 (X wouldt start)Clean installed and my Audigy, though totally configured didn't produce sound.
[01:35] <zenwhen> I really want to run Breezy soon.
[01:36] <crimsun> slomo: converting the names can be messy, because the current settings for "Element X" may behave differently in the newer ALSA for "Element newX"
[01:37] <crimsun> slomo: for instance, the whole External Amplifier conditionally needs to be muted in newer ALSA for certain AC'97-based codecs deal
[01:38] <slomo> crimsun: sounds problematic... hmm... can you detect whether asound.state is from an old version? removing it while updating from an older version may be a solution but probably not the best :/
[01:38] <crimsun> zenwhen: and I won't even begin to delve into the Audigy legacy
[01:39] <zenwhen> Oh?
[01:39] <zenwhen> Any idea whats breaking it?
[01:40] <crimsun> slomo: it's possible (we can check amixer's return code), but that seems suboptimal. Going to think about this tonight.
[01:40] <crimsun> zenwhen: semantics changed between ALSA 1.0.6, 1.0.8, and 1.0.9 fairly majorly.
[01:41] <zenwhen> Oh
[01:41] <slomo> hm nice... the python update yesterday broke some stuff :(
[01:42] <zenwhen> at least its a known bug :)
[02:56] <jdub> mjg59: ping
[03:07] <tseng> lamont: ive not seen mythmusic, from early this morning, yet
[03:07] <lamont> added missing packages for ia64/hppa ---> NEW.  sparc hasn't uploaded yet
[06:17] <dhonn> hey i just noticed i has a new file on my computer its abi-2.6.12-9-k7 what is it?
[06:23] <dhonn> nvermind
[07:01] <zenwhen> This question may have been asked a million time, but is there a reason that DMA isnt enabled by default on optical drives?
[07:01] <zenwhen> times*
[07:03] <Amaranth> zenwhen: it doesn't work with some drives
[07:03] <Amaranth> as in, those drives will refuse to work
[07:42] <robitaille> humm...I'm getting a connection refused when I try to access  http://archive.ubuntu.com/   anyone else can confirm this?
[07:43] <Aegir> Does the same thing here robitaille
[07:50] <Aegir> Bollocks, archive.ubuntu.com refusing connections is going to make synaptic real fun, oh well.
[07:51] <robitaille> Aegir,  maybe switch to another repository from another country?
[07:51] <Aegir> Yeah, but thats efffort.
[07:52] <robitaille> but ca, us, and uk all point to the same broken one...
[07:52] <Aegir> Hmm
[07:53] <Aegir> I'm actually on the Australian one atm, and thats refusing aswell by the looks of things
[07:53] <bob2> which is also the same as ca, us and uk
[07:54] <robitaille> so is there any country-specific repository left?
[07:54] <Aegir> Ohwell, I'll just strike installing wine off my list of things to do today. No big deal.
[08:09] <tseng> there is a list of non-canonical mirrors on the wiki
[08:09] <tseng> at universities and such
[08:10] <tseng> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Archive
[08:25] <Yagisan> G'day - who do I bother with ltsp questions ?
[08:27] <robitaille> Yagisan,  have you tried the channel #ltsp ?
[08:28] <Yagisan> robitaille: yeah - but it was more questions on Ubuntu's implementation
[08:31] <Yagisan> robitaille: hmm - it seems like I can set up the ltsp server without the ltsp-server package - nevermind
[08:53] <robitaille> so who can access archive.ubuntu.com?  a lot of question on #ubuntu about the fact that it has been down for the last hour
[08:53] <robitaille> as in system admin access to the machine...
[08:54] <jsgotangco> hmm i guess the whole world can't update at the moment then
[08:55] <robitaille> unless you use a mirror
[08:55] <tritium> robitaille, there's been a note in the topic, and bob2 added another one
[08:56] <bob2> hrm, oops, didn't notice that there, sorry
[08:57] <robitaille> tritium,  but people never read the topics :)
[08:57] <tritium> bob2, no need to apologize.  robitaille makes a good point :)
[08:58] <tseng> robitaille: if they cant read the topic, you cant be arsed to go around trying to get them more info
[08:58] <bob2> when did it stop responding?
[08:58] <tseng> or something.
[08:58] <robitaille> bob2,   at least for one hour
[09:03] <jdub> yo robitaille
[09:03] <jdub> GOOD MORNING FREEDOM LOVERS!
[09:03] <robitaille> hello jdub
[09:04] <robitaille> always find strange to be told good morning when I'm about to go to bed :)
[09:04] <jdub> heh
[09:04] <tseng> hi jdub
[10:57] <zyga> hello
[11:22] <mdke> any eta on archive.u.c coming back?
[11:24] <Treenaks> RSN
[11:24] <siretart> security.ubuntu.com should be even more important..
[11:24] <Treenaks> what happened then?
[11:24] <mdke> what is RSN?
[11:24] <siretart> really soon now
[11:25] <mdke> ah great
[11:56] <\sh> morning gentlemen
[12:32] <mdke> Treenaks, RSN? :p
[12:35] <\sh> is someone working to fix the webserver? ,-)
[12:39] <eruin> anyone have anything to do with aspell here?
[12:42] <eruin> I'm trying to translate it for breezy, and I'm wondering what this is and how/where it is set/configured: common/config.cpp : consider run-together words legal
[12:47] <j^> are there plans to work on something like Conary[http://wiki.conary.com/]  but using arch + deb + xyz?
[01:21] <\sh> hey madduck
[01:48] <siretart> hey, archive is back!
[01:50] <\sh> wow
[02:06] <Znarl> I restarted archive.
[02:08] <siretart> thanks, Znarl!
[02:12] <\sh> Znarl: fantastic :)
[02:14] <jdub> mjg59: so, i checked my bios, and IR is enabled on COM2
[02:15] <mjg59> jdub: Hrmph.
[02:15] <mjg59> jdub: Can you do cat /sys/bus/pnp/devices/*/pnp and stick it up somewhere?
[02:15] <jdub> you mean */id ?
[02:16] <mjg59> Yeah
[02:17] <jdub> pasted
[02:17] <jdub> hmm
[02:19] <mjg59> jdub: Yeah, your IR has vanished for some reason
[02:19] <jdub> i wonder if that was when i booted without the dock
[02:19] <jdub> i will try that :-)
[02:22] <\sh> whois jdong
[02:22] <\sh> kick jdong
[02:23] <\sh> grmpf
[02:24] <jdub> hmm.
[02:25] <jdub> that didn't work.
[02:25] <zenwhen> hey
[02:47] <tseng> Robot101: have you considered netdev-random or audioentropyd?
[02:48] <tseng> Robot101: the first is a kernel patch to supply entropy from network traffic, second from ambient noise on a cheap microphone
[03:24] <pitti> Hi
[03:26] <\sh> moins pitti
[03:27] <bddebian> Heya pitti
[03:28] <infinity> Hye pitti.
[03:58] <ogra> mjg59, around ?
[04:00] <pitti> Hi ogra
[04:00] <ogra> hey pitti
[04:00] <pitti> anyone from the backports team here?
[04:00] <ogra> hahaha
[04:01] <ogra> pitti, seen my discussion on the ubuntu-de ML ?
[04:01] <pitti> ogra: just replied
[04:01] <ogra> ah, thanks :)
[04:02] <pitti> ogra: do you happen to know a contact address for the backports team?
[04:02] <ogra> jdong
[04:02] <ogra> i'll look up his mail adress
[04:02] <pitti> email?
[04:02] <mdke> you could try the Mailing List?

[04:05] <pitti> mdke: that would be nice, is there<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[04:05] <pitti> ogra: thanks
[04:05] <mdke> pitti, something like that
[04:05] <ogra> pitti, yup
[04:05] <mdke> pitti, @lists
[04:08] <bddebian> elmo: ping?
[04:12] <mjg59> ogra: Hi
[04:13] <\sh> grmpfl .. wront my 2cents to -de ML
[04:13] <\sh> wrote even
[04:13] <ogra> mjg59, should gnome-screensaver work with acpi or did you postpone the work until dapper ? i have a bug about it and would like to make it a enhancement for dapper
[04:15] <mjg59> gnome-screensaver should work with acpi.
[04:15] <mjg59> But, well.
[04:15] <mjg59> The basic problem is that gnome-screensaver --deactivate unlocks the screen
[04:15] <mjg59> Whereas xscreensaver-command -deactivate pops up the password dialog
[04:17] <jdub> good bug
[04:18] <bddebian> heh
[04:19] <ogra> mjg59, i wont waste time with it now, and i guess you will neiher... lets make it a enhancement :)
[04:19] <\sh> hmm..reiserfs s*cks
[04:20] <ogra> jdub, since i'm working on marks changes for gnome screensaver now, "switch account" or "switch user" ? how shall i call the button
[04:20] <mdke> so in Breezy is suspend going to come back to a password prompt or just a blank screen (ogra, mjg59)?
[04:20] <ogra> s/gnome screensaver/xscreensaver/ indeed
[04:20] <mjg59> mdke: A password prompt (assuming we switch back to xscreensaver)
[04:20] <ogra> we already did
[04:20] <mjg59> ogra: When?
[04:20] <infinity> A week ago?
[04:20] <ogra> last week
[04:21] <jdub> ogra: well, i think it makes sense to use the same language everything else does at the moment - "switch user..."
[04:21] <mjg59> Ah, so we did
[04:21] <mjg59> I thought we were waiting for Mark to get back?
[04:21] <ogra> jdub, ok
[04:21] <mdke> ogra, gnome-screensaver hasn't be removed though, and the current behaviour is a blank screen
[04:21] <mdke> be/been
[04:21] <jdub> mjg59: mdz made the change very quickly after the meetnig, i assume he spoke to mark
[04:21] <ogra> mjg59, he made the final call... its just that i have to rewrite the lock screen completely :)
[04:21] <mjg59> Ah, ok
[04:22] <mdke> so gnome-screensaver is going to be removed?
[04:22] <mdke> at the moment my computer is coming back to a blank screen after suspend
[04:22] <mjg59> mdke: It'll be fixed
[04:22] <mdke> great
[04:23] <mdke> ok it's #16297
[04:23] <ogra> mdke, gnome-screensaver is in universe :)
[04:24] <mdke> ogra, i don't mind, but it's on my computer after a default breezy install
[04:24] <jdub> *SO MUCH TEH SUCK*
[04:24] <mdke> heh
[04:24] <bddebian> heh
[04:24] <mjg59> mdke: ubuntu-desktop no longer depends on it
[04:24] <jdub> the only network device supported by the install out of the box is firewire
[04:24] <mjg59> jdub: What hardware?
[04:24] <jdub> no drivers for any of the other major hardware
[04:24] <jdub> mjg59: Dell X300
[04:24] <mjg59> jdub: Uhm.
[04:25] <mjg59> That really shouldn't be the case
[04:25] <jdub> you have to stick in the other dell CD and go through a smegridden driver install process
[04:25] <mjg59> Oh, Windows? Ha
[04:25] <mdke> yeah windows does that
[04:25] <mjg59> OculusAquilae: Please don't set your away status publically
[04:25] <jdub> somehow, they didn't even manage to get the OEM install CD right
[04:25] <mdke> mjg59, so if ubuntu-desktop no longer depends on it, how does it get removed?
[04:25] <jdub> that said, at least i'm getting firmware updates and stuff :|
[04:26] <OculusAquilae> mjg59: ok
[04:26] <mjg59> mdke: xscreensaver probably ought to conflict with it, but doesn't seem to
[04:26] <mjg59> ogra: ?
