[02:33] <PoetaVampiro> hi!
[02:33] <PoetaVampiro> I'm quite interested in udubuntu
[02:35] <PoetaVampiro> i will be teatching computers to first graders this season, kids with 5-10 years
[02:36] <PoetaVampiro> where can i get a list describing the software that will come on the cd?
[02:36] <PoetaVampiro> not the packets names, the desctiption, please
[02:37] <PoetaVampiro> is there anyone here?
[02:37] <PoetaVampiro> also i would like to talk to someone for advice on how to teach linux to kids
[02:37] <PoetaVampiro> (litlle kids)
[02:39] <PoetaVampiro> does anyone here teaches children?
[02:39] <Rondom> hello
[02:39] <PoetaVampiro> hi rondom
[02:39] <Rondom> www.edubuntu.org is a good start
[02:40] <PoetaVampiro> i've been there already
[02:40] <Rondom> edubuntu isn't finished yet
[02:40] <PoetaVampiro> I know
[02:40] <Rondom> I'm not an expert, I'm not involved in development, I'm only interested in the development
[02:40] <PoetaVampiro> Rondom, are u a teacher?
[02:41] <Rondom> no an a-level-student
[02:41] <PoetaVampiro> what is a-level?
[02:41] <PoetaVampiro> (sorry, I'm portuguese)
[02:42] <Rondom> acutally I'm not an a-level-student, a-levels are the equivalent in the english school-system
[02:42] <Rondom> a-levels grant you to go to university
[02:42] <Rondom> in Germany we call it "Abitur"
[02:42] <PoetaVampiro> I'm currently using ubuntu, and I thought that it would be nice to teach linux to the kids, because windows, they already will learn everywhere
[02:43] <Rondom> 5-10 is your target-group?
[02:43] <Rondom> gcompris is nice
[02:43] <PoetaVampiro> yes
[02:43] <Rondom> it's a set of educational programs for kids
[02:43] <PoetaVampiro> where can I find a description?
[02:44] <Rondom> Klettres helps learning the alphabet, but I'm not shure if there's a protugues version for the language output
[02:45] <PoetaVampiro> i think i found it :-) on google
[02:45] <PoetaVampiro> will it work on gnome?
[02:45] <Rondom> http://www.ofset.org/gcompris/
[02:45] <Rondom> yes
[02:45] <Rondom> I have it installed and I tried it already :-)
[02:46] <Rondom> klettres also works on gnome
[02:46] <PoetaVampiro> will it show on synaptics?
[02:46] <Rondom> yes
[02:46] <PoetaVampiro> great
[02:47] <Rondom> I've just checked
[02:47] <Rondom> theere's also portugues language output, install gcompris-sound-pt and you'll hear portugues lettres
[02:47] <ioio24> hello! Anyone had try to install Oracle Database over Ubuntu?
[02:50] <PoetaVampiro> i'm already installing it
[02:50] <Rondom> it has a ui suited for children
[02:51] <Rondom> the only disadvantag is IMO that there isn't enough voice-output
[02:51] <ioio24> PoetaVampiro: Do you install the "Oracle 9i Lite" version?
[02:51] <Rondom> but there are pictures everywhere
[02:51] <Rondom> so you don't have to read
[02:53] <PoetaVampiro> nope ioio
[02:53] <ioio24> Personal? Database? What version?
[02:54] <PoetaVampiro> ok Rondom
[02:54] <PoetaVampiro> thanks a lot for that
[02:54] <ioio24> ups sorry.. im confuse with your conversation...
[02:54] <ioio24> bye
[03:36] <PoetaVampiro> Rondom nice games :-)
[03:36] <PoetaVampiro> some of them are not well translated
[03:37] <PoetaVampiro> but they are very nice
[03:37] <PoetaVampiro> :-)
[03:41] <Rondom> the package kdeedu also contains some other edu-games, but most of them are for older pupils
[03:41] <Rondom> it contains als education-related apps
[03:42] <Rondom> including KEduca, a app for creating tests
[03:47] <PoetaVampiro> it would be nice to put some online games on the site itself
[03:47] <PoetaVampiro> i  plan to let the kids use the internet a lot
[03:49] <PoetaVampiro> since most of the applications i use, are integrated on firefox, why not let the kids explore the same philosophy?
[03:51] <PoetaVampiro> if they can find sites where they can use software without having to pay, and most of the times, simpler to use then large company made programs, why not? :-)
[03:56] <PoetaVampiro> we should have some kind of 'open flash' tool with better quality than the original one :-D in that way there would be thousands of games for kids
[04:00] <PoetaVampiro> on the other hand, the objective is that they learn some stuff they probably wouldn't without guidance
[04:02] <PoetaVampiro> and in that way, i was impressed by gcompris
[04:04] <PoetaVampiro> because most of the activities is oriented to an objective
[04:05] <PoetaVampiro> I have to try this with my 2 kids
[04:14] !lilo:*! Whelp, time to upgrade the testnet to hyperion 1.0 release!
[08:01] -NickServ(NickServ@services.)- This nickname is owned by someone else
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[08:35] <ball> hello JaneW
[08:35] <JaneW> hi ball :)
[08:35] <JaneW> hello jsgotangco
[08:36] <ball> hello jsgotangco
[08:37] <jsgotangco> something is wrong with X
[08:37] <jsgotangco> heh
[08:37] <jsgotangco> hmm
[08:37] <jsgotangco> hmm
[08:37] <jsgotangco> or just firefox
[08:38] <jsgotangco> my mouse pointer won't respond lol
[08:38] <jsgotangco> i'll brb first
[08:40] <jsgotangco> hehehe it wasnt working
[08:40] <jsgotangco> dohh
[08:40] <jsgotangco> hi all (btw)
[08:41] <JaneW> oh no!
[08:41] <JaneW> the dreaded X
[08:42] <jsgotangco> JaneW, it works i probably messed up something
[08:43] <jsgotangco> i was testing the daily build
[08:44] <jsgotangco> hmm i still got hit by #14007
[08:45] <highvoltage> oh yes, morning too, btw ;)
[08:46] <jsgotangco> morning highvoltage
[08:47] <highvoltage> hi jsgotangco
[08:47] <highvoltage> jsgotangco: you've got one of the most complicated nicks i've seen. i have to think each time i type it :)
[08:47] <jsgotangco> oh
[08:47] <jsgotangco> sorry about that
[08:48] <jsgotangco> my surname is indeed complicated
[08:48] <jsgotangco> i wanted to change it before but people people keep asking who the hell am i
[08:48] <jsgotangco> if its easier for you just say "just got tangoed"
[08:49] <ball> jsgotangco: do they still have that big orange geezer?
[08:49] <jsgotangco> ball, ?
[08:49] <ball> jsgotangco: It was an old Tango ad that used that catchphrase
[08:50] <jsgotangco> oh yeah i remember that
[08:50] <jsgotangco> heh
[08:50] <ball> (Tango was a British soda)
[08:50] <jsgotangco> yes yes
[08:50] <jsgotangco> i think they  still do
[08:50] <ball> hello jyap
[08:50] <jyap> hi ball
[08:50] <jyap> whats up ball?
[08:51] <ball> Not much, just thinking about going to bed.
[08:51] <ball> Hello jsg_ltsp
[08:51] <jsg_ltsp> there it goes
[08:51] <jsg_ltsp> hi JaneW
[08:51] <jsg_ltsp> :)
[08:52] <jsgotangco> he its just me in the client
[08:53] <jsg_ltsp> hmm its quite fast even in a small switch
[08:54] <ball> small switch?
[08:55] <jsgotangco> i have a pocket switch here just 4 ports
[08:55] <ball> 100baseTX switch?
[08:56] <jsgotangco> yeah
[09:00] <jsgotangco> 0825 build is actually good
[09:03] <ball> Oh dear, it's time that I was in bed
[09:03] <ball> Goodnight all.
[09:05] <JaneW> this laptop is making me furious...
[10:27] <jsgotangco> hmmm
[10:36] <JaneW> where's ogra again?
[10:37] <JaneW> more line trouble for him too?
[10:40] <jsgotangco> he left us...
[10:40] <jsgotangco> and gave all the remaining work to you..
[10:41] <JaneW> YAY :)
[10:41] <jsgotangco> so we will wait your upcoming packages
[10:58] <JaneW> did I mention it's a MANILLA envelope....?
[11:00] <jsgotangco> its only 1 L
[11:11] <JaneW> sorry
[11:11] <JaneW> my lack of spelling skills is surpassed only by my lack of typing skills
[11:11] <JaneW> although I seems to do 43 wpm consistently... how good/bad is that?
