[12:15] <crimsun> phanatic: perhaps in a couple hours
[12:15] <crimsun> trying furiously to wrap up some work
[12:16] <phanatic> crimsun: okay, thanks
[12:57] <Sergi0> su
[02:58] <LaserJock> hmm, do I need all three MOTU UVF guys to approve a UVFe before I can upload/request sync?
[02:59] <ajmitch> yes
[03:00] <LaserJock> ajmitch: k, that's what I thought but I couldn't remember
[03:34] <zakame> heya all
[03:37] <LaserJock> hi zakame
[03:39] <ajmitch> hi
[04:04] <Kyral> hey all
[04:06] <imbrandon> 'ello
[04:08] <zakame> hi LaserJock ajmitch Kyral imbrandon
[04:08] <Kyral> lol
[07:35] <Hobbsee> bug 45575
[07:35] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 45575 in Ubuntu "Username Case Login Bug" [Critical,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/45575
[07:37] <LaserJock> Hobbsee: congrats on the Kubuntu Council position :-)
[07:37] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: thanks :)
[07:38] <ajmitch> next thing you know she'll be in core-dev as well
[07:38] <LaserJock> yep
[07:39] <LaserJock> especially coming from the Kubuntu side :-)
[07:39] <Hobbsee> hehe
[07:58] <imbrandon> ;)
[07:59] <Hobbsee> oh, and package.  bring on edgy!
[07:59] <imbrandon> hehe
[08:00] <Hobbsee> too bad about dapper you know...it's close enough :P
[08:01] <imbrandon> the more and more i'm messing with qt4 the more i love it
[08:01] <Hobbsee> hehe
[08:03] <imbrandon> Hobbsee: anything else that you see that i should prepare my self for at the kcc meeting ? ( /me dosent wanna look unprepared heh )
[08:03] <imbrandon> brb smoke break
[08:09] <imbrandon> hehe its afternoon here ( will be at 4pm localtime )
[08:11] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: but you enjoy the early meetings so much
[08:11] <Hobbsee> hehe
[08:11] <Hobbsee> sure i do.  not.
[08:17] <bluefoxicy> what
[08:17] <bluefoxicy> somebody said there was a girl on the dev team?
[08:17] <bluefoxicy> I didn't know girls were on the internet, much less maintaining linux distros
[08:18] <Hobbsee> bluefoxicy: no, girls dont exist.
[08:18] <imbrandon> lol
[08:18] <Hobbsee> bluefoxicy: read http://www.escapistmagazine.com/print/17/27
[08:18] <bluefoxicy> sivang:  nods, the digital paintball crew has one dev that was at a lan party recently, he was telling me today there were a couple "hot girls" there, just one or two, interesting creatures according to him
[08:19] <Hobbsee> hi Mithrandir
[08:20] <bluefoxicy> Hobbsee:  omfg pix plz
[08:20] <ajmitch> hello Mithrandir
[08:20] <bluefoxicy> :)
[08:20] <imbrandon> omfg pix!!!!!111
[08:20] <ajmitch> bluefoxicy: please just stop
[08:20] <bluefoxicy> she started it.  Kind of.
[08:20] <bluefoxicy> Anyway.
[08:20] <imbrandon> lol ajmitch it was from the link she posted ;)
[08:20] <Hobbsee> bluefoxicy: http://tinyurl.com/zshqd
[08:21] <imbrandon> that is too funny though Hobbsee ;)
[08:21] <Hobbsee> i know :P
[08:21] <Mithrandir> hi Hobbsee, ajmitch
[08:21] <Mithrandir> nice picture.
[08:21] <bluefoxicy> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Teams/Games 6 packaged already, 6 that need some love, 4 in development (2 work and could be packaged), 2 listed with licensing issues (Digital Paintball is being sorted out slowly by its devs)
[08:21] <Hobbsee> hehe thanks Mithrandir
[08:22] <bluefoxicy> Hobbsee:  rhino?
[08:22] <Mithrandir> Hobbsee: I had no idea rhinos used KDE. ;-P
[08:22] <Hobbsee> sure they do :P
[08:22] <imbrandon> haha
[08:22] <imbrandon> kinda hard to use the keyboard i would imagine
[08:22] <Mithrandir> imbrandon: hard to use a mouse too.  Also, are rhinos scared of mice, like elephants are`
[08:22] <Mithrandir> s/`/?/
[08:22] <bluefoxicy> You don't 'use' KDE, you just buy more memory for it every week
[08:23] <imbrandon> motu should realy have a ventrillo server though , and also for the ubuntu-meetings
[08:23] <bluefoxicy> ventrillo?
[08:23] <Hobbsee> then everyone would talk at once :P
[08:23] <imbrandon> voice meeting / chat
[08:23] <bluefoxicy> then we could hear the guys' porn in the background.
[08:24] <Mithrandir> phone confs suck a lot more than IRC confs.
[08:24] <bluefoxicy> Second
[08:24] <bluefoxicy> I can't read the backlog on your voice.
[08:24] <imbrandon> Hobbsee:  nah we used it in runuo development with alot of devs in there at once, dev's stay pretty quiet, now normal #kubuntu or something yea it would be a mess
[08:24] <bluefoxicy> anyway
[08:24] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: that they do, they kept telling me to be quiet :P
[08:24] <imbrandon> bluefoxicy: we kept mp3 logs on the web of the meetings AND transcribed them within 24 hrs ;)
[08:24] <bluefoxicy> imbrandon:  lol
[08:24] <bluefoxicy> guys
[08:25] <bluefoxicy> I think Ubuntu needs more games support
[08:25] <Hobbsee> bluefoxicy: add it?  :P
[08:25] <imbrandon> heheh i was trying to find a way to package cedegacvs legaly
[08:25] <imbrandon> no luck yet though, their lic sucks
[08:26] <Mithrandir> I think somebody should help out with making a clone of syndicate wars.  That'd be nice.
[08:27] <bluefoxicy> heh
[08:27] <bluefoxicy> I'd rather build a level-editable Zelda clone
[08:28] <imbrandon> ahhh i second that , i loved zelda ;)
[08:28] <Mithrandir> I'm so far at the "play with opengl" level, but I intend to get something playable-ish at some point.
[08:30] <bluefoxicy> heh
[08:32] <bluefoxicy> I am wondering how to go about getting some sort of in-main support for games in Ubuntu, due to the niche market of gamers and the availability of quality Free games such as Nexuiz, Tremulous, Battle for Wesnoth, Glest, Armagetron, GLtron; and up-coming Quake 3 Open Arena, Crystal Core, and Zymotic
[08:33] <Hobbsee> i doubt games would go into main...
[08:33] <bluefoxicy> Anyone think this is a viable idea?
[08:33] <bluefoxicy> Hobbsee:  why not?
[08:33] <Hobbsee> i thought they went into universe
[08:33] <bluefoxicy> Generally
[08:33] <bluefoxicy> aside from gnome-games and kde-games
[08:33] <imbrandon> depends on the lic i thought
[08:34] <bluefoxicy> I was more pondering the concept of an actual gaming seed though
[08:34] <bluefoxicy> Ubuntu, Kubuntu, Xubuntu, these each are basically a desktop system with a different GDE
[08:35] <bluefoxicy> Edubuntu is different, it has educational software, that's what it's for.
[08:35] <imbrandon> and ltsp in edubuntu
[08:35] <imbrandon> ;)
[08:37] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: what are the specs?
[08:37] <imbrandon> Hobbsee: i just finished reading that escapist link, thats too funny, but the sad part about it is i'm sure its all mosr than true and common ( although i'm sure you would know better than me )
[08:37] <bluefoxicy> I was thinking of the gamers niche market, perhaps Ubuntu Gaming Edition or LPUbuntu (Lan Party Ubuntu), similar concept.  Instead of desktop productivity, a bunch of games get installed, mainly 3D FPS deathmatch and networked turn/real-time strategy; although a few gems like gtetrinet or GLtron would pop up too.
[08:37] <imbrandon> spec's ?
[08:37] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: hehe
[08:37] <imbrandon> for what , edubuntu ?
[08:37] <Hobbsee> i saw it on your launchpad page
[08:37] <Hobbsee> i'm not sure
[08:37] <bluefoxicy> I don't know if it's worth proposing though
[08:37] <imbrandon> ahhh fubuntu is the specs
[08:38] <bluefoxicy> fubuntu?  o.o
[08:38] <imbrandon> fluxbox based ubuntu ;) speaking of seeds ;)
[08:38] <Mithrandir> I think putting at least networked games in main makes some sort of sense -- I've seen enough security advisories for crashes in random games due to bad programming
[08:38] <bluefoxicy> ah
[08:38] <bluefoxicy> Mithrandir:  it's more things go into main that ubuntu agrees to actually support
[08:39] <bluefoxicy> But also I am interested in a supported gaming distro
[08:39] <bluefoxicy> Just more to show off
[08:39] <imbrandon> Hobbsee: spec == fubuntu  , hold on i'll get the spec link : https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/fubuntu-desktop
[08:39] <bluefoxicy> Besides, I could go to a LAN party, bring 50 CDs with me, hand them out and everyone throws the LiveCD into their computer
[08:39] <bluefoxicy> we all play Armagetron, Nexuiz, Doom wtf
[08:40] <bluefoxicy> and then everyone goes home with an Ubuntu CD :)
[08:40] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: that should probably be on your wiki page :P
[08:40] <dholbach> good morning motu world!
[08:40] <imbrandon> hehe true, i dident think about that
[08:40] <ajmitch> hey dholbach
[08:40] <imbrandon> thanks
[08:40] <imbrandon> heya dholbach
[08:40] <bluefoxicy> that would be about the coolest way to get people dual-booting.
[08:41] <dholbach> hey ajmitch, hey imbrandon
[08:41] <imbrandon> bluefoxicy: maybe ;) start it up, see where it go's
[08:41] <bluefoxicy> imbrandon:  spec it?
[08:41] <imbrandon> why not, and on the ubuntuforums.org
[08:42] <imbrandon> maybe forums first and flesh it out
[08:42] <imbrandon> then spec it and head over to ubuntu-devel and discuss it
[08:42] <imbrandon> ;)
[08:42] <bluefoxicy> I am aiming at getting a job (interview on tuesday) and trying to manage Peppermill (project manager/technical advisor, avoiding actually doing any development)
[08:43] <imbrandon> peppermill casino ?
[08:43] <imbrandon> heh
[08:43] <bluefoxicy> peppermill uh.  side project for me to make a system to spit out livecds
[08:43] <imbrandon> ahh
[08:43] <bluefoxicy> not important
[08:44] <bluefoxicy> But anyway, I'm more looking at focusing on trying to convince the devs to go with proactive security features in Edgy
[08:44] <bluefoxicy> we have like no proactive security team anymore
[08:44] <bluefoxicy> it all fell apart, one of the guys moved to fedora
[08:44] <bluefoxicy> and nobody got anything done
[08:45] <bluefoxicy> Fortunately RedHat got some low entropy stack and mmap() randomization into mainline Linux; and there's a stack protector and FORTIFY_SOURCE in gcc 4.1 mainline
[08:45] <imbrandon> Hobbsee: added , thanks for the idea
[08:46] <Hobbsee> np :)
[08:46] <bluefoxicy> so all I have to do is figure out who to blow to get them to turn -Wstack-protector -DFORTIFY_SOURCE on and try to get a patch I wrote to adjust kernel entropy into Edgy's kernel
[08:47] <bluefoxicy> (and then try to get one of the more favored devs to propose said patch to upstream)
[08:47] <imbrandon> heh might be just as easy to get it upstream then it will flow to edgy
[08:47] <bluefoxicy> upstream says "Why would anyone want/need to do this"?
[08:47] <imbrandon> so make your case ;)
[08:47] <bluefoxicy> it's a hard case
[08:48] <bluefoxicy> there are cases where it does nothing; there are cases where it somewhat helps but the situation is still grave
[08:48] <imbrandon> honestly i have no idea about most kernel stuff so thats a tad over me atm ;)
[08:48] <bluefoxicy> well, it does something always
[08:48] <Mithrandir> what does fortify_source do?
[08:48] <bluefoxicy> it's just not anything important
[08:48] <bluefoxicy> Mithrandir:  I honestly don't really know :)
[08:48] <bluefoxicy> it replaces strcpy() and friends with checked functions if the buffer length is known
[08:48] <Mithrandir> also, adding random -W flags to the build doesn't change anything.
[08:49] <bluefoxicy> and makes a check if the source length and buffer length are known
[08:49] <bluefoxicy> Mithrandir:  it's supposed to be -fstack-protector, someone told me they made it -W
[08:49] <bluefoxicy> it's ProPolice merged into gcc basically, someone shifted around the code into different files to make it less invasive and sent it to mainline
[08:51] <bluefoxicy> at any rate the patch I wrote for the kernel adds framework to adjust stack and mmap() randomization entropy, and takes advantage of this framework with a kernel command line parameter (which can be removed later in favor of SELinux hooks)
[08:51] <bluefoxicy> thing is, basically your worst case is gaim having a stack buffer overflow (gaim has an executable stack, even on amd64), it's a straight 1/128 chance that your attack succeeds
[08:52] <bluefoxicy> so for every 1000 attacks in this theoretical scenario, 10 infections would occur
[08:52] <bluefoxicy> The point of ASLR, stack protection, and memory protection control is that before an attack exists, you can weigh what the impact of it would be, and reduce it to near nothing
[08:53] <Mithrandir> why 1/128?
[08:54] <bluefoxicy> Mithrandir:  the stack is randomized to 19 bits aligned on 16 byte boundaries.  If it is executable, you can pad shellcode to 4096 bytes (1 page) with NOPs in most cases, making it... oh, sorry.  11 bits, 2048 positions, where the hell did I get 128 from.
[08:54] <bluefoxicy> At any rate.
[08:54] <Mithrandir> yeah, it's not 100%, I see that.
[08:55] <Mithrandir> just wondering where 128 came from
[08:56] <bluefoxicy> For every 10,000 attacks, 5 succeed.  In theory, if we had a user base nearing 1 million, we could assume that there's a good chance random worm X would make a deep infection in 13 hours (5 iteratons, 1 attack per second, 1 iteration == 10,000 attacks from all infected machines, starting from 1 infected machine; iteration 5 leaves 1.25 million machines infected)
[08:57] <bluefoxicy> I re-did the math with 256M of stack randomization (24 bits), it takes  oh god let me go actually read my notes.
[08:58] <bluefoxicy> "The first iteration probably doesn't get anywhere; the attacker will likely have to attack 65536 times (18h12m @ 1/S) to start, and then each iteration is that many attacks with 1 infection per attacker.  The fifth iteration is 90 hours (3 days 18 hours) away, and on average 16 nodes should be infected by this time."
[08:58] <bluefoxicy>  -- Me, LKML
[08:59] <bluefoxicy> it takes 76 days to perform an infection to the scale of what takes 13 hours in this scenario on normal 8M stack randomization
[09:00] <bluefoxicy> this is 76 days for a patch to be written, tested, built, distributed, and applied to the user base before that kind of massive infection.. almost 4 days before even 16 users should be infected in this scenario.
[09:00] <bluefoxicy> The problem is
[09:00] <bluefoxicy> once in a while you break something.
[09:00] <bluefoxicy> Linus' mail client broke from high entropy randomization, when he tried to search his mail and it tried to mmap() a 2.5GiB mail box in and found the VMA was too fragmented to find a 2.5GiB not-used area
[09:00] <bluefoxicy> Oracle does this too, and breaks.
[09:01] <bluefoxicy> That's why the entropy is so small.
[09:01] <bluefoxicy> My solution was to create a framework where you can easily adjust entropy-- with the eventual goal of having selinux hooks where policy can say that the default system entropy is MASSIVE, but the one or two programs every 3 millionth user has that break are known and set to low-order entropy
[09:02] <Mithrandir> the right fix is obviously to not use mboxes, but maildirs.
[09:02] <imbrandon> ;)
[09:03] <bluefoxicy> Thing is, with a non-executable stack, you can only knock 1-1.5 bits of randomization off, and then have to deal with 8 bits of mmap() randomization to successfully perform a return to libc (return to system() with constructed stack frame)
[09:04] <bluefoxicy> so you're going through 26 bits of entropy in any normal attack scenario -- 67108864 states, with only 1 being a success state, and it's a different one for each attack.  Remember, we just did this with 65536 states, and it took 3 days to spread a worm to 16 machines.
[09:04] <Mithrandir> yeah, it scales up pretty quickly.
[09:04] <bluefoxicy> so under any normal situation, as long as you have an NX bit (i.e. you're not on i386) and your app doesn't stupidly make its stack executable, we're kind of covered.
[09:05] <bluefoxicy> I still prefer the whole-damn-world test myself.  Everyone in the whole damn world attacks you at once, how many get in :)
[09:05] <bluefoxicy> 6 billion people in the world.
[09:06] <bluefoxicy> another reason I like x86-64.  You can feasibly and sanely apply levels of entropy that put this test where every person in the world has to attack you 2 billion times before ONE compromises your system.
[09:07] <bluefoxicy> TASK_SIZE is 47 bits minus a page, 128 terrabytes of VMA, you can chuck 16TiB of randomization at stack and mmap() AND heap and it'll just be like "lalala we can still mmap() the whole internet in one straight line here"
[09:08] <bluefoxicy> and there's no trade-off
[09:08] <bluefoxicy> it's like applying 50 tons more steel to tank armor, execpt the tank doesn't get heavier, or bigger.  :)
[09:09] <bluefoxicy> And it's free steel.  :)
[09:09] <bluefoxicy> why would you NOT do it
[09:09] <bluefoxicy> forget looking for an excuse
[09:09] <bluefoxicy> at any rate
[09:09] <bluefoxicy> it's a hard argument to justify
[09:11] <bluefoxicy> the gains are fuzzy at best, attacks in certain situations can upscail insanely (you can break 256M stack/mmap() randomization in 216 seconds on average if you find an Apache bug, just by iterating every possible state as fast as possible; although on x86-64 with 32 bits stack and 32 bits mmap() it takes eternity)
[09:11] <bluefoxicy> and once in a while something breaks from it
[09:12] <bluefoxicy> (which is exactly the reason I am trying to make it policy-tunable and leave the default values in tact)
[09:12] <bluefoxicy> anyway 3am
[09:13] <bluefoxicy> I bored the shit out of everyone already, and I need sleep.
