[00:30] <dbungert> JackFrost: by chance are you running autopkgtest in schroot?  Sometimes tests try to write to home and those tests might work in another backend.
[00:32] <sarnold> does HOME get set somewhere meaningful on the others?
[00:32] <JackFrost> Hah, build time tests in pbuilder.
[00:32] <sarnold> (that's my first guess, anyway)
[06:38] <LocutusOfBorg> enr0n, armhf is fixed with a little more patch
[06:38] <LocutusOfBorg> ppc64el when built with -O3 is something I leave to you
[06:38] <LocutusOfBorg> as well as updating the upstream pull request once you have the full fix
[06:39] <LocutusOfBorg> https://launchpad.net/~costamagnagianfranco/+archive/ubuntu/locutusofborg-ppa/+sourcefiles/nfstrace/<IP_ADDRESS>+git20200805+b220d04-2.1ubuntu1/nfstrace_<IP_ADDRESS>+git20200805+b220d04-2.1ubuntu1.dsc
[10:00] <alexghiti> Hi guys, could someone trigger this job for me please? https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/request.cgi?release=jammy&arch=amd64&package=python-readme-renderer&trigger=pygments/2.11.2%2Bdfsg-2
[10:00] <alexghiti> Thanks!
[10:01] <seb128> alexghiti, k
[10:02] <alexghiti> seb128 thanks
[10:39] <mirespace> Hello... I'm packaging a huge project, and i discovered that the compression being used for control et al is zstd and lintian is flagging that as an error ... any way to overcome this? force another compression?
[10:47] <mirespace> I suppose I'll try with -Z option  for dpkg-source
[12:18] <ahasenack> morning
[12:21] <ahasenack> Happy Friday
[12:23] <mirespace> happy Friday ahasenack :)
[12:23] <ahasenack> hi mirespace
[16:01] <seb128> doko, ginggs, is that expected?
[16:01] <seb128> # python3.10 -c 'import sysconfig; print(sysconfig.get_path("include"))'
[16:01] <seb128> /usr/local/include/python3.10
[16:01] <seb128> # python3.9 -c 'import sysconfig; print(sysconfig.get_path("include"))'
[16:01] <seb128> /usr/include/python3.9
[16:01] <seb128>
[16:01] <seb128> that's the reason why brltty rebuild is failing atm
[16:02] <tumbleweed> seb128: yes, this changed
[16:02]  * tumbleweed looks at brltty
[16:03] <tumbleweed> also relevant: https://bugs.python.org/issue44445
[16:03] <seb128> tumbleweed, https://github.com/brltty/brltty/blob/master/Tools/pythoncmd#L50
[16:04] <seb128> tumbleweed, and https://github.com/brltty/brltty/blob/master/Bindings/Python/bindings.m4#L124
[16:12] <seb128> tumbleweed, it feels weird that sysconfig doesn't include the distro paths
[16:12] <tumbleweed> seb128: it does
[16:12] <tumbleweed> the default scheme changed from unix_prefix to unix_local
[16:12] <tumbleweed> (or posix_ as appropriate)
[16:12] <tumbleweed> which it used to be back in the 2.7 days, FWIW
[16:13] <tumbleweed> the easy patch is to force the use of the unix_prefix scheme in this pythoncmd script
[16:13] <tumbleweed> just seeing what the effects are
[16:18] <seb128> tumbleweed, thanks, I'm not going to have time to poke more today but I might pick it up on monday if noone beats me to it
[16:21] <tumbleweed> seb128: I'll file a PR upstream now, and a bug in Debian
[16:22] <seb128> tumbleweed, thanks
[16:26] <seb128> tumbleweed, I confirmed that adding scheme="posix_prefix" to the get_path calls fixes the build
[16:30] <seb128> tumbleweed, did you want to upload the fix to Ubuntu or should I do it?
[16:31] <tumbleweed> go for it, if you've got it ready
[16:33] <seb128> tumbleweed, I haven't yet but my local try worked so I will clean that up and upload on monday if no one has done it before, thanks again for the help!
[16:33] <tumbleweed> np
[16:37] <enr0n> LocutusOfBorg: I added a patch to fix the nfstrace build errors on armhf and ppc64el: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nfstrace/+bug/1965155/comments/3
[17:49] <LocutusOfBorg> enr0n, https://github.com/epam/nfstrace/pull/50/files
[17:49] <LocutusOfBorg> there was already a fix...
[17:49] <LocutusOfBorg> meh, uploading your version
[17:50] <LocutusOfBorg> I really would like if you could update the pull request you opened
[17:50] <LocutusOfBorg> and also please if possible open a PR with the TIRPC debian patch
[17:50] <LocutusOfBorg> they are doing TIRPC search for fedora only just removing that check might work
[17:59] <enr0n> LocutusOfBorg: yeah I didn't notice that until I opened my PR. It was a quick enough fix, and I have already updated my PR.
[17:59] <enr0n> There was another armhf failure anyways that wouldn't be fixed by the other PR.'
[18:01] <LocutusOfBorg> yes indeed
[18:01] <LocutusOfBorg> and about dropping the 4 lines in cmakelists?
[18:01] <LocutusOfBorg> https://github.com/epam/nfstrace/blob/master/CMakeLists.txt
[18:01] <LocutusOfBorg> I didn't test but removing: 36 37 38 46 47 should do the trick
[18:02] <LocutusOfBorg> also maybe changing the message at line 45
[18:09] <enr0n> I don't have much previous context for the TIRPC patch, but sure if I have time I will look into upstreaming.
[19:31] <Eickmeyer[m]> mapreri: Looks like inkscape is depending on libpoppler115, but only 118 is available. Should we do a NCR?
[19:39] <jbicha> Eickmeyer[m]: check your inkscape version; it doesn't sounds like you have the current jammy release
[19:41] <Eickmeyer[m]> jbicha: yeah, something's fishy here. Good point.
[19:47] <Eickmeyer[m]> jbicha: Yep, I had an inkscape PPA enabled. Disabling it fixed the problem. #RookieMistake
[19:47] <Eickmeyer[m]> mapreri: Disregard.
[21:56] <LocutusOfBorg> enr0n, I did it
[21:56] <LocutusOfBorg> https://github.com/epam/nfstrace/pull/52
[21:56] <LocutusOfBorg> so now we can go hopefully without patches on next upstream release


[04:29] <StevenJayCohen[m> Hey OvenWerks just saw this and wondered if me being willing to test on Debian would be of  any value? https://github.com/ovenwerks/studio-controls/issues/66
[04:30] <StevenJayCohen[m> StevenJayCohen[m: In the process of migrating from Ubuntu (both 20.04 and 21.10) to Debian 11 everyhwere
[20:03] <tarzeau> is some musician in there who wants to test a new music composing software? (komposter, stuck in NEW q)
[20:16] <RikMills> Debian NEW I suppose?
[20:16] <tarzeau> yes
[21:52] <RikMills> KDE Frameworks 5.88.0 should now be just about all landed. Please report any issues


[05:18] <alourie> good morning
[12:20] <jibel> You have an ATI or nVidia graphics card ? You can help in testing it on Oneiric.
[12:20] <jibel> Read the instructions at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Testing/ProprietaryDrivers/Oneiric/VideoDrivers
[12:20] <jibel> and submit your results on the tracker http://xorg.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/
[13:10] <brendand> jibel - cool, I do
[13:10] <brendand> ATI
[20:25] <hggdh> jibel: please add me to the Xorg testers; also...
[20:25] <hggdh> jibel: on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Testing/ProprietaryDrivers/Oneiric/VideoDrivers <- wouldn't it be better to run 'sudo lspci -v' to get the capabilities?
[20:27] <jibel> hggdh, you're right. I'm updating the page.
[20:28] <jibel> if the wiki allows me to log in of course.
[20:29] <jibel> done
[21:34] <hggdh> jibel: (and I would hope you would have called it a day ;-) -- any special package for dual-monitor bugs?
[21:34] <hggdh> or under nVidia?


[01:09] <thafreak> anyone play with kvm/spice?
[01:10] <thafreak> debian 8 host, 15.04 guest...resizing window doesn't automatically trigger guest video resolution change
[01:10] <thafreak> start a guest with debian 8 live gnome cd, and it supports resolution changing just fine
[01:11] <thafreak> all the moving parts as far as I can tell are the same...same spice-vdagent version, same xorg driver version
[01:11] <thafreak> :/
[13:40] <yano> https://i.imgur.com/yp1V1Sd.jpg
[13:41] <belkinsa> That's a crazy fact.
[13:41] <yano> hehe
[16:17] <thafreak> so...spice is pretty awesome
[16:18] <thafreak> you can watch youtube videos like they were running in your local browser but on a remote machine over the network


[06:55] <dholbach> good morning
[14:59] <Fantu> in trusty gvfs have important/critical bug solved upstream but not applied
[14:59] <Fantu> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=637095
[15:00] <Fantu> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gvfs/+bug/517021
[15:02] <Fantu> can someone apply the fix to trusty and precise please?
[15:03] <Fantu> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gvfs/commit/?id=23341281b7e7f3d92ea1f3d6dffc156a8adb03bc
[15:28] <rbasak> Fantu: can you follow https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Procedure please?
[15:29] <rbasak> Fantu: first it needs fixing in Vivid. Can you confirm if it has already been fixed, or still needs fixing?
[16:30] <Fantu> rbasak in vivid is already fixed upstream


[00:00] <danrik> k1l, ewww. how about something more hi-spec?
[00:02] <k1l> time will tell
[00:04] <danrik> k1l, k
[00:32] <pngo> does ubuntu-touch supports synchronization of evolution data (syncevolution) over local lan/wifi?
[04:19] <aquarius> hm. When I plug my Ubuntu Nexus 4 into my machine with USB, it doesn't show up in adb. Do I need to do something to make it do so?
[04:20] <lotuspsychje> aquarius: here's a nice tutorial: http://itsfoss.com/install-ubuntu-touch-nexus-7-2013/
[04:20] <lotuspsychje> just use nexus4 image instead
[04:21] <aquarius> ahaha! I need developer mode turned on.
[04:21] <aquarius> Now it is :)
[04:22] <nhaines> aquarius: The only thing I hate about that is the need for PINs.  :)
[04:25] <aquarius> nhaines, makes sense, though :)
[04:25] <nhaines> aquarius: I was never convinced.  :)
[05:28] <aquarius> hm. mirscreencast can't actually record a video because it drops about nine frames out of ten. Sigh.
[05:47] <nhaines> aquarius: yeah, I noticed.  :(  I spent hours on Wednesday recording off-screen footage.
[06:04] <aquarius> just tried piping the output of mirscreencast into netcat and then picking it up on my main machine, which helps quite a bit
[06:04] <aquarius> but it still isn't perfect.
[06:07] <nhaines> aquarius: http://i.imgur.com/NtV8BwC.png
[06:08] <aquarius> "nc -l -p 1234 > out" on my main machine; "mirscreencast -n 600 -m /var/run/mir_socket -s 360 640 --stdout | nc mainmachine 1234" on the phone, and then "mencoder -demuxer rawvideo -rawvideo fps=6:w=360:h=640:format=bgra -ovc x264 -o out.mp4 out" to make a sensible mp4 on the main machine once recording is stopped. It still isn't anything even close to perfect, but it does stop the phone basically locking up whil
[06:08] <aquarius> e recording is going on
[06:09]  * nhaines can't wait until Kazam is ported to Mir.
[06:22] <aquarius> http://www.kryogenix.org/days/2015/01/11/ubuntu-phone-screencasting-a-minor-tip/ written at least which should give someone the thought
[06:22] <aquarius> I'd like kazam too :)
[11:39] <aquarius> I think something's broken with the Kit that I have for compiling things for an Ubuntu arm device. How do I destroy it and create a new onw?
