[00:36] <larrymi_> nicbet: ack
[04:32] <konobi> is there a way to tell juju to stop asking for Ubuntu SSO creds?
[04:33] <konobi> (during deploy that is)
[04:41] <jrwren> publish your charm
[04:59] <spaok> if I have a subordinate charm one a service with multiple units, so each service lists my subordinate charm under it, can the subordinate charm get list of all the units in the service? seems like it only see's itself in related_units
[06:07] <marcoceppi> spaok: right, it can only see its peers
[06:07] <marcoceppi> spaok: what are you trying to get?
[06:36] <spaok> marcoceppi: I was thinking I needed to build a list of units in the charm to pass to haproxy, but I think from what I read about the haproxy charm it will union all the units that join with the same service_name so I might be ok
[06:37] <spaok> though I really wish the haproxy charm had a python example of how to send it the yaml structure it wants
[06:39] <spaok> i can't seem to figure out how to set the service structure it wants
[07:39] <stub> cholcombe: Yes. It needs to serialize the data it so it can detect changes and json was chosen as the format.
[08:15] <spaok> is relation_set local, or does it send data to the related unit
[08:18] <spaok> oh, interesting
[08:31] <stub> spaok: relation_set sets the data on the local end (the only place you can set data), which is visible to the remote units.
[08:32] <stub> spaok: A unit doesn't 'send' data on a relation. It sets the data on its local end and informs other units that it has changed.
[10:09] <socceroos> hi all
[10:10] <socceroos> Has anyone here tried using juju 2.0 to manage deployments on Digital Ocean?
[10:10] <socceroos> or any version of juju really...
[10:22] <socceroos> ping...
[12:10] <SimonKLB> is it possible to run charms that require authentication with the bundletester?
[12:11] <SimonKLB> and/or how can i run bundletester/amulet tests on charms that use resources?
[12:39] <anshul_> #juju
[12:41] <anshul_> facing an issue while testing Glance using Amulet.. Glance is loaded locally and while i execute JUJU STATUS the state does not change and it remains at glance:     charm: local:xenial/glance-150     exposed: false     service-status:       current: unknown       message: Waiting for agent initialization to finish       since: 06 Oct 2016 23:12:45+05:30     relations:       amqp:       - rabbitmq-server       cluster:       - glance
[12:42] <anshul_> facing an issue while testing Glance using Amulet.. Glance is loaded locally and while i execute JUJU STATUS the state does not change and it remains at "Waiting for agent initialization to finish".. and if i change the series to trusty it works fine
[12:43] <anshul_> Please help
[12:45] <anshul_> facing an issue while testing Glance using Amulet.. Glance is loaded locally and while i execute JUJU STATUS the state does not change and it remains at "Waiting for agent initialization to finish".. and if i change the series to trusty it works fine
[13:53] <nicbet> larrymi_ what version of VMWare are you running? I just can't get this to work properly. I've tried juju 1.25-6 over night, as well as using trusty images. always the same result with the public key not being injected properly and bootstrap failing.
[14:14] <petevg> bradm: did you ever get a chance to move the bip stuff to its own namespace. If so, would you go and close out the old reviews for it? (one of them is here: https://code.launchpad.net/~josvaz/charms/trusty/bip/client_side_ssl-with_helper-lp1604894/+merge/301802)
[14:16] <larrymi_> nicbet: I'm also using 6.0 3620759 for ESXi and 3644788 for the vCenter. I suspect it's a different issue but you'd need to be able to get to the logs. If I had to guess, I would guess that cloud-init is not able to get to a resource (perhaps blocked by the firewall)
[14:17] <nicbet> larrymi_ I'll have to do shenanigans and mount the failed bootstrap VM's hard drive to a different vm to access the logs... let me see
[14:18] <larrymi_> nicbet: ok
[14:20] <nicbet> larrymi_ would you mind sharing your redacted custom cloud yaml for vsphere? maybe I'm missing a config entry.
[14:22] <larrymi_> nicbet:   vsphere:
[14:22] <larrymi_>     type: vsphere
[14:22] <larrymi_>     auth-types: [userpass]
[14:22] <larrymi_>     endpoint: **.***.*.***
[14:22] <larrymi_>     regions:
[14:22] <larrymi_>       dc0: {}
[14:23] <nicbet> pretty much what I have, for me dc0 is replaced with our datacenter name
[15:06] <nicbet> larrymi_ : cloud-init.log on the mounted drive states that neither DataSourceOVFNet, nor DataSourceOVF could load any data. Notably this line appears too: ubuntu [CLOUDINIT] DataSourceOVF.py[DEBUG]: Customization for VMware platform is disabled.
[15:07] <nicbet> larrymi_ : did you configure something special on the vmware itself to enable OVF customization?
[15:09] <shruthima> hi kwmonroe , We are charming websphere liberty charm for Z , This charm provides httpport, httpsport, and hostname.we thought to make use of http interface https://github.com/juju-solutions/interface-http but we noticed http interface will provide only httpport and hostname . So, we want know do we need to wright a new interface ?
[15:19] <larrymi_> nicbet: I didn't have to configure anything... just the export prior to bootstrap that I mentioned earlier, but it won't bootstrap at without that.
[15:19] <larrymi_> nicbet: interesting that it's disabled.. I wonder what it's keying on.
[15:21] <nicbet> larrymi_ the cloudimage has open-vm-tools package installed. upon boot they are started, i see that from the logs. Then cloud init tries all different data sources, like EC2 store, Config ISO in CDROm, etc. one of them is OVFDatasource, which uses vmware tools to grab the info from the ovf template configuration
[15:21] <nicbet> larrymi_ at that point it's not given anything, and logs the above line about guest customization being disabled
[15:23] <nicbet> larrymi_ dumb question ... are you running juju against a vCenter or a vSphere ESXI?
[15:24] <larrymi_> nicbet: a vCenter
[15:24] <larrymi_> nicbet: which log are you looking at?
[15:25] <nicbet> larrymi_ /var/log/cloud-init.log and /var/log/vmware-vmsvc.log together with https://github.com/number5/cloud-init/blob/master/cloudinit/sources/DataSourceOVF.py
[15:28] <larrymi_> nicbet: I do have the same Oct  5 19:57:55 ubuntu [CLOUDINIT] DataSourceOVF.py[DEBUG]: Customization for VMware platform is disabled.
[15:28] <larrymi_> nicbet: can probably be ignored
[15:29] <nicbet> larrymi_ do you find a line that says it loaded cloud-init data from the OVF source?
[15:30] <larrymi_> nicbet: yes, it then goes on to Oct  5 19:57:54 ubuntu [CLOUDINIT] __init__.py[DEBUG]: Seeing if we can get any data from <class 'cloudinit.sources.DataSourceNoCloud.DataSourceNoCloud'>
[15:31] <nicbet> larrymi_ grep 'data found' cloud-init.log prints all lines as 'no local data found from ***' where *** is the DataSource it tried
[15:33] <rufus> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lm64uOErZ8w
[15:34] <larrymi_> nicbet: yeah they're there
[15:34] <larrymi_> Oct  5 19:57:55 ubuntu [CLOUDINIT] handlers.py[DEBUG]: finish: init-local/search-NoCloud: SUCCESS: no local data found from DataSourceNoCloud
[15:34] <larrymi_> Oct  5 19:57:55 ubuntu [CLOUDINIT] handlers.py[DEBUG]: start: init-local/search-ConfigDrive: searching for local data from DataSourceConfigDrive
[15:34] <nicbet> larrymi_ is there any that says data was found?
[15:40] <larrymi_> nicbet: the logs don't say data was found specifically but they seems to indicate that it only fails to get the data locally.
[15:45] <nicbet> larrymi_ I have a hunch that this only works with vCenter
[15:54] <kwmonroe> shruthima: i wouldn't write a new interface, just open an issue and/or provide a pull request to include an https port here:  https://github.com/juju-solutions/interface-http
[15:55] <shruthima> ok sure kwmonroe
[15:59] <shruthima> kwmonroe: May i know when will be the xenial series of current IBM-IM charm will be pulled back ? so we can push the ibm-im for Z
[16:00] <kwmonroe> shruthima: i'll try to complete that before my EOD, so roughly 7 hours from now.
[16:01] <shruthima> oh k thanku
[16:11] <larrymi_> nicbet: yes could be. I haven't tried with ESXi host as endpoint
[16:14] <shruthima> kwmonroe: i have edited http interface provides.py http://paste.ubuntu.com/23285185/ requires.py http://paste.ubuntu.com/23285180/ locally and tested it is working fine. So is there any way to create a merge proposal for http interface ?
[16:16] <shruthima> kwmonroe: i have seen https://github.com/juju-solutions/interface-http/issues/5 similar issue is opened for http interface also
[16:48] <kwmonroe> shruthima: issue #5 would allow you to define multiple http interfaces in your charm's metadata and react to them differently (with different ports).  if that would solve your needs, you can just add a comment to issue #5 saying it would be useful to you as well.  if you instead require multiple ports for a single http interface, i think that's a separate issue.  you could run "git diff" in the directory where you made your
[16:48] <kwmonroe>  edits, paste the output at http://paste.ubuntu.com, and then include that paste link in a new issue here: https://github.com/juju-solutions/interface-http/issues.
[16:50] <shruthima> ok thanks kevin
[17:01] <holocron> could some one take a look at this pastebin and tell me what next steps to debugging might be? http://pastebin.com/7MHZV4e3
[17:03] <holocron> this, specifically: unit-ceph-1: 12:57:00 INFO unit.ceph/1.update-status admin_socket: exception getting command descriptions: [Errno 111] Connection refused
[17:21] <spaok> stub: I guess what I'm confused on is, when I try to set the services structure for when haproxy joins, if do hookenv.relation_set(relation_id='somerelid:1', service_yaml) then the joined/changed hook runs, haproxy doesn't get the services yaml, however if I do hookenv.relation_set(relation_id=None, service_yaml) then it does work, and haproxy builds the config right, but after a bit when the update-status runs it errors because relation_id isn't set
[17:23] <stub> spaok: Specifying None for the relation id means use the JUJU_RELATION_ID environment variable, which is only set in relation hooks. Specifying an explicit relation id does the same thing, but will work in all hooks. Provided you used the correct relation id.
[17:25] <stub> spaok: You can test this using "juju run foo/0 'relation-set -r somerelid:1 foo=bar'" if you want.
[17:28] <stub> (juju run --unit foo/0 now it seems, with 2.0)
[17:28] <stub> "juju run --unit foo/0 'relation-ids somerelname' " to list the relationids in play
[17:29] <bdx> hows it going everyone?
[17:29] <bdx> do I have the capability to bootstrap to a specific subnet?
[17:29] <bdx> using aws provider
[17:31] <lutostag> any way to specify "charm build" deps? (for instance in my wheelhouse I have cffi, which when the charm is built depends on having libffi-dev installed. I have this in the README, but wondering if that was possible to enforce programatically
[17:31] <spaok> thanks stub, I'm fairly certain I have the right relid, but when I see from the haproxy side is only the private_ip and unit id something else, with None, I get the services yaml, its very confusing
[17:31] <spaok> I'll look at trying that command, I was wondering how to run the relation-set command
[17:32] <spaok> lutostag: layers.yaml ?
[17:32] <spaok> not 100% on that
[17:34] <lutostag> spaok: yeah, I have deps for install time unit-side like http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/23285512/, but not sure how to do it "charm build" side
[17:37] <spaok> ah gotca, not sure
[17:38] <lutostag> think I'll go with a wrapper around charm build in the top-level dir, don't need to turn charm into pip/apt/npm/snap anyways
[17:53] <kwmonroe> hey icey - can you help holocron with his ceph connection refused?  http://pastebin.com/7MHZV4e3
[17:57] <holocron> Something in dpkg giving an Input/output error
[18:00] <kwmonroe> lutostag: seems odd that an entry in your wheelhouse.txt would require a -dev to be installed for charm build
[18:02] <lutostag> kwmonroe: doesnt it though, it builds it locally. by compiling stuff, I guess there are c-extentsions in the python package itself
[18:02] <lutostag> lxml is another example
[18:02] <kwmonroe> cory_fu_:  does charm build have runtime reqs dependent on the wheelhouse?
[18:02] <kwmonroe> cory_fu_: (see lutostag's issue above)
[18:03] <lutostag> (but I can get around that one, cause we have that deb'd up)
[18:04] <holocron> kwmonroe icey going to try this http://askubuntu.com/questions/139377/unable-to-install-any-updates-through-update-manager-apt-get-upgrade
[18:04] <cory_fu_> lutostag, kwmonroe: You shouldn't need a -dev package for charm-build because it *should* be installing source only and building them on the deployed unit, since we don't know the arch ahead of time.
[18:05] <lutostag> ah, so I'll need these -dev's on the unit-side, good to know, but interesting.
