[09:04] <Tm_T> artnay: FINALLY! (yeah, code might be ugly but it works here!) http://kapsi.fi/~tm_travolta/kuvat/temp/kedubuntu-basic-03.svg
[09:07] <klepas> Tm_T: looks clean and sharp (the image, heven't peaked at the xml) :)
[09:13] <Tm_T> so it works, good
[09:14] <Tm_T> earlier I had problem with xml
[09:14] <Tm_T> now save as plain svg, read, modify, save as plain svg, read, modify back fixed the problem :p
[09:16] <klepas> cool
[02:35] <artnay> hey guys
[02:35] <artnay> damn, I missed the meeting :(
[02:36] <artnay> I've had some serious problems with all my computers (like not getting further from BIOS)
[02:36] <artnay> one lost VGA signal etc.
[02:36] <klepas> hey artnay !
[02:36] <artnay> and they are all broken at the moment
[02:36] <artnay> hey klepas
[02:36] <artnay> how was the meeting?
[02:36] <klepas> hey man, been a while now
[02:36] <klepas> i didn't know about it
[02:36] <klepas> just sort of was on at the right time
[02:37] <artnay> so did you have it?
[02:37] <klepas> not much happened
[02:37] <klepas> yea
[02:37] <artnay> great
[02:37] <artnay> well that doesn't surprise me
[02:37] <artnay> at least henrik was present, that's good. I've wanted to chat with him for a while now
[02:38] <artnay> I really need to get some new HW so that all computers would be functional
[02:39] <artnay> klepas: so school started, eh?
[02:39] <artnay> how was LCA?
[02:39] <klepas> no
[02:39] <klepas> that is monday
[02:39] <klepas> artnay: LCA was the most fun i've had for a very, very long time
[02:39] <klepas> check my blog man :)
[02:39] <artnay> what about andy's icon set?
[02:40] <artnay> do we something to play with?
[02:41] <artnay> *insert have*
[02:42] <klepas> andy is working on something as a sort of shot-off of tango
[02:42] <klepas> canonical will hire more graphic artists
[02:42] <klepas> especially one to do a set
[02:42] <klepas> and our influence on what goes into mainstream won't change
[02:43] <klepas> that doesn't mean some of our wallpapers or splashes might not make it into dapper or future releases
[02:43] <klepas> they just need to be very good
[02:44] <klepas> as for artwork in general we are encouraged to make and maintain art packages
[02:44] <klepas> if they are good and popular enough entire packages might be included in mainstream
[02:44] <klepas> that's the jist of it pretty much
[02:44] <artnay> oh, really? I was told that there was plans to hire experts but nothing happened with it
[02:45] <artnay> so dapper+1 then
[02:45] <artnay> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Evaluation/MetacityTheme
[02:46] <artnay> what's the main difference between cl2 and unity-no-red? if I recall correctly, unity does not waste that much space
[02:46] <artnay> but then, that goes against "the bigger the better when it comes to important functions" principle
[02:47] <artnay> at least I think that the current metacity theme has too big buttons
[02:47] <artnay> ...if you take account that X will not get configured correctly, you end up with terrible large metacity theme and low resolution :o
[02:50] <klepas> i'm personally fond of a brown version of tango metacity
[02:50] <klepas> :)
[02:53] <artnay> the edge is terribly large by default
[02:53] <klepas> yea, true
[02:53] <klepas> but it could be fixed :)
[02:53] <klepas> btw, using gnome now
[02:53] <klepas> on ubuntu
[02:53] <artnay> sorry guys, I'm using vista at the moment (friend's computer) and its windeco (aero black) is pretty damn decent
[02:54] <artnay> much better than xp's luna
[02:54] <klepas> http://wombat.nuxified.com/files/mydesktop_06-02-03.jpg
[02:55] <artnay> I find this better than OS X's traffic lights. maybe because this one reflects much better when cursor goes over buttons
[02:55] <artnay> what, klepas using G? :P
[02:56] <klepas> artnay: read my blog... :P
[02:56] <klepas> reasons are covered there
[02:57] <artnay> ok
[02:57] <artnay> so how was the change?
[02:58] <klepas> i'm still somewhat going through it
[02:58] <klepas> lots of things in gnome that really shitting me
[02:58] <klepas> and kubuntu annoyed me even more
[02:59] <klepas> gnome it is for a while
[02:59] <artnay> so was there any word of schedule for andrew's icon set?
[03:00] <artnay> hmm
[03:00] <artnay> hopefully kubuntu will get more (financial and dev) focus after dapper
[03:02] <klepas> i probably ought to properly explain what andy wants to do
[03:02] <klepas> basically rather than make so many icon sets, each with a different colouration and such
[03:02] <klepas> because it really is a lot of work
[03:02] <klepas> he wants to make a sort of generic set
[03:02] <artnay> I know, he explained it to me some time ago
[03:02] <klepas> which can be altered really quickly
[03:02] <klepas> ah, good
[03:03] <artnay> sounds reasonable
[03:03] <klepas> he wants to integrate it into tango
[03:03] <klepas> yea
[03:03] <artnay> that way just adapt ubuntu's palette to it and voila
[03:03] <klepas> he didn't inform me of any timeframe
[03:03] <klepas> andy is a great guy btw
[03:03] <artnay> so let's assume that is not for dapper
[03:03] <klepas> no
[03:03] <klepas> definitely not
[03:03] <artnay> damn, I'm missing words every once in a while
[03:03] <klepas> canonical is hiring a graphic artists from scandinavia to do it
[03:04] <artnay> why scandinavia?
[03:04] <klepas> for dapper
[03:04] <klepas> no idea
[03:04] <jsgotangco> heh
[03:04] <klepas> i guess the guy just lives there that they had in mind
[03:04] <artnay> umh, they will have some really busy time
[03:04] <klepas> mark didn't hint on his name
[03:04] <jsgotangco> we can still make a difference with AUC
[03:04] <artnay> jsgotangco: we actually should make
[03:04] <klepas> well i don't really care if they want the art team to not really have any major influence on mainstream art
[03:04] <artnay> that's a necessity if you ask me :o
[03:05] <klepas> more work for them
[03:05] <klepas> and if they or their artists bugger up not my problem
[03:05] <artnay> me neither, I'd just like to see some proper plans
[03:05] <klepas> yea
[03:05] <klepas> i'm going to ask Jeff to re-inforce the fact that we really don't get to decide what goes into mainstream
[03:06] <artnay> hmm, damn NAT. it's giving me a headache with this ssh connection
[03:07] <jsgotangco> :/
[03:07] <artnay> hmm, I was told something really different by two canonical devs
[03:08] <artnay> so, yes, announce the facts and there will be misunderstandings
[03:08] <jsgotangco> 2 different things?
[03:08] <artnay> *NO*
[03:08] <artnay> as I said, I'm missing words here :)
[03:08] <klepas> jsgotangco: you're using gnome?
[03:08] <artnay> 2 different things, yeah. you could sum that up to one thing, there really are no proper plans to be announced :(
[03:09] <jsgotangco> yes
[03:09] <jsgotangco> (i can switch to kde if you need something)
[03:09] <klepas> ah, goodie
[03:09] <klepas> nah, i've just moved to gnome
[03:09] <jsgotangco> what's up?
[03:09] <klepas> i'm after a good gtk rss feed aggregator
[03:09] <klepas> wondering whether you could recommend some good ones :)
[03:09] <artnay> liferea is my bet
[03:10] <artnay> or thunderbird
[03:10] <jsgotangco> im using liferea
[03:10] <klepas> i dislike thunderbird
[03:10] <artnay> haven't really used GTK apps for some time
[03:10] <jsgotangco> i used to have blam but since since i found lifrea, i've stuck to it
[03:13] <klepas> alrighty, i'll give it a go
[03:14] <klepas> hey you two
[03:14] <klepas> my personal suggestion is we just let canonical do their stuff
[03:14] <klepas> and we'll fix this wiki so others who join the team aren't under the notion that they can directly get their work into mainstream
[03:15] <klepas> and they we can produce and manage some universe art packages
[03:15] <klepas> and do some work aside from that which might go into mainstream
[03:16] <jsgotangco> well yes i was thinking more of cultivating community so that they'll see what we can actually do
[03:17] <jsgotangco> packaging them won't be a problem
[03:20] <klepas> jsgotangco: i just cba fighting what canonical, mark and others think in regards to this
[03:20] <klepas> because it will mean distraction from what i want to work on
[03:20] <klepas> and senseless frustration
[03:22] <jsgotangco> too bad i didnt get the chance to discuss that much art stuff with mark when i had lunch with him last thursday :/
[03:23] <jsgotangco> we discussed more about docs
[03:23] <artnay> hmm
[03:24] <jsgotangco> i dont think art has its own repository even
[03:24] <jsgotangco> but that's only secondary
[03:24] <artnay> I agree that wiki should be fixed
[03:24] <artnay> but how? henrik made some big changes but I don't follow them
[03:25] <artnay> there was this wiki page for wiki structure proposal (thanks to mhz for that)
[03:26] <artnay> for example /Artwork should be renewed (there are dupe links) but now I have no idea how to set it up
[03:27] <klepas> yea
[03:27] <klepas> and it should be /ArtWork
[03:27] <klepas> for CamelCase purposes
[03:28] <artnay> no offense but I think that the renewal of /Artwork missed the point
[03:28] <artnay> I think news section is essential
[03:28] <klepas> yep
[03:28] <artnay> on the main page...
[03:28] <klepas> i won't have time to have a look at it
[03:28] <klepas> damn college begins monday
[03:29] <klepas> and i've got to get this damn system working how i like it before then
[03:29] <jsgotangco> what do you suggest on the wiki page i can help out with markup
[03:29] <Tm_T> artnay: moin
[03:31] <klepas> btw jsgotangco, liferea is really nice. cheers :)
[03:31] <artnay> well my suggestion was what I set up last time
[03:33] <jsgotangco> oh goodie
[03:33] <artnay> I see no point in official wiki page. that one should be combined with marketing team's web button page etc.
[03:33] <artnay> and separate all the logos under different /*buntuArtwork pages
[03:34] <artnay> and you could navigate to those /*buntuArtwork pages though /Artwork
[03:38] <artnay> and the general feedback page is kind of useless. it *should* receive so much comments that it would be hard to navigate it
[03:38] <artnay> my proposal was to have a wiki page for each project. one to contain dependencies, members, current state, issues etc.
[03:38] <artnay> and other one for wip artwork and comments
[03:39] <artnay> it would be easier to track the comments that have something to do with projects one is interested of
[03:39] <jsgotangco> UbuntuArtwork/KubuntuArtwork/etc?
[03:40] <artnay> jsgotangco: UbuntuArtwork, KubuntuArtwork, EdubuntuArtwork and XubuntuArtwork for now (in order of appereance)
[03:40] <artnay> but the issue was how to cover those projects that are being worked on several *buntus
[03:41] <artnay> mainly UbuntuArtwork and EdubuntuArtwork as they use the same GNOME software in many cases
[03:42] <artnay> so, we would have ended to /Artwork/UbuntuArtwork/Metacity etc.
