[01:32] <SergioMeneses> Noskcaj, \o
[01:32] <Noskcaj> hey SergioMeneses
[01:36] <SergioMeneses> Noskcaj, I'm here reading the game of thrones book
[01:38] <Noskcaj> SergioMeneses: i should probably start reading/watching that.
[01:38] <SergioMeneses> Noskcaj, jeje
[01:38] <Noskcaj> Have you watched breaking bad?
[01:39] <Noskcaj> on a more Ubuntu topic, http://noskcaj10.wordpress.com/2013/06/02/the-ubuntu-pc-case-mod/
[01:42] <SergioMeneses> Noskcaj, awesome!
[01:45] <Noskcaj> it will take a few months, but it will be awesome. now if only system76 would sponsor me.
[01:47] <SergioMeneses> Noskcaj, and did you talk with them?
[01:48] <Noskcaj> i sent an email, i'll send more
[01:54] <SergioMeneses> Noskcaj, perfect! :)
[05:13] <jibel> good morning
[05:14] <SergioMeneses> jibel, 00:14 here! but morning to you :G
[05:14] <SergioMeneses> :D
[05:16] <jibel> Hey SergioMeneses
[05:20] <SergioMeneses> good night guys
[05:28] <balloons> night jibel :-p
[05:29] <jibel> Hey balloons , good night :)
[06:16] <pitti> jibel: would you mind if I commit http://paste.ubuntu.com/5734931/ to auto-upgrade-testing?
[06:16] <pitti> jibel: I currently need it to closely examine a daily upgrade, but I would have found it useful for doing offline work in a train, too
[06:16] <pitti> and if you don't care for the very latest stuff when debugging a test, it's massively faster
[06:31] <jibel> pitti, sure, I'll review your MP
[06:32] <pitti> jibel: ah, you want an MP? ok
[06:32] <jibel> pitti, s/MP/commit
[06:32] <jibel> pitti, I don't need an MP :)
[06:32] <pitti> jibel: I tested it both ways, I just wanted to ask whether you mind the extra option
[06:33] <pitti> jibel: I can hide it from --help if you think it's bloating
[06:33] <jibel> pitti, no problem, it looks fine to me
[06:33] <pitti> d'accord, merci
[06:34] <jibel> pitti, de rien
[06:34] <pitti> pushed
[06:35] <jibel> thanks
[10:34] <pitti> jibel: do you have a clever trick to deal with those timezone skews in run-adt-test VMs?
[10:34] <pitti> jibel: I regularly get apt complaining about these, and worse, it breaks package builds
[10:34] <pitti> checking whether build environment is sane... configure: error: newly created file is older than distributed files!
[10:40] <jibel> pitti, I don't have any special trick. can you tell me how to reproduce this error and I'll find a trick if not a permanent find in run-adt-test?
[10:40] <jibel> s/find/fix
[10:41] <pitti> jibel: "run-adt-test -sl" will do an apt-get update, and complain about the timezone offset
[10:41]  * pitti checks whether copying /etc/timezone helps
[10:41] <pitti> Fetched 18.8 MB in<PHONE_NUMBER>34601d 5h 0min 39s (0 B/s)
[10:42] <pitti> well, not quite complain, but that's one effect
[10:42] <pitti> that's 64 bit wrap around of "minus two hours" (UTC from CEST)
[10:43] <pitti> or just doing "date" in the VM, and seeing that it's UTC; although I'm not quite sure why that should matter for configure
[10:43] <pitti> when it copies the source package it somehow seems to retain the CEST timestamps
[10:48] <pitti> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5735388/ works for apt, testing package build
[10:48] <pitti> Fetched 18.8 MB in 10s (1,867 kB/s)
[10:48] <pitti> ah, that looks much saner :)
[10:49] <pitti> meh, but not for package build
[10:49] <pitti> we might actually need to set the TZ in the debconf db and reconfigure tzdata, I try that
[10:52] <jibel> pitti, I'll set the timezone in the cloud-config file during the provisioning and see if it helps
[10:58] <pitti> jibel: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5735402/ also works for apt, but something else is still fishy; the package build still fails
[10:58]  * pitti investigates this more closely
[11:00] <pitti> oh, WTH
[11:00] <pitti> stat configure
[11:00] <pitti> Modify: 2013-06-05 14:58:20.332812000 +0200
[11:00] <pitti> that's in two hours from now
[11:02]  * saintlulu waves at pitti
[11:03] <pitti> hey saintlulu
[11:04] <pitti> jibel: ok, this wrong timestamp from the files copied into the VM does not depend on the system timezone, so that was a red herring (the apt confusion still applies, though)
[11:08] <pitti> jibel: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5735421/ gets me a little further, but there are still complaints
[11:08] <pitti> gpg: key 270BF656 was created 7097 seconds in the future (time warp or clock problem)
[11:08] <pitti> adt-run: unexpected error: apt-ftparchive or signature failed, code 2
[11:09] <pitti> perhaps there's some cloud-init magic which does something weird to the clock during boot
[11:09] <jibel> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5735423/
[11:09] <jibel> pitti, ^
[11:10] <pitti> ah, nice
[11:10] <jibel> I didn't try a package build but the TZ matches the host
[11:12] <pitti> jibel: both combined also work for me: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5735428/
[11:12] <pitti> jibel: but I'll try your's, too (that'll take a bit)
[11:13] <pitti> nice, that now builds my brand new umockdev 0.2.4 package, installs it, and runs its autopkgtests
[11:16] <pitti> jibel: running prepare-testbed, downloading
[11:16]  * pitti prepares some lunch in the meantime
[11:16] <jibel> I built a simple package an configure is happy, I wish umockdev will be too
[11:24] <pitti> gpg: key 8EF5158D was created 7199 seconds in the future (time warp or clock problem)
[11:24] <pitti> and apt still complains, too
[11:25] <pitti> jibel: but I think there's something wrong with the scp'ing, not necessarily with the VM's tz (that causes the apt and gpg errors)
[11:25] <pitti> jibel: nope, same result :/
[11:27] <pitti> so far only http://paste.ubuntu.com/5735428/ seems to work (almost, it fails at the end, but not due to a time skew problem)
[11:29] <jibel> pitti, go for your fix, cloud-config doesn't modify debconf db
[11:30] <pitti> jibel: it needs to run dpkg-reconfigure tzdata if it modifies /etc/timezone; it doesn't do that?
[11:30] <pitti> jibel: but it seems the trick for the configure test is to use scp -p only, not the host's TZ
[11:31] <pitti> . o O { run-adt-test -sUkS file://..  sounds really like an insult! }
[11:31] <jibel> pitti, it doesn't and dpkg-reconfigure reverts tz to utc
[11:32] <jibel> :)
[11:32] <pitti> jibel: ok, I'll commit that for now; if it causes trouble, we can just revert it
[11:32] <jibel> pitti, ok, thanks
[12:07] <zyga> https://code.launchpad.net/~zkrynicki/checkbox/docker/+merge/167517
[12:07]  * zyga goes for lunch
[12:07] <zyga> oh, wrong channel
[12:07] <zyga> :)
[13:09] <pitti> jibel: meh, autopkgtest's "Restrictions: build-needed" is broken :/
[13:10] <pitti> jibel: despite the description, it runs the tests from the original cwd apparently, not from the built tree
[14:29] <DanChapman> afternoon everyone
[14:30]  * saintlulu waves
[14:31] <DanChapman> balloons, ping
[14:50] <balloons> DanChapman, [pmg
[15:57] <DanChapman> balloons, sorry didnt see your pong. With ubiquity is it to run all the way to the restart computer window?
[15:59] <balloons> DanChapman, indeed. The autopilot testcase will need to be part of a testrunner to get the full effect
[15:59] <balloons> for the moment though we can simply worry about getting the test to run through all the ubiquity UI screens and installation and hit that restart button :-)
[16:02] <DanChapman> balloons cool, one more question during install does it install the packages in the same order everytime. Just thinking about a way to travel through the package once all input windows are complete.
[16:03] <balloons> DanChapman, I'm not sure what your meaning here.. I mean it goes through the same process each time
[16:03] <phillw> balloons: thanks for updating the classroom sessions, could you also do the automated test cases round about the date of the manual one (and after the introduction to bzr ;P  ) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Activities/Classroom/Saucy#Learning_to_write_and_up-date_test-cases
[16:21] <DanChapman> balloons, what i mean is once i have got  through the create location, keyboard, user account etc it just the progress bar while copying and installing. I was wondering if the packages are always installed in the same order. I could track these via the label to get to the end of the install.
[16:22] <balloons> you'll know it's the end when you get the dialog window I think
[16:22] <balloons> however there is also a progress widget at the bottom
[16:22] <balloons> that should be exposed too
[16:25] <DanChapman> Would autopilot not timeout though waiting for a progress bar? I think the default is 10 seconds
[16:26] <DanChapman> i will get to that point anyway and see where its at :-)
[16:31] <balloons> you can change the timeout DanChapman
[16:31] <balloons> but that is a good point :-)
[16:32] <balloons> how long do we wait, and how do we know everything is still moving along
[16:35] <DanChapman> Yeah its a tricky one. Well i will get to that point first and we can take a look from there :-)
[16:35] <balloons> DanChapman, indeed
[16:35] <balloons> :-)
[17:16] <balloons> DanChapman, et la. I updated the trello board for autopilot tests and closed the bugs we fixed
[17:17] <balloons> we still have to decide if we're retaining the board or not :-)
[17:17] <DanChapman> Cool how do i join the trello board members?
[17:17] <balloons> https://trello.com/board/autopilot-tests/50e735ad7351f0a64e00040c
[17:17] <balloons> I can add you, you just need an account
[17:19] <DanChapman> Yeah, i quite like the visual side of trello. Or any backlog board in fact. should ask on the mailing list.
[17:20] <DanChapman> Right account created
[17:21] <DanChapman> what do you need to add me email?
[17:21] <balloons> email or account name
[17:22] <DanChapman> username = danchapman3
[17:23] <DanChapman> hmmm think i might sell my macbook and buy a Dell XPS :-)
[17:24] <balloons> the sputnik?
[17:25] <DanChapman> yeah sputnik or the XPS 14
[17:27] <balloons> If I had the option and wanted to spend that kind of money i would by the chromebook pixel everyday all day :-)
[17:28] <balloons> as it stands I tend to keep my mobile devices very light and basic and have a nice workstation and servers instead :-)
[17:28] <balloons> but the sputnik does look cool. honestly it's been so long since I've used a nice dev laptop like that
[17:29] <balloons> I've no idea how to compare it
[17:33] <DanChapman> I was lucky in getting my macbook pro. It was a perk to a job i did. But to be honest I'm not that keen on it, its only 3 months old so still worth a fair bit and macbooks seem to hold their price rather well. I would rather get relitavely same spec for less money and spend the rest on "extra's" :-)
[17:33] <balloons> ahh.. I've never liked the mac hardware.. mostly the keyboard drives me absolutely nuts
[17:34] <DanChapman> don't get me started on the keyboard
[17:34] <balloons> lol
[17:35] <DanChapman> Its a lovely put together casing but thats as far as my like for it goes
[17:37] <balloons> screens are also usually nice on the macbooks. Some other laptops don't like to include higher resolution screens
[17:39] <DanChapman> yeah true, the screen is rather nice.
[19:33] <DanChapman> damn vbox crashed with my test inside :'(
[19:33] <balloons> ohh netsplitting is bad today :(
[19:34] <balloons> DanChapman, sorry to hear that mate! best to use bzr branches and do everything local
[19:34] <balloons> then push to lp and swap to vm and to a bzr pull
[19:34] <DanChapman> Thats a good idea!! will do that :D
[19:34] <balloons> hehe.. the words of experience is all
[19:35] <balloons> and you've learned too!
[19:35] <DanChapman> And will never forget again :D
[19:52] <Letozaf_> balloons, hi
[19:53] <balloons> Letozaf_, hello
[19:53] <Letozaf_> balloons, I have almost finished screenshot test I have only two things that I wanted to ask you about
[19:54] <balloons> Letozaf_, sure
[19:55] <Letozaf_> balloons, the first is that after saving the screenshot and before verifying that the screenshot is >0 I had to put a sleep otherwise I get an error
[19:55] <balloons> Letozaf_, you should be able to use the lambda and eventually to avoid that
[19:56] <balloons> is everything pushed to your lp branch?