[11:42] <aquarius> aha https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/apps/sdk/tutorials/building-cross-architecture-click-applications/ explains it
[12:05] <ogra_> aquarius, for mirscreencast you might want to take a look at the --cap-interval option ... recording with 50fps (which the display uses) will indeed make the device go slow
[12:05] <aquarius> ogra_, hm, that seems useful! thank you
[12:30] <popey> aquarius: thanks for writing up that netcat stuff, I'd been pondering using that method
[12:30] <aquarius> popey, no worries
[12:30] <popey> you can probably get away with ~15 fps for a demo video
[12:30] <popey> unless it's a fast paced game
[12:31] <aquarius> in theory
[12:31] <aquarius> however I've just tried using --cap-interval and something isn't working
[12:31] <aquarius> not sure what I'm doing wrong; video is corrupt
[12:31] <aquarius> I shall keep trying
[12:31] <aquarius> "--cap-interval 4" for 15fps, right?
[12:32] <aquarius> ah
[12:32] <aquarius> the screen is 768 wide, not 720 :P
[12:32] <aquarius> doh.
[12:32] <popey> heh
[12:33] <aquarius> however, even with cap-interval 4 I don't capture a smooth video :(
[12:34] <aquarius> is specifying a smaller size to mirscreencast with -s a good idea? I don't know whether that will make it better (because there's less data) or worse (because it has to resize each frame after capturing it, which is extra work)
[12:34] <popey> dunno
[12:35] <popey> i am just trying with full-res
[12:35] <aquarius> that was probably more an ogra_ question :P
[12:35] <aquarius> the nc stuff works fine for me, which is handy
[12:35] <aquarius> I'm pretty confident that the problems I'm having are just that mirscreencast can't capture frames fast enough
[12:36] <popey> for me its running forever
[12:36] <popey> only with -n 600
[12:36] <popey> will play more later. need to cook
[12:37] <popey> aquarius: how about piping through gzip? ☻
[12:37] <popey> with minimal compression, assuming network is the bottleneck?
[12:39] <aquarius> I don't think that network is the bottleneck
[12:40] <aquarius> that would make things back up in the network buffer, but I don't think that that's what's happening; I think that mirscreencast isn't capturing the frames, not that it's capturing them but having to throw them away because the network's backed up
[12:40] <aquarius> but I'm testing that to find out
[12:40] <aquarius> or, rather, I would be if the phone hadn't locked up solid again, grrr
[12:43] <aquarius> aha!
[12:44] <aquarius> resizing *is* a good idea
[12:44] <aquarius> I get pretty smooth video with mirscreencast -n 60 -m /var/run/mir_socket --stdout --cap-interval 4 -s 384 640 | nc dawn.home 1234
[12:50] <aquarius> and the video I get out the far end is the right length, too
[13:15]  * aquarius updates blog post
[13:41] <ogra_> hmm ... so i have mplayer working on my krillin ... i can stream audio but sadly not video (-vo sdl just causes a reboot after garbling the screen, other -vo options (except null) dont work at all)
[13:41] <ogra_> oh, because it is only built for SDL1.x perhaps ...
[13:42] <gcollura> aquarius, I don't have mencoder, do you know if I can do the same with avconv?
[13:42] <aquarius> gcollura, I'm sure you can, but I don't know how; I stole that mencoder line from willcooke
[13:43] <aquarius> you get to work out how to read raw video with avconv, I'm afraid :)
[13:43] <gcollura> aquarius, ok don't worry :)
[13:47] <ogra_> in case someone is interested http://people.canonical.com/~ogra/ubuntu-touch/mplayer.tgz (just cd to /home/phablet/mplayer after untarring and run "./run-mplayer.sh <url or file>")
[14:12] <gcollura> aquarius, here's the command for avconv
[14:12] <gcollura> avconv -f rawvideo -pix_fmt rgba -s 384x640 -r 6 -i output.raw -c:v h264 result.mp4
[14:12] <gcollura> change -r 6 to the frame rate you need
[14:14] <gcollura> you can even change -i filename to -i udp/tcp://localhost:<port> with some other tweaking I think
[16:14] <pngo> I need help. I added public key to authorized_keys but still can not ssh to the phone. What is wrong?
[16:16] <pngo> I get: Permission denied (publickey).
[17:59] <Adrian47> Hello, I get "Failed to execute /init" in kmesg when trying to boot my port. Any tips how to repair it or finding solution?
[19:21] <pngo_> I'm not sure where report this, but I had problem to ssh to the phone, and I had public keys in authorized_keys. The problem was that /home/phablet is 777 and should be 755 in order for ssh to work.
[19:23] <netlore> I created an additional folder in /home/phablet and it is not visible via MTP.
[19:24] <netlore> Welcome Zach...
[19:24] <popey> pngo_: its not 777 here
[19:24] <ZacharyIgielman> Hi!
[19:25] <pngo_> popey; I just reinstalled ubuntu last night and that's what I had
[19:26] <netlore> pngo: it's 755 here on "stable", but I have not re-installed recently.
[19:28] <pngo_> looks like new image has that bug
[19:28] <netlore> pngo: which channel are you on?
[19:30] <pngo_> netlore: ubuntu-touch/ubuntu-rtm/14.09-proposed
[21:21] <netlore> Did I hear correctly, new stable release tomorrow?
[21:24] <nhaines> Ooh, that would be fun.


[02:23] <lotuspsychje> good morning
[08:58] <lotuspsychje> spacepirate: wich linux areas are you interested in?
[09:01] <lotuspsychje> spacepirate: one of my more fav tutorial websites is https://linuxconfig.org/
[09:01] <lotuspsychje> a lot of usefull info there
[09:01] <spacepirate> Well, I'm interested on the entirety of the Linux kernel itself. I got loads of questions regarding on how device driver works and how they are implemented.
[09:02] <lotuspsychje> spacepirate: on the ubuntu community we got a kernel channel and a devel channel too
[09:04] <lotuspsychje> !alis | spacepirate see also
[09:04] <lotuspsychje> a lot of linux minded channels on this network too
[09:05] <spacepirate> I see, I'll check it out later! Thank you so much for the abundant of info @lotuspsychje! Be seeing you later.
[09:05] <lotuspsychje> spacepirate: your kernel and driver interest have a purpose? are you busy with some project?
[09:07] <spacepirate> Actually my interest on what I mentioned are more of a fun learning expedition than a deadline.
[09:07] <spacepirate> I love learning!
[09:08] <spacepirate> But anyways, thank you for the information I'll look it up later. I got something to do first.
[09:08] <lotuspsychje> ttyl
[10:21] <JanC> spacepirate: https://www.kernel.org/doc/html/latest/driver-api/ has the official driver documentation, but that is *very* low-level   :)
[10:25] <JanC> you also get that installed on your system in '/usr/share/doc/linux-doc/' when you install the kernel documentation ('linux-doc' package)


[11:46] <ktosiek> ok, so I'm starting my first charm - are there any good examples of charms written with Ansible?
[11:48] <ktosiek> and BTW do I have to use bzr?
[12:00] <ktosiek> should charm's service start with the system (especially if it's basicaly stateless), or should it be started in config-changed?
[12:09] <ktosiek> oh, I see it should (at least after "start")
[14:19] <ktosiek> now, an architectural question: I want to make a Sentry charm that actually uses relation (the one in store now is pretty simple). Sentry is a server that aggregates errors from other services - the errors are provided by a dedicated (HTTP-based AFAIK) protocol, assigned to an app, and then grouped etc.
[14:19] <ktosiek> how should I provide the application name for a given relation?
[14:20] <ktosiek> should I make it one of relation's options, and make the consumer set it?
[17:03] <jrwren_> plz consider: https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/966
[17:23] <ktosiek> hmm, what should I do about internal app's secrets that users might or might not care about? Like Django's secret key?
[17:27] <ktosiek> Put them on a peer relation?
[20:19] <ktosiek> I have re-added a service after removing it, and now the machine is stuck in "agent-state: pending". What can I do about it? What should I look at?
[20:23] <ktosiek> hmm, and it looks like destroying that machine outside juju didn't help at all... I'll just redo that environment
[23:08] <lazyPower> ktosiek: Good questions - which service was stuck in agent state pending? As that should only happen during the provisioning of a machine
[23:08] <lazyPower> typically it means the machien never fully came online
[23:08] <lazyPower> ktosiek: looks like you've had a day full of juju
[23:09] <ktosiek> yeah, it looks pretty promising. But it would be much easier with more active people here ;-)
[23:10] <ktosiek> it was a service I'm trying to write, and I didn't know about "resolved" or looking at error in "status" when I was asking about that
[23:11] <ktosiek> turned out to be a combination of low RAM and slow HDD (and watching movies from said HDD)
[23:12] <ktosiek> lazyPower: do you use Juju in production?
[23:12] <lazyPower> ktosiek: i sure do
[23:13] <lazyPower> ktosiek: we're usually active mon-fri from ~ 4am EDT to ~ 8pm EDT
[23:13] <ktosiek> how do you store secrets? I mean things like Django's secret key, or SSL keys
[23:13] <lazyPower> we've got a mix of people from Europe and the US working on the project.
[23:13] <lazyPower> ktosiek: using the RAILS charm as an example, there is an ENVIRONMENT export config option
[23:13] <lazyPower> now, that relies on foreman
[23:14] <lazyPower> not sure how its used in the django charm - i dont have extensive hands on experience with it.
[23:14] <ktosiek> oh, so you have foreman next to juju
[23:14] <lazyPower> negative
[23:14] <lazyPower> foreman the ruby gem, puts the exports in teh upstart job it builds.
[23:14] <lazyPower> thats how heroku does it
[23:14] <lazyPower> which i know i know, so many projects with the name foreman its difficult to keep them straight.
[23:15] <lazyPower> however, you can use whatever config management framework you with with juju - so long as you write the underlying scripts in alignment with juju's event driven system, and they are idempotent.
[23:15] <lazyPower> ktosiek: re-using rails as an example, it wraps chef-solo to do the heavy lifting.
[23:15] <ktosiek> hmm, but how do you provide the secrets to new units?
[23:16] <lazyPower> ktosiek: and you asked about a solid ansible charm example - i suggest taking a look at our ElasticSearch charm - its written 100% in ansible
[23:16] <lazyPower> ktosiek: once you set it on the service, and you juju add-unit 'service' - they are distributed amongst the units.
[23:17] <lazyPower> eg: i set the SECRET_KEY_BASE environment variable for my rails app, and every new unit i spin up in that service cluster, automatically receives that SECRET_KEY_BASE
[23:18] <ktosiek> ok, so you set it in service's configuration. Then it's stored in juju state server?
[23:18] <lazyPower> basically
[23:18] <lazyPower> http://i.imgur.com/9dc2jpr.png  -- also you asked about me using juju in production - there's my prodstack
[23:19] <ktosiek> is there a way to impersonate a unit (to peek at some other unit's secrets)? (state server looks like a pretty lucrative attack target...)
[23:19] <lazyPower> just juju debug-hooks on that unit
[23:19] <lazyPower> then you can inspect the data being sent over the wire with relation-get
[23:19] <lazyPower> or config-get
[23:19] <lazyPower> ktosiek: https://juju.ubuntu.com/docs/authors-hook-debug.html
[23:20] <ktosiek> oh, I mean as another unit (like when someone breaks into one of the world-facing servers)
[23:20] <ktosiek> not as an admin
[23:20] <lazyPower> nope
[23:20] <lazyPower> you have to be within the context of juju to query juju information
[23:21] <ktosiek> cool ^_^
[23:21] <lazyPower> i mean its probably possible - if you work hard enough at it. I dont know what would be involved. thats a question better suited for #juju-dev when the core devs are around
[23:21] <lazyPower> much like trying to interrogate a chef-controlled unit, it can be done remotely but takes an unwholly amount of efffort
[23:22] <ktosiek> and about that screenshot... what are those heartbeat icons?
[23:22] <lazyPower> they signify a subordinate service
[23:22] <lazyPower> subordinates are deployed into an existing service machine - they occupy scope: container - so if its in an lxc container ona  node, it lives in that lxc container
[23:22] <lazyPower> if its on the host, it lives on the host
[23:23] <ktosiek> oh, ok. Haven't played with those yet, but I've read that part of manual
[23:23] <lazyPower> hey so you've read docs all day
[23:23] <lazyPower> how do you feel about our documentation - as you've viewed it today. was it helpful?
[23:23] <ktosiek> well...