[03:43] <artnay> I find the current structure much harder to navigate as it hides a lot of essential information under several pages
[03:44] <artnay> I consider /ArtworkTeam/Proposals to be the most important page currently, but it's hidden and the links are without explanations
[03:45] <jsgotangco> hmmm xchat is locking up on me again
[03:45] <artnay> mhz_dinner:
[03:45] <artnay> how's gnome-xchat anyways?
[03:46] <jsgotangco> hideous in my opinion
[03:47] <artnay> hey, GNOME's splash
[03:50] <artnay> http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=108761&page=4 - #1 and #33
[03:53] <artnay> any comments on those? if the metacity theme will be rounded, how about using the third one on #1? #33 is a nice approach, try it :o
[03:55] <klepas> 33 is nice
[03:55] <klepas> but i doubt we have any say in the matter
[03:56] <artnay> umh, isn't that against CoC? ;p
[03:56] <artnay> I mean, of course we should have some input, but the decision would be made by canonical devs and mark
[03:57] <artnay> and if they don't have time for that nor hired experts, who will do that?
[04:00] <klepas> yea, i guess
[04:00] <klepas> i might have a crack at it then after i do this splash for sweep :)
[04:07] <artnay> how about background?
[04:08] <asdax> hallo everybody
[04:08] <artnay> hey
[04:08] <asdax> i think all the pixel graphics icons should be replaced with svg in the next realese
[04:08] <artnay> what's on your mind?
[04:08] <asdax> if it would be possible, it is much cooler when you can scale all icons
[04:08] <artnay> it's not possible in every case AFAIK
[04:08] <asdax> witch case not?
[04:09] <artnay> and SVGs are heavier than PNGs
[04:09] <klepas> asdax: that is up to whether the underlying technology can
[04:09] <artnay> but yes, I love SVGs
[04:09] <klepas> not the artists
[04:09] <artnay> :)
[04:09] <asdax> not when they are rederd once
[04:09] <asdax> :P
[04:09] <asdax> but like all desktop icons
[04:09] <klepas> for example Qt in KDE 4 will have full SVG support
[04:09] <asdax> becouse its very nice when one can scale them (i use big icons)
[04:09] <artnay> asdax: I fully agree on that
[04:09] <klepas> asdax: rendering a PNG icon is easier for the computer than rendering SVGs
[04:10] <asdax> but i had to replace alot of icons that where pixelbased becouse they looked so ugly when they where scaled
[04:10] <artnay> yep, and it's much easier to change colours when you don't need gimp files etc.
[04:10] <asdax> yes :)
[04:10] <artnay> asdax: but the case is that we have no clue of the next icon set
[04:10] <asdax> are you all active in the making of the graphics for the next realese of ubuntu?
[04:10] <artnay> yasis is one chance
[04:10] <artnay> no we're not
[04:11] <asdax> oki
[04:11] <asdax> i could contribute some svg graphics
[04:11] <asdax> i made my own icon for the harddrive becouse that one was pixelbased
[04:11] <artnay> that would be great
[04:11] <artnay> yep
[04:11] <asdax> where does the graphics developers hang around?
[04:11] <asdax> or who to contact about such things?
[04:11] <artnay> my suggestion would be to use human yasis as a base icon set and then modify it heavily
[04:12] <artnay> use some tango icons, some andy's icons etc.
[04:12] <jsgotangco> you mean art that comes in the distro? that's contracted outside
[04:12] <asdax> oki
[04:12] <jsgotangco> the tango icons need some changes
[04:12] <artnay> just use ubuntu palette in those icons and add a unified reflection to all icons
[04:12] <asdax> is that the one that is the default in breezer?
[04:12] <jsgotangco> to match the palette
[04:12] <artnay> from left above, just like tango is doing
[04:13] <asdax> who is tango?
[04:13] <artnay> jsgotangco: yep, I think tango is a bit too colourful
[04:14] <artnay> just type "tango icon project" in your fx's address bar
[04:14] <artnay> that will do it :)
[04:14] <asdax> i have no tango command
[04:15] <artnay> wait, I'll give you the address
[04:15] <asdax> but the people in here are the onces responsible for the graphics shiped with ubuntu?
[04:15] <artnay> http://tango-project.org/Tango_Icon_Gallery
[04:15] <klepas> i might be off
[04:15] <klepas> good night folks
[04:15] <jsgotangco> night klepas
[04:15] <artnay> its license is CC-SA 2.5 which is debian takes as a free license
[04:15] <jsgotangco> have a good one
[04:16] <klepas> cheers
[04:16] <artnay> it permits everyone to change the palette etc.
[04:16] <jsgotangco> yes
[04:16] <artnay> no, none of us here is responsible for what is being included in default installation
[04:16] <asdax> i want to get involved alite with that
[04:16] <asdax> i like to make svg graphics :)
[04:17] <asdax> who are working with that then?
[04:17] <artnay> sure, one thing would to form a team to be responsible for the icon set
[04:17] <artnay> umh, I don't have any idea of that :o
[04:17] <jsgotangco> that's contracted outside for now (especially the wallpaper)
[04:17] <artnay> I don't know who did the background, who did the metacity theme etc.
[04:18] <artnay> jsgotangco: which parts of DE have been outsourced?
[04:18] <asdax> :P
[04:18] <artnay> artwork in ubuntu to be precise
[04:18] <asdax> so what are people in here doing then?
[04:19] <jsgotangco> asdax, we're trying to form a team you see
[04:19] <asdax> aha
[04:19] <artnay> asdax: umh, tweaking their own DEs and having a chat with people interested in ubuntu artwork
[04:19] <jsgotangco> and we've been trying to do that since breezy
[04:19] <asdax> what is a DE?
[04:19] <artnay> acronym for desktop enviroment
[04:19] <artnay> damn typos
[04:19] <asdax> oki
[04:20] <artnay> jsgotangco: yes, but there are a few things that have been preventing people to fully contribute on ubuntu artwork
[04:20] <asdax> what things?
[04:21] <jsgotangco> well there's a.u.c. but its terribly tedious work for admins
[04:21] <artnay> the lack of information, clear goals, disorganization
[04:21] <asdax> oki
[04:21] <asdax> auc? is that on organisation?
[04:22] <artnay> we've been trying to get answers to our questions but haven't succeded in that
[04:22] <asdax> :P
[04:22] <artnay> no, it's http://art.ubuntu.com
[04:22] <asdax> seems to be very much disorganisation then ;)
[04:22] <artnay> AUC should be the primary web site for ubuntu artwork
[04:22] <jsgotangco> silbs used to be involved but she seemed a bit busy lately
[04:23] <jsgotangco> artnay, yes, me and henrik talked about moving it to moin
[04:23] <artnay> jsgotangco: volvo and I have sent several mails to different people without getting replies
[04:23] <asdax> oki
[04:23] <jsgotangco> who?
[04:23] <jsgotangco> jeff?
[04:23] <artnay> and we have even /msg'd "hey, drop me a msg when you're there"
[04:23] <asdax> hope the rest of the ubuntu project is better organaiset :P
[04:24] <jsgotangco> asdax, define organized :)
[04:24] <artnay> jsgotangco: no, not jeff. I've spoken to many devs and they have instructed to contact PR people
[04:24] <asdax> :P
[04:24] <jsgotangco> PR people?
[04:24] <artnay> Jane*
[04:24] <jsgotangco> silber?
[04:24] <artnay> and W
[04:24] <jsgotangco> but JaneW is a project person
[04:25] <artnay> volvo sent his first mail back in july
[04:25] <jsgotangco> she's not involved in development at all
[04:25] <jsgotangco> she'll pass whatever info/email she gets to a dev or a community member that can give an answer
[04:26] <artnay> ok, good to know
[04:27] <jsgotangco> she's a really nice lady really
[04:27] <artnay> asdax: many of us have contributed a way or another. the main issue is just that we haven't organized, combined our strenghts to pick the best artwork out there
[04:27] <asdax> is volvo someone who use to hang around in this channel?
[04:27] <jsgotangco> yes
[04:27] <asdax> :P
[04:27] <artnay> he is the artwork team leader
[04:27] <jsgotangco> he's one of the original artwork people
[04:27] <artnay> take a look at the member list
[04:27] <asdax> oki
[04:28] <jsgotangco> but he got into some health problems lately
[04:28] <asdax> does volvo use to hang around in this channel?
[04:28] <artnay> yep, he was in a surgery
[04:28] <jsgotangco> and i haven't seen andy for quite a while
[04:28] <asdax> oki
[04:28] <artnay>  /last volvo = no result
[04:28] <artnay> excludind what we spoke :o
[04:29] <asdax> dont know what excludind means :P
[04:29] <asdax> sorry
[04:29] <artnay> excluding
[04:29] <asdax> aha
[04:30] <asdax> then i think i know
[04:32] <asdax> what harddrive icons do you use?
[04:32] <asdax> i maybe should show you the one i made
[04:32] <artnay> windows vista :(
[04:32] <asdax> do you use the original?
[04:32] <asdax> are you running on windows vista? (is that realesed?) :P
[04:32] <artnay> actually I don't even have a working computer now
[04:32] <artnay> friend's laptop
[04:32] <asdax> aha
[04:33] <artnay> all my three computers are broken at the moment
[04:33] <artnay> I'm waiting for new HW
[04:33] <artnay> that's why I missed the meeting, damn :/
[04:33] <asdax> i thought vista wasnt realesed yet, but i am not that up to date with the windows world :P
[04:33] <artnay> it's not
[04:33] <asdax> is there hardwere errors in all 3 of your computers?
[04:34] <artnay> it will most probably be released before dapper+1
[04:34] <asdax> oki :P
[04:34] <asdax> has it leaked out on the internet then or how did you friend got it?
[04:34] <artnay> yep, one crashes even in BIOS, one doesn't send VGA signal and one doesn't even boot
[04:34] <artnay> MSDN subscriber
[04:34] <asdax> oki
[04:35] <asdax> did you do anything special with the computers when they got strange?
[04:35] <artnay> http://www.ubuntuforums.org/gallery/showimage.php?i=1600&c=3
[04:35] <artnay> there's the hd icon I use
[04:35] <artnay> not actually, I didn't use one for a long time
[04:36] <asdax> oki
[04:36] <artnay> and one just crashed after 17 days of uptime
[04:36] <artnay> and since that it has kept crashing even in BIOS
[04:36] <asdax> does windows vista look nice or is it as ugly as xp? :p
[04:36] <artnay> I was pleasantly surprised by the changes (at least artwork changes :>)
[04:36] <artnay> aero black kicks luna's ass big time
[04:36] <asdax> nice screenshot, it looks alite bit mac
[04:37] <asdax> what windowsmanager do you use?
[04:37] <artnay> and this one has nice effects
[04:37] <artnay> KWin
[04:37] <asdax> oki
[04:37] <asdax> never heard of
[04:37] <artnay> it's KDE running there
[04:37] <asdax> aha :P
[04:38] <artnay> KWin is what Metacity to GNOME
[04:38] <asdax> oki
[04:38] <artnay> damn, now I'm starting to miss verbs as well :)
[04:38] <asdax> but you dont use everything in kde, just some parts of it that is kwin then?
