[14:33] <charlie-tca> Good morning
[14:34] <davmor2> morning charlie-tca
[14:35] <charlie-tca> another great day!
[14:35] <davmor2> that's one way you could describe it
[14:36] <charlie-tca> Got up on the green side of the grass again. Got to be good... ;-)
[14:36] <davmor2> charlie-tca: :)  Good one
[14:39] <TheSheep> grass has green side?
[14:41] <charlie-tca> Well, sometimes. If you get up on the dirty side, you ain't gonna have a good day :-)
[14:42] <TheSheep> gotta get there one day
[18:49] <charlie-tca> Xubuntu Community Meeting in #ubuntu-meeting in about 10 minutes; Agenda is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Meetings
[19:00] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit, cody-somerville, ochosi  : meeting time
[20:10] <mr_pouit> (got to go, dinner time)
[20:11] <mhall119> are gnome-panel applets compatible with xfpanel?
[20:12] <charlie-tca> Thanks, mr_pouit
[20:12] <charlie-tca> mhall119: only by installing xfapplet
[20:13] <mhall119> ok
[20:13] <charlie-tca> well, actually, I guess that should have been "yes"
[20:13] <mhall119> I'm going to try and make a new launcher applet for Qimo, would like it to work in both
[20:14] <mhall119> hmmm, that might pull in a lot of dependencies
[20:14] <mhall119> know of any good tutorials for writing Xfce panel applets in Python?
[20:14] <vinnl> I'd prefer not to use xfapplet, it's quite resource-heavy
[20:15] <mhall119> alternately, I may just write a stand-alone launcher using PyGTK
[20:15] <mhall119> rather than a panel applet
[20:16] <mhall119> but that seems like more work
[20:16] <charlie-tca> I guess I will get better at that meeting thing, huh?
[20:16] <vinnl> Hehe :)
[20:16] <mhall119> you did fine
[20:16] <vinnl> Proves that practice makes perfect
[20:17] <charlie-tca> well, at least practice makes it easier
[20:17] <vinnl> I can imagine IRC meetings to be a lot more difficult than real-life meetings
[20:17] <vinnl> Mostly because you can't see whether someone wants to say something
[20:19] <charlie-tca> yeah, that too. That's why there are delays too. You can't really tell if some one is typing a response out
[23:49] <micahg> charlie-tca: can you add the Xubuntu meetings to the Fridge?
[23:49] <charlie-tca> doesn't seem like it. I added them following the directions at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Fridge/Calendar
[23:50] <charlie-tca> but they only show up in google calendar, not on the fridge itself
[23:50] <micahg> charlie-tca: when?  it usually takes a day or 2
[23:50] <charlie-tca> a week ago
[23:50] <micahg> charlie-tca: check with nhandler then
[23:50] <charlie-tca> okay. I can do that
[23:51] <micahg> I wanted to attend, but I had a conflicting meeting
[23:51] <charlie-tca> Sorry about that. the good news - We will have meeting each week at the same time now
[23:51] <micahg> great
[23:51] <micahg> I hope to be able to start helping in January
[23:51] <charlie-tca> Great!
[23:52] <charlie-tca> help is welcome
[23:52] <micahg> maybe earlier if it's simple merges
[23:52] <micahg> mr_pouit: ^^^
[23:53] <charlie-tca> he's hiding now. It is midnight there for him
[23:53] <micahg> ok


[00:01] <dmcglone> can anyone recommend a good wireless router with good range
[00:01] <deejoe> yes, I recommend finding a good wireless router with good range
[00:01] <deejoe> ;)
[00:09] <Unit193> dmcglone: I've never used WRT300N (but 1 and 1.1 work with tomato and DD-WRT)
[00:16] <dmcglone> Unit193: linksys?
[00:18] <Unit193> dmcglone: Linksys/Cisco
[00:19] <dmcglone> gotcha. I've used belkin for so long, I've forgotten everything else pretty much
[00:25] <dmcglone> Oh yeah, the new KDE 4.6 has a netbook interface
[00:25] <dmcglone> You can choose between traditional and the netbook
[00:29] <Unit193> dmcglone: If we put a *buntu on the main, it will be Kubuntu!
[00:31] <Unit193> Ubuntu going the way of Unity, I would have Xubuntu for other...
[00:32] <dmcglone> so far I'm liking KDE 4.6. right now I'm learning how to share widgets on the network
[00:38] <dmcglone> exactly why I think I need a new quality router
[00:40] <Cheri703> dmcglone: belkins are reasonable
[00:45] <dmcglone> reasonable? I want superb ;-)
[01:05] <stalcup> jacob ping a ling
[01:10] <vorian> paultag: ping
[01:16] <paultag> vorian: hey, what's up
[01:17] <vorian> paultag: I need to update my blog url on the planet, but I'm stuck on a windows machine :(
[01:17] <vorian> can you help me out?
[01:19] <paultag> vorian: yeah, send me the URL
[01:19] <vorian> paultag: http://machinecrusade.blogspot.com/feeds/posts/default
[01:20] <paultag> vorian: same head?
[01:20] <vorian> yep. just the url
[01:20] <vorian> I'm not remembering when or why I changed it
[01:22] <paultag> just a sec, it's updating
[01:22] <paultag> the copy I have is way stale
[01:22] <vorian> ouch!
[01:22] <paultag> 5/13
[01:23] <paultag> my net sucks, it'll be a sec
[01:23] <vorian> no hurry, I have yet to finish my post
[01:23] <paultag> vorian: I can't change it, it's already set
[01:23] <vorian> wha?
[01:23] <paultag> vorian: jacob set it on 2011-02-17 03:54:56 -- Revision ID<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[01:23] <paultag> vorian: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~planet-ubuntu/config/main/revision/1294
[01:24] <jacob> yeah, did that not update on planet?
[01:24] <paultag> vorian: yeah, entry looks good
[01:24] <vorian> okay, i'll have to trust that
[01:24] <paultag> jacob: it looks good jacob
[01:24] <jacob> kk
[01:24] <vorian> for some reason it was showing ubuntu-vorian
[01:25] <vorian> I'll do a test post (mwahahahhahaha)
[01:25] <vorian> and it wont be directed at Matthew
[01:25] <vorian> ok, i lied
[01:25] <paultag> vorian: yeah, it looks good and that's your only entry
[01:25] <jacob> paultag: no need to claim your net sucks, it took a good 10 minutes to download on this fairly decent connection
[01:26] <jacob> lolbazaar
[01:26] <paultag> jacob: phew, it's not just me :)
[01:28] <jacob> burrito time, /afk
[01:31] <vorian> ahhhh
[01:31] <vorian> here is the problem
[01:33] <vorian> paultag: http://vorian-ubuntu.blogspot.com/feeds/posts/default
[01:34] <vorian> ^^ that is the correct url
[01:34] <paultag> vorian: so you want to switch that?
[01:34] <vorian> paultag: yes please :)
[01:35] <paultag> mkay
[01:35] <paultag> vorian: pushed
[01:35] <vorian> thanks paul!
[01:35] <Unit193> I take it no finch users here?
