[05:23] <nuvolari> o/ oh hi
[05:23] <Symmetria> lol, mannn an ISP actually got mad at me because we moved something around and it resulted in them using *3mbit* more traffic ;p
[05:23] <Symmetria> they are doing 1.5gigabit average, and they are crying about 3mbit? REALLY? like REALLY?
[05:24] <nuvolari> really? lol
[05:24] <nuvolari> I would just shush and enjoy
[05:24] <Symmetria> they proposed this immensely complicated setup
[05:24] <Symmetria> to give them back their 3mbit
[05:25] <Symmetria> I pointed out that the costs of running and implementing that cost a lot more than the 3mbit did :P
[05:26] <nuvolari> It's like my mom. She'll drive R5 worth's petrol out to get something that's 50c cheaper at another place :P
[05:27] <Symmetria> hahaha or like my mom, buy cheap stuff and then wonder why it breaks and then go buy more of the same and end up replacing the same thing 5 times at 3 times the cost of just buying decent stuff in the first place :P
[05:27] <Symmetria> this is why if I buy appliances and stuff, I prefer to spend more the first time and not have to replace later
[05:32] <Symmetria> heh nuvolari check this
[05:32] <Symmetria> so, I was working on something to process html logs
[05:32] <Symmetria> to geo-ip them
[05:33] <Symmetria> I write this thing in php, and it was HOLY HELL slow
[05:33] <Symmetria> lol re-wrote it in C and optimized the hell outta it
[05:33] <Symmetria> now
[05:33] <Symmetria> Processed 4959620 lines... sorting...
[05:33] <Symmetria> real	0m30.610s
[05:33] <Symmetria> lol thats fast :)
[05:37] <nuvolari> good grief!
[05:50] <Symmetria> Processed 4993139 lines in 32.000000 seconds [156036 lines/second]
[05:50] <Symmetria> heh there
[05:50] <Symmetria> I put a lines per second calculator in there
[05:51] <Symmetria> lol could probably knock half a second off there by removing the line counter as well
[05:57] <nuvolari> IIRC the C source was shorter as well?
[05:57] <nuvolari> Symmetria: ^^
[05:57]  * nuvolari doesn't really know C :P
[05:57] <Symmetria> nuvolari, nah the C source is a fair bit longer
[05:58] <Symmetria> close to double the length
[05:58] <Symmetria> heh, php handles all your memory for you
[05:58] <Symmetria> and has functions like explode()
[05:59] <Symmetria> where as in C, you gotta allocate your own memory all over the place, and to explode etc etc into arrays you gotta do things like strtok() and then duplicate the text into the arrays
[06:07] <Symmetria> heh the other problem with C, once you optimize past a certain level, the readability of the code becomes a bitch
[06:07] <Symmetria> because you start doing funky things to speed it up and tracking all those optimisations is a whore
[06:21] <ThatGraemeGuy> morning peeps
[06:21] <nuvolari> oh hi ThatGraemeGuy
[06:22] <Squirm> morning
[06:27] <nuvolari> hi Squirm
[06:43] <mazal> Morning everyone
[06:46] <Kilos> hi gremble mazal ThatGraemeGuy theblazehen and others
[06:46] <gremble> Hey
[06:54] <mazal> Gaanit oom Kilos ?
[06:55] <ThatGraemeGuy> hi Kilos
[06:56] <Kilos> eina mkop maar ons lewe dankie mazal en jy
[06:57] <Kilos> kop kop
[07:01] <inetpro> gppd mornings
[07:01] <inetpro> good as well
[07:01] <Kilos> hehe hi there inetpro
[07:03] <mazal> Die gaan is ok die terugkom sukkel oom
[07:03] <Kilos> haha
[07:09] <Kilos> ThatGraemeGuy, dropped things dropped then disappeared back in inventory last night, with a funny little sound, im not sure anymore but i think it was a small ploep sound
[07:09] <Kilos> hehe
[07:09] <ThatGraemeGuy> you mean things that dropped because of full inventory?
[07:09] <Kilos> no when i dropped them for the pro to pickup
[07:10] <ThatGraemeGuy> oh
[07:10] <Kilos> haha was weird
[07:10] <ThatGraemeGuy> mmmm i added a mod that picks up stuff be walking instead of clicking around like a madman
[07:10] <ThatGraemeGuy> maybe try and aim a bit further from you next time
[07:10] <Kilos> aha
[07:11] <ThatGraemeGuy> or else if it is too sensitive then i'll remove it
[07:11] <Kilos> will try that tonight ty
[07:11] <Kilos> lets test it properly first
[07:11] <ThatGraemeGuy> its supposed to pick up only when its quite close to you, so maybe you just dropped it too close to your feet
[07:12] <Kilos> yip iirc was close
[07:12] <Symmetria> haha I was having an argument with someone, so they produced this presentation to back up their side of the argument, I told them the presentation didn't mean what they said it did, they said, how would I know that, Im like, I know the author, and infact I know the author so well that 15 years ago we didn't speka for a year after I slept with his ex girlfriend
[07:12] <Symmetria> ;p
[07:12] <Symmetria> that pretty much ended the debate right there
[07:12] <ThatGraemeGuy> i added it because when i'm laser mining and my inventory gets full sometimes i end up with 50+ blocks of things lying there to pick up because i'm working too fast to notice
[07:13] <Kilos> ya the new tools mine like mad hey
[07:13] <ThatGraemeGuy> i'll be moving to quarry mining soon anyway
[07:13] <ThatGraemeGuy> so if that mod is too annoying i'll remove it
[07:14] <Kilos> no not yet lets first try it
[07:14] <Kilos> so if you walk over dropped things theyll appear in invetory
[07:14] <ThatGraemeGuy> yeah, that's what i mean. try it and let me know if it's too annoying
[07:14] <ThatGraemeGuy> yes
[07:15] <ThatGraemeGuy> if you have the space of course
[07:15] <Kilos> that could be good
[07:15] <ThatGraemeGuy> yeah its also nice for when you are going at trees with a chainsaw because they tend to spew stuff onto the ground all over
[07:15] <ThatGraemeGuy> so just walk around a bit to pick it all up
[07:16] <Kilos> haha that quarry makes a big hole hey, be tricky to get down there without falling
[07:17] <Kilos> my singleplayer is crashed but works with new name still so i dunno what went wrong
[07:18] <Kilos> oi i go sort sheep
[07:31] <charl> morning ThatGraemeGuy, Kilos
[07:31] <charl> Maaz: coffee on
[07:31]  * Maaz starts grinding coffee
[07:31] <Kilos> yhi charl Symmetria
[07:32] <ThatGraemeGuy> hi charl
[07:35] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for charl!
[07:39] <charl> Maaz: thanks
[07:40] <Maaz> charl: Sure
[07:52] <Kilos> hi Vince-0
[07:53] <Vince-0> o/
[07:59] <mazal> Grrrrrr
[08:01] <mazal> I'm gonna ask an illegal question now , but it is ubuntu related
[08:01] <mazal> And darkside
[08:02] <mazal> I want to remove file Windows file attributes ( like hidden for example ) from files that is on a usb stick , but I need to do it on a Ubuntu pc. Can it be done ?
[08:03] <ThatGraemeGuy> FAT32? NTFS? exFAT?
[08:04] <mazal> Both , some is FAT32 , some is NTFS
[08:04] <mazal> Different users format different formats
[08:04] <ThatGraemeGuy> ntfs: http://superuser.com/questions/321109/is-there-a-linux-tool-for-changing-dos-windows-file-attributes
[08:05] <mazal> Thax
[08:05] <mazal> Thanx even
[08:05] <ThatGraemeGuy> FAT32: http://blogs.gnome.org/diegoe/2012/04/21/removing-the-hiddensystem-bit-of-vfatfat32-files-on-gnulinux/
[08:06] <ThatGraemeGuy> insert standard, "use with caution" disclaimer :-)
[08:06] <ThatGraemeGuy> i just googled these, never done it myself
[08:06] <mazal> Thanx greame
[08:07] <mazal> aaaaaaaaaaaag , when Am I gonna learn to spell. Graeme even sorry
[08:07] <ThatGraemeGuy> its ok, people have been spelling it wrong my whole life
[08:08] <ThatGraemeGuy> i've actually added email aliases to compensate
[08:08] <ThatGraemeGuy> graham, greame and grame
[08:16] <Kilos> ai!
[08:17] <Kilos> whew mazal that question disconnected me
[08:17] <Kilos> hexchat didnt show i was ofline
[08:21] <mazal> Oom your pc just hear the word Windows and it disconnects and runs immediately lol :)
[08:25] <Kilos> lol
[08:25] <Kilos> its a weird prob it has. modem shows connected but everything is offline
[08:26] <Kilos> need to diable networking and move modem to another usb socket then enable networking again
[08:26] <Kilos> did you see what i asked about the win stuff
[08:27] <Kilos> mazal, ?
[08:31] <mazal> Nope Kilos , didn't see any question
[08:31] <Kilos> ah i was offline then sorry
[08:31] <Kilos> mazal, i dont know but if you open it what do you see
[08:32] <Kilos> does the view not give you show hidden option
[08:32] <mazal> In Linux I see everything on the sticks. But the problem is it has Windows hidden attributes so in Win pc you can't see the files
[08:33] <mazal> Is exactly the same problem as the guy in that first link Graeme posted
[08:33] <Kilos> ah i didnt see them
[08:33] <mazal> Sticks gets virus. Virus hides all files and folders.
[08:33] <mazal> Companie's AV can't even see let alone stop or clean the virus
[08:34] <mazal> So I clean the sticks with a bootable AVG cd. But that is linux based
[08:34] <Kilos> sjoe
[08:34] <mazal> After I cleaned the stick I need to reset those attributes.
[08:34] <Kilos> aha
[08:34] <mazal> Is quick and easy to do on my Win pc , but I have found that AVG also doesn't always clean all the virusses en then they climb onto my pc when doing the attributes
[08:35] <Kilos> i think ian has same kinda probs with sticks
[08:35] <mazal> So was looking for a way to do the attributes sommer in Linux
[08:35] <mazal> My pc also only have the companies AV on it , which is useless
[08:35] <Kilos> what does clamtk say about the virus
[08:35] <mazal> clamtk doesn't see the virus also
[08:36] <Kilos> sjoe
[08:36] <mazal> What I have at work: clamtk , Mcafee , MSE
[08:36] <mazal> Neither of those 3 see this particular virus
[08:36] <Kilos> avast?
