[01:05] <davecheney> niemeyer: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1002200/
[01:05] <davecheney> as an example API
[01:17] <davecheney> i will have to add mutexs around all of the variables touched by SetConfig to ensure their visibility
[01:26] <niemeyer> davecheney: Might make sense to have one or more internal helper methods.. e.g.: func (e) credentials() (accessKey, secretKey string)
[01:26] <niemeyer> davecheney: So the locking is constrained
[01:27] <davecheney> yeah, each providor is different
[01:27] <niemeyer> davecheney: yeah, that's for internal use only
[01:27] <davecheney> in ec2, config is used to construct an ec2 and s3 at open time
[01:28] <davecheney> so those will need to be reconstructed
[01:28] <niemeyer> davecheney: Same idea.. rather than credentials, func (e) s3() *S3 then..
[01:28] <davecheney> yup
[01:29] <niemeyer> davecheney: So locking is only necessary within the method itself
[01:29] <davecheney> i will try to make it as fine grained as possible
[01:30] <niemeyer> davecheney: I was more worried about convenience than granularity in this case
[01:30] <niemeyer> davecheney: THis is a very rare event
[01:30] <davecheney> yup
[01:31] <niemeyer> ... value *net.OpError = &net.OpError{Op:"remote error", Net:"", Addr:net.Addr(nil), Err:0x28} ("remote error: handshake failure")
[01:31] <niemeyer> Com'on Amazon
[02:26] <niemeyer> Woohay
[02:26] <niemeyer> Signed URL works
[02:46] <niemeyer> and proposed
[02:48] <davecheney> niemeyer: just go though a first cut of Environ.SetConfig
[02:50] <niemeyer> davecheney: Nice
[02:50] <niemeyer> davecheney: How does it feel?
[02:50] <davecheney> not too bad
[02:50] <davecheney> had to use _variables
[02:50] <davecheney> which feel icky
[02:50] <davecheney> but adding accessors for the configuration items wasn't too bad
[02:51] <davecheney> just running off lbox propose
[02:54] <niemeyer> davecheney: Feels icky indeed
[02:55] <davecheney> https://code.launchpad.net/~dave-cheney/juju/go-environs-setconfig/+merge/106930
[02:55] <niemeyer> davecheney: Will let you know if I can think of something else tomorrow
[02:55] <niemeyer> davecheney: Right now it's past bed time here
[02:56] <davecheney> niemeyer: at the risk of reactivating the discussion from earlier
[02:57] <davecheney> the proxy environ was cleaner
[02:57] <davecheney> as in the case of ec2, we replace everything when we call SetConfig
[02:57] <davecheney> the end result is very similar
[02:57] <davecheney> but we can continue that discussion tomorrow
[02:58] <niemeyer> davecheney: It's actually not, for the reasons I explained.. doing e.Foo(); e.Bar() and being completely unable to tell whether e is a completely different value is a no no.
[02:58] <davecheney> fair enough, i'm happy the discussino is closed
[02:58] <niemeyer> davecheney: I'm happy to discuss other possibilities, but something that has that property won't fly
[02:58] <davecheney> niemeyer: understood
[02:59] <niemeyer> davecheney: The locking you did, even if it feels like overhead, is putting you in control
[03:09] <davecheney> why does lp treat me so badly ?
[03:09] <davecheney> % lbox propose -wip -edit
[03:09] <davecheney> error: Failed to load data for project "juju": Get https://api.launchpad.net/devel/juju: unexpected EOF
[03:09] <davecheney> it's totally random
[03:10] <niemeyer> davecheney: Good question.. I haven't seen that level of weirdness
[03:11] <niemeyer> davecheney: and I'm not specially close to it either
[03:11] <niemeyer> Anyway, bed for reals now :)
[03:11] <niemeyer> davecheney: Have a good EOD
[03:11] <davecheney> kk
[06:58] <davecheney> rogpeppe: around today ?
[07:01] <TheMue> davecheney: Heya
[07:01] <davecheney> hey frank
[07:01] <davecheney> how are you going ?
[07:02] <TheMue> davecheney: Fine, pretty wither today here in Germany. And you?
[07:03] <davecheney> pretty cold in sydney
[07:03] <davecheney> still grinding on the provisining agent
[07:03] <davecheney> still rewriting the environs interface :)\
[07:06] <TheMue> davecheney: I'm still working on the relations, currently three depending branches in the queue.
[07:12] <rogpeppe> davecheney: just up
[07:12] <rogpeppe> davecheney, TheMue: morning!
[07:12] <TheMue> rogpeppe: Heya
[07:29] <Aram> morning.
[07:39] <rogpeppe> Aram: hiya
[07:55] <TheMue> Aram: Moin
[09:25] <rogpeppe> fwereade: yo!
[09:25] <fwereade> rogpeppe, heyhey
[09:26] <fwereade> rogpeppe, I just saw yu had anothe CL in that same sort of area perhaps?
[09:26] <fwereade> rogpeppe, if my comments are redundant, sorry
[09:26] <rogpeppe> fwereade: i'm moving it all forward bit by bit...
[09:27] <fwereade> rogpeppe, cool -- I'm just not sure about fixing the name without fixing the type ;p
[09:27] <rogpeppe> fwereade: you think that InstanceSpec is ill-conceived? what should we have there?
[09:27] <fwereade> rogpeppe, the type itself is not so bad, but half the fields are misleading/useless
[09:27] <TheMue> fwereade: Moin
[09:27] <rogpeppe> fwereade: "a type that is moderately ill-conceived in the first place." :-)
[09:27] <fwereade> rogpeppe, we have no interest in daily, desktop, or instance-store images
[09:28] <rogpeppe> fwereade: ok, i'll take out that param
[09:28] <fwereade> rogpeppe, when fully 50% of a type's fields are irrelevant, I think a little of the ill-conceivedness leaks out into the type itself :p
[09:28] <rogpeppe> fwereade: naah
[09:29] <fwereade> rogpeppe, ok, "obscures any essential rightness the type may be in posession of"
[09:29] <rogpeppe> fwereade: it's a place-holder for things to come IMHO
[09:29] <rogpeppe> fwereade: the important change is that the i want the type to represent the constraints on an instance, not just an machine image.
[09:30] <fwereade> rogpeppe, sure, a type can be incomplete, but it's carrying baggage that's just unhelpful, and that's all I'm complaining about
[09:30] <rogpeppe> s/the i/i/
[09:30] <fwereade> TheMue, heyhey
[09:30] <rogpeppe> fwereade: sure. maybe this is a good CL to change some of those in.
[09:30] <rogpeppe> fwereade: or perhaps i could do that in another CL
[09:30] <rogpeppe> fwereade: i'm trying hard to keep CL sizes down.
[09:31] <rogpeppe> fwereade: i.e. move things forward in small increments.
[09:31] <fwereade> rogpeppe, I'm easy
[09:31] <rogpeppe> fwereade: my next branch is too big and i'm going to need to split it up, which is a right pain
[09:32] <fwereade> rogpeppe, yeah, I seem to spend rather too much of my time doing that sort of thing
[09:32] <rogpeppe> fwereade: i was thinking last night that i want some way of saying "factor *these* changes into a new branch" - in about one line of shell.
[09:33] <Aram> so you want git? :D.
[09:33]  * Aram hides.
[09:33]  * rogpeppe has never used git
[09:33] <Aram> it does that thing.
[09:33] <Aram> probably the only thing it does well.
[09:33] <fwereade> that was kinda my first thought too :)
[09:34] <rogpeppe> Aram: out of interest, what git command would you use to do that?
[09:36] <Aram> if you want to do it at commit time, you just git add your changes (my understanding is that you can git add parts of the file as well, not whole files).
[09:36] <Aram> basically in git you don't commit everything by default, but have to chose what to commit every time.
[09:36] <Aram> there's also cherry picking.
[09:36] <Aram> that makes it easy to move only some changes between branches, but not every change.
[09:38] <Aram> cherry picking is literally picking commits from one place and applies them somewhere else, so you don't have to do any manual merging step or whatever. really handy.
[09:38] <Aram> as much as I dislike git and I complain about it all the time, it does some things well.
[09:44] <rogpeppe> fwereade: hope you've had a good few days off, BTW
[09:46] <rogpeppe> fwereade: for PersistentStorage/Daily/Desktop, are you saying that we will *never* want to use anything but PersistentStorage=true, Daily=false, Desktop=false ?
[09:47] <rogpeppe> fwereade: because that logic is in the python version, so i copied it across
[09:47] <rogpeppe> fwereade: but if we know the settings for all time, i'm always happy to delete code!
[09:52] <fwereade> rogpeppe, yeah: all that stuff is gone from the python
[09:53] <rogpeppe> fwereade: sigh
[09:53] <fwereade> rogpeppe, and niemeyer appears to be -1 on handling instance-store stuff
[09:53] <rogpeppe> fwereade: ok, i'll remove the settings in an upcoming branch
[09:53] <fwereade> rogpeppe, which I can get behind tbh, even though it would be trivial to implement
[09:53] <fwereade> rogpeppe, cool, thanks
[09:54] <fwereade> updates, restarting
[10:29] <rogpeppe> test
[10:31] <TheMue> rogpeppe: success
[10:31] <rogpeppe> TheMue: thanks. my web browser seems to be playing up.
[10:32] <TheMue> fwereade: Thx for review. Requirer as noun exists? Sounds strange. But ok. ;)
[10:33] <rogpeppe> cool google logo today
[10:33] <fwereade> TheMue, it's not one I'd use in conversation, but it's definitely closer to legitimate english than, say, "ReadCloser" :p
[10:33] <TheMue> rogpeppe: Already played a song?
[10:34] <TheMue> fwereade: Hehe, yeah.
[10:44] <TheMue> fwereade: So, name change done. No merge it again into the follow-up.
[10:45] <fwereade> TheMue, cool, thanks
[11:18] <fwereade> rogpeppe: in testing charm repos, would you agree it makes most sense to run them against an actual store.Server?
[11:19] <rogpeppe> fwereade: it depends how much interaction with the server it has, i guess
[11:19] <rogpeppe> fwereade: if it's just a simple GET, then maybe there's no point.
[11:19] <rogpeppe> fwereade: we don't necessarily want to fire up mongodb for every test.
[11:20] <rogpeppe> fwereade: but that's a *totally* off-the-cuff response!
[11:20] <fwereade> rogpeppe, that's the thing... it does feel a little bit heavyweight
[11:20] <fwereade> rogpeppe, but a canned-response tet server feels a little lightweight :/
[11:21] <rogpeppe> fwereade: does it actually do anything other than a simple GET?
[11:21] <fwereade> rogpeppe, I'll think on it some more; early lunch today, maybe somewhat extended; will be back for the rest of my "morning" in a bit
[11:21] <fwereade> rogpeppe, (taking half-days this week)
[11:21] <rogpeppe> fwereade: cool
[11:21] <rogpeppe> fwereade: still in the UK presumably?