[09:13] <Hobbsee> 3am's a great time to be up till :P
[09:13] <bluefoxicy> Next time we'll talk about games more instead of security and linux chicks
[09:13] <bluefoxicy> or wait
[09:13] <Hobbsee> oh good.
[09:13] <bluefoxicy> games and linux chicks more instead of security?
[09:13] <Hobbsee> no
[09:13] <Hobbsee> no discussions of chicks, linux or otherwise.
[09:13] <bluefoxicy> Hobbsee:  let's play global thermonuclear war
[09:14] <Hobbsee> heh
[09:14] <Hobbsee> that would be highly destructive
[09:14] <bluefoxicy> wikipedia has a list of all the scenarios the computer calculated for that
[09:14] <Hobbsee> besides, you cant discuss what doesnt exist.
[09:15] <bluefoxicy> honestly I don't know why guys ask for pictures as proof girls are girls
[09:15] <bluefoxicy> I knew a guy who always posed as a girl, he got his friend to give him pictures to post to pose as a chick
[09:15] <Hobbsee> i dont know why guys seem to entertain themselves with the idea of somethign that they're never going to get.
[09:15] <bluefoxicy> XD
[09:16] <Hobbsee> hehe - good on him!  :P
[09:16] <bluefoxicy> Jen used to call people on the phone
[09:16] <Hobbsee> i'll bet he enjoyed the responses too - then became one hell of a lot more considerate.
[09:16] <bluefoxicy> she would be like "What's your phone number?"
[09:18] <bluefoxicy> "I'm really a girl!"  "Pix plz"  "Okai let me set up my camera... google... image... hot girls...  OK picture coming"
[09:18] <Hobbsee> heh
[09:19] <Hobbsee> some guys seem to just believe what they want to believe...
[09:19] <bluefoxicy> .... XD
[09:19] <bluefoxicy> flashbacks
[09:19] <bluefoxicy> hah
[09:19] <bluefoxicy> rhino
[09:20] <imbrandon> ;)
[09:20] <imbrandon> hell infact my wife ( soon to be ex but lets not get into that ) can code better than me in c++ but she never gets on irc , hell she barely uses im's or email ;)
[09:21] <bluefoxicy> http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-11/495771/JACKASS.JPG
[09:21] <imbrandon> just for those reasons in that article that hob linked to
[09:22] <Hobbsee> hehe
[09:22] <bluefoxicy> I know enough girls but it's always fun to react that way :P
[09:23] <bluefoxicy> guys keep mistaking ME for a girl
[09:24] <bluefoxicy> sleepies.
[09:25] <Hobbsee> night bluefoxicy
[09:25] <imbrandon> gnight
[09:25] <bluefoxicy> oh
[09:26] <bluefoxicy> http://www.ocremix.org/songs/Chrono_Trigger_The_Place_We_Knew_OC_ReMix.mp3  :>
[09:26] <bluefoxicy> SPeaking of girls I know on the net
[09:26] <imbrandon> ?!?
[09:26] <bluefoxicy> I was hanging out in the OCR channel and i found out SHE'S ON THE OTHER SIDE OF TOWN FROM ME   o.o
[09:27] <bluefoxicy> I wanna go hear Jill sing live, she's got a really, really nice voice, plus she's really nice :)
[09:27] <bluefoxicy> sleepies time.
[09:27] <Hobbsee> heh.  again.
[09:35] <imbrandon> hmm i think its a night to update my blog, i've been meaning to add some kubuntu stuff to it anyhow
[09:37] <imbrandon> heh
[09:37] <imbrandon> i used to alot, i just got lazy the last 2 months or so with it
[09:37] <imbrandon> last post was like march something, and alot of my php code needs updated
[09:38] <imbrandon> Sunday, March 19th, 2006
[09:38] <imbrandon> looks like
[09:38] <imbrandon> Hobbsee: a blog dosent have to be personal , it can be about a subjust your interested in ( like KDE w00t )
[09:38] <Hobbsee> true
[09:38] <imbrandon> subject*
[09:39] <Hobbsee> i usually rss feed read other people's blogs....but i dont write myself.
[09:39] <imbrandon> and honestly i think blogs *about* something are alot better than blogs about someone personal life ;)
[09:39] <Hobbsee> besides, google caches everything
[09:39] <Hobbsee> true
[09:42] <imbrandon> whats a good qt based ftp client ?
[09:43] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: er...konq?
[09:43] <imbrandon> heh i guess thats as good as any
[09:46] <TheMuso> c/c
[10:27] <ivoks> is it only me, or t38modem needs rebuild?
[10:32] <Toadstool> hi here
[11:46] <phanatic> morning
[11:47] <DarkMageZ> it depends on your timezone, it is night here
[11:49] <phanatic> DarkMageZ: sorry, for me it's still morning :) (11am)
[01:34] <ivoks> hi
[01:38] <ivoks> anyone here?
[02:55] <spacey> 727 comments marked as spam
[03:24] <zul> hey
[04:33] <phanatic> hi people
[04:33] <Bluekuja> hello phanatic
[04:33] <phanatic> hi Bluekuja
[04:35] <bddebian> Heya gang
[04:35] <Bluekuja> oh bddebian
[04:35] <Bluekuja> hello
[04:35] <Hobbsee> hi bddebian and phanatic and Bluekuja
[04:35] <bddebian> Hi Bluekuja
[04:35] <bddebian> Hi Hobbsee
[04:35] <Bluekuja> hello HobbSee
[04:35] <Bluekuja> :)
[04:36] <phanatic> heya Hobbsee and bddebian :)
[04:36] <bddebian> Heya phanatic
[04:36] <phanatic> bddebian: have some time for a review?
[04:36] <bddebian> phanatic: Probably.  Give me a few minutes
[04:37] <phanatic> bddebian: thanks. for reference: bug 32485
[04:37] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 32485 in sysinfo "sysinfo locks on startup" [Normal,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/32485
[05:23] <phanatic> hey Gloubiboulga
[05:23] <Gloubiboulga> hi phanatic
[05:30] <xhaker> Seveas: hi
[05:30] <Seveas> hi
[05:30] <xhaker> Seveas: i have a request
[05:30] <Seveas> tell me more
[05:30] <xhaker> i wish you would grant
[05:30] <xhaker> i use your repositories for misc stuff
[05:31] <xhaker> maybe you could add libxft and libcairo with david turner patches
[05:31] <Seveas> hmm
[05:32] <Seveas> that sounds scary, my repositories are used by quite a few people and I don't want to make them use random patches
[05:32] <Seveas> Can you tell me more about those patches?
[05:32] <xhaker> i'm using some packages already they implement better subpixel font rendering
[05:33] <xhaker> many people are already using custom packages because the improvement is rather large
[05:33] <TomaszD> ah the ones which just *might* infringe cleartype patents. No thanks, until this is sorted out I wouldn't touch this. Or is it ok now?
[05:34] <Seveas> TomaszD, thanks for that
[05:34] <Seveas> xhaker, that makes it a definite no
[05:34] <xhaker> http://lists.nongnu.org/archive/html/freetype-devel/2006-05/msg00052.html
[05:34] <TomaszD> no seriously, I've been on the site just today and it in big red letters it says something about this issue.
[05:35] <TomaszD> "Note that these patches may infringe the ClearType patents !!. I haven't had the time to analyze them in detail, and thus don't know for sure at the moment if it is safe to distribute them on typical Linux distribution."
[05:35] <xhaker> the guy uses a FIR algorythm.. he alerts it might.. because obviously he didn't look at any microsoft code
[05:35] <TomaszD> ah, so purely hypothetical situation.
[05:36] <xhaker> i'm asking seveas since his repository is the only custom one i use
[05:36] <xhaker> besides seb128
[05:36] <TomaszD> xhaker, you know, making your own repository is a breeze
[05:37] <xhaker> TomaszD: i know.. just thought it might be a good addition to his.. i don't have the capacity to host it anywhere
[05:38] <Seveas> hmm, that screenshot looks pretty neat
[05:38] <TomaszD> xhaker, I just might have what you need, but I can't find the howto on making the simplest repository again for the life of me.
[05:38] <Seveas> I'm going to try those patches
[05:38] <TomaszD> yeah the screenshots are tempting indeed.
[05:39] <Seveas> TomaszD, making a repository is pretty simple with apt-ftparchive or falcon
[05:39] <xhaker> Seveas there are some packages attached to forum posts
[05:39] <ogra> Seveas, do you think so ? i find the fonts very blurry
[05:39] <xhaker> ogra.. have you tryed?
[05:39] <xhaker> i find some more thick.. but more defined also
[05:39] <ogra> xhaker, i'm preparing as release, no time to recompile the whole desktop locally for a new libcairo
[05:40] <xhaker> ogra: ;)
[05:40] <ogra> i find they look blurry like in KDE or XP
[05:40] <Seveas> blurry is the future
[05:40] <Seveas> fuzzy logic, fuzzy fonts ;)
[05:41] <TomaszD> hey it's not that bad.
[05:41] <TomaszD> maybe a bit too much on the fuzzy side, yes...
[05:41] <xhaker> let seveas try it and see for himself :P
[05:54] <xhaker> Seveas: enable autohinter and subpixel rendering to see it in action.. sorry if you already knew
[05:54] <Seveas> xhaker, I'm not going to try right now, it's at the bottom of a long todo list
[05:57] <tuxmaniac> heya gang
[06:05] <bddebian> Heya tuxmaniac
[06:06] <bddebian> phanatic: Still here?
[06:06] <tuxmaniac> bddebian: So wass up?
[06:06] <phanatic> bddebian: yeah
[06:07] <bddebian> tuxmaniac: "Bug fixing" as usual :_)
[06:07] <bddebian> phanatic: What did you want me to look at?
[06:08] <Gloubiboulga> bddebian, hi :)
[06:08] <Gloubiboulga> can we still upload, freeze is not today?
[06:08] <bddebian> Heya Gloubiboulga
[06:08] <phanatic> bddebian: bug 32485
[06:08] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 32485 in sysinfo "sysinfo locks on startup" [Normal,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/32485
[06:13] <bddebian> phanatic: Looking now
[06:14] <phanatic> bddebian: thanks
[06:27] <bddebian2> phanatic: Uploaded
[06:28] <phanatic> bddebian: thank you very much :)
[06:29] <bddebian> phanatic: No, thank YOU ;-)
[06:30] <phanatic> bddebian: with this fix, i've cleaned my packages :)
[08:20] <Spec> bddebian: is it normal to only be built for i386? are you asking if the package can be built on other packages? (zsnes/gsnes9x)
[08:21] <bddebian> Spec: I'm asking if this is normally that case or my upload crashed it :-)
[08:25] <Spec> I don't know what it's normally built for -- i only use x86 :)
[08:25] <Spec> actually
[08:25] <Spec> zsnes is only i386 (packages.debian.org)
[08:26] <Spec> gsnes9x should be built for i386, m68k, mips, powerpc
[08:26] <Spec> version: 3.12-8
[09:25] <siretart> hi folks
[09:25] <phanatic> hi siretart
[09:26] <siretart> heyho phanatic
[09:26] <siretart> I'd like to add a topic about backports to the MeetingAgenda of the TB
[09:26] <siretart> I've written down my proposal here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReinhardTartler/BackportsProposal
[09:26] <siretart> I'd love to hear your comments, before I put it to the agenda
[09:27] <bddebian> Oh, when is next TB meeting?
[09:27] <siretart> 23 May 20:00 UTC: Technical Board
[09:27] <siretart> iow: tomorrow evening
[09:27] <bddebian> Ack
[09:27] <LaserJock> bddebian: fridge has an ical file you can use to keep track :-)
[09:28] <siretart> the proposal is basically to open dapper-backports for direct uploads
[09:28] <LaserJock> siretart: ohhh, nice
[09:29] <crimsun> (only for core-dev)
[09:29] <siretart> exactly
[09:29] <siretart> is this proposal this scary that daniel has to leave? ;)
[09:30] <ogra> he fears he has to review them all ;)
[09:30] <LaserJock> hmm, well I would personally like to see core-dev also able do it, or maybe a universe-backport LP team
[09:30] <siretart> hrhr
[09:30] <crimsun> I disagree that dapper-updates should be opened before release, though (presuming referring to dapper's release)
[09:30] <siretart> crimsun: yes, I mean dapper release
[09:31] <ogra> LaserJock, core-dev doesnt care about backports officially we are only the point of contact for the backports team to make packages buildable on both releases
[09:31] <ogra> (if main is even required)
[09:32] <siretart> ogra: in fact, there hasn't been any new backport accepted to the archive for more than one month :(
[09:32] <ogra> siretart, that a technical prob i think
[09:32] <crimsun> rationale: If dapper-updates is opened prior to dapper's release, then effectively dapper will release with the updates that should have gone into dapper, which kinda defeats UVF.
[09:32] <crimsun> (I'm not sure if dapper-updates was mistakenly used instead of dapper-backports there)
[09:33] <siretart> ogra: So the technical board is the right adress to ask if there is a technical problem, no?
[09:33] <ogra> siretart, yep
[09:33] <ogra> but i'm not sure this week will be a meeting
[09:33] <siretart> ok. then I will ask about that problem there
[09:34] <siretart> ogra: according to ubuntu-meeting, it is scheduled
[09:34] <ogra> all other meetings were dropped for release testing
[09:34] <siretart> I'm just asking mdz
[09:34] <ogra> so this might be an oversight or not :)
[09:36] <crimsun> siretart: should I add comments to the proposal?
[09:36] <siretart> crimsun: please do! I'm happy for every comment
[09:36] <crimsun> ok
[09:37] <siretart> I'd suggest adding a chapter 'comments' below the text, but do as you wish
[09:37] <crimsun> right
[09:43] <pianoboy3333> What does /dev/random and /dev/urandom do ?
[09:43] <Spec> they provide randomization
[09:44] <Spec> , /dev/random is better, it's random
[09:44] <bddebian> pianoboy3333: They are entropy devices
[09:44] <crimsun> unless you have a /really/ good reason, you should be using /dev/urandom.
[09:44] <Spec> urandom is less random, not as good for things such as generating gpg keys
[09:44] <cmatheson> how does one report a bug if a package doesn't use malone as its official bug-tracker? (epiphany)
[09:44] <crimsun> (since /dev/random will block)
[09:44] <pianoboy3333> in general, what do the things in /dev do?
[09:44] <Spec> they are your devices
[09:44] <Spec> like, keyboard, mice, harddrive, video card, ...
[09:45] <crimsun> cmatheson: you should still be able to file a bug against src:epiphany-browser on Malone.
[09:45] <Spec> oh, and /dev/null is absolutely nothing
[09:45] <crimsun> cmatheson: granted you probably want to trawl upstream gnome bugzilla first
[09:46] <cmatheson> crimsun: well, it's a bug specific to ubuntu i think... my problem is that it doesn't respect gnome-text-editor when viewing source... it seems that it's hard-coded to use gedit or something?
[09:46] <cmatheson> (i haven't dug into the source yet0
[09:46] <cmatheson> )
[09:47] <crimsun> cmatheson: then file it against src:epiphany-browser
[09:47] <cmatheson> crimsun: ok, thanks
[09:48] <cmatheson> crimsun: hmm, No products matching src:epiphany-browser were found.
[09:48] <crimsun> cmatheson: no, that's notation for "the source package 'epiphany-browser'"
[09:49] <crimsun> (following packages.debian.org spec)
[09:49] <cmatheson> crimsun: oooooh, silly me
[09:49] <siretart> crimsun: I just answered your comment
[09:49] <crimsun> siretart: ok
[09:50] <crimsun> siretart: but that weakens -updates, doesn't it? Afair it's only for fairly non-invasive fixes to critical bugs, e.g., "fails to start".
[09:51] <siretart> crimsun: -updates was never supposed for newer upstream versions. afaik the policy was only for critical functional but non security related bugs in them.
[09:52] <crimsun> siretart: so essentially it would be a proposal to expand the usage of -updates?
[09:52] <siretart> crimsun: I propose to open -backports for more dangerous uploads, which involve newer upstream versions. it could be a prestage before edgy opens in some cases..
[09:52] <siretart> crimsun: I think -updates is just fine as it is
[09:52] <crimsun> ah, so it /was/ a typo (cf. $distro-updates instead of $distro-backports)
[09:52] <siretart> crimsun: updates to -updates are very minimal and 'save' to update.
[09:53] <siretart> I wouldn't want to have -backports to be enabled by default. -update is, ttbomk
[09:53] <siretart> argl, now I see the typo, just a sek
[09:54] <siretart> crimsun: fixed. thanks for spotting
[09:54] <LaserJock> siretart: I think it is cool, there are often times when I could do a trivial backport to breezy but the current backport policy is sooo restrictive
[09:54] <crimsun> np :-)
[09:55] <crimsun> siretart: probably want to do the same for "edgy-updates".
[09:55] <LaserJock> there was an app that I love (ghemical) that is totally broken in Breezy but works fine in Dapper and the backport wouldn't have been that hard
[09:56] <siretart> crimsun: right. to be opened after edgy's UVF
[09:56] <siretart> before that point, edgy-backports doesn't make any sense at all
[09:57] <crimsun> ("edgy-updates" -> "edgy-backports")
[09:58] <siretart> crimsun: fixed. thanks again
[09:58] <siretart> :/
[10:05] <Riddell> is Emmet Hikory around?
[10:05] <bddebian> He is persia on IRC
[10:05] <ivoks> guess not
[10:05] <ivoks> Riddell: looks like you have some free time :)
[10:05] <bddebian> heh
[10:06] <ivoks> and i know one bug that's very easy to fix :) i even provided dpatch :)
[10:06] <Riddell> ivoks: why?