[18:05] <kwmonroe> holocron: that doesn't sound like a ceph problem then... got a log with the dpkg error?
[18:06] <cory_fu_> lutostag: What's the repo for cffi so I can try building it?
[18:06] <lutostag> cory_fu_: my charm or the upstream python package?
[18:07] <cory_fu_> lutostag: The charm
[18:07] <lutostag> cory_fu_: lemme push...
[18:07] <cory_fu_> Sorry, I misread cffi as the charm name
[18:08] <holocron> kwmonroe: similar messages to this: http://pastebin.com/XZ0uFfz8
[18:08] <holocron> I've had make, and build-essential give the error, right now it's libdpkg-perl
[18:10] <kwmonroe> holocron: when do you see that?  on charm deploy
[18:10] <lutostag> cory_fu_: bzr branch lp:~lutostag/oil-ci/charm-weebl+weasyprint-dep
[18:11] <holocron> kwmonroe no, the charm deployed fine yesterday, it came in as part of the openstack-on-lxd bundle. i was able to create a cinder volume even.. logged in today and saw that error in my first pastebin
[18:11] <lutostag> (and I'll need to add the deps as explained too)
[18:11] <holocron> i logged into the unit and did an apt-get clean and apt-get update
[18:11] <holocron> now it's failing with this
[18:12] <holocron> is it common practice to scale out another unit and then tear down the breaking one?
[18:12] <holocron> like, should i just make that my default practice or should i try to fix this unit?
[18:12] <kwmonroe> holocron: common practice for for the breaking unit not to break
[18:13] <kwmonroe> especially on some nonsense apt operation
[18:13] <holocron> :P yeah that's the ideal
[18:13] <kwmonroe> is that unit perhaps out of disk space holocron?
[18:13] <kwmonroe> or inodes?  (df -h && df -i)
[18:13] <holocron> nope, lots of space
[18:14] <holocron> lots of inodes
[18:16] <kwmonroe> holocron: anything in dmesg, /var/log/syslog, or /var/log/apt/* on that container that would help explain the dpkg failure?
[18:18] <holocron> kwmonroe probably,sorry i've got to jump to another thing now but i'll try to get back
[18:19] <kwmonroe> np holocron
[18:36] <Siva> I am trying to remove my application in juju 2.0 but it is not working
[18:36] <Siva> I put pdb.set_trace() in my code
[18:36] <Siva> Not sure if it is because of that
[18:36] <Siva> juju remove-application does not remove the application
[18:37] <Siva> How do I now forcefully remove it?
[18:37] <Siva> Any help is much appreciated
[18:38] <spaok> is there a decorator for the update-status hook? or do I use @hook?
[18:40] <Siva> It is stuck at the install hook where I put pdb
[18:40] <Siva> I have the following decorator for the install hook, @hooks.hook()
[18:41] <spaok> Siva can you remove the machine?
[18:41] <lutostag> Siva: juju resolved --no-retry <unit> # over and over till its gone
[18:41] <kwmonroe> Siva: remove-application will first remove relations between your app and something else, then it will remove all units of your app, then it will remove the machine (if your app was the last unit on a machine)
[18:42] <kwmonroe> Siva: you're probably trapping the remove-relation portion of remove-application, which means you'll need to continue or break or whatever pdb takes to let it continue tearing down relations / units / machines
[18:43] <stub> Siva: The hook will likely never complete, so you either need to go in and kill it yourself or run 'juju remove-machine XXX --force'
[18:43] <kwmonroe> so lutostag's suggestion would work -- keep resolving the app with --no-retry to make your way through the app's lifecycle.  or spaok's suggestion might be faster -- juju remove-machine X --force
[18:43] <spaok> I work with containers, so I tend to do that mostly
[18:44] <stub> (and haven't we all left our Python debugger statements in a hook at some point)
[18:44] <Siva> I removed the machine, it shows the status as 'stopped'
[18:44] <spaok> takes a sec
[18:44] <kwmonroe> keep watching.. it'll go away
[18:45] <spaok> also rerun the remove-application
[18:45] <Siva> OK. @lutostag suggestion did the trick
[18:45] <spaok> I've notcied some application ghosts when I remove machines
[18:45] <Siva> Now it is gone
[18:46] <Siva> Thanks
[18:47] <stub> spaok: yes, its perfectly valid to have an application deployed to no units. Makes sense when setting up subordinates, more dubious with normal charms.
[18:48] <Siva> One thing I noticed is that after removing the machine (say 0/lxd/14 is removed) now when you deploy it creates the machine 0/lxd/15 rather than 14
[18:48] <Siva> is this expected?
[18:49] <spaok> ya
[18:49] <Siva> same for units as well
[18:49] <spaok> yup
[18:49] <spaok> makes deployer scripts fun
[18:49] <Siva> Why does it not consider the freed ones so that it is in sequence?
[18:50] <rick_h_> Siva: mainly because it makes things like logs more useful when the numbers are unique
[18:50] <rick_h_> Siva: especially as everything is async
[18:51] <rick_h_> Siva: so you can be sure any logs re: unit 15 are in fact the unit that was destroyed at xx:xx
[18:51] <Siva> OK
[18:52] <Siva> It looks a bit weird in the 'juju status' as the sequence is  broken
[18:52] <rick_h_> Siva: yea, understand, but for the best imho
[19:03] <spaok> Siva: why I have scripts to destroy and recreate my MAAS/Juju 2.0 dev env, good to reset sometimes
[19:05] <Siva> One question
[19:05] <Siva> I have the following entry in the config.yaml file
[19:05] <Siva> tor-type:     type: string     description: Always ovs     default: ovs
[19:06] <Siva> Now when do, tor_type = config.get("tor_type")     print "SIVA: ", tor_type
[19:06] <Siva> I expect it to print the default value 'ovs' as I have not set any value
[19:06] <Siva> It prints nothing
[19:06] <Siva> Is this a expected?
[19:06] <spaok> tor_type or tor-type?
[19:07] <Siva> oops! my bad
[19:07] <spaok> I put underscores in my config.yaml
[19:08] <Siva> Now after making the change, I can just 'redeploy', right?
[19:08] <spaok> you can test by editing the charm live if you wanted
[19:08] <Siva> How do I do that?
[19:09] <spaok> vi /var/lib/juju/agents/unit-charmname-id/charms/config.yaml
[19:09] <spaok> kick jujud in the pants by
[19:09] <spaok> ps aux |grep jujud-unit-charmname |grep -v grep | awk '{print $2}' | xargs kill -9
[19:09] <spaok> should cause the charm to run
[19:19] <Siva> I modified the config.yaml and restarted the jujud
[19:19] <Siva> still prints None
[19:30] <spaok> Siva: in my reactive charm I just config('tor_type')
[19:30] <spaok> not config.get
[19:30] <spaok> not sure the diff
[19:56] <Siva> I removed the app and deployed it again
[19:56] <Siva> config.get works
[19:57] <Siva> I can try config('tor_type') and see how it goes
[20:24] <cory_fu_> kwmonroe: Comments on https://github.com/juju-solutions/layer-apache-bigtop-base/pull/50
[20:25] <icey> hey holocron kwmonroe just seeing the messages
[20:25] <icey> to me, the line saying admin_socket: connection refused is more interesting; it looks like maybe the ceph monitor is down?
[20:27] <holocron> icey hey, i ended up tearing down the controller. I'm going to redeploy now and i'll drop a line in here if it happens again
[20:28] <icey> holocron:  great; kwmonroeis right though, the expectation is that it wouldn't break
[20:30] <Siva> @spaok, live config.yaml change testing does not work for me
[20:40] <kwmonroe> cory_fu_: i like the callback idea in https://github.com/juju-solutions/layer-apache-bigtop-base/pull/50.  but i'm not gonna get to that by tomorrow, and i really want the base hadoop charms refreshed (which depend on the pr as is).  you ok if i open an issue to do it better in the future, but merge for now?
[20:41] <kwmonroe> cory_fu_: it doesn't matter what you say, mind you.  petevg already +1'd it.  just trying to fake earnest consideration.
[20:41] <cory_fu_> ha
[20:42] <cory_fu_> kwmonroe: I'm also +1 on it as-is, but I'd like to reduce boilerplate where we can.  But we can go back and refactor it later
[20:44] <cory_fu_> kwmonroe: Issue opened and PR merged
[20:44] <cory_fu_> kwmonroe: And I'm good on the other commits you made for the xenial updates
[20:48] <kwmonroe> dag nab cory_fu_!  you're fast.  i was still pontificating on the title of a new issue.  thanks!!
[20:50] <kwmonroe> and thanks for the xenial +1.  i'll squash, pr, and set the clock for 24 hours till i can push ;)
[20:50] <kwmonroe> just think, you'll be swimming when the upstream charms get refreshed.
[20:50] <kwmonroe> nice knowing you
[20:58] <kwmonroe> before you go cory_fu_.. did you see mark's note to the juju ML about blocked status?  seems the slave units are reporting "blocked" even when a relation is present.  i'm pretty sure it's because of this:  https://github.com/juju-solutions/bigtop/blob/master/bigtop-packages/src/charm/hadoop/layer-hadoop-slave/reactive/hadoop_status.py#L22
[20:59] <kwmonroe> as in, there *is* a spec mismatch until NN/RM are ready.  what's the harm in setting status with a spec mismatch?
[21:01] <kwmonroe> afaict, they'll report "waiting for ready", which seems ok to me.  unless we want to add a separate block for specifically dealing with spec mismatches, which would be some weird state between waiting and blocked to see if the spec ever does eventually match.
[21:08] <cory_fu_> kwmonroe: I think the problem is one of when hooks are triggered.  I think that what's happening is that the relation is established and reported, but the hook doesn't get called on both sides right away, leaving one side reporting "blocked" even though the relation is there, simply because it hasn't been informed of it yet
[21:11] <kwmonroe> i think i don't agree with ya cory_fu_... NN will send DN info early (https://github.com/juju-solutions/bigtop/blob/bug/BIGTOP-2548/xenial-charm-refresh/bigtop-packages/src/charm/hadoop/layer-hadoop-namenode/reactive/namenode.py#L27).  but check out what's missing... https://github.com/juju-solutions/interface-dfs/blob/master/requires.py#L95
[21:12] <cory_fu_> kwmonroe: Doesn't matter.  The waiting vs blocked status only depends on the .joined state: https://github.com/apache/bigtop/blob/master/bigtop-packages/src/charm/hadoop/layer-hadoop-slave/reactive/hadoop_status.py#L36
[21:12] <kwmonroe> spoiler alert cory_fu_:  it's clustername.  we don't send that until NN is all the way up, so the specmatch will be false:  https://github.com/juju-solutions/bigtop/blob/bug/BIGTOP-2548/xenial-charm-refresh/bigtop-packages/src/charm/hadoop/layer-hadoop-namenode/reactive/namenode.py#L142
[21:13] <kwmonroe> cory_fu_: you crazy:  https://github.com/apache/bigtop/blob/master/bigtop-packages/src/charm/hadoop/layer-hadoop-slave/reactive/hadoop_status.py#L22
[21:13] <cory_fu_> kwmonroe: Ooh, I see.
[21:13] <cory_fu_> We should remove that @when_none line.  There's no reason for it
[21:14] <kwmonroe> great idea cory_fu_!  if only i had it 15 minutes ago.
[21:14] <cory_fu_> :)
[21:15] <kwmonroe> petevg: you mentioned you also saw charms blocked on missing relations (maybe zookeeper?).  could it be you saw the slaves blocked instead?
[21:16] <neiljerram> Aaaargh guys, would you _please_ stop making gratuitous changes in every Juju 2 beta or rc?
[21:17] <neiljerram> The latest one that has just bitten my testing is the addition of a * after the unit name in juju status output.
[21:17] <neiljerram> Before that it was 'juju set-config' being changed to 'juju config'
[21:17] <neiljerram> This is getting old....
[21:23] <petevg> kwmonroe: Yes. I think that it was probably just the hadoop slave.
[21:23] <kwmonroe> neiljerram: apologies for the headaches!  but you should see much more stability in the RCs.  at least for me, api has been pretty consistent with rc1/rc2.  rick_h_ do you know if there are significant api/output changes in the queue from now to GA?
[21:24] <kwmonroe> thx petevg - fingers crossed that was the only outlier
[21:24] <petevg> np
[21:24] <petevg> fingers crossed.
[21:25] <neiljerram> kwmonroe, tbh I'm afraid I have to say that I think things have been _less_ stable since the transition from -beta to -rc.  My guess is that there are changes that people have been thinking they should do for a while, but only now that the GA is really looking likely so they think that they should get them out :-)
[21:27] <neiljerram> kwmonroe, but don't worry, I've had my moan now...
[21:27] <kwmonroe> heh neiljerram - fair enough :)
[21:28] <neiljerram> Do you happen to know what the new * means?  Should I expect to see it on every juju status line?