[01:35] <paultag> no problem, man
[01:36] <paultag> Unit193: nawskies :)
[01:36] <paultag> vorian: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~planet-ubuntu/config/main/revision/1296 <-- all set :)
[01:36] <vorian> wicked awesome
[01:37] <vorian> now I just need to get my linux machine back online
[01:37] <paultag> I love the word wicked so much
[01:37] <paultag> vorian: what did you do to it?
[01:37] <vorian> it's booting too many systems
[01:37] <vorian> some of the systems are bleading over, quite odd
[01:38] <paultag> odd is right
[01:40] <paultag> OK, sushi time
[01:40] <paultag> godspeed
[01:40] <paultag> vorian: if you need me to update that again, just shoot me an email
[01:40] <vorian> paultag: will do! thanks for the offer :)
[01:52]  * Unit193 is really getting ticked of at finch!
[03:29] <Cheri703> if you had 2 cords, and they were white and colored, would you assume white to be ground or colored to be ground?
[03:32] <Unit193> Lick one and find out?
[03:34] <Cheri703> I think I found my issue. I had them in the right spots for the most part
[03:41] <dmcglone1> I'm back for a bit
[03:41] <Cheri703> IT'S ALIIIIVE! my first computer built from scratch is up and running :) :)
[03:41] <Unit193> Your first computer and it's not even for you.... right?
[03:42] <Cheri703> yep
[03:42] <Cheri703> but I got paid decent money for it, so I'm ok with it :)
[03:42] <Unit193> What OS?
[03:42] <Cheri703> I'm going to run it through its paces over the weekend, make sure EVERYTHING is working properly
[03:42] <Cheri703> 10.10
[03:47] <Cheri703> this thing is about to die, I'll bbl
[03:47] <Unit193> Bye Cheri703
[03:49] <Cheri703> bye
[03:53] <Cheri703> ok, back :) had to go to living room sooner than anticipated, so I got my cord then
[03:53] <Unit193> I thought you'd be gone longer
[03:54] <Cheri703> so did I
[03:55] <Unit193> Do you know if you can take the home dirs out of one *buntu and stick it into another? (and how to get most of the apps/config over)
[03:55] <Unit193> Not looking "how" now, just "if"
[03:55] <Cheri703> uhm, I know you can take from one installation of ubuntu to another, not sure about cross DE
[03:56] <Unit193> LXDE > XFCE
[03:56] <Cheri703> the .application folders are what you'll want (.mozilla, .ssh .xchat) worth a shot
[03:56] <Unit193> Now if I can just remember all I've installed...
[03:57] <Cheri703> ctrl h shows hidden files
[03:57] <Cheri703> you can see them then
[03:57] <Cheri703> they're in the home folder
[03:57] <Unit193> ls -a does too :)
[03:58] <Cheri703> kk
[03:59] <Unit193> canthus13 needs to do some sort of class where I get steal all his terminal wisdom
[04:00] <canthus13> Unit193: Heh. my terminal wisdom consists mainly of google. :)
[04:01] <Unit193> You seem to know all the best apps! along with all the other commands I seem to need/fotgot
[04:04] <canthus13> Unit193: Heh.  gthis guy knows all the best apps:  https://kmandla.wordpress.com/
[04:08] <Unit193> http://kmandla.wikispaces.com/ <--- seems real cool! arch fan...
[04:09] <canthus13> Unit193: Oh cool. I haven't seen that one yet. :)
[04:09] <Unit193> canthus13: If you find any real cool console apps, let me know!
[04:09] <canthus13> I will. :)
[04:40] <Cheri703> booted into 10.10 so I can make sure I'm setting up the new comp the way I want it
[04:40] <Cheri703> still getting it set up on mine as well
[04:41] <Unit193> How do you like it? how does it contrast to 10.04?
[04:41] <Cheri703> it's very similar
[04:41] <Cheri703> I had used it for a bit before, but went back to 10.04 because that's what I have to run on my desktop
[04:41] <Cheri703> also I'd upgraded and had issues, this is a clean install
[04:42] <vorian> jacob: sorry
[04:42] <Cheri703> I was somewhat turned off to it because I tried unity first -_- HATED the initial release of unity, but....hopefully it's better now
[04:42] <vorian> i was trying to find the easiest way to post
[04:43] <Unit193> Cheri703: I knew you liked .04 better... what are you going to do when 11.04 is out with only unity?
[04:43] <Cheri703> we'll see
[04:43] <Cheri703> I'll try it out, might just stay in the 10's
[04:43] <Cheri703> depends on if it works with my desktop video card...works PERFECTLY in 10.04, not at all in 10.10
[04:43] <Cheri703> so...we'll see
[04:44] <Unit193> that or just use Gubuntu ;) or even Xubuntu...
[04:44] <Cheri703> yeah, we'll see
[04:47] <canthus13> 10.10 has wireless issues with both wireless adapters I tried in this machine. :(
[04:48] <Cheri703> that sucks
[04:48] <Cheri703> mine works ok in 10.10...
[04:50]  * canthus13 has tried with a BCM 4312 and an Atheros AR9285.
[04:51] <canthus13> the BCM works perfectly in 9.10.
[04:51] <Cheri703> :/ that's annoying
[04:51] <Cheri703> I hate it when the "new and improved" has less usable things than the old ones
[04:54] <canthus13> Yup. makes me more likely to switch to another distro. :(
[04:56] <canthus13> Cheri703: 'Simplicity' is a feautre.
[04:59] <Cheri703> yeah
[04:59] <Cheri703> they focus on "let's make it shiny" vs "let's make it work" lately...that's frustrating
[05:08] <Unit193> canthus13: Do you think grml might be able to handle rdc/p on 128Ram? (and maybe video)
[05:08] <canthus13> Unit193: 128MB? Prolly not.
[05:08] <canthus13> but it shouldn't hurt to try. :)
[05:10] <Unit193> That's about what I was thinking!
[05:21] <Cheri703> 1080p monitor = AWESOME...
[05:21] <Cheri703> and it's super light weigh
[05:21] <Cheri703> t
[05:21] <Cheri703> weighs around the same as my netbook, perhaps a bit heavier
[05:21] <Cheri703> I wish I could keep this computer :(
[05:21] <Cheri703> but oh well
[05:34] <BiosElement> Wow
[05:35] <BiosElement> Just about had it with the Google TV FUD.
[05:35] <BiosElement> Google should totally hire an angry mob of lawyers and start suing viacom and company into the ground.
[05:35] <BiosElement> >.<
[05:36] <BiosElement> So tired of hearing the claim that google TV = Piracy.
[05:36] <BiosElement> It's such utter nonsense I'm 'sure' they could get a victory on one level or another >.<
[06:03] <Unit193> BiosElement: So how IS your project coming? (apart from the crazy people!)
[06:04] <BiosElement> It's coming great honestly.
[06:04] <BiosElement> We've got some really amazing people onboard.
[06:04] <BiosElement> One of our map designers is a guy who's been doing it professionally for 11 years.
[06:04] <Unit193> Well, that's great!
