[01:50] <beeman_nl> hi folk... in this page ( https://help.ubuntu.com/7.04/installation-guide/i386/preseed-contents.html ) there is a link to the example preseed
[01:50] <beeman_nl> but when you click it, you'll get a 404...
[01:51] <beeman_nl> i could'nt find a colofon on the help site, someone from #ubuntu pointed me to this channel
[01:55] <beeman_nl> i'm trying to create a bug report at https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-doc/   but i can't seem to add one...
[02:06] <ian_brasil> hi ...i am checking out the svn doc trunk and I received svn co https://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos/trunk/.
[02:06] <ian_brasil> Error validating server certificate for 'https://docteam.ubuntu.com:443':
[02:06] <ian_brasil>  - The certificate is not issued by a trusted authority. Use the
[02:06] <ian_brasil>    fingerprint to validate the certificate manually!
[02:06] <ian_brasil>
[02:10] <ian_brasil> any ideas?
[02:13] <beeman_nl> ian_brasil: i myself have no trouble checking it out...
[02:16] <ian_brasil> maybe you have already accepted the certificate?
[02:17] <beeman_nl> no, it is the first time i co it
[02:17] <beeman_nl> and it is valid till october '07
[02:17] <beeman_nl> so that shouldn't be a problem...
[02:23] <ian_brasil> Mmm
[03:42] <ian_brasil> the standard workflow ifor documentation s checkout svn, edit docbook, create diff (if without committ rights to svn)...e-mail patch to ubuntu-doc list ??
[06:42] <eset> hi, when is the next meeting for the documentation team?
[06:45] <nixternal> eset: we are waiting for mdke_ to get back after all of his wedding stuff, so hopefully in the next couple of weeks, we will post the date and time on the fridge as well as the mailing list
[06:49] <eset> ok, thanks
[07:01] <eset> i was wondering how the doc team feels about collaborating with other writing projects?
[07:02] <eset> has there been collaboration like this in the past?
[07:02] <nixternal> there have been attempts
[07:03] <nixternal> what kind of writing project are you referring to?
[07:03] <eset> a wiki for writing free manuals about free software
[07:04] <eset> i established one last year but i have just started working on it in earnest
[07:04] <eset> and it seems the ubuntu teams docs and the manuals in the wiki compliment each other quite well
[07:08] <nixternal> eset: they don't complement each other as much as we would like just yet
[07:08] <nixternal> hopefully one day they will be exactly where we want them
[07:09] <eset> ah, i meant the manuals in the wiki i work on and the ubuntu docs complimen teach other quite well
[07:10] <eset> and since the world of documentation writing is small, but growing, combining efforts might be a good idea
[07:10] <nixternal> they are definitely getting better for sure...but something like your idea would be a great topic during our next meeting
[07:10] <eset> okedoke
[07:11] <eset> how does somehting get on the agenda?
[07:11] <nixternal> dunno about combining efforts, but the licensing allows it to occur. most of our documentors tend to have lives, except for me..I am currently documenting KDE and Kubuntu, so I tend to get stretched thin on projects :)
[07:11] <eset> hehe...i bet
[07:11] <nixternal> eset: when we announce the meeting, we will setup a page on the wiki to add items to
[07:11] <eset> ok
[07:12] <eset> i will keep an eye on the announcement then
[07:12] <eset> and in the meantime i will focus on writing some more docs too ;)
[07:12] <nixternal> rock on!
[07:12] <nixternal> gimme a link to the wiki you have
[07:13] <eset> ok... -> www.flossmanuals.net
[07:13] <nixternal> hehe, nice name
[07:13] <eset> hehe, thanks
[07:13] <eset> welcome any feedback
[07:13] <nixternal> I just started a domain flossyard which will bring in various stale floss projects to one location to give new developers something to work on
[07:13] <eset> nice!
[07:14] <eset> seems we think alike...there is a lot already done if it can only be found easily....
