[14:05] <sladen> mdke: I've subscribed 'ubuntu-docs' to the just-filed:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-docs/+bug/808667 ("help.ubuntu.com uses pre-2010 branding/theme")
[14:05] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 808667 in ubuntu-docs "help.ubuntu.com uses pre-2010 branding/theme" [Undecided,New]
[14:07] <sladen> mdke: it's probably a case of porting the theme across from http://wiki.ubuntu.com/
[14:08] <sladen> mdke: newz2000 reckons that is something that -docs would normally do, then pester IS to deploy the update
[21:19] <mdke> sladen: we already have bugs about this, but yes, it requires us to develop/modify the moin theme and our toolchain for building the static part of the website
[21:21] <mdke> sladen: I've marked it as a dup, thanks for bringing it to our attention
[21:39] <sladen> mdke: thanks for finding the dup.  I've brought some of the information across
[21:39] <sladen> mdke: is there anything myself or others on the Design team can do to help out?
[21:40] <sladen> mdke: (I know little/nothing about moinmoin deployment, or how one uses themes with it)
[21:49] <mdke> sladen: it just needs someone willing to work on it really.
[21:51] <mdke> sladen: the information added to the description is not really helpful - the whole theme of the site needs changing, not just those files, and it's probably better not to specify those files separately. (I'm not much of a fan of changing the description of a bug when really you are adding a comment)
[21:51] <mdke> the parenthesis just a minor whinge, feel free to ignore :)
[22:03] <mdke> we had someone in the channel a while ago interested in working on this, but we didn't hear from them again. I can't remember who it was :(
[22:04] <mdke> if anyone reading the scrollback can remember, let me know
[22:04]  * mdke -> bed
[22:15] <sladen> mdke: (it's just the information carried over from the other---the do-minimum if getting a new theme is going to take another year)
[22:15] <sladen> mdke: I think what the bug report /could/ benefit from are some high-level details about how the theme can be deployed (is there a staging area)
[22:16] <sladen> mdke: that's probably obvious to those people that are familiar, but somewhat alien for those (and as me) who don't know the current install
[23:23] <cjohnston> mdke: is the current help.u.c theme somewhere for download?


[19:23] <the-nightphoenix> echo
[19:23] <the-nightphoenix> any prrogramers online
[19:24] <seiflotfy__> the-nightphoenix, yeah
[19:24] <seiflotfy__> i am one
[19:24] <seiflotfy__> :)
[19:25] <seiflotfy__> whats up
[19:25] <the-nightphoenix> hello
[19:25] <the-nightphoenix> do i know you from the meetings ?
[19:25] <the-nightphoenix> i meen have we met b4 ?
[19:27] <the-nightphoenix> r u still there ?
[19:27] <seiflotfy__> no i dont think we met before
[19:28] <seiflotfy__> which meetings?
[19:28] <seiflotfy__> I am an active ubuntu developer
[19:28] <seiflotfy__> as well as gnome
[19:28] <the-nightphoenix> ur seif lotfy
[19:28] <seiflotfy__> yes
[19:28] <seiflotfy__> :)
[19:28] <the-nightphoenix> omg ubuntu made that intervew with u
[19:28] <the-nightphoenix> right ?
[19:28] <seiflotfy__> omg never made an interview with me
[19:28] <seiflotfy__> but i also write for them
[19:28] <seiflotfy__> :)
[19:28] <the-nightphoenix> lol :D
[19:28] <seiflotfy__> linux format made an interview with me
[19:29] <the-nightphoenix> ah
[19:29] <the-nightphoenix> i read about in omg
[19:29] <seiflotfy__> :)
[19:29] <the-nightphoenix> so i thought that they made it
[19:29] <seiflotfy__> nope
[19:29] <the-nightphoenix> nvr mind
[19:29] <seiflotfy__> linux format and soon linux magazin :)
[19:29] <seiflotfy__> yay
[19:29] <the-nightphoenix> its great to know u
[19:29]  * seiflotfy__ blushes
[19:29] <the-nightphoenix> any way
[19:29] <seiflotfy__> i am happy to see a growing ubuntu community in egypt
[19:30] <the-nightphoenix> i have a question
[19:30] <seiflotfy__> how can i help you
[19:30] <seiflotfy__> shoot
[19:30] <the-nightphoenix> i have a college project
[19:30] <the-nightphoenix> a database project
[19:30] <the-nightphoenix> and i decided to use django
[19:30] <the-nightphoenix> are u familer with it ?
[19:31] <seiflotfy__> a bit
[19:31] <seiflotfy__> its python so its all good
[19:31] <the-nightphoenix> yup
[19:31] <seiflotfy__> but what db are u using
[19:31] <the-nightphoenix> any way my question is more general
[19:31] <seiflotfy__> mysql or sqlite
[19:31] <the-nightphoenix> mysql
[19:31] <seiflotfy__> ?
[19:31] <seiflotfy__> ok
[19:31] <seiflotfy__> good
[19:32] <the-nightphoenix> django comes with authntication model
[19:32] <the-nightphoenix> for user
[19:32] <the-nightphoenix> groups
[19:32] <the-nightphoenix> and permissions
[19:32] <the-nightphoenix> and its really easy to use
[19:32] <the-nightphoenix> but the problem comes when i need to extend the user model
[19:32] <the-nightphoenix> to put some extra fields related to my project
[19:33] <the-nightphoenix> i found some wayes to extend it but each has pros and cons
[19:34] <the-nightphoenix> and i dont have the experince to choose which to go with
[19:34] <the-nightphoenix> and im out of time i need to submit the early design in 2 days :D
[19:34] <the-nightphoenix> so i thought ill ask for help
[19:35] <egyDev> Someone really likes django :D
[19:35] <the-nightphoenix> lol
[19:35] <the-nightphoenix> can u help in my problem
[19:40] <the-nightphoenix> echo any body still there ?
[19:49] <seiflotfy__> back
[19:49] <seiflotfy__> sorry
[19:49] <seiflotfy__> was afk
[19:50] <seiflotfy__> hmmmmm
[19:50] <seiflotfy__> ok
[19:50] <seiflotfy__> what are the fields
[19:50] <the-nightphoenix> don wrry
[19:50] <the-nightphoenix> i have to link the user
[19:50] <the-nightphoenix> to a ceartain branch in a company
[19:50] <the-nightphoenix> and a certain department
[19:51] <the-nightphoenix> so i need to add 2 forign key fields to the user
[21:33] <d4de> Happy New Year - Egypt (^_^)


[15:56] <LinuxUser02484> hello friends!
[15:57] <khalil> cd /
[15:57] <khalil> useradd -D
[15:57] <khalil> ls /
[15:57] <khalil> ls -l /
[15:58] <khalil> ls -l
[15:58] <khalil> nano ls
[15:58] <khalil> gedit file
[16:03] <mhall119> we'll be live in just a minute, getting the website updated
[16:07] <dpm> about to start now!
[16:07] <popey> yay, website is right now
[16:07] <mhall119> please refresh http://ubuntuonair.com to see the video
[16:09] <mhall119> popey: is the video playing?
[16:09] <popey> yeah
[16:09] <mhall119> cool
[16:10] <aquarius> sound is working. :)
[16:10] <mhall119> http://developer.ubuntu.com/showdown/
[16:11] <cato1986> can't see video, but a whole system equalizer would set the OS apart from others.
[16:11] <aquarius> QUESTION: who do I ping about summit issues? I am registered to attend UOS 14.11 (did so about four hours ago) but the attend meeting pages don't think I am, so I can't attend meetings :(
[16:12] <mhall119> aquarius: that would be me
[16:12] <aquarius> mhall119, ah, cool. No rush, since you're busy ;)
[16:12] <mhall119> probably need a cron update from IS
[16:14] <mhall119> #ubuntu-app-devel
[16:14] <aquarius> QUESTION: will testing scopes in the desktop tool come to 14.04, or is the policy now that LTS users have to use the emulator to test stuff?
[16:15] <mhall119> http://www.reddit.com/r/ubuntuappshowdown/
[16:17] <ElOS> Hello everyone..
[16:18] <cato1986_> i run the  asus t100 ubuntu group on google, is there any chance of support improving with 15.04?  https://plus.google.com/communities/117853703024346186936
[16:18] <aquarius> ok. excuse me while I sit here and look sad about it.
[16:18] <mhall119> please start questions with "QUESTION"
[16:18] <mhall119> aquarius: so your normal look then :)
[16:18] <aquarius> mhall119, ha! touché
[16:18] <Guest54236> ok
[16:19] <ElOS> [Question] Does Canonical plan to integrate Ubuntu phone with Ubuntu Desktop.
[16:19] <Guest54236> hi anyone to know cssh
[16:19] <dpm> sorry aquarius :(
[16:20] <cato1986_> Ubuntu Asus T100 https://plus.google.com/communities/117853703024346186936
[16:20] <aquarius> I wouldn't mind using the emulator if I didn't have to deal with all the "Kit" stuff. :)
[16:20] <mhall119> http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1411/
[16:20] <mhall119> http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1411/tracks
[16:22] <dpm> aquarius, I'll run a "kits" session later on this week, to hopefully mitigate the pain a bit
[16:22] <aquarius> dpm, sure, but I think the pain ought to be mitigated by making them go away. If I create an emulator, create a kit for it, and don't show it to me and don't mention it to me ;)
[16:24] <dpm> Also check out https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UDS/Create
[16:27] <dpm> aquarius, yeah, we're very much aware of the usability issues with kits and chroots
[16:29] <Guest44344> [QUESTION]By the time BQ and Meizu being released, nexus 4 users will experience the same usability of ubuntu touch as BQ and Meixu users? Thank's :)
[16:30] <akiva-thinkpad> im here!
[16:31] <akiva-thinkpad> QUESTION: Are there composite sensors in Ubuntu for Phones? In Android, there is a sensor called RotationVector. It is a 'composite sensor' that fuses together values from the accelerometer, gyroscope, and magnetometer to get a really accurate and precise angular position measurement. Does such a sensor exist in Ubuntu? I saw QRotationSensor, but it doesn't say whether it uses sensor fusion to get its results.
[16:35] <mhall119> keep your questions coming!
[16:35] <akiva-thinkpad> QUESTION: Are there any sprints going on now?
[16:35] <akiva-thinkpad> Ahhhh thanks :D
[16:35] <akiva-thinkpad> You just made my day
[16:36] <dpm> :-)
[16:37] <mhall119> http://www.theorangenotebook.com/
[16:37] <akiva-thinkpad> QUESTION: Are the Click Packages still under development? Are there any pending features or is it basically complete?
[16:38] <akiva-thinkpad> Click packages as in, the technology of the binary packaging framework (if thats the right way to say it)
[16:39] <akiva-thinkpad> did you guys already talk about the ubuntu online summit?
[16:39] <mhall119> yes
[16:39] <Guest44344> [QUESTION]Thank's for the last answer! Just on more. And about the perfomance? Currently, nexus 4 seems a bit "slow" on opening apps. There's any plan to fix this? Thank's once again :)
[16:39] <akiva-thinkpad> okay :P
[16:43] <akiva-thinkpad> QUESTION: What pending bonus features do you guys want to see in the core apps?
[16:44] <dpm> http://developer.ubuntu.com/apps/platform/guides/
[16:44] <dpm> performance guide ^
[16:47] <n3tJ4ckr> QUESTION: In terms of development, how far behind is the tablet UT build compared with the phone?
[16:48] <popey> akiva-thinkpad: Bonus things? I can think of one!
