[07:43] <dpm> good morning all
[07:44] <happyaron> dpm: morning!
[07:46] <happyaron> dpm: could you have a look at bug 659280?
[07:46] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 659280 in poppler-data (Ubuntu) (and 3 other projects) "subject: Remove the string tags include Bitstream Vera、DejaVu inside in the setting file /etc/fonts/conf.avail/69-language-selector-zh-xy.conf where xy represents cn, hk, mo, sg and tw individually. (affects: 2) (heat: 38)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/659280
[07:48] <dpm> hi happyaron, good morning. Just a few minutes, I need to reboot. brb...
[07:50] <happyaron> :)
[07:58] <dpm> good morning again :)
[07:58] <happyaron> :)
[07:59] <happyaron> the bug I mentioned just now is bug 659280
[07:59] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 659280 in poppler-data (Ubuntu) (and 3 other projects) "subject: Remove the string tags include Bitstream Vera、DejaVu inside in the setting file /etc/fonts/conf.avail/69-language-selector-zh-xy.conf where xy represents cn, hk, mo, sg and tw individually. (affects: 2) (heat: 38)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/659280
[08:00] <dpm> reading...
[08:02] <dpm> happyaron, so as far as I understand, there is no agreement in how to fix this?
[08:02] <happyaron> no
[08:03] <happyaron> there are two opinions: fix it by changing fontconfig configuration so PDFs can work, but typefaces would be uglier; wait to fix it in poppler-data and all other applications that does not work as expected.
[08:05] <dpm> happyaron, the thing is that we don't have a font expert anymore, and I'm not knowledgeable enough to propose a solution in this case. Right now, it is a bit difficult to follow with all the opinions. Do you think you could add a comment with a summary of the two alternatives, with pros and cons of each one?
[08:06] <happyaron> dpm: I've tried to do that, but in fact the bug reporters are also arguing about which to choose on their forum.
[08:07] <happyaron> you can only see few people write on that bug report because he's just a translator who summarize things on their forum.
[08:08] <happyaron> I tried to read their forum posts, and they do not have an agreement either. personally I prefer to fix the problem in poppler-data, but unfortunately I cannot reproduce the bug in Debian so not sure whether I can forward it to Debian.
[08:10] <dpm> happyaron, still, I think you have a good overview on this. If someone who either does not speak Chinese or doesn't follow those forums would definitely get confused with all the current comments. I'm not saying it's the solution, but I think such a comment with a summary would help
[08:12] <happyaron> dpm: okay, I'll make the summary. But I think it's really an issue to be fixed. As far as I know most research papers in Chinese cannot be rendered correctly due to this issue, either zh_CN or zh_TW. I don't know the situation about Japanese and Korean.
[08:13] <dpm> happyaron, is freeflying aware of this bug?
[08:13] <happyaron> the special case in those research papers is they don't embed Chinese fonts to the PDF file, and our current settings cannot handle it at all.
[08:13] <happyaron> dpm: not sure
[08:14] <dpm> I'll point it to him, but as I say, right now all the comments make it a bit confusing (and the title of the bug, especially). The clearer it is, the easier it will be for someone to fix
[08:16] <dpm> You've got a good understanding of the bug, do you think you could come up with a better title, e.g. "Cannot render PDFs without embedded fonts in Chinese and other languages" or something along the lines?
[08:17] <happyaron> I'll try to make it clear for people who don't speak Chinese, but I failed to figure out why Debian works but Ubuntu does not (with same appearance on users experience, but not the same configuration files)
[08:17] <happyaron> OK, let me try
[08:19] <dpm> thanks happyaron
[09:28] <happyaron> dpm: done
[09:28] <happyaron> We'd move one to seek an expert to solve the problem.
[09:29] <dpm> thanks happyaron, it looks much better now
[09:29] <dpm> I'll point freeflying to it too
[09:29] <happyaron> :)
[10:57] <dpm> hi TLE, how are you doing? I sent you an e-mail about the language packs spec, have you had the chance to look at it?
[11:32] <happyaron> dpm: personally I think we'd find someone knows about poppler and poppler-data
[11:46] <dpm> happyaron, I'll look into it, but I cannot promise anything. I'm not familiar with it and I don't know anyone who is
[11:47] <dpm> you might want to ask around in #ubuntu-devel or in #ubuntu-desktop
[11:53] <happyaron> thanks
[11:56] <TLE> dpm: hallo
[11:57] <dpm> hey :)
[11:57] <TLE> yes I saw your email
[11:57] <TLE> I agree with you and it should just be done
[11:58] <TLE> I can handle it myself and I think I should have time to do it tomorrow
[11:58] <dpm> that sounds excellent, thanks
[11:58] <TLE> np
[12:00] <dpm> I'm looking forward to announcing this, it will address an important issue that hadn't been handled properly for a looong time.
[12:00] <dpm> great work
[12:01] <andrejz> @dpm: what is this about?
[12:06] <dpm> andrejz, the language pack updates policy spec Kenneth has been working on -> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/ubuntutheproject-community-n-translations-training-sessions
[12:12] <andrejz> cool
[12:15] <dpm> :)
[14:49] <dpm> hi everyone, Translations training session starting in ~10 minutes, feel free to join in!
[15:01] <dpm_> Hi everyone!
[15:01] <dpm_> Welcome to the first ever Translations Training Session :)
[15:01] <dpm_> we'll wait a couple of minutes to see if there are any late-comers
[15:05] <dpm_> ok, let's get started
[15:05] <dpm_> Let's see who's here, any new translators around?
[15:07] <dpm_> ok, first of all, a few words about these sessions.
[15:07] <dpm_> Here's how they will work:
[15:07] <dpm_> We'll be running IRC sessions every two weeks, covering different topics on each one, all related to different aspects of translating Ubuntu.
[15:08] <dpm_> The main goal is to help new translators giving them a quickstart on how to start contributing,
[15:08] <dpm_> but we will also cover topics that can be of interest to more experienced translators or to people starting to create a new translation team.
[15:09] <dpm_> As such, the range of topics will be broad. We've got a bunch of suggestions here:
[15:09] <dpm_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/Training/Suggestions
[15:09] <dpm_> and I encourage you to add your own suggestions on that page,
[15:09] <dpm_> so we can make this more personal and tailor the sessions to what you think it is important to know as a translator.
[15:10] <dpm_> When we run out of topics, we can repeat them again, as there are always new translators willing to learn :)
[15:10] <dpm_> Eventually, I'd like the resources created during these sessions (translations training projects in Launchpad, session logs, session outlines) to be useful for each local translation team
[15:11] <dpm_> to reuse them to run sessions in their language
[15:11] <dpm_> But enough introductory talk. Let's get started.
[15:12] <dpm_> * What we'll learn today: we'll focus on describing and using the Launchpad Translations web interface, which is what you'll be using to translate Ubuntu
[15:12] <dpm_>
[15:12] <dpm_> The Translations Web UI
[15:12] <dpm_> -----------------------
[15:12] <dpm_> Generally, you'd be going to http://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu to translate your favourite distro
[15:13] <dpm_> But today we'll be using a kind of a playground project in Launchpad,
[15:13] <dpm_> so you can start playing around with translations and submitting data without the worry of sending or overwriting real translation data.
[15:14] <dpm_> Here it is:
[15:14] <dpm_> https://translations.launchpad.net/translations-training/trunk/+pots/translate-this
[15:14] <dpm_> The Translations Training project
[15:14] <dpm_> So if you all go there, we'll first start looking at all of the elements of the UI.
[15:15] <dpm_> Go and click on the name of your language in that page, which should take you to the translatable messages.
[15:15] <dpm_> For example in my case (Catalan), it takes me to:
[15:15] <dpm_> https://translations.launchpad.net/translations-training/trunk/+pots/translate-this/ca/+translate
[15:16] <dpm_> Once you are there, click at the little magnifier icon on the far left of the first translatable message.
[15:16] <dpm_> It's the icon with a plus sign (+) on it.
[15:17] <dpm_> If you cannot find it, don't worry, you can just go to the Catalan version here:
[15:17] <dpm_> https://translations.launchpad.net/translations-training/trunk/+pots/translate-this/ca/1/+translate
[15:17] <dpm_> Ok, so we're all set now, and we can start having a look at all the UI elements.
[15:18] <dpm_> Here are the most important:
[15:18] <dpm_> 1. The original English message.
[15:18] <dpm_> That is the message on top, which says "My first ever translation".
[15:19] <dpm_> This is the message you'll have to translate into your language.
[15:19] <dpm_> We'll be calling this the original message or string (as in a string of characters),
[15:19] <dpm_> and it will be always in English.
[15:19] <dpm_> So you will in principle only need knowledge of English and the language you are trying to translate into
[15:20] <dpm_> 2. The translators comment.
[15:20] <dpm_> You'll see this text right below the original English message, next to a small info {i} icon.
[15:20] <dpm_> These are messages that are written by developers to give additional information to translators as to the context of the message.
[15:21] <dpm_> These are really useful to provide accurate translations, especially when the original text can be ambiguous
[15:21] <dpm_> 3. Current translation.
[15:21] <dpm_> Shown below the translators comment, this shows the current translation, if any, into the local language.
[15:21] <dpm_> If there isn't any translation, it will show the text "(no translation yet)".
[15:22] <dpm_> You'll see it's got a radio button, so that you can select the appropriate translation in case there are already translation suggestions (more on this below).
[15:22] <dpm_> 4. Translation suggestions.
[15:23] <dpm_> Right below the current translation, there is a space with radio buttons where translation suggestions (if any) are shown.
[15:24] <dpm_> You will not see this if there haven't been any suggestions yet.
[15:24] <dpm_> Translation suggestions are either translations that contributors have provided directly, or that have been found in other projects in Launchpad.
[15:24] <dpm_> Launchpad is quite clever on this, and if it finds the same original message in any of the hosted projects, it will show it as a suggestion automatically for you.
[15:25] <dpm_> meaning it will show the translations for the original message as a suggestion
[15:26] <dpm_> Suggestions are quite a cool feature: they allow you to basically do "point and click" translation and save you a lot of work.
[15:26] <dpm_> They will also allow you to ensure the quality of translations through review (more on this below).
[15:27] <dpm_> You can also dismiss suggestions by ticking the "Dismiss all suggestions above" checkbox and committing the change by pressing the "Save & Continue" button.
[15:27] <dpm_> 5. New translation.
[15:27] <dpm_> This is the interesting part.
[15:28] <dpm_> On this textbox you'll be able to submit your translations, which can be direct ones or suggestions - depending on the permissions of the translatable project and on your team membership.
[15:28] <dpm_> It might show an expander at the end of it, which you can click in case you need to expand the text box to provide a longer translation
[15:28] <dpm_> 6. Needs Review checkbox.
[15:29] <dpm_> Right below the "New translation" text field, you'll see the "Someone should review this translation" checkbox.
[15:29] <dpm_> You can use this to let reviewers look at your translations before they are accepted.
[15:29] <dpm_> This is generally recommended for translation quality, as the reviewers will spot mistakes, typos and inconsistencies, and will help you getting translations right before they are released to users.
[15:30] <dpm_> You will learn a lot from reviews, so I encourage you to get your translations reviewed by contacting the team responsible for your language
[15:30] <dpm_> or to do reviews yourself
[15:31] <dpm_> Ticking this checkbox and pressing the "Save & Continue" button will make your translations be submitted as suggestions, and applies only if you are already a member of a translation team.
[15:31] <dpm_> If you are not yet, your translations will be submitted as suggestions always, without the need to tick that box.
[15:32] <dpm_> As an example, you can see several suggestions, not yet reviewed and accepted, here:
[15:32] <dpm_> https://translations.launchpad.net/translations-training/trunk/+pots/translate-this/ca/1/+translate
[15:33] <dpm_> And here you can see a suggestion which has been reviewed and accepted:
[15:33] <dpm_> https://translations.launchpad.net/translations-training/trunk/+pots/translate-this/ca/2/+translate
[15:33] <dpm_> Notice how Launchpad properly credits both the translator and the reviewer.
[15:34] <dpm_> 7. Source code reference.
[15:34] <dpm_> Below the Needs Review checkbox you'll see a smaller text telling you where in the code for the program the string appears.
[15:35] <dpm_> You shouldn't worry much about that, but in some cases,
[15:35] <dpm_> this can be really useful to find out which file the string belongs to, or it might give you a hint to what kind of translation that is, depending on the type of file
[15:35] <dpm_> 8. Zoom.
[15:35] <dpm_> You've used this already, and it's the magnifier icon with the plus (+) or minus (-)
[15:36] <dpm_> on the far left of the translatable message
[15:36] <dpm_> If you click on it, it will let you switch between the single message view or all translatable messages view.
