[03:16] <Madpilot> odd... Stephan Hermann's blog has just reposted the same batch of old articles to the top of planet.u.c...
[03:24] <Madpilot> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HowToGetAdobeAcrobatReaderWorking  <-- this doesn't appear to apply to English-language Breezy installs; I just installed Adobe Acrobat Reader last night and it worked right after Synaptic installed it...
[03:33] <hyperactivecrond> guys i'll do the install guide
[03:33] <hyperactivecrond> for dapper
[03:36] <hyperactivecrond> seriously i will
[07:06] <jabra> anyone around?
[07:09] <robitaille> yes
[07:09] <jabra> how is the ubuntu guide for breezy coming?
[07:09] <jabra> also I wrote up a install guide step-by-step if you guys want it?
[07:18] <robitaille> http://www.ubuntuguide.org/ has nothing to do with this DocTeam.  So you should talk to them directly since there is not really a collaboration between us and them
[07:19] <robitaille> As for an install guide, you can send it to the mailing list, or put it on the wiki. Then we can check it out
[07:23] <jabra> ok sorry for my confusion
[07:24] <robitaille> no problem.  happens all the time :)
[07:24] <jabra> where on the wiki should I put it?
[07:24] <jabra> and which section
[07:25] <robitaille> why don't you put it in a subsection of your wiki page for now.  Once you are happy with it, you can always move it into a more official location
[07:26] <jabra> I put it up already online if you want to link it?
[07:26] <jabra> figured it would be useful last week when breezy was released
[07:27] <jabra> plus I didn't know if you guys would accept someting since I am not a "official" member of ubuntu yet
[07:28] <jabra> http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/jabra/breezy-docs.html
[07:29] <robitaille> we access anything that's good and useful.  Why don't you join the mailing list, and then send the link there so that people can comment on it?
[07:29] <robitaille> s/access/accept
[07:29] <jabra> google: ubuntu breezy install (5th hit)
[07:29] <jabra> ok will
[07:29] <jabra> let me find it
[07:29] <robitaille> because it's pretty quiet tonight, so it's not clear how many people are around right now :)
[07:31] <jabra> right
[07:31] <jabra> i'll send it to the mailing list
[07:31] <robitaille> the url doesn't seems to work right now from my home computer
[07:34] <jabra> i'll net connection is flaky i'll have to check it tomorrow
[07:40] <jabra> http://www2.shellbot.net:8080/breezy-docs.html
[07:40] <jabra> if the first is down
[07:40] <jabra> i'll post those tomorrow
[07:52] <robitaille> jabra,  it worked.  It just took a while to connect to the server
[08:12] <jabra> ya
[08:12] <jabra> ok
[08:14] <jabra> wat do you think
[08:16] <robitaille> looks pretty good.  nice screenshots
[08:16] <jabra> thanks
[08:17] <jabra> made some video's of it but that need the vmware codex to play it
[08:17] <jabra> so I removed the video's
[08:17] <jabra> well I removed just the link they are still there
[08:18] <jabra> tired to make it as easy as possible so anyone could install it
[08:18] <jabra> *tried
[08:22] <jabra> *sent* to the mailing list
[02:51] <apokryphos> I think it would be a good idea to get a mention of h.u.c on http://www.ubuntu.com/support (currently only the wiki is mentioned)
[02:52] <rob^> we are
[02:52] <rob^> :)
[02:57] <apokryphos> damn skim-reading; ok, good to know
[03:08] <rob^> xubuntu docs have arrived
[03:31] <jsgotangco> hi ho
[03:31] <rob^> hi jsgotangco
[03:33] <jsgotangco> hey rob^
[03:33] <jsgotangco> :)
[03:33] <rob^> everything goes blue :)
[03:38] <jsgotangco> lol
[03:39] <rob^> its perrdy
[03:39] <jsgotangco> konqueror doesn't seem to like gmail though...
[03:40] <rob^> heh
[03:40] <rob^> sometimes evo has a spit about it too
[03:41] <rob^> night jsgotangco
[03:42] <jsgotangco> night rob^
[03:42] <jsgotangco> :)
[03:42] <jsgotangco> have a good weekend
[03:42] <rob^> heh its half over
[03:42] <rob^> bloody work
[03:42] <rob^> ?
[03:43] <rob^> what the heck happend there?
[03:43] <rob^> ah I get it
[04:04] <hyperactivecrond> i'll do the install guide
[04:06] <hyperactivecrond> for dapper
[04:29] <sivang> hi all
[04:29] <sivang> how do I start a page in a wiki and specify the template so the template's content will get there?
[05:08] <hyperactivecrond> once again i'll do the ubuntu install guide
[05:09] <hyperactivecrond> for dapper
[05:09] <hyperactivecrond> i'll write it
[05:30] <jsgotangco> it won't be possible till a milestone cd gets released :)
[05:30] <jsgotangco> but nice to plan it early on aye
[05:30] <jsgotangco> :)
[06:43] <jsgotangco> night
[06:43] <Kamping_Kaiser> ngiht


[09:19] <sacarde> hi
[09:20] <sacarde> how can I set keyboard into /dev/pts/... different from /dev/tty... ?
[09:28] <alkisg> sacarde: what does "different keyboard" mean, are you talking about the layout? What's your use case?
[09:42] <lenovouser_> hi
[09:43] <lenovouser_> can somebody help me? I just did a fresh kubuntu install, latest version, yesterday I was able to use the internet just fine, today I turn on my computer and the wireless or wired connection to a modem is there, but I cannot use the internet, and I cannot even acces the router itself!
[09:43] <lenovouser_> what is going on?
[09:43] <lenovouser_> I check /etc/resolv.conf
[09:44] <lenovouser_> and I did s
[09:44] <lenovouser_> I did resolvectl status
[09:44] <lenovouser_> and it does show my router as the standard route...
[09:44] <lenovouser_> but still no connectivity
[09:44] <lenovouser_> what is going on?
[09:46] <lenovouser_> .
[09:48] <lenovouser_> ok
[09:48] <lenovouser_> nobody listening
[09:48] <returnMonkepleas> rip
[09:49] <returnMonkepleas> I'm also new to linux
[09:49] <returnMonkepleas> can't help
[09:49] <lenovouser_> ok
[09:50] <alkisg> lenovouser_: run `ip a` to see your ethernet name, e.g. enp2s0
[09:50] <alkisg> Then run: /usr/lib/klibc/bin/ipconfig -n enp2s0
[09:51] <alkisg> This does a fake dhcp request. Does your router reply?
[09:51] <lenovouser_> I actually got it to work now
[09:51] <lenovouser_> but strangely only AFTER I turned on the firewall!
[09:52] <lenovouser_> I remember removing dns server from the list of allowed services incoming from the "firewall configuration" tool
[09:52] <lenovouser_> but now I use the simple "firewall configuration tool", which has only 3 options... I turned it on and now it is working
[09:52] <lenovouser_> even after i reboot
[09:52] <lenovouser_> but I did notice that the firewall status changed to "off" again
[09:52] <lenovouser_> how do I make it stay "on"
[09:52] <lenovouser_> after reboot??
[09:56] <sacarde> alkisg, I whould like use "us" in /dev/pts/... under X, and "it" under /dev/tty..
[09:57] <sacarde> I apply https://superuser.com/questions/1320302/change-keyboard-layout-in-tty-permanently
[09:57] <sacarde> but dont works
[09:57] <sacarde> afk
[10:33] <lenovouser_> hello
[10:33] <lenovouser_> can somebody help me?
[10:33] <lenovouser_> each time I reboot ufw is inactive
[10:34] <lenovouser_> what can I do to make it persistent
[10:34] <lenovouser_> I tried sudo ufw enable
[10:34] <lenovouser_> but it does not work
[10:34] <lenovouser_> iptables persistent is not active on my system
[10:34] <lenovouser_> so that is not the problem either
[11:57] <BluesKaj> Howdy folks
[12:07] <Mamarok> lenovouser_: you need to add it to autostart, as all actions that need root privileges do not start automatically, by default. For all other configurations tweaks please refer to the wiki: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UncomplicatedFirewall
[13:53] <hanh_> 1
[14:25] <IrcsomeBot1> Yuri was added by: Yuri
 hello guys can anyone help to fix down problem i test on all distro with kde desktop i have three log in system logs … 1-pulseaudio … Failed to load module "module-alsa-card" (argument: "device_id="1" name="pci-0000_01_00.1" card_name="alsa_card.pci-0000_01_00.1" namereg_fail=false tsched=yes fixed_latency_range=no ignore_dB=no deferred_volume=yes use_ucm=yes avoid_resampling=no card_properties="module-udev-detect.discovered=1"
[15:33] <IrcsomeBot1> initialization failed. … 2-pulseaudio … Failed to find a working profile. … 3- snd_hda_intel 0000:01:00.1: no codecs found!
[17:49] <xnat834-M> Is there a good alternative to Okular?
[17:49] <xnat834-M> The font size to fill out forms is too large and the bug trackings shows no progress since 10 years or so
[17:49] <xnat834-M> I need something that allows me to fill out forms with a small font size
[17:49] <xnat834-M> small or smaller*
[18:53] <kirvesAxe> xnat834-M, there are several PDF readers available... I recently installed Atril because Okular had a buggy print-to-file dialog (that always printed the whole document even when requested only to print some pages)
[18:54] <jeremy__> yo haha
[19:24] <Guest48620> yo
 @xnat834-M, what version do you have of kubuntu and Okular? On Okular you can change the font size of what you write.


[16:11] <chrisccoulson> wow, google are telling me to use firefox today!
[16:13] <bhearsum> that's nice of them!
[19:37] <chrisccoulson> hi bhearsum
[19:37] <chrisccoulson> how are you?
[19:45] <micahg> chrisccoulson: can you upload the final lightning with the fix for bug 921917 today?