[06:04] <BiosElement> I've got a python web dev who worked with Creative Commons as a lead dev on their work. ^_^
[06:04] <BiosElement> So yeah, we're doing awesome with people heh.
[06:06] <Unit193> Man, how did you get these people?
[06:06] <BiosElement> Hah, good question. :P
[06:06] <BiosElement> Simply put, we really lucked out.
[06:07] <BiosElement> I suppose we either have a really compelling concept, or are somehow amazingly awesome and don't realize it ;)
[06:07] <Unit193> What's the site again?
[06:07] <BiosElement> cubecreate.com
[06:09] <Unit193> I love FAQ #3...
[06:09] <BiosElement> LOL
[06:09] <BiosElement> Wow, yeah. As you can tell, still a bit patchy sitewise
[06:12] <Unit193> Is the platform geared towards a certain type of game?
[06:12] <BiosElement> Oh yeah, and we have 2 professional writers. >.> *writes his best and sends it on to them to save him...*
[06:13] <BiosElement> No, the engine itself is very generic and we are deeply commited to keeping it tthat way. You could even do a 2D mario style game, though the engine is of course 3D.
[06:15] <Unit193> A person would have to know Lua in order to make a game?
[06:15] <Unit193> (Sorry for some real basic questions!)
[06:15] <BiosElement> No. We intend to make a plug/play style library of scripts to let developers who don't know lua design games. Although of course eventually there 'will' be a limit to that.
[06:15] <BiosElement> Nah, it's fine.
[06:16] <BiosElement> Actually just updated the FAQ >.>
[06:16] <BiosElement> So yeah, thanks ^_^
[06:17] <Unit193> Ubuntu CoC? ;)
[06:17] <Unit193> No problem!
[06:17] <BiosElement> Yes, yes it is heh.
[06:21] <Unit193> Was this going to be cross platform? (I thought I read thet at some point. Maybe I'm delusional?)
[06:21] <BiosElement> Of course.
[06:22] <BiosElement> Windows, Mac, Linux, FreeBSD and possibly a few more.
[06:24] <Unit193> I guess I missed that this time around! if/when you need people to test Linux/Windows binaries, I'll give it a shot!
[06:26] <BiosElement> Ahah, Will do. ^_^ I'll be sure to let folks know.
[06:26] <Unit193> Maybe I should stop asking questions, them FAQs are getting longer!
[06:27] <BiosElement> Ahah, long FAQ's are good ;P
[06:27] <Unit193> That they are, but being the person that makes them long isn't ;)
[06:29] <BiosElement> Ahah, maybe not. ;P
[06:35] <Unit193> Glad I could get lots more info on cC
[06:42] <BiosElement> Yep ^_^
[06:42] <BiosElement> Great to hear you care heh
[06:54] <BiosElement> Ugh
[06:54] <Unit193> What be the issue?
[06:54] <BiosElement> I really hate being
[06:54] <BiosElement> 'the man' when people want to stick it to him >.<
[06:54] <Cheri703> that's fairly existential
[06:54] <Cheri703> ah
[06:54] <BiosElement> Ahah
[06:55] <Unit193> That made me think of SG1... being "the man" is never a good thing...
[06:55] <BiosElement> Eh, as funder and project co-founder, I'm the biggest authority there is.
[06:55] <BiosElement> So even community-wide votes are an 'excuse'.
[06:55]  * BiosElement coughs
[06:56] <BiosElement> Ahh well, can't win every battle.
[06:56] <BiosElement> I really should write a book on community management. >.< I'm sure it'd be a best seller :P
[06:58] <BiosElement> See Unit193, no matter how many awesome people a project has, it still has it's road bumps :P
[06:59] <Unit193> That's why I'm never going to be one of the leaders! not so good with people! (and you were talking all about the crazy/annoying ones)
[07:00] <BiosElement> Hah, you have to be willing to take some bumps if you lead a project.
[07:00] <BiosElement> It's worth it, but sometimes it doesn't feel like it.
[07:01] <Unit193> I'm not sure how I would be able to help with your project...
[07:01] <BiosElement> Hah, well get yourself a club and go to this address and...ok maybe not such a good idea. *facepalms*
[07:02] <BiosElement> Feel free to just checkout the forums and comment. ^_^
[07:02] <BiosElement> We always need more lurkers poking around and giving ideas.
[07:02] <Unit193> Not the ideas I have...
[07:02] <Unit193> But I'll check them out!
[07:03] <BiosElement> Heh, If I sound annoyed it's just because this gets old
[07:04] <BiosElement> This is the third poll and 10-somethinith decision made that then somehow is all my evil doing
[07:04] <BiosElement> But wasn't a problem at the time. *sighs*
[07:05] <Unit193> I missed what "this" is?
[07:06] <BiosElement> Ahh, *rants about decision* "Ok fine, I'll hold a poll" *Good.* *month later* *That poll was crap!!!*
[07:07] <BiosElement> It looks bad but eh, I'm just going to ignore any further bitching about it. Decisions made, move on. I will never understand how folks like Jono and Mark put up with this heh.
[07:07] <Unit193> I soooo don't want to be you right now....
[07:08] <BiosElement> Yeah well, join the club. ^_^
[07:08] <BiosElement> My drug of choice is Crystal Method BTW, if you ever do lead a project. Just turn it up and blow a few speakers.
[07:13] <BiosElement> Wow.
[07:14] <BiosElement> So a poll is done with over a dozen random gamemode concepts
[07:14] <BiosElement> Now all of sudden it's 'my' project
[07:14] <BiosElement> I'm really glad I don't have to deal with this in person
[07:19] <BiosElement> Awesome, I wrote two paragraphs for every paragraph written.  Should I try it? ;)
[21:33] <dmcglone> Oh yes!
[21:34] <dmcglone> I think I'll be sticking here from now on
[21:38] <dmcglone> Unit193: you will not regret it :-)
[21:46] <thafreak> ok, I know some of you have mentioned using arch
[21:47] <thafreak> how the hell do I search the available packages?? what's the equivalent of apt-cache search, or aptitude search
[21:48] <thafreak> nm...I found it on the wiki
[21:53] <Unit193> dmcglone: I have always been a fan of Kubuntu!
[21:54] <Unit193> Back with 7.*
[22:12] <dmcglone> 7*???
[22:12] <Unit193> Feisty Fawn... I still have a CD of it...
[22:13] <dmcglone> Oh
[22:13] <dmcglone> I thought KDE was up to 7x and I missed it
[22:13] <dmcglone> haha
[22:13] <Unit193> Yeah... Kubuntu 7.04
[22:14] <dmcglone> I'm not running Kubuntu, I'm running Ubuntu with KDE
[22:14] <Unit193> I had Ubuntu 6.10 on one computer till Lubuntu 10.10 (well, 10.04 but a week later 10.10 came out)
[22:14] <Unit193> Why not Kubuntu?
[22:15] <dmcglone> why? it works either way
[22:15] <dmcglone> I have both Gnome and KDE on this computer
[22:16] <dmcglone> do you have both?
[22:20] <dmcglone> I wonder if there's a way to trick netflix to let me watch instant on linux
[22:27] <Unit193> I have Lubuntu(=LXDE) on one and going/had Kubuntu on another
[22:28] <Unit193> The lubuntu computer is moving to another unit, so I may swap L for X...