[11:22] <rogpeppe> fwereade: hope you've got the same lovely weather we have. perfect for half days...
[12:53] <TheMue> rogpeppe: Could it be that the watcher problems are since about one week?
[12:54] <rogpeppe> TheMue: it's possible.
[12:54] <rogpeppe> TheMue: i couldn't say for sure i'm afraid
[12:55] <rogpeppe> TheMue: have you got a possible candidate for the source of the problems?
[12:55] <TheMue> rogpeppe: Just found the change introducing the "initialValue" flag in the content watcher.
[12:55] <rogpeppe> TheMue: it's entirely possible that's the problem!
[12:55] <TheMue> rogpeppe: And the problem I've got here in my test belong to the content watcher.
[12:55] <rogpeppe> TheMue: it may easily all be my fault.
[12:56] <rogpeppe> TheMue: if that's true, we need better tests in the watcher package :-)
[12:56] <TheMue> rogpeppe: *lol*
[12:56] <TheMue> rogpeppe: What's the intention behind this flag?
[12:56] <rogpeppe> TheMue: it's so that the initial value is always sent, regardless of what it is
[12:57] <rogpeppe> TheMue: perhaps your tests are assuming otherwise...
[12:57] <rogpeppe> TheMue: s/tests are/code is/
[12:57] <TheMue> rogpeppe: That's possible, the old behavior has been different.
[12:58] <rogpeppe> TheMue: i think maybe the old behaviour didn't send something if the initial contents were blank
[12:58] <rogpeppe> TheMue: that might actually be the behaviour we want, i guess.
[12:58] <rogpeppe> TheMue: one question: why doesn't the test fail all the time?
[12:59] <TheMue> rogpeppe: It might or it is?
[12:59] <rogpeppe> TheMue: i dunno. depends what we're after.
[12:59] <TheMue> rogpeppe: Yes, that's an interesting question.
[12:59] <rogpeppe> TheMue: i think it's probably because it depends whether the content watcher sees the initial blank value before the test changes it.
[13:00] <TheMue> rogpeppe: So we're back to the race condition.
[13:01] <rogpeppe> TheMue: yeah, but we know what the problem is, and it's easy to solve - just put a sleep before the initial contents set.
[13:01] <TheMue> rogpeppe: Yip
[13:01] <rogpeppe> TheMue: woof
[13:31] <niemeyer> Hello all
[13:32] <Aram> hi.
[13:34] <niemeyer> yo.
[13:34] <niemeyer> Aram: Monday is the day then?
[13:34] <Aram> yes.
[13:34] <niemeyer> nice.
[13:35] <niemeyer> that's.
[13:35] <niemeyer> awesome.
[13:35] <niemeyer> :-)
[13:35] <Aram> yes :).
[13:35] <niemeyer> rogpeppe, TheMue, fwereade: Aram is joining us officially on Monday
[13:36] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: cool. i heard from robbiew yesterday.
[13:36] <rogpeppe> Aram: welcome!
[13:36] <TheMue> niemeyer: Moin. Great news!
[13:36] <Aram> thanks, hi all!
[13:36] <TheMue> Aram: Welcome.
[13:40] <andrewsmedina> fwereade: thanks for your review :D
[13:51] <fwereade> andrewsmedina, a pleasure :)
[13:52] <fwereade> Aram, welcome!
[13:52] <fwereade> niemeyer, heyhey
[13:52] <Aram> thanks/.
[13:53] <niemeyer> andrewsmedina: Heya
[13:54] <niemeyer> andrewsmedina: Aram is joining the team on Monday, btw
[13:54] <niemeyer> fwereade: Heya
[13:56] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Wanna have another look at SignedURL?
[13:56] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: looking already
[13:57] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Cool, thanks for the review, looks even better now :)
[14:00] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: "
[14:00] <rogpeppe> Corrupting the returned URL is testing the behavior of something that is not
[14:01] <rogpeppe> what the method produces.
[14:01] <rogpeppe> "
[14:01] <rogpeppe> i was suggesting, i think, that we test that the unsigned URL would fail where the signed URL would succeed
[14:01] <rogpeppe> i'm not sure that the tests verify that currently - we're just assuming that Get of the unsigned URL will fail because the object is private
[14:02] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: And I'm suggesting that this is not testing SignedURL
[14:02] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Because you're testing something that is *not* the signed URL
[14:02] <andrewsmedina> Aram: welcome :D
[14:02] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: the assumption of those tests is that the signed URL is giving us something that the unsigned URL does not, right?
[14:02] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: There are positive and negative tests in place already, and both of them verify the real URL.
[14:02] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: No
[14:02] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: The unsigned URL is completely irrelevant
[14:03] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: The behavior of a signed URL stands on its own.. if you corrupt the URL, you're not testing the method anymore
[14:04] <Aram> andrewsmedina: thanks.
[14:04] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: if the server is letting everything through anyway, then the signing is irrelevant and the test isn't testing anything.
[14:04] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: my suggestion makes sure that the test *is* actually testing something.
[14:04] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: If the server is letting everything through, the tests will fail, and they *did fail*!
[14:05] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: They are testing something.. please take the code and set authIsBroken to 1
[14:05] <andrewsmedina> Aram: were are you from?
[14:05] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: or 0
[14:05] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: It will break, because the auth is letting everything through in the fake server
[14:05] <TheMue> robbiew: Hi. I'm ready.
[14:05] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: for instance, i think the test would succeed ok if the server verified expiration time without testing the signature
[14:05] <Aram> andrewsmedina: I am from romania but I currently live in austria.
[14:06] <TheMue> Aram: Austria? Ah, so you now may be the nearest to me. Been twice in Vienna, a wonderful town.
[14:07] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Heh.. the server may be broken in all kinds of ways, yes
[14:07] <andrewsmedina> Aram: I'm from Brazil
[14:07]  * TheMue should measure, Roger still has good chances to be nearer.
[14:07] <Aram> TheMue: where are you from?
[14:07] <TheMue> Aram: Oldenburg in North Germany
[14:07] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: it's ok, i don't mind if we don't do the check. it was just a suggestion.
[14:08] <Aram> andrewsmedina: same place as niemeyer?
[14:08] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: If it allowed you to see a *private* object, just because you provided a URL with an expire time, what is broken is not the SignedURL method, though.
[14:08] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Thanks for the suggestion. I've read it, understood it, and replied.
[14:08] <robbiew> TheMue: g+ invite on the way
[14:09] <TheMue> robbiew: ack
[14:09] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: true. but it does mean we haven't verified SignedURL. i don't mind much.
[14:10] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: No, it doesn't mean that. I don't mind much that you don't agree either, though.
[14:10] <andrewsmedina> Aram: no, I live in Rio de JAneiro
[14:10] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Because we tend to get in those interminable arguments very frequently.
[14:10] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: sorry about that
[14:11] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: The test not only worked, but it detected the fact that the auth in the server was broken. There's a positive and a negative test, both verifying access to a private object.
[14:12] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Your argument is that you wanted to see that a plain URL, *without signature*, works.
[14:12] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: It's beyond me how you're willing to argue that to death.

[14:12] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: i'm not. i've stopped. i'm fine with what you've got.
[14:13] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: You've stopped with "it does mean we haven't verified SignedURL".  Happy to help.
[14:14] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: oh sorry. i meant that only in the case that the server is broken so it checks the expiry time only.
[14:16] <Aram> TheMue: by air you seem to be the same distance from me and rogpeppe, by land I'm closer because there's no water to cross.
[14:17] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: "// URL returns a non-signed URL that allows retriving the object at path".
[14:17] <rogpeppe> s/retriving/retrieving/
[14:17] <rogpeppe> :-)
[14:18] <rogpeppe> and i'd s/a non-signed/an unsigned/ too
[14:18] <rogpeppe> but i'm too late ...
[14:25] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Fixed.
[14:29] <TheMue> Aram: Yes, it's funny how near the UK is, only the North Sea between us.
[15:06] <niemeyer> Heading to lunch
[15:18] <fwereade> hey all: despite the very long lunch, I'm pretty sure I've done my half day now
[15:18] <rogpeppe> fwereade: np. you might want to have a brief look at this, if you have any time at all: https://codereview.appspot.com/6209094
[15:19] <rogpeppe> fwereade: it adds a "public-bucket" field to the ec2 config
[15:20] <rogpeppe> fwereade: i'm not entirely sure that's the best name for it, but gotta start somewhere...
[15:20] <rogpeppe> i have to have some lunch too
[15:21] <Aram> what's your setup guys, do you use a stable or unstable ubuntu release for development?
[15:21] <Aram> (so the hidden question really is if a stable version is good enough).
[15:22] <fwereade> rogpeppe, it suddenly seems to me as if we're going to a lot of trouble to accommodate something in juju (tool upload) that could be entirely replaced with (1) the public-bucket and (2) a tiny separate script that just nukes the bucket and repaves with fresh local builds
[15:23] <fwereade> rogpeppe, maybe my problem is derived from the name though... but surely the public source will always be the same for everybody? so, not necessarily a bucket, just a url prefix
[15:24] <fwereade> rogpeppe, and the only reason (that I can see) to make it configurable is for testing
[15:24] <fwereade> rogpeppe, have I just gone off into the weeds?
[15:25] <fwereade> Aram, stable, fwiw
[15:30] <fwereade> rogpeppe, I do need t be off now; I've left a tab open, it'll be the first thing I see when I come back :)
[15:30] <fwereade> later :)
[15:42] <rogpeppe> Aram: i use vanilla 12.04
[15:43] <TheMue> Aram: I'm using stable (so now 12.04) as "production environment" in a VM and test unstable releases in another VM.
[15:43] <Aram> I see.
[16:13] <rogpeppe> fwereade: i don't know. maybe you're right and we should just strip all that stuff out.
[16:13] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: what do you think?
[16:15] <niemeyer> fwereade: You mean implementing the exact same logic as tool upload, but outside of juju?
[16:19] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: If that's what fwereade means, I'm not sure.. feels like we'll have the exact same trouble on both sides.. we're just delegating it to a second class citizen that is not as well integrated.
[16:20] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: i guess it would mean that we could do a simple uploader for each provider type without having to have all the --upload-tools flags and args to Bootstrap etc
[16:20] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: All? You mean two? :)
[16:21] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: :-)
[16:21] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: the logic for finding tools would be a little simpler too. only one Storage per environ.
[16:22] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: I don't have a strong feeling about it, but I'm not convinced it's getting us much. Having convenient mechanisms for people to develop juju itself feels like a valuable goal.
[16:22] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: How so? public-bucket is a storage
[16:22] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: And it has to exist for every single storage, despite uploading tools
[16:23] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Because the real tool deployments uses the public storage too
[16:24] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: The only difference is that FindTools would look in a single storage, rather than in two. So 3 or 4 lines rather than 6 or 7
[16:24] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: yeah, that's true. we need both regardless.
[16:24] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: did you take a look at the public-bucket branch, BTW?
[16:25] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: (i'm quite happy with the direction we're going actually. it's always good to try and take a step back and think "is this really the right way to do it?" though.)