[19:45] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 921917 in mozilla-devscripts "xul-ext-calendar-timezones pulls in seamonkey because thunderbird 10.0 isn't in precise" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/921917
[19:45] <micahg> oh, hum
[19:45] <chrisccoulson> micahg, it's not a lightning bug
[19:45]  * micahg wonders why he didn't get the followup messages


[19:41] <godbyk> Was /usr/share/themes/Ambiance/unity/close.png generated from an SVG? If so, do you know where I can find the source SVG?  (I'm trying to generate higher-resolution images of some of the window control buttons for printed documentation.)


[00:05] <arraybolt3[m]> Can someone who has the ability to legally install WIndows 10 or 11 try to do a Lubuntu installation alongside Windows? I see someone having problems with that on Discourse and I've noticed that os-prober isn't trying to detect other operating systems on my system, so I'm wondering if maybe the os-prober problem that was fixed early on in the 22.04 cycle has resurfaced.
[00:07] <arraybolt3[m]> (I'd do it myself but I don't own any Windows 10 licenses or hardware with a Windows 10 license.)
[00:09] <arraybolt3[m]> (Also things have calmed down in $PERSONAL_LIFE so I should be back.)
[00:11] <kc2bez[m]> I could probably do it in a VM tomorrow. I am not wanting Windows on any of my bare metal hardware though.
[00:11] <arraybolt3[m]> Yeah me neither.
[00:12] <arraybolt3[m]> I should probably buy a license at some point in the future so I can do testing, but I don't ever want any version of Windows to touch my bare-metal hardware again. Blech.
[00:12] <kc2bez[m]> Technically you can install it you just can't activate it.
[00:12] <guiverc> arraybolt3[m], lubuntu kinetic (22.10)?
[00:13] <tsimonq2> Here's the thing about that...
[00:13] <tsimonq2> That's on purpose
[00:13] <arraybolt3[m]> guiverc: Nope, Jammy.
[00:13] <tsimonq2> I think juliank sent an email to the ML?
[00:13] <tsimonq2> Basically, we need to enable Calamares to run it once in the installer with a disclaimer
[00:14] <tsimonq2> They discovered a new attack vector in GRUB which allows sideloading of malicious code onto the partition that contains GRUB
[00:14] <guiverc> give me a little; I'll boot jammy (daily at most a few days old; SRU testing) and see if it detects a w10 I think I have on samsung thing
[00:14] <tsimonq2> I work around this on my local system by explicitly defining a config variable in GRUB
[00:14] <tsimonq2> But unfortunately this one isn't a bug... it's by design, and we know the situation isn't ideal right now
[00:15] <tsimonq2> If anyone has the chance to find the mailing list archives associated with this issue I'd appreciate it, probably either ubuntu-release or ubuntu-devel. Otherwise I'll likely look tomorrow
[00:15] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: I thought that it was purposefully disabled in GRUB and that Ubuntu purposefully enabled it again.
[00:15] <tsimonq2> I'd appreciate some context on the latter, if you could
[00:16] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: Context about the re-enabling of it?
[00:16] <tsimonq2> Correct, pretty please :)
[00:17] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: I actually don't know, I believe guiverc told me that it was behaving the current, secure but bad way early on in the Jammy cycle and then later on it started auto-detecting things right again. I may have misunderstood.
[00:18] <tsimonq2> I know you can re-enable it, and I do simply for my own use
[00:18] <tsimonq2> I'm not sure about the decision that was reached
[00:18] <kc2bez[m]> I am subscribed to -devel and I can't find it. It must be -release.
[00:19] <arraybolt3[m]> One moment...
[00:19] <arraybolt3[m]> I can't find it in -release either.
[00:19] <tsimonq2> No rush, I need to get back to $sidejob (in spite of current circumstances) so I'll catch you guys a bit later/here and there
[00:19] <arraybolt3[m]> Searched from October 2021 to April 2022.
[00:20] <kc2bez[m]> Hmm
[00:20] <tsimonq2> But I do remember seeing something about this...
[00:20] <tsimonq2> Maybe it was on debian-devel?
[00:20] <tsimonq2> If you guys can't find it I can search debian-private too...
[00:20] <tsimonq2> I know I saw an email about this though.
[00:20] <guiverc> arraybolt3[m], booting recent daily of jammy (SRU'd calamares from proposed) detects the windows 10 install (original OEM install though was factory reset prior to be given to me) on `samsung 700t1c-p10aat (i5-3317u, 4gb, 3rd gen.core.intel.graphics.4000)`
[00:20] <kc2bez[m]> I believe you my search wasn't too exhaustive
[00:21] <tsimonq2> No worries. Take care :)
[00:21] <arraybolt3[m]> guiverc: OK. I meant that when you install alongside W10 it doesn't detect it and put it in the boot menu. Though you probably don't want to risk nuking that system.
[00:22] <kc2bez[m]> It would have included debian-develop though too. I can look more tomorrow after some time spent horizontal.
[00:22] <kc2bez[m]> s/develop/devel/
[00:23] <arraybolt3[m]> December 2021 on ubuntu-devel, found it.
[00:23] <arraybolt3[m]> Hey look: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2021-December/041769.html
[00:23] <guiverc> not really; so you mean update-grub isn't detecting it... My system has jammy installed & w10 is detected  (never really select it though; last time was just to prove to someone I did have a windows but not knowing password I couldn't login)
[00:23] <kc2bez[m]> Ah, I didn't go far enough back.
[00:23] <guiverc> update-grub on my install detects & offers the w10... My w10 has fastboot off & hibernate disabled
[00:24] <arraybolt3[m]> guiverc: Hmm. Any chance you can show the contents of /etc/default/grub?
[00:24] <guiverc> arraybolt3[m], from installed system?  (I'm on live currently; only looked what calamares offered)... I can reboot & provide what is installed if helpful
[00:25] <arraybolt3[m]> Yeah, from the installed system. Just to see if maybe OS-PROBER was manually reenabled or something.
[00:28] <guiverc> arraybolt3[m], https://pastebin.ubuntu.com/p/7ZKPKzcsnm/
[00:30] <arraybolt3[m]> guiverc: Hmm, thanks, and that's weird. I wonder what makes GRUB decide when to use the prober and when not to.
[00:35] <guiverc> yeah I recall issues early in the cycle (tracking doc is where I'd look for clues), but they were resolved & I ignored it as I tested all releases with a winXP  (my d755-5 has a copy still) but rarely on that samsung (w10)... I commonly test with other GNU/Linuxes (which suffered same issue with prober when it impacted jammy)
[00:37]  * guiverc rebooted samsung & selected checked grub (if windows didn't show, I'd likely not notice!) & yep 'windows boot manager' is there & when selected got to w10 greeter... rebooted again at that point
 "Yeah, from the installed system...." <- edit /etc/default/grub and add the line GRUB_DISABLE_OS_PROBER=false
[00:52] <Roberalz[m]> You try that?
[00:53] <Roberalz[m]> With a update-grub2
[00:53] <arraybolt3[m]> Roberalz: I know that doing that will fix the problem, but my issue is with whether the problem exists at all by default. Also, my laptop only has one OS installed, I just notice that it tells me that os-prober isn't being used. I don't need it, but others who dual-boot do.
[00:53] <arraybolt3[m]> (Well, OK, only one host OS installed, I have an entire zoo of VMs but that's different.)
 "Roberalz: I know that doing that..." <- It has been disabled by default
[01:00] <Roberalz[m]> https://askubuntu.com/questions/1414245/why-do-i-get-warning-os-prober-will-not-be-executed-to-detect-other-bootable-p
[01:00] <arraybolt3[m]> Yeah. I thought they changed their minds but I guess not.
[01:02] <Roberalz[m]> A script call has been added as posted on askubuntu.
 "Hey look: https://lists.ubuntu...." <- YES that's the one
 "YES that's the one" <- Thanks for the info


[02:29] <spy> hello every body
[02:29] <spy> i'm insert the ubuntu studio now im my computer
[02:30] <spy> someone help-me please for i understand more the S.O.
[02:30] <spy> tks
[02:30] <cfhowlett> greetings spy
[02:30] <cfhowlett> what is your first language?
[02:30] <spy> portuguese
[02:31] <cfhowlett> !pt | portuguese
[02:32] <spy> have channel ubuntustudio in br?
[02:33] <cfhowlett> spy, you might be better served in #ubuntu-br
[02:33] <cfhowlett> !br
[02:33] <spy> sorry
[02:33] <cfhowlett> no worries.  come back here if you want English support
[02:34] <cfhowlett> also see the ubuntustudio on facebook
[02:37] <arianecmlima> hi!
[02:38] <cfhowlett> arianecmlima, ask your ubuntu questions
[02:39] <spy> hi arianecmlima
[02:44] <arianecmlima>  How do I install VLC on Ubuntu 16.10? I tried it in many ways and it failed, could anyone help me? Thanks
[02:44] <cfhowlett> !vlc | arianecmlima
[02:44] <cfhowlett> sudo apt install vlc*
[02:58] <arianecmlima>  The sudo apt-get install vlc command I already used
[02:58] <Guest53705> in ubuntu 16.10 not install the VLC...
[02:59] <cfhowlett> arianecmlima, sudo apt install vlc | pastebinit            <<< show the paste
[02:59] <Guest53705> and not too vlc-nox
[03:00] <Guest53705> cfhowlett: not is "sudo >>>>>> apt-get <<<<"
[03:00] <arianecmlima> I used vlc-nox as well
[03:00] <cfhowlett> Guest53705, "apt" is the replacement for "apt-get"
[03:01] <arianecmlima> ow! thanks
[03:02] <arianecmlima>  I'll try here and warn you!