[04:27] <mjg59> ^
[04:28] <mdke> i guess people might want both
[04:28] <ogra> mjg59, Keybuk firbid me to do that, the Conflicts field isnt for such cases he says, see #16128
[04:28] <ogra> s/firbid/forbid
[04:28] <mdke> however i think a way should be figured out in order to remove it from people default breezy systems
[04:28] <mdke> people/people's
[04:28] <ogra> (brware, its rather a novel than a bug)
[04:29] <Keybuk> that's right; such a conflict would prevent people who have gss installed from upgrading ubuntu-desktop
[04:29] <Keybuk> Conflicts != Breaks
[04:29] <ogra> :)
[04:29] <tseng> Keybuk: i have a dpkg question, btw
[04:29] <mdke> Keybuk, so is there any solution to get gss removed from people's systems?
[04:29] <Keybuk> mdke: no, none
[04:29] <Keybuk> other than ask them to
[04:29] <Keybuk> or remove it from the archive and replace it with an empty package
[04:29] <ogra> mdke, the same as with polypaudio in hoary
[04:30] <tseng> Keybuk: mono-assemblies-base became mono-classlib-1.0, so m-c-1 Replaces m-a-b
[04:30] <Keybuk> tseng: sure, any time
[04:30] <ogra> (manual remove)
[04:30] <Keybuk> tseng: right?
[04:30] <tseng> Keybuk: but, symlinks dont get replaced properly
[04:30] <mdke> ah that sucks
[04:30] <ogra> yup
[04:30] <ogra> about time to fix dpkg :)
[04:30] <Keybuk> tseng: what doesn't get replaced?
[04:30] <mdke> ogra, ok that seems like a good candidate for releasenotes
[04:31] <ogra> really ?
[04:31] <tseng> Keybuk: it seems like symlinks from m-a-b get removed and not replaced by m-c-1 on hoary->breezy update
[04:31] <Keybuk> tseng: are the symlinks in both packages, or created by maintainer scripts?
[04:31] <tseng> Keybuk: created
[04:31] <mdke> ogra, sure, it is a known issue which is not going to be fixed right?
[04:31] <Keybuk> tseng: then it's not a dpkg problem -- it's a bug in the maintainer scripts
[04:31] <ogra> it is fixed for all upgrades after last week and for all new installs
[04:32] <tseng> Keybuk: i think they are foo.links, looking
[04:32] <ogra> and for all people that didnt upgrade the week it wasnt in
[04:32] <mdke> ogra, a lot of people upgraded at PR
[04:32] <ogra> s/wasnt/was
[04:32] <Keybuk> I think debian/*.links is a debhelper thing, so they should go into the package
[04:32] <ogra> it wasnt in pr
[04:32] <ogra> it entered afterwards
[04:32] <mdke> ogra, that is the problem
[04:33] <mdke> ogra, so everyone who dist-upgraded before it came in, has the issue
[04:33] <ogra> nope
[04:33] <mdke> assuming they do fairly regular upgrades
[04:33] <ogra> everyone who upgraded *during* it was in
[04:33] <tseng> Keybuk: its hard to tell much of anything on a clean breezy install, can i make myself a tracker bug and CC you?
[04:33] <mdke> *sigh*
[04:33] <tseng> Keybuk: so that you can hit me with a cluebat.
[04:33] <bddebian> heh
[04:34] <Keybuk> tseng: please ... I'll have more time to look when it's not Sunday :p
[04:34] <mdke> ogra, everyone who upgraded to breezy before it came in, is likely to have upgraded *during* it was in, because most people upgrade their system on a regular basis
[04:34] <tseng> Keybuk: great, thanks.
[04:35] <ogra> mdke, anyway, it will affect people that should know what to do, but not the masses that upgrade on release, its a development version... i would put a note anywhere, but not in the official release notes
[04:35] <tseng> Keybuk: what was your bugs email
[04:35] <mdke> alright we can think about it
[04:36] <Keybuk><EMAIL_ADDRESS>[04:39] <Keybuk> if gss is so broken nobody in their right mind would want it, why don't we replace it with an empty package?
[04:41] <mdke> +1
[04:41] <mdke> then bring it in for dapper
[04:41] <ogra> Keybuk, because seb128 instists to have it in immediately in 3 weeks if dappr opens
[04:41] <ogra> and i tend to agree with him
[04:42] <ogra> since we want to have it ready for dapper release
[04:42] <jdub> and wjmccann is doing great stuff on it
[04:42] <mdke> is there a problem with having it in in 3 weeks for dapper and not in Breezy?
[04:42] <Keybuk> if it's in the archive, people are going to install it
[04:42] <torkel> and it's not _that_ broken, it is only a bit imature...
[04:42] <ogra> Keybuk, its in universe
[04:43] <ogra> universe isnt even enabled in the default sources list
[04:43] <Keybuk> sure, but people upgrading through breezy got it dragged in because it was in main for a while
[04:43] <mdke> quite
[04:43] <mdke> even if they don't have universe enabled
[04:43] <mdke> they still have it
[04:43] <ogra> torkel, i think there are some additional breakages we'll have to fix... GL seems not to work right on many systems
[04:44] <ogra> while the same screensavers work flawless in xss
[04:45] <torkel> ogra: yeah, there are some work needed to get it in good shape
[04:46] <ogra> yup
[04:46] <ogra> nd enhancements (i want the fade code in there before we ship it for example ;) )
[04:47] <jdub> mmm. fast gamma fading.
[04:47] <ogra> and the dbus problem needs a clean solution...
[04:50] <pitti> Mithrandir: tbird 1.0.7 has been released, yay
[04:51] <zyga> what has happened to the neet shadow in gksu?
[04:51] <zyga> now the window (without chrome) looks really bad
[04:52] <ogra> yes, it should have a border
[04:52] <zyga> IMHO the shade was better
[04:53] <zyga> but I guess it was removed due to performace
[04:53] <ogra> nope, due to ugliness
[04:53] <ogra> the implementation is wrong
[04:53] <ogra> it will look cool if it once uses the X servers compose extension
[04:54] <tseng> i liked the fading ogra
[04:54] <tseng> it was at least better than the gnome logout fade
[04:54] <ogra> yes, thats odd too
[04:54] <Mithrandir> pitti: excellent
[04:54] <ogra> pitti, great, is there a backport of it :p
[04:54] <zyga> I second tseng's opinion
[04:56] <zyga> hmm guys - how about a pygtk gui with three buttons, install standard ubuntu gnome destktop packages (gnome-desktop), install yada yada kde (kubuntu-desktop) and quit?
[04:57] <tseng> erm, why?
[04:57] <Keybuk> it'd look even cooler if we replaced X with something a little less 18th century <g>
[04:57] <zyga> clueless users could hit one button and get kubuntu
[04:57] <\sh> zyga: hu?
[04:57] <Keybuk> zyga: surely those kind of users are better served by the different CDs ?
[04:57] <tseng> clueless users can download kubuntu iso in the first place
[04:57] <\sh> zyga: don't tell me I'm clueless ,-)
[04:57] <zyga> hmm
[04:57] <zyga> \sh: I dont ;-)
[04:58] <zyga> but clicking on one button is better than explaining apt-get or synaptic
[04:59] <\sh> zyga: what about "http://go-ubuntu.net/" ? have a windows activeX control and is asking: "Do you want to install [ ] Ubuntu [ ] Kubuntu [ ] Xubuntu?"
[04:59] <Keybuk> is there a user who can't drive synaptic and yet understands the difference between GNOME and KDE?
[04:59] <zyga> \sh: go-ubuntu? :-)
[04:59] <zyga> hmm
[05:00] <zyga> Keybuk: YES!
[05:00] <Keybuk> zyga: show me one
[05:00] <Keybuk> understanding the difference between desktop environments to me suggests either
[05:00] <Keybuk> 1) a level of clue
[05:00] <Keybuk> 2) advice received from others
[05:00] <Keybuk> 1 suggests they could handle synaptic
[05:00] <zyga> Keybuk: I'm promoting ubuntu among my friends and believe me that at leas one does not understand packages or what they are but she prefers kubuntu and an easy way to get it (Apart from second CD) is nice IMHO
[05:01] <Keybuk> 2 suggests the fact there's two CD options would be fine
[05:01] <infinity> 3) Love of screenshot bling.
[05:01] <Keybuk> zyga: why "apart from second CD" though?
[05:01] <zyga> Keybuk: I gave them ubuntu cds
[05:01] <zyga> (they are clueless users type)
[05:01] <ogra> zyga, give them kubuntu CDs then :)
[05:01] <Keybuk> I seriously don't think there's any way you could describe this app without relying on clue
[05:01] <\sh> zyga: yes...something like the ximian people did before they were bought by novell..."go-ximian.org" ,-)
[05:02] <zyga> one has recently asked me to install 'the windows program, linux program does not handle my boyfriends game'
[05:02] <zyga> that's a quote ;-)
[05:02] <zyga> \sh: interesting
[05:03] <zyga> \sh: err, no such domain
[05:03] <Keybuk> zyga: hasn't existed since Ximian Desktop got dropped
[05:05] <zyga> BTW: how can one post at planet.ubuntu.com?
[05:05] <jdub> zyga: if you're an ubuntu member, send me your rss feed
[05:05] <jdub> (you/your plural)
[05:05] <zyga> jdub: I'm not
[05:05] <zyga> :/
[05:06] <zyga> working on it though :-)
[05:07] <ogra> zyga, go ahead !
[05:08] <ogra> zyga, become a MOTU and build such a selection package for universe if you think it helps your users ... and then teach them to use synaptic to install this package ;)
[05:08] <bddebian> Heh
[05:09] <zyga> I feel a feedback loop building inside my brain
[05:09] <zyga> hmm
[05:09] <ogra> heh
[05:10] <zyga> nevermind... I'll never work on one cd anyway
[05:12] <\sh> zyga: it's new and secret ;) no..it was just a joke ;)
[05:13] <Keybuk> zyga: there's no python-gtk in kubuntu ... you'd have to have a qt version too <g>
[05:13] <bddebian> ogra: Nice recruiting tactic btw ;-)
[05:13] <ogra> heh
[05:14] <\sh> zyga: Keybuk is right, the pygtk there is called pyqt and better pykde ;-)
[05:14] <zyga> Keybuk: true
[05:14] <zyga> Keybuk: the package could be called 'this-gui-looks-bad' ;-)
[05:14] <Keybuk> and would it uninstall ubuntu-desktop if you installed kubuntu-desktop, and vice-versa?
[05:14] <\sh> Keybuk: no
[05:14] <zyga> hehe, exactly
[05:15] <\sh> Keybuk: not as it works now ;)
[05:15] <Keybuk> so how would the user's session change?  I'm not even sure that the xdm changes either
[05:15] <\sh> Keybuk: but I can do a "Replaces: ubuntu-desktop\nConflicts:ubuntu-desktop" easily ;)
[05:15] <Keybuk> \sh: I know where you live.
[05:15] <\sh> Keybuk: without a session logout? never
[05:16] <\sh> Keybuk: ah well...wanted to move to peru anyways ;)
[05:16] <ajmitch> \sh: I've heard it's nice this time of year :)
[05:16] <zyga> as far as crazy packages go, no-kde or no-gnome could be nice to get rid of all respective stuff
[05:16] <\sh> ajmitch: and they want to push linux ;)
[05:17] <Keybuk> zyga: it could have pretty screenshots of the default desktop environments ... and if it could have "xfce" and stuff added
[05:17] <Keybuk> could be a cute ap
[05:17] <zyga> Keybuk: like 'hi user, select how you would like your desktop to look like'
[05:17] <zyga> an after-install prompt
[05:17] <zyga> hmm :-)
[05:18] <Keybuk> it'd have to change the users default session, of course
[05:18] <zyga> yes
[05:18] <zyga> hmm :-)
[05:18] <Keybuk> cute project anyway
[05:18] <bddebian> Why don't you all just install xpdm and be done with it
[05:19] <zyga> bddebian: I guess a small plugin infrastructure could be added ;)
[05:19] <Keybuk> bddebian: not come across that one, screenshots?