[07:14] <nixternal> where is emacs at under the text editors in the cli stuff ;p
[07:15] <eset> hehe...yeah yeah
[07:15] <eset> u can always add it ;)
[07:15] <eset> but im a vim guy
[07:15] <nixternal> man, I was at Barcamp Chicago this weekend, and a lot of people still use Pico, which is Nano really
[07:15] <eset> cant do anything about it
[07:15] <eset> yeah...i really like them both..really simple
[07:16] <eset> when i was using pine it all worked so well....
[07:16] <nixternal> 95-98 I was an Emacs guy, then working for Sun Microsystems I became a Vi guy, now I am whatever mood I am in :)
[07:16] <eset> ha! well, i know i will _never_ get the emacs virus, ever
[07:16] <nixternal> ahh Pine, the good old days. I just recently gave up Mutt for Kontact/KMail
[07:17] <eset> actually i settled for evolution (blush)
[07:17] <eset> i went on a trip for 3 months with very little connectivity and had to have it all local
[07:17] <eset> so downloaded 7 years of email
[07:17] <eset> yowser
[07:18] <nixternal> ouch
[07:18] <eset> rekin
[07:19] <nixternal> I used to use Evolution back when the Ximian desktop was out...that was some pretty nasty days, but I think it did quite a bit for the Linux desktop considering the time
[07:19] <eset> i like it...its pretty stable and simple to use...its fine...but i dont feel so geeky using it...its like buying and older, chumpier car
[07:19] <nixternal> hehe
[07:20] <nixternal> I still like Evolution over Thunderbird though, and actually Evolution doesn't crash as much as KMail does :)
[07:20] <eset> i have to say evolution hasnt crashed once for me
[07:20] <nixternal> but I play it safe, I use KMail for POP accounts, that way there I don't have to worry about losing email
[07:20] <eset> i just used it only 7 months or so
[07:21] <eset> ooo....my pizza is calling...smells good.....
[07:21] <eset> yum!
[07:22] <eset> ok...better run...i am on the mailing list...so i will look for an announcement about the meeting
[07:22] <eset> im keen for some kind of synergy if there is a possibility
[07:22] <eset> the more fusion the better i rekin
[07:23] <nixternal> talk to ya later, I need to run myself
[07:23] <eset> ok, cu :)
[07:34] <beeman_nl> guys, on this page there is a link to the example preseed.txt, but that link doesnt work... https://help.ubuntu.com/7.04/installation-guide/i386/preseed-contents.html
[07:35] <beeman_nl> where should i report that?
[10:22] <ian_brasil> can anyone recommend a docbook editor?
[10:44] <nixternal> ian_brasil: there isn't one. gEdit, Kate, Quanta, Bluefish, Vi, Emacs, all have syntax highlighters and indentation configurations, that is about as good as you can get
[10:46] <ian_brasil> ok, thx


[00:00] <Silver_Fox_> Goodbye
[00:17] <kosaidpo> hello
[02:44] <reaper_> having trouble getting a .bin file to work
[02:49] <udienz> reaper_: what a troble?
[02:49] <udienz> can copy error message at here?
[02:50] <reaper_> says I dont have permission
[02:52] <reaper_> now says cannot execute binary file
[03:08] <paultag> dang, someone could just tell reaper to chmod +x
[03:12] <udienz> dag.. and he's gone when i want to answering
[06:43] <reaper_> anyone awake in here
[06:46] <firewall_03> whats up?
[06:46] <reaper_> how do you mount cd/dvd drive
[06:46] <firewall_03> man mnt
[06:46] <bioterror> sudo mnt /dev/sr0 /mnt
[06:46] <bioterror> asdasd
[06:46] <bioterror> sudo mount /dev/sr0 /mnt
[06:46] <bioterror> sudo umount /mnt unmounts
[06:47] <firewall_03> so my toolbar at the top vanished in my xubuntu session any ideas?
