[23:18] <Xbehave> thats the guide i used (well the gutsy version) are you on a 64 bit system?
[23:19] <GrahamA> Xbehave: I'll try it
[23:20] <GrahamA> If it works, I'll show you naked pictures.
[23:20] <Xbehave> just a thx will do tbh ;P
[23:23] <AMIGrAve> just tried to install kubuntu 8.04 desktop (kde 3.x) on my brand new HP Pavillon HDX (nvidia geforce 8800M GTS) and the max resolution used is 800x600. I had a look to xorg.conf and saw it was nearly empty. No driver specified, no resolution specified. I guess a lot of changes has been made to xorg since last realease. Could someone point me to an url or something about how to setup...
[23:23] <AMIGrAve> ...correctly the video settings under kubuntu 8.04 ?
[23:24] <flipstar> AMIGrAve: just use the nvidia-settings if you already installed the nvidia drivers
[23:27] <f00f> that reminds me... I need to order a DVI cable...
[23:27] <Xbehave> AMIGrAve: do you have restricted drivers?
[23:27] <minaqua> how can I get the trash off the kicker and on to the desktop?
[23:27] <AMIGrAve> flipstar: didn't installed yet. Is there more than one package for proprietary drivers ? I remember something about legacy and not legacy drivers and I don't know which one to take
[23:28] <mefisto__> rance: have you seen this thread: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=729873
[23:28] <Xbehave> you dont need legacy if its brand new
[23:28] <flipstar> AMIGrAve: just use the driver manager.. kmenu>system>driver manager
[23:28] <flipstar> it will care about all this
[23:30] <AMIGrAve> Xbehave: flipstar : oh now I remember ! I have to install restricted. I remember on last release that a popup told me about that. But it didn't happened this time. Going to apt-cache search restricted
[23:30] <AMIGrAve> Xbehave: flipstar : going to reboot and try
[23:30] <mefisto__> minaqua: to put trash on desktop: right-click desktop, create new, link to location, and for the URL put in trash:/
[23:30] <flipstar> AMIGrAve: you don't have to.. there is a nice app for this..>driver manager
[23:31] <sumant> hi all
[23:32] <AMIGrAve> flipstar: ok, I'll try the front end for this task. After all, the reason I switched from debian to kubuntu is that I don't want to hack this kind of things anymore. So I'll check kmenu>system>driver manager. Thanks
[23:32] <mefisto__> minaqua: to remove trash icon from panel: right-click panel, remove from panel, applet, wastebin
[23:33] <AMIGrAve> flipstar: anyway, I hope that we can still override xorg settings by using xorg.conf
[23:33] <flipstar> AMIGrAve: sure
[23:33] <sumant> want help regarding usb modem
[23:33] <GrahamA> Xbehave: No such luck
[23:33] <GrahamA> Though I will try it with the gnome restricted drivers manager rather than the KDE provided one
[23:33] <sumant> http://ubuntu-in.org/wiki/BSNL_CDMA_WLL_Howto
[23:33] <AMIGrAve> flipstar: because I have an arcade cabinet and for this  I have to set up special modelines that should output 15khz horizontal frequency
[23:34] <sumant> am new to linux
[23:34] <sumant> can anyone help
[23:34] <AMIGrAve> flipstar: Xbehave : thanks for your help. Going to try this
[23:34] <GrahamA> Xbehave: As far as it's concerend... I don't have any propriatry devices anymire
[23:34] <GrahamA> anymore
[23:34] <flipstar> AMIGrAve: thats no problem..you can even do this with nvidia-settings
[23:35] <mefisto__> sumant: just ask your question and see
[23:35] <minaqua> mefisto: not working
[23:36] <mefisto__> minaqua: desktop icon not working?
[23:36] <Xbehave> have you added the ignore flgx line to devices?
[23:36] <sumant> @mefisto: i have a fixed wireless cdma phone....have the usb cable installed. (kubuntu7.10)
[23:36] <sumant> http://ubuntu-in.org/wiki/BSNL_CDMA_WLL_Howto
[23:36] <sumant> its shown here...but dunno how to run the commands
[23:37] <sumant> have reached step 2
[23:37] <sumant>      sudo wvdialconf
[23:38] <flipstar> sumant: open a shell (kmenu>konsole) and paste that there
[23:39] <sumant> flipstar:let me see
[23:39] <minaqua> mefisto: no...gives me an icon that looks like folded page
[23:39] <terrestre> do you think its a good idea install ubuntu and kubuntu in the same partition or its better separated?
[23:39] <flipstar> minaqua: if the link itself is working you can change the icon
[23:39] <sumant> flipstar:reached this step
[23:39] <mefisto__> minaqua: did you put in "trash:/" for the location (URL)? --without the quotes
[23:41] <flipstar> sumant: done? then now type <kdesu kate /etc/wvdial.conf> in a shell or the run dialog (alt+f2)
[23:41] <minaqua> mefisto: tried that and as soon as I type the slash, the OK button cannot be selected
[23:41] <JimmyJam> hello, I am attempting to install my D-Link Air DWL-650 on Kubuntu 7.10 and when I save the settings my laptop freezes and the caps and scroll lock indicators blink
[23:41] <JimmyJam> I have let it sit for 30+ mins before restarting to make sure that it wasn't just still working
[23:42] <mefisto__> minaqua: you need to give it a name, eg trash or wastebin
[23:42] <raw> hello, is it possible to switch from ubuntu to kubuntu in a vmware?
[23:43] <sumant> flipstar: thanks buddy...am doing it jsut a sec
[23:43] <Fujisan> how do i add a user in Konsole ?
[23:43] <minaqua> got it!  thX :)
[23:43] <SlimeyPete> Fujisan: "adduser username"
[23:43] <SlimeyPete> eg "adduser bob"
[23:43] <SlimeyPete> sorry, sudo adduser
[23:43] <mefisto__> minaqua: np
[23:43] <Fujisan> ty
[23:43] <terrestre> raw ----> using windows?
[23:43] <raw> terrestre: yes.
[23:43] <raw> iam just testing a bit the envoironments.
[23:44] <terrestre> raw, you can use the livecd
[23:44] <raw> but i dont want to install and setup every install.
[23:44] <sumant> flipstar: reached it , (wvdial.conf-kate)
[23:44] <SlimeyPete> if you want to switch you can just install the kubuntu-desktop package using synaptic.
[23:44] <sumant> so paste the new dialer defaults there ?
[23:44] <SlimeyPete> and then install ubuntu-desktop to switch back if you want to.
[23:44] <raw> SlimeyPete: thank you!
[23:45] <JimmyJam> has anybody had any similar expieriences?
[23:45] <flipstar> sumant: it's probably an individual setting with password and so
[23:45] <mefisto__> raw: you choose which one you want at the login screen menu
[23:45] <terrestre> raw, if you use the livecd you dont need to install
[23:46] <sumant> flipstar; yeah its common across all subscriber i did paste it ther
[23:46] <sumant> flipstar: http://ubuntu-in.org/wiki/BSNL_CDMA_WLL_Howto
[23:46] <minaqua> now I just need to figure why I can't get rotating cube in Hardy, while I could in Gutsy
[23:46] <flipstar> sumant: okay then save and go to step 4
[23:46] <krash3x> Does anyone know anything about installing nvidia drivers I got mine to work after installing them manually but I didnt install the 32 bit libraries
[23:46] <raw> terrestre: yes but i have to burn a cd, reboot and acts, i think looking with vmware player in different envoironments helps to choose more easylier.
[23:47] <flipstar> minaqua: compiz running and the plugins enabled ?
[23:47] <sumant> flipstar: saved the file, done step 4 buddy
[23:47] <flipstar> raw: a vm is also slower
[23:47] <sumant> next?
[23:47] <raw> flipstar: you are right, but just for checking a system its perfect.
[23:48] <minaqua> compiz running 4 sure...plugins, me no know.  how 2 find out bout plugz?
[23:48] <flipstar> sumant: <kdesu kate /etc/sudoers> and paste this in the mentioned section, thats important
[23:48] <terrestre> raw and then you can use wubi
[23:48] <raw> then i have to reboot and configure.
[23:48] <flipstar> raw: than you have an idea of how it look, but not how it acts :)
[23:49] <flipstar> and btw no 3d and stuff in an vm
[23:49] <raw> flipstar if i found something that looks nice to me, handling and stuff, i will install it on harddrive.
[23:49] <raw> i know.
[23:50] <mefisto__> how does wubi work? does it install in a folder on windows partition? does it create a file that works as a "virtual" partition? anyone know?
[23:50] <flipstar> raw: okay..but using a live cd doesn't mean to have to install anything or so
[23:51] <raw> mefisto__: it installs a virtual partition and adding a line in boot.ini
[23:51] <raw> flipstar: i know, but to burn a cd. ;)
[23:52] <flipstar> raw: use a cd+rw ;)
[23:52] <raw> i just have dvds laying around here now. :(
[23:52] <flipstar> there are also dvd images..
[23:52] <sumant> fipstar: typing that in konsole opened a new kate window
[23:53] <raw> yes.
[23:53] <flipstar> sumant: thats how it should be
[23:54] <flipstar> sumant: if you done editing this file and saved please type <sudo visudo -c> in a shell to check the syntax
[23:54] <sumant> i need to paste
[23:54] <sumant> # User privilege specification
[23:54] <sumant>      username machine_name = NOPASSWD: /usr/bin/wvdial, /usr/bin/killall
[23:54] <sumant> flipstar:
[23:54] <raw> but if just <anyhardwaredevice> doesnt work nice at start you have to configure and do stuff instead of checking the system.
[23:54] <flipstar> you need to edit username and machine name sumant
[23:55] <Fujisan> how do i add a user in Konsole ? (sorry but i cant scroll up and my logging is disable , this text here scrolls too fast)
[23:55] <sumant> flipstar, pasted the
[23:55] <sumant> # User privilege specification
[23:55] <sumant>      username machine_name = NOPASSWD: /usr/bin/wvdial, /usr/bin/killall
[23:55] <sumant> there now save it?
[23:55] <flipstar> raw: at least you know it will make trouble..in a vm you don't
[23:56] <flipstar> sumant: no.. you NEED to edit username and machine name
[23:56] <flipstar> sumant: and you need to paste this in the "User privilege specification" it already is there in the file
[23:57] <sumant> flipstar:i type myused name n machine name in the respective fields
[23:57] <sumant> flipstar: done that
[23:58] <flipstar> sumant: also in the right section ?
[23:58] <flipstar> sumant: good then save and run <sudo visudo -c> in a shell
[23:58] <spiroo> Is it possible to reset adept to factory settings?
[23:59] <spiroo> Something has happened. I cannot fetch updates at all anymore in Adept.
[23:59] <sumant> flipstar: u mean the internet user name, n m machine name
[23:59] <sumant> flipstar:sorry
[23:59] <flipstar> sumant: if sumant is your username on your pc you need to type sumant there..look at the example
[23:59] <jussio1> spiroo: whats the error?


[01:48] <snele> sgclark: I can test trusty backports when you finish it
[01:48] <snele> will it be in staging ppa?
[01:48] <sgclark> snele: yep, still one left to try and fix the build
[01:48] <sgclark> yeah staging-kdeapplications
[01:49] <sgclark> hush vivid, I will get to you
[04:20] <valorie> santa_: sorry for being non-responsive thus far
[04:20] <valorie> I'll read and respond to my email tonight
[04:27] <sgclark> snele: https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-ppa/+archive/ubuntu/staging-kdeapplications trusty applications ready for testing
[04:27] <sgclark> !testers
[04:27] <sgclark> ^^
[04:28]  * sgclark out
[04:35] <valorie> niters sgclark
[04:35] <valorie> thanks for your work!
