people will be using most of the time
[11:25] <niemeyer> It's a bit unfortunate that we don't have a chance of getting it wrong and then fixing it
[11:26] <Facu> Muy buenos días a todos!
[11:26] <Chipaca> well, we kinda do
[11:27] <Chipaca> Facu: salut!
[11:27] <niemeyer> Facu: Hey, good morning
[11:27] <Facu> hola Chipaca, niemeyer, happy friday!
[11:27] <Chipaca> Facu: likewise!
[11:27] <Facu> Chipaca, I'm curious on what evil had the laptop
[11:29] <Chipaca> ni ideq
[11:29] <Chipaca> they changed the motherboard and it works again
[11:30] <Facu> Chipaca, ah, ok
[11:30] <Facu> it was the motherboard, then! jeje
[11:31] <Chipaca> or the cpu (soldered on)
[11:31] <Chipaca> or the thermal paste
[11:32] <Chipaca> who knows
[11:33] <Facu> Chipaca, at least they changed something, it's not that they used a magic wand or a sonic screwdriver and that was all
[11:35] <Chipaca> aye
[12:07] <Chipaca> niemeyer: i seem to remember you mentioning that there was a document about the next-gen charm tool, particularly around verbs
[12:07] <Chipaca> with maybe some workflows worked out?
[12:07] <Chipaca> niemeyer: if so, i can haz?
[12:08] <Chipaca> if not, booooooooo i coulda used that :)
[12:16] <niemeyer> Chipaca: Let me find it
[12:16] <niemeyer> Chipaca: The focus was juju and snap themselves, so I'm not entirely sure about the quality of the charmcraft details
[12:17] <Chipaca> ah, ok
[12:17] <niemeyer> Chipaca: This is one:
[12:18] <niemeyer> If only copy and paste worked..
[12:18] <niemeyer> https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1CFl26rmUIKzH3qgBSZ6FbxU8Z0JEDNMTyYwx_CBzgYw
[12:18] <niemeyer> This is another one:
[12:18] <niemeyer> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1-N_Zkmma9H2R0TfvpGbS9yuNExnMrIIA-WcLn75DBw8
[12:22] <Chipaca> nice
[12:22] <Chipaca> thanks
[13:00]  * Facu bookmarks
[13:00] <Facu> ah, yes, I was involved in the second
[13:00] <Facu> (with other hat in my head, though)
[13:22] <facubatista> one "idea" or "concept" is WHAT from one place to other? "transported"? "carried"?
[16:53] <Chipaca> facubatista: infected :-)
[17:21] <facubatista> je
[17:44] <facubatista> niemeyer, how can I edit these pages? https://discourse.jujucharms.com/t/charm-writing/1260 (or suggest changes?) I already found two types
[17:44] <facubatista> *typos
[18:35] <niemeyer> facubatista: Commenting on the topic, or having indeed having access to edit it
[18:36] <facubatista> It looks I don't have access, indeed
[18:37] <facubatista> thought about commenting, but these topics don't have any reply
[18:39] <niemeyer> They should.. if you raise something and nobody responds, that's something we ought to fix
[18:51] <facubatista> I just replied both entries, let's see how it goes
[20:19] <facubatista> aghh, "New in version 3.7.", wanted to use that! :p
[21:07]  * facubatista eods, and eows! see you all on Wednesday!!


[02:05] <ScottL> jussi, how often do you check listadmin?
[02:05] <ScottL> TheMuso, when you get a chance, could you answer a few questions about me doing an SRU, the wiki information isn't completely clear about something to me
[03:05] <TheMuso> ScottL: sure
[03:14] <ScottL> TheMuso, thanks, i want to address a few issues in qjackctl and jack for 10.04.1
[03:14] <TheMuso> ScottL: ok
[03:15] <ScottL> for each of these a new upstream version was released that fixed the problem, do i still need to attach a patch to the SRU?
[03:15] <ScottL> or will the new ubuntu version just be used?
[03:16] <ScottL> i.e. use qjackctl-0.3.8 from maverick to fix the problem vs. qjackctl-0.3.5 that has the port renaming bug
[03:16] <TheMuso> ScottL: Unless the upstrea version fixes many problems that need addressing, its better to take the patch from upstrea that fixes the bug, and apply it to the Ubuntu package.
[03:16] <TheMuso> So take the single patch from 0.3.8 to fix the bug and apply it to lucid's 0.3.5.
[03:19] <ScottL> i'm not sure there was a "patch" from upstream, rather a new upstream version was released, but i can create the patch myself though
[03:19] <TheMuso> Yes, you have to extract the patch from the new upstream release that fixes that specific bug.
[03:22] <ScottL> okay, the next thing it says is to upload the fixed package to 'release-proposed'...
[03:23] <ScottL> not sure how to do this...is this with dput?
[03:23] <ScottL> and not sure if i had rights to upload to it as i'm not MOTU or anything
[03:25] <ScottL> TheMuso, ^^^
[03:26] <TheMuso> ScottL: You need to get someone to sponsor the upload for you.
[03:28] <ScottL> cool, that makes sense and is what i suspected
[03:28] <ScottL> very groovy, thanks TheMuso, i'll start working on them this week :)
[03:29] <TheMuso> ScottL: np
[10:45]  * abogani waves
[12:32] <ScottL> TheMuso, i had a thought while half awake in bed this morning, what if the package doesn't have a patch system right now?
[12:32] <ScottL> should i introduce quilt or dpatch?  or is there another way?
[21:58] <quadrispro> ScottL, composite has been uploaded to unstable
[21:58] <quadrispro> hey persia! how are you?
[21:59] <quadrispro> (hi guys!)
[22:19] <scott-work> doh, quadrispro is too quick to leave :P
[22:20] <scott-work> ardour 2.8.11 is released
[23:09] <TheMuso> ScottL: You simply apply the patch to the files in question directly, i.e don't create a patch. The patch will then become part of the diff.gz.