[04:39] <artnay> KWin takes care of the windecos etc.
[04:39] <jsgotangco> i gotta crash
[04:39] <jsgotangco> good night
[04:39] <artnay> bye
[04:39] <artnay> and it was nice talking with you
[04:40] <asdax> bye bye
[04:40] <artnay> WM != DE
[04:40] <jsgotangco> neat-o
[04:41] <asdax> DE is KDE with all menys and everything and WM is just for moving the windows and so on?
[04:41] <asdax> :P
[04:41] <asdax> or am i wrong?
[04:41] <artnay> DE includes lots of other stuff what WMs are mostly missing
[04:41] <asdax> like menus?
[04:41] <artnay> like file managers, music players, internet browser etc.
[04:42] <artnay> look at the wikipedia, it might explain the difference
[04:42] <artnay> but DEs include WMs
[04:42] <asdax> oki :)
[04:42] <artnay> but, umh, I have to get going
[04:42] <asdax> oki, C U
[04:42] <asdax> have a nice day!
[04:42] <artnay> I might come back later today, depends on what will happen
[04:42] <asdax> oki
[04:42] <artnay> you too, hope to see you here again
[04:43] <artnay> bue
[05:17] <derek[] > bbl


[07:15] <who_me> Hello. Mozilla will enable GTK3 builds on Linux starting with version 43. Are there plans for the Ubuntu build to enable GTK3 as well?


[05:37] <jokerdino> sorry guys, whenever irccloud.com goes berserk, it reconnects me to this channel for no reason.
[05:37] <elky> jokerdino, it's probably been saved in your config somewhere
[05:38] <jokerdino> i am trying to do something about this. hopefully, this won't happen again in the future.
[05:39] <jokerdino> leaving now.
[09:13] <Myrtti> botnick: hi?
[09:33] <Myrtti> botnick: hello?
[09:36] <IdleOne> IAmNotThatGuy: unless you need help from the ops team or have been made an op and we didn't get the memo, please don't idle in this channel.
[09:39] <popey> 18:35:48 < IAmNotThatGuy> Hello ikonia
[09:39] <popey> 18:35:58 <+ikonia> hi there, is there something we can help you with ?
[09:39] <popey> 18:36:19 <+Unit193> ikonia: Lubuntu OP.
[09:40] <popey> IdleOne: ^^
[09:40] <IdleOne> err damn
[09:40] <popey> The Lubuntu ops might think we have it in for them, the amount they get questioned and kicked from this place :/
[09:40] <IdleOne> why isn't he auto-op
[09:40] <popey> that was also discussed at the time
[09:41] <Flannel> might be wortwhile to wait more than a minute for a response in the future
[09:41] <IdleOne> I'll message and apologize and make mental note not to kick
[09:43] <IdleOne> back in the day we had 3 ops, we knew who they were and they knew us all.
[09:44] <elky> It's been a very very long time since there were only 3 ops...
[09:44] <elky> when i became one back in like 2006, there were already more than 3...
[10:13] <IAmNotThatGuy> IdleOne, I am an Lubuntu OP
[10:17] <IdleOne> IAmNotThatGuy: I know, now :/
[10:17]  * IdleOne gives IAmNotThatGuy a hug
[10:17]  * IAmNotThatGuy hugs back
[10:18] <IdleOne> there.
[10:19] <IAmNotThatGuy> I was tired and you made me wake up from the whole all of a sudden. Now I will get back to office to work. btw, ty IdleOne :]
[10:19] <IdleOne> plz2msg AlanBell and ask that he add you to access list :)
[10:20] <IAmNotThatGuy> Sure thing. :]
[14:07] <ikonia> hi dedalux
[14:14] <ikonia> dedalux: are you there ?


 I need to look at that when I get back
 (Location, lon: -78.884635, lat: 35.054977)
 My Chromebook is crostini compatible in beta.  Does that mean next release (70) I should get it?


[07:09] <jijojosephk> Can someone suggest a good resource for learning GTK?
[07:10] <jijojosephk> I want to contribute


[18:30] <jorrakay> Can anyone help me figure out why the main mirror has no binary-armhf folder?
[18:30] <jorrakay> Or rather, how to get upgraded to 14.04.2 through dist-upgrade
[18:45] <jorrakay> http://hastebin.com/qawetokina.rb
[19:38] <infinity> jorrakay: That should be "deb http://ports.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-ports trusty main restricted universe multiverse"
[19:38] <infinity> jorrakay: And then the same for trusty-updates and trusty-security.
[19:38] <infinity> jorrakay: Your original installation would have used ports, not sure why you changed it and expected it to work.
[19:41] <jorrakay> OK I changed them because i was following instructions for an EOL-upgrade
[20:06] <jorrakay> I think it's gonna work. thanks infinity


[14:14] <javaprince22> Hello room. am a Java programmer and dis my first time on irc
[14:15] <persia> javaprince22: Welcome.
[14:16] <javaprince22> Am a Java Programmer - Say intermediate. Am tryin to get a grabs of the Advanced Enterprise  part
[14:23] <persia> I'll admit to know actually knowing of what the Advanced Enterprise part consists.  Generally, this channel is about packaging Java in Ubuntu, but not so much about Java itself.
[18:06] <javaprince22> Hi programmers in d room
[18:29] <javaprince22> Do we have Java Programmers in here??? Would like to talk 2 one.


[08:16] <lordievader> Good morning
[11:48] <tsimonq2> o/
[12:05] <BluesKaj> Hey all
[16:59] <gorilych> hello. I have KDE 5.4.2 on kubuntu 15.10. Sometimes keyboard shortcuts stop working. Is this a known problem?
[17:16] <vitimiti> I'm trying to do sudo unity8-lxc-setup and after uninstalling systemd-sysv, there's an infinite loop of errors saying the petition to uninstall ubuntu-standard and systemd-sysv because they aren't installed. I'm using the official LXC PPA on Wily, does somebody know how to fix this?
[22:20] <Smedles> hi all - just realised, whilst i updated to wily a month or so ago, uname -r still reports a 3.19 kernel....
[22:22] <Faux> Do you lack linux-image-generic ?
[22:23] <Smedles> Faux: installing that now
[22:24] <Smedles> my other machine running 15.10 does have 4.2.x installed - so I guess something went awry during upgrade
[22:25] <Faux> linux-image-generic is just a pointer to a good kernel, it's very unlikely it would get uninstalled; more likely it was never there to start with.  virtual install / odd media?
[22:26] <Smedles> system was originally installed from usb flash - 15.04 IIRC, then  upgraded to 15.10
[22:27] <Smedles> booted now, but can't logon, returns to unity logon screen; command line boots ok and can logon
[22:39] <Smedles> looks like i need to reinstall nvidia drivers
[22:46] <Smedles> got a desktop backup, but no unity dock....
[22:47] <Smedles> and a bunch of 'kept-back' packages after removing nvidia drivers...


[12:56] <sveinse> Any activity here?
[12:56] <sveinse> (apparently not). Anyways: Anyone familiar with the SD FAT bootloader in OMAP(3) ?
[12:57] <sveinse> Are there any channels discussing TI OMAP?
[12:59] <armin76> #omap ? :D
[12:59] <armin76> there was one...
[13:00] <armin76> #linux-omap
[13:01] <armin76> sveinse: also #beagle could be of help
[20:06] <easwar> I'm trying to boot Maverick on a BB xM
[20:07] <armin76> gl :D
[20:07] <easwar> and the boot stops at * Enabling additional executable binary formats binfmt-support [OK]
[20:07] <easwar> I tried a search and there is only one thread on the BeagleBoard Google Group
[20:07] <easwar> which has not been solved
[20:08] <easwar> and Maverick doesn't seem to want to show up on my LCD monitor
[20:08] <easwar> any ideas?
[20:08] <easwar> armin76, gl?
[20:09] <easwar> I followed the OMAPMaverickInstall instructions on the Ubuntu Wiki
[20:10] <easwar> and edited the boot.scr to include console=ttyS2,115200n8 serialtty=ttyS2 option in the cmdline
[20:15] <easwar> armin76, you've tried?
[20:15] <easwar> did you run into the same issue?
[20:15] <armin76> easwar: sorry, i don't use ubuntu nor i have a bbxm :)
[20:15] <armin76> easwar: ubuntu support tends to happen on workdays
[20:15] <easwar> armin76, ah
[20:16] <easwar> armin76, why the gl then?
[20:16] <armin76> gl = good luck
[20:17] <easwar> armin76, ya, I got that after thinking it over for a min
[21:01]  * easwar will try tomorrow
[21:04] <ericb2> hello
[21:05] <ericb2> just for  the record : since I upgraded the Natty, no way to boot on my BeagleBoard
[21:05] <ericb2> (xM)
[21:09] <phh> (lol.)
[21:30] <amstan> hello, about to try installing on a gtab
[21:30] <amstan> wish me luck
[21:38] <rsalveti> ericb2: do you get at least the boot log?
[21:46] <ericb2> rsalveti: nothing:  the two leds never stop to be on .. nothing happens
[21:47] <ericb2> rsalveti: I have no other information, and I'll try to boot using the serial, to figure out what happened. But sure, something is guilty in the upgrade
[22:25] <Neko> steev, can you do me a huge huge favor and work out a way to modify /etc/update-manager/release-updates so it changes the setting to prompt=never ?
[22:29] <rsalveti> ericb2: hm, seems you can't even boot your kernel
[22:29] <ericb2> rsalveti: looks like
[22:29] <rsalveti> when only one led is on it's when it failed to load your x-loader
[22:29] <ericb2> rsalveti: I'll try the serial tomorrow
[22:29] <rsalveti> when one is on, then it blinks with both on it's u-boot that's running
[22:30] <rsalveti> so it could be that it failed to update your kernel properly, then you're now unable to boot
[22:30] <ericb2> rsalveti: I really wonder what happened. Everything was find after the apt-get upgrade
[22:31] <ericb2> s/find/fine/
[22:48] <amstan> what's the difference between the kernel flavours that you offer, which one should i pick? dove, omap, omap4, versatile
[22:50] <Neko> dove is for dove, omap is for omap3, omap4 is for omap4, versatile is for arm reference boards (or qemu)
[22:50] <Neko> if you got a beagle, omap is the one you need
[22:51] <amstan> i have a samsung gtab, it's similar to the tegra
[22:51] <amstan> viewsonic*
[22:52] <Neko> then there is no kernel for you
[22:53] <computerwiz_222> We have access to another kernel.. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=903505
[22:53] <computerwiz_222> (I'm with amstan)
[22:55] <computerwiz_222> Any thoughts on that?


[15:04] <rlaager> Anyone at the Penguins Unbound meeting?
[17:08] <mathomastech> rlaager: Not able to attend it this month
[17:09] <rlaager> They ended up not being able to stream this month, which was a bummer for me.