[10:06] <Riddell> ivoks: number?
[10:06] <ivoks> bug #25933
[10:06] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 25933 in mailman "depreceted funtcion in mailman with python2.4" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/25933
[10:06] <ivoks> it just needs that patch and that's it
[10:21] <bluefoxicy> hmm
[10:22] <Riddell> ivoks: I woudln't feel comfortable uploading that at this stage, it's not my area at all
[10:23] <ivoks> ok
[10:23] <ivoks> thanks anyway
[10:23] <ivoks> fwiw, it's tested :)
[10:24] <neutrinomass> Riddell: Does 'gtksee' happen to be in your area? Because I've uploaded a patch that hasn't been looked into either ;)
[10:24] <ivoks> neutrinomass: i'll take a look at that
[10:24] <ivoks> neutrinomass: just give me the number
[10:25] <neutrinomass> argh, just a moment
[10:25] <neutrinomass> bug 45828
[10:25] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 45828 in gtksee "gtksee crashes (Dapper-beta1)" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/45828
[10:26] <neutrinomass> ivoks: It's prety trivial actually :)
[10:26] <ivoks> ok
[10:27] <ivoks> omg... this is an aincent one :)
[10:27] <ivoks> hm... view thumbs work for me
[10:27] <ivoks> oh, there it goes :)
[10:27] <neutrinomass> heh ;)
[10:27] <neutrinomass> small icons crashes it too IIRC
[10:28] <ivoks> ok, i'll take a look at it, but first i have to finish something else
[10:28] <neutrinomass> and there should be tons of crashes everywhere fnumber and fsize are used
[10:28] <Riddell> neutrinomass: nope, i do kde
[10:28] <neutrinomass> ivoks: Thanks. It's just a newbie C error (I remember falling prey to it myself so it took like 2 min to spot :) )
[10:29] <neutrinomass> Riddell: Ok, thanks :)
[10:39] <ivoks> neutrinomass: http://www.grad.hr/~ivoks/ubuntu/gtksee_0.5.6-1ubuntu1_i386.deb
[10:39] <ivoks> neutrinomass: try and tell if it works
[10:41] <neutrinomass> ivoks: Generally when submitting patches should I forward stuff to debian too, or is that developer work ?
[10:41] <ivoks> works for me... but who uses this app anyway? :)
[10:41] <ivoks> neutrinomass: debian probably forgot they have that app :)
[10:42] <neutrinomass> ivoks: Exactly my thought, it's ugly and buggy :-/
[10:42] <LaserJock> you know that as soon as you say that there is bound to be somebody pipe up and say, "That app rulz!" ;-)
[10:43] <neutrinomass> ivoks: Works fine. Want to give me 3 minutes to fix up a .desktop for it as well ?
[10:43] <ivoks> too late :)
[10:43] <ivoks> report as another bug
[10:43] <neutrinomass> ivoks: Hmpf.... I might as well do it though since I'll forget
[10:45] <bddebian> heh
[10:52] <neutrinomass> Ok, this isn't funny anymore. How on earth can you find whether a package has an icon or not? for example, gtksee's sources contain a bunch of xpm icons, but nothing shows up in 'locate' and 'dlocate' ... do they end up hard coded ?
[10:54] <Spec> uhh
[10:54] <Spec> dpkg -L gtksee |grep -i xpm
[10:54] <Spec> dpkg -L gtksee | grep -i desktop
[10:55] <Spec> or
[10:55] <neutrinomass> Spec: Nothing and nothing respectively.
[10:55] <Spec> dpkg --contents <filename.deb> |grep whatever
[10:55] <Spec> okay, that means the .deb file does not contain the .xpms
[10:56] <neutrinomass> Spec: But the icons show up in the program ....
[10:56] <bddebian> Pull the source and do find ./ -name *.desktop
[10:56] <bddebian> or sometimes *.desktop.in
[10:56] <Spec> the icons show up in the program?
[10:56] <Spec> wait, but there's no desktop file for gtksee?
[10:57] <neutrinomass> Spec: Yes... and no respectively. It shows int he top-left part of the program. Of course gtksee doesn't show in the menus
[10:57] <Spec> ohh, okay
[10:57] <Spec> yeah, hard coded i suppose
[10:58] <Spec> must be
[10:58] <Spec> there's no picture files in that package :)
[10:58] <neutrinomass> bddebian: The program has an icon, but as Spec seems to notice as well it must be hard coded. It has no .desktop, but the sources do have .xpms . Anyway.... I'll open the bug
[10:59] <bddebian> bdefreese@archive:/archive/devel/gtksee/gtksee-0.5.6$ find ./ -name *.xpm
[10:59] <bddebian> ./icons/eye.xpm
[10:59] <bddebian> ./icons/eye_2.xpm
[10:59] <bddebian> ./icons/eye_mini.xpm
[10:59] <bddebian> ./icons/gtkiris.xpm
[10:59] <bddebian> ./icons/gtksee.xpm
[10:59] <neutrinomass> bddebian: Agreed! But non get installed ...
[11:00] <bddebian> Aye, that's the bug ;-)
[11:00] <imbrandon> morning  bddebian
[11:00] <bddebian> Heya imbrandon
[11:00] <Spec> well, not only do they not get installed, there's no .desktop file as well (separate bug?)
[11:00] <bddebian> Nah, I would put in same bug
[11:00] <bddebian> But what do I know? :-)
[11:01] <Spec> well, you could put it in the same bug
[11:01] <Spec> I'm certaintly not going to stop you :p
[11:01] <neutrinomass> Spec: Well if you are to be pedantic you should open seperate bugs. They will be both fixed in one go though, so makes no real ponit (heh, the other day I opened one bug for no .desktop and another that .desktop is not installed in the correct location :) )
[11:01] <Spec> haha
[11:02] <Spec> i did lack of icon/lack of desktop in one bug
[11:02] <neutrinomass> They got marked as duplicates but I didn't insist too much that they are different issues ...
[11:02] <Spec> it made me feel dirty
[11:03] <neutrinomass> Spec:  helps increase your karma though O:-)
[11:03] <LaserJock> heck, I would put them together. that way the lazy MOTUs have to do both to mark it "Fix Released" ;-)
[11:04] <bddebian> LaserJock: ;-)
[11:05] <bddebian> Hiya Hobbsee
[11:05] <Hobbsee> hi bddebian
[11:06] <Hobbsee> dont you dare, it's too early for that..
[11:06] <LaserJock> not here it isn't ;-)
[11:09] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: sure it is!  it's only possible to jump hobbsees when they're awake
[11:09] <bddebian> hehe
[11:10] <Spec> too early...end of work day :p
[11:10] <neutrinomass> Any information on whether the backports team is still alive ?
[11:11] <Spec> what meeting is happening?
[11:11] <Hobbsee> Spec: kubuntu meeting
[11:13] <Spec> bah, kde.
[11:14] <Spec> <starts war>
[11:14] <bddebian> heh
[11:16] <Hobbsee> heh.  i avoided that one yesterday.
[11:19] <ogra> Spec, do that in #ubuntu-meeting :)
[11:20] <ogra> (but ware a helmet ;) )
[11:20] <ogra> *wear
[11:20] <bddebian> hehe
[11:20] <Hobbsee> heh
[11:20] <Spec> wait, wait, you -want- me to start a war during the meeting?.... "Ogra said I could do it! "
[11:20] <ogra> haha
[11:20] <Hobbsee> ogra:shameful!  i'll make a note not to let you in!
[11:21] <ogra> Hobbsee, hey i ship KDE parts in edubuntu :)
[11:21] <Hobbsee> hehe
[11:24] <LaserJock> Hobbsee: but he secretly wants to rip them out in edgy ;-)
[11:24] <bddebian> hehe
[11:25] <Hobbsee> hehe
[11:25] <TheMuso> Hey all. Whats the status with UVF requests that haven't yet been uploaded yet? Are they now being left until Edgy opens?
[11:26] <crimsun> congrats, imbrandon
[11:26] <Hobbsee> ogra: you're good on screensavers right?  can you help me attack a few bugs that are left, probably in edgy by now?
[11:26] <crimsun> TheMuso: essentially, though siretart does have a proposal for dapper-backports to be raised in the next TB meeting
[11:26] <imbrandon> thanks crimsun
[11:26] <TheMuso> crimsun: Ok thanks.
[11:27] <ogra> Hobbsee, indeed
[11:27] <Hobbsee> ogra: thanks.  there's a lot of weirdness in the rss-glx screensavers on kde - if some packages are installed, it screws up, if others arent, it doesnt work at all. i'd like to know why
[11:28] <ogra> Hobbsee, i also plan to do more active stuff this time, i was rather occupied by ltsp in dapper, will try to weight out my time a bit better this time
[11:28] <bddebian> Ack, I have to get home.  Later folks
[11:28] <Hobbsee> fair enough :)
[11:28] <Hobbsee> bye bddebian
[11:29] <ogra> Hobbsee, and i have no clue at all about kscreensaver so you'll have to cover the whole KDE side here :)
[11:29] <Hobbsee> heh
[11:29] <Hobbsee> right
[11:30] <Seveas> MUHAHAHA I nailed bug 26436!
[11:31] <Hobbsee> Seveas: yay!  which was that?
[11:31] <Seveas> pygtkmozembed crashing
[11:32] <Hobbsee> fun
[11:33] <bluefoxicy> oi
[11:34] <bluefoxicy> I guess I'll install Dapper Beta 2 i386
[11:35] <neutrinomass> bluefoxicy: beta 2 is a bit old... you might want to go with a daily build or FL7 (is FL8 out? )
[11:35] <bluefoxicy> neutrinomass:  I can update-manager it up.
[11:36] <bluefoxicy> ....
[11:36] <bluefoxicy> that is awesome.
[11:37] <Hobbsee> neutrinomass: there wont be a flight 8, i'm told
[11:37] <bluefoxicy> dapper is out in a week guys.
[11:37] <bluefoxicy> get real
[11:37] <bluefoxicy> :)
[11:37] <neutrinomass> Hobbsee: That's what I knew, and then there were rumours about it ...
[11:37] <neutrinomass> bluefoxicy: You do have a point there :)
[11:37] <bluefoxicy> so
[11:37] <bluefoxicy> developer's day off is over
[11:38] <bluefoxicy> I guess it's no good inviting anyone to play Armagetron?  :)
[11:38] <bluefoxicy> (I want to install i386 dapper because 3D doesn't work with the 64-bit via driver)
[11:38] <neutrinomass> OT: Why aren't all windows partitions mounted by default ?
[11:39] <Hobbsee> in dapper?  from what i've seen, they are
[11:39] <bluefoxicy> mounted... ro?
[11:39] <Hobbsee> mind you, not mounted usefully...
[11:39] <bluefoxicy> it'd be neat if gnome-vfs mounted flash drives ro
[11:39] <bluefoxicy> and then remounted rw when you tried to write to them
[11:40] <bluefoxicy> right now I think it shows them and mounts when you open them.. it's been bouncing between that and straight out mounting them every update.
[11:40] <neutrinomass> Hobbsee: Wasn't the "only root can do stuff" bug fixed ?   Reload X
[12:49] <crimsun> LaserJock: both have been fine for mee.
[12:49] <crimsun> s/ee/e/
[12:49] <crimsun> LaserJock: did you get sponsorship?
[12:49] <LaserJock> crimsun: yes, I'm trying to pick between to flights now
[12:50] <crimsun> cool, congrats
[12:50] <LaserJock> I'm having a hard time figuring out what the heck the times are
[12:50] <LaserJock> :(
[12:50] <crimsun> it'd be awesome if $work allowed me :(
[12:50] <LaserJock> yeah, I'm taking advantage of being a grad student
[12:50] <LaserJock> I haven't told my advisor yet though ;-)
[12:51] <crimsun> I dunno if tritium has to go through something similar, but we have to request extra-US travel permission ~9 months in advance.
[12:51] <TheMuso> LaserJock: Congrats
[12:51] <LaserJock> crimsun: ugghh
[12:52] <LaserJock> hmm, is it generally recommended to aviod Heathrow?
[12:55] <LaserJock> me neither, I've never really been out of the US. I'm from a small town and one of the flight has me going through LAX, Heathrow, and CDG
[01:00] <crimsun> ugh, lax?
[01:00] <crimsun> that's arse-backward
[01:01] <LaserJock> that happens a lot for Reno, either LAX or San Fransisco
[01:02] <crimsun> oh yeah, you are on the left coast. My frame of reference is skewed. :-)
[01:02] <LaserJock> on flight does do Reno->Houston->Paris
[01:02] <LaserJock> I'm actually west of LA, iirc
[01:04] <crimsun> yeah, makes sense if you're in western NV
[01:04] <LaserJock> I'm having a hard time figuring out the times though
[01:04] <crimsun> flights are listed in the localtime
[01:06] <LaserJock> well, the travel agent seems to have confused 12hr and 24hr time, 12:03 is actually 12:03am I think
[01:06] <crimsun> better call for clarification
[01:07] <LaserJock> oh, meeting time
[01:34] <ajmitch> morning
[01:34] <crimsun> 'morning ajmitch
[01:37] <pianoboy3333> Does anyone here use the python module 'pynotify'?
[01:55] <ajmitch> wow, bddebian is going for core-dev
[01:55] <Laser_away> really? awesome
[01:56] <Laser_away> must be those Main .desktop bugs are getting to him ;-)
[01:56] <ajmitch> heh
[01:56] <ajmitch> he just applied for it a few hours ago, I think
[02:04] <bddebian> Heya gang
[02:04] <tseng> hi
[02:05] <bddebian> Heya tseng, how's it going?
[02:05] <tseng> fine thanks
[02:05] <ajmitch> hi tseng, bddebian
[02:05] <tseng> hi ajmitch
[02:05] <ajmitch> bddebian: decided to go for core-dev, i see
[02:05] <bddebian> Heya ajmitch, what's happening
[02:05] <tseng> bddebian++;
[02:05] <bddebian> ajmitch: Yeah, I thought I'd see how much they laugh at me :-)
[02:05] <ajmitch> heh
[02:06] <bddebian> I just got kicked out of a software conference so my humility is at an all time low anyway ;-)
[02:06] <ajmitch> I'm sure...
[02:07] <ajmitch> so when are you applying to work for canonical?
[02:07] <bddebian> When they move to the US ;-P
[02:08] <bddebian> Actually I'd love to but I don't think they could afford me :-)
[02:08] <ajmitch> heh
[02:09] <tseng> bddebian: isnt that the truth
[02:09] <bddebian> Unless of course I get fired for getting kicked out of the conference, then maybe I'd be cheap ;-P
[02:09] <bddebian> tseng: :-)
[02:09] <tseng> my benefits alone are an assload of $
[02:09] <zul> bddebian: going for core dev? hah good luck! ;)
[02:09] <tseng> haha!
[02:09] <tseng> ouch
[02:10] <zul> heh i would work for canonical if i could work in my boxers
[02:10] <tseng> you could!
[02:10] <tseng> i cant work w/o insurance
[02:10] <zul> i know but if i move to montreal jeff wouldnt let me actually he would
[02:11] <zul> tseng: you have to marry a teacher
[02:11] <tseng> ..what?
[02:12] <tseng> marrying a teacher would put us both in a way high tax bracket at a low teachers pay
[02:12] <tseng> it would be pointless
[02:12] <zul> tseng: im in the same boat but im on my wife's insurance
[02:12] <tseng> i have a good job with good insurance
[02:12] <tseng> canonical is a stressful job with no insurance
[02:13] <zul> ive heard
[02:13] <zul> but you get to travel sometimes
[02:13] <ajmitch> travel, get locked in a hotel for a week of 12+ hour days?
[02:13] <ajmitch> sounds like fun to me :)
[02:13] <tseng> just one of my medications is $800-1000 usd at a time
[02:13] <zul> still
[02:13] <tseng> every 8 weeks
[02:13] <zul> ouch
[02:14] <ajmitch> that starts to get expensive
[02:14] <tseng> yeah it does
[02:14] <tseng> pharmacuticals are a scam
[02:14] <zul> move to canada ;)
[02:14] <tseng> hahaha
[02:14] <tseng> i dont have time to wait for your socialist healthcare system when i am sick
[02:15] <bddebian> hehe
[02:15] <bddebian> zul: What are you trying to say "good luck"? :-)
[02:16] <zul> im just kidding..
[02:16] <ajmitch> bddebian: you'll need it
[02:16] <tseng> i think its illegal to import drugs from canada now
[02:16] <ajmitch> bddebian: enjoy the grilling
[02:16] <zul> ajmitch: yeah it was nasty..
[02:16] <bddebian> ajmitch: I know
[02:16] <tseng> i must be the only one who didnt get grilled
[02:16] <zul> i got semi-grilled
[02:16] <ajmitch> tseng: that's because they like you
[02:16] <tseng> slomo took a beating
[02:16] <bddebian> 'cause you DA MAN :-)
[02:16] <tseng> haha
[02:16] <tseng> right.
[02:17] <bddebian> They'll probably beat me to a pulp :-)
[02:17] <ajmitch> siretart had to answer a few interesting questions
[02:17] <ajmitch> like "what was keybuk's previous hair colour?"
[02:17] <bddebian> hehe
[02:18] <bddebian> I'd be screwed there
[02:18] <ajmitch> we were at UBZ at the time
[02:18] <tseng> it was brown at udu
[02:18] <zul> is it color or colour?
[02:18] <tseng> color.