[08:46] <snele>  sgclark: upgrade didn't go smooth. there are errors: https://paste.kde.org/phoidccyk
[08:49] <snele> sgclark: https://paste.kde.org/po6tolwyy
[10:23] <Mamarok> hm, we might have a packaging error for amarok 2.8.90, if I trust this guy https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=323802#c18
[10:23] <Mamarok> amarok should drag in MySQL by default
[10:25] <Mamarok> and amarok should be removed if something else removes MySQL
[10:26] <Mamarok> so at least the user would get aware that this could cause havoc
[10:48] <yofel> needs investigation what exactly amarok uses from mysql. It does depend on libmysqlclient18, so any API calls should succeed, but if you do shell calls to mysql binaries then that's a different story
[11:05] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[11:50] <santa_> valorie: no prob
[13:10] <shadeslayer> jmux: ping
[13:11] <shadeslayer> jmux: is there going to be a Munich BSP this year
[13:42] <marco-parillo> sgclark: I upgraded my 14.04 VM (It has been a while), rebooted, then I added deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/kubuntu-ppa/staging-kdeapplications/ubuntu trusty main to my software sources. Looks like KDE Apps 4.14.3 are available.
[13:42] <marco-parillo> Is there some kind of signing issue? I get a warning (The following pieces of software cannot be verified. WARNING: Installing unverified software represents a security risk, as the presence of unverifiable software can be a sign of tampering. Do you wish to continue?)
[13:43] <marco-parillo> Of course, I click continue, like 99% of folks who get malware ;-)
[13:50] <marco-parillo> sgclark: I got an error: /var/cache/apt/archives/kde-window-manager-common_4%3a4.11.14-0ubuntu1~ubuntu14.04~ppa6_i386.deb trying to overwrite '/usr/share/doc/kde/HTML/en/kcontrol/windowbehaviour/index.cache.bz2', which is also in package kde-workspace-data 4:4.11.11-0ubuntu0.2
[13:51] <marco-parillo> It says a re-boot is required, so I will try that, and re-try from the command line (I had been using Muon Update Manager).
[14:07] <marco-parillo> Well, my Trusty VM is unusable after trying to upgrade the KDE apps. I had no windowing, so I had to ctrl alt F1 to get a tty. I logged in, tried to update && upgrade again, but got a ton of errors I could not paste.
[14:42] <jmux> shadeslayer: we were just talking today, that nobody made a plan yet - too busy
[14:43] <shadeslayer> oh :D
[14:44] <jmux> I would still make one end of next month - as every year - but I don't want to do the preparations for 5 people
[14:44] <jmux> people here felt we're already too late
[14:45] <shadeslayer> jmux: yeah it seems a bit late, but I'd still be in
[14:46] <jmux> If we can get a quick feedback of 10-15 people, who would come too Munich, I can probably still organizing a BSP
[14:46] <shadeslayer> as long as it's not between 16th to 18th :P
[14:46] <jmux> I know LibreOffice is doing an other hackfest 2nd - 4th December in Madrid
[14:46] <shadeslayer> jmux: I can come, as long as it's not those dates ^ :D
[14:46] <shadeslayer> jmux: oh :D
[14:46] <shadeslayer> jmux: could merge with that, I'd get to ride a train then :>
[14:47] <jmux> They had a hackfest in Hamburg two weeks ago
[14:49] <shadeslayer> jmux: send a email out I guess
[14:49] <shadeslayer> and find out
[14:53] <jmux> shadeslayer: hmm. kde-devel, kubuntu-devel...
[14:53] <shadeslayer> jmux: debian-qt-kde
[14:56] <jmux> Ok. Guess I should add a doodle to collect feedback.
[15:18] <yofel> count me in!
[15:27] <jmux> So I just re-checked, there is actually money :-) Still need to get some approval, which I should get on Wednesday.
[15:28] <jmux> Now for the mail and the doodle...
[15:52] <sgclark> marco-parillo: hmm that sounds terrible. got any apt logs I can look at?
[15:53] <clivejo> ok dolphin is crashing again when Im trying to open the menu to delete an item
[15:55] <marco-parillo> sgclark: Sorry, it blew away my VM and there was nothing I could do with it.
[15:55] <clivejo> https://paste.kde.org/pltbchtlb
[15:56] <marco-parillo> Not your fault; my noob.
[16:07] <mhall119> last call, is there anybody who can give an hour presentation of Plasma Mobile as the Ubuntu Online Summit next week?
[16:16] <jmux> shadeslayer, yofel: https://dudle.inf.tu-dresden.de/LiMux_Hackfest_2015/
[16:17] <shadeslayer> mhall119: one hour :S
[16:17] <shadeslayer> I don't think there's enough info for a hour
[16:20] <tsdgeos> shadeslayer: apol and me spoke about it 35 min the other day don't think 1h would be horrible tbh https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PtE8g8ldS0
[16:20] <shadeslayer> mhall119: I found your guys ^
[16:20] <shadeslayer> :P
[16:20] <tsdgeos> but i'm not doing it again :D
[16:21] <mhall119> shadeslayer: tsdgeos: someone in #plasma is also volunteering, perhaps you can all go in together on it?
[16:21] <shadeslayer> I'm already doing the CI thingamajig with sitter
[16:21] <tsdgeos> mhall119: i know nothing about plasma mobile ;D i'm just in that video as sparring asking questions
[16:26] <shadeslayer> k, cya on Monday
[16:27] <jmux> BTW - everybody else is also free to add themself, if they want to hack in Munich too: https://dudle.inf.tu-dresden.de/LiMux_Hackfest_2015/
[16:27] <sgclark> would love to, but no idea how I would get therre
[16:57] <ghostcube> oha weisswurst hacking event
[16:57] <ghostcube> :D
[16:58] <sgclark> kde-workspace updated. trusty needs further testing
[16:58] <sgclark> !testers
[16:58] <sgclark> ^^
[17:12] <pursuivant> muon (master) v5.4.2-154-g4b469ec * Aleix Pol: libmuon/backends/ApplicationBackend/Application.cpp
[17:12] <pursuivant> Fix build on Ubuntu
[17:12] <pursuivant> Too much replace
[17:12] <pursuivant> CCMAIL<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[17:12] <pursuivant> http://commits.kde.org/muon/4b469ecc51795d5d76c7fc894f184e0242a582cc
[18:05] <pursuivant> muon (master) v5.4.2-155-ge3c5ce6 * Aleix Pol: discover/qml/MuonToolButton.qml
[18:05] <pursuivant> use tighter QtQuick dependency
[18:05] <pursuivant> http://commits.kde.org/muon/e3c5ce632805a52a2e5865e7685b5fc2d73aa9cd
[18:06] <pursuivant> muon (master) v5.4.2-156-g78a4813 * Aleix Pol: libmuon/backends/ApplicationBackend (2 files)
[18:06] <pursuivant> We already know if the process is running
[18:06] <pursuivant> No need to keep a variable to keep track of it.
[18:06] <pursuivant> http://commits.kde.org/muon/78a4813fa32cd69065e06fe7969186385c980560
[18:06] <pursuivant> muon (master) v5.4.2-157-g594f75c * Aleix Pol: libmuon/backends/ApplicationBackend/ApplicationNotifier.cpp
[18:06] <pursuivant> adopt new connect syntax
[18:06] <pursuivant> http://commits.kde.org/muon/594f75c55188705924231d86dcadf8c38a238b5b
[20:09] <valorie> sgclark: surely Ubuntu Community Fund would send you to Munich to fix bugs?
[20:11] <yofel> valorie: it would surely also send you over to motivate us all ;)
[20:11] <yofel> meh, it seems like quite a few people used geotagging in digikam
[20:12] <valorie> haha
[20:12] <valorie> that doesn't seem a wise use of the money
[20:13] <valorie> geotagging is useful!
[20:13] <yofel> yeah, except that we removed it in wily..
[20:13] <valorie> Munich sounds fun, for sure
[20:13] <valorie> oh, why?
[20:13] <yofel> because digikam is qt4 and marble qt5
[20:13] <valorie> ah
[20:13] <yofel> and we didn't upload another qt4 version of marble
[20:13] <valorie> that's a beast that needs porting
[20:14] <valorie> or well I guess updating the qt4 marble would be good enough?
[20:15] <yofel> we could put it in a PPA with a new digikam build, someone would need to package it though and make sure it doesn't conflict with marble(-qt5)
[20:16] <yofel> we need to packages digikam 4.14 as well (last qt4 release)
[20:17] <sgclark> oh yeah was reading that bug right nnow
[20:17] <sgclark> so why did we remove it?
[20:17] <sgclark> yeah need to package kdevelop last qt4 and new kf5 beta
[20:17] <yofel> because building both qt4 and qt5 marble from the same package doesn't work, and nobody had time to re-package a marble-qt4
[20:17] <sgclark> so much to do
[20:18] <sgclark> ah
[20:19] <sgclark> I am trying to debug my trusty updates and reproduce the explosion mparillo had.
[20:20] <sgclark> still have vivd backports too
[20:20] <yofel> problem with those is that we do a rather bad job at tracking moved files after multiple releases and multiple debian merges
[20:20] <yofel> let me install trusty in a VM
[20:20] <sgclark> yeah
[20:20] <sgclark> thanks
[20:22] <sgclark> well found problem one: libkdedecorationsabi1
[20:23] <sgclark> so abi need breaks replaces?
[20:23] <sgclark> seems like that should be done by manager
[20:23] <yofel> if it contains anything other than the lib, yes
[20:23] <sgclark> okies fixing
[20:26] <sgclark> hmm there is a breaks replace in there
[20:29] <sgclark> ahh right ok, dummy me, have to do dist-upgrade due to the new dependencies
[20:29] <sgclark> mparillo: did you do dist-upgrade?
[20:30] <yofel> file overwrites are unrelated to the upgrade type though... let me read the error message again
[20:31] <sgclark> hmm shouldnt be any file overwrites , I fixed the one in kde-workspace
[20:34] <yofel> oh, that breaks/replaces is useless. trusty-updates has kde-workspace-data 4:4.11.11-0ubuntu0.2, the B/R is kde-workspace-data (<< 4:4.11.11)
[20:34] <yofel> 4:4.11.11-0ubuntu0.2 > 4:4.11.11
[20:35] <sgclark> hmm insstalled fine here
[20:35] <yofel> should be << 4:4.11.14~ or os
[20:35] <yofel> *so
[20:35] <yofel> yes, because the order in which apt upgrades packages is non-deterministic
[20:35] <sgclark> ok
[20:36] <yofel> it depends on how the algorithm orders the packages to resolve dependencies
[20:37] <yofel> which is why a simple upgrade test is not a sufficent test case for file overwrites, but to properly detect those you would need to read the whole install files diff
[20:37] <yofel> maybe one could integrate something like that into the CI with a simple hashmap file DB or so which checks if a file was already in a package in the past
[20:38] <yofel> that would then also catch files that moved between sources
[20:39] <sgclark> I think it is in CI, problem is trusty packages are not :(
[20:40] <yofel> yeah :/
[20:42] <sgclark> uploaded fixed kde-workspace
[20:42] <sgclark> will need testing after build
[20:46] <yofel> sgclark: what's supported as upgrade path? trusty -> new backports and trusty+old backports -> new backports?