[21:29] <kwmonroe> neiljerram: i was just about to ask you the same thing... i haven't seen the '*'
[21:29] <kwmonroe> neiljerram: you on rc1, 2, or 3?
[21:30] <neiljerram> kwmonroe, rc3 now; here's an excerpt from I test I currently have running:
[21:30] <neiljerram>        UNIT                WORKLOAD  AGENT  MACHINE  PUBLIC-ADDRESS   PORTS  MESSAGE
[21:30] <neiljerram>        calico-devstack/0*  unknown   idle   0        <IP_ADDRESS>
[21:30] <neiljerram>
[21:30] <neiljerram>        MACHINE  STATE    DNS              INS-ID         SERIES  AZ
[21:30] <neiljerram>        0        started  <IP_ADDRESS>  juju-0f506f-0  trusty  us-central1-a
[21:32] <neiljerram> kwmonroe, just doing another deployment with more units, to get more data
[21:32] <kwmonroe> hmph... neiljerram i wonder if that's an attempt to truncate the unit name to a certain length.  doesn't make sense in your case, but i could see 'really-long-unit-name/0' being truncated to 'really-long-u*' to keep the status columns sane.
[21:32] <kwmonroe> just a guess neiljerram
[21:33] <kwmonroe> and at any rate neiljerram, if you're scraping 'juju status', you might want to consider scraping 'juju status --format=tabular', which might be more consistent.
[21:33] <neiljerram> kwmonroe, BTW the reason this matters for my automated testing is that I have some quite tricky code that is trying to determine when the deployment as a whole is really ready.
[21:33] <kwmonroe> ugh, not right
[21:34] <kwmonroe> sorry, i meant 'juju status --format=yaml', not tabular
[21:34] <neiljerram> kwmonroe, yes, I suppose that would probably be better
[21:36] <neiljerram> kwmonroe, Ah, it seems that * means 'no longer waiting for machine'
[21:44] <kwmonroe> neiljerram: you sure?  i just went to rc3 and deployed ubuntu... i still see:
[21:44] <kwmonroe> UNIT      WORKLOAD  AGENT       MACHINE  PUBLIC-ADDRESS  PORTS  MESSAGE
[21:44] <kwmonroe> ubuntu/0  waiting   allocating  0        <IP_ADDRESS>          waiting for machine
[21:44] <neiljerram> kwmonroe, exactly - because the machine hasn't been started yet
[21:44] <kwmonroe> oh, nm neiljerram, i should wait longer.. you said the '*' is....
[21:44] <kwmonroe> right
[21:45] <kwmonroe> i gotta say, intently watching juju status is right up there with the birth of my first child
[21:51] <kwmonroe> neiljerram: i can't get the '*' after the machine is ready, nor using a super long unit name.  i'm not sure where that's coming from.
[21:51] <kwmonroe> UNIT                       WORKLOAD     AGENT      MACHINE  PUBLIC-ADDRESS  PORTS  MESSAGE
[21:51] <kwmonroe> really-long-ubuntu-name/0  maintenance  executing  1        <IP_ADDRESS>          (install) installing charm software
[21:51] <kwmonroe> ubuntu/0                   active       idle       0        <IP_ADDRESS>          ready
[21:52] <neiljerram> kwmonroe, do you have rc3?
[21:52] <kwmonroe> neiljerram: i do... http://paste.ubuntu.com/23286448/
[21:55] <neiljerram> kwmonroe, curious, I don't know then.  I'm also using AWS, so it's not because we're using different clouds.
[21:56] <kwmonroe> neiljerram: i'm aws-west.  if you're east, it could be signifying the hurricane coming to the east coast this weekend.
[21:56] <neiljerram> kwmonroe, :-)
[21:56] <kwmonroe> rc3 backed by weather.com ;)
[21:57] <kwmonroe> neiljerram: care to /join #juju-dev?  i'll ask the core devs where the '*' is coming from
[21:57] <neiljerram> kwmonroe, sure, will do
[22:13] <kwmonroe> for anyone following along, the '*' denotes leadership
[22:29] <magicaltrout> i thought you were the leader kwmonroe
[22:29] <kwmonroe> that's kwmonroe* to you magicaltrout
[22:30] <magicaltrout> Texas' own Idi Amin
[22:30] <kwmonroe> magicaltrout: you still in souther california?  or did you get back to the right side of the atlantic?
[22:31] <magicaltrout> hehe
[22:31] <magicaltrout> i'm back in the motherland for now
[22:31] <magicaltrout> been instructed to report to Washington DC on the 28th November
[22:31] <magicaltrout> so not for long
[22:32] <magicaltrout> although i was hoping a nice sunny jaunt to ApacheCon EU was gonna be the last trip of the year
[22:34] <kwmonroe> must be hard being so popular magicaltrout
[22:34] <magicaltrout> trololol
[22:34] <magicaltrout> whatever
[22:34] <magicaltrout> kwmonroe: is cory_fu_ staying in your basement?
[22:35] <kwmonroe> magicaltrout: two things you should know about central Texas:  1) it's all bedrock; no basements.  2) cory_fu_ was a track lead at the summit; he stays at the Westin.
[22:37] <magicaltrout> Westin? and you lot dumped us at the Marriot?
[22:37] <magicaltrout> I need to upgrade
[22:37] <magicaltrout> get me a real community sponsor!
[22:37] <kwmonroe> apply for track lead in Ghent next year ;)
[22:38] <kwmonroe> comes with a bright orange shirt.. wearable anywhere!
[22:38] <magicaltrout> they did look nice....... sadly I'll be too drunk
[22:38] <magicaltrout> oh
[22:38] <magicaltrout> that never stopped you guys
[22:39] <magicaltrout> i could lead the "werid big data - container crossover"
[22:39] <magicaltrout> s/werid/weird
[22:40] <kwmonroe> pretty sure you're already leading that
[22:40] <magicaltrout> hehe
[22:40] <kwmonroe> i don't understand why mapreduce wasn't enough for you
[22:40] <magicaltrout> yeah i've been tapping up the mesos mailing list the last few days trying to figure out what needs to be done to get LXC support in their container stack
[22:41] <kwmonroe> everything can be solved with mapred.  and if it can't, map it again.
[22:41] <magicaltrout> i'm not a C programmer though so it might take me a while unless my IDE-fu wins
[22:43] <kwmonroe> try emacs
[22:44] <magicaltrout> I use emacs actually kwmonroe :P
[22:44] <magicaltrout> just not for coding :)
[22:44] <kwmonroe> sure magicaltrout.. it's also good as a desktop environment and for playing solitaire.
[22:44] <magicaltrout> exactly see
[22:44] <magicaltrout> you know kwmonroe
[22:44] <magicaltrout> you know
[22:45] <magicaltrout> sorry.... kwmonroe*
[22:45] <kwmonroe> so magicaltrout*, how can we help you with apachecon seville?  you've got some drill bit work i pressume?
[22:47] <magicaltrout> yeah. Plan do to a bigtop & drill demo
[22:47] <magicaltrout> get some stuff in a bundle so willing volunteers can test etc
[22:47] <magicaltrout> if that latest RC changelog isn't a lie.... drill will even work in LXC which is a bonus
[22:47] <kwmonroe> roger that magicaltrout.. i'll volunteer!
[22:48] <magicaltrout> for the first time ever, the Juju talk is the easier of the two. I'll knock something together next week and we can iterate over it
[22:49] <magicaltrout> we've got a month or so
[22:49] <magicaltrout> try and not leave it to the last minute for a change
[22:49] <kwmonroe> !remindme 1 month
[22:49] <magicaltrout> yeah, well for ApacheCon NA i was writing the talks on the plane
[22:49] <magicaltrout> so you know....
[22:49] <magicaltrout> how bad can it be?
[22:50] <kwmonroe> it could be as bad as a 6 out of 10. but no worse.
[22:51] <magicaltrout> thanks for the reassurance
[23:24] <bdx> cmars: https://github.com/cmars/juju-charm-mattermost/pull/2/files
[23:25] <cmars> bdx, why does it need nginx embedded?
[23:26] <cmars> bdx, the systemd support is nice
[23:26] <bdx> cmars: so I can give my users a clean fqdn with no ports hanging on the end
[23:27] <bdx> cmars: plus, mattermost docs suggest it
[23:27] <cmars> bdx, ok, that makes sense
[23:27] <cmars> bdx, is it worth exposing the mattermost-port at all then?
[23:28] <cmars> might just leave it fixed and local only..
[23:28] <bdx> ok
[23:29] <cmars> bdx, also, let's remove trusty from the series in metadata
[23:29] <bdx> I thought i did ... checking
[23:30] <cmars> bdx, ah, you did, my bad
[23:32] <bdx> cmars: there ya go
[23:32] <lutostag> how would I fix 2016-10-06 23:30:28 ERROR juju.worker.dependency engine.go:526 "leadership-tracker" manifold worker returned unexpected error: leadership failure: lease manager stopped... which daemon should I kick on the unit?
[23:33] <lutostag> 2.0 beta7 (can't tear down and redeploy for a little while unfortunately)
[23:36] <cmars> bdx, thanks, i'll have to test this out, but i could publish it soon. probably need to update the resource as well
[23:39] <bdx> cmars: totally, I was thinking of adding a tls-certificates interface, so if a user desired to have ssl, they could just relate to the easyrsa charms
[23:39] <cmars> bdx, oooh nice!
[23:40] <bdx> actually, I feel that functionality should be a part of the nginx charm though
[23:40] <cmars> bdx, do we have a LE layer yet?
[23:40] <cmars> that'd be really nice for a private secure mattermost
[23:40] <bdx> stokachu: ^^
[23:40] <bdx> cmars, stokachu: https://jujucharms.com/u/containers/easyrsa/2
[23:40] <bdx> LE layer?
[23:41] <cmars> let's encrypt
[23:41] <bdx> oooo
[23:42] <bdx> cmars: there should be
[23:42] <bdx> I know we have discussed it
[23:57] <stokachu> lutostag: switch to the admin controller and ssh into machine 0
[23:57] <stokachu> lutostag: then just pkill jujud and it'll restart and pick back up
[23:57] <stokachu> bdx: sorry some extra context?
[23:57] <stokachu> ah i see nginx


[00:01] <eduardosanzb> hello
[00:02] <eduardosanzb> i was installing ubunti on a nexus7, but after pushing all the files and, i guess flash the .img, the tablet never reboots!!
[00:02] <belak> eduardosanzb: how did you install it?
[00:03] <eduardosanzb> i follow the steps of the wiki
[00:03] <eduardosanzb> my n7 was unlocked already
[00:03] <eduardosanzb> right now is pushing the files
[00:04] <eduardosanzb> for third time
[00:04] <eduardosanzb> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Install?action=show&redirect=TouchInstallProcess
[00:04] <belak> I had better luck doing it manually...
[00:05] <eduardosanzb> how do u do that?
[00:05] <eduardosanzb> install the zip from clockword?'
[00:06] <eduardosanzb> there are 2 .zip
[00:06] <eduardosanzb> in the downloads
[00:06] <Courtenay> anyone tryed multirom yet? i think i need a .img.gz
[00:06] <belak> You use fastboot to install the boot
[00:06] <belak> And then flash both the zips
[00:07] <eduardosanzb> but, never was downloaded the boot
[00:07] <belak> eduardosanzb: well, that's how I did it
[00:07] <eduardosanzb> ok
[00:08] <eduardosanzb> well, i dont know what just happend
[00:08] <eduardosanzb> lol
[00:08] <eduardosanzb> but the screen when the .img is installing has an error
[00:09] <eduardosanzb> the progress bar is super large and has red pixels
[00:09] <eduardosanzb> =(
[00:12] <eduardosanzb> i found this
[00:12] <eduardosanzb> http://liliputing.com/2013/02/how-to-install-ubuntu-touch-on-a-nexus-7-with-windows-mac-or-linux.html
[00:12] <AlanBell> hi eduardosanzb
[00:12] <eduardosanzb> hi
[00:17] <roasted> hello!
[00:17] <roasted> question - will this dev preview get OTA updates as time goes on?
[00:17] <roasted> or will we have to manually install/flash/etc to get updates?
[00:19] <GuidoPallemans> where can I find the source for the ubuntu phone internet application?
[00:19] <robertjw> apt-get is not in the path, it looks like there are no provisions in this early version for installs or updates
[00:26] <roasted> so
[00:26] <roasted> I opened a picture in gallery... and I can't seem to get out of full screen mode of this picture. lol??
[00:27] <roasted> oh, I see. I can scroll up and bring up a back button.
[00:32] <eduardosanzb> i did the manual install
[00:32] <eduardosanzb> but the tablet, never rebots
[00:32] <eduardosanzb> reboots
[00:33] <eduardosanzb> im going to do a full wipe
[00:35] <eduardosanzb> i need to wait too mucho for the first boot?