[16:25] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: No, I had a look at a nice lunch just now :)
[16:25] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: cool. hope your weather is as nice as ours ...
[16:26] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: What's the public-bucket setting about?
[16:26] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: It's surprisingly good
[16:26] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Feels like we're going back onto summer, even though it's quite the opposite
[16:26] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: public-bucket is where the provider looks for public storage.
[16:26] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: i.e. to get the publicly accessible tools downloads from
[16:27] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Ah, nice
[16:27] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: perhaps in the future we might want to support a simple URL, so we don't have to host the binaries in EC2, but i think that a bucket should be ok for now. and it makes it easy to write to for testing purposes :-)
[16:27] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Btw, are you seeing my messages in that thread with William?
[16:28] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Or just William's?
[16:28] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: the "serve metadata and config" thread?
[16:28] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Yeah
[16:29] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: yeah, i'm seeing them. although i haven't read it in a couple of hours
[16:29] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Ok.. np
[16:29] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: negronjl seems to missing my messages that go to the list for some reason
[16:29] <niemeyer> negronjl: Apparently they're reaching the list, at least
[16:29] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: well, i *might* be missing some of your messages... :-)
[16:30] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: oh yeah, just seen negronjl's email. perhaps you count as spam :-)
[16:31] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: It might be half-right.. :-)
[16:31] <negronjl> niemeyer, rogpeppe:  lol ...
[16:31] <negronjl> niemeyer: I am checking my spam folder just to be sure ...
[16:31] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: while i remember... are we going to try to have monday meetings as planned?
[16:33] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Yeah, we should
[16:33] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: This one might be a tricky one as I'll be in London, but let's make an effort at least
[16:34] <rogpeppe> niemeyer: does that mean three of us will all be in the UK at once? woo!
[16:34] <negronjl> nothing on my spam from niemeyer ....
[16:41] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Unfortunately not.. William is back to Malta next week
[16:42] <niemeyer> negronjl: I really can't tell then.. maybe we should ask IS
[16:42] <negronjl> niemeyer: I'll ask
[16:46] <niemeyer> negronjl: Thanks, please let me know.. curious about what could be going on as well
[16:47] <negronjl> rt.admin.canonical.com #53190
[16:47] <negronjl> niemeyer: ^^
[17:01] <niemeyer> negronjl: Don't have access to it, but thanks.. let's see what they find
[17:10] <rogpeppe> i'm off to enjoy the sunshine
[17:10] <rogpeppe> see y'all tomorrow
[17:15] <niemeyer> rogpeppe: Enjoy
[21:15] <Aram> hi davecheney.
[21:15] <davecheney> howdy
[22:53] <niemeyer> davecheney: Morning
[23:05] <davecheney> morning
[23:18] <niemeyer> davecheney: 181 »       »       panic(fmt.Sprintf("configuration was %T, expected %T", cfg, new(
[23:18] <niemeyer>      providerConfig)))
[23:19] <niemeyer> davecheney: That's not necessary
[23:19] <niemeyer> davecheney: c, ok := cfg.(*providerConfig) => s/, ok//
[23:19] <niemeyer> davecheney: The compiler can do that for us
[23:27] <niemeyer> davecheney: Re-reviewed the branch, mentioned a couple of details, and LGTM
[23:54] <davecheney> niemeyer: thanks, i'll finalise and submit later today
[23:54] <davecheney> if you have time coudl you also take a look a the NewConfig banch
[23:54] <davecheney> branch


[08:41] <abhijit> hi
[09:04] <kermiac> hi seb128, I know you're extremely busy atm but did you get a chance to test the gedit hook mate? bug 582253
[09:05] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 582253 in gedit (Ubuntu) "Apport hook for gedit (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/582253
[10:06] <stanley_robertso> hi all
[10:07] <stanley_robertso> Guys.. I remember.. there is a weblink to request for a mentor for ubuntu bugsquad.. but i lost the link.. can somebody let me know the link
[10:22] <yofel> stanley_robertso: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugSquad/Mentors
[10:26] <nigelb> yofel: shortcut, poke vish :p
[10:27]  * vish pokes nigelb ;p
[10:27] <nigelb> hahaha
[10:41] <stanley_robertso> Thanks yofel .. i have placed my request now
[10:41] <stanley_robertso> Not sure.. who will be looking into it
[10:53] <JFo> that reminds me
[10:53] <JFo> I haven't sent an update to the list about my excellent mentee
[10:53] <JFo> :)
[11:07] <vish> stanley_robertso: did you read the wiki yofel gave you? ;)
[11:07] <stanley_robertso> yes vish
[11:07] <stanley_robertso> i went through it.. and then applied for membershiop .. anything that i missed ?
[11:08] <vish> stanley_robertso: the "How to request a mentor" section?
[11:08] <stanley_robertso> yes
[11:08] <stanley_robertso> I followed the same.
[11:08] <vish> stanley_robertso: read again :)
[11:12] <nigelb> vish: re: that trackpad bug
[11:12] <nigelb> the person complaining has probably never used a notebook and used a place where copy & paste isn't allowed.
[11:12] <vish> nigelb: trackpad! me?
[11:12] <nigelb> (or ctrl +V is disabled by default)
[11:12] <vish> nigelb: oh that..
[11:13]  * nigelb used putty for sometime
[11:13] <vish> nigelb: if you see the comments, i'm totally confused by the bug... i just reverted the status..
[11:28] <nigelb> vish: ah, ok
[14:20] <nigelb> pedro_: you around?
[14:20] <nigelb> fluxbox has like 14 bugs and the maintainer wants to work with us on clearing them
[14:20] <nigelb> (the debian maintainer)
[14:20] <pedro_> nigelb, yes
[14:21] <paultag> heyya nightwish
[14:21] <paultag> Oh shucks nigelb *
[14:21] <nigelb> pedro_: meet paultag.  He's the debian maintainer of fluxbox.
[14:21] <pedro_> nigelb, 9 New, 3 Confirmed, 1 Incomplete and 1 Fix Committed
[14:21] <pedro_> hello paultag!
[14:21] <paultag> heyya pedro_ :)
[14:22] <nigelb> is it big enough for a hug day or we just get down and dirty?
[14:23] <nigelb> paultag: Option A, you can look at the bugs and suggest what we need to do.
[14:23] <nigelb> Option B, you can talk to jcastro and get bug control access.
[14:23] <pedro_> nigelb, isn't having a lot of bugs for a bug day, I'd go ahead and triage those with some bugsquad help ;-)
[14:24] <nigelb> pedro_: seems reasonable to me.  I'll sit down tonight with paultag on those.
[14:24] <paultag> thanks pedro_, nigelb :)
[14:24] <nigelb> Just 14 bugs, should take only an hour or so to figure out
[14:24] <pedro_> paultag, if you have some instructions for debugging that'd be great as well so our community members can help you to triage the bugs there too
[14:24] <pedro_> and we can also put the product in the adopt a package list
[14:24] <paultag> pedro_: sure. I can note the status they should be on the bugs, and then have someone blast through. I don't mind spending time on it
[14:24] <nigelb> paultag: You mail the bug squad list asking for help btw.
[14:24] <paultag> nigelb: :)
[14:25] <jcastro> who needs bugcontrol?
[14:25] <nigelb> (and offering help with the debuging)
[14:25] <jcastro> I just happen to be in there
[14:25]  * nigelb hugs jcastro
[14:25] <paultag> Oh heyya jcastro
[14:25] <nigelb> paultag: Its your lucky day!
[14:25] <paultag> nigelb: any day with jcastro is never my lucky day
[14:25]  * paultag hugs jcastro
[14:25] <pedro_> hahaha
[14:25] <paultag> jcastro: thanks :)
[14:25] <nigelb> jcastro: paultag is the upstream maintainer for fluxbox and he wants bug control.
[14:26] <nigelb> There are some 14 bugs or so and he's recently pushed a new release of fluxbox :)
[14:26] <jcastro> done!
[14:26] <paultag> thanks jcastro :)
[14:27]  * nigelb hugs jcastro again
[14:27] <nigelb> jcastro: back from vacation?
[14:27] <jcastro> yeah
[14:27] <nigelb> \o/
[14:54] <devildante> everyone: shouldn't the [MIR] Banshee bug not be on the list of the bug day?
[14:55] <yofel> devildante: no it shouldn't, can you remove it from the list please?
[14:56] <devildante> yofel: okay :)
[14:57] <devildante> yofel: done :)
[14:58] <yofel> thanks
[14:58] <devildante> yofel: np
[15:05] <devildante> everyone: is banshee-dbg enough to have a good backtrace?
[15:05] <yofel> well, you'll need the debug packages of the used libraries too
[15:07] <devildante> yofel: thanks :)
[15:07] <abhijit> hello
[15:07] <abhijit> kermiac, ping
[15:07] <devildante> hi abhijit :)
[15:07] <abhijit> devildante, hello I have one doubt
[15:07] <devildante> abhijit: what is it?
[15:08] <abhijit> devildante, i need to submit one bug about suound. bug is whenever i am in fullscreen game - any game - e.g. beneath stell sky, mary any then at that time fn + and fn - and fn <mute> these three functions key dont work.
[15:09] <abhijit> devildante, so question is which is the package to submit bug against?
[15:09] <abhijit> maryo, freecol, wideland any application or game which go to fullscreen
[15:10] <abhijit> devildante, ??
[15:10] <devildante> abhijit: I *think* this is a known bug, lemme search
[15:11] <abhijit> devildante, ok
[15:16] <pedro_> guys if you have an identi.ca account or twitter, help out to spread the word about next bug day ;-)
[15:16] <paultag> pedro_: when is it?
[15:16] <pedro_> Thursday 19th August
[15:16] <paultag> ( and do you have a link to the announcement )
[15:16] <paultag> thanks pedro_ :0
[15:16] <paultag> :) *
[15:17] <pedro_> I've sent some announcement, wait a sec
[15:17] <yofel> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/20100819
[15:18] <paultag> thanks yofel :)
[15:18] <pedro_> if you can digg it too http://blog.qa.ubuntu.com/node/100
[15:19] <devildante> abhijit: didn't find it, I think you could file a bug against xserver-xorg (not sure)
[15:19] <devildante> thanks pedro_ :)
[15:19] <abhijit> devildante, not sure! :-(
[15:20] <yofel> abhijit: maybe ping crimsun_ - he should know more
[15:20] <abhijit> crimsun_, ping
[15:20] <abhijit> yoasif, ok
[15:20] <abhijit> pedro_, you know?
[15:20] <yofel> might be something in SDL, at least I think I reproduced that once
[15:20] <devildante> yofel: yeah, I suspected that as well
[15:20] <abhijit> hmm
[15:21] <devildante> yofel: I'd say also SDL, since apps that go full-screen like firefox and chromium aren't affected
[15:22] <abhijit> devildante, yoasif hey i am talking about full screen fire fox etc
[15:22] <nigelb> yofel: dan has sorta decreased his ubuntu sound involvement (just FYI)
[15:22] <abhijit> you guys got the difference between any other aps fullscreen and a game's fullscreen?