[19:56] <balloons> push it up and then we can chat about it :-)
[19:56] <Letozaf_> balloons, ok just a second
[19:57] <Letozaf_> balloons, ah! compiz crashed, have to reboot :)
[19:58] <Letozaf_> balloons, just a second and I will push the test to lp branch
[19:58] <balloons> Letozaf_, excellent
[20:02] <Letozaf_> balloons, pushed
[20:02] <balloons> Letozaf_, kk
[20:03] <Letozaf_> balloons, line 73 had to put that sleep it's just before an assert lambda
[20:03] <Letozaf_> balloons, it's after saving the screenshot
[20:04]  * balloons is looking
[20:04] <balloons> Letozaf_, ahh thatt's the file verification piece
[20:05] <balloons> so what I did was add a little polling loop in my example
[20:05] <Letozaf_> balloons, yes
[20:05] <balloons> let me pull it
[20:05] <balloons> ohh you have it ;-)
[20:05] <balloons> well almost.. I used         self.assertThat(lambda: os.path.isfile(fileName+'.png'), Eventually(Equals(True)))
[20:06] <balloons> basically just look for the file to exist
[20:06] <balloons> I should try running your code though and see why it's not working
[20:06] <Letozaf_> balloons, the first two tests are ok a part the sleeps
[20:07] <balloons> just the one test has issues?
[20:07] <Letozaf_> balloons, the last one
[20:07] <balloons> k, I'll run that ne
[20:08] <Letozaf_> balloons, is missing the part where I have to select the  drop shadow effect
[20:08] <Letozaf_> balloons, thats the othe problem
[20:10] <balloons> mm, yea that one failed
[20:10] <balloons> Letozaf_, ok so what's wrong with the drop shadow?
[20:11] <Letozaf_> balloons, can-t select the effect from the drop down menu
[20:11] <Letozaf_> balloons, :( drop down boxes hate me
[20:11] <balloons> I see it's commented out
[20:11] <Letozaf_> balloons, I-ve tried several "solutions" but non worked
[20:11] <balloons> right.. so let's see
[20:12] <balloons> we might have to exclude that test for now if we can't get it running :-0
[20:13] <balloons> Letozaf_, what is this line for? self.assertThat(lambda: self.incl_win_border.active, Eventually(Equals(1)))
[20:13] <Letozaf_> balloons, I wanted to verify that the check box include window border was checked
[20:14] <balloons> ahh ok.. and I see the issue Letozaf_
[20:14] <balloons> your code isn't bad, it's a bug
[20:14] <balloons> the file is a zero byte file
[20:14] <Letozaf_> balloons, fiew! :)
[20:14] <balloons> lol.. gnome-screenshot isn't making a good image
[20:14] <Letozaf_> balloons, it-s because there is no sleep
[20:15] <Letozaf_> balloons, put a sleep like the other tests and the file will be ok
[20:15] <Letozaf_> balloons, it you take the sleep away the file is 0 bytes
[20:15] <balloons> what the?
[20:16] <Letozaf_> balloons, just like the other tests, if you comment the sleep you have the same problem
[20:17] <balloons> ohh you have all the sleeps in there
[20:17] <balloons> wild, mine worked, but it was only checking for existence
[20:25] <balloons> Letozaf_, ok fixed it
[20:25] <balloons> we need both.. verify a file exists.. then verify a non-zero size
[20:25] <Letozaf_> balloons, \o/ great!!!
[20:26] <balloons> add self.assertThat(lambda: os.path.isfile('/tmp/'+fileName+'.png'), Eventually(Equals(True))) to verify_non_zero ahead of the assert you have
[20:28] <balloons> ok, so the drop shadow piece.. let's see
[20:29] <Letozaf_> balloons, great it worked also for me :-)
[20:29] <Letozaf_> balloons, yea cannot find how to select that drop down button and select drop shadow
[20:29] <balloons> does it make sense to you Letozaf_ /
[20:30] <Letozaf_> balloons, that checking that the file exists first ?
[20:30] <balloons> yea
[20:30] <balloons> the non-zero check is a good one too :-)
[20:30] <balloons> but it doesn't like us trying to os.stat a nonexistent file it seems
[20:31] <balloons> so verifying it's there first fixes that
[20:31] <Letozaf_> balloons, yeah I think that in place of a sleep you do do another check before checking the non-zero
[20:31] <balloons> right.. anyways, onto the drop shadow piece
[20:31] <balloons> so I see the query fails
[20:31] <balloons> ValueError: More than one item was returned for query
[20:32] <Letozaf_> balloons, argh! yes
[20:32] <Letozaf_> balloons, could not find anything better that workded
[20:32] <Letozaf_> sorry worked
[20:32] <balloons> right, so hmm
[20:35]  * balloons introspects
[20:36] <Letozaf_> balloons, hope you have more luck than me ;)
[20:36] <balloons> Letozaf_, btw at some point you should check out doing autopilot with the new apps.. It's really quite nice.. not frustrating with the inability to get objects like in gtk
[20:36] <thomi> balloons: +1 :-/
[20:36] <balloons> it will be a nice refreshing change when you need it :-)
[20:37] <Letozaf_> balloons, new apps ? you mean the core apps ?
[20:37] <balloons> lol.. though once you do it the limits you'll hit will be your own understanding so you can' t blame the app :-)
[20:38] <balloons> Letozaf_, yes, I specifically kicked off stuff for the cores apps in QML, but any Qt app is nice
[20:39] <Letozaf_> balloons, ok fine, but is there a list of apps somewhere to pick from?
[20:39] <balloons> Letozaf_, wow this screenshot app isn't too bad with spawning stuff though :-)
[20:39] <balloons> Letozaf_, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/CoreApps/Testing
[20:39] <Letozaf_> balloons, cool :)
[20:40] <balloons> so you tried the direct way, asking for 'Drop Shadow'
[20:40] <Letozaf_> balloons, yeah did not find anything better
[20:41] <balloons> ohh.. this looks interesting
[20:41] <balloons> we can test all the little checkboxes.. in theory
[20:41] <Letozaf_> balloons, how how ...
[20:41] <balloons> ah-ha! I think I found
[20:41] <balloons> I see a 'shadow' objet
[20:42] <Letozaf_> balloons, a what ?
[20:42] <balloons> gtkComboBoxAccessible, accessible_name = shadow
[20:43] <Letozaf_> balloons, how does that work ?
[20:44] <balloons> Letozaf_, trying it out now
[20:44] <Letozaf_> balloons, :-)
[20:49] <balloons> Letozaf_, ok I've got a list of stuff to try and use
[20:50] <Letozaf_> balloons, ok
[20:50] <balloons> if not we'll drop that piece of necessity and go with what we have
[20:50]  * balloons fingers crossed
[20:50]  * Letozaf_ fingers crossed too
[20:51] <balloons> Letozaf_, also try not to name things with a . in them.. the . has meaning ;-) user an underscore
[20:51] <balloons> self.drop.shadow -> self.drop_shadow
[20:51] <balloons> python less confused that way
[20:53] <Letozaf_> balloons, oh! I think it was a mistake I usually use underscore
[20:53] <Letozaf_> balloons, I will fix it right away
[20:54]  * Letozaf_ needs new glasses
[20:54] <Letozaf_> :p
[20:54] <balloons> lol, I hear that
[20:54] <balloons> so it will select the combobox now
[20:55] <Letozaf_> balloons, so it was the . that made it not work :p
[20:55] <Letozaf_> balloons, oh shoot!
[20:56] <balloons> window border seems to work now too
[20:59] <Letozaf_> balloons, even with the underscore in place of . it's not working for me, what did you use ?
[21:00] <balloons> self.drop_shadow=self.app.select_single('GtkComboBoxAccessible', accessible_name='shadow')
[21:00] <Letozaf_> balloons, oh! fine. let me try it
[21:03] <Letozaf_> balloons, not working but probably I am using that shadow stuff in a wrong way
[21:03] <balloons> lol.. gtk is a crapshoot
[21:04] <Letozaf_> balloons, true, I'm starting to realize it now
[21:08] <Letozaf_> balloons, it's getting late for me
[21:08] <balloons> Letozaf_, ok everything works here
[21:08] <Letozaf_> balloons, wow
[21:09] <Letozaf_> balloons, great
[21:09] <balloons> so.. I guess you want me to paste you this and you can put into branch?
[21:10] <Letozaf_> balloons, well I hope so :p
[21:11] <Letozaf_> balloons, I will finish the test and check it tomorrow and then propose to merge if I get everything working
[21:11] <balloons> k, incoming paste
[21:11] <Letozaf_> balloons, thanks
[21:11] <balloons> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5736998/
[21:11] <Letozaf_> balloons, I owe you a bear :p
[21:12] <balloons> lol... I don't drink alchohol.. but if I remember correctly I owe you one anyway from raring final iso testing :-)
[21:13] <balloons> mm.. looking at that probably could add logic again to not go through the drop shadow bit if it's already selected
[21:14] <balloons> ie, if self.drop_shadow_effect.enabled == 'True'
[21:14] <balloons> err.. lol if self.drop_shadow_effect.enabled == 'False': then do the bits to turn it on
[21:15] <balloons> like this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5737009/
[21:15] <balloons> I'll watch for your merge
[21:15] <balloons> good night Letozaf_
[21:15] <Letozaf_> balloons, thank you very much
[21:16] <Letozaf_> balloons, let you know tomorrow 'night
[22:32] <phillw> balloons: can you add the time in for your session on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Activities/Classroom/Saucy#Introduction_to_QA_tools Many thanks!


[09:56] <kotatsu> Xira: uh... okay... "Linux isn't popular except where it is!"
[09:56] <Spooks> Someone mind telling me where the xmms skins directory is please?
[09:56] <Xira> I'm refering to the desktkop kotatsu
[09:56] <raetsel> Sabator how about using GNU parted?
[09:56] <Xira> *desktop
[09:56] <sihen> can someone help please
[09:56] <Sabator> what is that raetsel?
[09:56] <Sabator> I know nothing of Linux or it's stuff
[09:56] <stazz> Spooks: ~/.xmms/Skins
[09:56] <deFrysk> I have to go
[09:56] <raetsel> sorry sihen no wireless stuff here
[09:57] <kotatsu> spacey: yes, and it's not hard to get an executable script onto a person's drive
[09:57] <raetsel> parted is another partition tool like fdisk
[09:57] <Sabator> *google(
[09:57] <^thehatsrule^> but better
[09:57] <^thehatsrule^> qtparted is easier
[09:57] <^thehatsrule^> with a gui
[09:57] <sihen> raetsel, ?
[09:57] <spacey> kotatsu, maybe not, but by default things you download are not +x
[09:57] <Sabator> can I unhide my ntfs partition with parted?
[09:57] <stazz> ^thehatsrule^: there is no substitute for fdisk :)
[09:57] <Zyan_eq> sihen: are familiar with ndiswrapper and wireless tools?
[09:57] <kotatsu> spacey: things you decompress are, if they come that way
[09:58] <Spooks> ~/ = home directory, right?
[09:58] <httpdss> sabator: you can do that with grub
[09:58] <spacey> Spooks, yes
[09:58] <stazz> Spooks: yes.. the tilde means current user's home directory.
[09:58] <Sabator> I need to get yast2 to edit GRUB
[09:58] <raetsel> you should have parted already on your ubuntu system, sabator
[09:58] <Spooks> So, /home/username/.xmms/Skins ?
[09:58] <hawke_> Sabator: why?
[09:58] <sihen> Zyan_eq, nop im not
[09:58] <Spooks> Just to clarify
[09:58] <stazz> Spooks: yes.
[09:59] <hawke_> Sabator: why not just edit directly?
[09:59] <Sabator> how do i do that?
[09:59] <stazz> Spooks: and for system wide, /usr/share/xmms/Skins/
[09:59] <Sabator> I have no clue how to do anything on Ubuntu :)
[09:59] <Zyan_eq> sihen: you should check out the ndiswrapper for Ubuntu first.
[09:59] <kotatsu> Sabator: btw your grub file looks fine to me, no idea what's going on... if the correct partition is in there I'm not sure why it wouldn't load
[09:59] <httpdss> sudo nano /boot/grub/menu.lst
[09:59] <apokryphos> Anyone know of any decent [extra]  font packages in the repositories?
