[00:07] <jelmer> Noldorin: if you run "bzr serve --directory=/" in cygwin, can you use bzr:// using root-based URLs?
[00:08] <Noldorin> hmm let's see :-)
[00:15] <Noldorin> jelmer, what port does normal smart serv run on?
[00:36] <Noldorin> jelmer, apparently it's a read-only transport?
[00:36] <jelmer> Noldorin: yes, unless you specify --allow-writes
[00:36] <Noldorin> ah
[00:36] <Noldorin> on the server end eh?
[00:37] <jelmer> it doesn't do authentication, so you probably want to do this on a world-facing machine
[00:37] <Noldorin> yes indeed
[01:06] <Noldorin> jelmer, not working any more
[01:06] <Noldorin> really weird
[01:06] <jelmer> Noldorin: what isn't?
[01:07] <Noldorin> bzr serve
[01:07] <Noldorin> very weird
[01:07] <Noldorin> hmm one min
[01:08] <Noldorin> jelmer, ok tested. interestingly, that inits the branch in the wrong dir too
[01:08] <Noldorin> under the home dir
[01:08] <Noldorin> instead of root cygwin dir
[01:08] <Noldorin> so nothing to do with ssh it seems
[01:08] <jelmer> Noldorin: are you specifying --directory=/ ?
[01:08] <Noldorin> yep
[01:08] <Noldorin> absolutely
[01:10] <Noldorin> hm
[01:14] <Noldorin> jelmer, any thoughts?
[01:15] <jelmer> Noldorin: what's the URL you're specifying to connect?
[01:16] <Noldorin> bzr://alex-serverb/test1
[01:16] <Noldorin>  bzr serve --directory=/ --allow-writes
[01:16] <Noldorin> on server
[01:19] <jelmer> Noldorin: and "bzr ls /test1" on the server works?
[01:20] <Noldorin> jelmer, correct
[01:33] <jelmer> Noldorin: hmm, no idea in that case. Perhaps a cygwin-specific issue?
[01:34] <Noldorin> maybe
[01:34] <Noldorin> hm
[01:34] <Noldorin> either way, quite annoying
[01:34] <Noldorin> let's see...
[01:38] <Noldorin> jelmer, maybe you could ocnfirm somehow?
[01:38] <Noldorin> confirm*
[01:52] <jelmer> Noldorin: sure
[02:33] <Noldorin> jelmer, cheers. let me know when you get any more info :-)
[02:43] <jelmer> Noldorin: ?
[02:43] <jelmer> Noldorin: what do you need me to confirm?
[02:44] <jelmer> I don't have cygwin (or Windows) here, I thought you were going to ask me for something else to confirm.
[02:44] <jelmer> sorry
[02:56] <Noldorin> why did you say sure then lol?
[02:56] <Noldorin> i meant that it *does* work without cygwin
[02:56] <Noldorin> all else the same
[02:56] <Noldorin> brb
[02:57] <jelmer> Noldorin: Yes, I'm sure it works without cygwin.
[02:57] <jelmer> (and just confirmed)
[09:36] <ggherdov> hi all. I'm looking for some docs on criss-cross merges (basically, what is the definition of criss-cross graph of branches?). bzr help criss-cross gave me a rough idea, in bzrlib/tests/test_merge.py there are some examples, but i'd like to get the general idea before digging into specific examples. Maybe a paper on three-way merge? any hint?
[11:34] <jelmer> hi ggherdov
[11:34] <ggherdov> hello jelmer
[11:35] <jelmer> ggherdov: see also 'bzr help criss-cross'
[11:36] <ggherdov> sure I did. Actually I came over this line in bzrlib/merger.py , class Merger :
[11:36] <ggherdov> lcas = self.revision_graph.find_lca(revisions[0], revisions[1])
[11:36] <ggherdov> if the list "lcas" have more than 1 elem,
[11:36] <ggherdov> i.e. more least common ancestors,
[11:37] <ggherdov> you get a criss cross (ie. a _is_criss_cross variable is set to True :-)
[11:37] <ggherdov> I was now looking into the find_lca method, to get a grasp on the algorithm.
[11:43] <jelmer> ggherdov: criss-cross isn't an algorithm but rather a situation that can occur during merge, are you asking about the lca merge algorithm?
[11:45] <ggherdov> jelmer: my question was: "what is the definition of criss-cross?". From the code, apparently, is: when you have more than one LCA. Now my question is: what is the definition of LCA? and for that, I am reading the algo that finds them.
[11:46] <jelmer> ggherdov: lowest common ancestor
[11:47] <ggherdov> how is an ancestor "lower" or "higher"?
[11:48] <ggherdov> I mean, it isn't just path's length,
[11:50] <ggherdov> since you have two paths to consider: A is a (common) ancestor of X and Y, so there is a path A-->X and A-->Y. How do you measure the distance pf ancestor A to the couple (X,Y), to compare with another ancestor, say B?
[11:50] <ggherdov> s/pf/of
[12:04] <jelmer> ggherdov: distance would be the number of edges between X and A and X and B
[12:05] <ggherdov> got it! it's in the file bzrlib.graph . Say that you have a bunch of ancestors. lowest common ancestor of two nodes are those ancestors such that none of their descendant is a common ancestor. pastebin of the comment in graph.py: http://pastebin.com/ijyzmSQs
[12:05] <jelmer> right
[12:05] <ggherdov> jelmer: isn't about distance, I was completely off road.
[12:06] <jelmer> ggherdov: right, it's about the relationship - the number of commits in between is irrelevant
[12:07] <ggherdov> Yeah. I am going to make a wikipedia entry right away :-D (joking)
[12:09] <jelmer> heh
[12:09] <jelmer> ggherdov: what are you trying to do?
[12:10] <ggherdov> bah, nothing specific. Last week at work I got this warning about "hey - you are trying to merge but there is a criss-cross", which looked voodoo to me, and I wanted to see things clearer
[12:10] <jelmer> ah, I see
[12:11] <jelmer> ggherdov: Do you think there's anything specific in the help text "bzr help criss-cross" that could be improved?
[12:11] <jelmer> *help text of
[12:12] <ggherdov> I had the impression that it didn't tell me what was happening, i.e. what the hell is criss-cross. Let me read it again.
[12:18] <ggherdov> no, I guess it was my inexperience. The help is good, it provides a practical explaination without a boring math definition:
[12:18] <ggherdov> Criss-crosses occur in a branch's history if two branches merge the same thing
[12:18] <ggherdov> and then merge one another, or if two branches merge one another at the same
[12:18] <ggherdov> time
[12:20] <ggherdov> the first is a "diamond" (clear criss cross), the second is a |X| (again clear criss cross).
[12:20] <ggherdov> then the help continues:
[12:20] <ggherdov> "Criss-crosses mean there is no good choice for a base"
[12:20] <ggherdov> which is just right into the problem.
[12:23] <ggherdov> maybe the point is that we're all a bit paranoid when merging (you are afraid of losing stuff silently), and anywhere you aren't 100 % in control you panic.
[12:24] <jelmer> ggherdov: yeah, I know that feeling :-)
[12:24] <ggherdov> :-)
[12:26] <jelmer> I don't think I've actually had merge lose stuff. Perhaps that message should be just a note rather than a warning.
[12:28] <ggherdov> Well, if there is even *just one* thoretically possible criss-cross situation where a bad thing can happen, i think that the warning is appropriate.
[12:29] <jelmer> ggherdov: with the default merge algorithm, the worst that can happen is that you get more conflicts than you would with --lca
[12:30] <ggherdov> I see. --lca triggers a different merge algorithm?
[12:31] <jelmer> ggherdov: yep
[12:33] <ggherdov> about the help: if anything, I would add a reference to some more specific documentation, like a technical paper or the code itself (like: to know more, read this paper / look into file XY)
[12:37] <ggherdov> jelmer: do you know if algorithms in bazaar are developed by the canonical folks, or rather the implementation of some standard stuff you can find in google scholar? if the latter, a tiny link somewhere would be nice I think.
[12:38] <jelmer> ggherdov: I'm not too familiar with the merge algorithm internals personally. I think it's a combination of both.
[12:38] <ggherdov> ok I see.
[15:58] <Noldorin> hey jelmer
[16:04] <jelmer> hi Noldorin
[16:04] <Noldorin> jelmer, found out the solution
[16:04] <Noldorin> jelmer, bzr+ssh is always relative to home directory it seems
[16:04] <Noldorin> at least in cygwin
[16:05] <Noldorin> it's designed this way
[16:05] <Noldorin> but i can get around with it by a) creatign a cygwin symolic link
[16:05] <Noldorin> b) creating a cygwin mount entry
[16:05] <Noldorin> :-)
[16:05] <jelmer> Noldorin: I'm pretty sure that's not design in bzr+ssh
[16:05] <Noldorin> jelmer, well either way, bzr+ssh doesn't work hwo it should with bzr+ssh urls in cygwin
[16:05] <Noldorin> but there is a solution
[16:05] <Noldorin> as i said ;-)
[16:05] <Noldorin> this works at least
[16:06] <jelmer> Noldorin: well, good to hear you found a solution at least
[16:06] <Noldorin> yeah :-)
[16:06] <Noldorin> jelmer, it's not a bug in bzr itself, i agree. either an explicit feature, or just the result of how cygwin operates
[16:29] <wgz> Noldorin: now you have it working, will you give in to my request to post about what you did on the bazaar list? :)
[16:29] <Noldorin> wgz, i was going to write a blog post, but okay...
[16:29] <Noldorin> what's the email?
[16:29] <wgz> blog post and link to it is fine also.
[16:29] <Noldorin> ok cool
[16:50] <Noldorin> jelmer, wgz any idea whether bzr+ssh urls on windows servers run bzr within cygwin or not?
[16:51] <jelmer> Noldorin: that depends on your ssh server
[16:51] <Noldorin> jelmer, openssh as i said before ;-)
[16:52] <Noldorin> but on windows of course
[16:52] <Noldorin> it is the cygwin sshd server
[16:52] <Noldorin> but
[16:52] <Noldorin> not sure whether it's actually run in the cygwin context
[16:52] <jelmer> Noldorin: natively compiled, or in cygwin?
[16:52] <jelmer> Noldorin: bzr simply connects to the ssh port - whatever happens behind there is up to you
[16:52] <Noldorin> jelmer, nothing is native in cygwin
[16:52] <Noldorin> you're thinking of msys
[16:52] <Noldorin> (mingw)
[16:52] <jelmer> Noldorin: openssh can be compiled natively perhaps?
[16:52] <Noldorin> nope
[16:53] <Noldorin> definitely not on windows
[16:53] <Noldorin> at least, no-one has tried it/released any source
[16:55] <Noldorin> jelmer, bah, i just figured it out
[16:56] <Noldorin> the problem is that the sshd uses cygwin fs
[16:56] <Noldorin> but not bzr exe itself
[16:56] <Noldorin> this explaisn everything :-(
[16:56] <Noldorin> hmm
[16:58] <jelmer> ahh
[17:00] <wgz> yeah, it's within the cygwin shell so it sees those paths
[17:00] <Noldorin> wgz, no, that's the thing. bzr *does not* run with the cygwin shell
[17:00] <Noldorin> it runs natively on windows
[17:01] <wgz> ah, if you call out to a native windows bzr, sure
[17:01] <Noldorin> native windows bzr is by far the easiest solution on windows
[17:01] <wgz> but the `bzr serve` command works from the cygwin shell
[17:01] <Noldorin> it doesn't like python on windows, esp. regarding plugins and whatnot
[17:02] <Noldorin> wgz, it works, but it uses the native win32 environment :-P
[17:02] <Noldorin> ok, so with a normal windows hard link:
[17:02] <Noldorin> it kind of works...but gives a remote lock error
[17:02] <Noldorin> http://pastebin.com/NmH0CU2j
[17:02] <Noldorin> any ideas? :-)
[17:04] <wgz> need to see the server side log
[17:04] <Noldorin> ok
[17:04] <Noldorin> one sec
[17:04] <wgz> likely you want a different BZR_REMOTE_PATH
[17:05] <Noldorin> wgz, http://pastebin.com/2ixVJHVh
[17:07] <Noldorin> no error there hmm
[17:09] <wgz> need some debug flags thrown in as well
[17:10] <Noldorin> wgz, tell me what to do :-)
[17:13] <wgz> need fullermd really, he has more cunning tricks than me
[17:14] <wgz> the basic issue is the chroot is in totally the wrong place apparently
[17:15] <Noldorin> heh
[17:15] <Noldorin> i see
[17:15] <wgz> Noldorin: <http://doc.bazaar.canonical.com/beta/en/user-reference/debug-flags-help.html>
[17:15] <Noldorin> wgz, well i'm happy to do some testing now, just give me orders.
[17:15] <Noldorin> otherwise we'll wait until fullermd is around
[17:15] <Noldorin> hmm
[17:15] <Noldorin> wgz, which ones, and on client or server?
[17:15] <wgz> in your config, set debug_flags to hpss and hpssdetail
[17:16] <Noldorin> ok
[17:16] <wgz> for the server, but but both wouldn't hurt
[17:16] <wgz> and hpssvfs too I guess
[17:16] <Noldorin> where is bzr.conf?
[17:16] <Noldorin> bazaar.conf*
[17:17] <wgz> run `bzr version` it will tell you what dir it's in
[17:18] <Noldorin> wgz, no file in the config dir. create one called bazaar.conf?
[17:20] <wgz> yeah, you want [DEFAULT] at the top too.