[08:36] <mazal> The AVG boot cd see it , but doesn't always remove all of it
[08:37] <Kilos> i never liked avg it made the pc run at half speed
[08:37] <mazal> avast doesn't have a good boot cd option. Remember it's the works pc , I am not allowed to just install stuff
[08:37] <mazal> AVG boot cd works great actually
[08:37] <Kilos> oi
[08:37] <mazal> Linux based
[08:38] <mazal> Is a very bad problem to have when your network is not protected and the managers don't want to do anything about it
[08:38] <mazal> I have to clean at least 2 pc's and 10 sticks every day
[08:38] <Kilos> hasnt avg then got a forum for help. im sure they would like to know about it and get a fix going
[08:38] <Kilos> eina
[08:38] <mazal> And I don't even have to tools to do it with
[08:39] <mazal> My only option was the bootable cd one , and AVG is the only one that has manual update as the pc's is not on internet
[08:39] <Kilos> do you get the virus name ever
[08:39] <mazal> Nah , the normal long trojan.warra.warra.warra
[08:40] <mazal> So far only my home pc see and kills it immediately , and there I have Trend on
[08:40] <Kilos> oh wait look at addaware or sometrhing like that
[08:40] <mazal> Not allowed to install stuff oom
[08:40] <Kilos> Maaz, google addaware
[08:40] <Maaz> Kilos: "Ad-Aware Free Antivirus and Antispyware by Lavasoft | Protection ..." http://www.lavasoft.com/ :: "Ad-Aware Free Antivirus+ - Lavasoft" http://www.lavasoft.com/products/ad_aware_free.php :: "Ad-Aware Free Antivirus + - CNET Download.com" http://download.cnet.com/Ad-Aware-Free-Antivirus/3000-8022_4-10045910.html :: "addaware problems. | AfterDawn Discussion
[08:40] <Maaz> Forums" http://forums.afterdawn.com/threads/addaware-problems.747224/ :: "Ad-Aware - Down…
[08:41] <Kilos> no i mean maybe you could get it for a cd as well
[08:41] <mazal> The one day I sat and whatched visibly how it climbs onto my pc and start changing my files on the stick. And both the Mcafee junk and MSE just sits there and does nothing
[08:42] <Kilos> i remember some time back someone had a virus that nothing else fixed and ad aware fixed it
[08:42] <Kilos> wow thats a bad one
[08:42] <mazal> But ya , that is Winsux and bad management issue. Not for this forum
[08:43] <mazal> I just hoped there is easy way to to the attrib in Linux so I don't have to plug it into my Win pc
[08:43] <Kilos> good to know though, im sure everyone has to do with win pcs now and again
[08:43] <Kilos> or even daily
[08:44] <mazal> I hate these Win pc's at work
[08:44] <mazal> I have at home for gaming as well , but at least there I decide what gets installed and I have proper protection on it. Not like here where I have no say , but I have to fix all the issues
[08:44] <Kilos> lol
[08:45] <Kilos> oi
[08:45] <mazal> ok , rant/rave/afpak over
[09:03] <nuvolari> eish. ya. winsux is something I avoid.  Sure Nigeria doesnt have as peacefull influences as we do. And they don't have as strong an economical growth either (if we have any growth at all, feels like we're going backwards)
[10:09] <Spekko> And I'm aware that there's bigger things happening in the world at the moment, that will probably affect us all
[10:09] <Spekko> BUT
[10:10] <mazal> Everyone is too focused on how rich they can get and how much they can suck out of the consumer in this country , rather than what they can provide to the consumer
[10:10] <Spekko> Nkandla... Really..  Nkandla...  And so will your company be.
[10:14] <Spekko> I guess it's just a vicious cycle
[10:14] <Kilos> but its world wide
[10:15] <Kilos> there are strikes and protests everywhere
[10:15] <Spekko> one douche decided to enrich himself to gain controll over others (or w/e) and then a stereotype/prejiduce sprang out, and people started doing things not only for the cause of enriching themselves, but also opressing others.
[10:15] <Spekko> And then the opress, opress the opress :P
[10:16] <Spekko> And so status became more important than community value
[10:17] <Spekko> and who you are, is a means of showing accomplishments, not what you achieved as a team
[10:17] <Spekko> WHOO LOOK AT ME.. I'M PRESIDENT.. And YOU !? You are but a birck layer.
[10:17] <Spekko> WHOO
[10:18] <Spekko> oh.. but my team of brick layers build your Nkandla..
[10:18] <Spekko> Can you do that ?
[10:18] <Spekko> Could you even do that in a team?
[10:19] <Spekko> Just because your bank account reflects your exploits, and your title your alliances with baboons that got elected into power because of World Wide propaganda of "Apartheid" & South Africa.. doesn't mean you acomplished anything you flat nosed escrement of a baboon (Little worked up here soz(
[10:21] <mazal> hehehe , but very true
[10:58] <Kilos> in my inventory or charging , look if its there or lemme just finish installing again please then ill give it to you ok?
[12:32] <mazal> Bye everyone , have a nice evening
[14:13]  * Kilos goes to kde
[14:25] <Symmetri1> hrm
[14:25] <Symmetri1> can someone do me a favour
[14:25] <Symmetri1> https://get.videolan.org/vlc/2.1.5/win64/vlc-2.1.5-win64.exe.asc?mirrorlist
[14:25] <charl> hi Symmetri1
[14:25] <Symmetri1> go there and tell me what the top mirror listed is
[14:25] <Symmetri1> (someone in south africa)
[14:26] <Symmetri1> and what the second mirror listed is
[14:37] <bushtech> http://mirror.zol.co.zw/videolan/	ZW MU RE	AF	659.97Km	100%	173
[14:37] <bushtech> #2	http://videolan.mirror.liquidtelecom.com/
[15:04] <Kilos> http://mirror.zol.co.zw/videolan/
[15:05] <Kilos> http://videolan.mirror.liquidtelecom.com/
[15:05] <Kilos> Symmetri1  ^^
[15:30] <Symmetri1> hrm
[15:30] <Symmetri1> ok
[15:30] <Symmetri1> I need them to make kenya primary
[15:40] <nuvolari> \o/ home time
[16:23] <Symmetri1> kilos what was the percentage chance on the za mirror
[16:23] <Kilos> lemme look
[16:24] <Kilos> 100% on the first one and NA on yours
[16:24] <Kilos> not applicable?
[16:24] <Symmetri1> hrm ok will get that fixed
[16:26] <Kilos> Symmetri1  wait i reloaded
[16:27] <Kilos> 1-http://videolan.mirror.neology.co.za/
[16:27] <Symmetri1> hrm, ok, and 2 and 3?
[16:27] <Kilos> 2-http://mirror.zol.co.zw/videolan/
[16:28] <Symmetri1> ok definately need to fix that zw one it should be a 1/2 kenya neology
[16:28] <Symmetri1> to optimize it
[16:28] <Kilos> 3-http://videolan.mirror.liquidtelecom.com/
[16:28] <Kilos> still na
[16:28] <Symmetri1> and leave zimbabwe going to zimbabwe
[18:02] <magespawn> good evening
[18:02] <magespawn> hi Kilos
[18:02] <Kilos> hi my magespawn  hows you?
[18:02] <magespawn> good and you?
[18:02] <Kilos> good too ty
[18:03] <Kilos> ohi ThatGraemeGuy  you came back silently
[18:04] <magespawn> using mint 17 with cinnamon now
[18:04] <magespawn> thought a change might be good
[18:05] <inetpro_> good evening
[18:05] <ThatGraemeGuy> oh hi
[18:06] <ThatGraemeGuy> i just logged on
[18:06] <magespawn> hi inetpro_
[18:06] <magespawn> hi ThatGraemeGuy
[18:06] <inetpro> uh
[18:06] <ThatGraemeGuy> 'lo magespawn, inetpro
[18:08] <magespawn> now we have another tail just lying around
[18:20] <nuvolari> o/
[18:21] <magespawn> hey nuvolari
[18:25] <charl> good evening
[18:37] <magespawn> early bed for me. good night all
[19:48] <inetpro> .
[19:49] <inetpro> ThatGraemeGuy: what are you breaking again?
[19:49] <Kilos> lol
[19:49] <ThatGraemeGuy> i forgot to enable something
[19:49] <ThatGraemeGuy> i added a protection mod so we don't accidentally damage the reactor building
[19:49] <ThatGraemeGuy> don't want a meltdown
[19:49] <ThatGraemeGuy> you can connect again
[19:49] <inetpro> no stress
[19:53] <inetpro> ThatGraemeGuy: tell us at #minetest-za when it's up again
[19:53] <inetpro> or do you guys have another channel on irc?
[19:53] <Kilos> its up inetpro
[20:05] <Trixar_za> I never noticed that Debian releases were named after Toy Story characters


[11:24] <CommanderGHz> HI
[13:31] <CommanderGHz> HI...
[13:33] <CommanderGHz> I have a question about ubuntu-dev-arm qemu ... I can ask one of you?
[14:52] <texaswriter> CommanderGHz: Just ask your question. If somebody can answer it they will, if not... But asking to asking a question will probably get you know where.
[15:00] <CommanderGHz> ok, thanks. My question is about the ubuntu-development-arm-rootfs: I used the guide on the web page RootfsFromScratch on ubuntu.
[15:01] <CommanderGHz> after operation is successful, how to install new packages because the Internet is not active. Moreover, it is possible to compile and run scripts like.C on arm-ubuntu?
[17:00] <robclark> CommanderGHz, probably most who are expert on that stuff are traveling right now, but if you are trying to do an arm chroot, and having network probs, did you cp /etc/resolve.conf from your host filesystem?
[17:02]  * robclark goes back to packing
[17:33] <CommanderGHz> thanks, I check the question on chan to the next days..., see you.
[18:25] <taruti> Does the 11.10 omap4 server image support hdmi output upon boot on pandaboard?
[21:48] <GrueMaster> taruti: yes, but the installation config is currently mapped to the serial port.
[21:49] <GrueMaster> Once you run through oem-config, you should get a login prompt on console.
[22:01] <taruti> hmm, so have either to get a larger sd-card or a suitable serial cable :)


[02:11] <zul> hey
[02:24] <BenC> ho
[02:26] <zul> how is it going?
[02:29] <infinity> BenC: Why do I have a feeling that "disable the debconf stuff" in kernel-package completely disabled all useful configuration (like symlink updating, creating initrd, etc, etc)?
[02:29] <infinity> BenC: The postinst on my 2.6.17-4 kernel is rather... Uhh... Light.
[02:30] <infinity> Oh, nevermind, that one was done with the old kernel-package...
[02:30] <infinity> This was produced by kernel-package version 9.001ubuntu17.
[02:31] <infinity> So, here's hoping the 2.6.17-5 kernels are less broken.
[03:04] <BenC> new kernel package is good
[03:04] <BenC> and about 10 minutes from uploading new kernel
[03:07] <zul> yay
[03:21] <BenC> hopefully this will be the knot-1 kernel
[03:49] <BenC> infinity: 5.13 uploaded
[03:49] <zul> is headers still broken
[03:50] <zul> yeah...never mind me i been in dreamland again
[04:07] <infinity> BenC: Thanks.  I'll babysit it and see if LRM works when it's done.
[04:09] <BenC> I built it locally, so there's a %40 chance it will work :)
[08:52] <kintaro> hi guys..i would like to know whats the use inetrd and sysmap..i tried compiling linux on manual before..what i did is compile then copy bzimage to /boot..and thats it then restart..not ubuntu distro....any idea..?
[11:54] <kriebly> Hi there. Does anyone know when the linux-source-2.6.15 package will be patched for latest local exploit (http://www.frsirt.com/english/advisories/2006/2816)?
[12:27] <doko> BenC: reparing to replace linux-kernel-headers 2.6.17-5.12 (using .../linux-kernel-headers_2.6.17-5.13_powerpc.deb) ...
[12:27] <doko> Unpacking replacement linux-kernel-headers ...
[12:27] <doko> dpkg: error processing /var/cache/apt/archives/linux-kernel-headers_2.6.17-5.13_powerpc.deb (--unpack):
[12:27] <doko>  trying to overwrite `/usr/include/scsi/scsi.h', which is also in package libc6-dev
[12:27] <doko> dpkg-deb: subprocess paste killed by signal (Broken pipe)
[12:28] <doko> ohh, infinity pasted that before ...
[12:43] <fabbione> include/asm/byteorder.h:5:28: error: linux/compiler.h: No such file or directory
[12:44] <fabbione> BenC: that's building git head (x86 server)
[02:15] <fabbione> BenC: WARNING: drivers/pci/hotplug/ibmphp.o - Section mismatch: reference to .exit.text: from .smp_locks after '' (at offset 0xc)
[02:15] <fabbione> TONS of those ones
[02:15] <fabbione> are they harmless?
[02:28] <fabbione> meh debconf kernel upgrading message grrr iiikkkkkk neeeee
[02:39] <zul> heylo
[02:46] <fabbione> BenC: for some reasons 1.7 lost the rhcs-modules- Provides
[02:46] <fabbione> BenC: but i don't understand crap on how the new control thing works...