[22:56] <canthus13> heh. just talked to someone whose house number was 1337.
[23:14] <dmcglone> I think my router is shot
[23:14] <Cheri703> that's no good dmcglone
[23:14] <dmcglone> I know.  BUT I just found a really cool site that shows how it works
[23:19] <dmcglone>    Hmmm pretty cool
[23:19] <dmcglone> http://imagebot.org/silverlight/postcards/
[23:19] <dmcglone> check it out using moonlight
[23:51] <Cheri703> cool video: controlling ardrone quadcopter with kinect: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMSM_9SeNZk&feature=youtu.be  friend of mine set that up at Dev8d
[23:57] <dmcglone> Im installing XP in a virtual box
[23:57] <Cheri703> dual boot
[23:57] <dmcglone> no, using virtual box
[23:58] <Cheri703> I meant you should dual boot
[23:58] <dmcglone> I already got dual boot with XP too... LOL
[23:58] <Cheri703> ....
[23:58] <dmcglone> I'm lazy
[23:58] <Cheri703> -_-
[23:59] <dmcglone> Im probably only going to use it to watch netflix movies


[11:34] <tarzeau> qemu is broken, i want  local x, but it keeps telling me: Display 'gtk' is not available. (nor sdl) instead it wants freaking vnc
[11:35] <tarzeau> debian has it right with 4.1-3 but focal still has 4.0+dfsg-0ubuntu10 :(
[11:35] <tarzeau> should i file an lp bug?
[11:43] <cpaelzer> sdl was removed, gtk should be available
[11:44] <cpaelzer> but gtk is an extension (to avoid pulling in too much dependencies)
[11:44] <cpaelzer> have you insatlled the package (... checks what the name is ...)
[11:44] <cpaelzer> "qemu-system-gui"
[11:44] <cpaelzer> tarzeau: ^^ ?
[11:46] <tarzeau> cpaelzer: thanks, after installing that it works :)
[11:46] <cpaelzer> great
[11:46] <cpaelzer> also a newer qemu will come once 4.2 is available
[11:46] <cpaelzer> well after christmas break I guess
[11:46] <tarzeau> any reason to skip archive sync of 4.1 from debian?
[11:47] <cpaelzer> interim updates usually only make a very very small amount of people happy but break many places that rely on virtualization for testing
[11:47] <cpaelzer> so I try to merge it once per cycle and that is then on the planned target version of the release
[11:47] <cpaelzer> after that only bug fixes
[11:47] <cpaelzer> no major version change
[11:49] <tarzeau> i see
[11:49] <cpaelzer> tarzeau: also Debian has --disable-sdl as well
[11:49] <tarzeau> i like sdl, certainly more than vnc or gtk
[11:50] <cpaelzer> sdl1 becomes more an more a gigantic dept to maintain and sdl2 had way too mcuh issues
[11:50] <tarzeau> i've never had issues with either version
[11:50] <cpaelzer> me neither, but a reasonable number of bugs pointed at Debian/Ubuntu had
[11:51] <tarzeau> debian import freeze 27th feb 2020, what if i got stuff stuck in debian new queue, but i'd like to see them with ubuntu 2020 lts?
[11:52] <cpaelzer> tarzeau: once you think you'll stay stuck you should try to hit Ubuntus new queue with an upload of the same
[11:52] <cpaelzer> and have a bug to discuss this with the archive admins
[11:53] <tarzeau> i'm not a canonical/ubuntu employee, i doubt i can upload anything to that queue you mean
[11:53] <cpaelzer> but our freezes aren't mcuh different IIRC
[11:53] <tarzeau> but i can point relevant people to my source packages?
[11:53] <cpaelzer> Feb 27th https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FocalFossa/ReleaseSchedule
[11:54] <cpaelzer> as I said not too mcuh gain by that
[11:54] <tarzeau> i meant ubuntu import freeze of course
[11:54] <tarzeau> ok thanks
[15:52] <Odd_Bloke> Hey folks, I just did a `sudo apt install nvidia-driver-440` and rebooted, and my system has come back up still using the nouveau driver.  Does anyone know how I can debug why that's happened?
[15:53] <lotuspsychje> Odd_Bloke: wich graphics card chipet please?
[15:54] <Odd_Bloke> lotuspsychje: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/vTsZRr4wdT/
[15:54] <Odd_Bloke> (`ubuntu-drivers devices`)
[15:54] <lotuspsychje> big RTX card might need the latest driver from the ubuntu graphics ppa Odd_Bloke
[15:56] <Odd_Bloke> I was successfully running the drivers from the archive previously; I removed them because I was seeing kernel panics and was working on debugging those.
[15:59] <Odd_Bloke> Oh, looks like the modules just weren't installed for my running kernel.
[15:59] <Odd_Bloke> That would explain it. :p
[16:05] <Odd_Bloke> OK, now I'm seeing this in dmesg: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/zD25HQGyY7/
[16:06] <lotuspsychje> wich driver version are you getting that warning?
[16:17] <Odd_Bloke> lotuspsychje: 440


[05:47] <seb128> goood morning desktopers
[05:48] <duflu> Morning seb128
[05:48] <seb128> duflu, hey, how are you today?
[05:48] <duflu> seb128, better but not fully better. How are you?
[05:49] <seb128> I'm alright!
[05:53] <oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
[05:54] <duflu> Hi oSoMoN
[05:54] <oSoMoN> hey duflu
[05:56] <seb128> lut oSoMoN, en forme ?
[06:01] <oSoMoN> salut seb128, ça va bien, et toi?
[06:05] <seb128> ça va :)
[06:10] <didrocks> good morning
[06:12] <oSoMoN> salut didrocks
[06:14] <didrocks> hey oSoMoN
[06:20] <seb128> lut didrocks
[06:20] <seb128> hey ricotz
[06:21] <didrocks> salut seb128
[06:26] <duflu> Salut didrocks
[06:27] <didrocks> bonsoir duflu :)
[06:27] <duflu> 2:27 PM :)
[06:28] <didrocks> bon après-m! donc :)
[07:22] <ricotz> hello desktopers
[07:27] <didrocks> hey ricotz
[07:29] <ricotz> didrocks, hi
[07:40] <duflu> Hi ricotz
[07:48] <oSoMoN> hello ricotz
[10:14] <diddledani> oSoMoN: should I set 1967963 as a duplicate of 1970594 considering the latter is where we have the fix
[10:14] <diddledani> #1967963 #1970594
[10:15] <diddledani> bah bot!
[10:15] <diddledani> LP: #1967963 LP: #1970594
[10:16] <oSoMoN> diddledani, that looks like a different problem, where the reporter couldn't set the default browser in the KDE settings app
[10:16] <diddledani> oh I thought it was the same issue - both seemed related
[10:16] <oSoMoN> hence the request for more info and the incomplete status
[10:18] <diddledani> in that case then, rereading it, it does look separate. Ignore me ;-p
[10:19]  * diddledani pets her rubber duck (oSoMoN )
[10:27] <oSoMoN> I am no rubber duck!