[23:23] <lazyPower> honesty points count ;)
[23:25] <ktosiek> first thing - navigation is awful. I have to find current site in the menu before I can go to the next one
[23:25]  * lazyPower nods
[23:25] <lazyPower> good feedback - keep it comin
[23:26] <ktosiek> having next/prev links with titles at the bottom would be great :-)
[23:26] <lazyPower> Did anything leap out at you as overly complex in explanation? or anything you had to re-read to understand?
[23:27] <ktosiek> not really, but I had some expectations about the overall workflow already (I've seen a talk about Juju on pycon pl)
[23:28] <lazyPower> Awesome. Thanks for the feedback ktosiek
[23:29] <ktosiek> but there's a lot of info I either missed or hadn't found yet - like how do I destroy things, what's the difference between {remove,destroy}-* commands, any info on resolved --retry
[23:29] <lazyPower> ah, well - lets break it down
[23:30] <lazyPower> remove-relation simply un-relates services. It doesnt' do anything destructive (unless the charm is implicit about how it hands that removal of relation - which depends on the context of the relationship - most subordinates will remove application binaries on relation-removed)
[23:30] <ktosiek> and I'm still not sure what "Added charm "local:trusty/sentry-7" to the environment." means (I mean, "added"? not "replaced ...-6 with ...-7"?)
[23:30] <lazyPower> destroy-service will remove teh service from teh machine, but the machine will be left in your environment
[23:30] <lazyPower> destroy-machine will terminate the machine at the cloud host (or lxc supervisor)
[23:31] <lazyPower> juju resolved is a YOLO brand of "who cares what happened, just go green" - juju resolved --retry will attempt to re-run the failed hook - and will continue to error if the hook exits with a code greater than 0
[23:32] <lazyPower> when it says added, that just means that it was submit to the state server - as it handles pushing the new blob to the agent(s)
[23:33] <lazyPower> at one point and time we used git to do this delivery, but that was problematic when users would edit something on the machine and basically trip git up, so we went to all or nothing blob delivery
[23:33] <ktosiek> oh, ok
[23:34] <lazyPower> but would it be more useful to you to know that instead of 'added' - if we had an existing charm, to say "updated" "upgraded" or "replaced"?
[23:35] <ktosiek> actually, "submitted for redistribution" would be pretty nice (as it would also tell me something about what really happens :-))
[23:35] <lazyPower> i can see how that would be confusing to other users though since the charm store is the primary delivery mechanism for charms
[23:35] <lazyPower> they might think the just inadvertantly published a charm
[23:36] <ktosiek> hmm, that's a good point too
[23:36] <lazyPower> but its good feedback to have regardless (i'm capturing this input to bring up at the next standup i attend)
[23:36] <lazyPower> I just happened by IRC before I sat down to do some more charming of my own network of services :) I'm off on Monday halleluja
[23:37] <ktosiek> haha
[23:38] <ktosiek> thanks for all the info, I'd like to pick your brain a little more but I've got to go to sleep now (it's already past midnight for me)
[23:38] <lazyPower> i'm usually around, feel free to ping me direct if i'm listed as present.
[23:38] <lazyPower> good to meet you ktosiek
[23:38] <ktosiek> see you tomorrow then ;-)


[12:03] <\sh> Riddell: works for me
[12:03] <Riddell> \sh: running ./kde-hal-device-manager?
[12:03] <\sh> Riddell: no...but trying kpybt
[12:03] <\sh> moment...
[12:03] <Riddell> yeah it compiles
[12:04] <\sh> ah did you use kapplication instead of qapplication?
[12:04] <Riddell> hmm, no I did not
[12:04] <\sh> Riddell: for kde you should
[12:04] <Riddell> right
[12:05] <\sh>     about=KAboutData(prgName,prgName,prgVersion,prgDesc,lic,"© 2005")
[12:05] <\sh>     about.addAuthor(authorname,str(authordesc),authormail)
[12:05] <\sh>     KCmdLineArgs.init(sys.argv,about)
[12:05] <\sh>     app=KApplication()
[12:05] <\sh>     mainWindow=KPyBTMainWindow(mainpath)
[12:05] <\sh>     mainWindow.show()
[12:05] <\sh>     app.setMainWidget(mainWindow)
[12:05] <\sh>     app.exec_loop()
[12:05] <\sh> this is the main fragment in __main__ for the starter :)
[12:05] <Riddell> ah thanks, was hoping I wouldn't have to look that up :)
[12:06] <\sh> Riddell: the variables for kaboutdata are set before :)
[12:07] <\sh> Riddell: and provide a Makefile :)
[12:07] <\sh> because the for building the app it should rebuild all .ui stuff :)
[12:07] <\sh> so you don't have to carry unused .py files with you :)
[12:09] <\sh> Riddell: but I'm glad to see you playing with python and qt/kde stuff :) it's so easy to implement nice apps with those tools :)
[12:09] <Riddell> oh yes, it's lovely
[12:09] <Riddell> the hal person doesn't want it in hal though :(
[12:11] <\sh> why not?
[12:11] <Riddell> doesn't want to have the same code in twice just for two different widget sets, and it's not that useful to end users anyway
[12:14] <allee> ah, an discussion about hal ...
[12:14] <allee> Riddell: any idea how best to debug what media events kfile_media gets?
[12:15] <Riddell> allee: nope, I don't think I even know what kfile_media is
[12:15] <allee> I try to figure out gphoto2 supported camera do not generate a pop up (works fine here with usb storage kameras)
[12:17] <allee> Riddell: I added a service type for ServiceTypes=media/removable_unmounted,media/camera_unmounted
[12:17] <allee> and now digikam download dialog can be started when a usb disk is pluged in
[12:17] <allee> but ServiceTypes=media/gphoto2camera
[12:18] <allee> gives nothing when a gphoto2 supported camera gets pluged in :(
[12:19] <\sh> Riddell: then package the stuff by yourself and bring it into ubuntu :)
[12:19] <\sh> Riddell: the gtk ui is separate from the normal hal package right?
[12:20] <Riddell> it's part of the hal sources
[12:20] <\sh> Riddell: but a separate package?
[12:20] <Riddell> yes, separate binary package
[12:20] <\sh> so you could seed your package for kubuntu
[12:20] <Riddell> certainly could
[12:21] <\sh> (if it's seeded anyways for ubuntu, the gtk ui)
[12:22] <Riddell> it's in main
[12:23] <Riddell> trouble with kde-hal-device-manager is that python-dcop brings in glib and stuff, but we have that in anyway from gstreamer
[12:23] <Verwilst> hm, how do i make xine play .mov again? :p
[12:23] <Riddell> Verwilst: get w32codecs
[12:23] <Verwilst> i have :p
[12:24] <Verwilst> maybe i'll just copy the binaries from the player site
[12:24] <Verwilst> mplayer*
[12:25] <\sh> Riddell: are you sure you need python-dcop?
[12:25] <\sh> Riddell: have a look here: http://mats.imk.fraunhofer.de/pipermail/pykde/2005-May/010265.html
[12:26] <\sh> Riddell: pykde brings his own dcop implementation as far as I know
[12:26] <teprrr> but wasn't that hal-device-manager qt-only?
[12:27] <\sh> teprrr: because riddell missed kdepyuic :)
[12:28] <teprrr> \sh, ahh. okay :)
[12:30] <\sh> Riddell: btw...dapper gets now a new python-kde3 package where I fixed some dependencies for python-kde3-dev
[12:32] <Riddell> \sh: just saw that coming by on dapper-changes
[12:34] <teprrr>   xmkmf: Depends: imake but it is not going to be installed
[12:34] <teprrr>   xutils: Depends: imake but it is not going to be installed
[12:34] <teprrr> still no luck with these?
[12:34] <Tm_T> teprrr <3
[12:35] <Tm_T> whooops
[12:35] <teprrr> btw, akregator has gotten an update but I see nothing new on gmane.linux.ubuntu.devel.changes.dapper feed.. why's that?
[12:35] <teprrr> Tm_T ;)
[12:36] <\sh> aren't we using the akregator from kdenetwork?
[12:36] <teprrr> akregator is in kdepim :)
[12:36] <teprrr> but hmm, so if something new happens on metapackage kdepim, all the packages get "updated"?
[12:36] <\sh> well...kdepim then
[12:36] <\sh> no
[12:37] <\sh> only if something is changing in kdepim source package :) then yes :)
[12:37] <Tm_T> /var/lib/dpkg/info/texinfo.postinst: line 56: update_ls_files: command not found
[12:37] <Tm_T> install problem
[12:37] <\sh> Tm_T: it's fixed in 4.8-3
[12:38] <Tm_T> \sh: Setting up texinfo (4.8-3)
[12:38] <\sh> uh..then 4.8-4
[12:38] <Tm_T> :p
[12:38] <\sh> which is not there in debian ;)
[12:38] <Tm_T> and that comes...
[12:38] <\sh> hmm...but why I was installing it today without any problems?
[12:38] <\sh> I just tested it
[12:38] <Tm_T> heh
[12:39] <Tm_T> well, I'll wait
[12:39] <\sh> I only saw the bugreport and debians maintainer talking about a fix...4.8-4 but 4.8-3 was the last one in the debian archives and nothing in incoming
[12:39] <teprrr> \sh, well. um, afaik kdepim isn't anything but metapackage on ubuntu, and it's a module name in kde..
[12:40] <\sh> Files:
[12:40] <\sh>  f3e627eadadedcbb43dc5c5a0fed7bfd 1579 kdepim_3.5.0-0ubuntu3.dsc
[12:40] <\sh>  3e1d7613173f369c69ec95ac116738c4 16251713 kdepim_3.5.0.orig.tar.gz
[12:40] <\sh>  cffe015c6c646bf5bd274f3ac97d66ca 154938 kdepim_3.5.0-0ubuntu3.diff.gz
[12:40] <\sh> no it's a source package name :)
[12:40] <teprrr> hmm.. :p
[12:40] <teprrr> where can I get that?
[12:40] <\sh> kdepim the meta package is in universe (breezy that is) and is a real meta package :)
[12:41] <\sh> teprrr: hmm? running breezy or dapper?
[12:41] <teprrr> \sh, dapper
[12:41] <\sh> teprrr: the source you will get if you vi /etc/apt/sources.list and add a deb-src line the same way as the normal deb line
[12:41] <\sh> then apt-get update
[12:42] <\sh> and apt-get source <package name> e.g. apt-get source akregator will download kdepim_3.5.0-0ubuntu3*
[12:43] <teprrr> well, mmh. yes I know that way.. but umm
[12:43] <teprrr> well, umh, mmh
[12:43] <teprrr> gonna watch shield first :)
[12:43] <\sh> to get the source of the kdepim meta package
[12:43] <\sh> is as well in the kdepim source package :)
[12:43] <\sh> check the debian/control
[12:45] <teprrr> yup, gonna check it
[12:51] <teprrr> mhm, source didn't went into /usr/src.. :o
[12:52] <\sh> no it's going directly there where you start the apt-get source command
[12:52] <\sh> there is a .dsc
[12:52] <\sh> a .diff.gz
[12:52] <\sh> a .orig.tar.gz
[12:52] <\sh> and a directory with the source named like kdepim-3.5.0
[12:52] <\sh> it's not like redhat where it goes into /usr/src/redhat/SRPMS/
[12:52] <\sh> or something like this
[12:54] <teprrr> ah, yes, I recalled it falsely
[12:57] <teprrr> umh, why on earth the whole kdepim is packaged into one package?!
[12:57] <\sh> no..
[12:58] <\sh> the binaries are splitted into several packages as you can see in debian/control
[12:58] <\sh> the source but is one big fat file..ask KDE.org why it is like this :)
[12:58] <teprrr> yeah, got it now.. so it's the original source file
[12:59] <\sh> the problem right now is, that e.g. amarok or kopete have as well separate single point releases which are not in the release files of the kde dist
[12:59] <\sh> teprrr: yes
[12:59] <teprrr> mmh, afaik kopete is in kde
[12:59] <teprrr> amarok is in extragear, so it's not included in distribution at all
[01:00] <\sh> right...I meant akregator :)
[01:00] <Riddell> akregator only historyic
[01:00] <Riddell> akregator only historyically I think
[01:00] <Riddell> before it went into KDE
[01:00] <Riddell> kopete did have a separate release to fix a problem with MSN chaning their protocol, we just patched it
[01:00] <teprrr> yup, akregator was before 3.4 outside too
[01:01] <teprrr> yup, thats the case
[01:19] <teprrr> mmh, where has ssh-askpass disappeared?