[06:48] <bioterror> start xfce4-panel
[06:48] <bioterror> alt+f2 and type that into it
[06:48] <firewall_03> bioterror, k thanks
[06:49] <reaper_> mount didnt work still cant get disk to show up in drive to continue installation
[06:49] <bioterror> what
[06:49] <bioterror> it should be seen in /mnt ;)
[06:50] <reaper_> nope
[06:50] <firewall_03> bioterror, rob@rob-laptop:~/Desktop$ start xfce4-panel
[06:50] <firewall_03> start: Unknown job: xfce4-panel
[06:50] <bioterror> firewall_03, hahaha, drop that start from the beginning
[06:50] <bioterror> sorry for misleading
[06:50] <firewall_03> bioterror, lol no prob
[06:51] <firewall_03> bioterror, and its back
[06:51] <bioterror> I'm trying to do my work at the same time
[06:51] <firewall_03> what work is that?
[06:51] <bioterror> local it-support, atm. installing three computers for users
[06:52] <reaper_> sounds like fun
[06:53] <bioterror> no its not :D
[06:53] <bioterror> but beats shoveling in that -8C degress
[06:53] <reaper_> yeah
[06:56] <firewall_03> bioterror, whats your location?
[06:56] <bioterror> soviet finland
[06:57] <firewall_03> bioterror, I spent a week in Krygyzstan that was an experience
[06:57] <bioterror> there was that riot about a year ago?
[06:58] <firewall_03> I was at Manas air base
[06:58] <firewall_03> I think I left right before or arrived right after
[07:04] <PCChris> anybody know why my flash drive might always auto-mount with perms set to being writable only by root, and sudo chmod as well as sudo chown failing?
[07:09] <firewall_03> bioterror, so hows the work comin along
[07:16] <bioterror> PCChris, you should format that flash drive and take the ownership of the device
[07:16] <PCChris> bioterror, yeah about to try that now
[07:17] <PCChris> bioterror, just strange because I know it was writable before
[07:19] <yofel> chmod/own should only fail if it's FAT or NTFS, but then it should mount it as owned by you by default
[07:20] <PCChris> yofel, bioterror hmm....reformatting seems to have fixed the issue for now...and it's fat32
[07:21] <PCChris> yofel, bioterror thanks
[07:23] <firewall_03> so the conky channels dea
[07:23] <firewall_03> dead rather
[07:30] <bioterror> firewall_03, problems with conky you have?
[07:49] <bioterror> Tue09:30 <+bioterror> firewall_03, problems with conky you have?
[08:13] <firewall_03> just having a heck of time getting the weather to work right
[08:14] <bioterror> hahaha
[08:14] <bioterror> it sucks
[08:14] <bioterror> I cant understand why someone havent made a script to fetch weather information from google
[08:14] <firewall_03> yep
[08:15] <firewall_03> bioterror, did not know google did weather
[08:15] <bioterror> my irc client uses google weather information
[08:16] <firewall_03> what client you use?
[08:16] <bioterror> weechat
[08:16] <bioterror> www.weechat.org
[08:17] <firewall_03> ahh
[08:17] <firewall_03> never heard of it
[08:18] <bioterror> weechat - Fast, light and extensible chat client
[08:18] <bioterror> can be found from ubuntu repositories
[08:19] <firewall_03> ill have to install it
[08:19] <firewall_03> give it a whirl
[08:19] <bioterror> yeah
[08:19] <bioterror> it's a text based
[08:19] <bioterror> ;)
[08:20] <firewall_03> lol sounds archaic
[08:20] <bioterror> install weeget script and you can install scripts from the client itself
[08:27] <hobgoblin> it is archaic ;)
[08:28] <hobgoblin> but useful in some circumstances
[08:44] <firewall_03> bioterror,  my isp sucks *shakes head
[08:45] <bioterror> well, mine aint that better tbqh
[08:45] <firewall_03> I want to blame my router or my modem but don't want to upgrade
[08:46] <JoeMaverickSett> firewall_03: blame the isp or better the modem. :D
[08:46] <firewall_03> haha its a pos modem they mailed me
[08:47] <JoeMaverickSett> then it's the modem to blame.  :D
[09:03] <firewall_03> bioterror, so I downloaded weechat how to I get it to run now :p
[09:04] <bioterror> firewall_03, with command weechat
[09:04] <JoeMaverickSett> firewall_03: terminal of course. :D
[09:04] <firewall_03> tried that
[09:04] <firewall_03> no dice
[09:04] <bioterror> http://weechat.org/files/doc/stable/weechat_quickstart.en.html
[09:05] <firewall_03> rob@rob-laptop:~$ weechat
[09:05] <firewall_03> weechat: command not found
[09:05] <firewall_03> rob@rob-laptop:~$ sudo apt-get install weechat
[09:05] <firewall_03> Reading package lists... Done
[09:05] <firewall_03> Building dependency tree
[09:05] <firewall_03> Reading state information... Done
[09:05] <firewall_03> weechat is already the newest version.