[16:48] <popey> Games. Make. More. Games. ☻
[16:48] <popey> (not core apps related, but you know)
[16:48] <akiva-thinkpad> popey: Heh
[16:48] <Sreedhar> Hey
[16:48] <popey> Especially games which are _not_ en_GB or en_US only.
[16:48] <popey> given our global audience
[16:48] <aquarius> QUESTION: now that there's no "home scope", that is no search box which searches all scopes and shows results, how will people discover new scopes without "configuring" their Dash to include them? What is the planned upcoming design for how the Dash will work now?
[16:48] <akiva-thinkpad> popey, ah that is true.
[16:48] <Sreedhar> hey I am just to join this Converstion
[16:49] <Sreedhar> can someone from team give me brief what is going on
[16:50] <akiva-thinkpad> Sreedhar, hey
[16:50] <akiva-thinkpad> preface your questions with QUESTION
[16:50] <mhall119> Sreedhar: the video will be available to re-watch on youtube once we're done
[16:51] <akiva-thinkpad> QUESTION: To what extent does Ubuntu Touch support text to speech? Will you be able to use it with google for example?
[16:52] <Sreedhar> Is there any chance that we can hangout with you and ask my questions
[16:52] <mhall119> Sreedhar: ask here and now and we'll answer it
[16:54] <akiva-thinkpad> QUESTION: Can you impliment phone vibration in your apps, or does it require a qt library?
[16:54] <akiva-thinkpad> errr
[16:54] <akiva-thinkpad> Bad way of asking that
[16:54] <vitimiti> Oh, man, and I'm in class right when there's a stream
[16:55] <akiva-thinkpad> QUESTION REDO; How do you implement phone vibrations in the app?
[16:55] <akiva-thinkpad> bah
[16:55] <akiva-thinkpad> in an application
[16:56]  * akiva-thinkpad is sleepy
[16:56] <Sreedhar> Is it discussion regarding only ubuntu for mobiles or Is it whole Ubuntu ?
[16:56] <akiva-thinkpad> Sreedhar, everything ubuntu
[16:56] <akiva-thinkpad> for example
[16:57] <akiva-thinkpad> QUESTION: Are you jealous of Mark Shuttleworth's beard?
[16:57] <Sreedhar> I work as Data Scientist at KisanHub, I observed  that there is problem with package
[16:57] <Sreedhar> http://unetbootin.sourceforge.net/
[16:57] <mhall119> http://developer.ubuntu.com/api/qml/sdk-14.10/QtFeedback/
[16:57] <akiva-thinkpad> bah I meant speech to text!
[16:57] <akiva-thinkpad> sorry
[16:58] <Sreedhar> I was getting kernel error after installation after this package vai apt-get
[16:58] <akiva-thinkpad> QUESTION: When will you guys be on Linux Unplugged?
[16:59] <popey> tonight ☻
[16:59] <akiva-thinkpad> :D
[16:59] <mhall119> popey: :)
[16:59] <akiva-thinkpad> Really? I missed that!
[17:00] <Sreedhar> Hey i am waiting for Answering my question
[17:00] <Sreedhar> :(
[17:00] <popey> Sreedhar: we dont do support questions here
[17:00] <popey> Sreedhar: generally http://askubuntu.com/ is better for that
[17:01] <Sreedhar> Thank you
[17:01] <akiva-thinkpad> Sreedhar, or reddit.com/r/ubuntuappdev
[17:02] <Sreedhar> Ok , Got it
[17:02] <Sreedhar> haa haa
[17:02] <Sreedhar> Thank you
[17:02] <Sreedhar> good night
[17:02] <Sreedhar> bye
[17:02] <mhall119> thanks everyone
[17:02] <akiva-thinkpad> Later!


[00:12] <teward> bryceh: around?
[00:13] <teward> oh nvm i can't read
[00:13] <teward> carry on
[05:12] <cpaelzer> good morning
[06:22] <jamespage> coreycb: hey - would you have time to complete the submitter information for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/jaraco.context/+bug/1975600
[06:22] <jamespage> then I can complete the MIR team review for you
[12:39] <lvoytek> Good morning
[13:03] <ahasenack> kanashiro: I started this discussion: https://lists.clusterlabs.org/pipermail/users/2022-May/030296.html
[13:04] <ahasenack> there is a node remove command that works, but I'm kind of leaning towards a full cluster removal when making changes. Depending on what you change, you may get away with it, or you will get phantom data
[13:05] <ahasenack> `pcs cluster destroy` does a lot of things, it goes over /var/lib/pcsd, /var/lib/pacemaker and removes many files
[14:20] <kanashiro> ahasenack, maybe the charms would be better using the high-level cluster management tools like pcs and crmsh instead of doing all of this manually (?)
[14:20] <ahasenack> maybe
[14:20] <ahasenack> but a bigger change
[14:20] <ahasenack> I think the key thing is changing nodeid, not just the name
[14:20] <ahasenack> if you keep the nodeid the same, and then change the name, all is fine (testing that now)
[14:22] <kanashiro> right, it makes sense, but from one of the answers in the thread I think if you restart first corosync and then pacemaker all should be fine
[14:22] <kanashiro> did you test that?
[14:22] <ahasenack> the phantom node is all about pacemaker, yes
[14:23] <ahasenack> I've been doing "systemctl restart pacemaker corosync", unsure if the order in that command line affects things
[14:23] <ahasenack> but after the package is installed, both are running, nothing that can be done about that (easily, other than policy-rc.d)
[14:24] <ahasenack> so the "contamination" with node1 happens right after install
[14:24] <kanashiro> so a possible minimum change to fix this would be to create a dependency between the pacemaker and corosync systemd services(?)
[14:24] <ahasenack> I have vague recollections of nish doing that in the past, and suffering a lot
[14:25] <ahasenack> it involved creating a file in one maintainerscript and checking for that file in another maintainer script
[14:25] <ahasenack> inter-package RPC :)
[14:26] <kanashiro> if we think this is too much we can at least document this in the server guide, so once we see this happening we can point users to it
[14:26] <ahasenack> even in the case where you keep the nodeid the same, and crm status is clean, the "node1" node is still referenced in old cib files
[14:26] <ahasenack> which seems right, if I understand it correctly
[14:27] <ahasenack> what I don't get yet is, let's say I deploy 3 nodes
[14:27] <ahasenack> all 3 get node1, nodeid=1 (default pkg install)
[14:27] <ahasenack> then in node1 I change name to be hostname, keep nodeid=1, adjust ring0_addr
[14:27] <ahasenack> and add the other 2 nodes to the config, with ids 2 and 3
[14:27] <ahasenack> and send the config to them via scp, and restart everything
[14:28] <ahasenack> I don't get why changing nodeid from 1 to 2 and 3 in the *other* nodes doesn't introduce the same problem
[14:28] <ahasenack> maybe because nodeid 1 is still around, it just has another name, and is no longer myself
[14:29] <ahasenack> I go from node1/id1, node1/id1, node1/id1 to f1/id1, f2/id2, f3/id3
[14:29] <ahasenack> (fN being the new names)
[14:30] <kanashiro> I *think* that in this case the cluster has quorum and they vote to make sure that node does not exist. In a single-node cluster I am not sure when to consider it quorate
[14:30] <ahasenack> if I change node1/id1 to f1/id101, then node1 is still in the list, but offline, even with the 3 nodes
[14:30] <ahasenack> f1/id101 does not replace node1/id1
[14:31] <ahasenack> and in reality, id1 really disappeared from the cluster in that case, no other node assumed id1
[14:31] <ahasenack> hence it shows offline
[14:31] <ahasenack> by "disappeared" I mean there is no host anymore responding to pings on id1
[14:31] <ahasenack> ok, I may be starting to get this
[14:31] <ahasenack> the charm does change the node ids too
[14:32] <ahasenack> from 1 to 1001 or something like that
[14:32] <ahasenack> 2 to 1002, and so on
[14:32] <ahasenack> the approach they took to fix it might be the simplest one after all. Pre-seed a config file
[14:32] <ahasenack> it's like one of the responses in the thread, don't start pacemaker until the config is final
[14:32] <ahasenack> achieves the same
[14:35] <kanashiro> I think that's the main takeaway here: do not restart pacemaker once everything in corosync is set
[14:45] <ahasenack> each cib-N.raw file in /var/lib/pacemaker/cib/ is like a state, right. I can diff between them to see what changed
[14:45] <ahasenack> there is probably a corosync/pacemaker (or cmrsh/pcs?) command to show that, I've sees some "diff" commands in some help output
[14:55] <ahasenack> messing with these attributes in a live cluster is dangerous
[14:56] <ahasenack> May 25 14:54:59 f3 pacemaker-controld[6239]:  warning: Node 'node1' and 'f1' share the same cluster nodeid: 1 f1
[14:56] <ahasenack> May 25 14:54:59 f3 pacemaker-controld[6239]:  error: crm_find_peer: Forked child 6391 to record non-fatal assert at membership.c:590 : member weirdness
[19:43] <sergiodj> kanashiro: hey, is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/openvpn/+bug/1975574 the bug you mentioned you were going to take a look during our housekeeping call today?
[19:43] <ahasenack> sounds like it
[19:44] <sergiodj> I will mark it as server-todo and bump its priority to high, just in case
[19:44] <sergiodj> ah, sorry
[19:44] <sergiodj> Lucas already did that, but I had opened the URL before his update
[19:44] <sergiodj> kanashiro: nevermind :)
[19:57] <kanashiro> :)
[21:55] <giu--> hi to all


[14:16] <BroUnicorn> Hello
[14:16] <BroUnicorn> Can I ask questions about the arm assembly language?
[14:17] <BroUnicorn> I could really use some help


[04:42] <Kilos> morning sleepy heads
[06:30] <superfly> hiya Kilos
[06:39] <Kilos> howdy superfly
[06:43] <magespawn> good morning y'all
[06:43] <superfly> yo magespawn
[06:43] <magespawn> hey superfly
[06:43] <superfly> magespawn: front page of http:// www.techcentral.co.za/
[06:43] <Kilos> hiya magespawn
[06:43] <superfly> hrm, how did that space get in there?
[06:43] <magespawn> Kilos gets the worms today
[06:43] <magespawn> hey Kilos
[06:44] <Kilos> hehe
[06:44] <Kilos> kde didnt give any probs today
[06:44] <Kilos> im happy
[06:49] <magespawn> sound?
[06:50] <magespawn> pretty cool superfly
[06:51] <superfly> magespawn: ta
[07:33] <Kilos> magespawn: i had to resort bios and disable the ac97 option
[07:50] <magespawn> Kilos at least it is working
[08:01] <Kilos> yeah me happy
[08:01] <Kilos> so far everything is working
[09:55] <magespawn> xkcd.com/1110 for those who have not seen this
[10:13] <tumbleweed> you do want a decent browser for that
[10:13] <tumbleweed> something keyboard controlled and/or zoomable
[10:16] <magespawn> would be able to zoom the comic out to see more?
[10:22] <tumbleweed> magespawn: this is the viewer I did, no zoom http://corelli.tumbleweed.org.za/stefanor/xkcd-1110.html
[10:23] <tumbleweed> but other people added zoom
[11:29] <Kilos> hi Trix[a]r_za tumbleweed
[11:29] <Kilos> ah Superhumanyou still alive
[11:29] <Kilos> ai
[11:29] <Kilos>  Superhuman you still alive?