[02:19] <bddebian> zul: color ;-P
[02:19] <tseng> obviously
[02:19] <bddebian> Heya imbrandon.  Congrats again ;-P
[02:19] <bluefoxicy> direct rendering: Yes
[02:19] <bluefoxicy> How do I make glxgears spit out frames per second
[02:19] <imbrandon> thanks bddebian
[02:19] <bddebian> bluefoxicy: RTFM? ;-)
[02:19] <bluefoxicy> bluefox@icebox:~$ man glxgears
[02:19] <bluefoxicy> No manual entry for glxgears
[02:20] <imbrandon> bluefoxicy: look for something in --help for like "-iackknolagethisisnotabenchmark"
[02:20] <bluefoxicy> bluefox@icebox:~$ glxgears --help
[02:20] <bluefoxicy> Warrning: unknown parameter: --help
[02:20] <imbrandon> hmm one sec
[02:20] <bluefoxicy> also I have direct rendering but glxgears eats 100% CPU and is slow :>
[02:21] <bddebian> glxgears -iacknowledgethatthistoolisnotabenchmark
[02:21] <bluefoxicy> 1717 frames in 5.0 seconds = 343.210 FPS
[02:21] <bluefoxicy> 1838 frames in 5.0 seconds = 367.447 FPS
[02:21] <bluefoxicy> heh
[02:21] <imbrandon> glxgears -iacknowledgethatthistoolisnotabenchmark
[02:21] <imbrandon> hehe
[02:21] <bluefoxicy> how'd you find that
[02:21] <imbrandon> google
[02:22] <bluefoxicy> ah
[02:22] <bddebian> Google, where else :)
[02:22] <bluefoxicy> damn, why is it so slow
[02:22] <bluefoxicy> via driver must be shit.
[02:22] <imbrandon> i goet 450ish on my gforce4 mx400
[02:23] <imbrandon> get*
[02:23] <ajmitch> imbrandon: it says it's not a benchmark...
[02:23] <imbrandon> ajmitch i know, he just wanted to know how to do it ;)
[02:23] <bluefoxicy> normally glxgears is like 20 times faster than normal performance
[02:23] <bluefoxicy> if you get +1000 on glxgears DRI should be working right
[02:23] <bluefoxicy> kind of meaningless but quick and dirty.
[02:24] <bluefoxicy> I ran armagetron and my X server froze due to CPU load
[02:24] <imbrandon> ouch
[02:24] <bluefoxicy> so I'll assume the via driver is not useful :(
[02:24] <lifeless> bluefoxicy: cpu load doesn't cause freezes. bugs do
[02:24] <ajmitch> bluefoxicy: it really means nothing - I get ~200 FPS in glxgears, yet I can play doom3 on this system
[02:24] <bluefoxicy> lifeless:  the mouse moves a bit.... heh.
[02:24] <bluefoxicy> ajmitch:  200fps with 100% CPU usage?
[02:27] <imbrandon> ajmitch true i play ut and such with only 400 to 450 on glxgears
[02:27] <imbrandon> but smooth on ut and tribes
[02:31] <bluefoxicy> hm
[02:33] <bluefoxicy> no composite extension?  o.o
[02:35] <bluefoxicy> no composite still.. how the...
[02:37] <bddebian> zul: BTW, what were you doing with kannel?  Did my upload not work?
[02:37] <zul> bddebian: i was trying to build it at one point
[02:38] <bddebian> Ah OK
[02:42] <bluefoxicy> yeah....... xcompmgr -c causes mass CPU load on dragging a window.
[03:26] <tritium> hi crimsun.  What's the travel question?
[03:30] <bddebian> Heya tritium
[03:30] <tritium> Hey there bddebian
[03:34] <crimsun> tritium: I was chatting w/ LaserJock regarding foreign travel. I mentioned that I don't know if you also have to request permission to travel outside the US well in advance (it's ~9 months for me).
[03:35] <tritium> crimsun: I do, especially to those countries on the "sensitive" list
[03:35] <crimsun> yeah
[03:35] <bluefoxicy> Hey
[03:35] <bluefoxicy> can someone on i386 install wesnoth and see if it has sound?
[03:35] <bluefoxicy> oh wait.
[03:36] <bluefoxicy> It doesn't depend on music, nm, wtf.
[03:55] <sladen> bluefoxicy: sudo apt-get install wesnoth-music
[03:57] <bluefoxicy> yeah got it already
[03:57] <bluefoxicy> I am going to spec something dumb
[03:57] <bluefoxicy> brb.
[04:00] <bluefoxicy> does LPUbuntu (L-P-Ubuntu) sound good for a gaming version of Ubuntu?  (Lan Party...)
[04:08] <DarkMageZ> hmm, that could be interesting
[04:08] <DarkMageZ> what would its main differences be over normal ubuntu?
[04:09] <ajmitch> yet another ubuntu derivative..
[04:10] <DarkMageZ> it would get more games into the repos (good games)
[04:23] <bluefoxicy> DarkMageZ:  writing up a spec, somebody will probably approve it in forever from now but it's fun to throw the idea out there.
[04:25] <ajmitch> whether they'll continue to have everything done in the same way as ubuntu, kubuntu, etc remains to be seen
[04:26] <ajmitch> since some people will want things to be supported that canonical may not want to support at all
[04:27] <imbrandon> true like nUbuntu
[04:27] <bddebian> WTF is nUbuntu?
[04:27] <imbrandon> hacker/cracker ubuntu
[04:27] <imbrandon> lol
[04:27] <imbrandon> its not official and never will be
[04:28] <imbrandon> http://www.nubuntu.com/
[04:29] <bluefoxicy> too bad
[04:30] <bluefoxicy> it'd be nice to have a seed like that.
[04:30] <imbrandon> it will be arround, just not endorced by conical
[04:30] <imbrandon> canonical
[04:30] <bluefoxicy> Yeah
[04:30] <bluefoxicy> too bad.
[04:31] <bluefoxicy> it'd be great to have commercial support for something like that.
[04:38] <ohoel> DarkMageZ: why not just make your own repo for these games?
[04:38] <ohoel> I'm getting sick and tired of all these *ubuntus o.O
[04:39] <imbrandon> ohoel: ;) how true
[04:40] <imbrandon> kinda like all the knoppixes ;)
[05:10] <bluefoxicy> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/lan-party-ubuntu  There, just a passing thought :)
[05:10] <bluefoxicy> In 5 minutes nobody will care.  ;)
[05:28] <bddebian> Heya LaserJock
[05:29] <crimsun> bddebian: so...you're gonna have BdDebianIsAGod linked prominently from wiki/$you, correct? :-)
[05:30] <bddebian> crimsun: Uhm, NO :-)
[05:32] <crimsun> good thing wiki's public :-)
[05:32] <bddebian> Gah
[05:32] <ajmitch> but we'd never do that..
[05:33] <crimsun> pssht, man, you know you've got good karma
[05:33] <ajmitch> soon he'll be replacing sabdfl
[05:33] <bddebian> pshaw
[05:34] <ajmitch> he's got more karma than all the motus put together
[05:35] <bddebian> Oh BS
[05:38] <Kyral> We love you bddebian
[05:38] <bddebian> Heh, heya Kyral
[06:03] <LaserJock> hi bddebian
[06:03] <Hobbsee> hi LaserJock and bddebian
[06:03] <LaserJock> I'm with ajmitch, if bddebian goes core I'm going to be able to retire :-)
[06:03] <Hobbsee> heh
[06:03] <bddebian> Hi Hobbsee
[06:03] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: surely you're not that old :P
[06:04] <bddebian> Hobbsee: They are making fun of me
[06:04] <Hobbsee> should they be?
[06:04] <bddebian> I guess if it makes them happy
[06:04] <Hobbsee> heh
[06:04] <Kyral> GROUP HUG :P
[06:04] <imbrandon> lol
[06:05] <LaserJock> Hobbsee: you don't like use?
[06:05] <Hobbsee> if Kyral's saying it like that, then that probably means a mass squish hug - and i'd like to keep all my bones in one piece thanks!
[06:05] <Hobbsee> sure i do :)
[06:05] <StevenK> Ow!
[06:05] <LaserJock> I put deoderant on today!
[06:05] <Kyral> .....
[06:05] <Hobbsee> heh
[06:05] <Kyral> LaserJock: the fact that you have to declare that....
[06:05] <LaserJock> I combed my hair and everything!
[06:06] <Hobbsee> Kyral: hehe
[06:06] <LaserJock> Kyral: no worries, I'm married
[06:06] <Kyral> THAT MAKES IT WORSE!!
[06:06] <LaserJock> Kyral: my wife wouldn't let me do that
[06:06] <imbrandon> heh
[06:06] <Kyral> roflmao
[06:06] <LaserJock> ouch
[06:06] <Hobbsee> :P
[06:06] <imbrandon> brb lunch time
[06:06] <StevenK> Dear me. Scathing today, aren't we?
[06:07] <Hobbsee> StevenK: whatever gives you that idea?
[06:07] <StevenK> Hobbsee: :-P
[06:08] <StevenK> You do or do not take the M2 to uni?
[06:08] <Hobbsee> dont - no point
[06:08] <Hobbsee> from where i live...it's pointless...
[06:08] <StevenK> Pennant Hills Rd instead?
[06:08] <Hobbsee> i couldnt get on it till around beecroft anyway...
[06:08] <Hobbsee> yeah, then beecroft road
[06:08] <Hobbsee> or via copeland road, beecroft road
[06:09] <StevenK> My mother used to work in Pennant Hills, I really really dislike Pennant Hills Rd.
[06:09] <Hobbsee> heh
[06:09] <StevenK> It's just the M4 in some ways. Something very little happens to one car, and all of sudden, you have total gridlock.
[06:09] <Hobbsee> the lights were out today - well, they stayed permanently red, turning right...had police and ambulances driving past...
[06:09] <StevenK> Just like
[06:09] <Hobbsee> true
[06:09] <Hobbsee> from...ah...boundary road onto pennant hills road
[06:10] <imbrandon> heheh
[06:10] <Hobbsee> heh
[06:10] <StevenK> Heh
[06:11] <StevenK> I tend to guess when I'm lost. I usually guess right.
[06:11] <imbrandon> a girl on teh Intarweb!!111 ?
[06:11] <TheMuso> Meh. Trains all the way. :)
[06:11] <Hobbsee> hush imbrandon
[06:11] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: yeah, bus train bus, for an ordinarily 20-25 min drive...
[06:11] <Hobbsee> lucky
[06:11] <StevenK> imbrandon: No, Hobbsee is a 47 year old man trying to make us believe he is really a teenage girl.
[06:11] <imbrandon> actualy they have that convo going on in -offtopic right now becouse some chick has been there all eve
[06:11] <crimsun> yeah, Hobbsee's a major figure in kubuntu, too.
[06:12] <crimsun> of course you already knew that having gone through the kubuntu membership process.
[06:12] <Hobbsee> heh
[06:12] <imbrandon> ;)
[06:12] <Hobbsee> StevenK: shh....
[06:12] <TheMuso> Hobbsee: Well I don't have any other way of traveling, on public transport that is.
[06:12] <Kyral> Wait wait wait
[06:12] <LaserJock> Hobbsee: my wife finds maps useless but manages to get places just fine
[06:12] <imbrandon> yes i know , Hobbsee is one of the few i interact with a bit on a daily basis ;)
[06:12] <Kyral> now there is a difference between Kubuntu Members and Ubuntu Members?
[06:12] <Hobbsee> Kyral: no, but different people decide them.
[06:12] <TheMuso> Cars are useless to me. :)
[06:12] <StevenK> Kyral: Yes. The Kubuntu people are tainted with KDE.
[06:12] <LaserJock> Kyral: and Edubuntu memebers too
[06:13] <Kyral> StevenK: I use KDE :P
[06:13] <StevenK> TheMuso: Can't or just don't drive?
[06:13] <Kyral> Qt: 3.3.6
[06:13] <Kyral> KDE: 3.5.2
[06:13] <Kyral> kde-config: 1.0
[06:13] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: i mostly succeed with that :P
[06:13] <LaserJock> Hobbsee: bugs I hope
[06:13] <TheMuso> StevenK: Can't drive, and don't look like being able to in the forseeable future.
[06:13] <LaserJock> me too
[06:13] <TheMuso> Meh. THink about the environment guys/girls.
[06:14] <StevenK> TheMuso: We prefer to be on time.
[06:14] <TheMuso> We do kinda need to take care of our planet a bit more.
[06:14] <StevenK> As opposed to fighting with Sh^WCityRail.
[06:14] <TheMuso> One can still be on time with public transport.
[06:14] <crimsun> no, you mean we need to take care of /us/. "The planet's fine; the people are fscked." -- George Carlin.
[06:14] <Hobbsee> StevenK: hehe....good point.  how are the trains at the moment?
[06:14] <StevenK> Hobbsee: I dunno.
[06:14] <TheMuso> Walking is good.
[06:14] <TheMuso> Trains are fine atm.
[06:15] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: right, so they're vaguely on time?
[06:15] <imbrandon> Kyral: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Meetings
[06:15] <TheMuso> I can't remember the time I didn't have one that was not on time, and by that I mean about 3-5 minutes.
[06:15] <StevenK> TheMuso: To get to work for 9am, I either leave home at 8:20 and drive, or get to Blacktown station at 7:40am and train in.
[06:15] <imbrandon> brb , lunch time *clocks out*
[06:15] <imbrandon> lol
[06:15] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: right
[06:16] <Hobbsee> StevenK: heh, exactly.  mine for uni would be similar
[06:16] <StevenK> TheMuso: Yes, but you're at a station that has 3 or 4 lines going through it, and Strathfield being very close.
[06:16] <TheMuso> I do wish the guards would firstly speak more clearly, and announce where the train is going sometimes.
[06:17] <StevenK> Hobbsee and I have the problem where the stations are one line only
[06:17] <TheMuso> StevenK: Yeah true.
[06:17] <TheMuso> I could live with that if I had to.
[06:17] <TheMuso> In fact, I have. I used to live out at Oakville, which is not that far from Riverstone station.
[06:17] <TheMuso> Boy it was fun getting trains from there.
[06:18] <StevenK> Ewww, the Richmond line.
[06:18] <TheMuso> But I always required someone to get me dwn/back to/from the station.
[06:18] <LaserJock> hmm, no train here. I could take a bus but that turns a 10-15 min drive into a 1-1.5 hr ride that goes all over the city :-/
[06:18] <Hobbsee> and dont get me started on the suicidal pedestrians in the evening...
[06:18] <TheMuso> The Richmond line is not *that* bad.
[06:18] <StevenK> Hobbsee: That's a feature of people getting their license from Corn Flakes packets.
[06:18] <LaserJock> lol
[06:18] <TheMuso> heh
[06:18] <Hobbsee> StevenK: you cant anymore - i had to do mine the hard way...
[06:19] <TheMuso> Oh well, I have no choice, so thats how I get around.
[06:19] <StevenK> Hobbsee: You're still a P plater, right?
[06:19] <TheMuso> You guys should consider coming to SLUG one month.
[06:19] <LaserJock> StevenK: here, when people from other states take the written test, if they don't pass they just give them back their old license and they can drive home :-)
[06:19] <Hobbsee> StevenK: yes, reds
[06:19] <StevenK> TheMuso: I should. Sridhar works with me, and keeps hassling me.
[06:19] <TheMuso> Heh.
[06:20] <TheMuso> I should get him to prod you some more. :p
[06:20] <StevenK> Hell, I was on my red Ps in 1999
[06:20] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: that happens here too - for overseas people...
[06:20] <StevenK> Well, 1998-1999
[06:20] <Hobbsee> well, tehy get chucked on provisional licences, depending on how long they've been driving, no test...
[06:20] <Hobbsee> and provisional licences arent very different to normal ones
[06:20] <Hobbsee> except the numbers of demerit points - i try to drive *very* carefully on double demerit days :P
[06:21] <StevenK> Back when I was learning to drive, one had no log book, or two levels of provisional licenses or anything.
[06:21] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Red Ps are still 4?
[06:21] <StevenK> Hobbsee: And when can you jump to greens?
[06:21] <Hobbsee> yes, 4, and 12 months after i first got the P's, ie july 22 this year
[06:22] <LaserJock> hmm, I just took a 100 question multiple choice test and drove around the block with a tester and I had a license
[06:22] <Hobbsee> yeah.  logs books are painful.  then again, dad loved writing in it, so it was good to keep him happy :P
[06:22] <StevenK> It's my sisters birthday...
[06:22] <StevenK> LaserJock: If I remember, the test is 45 questions.
[06:23] <TheMuso> Anybody else here besides LaserJock going to Paris?
[06:23] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Consider yourself lucky. From next year, the number of hours for an L plater goes up from 50 to 100
[06:23] <TheMuso> Ouch.
[06:23] <TheMuso> I guess there is a good reason for it.
[06:23] <Hobbsee> StevenK: yeah, ouch...i would have done about 70 anyway...
[06:23] <StevenK> Yes. People have discovered P platers still can't drive.
[06:23] <Hobbsee> besides, they dont look too closely...
[06:24] <Hobbsee> mind you, i think that i distracted my tester a bit....
[06:24] <Hobbsee> hehe
[06:24] <Hobbsee> StevenK: i've seen some p platers drive - i agree with you
[06:24] <LaserJock> well, they probably wouldn't let me drive over there, I can't drive on the wrong side of the road too well :-)
[06:24] <StevenK> Heh
[06:25] <Hobbsee> StevenK: yeah, it's 45, you have to get 42 of them, although it depends on the sections
[06:26] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: it feels weird driving on your side of the road...
[06:26] <LaserJock> I bet
[06:26] <StevenK> Two sections, 15 being general knowledge, and 30 about road rules. You can get 3 wrong in the first section and none wrong in the 2nd section.
[06:26] <StevenK> I *think*.
[06:26] <Hobbsee> StevenK: no, you can get one wrong in the second section :P
[06:26] <LaserJock> I had a friend that went to .au for 6 months. She had to remember to drive on the right side when she came back :-)
[06:27] <StevenK> Heh.
[06:27] <StevenK> Hobbsee: I suspect you haven't barrelled down the wrong side of Picton Rd overtaking a grandma in anger, then? :-P
[06:27] <Hobbsee> StevenK: never been out that way.
[06:28] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Two lanes, one each way, winding through forest.
[06:28] <Hobbsee> hmmm...i think dad drove an equivalent road to that
[06:28] <StevenK> There's no shortage of them.