[05:19] <zyga> bddebian: you could add anything you want then
[05:26] <bddebian> Keybuk: http://www.xpde.com
[05:27] <Keybuk> I actually quite like the XP greeter
[05:27] <ogra> eek
[05:28] <Keybuk> MS put a huge amount of user research into it
[05:28] <bddebian> greeter?
[05:28] <Keybuk> "welcome" screen
[05:28] <ogra> but a fake XP environment on top of linux is odd... it generates expectations that the system works like XP
[05:29] <Treenaks> bddebian: "Please click on your name"
[05:29] <bob2> haha
[05:29] <ogra> (crashes filling up memory, getting slow)
[05:29] <Keybuk> it works well, it's obvious what you have to do, it's used for both login and "unlock" -- it makes no need for the user to understand the difference between starting a new session or resuming an existing one, etc.
[05:29] <Keybuk> they just click on their name, and enter their password
[05:29] <Keybuk> it's cute
[05:29] <ogra> (apart from looking like a bonboniere)
[05:30] <bddebian> Ahhh
[05:30] <jdub> Keybuk: hopefully we'll be able to pull that off for gss in dapper
[05:31] <bob2> that would be pimp
[05:31] <Keybuk> can I put money now that if we finally get a face browser on the login screen, at least one person copies the face of one of the five-way ? :p
[05:32] <Keybuk> I want to be the girl with the digitally edited pig-tails
[05:34] <ogra> digitally edited pig tails ?
[05:34] <Keybuk> ogra: you'll see :p
[05:34] <ogra> heh :)
[05:35] <Keybuk> nah, I don't look good in pig-tails
[05:35] <Keybuk> only jdub can pull that of
[05:36] <ogra> lol
[05:36] <ogra> depends how beardy he is...
[05:37] <mjg59> Is there a way to get a dump of my current xkb state?
[05:55] <segfault> how's colony5? :)
[05:56] <ogra> released
[05:56] <segfault> going to install it right now, and erase my reiser4 partition
[05:56] <segfault> too buggy yet
[05:57] <ogra> good move :)
[05:57] <segfault> so, the language packs will fit in the 700mb live cd?
[06:16] <Chipzz> under what product is linux-image in bugzilla?
[06:17] <pitti> Chipzz: just "linux"
[07:02] <jdub> mjg59: do you remember which bios version the X300 you tested with had?
[07:07] <spayne> has anyone managed to get Skype installed on Breezy?
[07:12] <infinity> It's a QT app, isn't it?
[07:12] <infinity> And most likely still built for the old C++ ABI.
[07:12] <infinity> Their "completely static, including its own copy of QT" binary may be the way to go, until the provide one biult with g++-4.0
[07:12] <infinity> s/the provide/they provide/
[07:14] <mjg59> jdub: I haven't had an X300 to test
[07:17] <jdub> oh
[07:18] <infinity> I have an X300 (on my T43).  No idea what the video BIOS version is.
[07:18] <mjg59> infinity: Dell X300, rather than ATI one
[07:18] <infinity> Oh, silly me.
[07:22] <torkel> spayne: the <IP_ADDRESS> .deb should be installable. The newer deb (<IP_ADDRESS>) depends on libqt3c102-mt which is not available in breezy
[07:22] <spayne> i used the ubuntuguide one thanks
[07:23] <torkel> spayne: which one?
[07:24] <spayne> http://frankandjacq.com/ubuntuguide/skype_<IP_ADDRESS>-1_i386.deb
[07:24] <torkel> yeah found it
[07:27] <Keybuk> hmm, is ethereal known-busted?
[07:28] <ogra> not here (but probably not up to date)
[07:28] <ajmitch> Keybuk: capabilty module issue with latest kernel, iirc
[07:28] <ajmitch> ie the module stopped getting loaded by default for some reason
[07:30] <ajmitch> http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=16178 has the details
[07:31] <Keybuk> fair enough
[07:32] <ogra> Keybuk, why not modprobe capabilities ?
[07:32] <Keybuk> ogra: cause already capturing <g>
[07:32] <Keybuk> and ethereal can read tcpdump output
[07:33] <ogra> heh
[07:34] <Keybuk> once I ruled out SSL (well, openssl went "meh?") I figured I'd just capture the network transmission of this thing
[07:34] <Keybuk> and then read it later and look for patterns
[08:36] <Robot101> tseng: it looks like a kernel bug (see a later comment) rather than an excessive entropy user
[08:36] <Robot101> tseng: it's a 2.4 SMP box
[09:15] <BenC> anyone know what creates /lib/modules/`uname -r`/volatile?
[09:21] <jdub> BenC: linux-restricted-modules
[09:21] <jdub> /etc/init.d/linux-restricted-modules-common / lrm-manager
[09:23] <BenC> thanks
[09:28] <dholbach> hi
[09:29] <tritium> hi dholbach
[09:29] <dholbach> tritium: hi michael, how are you?
[09:30] <tritium> dholbach, fine, thanks.  How are you, Daniel?
[09:30] <dholbach> tritium: fine, i had a charming weekend :)
[09:30] <tritium> awesome :)
[09:30] <jdub> hey dholbach
[09:31] <dholbach> jdub: hey jeff, how are YOU?
[09:31] <jdub> rocking!
[09:31] <jdub> you?
[09:32] <Robot101> woot woot woot
[09:32] <dholbach> as i said, i had a charming weekend, so i'm particularly fine :)
[09:33] <jdub> :-)
[09:34] <dholbach> i'm still not used to blog regularly - else you'd all know, how the weekend was ;)
[09:36] <tritium> dholbach, sounds like a weekend worth blogging about...
[09:36] <dholbach> hmhmhmhmhm :)
[10:09] <Chipzz> BenC: if you want additional info on that bug, you can poke me here on irc too
[10:09] <Chipzz> it's not very severe but it tends to leave a messy trail as you upgrade through kernels :/
[10:32] <mxpxpod> does anyone use the quick-lounge applet?
[10:33] <dholbach> i did... some months ago
[10:33] <dholbach> anything wrong with it?
[10:33] <mxpxpod> dholbach: if I install a package like gazpacho while it's in the panel and then I go to use the drop down menu of qla, it sigsev's
[10:34] <dholbach> oh nice
[10:35] <mxpxpod> dholbach: could you check this out
[10:35] <dholbach> you couldn't catch a backtrace or something? the upstream guys would be delighted to hear about it, i'm sure
[10:35] <mxpxpod> dholbach: I couldn't get one... it kept telling me the backtrace was corrupt
[10:35] <dholbach> hrm
[10:36] <mxpxpod> maybe I don't have all the dbg packages I need installed... dunno
[10:41] <dholbach> the -dbg packages shouldn't be an issue
[10:41] <dholbach> but my trace seems to be corrupt too
[10:41] <dholbach> grm
[10:42] <mxpxpod> dholbach: so, it does it to you as well?
[10:42] <dholbach> mxpxpod: unfortunately so
[10:42] <dholbach> mxpxpod: i'll open an upstream bug and tell you the bug number
[10:42] <mxpxpod> dholbach: thanks
[10:42] <dholbach> mxpxpod: -> query
[10:49] <phlaegel> infinity: ping
[11:40] <jdub> Kamion: http://www.flickr.com/photos/s1mpl3/46534041/
[11:40] <jdub> Kamion: pr0n! :-)
[11:44] <zyga> hi
[11:44] <zyga> should any pygtk methods display gtk warnings?
[11:54] <dholbach> jdub: pr0n? :)
[11:58] <Kamion> jdub: heh :)
[11:59] <Kamion> rather random camera angles


[05:32] <hikiko> hello
[05:33] <hikiko> happy friday!
[06:23] <FJKong_> hello fri
[08:25] <willcooke> o/
[08:26] <flocculant> \\o
[08:33] <seb128> willcooke, hey, early start today? ;-)
[08:33] <seb128> hey flocculant
[08:53] <flexiondotorg> Morning willcooke seb128 hikiko FJKong_
[08:53] <hikiko> good morning willcooke seb128 flexiondotorg FJKong_ seb128 flocculant desktopers :)
[09:03] <Laney> west side
[09:08] <duflu> \  /\  /
[09:08] <seb128> hey flexiondotorg hikiko Laney
[09:08] <hikiko> I am about to create a partition for mir/z in my old laptop... /me fingers crossed
[09:09] <seb128> & duflu
[09:09] <hikiko> hi Laney and duflu
[09:09] <duflu> Morning seb128. I have zesty installed working fine (since yesterday)
[09:09] <duflu> Just use 20161102 or later
[09:09] <seb128> nice
[09:09] <seb128> I'm still on xenial :p
[09:10] <duflu> Only failed on 50% of machines I tried ;)
[09:10] <hikiko> I have xenial on desktop yaketty on laptop
[09:10] <hikiko> yakkety*
[09:10] <seb128> sort of the same here
[09:10] <seb128> though my desktop is my main laptop docked
[09:10] <seb128> the yakkety is the small inspiron
[09:11] <seb128> which is fine for testing but a bit of a small box for day work
[09:11] <hikiko> my desktop has a quite surreal setup: 2 GPUs, 4 monitors and I switch GPUs to test things :p
[09:12] <duflu> seb128: zesty is fine except (a) first attempt failed to install grub; (b) The software sources GUI doesn't work... edit /etc/apt instead
[09:12] <hikiko> duflu, you did a fresh installation?
[09:12] <duflu> hikiko: Yes
[09:12] <hikiko> is it safe to upgrade from Y?
[09:12] <duflu> hikiko: I don't know. If you need "safe" maybe assume no
[09:12] <hikiko> I am going to install x and upgrade to y and z afterwards
[09:13] <hikiko> duflu, I want to run mir on a machine
[09:13] <hikiko> should I use Y or X?
[09:13] <hikiko> Y or Z*
[09:13] <seb128> depends of what you mean by safe
[09:13] <seb128> but yeah upgrade should work
[09:13] <duflu> hikiko: Certainly Unity8 is working on zesty if you don't run into install issues
[09:13] <hikiko> but what do you use for work?
[09:14] <duflu> hikiko: xenial for my desktop, remotely logged into the zesty box :)
[09:14] <hikiko> and the mir is installed on zesty?
[09:15] <duflu> hikiko: Yes, Mir (and Unity8) is available in yakkety and zesty. Just choose it on the login screen
[09:15] <hikiko> cool :)
[09:15] <seb128> depends of what you work on
[09:16] <seb128> to work on mir you probably want to stay on the current devel version
[09:16] <seb128> e.g zesty
[09:16] <duflu> In fact the latest Mir release only exists on zesty right now
[09:16] <seb128> though early in the cycle you might still be fine on yakkety
[09:16] <seb128> like less moving and you might be able to rebuild the parts you need/work on
[09:17] <hikiko> I want to port chrome on mir, but I am going to start working actively at the task in 1 month or so, atm I just want to get a look to get an idea what's needed etc
[09:17] <hikiko> so I guess I will need the most recent version of mir every time
[09:17] <hikiko> so zesty
[09:17] <hikiko> right?
[09:17] <seb128> yes
[09:18] <hikiko> ok :)
[09:18] <hikiko> fingers crossed!
[09:18] <hikiko> and bbiab!
[09:18] <hikiko> thank you guys :)
[09:19] <willcooke> oops - sorry seb128, missed your message - yes, I'm leaving early tonight
[09:19] <willcooke> Center Parcs for the weekend
[09:19] <willcooke> (hence Monday off)
[09:21] <Laney> lads on tour
[09:21] <willcooke> \m/
[09:21] <duflu> hikiko: Sounds fun. Two notes: (1) racarr did Chromiun already but it probably bitrotted; and (2) Chrome relies on high precision frame timing which I still have a work in progress
[09:21] <duflu> *Chromium*
[09:22] <willcooke> yeah, the work racarr did is now bit-rotted to oblivion
[09:22] <hikiko> duflu, qengho told me that there was a patch for chromium from 2 years ago that doesn't work
[09:22] <hikiko> is that racarr's work/
[09:22] <duflu> Yep. And the high precision frame timing I think you can work around (I have in Xmir already)
[09:23] <hikiko> what is the high precision frame timing?
