[01:33] <Daekdroom> I don't quite understand why unity-panel-service only grabs metacity theme from Ambiance and Radiance, even if you use those window borders with other GTK themes
[01:40] <bcurtiswx> kenvandine, you still there?
[10:57] <htorque> hello everyone, i got a small invisible (desktop-blocking) window on every workspace - is this a known problem?
[10:58] <htorque> unfortunately i have no idea what i did to cause it. here's its xwininfo: http://paste.ubuntu.com/575909/
[11:44] <hytreem> hi
[11:44] <hytreem> im on 10.10 and wanna try out the latest appmenu
[11:45] <hytreem> how would i do that?
[11:55] <hytreem> ok nevermind
[11:55] <hytreem> i downloaded the appmenu
[11:55] <hytreem> how do i install it?
[12:02] <hytreem> HELLO?
[12:03] <kklimonda> !weekend
[12:03] <ion> O HAI
[12:08] <hytreem> hey
[15:44] <Omega> I see Unity talk in here all the time, but never Ayatana talk.
[17:04] <Omega> Does anyone know if there is a way to flush the notify-senf buffer?
[17:56] <Omega> notify-send even.
[21:33] <hytreem> hi
[21:33] <hytreem> will ubuntu once be a paid OS like windows or macosx?
[21:35] <hyperair> no.
[21:35] <hyperair> what gives you that idea?
[21:39] <Omega> No, it will not, more information here: http://www.ubuntu.com/project
[21:42] <Daekdroom> That is one of the most absurd questions I've ever seen here
[21:43] <Omega> D< Omega> How do you escape a ' in sh? I can't do '\''
[21:43] <Omega> Oops.
[21:43] <Omega> It could be an honest question, no need to attack hytreem.
[21:44] <Daekdroom> Well, it could.
[21:44] <hytreem> it is
[21:44] <hytreem> i have read a lot of articles about ubuntu
[21:44] <hytreem> and some say that the way things are going now in the ubuntu project it will be a paid OS
[21:45] <achiang> from the front page of ubuntu.com - "Ubuntu is, and always will be, absolutely free."
[21:45] <hytreem> that's just a promise though
[21:45] <Daekdroom> That's a premise from the project
[21:45] <hytreem> and there won't be a paid version?
[21:45] <Daekdroom> It's not named Ubuntu because the name looks cool or anything (does it? :p). There's a philosophy behind it
[21:46] <hytreem> and a free version we'll use?
[21:46] <hytreem> i know but these articles are scary
[21:46] <hytreem> they say that ubuntu now tries to be the cool kid on campus so it generates a lot of popularity and then when it's like fully ready to compete with osx and windows it'll be a paid OS
[21:51] <Omega> hytreem: The community would never allow that to happen.
[21:51] <hytreem> are you sure?
[21:51] <Omega> If that is on the horizon the project will be forken, probably under a new name.
[21:51] <Omega> Yes.
[21:51] <hytreem> one blog post earlier said that the community is becoming less important
[21:51] <Omega> forked*
[21:52] <Omega> But the software is still free software.
[21:52] <Omega> The source code has to be released alongside the binaries.
[21:52] <Omega> And with that someone can build a free Ubuntu (if it becomes paid)
[21:52] <hytreem> so i dont have to worry at all? i can keep using ubuntu FOREVER FOR FREE?
[21:53] <Omega> Yep.
[21:53] <Omega> Forever.
[21:53] <hytreem> and for free?
[21:53] <Omega> I guarantee you that.
[21:53] <Omega> Correct.
[21:53] <hytreem> like not paying any money?
[21:53] <Omega> No money at all.
[21:53] <hytreem> wow
[21:53] <hytreem> why are there articles about this then?
[21:53] <Omega> And the free isn't only gratis, but also be able to look at the internals of ubuntu.
[21:53] <Omega> And share ubuntu.
[21:53] <Omega> With anyone you want
[21:54] <hyperair> hytreem: you can't believe everything you read online.
[21:54] <hyperair> boycottnovell write articles too
[21:54] <hyperair> ridiculous article that do nothing but spread lies
[21:54] <hytreem> i know hyperair, but it's not just 1
[21:54] <hytreem> "boycottnovell"?
[21:54] <hyperair> boycottnovell.com
[21:54] <Omega> hytreem: The articles you read are talking about something different (if the ones you are talking about are the ones I think you are)
[21:55] <Omega> They are probably talking about the governance of the Ubuntu project.
[21:55] <hytreem> Omega, yes that too, and then it tries to predict the future which often seems to look bad, the opposite of what the site promises and what you promised too
[21:56] <hytreem> hyperair, that site redirected me to another site
[21:56] <hyperair> journalists like to do that. it generates readership.
[21:56] <Omega> No, these two things are different.
[21:56] <Omega> The promise is about the Ubuntu project always being free.
[21:56] <hyperair> hytreem: right, techrights has taken over the job of spewing garbage.
[21:57] <Omega> The articles are talking about the community's role in Ubuntu's governance.
[21:57] <hyperair> which article are we talking about anyway?
[21:57] <hytreem> Omega, yes
[21:57] <hytreem> and then it goes on to say that the community will end up having been a puppet that has popularized the by then paid OS
[21:58] <hyperair> hytreem: could you give us a link?
[21:58] <Omega> I don't know what article you have been reading then.
[21:58] <hyperair> i'm now interested in seeing who wrote that.
[21:58] <Omega> The ones I read were well written and not sensationalist.
[21:59] <hytreem> i've read tons by googling but i'll bring out one, hold on
[21:59] <Omega> (Actually, I attended the meeting)
[21:59] <hytreem> http://skitterman.wordpress.com/2011/03/02/business-opportunity-in-ubuntu/
[21:59] <vish> hytreem: that says nothing about Ubuntu being sold ;)
[21:59] <hytreem> comments also contribute to my summarization
[21:59] <vish> even about , anytime in the future
[22:00] <hytreem> hold on i'll give more
[22:00] <hyperair> hytreem: you need to read the entire conversation in context.
[22:00] <hytreem> he has quoted?
[22:00] <Omega> Yes.
[22:00] <Omega> There was a meeting a few days ago.
[22:00] <hyperair> hytreem: i have come to believe that 80% of the people who post comments are idiots, or are masquerading as idiots.
[22:01] <vish> ++++++++++++++
[22:01] <hyperair> one idiot will come up with some preposterous idea
[22:01] <hyperair> the rest will follow like sheep.
[22:01] <hyperair> and then everyone turns into an idiot.
[22:01] <hytreem> that is very likely yes
[22:01] <hyperair> the remaining 20% choose to stay silent, because it's like trying to fight off a sharkfest
[22:02] <Omega> hytreem: Do you have any more questions?
[22:02] <vish> comments section is like folks trying to audition to become a standup comedian
[22:02] <Omega> If you do, don't be afraid of asking.
[22:02] <hytreem> you guys have convinced me i must say
[22:02] <hytreem> the community can drop the project and fork away
[22:03] <hyperair> there's always debian to run to in the event of a crisis.
[22:03] <Omega> Yes, anyone can fork.
[22:03] <hyperair> but i don't believe crisis will come.
[22:03] <Omega> That is the beauty of Free Software :)
[22:03] <hytreem> Omega, actually i have but it has nothing to do with this, when do you see programs like ProTools coming to Ubuntu?
[22:03] <hyperair> what's protools?
[22:04] <hyperair> ah, don't we have jokosher?
[22:04] <vish> i think he means the adobe ones....
[22:04] <Omega> Yes and Ardour
[22:04] <hyperair> yeah
[22:04] <hytreem> hyperair, good for bringing that up, i also read some more neutral posts about the trouble relationship between debian and ubuntu, any ideas on that?
[22:04] <hyperair> hytreem: my impression is that ubuntu developers in general don't resent debian
[22:05] <hytreem> ProTools is what a friend of mine uses on his Mac to produce high quality music, there are some well known artists who solely use that
[22:05] <hyperair> and that a miniscule percentage of debian developers resent ubuntu.
[22:05] <hytreem> resent?
[22:05] <Omega> The relationship isn't really bad to be honest. The Ubuntu Community Council consists of many Debian Developers.
[22:05] <hyperair> https://encrypted.google.com/search?client=ubuntu&channel=fs&q=define%3Aresent&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8
[22:05] <hyperair> yes, the relationship between ubuntu and debian is actually really good
[22:06] <hytreem> a common statement i have read is that and i quote: ubuntu profits of all the work done at debian
[22:06] <hyperair> and many ubuntu developers, myself included highly recommend pushing fixes as far upstream as possible, which include to debian
[22:06] <vish>   encrypted.google.com  !!!
[22:06]  * vish reads more about it..
[22:06] <hyperair> hytreem: that's probably something you read from some noisy idiot in some comment.
[22:06] <Omega> vish: http://duckduckgo.com :)
[22:06] <hyperair> vish: heheh i use https-everywhere.
[22:07] <Omega> hytreem: That is not really accurate, we all stand on the shoulders of giants, it's what open source is all about, sharing.
[22:07] <hyperair> vish: incidentally, i get secure.wikimedia.org as well.
[22:07] <hyperair> vish: when accessing wiki stuff i mean
[22:07] <hytreem> so i have nothing to worry about? other than protools coming to ubuntu?
[22:07] <hytreem> Omega, when do you see that happening btw?
[22:07] <vish> meh, i think i'll let the system absorb me :-D
[22:08] <vish> too much hassle;..
[22:08] <hytreem> it will likely not become opensource
[22:08] <hyperair> vish: it won't be too much hassle when someone wielding firesheep steals your session cookies over wifi
[22:08] <Omega> Hah, firesheep, it's been possible long before the shiny GUI :P
[22:08] <vish> ;p
[22:08] <hyperair> or when someone serves you upsidedownternet via arpspoof.
[22:09] <hyperair> Omega: yeah, i know, but firesheep made it available to the skiddies.
[22:09] <hytreem> what's a skiddie?
[22:09] <hyperair> script kiddie.
[22:09] <hytreem> oh
[22:09] <Omega> hytreem: I do not know, you can look at free software alternatives in the meantime, like Jokosher and Ardour.
[22:09] <hyperair> https://encrypted.google.com/search?client=ubuntu&channel=fs&q=define%3Ascript+kiddie&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8
[22:10] <hytreem> Omega, i have tried those but the problem is that they are not advanced enough
[22:10] <hyperair> even ardour? i hear that was pretty damn awesome though
[22:11] <hytreem> from what I have seen from my friend, he connected a small keyboard to his mac, chose to play a certain type of beat and repeated that for a while and he had a song
[22:11] <hyperair> hytreem: well, i suggest systematically highlighting the missing features and filing feature request bug reports on ardour. =p
[22:11] <hyperair> that should really be possible with ardour as well, i think
[22:12] <hyperair> sounds like a pretty basic feature
[22:12] <hyperair> but i haven't actually tried
[22:12] <hytreem> if that would be true hyperair I could become a musician
[22:12] <hyperair> well have fun then =p
[22:12] <hytreem> now I can't because I cannot afford a mac with protools
[22:12]  * hyperair gave up on making music.
[22:13] <hyperair> i much prefer listening to music
[22:13] <hytreem> i like both
[22:13] <Omega> hytreem: With Ubuntu we want to make sure this never happens to anyone, that's why it's free :)
[22:13]  * hyperair is happy to make music with frets on fire though
[22:13] <hytreem> what do you mean with "this omega?
[22:13] <Omega> < hytreem> now I can't because I cannot afford a mac with protools
[22:13] <hytreem> yes
[22:14] <hytreem> oh
[22:14] <hytreem> i understand
[22:15] <hytreem> well omega
[22:15] <hytreem> i cannot afford a mac to be more precisely
[22:15] <hytreem> i could afford protools
[22:15] <hyperair> get hackintosh ;-)
[22:15] <hytreem> and a small keyboard to connect
[22:15] <Omega> Give ardour a try.
[22:15] <hytreem> i heard it wouldn't run well because i have suckish hardware
[22:15] <hytreem> ok Omega
[22:17] <hytreem> ardour seems to use something weird for the menu bar
[22:18] <hytreem> will it be a supported program for the next ubuntu version?
[22:18] <hyperair> hmm it's 6am here. i better sleep before the sun rises
[22:18]  * hyperair grins, showing off his fangs
[22:26] <Omega> hytreem: If you have further questions, ask them in #ubuntu, if you have ardour questions, ask in #ardour.
[22:26] <hytreem> ok
[22:26] <hytreem> thank you


[18:31] <ibeardslee> morning
[18:31] <ibeardslee> mwhudson: found decent coffee?
[18:31] <mwhudson> ibeardslee: no
[18:33] <ibeardslee> how is it all going over there?
[18:34] <mwhudson> ibeardslee: good, i think
[18:34] <mwhudson> there's certainly a lot going on -- it feels like i've been here for weeks
[18:34] <mwhudson> not 1.5 days
[18:46] <chilts> morning
[18:46] <chilts> mwhudson: where are you?
[18:47] <ajmitch> morning
[18:47] <mwhudson> chilts: uds, near orlando
[18:53] <chilts> holidaying? or Canonical stuff?
[18:54] <chilts> ah, ubuntu developer summit
[18:54] <chilts> :)
[19:48] <hads> morning
[19:48] <Atamira> morning
[21:18] <thumper> morning
[21:18]  * thumper half wishes he could have stayed for UDS
[21:27]  * ajmitch sort of wishes he could have gone to UDS
[21:30]  * Atamira has no idea what UDS is
[21:30] <ajmitch> ubuntu developer summit, was mentioned earlier :)
[21:42] <Atamira> ahh.