[05:35] <BenC> fabbione: for linux-{image,headers} stuff, edit debian/config/flavours-control.stub
[05:40] <BenC> fabbione: The linux/compiler.h thing is harmless, and so are the warnings about mismatches
[05:58] <BenC> zul: ping
[05:58] <fabbione> BenC: ok. the problem is that only certain images should provide rhcs-modules2
[05:58] <fabbione> ah ok
[05:58] <fabbione> never mind
[05:58] <fabbione> i was right
[05:58] <fabbione> i can't just edit that one
[05:58] <fabbione> rhcs-modules2-1 is not provided by all images
[05:58] <fabbione> so either we enable GFS/OCFS everywhere or we need to find another way
[05:58] <BenC> what the provides line?
[05:58] <BenC> and where is it enabled?
[05:58] <BenC> that should be one of those things we automate somehow based on the kernel config
[06:05] <zul> BenC: pong
[06:06] <BenC> zul: #kernel-security on OFTC
[06:06] <zul> im coming
[06:10] <BenC> fabbione: as soon as you get something for me for rhcs, I am uploading 2.6.15-5.14
[06:11] <fabbione> BenC: it was on Provides before on some images
[06:11] <fabbione> BenC: i am about to push some changes but not the Provides thing
[06:12] <BenC> do a pull, I just pushed some things to fix lkh
[06:13] <BenC> rhcs-modules-2 or rhcs-modules2?
[06:15] <fabbione> rhcs-modules2-1
[06:20] <fabbione> BenC: i am theoretically done
[06:20] <fabbione> all is pushed to my edgy branch on people
[06:20] <fabbione> 2 things
[06:20] <fabbione> - make sure it build everywhere because for this test-round i was focused only on i386
[06:20] <fabbione> - gfs might export symbols and change the abi
[06:21] <fabbione>   Changes by Fabio M. Di Nitto:
[06:21] <fabbione>   * Update gfs2 to the latest git code.
[06:21] <fabbione>   * Update dlmfs to the latest git code.
[06:21] <fabbione>   * Readd gfs1 filesystem.
[06:21] <fabbione>   * Cleanup gfs1/gfs2 headers.
[06:21] <fabbione>   * Export all gfs1/gfs2/dlm headers to userland.
[06:21] <fabbione> this is my changelog
[06:22] <BenC> fabbione: hmm, I may have to skip those until I get lkh fixed
[06:22] <BenC> I have the rhcs fix in
[06:22] <fabbione> BenC: ok. they can wait
[06:22] <fabbione> BenC: but please pull them in once knot-1 is done
[06:24] <BenC> sure thing, thanks
[06:24] <fabbione> thanks to you
[07:07] <BenC> fabbione: damn you for already having a roomate in germany :P
[07:13] <BenC> hmm...I think it's time I move the 12gauge pump action shotgun off my desk
[07:21] <zul> grrr...reiserfs bad....
[07:22] <BenC> want to borrow the shotgun? :)
[07:22] <zul> yes please...
[07:45] <jbailey> BenC: 2.6.17-5 works for me with atheros wireless.
[07:45] <jbailey> Network manager in edgy happens to be broken, but iwconfig and dhclient do the right things.
[07:48] <kriebly> Hi there. Do you folks know when the linux-source-2.6.15 package will be patched for latest local exploit (http://www.frsirt.com/english/advisories/2006/2816)?
[07:49] <kriebly> (or if it will be patched)
[07:50] <BenC> kriebly: It will be uploaded shortly
[07:51] <BenC> how long it takes to get in the archive and available is up to security team
[07:51] <kriebly> good to know. Thank you!
[07:51] <kriebly> i justed wanted to find out, to see if I need to bug our developers to make some authentication utility compatible with the current kernel
[07:55] <BenC> there is  a local workaround, made possible with some mount options
[07:57] <kriebly> mounting /proc a certain way? would that break anything important?
[07:59] <zul> BenC: why is there flavour specific linux-headers?
[08:00] <BenC> zul: because the .config's are different
[08:00] <zul> ah ok
[08:00] <BenC> zul: they are created in such a way that only files that are different from linux-headers-2.6.1x-x are actually in the flavour specific packages
[08:01] <zul> ok because im just working on the xen-headers right now
[08:16] <fabbione> BenC: yeah i thought you did prefer to share with Adam and be able to smoke.. you know i did quit smoking 5 months ago
[08:16] <BenC> zul: Are you handling breezy/hoary?
[08:16] <fabbione> BenC: and ogra agreed not to smoke in the room
[08:16] <BenC> fabbione: Ah, that's a good point
[08:16] <zul> BenC: yes i will do the patch when i get home tonight
[08:16] <BenC> zul: ok, thanks
[08:24] <zul> midgets?
[08:26] <fabbione> hmmmm
[08:32] <BenC> rabid foxes
[08:32] <BenC> we've killed two of them in the past week
[08:35] <zul> meh...need faster computer..
[08:36] <zul> must...kill...wife
[08:36] <zul> patch almost done for hoary
[08:36] <fabbione> speaking of which
[08:37] <fabbione> i should really upgrade my server to dapper
[08:37] <BenC> I love being able to build linux-source for i386 in 30 minutes
[08:37] <fabbione> but now.. stop
[08:37] <fabbione> BenC: ehhehe that long? :P
[08:37] <fabbione> time to play OutRun
[08:37] <BenC> 5 kernels in 30 minutes ain't so bad :)
[08:37] <zul> it takes me a half hour to build one flavour
[08:38] <fabbione> zul: that's because you don't use ccache
[08:38] <BenC> actually, he does I think
[08:38] <mjg59> I don't have enough disk space for ccache
[08:38] <fabbione> mjg59: disk space is cheap now
[08:39] <zul> i use ccache
[08:39] <mjg59> fabbione: Not in 1.8" form, it's not
[08:39] <fabbione> zul: if you have ccache, just fork more.. export CONCURRENCY_LEVEL=16
[08:39] <mjg59> I should set up an mdns distcc farm using the pile of laptops
[08:39] <fabbione> 1.8" ????
[08:39] <mjg59> Yeah
[08:39] <fabbione> ccache+distcc = the rock
[08:40] <BenC> yeah, put those laptops to good use
[08:40] <fabbione> ok i am off
[08:40] <fabbione> later
[08:40] <BenC> later
[08:42] <zul> installing domino is so mucho fun
[10:06] <zul> later


[00:00] <chu> I *have* (begrudgingly - i.e. it was at a "special event") eaten shark's fin soup (and some other fancy Chinese "cuisine" I don't remember), bear and (forest) rat before.  Even if you cook the heck out of it and turn it to rubber,
[00:22] <elky> lamb shank soup cooked overnight in a slow cooker? you won't get rid of that smell for like a week
[00:23] <elky> yeah lamb you have to eat hot, or in a soup/braise where the fat renders off into the gravy
[00:24] <elky> shank and loin tend to not have so much of the fat, but the cheaper cuts do
[00:24] <chu> Yep, and I am *very* cheap :p
[00:25] <elky> yeah, once upon a time, lamb shanks were cheap and you got them from the butcher direct because they're "offal". now they're like $5 a piece
[00:27] <chu> Yep, same as lamb's neck - I think "Masterchef" did an episode making "Osso bucko"(sp? Slow cooked etc) and they sky-rocketed in price.\
[00:27] <elky> osso bucco is shin
[00:27] <chu> Shin?
[00:28] <chu> Oh I see.  But then again, I also can't stand miso(I think? The uber salty soup).
[01:12] <bazhang> yeah
[01:13] <bazhang> seaweed, bits of tofu in it as well
[01:14] <bazhang> for insanely nasal clearing spicy, there's nothing quite as bracing as kimchi fried bacon
[01:14] <chu> I don't mind the slightly "fried" (I think) tofu, with like a crusty outside (I assume fried) but soft inner core. I actually think that's amazing.
[01:14] <elky> baked tofu i think is what you'd ask for to get that
[01:15] <bazhang> thats called dou-gan, meaning dried dou fu
[01:16] <elky> i miss japanese food. outside japan (i'd assume is the important factor here) it is amazingly difficult to get sushi that's not glutened.
[01:17] <elky> and that problem starts with the vinegar
[01:17] <chu> Yep, but the problem is.... There's this Japanese restaurant in Canberra my family used to go to heaps (like, once every week), but then when we actually went to Japan, I couldn't eat there anymore.
[01:18] <elky> and of course finding somewhere that uses pure soy sauce is difficult because it's usually thai or tamari and thus too expensive for most shops if you're not paying top dollar for the product
[01:19] <elky> thai pure soy sauce is a rather light sauce
[01:19] <elky> ime anyway
[01:19] <bazhang> good point
[01:19] <chu> Yep
[01:20] <bazhang> some soy can be unbearably heavy and cloying, like instant BP raising
[01:20] <elky> there's a place in sydney at the west ryde station that has _awesome_ don. it's not dry, it's actually saucy, and there's actually vegetables and a soft egg. if you ever end up there, highly recommended
[01:20] <chu> Thais generally have their little 4-piece rack with like dried chilli, wet chilli (in fish sauce), sugar and salt. They kind of go on the idea "You can have it however you wan, we give you *this* dish, and you add to it as you need to".
[01:21] <bazhang> sounds great
[01:21] <bazhang> and that thai mini dish is fun to add from
[01:22] <chu> Yeah dude, it's awesome. You can actually do so much with the flavours here. Although, I tend to think Thais generally use too much sugar.
[01:22] <elky> assuming they're still run by the same people of course. they also give you a plate piled high with shredded cabbage and carrot that's been drizzled with a ginger dressing. and their agedashi tofu is nice too
[01:23] <chu> Is it like that purple cabbage?
[01:23] <elky> a mix of green and purple if i recall
[01:23] <chu> I love purple cabbage.
[01:24] <elky> sydney is weird with good eats. some of the best are right next to train stations. at parramatta station there is/was a really good thai place
[01:25] <chu> Yeah, Canberra has "Amazing, flashy French(insert other fancy country) cuisine" but it's ridiculously expensive, or "Terrible, cheap take-away(insert other fast food chain)" and really, very few in between.
[01:27] <chu> From what I understand, there's interest in making a section of the CBD sort of the "food capital" of Canberra, but there are always new proposals and very little action, so I don't know what will happen.
[01:44] <bazhang> yikes insanely huge earthquake just now
[01:45] <valorie> where, bazhang?
[01:45] <bazhang> taiwan valorie
[01:46] <valorie> :(
[01:46] <valorie> damn old ring of fire
[01:46] <bazhang> unusual for taipei to have such a huge one
[01:46] <bazhang> the computer nearly came clean off the desk
[01:46] <valorie> yikes!
[01:46] <bazhang> ikr
[01:46] <genii> Whoa!
[02:23] <elky> geonerding commencing in 3... 2...
[02:29] <elky> not quite 30km down, probably shallow enough to wipe out slums and stuff :-/
[02:31] <elky> wait how did this turn into an offtopic channel?
[09:19] <Ben64> 101 lines of off topic isn't enough?
[09:20] <Tm_T> it's enough, which is why I quieted them now
[09:20] <Tm_T> what bothers me is the behaviour of other people in the channel
[09:20] <Ben64> no you haven't
[09:20] <Tm_T> ha you're right, fixed that
[09:22] <Ben64> i just don't see the point in letting people like that continue
[09:22] <Tm_T> I would have stopped them long time ago if other wouldn't have been too hostile from the begin with
[09:23] <Ben64> well that makes no sense
[09:24] <Tm_T> when there's several people slapping around it's less easy to tackle the case with a clear cut
[09:26] <Tm_T> oh boy, I'm getting more annoyed by people behaving badly because there's troll than the troll themselves ):
[10:07] <Myrtti_> it took me a while to realise I did it too, some years back. now its painful to watch when others do it.
