[00:00] <spacebug-> sorry was ment to pru
[00:00] <spacebug-> ;)
[00:00] <spacebug-> he/she left and my tabcompletion thought I should talk to you hehe
[00:02] <mylenthes> What irc client do you guys youse?
[00:09] <spacebug-> mylenthes: I'm using irssi
[00:13] <mylenthes> k
[00:31] <itmannen> Hello from 12.04 Beta1 in Sweden
[00:32] <itmannen> And soon Beta2 Is online
[00:33] <itmannen> next week I think ?
[00:35] <haz3lnut> Is there any compelling reason I should not upgrade to Pangolin right now?  I mean are the outstanding issues livable?
[00:36] <itmannen> I use 12.04 beta 1. And no problem
[00:37] <haz3lnut> There's 1 vote of confidence, any more? :-)
[00:39] <haz3lnut> itmannen: how long have you been on 12.04?
[00:39] <itmannen> I used 12.04 simce alpha1
[00:41] <itmannen> In the start there whas somproblem. But now It is fast and stabil for me here
[00:41] <itmannen> *some
[00:43] <itmannen> Hm.  So I have to learn :)
[00:49] <spacebug-> ;)
[01:12] <kklimonda> wow, 12.04 is much faster than 11.10 on this underpowered netbook..
[01:13] <kklimonda> at least for now, lets see if I can slow it down
[01:13] <snadge> yeah, i noticed that
[01:13] <snadge> firefox will fix that
[01:13] <scar3crow> zoom tile scale etc. are missing from appearance properties when switching backgrounds... help?
[01:13] <kklimonda> and two-finder scroll actually works
[01:13] <snadge> after a while
[01:13] <kklimonda> snadge: I've been using noscript to fix that ;)
[01:13] <snadge> i just use adblock
[01:13] <kklimonda> (Firefox with JS disabled for most pages actually works really well)
[01:14] <kklimonda> yeah, that may work too
[01:14] <snadge> i have alcohol poisoning
[01:14] <kklimonda> heh, good for you :P
[01:15] <snadge> i need bacon and eggs, stat
[01:59] <realubot> When will 12.04 be freezed?
[01:59] <itmannen> realubot: About 3 weeks
[01:59] <realubot> itmannen: Ok. Thanks.
[01:59] <spacebug-> hello realubot ;)
[01:59] <realubot> spacebug-: Hi spacey.
[02:00] <realubot> Anyone has got a release schedule for 12.04?
[02:00] <spacebug-> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PrecisePangolin/ReleaseSchedule
[02:00] <itmannen> Nice to see friends :)
[02:00] <realubot> spacebug-: Thanks. :)
[02:01] <realubot> I didn't even know about this channel before.
[02:01] <itmannen> realubot:  The same here
[02:02] <realubot> How about the "thing" that will make Unity 3d run in VirtualBox without support for graphics card 3d effect. Will it be included in the 12.04 release?
[02:03] <realubot> There will be som kind of support that makes 3d effects work in VirtualBox without need of ordinary graphics card support.
[02:04] <itmannen> Maybe in the finale. But not now
[02:04] <realubot> It would be great to test Ubuntu in VirtualBox with Unity support.
[02:04] <realubot> itmannen: Ok.
[02:05] <realubot> Will 12.04 using Unity 2d work in VirtualBox?
[02:05] <itmannen> I and I should go to bed. Yes I now rel. :)
[02:05] <realubot> itmannen: Coward.
[02:05] <itmannen> :D
[02:06] <realubot> itmannen: ;)
[02:06]  * itmannen hugs The real thing :)
[02:07] <realubot> Coffee time.
[02:07] <itmannen> Brother to brother of cource
[02:07] <realubot> itmannen: Haha.
[02:07] <itmannen> Goodnight spacebug- and tealubot. See you
[02:09] <realubot> itmannen: Good night!
[02:10] <spacebug-> gnight. Btw itmannen can you test this one later. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/957489 and press affects me if it does
[02:15] <realubot> Maybe I shall install 12.04 like in 22th mars. When beta2 is in state of freeze.
[02:17] <spacebug-> well the only thing happening there is that they freeze the packages going in the beta 2 I think
[02:17] <spacebug-> once installed and you start running upt-get update/upgrade you will get new packages
[02:17] <realubot> spacebug-: Yeah, but until then they will still do some changes.
[02:18] <realubot> Maybe I will just waint until the stable release.
[02:18] <realubot> I'm not in a hurry.
[02:18] <realubot> *wait
[02:19] <spacebug-> ;)
[02:20] <realubot> I don't really know what's happening in all weeks during the development.
[02:22] <avuton> Is it possible to get date/time on the menu in gnome classic?
[02:23] <log> How did you get Gnome Classic on 12.04? o_O
[02:24] <log> Oh, gnome-session-fallback?
[02:24] <avuton> It calls it Gnome Classic, that's really all I know :)
[02:25] <avuton> The wife can't take unity.
[02:25] <MaximLevitsky> Today is 1st of april or what?
[02:25] <MaximLevitsky> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/policykit-desktop-privileges/+bug/812394
[02:25] <MaximLevitsky> Whats is that?
[02:26] <MaximLevitsky> And I already week don't know what is going on, blaming KDE upower support for this
[02:26] <psusi> MaximLevitsky, sounds like a request to disable hibernation by default... ;)
[02:26] <avuton> 2012 and power management still blows.
[02:27] <MaximLevitsky> now, its the ubuntu that blows
[02:27] <MaximLevitsky> no
[02:27] <psusi> avuton, it's worked fine for me for years
[02:27] <avuton> Not here, I've /never/ had luck with any power management over the years on any of my computers. Not blaming anyone. It's a terrible spec.
[02:27] <MaximLevitsky> I aleady have a solution, an awesome solution
[02:27] <avuton> Laptops being the exception
[02:28] <MaximLevitsky> I only use linux now, because I do operation system course now
[02:28] <MaximLevitsky> Win7 is superb, and I already installed an configured it in the way I like
[02:29] <MaximLevitsky> And I used linux exclusively for 8 years
[02:29] <MaximLevitsky> I even wrote a bunch of kernel drivers
[02:29] <psusi> avuton, it's actually a rather good spec... problem is that nobody complies with it ;)
[02:30] <realubot> avuton: http://askubuntu.com/questions/58172/how-to-revert-to-gnome-classic
[02:30] <Daekdroom> Hibernate not working very well is about Linux, not Ubuntu
[02:30] <psusi> vendors keep cranking out broken implementations and the market fails to punish them... largely because they provide windows specific workarounds to their brokenness
[02:31] <MaximLevitsky> Nope, it does work. In fact it always worked for me on all systems
[02:31] <MaximLevitsky> Suspend sometimes doesn't work
[02:31] <MaximLevitsky> I even fixed once very hard suspend bug
[02:31] <psusi> I don't understand that myself... I have NEVER had trouble with hibernation... suspend yes, as it relies on often broken acpi bios... but not hibernation
[02:32] <MaximLevitsky> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-source-2.6.22/+bug/160763
[02:32] <MaximLevitsky> And another bunch of bugs related to unreliable suspend
[02:32] <avuton> hibernation causes two of the kernel threads on my computer to ping 100% cpu, old problem no one has fixed yet.
[02:32] <MaximLevitsky> And that what I get in return?
[02:33] <MaximLevitsky> Everything is broken in this ubuntu. KDE is full of bugs, Gnome shrinks to one big power button
[02:33] <MaximLevitsky> Compiz is undead with that f*** unity
[02:33] <MaximLevitsky> You really just damage linux reputation
[02:34] <MaximLevitsky> I already feel that linux is over the peak, its less used now
[02:34] <realubot> avuton: Another option would be to use Lubuntu as it looks more like Gnome 2 than Unity.
[02:34] <MaximLevitsky> It had a moment of fame when MS put out Vista
[02:34] <MaximLevitsky> sad, really sad.
[02:35] <Daekdroom> Don't worry. MS will crash again with 8.
[02:36] <MaximLevitsky> True, but this time, we have Win7, and ulike XP its a modern OS
[02:36] <MaximLevitsky> so peoples can keep using it for ages
[02:36] <MaximLevitsky> Its not possible in linux, because of many reasons
[02:37] <MaximLevitsky> Just try using an old distro
[02:37] <MaximLevitsky> Not to mention that Win8 will have Win7 desktop
[02:46] <psusi> MaximLevitsky, can't you just go into gnome-power-settings or something and turn it back on?  it sounds like that was how it was supposed to work
[02:46] <Daekdroom> psusi, nope. You have to deal with gconf/dconf or something like that.
[02:46] <MaximLevitsky> Are you kidding? gnome-power-settings is dry clean of features
[02:47] <psusi> ugh.. I know.. it's been getting worse the last few releases... I tried to patch it last year to put back the ability to lock on hibernate, but not suspend, and the upstream gnome devs rejected it
[02:47] <psusi> it seems like they think people are all idiots and confused by options so it's better to hide things where nobody will find them
[02:52] <psusi> this seems to be the same idiotic mentality that has led to the menu in gnome-shell not having a bloody shutdown command by default, and you have to install an extension to get one
[02:56] <jbicha> hibernate doesn't work for many computers and if it doesn't work, people lose data which is never a good thing
[02:57] <jbicha> here's the fix anyway: http://askubuntu.com/questions/94754/how-to-modify-policykit-to-allow-hibernation-in-upower but I think this will be configurable in System Settings
[02:57] <jbicha> but that option might not make it into Precise since we passed UI freeze weeks ago
[02:58] <jbicha> Hibernate is quite unreliable in Linux, you not only need the right hardware but you need to have installed your OS the right way
[03:00] <psusi> this "hibernation doesnt work for many computers" is nonsense as far as I can see... hibernation is implemented purely in software so doesn't depend on anything specific to the computer... so it pretty much works everywhere as far as I have seen... it's suspend that breaks on a fair number of systems because of acpi bios bugs/quirks
[03:01] <jbicha> anyway, we don't have really have any hard numbers/percentages on how often suspend & hibernate work or don't work, that would be really useful for making decisions like this
[03:02] <trism> psusi: not really related to the conversation, but you don't need the extension, just hold alt and suspend turns into power off
[03:07] <Mylenthes> Hello
[03:07] <Mylenthes> I have a problem
[03:09] <Bobbeh> SO
[03:09] <Bobbeh> I have a problem, my minecraft lags in fullscreen mode, but it runs perfectly smooth not fullscreen, but i want fullscreen
[03:12] <vexati0n> so i just did a dist-upgrade, and now Totem has replaced ALL flash content in ALL browsers.
[03:12] <vexati0n> wtf guys
[03:13] <Bobbeh> i fixed my problem
[03:13] <Bobbeh> Totem?