[21:43] <Atamira> nice play to have it too
[21:43] <Atamira> play/place


[00:08] <rick_h_> I hate windows...ugh
[00:36] <snap-l> rick_h_: a-yep
[01:04] <brousch1> rick_h_: Who has foisted this insult upon you?
[01:04] <rick_h_> meh, stupid medical software stuff
[01:04] <rick_h_> getting my wife a new laptop and rather than dual boot I'd prefer to just do ubuntu witha windows VM
[01:05] <rick_h_> but to do that, I have to buy a full real non-oem license to put in the VM
[01:05] <rick_h_> so not only do I buy a window license I don't need with the new machine, but another more expensive one that costs the same as the SSD for my wife to have a happier computing experience
[01:12] <brousch1> Hm, how do I tell a python program to use Python3?
[01:12] <rick_h_> /use/bin/env python3 ?
[01:15] <Blazeix> *usr
[01:17] <rick_h_> yea...that
[01:21] <brousch1> grrrr
[01:21] <brousch1> I'll just shove a copy of this damn module into my project. It's abandoned anyways
[01:25] <rick_h_> lol
[01:43] <brousch1> I'm going crazy
[01:43] <brousch1> It's like the python files in a module don't see the other files in the module
[01:44] <brousch1> From a.py I can't do import b even though they are in the same module and there's an __init__.py
[02:00] <brousch1> Wait a minute.  Ask again later.
[13:46] <rick_h_> damn
[17:00] <snap-l> So, good day so far?
[17:00] <jcastro> good day for rick
[17:01] <jcastro> delicious merge proposals!
[17:01] <rick_h_> psh :P
[17:01] <rick_h_> landing day
[17:01] <snap-l> rick_h_: Oh, you've started using psh?
[17:01] <rick_h_> 2 down one to go
[17:01] <snap-l> ;)
[17:01] <snap-l> Launch days are the worst
[17:01] <rick_h_> not launch, land
[17:01] <snap-l> landing = ?
[17:01] <rick_h_> fortunately all our stuff is still pre-staging/staging
[17:02] <snap-l> Ah, ok
[17:02] <snap-l> landing changes vs launching changes
[17:02] <rick_h_> landing == in trunk
[17:02] <rick_h_> launching means no server behind port 80
[17:02] <rick_h_> err means behind server behind port 80 and such
[17:03] <snap-l> publicly accessible
[17:03] <rick_h_> there you go
[17:03] <rick_h_> something like that
[17:11] <greg-g> hah
[17:35] <rick_h_> grr, google stuff having issues today
[17:35] <rick_h_> gmail.com failed to load, now rietveld 500 issues, slow as crap too
[17:41] <rick_h_> jcastro: just a few fields not required eh? https://code.launchpad.net/~rharding/charmworld/qa_form_cleaning/+merge/143365 lol
[17:46] <jrwren> shite day
[18:15] <rick_h_> lol
[18:15] <rick_h_> The Website Ahead Contains Malware!
[18:15] <rick_h_> Google Chrome has blocked access to techcrunch.com for now.
[18:15] <snap-l> Good riddance.
[18:16]  * snap-l can get to Tech Crunch
[18:16] <rick_h_> in chrome?
[18:16] <snap-l> Yeah
[18:16] <snap-l> Are you in beta?
[18:16] <rick_h_> dev yea
[18:17] <snap-l> Hm
[18:21] <jrwren> why would you want to go to that web page?
[18:21] <rick_h_> was following a link to see wtf the FB announcement was
[18:24] <snap-l> Graph Search
[18:25] <snap-l> now can we please stop caring what valley hipsters think is near?
[18:27] <snap-l> neat, even. ;)
[18:35] <jcastro> rick_h_: heh yeah
[18:35] <jcastro> I should have been more specific with you in the first place
[18:36] <rick_h_> all good, got it worked out
[19:38] <brousch> I finally got that Python3 project released in stable condition. My first release in over a year
[19:41] <jrwren> cool
[19:41] <jrwren> so its final. python3 is the default and best.
[19:41] <brousch> he
[19:41] <brousch> h
[19:43] <brousch> I might have another one to jump on now
[19:48] <greg-g> man, confluence (by Atlassian) is horrible
[19:48] <snap-l> Which one is that?
[19:48] <greg-g> why do they give free licenses to floss projects? it just hurts floss projects
[19:48] <greg-g> can you see https://wiki.benetech.org/dashboard.action
[19:48] <greg-g> yeah, that's public, the one that looks like that
[19:49] <snap-l> Yeah. Looks like most Atlassian fare
[19:49] <jrwren> a lot of 15yo projects are ugly like that.
[19:49] <greg-g> it's not just the ugly part
[19:49] <snap-l> At lot of Java applications are ugly like that
[19:50] <greg-g> it's, I clicked on the "view history" link on a wiki page, looked at who edited, great, the saw the link "go back to page information" which totally sounded wrong, but it must know where I came from, so ok, NOPE, there's this weird ass summary of a wiki page that isn't the page
[19:50] <snap-l> greg-g: Atlassian seems like a company that wants to do good things, but has a butt that's full of lead (named Java and their legacy codebase)
[19:50] <greg-g> heh, fair
[19:50] <greg-g> I know nothing of them, just only been a user of confluence a couple times
[19:51] <snap-l> They have some interesting interoperability
[19:51] <snap-l> We had their ticket tracking software for one project that linked together with Fisheye (which was a repo-checker)
[19:51] <greg-g> huh
[19:51] <snap-l> That it worked as well as it did was shocking
[19:52] <snap-l> Jira
[19:52] <greg-g> yeah, that's the other time I've used their stuff, was at UMich where the Med School dept I worked in used it for issue tracking
[19:52] <snap-l> Were I to do everything in house, and had money to burn, I'd probably take it seriously.
[19:52] <greg-g> Sakai also uses it
[19:53] <snap-l> Barring that, I'd probably either pay someone else to host it, or use OSS
[19:53] <snap-l> seemed about the same effort either way.
[19:53] <jrwren> jira is a baby step up from bugzilla
[19:54] <snap-l> It wasn't horrible to use, just felt like every other issue / project tracking system: clunky, ill fitting, and baroque.
[19:55] <greg-g> heh


[12:09] <siretart> uniq: yes, note this on wiki.ubuntu.com/REVUDevelopment
[12:09] <uniq> will do. thanks.
[12:09] <siretart> sorry, I'm currently not available very well, I'm in an internet cafe with friends right now..
[12:10] <uniq> no problem, enjoy :)
[12:22] <pef> bye !
[12:26] <uniq> figured out the linda error.
[12:34] <comadreja> how do I setup my hoary to compile breezy packages without breaking the system ?
[12:34] <uniq> install pbuilder
[12:35] <uniq> or make a chroot with debootstrap and dchroot
[12:35] <comadreja> how do I use any ? howtos ? pointers ?
[12:35] <uniq> hang on.
[12:38] <uniq> comadreja: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebootstrapChroot
[12:39] <comadreja> thanks uniq :)
[01:27] <comadreja> uniq: ping
[01:28] <uniq> pong.
[01:28] <comadreja> I get an error with pbuilder
[01:28] <comadreja> I: Configuring dpkg-dev...
[01:28] <comadreja> W: Failure while configuring base packages.  This will be attempted 5 times.
[01:29] <comadreja> ...
[01:29] <comadreja>  -> Aborting with an error
[01:29] <comadreja>  /usr/bin/apt-get: error while loading shared libraries: libstdc++.so.6: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
[01:30] <uniq> force it from the shell; 'pbuilder login --save-after-login'
[01:30] <ogra> comadreja, did you follow the howto ?
[01:30] <comadreja> yep
[01:30] <uniq> if the base.tgz. is made at all.
[01:30] <ogra> and installed a hoary pbuildr first...
[01:30] <comadreja> it fails at pbuilder create
[01:31] <uniq> oh, you're trying to make a breezy build directly?
[01:31] <comadreja> I installed a breezy pbuilder
[01:31] <ogra> doesnt work
[01:31] <ogra> update a hoary pbuilder
[01:31] <comadreja> nopes, sorry breezy debootstrap
[01:31] <ogra> like the howto says :)
[01:31] <comadreja> hoary pbuilder
[01:32] <comadreja> then pbuilder create --distribution breezy
[01:32] <ogra> nope
[01:32] <ogra> look at the howto
[01:32] <ogra> it says how to build a hoary pbuilder and how to update that to breezy
[01:33] <comadreja> yes, I did, I think so
[01:33] <comadreja> I created the config, changed the hoary for breezy
[01:33] <ogra> you created it for hoary ?
[01:33] <comadreja> oh, nopes, I directly created the config for breezy
[01:33] <ogra> thats what i mean
[01:34] <comadreja> thanks, sorry :/
[01:46] <comadreja> now I get this trying to build gnome-terminal :
[01:47] <comadreja>  -> Considering  libvte-dev (>= 1:0.11.13)
[01:47] <comadreja>       Tried versions: 1:0.11.12-0ubuntu2
[01:47] <comadreja>    -> Does not satisfy version, not trying
[01:47] <comadreja> E: Could not satisfy build-dependency.
[01:47] <comadreja> E: pbuilder-satisfydepends failed.
[01:47] <uniq> did you update it to breezy?
[01:48] <comadreja> yep
[01:48] <comadreja> everything worked fine
[01:49] <comadreja> I'm trying to build breezy gnome-terminal
[01:49] <uniq> try another mirror then, i have libvte-dev 1:0.11.13-2ubuntu1 available in breezy.
[01:50] <uniq> how did you change sources.list in pbuilder?
[01:50] <comadreja> 1,$s/hoary/breezy
[01:51] <uniq> which file? and how did you get into the pbuilder base.tgz? pbuilder login --save-after-login ?
[01:51] <comadreja> I changed /etc/pbuilder/apt.config/sources.list
[01:52] <jamessan|laptop> you didn't read the howto very well, then.  it tells you exactly what to do
[01:52] <comadreja> sorry, maybe we're reading different howtos
[01:53] <comadreja> it has three lines regarding the change to breezy
[01:53] <comadreja> one is this
[01:53] <comadreja>  change all occurences of hoary in /etc/pbuilderrc and /etc/pbuilder/apt.config/ to breezy
[01:55] <uniq> I didn't read a howto, i did it from reading the manpage :)
[01:55] <comadreja> ok, sorry, I just did what the howto says
[01:55] <uniq> you started it with pbuilder --override-config then?
[01:55] <comadreja> and it doesn't seem to work, I'll fix the howto when I get how this works
[01:55] <ogra> comadreja, i did it too, and my pbuilder works
[01:55] <comadreja> yep
[01:56] <comadreja> ogra, I don't doubt it, but mine doesn't
[01:56] <uniq> comadreja: when you execute 'pbuilder update' does it say hoary or breezy?
[01:57] <comadreja> I didn't check, should I'll do it again ?
[01:57] <comadreja> it says Upgrading for distribution breezy
[01:58] <uniq> when downloading from the mirrors too?
[01:58] <comadreja> oh, I see the problem
[01:58] <comadreja> Failed to fetch http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/s/sed/sed_4.1.4-2_i386.deb  MD5Sum mismatch
[01:58] <uniq> ah.
[01:59] <uniq> change to archive.ubuntu.com :)
[01:59] <comadreja> also with libacl1_2
[01:59] <ogra> dont use the us mirror, its unstable :)
[01:59] <comadreja> ok, thanks
[01:59] <comadreja> that's not in the howto ;)
[01:59] <ogra> and if youre developing its better to use archive directly because the mirrors have a timeshift
[01:59] <tseng> we should probabyl not make that default in the installer
[02:00] <tseng> if no one is going to fix it
[02:00] <ogra> tseng, huh ?
[02:00] <ogra> us is the default in the installer anywhere ?
[02:00] <tseng> us mirror
[02:00] <comadreja> ogra yes
[02:00] <tseng> if you use us locale
[02:00] <ogra> ouch
[02:00] <comadreja> I used the installer
[02:00] <comadreja> and it was my default
[02:00] <ogra> thats bad
[02:00] <comadreja> that's in hoary...
[02:01] <uniq> it's like that in the most recent breezy too.
[02:01] <uniq> afaik.
[02:02] <ogra> hmm, so the mirror should be stabilized then ...
[02:03] <uniq> or us.archive should be redirected to archive. temporarily
[02:03] <uniq> as dns is often easier to change than fixing a broken mirror.
[02:09] <comadreja> ok, now I (supposedly) fixed a bug in gnome-terminal, how do I test the package ?
[02:10] <comadreja> it's built
[02:10] <schweeb> you install it
[02:10] <schweeb> and test it
[02:10] <comadreja> no dependency problems ?
[02:11] <uniq> it'll end up in /var/cache/pbuilder/result if you don't specify otherwise.
[02:11] <comadreja> yes, dependency problems
[02:11] <comadreja> I can't install it
[02:11] <schweeb> although, gnome-terminal is in main, so you'll have to submit a patch to the maillist or bugzilla, rather than having someone upload a package
[02:11] <schweeb> which branch are you running?
[02:12] <comadreja> sure, I'm just willing to check it. Hoary
[02:12] <schweeb> may just want to submit the bug, and have one of the main devs fix it and test it themselves
[02:12] <schweeb> if you're unwilling to go to breezy
[02:13] <comadreja> oh, it's an already submitted bug
[02:13] <schweeb> I know
[02:13] <comadreja> 1219, malone
[02:13] <schweeb> I would imagine so
[02:13] <schweeb> paste the text of the patch into the notes
[02:13] <schweeb> as a proposed fix
[02:13] <tseng> schweeb++
[02:13] <comadreja> how would I do that, if I don't even know if it works ?