[17:47] <bynarie> hello is anyone available? i would like to inquire about getting my ban lifted from #ubuntu please
[18:38] <Pici> bynarie: I'm afraid that we're not willing to do that at this time.
[18:41] <bynarie> ok no problem
[18:41] <bynarie> thanks for atleast replying
[18:42] <bynarie> have a good day


[13:29] <denisw> hi
[13:29] <denisw> i would like to install ubuntu arm on a compulab trimslice, has somebody done this before?
[13:29] <denisw> (nvidia tegra 2)
[19:58] <omac> Good day :)  I have an advent vega that I installed ubuntu1204fullimage using linuxonandroid app.  very cool.  openssh works, unity takes 10-20 minutes to show up and the colors aren't displaying correctly.
[20:01] <omac> when I do lsusb nothing gets listed.  It's a tricky tablet to play with because in order to use a usb keyboard/mouse with it I needed to use usb host mode through the shuttle tools available only in the VEGACOMB3.2.  The other cyanogenmod latest version for the advent vega doesn't have usb host-mode gui tools and the tricks about holding the back button while powering up didn't bring it up in host mode.  I have been flashing roms a lot on this
[20:01] <omac> tablet as a result of this usb host mode issue.
[20:02] <omac> Advent VEGA == P10AN01 == Viewsonic ViewPad 10
[20:09] <omac> Advent VEGA requires a Type A to Type A USB cable to connect it to the computer.  Here is the one config file you need for the tablet to speak usb to ubuntu http://pastebin.com/VeMDKnja
[20:10] <omac> Under windows, there is a similar file that needs to be used with the latest android dev kit's google usb driver.  Tweak it with the above config file and you're up and running in windows 7.


[11:32] <Nothing4You> is there a way to set an env var for a runcmd command?
[11:36] <Nothing4You> i guess it could work when passing a string as command instead of a list
[23:31] <blackboxsw> Nothing4You: something like? runcmd:
[23:31] <blackboxsw>  - MINE=blah sh -c 'echo Hiya $MINE'
[23:33] <Nothing4You> blackboxsw: yeah that's what i'm doing now
[23:33] <Nothing4You> it just doesn't allow me to use the list syntax though


[07:16] <dholbach> good morning
[09:10] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Friday, and happy Bring Your Manners To Work Day! 😃
[10:49] <nik90> Mirv: Just read your landing email. The clock app update yesterday already brings custom-alarm-sound support :)
[10:50] <Mirv> nik90: oh, oh! :) I didn't check the bzr log for that one, I just didn't notice it but now I found it! great!
[10:53] <Mirv> nik90: are you replying or shall I reply to myself?
[10:54] <nik90> Mirv: Its just a minor thing, .. I de-enrolled from the mailiing list temporarily and am following it via the online web archives. Could you do it?
[10:55] <Mirv> nik90: ok, thanks! replying.
[10:55] <nik90> thnx
[11:32] <karni> going mostly offline for the weekend. I'd like to download Qt documentation, but all I can find is Qt online installer http://www.qt.io/download/ . Any pointers for me?
[11:32] <karni> I'm so used to online documentation I feel embarrased to find myself having trouble downloading it haha
[11:45] <karni> ok, I guess the only way is to use the Assistant from within the SDK :[
[11:49] <didrocks> karni: I guess you can install qt5-doc-html
[11:49] <didrocks> then, dpkg -L qt5-doc-html -> and point to the file you want in your browser
[11:50] <karni> didrocks: whee \o/ thank you!! :)
[11:50] <didrocks> yw
[15:04] <ahayzen> t1mp, when you have the adaptivepagelayout in the mode which it appears to 'push' things to a stack, i've found it sets the width of pages lower in the stack to 0 to 'hide' them, could it not set visible: false instead? as that causes some of our views to reflow :-/
[15:34] <t1mp> ahayzen: that is strange
[15:34] <t1mp> ahayzen: when a page is no longer supposed to visible in the APL, it is added to an invisible parent Item
[15:34] <t1mp> ahayzen: so then its visible property should become false
[15:34] <t1mp> ahayzen: the behavior you mention was not intentional. Can you report a bug?
[15:36] <elopio> appdevs: I made some progress with my mapillary scope. I decided to write it in go.
[15:36] <elopio> but I have some basic questions. First, on my main category, I want to have two rows of random curated photos.
[15:36] <elopio> should I feed the scope with 6 or 8 results?
[15:36] <elopio> I mean, how do I know how many results fit in a row?
[15:39] <ahayzen> t1mp, yup will do, thanks :-)
[15:44] <ahayzen> t1mp, does bug 1492343 make sense ?
[15:52] <t1mp> zsombi: around?
[15:53] <t1mp> ahayzen: yes, I confirmed it... but there is an issue with it. Writing a comment now.
[16:14] <ybon> Seems the command line to run the browser with inspector has changed again? When running "ubuntu-app-launch webbrowser-app --inspector" it does run the browser, but then try to load file:///usr/share/webbrowser-app/webbrowser/--inspector any hint?
[16:15] <ahayzen> t1mp, cool thanks, i may be able to detect if the width doesn't change when you come back to visible from what it was before and then not reflow things, i'll check if i can do that, but it would be useful if the component itself didn't make it go to zero :-)
[16:18] <ybon> cc daker popey :)
[16:19] <daker> ybon: ask oSoMoN
[16:19] <ybon> thanks :)
[16:20] <t1mp> ahayzen: so you reflow in onWidthChanged?
[16:21] <t1mp> ahayzen: what if you have onWidthChanged: { if (width [16:21] <t1mp> ahayzen: in that case, if it becomes 0 it is easier for you to distinguish between being hidden and not hidden, then if it becomes a not-0 value (for example the full AdaptivePageLayout width)
[16:22] <t1mp> ahayzen: depending on how the reflow works, you also want to do nothing when the size changes back from 0 to the previous size, of course
[16:27] <oSoMoN> ybon, the --inspector parameter is still valid, but ubuntu-app-launch interprets it as a URL, I’m not sure how to specify command-line args for an app through ual, tedg would know
[16:27] <ybon> ok thanks :)
[16:34] <ahayzen> t1mp, bet its hitting the columnWidthChanged http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~music-app-dev/music-app/refactor/view/head:/app/components/ColumnFlow.qml#L46
[16:35] <ahayzen> t1mp, i have some plans to solve it for us :-) should be able to just detect as you said
[16:51] <t1mp> ahayzen: cool :)
[16:52] <t1mp> ahayzen: if you hae a solution, please comment on the bug as well
[16:52] <t1mp> perhaps, if we don't make changes to the way it works now, we should document a solution for other people
[17:15] <tedg> ybon: If you need to specify command line args you need to do it in the desktop file or use ubuntu-app-test.
[17:15] <ahayzen> t1mp, i commented on the bug with a link to how i fixed it :-)
[17:16] <ahayzen> t1mp, note that is a super duper custom component we have :-) hehe
[17:22] <ybon> tedg: thanks for your inputs
[17:23] <ybon> tedg: I'm just trying to debug a website with my phone, actually
[17:23] <ybon> I've bash: ubuntu-app-test: command not found but can't sudo apt-get install it, it seems
[17:23] <tedg> ybon: Sure, really the browser should provide it as an action. Probably something when the HUD comes back so there doesn't have to be a UI element.
[17:24] <tedg> ybon: You'll need your image to be read-write to apt-get something.
[17:24] <ybon> ah right :)
[17:24] <ybon> thanks :)
[17:31] <ybon> tedg: "ubuntu-app-test webbrowser-app --inspector" still try to load "--inspector", so I guess I'm missing something
[17:32] <tedg> ybon: Hmm, that passess it right to the binary, so you can blame oSoMon in that case :-)
[17:33] <ybon> meeeeeeh :p
[17:33] <tedg> ybon: It seems it can take a port, perhaps --inspector=2000
[17:34] <ybon> ah wait
[17:34] <ybon> I think it tried to load --inspector' because it was the last known URL
[17:35] <ybon> humm webbrowser-app: unrecognized option '--inspector'
[17:35] <ybon> webbrowser-app: unrecognized option '--inspector=2000' too
[17:43] <ybon> though I see it in the available options when I do "ubuntu-app-test webbrowser-app --help"
[18:44] <Inglebard> Hi, someone already tries to make a cordova app ?
[18:45] <Inglebard> *for ubuntu phone
[18:55] <Inglebard> nobody ?
[23:33] <rpadovani> ahoneyburen, o/ did you receive my last mail? :-)
[23:33] <rpadovani> ahoneybun, sorry :D


[07:19] <dholbach> good morning
[07:19] <ajmitch> hi dholbach
[07:20] <dholbach> hi ajmitch
[07:24] <iulian> Morning.
[07:27] <dholbach> hi iulian
[10:50] <AnAnt> Hello
[11:35] <geser> Hi
[11:39] <sladen> hello geser
[11:39] <sladen> hello AnAnt
[11:41] <hrw> can someone sync bug 832692?
[11:42] <geser> Hi sladen
[11:45] <geser> hrw: you don't need a FFe for that as fixing a FTBFS isn't a new feature (FFe is more for new upstream revisions or when a new feature gets added to a package (e.g. enable linking against an additional library to enable a feature))
[11:48] <geser> does somebody know if the LP sync button is already in the web UI or only in the API?
[11:48] <hrw> geser: thx
[11:50] <tumbleweed> geser: web ui, but we'd like everyone to use the API
[11:50] <tumbleweed> also, be aware that it won't currently close bugs on upload
[11:51] <hakermania> How many hours remain till last-last-last Freeze???
[11:52] <tumbleweed> hakermania: wiki.ubuntu.com/OneiricReleaseSchedule
[11:53] <hakermania> tumbleweed, the exception is till Final Freeze?
[11:53] <jtaylor> what is that for an error: http://paste.ubuntu.com/673760/
[11:54] <geser> tumbleweed: doesn't the web ui use the same LP API call?
[11:54] <tumbleweed> geser: yes
[11:54] <geser> but I have to use the (updated) syncpackage script and can't push a button on the web ui?
[11:55] <tumbleweed> geser: bug 830584 for some of the issues we have wit hthe web ui
[11:57]  * tumbleweed has a quick look at adding sync blacklist support to syncpackage
[11:57] <geser> jtaylor: that usually happens when there are no files to build the deb from (e.g. when the package uses only build_indep but some packages in debian/control mention they are arch-specific)
[11:58] <jtaylor> ah ok
[11:58] <jtaylor> its a i386 and I'm trying to build on amd64
[11:58] <Rhonda> Laney: I'm up to 5 caches in 5 days, need to do one today still. :)
[11:59] <AnAnt> Hello
[11:59] <hakermania> AnAnt, hi :P
[11:59] <geser> tumbleweed: thanks for the bug number
[12:00] <geser> it would be quite handy to just press a button in the web browser to sponsor a sync request
[12:07] <tumbleweed> geser: yeah. The plan was always to make sponsor-patch handle sync sponsoring too (responsible sponsors test-build :) )
[12:09] <Laney> Rhonda: still without a gps?
[12:10] <geser> Geo-caching without a GPS?
[12:10] <hakermania> Sorry, the feature freeze exception is till the final freeze?
[12:10] <Laney> yes
[12:10] <hakermania> Nice! Much more time :)
[12:10] <Laney> erm, not really
[12:11] <Laney> it gets harder to justify the addition of new stuff as the release comes closer
[12:13] <hakermania> Laney, why so? Because of loads of work?