[15:23] <nigelb> yofel: though he does sponsor from time to time
[15:23] <yofel> nigelb: I know, but he still knows a hundred times more about audio than I do...
[15:23] <abhijit> devildante, yoasif when we go to game fullscrenn we only have control over to game only not the windows behind it
[15:23] <devildante> abhijit, nigelb, yofel: *all* functions keys doesn't work when fullscreen, btw
[15:23] <nigelb> yofel: hehe, agreed.  There is #ubuntu-audio-help too.  Not sure how many people are in there.
[15:23] <abhijit> devildante, no
[15:23] <abhijit> devildante, brightness function key work for me
[15:25] <devildante> abhijit: yes, but without the bubble, so I think it should be that the game/SDL captures those hotkeys
[15:25] <yofel> I can't mute/unmute in warzone fullscreen, but brightness change works fine
[15:25] <abhijit> devildante, bubble? you mean notification? then yes brightness key work but withouht notification
[15:25] <devildante> the thing is, on my ncomputer, if
[15:25] <devildante> whoops
[15:26] <devildante> the thing is, on my computer, only brightness works when fullscreen, not the other function keys
[15:26] <abhijit> devildante, yoasif tell me on thing. suppose now i just submit a bug for sdl so later someone find that its not sdl bug then we will change package. is that ok?
[15:26] <nigelb> yes, it is.
[15:26] <nigelb> We do that all the time.
[15:26] <devildante> abhijit: yeah :)
[15:26] <abhijit> nigelb, devildante ok now i submit
[15:26] <yofel> abhijit: btw, I'm yofel, not yoasif..
[15:26] <devildante> yoasif :p
[15:27] <abhijit> yofel, :D
[15:27] <abhijit> hey
[15:27] <abhijit> package sdl dont exist on my ubuntu? :-o
[15:27] <abhijit> :(
[15:27] <abhijit> devildante, yofel nigelb ???
[15:28] <yofel> there is libsdl1.2debian/-pulseaudio/-oss/-alsa/... choose one
[15:28] <devildante> abhijit: libsdl1.2 is the source package
[15:28] <nigelb> you can only file on a binary package
[15:28] <abhijit> i see
[15:30] <abhijit> yah i first written ubuntu-bug sdl. now i written libsdl1.2debian-alsa and now it worked. now submitting it
[15:30] <nigelb> great :)
[15:30] <abhijit> :)
[15:33] <abhijit> yofel, devildante nigelb can you just mark my bug as afffect to you?
[15:33] <devildante> abhijit: which bug?
[15:33] <abhijit> devildante, this sound one
[15:33] <devildante> which bug number?
[15:33] <abhijit> devildante, yofel nigelb https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libsdl1.2/+bug/619256
[15:34] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 619256 in libsdl1.2 (Ubuntu) "Function keys wont work in fullscreen game (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
[15:34] <devildante> ubot2 is slooow
[15:34] <ubot2> Factoid 'is slooow' not found
[15:34] <abhijit> yah
[15:34] <abhijit> but it is intelligent!
[15:34] <devildante> ubot2 intelligence
[15:34] <ubot2> Factoid 'intelligence' not found
[15:34] <abhijit> :)
[15:35] <abhijit> devildante, yofel nigelb can someone please mar this as confirmed?
[15:35] <devildante> abhijit: okay
[15:35] <abhijit> devildante, thanks
[15:35] <devildante> done :)
[15:36] <devildante> abhijit: can you search for it upstream and file a bug if there isn't already one there?
[15:37] <abhijit> devildante, upstream where?]
[15:38] <devildante> abhijit: libsdl upstream: http://bugzilla.libsdl.org/
[15:40] <abhijit> devildante, but wer not clear yet about if it is sdl bug or not?
[15:40] <abhijit> we*
[15:40] <devildante> abhijit: I think the sdl guys could determine this
[15:41] <abhijit> devildante, ok
[15:41] <devildante> but search for the bug first
[15:41] <abhijit> yah
[15:41] <abhijit> yofel, nigelb can you please that bug as affect to you?
[15:45] <abhijit> devildante, does this bug addresses my fullscreen issue?
[15:45] <abhijit> devildante, http://bugzilla.libsdl.org/show_bug.cgi?id=670
[15:46] <ubot2> bugzilla.libsdl.org bug 670 in events "Multimedia keys and dead keys no longer working" [Normal,Waiting]
[15:48] <devildante> abhijit: yes, now link it to the launchpad bug (do you know how to do that?)
[15:49] <abhijit> devildante, no i dont know how to do that?
[15:50] <devildante> abhijit: click on "also affects project"
[15:50] <abhijit> devildante, ok
[15:50] <abhijit> devildante, yes clicked new page opened
[15:51] <abhijit> devildante, now added that bug link right?
[15:51] <devildante> yes :)
[15:52] <abhijit> devildante, now tell me. in this way only launchpad people will know that this bug is there in upstream. but how sdl people will know that a bug is reported downstream in launchpad?
[15:53] <abhijit> ??
[15:53] <devildante> good question
[15:53] <abhijit> :)
[15:53] <devildante> abhijit: you have to register to the bugzilla first
[15:54] <abhijit> devildante, i am registered in bugzilla too!!! :D
[15:54] <devildante> abhijit: which one? (they are several bugzillas, and they don't share the same users)
[15:54] <abhijit> this info is new to me
[15:54] <abhijit> wait
[15:57] <abhijit> devildante, i dont remember exactly now but abiword,openoffice
[15:58] <devildante> abhijit: so, you need to register to the libsdl bugzilla
[15:58] <abhijit> devildante, ohhh
[16:03] <abhijit> devildante, done.
[16:03] <abhijit> now i am logged in.
[16:04] <devildante> abhijit: in the bug page, you should see a "URL:" text entry. Put the launchpad bug link there
[16:04] <abhijit> devildante, ok
[16:07] <abhijit> devildante, i just done. you just crosscheck if i done correctly http://bugzilla.libsdl.org/process_bug.cgi
[16:07] <devildante> you mean http://bugzilla.libsdl.org/show_bug.cgi?id=670 :p
[16:07] <ubot2> bugzilla.libsdl.org bug 670 in events "Multimedia keys and dead keys no longer working" [Normal,Waiting]
[16:07] <devildante> yes, good job
[16:08] <devildante> now, we just have to wait for the devs to fix this :p
[16:08] <abhijit> i am totaly confused
[16:08] <abhijit> devildante, i cant see the link which i submitted. where it gone?
[16:08] <abhijit> devildante, oh sorry i can see it now :D
[16:08] <abhijit> devildante, yah the main step - to wait!!! :D
[16:09] <devildante> yofel: could you triage abhijit's bug?
[16:09] <devildante> yofel: priority medium
[16:09]  * abhijit will be glad!!!
[16:10] <devildante> yofel: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libsdl1.2/+bug/619256
[16:10] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 619256 in libsdl1.2 (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Function keys wont work in fullscreen game (affects: 2) (heat: 12)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[16:12] <abhijit> yofel, ping
[16:14] <abhijit> :(
[16:23] <njin> pedro_: hello
[16:28] <abhijit> vish, ping
[16:30] <abhijit> :/
[16:34] <abhijit> :(
[16:38] <abhijit> charlie-tca, ping
[16:39] <charlie-tca> pont
[16:39] <charlie-tca> pong
[16:39] <abhijit> :)
[16:39] <abhijit> charlie-tca, can you traiage my bug report?
[16:39] <abhijit> charlie-tca, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libsdl1.2/+bug/619256
[16:39] <charlie-tca> number?
[16:39] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 619256 in libsdl1.2 (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Function keys wont work in fullscreen game (affects: 2) (heat: 12)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[16:40] <abhijit> charlie-tca, as deviladante suggested importance to medium?
[16:40] <sinurge> how do u take care of a bug report that might be kinda a wishlist - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/maverick/+source/ubuntuone-client/+bug/612988
[16:40] <charlie-tca> done
[16:40] <abhijit> charlie-tca, thanks!
[16:40] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 612988 in ubuntuone-client (Ubuntu Maverick) (and 2 other projects) "[nautilus] shows ubuntu-one ribbon in each folder (affects: 7) (dups: 2) (heat: 48)" [Undecided,New]
[16:40] <charlie-tca> Nice job
[16:41] <charlie-tca> sinurge: we don't
[16:42] <sinurge> k, thanks
[16:42] <charlie-tca> It is marked as an opinion already in the main package, and the developers will decide for maverick
[16:42] <abhijit> yofel, ???
[16:43] <abhijit> anyone can just mar that report as affect to you?
[16:43] <abhijit> please?
[16:43] <abhijit> mark*
[16:43] <paultag> abhijit: why would someone do that if it does not affect them?
[16:44] <abhijit> paultag, i am requesting anyone to reproduce the condition and mark it. i am not saying to mark directly
[16:46] <abhijit> hello
[16:47] <abhijit> should i ask this person to do ubuntu-bug lernid so that we will have more info?
[16:47] <abhijit> https://bugs.launchpad.net/lernid/+bug/610447
[16:47] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 610447 in lernid "Lernid crash in Session (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
[16:51] <sinurge> i think you can write that, and in addition mark the bug as incomplete.
[16:51] <abhijit> sinurge, ok
[16:52] <vish> abhijit: pong
[16:52] <abhijit> vish, should i ask this person to do ubuntu-bug lernid so that we will have more info?
[16:52] <abhijit> virtuald, https://bugs.launchpad.net/lernid/+bug/610447
[16:52] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 610447 in lernid "Lernid crash in Session (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
[16:52] <abhijit> oh sorry
[16:52] <abhijit> vish, ^^
[16:53] <sinurge> abhijit:installing lernid, let me see if ic an reproduce the same bug
[16:53] <abhijit> sinurge, yah sure
[16:53] <vish> abhijit: thats an upstream bug , we cant set status for it
[16:53] <abhijit> vish, no no not status
[16:53] <abhijit> vish, i feel that bug is incomplete. shoulk i ask that person to do ubuntu-bug lernid? so that we will have more info?
[16:54] <vish> abhijit: i dont know about lernid ;)
[16:54] <abhijit> vish, ohhh okk np :)
[16:55] <abhijit> sinurge, that bug is not reproducable for me
[16:55] <sinurge> same here
[16:56] <abhijit> sinurge, yah
[17:06] <njin> hello to all, just a curiosity, what mean this ( tags:  	 added: kj-triage )
[17:07] <stanley_robertso> hi
[17:07] <stanley_robertso> hi all
[17:07] <abhijit> stanley_robertso, :)
[17:07] <stanley_robertso> hi abhijit
[17:09] <ashams> hello all
[17:09] <stanley_robertso> hi ashams
[17:10] <sinurge> evening/afternoon everyone
[17:11] <bdmurray> njin: the bug was programmatically triaged by the kernel janitor
[17:12] <sinurge> abhijit: u did not mark that bug?