[15:36] <dpm_> Useful to concentrate on a difficult translation or to get the URL to a particular message you want to point out to (i.e. for review or to show someone a particular translation).
[15:37] <dpm_> 9. Copy text.
[15:37] <dpm_> That's the arrow icon right to the left of the translatable message.
[15:37] <dpm_> It provides a shortcut to be able to just copying the original text into the translation field
[15:37] <dpm_> without having to retype the message
[15:38] <dpm_> This comes in quite handy when the translation is actually the same as the original
[15:39] <dpm_> i.e. it is actually not translated. This happens in the names of programs, acronyms, names of programming languages, etc.
[15:39] <dpm_> 10. "Save & Continue" button.
[15:39] <dpm_> That is a key part of the UI.
[15:39] <dpm_> The moment you press it, your translations or suggestions are saved in the Launchpad database.
[15:39] <dpm_> This allows you coming back at a later time to review them and they will be right there where you left them last time.
[15:40] <dpm_> You don't have to complete all translations in a page
[15:40] <dpm_> you can press it at any time and it will save only the ones you've made.
[15:41] <dpm_> Ok, so that has covered the most important UI elements of the Launchpad Translations interface.
[15:41] <dpm_> I tried to detail each one of them, but you'll see that they are quite intuitive and it will just take you a couple of minutes to get used to them.
[15:41] <dpm_> -> Any questions so far?
[15:42] <dpm_> ok, let's move on
[15:42] <dpm_> Doing Your First Translations
[15:42] <dpm_> -----------------------------
[15:42] <dpm_> So now for the fun part.
[15:42] <dpm_> The translations-training project is thought for you to experiment with translations and with all the UI elements.
[15:43] <dpm_> It's thought of as a hands-on tutorial, as the translator comments will tell you more about the particular translation
[15:43] <dpm_> and help you learn more about elements of translation.
[15:43] <dpm_> It has just a few translatable messages now, but we'll be adding more in future sessions.
[15:44] <dpm_> If you are not there yet, you can go to
[15:44] <dpm_> https://translations.launchpad.net/translations-training
[15:44] <dpm_> Then click on your language and start submitting your translation suggestions.
[15:44] <dpm_> Right now the project is set up with Restricted permissions, in the same way Ubuntu is.
[15:45] <dpm_> This means that you can only submit direct translations if you are a member of an approved translation team,
[15:45] <dpm_> but you'll always be able to submit translation suggestions.
[15:45] <dpm_> If, after you've tried submitting suggestions you want to see what it's like submitting direct translations, do let me know and I can change the permissions temporarily to Open, so that anyone can do it.
[15:46] <dpm_> So go and play with this project, and do come back if you've got any questions
[15:46] <dpm_> Everything clear so far?
[15:48] <dpm_> So if there aren't any questions, we'll wrap up and leave it here for today, and we'll continue in two weeks time in the next session
[15:48] <dpm_>
[15:48] <dpm_> Summary
[15:48] <dpm_> -------
[15:48] <dpm_> So today we learnt about:
[15:48] <dpm_> * The Launchpad Translations UI elements and how to use them
[15:49] <dpm_> * Submitting translations and suggestions through the Translations Training project in Launchpad: https://translations.launchpad.net/translations-training
[15:50] <dpm_> Next session we can look at the rest of UI elements and to more advanced topics, for example translations workflow: how translation teams work
[15:50] <dpm_> If you've got any questions, feel free to ping me any time on #ubuntu-translators
[15:51] <dpm_> And thanks for reading! :-)


[01:46] <fta> asac, you said you wanted a pet-bug ? ;)
[01:47] <asac> really ;)?
[01:47] <fta> the gtk systray thing...
[01:49] <fta> ok, i updated my ppa scripts so that they accept conf files
[01:49] <fta> one step closer to daily builds
[01:50] <fta> i can update the branches and push to ppa from my server
[01:50] <fta> but i don't build locally yet
[01:51] <fta> i'm not sure i should use my old bot, pbuilder or a full sbuild for that
[01:51] <fta> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~fta/+junk/ppa-scripts/files (update* and sync* are ready)
[01:52] <fta> asac, ^^
[01:53] <fta> asac, i have to check m-d as it seems it's sometimes going backward with hg commit dates
[01:54] <asac> fta: revision ids are supposed to always go forward i think
[01:55] <asac> the time might not ;)
[01:55] <fta> the date is first so it's an issue
[01:55] <asac> fta: i think we shouldnt do a local build first
[01:55] <asac> fta:  just unpack: quilt push -a ... if no error -> go
[01:55] <fta> then the failure rate will be high
[01:56] <asac> welll ... i think most issues are diverged patches
[01:56] <asac> just quilt push would eliminate that
[01:56] <fta> yeah, i often do that when i'm in a hurry or lazy. bzr bdm -e ; cd ../build/whatever ; dquilt push -a
[01:56] <asac> imo thtas ok
[01:57] <asac> i mean one purpose for dailies is regression window narrowing
[01:57] <asac> the other is detecting build issues automatically ;)
[01:57] <asac> well not really a purpose, but a side effect
[01:57] <asac> if we can eliminate most issues by testing quilt push
[01:58] <asac> that should be ok until someone complains
[02:01] <fta> also, the *.head branches will grow faster once this is on
[02:03] <asac> fta: do we really commit stuff for daily builds?
[02:03] <asac> wouldnt just bumping version be enough?
[02:03] <asac> i mean in case it fails we can hopefulyl reproduce with just that version info
[02:07] <fta> not sure.. the daily branch has a value, but i don't want to force the scripts merge from *.head, too many chances of conflicts, meaning the bot is stuck until someone fixes the daily branch
[02:08] <asac> fta: no. i dont mean daily branch
[02:08] <fta> if the bot updates *.head, he will never conflict, but we may
[02:08] <asac> i just say the daily builders bump version without committing each and every day
[02:08] <asac> based on .head that is
[02:08] <asac> if builders fail we fix head and move on
[02:09] <asac> fix head == fix and commit new checkpoint
[02:09] <asac> aka changelog bump on every required change
[02:09] <asac> and whenever something thinks we should checkpoint (though not sure why to checkpoint if there are no changes)
[02:10] <asac> would that make sens or did i misread the problem
[02:11] <asac> ?
[02:12] <asac> s/something/someone/
[02:12] <fta> i need to think about it a little bit
[02:12] <asac> sorry ... tiresome ;)
[02:12] <asac> yeah. probably not the right time to decide at 3am
[02:16] <asac> fta: imnportant change to ppa notice ... did you get that too?
[02:16] <fta> yes
[02:17] <asac> so 30 days ... done
[02:17] <asac> too bad
[02:17] <fta> 30 days, that means we should probably backup our stuff
[02:17] <asac> yeah
[02:18] <fta> screen scrap the ppa for logs, debs, src..
[02:18] <fta> unless there's enough in the lp python api
[02:18] <asac> fta: from what i read the logs et al are still there
[02:18] <asac> just the bits not
[02:18] <asac> fta: one could probably do ftp synh ;)
[02:19] <asac> and disable removal
[02:19] <asac> local side
[02:19] <asac> i think its easiest to ask for exception from this rule
[02:19] <asac> we want 700 days ;)
[02:19] <fta> lol
[02:20] <asac> how much is 700 days of xul?
[02:20] <asac> with -dbg package its probably 120M a day ;)
[02:20] <fta> but it's not very handy to ask users to grab a bunch of debs from lp for each test
[02:21] <asac> fta: yeah. we would need a wrapper or osmething
[02:22] <fta> something like dget --with-binaries lp:.../*.dsc
[02:23] <fta> --with-binaries=i386
[02:23] <asac> usuually saying apt-get install xulrunner-1.9=version xulrunner-1.9-gnome-support=version should work
[02:23] <fta> only if the files are in the archives
[02:23] <fta> only the last one is
[02:24] <fta> the others are in lp librarian something, and 30 days only
[02:25] <asac> fta: in librarian?
[02:25] <asac> thats easy then ;)
[02:25] <asac> ... to trick
[02:25] <asac> hmmm ... maybe not
[02:25] <fta> i think they added a redirect
[02:26] <fta> yeah, https://edge.launchpad.net/~fta/+archive/ppa/+files/some_random.deb
[02:26] <fta> ex: https://edge.launchpad.net/~fta/+archive/ppa/+files/gwibber_0.7.3~bzr193-0ubuntu1~fta1_i386.deb
[02:27] <fta> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/21661217/gwibber_0.7.3~bzr193-0ubuntu1~fta1_i386.deb
[02:27] <fta> with an HTTP 302
[02:27] <asac> yeah
[02:28] <asac> fta: do you have something that potentially will get removed?
[02:28] <asac> so we can try?
[02:28] <asac> (soon)
[02:28] <fta> what do you mean?
[02:28] <asac> e.g. something longer superseeded or removed
[02:28] <asac> for which we still have the librarian link
[02:28] <fta> https://edge.launchpad.net/~fta/+archive/ppa/+index?field.name_filter=xulrunner-1.9.2&field.status_filter=any&field.series_filter=jaunty
[02:29] <fta> https://edge.launchpad.net/~fta/+archive/ppa/+files/xulrunner-1.9.2_1.9.2~a1~hg20081221r22990+nobinonly-0ubuntu1~fta3_i386.deb
[02:29] <fta> Dec 21
[02:30] <asac> fta: open a bug against sometihng ... put the librarian url of one file init ... and one of a second file, but make it so its not a valid url
[02:30] <fta> ?
[02:30] <asac> with some luck the referenced one will not get removed
[02:30] <fta> and then what? file daily bugs?
[02:31] <fta> lol
[02:31] <asac> hehe
[02:31] <asac> yeah
[02:31] <asac> stupid. would just be fun ;)
[02:31] <asac> to see if they parse those urls
[02:31] <asac> file bug: "keep this daily for now"
[02:31] <asac> ;)
[02:31] <asac> no ... i really think we have to mirror somewhere
[02:31] <asac> if we need more that lets say half a year
[02:31] <fta> you can do it yourself ;)
[02:32] <asac> otherwise we might be able to get an exception
[02:32] <asac> sure. i can start on people.ubuntu.com
[02:32] <asac> at some points there will be a complains
[02:32] <asac> then louder complains
[02:32] <asac> then maybe i get forced to remvoe or we get a dedicated place ;)
[02:33] <asac> anyway. all this can come when daily stuff is working
[02:33] <asac> i can also open a ticket and ask for something more dedicated
[02:33] <asac> for our purpose
[02:33] <asac> but thats easier to do when we have it all runing
[02:34] <asac> and then say: "here is something that is not perfect, lets fix it"
[02:35] <asac> so the fact that 302 works well is really interesting
[02:35] <asac> i will sleep about it ;)
[02:36] <asac> good night
[02:46] <fta> 'night
[10:14] <gnomefreak> I'm back home at least until March (maybe a wedding) or over the summer for vacation(but should have PC with me
[10:19] <gnomefreak> is it me or did they drop seamonkey-mailnews from seamonkey-2.0?
[10:24] <gnomefreak> seems seamonkey-1.1.13 is out of date as well newest release 1.1.14
[10:27] <BUGabundo> one more thing
[10:27] <BUGabundo> I'm trying to test this
[10:27] <BUGabundo> http://broadband.mpi-sws.org/transparency/bttest-mlab.php
[10:27] <BUGabundo> and FF keeps segfaulting
[10:28] <BUGabundo> java bug?
[10:28] <gnomefreak> looking
[10:28] <gnomefreak> sort of :(
[10:28] <BUGabundo> gnomefreak: don't use it with your regular Firefox
[10:29] <BUGabundo> or you will lose your session
[10:29] <gnomefreak> good because it works here in 3.2
[10:29] <BUGabundo> already happened to me 3 times in two browsers
[10:29] <BUGabundo> 3.1 and .2
[10:29] <gnomefreak> i'm not segfaulting
[10:29] <BUGabundo> grr and 3.0
[10:29] <BUGabundo> no ?
[10:29] <gnomefreak> ah yes i am
[10:29] <gnomefreak> hold that though5t
[10:29] <BUGabundo> let me test a new profile
[10:29] <BUGabundo> heehehehehhehehehe
[10:29] <BUGabundo> you did not click the teste, did you ?