[01:30] <\sh>  /usr/lib/ssh/x11-ssh-askpass
[01:30] <\sh> is in ssh-askpass package
[01:30] <\sh> or ssh-askpass-gnome or ssh-askpass-fullscreen
[01:37] <Riddell> hello poningru
[01:38] <poningru> Hi
[01:38] <poningru> woah
[01:39] <poningru> Riddell saying hi to me?
[01:40] <Riddell> unless there's another poningru around here :)
[01:40] <Riddell> poningru: going to join our rocking team of KDE MOTU?
[01:41] <poningru> hehe I would love to
[01:41] <poningru> if only I had the time
[01:41] <poningru> actually if you had some mule work for me to do I would love to do it
[01:42] <poningru> see if someone wanted something tested etc.
[01:42] <poningru> wait is there a different kde-motu team than the ubuntu motu team?
[01:42] <poningru> err kubuntu motu team
[01:43] <Riddell> KDE MOTU is one of the teams that makes up the MOTU
[01:43] <Riddell> there is also GNOME MOTU and various other affiliations
[01:43] <poningru> ah gotcha
[01:43] <Riddell> we're all the same MOTU though
[01:43] <poningru> right
[01:45] <\sh> there is always some time to spend on k-ubuntu :)
[01:45] <Riddell> mule work.. want to fill in my tax return form? :)
[01:45] <amu> \sh: yes :)
[01:45] <\sh> shock
[01:45] <sealne> Riddell: you mean you have money? :)
[01:45] <\sh> AMU !
[01:46] <\sh> amu: back from holidays?
[01:46] <amu> btw. the airport extreme runs under linux
[01:46] <poningru> heck I will probably do it
[01:46] <Riddell> sealne: only until Her Maj's Customs and Excise take it off me
[01:46] <poningru> Riddell: is it anything bigger than a 1040ez?
[01:46] <sealne> altho i suppose IRS don't care
[01:46] <amu> \sh: yep
[01:46] <Riddell> poningru: hmm?  what's one of those?
[01:46] <poningru> I thought you were in the US
[01:46] <Riddell> no, Scotland
[01:47] <\sh> amu: short trip :)
[01:47] <\sh> hmmm..just updating remotely my amd64 to dapper...and hope the kernel is not breaking my machine
[01:47] <poningru> could have sworn you wrote something about hawaii or something
[01:47] <poningru> must have been someone else then
[01:47] <\sh> Riddell is everywhere
[01:47] <Riddell> poningru: the conference in hawii is using kubuntu, but I'm not going
[01:48] <poningru> ah
[01:48] <crimsun> \sh: I've considered that, but my pbuilder is on the opposite coast of the US, so I'm "playing it safe."
[01:48] <\sh> crimsun: hehe :)
[01:49] <Riddell> poningru: if you want to download and test a daily live or install CD that's always welcome
[01:49] <sealne> Riddell: any news on a vote? i'd kinda like to know wether i'm having a holiday this summer or not :)
[01:49] <poningru> well ofcourse I do that
[01:49] <Riddell> sealne: no news at all I'm afraid, I'm a bit annoyed that one hasn't started, I asked why and got no response
[01:50] <poningru> flight 2, two partitions: kubuntu, ubuntu
[01:50] <poningru> 2 gigs each
[01:50] <Riddell> poningru: daily build, not flight 2 that's old stuff now
[01:50] <poningru> hmm
[01:50] <poningru> how does one do that?
[01:50] <poningru> linky?
[01:50] <sealne> Riddell: thats a bit shit, delaying for a reason can be justified but...
[01:50] <Riddell> poningru: grab it from cdimage.ubuntu.com/kubuntu
[01:51] <poningru> awesome
[01:51] <sealne> and its not like we are the only ones in this situation
[01:51] <crimsun> I see janimo has already uploaded a newer ivman. Cool.
[01:51] <poningru> how fast are those updated?
[01:51] <Riddell> poningru: every day at about 05:00UTC
[01:52] <poningru> nice
[01:52] <poningru> will do
[01:52] <poningru> you know what then, maybe I should go do that right now
[01:52] <Riddell> poningru: usually they get tested just before we make a flight release but it's a lot better to have people testing them between flight releases so we know it's broken before we want to make a flight CD
[01:52] <poningru> hmm true
[01:53] <poningru> is there a changelog somewhere?
[01:53] <poningru> to know what to test etc.
[01:53] <Riddell> poningru: dapper-changes mailing list :)
[01:53] <poningru> hehe cool
[01:54] <sealne> ooh didn't even know they existed
[01:56] <\sh> KlistviewSearchLine?
[01:57] <\sh> is it 3.5? or as well in 3.4.x?
[01:57] <\sh> because pykde supports still only 3.4.x api
[01:57] <sealne> apparently neither does korundum
[01:57] <poningru> whats katch?
[01:57] <sealne> just something i'm working on
[01:58] <sealne> forensic analysis
[01:58] <Riddell> ah, got it working with a quick addListView()
[01:58] <Riddell> and voila, a searchable list view.  nice
[02:01] <poningru> when does expresso land?
[02:02] <Riddell> bah, kdepyuic doesn't work with KListViewSearchLineWidget
[02:03] <Riddell> passes the wrong arguments to the contructor
[02:03] <\sh> Riddell: then there is something wrong with the sip stu
[02:03] <\sh> ff
[02:04] <Riddell> \sh: any idea where I report that as a bug?
[02:05] <Riddell> poningru: about a week before release probably :)
[02:05] <poningru> hehe
[02:05] <\sh> Riddell: yes
[02:06] <\sh> Riddell: riverbanks computing..
[02:06] <\sh> Riddell: http://mats.imk.fraunhofer.de/mailman/listinfo/pykde
[02:06] <\sh> on this list
[02:06] <\sh> I don't know if they have a bts for this
[02:07] <poningru> is livecd testing necessary?
[02:08] <poningru> well that important I mean
[02:08] <crimsun> I'd say so, yes.
[02:08] <Riddell> NameError: global name 'KIconButton' is not defined
[02:08] <Riddell> waa
[02:09] <Riddell> poningru: of course, we need the live CD to work as well as the install one
[02:09] <\sh> KIconButton ?
[02:10] <\sh> I don't find any kiconbutton in the kdeui class list ,()
[02:10] <Riddell> why is KIconButton in kio/kfile?
[02:10] <Riddell> that's crazy
[02:10] <\sh> what?
[02:10] <Riddell> http://developer.kde.org/documentation/library/cvs-api/kdelibs-apidocs/kio/kfile/html/classKIconButton.html
[02:11] <\sh> no
[02:11] <\sh> it's a joke, right?
[02:11] <\sh> A pushbutton for choosing an icon. A push button that allows selection of an icon.
[02:11] <\sh>  Pressing on the button will open a KIconDialog for the user to select an icon. The current icon will be displayed on the button.
[02:11] <\sh> lol
[02:11] <\sh> well...
[02:12] <\sh> actually it should belong in kdeui
[02:12] <\sh> or it should be a private class only for kicondialog
[02:13] <\sh> Unpacking replacement kmail ...
[02:13] <\sh> Errors were encountered while processing:
[02:13] <\sh>  /var/cache/apt/archives/krita_1%3a1.4.2-3ubuntu6_amd64.deb
[02:13] <\sh> E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)
[02:13] <\sh> ah now it goes...after apt-get -f install
[02:26] <Riddell> now I'm stuck on how to use KIconLoader's SmallIconSet() from pykde
[02:26] <Riddell> it's not a member function
[02:33] <\sh> what about QPixmap KIconLoader::SmallIconSet()
[02:33] <\sh> or SmallIconSet
[02:34] <\sh> SmallIconset() only I think...it doesn't belong to the namespace it looks like
[03:17] <sebas> Riddell: http://mats.imk.fraunhofer.de/pipermail/pykde/2005-April/010092.html
[04:27] <Riddell> Mez: up late?
[04:27] <Mez> yeah - for once - lol - I'm actually up late instead of just going to bed
[04:28] <Mez> I'm in the transitional phase of going from nights to days
[04:28] <Mez> lol - but then gotta go back to nights again for tuesday
[04:28] <Mez> lol
[04:28] <Mez> so I dont know why i do it
[04:28] <Riddell> working nightshift or something?
[04:32] <Mez> I work a permanent night shift
[04:32] <Mez> just got three days off :D lol
[04:32] <Mez> so I'm still trying to get back to being up in the day
[04:32] <Mez> lol
[04:32] <Mez> I still havent seen daylight for about 3 montsh
[04:43] <poningru> yikes
[05:47] <Riddell> anyone awake to try http://kubuntu.org/~jr/kde-hal-device-manager/kde-hal-device-manager_0.3-0ubuntu1_i386.deb ?
[05:50] <Mez> Riddell, downloading
[05:50] <Mez> 04:50:51 ERROR 404: Not Found.
[05:52] <Riddell> try now
[05:56] <Mez> where should it show ?
[05:57] <Riddell> kmenu->system
[05:57] <Mez> apparently I dont have hal installed
[05:57] <Riddell> install it?
[05:58] <Mez>  hal: Depends: dbus (>= 0.60) but it is not going to be installed
[05:58] <Mez>   dbus: Conflicts: libdbus-1-1 but 0.36.2-0ubuntu7 is to be installed
[05:59] <Mez> no wonder this thing has been cruddy
[06:07] <Riddell> hello LaserJock
[06:11] <LaserJock> Hi Riddell
[06:11] <LaserJock> would you happen to be available for a REVU review?
[06:12] <Riddell> LaserJock: it's 5 in the morning!
[06:12] <Riddell> (maybe)
[06:13] <LaserJock> oh, well nevermind then
[06:13] <LaserJock> I can ask somebody else
[06:14] <Riddell> what is it?
[06:14] <LaserJock> plotdrop
[06:14] <LaserJock> it was already advocated 2 times but ajmitch wanted me to change something real quick
[06:15] <LaserJock> I only need one more vote and an upload ;-)
[06:15] <LaserJock> it is a pretty small package
[06:15] <Riddell> LaserJock: did you make the change ajmitch wanted?
[06:16] <LaserJock> maybe if I called it kplotdrop it would have reviewed faster ;-)
[06:16] <LaserJock> Riddell: yes I did
[06:16] <LaserJock> I checked with him and he seemed satisfied
[06:16] <LaserJock> but he didn't have time to do a proper review himself I guess
[06:18] <freeflying> Riddell: hi
[06:18] <Riddell> hi freeflying
[06:18] <Riddell> freeflying: still working on qt I'm afraid, will do first thing tomorrow
[06:19] <freeflying> Riddell:  :)
[06:19] <LaserJock> sure seems like there is a big movement within the Ubuntu community toward Kubuntu
[06:21] <LaserJock> I was looking at the Distrowatch stats the other day and Kubuntu was #11 and it has more hits per day than Ubuntu did last year
[06:22] <Riddell> how does that work?
[06:23] <LaserJock> I guess that is a comparison of 2004 to 2005 but I think the #11 ranking is pretty impressive
[06:23] <LaserJock> I was looking at http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20060102#phr
[06:24] <Riddell> LaserJock: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1344  some issues, you can fix them or I'm happy to upload if you don't want to
[06:27] <Riddell> but I'm going to bed now so make your mind up soon
[06:28] <LaserJock> well, the libglade warning is an upstream thing that I'm not going to fix as it is a known issue
[06:28] <LaserJock> it doesn't really effect anything so I'm not worrying about it
[06:28] <Riddell> fair enough
[06:29] <LaserJock> I would like to get it uploaded if possible, I can change the debhelper with the next release if that is ok with you
[06:32] <Riddell> yep, I'll upload
[06:38] <LaserJock> Riddell: thank you so much, I have been trying to get reviewers for around a month now.