[09:59] <Sabator> kthx
[09:59] <sihen> Zyan_eq,  ta
[09:59] <Zyan_eq> sihen: that will walk you through the configuration. If your still having problems I can help
[10:00] <Spooks> Ah, that's the one. Great stuff, many thanks
[10:00] <sihen> ta
[10:00] <snetx10> whenever i try to install a software package in the ubuntu live cd hoary version i keep getting an error message (using sudo apt-get install vncserver, for example)
[10:00] <snetx10> the error message has to do with /var/cache/apt/archives/libcurl2_7.12.0.is.7.11.2-lubuntu0.1_i386.deb
[10:02] <snetx10> libcurl2_7.12.0.is.7.11.2-1ubuntu0.1_i386.deb:  trying to overwrite `/usr/share/curl/curl-ca-bundle.crt', which is also in package libcurl3
[10:02] <dumbhack> Any suggestions for the best way to set up a virtual host with Ubuntu (Warty)?  I just want Apache2 and a mail server, with quota, etc.  I have Apache2/PHP/Perl and sendmail installed now.  Is there anything that I can apt-get to help set this up?  Or do I have to chagne each config file manually-like?
[10:03] <Sabator> Okay guys, I think I fixed GRUB, If I manage to boot up windows I'll use my windows IRC client to come and say thanks. Wish me luck, i'm gonna need it.
[10:03] <raetsel> good luck Sabator
[10:03] <raetsel> when it's fixed copy the files off and format it all as Linux
[10:04] <raetsel> So who thinks Sabator will make it?
[10:04] <raetsel> I reckon it is 50-50
[10:05] <kotatsu> what did he change in his grub config?
[10:06] <raetsel> some settings to unhid the ntfs partition
[10:06] <Sabator> Dammit!
[10:07] <raetsel> still no good sabator?
[10:07] <Sabator> No
[10:07] <kotatsu> =\
[10:07] <kotatsu> same error messages?
[10:07] <Sabator> I think I may have...er...messed up GRUB. Lemme try and fix it and I'll reboot again
[10:07] <raetsel> Kotatsu, it was stuff posted on this site http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=21022
[10:08] <kotatsu> "Ubuntu and my monitor."?
[10:08] <Beuno> hey, I installed kubuntu over my ubuntu, with apt-get
[10:08] <Beuno> now
[10:08] <Beuno> I would like to be able
[10:08] <Beuno> to load my gnome again
[10:09] <Beuno> any ideas?
[10:09] <raetsel> oops I meant http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/16969/
[10:09] <^thehatsrule^> in your login screen, change the session?
[10:09] <sic|> Beuno: install gnome
[10:09] <BockBilbo> whats the best ftp server in the ubuntu repositories?
[10:09] <apokryphos> Beuno: you installed the Kubuntu ISO?
[10:09] <Sabator> Okay, time to reboot again! Hopefully I'll do better...
[10:09] <apokryphos> BockBilbo: it's a matter of preference. I like Konqueror.
[10:09] <Beuno> thehatsrule: gnome isnt on my session startup anymore
[10:09] <BockBilbo> apokryphos, lol
[10:09] <raetsel> good luck sabator
[10:09] <BockBilbo> konqueror is a browser from kde
[10:10] <Beuno> apok: no, I installed ubuntu, and then did apt-get to install the kubuntu desktop
[10:10] <apokryphos> BockBilbo: Thanks; it's also an ftp client.
[10:10] <BockBilbo> i actually want a ftp daemon
[10:10] <BockBilbo> :p
[10:10] <apokryphos> Beuno: Gnome is still there then.
[10:10] <BockBilbo> apokryphos, i know.. but im looking for a server
[10:10] <BockBilbo> ;)
[10:10] <Beuno> I know it
[10:10] <Beuno> just want to know how to get to ir
[10:10] <apokryphos> BockBilbo: eek, bad misreading.
[10:10] <Beuno> it
[10:10] <Beuno> :D
[10:10] <BockBilbo> ;)
[10:11] <apokryphos> Beuno: It really should be there under "Session". kubuntu-desktop does not uninstall any stuff
[10:11] <Beuno> yeah, I know
[10:11] <Beuno> it just isnt
[10:11] <Beuno> :(
[10:11] <apokryphos> Beuno: check to see if you've got all the Gnome packages still; i.e. gnome-session
[10:11] <raetsel> Sabator been gone a while. Either he's booting XP ( which takes a while ) or he ain't booting anything now :oS
[10:12] <Beuno> searching...
[10:12] <raetsel> oooh drumroll
[10:12] <Sabator> I never thought I'd say this
[10:12] <Sabator> but I'm so happy to see the Windows XP theme
[10:12] <apokryphos> Beuno: sudo dpkg -l | grep gnome-session
[10:12] <tahorg> ?
[10:12] <raetsel> hehe it worked then Sabator?
[10:12] <Sabator> Thanks for everything, guys.
[10:12] <raetsel> you are welcome
[10:13] <Sabator> Seriously, you saved my life
[10:13] <karlos> hi
[10:13] <Beuno> firing up the cosole
[10:13] <thurston> hi
[10:13] <raetsel> now backup your data and format that XP partition to be Linux as well :o)
[10:13] <Sabator> I had like 50GB of anime I hadn't burned yet
[10:13] <nis> apokryphos: I like the new Bitstream Vera fonts (truetype).
[10:13] <Beuno> rc  gnome-session  2.8.0-0ubuntu2 The GNOME 2 Session Manager
[10:13] <apokryphos> nis: cool :). I use Bitstream Vera Sans, generally.
[10:13] <kotatsu> Sabator: what did you do? just change it to regular NTFS instead of hidden?
[10:13] <Beuno> looks like I have it
[10:13] <tahorg> Beuno: rc != ii
[10:13] <Sabator> No, I'm keeping it as a dual-boot system, I'm using the windows partition for gaming and the Linux partition for...everything else, really.
[10:14] <Beuno> oh
[10:14] <plagerism> Why is there no kernel headers for my running kernel?? The package manager updated my kernel to 2.6.10-5-amd64-generic, however there is no matching kernel?? Anyone know why??
[10:14] <kotatsu> btw what's a hidden ntfs partition - what's its usefulness? never heard of that
[10:14] <Beuno> so, its gone for no apparent reason?
[10:14] <Sabator> Yeah kotatsu, I just unhid it. I deleted some stuff from GRUB menu accidentally, but I fixed it and now it loads.
[10:14] <raetsel> Sabator I read an article about WINE on Linux for gaming, did quite a good review
[10:14] <dieman> grr
[10:14] <dieman> h8 oopses in the install kernel
[10:15] <Sabator> I know raetsel, the performance may be good, but a game running on an emulator will never beb better than a game running on it's native system
[10:15] <Sabator> See you later then guys.
[10:15] <Agrajag> wine is not an emulator.
[10:15] <kotatsu> ahhh interesting, it's a partition magic thing
[10:15] <kotatsu> the xmnt2002
[10:15] <Sabator> Bye
[10:15] <raetsel> true Sabator
[10:15] <kotatsu> bye Sabator, have fun
[10:15] <raetsel> bye
[10:16] <raetsel> we helped him get back to XP, should we feel dirty? :o)
[10:16] <kotatsu> heh
[10:16] <plagerism> lol raetsel, linux is about choices!!
[10:16] <kotatsu> I'm a little confused as to why he didn't just copy the data from XP to linux though
[10:17] <raetsel> but some choices are more equal than others
[10:17] <raetsel> good point Kotatsu, wonder if his window partition mounted under linux
[10:17] <raetsel> anyways he wants his gaming in XP
[10:17] <sic|> about his gaming comment...UT2k4 runs better in linux then in windows
[10:18] <sic|> and I ahve heard Q3 does too
[10:18] <sic|> *have
[10:18] <Agrajag> sic|: neither of those are running in wine
[10:18] <raetsel> Here's that article about Wine and Cadega http://linuxtoday.com/infrastructure/2005031300326RVDTGM
[10:18] <sic|> hehe
[10:18] <sic|> true
[10:18] <thurston> i am having trouble accessing my xp partition too
[10:18] <raetsel> what problem are you having thurston?
[10:18] <thurston> ithink i came in just after the crucial bit
[10:18] <thurston> i cant access it at all
[10:19] <sic|> the point2play guys need to come out with a strict gaming/mulitmedia distro...that would be cool
[10:19] <raetsel> what errors do you get? Thurston
[10:19] <thurston> madee the partition through linux
[10:19] <tigger|nl> I've got a question: I've just installed Webmin with Synaptic, but I cant login (https://localhost:10000) because I don't know the standard login name/password and I can't find it anywhere....
[10:19] <thurston> and now have no idea how to get to it
[10:20] <Agrajag> tigger|nl: webmin needs a password for root
[10:20] <raetsel> it would be the root user tigger but that is disabled, your main ubuntu account can sudo
[10:20] <Agrajag> sudo passwd root will set it
[10:20] <thurston> have tried a few things suggested on the forum but to no avail
[10:21] <raetsel> I think in webmin you can delegate stuff to other users, maybe you should do that then switch the root account off again ( in keeping with ubuntu philosophy )
[10:22] <raetsel> see if this helps Thurston ( though I think it is only for partition magic related errors ) http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/16969/
[10:23] <thurston> ill try that then, cheers raetsel
[10:23] <raetsel> bbl
[10:23] <raetsel> afk
[10:25] <foznot> does anyone have a tip for turning audio on in vlc?
[10:25] <pngai> After downloading the linux-source and unpacking it. Are there any environment variables that need to be set?
[10:25] <nis> raetsel: how do u transition from a debian system with a root account to a no-root ubuntu system?
[10:25] <raetsel> back, did you miss me?
[10:26] <nis> (too late; saw the afk)
[10:26] <raetsel> nis, hmm well set an account up with the full sudo permissions then disable root. I guess. Never disabled root on a running system
[10:27] <nis> raetsel: I guess I could find the base package that establishes /etc/passwd shadow etc and do the edits by hand.
[10:28] <Redwraith111> hey all, does anyone know how to disable the accupoint 2 on a toshiba tecra s1
[10:28] <raetsel> hmm is root just there but with an unknown password? it shows something in the users and groups tool
[10:28] <Redwraith111> it is broken i guess and it is jumping around
[10:28] <Redwraith111> no
[10:28] <Redwraith111> root isnt activated.. if your talking about ubuntu off the bat
[10:29] <Redwraith111> the accupoint/touchpad just jumps arouind or gets stuck on the bottom (i move it and it jumps back) and even if a mouse is hooked up it wont detect.
[10:29] <ubuntu_user23> sudo apt-get install xine-ui doesn't work in my Hoary Hedgehog version of ubuntu.. is this because xine isn't yet supported in this new version of ubuntu?
[10:29] <bung__> doubtful
[10:29] <raetsel> ah right - Redwraithull
[10:29] <sh1mmer> does anyone know a reliable way to remove all the x components from hoary?
[10:29] <nis> Redwraith111: yes but define 'activated'
[10:29] <Redwraith111> how?
[10:29] <bung__> use debian? :)
[10:29] <Redwraith111> i want to DISABLE the touchpda and accu
[10:30] <Redwraith111> i jsut want to use a mouse
[10:30] <Redwraith111> because i am suspecting breakage
[10:30] <Redwraith111> the mouse works at the same time as the dualpoint
[10:30] <Redwraith111> but the dualpoint is broken so it randomly chooses a side to move to
[10:30] <Redwraith111> ho
[10:30] <Redwraith111> oh
[10:30] <Redwraith111> we were tlaking about the root account
[10:31] <Redwraith111> you have to set a password by using the sudo something or other passwd.. one sec ill look it up
[10:31] <raetsel> and a passwd -l to lock it amd -u to unlock it
[10:31] <Redwraith111> nis: sudo passwd root
[10:31] <Fackamato> someone please kickban PizdaChujKurwa
[10:31] <Redwraith111> then it will prompt for password
[10:32] <Fackamato> -PizdaChujKurwa/#ubuntu- X Fedora is the best linux distribution. Download now: http://fedora.redhat.com
[10:32] <raetsel> There  is a wiki all about htis http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/RootSudo
[10:32] <Redwraith111> lol
[10:32] <Redwraith111> good someone got the link lol
[10:32] <Redwraith111> no one knows about the accupoint though eh?