[03:14] <Daekdroom> You're the first person that I've seen complain about that, vexati0n
[03:14] <Daekdroom> Therefore, I don't see why say 'wtf guys'
[03:14] <vexati0n> yeah me too
[03:14] <vexati0n> i meant wtf as in how might i go about fixing that, old chap
[03:15] <vexati0n> i checked the about:plugins in all my browsers, they all list the usual stuff... and libflashplayer.so is in the right place, and it isn't a symlink to some weird thing like libTotemTrolLOL.so
[03:16] <vexati0n> which is what i almost expected...
[03:17] <vexati0n> but wherever i go, all flash - not just video but ads and banners and even menus are replaced by a big, useless "Movie Player" icon with a play button that does nothing
[03:17] <Bobbeh> vexati0n: Did you try changing it to Wumbo?
[03:18] <vexati0n> Bobbeh: I do not know what a Wumbo is.
[03:18] <Bobbeh> ...
[03:18] <Bobbeh> nvm its a joke
[03:18] <vexati0n> yeah sorry...long week
[03:21] <vexati0n> seriously though, how do you find out where firefox is getting its plugin orders from?
[03:21] <vexati0n> and chrome... and even epiphany.
[03:26] <vexati0n> ehh.. nevermind... apparently there are gremlins...
[03:35] <Bobbeh> nighty night
[04:38] <crond> has anyone run into any issues with wine/sound and 12.04? I get a bunch of ALSA errors from any app that tries to use sound in wine, but my audio works fine otherwise.  Error occurs with padsp or without.
[04:39] <crond> and wine 1.4 can't be set to use pulseaudio... at least, not the one in the ubuntu repos
[05:34] <kanliot> i can't play any videos on precise because the plugins won't download
[05:34] <kanliot> where do i file a bug?
[05:35] <Fyodorovna> you try the restricted-extras? kanliot
[05:35] <kanliot> i declined the restricted extras
[05:35] <kanliot> i didn't think it would matter
[05:35] <kanliot> is that where i file the bug?
[05:36] <Fyodorovna> I doubt you have a bug, rather a=something is amiss.
[05:37] <Fyodorovna> !bugs
[05:39] <kanliot> i'm just gonna file it against movie-player
[06:10] <kanliot> sound settings.  how do I file a bug against that?
[07:14] <Belial`> all your nonworking ayatana scrollbars are belong to us.
[08:18] <snadge> the scroll bars in ubuntu do kinda suck
[08:18] <snadge> and are inconcsistent.. eg, firefox has "normal" scroll bars
[08:18] <snadge> but even they suck, the colour scheme makes it non obvious where the scrolling button is and/or how large it is
[08:38] <baronos> ubuntu do  which patches and packages of gnome libs for  the unity?
[08:47] <Belial`> snadge, the scroll bars aren't even working for me in the beta. they keep disappearing as soon as i hover over them. it only happens with gtk3 apps.
[09:32] <lapion> hello, upgrades, either from commandline or the update-manager, with a btrfs root  do not work.
[09:32] <lapion> a regular upgrade doesn't work, and a sandbox upgrade doesn't start up.
[10:05] <gecko> Test
[10:43] <trijntje> I'm having some trouble with nmap not showing all open ports on a machine on the network. Can somebody confirm this?
[10:43] <trijntje> I've recently updated my router, and I haven't got a oneiric machine left to test with
[11:07] <diverse_izzue> hi all
[11:12] <jtaylor> :( xorg still crashes on video play, probably time to do some debugging myself
[11:26] <djbenny> Morning
[11:26] <djbenny> was just wondering if there has been a bug reported when laptop waking from standby and the screen remains blank
[11:27] <wylde> djbenny: I'm sure I've seen a number of those in launchpad
[11:27] <wylde> moment
[11:28] <djbenny> wylde, ok cheers. just wanted to know if it had been reported somewhere as its kind of annoying
[11:29] <wylde> djbenny: I imagine it would be, I have fortunately not had the issue but then I'm primarily on a desktop and I'm rather lax about powersaving heh
[11:30] <djbenny> wylde, ahh fair enough, well its just habit to close laptop when not using it as it bots up after standby instantly anyway
[11:32] <wylde> djbenny:  yeah I'm pretty sure I've seen a number of similar bug reports, although it may not be the same thing causing it
[11:33] <wylde> if you use ubuntu-bug <packagename> it'll gather more info and submit it to launchpad
[11:33] <djbenny> wylde: yeah ok fair enough, well i was expecting bugs so im not that fussed
[11:33] <djbenny> but im not sure which package is causing the issue
[11:33] <wylde> djbenny: the bug bot will find if there are duplicates most likely anyway and mark it as duplicate.
[11:33] <djbenny> though it did come up wth a system warning error when i booted back up
[11:35] <wylde> djbenny: hmm, I'll see what I can find.
[11:38] <wylde> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.searchtext=resume+from+suspend anything there look similar?
[11:39] <wylde> I imagine it could be a hung gpu or something to do with an incomplete saved state when you close the lid, but I'm mostlyguessing right now
[11:41] <wylde> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pm-utils/+bug/953288 or maybe https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/952713
[11:43] <wylde> or bug #951466 or bug #951143
[11:43] <djbenny> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/acpi-support/+bug/28959
[11:43] <djbenny> that one looks similar, as when i move the mouse it still finds the login window as the cursor changes to the text field cursor
[11:44] <wylde> ahh I see
[11:44] <sagaci_> on the latest +1 updates, is the area in the top left where it displays the program name, ie. XChat IRC or Home Folder, the first character is slightly wrong?
[11:44] <djbenny> but I've not tried to bring up the console
[11:45] <wylde> that's a really old bug report hmm
[11:45] <djbenny> sagaci_, for me its fine on XChat
[11:45] <djbenny> wylde, yup. it was fine with 11:10
[11:46] <djbenny> wylde, plus that bug was reported in 2006!
[11:46] <sagaci_> what's the package I need to file a bug against if it's to do with the unity panel?
[11:47] <wylde> djbenny: you could file a bug report and then use apport-collect <bugnumber> to gather more information, moment there's a good page on the ubuntu wiki to help find what package to file a bug against
[11:48] <djbenny> sagaci_, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/FilingBugs
[11:49] <djbenny> wylde, ok cheers...
[11:49] <djbenny> thanks for the advice. bye
[12:18]  * penguin42 spends 5mins debugging PA - and then remembers to switch the amp on
[12:20]  * ironhalik spent two hours debugging PA - figured out PA disabled audio jack
[12:29] <itmannen> Hm. Lost connection
[12:33] <itmannen> realubot: Goodmorning young man :)
[12:34] <itmannen> Lost connection again. What is this
[12:36] <spacebug-> ;)
[12:38] <realubot> itmannen: Good morning old man.
[12:38] <realubot> :)
[12:39] <realubot> Good morning to you too spacey.
[12:39] <itmannen> realubot: :)
[12:40] <itmannen> realubot:  Spacey ?
[12:45] <realubot> itmannen: spacebug- :)
[12:45] <spacebug-> hello ;)
[12:46] <spacebug-> got some answers on bugreports today. Thats nice. Two were already known and fixed
[12:51] <realubot> spacebug-: Nice.
[12:59] <spacebug-> yes
[14:01] <itmannen> realubot:  Send best regards to Barre and amelia :(
[14:02] <realubot> itmannen: Haha. I will. For how long willl you be banned?
[14:02] <itmannen> realubot:  And of cource to CasperN to :(
[14:02] <itmannen> realubot: I think t 16 april
[14:03] <maxjezy> itmannen, what did you do?
[14:04] <realubot> itmannen: Ok. One month then.
[14:04] <itmannen> maxjezy:  I log in to many times when I test my bouncer
[14:04] <maxjezy> i c
[14:04] <itmannen> realubot: :(
[14:06] <itmannen> maxjezy:  And CasperN went mad and went to op.
[14:07] <itmannen> realubot: Do you now how to unzipp everything in one mapp ?
[14:07] <itmannen> Terminal
[14:08] <realubot> itmannen: Do you have a zip archive?
[14:08] <realubot> Or tar?
[14:08] <itmannen> realubot:  Yes
[14:08] <realubot> zip?
[14:08] <itmannen> realubot: Both
[14:08] <itmannen> realubot:  yes zip
[14:10] <jtaylor> "one mapp"?
[14:10] <itmannen> Sorry fore the spelling
[14:10] <maxjezy> folder
[14:10] <itmannen> Yes
[14:10] <maxjezy> mapp is the swedish word for it
[14:10] <realubot> itmannen: unzip file.zip -d /path/to/dir/
[14:11] <realubot> itmannen: I think.
[14:11] <itmannen> realubot: Ok. I test
[14:11] <jtaylor> useful script for extracting: http://paste.ubuntu.com/887807/
[14:12] <realubot> Mapp or Folder is Windows word for a graphical directory icon. In Linux you use the words directory or catalog, I think.
[14:12] <realubot> Or am I wrong?
[14:12] <maxjezy> yes
[14:12] <maxjezy> totally
[14:12] <glosoli> "Mapp" ?
[14:13] <maxjezy> find the word Mapp in english and i give you a b j
[14:13] <realubot> itmannen: unzip  [-Z]  [-cflptTuvz[abjnoqsCKLMVWX$/:]]  file[.zip]  [file(s) ...] [-x xfile(s) ...] [-d exdir]
[14:13] <realubot> itmannen: http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/hardy/man1/unzip.1.html
[14:15] <realubot> maxjezy: Idiot. "Strictly speaking, there is a difference between a directory, which is a file system concept, and the graphical user interface metaphor that is used to represent it (a folder)."
 Maybe there is a Folder in Linux too. And the Folder is a graphical representation of the file system concept Directory.
[14:20] <realubot> Maybe there is no difference between Folder/Directory in Windows/Linux.
[14:20] <realubot> Other than that Folder is a grpahical representation then...
[14:20] <jtaylor> on windows 7 there probably is, it has the concept of libraries, which is basically just a tag for files in multiple directories
[14:23] <realubot> jtaylor: Ok.
[14:25] <realubot> I'm sorry that I lost my temper when I was talking to maxjezy. We have been arguing in another Ubuntu channel before and I'm rather tired at him. Sorry.
[14:25] <itmannen> realubot:  And If there are many zipfiles in that folder ?
[14:25] <realubot> itmannen: unzip *zip -d /pat/to/dir
[14:25] <realubot> ?
[14:25] <realubot> Doesn't that work? As in dpkg -i *.deb
[14:25] <realubot> itmannen: Otherwise you could use this:
[14:26] <itmannen> realubot:  Nope
[14:26] <realubot> for file in /path/tozip/archive/*.zip; do unzip file -d /path/to/dir/; done
[14:27] <jtaylor> unzip $file
[14:28] <maxjezy> i'm also sorry that i did use words like retarded and fuck, not good language.