[03:03] <Guest53705> but really not install VLC on Version to Ubuntu 16.10 Only 16.04 version to install the vlc
[03:05] <arianecmlima> Some packages could not be installed. This may mean that You asked for an impossible situation or, if you are using the Unstable distribution, that some required packages were not Still created or have been removed from Incoming. The following information may help resolve the situation:  The following packages have mismatched dependencies:  Vlc: Depends: vlc-nox (= 3.0.0 ~~ git20160525 + r64784 + 62 ~ ubuntu16.10.1) but 2
[03:05] <arianecmlima> Did not work again
[10:07] <studio-user591> I instaled Cmaptools program in Studio but I can NOT open as a PROGRAM. It opens as a TEXT :-/ How can I change this way to open? Thanks
[10:10] <studio-user591> Some body can HELP me with this problem? HOW change the way to open Cmaptools Program: because is opened with MousePad :-(
[12:16] <strk> I've put the 16.04.1 live on an USB key. The key works on a minipc but fails to boot on an HP Compaq nx8220 from 2013 - what could it be ?
[12:16] <strk> the BIOS says: no system disk error
[12:16] <strk> something like that
[12:18] <strk> there's an "Intel Execution Disable" feature in BIOS which is "enabled", will try disabling it
[12:18] <strk> then the Boot order allows USB Floppy, SUperDisk, CD-ROM, Hard Disk
[12:18] <strk> is "Hard Disk" the right choice for an usb dongle ?
[15:49] <OvenWerks> strk: I had trouble with that. It may depend on how you make the usb stick
[15:50] <OvenWerks> strk: I made mine by using dd to copy the iso on as the first partition and it fails on one of my boxes.
[15:52] <OvenWerks> it seems to me I tried both copying to sd* and sd*1 and neither worked for me. The iso makes the USB stick look like a CD/DVD or floppy, but my machine expected a hard drive setup on the stick
[15:54] <OvenWerks> I never did figure it out, I ended up printing a DVD which worked just fine. For reference the machine was an older P4 based box.
[17:00] <ChristopherG> Good morning ladies and gents!
[17:00] <ChristopherG> wondering if I could trouble someone for some help on setting up my system, i have all the info (hopefully) that you'll need
[17:07] <leftist> mornig
[17:07] <leftist> anyone using touchscreen with ubuntu-studio?
[17:08] <ChristopherG> No sadly
[17:08] <ChristopherG> I just installed ubuntu studio and i'm looking for help as well
[17:08] <leftist> actually i'm not sure on my opinion about touchscreen to begin with
[17:08] <leftist> it works
[17:08] <leftist> works great
[17:09] <leftist> whats up christopherg
[17:09] <ChristopherG> silly as it sounds i've never used a touchscreen computer, i used a macintosh for about 8 years
[17:09] <leftist> i run osx on a dell :D
[17:09] <ChristopherG> well, i installed ubuntu studio 64bit on my dell inspiron 3558
[17:10] <ChristopherG> i'm running it right now from an external HD
[17:10] <ChristopherG> wireless works, video works.
[17:10] <ChristopherG> i'm just trying to make sure i get all the drivers set up for things like sound
[17:10] <leftist> sound works right?
[17:11] <ChristopherG> naw
[17:11] <leftist> why not just use the default drivers that come with the os?
[17:11] <leftist> let me look something up
[17:11] <ChristopherG> it's your basic dell inspiron 15 with intel HD 5000 graphics, 2GHz intel core i3, 16GB DDR3L ram
[17:12] <ChristopherG> duel core*
[17:12] <leftist> ok
[17:13] <leftist> https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2279687
[17:13] <ChristopherG> thanks ;D
[17:13] <leftist> see if that corrects the issue
[17:13] <ChristopherG> i'm ubuntu a trial period as i've been running windows 10 with cubase 9
[17:14] <ChristopherG> i'll check it out!
[17:14] <leftist> ahh ok
[17:14] <leftist> yeah i dual boot this
[17:14] <leftist> 10 on the other end
[17:14] <leftist> dont use it on this one though cause i cant get edge to launch
[17:15] <ChristopherG> also, i'm not sure if i'm doing something but my cursor randomly leaves this window when i'm typing xD
[17:15] <ChristopherG> Ah
[17:15] <leftist> do you have a dell power supply
[17:15] <leftist> i have that problem with a after market ac adapter and battery
[17:16] <leftist> the audio should be a simple solve btw
[17:16] <ChristopherG> i do yeah
[17:17] <ChristopherG> it's the one that came with the laptop
[17:17] <leftist> ok
[17:17] <leftist> i recall that in the past dont remember the solve. you might ask in #ubuntu or #debian
[17:17] <leftist> i cant remember now
[17:18] <leftist> its a simple solve i just cant remember
[17:19] <leftist> my other touchscreen is a dell f200ca. i had to run it with windows 10 with a fresh install to remove all the bloat that comes with windows and it works pretty ok. i prefer linux though.
[17:21] <ChristopherG> one thing i have always liked about dell is they don't seem to have a lot of bloatware xD
[17:22] <leftist> well with 10 you sure get blasted :D
[17:22] <leftist> laugh
[17:22] <leftist> i had to add 8 gig to be able to do diddly
[17:23] <ChristopherG> yeah my laptop came with 4GB
[17:23] <ChristopherG> cubase barely ran obviously so i splurged and put in 16GB
[17:24] <ChristopherG> FYI my sound is working :D now i just need to get this keyboard to stop spazzing
[17:24] <ChristopherG> it does everything from selecting random text to switching tabs when i'm typing xD
[17:25] <leftist> umm
[17:25] <leftist> i know there is a resolve for that
[17:25] <leftist> glad the sound works
[17:25] <ChristopherG> good man/woman i should mail you cookies :D
[17:25] <leftist> did you have the same results with windows?
[17:25] <leftist> ha
[17:26] <ChristopherG> nope windows 10 feels like the best version of windows ever xD that's coming from a former macintosh user
[17:26] <leftist> ha
[17:26] <ChristopherG> TBH i have moments where i miss that hunk of aluminum =c
[17:26] <leftist> why dont you run osx in vm on that box?
[17:26] <ChristopherG> i tried =/
[17:27] <leftist> dells work great
[17:27] <ChristopherG> it would spin the beachball of death instead of laoding the installer
[17:27] <leftist> umm
[17:27] <ChristopherG> but i wanted to look into installing OS X on the actual computer
[17:27] <leftist> i even have sound and wireless and camera :D
[17:27] <ChristopherG> VMing doesn't work great for audio
[17:27] <leftist> i did that as well
[17:28] <leftist> it works there is a patch on sourceforge
[17:28] <ChristopherG> at least, in past exp. maybe it's better now
[17:28] <ChristopherG> i'd like one of those new imacs or mac pros. but i'm broke as hell
[17:29] <leftist> yeah they are hot
[17:29] <ChristopherG> i'm not anti microsoft or anything, i have an XB1 i just... kinda miss MacOS
[17:29] <ChristopherG> haha
[17:29] <leftist> osx is excellent
[17:29] <leftist> i love amigaos :D
[17:30] <ChristopherG> what version of OS X do you have? i was running el capitain on my MBP
[17:30] <ChristopherG> but i still have the DVD of snowy lep
[17:30] <leftist> i think snowy lep
[17:31] <leftist> i havent used it in quite some time now. i let the baby play with that laptop
[17:31] <ChristopherG> so how easy is it to install OS X on a dell laptop?
[17:31] <leftist> i used this guys installer
[17:31] <leftist> i'll have to look it up
[17:31] <ChristopherG> i have a 1tb HD so i could give a small amount  to OS X to try it out
[17:32] <leftist> you can check out hackintosh i forgot all the different variations now. there were maybe 10 different groups doing different stuff
[17:33] <leftist> http://www.hackintosh.com/
[17:34] <ChristopherG> i remember when hackintoshing became a thing
[17:34] <leftist> yeah
[17:34] <ChristopherG> i always avoided it because of reliability but let's just say i'm too broke to worry about =P
[17:35] <leftist> :D
[17:36] <leftist>  you might check dell for a fix for the keyboard issue as well. they sell their machines iwth linux on it and have drivers for different components on their hardware
[17:36] <leftist> cya later
[17:36] <leftist> peace
[17:37] <ChristopherG> thanks have a good day


[00:14] <puddles> does anybody have a pegatron nettop?  or something based on babbage?
[00:15] <puddles> (also same as "efika mx")
[06:53] <siji> good morning all
[10:09] <eggonlea_> quit
[14:54] <serdar> hi guys
[16:04] <ogra> lool, NCommander why is bug 435046 not milestoned ?
[16:04] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 435046 in linux-mvl-dove "Ethernet port on the dove sometimes changes MAC addresses" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/435046
[16:07] <lool> ogra: it is milestoned
[16:07] <lool> ogra: for 9.10
[16:07] <ogra> lool, NCommander can one of you please unmilestone the marvell desktop spec ?
[16:07] <lool> not sure it's worth it ghouth
[16:07] <lool> ogra: ??
[16:08] <lool> ogra: Why unmilestone it?
[16:08] <ogra> its A6 milestoned
[16:08] <lool> Yeah and was delivered back then
[16:17] <lool> ogra: Are you seeing my comments on the status report?
[16:18] <ogra> yes
[16:18] <ogra> working them in
[17:20] <NCommander> ogra, its marked as implemented O_o;, why does the milestone need to go away
[17:22] <ogra> i thought it had to
[17:22] <ogra> apparently i'm wrong
[21:57] <ojn> I like how apt-get suggests I install nvidia-libvdpau when installing mplayer on arm. or is it used for tegra too?


[01:59] <lisandro> FWIW: https://bugreports.qt.io/projects/QTCREATORBUG/issues/QTCREATORBUG-19469?filter=allissues
[01:59] <lisandro> seems ubuntu-only
[07:25] <acheronuk> LocutusOfBorg: nope. that fails
[07:32] <LocutusOfBorg> acheronuk, why?
[07:35] <LocutusOfBorg> acheronuk, why?