[02:14] <schweeb> you could try to compile it against the libs on your running system
[02:14] <schweeb> but, the abi/apis have almost certainly changed
[02:14] <comadreja> doing, thanks
[02:14] <comadreja> damn...
[02:14] <schweeb> best option: upgrade to breezy :p
[02:15] <schweeb> kinda have to run the development branch if you plan on developing for it
[02:15] <tseng> schweeb: it rocks
[02:15] <comadreja> really, is it not dangerous ? but I work with my laptop on development too... It scares me a bit
[02:16] <schweeb> tseng: rocks is a relative term
[02:16] <tseng> ok, it rocks oo 1.1
[02:16] <schweeb> I've been running breezy on my laptop for about a month now
[02:16] <schweeb> works great
[02:16] <seth_k> I've been running breezy on laptop and desktop since Hoary+1
[02:16] <seth_k> no real worries
[02:16] <schweeb> kinda gotta stay plugged into the community to know what's known to be broken
[02:16] <comadreja> ok, I'll make you responsible ;P
[02:16] <seth_k> 2.6.12 kernel still not working on desktop though
[02:17] <tseng> make yourself responsible
[02:17] <schweeb> lemme guess - you need the linux-restricted-modules package, seth_k ?
[02:17] <uniq> i use the 2.6.12 kernel.. works great :)
[02:17] <comadreja> tseng, it was a joke, as just you could have imagined
[02:17] <schweeb> same here
[02:17] <seth_k> schweeb: no. My system clock runs about 20x too fast
[02:17] <seth_k> schweeb: with the 2.6.12-k7 kernel
[02:17] <tseng> i dont have a very vivid imagination RE user support
[02:17] <tseng> ive seen it all
[02:17] <seth_k> schweeb: the laptop, running 2.6.12-686 is fine
[02:18] <comadreja> tseng : feeling better of your nightmares ?
[02:18] <tseng> no.
[02:18] <comadreja> I guessed ;)
[02:18] <schweeb> seth_k: does it do the same w/ the -386 kernel?
[02:18] <schweeb> and, is the bug reported?
[02:19] <seth_k> schweeb: only k7 kernel affected afaik, and reported yesterday
[02:19] <schweeb> reminds me, I need to file a couple kernel bugs
[02:19] <schweeb> frigging ACPI
[02:33] <tseng> schweeb: do it
[02:42] <comadreja> is there anything like a --save-after-build for pbuilder ?
[02:43] <schweeb> save after build?
[02:43] <schweeb> it throws all of the packages into a directory in its chroot
[02:43] <schweeb> somewhere in /var
[02:43] <comadreja> but for every build it reinstalls
[02:44] <schweeb> oh
[02:44] <schweeb> that's intentional
[02:44] <schweeb> it's the whole point
[02:44] <comadreja> anyway, I don't know if it has too much sense (me using pbuilder) as I'm upgrading to breezy
[02:45] <schweeb> if you leave packages installed in there, then it wouldn't be useful to determine if your dependencies are correct
[02:45] <schweeb> pbuilder is useful for a clean build environment
[02:45] <schweeb> your running system is not a clean build environment
[02:45] <comadreja> I see
[02:46] <schweeb> you understand what I'm getting at?
[02:46] <comadreja> yep, I do, thanks
[02:46] <comadreja> :)
[02:47] <comadreja> but for tests, I definitely can't use pbuilder
[02:47] <comadreja> it just takes too long
[02:47] <schweeb> yea, pbuilder isn't meant to be an interactive install
[02:47] <schweeb> er s/install/desktop/
[02:48] <comadreja> btw, instead of moving completely to breezy, I just duplicated deb and deb-src in the sources.list (breezy/hoary)
[02:48] <comadreja> and installed necesary packages with -t breezy
[02:48] <schweeb> ewwww
[02:48] <tseng> well if you dist-upgrade
[02:49] <comadreja> also made hoary default:release
[02:49] <tseng> you will get everything
[02:49] <schweeb> that's not a reliable testing environment
[02:49] <tseng> besides that being disgusting
[02:49] <schweeb> not at all
[02:49] <comadreja> :(
[02:49] <schweeb> you're supposed to be testing it in the exact same environment that it will run in
[02:49] <schweeb> which, if you're only half breezy, you've got a horrible mismatch of junk
[02:50] <comadreja> I see, yes
[02:50] <schweeb> some libraries will be old versions, some will be new
[02:50] <schweeb> and will interact in different ways than if you were fully breezy
[02:50] <comadreja> but dependencies should work that out, right ?
[02:51] <seth_k> no
[02:51] <schweeb> not necessarily
[02:51] <comadreja> ok, I'll move to breezy
[02:52] <schweeb> is there some non-ugly way to set your default gcc w/o manually changing the symlink?
[02:53] <schweeb> pretty sure this cisco vpnclient is failing on build because of the c/c++ api/abi change
[03:19] <schweeb> is malone the preferred place to submit all bugs now?  or should I cross-post with bugzilla?
[03:19] <seth_k> oy, wish i knew
[03:30] <comadreja> now I need help
[03:30] <comadreja> I was upgrading, and I get this
[03:31] <comadreja> Unpacking x-common (from .../archives/x-common_1.02_all.deb) ...
[03:31] <comadreja> dpkg: error processing /var/cache/apt/archives/x-common_1.02_all.deb (--unpack):
[03:31] <comadreja>  trying to overwrite `/usr/bin/X11', which is also in package xorg-common
[03:37] <plugwash> it sounds like a package has been renamed without appropriate replaces or conflicts being in place
[03:37] <plugwash> i think you need to remove xorg-common then try to upgrade again
[03:39] <comadreja> I did a dpkg --force-overwrite -i ... of the package
[03:39] <comadreja> is this a reported bug ?
[04:08] <comadreja> ok, I upgraded to breezy and now X won't start
[04:08] <comadreja> missing output drivers, it says
[04:10] <comadreja> nopes, signal 11
[04:10] <schweeb> chris@schweeb-x41:~/Desktop/vpnclient$ ls -l /usr/bin/X
[04:10] <schweeb> lrwxrwxrwx  1 root root 14 2005-07-04 13:09 /usr/bin/X -> ../X11R6/bin/X
[04:10] <schweeb> be sure that symlink is correct
[04:10] <comadreja> yep, it is
[04:11] <comadreja> help, please
[04:12] <schweeb> could you paste the exact errors to a pastebin somewhere or something?
[04:13] <comadreja> I have no web browser
[04:13] <comadreja> Exact error is:
[04:13] <comadreja> Fatal server error:
[04:13] <comadreja> Caught signal 11. Server aborting
[04:15] <comadreja> is there a solution or should I start reinstalling hoary ?
[04:15] <comadreja> I mean, I've gotta work tomorrow
[04:15] <comadreja> and I need the computer :)
[04:17] <schweeb> I'm not well versed as to what sig11 is
[04:17] <schweeb> how are you starting X?
[04:17] <schweeb> through GDM or startx
[04:18] <comadreja> gdm
[04:19] <comadreja> startx does the same
[04:20] <schweeb> you ONLY have breezy sources in your sources.list right now?
[04:20] <schweeb> and you don't have any odd pinning going on?
[04:20] <comadreja> only breezy, no pinning
[04:21] <comadreja> but I'll start pinning right away
[04:21] <comadreja> :)
[04:30] <comadreja> nothing, fuck it
[04:31] <comadreja> I'll reinstall hoary
[04:33] <schweeb> be sure you don't have any packages still held
[04:34] <comadreja> I don't, I'm screwed
[04:34] <comadreja> it's a signal 11
[04:34] <comadreja> that's a sigint, right
[04:34] <comadreja> ?
[04:35] <jamessan> man 7 signal
[04:36] <comadreja> cool, much better
[04:39] <comadreja> is there any way to use aptitude to install hoary's X ?
[04:53] <comadreja> how do I reinstall the whole gnome, ubuntu-desktop, X, and all related ?
[05:56] <_crimsun> 'evening, tritium. How are things?
[05:56] <tritium> hi _crimsun.  Getting close now.  How are you?
[05:58] <bddebian> Heya tritium
[05:58] <tritium> hi there bddebian.  Still up, eh?
[05:59] <bddebian> tritium: Of course :-)
[05:59] <comadreja> hey, I need help
[06:00] <bddebian> comadreja: Yeah, we know :-)
[06:00] <comadreja> :/ damn it's 6:00 am
[06:00] <comadreja> I won't sleep today
[06:00] <comadreja> where could I find an older xserver-xorg package ?
[06:00] <tritium> _crimsun, it's been a while.  What's new?
[06:03] <jamessan> comadreja: why not just install hoary and be done with it?
[06:04] <comadreja> I won't give up :)
[06:04] <comadreja> it's just a bug in xserver-xorg
[06:04] <comadreja> with i810
[06:04] <comadreja> if I could find an older version... I made too many fixes to this installation
[06:04] <comadreja> I don't wanna lose them.
[06:05] <comadreja> I'm downloading the colony cd2
[06:05] <comadreja> I guess I could find an older xserver-xorg there
[06:05] <ajmitch> comadreja: morgue.ubuntu.com may help
[06:05] <comadreja> cool, thanks ajmitch !
[06:05] <ajmitch> although it doesn';t look to have been updated for awhile
[06:06] <_crimsun> tritium: not much, finally got in contact with my sister in london a couple hours ago, so things are looking up. What's new with you?
[06:06] <schweeb> the archive should have a few versions back still, I believe
[06:06] <comadreja> is there anyway to search over morgue ?
[06:06] <tritium> _crimsun, I'm glad you heard from her.  I didn't realize you had family there.  Same with me.  Finalizing my dissertation this weekend.
[06:07] <comadreja> seems too old packages
[06:07] <_crimsun> tritium: ah, best of luck (again)! You'll do great. :)
[06:08] <tritium> _crimsun, thanks.  I've been running Monte-Carlo simulations for I can't recall how long now... :)
[06:08] <_crimsun> :)
[06:28] <tritium> good night, guys
[06:33] <comadreja> hey, with 6.8.2-33 I get an X not executable, but I have the link
[07:26] <comadreja> ok, got the X working
[07:26] <comadreja> but the desktop is very unstable
[07:52] <comadreja> :)
[09:30] <tiglionabbit> hello
[10:54] <ivoks> siretart: ping
[11:26] <siretart> ivoks: pong
[11:26] <siretart> morning :)
[11:31] <mitsuhiko> morning siretart
[11:32] <siretart> hi mitsuhiko
[12:17] <lunatech> is there a ubuntu jabber server ?
[12:18] <lunatech> to test out MOTUIM ?
[12:22] <Mez> I doubt it luna :D
[12:22] <Mez> but that's something to think about
[12:22] <Treenaks> hm... I guess I'm too late to troll Microsoft Teched with Hoary CDs ;)
[12:28] <tseng> ftp://ftp.ssc.com/pub/lj/Web/RC/8272.txt
[12:29] <tseng> we are up against CentOS and Fedora
[12:29] <tseng> good times
[12:43] <uniq> lunatech: you can make your own, apt-get install jabber :)
[12:50] <mort> hey DanielN, you allright?
[12:52] <lunatech> uniq: i know, just wanted to see what the cutting edge is like on ubuntu-jabber :)
[12:53] <lunatech> for example, i read that you could tunnel y! and msn network into jabber - but i don't know how
[12:54] <mort> http://kqe.de/pruell/parents-magazine.gif
[12:55] <Treenaks> mort: sigh
[01:02] <mort> Treenaks: :-) do you have moral problems reading that word or do you think making fun of it isn't very mature or didn't you get it?
[01:30] <Treenaks> mort: the immature part :)
[02:53] <siretart> ok, worked on revu a bit
[02:53] <siretart> now html comments work, archive is reenabled. uploads are "unarchived" on every new upload
[02:54] <siretart> have fun!
[02:57] <slomo> siretart: hmm... maybe sort the uploads by their upload date, oldest on top
[03:04] <siretart> slomo: well, sort of this is already done that way
[03:04] <siretart> slomo: but additionally, uploads are grouped by 'Updated' and 'NEW' Packages
[03:05] <slomo> hm when exactly does a package change from new to updated?
[03:09] <siretart> slomo: a NEW package is a package not in the ubuntu archive (yet)
[03:10] <siretart> an 'updated' package is updating a package in the archive
[03:11] <slomo> ok... i thought that state only relates to the upload in some way, for example updated when an updated upload is uploaded
[03:12] <siretart> nope
[03:12] <siretart> the difference is that NEW packages need 3 advocates, normal package updates only 1 advocate
[03:12] <siretart> therefore they are likley to get uploaded more quickly
[03:13] <slomo> yes that makes sense ;)
[03:15] <slomo> btw... is anyone here who knows why there is a fairly new version of smlnj as sourcepackage in the archives but only old versions are available as binary package (which are even incomplete)... on my ppc machine the new sourcepackage builds fine
[03:16] <slomo> or is there some place where i can look at the build logs?
[03:22] <comadreja> howdy all
[03:22] <siretart> slomo: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont
[03:22] <ogra> slomo, if you want just an overwiew for the day also hwdb.ubuntu.com
[03:22] <ogra> err
[03:23] <ogra> hwdb.ubuntu.com/buildlogs
[03:23] <slomo> thanks
[03:24] <siretart> wow. hwdb is nice!