[14:29] <bazhang> maxjezy, ...
[14:29] <maxjezy> bazhang, ... ?
[14:29] <itmannen> realubot: bash: syntaxfel nära den oväntade symbolen "do"
[14:29] <bazhang> maxjezy, dont repeat them...
[14:29] <maxjezy> is there any way of installing windows from within linux?
[14:30] <maxjezy> using a iso or something?
[14:30] <itmannen> maxjezy: Wubi
[14:30] <maxjezy> itmannen, thats the opposite way
[14:30] <jtaylor> wubi is the other way round I think
[14:30] <bazhang> itmannen, thats the reverse
[14:30] <bazhang> maxjezy, ##windows
[14:30] <itmannen> Ok
[14:30] <itmannen> maxjezy: Oracle Virualbox
[14:30] <realubot> maxjezy: VirtualBOx.
[14:31] <wylde> maxjezy: in a VM
[14:31] <maxjezy> yeah, but that's like a fake install, i want to run the installation from grub
[14:31] <Daekdroom> Altho that is nothing like Wubi,.
[14:31] <maxjezy> i would like to install windows xp on a netbook
[14:31] <maxjezy> it has only ubuntu now
[14:31] <bazhang> maxjezy, and support for that is in ##windows
[14:32] <maxjezy> well, that's a linux issue
[14:32] <itmannen> maxjezy: Hm. No win here :)
[14:32] <maxjezy> not a windows issue
[14:32] <bazhang> maxjezy, incorrect
[14:32] <realubot> itmannen: Give me tha path to the directory where the zip files are stored and give me the path to the directory you want to extract it to and I'll give you the right code.
[14:32] <wylde> maxjezy: the windows install will bork grub, so you'll have to reinstall grub afterwards
[14:32] <maxjezy> if i want to install a windows game in linux
[14:32] <maxjezy> its a linux thing
[14:32] <bazhang> maxjezy, you wish to install windows, it is a windows issue
[14:32] <maxjezy> same thing here
[14:32] <itmannen> realubot: Ok. thanks: /media/sdb1/GSP1/images/*.zip; do unzip file -d /media/sdb1/Unzipped-gsp1;
[14:32] <maxjezy> it's a software i would like to install from within linux
[14:33] <bazhang> maxjezy, run using wine
[14:33] <realubot> maxjezy: Install Windows and reinstall Grub afterwards.
[14:33] <bazhang> check the appdb and /join #winehq
[14:33] <bazhang> !appdb | maxjezy
[14:33] <maxjezy> realubot, how do i install it on a netbook not having a CD?
[14:33] <maxjezy> drive
[14:33] <itmannen> realubot: update-grub :)
[14:33] <realubot> itmannen: You forgot the done after last;
[14:33] <realubot> itmannen: Did you?
[14:34] <itmannen> maxjezy:  Make a boot-usb
[14:34] <maxjezy> itmannen, find me a working guide?
[14:34] <bazhang> maxjezy, again, this is not the place to ask about installing windows.   /join ##windows
[14:34] <itmannen> realubot: Aha
[14:34] <realubot> maxjezy: Booting Ubuntu Live from USB.
[14:34] <maxjezy> bazhang, still, it's a place for support in linux
[14:34] <realubot> maxjezy: And fron within the Live USB reinstall Grub. Then Windows AND Ubuntu will show up at boot.
[14:34] <itmannen> realubot:  No: bash: syntaxfel nära den oväntade symbolen "do"
[14:35] <realubot> itmannen: Strange.
[14:35] <realubot> itmannen: The code should work.
[14:35] <jtaylor> no it should not
[14:35] <itmannen> realubot: Ok.
[14:35] <realubot> itmannen: Ah!
[14:35] <realubot> itmannen: You have to have unzip $file -d ...
[14:35] <jtaylor> like I said before
[14:36] <realubot> The $ sign in fornt of the word file tellint that file is a variable.
[14:36] <itmannen> realubot: What ?
[14:36] <realubot> Ofcourse.
[14:36] <realubot> jtaylor: What did you say before then?
[14:37] <realubot> itmannen: for file in /media/sdb1/GSP1/images/*.zip; do unzip $file -d /media/sdb1/Unzipped-gsp1/; done
[14:37] <itmannen> realubot: How sould my command look like ?
[14:37] <realubot> itmannen: I think that will work otherwise I don't know.
[14:37] <itmannen> realubot: Nope: bash: syntaxfel nära den oväntade symbolen "do"
[14:38] <realubot> itmannen: Does this one work? for file in /media/sdb1/GSP1/images/*.zip; do echo "$file"; done
[14:39] <itmannen> realubot: Nope
[14:39] <realubot> itmannen: ls -l /media/sdb1/GSP1/images/*.zip
[14:39] <realubot> itmannen: Do you have the correct path?
[14:42] <itmannen> realubot: yes. But we leave this. Thank you
[14:46] <realubot> itmannen: Ok. Sorry I could not help you out on this.
[14:47] <itmannen> realubot: NP. You help me a lot :)
[14:48] <ironhalik> hmm, not sure if GSM modems have so crappy support or just my modem is so lame :/
[14:51] <wylde> realubot: maybe find /path/to/files -name '*.zip' -exec unzip {} \; would do it
[14:58] <wylde> oops my bad, I meant itmannen
[14:58] <realubot> wylde: Maybe it will work.
[14:59] <realubot> This works for me to echo all png-files in $HOME: for file in $HOME/*.png; do echo "$file"; done
[14:59] <realubot> So I don't get why it wont work using unzip. Well...
[15:00] <realubot> itmannen: http://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/linux-unix-shell-unzipping-many-zip-files/
[15:01] <wylde> hmm, I think it has something to do with how unzip see's it's arguements
[15:01] <realubot> wylde: Mee too.
[15:03] <realubot> itmannen: Try this then: unzip '/path/to/zip/files/*.zip' -d /path/to/unzip/dir/
[15:04] <wylde> random thought. I wonder if anyone's put something togther to direct place output of a command to pastebin? heh, eg. man apt-get > man_apt.txt but rather than outputting to the file, use curl or somesuch to output directly to pastebin... </OT>
[15:05] <realubot> itmannen: or: cd /path/to/zip/files/ && unzip '*.zip' -d /path/to/unzipped/
[15:05] <realubot> wylde: You could use the program called pastebinit
[15:05] <wylde> realubot: ahh ok
[15:06] <realubot> wylde: Like this: echo "Hello World" | pastebinit
[15:06] <realubot> wylde: You will get a link to the pastebin page in return in Terminal.
[15:07] <wylde> realubot: yeah alredy installed it and browsing the help :)
[15:07] <realubot> wylde: Ok, ok.
[15:07] <wylde> realubot: thank you :)
[15:07] <realubot> wylde: np
[15:14] <realubot> "På lördagen samlades ett drygt hundratal demonstranter på Götaplatsen för att protestera mot den nya datalagen.
[15:14] <realubot> "
[15:14] <realubot> Ops. Excuse me.  What to do ?
[15:48] <realubot> itmannen: Why don't just give it back to the right owner? ;)
[15:49] <realubot> ior3k: Maybe it will work changing the owner using the chown command?
[15:49] <realubot> ior3k: Sorry.
[15:49] <realubot> itmannen: That was ment for you.
[15:50] <wylde> itmannen: is it mounted in fstab? Could just be the options used to mount it.
[15:51] <itmannen> wylde:  Yes. Now it is root as owner. But it should be me
[15:51] <itmannen> realubot:  Ok. whar is the command for that
[15:51] <itmannen> *what
[15:52] <wylde> itmannen: sudo chown <username> <path/to/mountpoint>
[15:53] <itmannen> wylde:  Thanks a lot
[15:53] <wylde> itmannen: you may want to chgrp as well, just substitute chgrp for chown
[15:53] <wylde> and no problem, glad to help
[15:53] <realubot> sudo chown itmannen:itmannen -R /path/to/mountpoint
[15:53] <realubot> Or something.
[15:54] <wylde> right, I forgot about doing the user and group that way, not to mention the _R "recursive"
[15:54] <wylde> err -R
[15:56] <itmannen> Now it is ok. thanks
[15:57] <realubot> Maybe this is the wrong channel for talking about this kind of problems. Maybe one should talk about various Ubuntu problems in channels like #ubuntu
[15:57] <realubot> instead.
[15:58] <realubot> This is for the 12.04 release.
[15:59] <crond> Is there a particular reason that Ubuntu's wine doesn't have pulseaudio support? Sound doesn't work under wine at all.
[15:59] <itmannen> I am using 12.04. And it is in this i have problems
[16:00] <itmannen> Goodbye. See you later
[16:01] <haz3lnut__> Is the daily/current build still beta 1 or would that be considered beta 2 ?
[16:01] <jtaylor> its something in between
[16:01] <Daekdroom> It's neither.
[16:02] <haz3lnut__> when is scheduled release of beta 2 ?
[16:02] <Daekdroom> !schedule
[16:02] <injureddeer> someone know syslog-ng regexps a bit? i try cache "Mar 17 16:51:10 honeypot psad:" this :\
[16:02] <LetterRip> hi all - how to i disable the 'feature' where any window is automatically moved to the upper right hand corner
[16:02] <haz3lnut__> ty
[16:03] <|Long|> hi, is there a cmd which is tell me who is users has root access to the box from ssh screen?
[16:06] <brobostigon> !info unity-2d precise
[16:07] <haz3lnut> |Long| grep admin /etc/group
[16:08] <haz3lnut> |Long| and ...  sudo cat /etc/sudoers
[16:08] <toxi> hey, i'm currently on kubuntu 12.04 and telepathy didn't connect to icq network. anybody knows that problem?
[16:37] <Lirusaito> Hai... um... this:
[16:37] <Lirusaito> E: Encountered a section with no Package: header
[16:37] <Lirusaito> E: Problem with MergeList /var/lib/apt/lists/archive.ubuntu.com_ubuntu_dists_precise-updates_universe_binary-amd64_Packages
[16:37] <Lirusaito> E: The package lists or status file could not be parsed or opened.
[16:37] <Lirusaito> What do?
[16:40] <GangstaRapMadeMe> hey
[16:41] <GangstaRapMadeMe> does anyone know if i can run a virtual operating system?
[16:41] <GangstaRapMadeMe> i tried to download virtualbox but it didn't seem to work.
[16:44] <jo-erlend> has anyone been able to install precise using manual partitioning using Ubiquity yet?