[11:11] <JaneW> seem
[11:12] <jsgotangco> JaneW, I can do 72
[11:13] <JaneW> no way!
[11:13] <jsgotangco> I had typing classes during HS and college
[11:13] <JaneW> and I still look at my hands most of the time
[11:13] <jsgotangco> with huge IBM and Olympia typewriters
[11:13] <jsgotangco> I could probably excel as a transcription professional
[11:14] <jsgotangco> and just forget about Linux haha
[11:14] <JaneW> I use 6 fingers... I am now aware of using more than that, but I am typing thing now to check, NOPE IT;S 8
[11:14] <jsgotangco> if you were trained to touch type, its quite easy
[11:14] <jsgotangco> although i can only do it in a US keyboard
[11:14] <JaneW> It's just the little fingers tha get ignored, the ring fingers do shift and enter ;)
[11:15] <JaneW> typing was seen as lame at school
[11:15] <jsgotangco> it also helps if i use a full size keyboard instead of a laptop keyboard
[11:15] <JaneW> and only the 'stupid' kids did it
[11:15] <JaneW> if only we knew...
[11:15] <jsgotangco> eh?
[11:15] <JaneW> it was one of the only subjects teaching a skill you could actually use!
[11:15] <jsgotangco> aaa ;;; sss lll
[11:15] <jsgotangco> asdf jkl;
[11:15] <jsgotangco> hehe
[11:15] <jsgotangco> have you heard of the game typer shark for windows
[11:16] <jsgotangco> its actually much more exciting than mavis beacon
[11:17] <jsgotangco> i also bought "typing of the dead"
[11:20] <JaneW> in our school it was only taken by kids who had dropped 'real' subjects like maths, accountancy etc, and needed something 'easy' to fill the gap
[11:20] <JaneW> what can I say it was an academic (read elitist) school
[11:20] <JaneW> now I know that was far from the truth and those who took typing have a distinct advantage
[11:21] <jsgotangco> eh?
[11:21] <jsgotangco> i also took accounting
[11:21] <jsgotangco> never had that much use of it
[11:22] <jsgotangco> JaneW, have you heard of typing of the dead
[11:28] <DanielC> Hello. I'm making progress, albeit very slowly.
[11:29] <DanielC> My thin client boots now, but I can't login.
[11:29] <JaneW> jsgotangco: huh?
[11:29] <DanielC> This is strange. I can't login even from a tty.
[11:29] <JaneW> DanielC: good to hear - glad mdz was able to help you..
[11:29] <DanielC> I get a "Login incorrect" message.
[11:29] <DanielC> JaneW: Yeah... :)
[11:30] <JaneW> DanielC: it's a pitty Ogra is not here again
[11:30] <DanielC> Still having ISDN problems?
[11:30] <jsgotangco> JaneW, http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&ct=res&cd=2&url=http%3A//www.planetdreamcast.com/games/reviews/typingofthedead/&ei=MeEOQ9jAMJOWswG40r2kCg
[11:30] <jsgotangco> oopps
[11:31] <jsgotangco> http://www.planetdreamcast.com/games/reviews/typingofthedead/ rather
[11:37] <JaneW> jsgotangco: looks like fun
[11:46] <DanielC> If I my ask, what is ogra's and mdz' role in Edubuntu? I noticed that someone on the list deferred to mdz...  Just trying to learn who is who  :-)
[11:46] <DanielC> if I *may* ask...  :-)
[01:53] <JaneW> what's up with my link....?
[01:53] <JaneW> must be the gale force wind and rain.
[02:03] <JaneW> DanielC: ping
[02:04] <DanielC> JaneW: pong
[02:04] <DanielC> hi
[02:04] <JaneW> DanielC: hi, did your question get answered earlier?
[02:04] <JaneW> re ogra and mdz?
[02:04] <DanielC> No, I didn't.
[02:04] <JaneW> ok, well I can shed some light
[02:05] <DanielC> :-)
[02:05] <JaneW> mdz is Canonical's CTO
[02:05] <JaneW> chief technical officer
[02:05] <JaneW> so he is in charge of everything we release
[02:05] <JaneW> and gets to decide what's in and what's out etc
[02:05] <JaneW> and approves decisions and delays etc
[02:05] <JaneW> we all report to him
[02:06] <DanielC> So the CTO is answering support questions on the list?
[02:06] <JaneW> ogra is the developement lead for edubuntu
[02:06] <JaneW> our CTO is very involved yes ;)
[02:06] <DanielC> cool
[02:06] <DanielC> you don't see that often...
[02:06] <JaneW> and VERY knowledgable too
[02:06] <DanielC> :-)
[02:07] <JaneW> the fact that he wrote (and/or customised) the LTSP package played a role in him responding in this case too
[02:07] <DanielC> ah
[02:07] <DanielC> If I may ask, what do you do?
[02:07] <DanielC> what's your area?
[02:08] <JaneW> I am a project manager
[02:09] <JaneW> so I am trying to co-ordinate all the bits of edubuntu
[02:09] <JaneW> and hopefully they'll all tie up nicely as we reach the launch date
[02:09] <DanielC> What's the difference between a project manager and a lead?
[02:09] <JaneW> it's about having lots of responsibility, but not very much control ;)
[02:09] <DanielC> :-)
[02:09] <JaneW> a PM watches the 'triple constraint'
[02:10] <JaneW> Time, Cost/Budget, Quality
[02:10] <DanielC> ah
[02:10] <JaneW> changing one always affects the others
[02:10] <JaneW> I only started with Canonical in April, so am new to this world
[02:10] <DanielC> Ok. Running a project is a balancing act, and your job is to find a good balance.
[02:11] <JaneW> I was working main-stream before, so this is quite different
[02:11] <JaneW> nod
[02:11] <DanielC> Do you like it so far?
[02:11] <JaneW> yes, but I still don;t understand everything
[02:11] <JaneW> I am loving using Ubuntu
[02:11] <JaneW> until I decided to d/l and install a program
[02:11] <DanielC> new experiences is what makes life interesting :-)
[02:11] <JaneW> and then I fnd I don't know what to do
[02:12] <JaneW> it's all so very different
[02:12] <DanielC> It's certainly different.
[02:12] <DanielC> I like the way installation works on Ubuntu/Debian better, but it's very different from other environments.
[02:12] <DanielC> Do you know how to install software now?
[02:13] <JaneW> I like to think I represent a large portion of the target market
[02:13] <JaneW> so if it;s made so I can understand and handle it, many people will
[02:13] <JaneW> (I am an above average windows user, and do have some AIX exeperience too)
[02:13] <JaneW> well I tired to install freemind, but I had a conflict so I eventually gave up
[02:13] <DanielC> Sounds like a good POV.
[02:14] <JaneW> I also installed flash and that caused havoc so I had to remove it again...
[02:14] <DanielC> :(
[02:14] <JaneW> yep, so no funky flash sites for me...
[02:15] <DanielC> Are you running Hoary?
[02:15] <JaneW> yes
[02:15] <DanielC> I see that freemind is not in the archives :(
[02:15] <DanielC> I guess that explains why it's hard.
[02:15] <JaneW> I have Breezy (installed beg July) but it has no sound...?
[02:16] <JaneW> so I mostly stick with hoary
[02:16] <DanielC> Installing from the archives is easy. Installing something that's not on the archives might be anywhere from easy to impossible.
[02:17] <DanielC> I got flash installed by following the instructions on ubuntuguide.org
[02:18] <DanielC> I think it's well written. The steps are clear and unambiguous.
[02:18] <DanielC> At least, I thought so... then again, I'm used to Linux.
[02:18] <DanielC> I've been using it for 7 years.
[02:18] <JaneW> cool
[02:19] <JaneW> I installed the default from a web page first (mistake)
[02:19] <JaneW> then I installed from inside ubuntu - easy
[02:19] <DanielC> :-)
[02:19] <JaneW> but it still didn;t work
[02:19] <DanielC> oh
[02:19] <JaneW> or at least it did, the falsh part was fine, but it made ff unstable and if I tried to edit a wiki all ff wondows would crash
[02:20] <JaneW> I need to edit wikis, so I had to uninstall
[02:20] <DanielC> That's surprising...
[02:20] <DanielC> and bad.
[02:20] <JaneW> yep
[02:20] <DanielC> A broken flash shouldn't kill ff.
[02:22] <DanielC> Well, thank you for the introductions.