[17:20] <Noldorin> kk
[17:20] <wgz> if you run `bzr config debug_flags=hpss,hpssdetail,hpssvfs it's do it for you think
[17:20] <Noldorin> yep just did that, ta
[17:21] <wgz> then try the init again and paste the client and server logs again
[17:23] <Noldorin> http://pastebin.com/uWrLUtsx
[17:23] <Noldorin> (server)
[17:23] <Noldorin> err wait
[17:23] <Noldorin> that's someone else's paste
[17:23] <Noldorin> weird
[17:23] <Noldorin> http://pastie.org/3036664
[17:24] <wgz> try again with /testreallyuniquenamethistime ?
[17:25] <wgz> ...really I want to see what the underlying fs path is getting mapped to...
[17:25] <wgz> wait, no, misread, that does create the dir
[17:25] <Noldorin> cleint is same
[17:25] <Noldorin> yeah
[17:25] <Noldorin> it does
[17:25] <Noldorin> the actual dir/repo/branch looks like it's created fine
[17:26] <Noldorin> just the stupid remotelock error
[17:26] <wgz> in what location?
[17:26] <Noldorin> C:\projects
[17:26] <wgz> need some way of getting the actual error/traceback on the server side...
[17:27] <Noldorin> wgz, -Derror maybe?
[17:27] <Noldorin> see the page you linked me to
[17:27] <wgz> throw in "lock" and "strict_locks" and yeah, why not "error" as well.
[17:29] <Noldorin> http://pastie.org/3036698
[17:29] <Noldorin> wgz, there
[17:31] <wgz> okay, that's helpfuly.
[17:31] <wgz> -y
[17:32] <wgz> looks like a lockdir bug.
[17:32] <wgz> I wonder what cwd is from the perspective of bzr
[17:35] <Noldorin> yeah
[17:35] <Noldorin> hmm
[17:42] <wgz> okay, it feels like something is holding open the '8fuv1clmc4.tmp' file preventing it from being renamed into place
[17:43] <wgz> but it's a directory, so I'm not even sure if that can happen
[17:55] <jelmer> hah, bzr run time is finally creeping towards 0.1s again
[17:55] <wgz> yeah, we regressed that pretty badly.
[17:57]  * jelmer has a nasty patch that copies urllib.quote and urllib.unquote into bzrlib.urlutils
[17:57] <jelmer> it avoids import socket and ssl during normal operation though
[18:01] <wgz> okay, I think I understand the lockdir issue
[18:03] <wgz> jelmer: the other option would be something like the inspect_for_copy hack :)
[18:03] <wgz> I don't think you should feel too bad about reimplementing bits of urllib though
[18:03] <wgz> everyone else does.
[18:04] <wgz> Noldorin: is there any antivirus/other filsystem scanning software on your server?
[18:06] <wgz> LocalTransport.put_bytes_non_atomic etc are pretty bad
[18:07] <wgz> not safe in face of signals, way too much platform workaround code
[18:13] <wgz> ha, I wonder.
[18:15] <Noldorin> wgz, not on the server i don't believe...
[18:15] <Noldorin> no antivirus
[18:15] <Noldorin> wgz, what do you think it is then?
[18:29] <Noldorin> wb wgz
[18:29] <Noldorin> did you get my messages?
[18:31] <wgz> nope, sorry, paste me in pm?
[18:35] <wgz> thanks.
[18:35] <wgz> okay, so lockdir works like so
[18:36] <wgz> create a folder with a temp name
[18:36] <wgz> create a file inside the folder with info in it
[18:36] <wgz> try to rename the folder to "held" to take the lock
[18:37] <wgz> if that fails, assume someone else already has the lock
[18:37] <Noldorin> right
[18:37] <Noldorin> trying that now
[18:37] <Noldorin> hmm
[18:37] <wgz> however, it can fail for reasons other than "held" already existing
[18:37] <Noldorin> wgz, i'm the only user using this btw
[18:37] <Noldorin> oh wait, you're just explaining how it works
[18:37] <Noldorin> okay...
[18:37] <wgz> one way to get the error you had is just by another process having the info file open when the rename happens
[18:38] <wgz> this is incorrectly reported as LockContention
[18:38] <Noldorin> right
[18:38] <wgz> actually debugging this without changing code is hard.
[18:39] <Noldorin> yeah, so i thought
[18:39] <wgz> can you run the bzr serve from a source tree?
[18:39] <Noldorin> sure
[18:39] <wgz> the problem is a lot of our code here is... not great
[18:39] <Noldorin> hah
[18:40] <Noldorin> wgz, you trying to say some bzr is the composite work of monkeys on typewriters? ;-)
[18:40] <wgz> no, but the layering and platform specific hacks work against sanity in many respects
[18:40] <Noldorin> okay
[18:41] <Noldorin> wgz, so not all the codebase is bad huh? :-P
[18:41] <Noldorin> wgz, running it from a specific branch...just on the bzr:// protocol eh?
[18:42] <wgz> right, I should probably see if I can repo anything here, but I suspect not
[18:43] <Noldorin> wgz, ooh, this is kind-of-good news
[18:43] <Noldorin> a local bzr init in that directory fails
[18:43] <Noldorin> with LockContention
[18:43] <Noldorin> with a traceback
[18:43] <wgz> pastebin?
[18:43] <Noldorin> http://pastie.org/3037040
[18:44] <wgz> it may also be a geniune permission error, given you're on a newer windows
[18:44] <Noldorin> just check i have full control on that dir
[18:44] <Noldorin> so unlikely
[18:46] <wgz> what exists inside Shared-Projects\foo\.bzr\branch-lock ?
[18:46] <wgz> if there are any files, pastebin me them
[18:47] <wgz> (also see if, from Shared-Projects, you can do `bzr init newfoo`)
[18:47] <Noldorin> wgz, no files
[18:49] <Noldorin> identical
[18:49] <Noldorin> result
[18:49] <Noldorin> with that command
[18:49] <wgz> okay, now
[18:49] <wgz> set BZR_PDB=1
[18:49] <wgz> then run the command again
[18:50] <wgz> will get you into the debugger at hopefully, line 641 in lockdir
[18:52] <wgz> if you then type "self._attempt_lock()" you should get the same exception as before
[18:52] <wgz> we can then try stepping into that
[18:55] <Noldorin> *** LockContention: Could not acquire lock "LockDir(file:///Z:/Alex/Shared-Projects/foo/.bzr/branch-
[18:55] <Noldorin> lock)":
[18:56] <Noldorin> wgz, i end up with that
[18:56] <Noldorin> on self._attempt_lock
[18:56] <wgz> ace.
[18:57] <Noldorin> so what next? :-)
[18:58] <teusje> looks like the bzr documentation for windows is very out of date
[18:58] <teusje> isn't it Noldorin :)
[18:59] <wgz> Noldorin: "debug self._attempt_lock()", then start hitting 's'
[19:00] <wgz> till you get inside _attempt_lock
[19:00] <wgz> then use 'n' till you get to the 'self.transport.rename' line
[19:02] <Noldorin> teusje, most of the docs are platform-agnostic ;-)
[19:02] <Noldorin> but some of it is old yes
[19:02] <Noldorin> heh
[19:02] <Noldorin> wgz okies
[19:03] <teusje> :p
[19:04] <teusje> windows default paths that don't exist anymore in windows vista/win 7 :p
[19:04] <wgz> so, "n" is forwards, and "s" is forwards-and-in
[19:04] <wgz> we want to go in to the rename
[19:04] <Noldorin> got it
[19:04] <Noldorin> wgz, step over and step into as we say on windows :-)
[19:04] <wgz> get to the except clause, where we have the real error from os.rename
[19:05] <Noldorin> wgz, just one s i think?
[19:05] <Noldorin> not sure i'm inside it yet
[19:05] <wgz> this should be in transport/local.py
[19:05] <wgz> hit 's' if unsure
[19:05] <Noldorin> k
[19:05] <wgz> but can always redo if you accidentally jump over
[19:05] <Noldorin> cool, how?
[19:06] <Noldorin> PermissionDenied: Permissi...s denied)
[19:06] <Noldorin> > z:\alex\shared-projects\bzrlib\lockdir.pyo(243)_attempt_lock()
[19:06] <Noldorin> wgz, get that before i get to self.transport.rename
[19:06] <wgz> that looks like the error from that line
[19:07] <wgz> we need to get into the call, so more 's' and less 'n'
[19:07] <Noldorin> wgz, do you fancy just teamviewer-ing in? might go a lot quicker this way
[19:08] <Noldorin> how do i back up then?
[19:09] <Noldorin> *awaits command*
[19:09] <vila> Noldorin: format c:
[19:09]  * vila ducks
[19:09] <teusje> vila tries to be funny
[19:09] <Noldorin> *anticipates vila's duck and clobbers him with a Windows 7 install DVD*
[19:10] <vila> . o O (Only way to be is to try ;)
[19:10] <wgz> Noldorin: j 241
[19:10] <Noldorin> wgz, then just 's' until... ?
[19:10] <wgz> right
[19:10] <wgz> Noldorin: could do some desktop sharing thing if you want, I'd need to install things
[19:11] <Noldorin> wgz, actually teamviewer can run locally without install, that's what nice about it :-)
[19:12] <Noldorin> wgz firstly though, http://pastie.org/3037180
[19:13] <wgz> ace.
[19:13] <teusje> Noldorin that it is not supported on their windows xp that they use for writing documentation :p
[19:13] <wgz> do "p path_from" and "p path_to"
[19:13] <Noldorin> u'Z:/Alex/Shared-Projects/foo2/.bzr/branch-lock/j2robxgreu.tmp'
[19:14] <Noldorin> and u'Z:/Alex/Shared-Projects/foo2/.bzr/branch-lock/held'
[19:14] <Noldorin> respectively
[19:14] <wgz> then you can do "os.exists(path_from)" and "os.exists(path_to)"
[19:14] <Noldorin> teusje, heh
[19:14] <wgz> I expect path_from to exist, and path_to not to.
[19:14] <Noldorin> wgz, module has no attribute exists
[19:15] <wgz> *os.path.exists, sorry
[19:15] <Noldorin> wgz, you expectations were correct.
[19:15] <Noldorin> your*
[19:16] <wgz> ok, now "p os.listdir(path_from)"
[19:16] <Noldorin> wgz, just u'info'
[19:16] <wgz> then "f = open(os.path.join(path_from, 'info'))
[19:17] <wgz> "p f.read()"
[19:17] <wgz> "f.close()"
[19:17] <Noldorin> 'hostname: Alex-ServerB\nnonce: 2a540tvz6rmuz5p97tvz\npid: 3900\nstart_time:<PHONE_NUMBER>\nuser: Alex\
[19:17] <Noldorin> n'
[19:18] <wgz> "os.remove(os.path.join(path_from, 'info'))"
[19:18] <Noldorin> done
[19:18] <wgz> and it worked, heh.
[19:18] <wgz> so, discounts the handle issue
[19:18] <wgz> now, "os.rename(path_from, path_to)"
[19:19] <Noldorin> *** WindowsError: [Error 5] Access is denied
[19:20] <wgz> "os.stat(path_from)"
[19:20] <wgz> "os.remove(path_from)"
[19:20] <Noldorin> nt.stat_result(st_mode=16895, st_ino=0L, st_dev=0, st_nlink=0, st_uid=0, st_gid=0, st_size=0L, st_at
[19:20] <Noldorin> ime=1324235908L, st_mtime=1324235908L, st_ctime=1324235155L)
[19:20] <Noldorin> *** WindowsError: [Error 5] Access is denied: u'Z:/Alex/Shared-Projects/foo2/.bzr/branch-lock/j2robx
[19:20] <Noldorin> greu.tmp'
[19:20] <wgz> cute.
[19:20] <Noldorin> is that informative at least?
[19:20] <Noldorin> heh
[19:21] <wgz> "os.getcwd()"
[19:22] <Noldorin> 'Z:\\Alex\\Shared-Projects'
[19:22] <wgz> okay, so, everything is sane.
[19:22] <Noldorin> heh
[19:22] <Noldorin> what's going on then?
[19:23] <wgz> except we have created a directory, that we can't rename or remove.
[19:23] <Noldorin> hah
[19:23] <Noldorin> nice
[19:24] <wgz> have you got process explorer installed?
[19:24] <Noldorin> wgz, i *literally* just started up procexp 2 seconds before you said that :-)
[19:24] <Noldorin> to check for locks
[19:24] <Noldorin> by other procs
[19:24] <Noldorin> heh
[19:25] <wgz> right, find handles with substring "Z:\Alex\Shared-Projects"
[19:25] <Noldorin> wgz, no open handles on it
[19:25] <Noldorin> none at all
[19:25] <wgz> okay, so that discounts the theory.
[19:25] <Noldorin> permissions look fine on it to :-S
[19:25] <Noldorin> hrmm
[19:26] <Noldorin> wgz, interestingly i have no prob deleting it from winexplorer
[19:27] <Noldorin> what credentials is bzr.exe running with?...
[19:27] <wgz> the code doesn't seem to be suprising either...
[19:28] <wgz> potentally not the right ones, but letting you make a dir you can't remove doesn't sound like a standard persm issue ither
[19:28] <wgz> ha, I mistyped an instruction earlier, than may have confused things
[19:29] <wgz> want to try the screen sharing thing? what do I need to see your desktop rather than visa versa?
[19:30] <Noldorin> wgz, sure, we can do that. teamviewer is already set up here
[19:30] <Noldorin> wgz, actually, mind waiting 20 minsm as i need to eat?
[19:31] <wgz> go for it.
[19:31] <wgz> I shall ponder in the mean time.