[10:35] <diddledani> then how did I just do rubber duck decision making?! ;-p
[10:37] <ogra> oSoMoN, we had many people complain in #ubuntu that you can not run chroimum with native wayland support (i think there is even a bug open) ... i wonder if we couldn't change the desktop helpers a bit to allow overriding "DISABLE_WAYLAN😧 1" from the user side somehow (env will obviously not work since snapcraft sets it after start, but probably an extra cmdline option or so)
[10:57] <oSoMoN> ogra, I think DISABLE_WAYLAND is intended for applications which are known not to support wayland natively, so if chromium is supposed to work well with wayland these days (I haven't checked recently but I will do that again), we should simply not set it in the snap
[10:58] <ogra> oSoMoN, well, to run chromium with wayland you need to add some cmdline switches, it works fine in my electron snaps, but DISABLE_WAYLAND will make the desktop-launcher force it into XWayland so it does not even find a socket
[10:59] <ogra> our launcher setup makes it impossible for people to test it in that context (i dont want to move chromium to wayland permanently, i just want us to have a way to not make the launcher be so strict)
[11:00] <ogra> oSoMoN, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/chromium-browser/+bug/1897454 was the bug
[11:02] <ogra> ... the launcher picks up the snapcraft.yaml env variable and we can not override this from the user side
[11:04] <oSoMoN> testing now whether a repacked chromium snap without that env var works as expected
[11:05] <ogra> FORCE_WAYLAND=1  chromium --enable-features=UseOzonePlatform --ozone-platform=wayland ... if something like that would simply make the launcher "export DISABLE_WAYLAND=0" at the very top, users could force-override the hardcoded default
[11:05] <ogra> (or "unset DISABLE_WAYLAND")
[11:06] <oSoMoN> if it does I'll remove the var (from what I read chromium still defaults to xwayland unless explicitly instructed otherwise)
[11:07] <ogra> right, i dont want the default changed ... just an option for users wanting to "explicitly instruct it otherwise" 😉
[11:07] <ogra> i.e. not a chromium change, but added launcher flexibility
[11:10] <diddledani> ogra: oSoMoN : I forget whether this is true, but you might find traction with a change to the `environment` declaration - use a posix shell "if this is not currently defined" variable expansion the way that the desktop runtime extensions add to `build-environment` to allow for augmenting pre-existing vars like LD_LIBRARY_PATH
[11:10] <oSoMoN> in this case though I think the chromium change is the most sensible option (provided my testing validates it): chromium will still default to xwayland, but it does support native wayland, at least experimentally
[11:10] <ogra> i just assume that chromium is not the only app that would benefit from a little less strictness
[11:11] <oSoMoN> here the use of DISABLE_WAYLAND is clearly not correct (any longer)
[11:12] <oSoMoN> sure, but I argue that the packagers of these apps should decide whether DISABLE_WAYLAND is (still) relevant to the app they package
[11:12] <ogra> especially in the light that likely more and more apps will slowly switch to native wayland, so you could optionally try running them in that context and help devs identify bugs etc
[11:12] <oSoMoN> but it wouldn't hurt to allow overriding it, I guess
[11:14] <ogra> diddledani, i'm not sure there is a way to have the snapcraft wrapper pick it up in such a way ... but yeah, it might make more sense overriding it there than in the desktop launcher if such things work there
[11:16] <ogra> though i think that requires a bigger change in snapcraft itself
[11:17] <oSoMoN> diddledani, ogra: in fact I did exactly this in the firefox snap two days ago: https://git.launchpad.net/~mozilla-snaps/+git/firefox-snap/commit/?id=21aad6e1944b72b359305ad22d665802ce4df6ed
[11:17] <ogra> hah !
[11:18] <diddledani> what I was thinking is the user can export DISABLE_WAYLAND=0 somehow which based on using an environment block like `environment: { DISABLE_WAYLAND: ${DISABLE_WAYLAND:-1} }`
[11:18] <ogra> diddledani, not sure the yaml parser would permit that syntax
[11:19] <oSoMoN> yeah, I don't think so
[11:19] <ogra> (would be awesome if it did though)
[11:19] <diddledani> well it supports this: https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/blob/8062dfd03ddd4ba8ca3445a46b8bd0e89391fb35/snapcraft/internal/project_loader/_extensions/gnome_3_38.py#L140
[11:20] <diddledani> might need quotes
[11:20] <diddledani> other than that I think it'll work
[11:21] <ogra> DISABLE_WAYLAN😧 ${DISABLE_WAYLAN😧-1}
[11:21] <ogra> bah
[11:21] <diddledani> EMOJI INVASION!
[11:21] <ogra> it works without the outer curly brackets here
[11:21] <ogra> no idea if it functions as expected though
[11:21] <diddledani> you need the curlies because it's a posix shell expansion
[11:22] <diddledani> the curlies around environment: {} are a yaml syntax thing
[11:23] <diddledani> the curlies on ${DISABLE_WAYLAND:-1} are a posix shell expansion
[11:24] <diddledani> the equivalent yaml could be: https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/ExaSY2XG/
[11:24] <diddledani> that's identical to the line I put above
[11:25] <diddledani> these are both identical https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/dYYwSOqB/
[11:26] <KGB-0> gtk4 tags 133c584 Simon McVittie upstream/4.6.3+ds1 * Upstream version 4.6.3+ds1 * https://deb.li/3p8dg
[11:26] <KGB-2> gtk4 pristine-tar 28e4bbd Simon McVittie gtk4_4.6.3+ds1.orig.tar.xz.delta gtk4_4.6.3+ds1.orig.tar.xz.id * pristine-tar data for gtk4_4.6.3+ds1.orig.tar.xz * https://deb.li/xJHh
[11:39] <oSoMoN> it'd be interesting to have stats on how many snaps set DISABLE_WAYLAND in their environment


  It autodetects what it needs...
[00:12] <awardle> So should I tell the person just to remove their xorg.conf then?
[00:15] <jmarsden> awardle: Unless they have a system that needs one...
[00:16] <jmarsden> awardle: You have not given the channel enough context to really answer that question... what is wrong with the setup "the person" has right now?
[02:46] <LimCore> happy, less full of bugs, 2010 \o/
[03:25] <cyan-spam> hey all, trying to triage a bug here and i think i need someone more experienced to help me out :)
[03:42] <yofel> cyan-spam: if you need help please always post the bug number as 'bug XXX' so that we can help you
[03:42] <yofel> if you have a general question then just fire away, someone will answer when they see the question
[03:43] <yofel> and know the answer ;)
[03:43] <cyan-spam> yofel: ok, thanks. the bug is <https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/501744>. i tried my best when i got no response.
[03:43] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 501744 in ubuntu "crashed entire gui while in fullscreen" [Undecided,Incomplete]
[03:44] <yofel> cyan-spam: just bug 501744 is enough, we have a great bot in here ;)
[03:44] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 501744 in ubuntu "crashed entire gui while in fullscreen" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/501744
[03:44] <cyan-spam> yofel: well, it was easier to copy the URL for me. :) if you have a better response, please take over. not sure what the right procedure is here
[03:48] <yofel> hm, I'm not the best person to ask about when it comes to X related bugs...