[06:39] <crimsun> I'm still waiting for a way to actually set a password in revu, heh.
[06:40] <crimsun> if this keeps up, I'll just manually add a subkey component and reupload my key to a keyserver, because this is getting annoying.
[06:44] <Riddell> plotdrop_0.5-0ubuntu1_source.changes is NEW
[06:46] <LaserJock> Riddell: got the email. thanks agian
[06:47] <Mez> night Ridell
[06:47] <Mez> crimsun - whats up with your key /
[06:48] <Mez> something to do with REVU?
[06:48] <crimsun> Mez: it's sign-only, so both LP and REVU (which require one to be able to encipher/decipher text) fail
[06:49] <Mez> ah - why do you have a sign-only key ?
[06:49] <crimsun> the needed portion was revoked.
[06:49] <crimsun> I'm just going to add another subcomponent and resync to wwwkeys.eu.pgp.net
[12:26] <mornfall> anyone has read the (new) adept spec?
[12:26] <mornfall> comments?
[12:27] <jpatrick> where?
[01:00] <mornfall> wiki.ubuntu.com/KubuntuDapperPackageManager
[01:24] <apokryphos> looks very cool; the individual deb handling a very good idea IMO
[01:25] <apokryphos> they're hoping to eventually replace synaptic with gnome-app-install -- is that going to be (if a somewhat fareoff) ideal of adept too?
[01:38] <apokryphos> (personally it's really good to see such close connection to the advances in apt and apt-related things; sounds promising)
[03:06] <Riddell> mornfall: reading
[03:12] <Riddell> mornfall: "The expanded package info shall have the states colored in the same way the list has."
[03:12] <Riddell> have I seen the list being coloured?  or is it just the states text in the list?
[03:14] <Riddell> "By default the terminal that is used during commit will be hidden and a progressbar will be shown. A button will be present to show the terminal."  too many shows
[03:14] <Tm_T> show the terminal by default please :)
[03:15] <jpatrick> hey Tm_T
[03:15] <Tm_T> hullo
[03:16] <Tm_T> +l
[03:16] <Riddell> mornfall: "Eventually, the detailed package view" I don't think this is about evenually it's about what will go in adept 2
[03:16] <Tm_T> that means, trying to use, but it does not =)
[03:16] <Tm_T> doesn't work
[03:18] <Riddell> mornfall: "Otherwise, we rely on the apt cronjob to pull updates."  which apt crontjob?
[03:20] <mornfall> Riddell: /etc/cron.daily/apt ?
[03:20] <Riddell> mornfall: "the presented package list will reflect ubuntu menu structure", I'm changing that to Kubuntu since if it uses kde-applications.menu they'll show the the KDE manor
[03:21] <mornfall> morn@lor-k-breezy/k3:~ -> apt-config shell x APT::Periodic::Update-Package-Lists
[03:21] <mornfall> x='1'
[03:21] <Riddell> mornfall: ok, I get it
[03:21] <mornfall> breezy has a cronjob that runs apt-get update :)
[03:22] <mornfall> and it's enabled by default... so i guess it'd be non-nice to do that on our own again
[03:22] <mornfall> Riddell: as for eventually, that depends on how we decide on the UI
[03:23] <mornfall> Riddell: the things that are not decided are, well, not decided
[03:25] <mornfall> as for stylistic changes, feel free to correct them
[03:26] <mornfall> s/changes/problems/
[03:28] <Riddell> 14:12 < Riddell> mornfall: "The expanded package info shall have the states colored in the same way the list has."
[03:28] <Riddell> 14:12 < Riddell> have I seen the list being coloured?  or is it just the states text in the list?
[03:28] <mornfall> Riddell: package states and actions are coloured
[03:28] <Riddell> the text of them?
[03:29] <mornfall> what else :)
[03:29] <mornfall> yes the text
[03:29] <Riddell> well I was imagining large blocks of background colour for some reason, I'll edit to clarify
[03:31] <jpatrick> hey JRe, freeflying_
[03:31] <JRe> hi jpatrick
[03:31] <freeflying_> jpatrick: hi
[03:31] <Riddell> mornfall: looks good, I think it might need some rought mockups of the new user interfaces
[03:32] <freeflying_> Riddell: today's ppc livecd can not login
[03:32] <Riddell> mornfall: just of the quality like these is fine https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuExpress/GnomeUserInterface
[03:32] <Riddell> freeflying_: hmm, what stage does it get to?
[03:33] <freeflying_> Riddell: kdm
[03:33] <mornfall> Riddell: make snapshots of the alpha :p
[03:35] <Riddell> freeflying_: but then it just can't log in at all?  or does it start to log in then break?
[03:36] <Riddell> mornfall: yep, that's fine too
[03:36] <Riddell> but it doesn't have .deb installer yet etc
[03:36] <freeflying_> Riddell: it can't login
[03:36] <freeflying_> Riddell: stop at kdm
[03:36] <Riddell> freeflying_: actually the live CD shouldn't bring up KDM it should just automatically login.  so something strange there, I'll look into it thanks
[03:37] <freeflying_> Riddell: because it can not automatical login , so it give a kdm login face
[03:38] <mornfall> Riddell: if someone does the sketches why not, i just don't have time to fool around, since it's generally just little more work to implement it
[03:40] <freeflying_> Riddell: you still owe me th qt ,  :)
[03:48] <Riddell> freeflying_: working on it
[03:48] <Riddell> mornfall: ok
[04:09] <Tonio_> hi all
[04:09] <Tonio_> Riddell: ping
[04:09] <Riddell> hi Tonio_
[04:10] <Tonio_> fine ?
[04:11] <Riddell> I think I am
[04:11] <Tonio_> I just made several tests with the profiles and I cannot find a better solution than 2 bars
[04:11] <Tonio_> so what do you decide ?
[04:11] <Tonio_> One bar and no kpart fonctions, or 2 bars like http://www.planetemu.net/temp/capture4.png
[04:12] <Tonio_> Riddell: also, what about adding to akregator kubuntu feeds by default, like for konversation with the chan ?
[04:13] <Riddell> Tonio_: 2 bars like that is ugly as anything, it'll just have to stay as one bar and no kpart fonctions
[04:13] <Riddell> akregator should have kubuntu feeds as default, unless that's been lost somewhere
[04:14] <Tonio_> okay, I wasn't sure, because I personaly changed the profiles
[04:14] <Riddell> yep, akregator does, you just need to start with a fresh akregatorrc
[04:14] <Tonio_> okay, so let's remove the "window" menu
[04:15] <Tonio_> and plce some of it's options in the view one, and I'll show you the result
[04:15] <Riddell> yeah
[04:16] <Tonio_> http://www.planetemu.net/temp/capture5.png
[04:16] <Tonio_> and what about that ?
[04:16] <apokryphos> having the extra kpart with icons+text looks interesting; been using a similar thing for a few weeks now
[04:16] <Tonio_> is that ugly to you ?
[04:16] <Tonio_> that better to my view, although it ressembles to the kde default
[04:16] <Tonio_> but with extra things missing
[04:16] <Tonio_> apokryphos: ok ;)
[04:16] <Riddell> Tonio_: yes, it's just the kde default, too many toolbar buttons by far
[04:17] <apokryphos> too much space
[04:17] <Tonio_> hum
[04:18] <Tonio_> you decide, even if I personally disagree ;)
[04:19] <Tonio_> simplifying by removing fonctionnalities is a point of view I don't share...
[04:20] <Tonio_> let's go with this
[04:20] <raphink> agreed
[04:20] <raphink> kde is great because it has a lot of functionality
[04:20] <raphink> s/functionality/functionalities/
[04:21] <raphink> for example, the splitting windows thingy
[04:21] <Tonio_> it will just act like the Windows Explorer actually...
[04:21] <Tonio_> not more.....
[04:21] <raphink> before you told me it could be accessed by right clicking the status bar, I just couldn't use it anymore Riddell
[04:21] <raphink> I couldn't guess it was there
[04:22] <raphink> yet it's such a useful feature
[04:22] <Riddell> no, that's why the splitting stuff should go back either in the Window menu or a sub-menu of View
[04:22] <Tonio_> that's the goal, reorganising the menus raphink
[04:22] <Tonio_> that will be changed, I changed many things on that point
[04:22] <raphink> ok
[04:22] <raphink> well I'd be happy as long as I can find all the options in logical places
[04:22] <Tonio_> the problem is just on the kpart integration to menus
[04:23] <raphink> and not have to right click on a weird place to access them
[04:23] <Tonio_> for example the zoom functions while browsing the web, or images functions etc....
[04:23] <raphink> mhm
[04:23] <Tonio_> ht issue is that I can't tell konq to display those buttons only while the khtmlpart isn't in use.....
[04:24] <Tonio_> so we're gettings 4 additionnal buttons while browsing the web : http://www.planetemu.net/temp/capture5.png
[04:24] <Tonio_> and I can't find a good compromisse....
[04:24] <Tonio_> s/compromisse/compromise
[04:25] <Tonio_> I just ask many users and the great majority was prefering capture5.png, but anyway, I don't decide ;)
[04:26] <Tonio_> everyone is fine with Nero on windows, which has about twice as many buttons....
[04:27] <Riddell> ug, I find nero unusable
[04:27] <Tonio_> same for winamp, amarok, is WAY more complicated that this....
[04:27] <Riddell> I also find amarok unusable :)
[04:27] <Tonio_> Riddell: about 80% windows users seems to be fine with it....
[04:28] <Tonio_> same with photoshop elements.... lots of non experts are using it quite easilly....
[04:28] <raphink> right
[04:28] <raphink> windows users are used to having lots of buttons
[04:28] <Tonio_> that's why kde is used by much more newbies that gnome
[04:28] <Tonio_> although gnome is way more simplified
[04:28] <raphink> and windows users are the main target for (k)ubuntu
[04:29] <freeflying_> Riddell:  no program will perform better than amarok
[04:29] <jpatrick> Tonio_: that's the bad thing
[04:30] <jpatrick> it goes overboard
[04:30] <Tonio_> jpatrick: you meen ?
[04:30] <Tonio_> jpatrick: I don't talk about not simplying it
[04:30] <Tonio_> I agree it has to
[04:30] <raphink> kde is full of options, what's the point of having it look like gnome when you could use all the options it has in a click?
[04:30] <Tonio_> jpatrick: but not by removing one of it's major feature
[04:31] <Tonio_> the kpart integration to menus, that make konq that modular and that powerfull
[04:31] <raphink> yes
[04:31] <Tonio_> actually, just open a pdf file on the web.... 80% will be unreadable if tou can't zoom
[04:31] <Tonio_> windows + IE has no problem
[04:31] <raphink> mhm
[04:32] <Tonio_> that what a windows user will say, and he will be right....
[04:32] <raphink> well zooming with kpdf embbed in konq is terrible right now
[04:32] <raphink> that might be why easykubuntu proposes to install acroread iirc
[04:32] <raphink> and people use acroread embbed in firefox
[04:32] <Tonio_> exactly...
[04:33] <raphink> so they have the buttons to zoom, etc.
[04:33] <raphink> although it would be possible to get exactly the same features with konq+kpdf
[04:33] <Tonio_> same thing if you open a tgz....
[04:33] <raphink> if dealing properly with the buttons
[04:33] <raphink> yes
[04:33] <Tonio_> you have to perform a right click, openwith....
[04:33] <raphink> you should access the ark buttons
[04:33] <raphink> Tonio_: well you can go to the file menu, too
[04:33] <raphink> and choose open with
[04:34] <Tonio_> that's what I said....
[04:34] <raphink> but I agree the ark buttons should just be available in konq when viweing archies
[04:34] <Tonio_> but that's not convenient....
[04:34] <Tonio_> same for images with the gwenview component....
[04:34] <raphink> yes
[04:34] <raphink> I hate gwenview as it is right now
[04:34] <raphink> because you can do nothing with the images almost
[04:35] <raphink> you just view images one by one
[04:35] <Riddell> hello Huahua
[04:35] <raphink> we have softs to have it like windows does it : performing a slide show within konq
[04:35] <Huahua> hello Riddell
[04:35] <freeflying_> Huahua: hi
[04:35] <raphink> hi Huahua
[04:35] <Huahua> hi raphink
[04:36] <Tonio_> hi Huahua
[04:36] <Riddell> morning Sime
[04:36] <Huahua> hi Tonio
[04:36] <freeflying_> Riddell:  can we translate system setting into chinese now in launchpad
[04:36] <Sime> morning(?)