[11:31] <tonberryE352> http://xkcd.kajakklubben.org/
[11:31] <tonberryE352> this one is also amusing
[13:41] <Kilos> even our mailing list is quiet
[13:41] <Kilos> magespawn: coffee on
[13:41] <Kilos> yo inetpro het jy vergeet om morning te se
[13:45] <inetpro> Kilos: skuus
[13:46] <inetpro> Kilos: goeie more
[13:46] <Kilos> hehe gp
[13:46] <Kilos> gaan dit goed boet?
[13:46] <inetpro> Kilos: te warm
[13:46] <Kilos> nee man dis lekker. was nou net in die son
[13:46] <inetpro> ai
[13:47] <Kilos> UV's vang
[13:59] <magespawn> Coffee is ready for Kilos
[13:59] <Kilos> hehe ty magespawn
[14:00] <Kilos> hey magespawnwhat ubuntu's you running
[14:01] <Kilos> this stupid tab complete doesnt add a space after nick
[14:01] <Kilos> magespawn: hi
[14:01] <Kilos> now it did
[14:01] <Kilos> almost weekend for the working class
[14:11] <Symmetria>  4:11PM  up 1499 days,  6:30, 2 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.02, 0.00
[14:11] <Symmetria>
[14:11] <Symmetria> !
[14:12] <Symmetria> lol, and the irc daemon was last restarted on the 27th May 2010
[14:36] <Kilos> hmm
[14:57] <charlvn> good afternoon
[14:57] <charlvn> hi Kilos, Symmetria, magespawn
[14:58] <charlvn> Maaz: coffee on
[14:58]  * Maaz flips the salt-timer
[14:58] <magespawn> hi charlvn
[14:58] <Kilos> charlvn: you still alive too
[14:58] <Kilos> yay
[14:58] <Kilos> magespawn: coffee please
[14:58] <Kilos> eish
[14:58] <magespawn> lol
[14:58] <Kilos> Maaz: coffee please
[14:58] <Maaz> Kilos: Done
[14:59] <charlvn> wow the zar currency has devalued immensely in the last two days
[14:59] <Kilos> how come you jumped in front of maaz with the tab thing
[14:59] <charlvn> http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=EUR&to=ZAR&view=1W
[14:59] <charlvn> that's strange, i start with c, not m
[15:02] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for charlvn and Kilos!
[15:02] <Kilos> no man magespawn
[15:02] <Kilos> not you dodo
[15:03] <Kilos> charlvn: you missed all the fun here
[15:03] <magespawn> hah
[15:03] <Kilos> im using kde 12.04
[15:03] <Kilos> took about 10 installs to be right
[15:04] <zeref> o0o0
[15:04] <Kilos> and lotsa grey hairs for the fly and pro
[15:04] <zeref> Kilos: to get what roght?
[15:04] <Kilos> i think it might be just a shade better than unity
[15:04]  * Kilos ducks
[15:05] <zeref> gnoe-shell ftw :)
[15:05] <zeref> oh dear, *gnome-shell
[15:08] <Kilos> zeref: mate is much better
[15:09] <Kilos> have that on 12.04 on other pc
[15:09] <zeref> i went though all of them, always came back to the shell ;)
[15:10] <zeref> waitng  for  gnomeBuntu
[15:10] <Kilos> well i gave unity about 3 months or more now will do the same for kde
[15:11] <Kilos> kde aint bad once you know a coupla basics
[15:13] <charlvn> Maaz: thanks
[15:13] <Maaz> charlvn: Sure
[15:13] <charlvn> Kilos: i heard there are massive strikes and chaos
[15:13] <charlvn> very sad to hear :(
[15:16] <magespawn> man if i did not need winsucks to function i would have dumped it long ago
[15:17] <magespawn> sorry bit of a rant
[15:17] <magespawn> just wasted the last 3 hours trying to get a program to work
[15:18] <Kilos> magespawn: you didnt restart often enough
[15:19] <Kilos> there is a very lekker free tool that fixes lotsa winsucks probs
[15:19] <magespawn> ubuntu
[15:19] <Kilos> not just registry
[15:19] <magespawn> yeah maybe
[15:19] <Kilos> called ccleaner
[15:20] <magespawn> just tired of trying for now
[15:20] <Kilos> win stores stuff in registry and then forgets where to find them
[15:21] <magespawn> and windows installers are generally retarted becuse they have to work with win
[15:21] <Kilos> lol
[15:22] <Kilos> ya i hated that, every game or app needs a restart
[15:22] <magespawn> and most of the options that i enjoy in ubuntu are not even there
[15:23] <magespawn> wanted to type sudo aptitude install at one point
[15:23] <Kilos> hahaha
[15:23] <Kilos> it grows on you hey
[15:24] <magespawn> it is like they have decided that because you use windows you are stupid therefore cannot make a choice
[15:28] <Kilos> thats for the peeps that call in IT guys for everything
[15:29] <Kilos> thats why most of the larger companies employ IT guys
[15:31] <magespawn> yeah
[15:31] <magespawn> even a person who is busy studying it though it can be exceedingly frustrating
[15:51] <Kilos> lol
[16:01] <Kilos> yo Trix[a]r_za
[16:01] <smile> :)
[16:01] <Kilos> Maaz: nickometer Trix[a]r_za
[16:01] <Maaz> Kilos: Trix[a]r_za is 69.4% lame
[16:02] <Kilos> hi smile
[16:02] <smile> hi Kilos :D
[16:02]  * smile is watching  Tears of Steel - Blender Foundation's fourth short Open Movie
[16:02] <Kilos> Maaz: nickometer Trixar_za
[16:02] <Maaz> Kilos: Trixar_za is 14.4% lame
[16:03] <Trixar_za> Hey Kilos
[16:03] <Trixar_za> Sorry, I'm bored so I'm looking for games to use with ScummVM
[16:03] <Kilos> smile: have you tried using blender?
[16:03] <Trixar_za> Will put them all together and put it on a CD or something
[16:03] <smile> yes I have, long time ago :p wasn't that easy for me :p
[16:04] <Kilos> yeah i struggled as well. blender is for clever peeps
[16:04] <smile> so I gave up :)
[16:04] <Kilos> lol
[16:04] <Kilos> all good apart from bored Trixar_za
[16:04] <magespawn> Maaz: nickometer magespawn
[16:04] <Maaz> magespawn: magespawn is 0.0% lame
[16:04] <Kilos> ?
[16:04] <magespawn> hah cool
[16:04] <magespawn> 100% cool then
[16:05] <smile> big hug, Kilos :P
[16:05] <Trixar_za> Well admit it, ScummVM is a good reason to find old adventure games
[16:05] <Kilos> i think maaz doesnt like funny characters in nicks
[16:05] <Trixar_za> I used to Love them :P
[16:05] <Trixar_za> And I can now enjoy them on Linux too :P
[16:05] <magespawn> or maybe likes all lower case
[16:05] <Kilos> Maaz:  nickometer Kilos
[16:05] <Maaz> Kilos: Kilos is 0.0% lame
[16:05] <smile> that's amazing, Trixar_za :)
[16:06] <magespawn> has anybody got the latest humble indie bundle?
[16:06] <Kilos> Trixar_za: where you get them?
[16:06] <smile> no, magespawn :) do you ;)
[16:06] <Trixar_za> Er, I use Abandonia and GamesWin
[16:06] <Kilos> maybe i can get some on night surfer data when i can stay awake one day
[16:06] <Trixar_za> GamesWin has more games, but less English reviews
[16:06] <magespawn> no laptop and such are only for work
[16:07] <magespawn> and very little spare cash at the moment smile
[16:07] <Trixar_za> It also uses rar files instead of zip files - which means the downloads are smaller than with Abandonia
[16:07] <smile> magespawn: okay :(
[16:07] <Kilos> win rar
[16:07] <Kilos> sjoe
[16:08] <smile> 7-zip for linux! :)
[16:08] <Kilos> i want to find something like red alert or AOE that is a linux game
[16:08] <Trixar_za> Nah, just get the unrar package or the full rar-nonfree package
[16:08] <Trixar_za> :P
[16:09] <Kilos> dont wanna corrupt kde with wine
[16:09] <Trixar_za> Kilos: There is a few
[16:09] <superfly> Kilos: there is 0ad, and a few others
[16:09] <Kilos> oh thats first in muon
[16:09] <superfly> magespawn: I did
[16:10] <magespawn> i heard that it is awesome superfly
[16:10] <magespawn> what did you think?
[16:10] <Kilos> have you tried it superfly?
[16:10] <superfly> magespawn: when I eventually get to downloading it, I will let you know...
[16:10] <magespawn> hah
[16:10] <magespawn> work getting in the way again?
[16:10] <superfly> Kilos: 0AD, yes. it looks really nice
[16:10] <Kilos> good ty superfly i will try it
[16:11] <superfly> magespawn: OpenLP, my biggest open source project, is releasing version 2.0 at the end of this month, so I'm trying to get everything organised for that
[16:11] <magespawn> so not paid work then but still lots to do
[16:12] <magespawn> yup read the blog
[16:12] <Trixar_za> Kilos: http://www.lgdb.org/games/all?tid[]=8&tid_9=All&sort_by=field_release_value&sort_order=DESC
[16:13] <Kilos> ty Trixar_za
[16:13] <superfly> magespawn: yup
[16:13] <smile> What do you think, guys? Fork from LibreOffice? http://www.pcworld.com/article/2011247/gs-calc-a-low-cost-spreadsheet-with-a-unique-interface.html
[16:13] <Trixar_za> linux game database rocks
[16:13] <Trixar_za> :P
[16:13] <superfly> I'm busy trying to get a press kit together, lots of work, more than coding
[16:14] <Trixar_za> But http://www.lgdb.org/game/openra will probably interest you more
[16:14] <Trixar_za> :P
[16:14] <magespawn> I would not mind helping out if you want superfly
[16:15] <Kilos> Trixar_za: why?
[16:17] <Trixar_za> It's a port of Red Alert's engine?
[16:17] <Trixar_za> Shame about being written in Mono though
[16:17] <Trixar_za> :P
[16:17] <superfly> magespawn: if you have some time, that would be great. You're welcome to join us in #openlp
[16:17] <Kilos> oh ya red alert
[16:22] <Trixar_za> http://www.pokemon-online.eu/
[16:22] <Kilos> isnt there an app to convert mono to python
[16:22] <Kilos> ?
[16:22] <Trixar_za> Now I've seen everything
[16:22] <Kilos> oh can you tell what language is used by looking at it?
[16:26] <Kilos> http://slexy.org/view/s20Ber9TOX
[16:32] <superfly> Kilos: VB.NET
[16:34] <Kilos> oh my is that a language superfly?
[16:34] <Kilos> or must i go to that site?