[17:12] <abhijit> sinurge, i was waiting for you!!!
[17:12] <abhijit> :-o
[17:13] <abhijit> i mean i was waiting for you to mark it sinurge
[17:20] <njin> bdmurray: thanks
[17:31] <yofel> abhijit: sorry, went swimming, and I marked that bug as affecting me right after you filed it
[17:32] <abhijit> yofel, thanks :)
[18:02] <MiketheMagiCat> Hi. Can someone help me? I had Ubuntu installed on my computer. I also have Windows Vista (which I hate). But today it would not let me go online. It said there was a broken link. I could not find it. I uninstalled it. I installed Download Ubuntu Desktop Edition 32 bit. And then it told me when it finished downloading to choose a program to open it up. I chose Internet Explorer. Now I can't find the
[18:02] <MiketheMagiCat> 	MiketheMagiCat	program anywhere on the computer, or in my files. I also tried loading it on to my usb flash drive, and it didn't work. Is there a phone number to call for support for Linux products. I am a beginner and an idiot.
[18:09] <MiketheMagiCat> If someone could email me about this I would apprciate it<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[18:49]  * nigelb pokes pedro_
[18:49] <nigelb> pedro_: were you able to get around to be blog post?
[19:10] <pedro_> nigelb, having in a draft , one sec
[19:15] <penguin42> pedro_: If you get a chance can you look at bug 598780 - I've written a fairly long analysis of what I think is happening there
[19:15] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 598780 in gtk+2.0 (Ubuntu) "Gtk-WARNING **: Failed to load type module: (null) (affects: 2) (heat: 14)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/598780
[19:17] <pedro_> penguin42, i'll look at it in a bit, thanks for filing the report btw
[19:17] <penguin42> np
[19:21] <simar> ashams: hi
[19:21] <simar> ashams: finally
[19:21] <simar> :))
[19:35] <nigelb> yay! http://blog.qa.ubuntu.com/node/101
[19:36] <kiwinote> hi! I have been pointed to bug 618855 by the reporter (it was their first time filing a bug), but I don't have permission to view it. Does anyone know what sort of a bug this is (ie it must be something more than just a private bug)?
[19:36] <ubot2> kiwinote: Bug 618855 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/618855 is private
[19:36] <nigelb> devildante, vish, yofel, and others: http://blog.qa.ubuntu.com/node/101
[19:36] <micahg> kiwinote: probably needs retracing
[19:36] <nigelb> kiwinote: looks like I can't see it either.
[19:37] <nigelb> Maybe its not in the ubuntu project?
[19:37] <abhijit> bye
[19:37] <micahg> that could be too
[19:38] <vish> kiwinote: easiest would be to ask them to subscribe you to the bug
[19:38] <nigelb> Yep.
[19:38] <kiwinote> ok, thanks everyone, that subscribing does sound the easiest
[19:42] <penguin42> nigelb: Thats good - Ubuntu often picks up stick for not contributing
[19:42] <nigelb> penguin42: Yep, that's what we're trying to reduce.
[19:43] <penguin42> nigelb: Although similarly I don't know when it becomes visible that it was an ubuntu fix; i.e. if we fix something, that gets pushed up to debian and that gets pushed to the original project I wonder what the chances are that it will keep its attributions
[19:44] <nigelb> penguin42: That shouldn't be our concern.
[19:44] <micahg> penguin42: most people will keep the original attributions when pushing up a patch
[19:44] <penguin42> nigelb: What happened to the Review queue in June ?
[19:44] <vish> nigelb: thats 30 done on that day, or the week?
[19:44] <nigelb> Our concern should be that we aren't holding a patch that was in our bug tracker that fixes a *big* issue.
[19:45] <nigelb> penguin42: from since we started, its gone down from 1903 to 1481.
[19:45] <nigelb> Slow but steady
[19:45] <nigelb> vish: week.
[19:45] <vish> nigelb: hmm, wasnt the target 20 per day? or something higher?
[19:45] <penguin42> nigelb: Oh it's just the graph shows it as a big upwards movement in June
[19:45] <nigelb> Note that we get patches every day, so progress that can be tracked is very slow.
[19:45] <nigelb> vish: it was 20.  We need more help :(
[19:45] <vish> nigelb: stop talking now! review a bug! :D
[19:45] <penguin42> nigelb: We have to be a little careful with bugs with patches; it's like I posted a workaround patch to a bug but put big hairy screeamy warnings on it saying it was voodoo code and someone who actually understood it should look at it; it's still marked as a bug with a patch
[19:46]  * vish jumps on lp too! ;)
[19:46] <nigelb> vish: good idea.
[19:46] <nigelb> penguin42: We let the upstream decide.
[19:47] <penguin42> nigelb: Well it depends as the one who wrote the patch I wouldn't want it upstreamed
[19:47] <penguin42> It's commented that way to stop anyone thinking it's supposed to be
[19:47] <nigelb> penguin42: Well, I see it this way.
[19:48] <yofel> penguin42: that is unreasonable, we should keep our differences from upstream as small as possible
[19:48] <nigelb> I try the patch to see if its working first.
[19:48] <nigelb> If it isn't, we tag it patch-needswork.
[19:48] <penguin42> yofel: My point is it works, and I wouldn't even push it into the release never mind upstream; because I know it needs someone to look at it properly - it might break other cases worse and I know it's not good
[19:49] <vish> penguin42: the easiest you can do is just forward patches upstream .. to where they belong
[19:49] <penguin42> vish: that would be wrong if the original author had said it wasn't ready for release
[19:49] <yofel> penguin42: well, we want upstream to review the patch because they know the code best?
[19:49] <penguin42> yofel: No, I know it needs a proper fix from upstream, my code was just a hack which seems to work - I *know* it needs a proper fix
[19:50] <vish> penguin42: do note , once reviewed , it needs to be uploaded as well , so the sponsor must be really dumb to upload a  "voodoo code"
[19:50] <yofel> so, upstream might still want to apply it while they work on another fix
[19:51] <vish> penguin42: which we are spared since the sponsors are chosen carefully ;)
[19:51] <penguin42> yofel: Oh yeh I'm sure no one would look at my patch and push it upstream since it's got big scray comments in saying it's voodoo code - but I'm just saying just to take care that the people writing a patch might know it's not the right thing to release it; in that case it would be right to forward the bug upstream with a note saying there was a work around
[19:52] <simar> ashams: there??
[19:53] <vish> penguin42: imo, if the patch can just be forward , let the upstream decide if they really do want that voodo
[19:53] <vish> s/if//
[19:54] <penguin42> vish: My point was to violently disagree with that!  If the original author of something thinks it's horrible and shouldn't be put into a release I think their view should be respected
[19:55] <vish> penguin42: then why are they submitting the patch?  [i'm now confused with the question]
[19:55] <penguin42> (Interestingly in the case of the bug in question - bug 605686 - someone else who obviously understands stuff a bit more included a patch after mine - but put it inline instead of as a patch - and it all seems to have gone quiet
[19:55] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 605686 in linux (Ubuntu) "nointremap needed - Blocked an interrupt request due to source-id verificiation failure (affects: 1) (heat: 133)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/605686
[19:55] <micahg> penguin42: well, sometimes a patch is only needed by us and not usable upstream and they'll reject it, or the level of hack is acceptable for us due to a problem it solves
[19:55] <penguin42> vish: Well I submitted it because it was a work around that worked for me and might be useful to others
[19:55] <penguin42> micahg: Yeh indeed; my objection was purely to the thought that a patch should be upstreamed even if the original author didn't think it was right
[19:56] <vish> penguin42: so why cant this workaround be done upstream? even if it is a stop gap?
[19:56] <vish> penguin42: upstream might like it.. :)
[19:56] <ashams> simar: hi, are you still there
[19:56] <simar> ashams: ya :))
[19:56] <micahg> penguin42: also, upstream might suggest how to make it better and you can create a better patch
[19:56] <penguin42> vish: It was one of those things that was patching something hideously complex (interrupt mapping) that frankly I haven't got a clue about but managed to hack around
[19:56] <ashams> simar: how is your day?
[19:56] <simar> ashams: at last, actually i have some temporary internet probems
[19:57] <simar> ashams: just fine ..
[19:57] <ashams> simar: it's fine
[19:57] <penguin42> vish: Sticking a thumb in a leaking ditch might stop a flood, you wouldn't want it included in the design
[19:57] <simar> ashams: :))
[19:57] <simar> ashams: did you read the new documents that I sent you through mail
[19:57] <vish> penguin42: imo, it might not be perfect now, but it can be perfected by upstream.. it might be a new idea. [i havent seen your patch though]
[19:58] <penguin42> vish: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/51999685/intremap-hack.patch
[19:58] <ashams> simar: I was sick in the last days, I didn't finish them yet! :((
[19:59] <simar> ashams: Do you think that you are in a position to start triaging the touchpad bugs or should we wait??
[19:59] <simar> ashams: In the other case I hope you can clarify some doubts
[19:59] <vish> penguin42: maybe we should send it to Linus? ;)
[20:00]  * penguin42 flippers vish
[20:01] <micahg> vish: IMHO, the kernel team should be the only ones upstreaming kernel patches
[20:01] <ashams> simar: actually, I was thinking if You can assign me some bugs so you may check If I'm ready or not?
[20:01] <vish> micahg: yeah , i dint offer to send it :)
[20:01] <vish> lol! "DANGER! Voodoo coding"
[20:02] <penguin42> vish: See, I was subtle!
[20:02] <ashams> simar:  that I'm not sure If I'm really ready to start...
[20:03] <vish> micahg: upstream folks dont even like "regular" users sending bugs , let alone patches ;)
[20:03] <vish> upstream kernel*
[20:03] <micahg> vish: I know, that's why I said it ;)
[20:03] <penguin42> vish: They can be OK if you send a good patch and send it to the right people
[20:05] <vish> penguin42: if we send a patch they *hate* , they will ensure to trash the submitter :D
[20:05] <penguin42> oh yes
[20:05] <simar> ashams: you should not be afraid to do
[20:05] <simar> ashams: let me introduce you some bugs and lets triage them together.. :))
[20:06] <vish> Fear is what you have to fear itself!
[20:06] <simar> ashams: just a sec
[20:06] <simar> vish: Right :))
[20:07] <simar> vish: I'm happy to have another student .. cheers for that :-))
[20:07] <ashams> simar: just a sec!
[20:07] <simar> vish: Happy to introduce many people to ubuntu :)
[20:07] <vish> simar: yay!
[20:07] <simar> vish: :)
[20:08] <vish> simar: you need not necessarily teach only about synaptics , if they want to do other bugs , you can just guide them with the bugs and get them familiar with the workflow..
[20:10] <simar> vish: ya but ashams says he'll be happy triaging something that i know and it will be a start and then he'll triage many others..
[20:10] <vish> simar: cool!  was just mentioning it now, wanted to send that in the mail , but forgot :)
[20:12] <simar> vish: I will try, that my other student will triage something else.. n myself too ;)
[20:13] <simar> ashams: Here is a list of all bugs that need to be touched ie New as you have read in documentation.