[20:48] <sgclark> hmm not sure. I did trusty updates, then rebooted and added the ppa and then dist-upgrade with success
[20:48] <sgclark> did not try a path with backports
[20:48] <sgclark> though I reckon it needs to be tested
[20:49] <yofel> it does, as that's where the packages will end up, so all that have the backports enabled will go that path
[20:49] <yofel> I guess I'll start with that then
[20:49] <sgclark> thank you
[20:50] <sgclark> wait for kde-workspace to build though
[20:50] <yofel> will do, my VM is still installing anyway ^^
[20:50] <sgclark> :)
[21:00] <ahoneybun> mm
[21:00]  * yofel sees ahoneybun and remembers that he forgot something
[21:00] <yofel> dangit
[21:01] <ahoneybun> lol
[21:01] <ahoneybun> I did not mean it like that
[21:01] <yofel> XD
[21:02] <ahoneybun> but I'll take it lol
[21:05] <mparillo> sgclark: I first tried muon (which I assume does not do a dist-upgrade), but when I pretty much had no gui after a re-boot, I did update && upgrade && dist-upgrade from apt.
[21:06] <yofel> hm.. plasma2, so nostalgic :D
[21:07] <sgclark> lol
[21:07] <sgclark> hmm
[21:08] <sgclark> yofel: muon updater does not dist upgrade? that could be a problem
[21:09] <yofel> I don't know actually.. let me check
[21:09] <sgclark> though this is not the first mass updates, seems like this issue would have come up in the apst
[21:09] <sgclark> past
[21:09] <yofel> hm, if I just add the backports ppa, then muon-updater does ask me to remove 3 packages. That's a dist-upgrade
[21:09] <sgclark> mparillo: did you do a dpkg --force overwirte on that package that failed?
[21:10] <sgclark> ok cool, good to know
[21:10] <sgclark> so that is not it.
[21:10] <sgclark> seems like kde-workspace did not get installed, it has since been fixed
[21:11] <sgclark> which is why testing is so important!
[21:12] <mparillo> sgclark: I did not dpkg -- force; when I was on the commandline it said something like apt install -f, which I did try.
[21:13] <sgclark> ok so kde-workspace did not get installed, that is why your gui exploded
[21:13] <sgclark> that has been fixed, thanks to your testing, sorry for the loss of your VM
[21:16] <mparillo> sgclark: My pleasure to help out. I actually miss 14.04 (and really miss 14.10), but I do not miss that VM. BTW, I am back home now, so I am re-creating the 14.04 VM on my work laptop, while I can IRC on my netbook (Kubuntu is the only Plasma5 distro that is happy on a 1GB netbook).
[21:16] <yofel> protip: use VM snapshots for testing ;)
[21:17] <snele> sgclark: did you get my messages about trusty backports?
[21:17] <sgclark> yeah I had snapshots at one point. really need to set that up again
[21:17] <sgclark> snele: hmm no
[21:20] <snele> sgclark: upgrade didn't go smooth. there are errors: https://paste.kde.org/phoidccyk
[21:20] <snele>  sgclark: https://paste.kde.org/po6tolwyy
[21:20] <sgclark> snele: kde-workspace is now fixed
[21:21] <sgclark> which is the source of that mess
[21:21] <sgclark> and thanks to testers it was caught and fixed!
[21:22]  * yofel kicks the publisher
[21:22] <yofel> it's in weekend mood -.-
[21:22] <sgclark> lol
[21:22] <soee_> yofel: this "bug" with notification spam when there are some updates its part of kde/plasma or ubuntu/kubuntu releated stuff /
[21:22] <yofel> "spam" ?
[21:22] <yofel> I only ever see one notification when there are updates
[21:23] <sgclark> snele: as soon as it publishes an apt update and dist-upgrade should sort it all out.
[21:23] <soee_> yofel: yes, when apt update command is fetching packages, and there are some updates, we see notification every few seconds
[21:23] <sgclark> I only see one
[21:23] <soee_> a bit annoying tbh
[21:23] <sgclark> I am on CI though so it must have been fixed upstream?
[21:23] <yofel> ah, that might be due to how apt-check works..
[21:24] <yofel> now the question is whether that's from muon-updater or kubuntu-notification-helper (I think it's the updater)
[21:24] <soee_> sgclark: always one time notification ?
[21:24] <sgclark> got one notification and have a red icon in tray
[21:26] <sgclark> snele: yofel updated kde-workspace has published
[21:26] <yofel> so, did an apt update. 3 updates before, 3 updates after it and no notification at all
[21:27] <soee_> yofel: 15.10 ?
[21:27] <yofel> yep
[21:27] <sgclark> oh hmm I have no updates and it is red, that is unexpected
[21:28] <mparillo> yofel: For VM snapshots, I think I would have to upgrade my VMware Player to Workstation. Fortunately my work laptop makes installation relatively quick. And re-start is complete. Step 1 is to upgrade, dist-upgrade 14.04 and re-boot?
[21:28] <clivejo> is red not bad?
[21:28] <sgclark> when I see red I expect attention is required
[21:28] <clivejo> ditto
[21:28] <yofel> red in the updates means security updates I believe
[21:29] <sgclark> that is what I would expect, but my system has no updates
[21:29] <sgclark> System up to date
[21:29] <clivejo> pending reboot?
[21:29] <sgclark> but red >.<
[21:29] <sgclark> oh hmm
[21:29] <clivejo> been a few kernel updates recently
[21:29] <sgclark> don't think so , but perhap, used to get another notification for that though
[21:30] <sgclark> rebooted today
[21:30] <soee_> sgclark: this is how it behaves now, if you do updates those icons stay in systray till reboot
[21:30] <soee_> or also after reboot
[21:30] <sgclark> it remains red forever because I had security updates? that does not seem logical
[21:31]  * yofel might be wrong..
[21:31] <sgclark> ok rebooting to see for myself, I am now curious
[21:32] <yofel> hm, here updater doesn't seem quite in sync with apt
[21:32] <yofel> installed all 3 updates, now I still have a green symbol telling me that I have 3 pending updates
[21:34] <soee_> yofel: @ this notification spam, i think the slower connection/more time it need to fetch packages, the more the same notification we see
[21:34] <soee_> i remember on a slow connection i'v seen it like 20 times
[21:36] <yofel> which makes be really believe that this is related to apt-check. That can trigger multiple times during an update run
[21:38] <soee_> my top 3 'visual' bugs in 15.10: 1. missing nm/plasma-pa icon in systray (plasma devs tries to fix it, but no fix yet), 2. updates icon stays in systray when there are no updates, 3. updates notification spam :)
[21:40] <sgclark> ok reboot and now my updates icon is green and in the hidden icons panel
[21:40] <sgclark> which is fine
[21:40] <sgclark> but I have to enter my wifi password every time now. Which is exteremly annoying
[21:41] <snele> sgclark: i can confirm that apt update, apt install -f and apt dist-upgrade   fixed issue. Thank you for doing backports
[21:41] <sgclark> excellent, thanks for testing!
[21:43] <yofel> boom
[21:43] <yofel> Unpacking plasma-dataengines-workspace (4:4.11.14-0ubuntu1~ubuntu14.04~ppa8) over (4:4.11.11-0ubuntu0.2) ...
[21:43] <yofel> dpkg: error processing archive /var/cache/apt/archives/plasma-dataengines-workspace_4%3a4.11.14-0ubuntu1~ubuntu14.04~ppa8_amd64.deb (--unpack):
[21:43] <yofel>  trying to overwrite '/usr/share/kde4/apps/plasma/shareprovider/im9/metadata.desktop', which is also in package plasma-widgets-workspace 4:4.11.11-0ubuntu0.2
[21:43] <yofel> dpkg-deb: error: subprocess paste was killed by signal (Broken pipe)
[21:43] <snele> sgclark: about your wifi password problem, I usually fix it by removing connection and then connect again to that network
[21:43] <sgclark> will try thanks
[21:44] <sgclark> yofel: err ok fixing
[21:44] <sgclark> how much longer is trusty supported?
[21:44] <sgclark> this is clunky :(
[21:44] <yofel> april 2019
[21:44] <sgclark> ouch
[21:45] <yofel> well, that does not include our PPA, but it is nice to care about it. (And we usually do that until the next LTS is out)
[21:45] <yofel> so, april next year
[21:45] <sgclark> ok
[21:46] <soee_> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Fedora-KDE-SIG-Loss
[21:46] <sgclark> I don't see kde putting out much more in qt4, though do you know if they will?
[21:46] <yofel> I don't think they will. Maybe the occasional security patch or so
[21:47] <yofel> oh right, I did want to upload that sddm CVE
[21:49] <mparillo> sgclark: My 14.04 VM is dist-upgraded. Ready for me to re-try the PPA?
[21:49] <sgclark> nah gotta wait again, yofel found another boom
[21:50] <sgclark> fixing now
[21:50] <mparillo> I can wait. Dinner soon however. BTW, can the PPA be applied by adding the source in Muon-updater, and using it? Or do I need to also apt dist-upgrade?
[21:51] <sgclark> muon will dist-upgrade
[21:51] <soee_> uh finally it has Critical importance https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-graphics-drivers/+bug/1501041
[21:52] <mparillo> TY. So I will wait for the testers call then?
[21:52] <sgclark> yeah uploading now, but needs to build
[21:53] <valorie> may I just say: y'all rock
[21:53] <valorie> and I love you all
[21:53]  * sick_rimmit Waves, Nods and Grins
[21:53] <sick_rimmit> Yes.. Y'all do
[21:53] <yofel> :)
[21:54] <sgclark> :)
[22:13] <mparillo> valorie: {{{hugs}}}
[22:14] <valorie> thank you mparillo!
[22:14] <valorie> {{{{{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}}}}}} to you as well
[22:14] <mparillo> P.S. During the drama, I tried Fedora 22 KDE. Not even close.
[22:15] <valorie> I love that we are on the cutting (and even bleeding) edge
[22:15] <valorie> AND that we take care of our silent LTS users
[22:15] <valorie> all those people who never file a bug report or complain on IRC/lists/forums
[22:15] <yofel> Fedora has it's use cases, but it's more for devs I think
[22:16] <yofel> opensuse is usually the RPM user distro
[22:18] <sgclark> I have not really found a distro I hated. I have enjoyed most at one time or another. Community is what has kept me here the longest.
[22:19] <mparillo> yofel: True, but some RPMs that claim to be both for Fedora and OpenSUSE are only really tested on Fedora (I have been burned).
[22:19] <mparillo> sgclark: +1
[22:19] <valorie> so true, sgclark
[22:20] <valorie> same experience here
[22:23] <ScottK> Before I used Kubuntu, I tried OpenSUSE, which was a disaster (this was in 2006, so don't hold it against them).  I gave up when the attitude of the people that had broken the latest OpenSUSE release was that if I wanted it to work, I should be using SLED.
[22:24] <mparillo> And SLED (at least today) defaults to gnome.
[22:25] <ScottK> At the time, I don't think it did.
[22:25] <ScottK> Either way, it led to me having a requirement for a distro I used to not be a 'community edition' of the real product.
[22:27] <sick_rimmit> We have a brilliant community here, I have been hanging around Linux and Open Source since the Dark Ages. We have a special friendly environment.
[22:28] <sick_rimmit> I am really hoping to do my part in growing and developing that..
[22:28] <ScottK> As long as you keep your head down and don't get the CC annoyed at you, sure.