[09:23]  * duflu digs
[09:23] <hikiko> sounds like something alien :)
[09:23] <duflu> https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/attachmentText?aid=178027
[09:24] <seb128> willcooke, enjoy the w.e there!
[09:24] <duflu> It's the reason why Chrome has lower latency than just everything else
[09:24] <seb128> willcooke, don't forget the tie for the sauna
[09:24] <willcooke> :D
[09:24] <seb128> :-)
[09:25] <hikiko> oh I see
[09:28] <hikiko> duflu, so mir doesnt support this extension?
[09:29] <duflu> If you've ever wondered how a web page in chrome can have lower latency than a native app, I think that's the reason. Yes, I have started work to implement it in Mir. But it will take more time to complete
[09:30] <duflu> Xmir (DRI clients) want the same functionality too
[09:32] <hikiko> duflu, I am going to start this task in 1 month or so, and I guess that I can start porting other functions first... tbh I didn't look at the code yet but as far as I know from a first discussion with qengho  there's an API layer for displays called Ozone that should be ported first
[09:32] <duflu> hikiko: Yes, that's all I know... racarr worked on something called ozone :)
[09:33] <hikiko> so hopefully you will have done some work by then or if we see that I can't continue working on the task without this extension ported I could help you
[09:33] <duflu> hikiko: Ummm, they mention Mir too!  https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromium/src/+/master/docs/ozone_overview.md
[09:34] <hikiko> !
[09:34] <hikiko> that document seems helpful :)
[09:34] <hikiko> it explains what needs to be ported step by step!
[09:45] <duflu> hikiko: You can survive without the high precision frame timing. It's easy to fake: https://git.launchpad.net/~xmir-team/xorg-server/+git/xmir/commit/?id=4003bec9f46c725b840f6da05936add439d85ad2
[09:47] <hikiko> :D
[10:00] <Laney> menus seem messed up in z
[10:01] <Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/whatthemenu.png
[10:02] <seb128> :-/
[10:04]  * Laney isn't very clueful about how that hangs together
[10:05] <Laney> maybe attente has a few minutes to take a look? :-)
[10:05] <jbicha> bug 1615408
[10:05] <ubot5`> bug 1615408 in gnome-calculator (Ubuntu) "Theming issues with yakkety gnome-calculator in Unity" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1615408
[10:07] <Laney> I show two applications in that screenshot
[10:08] <seb128> that bug also has an extra menu
[10:08] <seb128> but the screenshot from z has the extra menu + an unstripped bar
[10:09] <Laney> I don't think it is quite the same bug
[10:09] <Laney> never seen the linked one myself
[10:09] <Laney> the title of gnome-calculator is wrong, but not the menu thing
[10:10] <jbicha> right, it's not the same bug
[10:13] <Laney> Trevinho: compiz is go
[10:14] <Trevinho> Laney: thanks
[10:14] <Laney> morning ;-)
[10:14] <Trevinho> morning Laney  :-)
[10:14] <Trevinho> Laney: as for the menus... yeah, I noticed something weird too... Might be unity-gtk-module related?
[10:15] <Laney> maybe, that's why I pinged the Super Canadian
[10:16] <seb128> hey Trevinho
[10:16] <seb128> is u-g-m still needed/used for gmenumodel code?
[10:18] <Trevinho> hi seb128
[10:18] <seb128> Trevinho, happy friday! how are you?
[10:18] <jbicha> by the way, I don't have Z's menu problem with Yakkety + backported GTK 3.22 from gnome3-staging ppa
[10:19] <Trevinho> seb128: Mh, I woke up a little upstet this morning... But ok :-)
[10:19] <seb128> oh?
[10:19]  * seb128 hugs Trevinho
[10:19] <Trevinho> And tomorrow there's an ubuntu it loco team meeting :)
[10:19] <seb128> great!
[10:19] <Trevinho> seb128: yeah, it happens often in the morning... I just hate the morning in any case 😂
[10:20] <Laney> oh Marcooooo
[10:20] <Laney> abbracci
[10:22] <Trevinho> Laney: ahahah :-)
[10:47] <hikiko> does anyone else have problems with the hr website?
[10:49] <Laney> hikiko: anything in particular?
[10:49] <Laney> loads ok
[10:50] <hikiko> Laney, when I try to submit a day off
[10:50] <hikiko> it shows an error page
[10:50] <Laney> lame
[10:50] <Laney> try #hr on the internal IRC
[11:04] <andyrock> morning
[11:10] <willcooke> hey andyrock
[11:38] <shiznix> i may be blind here but using say https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1630990 as an example, is there an easy way to see what the 'fix' committed/released actually is?
[11:38] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1630990 in linux (Ubuntu Yakkety) "include/linux/security.h header syntax error with !CONFIG_SECURITYFS" [High,Fix committed]
[12:10] <flocculant> oh my, I'm getting tarred with the desktoper brush instead of the idler one :p
[12:39] <attente> whoa. cool menus
[12:40] <Laney> hey attente!
[12:41] <attente> hi Laney!
[12:41] <Laney> how's it going?
[12:42] <attente> Laney: gooood
[12:42] <attente> Laney: you don't like the new menu design?
[12:42] <Laney> haha
[12:42] <Laney> what's the philosophy?
[12:42] <Laney> wherever the user might want to find a menu, we put one there
[12:43] <attente> if we have it in two places, everything will be more 'discoverable' :)
[12:44] <Laney> true
[12:44] <Laney> Won't Fix
[12:45] <Laney> didn't happen in a live session for me btw
[12:45] <Laney> but after installing zesty in a VM it was there
[12:45] <attente> how is that possible...
[12:46] <Laney> that is the fun!
[13:51] <Laney> lunch
[13:51] <Laney> then time to cross the badlands
[13:51] <Laney> and do some juju
[14:17] <attente> gtk-shell-shows-menubar is false under unity for some reason
[14:22] <Sweet5hark> popey, willcooke: around?
[14:23] <popey> Sweet5hark: for you, always
[14:24] <willcooke> Sweet5hark, otp
[14:25] <Sweet5hark> popey: <3 -- ok, lemme try to pick up the guys interested in snap stuff and (will bring them to #snappy)
[14:26] <willcooke> Sweet5hark, popey - quick hangout?  I've got to go in 2 mins, but would like to catch up with you before I do
[14:27] <Sweet5hark> willcooke: nah, no hangout now IMHO. Just wanted to find a date ...
[14:27] <willcooke> Sweet5hark, oki, I'll leave it with you guys then
[14:27] <willcooke> and with that - the weekend starts ..........  here
[14:27] <willcooke> off Monday, see yall Tuesday
[14:27] <Sweet5hark> willcooke: aright -- have fun!
[14:27] <willcooke> dont touch my stuff
[14:28] <popey> hah
[14:28]  * Sweet5hark burns down the village.
[14:28] <Sweet5hark> Same procedure as every year.
[14:28] <popey> Oh, Tuesday is "Laugh at the Americans and their new President elect" day
[15:04] <Laney> attente: I forgot where that comes from... u-s-d?
[15:05] <attente> Laney: yeah, u-s-d is looking for AppMenuRegistrar on the bus
[15:06] <attente> don't know if it's some kind of race or what
[15:07] <attente> but i didn't really look that deep into it yet
[15:07] <Laney> k
[15:20] <xnox> popey, i have faith in humanity. As a back plan i live near a deep underground station that can be used as nuclear shelter.
[15:20] <xnox> off to get a box of tuna over the weekend.
[15:21] <popey> :D
[15:50] <flexiondotorg> Laney, Unforeseen problem at home. I'm going to finish here today and do some work over the weekend to catch up.
[15:51] <Laney> flexiondotorg: Mmk, no worries
[15:51] <Laney> you can give me a link to the the aptdaemon etc on Monday
[15:57] <tsdgeos> do you guys know who creates the /usr/share/icons/default/index.theme symlink in a default installation?
[15:57] <tsdgeos> i.e. it doesn't come from any .deb file, does it?
[16:00] <Laney> tsdgeos: The package sets it up using the alternate system
[16:07] <xnox> just imagine; 2020; whilst one seeks re-election, the other seeks revenge. Hillary vs Trump round #2
[16:14] <tsdgeos> Laney: which package? i have a snap that is installing dmz-cursor-theme and has no such symlink. do you know anything about snaps? maybe snaps "intsall" deb files in a different way?
[16:16] <Laney> tsdgeos: The package it refers to, which by default is dmz-cursor-theme
[16:16] <Laney> It's done in the postinst, maybe that doesn't work somehow when building the snap
[16:16] <tsdgeos> yeah
[16:16] <tsdgeos> ok, tx
[16:24] <sarnold> xnox: y u do mean things?
[16:57] <Laney> attente: I had a brainwave
[16:58] <Laney> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/290846720/lightdm_1.19.5-0ubuntu1_1.20.0-0ubuntu2.diff.gz
[16:58] <Laney> -eval `dbus-launch --sh-syntax`
[16:58] <Laney> +[ -n "$DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS" ] || eval `dbus-launch --sh-syntax`
[16:58] <Laney> so the greeter is now on the same bus as the session
[16:58] <Laney> explains why there's already an xsettings manager
[16:58] <Laney> sort of
[17:03] <Laney> actually I don't understand why, but it seems to be that anyway
[17:03] <Laney> :)
[17:11] <Laney> it looks like this makes the lightdm session not be closed
[17:11] <Laney> so its usd stays alive
[17:12] <Laney> or something
[17:12] <Laney> ._.
[17:12] <attente> i guess that explains why gtk doesn't get display scaling changes either
[17:14] <Laney> maybe
[17:14] <Laney> don't know offhand how to fix this
[17:19] <attente> me neither
[17:54] <Trevinho> Laney: something else to ACK if you're still here :)
[17:54] <Trevinho> https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2081
[17:58] <Laney> Trevinho: ok
[17:58] <Laney> uploading unity8, fancy
[17:58] <Trevinho> Laney: :-)
[17:59] <Trevinho> Laney: there's also https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2134 if you want, since it's blocking lots of stuff
[17:59] <Trevinho> Laney: see #ubuntu-ci-eng
[17:59] <mitya57> Trevinho, hi, will you mind if I upload new metacity & rebuild compiz against it?
[17:59] <mitya57> Or do you want the current compiz upload to migrate first?
[18:00] <Trevinho> mitya57: if compiz needs a rebuild, please do it by submitting a MP so that we do it with CI-itrain... Or, notify me once done so that I can sync downstream and upstream
[18:01] <mitya57> OK, I can do it via CI-train.
[18:01] <Trevinho> mitya57: better, thanks...
[18:01] <Laney> Trevinho: sorry, no time, but mitya57 can maybe click it for you
[18:01] <Laney> got to go now, going away for the weekend
[18:01] <Laney> o/
[18:01] <Trevinho> Laney: ok, no problem... enjoy your weekend
[18:01] <mitya57> haha
[18:01] <Trevinho> Laney: thanks
[18:01] <Trevinho> mitya57: so... yeah :-D
[18:02] <Trevinho> mitya57: this would need publication https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2134 as it's breaking xenail builds for u8 stack
[18:02] <Trevinho> that's only for the phone overlay ppa tho
[18:02] <mitya57> Trevinho, I should just publish it and ACK packaging, right?
[18:03] <Trevinho> mitya57: yeah, if you believe so :-)
[18:06] <mitya57> Trevinho, done
[18:06] <Trevinho> mitya57: thanks :-)
[18:06] <dobey> great
[18:06] <mitya57> You are welcome
[18:16] <seb128> Trevinho, Laney, desktopers, have a good w.e!