[00:18] <CreativeEmbassy> I have a brand new setup. I have two servers, maas is set up on one, and it's set to handle dhcp and dns. I'm now trying to boot a second machine with PXE turned on.
[00:19] <CreativeEmbassy> On the second machine, I'm just getting a TFTP timeout. Know what could be causing that?
[00:19] <CreativeEmbassy> PXE-E32
[00:20] <bigjools> CreativeEmbassy: I've seen a few reports of tftp timeouts lately
[00:20] <bigjools> this is 13.10 maas?
[00:20] <CreativeEmbassy> bigjools: yeah. assumed the machine with MAAS would have already taken care of setting up TFTP, opening the port in the firewall, and whatever else.
[00:20] <bigjools> it does not set firewalls
[00:20] <bigjools> so check that
[00:20] <CreativeEmbassy> alright, I'll look that up
[00:20] <bigjools> but it will start a tftp server
[00:21] <bigjools> do you have maas managing dhcp?
[00:22] <CreativeEmbassy> Yeah. And DNS.
[00:22] <CreativeEmbassy> I just turned off DHCP on the main router to make sure it wasn't interfering.
[00:23] <bigjools> if it's on the same network it will interfere
[00:31] <CreativeEmbassy> do you know what file is requested over tftp? pxelinux.0?
[00:31] <CreativeEmbassy> I want to try it on localhost first to make sure I can access it here, before I try to reboot the node and let it go again
[00:32] <CreativeEmbassy> nm, looks like it is that file
[00:49] <CreativeEmbassy> not having luck. opened up ports 67, 68, 69. now the node isn't even able to talk to the controller via DHCP
[00:49] <CreativeEmbassy> it's late, and I need to head home. I'll be in here again tomorrow :)
[00:49] <CreativeEmbassy> thanks for your help
[06:50] <NCommander> morning all
[06:50] <NCommander> anyone around who can answer 20 questions on MAAS epermial images?
[06:51] <bigjools> NCommander: hit me
[06:51] <bigjools> assuming you mean ephemeral images
[06:52] <NCommander> bigjools, yeah, sorry, its early
[06:53] <NCommander> bigjools, I'm looking at enabling MAAS for a new ARM subarchitecture, but MAAS's internals have changed a *lot* since the last time I looked
[06:53] <NCommander> As best I can tell, instead of just preseeding an installer, it does some voodoo with iSCSI, and then I got lost
[06:53] <NCommander> (I'm also having a lot of trouble getting a dev environment setup; issues with image importation)
[06:53] <bigjools> none of this stuff has changed really
[06:54] <NCommander> Well, how exactly are the ephemeral images used (I've not gotten to the point where I can actually get my cluster to run)
[06:54] <bigjools> so to enable a new subarch you need to get it in simplestreams and then edit the maas-import-pxe-files filter.  I think that's it.
[06:54] <bigjools> ok
[06:55] <bigjools> so they are obviously imported and stored on the cluster controller
[06:55] <bigjools> next
[06:55] <bigjools> when booting a node, maas supplies the kernel command line with the iscsi target of the image, depending on what its architecture us
[06:55] <bigjools> is*
[06:55] <bigjools> so it all depends on the arch/subarch getting set right on the node definition
[10:31] <gnuoy> Hi, I have maas 1.4+bzr1693+dfsg-0ubuntu2~ctools0  installed but I don't see a /etc/maas/preseeds directory (as mentioned in stokachu's article http://astokes.org/automatically-configuring-vlans-maas/ ). Do I need a different version ? or has the location moved ?
[10:32] <bigjools> it ought to be there
[10:33] <bigjools> I am EOD now but perhaps allenap can help
[10:34] <gnuoy> thanks, I'll wait for him to pop in
[10:36] <gnuoy> I upgraded from 1.2 if that's relevant
[10:48] <gnuoy> morning mgz, is allenap hiding behind the fish tank ?
[10:48] <mgz> he's right beside me
[10:49] <mgz> unlike certain less reliable fellows
[10:51] <gnuoy> I seem to have an additional issue that juju is claiming my maas environment is not bootstrapped (I have recently added the cloud archive and cloud tools archive)
[10:51] <gnuoy> maas-cli maas files list  shows a number of files including provider-state
[10:52] <gnuoy> but retrieving it seems to be failing
[10:52] <gnuoy> AttributeError: 'HttpResponse' object has no attribute '_is_string'
[10:53] <mgz> gnuoy: I am berating allenap about maas-cli now
[10:53] <gnuoy> thanks :)
[10:54] <allenap> mgz: http://blog.allenap.me/2013/06/workaround-for-uploading-files-to-maas.html
[11:00] <mgz> gnuoy: can you re-run the command with --debug (stick it near the end)
[11:01] <gnuoy> mgz http://paste.ubuntu.com/6335114/
[11:02] <mgz> gnuoy: can you look at the log on the server side for the full traceback?
[11:03] <gnuoy> mgz http://paste.ubuntu.com/6335119/
[11:03] <mgz> that looks like a masking error in the handling of an earlier exception
[11:04] <gnuoy> mgz, I have that message repeated every 5 minutes in the maas.log but nothing else that I can see
[11:05] <mgz> gnuoy: my best guess is your maas install is slightly hosed, you probably need a version bump to one or other python package
[11:06] <gnuoy> mgz, ok, let me look into that
[11:07] <gnuoy> mgz, ah, I had some packages that had been kept back
[11:09] <gnuoy> mgz, allenap, all fixed, thanks. I have a preseeds dir now and juju status is working again
[11:09] <mgz> ace.
[12:09] <NCommander> bigjools, I'm at an absolute loss at how boot images are reported; I canmanually call tftpboot, and get a valid dict[] with images, but looking at web(app)s logs, I can never see the controller reporting it has images, thus the maas error messages aren't cleared
[12:10] <NCommander> I can see in the log that its attempted to report
[12:10] <NCommander> But there's no actual POST call made
[12:17] <NCommander> [2013-10-31 08:16:42,295: DEBUG/PoolWorker-6] Not reporting boot images: don't have API key yet.
[12:17] <NCommander> Ah
[12:17] <NCommander> There's the problem
[12:30] <NCommander> bigjools, how does the regional cluster get an API key?
[12:55] <NCommander> mgz, allenap, any chance you know the necessary magic to get the regional controller to know its API key?
[12:56] <mgz> NCommander: sorry, didn't respond because I didn't understand the question
[12:57] <NCommander> mgz, I've got a local setup of lp:maas locally because I'm trying to do platform enablement
[12:57] <NCommander> mgz, right now, I'm stuck with "regional controller doesn't see disk images" issue, and looking at the logs when celeryd is running DEBUG, I'm getting complaints that the API key is missing
[12:58] <NCommander> [2013-10-31 08:38:59,070: DEBUG/PoolWorker-5] Not reporting boot images: don't have API key yet.
[12:59] <allenap> NCommander: You're not going to like this, but I suggest working against the packages.
[13:00] <NCommander> allenap, that's somewhat annoying ...
[13:00] <allenap> NCommander: Cluster controllers should be given some tokens in order to talk back to the region controller, but there may be some -fu in the packages.
[13:00] <NCommander> allenap, I need this to land for trusty; working against saucy's code isn't going to help me much
[13:01]  * NCommander already has patches that fix some of the debug scripts
[13:01] <allenap> NCommander: It hasn't diverged much yet.
[13:01] <NCommander> allenap, "yet" is a scary word :-)
[13:01] <allenap> NCommander: Obviously fixes will have to get into lp:maas, but I suggest doing enablement with packages.
[13:02] <allenap> NCommander: And I mean a daily PPA (https://launchpad.net/~maas-maintainers/+archive/dailybuilds), rather than those in the distro.
[13:03] <NCommander> allenap, that's exceptionally annoying for doing work, as then I have to hunt down where all the libraries have ended up.
[13:03] <NCommander> */grumbles*
[13:03] <NCommander> Then again, I've already lost 2 days to this nonsense
[13:03]  * NCommander has been playing debug the breaking script :-/
[13:04] <NCommander> allenap, I can probably put my stuff in a series of quilt patches and rebuild the source packages from scratch ...
[13:06] <allenap> NCommander: That sounds good to me. We can then absorb those changes upstream once they're working. However, roaksoax is the packaging guy for MAAS, so I'll let him comment.
[13:08] <NCommander> allenap, so the daily PPAs pull from trunk? (want to make sure my stuff is relatively sane)
[13:09] <allenap> NCommander: Yep. There's no recipe for trusty yet though.
[13:22] <NCommander> allenap, well, fudge, in about 10 minutes I've gotten farther than I have in 2 days :-/
[13:23] <allenap> NCommander: \o/
[13:25] <allenap> NCommander: We're going to be charming up MAAS this cycle, and one of my goals is to make sure that it's as easy to deploy from branch as it is from packages. I think that should help this story. Sorry it's not there yet.
[13:25] <NCommander> allenap, its fine, but I'd appreicate it if the dev documentation was a bit more in touch with reality . I'm fairly sure I'll have more questions
[16:07] <Guest97534> Hi. Does anyone know anythig about "metadata request failed http://server/MAAS/metadata - internal server error 500" while commisining a node? The nodes fail to tag.
[16:07] <Guest97534> These nodes used to tag before
[16:07] <Guest97534> But failed after recommisioning
[16:11] <Guest97534>   File "/usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/django/core/handlers/base.py", line 111, in get_response
[16:11] <Guest97534> ....
[16:11] <Guest97534>   File "/usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/maasserver/api_auth.py", line 55, in is_authenticated
[16:11] <Guest97534>     raise OAuthUnauthorized(error)
[16:12] <Guest97534> found those in the log. May be related
[18:03] <CreativeEmbassy> just curious, can I add other stuff to maas-dns somewhere, even for computers that aren't being provisioned by MAAS?
[19:37] <NCommander> smoser, ping, so I need to cook an ephemeral image for a new subarch, and I was pointed to you :-)
[20:42] <stokachu> the filename for the user preseeds can someone give me an example
[20:42] <stokachu> included arch_subarch_series_nodename
[20:42] <stokachu> i know what series and nodename should look like
[20:43] <stokachu> is the prefix actually required in order to be the first in the lookup list
[20:44] <stokachu> so amd64_generic_saucy would be selected before 'generic'
[20:45] <stokachu> ah nm
[20:45] <stokachu> helps if i read down
[20:53] <rbasak> NCommander: I pointed you to smoser to point you at the maas ephemeral image generation script, which I think he has in bzr somewhere. Adding a subarch to a master script is a bit of a dubious proposition right now without coordination on what to do with the subarch field, kernels, etc.
[21:07] <tych0> you can specify your own mirrors, though
[21:07] <tych0> so you could do a local generation and then use that
[21:08] <NCommander> rbasak, well, I'm trying to figure out what that will need; I think I can just set the arch field to "armhf+slayton" and call it good, but I'm not sure how hard it will be to bend those scripts


[21:56] <ricardogp> hello
[21:56] <ricardogp> I have a doubt
[21:56] <ricardogp> wonder if someone can help me here
[21:57] <ricardogp> I want to install lubuntu alongside windows in a 2gb ram samnsung ativpc500
[21:57] <ricardogp> how many disk space you think I should have?