[10:33] <raetsel> not at the minute redwraith
[10:33] <Redwraith111> and does anyone notice firefox is a little laggy?
[10:33] <Redwraith111> to open and such
[10:33] <hemphill> Does hoary have a firewall on by default?
[10:33] <Redwraith111> last question: how do you disable those black squares when you minimize a window
[10:33] <nis> Redwraith111: yes.  thanks. However, I want to do the opposite: I want to lockdown root as if I'd installed ubuntu native, instead of  transitioning off of Debian as I did.  I have a std root account now (I use it often for system maintenance).  Trying to learn the ubuntu way.
[10:33] <Redwraith111> no.
[10:33] <Fackamato> hemphill: no, install firestarter
[10:33] <Redwraith111> oh
[10:33] <Redwraith111> i completely formatted debian and installed a fresh ubuntu
[10:34] <Redwraith111> so i dont know
[10:34] <dumbhack> How can I determine the version of Postfix installed?
[10:34] <Redwraith111> last question: how do you disable those black squares when you minimize a window they go to slow because my computer is dumb...
[10:34] <_BIJ_> hi
[10:34] <nis> raetsel: tnx for wiki ptr!
[10:35] <jason> nis: setup sudo then make the root passwd random
[10:35] <raetsel> well there is nothing new under the sun, someone else has already worked out the answer. I'm just lazy :o)
[10:35] <nis> jason: is that canonical here? ;)
[10:35] <Redwraith111> anyone know how to get rid o fthe blackboxes animation when minimizing?
[10:35] <_BIJ_> one question: i want to install "gimp-2-2-4" from where do i get the apt-url in order to install it via apt-get... otherwise there are too many dependencie problems...
[10:35] <_BIJ_> ???
[10:36] <Redwraith111> just go gimp and shouldnt it get the packages for you?
[10:36] <ubuntu_user23> sudo apt-get install xine-ui doesn't work in my Hoary Hedgehog version of ubuntu.. is this because xine isn't yet supported in this new version of ubuntu?
[10:36] <bung__> doubtful
[10:36] <Redwraith111> lol bung didnt you say that already
[10:37] <bung__> :)
[10:37] <_BIJ_> Redwraith111, the gimp version for ubuntu is 2-2-2
[10:37] <Redwraith111> what about my question lol
[10:37] <jason> nis: I dont think so, isnt that what you asked for?
[10:37] <Redwraith111> oh ok
[10:37] <Redwraith111> those animations run slow and look bad
[10:37] <Redwraith111> hmm.
[10:37] <nis> jason: I want to know exactly how 'root is disabled' in ubuntu.
[10:37] <Redwraith111> not sure then bij
[10:37] <nis> details, man. ;)
[10:37] <_BIJ_> from where do i get the line i have to add to the apt-sources.list
[10:38] <nis> there's no pt to disabling root if you're not really doing it securely.
[10:38] <Redwraith111> the directory is /etc/apt/sources.list... you have that?
[10:38] <jason> nis: it technically isnt disabled
[10:38] <BockBilbo> anyone here knows where does vsftpd keep its default anonymous directory?
[10:38] <Redwraith111> nis: is it a large deal? because I have a root account I just have a hard password and a stealthing* firewall and router
[10:39] <jason> nis: I believe the passwd is just random with sudo set up
[10:39] <Redwraith111> hm
[10:39] <bung__> jason: I doubt that
[10:39] <raetsel> no jason I thin the account is locked with "passwd -l"
[10:39] <jason> nis: if you sudo passwd root, you have a root account
[10:39] <bung__> it's more likely root logins are fully disabled
[10:39] <jason> ahh
[10:40] <Redwraith111> ok NIS
[10:40] <Redwraith111> go to your passwd file
[10:40] <Redwraith111> and change the UID
[10:40] <Redwraith111> from 0 to something different
[10:40] <bung__> you crazy fool
[10:40] <Redwraith111> then the root account is just another account
[10:40] <Redwraith111> lol
[10:40] <raetsel> Redwraith, try this link for disabling the animation http://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2005/01/msg01088.html
[10:40] <Redwraith111> To disable remote login access for your root user, edit the /etc/security/user file. Specify false as the rlogin value on the entry for root.
[10:41] <nis> Redwraith111: cool.
[10:42] <nis> I knew all that.  I thot ubuntu had done something *interesting and new*.  What they've really done is dumbed down the system. ;)
[10:43] <bung__> by disabling root access?
[10:43] <nis> Well they haven't changed anything, bung.
[10:43] <igraltist> hi
[10:43] <nis> In other words they're using passwd -l which isn't a new idea.
[10:44] <igraltist> i have debian sid, is ubuntu better to play games?
[10:44] <nis> from my pt of view, sudo isn't worth the bother.
[10:44] <robertj> igraltist: native games, wine, anything in particular?
[10:44] <raetsel> well sudo -s is as quick su - :o)
[10:44] <jason> nis: it is nice to use for users to have limited priverages
[10:44] <igraltist> games with cedega
[10:45] <robertj> jason: and it logs the cmds
[10:45] <bung__> discouraging new users from using root for everything is important
[10:45] <robertj> jason: so you can properly blame your co-worker ;)
[10:45] <bung__> otherwise they'll be surfing as root and so forth
[10:45] <jason> :)
[10:45] <nis> jason: that wiki  page raetsel cited really answered my Q.  it discusses the pros and cons of sudo use.
[10:45] <igraltist> i had read ubuntu is more for desctop build
[10:45] <nis> bung__: yea but let them!
[10:46] <robertj> lgraltist: hrmmm, dunno. If it plays nice I'd say its going to be better because at least Ubuntu's stable is usable on the desktop.
[10:46] <Redwraith111> nis: i dont sudo either
[10:46] <Redwraith111> i rather work in a terminal with su
[10:46] <Redwraith111> is there a way to shutdown x and jsut use the cmd line?
[10:46] <robertj> lgraltist: OTOH, if it has nasty deps and whines you might be forced into the depraved lifestyle of running unstable
[10:46] <bung__> ctrl-alt-backspace? :)
[10:47] <Redwraith111> that resets it
[10:47] <zenrox> Redwraith111, sudo /etc/init.d/gdm stop
[10:47] <Redwraith111> i want to USE the cmd line
[10:47] <nis> Redwraith111: about the only concession I make is that I never login to the linux virtual console as root; I su.
[10:47] <raetsel> an action replay: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/RootSudo
[10:47] <Redwraith111> k.. then how can i start again?
[10:47] <munki> anybody ever tried to get a usbphone connect to linux ?
[10:47] <zenrox> put start at the end
[10:47] <jason> Redwraith111: CTRL-ALT-F1-2-3-4-5-6
[10:47] <Redwraith111> yeah.. i SU at a terminal
[10:47] <jason> x still runing
[10:47] <munki> made a modprobe for it, but can't find it in /dev/
[10:47] <nis> Redwraith111: of course u can shutdown X.
[10:47] <jason> Redwraith111: or change init
[10:48] <raetsel> jason, how do you get back to the X session after the CTRL-ALT-F1 etc?
[10:48] <jason> f7
[10:48] <jason> alt-f7
[10:48] <raetsel> cool jason, can never remember what it was
[10:49] <igraltist> robertj, ok i must more read about ubuntu und how  the dist-upgrade from sid
[10:49] <nis> Redwraith111: edit /etc/inittab to add more getty lines to the virtual console.
[10:49] <Trixisity> Does anybody know where my mozilla-firefoz plugin directory would be?
[10:49] <robertj> lgraltist: i'd stick with ubuntu and install the bare minimum needed out of sid
[10:49] <raetsel> /usr/lib/mozilla-firefox I think  Trix
[10:49] <raetsel> then a dir called plugins
[10:49] <robertj> googling seems to indicate that cedega works ok
[10:49] <munki> Trixisity : try finding it with 'whereis firefox'
[10:50] <robertj> I'm still kinda bumbed out that wine can't play HOMM3 for win32 ;)
[10:50] <Trixisity> Thanks all
[10:50] <Trixisity> found it
[10:50] <Trixisity> used to SuSe :s
[10:50] <munki> robertj  : Cedega can :)
[10:50] <robertj> btw, Ubuntu passed Fedora on distrowatch today :)
[10:50] <nis> Redwraith111: and also 'kill -HUP 1' as root after editing inittab
[10:50] <raetsel> review of Cadega here http://linuxtoday.com/infrastructure/2005031300326RVDTGM seemed quite postive
[10:51] <robertj> munki: yeah but I don't want to pay for something that will just go away at some point.
[10:51] <robertj> getting bochs up and going is probably what I need for HOMM3 and Worms
[10:51] <linux_galore> yeah Fedora has some bad kama with users right now
[10:51] <linux_galore> not hard to do
[10:52] <munki> robertj : okay, I never paid a cent :) and i'm running HOMM4 on Cedega
[10:52] <sig> is there a net install if you don't have a floppy or a cd drive for ubuntu?
[10:52] <linux_galore> karma*
[10:52] <robertj> munki: ?
[10:52] <robertj> (is 4 worth getting, i've heard 3 is the better game by far)
[10:53] <linux_galore> sig: havent seen one...... you will have to use debian
[10:53] <munki> robertj : used my friends account to install HOMM4, and don't need to use the account to play
[10:53] <Redwraith111> lol guys that didnt work
[10:53] <Redwraith111> haha
[10:53] <munki> robertj : off cause HOMM4 is better than HOMM3 , but they are both old games !
[10:53] <Redwraith111> i had to reboot because it says the xserver was already running
[10:54] <robertj> munki: I bought it a year after it was out and it's still a great game
[10:54] <robertj> plays fine under SP 2
[10:54] <Redwraith111> ubuntu was alot easier than debian for installing fglrx drivers
[10:54] <munki> robertj : okay :) HOMM is a great game, never expires...
[10:54] <robertj> yeah, but is it a better game than 3 or just different?
[10:54] <munki> robertj : else Cedega isn't any expencive to use
[10:55] <Redwraith111> lol can wine run mohaa? or do i have to buy cedega
[10:55] <robertj> I'd love a wine compatability list for Ubuntu
[10:55] <munki> Wine is bad for playing games !
[10:55] <linux_galore> if you pay monthly cedega is pretty cheap......only need to pay for 3 months subscription and cedega is yours to keep
[10:55] <kensai> Redwraith111, build cedega from source it's free
[10:55] <Redwraith111> if i knew how
[10:55] <robertj> I'll definately take my 3 games and see how they do with Hoary when it hits stable
[10:55] <Redwraith111> is it a tarball?
[10:55] <kensai> cvs
[10:56] <Redwraith111> hoary is pretty much stable robertj
[10:56] <Redwraith111> hm
[10:56] <topyli> robertj: i doubt it's a distro issue, wine is wine
[10:56] <robertj> Red: I know, I've been running it for months
[10:56] <Redwraith111> im gonna need a walkthrough lol
[10:56] <robertj> topyli: I know but versions change
[10:56] <linux_galore> Redwraith111:  www.frankscorner.org
[10:56] <Redwraith111> forok
[10:56] <robertj> and google indicates taht Homm3 worked at one time, but now it does not
[10:56] <linux_galore> everything wine is there
[10:56] <kensai> Redwraith111, there is a walkthrough google
[10:56] <Redwraith111> and cedega
[10:56] <Redwraith111> thanks kensai haha
[10:56] <sic|> robertj: or you could just biuld a dedicated game box...only thing I have a windows box for is games...nothing else is even installed on it
[10:57] <topyli> robertj: sure. you get the wine release that runs your apps. the distros ship whatever seems to be available at relase time
[10:57] <nis> Redwraith111: I often start a second xserver to hot-key into when 'mom' shows up and there's um questionable graphics on the screen.  I have a wholesome environment at-the-ready with a single keybinding. ;)
[10:57] <robertj> sic: yeah, the only time I really play though is when I visit my parents so it has to be the laptop ;)
[10:57] <linux_galore> frankscorner is one of the best wine/crossover/cedega hack sites Ive seen
[10:57] <kensai> the best tool of a linux user should be google
[10:57] <Redwraith111> how can you run anothe rx server?