[18:17] <Trevinho> seb128: you too!


[11:38] <otubo> rick_h: I couldn't stay for the further discussions on the VMWare data source, the guestinfo. I just have two questions that you might know the answer: 1) Does it *replace* OVF? 2) Do you have plans to merge it on the main cloud-init tree?
[13:30] <otubo> Another general question: Do we have a release roadmap? I'm gonna start a new rebase for Fedora Rawhide (to be included on Fedora 34) so I just wanted to know if I should wait for a new release or not :-D
[16:38] <blackboxsw> otubo: I think the followup we had with AndrewK on vmware datasource is that he'd put a PR up for review shorlty. The goal is to get that landed and he wasn't certain how "soon" we could start moving off of OVF -> new vmware datasource because there are a lot of legacy platforms that may not be compatible with new VMwareDS.
[16:39] <blackboxsw> so I think it will be a long process, and goal is to eventually deprecate/drop the VMWare components withing OVF once new DatasourceVMWare if vetted on their support matrix
[16:45] <otubo> blackboxsw: awesome, thanks! :-)
[17:54] <Odd_Bloke> falcojr: Heads-up, I ran into an issue when writing my test locally: https://github.com/canonical/pycloudlib/issues/29
[19:37] <meena> something about this tox output strikes me as wrong: https://gist.github.com/479e8ec292c3bffc9bc304b41146bf40
[19:49] <Odd_Bloke> meena: `git pull --tags` will probably fix it.
[21:25] <Odd_Bloke> falcojr: I think we need to discuss SSH key management in the integration tests; currently the assumption is that ~/.ssh/id_rsa.pub is (a) the appropriate key to use, and (b) is registered in the cloud with the name "$(whoami)".  Neither of those hold true for me in EC2, and I'm sure I won't be the only person.
[21:25] <Odd_Bloke> (Sorry, you're getting a pre-EOD brain dump. :p)
[21:26] <Odd_Bloke> I started looking at hooking up configuration options for it, but that's verbose and annoying to manage (it really needs to have a per-cloud SSH key/name option).
[21:27] <Odd_Bloke> What I've done in the past is to have the test framework completely manage keys: it creates them locally, registers them with the cloud, then once the test is complete, removes them from the cloud, and deletes them locally.
[21:28] <Odd_Bloke> A middle ground would be to modify pycloudlib to not require a public key path, and to use SSH's normal key discovery if one is not specified.
[21:28] <Odd_Bloke> (I assume paramiko can do that.)
[23:16] <powersj> If memory serves we had to provide a key_filename to paramiko which is why it ended up that way.
[23:17] <powersj> but that could be wrong, as looking at https://docs.paramiko.org/en/stable/api/client.html real quick shows the order it attempts
[23:17] <powersj> which includes "Any “id_rsa”, “id_dsa” or “id_ecdsa” key discoverable in ~/.ssh/"


[15:59] <ogra> hey
[15:59] <seb128> hey
[16:00] <ogra> #startmeeting nexus7 status
[16:00] <meetingology> Meeting started Fri Feb  1 16:00:02 2013 UTC.  The chair is ogra. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[16:00] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[16:00] <ogra> so who is here ?
[16:00] <ogra> (sorry, i didnt manage to send an announcement  today)
[16:00]  * xnox is here in spirit.
[16:00] <ogra> spirit is good :)
[16:01] <ogra> so ... seems the distro sprint for n7 work this week was quite a success
[16:01] <ogra> thanks to seb128 :)
[16:01] <ogra> i personally see the ram usage on an idle desktop being cut in half on my install (using htop)
[16:02] <seb128> thanks to everyone rather, good team work ;-)
[16:02] <ogra> battery status was fixed (thanks gema) and the device doesnt randomly shut down anymore
[16:02] <seb128> rotation and bluetooth working!
[16:02] <ogra> yeah
[16:02] <ogra> and it seems that TheMuso has an idea how to get sound working without suspend cycle
[16:03] <ogra> i personally palyed a bit with gps ... i can gpsd to connect and init the device but sadly thats it
[16:03] <ogra> (suspecting we need some firmware here)
[16:03] <ogra> oh, and i worked massively on the interactive cpufreq scheduler
[16:03] <ogra> the load used to be above 1 all time ... this was fixed this week
[16:04] <ogra> our worst bug wasnt fixed yet though
[16:04] <ogra> bug 1068994
[16:04] <ogra> ignoring that obstacle i think we made some leap jump this week in nexus7 support :)
[16:05] <ogra> and work seems to be going on :)
[16:05]  * ogra has not much to add, anyone else ?
[16:05] <seb128> yeah, let's keep going this way now that we are started ;-)
[16:06] <ogra> ++
[16:06] <ogra> feels like everyone in the distro team actually actively uses the nexus now
[16:06] <seb128> we had quite some valgrind/leak fix actions from some people this week (thanks cjwatson especially ;-)
[16:06] <seb128> still quite some of those to do if anyone feels like working on that
[16:06] <seb128> if you do and need some guidance feel free to ask on #ubuntu-devel or to ping me directly
[16:07] <cjwatson> ogra: cut in *half*?  wow, that's considerably better than I expected
[16:07] <ogra> davmor2 gave a nice hint to statgrab too
[16:07] <seb128> I'm a bit surprised by the half as well
[16:07] <cjwatson> I thought we'd managed maybe 10%
[16:07] <ogra> cjwatson, overall the desktop used to take above 600M for me when idling, i'm at 357M now
[16:07] <seb128> we didn't did really big improvement
[16:08] <seb128> out of lightdm which cut 25M by not putting the whole process in locked memory
[16:08] <cjwatson> hm, yes, 400 or so for me
[16:08] <ogra> (currently with xchat and ff with 6 busy tabs open htop shows 570)
[16:08] <cjwatson> (that said I have swap)
[16:08] <ogra> filled ?
[16:08] <cjwatson> 130M used
[16:08] <ogra> i have 17M in use
[16:09] <ogra> intresting
[16:09] <ogra> oh, big thanks to Laney for uploading maliit
[16:09]  * ogra cant wait to see it coming out of NEW
[16:09] <seb128> that as well indeed
[16:09] <seb128> you can get in laney's ppa if you want to try
[16:10] <ogra> there is hope it doesnt eat the 30M that onboard takes
[16:10] <seb128> I will try to NEW review it today or monday if I fail getting to it today
[16:10] <cjwatson> Do you think we've hit the second memory target on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Nexus7/raring-targets ?
[16:10] <ogra> why is instant on striked out there ?
[16:11] <ogra> resume is pretty instant here
[16:11] <cjwatson> it links to an open bug
[16:11] <cjwatson> which is actually more about slow suspend
[16:11] <ogra> yeah
[16:11] <ogra> well, i havent run a desktop with FF and TB running yet
[16:12] <ogra> not sure if that runs well within 1G
[16:12] <ogra> without TB i'm 100% positive we have hit that target
[16:12] <ogra> the desktop seems to have a spike hwen starting though
[16:13] <ogra> i dont see the 3-400M right after start, it spikes above that
[16:13] <ogra> there is probably still work to do
[16:13] <ogra> else i would have said we even have the 3rd marker
[16:14] <seb128> there are still quite some processes that run and could be not running
[16:14] <seb128> we will get another set of improvement when upstart for session lands
[16:14] <ogra> we're pretty close to the 3rd marker for battery life too i think
[16:14] <ogra> seb128, yeah, to me it looks more like there are processes started that then shut down after a while
[16:15] <seb128> ogra, that's orthogonal, but yeah we have a bit of run and exit on idle
[16:15] <seb128> e.g oneconf does that
[16:16] <ogra> right, but that keeps us bunmping above the 512M
[16:16] <ogra> even though it goes down again
[16:17] <cjwatson> ogra: Have we hit the first two battery markers?
[16:17] <ogra> we're at least close since the interactive governor behaves
[16:18] <ogra> i think there is still room for improvement (afaik android uses a userspace process to dynamically adjust the governor settings, i'll look into that)
[16:19] <ogra> X definitely keeps us above 1% though
[16:20] <ogra> (i hev never tested the standby battery life, i use my device to often for testing 150h)
[16:21] <ogra> oh, i forgot to mention, we have a default usbnet connection on the USB wire now ... additionally to the serial console
[16:22] <ogra> that was actually a change requested, tested and submitted from the community :)
[16:22] <ogra> heh
[16:22]  * ogra hasnt noticed "Play a youtube video of a cat" in the third marker before
[16:23] <ogra> anything else from anyone ?
[16:24] <seb128> not really
[16:24] <ogra> hmm, seems we'Re done then
[16:25] <seb128> I will try to send a summary email from things that got done this week to ubuntu-devel@
[16:25] <ogra> great !
[16:25] <seb128> just to share the good news
[16:25]  * ogra hugs seb128
[16:25]  * seb128 hugs ogra back
[16:25] <ogra> so lets close this then and enjoy the weekend :)
[16:25] <seb128> I will also try to set up a proper agenda for the meeting next week
[16:25] <ogra> going once ...
[16:25] <seb128> works for me
[16:25] <seb128> thanks ogra!
[16:25] <ogra> going twice
[16:25] <seb128> thanks everyone
[16:25] <ogra> done ...
[16:25] <ogra> #ednmeeting
[16:25] <ogra> #endmeeting
[16:25] <meetingology> Meeting ended Fri Feb  1 16:25:58 2013 UTC.
[16:25] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-02-01-16.00.moin.txt
[16:25] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-02-01-16.00.html
[16:26] <ogra> bah
[16:26] <ogra> thanks!
[18:04] <bobweaver> Hello all
[18:04] <mhall119> hello
[18:04] <CrestedNewt> YO!! Bobweaver
[18:04] <tgm4883> o/
[18:04] <mhall119> who wants to chair this meeting?
[18:04] <bobweaver> I do not
[18:04] <mhall119> CrestedNewt: you want to give it a go?
[18:04] <CrestedNewt> I'll give it a go - no idea's how though :D
[18:05] <CrestedNewt> #startmeeting
[18:05] <meetingology> Meeting started Fri Feb  1 18:05:06 2013 UTC.  The chair is CrestedNewt. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[18:05] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[18:05] <mhall119> CrestedNewt: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology has all the commands
[18:05] <mhall119> bobweaver: tgm4883: do you guys have specific topics?
[18:05] <tgm4883> nope
[18:05] <CrestedNewt> mhall119 - will check that in a inute
[18:05] <bobweaver> nothing to crazy
[18:05] <rewarp> I have a question about writing style guidelines. Non-programmer here.
[18:06] <bobweaver> mhall119,  ^^
[18:06] <CrestedNewt> OK, before we go there rewarp, lets just cover where we are
[18:06] <mhall119> ok, let's quickly give an update on the mythtv and front-end work, then we'll get to questions
[18:06] <CrestedNewt> bobweaver - what has been happening?
[18:06] <bobweaver> It is 100% pluged in
[18:06] <bobweaver> I just finshed guide
[18:06] <mhall119> CrestedNewt: #topic Front-end updates
[18:07] <CrestedNewt> #topic Front-end updates
[18:07] <CrestedNewt> thx :D
[18:07] <bobweaver> that holds real data that one can use and preview what is in each thing
[18:07] <mhall119> np
[18:07] <bobweaver> if it is recording or also set up recording
[18:07] <mhall119> bobweaver: I had a question about the front-end you've been working on
[18:07] <bobweaver> this is just temp
[18:07] <mhall119> you have settings for different layouts, icon-view, listview, coverflow
[18:07] <mhall119> shouldn't those be declared by the Category in the Lens?