[10:30] <gnomefreak> i clicked the link but it took a while for apport to pop up
[10:30] <gnomefreak> browser hasn't closed though
[10:30] <BUGabundo> ok, its not only me
[10:30] <BUGabundo> no ? mine did
[10:30] <BUGabundo> firefox-3.0 \n sh: acroread: not found \n Segmentation fault
[10:31] <BUGabundo> but no apport crash here
[10:31] <gnomefreak> can you upgrade libxcb1, libxcb-render0, libx11-6?
[10:31] <BUGabundo> other then the usual 3.1
[10:31] <BUGabundo> let me check
[10:32] <BUGabundo> 1.1.93-0ubuntu2
[10:32] <gnomefreak> that is the problem (i'm thinking its apport not supporting 3.2
[10:32] <BUGabundo> libx11-6:  Installed: 2:<IP_ADDRESS>-1build1
[10:32] <BUGabundo> is there any upper version of those?
[10:32] <gnomefreak> libx11-6: Installed: 2:1.1.5-2ubuntu2 Candidate: 2:<IP_ADDRESS>-1build1
[10:33] <gnomefreak> it looks like they are being held back on my system
[10:33] <BUGabundo> lol
[10:33] <BUGabundo> yeah
[10:33] <gnomefreak> let me see the log here to see why crash
[10:33] <BUGabundo> I had to manually distupgrade a few libs today
[10:34] <BUGabundo> gnomefreak: where would I find that?
[10:34] <BUGabundo> how can I run $ gdb --arg firefox-3.0
[10:34] <BUGabundo> ?
[10:35] <BUGabundo> hi asac
[10:35] <BUGabundo> good morning
[10:36] <gnomefreak> BUGabundo: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MozillaTeam/Bugs  should have insttructions
[10:37] <gnomefreak> from crash report it only says that my packages are out of date
[10:37] <gnomefreak> let me upgrade and test (in a few minutes)
[10:38] <BUGabundo> okay
[10:38] <BUGabundo> installing remaining gdb libs
[10:38] <BUGabundo> hope I have the disk space for it
[10:39] <gnomefreak> nope still no go so i have to guess that is why apport cant report it
[10:40] <gnomefreak> clicking on start testing
[10:41] <gnomefreak> BUGabundo: do you have java installed?
[10:42] <BUGabundo> ROFL
[10:42] <BUGabundo> now that I installed all dgb libs it won't crash
[10:42] <BUGabundo> gnomefreak: apparently too many for it to work ok
[10:42] <BUGabundo> last one I installed was ice something
[10:43] <gnomefreak> the free version?
[10:43] <BUGabundo> [New Thread 0x7f21d79d2950 (LWP 28617)]
[10:43] <BUGabundo> Program received signal SIGSEGV, Segmentation fault.
[10:43] <BUGabundo> [Switching to Thread 0x7f21dbfff950 (LWP 28616)]
[10:43] <gnomefreak> BUGabundo: are you on intrepid or jaunty?
[10:43] <BUGabundo> humm I see a seg fault, but it is running still
[10:43] <BUGabundo> jaunty
[10:43] <gnomefreak> thats what i got too
[10:43] <BUGabundo> I have sun-java 6, and few others too
[10:43] <gnomefreak> it seems 3.2 has had that issue for a few days at least
[10:44] <BUGabundo> No space left on device
[10:44] <BUGabundo> bah!!! I knew this was going to happen with all those 50*MiBs libs
[10:44] <BUGabundo> I'm testing this with 3.0
[10:44] <gnomefreak> BUGabundo: icedtea*?
[10:45] <BUGabundo> can I get a seg faul, gdb stops, and Firefox keeps working?
[10:45] <BUGabundo> strange
[10:45] <BUGabundo> I think so... but let me check galternatives
[10:46] <BUGabundo> by the way here is bt full http://paste.ubuntu.com/111187/
[10:46] <BUGabundo> ahh so FF seg fault, but java kept on running
[10:47] <BUGabundo> gnomefreak: http://paste.ubuntu.com/111188/ java packages installed
[10:48] <gnomefreak> We are sorry. Our measurement servers are currently overloaded and cannot serve you at the moment. Please try again later or try our alternative deployment by clicking here.
[10:48] <gnomefreak> i'm thinking the crash is only on 3.2 i have 3.1 open with the link and no crash
[10:49] <gnomefreak> with java6-plugijn installed
[10:49] <BUGabundo> I'm crashng 3.0 here
[10:49] <BUGabundo> or at least seg faulting it
[10:49] <BUGabundo> let me try 3.2
[10:49] <gnomefreak> sun-java6-jre  should be fine
[10:49] <gnomefreak> 3.2 crashing here
[10:50] <gnomefreak> 3.1 not and i havent test 3.0 i need to screw around with lavabit
[10:50] <BUGabundo> humm no gdb for 3.2
[10:51] <BUGabundo> ok swiching from openjdk to sun
[10:51] <gnomefreak> BUGabundo: no debug packages for packages that are not in repos
[10:51] <BUGabundo> and testing again
[10:51] <BUGabundo> but fta could build a few and place in the ppa
[10:51] <gnomefreak> Sorry, the program "firefox-3.1" closed unexpectedly
[10:51] <gnomefreak> Your computer does not have enough free memory to automatically analyze the problem and send a report to the developers.
[10:51] <gnomefreak> thats crock
[10:51] <gnomefreak> thats a crock
[10:52] <BUGabundo> Program received signal SIGSEGV, Segmentation fault.
[10:52] <BUGabundo> again seg fault with sun java
[10:53] <BUGabundo> hey I have 4GiBs LOL plus 8GiBs swap
[10:53] <BUGabundo> I've never seen that message
[10:53] <BUGabundo> LOL
[10:54] <BUGabundo> new crash http://paste.ubuntu.com/111190/ with java6sun/jre
[10:56] <asac> i gnomefreak
[10:56] <asac> hi
[10:56] <asac> ;)
[10:57] <gnomefreak> 111	xpcthreadcontext.cpp: No such file or directory. in xpcthreadcontext.cpp
[10:57] <gnomefreak> that looks to be why crash
[10:57] <gnomefreak> xpcthreadcontext.cpp: No such file or directory. in xpcthreadcontext.cpp
[10:57] <gnomefreak> i would think it would have closed without crashing but guess not
[10:57] <gnomefreak> hi asac
[10:59] <gnomefreak> 568 is outgoing sever for tb right?
[10:59] <asac> 568?
[11:00] <gnomefreak> s/server/port
[11:00] <asac> do you refer to port number?
[11:00] <asac> gnomefreak: hmm ... smtp is usually 25 or something
[11:00] <asac> ssmtp           465/tcp         smtps           # SMTP over SSL
[11:00] <asac> thats for ssmtp
[11:01] <gnomefreak> ok thanks
[11:01] <asac> and without crypto its
[11:01] <asac> smtp            25/tcp          mail
[11:01] <BUGabundo> both 465 and 568 are common ports
[11:01] <BUGabundo> for smtps
[11:03] <asac> not according to /etc/services
[11:04] <filipegarcia> i'm having problems configuring a static ip with NetworkManager
[11:04] <asac> but well ... mail provider should give definitly info what port to use ... then no problem
[11:04] <asac> filipegarcia: how is that?
[11:04] <filipegarcia> every time i create a new static, after reboot the machine, it creates another eth0 with dhcp and uses that
[11:05] <filipegarcia> i try with the gui and with the /etc/network/interfaces
[11:07] <BUGabundo> guys I have to leave for a bit, but if find anything else or need extra debug on that java crash, let me know, ping me here (if pidgin doesn't crash (I didn't like xchat, fta) ), or dent me on identica. cu soon
[11:08] <filipegarcia> i never had problems with dhcp but i can't use a static ip
[11:08] <filipegarcia> ok bye BUGabundo and thanks
[11:10] <gnomefreak> finally have a working lavabit account. evo sucks i wasnt able to send from it, brb smoke and coffeee
[11:11] <asac> filipegarcia: try a bit harder. use the gui ... create a new one so its really safed
[11:12] <filipegarcia> i create a new one and it work fine. but after reboot it creates a new eth0 and start to use that one instead
[11:35] <filipegarcia> I mean, if i remove the connect automatically from the dhcp wired connection, after i reboot, it gets connect automatically checked again and i never can make him use the static ip
[11:35] <filipegarcia> and if i remove the dhcp wired connection, after reboot, it creates a new one....
[11:40] <asac> filipegarcia: yeap
[11:40] <asac> filipegarcia: try to make a system connection
[11:41] <asac> are you sure your new connection is still there after reboot?
[11:41] <filipegarcia> is still there but not the default one
[11:41] <asac> filipegarcia: in any case ... if you want a fix for this use ~network-manager PPA packages for intrepid
[11:42] <asac> well ... at least that package version has a bunch of fixes sourrouding this issue
[11:42] <filipegarcia> ok
[11:45] <filipegarcia> i already have the 8.10
[11:49] <filipegarcia> and every time i check the system connection on the static eth0 , after reboot it gets unchecked
[11:56] <asac> filipegarcia: yes. thats why i sam saying: create new connection and directly check that
[11:56] <asac> filipegarcia: also i am saying try the intrepid packages in ~network-manager PPA
[11:56] <asac> those have fixes for system connection
[12:00] <filipegarcia> ok
[12:00] <filipegarcia> thanks
[12:01]  * gnomefreak fixing flashgot branches while waiting for coffee :)
[12:40] <gnomefreak> ok flashgot is fixed and pushed to PPA all branhes updated, i'm going for smoke
[12:41] <BUGabundo> gnomefreak: smoke is BAD! you should stop with it!
[12:45] <gnomefreak> eh something is going to kill me might as well have fun while waiting
[13:01] <gnomefreak> asac: you were last to touch enigmail. you have seamonkey as a dep. however i dont see a way to add it to seamonkey mail news
[13:02] <asac> yes. sm is still not supported
[13:02] <gnomefreak> ah
[13:02] <asac> we probably wait for sm 2.0 that has the extension manager
[13:02] <gnomefreak> asac: if 2.0 had a mail/news app would be great
[13:02] <BUGabundo> gnomefreak: did you manage to track that seg fault?
[13:03] <BUGabundo> or anybody else even looked at my bt full?
[13:03] <gnomefreak> BUGabundo: no just what i said earlier (the lines i pasted)
[13:03] <BUGabundo> okay
[13:03] <BUGabundo> should we file a bug?
[13:03] <gnomefreak> only for 3.0
[13:03] <BUGabundo> I know
[13:03] <gnomefreak> !info firefox-3.1 jaunty
[13:04] <gnomefreak> BUGabundo: 3.1 as well if you wish
[13:04] <BUGabundo> okay
[13:04]  * gnomefreak wasnt sure if 3.1 was in repos but it seems to be
[13:04] <BUGabundo> but I have PPA 3.1
[13:04] <BUGabundo> so its going to be a mess
[13:04] <gnomefreak> BUGabundo: than use repos verson to file bug
[13:05] <gnomefreak> btw trying to add fta's key for PPA failed
[13:05] <gnomefreak> is this known?
[13:05] <asac> there is no backtrace in http://paste.ubuntu.com/111190/
[13:06] <BUGabundo> I did manage to get it in
[13:06] <BUGabundo> asac: that was just the 1st
[13:06] <BUGabundo> with a simple segfault
[13:06] <BUGabundo> latter I run bt full
[13:08] <asac> yeah ... not in my backlog
[13:08] <BUGabundo> try the next few pastebins
[13:08] <BUGabundo> lol
[13:08] <asac> no i wont
[13:08] <BUGabundo> (10:46:09 AM) freenode: by the way here is bt full http://paste.ubuntu.com/111187/
[13:08] <BUGabundo> (10:46:29 AM) freenode: ahh so FF seg fault, but java kept on running
[13:08] <BUGabundo> (10:47:29 AM) freenode: gnomefreak: http://paste.ubuntu.com/111188/ java packages installed
[13:08] <gnomefreak> .:05:57:23:. <      gnomefreak > xpcthreadcontext.cpp: No such file or  directory. in xpcthreadcontext.cpp  is what i saw
[13:09] <BUGabundo> (10:27:40 AM) freenode: one more thing
[13:09] <BUGabundo> (10:27:45 AM) freenode: I'm trying to test this
[13:09] <BUGabundo> (10:27:45 AM) freenode: http://broadband.mpi-sws.org/transparency/bttest-mlab.php
[13:09] <BUGabundo> (10:27:52 AM) freenode: and FF keeps segfaulting
[13:09] <BUGabundo> (10:28:02 AM) freenode: java bug?
[13:09] <BUGabundo> (10:28:07 AM) gnomefreak: looking
[13:09] <gnomefreak> see above, not a great backtrace if at all but it failed ont he above
[13:09] <gnomefreak> s/int he/on the
[13:10] <asac> yeah java bug. ffox probably shouldnt crash, but well.