[19:31] <Noldorin> wgz, something tells me though that because Windows Explorer can delete the dir fine but Python can't, the Samba share on the directory is confusing it. maybe the Windows shell sends a notification to the Samba server to release it before deleting
[19:31] <Noldorin> *shrug*
[19:31] <Noldorin> be back soon!
[19:33] <roryy> should directory names in entries in dirstate (in dirstate field _dirblocks) be unicode or bytes?
[19:34] <wgz> they're utf-8 bytes.
[19:35] <roryy> i'm looking at bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/185211
[19:35] <roryy> and i've run robert collins demo script with pdb
[19:35] <roryy> they look like bytes to me
[19:35] <roryy> but my python-fu is not super-strong, so I may be missing something
[19:37] <wgz> oh, oh man
[19:38] <wgz> nice bug rorry, that repo script is hilarious
[19:39] <roryy> yeah, i dunno why all those weird characters
[19:39] <wgz> looks a lot like a 'safe' unicode bug
[19:39] <roryy> what does that mean?
[19:40] <wgz> I bet you can double-decode as utf-8
[19:40] <wgz> yep, win.
[19:41] <wgz> >>> b = "\xc3\x83\xe2\x80\x9e\xc3\x83\xe2\x80\x93\xc3\x83\xc5\x93"
[19:41] <wgz> >>> u = b.decode("utf-8")
[19:41] <wgz> >>> b2 = u.encode("CP1252")
[19:41] <wgz> >>> u2 = b.decode("utf-8")
[19:42] <wgz> basically, a bug due to bad handling of which encoding is used for what
[19:45] <wgz> the tricky part is the failure comes after the bug has already happened
[19:45] <wgz> have you tried running the script with -Ddirstate added?
[19:46] <roryy> no
[19:46] <roryy> ah, track dirstate activity
[19:47] <roryy> interesting that u2==u in this case
[19:47] <roryy> oh, hang on
[19:47] <roryy> did you mean u2=b2.decode() there?
[19:47] <wgz> ah yes, my error
[19:47] <wgz> >>> u2 = b2.decode("utf-8")
[19:48] <roryy> ok, that is saner
[19:48] <wgz> >>> u
[19:48] <wgz> u'\xc3\u201e\xc3\u2013\xc3\u0153'
[19:48] <wgz> >>> u2
[19:48] <wgz> u'\xc4\xd6\xdc'
[19:48] <roryy> i thought somehow cp1252 and utf-8 had a weird equivalence
[19:52] <roryy> hmm, -Ddirstate doesn't obviously output anything
[19:55] <wgz> it goes in .bzr.log
[19:55] <roryy> ah-ha, thank you
[20:00] <wgz> I suggest cutting down the filename to the shortest thing you need to reproduce the bug, then seeing if you can track when it turns into something that doesn't match what's on disk
[20:13] <roryy> the error is triggered with just one non-ASCII character in the filename
[20:14] <roryy> and in the entry, i see only 'abc' for the directory name, where I expected to see u'abcÃ'
[20:15] <roryy> the -Ddirstate and trace.mutter look useful; might be easier than working with pdb
[20:23] <Noldorin> hi wgz
[20:23] <Noldorin> back
[20:26] <wgz> hey Noldorin
[20:27] <Noldorin> hi
[20:27] <Noldorin> any more thoughts? :-)
[20:28] <wgz> only for a different bug with a similar symptom I'm afraid
[20:28] <wgz> want to try some more debugging?
[20:28] <Noldorin> yes please
[20:29] <wgz> okay, if you pm me the id thingy let's try teamviewer
[20:34] <roryy> wgz: thanks for the help.  i'm off to sleep.
[20:38] <wgz> night roryy
[21:41] <wgz> bug 716507 ...not completely relevent
[21:41] <jelmer> wgz: btw, what are your thoughts on using __future__.unicode_literals?
[21:42] <wgz> it's a bad idea.
[21:46] <jelmer> wgz: because string handling in python3 isn't quite right either?
[21:48] <wgz> just breaks too many basic things
[21:48] <jelmer> wgz: well, we'll have to deal with that at some point, if we ever want to support python3
[21:49] <wgz> the number of things that need to be str/unicode are fewer than those that need to be str/str
[21:50] <wgz> that's 3/2 confusingly...
[21:50] <jelmer> ah, hmm
[22:36] <thumper> morning
[22:36] <thumper> does anyone remember a simple way to use meld to see the diff between two branches?
[22:36] <thumper> or am I going to have to look it up again :)
[23:51] <poolie> hi all
[23:51] <wgz> hey poolie
[23:51] <poolie> hi wgz
[23:52] <poolie> i'm riding a pangolin
[23:52] <poolie> it's bit bumpy
[23:52] <poolie> but good
[23:53] <wgz> yeah, the guys on thursday were talking about that too


[04:14] <AndChat|99281> morning everyone
[05:08] <Kilos> morning bushtech  bduk1  inetpro  and others
[06:19] <ThatGraemeGuy> mornings
[06:35] <bduk> Hi ThatGraemeGuy
[07:24] <Kilos> hi ThatGraemeGuy
[07:46] <ThatGraemeGuy> hey Kilos
[08:03] <Kilos> morning superfly
[08:23] <Kilos> wbb
[11:28] <bduk> Kilos:  waar is almal vandag? dis baie stil hier
[11:38] <ThatGraemeGuy> .
[11:39] <bduk> maaz : you there?
[11:39] <Maaz> bduk: Huh?
[11:40] <bushtech> ThatGraemeGuy,  don't know what 1 . means but i'll raise you 1
[11:40] <bushtech> ..
[11:40] <ThatGraemeGuy> .....oooooOOOOO
[11:41] <bushtech> you win :(
[11:42] <ThatGraemeGuy> muhahahaha!
[14:39] <inetpro> good mornings
[14:41] <bduk1> Hi inetpro
[14:42] <inetpro> hello bduk1
[14:42] <inetpro> why you so quiet today?
[14:44] <bduk1> The  channel was quiet
[14:45]  * inetpro went to home affairs this morning for application of id
[14:45] <inetpro> can't believe the number of people in the queues
[14:45] <bduk1> Ish thats bad hope you took lots of patience with
[14:46] <inetpro> the process took just more than 4 hours
[14:46] <inetpro> came like 10 minutes after opening and was like 176 in the line
[14:48] <bduk1> Ish, went to the bank this morning and a guy behind me said he went to the postofice yesterday to renew his postbox, he was seveth in the row and the gy
[14:48] <bduk1> Guy being helped took 1 hour and 15 minutes
[14:48] <inetpro> ai!
[14:49] <inetpro> one guy completely lost it in the end
[14:50] <inetpro> started shouting and screaming at officials, and I think it was just because he didn't bring his relevant docs
[14:50] <bduk1> I dont have patience for that, ill struggle for hours with my pc, my car my animals what ever but dont let me stand in a que.
[14:51]  * inetpro hates queues also
[14:51] <inetpro> I avoid them like a plague
[14:51] <inetpro> but sometimes you just have to go with the flow
[14:52] <bduk1> What make me angry like at our postofice, you go to renew yor licence or po box, waiting in the line for hours and when you get to the front r
[14:53] <bduk1> They tell you the system is down, why not put a not up somewhere and say whatever system is of then  i wont stand there and come back next day
[14:54] <inetpro> so much that can be done to improve things
[14:55] <bduk1> True simple things
[14:55] <inetpro> exactly
[14:56] <inetpro> starting with simple notice boards to inform people in the queue about relevant documents for different scenarios
[14:56] <bduk1> Yip
[14:56] <inetpro> luckily info is on the web these days, but why not put it up on notice boards right there as well?
[14:57] <bduk1> Did you get the new id card
[14:57] <inetpro> has to go through a process at head office
[14:58] <inetpro> takes anything from 2 to 4 weeks IIRC
[14:58] <inetpro> will be notified by SMS to come collect
[14:59] <bduk1> Home afairs, sars and trafic licence departme ts are the wors
[14:59] <inetpro> yep, terrible
[14:59] <inetpro> though I must say that sars has become very efficient
[15:00] <bduk1> Since they went online i stay away there
[15:01]  * inetpro actually prefers going there these days
[15:01] <inetpro> you know when you walk out of there it's all done
[15:02] <bduk1> True
[15:04] <bduk1> At least the weekend is here
[15:04] <inetpro> weekend?
[15:05] <bduk1> Like Saterday and Sunday
[15:05] <inetpro> hehe, we're still on Thursday man
[15:06] <bduk1> I know but only one day left
[15:06] <inetpro> ok
[15:06] <bduk1> Much better than four days left
[15:09] <inetpro> :-)
[15:11] <inetpro> Linux Mint 17.1 Rebecca KDE Edition release today
[15:35] <bduk1> I stick with ubuntu
[15:37] <bduk1> Anyone using clearos
[16:11]  * inetpro sticks with Kubuntu but it's always interesting to see what other distros are coming up with
[18:53] <bushtech>  Kilos ! I'm afraid to ask?
[18:55] <Kilos> lolol
[18:55] <Kilos> ya you should be
[18:55] <Kilos> something funny with that ssd thing
[18:55] <bushtech> Ag nee!
[18:55] <Kilos> cant even format to ext2 in 5 hours
[18:56] <Kilos> now its out where it should have been for starters
[18:57] <Kilos> will work on it in usb mode so i still can go on here
[19:00] <Kilos> its messed up my 1TB as well so the good 1TB kde dont even see it
[19:00] <bushtech> in that line, which is the best HD format for linux , ext2, 3 ,4 ? anybody know or tried them all?
[19:00] <Kilos> 4
[19:01] <Kilos> i only use ext2 with gparted because it can only check the drive in etx2
[19:01] <bushtech> ja, jy het seker wragtig almal probeer en nog 'n paar andr ook
[19:01] <Kilos> ext4 has protection stuff built in to save drives with power cuts
[19:02] <Kilos> i forget whats its called but it safer to lose power with ext4 drives
[19:02] <bushtech> and I suppse changing formats is basically a reformat?
[19:03] <Kilos> ya
[19:04] <bushtech> don't think even ext 4 will save us from the prince of darkness
[19:04] <Kilos> you got disk utility there
[19:04] <Kilos> and gparted
[19:05] <Kilos> ext4 is the best to use
[19:05] <Kilos> for us anyway
[19:08] <bushtech> hmm, quite chuffed, I can see that at least one of my drives in raid is ext 4 (ver 1.0)
[19:09] <Kilos> lol
[19:11] <bushtech> so do you know that there is something wrong with the ssd?
[19:13] <Kilos> there must be, i got slower and slower and hung when copying folders and now it wont accept windows or ubuntu
[19:13] <Kilos> the first day with kde was magic the things started taking longer to happen
[19:14] <Kilos> ill move it to my old pc and see what happens there
[19:14] <bushtech> and have you got some utility that can tell you whats wrong exactly?
[19:14] <Kilos> atm i dont even want to see it
[19:15] <Kilos> i downloaded some ssd tools but i think they were on it
[19:15] <Kilos> will look here maybe i got them here hehe
[19:16] <Kilos> ya here i got a tool called samsung magician
[19:18] <Kilos> a firmware update might help. but disk utility says it good with no bad sectors
[19:20] <bushtech> thats odd then, try the firmware update
[19:24] <Kilos> i still have to learn how
[19:25] <Kilos> scared of firmware upgrading, best way to brick drives if you mess up
[19:26] <bushtech> where you got the firmware update there should be instructions on how to do it
[19:27] <Kilos> ya i think so but all that kind of info is normally for boffins
[19:28] <Kilos> oh have you joined our mailing list
[19:28] <Kilos> our other bally needs help
[19:28] <bushtech> nope
[19:28] <Kilos> he is older than me
[19:28] <Kilos> http://bit.ly/MCOujZ
[19:28] <bushtech> I'm on too many mailing lists
[19:29] <Kilos> kom kom nou
[19:29] <Kilos> ours is the most important one
[19:29] <Kilos> and not often more than 5 mails a day unless there is a prob
[19:30] <bushtech> Jan Greeff
[19:30] <Kilos> ya
[19:31] <Kilos> havent you had that same prob
[19:31] <Kilos> i have but forget what i did to fix it
[19:31] <Kilos> you get 640x480 resolution
[19:32] <bushtech> well on a monitor you could prob just press auto but on a laptop?
[19:34] <Kilos> im sure the prob is with the graphics drivers
[19:34] <Kilos> but with that resolution you cant even see the dash to start additional drivers
[19:40] <Kilos> eish the samsung disk magician is for windows
[19:41] <bushtech> het jy windows iewers?
[19:42] <Kilos> ya
[19:43] <Kilos> maar nie vir my lekker om dit te gebruik nie
[19:43] <Kilos> ill first read up more
[19:44] <bushtech> kan hy met die cursor buttons op die groot sceen rond beweeg?
[19:53] <Kilos> ek dink so ya maar dan kry jy vensters wat to groot is dat jy dit nie kan kleiner maak nie of skyf sodat jy die ok knoppie onder kan tiek nbie
[19:53] <Kilos> nie
[19:55] <superfly> So glad I have a 2TB hard drive. I just made a "video" file which is 355GB
[19:56] <Kilos> whew
[19:56] <bushtech> isnt a bluray disc about 50Gb?
[19:57] <Kilos> ?
[19:58] <Kilos> never even seen one
[19:58] <Kilos> Maaz  good blueray disk size
[19:58] <Maaz> Kilos: Huh?
[19:58] <Kilos> ai!