[10:57] <Redwraith111> you HAVE to tell me that
[10:57] <linux_galore> www.google.com/linux   the must know Linux tool
[10:57] <raetsel> amen to that kensai
[10:57] <Redwraith111> just for other uses
[10:57] <sippeter> HELP HELP: Where is this from: "Uppy, Stewie wants to go uppy"?
[10:57] <Redwraith111> i agree
[10:57] <Redwraith111> but it takes work lol sometimes
[10:57] <Redwraith111> anyway running another xserver? how
[10:57] <Redwraith111> lol
[10:57] <raetsel> and the google groups as well
[10:58] <kensai> gentoo gives cedega free from portage
[10:58] <Redwraith111> cedega from cvs.. is that eaaaaaasy
[10:58] <Redwraith111> lol
[10:58] <raetsel> well bye for now
[10:58] <raetsel> goodnight
[10:59] <linux_galore> Ive got a machine running Vidalinux.....its basically Gentoo made easy
[10:59] <Redwraith111> nis: how do i set up another x server? i would imagine is slow
[10:59] <robertj> old games are awesome, I remember how my monstrous p 133 with 64 megs of ram could play the 64 meg maps but none of my firneds could
[10:59] <topyli> Redwraith111: just run it. you can run as many X servers you like (if i understand what you mean)
[10:59] <Redwraith111> i thought you could only run one x server
[10:59] <Trixisity> It's kinda irritating, that mozilla keeps asking me on several sites to install the application/x-java-vm plugin, has anybody solved that/
[10:59] <kensai> Redwraith111, maybe you can take a cedega tarball from a gentoo portage mirror and ./configure && make && make install
[10:59] <Redwraith111> nah i got hte cvs instructions
[10:59] <robertj> I made a map a few years ago that took 10 minutes to cross with the main unit ;)
[10:59] <Redwraith111> have*
[11:00] <Redwraith111> is there a cvs package on ubuntu repos?
[11:00] <nis> Redwraith111: not slow at all.  I generally copy the exec ${HOME}/startx.d/_startx -- :1 > ~/startx.errorlog 2>&1 &startx script to _startx and then:
[11:00] <Redwraith111> i can just stick with what igot
[11:00] <Redwraith111> ill write a kill script
[11:00] <robertj> ok guys been fun, check yall around tonight
[11:00] <Redwraith111> or somethign
[11:00] <nis> bad paste
[11:01] <kensai> I just realized today thta from nearly 400 distros there existe there are only like 5 which are good
[11:01] <nis> Redwraith111: not slow at all.  I generally copy the startx script to ~/startx.d/_startx and then:  exec ${HOME}/startx.d/_startx -- :1 > ~/startx.errorlog 2>&1 &
[11:01] <Redwraith111> do you guys have to click on the title bar to bring a window to front or did i mess a setting?
[11:01] <petemc> kensai: good is relative
[11:01] <nis> Redwraith111: so the essential is (at the console) 'startx -- :1'
[11:01] <kensai> but is a better statistic than windows cause there only exist one and is worthless
[11:02] <geneo93> there all good just different use for them
[11:02] <sic|> Trixisity, http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=16230&postcount=48
[11:02] <Redwraith111> YES kensai
[11:02] <Redwraith111> im setting that s my msn
[11:02] <Trixisity> thanks sic
[11:02] <Brunellus> hey all.
[11:03] <sippeter> Fuck.
[11:03] <Brunellus> anybody running fluxbox in the house?
[11:03] <topyli> kensai: of the 400, probably 350 are very special-purpose custom distros to do one thing. then there's 40 beginners and 10 that count as something for the general public
[11:03] <sippeter> sowwy.
[11:04] <Redwraith111> lol
[11:04] <Redwraith111> i am installing flux tomorrow
[11:04] <Redwraith111> i want to play with it again
[11:04] <Redwraith111> im too busy tonight
[11:04] <kensai> topyli, and you take gentoo and make the one you need and don't need the othe 300+ worthless distros
[11:04] <syn-ack> The last time I ran flux, I was running Gentoo on my old G3 333 /w 98 Megs RAM
[11:05] <topyli> kensai: probably. i'm used to customizing debian for any purpose i'm building a box for :)
[11:05] <nis> Redwraith111: title-bar clicking is a function of your chosen window-manager.  Each has it's own idea about this.
[11:05] <Brunellus> I'm running flux now, and liking it
[11:05] <Brunellus> although.
[11:06] <kensai> topyli, good one debian and gentoo are the best to customize your needs I'm in love with both debian when I feel like not compiling in the box I put it ;)
[11:06] <nis> I like sawfish.
[11:06] <Brunellus> I'm trying to work out how to make it run dockapps when it starts without those same apps running when I run gnome
[11:06] <andrewski> xfwm4 rocks the house!
[11:06] <topyli> Brunellus: in ubuntu, do you get the debian menu when you install fluxbox or E or another simple window manager, or do you have to build a menu?
[11:06] <syn-ack> a base Gentoo install is about 1 gig, thats not bad if Im running something "custom" and I dont mind taking the space. For all other "custom" installs its Debian, seeing that I can get a base install of that down to about 500 megs
[11:06] <Brunellus> topyli:  you will have to build a menu.
[11:07] <nis> I use 'wmsetbg' from windowmaker tho.
[11:07] <geneo93> Brunellus:  you need some kde apps for that
[11:07] <topyli> kensai: yes
[11:07] <topyli> Brunellus: ah. not too bad still, at least with E
[11:07] <Brunellus> do NOT use the fluxbox .deb on the warty repositories
[11:07] <Brunellus> it is ANCIENT.  find a 0.9.12 .deb;  things will run nicely.
[11:07] <kensai> which version is enlightenment in ubuntu?
[11:07] <syn-ack> or if Im building my custom routers with a Soekris, I use Peanut linux
[11:08] <syn-ack> kensai: the same one thats in the rest of the world. E 16
[11:08] <syn-ack> kensai: I *highly* doubt E 17 would be in there.
[11:08] <nis> topyli: the 'menu' package does that I believe.
[11:08] <Brunellus> geneo:  why KDE apps?
[11:09] <topyli> kensai: nobody has E more recent than .16 i guess, except real E sportsmen :)
[11:09] <kensai> syn-ack, I was using e17 alpha in gentoo a few days ago from cvs and is going to impress everybody is so awesome
[11:09] <topyli> nis: comes with universe :)
[11:09] <Brunellus> what I'm looking for is a way to fudge the init script so that it runs wmix and wmcpuload when flux starts
[11:09] <Brunellus> but otherwise does nothing if I want to run gnome
[11:09] <geneo93> Brunellus:  fluxbox uses them
[11:09] <ikaro> sorry. fixed.
[11:09] <nis> topyli: for example I have full menus in blackbox (forced to use it because sawfish is broken until I finish the upgrade to ubuntu).
[11:10] <syn-ack> kensai: inho, E 17 is like the HURD... its the WM of the future... The future will never come though
[11:10] <Redwraith111> how is kubuntu guys?
[11:10] <topyli> kensai: E17 is very neat, i just hope it will be usable one day :(
[11:10] <Roey> Redwraith111:  ok
[11:10] <Riddell> Redwraith111: we're very well thanks
[11:10] <apokryphos> Redwraith111: great. :)
[11:10] <kensai> syn-ack, the hurd is the future in like 10 years more if they don't switch kernels again
[11:10] <Roey> apokryphos:  aren't you speaking on #kubuntu as well
[11:10] <Redwraith111> nice
[11:10] <Redwraith111> i like gnome
[11:11] <Redwraith111> ill try it someday
[11:11] <syn-ack> kensai: thats my point. :)
[11:11] <apokryphos> Roey: I am. :)
[11:11] <topyli> nis: i'm also quite accustomed to the (admittedly pretty unwiedly) debian menu by now, so that should be enough for me
[11:11] <syn-ack> kensai: Ive used Gnome since I was using RedHat 5.2.
[11:11] <kensai> syn-ack, ;)
[11:11] <Brunellus> geneo:  again, what do the kde apps have to do with what I'm trying to do?
[11:11] <syn-ack> kensai: Im quite fine with that. :D
[11:12] <syn-ack> Hell, Im thinking about using SawFish as Gnome's WM like back in the day.
[11:12] <geneo93> i dunno what your trying to do
[11:12] <neighborlee> I dont need concensus of a hundred people here LOL but just wondering what email client you all use and why...
[11:12] <topyli> syn-ack: i always reverted back to E before gnome got to 2.2 or so
[11:12] <HrdwrBoB> I use evolution and mutt
[11:12] <topyli> then it got better
[11:12] <HrdwrBoB> evolution because it's easy
[11:12] <HrdwrBoB> mutt because it rocks
[11:12] <nis> topyli: I generally use the Debian menu only to remind me of what's on the system; I launch everything in an xterm tho. ;)
[11:12] <neighborlee> I love evo but its horriby buggy here in hoary
[11:13] <andrewski> neighborlee: horribly buggy?
[11:13] <syn-ack> Evolution, bucause I thought all the others with the exception of mutt suck
[11:13] <garrut> thunderbird for me
[11:13] <neighborlee> andrewski, horribly buggy yes
[11:13] <kensai> syn-ack, gnome rulez
[11:13] <andrewski> neighborlee: which version are you using?
[11:13] <topyli> nis: well it's hard to find stuff on menus anyway :)
[11:13] <neighborlee> andrewski, it woudn't even 'reply' to emails right without giving a relay error and its crashed way too much
[11:13] <neighborlee> andrewski, latest that came with hoary
[11:13] <nis> topyli: The debian menu comes into its own when a visitor pops in and wants to use my machine tho.
[11:13] <neighborlee> andrewski, <IP_ADDRESS>
[11:14] <topyli> nis: well yes, it does have _everything_ in there :)
[11:14] <syn-ack> The only thing I use mutt for nowadays is internal mail though
[11:14] <Anubis> Err http://archive.ubuntu.com hoary-updates/main Packages
[11:14] <Anubis>   404 Not Found
[11:14] <nis> syn-ack: I've been using sawfish since I first saw it in GNOME yrs ago.  I like it.
[11:14] <EsK> hey how can i check my computer specs
[11:14] <andrewski> neighborlee: well, 2.2 is the latest stable version, maybe you should downgrade.  or, perhaps more stable would be going back to the 2.0 version.  using packages in hoary is hit-or-miss, and evo 2.1 was a development version, so i'm not sure what you expected. :P
[11:14] <syn-ack> nis: Those were the days.....
[11:14] <neighborlee> andrewski, its also slow'ish I find to respond to things unlike sylpheed or say thunderbird..but it might be that what came with hoary is bleeding edge and to be expected I dont know
[11:14] <Silvergun> so why cant you people give firefox its real fucking icon instead of some ulgy blue world that's missing the firefox
[11:15] <EsK> lol
[11:15] <EsK> true that
[11:15] <ells> anyone familiar with acidrip
[11:15] <kensai> Silvergun, the icon is not gpl
[11:15] <sippeter> My braces hurt.
[11:15] <andrewski> neighborlee: well, it's larger.  you could try balsa: email only, but still GTK+2.
[11:15] <nis> EsK: dmesg ?
[11:15] <Trixisity> wget http://copy.the.correct/url/from/your/browser
[11:15] <EsK> what
[11:15] <neighborlee> andrewski, I expect them to ship half way stable versions frankly even if its hoary ;-) ( considering hoary is stabalizing nicely now ) but hey that just me <wink>
[11:15] <Trixisity> what would he mean with that
[11:16] <warmfreeze> hi everyone
[11:16] <andrewski> neighborlee: if evo releases it, it ends up in hoary.  until hoary is stable, you can't expect stable *upstream* software...
[11:16] <syn-ack> Silvergun: iirc, the icon is NPL not GPL
[11:16] <Silvergun> kensai: oh. well tons other apps get their real icons, and the icon is seriously one of the coolest things about firefox.
[11:16] <ells> anyone familiar with the program acidrip
[11:16] <EsK> hey, can someone send me that script that shows you the computer specs
[11:16] <neighborlee> andrewski, yeah I know evo does quite a bit indeed and sadly thunderbird doesn't handle global filters making it rather pita to setup..can't win LOL
[11:16] <andrewski> ells: you can usually take silence as no. :P
[11:16] <Silvergun> so...figure out a way around it :P
[11:16] <andrewski> neighborlee: i'd suggest balsa... again.