[09:05] <firewall_03> 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.
[09:05] <bioterror> hahaha
[09:05] <bioterror> weechat-curses
[09:05] <JoeMaverickSett> !pastebin | firewall_03
[09:05] <ubot2> firewall_03: For posting multi-line texts into the channel, please use http://paste.ubuntu.com | To post !screenshots use http://tinyurl.com/imagebin | !pastebinit to paste directly from command line | Make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic.
[09:05] <bioterror> JoeMaverickSett <3
[09:05] <firewall_03> lol
[09:05] <firewall_03> I will be sure to pastebin next time
[09:05] <bioterror> remember, you can complete words with tab -key
[09:05] <JoeMaverickSett> bioterror: did i get it right this time?
[09:05] <hobgoblin> oh good ;)
[09:05] <JoeMaverickSett> :D
[09:05] <bioterror> JoeMaverickSett, yes you did
[09:06] <JoeMaverickSett> 'ello! hobgoblin :)
[09:06] <hobgoblin> hi JoeMaverickSett
[09:06] <firewall_03> bioterror,  ya lol not diggin weechat, I will stick with xchat for now
[09:06] <JoeMaverickSett> bioterror: do i have to install weechat or weechat-curses?
[09:07] <JoeMaverickSett> firewall_03: try irssi. :P
[09:07] <hobgoblin> firewall_03: good decision :)
[09:07] <bioterror> JoeMaverickSett, weechat is the package, weechat-curses is the binary
[09:07] <JoeMaverickSett> bioterror: ah, okie. i'll still stick with irssi. XD
[09:07] <bioterror> JoeMaverickSett, why?-)
[09:08] <bioterror> JoeMaverickSett, try something new ;)
[09:08] <JoeMaverickSett> firewall_03: good decision. :-) stay with whatever fits ya.
[09:08] <hobgoblin> JoeMaverickSett: try paper and pen - better than either irrsi or weechat :D
[09:08] <firewall_03> JoeMaverickSett, yep still a noob been fiddling with nix for a while so much to learn
[09:08] <JoeMaverickSett> hobgoblin: definitely. XD
[09:09] <JoeMaverickSett> bioterror: trying something new makes me hop on newer/newest things. :D
[09:09] <hobgoblin> I do use weechat from time time - but all the mucking about with windows and channels drives me nut
[09:09] <hobgoblin> anyway - back later
[09:11] <firewall_03> later
[09:12] <JoeMaverickSett> firewall_03: good luck! come by here if you need help. :)
[09:12] <firewall_03> JoeMaverickSett, Im not leavin just yet
[09:13] <firewall_03> I have been trolling around a little while
[09:13] <JoeMaverickSett> :O
[09:14] <bioterror> JoeMaverickSett, keys to be cool ircer is urxvt and weechat ;)
[09:15] <JoeMaverickSett> bioterror: i'm not listening. :P
[09:15] <firewall_03> alright later for now, gotta get some rest big interview tomorrow with a local cell phone provider
[09:21] <bioterror> you get cells that phones to you
[10:16] <Ace> ubuntu is boring
[10:17] <udienz> Ace: why?
[10:17] <Ace> There is nothing interesting to do with it other than browsing and listening to music and watching music
[10:18] <Puck`> hi everyone
[10:18] <Puck`> is anyone up for some bash scripting? (:
[10:21] <Puck`> oh you guys are all asleep (:
[10:23] <udienz> Puck`: i love basg script
[10:24] <udienz> *bash
[14:39] <dd_> hi
[14:39] <dd_> help
[15:56] <firewall_03> whats up
[16:01]  * nlsthzn lurks
[16:16] <firewall_03> hey bodhizazen hows it goin?