[22:29] <sick_rimmit> Well I think my contribution sits in Promotion, Advocacy and Talk..
[22:29] <sick_rimmit> I do lots of Talking
[22:29] <sick_rimmit> I like talking
[22:29] <sick_rimmit> and there is chance I might be good at it
[22:29] <sick_rimmit> I'm worried about packagers and release managers..
[22:30] <sick_rimmit> I've tried working on packaging. I can do it, but it takes a lot of focused time
[22:30] <sick_rimmit> This is something I have very little of, family, young children, work
[22:30] <sick_rimmit> So I run around saying
[22:31] <sick_rimmit> "Yay Kubuntu, try it. It's ACE!"
[22:31] <sick_rimmit> lol
[22:33] <ahoneybun> the community is +1 to me as well, openSUSE I find a big hard to get into
[22:34] <valorie> ScottK: that is a concern, since I think we all continue to object to the canonical IP policy
[22:34] <valorie> and I for one will not let that go
[22:35] <ScottK> I worry less about the fact that people are objecting and more about how the fact that the CC got tired of hearing about it was handled.
[22:35] <valorie> we aren't just "open source"
[22:35] <valorie> we're free and open
[22:35] <clivejo> are the KCC putitng out a statement about who is taking over from Jonathan?
[22:35] <ScottK> Need to decide first.
[22:35] <valorie> clivejo: should we?
[22:35] <ScottK> valorie: You need to pick a release manager.
[22:36] <sgclark> yofel and me as backup
[22:36] <valorie> it has to be one person?
[22:36] <ScottK> For a long time it's been JR and me as assistant.
[22:36] <valorie> I'd like to see a team
[22:36] <clivejo> I dunno, I thought thats what you guys do!
[22:36] <ScottK> valorie: Primary and alternate is great.
[22:36] <sgclark> yofel as main and me as backup!
[22:36] <ScottK> clivejo: release management is a technical function.  KC does is broader than that.
[22:36] <valorie> ok, as long as both people are trained
[22:36] <clivejo> I was expecting a statement following Jon's stepping down
[22:37] <valorie> KC is mostly about Kubuntu members
[22:37] <sgclark> trained?
[22:37] <sgclark> by whom?
[22:37] <yofel> right, that's the plan, we just didn't send a mail out yet. I'll talk to the release team over the weekend about how what where we should do that
[22:37] <ScottK> valorie: You also get to decide non-technical policy and stuff.
[22:37] <valorie> sgclark: I'm worried about the bus factor
[22:37] <sgclark> bus factor?
[22:37] <ScottK> I'm happy to assist/train.
[22:37] <valorie> life happens, as we've seen
[22:37] <valorie> ScottK: cool
[22:38] <sgclark> yofel and I already agreed to team it, he just is taking lead
[22:38] <valorie> bus factor = what happens when the expert gets hit by a bus?
[22:38] <valorie> thanks yofel
[22:39] <sgclark> I think more than two is too many cooks in the kitchen
[22:39] <valorie> I'm willing to write a press release if that is a useful thing
[22:39] <yofel> valorie: number of people that have to be hit by a bus for a project to die
[22:39] <valorie> sgclark: a small number is good if there is some documentation
[22:39] <valorie> IF
[22:40] <valorie> and I assume that the job has changed some over the years
[22:40] <valorie> yofel: yes, I've heard that version too
[22:40] <ScottK> One challenge both of you will have that neither JR nor I did is that you aren't on the ~ubuntu-release team.  That's not essential, but it does make some things easier.
[22:41] <ScottK> To up your chances of being on the team, you want to get core-dev.
[22:41] <sgclark> so we have yofel -> me -> and ScottK to assist, I think we will survive
[22:41] <yofel> right, but I think we'll manage still - we'll just be slower
[22:41]  * yofel aims for MOTU first, then I'll go from there
[22:41] <ScottK> Yeah.
[22:41] <sgclark> same
[22:41] <ScottK> Good plan.
[22:41] <yofel> I at least need new-source upload rights, otherwise things will get painful
[22:41] <sgclark> I am willing to put inn the effort to be on the necessary teams
[22:42] <sgclark> in
[22:43] <sgclark> kde-workspace is ready yofel mparillo
[22:43] <sgclark> please test :)
[22:44] <valorie> sgclark: what I meant by training was having someone to answer questions, and just learning on the job
[22:44] <valorie> shadeslayer can tell you about the joys of MOTU
[22:44] <valorie> :-)
[22:44] <sgclark> that depends , has Jonathan said anything about training yofel?
[22:44] <ScottK> yofel: You might want to consider just syncing Kf5 from Debian this cycle.  maxyz has been pretty quick about uploading new releases and it would make things easier.
[22:45] <valorie> ScottK: does that mean junking the CI work?
[22:45] <ScottK> I don't know.
[22:45] <yofel> I'm not sure how good that'll work out with our branches, but that would be a good idea probably
[22:45] <ScottK> It all comes out of the same git repositories, so it may just mean pointing at different branches.
[22:45] <sgclark> I do not wish to junk that, but I don't know that we have a server to keep it on
[22:45] <valorie> well, doesn't ubuntu now have CI?
[22:46] <yofel> OTOH, if we can do easy merges, then that would also be an idea
[22:46] <yofel> ubuntu uses CI for autopackagetests at least
[22:46] <sgclark> yeah but it does nt have the tololing harald worked on for kde specific stuff
[22:46] <sgclark> tooling
[22:46]  * sgclark can't type
[22:47] <sgclark> I could likely take it over , but I do not have the resources to host it
[22:47] <valorie> would be good to get that moved onto Ubuntu infra, IMO
[22:47] <valorie> or work out something with Harald/JR
[22:47] <valorie> not sure what they are up to, technically
[22:48] <yofel> I can help out with the hosting for the time being if we really need to set up our own
[22:48] <yofel> we'll see
[22:49] <sgclark> Mark ddid say to let him know if we need anything, so there is that
[22:50] <valorie> heh
[22:51] <valorie> hmmm, sitter isn't here -- I would value his insight
[22:51] <valorie> Riddell: anything to add?
[22:51] <maxyz> It shouldn't be that hard to merge the debian branches into the unstable ones. Feel free to ping me if you find a big divergence.
[22:51] <sgclark> thnas maxyz :)
[22:51] <sgclark> err thanks
[22:52] <yofel> it certainly not hard to merge them, I'm just curious if there's a reasonable way to automate it
[22:52] <yofel> *it's
[22:54] <maxyz> If you promise me that the person that signs the uploaded tags knows about them I'll consider to start merging them again...
[22:54] <sgclark> fiddle with this  https://github.com/apachelogger/kubuntu-repo-merge ?
[22:54] <maxyz> But right now I need to go to bed
[22:54] <sgclark> night :)
[22:55] <sgclark> signs the uploaded tags - what does that mean?
[22:56] <sgclark> afk
[23:04] <santa_> yofel: do-all git merge ... ?
[23:04] <yofel> right, I'm more wondering about how to handle conflicts (e.g. changelog)
[23:05] <santa_> I think there was something to handle that automagically
[23:06] <yofel> there is dpkg-mergechangelogs
[23:06] <yofel> need to look how to use that again
[23:07] <santa_> regarding the packaging, I don't think syncing packages from debian is a good solution, but merging the branches and upload the packages
[23:08] <santa_> I can help with that, my only problem, as usual, is the lack of permissions everywhere
[23:16] <ScottK> I'm sure the fact that you're banned from Debian Qt-KDE doesn't affect that opinion.
[23:20] <sgclark> well we need to do whatever results in the best end user experience while we rebuild our process
[23:22] <santa_> ScottK: well, banned or not I can help with the upload of new packages to kubuntu, however not having permissions to do things such as uploading to ppa's - for instance - limits my ability to help, obviously
[23:23] <sgclark> it is an LTS so stability is of great importance
[23:23] <sgclark> santa_: you  have to apply for kubuntu dev then
[23:23] <santa_> sgclark: yep, in process to get the kubuntu membership already
[23:24] <sgclark> ok
[23:27] <ScottK> I would find it surprising if your perspective on the usefulness of syncing from Debian wasn't colored by your experience there.
[23:28] <ScottK> Of course my perspective about Debian is also based on my experience with it.
[23:28] <sgclark> are we really that far diverged from them? I dont think we are
[23:28] <ScottK> Not where I've checked.
[23:28] <sgclark> and we need to do debian merges anyway
[23:29] <sgclark> dunno I think at least for this release it is a good idea. yofel and I still have alot of work with getting on teams and whatnot
[23:30] <sgclark> never ending backports
[23:30] <sgclark> and everything else
[23:30] <sgclark> we need more packagers >.<
[23:30] <santa_> well, I don't think withdrawing kubuntu's ability to upload its own packages is going to help in the long term
[23:31] <sgclark> oh we withdraw the ability to upload?
[23:31] <yofel> where did that come from?
[23:31] <sgclark> that does not sound right
[23:32] <yofel> I didn't hear about that, and I'm fairly certain that's not the plan
[23:32] <yofel> doesn't change the fact that we barley have any people left that can upload more than the kubuntu set
[23:32] <sgclark> I can only upload kubuntu and not even all of that
[23:33] <sgclark> so yeah I have to fix that
[23:36] <santa_> sgclark: but you can upload all of frameworks/plasma/apps?
[23:36] <sgclark> few lingering apps that I get rejects on
[23:37] <sgclark> but mostly yeah
[23:40] <santa_> ScottK: but indeed my opinions of debian are "coloured" by my experience there - such as the well known lack of manpower of the debian qt/kde team and other things
[23:41] <santa_> which I suffered in first person, and which was a problem before I joined, while I was in, and after I left
[23:44] <sgclark> well we are going to have that problem here. So we need to make do with what have and make the best of it.
[23:45] <santa_> that depends on the direction that the project takes
[23:46] <santa_> that's "terra incognita" for now
[23:47] <santa_> I think with the right people here, with a minimum of 3 packagers we have the thing saved
[23:48] <santa_> or even 1 XD
[23:48] <santa_> but I think there will be more than one I hope
[23:48] <santa_> we will see how the thing evolves


[01:16] <axw> jw4 katco: yep, that was baby's first plantuml diagram :)
[01:16] <jw4> axw: lol
[01:38] <katco> anastasiamac: lmk when you've forwarded it
[01:39] <katco> ACK! one of my rules was deleting it!
[01:41] <jw4> katco: you mean the 'killfile anastasiamac' rule?
[01:42] <katco> jw4: lol no
[01:42] <jw4> :)
[01:42] <katco> jw4: it deleted an email from alexisb as well =|
[01:42] <katco> jw4: gmails filtering syntax doesn't work like i thought it did apparently =|
[01:42] <jw4> urg.
[01:42] <anastasiamac> katco: waht rule do u have? delete all from anyone starting with "A"?
[01:42] <jw4> hahaha
[01:42] <katco> anastasiamac: LOL
[02:44] <wallyworld_> axw: here's a trivial 1.22 fix when you get a chance http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/927/
[02:44] <axw> looking
[02:45] <axw> wallyworld_: are all the clouds updated?
[02:46] <wallyworld_> axw: the packaging change is for the deb in the cloud archive repo
[02:46] <axw> right, ok
[02:46] <wallyworld_> so the cloud images don't need updating
[02:47] <axw> wallyworld_: LGTM
[02:47] <wallyworld_> ty
[03:08] <axw> wallyworld_: http://www.reddit.com/r/golang/comments/2vo357/if_you_use_jetbrains_intellij_for_development_the/
[03:08] <axw> you use intellij right?