[21:59] <wxl> ricardogp: i'd expect lubuntu to take no more than 4-5GB in the default install
[22:00] <ricardogp> thanks!
[22:00] <wxl> np
[22:00] <ricardogp> should I create new partition or simply install alongside?
[22:00] <wxl> install windows first
[22:00] <wxl> then install alongside
[22:01] <ricardogp> so no need to partition
[22:01] <ricardogp> thanks a lot!
[22:01] <ricardogp> really
[22:01] <wxl> the installer will take care of it for you
[22:01] <ricardogp> great


[01:44] <Coimbra> OERIAS is back!
[03:14] <gebbione> serious? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+bug/1322925 5 months and no change?
[03:15] <gebbione> useless distro
[03:15] <gebbione> going to look for something better, so many bugs, how was ubuntu 14 acceptance tested????
[07:42] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[08:18] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Swap Ideas Day! :-D
[08:27] <DJones> Have I slept for 6 months, its not APril 1st is it? http://games.slashdot.org/story/14/09/09/2334235/report-microsoft-to-buy-minecraft-studio-for-2bn
[08:28] <Myrtti> if Notch would want more money quickly, then that might be the way, I'm a bit doubtful he'd do that though.
[08:28] <Myrtti> I suppose everything is possible.
[08:29] <DJones> Its possible, but I can't see how MS would expect to recover $2bn from Minecraft sales/income
[08:30] <DJones> Plus there's the comment by Notch about releasing the source code as "some kind of open source" once sales drop off
[08:31] <Elions> Some cities have less habitants than there are people who own minecraft
[08:31] <Elions> So it's unlikely
[08:32] <Elions> at least, anytime soon.
[08:32] <Myrtti> well there is a saturation point to it all
[08:32] <Myrtti> what keeps the sales going is new ways Minecraft is being used
[08:33] <DJones> Xbox version looks to sell for £17 ish, that'd be around 70M xbox minecraft sales needed to break even
[08:34] <diplo> + the income from Xbox Gold to use it?
[08:38] <DJones> Ahh, thinking about it, its probably not got anything to do with the game, they just want to by copyright/patents :)
[08:49] <pulse> hi
[08:49] <pulse> when do jobs start at in uk on average?
[08:49] <pulse> can someone tell me? :P
[08:49] <pulse> (i mean what hour of the day)
[08:51] <diplo> Between 8-9am
[08:51] <diplo> I start at 8 as do quite a few of my friends, depends on the job I guess
[08:53] <DJones> If you're a postman, its probably around 5am
[08:54] <DJones> Typical shift work would be 6am-2pm, 2pm-10pm, 10pm-6am
[08:58] <popey> my previous job had "core" hours between 10 and 4 which you had to be in the office for, but they didn't care about the start/end time
[08:58] <popey> so if you came in early, you could go out early
[08:59] <pulse> thanks :)
[09:13] <directhex> pulse: it largely depends on office culture
[09:14] <directhex> pulse: e.g. i set off the alarm for my current job on my third day by arriving at 10am
[09:14] <pulse> well, i think each country has an average of its own
[09:14] <pulse> here in slovenia jobs usually start at 8
[09:15] <pulse> it's no rule though, i was wondering when i can contact some firm in the uk :P
[09:15] <pulse> i contacted them successfully now so no worries
[09:17] <Myrtti> when I was a kid I thought all the jobs in Finland started at 7
[09:20] <ThomasRedstone> lol, office jobs are traditionally 9-5:30, but there are increasingly jobs that either specify an earlier start, say 8:30, and later end, around 6:00, or where pressure of the work, and the culture forces people to work longer hours without it being in their contract...
[09:22] <DJones> Bankers are at the office between 5am and 8pm, 1st & last 3 hours of the day to shred the incriminating paperwork
[09:24] <ThomasRedstone> from what I've heard a lot of that time is wasted (at a junior level), and the later time is the actual work, because they only actually get the stuff they've been waiting on towards the end of the day, crazy bankers
[09:25] <ThomasRedstone> anyone here been using Netflix on Ubuntu? I've got it working by upgrading lnbnss3 to the version used 14.10, but it's unstable (which might be purely down to the fact I'm using a different OS's deb files...)
[09:25] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[09:25] <bigcalm> Anybody here make use of Checkpoint VPN?
[09:26] <davmor2> bigcalm: NO
[09:26] <bigcalm> davmor2: DAMN
[09:28] <popey> i used to
[09:28] <popey> when i worked in an office with silly windows rubbish
[09:28] <bigcalm> :(
[09:29] <ThomasRedstone> bigcalm, what's your real question? Maybe someone knows something...
[09:31] <davmor2> popey: but windows let in light into the office, without windows you would be able to see unless they have those new fangled electric lights!
[09:31]  * popey notes his blind is shut
[09:36] <ThomasRedstone> popey, my curtains too, what is wrong with us?!
[09:37] <davmor2> it's the sun it burnses us, the precious
[09:37] <ThomasRedstone> Freelancer.com sent me an email with the subject "Are you capturing your mobile users?", where the hell do they expect me keep them all?! I'm not some evil super villain!!!
[09:38] <davmor2> ThomasRedstone: surely you are the only person using your mobile
[09:39] <ThomasRedstone> a good point, my daughter does sometimes, and she's already kind of captured, she can't legally go anywhere without my permission! Muhahaha :-P
[10:10] <diplo> Recommendations of what to use other than Nagios, any preferred over another ?
[10:12] <diplo> OPsview/Icinga/Zabbix are what I was thinking of trying
[10:17] <foobarry> bleurgh
[10:17] <foobarry> doc says i have bronchitis
[10:37] <bigcalm> Tummy says I have hunger *gurgle*
[10:40] <davmor2> bigcalm: it lies
[10:41] <bigcalm> It makes me feel ill
[10:41]  * bigcalm reaches for the chewing gum
[10:42] <foobarry> diplo: adagios
[10:43] <foobarry> its nagios with the annoying bits fixed
[10:43] <bigcalm> foobarry: that sucks, I hope you get well soon
[10:44] <diplo> I've not seen that foobarry
[10:44]  * diplo takes a look
[10:45] <bigcalm> A possible alternative to nagios: https://github.com/intrbiz/bergamot
[10:46] <foobarry> i also had a 24hr sick bug yesterday to compound issues :(
[10:46] <foobarry> feeling v sorry for myself
[10:46] <diplo> demo is broke bigcalm, foobarry that looks quite nice
[10:46] <diplo> May play with it locally
[10:48] <bigcalm> diplo: it's by a guy from our LUG. He really needs more people to contribute and make the project great
[10:48] <diplo> Get him to fix the demo first then :D
[10:48] <diplo> I'll download later and try it locally
[10:48] <foobarry> adagios allows editing of config files , where nagios will overwrite and squash files badly
[10:48] <bigcalm> I'll prod him about the demo
[10:48] <foobarry> also its morepretty
[10:49] <diplo> yeah I noticed that, quite liked that
[10:54] <foobarry> where's this list of 5m gmail accounts that were compromised?
[10:57] <foobarry> think i've got it
[10:57] <foobarry> wow there's some lame passwords
[11:19] <intrbiz> bigcalm: hello there, thanks for plugging http://bergamot-monitoring.org/
[11:20] <Myrtti> eh
[11:21] <davmor2> intrbiz: wow dude what are you doing here ;)
[11:22] <bigcalm> o/
[11:22] <intrbiz> haha, dancing with the devil, something like that
[11:22] <intrbiz> is Ubuntu 14.10 shipping with systemd?
[11:22] <davmor2> intrbiz: dancing with the devil in the pale moonlight :)
[11:23] <bigcalm> davmor2: at the moon under water no doubt
[11:23] <intrbiz> mmmmm beer
[11:23] <foobarry> my wife's name is on the 5M google emails
[11:23] <davmor2> intrbiz: pass it's had bits for a while so I'm not sure
[11:23] <foobarry> is there a list of passwords associated with the 5m names?
[11:28] <davmor2> intrbiz: I would say it is more likely to land fully in 15.04 though but that is me guessing.
[11:28] <diddledan> foobarry: what's this about gmail accounts?
[11:28] <diddledan> (I just came in)
[11:28] <foobarry> list of 5M compromised gmail  accounts out there
[11:28] <diddledan> ooh
[11:28] <diddledan> not good
[11:29] <bigcalm> intrbiz: if it's the only thing stopping a .deb release, man up and write a init.d script ;)
[11:29] <davmor2> foobarry: the guys purged the passwords reading the news articles
[11:29] <bigcalm> intrbiz: or are there other bits of systemd that I'm missing?
[11:31] <foobarry> the first two letters of the pasword don't match with one she ever used
[11:32] <foobarry> have google ever distinguished between accounts with a "." in the name?
[11:35] <foobarry> looks like hte passwods are not for gmail accounts
[11:37] <diddledan> I'm not sure I understand the question
[11:37] <diddledan> gmail usernames with or without a . must be unique
[11:38] <diddledan> i.e. dan.llew and danllew are different usernames
[11:41] <foobarry> really? even in gmail?
[11:41] <foobarry> i thought i could send to foo.barry and foobarry and get both mails
[11:42] <foobarry> "Gmail doesn't recognize dots as characters within usernames, you can add or remove the dots from a Gmail address without changing the actual destination"
[11:42] <diddledan> weird
[11:42] <diddledan> that's odd behaviour
[11:43] <intrbiz> bigcalm: Its the initscript and log handling that I mainly rely on, nothing to major, just another bit of time
[11:44] <bigcalm> Fair enough. I think you need more contributors to the project :)
[11:46]  * bigcalm slithers off to lunch
[12:30] <mapps> yay
[12:30] <mapps> samsung motherboard here
[12:30] <popey> \o/ changed my launchpad name https://launchpad.net/~popey
[12:30]  * popey like sbears
[12:30] <popey> also bears
[12:30] <Azelphur> popey: now get your name changed by depol to that. :P
[12:31] <popey> hehe
[12:31] <popey> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZZHBxM70OI
[12:32] <Azelphur> hehe
[12:32] <Azelphur> popey: did you see my latest shenanigans in Bitcoin land?
[12:32] <popey> your job?
[12:33] <Azelphur> yea
[12:33] <popey> yeah, nice one.
[12:33] <Azelphur> that and I got randomly shipped to Berlin by ownCloud, having only heard about it 4 days prior
[12:37] <mapps> what you don re bitcoin
[12:37] <Azelphur> mapps: https://home.azelphur.com/owncloud/public.php?service=files&t=0d302c5f272a6614b4e0502df3360659 is my employment contract :P
[12:38] <mapps> lol cool
[12:38] <Azelphur> indeed, gonna be fun :)
[12:38] <mapps> think id be laughed at if i asked for that
[12:38] <mapps> i guess small company?