[00:43] <GuidoPallemans> what apps have settings?
[00:50] <robertjw> I should correct a statement I made earlier.  apt-get is in the path after you change context with 'ubuntu_chroot shell'
[00:52] <robertjw> roasted: so you should be able to do updates from a usb shell
[00:52] <roasted> oh?
[00:53] <robertjw> I just tried doing updates and apt-get went through all the right motions, but there were no packages needing update
[00:53] <roasted> how on earth did you get to apt-get?
[00:53] <roasted> did you find terminal?
[00:53] <robertjw> there are two ways
[00:53] <robertjw> first, the device supports adb
[00:54] <roasted> are you experiencing any slowness as you load on more apps?
[00:54] <robertjw> so you can do "adb root; adb shell"  and that will give you a root command prompt on the device
[00:55] <robertjw> then on that command prompt, do "ubuntu_chroot shell" to get into a context with access to apt-get
[00:56] <robertjw> the second way, is to use your usb adb connection to install openssh-server and then you can ssh directly through your wifi connection
[00:56] <robertjw> that's what i'm doing now
[01:13] <usererror> anyone else getting a blank screen?  tried redownloading and flashing the files again using phablet-flash 3 times now.. just a black screen.. gave it about 35 minutes and so far nothing past black.. am I not giving it long enough or is should I try manually pushing the files?
[01:16] <usererror> okay I got a loading bar now
[01:16] <usererror> progress bar* on a gray screen
[01:16] <usererror> so apparently 4th time is the charm?
[01:25] <usererror> :) okay well it sorted itself out
[02:49] <LarrySteeze> hello my friends!
[02:49] <LarrySteeze> just wanted to check in to see if anyone knew where I could find a list of devs for this project
[04:36] <ethana3> I just installed Ubuntu Touch Preview on my Nexus 10, how long should I wait for it to boot up?
[04:37] <ethana3> I waited for what felt like an hour, and it was just a black screen with the backlight on
[04:37] <ethana3> and then restarted it.. and reflashed it
[04:37] <ethana3> now it's sitting there black with the backlight on again
[04:38] <ethana3> #colemak
[04:38] <ethana3> oops, sorry, forgot the /join
[04:41] <ethana3> I can't turn it off, no matter what I do it just starts back up, does nothing, and slowly decreases the life of the screen LEDs
[04:44] <rsalveti> ethana3: can you check the amount of disk space you have at /data?
[04:44] <rsalveti> you need at least 2gb there
[04:44] <rsalveti> run adb shell
[04:45] <ethana3> rsalveti: I thought it wiped everything?
[04:45]  * ethana3 runs adb shell
[04:45] <rsalveti> see if you have /data/ubuntu/
[04:45] <ethana3> k
[04:45] <rsalveti> ethana3: we're still not formating /data/ by default
[04:45] <ethana3> can't cd, permission denied
[04:46] <ethana3> cd /data/ubuntu says no such file or directory
[04:46] <rsalveti> ethana3: yeah, probably not enough disk space
[04:46] <ethana3> rsalveti: I backed everything up
[04:46] <rsalveti> we're working on a fix, but meanwhile just boot to recovery, format /data and flash it again
[04:47] <ethana3> should I just start deleting videos from my DCIM?
[04:50] <rsalveti> ethana3: that is also an option, but formating is always the safe choice
[04:50] <rsalveti> as you got backup going already
[04:50] <ethana3> ok, I can't boot into recovery with actual options; i'm trying to do this through adb
[04:51] <ethana3> ok, ran "recovery --wipe_data" in adb shell.
[04:51] <ethana3> looks like it's doing things.
[04:52] <ethana3> reflashing
[04:56] <ethana3> ok, it's going through the flashing process on the tablet again
[04:57] <doomlord> what do you get access to in c++ on ubuntu-tablet
[05:05] <ethana3> rsalveti: do you know how long I should wait for it to boot up before I conclude that something failed? Is an hour excessive?
[05:06] <rsalveti> ethana3: yeah
[05:06] <rsalveti> it should come up right away
[05:06] <rsalveti> the black screen usually means it didn't flash the ubuntu file correctly
[05:06] <ethana3> rsalveti: ....ah. then it failed again
[05:06] <rsalveti> ethana3: then go to recovery
[05:06] <rsalveti> ethana3: install zip
[05:07] <rsalveti> and install the quantal-....ubuntu.zip
[05:07] <ethana3> I don't think I can get there...
[05:07] <rsalveti> see if that works
[05:07] <rsalveti> adb reboot recovery
[05:07] <ethana3> aahhhhh
[05:08] <ethana3> it went straight to the open-chassis android with the spinny icosatertradacteron or whatever
[05:08] <ethana3> and a progress bar
[05:08] <rsalveti> right, that's probably the autoflash working now
[05:08] <rsalveti> that should take 1 minute
[05:08] <ethana3> k
[05:10] <ethana3> that bar always seems to get to about 80% before it just restarts or whatever it does next
[05:11] <ethana3> it rebooted O.o
[05:12] <ethana3> twice
[05:12] <rsalveti> right
[05:12] <ethana3> UBUNTU!
[05:12] <rsalveti> \o/
[05:12] <ethana3> it looks AMAZING
[05:12] <ethana3> rsalveti: you have saved my sanity tonight, I haven't been this excited for quite some time
[05:12] <ethana3> rsalveti: thank you SO MUCH
[05:12] <rsalveti> :D
[05:13] <ethana3> I can't wait to show everyone at work :D
[05:13] <ethana3> hmm, it froze
[05:14] <rsalveti> I'd suspect that the flash kind of worked
[05:14] <rsalveti> due the reboots
[05:14] <ethana3> booting it up again..
[05:14] <rsalveti> copy quantal-preinstalled-phablet-armhf.zip to /sdcard/
[05:15] <rsalveti> then recovery and install that via the zip option
[05:15] <rsalveti> make sure you don't have /sdcard/autoflash.zip
[05:15] <ethana3> hmm, i'm at the home screen, it's responsive now
[05:16] <ethana3> adb shell still works; I guess it's not running on the tablet... or running on a part of the Android kernel that Ubuntu still uses?
[05:16] <rsalveti> latter
[05:17] <ethana3> I don't see autoflash.zip in /sdcard
[05:17] <rsalveti> cool, then the flash procedure was done
[05:17] <rsalveti> just weird that it rebooted 2 times
[05:18] <rsalveti> it shouldn't
[05:18] <rsalveti> in case of big issues and big crashes try flashing just the ubuntu part again
[05:18] <rsalveti> there's one ui freeze that we know and if you open too many apps the shell will crash
[05:18] <ethana3> k
[05:18] <rsalveti> we're working to fix that asap
[05:20] <ethana3> does wifi work on the Nexus 10?
[05:20] <rsalveti> yup
[05:20] <ethana3> AHA, found it
[05:20] <ethana3> interesting.
[05:21] <doomlord> ubuntu website says c++/gl is supported .. are there SDK samples for this..'hello triang;e'  in ubuntu-tablet
[05:23] <rsalveti> time to go, cya
[13:33] <gurix> hey hey, great work as far as i can see
[13:34] <ali1234> gurix: everyone is in #ubuntu-phone
[13:34] <gurix> so phone and tablet is almost the same technicaly speaking?
[13:35] <Walther> gurix: that is pretty much the reason the repository is called "phablet", no matter how much many people hate that "word"
[13:36] <ali1234> gurix: they use identical root filesystem
[13:36] <gurix> sounds logical to me, but i am not an ubuntu coder so i don't know their repositories
[13:37] <gurix> half a your ago I bought an adroid tablet and after all I am really disappointed
[13:39] <gurix> so is there any chance to get ubuntu tablet working an older tablet or is the first versions only for dedicated hardware?
[13:41] <ali1234> unofficial ports are in progress
[13:41] <ali1234> what tablet do you have?
[13:42] <gurix> Acer Iconia Tab A510
[13:42] <k1l> gurix: make sure they meet the minimum requirements
[13:42] <k1l> gurix: and then you will need someone to port it to your device.
[13:42] <k1l> (and keep in mind its not a full working OS yet. just in preview state)
[13:42] <ali1234> gurix: that should be doable
[13:43] <ali1234> hardware is good enough at least
[13:43] <ali1234> tegra3 = same as nexus 7
[13:44] <gurix> is there any documentation how to build and install it?
[13:45] <ali1234> yes https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Porting
[13:47] <gurix> oh yeah just found it too. That would help for the moment. Thanks guys
[14:12] <Walther> Any news on dualboot support?
[15:09] <ptl> hi
[15:09] <ptl> what's the URL of the hangout?
[15:09] <ptl> ubuntuonair.com does not show it
[15:10] <ali1234> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOvGullZwcw&feature=plcp&newstate=d51b25c17af5ed0dd58f1333b86cfc60
[16:37] <bcurtiswx> in the tablet edition, what editor can i install to edit system files ?
[16:46] <genii-around> Heh, Jose Antonio seems to be on every *buntu video
[16:56] <bcurtiswx> seems the nexus7 can't connect to secure networks, and when i have to login to a non-secure network it only lets me type in 2 characters to the login field before it acts funny
[16:57] <bcurtiswx> can i launch the browser from shell ?
[17:13] <doomlord> for C++ applications, what libraries/interfaces are available.. how does your program interact with the rest of the UI
[17:46] <bcurtiswx> how do you quit an app? seems like i'm just missing something
[17:54] <mhall119> bcurtiswx: https://plus.google.com/u/0/109919666334513536939/posts/ELTLYHFqNdo
[18:05] <bcurtiswx> mhall119, weird that icon to close doesn't light up for me..
[18:08] <bcurtiswx> reboot fixed it
[19:23] <doomlord> anyone here using c++ to develop for ubuntu-tablet?
[19:36] <doomlord> ubuntu-arm only runs on N7 ?
[19:37] <doomlord> i think from what i've seen its ubuntu-arm that interests me more
[19:37] <doomlord> the desktop
[19:40] <ali1234> yeah
[19:42] <doomlord> dual boot that + android would be perfect
[19:43] <doomlord> rework desktop apps to be more touchfriendly generally
[19:46] <doomlord> will optimization of browser on ubuntu-tablet feed back into ubuntu-arm-desktop..
[19:49] <ali1234> i doubt it considering that desktop uses firefox and tablet uses some qt webkit thing :)
[19:50] <doomlord> so perhaps its possible to get a desktop browser based on the same qt webkit
[19:51] <ali1234> sure
[19:52] <ali1234> that would likely run faster than firefox today
[19:52] <doomlord> kde is all qt based right? konqueror
[19:52] <ali1234> it would also lack most features
[19:52] <doomlord> oh maybe there isnt much precompiled for arm
[21:06] <myusdat> Ali1234 :-D
[21:06] <myusdat> Hi everybody
[21:50] <oreneeshy> myusdat: conversation is on #ubuntu-phone
[22:08] <darent> hello
[22:09] <darent> does somebody know what are the requirements to run ubuntu on a tablet?
[22:09] <darent> i mean, any dual core tablet will do?
[22:11] <k1l> no not any
[22:12] <k1l> darent: http://www.ubuntu.com/devices/tablet/partner
[22:13] <k1l> and open bootloader and such. today there are only nexus7 and nexus10 officially supported. but the community will port it to other tablets.
[22:13] <darent> i see... no chance to have it done with any  100€ tablet hehe
[22:13] <k1l> but there is the demo version only, yet.
[22:14] <darent> also, does it run a whole ubuntu system with debian repositories and all that or is it a different system
[22:14] <darent> ?
[22:14] <k1l> its different
[22:14] <darent> that's kind of dissapointing... at least for me
[22:15] <darent> but i supose we'll have to wait and see
[22:15] <k1l> read the ubuntu.com pages i gave you
[22:16] <darent> ok, thanks k1l
[22:17] <darent> i got a little confused between the ubuntu tablet, ubuntu phone and the ubuntu for android things xD
[22:19] <darent> i supose i'll get a new tablet soon, but a cheap one, and install ubuntu in a chroot
[22:26] <darent> ok, good night people, and thanks
[23:29] <doomlord> will ubuntu tablet applications run in a window in regular desktop ubuntu (however bad it may be with mouse)
[23:39] <ali1234> doomlord: maybe, with some hacking


[00:15] <thomi> bschaefer: cool, what was the issue?