[07:37] <acheronuk> LocutusOfBorg: tried in a ppa, and it failed to build
[07:38] <acheronuk> LocutusOfBorg: same error
[07:40] <acheronuk> LocutusOfBorg: which I guess you just discovered with your ubuntu2 upload :P
[07:41] <LocutusOfBorg> yep, let me fixup it
[07:57] <acheronuk> LocutusOfBorg: export DEB_CXXFLAGS_MAINT_APPEND := $(shell pkg-config --cflags glib-2.0) in rules seems to work
[08:10] <LocutusOfBorg> acheronuk, interestingly it doesn't ftbfs with pbuilder
[08:10] <LocutusOfBorg> let me debug a little bit before pushing a fix
[08:10] <LocutusOfBorg> oh picking up old momdemmanager
[08:12] <acheronuk> yeah, I tried in pbuilder against proposed and it failed
[08:12] <acheronuk> with that line in rules, it built. same in a ppa
[08:13] <acheronuk> we are going to do debian merges with frameworks 5.47 anyway
[08:15] <LocutusOfBorg> I hope to see it somewhat in sync soon :)


[00:08] <cnd> yeah
[00:08] <cnd> I only branched because of the multiarch issue
[00:08] <cnd> I haven't branched the other projects
[10:05] <dandrader> tvoss, morning
[10:06] <tvoss> dandrader, morning :)
[10:06] <dandrader> have you played with Unity's autopilot already?
[10:06] <tvoss> dandrader, a little bit, but no serious result yet
[10:07] <tvoss> dandrader, tried to prototype a class MultiTouchDevice in X11.py, like lamalex suggested yesterday
[10:07] <dandrader> tvoss, I found it a bit fragile. When I run, a good number of tests failed
[10:07] <tvoss> dandrader, did you look into autopilot yet?
[10:08] <tvoss> dandrader, I think thomi sent around an email in the morning that mentioned failing autopilot tests
[10:09] <dandrader> quite hard to make this kind of tests reliable, there are just so many variables. running from within a virtual machine with a pristine ubuntu installation might be "a must" for running it...
[10:10] <dandrader> on the other hand it's quite neat to see the whole UI moving by itself, showing and hiding launcher, dash, etc :)
[10:10] <dandrader> hmm... good to know
[10:18] <tvoss> dandrader, yeah, it's a pretty cool technology
[10:19] <tvoss> dandrader, are you planning on looking further into autopilot? I have pretty much stuff on my plate regarding chromium patch and jenkins maintenance
[10:22] <dandrader> I have to provide some testing for the utouch stuff there one way or another, since I have two bug fixes that have been blocked because they are missing tests
[10:23] <dandrader> but first I will invest some time in figuring out the feasibility of making unit tests
[10:24] <dandrader> I fear the headaches that might come from autopilot (many dependencies)
[10:38] <tvoss> dandrader, ack ... unity already uses google test
[10:38] <dandrader> yes
[12:19] <Satoris> Someone want to test this: lp:~jpakkane/arsenal/utouch-bug-script
[12:19] <Satoris> Run the file scripts/get_touch_bugs.py and redirect stdout to an HTML file.
[12:34] <Satoris> Are three and four finger actions broken for anyone else?
[12:44] <dandrader> Satoris, they were working last time I tried
[12:44] <dandrader> that was last Friday. But I'm using lp:trunk versions of utouch-* and not stuff from repositories
[12:46] <Satoris> I use the daily build PPA, which should be the same.
[12:48] <Satoris> Three and four finger touches come to applications, but two finger touches disappear somewhere.
[12:48] <Satoris> Even though I have disabled all scrolling thingies.
[12:51] <dandrader> Satoris, one thing you could do is removing synaptics xorg driver and see if you get the two-touches events
[12:51] <dandrader> that would confirm the culprit at least
[12:52] <Satoris> But doesn't that driver read the evemu interface? Without it there should be no mouse/touch events at all.
[13:01] <bregma> I believe both synaptics and evemu use the /dev/input interface
[13:02] <bregma> I mean evdev, not evemu
[13:02] <Satoris> There is a plain evdev driver for X now?
[13:02] <bregma> although evemu also uses the /dev/input interface
[13:03] <bregma> there has been for a few releases now
[13:03] <bregma> it's what gets used for touchscreens
[13:03] <bregma> it can also be used for touchpads, but we don;t normally recommend it
[13:03] <bregma> because it won;t work the way WIn 95 and Mac OS users expect
[13:04] <Satoris> Ok, I see it. Is there a way to blacklist the Synaptics driver or does one have to uninstall the package?
[13:04] <bregma> you can blacklist the synaptivs driver usiing fancy config scripts in, um, some /var/lib directory somewhere....
[13:05] <bregma> /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d
[13:05] <bregma> see, /var/lib
[13:08] <Satoris> It does not seem to have anything X or evdev related ...
[13:27] <Satoris> Changing the input driver from synaptics to evdev causes all touches disappear.
[13:28] <Satoris> Changing it back made touches work.
[13:29] <Satoris> Gestures, too.
[13:31] <Satoris> This does not make ANY SENSE. <o>
[13:34] <bregma> dark magic?
[13:34] <bregma> blood magic?
[13:35] <Satoris> I think this calls for magic written with a 'k'.
[13:35] <bregma> restarting X to pick up new shared libraries?
[13:35] <Satoris> By which I mean magick.
[13:36] <Satoris> In theory, yes. But the old X used the old libraries, which were working fine yesterday.
[13:54]  * tvoss will miss the standup today, ps-qa meeting
[14:06] <cnd> tvoss, when you have a chance, just pop in to let us know how things are going and what you're up to
[14:06] <cnd> Satoris, I don't have any issues with trackpad 3 and 4 touch gestures
[14:07] <cnd> four touch gestures should always work, no matter what settings you have
[14:11] <Satoris> The properties reported by xinput were strangely out of whack when the gestures were broken. Fiddling with them did not help. They are ok now, though.
[14:11] <cnd> interesting
[14:11] <cnd> Satoris, are you running the standard desktop with gnome-control-center, gnome-settings-daemon?
[14:12] <Satoris> As it comes out of the box, yes.
[14:13] <Satoris> Shared library wackiness is the most probable explanation, methinks.
[14:13] <cnd> huh
[14:13] <cnd> Satoris, I just tried your script
[14:13] <cnd> it looks pretty good!
[14:14] <cnd> I think all the data is there
[14:14] <cnd> it could be cleaned up visually, table borders and headers, etc.
[14:14] <cnd> but it'll be a great help
[14:14] <Satoris> The API differences between launchpadlib and the helper lib thingie are minimal. The only difference seems to be how you get the launchpad object.
[14:14] <cnd> it's already found lots of bugs I didn't know existed :)
[14:15] <cnd> ok
[14:15] <Satoris> Which made me suspect that one of them was deprecated.
[14:15]  * bregma stands up, scratches his arm, and yawns
[14:15] <cnd> heh
[14:15] <cnd> I'm going to be proposing a fix for bug 972012: Touchscreen touches are not rejected until they end
[14:16] <cnd> then probably weeding bugs from the new bug list that Satoris has created
[14:17] <Satoris> Made the script. Then I fought the X, and the X won.
[14:17] <bregma> I'm seeing q few memory leaks when running the geis testsuite, I'm hoping they're poorly written test cases, but I want these to run clean, so.....
[14:17] <bregma> I shot the sherriff
[14:17] <cnd> dandrader|lunch, standups :)
[14:18] <bregma> I'm trying to do a dist-upgrade in the background and it's giving me a time-to-copletion estimate of between 4 hours and 9 days, depending on when I look
[14:18] <cnd> ugh
[14:18] <bregma> right now it's down to 1 hour 15 minutes
[14:18] <Satoris> I strongly suggest having someone else do the CSSification of the bug list. I haven't done it in ages, so the end result probably won't be all that spectacular.
[14:19] <cnd> Satoris, hopefully we can reuse an existing template?
[14:19] <cnd> and change it slightly as needed?
[14:20] <Satoris> The "templates" in Arsenal are mostly test thingies rather than production. Most scripts just do their own thing, some with Gnuplot, even.
[14:20] <cnd> hmm
[14:20] <Satoris> Plus if there is not a template for the exact layout we have, it has to be recreated anyway.
[14:26] <Satoris> And the test templates are very problem specific, such as bugs-by-team.mako.
[14:27] <Satoris> They seem to be doing some sort of a JSON data transfer thingie of which I'm not entirely sure what it does.
[14:28] <cnd> ok
[14:30] <cnd> Satoris, I would love it if we could get a nice list like: http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/kernel-bugs/reports/_kernel_hot_.html
[14:30] <Satoris> Since (not all of) their scripts are not in Python, this is probably just a way to get data from one place to another rather than just using Genshi directly.
[14:32] <Satoris> Well, I _can_ do it, but someone with Web experience probably would get it done faster. Just sayin'.
[14:32] <cnd> dandrader|lunch, bregma: I just pushed a couple MPs for grail
[14:33] <cnd> biab
[14:33] <Satoris> cnd: leaving now, Skype later?
[14:33] <cnd> Satoris, sure
[14:33] <Satoris> Ok. Bye.
[14:36] <bregma> 22h 59min 27s
[14:37] <bregma> 5d 14h 6min 19s
[14:38] <bregma> I think I'm overloading a local network node or something
[14:39] <tvoss> hey folks
[14:40] <bregma> 8d 9h 10min 7s
[14:40] <tvoss> working on chromium patch set, helping out with various jenkins tasks
[14:42] <tvoss> dived into autopilot today a little mor
[14:42] <tvoss> e
[14:42] <tvoss> but no definite result, yet
[14:46] <dandrader> damn, missed the stand up.
[14:46] <dandrader> I'm working on a unit test for GestureEngine in unity
[14:47] <dandrader> for bugs https://code.launchpad.net/~dandrader/unity/lp940612 and https://code.launchpad.net/~dandrader/unity/lp969554
[16:00] <tvoss> cnd, hangout?
[16:00] <cnd> sure
[16:00] <cnd> one sec
[16:00] <tvoss> cnd, ack :)
[16:02] <cnd> tvoss, did you get an invite?