[03:28] <slomo> hum... i remember the problem i had with smlnj... the package build depends on itself... by ignoring the depencies one get a (incomplete) binary of the compiler which then can be used to build the whole package... is also written in the README.Debian
[03:28] <slomo> what can be done about that?
[03:29] <plugwash> slomo fix the debian build system so it can build without build depending on itself
[03:29] <plugwash> by making it do two compilation runs as part of the normal bulid process
[03:31] <slomo> hm i make a note and will look at it later...
[03:44] <\sh> *phew*
[03:44] <\sh> my laptop is actually working again
[03:45] <Lathiat> heh
[03:46] <\sh> actually only half way through with a nice working env
[03:47] <ivoks> hi all
[03:48] <Lathiat> i can get ubuntu up adn going within an hour
[03:48] <Lathiat> plus some download time
[03:48] <Lathiat> which totally rocks
[03:48] <ivoks> yeah
[03:48] <\sh> lathiat: it took me two hours now, just because I'm too blond to install my new hd correctly ;)
[03:48] <Lathiat> i want to write a script to set my magic gconf keys
[03:48] <\sh> and updated to breezy, xorg was breaking again ;)
[03:48] <Lathiat> already got one that installs packages, fixes config files, etc
[03:48] <ivoks> i hate blond guys :)
[03:48] <Lathiat> \sh: yeh, i had to futz to get Xorg going
[03:48] <Lathiat> had to do a mix of
[03:48] <Lathiat> upgrade
[03:48] <Lathiat> dist-upgrade
[03:48] <Lathiat> -f install
[03:49] <Lathiat> and dpkg -i stuff
[03:49] <\sh> yeah
[03:49] <Lathiat> cus xorg-common vs x-common
[03:49] <Lathiat> wanted to replace a file
[03:49] <Lathiat> installing in the wrong order
[03:49] <Lathiat> so i had to force install one
[03:49] <Lathiat> then -f
[03:49] <Lathiat> then dist-upgrade
[03:49] <Lathiat> plus i had to -f install just to get to that point
[03:50] <\sh> ok...my backups are at home...
[04:53] <j^> doey anyone know what happend to libwx2.5.3 in breezy, is it just missing due to some transision?
[04:55] <Hieronymus> apt-cache search libwx
[04:55] <Hieronymus> shows some
[04:56] <j^> Hieronymus only 2.4 not 2.5
[04:56] <Hieronymus> Hieronymus: yes I see. And there was 2.5 in Hoary?
[04:56] <Hieronymus> That'd be weird
[04:57] <j^> libwxgtk2.5.3
[04:57] <j^> http://packages.ubuntu.com/hoary/libs/libwxgtk2.5.3
[04:57] <j^> together with the python bindings
[04:57] <Hieronymus> you might want to file a bug then
[04:57] <j^> problem is wxgtk2.4 is still using gtk1.2
[04:57] <j^> in malone?
[04:58] <Hieronymus> j^: universe is malone, main is bugzilla
[04:59] <j^> well it was in universe in hoary...
[05:00] <Hieronymus> j^: you might want to file a bug then, if none is already filed
[05:04] <j^> ok https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/bugs/1308
[05:05] <Hieronymus> aha!!
[05:05] <Hieronymus> wxvlc depends on that!
[05:05] <Hieronymus> might that be why vlc has not been installable?
[05:05] <Hieronymus> https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/bugs/1138
[05:07] <j^> yup.
[05:08] <j^> it needs wx2.5 + a rebuild to depend on dbus 0.3
[05:08] <j^> or not depend on dbus
[05:12] <Hieronymus> How do I figure out who's the maintainer for a Universe package?
[05:13] <ogra> Hieronymus, the last guy who changed it
[05:13] <Hieronymus> uh, yeah, how do I figure that out?
[05:14] <j^> Hieronymus debian/changelog
[05:15] <ogra>  /usr/share/doc/<package>/changelog.Debian.gz
[05:16] <Hieronymus> It's a Debian guy
[05:16] <Hieronymus> well, he has @debian.org
[05:16] <Hieronymus>  -- Isaac Clerencia<EMAIL_ADDRESS>Wed, 29 Jun 2005 23:01:04 +0200
[05:17] <j^> wxwidgets2.5 (<IP_ADDRESS>ubuntu4) hoary; urgency=low
[05:17] <j^>   * Fix missing wx/archive.h header in wx2.5-headers.  Thanks,
[05:17] <j^>     Werner Mahr!  Closes: Ubuntu#8316 and Debian#294998.
[05:17] <j^>  -- Daniel T Chen<EMAIL_ADDRESS>Mon, 28 Mar 2005 19:44:26 -0500
[05:17] <ogra> so it wasnt touched in ubuntu then...
[05:17] <j^> thing is that it was only in experimental if i remember right
[05:17] <j^> and never made it into sarge
[05:18] <j^> latest version on http://www.wxwidgets.org/ is 2.6.1 stable release
[05:18] <ogra> j^, iirc we wanted to wait for 2.6 .... but dont quote me on that
[05:18] <Mez> nope,. cant be arsed, although it would be nice.
[05:18] <ogra> (for 2.6 to be packaged in debain)
[05:18] <Mez> though technically I could make a package to run the .run file ;)
[05:18] <j^> but removing 2.5 and not replacing it with 2.6 is a bad idea
[05:21] <Hieronymus> so I should file a Debian bug report instead?
[05:21] <j^> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=316680
[05:22] <Hieronymus> for https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/bugs/1213
[05:43] <blackmoon> hi
[05:46] <blackmoon> there are a packager for freepops (amd64 )for hoary?
[05:48] <Hieronymus> blackmoon: http://packages.ubuntu.com
[05:49] <blackmoon> Hieronymus: i've already look there but this package is only for breezy...
[05:49] <blackmoon> Hieronymus: ...and this don't work on hoary...
[05:49] <Hieronymus> blackmoon: so?
[05:49] <Hieronymus> then ther is none
[05:50] <Mez> omg...
[05:50] <Mez> this is going to be such an awkward package
[05:50] <blackmoon> Hieronymus: ...i've recompiled (and packaged) it for hoary (amd64) and work...
[05:52] <Hieronymus> blackmoon: smile, be happy :)
[05:52] <blackmoon> ...so you can do the same and put it in the hoary repository, for all other user...
[05:53] <Hieronymus> maybe you can add it at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseCandidates with the comment "I recompiled the Breezy package and it worked" or something similar?
[05:54] <blackmoon> ok, why not... but i'm not a programmer... it's the same?
[05:56] <blackmoon> ok, thanks for your time.... bye...
[06:07] <bddebian> Heya
[06:18] <ed1t> hello
[07:21] <sistpoty> siretart: huhu... i just commited some diagrams for revu2 :)
[07:22] <siretart> hey, great! :)
[07:23] <siretart> sistpoty: I'll install a mail trigger for us both, ok?
[07:23] <siretart> ed1t: hi
[07:23] <sistpoty> siretart: yeah, this would be great
[07:23] <ed1t> hey siretart
[07:24] <siretart> done
[07:24] <sistpoty> http://studhome.rrze.uni-erlangen.de/~sistpoty/revu2/
[07:25] <siretart> sistpoty: is this dia?
[07:26] <sistpoty> siretart: yes (dia in svn, on studhome the png's)
[07:26] <siretart> just checked it out
[07:26] <siretart> tseng: ping
[07:27] <sistpoty> siretart: shall I write s.th. on the Revudevelopment-page in wiki about it?
[07:28] <siretart> sistpoty: that would be great. tseng and Burgundiva created and discussed about further revu devolpment earlier this week..
[07:29] <sistpoty> siretart: ok :)
[07:30] <ed1t> i hate gaim
[07:30] <jsgotangco> ed1t: amen
[07:30] <ed1t> lol
[07:30] <ed1t> jsgotangco wat do u use?
[07:31] <jsgotangco> well my laptop got busted today and they gave me a loaner on XP
[07:31] <jsgotangco> which im using now
[07:31] <jsgotangco> i just installed GAIM
[07:31] <siretart> hrhr:         * Major Version 2 (can do nothing, but that very elegantly)
[07:31] <jsgotangco> and using it now to chat with you
[07:33] <jsgotangco> gaim on windows is nice though
[07:33] <ed1t> i just want a AIM client which flashes the windows when i get a message like windows
[07:33] <ed1t> coz its annoying to go back forth and check for a message
[07:33] <pef> hello
[07:34] <siretart> hello pef
[07:34] <bddebian> Hello pef
[07:34] <ed1t> is this the channel for laptop supports team?
[07:34] <Hieronymus> ed1t: this is MOTU. http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU
[07:35] <siretart> ed1t: this channel is about maintenance of the universe ;)
[07:36] <bddebian> You guys are maintaining the Universe? Wow! :-)
[07:37] <ed1t> lol
[07:37] <jsgotangco> you should talk to those maintaining the Multiverse!
[07:37] <siretart> hehe
[07:41] <jsgotangco> well i gotta sleep at least when i wake up i'll be able to get my laptop again
[07:41] <jsgotangco> rest easy guys
[07:44] <Hieronymus> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUNEWGames If I find games somewhere am I allowed/supposed (as non-MOTU) to edit that page?
[07:44] <siretart> Hieronymus: you are perfectly welcome to do so!
[07:45] <sistpoty> siretart: just wrote some (more or less silly) text... want to look over it?
[07:49] <siretart> sistpoty: sure
[07:49] <ivoks> hi
[07:49] <bddebian> Heya ivoks
[07:50] <siretart> huhu ivoks
[07:50] <ivoks> siretart: oh, did you saw my feature request for revu? :)
[07:50] <siretart> ivoks: err, which one? ;)
[07:50] <ivoks> to create repository on server
[07:50] <pef> siretart: is it possible you to delete from revu datakiosk uploaded by jridell ? I've just uploaded a corrected version
[07:50] <ivoks> so we can apt-get source bla bla
[07:51] <ivoks> so we don't have to download each file individualy
[07:52] <siretart> ivoks: hm. how do you specify which upload candidate to download with apt-get?
[07:52] <ivoks> apt-get -t revu source bla
[07:53] <siretart> ivoks: assuming there are 3 uploads, 2 with the same version number. how to get each of those 3?
[07:53] <ivoks> why each? only last one
[07:53] <siretart> only latest one.. hmhmm..
[07:54] <sistpoty> maybe a hook on upload could do this?
[07:54] <siretart> ivoks: which archive software would you recommend for this?
[07:54] <ivoks> none :)
[07:54] <sistpoty> there must be s.th. out there ;)
[07:54] <ivoks> archive software?
[07:54] <Hieronymus> siretart: well, I did at some (lincity-ng and dangerdeep) :-)
[07:55] <Hieronymus> * have added
[07:55] <sistpoty> ivoks: to create a debian-structured archive
[07:55] <sistpoty> i assume :)
[07:55] <siretart> sistpoty: well, I certainly don't want to reimplement half of dak with a revu hook ;)
[07:55] <siretart> right
[07:56] <sistpoty> hrhr got that one :)
[07:56] <ivoks> sistpoty: i don't know, but there are tools for that, otherwise we wouldn't have archives :)
[07:56] <sistpoty> ivoks: that's what i meant with "there must be s.th. out there" ;)
[07:56] <siretart> Hieronymus: err, sorry. what did you do?
[07:56] <pef> siretart: I tried to upload my package of datakiosk but it seems to be unsuccesful, could you help me ?
[07:56] <Hieronymus> siretart: add things to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUNEWGames
[07:57] <siretart> Hieronymus: aaah, great :)
[07:57] <ivoks> debarchiver - Tool to handle debian package archives
[07:57] <siretart> pef: just a moment
[07:57] <pef> siretart: sure :)
[07:58] <ivoks> i think debarchiver is something that we would use
[07:58] <ivoks> check apt-cache show debarchiver
[07:58] <sistpoty> ivoks: just read about it... i'll give it a try
[07:58] <siretart> ivoks: I know debarchiver, but I think that mini-dinstall would be better suited for our purpose
[07:58] <ivoks> ok
[07:59] <ivoks> siretart: i have no exp. with creating deb archives :( i'm sure you know better then me
[07:59] <siretart> mini-dinstall has integrated checking of signatures of uploads, plus ability to extend with hooks. but I only worked with debarchiver until now
[07:59] <ivoks> ok, mini-dinstall sounds good
[08:00] <sistpoty> yes
[08:00] <siretart> pef: I don't see any upload concerning datakiosk in my upload queue, did dput tell you it got uploaded? have a look at the .upload file
[08:02] <pef> siretart: typo in dput.cf, upload gone to ubuntu host :/
[08:03] <siretart> pef: err, thats not good ;)
[08:03] <ivoks> :))
[08:03] <pef> siretart: it asks me a password ?
[08:03] <ivoks> it will be silently droped :)
[08:05] <siretart> pef: no, revu is using an anonymous ftp, no password necessary
[08:05] <pef> siretart: sorry
[08:06] <siretart> n/p. another uploader already asked me this question already, but I have no idea what he got misconfigured. he finally managed to fix his config
[08:06] <siretart> I don't remember who this was
[08:06] <slomo> that was me ;)
[08:07] <siretart> hehe
[08:07] <siretart> slomo: perhaps you can help pef? ;)
[08:07] <pef> erf :) now I think it's ok, but no .upload file
[08:08] <slomo> hehe ok ;) my problem was the -c parameter of dput... solved it by copying the revu lines to the global dput.cf
[08:08] <siretart> ah, there is a datakiosk in the UploadQueue..
[08:09] <pef> :D
[08:12] <pef> mm a lintian error
[08:14] <pef> "W: datakiosk source: native-package-with-dash-version" is it a consequence of source only upload ?