[03:50] <yofel> someone else should look at this too, but IMHO you did the right thing so far
[03:54] <cyan-spam> thanks
[04:27] <cyan-spam> night all
[05:53] <\vish> could someone kick start/re-start the 5-a-day bot :(
[05:54] <\vish> bdmurray: ?
[11:11] <RoyK> hi all
[11:12] <RoyK> how long does it usually take from a bug is reported till it's fixed? weeks? months? #471163 puts a limit on the usability on this laptop...
[11:12] <nigel_nb> bug 471163
[11:12] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 471163 in linux "kernel 2.6.31-14 report error in eth9x module" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/471163
[11:13] <RoyK> I think I've reported the necessary stuff
[11:13] <RoyK> if not, please tell
[11:14] <nigel_nb> checking
[11:17] <nigel_nb> RoyK: what exactly is the issue?
[11:17] <nigel_nb> you cant use your wireless?
[11:18] <RoyK> nigel_nb: I get a kernel bug/crash and after that the wlan is dead
[11:18] <nigel_nb> okay, all required info is attached
[11:18] <nigel_nb> I'll mark it as confirmed
[11:18] <RoyK> thanks
[11:19] <nigel_nb> it was a one-time situation or happens every time?
[11:19] <RoyK> it happens every now and then
[11:19] <RoyK> it took for ever to upgrade to -16 - I had to go through 5-6 reboots to download it all
[11:22] <nigel_nb> RoyK: marked as confirmed
[11:24] <RoyK> danke
[12:34] <Yos> nigel_nb, ping
[12:34] <nigel_nb> Yos: yes
[12:35] <Yos> Hey, how is the best way to find a duplicate?
[12:35] <nigel_nb> Yos: google ;)
[12:35] <Yos> There is a report of a bug now that I know is a duplicate of a bug reported earlier
[12:36] <nigel_nb> it may or may not have been filed under proper package
[12:36] <nigel_nb> gimme current bug number
[12:37] <Yos> 502265
[12:37] <nigel_nb> bug 502265
[12:37] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 502265 in alsa-driver "audio muted on boot sometimes" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/502265
[12:37] <Yos> I changed the package to alsa
[12:37] <nigel_nb> Yos: good, now the audio team is subscribed
[12:38] <Yos> So I should just let them deal with it now?
[12:39] <nigel_nb> they would deal with it, but lets find the dup
[12:39] <nigel_nb> already daniel is overworked, we'll take some work off his head
[12:39] <nigel_nb> is it bug 453776
[12:39] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 453776 in ubuntu "volume muted after boot" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/453776
[12:44] <Yos> I found it YaY
[12:44] <Yos> 352732
[12:44] <yofel> bug 352732
[12:45] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 352732 in alsa-utils "[jaunty,karmic] Sound muted after boot" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/352732
[12:45] <Yos> Others were also reported as a duplicate of it
[12:46] <nigel_nb> ah
[12:48] <Yos> in google, I added 'site:launchpad.net' so that it only searched launchpad
[12:49] <nigel_nb> Yos: thats wat we all do
[12:49] <nigel_nb> launchpad search obviously kinda sucks
[12:49] <Yos> Like ubuntuforums
[12:50] <nigel_nb> I'm not that active on forums, I live on LP and IRC ;)
[12:50] <Yos> I'm still trying to find my way around on LP
[12:53] <Yos> Just another '?', when I report a duplicate, should I leave a comment telling the reporter that I have done so and direct them to the new location?
[12:56] <nigel_nb> Yos: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Responses
[12:56] <nigel_nb> Yos: Ideally, before you link as duplicate you need to give standard response for duplicate
[12:56] <nigel_nb> then mark as duplicate
[12:56] <Yos> oops, now I know
[12:57] <nigel_nb> Yos: but if you've already marked, dont add the comment because everyone else on the original bug would get a copy, would create unnecessary noise on mails
[12:57] <Yos> gotcha
[12:57] <Yos> Thanks again :)
[13:03] <nigel_nb> no problem :)
[18:39]  * WeatherGod waves
[18:41]  * nigel_nb waves back to WeatherGod
[18:41] <WeatherGod> good to be back
[18:41] <WeatherGod> gotta long backlog of bug reports to answer
[18:43] <nigel_nb> hehe
[18:43] <nigel_nb> me too back after some time today
[18:44] <WeatherGod> nigel_nb: have a good holiday?
[18:45] <nigel_nb> WeatherGod: not bad, I had work.  too much work actually
[18:45] <WeatherGod> ah
[18:46] <WeatherGod> anything interesting happen with Ubuntu in the past couple of weeks?
[18:47] <nigel_nb> nothing much
[18:49] <WeatherGod> oh, btw, to whoever did the update to the lp plugin for firefox, I really love the new feature of coloring the OP's replies
[18:50] <WeatherGod> it makes it easier to spot when someone else hijacks a bug report
[18:52] <nigel_nb> is there an lp plugin, i didn't know
[18:53] <WeatherGod> yeah... let me find the name
[18:54] <WeatherGod> nigel_nb: firefox-lp-improvements
[18:54] <WeatherGod> it is a PPA
[18:54] <nigel_nb> ah
[18:55] <WeatherGod> there is also firefox-launchpad-plugin, but I haven't noticed it doing anything, I don't think
[18:56] <WeatherGod> firefox-lp-improvements modifies your bug report pages so that you can see the karma of each user that replies
[18:57] <WeatherGod> which is really nice in determining the level of expertise someone has in their comments
[18:58] <WeatherGod> it also shows little icons for which projects they are involved in next to their username
[18:58] <WeatherGod> so you can see if another bug triager has already taken control of a report
[18:58] <WeatherGod> or a ubuntu developer...
[18:59] <nigel_nb> how do I install it?
[19:00] <WeatherGod> you go to it's PPA page and add its debsrc entries to your sources list
[19:00] <WeatherGod> then you can install the package
[19:00] <nigel_nb> lemme try out
[19:10] <SoftwareExplorer> I'm trying to submit a suspend / resume bug, and I am following the page at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingKernelSuspend. I get to the part where it says 'hash matches /build/buildd/linux-2.6.32/drivers/base/power/main.c:430', but I don't get any 'hash matches device i2c-9191' type of line. I am doing this on 10.04. What shoul I do/try next?
[19:13] <SoftwareExplorer> link to pastebin of dmesg.txt http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/350491/
[19:15] <WeatherGod> SoftwareExplorer: I am taking a look, give me a second to catch up
[19:16] <SoftwareExplorer> WeatherGod: Ok, thanks.
[19:22] <Yos> If you are unsure which package is causing the problem, a safe bet is the kernel, ''but make the bug title includes "suspend" or "hibernate"''  Ok, so how does one file a bug against 'The kernel'?
[19:23] <yofel> Yos: ubuntu-bug linux
[19:24] <WeatherGod> SoftwareExplorer: I would agree to file this one against the kernel...