[20:13] <simar> ashams: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-input-synaptics/+bugs?search=Search&field.status=New
[20:13] <simar> ashams: just have a look
[20:13] <ashams> simar:ok
[20:14] <simar> ashams: let me find some suitable one
[20:14] <ashams> simar: ok
[20:16] <simar> ashams: till then you would like to have a look here https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/565543
[20:16] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 565543 in linux (Ubuntu) "Alps touchpad detected as ImPS/2 Generic Wheel Mouse(in VAIO E series) after the kernel upgrade (affects: 13) (heat: 82)" [Medium,Incomplete]
[20:22] <ashams> simar: well, it looks like a problem with the driver?
[20:23] <simar> ashams: yes .. have you noticed how a triager intervenes a bug report.
[20:23] <simar> ashams: how to greet at first..
[20:28] <ashams> simar: I cannot understand what you say!
[20:28] <simar> ashams: don't worry, take your time..
[20:29] <simar> ashams: leave it and keep it as a reference , just subscribe it using Subscribe in green at right ..
[20:29] <simar> ashams: report after doing so
[20:29] <ashams> simar: done
[20:30] <simar> ashams: Now you can find this bug easily using launchpad in bugs section at you page and then subscribed bugs..
[20:30] <ashams> simar: what did you mean with " how to greet at first.."?
[20:30] <simar> ashams: can you find it
[20:31] <simar> ashams: That how a triager greets and thanks for reporting bug that i did in my first comment..
[20:31] <ashams> simar: yes
[20:32] <simar> ashams: both things clear?
[20:34] <ashams> simar: yes
[20:35] <simar> ashams: we need to speed up. I have a class tomorrow at 8 and its 1 am here already.
[20:35] <simar> ashams: see this  https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-input-synaptics/+bug/355372
[20:35] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 355372 in xserver-xorg-input-synaptics (Ubuntu) "unstoppable scrolling synaptics touchpad (heat: 7)" [Undecided,New]
[20:36] <simar> ashams: First subscribe..
[20:36] <njin> pedro_: are you around ?
[20:37] <pedro_> njin, hello , yes
[20:38] <ashams> simar: yes I see it in my supscription list
[20:38] <ashams> simar: and I got back to it!
[20:39] <njin> pedro_: today i've  alp trecking with son's, i'm phisically destroyed.
[20:39] <ashams> simar: so is there any triagging mistakes?
[20:43] <simar> ashams: subscribe the new bug. I can't see you in subscribers list..
[20:43] <simar> ashams: bug 355372
[20:43] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 355372 in xserver-xorg-input-synaptics (Ubuntu) "unstoppable scrolling synaptics touchpad (heat: 8)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/355372
[20:43] <ashams> simar: ok
[20:46] <ashams> simar: yes I supscribed now, so you want to finish it, its ok!
[20:47] <ashams> simar: if you're going to finish now, please tell me when to be here again?
[20:47] <simar> ashams: wait a sec now
[20:47] <ashams> simar: ok
[20:48] <simar> ashams: change the status to incomplete..
[20:49] <simar> ashams: This means you need to get information from the user, and you are triaging the bug
[20:49] <ashams> simar: I'm sorry I need to go.
[20:50] <simar> ashams: ok, we 'll catch tomorrow with the same bug ..
[20:50] <ashams> simar: OK but when???
[20:50] <ashams> simar: when?
[20:51] <ashams> simar: please give me the exact time to be here?
[20:52] <simar> ashams:  at 16:30 UTC
[20:52] <ashams> simar: ok
[20:52] <ashams> simar: bye now
[20:52] <simar> ashams: see my time here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugSquad/Mentors
[20:52] <simar> ashams: see ya
[20:53] <ashams> simar: ok
[20:53] <simar> ashams: gn
[21:09] <devildante> unreviewed patches reduced to 1479! woohoo!
[21:11] <vish> devildante: hey , are you working on the update-manager renaming?
[21:11] <devildante> vish: oh god, I forgot :p
[21:12] <vish> devildante: needs to be ready before UIF ;)
[21:12] <devildante> vish: will start working on it now :)
[21:12] <vish> devildante: yay! \o/
[21:13] <vish> devildante: woah! maverick u-m is gonna rock!
[21:13] <devildante> vish: would a renaming make it rock even more? :p
[21:14] <vish> devildante: rocker!  ?  ;p
[21:14] <devildante> vish: anyway, I got plans for this little guy (muhaha)
[21:15] <devildante> for NN (insert joke about the version code)
[21:15] <vish> no one shall be spared:  > http://www.weebls-stuff.com/songs/Narwhals/ listen and get addicted too !
[21:17] <devildante> bookmarked :p
[21:17] <yofel> u-m is being renamed?
[21:18] <yofel> (I don't follow gnome things much ^^)
[21:20] <devildante> yofel: it was a decision taken yesterday or the day before (I don't quite remember :p)
[21:20] <devildante> vish: I'm gonna put this link EVERYWHERE :p
[21:21] <vish> :D
[21:28] <devildante> vish: do you know the applications that uses update-notifier's gconf keys?
[21:31] <vish> devildante: not sure.. maybe the indicator-session?
[21:31] <vish> nah not it
[21:31] <devildante> vish: I would like to rename the gconf keys as well
[21:33] <vish> devildante: i would do that in probably two branches/commits.. in case it breaks something , we can revert easier
[21:33] <devildante> vish: yeah, you're right
[21:34] <devildante> vish: still, I'll rename the update-manager ones, as I think only the app itself uses them
[21:34] <vish> devildante: cool!
[21:34] <vish> devildante: we need an mvo! ;p
[21:35] <jpds> a mvo.
[21:35]  * devildante creates an mvo
[21:35] <vish> heh
[21:35] <devildante> jpds: why?
[21:35] <jpds> devildante: m is not a vowel, so it's an a.
[21:36] <devildante> jpds: wow, you're right - still, "an mvo" sounds cool :p
[21:36] <jpds> ;-)
[21:36] <astraljava> Yeah, but only if you pronounce them together. If separately, it's an m-v-o.
[21:37] <devildante> all right, I want everyone to include this in their quit/part message: http://www.weebls-stuff.com/songs/Narwhals/
[21:37] <devildante> :p
[21:41] <penguin42> devildante: I'm sure those guys would do custom version
[21:42] <penguin42> s
[21:42] <devildante> :p
[22:10] <virusuy> Evening 0/
[22:12]  * penguin42 is confused by bug 428318 - one with a patch
[22:12] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 428318 in util-linux (Ubuntu) "unable to mount an ext2 partition by label or uuid, unbootable system (affects: 14) (dups: 2) (heat: 83)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/428318
[22:12] <penguin42> I think the patch that is there is already in the util-linux 2.17.2 that it is in maverick, however I don't know if it actually fixes those guys problems
[22:13] <penguin42> and actually it sounds like it was probably in lucid


[02:31] <jjesse> nixternal can't come up w/ a good name?
[02:47] <nixternal> jjesse: nah, just registering 2 nicks for my phone
[02:48] <jjesse> haha
[02:49] <jjesse> so bored
[05:41] <shadeslayer> neversfelde: congrats.. but shouldnt that be MOTU ? or is MOTO something else?
[05:42] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: oh btw got a sec?
[07:37] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: would you happen to know of any particular reason why akonadi build-deps on mysql-server-core-5.1?
[07:37] <JontheEchidna> in debian
[07:37] <JontheEchidna> (I'm merging)
[07:42] <JontheEchidna> oh, no, that's us according to DEBIAN-KUBUNTU-DIFFERENCES?
[07:42] <JontheEchidna> ah, ok. gotcha. I'll leave that bit be ;)
[07:42]  * maco wonders if jon the taco is talking to himself
[07:49] <JontheEchidna> It's a necessity when one is merging things before 9:00 AM in a hotel :P
[07:51] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: I do have a another question that I don't see an answer for in debian/control. You have a line in debian/rules that looks like it does the same thing as 02_hardcode_debian_notmysqld_path.diff
[07:52] <JontheEchidna> which debian renamed to 02_hardcode_debian_mysqld_path.diff in this release
[07:52] <maco> haha
[07:53] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: so I'm wondering if you renamed that patch on purpose in favor of the debian/rules line, or if debian just named it weirdly in the past
[07:55] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: I have to leave for the airport in 2 hours, so I'll probably just re-ask this all when I get back :P
[08:43] <shadeslayer> hehe... well now the topic is corrected :
[08:48] <shadeslayer> kubotu: np
[08:48] <kubotu> shadeslayer hasn't played anything recently
[08:50] <shadeslayer> and till yesterday you showed me what i played 3 months ago :P
[08:52] <shadeslayer> oh wait
[08:58] <shadeslayer> ah finally
[08:58] <shadeslayer> kubotu: np
[08:58] <kubotu> shadeslayer_ is listening to "ACDC - Highway To Hell - 01 - Highway To Hell" by AC/DC -- see http://www.last.fm/user/shadeslayer_ for more
[09:01] <shadeslayer> hahahah .... amarok in gnome has a miniscule icon.. its not even a icon by standards :P
[09:02] <shadeslayer> just a empty vertical bar....
[09:43] <Riddell> it's... spec time! https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuMaverickKPackagekitUsability
[09:56] <Riddell> https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuMaverickKPackagekitAppStore
[10:01] <valorie> has kpackagekit stopped its crashing problem?
[10:01] <valorie> my kpackagekit wound hasn't yet healed
[10:02] <valorie> :-)
[11:01] <shadeslayer> Riddell: are you at UDS?
[11:09] <Riddell> shadeslayer: yes I'm at UDS
[11:09] <Riddell> shadeslayer: do you know if there's any rekonq release schedule?
[11:09] <shadeslayer> Riddell: cool,i just wanted to the status of rekonq :)
[11:09] <shadeslayer> Riddell: ah yes theres a roadmap,but schedule is decided by adjam
[11:10] <shadeslayer> Riddell: http://techbase.kde.org/Projects/rekonq/Roadmap
[11:11] <shadeslayer> Riddell: lionel__ may have some info about the release schedule :)
[11:12] <lionel__> about the schedule I don't know
[11:12] <lionel__> but about the features
[11:12] <lionel__> we are finishing the urlbar
[11:12] <lionel__> 0.5 will come soon
[11:12] <lionel__> and after
[11:13] <shadeslayer> txwikinger: http://gitorious.org/~nikhilm/rekonq/nikhilms-mainline/commits/extensions
[11:13] <lionel__> 0.6 will be a "fix" release
[11:13] <shadeslayer> txwikinger: thats the plugin integration,unofficial though
[11:13] <txwikinger> thanks shadeslayer
[11:14] <shadeslayer> no problem :)
[11:14] <lionel__> for an exact schedule, we must ask to Andrea
[11:14] <Riddell> lionel__, shadeslayer: do you know what happened to the "clear" button in the address bar
[11:15] <lionel__> it will be reintroduce I think
[11:15] <lionel__> It has been removed in order to implements buttons at the right of the bar (rss for example)
[11:15] <lionel__> an other possibility
[11:15] <lionel__> it select the text
[11:16] <lionel__> when we click in the bar
[11:16] <lionel__> by default
[11:16] <lionel__> I am not clear, I hope you understand
[11:22] <Riddell> lionel__: yes I understand, I'd certainly like to see it come back
[11:40] <shtylman> dantti: ping
[11:40] <shtylman> are you aware of the common print dialog session?