[18:08] <bobweaver> as I want to have all of the different things for tgm4883  scope for future
[18:08] <bobweaver> in the future all things myth will be controled by tgm4883  scope unless we need dire things
[18:08] <bobweaver> if that is ok with tgm
[18:08]  * tgm4883 nods
[18:09] <bobweaver> for knnow it querys the backend and reads the xml and renders to screen
[18:09] <bobweaver> it is like what mhall119  is talking about
[18:09] <mhall119> bobweaver: do you have a screenshot of the guide?
[18:09] <bobweaver> No
[18:09] <mhall119> ok
[18:09] <bobweaver> will not go public till 3 things on G+ go
[18:09] <bobweaver> that is one of them
[18:10] <mhall119> bobweaver: we got a design spec a while back, do you remember if it govers how the guide should look?
[18:10] <bobweaver> but pm me mhall119  and I will pass you example code
[18:10] <mhall119> ok
[18:10] <bobweaver> yeah
[18:10] <bobweaver> you question about frontend
[18:10] <bobweaver> mhall119,  ^^
[18:10] <bobweaver> Yes the lens can do that already
[18:10] <bobweaver> but the user can also do this
[18:11] <mhall119> ok, so it's a user override?
[18:11] <bobweaver> Like the user can set up in his lens that he is using Channel render
[18:11] <bobweaver> it is now living on dbus
[18:11] <bobweaver> in unity
[18:11] <bobweaver> well
[18:11] <bobweaver> unity2d
[18:11] <mhall119> ok
[18:11] <mhall119> any other front-end updates
[18:11] <mhall119> ?
[18:11] <bobweaver> I can not remeber what I called the glib
[18:12] <mhall119> I've seen you posting a lot of videos
[18:12] <bobweaver> yeah I have made david calle lens for
[18:12] <bobweaver> news and also for torrents stock and only call them when needed
[18:12] <bobweaver> this has cut down ram 1/2
[18:12] <CrestedNewt> bobweaver, so when you say that the user can change the lens, is that to remove channels that aren't wanted?
[18:13] <bobweaver> so lens are not listening all the time unless it i needed but that is all going to change in about 3 or 5 weeks
[18:13] <mhall119> bobweaver: you might be interested in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SmartScopes1304Spec as well
[18:13] <bobweaver> mhall119,  yeah I looked at that
[18:13] <mhall119> which is going to keep scope processes from running all the time
[18:13] <bobweaver> CrestedNewt,  the "catagory let me take screenshot "
[18:14] <CrestedNewt> ok
[18:14] <mhall119> the good news is that the Dash "Home" will now be an actual scope, not hard-coded into the Dash
[18:15] <bobweaver> http://imagebin.org/245076
[18:15] <bobweaver> I have also cleaned up the code massivly
[18:15] <bobweaver> and made a who;e new framework for qt5
[18:15] <bobweaver> whole *
[18:15] <bobweaver> any more things on front end for me ?
[18:15] <mhall119> a framework for what?
[18:16] <bobweaver> Phone
[18:16] <CrestedNewt> bobweaver - superb looking!
[18:16] <mhall119> I don't follow
[18:16] <bobweaver> like removing all the c++ stuff for backend
[18:16] <bobweaver> for a explaintion of that size we are going to have to do G+
[18:16] <bobweaver> sorry google hangout
[18:16] <bobweaver> next time
[18:16] <mhall119> ok, another time
[18:17] <CrestedNewt> ok - so we need to sort out a G hangout at some stage
[18:17] <mhall119> shall we move on to MyTV updates?
[18:17] <bobweaver> mhall119,  feel free to ping me after thi and we can do a hangout if you like
[18:17] <mhall119> bobweaver: ok
[18:17] <bobweaver> sounds good
[18:17] <CrestedNewt> #topic MyTV updates
[18:18] <CrestedNewt> OK where are we?
[18:18] <mhall119> tgm4883: I saw you posted a video of it in action, thanks for that
[18:18] <bobweaver> tgm4883,  and I have been talking about his awesome scope
[18:18] <tgm4883> it's being packaged
[18:19] <bobweaver> I am pacakging his old on <12.04
[18:19] <tgm4883> I'm running into issues today with it not starting for some reason
[18:19] <bobweaver> the one that I use on my TV
[18:19] <mhall119> tgm4883: I saw that your Dee bug is being worked on
[18:20] <tgm4883> yep
[18:20] <mhall119> hopefully that will be in 12.04's backports soon
[18:21] <bobweaver> anything else ?
[18:21] <mhall119> bobweaver: once that's packaged, are you going to put it in the PPA with the packages you made for the ubuntu-fr team?
[18:21] <bobweaver> nope u2t
[18:21] <bobweaver> which is when that goes stable
[18:21] <mhall119> are there unity2d TV packages in there?
[18:22] <bobweaver> yeah it is all one big metapackae
[18:22] <bobweaver> package
[18:22] <mhall119> and what versions of Ubuntu does it support?
[18:22] <bobweaver> 12.04
[18:22] <mhall119> ok
[18:22] <CrestedNewt> superb - LTS is good
[18:22] <bobweaver> And I am not moving from that at all
[18:22] <mhall119> why not?
[18:22] <bobweaver> but if someone else wants to....
[18:23] <bobweaver> because I am going to use Phone
[18:23] <bobweaver> and because I love qml
[18:23] <mhall119> for >12.04?
[18:23] <bobweaver> we will see mhall119
[18:23] <bobweaver> that all depends on future
[18:24] <mhall119> is there anything technical that would stop us from making those packages available on 12.10 or 13.04?
[18:24] <CrestedNewt> bobweaver, so you are going to use the Phone OS for TV?
[18:24] <mhall119> CrestedNewt: the shell parts of the Phone are in QML
[18:24] <bobweaver> for now because there is no unity 2d on >12.04 I am not going to move it up because I can not do all the cool things that I can do in qml qith Nux this is because this is just me
[18:24] <tgm4883> I still need someone to explain to me why previews from 12.10 don't work in Ubuntu TV
[18:24] <bobweaver> CrestedNewt, I will be using what Is in front of me but yes it will run on the phone
[18:25] <CrestedNewt> mhall119 - thx for that
[18:25] <bobweaver> sure tgm4883
[18:25] <mhall119> tgm4883: because the Previews API was never implemented in Unity 2d
[18:25] <bobweaver> the way that I have coded the previews for unity 2d it just reads from the lens
[18:25] <bobweaver> there is no catagorys to add to them
[18:26] <bobweaver> though I could make them
[18:26] <bobweaver> but that is a waste of my time as 1) I have something that is awesome
[18:26] <mhall119> bobweaver: you've implemented the Previews API?
[18:26] <bobweaver> 2)  I want to make Phone and it togeather
[18:26] <bobweaver> mhall119,  yes
[18:26] <mhall119> ok
[18:26] <bobweaver> there are now previews in Ubuntu TV
[18:26] <mhall119> cool
[18:27] <bobweaver> for almost everything
[18:27] <mhall119> for any scope that provides it?
[18:27] <bobweaver> yeah just reads things like uri
[18:27] <bobweaver> cat mimeType
[18:27] <bobweaver> ect
[18:27] <bobweaver> anything that one is passing to unity in lens/scope
[18:28] <mhall119> bobweaver: in 12.10 there was a new API introduced to provide more data for Previews
[18:28] <mhall119> http://developer.ubuntu.com/api/ubuntu-12.10/python/Unity-6.0.html#Unity.Preview
[18:28] <mhall119> that's what I was asking about
[18:28] <bobweaver> not that far yet
[18:28] <mhall119> ok
[18:28] <bobweaver> I do not want to hack that deep ^^ which should also anwser tgm4883  question
[18:28] <bobweaver> until we get phone
[18:28] <mhall119> ok
[18:29] <bobweaver> then what ever that is using to talk to Unity I will be using that
[18:29] <mhall119> makes sense
[18:29] <bobweaver> which I am sure all that is going to be AWESOME !
[18:29] <mhall119> well we're half way through our hour, should we move on to Q&A?
[18:29] <CrestedNewt> OK
[18:29] <bobweaver> good call
[18:29] <CrestedNewt> #topic Q&A
[18:30] <mhall119> rewarp: you had a question?
[18:30] <rewarp> Yes.
[18:30] <rewarp> I did some corrections for the spellingcheck branch.
[18:30] <rewarp> And I was wondering whether there were any official writing guidelines I could base my edits on.
[18:31] <rewarp> I edited the document based upon my academic training, so it may not be suitable for a UI.
[18:31] <mhall119> not that I know of
[18:31] <bobweaver> which is awesome btw rewarp  and I approved your branch for merged
[18:32] <rewarp> Thanks. I did some Googling and found this guideline on lp: https://dev.launchpad.net/UserInterfaceWording
[18:32] <rewarp> And Canonical's styleguide: https://dev.launchpad.net/UserInterfaceWording/CanonicalStyleGuide
[18:32] <tgm4883> omg, i don't want your stupid landline service comcast, leave me alone!
[18:32] <mhall119> I didn't even know we had that
[18:32] <mhall119> tgm4883: ?
[18:32] <bobweaver> lol
[18:32] <bobweaver> tellie
[18:32] <CrestedNewt> lol is right :D
[18:32] <tgm4883> people calling me
[18:33] <tgm4883> bah
[18:33] <CrestedNewt> ok - lets get back on track
[18:33] <bobweaver> good call ^^
[18:33] <tgm4883> it's like, I know more about your service than you do. leave me alone
[18:33] <tgm4883> ok
[18:33] <mhall119> so, bobweaver, do you have any guidelines or anything you think should be followed for the UI text?
[18:33] <mhall119> or just anything that looks and sounds good
[18:34] <bobweaver> Well I am the worse person to do spell chacking
[18:34] <rewarp> There is this line in the lp guidelines: Buttons should be Headline Case; the last word capitalized, and all other words capitalized except those three letters or fewer that are prepositions, articles, or conjunctions.
[18:34] <bobweaver> I told him about what the things like \t and \n do and He understood it real well
[18:34] <CrestedNewt> bobweaver, do I understand that rewarp is helping take some of the strain away from you?
[18:34] <mhall119> rewarp: it seems you're move of an expert on this than the rest of us, so I think we'll follow your lead here
[18:35] <bobweaver> correct and he is doing a great job
[18:35] <bobweaver> CrestedNewt,  ^^
[18:35] <CrestedNewt> GJ rewarp!
[18:35] <mhall119> thanks for your contributions rewarp, they are very much appreciated
[18:35] <rewarp> Thanks. And you are welcome.
[18:35] <bobweaver> rewarp,  how about this
[18:35] <rewarp> I have always wanted to contribute something back to the project.
[18:35] <bobweaver> you set the rules for now
[18:35] <CrestedNewt> Are there any other area's that you can help bobweaver with?
[18:35] <bobweaver> and if we get yelled at we will change
[18:36] <rewarp> I am not sure. Not much programming experience.
[18:36] <bobweaver> CrestedNewt,  I put a thing up on g+ looking for help and there are now 2 people
[18:37] <mhall119> \o/
[18:37] <bobweaver> which is also right you all should join the temp team that I made for this
[18:37] <CrestedNewt> YIPEE!!
[18:37] <bobweaver> rewarp,  apply to join lp~u2t
[18:37] <CrestedNewt> superb bobweaver - do you have a framework setup for who is doing what?
[18:37] <rewarp> Okay bobweaver.
[18:38] <bobweaver> CrestedNewt,  not yet I have some blue prints and also bugs
[18:38] <bobweaver> that is what I am hoping will happen more but I am not good at stuff like that
[18:38] <CrestedNewt> OK but there is a starting point - will PM you later
[18:38] <bobweaver> would be cool if we could find a different person that can tell people what to do
[18:39] <bobweaver> "when you dont ask you dont expect "
[18:39] <bobweaver> :P
[18:39] <mhall119> a project manager of sorts?