[02:22] <JaneW> np :)
[02:22] <highvoltage> i wish i could know as much as mdz or ogra.
[02:22] <DanielC> I'm impressed that the people in charge are so easy to reach. That's very cool.
[02:23] <highvoltage> oh sorry, i'm replying to old messages PgDn...
[02:23] <highvoltage> i'm sure when I'm as old as they are I will though :)
[02:23] <DanielC> :-)
[02:24] <DanielC> highvoltage: how old are you?
[02:25] <highvoltage> 23
[02:25] <highvoltage> quite old myself, now that i think of it.
[02:25] <DanielC> prime of your youth :-)
[02:25] <DanielC> I'm a geezer. I'm 26  :-)
[02:25] <highvoltage> hehe.
[02:26] <highvoltage> i think prime was at about 8, from there it was just downhill
[02:26] <DanielC> I think 18-24 is are the prime years.
[02:27] <highvoltage> did you know, that when you're about 10, your hearing starts to weaken?
[02:27] <DanielC> no, I didn't.
[02:27] <DanielC> That's interesting.
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[02:32] (mpt/#edubuntu) "don't drink"
[02:33] <mpt> "be nice to your teachers"
[02:33] <JaneW> DanielC: even sabdfl hangs around in #ubunut-devel and talk to people directly
[02:33] <JaneW> it's literally and open company ;)
[02:33] <JaneW> highvoltage: so do I!
[02:33] <JaneW> s/and/an
[02:33] <JaneW> sorry more typos than usual - I am trying to eat lunch and read something ;)
[02:33] <DanielC> JaneW: Who is sabdfl ?
[02:34] <highvoltage> self appointed benevolent dictator for life.
[02:34] <highvoltage> aka Mark Shuttleworth
[02:34] <DanielC> Mark?
[02:34] <DanielC> :-)
[02:34] <DanielC> cool
[02:34] <highvoltage> aka founder of Canonical/Ubuntu
[02:34] <highvoltage> aka space traveler
[02:34] <DanielC> I hear Mark's a cool guy.
[02:34] <highvoltage> aka founder of shuttleworth foundation
[02:34] <highvoltage> etc :)
[02:34] <DanielC> My employer met him last week to talk about education.
[02:35] <highvoltage> well, if it wasn't for his hairstyle... but that's contraversial
[02:35] <DanielC> :-)
[02:35] <highvoltage> in south africa, two newspapers even had articles about the various bad hairstyles he's had before :)
[02:36] <DanielC> he he
[02:36] <JaneW> been lagged but technically niether 18 nor 24 are 'prime
[02:36] <JaneW> '
[02:36] <DanielC> JaneW: what's the prime then? :-)
[02:36] <highvoltage> damn. and there i though i had something to look forward to for next year.
[02:36] <highvoltage> DanielC: i think it's at 11% or something atm.
[02:37] <JaneW> prime = divisible by itself and 1 only :P
[02:37] <DanielC> he he
[02:37] <JaneW> so who's lost their braincell now!?
[02:37] <highvoltage> ah, yes.
[02:37] <JaneW> and I'll a cretin of 31
[02:37] <highvoltage> ok, so i'm at prime atm :)
[02:38] <DanielC> :-)
[02:38] <highvoltage> actually i like the even numbered ages better.
[02:38] <highvoltage> (or at least so far)
[02:38] <highvoltage> every odd year, i take on too much and end up doing way too much work. on the even numbers, i relax a bit and enjoy life.
[02:38] <JaneW> oh and yes Mark is a cool guy
[02:39] <highvoltage> (except for the hair)
[02:39] <JaneW> highvoltage: really?
[02:39] <highvoltage> JaneW: i'm quite sure the entire 12 plein street is in agreement about that? or are you objecting?
[02:39] <DanielC> JaneW: Do you meet often? I know he's in London. And Canonical is supposed to be based in South Africa.
[02:39] <highvoltage> JaneW: i'll find you those newspaper articles, kim still has them :)
[02:39] <highvoltage> DanielC: no it's not.
[02:40] <JaneW> Canonical is based in Isle of Man
[02:40] <JaneW> Mark is in London
[02:40] <JaneW> I am in SA
[02:40] <JaneW> as is highvoltage
[02:40] <DanielC> Isle of Man?  That's news to me.
[02:40] <JaneW> ogra is ain Germany
[02:40] <highvoltage> DanielC: they say so on the ubuntu site, and on distrowatch
[02:40] <highvoltage> DanielC: it's well documented everywhere :)
[02:40] <highvoltage> DanielC: it was even on slashdot a few weeks ago.
[02:41] <highvoltage> what do you do? AOL time warner?
[02:41] <DanielC> highvoltage: I take it that you work for Canonical too then?
[02:41] <highvoltage> ;)
[02:41] <highvoltage> DanielC: no.
[02:41] <DanielC> ok
[02:42] <highvoltage> I work on the non-profit side- shuttleworth foundation.
[02:42] <DanielC> FWIW I'm in Birmingham, UK :-)
[02:42] <DanielC> 2 months ago I was in the USA
[02:42] <JaneW> DanielC: cool
[02:42] <DanielC> 3 years before I was in Canada
[02:42] <highvoltage> but i'm jumping into edubuntu, and it's nice to be involved. i'll be doing more and more as i get things organised.
[02:42] <DanielC> and 9 years before that I was in Venezuela.
[02:43] <highvoltage> DanielC: what nationality are you?
[02:43] <DanielC> I'm a dual citizen of Venezuela and Canada.
[02:43] <DanielC> I'm special  :-)
[02:43] <JaneW> 2 months ago we were in London
[02:44] <DanielC> JaneW: Meeting Mark?
[02:44] <JaneW> DanielC: well meeting with him - we have met him before...
[02:44] <DanielC> I've just been to London once. I liked it.
[02:44] <DanielC> Yeah, that's what I meant, meeting with him.
[02:44] <JaneW> I sort of liked it, but found it pretty dirty surprisingly
[02:44] <DanielC> really?
[02:45] <JaneW> DanielC: oic, well then yes...
[02:45] <DanielC> I didn't notice it being particularly dirty. Certainly cleaner than Washington DC  (where I was located before).
[02:45] <highvoltage> JaneW: dirty?
[02:46] <highvoltage> oh, London. :)
[02:46] <JaneW> DanielC: see: http://www.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuSummitGallerys
[02:46] <highvoltage> hehe...i thought you meant mark.
[02:46] <DanielC> he he
[02:46] <DanielC> That would have been an interesting comment.
[02:46] <JaneW> highvoltage: yes I meant London was dirty as in grimey and sooty - no other interpretations please!
[02:46] <highvoltage> the station at westminster was *very* dirty
[02:46] <highvoltage> it made me think of Bellville station.
[02:47] <JaneW> ppl complain about SA being dirty but it's not
[02:47] <JaneW> we wash our roads!
[02:47] <DanielC> what's SA?
[02:47] <highvoltage> South Africa
[02:47] <DanielC> I thought you were in the states?
[02:47] <highvoltage> nope, we're in south africa.
[02:48] <DanielC> ok
[02:48] <highvoltage> we're too cool for the states.
[02:48] <DanielC> :-)
[02:48] <DanielC> that's a good man...
[02:48] <DanielC> I am too. That's why I left... :-)
[02:48] <JaneW> hehe
[02:48] <JaneW> DanielC: so you're a yank?
[02:48] <DanielC> Are most employees in SA?
[02:49] <JaneW> *run*
[02:49] <DanielC> argh!
[02:49] <JaneW> DanielC: nope
[02:49] <highvoltage> DanielC: spread across the world!
[02:49] <highvoltage> bye!
[02:49] <DanielC> No, I'm not a yank.
[02:49] <JaneW> DanielC: there are 5 Canonical employees in SA the rest are ALL over the world
[02:49] <DanielC> that's very cool.
[02:49] <highvoltage> JaneW: 5?
[02:49] <JaneW> Australia, USA, CAnada, UK, Germany, Norway, Denmark, Lithuania you name it...
[02:50] <JaneW> highvoltage: marilize, charles, morgan, eilise, adi and I
[02:50] <JaneW> 6
[02:50] <DanielC> Interesting.
[02:50] <JaneW> but elise is not full time
[02:50] <DanielC> It's a lot more spread out than most companies.
[02:50] <DanielC> So you talk mostly by email and IRC then?