[19:58] <Kilos> Maaz  google  blueray disk size
[19:58] <Maaz> Kilos: "Blu-ray Disc - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blu-ray_Disc :: "1TB per disc: Sony and Panasonic team up on next-gen Blu-ray ..." http://www.extremetech.com/gaming/178166-1tb-per-disc-sony-and-panasonic-team-up-on-next-gen-blu-ray :: "Pioneer Increases Disc Size to 500GB - Blu-ray.com" http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=1616 ::
[19:58] <Maaz> "What is Blu-ray? (Blu-ray, Blu-ray Disc, not Blue-ray or ... - Blu-ray.com" http://www.bl…
[19:59] <Kilos> looks like 500g to 1TB
[19:59] <Kilos> but wont be cheap i think
[20:00] <bushtech> I'm talking about bluray movie disks not storage
[20:00] <bushtech> 355gb just seems huge
[20:04] <Kilos> massive
[20:05] <Kilos> bigger than the lord of the rings trilogy
[20:07] <superfly> bushtech: it's uncompressed frames
[20:14] <Kilos> hi captine
[20:15] <captine> evening all
[20:19] <Kilos> ai!
[20:19] <Kilos> poor jan struggling
[20:20] <captine> ?
[20:21] <Kilos> 12.4 install is hanging on the black screen that says it is
[20:21] <Kilos> going down for a reboot after the fresh install. Last time it did that,
[20:21] <Kilos> I force-quit it after a while and then got "file '/boot/grub/i386
[20:21] <Kilos> -pc/normal.mod' not found" when I tried to restart.
[20:23] <captine> not fun.  i just finished struggling to get 14.04 working on my mac mini,=...  now i am doing the massive software installs for all the tools not included on the iso
[20:23] <captine> Kilos, i wish i could help.  not sure where to start
[20:24] <captine> what machine is it on?
[20:24] <Kilos> its ugly when an install reboots to black screen
[20:24] <Kilos> its jan greef on the mailing list on a lappy i think
[20:25] <captine> my mini did that on my first install.  dont think it liked my attempted btrfs home directory...
[20:25] <Kilos> Proline laptop
[20:26] <Kilos> if he can just get to a terminal ill get him going in sure
[20:29] <Kilos> something wrong with ubuntu-desktop install
[20:31] <captine> can u not pass some arguments at grub
[20:31] <captine> or does it not even get to the grub screen ?
[20:32] <Kilos> i dont know
[20:32] <Kilos> waiting for a reply
[20:33] <Kilos> It says "grub rescue> _" (cursor) but "sudo" is "unknown command"
[20:34] <captine> my standard is to just re-install... but might not be appropriate
[20:34] <captine> also, not really fixing it
[20:34] <Kilos> eish i been there before
[20:34] <captine> just covering it up
[20:35] <Kilos> he has installed twice already
[20:35] <captine> is it a fairly new machine?
[20:37] <captine> i need to crash
[20:38] <captine> i really dislike the software centre... lol
[20:38] <captine> always hanging on me
[20:38] <Kilos> yes software centre sucks , synaptic way better
[20:38] <Kilos> its slow as molasses as well the centre
[20:41] <Kilos> and synaptic can fix broken packages as well
[21:05] <Kilos> night all. sleep tight
[21:06] <Kilos> ohi nlsthzn  didnt see you but moeg now
[21:06] <Kilos> see ya tomorrow


[03:08] <charlie-tca> ochosi: article looks good to me. Thanks
[09:58] <knome> 23:30  AlanBell: knome: the IS team should have been working on upgrading the canonical wiki this week, and in theory they might announce some downtime on the main wiki for the upgrade in the next week or two.
[10:12] <TheSheep> finally moin 1.9.3?
[10:21] <knome> i suppose so, but hey...
[10:22] <knome> 23:30  AlanBell: believe it when you see it
[10:53] <ochosi> TheSheep: a new moin-version would mean more speed?
[10:54] <knome> ochosi, yes, apparently
[10:54] <knome> at least that's what they are saying
[10:54] <ochosi> TheSheep: btw, i wrote an article for UWN or the blog (not sure where they wanna publish it in the end) and that's pretty much continuing the nice discussion we had about project management and feedback
[10:54] <TheSheep> ochosi: more importantly, security fixes
[10:55] <ochosi> right
[10:55] <TheSheep> ochosi: that's great, I will be sure to read it and comment :)
[10:58] <ochosi> TheSheep: thanks
[11:01] <ochosi> pleia2: i read something in the meeting minutes from yesterday about an account for me, could you fill me in what that's exactly about?
[11:01] <ochosi> pleia2: drupal == xubuntu.org?
[11:45] <mr_pouit> daily not oversized (+3Mb)
[11:45] <mr_pouit> hal isn't installed by default anymore now that we removed exaile
[11:46] <mr_pouit> there's a thunderbird-globalmenu pulled in though, but it's only useful to unity :(
[13:59] <ochosi> pleia2, knome: the front-page of elementaryos is a good example of a nice slideshow: http://elementaryos.org/
[14:04] <knome> ochosi, yeah, and if js is turned off, the page looks like shit
[14:06] <ochosi> knome: well, i'm not saying we have to take this implementation
[14:06] <ochosi> it's just a nice idea of letting the apps scroll by
[14:13] <Sysi> i think people like more when things don't move automatically but when they press button
[14:15] <ochosi> not sure, i think xfce.org also does a good job at that
[14:15] <ochosi> (and it's moving by default)
[14:15] <ochosi> same for the slideshow in the installer
[14:32] <charlie-tca> Good morning
[15:16] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit: did we get the shutdown bug fixed ? I can not reliably reproduce it
[15:17] <charlie-tca> bug 711571
[15:20] <mr_pouit> nope, it's not fixed afaik
[15:20] <mr_pouit> I can reproduce it from time to time
[15:21] <mr_pouit> not reliably either :/
[15:27] <charlie-tca> thanks
[15:27] <charlie-tca> That seems to be our "bad bug"
[17:04] <knome> charlie-tca, what do you want to have in the slideshow?
[17:04] <ochosi> hey charlie-tca
[17:04] <ochosi> knome and me thought we could work on updating the slideshow
[17:05] <charlie-tca> in a meeting right now,
[17:05] <charlie-tca> give me a few minutes, okay?
[17:05] <knome> sure
[17:05] <ochosi> sure, it's not likely we'll finish anything by then ;)
[17:07] <charlie-tca> Okay
[17:07] <charlie-tca> what do I want?
[17:08] <charlie-tca> I want a shot of the desktop, with the new theme and launcher panel
[17:08] <charlie-tca> or something like that?
[17:08] <charlie-tca> any chance of a screen shot of gmusicbrowser?
[17:09] <charlie-tca> the web chat screen is great! People seem to really like that capability
[17:09] <charlie-tca> and other than that, I am wide open
[17:10] <charlie-tca> What do you want in there? You are both very good at that kind of "people like this" thing.
[17:10] <knome> we were thinking of adding some introductions to default apps
[17:10] <knome> and generally, cutting down the slide text length
[17:11] <charlie-tca> too much reading?
[17:11] <knome> comparing to the ubuntu slides, the xubuntu slides feel like novels
[17:11] <charlie-tca> do it, I think.
[17:11] <knome> too many things going on, really
[17:11] <knome> try to focus on descriptive screenshots
[17:12] <charlie-tca> Like I said, you both are good at that kind of stuff. I could screw it up good :-)
[17:12] <charlie-tca> If you need me to get screenshots, let me know
[17:12] <knome> ochosi has a natty installation, so not necessarily
[17:13] <charlie-tca> but his is more like the real installs... mine is highly modified ;-)
[17:13] <knome> so better use his shots then :P
[17:13] <charlie-tca> well, then
[17:13] <knome> we still need to get the new menu icon in before taking the final shot of the desktop
[17:14] <charlie-tca> yup
[17:14] <knome> probably won't add one big shot of the whole desktop, but little pieces or so
[17:14] <charlie-tca> that works when done right
[17:14] <knome> the user will see the desktop anyway
[17:15] <charlie-tca> a shot of firefox 4 would be good, too. It is quite different than what the users are seeing in maverick, isn't it?
[17:15] <knome> bzr branch lp:ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu
[17:15] <knome> ./test-slideshow.sh
[17:15] <knome> ^ charlie-tca
[17:15] <charlie-tca> isn't there a ubiquity-slideshow-xubuntu?
[17:15] <knome> a bit at least, i think
[17:15] <knome> the xubuntu slideshow is in the same repository
[17:15] <knome> try it
[17:16] <knome> you get to choose which slideshow you want to test
[17:16] <ochosi> hm, i think that ff4 still has the menubar on by default
[17:16] <charlie-tca> Oh, I get to see it every time I test a11y in Ubuntu
[17:16] <ochosi> only if you change that it looks different (but i might be wrong)
[17:16] <charlie-tca> I don't pay much attention to it
[17:16] <ochosi> :)
[17:17] <ochosi> the ubuntu slideshow is also in that repo
[17:17] <knome> mm
[17:17] <ochosi> actually all ubiquity slideshows are there
[17:17] <knome> and kubuntu
[17:17] <knome> yup
[17:17] <charlie-tca> ff4 has the menubar, but they moved the tab bar and toolbars enough to make it hard to learn
[17:17] <ochosi> right
[17:17] <ochosi> should check out the default again at some point
[17:17] <ochosi> even my natty ff is modified
[17:17] <charlie-tca> You can not click a tab to bookmark it anymore, either. You have to right-click the page itself
[17:18] <charlie-tca> and they removed the bottom stuff, like when updating a page or going to a link.
[17:18] <charlie-tca> well, maybe just screwed that up too
[17:20] <charlie-tca> I will be happy with a slideshow that is current for Natty.
[17:21] <charlie-tca> Now I am going test the images again. I heard they are broken again today
[17:21] <ochosi> ok, we'll try to update it good :)
[17:22] <charlie-tca> ochosi, knome : Thank you for doing the slideshow!
[17:22] <ochosi> np
[17:23] <ochosi> it really would be a shame if the natty slideshow would still be so out-of-date as mavericks...
[18:33] <ochosi> charlie-tca: just wanted to quickly ask again: where will that article of mine be published? UWN? xubuntu.org?
[18:34] <charlie-tca> um, xubuntu.org at least
[18:34] <charlie-tca> You want to push it into UWN? I can do that, too
[18:34] <ochosi> dunno, thought UWN was the goal originally
[18:34] <ochosi> but i don't mind
[18:34] <ochosi> just not sure anyone will read it if it's only on xubuntu.org :)
[18:34] <charlie-tca> I forget things. Let's push it to them, too!
[18:35] <charlie-tca> I will forward it to UWN
[18:35] <ochosi> ok cool
[18:35] <ochosi> thanks
[18:35] <charlie-tca> Thank you for reminding of these things
[18:35] <ochosi> np
[18:35] <ochosi> btw, could we add the workspace-switcher to the next meeting's agenda?
[18:35] <charlie-tca> we discussed it this week.
[18:36] <charlie-tca> We really want it, you know
[18:36] <ochosi> yeah, i got that from reading the meeting log
[18:36] <ochosi> but there are several ways to do it
[18:36] <charlie-tca> but, if you want to discuss it again... I can add it
[18:36] <ochosi> not just the panel-plugin
[18:37] <ochosi> i think it's nicer to check the alternatives too
[18:37] <charlie-tca> Okay
[18:37] <charlie-tca> I mean, I use 8 workspaces, myself
[18:37] <ochosi> e.g. in the window-buttons plugin we could activate "show windows from all workspaces"
[18:37] <ochosi> and "group windows" by default
[18:37] <charlie-tca> that's not the same, though
[18:37] <ochosi> i know
[18:38] <ochosi> but it serves a similar purpose in a way
[18:38] <charlie-tca> I purposely separate my applications into different windows, I don't wnat them all shown at once
[18:38] <ochosi> right
[18:38] <ochosi> how many workspaces do we have by default?
[18:38] <charlie-tca> 4
[18:39] <ochosi> hm, maybe we could reduce that to 2
[18:39] <knome> +1
[18:39] <ochosi> then the ws-switcher would also look nicer :)
[18:39] <charlie-tca> That is a feature
[18:39] <ochosi> ok
[18:39] <knome> bigger number of default workspaces isn't a feature imo
[18:39] <Sysi> i think there's only two?
[18:39] <ochosi> too bad
[18:39] <charlie-tca> Ubuntu took theirs down to 2, and now they are back up to 4 or 8
[18:40] <ochosi> ok, maybe we should check how many we really have
[18:40] <ochosi> and then check whether it's a feature to reduce them
[18:40] <ochosi> and then discuss it
[18:40] <ochosi> ?
[18:40] <Sysi> btw it's kinda interesting to have compositing enabled by default and then hide contents of window when moving
[18:41] <charlie-tca> I honestly dislike that thing that says you get two workspaces by default, and we will hide them from you so you won't know they are even there
[18:44] <charlie-tca> Oh, by the way...
[18:44] <ochosi> charlie-tca: my suggestion was just to make it 2 ws and add the switcher to the panel
[18:44] <charlie-tca> If we can't get the shutdown/restart to gdm thing fixed, we need to look at reverting to the action buttons instead of session menu
[18:44] <ochosi> Sysi: not all of those decisions were taken consciously, i think the moving-windows thing was already present in maverick
[18:45] <charlie-tca> The shutdown and restart thing seems to be directly related to session menu, somehow
[18:45] <ochosi> charlie-tca: yeah, the fact that the session-menu isn't working so well is frustrating (since the plugin seems so simple in a way)
[18:45] <charlie-tca> +1
[18:46] <charlie-tca> Even I could learn to not hate it :-)
[18:46] <ochosi> :)
[18:46] <Sysi> ochosi: iäm not really against it' it just feels weird
[18:47] <ochosi> Sysi: in fact i've been using that combination always :)
[18:48] <Sysi> i can't see windows well enough without content in them..