[16:34] <magespawn> Visual Basic
[16:35] <Kilos> oh ty magespawn
[16:36] <Kilos> ty superfly thats what ian has to fiddle with to get them scanner things working
[16:39] <magespawn> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visual_Basic_.NET
[16:39] <Kilos> ty magespawn
[16:40] <smile> you didn't know that vb.net is visual basic with .net framework? :)
[16:41] <Cantide> eeewwww
[16:41] <smile> Kilos: you have to learn more
[16:41] <smile> even at your age :)
[16:41] <magespawn> smile maybe you do to
[16:42] <Kilos> learning is easy smile , its remembering that is the prob
[16:42] <Kilos> but i been learning almost daily since i came to ubuntu
[16:42] <smile> :)
[16:43] <Kilos> lol ya magespawn i told him as well he must still study for a few more years
[16:43] <smile> very good uncle Kilos :)
[16:43] <smile> magespawn: what? :)
[16:43] <Kilos> hehe
[16:45] <magespawn> there is always more things to learn
[16:46] <magespawn> smile learn more
[16:47] <smile> :D
[16:47] <smile> I'm doing that already
[16:48] <smile> :)
[16:48] <smile> I'm trying to learn how ChatZilla works
[16:48]  * smile has just made a new bug report https://bugs.launchpad.net/midori/+bug/1062421
[16:48] <smile> :)
[16:48] <magespawn> and age SHOULD have nothing to do with it
[16:48] <magespawn> right
[16:48] <smile> of course not, magespawn
[16:52] <magespawn> me thinks that you concentrate mainly on computer though
[16:55] <smile> yeah, but you should learn other things too :)
[16:56] <smile> like local geography
[16:56] <smile> know your region
[16:56] <smile> :)
[16:59] <Kilos> supper time
[16:59] <Kilos> bbl
[16:59] <smile> Guys, do you like http://geoffrey.site44.com/ ? :)
[17:00] <smile> It's in Dutch, but if you know Afrikaans it will be easy to read :)
[17:05] <charlvn> hi all
[17:06] <charlvn> wow i have never seen the rand drop this fast
[17:06] <charlvn> it's like people are moving money out of the country at a massive speed
[17:06] <charlvn> are they expecting serious trouble or something?
[17:06] <charlvn> i thought the strikes etc would blow over
[17:06] <charlvn> hi smile
[17:07] <Cantide> well, Amplats just fired 12 000
[17:07] <Cantide> and i think the chaos is still to follow
[17:07] <smile> hi charlvn :p
[17:08] <charlvn> hmmm that's pretty drastic
[17:08] <Cantide> it sucks -.- i'm just watching the exchange rate drop...
[17:08] <charlvn> is amplats planning on closing down?
[17:08] <Cantide> going to be poor on holiday ._.
[17:08] <Cantide> i don't think so
[17:08] <Cantide> i think their workers were striking illegally
[17:08] <charlvn> my uncle has worked there for many years, i wouldn't mind hearing what he has to say
[17:08] <charlvn> i think he still does consulting for them actually
[17:09] <smile> lol, only chatzilla stayed active when enlightenment crashed :p
[17:09] <Cantide> charlvn, i'm off to Korea for a few weeks at the end of November '-'
[17:09] <charlvn> very nice, south korea i hope?
[17:09] <charlvn> :)
[17:10] <charlvn> i was looking at this earlier today: http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/hungry-kim-jong-un
[17:10] <Cantide> yup :)
[17:12] <charlvn> oh my goodness: http://youtu.be/PWiT6VbVpjg
[17:12] <Cantide> hahaha
[17:12] <Cantide> nice meme :p
[17:14] <charlvn> watching part 2 now: http://youtu.be/mGycPE3XdIc
[17:15] <Cantide> hahahahaha
[17:15] <Cantide> WTF
[17:15] <Cantide> this is hilarious :D
[17:16] <charlvn> ok now i have seen it all :)
[17:16] <charlvn> part 1: http://youtu.be/f37K0hIv3zk
[17:17] <smile> charlvn: north is better temperature ;)
[17:18] <charlvn> more insanity: http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/events/death-of-kim-jong-il
[17:19] <charlvn> smile: i hear it's really really hot in south korea, a former colleague of mine's girlfriend is south korean so he spent (spends?) a lot of time there
[17:20] <magespawn> later
[17:20] <magespawn> hoem time
[17:20] <magespawn> home even
[17:20] <smile> It's hotter than Cape Town, of course :)
[17:20] <smile> good night, magespawn
[17:21] <charlvn> haha, just rediscovered this: http://youtu.be/5ac9Arzm7_o
[17:22] <Cantide> charlvn, I was in Daegu in summer a few years ago... that was hotter than Durban ,_,
[17:22] <Cantide> but i think the Philippines is worse - hot all day, all night, all year -.-
[17:24] <smile> Cantide: Just keep in SA ;)
[17:26] <Cantide> smile, nah :D
[17:26] <smile> why not :)
[17:26] <Cantide> that's a complex question
[17:28] <Cantide> Asia gives me economic freedom, safety, a better society and it feels like a permanent holiday '-'
[17:29] <charlvn> Cantide: wow, that's pretty hectic (the heat)
[17:30] <charlvn> and cheap electronics
[17:30] <charlvn> :)
[17:31] <Cantide> oh yeah!!
[17:32] <Cantide> I'm planning to spend at least a full day in Yongsan this time
[17:32] <smile> okay, Cantide :) and what about girls? :p
[17:32] <smile> do you like the asian ones :)
[17:32]  * Cantide blushes
[17:32] <smile> lol :D
[17:32] <Cantide> nothing wrong with them!
[17:33] <smile> I like the girls more here :DD (some :P )
[17:33] <Cantide> haha
[17:33] <smile> here: Belgium :)
[17:33] <Cantide> South African girls... hmmm not for me
[17:33] <Cantide> oh cool :)
[17:33] <Cantide> I'm sure I'd like the girls there, too
[17:34] <smile> Of course you would.
[17:34] <smile> :D
[17:34] <smile> In NL they are nice too
[17:34] <Cantide> i bet :)
[17:34] <smile> will ya visit me, Cantide ? :)
[17:34] <Cantide> haha
[17:34] <Cantide> umm
[17:34] <Cantide> Are you an Asian girl by the name of 민아 in 부산?
[17:35] <smile> noo :p but I can show you what pretty girls are
[17:35] <smile> but only if you have a real relationship with them :)
[17:35] <smile> girls aren't there to hurt
[17:36] <Cantide> sure, i didn't mean to imply that they were
[17:36] <Cantide> anyway, i'm going to see some friends in Korea
[17:36] <Cantide> one of them a girl '-'
[17:36] <smile> some guys only want sex. I don't understand
[17:36] <smile> :p
[17:37] <smile> Cantide: remember it's a friend, not ur girlfriend :p
[17:37] <charlvn> i met the girlfriend of above mentioned (former) colleague in ireland (we were there for a meeting)
[17:37] <smile> have you planned your trip yet?
[17:37] <smile> :)
[17:37] <charlvn> not saying it's my personal taste in women but she was definitely very nice and pretty
[17:38] <Cantide> smile, we will see when i get there how things go :p and no, sex is not going to happen
[17:38] <smile> thats good :p
[17:38] <Cantide> smile, nah, some of my friends seem to be planning it for me -.-
[17:38] <Cantide> but yeah, i have a few things i want to do
[17:38] <smile> lol.. but it can be annoying too
[17:39] <Cantide> yeah
[17:39] <Cantide> they did it last time
[17:39] <Cantide> haha
[17:39] <Cantide> i actually told him to relax a little :p
[17:39] <smile> :p
[17:39] <smile> ^^
[17:40] <smile> I like that.. http://www.hyped.nl/nieuws/samsung-komt-met-kleintje-s3.html
[17:40] <smile> (Galaxy Mini S3 coming)
[17:40] <smile> with nice specs :)
[17:40] <smile> I hope the price won't be over 200 dollars :p
[17:41] <Cantide> oh, nice!
[17:41] <Cantide> i always thought the S3 was a little large
[17:41] <Cantide> but i'd still like one :D
[17:41] <smile> I don't like the format of the S3, so a mini would be fine :D
[17:42] <smile>  Johannesburg – 'n Sangoma en sy bestuurder is Vrydagoggend in hegtenis geneem vir die skending van 'n graf by 'n begraafplaas in Mmabatho, in die Noordwes, het die polisie gesê.
[17:43] <smile> nuus24 :)
[17:43] <smile> I need to inform you of the news :D
[17:43] <Cantide> damn
[17:43] <Cantide> my Afrikaans is not good enough to understand it 100% ,_,
[17:45] <smile> I understand it fully :P And I'm not native speaker :)
[17:46] <Cantide> :p
[17:47] <smile> Cantide: Dutch is very similar to Afrikaans
[17:47] <smile> And the other way around, too
[17:47] <Cantide> yes '-'
[17:47] <Cantide> of that i am aware
[17:47] <Cantide> I haven't used Afrikaans for 10 years
[17:47] <Cantide> and even 10 years ago it wasn't very good
[17:48] <charlvn> dutch and afrikaans is a little like dutch and german - there are a lot of things that are the same but they are just different enough to get you into some serious trouble
[17:48] <charlvn> ;)
[17:48] <Cantide> haha
[17:48] <Cantide> I know a little German, too
[17:48] <charlvn> i was having a conversation with some of my colleagues today about it
[17:48] <Cantide> but I think my Afrikaans might be better than my German ._.
[17:49] <smile> charlvn: lol ;)
[17:49] <Cantide> brb, coffee time '-'
[17:49] <smile> Afrikaans is more similar to Dutch than Dutch is similar to German
[17:49] <charlvn> i used the example of a south african that asked the girl behind the till if he could see her "slipje"
[17:49] <smile> :o
[17:49] <charlvn> a "slip" is a "bonnetje" in afrikaans so that is perfectly normal to ask to see the slip
[17:50] <charlvn> of course, in dutch it has a whole other meaning and the girl was very angry
[17:50] <charlvn> but that kind of thing happens so easily
[17:50] <charlvn> it's like when i tried to log into google in germany and i got asked to log into "google konten"
[17:50] <charlvn> i understood "konten" to mean "assholes" so i was quite terrified of having to "log in"
[17:51] <charlvn> then i looked it up in the dictionary and found out it means "accounts" in german
[17:51] <charlvn> again, have to be very careful ;)
[18:03] <smile> Peace and happiness might be found. :)
[18:04] <smile> lol, charlvn :p
[18:12] <charlvn> i just got this sent to me by someone in south africa: http://i.imgur.com/x7r4N.jpg
[18:15] <smile> The most explicit song text was written by I Wayne
[18:15] <smile> :)
[18:15] <smile> One man can't satisfy her / She needs more wood for da fire / Sex price getting higher, ah more money she require
[18:15] <smile> House, car , and land she desire / so from di prostitution work she won't retire / Flames and fireee, burn the sex seller and the fire
[18:16] <smile>  / is new line ;)
[18:20] <charlvn> phew
[18:20] <charlvn> some gangsta stuff
[18:21] <smile> yeaah :p
[18:21] <smile> charlvn: are you gangsta? :o
[18:21]  * smile runs to to the other side of the world
[18:21] <smile> * to to => to
[18:21] <charlvn> nope, i'm gangnam style, nog gangsta style ;)
[18:22] <charlvn> oppa gangnam style!
[18:22] <smile> :D
[18:22] <smile> Dancin' before she reach eleven :o
[18:22] <charlvn> :D
[18:23] <charlvn> like on a horse
[18:23] <smile> :P
[18:23] <smile> What they mean with the L zone?
[18:24] <charlvn> l zone? no idea, where did you see it?
[18:24] <smile> in that video, I thought I heard that
[18:24] <smile> :)
[18:26] <Cantide> http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mbccmj9iAS1romxd7o1_1280.png
[18:27] <smile> Who's that? :)
[18:27] <Cantide> gangnam style :p
[18:28] <Cantide> transposed onto a picture of the NZ rugby team doing the haka
[18:28] <smile> oo :)
[18:28] <smile> :D
[18:28] <Cantide> looks like the same moves :D
[18:28] <smile> xD
[18:28] <smile> Cantide: how many mb/month have you? :)
[18:29] <Cantide> 60 GB + 60 GB
[18:29] <Cantide> lasts for a year or until i use it up .-.