[13:10] <asac> if its reproducible that would be ok
[13:10]  * BUGabundo keeps finding strange bugs! it's the love for being a alpha/beta tester
[13:10] <gnomefreak> seems that sm download manager still isnt worth a shit
[13:10] <BUGabundo> asac: I could try a couple more java sites
[13:11] <BUGabundo> this is just ONE site
[13:11]  * gnomefreak doesnt find too many bugs and most are not strange :)
[13:11] <asac> BUGabundo: you do strange things to your system like copying stuff manually ... replacing .so files in system paths ... you shouldnt be shocked
[13:11] <BUGabundo> ehehehehe
[13:11] <BUGabundo> come on!!!
[13:12] <BUGabundo> its how its meant to be
[13:12] <BUGabundo> acording to adobe
[13:12] <asac> no really ... if you do that you should really not file bugs
[13:12] <gnomefreak> the least mads you make the better testing is
[13:12] <asac> just flash is ok
[13:12] <BUGabundo> if you would like to package it, it would be great
[13:12] <BUGabundo> when I do something out of the "standard" case I tend to mention it
[13:12] <asac> BUGabundo: but if you do something similar to other stuff :) ... then you are de-facto not supportable
[13:13] <BUGabundo> other then that I try to keep a regular stock system
[13:13] <asac> yeah. problem is that one forgets about hacks one did
[13:13] <asac> ok
[13:13] <BUGabundo> and always report versions of software installed
[13:13] <asac> good to know
[13:13] <BUGabundo> and if possilbe use apport/ubuntu-bugs to collect data
[13:13] <asac> yeah. thats good.
[13:13] <BUGabundo> I'll be formating and instaling fresh in a few days
[13:14] <asac> good news ;)
[13:14] <asac> hehe
[13:14] <BUGabundo> as soon as I get my hands on a free 300GiBs disk
[13:14] <BUGabundo> to backup everyting before going ext4
[13:14] <asac> no really. but if you can reproduce the crash with the official sun plugin then you should file it upstream
[13:14] <asac> in bugzilla.mozilla.org
[13:14] <gnomefreak> ok taking break for coffee breakfast
[13:14] <BUGabundo> I did
[13:14] <BUGabundo> with both java plugins
[13:14] <BUGabundo> ice and sun
[13:15] <asac> thoght it was 64 bit ... sun has 64 bit now?
[13:15] <BUGabundo> asac: it was repos version
[13:15] <BUGabundo> I guess what ever the java guys at ubuntu pack
[13:15] <asac> yeah ... still we dont have sun plugin for 64 bits afaik
[13:16] <asac> e.g. $ apt-cache search sun java plugin
[13:16] <asac> openoffice.org - OpenOffice.org Office suite
[13:16] <asac> $ uname -a
[13:16] <asac> Linux hector 2.6.28-4-generic #11-Ubuntu SMP Fri Jan 16 21:50:52 UTC 2009 x86_64 GNU/Linux
[13:16] <asac> but:
[13:16] <asac> $ apt-cache search sun java plugin
[13:16] <asac> sun-java5-plugin - The Java(TM) Plug-in, Java SE 5.0
[13:16] <asac> sun-java6-plugin - The Java(TM) Plug-in, Java SE 6
[13:16] <asac> openoffice.org - OpenOffice.org Office suite
[13:17] <asac> $ uname -a
[13:17] <asac> Linux tinya 2.6.29-rc2 #1 SMP Mon Jan 26 22:48:22 CET 2009 i686 GNU/Linux
[13:17] <asac> so just 32 bit
[13:17] <BUGabundo> okay
[13:17] <BUGabundo> its what I have
[13:17] <BUGabundo> no idea how it works!
[13:18] <BUGabundo> maybe some wrapper like flash
[13:19] <asac> no there is no wrapper
[13:19] <asac> you definitly did something manually if you have sun plugin
[13:19] <BUGabundo> asac: just went to synaptic and clicked on it
[13:19] <asac> BUGabundo: there is sun-java
[13:19] <asac> but not a plugin for 64 bit
[13:20] <BUGabundo> ahhhhhhhhhh
[13:20] <BUGabundo> ok
[13:21] <BUGabundo> so that's why it didn't show up on about:plugins
[13:21] <asac> obviously yes
[13:21] <BUGabundo> and after I installed ice it appeared
[13:21] <asac> so its just iced te3a
[13:21] <BUGabundo> allways learning
[13:21] <asac> if you can reproduce on 32 bit with sun plugin its a firefox bug ... otherwise its an icedtea thing
[13:21] <BUGabundo> so chaning galternatives didn't changed anything
[13:22] <asac> you dont get that plugin != jre != sdk
[13:22] <asac> the alternative for jre .... nor sdk doesnt change a thing for the plugin
[13:22] <asac> the plugin alternative has most likely no alternatives for you ;)
[13:24] <BUGabundo> now I do... before I didn't
[13:25] <asac> good
[13:25] <asac> next level ;)
[13:25] <BUGabundo> okay filling bug against icedtea
[13:48] <BUGabundo> see you in a few hours
[13:48] <BUGabundo> lunch time
[15:57] <asac> fta: did you backout the xulrunner-1.9.1-dev conflict on 1.9-dev together with .pc file reanme?
[15:57] <fta> i don't think so
[15:58] <fta> they all conflict now
[15:58] <asac> fta: ok so 1.9.1 hasnt been updated since?
[15:58] <asac> in jaunty?
[15:59] <fta> jaunty is stuck to b2, i don't remember when you dropped my .pc hack
[15:59] <asac> fta: wanna upload b3pre?
[15:59] <asac> ;)
[15:59] <asac> fta: yeah. seems like it is really old in jaunty
[15:59] <fta> when is the 1st b3 build ?
[15:59] <fta> [reed], ?
[16:00] <asac> not sure they are currently preparing freeze
[16:00] <asac> fta: or upload current head?
[16:01] <asac> i would like to get seb easy test instructions for trying ephy with new xul
[16:01] <asac> and its easiest to just install -dev and build
[16:06] <fta> i'm busy with work right now
[16:08] <BUGabundo1> Friends I would like to invite you all to show up at Tokamak, a KDE summit to discuss the future of Plasma. from day 6 to 9, at Porto (ISEP) Portugal. http://techbase.kde.org/Projects/Plasma/Tokamak2 & http://tuxvermelho.blogspot.com/2009/01/tokamak-ii-no-porto.html
[16:46] <[reed]> fta: when all blockers are fixed
[22:31] <[reed]> asac: hey, new Firefox maintainer for SLED
[22:31] <[reed]> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=460425#c63
[22:32] <[reed]> might want to meet him and see if he'll help out on stuff?


[14:57] <Petaris_Aki> Hello
[14:58] <spiekey> how can i capture all packets which the SYN flag using tcpdump?
[14:59] <Gargoyle> kraut: It got you stumped too?
[14:59] <kraut> Gargoyle: sorry, i need to fix a breakdown
[14:59] <kraut> no time atm
[15:00] <Gargoyle> np
[15:02] <soren> nealmcb: Around?
[15:02] <nealmcb> howdy
[15:03] <soren> nealmcb: Hey.
[15:03] <nealmcb> back home?
[15:03] <soren> Yeah.
[15:03] <nealmcb> nice
[15:03] <soren> I also finally got round to looking at your ubuntu-jeos changes.
[15:03] <soren> Apart from a few minor thing, it looks great!
[15:03] <nealmcb> :-)
[15:04] <nealmcb> I stumbled a while on the need to mark the vm type.....
[15:04] <nealmcb> I also am wondering how this might hook in with some other similar tools...
[15:04] <soren> Such as?
[15:05] <nealmcb> libvirt and virt-manager
[15:05] <nealmcb> qemu-make-debian-root
[15:06] <soren> I'm working on libvirt and virt-manager right now.
[15:06] <nealmcb> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qemu/+bug/63429
[15:06] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 63429 in qemu "[Edgy] qemu-make-debian-root hasn't worked since Debian Sarge, and not even then" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[15:07] <nealmcb> I still haven't gotten back to getting networking working right - need for local bridge-aware interfaces or something in qemu
[15:07] <nealmcb> have you also read that forums thread?
[15:07] <soren> Which forum thread?
[15:09] <nealmcb> xen-create-image: http://www.debian-administration.org/articles/533
[15:09] <nealmcb> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=549222&page=4
[15:11] <nealmcb> how do you intend to package it?  hardy and  backport for gutsy?
[15:12] <nealmcb> the forum thread has lots of questions about this release vs the demo last summer, which seemed to be a much smaller or somewhat different thing - can you shed light on that?
[15:14] <soren> No :) I'm still trying to get some sort of overview over the entire situation.
[15:14] <nealmcb> still no jeos iso released.  is the md5 341ca65a187c71643079a2f9ee5523b5  ubuntu-7.10-jeos-i386.iso  (seen in the wild)
[15:17] <m1r> hello
[15:17] <nealmcb> huh - what is http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/jeos/releases/7.10/release/
[15:20] <m1r> i cant install landscape-client, i get : landscape-client: Depends: smartpm-core (>= 0.52-gutsy1-landscape1) but...
[15:20] <m1r> nealmcb: that is virtualization based ubuntu
[15:21] <nealmcb> m1r: right - I'm chatting with soren about it - and wondering why that one is there but not at http://releases.ubuntu.com/7.10/
[15:21] <m1r> ah
[15:21] <m1r> i was looking for it other day and cojuldnt find it
[15:23] <soren> m1r: I think it only just got moved there a few days ago.
[15:24] <soren> nealmcb: I'm not sure why it's not on releases.
[15:24] <m1r> ok , tnx soren
[15:24] <m1r> i thought i was searching for somthing unavailable :)
[15:25] <avatar_> whats the problem with landscape-client?
[15:25] <m1r> avatar_: i get error when adding 2nd host
[15:25] <soren> nealmcb: I've just asked our release manager. He put it there, so he should know :)
[15:26] <soren> m1r: Have you added the repository to the machine or are you just copying the landscape-client deb around?
[15:26] <avatar_> deb http://landscape.canonical.com/packages/gutsy ./
[15:26] <avatar_> thats were you can get it
[15:26] <m1r> soren, added rep and key
[15:27] <avatar_> % apt-cache policy landscape-client
[15:27] <avatar_> landscape-client: Installed: 0.15.0-gutsy1-landscape1
[15:27] <soren> nealmcb: the general answer to that is that releases.ubuntu.com is for the highest-traffic things, and has limited  space
[15:27] <m1r> and when i try install i get missing dependencies
[15:27] <m1r> landscape-client: Depends: smartpm-core (>= 0.52-gutsy1-landscape1) but...
[15:28] <soren> Please put the output of "apt-cache showpkg smartpm-core" onto pastebin
[15:30] <m1r> soren ; http://pastebin.ca/773448
[15:30] <soren> m1r: What does "apt-get install smartpm-core=0.52-gutsy1-landscape1" do?
[15:33] <m1r> let me check
[15:33] <avatar_> i would like landscape-server to run localy
[15:33] <avatar_> not so happy with canonical having al my data
[15:33] <m1r> paranoia avatar_ ? :)
[15:34] <avatar_> but<EMAIL_ADDRESS>is slow with answering my questions
[15:34] <m1r> soren : smartpm-core: Depends: libc6 (>= 2.6-1) but 2.5-0ubuntu14 is to be installed
[15:34] <avatar_> m1r: imho it conflicts with privacy terms
[15:35] <ivoks> m1r: what version of landscape are you installing?
[15:35] <m1r> hi ivoks
[15:35] <m1r> the one from CP
[15:35] <avatar_> canonical can view all information from our and our customers servers. Installed packages, users etc
[15:35] <soren> m1r: You're running feisty on that box...
[15:35] <m1r> soren, i think is gutsy
[15:36] <soren> m1r: No :)
[15:36] <ivoks> m1r: it isn't
[15:36] <soren> m1r: 2.5-0ubuntu14 is from feisty.
[15:36] <m1r> omg :P
[15:36] <soren> m1r: If it doesn't know a libc > 2.6, it's not running gutsy.
[15:37] <m1r> ye i see
[15:37] <soren> There's a feisty version of landscape, isn't there?
[15:39] <m1r> ok solved, many tnx guys
[15:40] <soren> m1r: np
[15:40] <ivoks> soren: so, how are you? :)
[15:40] <soren> ivoks: I'm rocking!
[15:42] <nealmcb> soren - cool - thanks for the trunk commit - yeah the kvm vs qemu needed cleaning up also
[15:42] <nealmcb> nice changes
[15:42] <nealmcb> though I don't know that I rate as an "author" :-)
[15:42] <soren> nealmcb: Sure you do.