[18:48] <Sysi> and on small screen you need to know exactly how much to move
[18:52] <charlie-tca> Well, that takes care of my power outage today
[18:53] <charlie-tca> ochosi: the other issue I am getting when using session menu is that my computer does not restart correctly. Xfwm4 does not restart when using it.
[18:53] <ochosi> strange
[18:53] <charlie-tca> Using Action Buttons, I can restart and xfwm4 restart when I login
[18:53] <ochosi> haven't experienced that yet
[18:53] <charlie-tca> It is every boot here
[18:54] <ochosi> restart sometimes just gets me back to gdm
[18:54] <charlie-tca> yeah, mine won't do that most of the time, but then I have to manually start xfwm4
[18:54] <charlie-tca> and increase the workspaces back to 8
[18:54] <ochosi> hmm, that sucks
[18:55] <ochosi> mr_pouit: to what chances will the session-menu be fixed soon?
[18:55] <charlie-tca> yeah, I think these power fluxes suck worse
[19:00] <ochosi> k, g2g now and will be away over the weekend!
[19:00] <ochosi> have a nice weekend everyone
[19:00]  * ochosi waves
[19:00] <charlie-tca> Have a good weekend!
[19:00] <ochosi> thanks
[22:38] <knome> whoever is moderating the xubuntu-devel list, you can unapprove the mail from<EMAIL_ADDRESS>- i sent the same mail from the correct account so it got posted to the list immediately


[08:57] <Tm_T> we had uds-m sessions?
[09:05] <nigelbabu> Tm_T: nt yet I think.  you mean for uw right?
[09:05] <Tm_T> ye
[09:06] <nigelbabu> nope.
[09:07] <rww> Tm_T: summit.ubuntu.com says it's Friday at 10am (Local) in Flamboyant
[09:08] <Tm_T> ...someone should set it to topic then too (:
[09:22] <pleia2> technically I think we're supposed to have a meeting in an hour and a half... but it was never announced or anything
[09:22] <pleia2> ....and maybe I got the utc time wrong there
[09:24] <pleia2> there
[09:25] <pleia2> oh, logged notice


[21:18] <ePirat> Hello
[21:22] <ePirat> I think I found a regression in the linux kernel shipped with ubuntu 15.04 (kernel 3.19)
[21:22] <ePirat> after some time my wifi connection behaves as it has dropped (but still displays as connected)
[21:23] <ePirat> this seems to only happen after some amount of data has been downloaded
[21:24] <ePirat> if I boot with 3.16 kernel I am not able to reproduce this, so I think this is a regression.
[21:25] <ePirat> as far as I understood I need to identify the version (and commit?) that breaks it, but I have no idea how to do so
[21:26] <ePirat> especially since it takes some time to reproduce the issue this isn't easy
[21:34] <ePirat> any hints/help much apreciated


[12:43] <marcin_ant> hi all
[12:43] <marcin_ant> guys I need some help
[12:43] <marcin_ant> I would like to know how uploading *.po works in rosetta
[12:45] <marcin_ant> I don't like online interface and would like to download and translate po file then upload..
[12:45] <marcin_ant> will it work?
[12:48] <lifeless> jordi: ^^^
[12:49] <mdke> marcin_ant: yes, it works
[12:50] <marcin_ant> mdke: is there some delay between upload and applying changes?
[12:50] <marcin_ant> mdke: I uploaded but cannot see changes I did..
[12:50] <mdke> marcin_ant: yeah, there is a delay sometimes
[12:51] <mdke> there is a page you can view the status at
[12:51] <mdke> https://launchpad.net/rosetta/imports
[12:53] <marcin_ant> mdke: whoooa 13543 waiting to be imported?
[12:55] <mdke> marcin_ant: that list includes files which have already been imported. Use the filter at the top
[12:56] <marcin_ant> mdke: filter at top doesn't have 'not imported' option
[12:56] <mdke> no, good point
[12:57] <mdke> marcin_ant: apart from that, if you wait, it should be imported quickly, don't worry
[12:57] <marcin_ant> mdke: and I cannot see my upload :(
[12:58] <marcin_ant> mdke: anyway I will wait more
[12:58] <mdke> marcin_ant: it will arrive, don't worry
[12:58] <marcin_ant> mdke: ok
[05:31] <mpt__> Gooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooood afternoon Launchpadders!
[05:32] <mpt__> It's a lovely Sunday afternoon here in the Edinburgh of the Southern Hemisphere
[08:24] <robitaille> well it seems we cannot connect to the LP server since a few minutes ago
[08:37] <SteveA> i just unstuck it
[08:42] <BHSPitLappy> that was scary.
[08:48] <robitaille> thanks SteveA.   LP seems to be have been quite unstable in the last 24 hours.
[08:49] <SteveA> yes.  we're getting deadlocks.  we're investigating why.
[08:51] <BHSPitLappy> yep... that 502 was real upsetting :P
[08:55] <SteveA> sorry man
[09:22] <BHSPitLappy> no prob
[09:23] <BHSPitLappy> turns out I couldn't even order those Ubuntu CDs I was after, anyways, so it's cool.
[09:23] <BHSPitLappy> :)
[09:35] <glatzor> Is there currently a problem with lp?
[09:35] <glatzor> I want to report a bug and get the following error message:
[09:35] <glatzor> UnicodeEncodeError
[09:35] <glatzor> A server error occurred.
[09:44] <nkbj> Hello
[09:51] <nkbj> Hello
[09:58] <mpt> glatzor, yes, there's a problem with Launchpad, but probably not related to the problem you're having
[09:58] <mpt> glatzor, did the bug get reported after all?
[09:59] <glatzor> no.
[10:01] <glatzor> mpt: I want to file a bug report against ubuntu-docs
[10:01] <glatzor> mpt: by the way do you know how the translation of koffice are handled in rosetta?
[10:02] <glatzor> mpt: there are templates for koffice which is in main, but the upstream translations are in the koffice-18n package that is in universe
[10:02] <glatzor> It seems that the Rosetta translations of koffice aren't used at all
[10:09] <sehute> Hi, Launchpad says UnicodeEncodeError A server error occured.
[10:09] <sehute> This was when I submitted text for translation
[10:09] <sehute> I think it's reproducible, and expected behaviour is to accept the text I wrote
[10:09] <sehute> (just to do the bug-report-dance)
[10:10] <sehute> Any solutions? Is it common? Should I just wait and try again some time later?
[10:12] <sehute> I get this error also in places where I didn't get this error previously, so it's something that has happened very recently.
[10:12] <sehute> I do not think it's my browser.
[10:13] <sehute> (Firefox)
[10:13] <sehute> Well, happy hacking/fixing whoever this might consern.
[10:13] <sehute> See you
[10:30] <mpt> glatzor, sorry, I know very little about how Rosetta does things
[10:33] <glatzor> mpt: thanks anyway. I will wait for carols or Ridell. I hope that this isn't a large issue, but the KDE upstream team is confused and upset.
[10:38] <mpt> glatzor, carlos or Riddell or jordi, I assume
[10:38] <mpt> :-)
[10:41] <lifeless> are you guys seeing this UnicodeEncodeError only on rosetta ?
[10:42] <lifeless> Seveas: do you get an OOPS id on the error page ?
[10:42] <lifeless> erm
[10:42] <lifeless> whomever.
[10:42] <lifeless> glatzor: do you get an OOPS id when you try to submit that bug ?
[10:49] <glatzor> lifeless: since I don't know what a OOPS id, I don't think so :)
[10:50] <glatzor> lifeless: since I don't know what an OOPS id is, I don't think so :)
[10:51] <sivang> hey glatzor
[10:51] <sivang> morning all
[10:51] <glatzor> hi sivang
[10:51] <glatzor> morning
[10:51] <sivang> mornig , what's up?
[11:11] <jordi> glatzor: hmm, can you file a bug about this?
[11:12] <glatzor> jordi: could you confirm this? I am not sure if I am right
[11:13] <jordi> checking
[11:13] <glatzor> The problem is, that the koffice translation was redone in Rosetta and I want to be sure that this efforts do not conflict with the upstream translation.
[11:13] <glatzor> upstream translated 100%.
[11:14] <glatzor> jordi: furthermore it seems that the koffice templates in Rosetta are still the ones of version 1.4 and not of the current version 1.5
[11:15] <jordi> is there https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+source/koffice/+pots/koffice/
[11:15] <jordi> ok, so afaict, the translations are being applied
[11:16] <jordi> (if all of them were done in Rosetta, they would be purple)
[11:16] <jordi> re the version of the translations, let's have a look
[11:16] <jordi> ugh, that's true.
[11:16] <jordi> I guess ridell needs to have a look at that
[11:18] <jordi> I filed a bug report
[11:18] <jordi> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/koffice-i18n/+bug/47057
[11:18] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 47057 in koffice-i18n "koffice-i18n version not in sync with koffice" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
[11:20] <stub> lifeless: I'm messing with Launchpad production
[11:20] <glatzor> jordi: may I put this to urgent?
[11:21] <glatzor> jordi: monday is translation freeze :/
[11:22] <glatzor> jordi: by the way why is koffice-i18n in universe and not main?
[11:26] <jordi> glatzor: not sure
[11:27] <jordi> glatzor: we need ridell here
[11:36] <jordi> I already had time to go to the beach to swim for more than one hour :)
[11:41] <glatzor> jordi: :/ fine. I sit here for two hours and watch the rain.
[11:42] <jordi> glatzor: oops :D
[11:44] <sivang> jordi: you leave by the sea side?
[12:00] <jordi> sivang: yes
[12:00] <jordi> well
[12:00] <jordi> 10 min cycle
[12:02] <sivang> s/leave/live
[12:02] <sivang> jordi: nice
[12:02] <sivang> jordi: like me :-)
[12:02] <sivang> but the beach here is nothing close to it's quality in Spain
[12:06] <jordi> well, Valencia's beach is not spectacular
[12:06] <jordi> no transparent water, if you're thinking something like this
[12:17] <mdke> stuck in London = :-(
[12:21] <sivang> jordi: I was thinking along the lines of Mataro's beach water. I could see through them so nicely :)
[12:22] <sivang> jordi: we have most of the beach here polluted by industrial plants etc, many trash is around the beach . :-(
[12:30] <jordi> yick
[12:31] <sivang> yes
[12:31] <sivang> it's bad as it sounds
[12:31] <sivang> mdke: I though you were germen
[12:32] <mdke> sivang: !!! never say that to an Englishman
[12:38] <aa_> "I thought you were Welsh"
[12:41] <sivang> mdke: oh oops , sorry :-(
[12:41] <sivang> mdke: weren't you once living in germany or something
[12:41] <sivang> ?
[12:41] <sivang> (I think I recall you told me that sometime ago)
[12:42] <mdke> sivang: nope, maybe someone else
[12:49] <lifeless> stub: k
[01:21] <glatzor> jordi: can you point me to a document that explains how the updated translation for dapper will be treated?
[01:21] <glatzor> are the cd images updated? will the installer download the latest version?
[01:22] <cbx33> I'm writing a small app for linux, what are the restrictions on putting such things on LP?
[01:22] <glatzor> cbx33: i think only the code of conduct :)
[01:22] <glatzor> and you have to register
[01:22] <cbx33> both of which I am already
[01:23] <glatzor> I also maintain my personal app in lp https://launchpad.net/products/webboard
[01:24] <cbx33> glatzor, i suppose the size of the app doesn't matter
[01:24] <cbx33> this one is more of a utility
[01:25] <glatzor> I would not claim to call my app a larger one
[01:28] <jordi> glatzor: it would appear in language packs
[01:29] <cbx33> just don't want to get in trouble for putting something on LP that isn't worthy:p
[01:30] <glatzor> jordi: what about the language packs on the shipit cds and the iso images? will the updated translations packs be available via the update repository or do they get into the main ubuntu repo?
[01:32] <jordi> glatzor: language packs get updatd periodicaly
[01:32] <jordi> I don't think the CD images will be updated though
[01:33] <jordi> so you have to install from the cd and then update them
[01:34] <glatzor> do they land in the dapper-updates or the dapper repo?
[01:34] <glatzor> so the live cd will not see any updated translations?
[01:56] <mdke> glatzor: dapper-updates
[01:56] <mdke> I doubt they update the cd images
[01:57] <glatzor> mdke: that is a pity. the kde upstream translators won't be happy :/
[01:59] <mdke> glatzor: well, that's life
[02:37] <mdz> glatzor: no, we currently do not ship updated CD images (there are few language packs available on the CDs anyway due to space constraints)
[02:38] <glatzor> thanks mdz
[02:38] <mdz> glatzor: updated language packs will go into dapper-updates
[02:38] <mdz> so they will be upgraded by default via the periodic update mechanism
[03:34] <moyogo> hi
[03:35] <moyogo> I assigned a bug to the wrong group and I can't assign it back to nobody
[04:05] <Yannig> Hello everybody :)
[04:07] <Yannig> Still no news from Mailman team for the creating of an Occitan mailing-list, I'll have to find and edit every single reference to it in all packages :(
[05:17] <glatzor> mdz: which languages will be on the live cd? I cannot find this information in the wiki
[06:36] <Pixel1983> Problem solved, looks like it didn't really reset my password but just log me in. Doing the reset process again and clicking submit instead of hitting enter worked.