[06:28] <TheMuso> I will travel with anybody that I haven't traveled with before once. I will continue to do so unless I feel their driving is unsafe.
[06:29] <TheMuso> Mid you, I am probably not the best judge of safe driving.
[06:29] <TheMuso> s/Mid/Mind
[06:29] <StevenK> I tend to be able to watch someone drive for a five to ten minutes and be able to tell if they can actually drive.
[06:29] <Hobbsee> hehe
[06:30] <TheMuso> heh
[06:30] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Oh, what?
[06:31] <Hobbsee> StevenK: was another friend of mine
[06:31] <Hobbsee> she failed her P's first time, too, which was excellent :P
[06:31] <StevenK> Hobbsee: When the older of my younger sisters told me how I was driving was wrong, I found the relevant part of the DART and waved it at her.
[06:31] <Hobbsee> hehe
[06:31] <imbrandon> lol
[06:32] <Hobbsee> nah, stay and chat :P
[06:32] <StevenK> I can chat from home...
[06:32] <Hobbsee> true
[06:32] <StevenK> It should only take me 20 minutes to get there, too.
[06:32] <Hobbsee> no point leaving now - schoolzones
[06:32] <StevenK> Bah, they just kicked in, too.
[06:32] <Hobbsee> especially the one on epping road
[06:32] <TheMuso> Don't we know it. In our general area, we have no less than 4 schools.
[06:32] <Hobbsee> yep, exactly - why do you think i came hom earlier?
[06:32] <StevenK> I pass one going home.
[06:33] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: lucky.  20-25 min drive, i hit at least 7.
[06:33] <imbrandon> ouch
[06:33] <TheMuso> ooo nice
[06:33] <TheMuso> All these 4 schools are in different areas though and not along the same road etc.
[06:33] <StevenK> I hit one or two.
[06:33] <Hobbsee> at least, because there are a couple that have multiple schools, so are really long...
[06:33] <StevenK> One to and from work, one going home from uni and two going to uni.
[06:34] <TheMuso> Just got the end of this semster at TAFE, and I am done for studying for a while I HOPE>
[06:34] <Hobbsee> (beecroft road, pennant hills road - for a bit, that one's not too bad, as you have to slow down for the lights anyway), epping road, and boundary road)
[06:34] <TheMuso> Unless it is for LPI.
[06:34] <Hobbsee> oh, and one really close to me, which i cant really avoid :P
[06:35] <StevenK> The school zone near me is very close to my house, so I have the same problem.
[06:37] <Hobbsee> they're the ones really in danger!
[06:37] <Hobbsee> epping station, coming towards mobil/carlingford road, from the bridge - people standing on the double white lines, cars everywhere.   stupid people.
[06:38] <Hobbsee> there's an overhead crossing there, too!  so they have no excuse@
[06:38] <DBO> Hobbsee, I work on a college campus, I have to dodge students all the time =P
[06:38] <Hobbsee> hehe
[06:38] <bddebian> Ack, I gotta get to bed.
[06:40] <imbrandon> lol
[06:40] <StevenK> Hah, $name
[06:41] <StevenK> Like it's hard to find out your first name. :-P
[06:41] <imbrandon> python lol
[06:41] <Hobbsee> you had quorum - you didnt need them...
[06:41] <Hobbsee> er, me
[06:41] <Hobbsee> StevenK: i know
[06:41] <imbrandon>  /whois Hobbsee
[06:41] <Hobbsee> er....
[06:41] <StevenK> That won't do it.
[06:41] <Hobbsee> hah.
[06:42] <imbrandon> true but the wiki will or umm the mailing list(s)
[06:42] <ajmitch> looking at the irc logs from the meeting today will :P
[06:42] <StevenK> Heh
[06:42] <Hobbsee> true
[06:42] <imbrandon> heh i lost my logs , speaking of which , you have a copy Hobbsee and i'll stick them on a wiki entry
[06:42] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: i'm reading a copy now...
[06:42] <imbrandon> k
[06:43] <StevenK> The last time I got up at 7am for a meeting was the CC meeting.
[06:43] <imbrandon> OdyX was supose to do some minutes for it but i dont think he got arround to it
[06:43] <StevenK> mdz's spotlight scorched my tired eyes.
[06:43] <Hobbsee> next semester i'll demand that they get put later, fi they want me there
[06:43] <imbrandon> ;)
[06:44] <TheMuso> Hobbsee: Nice of you to consider people living all round the world who want to attend the meeting.
[06:44] <imbrandon> yea even though i'm in a diffrent timezone that was still my sleeping time
[06:44] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: yeah, i know...there doesnt seem to be *that* many people in the US
[06:44] <ajmitch> TheMuso: but she's an Important Person now
[06:44] <Hobbsee> besides, freeflying can never make our meetings...
[06:44] <Hobbsee> hehe...yes, that's the only reason i asked for it
[06:46] <TheMuso> Oh right
[06:46] <Hobbsee> well, while raphink was there, anyway
[06:47] <TheMuso> So what is the purpose of the Kubuntu community council?
[06:47] <imbrandon> to take the kde people load of the ubuntu cc ;)
[06:49] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: the idea was that the CC has to go over so many memberships, when tehy dont really know the people - so the kcc is to decide the memberships, and to vote on kubuntu specific stuff...
[06:49] <Hobbsee> but not stuff that's still the tech board's domain, of course
[06:49] <Kyral> Night people
[06:49] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: it became very hard to establish agreement with around 20 people...
[06:49] <imbrandon> gnight Kyral
[06:49] <TheMuso> Right.
[06:49] <Hobbsee> night Kyral
[06:52] <TheMuso> So if you are a kubuntu member, are you an ubuntu member as well?
[06:52] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: yes
[06:52] <TheMuso> Right.
[06:52] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: the way it used to be, Riddel*l would do the kubuntu membership, but the real membership stuff would be with ubuntu members, and CC...
[06:53] <Hobbsee> so now we do it, instead of them - and we tend to know the people :P
[06:53] <TheMuso> Fair enough.
[06:54] <TheMuso> Are there really heaps of people applying every couple of weeks?
[06:55] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: in the CC?  there's other business as well
[06:55] <TheMuso> Yeah I know.
[06:56] <TheMuso> But I am just curious as to whether most of that time is now spent on membership applicants.
[06:56] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: well...we had nothing to discuss today in ours...well, hardly anything...so...
[06:57] <TheMuso> hehe
[06:57] <Hobbsee> in the CC?  it tends not to be...oh i dont know...
[06:57] <TheMuso> Fair enough.
[06:57] <Hobbsee> seeing as they like being set during the early hours of the morning - like from about 3am onwards...
[06:58] <TheMuso> I noticed.
[07:01] <imbrandon> ;)
[07:01] <TheMuso> Back in the days before Launchpad.
[07:03] <imbrandon> ;)
[07:03] <Hobbsee> it seems weird to me that so soon after that, i get to listen to the cheering :P
[07:15] <imbrandon> uht ohh
[07:15] <StevenK> Ow
[07:17] <Hobbsee> hehe..whcih were they?
[07:17] <StevenK> 1) You'd think a van with "Urgent Medical Supplies" on the back would go faster than 45km/h.
[07:18] <StevenK> 2) Being stuck behind two, count 'em, two L platers on the Great Western Hwy for a few sets of lights.
[07:18] <Hobbsee> hehe
[07:18] <Hobbsee> yeah, L platers are great like that :P
[07:20] <imbrandon> ummm ok for us in the US wth is a l plater ?
[07:21] <ajmitch> learner driver
[07:21] <imbrandon> ahh
[07:21] <StevenK> I was going to say, "Someone who can't drive", but that doesn't narrow it down much.
[07:21] <imbrandon> haha
[07:21] <Hobbsee> hehe
[07:30] <freeflying> imbrandon: congrats, you r the first member approved under KC  :)
[07:30] <imbrandon> thanks freeflying
[08:03] <imbrandon> he its actualy quiet in all the chans tonight
[08:03] <Hobbsee> it's tuesday...not sure why...
[08:06] <Hobbsee> hehe
[08:07] <imbrandon> heh
[08:07] <Hobbsee> slackern: back in the naughty corner!
[08:07] <slackern> *roar*
[08:07] <Hobbsee> *waves pitchfork threateningly
[08:07] <Hobbsee> good slackern
[08:08] <slackern> *a tendril of drool runs downs slackerns cheek*
[08:08] <slackern> heh maybe time for a ubuntu-roleplay chan :)
[08:08] <imbrandon> haha
[08:08] <crimsun> "the calm before the storm", or rather, "the eye in the storm"
[08:09] <Hobbsee> hehe
[08:11] <Hobbsee> hehe
[08:11] <imbrandon> haha
[08:12] <ajmitch> I'll want more than that
[08:12] <Hobbsee> flaming torch?
[08:12] <ajmitch> I want to play... global thermonuclear war
[08:12] <imbrandon> horay install cd ?
[08:13] <Hobbsee> none of that!
[08:13] <ajmitch> you spoil all my fun
[08:13] <slackern> I got to show off a breezy install yesterday to a guy who i actually went to help to reinstall windows, now he wants me to come back when dapper is released and install it on both his machines :)
[08:13] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: yep, i'm here to make your life miserable :P
[08:13] <imbrandon> nice
[08:13] <Hobbsee> yay!
[08:13] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: wonderful..
[08:13] <slackern> he was mighty impressed of breezy on a celeron 333mhz with 4.3gb harddrive and 196mb ram.
[08:14] <slackern> but it was kind of painful since his monitor only has 800x600 as a max resolution
[08:14] <imbrandon> ouch
[08:15] <slackern> so some of the default applications like synaptic didn't adept to the resolution properly but ended up underneat the panel
[08:25] <dholbach> good morning motu world!
[08:26] <imbrandon> heya dholbach
[08:26] <dholbach> hey imbrandon
[08:26] <Gloubiboulga> hello dholbach
[08:26] <dholbach> imbrandon: I saw you were starting Edubuntu/Kubuntu test plans - do you have any ideas for that?
[08:26] <dholbach> hey Gloubiboulga
[08:27] <dholbach> Gloubiboulga: how does xubuntu look for release?
[08:27] <imbrandon> dholbach: i was getting them ready for RC ( mainly the kubuntu ones ) im gonna finish those sections up later tonight
[08:27] <Gloubiboulga> dholbach, not bad, still a few bugs, bug it's in a really good shape
[08:27] <imbrandon> Riddell: ask me to look into it today at the meeting
[08:27] <Gloubiboulga> s/bug /but /
[08:28] <dholbach> Gloubiboulga: that's my feeling too - i'll do a ppc install later on
[08:28] <dholbach> imbrandon: nice - when I wrote the test plans initially, I made sure, that they were generic, so that all the distro flavours could use them
[08:28] <dholbach> imbrandon: it's nice to see some work on that
[08:28] <imbrandon> ;)
[08:29] <imbrandon> just just a few minor diffrences
[08:29] <imbrandon> not many at all
[08:29] <Hobbsee> hi dholbach - do we have a new list yet?
[08:30] <dholbach> Hobbsee: not yet - sorry
[08:30] <dholbach> but main is done - YAY!
[08:31] <imbrandon> ;)
[08:34] <Hobbsee> dholbach: yay!
[08:34] <dholbach> Hobbsee: i'll do a ubuntu-artwork update and look into it after that
[08:34] <Hobbsee> dholbach: are we going to run into it being too close to release to change all this?
[08:34] <Hobbsee> okay
[08:36] <crimsun> I'm still awaiting the bright orange warty-final-ubuntu.png. :-)
[08:36] <imbrandon> heh
[08:37] <imbrandon> i serouisly think i'm gonna package up this theme in a deb though and put it on my website, mainly so i dont have to redo all the little pieces every time i reload ( which seems like once a week lately )
[08:44] <slackern> imbrandon: got a screensot of the theme?
[08:44] <slackern> screenshot
[08:45] <imbrandon> yea one sec ....
[08:45] <slackern> always fun to see what other people use. :)
[08:45] <imbrandon> this is a week or so old but still close to the same
[08:45] <imbrandon> http://imbrandon.sytes.net/misc/snapshot1.png
[08:46] <slackern> ahh hehe xp mediacenter theme, whats the horrible icon i see on the desktop? :)
[08:47] <imbrandon> heh i use that to look at how broken my websites are in IE
[08:47] <imbrandon> thats all
[08:47] <imbrandon> firefox day to day
[08:47] <imbrandon> ;)
[08:47] <slackern> Almost got me scared :)
[08:48] <imbrandon> i dont use the nero either, i was compareing it to k3b though, its also uninstalled
[08:48] <DarkMageZ> i don't check my php under IE, solong as the output is w3c compliant, works under firefox & opera, then i'm done
[08:49] <imbrandon> i check it to make sure its not TOTALY broken, but dont change anything unless its just unuseable
[08:51] <DarkMageZ> has it ever been totally broken?
[08:52] <DarkMageZ> ie isn't horrid standards wise, it's just bad
[08:54] <imbrandon> a few times with the css overlays it has, not often
[09:46] <seth|lappy> that's so violent :(
[09:46] <seth|lappy> couldn't you just... politely move her out of the way?
[09:46] <seth|lappy> :P
[09:46] <Hobbsee> hehe
[09:46] <Hobbsee> i could...
[09:47] <Mithrandir> but you were in a rage, so you didn't?
[09:47] <ajmitch> morning Mithrandir
[09:47] <Mithrandir> good morning ajmitch
[09:47] <Hobbsee> hi Mithrandir
[09:47] <Hobbsee> oops.
[09:47] <Hobbsee> hehe!
[09:47] <ajmitch> now don't do that
[09:47] <Mithrandir> hiya Hobbsee.  How's it south of the equator today?
[09:48] <ajmitch> evening Yagisan
[09:48] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: damned cold!!!
[09:48] <ajmitch> FSVO 'cold'
[09:48] <Mithrandir> only +25C?
[09:48] <Hobbsee> FSVO?
[09:48] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: 15C
[09:48] <Mithrandir> for some value of
[09:48] <Hobbsee> ah
[09:48] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: I explained that to you yesterday :P
[09:48] <Hobbsee> i know you did
[09:49] <Mithrandir> +15C is nice and warm.  T-shirt and shorts weather.
[09:49] <Hobbsee> i blame it on being woken up this morning.
[09:49] <Hobbsee> maybe for those of you who are not skin and bone...
[09:49] <Yagisan> G'day ajmitch
[09:49] <Mithrandir> waking up in the morning is usually considered a good thing, compared with the alternatives.
[09:49] <Yagisan> I prefer the evening myself
[09:50] <Mithrandir> heh
[09:51] <Yagisan> ajmitch: do you know if it is possible to check for ssp from a configure script ?
[09:51] <ajmitch> Yagisan: I don't have experience with it, sorry
[09:51] <Mithrandir> Yagisan: ssp as in?
[09:52] <Yagisan> Mithrandir: Stack Smashing Protection in GCC-4.1
[09:52] <Mithrandir> look in gcc -dumpspecs or something?
[09:54] <Hobbsee> Yagisan: exactly :P
[09:55] <Hobbsee> oh, so it's gone down has it...great
[09:55] <Yagisan> Hobbsee: yeah. it's dropping quickly
[09:56] <Hobbsee> brrr...and i'm going out tonight...
[09:57] <Yagisan> Hobbsee: where ? I'm strongly considering not going shopping today
[09:58] <Hobbsee> Yagisan: out to a friends place
[09:58] <Yagisan> Hobbsee: why ? they are all here :-P
[09:58] <imbrandon> heh
[09:59] <imbrandon> life > computer
[09:59] <Hobbsee> there are some here, yes :P
[09:59] <Hobbsee> hehe
[09:59] <Hobbsee> the trouble with that is, is that you start meeting people from the computer, who suddenly exist in life too...and that seems weird
[09:59] <imbrandon> hahaha
[09:59] <ajmitch> huh? life?
[10:00] <imbrandon> or you hear their voice before 7am ;)
[10:00] <Hobbsee> hehe
[10:00] <Hobbsee> it was 7.01, according to my phone :P
[10:00] <imbrandon> heh
[10:00] <Hobbsee> but that too
[10:00] <Hobbsee> *kills ndiswrapper again*
[10:00] <Hobbsee> *and again*
[10:01] <Hobbsee> thanks, that's what i'm using..
[10:01] <imbrandon> ndiswrapper for sounds ?
[10:01] <imbrandon> thought it only worked for nic cards
[10:02] <Hobbsee> no, i was just trying killing it off, seeing if that made the sound work
[10:02] <imbrandon> ohh
[10:23] <ajmitch> sigh, destructive wiki gnomes on the loose again
[10:23] <ajmitch> well not so much destructive, as creating random junk :P
[10:25] <imbrandon> heh
[10:26] <ajmitch> ah, and renaming a page or too
[10:26] <ajmitch> s/too/two/
[10:34] <dholbach> hum
[10:34] <dholbach> now hobbsee left
[10:34] <dholbach> I update http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DhIconCacheChanges
[10:34] <imbrandon> she said she had somewhere to be tonight
[10:34] <dholbach> don't make me do it again
[10:34] <imbrandon> lol
[10:34] <dholbach> I downloaded myriads of packages and dpkg -e'd them all
[10:35] <dholbach> so get cracking on those - that's easy stuff :-)
[10:35] <ajmitch> heh
[10:36] <imbrandon> k will do, heheh give me something to do today
[10:36] <imbrandon> jez there is a ton of them lol
[10:44] <dholbach> if you want you can link the debdiffs there or assign bugs to motureviewers - as you like
[10:46] <imbrandon> ok will do, and i removed all the uploaded packages
[10:46] <imbrandon> easier to see whats not done
[10:46] <Gloubiboulga> all the xfce packages are ok AFAIK (checking)
[10:48] <dholbach> oops
[10:48] <imbrandon> remove the xfce ones ?