[16:02] <tvoss> cnd, no
[16:02] <cnd> hmm
[16:02] <tvoss> cnd, let me try
[16:02] <cnd> k
[17:55] <tvoss> cnd, pint
[17:55] <tvoss> s/t/g
[17:55] <cnd> pong
[17:56] <tvoss> regarding the virtual d'tor: I think every test reyling on a a custom fixture inherits the fixture
[17:56] <tvoss> iirc
[17:57] <cnd> oh right
[17:57] <cnd> didn't think of that
[17:57] <tvoss> should we put it in the comment on the mp for reference?
[17:57] <cnd> I forgot about the distinction between the test class and the fixture class
[17:57] <cnd> I'll do it
[17:57] <cnd> thanks
[17:58] <tvoss> np, happy to approve with that changes
[18:05] <cnd> tvoss, so I did some more reading
[18:05] <cnd> and the virtual destructor doesn't need to be specified if you are deriving from a base class that already has one
[18:05] <cnd> which testing::Test does
[18:05] <tvoss> ah, like a transitive virtual d'tor?
[18:06] <cnd> I guess
[18:06] <cnd> http://www.parashift.com/c++-faq-lite/virtual-functions.html#faq-20.7
[18:06] <cnd> it might also explain why it wasn't necessary in any of the other tests
[18:07] <tvoss>  yeah, wasn't aware that it is transitive, thanks for the hint :)
[18:11] <cnd> tvoss, I pushed the subscription deletion change to the test branch
[18:12] <cnd> and commented on the fix branch
[18:12] <tvoss> makes sense. Do I just need to approve the test branch then?
[18:13] <tvoss> ah, got it ... already approved
[18:13] <cnd> yay
[18:13] <tvoss> cool
[18:21] <bregma> woo-hoo, I'm back
[18:22] <bregma> seems my ISP was having some network troubles, or something
[18:34] <cnd> bregma, are you all updated too?
[18:35] <bregma> as of a few hours ago, yes
[18:35] <bregma> I have about 16 kernels I need to purge
[18:35] <cnd> dandrader, bregma: still looking for a review of: https://code.launchpad.net/~chasedouglas/utouch-grail/fix-hold-reject/+merge/100621
[18:35] <cnd> heh
[18:35] <cnd> I'm going to cut a new release of grail after it's merged


[01:20] <user|53> Olá!
[01:20] <user|53> Sabem como corrijo o bug no download de temas?
[01:39] <mmikowski> ¿Quieres modificar un tema? ¿Que parte?
[01:52] <user|53> Estou rodando a versão 5.24.4 e sempre que abro o instalador de temas (qualquer que seja) da um bug.
[01:54] <mmikowski> El primer paso es actualizar a 5.24.6 LTS si puede. Eso podría ayudar.
[01:56] <mmikowski> Mi idioma nativo es el inglés, así que estoy usando un software de traducción (mi español no es bueno). ¿Puedes hablar ingles?
[01:57] <user|53> ok mine is portuguese brazil
[01:57] <user|53> rsrs
[01:57] <mmikowski> haha
[01:58] <user|53> Is this update already available in the default repository?
[01:59] <mmikowski> I just downloaded and installed a theme on 5.24.6 (Sweet Ambar Blue) without an issue. However, I have seen problems that from other themes at times.
[01:59] <mmikowski> 5.24.6 is in kubuntu-backports.
[02:00] <user|53> I understand
[02:00] <user|53> How do I upgrade to version 5.24.6?
[02:01] <user|53> What command or repository should I add to the system?
[02:01] <mmikowski> A lot of themes can be a challenge. Breeze and breeze dark are the most widely tested. Community-created themes can have issues or missing parts. So be ready to switch back to Breeze to debug, or make sure you have a well-supported theme :)
[02:02] <user|53> ok
[02:03] <mmikowski> Ok, to add backports: sudo add-apt-repository ppa:kubuntu-ppa/backports should do the trick.
[02:03] <mmikowski> the sudo apt update && sudo apt upgrade.
[02:03] <user|53> Do I run the risk of breaking the system with the addition of the PPA?
[04:54] <enigma9o7[m]> Well of course anything is possible.
[06:26] <isthisgood> hello
[10:30] <Guest75> How does kubuntu make the Live ISO?
 many of these packages show broken after forced upgrade : https://irc-attachments.kde.org/5aa21737/file_59558.jpg
 Shows this : https://irc-attachments.kde.org/ccc44c9c/file_59559.jpg
 Don't force upgrade then
 Wait for the updates to fully phase, then upgrades should be fine
 ok
[11:47] <user|23> how do I enable blue-tooth? I have a mouse that I want to use. I find no blue-tooth devices to connect to.
[11:58] <Elliria> Hey there, is anybody else experiencing a notification bug after the latest update? I just grabbed the most recent updates and one of them was for Plasma. Now my update notification icon is always showing even when no updates are available even though it's set to only show when relevant.
[12:01] <RikMills> Elliria: there are some more plasma updates pending that are not fully phased yet, so it is likely to be those. in a day or 2 they should become available
[12:04] <Elliria> Are those likely to fix it, RikMills?
[12:07] <RikMills> when I tested bypassing update phasing earlier today, it did
[12:08] <Elliria> Okay, good to know, thanks.
[12:08] <Elliria> By the way, I noticed you're working on this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntustudio-default-settings/+bug/1965439
[12:08] <RikMills> yes
[12:09] <Elliria> I'm fully intending to test it as soon as possible, but the latest kernel has made it impossible to create a virtual machine in VirtualBox, so as soon as they update that kernel, I'll be testing it.
[12:09] <Elliria> I plan on doing the same tests the other person did.
[12:12] <RikMills> thanks!
[12:12] <Elliria> My pleasure, and thank YOU for working on the bug!
[12:58] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[14:46] <user|11> hiiii... sudo apt update && sudo apt dist-upgrade && sudo apt autoremove kind of broke my kubuntu. it decided to unstall haveged & sddm .. and now it doesn't startx anymore ...
[14:47] <user|11> manually installed those 2 back and now the sddm login screen is ugly AF
[14:47] <user|11> how can I get the old kde sddm look back?
[14:47] <user|11> (ugly AF = wrong reso, debian logo??, onscreen MASSIVE keyboard noone needs...)
 6JAH
[17:13] <user|31> Hai
[17:13] <user|31> I have a problem in my loginscreen
[17:14] <user|31> I cannot login anymore. It is a different desktop interface
[17:14] <user|43> yeah, me too
[17:20] <arraybolt3[m]> user|43, user|31: What version of Kubuntu are you running?
[17:21] <arraybolt3[m]> (You as in "you plural", I'm realizing that might look like I'm trying to say you're both the same user...)
[17:38] <mparillo> Did you recently upgrade LTS? From 20.04 to 22.04?
[21:45] <user|17> Hi,
 Co85
 C075
 Hey, what's the difference between kubuntu and Ubuntu with plasma installed
 Hey, what's the difference between kubuntu and Ubuntu with plasma installed ?
 Hey, what's the difference between kubuntu and Ubuntu with plasma installed (current setup) ?
[23:06] <arraybolt3[m]> Kubuntu will give you a full Ubuntu experience geared toward the KDE desktop. On the other hand, installing Ubuntu and then adding KDE on top will result in both GNOME and KDE being installed at the same time, which could potentially be dangerous or tricky to work with.
 If I'm a dev does it make a difference which one i use ?
[23:14] <oerheks> if you start with ubuntu, add plasma, then you would have gnome apps available too.
 Thanks
[23:35] <Dragnslcr> You can also install Kubuntu and then install whatever Gnome programs you need
[23:35] <Dragnslcr> Both Ubuntu and Kubuntu use the same software repositories, so all of the same programs are available with both


[08:06] <dholbach> good morning
[08:09] <fgimenez> good morning
[08:15] <anpok> I continued toying around with a nfs server snap... now there is a library opening a config file in /etc/.. libtripc within rpcbind. The path is a compile time literal. Whats the right way to solve that? Is snappy doing something on startup to remap paths for each app? Should I change that to a relative path.. or use an env var?
[08:49] <asac> happy new year!
[08:53] <dholbach> asac: and the same to you!
[08:54]  * asac hugs dholbach
[08:54]  * dholbach hugs asac
[09:25] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Monday, happy New Year, and happy World Braille Day! 😃
[09:31] <anpok> snappy new year!
[10:21] <asac> ubuntu@localhost:~$ snappy enable-classic
[10:21] <asac> 147.41 KB / 73.75 MB [______________________________________________________________________________] 0.20 % 367.10 KB/s 3m25s
[10:21] <asac> 73.75 MB / 73.75 MB [[10:21] <asac> failed to create classic mode dir: mkdir /writable/classic: permission denied
[10:21] <asac> mvo: ?
[10:21] <asac> $ snappy list
[10:21] <asac> Name                   Date       Version      Developer
[10:21] <asac> canonical-linux-raspi2 2015-12-17 4.2.0-1014-3 canonical
[10:21] <asac> ubuntu-core-armhf      2015-12-21 16.04.0-4    canonical
[10:21] <asac> canonical-pi2          2015-12-17 2.2          canonical
[10:22] <asac> dont see an apparmor error for that... so guess just missing directory?
[10:22]  * asac mkdir /wrtable/classic and then retries
[10:24] <asac> mvo: oh i think its bnecause i didnt use sudo
[10:24]  * asac retries another time
[10:27] <asac> bah lp timeout when filing this as a bug :(\
[10:30] <mvo> asac: yeah, sudo - but that is a bug in itself that it tries to do that even without uid=0
[10:30] <asac> mvo: nexty problem ist hat i cant apt-get install in classic\
[10:30] <asac> tried to snappy classic shell with sudo, but didnt work
[10:31] <asac> also when running snaoppy shell classic i end up with ubuntu user in the container
[10:31] <asac> mvo: https://bugs.launchpad.net/snappy/+bug/1530826
[10:31] <asac> bug one
[10:33] <asac> mvo: bug two: https://bugs.launchpad.net/snappy/+bug/1530827
[10:36] <mvo> asac: that seems to be something new in xenail I will debug
[10:36] <mvo> asac: releated to the new apt sandbox stuff
[10:40] <asac> mvo: what is apt sandbox
[10:40] <asac> ?