[08:14] <ogra> nope
[08:15] <ogra> thats a warning that you built a native packages (without orig.tar.gz)
[08:15] <sistpoty> i bet the orig-tarball is spelled wrong (took me some time to find out that it has to be package-version_orig instead of packge-version-orig.tar.gz)
[08:15] <bddebian> No one looks at my whacky lintian errors.. :'-(
[08:15] <pef> bddebian: which package ?
[08:16] <pef> sistpoty: thanks
[08:16] <bddebian> pef: python-pyrtf
[08:16] <sistpoty> pef:  really?
[08:16] <sistpoty> was just a guess G
[08:17] <sivang> bddebian: yo :-) have you already uploaded a HURD package to Universe?
[08:17] <bddebian> pef: It's OK, ogra just lets me stay around as the #ubuntu-motu jester :-)
[08:18] <ogra> hehe
[08:18] <bddebian> sivang: Not yet, I'm trying to get my FTP server going first
[08:18] <bddebian> heh
[08:20] <comadreja> what's the right way to report bugs ? bugzilla or malone ?
[08:20] <ivoks> depends on package
[08:21] <ivoks> main or universe?
[08:21] <comadreja> xserver-xorg
[08:21] <comadreja> main
[08:21] <ivoks> bugzilla
[08:21] <comadreja> cool, ivoks
[08:21] <comadreja> thanks
[08:21] <SloMoSnail> what's the correct way to get an updated package into universe which is currently not updated in debian?
[08:21] <ivoks> ?
[08:22] <ivoks> new upstream version?
[08:22] <SloMoSnail> that and also updated packaging files
[08:23] <ivoks> i'm not sure... ogra ?
[08:23] <ivoks> \sh: hi
[08:24] <bddebian> SloMoSnail: Bug the Debian maintainer to update it! :-)
[08:24] <ogra> SloMoSnail, first step is always to talk to the debian maintainer
[08:24] <bddebian> +1 bddebian
[08:25] <SloMoSnail> i talked to the debian maintainer... the updated package ist by him ;) but he means he was unsuccessful at getting it uploaded into debian and is currently to busy with other work
[08:25] <\sh> ivoks: sorry, i couldn't do anything for 2 days now
[08:27] <ivoks> \sh: that's ok
[08:28] <ivoks> i'm bussy too
[08:28] <ivoks> last exams and stuff...
[08:28] <ivoks> yay! first package with my name in changelog in ubuntu :)
[08:29] <ivoks> etherape
[08:29] <ivoks> :)
[08:29] <pef> ivoks: only one ? ;)
[08:29] <siretart> SloMoSnail: I would "backport" the changes of the net yet uploaded package to a new upload to ubuntu using the normal versioning convention
[08:29] <bddebian> It rapes your ethe??
[08:29] <bddebian> ivoks: Congrats! :-)
[08:29] <ivoks> pef: yeah, guys don't like my nativly packaged wifi-radar :(
[08:29] <ivoks> ;)
[08:30] <\sh> ivoks: grats :)
[08:30] <ivoks> all i did is gksu -> gksudo
[08:30] <\sh> ivoks: can u upload already? ,-)
[08:30] <ivoks> dman :)
[08:30] <ivoks> \sh: well, didn't check for some time...
[08:30] <tseng> siretart: hi
[08:30] <ivoks> i sent e-mail to keyring
[08:30] <ivoks> didn't get any confirmation
[08:31] <pef> sistpoty: sorry to bother you again, but I've made a new upload to correct a stupid error (orig file missing due to bad filename), can you delete again the oldest entry ?
[08:31] <pef> oups
[08:31] <pef> owned by tab completion
[08:31] <siretart> pef: he can, too ;) - but just do another upload
[08:31] <pef> done a minute ago
[08:32] <ivoks> gnome dropping bonobo?
[08:32] <siretart> huh?
[08:32] <siretart> replacing with what?
[08:32] <ivoks> < netdur> sivang, I heard that GNOME poeple moving away bonobo thing
[08:33] <sistpoty> siretart: restart apache :P
[08:33] <SloMo_> siretart: i'll try that... but currently i'm looking whether the package compiles ;)
[08:34] <siretart> sistpoty: I think it's a bit more complicated. I'm on it
[08:34] <sistpoty> omg
[08:35] <ivoks> does every ubuntu derivated distro has to be brown? :)
[08:35] <sistpoty> hrhr
[08:36] <ivoks> doh, no time to devote it to edubuntu :(
[08:37] <ivoks> just one more week on faculty, then i will have more time for ubuntu development
[08:37] <ivoks> :)
[08:38] <siretart> sistpoty: see commit mail, should work now
[08:38] <sistpoty> cool :)
[08:39] <siretart> who is martin schmeisser? do you happen to be in this channel?
[08:39] <ivoks> bye all
[08:40] <bddebian> Later ivoks
[08:40] <pef> ivoks: bye !
[08:40] <sistpoty> bye ivoks
[08:40] <siretart> bye ivoks
[08:40] <pef> when correcting bugs in a package, what's the right way ? filling a bug report, making a corrected package, uploading it to revu, if validated set the bug as fixed, is it right ?
[08:41] <siretart> pef: yes, that would be best, I think
[08:41] <pef> siretart: perfect :)
[08:41] <SloMo_> siretart: "backporting" the packaging changes isn't that simple... in the debian package the upstream tarball contains the parts missing in the older packages...
[08:42] <siretart> pef: I consider revu as a launchpad for getting your uploads into ubuntu..
[08:42] <siretart> SloMo_: is it a new upstream version?
[08:43] <pef> ok
[08:43] <SloMo_> siretart: it's a bit complicated with that package... the "upstream tarball" contains many tar.gz from the upstream homepage which are all needed for compilation... and in this version the former missing ones are included
[08:43] <pef> that's very interesting all this process :)
[08:43] <SloMo_> siretart: and yes, its a new upstream version but that isn't the problem
[08:44] <siretart> SloMo_: I'll say decide at your own discretion and make an upload candidate to ubuntu, documenting your decisions in the changelog.
[08:46] <pef> is there a usual way to use a temporay file in rules file ? like applying a program to a file (iconv for me)
[08:47] <SloMo_> siretart: ok, but what would be the right direction: old upstream version with changed tarball or new upstream version with the tarball of the debian maintainer? maybe just take the new version from the debian maintainer und set version from *-1 to *-0?
[08:48] <siretart> SloMo_: to *-0ubuntu1 sounds sane
[08:49] <SloMo_> ok
[08:49] <Mez> siretart, I've had to make some 0ubuntu1's before (k3b, etc)
[08:50] <SloMo_> siretart: ok, i'll do that later ;) hehe uploading 22 mb to revu will be fun ;)
[08:50] <Mez> SloMo_, not as fun as uplaoding 40 Meg to backports ;)
[08:52] <SloMo_> Mez: uploading 40 mb to backports hasn't worked for me ;) how do you do that?
[08:52] <Mez> slomo, waited for about an hour :D
[08:52] <Mez> hehe :D was a pain updating acroread ;)
[08:52] <SloMo_> Mez: hm, i always got a timeout ;) had to send the packages to jdong to upload
[08:53] <Mez> never had a timeout ...
[08:53] <Mez> he musta changed it or something
[08:53] <Mez> *Shrugs*
[08:59] <ogra> \sh, did youget a bigger one ?
[08:59] <ogra> (disk indeed)
[08:59] <Mez> lol
[08:59] <\sh> ogra: no...the same size
[09:00] <\sh> ogra: oh you mean the disk ;)
[09:00] <ogra> hehe
[09:01] <\sh> no..disk was only exchanged...same size :)
[09:01] <ogra> hm..
[09:01] <\sh> but it was difficult to install the disk...first I plugged it in, and it wasn't recognized at all...then I had to use force..after this enforcement of the disk, everything worked fine
[09:04] <DanielN> hiho
[09:04] <pef> hu
[09:04] <pef> hi
[09:04] <DanielN> \sh, around?
[09:06] <Mez> Daniel Neunshwader (or whatever it is)
[09:06] <Mez> ?
[09:06] <DanielN> Mez, Neuenschwander, and yes, i am :)
[09:07] <Mez> ah
[09:07] <Mez> :D
[09:07] <DanielN> ^^
[09:17] <\sh> DanielN: how can Ihelp u?
[09:18] <Mez> ogra, I'm noticing a few packages that are dependent on libs that have been fixed
[09:18] <Mez> libblac2 etc
[09:19] <Mez> what is done about those (increase version number and reupload or what?)
[09:19] <Mez> I assumed that was the case until siretart told me to ask
[09:21] <\sh> hmm...why is my secret key not recognized
[09:21] <Mez> what is your secret key ?
[09:21] <Mez> :P
[09:21] <bddebian> HEHE
[09:22] <\sh> strange
[09:35] <\sh> ah...found it...:) environment vars are missing *lol*
[09:44] <pef> in changelog there are only references to unstable, not breezy, should I put my new changelog entry as breezy or unstable ?
[09:44] <tseng> if you mean to upload something to breezy
[09:44] <tseng> it needs to be breezy
[09:46] <\sh> pef: man dch ;)
[09:47] <pef> last question : currently I  correct some wrong encodings in manpages (iso8859-1 instead of utf8), is I see others charsets, should I convert them to utf-8 too ?
[09:47] <pef> s/is/if/
[09:51] <sladen> pef: yup, everything to UTF-8  recode can do this for you;  if you want to keep the patch size down against Debian you could do it during the package process
[09:53] <pef> sladen: yes, this is what people say to me in this channel, I will add a command to rules file
[09:54] <pef> sladen: iconv is better because installed by default no ?
[09:54] <sladen> pef: I guess so :)
[09:55] <sladen> UTF-8 is goodness, anything else is less good :)
[09:55] <pef> ok, it's all I have to know :)
[10:49] <pef> bye !


[00:05] <pjotter> Hi people. Since latest updates, I found that the vertical scrolling in both mousepad and gedit is lagging. Anyone kwno what can cause this behaviour?
[00:06] <pjotter> Xubuntu 14.04.3 with xfce 4.12
[00:06] <pjotter> amd64
[00:24] <knome> pjotter, hey! the support channel is still #xubuntu ;)
[00:27] <pjotter> o
[00:27] <pjotter> :D
[07:18] <flocculant> ochosi: just a fyi - seems numix breaks gtk3 apps again
[07:19] <flocculant> mcs_: thanks for pointing that out
[08:18] <flocculant> mind you it might never have not not broken - I don't use numix ...
[11:54] <bluesabre> yeah, numix is pretty broken right now
[11:55] <bluesabre> ochosi: any idea if satya will be finishing the updated numix any time soon?
[11:55] <bluesabre> seems like the sass port was going going... quiet
[13:07] <flocculant> bluesabre: if it stays pretty broken - are we going to ditch it?
[13:07] <Unit193> Dang.
[13:12] <knome> .gnaD
[13:17] <bluesabre> flocculant: if it doesn't work, and there's no patches, it's probably not going to make it to release
[13:18] <bluesabre> gotta run, bbl
[13:18] <flocculant> cya - have a day :)
[13:19] <bluesabre> I shall have a day!
[13:20] <flocculant> :)
[13:21] <Zeioth> hi, I'm experiencing a boot problem in Xubuntu 15.10: I can see the login screen but my mouse and keyboard are not responding, and after about 10 seconds, the mouse cursor stops blinking. there's any precedent of this error? if not, please, tell me how can I report it.
[13:22] <Zeioth> it's after a fresh install
[13:24] <flocculant> Zeioth: #xubuntu for support, if you want to report it - pretty sure ubuntu-bug lightdm
[13:25] <flocculant> you could also try #ubuntu as this is not just a xubuntu package
[13:25] <flocculant> bbl
[13:25] <Zeioth> I see, i'll do it thanks ^_^
[14:55] <mcs_> flocculant: No worries. been out for most of the day though
[17:58] <flocculant> dkessel: re doodle, just so you know, if there's a tie on time and people I've never heard of outweigh people I have - I'll pick the one with new people :)
[18:00] <dkessel> flocculant: sure, no problem.
[18:01] <flocculant> but thanks :)
[23:10] <pleia2> flocculant: g+ and fb the packages testing scheduling email (knome got twitter yesterday)
[23:12] <pleia2> also social mediaed the flash drives fro hellotux
[23:13] <flocculant> \o/
[23:14] <flocculant> lots of stuff to talk up is good :)
[23:14] <flocculant> thanks pleia2 ;)
[23:14] <pleia2> sure
[23:15] <flocculant> don't get to see you much lately - so have a good 4 days assuming you do :)
[23:15] <pleia2> thanks, you too :)
[23:16] <flocculant> I'll try my best :)
[23:24] <flocculant> pleia2: re the vps and building the docs with the contributor stuff ... and you'll like this now - should that all be up before I run this next irc session?
[23:24] <flocculant> that's weeks :D
[23:25] <pleia2> flocculant: my plan is to spin it up over new years
[23:26] <flocculant> okey dokey
[23:26] <pleia2> the contributor docs are up, I think knome asked me to do something else but I've been dying of a stomach bug for a couple days
[23:26] <flocculant> :(
[23:27] <flocculant> I guess I just need to watch, if it goes wonky there's other ways for people to grab them :)
[23:28] <pleia2> goes wonky?
[23:28] <pleia2> oh dear, docs.xubuntu.org is down
[23:28] <flocculant> explodes all over the known universe and we suddenly have 5 quintillion testers mailing akxwi
[23:28] <flocculant> cos I will have run ...