[10:49] <dholbach> sorry no
[10:49] <Gloubiboulga> dholbach, are you sure that you shouldnt s/don't// ? :)
[10:49] <dholbach> <- moron
[10:50] <dholbach> yeah, was the other way around
[10:50] <dholbach> easy to remedy
[10:55] <dholbach> have a look again, if that list now makes more sense
[10:56] <imbrandon> ahhh much
[10:56] <Gloubiboulga> yep :)
[10:57] <imbrandon> ktorrent is main isnt it?
[10:57] <dholbach> oh well, then it seems to need fixing too
[10:58] <imbrandon> hehe np was just wondering .... i got a debdiff for it right now
[10:59] <imbrandon> dholbach: can you upload main ? http://ubuntustuff.sytes.net/devel/dapper/ktorrent-dh_iconcache.debdiff
[10:59] <dholbach> imbrandon: does it still build and make the world happy? :)
[11:00] <imbrandon> yup ;)
[11:01] <dholbach> hrm, patch doesn't apply
[11:01] <imbrandon> i did that a few days ago, lemme redo it
[11:01] <dholbach> yeah
[11:02] <dholbach> imbrandon: and do it before dh_builddeb
[11:02] <imbrandon> k
[11:02] <dholbach> imbrandon: for example after dh_installdocs or something
[11:02] <imbrandon> sounds good
[11:05] <imbrandon> ahh yea Riddell did a change since i made that diff, redoing it
[11:09] <imbrandon> ok dholbach here is the new one http://ubuntustuff.sytes.net/devel/dapper/ktorrent-dh_iconcache.debdiff  , the rest i do today i'll make in one back for someone to upload later tonight
[11:09] <imbrandon> batch*
[11:09] <dholbach> imbrandon: you rock
[11:10] <imbrandon> ;) heheh not yet but soon i hope ;)
[11:11] <dholbach> imbrandon: uploaded
[11:11] <imbrandon> kool, yea this time instead of putting "uploaded" on the wiki i'm just gonna remove the line
[11:11] <imbrandon> will make it easy to read
[11:11] <imbrandon> or mabey add it to the bottom "finished" list ?
[11:13] <dholbach> however you like
[11:47] <imbrandon> [04:42]  <imbrandon> hmmm
[11:47] <imbrandon> [04:42]  <imbrandon> why would i get this
[11:47] <imbrandon> [04:42]  <imbrandon> E: Build-dependencies for kbabel could not be satisfied.
[11:47] <imbrandon> [04:42]  <imbrandon> pkgs missing in repos ?
[11:47] <imbrandon> [04:43]  <imbrandon> that was with apt-get build-dep kbabel
[11:47] <ajmitch> imbrandon: they appear to all be there
[11:48] <imbrandon> hmm
[11:48] <ajmitch> as in, apt-get build-dep kbabel doesn't throw an error for me
[11:48] <imbrandon> k
[11:48] <Gloubiboulga> imbrandon, I'm building the package
[11:48] <imbrandon> i might need to update
[11:49] <imbrandon> lol
[11:49] <Gloubiboulga> it's part of the kdesdk source package
[11:49] <imbrandon> ahh yes apt-get update seemed to fix it
[12:03] <\sh> moins
[12:05] <ajmitch> hi \sh
[12:21] <dholbach> i would appreciate it, if somebody could file another round of UNMETDEPS bugs
[12:21] <dholbach> seems there are a couple to fix still
[12:21] <dholbach> (apart from those that are open)
[12:21] <dholbach> http://daniel.holba.ch/bzr/massfile is the bzr branch of the massfile script
[12:21] <ajmitch> dholbach: how about FTBFS? I think infinity was compiling a list of those
[12:21] <dholbach> ajmitch: ask him
[12:21] <magnon> my god, the network applet icons are annoying today :)
[12:22] <dholbach> magnon: which ones are that?
[12:23] <magnon> the network monitor
[12:24] <dholbach> magnon: do you mean the space that is too much there?
[12:24] <magnon> the idle state icon is 1px up and to the left compared to the transferring state ones
[12:24] <magnon> so it moves all the time :)
[12:25] <dholbach> magnon: can you follow up on bug 45658 with that information?
[12:25] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 45658 in ubuntu-artwork "Human netstatus icone" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/45658
[12:25] <dholbach> so i can pass that on?
[12:25] <magnon> oh sure
[12:27] <defrysk> does anyone know about the mdf2iso patch for "file too large" ?
[12:27] <defrysk> http://developer.berlios.de/patch/index.php?func=detailpatch&patch_id=665&group_id=2545
[12:27] <defrysk> I found it after I also had that "file too large prob in ubuntu
[12:28] <defrysk> so I grabbed file2iso from here http://www.slackware.com/~alien/slackbuilds/mdf2iso/ , made .deb with alien and it worked fine again
[12:29] <defrysk> mdf2iso that is
[12:29] <defrysk> its a patched version, I hope you guys can also patch mdf2iso for debian, thank .
[12:31] <defrysk> also read ; http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/showthread.php?t=438219
[12:33] <ajmitch> will take a look at it
[12:33] <defrysk> ajmitch, thanks :)
[12:33] <ajmitch> usually the best way to get these in is filing a bug on malone
[12:34] <defrysk> ajmitch, agree but was bust and decided to do a quick post here :)
[12:34] <zakame> hi all
[12:34] <defrysk> bust = busy
[12:34] <Toadstool> hi motus
[12:35] <ajmitch> hi Toadstool
[12:35] <Toadstool> hi ajmitch
[12:36] <ajmitch> well that was a quick bug report :P
[12:36] <ajmitch> not even enough time to get a name for the changelog
[12:37] <Toadstool> :)
[12:37] <zakame> hi Toadstool ajmitch
[12:37] <ajmitch> hey zakame
[12:37] <ajmitch> how's it going?
[12:37] <Toadstool> heya zakame
[12:37] <zakame> here I am, looking at lubungif4 and cvs
[12:38] <zakame> *libungif4
[12:38] <ajmitch> heh
[12:38] <ajmitch> well mdf2iso was a quick patch, applied cleanly
[12:40] <imbrandon> someone wanna do a few uploads for me ? ( 4 small ones )
[12:45] <sladen> imbrandon: should you probably post the names of the packages
[12:46] <imbrandon> http://ubuntustuff.sytes.net/devel/dapper/
[12:46] <imbrandon> digikam kiso klamav kmess
[12:48] <imbrandon> if someone has a few minutes
[12:48] <imbrandon> ;)
[01:51] <imbrandon> heh whom ever whats to upload ;)
[01:52] <imbrandon> wants*
[01:52] <imbrandon> http://ubuntustuff.sytes.net/devel/dapper/    <-- a few debdiffs i just finished
[01:53] <imbrandon> k
[02:00] <ajmitch> this'll be a painful upload
[02:00] <ajmitch> 20MB source tarball, 20MB of binary packages
[02:19] <lifeless> ajmitch: rocking!
[02:20] <ajmitch> lifeless: ?
[02:20] <lifeless> 40Mb upload
[02:20] <ajmitch> ah right
[02:20] <ajmitch> I prefer source-only ubuntu uploads
[02:22] <sladen> imbrandon: http://ubuntustuff.sytes.net/devel/dapper/digikam-dh_iconcache.debdiff is empty
[02:23] <sladen> imbrandon: as are the rest, except for  kdissert-dh_iconcache.debdiff
[02:23] <imbrandon> most are just rebuilds for Riddell but he took care of them
[02:23] <imbrandon> a few minutes ago
[02:24] <imbrandon> the rebuilds use a new kde.mk when built
[02:24] <imbrandon> no in the diff
[02:24] <Riddell> imbrandon: I've uploaded, please check back to make sure they all build ok
[02:24] <imbrandon> its on the build server
[02:24] <imbrandon> ok
[02:24] <Riddell> it's in cdbs
[02:25] <Riddell> ajmitch: why are you uploading binary packages?
[02:25] <ajmitch> Riddell: debian?
[02:25] <Riddell> ah, right
[03:00] <phanatic> hi people
[03:01] <ajmitch> hi
[03:03] <Hobbsee> hi phanatic
[03:03] <phanatic> hey Hobbsee, i forgot to congratulate for kubuntu council membership ;)
[03:03] <Hobbsee> phanatic: thanks (how's everyone found out???)
[03:04] <ajmitch> there are no secrets around here
[03:04] <phanatic> Hobbsee: it was announced on -announce or -deve-announce
[03:04] <Hobbsee> scary.  i didnt see a major annoucement though
[03:04] <Hobbsee> ah...
[03:05] <ajmitch> devel-announce
[03:09] <Hobbsee> oh, so that did get cross-posted...okay then...
[03:13] <ajmitch> well, only 8 open bugs assigned to me now
[03:14] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: congratulations!
[03:15] <ajmitch> there will be more
[03:15] <imbrandon> gnight all
[03:15] <ajmitch> since there are 21 open on f-spot still
[03:41] <ajmitch> dholbach: still want the source from bug 33393 to be uploaded?
[03:41] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 33393 in gnome-phone-manager "uvf exception 0.6 -> 0.7" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/33393
[04:09] <bddebian> Heya gang
[04:09] <Toadstool> hi bddebian
[04:09] <bddebian> Hi Toadstool
[04:09] <bddebian> dholbach: ping?
[04:09] <ajmitch> hello bddebian
[04:09] <ferronica> any one here using ADSL modem ??
[04:09] <bddebian> Heya ajmitch
[04:10] <ferronica> which is connected via phone line
[04:10] <ferronica> need help please
[04:10] <bddebian> ferronica: Have you tried asking in #ubuntu?
[04:11] <ferronica> bddebian:: they banned me :(
[04:12] <ajmitch> I wonder why
[04:12] <ferronica> bddebian:: Is there any way to join channel again from last 2 days i am unable to join the channel???
[04:12] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: you can't do that
[04:12] <bddebian> ferronica: Probably not if you were banned.  That is usually not taken lightly
[04:13] <ferronica> bddebian:: If i change my nick name then??
[04:14] <ajmitch> :P
[04:23] <dholbach> bddebian: pong
[04:23] <dholbach> ajmitch: yes
[04:23] <bddebian> dholbach: Has anyone hit that openswan patch yet?
[04:25] <dholbach> bddebian: no idea, not that i've heard
[04:25] <bddebian> You just don't love me anymore :'-(
[04:26] <tseng> hah
[04:27] <dholbach> bddebian: pffft :-)
[04:27] <bddebian> :-)
[04:27] <bddebian> You see how bad it is.  I put my name on the list for main and they cancel the meeting. ;-P
[04:32] <bddebian> Isn't there some utility to rip DOS cr/lf from a file?
[04:33] <ogra> bddebian, sudo apt-get install tofrodos
[04:33] <ajmitch> or flip
[04:33] <bddebian> thx
[04:34] <ogra> or use vim :)
[04:34] <bddebian> Well nano converts it but it doesn't save it does it?
[04:34] <tseng> it doesnt convert it
[04:34] <tseng> it just understands it
[04:34] <ajmitch> dholbach: ok, gnome-phone-manager uploaded
[04:35] <dholbach> rock on
[04:35] <ajmitch> we'll get this bug count down yet...
[04:37] <bddebian> dholbach: Who do I credit for that patch?
[04:37] <dholbach> bddebian: I think it was Dave Miller
[04:40] <Kyral_Laptop> Morning....
[04:42] <ajmitch> hello
[04:51] <bddebian> Heya Kyral
[04:58] <kagou> hi
[05:01] <kagou> when you ask for  "diffstat of the upstream tarballs" for an UVF process, do i do a "diff -Nru  foo-1.0/ foo-2.0/ | diffstat" on fresh and clean dirs or on dirs with debian modifications (debian subdir ...) ?
[05:05] <bddebian> kagou: Yes
[05:06] <bddebian> On clean dirs
[05:06] <kagou> bddebian: tanks
[05:06] <kagou> bddebian: tHanks ^_^
[05:06] <ajmitch> Msgs:42310 New:31212
[05:06] <bddebian> ajmitch: Fix them all :-)
[05:06] <ajmitch> only 30K unread :)
[05:06] <bddebian> eeks
[05:07] <kagou> bddebian: last question with version
[05:07] <ajmitch> I get lots of mail come in & use filtering to see what I need
[05:07] <bddebian> kagou: Shoot
[05:07] <kagou> do i put an ubuntu on ? like foo-8.1-ubuntu N
[05:08] <bddebian> kagou: Is this from Debian or upstream?
[05:08] <kagou> bddebian: i do upstream (dapper and debian are equal)
[05:08] <kagou> ufraw is 0.5+cvs20051021-1
[05:08] <kagou> i make 0.8.1
[05:09] <bddebian> kagou: No, leave it 0.8.1.     Gnight ajmitch :-)
[05:43] <ajmitch> yeah, I'll get back to bugs tomorrow
[05:43] <ajmitch> night
[05:55] <kane77> not sure if I'm talking to the right forum... I need to know where I find some documentation about a screen cap (PrtScr) as I'm planning to create a program...
[05:55] <kane77> *possibly a source of how it's done...
[06:07] <bddebian> kane77: Sorry but this is bad timing, we are WAY busy for release.  A great start would probably be the Debian New Maintainers guide or the package building tips on the Ubuntu wiki pages.
[06:11] <shenki> sladen: ping?
[06:12] <crimsun> kane77: apt-get source gnome-utils, and look at the source to gnome-screenshot
[06:13] <crimsun> kane77: there are numerous utilities; another example is import from imagemagick
[06:23] <bddebian> Heya LaserJock
[06:26] <LaserJock> hi bddebian
[06:26] <LaserJock> how's it going?
[06:26] <LaserJock> has the TB meeting been canceled?
[06:30] <bddebian> Yes :-(
[06:32] <LaserJock> hmm, bummer
[06:51] <Gloubiboulga> dholbach, could you upload kdesdk with my wonderful patch: http://gauvain.tuxfamily.org/kdesdk_iconcache.debdiff ?
[06:51] <Gloubiboulga> it's for dh_iconcache, it builds fine in pbuilder, but it's in main
[06:51] <bddebian> Gloubiboulga: :-)
[06:51] <Gloubiboulga> bddebian, I've tried, but the package has been rejected :p
[06:52] <bddebian> I HATE when that happens ;-)
[06:53] <LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: you could ask Riddell or raphink too since they are the KDE core-devs
[06:53] <dholbach> Gloubiboulga: that patch doesn'T help
[06:53] <dholbach> Gloubiboulga: you just change the changelog
[06:54] <Riddell> Gloubiboulga: kdesdk has its own kde.mk file
[06:54] <Gloubiboulga> oh yep, indeed...
[06:54] <Gloubiboulga> ok, I prepare a new diff
[06:55] <Gloubiboulga> a chance it's been rejected...
[07:26] <Tonio_> hello
[08:14] <LaserJock> ack, how do I get diff to ignore .svn directories?
[08:15] <crimsun> LaserJock: with the magical -x option.
[08:16] <LaserJock> crimsun: doh, I was using -I
[08:21] <crimsun> someone needs to punch that tsume feller right where the spleen is
[08:21] <tseng> he was a dick on #mono for months
[08:21] <tseng> before we finally got rid of him
[08:23] <shutdownrunner> why do I get errors while building a .deb package, whereas ./configure, make, etc don't give any errors. The errors are http://pastebin.com/731819
[09:10] <allee> shutdownrunner: check debian/rules and the other files below debian/.  For patches and special configure args
[09:11] <shutdownrunner> allee:could the fact that ./configure detects my system as i686, and dpkg-architecture as i486 cause any problems?
[09:14] <allee> shutdownrunner: I doubt. unresolved symobls seem to indicates that a lib is missing in linker line.
[09:14] <bddebian> re
[09:16] <shutdownrunner> allee:ok. thanks.  If I execute ./configure and then fakeroot debian/rules binary I don't get any such errors. But with full debuild....
[09:47] <allee> shutdownrunner: compare the linker line that fails in debuild with the one of configure;debian/rules binary
[09:47] <allee> shutdownrunner: have a look into rules what configure options are used
[09:48] <crimsun> kagou: there's not much point in a uvfe req now...
[09:51] <LaserJock> yeah, are we pretty much closed for UVFe requests?
[09:52] <bddebian> Nah ;-P
[09:52] <shutdownrunner> allee:thanks. I didn't think of it before. I removed CFLAGS="$(CFLAGS) -Wl,-z,defs" that were before ./configure in rules file
[09:53] <shutdownrunner> allee:I mean I'll try to see what is the exact cause of the problem, but now at least I know where to look for it.
[09:58] <allee> shutdownrunner: if -z defs is the problem then report upstream.  they miss a lib (see also man ld)
[09:58] <crimsun> LaserJock: no, that was prior to me reading daniel's latest comment.
[10:01] <crimsun> geez, I don't touch sound/ for a couple days, and this is what I've had to merge:
[10:01] <crimsun>  7 files changed, 14 insertions(+), 31 deletions(-)
[10:01] <shutdownrunner> allee:I don't have that many parameters. Only -Wall (which shouldn't cause any problems), -g (I don't know what this one does) and -O2 (this shouldn't cause any problems either)
[10:07] <allee> shutdownrunner: back (had to reboot)
[10:07] <crimsun> shutdownrunner: -g is for debug symbols
[10:08] <shutdownrunner> allee: you were right about -z . I get " -z: linker input file unused because linking not done"
[10:10] <bddebian> So, do we have an "official" FTBFS list somewhere now?
[10:11] <allee> shutdownrunner: these warning are due --mode compile one line up.  Not the --mode link that fails
[10:13] <allee> shutdownrunner: I'm almost sure upstream just forgot some -l<libname>
[10:14] <allee> shutdownrunner: propably they are loaded indirectly via other shared libs so without -z defs it's okay
[10:14] <allee> shutdownrunner: welcome to: proper relibtoolizations are fun ;)
[10:15] <crimsun> for values of fun that include a blunt spade and a gimp mask.
[10:15] <shutdownrunner> allee: at least I can create a package now. I'll have to read sth more about cflags. so far plain ./configure --prefix=/usr was enough for me:)
[10:16] <allee> crimsun:  :)
[10:29] <LaserJock> bddebian: not that I know of
[10:42] <dholbach> good night
[10:42] <crimsun> 'night daniel
[10:52] <phanatic> hey raphink
[10:53] <raphink> hi phanatic
[10:53] <phanatic> raphink: may i msg you?