[00:15] <bschaefer> the display
[00:16] <bschaefer> thomi, so when it was done the display wasn't getting closed, but we didn't actually need the display
[00:16] <thomi> ahh ok. Let me know if you want me to re-review your MP
[00:16] <bschaefer> yup, working on the autopilot test right now
[00:16] <thomi> coolio
[00:17] <bschaefer> so far I changed it to test_ctrl_a, test_ctrl_c_v and test_ctrl_x_v
[00:17] <bschaefer> which will test for that crash anyone
[00:17] <bschaefer> anyway*
[00:17] <thomi> bschaefer: cool
[00:17] <thomi> bschaefer: while you're at it, I think you should change the text to something nicer than "Segfault" :)
[00:17] <bschaefer> yeah
[00:18] <bschaefer> haha
[00:18] <bschaefer> also thanks for the novel, its very helpful
[00:18] <bschaefer> thomi, that test is getting removed anyway
[00:18] <bschaefer> its replaced with ctrl_c_v which just uses Copy as the text
[00:18] <thomi> heh, ok
[00:18] <thomi> cool
[00:19] <bschaefer> and Cut for the ctrl_x_v one
[00:19] <bschaefer> thomi, o yeah, should I be putting these under DashKeyNavTests?
[00:20] <thomi> bschaefer: hmm, I'd make a new class, something like DashClipboardTests
[00:20] <thomi> since it's not really keyboard navigation
[00:20] <bschaefer> alright sounds good
[00:23] <Daekdroom> Is precise going to ship Unity 5.6.0?
[00:35] <thumper> Daekdroom: or later
[00:41] <Andy80> jono: I've installed Ubuntu 12.04 on VirtualBox too so I can test "Ubuntu Accomplishments" and if it's not too hard I can help implementing other accomplishments
[00:42] <jono> Andy80, awesome!
[00:43] <jono> if you can install and run it that would be cool as a first step
[00:43] <jono> and some contributed accomplishments would be great
[00:43]  * DebolazW likes this idea.
[00:43] <jono> Andy80, for creating them, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Accomplishments/Creating
[00:44] <jono> DebolazW, if you can help, that would be cool too :-)
[00:44] <DebolazW> I think I would fall quite short if attempting to think up new achievements. :)
[00:45] <Andy80> jono: yes, I already installed and tested on my netbook. Now I'd like to try again on the desktop so I can work better on the code. And yes, I was referring to your blogpost for all the informations :) the wiki is written very well and all the steps worked without any problem
[00:46] <jono> Andy80, cool, so you saw the trophies appear OK?
[00:46] <jono> DebolazW, you can also help improve the docs on our existing ones: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Accomplishments/GetInvolved#Documentation
[00:48] <Andy80> jono: yes, the one I have appeared. There was just a delay on the "First bug filled" trophy, but I could not understand why.
[00:48] <jono> Andy80, that is because it was unlocked until you got the registered on LP one :-)
[00:48] <jono> they come in in waves :-)
[00:49]  * thumper waves
[00:49] <Andy80> jono: ahhh, now I understand :) it's something like .deb deps ;) to have one you need to first have another one ecc...
[00:49] <jono> indeed
[00:50] <jono> it helps map out the community journey
[00:50] <jono> would be awesome to have trophies for Unity team contributions
[00:50] <jono> e.g. First Bug Fix
[00:50] <jono> First Successful Merge
[00:50] <jono> etc
[00:52] <Andy80> jono: ok, I'll have to implement something anyway if I want to test how to create them. Any idea, please let's add it to the wiki, possibly something like this: "First Unity bug fixed" - IN PROGRESS - @yourlaunchpadId
[00:52] <Andy80> so people can know if another one is already working on it and they won't duplicate code
[00:53] <jono> indeed
[00:53] <jono> good idea
[01:10] <Andy80> ok, time to sleep now (2:00 AM here), I'll continue tomorrow! See ya guys :)
[01:10] <bschaefer> thomi, hmm setting the primary text doesnt seem to work
[01:12] <DebolazW> jono: By the way, while I have you here, which mailing list should I post on if I want to draw attention to a compiz-on-unity bug?
[01:13] <thomi> bschaefer: be with you ina minute
[01:14] <bschaefer> thomi, alright, dont rush, I pushed the changes I had so far
[01:14] <jono> DebolazW, probably unity-devel
[01:15] <thomi> bschaefer: OK, so.. when you say it doesn't work...
[01:15] <thomi> you mean that GTK code snippet?
[01:15] <DebolazW> It's a regression bug that sneaked in for 12.04, it looks very simple to fix but I have no idea how to do it. :-)
[01:16] <bschaefer> thomi, I make a PRIMARY clipboard, then set the text and try pasting. Nothing is in the PRIMARY clipboard when I try to manual do it also
[01:16] <thomi> bschaefer: it works perfectly for me - where are you trying to paste to?
[01:16] <bschaefer> https://code.launchpad.net/~brandontschaefer/unity/unity.fix-middle-paste-reg/+merge/94441
[01:17] <bschaefer> line 182
[01:17] <bschaefer> in the diff
[01:17] <bschaefer> 192*
[01:19] <thomi> bschaefer: OK, a few things I forgot to mention in my previous novel:
[01:19] <thomi> the most important thing is that the values of classes (like SearchBar) don't automatically refresh when the unity state changes, so you need to call 'searchbar.refresh_state()' if you think it may have changed unity-side
[01:19] <thomi> OR you can just construct the searchbar when you need to read the state
[01:20] <thomi> so diff line 194 should have a search_bar.refresh_state()
[01:20] <snadge> you guys are on fire!! another unity update in precise?
[01:20] <bschaefer> I should do a searchbar = self.dash.get_searchbar()
[01:20] <thomi> otherwise you'll get the 'search_string' from whenever it was created
[01:20] <bschaefer> do both?
[01:20] <thomi> bschaefer: or just call refresh_state()
[01:21] <thomi> just one or the other
[01:21] <bschaefer> ok
[01:21] <thomi> they actually do the same thing - both trigger a dbus call, grab the new state, and set the object properties
[01:21] <bschaefer> whats weird is I just changed it from PRIMARY to CLIPBOARD and now the text is getting set in the clipboard
[01:21] <thomi> calling refresh_state() looks nicer, sinc eyou've already created the object
[01:22] <bschaefer> very true
[01:22] <thomi> bschaefer: also, you should really move the mouse to "searchbar.x + (searchbar.width/2)" instead of "searchbar.x + 100"...
[01:24] <bschaefer> yeah, I saw it used above in a different test
[01:24] <thomi> ok
[01:24] <bschaefer> saw it used that way, but that makes more sense to put it in the middle
[01:24] <thomi> so are you sure middle-mouse-btn paste works in the dash?
[01:24] <bschaefer> yeah, I also tried to see if it was in the clipboard just using gnome-termainl
[01:24] <bschaefer> terminal*
[01:25] <bschaefer> and I can get it to work for the normal CLIPBOARD but not PRIMARY
[01:25] <thomi> bschaefer: OK. everything I need is in that one branch, correct? I'll build the branch and try and see what's goingon
[01:25] <bschaefer> yes!
[01:26] <bschaefer> ok, thanks. I added test for just ctrl+c and ctrl+x also
[01:26] <bschaefer> using Clipboard, so those have test now!
[01:26] <thomi> cool
[01:26]  * thomi grabs the branch
[01:27] <bschaefer> thomi, yeah also sorry about the length of my name haha
[01:27] <bschaefer> that I used for the launchpad login
[01:27] <thomi> no worries - that's what copy+paste is for
[01:27] <bschaefer> haha, not if its broken!
[01:27] <thomi> building...
[01:28] <bschaefer> I put the wait_for_text in there since it should be a better timer then sleep
[01:29] <thomi> ok
[01:29] <thomi> I didn't realise you even had to wait :)
[01:29] <bschaefer> idk if you do or not
[01:29] <bschaefer> I guess it might take a while to convert to utf8
[01:30] <bschaefer> I bet its un needed
[01:36] <thomi> bschaefer: wtf?
[01:36] <thomi> wow, that's odd
[01:36] <bschaefer> yeah
[01:37] <thomi> OK, when I run it manually myself it works...
[01:37] <bschaefer> on the command line?
[01:37] <bschaefer> or python interpreter
[01:38] <bschaefer> yeah it does thats weird!
[01:40] <thomi> bschaefer: in the python interpreter
[01:40] <thomi> bschaefer: also, your indentation is a bit messed up
[01:40] <thomi> all indents should be 4 spaces
[01:40] <bschaefer> yeah, I just tested it in the interpreter and it worked
[01:40] <thomi> in the python files, that is
[01:40] <bschaefer> ops, have it set to 2 for unity
[01:41] <bschaefer> I was wondering why the functions were 4 spaces away
[01:44] <thomi> hmmm, OK, that's interesting
[01:45] <thomi> if you set the clipboard text, then exit the interpreter, the primary clipboard gets cleared, which makes sense, since it's a client-side property
[01:45] <thomi> but that's not happening in our test...
[01:46] <bschaefer> I also tried cb.store() which should store it for when the app closes
[01:46] <bschaefer> the primary text doesn't get cleared when I exit from the interpreter
[01:47] <bschaefer> thomi,  nerver mind it does
[01:47] <thomi> huh? does what?
[01:47] <bschaefer> it clears the primary text
[01:47] <thomi> oh
[01:47] <thomi> ok
[01:47] <bschaefer> sorry
[01:47] <thomi> I'm with you
[01:49] <bschaefer> hmm but it should still work since the program is still running!
[01:50] <thomi> ahhhh
[01:50]  * thomi has an idea
[01:51] <bschaefer> what is it!
[01:58] <thomi> I wonder whether it's because our Mouse emulator uses python-XLib and we create our own display instance, while gtk uses the gtk.gdk.Display class
[01:58] <thomi> hmmm...
[01:58] <bschaefer> o i bet if we used the main display for the clipboard it would work
[01:58] <bschaefer> hmm well
[01:58] <bschaefer> it should actually already do that
[01:59] <bschaefer> thomi, one thing I found odd is if you replace PRIMARY with CLIPBOARD
[01:59] <bschaefer> thomi, then do a cb.store() after the set text and run the problem
[01:59] <bschaefer> and if you paste anywhere its the set_text worked
[01:59] <thomi> ok, I'm getting closer
[01:59] <bschaefer> program*
[02:00] <thomi> I have a tiny function now that works when run from the interpreter, but not from the command line
[02:00] <dmj726> Mainly curious here: Why was the switch workspace shortcut changed?
[02:00] <thomi> and it's only 5 lines long
[02:01] <bschaefer> nice!
[02:01] <bschaefer> could you pastebin it?
[02:01] <bschaefer> or just paste it here
[02:02] <thomi> yeah..
[02:02] <thomi> bschaefer: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/854850/
[02:03] <thomi> if you download that to a file called 'cp.py' in your tests/autopilot dir
[02:03] <thomi> and then open a python interpreter and do this:
[02:03] <thomi> from cp import test_middle_mouse_paste; test_middle_mouse_paste()
[02:03] <thomi> it works perfectly
[02:04] <thomi> but if you run to from bash: (python cp.py) it doesn't do anything
[02:04] <bschaefer> hmm thats odd
[02:04] <bschaefer> so what does th interpreter do differently?
[02:05] <thomi> exactly - I can't think of anything
[02:07] <thomi> ok, using the 'xsel' app, it looks like that gtk method isn't doing what we think it is
[02:07] <bschaefer> the set_text method?
[02:09] <thomi> yeah
[02:10] <bschaefer> is the set_text only for the CLIPBOARD?
[02:10] <bschaefer> as I think it is used for copy more so
[02:11] <bschaefer> no, otherwise the interpreter wouldn't work...
[02:11] <thomi> no, the docs indicate it should work
[02:11] <thomi> and yeah, it works interactivelky
[02:17] <bschaefer> hmm weird, so if you run that program "python cp.py" and while it is sleeping select and copy something into primary
[02:17] <bschaefer> and it works
[02:21] <thomi> wow, ok
[02:23] <thomi> hah! got it
[02:24] <bschaefer> what was it?
[02:24] <thomi> the gtk.Clipboard needs the gtk event loop running. check this out:
[02:24] <thomi> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/854874/
[02:24] <thomi> that works perfectly
[02:24] <bschaefer> awesome
[02:25] <bschaefer> do we want the gtk main loop running in the test?
[02:25] <thomi> OK, so we need a way to do this in pyre python-xlib. I'll take a gander at the gtk source code and try and see how they do it
[02:25] <thomi> bschaefer: no, we can't have it running :(
[02:25] <bschaefer> yeah, hmm well I wish selecting and coping in the unity dash set it as primary
[02:26] <bschaefer> hmm I should look into that
[02:26] <bschaefer> thomi,  why was the gtk main loop running int he interpreter?
[02:26] <thomi> bschaefer: do you use ipython?
[02:27] <thomi> I do, and it runs a gtk loop for you I believe
[02:27] <bschaefer> hmm I just type python on the command line
[02:27] <thomi> oh ok
[02:27] <thomi> maybe pygtk is trying to be clever, and does it differently when it's being run interactively?
[02:27] <bschaefer> I could init something
[02:27] <bschaefer> it*
[02:28] <thomi> in either case, it'd be nicer to do it in XLib
[02:28] <bschaefer> yeah
[02:28] <thomi> well, I say nicer....