[11:16] <warmfreeze> this is the coolest OS sence BeOS
[11:16] <warmfreeze> lol
[11:17] <ells> andrewski: are you trying to be rude man
[11:17] <neighborlee> andrewski, I might try just grabbing evo earlier and see or just go with thunderbird shrug....
[11:17] <kensai> Silvergun, nah is just one of my guess but the real firefox icon is not even used in gentoo
[11:17] <syn-ack> Silvergun: call Netscape and bitch at them if it makes you that mad.
[11:17] <neighborlee> andrewski, hmmm yes I know of balsa..Ill take a look
[11:17] <andrewski> ells: no, sorry.
[11:17] <ells> andrewski, just hoping someone had some answers. Will check back later
[11:17] <Silvergun> ite i will do that. thx
[11:17] <ells> andrewski, it is all good
[11:18] <andrewski> ells: it's just that typically repeating your question so soon after asking can be annoying. :)
[11:18] <Anubis> Err http://archive.ubuntu.com hoary-updates/restricted Packages
[11:18] <Anubis>   404 Not Found
[11:18] <kensai> Silvergun, tell us what response you get from the netscape people
[11:18] <andrewski> ells: but no sweat; i'm not trying to be a pain.
[11:18] <nis> ells: nothing is all good /pedant
[11:18] <Anubis> anyone have a hoary-update link in there apt source list?
[11:18] <syn-ack> kensai: no doubt that I would love to hear it. :)
[11:18] <Silvergun> kensai: k
[11:18] <ells> andreski, undestand, but sometimes when people typ over you and the text seems to sometimes get lost or unanswered
[11:18] <kensai> LOL
[11:18] <Silvergun> but wait, netscape and not mozilla?
[11:19] <syn-ack> Silvergun: Netscape OWNS mozilla
[11:19] <Silvergun> word
[11:19] <kensai> Silvergun, netscape are the fathers of mozilla
[11:19] <Silvergun> wait, ima check /. archives on the firefox icon
[11:19] <syn-ack> I thought everyone knew that.
[11:19] <Silvergun> i remember seeing somethign abotu it
[11:19] <Silvergun> I did
[11:19] <Silvergun> but i was jsut thinking mozilla would be in greater contact with the users
[11:19] <EsK> how do you pernounce mozilla, is it like, moh ZIL LAAA or like mozeeah
[11:20] <syn-ack> I dont see what the fuss is about for a damned icon anyway
[11:20] <Silvergun> EsK: dictionary.com
[11:20] <Silvergun> i thin it's MO zilla
[11:20] <syn-ack> its mo zilla
[11:20] <EsK> ok
[11:20] <geneo93> u can use any icon you want
[11:21] <EsK> where can u find a script that shows your comp specs
[11:21] <nis> mo ZIL a
[11:22] <syn-ack> Mozilla           [Derived from "{Mosaic} killer/Godzilla"?]
[11:22] <nis> EsK: dmesg
[11:22] <EsK> wtf is dmesg
[11:22] <andril> hello all
[11:22] <syn-ack> There you have it. Straight from dict
[11:22] <geneo93> just stick it in /usr/share/pixmaps/
[11:22] <nis> Mosaic was nice back in the day.
[11:22] <syn-ack> EsK: man dmesg
[11:22] <nis> Esk try it.
[11:23] <EsK> im not linux, this is my windows bot
[11:23] <EsK> box*
[11:23] <EsK> i got this box made for me, and i dont know the specs and i was just wondering
[11:23] <syn-ack> EsK: then let google be your friend.
[11:23] <EsK> i've been doing that
[11:24] <topyli> EsK: here's one: http://siltala.net/system-info.sh -- didn't write it, found it on the web. it tells you pretty much
[11:24] <nis> EsK: something in Control Panel maybe.
[11:24] <warmfreeze> bbl ..goign to go try this live CD
[11:25] <syn-ack> Man, Im in love with this box.
[11:26] <andril> does any one know the name of the Dock for gnome?
[11:26] <Silvergun> syn-ack, kensai, etc: it's something to do with its trademark
[11:26] <Silvergun> http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2004/02/msg01877.html
[11:26] <Silvergun> from debian itself^
[11:26] <syn-ack> andril: gnome-panel
[11:27] <Silvergun> Unfortunately it seems these icons and even
[11:27] <Silvergun> the name "Firefox" (and Mozilla even) are trademarked and can't be
[11:27] <Silvergun> used except with the official builds or permission of the Mozilla
[11:27] <Silvergun> Foundation (see http://mozilla.org/foundation/licensing.html and
[11:27] <Silvergun> http://forums.mozillazine.org/viewtopic.php?t=50876)
[11:28] <njan> according to the wpa howto on the ubuntu wiki, wpasupplicant is in universe, but I don't see it; is it in hoary and not warty or something?
[11:28] <Silvergun> that's what i thought all along, kinda ghey
[11:28] <Silvergun> http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v464/genocider/firefox_abstract_01_png.png kewl
[11:29] <cavediver> Hi. How do I disble the Nvidia logo under Hoary. I've added Option "NoLogo" "True" under Device section with no luck.
[11:30] <syn-ack> cavediver: for the most part you dont.
[11:30] <njan> cavediver, 1, not True.
[11:30] <Silvergun> uhhh...
[11:30] <njan> cavediver,         Option "NoLogo" "1" # Disable nVidia splash logo on starting X. <= that's what I have in my XF86Config-4
[11:30] <^thehatsrule^> :P
[11:30] <cavediver> njan: ok will do that, Thanks
[11:30] <njan> Silvergun, server split. One freenode server has decided not to talk to another. :)
[11:30] <njan> cavediver, yw
[11:30] <Silvergun> njan: I know lol
[11:31] <njan> Silvergun, :p
[11:31] <Silvergun> just funny when it happens in the middle of a convo
[11:31] <njan> Silvergun, indeed.
[11:31] <BockBilbo> hello??
[11:31] <njan> kornbluth has done this a few times today iirc.  I've been running xorg for ~18 months straight, but I need stable software, and I'm not hacking warty to bits just so I can use xfree in the few weeks before hoary's released :)
[11:32] <darkling> BockBilbo: It's the number of links to the file.
[11:32] <BockBilbo> of links?
[11:32] <BockBilbo> darkling, which kind of links?
[11:32] <njan> BockBilbo, hard/soft links.
[11:32] <Silvergun> aye
[11:32] <darkling> Hardlinks.
[11:33] <darkling> (_not_ softlinks)
[11:33] <njan> darkling, no? didn't know that
[11:33] <njan> BockBilbo, man ln
[11:33] <darkling> In this case, it's got one link from the parent directory,
[11:33] <njan> darkling, I suppose that makes sense, though.
[11:33] <darkling> one from the "." it contains, and one from a ".." in a directory inside it, I think.
[11:34] <Smeven> hi\
[11:34] <Smeven> I was wondering if libflash worked at all in amd64?
[11:34] <cavediver> Actually the NoLogo 1 didn't work. Is there another option in Hoary ?
[11:35] <cavediver> Smeven: I don't get flash to work on my system either
[11:35] <Silvergun> did you try it with the quotes
[11:35] <cavediver> yes
[11:35] <cavediver> Option "NoLogo" "1"
[11:35] <cavediver> Under device
[11:35] <Silvergun> prolly something different in xorg
[11:35] <cavediver> really strange.
[11:35] <cavediver> Maybe.
[11:35] <Dillweed> cavediver: did you restart X
[11:35] <cavediver> yes
[11:36] <cavediver> maybe that option is changed in x.org
[11:36] <Smeven> cavediver: i load the plugin and it just crashes firefox
[11:36] <_kees_> .
[11:36] <cavediver> oh ok
[11:36] <Dillweed> cavediver: here is the command from nvidia.com readme
[11:36] <Dillweed> cavediver: Option "NoLogo" "boolean"
[11:37] <cavediver> Yes i know. And from what i recall, it did work in Warty
[11:37] <Dillweed> cavediver: so I think you would do this option "NoLogo" "true"
[11:37] <cavediver> But after an upgrade it doesn't work
[11:37] <cavediver> Tried true
[11:37] <Dillweed> cavediver: then do a clt-alt-backspace
[11:37] <Smeven> Anyone know how I go about getting the flash plugin working on amd64
[11:37] <cavediver> Don't work
[11:38] <Dillweed> cavediver: what did u update?
[11:38] <burbuja> hi all
[11:38] <cavediver> from warty to hoary
[11:38] <cavediver> from xfree to x.org
[11:38] <Dillweed> cavediver: what does your xorg.conf say?
[11:38] <Dillweed> cavediver: can you dcc it the file to me?
[11:39] <cavediver> Dillweed: will put it on the web, hang on
[11:39] <Dillweed> k
[11:39] <njan> cavediver, the option doesn't change, xfree => xorg. My config file has been identical for both for the last ~6 months, apart from font-specific stuff.
[11:39] <njan> cavediver, No Logo 1 should work.
[11:40] <cavediver> strange
[11:40] <cavediver> http://helium.terminal.se/dump/XF86Config
[11:41] <Dillweed> cavediver: are you using xorg.conf or xf86config for the config file for X?
[11:41] <cavediver> hang on.. is it the wrong file I'm editing !!
[11:41] <cavediver> ohh, maybe that is the problem :
[11:41] <cavediver> I assume it was the same config as before..
[11:41] <cavediver> Aaaaahhh
[11:41] <Dillweed> cavediver: xorg use xorg.conf
[11:41] <cavediver> i see
[11:41] <cavediver> :)
[11:41] <cavediver> No wonder
[11:41] <njan> cavediver, :)
[11:41] <Dillweed> cavediver: your xorg log should show what file it is parsing.
[11:42] <phxguy> Can anyone help with the modprobe error??? I followed the instruction on ubuntuguide but i am still getting the error
[11:42] <Dillweed> phxguy: what is the error?
[11:43] <andril> hello all
[11:43] <phxguy> Dillweed: would the error show up in the system logs??? dont remember the whole thing but it says modeprobe fatal ..... device does not exist
[11:43] <syn-ack> phxguy: it will show in dmesg
[11:43] <Dillweed> phxguy: the only thing that I know about modprobe is if the hardware isn't there the module won't load
[11:44] <phxguy> hmmm
[11:45] <marcin_ant> hi all
[11:45] <marcin_ant> short question
[11:45] <shubist> congrats on knocking Fedora down on distrowatch.
[11:45] <Dillweed> but geez i really fedora and those rpm;s
[11:45] <marcin_ant> when can I find good howto about printer sharing on ubuntu?
[11:46] <marcin_ant> I got desktop with printer shared with samba
[11:46] <syn-ack> YAY! the net is unsplitting
[11:46] <njan> Goddamnit.. bittorrent is like Zeno's paradox, the transfer rate just keeps going down in the last 5%...
[11:46] <EsK> anyone got a script to show your comp specs to everyone
[11:47] <phxguy> anybody else have any ideas about modprobe fatal errors
[11:47] <Dillweed> esk: look on www.mircscripts.org
[11:47] <EsK> ] i did
[11:47] <Elysium_> phxguy, yes, wrong module, wrong hardware
[11:47] <Dillweed> tons there.
[11:47] <syn-ack> SYSTEM GNU/Linux, kernel 2.6.10-5-k7, GLIBC 2.3.2 | CPU AMD Athlon(TM) XP 2000+, 1658Mhz, 256KB cache, 3284 BMIPs | RAM 181MB of 1520MB Used | SWAP 0MB of 847MB Used | STORAGE 114G reiserfs, 761M tmpfs, 45M ext2 | UPTIME 1 Day, 17 Hrs, 52 Mins | LOAD 0.06 0.04 0.00
[11:47] <syn-ack> Like that?
[11:47] <EsK> yeah
[11:48] <EsK> wait no
[11:48] <phxguy> Elysium_: well how do i find out what its trying to load?
[11:48] <EsK> uh
[11:48] <Dillweed> your not using xchat though
[11:48] <EsK> yeah
[11:48] <EsK> nvm
[11:48] <EsK> anyone mirc scripts
[11:48] <Elysium_> phxguy, start from the beginning. what are you trying to do?