[19:24] <Yos> ty yofel
[19:24] <WeatherGod> according to your dmesg output, it does not indicate any particular driver module to be the culprit
[19:25] <yofel> afaik almost all suspend/resume bugs are kernel issues
[19:25] <WeatherGod> oh, shoot
[19:25] <WeatherGod> SoftwareExplorer: your issue is Suspend/Resume from DISK, not RAM
[19:25] <WeatherGod> at least, that is what your dmesg says
[19:26] <Yos> yofel Too many matches. Please try to narrow your search.  I'm trying to assign a bug to the kernel ???
[19:27] <WeatherGod> Yos, yeah, that's annoying...
[19:27] <Yos> Is it just 'ubuntu
[19:27] <yofel> Yos: a) which bug? b) what are you searching for
[19:27] <Yos> one sec
[19:27] <SoftwareExplorer> WeatherGod: Ok. I started the suspend with sync; echo 1 > /sys/power/pm_trace; pm-suspend, Is that a hibernate command?
[19:27] <Yos> bug 502376
[19:27] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 502376 in ubuntu "Toshiba Tecra doesn't resume from suspend" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/502376
[19:28] <yofel> Yos: put 'linux' into the package field
[19:28] <Yos> ok
[19:28] <yofel> thats the name of the kernel package
[19:28] <yofel> *source-package
[19:29] <WeatherGod> SoftwareExplorer: are you having trouble with suspend-to-disk or suspend-to-memory?
[19:30] <SoftwareExplorer> WeatherGod: Both, IIRC, but I was going to start with suspend to ram first
[19:30] <Yos> ty yofel now can they use apport-collect to provide the missing information ?
[19:31] <WeatherGod> SoftwareExplorer: if you are  having trouble with both, then I would do the tests for suspend-to-disk first
[19:31] <WeatherGod> suspend-to-ram is trickier to diagnose
[19:31] <yofel> Yos: yes, just 'apport-collect 502376' will do the trick here
[19:32] <Yos> Thanks :)
[19:32] <SoftwareExplorer> WeatherGod: OK. I guess I'll have to read up on how to do that. Thanks.
[19:34] <WeatherGod> SoftwareExplorer: np
[19:35] <yofel> Yos: also, since this reporter seems new here, you might consider posting the 'package assignment' stock response so that the reporter can learn about choosing the right package himself next time
[19:36] <Yos> Cool, will do
[19:37] <yofel> Yos: ideally you should always post a short explenation if you change anything on a bug reporrt
[19:37] <yofel> *report
[19:37] <yofel> so that the people following the bug understand why
[19:38] <yofel> Yos: tried the ffx-lp-improvements? with it you have most stock responses only a click away on a report
[19:39] <Yos> Is that from the ML ?
[19:39] <yofel> hm?
[19:40] <nigel_nb> yofel: how do u put in the stock reponses while using lp improvements?
[19:40] <yofel> Yos: there is a firefox extension package with a few scripts that make triaging bugs easier
[19:40] <WeatherGod> Yos: it is from the PPA for firefox-lp-improvements
[19:40] <Yos> Is that from the mailing list ?
[19:41] <Yos> Ah, ok
[19:41] <yofel> Yos: the link to the ppa is on the top of the responses page
[19:41] <yofel> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Responses
[19:42] <Yos> I got it, thanks
[19:43] <yofel> nigel_nb: when you click on the arrow beside the package name on a bug and the menu to change the bug detail open up, then you'll have the responses titles shown below the comment box
[19:43] <nigel_nb> yofel: ah, saw it now! I've been copying and pasting for months bah!!
[19:43] <yofel> you can modify them and add your own if you need
[19:43] <yofel> nigel_nb: hehe, me too before I found them
[19:43] <nigel_nb> way too cool :)
[19:45] <yofel> *sigh*
[19:46] <yofel> the kernel stock response is still out of date
[19:46] <Yos> yofel, I can't find that "'package assignment' stock response"
[19:47] <nigel_nb> Yos: just look properly
[19:47] <nigel_nb> its in 2 lines
[19:47] <yofel> nigel_nb: the line depends on how large the ffx window is :P
[19:48] <nigel_nb> yofel: I assumed he did search with ctrl f, so the only way to miss it if its 2 lines
[19:48] <yofel> Yos: but nigel_nb is right, it's in the extension package and on the responses page (its called 'bugs without a package' there)
[19:49] <yofel> nigel_nb: ah true
[19:49] <nigel_nb> ;)
[19:49] <Yos> Ah yes, bugs without a package was the closest I could find
[19:50] <nigel_nb> yofel: the more I triage bugs, the more I think like of the possibilities a normal person would do
[19:50] <WeatherGod> how true
[19:58] <crimsun> guys/gals, "volume muted on boot" is *not* alsa-driver. Please stop mis-triaging it.
[19:58] <crimsun> it's alsa-utils; it's fixed in Lucid
[19:58] <nigel_nb> crimsun: oops, thanks for the alert
[19:58] <nigel_nb> what happened to the other nick btw?
[19:59] <crimsun> what do you mean?
[19:59] <nigel_nb> I mean dtchen
[19:59] <WeatherGod> nigel_nb: dtchen and crimsun are two different people
[19:59] <yofel> bdmurray: the kernel bug response in the firefox extension is out of date, can you do something about it? (or tell me who I have to call)
[19:59] <nigel_nb> WeatherGod: huh?
[19:59] <crimsun> oh, probably because I don't care to /nick every reconnect
[20:00] <WeatherGod> aren't they?
[20:00] <crimsun> uh, no.
[20:00] <nigel_nb> hahaha
[20:00] <WeatherGod> oh
[20:00] <nigel_nb> crimsun: oh okay :)
[20:00] <crimsun> I've been 'crimsun' on many, many irc networks since '94
[20:00] <WeatherGod> because, I could have sworn I carried on a conversation with both nicks at the same time once
[20:00]  * yofel didn't know that either :D
[20:01] <WeatherGod> as a matter of fact, I distinctly remember crimsun asking dtchen where he was going to eat
[20:02] <nigel_nb> that was maco
[20:02] <nigel_nb> not crimsun
[20:02] <WeatherGod> oh, right
[20:02]  * WeatherGod needs to get internal RAM checked
[20:03] <WeatherGod> crimsun: feel up to look at a system bell issue again?
[20:04] <nigel_nb> I'm off to bed, night folks :)
[20:04] <WeatherGod> the guys have really advanced on it and even has a possible patch
[20:04] <WeatherGod> goodnight
[20:04] <WeatherGod> it is bug 486154
[20:04] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 486154 in metacity "System beep broken in Karmic despite heroic efforts to fix it" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/486154
[20:05] <WeatherGod> the two people in it seem to be pretty exhaustive, but it is way over my head
[20:05] <crimsun> I'll look at it sometime later, so, no not right this moment
[20:05] <WeatherGod> ok, just thought I give you a heads-up on it
[20:10] <crimsun> also, if you see 9.10 sound bugs where the codec in use is a VIA something or another, please ask the original reporter to install linux-backports-modules-alsa-karmic-generic
[20:10] <crimsun> e.g.,  Mixer name   : 'VIA VT1708B 8-Ch'
[20:13] <WeatherGod> will do
[20:17] <crimsun> (that's directed toward all triagers, really :-)
[20:23] <WeatherGod> crimsun, it is ok to file "no sound" bugs that are due to slmodemd against the sl-modem package?