[18:29] <smile> okay :)
[18:29] <Cantide> so if i use 5 GB a month, i will be fine :p
[18:29] <smile> I see :)
[18:29] <smile> :D
[18:29] <smile> boemboem?
[18:29] <Cantide> and the other 60 GB at night i can use for downloads or such '-'
[18:29] <Cantide> boemboem?
[18:30] <Cantide> i won't ask about your internet connection, because it'll make me weep
[18:30] <smile> Cantide: boemboem => BOOM!! :D
[18:30] <Cantide> oh :p
[18:31] <Cantide> talking to that girl now '-'
[18:31] <smile> Cantide: I'm even uploading.. :p not only downloading
[18:31] <Cantide> so excuse my slow responses
[18:31] <smile> is the pretty :)
[18:31] <charlvn> boemkool!
[18:31] <Cantide> smile, i would if i had the bandwidth to spare :p
[18:32] <Cantide> smile, all girls are pretty :)
[18:32] <smile> charlvn: ja.
[18:32] <charlvn> http://youtu.be/5-5BL7WqwZA
[18:32] <smile> Cantide: they aren't :p
[18:32] <Cantide> depends how you look at them :p
[18:32] <Cantide> well, if you like a girl, she is pretty to you
[18:32] <Cantide> so of course my answer is yes
[18:33] <smile> doei! :)
[18:33] <charlvn> ciao smile
[18:33] <smile> i see, Cantide :)
[18:33] <smile> but not every girl is pretty (according yourself)
[18:33] <smile> good night everyone :)
[18:33] <charlvn> oooh that film, that "egel" is obnoxious
[18:34] <Cantide> good night smile :p
[18:34] <Cantide> smile, that's because you can only like 1 at a time :p
[18:34] <smile> :)
[18:34] <smile> hug
[18:34] <smile> you could be right :)
[18:34] <smile> see ya
[18:39] <Kilos> night guys. sleep tight
[19:16] <magespawn> evening all
[19:28] <charlvn> hi magespawn
[19:29] <magespawn> hey charlvn
[19:42] <Squirm> internet
[19:42] <Squirm> finally
[19:47] <magespawn> hey Squirm
[19:47] <Squirm> hello magespawn
[19:54] <magespawn> good night y'all
[19:55] <Squirm> same. I'm off. gnight
[20:09] <inetpro> good evening
[20:22] <charlvn> hi inetpro
[20:22] <inetpro> hi charlvn
[20:22] <inetpro> how goes
[20:22] <charlvn> long time no speak to, how's it going
[20:22] <charlvn> i'm doing well thanks
[20:22] <inetpro> good and yeah self?
[20:22] <charlvn> finished moving into my new appartment, feeling great
[20:22] <inetpro> nice
[20:23] <charlvn> i still have a couple of loose ends i need to finish off here though
[20:23] <charlvn> but for the most part i can start taking it a little easier now
[20:23] <inetpro> charlvn: I was wondering, have you dealt with drupal yet?
[20:23] <charlvn> i used to develop on drupal 6 and 7 a long time ago
[20:23] <charlvn> well, by long time i mean something like 6 or so years
[20:23]  * inetpro is thinking about importing lots of legacy data to a drupal database
[20:23] <charlvn> for ict terms, a really long time
[20:24] <inetpro> all text based
[20:24] <inetpro> one record per file
[20:24] <charlvn> drupal can have a very strange database structure sometimes, as long as you're careful it shouldn't be too difficult
[20:24] <charlvn> it used to have a really strange way of handling metadata
[20:24] <charlvn> it had these nodes but that then link with a bunch of different tables
[20:25] <inetpro> eish
[20:25] <charlvn> i didn't really like it very much, i found it too complex to and unhandy to work with
[20:25] <charlvn> that said, that was a long time ago :)
[20:25] <charlvn> maybe by now it's much cleaner / easier
[20:25]  * inetpro needs to find some time to learn the structure a bit
[20:25] <charlvn> once you "get it" it isn't too bad
[20:25] <charlvn> you just need to put some time aside and learn it properly
[20:26] <inetpro> I've seen a html to drupal import module somewhere but not text to drupal
[20:27] <inetpro> or a script at least
[20:28] <charlvn> if it's a simple structure it should be really easy to do it directly into the database
[20:28] <charlvn> i have done database imports where i literally generate the sql with some bash script
[20:28] <charlvn> *scripting i mean
[20:29]  * inetpro should actually create some dummy data and put it out as a challenge for anybody
[20:29] <charlvn> lol
[20:29] <charlvn> could be fun
[20:29] <charlvn> (for someone who still works with drupal, i mean, not me) ;)
[20:29] <inetpro> :-)
[20:53] <inetpro> Ludo: wb
[20:54] <inetpro> charlvn: can you see the files in the following link https://www.dropbox.com/sh/hifxmtf9hdemu36/TtZNa0Q-AL/DrupalTXTImportTest
[21:02] <charlvn> inetpro: that's just a date, title and body right?
[21:02] <charlvn> that's very easy
[21:03] <inetpro> charlvn: yes it is basically as simple as that
[21:03] <charlvn> so you wanna loop through each directory and just import the files one by one
[21:03] <inetpro> just for proof of concept
[21:03] <charlvn> if i remember correctly that would be very easy to do
[21:03] <inetpro> charlvn: true
[21:03] <charlvn> with a little python script or something
[21:03] <charlvn> you just need a database connector and some basic file/string handling
[21:04] <charlvn> if i had a drupal database handy i would have done it for you
[21:06] <inetpro> charlvn: even if you just play with the basic concept of reading the data from file and submitting to a dummy database I'd appreciate the help
[21:06] <inetpro> we can find out about the drupal structure laters
[21:11] <zeref> hmmm
[21:11] <zeref> any css, php guru here?
[21:12] <inetpro> zeref: don't ask to ask, just ask
[21:12] <inetpro> oh and anybody is welcome to help with above mentioned challenge
[21:13] <zeref> forgot bout the asking thing.
[21:14] <inetpro> zeref: no problem :-)
[21:14] <zeref> k, i would like to create a table with a couple of rows and colums
[21:14] <zeref> i will use css for that.
[21:15] <zeref> not i need to fetch data from database and place it into the rows and columns
[21:15] <zeref> for that I'll use php.
[21:15] <zeref> how do i get the data into the table?
[21:20] <charlvn> zeref: retrieve rows, loop through each row, generate <tr>...</tr> html?
[21:21] <charlvn> that's pretty simple, there should be a million tutorials out there that can give an example
[21:21] <inetpro> zeref: I was thinking the same thing as charlvn, there should be many samples out there for your case
[21:22] <charlvn> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/8904124/looping-through-and-displaying-multiple-table-rows-from-sql
[21:22] <inetpro> not sure how you want to use css for creating rows and columns
[21:23] <charlvn> http://davidwalsh.name/html-mysql-php
[21:25] <charlvn> and a million others, just google
[21:25] <superfly> A million bad tutorials too.
[21:26] <charlvn> that's true
[21:27] <charlvn> but you start somewhere :P
[21:27] <charlvn> start dumb, iterate until smart
[21:35] <superfly> if only it actually worked that way...
[21:38] <zeref> sigh
[21:39] <inetpro> zeref: wb
[21:44]  * inetpro 's challenge described in just a bit more detail: http://slexy.org/view/s208X0EQYU
[21:48] <zeref> hmmmm
[21:48] <zeref> inetpro: I'm also busy with drupal as well :D
[21:50] <inetpro> zeref: I just had to spell a few things out for myself to start with, will continue with the exercise as I find time
[21:50]  * inetpro heading off to hit the sack
[21:50] <inetpro> good night everyone
[21:51] <charlvn> superfly: you don't become smart by practising? are you smart overnight?
[21:51] <charlvn> inetpro: good night! :)


[15:14] <hal> I am trying to create a searchplugin for firefox, but it keeps using the + character to separate searchTerms
[15:14] <hal> does someone know how I can change this behaviour?
[15:15] <gavin> you can't, short of modifying firefox
[15:16] <hal> do you know that for certain gavin ?
[15:21] <gavin> I wrote the firefox search service :)
[15:21] <hal> oh :) Thank you for your authoritive answer then :)
[22:00] <chrisccoulson> fta - how come the umd uploads still fail? i reverted the change that made it break initially
[22:00] <micahg> chrisccoulson: so, disabling PIE is the answer for natty builds ATM?
[22:01] <chrisccoulson> micahg - yeah, but only temporarily
[22:01] <chrisccoulson> we still need to fix the real problem
[22:02] <micahg> I guess it doesn't matter much, early adopters are probably more cautious anyways
[22:05]  * chrisccoulson must remember to send the gcc bug upstream tomorrow
[22:06] <micahg> chrisccoulson: so, the TB dailies will take me a little while longer, so I'm going to get the wrapper script for Lucid done first since I know how to do that, that way we can start the testing and have about a month until we have to push to Lucid
[22:06] <chrisccoulson> cool, thanks
[22:42] <fta> chrisccoulson, conflicts in a branch, not sure how. did you do a revert at some point?
[22:44] <fta> conflicts in d/control
[22:45] <micahg> xul192 needs to be updated to not use PIE for natty, I'll do this before the bot run later tonight
[22:58] <chrisccoulson> fta - hmmm, i've not changed much in debian/control
[22:58] <chrisccoulson> micahg - i thought i updates xul192 already
[22:58] <chrisccoulson> s/updates/updated
[22:58] <micahg> chrisccoulson: if you did, I must have missed it, feel free
[22:59] <chrisccoulson> micahg - oh, forgot to push ;)
[22:59] <micahg> chrisccoulson: k
[22:59] <chrisccoulson> ok, just pushed that now
[22:59]  * micahg was wondering why the others were done
[23:00]  * micahg just didn't want to have to poke lamont again to kill the prism build
[23:08] <fta> chrisccoulson, something nov 3. i reverted a bunch of my branches to before that point. re-spinning now
[23:09] <chrisccoulson> fta - thanks
[23:27] <fta> http://q-funk.blogspot.com/2010/11/ubuntu-no-longer-ships-debianchangelog.html !?? wtf?


[12:57] -queuebot:#ubuntu-quality- Builds: Ubuntu Base amd64 [Xenial 16.04.2] (20170209) has been added
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[18:26] <vgoodguy> anyone ?
[18:30] <flocculant> anyone what?


[03:09] <White_Light> is there any documentation on the performance effects of having CONFIG_LOCK_STAT enabled, with /proc/sys/kernel/lock_stat set to 0
[08:11] <apw> White_Light, not that i am aware of
[10:25] <mamarley> apw: It looks like the mainline build for 4.16.8 again failed: http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/v4.16.8/
[10:29] <apw> mamarley, bah, bloody upstream changing the kernel makefile ABI
[10:29] <apw> "kconfig: rename silentoldconfig to syncconfig"
[10:30] <mamarley> Yeah, that seems ill-advised for a point release…
[10:30] <apw> no this is because 4.16 does not have it, but 4.17 does, which is where the packaging is coming from
[10:30] <mamarley> Ah, OK.
[10:30] <apw> but really upstream, a pox on you
[10:30] <apw> mamarley, that is going to take a bit to work around
[10:31] <mamarley> No problem, I will just run by own build.
[10:31] <mamarley> s/by/my
[13:00] <White_Light> apw, but I'm guessing that performance is the reason CONFIG_LOCK_STAT is not set on stock ubuntu kernel configs?