[23:29] <flocculant> just goes wrong somehow :)
[23:29] <JackFrost> I didn't kill it.  Mine is still up! :3
[23:30] <flocculant> pleia2: thing is I have no idea how the docs get built and land on the site - all I do know is pdf fails locally in xenial :)
[23:30] <flocculant> JackFrost: then I can point the 5 quintillion new people there then :D
[23:31]  * flocculant awaits a chilly response ...
[23:31] <JackFrost> Hah, well it is Xenial, sooo.  I don't care as long as others don't care. :P
[23:31] <flocculant> :)
[23:31] <pleia2> flocculant: oh, it's all manual, if it's broken I don't upload
[23:32] <flocculant> JackFrost: I suppose the main thing is I said it was broken a week after xenial arrived :D
[23:32] <flocculant> pleia2: aah cool - and I suspect you might not be running xenial :D
[23:32] <flocculant> not for prod stuff anyway ;)
[23:34] <pleia2> submitted a ticket for docs/static.x.o
[23:36] <pleia2> I think they're all off on holidays already, but I stressed that we need docs up for google code-in and Cc:ed dpm
[23:36] <pleia2> so hopefully someone is on call and can do whatever is needed
[23:37] <pleia2> I think I need to go back to bed
[23:37] <flocculant> pleia2: k - private I assume, don't see it on the front page
[23:37] <flocculant> sleep well then
[23:37] <pleia2> flocculant: I just email to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[23:38] <pleia2> #27931
[23:38] <pleia2> maybe it's private by default?
[23:38] <flocculant> oh nvm - don't appear there straight away anyway
[23:38] <flocculant> don't think so - if it's new ...
[23:38] <flocculant>  No permission to view ticket
[23:38] <flocculant> must be private :)
[23:39] <flocculant> anyway - no worries - back to bed for pleia2 :)
[23:42] <pleia2> :)


[14:20] <raubvogel> Got my keg beer pull thingie. I am prepared for tomorrow ;)
[15:24] <itnet7> raubvogel: lol
[16:00] <raubvogel> itnet7: you got to worry about what really matters, right?


[02:36] <Acid190> Anyone interested in being the artist for a new distro?
[20:11] <coz_> hey all
[20:13] <thorwil> hi coz_
[20:13] <coz_> thorwil,  hey guy
[20:40] <doctormo> hey coz_
[20:40] <coz_> doctormo,  hey guy
[20:40] <doctormo> coz_: My name is Martin, but you may call me 'My Lordship'
[20:41] <coz_> doctormo,  ah  ok    that's cool... and very modest of you :)
[20:41] <doctormo> coz_: I try to be as humble as I can for the little people.
[20:42] <coz_> doctormo,  ah yes... I completely understand... I want to be emperor of the US  but no one understands
[20:42] <coz_> :)
[20:42] <coz_> so guys... have all of the wallpapers for Ubuntu been chosen already?
[20:43] <doctormo> coz_: I don't think so.
[20:43] <coz_> doctormo,  ah ok
[20:50] <darkmatter> bah. slingshot wont build on maverick
[20:51]  * darkmatter pats coz_ good afternoon
[20:51] <darkmatter> <--- just woke up. lol
[21:02] <coz_> darkmatter,  hey guy...sorry for delay...was busy in inkscape
[21:02] <darkmatter> np. I was busy yawning
[21:06] <darkmatter> coz_: I'm going to "attempt" to do some coding in a bit. late riser today, so that results in an inherent lazy.... errr... I mean sluggishness ;p
[21:10] <coz_> :)
[21:21] <coz_> can anyone see this page?   http://www.brandonberinger.com/
[21:29] <darkmatter> lol. I'll need to update php to see it ;D
[21:29] <coz_> darkmatter,  yeah that's what is says here  but installed php5
[21:30] <coz_> I wanted to see more of this guys work
[21:30] <darkmatter> coz_: and thus the winky grin thingy :P
[21:30] <coz_> :)
[21:30] <coz_> I am trying to relaxe..we had a fire in the house today...  someone threw a lit cigarette into a paper waiste basket
[21:31] <darkmatter> o;o
[21:31] <coz_> whole house filled with smoke... 5 police cars... two fire engines
[21:31] <darkmatter> yikes
[21:31] <coz_>  and all of the super  nice  super cool
[21:31] <coz_> all lf them rather
[21:31] <coz_> of course I had a calm head during the whole thing...now find myself a bit   worked up  now that I am alone
[21:32] <coz_> darkmatter,  the house has 11 foot ceilings and I am over 6 ft tall and couldnt breathe  the smoke was thick from the ceiling down to my waiste
[21:33] <coz_> but in the room where the fire started  ,, the old dell computer survived ...go figure :)
[21:34] <coz_> keyboard melted though :)
[21:34] <darkmatter> coz_: do a sudo update-alternatives --configure php   and see what it's set to. if you have more than one version it may be using the older one. it'll list the options (if any) with a * by the default
[21:34] <darkmatter> coz_: yikes
[21:34] <coz_> darkmatter,  ok let me try
[21:34] <darkmatter> and slow response to the php thingy. because I saw "house caught on fire" :P
[21:34] <coz_> :)
[21:35] <coz_> darkmatter,  mm "unkown optio9ns  " --configure"
[21:37] <coz_> darkmatter,  although   sudo update-alternatives --list php  gives   /usr/bin/php5
[21:37] <darkmatter> coz_: oops. pre coffee typo
[21:37] <darkmatter> config
[21:37] <coz_> :)
[21:37] <darkmatter> is the spelling
[21:38] <coz_> here is only one alternative in link group php: /usr/bin/php5
[21:38] <coz_> darkmatter,  must be on his end
[21:39] <darkmatter> coz_: yeah. if yoy had more han one version it would list them and let you change the one to use. so his site is silly ;)
[21:39] <coz_> right :)
[21:43] <coz_> ok I need to eat something... be back in a bit
[21:43] <darkmatter> coz_: I'm revisiting some of my older design and interaction stuff. although not much has changed in the overall concept, I found something I removed I'm considering adding back
[21:44] <coz_> cool


[08:08] <knome> pleia2, the arrows aren't styled yet. we can either hide them completely, or, style them
[20:20] <knome> cody-somerville, ping


[00:03] <h3sp4wn> infinitycircuit: The hpet ones are not that important to me (got a working bios for that eventually after much proding of gigabyte)
[00:04] <infinitycircuit> h3sp4wn, yeah it all depends on your hardware.  the hpet patches give me huge power savings on my thinkpad x40
[00:05] <h3sp4wn> infinitycircuit: interesting I did notice on my thinkpad X31 that the fan works properly with 2.6.24
[00:06] <h3sp4wn> i.e not just on all the time when it doesn't need to be
[00:21] <DanaG> wtf?  Choosing a theme doesn't change my metacity theme.
[00:22] <DanaG> I select any theme, and it immediately jumps to "custom" because it's not using the right Metacity theme.
[00:43] <brianski> !roadmap
[00:43] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about roadmap - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
[00:43] <brianski> hrm
[00:43] <WorkingOnWise> !kernel
[00:43] <ubotu> The core of the Ubuntu Operating System is the Linux kernel: see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Kernel - You shouldn't have to compile your own, but if you're convinced you do, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Kernel/Compile - For more: /msg ubotu stages
[00:45] <brianski> !hardy
[00:45] <ubotu> Hardy Heron is the code name for the next release of Ubuntu (8.04-LTS), due April 2008 - For more info, see: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardyHeron - Discussion and support in #ubuntu+1, NOT #ubuntu
[00:48] <h3sp4wn> !msg the bot
[00:48] <ubotu> Please investigate with me only in /msg or in #ubuntu-bots (type also /msg ubotu Bot). Don't use commands in the public channels if you don't know if they really exist. Also avoid adding joke/useless factoids.
[00:49] <brianski> yeah, clearly my 2 queries really messed up the roaring flow of conversation in this channel
[00:50] <WorkingOnWise> So I see that Hardy is using 2.6.22 for a kernel. Is that right? The same kernel as Gutsy?
[00:50] <crimsun> WorkingOnWise: that is correct currently.  It will release with a 2.6.24-based one.
[00:51] <WorkingOnWise> crimsun: ok. I was mildly concerned that my upgrade didn't go as smooth as I thought.
[00:51] <DanaG> I also can't seem to drag from File-roller to Nautilus.
[00:53] <crimsun> WorkingOnWise: it was decided at UDS-Boston that a reasonable attempt to ship 8.04 with a 2.6.24-based one would be made.  Obviously, since 2.6.24 has not been released yet, 8.04 continues to use 7.10's 2.6.22-based one.
[00:56] <DanaG> Oh yeah, that reminds me:
[00:56] <DanaG> A friend asked me about something to do with "No high-resolution timers available" in some audio app.
[00:56] <WorkingOnWise> crimsun: ty.
[00:56] <DanaG> It turns out, Dell apparently either is missing, or deliberately broke, HPET in their BIOS.
[00:56] <DanaG> Is there any way to work around that?
[00:57] <h3sp4wn> perhaps just use 2.6.24
[00:57] <WorkingOnWise> DanaG: lt is probably Audacity. I know nothing else about it, bit I have seen the same error.
[00:58] <h3sp4wn> or use the patches - http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/people/tglx/hrtimers/ (I think they have the hpet series enabled that went into 2.6.24)
[00:58] <h3sp4wn> Infact I don't think I know they do
[00:59] <DanaG> Oops, you lost some punctuation, and that made that sentence a bit ambiguous.
[01:00] <crimsun> insert the comma proceeding the 'k'
[01:00] <crimsun> or the semicolon if you wish to be pedantic
[01:01] <DanaG> aah.
[01:01] <infinitycircuit> DanaG, make sure you boot with hpet=force if dmesg| grep hpet fails to show anything
[01:02] <DanaG> Well, it's not my PC, so I'll have to remember it for next time I see that person.
[01:03] <crimsun> cfs 24 for 24-rc3 seems pretty nice
[01:04] <DanaG> It's funny -- I tried 'osx86' on my laptop, and while it worked reasonably well, I concluded I have no real reason to actually use it.  Ubuntu works more than well enough for me -- and it's more customizable.
[01:05] <DanaG> I realized that for some reason, I find it FUN fixing things when they break.
[01:05] <DanaG> Or abusing things to see if they WILL break -- for example, setting window transitions to slow 'dodge' and clicking back and forth between windows makes compiz-fusion hard-lock.
[01:06] <h3sp4wn> infinitycircuit: are you using the latest thinkpad-acpi ?
[01:07] <h3sp4wn> I am not sure whether to bother sourcing a usb floppy drive to update the bios on mine (apparantly I don't need to if I use that something to do with NVRAM)
[01:44] <PirateHead> The home of X breakage? Maybe I don't want to try out the alpha after all. :-\
[02:04] <gsker> Here goes nothing!  :-)
[02:04] <h3sp4wn> gsker: Thats probably how you will feel later
[02:06]  * gsker ponders that
[02:09] <gsker> I wonder how long this will take......
[02:10] <Hobbsee> a while.
[02:10] <gsker> give or take?   :-)
[02:10] <gsker> Done getting.... unpacking .... installing....
[02:14] <h3sp4wn> gsker: Obviously it depends on the connection it didn't take long at all for me
[02:14] <h3sp4wn> perhaps if there is tons of people upgrading right now it will take longer
[02:14] <gsker> well since I got it all, it doesn't depend on the connection any more....
[02:15] <h3sp4wn> I don't remember it taking a noticable amount of time
[02:15] <gsker> :-) Noticeable?  you like, blinked and it was done!???
[02:15] <DanaG> I usually have two mirrors.
[02:16] <DanaG> A fast, local, but often out-of-date mirror, and the official US mirror.
[02:16] <DanaG> Put the faster one above the other in sources.list, and it'll be preferred for any packages not out of date.
[02:16] <h3sp4wn> gsker: perhaps I was not paying attention (probably so)
[02:16] <DanaG> I use mirrors.kernel.org.
[02:17] <gsker> I just followed the 3 lines of instruction from linuxjournal.
[02:18] <gsker> sudo sed -i "s/gutsy/hardy/g" /etc/apt/sources.list;sudo aptitude update;sudo aptitude dist-upgrade
[02:18] <h3sp4wn> I used perl -pi but other than that the same
[03:02] <dick-richardson> is kde 4.0 planned to be released with hardy?
[03:05] <hashbrowncipher> dick-richardson: it appears so, see https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/kubuntu-hardy-kde4
[03:29] <hydrogen> not as the default desktop
[03:29] <hydrogen> however
[04:03] <gsker> Well, I had to blink a coupla times, but it's there!
[04:11] <infinitycircuit> is anyone else having trouble with brightness control in hardy?
[04:12] <infinitycircuit> my laptop screen reverts to maximum brightness every minute even if i bring it down with the keyboard keys
[04:20]  * Hobbsee supsects that's laptop specific
[04:23] <RAOF> infinitycircuit: I think that may be a g-p-m bug - maybe if you have "dim when idle" set, then the brightness level that gets triggered by the dim is the default brightness - some number, rather than current brightness - some number.
[06:03] <choudesh> is the new kernel in the repos yet?
[06:03] <choudesh> for hardy that is
[06:03] <Hobbsee> no
[06:03] <choudesh> ahh, ok.
[06:04] <pwnguin> where's the best avenue to hunt down developers who can fix SD readers?
[06:06] <Hobbsee> depends how they're broken, i expect, but driver developers, i guess...
[06:12] <pwnguin> it worked with like .17, but hasnt since
[06:59] <choudesh> if there way to blacklist a package from a certain repository? say if I wanted to download update-manager from a different repo then ubuntu's and not use priorityies - is there a way to do it?