[02:50] <JaneW> DanielC: there are obviously many more pple working for Mark in SA for HBD and TSF etc
[02:51] <JaneW> DanielC: yes, IRC, e-mail and wikis
[02:51] <DanielC> What's HBD?
[02:51] <JaneW> DanielC: and we get together 2/3 times a year
[02:51] <DanielC> TSF == The Shuttleworth Foundation ?
[02:51] <JaneW> Here Be Dragons www.hbd.com
[02:51] <JaneW> yes
[02:51] <DanielC> So you get free trips around the world?
[02:52] <DanielC> re HBD:  Ok, I see.
[02:55] <DanielC> The Edubuntu summit looks like it was fun.
[02:55] <JaneW> DanielC: well yes the company sponsors us to attend INSTENSIVE work weeks (7-12 days)
[02:56] <DanielC> So, the idea is that all the employees from around the world get together to work for 7-12 days?
[02:56] <JaneW> I found the hair article
[02:56] <JaneW> http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?set_id=1&click_id=139&art_id=vn20050209102227763C337661
[02:57] <DanielC> ok
[02:59] <DanielC> It sounds like working for Canonical should be an interesting experience.
[02:59] <JaneW> DanielC: see: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBelowZero
[02:59] <JaneW> that's the next Dev Summit
[02:59] <JaneW> DanielC: interesting it is
[03:00] <DanielC> So, you get to travel a lot it seems. That's very neat.
[03:00] <DanielC> I'm lucky to be employed at an open source company. It's a small business, but I get to work on FOSS all day.
[03:02] <JaneW> the travelling's cool - I just kind of wish it was 10 years ago
[03:02] <JaneW> (for me)
[03:02] <DanielC> :-)
[03:02] <JaneW> would have been much more fun (and free spirited)
[03:02] <DanielC> 31 is not a bad age to travel at.
[03:03] <JaneW> DanielC: agreed, but married, kids, cars, mortgage etc makes things less flexible
[03:03] <DanielC> I'm not far from your age, and I love travelling.
[03:03] <DanielC> ah
[03:03] <JaneW> so much more co-ordination involved
[03:03] <DanielC> Yeah... I see.
[03:04] <DanielC> I'm still single, so I can still move about with minimal coordination.
[03:04] <JaneW> right
[03:05] <DanielC> well, I'm glad you are doing something interesting.
[03:05] <DanielC> that's what makes life fun to live :)
[03:08] <JaneW> yes
[03:22] <DanielC> Is ogra still having ISDN problems?
[03:23] <DanielC> I'm stuck with a problem. I can't login from the thin client. I sent an email to the mailing list, but haven't had a response.
[03:26] <JaneW> ogra has responded go look
[03:26] <DanielC> ok, thanks
[03:27] <JaneW> I have a feeling ogra is knuckling down to work and so is staying off line for a bit
[03:27] <DanielC> "knuckling down to work" ?  What does that mean?
[03:28] <JaneW> 'nose to the grind stone' 'back to the salk mines'
[03:28] <JaneW> salt I mean
[03:28] <DanielC> ok, thanks.
[03:28] <JaneW> 'getting stuck in'
[03:28] <JaneW> got it?
[03:29] <DanielC> I'm still confused by some expressions :-)  Yes, I got it now.
[03:43] <JaneW> hi jsgotangco , been to the pub again?
[03:43] <JaneW> being Friday and all ;)
[03:43] <jsgotangco> lol no
[03:43] <jsgotangco> no more budget for the week
[03:43] <jsgotangco> heh
[03:43] <jsgotangco> im just going to spend the night trying to figure out my schedule and life
[03:45] <smykes> will alexandria be included in edubuntu?
[03:45] <jsgotangco> hmm
[03:45] <jsgotangco> im not sure
[03:45] <jsgotangco> let me check
[03:45] <smykes> I didnt see it on the list
[03:45] <smykes> and Im trying to get it running on my classroom ubuntu box
[03:45] <smykes> but it just sits there when I try and search
[03:45] <jsgotangco> smykes: if its the Universe repository, you can just download it
[03:46] <jsgotangco> the listing means that it has passed QA and security checks
[03:46] <jsgotangco> to be included in Main
[03:46] <jsgotangco> other than that, it is probably in Universe
[03:47] <smykes> it seems I have the latest version
[03:47] <smykes> its just kind of odd
[03:48] <jsgotangco> because?
[03:48] <smykes> it opens
[03:48] <smykes> it just wont search
[03:48] <jsgotangco> smykes: where did you get it
[03:48] <smykes> sudo apt-get install alexandria
[03:48] <DanielC> JaneW: Do Canonical employees often answer questions over the weekend?  Ogra's suggestion worked, btw. I can login from the text terminal. So now I'll start trying to fix the graphical login.
[03:49] <jsgotangco> DanielC: sure if they're online
[03:49] <jsgotangco> (its not like it has an office anyways)
[03:49] <JaneW> DanielC: there's generally always folk around on the week end
[03:49] <DanielC> Ok, thanks. Good to know.
[03:49] <JaneW> luck of the draw though
[03:50] <jsgotangco> smykes: oh its in Universe, if you encounter a problem, file a bug in launchpad.ubuntu.com
[03:50] <jsgotangco> smykes: via Malone
[03:50] <smykes> if I cant get alexandria working can you sugges another database app like filemaker or acces
[03:50] <smykes> only better then access
[03:50] <jsgotangco> im not sure ogra will be over here the weekend either...
[03:51] <jsgotangco> smykes: breezy will have OOo 2 with a database application similar to access
[03:51] <jsgotangco> its actually good
[03:51] <smykes> is that open office?
[03:51] <jsgotangco> yes
[03:52] <jsgotangco> OOo Base
[03:52] <smykes> what would I apt get for that
[03:52] <smykes> what name
[03:52] <jsgotangco> are you in Hoary?
[03:53] <smykes> I believe so yes
[03:53] <jsgotangco> (i wouldn't recommend it in Ubuntu 5.04)
[03:53] <smykes> whats the command line for os version
[03:54] <jsgotangco> uname -a
[03:54] <jsgotangco> put it and i'll see what you're using
[03:54] <smykes> Linux ubuntu 2.6.10-5-386 #1 Thu Aug 18 22:23:56 UTC 2005 i686 GNU/Linux
[03:54] <jsgotangco> you're in Hoary
[03:54] <smykes> ok
[03:55] <smykes> two more questions sorry
[03:55] <jsgotangco> sure (im not doing anything actually)
[03:55] <smykes> the database thing, I need to do inventory of all my instruments in the room
[03:55] <smykes> recomendations
[03:55] <smykes> and a content filter because sometimes students get on this machine
[03:56] <jsgotangco> inventory hmmm
[03:56] <jsgotangco> your linux skill level?
[03:56] <smykes> Im an OS X user
[03:56] <smykes> so low
[03:56] <smykes> ;)
[03:56] <jsgotangco> i see hmmm
[03:56] <smykes> I know enough to be dangerous
[03:56] <jsgotangco> im a filemaker user myself...
[03:56] <smykes> oh yeah I know filemaker
[03:56] <jsgotangco> i can only say OOo Base for a desktop database
[03:57] <smykes> but it costs money
[03:57] <smykes> this is a public school ;)
[03:57] <jsgotangco> there are loads of free software out there for inventory but it may require some skill....
[03:57] <smykes> yeah
[03:58] <smykes> just looking for something with a frontend
[03:58] <jsgotangco> im sorry i really can't say...
[03:58] <jsgotangco> i'm so biased with OOo base :)
[03:58] <smykes> heh
[03:58] <smykes> what about content filtering?
[03:58] <jsgotangco> content like adult sites, etc.?