[18:39] <bobweaver> correct
[18:39] <CrestedNewt> Well if I knew more I would be happy to oblige
[18:39] <tgm4883> I'll tell people what to do
[18:39] <bobweaver> we should add that to do
[18:39] <bobweaver> ok
[18:39] <bobweaver> I have a idea
[18:40] <mhall119> CrestedNewt: can you #topic General Discussion
[18:40] <CrestedNewt> #topic General Discussion
[18:40] <mhall119> thanks
[18:40] <bobweaver> we have 20 min left after this we can do google hangout and I will tell you all what I need or am doing if you like
[18:40] <mhall119> bobweaver: I won't be available for a hangout right away
[18:40] <CrestedNewt> would love to but for me it will be short as it is dinner time here
[18:40] <mhall119> or maybe not at all today....depending on my other work
[18:41] <mhall119> bobweaver: tgm4883: Can you guys go through the work items on https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/community-r-tv-development and update them?
[18:41] <mhall119> bobweaver: I know most of yours are blocked until the phone shell is released
[18:41] <bobweaver> mhall119,  I would like to keep all the stuff on u2t
[18:41] <bobweaver> let me get thouse links
[18:41] <bobweaver> untill phone that is &^^&
[18:42] <bobweaver> Daily PPA for U2t (ubuntu tv proto)   https://launchpad.net/~u2t/+archive/bleedingedge
[18:42] <bobweaver> Team :  https://launchpad.net/~u2t
[18:42] <mhall119> bobweaver: that blueprint is being tracked as part of Raring's progress though, so we need to keep it up to date as well
[18:43] <bobweaver> Project page   https://launchpad.net/u2t
[18:43] <bobweaver> good point mhall119
[18:43] <bobweaver> Bugs:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/u2t
[18:43] <bobweaver> blue Prints : https://bugs.launchpad.net/u2t
[18:43] <CrestedNewt> OK, for TV to be taken seriously, as much as I hate saying this, the progress and documentation must be kept up to date
[18:44] <bobweaver> mhall119,  can we medge things and what not like say that this effects this also ?
[18:44] <CrestedNewt> I hate documentation like any IT person
[18:44] <bobweaver> CrestedNewt,  you are right about that
[18:44] <mhall119> bobweaver: in blueprints?
[18:44] <tgm4883> I disagree
[18:44] <bobweaver> mhall119,  yeah
[18:44] <mhall119> bobweaver: I don't know, it can do some dependency stuff, but I'm not real familiar with it
[18:44] <tgm4883> for TV to be taken seriously, we need to actually have something someone can use
[18:44] <CrestedNewt> that is also very true
[18:45] <bobweaver> how many of you have tried the daily in VM ?
[18:45] <CrestedNewt> I haven't
[18:45] <mhall119> not me, do you have a written guide for getting it setup that way?
[18:45] <bobweaver> I think that you should before you say that we have nothing that works
[18:45] <tgm4883> mhall119, where should I be defining this stuff
[18:46] <tgm4883> bobweaver, I'm pretty confident I didn't say that
[18:46] <bobweaver> sorry tgm4883  s|you|we
[18:46] <mhall119> tgm4883: defining which, a guide to getting it running in a VM?
[18:47] <tgm4883> mhall119, no, my blueprint stuff
[18:47] <tgm4883> Define what data needs to be passed between Scopes and Renderers
[18:47] <tgm4883> Define what lenses and scopes will be used
[18:47] <mhall119> tgm4883: at the bottom of https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/community-r-tv-development there is a "Work Items" section
[18:47] <tgm4883> mhall119, yes, I know
[18:47] <bobweaver> I think the hardest part is going to be getting people to set up there myth
[18:47] <tgm4883> what I mean is
[18:47] <mhall119> just change the bit at the end to "DONE, BLOCKED or INPROGRESS"
[18:48] <tgm4883> where should I define what data needs to be passed between scopes and renderers?
[18:48] <tgm4883> a wiki page?
[18:48] <tgm4883> in an email to bobweaver
[18:48] <tgm4883> etc?
[18:48] <mhall119> oh, that
[18:48] <mhall119> tgm4883: yeah, a wiki page would be good
[18:49] <mhall119> tgm4883: you can make a sub-page on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuTV
[18:49] <bobweaver> something that we should think about docs for what kinda capture cards are cheap and also work with kernel OFB and
[18:49] <bobweaver> Like a recomended stuff like that
[18:49] <tgm4883> OFB?
[18:49] <bobweaver> out of box
[18:50] <tgm4883> OOB
[18:50] <CrestedNewt> minimum spec requirements should do, or not?
[18:50] <mhall119> can people test capture cards running this from a VM?
[18:50] <mhall119> or would it have to be installed natively
[18:50] <tgm4883> mhall119, some
[18:50] <tgm4883> mhall119, depends on the VM software
[18:50] <mhall119> maybe we can make a table on the wiki where people can fill in their experience with different cards
[18:51] <CrestedNewt> thats a superb idea !
[18:51] <tgm4883> mhall119, there are only 2 types of cards that we should worry about
[18:51] <tgm4883> DVB, and HDHomerun
[18:51] <tgm4883> inside of DVB, good luck making recommendations that work around the world
[18:52] <tgm4883> I say we pick a few recommended cards in a few major markets and stick with that
[18:52] <bobweaver> tgm4883,  me or you can make video about installing or should we target usb ones .
[18:52] <tgm4883> or just point people at the mythtv wiki and/or linux tv wiki
[18:52] <bobweaver> pci or usb
[18:52] <tgm4883> ethernet?
[18:52] <CrestedNewt> tgm4883 - there may be others as well.... There are so many different formats out there that need to be tested in each region/country
[18:52] <tgm4883> CrestedNewt, no, DVB or HDHomerun
[18:53] <tgm4883> DVB has subtypes (eg. DVB-C, DVB-S, DVB-T)
[18:53] <CrestedNewt> tgm4883 - ok
[18:53] <tgm4883> but the two major types of cards are DVB and HDHomerun
[18:53] <tgm4883> I have stats to back that up
[18:53] <bobweaver> tgm4883,  can you talk more about that ^^
[18:53] <bobweaver> like hdhomerun
[18:53] <tgm4883> more about what part?
[18:53] <mhall119> I'm +1 for referring to upstream wikis if they already have that info and it's accurate for UbuntuTV
[18:54] <tgm4883> mhall119, nothing is accurate for Ubuntu TV, it needs to be accurate to Ubuntu + MythTV
[18:54] <bobweaver> I can google after this but I know you know a bunch of good stuff
[18:54] <tgm4883> yes I do :)
[18:54] <bobweaver> :/
[18:54] <tgm4883> we're running out of time here though
[18:54] <bobweaver> like why thous 2
[18:55] <tgm4883> bobweaver, those two types cover ~85% of the market
[18:55] <CrestedNewt> tgm4883 - lol - we have 5 mins so lets wrap this up or move to #ubuntu-tv and finnish there
[18:55] <mhall119> ok, so tgm4883 are you going ot start a new wiki page for hardware compatibility?
[18:55] <mhall119> and also one for the guide data model?
[18:55] <bobweaver> tgm4883,  that is the perfect reason !!
[18:55] <tgm4883> mhall119, I did, it's at http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Category:Hardware
[18:55] <bobweaver> thanks n
[18:56] <mhall119> tgm4883: ok
[18:56] <tgm4883> mhall119, I mean, it might be better for us to have a custom google search of the mythtv wiki on one of our pages
[18:56] <tgm4883> but yea, the world is big so people are just going to have to look if they don't live in a major market
[18:57] <CrestedNewt> OK, so we are decided on just these 2 types of card. We need to wrap this up now in reality
[18:57] <tgm4883> I can make recommendations on USA and Canada, and maybe the UK
[18:57] <tgm4883> but outside of those countries, it's "find a card for whatever standard you have and see if it is supported"
[18:58] <bobweaver> tgm4883,  maybe we can do a hangout and we can explain all this
[18:58] <mhall119> alright, anything else we need to discuss before ending the meeting?
[18:58] <tgm4883> really, we should just pick a card for each type HDHomerun, HDHomerun-CC, DVB-S, DVB-SII, DVB-T, DVB-T
[18:58] <CrestedNewt> OK ladies and gents, lets end this meeting here and move to more details in the tv channel
[18:59] <tgm4883> ok
[18:59] <bobweaver> later in the week that is tgm4883
[18:59] <bobweaver> cool
[18:59] <rewarp> Ok. Thanks everyone.
[18:59] <mhall119> CrestedNewt: thanks for chairing it
[18:59] <CrestedNewt> been productive guys
[18:59] <tgm4883> mhall119, I'm going to bug you about some scope stuff probably
[18:59] <CrestedNewt> mhall119 no probslems
[18:59] <tgm4883> after I look into this a bit more
[18:59] <CrestedNewt> #endmeeting
[18:59] <meetingology> Meeting ended Fri Feb  1 18:59:41 2013 UTC.
[18:59] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-02-01-18.05.moin.txt
[18:59] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-02-01-18.05.html
[18:59] <mhall119> tgm4883: sure, I'll try and get you some docs on the upcoming stuff
[19:00] <CrestedNewt> sry guys but I don't like over-runs :D
[19:00] <mhall119> CrestedNewt: perfect timing according to my clocks
[19:00] <CrestedNewt> I try :D


[01:06] <puff> Evening... finally got my disk imaged to a backup drive, going to try the next step in my journey of getting an external monitor to work on my t520 w/optimus running xubuntu 11.10.
[01:16] <trasp> Has anyone else noticed firefox behaving strange last couple of days/week?
[01:17] <trasp> Thinking if it's some update that's the reason
[01:17] <puff> Define "strange"....
[01:17] <puff> Firefox has been generally sucking for months, fo rme.
[01:17] <puff> unstable, crashy, thrashy.
[01:17] <puff> No marked differencein the past couple weeks.
[01:18] <trasp> Well, it doesn update the page and redirect on some javascript-calls and such things
[01:19] <trasp> (such thing = searching on google for example, have to make the change in the url manually or tometimes just update the page)
[01:19] <puff> Hm, haven't noticed that.
[01:20] <trasp> jquery behaves "strange" in such ways as well, pages that usually updates "live" doesn't update at all
[01:20] <puff> Then again, I kind of hate that auto-updating feature anyway, so it's likely my typing reflexes would carry me right past that.
[01:20] <puff> (on google searches, that is)
[01:20] <trasp> Well, you would notice that you can't press "next" page
[01:21] <trasp> Everytime I just get a blank page except from the searchfield and buttons...
[01:21] <puff> Haven't seen that.
[01:21] <trasp> But since you haven't noticed it and no-one else has said anything the problem isn't local
[01:21] <trasp> is probably*
[01:22] <trasp> haven't made any changes except updates tho ;/
[01:23] <puff> Do you know offhnd how to purge a ppa?
[01:23] <puff> is it just removing it/commenting it out in apt.sources, or is more required?
[01:24] <trasp> Uhm.. when I've removed any source I've just commented it out, but I'm not that advanced
[01:25] <Zelouille> trasp, maybe try the safe mode (firefox -safe-mode) or another profile.
[01:25] <trasp> Zelouille: Will do, thanks
[01:26] <trasp> Same problem
[01:26] <trasp> Oh well
[01:27] <trasp> Anyone that favours any other browser?
[01:28] <trasp> Might as well install another one for now
[01:28] <trasp> Except from konquer I haven't used any other than firefox for years tho, so I'm not really updated
[01:29] <puff> So, I'm on 11.10. I've been avoiding upgrading because upgrading always breaks things (especially on thinkpads) but now I'm deliberating upgrading to 12.04.
[01:29] <puff> Rather than installing the nvida binary.
[01:29] <Zelouille> puff, sudo ppa-purge ppa:<name>
[01:29] <puff> Zelouille: Thanks.
[01:30] <puff> Hm, odd... okay, so the pages about the driver say it's there for 12.10/12.04, ut https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-x-swat/+archive/x-updates does not list it.