[15:48] <nealmcb> ivoks: howdy!  thanks for your blog writeup - it was indeed a pleasure to hang out with you!
[15:50] <ivoks> nealmcb: hi! no problem... :)
[15:50] <ivoks> hopefully, we'll meet again on next UDS, or sooner ;)
[15:50] <Gargoyle> anyone use drbd?
[15:51] <ivoks> Gargoyle: me
[15:52] <Gargoyle> after you fail over, and back again. if drbdadm state all returns Primary/Unknone and Secondary/Unknown on the two machines, is there a command I should be running to resync them?
[15:52] <ivoks> they sync automaticaly
[15:52] <ivoks> i have primary/primary
[15:53] <ivoks> and when one dies, on reconnect, becomes secondary, but outdated
[15:53] <ivoks> then they sync, and when that's over i have a mechanisam that makes it primary again
[15:53] <zul> hey mathiaz
[15:53] <mathiaz> hi zul
[15:54] <Gargoyle> ivoks: I am using heartbeat, and it put things back over onto node 1, which is reporting as primary.
[15:54] <Gargoyle> but node 2 is unknown.... Is this because heartbeat might have switched back too soon
[15:55] <ivoks> oh... are you mounting fs?
[15:55] <Gargoyle> ypu
[15:55] <Gargoyle> yup
[15:55] <ivoks> you can't do that if it's secondary
[15:56] <Gargoyle> ivoks: Nahh that's handled by heartbeat. only gets mounted on promary
[15:56] <ivoks> ok
[15:57] <ivoks> so, primary has Primary/Unknown
[15:57] <ivoks> and the 'rebooted' one has?
[15:57] <Gargoyle> It not been rebooted yet, but it has Secondary/Unknown
[15:57] <ivoks> then you have to connect it
[15:58] <Gargoyle> It's like each node is in the correct state, just not aware what the other one is upto!
[15:58] <ivoks> if you want to drop it's data:
[15:58] <ivoks> drbdadm -- --discard-my-data connect all
[15:58] <ivoks> and on the primary:
[15:58] <ivoks> drbdadm connect all
[15:59] <Gargoyle> do you have to do that each time it fails over, or was it just in the middle of a sync or something?
[15:59] <ivoks> you have to do that only on split brain situtation
[16:00] <ivoks> so, in real world, you will never use it :)
[16:01] <Gargoyle> right, so if I unplugged my nic cables. and watched it fail over.
[16:01] <ivoks> then hb should take care of making secondary - primary, and mounting filesystem
[16:01] <Gargoyle> then plugged them back in, and heartbeat switched back to node 1 (even though I have told it not to) could that have caused split brain
[16:01] <ivoks> no
[16:01] <ivoks> that should be normal situation
[16:02] <ivoks> old primary should resync first
[16:02] <ivoks> to become secondary
[16:02] <ivoks> after that it can become primary and get services back
[16:02] <ivoks> imho, two primaries would be better solution
[16:03] <ivoks> and some redhat tools instead of heartbeat
[16:03] <Gargoyle> It'f for a high available mysql
[16:03] <ivoks> i see
[16:04] <ivoks> i did mysql ha like this:
[16:04] <ivoks> mysql master-master replication with VIP over heartbeat
[16:04] <ivoks> but i will replace heartbeat with redhat-cluster-suite
[16:06] <ivoks> with master-master replication, you can also do load balancing
[16:06] <Gargoyle> is rh cluster suit a lot better?
[16:06] <ivoks> well, it includes a lot more than heartbeat
[16:07] <ivoks> sine i'm using GFS on drbd, having redhat-cluster-suite is just natural way to go...
[16:08] <Gargoyle> ivoks: I read quite a bit on GFS, got confused with some of it. Can GFS give you no single points of failure with 2 servers?
[16:09] <ivoks> GFS is just a filesystem which can be mounted on more than computers
[16:09] <ivoks> drbd provides high availability
[16:09] <ivoks> with drbd you can create 'network mirror'
[16:10] <ivoks> and then on top of drbd is GFS, and if you have primary/primary drbd, then you can mount /dev/drbd0 on two machines
[16:10] <ivoks> and write on it at the same time
[16:12] <Gargoyle> I just checked node 1 with the nic's stull unplugged. drbd still thinks it's primary.
[16:13] <Gargoyle> I pulled the cables out 10 mins ago.
[16:13] <ivoks> well yes
[16:13] <ivoks> it is primary
[16:13] <ivoks> it doesn't know if node1 or node2 is out
[16:14] <kraut> grr
[16:14] <ivoks> both nodes think they are the one that survived, and both are primary, right?
[16:14] <Gargoyle> but heartbeat does. since it released the vip to node 2.
[16:14] <kraut> Gargoyle: did you fixed your hb issue?
[16:14] <Gargoyle> kraut: Not yet
[16:15] <ivoks> Gargoyle: did you add drbd relevant stuff to ha.cf?
[16:15] <nealmcb> soren: have you tried installing the jeos iso in qemu?  I just get initramfs on reboot
[16:15] <ivoks> respawn hacluster /usr/lib/heartbeat/dopd
[16:15] <ivoks> apiauth dopd gid=haclient uid=hacluster
[16:16] <Gargoyle> ivoks: Not dopd
[16:16] <kraut> god, damn it
[16:16] <ivoks> Gargoyle: this way hb desides which one should be primary
[16:16] <ivoks> decides
[16:16] <Gargoyle> the guide I have says respawn hacluster /usr/lib/heartbead/ipfail
[16:16] <ivoks> that's for IP
[16:17] <ivoks> you need it also for drbd
[16:17] <Gargoyle> ahhh!
[16:20] <nealmcb> soren: since http://releases.ubuntu.com/7.10/ doesn't have all the releases, it should say so and link to the others.....
[16:22] <Gargoyle> ivoks: does it matter which order they are in the file?
[16:22] <ivoks> no
[16:23] <soren> nealmcb: I honestly don't remember.
[16:24] <ivoks> Gargoyle: one more thing
[16:24] <ivoks> Gargoyle: in /etc/drbd.conf
[16:24] <Gargoyle> yup...
[16:24] <ivoks> Gargoyle: you need handlers { outdate-peer "/usr/lib/heartbeat/drbd-peer-outdater"; }
[16:25] <ivoks> Gargoyle: under common {}
[16:25] <Gargoyle> my haresources is just - mysql-01        drbddisk Filesystem::/dev/drbd0::/drbd::ext3 mysql <IP_ADDRESS>
[16:25] <ivoks> not haresources
[16:25] <ivoks> ha.cf and drbd.conf
[16:26] <Gargoyle> yeah, but I was just checking my haresources looked ok to you - since this guide seems to have an error or two.
[16:27] <Gargoyle> ivoks: I have "outdate-peer /usr/sbin/drbd-peer-outdater" in the resource section.
[16:28] <ivoks> well, do you have that file? i don't :)
[16:29] <ivoks> there is /usr/lib/drbd/outdate-peer.sh, tough...
[16:29] <Gargoyle> damn!
[16:29] <Gargoyle> :)
[16:29] <ivoks> Gargoyle: don't worry
[16:29] <Gargoyle> so do I change it on my resource or common? (I only have 1 resource so I am assumng it doesnt matter!)
[16:30] <ivoks> HA and LB isn't trivial to set up...
[16:30] <ivoks> i've put it in common
[16:30] <ivoks> but should be ok in resource too, yes...
[16:33] <ivoks> dendrobates: hi there
[16:33] <dendrobates> ivoks: hi
[17:08] <zul> someone say they were working on libvirt and virt-install?
[17:16] <soren> Me.
[17:16] <soren> zul: ^^
[17:18] <zul> soren: ah ok...good..
[17:20] <zul> let me know if you need to bounce stuff off of me
[17:25] <soren> zul: I'll keep that in mind.
[18:59] <nealmcb> soren, zul - so do we need a plan for bridging/combining libvirt, virt-manager, virt-install, ubuntu-jeos-builder for xen and qemu?
[18:59] <nealmcb> has anyone written up the virtualization blueprint based on the uds discussions?
[19:00] <soren> Possibly. I need to look into how much of ubuntu-jeos-builder's job virt-install can do.
[19:00]  * nealmcb nods
[19:18] <zul> afternoon
[19:21] <nealmcb> zul afternoon here in Boulder too :-)  where are you?
[19:23] <zul> ottawa,canada
[23:03] <mralphabet> what determines the contents of "Suggested Packages" when you install something?
[23:04] <mralphabet> IE apt-get install blah
[23:04] <mralphabet> Suggested Packages
[23:04] <ivoks> debian/control file
[23:04] <mralphabet> some-other-package
[23:04] <mralphabet> who would change one? moatas?
[23:04] <soren> mralphabet: Each package can Suggest: other packages.
[23:04] <mralphabet> er, motus?
[23:05] <soren> Depends on the package.
[23:05] <mralphabet> k, thanks
[23:05] <soren> If it's in universe, yes. If it's in main, core-dev's can do it.
[23:05] <ivoks> mralphabet: motus for universe, core for main
[23:05] <ivoks> i feel like in real server
[23:05] <ivoks> everything is redundant :)
[23:06] <soren> *g*
[23:07] <soren> I also feel like a real server...
[23:07] <soren> ...but that's because I seem to never stop working.
[23:09] <ivoks> hehe
[23:09] <ivoks> then you are ubuntu-server :)
[23:10] <ivoks> we should rethink heartbeat :/
[23:11] <ivoks> i know i was the one asking for it, but every day it takes one year of my life...
[23:20] <soren> ivoks: Heh. Have you looked into redhat-cluster-suiter?
[23:20] <soren> *suite
[23:22] <ivoks> yes
[23:23] <ivoks> i'm planing to replace my heartbeat installations with redhat cluster suite
[23:50] <nealmcb> zul, soren: fwiw, I registered the libvirt project for the hardy libvirt package and configured the cvs import
[23:52] <soren> nealmcb: Ah, handy.
[23:52] <nealmcb> I'm happy to hand it over to Daniel Veillard  or the "registry" group or whoever
[23:55] <ajmitch> as long as you stick around it shouldn't be necessary
[23:56] <ajmitch> or put ubuntu-server as the team to own it
[23:56] <ajmitch> so that team members can update things where necessary


[19:58] <bumblefuzz> I'm trying to install vanilla ubuntu mate on my thinkpad P50 and it just isn't working
[19:58] <bumblefuzz> when I input my password it just returns to the login screen
[20:00] <bumblefuzz41> I am unable to install ubuntu mate on my thinkpad P50


[05:06] <idi0tf0wl> hello folks...
[05:06] <idi0tf0wl> is anyone around to answer a question?
[07:20] <dpm> good morning all!
[07:37] <idi0tf0wl> hi
[07:37] <gtriderxc> hi
[07:37] <idi0tf0wl> i'm glad someone's here
[07:38] <idi0tf0wl> or multiple someones...
[07:38] <idi0tf0wl> anyhow
[07:38] <idi0tf0wl> question:
[07:38] <idi0tf0wl> every now and again i come across typos and other errors while i'm translating things on launchpad
[07:38] <idi0tf0wl> how do i submit changes to the original english strings?
[07:39] <gtriderxc> You should report a bug
[07:39] <idi0tf0wl> oh
[07:39] <idi0tf0wl> errors in the source strings, i should have said
[07:39] <idi0tf0wl> really?
[07:39] <gtriderxc> yes
[07:39] <idi0tf0wl> well alright, then
[07:40] <gtriderxc> you just report a bug and then someone correct the mistake
[07:40] <idi0tf0wl> thanks!
[07:40] <idi0tf0wl> i suppose i will begin doing that, then
[07:40] <gtriderxc> i always do
[07:40] <gtriderxc> cause there are lots of 'em
[07:40] <idi0tf0wl> i feel like there should be something a  bit more intuitive for it
[07:41] <idi0tf0wl> 'cause you're right
[07:41] <idi0tf0wl> there are lots of them
[07:41] <idi0tf0wl> and it's important
[07:41] <idi0tf0wl> thanks again
[07:41] <gtriderxc> if You make a few reports
[07:41] <idi0tf0wl> i'm going back to that now
[07:41] <gtriderxc> You will find it intuitive:)
[07:41] <idi0tf0wl> ?
[07:41] <idi0tf0wl> peace people
[07:41] <idi0tf0wl> tata
[07:41] <idi0tf0wl> good to know
[07:41] <idi0tf0wl> ha
[07:42] <gtriderxc> ;)
[08:07] <andrejz> morning!