[11:48] <^thehatsrule^> EsK... theres a hell a lot of mirc scritps that does that
[11:48] <EsK> well i cant find any
[11:48] <Dillweed> EsK: try google.  Or use the nnscript
[11:48] <syn-ack> EsK: I would NEVER use mIRC on anything.
[11:48] <^thehatsrule^> then you dont know www.google.com
[11:48] <Nermal> EsK: google mirc sysinfo
[11:48] <Nermal> just use xchat on doze
[11:48] <phxguy> when i boot up i get modprobe Fatal  ...... device does not exist
[11:49] <Elysium_> and is that messing up anything?
[11:49] <Dillweed> phxguy: the wrong module is loading for your hardware
[11:49] <phxguy> Elysium_: it mentions something about pcielp
[11:49] <Elysium_> or you just want to get rid of the message?
[11:49] <syn-ack> phxguy: thats ok. thats hotplug
[11:49] <phxguy> but i followed the instructions on ubuntuguide for the error and i still get it
[11:50] <syn-ack> Its not loading the pci-x driver.
[11:50] <Elysium_> yea
[11:50] <Elysium_> usplash would be a nice hood to cover these messages :)
[11:50] <Elysium_> can't wait
[11:50] <phxguy> syn-ack: could this be the reason why my External USB drive doesn't always show up on my desktop???
[11:50] <syn-ack> phxguy: you didnt follow it correctly then, because that needs to be blacklisted.
[11:51] <phxguy> well I added it to the end of the file with those other things and saved the file....
[11:51] <phxguy> I will double check it suppose
[11:52] <EsK> [Operating System] :-[WinXP Pro (5.1 - 2600)]  [CPU] :-[1-AMD , 1499MHz, 256KB]  [RAM] :-[Usage: 175/512MB (34.18%)]  [Uptime] :-[Now: 24mins 7secs] -[Record: ]  [Resolution] :-[1024x768 32bit 60Hz]
[11:52] <EsK> [Free Space] :-[C 33.86/38.33GB] -[Total 33.86/38.33GB]
[11:52] <HrdwrBoB> EsK: please do not do that
[11:52] <EsK> my bad i was just checking
[11:52] <syn-ack> thats some uptime.
[11:52] <Elysium_> syn-ack, HAHA
[11:52] <EsK> whats is mean by 1-amd
[11:52] <^thehatsrule^> 1 cpu...
[11:53] <Elysium_> cpu 1 probably
[11:53] <shubist> sweet, i found 50 blank cds in my brothers room. I now have 50 blank rewritable cds
[11:53] <Elysium_> heh
[11:53] <Elysium_> I'm glad you're not my brother
[11:53] <syn-ack> shubist: nothing like a lil jack to make the home a happy place. :p
[11:53] <shubist> haha
[11:53] <Elysium_> "I found a girl in my bros room, now I have a girlfriend!"
[11:53] <shubist> LOLl
[11:54] <aspire> hello
[11:54] <aspire> i am using ubuntu
[11:54] <aspire> and have a windowze machine
[11:55] <aspire> Elysium_,
[11:55] <aspire> thanks
[11:55] <aspire> can you give me a hand here
[11:55] <phxguy> > # Added 21MAR05 - UbuntuGuide
[11:55] <phxguy> > pcihelp
[11:55] <phxguy> > shpchp
[11:55] <phxguy> > hw_random
[11:55] <phxguy> syn-ack: here is what i have in the blacklist file :::
[11:55] <aspire> i am connecting it peer to peer
[11:55] <nis> hehe
[11:55] <Elysium_> aspire, ask your question! :)
[11:55] <aspire> but they dont finde eachother
[11:56] <Nermal> aspire: crossover cable ?
[11:56] <Nermal> and they can't ping each other ?
[11:56] <aspire> Elysium_, no usb2 datalink
[11:56] <Nermal> HAR
[11:56] <Nermal> GFL
[11:56] <Elysium_> uhh
[11:56] <aspire> Nermal, usb2 datalink
[11:56] <Nermal> use ethernet :P
[11:56] <aspire> no i cant ping
[11:56] <Nermal> much easier :)
[11:57] <aspire> Nermal, i dont have ethernet but i hav usb2 and would like to use it
[11:57] <andrewski> is this forum descending into partial sentences and unintelligible drivel?
[11:57] <Jesterace> host[mana]  os[Linux 2.6.10-5-k7 - Debian 3.1]  up[41 minutes]  cpu[AMD Athlon(TM) XP 2600+, 1916.547 MHz (3801.08 bogomips)]    cache[512 KB]  mem[399.67/1012.24 MB (39.5%)]  users[1]  load[0.16]  procs[71]  swap[0.00/486.30 MB (0.0%)]  disk[23330.94/302610.68 MB (7.7%) (WDC WD1600JB-00GVA0)]  video[ at 1600x1200 (24 bits)]    xchat[Version: 2.4.1]   eth0[in: 19.14 MB, out: 1.09 MB]
[11:57] <phxguy> any ideas syn-ack ???
[11:57] <aspire> so i have the device set up drivers and the usb0 is up
[11:58] <aspire> still cant ping each other
[11:58] <bob2> Jesterace: please don't
[11:58] <aspire> what am i doing wrong Nermal
[11:59] <aspire> Elysium_, do you know
[11:59] <nis> bbl.
[11:59] <Brunellus> flux users?
[11:59] <Elysium_> aspire, I have never setup peer 2 peer usb hat way .. I'm not sure if you would need proprietary driver
[11:59] <Elysium_> aspire, did you have to install any drivers on the windows side?
[11:59] <aspire> yes
[11:59] <aspire> but i have the drivers installed
[12:00] <aspire> and it works


[01:25] <rwlove> My sound is not working on mythbuntu 9.04, I've tried debugging with the ALSA guys and had no luck. Can someone suggest how to remove and then reinstall all of the default sound packages?
[01:40] <Leebier> i am trying to move over from Mythdora to Mythbuntu and I want to keep my recordings, other than that i'm installing fresh, but i'm not sure what kind of partition setup I need
[01:41] <Leebier> this may be more due to not being familliar with the needs of Ubuntu vs. fedora rather than a myth issue...
[01:42] <Leebier> e.g., do i need swap, /boot, /, and /storage (where the last is not a required name, but it gets the point across), or is this a different paradigm?
[01:44] <Leebier> and, more critically, if i have LVM on my old distro, can i keep those partitions in my new one? or do i have to conform to 1 or more partitions per drive?
[03:47] <quentusrex_> I'm having an issue with mythbuntu sound...
[03:47] <quentusrex_> It works just fine for videos, but not for watching live tv
[03:47] <quentusrex_> I can see live tv just fine, just can't hear any audio...
[03:49] <quentusrex_> http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-835815.html
[03:49] <quentusrex_> same issue here....
[04:29] <CyberKnet> I just installed Mythbuntu 9.04 tonight, and after rebooting I Grub puts a message "Loading stage1.5." and then "Grub loading, please wait..." and finally "Error 15".
[04:30] <CyberKnet> I've been searching in google for a solution, but I have not found one yet.
[04:30] <CyberKnet> I have booted to the live cd and ran grub and issued a few commands to try to install grub again, but to no avail. (I can expand on what "a few commands" are if requested)
[04:31] <CyberKnet> anyone have any idea how I can fix this from the rescue cd? I let Grub use the entire disk (sda - new 320Gb sata drive)
[04:31] <CyberKnet> argh. s/Grub/Mythbuntu/
[04:41] <SpicyLemon> I did a fresh full install of Mythbuntu 9.04. I've got a Pinnacle PCTV HD 800i card and I can't seem to get it to work.  I been reading the wiki page (http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Pinnacle_PCTV_HD_Card_(800i)) over and over again and can't seem to figure anything out.  I've followed the instructions for the firmware and drivers.
[04:41] <SpicyLemon> My signal is cable and I've had it working on this same card before - different computer and mythbuntu version though.  I'm pretty sure I can't get any of the digital signals so I've been focusing on V4L.  I've tried various setups with and without a DVB capture card and can't seem to get anything that finds any channels on a scan.
[04:41] <SpicyLemon> Does anyone have any thoughts or pointers?
[04:41] <CyberKnet> no, but I'd really like to know how you got it to boot after installing from the CD :)
[04:42] <SpicyLemon> I did have a small bit of trouble with that.  It ended up that my first CD was messed up a little bit.
[04:42] <SpicyLemon> ... so I had to burn a second copy.
[04:43] <CyberKnet> were you getting an Error 15?
[04:43] <SpicyLemon> no. I can't remember what the error was. something to do with squashfs I think.
[04:46] <CyberKnet> did you use the default option for partitioning, or manual?
[04:46] <SpicyLemon> default, whole hard drive.
[04:47] <CyberKnet> seeing some really odd stuff on my boot partition... not expecting to see a "home" directory there
[04:49] <CyberKnet> and dev/sda6 looks more like it has a bunch of configuration files in it
[04:49] <CyberKnet> not /etc though
[04:49] <CyberKnet> not sure what mythbuntu directory this would be (mostly fedora user here)
[04:50] <SpicyLemon> linux is still kind of alien to me, I'm sad to say.
[04:50] <CyberKnet> directories that contain configuration files, rather - not configuration files in the root of it
[04:51] <SpicyLemon> well... I think I'm going to go get another coax cable just to make sure that's not the problem.
[04:54] <CyberKnet> good luck.
[05:22] <mythbox> Can't connect, can't log in: http://mythbuntu.pastebin.com/f58c28188
[05:24] <mythbox> I had a system which at boot would insist that it couldn't connect, give me the setup screen where it thought its own host was localhost (instead of the fixed IP) and the port was blank/3306 (instead of 6543)
[05:24] <mythbox> I deleted the mysql.txt instances thinking that I could run mythtv-setup to clear this issue up (as I wanted to use a frontend on another PC) and instead borked the system somehow
[09:41] <spoky99> hi all
[09:43] <spoky99> someone know how to modify o insert a frequency table for the scan? In mythbuntu 8.10 is missing italy table and... I don't found all the channel
[12:40] <Blaidd> I have a quick question.  I'm running into an issue where mythtv is writing files with an owner of nobody and a group of none.  I suspect it's happening when mythtv is transcoding the file.  Does anyone have any ideas as to why they might be created like that?
[13:20] <Drifting> Could do with some help, re frontends stopped working, all except frontend on server, yet I can telnet to the Mqsql server
[13:48] <spoky99> someone know how to modify o insert a frequency table for the scan? In mythbuntu 8.10 is missing italy table and... I don't found all the channel using the frequency table of other coutry
[21:48] <family-mythbox> Anyone here can offer a bit of help on 9.10 + mythtv trunk?
[21:52] <family-mythbox> for whatever reason mythtv can't find any movies in the /var/lib/mythtv/videos folder (not even after going to the video manager)
[22:03] <aliby> are there any videos in the folder?
[22:04] <family-mythbox> yes, bigbuckbunny and a big Lebowski rip
[22:04] <family-mythbox> I had a decent setup from mythbuntu 9.04 + mythtv .21
[22:05] <family-mythbox> I just noticed in my mythweb settings that I had no entry for "VideoStartupDir:"
[22:05] <family-mythbox> so I entered /var/lib/mythtv/videos, restarted mythbackend and ran mythfilldatabase, but to no avail
[22:13] <SpicyLemon> I have a Pinnacle PCTV HD 800i.  I've gotten the firmware, installed the v4l-dvb driver tree but I can't seem to find any channels.  I know the signal is getting to the card. All scans turn up empty on all channels.
[23:39] <aliby> any idea when I hit the skip button on my remote that it skips but also mutes the audio?


[14:35] <chilversc> how do I run the equivelent of "debian/rules genconfigs" for a single architecture?
[14:45] <chilversc> the instructions under https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Kernel/Compile seem to be out of date. I can't find debian/configs anymore as it seems to have been replaced with this new annotations system that generates configs for multiple architectures.
[15:06] <chilversc> Also, using the new "debian/rules genconfigs" how do I modify certain flags? With a ".config" file I could use use "scripts/config --disable", etc.