[02:28] <thomi> ;)
[02:28] <bschaefer> haha
[02:28] <bschaefer> that was definitively interesting, what made you think we needed the gtk loop?
[02:29] <thomi> dunno... just a wild guess
[02:29] <thomi> I'm grabbing the gtk source
[02:29] <bschaefer> haha either way good job! I was just getting more and more confused haha
[02:32] <thomi> right, the answer we need is in here somewhere: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/precise/xsel/precise/view/head:/xsel.c
[02:33] <thomi> ahhh, nicely written C code... such a pleasure to read
[02:35] <bschaefer> hmm, so we are looking for some sort of event loop?
[02:36] <bschaefer> and yes this is very nice C code...
[02:36] <thomi> line 1468 is what we need I think
[02:37] <bschaefer> I just saw line 1624
[02:38] <bschaefer> which looked like it was waiting for the next event...
[02:40] <thomi> I'm hoping we can do a fire-and-forget
[02:40]  * thomi hacks something together
[02:45] <bschaefer> nice, im interested to see what you hack together!
[02:53] <snadge> i hate to sound like a broken record, but is anyone going to fix fglrx?
[02:54] <snadge> whenever i try to play a video with totem/gstreamer x just crashes.. and it still has the window title not being updated bug
[02:55] <snadge> im on the radeon driver atm, cos that works without these issues, but obviously that solution isnt the most ideal
[02:58] <snadge> i fear that 12.04 will be released with this issue, because nobody cares enough to fix it
[02:59] <thomi> bschaefer: I see how it works... it's a bit of a pain
[03:00] <bschaefer> thomi, :(, if it will take much time there is still a manual test
[03:00] <bschaefer> that will cover this
[03:00] <thomi> basically, you need to create a window (it can be unmapped, so that's OK), and whenever you want to set the clipboard contents, you raise an X event. Then when someone pastes something, you get a XSelectionEvent, which you need to respond to  sending the selection data
[03:00] <thomi> bschaefer: yeah, let's go with the manual test.
[03:01] <thomi> bschaefer: delete the AP test for MMB paste I guess
[03:01] <bschaefer> thomi, ok, let me remove that test :(, but ill keep the other ones
[03:01] <thomi> yeah
[03:01] <thomi> remember to fix the indentation also :)
[03:01] <bschaefer> already did :)
[03:01] <thomi> oh, and if you can, trim trailing whitespace :)
[03:01] <bschaefer> ok
[03:01] <thomi> cheers
[03:02] <bschaefer> thank you for spending so much time working on this!
[03:02] <thomi> ahh well, I now know a bit more about how X works.... I'm not sure that's a good thing or not
[03:02] <thomi> heh, no worries
[03:02] <bschaefer> haha yeah I didn't know copy and pasting had so many standards before today
[03:07] <bschaefer> thomi, alright, just pushed the changes if you want to review
[03:07]  * thomi looks
[03:09] <thomi> bschaefer: are you satisfied that you haven't introduced a memory leak in the new clipboard code?
[03:09] <thomi> I notice that the old code used a glib::GObject<> smart ptr thingy
[03:09] <thomi> ...and now we don't
[03:10] <bschaefer> o, umm I should add that back in
[03:10] <bschaefer> I thought it was casting it rather then using a smart ptr
[03:10] <thomi> no hang on
[03:10] <thomi> the docs say:
[03:10] <thomi> Returns :
[03:10] <thomi> 	the appropriate clipboard object. If no clipboard already exists, a new one will be created. Once a clipboard object has been created, it is persistent and, since it is owned by GTK+, must not be freed or unreffed. [transfer none]
[03:11] <thomi> better not unref it then :)
[03:11] <bschaefer> yeah haha, so it should be good :)
[03:14] <thomi> bschaefer: approved. Do you have permissions to set the MP to approved?
[03:15] <bschaefer> yeah
[03:15] <thomi> cool - do it :)
[03:15] <bschaefer> alright!
[03:15] <bschaefer> nice, not copy/cut and pasting isn't crashing and works!
[03:15] <bschaefer> now*
[03:16] <bschaefer> thanks for your help
[03:27] <TheMuso> Is someone able to point me to a document/spec that explains why we needed to change workspace switching keyboard shortcuts? IMO the ones we had are fine and have been around for a long time.
[06:22] <topdownjimmy> What the hell just happened to my inbox?
[06:24] <snadge> hmm.. caps lock / num lock / scroll lock hints aren't showing in latest unity
[06:24] <snadge> im on a netbook which doesnt have led indicators for them
[08:06] <AlanBell> wow, interesting thread on the unity-design mailing list :(
[08:16] <sense> AlanBell: Which one?
[08:16] <AlanBell> [Unity-design] Remove Pornographic Apps from the "Apps available for download" (51 messages)
[08:17] <AlanBell> not sure adding my opinion to that would improve matters, or state anything not already stated
[08:18] <AlanBell> I don't like the adverts at all, and I have seen p0rnview pop up in it too
[08:18] <AlanBell> though like most I find religion far more offensive than porn, but that isn't really the point
[08:19] <AlanBell> what really offends me is that the lens folds up the stuff I do have, to make room for adverts for stuff I don't have
[08:21] <tsdgeos> OMG huge trolling there
[08:29] <snadge> i hate how my porn comes up in recently used documents
[08:29] <snadge> or downloads
[08:29] <snadge> its like.. err.. glad this is my home computer, and not my work one :p
[08:32] <davidcalle> snadge, do you know that you can prevent some folders to appear in here?
[08:33] <snadge> no
[08:34] <snadge> i thought alternatively i could create a seperate login .. and do all my dirty masturbation and porn from that account
[08:34] <snadge> but y'know, that involves logging out and back in again.. effort ;)
[08:39] <davidcalle> snadge, look into System Settings -> Privacy -> Files
[08:46] <snadge> im joking.. im a grown man, in a relationship.. with a 1 week old child
[08:46] <snadge> .. which is probably why i need to masturbate.. but anyway j/k
[09:22] <davidcalle> didrocks, hello, would you have a hand for a bug fixes upload of the video lens?
[09:22] <didrocks> davidcalle: are they critical bugs?
[09:22] <davidcalle> didrocks, nope. One high.
[09:23] <davidcalle> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-lens-video/+bug/939279
[09:23] <didrocks> davidcalle: hum, can be handy to upload this
[09:23] <didrocks> davidcalle: we only upload high/critical bugs
[09:23] <didrocks> fixes*
[09:24] <davidcalle> didrocks, it's a corner case, but still.
[09:24] <didrocks> as we are in beta freeze
[09:24] <didrocks> ah corner case
[09:24] <didrocks> it's the one where Video doesn't exist?
[09:24] <didrocks> and so fallback to $HOME
[09:24] <davidcalle> didrocks, no, this one is in since yesterday (kenvandine pushed it)
[09:25] <davidcalle> It's the one where the folder contains a lot of vids and they havn't been seen in Nautilus (so no thumbnails).
[09:25] <didrocks> davidcalle: ok, corner case
[09:25] <didrocks> davidcalle: can wait after beta1, isn't it?
[09:25] <davidcalle> didrocks, sure we can.
[09:26] <didrocks> davidcalle: let's plan on that then! :)
[09:27] <davidcalle> I will use this time to test it in a PPA on people affected by it.
[09:27] <davidcalle> didrocks, fine with me. :)
[09:27] <didrocks> yeah ;)
[10:55] <apw> didrocks, ok found a way to tirgger the 'white on black numbers' getting stuck; using the new Super+Shift+<arrow> keys, makes it come out and get stuck pretty much all the time
[10:55] <jml> hello, I just did a precise -> precise upgrade after a couple of weeks blocked on an apt bug. Unity seems different. Is there something summarizing the diffs between current precise and, say, oneiric?
[11:01] <didrocks> apw: yeah, I saw that I can trigger that quite easily as well
[11:01] <didrocks> apw: can you comment on your bug report? (and give me the number back)
[11:02] <didrocks> apw: I'm adding it to the priority list now that it's easy to get it
[11:04] <apw> didrocks, hmm its been dup'd against another bug which sounds different, my original was bug #933630
[11:04] <apw> arrgle no thats the dup
[11:04] <apw> mine is bug #934084
[11:06] <didrocks> apw: agreed, the dup makes no sense
[11:06] <apw> didrocks, anyhow added comment to the dup
[11:06] <didrocks> apw: I'm undupping it
[11:06] <didrocks> apw: and taking yours on the list
[11:06] <apw> and the original :)
[11:07] <apw> didrocks, also just filed this one:
[11:07] <apw> bug #940201
[11:07] <didrocks> apw: ah, this is a dup :)
[11:07] <didrocks> one sec :p
[11:08] <didrocks> apw: it's a dup of bug #939521
[11:08] <didrocks> apw: I filed it, we will have compiz enabling what we need to do just after beta1
[11:08] <didrocks> I'll fix this afterwards
[11:08] <apw> didrocks, ok thanks
[11:08] <didrocks> apw: btw, I'm interesting to gather feedback on those new keybindings
[11:08] <didrocks> apw: I can't get used to them after 3 days here
[11:09] <didrocks> so if you are trying some for some days, I'm interested in the feedback
[11:10] <apw> i thought that we wern't removing the old ones yet, that was a bit of a supprise
[11:10] <apw> didrocks, and for me, i think i have reached the number of bindings i can remember which all use the same keys
[11:11] <didrocks> apw: yeah, compiz doesn't allow multiple keybindings for an action :/
[11:11] <Andy80> 'morning
[11:11] <didrocks> apw: ahah, indeed :)
[11:11] <didrocks> hey Andy80
[11:12] <didrocks> apw: at least, I tried to be clear in the changelogs for compiz/c-p-m/metacity to document the changes
[11:12] <apw> didrocks, we must have a few lines of change for the release notes, perhaps we could beef those up for this purpose
[11:13] <Andy80> didrocks: is it ok for you if I temporary switch to another task (helping Jono with Ubuntu Accomplishments) while the u1db guys complete the migration to the new API system?
[11:13] <didrocks> apw: agree, I'm noting that in a note
[11:13] <apw> didrocks, as we'll have to release note a complete change of key bindings surely
[11:13] <didrocks> Andy80: sure sure, there is no hurry at all one the OneConf side before UDS, take your time! :)
[11:14] <Andy80> didrocks: cool thanks :)
[11:14] <didrocks> apw: yeah, we definitively need to do that. Noting that down  :)
[11:17] <apw> didrocks, are we going to get a ticky in appearance to allow us to turn off the help, or at least move it out to like 10s
[11:18] <apw> as its pretty annoying when waht you wanted was the white on black numbers to appear
[11:18] <apw> and its timed at the exact same time
[11:18] <didrocks> apw: yeah, the timeout will get longer after discussing with John, but also, Super + another key will not show the help
[11:18] <didrocks> basically, it's the 2 planned changes
[11:19] <didrocks> (maybe not 10s, but a little bit more than the one used for the numbers ;))
[11:19] <apw> didrocks, i'd like a slidey, so as i get better at them i can move it right, eventually only getting it if i am very persistant
[11:21] <didrocks> apw: yeah, i'll discuss this with John, but yesterday he basically agreed to get a longer timeout (he's not around until Tuesday, so will be after beta1)
[11:22] <apw> didrocks, gawd you know how to mess with my head and no mistake, changing every single window management keybinding, and not keeping the originals ... gurgle
[11:23] <didrocks> apw: yeah, I totally agree and I was not supportive of the change for the record
[11:23] <snadge> isnt holding down super supposed to bring up the shortcuts menu?
[11:23] <snadge> or has that been disabled
[11:23] <didrocks> yeah, it is
[11:24] <didrocks> it does*
[11:24] <AlanBell> you can turn it off though
[11:24] <snadge> its not coming up on my netbook.. im running the latest unity build in precise
[11:24] <AlanBell> oh, I think it doesn't come up on short screens
[11:24] <snadge> maybe its a resolution dependant thing yeah.. i have 1024x600
[11:24] <AlanBell> I seem to recall seeing something about that in the code
[11:25] <snadge> bummer
[11:25] <didrocks> apw: I would even not speak about the 7 hours to dig into different compiz sources (and metacity) to ensure everything is working and picking the right value at the right place. You can confort yourself in knowing it gave me a real bad headache ;)
[11:25] <snadge> perhaps it could be shrunk or made wider on short screens?
[11:25] <AlanBell> it also gets in the way of enhanced zoom on super+mousewheel
[11:25] <snadge> yeah ive noticed that
[11:25] <apw> didrocks, heh sounds like working with the kernel :)
[11:25] <snadge> the proper thing to do would be to have the shortcut screen turn off when zoom is activated
[11:25] <didrocks> apw: ahah, some kind of surgery indeed :)
[11:26] <AlanBell> also you can't read it with orca which is a bit faily
[11:26] <snadge> either that.. or the shortcut screen should zoom along with the rest of the desktop.. maybe its too small and you want to blow it up so you can see it better
[11:36] <apw> didrocks, i have more odd behaviour, i am no longer getting window titles in the menubar, and holding alt for a lot of windows does not reveal their menu, is this right ?