[16:44] <jo-erlend> I haven't been able even once. Not in VMs, laptops, desktops... Think it's somewhat scary.
[16:48] <glosoli> Anyone using Kubuntu Precise here ?
[16:48] <glosoli> with Chrome or Audacious ?
[16:50] <htorque> jo-erlend: what exactly is your problem?
[16:51] <jo-erlend> htorque, same as it's been since the beginning of Precise. Ubiquity crashes consistently whenever I choose "Advanced".
[16:51] <htorque> i needed to use manual partitioning in a small VM (8gb, virtualbox) due to bug bug 899683
[16:52] <htorque> so yes, that works here
[16:52] <jo-erlend> using Ubiquity and not d-i, right?
[16:52] <jo-erlend> I have no problems installing using d-i. Only Ubiquity.
[16:54] <htorque> jo-erlend: d-i is what again? (so yeah, likely ubiquity ;))
[16:54] <jo-erlend> I have no issues with alternate. Only live-cd.
[16:54] <htorque> ah, no - i used the normal desktop daily live images.
[16:55] <htorque> is there a bug report for your problem? not being able to install sounds... bad?
[16:56] <jo-erlend> it crashes too bad for me to find any error messages.
[16:59] <toxi> hey, i'm currently on kubuntu 12.04 and telepathy didn't connect to icq network. anybody knows that problem?
[17:01] <Lirusaito> Su um... any help with this?:
[17:01] <Lirusaito> E: Encountered a section with no Package: header
[17:01] <Lirusaito> E: Problem with MergeList /var/lib/apt/lists/archive.ubuntu.com_ubuntu_dists_precise-updates_universe_binary-amd64_Packages
[17:02] <Lirusaito> E: The package lists or status file could not be parsed or opened.
[17:02] <jtaylor> try updating again
[17:02] <jtaylor> if that does not work delete the file and try again
[17:02] <Lirusaito> jtaylor: Yeah... tried that... wouldn't be bothering if it wasn't serious.
[17:09] <jtaylor> if that does not help, you'll have to wait for your mirror to pick up a file thats not broken
[18:54] <dermaster> Heloooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
[18:54] <FernandoMiguel> olá
[18:54] <dermaster> I installed Kubuntu 12.04.................
[18:54] <dermaster> but i listened after 12.04 it will be stopped
[18:55] <bazhang> dermaster, not so
[19:03] <penguin42> dermaster: Just that the pre-made physical CDs of it won't be made, and Canonical isn't paying for the guy to do some of the work
[19:03] <dermaster> what are pre made? cd ???
[19:04] <penguin42> dermaster: You can ask Canonical for some actual CDs with Ubuntu on it, in nice printed wallets, and you can get Kubuntu ones as well
[19:04] <dermaster> ah okay thank you my darling lover pengiun42
[19:05] <penguin42> ooh err :-)
[19:06] <bjsnider> too much information
[19:07] <dermaster> ^^
[19:07] <dermaster> no problem
[19:07] <dermaster> :)
[19:07] <dermaster> ^^
[19:14] <pauleberber> Hello i just installed xubuntu 12.04 beta 1. The network manager applet is not appearing in the upper right corner :-( Wired Network works of course automatically :-D
[19:14] <pauleberber> i ´ m updating now
[19:15] <pauleberber> but i have the feeling the problem will still be there after finishinfg the updates
[19:22] <glosoli> hmm
[19:22] <glosoli> anyone is getting problem for not autosetting current desktop wallpaper to LightDM Screen
[19:22] <glosoli>  ?
[19:29] <paule> okay just wanne say, that after updating the whole shit (xubuntu 21.04 beta 1) the network manager applet appeared in the upper right corner
[19:30] <paule> sorry for bothering
[19:30] <glosoli> !bug | paule
[19:33] <paule> okay
[19:34] <paule> bye
[20:17] <glosoli> Anyone can confirm problem for LightDM. It's that LightDM doesn't use default desktop wallpaper for its' background
[20:19] <Daekdroom> glosoli, but it does.
[20:19] <Daekdroom> Well, it uses the default desktop wallpaper set in nautilus.
[20:19] <glosoli> Daekdroom, hmm after clean install with daily build
[20:19] <glosoli> It doesn't for me
[20:24] <glosoli> Daekdroom, for the first time I thought it might be some restrictions for my Wallpaper read/write permissions but after setting to be available for everyone I found it as a system problem or bug hmm, so came here to ask
[20:30] <|Long|> haz3lnut, thanks alot
[20:32] <dualMoon> what's the lightdm equivalent of kdm/Xsetup or gdm/Init/Default?
[20:39] <brobostigon> what is a unity lens?
[20:42] <glosoli> brobostigon, open unity dash, and you will see home lense, music lense, folder lense, application lense, video lense
[20:42] <glosoli> brobostigon, these things are called lenses
[20:43] <glosoli> unity lens i mean"
[20:43] <brobostigon> glosoli: ah, i see. i didnt know they were called that, interesting, thank you.
[20:43] <brobostigon> glosoli: so equally in unity3d and unity2d ?
[20:45] <glosoli> brobostigon, exactly :)
[20:46] <glosoli> brobostigon, I did not know for the first time too. Happens. There're a lot of names I use incorrectly  ;D
[20:47] <brobostigon> glosoli: i probebly do the same thing, yes. good to know it works in both modes.
[20:51] <glosoli> brobostigon, some interesting news too http://goo.gl/fF9UZ
[20:51] <glosoli> ah not news, names :D
[20:52] <brobostigon> make sense really.
[21:34] <haz3lnut> ok, who knows how to set the toggle shade when double click on titlebar?  Is it still possible in precise?
[21:38] <ironhalik> haz3lnut: IIRC, you could change that somewhere in gconf-editor
[21:39] <ironhalik> also, take a look at the gnome tweak tool
[21:40] <ironhalik> yup, its in gnome-tweak-tool -> windows -> action on title bar double-click
 I tried gnome-tweak-tool and it didn;t work.  It works in 11.10 but not now.
[21:42] <ironhalik> oh, then you probably should file a bug
 gconf-editor says schemas cannot be edited.
[21:43] <haz3lnut> I wouldn't be surprised if it was a feature
[21:43] <ironhalik> haz3lnut: /apps/metacity/general/action_double_click_titlebar
[21:43] <ironhalik> in gconf-editor
[21:44] <ironhalik> its under schemes in the search box
[21:47] <haz3lnut> ironhalik: yep, it's there.  says toggle-shade, but it doesn;t work.  I thought unity replaced metacity anyway. no?
[21:48] <ironhalik> try toggle_shad
[21:48] <ironhalik> toggle_shade
[21:48] <ironhalik> but, yeah, it might not work now
[21:49] <haz3lnut> Well I'll be danged, that worked
[21:50] <ironhalik> :)
[21:50] <haz3lnut> I guess gnome-tweak-tool put the wrong spelling
[21:50] <ironhalik> Im kinda surprised too ;)
[21:51] <haz3lnut> I guess I'll go file a bug report
[21:54] <chmac> Since the most recent updates I installed (about a month's worth I think), alt-f2 no longer works. Anyone have any ideas?
[21:54] <chmac> I can only start some of my firefox profiles (using --no-remote) from a terminal without the run prompt.
[21:54] <chmac> Likewise, alt-tab no longer works.
[21:55] <ironhalik> for the alt issue, check if you still got alt bound to HUD in CCSM
[21:55] <ironhalik> theres a bug that disabled alt when its unbound from HUD
[21:55] <chmac> ironhalik: Ok, great, I'll check that out, thanks.
[21:56] <chmac> ironhalik: What is HUD? I can't see anything with those initials in CCSM.
[21:57] <chmac> ironhalik: Got it, now it's working, thanks a lot :-)
[21:58] <ironhalik> :)
[22:01] <Darxus> GParted is resizing some of my partitions.  I've been alt-tabbing between it and a terminal and firefox for a while.  The little status window disappeared.  Any suggestions on getting it back?  I un-maximized all the windows, can't find it.
[22:01] <Darxus> vmstat looks pretty clearly like it's still moving my partitions around.
[22:11] <Whoopie> Hi, I'm running precise with gnome3 fallback session. I noticed that all sub menus don't open when the mouse is over the menu. How can I fix that?
[22:13] <Jordan_U> My unity launcher isn't hiding itself, even when I have a maximized window, and so it's blocking a good deal of content. Any idea how to get it to hide again?
[22:15] <itaylor57> KM0201,  yea wubi is good advice to give LOL
[22:15] <KM0201> lol, i know.. id idn't say anything.. but.. hey, :)
[22:16] <brobostigon> Jordan_U: there us a setting, inside system settings to enable or disable higing of the launcher.
[22:16] <trism> Jordan_U: System Settings/Appearance/Behavior allows you to set it back to autohide
[22:16] <itaylor57> yea i kept my mouth mum also
[22:17] <Jordan_U> brobostigon: trism: Autohiding was set to "Off", now it's set to "On" but I see no difference in behavior.
[22:17] <KM0201> this is gonna be awesome, i'm definitely watching this.
[22:18] <KM0201> lol
[22:18] <trism> Jordan_U: may need to restart your session, although it happened immediately for me just now
[22:18] <brobostigon> logout, and then, log back in. yes.
[22:21] <Whoopie> Nobody an advice for my issue?
[22:26] <Darxus> Yeah, autohide was enabled immediately for me.  This is the first time I ever tried it, I think.
[22:45] <wubino> has anyone upgraded 11.10 to 12.04b over ssh?
[22:47] <Fyodorovna> wubino, you running a wubi install with 11.10?
[22:53] <wubino> Fyodorovna, this is for the server
[22:53] <wubino> using aws
[22:53] <wubino> It warns against doing so and it did freeze but just wondering if there is ways through this
[23:13] <etfb> Right, I'm REALLY sick of Kubuntu 11.10.  I want to go back to Ubuntu, but it seems like a waste to reinstall now and again in a month.  Give me the verdict: is the latest build of 12.04 good enough for daily use?
[23:15] <Fyodorovna> etfb, you can run both desktops on the same OS.
[23:16] <Fyodorovna> develpments are not for a main OS use is the general answer etfb
[23:17] <Daekdroom> etfb, why not install Ubuntu and upgrade it to 12.04 in a month?
[23:20] <etfb> Upgrade? Really? That doesn't really work, does it?  It's just something you tell people to lull them into a false sense of security.
[23:20] <etfb> The only time I ever did a straight upgrade, I regretted it even more than I now regret installing Kubuntu.
[23:21] <Darxus> etfb: The difference between kubuntu and ubuntu is a matter of running a package installation.  Just install the package for the ubuntu stuff, and run ubuntu.