[07:00] <glatzor> Are there any known problem with the import function of po files? We are waiting for days now to get the German translation of gdm and gnome-power-manager in
[07:02] <Yannig> For days?
[07:02] <glatzor> Yannig: yes.
[07:02] <Yannig> I have to wait about 12 hours
[07:04] <glatzor> That is what a team member said to me.
[07:07] <NERvOus> are there any plans to release malone's source code?
[07:55] <cbx33>  Launchpad could not mirror this branch at 2006-05-28 17:50:03 BST.  The error was: Could not install revisions: pete@ubuntu-20060528162637-0459f15378bbae24
[07:55] <cbx33> what does this mean?
[08:08] <aa_> cbx33: (I believen and I am not a developer or anything) that launchpad cannot (for now) nirror knit branches. This will be remedied soon. I think I ehard (in the next rollout)
[08:08] <aa_> cbx33: still means you can access your code over sftp
[08:09] <aa_> or from the original place it is trying to mirror from
[08:09] <aa_> (that information comes with no warranty)
[08:09] <SteveA> yep, knits should be working on the supermirror sometime early next week
[08:09] <SteveA> the code is done, it just needs rolling out there
[08:11] <cbx33> knits?
[08:11] <cbx33> I'm a n00b to bzr really
[08:11] <SteveA>  #bzr is a good place to ask about it for detailed answers
[08:12] <SteveA> knits and weaves are the back-end data storage formats bzr uses
[08:12] <SteveA> knits is the new format, and bzr works faster and data takes up less space with knits
[08:15] <glatzor> cbx33: do you make progress any with your new product? :)
[08:16] <cbx33> glatzor, yes
[08:16] <cbx33> ah i see
[08:16] <cbx33> it's a product now
[08:16] <cbx33> glatzor, https://launchpad.net/products/gisomount
[08:18] <glatzor> cbx33: which language?
[08:18] <cbx33> en
[08:18] <cbx33> it still needs a README
[08:18] <glatzor> no, programming language :)
[08:20] <cbx33> oh
[08:20] <cbx33> :p
[08:20] <cbx33> python
[08:21] <glatzor> python is fine. :)
[08:40] <Zerlinna> hey there - is it normal that http://launchpad.net/people/nameofuser/ codesofconduct in firefox kills the xserver?
[08:55] <mdke> Zerlinna: no, that would not be normal, as you can probably guess ;)
[08:57] <Zerlinna> mdke ok the question was kind of rhetorical.. better would be: have an idea why it's crashing? I use Kubuntu Dapper (up-to-date) firefox <IP_ADDRESS>
[08:58] <mdke> Zerlinna: no idea. It seems to work ok here. What is the precise url causing the problem?
[08:58] <Zerlinna> http://launchpad.net/people/waeckerlin/ codesofconduct
[08:59] <mdke> Zerlinna: with a space between waeckerlin/ and codesofconduct?
[08:59] <Zerlinna> my log (firefox 2&> log.txt) says
[08:59] <Zerlinna> no with a plus
[08:59] <Zerlinna> X Error: BadDevice, invalid or uninitialized input device 169  Major opcode:  147  Minor opcode:  3  Resource id:  0x0Failed to open deviceX Error: BadDevice, invalid or uninitialized input device 169  Major opcode:  147  Minor opcode:  3  Resource id:  0x0Failed to open deviceThe application 'Gecko' lost its connection to the display :0.0;most likely the X server was shut down or you killed/destroyedthe application.
[09:00] <mdke> and the xserver dies when you visit that page?
[09:00] <mdke> that's pretty crazy
[09:00] <Zerlinna> yes instantly
[09:00] <mdke> great bug
[09:01] <mdke> i can't reproduce it here when I go to my homepage/+codesofconduct
[09:01] <Zerlinna> it gives me little purple stars.. and restarts x
[09:01] <mdke> that's so awesome
[09:01] <Zerlinna> it happens only with firefox not with konqueror
[09:01] <mdke> Zerlinna: ever seen it on any other websites?
[09:01] <Zerlinna> I found this "awesome" too
[09:01] <Zerlinna> nope never
[09:01] <mdke> wow
[09:01] <mdke> I guess you'd better file a bug on firefox AND launchpad
[09:02] <Zerlinna> I think I'll do this :)
[09:02] <mdke> assuming you can do so without it crashing your xserver
[09:02] <Zerlinna> I think I should make a little movie...I've never seen such a thing before... !
[09:03] <Zerlinna> the rest of launchpad worked fine (by now )
[09:03] <Zerlinna> except that I couldnt sign the coc 1.0.1 - it always told me I changed the text (which I didnt)
[09:03] <Zerlinna> so I signed the first version
[09:04] <mdke> yeah, that's a well known bug
[09:04] <Zerlinna> ah ok that's fine then
[09:04] <mdke> it has existed since the coc 1.0.1 was added, I think, and still not fixed
[09:04] <Zerlinna> ok first version is ok for me too
[09:05] <ssam> Zerlinna, are you using the nvidia driver?
[09:05] <Zerlinna> ssam yes I am
[09:05] <ssam> i bet it does not crash with the nv driver
[09:06] <Zerlinna> ssam it's the one from the repos nvidia-glx
[09:06] <ssam> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-glx/+bug/46034
[09:06] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46034 in nvidia-glx "Page crashes X" [Major,Needs info]
[09:07] <Zerlinna> ah ok
[09:07] <mdke> does that do it too?
[09:08] <Zerlinna> If I try it out now I'll quit IRC ;)
[09:08] <mdke> ah
[09:08] <Zerlinna> so if I'm away you'll know...
[09:09] <ssam> Zerlinna, good luck
[09:09] <Zerlinna> nope I can access the given site without any problem
[09:10] <Zerlinna> bizarre...
[09:10] <mdke> it's likely to be something like that though I suppose
[09:10] <Zerlinna> mdke I think that too.. so I'll add another comment to the bug
[09:14] <ssam> Zerlinna, and set it to confirmed aswell please
[09:15] <mdke> well, it's not the same bug, right?
[09:15] <mdke> you can't reproduce that one
[09:15] <Zerlinna> mdke good question
[09:15] <mdke> maybe another bug is appropriate
[09:15] <Zerlinna> hm
[09:15] <mdke> see if with the "nv" driver it still happens
[09:15] <ssam> hmm
[09:19] <Zerlinna> Ok I'll try this out.. - I just have to change my xorg.conf right?
[09:20] <mdke> i think so
[09:20] <Zerlinna> so I just restart x then I'll be back in a few ...
[09:22] <Zerlinna> re :)
[09:23] <Zerlinna> mdke ssam you were right.. without nvidia there's no crashing
[09:23] <Zerlinna> so I think it must be the same bug..
[09:24] <Zerlinna> of course I forgot to bookmark the link ssam could you paste it again? thx
[09:24] <ssam> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-glx/+bug/46034
[09:24] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46034 in nvidia-glx "Page crashes X" [Major,Needs info]
[09:24] <Zerlinna> thank you :)
[09:25] <ssam> np
[09:35] <cbx33> SteveA, got a question about knits and weaves
[09:35] <cbx33> is it possible to convert back to weaves?
[09:35] <cbx33> or indeed to create it in weaves
[09:35] <SteveA> it is, but it is a very slow operation
[09:35] <SteveA> converting from weaves to knits is quite quick
[09:36] <cbx33> SteveA, the repo is tiny
[09:36] <cbx33> how long did you say till LP will accept knits
[09:51] <SteveA> cbx33: a few days
[10:04] <pixelgirl> Hi
[10:48] <pixelgirl> sabdf1: ping
[10:49] <pixelgirl> sabdfl: ping
[10:49] <LarstiQ> is sabdfl even awake at this time?
[10:50] <pixelgirl> dunno ;)
[10:50] <LarstiQ> cbx33: it is doable if you need to, for interoperating with 0.7 perhaps?
[10:51] <cbx33> LarstiQ, It's ok...i can wait :p
[10:51] <mdke> one never knows when sabdfl is awake ;) He's marked as away though
[10:51] <pixelgirl> maybe that's default ;)
[11:18] <lifeless> morning
[11:19] <LarstiQ> moin


[04:09] <lotuspsychje> good morning to all
[04:11] <Bashing-om> o/ lotuspsychje
[04:11] <lotuspsychje> hey Bashing-om hows the night been
[04:12] <Bashing-om> slowed down .. was fairly active ... lull in the storm ?
[04:25] <lotuspsychje> sitting back with a coffee first :p
[04:26] <Bashing-om> 2 cups to get te cognitive juices flowing :)
[04:39] <lotuspsychje> lol
[05:21] <Bashing-om> Good nite good folks - yall take care .
[06:25] <lotuspsychje> morning OerHeks :p
[06:25] <OerHeks> hey lotus :-)
[07:28] <ducasse> hi all
[07:28] <OerHeks>  i get spam, therefore i exist.
[07:29] <OerHeks> heya ducasse :-D
[07:29] <ducasse> good morning OerHeks - is the botnet back?
[07:30] <OerHeks> No clue, i used /umode +R
[07:30] <ducasse> just wondered, after your comment above :)
[10:10] <OerHeks> Ben64 to the rescue \0/
[10:12] <Ben64> i should have continued lurking
[10:13]  * nacc too
[10:14] <Ben64> i mean really?
 Ben64: there can be no exploits in /etc/apt unless you're terminally stupid
[10:14] <Ben64> where does he think packages come from?
[10:15] <nacc> yep, back to ignore the channel and doing useful stuff :)
[10:15] <Ben64> yep, gotta watch agents of shield
[10:15] <OerHeks> i was going to mention dist-upgrade, but then again ..
[10:15] <Ben64> yeah me too OerHeks
[10:15] <Ben64> seemed like a classic case of "doing it wrong"
[10:30] <Ben64> hmm.. to help that rude guy or not...
[10:30]  * Ben64 goes back to his show
 I've just synced my servers' /etc/apt to the official apt configuration and apt-get upgrade still does _not_ offer to update the kernel!
[10:30] <Ben64> heh.
[10:31] <Ben64> guess that 15 years of experience didn't include how to update
[10:32] <Ben64> aw, nacc being helpful
[10:33] <nacc> Ben64: but they have yet to respond to me directly :)
[10:34] <Ben64> did now, with 0/2 of the information you requested
[10:35] <Ben64> 1/2 now
[10:35] <nacc> Ben64: :)
[10:38] <Ben64> nacc: how does it work exactly in 16.04? i haven't heard about that yet
[10:38] <Ben64> aw, i should have read more
[10:38] <nacc> Ben64: i think they updated the wiki page now, that they've decided, let me see
[10:39] <nacc> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/RollingLTSEnablementStack
[10:39] <nacc> Ben64: --^ more dtils
[10:39] <nacc> *details
[10:39] <Ben64> yeah checking that page, seems better
[10:40] <nacc> Ben64: it makes the "which hwe is supported" discussion much much simpler
[10:40] <nacc> as there is only one stack
[10:41] <Ben64> makes a lot of sense
[10:42] <nacc> the discussion internally has been pretty fun to read -- as there were other options bandied about that were going to be crazy and confusing still. Luckily they chose the sane route
[10:54] <OerHeks> "I might write them a letter but ...I need managment to restart services"
[12:18] <OerHeks> ♫ fixing ubuntu with kali-usb ♫ do da dee
[12:59] <OerHeks> yay, ota14 http://news.softpedia.com/news/ubuntu-touch-ota-14-officially-released-with-revamped-unity-8-interface-fixes-510787.shtml
[13:30] <BluesKaj-pi> hiyas all
[14:39] <HsocietyPenetrat> Do someone have hacked a CMS in this room?
[14:40] <HsocietyPenetrat> I need to know
[14:40] <OerHeks> yes, where the password was empty :-D
[14:42] <OerHeks> in some countries it is called hacking too.
[14:43] <HsocietyPenetrat> do someone know a hacking tool that just find the right combination, without wordlist or hash.
[14:44] <HsocietyPenetrat> How do people call a Password-Combination Finder?
[14:44] <nacc> !hacking | HsocietyPenetrat
[14:44] <nacc> err, nm, i thought there was a faq that we don't help you do illegal things
[14:45] <HsocietyPenetrat> dude, i'm a pen tester, i am doing a test in order from my boss.
[14:45] <HsocietyPenetrat> this task is find out how a program like this is called
[14:48] <nacc> HsocietyPenetrat: you probably wanted #ubuntu then
[14:48] <nacc> HsocietyPenetrat: this channel is not for support
[14:48] <ducasse> HsocietyPenetrat: or ##security, more likely
[15:03] <lordievader> A penntester who doesn't know how bruteforce tools are called? Impressive.
[15:07] <ducasse> lordievader: even more concerning if his boss doesn't know :)
[15:07] <lordievader> Not if his boss is not in that business ;)
[15:09] <ducasse> good point :)
[15:10] <OerHeks> i hope he did a check on empty password
[15:10] <OerHeks> grinn
[15:15] <ducasse> or "admin"
[15:26] <OerHeks> ehm, true, i did use admin
[17:04] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[17:23] <OerHeks> brrr .. "load one simple webpage from our internal server"
[17:26] <daftykins> o0
[17:27] <ducasse> daftykins: this guy wants to keep using his gutsy install...
[17:29] <OerHeks> such security breach could be facing the patriot-act in some countries :-P
[17:29] <daftykins> extend a finger at random and set ignore, sir ;)
[17:30] <OerHeks> "who helped you?" > ducasse OerHeks nicomachus
[17:30] <OerHeks> oh boy
[17:30] <nicomachus> whoa whoa whoa
[17:30] <nicomachus> all I did was relay info about 32 bit chromium
[17:30] <nicomachus> ....and tell him that nano is the default editor
[17:31] <OerHeks> ha ha ha we see each other in jail
[17:31] <nicomachus> I'm American tho. They can't get me under the Patriot Act.