[12:14] <Laney> because we need to be concentrating on fixing bugs and not introducing new things, and as new source packages take up a lot of time (as you are seeing with your reviews) there needs to be a good reason for them.
[12:16] <hakermania> Laney, they take a lot of time as for the uploader, not as for the reviewer, I think... See, this is the try of one of the reviewers to build my package. It failed but it took no more than a minute: http://paste.ubuntu.com/669042/
[12:17] <Laney> right
[12:17] <Laney> so tumbleweed has not spent much time working with you on this package?
[12:17] <tumbleweed> jtalyor too
[12:18] <hakermania> Laney, yes ofcourse they have. But that's only because I'm newbie :|
[12:18] <tumbleweed> as a reviewer, I'd argue reviewers probably spend more time reviewing things than some people spend preparing them
[12:20] <hakermania> tumbleweed, that's doesn't apply on me actually, being a new coder and packager, is a hard work understanding how things work or should have worked. But thanks to you guys now all are more clear. Also, an experienced packager wouldn't need so much guidance and repeatation.
[12:21] <Rhonda> Laney: yes, still without gps.
[12:21] <Rhonda> geser: yep. :)
[12:21] <Laney> :)
[12:21] <Laney> the one on my phone works well enough
[12:22] <Rhonda> the one in google maps works well enough
[12:22] <Rhonda> At least within a city as Vienna
[12:22] <Laney> i find openstreetmap better as it marks more features
[12:28] <tumbleweed> hakermania: of course, just responding to "they take a lot of time as for the uploader, not as for the reviewer, I think..."
[12:29] <hakermania> tumbleweed, I'd really one day have as a hoppy fixing bugs :D
[12:29] <cjwatson> there's a certain amount of general archive maintenance work which kind of mounts up for every extra package in the archive, and packages introduced too late can be problematic there
[12:29] <hakermania> love^
[12:29] <cjwatson> it's not just review time
[12:30] <hakermania> cjwatson, do you refer to the new packages after FF?
[12:30] <Laney> right, it's not just about regressions or bugs in the distribution, it is about the time of people who have to deal with them
[12:31] <cjwatson> hakermania: I do
[12:31]  * cjwatson notes that he has spent most of the last week doing very little else but cleaning up after packages people weren't keeping properly up to date in various ways
[12:31] <Rhonda> Laney: well, google maps is integrated directly in geocaching.com website
[12:32] <Laney> you can get on OSM there too
[12:32] <Laney> "View dynamic map" or similar
[12:32] <Laney> cjwatson: we need to do more to get people to care for transitions they start, certainly
[12:32] <hakermania> cjwatson, this is unhappy, does this come from unresponsible uploaders? Uploaders don't care if their packages don't build in new ubuntu versions?
[12:34] <cjwatson> not all the problems are easy for people to notice, and many of the packages are just synced from Debian and don't have a specific Ubuntu uploader but need to be poked for Ubuntu in some way
[12:34] <cjwatson> but yes, some of them are just semi-abandoned
[12:34] <Laney> a lot of stuff certainly could have been predicted (libav...)
[12:34] <cjwatson> yes
[12:34] <cjwatson> I don't know why that was left for so long; I assume somebody got busys
[12:34] <cjwatson> *busy
[12:36] <cjwatson> but anyway, this contributes to more caution about adding extra packages late
[12:37] <hakermania> cjwatson, that's one reason why having a package 1stly go through debian and then import it to ubuntu is not a good idea?
[12:37] <cjwatson> no no no no no
[12:37] <cjwatson> please do that whenever you can
[12:37] <hakermania> xD
[12:37] <cjwatson> for the most part it's much less work for us and does more good for more people
[12:38] <cjwatson> but people do need to keep an eye on health in Ubuntu as well
[12:38] <cjwatson> I absolutely think people should work through Debian whenever it make sense
[12:38] <cjwatson> *makes
[12:39] <hakermania> cjwatson, So, mainly, the best way is to build a package wherever, test it that it works both on debian and ubuntu, send it to debian and import it to ubuntu :)
[12:39] <paultag> yes :)
[12:40] <paultag> just like fixing a bug in the kernel is better served in linux, and not here in Ubuntu
[12:40] <cjwatson> the problems I'm working on are not about things that worked at the time they were first built, they're about keeping up to date with library changes and the like
[12:40] <cjwatson> packages don't tend to exist in glorious isolation with no changes required
[12:44] <hakermania> I feel a bit guilty for sending my package to revu now ._. But Ubuntu is so excellent and up-to-date that it *HAS* to have its very-own programs
[12:45] <paultag> hakermania: it's actually not that much more up to date then Debian
[12:45] <paultag> hakermania: you might be thinking of debian stable? Unstable and Testing both have really up to date stuff. It's where we pull from for Ubuntu
[12:45] <paultag> something crazy like upwards of 75% of our packages are direct clones from Debian
[12:46] <Laney> huh, I went to look at the graph but it looks like MoM is borked and didn't generate the entire page
[12:46] <Laney> https://merges.ubuntu.com/universe-now.png
[12:46] <cjwatson> I don't think you should feel *guilty* about it, but it might be worth considering sending your next one to Debian
[12:47] <hakermania> paultag, I downloaded the last version of debian (the one with a space rocket or similar, lol) and when i tried installing there my package it said that multiple dependencies were missing, though the debian system itself was up-to-date
[12:47] <paultag> hakermania: it's rock solid here. The reason Ubuntu's so stable is because Debian is. We have a great relationship with them
[12:47] <cjwatson> Laney: *cough* looks like I might have left the lock held when I was last working on MoM disk space :-/
[12:47] <cjwatson> fixed I hope
[12:47] <Laney> heh
[12:48] <hakermania> paultag, I understand
[12:48] <tumbleweed> bdrung, cjwatson: sync blacklist detection for syncpackage proposed
[12:48] <Laney> Rhonda: I placed a cache outside my office window — sometimes I get to watch people looking for it :-)
[12:48] <Laney> (like now)
[12:49] <cjwatson> hakermania: you can't necessarily take a package built on Ubuntu or on a newer Debian version and install it on Debian stable; this is also true of building a package on oneiric and trying to install it on, say, lulcid
[12:49] <cjwatson> *lucid
[12:49] <bdrung> tumbleweed: do you have the time to add a bug closing feature to the tool?
[12:49] <cjwatson> it needs to be built for the release in question
[12:49] <tumbleweed> bdrung: working on that next
[12:49] <tumbleweed> bdrung: although I see talk of that happening in LP now
[12:50] <hakermania> cjwatson, so how can you test your program in both Debian and Ubuntu?
[12:50] <Laney> wouldn't it be nice if launchpad had a real blacklist feature?
[12:50] <bdrung> tumbleweed: at least -b should work (or throw an error)
[12:50] <cjwatson> hakermania: note that you said that, I diddn't
[12:50] <cjwatson> hakermania: but building it on the *oldest* usually works; or just build it for both
[12:50] <cjwatson> building it for both isn't usually necessary unless you depend on fast-moving libraries
[12:51] <hakermania> cjwatson, 'you' was general, thanks for the info
[12:51] <cjwatson> usually testing it on the one you upload to is sufficient
[12:56] <bdrung> tumbleweed: is_blacklisted could get a comment
[12:56] <tumbleweed> fair enough
[12:58] <bdrung> tumbleweed: login_anonymously is enough for the old sync way
[12:58] <tumbleweed> bdrung: yes, but I don't see the point of that (and the launchpad people really don't seem to like people using anonymous logins)
[12:59] <tumbleweed> they weren't very interested in ubuntu-sponsoring breaking when logged in anonymously
[13:00] <bdrung> tumbleweed: but why should syncpackage require the credentials if it is not needed?
[13:01] <tumbleweed> bdrung: no, but I think that'll be a minority use case
[13:01] <bdrung> tumbleweed: but not impossible
[13:02] <tumbleweed> bdrung:
[13:02] <tumbleweed> < lifeless> we only really support anonymous API access for folk doing experimentation in browsers etc - thats the primary anonymous use case.
[13:03] <tumbleweed> < tumbleweed> lifeless: I wish that were better documented. I use anonymous API access whenever I can
[13:04] <bdrung> hm, okay
[14:34] <hakermania>  Ubuntu-humour :P https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FinalFreeze
[14:35] <nigelb> that sounds like robbie.
[14:35] <nigelb> yep, robbie.
[14:53] <log69> hi all! anyone interested in helping me test my software: tomld? security related stuff. I'm about to release my first stable version soon. I gladly take any opinions or feedback of it. my site: http://log69.com/tomld_en.html
[15:01] <hakermania> log69, hi! You can also make a post at ubuntuforums.org about this.
[15:08] <log69> hakermania: ok
[18:42] <hakermania> Laney, what does this guy says here: bug 824102 ? :( I thought it was till FinalFreeze :'(
[18:45] <tumbleweed> hakermania: firstly, it's not a guy. And I don't think the UI Freeze is relevant here. But I also don't think the FFe is valid forever.
[18:47] <hakermania> tumbleweed, you said that because it's a woman? Sorry for the slang, but I use 'guy' for everyone :) I knwo FFe is not valid 4ever, it's till September 29th.
[18:49] <tumbleweed> at some point it should be re-evaluate is what I'm saying. I've asked her why she thinks UI freeze applies here
[18:50] <tumbleweed> hakermania: is it ready for another review? or are there still issues?
[18:53] <hakermania> tumbleweed, my co-developer just noticed something in the Help Files (Contents) so fixing it and it will be ready
[18:59] <iulian> hakermania: Every single day counts here and thus if you wait till the 29th of September, I'm afraid that it's not gonna get in. You have to be utterly lucky to find an archive admin to review new packages that late in the cycle.
[19:00] <hakermania> iulian, I am optimistic enough to believe that the package is fine
[19:00] <hakermania> It will be advocateed soon
[19:00] <iulian> The sooner the better.
[19:00] <hakermania> iulian, not in bed o.O
[19:00] <iulian> Er?
[19:01] <hakermania> iulian, nothing :D
[19:01] <tumbleweed> considering that some of us spent half the last feature freeze looking at it too, I'd be only to glad to see it accepted :)
[19:02] <tumbleweed> (which begs the question of why it took so long. and in future, please try to get new versions in before FF)
[19:03] <hakermania> tumbleweed, I know. I was a #%$#&$ (censored) doing so but we are in the last year of school and the most vital for our life, so we didn't have enough time to develop the application prior to FF
[19:06] <hakermania> tumbleweed, thanks :D When I told my dad about how helpful and patient some people are answered that that's the reason why this world will always tend to become better even if it seems things go bad
[19:06] <hakermania> I dunno if that's true :)
[19:07] <tumbleweed> np. We also didn't put much effort into reviews for you before FF. But that's part of the problem with REVU
[19:13] <hakermania> tumbleweed, if you can, please delete the older build tries stored at revu. They don't need to take web space there.
[19:13] <tumbleweed> sorry, I'm not a revu admin. I assume everything is kept purposely. It can be deleted when uploaded to Ubuntu
[19:46] <hakermania> tumbleweed: if you do review wallch now, don't! We forgot to remove the freeware non-commercial icons from the mime types :((((((((((
[19:46] <tumbleweed> don't worry, I'm waiting for you to tell me to
[19:47] <hakermania> ouf
[19:47] <hakermania> glad you don't trust me hehe
[20:30] <ajmitch> morning
[20:32] <hakermania> ajmitch, it 23:31 here :P
[20:32] <hakermania> it's*
[20:32] <ajmitch> yes, it'll always be night somewhere in the world :)
[20:33] <hakermania> tumbleweed, if we have made a synthesis of 2 files from a public domain should we mention that in copyright? Or the copyright of the file has passed to us as GPL3 now?
[20:34] <tumbleweed> mention it, if you don't document it, you'll forget, and then if anyone asks...