[13:00] <apw> White_Light, that is highly likely
[13:00] <apw> though we would have evaluated it most likely at the time it was first added and not since
[13:02] <White_Light> I see
[13:03] <White_Light> thanks for your help, I appreciate you guys having this public channel
[13:03] <apw> it is the ubuntu way :)
[13:04] <apw> we try and be transparent in the main


[15:44] <jrwren_> doing impish -> jammy right now.
[15:44] <jrwren_> I tried to lookup the definition of jammy. I'm still not sure what it is.
[15:44] <jrwren_> Imma assume it is related to Ice Cube lyrics.
[18:14] <Scary_Guy> I read it and thought it was https://jami.net at first.
[18:17] <cmaloney> I used to use that
[18:17] <cmaloney> until I realized it was easier to throw my message into a bottle in the ocean than to expect real-time conversations


[11:47] <flocculant> morning
[11:48] <flocculant> pleia2: could you a small thing for me please - lose me off the facebook thingy as admin. TIA :)
[16:37]  * pleia2 tries to figure out how to use fb
[16:38] <pleia2> flocculant: I think I succeeded ;)
[17:03] <flocculant> pleia2: thank you :)


[00:32] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- Trevinho, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2985 Publishing packages
[00:47] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- Trevinho, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2985 UNAPPROVED queue
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[09:24] <rmg51> Morning
[11:45] <icey> ahoy
[12:11] <teddy-dbear> Morning peoples, critters and everything else


[10:27] <DanChapman> Good Morning :-)
[10:58] <davmor2> Morning all
[13:46] <pitti> jibel: argh, does *every* effing autopkgtest have to fail now :(
[13:47] <pitti> libchewing is a real failure, libgdata another instance of "test runs on known-uninstallable packages"
[13:47] <pitti> jibel: (nevermind, just whining)
[13:49] <jibel> pitti, because it is Friday.
[13:50] <jibel> DanChapman, I reviewed your MP of ubiquity, looks good but I couldn't test on lubuntu or xubuntu because the session doesn't start
[13:51] <jibel> DanChapman, I tested with the current version too and they dont start either. So I'm tempted to blame the current images and approve your mp
[13:55] <DanChapman> jibel, hey there o/. Lovely thanks :-) They were running fine when I did the MP I haven't tried them the last few days, so I would probably also be inclined to blame the current images. I'll give them a run now, also it looks like that bug is still hanging around??
[13:57] <jibel> DanChapman, I tried with current build
[13:58] <jibel> as of less than 1h ago
[14:33] <jibel> DanChapman, merged and deployed
[14:33] <jibel> DanChapman, do you want me to re-run some tests or wait for next automated run?
[14:38] <DanChapman> jibel, great thanks, might as well wait for the next run of automated tests, the GNOME runs start soonish anyway and see how they all look over the weekend :-) thanks for the review
[15:17] <qengho> phillw, all: Hi hi.  Want to check chromioum before I give upload?  https://launchpad.net/~canonical-chromium-builds/+archive/stage
[19:47] <TheLordOfTime> jibel, ping, mind if i bother you for a bit?
[20:00] <TheLordOfTime> bdmurray, ping, have you noticed the major changes to the bug wiki data?  (jibel sent out an email to -quality about it)
[20:01] <TheLordOfTime> (well, CC'd, same difference)
[20:01]  * TheLordOfTime is curious about others' opinions, since jibel and myself have already voiced to some extent disagreements
[20:04] <balloons> TheLordOfTime, I saw your reply
[20:05] <TheLordOfTime> balloons, apart from me obviously having my triaging disrupted from things, opinions on the radical changes ALberto did?
[20:05] <TheLordOfTime> (that disrupted my triaging a bit...)
[20:06] <balloons> TheLordOfTime, it's better practice to not make sweeping changes that you think would have potential to be discussed
[20:06] <balloons> really, even a passing glance or informal disscussion would be better
[20:06] <TheLordOfTime> balloons, so generally the same thing that jibel and myself said, of course i went a little more verbose...
[20:06] <balloons> I'll let Alberto know how to copy pages and setup his new versions without disrupting things
[20:06] <balloons> that's how I would rather see it done
[20:06] <TheLordOfTime> balloons, agreed, that's how its always been done
[20:07] <balloons> I think he wanted to prompt discussion and needed to show what he wanted to do
[20:07] <TheLordOfTime> even with the BUg Squad, a while ago, when we were defining "core" and "non-core" for importance, I opened the discussion up before we changed *anything*
[20:07] <TheLordOfTime> did you read his response to jibel, balloons?
[20:07] <TheLordOfTime> Why I changed pages without asking
[20:07] <TheLordOfTime> - Because I guess letting people make changes and discussing only those on which we don't agree makes further progress, further than speaking everything before hand. And if there's no consensus letting other's opinion to prevail.
[20:07] <TheLordOfTime> i don't understand his reasons
[20:08] <balloons> english is not his native language so it's difficult sometimes :-) But I think I get his points
[20:08] <balloons> he wants to make changes and not sit and wait.. he should make changes, be proactive, ask for discussion and then make the page edits
[20:08] <balloons> if no one responds over a time period, well, he should feel free to make the changes
[20:09] <balloons> but you'll always get a response unless you are the only team member :-)
[20:09] <TheLordOfTime> agreed
[20:13] <TheLordOfTime> balloons, forgive me if i seemed to take a wholly-negative view on his changes, pointing out my concerns with each thing he said in his response... if i seemed too much on the offensive I apologize
[20:13] <balloons> TheLordOfTime, no worries. It was taken out of a defensive position certainly, but we'll keep the conversation going
[20:13] <balloons> Did anyone revert back or are we leaving it alone for now?
[20:14] <TheLordOfTime> it's still at alberto's revs
[20:14] <TheLordOfTime> I agree with jibel though.  "I'd suggest to revert this page to rev 33, (especially the renaming of the page) then discuss your changes."
[20:15] <TheLordOfTime> (rev33 was the last changes I made after the discussion on the bugsquad mailing list about the defining of core and non-core on the page
[20:17] <TheLordOfTime> but i don't have privs apparently so i can't do anything, your call though whether we revert and force the discussion, balloons.
[20:17] <TheLordOfTime> oop
[20:17] <TheLordOfTime> balloons, it's already reverted
[20:17] <TheLordOfTime> by Alberto
[20:18] <balloons> ohh, I see
[20:19] <balloons> lol, I clicked send before I finished the mail
[20:19] <balloons> ohh well
[20:19] <TheLordOfTime> balloons, it needs a name change though AFIACT
[20:19] <TheLordOfTime> but that'll break the links again
[20:20] <TheLordOfTime> since he seems to have suggested he changed the links everywhere to the new page URL
[20:20] <balloons> mm.. redirects are MUCH more appropriate. But why change the name of the page?
[20:22] <TheLordOfTime> exactly
[20:23] <TheLordOfTime> I even stated as such: "Why?" and made note that it's sufficient as it was by URL alone to identify it is about BUg importance
[20:25] <TheLordOfTime> balloons, i'm all for simplifying the documentation.  I'm not in support at all of changing the URL and page name
[20:25] <TheLordOfTime> at all.
[20:25] <TheLordOfTime> but that's my opinion
[20:25] <balloons> yes.. there's still many /Testing pages because I'm not changing them all to /QATeam or whatever
[20:25] <TheLordOfTime> mhm
[20:25] <balloons> or /Quality
[20:25] <balloons> lol..
[20:25] <TheLordOfTime> heh
[20:36] <TheLordOfTime> balloons, "and make drastic changes there. Then ask others for feedback. Does this make sense? Look at the " Error: Reached End Of Line before sentence was complete.
[20:36] <TheLordOfTime> (grammar nazi mode on :P)
[20:44] <balloons> TheLordOfTime, yes, my email wasn't done when it sent
[20:44] <balloons> remember the convo? I was asking if it had been reverted and hit send on accident
[20:44] <balloons> haha
[20:45] <TheLordOfTime> lol
[21:23] <phillw> qengho: hi, sorry, been on a course today... ppas added and am uploading now.
[21:24] <qengho> phillw, uploading?
[21:24] <phillw> qengho: how much testing do you need? As to if it works with multiple tabs I can do that PDQ
[21:25] <phillw> qengho: sorry... been playing on the server... I mean dowloading :P
[21:26] <phillw> TheLordOfTime: btw, what killed your znc the other night? was it the dreaded OOM as I was told the server itself was still functional?
[21:26] <qengho> phillw, not extensive. precise or q simple tests.
[21:27] <TheLordOfTime> phillw, probably best to ask in the trekweb channel, although it appears i got boucned from your channel o.O
[21:27] <phillw> qengho: if it handle what abuse I give it, and does not go silly with cpu time for facebook would be nice :P
[21:28] <phillw> TheLordOfTime: I was granted primary channel status, so it is now #phillw :D
[21:28] <TheLordOfTime> ah nice
[21:29] <TheLordOfTime> phillw, i privmsg'd you about the details of what happened
[21:41] <phillw> qengho: it has restarted into Version 31.0.1650.63 Ubuntu 13.10 (31.0.1650.63-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS>~20131204) opened up my 13 tabs which are a mix of bbc news / wiki / launchpad and various other pages quite happily... I'd give it a thumbs up.
[22:01] <phillw> qengho: I've asked on the lubuntu-qa list if any of them are running chromium, it has been cc'd to Chad (unless you are he). but from me, it is fine. Is there any particular bug fixes in the new version we should be looking for?
[22:23] <qengho> phillw, just security update, major version change tho
[22:23] <qengho> phillw, I am C.
[22:34] <phillw> qengho: it is performing perfectly with multiple tabs open. I've not had chance to see if it still hits the OOM error problem.
[22:39] <phillw> qengho: I'd have to re visit the bug and set up test machines again for that. Do they think that they have solved the memory leakage yet? If so, I'd be more than happy to re-run the tests I did last time.
[22:40] <qengho> phillw, i expect no change, but i world like to be surprised.
[22:40] <phillw> do you recall the bug # ?
[22:43] <phillw> qengho: well, if they have, it would silence this.. http://ubuntu.5.x6.nabble.com/Chromium-Memory-Hog-and-Crashing-td5028285.html
[22:45] <phillw> I'm frankly amazed that a company the size of google does not have people to solve a critical memory leak issue. It's the #1 priority of an application!
[22:46] <phillw> but, meh, that's just me getting annoyed at things.. please do not take offence :)
[22:47] <qengho> phillw, i can't see that here, but it may be passive to write javascript that "correctly" makes objects that can't be GC'd..
[22:47] <qengho> possible
[22:50] <phillw> well, if it goes OOM on sites like http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/ then it does have major issues :)
[23:00] <phillw> qengho: you can accept the invite, we do not bite! BTW, I found the bug... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/chromium-browser/+bug/1096603


[00:30] <thumper> babbageclunk, timClicks: vsan summary?
[00:30] <babbageclunk> thumper: summary is: good - just testing out the non-hacked together version
[00:31] <thumper> cool cool
[03:56] <wallyworld> thumper: new azure regions turned out to be lots-o-fun https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/10518
[04:07] <timClicks> wallyworld: thanks for wrangling through all of that
[04:08] <timClicks> babbageclunk: hey btw could you raise a PR against my branch? I think that thin disk provisioning may be closer than we think
[04:08] <timClicks> but I need the VM template stuff working
[04:15] <babbageclunk> timClicks: pushing as we speak
[04:24] <babbageclunk> timClicks: https://github.com/timClicks/juju/pull/1
[04:25] <babbageclunk> ha, it's prompting me to delete my fork of timClicks/juju
[04:26] <babbageclunk> and I'm all like "nuh-uh! If anything timclicks/juju is a fork of babbageclunk/juju!"