[15:08] <arighi> chilversc, https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/kernel-configuration-in-ubuntu/35857
[15:08] <arighi> if you are using a kernel >= lunar
[15:09] <arighi> just edit debian.master/configs/annotations
[15:10] <chilversc> I'm trying to script out something that doesn't need manually updating, so that I can just point it at the latest mainline tag and build for a specific architecture
[15:10] <arighi> or generate your config via `make menuconfig` and then import it with `./debian/scripts/misc/annotations --arch amd64 --flavour generic --import .config` (for example for arch=amd64 and flavour generic)
[15:11] <arighi> if you have the whole .config already you can this from your script ^
[15:11] <chilversc> previously I was just using; "cp /boot/config-$(uname -r) .config; make genoldconfig; make -j$(nproc) bindeb-pkg", but that's giving me issues with the latest 6.4-rc4
[15:12] <chilversc> I suspect its a missing flag that needs to be enabled, but the build starts failing with; "warning: 'nocf_check' attribute ignored. Use '-fcf-protection' option to enable it"
[15:13] <chilversc> which doesn't happen when using "fakeroot debian/rules clean; dpkg-buildpackage -b -nc -uc -ui -d"
[15:13] <juergh> chilversc: you shouldn't use make to build the Ubuntu kernel. Results might be unexpected or it won't work at all.
[15:14] <chilversc> yup, hence why I'm trying to switch over to using debian/rules; but all the instructions on the wiki appear to be out of date?
[15:15] <juergh> most likely yes. all the docs need to be migrated to discourse (we've been told)
[15:15] <chilversc> I was looking to grab the latest mainline, generate a config for a single architecture (and override certain options), then build all the binary packages (including debug symbols) for that architecture
[15:15] <juergh> and updated and fixed and what not
[15:16] <juergh> mainline as in our Ubuntu-mainline?
[15:17] <chilversc> I was wondering if I could grab mantic's Ubuntu-gcp-6.2.0-1006.6 to get the GCP optimised options, then upgrade that to 6.4
[15:17] <chilversc> yeah, I need test out some changes that have been merged into the latest 6.4 kernel, only there's currently a bug so I also need to apply a patch from the mailing list
[15:18] <chilversc> so unfortunatly I can't use the pre-built mainline packages
[15:26] <arighi> chilversc, ok so you have your config, but the build is failing with that control flow protection error, probably a toolchain issue I'd say
[15:26] <arighi> do you have CONFIG_X86_KERNEL_IBT enabled?
[15:26] <chilversc> I don't think so,
[15:27] <chilversc> Though I did want to move over to the proper build process instead of using .config and the old make olddefconfig, hence why I'm trying to figure out using debian/rules to build, but I only want a single architecture as I've not setup for cross-compilation
[15:27] <chilversc> so make fails trying to generate configs for arm64, etc
[15:29] <chilversc> also, the base generic config from mainline isn't optimal for gcp, so there's some extra flags I need to enable, and I can't find instructions on how to do that easily within the new annotations process (without having to clone the git repository and create my own branch)
[15:31] <chilversc> in the old .config process it was as simple as running; "scripts/config --disable ...", and I was expecting something similar with the annotations system, so that I can just checkout the mainline branch, override a specific config option then generate the config for my architecture
[22:18] <arighi> chilversc, you can still produce a baseline config from annotations ("./debian/scripts/misc/annotations --arch arm64 --flavour generic --export > .config"), then do all your changes ("scripts/config --disable ...", "make menuconfig", etc.), then import the config back into annotations "./debian/scripts/misc/annotations --arch arm64 --flavour generic --import .config") and at this point you
[22:18] <arighi> can use the regular debian/rules build process


[09:33] <Spass_Cosmic> testing wednesday - I'm on 18.10 install downloading 18.04.1 iso
[09:34] <Spass_Cosmic> probably a known bug, but Ristretto fails to change the wallpaper on 18.10
[11:31] <Spass_Cosmic> tbh I don't see a point in including 'Greybird-compact' Xfwm theme by default, and what's funny is the '-compact' version has 2px borders and the standard Greybird has 1px
[11:46] <Spass_Cosmic> anyway, was playing a bit on current 18.10 on my HDD and besides that Ristretto wallpaper issue it seems to run perfectly fine, also tested 18.04.1 ISO in VM and all was good too
[11:53] <Spass_Cosmic> well... I'll be repeating myself with those two, but this bug still haunts me - https://forum.xfce.org/viewtopic.php?pid=48223 and the panel plugin/indicator icons look inconsistent on big panels (I'm testing on 32-40px panel) </complaints>
[18:42] <knome> Spass, 10.10 wallpaper also visible after getting the max upload size bumped up; thanks again! (https://xubuntu.org/release/10-10)
[18:45] <Spass> looks good :) no need to thanks
[18:55] <knome> of course there is!
[18:55] <knome> again, every contribution is important :)
[18:58] <Spass> glad that I've inspired a positive small change
[19:25] <flocculant> bluesabre: just doing the missing tests - then we'll have a complete set
[19:25] <flocculant> and evening lurkers
[22:52] <bluesabre> flocculant: thanks! I'll get a few more spot tests in tonight or tomorrow morning, sleep deprivation depending :)


[10:49] <facundo__> ¡Muy buenos días a todos!
[10:49] <bthomas> morning facundo__
[10:49] <facundo__> hola bthomas
[10:50] <bthomas> facundo__: Just going through your dbinterface example. I may have a couple of questions and comments regarding it later today. I will post on MM or request a 1:1, perhaps after standup. Hope that is ok.
[10:51] <facundo__> bthomas, let's talk before, I will miss the standup (virtual meeting with kid's school) and later I'm complicated
[10:52] <facundo__> bthomas, I have a meeting in 9', it should take an hour, later I'm free
[10:52] <bthomas> facundo__: ok I will send you a calendar invite now. Will check your schedule.
[11:59] <JoseMasson> good morning!
[12:30] <bthomas> morning
[13:59]  * bthomas -> lunch
[14:26]  * bthomas -> back
[17:55] <cory_fu> I opened https://discourse.charmhub.io/t/versioning-interface-protocol-apis/3956 for discussion because evolving interface protocols over time has been a repeated pain point for me, and I'd really like to see this handled well in the new framework (at least doing a good job of promoting a good standard and making it easy to implement).
[18:25] <jldev> cory_fu: the last conversation about relation epochs was targeted at Juju. The idea would be for metadata.yaml to include an epoch range for each relation, and to negotiate the epoch on add-relation. Juju would then communicate the epoch into each charm, so they could have unique code paths (probably different classes)
[18:27] <jldev> The advantage to having this functionality in Juju, over a lighterweight approach in the Framework, is Juju could prevent a charm-upgrade from breaking a currently working relation.
[18:30] <jldev> We're actively working on a relation "handler" pattern in the Framework. being able to specify a class which handles a relation and provides its own events, observable by the charm. This pattern could be extended to support epochs by allow the charm to specify a different class for each supported epoch.
[18:30] <cory_fu> Well, the relation would only "break" if one side dropped support for the older version. That approach also means that the charm author has to keep the metadata.yaml in sync with the version of the library they're using.
[18:31] <jldev> The current goal of the handler pattern is charm libraries - for example, Prometheus will be able to provide a library which handles its scrape-target relation - so each charm author doesn't need to learn the innerworkings of the relationship, and write their own code.
[18:31] <cory_fu> If interfaces are libraries, then it seems reasonable for them to manage any protocol changes, as long as they have the tools to do so.
[18:32] <jldev> cory_fu: That's exactly the point of epochs, is being able deprecate and drop support for older versions.
[18:32] <cory_fu> Ah, fair.
[18:33] <jldev> Even with an interface library, you may control the code on both ends, but you cannot guarantee they are in sync. So you still would want epochs to isolate breaking changes
[18:35] <jldev> There's more benefit of having epochs in metadata.yaml, like being able to issue deprecation notices to all charm authors consuming epoch 1 of your interface. But that's a consideration for down the road.
[18:42] <cory_fu> The "handler" pattern for interface libraries sounds pretty much like what we've been doing so far (e.g., https://github.com/charmed-kubernetes/interface-k8s-service), and that pattern is close enough to how "interface layers" in charms.reactive were intended to work (though they should have been proper libraries, rather than layers... like everything else) that I recently created a "compatibility shim" to try to make it so interface
[18:42] <cory_fu> libraries written for the Operator framework can be used directly in reactive charms to help encourage everyone to adopt the new framework as much as possible.
[18:44] <cory_fu> https://github.com/juju-solutions/ops-reactive-interface/tree/initial-impl is the shim, and basically just relies on some entry point definitions in the interface's setup.py
[18:45] <cory_fu> It's still in review (https://github.com/juju-solutions/ops-reactive-interface/pull/1) / consideration stage.  I am worried about it being a bit of magic and potential fragility against changes to the framework, but I'm also willing to actively maintain it so that I don't have to maintain two copies of a bunch of interface libraries.
[18:45] <mup> PR juju-solutions/ops-reactive-interface#1: Helper for operator-framework focused interface libraries to be used in reactive charms <Created by johnsca> <https://github.com/juju-solutions/ops-reactive-interface/pull/1>
[18:45] <cory_fu> I'd really appreciate feedback on that.
[18:46] <cory_fu> And I'd also like it to become moot as quickly as possible as everyone updates their charms to the new framework. ;)
[18:47] <jldev> cory_fu: I had considered trying to work on something similar. But there's a lot of layers of the framework which would need to be repeated in Reactive for full compatibility. I'll take a look at what you've done when I have a few minutes.
[18:49] <cory_fu> It's basically just running a stripped down version of the actual Operator framework in the reactive charm, TBH.  The Operator framework is a lot lighter weight than the reactive framework, so I don't think it'll add much overhead at all.
[18:51] <cory_fu> There are definite caveats, and I really don't want to restrict interface authors in ways that will prevent good designs going forward, but so far it doesn't seem like it should place too many restrictions.  Haven't used it in anger, of course, but I plan to with the loadbalancer interface I'm working on.  Dev that from the ops framework perspective first and foremost and then fix up any issues that reactive charms run into in the shim.


[01:28] <LinDol> hi all :)
[09:08] <darkxst> jbicha, gnome initial setup shows up on upgrades also
[10:10] <jbicha> darkxst: yes, it shows up unless ~/.config/gnome-initial-setup-done exists
[10:11] <darkxst> jbicha, yes I realise that, just seems wrong
[10:12] <darkxst> like we should stamp that file on upgrades, not sure how though?
[10:12] <jbicha> many other distros don't have this problem because they began shipping initial setup years ago
[10:17] <darkxst> yeh because they don't have the overlap with ubiquity
[10:18] <jbicha> I don't think it really overlaps with ubiquity
[10:19] <jbicha> sure for a single-user computer, maybe we don't need to ask about keyboard and language
[10:19] <darkxst> perhaps we just copy the stamp from the getting started guide (which I assume is no longer used now g-i-s is used)
[10:19] <jbicha> but privacy and online accounts isn't in the Ubuntu GNOME installer
[10:20] <darkxst> true, its reallly just the language bit
[10:21]  * darkxst yaketty yaking on my laptop now ;)
[10:24] <jbicha> you can patch the autostart file like that if you want
[10:24] <darkxst> have a massive 16GB of data to use this month :)
[10:24] <darkxst> hmm, no I would just copy the stamp in the maintscripts
[10:25] <jbicha> on the other hand, people complain that Ubuntu and GNOME don't change very much so having something new even if it's not necessary might be good
[10:26] <darkxst>   lol, people will complain always no matter what we do ;)
[10:30] <robik> Hello. Is the the place to ask for help with (probably) GNOME ubuntu related issues?
[10:42] <jbicha> robik: yes but a lot more people use askubuntu.com so you may get better help there
[10:52] <robik> jbicha, okay, thanks :)
[14:37] <msev--> Emmm anyone of you guys using kdeconnect with gnome?
[19:40] <ouned> i cant login into chromium or gnomes online accounts (google) it always says "service unavaiable try again later"
[19:41] <ouned> this is with ubuntu gnome 16.10 but works on the same machine with windows or ubuntu gnome 16.04
[19:41] <jamie_1> let me give it a try... i ran into the same issue quite a while ago
[20:05] <jamie_1> have no issues on 14.05
[20:05] <jamie_1> *04
[23:01] <jbicha> ouned: I can't tell from your description but some times I'm affected by https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=771547
[23:01] <jbicha> rebooting is one workaround