[23:22] <etfb> Darxus: that doesn't seem to be true in practice.  Kubuntu has stuffed up a lot of kernel-level stuff (suspend/resume, ACPI, mousepad) that Ubuntu got right.
[23:22] <penguin42> Darxus: Almost, you normally get a few left overs, like the splash screens and it tends to leave it using kdm as the splash unless you flip it over
[23:22] <penguin42> etfb: That shouldn't happen - that *is* all the same code
[23:22] <penguin42> etfb: I can see mousepad stuff being from settings in the user session though
[23:24] <Darxus> etfb: I guess you're aware of this already, but I still need to say it, the package is ubuntu-desktop.
[23:25] <Daekdroom> Well, after installing ubuntu-desktop, it'd be interesting to try and remove the kubuntu packages.
[23:25] <Daekdroom> Otherwise you'll have a bunch of QT apps in Dash.
[23:25] <etfb> I'd rather rebuild anyhow. I've never seen an OS upgrade work properly, in Linux, Windows or MacOS, since at least 1984.
[23:25] <penguin42> etfb: You might also want to uninstall kdm, and if you really want to do it uninstall kdelivs5 will get rid of most of the rest of KDE
[23:26] <etfb> The only question for me is: will I hate a beta version of 12.04 more than I'll hate the current version of Kubuntu?  Is there a summary of outstanding issues (bugs) anywhere?
[23:26] <Darxus> I've switched between ubuntu, debian, and mint a number of times - by dist-upgrades.  *Not* recommended.  Made lots of messes.  But it can generally be done.
[23:26] <jtaylor> depends on why you hate your current version
[23:27] <Darxus> etfb: Weird, I've been upgrading debian, and then ubuntu installs effortlessly for lots of years.
[23:28] <Darxus> etfb: Yes, there is a summary of known issues in Precise, as there always is.  I'd recommend running it from a livecd for a day or so before upgrading to try it out for yourself.
[23:28] <etfb> It's mostly KDE4 that I loathe (a shame; I used to be a big fan of KDE3.5) but I need to do a fresh rebuild because I have a lot of broken stuff - things half installed, versions gone wrong, incompetent deb dependency handling from third parties, etc.
[23:28] <etfb> Darxus: Cool. Where can I find it?
[23:28] <jtaylor> 12.04 is still kde4 so you'll probably hate it too
[23:28] <Darxus> etfb: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PrecisePangolin/TechnicalOverview/Beta1#Known_issues
[23:29] <Darxus> etfb: First google hit for: precise beta 1
[23:29] <etfb> jtaylor: Yeah, that's why I want to go back to Unity.  I'm one of the rare people who actually prefers Unity over Gnome, and has done since it came out.
[23:29] <etfb> Darxus: Cool. Wasn't sure if it was being called a beta or something else.
[23:29] <Darxus> etfb: Precise Beta 2 is scheduled for March 29th:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PrecisePangolin/ReleaseSchedule
[23:30] <Darxus> Which, I suppose, could be more or less stable / usable.
[23:30] <Darxus> etfb: Honestly, now that I think about it for a moment, if you're unhappy with kubuntu, and not comfortable fixing those problems yourself without a full reinstall, I definitely do *not* recommend you install before the official release.
[23:31] <Darxus> Running a beta means willingness to deal with breakage, entirely possible to be worse than converting a kubuntu install back to ubuntu.
[23:31] <etfb> Darxus: I was just installing willy-nilly because I knew I'd be upgrading anyway.  I can fix stuff better from a clean start than I can from an already messed up one.
[23:32] <Darxus> I don't know what you mean by messed up, I love how clean debian and ubuntu stay over lots of years.
[23:32] <etfb> The list of Known Issues doesn't look too bad.    Ever tried to install Free Pascal and Lazarus using only the available documentation?  It's a sad, tragic fate for a poor innocent computer.
[23:33] <Darxus> Hell, I bet you could get a list of all the packages included in ubuntu oneric by default, and use dpkg --set-selection and apt-get dselect upgrade to revert to exactly that package set.
[23:33] <Darxus> etfb: Ah, no, I have no experience with that software.
[23:34] <etfb> Any time you want to know why so many people are mistrustful of free/open source projects and consider them to be the province of clueless nerds, FreePascal is the place to go to find out.  It's quite dreadful.
[23:34] <drtwox> Hi all. Is this an appropriate place to seek help with a broken Kubuntu update/upgrade?
[23:34] <Darxus> etfb: Hah, good to know.
[23:34] <penguin42> drtwox: If you're updating to Precise, yes
[23:35] <etfb> drtwox: My response would be "Kubuntu: Broken By Default", but I'm an old cynic and you can (and should) ignore me.  I'll just sit in the corner ranting and dribbling...
[23:36] <etfb> Anyhow, I'll take your advice -- try it with a Live CD for a while.  If it all Just Works, I'll take the plunge.  Thanks all.  (Dribble, dribble, rant.)
[23:37] <penguin42> drtwox: What's up?
[23:38] <drtwox> I install the Kubuntu Precise Beta1 (from iso), do an apt-get update/upgrade/reboot, and the system boots to a minimal busybox shell with the prompt: (initramfs)
[23:38] <penguin42> drtwox: OK,  shouldn't do that!   Tell us about your machine - single SATA drive? Anything special?
[23:40] <drtwox> Single SATA drive yes. nforce chipset. Kubuntu installed to use the entire disk. This happened about 4 days ago. I've been using Kubuntu Precise since Alpha2 with no problem.
[23:42] <drtwox> During the update/upgrade the Grub configuration says it can no longer find the drive it was originally installed on, and prompts me where to install. I choose sda and sda1.
[23:44] <Fyodorovna> drtwox, you would normally just choose the mbr sda
[23:44] <Fyodorovna> unless you had a boot partition.
[23:45] <drtwox> Fyodorovna: I have reinstall a few times, once of those times I did just select sda as the boot device.
[23:48] <penguin42> drtwox: OK, at the prompt that you are at, what happens if you cat /proc/partitions - can it see the hard drives?
[23:56] <drtwox> penguin42: I'll boot and report back...


[09:14] <zoon01> are here admins around to delete an translation completely?
[09:14] <zoon01> i messedup de.po and de_DE
[14:17] <ricotz> hello, I am seeing this chroot problem https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mozilla-daily/+archive/ubuntu/ppa/+build/15093226
[14:28] <acheronuk> ricotz: flaky ubuntu keyserver. I've had that happen from time to time. canonical sysadmin did have an open ticket on it
[14:28] <acheronuk> retry usually sorts it
[15:30] <kkeithley> yesterday I built my (glusterfs-4.1.1) packages with no problem. Today I'm trying to respin with arm64 and armhf enabled. The arm packages have built, but the amd64 and i386 builds are all failing with chroot problems.
[15:31] <cjwatson> just retry those - there are known keyserver issues that cause that
[15:32] <cjwatson> in fact I'll do a batch-retry of today's failures
[15:34] <cjwatson> (done)
[15:35] <kkeithley> mkay. I've been retrying them. quite a few times. As long as it's a known problem I'll keep retrying
[15:35] <cjwatson> ask #canonical-sysadmin if it persists.  I'm off today
[15:35] <ricotz> retrying doesn't help here :(
[15:36] <cjwatson> then a sysadmin will need to fix the keyservers - LP staff can't
[15:36] <ricotz> is the ticket public viewable?
[15:36] <cjwatson> no idea
[15:36] <cjwatson> see "off today"
[15:39] <ricotz> alright, thanks
[15:40] <cjwatson> I've poked our internal outage channel
[15:53] <acheronuk> 2/2 uploads failed for me :/
[15:54] <cjwatson> nothing more possible to be done here
[15:54] <cjwatson> it's in sysadmins' hands
[16:13] <acheronuk> some ppas seem ok. others fail time after time. weird
[16:15] <cjwatson> yes, there's caching involved.
[16:15] <cjwatson> so such an effect is to be expected.
[16:19] <acheronuk> so maybe a temp way around it if you NEED to get something built, is to build in an ok ppa and then copy over
[16:19]  * acheronuk shrugs
[16:20] <acheronuk> or maybe not. sigh
[19:22] <cjwatson> OK, the keyserver issues should be better now
[19:23] <cjwatson> retrying a bunch of earlier failures
[19:23] <cjwatson> (bug in an Apache rewrite rule, apparently)


[00:17] <bigjools> davecheney: seems like the azure provider is now basically blocked on a cloudinit sru to precise...
[00:18] <davecheney> bigjools: ok, i'm making a 1.14 branch
[00:18] <davecheney> we can backport fixes in there to get it working once cloudinit is done
[01:04] <axw> davecheney: https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1216770 is merged, I just forgot to update the bug
[01:04] <axw> it is in 1.13.3
[01:15] <davecheney> axw: no worries
[01:15] <davecheney> https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/document/d/1aEvcmxSJaj1i9zNjGy48yKF-SPlTFwW-NiKfoO_Ygo4/edit#heading=h.h7wry0fbg197
[01:15] <davecheney> ^ hint hint
[01:17] <axw> davecheney: updated
[01:17] <axw> feel free to edit
[01:19] <wallyworld> axw: hi, i had a test failure locally with the manual provisioning stuff - detectSeriesAndHardwareCharacteristics() because for some reason the bash that runs doesn't like my .shinit. i think we should ensure the bash that runs ignores all such files
[01:19] <axw> wallyworld: doh, thanks. I'll get onto it
[01:19] <wallyworld> np :-)
[01:20] <davecheney> axw: cool
[01:20] <davecheney> the builders are backed up
[01:20] <davecheney> i won't get the build til after lunch
[01:20] <davecheney> but we've tagged 1.13.3 now
[01:20] <davecheney> so feel free to wreck the build
[01:20] <wallyworld> axw: i had a quick look - using --noprofile or --norc didn't work; there must be another option to ensure .shinit is ignored. .shinit is more a sh thing i think
[01:21] <axw> wallyworld: k, thanks
[01:21] <axw> wallyworld: do you mean the unit tests were failing? or you were playing with it?
[01:22] <axw> ah the sshscript thing I guess...
[01:22] <wallyworld> axw: test failure. i ran the tests cause a merged trunk and there were api changes i needed to port into the new manual provisioning code.