[10:40] <ogra_> asac, apt has its own user now
[10:40] <ogra_> (broke the images for a week :P )
[10:41] <ogra_> so it drops privs (abd does other stuff to operate more securely)
[10:41] <ogra_> *and
[10:42] <mvo> asac: yeah, what ogra_ says. the idea is that if e..g there is a buffer overflow in the http downloader then the attacker does not get root right away
[10:45] <mvo> asac: on fixing the issues now (but may get interrupted by a lunch break soon :)
[10:46] <ogra_> mvo, are you actually working already again ?
[10:48] <asac> mvo: so we got debian crack that broke everywhere? nice :P
[10:49] <ogra_> it only broke snappy and touch due to the added user :)
[10:50] <mvo> ogra_: I think so, I need to check the calendar but I think I do :)
[10:50] <anpok> hm i guess there is no policy called network-servr
[10:50] <anpok> *server
[10:50] <mvo> ogra_: may take a day off during the week
[10:50] <mvo> asac: *cough* yeah
[10:51] <ogra_> mvo, heh ... i'm still off til 16th ... but wanted to poke you with that pending u-d-f merge .... and snappy FTBFS on arm64 in xenial since a few weeks now
[10:51] <ogra_> would be good if someone could handle that
[10:52] <mvo> ogra_: 16! woah :)
[10:52] <ogra_> well, i had to burn vac. days and decided to actually burn some in advance this year :)
[10:52] <mvo> ogra_: u-d-f> I have a look, I think I need to spend some time on that one :/
[10:53] <ogra_> oh, why is that ?
[10:53] <mvo> ogra_: just because noone else is and the all-snap branch needs integration in there too
[10:53] <ogra_> it applies, builds an runs fine for me
[10:53] <mvo> ogra_: oh, sorry, not specific to your diff, thats just a tiny part of it :)
[10:53] <ogra_> i dont think it should be affected by all-snaps ... at least not beyond some preipherial bits
[10:53] <mvo> ogra_: thats good
[10:54] <mvo> ogra_: arm64> is it just a test failure? if you don't know from the top of your head don't worry, I check it out
[10:54] <ogra_> i dont know, i just see the image build failure since a while, i didnt check the snappy build itself
[10:55]  * ogra_ sighs ...snow ... i thought i'd get away without shoveling this year
[11:19] <mvo> asac: sorry for the apt trouble, I looked at this and you need to run "sudo apt update",  this is a bug in apt that it does not tell you this. plus you probably can't use sudo in classic right now because the fix https://github.com/ubuntu-core/snappy/pull/266 is not merged yet :/
[12:17] <pindonga> sergiusens, mvo jdstrand_ hi there... if I need to add a dependency to snapcraft for a feature I'm proposing, I also need to package that dependency as an ubuntu package right?
[12:17] <pindonga> but that would also mean having to introduce a PPA until the pkg is available in the main repos
[12:17] <pindonga> maybe there's a better alternative?
[12:18] <sergiusens> pindonga, you only want to target xenial for snapcraft 2.0 (if the question is about that)
[12:18] <sergiusens> pindonga, landing in xenial is pretty fast
[12:18] <pindonga> sergiusens, so the answer would be 1) yes, package deps for ubuntu (xenial), 2) yes, use main repos
[12:19] <pindonga> right?
[12:19] <sergiusens> pindonga, yeah, I was also suggesting no need to think about backporting
[12:19] <pindonga> ack
[12:40] <asac> mvo: no worries.... thanks! let me try
[12:42] <asac> so yeah, no sudo in classic (e.g. lack of sudoers)
[12:47] <ogra_> ppisati, http://paste.ubuntu.com/14399210/ ... worjking dragonboard config with your branch ... it isnt merged with the std ubuntu one yet so a bit messy, but it makes all HW work fine
[12:48] <ogra_> ppisati, it uses the apq8016-sbc.dtb DT
[12:53] <mvo> asac: yeah, this is fixed in the branch above, once that branch is merged it will be fine
[12:54] <asac> cool... waiting then
[13:06] <kyrofa> Good morning
[13:29] <kyrofa> Chipaca, so `snappy remove` doesn't remove any of the snap's data?
[13:35] <ppisati> ogra_: i've seen your email from december
[13:35] <ppisati> ogra_: the kernel with your config changes is building ATM
[13:35] <ppisati> ogra_: https://launchpad.net/~p-pisati/+archive/ubuntu/embedded/+build/8800172
[13:35] <ogra_> ppisati, yeah, but i re-did a lot of that stuff since
[13:35] <ogra_> cool !
[13:35] <ppisati> ogra_: ah
[13:36] <ppisati> ogra_: did you change anything in the config?
[13:36] <ogra_> initially i was using the wrong DT ...
[13:36] <ogra_> a lot, yeah
[13:36] <ppisati> ogra_: oh ok, then i'll do anothe config diff and repush
[13:36] <ogra_> effectively i went back to the 96boards one plus systemd and apparmor options
[13:37] <ppisati> ogra_: anyhow, i couldn't test this kernel
[13:37] <ogra_> i.e. you will have to go over it and somehow merge it with the normal ubuntu config (not all USB modules, etc etc ... )
[13:37] <ppisati> ogra_: cause i've a problem with your img
[13:37] <ogra_> oh ?
[13:37] <ppisati> ogra_: it's weird, but after the first boot
[13:38] <ppisati> ogra_: my board refuses to boot subsequently from sd
[13:38] <ogra_> you made sure it is a 4G card ?
[13:38] <ppisati> ogra_: 8G
[13:38] <ogra_> !
[13:38] <ogra_> there is a reaadme next to the image :P
[13:38] <ogra_> resizing is still broken, it wipes your GPT
[13:38] <ppisati> ogra_: fuck
[13:38] <ogra_> you need a 4G card
[13:38] <ppisati> i haven't see that
[13:39] <ppisati> that explain it
[13:39] <ppisati> ok
[13:39] <ogra_> yeah
[13:39]  * ppisati search for a 4G card then
[13:39] <ogra_> i might fix the resizing during my vacation :)
[13:39]  * ogra_ is still officially off til 16th
[13:40] <ppisati> ogra_: no prob, i'll play with your img and my kernel
[13:40] <ppisati> ogra_: till it works fine
[13:41] <ogra_> well, the current cnfig should work fine but surely has glitches (iirc it has preempt turned on and stuff)
[13:41] <ppisati> ogra_: the kernel compiling there, it's the same from december + the config diff you posted back then
[13:41] <ogra_> i also havrnt looked at the firewall options, i think most are missing as well
[13:41] <ppisati> ogra_: i'll make sure eveyrhing is fine
[13:41] <ogra_> yeah, i just used your source package ;)
[13:42] <ppisati> at least now i know why the img had that weird behaviour
[13:42] <ogra_> yeah
[13:42] <ogra_> note that you have to replace the wrongly named DTB when you change the kernel on it
[13:42] <ogra_> uboot still points to the wrong name
[13:43] <ogra_> (<ou need to copy apq8016-sbc.dtb over it)
[13:43] <ppisati> ok
[13:44] <ogra_> oh, and with that kernel there is a bug with console blanking(havent checked if the 96boards kernel has it too) ... it doesnt wake up on keystroke
[13:44] <ogra_> in case you plan to use the tty console :)
[13:45] <ppisati> ogra_: i even tried to install uboot on the boot partion on the internal flash
[13:46] <ppisati> ogra_: but i couldnt make the board boot in that case
[13:46] <sergiusens> kyrofa, morning
[13:46] <ppisati> lets' see if i can figure that out too
[13:46] <kyrofa> Hey sergiusens!
[13:46] <kyrofa> Good vacation?
[13:46] <sergiusens> kyrofa, you can tell from my absence here :-)
[13:46] <ogra_> ppisati, well, you need to turn it into a boot.img first if you use the internal flash i think
[13:47] <kyrofa> sergiusens, haha :)
[13:47] <sergiusens> it was pretty good, really humid and rainy though, flooded cities everywhere
[13:47] <kyrofa> Ugh
[13:47] <kyrofa> Everyone save though?
[13:47] <ppisati> ogra_: i did that, my problem was that i couldn't boot the board
[13:47] <kyrofa> s/save/safe/
[13:47] <asac> mvo: can i hack my classic stuff so that ubuntu is in sudoers maybe?
[13:48] <asac> would really love to unblock what i am really after: "get an armhf build env"
[13:48] <ppisati> ogra_: it was like, after kernel / dtb load and decompression, the board hung there
[13:48] <ogra_> ppisati, like ... not at all ? i.e. not even messages from the SPL on the serial console ?
[13:48] <ppisati> ogra_: zero
[13:48] <sergiusens> kyrofa, mostly evacuated and the losses are only monetary; but it hasn't been without losses
[13:48] <ogra_> ppisati, well, you should at least get the SBL messages, else you messed something up ...
[13:48] <ppisati> ogra_: i was following this, i guess you saw that too
[13:49] <ppisati> ogra_: http://rglinuxtech.com/?p=1606
[13:49] <ppisati> ogra_: sorry
[13:49] <ppisati> ogra_: still sleepy :P
[13:49] <sergiusens> kyrofa, how was your time off?
[13:49] <kyrofa> sergiusens, I'm sorry :(
[13:49] <ppisati> ogra_: yes, i got a "complete boot" up to the point of loading kernel / dtb
[13:49] <ogra_> ah
[13:49] <ppisati> ogra_: so uboot was live and 'working'
[13:49] <ogra_> that was with your kernel back then ?