[03:58] <smykes> pretty much
[03:59] <jsgotangco> there's squidguard...BUT
[03:59] <jsgotangco> there's always the BUT
[03:59] <smykes> oh theres always a but
[03:59] <jsgotangco> Edubuntu should address those things soon
[04:00] <jsgotangco> as for a stable desktop database, I'd wait at least 2 months :)
[04:00] <jsgotangco> because OOo Base 2 is really good
[04:00] <jsgotangco> you can actually download it for hoary but its horribly slow
[04:00] <jsgotangco> the GCC 4 transition did wonders on it
[04:01] <smykes> I have to say I love Ubuntu
[04:01] <smykes> its great
[04:02] <jsgotangco> smykes: Edubuntu however is a server environment
[04:02] <smykes> but the release date for edubuntu, I know it coincide with ubuntu, causes some problems for educators, summers is when we learn things
[04:02] <jsgotangco> ahhh
[04:02] <smykes> im not saying that to put it down at all
[04:02] <smykes> because its great
[04:03] <smykes> its just once school starts up, time becomes less and less available
[04:04] <jsgotangco> smykes: i hope you don't get disappointed with the initial release, our goals were minimal but we intend to grow with it
[04:05] <smykes> oh I know I wont be disapointed
[04:05] <smykes> and what you are doing is great
[04:05] <smykes> the timing, which isnt your fault, is just two or thee months off
[04:05] <jsgotangco> perhaps we can consider that next time
[04:05] <jsgotangco> we just coincide with ubuntu/kubuntu naturally
[04:05] <smykes> yeah I know
[04:05] <smykes> thats why im saying its not your fault
[04:07] <smykes> im going to try this bumblebe app
[04:07] <smykes> if I can get it running
[04:07] <smykes> something about GladeXML.pm
[04:08] <jsgotangco> smykes: brb i have a meeting with the docteam in #ubuntu-meeting feel free to come if you want
[04:09] <smykes> thanks
[04:09] <smykes> for your help
[04:38] <DanielC> I think I've located the problem. The thin client is mounting the file system as read-only.
[04:39] <DanielC> That's why other things are breaking.
[04:39] <DanielC> For example, when you login through the GUI, X will write a few files to your home directory, and if it can't it'll log you out. I've seen this before.
[04:40] <DanielC> Does anyone know how to make the clients mount the file system read-write ?
[04:43] <jsgotangco> he ogra any success with your dsl?
[04:43] <ogra> seems to work agaon :)
[04:44] <ogra> again
[04:48] <DanielC> ogra: thanks for the help.
[04:48] <ogra> youre welcome :)
[04:48] <DanielC> ogra: I can login from a tty now. I experimented a bit and it turns out that the problem is that the client is mounting the file system as read-only.
[04:49] <DanielC> Very strange.
[04:49] <ogra> no thats ok
[04:49] <DanielC> it is?
[04:49] <ogra> (if you mean the local filesystem on the client)
[04:50] <DanielC> But you can't write any files...
[04:50] <ogra> the login manager then opens a ssh tunneled X session
[04:50] <DanielC> Ok, then the problem must be on the ssh tunnel. I'll check the logs, one sec...
[04:50] <ogra> you can, via the chroot command on the server.... what you have on the client is /opt/ltsp/i386 ;)
[04:54] <DanielC> "Could not create directory '/root/.ssh'"
[04:54] <DanielC> The other lines in the log didn't look like errors.
[04:55] <JaneW> DanielC: you are awarded one of my 'Virtual Gold Star's (TM) for being the most tenacious tester we have...
[04:55] <JaneW> well done
[04:55] <DanielC> :-)
[04:55] <DanielC> Thanks.
[04:58] <DanielC> ogra: I don't understand most of the log, so I don't know what's relevant and what's not...
[05:16] <DanielC> Okay, I just sent the log to the list.
[05:16] <jsgotangco> JaneW: bah
[05:16] <jsgotangco> you award someone with a star while we toil with your whip
[05:17] <DanielC> :-)
[05:20] <DanielC> jsgotangco: I take it you work for Canonical?
[05:21] <jsgotangco> no
[05:21] <DanielC> ok
[05:21] <jsgotangco> i have met them though
[05:22] <DanielC> ok
[05:22] <DanielC> are you developer then?
[05:23] <jsgotangco> sort of
[05:23] <DanielC> :-)
[05:23] <jsgotangco> i was part of the original Edubuntu spec writers
[05:23] <DanielC> cool
[05:23] <DanielC> do you have experience in education?
[05:23] <jsgotangco> no its my interest though
[05:24] <DanielC> ok
[05:24] <DanielC> that still works :-)
[05:24] <jsgotangco> i don't know why exactly..probably its because i already have a child
[05:25] <DanielC> are you a volunteer?
[05:25] <jsgotangco> yes
[05:26] <jsgotangco> i didnt get that much quality education either but i can say i have fared well...
[05:27] <DanielC> I'm interested in education :-)
[05:27] <DanielC> It's certainly an important area to work on.
[05:27] <jsgotangco> well yes, in my home country, we don't even have that much labs in public schools
[05:27] <jsgotangco> or a computer even (sad)
[05:28] <DanielC> which one is your home country?
[05:28] <jsgotangco> Philippines
[05:28] <DanielC> ok
[05:29] <DanielC> I grew up in Venezuela, so I'm familiar with the idea of schools with no resources.
[05:29] <jsgotangco> yeah its sad really
[05:29] <DanielC> Though I was lucky enough to go to a private school, I know that most of my contemporaries weren't as lucky.
[05:29] <jsgotangco> i was in my hometown this morning and nothing really changed in my old school
[07:13] <jsgotangco> night
[08:55] <DanielC> ogra rocks
[08:55] <DanielC> :-)
[08:56] <ogra> heh, thanks :)
[08:56] <DanielC> Will I have to update the ssh keys often?
[08:56] <ogra> nope, only if you change the ip
[08:56] <ogra> (or name if DNS in your localnet is working)
[08:57] <DanielC> ok
[08:58] <DanielC> We want to deploy this at a local school. They are aware that this is a bit of an experiment. Our deal with them is that they only pay for hardware and they allow us to use their school to learn how to setup thin clients.
[08:58] <DanielC> But of course I want to make the experience positive for them. I want them to like Linux :-)
[08:58] <ogra> :)


[03:53] <lotuspsychje> good morning
[04:53] <Maik> good morning
[06:22] <ducasse> good morning
[22:06] <guiverc> FYI: with supporting users; in the future, amd64 ISOs won't display messages if booted on i386 boxes (older ISOs report "This kernel requires an x86-64 CPU, but only detected an i686 CPU"  no longer applies in groovy lp 1895956
[22:29] <oerheks> yay ..


[18:18] <saiarcot895> Just to check, for a package to be truly multiarch, a Multi-Arch property has to be set, right?


[15:01] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Planet:: Alan Pope: Distrowatch is Not a Measure of Popularity @ https://popey.com/blog/2021/01/distrowatch-is-not-a-measure-of-popularity/


[06:18] <pitti> Bonjour tous le monde !
[06:23] <didrocks> bonjour pitti !
[06:26] <pitti> bonjour didrocks, ça va ?
[06:26] <didrocks> ça va bien, et toi ?
[06:27] <pitti> didrocks: je vais grand ! c'était un miracle :)
[06:27] <didrocks> pitti: ah, il y a eu un match ?
[06:27]  * didrocks googles
[06:27] <didrocks> 7-1, sérieux ?
[06:28] <pitti> didrocks: we won against Brazil, very tightly :)
[06:28] <didrocks> c'était du handball, pas du foot, non ? :p
[06:28] <pitti> didrocks: yeah, the first half was the best our team ever played - 5:0
[06:28] <pitti> it was unbelievable, *everything* just worked
[06:29] <pitti> at least Brazil managed to get a goal in the 91st minute
[06:29] <didrocks> waow, I guess there are a lot of cries in Brazil after such a defeat
[06:29] <didrocks> ah, even worse :)
[06:29] <pitti> absolutely, yes
[06:29] <didrocks> really at the last minute they avoided the -0
[06:29] <pitti> in the end, the Brazilian fans cheered for the German goals..
[06:30] <didrocks> yeah, seems that google is telling they were approximately the same number of shoot in the goals
[06:30] <didrocks> so the German goal should have been very effective
[06:30] <didrocks> I understand why you are connecting later than usual :)
[06:30] <didrocks> good celebration!
[06:42] <pitti> didrocks: yeah, I only went to bed around midnight, and then couldn't sleep for some time
[06:42] <didrocks> heh, too much excitement I guess :)
[06:43] <pitti> didrocks: that, and all the car horning outside
[06:44] <didrocks> ahah, I bet!
[06:48] <seb128> good morning desktopers!
[06:48] <seb128> hey pitti didrocks
[06:48] <seb128> pitti, well done for the game :-)
[06:49] <pitti> bonjour seb128
[06:49] <pitti> seb128: that's an understatement, but thanks!
[06:49] <didrocks> salut seb128!