[16:47] <spyder> Hi, I am new to Ubuntu, and my experience lends more to Win.  I had a hd running winxp, installed a 2nd hd with ubuntu, no prob, both booted, started going through ubuntu, installing first set of updates, then it popped up with a grub update, with the option to check both disks. In Help, it said if you are unsure which to check it is better to select all.  So I did.  It needed to reboot. then, after the reboot, when it tries
[16:48] <spyder> and numbers), then the next line is the prompt "grub rescue>"
[16:48] <spyder> I cannot get past this, I cannot get to windows, safe mode, or ubuntu. Can someone give me some pointers please?
[16:53] <rahul27> spyder, you there?
[16:54] <spyder> yes
[16:54] <spyder> please tell me you can help?
[16:54] <rahul27> this link may help you https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RecoveringUbuntuAfterInstallingWindows
[16:55] <rahul27> do you have a live cd?
[16:55] <spyder> no
[16:55] <spyder> ok, even though windows was the first os?
[16:55] <spyder> i did it through webu or whatever that was
[16:56] <spyder> i made a cd, but it kept giving me an error
[16:56] <rahul27> hehehe
[16:56] <rahul27> its Wubi
[16:57] <rahul27> anyway did you download the iso?
[16:57] <spyder> i couldn't get either hd to work, had to put in another one to be able to get on here and research
[16:57] <spyder> the iso i downloaded is on one of the hd's that i cannot access right now
[16:57] <spyder> but I can download again
[16:57] <rahul27> oh ok
[16:57] <rahul27> great then
[16:58] <rahul27> do you have a flash drive?
[16:58] <spyder> yes, only a 4g.... is that enough?
[16:58] <rahul27> yeah
[16:58] <rahul27> download the iso
[16:58] <spyder> k....
[16:58] <rahul27> load it to the pendrive using this: http://www.pendrivelinux.com/universal-usb-installer-easy-as-1-2-3/
[16:59] <rahul27> im assuming you are on windows
[16:59] <spyder> k....
[16:59] <rahul27> are you?
[17:00] <spyder> yes, winxp
[17:00] <rahul27> once you have your ubuntu live cd on your pendrive
[17:01] <rahul27> boot from the pendrive and follow the instructions on the 1st link that I sent you
[17:02] <spyder> ok. I appreciate your help. Just so I know for future reference, what did I do wrong?
[17:03] <rahul27> spyder, think you got your grub update wrong
[17:04] <spyder> will this make me lose data on my winxp hd?
[17:05] <rahul27> naah
[17:06] <spyder> k....ty.
[17:06] <rahul27> it will just restore your grub
[19:17] <firewall_03> hows it going?
[19:21] <bioterror> firewall_03, for the offtopic chats #ubuntu-beginners-team if available
[19:21] <bioterror> is available
[19:21] <firewall_03> ok...
[19:51] <wolfpack> how to save the channels in pidgin?
[21:03] <hobgoblin> nlsthzn: hi there
[21:04] <nlsthzn> hobgoblin: hey *waves*
[21:05] <hobgoblin> assuming no two people whuld be crazy enough to have the same nick your forum account got disabled
[21:07] <nlsthzn> :) I asked for it to be disabled... read an interesting article about online security and not using the same passwords and also not the same usernames online... however, I was still able to log in with my account so I then asked for it not to be disabled... so now I am not sure if it is workign or not? brb
[21:07] <hobgoblin> bapoumba came back and redid it I think
[21:08] <nlsthzn> lol, yup, I am locked out T_T
[21:09] <hobgoblin> you want me to ask someone if they can let you back in ?
[21:09] <nlsthzn> and I changed my password and was online the whole day yesterday...
[21:09] <hobgoblin> ha ha ha ha
[21:09] <hobgoblin> I can ask someone if you want :)
[21:09] <nlsthzn> hobgoblin: nah... its ok.. now I can have a new unique user name for the forum
[21:09] <hobgoblin> okey doke
[21:10] <nlsthzn> if it will let me re-use the same email addy... hmmm... but thanks for the heads up!