[06:59] <choudesh> say to use packages from gutsy instead of hardy
[07:03] <chowmeined> choudesh, preferences
[07:03] <chowmeined> chowmeined, man apt_preferences
[07:41] <DanaG> Odd: trying to add wallpapers to the list doesn't work.
[08:06] <chronographer> what repositories do I use and is Hardy going to break for me?
[08:06] <chronographer> I'm going to update without checking what is to be updated
[09:09] <choudesh> anyone having issues with hardy + azureus?
[09:10] <RAOF> jdong will be most upset :)
[09:11] <RAOF> choudesh: What sort of issues?
[09:11]  * RAOF doesn't, of course, because he uses either deluge or transmission.
[09:11] <choudesh> #19 /usr/lib/jvm/java-6-sun-<IP_ADDRESS>/jre/lib/i386/client/libjvm.so [0x620bc6d]
[09:11] <choudesh> java: xcb_xlib.c:82: xcb_xlib_unlock: Assertion `c->xlib.lock' failed.
[09:11] <RAOF> Babaw!
[09:11] <RAOF> Use icedtea-java7
[09:11] <RAOF> All the other sun java vms are broken.
[09:12] <RAOF> (And have been forever, it's just that Xorg didn't care so much before)
[09:12] <choudesh> what is the package name?
[09:12] <RAOF> icedtea-java7, I think :)
[09:12] <RAOF> !find icedtea hardy
[09:12] <ubotu> Found: icedtea-java7-bin, icedtea-java7-demo, icedtea-java7-doc, icedtea-java7-jdk, icedtea-java7-jre (and 2 others)
[09:12] <choudesh> icedtea-java7-sdk and jre
[09:12] <choudesh> I apt-cached it. ;-)
[09:13] <choudesh> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
[09:13] <choudesh>   icedtea-java7-jre: Depends: icedtea-java7-bin (>= 7~b21) but it is not going to be installed
[09:13] <choudesh> I love being an early adopter. ;-)
[09:13] <RAOF> Technically, the problem is that all the sun JRE's have some Xlib stuff, built without threading support, statically linked in.  Since absolutely everyone has Xlib built with threading enabled, this is a problem :)
[09:14] <choudesh> ahhhh. I see.
[09:14] <RAOF> choudesh: Hm.  Aptitude *may* be able to find some way to install it.
[09:14] <choudesh> damn libgif4 has a done of depends.
[09:14] <RAOF> Yup, indeed.
[09:15] <choudesh> I just have a script that looks at depends and starts at the beginning.
[09:15] <RAOF> Oh, if you really can't install icedtea, I think you can work around this with an evil, evil hack.
[09:15] <RAOF> Basically by sedding out the XINERAMA string from the java VM binary.
[09:15] <choudesh> Need to get 36.9kB of archives.
[09:15] <choudesh> After unpacking 154MB disk space will be freed.
[09:15] <choudesh> that is odd
[09:15] <RAOF> WHat's it removing?
[09:16] <choudesh>   kde4base kde4libs-bin kdelibs5 kdepimlibs5 libgdiplus
[09:16] <choudesh>   libmono-winforms2.0-cil libungif4g monodevelop
[09:17] <RAOF> Heh.  kde4base is big :)
[09:17] <choudesh> yea... I missed that one when I looked. I was like, holy ****
[09:17] <RAOF> This may be a good time to check out various other bittorrent clients, though :)
[09:18] <RAOF> Either deluge-torrent or (maybe) transmission would be worth a look.
[09:18] <choudesh> heh. I have deluged installed - but I love azureus...it is heavy but I just love some of the plugins
[09:18] <choudesh> does icedtea-java7-jre update java-alternatives?
[09:18] <RAOF> Probably not.
[09:19] <RAOF> I'm not sure.  It'd be a good plan to check :)
[09:19] <choudesh> root@duo:/home/choudesh/.azureus# java -version
[09:19] <choudesh> java version "1.7.0"
[09:19] <choudesh> IcedTea Runtime Environment (build 1.7.0-b23)
[09:19] <choudesh> IcedTea Client VM (build 1.7.0-b23, mixed mode, sharing)
[09:19] <choudesh> it does. ;-)
[09:19] <RAOF> Score.
[09:19] <RAOF> Now, does azureus run under icedtea? :)
[09:19] <choudesh> yeppers
[09:19] <choudesh> thanks for your help
[09:19] <RAOF> NP.
[09:20] <RAOF> (Let this be a lesson: static linkind FTL!)
[09:20] <choudesh> heh
[09:20] <RAOF> s/d/g/
[15:00] <Richie> Hi, for some reason my sound will stop working after a couple of hours. I go System > Preferences > Sound and when i hit Test i get this: audiotestsrc wave=sine freq=512 ! audioconvert ! audioresample ! gconfaudiosink profile=chat: Internal data flow error.
[15:01] <Richie> Any ideas on how to fix?
[15:23] <bardyr> !info linux-image-generic hardy
[15:23] <ubotu> linux-image-generic: Generic Linux kernel image. In component main, is optional. Version <IP_ADDRESS>.21 (hardy), package size 24 kB, installed size 52 kB
[15:23] <bardyr> :(
[15:24] <bardyr> 2.6.24-rc has been accepted and even after the alpha1 release isnt out :(
[17:03] <hetauma> when I try to use vncviewer I can't type in password. I know that this is due to compiz but is there any workaround that ?
[17:03] <h3sp4wn> hetauma: disable compiz
[17:04] <hetauma> h3sp4wn, apart from that?
[17:15] <stdin> hetauma: I don't use compiz but I've heard shift+click may work
[17:19] <hetauma> stdin, worked fine thanx alot :D
[17:20] <stdin> heh, reading blogs can actually be useful sometimes :p
[19:17] <yogi> what do I need to do get intel wireless (thinkpad t60) run with the hardy kernel?
[19:17] <yogi> I'm using gutsy as base, but I would like to use 2.6.24 for the power savings (on AMD64)
[19:21] <void^> 2.6.24 isn't released, yet
[19:21] <yogi> void^: IK;  I am using linux for 12 years...
[19:22] <yogi> I'm just not clear on the whole /lib/firmware thing
[19:22] <yogi> and what ucode goes with what version
[19:22] <yogi> especially since the intel wireless code changed from .22 to .24
[19:22] <crdlb> gutsy + hardy kernel isn't supported at all (not even here)
[19:23] <[ifr0g]> I heard CNR will come with hardy, is the rumor true ?
[19:23] <yogi> crdlb: define 'supported'
[19:24] <h3sp4wn> crdlb: There is not a massive difference between the 2 at the moment that I can see - gutsy with a custom kernel should be supported
[19:24] <crdlb> I'm not saying it won't work
[19:24] <yogi> crdlb: does that mean 'does not run at all' or does it mean 'you cannot pay anybody to fix it for you'
[19:24] <yogi> crdlb: I'm not interested in the second answer...
[19:24] <crdlb> I'm saying that this channel is for people actually running hardy :)
[19:25] <yogi> are you running hardy on a laptop ATM?
[19:25] <crdlb> nope
[19:25] <h3sp4wn> Theoretically - I am running hardy on a thinkpad X31
[19:26] <yogi> I have built the kernel from the sources in http://ftp.ubuntulinux.org/ubuntu/pool/main/l/linux/
[19:26] <yogi> since I could not find linux-image and linux-modules packages in the pool
[19:26] <yogi> the kernel package installed fine, everything works, except the wireless
[19:27] <yogi> I have copied ipw3945.ucode  iwlwifi-3945-1.ucode from 2.6.22-14-generic to 2.6.24-1-generic/
[19:27] <yogi> and I'm getting a 'wlan0_rename' interface
[19:28] <yogi> does NetworkManager need a bump?
[19:28] <h3sp4wn> I doubt it
[19:29] <h3sp4wn> Just use http://www.intellinuxwireless.org/iwlwifi/downloads/iwlwifi-1.2.22.tgz
[19:32] <yogi> h3sp4wn: isn't that (or something really close to it) already part of the linux kernel?
[19:33] <h3sp4wn> Maybe - with wireless I usually just use whatevers the newest stable release
[19:34] <h3sp4wn> I haven't messed with mac80211 for a client though - I think its still compatible with wext
[19:34] <h3sp4wn> But I know for hostapd you need the devicescape driver
[20:24] <h3sp4wn> Does ubuntu mobile support the eepc ?
[20:58] <pwnguin> h3sp4wn: i think it targets a different set of devices. you can probably wedge normal ubuntu on it though
[21:00] <h3sp4wn> pwnguin: I want to play with it but I dunno what devices I can get (for not a silly amount of money a $1000 dev board is too much)
[21:01] <h3sp4wn> They are both x86 the one it does support and the eepc
[21:02] <pwnguin> what i mean is that they're after a smaller touchscreen type device
[21:03] <pwnguin> you should be able to use a chroot and xephyr to get an idea
[21:12] <underwatercow> I upgraded to hardy, and now my sound isn't working... is it likely this is related?
[21:13] <crimsun> related to what?
[21:13] <crimsun> your dist-upgrade?  Unlikely.
[21:13] <crimsun> We're still using the same kernel.
[21:14] <crimsun> note: I'm not referring to "some random mixer element is muted" but to "sound driver is broken completely"
[21:14] <crimsun> I'm not concerned about the former; the latter is significant.
[21:14] <underwatercow> I got a new card recently, but it was working... so it's possible it's still just related to my still not having it working right
[21:15] <underwatercow> the gnome mixer shows the right card and that sound is working and everything, but the alsamixer is showing my onboard card... could this be why?
[21:16] <crimsun> underwatercow: no, that's irrelevant.
[21:17] <underwatercow> I still think that the dist-upgrade had something to do with it somehow...
[21:17] <underwatercow> though I know it shouldn't have
[21:17] <crimsun> underwatercow: download http://trilug.org/~crimsun/alsa-info.sh, run it using bash, and tell me the url.
[21:19] <underwatercow> crimsun: does it need su?
[21:19] <crimsun> no.
[21:21] <underwatercow> crimsun: still running... :-p
[21:21] <crimsun> wait a tic; it may take a bit.
[21:22] <underwatercow> crimsun: who wrote this script?
[21:22] <crimsun> underwatercow: members of #alsa
[21:22] <underwatercow> crimsun: ah, nifty
[21:25] <underwatercow> crimsun: um.... it says Your ALSA information is located at
[21:25] <underwatercow> Please inform the person helping you.
[21:26] <crimsun> underwatercow: ok, then your connection to pastebin.ca is fubar
[21:26] <crimsun> underwatercow: instead, pass the --debug option
[21:26] <crimsun> underwatercow: it will place an alsa dump text file in /tmp/
[21:27] <underwatercow> crimsun: want me to paste it manually to pastebin?
[21:27] <crimsun> underwatercow: yes
[21:27] <underwatercow> crimsun: now it has to run again.... *sigh* :-p
[21:27] <crimsun> there's a no-upload option, too.
[21:28] <underwatercow> crimsun: that's a good call
[21:33] <underwatercow> crimsun: which pastebin would you like me to use? or does it matter?
[21:34] <crimsun> doesn't really matter.
[21:35] <underwatercow> crimsun: http://pastebin.com/d4f41fdb9
[21:35] <crimsun> (ok, sec, on the phone.)
[21:35] <underwatercow> crimsun: sure
[21:36] <underwatercow> crimsun: fyi, the Intel is my onboard that I don't want to use
[21:39] <crimsun> hmm.
[21:39] <crimsun> you seem to have compiled 1.0.15 manually.
[21:40] <underwatercow> crimsun: I was trying to, lol... don't know if I did it right
[21:40] <crimsun> (we ship -driver with 1.0.14 by default and 1.0.15rc3 in linux-backports-modules)
[21:40] <crimsun> (we also don't ship libasound2-dev by default, which would be required for the script to pick up the lib version)
[21:40] <underwatercow> crimsun: I'm not partial to 1.0.15 for any reason... I just want my sound working
[21:41] <crimsun> well, it's good to be running 1.0.15 -driver and -lib, but note that you've messed with the Ubuntu infrastructure
[21:41] <crimsun> I recommend at some point you do a clean install of a Hardy Alpha
[21:41] <crimsun> anyhow, let me look more closely
[21:41] <underwatercow> crimsun: will hardy include 1.015 at some point?
[21:42] <crimsun> underwatercow: I've already uploaded 1.0.15
[21:42] <underwatercow> lol
[21:42] <crimsun> the version that ships in the kernel, however, is still 1.0.14.  It uses Gutsy's kernel.
[21:43] <underwatercow> gotcha...
[21:43] <crimsun> well, this problem is fairly straightforward.
[21:43] <crimsun> Your asoundrc references your onboard HDA, which is index 0.
[21:43] <crimsun> your ice17xx-based card is not index 0 but index 1
[21:43] <underwatercow> oh.... the asoundrc was one I got online... do I need it even?
[21:44] <crimsun> you may need it for non-GSt-aware apps.
[21:44] <underwatercow> the reason I got it was I was trying to make my surround sound work, which I may have without it
[21:44] <crimsun> I'd mv ~/.asoundrc ~/.asoundrc.bak
[21:44] <underwatercow> it*
[21:44] <crimsun> then `asoundconf set-default-card Revolution51`
[21:44] <crimsun> then log out and back in
[21:45] <underwatercow> crimsun: thanks, I'll brb
[21:52] <underwatercow> crimsun: Ok... I have sound now, though I had to do a full restart. It didn't seem to want to fully load gnome from a logout
[21:52] <underwatercow> crimsun: I don't have surround now though
[21:53] <underwatercow> crimsun: I also got a popup that says "Refresh Advanced Linux Sound Architecture (ALSA) configuration presets"
[21:53] <crimsun> yes, that's correct.