[11:38] <didrocks> apw: hum, doesn't seem related to latest change but rather bamfdaeamon going crazy (for both issues)
[11:38] <rye> hm, i have this too
[11:38] <didrocks> apw: you can poke d-feet about bamfdaemon
[11:38] <apw> didrocks, odd over time something i did has made weechat now show it, whereas before it did not, but pidjin still not
[11:38] <rye> apw, does ctrl+alt+right arrow jump to right workspace?
[11:38] <didrocks> apw: if you can dump all bamf data, then, DBO can look at them
[11:39] <rye> ah, hud-service[2129]: segfault at 10 ip b74bbd24 sp bf859a2c error 4 in libglib-2.0.so.0.3118.0[b743f000+f6000]
[11:39] <apw> didrocks, erm, what is bamf and how can i get to its brains
[11:39] <rye> but hud works
[11:39] <smb> rye, think that is super-shift-left/right now
[11:39] <rye> smb, well, does not work either, brings hints overlay
[11:39] <apw> rye, does both for me, and thats a known issue
[11:39] <smb> I got that overlay thing too but it also shifts
[11:40] <smb> bug 940198
[11:40] <didrocks> apw: do you have d-feet installed?
[11:40] <apw> nope
[11:40] <didrocks> apw: bamf is what matches your opened apps to the window
[11:40] <didrocks> apw: please install it :)
[11:41] <didrocks> then, go the session bus (connect to it if needed)
[11:41] <didrocks> click on org.ayatana.bamf
[11:41] <didrocks> than, you will see Object Paths like: /org/ayatana/bamf/application<…>
[11:42] <didrocks> opens org.ayatana.bamf.application interface for all of them
[11:42] <didrocks> and run DesktopFile() Methods
[11:42] <didrocks> tell me if you have a desktop file containing pidgin
[11:43] <didrocks> for weechat, you have a gnome-terminal icon, isn't it? <- /me uses weechat as well
[11:43] <apw> ok i have a button which looks like an elephant and hitting that says "Bus Address:" any dea what the answer is
[11:43] <apw> didrocks, actually no, i have a weechat icon :)
[11:44] <didrocks> oh?
[11:44] <apw> didrocks, i couldn't cope with unity merging everything i run under one icon, so i worked out how to convince it to keep them separate
[11:44] <didrocks> ah, you added a weechat .desktop file?
[11:44] <didrocks> apw: in the menu File -> Connect to session bug
[11:44] <didrocks> bus*
[11:45] <apw> didrocks, yeah have one for weechat and one for mutt, so i get separate launcher entries
[11:45] <apw> Exec=gnome-terminal --class weechat --disable-factory --window-with-profile=Ambiance -e weechat-curses
[11:45] <apw> the key bit is the class needs to be unique to get unity launcher to keep them appart
[11:46] <apw> didrocks, oh it has menus, ... i can't tell that cause there is no hint they exist ... arrrg
[11:47] <didrocks> apw: thanks for the exec key, will use it as well! :)
[11:47] <rye> hm, relogin - alt does not work
[11:47] <rye> hud works, regular menu does not show up
[11:47] <apw> didrocks, the desktopfile i use is on chinstrap ~apw/weechat.desktop
[11:47] <apw> didrocks, that gives you an icon too
[11:48] <didrocks> apw: thanks ;) I'll gadly steal it!
[11:48] <apw> didrocks, it would
[11:48] <apw> didrocks, it would be nice to be able to allow a user from a running application to say "make this separate and use this icon please"
[11:49] <apw> if we have a suggestions box that might go in
[11:49] <didrocks> apw: yeah, it's not technically difficult to get that. I think pinging JohnLea is the fastest way to get an answer
[11:49] <didrocks> apw: as everything has to be validated by design for unity
[11:53] <apw> didrocks, ok no i do not have any applicaiton with DesktopFile as pidgin, i have one which has u'' as its desktop file and i assume that is <empty>
[11:53] <didrocks> apw: ah interesting, that shouldn't happen
[11:54] <didrocks> apw: so, probably pidgin
[11:54] <didrocks> apw: if you look at Xids()?
[11:54] <apw> didrocks, yeah i have one with something sane in all of the others and matching the apps i think i have other than pidgin
[11:54] <didrocks> I guess from there, you have to wait on DBO though
[11:55] <apw> didrocks, there is a whole bunch of xids
[11:55] <didrocks> interesting, so maybe it lost track of a bunch of apps
[11:55] <didrocks> and put all them in this one
[11:55] <didrocks> definitively have to wait on DBO though, if you can keep the "broken" state
[11:56] <didrocks> if you don't, killing bamfdaemon should hopefully fix it without logging out and back
[11:56] <apw> interestingly the mumble also doesn't work, but it does have an application entry in its name
[11:56] <apw> i can not kill tings, its only the menus in pidgin which are missing, but it may self fix as i work, weechat did oddly
[11:56] <didrocks> yeah, that's really weird, need upstream on that :)
[12:03] <apw> didrocks, am i expecting to get a menu hint, i see there is a mnenu hint time, what does that make happen
[12:05] <didrocks> apw: you mean, when you open an application, the menu is showing for a second before disappearing?
[12:06] <apw> didrocks, is it?  is that what that is meant to do
[12:06] <jml> hmm. my compose key no longer works.
[12:06] <apw> didrocks, oh yeah, so it does, not long enough for me to notice, but it does appear; ok so thats is what it means
[12:06] <didrocks> apw: indeed
[12:07] <apw> bug #940251
[12:07] <snadge> end of the universe!Q
[12:07] <jml> I know it's a bit of a geeky thing, but I do rather need some way of typing out the pound symbol
[12:07] <didrocks> apw: thanks, let's wait on DBO for it
[12:07] <apw> jml, the UK GBP symbol ?
[12:07] <jml> apw: yes
[12:08] <snadge> i was going to suggest system settings -> keyboard layout -> options
[12:08] <apw> jml does alt-gr-3 do it ?
[12:08] <snadge> theres an option in there for adding currency signs to certain keys.. but its only for euro and rupee :p
[12:08] <didrocks> jml: seb128 had some issue with his keyboard layout this morning, he had to change it back manually
[12:08] <jml> snadge: already has Compose set to Right Alt. It seems Unity now grabs that and interpret it as Alt
[12:09] <jml> apw: I don't know how to type that (I have a US Apple keyboard)
[12:10] <jml> didrocks: the setting is already set. I guess I could try un-setting then re-setting.
[12:10] <apw> jml, then you are in a world of pain as it doesn't have almost any useful keys
[12:10] <jml> !
[12:10] <jml> apw: I was using it quite happily until today.
[12:10] <didrocks> jml: he had to xmodmap IIRC
[12:10] <apw> jml, heh, sounds annoying
[12:10] <didrocks> so maybe not the same issue, but just telling it's maybe the same thing
[12:11] <jml> didrocks: you realize this means that no normal English speaking is ever going to spell "cafe", "fiancee" or "resume" properly ever again.
[12:11] <jml> s/speaking/speaker/
[12:11] <apw> jml, i think the art of those being spelt write was lost long ago
[12:11] <didrocks> jml: noooooooooooooo :)
[12:12] <didrocks> jml: café <- quick, cute and paste as long as I have them :)
[12:12] <didrocks> cut*
[12:12] <jml> heh.
[12:13] <apw> jml, i suspect you will have instead put the Compose keysym on that key
[12:13] <apw> though in my experience unity converts it syms to codes very early and doesn't notice when you change them
[12:16] <jml> well, I guess I'll file a bug about this.
[12:16] <smb> £ <- <alt-gr>+<shift>+3 ?
[12:16] <jml> smb: where is <alt-gr>, exactly?
[12:16] <smb> jml, On a German non-mac keyboard it is the right alt
[12:17] <jml> smb: see, my system has Right Alt bound to Compose, except that's being ignored now.
[12:19] <smb> Yep, in the German keybinding it always was special, not really compose, but giving all kinds of "weird" characters. Was just wondering whether this took over the world... ;-P
[12:24] <snadge> hmm.. either alt.. shift 3 gives #
[12:24] <snadge> my keyboard just has "alt" and "alt" .. but i have seen alt-gr on some kbs
[12:26] <tsdgeos> greyback: what do you think of moving the GOBJECT_CALLBACKX macros to a separate header? we use them in two files already and MM uses it in a new one, it's only three lines, buw why copy them all over?
[12:28] <greyback> tsdgeos: true. I can think of no objection to that
[12:35] <jml> anyway, I've filed https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/940271
[12:35] <jml> I've tried to describe the problem & symptoms rather than recommend a solution
[12:40] <tsdgeos> greyback: https://code.launchpad.net/~aacid/unity-2d/unity-2d_gobject_callback_header/+merge/94532
[12:40] <apw> jml, if you run xev what key (put your cursor in the window it makes) and hit left and right alts which keys does it say you pressed
[12:41] <apw> jml, as i don't think on my keyboard the alt on the right is doing the hud thingy
[12:42] <apw> jml, my right alt seems to have ISOLevel3Shift on it !?!
[12:44] <jml> apw: will try
[12:45] <jml> I hate using xev :\
[12:46] <apw> jml keyboard layout settings thingy has a little keyboard layout button which then lets you see wich button lights up when you hit a key
[12:46] <apw> that might help too
[12:49] <jml> apw: it's not doing the HUD thingy. I made a mistake there.
[12:49] <jml> apw: Right Alt comes up as keycode 108, keysym 0xff20, Multi_Key
[12:49] <jml> apw: Left as keycode 64, keysym 0xffe9, Alt_L
[13:13] <apw> jml, hmmm, then you should be able to put compose on the Multi_Key in the settings thingy no ?
[13:15] <apw> jml, oh you can put compose on caps-lock, a use for that key finally
[13:15] <jml> apw: I use it rather heavily as a Control
[15:00] <mhall119> didrocks: ping
[15:03] <mhall119> didrocks: my unity-lens template for quickly is ready
[15:14] <didrocks> mhall119: \o/ awesome
[15:14] <didrocks> mhall119: so you added an "install" command?
[15:15] <mhall119> didrocks: and "uninstall" too
[15:15] <didrocks> mhall119: nice nice!
[15:15] <didrocks> mhall119: do you want a review?
[15:15] <mhall119> didrocks: and also help getting it into the archives, if you don't mind
[15:15] <didrocks> mhall119: sure, but we will need a FFe for that
[15:15] <didrocks> should be easy to get
[15:16] <mhall119> should I wait for a review from you before filing for an FFe?
[15:16] <didrocks> in universe, not installed by default, just a new functionnality not impacting existing pacakage
[15:16] <didrocks> mhall119: yeah, I can do that by monday
[15:16] <mhall119> ok
[15:16] <didrocks> that's going to be awesome!
[15:17] <didrocks> mhall119: seems creating a Quickly template wasn't so aweful at the end? (as we didn't get a lot of people creating templates for Quickly, I didn't get a lot of feedbacks)
[15:17] <mhall119> I made sure that you get a working lens, complete with search results, without having to change any code
[15:17] <mhall119> didrocks: yeah, not too bad
[15:17] <mhall119> didrocks: you need a meta-template ;)
[15:17] <mhall119> quickly create quickly-template
[15:17] <didrocks> mhall119: hum, that's the question :)
[15:18] <didrocks> mhall119: in fact, the initial template system isn't based particularly on python
[15:18] <didrocks> as some people contributed some templates in shell, C
[15:18] <didrocks> hence the "I don't inherit from anything"
[15:18] <mhall119> didrocks: oh, I did remove all of the extras- stuff from the packaging template
[15:18] <didrocks> not sure if we should keep that or not
[15:19] <mhall119> so the package it creates is more standard, not tailored to the ARB
[15:19] <mhall119> I haven't looked into what submitubuntu command does
[15:21] <didrocks> mhall119: well, I'm afraid that now that we moved to dh_python2, submitubuntu is broken
[15:21] <didrocks> mhall119: I have changed multiple components (4) to support /opt in python, but it was with pycentral
[15:21] <didrocks> (it added --prefix)
[15:21] <didrocks> I even touched some perl, telling how I was motivated for :)
[15:22] <mhall119> wow
[15:23] <mhall119> didrocks: do we have bugs filed against quickly for those problems?
[15:24] <mhall119> no guarantees I'll touch Perl though, I've been perl-sober for a while now
[15:27] <didrocks> mhall119: I didn't, I think nobody tried this release TBH :)
[15:27] <didrocks> heh, perl-sober is nice sometimes :)
[15:27] <mhall119> it's hard, sometimes things just aren't working, and you know a little bit of perl will make the pain go away, at least for a little while
[15:28] <didrocks> heh
[16:56] <jono> hey folks
[17:11] <Andy80> 'morning jono
[17:11] <jono> hney Andy80
[17:14] <Boardinary> Are there plans to make unity QT the default unity experience in the future?