[20:35] <hakermania> +1
[20:50] <hakermania> tumbleweed, I tell you to D
[20:50] <hakermania> xD
[20:51] <tumbleweed> hakermania: ok, I'll look in half an hour or so
[20:52] <hakermania> tumbleweed, excellent :)
[20:53] <al-maisan> hello there, can somebody please shed light on the "install_egg_info" action/target, I am seeing this while building a source package in pbuilder: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/674131/
[20:54] <al-maisan> it's a python package FWIW
[21:01] <tumbleweed> al-maisan: it's metadata used by distribute / setuptools / pkg-resources
[21:01] <al-maisan> Is there a way to turn this off? Or should I leave it alone?
[21:01] <tumbleweed> leave it be
[21:02] <al-maisan> ok, thanks tumbleweed !
[22:01] <Laney> I shouldn't have approved that ffe until the package was closer to being ready
[22:01] <Laney> it's not an open ended "now you can take as long as you want" ticket
[22:03] <tumbleweed> Laney: this is how we learn :)
[22:04] <ajmitch> Laney: I'll have to file a FFe for you to approve & then leave it until a day before release, shall I? :)
[22:05] <tumbleweed> Laney: oh, I'd appreciate it i fyou could play with/review my syncpackage merges
[22:05] <bdrung> tumbleweed: tomorrow
[22:06] <bdrung> tumbleweed: i have to write in my diary and then go to bed
[22:06] <tumbleweed> bdrung: thanks
[22:06] <bdrung> tumbleweed: ups, you asked Laney - i was highlighted due to the keyword syncpackage :)
[22:07] <tumbleweed> bdrung: heh
[22:07] <bdrung> tumbleweed: after a quick look. test cases! test cases! test cases!
[22:07] <Laney> heh
[22:07] <ajmitch> does syncpackage work in new & interesting ways now?
[22:07] <tumbleweed> yeah, that's why it needs some manual testing
[22:07] <tumbleweed> ajmitch: native package sync
[22:07] <bdrung> ajmitch: especially interesting ways ;)
[22:08] <tumbleweed> bdrung: really I wish I could, but that's a *massive* job
[22:08] <ajmitch> right, I saw mention of that on irc, wasn't sure if it was in production LP yet
[22:08] <bdrung> tumbleweed: i know, but someone needs to start. otherwise the quality won't improve
[22:09] <ajmitch> at least most of the testing should have been done on the server side :)
[22:09] <bdrung> ajmitch: it will be announced once the new syncpackage is released (and hopefully after some blocker bugs are fixed)
[22:09] <ajmitch> bdrung: right
[22:09] <tumbleweed> ajmitch: well, we found a whole buch of issues when we started trying to use it...
[22:10] <ajmitch> tumbleweed: that's the nature of it
[22:11] <tumbleweed> yeah
[22:11] <ajmitch> it'll be good to lessen the load on archive admins, even if it was relatively straightforward
[22:12] <tumbleweed> right, which is why we want a client interface that works nicely
[22:14]  * tumbleweed promised quick turnaround on that dh_python2 ffe /me better look at it
[22:15] <ajmitch> that reminds me, I think I have one ffe I need to file for that
[22:16] <hakermania> tumbleweed, translations are Ok, seriously
[22:17] <tumbleweed> hakermania: ohreally? http://paste.ubuntu.com/674171/
[22:18] <hakermania> tumbleweed, see ./usr/share/wallch/translations/ ?
[22:18] <hakermania> Files are in there
[22:19] <hakermania> I just create the .qm files, move them to data/to_usr_share/wallch/translations and copy recursively this folder to $PREFIX
[22:20] <tumbleweed> hakermania: if they were there, they'd be listed. They aren't.
[22:20] <hakermania> i'll test it again :/
[22:22] <hakermania> tumbleweed: http://i.imgur.com/JZlmc.png
[22:22] <hakermania> See the md5sum
[22:23] <tumbleweed> hakermania: the md5sum will be different every time you build it. run debc, and you'll also see they aren't there
[22:24] <hakermania> tumbleweed, watch seriously the screenshot, the /usr/share/wallch doesn't exit ('ls' says it) and wallch binary isn't there ('which' says it), I run dpkg -i *.deb and then I ls /usr/share/wallch/translations and files are there
[22:25] <hakermania> All these plus the md5sum are in the screenshot
[22:25] <hakermania> And the md5sum of the DEB with the one I uploaded to revu are *exactly* the same
[22:26] <tumbleweed> hakermania: it's not about the deb you upload, it's about what deb gets produced when *I* (or anyone else) builds it
[22:26] <hakermania> why should be different?
[22:26] <ajmitch> especially as only source packages are uploaded to ubuntu, so what counts is the binary package that the buildds produce
[22:26] <tumbleweed> it shouldn't
[22:26] <hakermania> tumbleweed, why it IS?
[22:27] <tumbleweed> hakermania: have you run debc on the deb you built. Are the translations there?
[22:28] <hakermania> tumbleweed, it says it can't read the .changes file
[22:28] <tumbleweed> point it at the _i386.changes file
[22:28] <hakermania> oh
[22:29] <hakermania> tumbleweed, yes, they are http://i.imgur.com/6H0WO.png
[22:29] <cjwatson> why is the man page in section 2?
[22:29] <tumbleweed> hrm, interesting
[22:29] <hakermania> tumbleweed, yes, indeed :D
[22:30] <ajmitch> possibly a missing build-dependency for building translations
[22:30] <hakermania> cjwatson, are you talking to me?
[22:30] <cjwatson> yes
[22:31] <hakermania> cjwatson, lintian told me that it should be there (it is wallch 2.0 no 1.0)
[22:31] <cjwatson> you misread it
[22:31] <hakermania> :|
[22:31] <cjwatson> the version number of the software is irrelevant
[22:31] <cjwatson> section 2 is for system calls - the interface between the kernel and userspace
[22:31] <hakermania> cjwatson, omg :)
[22:31] <cjwatson> manual pages for ordinary user programs belong in section 1
[22:32] <hakermania> cjwatson, well, I will fix this ;)
[22:32] <cjwatson> thanks
[22:32] <cjwatson> lintian was probably identifying some other real problem, but without seeing the exact warning it gave you it's hard to say exactly what
[22:39] <tumbleweed> hakermania: it was actually due to the --parallel. Your changes to the qm file installation aren't parallel-make-safe
[22:40] <hakermania> tumbleweed, Yeah, i can understand why.
[22:41] <hakermania> They are built and then moved to $prefix/share/wallch/translations, if this isn't done with the right order nothing will be moved
[22:41] <tumbleweed> right, and make doesn't guarantee the order rules will be run in
[22:41] <hakermania> So, should I just remove the parallel?
[22:41] <tumbleweed> I'd fix the makefile :)
[22:42] <hakermania> tumbleweed, hm, a clever thought would be to make the same rule building and moving the files, I'll try this, but I won't be able to test if it will work or not :/ I may still work for me but not for you
[22:42] <hakermania> How could I test it?
[22:43] <hakermania> It*
[22:43] <cjwatson> dependencies are the usual way to force things in the correct order
[22:44] <hakermania> also data/mime contain a wallch.xml file which is ours, so I will prefer the data/mime/x/* format
[22:44] <cjwatson> I find it hard to believe that --parallel gains you any significant amount of build time
[22:44] <hakermania> cjwatson, sorry but i don't get you. The only thing i know about dependencies are the build ones and the normal ones :/
[22:44] <tumbleweed> in this case install_helpfiles_and_translations builds the translations, install_configfiles installs them
[22:44] <tumbleweed> it really should just be tidied
[22:45] <hakermania> Yeah, I see
[22:45] <cjwatson> the concept is explained in make's documentation, although I haven't looked at your build system in any detail
[22:45] <tumbleweed> cjwatson: yeah I askedb for that because I'd built it a few times, and it's nice to have something build almost 8 times as fast...
[22:45] <cjwatson> ccache :)
[22:45]  * tumbleweed hasn't set that up in my sbuild
[22:49] <hakermania> tumbleweed, yes, it should be tidied but I assumed that while I INSTALLS 1stly the one and then the other the job will be done correctly
[22:50] <hakermania> tumbleweed, about the synthesized image, i'd like to completely remove the info from the copyright, we are the holders and this goes to *
[22:50] <hakermania> Files: *^
[22:51] <tumbleweed> hakermania: fine, I don't care that much (I've made you review the copyright on the images, that was the most important thing)
[22:51] <tumbleweed> if install_configfiles depends on things from install_helpfiles_and_translations, it should depend on install_helpfiles_and_translations
[22:52] <tumbleweed> really I think you should separate the translations and helpfiles (tehy got to separate places) and remove configfiles (you don't have any)
[22:55] <hakermania> tumbleweed, I thought separating the helpfiles from translations, removing completely translations and making unix:configfiles.extra and there making the translation binaries
[22:56] <hakermania> it's all in one, they are moved by configfiles and build from configfiles, i'm just saying
[22:57] <hakermania> If the unix commands are run firstly and then it installs the target to path, problem solved. One moment to test it :D
[22:57] <tumbleweed> oh also when chaining commands together you should probably use && rather than ;
[22:57] <hakermania> hm
[22:57] <hakermania> ok, thanks
[22:57] <tumbleweed> otherwise if one of the ones in the middle fails, you'll never know
[23:07] <hakermania> yeah, it is as I said
[23:10] <hakermania> cjwatson: I don't think that I didn't understood correctly, the error is: W: wallch: manpage-section-mismatch /usr/share/man/man1/wallch.1.gz:1 1 != 2
[23:10] <hakermania> ohhh
[23:10] <hakermania> just change the 1.gz to 2.gz?
[23:11] <cjwatson> no absolute not
[23:11] <cjwatson> *absolutely
[23:11] <cjwatson> it says that because the .TH field in your manual page says 2.  change it to 1
[23:11] <cjwatson> if you run the output from lintian through the lintian-info program, it will give you more information
[23:11] <cjwatson> http://lintian.debian.org/tags/manpage-section-mismatch.html
[23:14] <hakermania> cjwatson, I am curious to know why the error was gone when I moved it to man2
[23:15] <cjwatson> because then the file name and the .TH header matched - that's all that check tests
[23:15] <cjwatson> that doesn't mean that the admittedly consistent state you ended up in was correct
[23:15] <hakermania> cjwatson, thx :)
[23:24] <hakermania> Of :) there's a new upload... enough for today I think, goodnight it's almost hald past too and I miss my bed :P thanks guys again for all the help :)


[00:33] <diddledan> daftykins, I agree, I'm not dead yet so they're ok
[00:34] <diddledan> cremepocalypse averted
[00:34] <diddledan> or should that be eggmageddon?
[00:35] <daftykins> :D
[00:35] <daftykins> i ought to introduce you to a pun master from another chan
[03:08] <zmoylan-pi> pi 2 http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/02/02/raspberry_pi_model_2/
[03:43] <daftykins> zmoylan-pi: you'll have to upgrade
[03:44] <daftykins> ;D
[03:45] <zmoylan-pi> not an upgrade, more start a herd
[03:51] <daftykins> :>
[03:51] <daftykins> no real talk of graphics improvement 0o
[03:53] <zmoylan-pi> no problem for me on that account
[04:17] <mapps> hi all
[04:17] <mapps> gonna try and quit smoking and drinking this month
[04:17] <mapps> :D
[04:19] <daftykins> \o/
[04:19] <daftykins> gl!
[04:19] <mapps> unlikely il manage;p
[04:20] <mapps> been doing it for too long
[04:20] <daftykins> well you probably can't go cold turkey on either
[04:20] <mapps> my dad said he hates me coming home as i do the same there
[04:20] <mapps> yea
[04:21] <mapps> im the embarassment of the street :)
[04:21] <mapps> million pound houses and then idiot mapps that cant stop drinking!