[01:22] <wallyworld> i have a .shinit, the bit that failed was a mkdir, go figure
[01:24] <hazmat> davecheney, re slowness on cli.. how long does bootstrap take for you ? i'm consistently getting 2m plus
[01:24] <davecheney> lucky(~) % juju bootstrap -e us-west-1 -v
[01:24] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:24:23 INFO juju.provider.ec2 ec2.go:209 preparing environment "us-west-1"
[01:24] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:24:23 INFO juju.provider.ec2 ec2.go:187 opening environment "us-west-1"
[01:25] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:24:23 INFO juju.environs.tools tools.go:81 filtering tools by released version
[01:25] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:24:23 INFO juju.environs.tools tools.go:28 reading tools with major version 1
[01:25] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:24:23 INFO juju.environs.tools tools.go:36 filtering tools by series: precise
[01:25] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:24:28 INFO juju.environs.tools tools.go:43 falling back to public bucket
[01:25] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:24:29 INFO juju.environs.tools tools.go:92 picked newest version: 1.12.0
[01:25] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:24:38 INFO juju.environs.boostrap bootstrap.go:56 bootstrapping environment "us-west-1"
[01:25] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:24:38 INFO juju.environs.tools tools.go:28 reading tools with major version 1
[01:25] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:24:38 INFO juju.environs.tools tools.go:33 filtering tools by version: 1.12.0
[01:25] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:24:38 INFO juju.environs.tools tools.go:36 filtering tools by series: precise
[01:25] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:24:39 INFO juju.environs.tools tools.go:43 falling back to public bucket
[01:25] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:24:48 INFO juju.provider.ec2 ec2.go:426 started instance "i-24a95f7e"
[01:25] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:24:50 INFO juju supercommand.go:284 command finished
[01:25] <davecheney> that is from australia
[01:25] <davecheney> i suspect the growing number of tools we have in the public bucket is not helping
[01:25] <hazmat> wow
[01:26] <hazmat> thats a huge delta from what i see
[01:26] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:14:29 DEBUG juju state.go:159 waiting for DNS name(s) of state server instances [i-9b6cfffc]
[01:26] <hazmat> davecheney, yeah.. it would be nice to just have a latest pointer
[01:26] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:14:40 INFO juju.state open.go:68 opening state; mongo addresses: ["ec2-54-226-75-153.compute-1.amazonaws.com:37017"]; entity ""
[01:26] <davecheney> i have no idea what is happening in those 10 seconds
[01:26] <davecheney> oh, sorry
[01:26] <hazmat> so that's roughly 16s vs 25s
[01:26] <davecheney> that is getting the dns name from the provider
[01:26] <hazmat> yeah.. instance id -> ip addr
[01:27] <davecheney> it's ec2 being slow
[01:27] <davecheney> what can I say
[01:27] <hazmat> its still 75% of the runtime cost that can be saved with some trivial caching
[01:27] <hazmat> per the bug title
[01:28] <davecheney> lucky(~) % juju status -e us-west-1 -v
[01:28] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:28:26 INFO juju.provider.ec2 ec2.go:187 opening environment "us-west-1"
[01:28] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:28:29 INFO juju.state open.go:68 opening state; mongo addresses: ["ec2-54-219-20-209.us-west-1.compute.amazonaws.com:37017"]; entity ""
[01:28] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:28:30 INFO juju.state open.go:106 connection established
[01:28] <davecheney> environment: us-west-1
[01:28] <davecheney> machines:
[01:28] <davecheney>   "0":
[01:28] <davecheney>     agent-state: started
[01:29] <hazmat> pastebin pls
[01:29] <davecheney>     agent-version: 1.12.0
[01:29] <davecheney>     dns-name: ec2-54-219-20-209.us-west-1.compute.amazonaws.com
[01:29] <davecheney>     instance-id: i-24a95f7e
[01:29] <davecheney>     instance-state: running
[01:29] <davecheney>     series: precise
[01:29] <davecheney>     hardware: arch=amd64 cpu-cores=1 cpu-power=100 mem=1740M
[01:29] <davecheney> services: {}
[01:29] <davecheney> 2013-09-02 01:28:33 INFO juju supercommand.go:284 command finished
[01:29] <davecheney> you'l live :)
[01:29] <hazmat> davecheney, i'm using us-west-2 incidentally
[01:29] <hazmat> us-west-1 has higher pricing
[01:29]  * davecheney tried us-west-2
[01:30] <hazmat> davecheney,  http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6053452/
[01:30] <hazmat> 36s compared to 17s
[01:30] <davecheney> hazmat: it's slow in us-west-2 'cos there are no tools
[01:30] <hazmat> davecheney, there's tools in us-west-1?
[01:31] <hazmat> i thought only in us-east
[01:31] <davecheney> i have no idea why
[01:31] <davecheney> tools are no region specific in ec2
[01:31] <davecheney> the automatic fallback to sync-tool is very confusing if you don't pass -v
[01:31] <davecheney> hazmat: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6053456/ us-west-1
[01:32] <davecheney> us-west-2 is taking much longer
[01:32] <davecheney> i can only assuming it's doing sync tools
[01:32] <hazmat> generally with fios/fiber to the home, i have pretty good bandwidth & latency.. in terms of ruling out client connectivity.
[01:33] <hazmat> davecheney, there's some sleep and retry logic in the ec2/s3 code for eventual consistency as well
[01:33] <davecheney> hazmat: if I can bootstrap in 25 seconds from australia
[01:34] <davecheney> isn't not a latency problem :)
[01:34] <hazmat> wow
[01:34] <hazmat> 2m9 vs 25s
[01:34] <davecheney> it's sync tools
[01:35] <davecheney> hazmat: still going ...
[01:35] <davecheney> us-west-2
[01:35] <hazmat> davecheney, plus it looks up tools multiple times..
[01:35] <hazmat> in bootstrap
[01:35] <hazmat> one to find/upload them, one to launch an instance
[01:36] <hazmat> which gets duplicated by the provisioning worker for every launch
[01:40] <davecheney> hazmat: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6053480/
[01:40] <davecheney> ends with a Fffffuuuuu
[01:40] <hazmat> 2m4s
[01:40] <davecheney> 'cos of sync tools
[01:40] <davecheney> workaround: don't use us-east-2
[01:41] <davecheney> west-2
[01:41] <hazmat> that's interesting i don't see the tool sync
[01:41] <davecheney> gotta use -v
[01:41] <davecheney> always -v
[01:41] <davecheney> use -v for everything
[01:41] <davecheney> got a question
[01:41] <davecheney> -v
[01:41] <davecheney> need answers
[01:41] <davecheney> -v
[01:41] <hazmat> i've been using --debug
[01:41] <hazmat> which seems like it should imply -v
[01:41] <davecheney> sure
[01:41] <davecheney> i use-v
[01:41] <davecheney> did i mention i use -v
[01:41] <davecheney> -v is great
[01:42] <davecheney> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6053487/
[01:42] <davecheney> wut
[01:42] <davecheney> it either is, or is not bootstrapped
[01:42] <hazmat> davecheney, i know that bug
[01:43] <hazmat> davecheney, its when you have a bucket but no environment, ie. shutdown from the console
[01:43] <hazmat> davecheney, the only resolution was to destroy the environment again
[01:43] <davecheney> whoo
[01:44] <hazmat> or manually empty the bucket..
[01:44] <davecheney> hazmat: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6053492/
[01:44] <davecheney> 25seconds
[01:46] <hazmat> davecheney, for comparison http://paste.ubuntu.com/6053494/
[01:46] <wallyworld> axw: i looked at the simplestreams branch - i marked it as lgtm so long as a few issues are fixed. let me know if you have any questions. as soon as it lands, i need to munge simplestreams format a bit
[01:46] <axw> wallyworld: okey dokey, thanks
[01:47] <davecheney> 2013-09-01 14:47:35 INFO juju.environs.tools tools.go:93 picked newest version: 1.13.2
[01:47] <davecheney> 2013-09-01 14:48:04 DEBUG juju.provider.ec2 storage.go:52 Creating bucket
[01:47] <davecheney> what the heck is it doing for 30 seconds there
[01:48] <davecheney> 2013-09-01 14:48:35 DEBUG juju.provider.ec2 ec2.go:394 ec2 user data; 12541 bytes
[01:48] <davecheney> 2013-09-01 14:48:56 DEBUG juju.provider.ec2 ec2.go:397 ec2 groups setup
[01:48] <davecheney> hazmat, whatever ec2 enpoint you are talking to
[01:48] <davecheney> it's screwed
[01:48] <hazmat> davecheney, that's us-east
[01:48] <hazmat> davecheney, its the same time for us-west
[01:48] <davecheney> sure, but bgp says we don't see the same thing
[01:49] <hazmat> yeah
[01:49] <axw> wallyworld: where did you try adding --noprofile/--norc?
[01:49] <wallyworld> axw: in the call which invoked bash
[01:49] <wallyworld> md := exec.Command("ssh", sshHost, "bash")
[01:50] <wallyworld> but i may have not done it right, i was in a hurry
[01:50] <axw> ok, that wouldn't work - bash doesn't actually get executed there
[01:50] <davecheney> axw, maybe need -t
[01:51] <axw> davecheney: ?
[01:51] <axw> ssh -t?
[01:51] <davecheney> otherwise bash won't have a pty
[01:52] <axw> davecheney: yeah.. don't need it here. not actually running a real ssh in the tests
[01:52] <davecheney> kk
[01:52]  * davecheney stops 'helping'
[01:52] <axw> ;)
[02:00] <axw> wallyworld: I'm not sure how to reproduce the problem. Can you please try "var sshscript = `#!/bin/bash --noprofile" in detection_test.go, when you have a minute
[02:00] <wallyworld> axw: sure, i'll just park some stuff and try it
[02:03] <wallyworld> axw: no good :-(. you could maybe reproduce it by having a ~/.shinit with a non zero exit code?
[02:03] <axw> wallyworld: tried that..
[02:03] <axw> hrm
[02:03] <wallyworld> hmmm. was you .shinit run?
[02:04] <axw> probably not :)
[02:04] <axw> it is if I run "sh"
[02:04] <wallyworld> so i'm confused
[02:04] <axw> I guess your bash profile is running something through sh?
[02:04] <wallyworld> ah, i think i might invoke it
[02:04] <wallyworld> elsewhere
[02:05] <axw> I'm sure we have other tests which do this though
[02:05] <axw> so I don't know why this one in particular would break
[02:05] <wallyworld> i have it in my .bashrc
[02:05] <wallyworld> BASH_ENV=$HOME/.shinit
[02:06] <wallyworld> but .bashrc should not be run, right?
[02:06] <thumper> wallyworld: what are you doing that is so special?
[02:06] <wallyworld> thumper: the line that fails is a mkdir -p foobar
[02:06] <thumper> axw: I suggest we just blame wallyworld and make him fix it
[02:06] <axw> hehe
[02:07] <thumper> wallyworld: what is in your .shinit?