[01:30] <puff> I wonder if there's an nvidia ppa support channel :-).
[01:31] <puff> Zelouille: Hm, ppa-purge no found.  Did sudo apt-add-repository --remove, instead.
[01:32] <Zelouille> puff, you'll need to install it: sudo apt-get install ppa-purge
[01:32] <puff> Ah.
[01:32] <puff> Does ppa-purge do something different than apt-add-repository --remove?
[01:35] <Zelouille> trasp, Midori is really light. Works well with Xubuntu.
[01:35] <Zelouille> puff> i think, but i don't really know :p
[01:35] <trasp> :) Will try it, thanks again
[01:40] <Zelouille> puff, well, "ppa-purge" remove the packages from that repo. While "apt-add-repository --remove" only remove the repo.
[01:41] <puff> Zelouille: Ah.
[01:41] <puff> Zelouille: Hm, seems to say here that ppa-purge isn't reliable on 11.10..
[06:37] <XubTz> hello everyone
[06:38] <XubTz> does anybody know of any Network Manager bugs on 12.10???
[08:56] <ms__> hey guys! I'm on xubuntu12.04LTS (my english isn't very good yet) but,..... all thing is ok with my os but not this one....
[08:57] <ms__> I can't change my background, it's blue and I tried to change it with"xfmw4 --settings" and check in "apparence" but all them are working.
[08:58] <ms__> ooops, but all of them aren't working....
[08:58] <ms__> help, help....
[08:58] <TheSheep> ms__: perhaps xfdesktop is not running
[08:59] <TheSheep> ms__: try starting it
[08:59] <TheSheep> ms__: open a terminal and type 'xfdesktop'
[09:00] <ms__> TheSheep, eeeeeuh, it shows me "another desktop manager is running" I use "xfmw4"
[09:04] <ms__> TheSheep, are you there?
[09:05] <TheSheep> ms__: yes
[09:06] <TheSheep> ms__: try 'xfwm4 --replace'
[10:12] <popolon> re
[10:13] <popolon> Network icon appear and after I removed the unique share on the computer it disappear again :/
[10:21] <ms_> TheSheep, you told me to try"xfwm4 --replace", I've done, nothing. I'm now using "xfwm4"
[10:22] <ms_> TheSheep, I meant xfwm4 is already my window manager
[10:22] <TheSheep> ms_: and xfdesktop still refuses to start?
[10:22] <ms_> yes.
[10:25] <TheSheep> do you have nautilus running?
[10:26] <ms_> yes.
[10:27] <TheSheep> ms_: can you kill it and try with xfdesktop again?
[10:29] <ms_> TheSheep, (xfdesktop:11670): GdkPixbuf-CRITICAL **: gdk_pixbuf_composite: assertion `dest_y >= 0 && dest_y + dest_height <= dest->height' failed
[10:32] <ms_> it shows me that but, but, but, BUT, .............
[10:32] <ms_> THANK YOU.
[10:32] <ms_> :)
[10:35] <TheSheep> the problem is that nautilus also displays the desktop
[10:38] <ms_> ahhhh. ok. my computer is now alright. :)
[11:07] <Daro> Hi, im find information if here i can find help with my xubuntu, it is correct? :)
[11:08] <TheSheep> !hi | Daro
[11:11] <Daro> great, i have slow netbook (ASUS 1001PXD) and i look in xubuntu if i close any software (from "X") he dont terminate process i can see him in Task Manager how i can hange this?
[11:12] <TheSheep> Daro: that happens with all programs?
[11:13] <Daro> not for all for most
[11:14] <Daro> example gmusicbrowser.
[11:14] <TheSheep> I think that gmusicbrowser has an option to stay in memory when you press the close button
[11:14] <TheSheep> in the settings
[11:16] <Daro> ok nex is adobe flash player he runing is always even if you do not run during this session
[11:16] <Daro> sometimes I feel that it is still using the same session
[11:17] <TheSheep> I think that it starts with the web browser
[11:18] <Daro> even if you do not use it?
[11:23] <Daro> okay, for examle i can set any auto killer for this process?, or i try set the priority in task manager he writing if i dont have rights, okay i try using him from root and i can`t look my process
[11:25] <Daro> I noticed that in reality is a lot more than me these processes shows
[11:34] <daro> ok, my firefox crash, next example for not exit process is gnome keyring
[11:36] <daro> if all programs will be are really exit this computer working great yes im know "meybe this process will be needed in the future"  but it only works when you have a "good hardware"
[11:46] <daro> ok thanks for help, bye :)
[13:59] <xubuntu911> can xubuntu be install on usb drives?
[14:00] <TheSheep> yes
[14:00] <xubuntu911> thnks
[14:00] <TheSheep> !liveusb | xubuntu911
[14:01] <TheSheep> xubuntu911: the second link
[14:01] <xubuntu911> so first link is for what??
[14:02] <TheSheep> xubuntu911: as it says
[14:02] <xubuntu911> ok
[14:45] <Riley88> hey guys i just got my beta invite for steam is there away to get it without having to do the work around im on xubuntu 12.10
[14:46] <holstein> Riley88: should have directions.. what does it say? its only for 12.04?
[14:47] <Riley88> not sure its wanting me to log in to the website
[14:47] <GridCube> Riley88, the mail indicates a forum, the first topic on that forum explains how to install steam
[14:48] <GridCube> no hacks neededs, you just need to download a small .deb file that then downloads about 350MiB from the internets
[14:48] <Riley88> freakin captas i swear lol
[14:52] <Riley88> wtf this capta is retarded
[14:53] <GridCube> !language | Riley88
[15:04] <Riley88> well the capta finnally worked but i still cant fine the deb package
[15:05] <holstein> Riley88: is there a contact method? we dont have access to anything steam related
[15:06] <Riley88> actually i got it its pretty far down the page lol
[15:09] <GridCube> Riley88, second post on the forum: Getting Started: https://steamcommunity.com/app/221410/discussions/1/882965118609963322/
[18:25] <nantou> does the last kernel upgrade fix the utpomatically mount external HD?
[18:25] <nantou> bug?
[18:54] <GridCube> !ee
[20:11] <xubuntu842> hello
[20:13] <xubuntu842> iam building a htpc atm based on a asrock m75 with an a4 3400
[20:14] <xubuntu842> and iam interestet in using xubuntu on it. how is the support for the grphic in the a4?
[21:50] <rams> incredible how other linuxes force me to use xubuntu :)
[22:28] <nantou> lol


  :D
[10:10] <shipcode> !bot uname -a
[10:10] <butiki> shipcode: Error: "bot" is not a valid command.
[10:10] <jar2xbinx> FreeBSD shellmix.com 8.2-RELEASE FreeBSD 8.2-RELEASE #0: Sun Apr  3 05:44:29 UTC 2011     spaj@:/usr/src/sys/amd64/compile/jajo  amd64
[10:11] <shipcode> kanino ba yan
[10:11] <shipcode> wag nman kau gnyan tol
[10:12] <shipcode> wag nyo nman iname sa name ko yung mga irc nicks
[10:12] <shipcode> its nt funny
[10:12] <shipcode> abuso ito ah
 ano ung jjturlahacker? :D > opo
[10:12] <shipcode> abuso yan
[10:12] <shipcode> kanino ba yan
[10:12] <shipcode> ni name nila sa name ko sa fb
[10:12] <shipcode> d nakakatuwa
[10:13] <shipcode> nka shellmix oa
[10:14] <shipcode> kanino kaya yan
[10:15] <shipcode> grabe nman sila
[10:20] <epal> aw idk, sorry
[10:23] <shipcode> oo
[10:24] <shipcode> sino kaya gumawa nyan
[10:24] <shipcode> just bco im from rootcon i nag make fun na sya sa akin
[10:24] <shipcode> ewan ko ba sino nag spread pa join nyan d2
[10:24] <shipcode> its nt funny
[10:33] <shipcode> nka shellmix eh
[11:42] <compromised> !ping
[11:42] <butiki> pong
[11:43] <compromised> O_O
[11:44] <compromised> What's with the hacker clone nicks?
[11:52] <shipcode> dunno
[11:52] <shipcode> who did that
[11:52] <shipcode> damn
[11:52] <shipcode> its kinda insulting
[11:52] <shipcode> its hosted on shellmix
[11:53] <shipcode> that's my nick in fb
[11:53] <shipcode> jjturla
[11:57] <shipcode> wtf someone hacked my shellmix.com
[12:00] <shipcode> ohw now I know
[12:00] <shipcode> someone
[12:01] <shipcode> accessed my bot by using my nick
[12:01] <shipcode> then
[12:01] <shipcode> he made a directory
[12:01] <shipcode> there is no history in my shellmix
[12:01] <shipcode> lol
[12:01] <shipcode> someone
[12:01] <shipcode> did
[12:01] <shipcode> it was not hacked
[12:03] <compromised> eh?
[12:03] <compromised> anu yun?
[12:03] <shipcode> ah ginamit nya lang nick ko
[12:03] <shipcode> kasi yung bot ko
[12:03] <shipcode> nag oobey sa admin nya na nick
[12:03] <shipcode> eh nag chnage nick lang
[12:03] <shipcode> ang isang user dito
[12:03] <shipcode> kaya may ganun
[12:04] <shipcode> ginamit nya yun tapos ni run bot ko
[12:04] <shipcode> lol
[12:04] <compromised> o_O
[12:05] <shipcode> hehe
[12:05] <shipcode> lol
[12:05] <shipcode> no harm done eh
[12:16] <shipcode> takte nman
[12:16] <shipcode> kung sino gumamit sa nick ko
[12:16] <shipcode> kasi pag i cntrl nya bot ko pwede syang mag gawa ng file
[12:16] <shipcode> lol
[12:23] <shipcode> scryptzoid mkdir shipcode_was_here
[12:23] <scryptzoid> mkdir: shipcode_was_here: Permission denied
[12:25] <shipcode> scryptzoid @join #scryptzoid
[12:27] <shipcode> !bht @part #ubuntu-ph
[12:27] <butiki> shipcode: Error: "bht" is not a valid command.
[13:01] <compromised> anyone using irssi right now?
[13:11] <Moflux88> :D
[13:11] <shipcode> me
[13:11] <shipcode> lol
[13:11] <shipcode> sup green
[13:24]  * Craw^ mano kay Shipcode and Moflux88
[13:42] <Moflux88> mabuhay !!!!
[15:21] <Moflux88> tao po!
[15:39] <Craw^> *ubo*
[15:58] <Moflux88> lol
[16:14] <Craw^> Yung CD-R King ba may HDDs and video cards?
[16:39] <Moflux88> may wheels k naman ata sir, alabang k n lng...sure k p ;)
[16:40] <Moflux88> try mo PC Madness, festival mall alabang sir


[16:53] <Tehdastehdas> 20.04.1 nags "Mouse battery below 10%" every time my mouse wakes up from hibernation. It hibernates after ~2 minutes of inactivity, so I get ~40 notifications/day, most annoyingly when watching a movie and setting a cup on the table, waking the mouse. The battery has ~2 months of juice left. These minor issue notifications should be limited to a maximum frequency of 1/login + ~1/day. How to do that?
[16:54] <Tehdastehdas> People have complained about this since at least 17.10:
[16:54] <Tehdastehdas> https://askubuntu.com/questions/1071406/how-to-disable-mouse-battery-low-notification-in-ubuntu-18-04
[16:54] <Tehdastehdas> https://askubuntu.com/questions/985963/disable-mouse-battery-low-spam-notification
[16:55] <Tehdastehdas> I'm new here. Where am I supposed to report issues?
[17:40] <fossfreedom> Tehdastehdas: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs
[17:41] <balloons> launchpad, if it doesn't already exist. you can use `ubuntu-bug` to file