[06:49] <pitti> at the 4:0 I thought they were showing a repetition, but in general it was quite incredible
[06:50] <pitti> like those 10 minutes in a player's life when just everything works
[06:50] <seb128> right
[06:50] <seb128> or doesn't work in the case of Brazil
[06:50] <seb128> seems like it was not their day at the same time it was Germany's one
[06:51] <pitti> seb128: yeah; well, some things just can't be explained (or repeated)
[06:51] <seb128> (let's see if they repeat that on sunday ;-)
[06:56] <pitti> seb128: see, that's the expectation of 80 million people which will ruin everything :)
[06:56] <pitti> seb128: nah, really good chances now
[06:58] <seb128> right, first let's see who wins tonight
[08:02] <Laney> hey
[08:04] <didrocks> hey Laney!
[08:04] <pitti> hey Laney
[08:04] <Laney> hey didrocks et pitti
[08:04] <Laney> how's it going?
[08:04] <didrocks> I'm great, thanks! Yourself?
[08:04] <Laney> sunny and warm here!
[08:05] <Laney> sehr gut, danke
[08:05]  * didrocks doesn't wonder anymore where the sun was stolen then…
[08:05] <Eisbrecher_xnox> Morning =)
[08:05]  * Eisbrecher_xnox is in the office and it's full of CTS people
[08:06] <pitti> yeah, it has rained pretty much non-stop since yesterday here too
[08:06] <pitti> o_O "Eisbrecher"?
[08:19] <Laney> pitti: can I mock bus activated services with dbusmock somehow?
[08:20] <pitti> Laney: you mean the activation part? I guess you could start a dbus daemon with a different .service dir and put an appropriate service file there?
[08:21] <pitti> Laney: but this pretty much sounds like a D-BUS internal, so I never bothered about that and just manually started the mocks
[08:21] <Eisbrecher_xnox> pitti: Das ist meine Familienname im Deutsch ;-)
[08:21] <pitti> Eisbrecher_xnox: really, "Ledkovs"? haha
[08:21] <Eisbrecher_xnox> pitti: *Ledkov, yeah.
[08:21] <pitti> Eisbrecher_xnox: ah, I thought the "original" one was
[08:22] <pitti> fun!
[08:23] <seb128> Laney, hey ;-)
[08:23] <Laney> pitti: we had a bug where the application wasn't re-activating the service properly so I wanted to write a testcase for this
[08:23] <Laney> hey hey seb128
[08:23] <Laney> how are you?
[08:24] <seb128> Laney, good! a bit tired though, but working on it with coffee ;-)
[08:24] <seb128> how are you?
[08:25] <pitti> Laney: hm, so dbusmock has no particular support for this, so I'm afraid you have to write the session.conf manually
[08:25] <pitti> Laney: happy to hear suggestions how to make this easier, of course
[08:25] <Laney> seb128: it's this new early morning regime :P
[08:26] <pitti> as newly self-declared German he now needs to get up at 6!
[08:26] <seb128> Laney, well, things were alright, until that visa stuff kept me up until 1h30 (my fault for starting to look at what is needed exactly after the game at midnight)
[08:26]  * seb128 hates paperwork like that
[08:26] <Laney> but yeah, I'm good
[08:26] <seb128> pitti, lol
[08:26] <Laney> going to go out before lunch to print/fill in/submit that stuff
[08:27] <Laney> need to get a picture taken too
[08:27] <pitti> seb128: Visa? Où vas-tu ?
[08:28] <seb128> pitti, China, going to visit the office and work a bit with Kylin
[08:28] <pitti> seb128: oh, fun! I've never been there either
[08:29] <Laney> pitti: I was thinking of an API which lets you register a callback to start a service
[08:29] <Laney> I guess the interesting part is emitting the NameOwnerChanged and other signals
[08:34] <pitti> Laney: your test can of course start and stop the mock whenever it likes
[08:34] <Laney> ya, I could do that and send the signals manually
[08:35] <pitti> but that's hard to hook into when the programunder test actually needs it
[08:35] <Laney> indeed
[08:35] <pitti> Laney: dbusmock already writes a dbus config file etc., perhaps some extra kwargs will make this easy?
[08:37] <Laney> pitti: I'll look into it a bit and get back to you
[08:38] <Laney> I think we'll end up having to write out .service files and specify a custom directory for those in the config file (assuming that's possible)
[08:38] <Laney> Might get a bit complicated
[08:55] <pitti> seb128: haha! http://www.google.de
[08:55] <pitti> (not sure if you can see that)
[08:55] <seb128> pitti, dancing letters with german hats, etc?
[08:55] <pitti> yeah
[08:55] <seb128> ;-)
[08:56] <ogra_> lol
[09:06] <rsalveti> com.br is just pure and plain 'google'
[09:06] <rsalveti> hahah
[09:07] <Sweetshark> How many letters are in the word "Germany"?
[09:13] <ogra_> rsalveti, surprising ... since half the stadium cheered for germany in the end
[09:13] <seb128> rsalveti, enough disappointment without having google mocking you
[09:13] <ogra_> (which i found really awful)
[09:13] <rsalveti> ogra_: but still, it was really painful
[09:13] <ogra_> yeah
[09:14] <rsalveti> never saw such disaster happening with our football
[09:14] <ogra_> i still dont get why ...
[09:14] <ogra_> its not like there were bad players on the field or anything ...
[09:14] <rsalveti> blame our coach, he thought he didn't have to improve the defense tactics when playing against germany
[09:15] <seb128> well, the Brazil team has not been that strong in that worldcup
[09:15] <rsalveti> but I don't blame the players itself, the tactics was completely wrong
[09:15] <seb128> they mainly relied on some keys players who were missing yesterdays
[09:15] <pitti> at some point this just isn't explicable any more, but I guess a good deal this is about having a ridiculous mental pressure and losing faith after the first goal
[09:15] <seb128> that and got some luck/help from referees
[09:16] <rsalveti> yeah, tiago not playing made a huge difference
[09:16] <ogra_> yup
[09:16] <rsalveti> more than neymar
[09:16] <pitti> but their defence was rather nonexisting indeed; it felt like Brazil kept half their team at the German goal to score and forgot to cover the German players
[09:16] <rsalveti> pitti: exactly
[09:16] <ogra_> well, the neymar factor was psychological ...
[09:16] <ogra_> and surely had a lot of impact too
[09:17] <pitti> well, Neymar might have scored more, but I guess the loss of Silva might have been much more important
[09:17] <rsalveti> yeah
[09:17] <ogra_> even though he didnt really do much in many games
[09:17] <rsalveti> just unbelievable
[09:17] <pitti> well, it's again psychology; if your "captain" of defense isn't there, self-confidence suffers
[09:17] <ogra_> yeah
[09:18] <pitti> and I suppose they were really eager to score early and often to revenge Neymar, and over that just forgot to defend
[09:18] <ogra_> and the pressure "you need to compensate the star" from all sides in the press etc
[09:18] <rsalveti> yeah, they wanted to make the goal but forgot to defend
[09:18] <rsalveti> against... germany
[09:18] <rsalveti> lol
[09:19] <pitti> I suppose they wanted something like in the first minutes of second half very early on
[09:20] <pitti> where they had like 5 shoots at the goal
[09:20] <rsalveti> yeah
[09:20] <ogra_> yup
[09:20] <rsalveti> but at that time the german team was already thinking about the next match
[09:20] <ogra_> haha
[09:21] <pitti> rsalveti: anyway, good luck on Saturday! won't be much easier against Argentina or the Netherlands, but certainly not such a disaster again
[09:21] <rsalveti> haha, we'll see
[09:22] <ogra_> yeah, no more pressure ...
[09:22] <ogra_> and thiago is back
[09:22] <pitti> rsalveti: I still remember our amazement when Caesar caught 3 penalty shots
[09:22] <rsalveti> wow, someone won the bet: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BsDl4dWIYAAJR4x.jpg
[09:23] <rsalveti> pitti: yeah, that was a great match
[09:23] <pitti> *shakes head*
[09:23] <ogra_> khedira didnt score though, did he ?
[09:23] <pitti> sure he did
[09:24] <pitti> wasn't it the 5th?
[09:24] <ogra_> oh, i only remember that he shot kroos in the back :)
[09:24] <ogra_> there were so many goals :(
[09:24] <rsalveti> yeah, he did score
[09:24]  * ogra_ lost the overview
[09:25] <pitti> ogra_: yeah, it chuckled when the status bar became too small and they had to scroll
[09:25] <ogra_> haha, yeah
[09:25] <ogra_> well, at least they could make use of that feature once :)
[09:25] <pitti> but weird on what things people bet
[09:26] <ogra_> yup ... but he/she made a lot out of $20 :)
[09:28]  * ogra_ was only 4 goals off with his 3:1 prediction ...