[10:53] <raphink> sure do
[10:54] <raphink> I might not answer, but you may msg ;)
[10:54] <bddebian> aaaahhhh
[10:54] <bddebian> crimsun: You bored?
[10:55] <crimsun> bddebian: I have a presentation in an hour, so no, but what's up?
[10:55] <bddebian> Never mind then
[10:55] <bddebian> This ivtools thing is just pissing me off
[12:16] <persia> My last change to gnome-phone-manager was uploaded (thank you), but missed a patch.  Could someone please upload the patch from bug #46220 to allow the program to run?
[12:16] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46220 in gnome-phone-manager "cellphone.png missing" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46220
[12:24] <phanatic> 'night all
[12:31] <crimsun> persia: done.
[12:40] <persia> crimsun: Thanks a lot.
[01:17] <zul> did someone get an exception for this? https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/dapper-changes/2006-May/011467.html
[01:19] <LaserJock> zul: I would think so
[01:19] <zul> ok...yeah i just checked the logs
[01:20] <zul> later
[01:21] <bddebian> re
[01:28] <ajmitch> of course there was an exception for it.. :)
[01:29] <bddebian> Suuure ajmitch :-)
[01:29] <ajmitch> :P
[01:29] <bddebian> Troublemaker ;-P
[01:29] <LaserJock> ajmitch: ah, I wondered who uploaded it
[01:29] <ajmitch> I may be incompetent, but I'm not *that* bad
[01:31] <bddebian> ajmitch: I would never say you are incompetent :-)
[01:32] <ajmitch> not in so many words
[01:33] <LaserJock> not in any words
[01:34] <bddebian> Aye
[01:34] <bddebian> Lazy maybe but never incompetent..
[01:35] <bddebian> j/k bro ;-P
[01:45] <bddebian> ajmitch: You can't hang up your keys until you tell the main folks how wonderful I am.. ;-P
[01:45] <LaserJock> hehe
[01:45] <ajmitch> sure
[01:46] <ajmitch> of course I'll support you
[01:46] <ajmitch> if I'm awake
[01:47] <imbrandon_> heh
[01:53] <LaserJock> sometimes I just think, "If only I could steal ajmitch or crimsun's brain for a bit, oh what work I could get done" :-)
[01:53] <ajmitch> if you stole my brain, you'd get nothing done
[01:53] <ajmitch> oh man
[01:53] <ajmitch> 11494 N   May 23 Chuck Short     (  45) Accepted snes9express 1.42-4 (source)
[01:53] <ajmitch> 11495 N   May 23 Barry deFreese  (  45) Accepted snes9express 1.42-3ubuntu1 (source)
[01:53] <ajmitch> fight! fight!
[01:54] <LaserJock> lol
[01:54] <imbrandon_> lol
[01:55] <zul> oops..
[01:55] <bddebian> -4 wtf??
[01:55] <bddebian> :-)
[01:56] <ajmitch> -4 is a Bad Thing to do
[01:56] <ajmitch> zul should be strung up
[01:56] <bddebian> bbiam
[01:56] <zul> yeah i should
[01:56] <imbrandon_> heh looking at the changelog they are abouthe same thing too ;)
[01:57] <LaserJock> anybody got some rope? ;-)
[01:57] <ajmitch> yep
[01:59] <zul> i think ill stop for tonight
[01:59] <ajmitch> why would you do that?
[02:00] <zul> hehe...its 8pm here
[02:00] <LaserJock> cat5 should work
[02:00] <imbrandon_> bnc == stronger
[02:01] <zul> *sigh* i know when im not wanted
[02:01] <imbrandon_> heheh j/k
[02:02] <LaserJock> I've got some gpib cable in the lab :-)
[02:02] <ajmitch> seems like I've awakened the bloodlust
[02:04] <zul> meh..
[02:10] <LaserJock> crimsun: http://www.spurl.net seems cool
[02:13] <ajmitch> bddebian: 10340! get those bugs fixed!
[02:23] <ajmitch> it was python2.3-4suite that was uninstallable..
[02:40] <bddebian> ajmitch: Really?  Damn, it was 330 a little while ago?? :-(
[02:41] <ajmitch> I know
[02:41] <ajmitch> blame the users
[02:41] <bddebian> ajmitch: Did you ever get through the zope mess?
[02:42] <ajmitch> sure
[02:42] <LaserJock> yah know, if nobody used the darn distro we wouldn't have so many bugs to fix ;-)
[02:42] <ajmitch> at least most of it should work & be installable now :)
[02:42] <bddebian> ajmitch: Oh you could help me with ivtools
[02:42] <bddebian> LaserJock: ;-)
[02:42] <bddebian> zul: Bah, don't quit homey :-)
[02:48] <ajmitch> I'll never catch up in karma now
[02:48] <ajmitch> it is impossible
[02:49] <bddebian> Bah
[02:49] <bddebian> More mocking
[02:49] <zul> yes yes it is
[02:49] <ajmitch> no it's not mocking
[02:50] <ajmitch> I r teh suck
[02:50] <ajmitch> ;)
[02:50] <bddebian> pfft
[02:51] <bddebian> ajmitch: Seriously man, help me with ivtools
[02:52] <ajmitch> it's evil
[02:52] <bddebian> No shit :-)
[02:52] <ajmitch> is it even remotely useful?
[02:52] <bddebian> But I think it's what's killing mxv
[02:54] <bddebian> Has xlibs-pic replaced xlibs-static-pic?
[02:55] <ajmitch> I really doubt it
[02:55] <ajmitch> we shouldn't have xlibs-*
[02:55] <ajmitch> and you can't just replace a static lib like that
[02:56] <bddebian> Package libadabindx-dev version 0.7.2-6 has an unmet dep:
[02:56] <bddebian>  Depends: xlibs-static-pic
[02:56] <ajmitch> I know
[02:56] <ajmitch> it's old, broken, etc
[02:56] <ajmitch> my assignedbugs page is shrinking
[02:57] <bddebian> Should it be removed?
[02:58] <ajmitch> I don't know, you make that judgement
[02:59] <bddebian> Nah, Keybuk and/or Kamion always seem to disagree with me :-)  See mgapdesk :-)
[02:59] <ajmitch> you're the one going for main, I haven't looked at the package :P
[02:59] <bddebian> You already ARE main so ppfffttt ;-O
[03:00] <ajmitch> so?
[03:00] <ajmitch> doesn't mean that I've spent time looking at the package
[03:00] <bddebian> So you are a bigger man than me :-)
[03:00] <ajmitch> don't make fun of me being fat ;)
[03:01] <bddebian> Oh yeah right.  I garauntee I weigh more than you do.  AND I'm old. ;-P
[03:01] <ajmitch> old, yes
[03:01] <ajmitch> but probably not heavier :)
[03:01] <bddebian> <-- 215+
[03:01] <ajmitch> that's nothing
[03:02] <zul> welter weight
[03:02] <bddebian> heh
[03:04] <LaserJock> unfortunately I think I'm up to 235-240. To much grad school and eating at Taco Bell/Wendy's/Jack in the Box
[03:04] <ajmitch> yeah
[03:04] <bddebian> Rockin'  My favorites :-)
[03:04] <ajmitch> and I'm a short little guy at 6'1" or so
[03:05] <LaserJock> I think I'm somewhere around 6'1" or 6'2"
[03:05] <LaserJock> but my brother-in-law is 6'4" and ~ 180
[03:06] <bddebian> F you both.  I'm 5'9" or so :-)
[03:06] <LaserJock> :/
[03:06] <bddebian> AND old :-)
[03:06] <LaserJock> bddebian: jeeze, you are fat :-) j/k
[03:06] <ajmitch> haha
[03:06] <bddebian> Uhm where is libluminate6 coming from?
[03:06] <ajmitch> bddebian: it's not
[03:06] <bddebian> illuminator builds libluminate7
[03:06] <ajmitch> Source: illuminator
[03:07] <LaserJock> bddebian: I was going to say Uranus but that is a going a bit to far :-)
[03:07] <ajmitch> so the binary package is in the archive with no reason?
[03:07] <bddebian> ajmitch: afaict
[03:07] <bddebian> LaserJock: Heh
[03:07] <ajmitch> wonderful
[03:10] <bddebian> Yeah
[03:10] <bddebian> Hmm, no rdepends on it
[03:15] <ajmitch> bddebian: it'll work best if you subscribe the archive team to it, instead of irc harassment
[03:15] <ajmitch> RC is awfully close, they probably don't want to be disturbed :)
[03:15] <bddebian> It's not a bug that I know of.    When you bump something a buildX or ubuntuX version it breaks dependencies :-(
[03:19] <bddebian> ajmitch: :-)
[03:20] <crimsun> bddebian: I'm pretty sure you want to follow ajmitch's suggestion RE: libluminate6.
[03:21] <ajmitch> you'd tell bddebian to follow my advice? :)
[03:21] <ajmitch> heh
[03:21] <crimsun> (i.e., make sure it should be removed, then sub archive)
[03:21] <bddebian> THERE IS NO BUG
[03:22] <bddebian> Should I report one??
[03:22] <crimsun> well, it's either bug kamion/mdz, or file a bug.
[03:23] <LaserJock> file the bug!
[03:23] <ajmitch> or see why it's still in the archive
[03:23] <LaserJock> nooooooo
[03:23] <bddebian> ajmitch: How would I go about doing that?
[03:23] <ajmitch> research
[03:23] <ajmitch> the lib version is one that's only been in dapper
[03:24] <ajmitch> so we have a binary package without matching source
[03:25] <ajmitch> source is still in the archive
[03:25] <ajmitch> launchpad lists it as 'superseded', not removed
[03:28] <bddebian> Where do you see that?
[03:28] <ajmitch> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/illuminator/
[03:29] <bddebian> I'm already there.  What does that tell me?
[03:30] <ajmitch> just what I told you
[03:30] <ajmitch> that 0.9.1-3 was in dapper, and is superseded
[03:31] <bddebian> OK
[03:31] <bddebian> So...?
[03:32] <ajmitch> so yes
[03:32] <bddebian> So yes what?
[03:35] <LaserJock> yeah, I haven't quite figured out what superseded means, I take it to mean that it is a source package that is not the newest but hasn't been removed from the archives yet
[03:35] <ajmitch> not removed since there are still binaries in the archive built from it
[03:37] <bddebian> But my question is still why?
[03:38] <bddebian> And afaict libluminate7 isn't a conflicts/replaces for libluminate6 unless I missed something?
[03:38] <ajmitch> because that's how it all works?
[03:38] <crimsun> I don't see a c/r against 6
[03:39] <bddebian> crimsun: ?
[03:39] <bddebian> Guys, I'm not trying to be a pain in the ass, I'm trying to understand.
[03:42] <crimsun> bddebian: apt-cache show libluminate7 |grep Conf
[03:43] <bddebian> crimsun: Nothing
[03:44] <crimsun> bddebian: so as far as we know, libluminate7 doesn't c/r 6, as you said.
[03:45] <crimsun> judging from the changelog on packages.qa.d.o for illuminator 0.10.0-1, libluminate7 just gets rid of the dvips b-d-i
[03:45] <crimsun> the chain goes back to Bug #337378: illuminator: FTBFS: Unsatisfiable Build-Depends on dvips
[03:47] <bddebian> Right, OK
[03:50] <ajmitch> alright, only zope-docfindertab, zope-cmfsin, zope-ttwtype and zope-cmfphoto have unmet deps for zope ;)
[03:50] <ajmitch> all of which because they want an older CMF API
[03:54] <bddebian> So my question still remains.  What would be the proper way to ask about getting that binary removed?
[03:56] <crimsun> I would politely ping kamion about it (since I don't know if infinity or keybuk have the ability to remove)
[03:56] <LaserJock> bddebian: do you need the binary removed?
[03:56] <bddebian> LaserJock: Need it a little strong.    Should I just replace hotplug with udev and module-init-scripts?
[05:37] <bddebian> Uhm, is there a Squirrel SQL package?
[05:40] <crimsun> squirrel or squirrelmail?
[05:40] <bddebian> Dunno, I'm confused
[05:41] <bddebian> Bug #30079
[05:41] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 30079 in gdk-pixbuf "Squirrel SQL Install fails  GdkPixbuf-CRITICAL" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/30079
[05:46] <crimsun> bddebian: NeedsInfo, req:Please try 2.2 final http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=28383&package_id=29193&release_id=410063
[05:47] <crimsun> (no, we don't have squirrel-sql)
[05:49] <bddebian> crimsun: So how can he (we?) say it's a bug in gdk-pixbuf and not squirrel-sql?  Ohh, nm
[05:51] <crimsun> bddebian: more than likely it has naught to do with gdk-pixbuf
[05:51] <bddebian> Well I was thinking of rejecting it but is that rude?
[05:55] <ajmitch> ok..
[05:55] <ajmitch> for my 2 hours of lab demonstrating stuff
[05:55] <ajmitch> where I sit on irc ;)
[05:56] <bddebian> Heh
[05:56] <crimsun> rockin, ajmitch ;)
[05:56] <ajmitch> & fix bugs
[05:56] <ajmitch> I can handle that
[05:56] <crimsun> bddebian: I would leave it NeedsInfo and just ask the submitter to try 2.2 final.
[05:57] <bddebian> crimsun: OK, thx
[05:57] <ajmitch> bddebian: under 10300 yet?
[05:58] <ajmitch> hm, 10349, going up
[05:59] <bddebian> Yep :-(
[05:59] <bddebian> And I'm losing steam :'-(
[06:02] <ajmitch> don't worry
[06:02] <ajmitch> just get plenty of caffeine, lock yourself away from work, wife & kids
[06:02] <ajmitch> and then come out after release
[06:02] <bddebian> Heh, I wish :-)
[06:02] <imbrandon> well let the wife in once in a while ( that help me get more "steam" ;)
[06:02] <ajmitch> hehe
[06:03] <imbrandon> brb gonna restart x
[06:06] <imbrandon> ohhhh logging in reminded me, who handles the brandon@ubuntu/members/imbrandon type hostmasks , i get one of those cool ones now huh ? lol ( no biggie just wondering whom to bug later )
[06:07] <LaserJock> imbrandon: Seveas does that
[06:07] <imbrandon> kool , i'll catch him online sometime, like i said , just kinda curious
[06:07] <imbrandon> logging back into irc reminded me when it set my mask
[06:08] <bddebian> ajmitch: Me either bro :-)
[06:08] <imbrandon> heh
[06:08] <LaserJock> I didn't think it was all that interesting, but everybody else was doing it :-)
[06:08] <imbrandon> mine is just a generic one nalith set a few months ago becouse someone was trying to DDoS me or some shiznit
[06:09] <LaserJock> yeah, apparently that sort of thing happens so that's why I've got a mine
[06:09] <LaserJock> plus it sort of helps people identify who should at least have basic knowledge of ubuntu
[06:09] <LaserJock> I think anyway
[06:09] <imbrandon> not like i dont post diff / screenshots / other tidbits to ubuntustuff.sytes.net now and then anyhow thats on the same IP ;)
[06:10] <imbrandon> i realy should upload that stuff to my normal webhost to avoid that huh ? lol
[06:11] <imbrandon> just to easy to copy it to /mnt/server/var/www somtimes though
[06:12] <imbrandon> *thinks about ftpfs ...hmmm* nah i need to et some real work done
[06:21] <bddebian> Well gnight gents
[06:22] <LaserJock> I'm off too
[06:23] <imbrandon> gnight guys
[06:28] <chillywilly> wassup dudes?
[06:34] <imbrandon> 'ello
[07:23] <ajmitch> hm
[07:23] <ajmitch> it feels like it's about beer o'clock
[07:25] <Lathiat> Wed May 24 13:25:55 WST 2006
[07:25] <Lathiat> i wish
[07:25] <Lathiat> 5 mroe hours
[07:26] <ajmitch> heh
[07:26] <Lathiat> man ive got this lovely C program here which stores its data by writing binary structs directly into data files
[07:26] <Lathiat> its running on redhat9
[07:26] <Lathiat> doesnt work on debian or ubuntu
[07:26] <ajmitch> that sounds sane
[07:26] <Lathiat> and especially not on 64bit
[07:26] <ajmitch> I heard MS Word was like that :)
[07:26] <Lathiat> even if i statically compile it on the machine it works on
[07:26] <Lathiat> which is a bit crak
[07:36] <ajmitch> just slightly
[08:46] <dholbach> good morning motu world!
[08:55] <Gloubiboulga> hi dholbach
[08:57] <dholbach> hey Gloubiboulga
[08:59] <ajmitch> hi dholbach
[09:00] <dholbach> hey ajmitch
[09:03] <ajmitch> ah well, I've got a few packages to upload tonight ;)
[09:03] <ajmitch> dholbach: how's it going?
[09:04] <dholbach> ajmitch: overlong todo list, but i have some coffee here, and got myself some strawberries and grapes from the grocery store, so I'm good - thanks
[09:04] <dholbach> how are you?
[09:05] <ajmitch> I'm alright, just been at the pub after work for a couple of beers :)
[09:05] <ajmitch> got a friend's birthday to celebrate tonight, and then back to dapper-fixing
[09:05] <dholbach> ah nice
[09:05] <dholbach> enjoy yourself!
[09:06] <ajmitch> I hope the release-week isn't too stressful for the distro team :)
[09:07] <Mithrandir> ajmitch: funny you.
[09:07] <ajmitch> heh
[09:07] <ajmitch> Mithrandir: surely you'll all be sitting back & relaxing, since there'll be nothing to fix after RC? ;)
[09:08] <Mithrandir> ajmitch: yeah, I'll just go on a week's vac to hunt flying pigs.