[04:27] <timClicks> babbageclunk:  thanks for ruining my day by destroying all of my stuff github
[06:07] <wallyworld> kelvinli_: i just need a +1 on a forward port of 2.6 https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/10519
[06:08] <kelvinli_> wallyworld: done!
[06:08] <wallyworld> ty
[06:08] <kelvinli_> np
[10:07] <stickupkid> merge 2.6 branch of pylibjuju into master https://github.com/juju/python-libjuju/pull/338 - only 120k of changes :|
[13:28] <stickupkid> achilleasa, if we get rick_h to make a 2.7 branch once i've merged https://github.com/juju/python-libjuju/pull/338 into master, then you should just be able to copy the schema to the client folder and ln -s correctly with latest and then run make client
[13:29] <achilleasa> stickupkid: thanks for the tip!
[13:29] <rick_h> stickupkid:  land your branch first so the branch has that in it
[13:29] <stickupkid> rick_h, achilleasa yeah, i've kicked it off
[13:29] <stickupkid> achilleasa, pointers here https://discourse.jujucharms.com/t/python-libjuju/1553
[13:29] <stickupkid> love me some discourse :D
[13:32] <stickupkid> rick_h, achilleasa it's landed
[13:32] <rick_h> stickupkid:  k, after the call I'll try to get it up
[13:40] <rick_h> stickupkid:  achilleasa created the 2.7 branch
[14:17] <stickupkid> rick_h, pylibjuju new version with CMR, 0.11.8 or 0.12.0 or 1.0.0?
[14:18] <rick_h> stickupkid:  hmm, we talked about matching juju right?
[14:18] <rick_h> stickupkid:  what do you think of the 2.6.x?
[14:18] <stickupkid> rick_h, well, yeah, that could work, as it would make sense
[14:18] <stickupkid> rick_h, should i mention anything in the readme about that?
[14:20] <rick_h> stickupkid:  yea, and maybe discourse about moving to matching the juju versions
[14:20] <rick_h> stickupkid:  always better to overshare vs under
[14:20] <stickupkid> rick_h, 100% agree
[14:29] <achilleasa> stickupkid: so for the bundle bit do I need to set my version to 2.7.0? 2.7-rc1 ?
[14:30] <stickupkid> achilleasa, i'm never sure, we shouldn't release it with that, so maybe rc1 to ensure people delete it and replace it with 2.7.0
[14:30] <stickupkid> 2.7-deleteme
[14:30] <achilleasa> or 2.7-dev?
[14:31] <achilleasa> I see some with the -rcX suffix
[14:35] <stickupkid> 2.7-dev
[14:35] <stickupkid> achilleasa, the rcX suffix ones need to be removed
[14:36] <rick_h> stickupkid:  HO?
[15:09] <stickupkid> CR for 2.6.6 release for pylibjuju https://github.com/juju/python-libjuju/pull/339
[15:13] <manadart> hml: I am about to finish up, but could you look at https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/10520 in your day?
[15:14] <hml> manadart:  sure.  trade you for a short one? https://github.com/juju/description/pull/59
[15:14] <manadart> hml: Done deal.
[15:51] <pmatulis> in an overlay, i needed to include a machine definition not used in the overlay but that *is* used in the accompanying bundle. what is the rationale there?
[15:52] <stickupkid> pmatulis, achilleasa might know that
[15:53] <achilleasa> pmatulis: is this with 2.6 or develop? can you share the bundle/overlay so I can take a look?
[15:56] <rick_h> pmatulis:  I think it's just a limitation of the merging logic
[15:58] <pmatulis> achilleasa, v.2.6.6
[15:58] <pmatulis> rick_h, seems odd. especially when the error references the bundle and not the overlay
[15:59] <rick_h> pmatulis:  right, a matter of the merging/resolving process is my guess
[15:59] <achilleasa> pmatulis: can you please try the same with develop? We have completely refactored the merge logic for the upcoming 2.7 so it might work as expected with the latest edge
[16:04] <pmatulis> achilleasa, ohh, fyi: https://pastebin.canonical.com/p/CGPR6ZsnMF/
[16:07] <pmatulis> achilleasa, will the upcoming changes have potential for breakage if people don't make changes?
[16:08] <achilleasa> pmatulis: no, the changes should be backwards-compatible (actually even better as some stuff like for instance the 'trust' flag cannot be currently overwritten via an overlay). The 2.7 version additionally supports the cmr-in-bundle work
[16:11] <rick_h> stickupkid:  one question on the versioning in the PR
[16:12] <stickupkid> rick_h, shoot
[16:12] <stickupkid> rick_h, actually i'll trade you a PR for a question https://github.com/juju/cmd/pull/66
[16:12] <rick_h> stickupkid:  sorry, replied with it. mainly...as much as I don't want to...<IP_ADDRESS>?
[16:12] <stickupkid> hmmm
[16:12] <stickupkid> <IP_ADDRESS>?
[16:12] <rick_h> stickupkid:  e.g. if we have to rev a libjuju version without a new juju version?
[16:13] <stickupkid> rick_h, yeah, but start a 0
[16:13] <stickupkid> ?
[16:13] <rick_h> stickupkid:  is it enough to do 2.6 and then rev libjuju indepdenent?
[16:13] <rick_h> stickupkid:  fair enough
[16:13] <pmatulis> achilleasa, sweet, thanks
[16:13] <stickupkid> rick_h, "is it enough to do 2.6 and then rev libjuju indepdenent" - not sure i understand
[16:13] <achilleasa> pmatulis: the QA steps for https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/10476 include examples of the upcoming overlay changes. Note that the multi-doc yaml bundles are only processed by the new code path (but they are only used by the CMR features which older clients ignore anyway)
[16:14] <rick_h> stickupkid:  so do we say that python-libjuju tracks 2.6 and so 2.6.3 might actually have the release note item of "updated to 2.6.7 api changes"
[16:14] <rick_h> stickupkid:  e.g. since the api facades are locked in a way you should be able to use python-libjuju 2.6.x with any 2.6 juju?
[16:14] <stickupkid> rick_h, ah in that case shouldn't it be 2.6.7 and we jump versions?
[16:15] <stickupkid> rick_h, that might luck ugly though
[16:15]  * rick_h doesn't follow that...
[16:15] <stickupkid> rick_h, ho?
[16:16] <rick_h> stickupkid:  omw
[16:31] <pmatulis> first time i've seen one of my machines' state suddenly go from 'started' to 'down'. why does this happen?
[16:31] <pmatulis> machine agent croaks?
[16:33] <pmatulis> corresponding MAAS node shows it's powered off
[17:00] <stickupkid> pylibjuju 2.6.0 released with CMR support
[17:00] <stickupkid> manadart, released, i'll make a discourse post for it
[17:06] <stickupkid> manadart, here you go https://discourse.jujucharms.com/t/pylibjuju-2-6-0-release-notes/1926
[17:30] <rick_h> pmatulis:  so the agent restarts as part of going up
[17:30] <rick_h> pmatulis:  if you time it right you can catch it in a down state but it should flip back
[17:30] <rick_h> pmatulis:  if it doesn't then something went boom/etc
[17:31] <pmatulis> rick_h, yeah, the node just crapped out on me. i had to power it back on via the MAAS web UI. everything looks fine now though. scary
[17:31] <rick_h> pmatulis:  ah, yea don't trust hardware :)
[17:36]  * rick_h secretly adds cards and sticks stickupkid's head on them for later in the week bwuhahahaha
[18:44] <rick_h> hml:  can I bug you to make sure I typed "python" right please? https://github.com/CanonicalLtd/juju-qa-jenkins/pull/261
[18:44] <hml> rick_h: sure, looking
[18:48] <hml> rick_h: approved
[18:51] <rick_h> hml:  ty
[20:13] <stickupkid> rick_h, :worried:
[20:13] <rick_h> stickupkid:  lol, all good you already did it
[20:13] <rick_h> just didn't see it right away
[20:13] <stickupkid> rick_h, haha
[21:27] <wallyworld> timClicks: any luck with the thin disk spike?
[21:28] <timClicks> wallyworld: I've found the two places that we need to change, but something weird happened when I tried to bootstrap
[21:28] <timClicks> the process hung indefinitely
[21:29] <wallyworld> could be related to the changes i guess. sounds like it needs a little more work to be acheievable
[21:29] <wallyworld> thanks for trying
[21:44] <timClicks> wallyworld: out of curiousity, how does juju/mutex work? I think bootstrap is hanging because a previous mutex hasn't been released
[22:04] <wallyworld> timClicks: it's a machine wide mutex which uses flock on *nix and something else on windows
[23:34] <thumper> review for someone: https://github.com/juju/schema/pull/19
[23:35] <thumper> ugh, no merge bot set up for schema package
[23:36] <thumper> looks like we have never had one set up
[23:37] <thumper> babbageclunk: got a moment? ^^
[23:38]  * thumper remembers that babbageclunk is busy this morning
[23:38] <thumper> wallyworld: ^^
[23:38] <babbageclunk> thumper: sure - in 1:1?
[23:38] <thumper> oh... you are here
[23:38] <thumper> babbageclunk: I was pointing to the simple schema review
[23:38] <thumper> I tried to use a schema.TimeDuration in controller config
[23:38] <thumper> and the error message it gave was not overly helpful,
[23:38] <thumper> so fixing the root problem
[23:38] <babbageclunk> oh sorry, thought you were asking about a merge
[23:39] <babbageclunk> -bot
[23:39] <babbageclunk> ok taking a look
[23:39] <thumper> nah, just the PR
[23:39] <hpidcock> thumper: LGTM
[23:39] <thumper> the duration was added by copying the time one
[23:40] <thumper> unfortunately, I wrote the time one four years ago
[23:40] <thumper> so I can't even really blame someone else for missing it
[23:40] <thumper> thanks hpidcock
[23:40] <babbageclunk> I also have approved it
[23:41]  * thumper waits just in case babbageclunk has a question
[23:41] <thumper> thanks
[23:41] <babbageclunk> just in case
[23:41] <thumper> all good
[23:41] <babbageclunk> only comment was about the horrible formatting you fixed
[23:41] <thumper> you mean gofmt fixed
[23:41] <babbageclunk> Sure, your robot minion
[23:42] <babbageclunk> sometimes I deliberately format code wrong so I can watch it fix it
[23:42] <thumper> now I need to remember how to update the vendor shit
[23:42] <babbageclunk> make rebuild-dependencies?
[23:42] <thumper> anastasiamac: that is a bit of a burn
[23:42] <babbageclunk> Oh but you need to add it to the toml file first
[23:42] <thumper> yeah
[23:43] <anastasiamac> thumper: https://discourse.jujucharms.com/t/juju-dependencies-managed-by-dep/139
[23:43] <anastasiamac> thumper: haha u picked on that? :D
[23:44] <thumper> anastasiamac: thanks, I think I remembered enough
[23:44] <anastasiamac> \o/
[23:44] <anastasiamac> that discourse post has instructions on how to bring/update deps for juju/juju
[23:44] <anastasiamac> i refer to it when needed - less to remember :D
[23:49]  * thumper runs to the gym
[23:56] <anastasiamac> wallyworld: PTAL https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/10523
[23:56] <wallyworld> ok


[09:57] <mup> PR snapd#4299 opened: osutil/user: replace our uses of os/user and filepath.Glob("/home/*") <Created by chipaca> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/4299>
[09:57] <zyga-ubuntu> john, it's Saturday!