[04:22] <zmoylan-pi> won't doing both at same time be extra hard?
[04:22] <mapps> yea
[04:22] <daftykins> mapps: you from a fancy area 0o
[04:22] <mapps> hence il proably fail
[04:23] <mapps> daftykins Knighstbridge
[04:23] <zmoylan-pi> could try switching to e-cigarette.  seems to work for quite a few
[04:23] <mapps> sister lives in Surrey
[04:23] <daftykins> sorry, don't really know England to know the name
[04:23] <mapps> hm
[04:23] <mapps> knightsbridge is ctl london
[04:23] <daftykins> zmoylan-pi: yeah i think i mentioned that once, didn't think mapps was a fan
[04:23] <mapps> surrey south east
[04:23] <mapps> :)
[04:23] <daftykins> ah right
[04:23] <daftykins> what does a mill buy? :)
[04:23] <daftykins> boss had a flat in Chelsea at one point
[04:23] <mapps> a one bed flat
[04:23] <mapps> lol
[04:23] <daftykins> O_O
[04:24] <daftykins> figures :>
[04:24] <mapps> dad lived there for years
[04:24] <mapps> he's 66 remember
[04:24] <zmoylan-pi> but it had enough room to swing a cat hopefully
[04:24] <mapps> he lives in a hm 3 bed place
[04:24] <mapps> 3 bed is stretching it;p
[04:28] <mapps> my house in stoke is bigger than my dads place
[04:28] <mapps> but because of postcodes its worth like 1/20:)
[04:50] <daftykins> o0
[04:50] <daftykins> bed for me
[04:50] <daftykins> nn gents \o have a good week
[04:50] <mapps> nn
[04:51] <zmoylan-pi> cya o/
[07:16] <diddledan> the raspi2 has an armv7 cortex a7 core - does that mean it'll run ubuntu OTB?
[07:20] <zmoylan-pi> time will tell, a lot of questions will be asked AND answered today
[07:22] <diddledan> also daftykins appears correct in that they don't actually say what the new chip has in terms of gfx - they say extensively what the old one had
[07:23] <mapps> hm
[07:23] <diddledan> from the article: The BCM2835, as used in previous Pis, is a Broadcom GPU – the VideoCore IV – with a single 700MHz 32-bit ARM1176JZF-S application core glued in to run software.
[07:24] <diddledan> I would hope that either the chip has the same api as the previous or that broadcom also do a spec dump for opensource driver programmers to be able to create free/libre drivers for it like they're working on for the original
[07:41] <ali1234> officially the raspberry pi only has opengl
[07:42] <diddledan> ali1234, you still need to marshall opengl into the registers tho
[07:42] <ali1234> it is highly likely the new chip is exactly the same as the old one, but with 4 arm cores instead of 1
[07:42] <diddledan> ali1234, and that's what the driver is for
[07:43] <ali1234> the driver is nearly completely undocumented
[07:43] <ali1234> there is a source code dump from another videocore chip, but not the one used in the pi
[07:43] <diddledan> hence why people are working on it
[07:43] <ali1234> it's similar enough that some people kind of got it working
[07:44] <ali1234> anyway, given they only bumped one digit, i can pretty much guarantee this is what they've done
[07:45] <diddledan> they say in the article that the new soc is "very very similar" so I'm guessing the only change is going from single core to quad core arm and the doubling of the PoP ram
[07:45] <ali1234> exactly
[07:45] <ali1234> and likely doubling the power consumption as well
[07:46] <ali1234> most people try to use the raspberry pi as a small computer or media player
[07:46] <ali1234> it's really not powerful enough for that
[07:47] <ali1234> so this will help them
[07:47] <ali1234> for embedded, it will just burn even more power
[07:49] <diddledan> they do say "armv7 and cortex-a7" tho, which would suggest the arm has a different arch to the previous chip
[07:49] <diddledan> obv backwards compatible but potentially able to run stock ubuntu arm
[07:50] <ali1234> yes it is
[07:50] <ali1234> but again, that is only really interesting to people who want to try to use it as a computer
[07:50] <ali1234> and it still isn't really powerful enough for that
[08:11] <MooDoo> morning all
[08:21] <diddledan> moo
[08:37] <MooDoo> anyone know of anyone in nottingham looking for an IT position?
[08:37] <MooDoo> well not necassarily just nottingham
[08:48]  * diddledan heads off to find chocolate before starting to work.
[09:10] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[09:12] <MartijnV1S> hi brobostigon
[09:14] <brobostigon> hi MartijnVdS
[09:18] <bashrc> morning
[09:19] <brobostigon> morning bashrc
[09:21] <davmor2> Morning all
[09:27] <czajkowski> aloha
[09:27] <zmoylan-pi> how's the lungs czajkowski?
[09:28] <czajkowski> zmoylan-pi: hanging in
[09:28] <czajkowski> getting better thanks
[09:28] <zmoylan-pi> watch fosdem on streaming?
[09:28] <diddledan> allo everyone who said morning while i wasn't watching :-p
[09:28] <knightwise> morning everyone
[09:29] <knightwise> Fosdem was great .. but snowy
[09:29] <knightwise> too bad I didn't get a chance to meet Popey or any of the other ubuntu-uk rockstars :(
[09:29] <knightwise> Did go to the HPR BOF Meetup
[09:31] <diddledan> so raspi say that windows10 will run on the 2B
[09:32] <diddledan> so do ms: http://dev.windows.com/en-us/featured/raspberrypi2support
[09:32] <MartijnVdS> is it April yet?
[09:33] <zmoylan-pi> for amusing values of /run/ :-)
[09:34] <awilkins> Windows 10 for RaspPi2 for FREE
[09:34] <awilkins> ROLL YOUR SLEEVES UP GUYS. FIRST ONE'S FREE.
[09:34] <diddledan> awilkins, yes
[09:35] <awilkins> Wonder if you can get a decent high-res head-up display goggle set
[09:35] <zmoylan-pi> when the monthly rental of windows 10 costs more than the computer...
[09:35] <awilkins> That plus a Pi2 plus a reasonably large battery and a USB KB/Mouse
[09:36] <awilkins> CYBERDECK
[09:36] <zmoylan-pi> with a 7" screen
[09:38] <knightwise> hmmm
[09:38] <knightwise> does anybody know a graphical image writer for Ubuntu ?
[09:39] <knightwise> i need to convert my retropi sd card back to a backup .img
[09:39] <knightwise> and dd is going to be a pain in the ass since i'm doing this on my chromebook and I have a lot of partitions mounted
[09:47] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Monday, and happy World Wetlands Day! :-D
[09:47] <zmoylan-pi> no no happy raspberry pi 2 day jamestait :-)
[09:51] <JamesTait> zmoylan-pi, yes, I got a mail from pimoroni about it this morning. :)
[09:51] <JamesTait> Ubuntu on the raspi 2?
[09:51] <MartijnVdS> that should work
[09:52] <awilkins> Is the new one ARM7?
[09:52] <diddledan> awilkins, yes
[09:52] <awilkins> Then it should work AFAIK
[09:52] <awilkins> Problem with the Pi1 was that it was ARM6
[09:53] <zmoylan-pi> wonder if dropbox will get around to sorting a client for new pi
[09:53] <davmor2> JamesTait: oh you must take a trip to slimbridge
[09:53] <davmor2> JamesTait: http://www.wwt.org.uk/wetland-centres/slimbridge/
[09:53] <bashrc> I wonder if the new Pi can have ordinary Debian installed
[09:53] <JamesTait> awilkins, that was my first thought, too. :)
[09:55] <JamesTait> That looks nice, davmor2.
[09:55] <davmor2> JamesTait: would be a nice day out for you and your family possibly when it is a bit warmer :)
[09:57] <JamesTait> davmor2, added to the school holiday list. ;)
[10:02] <awilkins> Already a Snappy Ubuntu Core image for RasPi2 up
[10:04] <knightwise> hmmm :) Im happy I waited for this new model
[10:11] <cocoa117> is there a way to create vlan on ethernet card without installing vlan package?
[10:11] <MartijnVdS> cocoa117: yes, using the "ip" tool
[10:11] <MartijnVdS> cocoa117: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/VLAN#Create_the_VLAN_device shows how
[11:41] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[11:56] <MooDoo> morning bigcalm
[11:57] <bigcalm> \o
[12:30] <ChunkzZ> I probably shouldn't ask here but has anyone quit smoking?
[12:34] <bigcalm> p/
[12:34] <bigcalm> o/ even
[12:34] <MartijnVdS> q/
[12:34] <ChunkzZ> :/
[12:35] <bigcalm> Quit cold turkey. Ate a lot of chocolate things. Gave my parents hell for 3 weeks
[12:35] <MartijnVdS> quit what?
 I probably shouldn't ask here but has anyone quit smoking?
[12:35] <ChunkzZ> bigcalm, I tried that and lasted 3 days lol
[12:36] <MartijnVdS> I just never started in the first place
[12:36] <bigcalm> I was off work with a back injury for 20 months. Bored and wanted something to do
[12:36] <ChunkzZ> you smoke now bigcalm ?
[12:47] <bigcalm> Nope, quit 26th August 2002
[12:47] <bigcalm> Oh, I'm late
[14:14] <knightwise> man its quiet here
[14:14] <knightwise> everyone still drunk from Fossdem ?
[14:15] <bashrc> I guess
[14:16] <knightwise> I went and had a peek yesterday morning
[14:18] <s3_virge> hi
[14:18] <s3_virge> someone can help me to change resolution on vesa mode?
[14:30] <davmor2> knightwise: still no popey won't be loud again properly till tomorrow
[15:06] <knightwise> davmor2: I think you might be right.
[15:06]  * knightwise is miffed .. misplaced my 64 gig SD card :(
[15:07] <davmor2> knightwise: did you misplace it into an envelope and send it to me?
[15:07] <awilkins> ctrl-alt-del logout - is there actually a way to abort it
[15:07] <awilkins> And un-configure that shortcut too
[15:08] <awilkins> I have a small keyboard I use for webconferences because my Model M is too loud...
[15:08] <awilkins> But ctrl-alt-del is painfully close to ctrl-alt-left on it
[15:08] <awilkins> So when I shift workspaces I sometimes hit logout
[15:08] <awilkins> Now I have a "log out" prompt obscuring my view in a webconf
[15:09] <awilkins> Is there a way to cancel the logout? Clicking the "close" box on the logout dialog isn't doing anything
[15:13] <awilkins> None of the other buttons on the dialog are working either
[15:13] <awilkins> Arrgh
[15:13] <cocoa117> how do  you create /etc/network/interfaces so ubuntu 14.04 can do vlan on device name p2p1 for example
[15:14] <MartijnVdS> cocoa117: just add an interface named "p2p1.2" for VLAN 2
[15:14] <moreati> awilkins: the ESC key? Perhaps twice
[15:15] <MartijnVdS> cocoa117: and configure it as normal
[15:15] <MartijnVdS> (or .200 for VLAN 200 etc)
[15:15] <awilkins> moreati, Naah, that's not doing it
[15:15] <awilkins> moreati, not sure if I pushed ctrl-alt-del twice
[15:16] <moreati> awilkins: are you sure the dialog has keyboard focus?
[15:17] <awilkins> moreati, It doesn't have a window in the task switcher
[15:17] <awilkins> Even if I minimise all the other windows and click on it it doesn't respond
[15:17] <moreati> awilkins: then I'm out of ideas
[15:18] <awilkins> Think it's a Unity overlay anyway
[15:18] <awilkins> Has that "polarised filter" effect on the rest of the desktop
[15:19] <knightwise> davmor2: I wish i did
[15:20] <awilkins> Doing unity --replace a couple of times seems to have rectified matters
[15:20] <awilkins> .. and smushed all my windows into one workspace, but that's not so bad
[15:21] <awilkins> DIdn't interrupt my webconference
[15:21] <cocoa117> MartijnVdS, Do i need to install vlan package?