[03:08] <wallyworld_> yeah
[03:09] <wallyworld_> i use a go plugin from someone on github
[03:09] <wallyworld_> this might be a different one
[03:10] <wallyworld_> oh, no same one
[03:11] <wallyworld_> i normally compile from source as i've done a patch or two to it
[03:14] <axw> wallyworld_: http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/923/, PTAL
[03:14] <wallyworld_> sure
[03:20] <wallyworld_> axw: did you push? still the old rev
[03:20] <axw> wallyworld_: bleh, I guess the hook didn't transfer to RB
[03:20] <wallyworld_> np, i look in gh
[03:32] <axw> wallyworld_: I've just rebased and pushing again, I've deleted that file
[03:32] <wallyworld_> ok
[03:33] <axw> wallyworld_: btw I don't think the storage/pool package should be depending on storage/provider, it should be the other way around if anything
[03:33] <axw> storage/provider is common providers... I don't think the pool package doesn't need to know about it
[03:33] <wallyworld_> yeah, the dependencies are a little messy
[03:34] <wallyworld_> pool uses provider to reference ProviderType
[03:35] <wallyworld_> maybe defaultpool should move
[03:38] <wallyworld_> axw: done, i hate it how gh sends comments before you have a chance to correct them
[03:38] <axw> wallyworld_: heh yeah :)
[03:38] <axw> sorry, I should've waited
[03:39] <wallyworld_> np :-)
[03:56] <anastasiamac> axw: how idid u come accross the idea article? r u thinking of converting to the dark side?
[04:04] <axw> anastasiamac: I just saw it on http://www.reddit.com/r/golang
[04:04] <axw> and no, I am not :)
[04:05] <anastasiamac> axw: ic :D
[04:06] <anastasiamac> axw: m sure if they got runtime debugging going, it would convert a few ..
[04:14] <wallyworld_> works for me
[04:19] <anastasiamac> wallyworld_: debugging works for u? like stepping through at runtime?
[04:20] <wallyworld_> yep
[04:20] <wallyworld_> but it doesn't go over the api
[04:20] <wallyworld_> so limited use
[04:20] <anastasiamac> oh i c...
[04:23] <katco> anastasiamac: i can step through code in emacs as well :)
[09:11] <Muntaner> good morning!
[09:13] <TheMue> Muntaner: o/
[09:59] <perrito666> morning
[09:59] <dimitern> perrito666, o/
[10:00] <TheMue> heya perrito666
[10:01] <dimitern> voidspace, dooferlad, standup?
[10:01] <TheMue> dimitern: see you're in but it doesn't work
[10:02] <voidspace> dimitern: omw
[10:17] <perrito666> frankban: ping
[10:17] <frankban> perrito666: morning
[10:17] <perrito666> hello :)
[10:17] <perrito666> frankban: I broke your code and defintely could use a bit of guidance fixing it
[10:18] <frankban> perrito666: hope I can help, what's up?
[10:19] <perrito666> frankban: so, this is the deal, I am working on having agent status and unit status split up
[10:19] <perrito666> what used to be status for unit, now is status for an agent entity, that holds nothing else other than status
[10:19] <perrito666> and unit now has a different status with a new globalKey
[10:20] <perrito666> so, for transitions sake, unit uses the same globalKey than it used to for most things except status
[10:21] <perrito666> with your last addings to mega/multi watcher it seems that if I am watching agent (that is what you actually want to know) it never gets informed when ports change
[10:21] <perrito666> and if I watch unit, it never gets informed of the other changes :)
[10:21] <perrito666> I might add agent and unit to the watcher and split things up
[10:21] <perrito666> but I will most likely break whatever you are using the watcher for
[10:22] <perrito666> so I could use some light in that department
[10:23] <perrito666> oh and al of this before coffee
[10:23] <frankban> :-)
[10:24]  * perrito666 tries to defeat the lazyness to turn on the expresso machine
[10:26] <frankban> perrito666: so the status for the unit is already updated by watching a separate collection right?
[10:26] <perrito666> if I let the code as is, yes, it watches the unit and gets updates for port changes (although the states are not the one you would expect)
[10:26] <perrito666> and then you loose the agent statuses
[10:27] <perrito666> if I change it to watch agent instead, you loose the ports
[10:27] <perrito666> so I definitely need to watch both
[10:28] <frankban> perrito666: I am not sure I understand how status and ports are related, perhaps you can show me some code, or we could have an hangout?
[10:29] <perrito666> frankban: I can do both :)
[10:30] <frankban> perrito666: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/canonical.com/gogogo?authuser=1
[10:31]  * perrito666 checks that he can speak english this early, check
[10:31] <frankban> lol
[10:32] <perrito666> frankban: hold a sec, my computer jsut los sound... because of reasons
[10:32]  * perrito666 restart
[10:38]  * perrito666 is in trying to join the call to long
[10:38] <perrito666> there, you go, wrong authuser
[10:49] <perrito666> frankban: you froze
[10:50] <perrito666> frankban: but that's ok I got the info I needed, Ill let you know whenever this is ready to land so you can take a look
[10:52] <frankban> perrito666: my machine decided to freeze :-/ I am back in the hangout
[10:53] <perrito666> frankban: brt
[10:55]  * perrito666 wonders who designed his computer and didn't add a kb key for play/pause
[10:57] <mgz> I filed bug 1421606 as a blocker
[10:57] <mup> Bug #1421606: TestAddServiceStorageConstraints fails on ppc64 <ci> <regression> <test-failure> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1421606>
[10:57] <perrito666> frankban: look into chrome://gpu if your hardware acceleration is dissabled you migh need to hack a bit your chrome launcher to bypass dri check
[10:58] <frankban> perrito666: good to know, ty
[11:07] <aznashwan> time-appropriate greetings to everyone! just wanted to consult you guys a little on something
[11:08] <aznashwan> I'm currently working on getting CentOS fully supported (cloudinit and sshinit-capable), my first point of concern being abstracting away the differences between apt and yum (mostly for sshinit purposes)
[11:10] <aznashwan> my question is, how necessary is it we set up apt-package pinning, I see it's only actually done in a couple of places and does not seem (from what I can discern) to be that necessary really. would dropping the whole pinning process be too much to take?
[11:13] <perrito666> aznashwan: without knowing where and why I cant tell you for sure
[11:14] <aznashwan> perrito666: my bad. they're declared here: https://github.com/juju/juju/blob/master/cloudinit/cloudinit.go#L32
[11:15] <perrito666> aznashwan: not very explicit of what is that for
[11:15] <perrito666> aznashwan: doesn't yum support some sort of pinning?
[11:16] <aznashwan> perrito666: and the only place one is used (apart from a couple of test files), is here: https://github.com/juju/juju/blob/master/environs/cloudinit/cloudinit.go#L370
[11:16] <perrito666> that is a rather important one
[11:16] <aznashwan> perrito666: yes it does, but for settling priorities for whole repositories, not for a single package available in multiple sources
[11:17] <perrito666> aznashwan: you dont want to en up with an unsupported cloud tools
[11:18] <perrito666> aznashwan: my take, just add a mock implementtion of pining for the moment
[11:19] <aznashwan> perrito666: true, but this gets us to a bigger problem: that's a cloud tools repo full of .deb's (which is a topic we'll be pitching next week, about how we also need rmp's for all the specific stuff, like the juju specific mongo package you guys have...)
[11:20] <perrito666> aznashwan: I dont think that old app to install debs in redhat still exist right ? :)
[11:22] <aznashwan> perrito666: that's a good question, either way it wouldn't be too much work, just the juju-mongodb package and these tools, which I suspect you guys have built automatically, and the main juju package for CentOS...
[11:22] <aznashwan> perrito666: will look further into the matter, and will take your advice for now and just work around this
[11:24] <perrito666> aznashwan: seems the easiest way for the moment
[11:24] <aznashwan> perrito666: much obliged :D
[11:36] <Muntaner> gsamfira: o/
[11:36] <Muntaner> I'll be back at work on windows + juju on Monday
[12:15] <jam> perrito666: is someone looking at https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1421606 I just saw its blocking trunk
[12:15] <mup> Bug #1421606: TestAddServiceStorageConstraints fails on ppc64 <ci> <regression> <test-failure> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1421606>
[12:16] <jam> i realize that ideally axw or wallyworld_ would be looking at it
[12:16]  * perrito666 looks
[12:16] <jam> but I think its past their EOD
[12:16] <jam> (and thus past their EOW, I believe)
[12:16]  * perrito666 hears an incoming email from axw as soon as jam said that
[12:20] <wwitzel3> perrito666: he sets them up on notifies from IRC
[12:20] <perrito666> lol
[12:20] <perrito666> jam: but short answer is no, no one was looking at that, I guess we will have to since that seems to lock CI :)
[12:20] <jam> perrito666: ype
[12:20] <jam> yep
[12:21] <perrito666> jam: incidentally, isn't today like saturday for you?
[12:21] <jam> perrito666: yeah, but I had a big meeting, so I was around, and tried to submit one of my backlog packages, respond to email, etc.
[12:27] <wwitzel3> jam: lots of people or very important? ;)
[12:28] <jam> wwitzel3: very important
[12:28] <jam> spec review with Mark, though hopefully we'll get that regularly scheduled on a workday for me :)
[12:28] <perrito666> ah the infamous: "meeting on saturday or unemployment on monday" :p
[12:28] <wwitzel3> jam: ahh, which spec?
[12:29]  * perrito666 runs to see his spec to make sure it hasn't changed
[12:29] <jam> wwitzel3: well, we're hopefully going to be doing regular weekly chats about features we're working on. though today's was about the Juju Unit and Service States (aka charm health)
[12:29] <jam> s/States/Status/
[12:29] <perrito666> jam: :( I thought we where done with that
[12:30] <jam> perrito666: nothing major. mostly just moving the stuff we discussed in the overview into the core of the doc
[12:30] <wwitzel3> jam: nice
[12:47] <TheMue> hmm, is writing "shit it" due to friday afternoon?
[12:48] <perrito666> TheMue: ?
[12:48] <perrito666> dislexic are we
[12:48] <perrito666> ?
[12:49] <TheMue> typo during review, thankfully not published w/o correction
[12:49] <TheMue> ;)
[13:10]  * dimitern steps out for ~1h
[13:10] <ashipika> hi all.. a question: trying to bootstrap my ec2 environment in eu-west-1.. but i'm getting the following error: error: invalid value "arch=amd64 cpu-cores=1 cpu-power=100 mem=1740M root-disk=8192M availability-zone=eu-west-1a" for flag --hardware: unknown characteristic "availability-zone"
[13:10] <ashipika> 13:56
[13:10] <ashipika> juju version 1.22-alpha1-trusty-amd64
[13:11] <ashipika> also juju (at least this version) does not seem to know about t2.micro instances (free tier eligible ) if i specify --constraints 'instance-type=t2.micro'
[13:14] <wwitzel3> ashipika: you can type juju help ec2-provider for specific help with EC2, but the placement directive should just be zone, not availability-zone
[13:14] <wwitzel3> ashipika: also looking at our instance types, you are right, we only know about t1.micro atm
[13:17] <ashipika> wwitzel3: zone=<availability-zone-name>
[13:19] <ashipika> wwitzel3: but then it says: unknown constraint zone
[13:21] <wwitzel3> ashipika: right, the zone placement should be outsize the constraints
[13:23] <wwitzel3> ashipika: juju bootstrap zone=name --constraints=""
[13:24] <ashipika> wwitzel3: juju bootstrap zone="eu-west-1c" —upload-tools    ->  unrecognized args ["zone=....