[13:50] <ppisati> ogra_: right, but even with the config change you pasted back then
[13:50] <ogra_> oh
[13:50] <kyrofa> sergiusens, mine was nice, but a little tough-- my wife has been having some pretty good contractions and we're still over a month out. She's been more or less on bed rest
[13:50] <ogra_> but you used the right dtb :)
[13:50] <ppisati> ogra_: right
[13:50] <ppisati> ogra_: apq-
[13:50] <ogra_> my first config change only worked withteh wrong one
[13:51] <ppisati> ogra_: that might explain it
[13:51] <ogra_> the pasteed config above now works with the right one :)
[13:51] <sergiusens> kyrofa, yeah, that can be tough
[13:51] <ppisati> ogra_: cool, i'll do config diff, recompile and reboot tests
[13:51] <sergiusens> kyrofa, I get you guys are getting pretty anxious due to that
[13:51] <kyrofa> sergiusens, yeah it's a bit stressful
[13:51] <ppisati> ogra_: it'll be ready for when you are back
[13:52] <ogra_> :D
[13:55] <mvo> asac: yes, just do "sudo vi /writable/classic/etc/group" and add "ubuntu" to the "sudo" group
[13:56] <mvo> asac: and bribe someone to review my branch that fixes the issue :P
[14:00] <asac> mvo: i need your branch on top?
[14:05] <mvo> asac: just that, then you should be fine
[14:05] <mvo> asac: the branch will do it automatically
[14:33] <sergiusens> kyrofa, elopio should we do a quick standup?
[14:33] <elopio> Hello everybody.
[14:33] <elopio> it's good to be back.
[14:33] <kyrofa> sergiusens, yeah
[14:33] <elopio> sergiusens: yes.
[14:33] <sergiusens> elopio, trading a natural jungle with a software one :-)
[14:33] <sergiusens> elopio, kyrofa I'm in
[14:56] <kyrofa> asac, how are those snapcraft PRs coming? I'd be happy to push them the rest of the way if you like
[15:02] <kyrofa> sergiusens, the ld.so.conf.d idea is really elegant. I'm wondering if we should perhaps do that throughout snapcraft rather than just the catkin plugin. Thoughts?
[15:03] <kyrofa> sergiusens, might save some pain for devs
[15:04] <kyrofa> elopio, ^^
[15:18] <sergiusens> kyrofa, +1 on that
[15:18] <kyrofa> sergiusens, excellent :)
[15:24] <asac> kyrofa: could be that we can abandon them... let me try something
[15:25] <kyrofa> asac, alright let me know
[15:25] <asac> and hny!
[15:26] <asac> sergiusens: heya! can we ahve a default target back to be snap?
[15:26] <asac> on master
[15:27] <asac> utlemming: do you have xenial snappy all-snaps builds set up for aws, gcloud etc. yet?
[15:27] <asac> that would make my month :)
[15:29] <sergiusens> asac, we can, yes; I just need to make it clear in the spec.
[15:30] <asac> cool
[15:30] <asac> i think that would feel more natural than bailing out
[15:30] <asac> kyrofa: https://github.com/asac/etherpad-lite-snap/commit/e68ad2fd5ab2d75034c5fc32466c32eb380a0417
[15:30] <kyrofa> asac, happy new year to you as well!
[15:30] <asac> that seems to work; entirely due to my lack of node knowledge
[15:30] <asac> i have to dobule check but for now assume its an abandon
[15:31] <kyrofa> asac, ah, interesting. And yeah, I can't help you on the node knowledge-- maybe sergiusens can? I think he made the plugin
[15:31] <asac> i think its fine as above
[15:31] <asac> and i wont need a new feature for node plugin this way
[15:31] <asac> just have to test the runtime package :)
[15:31] <kyrofa> asac, I'll go ahead and close them, then-- you can always reopen if you still want it :)
[15:32] <asac> will do thanks!
[15:32] <asac> if anyone wants to install http://people.canonical.com/~asac/etherpad-lite_master_amd64.snap and see if the pad is working on 9001 port after
[15:32] <asac> that would be cool
[15:32] <sergiusens> kyrofa, I am not a node expert, only looked at it for one day and came up with a simple hand written app and an existing popular one :-)
[15:33] <asac> i only have my new "production" etherpad snappy instance
[15:33] <sergiusens> asac, if you need node help, beowulf is the guy we want to talk to
[15:33] <kyrofa> sergiusens, heh
[15:33] <sergiusens> asac, is that snap built with snapcraft?
[15:34] <asac> sergiusens: of course
[15:34] <sergiusens> asac, nice!
[15:34] <asac> with the branch above
[15:34] <asac> https://github.com/asac/etherpad-lite-snap/
[15:34]  * beowulf looks to see what kind of bus sergiusens has thrown him under
[15:34] <asac> is legacy already though, because the real variant moved it into real tree
[15:34] <asac> https://github.com/asac/etherpad-lite
[15:35] <asac> e.g. in tree snapcraft
[15:35] <asac> vs. out of tree snapcraft which is the -snap repo above
[15:35] <asac> will hack on awesome config support today
[15:35] <kyrofa> Haha, hey beowulf
[15:35] <asac> https://github.com/asac/etherpad-lite/tree/snap-support/bin/snappy
[15:36] <asac> thats the in-tree snapcraft
[15:36] <beowulf> o/ kyrofa
[15:36] <kyrofa> beowulf, it's been a while! What are you working on nowadays?
[15:36] <asac> would love to consolidate the README to just have "snapcraft" for both 1.x and 2.x
[15:37] <beowulf> kyrofa: i'd like to say i work on the store, but it's more like the store works on me
[15:37] <kyrofa> beowulf, :D
[16:15] <elopio> ping plars. Are you working today?
[16:15] <plars> elopio: yes, Happy New Year :)
[16:16] <plars> elopio: what's up?
[16:16] <elopio> plars: same to you!
[16:17] <elopio> plars: we are wondering about making an ubuntu-device-flash specific for 16.04. That would mean that you need xenial to build new images, and an older distro to generate 15.04 images.
[16:17] <elopio> plars: could you get two agents working, one for new and one for old images?
[16:18] <plars> elopio: no, it's not really possible to have two different agents coordinating the same device
[16:19] <plars> elopio: it may be possible to somehow give a hint to how it's built, but it couldn't be on two different agents. Wouldn't it be possible to just have two different ubuntu-device-flash binaries? Why does the whole distro it's built on need to be different?
[16:21] <elopio> plars: well, there are many options, I just thought two builders was the easiest. The u-d-f from xenial will build 16.04, the u-d-f from the other distros will build 15.04. If you can install both on the same agent, and tell me how to choose, I think that works too.
[16:22] <plars> elopio: so it's just a different binary then, the whole distro you are building the image on does not need to be updated correct?
[16:23] <plars> a different udf binary that is
[16:24] <elopio> plars: afaik, yes. sergiusens: right?
[16:24] <plars> elopio: do you know if there's any plan to add backward compatibility support?
[16:24] <elopio> plars: that's what we want to avoid.
[16:25] <plars> elopio: There are a few different approaches we could take, either way you'll definitely want to set up a new "image" in spi (since it is a new image)
[16:25] <plars> elopio: for that image, you'll need to tell it to use the new udf binary to build the image, not the default one
[16:26] <elopio> plars: sure. So what remains is to see if we can have both installed in the same machine.
[16:29] <sergiusens> elopio, I don't know, that is a mvo question, but I am thinking that there is a dependency on using 16.04 for the new stuff
[16:29] <plars> elopio: this will require some rethinking of how the agents work too I'm afraid... we never anticipated needing multiple versions of UDF, rather it was assumed that we want to carefully control the version of udf installed and make sure it's updated only when needed
[16:30] <plars> elopio: so as a result, you specify the options to udf, rather than a script to just go get whatever version of udf you want (like you do with the tests) and run it
[16:30] <plars> sergiusens: dependency on using 16.04? or a dependency on using 16.04 version of udf? And can that version also build 15.04 based images?
[16:30] <elopio> plars: worst case scenario, we'll want the agents to be xenial. And fgimenez and I can run the 15.04 tests manually on our homemade labs :p
[16:30] <noise][> elopio: wasn't there some talk about u-d-f becoming ubuntu-image + ubuntu-flash as 2 new separate binaries for 16.04?
[16:31] <plars> elopio: it may not be so simple... what about others that may want to test 15.04 images?
[16:31] <elopio> noise][: yup. We are planning the transition for that.
[16:31] <plars> elopio: hopefully there's some transition path for all of this? Otherwise everything will just be broken for a while
[16:32] <plars> elopio: of course, for bbb, I think we're still down because of that bug right?
[16:32] <noise][> if that were the case, couldn't the existing 15.04 compat. u-d-f still be packaged for xenial alongside the 16.04 split ones?
[16:33] <sergiusens> noise][, u-d-f can still be there in xenial; but the new ubuntu-image will only build with all snaps in mind
[16:33] <elopio> noise][: maybe. So far I'm just asking the questions to see what are the requirements for the transition.
[16:33] <elopio> I'm ok with a little downtime, if that speeds up the transition to all-snaps.
[16:33] <elopio> Also we want to avoid having u-d-f generating 15.04 and 16.04 images.
[16:34] <anpok> Jan  4 16:33:03 localhost systemd[1]: Cannot add dependency job for unit ubuntu-snappy.snapd.socket, ignoring: Unit ubuntu-snappy.snapd.socket failed to load: No such file or directory.
[16:34] <anpok> ^ something I should care about?
[16:38] <plars> elopio: so it's a whole new command - ubuntu-image, that will be used?
[16:38] <plars> elopio: is there any documentation about this?
[16:39] <elopio> plars: that's the final solution, yes. While that command is ready, we need to support building new images.
[16:40] <plars> elopio: it would be a little weird to run these agent hosts on xenial I think, is there no plan to build a trusty version of the new ubuntu-image binary?
[16:40] <plars> elopio: it's still not clear to me if the build host *must* run xenial, or if it just needs the new binary
[16:40] <elopio> plars: we want to avoid that. We want to have people writing things for xenial to be using xenial.
[16:41] <plars> elopio: but we're not developing anything on that system, just building an image
[16:42] <plars> elopio: In either case, I think we'll need to extend the json you pass for spi to support a new field for using ubuntu-image vs. udf
[16:42] <elopio> plars: again, right now I'm just asking for requirements. If we can completely ignore trusty, that would be easier for sure.