[09:58] <sergiusens> says the one who noticed ;-)
[09:59] <zyga-ubuntu> well
[09:59] <zyga-ubuntu> haha, isn't it a bit early for you too? :)
[10:55] <zyga-ubuntu>
[10:55] <zyga-ubuntu>
[10:56] <zyga-ubuntu>
[10:56] <zyga-ubuntu>
[10:56] <zyga-ubuntu>
[10:56] <zyga-ubuntu>
[10:56] <zyga-ubuntu>
[13:40] <lundmar> Hi. I'm creating a snap that includes some man pages but I can't find any documentation how to enables the man pages in snapcraft.yaml?
[13:40] <lundmar> enable*
[13:43] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: that is not supported yet
[13:46] <lundmar> darn :/
[13:46] <zyga-ubuntu> as a poor man's workaround embed man and your manual pages as a "man" command in your snap
[13:46] <zyga-ubuntu> it's not perfect, we will get to properly integrated man pages, it's just not on the immediate roadmap
[13:47] <lundmar> the man package is quite an unwnanted dependency sizewise :)
[13:47] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: how big is "/usr/bin/man" itself?
[13:47] <zyga-ubuntu> but sure, I get it
[13:48] <zyga-ubuntu> just letting you know
[13:50] <lundmar> well, I assume the binary itself is not big but it comes with other files/dependencies I guess I would have to swing my rake at.
[13:51] <lundmar> also, your man command would override the systems man command which I think would be unfortunate and maybe cause other issues.
[13:53] <lundmar> supporting man pages via a snapcraft plug interface would be really useful. This is kind of the last step to get to first class support for commandline tools.
[13:54] <lundmar> how about support for completion scripts? I reported it as an issue long ago and it seems it has been fixed since snap v2.28 but I just tested and it does not automatically pick up on the completion scripts. Do I need to add anything to snapcraft.yaml?
[14:01] <lundmar> zyga-ubuntu: Can snaps update a users environment variables? In other words, can I create a snap that adds my man page path to the users MANPATH variable?
[14:01] <lundmar> or is it fully isolated so that can't be done
[14:05] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: no, that would be extremely dangerous in genral
[14:06] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: we have a plan on how manual pages can be integrated
[14:06] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: but it's not something that will happen overnight
[14:06] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: there's confinement coming to man itself, so that it can process untrusted input
[14:06] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: and there's a plan to pre-process the manual pages from snaps before they are exported to unconfined world
[14:06] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: but both are still unscheduled (I think the man work is upstream)
[14:07] <zyga-ubuntu> I'm going AFK, if you leave me messages I'll check them out late r:)
[14:07] <lundmar> ok thanks for the info. Glad to know a solution is on its way.
[14:07] <lundmar> Now, I need to figure out how this completion support works
[14:11] <lundmar> My snap package 'tio' (a serial TYY too) is running in to all the hard snapcraft issues. First it could not access serial ports (fixed now by serial-port plug), then no completion script feature, and now the man page feature he he
[14:11] <lundmar> tool*
[14:12] <lundmar> If anyone can provide me an example snapcraft.yaml on how to enable autocompletion scripts that would be helpful. thanks.
[14:14] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: there are some in snapcraft and snapd source code
[14:15] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: you need a complete: or something similar key
[14:15] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: grep for that in tests/ in snapd tree
[14:15] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: there are examples in snapcraft that are more educational but I'm on the snapd side
[14:17] <lundmar> zyga-ubuntu: yeah, I finally found that via google. I'm looking at it now. thanks.
[14:19] <lundmar> I found it referenced by this guy: http://chipaca.com/post/160369439977/in-snap-tab-completion
[14:50] <lundmar> hmm, it seems to use the new "completer:" key I have to make a copy of my completion script and put it in some "prime" directory to make it succesfully build my snap. Seems a bit silly to make a copy when it actually gets installed. Is there a way I can reference the installed script instead?
[15:04] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: yeah, chipaca implemeted it all :)
[15:04] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: probably, I don't know
[15:05] <lundmar> hehe, the prime directory gets cleaned out by snapcraft clean so that is definitely not the place to put it
[15:06] <lundmar> I'm not liking all the temp directories that snapcraft creates. You guys should consider putting all of them in a single top "build" directory
[15:18] <lundmar> Also, it seems odd to me that snapcraft init create snap/snapcraft.yaml. I think it would be better if it simply creates snapcraft.yaml in the current directory or a directory specified by the user, for example: snapcraft init tio would create tio/snapcraft.yaml
[15:19] <lundmar> it gets even worse when you then start adding stuff like snap/snap/gui/icon.png
[15:20] <lundmar> I'm missing structure guys :)
[15:33] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: snapcraft needs to know the root directory
[15:33] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: and snapcraft integration needs to be automatic (for build systems)
[15:33] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: so we pick either top-level/snapcraft.yaml or snap/snapcraft.yaml
[15:33] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: for simplicity and consistency
[15:34] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: as for the swarm of helper directories, yes, I agree and I _think_ this is something that's under control now, I'm just not sure how (again, mostly working under the hood in snapd)
[15:34] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: kyrofa, sergiusens or kalikiana can help you
[15:36] <kalikiana> lundmar: the preferred location these days is snap/snapcraft.yaml for the reason you mentioned, things like gui/icon.png also go in there and you don't need to scatter them all over your source tree
[15:37]  * zyga-ubuntu makes some tea and returns to debugging snapd integration tets
[15:37] <zyga-ubuntu> *tests
[15:37] <kalikiana> lundmar: regarding prime: you don't have to copy anything in there, it gets created during the build, so you can just reference in the yaml
[15:37] <lundmar> I guess my point os to make snapcraft init work more like git init which is a bit more intuitive.
[15:38] <lundmar> is*
[15:38] <kalikiana> lundmar: more intuitive in what respect?
[15:38] <lundmar> kalikiana: mkdir tio; cd tio; snapcraft init
[15:39] <lundmar> kalikiana: or simply snapcraft init tio; cd tio
[15:39] <kalikiana> ah
[15:39] <kalikiana> never noticed that
[15:39] <kalikiana> but you're right
[15:39] <lundmar> currently: snapcraft init; mv snap tio; cd tio
[15:39] <lundmar> its a bit messy imho
[15:40] <kalikiana> I guess I don't have a strong preference personally for that sort of detail
[15:40] <lundmar> I'm sorry, I'm a stickler for details :)
[15:40] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: maybe I don't understand your point fully but I always thought about snapcraft init as creating the debian/ directory
[15:40] <zyga-ubuntu> packaging stays "there"
[15:41] <lundmar> Imagine you start out by creating multiple snaps with different names, you will see my point ;)
[15:41] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: I don't get it, can you explain please?
[15:41] <zyga-ubuntu> mkdir foo; cd foo ; snapcraft init; # repeat for bar, etc
[15:41] <zyga-ubuntu> is that what you mean?
[15:42] <lundmar> or even simpler: snapcraft init tio; snapcraft init firefox; snapcraft init nano
[15:43]  * zyga-ubuntu tries
[15:43] <lundmar> currently: snapcraft init; mv snap tio; snapcraft init firefox; mv snap firefox; snapcraft init; mv snap nano
[15:44] <lundmar> the way I suggest is more flexible with fewer commands
[15:44] <zyga-ubuntu> lundmar: snapcraft init tio doesn't work on 2.34 for me
[15:44] <zyga-ubuntu> (probably out of date)
[15:44] <lundmar> zyga-ubuntu: thats exactly my point ;)
[15:44] <lundmar> it is not supported
[15:45] <zyga-ubuntu> I see your point then :)
[15:45] <lundmar> hehe
[15:45] <zyga-ubuntu> kalikiana: is that something that fits your design?
[15:46] <lundmar> if one is a git user the current way snapcraft init works catches your eye immediately :)
[15:47] <zyga-ubuntu> well, I'm a git user but I rarely git init
[15:47] <zyga-ubuntu> but I see your point
[15:49] <lundmar> I'm a big fan of structure so I would love it snapcraft worked something like this example: snapcraft init tio; cd tio; snapcraft; snapcraft build (the latter creates a build directory containing all the temp build dirs: stage, prime, parts, etc.)
[15:49] <lundmar> if*
[15:49] <kalikiana> lundmar: I'd suggest you propose it in the forum (https://forum.snapcraft.io/) and we can see what other people think
[15:50] <lundmar> kalikiana: i'll do that
[15:51] <lundmar> hmm, can't I use my Ubuntu one SSO credentials to login to that forum?
[15:52] <zyga-ubuntu> no, it's long overdue
[15:52] <zyga-ubuntu> sorry
[15:52] <lundmar> ok, it seems I can't
[15:52] <lundmar> oh well, I'll create yet another account hehe
[15:54] <lundmar> kalikiana: on another note, do you know where I should put the completion script file referenced by the new "completer:" key?
[15:55] <lundmar> because I can't seem to find the right place, nor in any examples.
[15:55] <lundmar> there is an example here: https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/blob/master/tests/lib/snaps/test-snapd-complexion/meta/snap.yaml
[15:56] <lundmar> but it does not work for me
[15:56] <kalikiana> lundmar: use `stage:\n - my-script-name` where the script is relative to the source of the part
[15:56] <lundmar> ahh, thanks
[15:57] <kalikiana> meta is assembled by snapcraft for you, so I'd recommend you consider it an implementation detail
[16:00] <lundmar> kalikiana: would you happen to have an example anywhre using stage: ?
[16:00] <lundmar> none of the snapd tests uses it
[16:00] <kalikiana> lundmar: snapcraft itself uses it
[16:02]  * lundmar is grepping snapd and snapcraft gits
[16:03] <lundmar> no matches :/
[16:03] <kalikiana> lundmar: https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/blob/master/snap/snapcraft.yaml#L26
[16:09] <lundmar> does the apps completer key reference a part?
[16:09] <lundmar> so I have to create a part which include stage: to my completion script file
[16:14] <kalikiana> yes
[16:24] <lundmar> hmm, there must be a way to avaoid creating two staging areas. I mean, my snap is already staging all my source files including my autocompletion script. I just need to find a way to reference what is already created
[16:24] <lundmar> I tried this but it fails : https://gist.github.com/lundmar/ce6e3a654f9df61fb92f27e2c47c6682
[16:26] <lundmar> I really want to avoid extracting the completion script from my .tar.xz and putting it somewhere else for snap to use. It would be redundanct
[16:26] <lundmar> redundant*
[16:35] <kalikiana> lundmar: where's the file located? you should be able to use the part relative to the part's extracted source
[16:35] <kalikiana> the *script
[16:37] <lundmar> kalikiana: it's parts/tio/build/src/bash-completion/tio
[16:37] <lundmar> no, sorry, I meant  parts/tio/install/share/bash-completion/completions/tio
[16:38] <lundmar> I assume parts/tio is the staging area
[16:42] <kalikiana> hold on, I'll try it here
[16:43] <kalikiana> lundmar: remove the leading "install" from the completer path
[16:48] <lundmar> kalikiana: darn, I almost had it right then hehe. Thanks!
[16:49] <lundmar> I guess I'm one of the first actually using this new completion feature
[17:00] <lundmar> kalikiana: https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/suggestion-lets-improve-snapcraft-init-command
[17:11] <kalikiana> Awesome. Thanks for starting the conversion
[17:15] <lundmar> no problem, I have another incoming regarding consolidating the temporory build directories
[17:15] <lundmar> temporary*
[17:25] <Syntist_> Any update on theme issue?
[17:41] <lundmar> kalikiana: https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/suggestion-lets-consolidated-temporary-build-directories-under-one-directory-build