[13:26] <ashipika> wwitzel3: ah.. juju bootstrap —to zone=eu-west-1c ....
[13:28] <wwitzel3> ashipika: you got there first :), was just typing that, my fault .. I've never actually used zone with bootstrap, only with add-machine, and with add-machine you don't need to specifiy a --to
[13:30] <ashipika> wwitzel3: not solved the problem, though.. still getting
[13:30] <voidspace> dimitern: so when you say forwarding needs to be setup in container initialisation, you mean from the "initialiseAndStartProvisioner" method of ContainerSetup.
[13:30] <ashipika> wwitzel3: error: invalid value "arch=amd64 cpu-cores=1 cpu-power=100 mem=1740M root-disk=8192M availability-zone=eu-west-1c" for flag --hardware: unknown characteristic "availability-zone"
[13:30] <ashipika> ERROR failed to bootstrap environment: subprocess encountered error code 1
[13:33] <wwitzel3> ashipika: right, you need to remove that availability-zone from your constraints
[13:33] <ashipika> wwitzel3: i ran -> juju bootstrap --to zone=eu-west-1c --upload-tools
[13:38] <ashipika> wwitzel3: and the same error without —to
[13:38] <wwitzel3> ashipika: try running a destroy-environment (you may have to use --force), to clean up, then retry bootstrap
[13:38] <ashipika> wwitzel3: did.. a few times already.. after every failed attempt
[13:40] <wwitzel3> ashipika: you can check ~/.juju/environments , probably an old amazon.jenv hanging around
[13:40] <ashipika> wwitzel3: nah.. deleted .juju and ran juju init..
[13:42] <wwitzel3> ashipika: hrmph .. then I don't know, you may have found a bug, unless someone else here has some ideas?
[13:44] <ashipika> wwitzel3: trying with region set to us-east-1 in the .yaml config.. if that fails i'll create a bug report
[14:00] <TheMue> dimitern: btw, why do we use int for ports, instead of uint16?
[14:18] <Muntaner> gsamfira: ping
[14:43] <turicasto> hi to everyone!
[14:46] <dimitern> TheMue, it's doesn't matter in practice
[14:47] <dimitern> TheMue, i.e. saving a few bytes at (de)serialization time is negligible
[14:48] <TheMue> dimitern: I'm not talking about parameters, but as a field type which only allows uint16 values. a port number -1 would be strange ;)
[14:50] <jw4> turicasto: o/
[14:51] <rogpeppe> TheMue: using int means that you get a better failure mode if someone happens to get some arithmetic wrong and passes a negative number
[14:52] <TheMue> rogpeppe: a better one? uints can't even be negative
[14:53] <rogpeppe> TheMue: if you accidentally substract 64 from 62 and pass -2, you don't really want it to be treated as 65534
[14:54] <rogpeppe> TheMue: better to have it fail with an out of bounds error
[14:54] <TheMue> rogpeppe: arg, yes, this arithmetic behavior
[14:54] <rogpeppe> TheMue: there's a similar argument for not allowing negative slice indexes like in python
[14:55] <dimitern> TheMue, you mean in network.Port ?
[14:55] <TheMue> dimitern: yep
[14:55] <dimitern> TheMue, yeah, that sounds like a good idea, I'd suggest adding this to your list of things to change in the next PR :)
[14:56] <TheMue> dimitern: Number is an int and so could have invalid values
[14:56] <TheMue> dimitern: shit, I shouldn't have asked
[14:56] <TheMue> :D
[14:56] <dimitern> TheMue, they are validated internally, but yeah
[14:56] <dimitern> ;)
[14:57] <TheMue> dimitern: one of the arguments for static typed languages is to have more safety. thankfully go provides very detailed types here (ok, not uint48 *lol*)
[14:58] <TheMue> or uint128 for uuids, but that better would be a bitstring
[14:58] <dimitern> TheMue, +1
[15:00] <jw4> do we do pull requests for just adding a deprecation comment?  https://github.com/juju/charm/pull/84
[15:00] <dimitern> TheMue, I'd even go further and suggest having a type PortType uint16 in the network package and use it everywhere for port values
[15:00] <TheMue> dimitern: +1
[15:01]  * TheMue always likes the simple type definition in Go
[15:03] <dimitern> TheMue, yeah, and you can even have methods on it;)
[15:03] <TheMue> dimitern: yeah, that's cool
[15:05] <perrito666> ericsnow: wwitzel3 ?
[15:08] <rogpeppe> dimitern, TheMue: a large but totally trivial change: https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/1601/files
[15:09] <rogpeppe> dimitern: i'd appreciate a quick review so that it doesn't get stale, if poss - there are no manual changes there at all.
[15:09] <dimitern> rogpeppe, will have a look
[15:09] <rogpeppe> dimitern: ta!
[15:09] <TheMue> rogpeppe: currently standup, but will look then
[15:09] <rogpeppe> TheMue: ta
[15:16] <wwitzel3> TheMue: http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/932/
[15:16] <wwitzel3> TheMue: that is for fixing https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1417875
[15:16] <mup> Bug #1417875: ERROR juju.worker runner.go:219 exited "rsyslog": x509: certificate signed by unknown authority <canonical-bootstack> <logging> <regression>
[15:16] <mup> <juju-core:In Progress by wwitzel3> <juju-core 1.21:Triaged by wwitzel3> <juju-core 1.22:Triaged by wwitzel3> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1417875>
[15:16] <TheMue> wwitzel3: already opened, will review after standup
[15:17] <wwitzel3> TheMue: thanks
[15:29] <TheMue> wwitzel3: +1
[15:31] <dimitern> rogpeppe, LGTM
[15:32] <rogpeppe> dimitern: thanks!
[15:32] <rogpeppe> dimitern: aw, remind me of the juju magic word for submitting a PR please?
[15:33] <dimitern> rogpeppe, $$anything-between-two-dollar-signs$$
[15:33] <dimitern> :)
[15:35] <TheMue> dimitern: thx, you've been faster
[15:35] <dimitern> np
[15:35] <TheMue> rogpeppe: won't merge due to missing fix, but is reviewed. so should be comming soon
[15:36] <rogpeppe> TheMue: cool. hopefully it won't conflict.
[15:36] <katco> dimitern: hey sorry, what are you meaning when you say "d"?
[15:36] <perrito666> katco: delete
[15:37] <katco> perrito666: ty
[15:37] <dimitern> katco, :) d==delete this line
[15:37] <katco> dimitern: so are you referring to whitespace in a lot of those?
[15:37] <perrito666> katco: which you would know if you used vi :p
[15:37] <dimitern> katco, but d it's nicer and geeky :D
[15:37] <katco> haha
[15:37] <katco> perrito666: shouldn't it be dd?
[15:37] <mgz>  dd would be clearer :P
[15:38] <dimitern> katco, yeah, I don't mind it that much though
[15:38] <mgz> katco won...
[15:38] <perrito666> d-> is enough :p
[15:38] <dimitern> dd only if you use vim
[15:38] <katco> dimitern: i tend to use whitespace to aid in readability
[15:38] <perrito666> katco: I actually interrupted my lunch to troll you, and you counter troll me
[15:38] <perrito666> :p
[15:38] <dimitern> and C-k is longer to type :)
[15:38] <katco> perrito666: i muahaha at you sir!
[15:39] <dimitern> katco, I understand
[15:39] <TheMue> *LOL*
[15:39] <dimitern> katco, so I'll leave it up to you ;)
[15:39] <katco> dimitern: ok, ty for the review :)
[15:39] <dimitern> katco, I'm not done yet :)
[15:39] <katco> dimitern: oh i know, but i wanted to say ty :)
[15:40]  * katco making some tea
[15:40] <dimitern> katco, np
[15:56] <dimitern> katco, you have a review
[15:56] <katco> dimitern: tyvm!
[15:57] <katco> dimitern: hey rq about the SignedURL
[15:57] <katco> dimitern: i thought this might come up... the new v4 signing messes with request headers, so there's no concept of a signed url
[15:58] <dimitern> katco, I'd like to read about this more if you have the source
[15:59] <katco> dimitern: check out aws/sign.go
[15:59] <dimitern> katco, also, is the v4 signing process now mandatory for all s3 operations?
[15:59] <katco> dimitern: https://github.com/go-amz/amz/blob/v1/aws/sign.go#L82
[15:59] <katco> dimitern: it is not; you pass in which signing you'd like into S3 ctor
[16:00] <dimitern> katco, ok so for older versions URL and SignedURL still make sense to exist, and at least URL should be implementable for V4
[16:01] <katco> dimitern: for v2, signedurl could still work
[16:02] <katco> dimitern: for URL, it didn't make much sense to me. what would you do with it?
[16:03] <dimitern> katco, get a link to something in your bucket that's accessible to public (permission-wise)
[16:04] <katco> dimitern: ah ok
[16:04] <dimitern> katco, :)
[16:04] <dimitern> katco, we do still use this in juju IIRC
[16:05] <dimitern> katco, and even if we didn't and URL/SignedURL no longer make sense, we can't just drop them - such a change needs a version bump (e.g. a separate PR for v3-unstable)
[16:05] <katco> dimitern: that was the idea :)
[16:06] <ericsnow> jam: thanks for the reply re: fakes
[16:06] <katco> dimitern: so if you'd like to keep SignedUrl, how should we detect that the signing method supports a signed url?
[16:06] <ericsnow> jam: I sent a follow-up to get some clarification
[16:06] <dimitern> katco, I see, well - is this something we'll need to use in juju soon?
[16:06] <katco> dimitern: it's targetted for 1.23. feature freeze is 2w from today.
[16:07] <dimitern> katco, so that's why it needs to go in v2, but because of the versioning rules, we can't also drop stuff from the exported interface
[16:07] <dimitern> katco, ...in v2, but we can in v3-unstable
[16:08] <katco> dimitern: is versioning of goamz tied to something? why can't we do a cut?
[16:08] <dimitern> katco, out of respect for any potential users
[16:08] <katco> dimitern: they're free to remain on v2 aren't they?
[16:08] <dimitern> katco, yes
[16:09] <dimitern> katco, but once your change lands, their code won't compile anymore with v2
[16:09] <dimitern> if they use URL and/or SignedURL
[16:09] <katco> dimitern: my change is targetted against v3-unstable isn't it?
[16:09] <dimitern> katco, aww :/
[16:09] <dimitern> katco, that's my bad, sorry - I should've looked
[16:10] <katco> dimitern: oh no worries.. i was very confused! lol
[16:10] <dimitern> katco, and I actually asked you to re-target it :)
[16:10] <dimitern> katco, ok, then it's fine
[16:10] <dimitern> katco, still isn't URL worth keeping?
[16:10] <katco> dimitern: sure, i can add that back in
[16:10] <dimitern> katco, thanks
[16:11] <dimitern> katco, I'll update the review - how about the live tests?
[16:11] <katco> dimitern: it will be a function that is: .Region.ResolveS3BucketEndpoint(b.Name)+"/"+path
[16:11] <katco> dimitern: i still need to do that
[16:11] <dimitern> katco, however, just a sec
[16:11] <katco> dimitern: as you pointed out, obviously unit tests pass
[16:12] <dimitern> katco, if this needs to go in juju for 1.23, then you'll need to cherry-pick what's relevant from this and backport it to v2, isn't it?