[04:36] <Sime> Hi
[04:37] <Riddell> freeflying_: not yet, but you will be able to when dapper translation files get loaded into launchpad at string freeze time
[04:38] <Sime> Riddell: http://www.simonzone.com/software/pykdeextensions/en/using-qtdesigner.html
[04:38] <Sime> Riddell: PyKDE extensions should work with Qt designer and KDE widgets
[04:39] <freeflying_> Riddell: then how long will it be
[04:40] <raphink> Riddell: isn't it because most users want as many buttons as possible ?
[04:40] <Tonio_> raphink: +1
[04:40] <raphink> Riddell: from my experience teaching computers to newbies (my mom for ex), most users are afraid of menus
[04:40] <raphink> they're afraid of anything that has too much text
[04:40] <Tonio_> maybe not, but they prefer functionnalities than extreme simplification
[04:40] <raphink> they much prefer having buttons they can recognize
[04:41] <raphink> than lists of text
[04:41] <Riddell> freeflying_: http://wiki.kubuntu.org/DapperReleaseSchedule  march 16th
[04:41] <raphink> hmm fine
[04:42] <raphink> Riddell: I totally understand that you created this distro and it's normal that you want to decide about this kind of things
[04:42] <Riddell> Sime: that /is/ interesting.  didn't know you could do it like that.
[04:42] <raphink> but I'll point out that this gets many users to use firefox and its options withing kubuntu
[04:42] <raphink> which imo is not the way it could be
[04:43] <Riddell> raphink: firefox has less buttons than simplified konqueror
[04:43] <raphink> and for such a distro as kubuntu which is aimed most users
[04:43] <raphink> Riddell: when you view a pdf in firefox with acroread, you can at least zoom with the buttons
[04:43] <raphink> we're mostly talking about kparts buttons here
[04:43] <Tonio_> Riddell: but everyone is adding 10 extensions......
[04:43] <raphink> not the browsing view, which is fine
[04:43] <raphink> Riddell: most firefox users don't use firefox as such
[04:43] <Tonio_> very few people are using it at it's default state
[04:44] <raphink> they add bars and so on
[04:44] <raphink> to add buttons to id
[04:44] <Tonio_> extensions are what have done konq that popular
[04:44] <raphink> it
[04:44] <raphink> firefox without extensions is pointless
[04:44] <raphink> I'd be interested to know the result of a poll in the whole kde community
[04:44] <Tonio_> Riddell: and anyway, konq isn't just a browser....
[04:44] <raphink> and ask windows users who don't know kde, too
[04:45] <Tonio_> the problem is more while managing files that browsing....
[04:45] <raphink> if konq was just a browser, I wouldn't use it probably
[04:45] <raphink> I use it because it can read most files
[04:45] <raphink> because I can view pdf in it, open archives, etc.
[04:45] <Tonio_> 'night freeflying_
[04:46] <raphink> but if I miss functionalities doing so, then it lacks something
[04:46] <Riddell> freeflying_: qt compiling now, will be done when you wake up
[04:46] <raphink> "night freeflying_
[04:46] <Riddell> raphink: it is pretty easy to change back to the kde default konqueror layout
[04:46] <raphink> Riddell: it's pretty easy for someone who knows how to use a console
[04:46] <raphink> it's not the case of most newbies
[04:47] <raphink> who would like to be able to zoom while viewing pdfs
[04:47] <Tonio_> Riddell: hum.... I don't like the default, too much functions ;)
[04:47] <Tonio_> compromise is more interesting
[04:47] <Riddell> Tonio_: hah!
[04:47] <raphink> it's easy to do most things in Linux
[04:47] <raphink> if a program is missing
[04:47] <raphink> heh it's easy to compile it
[04:47] <raphink> even easy to package it
[04:47] <raphink> but not for all users ;)
[04:47] <Tonio_> Riddell: I agree it has to be simplied
[04:47] <Tonio_> that's why I'm working on that
[04:48] <Tonio_> but to me, not by removing one of it's top 5 functions
[04:48] <Tonio_> something unique that make it good
[04:48] <Tonio_> simplying menus, removing additionnal features, I agree, but not the kparts.....
[04:48] <Riddell> can we not just alter the kpdf and ark parts to have a new toolbar with their stuff?
[04:49] <Tonio_> Riddell: not to what I know
[04:49] <Tonio_> konq is merging the toolbars depending the context
[04:49] <Tonio_> and it always places this in the main toolbar
[04:49] <raphink> doesn't seem so
[04:49] <Tonio_> no other choice
[04:50] <raphink> yes
[04:50] <Tonio_> also, I didn't find a way to tell him "ignore the khtmlpart, and don't ignore other ones
[04:50] <raphink> you'd have to hack konqueror to get it generate new toolbars for kparts
[04:50] <raphink> and I don't think Tonio_ really wants to do this ;)
[04:50] <Tonio_> raphink: can't do.... I'm not a coder lol
[04:50] <raphink> hehe
[04:50] <raphink> Tonio_: oh really? why this is easy ;)
[04:51] <raphink> users can code it themselves if they want it :)
[04:51] <Tonio_> ;)
[04:51] <Riddell> --- /usr/share/apps/kpdfpart/part.rc~   2005-09-10 09:18:43.000000000 +0100
[04:51] <Riddell> +++ /usr/share/apps/kpdfpart/part.rc    2006-01-08 15:50:50.000000000 +0000
[04:51] <Riddell> -<ToolBar name="mainToolBar"><text>Main Toolbar</text>
[04:51] <Riddell> +<ToolBar name="newmainToolBar"><text>New Main Toolbar</text>
[04:51] <Riddell> voila
[04:51] <Tonio_> hum
[04:51] <Tonio_> interesting
[04:52] <Tonio_> but we'ill have an empty bar then ?
[04:52] <raphink> won't be translated though
[04:52] <Tonio_> when nothing is loaded
[04:52] <Tonio_> it'll look like this :
[04:53] <Riddell> Tonio_: no, that new toolbar only gets loaded when a PDF is opened
[04:53] <Riddell> seems to be working for me
[04:53] <Tonio_> hum interesting
[04:53] <Tonio_> same thing to be done with gwenview kpart, no ?
[04:54] <Tonio_> and ark one also
[04:54] <Riddell> yes
[04:54] <Tonio_> gonna test ;)
[04:55] <Tonio_> how would you suggest to install the part.rc stull ?
[04:55] <Tonio_> kubuntu-default-settings ?
[04:56] <Riddell> I think it'll have to be a patch to the original
[04:56] <Riddell> dunno, try putting it in /usr/share/kubuntu-def...
[04:56] <Tonio_> okay, that's a good compromise ;)
[04:57] <Riddell> yay :)
[04:57] <Tonio_> Riddell: did you add that toolbar as "newline" to konq-kubuntu.rc ?
[04:58] <Riddell> Tonio_: I didn't touch konq-kubuntu.rc
[04:58] <Tonio_> hu ? strange.....
[04:59] <Tonio_> it is certainly because you have the "merge" activated on the hidden maintoolbar....
[05:00] <Riddell> what is?
[05:01] <Tonio_> the "merge" option is what is "merging" the toolbars depending the context
[05:01] <Tonio_> I assume the toolbar is just dynamically created because of it's new name....
[05:01] <Tonio_> I'm testing, but I'm fine with that solution ;)
[05:01] <Tonio_> sounds good :)
[05:01] <Riddell> yes, so it doesn't merge and instead just adds a new one
[05:01] <Tonio_> hum it merges
[05:01] <Tonio_> whenever browsing
[05:02] <Tonio_> but the browsing stuff is merged in the "maintoolbar" that is hidden
[05:02] <Tonio_> then the pdf stuff is merges on a new toobar that then displays
[05:02] <Tonio_> that's the trick....
[05:02] <Tonio_> the khtmlpart is merged on an hidden toolbar ;)
[05:02] <Tonio_> very nice hack ;)
[05:03] <Riddell> http://kubuntu.org/~jr/tmp/pdf.png  no merges
[05:03] <Tonio_> that's merged no ?
[05:03] <Tonio_> if you look at your konqrc, you should see this :
[05:04] <Riddell> that's a new toolbar on the second line
[05:04] <Tonio_> yes
[05:04] <Riddell> need to remove <Separator/> from kpdf partrc
[05:04] <Tonio_> the main toolbar is merging, while the part.rc is telling the merging is done on a new toolbar
[05:04] <Tonio_> Riddell: yes I can see that
[05:05] <Tonio_> Riddell: you should see this in your konq profile :
[05:05] <Tonio_> <ToolBar newline="true" hidden="true" name="mainToolBar" fullWidth="true" >
[05:05] <Tonio_>   <text>Main Toolbar</text>
[05:05] <Tonio_>   <WeakSeparator/>
[05:05] <Tonio_>   <Merge/>
[05:05] <Tonio_>  </ToolBar>
[05:05] <Tonio_> the <Merge/> directive is what is displaying the context kpart buttons
[05:05] <Riddell> yes
[05:05] <Tonio_> if you remove that, it won't work anymore
[05:05] <Tonio_> anyway, the toolbar is hidden
[05:06] <Tonio_> so the khtmlpart is merged but hidden
[05:06] <Riddell> yep
[05:06] <Tonio_> then the kpdf stuff is merge because of that directive, but on another one ;)
[05:06] <Tonio_> sounds clear and efficient
[05:07] <Tonio_> Riddell: sorry for bugging you with this, but finally, the result is nice ;)
[05:07] <Riddell> don't be sorry, we'll make this thing rock
[05:07] <Tonio_> yep, that's the goal :)
[05:08] <Tonio_> Riddell: concerning kubuntu-default-settings
[05:08] <Tonio_> how does this thing work ?
[05:08] <Tonio_> does it take priority to the /usr/share folder ?
[05:08] <Tonio_> just have to put a file there, or does it needs to be declared somewhere ? ?
[05:08] <Riddell> it edits /etc/kderc so that any resources in /usr/share/kubuntu-def... override those in /usr/share/apps
[05:08] <Tonio_> okay ;)
[05:09] <Riddell> Tonio_: so in theory just putting the new kpart rc file in kubuntu-default-settings is fine
[05:09] <Tonio_> Riddell: good ;)
[05:09] <Riddell> but there's a bug in konqueror which means for restarting konq from a saved session it doesn't do that
[05:09] <Tonio_> let's go, and show you the result in an hour :)
[05:09] <Riddell> that's why the /usr/share/apps/konqueror has the edited file in it
[05:09] <Riddell> so we need to experiment and see if kpdf etc are affected by that
[05:10] <Tonio_> yep
[05:11] <Tonio_> Riddell: last question, why are kubuntu default fonts that big ?
[05:11] <Tonio_> I was asking that several time
[05:12] <Tonio_> is there a particular reason ?
[05:12] <Riddell> it depends on what your kdm sets your dpi to
[05:12] <Riddell> which is what it gets from the monitor
[05:13] <Riddell> it might be a good idea to investigate how to get kdm to just use a static DPI for everyone
[05:13] <Tonio_> by default it is always set to 12 on all machine I installed....
[05:13] <Tonio_> I don't talk about the dpi, but the size in kde profile
[05:14] <Riddell> yes
[05:14] <Riddell> but how large that ends up depends on the dpi
[05:14] <Tonio_> so it cannot be set to 10 by default ?
[05:14] <Riddell> it can but then its too small for some people with different DPIs being set
[05:14] <Tonio_> yep I know the size on the screen depends on the dpi
[05:14] <Tonio_> okay, that's the reason ;)
[05:22] <Tonio_> Riddell: works perfectly
[05:23] <Riddell> Tonio_: what does?
[05:27] <Tonio_> the part.rc in kubuntu-default-settings
[05:27] <Riddell> Tonio_: have you tried logging out and in again with konqueror loaded with a PDF file?