[17:39] <mhall119> Boardinary: I don't think so, non
[17:39] <mhall119> but it will likely be default for mobile devices, given Qt's advantages in that space
[17:40] <jokerdino> hey mhall119 i was just looking for you.
[17:40] <jokerdino> could you spare a moment and look if you can answer this question? (http://askubuntu.com/q/107317/25798)
[17:40] <Boardinary> mhall119, Compiz just seems to be really buggy in lots of different areas - even sound - so I'm wondering what Canonical is thinking about the state of unity 3d
[17:41] <Daekdroom> Sound?
[17:41] <Daekdroom> Does compiz handle sound at all?
[17:41] <mhall119> jokerdino: sure
[17:41] <Boardinary> Daekdroom, for the volume change toggle sound
[17:41] <mhall119> Boardinary: I don't think compiz does anything with sound
[17:41] <Boardinary> there is a bug that is preventing it from playing
[17:42] <Boardinary> If I switch to gnome shell, the sounds play perfectly
[17:42] <mhall119> well that's definitely a bug, but probably not in compiz
[17:42] <Boardinary> if you type replace --metacity the bug disapears as well
[17:43] <mhall119> metacity --replace?
[17:43] <didrocks> yeah, it's a long standing known bug in compiz and libcanberra
[17:43] <mhall119> didrocks: so compiz is breaking sound? weird
[17:43] <jokerdino> compiz affects sound? never knew that.
[17:43] <didrocks> mhall119: yeah, it's as powerful as this :)
[17:43] <mhall119> heh
[17:44] <mhall119> with great power comes great responsibility, not stop making my menus transparent
[17:44] <didrocks> I had the same reaction first time I looked for the code for this issue :)
[17:44] <Boardinary> even smspillaz has expressed frustration with compiz sstability
[17:48] <Daekdroom> But regardless, Unity feels smoother than Unity-2D
[17:49] <Daekdroom> Or atleast it used to, I haven't tested 2D in quite awhile.
[17:49] <Boardinary> I wonder what the gameplan will be for design as gnome diverges from unity.  It is already starting to happen.  Plus now ubuntuone is switching to QT.
[17:50] <jono> are you folks aware of switching virtual desktops and the currently focused window being moved as I switch?
[17:51] <Daekdroom> jono, how are you switching workspaces?
[17:51] <gord> jono, on precise? yeah i think there was a keybindings issue
[17:52] <jono> Daekdroom, I switched the binding back to Crl-Alt-Arrows
[17:52] <jono> which works fine, but when I switch the currently focused window moves with the switch
[17:52] <Daekdroom> Oddly enough, Crtl-Alt-Arrows doesn't work for me.
[17:52] <jono> which is unfuriating
[17:52] <jono> Daekdroom, yeah the bindings changed
[17:53] <Daekdroom> Super + Shift.. hm..
[17:53] <jokerdino> oh the key bindings changed?
[17:53] <jokerdino> i did an upgrade from 11.10 and didn't see any change.
[17:53] <jono> jokerdino, looks like it
[17:53] <jono> jokerdino, was in a recent Unity upload
[17:54] <Daekdroom> But while the shortcut overlay says Super-Alt-Arrows should move windows between workspaces, Crtl-Shift-Alt-Arrows is doing it instead.
[17:54] <Boardinary> jono, are you still having problems with the volume toggle sound notification not working?  I saw your replies to askubuntu questions.
[17:55] <jono> Boardinary, that wasnt me
[17:55] <mhall119> jokerdino: answered
[17:55] <jokerdino> mhall119: i saw and voted up! :)
[17:55] <mhall119> jokerdino: I expanded on it
[17:55] <jokerdino> more awesomeness then.
[17:58] <jokerdino> is there any way to make super + w activate expo instead of window picker?
[18:02] <Daekdroom> jokerdino, I think what you want is Super + S
[18:03] <jokerdino> super + s shows all the workspaces.
[18:03] <Daekdroom> But yes, there is. Expo plugin on CCSM
[18:03] <Daekdroom> What exactly are you calling expo?
[18:04] <jokerdino> 11.10 used to show windows across all workspaces, that is expo.
[18:04] <Daekdroom> Ah, I think you can't.
[18:04] <jokerdino> but now, it only shows from the active workspace. that is window picker.
[18:04] <jokerdino> so, super + w and shift + alt + up does the same thing.
[18:04] <Daekdroom> They changed it somehow that CCSM has Super + W set for all windows, but only shows active workspace.
[18:05] <jokerdino> i foresee such questions coming in Ask Ubuntu later on.
[18:09] <arand> Supplying x64 and x128 hicolor-theme icons should be enough to make the unity applauncher look ok right?
[18:09] <arand> I was testing redeclipse via a liveCD before and the icon ended up mangled, could this be due to it being a liveCD or am I doing something wrong in packaging?
[18:17] <dmj726> didrocks: I'm wondering what the reasoning behind the keyboard shortcut change for switching workspaces is?
[18:17] <didrocks> dmj726: as stated in the debian/changelog, it's a design decision. You can try to ping JohnLea (he's on holidays today) on Monday
[18:18] <dmj726> didrocks: ah, yeah I wasn't able to find the design decision in a google search so figured I'd ask
[18:18] <didrocks> dmj726: did you look at the bug I linked in debian/changelog?
[18:19] <didrocks> they contain the design info :)
[18:25] <cyphermox> didrocks: how would I change the whitelist for status icons for unity?
[18:26] <didrocks> cyphermox: you mean, on your system or for everyone?
[18:26] <dmj726> didrocks: I did look and I don't see a linked bug
[18:26] <cyphermox> on my system :)
[18:26] <didrocks> cyphermox: dconf-editor
[18:26]  * cyphermox thinks there is no reason not to use indicators
[18:27] <cyphermox> ah, cool
[18:27] <didrocks> cyphermox: it's not for indicator
[18:27] <didrocks> cyphermox: for system tray
[18:27] <cyphermox> didrocks: I know
[18:27] <cyphermox> I'm saying, there's no reason to want to change the whitelist for everyone
[18:27] <didrocks> dmj726: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/1:<IP_ADDRESS>~bzr2995-0ubuntu5
[18:27] <didrocks> dmj726: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/metacity/1:2.34.1-1ubuntu6
[18:28] <didrocks> dmj726: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz-plugins-main/1:<IP_ADDRESS>~bzr19-0ubuntu3
[18:29] <didrocks> cyphermox: desktop.unity.pnale.systray-whitelist
[18:29] <didrocks> panel*
[18:29] <didrocks> cyphermox: it needs to be the X window name return by "xpropr"
[18:30] <cyphermox> sure
[18:32] <dmj726> didrocks: huh
[18:33] <dmj726> https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/document/d/1jqeKtIJwqLtl58Wk_fqjr9Rrgxn9zsouCYOo-cZsLSE/edit?authkey=CLGG9NkJ&hl=en_GB&pli=1
[18:33] <didrocks> yeah, it's refered in one of the bugs  :)
[18:33] <dmj726> So this new keyboard shortcut for workspace switching introduces a bug
[18:34] <dmj726> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ayatana-design/+bug/891757 "If a existing keyboard shortcut setting conflicts with one of the  shortcuts detailed here, the existing keyboard shortcut should be  overwritten.  However where there is no conflict between the existing  keyboard shortcuts and the new shortcuts, the existing shortcuts should  always be preserved."
[18:34] <dmj726> can't see where ctrl + alt + Cursor Keys is listed anywhere else in the doc, so not sure why it was changed
[18:35] <didrocks> dmj726: on the google doc you pointed
[18:35] <didrocks> dmj726: look at "switching worspace"
[18:35] <didrocks> you will see super + shift + arrows
[18:35] <dmj726> the new Super + Shift + Cursor combo (which is listed) does introduce a bug
[18:36] <didrocks> which one?
[18:36] <dmj726> you end up seeing the shortcut overlay all the time
[18:36] <didrocks> indeed
[18:36] <didrocks> I already logged it
[18:36] <didrocks> put it in the priority list
[18:36] <didrocks> it's not trivial, but will get fixed after beta1
[18:36]  * dmj726 just changed the shortcut back so I wouldn't have to look at that
[18:37] <didrocks> yeah, I worked on gnome-control-center as well to ensure this is possible (changing it back)
[18:38] <dmj726> The other nice thing about the old shortcut combo was that one could switch workspaces with one hand
[18:39] <dmj726> (Still possible on desktops, just not on laptops without reconfiguring the keyboard layout.
[18:39] <didrocks> please discuss on the design decision either with JohnLea on this channel or on the unity-design ML :)
[18:39] <didrocks> otherwise, it will get lost :)
[18:39] <dmj726> yeah, I'll do that later
[18:39] <didrocks> thanks dmj726
[18:47] <pquest> I am interested in starting to contribute to ubuntu, is this a good place to get info?
[18:48] <mhall119> pquest: what kinds of contributions do yu want to work on?
[18:48] <pquest> I was interested in coding
[18:48] <pquest> I do a lot of .net programming at work, but I havent ever really coded in another environment
[18:50] <mhall119> there's not too much .Net in Ubuntu, just a handful of apps
[18:50] <mhall119> you might look at Vala though, it's a C#-like language that is starting to be used quite a bit in Ubuntu
[18:51] <pquest> Hm, I've never heard of that
[18:51] <pquest> I am pretty sure I am capable of using c++ or Java as well. I guess I am just trying to figure out where to start helping
[18:51] <mhall119> C++ would give you a lot of areas where you can contribute
[18:52] <mhall119> Python as well, which isn't very C#-like, but is a very easy language to learn
[18:53] <pquest> Where would be a good place to set myself up?
[18:54] <JanC> Python is easy to get started & productive with, but learning all the useful details takes some time
[18:54] <mhall119> pquest: http://developer.ubuntu.com/ has a lot of information about developing for Ubuntu
[18:54] <mhall119> including languages, APIs, tool, etc
[18:55] <mhall119> if you want to hack on Unity itself, http://unity.ubuntu.com/ has resources for that
[18:57] <pquest> I suppose bite-sized bugs is probably the best starting point for unity?
[18:57] <pquest> I don't really know what I want to do tbh
[18:57] <pquest> I just know I want to do something
[18:57] <JanC> if you want to work on unity, yes
[18:58] <mhall119> pquest: you should check http://harvest.ubuntu.com/ for bitesize bugs too
[18:58] <pquest> awesome
[18:58] <pquest> thanks
[18:58] <jokerdino> harvest hasn't been updated for a while.
[19:00] <pquest> Harvest is something old?
[19:00] <JanC> you can always look at the bug tracker...
[19:01] <jokerdino> http://goo.gl/tiheb bitesize unity bugs.
[19:11] <rye> remmina not going fullscreen properly in current unity/precise - is it known?
[19:17] <mhall119> rye: check the unity bug tracker for it
[19:17] <mhall119> if you don't find it, please file one
[19:19] <jokerdino> https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-2d/+bug/910167
[19:19] <jokerdino> I think I will take a crack at that bug. Any tips?
[19:20] <jokerdino> hi seif.
[19:45] <arand> Does unity pick up on hicolor-theme icons or does it need one in pixmaps for the app launcher?
[20:03] <mhall119> arand: I think it uses whatever the .desktop file says to use,  using the normal icon lookup priority
[20:04] <mhall119> arand: see http://standards.freedesktop.org/icon-theme-spec/icon-theme-spec-latest.html#icon_lookup
[20:19] <arand> mhall119: Well, that one indicates that hicolor take prio over pixmaps, I don't see why I would get this issue -_-
[20:39] <mhall119> arand: it could be that the app is using the direct patch to the icon file, rather than a name that goes through the lookup process
[20:43] <mfisch> mhall119: one thing that's been bugging me about my lens is that I can't get the stock quotes to use more than 1 row
[20:43] <mfisch> mhall119: the other ones seem to use as many rows as they need
[20:57] <arand> mhall119: No, the desktop file uses simply "redeclipse", as is the name of the icons and of the binary that is running...
[21:11] <mhall119> arand: is there a hicolor icon for that, or just the pixmap
[21:14] <arand> mhall119: I have a .xpm icon in pixmaps, and x32 x48 x64 x128 png icons in hicolor.
[21:23] <mhall119> arand: interesting, where do you see it using the low-res version?
[21:24] <arand> mhall119: In the app launcher (left), not sure the correct terminology..
[21:24] <mhall119> Launcher is the correct term, can you file a bug against unity with details about the app, and perhaps a screenshot too?
[21:27] <arand> Yeah, I'll be doing some more testing once I get a precise kvm up and working, hm... I wonder if it worked in oneiric before...