[15:21] <MartijnVdS> cocoa117: probably
[15:22]  * awilkins disables ctrl-alt-del
[15:22] <MartijnVdS> cocoa117: because that contains the /etc/network/interfaces scripts
[15:22] <MartijnVdS> cocoa117: (that handle vlans)
[15:22] <cocoa117> MartijnVdS, that explains it. the ifup keep saying it don't undertand p2p1.2, unknown interface
[16:26] <shauno> hm.  ordered a new pi.  I'm curious :)
[16:31] <awilkins> Pi2 is popular
[16:31] <awilkins> You order it from RS?
[16:32] <shauno> from 'the pi hut' because farnell wasn't responding
[16:33] <awilkins> Bums, RS sold out of the attractive black case I had in my shopping basket
[16:34] <awilkins> What's the shipping at Pi Hut?
[16:35] <shauno> 2 quid to ireland, dunno what it's like within the uk
[16:35] <shauno> (I assume less  heh)
[16:35] <awilkins> RS has a list price of £22.85 for a Pi2 but implies that their free shipping is only available to business customers
[16:36] <awilkins> Aha, £4.95 "handling fee" on orders they suspect of being FOR YOUR PERSONAL USE, SCUM#
[16:37] <awilkins> HOW DARE YOU BUY STUFF FROM US FOR HOBBY REASONS
[16:37] <shauno> haven't bothered with a case though.  nothing else on my desk still has it's clothes on, so going out of my way to pretend I'll house it seems silly
[16:37] <awilkins> YOUR MONEY IS FULL OF ICKY PERSONAL TAINT
[16:38] <awilkins> My other Pi is currently just lying in a tangle of wires next to my router
[16:38] <shauno> actually, I like, my monitor still has its pants on.  because it's a crt, and they scare me
[16:38] <shauno> er, *lie
[16:38] <awilkins> Yeah
[16:38] <awilkins> CRTs contain the spirit of sudden death
[16:38] <awilkins> Poke the wrong bit and feel his wrath. Briefly.  The RS website is intended for use by business customers and not by consumers or private individuals. Notwithstanding the foregoing, nothing in these terms and conditions of sale shall affect the statutory rights of a Customer who deals as a consumer. "
[16:40] <shauno> this is why I like farnell.  they treat my money like money  lol
[16:41] <awilkins> I remember poring over the RS catalogue when I was a kid and lusting after things, and realizing that they sell certain things WAY above the right price
[16:41] <ali1234> it's not very hard to convince them you are a business
[16:41] <shauno> (and their free next-day isn't kidding.  they don't act like Ireland's somewhere left of ghana)
[16:41] <ali1234> farnell are better but they don't have as much range
[16:42] <shauno> I'll take "less things that they want to sell me" over "more things that they don't want to sell me"
[16:42] <vnc_turps> well, depends on the part of ireland your in...
[16:43] <awilkins> Farnell : awaiting delivery
[16:43] <shauno> I'm in the good part :)  where "swimmers attacked by dolphins" is a headline news
[16:45] <shauno> http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-29460544
[16:45] <shauno> none of that scary, miserable news the north puts up with
[16:46] <awilkins> RS seem to have underordered the cheaper cases for Pi B+
[16:46] <awilkins> Seems a foolish thing on Pi2 day
[16:48] <vnc_turps> won't the 2 fit in b+ case?
[16:48] <awilkins> Yes
[16:48] <ali1234> it depends on the case actually
[16:48] <awilkins> Same form factor / port placement
[16:48] <shauno> I'm just curious to see what it'll do for retropie.  it might actually make ps1 playable
[16:48] <shauno> although if it can run opencpn without crying, I know a few people who'll be very happy
[16:49] <ali1234> shauno: it might just about do PS1
[16:50] <shauno> I've a few games that are surprisingly close on the stock B.  so I'm optimistic
[16:50] <awilkins> £2 shipping for Pi Hut / UK
[16:52] <awilkins> And much higher prices (20% higher... ohwait, are RS prices exVAT)
[16:53] <awilkins> And they have this reallly prrrrty case http://thepihut.com/products/flirc-raspberry-pi-b-case
[16:53] <ali1234> lol
[16:53] <ali1234> that's super ugly
[16:53] <awilkins> Aha
[16:53] <awilkins> RS prices are exVAT
[16:53] <awilkins> so the price is really £27.42
[16:53] <awilkins> Not £22.85
[16:54]  * awilkins shakes fist at their "business to business" face
[16:54] <ali1234> http://shop.pimoroni.com/products/raspberry-pi-2-with-pibow
[16:54] <vnc_turps> set up a corporation with your cat as ceo before making an order...
[16:55] <awilkins> All that paperwork for less than a fiver... think I'll pass :-)
[16:56] <awilkins> The PiBow cases are cool
[16:56] <awilkins> But a bit hobby
[16:56] <vnc_turps> it'll be a tortoiseshell company... :-)
[16:57] <awilkins> A Manx corporation might have better tax advantages
[16:57] <ali1234> http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/100/097/business-cat-19.jpg
[17:01] <awilkins> http://www.businesscat.happyjar.com/comic/photocopier/
[18:08] <mapps> hi all
[18:09] <mapps> icelands last mcdonalds shut down the papers say...cant imagine that ever happening here
[18:10] <zmoylan-pi> all the fat people migrating south could tip the country over... :-P
[18:10] <davmor2> mapps: it's the cost of getting stuff there made them the world most expensive burgers
[18:23] <DJones> mapps: We can only hope and pray
[18:24] <DJones> The sawmills would go out of business if they shut down
[18:25] <popey> \o/ home
[18:25] <DJones> popey: I'll assume that was an appropiate answer in -irc
[18:26] <DJones> Welcome back btw
[18:26] <popey> ta
[18:33] <popey> \o/ raspberry pi 2 ordered
[18:43] <Azelphur> Anyone handy with debugging optimus? getting primus: fatal: Bumblebee daemon reported: error: Could not load GPU driver
[19:09] <ali1234> well this is annoying
[19:09] <ali1234> printer prints the first 100 pages of my document
[19:09] <ali1234> then overheats and starts printing one page every 5 minutes
[19:10] <ali1234> and i have another 100 pages to print
[19:15] <davmor2> popey: you snappy whore you ;)
[19:15] <davmor2> ali1234: that's what a library is for :)
[19:15] <popey> davmor2: wat
[19:16] <davmor2> popey: you only want to run snappy on your pi2
[19:16] <popey> thats one thing i wanna do
[19:16] <ali1234> if you put snappy on pi2, can you turn it into a "normal" apt-get system, like you can on the phone?
[19:16] <ali1234> someone asked me this today, and i didn't know the answer
[19:16] <popey> no
[19:17] <popey> i dont think snappy builds are the same as the phone builds
[19:17] <ali1234> ... why not?
[19:17] <davmor2> ali1234: no snappy use snaps
[19:17] <popey> i dont think it has debs
[19:17] <popey> at all
[19:17] <ali1234> well, that's stupid
[19:17] <ali1234> why duplicate all that work?
[19:18] <popey> to be fair i haven't ripped apart a snappy image yet
[19:18] <popey> so i may be wrong
[19:19] <popey> you'd have to ask in #snappy I think :)
[19:19] <ali1234> i sent em to #ubuntu-arm
[19:19] <ali1234> not sure if that's still a thing or not
[19:19] <popey> oh, I'm wrong, i see /var/lib/dpkg inside it.
[19:19] <popey> just double clicked the ubuntu-core.img and it mounted in nautilus
[19:22] <davmor2> popey, ali1234: snaps and clicks use deb format for installs but there is no apt-get on snappy and I don't think there is a snappy install apt-get either. So dpkg might work but you would have to hack it to make the system read write then install apt-get then install the package you wanted.  However you could just use ubuntu-core rather than snappy
[19:22] <davmor2> that would then give you a deb system I believe
[19:28] <ali1234> davmor2: the question is specifically in reference to the pi2 for which there is only a snappy image currently, afaik
[19:29] <davmor2> ali1234: indeed, and snappy has no apt-get and the system is read only.  So you can only install into containers effectively.
[19:30] <ali1234> well the issue is that nearly everyone who uses a raspberry pi is trying to use it as a cheap ass computer
[19:30] <ali1234> they are all asking "wtf is snappy, i just want apt-get"
[19:31] <davmor2> ali1234: best place to discuss it is #snappy
[19:32] <ali1234> the perception seems to be that snappy is like raspbian with a proprietary app store and no ability to install debs, and no reason to exist
[19:33] <shauno> I don't think it's actually a Snappy issue.  it's more that it's the only ubuntu download offered on rpi's site, and with no explanation that 'snappy' in 'snappy ubuntu core' isn't just an adjective
[19:33] <ali1234> right
[19:33] <ali1234> today in #raspberrypi i saw more hate for canonical than microsoft
[19:34] <shauno> that'll likely change once msft actually delivers something ;)
[19:35] <shauno> msft are describing their release as "Windows Developer Program for IoT".  which sounds like it's geared to present exactly the same "expected ubuntu, got snappy" issue
[19:36] <shauno> (where they're treating the pi as a target to deploy to, not a desktop to run on)
[19:36] <ali1234> to be fair, it's not their fault that people are using the thing wrong
[19:36] <ali1234> the pi 2 will make a rubbish desktop just like the old one did
[19:37] <ali1234> but that's all anyone does with it because ... derp
[19:40] <ali1234> the funny thing is that snappy would be perfect for my application, but my application uses the A+ because it's on batteries, so i can't use snappy
[19:41] <ali1234> switching to the pi 2 would quarter my battery life
[19:43] <shauno> I'm curious to see how that goes too.  I've read that the Pi2 uses 'more', but no numbers
[19:52] <directhex> http://blog.barisione.org/2015-02/webkit-rpi2/
[20:18] <davmor2> night all
[20:31] <popey> directhex: is there some public steam info thing which shows which games have clocked up more hours, and who clocked up the most?
[20:32] <directhex> i don't think so. not cumulatively. someone did statistical sampling of user profiles
[20:40] <ali1234> popey: that website that tells you how long it will take to finish all your games
[20:40] <ali1234> it uses the average time people played each game
[20:40] <popey> ah
[20:40] <ali1234> so if you go to the data source and then also get sales numbers and then multiply
[20:40] <ali1234> that should give you a ballpark?
[21:35] <popey> never ceases to amaze me what people will back https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/217809965/sleev-protect-your-wires-from-damage
[21:45] <ali1234> heat shrink tubing?
[21:45] <ali1234> lolololololol
[21:45] <ali1234> LOL
[21:45] <ali1234> hahaha
[21:45] <ali1234> why didn't i think of this
[21:45] <ali1234> $5 for 10cm of heat shrink tubing
[21:46] <ali1234> which costs $1 per m
[22:25]  * zmoylan-pi has urge to do a kickstarter for red bubblewrap with tension sheet written on it... :-D
[22:46] <shauno> hm, see, that's what I suspected - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8983801   "Windows 10 on Pi 2 will be an IoT platform, not a desktop OS. You'll develop your app in Visual Studio on a Windows PC and deploy it to the Pi.
[23:08] <zmoylan-pi> yeah, couldn't see a pi 2 doing anything than barely displaying desktop and running full pelt just to do that
[23:08] <zmoylan-pi> windows is a resource hog, always has been
[23:09] <zmoylan-pi> it'd be interesting if you could make the one app deployed chrome or some other extension capable browser
[23:45] <gioans> #ubuntu-uk
[23:45] <gioans> hello