[12:38] <Azelphur> mapps: well, it was offered to me, they offered me any currency I liked
[12:39] <Azelphur> somewhat small, but they are in the Bitcoin realm which is why Bitcoin is an option
[12:39] <mapps> ah yea
[12:39] <mapps> somehow dont think bet365 will pay me in btc;p
[12:39] <mapps> i have to wait 6 weeks for pay after this month too..which blows
[12:40] <Azelphur> mapps: the fact that a site like bit365 doesn't accept BTC is a major loss for them :P
[12:40] <mapps> somehow bcause my pay date moves when i move to gibraltar ..quite annoying and i dont see why
[12:40] <Azelphur> the BTC casinos are /huge/ now
[12:40] <Azelphur> I made a tidy sum by investing in SatoshiDice
[12:40] <mapps> really?
[12:40] <Azelphur> yup
[12:40] <mapps> i dunno its too much hassle for me tbh
[12:40] <mapps> and for most people betting id imagine
[12:40] <mapps> login betfair type my 3 digits in moneys there
[12:41] <Azelphur> mapps: it circumvents gambling laws in USA, which is why its so popular.
[12:41] <mapps> yea
[12:41] <mapps> make a betting exchange with btc
[12:41] <mapps> that would be cool
[12:43] <Azelphur> hehe
[12:44] <mapps> the new iphones seem nice
[12:44] <mapps> and claim prety good battery life
[12:45] <Azelphur> mapps: sorry, I read the specs last night while giggling
[12:45] <mapps> pfff
[12:45] <mapps> the battery life was decent..no?
[12:46] <Azelphur> theverges article read like a comedy
[12:46] <mapps> i dont see the appeal of a smart watch tho
[12:46] <mapps> cant see what id want it for
[12:46] <Azelphur> mapps: yea, apparently it's a bit better battery wise
[12:46] <mapps> they claim 24hrs on one of them
[12:47] <Azelphur> the things that made me laugh were the 1334x750 "Retina HD woo shiny" display :P
[12:47] <mapps> heh
[12:47] <marxjohnson> Um, 24 hours battery life for the iphone?
[12:47] <mapps> ja
[12:47] <Azelphur> "Apple says it uses an all-new sensor with even larger pixels than before." made me burst out laughing
[12:47] <marxjohnson> If that's decent, what's it like on the 5?
[12:48] <mapps> way less than 24jrs lol
[12:48] <Azelphur> "Apple says the camera has a new autofocus system that uses pixels on the image sensor to focus even faster than before." what else is it gonna use, magic sky fairies? :P
[12:48] <marxjohnson> Oh dear. I wonder what they do differently that makes it eat power? Maybe I just have less power-hungry stuff on all the time on my Nexus
[12:48] <Azelphur> sorry...that article was so funny :x
[12:49] <mapps> yea my nexus7 lasts a long time
[12:49] <mapps> but my 5s if i actually do anything on it dies pretty quickly
[12:49] <Azelphur> marxjohnson: it's 24 hours of standby time, web browsing and such is only 10 hours.
[12:49] <Azelphur> and that 10 hours is probably with everything but the essentials turned off
[12:50] <marxjohnson> Holy crap
[12:50] <Azelphur> I imagine it's pretty much on par with other modern smartphones.
[12:50] <mapps> yea
[12:50] <Azelphur> mapps: on the watch, I really did like apples navigation thing, can't fault that in theory
[12:50] <Azelphur> and googles one is terrible
[12:50] <mapps> but who needs it
[12:50] <Azelphur> I'd use it
[12:51] <marxjohnson> Well when i was playing Sonic 4 on my Nexus that drained the battery in a few hours, but with normal usage (occasional calls/texts/browsing, TTS audio books) it lasts about 2 days
[12:51] <Azelphur> I walk places a lot
[12:51] <mapps> so do i..but use your phone for stuff?
[12:52] <Azelphur> mapps: it's another stage in miniaturisation and portability, on the same basis, use your laptop for stuff ;)
[12:53] <Azelphur> the watches are mostly useful for notifications though, it's a pain to pull your phone out just to find out you got an email that could have been viewed with a glance at your wrist.
[12:54] <marxjohnson> Plus you get to feel like you're in Thunderbirds
[12:56] <Azelphur> indeed, great fun talking to your watch and freaking people out
[13:01] <diplo> Azelphur, I got round the email alerts by only having alerts/noises on emails I care about. Family/friends and a few important ones make a notification sound etc where as everything else just slips through
[13:01] <Azelphur> I see, I prefer to not miss anything :)
[13:06] <mapps> how long you in germany for?
[13:08] <Azelphur> mapps: I'm not in Germany any more, I came back last Monday :)
[13:09] <mapps> oh
[13:20] <mapps> hm cool got 4g where i am atm
[13:20] <mapps> normally only use my orange 3g contract..luckily one of thems ending in 2 weeks:D
[13:21] <mapps> still got 18months on my ee one tho and i wont be here..dunno if its worth phoning ..im not gonna pay it off may aswell keep it if thats the case
[13:22] <Azelphur> ouch
[13:22] <Azelphur> mapps: going to Berlin?
[13:23] <mapps> nah
[13:23] <mapps> gibraltar
[13:23] <mapps> but gt 2 contracts atm orange unlimited 3g iphone 5
[13:23] <mapps> ee iphone 5s 5gig 4g
[13:23] <mapps> didnt really want 2 while im not here..so luckily 1 runs out
[13:23] <mapps> i could try and lower the tarrif on ee one i guess
[13:24] <Azelphur> mapps: or sell it to someone that wants it
[13:24] <mapps> nah then if theyre up to no good its under my name:D
[13:25] <Azelphur> spose
[13:50] <directhex> 10T sata rust drives announced by hgst @_@
[14:04] <popey> wowzers
[14:04]  * popey looks at the 12 bays in his microserver and ponders 12x10TB
[14:07] <diddledan> popey: they have 12 bays?!
[14:07] <popey> 4 internal, 8 external
[14:07] <diddledan> aah
[14:08] <davmor2> popey: why you ponder that, what flowers would you like at your funeral when you're beloved finds out an kills you? ;)
[14:08] <diddledan> I wonder how quickly you could fill up a 120TB array?!
[14:09] <diddledan> I suggest running a `for i in /dev/sd??; do dd if=/dev/zero of=$i; done` first... might take a few days to complete :-p
[14:10] <intrbiz> Seagate (sort of) announced 8TB drives the other week.  Sadly it looks like HGST are having to use SMR to get the 10TB, which will dent perf somewhat
[14:10] <diddledan> intrbiz: SMR?
[14:10] <intrbiz> shingled magnetic recording
[14:14] <popey> i could keep backups for longer
[14:30] <ujjain> are credit cards used for paying rent? seems like a good idea to use a 2% unlimited cash back credit card for your rent
[14:30] <ujjain> that 2% is 240 yearly for me
[14:43] <diddledan> ujjain: no
[14:44] <diddledan> ujjain: it is usually cash, cheque, debit or directdebit
[14:47] <SuperEngineer> "Following the death of his pet rat, Pepeijn Bruins decided he wanted to have it stuffed and attach three propellers."
[14:47] <SuperEngineer> is that really what happens on the Real Ale Train?
[14:48] <diddledan> yey for getting "stuffed" drinking ale
[15:03] <SuperEngineer> ;)
[15:16] <davmor2> SuperEngineer: only before the party starts, afterwards they are too busy playing pass the ratcopter
[15:27]  * SuperEngineer likes the idea of a ratcopter
[15:27] <mapps> ujjain,  nah places charge a fee for using cc
[15:28] <ujjain> ah right
[15:28] <mapps> like booking flights and hotels :( else id use a cashback card all the time
[15:28] <mapps> ive had like £60 of m&s vouchers so far his year:D
[15:28] <ujjain> ah right fair point
[15:28] <ujjain> I remember having such experiences
[15:28] <mapps> i get cashback on my m&s mastercard
[15:28] <mapps> i get cashback on my barclays american express BUT not everywhere takes it anyway
[15:29] <SuperEngineer> mapps - keep a gun in same pocket as wallet... you'd be serprised how much cash back you get ;)
[15:29] <mapps> heh
[15:30] <mapps> its obv known not everywhere takes amex..as its 1 account but 2cards.an amex and a mastercard..the amex has cashback and 0 abroad fees:D
[15:30] <mapps> hm i didnt know you were allowed lighters or matches in hand luggage..had to chuck some cool matches we got in a bar in Latvia..but yet at the airport accidently had a lighter on me and they said its ok
[15:31] <mapps> i was sure you werent allowed O_o
[15:33] <SuperEngineer> [probably the phosphorous in the matches that frightened them... silly huh?]
[15:34] <SuperEngineer> [as if you could do anything nasty with phosphorous!]
[15:34] <mapps> no i mean i chucked them in the bin at hotel
[15:34] <mapps> but a lighter is ok?!
[15:34] <SuperEngineer> in other words - they were correct
[15:34] <mapps> i thought lighters.matches everything was banned
[15:35] <SuperEngineer> provoded it's only got lighter fuel in it - it can't do anything more than explode, surely?
[15:35] <SuperEngineer> ;)
[15:35] <mapps> well thats enough
[15:35] <mapps> you could start a fire!
[15:36] <SuperEngineer> guess the NSA & GCHQ have now just started this channel lol
[15:36] <SuperEngineer> ...& having mentioned them... hmmmmmmmm
[15:36] <diddledan> I think the NSA and GCHQ have been monitoring this channel for some time - I'm here
[15:37] <diddledan> surely my presence is enough to warrant surveilance, no?
[15:37] <mapps> ;]
[15:38] <SuperEngineer> diddledan [no, probably only the crime squad]  :D
[15:39]  * SuperEngineer likes Gregg Proops advice to all peeps who send him mail following his podcast... add a little hate message for the NSA
[15:40] <SuperEngineer> [last one was "if you're going to do that in the office - clean up after you]
[15:41] <SuperEngineer> expletives deleted of course
[15:52] <mapps> itd be ok to leave a raspberry pi on for 6months while im away wouldnt it?
[15:52] <diddledan> yeah
[15:52] <mapps> just wanted to leave squid and openVPN running on it so i can use stuff like bbc iplayer
[15:52] <mapps> 4od
[15:53] <mapps> etc
[15:53] <mapps> i thought about leaving my dell desktop (old machine i use as server) but i feel its a bad idea?
[15:53] <diddledan> at 5volt/1amp it'll barely register on any leccy bill
[15:53] <mapps> im not meaning that
[15:53] <mapps> i mean like no chance of a fire or something
[15:53] <mapps> leaving my old dell desktop on for 6-12months would be dodgy?
[16:13] <daftykins> i was rudely awoken today my a stern knock at the door
[16:13] <daftykins> i dragged myself out of bed which was quite painful due to not having had my morning pain meds yet, and high-tailed it down there
[16:13] <daftykins> nobody on the street, too slow =|
[16:14] <SuperEngineer> yeah gads! I'm either running my pooters on coal or someone locally just lit a coal fire -and I'm *not* running pooters on coal!