[08:08] <TLE> good morning
[08:08] <andrejz> we made a pdf about how to start translating in launchpad - http://dl.dropbox.com/u/6183401/Uvod%20v%20prevajanje%20v%20Launchpadu.pdf If anyone wants to do something similar for his team, let me know i can can give you original .odt file
[08:09] <andrejz> basically you can use the images and structure, but need to rewrite the text
[08:11] <gtriderxc> thanx
[08:12] <gtriderxc> the greatest problem however is
[08:13] <andrejz> dpm, you here ? i am running 11.04 and noticed transmission is not translated (version 2.13 in natty). Is this to be expected? I know firefox is not supposed to be translated yet, is the same true for transmission too ?
[08:13] <gtriderxc> that people steel kee on coming to Launchpad
[08:13] <andrejz> @gtriderxc: kee?
[08:13] <dpm> morning andrejz, TLE, gtriderxc
[08:13] <gtriderxc> and  waste their time translating thing which are not translated on launchpad
[08:14] <dpm> andrejz, I haven't been using transmission for a while, let me check...
[08:14] <gtriderxc> for example people come to launchpad and translate k3b on firefox
[08:16] <andrejz> different teams have different workflow, but yes.. that happens occassionally for us as well (but less and less often since upstream is getting better translated  - about 1 package per cycle)
[08:24] <TLE> hey, any germans around
[08:24] <gtriderxc> only half Germans:0
[08:26] <TLE> good enough, I forgot from my school german, is there both a small and capital version of the double s "ß" letter in the german alfabet?
[08:26] <gtriderxc> no
[08:26] <TLE> great
[08:26] <gtriderxc> SS is only for small
[08:26] <TLE> thanks, that is just what I wanted to know
[08:26] <gtriderxc> ;)
[08:27] <TLE> The gnome guys decided to use a new font as default without making sure that it had all the letters needed
[08:27] <gtriderxc> :/
[08:27] <TLE> So I was just checking that it had the special danish letters, though I might as weel check for swedish, norwegian and german while I was at it
[08:42] <andrejz> @TLE: where can one check that ?
[08:43] <TLE> andrejz: I downloaded the ttf files and opened them with fontforge
[08:43] <TLE> just a sec I'll find the link to the files
[08:43] <andrejz> great
[08:44] <TLE> http://git.gnome.org/browse/cantarell-fonts/plain/ttf/Cantarell-Regular.ttf
[08:45] <TLE> http://git.gnome.org/browse/cantarell-fonts/plain/ttf/Cantarell-Bold.ttf
[08:45] <andrejz> thx
[08:45] <TLE> someone just answered my email, I'll quote:
[08:45] <TLE> More languages are. From [1]:
[08:45] <TLE> Each font file currently contains 391 glyphs, and fully support the
[08:45] <TLE> following writing systems: Basic Latin, Western European, Catalan,
[08:45] <TLE> Baltic, Turkish, Central European, Dutch and Afrikaans.
[08:46] <TLE> I don't know if that covers yours *G*
[08:47] <andrejz> you can add that it also covers slovenian
[08:47] <andrejz> i just checked
[08:49] <andrejz> if there is such a list somewhere
[08:50] <TLE> I think the homepage of the project is here: http://abattis.org/cantarell/
[08:50] <TLE> I just saw the thread on gnome-i18n and wanted to check for Danish, I don't know if developers listen in
[08:50] <andrejz> ok thanks
[08:50] <TLE> so you might want to write them (must be a link somewhere on the homepage) and tell them
[08:50] <andrejz> probably i will get it at 1 pm since i get batch mail
[08:51] <andrejz> ok, will tell them, thanks TLE
[08:51] <TLE> np
[15:16] <askhl__> Hi.  Can anyone tell me how to see whether a source package (such as gedit or coreutils) has automatic imports (from GNOME or TranslationProject)?  The motivation for this question is that I would like to know which modules I have to manually upload translations for from upstream
[15:22] <dpm> askhl_, at this point, I cannot tell you for sure, as the LP squad working on translations is still developing the UI to allow setting up upstreams for automatic imports. I think the best thing might be to ask henninge ^
[15:22] <askhl_> dpm: thank you
[15:22] <dpm> np :)
[15:23] <askhl_> do you know roughly for which modules automatic imports are enabled as of now?  E.g. whether there are any at all
[15:36] <dpm> askhl_ I'd say roughly the GNOME modules in main, but the Launchpad people should be able to tell you best
[15:37] <dpm> askhl_, in any case, even for those which haven't got automatic imports enabled yet, translations should be imported through package uploads (i.e. "the old way") as usual
[15:37] <dpm> so you shouldn't have to resort to manual uploads unless there is a problem with importing translations
[15:43] <askhl_> dpm: I've always found that if I don't manually push the translations, there's a high probability that nobody will.  Also on TP, most translators commit only the version they translate and don't merge/commit for the previous versions.  This means while the newest one might be at 100%, that is of little use if ubuntu branches the second-newest.
[15:48] <andrejz> hello dpm! Have you found out anything about transmission translation status in natty?
[15:50] <dpm> andrejz, no, sorry, I got disconnected and then sidetracked. Let me do this now... :)
[15:53] <dpm> it seems that the transmission.mo file is shipped with the language packs correctly, and that _some_ translations are loaded, but all of the interface is in English
[16:20] <andrejz> @dpm: could this be some sort of bug?
[16:21] <dpm> andrejz, it might well be. Looking at the code, the template seems to build fine and translations are mostly up to date
[16:22] <dpm> so I'm not sure what's going on
[18:00] <Gwaihir> hello folks, does anybody know if the import queue is stuck? or is it only huge and it needs time to importa a manually uploaded po?
[18:02] <askhl_> Gwaihir: I know of a po-file which was imported ~12 hours ago
[18:02] <Gwaihir> askhl_ when did you import it?
[18:03] <askhl_> Gwaihir: it was imported by someone (not me) within the last two days I think
[18:03] <askhl_> Could be 24 hours ago
[18:03] <Gwaihir> ok, automatically imported maybe... well I uploaded one po yesterday night and is approved right now, but usually the queue was faster
[18:04] <askhl_> No, it was a manual import
[18:04] <Gwaihir> ok, cool
[18:04] <askhl_> Give it another 24 hours
[18:05] <Gwaihir> will do :) have nothing else I can do to speed it up :)
[18:06] <askhl_> yeah, it would be nice if the system said "hey, someone manually clicked several buttons to start this import, maybe it's important to get it done right away"
[20:58] <alex__> Hi All - quick question about .desktop keys if anyone can help...
[21:00] <alex__> Does anyone know if the X-Ubuntu-Gettext-Domain key needs to go in the [Desktop Entry] section, or can it go anywhere?


[23:24] <tsimonq2> Hi, could I please get an Ubuntu Member cloak?
[23:25] <sarnold> woot ;) could you pop your libera nickname on https://launchpad.net/~tsimonq2 ?


[00:25] <slestak> i know netselect and apt-spy are not official ubuntu-server programs.  is there a preferred way for finding a good mirror from the console?
[00:30] <giovani> slestak: if an "official" solution to that situation existed ... then there probably wouldn't be other apps to do it
[00:30] <giovani> use either of those ... or select one at random
[00:32] <Bytewalker> Hi all, im new to servers.. I registered www.custom-quiz.com and pointed it to my IP (ubuntu box with apache/etc), my friend says he can't connect to it through http://custom-quiz.com OR http://<IP_ADDRESS> , can anyone tell me if either of these work for them?
[00:33] <slestak> giovani: thx, i prefer to stay with blessed tools, just wanted to ask.
[00:33] <giovani> Bytewalker: nope ... port 80 at that IP isn't open
[00:34] <giovani> well, technically it's "filtered" ... but there's no service responding on that port
[00:35] <Bytewalker> giovani: really weird.. my computer in the other room is on a diff IP (<IP_ADDRESS> (one below)) and it can connect to custom-quiz.com and it works, any ideas?
[00:35] <giovani> Bytewalker: uh ... probably a filter
[00:35] <giovani> given that the IP is filtered
[00:36] <giovani> is this a residential IP?
[00:36] <Bytewalker> Hmm, this computer isnt connected to a router at all.. what could be filtering it
[00:36] <giovani> many residential ISPs filter port 80
[00:36] <giovani> at their router
[00:36] <Bytewalker> yeah im connected through telus ADSL.. it gives me 2 IPs
[00:37] <giovani> if your computers are both connected over a switch/hub, then you wouldn't be accessing computer number 2 through Telus' router
[00:37] <giovani> hence why computer 1 would be able to access port 80 on computer 2, but not anyone else on the internet
[00:37] <Bytewalker> i have a main hub (one line to server, one to a router) and my other comp is behind router
[00:37] <giovani> yes
[00:37] <Bytewalker> omg thanx, makes sense
[00:37] <giovani> Telus is filtering port 80 for you
[00:37] <giovani> try moving your web server to port 81
[00:37] <giovani> to test this theory out
[00:38] <giovani> or some other random port
[00:38] <giovani> and then try to access it this way: http://<IP_ADDRESS>:81/
[00:38] <Bytewalker> ok. will http:// look at port 81 too by default?
[00:38] <giovani> nope
[00:38] <Bytewalker> doh
[00:38] <giovani> only 80
[00:38] <Bytewalker> lol.. just wondering why my isp would filter port 80
[00:38] <Bytewalker> they dont want me to host?
[00:38] <giovani> of course not
[00:38] <giovani> most residential ISPs do this now
[00:39] <giovani> they see "hosting" as a non-residential use of the connection
[00:39] <Bytewalker> but bittorrent is ok i guess... lol..
[00:39] <giovani> nope, they're making efforts to block that too
[00:39] <giovani> it's just much much harder
[00:39] <Bytewalker> ok wel thanks dude, i'm gonna try port 81 rly quick
[00:39] <Bytewalker> or mabey call telus and bitch?
[00:40] <giovani> nope
[00:43] <Bytewalker> any hint on moving apache to port 81 would be mucho appreciated:) plus.. do isps block any other ports?
[00:55] <giovani> Bytewalker: depends entirely on the ISP
[00:56] <giovani> look in /etc/apache2/httpd.conf
[00:56] <Bytewalker> giovani: im gonna try 8080 and mabey you can test it after :D, they mighta blocked that too though im guessing
[00:56] <giovani> very possible
[00:57] <giovani> as for how to change the port: http://httpd.apache.org/docs/2.2/mod/mpm_common.html#listen
[00:57] <giovani> documentation is plentiful -- please make an attempt to look those things up first
[01:36] <linux_noob> hello, anyone around?
[01:37] <linux_noob> I have an issue transitioning from http to https access... I'm using svn as a test.
[03:03] <kj4> hello all
[03:04] <kj4> anyone here that could help me with setting up a mail server?
[03:09] <twb> !anyone
[03:10] <kj4> will someone review my zonefile and tell me if it looks good for mail?
[06:55] <FFForever> Hello
[06:55] <FFForever> why does this happen?, $ ls
[06:55] <FFForever> znc-0.068  znc-0.068.tar.gz
[06:55] <FFForever> $ ^[[A
[06:57] <FFForever> i get the ^[[A when i press up...
[07:03] <foxbuntu> FFForever, sounds like you created a new user and didnt set the default shell to bash
[07:03] <foxbuntu> FFForever, to test, try this: $ bash
[07:03] <foxbuntu> ls -l
[07:03] <foxbuntu> then press up
[07:04] <FFForever> foxbuntu, whoops, how do i set it?
[07:06] <Kamping_Kaiser> try `echo $SHELL` - bash returns /bin/bash
[07:07] <foxbuntu> FFForever, sudo nano /etc/passwd
[07:07] <foxbuntu> FFForever, then you can find your user and set the end of the line to /bin/bash
[07:08] <Kamping_Kaiser> I'd recommend `chsh` personally
[07:08] <FFForever> i like bash :D
[07:08] <FFForever> foxbuntu, it was /bin/sh
[07:08] <foxbuntu> FFForever, that should do it, log out and back in to verify
[07:09] <FFForever> foxbuntu, how hard would it be to upgrade from 8.10 to 9.04?