[16:12] <katco> dimitern: any reason we can't move juju to v3?
[16:13] <dimitern> katco, we could, but this'll mean carefully integrating changes from v2, renaming v3-unstable to v3 and branching v4-unstable of it
[16:13] <dimitern> katco, as we can't depend on v3-unstable for a release in juju
[16:13] <katco> dimitern: right
[16:14] <katco> dimitern: i'm good with whatever you suggest
[16:14] <dimitern> katco, there are not many things to port from v2 to v3 IIRC
[16:15] <dimitern> katco, then let's agree to do this migration - I have a couple of PRs for goamz which I'll need to land before the freeze, so I'll re-target them to v3 as well
[16:15] <katco> dimitern: ok cool
[16:16] <dimitern> katco, cheers!
[16:16] <dimitern> katco, I didn't quite get your response on whether you've run go test -check.v -amazon in s3/
[16:16] <katco> dimitern: :) and progress marches inexorably forward!
[16:17] <katco> dimitern: no i haven't done that yet
[16:17] <dimitern> katco, as it should :)
[16:17] <dimitern> katco, ok, just a reminder then
[16:17] <katco> dimitern: yep, ty i didn't know about that flag
[16:17] <katco> dimitern: i was going to test manually
[16:18] <dimitern> katco, that's fine (ideally we'd like a live test using both s3test and live AWS), but at minimum let's ensure no existing local/live s3test/AWS tests break
[16:19] <katco> dimitern: will do. thanks for the pointers and your help.
[16:20] <dimitern> katco, no worries, thank's for bearing up with me :)
[16:20] <katco> dimitern: it was not a burden; great questions
[16:20] <dimitern> thanks even
[16:20] <dimitern> :)
[17:21] <voidspace> dimitern: ping
[17:21] <dimitern> voidspace, pong
[17:21] <voidspace> dimitern: hey, hi
[17:21] <voidspace> dimitern: I'm really struggling to test the lxc-broker changes
[17:22] <voidspace> dimitern: I could just mock out the call that takes the NetworkInfo and check that the results of PrepareContainerInterfaceInfo are used
[17:22] <voidspace> dimitern: but that seems yucky
[17:22] <dimitern> voidspace, hmm, let me think
[17:22] <voidspace> dimitern: and as far as I can tell the results of calling broker.StartInstance don't include network details to check
[17:22] <voidspace> surprisingly result.NetworkInfo is empty (nil) so I can't inspect that
[17:22] <dimitern> voidspace, do you have a wip branch up to have a look?
[17:23] <voidspace> dimitern: yep, hang on
[17:23] <voidspace> dimitern: I'll push what I have
[17:23] <dimitern> voidspace, cheers
[17:23] <voidspace> ah, there might be an lxc.conf file I can look at...
[17:23] <voidspace> just discover3ed
[17:23] <dimitern> voidspace, so the result of StartInstance after PCII() did its job must have NetworkInfo populated
[17:23] <voidspace> dimitern: shall I check that first?
[17:24] <dimitern> voidspace, yes please
[17:24] <voidspace> well, it doesn't but I can confirm that our code is being called...
[17:24] <voidspace> dimitern: I'll check the conf file and see if it has testable info
[17:24] <dimitern> voidspace, because this is later needed in other cases
[17:25] <dimitern> voidspace, so, the result of PCII() is used to generate lxc.conf, cloud-init userdata, and to run a few commands essentially
[17:25] <voidspace> right
[17:25] <dimitern> voidspace, so all these should be testable, but I might've missed something
[17:26] <voidspace> testing the commands would just duplicate the production code in the tests so seems pointless
[17:27] <voidspace> dimitern: see TestNetworking in this branch
[17:27] <voidspace> dimitern: https://github.com/voidspace/juju/compare/container-prepareprovisioner
[17:27] <dimitern> voidspace, looking
[17:27] <voidspace> dimitern: the output of lxc.NetworkInfo is "[]network.InterfaceInfo(nil)"
[17:28] <voidspace> so NetworkInfo on the StartInstanceResult is not populated
[17:28] <voidspace> (and I haven't moved forwarding setup to container initialisation yet because that's trivial to do - although also not easy to test)
[17:29] <ericsnow> niemeyer: thanks for the feedback on "fakes"
[17:29] <dimitern> voidspace, not in my demo branch, but it should be populated
[17:29] <ericsnow> niemeyer: it's very insightful and has given me plenty to think about :)
[17:29] <voidspace> dimitern: oh, you mean this is something additional that should be done?
[17:31] <dimitern> voidspace, well, my plan is to support passing non-empty args.NetworkInfo to StartInstance() for cases like "start with statically configured network" or "create these 3 nics like this", etc.
[17:31] <voidspace> ok
[17:32] <niemeyer> ericsnow: Glad it's being useful
[17:32] <dimitern> voidspace, then, inside PCII() handle what's needed and return an updated NetworkInfo which is then returned by StartInstance for other uses
[17:33] <dimitern> voidspace, e.g. to update the firewall rules or something else that happens on the host of the newly provisioned container
[17:33] <voidspace> ok
[17:33] <voidspace> dimitern: by the way, pretty sure we'll get the keys to the new house on Wednesday
[17:33] <voidspace> dimitern: so I'll be in Monday and Tuesday
[17:33] <dimitern> voidspace, +1, sure
[17:34] <voidspace> dimitern: thanks
[17:34] <dimitern> voidspace, so coming back to your question
[17:34] <dimitern> voidspace, these are a few ideas of what needs testing there
[17:35] <dimitern> voidspace, 1. given a networkInfo and provided networking and address allocation is supported, verify we get an updated networkInfo out of start instance
[17:36] <dimitern> (updated like - having an Address, DNSServers and GatewayAddress, as well as ConfigStatic)
[17:37] <dimitern> voidspace, 2. test local dns servers are parsed and added, when available (mocking where you read them from ofc)
[17:38] <dimitern> voidspace, 3. the necessary commands for setting up routes, etc. are called (also by mocking - there are a few similar examples in the cmd/ package IIRC and around cloudinit/sshinit)
[17:39] <dimitern> voidspace, 4. for lxc specifically, check the lxc.conf is updated as expected, and the cloud-init userdata gets updated
[17:39] <dimitern> voidspace, all these are just the happy path tests
[17:40] <dimitern> voidspace, the failures need testing as well - like if PCII fails or one of the other steps fail
[17:41] <dimitern> voidspace, how does this sound?
[17:43] <voidspace> dimitern: so that will mean *adding* the networkInfo :-)
[17:43] <voidspace> dimitern: lxc.conf does include some details from PCII() (network name and MAC)
[17:43] <voidspace> dimitern: testing 2 & 3 will effectively mean duplicating the commands straight from the code into the test
[17:44] <voidspace> dimitern: so they're not very good tests
[17:44] <dimitern> voidspace, well, not quite :)
[17:44] <voidspace> dimitern: mock and record the calls, check the calls match the expected calls
[17:44] <dimitern> voidspace, the command tests can separately test the behavior around parsing resolv.conf and setting up iptables, etc.
[17:45] <voidspace> dimitern: what do you mean by "command tests"?
[17:45] <dimitern> voidspace, while the start instance tests can just check the commands get called or fail
[17:45] <voidspace> voidspace: executeCommands is called several times (3 I believe)
[17:45] <voidspace> oops, dimitern ^^
[17:45] <dimitern> voidspace, I mean the tests around localDNSServers etc.
[17:46] <voidspace> dimitern: the only way to test that localDNSServers is used is to record what executeCommands is called with and check it matches the production code
[17:46] <voidspace> dimitern: I mock readFile and I can check the pre-canned data is used, so I can test the file is read
[17:47] <dimitern> voidspace, let's have a chat on monday ;)
[17:47] <voidspace> which more-or-less amounts to the same thing
[17:47] <voidspace> dimitern: just to clarify though
[17:47] <dimitern> voidspace, I need to sit down and write this first
[17:47] <voidspace> dimitern: you need the NetworkInfo populated on StartInstanceResult?
[17:47] <dimitern> voidspace, I'm thinking of several levels of tests
[17:47] <dimitern> voidspace, yes, indeed
[17:47] <voidspace> right
[17:47] <voidspace> I'll look at adding that
[17:48] <dimitern> voidspace, ta!
[17:56] <dimitern> happy weekends everyone! ;)
[17:57] <perrito666> dimitern: likewise
[17:57] <dimitern> perrito666, ;) cheers
[18:15] <marcoceppi> natefinch  : any chance we could get this looked at? It's break charm testing and has kind of a weird long standing low priority https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju/+bug/802117
[18:15] <mup> Bug #802117: juju ssh/scp commands cause spurious key errors <ssh> <Amulet:Triaged> <pyjuju:Triaged> <juju-core:Triaged> <juju (Ubuntu):Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/802117>
[18:21] <sinzui> marcoceppi, ci works around the issue with a rule like this
[18:21] <sinzui> host 10.* 172.* 54.85.* 15.185.*
[18:21] <sinzui>   StrictHostKeyChecking no
[18:21] <sinzui>   UserKnownHostsFile /dev/null
[18:22] <marcoceppi> sinzui: I can't expect every user to do that though
[18:23] <sinzui> marcoceppi, I expect ever cloud user and lxc user has come across this given time and has realised they don't want those ips in the files
[18:24] <marcoceppi> :\ I have several long running instances in Amazon that I would like hostkeychecking with
[18:37] <alexisb> dude marcoceppi that bug has been around a long time
[18:54] <marcoceppi> alexisb: yeah, it totally has! Someone just hit it on the mailing list. I've always just removed offending keys but surely we can do better
[18:54] <alexisb> marcoceppi, we can it is a matter of prioritizing it amount the 800+ other bugs
[18:54] <alexisb> so tag it, and send me a mail
[18:57] <marcoceppi> Tag it what?
[18:57] <natefinch> marcoceppi: just got back to the keyboard.  Sounds like alexisb has you covered.
[18:58] <natefinch> haha, that bug is older than all my kids
[18:58] <alexisb> natefinch, mine too! ;)
[18:58] <alexisb> marcoceppi, that is an excellent question, we need better tags, for now send me a note with the bug number
[18:59] <marcoceppi> alexisb: ack
[19:00] <natefinch> haha that's from before the project was called juju :)
[19:01] <marcoceppi> Yeah, it's been lingering around for a bit ;)
[19:01] <natefinch> Hey, sweet, monday is a holiday in the US
[19:03] <perrito666> natefinch: here too, and also tuesday
[19:03] <perrito666> natefinch: what is it there?
[19:03] <voidspace> right
[19:03] <voidspace> EOW
[19:03] <voidspace> g'night all
[19:03] <voidspace> see you on Monday
[19:03] <voidspace> except natefinch ...
[19:04] <sinzui> marcoceppi, "charmers" is the official tag for ecosystems stakeholders
[19:04] <natefinch> perrito666: George Washington's birthday (first President of the US).... guessing that's not what you're celebrating ;)
[19:04] <perrito666> natefinch: carnival :p
[19:06] <sinzui> marcoceppi, and ha ha. regarding those ssh rules I pasted. we don't have those rules for azure and this just just failed http://juju-ci.vapour.ws:8080/job/azure-quickstart-bundle/211/console
[19:06] <marcoceppi> <3
[19:14] <natefinch> wwitzel3: you wanted some pictures of the snow?  Here you go: http://imgur.com/a/yqfQS
[19:16] <TheMue> so, 8:15pm, time for a Single Malt, bye folks, enjoy your weekends
[19:18] <natefinch> I love the way that I can search for gimp in the software center and it comes up, but if I click on it, it says it can't be found
[19:18] <perrito666> natefinch: ???