[02:07] <wallyworld> except we shouldn't be running profile scripts when doing the ssh :-)
[02:07] <axw> wallyworld: so you could change --noprofile to --norc, but it's still a bit weird
[02:07]  * thumper reads that quickly as "shit init"
[02:07]  * axw snorts
[02:07] <axw> I did the same :)
[02:07] <thumper> heh
[02:08] <wallyworld> thumper: i have a bunch of exports, and a line to make a tmp dir cause i have /tmp mapped to ram. the line which errors in the tests is mkdir -p /var/tmp/mailman/logs
[02:08] <wallyworld> the test error is
[02:08] <thumper> wallyworld: why does it fail?
[02:08] <wallyworld> ...     "error detecting hardware characteristics: exit status 126 (/home/ian/.shinit: line 49: /bin/mkdir: Argument list too long\n" +
[02:09] <wallyworld> ...     "/tmp/gocheck-8674665223082153551/3/ssh: line 14: /tmp/gocheck-8674665223082153551/3/ssh: Argument list too long\n" +
[02:09] <wallyworld> ...     "/tmp/gocheck-8674665223082153551/3/ssh: line 14: /tmp/gocheck-8674665223082153551/3/ssh: Success)"
[02:09] <thumper> wallyworld: why have it in .shinit instead of .bashrc?
[02:09] <wallyworld> thumper: i call .shinit from my bashrc
[02:09] <thumper> why?
[02:09] <wallyworld> not sure now. there was a reason at some point
[02:09] <thumper> if you renamed it to something else, what fails?
[02:10] <wallyworld> if i rename it, the tests pass
[02:10] <wallyworld> but then it is not run
[02:10] <thumper> \o/
[02:10] <wallyworld> well, there is still the roblem that my .bashrc is being run
[02:10] <wallyworld> in order to call .shinit
[02:11] <wallyworld> and we shouldn't be doing that
[02:11] <thumper> well, no
[02:11] <thumper> /bin/sh loads .shinit
[02:11] <axw> wallyworld: can you try replacing --noprofile with --norc?
[02:11] <wallyworld> sure
[02:12] <wallyworld> damn. no good
[02:13] <axw> wtf
[02:13] <wallyworld> yeah, makes no sense to me
[02:15] <wallyworld> i'll just rename the shinit
[02:39] <axw> wallyworld: re "Please make this a big number so that we can ensure the fix actually works"
[02:39] <axw> that test is not testing the fix at all
[02:40] <axw> it's testing that standard JSON unmarshalling behaviour takes palce
[02:40] <axw> place*
[02:40] <wallyworld> ah, ok. i thought that the new unmarshall/marshall stuff was being invoked all the time
[02:40] <axw> if you unmarshal a number into an interface{}, you get a float64
[02:40] <axw> no, only if you go through ParseCloudMetadata
[02:40] <axw> because only then do you have a template value
[02:40] <wallyworld> ok, no problem. thanks for clarifying
[02:41] <axw> nps, I'll add a comment in the review too in case anyone else cares
[02:41] <wallyworld> did i make sense when i said i just wanted the marshall/unmarshall code moved out?
[02:41] <axw> yes
[02:41] <axw> I've kept "itemCollection" (the clone of ItemCollection) and the ItemCollection methods in json.go
[02:41] <axw> everything else has gone back
[02:41] <axw> is that right?
[02:42] <axw> ItemCollection methods = UnmarshalJSON & construct
[02:42] <wallyworld> yeah, i think that's good. i wanted the business logic / data model as it was, and the on the wire stuff separate to it's easier to grok etc
[02:42] <axw> cool
[02:42] <wallyworld> cause the user reading the simplestreams logic doesn't care about the json crap
[02:43] <thumper> dog walk time
[02:43] <wallyworld> and visa versa
[02:43] <wallyworld> ha, that last comment could also apply to thumper
[02:43] <wallyworld> even though it wasn't meant to
[02:48] <axw> davecheney: the azure bugs can be fixed pretty quickly it seems
[02:48] <axw> davecheney: any chance of slipping anything else in?
[02:49] <axw> wallyworld: have you seen this? https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1219123
[02:49] <davecheney> axw: too late
[02:49] <davecheney> release it tagged
[02:49] <davecheney> we can always back port
[02:49] <axw> okey dokey
[02:50] <wallyworld> axw: no, haven't seen that before
[03:28] <thumper> arse biscuits
[03:28] <thumper> some of our code is truly horrible
[03:28]  * thumper thinks
[03:45]  * thumper decides not to fix everything at once
[04:03] <wallyworld> axw: are you landing your simplestreams branch now?
[04:04] <axw> wallyworld: yes. do you want to make another pass, or shall I go ahead?
[04:04] <wallyworld> axw: nah, Just Do It. we can iterate as needed
[04:04] <axw> cool
[04:04] <wallyworld> i need to merge it into my work after it lands, and then change stuff to do with the data format
[04:05] <axw> okey dokey. let me know if there's something you'd like me to do
[04:06] <axw> also, sorry it took so long
[04:07] <wallyworld> no problem, it didn;t take long, it was fairly involved
[04:18] <axw> wallyworld: just merging with trunk, I'll let you know when the bot's done
[04:18] <wallyworld> yay, thanks
[04:24] <axw> or not, one of the tests is playing up
[04:41]  * thumper wonders how to withdraw a rietveld review
[05:01] <wallyworld> axw: i have school pickup, i check when i get back to see how the merge is going
[05:01] <axw> wallyworld: ok, later. fixing tests atm
[05:11]  * thumper uses some mocks for agent.Config
[05:11] <thumper> it feels GOOD
[05:14] <thumper> hmm...
[05:14] <thumper> WTF went wrong there...
[05:15] <thumper> copy and paste went wrong there
[06:02] <jam> axw: I bring up the SHA256 thing because it failed in the bot
[06:03] <axw> jam: ah right. yeah there was a bug in my test code, I was accidentally writing dynamic content to the fake tools files
[06:03]  * thumper is almost done
[06:03] <axw> must've been lucky with the gocheck temporary dir being the same on my machine
[06:06] <thumper> argh!!!
[06:06]  * thumper takes a deep breath
[06:06] <jam> thumper is never almost done
[06:06] <jam> :)
[06:06] <thumper> :P
[06:06] <jam> well, never *actually* done
[06:07]  * thumper leaves it for now
[06:10] <axw> jam: expect MS to call you if you've signed up for Azure
[06:10] <axw> they woke me up the other day..
[06:11] <jam> axw: yeah.
[06:12] <jam> axw: so when I "LGTM" with some comments, if you address and agree with the comments, you can feel free to just land it
[06:13] <axw> jam: ok, will do
[06:13] <axw> I'm just updating the default-precise comment now
[06:13] <axw> and testing
[06:34] <davecheney> 1.13.3 is released
[06:34] <davecheney> the lp builders are lagged
[06:34] <davecheney> i'll uploda the tarball and publish the release notes once the tools are uploaded
[06:34] <jam> thanks davecheney
[06:36] <davecheney> will look at the 1.14 branch next
[06:36] <davecheney> /s/branch/series
[06:41] <davecheney> i release 1.13.3 so y'all would stop putting bugs back in there :)
[06:49] <davecheney> https://launchpad.net/juju-core/+milestone/1.14.0
[07:08] <wallyworld> axw: just saw your test error - that's intermittent, i raised a bug 1219602
[07:08] <wallyworld> i resubmitted and it worked
[07:08] <axw> wallyworld: thanks, I was about to look into it...
[07:08] <axw> cool
[07:08] <wallyworld> np, that's why i pinged you to save you the trouble :-)
[07:09] <axw> wallyworld: it says "needs review" still?
[07:09] <wallyworld> axw: if a test run failes, the bot puts it back to needs review
[07:10] <wallyworld> you need to flip it to approved again
 i resubmitted and it worked  <- what worked?
[07:10] <wallyworld> axw: the landing bot ran the tests successfully and merged the branch
[07:11] <wallyworld> when i say resubmitted, i mean i marked the mp as approved
[07:11] <axw> oh ok
[07:11] <axw> yep..
[07:11] <wallyworld> and so the bot noticed and re did its thing
[07:12] <axw> I'm confused because it's not saying merged, but it doesn't matter. I'll do it again
[07:16] <wallyworld> axw: it's not saying merged because the merge did not happen because the tests failed
[07:16] <wallyworld> so the bot emailed the test failures and flipped the status back to needs approved
[07:16] <axw> wallyworld: yeah I get that, but I thought you said it passed
[07:17] <axw> sorry, I'm being a bit thick
[07:17] <wallyworld> it passed for *me* for my branch when i tried a second time
[07:17] <axw> ahh right, on a different MP
[07:17] <wallyworld> yeah, sorry
[07:17] <dimitern> morning!
[07:17] <axw> morning dimitern
[07:17]  * wallyworld goes to soccer
[07:21] <axw> wallyworld: it has finally merged
[07:21] <axw> enjoy soccer
[08:03] <jamespage> davecheney, I'm assuming that my next upload to saucy should be 1.14.0 right?
[08:03] <jamespage> and thats really just 'stable release of 1.13.x'?
[08:03] <jamespage> (need to phrase my changelog message right as I don't think its a huge jump from 1.13.2)
[08:36] <jam> jamespage: that sounds right to me
[08:36]  * jam heads out to run a couple of errands.
[08:41] <davecheney> jamespage: correct
[08:41] <davecheney> will be ready by weeks end if not sooner
[08:41] <davecheney> i wouldn't worry about 1.13.3
[09:14] <mgz> so, it's a no US day today
[09:20] <thumper> jam: hey, seen mramm?
[09:24] <mgz> thumper: I assume he's out as it's a US holiday today
[09:25] <thumper> mgz: he's in the UK :)
[09:26] <mgz> oh, then I guess not :)
[10:02] <jam> mgz:  /wave
[10:03] <jam> I haven't seen mramm all day anyway
[10:05] <mgz> hey jam
[10:17] <dimitern> https://codereview.appspot.com/13272045 - mgz, jam, please take a look (uniter api's remaining unit ops)
[10:24] <dimitern> fwereade: ^^?
[10:25] <fwereade> dimitern, sure
[10:26] <dimitern> fwereade: ty
[10:27] <mgz> dimitern: sure
[10:31] <jam> mramm: hey, good to see you around
[10:32] <mramm> jam: in the london office for the gui sprint
[10:33] <dimitern> mramm: hey, so we can book now for the sf sprint?
[10:34] <mramm> dimitern: yep
[10:34] <dimitern> mramm: cool!
[10:34] <dimitern> mramm: arriving 21, leaving 25 oct, right?
[10:34] <dimitern> mramm: or thereabouts
[10:42] <jam> dimitern: I think you need the final signoff from mramm before you can actually get the agency to book the travel
[10:42] <jam> but you could probably start the conversation.