[09:08] <ajmitch> heh
[09:08] <Mithrandir> I've heard their meat is delicious
[09:09] <dholbach> can I go with you? I'll carry your rifle and everythin
[09:09] <Mithrandir> sure
[09:09] <Mithrandir> I'm sure Matt won't object
[09:09] <dholbach> yeah :)
[09:15] <ajmitch> oh dear, SoC results are out
[09:19] <Hobbsee> hi all
[09:19] <ajmitch> hello
[09:21] <Hobbsee> hi Mithrandir
[09:21] <ajmitch> I guess I need to start working on this SoC project then.. how much beer do I need to bribe my mentor with?
[09:21] <DarkMageZ> what did telstra do today? or just hating them in general?
[09:21] <Mithrandir> ajmitch: depends on what kind of beer you're bribing with.
[09:23] <Hobbsee> argh!
[09:24] <Mithrandir> can't have you tumble into a wall or something.
[09:24] <Hobbsee> heh
[09:24] <Hobbsee> thankyou.
[09:24] <Mithrandir> :-)
[09:44] <Hobbsee> DarkMageZ: cable went down this morning - ie, no internet, no phone.  great.
[09:44] <DarkMageZ> :O you don't have a standard home phoneline?
[09:44] <Hobbsee> DarkMageZ: not anymore
[09:45] <DarkMageZ> lucky, those sob's won't provide me with adsl without paying the monthly phone line rental...
[09:45] <ajmitch> sounds usual
[09:45] <DarkMageZ> and they refuse to provide cable
[09:45] <DarkMageZ> yeah, but still
[09:47] <Hobbsee> ah, this is cable, not adsl - so we pay for the cable connection, then the phone is VOIP...
[09:47] <DarkMageZ> exactly, you are lucky
[09:47] <Hobbsee> we cant get adsl here - or couldnt at the time we got cable, anyway - not sure about now
[09:47] <Hobbsee> ah...i get it...
[09:48] <DarkMageZ> if telstra had competition... they wouldn't be so greedy
[09:48] <Hobbsee> true
[11:55] <zakame> hi all
[11:59] <Gloubiboulga> hi zakame
[12:00] <zakame> hi Gloubiboulga
[12:42] <phanatic> hi people
[12:46] <phanatic> hey zakame, you accepted to soc? :)
[12:49] <phanatic> hi Hobbsee
[12:49] <Hobbsee> hi phanatic
[12:50] <MiniJames> james@jameslaptop:~$ sudo apt-cache search realplay
[12:50] <MiniJames> kmplayer-konq-plugins - KMPlayer plugin for KHTML/Konqueror
[12:50] <MiniJames> realplayer - Real Player (installer)
[12:50] <MiniJames> james@jameslaptop:~$ sudo apt-get install realplayer
[12:50] <MiniJames> Reading package lists... Done
[12:50] <MiniJames> Building dependency tree... Done
[12:50] <MiniJames> Some packages could not be installed. This may mean that you have
[12:50] <tseng> please dont do that here
[12:50] <MiniJames> requested an impossible situation or if you are using the unstable
[12:50] <MiniJames> distribution that some required packages have not yet been created
[12:50] <MiniJames> or been moved out of Incoming.
[12:50] <MiniJames> Since you only requested a single operation it is extremely likely that
[12:50] <MiniJames> the package is simply not installable and a bug report against
[12:50] <MiniJames> that package should be filed.
[12:50] <MiniJames> The following information may help to resolve the situation:
[12:50] <tseng> pastebin.ca please.
[12:50] <MiniJames> ^^ sorry
[12:50] <MiniJames> ok :)
[12:51] <MiniJames> http://pastebin.com/734821
[12:51] <MiniJames> :)
[12:51] <MiniJames> Im using ubuntu dapper, having big problems installing real player
[12:52] <MiniJames> its clear why :)
[12:52] <MiniJames> thing is, ive no idea what to do from here
[01:08] <MiniJames> hm
[01:08] <MiniJames> can someone help me
[01:08] <MiniJames> xlibs dependencies seem to be a bit skrewed in dapper
[01:09] <spacey> xlibs doesn't exist anymore afaik
[01:11] <MiniJames> lol ouch
[01:11] <MiniJames> im trying to install real player on dapper
[01:11] <MiniJames> any ideas?
[01:12] <imbrandon> did you follow the instructions on http://wiki.kubuntu.org/RestrictedFormats
[01:16] <MiniJames> ive just read them ;)
[01:16] <MiniJames> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RestrictedFormats#head-848295cba1b3591a4b4a0dbea5844fd5d2894b6b
[01:16] <imbrandon> sudo apt-get install libstdc++5
[01:16] <imbrandon> wget -c ftp://ftp.nerim.net/debian-marillat/pool/main/r/realplay/realplayer_10.0.7-0.0_i386.deb
[01:16] <imbrandon> sudo dpkg -i realplayer_10.0.7-0.0_i386.deb
[01:16] <MiniJames> already done it
[01:17] <MiniJames> about 5 mins ago
[01:17] <MiniJames> just beat you to it ;)
[01:17] <MiniJames> but, thats alot for the effort
[01:17] <MiniJames> great support :)
[01:17] <MiniJames> really appreciated
[01:28] <thierry_> Hi, is it too late to upload my patch in bug 4587 ? It has been reviewed but since it's in main, the reviewer couldn't upload it
[01:28] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 4587 in bittornado "[PATCH]  bittornado absolute icon path and specs problems" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/4587
[01:29] <ajmitch> any patches for main have to be approved by mdz, and RC is coming out Real Soon Now
[01:29] <ajmitch> so it's probably too late
[01:29] <ajmitch> minor fixes like that have to wait
[01:36] <thierry_> ajmitch : k, but could you assign it to yourself or to a MOTU for dapper+1 ? It's been about 3-4 months that it's there waiting for uploading and I don't want it to wait an other 3 months
[01:37] <ajmitch> considering that it was unassigned to anyone, it's not surprising that noone uploaded it
[01:38] <thierry_> ajmitch : k, I should have assigned it to MOTU?
[01:39] <ajmitch> being main, I'm not sure what decent way there is, apart from asking someone who's got main upload rights
[01:39] <ajmitch> for universe, you assign to motu-reviewers
[01:40] <thierry_> k... but now if I want it to get uploaded for dapper+1, to who do i assign it?
[01:40] <ajmitch> at the moment, noone
[01:41] <ajmitch> I can look at it for edgy
[01:43] <thierry_> k then I'll come back asking for that when dapper will be out
[01:51] <siretart> I don't see too much point in assigning any bug to a team, atm. Subscribing teams have the same effect and doesn't make the false impression that anyone was actively working on that task
[01:51] <siretart> morning, btw ;)
[01:51] <ajmitch> hey siretart
[01:52] <siretart> huhu ajmitch
[01:52] <ajmitch> yes, that's why mdz larts you if you assign bugs to ubuntu-archive rather than subscribing them :)
[01:52] <ajmitch> we should probably do the same for motu-uvf & motu-reviewers
[01:52] <Hobbsee> oh, is that why?  i see...i see...
[01:54] <siretart> ajmitch: I see only one advantage in using the maintainer field: I can sort them away with procmail rules
[01:54] <siretart> ajmitch: but in general, I agree with that
[01:54] <ajmitch> yes, I'm finding mutt's filtering to be a great help
[01:54] <ajmitch> colouring bug mails based on various criteria
[01:55] <siretart> interesting idea: use coloring :)
[01:55] <ajmitch> it's an eyesore, but effective
[02:12] <kagou> hi
[02:13] <kagou> slomo: if you have time can you have a look at Bug #45798 :)
[02:13] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 45798 in ufraw "Doesn't handle RAW files from Canon EOS 30D" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/45798
[05:42] <bddebian> Heya gang
[05:48] <tuxmaniac> bddebian: boooo
[05:49] <bddebian> Howdy tuxmaniac
[05:50] <tuxmaniac> bddebian: what was the flood you were talking about yesterday?
[05:50] <bddebian> Oh, had a drain pipe in a sink come loose :-(
[05:50] <ogra> fun
[05:51] <ogra> plumbig is great fun, isnt it ? :)
[05:51] <ogra> *plumbing
[05:51] <bddebian> ogra: No :-)
[05:51] <ogra> i know :)
[07:09] <selinium> Hi there, I was wondering if maybe a MOTU lug might be arranged in London that I could attend for some mentoring?
[07:14] <Spec> wellll, if you pay me to fly out to london.....even though I'm not a MOTU.... O:)
[07:17] <bddebian> heh
[07:40] <selinium> Spec: :) I kinda figured there must be some MOTUers in London... :)
[10:13] <bohan_> hi, is the appending of the "ubuntu" string in debian package names entirely automatic or is there something to do explicitly?
[10:14] <dholbach> bohan_: needs to be done manually and needs to be done, if we change things in the debian package
[10:14] <tseng> it is done (manually) when an ubuntu motu adds changes to the debian package
[10:14] <tseng> uh
[10:14] <tseng> dholbach: *hugs*
[10:14] <siretart> could someone with amd64 tell me the output of 'dpkg-divert --list | grep ia32-libs', please?
[10:14] <tseng> ~$ dpkg-divert --list | grep ia32-libs
[10:14] <tseng> nothing
[10:15] <siretart> interesting
[10:15] <dholbach> siretart: I can't in the middle of an install, sorry.
[10:15] <dholbach> ah ok
[10:15] <siretart> thanks, tseng
[10:15] <tseng> np
[10:15] <siretart> I get diversion of /usr/bin/ldd to /usr/bin/ldd.amd64 by ia32-libs
[10:15] <bddebian> Heya dholbach, tseng, siretart
[10:15] <tseng> well
[10:15] <tseng> i dnt have ia32-libs
[10:15] <tseng> this is a server
[10:15] <siretart> oh.
[10:15] <siretart> hm
[10:15] <dholbach> give me a sec until it's installed and rebooted
[10:15] <bohan_> thanks dholbach and tseng
[10:21] <dholbach> siretart: hum, empty here as well
[10:22] <siretart> dholbach: interesting
[10:22] <siretart> I'm biten by bug #46285 and try to investigat it
[10:22] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46285 in ia32-libs "pre-installation of the package is trying overwrite '/usr/bin/ldd' with  `/usr/bin/ldd.amd64'" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46285
[10:22] <siretart> it seems that I cannot remove the diversion
[10:28] <dholbach> Good night fellas.
[10:28] <siretart> gn8 daniel!
[10:31] <bddebian> Gnight dholbach
[10:32] <crimsun> 'night daniel
[10:33] <bddebian> Heya crimsun
[10:33] <crimsun> heya bddebian
[10:33] <dholbach> night Reinhard, Barry, Daniel :)
[11:22] <bddebian> Later folks
[11:22] <cbx33> nn bddebian
[11:35] <selinium> I threw this question out earlier today, I wasz wondering if there were any London based MOTUers who could meet at / host a lug so some London based hopefuls can get some hands on mentoring.... :)
[11:36] <cbx33> selinium, oooh nice idea
[11:37] <selinium> cbx33: Cheers! :)
[11:37] <cbx33> need some mentoring
[11:37] <selinium> cbx33: Are you London based?
[11:37] <cbx33> selinium, have you read LaserJock's packaging guide
[11:37] <cbx33> nope
[11:38] <cbx33> I'm southampton based
[11:38] <selinium> damn...
[11:38] <selinium> I like Southhamton :)
[11:38] <cbx33> heheh
[11:38] <selinium> I have been through the MOTU pages. :)
[11:40] <crimsun> I suppose the best online solution is simply to ask questions.
[11:40] <cbx33> indeed it is
[11:40] <cbx33> all of my questions have been answered well
[11:40] <cbx33> I suppose on my part it was just getting to grips with it quicker
[11:40] <cbx33> like having someone teach me
[11:41] <cbx33> and could....*snigger* hold my hand through it
[11:41] <cbx33> by I suppose in the end you learn more by trying it out yourself
[11:41] <selinium> THere are a bunch of Ubunteros heading up to the LugRadio live...  http://tinyurl.com/zhwmj
[11:41] <cbx33> and the guys here anre so helpful
[11:41] <cbx33> selinium, yeh I won;t be able to make it unfortunately
[11:42] <cbx33> one ubuntu member
[11:42] <cbx33> ??
[11:42] <Spec> hey...i have me a question
[11:42] <Spec> I'm building this package for someone, and it requires libnotify >= 4.0, but dapper uses 3.2
[11:43] <Spec> debian unstable uses 4.0, and if I install libnotify-dev, ignoring the dependency on libnotify1 (I only want the dev packages), I can compile this thing
[11:43] <selinium> cbx33: Only eight people so far.. :)
[11:43] <selinium> :)
[11:43] <selinium> :(
[11:43] <Spec> but, how would I accomplish the same thing in the pbuilder environment?
[11:57] <LaserJock> Spec: you want to have other packages be avialable in the pbuilder?
[12:00] <Spec> not quite
[12:00] <Spec> i need to force an ignore-depends for a specific package
[12:01] <Spec> I'm thinking about just rebuilding debian's libnotify-dev to not have a dependency on libnotify1
[12:02] <LaserJock> yeah, I have no idea if you can make pbuilder ignore dependencies
[12:03] <Spec> i mean, in all respects -- it's a very bad idea :p
[12:29] <Spec> LaserJock: got it without using pbuilder
[12:30] <Spec> good enough, Not My Package! (tm)
[12:35] <LaserJock> Spec[x] : hehe
[01:04] <ajmitch> morning
[01:05] <carthik> Hi ajmitch, top of the day to you
[01:16] <LaserJock> hi ajmitch
[02:18] <bddebian> Heya gang
[02:20] <LaserJock> bddebian: hi! I have a question for you
[02:20] <LaserJock> bddebian: do you know how /usr/bin/env works?
[02:20] <bddebian> Heya LaserJock
[02:21] <LaserJock> I'm trying to adjust what #!/usr/bin/env python executes
[02:21] <bddebian> What does it execute now?
[02:22] <LaserJock> I'm not sure, but it isn't the python I want :-)
[02:22] <LaserJock> this is on my mac
[02:22] <LaserJock> so I've got like 3 different pythons running around
[02:22] <bddebian> You want alternatives then?
[02:22] <LaserJock> yeah, well basically I have a python script that uses #!/user/bin/env python
[02:23] <LaserJock> and I want it to execute a specific python I have installed
[02:23] <bddebian> Call python2.4 specifically then ;-P
[02:24] <LaserJock> well, but I'm not the only one using the script so I don't want to mess other people up just cause I'm using the stupid mac
[02:24] <bddebian> env just sets environment variables doesn't it?
[02:24] <LaserJock> right
[02:24] <LaserJock> so I tried using export python= but that didn't work
[02:26] <bddebian> what is /usr/bin/python symlinked too?
[02:26] <LaserJock> to the one I don't want ;-)
[02:26] <LaserJock> maybe I just need to switch the symlinks
[02:26] <LaserJock> but I wanted to just be able to do an alias or something to run the script
[02:27] <LaserJock> bddebian: this is my first programming project and I'm failing on the first day :/
[02:27] <bddebian> I would think about all you could do is either create a local symlink or something unless you update-alternatives
[02:28] <bddebian> LaserJock: bbias, gotta get the kids in bed
[02:29] <LaserJock> bddebian: I gotta get home too
[02:58] <crimsun> universe iconcache almost finished. :-)
[03:00] <ogra> wow
[03:00] <ajmitch> hey ogra
[03:02] <bddebian> It wasn't finished already?
[03:02] <crimsun> nope
[03:03] <ogra> hey ajmitch
[03:04] <bddebian> Heya ajmitch, jaldhar
[03:08] <ajmitch> what's up, bddebian?
[03:08] <ajmitch> got the bug count down yet?
[03:09] <bddebian> No, I'm failing today :-(
[03:09] <ajmitch> ah well
[03:09] <ajmitch> hopefully we can still get a few fixes in universe before release
[03:10] <bddebian> Any idea how I remove my name from the core-dev team?
[03:11] <ajmitch> why would you do that?
[03:11] <ajmitch> if you *really* think you should, ask #launchpad
[03:12] <ajmitch> applying for main doesn't mean you need to know all there is about development..
[03:12] <ajmitch> if that were true, I'd have never got in
[03:12] <bddebian> It's not that
[03:12] <ajmitch> what is it then?
[03:12] <bddebian> I think my "personality" is not conducive to the group
[03:13] <ajmitch> ?
[03:13] <crimsun> oh shush, barry.   I don't know that anyone has tried an embedded Ubuntu
[03:19] <bioeng> I am wanting to specialize in embedded systems for my EE degree
[03:19] <bioeng> that and power systems
[03:19] <ajmitch> how embedded do you mean?
[03:19] <bioeng> I'm exploring the field right now
[03:20] <bioeng> putting computer systems in different devices
[03:22] <bddebian> ajmitch: What bugs are worth looking at this point in the game?
[03:23] <ajmitch> I don't know
[03:23] <ajmitch> I've been focusing on my areas of interest (zope, python)
[03:23] <ajmitch> and my debian packages
[03:24] <ajmitch> trying to get at least the things I care about into shape
[03:24] <bioeng> I'll say it again:  The people on IRC are SO much better than the idiots at my school
[03:26] <bioeng> I mean, the people I go to school with are so uninspiring
[03:27] <LaserJock> ajmitch: is the python MOTU team active?
[03:27] <ogra> LaserJock, yes, it was just talking to you :P
[03:27] <LaserJock> ogra: hehe
[03:28] <bddebian> bioeng: That's true of most of the planet unfortunately :-)
[03:28] <ogra> together with the zope team :)
[03:28] <LaserJock> ogra: technically only half of the team
[03:28] <bioeng> I wonder if UIUC is actually a good school to go to
[03:28] <ogra> who is the other half ?
[03:28] <bddebian> bioeng: University of Illionis?
[03:29] <bddebian> Err Illinois even
[03:29] <ajmitch> well the zope team consists mainly of DDs
[03:29] <ajmitch> & the work is mostly done on the debian side
[03:30] <bioeng> Yes
[03:30] <crimsun> bioeng: uiuc is an excellent school
[03:30] <bddebian> U of I is a great school