[19:19] <natefinch> $ sudo apt-get install gimp
[19:19] <natefinch> [sudo] password for nate:
[19:19] <natefinch> Reading package lists... Done
[19:19] <natefinch> Building dependency tree
[19:19] <natefinch> Reading state information... Done
[19:19] <natefinch> Package gimp is not available, but is referred to by another package.
[19:19] <natefinch> This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or
[19:19] <natefinch> is only available from another source
[19:19] <natefinch> E: Package 'gimp' has no installation candidate
[19:20] <mbruzek> jog ping?
[19:21] <jog> mbruzek, pong
[19:21] <mbruzek> jog is the link to the kubernetes reports http://reports.vapour.ws/kubernetes ?
[19:21] <mbruzek> Is my url incorrect or is it not working again?
[19:22] <jog> http://reports.vapour.ws/charm-summary/kubernetes
[19:24] <mbruzek> jog thanks I spaced on the URL
[19:24] <jog> mbruzek, http://reports.vapour.ws/charm-summary is the top level for charms and lists all that have test results. If you want to narrow it down to a particular charm you can append /"short charm name" to the URL
[19:25] <mbruzek> jog that is logical, I was not aware
[19:26] <jog> mbruzek, or you can find the charm you are interested in on the top level page and just click on it's Charm column entry to get the filtered page.
[19:33] <natefinch> perrito666: for reference, somehow "main" got unchecked from my list of package sources
[19:33] <perrito666> ouch
[19:34] <natefinch> yay for utopic :/
[19:35] <perrito666> you should try vivid
[20:56] <ericsnow> natefinch: could you take a quick look at https://github.com/juju/testing/pull/51
[20:56] <ericsnow> natefinch: niemeyer convinced me Fake wasn't the right name :)
[20:59] <katco> ericsnow: fwiw that's the nomenclature i've always seen as well (mocks, stubs)
[21:07] <natefinch> ericsnow, katco:  I generally use stub as a verb, to stub out an interface, which generally means "make it compile but don't have any logic".  However, if there are some well-known nomenclatures, it makes sense to follow those, even if I think they're silly :)
[21:07] <ericsnow> natefinch: yep
[21:08] <ericsnow> natefinch: so all that patch does it change the name
[21:08] <katco> natefinch: i was the same, but wallyworld pointed out to me awhile ago that stub had an actual meaning.
[21:09] <katco> natefinch: as far as agreeing on nomenclature, that's rather important... i.e. it's how humans communicate ;)
[21:09] <perrito666> katco: oh no biggie, we can code a shim to translate between our nomenclatures
[21:10] <ericsnow> katco: see http://martinfowler.com/articles/mocksArentStubs.html#TheDifferenceBetweenMocksAndStubs
[21:10] <katco> perrito666: whassa shim? you mean facade? (tongue firmly in cheek)
[21:10] <natefinch> ha
[21:10] <katco> ericsnow: yeah that's exactly what i read a few months ago
[21:10] <ericsnow> katco: Fowler cites http://xunitpatterns.com/Mocks,%20Fakes,%20Stubs%20and%20Dummies.html
[21:10] <katco> ericsnow: also, regarding the end-to-end vs. mock/stub debate
[21:10] <ericsnow> katco: and that guy has the noble goal of sorting out the nomenclature :)
[21:11] <katco> ericsnow: i feel like we're rehashing this. i sent out an email a bit ago about the new top-level featuretests package
[21:11] <ericsnow> katco: eh, I'll still argue both have their place :)
[21:11] <katco> ericsnow: and my understanding of what the team had agreed upon for going forward: mocks/stubs embedded along-side code. happy-path end-to-end functional tests in featuretests/*
[21:12] <ericsnow> katco: right
[21:12] <katco> ericsnow: maybe i confused myself. it just seemed like we were headed back towards that conversation on the ML
[21:30] <ericsnow> natefinch: thanks


[00:08] <manters2000> hello po
[00:08] <manters2000> magandang uma
[00:08] <manters2000> ga
[00:15] <manters2000> hello po


[05:13] <davers> I need help
[05:14] <davers> I am getting this in my /var/log/messages
[05:14] <davers> [  472.418877] printk: 7 messages suppressed.
[05:14] <davers> [  502.370233] printk: 1 messages suppressed.
[05:14] <davers> [  678.703103] printk: 5 messages suppressed.
[05:14] <davers> I think this is a problem
[05:14] <davers> it's suppressing all of my messages
[05:14] <davers> how can i fix this?
[05:15] <davers> anybody alive?
[05:15] <crimsun> what's the line prior to timestamp 472.418877?
[05:16] <davers> there isn't one
[05:16] <davers> oh i mean
[05:16] <davers> i have a huge list
[05:16] <davers> it goes on forever
[05:16] <davers> those are like the last three lines
[05:16] <davers> it's still writing new lines as we speak
[05:16] <davers> you want the first line?
[05:17] <davers> [  127.842337] printk: 429 messages suppressed.
[05:17] <crimsun> ok, but what is the last non-printk suppressed line?
[05:17] <davers> oh
[05:17] <davers> [  106.348721] eth1: no IPv6 routers present
[05:17] <davers> [   95.951519] NET: Registered protocol family 10
[05:17] <davers> [   95.951831] lo: Disabled Privacy Extensions
[05:17] <davers> [   95.952069] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_UP): eth0: link is not ready
[05:17] <davers> [  106.348721] eth1: no IPv6 routers present
[05:18] <crimsun> are you sure it's not related to a wireless device reassociating?
[05:19] <davers> I am not sure of anything at this point :)
[05:19] <crimsun> I have a lot of those, but I know I'm using a very crappy AP
[05:19] <davers> ahhh
[05:19] <davers> could be
[05:19] <davers> it's how i'm connected at the moment
[05:19] <davers> WPA to a crappy AP
[05:21] <davers> anyway
[05:21] <davers> maybe you can help me with something else
[05:22] <davers> i'm trying to use autofs
[05:22] <davers> and it's not logging any error messages to /var/log/messages
[05:22] <davers> but it's not working
[05:22] <davers> and there's no way for me to diagnose a problem
[05:24] <crimsun> not familiar with it, sorry.
[05:24] <davers> k
[05:25] <crimsun> if you're comfortable using kdb or sprinkling printks...
[05:26] <davers> what's kdb?
[05:28] <crimsun> a kernel debugger of sorts.
[05:28] <davers> ahh
[05:28] <davers> what does it mean when it suppresses messages?
[05:31] <crimsun> it's a means, roughly, of preventing floods of the same message within a period.
[10:07] <freeflying> crimsun: arounds?
[13:21] <kraut> moin
[18:21] <goldphish> I'm trying to rebuild linux-ubuntu-modules. Seems like everything built fine but the modules were apparently built for the wrong kernel. How do I specify which kernel to build against?
[18:50] <lamont> BenC: I assume your Christmas stuff arrived?


[00:16] <krytarik> Uhm, we still need to update some IRC webchat links from Kiwi IRC to Libera proper.. in the installer slideshow and on the website, I'll see if I can update the latter right away..
[00:28] <krytarik> Well, I think I've updated the link and box on <https://xubuntu.org/irc/> properly.. minus the caching..
[01:48] <krytarik> And it seems someone should figure a proper Mastodon icon and add it on <https://xubuntu.org/contact/>.. alongside updating some of the links to HTTPS.
[02:01] <krytarik> Oh lol, speaking of which, the help link in the description on <https://floss.social/@xubuntu> is still HTTP too.. XD
[06:07] <JackFrost> https://www.linode.com/blog/linode/a-bold-new-approach-to-the-cloud/ Welp.
[10:25] <bluesabre> Slowly but surely, Akamai absorbs everything. Sad to see that with Linode :(
[10:26] <JackFrost> Indeed.  I hope they retain the FOSS contributions, if not a lot of servers will disappear (Libera and OFTC would both be affected.)
[10:27] <JackFrost> Also congrats on the progress!
[10:28] <bluesabre> Yes! Everything got merged yesterday, but still working out issues. You can see a not minimal minimal iso on the dailies now: https://cdimage.ubuntu.com/xubuntu/daily-live/current/
[10:30] <bluesabre> Looks like that should be fixed once livecd-rootfs makes it out of proposed: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/livecd-rootfs
[10:45] <bluesabre> krytarik: Updated Mastodon with https links, added Mastodon to the contact page, and updated to https links there as well. Good catches!


[03:27] <Tm_T> hmm, so ubuntu, kubuntu, edubuntu and xubuntu all four are "official" distros? I mean if I make background with all of them
[03:29] <Tm_T> ok, ubuntu.com talks only about ubuntu, kubuntu and edubuntu
[03:30] <Tm_T> and I already got the idea... this will be great if I manage to do this right :)
[11:43] <EU> Ol!
[11:43] <EU> sorry.... hello!


[03:52] <dax> !search xchat
[03:52] <dax> !xchat
[03:52] <dax> what.
[03:52] <dax> !-xchat
[03:54] <dax> !no, xchat and xchat-gnome have not had stable releases in years. xchat was removed from Ubuntu for 16.04. Consider using hexchat instead, which is actively developed and available in 14.04 onwards.
[03:54] <dax> oops
[03:54] <dax> !no, xchat is <reply> xchat and xchat-gnome have not had stable releases in years. xchat was removed from Ubuntu for 16.04. Consider using hexchat instead, which is actively developed and available in 14.04 onwards.
[03:54] <dax> !xchat
[20:27] <valorie> question: how would I investigate whether or not a person is ban-evading?
[20:27] <valorie> we have someone lurking in #ubuntu-women who has been a problem in the past, now appearing as meiko
[20:28] <valorie> formerly tyil<EMAIL_ADDRESS>-- really tiresome troll in there for quite awhile
[20:41] <elky> bantracker doesn't return any results searching for tyil
[20:43] <elky> if you cant find a ban matching them from a visual inspection of the ban list, then nope.
[20:44] <valorie> ok
[20:44] <valorie> just have to keep eyes on then
[20:45] <valorie> evidently has been a serial harasser in any known women's chans
[20:45] <elky> you have logs of that?
[20:45] <elky> #ubuntu-women gets to be more preventative than other channels because of the kind of harasser that shows up there
[20:46] <elky> if you have evidence they're abusive, just get rid of them
[20:47] <valorie> [13:11] <meskarune> https://ptpb.pw/HKBr
[20:47] <valorie> [13:11] <meskarune> some logs from #archlinux-women
[20:47] <valorie> according to that same informant, they have been banned in arch women and the #feminist channel already and have bee trolling in fedora-diversity
[20:49] <elky> you have ops there yes?
[20:51] <valorie> yup
[20:52] <elky> valorie: then go ahead and ban and kick them
[20:52] <valorie> ok
[20:52] <elky> you don't need our permission
[20:52] <valorie> oh, I was just looking to see if ban-evading was already there
[20:52] <valorie> they are causing no problems right now
[20:52] <elky> doesn't matter.
[20:52] <valorie> right
[20:53] <valorie> just dealing with a couple of other issues atm
[22:14] <dax> huh, icesword wasn't banned in #u as far as I can tel
[22:14] <dax> oh, 71964 is still active. noice
[22:16] <dax> @comment 72352 ban-evading, long-term network problem user, joined and immediately trolled