[07:09] <foxbuntu> FFForever, depends on your hardware
[07:09] <foxbuntu> but should be easy nuff
[07:09] <FFForever> its a vps
[07:09] <foxbuntu> FFForever, sudo do-release-upgrade
[07:09] <foxbuntu> FFForever, oh then it should be no big deal
[07:10] <foxbuntu> FFForever, actually, do it this way
[07:10] <foxbuntu> sudo apt-get update && sudo do-release-upgrade
[07:11] <FFForever> foxbuntu, how do i add my user to the admin group
[07:12] <foxbuntu> FFForever, sudo usermod -a -G root
[07:12] <wizardslovak> hello people
[07:12]  * foxbuntu hides from wizardslovak
[07:13] <wizardslovak> FFForever: i did update without any problems
[07:16] <FFForever> foxbuntu, root@chr1831:/home/chris# usermod -a -G chris chris like that?
[07:17] <FFForever> whoops i am already in chris...
[07:18] <FFForever> sudo: do-release-upgrade: command not found
[07:18] <wizardslovak> try do-release-upgrade
[07:18] <wizardslovak> myne worked without sudo
[07:19] <foxbuntu> wizardslovak, it requires sudo
[07:19] <foxbuntu> FFForever, yeah... and there is indeed an admin group so
[07:19] <wizardslovak> lol
[07:19] <FFForever> foxbuntu, not for me :D
[07:19] <FFForever> no admin group...
[07:20] <wizardslovak> i might be su then
[07:20] <foxbuntu> FFForever, switch to your first user
[07:20] <foxbuntu> FFForever, you can also just edit the conf
[07:20] <FFForever> i did :D
[07:20] <foxbuntu> FFForever, sudo nano /etc/groups
[07:21] <foxbuntu> oops
[07:21] <foxbuntu> FFForever, sudo nano /etc/group
[07:21] <FFForever> anyways..., how do i upgrade?
[07:21] <foxbuntu> sudo do-release-upgrade should work
[07:22] <FFForever> nope...
[07:22] <foxbuntu> did you log out after changing your groups?
[07:22] <FFForever> didn't change it...
[07:22] <FFForever> there we no admin groupd lol
[07:22] <Kamping_Kaiser> FFForever, what version of ubuntu server are you running? whats the output of `groups`?
[07:22] <foxbuntu> adm?
[07:22] <Kamping_Kaiser> are you in shared hosting, or your own host?
[07:23] <FFForever> 8.10 from what i am told...
[07:23] <FFForever> well according to the ubuntu64 tar.gz file :D
[07:23] <foxbuntu> FFForever, lsb_release -a
[07:24] <FFForever> chris@chr1831:~$ lsb_release -a
[07:24] <FFForever> No LSB modules are available.
[07:24] <FFForever> Distributor ID:	Ubuntu
[07:24] <FFForever> Description:	Ubuntu 8.10
[07:24] <FFForever> Release:	8.10
[07:24] <FFForever> Codename:	intrepid
[07:24] <foxbuntu> indeed it is 8.10
[07:24] <FFForever> stripped :D
[07:25] <Kamping_Kaiser> what about your groups?
[07:25] <foxbuntu> FFForever, check for the group called "adm"
[07:25] <FFForever> my ubuntu is only 605mb
[07:25] <foxbuntu> so?
[07:25] <FFForever> shouldn't it be bigger?
[07:25] <foxbuntu> that sounds about normal for server
[07:25] <FFForever> centos was 2gb =\
[07:26] <FFForever> 2gb on a 6gb vps sucks... LOL!
[07:26] <foxbuntu> heck, with Mythbuntu we are still inside a CD
[07:26] <foxbuntu> and there is allot more there than server default install
[07:26] <FFForever> anyone in here setup ubuntu + suphp?
[07:31] <Bhagavat> hi
[07:32] <Bhagavat> someone talk in spanish?
[07:38] <Bhagavat> i know that ubuntu comunity is expert talking in english, but i not good talking tecnique terms in english
[07:41] <FFForever> any idea why i get this?, Internal Server Error
[07:41] <FFForever> File "/home/chris/public_html/index.php" is not in document root of Vhost "/var/www/"
[07:42] <foxbuntu> Bhagavat, I believe there is a spanish channel #ubuntu-es iirc
[07:42] <Bhagavat> well i wole like activate a new ubuntu server, but i have cuestions about the technical specifications of my machine
[07:43] <Bhagavat> thanks foxbuntu
[07:43] <foxbuntu> FFForever, sounds like you need to update your vhost (google apache vhost for specifics) /etc/apache2/sites-enabled/default is the file you need to edit
[07:44] <FFForever> foxbuntu, how do i find out what uid 1 is?
[07:45] <FFForever> i mean 33
[07:45] <FFForever> =\, chris:x:1000:1000::/home/chris:/bin/bash.... i modded the dir with chown chris:chris /blah/index.php shouldn't it be 1000:1000 then?
[07:46] <FFForever> www-data:x:33:33:www-data:/var/www:/bin/sh.......... why is it launching as www-data...
[07:46] <foxbuntu> FFForever, no
[07:46] <Kamping_Kaiser> FFForever, you need to include more details in what your talking about
[07:46] <foxbuntu> FFForever, uh...
[07:46] <FFForever> i was writing the files as root...
[07:46] <FFForever> i am trying to setup suphp :D
[07:46] <FFForever> http://vps.chr1831.com/~chris/
[07:46] <foxbuntu> FFForever, because apache runs under www-data
[07:47] <Kamping_Kaiser> what is it? whats it do? why does it need to access particular files? what did you do to create those errors? etc etc etc
[07:47] <foxbuntu> Kamping_Kaiser, thanks
[07:47]  * foxbuntu felt like a fog was setting in
[07:47] <foxbuntu> ;)
[07:47] <FFForever> foxbuntu, so the file is owned by www-data?
[07:47] <Kamping_Kaiser> foxbuntu, ;)
[07:48] <Kamping_Kaiser> FFForever, stop saying "the file" or "the directory". *what* file? *what* directory?
[07:48]  * Kamping_Kaiser still isnt sure whats *broken*
[07:48] <FFForever> /home/chris/public_html and its index.php
[07:48] <Kamping_Kaiser> how did you try and access it?
[07:48] <FFForever> via userdir
[07:48] <FFForever> wait i know why.........
[07:50] <FFForever> fixed the miss matched uids... now i get this Could not execute script "/home/chris/public_html/index.php"
[07:50] <Kamping_Kaiser> foxbuntu, there must be a 'give us useful info' factoid, but no idea what it is :(
[07:50] <FFForever> do i need to have +ExecCGI on the vhost?
[07:50] <Kamping_Kaiser> no
[07:50] <Kamping_Kaiser> what gave you that error?
[07:51] <FFForever> trying to browse my index.php =\
[07:51] <FFForever> i have error to browser to true
[07:51] <foxbuntu> Kamping_Kaiser, I don't know what it is on ubottu
[07:52] <FFForever> suphp.log says [Sat May 09 06:51:37 2009] [info] Executing "/home/chris/public_html/index.php" as UID 1000, GID 1000
[07:52]  * Kamping_Kaiser wonders why its executing
[07:53] <Kamping_Kaiser> FFForever, http://www.suphp.org/Home.html is this what your playign with?
[07:53] <FFForever> nothing in the error log =\
[07:53] <FFForever> Kamping_Kaiser, yeah
[07:53] <FFForever> i compiled from source
[07:53] <Kamping_Kaiser> why on earth are you using that?'
[07:54] <FFForever> Kamping_Kaiser, to make php run as the user :)
[07:54] <Kamping_Kaiser> suPHP is a tool for executing PHP scripts with the permissions of their owners. It consists of an Apache module (mod_suphp) and a setuid root binary (suphp) that is called by the Apache module to change the uid of the process executing the PHP interpreter.
[07:54] <Kamping_Kaiser> my god that sounds bad ;S
[07:54] <FFForever> why?
[07:55] <FFForever> Kamping_Kaiser, how would you suggest i run php as the user?
[07:55] <Kamping_Kaiser> FFForever, for a start - why do you want to?
[07:55] <FFForever> because its better for security when doing hosting..
[07:56] <Kamping_Kaiser> FFForever, and it sounds bad, because your putting one of the most abused languages onto your system, with control of a suid binary.
[07:56] <Kamping_Kaiser> if its going via suid , its not more secure then anything.... imho, of course
[07:57] <FFForever> php is not that bad...
[07:58]  * Kamping_Kaiser laughs
[07:58] <FFForever> wanna rewrite my site in python then?
[07:59] <Kamping_Kaiser> half a minute, let me put on my caring face...
[07:59] <Kamping_Kaiser> speaking of python *goes to get his laptop and work on a website*
[08:01] <wizardslovak> what ports should i open??
[08:01] <wizardslovak> besides 80
[08:03] <FFForever><PHONE_NUMBER>9
[08:03] <FFForever> :D
[08:04] <Kamping_Kaiser> wizardslovak, depends which ports you need to use.
[08:06] <wizardslovak> well i am trying to setup ufw
[08:06] <wizardslovak> i am using  browser,ssh
[08:06] <wizardslovak> ssh is 22 ,right?
[08:07] <Kamping_Kaiser> yes
[08:07] <wizardslovak> thats should be it
[08:07] <wizardslovak> hmmm basically two  lol
[08:09] <wizardslovak> also https should be good
[08:09] <wizardslovak> 443 if i am not mistaken
[08:21] <wizardslovak> how to unzip .zip?
[08:24] <Kamping_Kaiser> unzip file
[08:31] <wizardslovak> hmmm i cannot find Gtk2
[08:37] <Kamping_Kaiser> not a problem on servers ;)
[08:38] <wizardslovak> sorry
[08:38] <wizardslovak> i though ti am on kubuntu chat
[08:53] <cemc> I just found out that my maillog files are not rotated as they should... I have 'monthly' specified in the logrotate.conf, but they still get rotated daily
[08:53] <cemc> on Hardy
[09:03] <reid> hi all.  my server's mobo just fried and I just put a new one in with it.  It no longer connects to my network.  Any ideas?
[09:07] <Kamping_Kaiser> reid, onboard ethernet?
[09:07] <Kamping_Kaiser> !z25
[09:07] <Kamping_Kaiser> bah.
[09:07] <Kamping_Kaiser> dpkg does :o
[09:07] <Kamping_Kaiser> reid, <dpkg> As of version 0.090, udev has the ability to statically rename ethernet cards based on MAC address. The addresses are configured in /etc/udev/rules.d/z25_persistent-net.rules .  If you want the mappings to change, edit that file.  See <forcedeth mac>.  As of version 0.124-1 the file is called /etc/udev/rules.d/70-persistent-net.rules
[09:07] <Kamping_Kaiser> reid, the file name might be slightly different, but the idea is the same ;)
[09:07]  * Kamping_Kaiser -> afk
[09:12] <wizardslovak> good night people
[12:09] <cumulus007> I'm looking for the location mysql saves my databases in
[12:16] <Kamping_Kaiser> cumulus007, /var/lib iirc
[12:18] <cumulus007> and then?
[12:18] <cumulus007> never mind ;)
[12:24] <XiXaQ> is it common for mailserver to refuse to relay mail from users on a mailserver that isn't encrypted, or one that uses self-signed certificates?
[14:03] <Doonz> hey does anyone know when your growing a raid 5 software array and the computer fails. does it break the array
[14:28] <emgent> hallo
[14:40] <emgent> some mysql guy around ?
[14:44] <LoreCaster> Hey all, question... i've installed ubuntu server 32-bit v9.04 on my machine, but it's just a flat install. i need to install the materials required for remote login (since i just want a power cord and a network cable plugged into the tower) and a webserver. My admin also needs remote access, and all that good stuff. Can i ask where i go now?
[14:45] <LoreCaster> i know that, sometimes, the order of operations for a server is important... didn't want to start anything without more knowledge lest i foul something up
[14:48] <LoreCaster> i've foudn this, is it a good source of info? http://www.howtoforge.com/perfect-server-ubuntu-9.04-ispconfig-2
[14:50] <Nicke> LoreCaster: Have you looked at the Ubuntu server guide? https://help.ubuntu.com/9.04/serverguide/C/index.html
[14:51] <LoreCaster> i've never had much luck with these, is it a step-by-step how-to for my needs?
[14:53] <LoreCaster> i've NEVER seen such a comprehensive resource!! thanks so much! :D
[16:15] <kirkland> Nafallo: pong
[16:16] <kirkland> Nafallo: i was on holiday yesterday :-)
[16:16] <NativeAngels> can anyone help me with im having a problem with start a xen virtual machine
[16:24] <billybigrigger> hey all
[16:25] <NativeAngels> anyone here use xen server
[16:25] <giovani> NativeAngels: you might want to try #xen ... that's what it's there for
[16:34] <FFForever> Hello
[16:35] <NativeAngels> ok
[16:35] <FFForever> Anyone know anything about suphp?, i am trying to set it up but i get an error that says it cannot execute the script "..../index.php" =\
[16:37] <FFForever> 500 internal server error, Could not execute script "/home/chris/public_html/index.php" to be exact....