[11:40] <shtylman> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommonPrintingDialog
[11:41] <shtylman> last session of today
[11:41] <shtylman> in Mahogany
[11:41] <shtylman>  think it would be useful if you went to that session and also looked at that spec page for where this stuff is going... it could affect you and your work with printer dialog
[11:45] <dantti> shtylman: pong
[11:46] <dantti> shtylman: I'm aware, unfurtunatly I'm won't be able to be there
[11:46] <dantti> I have to go to the airport at 6pm
[11:46] <dantti> no 4pm
[11:48] <shtylman> dantti: hm... :(
[11:48] <dantti> shtylman: will you be able to be there?
[11:48] <shtylman> well... the spec will be there
[11:48] <shtylman> I was gonna go to the chromium session... just out of interest... but I can go to that session instead
[11:48] <dantti> because there is an item there that is wrong
[11:48] <shtylman> and see where they are with this stuff and whatnot
[11:49] <shtylman> what item is that?
[11:49] <Riddell> shtylman, dantti: that's unrelated to dantti's printing stuff.  dantti is doing printer status and config tools.  common print dialogue is the File->Print dialogue
[11:49] <shtylman> Riddell: right... I am aware
[11:49] <Riddell> I'm going to the common print dialogue session anyway
[11:49] <dantti> shtylman: no actually wrong but it's a drive problem  Laura has an Epson printer...
[11:49] <shtylman> but it is still "relevant" knowledge
[11:49] <Riddell> but I doubt common print dialogue will get anywhere, it's been in progress for the last 4 years
[11:50] <shtylman> Riddell: ahh ok
[11:50] <shtylman> hahah
[11:50] <dantti> right, I just would like to be sure that if they mention about ink levels their efforts go to fixing the drivers to export through cups and not integrating in system-config-printer
[11:51] <shtylman> gotcha
[11:51] <shtylman> makes sense
[11:52] <dantti> :) and it's easier (also because I already support that)
[11:52] <dantti> no "I" the printer stuff :P
[12:49]  * Riddell reads http://www.linux.com/news/embedded-mobile/netbooks/308465:five-best-linux-netbook-oses-for-now and notes that https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Netbook needs updated
[12:52] <shadeslayer> Riddell: have you seen the Archos 9 ?
[12:52] <Riddell> nope
[12:52] <shadeslayer> hold on...
[12:53] <shadeslayer> http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/13/archos-7-home-tablet-review/
[12:53] <shadeslayer> Riddell: ^^
[12:54] <shadeslayer> Just replace the resistive touchscreen with a capacitive one,and the ability to dual boot between android and kubuntu and we have a winner
[12:59] <Riddell> just what we need to test Ubuntu Liquid/Kubuntu Mobile
[12:59] <shadeslayer> :)
[12:59] <Riddell> shadeslayer: what's wrong with a resistive touchscreen?
[13:00] <shadeslayer> Riddell: see the video :P
[13:00] <shadeslayer> yoll know whats wrong xD
[13:00] <shadeslayer> *youll
[13:01] <shadeslayer> Riddell: oh and btw can we haz a update to plasma-widget-networkmanagement? the current one does not connect to WEP
[13:02] <Riddell> in maverick we will yes
[13:02] <shadeslayer> Riddell: in lucid...
[13:03] <shadeslayer> maybe a SRU or something? neither kde network manager nor the plasmoid work with WEP networks
[13:03] <Riddell> I suspect they do, we had plenty people test it, it's probably only one of the various types of WEP connections which you are unfortunate enough to have
[13:04] <shadeslayer> hmm.. well i have a 128 bit passphrase WEP network..
[13:04] <shadeslayer> Riddell: known bug : https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/plasma-widget-network-manager/+bug/453260
[13:05] <shadeslayer> and this still happens for people...
[13:06] <Riddell> poke agateau into test when he gets back home, he wrote the original support
[13:08] <shadeslayer> okies
[15:03] <Riddell> spec! https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuMaverickWebBrowser
[15:08] <EagleScreen> the only decent web browser is Firefox
[15:09] <Riddell> well, that's constructive.
[15:09] <EagleScreen> Firefox + KDE integration patches should be the default web browser
[15:11] <maco> the force-firefox-to-use-kde's-theme stuff doesnt actually work that great though...the menus get a bit "eh" ... is there actually any integration other than the theme when you add "kde integration"?
[15:14] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: the only decent browsers are those which use webkit ( or whatever chrome uses ) :P
[15:14] <EagleScreen> KDE ntegration patches add KDE dialogs for save and open files
[15:14] <EagleScreen> add KDE notification fo downloads
[15:15] <EagleScreen> and with kcm-gtk, the theme is good enought
[15:15] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: patching is just a quickfix for bugs which will eventually be fixed in upstream
[15:15] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: use ff if you like,no ones forcing you
[15:16] <shadeslayer> stupid cafe wifi....
[15:17] <EagleScreen> be realist, Firefox is the only good browser, users dont like to use it, userse NEED to use it
[15:17] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: hahahaha
[15:17] <EagleScreen> there is too many webs broken for Konqueror, Rekonq, Arora...
[15:17] <jjesse> EagleScreen: actually disagree w/ you on this, FF is a resource hog, especially on a netbook
[15:17] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: chrome > rekonq > FF ( for KDE )
[15:18] <shadeslayer> although since chrome doesnt integrate nicely and isnt a Qt app i favour rekonq
[15:18] <shadeslayer> -although
[15:18] <EagleScreen> too many webs broken for Rekonq
[15:19] <EagleScreen> all webs working for Firefox
[15:19] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: eventually our kde ff package will contain more patches and less of actual ff code
[15:19] <EagleScreen> that is the question
[15:19] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: uh which rekonq version and site?
[15:19] <shadeslayer> since everything works here,im on a git build and 99pc of the sites work...
[15:20] <shadeslayer> which is true FF as well...
[15:20] <EagleScreen> i could give a good list with some minuties of testing
[15:20] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: ok gimme one
[15:20] <shadeslayer> lets see whats broken
[15:20] <shadeslayer> right now the wifi is really really bad.. but ill try :)
[15:21] <lionel__> shadeslayer: there are broken sites with rekonq
[15:21] <shadeslayer> \o/ rekonq just surpassed chromium in opening a page :P
[15:21] <shadeslayer> lionel__: like i said 1 pc
[15:21] <lionel__> no there are several very used websites
[15:22] <lionel__> that are broken
[15:22] <EagleScreen> very used for you?
[15:22] <shadeslayer> lionel__: btw do we use kpart?
[15:22] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: well most of the sites i use work.. gmail,vimeo,youtube,etc
[15:22] <lionel__> yes
[15:22] <shadeslayer> lionel__: ok... nsm was asking :)
[15:22] <EagleScreen> most if the sites I use are broken
[15:23] <lionel__> but It needs to be fixed
[15:23] <EagleScreen> there are more persons like you than like me?
[15:23] <EagleScreen> how can we know?
[15:23] <EagleScreen> the problem in osme cases is webkit engine, and in other cases is rekonq itself
[15:24] <EagleScreen> ok
[15:24] <EagleScreen> rekonq 0.4.0 is valid for you?
[15:25] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: im on 0.4.68
[15:25] <EagleScreen> is here much difference?
[15:27] <shadeslayer> yes...
[15:27] <EagleScreen> ok, installing 0.4.68+git
[15:27] <shadeslayer> for eg. CNN videos play here
[15:27] <shadeslayer> http://ubuntuone.com/p/3jE/
[15:28] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: look im not saying rekonq doesnt need work,it does,alot of it
[15:28] <EagleScreen> it is better than konqueror roght now
[15:28] <EagleScreen> but very poorer thanFirefox
[15:28] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: yes
[15:29] <shadeslayer> um both are good in their own respect
[15:29] <shadeslayer> Riddell: ping
[15:29] <shadeslayer> Riddell: CNN Vids working here : http://ubuntuone.com/p/3jE/
[15:30] <EagleScreen> Internal Server Error <-- http://ubuntuone.com/p/3jE/
[15:30] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: try a refresh
[15:30] <shadeslayer> the problem with yahoo is genuine though
[15:30] <EagleScreen> refresh not working
[15:31] <shadeslayer> http://ubuntuone.com/p/3jE/
[15:31] <shadeslayer> :P... same thing here now :)
[15:32] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: Riddell http://imagebin.ca/view/tcCk4YPM.html
[15:33] <EagleScreen> i ma now in rekonq 0.4.68+git
[15:33] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: ok,where did you get that btw?
[15:34] <shadeslayer> rekonq-daily ppa?
[15:34] <EagleScreen> yes
[15:34] <shadeslayer> ok good enough
[15:34] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: try now...
[15:34] <EagleScreen> first site not working: www.tuenti.com
[15:35] <EagleScreen> 2nd site: www.policia.es
[15:35] <shadeslayer> i think theres a known bug about this site on bugs.kde
[15:36] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: 2 sites out of....
[15:37] <maco> EagleScreen: but konqueror has always been our browser so going to konqueror's successor makes sense
[15:37] <EagleScreen> 3rd www.hotmail.com
[15:37] <maco> by the way, why the heck do the kubuntu shipit cd sleeve talk about firefox and the music store?
[15:37] <shadeslayer> maco: 10.04 ?
[15:37]  * maco giggles at the ide aof linux users on hotmail
[15:37] <maco> shadeslayer: yes
[15:37] <shadeslayer> maco: canonicals trying to make some moolah
[15:38] <maco> shadeslayer: i can understand ubuntu sleeves mentioning them, but kubuntu doesnt have those
[15:38] <shadeslayer> maco: yeah i lol'd when i saw Hotmail needs special case user agent
[15:38] <jjesse> probably the same sleeve just changed the cover?
[15:38] <shadeslayer> maco: i havent recieved my CD's yet... :(
[15:38] <shadeslayer> jjesse: replaced orange with blue and added a extra k
[15:39] <EagleScreen> 4th www.lacaixa.es
[15:39] <EagleScreen> i can continue all day...
[15:40] <Riddell> shadeslayer: you're right, cnn does work, must have been a demo syndrone bug during the session
[15:41] <shadeslayer> Riddell: theres a dialog box that pops up about AJAX and if you click ok the video plays
[15:41] <shadeslayer> EagleScreen: whats the error on no. 4?
[15:41] <shadeslayer> seems to be working here
[15:43] <maco> jjesse: yeah looks like s/ubuntu/kubuntu/g
[15:43] <shadeslayer> maco: do they have the sleeves online?