[16:14] <daftykins> then again later! caught him that time though, all for a pesky gas meter reader =|
[16:14] <daftykins> SuperEngineer: feeling some heat?
[16:14] <SuperEngineer> pooooooooh!
[16:14] <daftykins> Winnie, the?
[16:14] <SuperEngineer> daftykins: nah - smelling the smell
[16:14] <daftykins> ah i see
[16:14] <SuperEngineer> lol
[16:17]  * SuperEngineer hears sheep bleating - assume they don't like the smell either
[16:18] <bigcalm> Are there any better Markdown editors than ReText?
[16:19] <daftykins> just sent a client an email to see if they'll read the serial number off a NAS i put in for them so i can get the £35 rebate - fingers crossed!
[16:20] <SuperEngineer> you hum it - I'll sing it!
[16:20]  * daftykins blinks
[16:20] <SuperEngineer> ^ for bigcalm
[16:20] <daftykins> i want what SuperEngineer's having
[16:21] <bigcalm> SuperEngineer: you've lost me
[16:21] <SuperEngineer> daftykins: it's called "on leave" - it's a rare earth material
[16:21] <daftykins> mmm leaves
[16:22] <SuperEngineer> spoil sport
[16:23] <SuperEngineer> ..but honest - no leaves [well tobacco is/are leaves I sippose - but nowt else
[16:24] <SuperEngineer> [don't worry - I'm off to see daughter tomorrow - i'll you in peace then ;)  ]
[16:24] <SuperEngineer> *leave you
[16:24] <daftykins> lol
[16:25] <daftykins> i'm playing some more Destiny on my new xbox one which i bought yesterday
[16:25] <SuperEngineer> did you choose destiny or was that the "enforced" freebie?
[16:26] <daftykins> choice yeah, it was on offer
[16:26] <SuperEngineer> nice one!
[16:26] <daftykins> they had none of the consoles in with the silly Kinect device so i thought meh, no harm in getting the one without :D
[16:26] <daftykins> so i got the console + game for £291
[16:27] <SuperEngineer> yeh - less chance of NSA looking at the silly faces we make when playing games
[16:28] <daftykins> :D
[16:28] <daftykins> agreed
[16:28] <daftykins> but i really don't get this voice control fascination
[16:28] <daftykins> it's totally unpleasant to me, i never even found myself wanting to try it on my smartphone
[16:28] <SuperEngineer> £291?!!! - ypu could have given me £100 and I'd have given you an ex-box!
[16:29] <SuperEngineer> emphasis on *ex*-box
[16:29] <SuperEngineer> :D
[16:29] <daftykins> that'll be my VAT-less benefit yeah ;)
[16:29] <daftykins> i am quite impressed by HMV Guernsey, they were practically within £3 of amazon UK's price
[16:30] <SuperEngineer> wow - also impressed
[16:30] <daftykins> so i figured i'd prefer walking the ~150m rather than waiting for delivery :D
[16:32] <SuperEngineer> I can do the £/metre maths there - that's good value
[16:34] <daftykins> :D
[16:34] <daftykins> i did have to carry it in my one good arm mind you ;)
[16:35] <daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/hhdxqw6zm40opvo/AABr7vB7JayyUR60cxW8YERAa?dl=0
[16:37] <popey> I'm with daftykins
[16:37] <popey> voice control. pah
[16:38] <directhex> but for skyrim?
[16:38] <directhex> fus ro DAH!
[16:40] <bigcalm> Where are .desktop files stored globally?
[16:41] <bigcalm> Oh, found them, ta
[16:47] <bigcalm> So, anybody used uberwriter? :)
[16:48] <popey> looks like pyroom
[16:49] <bigcalm> I'm trying to find a decent Markdown editor that will allow me to include CSS when exporting to HTML
[16:49] <bigcalm> Uberwriter does so, but it's a bit buggy
[16:49] <popey> patches welcome
[16:49] <popey> ☻
[16:49] <bigcalm> ReText isn't buggy but doesn't offer that option
[16:49] <intrbiz> bigcalm: have you looked at somethink like jekyl?
[16:49] <bigcalm> intrbiz: is that a KDE app?
[16:50] <intrbiz> bigcalm: where you can apply templates to the MD, nah its a Ruby servery thingy
[16:50] <intrbiz> bigcalm: it what github uses to do their pages stuff - http://jekyllrb.com/
[16:51] <bigcalm> Ah. Looks overkill, but I'll have a play with it. Ta :)
[16:52] <intrbiz> bigcalm: MD does allow you to inline HTML, should you might be able to cheat and munge in a style block
[16:54] <Pendulum> daftykins: I do like that voice control makes things more accessible to disabled people. Personally, I have a love/hate relationship.
[17:01] <davmor2> bigcalm: emacs, emacs does everything, or vim vim does everything :D
[17:05] <davmor2> bigcalm: have you had a look at sublime I think there are a few people using that.
[17:05] <bigcalm> davmor2: I thought sublime was Mac only
[17:06] <davmor2> bigcalm: pass
[17:06] <davmor2> bigcalm: http://www.sublimetext.com/2
[17:06] <bigcalm> Ta
[17:07] <davmor2> bigcalm: I don't know what it can do and not do I just see it's name banded around by devs
[17:07] <bigcalm> $70
[17:08] <bigcalm> I'll see if my current IDE can export MD to HTML
[17:09] <davmor2> bigcalm: it does say free for evaluation it doesn't say how long evaluation is :)
[18:21] <MartijnVdS> http://www.commitstrip.com/en/2014/09/10/guilty-sales-guy/
[19:11] <popey> anyone know someone into debian packaging who wants some contract work? https://plus.google.com/u/0/116915640151584325691/posts/PYh6TGSGZEJ
[19:29] <ujjain> Are sleeping at work and playing pc games at work valid rasons to get fired?
[19:30] <daftykins> no to the first if you're in Japan, but i'd hope so for the majority of cases :D
[19:32] <popey> Depends if there's guidelines that say don't do either of those things.
[19:33] <popey> I saw an article recently about Googlers who sleep at work to avoid paying rent
[19:33] <popey> and I know people who play games at work, but they work for game developers... sooo....
[19:33] <daftykins> haha
[19:34] <daftykins> hmm just grep'd that leaked gmail password text file for my addy and some others
[19:34] <daftykins> no sign
[19:34] <daftykins> thankfully
[19:34] <ujjain> our guidelines say we can be subjected to drug tests
[19:34] <ujjain> not that I use drugs, but still seems like you should be able to do what you want in your free time
[19:35] <ujjain> yeah, my gmail address wasnt in the list either, fortunately
[19:35] <ujjain> although I use a unique password for my gmail address that I dont use anywhere else
[19:42] <daftykins> a friend did research work in Japan, it's considered a high mark of professionalism to have fallen asleep at your desk
[19:42] <daftykins> what with the crazy hours they put in, etc
[19:43] <ujjain> hmm, but everybody is so close to eachother at my company
[19:44] <ujjain> I couldn´t, but I hear stories about people arriving 3am at the company after going and waking up at 8am and work
[19:44] <shauno> I don't seem to get in trouble for napping.  I get in trouble for snoring.  apparently that makes the difference.
[19:44] <ujjain> ah me too, buffalo ujjain :(
[19:45] <daftykins> XD
[19:46] <shauno> the difference seems to be we can nap if there's no-one in sight.  but I can't snore unless the floor (and the floor below) are empty :/
[19:48] <ujjain> they can make silencers for bazooka´s, why not for me :-( I´m sure I make less sound than them


[11:15] <thorwil> flan, nisshh, vish: http://www.foopics.com/showfull/cb9b56043d6a15f0c3e3cef29f89b63b
[11:26] <vish> thorwil: interesting.. but i seem to have forgotten what we wanted for quickshot..
[11:26] <vish> an icon?
[11:28]  * vish should stop being everywhere , and start to FOCUS! :(
[11:49] <thorwil> vish: well, this is an icon ;)
[11:49] <thorwil> vish: why? it feels familiar everywhere because you are already there!!
[11:49] <vish> ;p
[13:03] <nisshh> thorwil: whats that picture about?
[13:04] <thorwil> nisshh: i could bet you saw a draft, that you would have to ask puzzles me
[13:05] <nisshh> thorwil: im talking about the link you pinged me about 2 hours ago
[13:05] <nisshh> i was afk
[13:08] <thorwil> nisshh: quickshot icon
[13:09] <nisshh> thorwil: ah, ok
[15:12] <flan> Works for me, thorwil.
[15:12] <thorwil> cool
[15:13] <flan> Once you've finalized it, can I get a favicon version, too? (It can probably be the samea s the icon for window managers)
[15:14] <flan> I can just generate one myself from the full-size reference, if needed, though.
[15:15] <flan> Oh. And the server needs a logo. It could, if this is aesthetically acceptable to you, be that, with "Quickshot" written in a neutral font to the right. Maybe. (I dunno. I'm not a designer)
[15:15] <flan> http://flan.uguu.ca:5000/ump/10-04 Just something to sit in the top left corner so it doesn't seem so bland.
[15:16] <flan> I'll be tweaking the CSS based on feedback from users during the Maverick run, so the colours and sizing aren't finalized or anything.
[15:17] <thorwil> ok
[16:36] <daker> godbyk, ping
[19:06] <jenkins> hey flan
[19:06] <flan> Hi.
[19:06] <jenkins> am i ok to push stuff to the branch
[19:07] <flan> Yep. I won't be making any changes until I get home anyway.
[19:07] <flan> And, even if I were, I could just pull before committing.
[19:07] <flan> You shouldn't ever need to ask.
[19:07] <flan> Oh. I've got someone who's willing to help rewrite and test the library functions.
[19:08] <jenkins> cool who?
[19:08] <flan> So I'll probably invite him to join until we're at 1.0.
[19:08] <flan> Just a friend I know from other venues. He's new to Python, but he's pretty meticulous about quality.
[19:09] <jenkins> ok cool sounds good
[19:09] <flan> He's just gonna write the user-status-screening and WM-integration stuff while I work on the UI-to-library bindings and event logic.
[19:09] <flan> While you work on the layout and appearance stuff.
[19:10] <thorwil> jenkins: hi! http://www.foopics.com/showfull/cb9b56043d6a15f0c3e3cef29f89b63b
[19:10] <jenkins> thorwil: looks great! can we play with the back ground colours? 3 different ones may be
[19:11] <jenkins> be back in 10 mins being called to dry up
[19:12] <thorwil> jenkins: ty. better not. i think of the 3 shots as being in one series, so theme doesn't change, just windows
[19:13] <flan> Ia gree.
[19:13] <flan> Iagr ee.
[19:14] <jenkins> k makes sense
[19:15] <jenkins> but can you make the arrows and the camera more distinct?
[19:15] <jenkins> I am really pleased with thoses thorwil
[19:16] <thorwil> jenkins: i could. maybe i will. though i made them subtle to not distract and also because the smaller sizes don't have those details at all
[19:18] <jenkins> I see your point it, I think it depends on the angle of my laptop screen, I will print it out tomorrow and have a look.
[19:19] <jenkins> can you e-mail/put in the branch a 48px one please ?