[16:58] <wizardslovak> morning people
[17:11] <FFForever> mornin
[17:12] <FFForever> can anyone help with the suphp?, plz lol
[18:49] <incorrect> i am going to install my new server, but its in the garage,  can i pxe boot it and ssh in somehow?
[18:52] <Nafallo> kirkland: did you change something in the screen madness that steals my alt+pgup/pgdown?
[18:52] <Nafallo> kirkland: where 'alt' = 'shift'... ;-)
[18:53] <Nafallo> 16:25 < NativeAngels> anyone here use xen server
[18:53] <Nafallo> ehrm
[18:53]  * Nafallo blames weird Xorg
[19:26] <FFForever> can i ban running passwd via sudo and disable sudo -i?
[19:26] <FFForever> (for 1 user)
[19:31] <giovani> FFForever: certainly for denying passwd access
[19:32] <giovani> did you read the sudoers manpage?
[19:32] <giovani> you can deny all access to passwd, or prevent just access to changing the root password
[19:32] <giovani> using some basic expressions
[19:32] <FFForever> what about the -i option?
[19:33] <giovani> I don't believe so, it doesn't really accomplish anything special though, so I'm unclear on why you want to ban its use
[19:36] <giovani> you can ban access to the shell
[19:36] <giovani> or don't give the root user a shell
[19:37] <FFForever> how do i remove the shell from root?
[19:37] <giovani> sudo usermod -s /bin/false root
[19:40] <FFForever> ahhh cool :D
[19:40] <giovani> /bin/false is just a non-existant shell
[19:40] <giovani> it's not a special name
[19:40] <giovani> it could be /bin/doesntexist
[19:45] <AnRkey> how can i get cupsys to recieve jobs like lprng does? I need to add queues like I did in my /etc/printcap file but I cant see how with cupsys
[19:47] <NativeAngels> can anyone here help me with xen setup
[19:49] <giovani> NativeAngels: I've recommended you visit #xen
[19:52] <incorrect> wow jaunty recognised my sata raid and did the mirroring, but i don't see any mdadm
[19:55] <giovani> if you have a "raid card" then you shouldn't be running md
[19:55] <incorrect> no its not real raid
[19:55] <giovani> heh, then let's not call it a raid card :)
[19:55] <incorrect> /dev/mapper/isw_bdgaggad_Vol07
[19:56] <incorrect> it created those mappings
[19:56] <giovani> ok
[19:56] <giovani> ps aux | grep -i md   returns what?
[19:56] <incorrect> krfcommd
[19:56] <giovani> that's it?
[19:56] <incorrect> yes
[19:57] <incorrect> i don't see mdadm
[19:57] <giovani> well mdadm isn't the daemon
[19:58] <incorrect> well you can normall see something running that is monitoring the raid array
[20:00] <giovani> well as long as the raid is setup and running, what's the problem?
[20:23] <jetole> Is anyone in here familiar with linux advanced routing and filters on the PRIO queing discipline, the filters I am applying are not being used the way I like => http://pastebin.com/m46e44c4e
[20:34] <NativeAngels> can you use sun virtualbox from ubuntu server edition
[20:35] <giovani> NativeAngels: sure ...
[20:36] <giovani> my view of VirtualBox is that it's more of a desktop virtualization product
[20:36] <giovani> but it's possible it has some non-gui interface I don't know of
[20:37] <jetole> I honestly don't know why anyone with a modern cpu would want to use virtualbox
[20:37] <jetole> linux kvm ftw
[20:47] <jmarsden> It looks as though libvirt support for VirtualBox is almost there, so I'd think vmbuilder support could follow?  http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.emulators.libvirt/12872
[20:55] <incorrect> hmm my nic bonding module options don't work anymore
[20:58] <guiss> Hello guys. Where I can find documentation to configure an ubuntu LTS server? I went to the helpt pages of ubuntu community but it wasn't helpufl
[20:58] <wizardslovak> guiss: what do you need to install
[20:59] <wizardslovak> http://www.howtoforge.com/perfect-server-ubuntu8.04-lts
[20:59] <guiss> wizardslovak: I want to install a terminal server, I did the lstp-server installation and configuration of dhpc but the thin client hangs on login
[21:02] <guiss> oops, my mistake. Linux Terminal Server :) not Long Term Support
[21:03] <jmarsden> guiss: Did you read and try ideas from https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ClientTroubleshooting
[21:04] <incorrect> I want to bring up my bond0 interface with no ip config so i can then bridge it
[21:04] <incorrect> i don't see an option for no config
[21:06] <jetole> incorrect: are you asking how to enable bond0 without an IP address?
[21:07] <incorrect> yes
[21:07] <jetole> did you try ifconfig bond0 up?
[21:08] <jetole> or ip link set bond0 up
[21:08]  * Nafallo thinks the bond0 device is on vlan 007
[21:10] <incorrect> jetole, so what about running all the scripts to recreate the interface?
[21:11] <jetole> incorrect: don't know what you just asked me now but you asked how to enable a device without assigning an IP address to it
[21:11] <android6011> I want to create an energy efficient media streaming server /nas, I thought maybe installing ubuntu server to somethign such as a flash drive would help. Is this a good idea or no?
[21:11] <incorrect> jetole, with the other info was in interfaces
[21:12] <jetole> still not sure what you just asked
[21:12] <incorrect> you know what the interfaces file is?
[21:13] <jetole> /etc/network/interfaces?
[21:13] <jmarsden> android6011: You could do that... have you tried FreeNAS http://www.freenas.org/ ?
[21:13] <jetole> thats my guess
[21:13] <android6011> jmarsden: im looking to also have a mythtv backend so linux is my best bet
[21:15] <android6011> I thought maybe webmin would also help simplify maintenance if anyone has any experience with it
[21:15] <jetole> webmin is for people who don't know how to setup a system and want to risk breaking it at the gleam of a point and click interface
[21:16] <jetole> webmin is not something I would ever recommend to anyone
[21:16] <jetole> it doesn't know all the details about which version of what you have installed and tends to make some bad mistakes
[21:16] <android6011> thats too bad, well there is always ssh
[21:16] <jetole> best bet for simplifying maintenance is to know how to maintain it
[21:17] <jetole> yeah, ssh is a great tool
[21:17] <jetole> one I have used for over a decade
[21:18] <jetole> puppetmaster and cfengine are also great when it comes to distributed maintnance but you can't put a GUI in front of something and hope it makes it easiar unless you really understand how the gui works
[21:18] <android6011> ya
[21:18] <jetole> and if you are using webmin then you probably don't in the first place
[21:19] <android6011> also, because this is just a home streaming server, i would like for it to go into some power saving mode and wake up if something tries to access it over ethernet, will i specifically need wake on lan or does say sleep mode cover that
[21:19] <jetole> sorry to sound crass but linux server admin has been my job for a long time
[21:19] <android6011> heh ya
[21:20] <jetole> well sleep mode and wake on lan can work together however I don't think the kernel in ubuntu server supports sleep mode
[21:20] <jetole> it shouldn't since it's for a server
[21:20] <android6011> ya thats what i figured
[21:20] <jetole> look into using the desktop version
[21:21] <android6011> ya i was thinking about doing the desktop and just dissabling x but I don't like the idea of having all the extra overhead
[21:21] <jetole> they both use the same package repo i.e. same packages for both but the big diff is how the kernel is setup
[21:21] <jetole> what extra overhead?
[21:22] <jetole> update-rc -f gdm remove
[21:22] <jetole> X no longer starts
[21:22] <jetole> you can also install a server and then install the desktop kernel
[21:22] <android6011> just like all the extra packages installed by default etc
[21:23] <android6011> is there a minimal install disk like there is with debian?
[21:24] <jetole> I don't know but I have never seen it
[21:24] <jetole> I don't think so
[21:24] <jetole> install the server, then do an => apt-get install linux-image-generic
[21:25] <jetole> then set the generic kernel inside /boot/grub/menu.lst
[21:25] <android6011> wouldnt apt add it to menu.lst by default?
[21:25] <jetole> it might but I don't know if it will become the default
[21:25] <jetole> double check
[21:26] <jetole> also, even though the kernel supports it, I don't know if sleep will be enabled by default
[21:27] <jetole> you would probably have to read into that
[21:27] <jetole> I know on desktop edition it's not
[21:27] <jetole> it has to be told to but I have never set it up since I ssh into my machines
[21:28] <jetole> actually, wake on lan would work for a few but I have never looked into it
[21:29] <android6011> ya, i just dont want to have to manually tell the machine to wake up
[21:30] <jetole> then don't put it to sleep
[21:32] <incorrect> jetole, the answer is 'manual'
[21:32] <incorrect> or inet manual
[21:33] <jetole> incorrect: I don't know what your question was to begin with but you can do just about anything with manual mode or you can even skip interfaces entirely and write your own startup script
[21:34] <incorrect> nevermind then
[21:35] <jetole> did I sound concerned?
[21:35] <jetole> sorry if I did
[21:35] <incorrect> hmm i wonder what created virbr0
[21:35] <jetole> libvirt
[21:36] <jetole> /etc/init.d/libvirt-bin
[21:44] <incorrect> thanks
[22:10] <kirkland> Nafallo: hmm, no, not that I know of ...
[22:11] <kirkland> Nafallo: shift-pgup & shift-pgdown should be trapped by gnome-terminal, or whatever, and will scroll back in its buffer
[22:11] <kirkland> Nafallo: for proper scrollback on a per-window basis in screen itself, use F7
[22:13] <Nafallo> kirkland: well. my issue is that the screen doesn't scroll up in the current screen window anymore, but rather scroll to the previous one.
[22:13] <Nafallo> kirkland: this is HIGHLY suboptimal when you want to check switch configs for example.
[22:14] <kirkland> Nafallo: huh?
[22:14] <kirkland> Nafallo: i don't understand
[22:15] <Nafallo> kirkland: might be easier if we find each other on allhands? :-)
[22:15] <kirkland> Nafallo: :-)  sure
[22:15] <kirkland> Nafallo: so shift-pgup is switching among your tabs in gnome terminal?
[22:16] <Nafallo> kirkland: terminator
[22:16] <kirkland> Nafallo: or is it doing what f3-f4 are suppose to do?
[22:17] <Nafallo> kirkland: no. it's weirder than f3-f4, it's like it's scrolling back in it's buffer (as it should) but instead of scrolling a screen at a time it's scrolling back between windows (which should be what you call tabs)
[22:17] <Nafallo> kirkland: get a few windows and then output lots of content in the last one (cat or whatever), then try shift+pgup :-)
[22:18] <Nafallo> ehrm
[22:18] <Nafallo> actually. right now it DTRT :-/
[22:18] <Nafallo> I wonder if this have to do with the switches outputting something strange.
[22:19] <kirkland> Nafallo: oh, right, that's sort of "expected"
[22:19] <kirkland> Nafallo: so that shift-pgup is trapped by gnome-terminal
[22:19] <Nafallo> kirkland: I don't use gnome-terminal
[22:19] <kirkland> Nafallo: and it scrolls back through what it "knows" about
[22:19] <kirkland> Nafallo: okay, whatever your terminal is
[22:19] <kirkland> Nafallo: really, you need to use F7 if you want to scroll back in only one window
[22:20] <kirkland> Nafallo: this will let screen do the scrolling properly
[22:20] <kirkland> Nafallo: if you only open one window, it will DTRT all the time :-)
[22:20] <kirkland> Nafallo: if you don't switch between the two windows, it will DTRT
[22:20] <Nafallo> kirkland: well. I don't open "just one window" :-P
[22:21] <kirkland> Nafallo: you'll see the problem if you open two windows, do a "find . " in one, then switch to the other window, do an 'ls' and then shift-pgup
[22:21] <kirkland> Nafallo: your terminal is sort of like a video camera
[22:21] <kirkland> Nafallo: recording everything it sees scrolling by
[22:22] <kirkland> Nafallo: it doesn't have any intelligence about screen's windows
[22:22] <Nafallo> hmm. yeah. not sure if I understand correctly or if what I saw was different :-)
[22:23] <Nafallo> and the damn thing does the right thing at the moment.
[22:23] <Nafallo> which isn't extremely helpful :-P
[22:34] <incorrect> when i try and run a kvm I errors trying to connect to the framebuffer
[22:52] <incorrect> i thought kvm was supposed to be fairly fast?
[23:04] <Nafallo> incorrect: you might have better luck with those questions in #ubuntu-virt :-)
[23:05] <incorrect> thanks