[20:23] <crimsun> no
[20:23] <crimsun> those are pulseaudio bugs
[20:23] <WeatherGod> oh, ok, I will fix that
[20:24] <crimsun> LP: #394500, #450222
[20:24] <WeatherGod> should I mark it as a dupe of one of those?
[20:24] <crimsun> yes
[20:30] <WeatherGod> crimsun, if the fix has been released  a few months ago, why is it still an issue?
[20:32] <crimsun> because it's fixed in *lucid*
[20:32] <crimsun> the patch is pretty big for karmic, so I don't plan to SRU it
[20:33] <WeatherGod> ok
[20:33] <crimsun> if they really, really want it, I just refer people to the ubuntu-audio-dev PPA in which I've backported it
[20:33] <crimsun> but, I do note that it is a PPA, so it's unsupported. It could eat kittens.
[20:34] <WeatherGod> actually, it looks like the one reporter is saying that he re-installed alsa with the hda-intel option
[20:35] <crimsun> most people commenting in those bugs are just shooting in the dark
[20:35] <WeatherGod> and that his only remaining issue is that he can not change the volume except through alsamixer
[20:35] <crimsun> you'll see that everywhere on LP; people just spraying utterly irrelevant comments all over sound bug reports
[20:36] <WeatherGod> well, yeah, I kinda figured that
[20:36] <WeatherGod> maybe he is leaving out some important info
[21:48] <rev42> i have a JMicron USA Technology Corp. JM20337 Hi-Speed USB to SATA & PATA Combo Bridge device that regularly just disconnects the harddrive and hangs with an led lit and this bug has been around since a year or so.. and now i look at launchpad just to see that bug reportin goonly leads to.. an information page.. wtf?
[21:54] <rev42> some of the things dmesg shows:    scsi 54:0:0:0: [sde] Result: hostbyte=DID_NO_CONNECT driverbyte=DRIVER_OK,SUGGEST_OK      end_request: I/O error, dev sde, sector 5664652            usb 2-1: new high speed USB device using ehci_hcd and address 82       usb 2-1: device descriptor read/64, error -71
[21:56] <WeatherGod> rev42, which bug report?
[21:58] <rev42> no bug report
[21:59] <WeatherGod> oh, were  you trying to file a bug report?
[21:59] <rev42> maybe...
[22:01] <WeatherGod> well, I would suggest doing so
[22:01] <bdmurray> yofel: if I knew what was wrong with it I could do something about it ;-)
[22:01] <rev42> so how does one report a bug these days?
[22:01] <WeatherGod> please read the How to Submit Bug Reports page
[22:02] <rev42> did so
[22:02] <WeatherGod> and you clicked on the link, didn't you?
[22:03] <yofel> bdmurray: ok
[22:05] <rev42> why should i use apport when i don't want a stupid tool to 'gather' things it's not supposed to send out in my oppinion?
[22:06] <WeatherGod> you don't have to... give me a second to find the right link
[22:07] <jmarsden> rev42: Because doing things that way may help get your bug fixed?  But if you don't want to, you don't have to, read that page again more carefully.  https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs#Filing%20bugs%20at%20Launchpad.net
[22:09] <WeatherGod> jmarsden: thanks for the link... you beat me to it
[22:10] <WeatherGod> I really need to update my bookmarks
[22:13] <rev42> what is the package for external usb disk controller failure?
[22:15] <WeatherGod> hmmm, someone can correct me if I am wrong, but I am gonna vote that this is a device-kit issue
[22:18] <jmarsden> rev42: Now do you see why allowing apport to help you choose the correct package for your report, and what info might be relevant, could be a good idea?
[22:19] <jmarsden> It has a whole set of questions regarding handling external storage devices built into it... run apport-bug to start the questions...
[22:20] <rev42> jmarsden: maybe some day. i feel discriminated as a professional bugzilla coder and professional bug filer..
[22:21] <jmarsden> rev42: As a professional bug filer, then, you would alreado know what package to file against, you don't need the help apport provides... so why did you need to ask the question here? :)
[22:21] <rev42> the world is big. not everything has to do with ubuntu
[22:22] <jmarsden> Right, so use the provided tools to avoid having to remember lots of details, let the software remember them for you...
[22:22] <jmarsden> Either that, or *do* remember all the details.  The choice is yours :)
[22:23] <WeatherGod> rev42: the world is big... that's why I come here to work with people that have different experiences and specialties
[22:23] <rev42> never mind. the time until someone fixes this.. will take too long anyways. i can't run fsck every 30 minutes for the next months.
[22:24] <WeatherGod> but, then that deprives us of a fix
[22:24] <WeatherGod> at least submit some information so that it can be examined
[22:25] <jmarsden> rev42: Some bugs are fixed in a day or two, if they have full information in the bug report so they can easily be reproduced...
[22:26] <jmarsden> I just helped test a proposed fix to spamassasin for a bug that emerged yesterday and the fix is already in the -proposed repos and headed for -updates.  Just as an example.
[22:27] <WeatherGod> rev42, by coming here, you actually do improve your chances of a bug getting fixed by coming here and raising awareness
[22:27] <WeatherGod> a bug like yours is quite serious as it can cause data corruption
[22:31] <WeatherGod> crimsun, are you still around?
[22:34] <rev42> well, to make it more tangible which device is failing: http://www.sharkoon.com/html/produkte/docking_stations/drive_link/index_en.html?id=11
[22:35] <WeatherGod> interesting... never seen one of those before
[22:36] <rev42> it work's fine with IDE drives. fails for SATA.
[22:36] <WeatherGod> interesting observation
[22:37] <WeatherGod> have you tried it with any other OS?
[22:37] <rev42> no
[22:38] <WeatherGod> would be interesting to see if there is a hardware issue with the SATA side
[22:57] <SoftwareExplorer> Ok, I have a question about an mpx bug I found. With two cursors, on a gnome application but not a qt3 one, both cursors are the same type (i-shape for text, double arrow for adustment, etc), with the type determined by the last cursor that moved. What package should I file this bug against?
[23:09] <SoftwareExplorer> also, this bug does not occur on a qt4 application
[23:14] <WeatherGod> softwareexplorer: I don't know, but maybe gtk?
[23:14] <WeatherGod> does it happen only for that one program, or what?
[23:15] <SoftwareExplorer> WeatherGod: Pretty much any gtk application. I thought it was a problem every program had until I tried a kde application
[23:15] <WeatherGod> ok, then this is likely a compiz, metacity or gtk issue
[23:18] <SoftwareExplorer> Well, we can rule out compiz. With compiz, you can hardly see the other cursor, so I'm using metacity. I got the kde application to work under metacity, so I guess I'll file it under gtk. Are there any special tags for mpx - related problems?
[23:19] <WeatherGod> dunno
[23:19] <SoftwareExplorer> Ok. Thanks.
[23:20] <WeatherGod> np