[21:53] <crimsun> can you use -Dplug:surroundXX ?
[21:53] <underwatercow> crimsun: I don't know?
[21:54] <crimsun> asoundconf list
[21:54] <underwatercow> crimsun: it says Revolution51 and Intel?
[21:54] <crimsun> I need the specific order
[21:54] <underwatercow> that order
[21:55] <crimsun> ok, so test plug:surround51:0
[21:55] <crimsun> use a multichannel file as appropriate
[21:55] <crimsun> or use speaker-test(1)
[21:55] <crimsun> speaker-test -c6 -Dplug:surround51:0
[21:56] <underwatercow> the first did nothing, the last...
[21:56] <underwatercow> Unable to set sw params for playback: Invalid argument
[21:56] <underwatercow> Setting of swparams failed: Invalid argument
[21:57] <crimsun> remove the :0
[21:58] <underwatercow> same
[21:58] <crimsun> probably hitching on S32_LE, then
[21:58] <underwatercow> what is that?
[21:58] <crimsun> it's the format that your driver requires
[22:00] <underwatercow> crimsun: should I use the .asoundrc with the correct sound device? or should I be able to get it working without?
[22:00] <crimsun> sure, you can erase ~/.asoundrc and ~/.asoundrc.asoundconf
[22:00] <crimsun> and mv ~/.asoundrc.bak ~/.asoundrc
[22:02] <underwatercow> crimsun: so do I still need to change to hardware 1? or did making it default do that?
[22:03] <underwatercow> make it 0 that is
[22:03] <crimsun> you can leave it 0, since the ice17xx-based one is currently index 0
[22:03] <underwatercow> aight... is it enough to restart alsa-utils? or should I log out?
[22:04] <crimsun> I would also use the slots parameter for snd to force the driver to always load as index 0
[22:04] <underwatercow> what do you mean?
[22:05] <crimsun> echo options snd slots=snd-ice1724,snd-hda-intel |sudo tee -a /etc/modprobe.d/alsa-base
[22:07] <underwatercow> ok, done
[22:07] <crimsun> yeah, you'll likely need to log out and back in for the asoundrc change
[22:07] <crimsun> (to be safe, at least)
[22:07] <crimsun> without knowing what you have running, that's the safest guess
[22:08] <underwatercow> crimsun: very little at the moment, but I'll log out
[22:08] <underwatercow> brb again
[22:16] <underwatercow> crimsun: ok, has surround now :-p
[22:16] <underwatercow> crimsun: is it just duplicating the front to the back?
[22:17] <crimsun> underwatercow: well, yes, that's what your asoundrc specifies.
[22:17] <underwatercow> crimsun: is that the only way I can do it? or can I have genuine surround sound? lol
[22:19] <crimsun> genuine?
[22:19] <underwatercow> crimsun: different channels I guess for the rear speakers?
[22:19] <underwatercow> crimsun: so you can have different sound in the front than in the back
[22:19] <crimsun> if the app sets the appropriate parameters via alsa-lib, of course you can have "genuine" surround
[22:19] <crimsun> e.g., xine-lib, GSt, etc.
[22:19] <crimsun> mplayer, too
[22:20] <underwatercow> crimsun: even with the back duplicating the front?
[22:20] <crimsun> I don't think you understand your asoundrc dupe stanza
[22:20] <underwatercow> crimsun: apparently not, lol
[22:20] <crimsun> that's an upmix that's used for "plain" 2-channel files
[22:20] <underwatercow> crimsun: oh...
[22:21] <underwatercow> so without the file
[22:21] <underwatercow> it would be stereo unless the app was set up for 5.1?
[22:21] <crimsun> xine-lib, GSt, mplayer are all intelligent enough to set the appropriate parameters via alsa-lib for "genuine" 6-channel or 8-channel files
[22:21] <crimsun> essentially, yes
[22:22] <underwatercow> crimsun: so are things like web browsers, playing in two channel then?
[22:22] <crimsun> err, well, it depends what format the files are
[22:22] <crimsun> there's nothing preventing a Web browser from sending a genuine 8-channel file to alsa-lib
[22:23] <crimsun> it would be foolhardy, but well, it's certainly possible
[22:23] <underwatercow> crimsun: gotcha, so it's possible, but not likely
[22:23] <crimsun> correct.
[22:23] <underwatercow> crimsun: why doesn't it dupe by default?
[22:23] <crimsun> because it can't, as you've discovered.
[22:23] <crimsun> there are far too many variations on codecs, many of them broken by the manufacturers.
[22:24] <underwatercow> crimsun: ah... well in windows, do the manufacturers set it up to do that by default then?
[22:25] <crimsun> depends
[22:25] <crimsun> I can't speak of the ones under NDA
[22:26] <underwatercow> crimsun: Can I ask you a windows related sound question?
[22:26] <underwatercow> another that is
[22:26] <underwatercow> lol
[22:26] <underwatercow> it might not be windows specifically
[22:27] <underwatercow> but that's where I noticed it
[22:27] <crimsun> I probably won't have the tech-fu to answer a Windows audio question, but sure.
[22:27] <underwatercow> lol
[22:28] <underwatercow> when I set up my card for surround sound in windows, the game I am playing will play all of the sounds except certain dialog
[22:28] <underwatercow> I have to put it to stereo to hear the dialog
[22:28] <crimsun> report the bug to your manufacturer :-]
[22:28] <underwatercow> lol
[22:29] <underwatercow> I didn't know if it was me, the game, the manufacturer...
[22:30] <crimsun> difficult to say
[22:30] <crimsun> I would surmise it's the driver
[22:30] <underwatercow> I haven't tested it on any other games in windows yet
[22:30] <underwatercow> maybe I'll try that first
[22:30] <crimsun> OTOH, it could be in the game, too, in the way it sets DX params
[22:30] <underwatercow> it's a vista driver, so who can say
[22:30] <underwatercow> I hate vista
[22:31] <crimsun> I love Vista, works great here
[22:31] <crimsun> I also have not used Vista.
[22:31] <crimsun> thus the vacuous statement
[22:31] <underwatercow> lol
[22:31] <underwatercow> I only installed it because it cost me nothing
[22:31] <underwatercow> and it will have more support than xp
[22:31] <underwatercow> if only wine could run all my games
[22:32] <underwatercow> oh joyous day
[22:35] <underwatercow> crimsun: thanks for your help
[22:35] <crimsun> np
[23:05] <pvandewyngaerde> crap crap crap, i'll never learn i lost my amarok database after upgrading to hardy
[23:11] <mcscruff> lo all
[23:12] <mcscruff> im running hardy :P on a second laptop, just wondered where the xorg.conf (or replacement) is, as i need to add my touchpad
[23:14] <PriceChild> mcscruff, /etc/X11
[23:15] <mcscruff> what file tho
[23:15] <torben> hi! i upgraded to hardy but still have kernel 2.6.22-14..is that normal?
[23:15] <mcscruff> yes
[23:15] <mcscruff> 2.6.22-14-generic is default
[23:17] <mcscruff> why was the "about ubuntu" not updated
[23:17] <choudesh> the new kernel isn't in hardy yet
[23:18] <torben> hmm, i wanted to check out a more recent kernel :/ can i get rid of that "amd testing uso only unsupported hardware" sign in the bottom right corner?
[23:20] <cafuego> You can always bake a vanilla 2.6.23-whatever-is-current kernel.
[23:20] <mcscruff> torbon, ati?
[23:20] <mcscruff> i was just reading a fix for that
[23:20] <mcscruff> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=623882&highlight=hardy
[23:21] <h3sp4wn> torben: You could build the current ubuntu git
[23:22] <mcscruff> i really dont have an xorg.conf
[23:23] <h3sp4wn> mcscruff: Is that a problem ?
[23:23] <mcscruff> when i need to add touchpad it is
[23:23] <mcscruff> /usr/share/xresprobe/xorg.conf  <<does it use that?
[23:24] <h3sp4wn> You can still have one if you need to (but for common cases its unnecessary)
[23:24] <torben> h3sp4wn: how can i do that?
[23:24] <h3sp4wn> torben: Just write one
[23:24] <mcscruff> do you need it all or can i just add the lines i need?
[23:25] <torben> h3sp4wn: sounds like too much work, i'm not really into this..
[23:26] <h3sp4wn> torben: actually I just got confused - there is a page on the wiki about git kernels
[23:26] <h3sp4wn> mcscruff: Should just be able to add what you need
[23:26] <BlackDiamonds> is there anything major in the new alpha ?
[23:26] <torben> ah ok
[23:27] <BlackDiamonds> or was it just the package sync ?
[23:27] <Trewas> torben: or just wait some time, I guess 2.6.24 kernel is coming soonish
[23:27] <mcscruff> BlackDiamonds, no xorg.conf :)
[23:27] <BlackDiamonds> wait wut
[23:27] <BlackDiamonds> is everything automated now ?
[23:27] <mcscruff> im not sure if its just me but something has been tweaked and my system seems to be running very fast
[23:28] <h3sp4wn> mcscruff: Its always fast the further away from the release it is
[23:28] <mcscruff> the restricted driver thing is missing (good move)
[23:29] <BlackDiamonds> Does anyone know when that hardware detection spec will be implemented ?
[23:29] <h3sp4wn> mcscruff: No doubt that will be back
[23:29] <mcscruff> time to try a nice ati driver
[23:29] <magnetron> BlackDiamonds: try asking in #ubuntu+1
[23:29] <h3sp4wn> mcscruff: What ati card are you using ?
[23:30] <mcscruff> h3sp4wn, radion 200M
[23:30] <BlackDiamonds> magnetron this is ubuntu+1
[23:30] <magnetron> BlackDiamonds: eh... oopss
[23:30] <mcscruff> lol
[23:30] <h3sp4wn> Think that is a bit new for XiG but my radeon mobility absolutely fly's with the XiG non-free X server
[23:31]  * magnetron facepalms
[23:33] <Trewas> h3sp4wn: XiG is still alive? I somehow would have expected a commercial X server to die with the previous millennium (when I last heard of it) :)
[23:33] <h3sp4wn> Trewas: Still alive and well
[23:34] <h3sp4wn> and still tons better than xorg for the supported ati cards
[23:35] <h3sp4wn> (If amd does release the specs I would expect XiG to produce better drivers than the xorg people)
[23:35] <h3sp4wn> Just for comparison - ut2004 is totally unplayable on this laptop with xorg and perfect with XiG
[23:36] <h3sp4wn> (and its a 16MB radeon mobility where all parties had access to the specs)
[23:36] <mcscruff> Xig , ooo i want it
[23:37] <Trewas> unsurprisingly they don't have support for nvidia chips where the company itself is making decent drivers... but I wonder how good their intel drivers are
[23:38] <h3sp4wn> Trewas: I don't think much to the nvidia drivers
[23:40] <Trewas> well, I haven't found anything to complain (stability or feature-wise) yet about nvidia drivers, granted that I have used them only on desktops
[23:40] <torben> is it possible to get a framebuffer at native resolution (1440x900) on a macbook pro using that new ati-driver?
[23:40] <h3sp4wn> Or perhaps its just the nvidia hardware - perhaps a quadro is better I dunno if I want to give nvidia more money
[23:40] <h3sp4wn> *But I dunno ...
[23:41] <h3sp4wn> I would be interested to compare similarly prices Matrox and Nvidia cards (Matrox with the XiG drivers)
[23:43] <Trewas> g550 at least has some hardware limitations, like supporting xvideo only up to 1024x1024, maybe parhelia cards are better bug afaik they don't have any support in xorg
[23:44] <h3sp4wn> Trewas: exactly - the XiG xserver supports them (I don't mind paying) I have to use so much non-free stuff for my course anyway I am no longer really bothered
[23:44] <Trewas> hrr, and now that I checked nvidia 8600gt I have in this computer costs the same as new g550
[23:46] <Trewas> h3sp4wn: I don't care about closed source that much either, but for graphics cards I have not been impressed with matrox and nvidia has good free (as in beer) drivers
[23:46] <h3sp4wn> I have an nvidia 7950GT and a 7300GT and the picture quality is not nice on either
[23:48] <Trewas> well, that doesn't matter much with lcd monitors with dvi-inputs
[23:48] <h3sp4wn> That is what I am using
[23:49] <h3sp4wn> Maybe I should try a quadro but its an expensive gamble
[23:49] <mcscruff> brb
[23:49] <Trewas> hrm, using dvi and the right resolution there is not much room for quality, bad or good
[23:51] <h3sp4wn> Dunno its perfect with an ati 9250 or an ati 9800pro (I have messed around with it for ages)
[23:51] <Trewas> I haven't seen any problems with 6600gt or 8600gt cards
[23:53] <h3sp4wn> I dunno the others are just easier on my eyes
[23:54] <Trewas> with dvi the picture quality should be either perfect or very bad, the digital connection does now allow very subtle differences
[23:55] <h3sp4wn> Trewas: *should* being the operative word
[23:56] <Trewas> h3sp4wn: yeah, pixel-perfect is pixel-perfect no matter what card :)
[23:57] <h3sp4wn> Trewas: That is how its supposed to be however in reality it isn't
[23:58] <Trewas> h3sp4wn: maybe, but the differences are somewhere else than in the dvi connection
[23:59] <Trewas> maybe some card/monitor combinations have problems or something...