[21:10] <hobgoblin> if it doesn't let me know
[21:11] <nlsthzn> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=10261405#post10261405 classic :D
[21:14] <hobgoblin> yea I know - I saw the nah don't bother post earlier - trouble with not everyone in the wordl with the one mother tongue :)
[21:20] <nlsthzn> hobgoblin: I guess... :) all good... now I can attempt to spend less time in the OT and more time in the technical threads :)
[23:49] <reaper_> has anyone tried to get the usb xbox 360 controller to work because I am having no luck


[08:48] <Hobbsee> is it intentional that all jaunty upgrades pull lilo in by default, due to the kernel?
[10:19] <apw> Hobbsee, i am not aware of our dependancies changing specifically on lilo
[10:21] <apw> yep, our specified dependancies have not changed from Intrepid to Jaunty
[10:21] <apw> debian/control.stub:Recommends: lilo (>= 19.1) | grub
[10:21] <apw> would we expect that form to force lilo on?  that sounds bad to me
[10:22] <apw> (and wrong)
[10:30] <Hobbsee> apw: well, I suspect it's a bug in intrepid upgrades too then
[10:31] <Hobbsee> i'm not sure if it actually turns lilo on or not, but installing two boot loaders by a normal dist-upgrade seems...strange?
[10:34] <apw> frankly i would expect them to conflict: with each other
[10:35] <Hobbsee> they don't seem to (as that's what I'd expect too). how strange.
[10:35] <apw> Hobbsee, as the kernel only recommends them surly that wouldn't ever install them?  do we not rely on the d-i at first install to have picked one, and normal upgrades to keep that one up to datge
[10:36] <Hobbsee> apw: a dist-upgrade installs recommends for new packages by default, i think.  and the new kernel qualifies as a new (binary) package.
[10:37] <Hobbsee> (it keeps the metapackages right, but the bit that recommends grub itself is actually the kernel image binary, which keeps changing)
[10:37] <apw> Hobbsee, hmmm well that might allow it to install one or the other, but i would hope that it would only install recommends with 'or' in them if one was not already installed
[10:38] <apw> i wonder if apt has changed behaviour somewhere
[10:39] <Hobbsee> apw: indeed.  it would be odd that apt doesn't say "the second is installed, don't install hte first"
[10:39]  * apw wonders if there is any magic in update-manager to solve this
[10:39] <apw> that makes it feel like a bug, but a bug in the update
[10:40] <Hobbsee> could be.  I didn't use update-manager
[10:40]  * apw gets the source
[10:51] <apw> Hobbsee, is your dual installed machine 32 or 64 bit?
[10:51] <Hobbsee> apw: 32
[10:51]  * apw notes his 32 bit Intrepid install has both installed
[10:51] <apw> but his 64 does not
[10:51] <Hobbsee> i clean installed intrepid today, then dist-upgraded it
[10:51] <Hobbsee> got jaunty, and lilo installed
[10:51] <Hobbsee> haven't rebooted it yet.
[10:52] <apw> well i have a laptop here (32 bit) which was installed from the Intrepid final CD and only has official updates on it
[10:52] <apw> and that also has both loaders installed
[10:52] <apw> my other laptop installed from the amd64 CD image only has grub
[10:53]  * apw is suspicious of the 32 bit installer now
[10:53] <Hobbsee> did you dist-upgrade it?
[10:54] <Hobbsee> oh, wait, i misread you sorry
[10:54] <apw> nope this was a virgin install from a CD, and the most it has is -proposed enabled
[10:54] <apw> always updated using update-manager
[10:54] <Hobbsee> very strange.
[10:54] <apw> proper user stylee, and it seems to be infected with both
[10:55] <apw> yes it does have proposed enabled too
[10:58] <apw> according to the logs in /var/log/apt, it was installed in the initial install burst
[11:28] <dholbach> hello my Kernel friends!
[11:28] <dholbach> who of you would like to give a session at the next Ubuntu Developer Week? something about module packaging with DKMS maybe?