[17:37] <ducasse> OerHeks: we can start an ubuntu prison gang! ;)
[17:39] <BluesKaj> you guys waorry too much  ;-)
[17:39] <BluesKaj> worry even
[17:41] <nicomachus> I never waorry
[17:43] <BluesKaj> well, make fun of my typos , but you get my drift
[17:43] <ducasse> i'm not really very worried about a us law, tbh.
[17:46] <BluesKaj> Asange and Snowden certainly are , but they both have that missionary zeal that clouded their judgement, IMO
[17:46] <daftykins> hmm what will be our prison song?
[17:47] <nicomachus> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPwgVna2nF8
[17:47] <BluesKaj> we're in the jailhouse now
[17:49] <daftykins> i'd much prefer - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcqtAPge_bI
[17:49] <daftykins> "we're on a mission... from Tux"
[17:52] <ducasse> we can smuggle in usb sticks with live images
[17:53] <OerHeks> 256 gb stick with a weekly mirror
[23:57] <Bashing-om> Here ! Better late than never .


[00:00] <knome> that's a start, now a volunteer that has access to the same hardware as you has to have time to look at the reports sent
[00:00] <knome> and even then, the solution isn't likely to be trivial - usually quite the opposite with driver issues
[00:01] <xubuntu11w> the freezing of the computer from this is the biggest problem. ctrl-alt-delete doesnt work, even numlock frozen on.
[00:02] <xubuntu11w> ctrl-alt-f2* i mean
[00:02] <knome> i wouldn't be surprised if it was caused by the issues caused by the wireless adapter
[00:04] <xubuntu11w> yeah, thats what it is. its the network manager causing this. Ive used Linux a lot, like older versions. But this happens now. im on 15.10. it almost seems that it started after kernel 4. came out
[00:04] <knome> you can try booting a 3.x kernel
[00:05] <xubuntu11w> i would but the problem is random. it just does it when it wants. and i have newer hardware so that might not be a good idea
[00:06] <knome> if it doesn't boot, then it doesn't boot, and you can go back to using 4.x
[00:06] <knome> but as you wish
[00:06] <xubuntu11w> should i give it a try? Or wait for the issue to be resolved?
[00:07] <knome> it's possible that the issue is resolved after a year or two - or never
[00:07] <knome> i would try the older kernel
[00:08] <xubuntu11w> what happens when I use a older kernel? will i have less performance? or maybe run into issues on the old kernel?
[00:09] <knome> nothing worse than getting freezes on the new kernel
[00:09] <xubuntu11w> okay. how do i use old kernel?
[00:16] <xubuntu11w> if you are busy or something right now. Or if you would like, I could try asking some other time. On the steps to try old kernel.
[00:19] <xubuntu11w> I will go. Thanks for talking with me about this issue. Goodbye
[03:36] <hoodedice> hey guys!
[03:36] <hoodedice> I'm here to report a bug in 15.04 =D
[03:37] <hoodedice> Description: Suspend fails to suspend computer
[03:37] <hoodedice> Steps to Reproduce: Press Suspend from whisker menu's power off button. Close laptop lid
[03:37] <hoodedice> Expected Result: Laptop remains in suspend state
[03:38] <hoodedice> Observed Result: It turns back on, overheats in my backpack, warms me during these cold days, but also has no battery left when I actually need it
[03:38] <hoodedice> Reproduction Rate: 10/10
[03:39]  * xubuntu31w slaps AntiSpamMeta around a bit with a large fishbot
[03:40]  * xubuntu31w slaps alexandros_c around a bit with a large fishbot
[03:40] <xubuntu31w> sudo killall
[03:40] <hoodedice> you think that will work?
[03:41] <hoodedice> my friend is telling me to sudo -rm rg or something like that
[03:41] <hoodedice> *rf
[07:08] <Ragadozo67> Hi All!!:))
[07:24] <anykeyshop> hello! how to make distributive upgrade from 15.04 to 15.50? I used "dist-upgrade" but after some packages downloaded and upgrade process finished my distr is still 15.04
[07:25] <anykeyshop> ....15.10 of couse :)
[07:32] <anykeyshop> solved
[09:27] <nils17> hi. on a xubuntu-based live cd I get this warning: http://snag.gy/Xp5sd.jpg   Where is this setting stored, so that I could disable this warning? (because everytime the live-iso boots the message comes back)
[10:19] <reel> I just updated to Wily Werewolf and now my sound controll has stopped working. I am using i3 window manager and have made my own audiomode. Any tips or advice on this matter?
[10:21] <reel> To specify: I can not lower or raise the volume. I can mute, but not change the percentile value
[10:36] <reel> Nevermind, I fixed it myself.
[13:55] <Guest95467> join #openFOAM-IRC
[17:15] <xubuntu337> join
[17:17] <xubuntu337> join
[17:17] <drc> xubuntu337: what are you trying to join?
[17:23] <xubuntu337> I saw a message to join or help, sorry I am a nem user from Brasil, Bahia andi I am not so good in english. I want to be with you cause I wanto to my Xubuntu fly. I have only 3 months of Linux... sorry
[17:24] <Pici> !br
[17:24] <drc> That is not a problem.  You are in the Xubuntu Suport channel, it is just very quiet today.
[17:25] <drc> Or, as Pici says, you can join  #ubuntu-br but it is probably just as quite.
[17:36] <xubuntu337> I must write  /join #ubuntu-br here?
[17:37] <drc> xubuntu337: Yes, you can do that.
[17:40] <xubuntu337> ok, guys I will have to to leave now, because my intalation is finishing and firefox is Syncing... thank you. I really love Xubuntu and Ubuntu.
[17:51] <Guest58339> any help please ? x will not start after update. now using usb live
[18:22] <evandrojr>  /join #ubuntu-br
[19:19] <Eightynine> Hi. I have just installed Xubuntu 15.10 and added English and Russian layouts and selected Ctrl-Shift to switch layout and it's not working.
[20:13] <xubuntu337> Hi everybody, I need to tell you I am ew user and I like a lot of xubuntu 14.04.3 LTS but I am 3 months of  linux learning. I am from Brasil, Bhia. I live in a poor small town by a beautiful black river. 22.000 people live here only. Most of them do not know read or write. A was school teacher by mi time , contract is over. Now I have another stable work but is not a great thing. My english is no to good. I wato learn how to make internet faster an
[20:13] <xubuntu337> d xubuntu to. My PC is 2.0 of memory only. THAT'S cause of this I choose Xubuntu it work well in my poor machine. That's it if someone could guide me I will be glad. I'm waiting for my master Yoda... Kkkkkkkk. Thank's.
[20:14] <xubuntu337> I want to learn how make internet faster and xubuntu to.
[20:15] <xubuntu337> my typing is better than that I do not know why I am writing everything wrong.
[20:18] <xubuntu337> But the drugs are among us now. Like Crack, cocaine and a horrible thing called pasta loló.
[20:25] <knome> xubuntu337, this channel is for user support, #xubuntu-devel is for general chatter.
[20:25] <Unit193> That is, #xubuntu-offtopic.
[20:25] <flocculant> #xubuntu-offtopic rather
[20:25] <flocculant> heh
[20:25] <knome> ....yes, i'm very much off-focus
[20:25] <knome> :P
[20:26] <flocculant> :)
[20:45] <sacarde> hi
[20:45] <sacarde> xubuntu what DM use?
[20:45] <Azelphur> xfce
[20:45] <Unit193> Xubuntu uses lightdm, with the lightdm-gtk-greeter.
[20:45] <Azelphur> oh whoops, dm not de :)
[20:46] <sacarde> ah,
[20:46] <sacarde> ok
[20:46] <sacarde> thanks
[21:18] <xubuntu337> Dm ?
[21:18] <xubuntu337> Let me see the info about my PC...
[21:22] <xubuntu337> my PC 2.0 RAM Intel celeron (R) CPU J1800 @2,41GHz X 2 -  iNTEL bAY tRAIL X 86/mmx/sse2 32 bit 312GB
[21:25] <xubuntu337> What can I do to this poor PC work Xubuntu better not touching in the Hardware?
[21:26] <mrkramps> xubuntu337, not much
[21:26] <xubuntu337> I could search on web...
[21:27] <xubuntu337> Again, sorry for my english I am from Brasil...
[21:27] <mrkramps> xubuntu337, what exactly is not working as you expect
[21:30] <xubuntu337> Everything is working fine. Only when I do reboot I got black screen. If I only shudown everything ok xubuntu comes back fast.
[21:33] <mrkramps> xubuntu337, which version of xubuntu are you using?
[21:34] <xubuntu337> And I wanto learn to preserve my desktop the same when  start xubuntu. And want to learn to make this incredible almost alive desktops full of info about  PC . The devian art I already got. The Themes I have a tutorial.
[21:34] <xubuntu337> 14.04.3 LTS
[21:35] <xubuntu337> I bet I've done something wrong.
[21:39] <xubuntu337> I know xubuntu can make a simple machine like mine fly.
[21:40] <flocculant> xubuntu337: only up to a point. It's likely to be flying as much as it will already
[21:41] <xubuntu337> Just do not know how... everybody always wants more right? Sorry, if It's not the place to talk about it. I green new in this kind of world.
[21:42] <mrkramps> xubuntu337, concerning this reboot issue you can try to diable plymouth (boot splash)
[21:43] <xubuntu337> ok
[21:43] <xubuntu337> could you please said how do I do that?
[21:44] <xubuntu337> disable plymouth, how?
[21:44] <mrkramps> xubuntu337, you've already used a terminal?
[21:45] <xubuntu337> yes I got 40 hours of terminal, doing dummy things.
[21:45] <mrkramps> ok
[21:46] <xubuntu337> sudo apt-get, sudo su, sudo  apt-get clean
[21:46] <mrkramps> sudo nano /etc/defaul/grub
[21:46] <xubuntu337> shutdown -h now...
[21:46] <mrkramps> replace: GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT="quiet splash"
[21:46] <xubuntu337> opening
[21:47] <mrkramps> with: GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT="noplymouth"
[21:47] <flocculant> /etc/default/grub
[21:47] <flocculant> mrkramps: sorry for butting in there :)
[21:47] <mrkramps> *sigh*
[21:48] <mrkramps> be my guest … i guess i need another keyboard
[21:48] <flocculant> I'm not really here - in and out a bit
[21:49] <xubuntu337> I'm in GNU nano 2.2.6 the screen have not a single word
[21:49] <mrkramps> xubuntu337, exit and do NOT save
[21:49] <mrkramps> i told you the wrong path
[21:50] <mrkramps> xubuntu337, the correct command is `sudo nano /etc/default/grub`
[21:51] <xubuntu337> alright
[21:51] <xubuntu337> ok
[21:51] <mrkramps> there you replace "quiet splash" with "noplymouth"
[21:52] <mrkramps> double check if there is no typo, save and exit nano
[21:52] <xubuntu337> Now I am seeing words thank you.
[21:53] <xubuntu337> I find it a minute please?
[21:59] <xubuntu337> I can not erase "quiet splash" I did sudo su, then su them your command but I can1t erase these words. KKkkkk. sorry
[22:00] <mrkramps> i did not tell you to use `sudo su`
[22:01] <xubuntu337> But don't give up on me maybe another time. I don want to botter anyone.
[22:01] <xubuntu337> ok I-ll try again.
[22:02] <mrkramps> take your time
[22:07] <xubuntu337> I can't believe I did it. I am nervous...
[22:07] <xubuntu337> emotional... sorry
[22:07] <xubuntu337> now save it?
[22:08] <mrkramps> xubuntu337, yes
[22:08] <xubuntu337> them what maste Yoda?
[22:08] <mrkramps> exit nano
[22:08] <xubuntu337> master Yoda. Kkkkk
[22:09] <mrkramps> if not done already
[22:09] <xubuntu337> do not save anything?
[22:09] <mrkramps> xubuntu337, save file and exit nano
[22:09] <xubuntu337> ^0 ?
[22:10] <mrkramps> ctrl+o
[22:11] <xubuntu337> ok save and closed.
[22:12] <mrkramps> and now update your bootloader configuration: sudo update-grub
[22:13] <xubuntu337> not use sudo su right?
[22:13] <mrkramps> right!
[22:13] <flocculant> forget all about sudo su
[22:14] <xubuntu337> see that:   Generating grub configuration file ...
[22:14] <xubuntu337> Atenção: Setting GRUB_TIMEOUT to a non-zero value when GRUB_HIDDEN_TIMEOUT is set is no longer supported.
[22:14] <xubuntu337> Encontrado imagem linux: /boot/vmlinuz-3.19.0-25-generic
[22:14] <xubuntu337> Encontrado imagem initrd: /boot/initrd.img-3.19.0-25-generic
[22:14] <xubuntu337> Found memtest86+ image: /memtest86+.elf
[22:14] <xubuntu337> Found memtest86+ image: /memtest86+.bin
[22:15] <mrkramps> looks good
[22:15] <xubuntu337> It's alright?
[22:15] <xubuntu337> yeah!
[22:15] <mrkramps> you can now try to reboot
[22:16] <xubuntu337> mrkramps thant you
[22:16] <xubuntu337> maste Yoda for me.
[22:16] <xubuntu337> anything more to do?
[22:17] <mrkramps> xubuntu337, not for now … reboot and check back to tell us about the result
[22:17] <xubuntu337> Can you teach me to do a amazig desktop?