[11:58] <davmor2> ogra_: yeah but I bet that seb128 is permanently based your side of the river for now :)  It would be nice to see an all European final.  Especially as there is no rivalry between the Germans and Dutch right
[11:59] <ogra_> heh, yeah, no rivalry evar :P
[11:59]  * ogra_ really wishes for arg in the final ... that means we have all of brazil behind us against them ;)
[12:00] <davmor2> ogra_: hahaha
[13:00] <ChrisTownsend> seb128: Hi!  What are the next steps on getting the Trusty Compiz SRU promoted to -updates?  I think sil2100 may have been working on this, but he didn't respond to my ping yesterday.
[13:01] <seb128> ChrisTownsend, hey
[13:01] <sil2100> ChrisTownsend: hey! I might have missed that, yeah, I looked into it and it was strange that this bug was still tracked
[13:01] <seb128> ChrisTownsend, http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/pending-sru.html indicates it's 6 days old, so 1 day to wait, and 1 bug is not marked as validated
[13:01] <sil2100> seb128: that bug shouldn't be there...
[13:01] <sil2100> seb128: I think something strange happened with the changelog ;/
[13:01] <seb128> if that's a bug, just tag it verification-done and untag once it migrates
[13:02] <sil2100> Ah, ok, such an override?
[13:02] <seb128> well "override"
[13:02] <seb128> it's just going to make it validated
[13:02] <sil2100> ChrisTownsend: since I checked quickly and it seems that you have an UNRELEASED entry in your changelog contents besides the latest version, which is strange
[13:02] <ChrisTownsend> Right, that bug shouldn't be there.  It was reverted and a new Compiz package was uploaded, but it seems the SRU tools don't take that into account.
[13:02] <seb128> or tell the sru team to ignore it and do the copy
[13:03] <ChrisTownsend> sil2100: The UNRELEASED is due to some version bump stuff we needed to do.  Since we are on the ci-train, we just can't bump the version and push to trunk.
[13:04] <ChrisTownsend> seb128: Ok, thanks.  Will wait until tomorrow then.
[13:04] <ChrisTownsend> sil2100: Thanks for looking into this.
[13:09] <sil2100> ChrisTownsend: hm, what exactly was the problem when dealing with it with CI Train? You wanted to bump the version?
[13:12] <ChrisTownsend> sil2100: I realized I need to bump the version after we already started the ci-train process and we thought it better to add the version bump as a separate MP.   This usually works in that it is all contained in one changelog stanza, but I think since we already had previous builds, it decided to create a separate stanza for just the version bump and left the previous stanza as UNRELEASED when it should have be
[13:17] <sil2100> ChrisTownsend: yeah, so hm, the order of merges is also important so most probably in this case the version bump in the changelog should be the first merge on the list I guess
[13:18] <ChrisTownsend> sil2100: Yeah, could be that.
[13:19] <sil2100> ChrisTownsend: I just hope the SRU team won't kill us for this
[13:19] <ChrisTownsend> sil2100: It's ok, I already got it approved from SRU team.
[13:19] <seb128> yeah, that SRU is validated, should be ok
[13:20] <ChrisTownsend> The only thing is that they made me do the "needs verification" stuff in the bug since he couldn't run his tools in the new changelog stanza.
[13:21] <ChrisTownsend> Which is ok since this is the 3rd spin of the SRU:)
[13:23] <greyback> hey folks, I ran out of disk space and my dconf database has got corrupted
[13:23] <greyback> how do I reset it?
[13:24] <greyback> "Cannot open dconf database: invalid gvdb header" is the error I'm getting everywhere
[13:28] <seb128> desrt, ^
[13:28] <seb128> Laney, what's the issue on http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/battery.png with the previous date data? you mean the | is not really aligned on the mark?
[13:30] <Laney> it turns back on itself
[13:30] <desrt> uh oh
[13:30] <seb128> oh, you mean the curve itself
[13:30] <seb128> wth
[13:30] <desrt> seb128: 0-length file in ~/.config/dconf ?
[13:31] <desrt> and if so, what is your weird filesystem config?
[13:31] <seb128> desrt, you are asking the wrong person, I was just pinging
[13:31] <greyback> desrt: yep, user is size 0
[13:31] <seb128> Laney, and that doesn't happen with the previous version?
[13:31] <desrt> greyback: what fs setup?
[13:32] <greyback> desrt: home with encryptfs
[13:32] <desrt> sounds like a bug....
[13:32] <Laney> seb128: don't know ...
[13:32] <Laney> you don't want to try and fix it?
[13:32] <greyback> desrt: who should I log it against? And how can I recover? Just delete that file?
[13:32] <seb128> Laney, can you go back to the archive version and see if that still happens?
[13:32] <desrt> greyback: are there any other tmp files around there?
[13:33] <seb128> Laney, I would if I could reproduce, no idea how to debug without having it
[13:33] <desrt> user.XXXXXX stuff?
[13:33] <greyback> desrt: no
[13:33] <desrt> :(
[13:33] <desrt> yes -- just delete it
[13:33] <seb128> Laney, I hate upower, it gives me a charge record only since I woke up the laptop this morning
[13:33] <seb128> so I don't have a yesterday history
[13:33] <Laney> well I can't unlock unity8 now
[13:33] <desrt> greyback: so dconf uses the universal fsync()-then-rename-over approach to replacing the database
[13:34] <seb128> Laney, let me try on the phone
[13:34] <desrt> this is 'guaranteed safe', regardless of a crash at any point during the process
[13:34] <desrt> i guess ecryptfs is not geeting that guarantee correct
[13:34] <Laney> if I have to reboot then I will lose the data
[13:34] <seb128> why?
[13:34] <seb128> upower store those in /var that's not cleared over reboot
[13:34] <desrt> greyback: first i've heard of this problem with ecryptfs :(
[13:35] <greyback> desrt: oh well. Any idea what project might appreciate a bug?
[13:35] <desrt> ecryptfs, i guess
[13:35] <desrt> did you have a crash recently?
[13:35] <desrt> ie: improper shutdown
[13:36] <seb128> Laney, :-(
[13:36] <seb128> I don't have that reverse curve issue
[13:37] <Laney> it did keep the data after reboot
[13:37]  * Laney tries old version
[13:38] <Laney> that one is normal ;-)
[13:39] <seb128> :-(((
[13:39] <seb128> hate the world
[13:40] <seb128> Laney, if you revert the last chunk from the diff, does it fix it?
[13:40] <seb128> Laney, I've no clue otherwise, I didn't change anything in the curve drawing, just in the axises
[13:41] <seb128> that one looked like a typo, but maybe I misunderstood it
[13:43] <Laney> ummm that breaks the graph completely
[13:43] <seb128> wth!?
[13:43] <seb128> you graph doesn't even go back on a particular time
[13:46] <Laney> ah wait
[13:47] <Laney> it does fix it, I just changed the wrong bit
[13:49] <seb128> Laney, k, thanks, i'm just going to revert that bit
[13:50] <Laney> I can't immediately work out why this is correct
[14:11] <Laney> I'm sure there is a bug here
[14:13] <seb128> "here"? the charge curve?
[14:15] <Laney> yeah
[14:20] <GunnarHj> Laney: Any hint on how you make a package clean up itself - and why?
[14:22] <Laney> GunnarHj: https://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-source.html#s-debianrules scroll down to clean
[14:22] <Laney> as for how: override_dh_auto_clean: and undo everything you did in there
[14:24] <GunnarHj> Laney: Ok.. Can the fact that it's format 1.0 be related? Would it make a difference to switch to 3.0 (native)?
[14:24] <Laney> no
[14:24] <Laney> you can just add a target that removes all of the output files
[14:25] <GunnarHj> Laney: Ok, I'll check it out. Thanks!
[16:28] <Laney> hmm, the graph actually looks alright now
[16:29] <Laney> maybe whoever wrote it in the first place was actually right(!)
[16:50] <seb128> Laney, you mean with the height/width revert?
[16:50] <Laney> yeah
[16:51] <seb128> yeah
[16:51] <Laney> I thought it was stopping some distance out from the left side
[16:51] <Laney> but now with more data it fills the whole area
[16:51] <seb128> it doesn't make much sense to me, but it works...
[16:51] <Laney> my theory was that it was drawing in a square
[16:51] <Laney> that now doesn't make sense
[16:51] <Laney> oh well
[16:51] <seb128> yeah
[16:51] <seb128> something to investigate at some point, maybe not today
[16:52] <seb128> thanks for approving it btw ;-)
[16:53] <Laney> yw
[17:12] <Laney> bye desktoppers!