[11:28] <dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperWeek/Prep
[11:29] <dholbach> is the preliminary schedule
[11:56] <Keybuk> Thought of the day:
[11:56] <Keybuk> what happens if init calls clone() with CLONE_PARENT? :p
[11:58] <dholbach> hey Keybuk
[11:58] <mjg59> Keybuk: Looks like failure
[11:58] <dholbach> Keybuk: you could give a session about upstart at Ubuntu Developer Week - what do you think?
[11:59] <Keybuk> mjg59: the clone() doesn't look like it'll fail?
[11:59] <Keybuk> but it looks like if that process exited, lots of things assume that real_parent is not 0?
[11:59] <mjg59> Keybuk: Right
[12:00] <mjg59> Hence, failure :)
[12:00] <Keybuk> in fact, it looks like there's lots of -> after that ;)
[12:00] <Keybuk> definitely a "don't do that, then"
[12:00] <mjg59> I think it's assumed that anyone writing init can already DoS the system whenever they want to
[12:23] <apw> Keybuk, i concur with your analysis, bad karma will result from that
[12:23] <apw> i suspect a very simple fix is possible, and probabally desirable
[12:24] <Keybuk> *shrug* I tend to agree with mjg59 here ;)
[12:24] <Keybuk> very few people write init daemons, and those who do already need to know about various special behaviours
[12:26] <apw> i tend to be suspicious of anything which allows user space to blow the kernel up
[12:26] <apw> yeah you are already winning if you can run init, but hey
[12:28] <Keybuk> I can blow the kernel up from init easily ;)
[12:28] <mjg59> exit(-1)
[12:29] <Keybuk> just one function call ... exit()
[12:31] <apw> yeah i know, but that is 'deliberate' it is designed.  this is a blammo, they are unsatisfactory at best
[12:32] <apw> i am sure linus would agree with you
[14:27] <dholbach> BenC: would you like to give a session at the next Ubuntu Developer Week? something about module packaging with DKMS maybe? :)
[14:27] <dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperWeek/Prep is the preliminary schedule
[14:27] <dholbach> it'd be nice to have something like a "hands on" session where people could get involved in the kernel team somehow
[14:27] <BenC> dholbach: I did dkms last time :) you want a new topic?
[14:28] <dholbach> BenC: I could imagine that it's still interesting - if you have something better ... sure :)
[14:29] <dholbach> pgraner: you could give a session about "mass-testing kernel fixes" :)
[14:29] <BenC> dholbach: ok, If I don't come up with something better, I'll do dkms
[14:30] <dholbach> BenC: will you just grab a slot on there?
[14:31] <BenC> dholbach: ok
[14:32]  * dholbach hugs BenC
[14:32] <dholbach> you ROCK :)
[14:33] <BenC> dholbach: no YOU rock!
[14:34]  * dholbach looks forward to seeing everybody in Berlin soon
[14:34] <Nafallo> you both rock... now, where's the fire? ;-)
[14:34] <dholbach> Nafallo: eh? :)
[14:34] <Nafallo> two rocks (stones) should lead to fire ;-)
[14:35]  * dholbach is too slow today :)
[15:09] <dholbach> BenC: which slot would you like to have? we can always change the session title afterwards
[15:10] <BenC> dholbach: late on a Friday is good
[15:10] <dholbach> 20 UTC? 19 UTC?
[15:18] <BenC> dholbach: 19
[15:18] <dholbach> BenC: alright, I'll add you to it
[15:18] <BenC> dholbach: thanks...still catching up on email
[15:18] <dholbach> BenC: same here :)
[15:22] <dholbach> BenC: added
[16:47] <alex_joni> can I use ppa to build custom flavours for a kernel?
[16:48] <_MMA_> alex_joni: A custom kernel? Sure. I couldn't tell you how though. :P
[16:50] <abogani> I can confirm it.
[16:52] <alex_joni> abogani: can you then build other packages that depend on that kernel (e.g. with installed header files) ?
[16:55] <abogani> alex_joni: I have done that job for rt kernel, headers and rt-tests packages without problems.