[22:17] <xubuntu337> amazing desktop... sorry
[22:17] <mrkramps> nope, i can just teach people to keep a working desktop
[22:18] <xubuntu337> ok. So there's more stuff to do master?
[22:19] <mrkramps> yes, try to reboot to see if this change helps
[22:19] <xubuntu337> I will reboot. Thank you very much master Yoda.
[22:19] <xubuntu337> by
[22:23] <xubuntu337> The reboot work's fine and fast. No windows do that in my humble PC.
[22:25] <xubuntu337> by  and thak's again.
[22:25] <xubuntu337> thank's
[22:25] <mrkramps> you're welcome!
[22:28] <xubuntu337> I will contribute xubuntu. Anything more to do master?
[22:29] <xubuntu337> so I will continue downloadind on the central.
[22:29] <knome> xubuntu337, enjoy.
[22:29] <xubuntu337> free
[22:30] <xubuntu337> by


[12:42]  * Frugals goes sit in a corner
[16:46] <geek1on1> Isn't a classroom? No sessions currently in progress?
[16:46] <jose> as you read
[16:46] <jose> nothing scheduled at the moment
[16:46] <geek1on1> All right...
[16:46] <geek1on1> thanx buddy...


[00:24] <flaccid> where is that webpage that shows the latest published kernel images ?
[00:29] <SpamapS> erichammond: good call.. almost done 23 minutes into the build on a c1.medium. :)
[00:30] <erichammond> SpamapS: :)
[00:31] <erichammond> flaccid: By "latest published" do you want to see temporary testing kernels or do you mean the latest officially supported kernels?  Also, do you mean kernel images themselves or the AKI/ARI ids for EC2?
[00:33] <erichammond> flaccid: If you want the AKI/ARI ids for the officially supported kernels on EC2, I think you can just look at the AKI/ARI ids associated with the latest officially supported AMIs on EC2.
[00:33] <flaccid> erichammond: i think all of the above please :) i need to bookmark these URLs
[00:33] <flaccid> i recall a manifest or something gets published
[00:35] <erichammond> flaccid: You might want to browse http://uec-images.ubuntu.com/query/
[00:35] <flaccid> ah yes /query thats what i missed, thanks eric!
[00:35] <erichammond> flaccid: For image files, you should be able to build the URL paths from the info in those files.
[00:36] <flaccid> http://uec-images.ubuntu.com/query/lucid/server/released.txt awesome
[00:36] <flaccid> thanks again!
[00:36] <erichammond> thanks to smoser
[04:52] <smoser> flaccid, one thing to note, is that there really aren't going to be newer versions of aki and aris
[04:52] <smoser> other than on lucid
[04:52] <smoser> on maverick, we're using the pv-grub kernels from amazon and loading the kernel from inside the images.
[09:41] <flaccid> smoser: really happy to hear that!
[14:28] <progre55> hi guys. I have rebundled an aws ami into an uec image, and uploaded it into a bucket and registered.
[14:29] <progre55> now I can see it in my "images", but how do I start it?
[14:29] <progre55> it says "state - available, actions - disable"
[14:33] <progre55> ah nvm =)
[14:46] <progre55> when trying to run an instance, I get "ImageVerify: Unable to determine required kernel image." Any suggestions, please?
[14:51] <marrusl> Hello.  I'm running the standard image store Lucid 64 bit EMI.  On "cluster1" it works correctly and I can ssh to it, on a second cluster, "cluster2" (connected via openvpn to the CLC) I get errors in the console.  For example:
[14:51] <marrusl> Caught exception reading instance data: http://<IP_ADDRESS>/2009-04-04/user-data
[14:51] <marrusl> And it never boots far enough to ssh to it.
[14:52] <smoser> progre55, most likely you want to launch it with one of the ubuntu kernels.
[14:52] <smoser> you *can* register it with a default kernel, then you dont have to specify one at launch time.
[14:53] <progre55> smoser: how do you register it?
[14:53] <progre55> while registering the image?
[14:54] <smoser> marrusl, you're seeing a metadata service bug.  the metadata service is the thing that provides that web api/interface to the client.  it is a bug or misconfiguration in eucalyptus if you can't get to it.
[14:54] <smoser> if you download and register a newer image (http://uec-images.ubuntu.com/releases) you will get better information on what is going on in the console.
[14:54] <smoser> how did you register it ?
[14:55] <smoser> progre55, ?
[14:55] <smoser> you must have bundled and uploaded ?
[14:55] <progre55> yep
[14:55] <smoser> when you bundle you can specify --kernel/--ramdisk
[14:55] <progre55> and registered it on the console
[14:55] <smoser> when you register, you can also add those flags.
[14:56] <smoser> i have little to no experience with the console
[14:56] <smoser> but i would expect it would let you specify them somehow.
[14:56] <progre55> oh I see.. and can I use one of those standard-ubuntu-image kernel/ramdisk's?
[14:56] <smoser> yeah, you'll want to use those.
[14:56] <marrusl> thanks smoser.  I will bring down a newer image.  I swear I had this one at least booting once before though!  :)
[14:56] <smoser> you can look at a ubuntu registered image, and use that, or get that information from http://uec-images.ubuntu.com/query
[14:57] <smoser> (traverse and find the build that you based it on and use the aki/ari that are listed there)
[14:57] <smoser> note that lucid images do not use an ari
[14:57] <smoser> marrusl, it is possible.
[14:57] <smoser> unfortunately, the metadata service is not 100%
[14:57] <smoser> and i have seen people have issues with multiple clusters (i think).
[14:58] <smoser> i have little to no experience with multiple clusters, personally.
[14:58] <progre55> smoser: according to the description, neither euca-register nor euca-upload-bundle have --kernel or --ramdisk options..
[14:59] <marrusl> smoser, yup.  it doesn't seem many people have done it.  out of those I talk to at least.  fun.
[14:59] <smoser> progre55, euca-bundle-image does.
[15:00] <smoser> sorry.. its bundle time or register time, not upload time.
[15:00] <progre55> oh yeah =)
[15:00] <progre55> thanks
[15:00] <smoser> the ec2 tools do have it for register. the euca2ools lag that a bit.
[15:01] <progre55> yeah, this is my first day with uec =)
[15:16] <smoser> progre55, oh. you're using uec ?
[15:16] <smoser> i thought ec2.
[15:16] <smoser> if you're using uec, i suggest using "uec-publish-image"
[15:16] <smoser> which wraps the upload and bundle and such.
[15:16] <smoser> its usage should be self explanatory
[15:16] <smoser> marrusl, you can use uec-publish-tarball with the thing you download from uec-images.ubuntu.com
[15:17] <smoser> they're just convenience wrappers
[15:17] <marrusl> Nice, smoser.  I will start.  Although I'm glad I learned it the hard way the first few times.  :-)
[15:18] <smoser> the hard way is quite painful
[15:18] <smoser> :)
[15:19] <progre55> well, I'm using euca2ools
[15:19] <marrusl> indeed.  eventually it makes sense though.
[15:19] <marrusl> still annoying to type.
[15:22] <smoser> progre55, yeah, the euca2ools are fine. you can use the uec-publish-image, it just wraps them.
[15:23] <smoser> uec-publish-image x86_64 my-rebundled-image.img my-bucket --kernel aki-abcdefg --ramdisk ari-hijklmn
[15:23] <smoser> and it does what it needs to do
[15:24] <progre55> smoser: thanks
[15:25] <marrusl> smoser, I won't know if that helped for a while.  it's pretty slow bringing down an image over VPN the first time.  :)
[15:25] <marrusl> walrus is not local.
[15:33] <progre55> hmm.. the instance is starting up as "terminated"
[15:36] <smoser> progre55, hm...
[15:36] <smoser> you have to make sure that the instance size will hold the root filesystem
[15:37] <progre55> smoser: yeah, the image is 10Gb, and the first time I ran it as m1.small, but it didnt start saying the disk is too small
[15:37] <smoser> yeah. what is your host ?
[15:37] <progre55> then it didnt say anything when I started it as m1.large
[15:37] <smoser> 10.04 ?
[15:37] <progre55> yeah
[15:37] <progre55> it's a rebundled AMI
[15:37] <smoser> i think that euca 2.0 gives a better error message
[15:37] <progre55> from amazon
[15:37] <smoser> but its a pita
[15:37] <smoser> you can resize the filesystem
[15:37] <smoser> uec-resize-image will help
[15:38] <smoser> if you have space to spare
[15:38] <progre55> aha, thanks, let me try that
[15:38] <progre55> do I resize after I bundle it?
[15:38] <smoser> before bundle
[15:38] <smoser> it operates on a partition image
[15:39] <progre55> oh I see, let me try that
[15:43] <marrusl> smoser, well it is a new error now, though sort of the same...
[15:43] <marrusl> waiting for metadata service at http://<IP_ADDRESS>/2009-04-04/meta-data/instance-id
[15:43] <marrusl>   14:41:31 [ 1/100]: http error [500]
[15:43] <marrusl> (and then the 2nd line keeps repeating and counting up)
[15:54] <marrusl> looks a lot like this thread actually:  http://groups.google.com/group/ec2ubuntu/browse_thread/thread/17101fb30179c8f6?pli=1
[15:54] <progre55> how long does it take for an image to run? cause I ran it, and it's been "pending" for a long time now..
[16:00] <smoser> marrusl, your'e on lucid (10.04) ?
[16:00] <smoser> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/eucalyptus/+bug/637659 is 10.10 with 500
[16:00] <marrusl> progre55, if it's the first run of a particular EMI or if has to recache it later. it can take a little while.
[16:00] <smoser> marrusl, you should open a bug, please. use 'ubuntu-bug eucalyptus-common'
[16:01] <smoser> progre55, it does take a long time on the first time to a node controller
[16:01] <smoser> you can ssh to the nc, and you should see something happening
[16:01] <smoser> sudo euca_conf --list-nodes
[16:01] <smoser> might tell you which node its running on
[16:01] <smoser> (that has to be run on the CC i think)
[16:02] <marrusl> smoser, thanks.  will do.
[16:04] <progre55> aha, thanks
[16:07] <progre55> ah, I guess I've ran out of space on the node =)
[16:07] <progre55> how can I stop the instance run process?
[16:08] <progre55> the thing is, for now I have only one node, set up on a 4G flash drive, as I dont need much hd space, but processor power only )
[16:09] <progre55> and the flash drive only had 3.24G available after the node installation, and my image was 4G
[16:10] <progre55> when I ssh'd into it, it even said "-bash: cannot create temp file for here-document: No space left on device" =)
[16:11] <progre55> so I guess I need to stop the instance run now..
[16:21] <smoser> progre55, i dont know if you can easily do that if you cant get to the node
[16:21] <smoser> if you could, just start killing 'dd' pids or whatever looks like its doing someting
[16:21] <smoser> or sudo restart eucalyptus-nc CLEAN=1
[16:21] <progre55> well, I have terminated it
[16:21] <smoser> would probably do it.
[16:21] <smoser> ok.
[16:22] <progre55> using euca-terminate-instances
[16:22] <smoser> if you want to test to see if things are generally running, i have smaller images available that you can start with
[16:22] <smoser> http://smoser.brickies.net/ubuntu/ttylinux-uec/
[16:22] <progre55> cool, thanks
[16:24] <smoser> you can use those with 'uec-publish-tarball' to bundle/upload/register.
[16:34] <progre55> how can I browse the walrus contents and my buckets?
[16:37] <smoser> hm...
[16:37] <smoser> progre55, you can patch s3cmd
[16:37] <smoser> there are other s3 tools that can be pointed at euca i think
[16:38] <smoser> (i'm interested in if you find something easy)
[16:38] <smoser> i just dont know much there.
[16:40] <progre55> but how do YOU do it? )
[16:42] <progre55> there is JetS3t, let me have a look at it
[16:45] <smoser> i dont put anything in buckets that isn't an ami
[16:45] <smoser> so i use euca-describe-images
[16:45] <smoser> :)
[16:48] <progre55> =)
[16:48] <progre55> I see
[16:49] <progre55> so, again, my instance was terminated when I just ran it
[16:49] <progre55> is there any ways I can see the errors or causes brought to its termination?
[16:55] <smoser> it just went straight to terminated ?
[16:55] <smoser> there are loads of logs, the problem is there are too many usually.
[16:55] <smoser> i might look on the node controller
[16:56] <smoser> and look in libvirt to see if there is any informatoin there.
[16:56] <smoser> /var/log/libvirt
[16:56] <smoser> and /var/log/eucalyptus
[16:58] <progre55> let me check it out..
[16:59] <smoser> the libvirt/<instance-id>.log might have something if you got that far.
[16:59] <smoser> you may be running out of space
[17:00] <smoser> the NC needs space for at least 2 copies of the partition image
[17:02] <progre55> well, libvirt doesnt have anything
[17:02] <progre55> but /var/log/eucalyptus/axis2c.log has a buch of  "[Tue Sep 14 18:01:36 2010] [error] error.c(94) OXS ERROR [x509.c:287 in openssl_x509_get_subject_key_identifier] oxs defualt error , The extenension index of NID_subject_key_identifier is not valid"
[17:04] <progre55> oh and in /var/log/eucalyptus/nc.log I have this "insufficient disk capacity remaining (2042MB) in VM Type of instance i-3A780611 for component disk"
[17:04] <progre55> so it IS the disc space issue =)
[23:50] <rberger_> Does cookbook_file use the checksum attribute like remote_file or does it do that automatically? I'm cleaning up my remote_file calls and wondering if I should delete the checksum attribute?
[23:50] <rberger_> Opps sorry wrong irc