[19:19] <flan> Are we replacing the existing logo with this one? Or using them side-by-side?
[19:20] <flan> (The existing one is heavily pro-Ubuntu, but it *is* pretty)
[19:20] <flan> (This one is nice and neutral and clean)
[19:22] <jenkins> I think this is the icon not a logo . iirc
[19:22] <flan> Sorry. That's what I meant to imply by "side-by-side".
[19:22] <jenkins> well we need to come up with a logo basically
[19:24] <thorwil> jenkins: https://code.launchpad.net/~t-w-/+junk/quickshot_art
[19:26] <jenkins> thanks thorwil
[19:26] <jenkins> pidgin crashed
[19:39] <jenkins> flan: how do i get a url to appear like the one here imagebin.org/112417
[19:39] <jenkins> http://http://imagebin.org/112417
[19:40] <jenkins> http://imagebin.org/112417
[19:40] <flan> http://www.pygtk.org/docs/pygtk/class-gtklinkbutton.html
[19:40] <flan> Glade should have it in its toolbox.
[19:41] <flan> Note that the project's URL will not always be displayable.
[19:41] <flan> And there may be up to three URLs.
[19:41] <flan> How you present them is up to you.
[19:41] <flan> (If you even want to present all of them)
[19:42] <flan> Quickshot project URL (not exposed if the project isn't public), version homepage (may not be defined), project homepage (may not be defined)
[19:42] <jenkins> I thought I would just but quickshot.org there?
[19:42] <flan> Oh. Yes, you can do that, too.
[19:43] <jenkins> thanks flan i had found that button but not the setting to make it look like a noraml window but have now
[19:44] <flan> Where are you packing it? (On the welcome screen, I presume, but where?)
[19:45] <jenkins> i am doing the about window :P the most un important one
[19:45] <flan> As fro project/progress URLs, just give me a vbox on the screenshot-list window with two panels in it. I'll rip them out and put URLs in their place, if they're defined.
[19:45] <flan> Ah.
[19:45] <flan> That works.
[19:46] <flan> Rip them out in code*
[19:46] <flan> Part of the reason why GTK's box model is so useful.
[19:46] <flan> And why I'll nag you about the importance of using it to group related content.
[19:46] <jenkins> I know its not an important window but I had the urge to do it. I saw your changes and I can see why it makes sense
[19:47] <flan> The about window is important.
[19:47] <flan> It's just not crucial.
[19:48] <jenkins> I will do the resolution ones as well just can't decide on how to improve over last time
[19:48] <flan> Embed the progress bar in the page itself.
[19:48] <flan> Instead of making a pop-up.
[19:48] <flan> Just put a GTK progress bar in it (one of the "I dunno how long this'll take" ones.
[19:49] <flan> We can show it dynamically once the process begins.
[19:49] <flan> Assuming the process takes long enough to warrant the use of the bar.
[19:49] <flan> I can't remember if it was fast or slow before.
[19:51] <flan> In any case, it's basically just going to say "This project, <name>, requires that screenshots are captured at a resolution of XxY. Something, something. We change things now!"
[19:51] <flan> Oh. I remember what the delay was.
[19:51] <flan> Installing disper.
[19:51] <flan> Are we making that a dependency of the .deb to avoid it?
[19:51] <jenkins> it was slow last time but it will be fast as I have changed the way the graphics driver is detected. i would like to make it a dependency
[19:51] <flan> Until we can look at its code and find the right stuff to run ourselves.
[19:52] <jenkins> yep
[19:52] <flan> If it's fast, no progress bar.
[19:53] <flan> See if you can prototype that window and the user details window by the end of today. I'll try to get the UI flow advancing to the screenshot list.
[19:53] <jenkins> that window is there already
[19:53] <flan> I mean so that it has only the buttons and stuff that we need.
[19:54] <flan> It's kinda hard to go back once that point's been passed.
[19:54] <jenkins> and the screenshot list one is done and the screenshot detail one
[19:54] <flan> It really just has "Okay" and "Bail".
[19:54] <jenkins> I wil adjust them
[19:55] <flan> Screenshot details may get some tweaking once I get there, since there are more/different/stuff options than before. I won't get to it until this weekend, though, so we can probably discuss changes and work on its pieces concurrently.
[19:55] <jenkins> http://imagebin.org/112420 is what I was going to use for the user to comfirm that the change has been made correctly so it is standard gnome stuff.
[19:55] <jenkins> cool sounds good
[19:56] <flan> Same with the username-change. Once the user's been created, Quickshot will have to close before the user can continue. It's a window that kinda creates a dead end if it ever appears.
[19:56] <flan> Looks good.
[19:56] <flan> Probably just tweak the wrap-points.
[19:56] <flan> But I like it.
[19:56] <flan> Is Maverick going with orange to indicate active buttons?
[19:56] <jenkins> yep
[19:57] <flan> active/selected/default
[19:57] <flan> Kinda ugly, but whatever.
[19:57]  * flan isn't an art guy.
[19:57] <flan> Wait... Wait...
[19:57] <flan> Is that dock standard?
[19:58] <jenkins> no thats awn
[19:58] <flan> 'Kay.
[19:58] <flan> The dock is one of the things I like least about using my Mac.
[19:59] <flan> (Not because it's impractical, but because it's an inefficient use of space)
[19:59] <jenkins> i auto hide it
[19:59] <flan> Same.
[19:59] <Muscovy> I like to switch between dock and window buttons every few months.
[19:59] <flan> But then I lose the ability to see what I have open at a glance.
[19:59] <Muscovy> Docks are better for when I'm working with a lot of applications, I find.
[20:00] <flan> It's a very intuitive design, but it's not well-suited to my mindset.
[20:00] <Muscovy> You seen Gnome 3 yet? :P
[20:00] <flan> I've been avoiding it.
[20:00] <Muscovy> I've been using it, after I got over my initial shock.
[20:01] <flan> I mean I've been avoiding all news of it.
[20:01] <flan> I want to be surprised.
[20:01] <Muscovy> Ah. XD
[20:01] <thorwil> flan, jenkins: playing around with logo ideas: http://www.foopics.com/showfull/456df83df6c2d6df882e2af8261ba970
[20:01] <Muscovy> I won't spoil it then.
[20:01] <Muscovy> Those are neat logos.
[20:01] <Muscovy> I like the first and third.
[20:01] <jenkins> I like the third one :)
[20:02] <flan> The second one's brilliant, but I'd go with the third.
[20:02] <jenkins> I can't decide on gnome 3 I am waiting untill it is nearer reles
[20:02] <jenkins> *release
[20:03] <jenkins> third one has got me excited
[20:03] <thorwil> ok, so i will tweak the 3rd on another day
[20:03] <flan> The second'd be my pick if it weren't just a tad too subtle.
[20:04] <flan> But I can't see a way to un-subtle it.
[20:04] <flan> Short of moving the hybrid to the right.
[20:05] <thorwil> using 2 colors and no split on the S should help the 2nd
[20:06] <flan> Yeah... that might work.
[20:06] <flan> Except it'd be three colours, wouldn't it?
[20:07] <flan> Unless the Q becomes an outline.
[21:14] <daker> flan, ping
[21:45] <flan> Hi.
[21:45] <flan> daker, pong.
[21:46] <Muscovy> What's with the pingpongs?
[21:46] <daker> it's fine, just want to ask question how we can login to qs board
[21:47] <daker> so i used my lp openid
[21:47] <flan> I'd just need to add you as a project owner.
[21:47] <flan> I'll add everyone who's interested after I reset the database.
[21:47] <flan> (In preparation for 10.10)
[21:48] <daker> we should ask humphreybc to design something for the qs board
[21:48] <flan> Wait... Which board?
[21:48] <flan> I thought you meant my staging site.
[21:48] <flan> Which will probably be used for the next manual release.
[21:49] <daker> yes
[21:49] <flan> (I doubt I'll be ready to hand it to godbyk until after 1.0.0)
[21:49] <daker> & for other projects :)
[21:49] <flan> There's not really much to design... It's a backend to the client.
[21:49] <flan> Again, it's not intended for public perusal.
[21:49] <flan> It's just meant for administrators to approve and download screenshots.
[21:50] <daker> ah oki
[21:50] <flan> It's a very utilitarian concept.
[21:50] <flan> The quickshot.org page will be a lot more general-user-oriented.
[21:50] <daker> but it's should provide other things
[21:50] <flan> My server's basically justa  glorified database with a special protocol.
[21:51] <daker> project activity, how many screenshot has been taken by hour, by day for each user
[21:52] <flan> ...But why? It's not a social networking system.
[21:52] <flan> It's just a filesystem + database, intended to facilitate the execution of a task.
[21:53] <flan> Can you identify a benefit of indicating project activity levels?
[21:54] <daker> i don't know it's just an idea :)
[21:57] <daker> if i understand what you said, the stagging site will be just a backend for the projects owners ?
[21:58] <flan> Yep.
[21:58] <flan> It'll have some degree of public visibility, but only as much as is needed for people to decide which languages need their attention.
[21:58] <flan> And then only if the project is public.
[21:59] <flan> For all we know, someone might set up a project to so they have a checklist of things they need to capture for a school project.
[21:59] <flan> just so*
[21:59] <daker> i understand
[22:00] <flan> Whatever you see at http://flan.uguu.ca:5000/ump/10-04 is about as much as I can imagine a contributor ever needing to see.
[22:00] <flan> The system is flexible, so we can add more later.
[22:01] <flan> But, from my ancient mindset of minimalism-is-good-so-build-stuff-as-a-component-that-can-be-harnessed-by-other-stuff, this seems like the right way to do things.
[22:02] <flan> An aggregator, like the quickshot.org site, can get enough information from the backend servers to calculate activity levels, general rates of completion, and user helpfulness to display it in a more engaging manner.
[22:02] <flan> The quickshot.org site won't need to host any of the data itself, aside from deltas, because it's essentially all offered as a service by any known suppliers.
[22:03] <flan> The backends retain their one simple purpose, the aggregators layer on top of them, and then a super-aggregator could be built on top of the aggregators.
[22:03]  * flan likes layers.
[22:06] <flan> Note: Suppliers of information could be resolved by indexing/scanning the .qsproj files that are submitted to the site's bulletin board. The model's design allows for easy information-scraping.
[22:06] <flan> (I don't like proprietary or undiscoverable anything)
[22:07] <flan> </rant?
[22:08] <jenkins> flan: please let me know what else you would like me to do tomorrow night
[22:08] <flan> Can do. Mostly, it's just a matter of getting the usability logic of the GUIs out of the way.
[22:09] <jenkins> please make a list and I will do anything needed
[22:09] <flan> Then (re)building the basic libraries behind them (which is what Wetbox^3 will help me with), and then binding everything together (which is what I'll do).
[22:09] <flan> I'll just keep memo-spamming you.
[22:09] <jenkins> yep sounds good spam!
[22:09] <flan> Yay for spam!
[22:09] <flan> G'night~
[22:10] <jenkins> thnaks flan night
[22:58] <daker> dutchie, ping