[16:55] <rtg> tmiller0
[16:56] <alex_joni> abogani: cool, that's nice to know
[16:56] <alex_joni> one day I might bug you about details (if I can't figure it out ;)
[16:58] <abogani> alex_joni: I think that you'll do it without problems and without any helps. ;)
[20:06] <johanbr> Would it be possible to go back to building pcspkr as a module? The only 100% reliable way I've found to get rid of the noise is to blacklist the module.
[20:15] <rtg> johanbr: I believe it is being built as a module: CONFIG_INPUT_PCSPKR=m
[20:16] <johanbr> really? hmm... then my blacklisting stopped working for some other reason
[20:16] <johanbr> it stopped working when jaunty rebased to 2.6.28
[20:17] <johanbr> I assumed it was due to the "stuff more stuff into the kernel" move.
[20:24] <zackr> are any of the people maintaining the lpia kernel online?
[20:27] <rtg> zackr: that is sconklin
[20:27]  * sconklin ducks
[20:28] <sconklin> zackr: the mobile group has a tree for their work, and I'm in the process of bringing it into our main tree. What do you need?
[20:30] <zackr> sconklin: ah, great. i have a machine with jaunty here and need to test a driver on 2.6.28, "fakeroot make-kpkg --initrd kernel_image" fails with "debian/ruleset/misc/checks.mk:36: *** Error. I do not know where the kernel image goes" is there any quick way of compiling 2.6.28 lpia package ?
[20:32] <sconklin> zackr: oh, that's out of my knowledge base since I don't actually *build* those kernels yet, and everything we have for lpia is based on Hardy. But hold on a sec and let me see if I can find someone who should know.
[20:32] <zackr> sconklin: that'd be great, thanks
[20:38] <sconklin> zackr: still looking
[20:43] <sconklin> zackr: so I understand - you want to cross-compile, this is not a native build, right?
[20:44] <zackr> sconklin: no, it's a native build. i just want to have 2.6.28 lpia packages
[20:45] <sconklin> ok, just making sure
[21:05] <sconklin> zackr: You have to build it in a chroot, and here's a procedure for setting up that chroot environment: http://lwn.net/Articles/247003/ - I tried s/gutsy/intrepid/ in those instructions (on an intrepid host). I don't have a jaunty machine at the moment to make sure it also works for jaunty.
[21:09] <zackr> sconklin: i'm a little confused. i have a lpia system running ubuntu already, i just wanted to compile new kernel on it. what would chroot give me in this case?
[21:12] <sconklin> zackr: Sorry, I left out the important bit.  No one I talked to does native builds, they are all done on other archs as chroot.
[21:12] <sconklin> but it should work
[21:13] <zackr> sconklin: could you ask the person who's building the lpia kernels to write up a procedure for building a new kernel? in particular the make-kpkg line
[21:20] <sconklin> zackr: the lpia kernels in the chroots are build using "fakeroot debian/rules <target>", so I don't think make-kpkg has been used or tested. Another option that was mentioned is to use a launchpad PPA to build them, but that's not really what you asked for at all.
[21:25] <zackr> sconklin: ok, and what <target> are you using on those then? on my lpia machine "fakeroot debian/rules lpia" returns exact the same error as make-kpkg which is "debian/ruleset/misc/checks.mk:36: *** Error. I do not know where the kernel image goes to [kimagedest undefined] ...", so it looks like there's some patch to the debian/ that you guys are applying before building those kernels
[21:28] <sconklin> zackr: that's possible. all my time has been spent looking at hardy, and there may have been something missed in Jaunty. Give me a few mins to have a look
[21:30] <zackr> sconklin: thanks. btw, i had the same problem on hardy. essentially the question is how to get debian packages for either git://git.kernel.org/pub/scm/linux/kernel/git/torvalds/linux-2.6.git on hardy or linux-source-2.6.28 if running jaunty
[21:36] <sconklin> zackr: you can look at the current (hardy) lpia tree as easily as I can - it's here:  git://kernel.ubuntu.com/mid-team/hardy-netbook.git
[21:36] <sconklin> That's what I'm doing now.