[05:28] <Tonio_> to be honnest, the result is better that what I would have though :)
[05:28] <Tonio_> Riddell: yep
[05:28] <Riddell> groovy
[05:28] <Tonio_> I removed the separator also
[05:28] <Tonio_> let's take the gwimageview kpart and ark
[05:28] <Riddell> Tonio_: ok, supply me with rc files for kpdf, ark, gwenview and whatever else you think needs done and I'll update kubuntu-default-settings
[05:28] <Tonio_> Riddell: do you want a patch for kubuntu-default-settings directly ?
[05:29] <Riddell> Tonio_: sure, that would do nicely
[05:29] <Riddell> mind and edit the Makefile in there
[05:29] <Tonio_> okay ;)
[05:29] <Tonio_> that'll groove :) hehe
[05:30] <Tonio_> Riddell: do I let the context options in the view menu ?
[05:30] <Tonio_> I personally find that confusing
[05:30] <Riddell> what are they?
[05:30] <Tonio_> same
[05:31] <Riddell> and we haven't decided about Window menu against View->Split yet
[05:31] <Tonio_> you get by default all kpart options in the "view" menu
[05:31] <Tonio_> Riddell: concerning this, I suggest to have that in view
[05:31] <Tonio_> sounds logic....
[05:31] <Riddell> yeah
[05:31] <Tonio_> but concerning the context options.... nothing to do view "view" I think
[05:32] <Tonio_> better to have that in "tools" or something
[05:32] <Riddell> such as which options?
[05:32] <Tonio_> pdf options ;)
[05:32] <Tonio_> zoom etc....
[05:32] <Tonio_> let me show you
[05:33] <Riddell> they are all Viewing related options
[05:33] <kozz> Riddell: fyi, no luck with network manager and knetworkmanager
[05:33] <Tonio_> hum..... not with ark kpart for example ;)
[05:34] <Riddell> kozz: fooey, what does it complain about?
[05:34] <Tonio_> but well, it is not behind your eyes so...
[05:34] <Tonio_> nobody compained about this
[05:34] <kozz> Riddell: where did you get that package anyway, have searched for knetworkmanager but didn't found that archive
[05:34] <Riddell> kozz: it's from suse's factory (development) archives
[05:34] <Tonio_> Riddell: replacement for knetworkconf ?
[05:34] <kozz> Riddell: something about unhandles event or such
[05:34] <kozz> unhandled event even
[05:35] <Riddell> kde frontend to network-manager
[05:35] <kozz> Riddell: but they are not publiv available, right?
[05:35] <Riddell> kozz: it is
[05:35] <Riddell> only as a source RPM
[05:36] <kozz> hmm, at least google can't find it :)
[05:43] <Riddell> search for suse factory
[05:43] <Riddell> the source RPM might be called networkmanager-kde or something
[06:00] <Tonio_> Riddell: works nice with gwenview also.... but I have a problem with kar
[06:00] <Tonio_> ark
[06:00] <Tonio_> it used the kio tar instead
[06:01] <Tonio_> what would you suggest ? keep the kio changing that to use the kpart ?
[06:01] <Tonio_> I think the kpart gives a better feeling
[06:03] <Riddell> Tonio_: not sure which is best, you could argue either way
[06:03] <Tonio_> hum
[06:03] <Riddell> you can get to ark by right clicking
[06:03] <Tonio_> when using the kio, you sometime don't have the feeling to be in an archive
[06:04] <Tonio_> that's by default...
[06:04] <Tonio_> there are three possibilities :
[06:04] <Tonio_> - using the kio
[06:04] <Tonio_> - opening it in konq internally
[06:04] <Tonio_> - opening it externally
[06:04] <Tonio_> actually the kio is used by default
[06:06] <Tonio_> my question is : how to disable a kio, to make tests ?
[06:06] <Riddell> well you can right click to choose
[06:06] <Tonio_> yes
[06:06] <Riddell> don't know how to change the priority forever
[06:07] <Tonio_> but if I want a double click not to launch tar:/ ?
[06:07] <Tonio_> okay
[06:07] <Tonio_> let's search
[06:09] <Riddell> maybe raise priority of ark ub .desktop file
[06:09] <Riddell> s/ub/in/
[06:09] <Tonio_> I'm asking on a kde channel ;)
[06:10] <Tonio_> kios are great, but this one is confusing... I personnaly prefer to have the archive manager opening....
[06:59] <Tonio_> Riddell: grmpf..... don't find the solution to disable the kio.....
[06:59] <Tonio_> my config works with 7z, rar etc.... but no way for tgz and zip....
[07:56] <Tonio_> Riddell: don't want to see the pannel by default in filemanagement profile ?
[08:00] <Riddell> Tonio_: which panel?
[08:00] <Tonio_> F9, the sidebar
[08:00] <Tonio_> it is not displayed by default in the filemanagement profile
[08:02] <mornfall> i don't find it "ridiculous" but so be it
[08:02] <mornfall> Riddell: could you please point the user at b.k.o and have a wishlist bug filed so i don't forget?
[08:08] <Riddell> mornfall: I'll do so and point out that missing a minor feature is certianly not rediculous, it's just an interesting idea I hadn't come across before
[08:09] <Tonio_> Riddell: so would you like the sidebar in filemanagement profile ?
[08:12] <mornfall> Riddell: no need to bother, just have him record it in bugzilla, i almost certainly lose those otherwise
[08:12] <Riddell> Tonio_: dunno, what do we have at the moment?
[08:12] <Tonio_> Riddell: we don't display it
[08:13] <Tonio_> Riddell: I think it is necessary in the filemanagement profile... making things way easier
[08:14] <Riddell> Tonio_: add it in then :)
[08:14] <Tonio_> okay ;)
[08:15] <Tonio_> Riddell: also I noticed that konqueror uses kate to open file very often...
[08:15] <Tonio_> example http://<IP_ADDRESS>/search?q=cache:EEJhNo0bAfUJ:corpo_acm.netasso.net/files/+%22index+of%22+rar&hl=fr&ie=UTF-8
[08:15] <Tonio_> click on a rar file
[08:15] <Tonio_> it doesn't ask for downloading it....
[08:16] <Tonio_> I don't know why.....
[09:26] <mornfall> Riddell: trimmed down list ... is presented was actually correct :-)
[09:27] <mornfall> other than that, looks good, thanks :)
[09:36] <allee> Tonio_: Koos asked if someone is interested to bring kmplayer to debian.  You uploaded kmplayer to revu half a year ago but it's not in dapper yet.  Any reason why it got stuck?
[09:40] <Tonio_> yep, my package was crappy
[09:41] <Tonio_> and it is very hard to package, so that I don't have the time for this ;)
[09:41] <Tonio_> the problem is that it is now very modular, lots of separated libs etc...
[09:41] <Tonio_> My package should be removed from revu allee
[09:42] <allee> Tonio_: I can't do this ;)
[09:42] <jpatrick> allee: can I try?
[09:42] <Tonio_> hum
[09:42] <Tonio_> getting mad with this
[09:43] <Tonio_> allee, jpatrick : does anyone of you know on earth is the settings to disable a kioslave ?
[09:43] <allee> jpatrick: go head! (as if anyone about my okay ;)
[09:43] <Tonio_> and secondly, where is the setting telling konqueror to open files with kate ?
[09:43] <jpatrick> I don't :(
[09:43] <Tonio_> tgz files on the web are opened with kate
[09:43] <allee> Tonio_: rename the corresponding protocol desktop file?
[09:44] <Tonio_> allee: hum, why not :)
[09:44] <allee> Tonio_: then either the tar file is buggy or the file associations need a fix
[09:44] <Tonio_> and concerning kate ?
[09:44] <allee> s/tar file/mime type returned bye the server/
[09:44] <Tonio_> allee: well, it works with rar or 7z files
[09:45] <Tonio_> but there are kioslaves for zip and tar
[09:45] <Tonio_> so according to you that is a problem on the server part ?
[09:45] <allee> try:  HEAD  url-to-tar.  Maybe the server returns wrong mime-type
[09:45] <jpatrick> allee: I'm going now.. added kmplayer to todo
[09:46] <Tonio_> hum.......... shouldn't work with extensions instead of the mimetype ?
[09:46] <allee> Tonio_: check HEAD output.  then you will know
[09:46] <jpatrick> school starts again tomorrow!!
[09:46] <Tonio_> firefox or IE are working with extensions
[09:47] <jpatrick> night everyone
[09:47] <allee> Tonio_: well, if you download via http: the server should return right mime type.
[09:48] <allee> jpatrick: night!
[09:49] <Tonio_> allee: I know that, but if 80% webserver are badly configured.....
[09:49] <Tonio_> well
[09:49] <Tonio_> anyway :
[09:49] <Tonio_> [Property::X-KDE-LocalProtocol]
[09:49] <Tonio_> Type=QString
[09:49] <Tonio_> Value=zip
[09:49] <Tonio_> that's it ;)
[09:51] <allee> Tonio_: URL?
[09:55] <allee> jpatrick: fyi: kde svn kmplayer contains a debian subdir
[10:09] <Tonio_> allee: /usr/share/mimelnk/application/x-zip.desktop
[10:10] <Tonio_> sorry, I was gone take a lunch
[10:10] <allee> Tonio_: np
[10:11] <allee> Tonio_: next try ;) what's the URL for the tar file that get's opened with kate?
[10:26] <Tonio_> allee: let me show you
[10:26] <Tonio_> just finished eating ;)
[10:27] <Tonio_> allee: I personally don't have the problem with tar.gz files
[10:27] <Tonio_> but with rar, for example...
[10:27] <Tonio_> http://<IP_ADDRESS>/search?q=cache:0HP8Oe3ksYMJ:distro.ibiblio.org/pub/linux/distributions/lormalinux/v5/ecd25RAR/+%22index+of%22+rar&hl=fr&ie=UTF-8
[10:27] <Tonio_> you can try to download a rar file there
[10:27] <Tonio_> JRe has the problem with tar.gz files I think
[10:27] <Tonio_> JRe: can you confirm ?
[10:29] <JRe> Tonio_: yes
[10:30] <JRe> it used Kate to open that URL
[10:30] <allee> Tonio_: the server return text/plain  and kate load the *13.rar file here (as expected :( )
[10:32] <allee> Tonio_: ditto for firefox.  rar is displayes it inline.  Lots of garbage
[10:32] <JRe> allee: ok I understand
[10:33] <allee> hi JRe
[10:33] <JRe> hi allee
[10:33] <JRe> allee: I took a look for the bug you showed me yesterday
[10:34] <allee> JRe: YYEEEAAAHHHH!!!
[10:34] <JRe> allee: but everything in the code of medianotifier seems ok: it do watch the media/gphoto2camera mimetype
[10:34] <JRe> allee: so I think that this bug can come from 1) mediamanager 2) HAL
[10:34] <JRe> allee: ervin thinks it's more a HAL packaging problem
[10:35] <allee> JRe: Do you have a camera that is supported by gphoto2?
[10:35] <JRe> allee: so did you test if you really receive the hal event when pluggin it to you computer ?
[10:35] <JRe> allee: unfortunately not
[10:35] <JRe> allee: all my camera are recognized by media/removable
[10:35] <JRe> allee: but i am overmotivated
[10:35] <JRe> allee: I _want_ this feature
[10:35] <Tonio_> allee: jre has the problem with tar.gz files
[10:35] <Tonio_> while I don't
[10:36] <allee> JRe: I tried lshal some minutes ago.  Long list.  Looks I have to save before/after plugin and diff it but got sidetracked by kmplayer and tar/rar mimetypes
[10:36] <Tonio_> http://planetemu.net/?section=emulateurs&machine=42&os=Linux&orderby=nom&ordertype=ASC&viewtypeemulateurs=detailled#go842
[10:36] <Tonio_> for example there
[10:36] <JRe> Tonio_: it did use kate again
[10:36] <Tonio_> not for me
[10:37] <Tonio_> I get a download dialog box
[10:37] <Tonio_> allee: what about you ?