[16:42] <plars> elopio: then once all 15.04 images are deprecated, we can just kill the previous stuff
[16:43] <plars> elopio: I think in the near future though, we have to support both
[16:45] <kyrofa> Chipaca, ping
[16:46] <kyrofa> Chipaca, I'm having trouble merging my understanding of snappy with my understanding of this purge code :P
[16:47] <kyrofa> Chipaca, specifically, if DataDirs returns multiple results, Purge seems to try and deactivate the snap more than once, resulting in an error after the first deactivation since it was already deactivated
[16:48] <kyrofa> Chipaca, I thought that was a common scenario?
[16:58] <kyrofa> Chipaca, trying to fix https://github.com/ubuntu-core/snappy/pull/264 by the way
[16:59] <kyrofa> sergiusens, any chance you know what I'm talking about?
[17:07] <Chipaca> kyrofa: sorry, hadn't brought irc up yet. am here now.
[17:07] <Chipaca> reading backlog
[17:07] <kyrofa> Chipaca, ah, no problem :)
[17:08] <Chipaca> kyrofa: so, correct, `snappy remove` leaves data in place
[17:08] <kyrofa> Chipaca, makes sense given how apt-get works
[17:08] <kyrofa> Chipaca, or dpkg I guess
[17:09] <Chipaca> kyrofa: yeap, which is why it's this way, but it is surprising if you don't come from apt, so it'll change for 16.04 to be less so
[17:09] <Chipaca> kyrofa: oh dear, you are correct in that the use of datadirs is buggy :-(
[17:10] <Chipaca> hmm
[17:10] <kyrofa> Chipaca, oh *whew* that's better than me being incredibly confused :P
[17:10] <Chipaca> :-)
[17:10] <Chipaca> well, users might disagree with you on that =)
[17:10] <kyrofa> Hahaha
[17:11] <kyrofa> Chipaca, well I've got fixed (i.e. failing) tests anyway
[17:11] <Chipaca> hmm
[17:11] <kyrofa> Chipaca, I can make a PR to fix it before fixing #264
[17:11] <Chipaca> on the other hand, maybe not
[17:12] <Chipaca> ah! yes because it'll do deactivate in the second path
[17:12] <Chipaca> bah humbug :-(
[17:12] <Chipaca> kyrofa: +1
[17:12] <Chipaca> kyrofa: things current code doesn't consider is a snap using both data dir and user data dir, and multiple users
[17:12] <Chipaca> kyrofa: both would fail in similar ways
[17:13] <kyrofa> Chipaca, ah, indeed
[17:13] <Chipaca> kyrofa: in both cases moving deactivate to inside the first loop would solve it i think?
[17:13] <kyrofa> Chipaca, what was the purpose of looping through the data dirs in the first place? Is there a use-case I'm missing?
[17:13] <Chipaca> kyrofa: as opposed to what?
[17:13] <kyrofa> Chipaca, ah, it was for multiple VERSIONS
[17:13] <kyrofa> Chipaca, yes?
[17:14] <Chipaca> ah, yes
[17:14] <kyrofa> Chipaca, okay, I'll point you to the PR when I make it, if that's alright
[17:15] <Chipaca> kyrofa: that would be very alright
[17:33] <Chipaca> kyrofa: going back on this a bit, depending on the size of the change, maybe moving it to pkg/lightweight is better
[17:35] <kyrofa> Chipaca, ah, I've never looked at that package
[17:36] <Chipaca> kyrofa: they're both my fault, but datadirs is rather adhoc for the purge command, whereas lightweights is an iteration of the idea made more generally useful (only i didn't get around to removing datadirs)
[17:37] <kyrofa> Chipaca, I don't think the change is large, but it sounds like a refactor that should happen at least eventually. Would you like me to do that here?
[17:38] <Chipaca> kyrofa: as the whole purge command is going away, probably not worth it unless fixing datadirs is big
[17:38] <kyrofa> Chipaca, I think not. But I'll keep it in mind just in case
[17:38]  * Chipaca nods
[18:27] <kyrofa> Chipaca, https://github.com/ubuntu-core/snappy/pull/283
[19:47] <sergiusens> kyrofa, so should we do a 1.x today?
[19:49] <kyrofa> sergiusens, we can, but this ld.so.conf.d feature will need to get into 1.x as well. I'm fine with waiting on it or releasing twice-- up to you
[19:49] <kyrofa> sergiusens, but I know we've been wanting to get that out
[19:50] <sergiusens> kyrofa, depends on how long it will take, I don't want to delay too much ;-)
[19:50] <sergiusens> kyrofa, also, do the docs need more work or can they merge?
[19:51] <kyrofa> sergiusens, agreed. How about we wait until tomorrow. If it's not done and looking good, we'll release
[19:51] <kyrofa> sergiusens, ah, let me look them over again now
[19:51] <sergiusens> kyrofa, yeah, releasing on wednesday is fine by me
[19:51] <sergiusens> kyrofa, it would be nice to get the qml fix backported too
[19:52] <kyrofa> sergiusens, agreed. I didn't see a response on that, so I can cherry pick
[19:52] <sergiusens> kyrofa, is it CLA worthy? A single cherry requires squashing though iirc
[19:53] <kyrofa> sergiusens, the qml fix guy did sign the CLA
[19:56] <sergiusens> great
[20:31] <brei> is it possible to define an unpack path for the tar_content.py plugin?
[21:01] <kyrofa> sergiusens, the ld.so.conf idea may not actually work. At least from what I've seen so far, those files are placed in the .deb postinst, which doesn't seem to have an effect since we're really only unpacking them
[21:07] <sergiusens> kyrofa, oh bummer
[21:07] <kyrofa> sergiusens, yeah it's sad... it was such a good idea
[21:08] <sergiusens> kyrofa, I can't think of another way that can reliably work for all cases
[21:08] <kyrofa> sergiusens, I want all that stuff to be done in some sort of temporary lxc so the packages can actually be installed or something
[21:12] <sergiusens> kyrofa, we should only focus on lxc for 2.x
[21:12] <sergiusens> kyrofa, I'd say, send some sort of proposal to the devel list to see what comes
[21:13] <kyrofa> sergiusens, alright... I guess I'll scrap this idea for 1.x then, unless you think walking /lib and /usr/lib and adding them all to LD_LIBRARY_PATH is an acceptable backup plan
[21:13] <sergiusens> kyrofa, what about things in /opt' and such?
[21:14] <sergiusens> it sort of gets some things working, but not all
[21:14] <kyrofa> sergiusens, yeah, it doesn't work in all cases, but it works better than what we have now
[21:14] <kyrofa> Exactly :P
[21:14] <sergiusens> kyrofa, can we use rpath with relative paths?
[21:14] <sergiusens> probably not a good solution either
[21:17] <kyrofa> sergiusens, I think you can with some special keywords, but it's been a long time since I played with that
[21:18] <kyrofa> sergiusens, yeah... I'm not a huge fan of either. Do we like one better than the other, or stick the .snap author with making wrappers every time they have a lib outside of the standard?
[21:19] <sergiusens> kyrofa, the general consensus was that most of this is a project specific problem
[21:20] <kyrofa> sergiusens, which makes a certain amount of sense, but also can mean a nightmare for someone just trying to package something with a lot of .deb dependencies
[21:20] <sergiusens> kyrofa, personally, snapcraft magic voodoo should only be done when there's something we can hold on to
[21:21] <kyrofa> sergiusens, yeah, you're right
[21:21] <sergiusens> kyrofa, there's nothing reliable we can use here
[21:21] <sergiusens> too bad those ld things are postinst :-(
[21:21] <sergiusens> I thought they'd be config files at most
[21:21] <kyrofa> sergiusens, agreed. Let's scrap the idea and revisit if we ever get some sort of contained build
[21:22] <kyrofa> sergiusens, they are, but they're symlinked in
[21:22] <sergiusens> kyrofa, is there any specific path that is already blocking something?
[21:23] <kyrofa> sergiusens, I ran into it making a ROS .snap that uses opencv, which relies on opengl, which is in /usr/lib/arch/mesa
[21:23] <sergiusens> kyrofa, for the case of mesa/egl/gl, right?
[21:23] <kyrofa> sergiusens, right
[21:23] <sergiusens> kyrofa, those are sufficiently common I guess to be able to track and check for
[21:24] <kyrofa> sergiusens, I can at the very least add it to the catkin env(). Want me to add them to the overall runtime_env()?
[21:26] <sergiusens> kyrofa, overall is fine
[21:27] <sergiusens> kyrofa, I wonder if this is a pattern ''/etc/alternatives/.*_conf
[21:27] <sergiusens> something we can check for
[21:31] <kyrofa> sergiusens, in the case I'm looking at, the real .conf is distributed within /usr/lib/arch/mesa, and the postinst installs it with update-alternatives
[21:31] <kyrofa> So yes.... but no
[21:31] <kyrofa> Because in that case, even the etc/alternatives is a symlink
[21:32] <sergiusens> kyrofa, ah/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/mesa-egl/ld.so.conf
[21:32] <kyrofa> sergiusens, right
[21:33] <kyrofa> Stupid chicken and egg problems...
[21:33] <sergiusens> kyrofa, the other option is to search for ld.so.conf files
[21:33] <sergiusens> but that can be dangerous too
[21:33] <kyrofa> sergiusens, I assume that name is nonstandard
[21:34] <sergiusens> kyrofa, exactly
[21:34] <sergiusens> kyrofa, so maybe search for those specific egl ones and read them through
[21:34] <sergiusens> kyrofa, we'll need to figure out what nvidia does as well
[21:34] <sergiusens> gl is sort of an important topic
[21:35] <sergiusens> ah, nvidia is mostly a runtime thing, disregard me
[21:36] <kyrofa> sergiusens, alright, I can do that
[22:11] <sergiusens> kyrofa, elopio is this just me with a new pep? http://paste.ubuntu.com/14404846/
[22:13] <sergiusens> easy fix, just want to know how it got through :-)