[17:28] <seb128> Laney, have a good evening


[21:32] <cjohnston> daker: ping
[21:32] <daker> cjohnston: pong
[21:33] <cjohnston> https://code.launchpad.net/~chrisjohnston/ubuntu-community-webthemes/light-django-theme-static/+merge/141264 please?
[21:35] <daker> cjohnston: for some reasons i can't merge/approve it, i am not part of the team i think
[21:36] <cjohnston> you are now
[21:38] <daker> done
[21:43] <cjohnston> t
[21:43] <cjohnston> ty


[08:11] <ppisati> moin
[08:14] <smb> morning
[08:22] <ppisati> i love the smell of Linus's rants in the morning
[08:38]  * smb rather prefers the scent of fresh coffee...
[08:38] <ppisati> :)
[08:38] <smb> ppisati, what is going wrong today? :)
[08:39] <ppisati> smb: nothing yet, but it could get worse
[08:39] <ppisati> it could rain :)
[08:40] <smb> it could snow if it was colder... no, anything particular that roused Linus?
[08:42] <ppisati> smb: opensuse security model requiring root password for everything
[08:42] <ppisati> smb: he said one of his daughter called him from school saying she couldn't add school's printer without root pwd
[08:42] <ppisati> you can imagine his reaction... :)
[08:42] <smb> heh. :) can imagine
[08:43] <ppisati> but the real question is, did he give the root pwd to hhis daughter at the end or not? :)
[08:44] <smb> maybe remote login and change it after... well in some way the security of being able to do all those things with your default user is relatively similar
[08:45] <ppisati> yeah
[08:45] <ppisati> but i agree he has a point
[08:45] <diwic> why not boot from a live-CD and just change the root pwd that way?
[08:46] <ppisati> he mentions some other mundane tasks like chaging wireless network or date/timezone
[08:48] <smb> Yes, I guess there are probably things/subsystems which you would expect to operate on their own rights without requiring additional ones. At least making decisions only affecting your profile
[08:50] <ppisati> right
[08:50] <ppisati> and i wonder where we stand in this stance
[08:50] <ppisati> e.g. will Linus's daughter be able to add a printer without root? changing network? timezone?
[08:51] <ppisati> anyway, dist-upgrade just finished, brb
[09:05] <smb> ppisati, Guess in out case she would not need the non-existent root password but do a lot of things as root anyway. :)
[09:06] <ppisati> :)
[09:23]  * apw yawns
[10:53] <cking> hrm, creating a minimal USB DOS image for a BIOS upgrade from scratch is interesting
[11:16] <Daviey> cking: does freedos not cover it?
[11:42] <cking> Daviey, I wish it did, but alas no
[11:57] <ppisati> perhaps i'm drunk, but it seems i'm getting a completely different panic on armhf vs armel...
[12:41]  * henrix is out for lunch
[12:47] <apw> ppisati, if that is a float triggered issue then it could easily be different
[13:41] <apw> henrix, i assume we are still committing to lucid/mvl-dove, in order to make maverick/mvl-dove
[13:41] <apw> herton, ^^
[13:41] <apw> (a new h on the block, messing up my tab completion)
[13:42] <herton> apw, yes, ppisati usually pushes on his branch, I push the updated branch
[13:47] <ppisati> apw: yep, i update my zinc branch and then pull from it for M/dove
[13:48] <herton> then I verify and push to "master" (lucid/mvl-dove, maverick/mvl-dove) when ppisati sends the request to fetch/pull
[13:49] <ppisati> herton: ah btw, Houston we have a problem
[13:49] <ppisati> latest P/omap4 update is ok for armel
[13:50] <ppisati> while it complains about a missing module for armhf
[13:50] <ppisati> any way we can fix it?
[13:50] <ppisati> i mean, can we withdraw the pull and fix it? or it's already queued and thus we are screwed?
[13:50] <herton> ppisati, I think tgardner is taking care of P
[13:51] <ppisati> herton: yes, but he forgot we have armhf too
[13:51] <ppisati> herton: so he fixed the armel side only
[13:51] <ppisati> ah right, you are the stable team... :)
[13:54] <herton> yes, you have to see with him this, not sure what he already done/queued
[13:57] <apw> ppisati, which module is missing ?
[13:58] <apw> (i presume by this it is meant to be missing now)
[13:58] <ppisati> apw: the led heartbeat was compiled in
[13:58] <ppisati> apw: tim took care of the armel side, but not armhf
[13:58] <apw> oh yeah, so i assume it was a build faliure on armhf
[13:58] <ppisati> yep
[13:59] <ppisati> but since it takes AGES to build a kernrl on one of our arm builders, if we can fix it would be nice
[13:59] <apw> ppisati, so its not uploaded yet
[14:00] <ppisati> nope
[14:03] <herton> removing  ledtrig-heartbeat from debian.ti-omap4/abi/3.2.0-1406.8/armhf/omap4.modules should fix it, may be fixing the commit and rebasing, on push a fix on top, should do it
[14:04] <herton> *or push a fix on top
[14:04] <apw> herton, yeah easy to fix, will do that and repush it
[14:28] <ppisati> apw: thanks
[14:37] <apw> ppisati, pushed ... and tim emailed just in case
[14:43] <ppisati> apw: cool, thanks
[14:57] <henrix> cking: ping
[14:58] <henrix> cking: i remember you were asking yesterday something about ath9k-related panics...
[14:58] <cking> henrix, yep
[14:58] <henrix> cking: well, i accidentaly came across this commit: 07445f688218a48bde72316aed9de4fdcc173131
[14:59] <henrix> cking: not sure if related with the bug you were looking at...
[14:59] <henrix> and it looks like its not on precise
[15:00] <cking> henrix, that's a great find - I will spin a test kernel with that in for the user who's seeing issues with it - thanks!
[15:00] <henrix> it may be completely unrelated, but worth taking a look ;)
[15:00] <henrix> btw, its already on stable
[15:03] <apw> henrix, nice :)
[15:03] <cking> it sounds like it definitely worth trying :-)
[15:03] <henrix> cool
[15:03] <henrix> i was looking for something completely unrelated on stable... and just found this
[15:19]  * ogasawara back in 20
[16:16] <jsalisbury> cking, henrix, comment #13 was added to bug 894584  This is someone other than the original bug reporter reporting panics possibly related to ath9k
[16:16] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 894584 in linux "ath9k driver causes kernel panic" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/894584
[16:19] <cking> jsalisbury, I'll take a peek at that once I've popped my stack of things to do
[16:19] <jsalisbury> cking, cool.  Not much to look at.  Just another person stating they see panics and thing they could be related to ath9k.  I asked them to post a screen shot of the panic.
[16:22] <henrix> cking: have you managed to build the test kernel?
[16:22] <cking> henrix, yep, uploading the debs is taking a while at the mo
[16:22] <henrix> ah, ok. cool
[16:23] <cking> patch applied cleanly which is good
[16:23] <henrix> since we have a "fresh" comment, maybe the new guy may be able to test it quickly :)
[16:24] <cking> the user is sporadic, sometimes he tests immediately, sometimes it takes a week or more to get back to me
[17:21] <brendand> hey
[17:22] <brendand> if i install on a system with > 3GB of RAM, is there something that tells the -pae kernel to be used?
[17:22] <brendand> past experience shows this to be the case on my main laptop
[17:23] <brendand> but not sure if this is 'guaranteed'
[17:28] <brendand> in other words, is it a bug for a system which needs pae to address all it's memory not to install it?
[17:31] <brendand> never mind
[17:31] <brendand> preseed #fail
[18:51] <JanC> a non-PAE kernel kan address 4 GiB of RAM, which is > 3 GiB...  :P
[20:05]  * cking ->EOD
[21:30] <jdstrand> ogasawara, jsalisbury: thanks for your work on bug #911059
[21:30] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 911059 in linux "Intel wireless randomly drops connection" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/911059
[21:32] <ogasawara> jdstrand: np, jsalisbury did all the heavy lifting.
[21:43] <bjf> jjohansen: bug 931627 has been waiting for your signoff
[21:43] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 931627 in kernel-sru-workflow/security-signoff "linux: 2.6.24-31.99 -proposed tracker" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/931627
[21:44] <jjohansen> bjf: hrmm, right sorry /me has been deal with a mailbox implosion
[21:44] <bjf> jjohansen: np, this was just a reminder :-)
[21:45] <jjohansen> bjf: looking at it now