[15:43] <maco> dunno
[15:43] <maco> i grabbed some cds at a lug meeting
[15:43] <shadeslayer> :D
[15:43] <maco> and forced an ubuntu and a kubuntu cd upon my dad because he *still* hasnt switched
[15:44] <shadeslayer> maco: same goes for my friends and teachers here :P
[15:44] <maco> i teased him a bit while i was giving my talk at the lug
[15:44] <shadeslayer> Riddell: what needs to be added to the wiki is Ctrl+Enter support in URLbar
[15:45] <EagleScreen> shadeslayer: you wont see the operation menus; if you try to do a money transaction, browser crash ( i think webkit issue)
[15:46] <Riddell> shadeslayer: what should that do?
[15:46] <maco> because i mentioned cases where installers had broken windows bootability on dualboots but left linux intact (um like lucid...or like when dapper ate ntfs for breakfast) and some folks said "so? who needs windows?" and my dad was there so "well if youve got someone like my dad who still hasnt switched, and by teh way he's sitting right *point* there..."
[15:46] <shadeslayer> Riddell: like type google and press Ctrl+Enter to automatically add www. and .com
[15:46] <shadeslayer> and go to google.com.... like chromium
[15:47] <EagleScreen> 5th https://www.ucm.es/campusvirtual/CVUCM/index.php
[15:48] <shadeslayer> maco: hehehe
[15:49] <shadeslayer> ok got another one : http://ubuntuone.com/p/3jB/
[15:49] <shadeslayer> works in chromium :P
[15:50] <shadeslayer> ubuntuone is not supported.. canonical wont go ahead with this... *run_for_cover*
[15:50] <shadeslayer> jk
[15:52] <shadeslayer> http://ubuntuone.com/p/3jB/ is a beautiful vid btw... timelapse,taken from http://vimeo.com/channels/hd#11673745
[15:56] <Riddell> ScottK: I made a start on https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuMaverickPlasmaNetbookConfig do fill it in with anything else from that session which I can't remember just now (can't find a gobby document for it either)
[15:56] <ScottK> Riddell: Thanks.
[16:09] <evilshadeslayer> hahahaaha : http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2010/05/chromium-daily-shifts-buttons-to-left.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed:+d0od+(Omg!+Ubuntu!)
[16:09] <evilshadeslayer> this is why we dont have chromium in kubuntu :P
[16:22] <apachelogger> python--
[16:25] <apachelogger> 2010-05-14 17:25:03,559 - ubuntuone.SyncDaemon.ActionQueue - ERROR - The request 'oauth_authenticate' failed with the error:
[16:25] <apachelogger> 'str' object has no attribute 'key'
[16:25] <apachelogger> \o/
[16:26] <apachelogger> runtime issues ftw
[16:27] <Mamarok> evilshadeslayer: it doesn't switch buttons at all here, so only on Ubuntu probably
[16:29] <apachelogger> ah
[16:29]  * apachelogger just found the apparent wrongness
[16:33]  * apachelogger spoke too soon
[17:21] <ryanakca> ScottK: KNR made the news, http://www.linux.com/news/embedded-mobile/netbooks/308465:five-best-linux-netbook-oses-for-now
[17:35] <ScottK> ryanakca: Thanks.
[18:35] <neversfelde> Would someone please unsubscribe ubuntu-sponsors from bug 572657
[18:39] <Mamarok> neversfelde: well, they can do that themselves
[18:40] <neversfelde> Mamarok: I want to make sure, that this is not uploaded
[18:41] <apachelogger> oh qpointers
[18:41] <apachelogger> sweet
[18:45] <maco> neversfelde: unsubbed
[18:45] <neversfelde> thank you
[18:46] <Mamarok> I have a friend on the phone who can't select anything in the grub menu, his keyboard doesn't work untill Kubuntu starts
[18:46] <Mamarok> any idea how to debug that?
[18:46] <apachelogger> is it usb?
[18:46] <Mamarok> yes
[18:46] <apachelogger> if so he needs to ensure his bios is set to support that
[18:47] <Mamarok> what in the bios? He has a dual boot installation, the keyboard worked on Windowa
[18:47] <apachelogger> grub does not do drivers AFAIK
[18:47] <apachelogger> so the keyboard must be made working by the bios
[18:48] <apachelogger> if it fails to do, the keyboard will not be working
[18:48] <apachelogger> or do I misunderstand the problem?
[18:49] <Mamarok> what I don't understand is that it does not allow to select Grub entries, there must be a way to activate a keyboard by default, the first time I hear that oyu need to change something in the BIOS
[18:50] <Mamarok> I have done many Linux installations, never ever seen that happening, seriously, why wouldn't there be a keyboard available by default?
[18:51] <apachelogger> because bios is made out of crap and probably even worse than python
[18:51] <maco> heh
[18:51] <apachelogger> when bios was created usb was not even around
[18:51] <maco> Mamarok: some BIOSes will only speak to PS/2 keyboards unless you toggle a setting
[18:51] <apachelogger> so ultimately usb support for biosses is an expansion
[18:51] <Mamarok> still, that is something I have never senn in 10+ years on Linux
[18:51] <apachelogger> Mamarok: that has nothing to do with linux
[18:51] <maco> its not a linux thing though...its just a stupid-hardware thing
[18:52] <apachelogger> aight
[18:52] <Mamarok> wait, the PS/2 keyboard doesn't work either
[18:52] <maco> oh :(
[18:52] <Mamarok> we tried with a USB keyboard and a PS/2 keyboard
[18:52] <Mamarok> so there is something wrong elsewhere, not the BIOS
[18:54] <apachelogger> only thing that comes to mind is fast boot stuff
[18:54] <apachelogger> Mamarok: did he run windows before?
[18:54] <Mamarok> the time out is set to 5 seconds
[18:54] <apachelogger> or was it not operational ever
[18:55] <Mamarok> he did a dual boot isntallation today
[18:55]  * apachelogger notes that some biosses support some weird bit to be set by windows which then renders the keyboard disfunctional under some circumstances ... only have seen that with laptops though
[19:02] <Mamarok> riight, I think I found the problem: both are PS/2 keyboards, one is a wireless one, so the infrared driver is not loaded in Grub
[19:02] <Mamarok> any ideas if this is planed for grub2?
[19:03] <Mamarok> the other one works. He just wrongly told me it was USB
[19:26] <txwikinger> Should rekonq bugs be filed in the kde tracker?
[19:33] <apachelogger> txwikinger: yep
[19:34] <apachelogger> Mamarok: I do not think that will ever happen... grub does not do drivers
[19:34] <apachelogger> what the bios does not manage to initialize the grub will not be able to access
[19:35] <apachelogger> of course i am not involved with grub development, so I am probably no good person to listen to ^^
[21:49] <neversfelde> is there an overview about what was decided on UDS for Maverick somewhere, yet?
[21:58] <PyObjectPtr> neversfelde: usually we have a meeting after UDS to discuss the specs
[21:58] <PyObjectPtr> also a list of all specs should be published soonish somewhere
[21:58] <PyObjectPtr> each spec then basically concludes what was decided
[21:59] <neversfelde> PyObjectPtr: but that is not fast enough, I am bored right now
[21:59] <PyObjectPtr> neversfelde: you can inspect kubuntu-maverick-* on gobby.ubuntu.com (using gobby obviously)
[21:59] <PyObjectPtr> or search the wiki for specs having maverick in their name
[22:00] <neversfelde> no gobby
[22:00] <PyObjectPtr> I am not sure they are all specd up already
[22:01] <CIA-6> [ubuntuone-kde] Harald Sitter<EMAIL_ADDRESS>*<EMAIL_ADDRESS>* (18 files in 5 dirs) Merege with login branch: new application ubuntuone-auth, exposting com.ubuntuone.Authentication to D-Bus
[22:02] <Riddell> neversfelde: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/10.10/Specs although it needs tidying up
[22:03] <neversfelde> I can only find specs written by a HaraldSitter, I am not sure, if I can trust them :)
[22:03] <neversfelde> Riddell: thanks
[22:07] <neversfelde> as far as I can see no one talked about digikam/kipi, so I will ask Lure, if he is still busy and if so, I can have a look at the necessary MIRs for kipi
[22:07] <CIA-6> [ubuntuone-kde] Harald Sitter<EMAIL_ADDRESS>*<EMAIL_ADDRESS>* data/ (3 files) Remove workaround for broken gnome-keyring now that we have working KWallet based auth.
[22:07] <Riddell> aye we didn't talk about them
[22:09] <PyObjectPtr> u1-kde is at 1635 SLOC
[22:13] <PyObjectPtr> sweet
[22:14] <PyObjectPtr> u1-kde can now also initialize u1 without support from the gnome side of things
[22:14] <neversfelde> !kubotu np
[22:14] <neversfelde> mhh
[22:14] <PyObjectPtr> neversfelde: ~np or kubotu: np
[22:14] <neversfelde> ~np
[22:14] <kubotu> neversfelde is listening to "Wig-Wam Bam" by Sweet [The Best of Sweet, 1997] -- see http://www.last.fm/user/neversfelde for more
[22:14] <neversfelde> sweet
[22:25] <CIA-6> [ubuntuone-kde] Harald Sitter<EMAIL_ADDRESS>*<EMAIL_ADDRESS>* src/auth/AccessToken.cpp Fix hardcoded hostname ;)
[23:24] <PyObjectPtr> aha!
[23:24]  * PyObjectPtr has no clue how to use a qpointer properly
[23:24] <PyObjectPtr> -.-
[23:31] <PyObjectPtr> ... wait for it ... :P
[23:31] <CIA-6> [ubuntuone-kde] Harald Sitter<EMAIL_ADDRESS>*<EMAIL_ADDRESS>* src/libs/SyncDaemon.cpp Fix realm
[23:32] <CIA-6> [ubuntuone-kde] Harald Sitter<EMAIL_ADDRESS>*<EMAIL_ADDRESS>* src/auth/AuthApplication.cpp Do not login by default
[23:32] <CIA-6> [ubuntuone-kde] Harald Sitter<EMAIL_ADDRESS>*<EMAIL_ADDRESS>* src/auth/AccessToken.cpp Fix writing of oauth access token (use expected format for syncdaemon)
[23:33] <CIA-6> [ubuntuone-kde] Harald Sitter<EMAIL_ADDRESS>*<EMAIL_ADDRESS>* src/auth/AuthHandler.cpp Do not delete the accessToken objects for the time being ... I do not know how to use them properly -> segfault :(((
[23:34]  * PyObjectPtr holds back on the kcm commits for now ;)
[23:38] <CIA-6> [ubuntuone-kde] Harald Sitter<EMAIL_ADDRESS>*<EMAIL_ADDRESS>* syncd-kwallet.patch Add patch to make syncdaemon kwalletier
[23:44]  * debfx requests that kdepimlibs5-dev depends on boost
[23:49] <nixternal> the rate apachelogger is committing, and in the same area back-to-back, he is hacking!!!