[10:43] <dimitern> jam: well, following the steps in the mail, I'm filling in the form first, then will contact bts travel
[10:44] <jam> dimitern: right, so after filling in the form mramm gives a final signoff on it, and you get a confirmation ID that you need to share with BTS before they'll book anything
[10:44] <jam> I think you actually share the whole email with them.
[10:44] <dimitern> jam: ok
[10:45] <mgz> will miss the standup, will catch up when I'm back shortly after
[10:49] <fwereade> dimitern, couple of questions, not *quite* an LGTM, the Destroy test is the only one that gave me serious pause
[10:50] <dimitern> fwereade: ok
[10:52] <dimitern> fwereade: well, the uniter does call unit.Destroy
[10:52] <fwereade> dimitern, but not on itself
[10:52] <dimitern> fwereade: filter.go:453, uniter.go:498
[10:53] <fwereade> dimitern, bah, filter, I stand corrected
[10:53] <dimitern> fwereade: :) so it's ok then?
[10:55] <fwereade> dimitern, yeah, I think so
[10:55] <fwereade> dimitern, it might be neater to implement the test for a unit destroying its own subordinate, though, because that's the one that's least sensitive to future change
[10:55] <fwereade> dimitern, and you've already written that support code, so it should be easy ;p
[10:56] <dimitern> fwereade: ok, will do
[10:56] <fwereade> dimitern, thanks
[11:07] <dimitern> fwereade: hmm
[11:08] <fwereade> dimitern, eh, problems?
[11:08] <dimitern> fwereade: I'm not sure it's possible to do an api call for a subordinate if you've logged in as the principal
[11:09] <fwereade> dimitern, doesn't the principal destroy its own subordinates? maybe I misremembered
[11:09] <dimitern> fwereade: i mean, it'll return ErrPerm because the auth'ed entity tag won't match
[11:09] <fwereade> dimitern, modes.go:298
[11:09] <dimitern> fwereade: so the when logged in as a principal, you should be able to call Destroy() (and only that method?) on its subordinates as well
[11:10] <fwereade> dimitern, that's the only one I can think of offhand
[11:10] <dimitern> fwereade: ok, that'll require a few changes at server-side
[11:10] <fwereade> dimitern, hopefully minor?
[11:10] <dimitern> fwereade: they should be, yeah
[11:11] <fwereade> dimitern, cool, thanks
[11:11] <fwereade> dimitern, if it needs to be a separate CL so be it
[11:12] <dimitern> fwereade: yeah it seems more like that
[11:12] <dimitern> fwereade: more changes are needed actually - I need to be able to fetch a subordinate from a logged in principal
[11:13] <dimitern> fwereade: so what do you say to leaving it as is, adding a TODO to fix it and doing the fix in a follow-up?
[11:15] <fwereade> dimitern, LGTMed
[11:15] <dimitern> cheers
[11:15] <fwereade> dimitern, well, you don't need to get the subordinate for that piece of code
[11:15] <fwereade> dimitern, that's just a Destroy loop over SubordinateNames
[11:16] <dimitern> fwereade: not really
[11:16] <fwereade> dimitern, hell, the first 10 lines of that mode should really just be a "destroy all subordinates plskthx" api call
[11:17] <dimitern> fwereade: SubordinateNames returns names, not tags, and I need a uniter.Unit proxy object to call the server-side
[11:17] <dimitern> fwereade: so I have to construct it in place, it'll be a bit ugly
[11:17] <fwereade> dimitern, all the more reason to replace it all then -- but that's not the approach we agreed, I know
[11:18] <fwereade> dimitern, that said
[11:18] <fwereade> dimitern, why would we use names over the API? *shouldn't* they be subordinate tags? ;p
[11:19] <dimitern> fwereade: we return names, but take tags as args
[11:19] <fwereade> dimitern, that's incoherent
[11:20] <fwereade> dimitern, how widespread is it?
[11:20] <dimitern> fwereade: in most cases we use only tags, except for a few cases like SubordinateNames and the strings watchers
[11:20] <dimitern> fwereade: not much, but I have to check
[11:22] <fwereade> dimitern, so long as there's general agreement that the appropriate language is tags, not names, I'm reasonably happy
[11:22] <fwereade> dimitern, bugger, we have deployed lifecycle watchers that use names, haven't we?
[11:24] <dimitern> fwereade: so these return or use names: GetPrincipal, SubordinateNames,Relation (inside the RelationResult struct there's a ServiceName field), ReadRemoteSettings (only in the error message "cannot read...")
[11:25] <dimitern> fwereade: lifecycle watchers are notifywatchers I think
[11:26] <dimitern> fwereade: but the deployer uses a stringswatcher that returns names
[11:26] <fwereade> dimitern, ideally I think all those would be fixed before we deployed something that expected names
[11:26] <fwereade> dimitern, but the StringsWatcher thing has rather screwed us
[11:28] <dimitern> fwereade: yep, so I looked
[11:29] <dimitern> fwereade: stringswatchers, error messages, a few params struct fields, and these 2 methods of UniterAPI use names
[11:31] <dimitern> fwereade: standup
[11:33] <jam> TheMue: standup? https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/f497381ca4d154890227b3b35a85a985b894b471
[12:54] <dimitern> wow, so with some of the cli now using the api, cmd/juju tests running time increased like 5 fold
[13:05]  * dimitern lunch
[13:32] <dimitern> fwereade: hey
[13:32] <fwereade> dimitern, heyhey
[13:33] <dimitern> fwereade: the way uniter api works now, it calls Life when you call uniter.Unit(tag)
[13:33] <dimitern> fwereade: and that's the only way to get a unit proxy object
[13:33] <dimitern> fwereade: does Life has to work for subordinates as well? because that opens a different can of worms
[13:33] <fwereade> dimitern, I don't think so
[13:34] <fwereade> dimitern, I suspect a simple DestroyAllSubordinates will be the easiest way
[13:34] <dimitern> fwereade: so the client-side api has to distinguish between a principal and a subordinate
[13:34] <dimitern> fwereade: ah, so make a new method on unit - DestroyAllSubordinates then?
[13:34] <dimitern> fwereade: and the matching call at server-side
[13:34] <fwereade> dimitern, I think so
[13:35] <dimitern> fwereade: this will require some changes in the uniter as well
[13:36] <fwereade> dimitern, agreed
[13:37] <dimitern> fwereade: ok, will add a TODO for that as well
[13:38] <fwereade> dimitern, we're writing code either way
[13:39] <fwereade> dimitern, use your judgment
[13:39] <fwereade> dimitern, if it's cleaner to preserve the structure then that's ok too
[13:39] <dimitern> fwereade: it's not cleaner at all - it involves chaning LifeGetter to accomodate that special case
[13:40] <dimitern> fwereade: I prefer not to do it unless we need to
[13:40] <fwereade> dimitern, huh? surely not
[13:40] <fwereade> dimitern, auth is specified outside LifeGetter
[13:40] <fwereade> dimitern, it's the same getauth as deployer, surely?
[13:41] <fwereade> dimitern, ah not quite
[13:41] <fwereade> dimitern, but still
[13:41] <dimitern> fwereade: well, the auth func will get a lot more complicated, but yes LifeGetter might not need to change
[13:53] <dimitern> fwereade: well, the auth func will get a lot more complicated, but yes LifeGetter might not need to change<
[13:53] <dimitern> fwereade: oops, sorry
[13:54] <dimitern> fwereade: too many windows :)
[14:13] <dimitern> fwereade: there it is https://codereview.appspot.com/13426045
[14:35] <dimitern> fwereade: ping
[14:35] <fwereade> dimitern, hey, sorry, I'm looking
[14:36] <dimitern> fwereade: cheers
[14:49] <fwereade> dimitern, LGTM
[14:49] <fwereade> dimitern, sorry delay
[14:49] <fwereade> dimitern, although actually...
[14:49] <dimitern> fwereade: thanks!
[14:49] <fwereade> dimitern, how about putting that comment in uniter?
[14:50] <fwereade> dimitern, that's where we'll need to know it, not the other places, really
[14:50] <dimitern> fwereade: ah, good idea!
[14:59] <dimitern> fwereade: another, quite trivial https://codereview.appspot.com/13348050
[15:10] <fwereade> dimitern, a thought
[15:10] <fwereade> dimitern, if we have DestroyAllSubordinates, the only use of Subordinates would be better expressed plain old HasSubordinates
[15:11] <dimitern> fwereade: have to check
[15:11] <dimitern> fwereade: yeah, that seems sane
[15:12] <dimitern> fwereade: there are only 2 cases where it's used, and the the second one is just like HasSubordinates
[15:17] <dimitern> fwereade: so you're saying rename Subordinates to HasSubordinates, returning just a bool
[15:24] <dimitern> fwereade: the penultimate for today, promise :) https://codereview.appspot.com/13383046
[15:24] <dimitern> fwereade: the last will be a trivial rename s.unit -> s.stateUnit and unit -> apiUnit in client-side tests
[15:25] <fwereade> dimitern, <3
[15:28] <fwereade> dimitern, reviewed
[15:28] <dimitern> fwereade: tyvm
[15:40] <dimitern> fwereade: updated https://codereview.appspot.com/13348050
[15:43] <fwereade> dimitern, LGTM, couple of things to check
[15:47] <dimitern> fwereade: cheers
[15:53] <dimitern> fwereade: updated https://codereview.appspot.com/13383046/
[16:03] <hazmat> anyone tried local provider lately? i keep running into bug 1219887
[16:03] <_mup_> Bug #1219887: local provider needs to wait for upstart to load service file <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1219887>
[16:12] <rick_h> hazmat: used it on friday, what version? I was on the stable ppa I think
[16:22] <hazmat> rick_h, trunk of go and juju
[16:45] <dimitern> fwereade: last one - https://codereview.appspot.com/13472043
[16:46]  * dimitern bbiab
[17:15] <dimitern> fwereade: ping
[17:24] <dimitern> TheMue, mgz: still aroung?
[17:24] <dimitern> around
[17:26] <TheMue> dimitern: will take a look after dinner
[17:29] <dimitern> TheMue: cheers; it's a trivial renaming
[18:09] <TheMue> dimitern: you've got a LGTM
[18:16] <dimitern> TheMue: thanks!
[21:46] <thumper> WTF?
[21:46] <thumper> my review seemed to pick up all sorts of weird changes
[21:47]  * thumper grunts
[21:47] <thumper> because lbox uses the launchpad copy of the branch, not the local one
[22:04] <davecheney> mramm ping
[22:06] <davecheney> mramm ping
[22:06] <mramm> davecheney: pong
[22:09] <davecheney> goodbye sweet prince
[22:10] <davecheney> that's what you get for using a mac
[22:10]  * davecheney waves
[23:51] <thumper> gym time \o/