[10:38] <allee> JRe: okay so you check the why media/removable and not media/camera  and I try to find out more about media/ghoto2camera
[10:38] <allee> Tonio_: Still loading nothing to 'click' :(
[10:38] <allee> Tonio_: konqueror: still waiting for reply
[10:40] <Tonio_> I personally can download
[10:40] <Tonio_> the website doesn't work for you ?
[10:40] <allee> Tonio_: stop and reload 'fixed' it.  Now looking for an tar file there ...
[10:40] <Tonio_> k
[10:41] <allee> Tonio_: when I click on FBZX V1.5 I get:
[10:41] <allee> Open 'http://planetemu.n...x_1.5_linux.tar.gz'?
[10:41] <allee> Type: Tar file
[10:42] <allee> and as expected: HEAD 'http://planetemu.net/php/emulateurs/?action=download&id=933'
[10:42] <allee> returns: Content-Type: application/x-tar
[10:43] <Tonio_> allee: that's correct ;)
[10:43] <JRe> allee: yeah right
[10:43] <allee> Tonio_: yes :)
[10:43] <JRe> :)
[10:44] <Tonio_> ;)
[10:44] <Tonio_> okay, so I can disable that kio
[10:44] <Tonio_> good news
[10:45] <JRe> allee: ok gonna try with my ixus
[10:45] <JRe> allee: BTW many thanks for having thinked to that feature!
[10:45] <Tm_T> interesting, ubuntu and ubuntuserver install cd's have same problem with my server machine
[10:45] <Tonio_> JRe: pv ;)
[10:45] <Tm_T> installer "crashes" when it should start partitioning step
[10:47] <allee> JRe: diff of lshal before and after gphoto2 camera pluged in
[10:47] <allee> http://rafb.net/paste/results/UweUx090.html
[10:47] <Tm_T> and flashes "E: Unimplemented function"
[10:49] <JRe> allee: it seems to work
[10:49] <Tm_T> have anyone of you heard about that?
[10:50] <Riddell> Tm_T: dapper or breezy?
[10:50] <allee> JRe: media:/ is still empty (and no media dialog
[10:50] <JRe> allee: kde 3.5 ?
[10:50] <allee> JRe: yes.  Dapper uptodate
[10:51] <JRe> ok
[10:51] <Tm_T> Riddell: breezy
[10:51] <Riddell> Tm_T: that's not a good sign
[10:52] <allee> JRe: I must admit I'm lost again.  To many numbers.  No human readable string like camera or gphoto2 :(
[10:52] <Tm_T> ubuntu shipped install-cd, selfburned ubuntuserver install-cd
[10:52] <Tm_T> Riddell: that's not
[10:52] <Riddell> Tm_T: does it have raid?
[10:52] <JRe> allee: yes all output is a mess
[10:52] <Tm_T> Riddell: bios does find HD just fine, so I don't think that's the problem
[10:52] <Tm_T> Riddell: nope =)
[10:53] <Tm_T> Riddell: just single ATA drive in primary ide as master
[10:53] <JRe> allee: ok I have the same bug
[10:53] <JRe> allee: damn damn damn
[10:54] <JRe> allee: to resolve that the first thing to do is to inspect the output of mediamanager
[10:54] <Tm_T> Riddell: I doublecheck bios settings
[10:54] <JRe> allee: dcop kded mediamanger
[10:54] <JRe> allee: dcop kded mediamanager fullList
[10:54] <allee> JRe: Oh: object 'mediamanger' in application 'kded' not accessible
[10:55] <JRe> allee: that's not normal
[10:55] <JRe> allee: it's working at home
[10:55] <allee> JRe: ah an 'a' was missing not it works so
[10:55] <JRe> allee: and the mediamanager has not my camera in the list
[10:56] <JRe> allee: same for you ?
[10:56] <allee> JRe: yeah. fullList is empty before and after plugin of gphot2 camera
[10:57] <JRe> allee: ok so the bug come from that
[10:57] <JRe> allee: so It will be hard to fix
[10:57] <JRe> allee: it need a commit in kdebase
[10:57] <JRe> allee: the first thing to do is to report a bug I think
[10:58] <allee> JRe: I'm sure Riddel gladly add this patch to debian/patches ;)
[10:58] <JRe> allee: ok. but we need ervin to do that ;)
[10:58] <JRe> allee: I am not tough enough on HAL
[10:58] <allee> JRe: so bug against mediamanager?  I'll do it.
[10:59] <allee> JRe: questions: to bugs 1) camera is media/removable_unmounted and 2) ghoto2camera not detected.  right?
[10:59] <allee> s/to bugs/two bugs/
[10:59] <JRe> allee: yes
[10:59] <JRe> allee: the first one come from HAL I think
[11:00] <JRe> allee: because it did send a HAL event with the wrong type
[11:00] <JRe> allee: the second one is clearly coming from mediamanager
[11:00] <allee> JRe: okay so I submit 2).  Do you care about 1)?
[11:01] <JRe> allee: I will see for #1 with ervin and see what is the best thing to do
[11:01] <allee> JRe: thx!
[11:02] <JRe> allee: thanks to you!
[11:02] <JRe> allee: what is the deadline for the patch ?
[11:03] <allee> JRe: for digikam 19th Jan so 0.8.1 with the media features can go it.  But a bugfix patch to kdebase should more time.
[11:04] <allee> JRe: digikam is independent of the patch but we would like to test before releasing ;)
[11:04] <JRe> allee: sure
[11:04] <Tm_T> Riddell: nope, no luck with bios tweaking either
[11:04] <allee> JRe: but we can add a patch to digikam also later too if it does not the right thing with the mediamanager patch
[11:05] <JRe> allee: ookee
[11:05] <allee> :)
[11:05] <JRe> allee: what is your camera brand and model ?
[11:05] <JRe> allee: (just to see if it could not be a just for us bug)
[11:05] <allee> JRe: gphoto2: canon powershot a49
[11:06] <allee> JRe: usb storage: sony dsc w12
[11:06] <allee> a40 that is
[11:06] <JRe> allee: gphoto2: i also have a canon
[11:07] <allee> JRe: but I can recruite many more testers on #digikam.  At least 3 running dapper
[11:07] <JRe> allee: should be cool
[11:08] <JRe> allee: they also have the bug with media:/ not showing gphoto2 camera ?
[11:08] <allee> JRe: yea
[11:08] <allee> yes
[11:08] <JRe> allee: ooky
[11:09] <JRe> s/it/he/
[11:15] <allee> JRe: there was no service entry media/pghoto2camera yet?
[11:15] <allee> JRe: next digikam release will have it.  Promised :)
[11:17] <JRe> =)
[11:20] <Tm_T> Riddell: maybe I test dapper installer, where's flight-2 install media?
[11:20] <Tonio_> http://www.planetemu.net/temp/kubuntu-default-settings_5.10-18_all.deb
[11:20] <Tonio_> anyone wants to test this on breezy ?
[11:20] <Tonio_> JRe: if you wanna test ;)
[11:20] <\sh> Tm_T: cdimage.ubuntu.com?
[11:20] <Tm_T> ah!
[11:20] <Tm_T> I'm blind
[11:21] <Tm_T> and too angry about this whole mess
[11:22] <allee> JRe: $%#^ what's the 'application' to file the bug against? Searching in the popdown list is crazy :)
[11:22] <JRe> mediamanager ?
[11:22] <Tm_T> supposed to have working shell server 2h ago
[11:23] <allee> JRe: only two mediacontrol entries.  Check this already :(
[11:23] <allee> JRe: kio/media?
[11:23] <JRe> mmm
[11:23] <JRe> dam
[11:23] <JRe> kioslaves/media
[11:23] <JRe> kdebase/kioslave/media
[11:24] <JRe> the last I am almost sure
[11:26] <allee> JRe: only kio/media exists.
[11:27] <JRe> kio/media is fine
[11:31] <JRe> allee: don't worry next time I see ervin on #solid i'll remember that to him :)
[11:32] <allee> JRe: :)  Thx!
[11:56] <poningru> so can someone confirm something
[11:56] <poningru> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RecentChanges
[11:56] <poningru> that says that the next release code names will be alphabetical
[11:57] <poningru> is that true?
[12:02] <Riddell> poningru: yes
[12:02] <poningru> ok cool thanks man


[00:20] <jmburgess> is bughelper no longer in the repository?
[00:26] <jmburgess> it seems lit it isn't
[03:03] <geofft> Hm. Can I not reopen a Fix Released bug? Should I just file a new one?
[10:09] <evfool> hggdh, mvo: about bug 199669 - it's triaged for both update-manager and update-notifier in Ubuntu, could you explain what needs to be done in update-manager?
[10:09] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 199669 in update-notifier (Ubuntu) (and 3 other projects) "Tray notification doesn't disappear when the Update Manager starts (heat: 2)" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/199669
[10:17] <mvo> evfool: its only a issue for poeple using the non auto-open mode (which is not the default on ubuntu anymore)
[10:21] <evfool> mvo: but what needs to be done in u-m to fix it? isn't it only an update-notifier bug?
[10:23] <mvo> evfool: u-m could send a dbus signal, but I guess all the u-n should do is what the bus and if u-m appears just hide, so you are right, nothing for update-manager to do here and its fine to close the task
[10:24] <evfool> mvo: thanks, setting it to invalid then
[10:25] <mvo> thanks! please include the note about the bus watching that u-n needs to do
[13:50] <veger> hallo, anyone around to answer a couple of questions?
[14:19] <hggdh> veger: there is always someone around; it is better to just ask the questions, and whoever knows the answer will (eventually) answer them
[14:21] <veger> tried that yesterday (and fialed) ;)
[14:21] <veger> *failed
[14:22] <veger> I found an upstream report for bug 818775, stating that it has a  wishlist importance. So could someone set the LP report to Wishlist importance as well?
[14:22] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 818775 in kdeutils (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Ark: adding a file to a folder get it in the 'root' of the archive (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/818775
[14:23] <veger> Furthermore, I suppose I should set the status of the bug report to Triaged?
[14:34] <kamusin> veger, I have already done this for you ;)
[14:34] <veger> thanks
[14:35] <veger> as I'd like to learn: I had the correct ideas for setting it to wishlist due to the wishlist status of the upstream report?
[14:36] <paultag> veger: not in all cases, there might be some cases where something we see as critical ( a use case we have ), that upstream does not care about
[14:37] <paultag> veger: so if upstream only cares about, say, fedora, and we are having a critical issue because it interfaces with package X we use by default in Ubuntu that say fedora does not have, we might consider it critical, but upstream might consider it minor / wishlist
[14:37] <veger> So for such cases I'd need info on 'us'? :)
[14:37] <paultag> veger: that case is very very rare :)
[14:37] <paultag> veger: :)
[14:38] <veger> thanks for helping
[14:38] <paultag> sure sure
[14:38] <yofel> hm...
[14:39] <yofel> I'm closing this. We (the kubuntu team) don't track any upstream issues that aren't at least High/Critical on launchpad. We only end up with bug zombies for long fixed bugs
[14:40] <paultag> yofel: someone should write an lplib script to clear out upstream fixed bugs
[14:40] <paultag> yofel: it could be useful if someone wants to help and they cherry pick some low hanging fruit
[14:41] <paultag> not telling you that policy's out of line, I agree that happens, but I'm just shooting up an idea
[14:41] <veger> oh... so after sending a report upstream it can be closed...? (assuming it is a low importance bug)
[14:41] <paultag> veger: no, so after upstream closes, it will close the local bug too with a message
[14:41] <yofel> the script would be an idea, the cherry picking not really since we don't add patches unless it's really necessary
[14:41] <paultag> veger: yeah but even something like me subscribing to a bug
[14:42] <yofel> and then the bug would be at least High anyway
[14:42] <paultag> veger: it's be nice to get followup :)
[14:42] <paultag> not nitpicking or anything
[14:42] <yofel> veger: that's for kde packages, usually triaged is right
[14:43] <veger> yofel: well I kind of try to help out with kde packages... but I'll try to rember it is for kde only :)
[14:43] <yofel> feel free to poke in #kubuntu-devel for details, haven't triaged much myself lately :/
[14:45] <veger> As I mentions I have multiple questions: bug 577560 is fixed upstream with a patch. I have updated the package and tried it. It works and solves the problem. Should I set the status to 'fix committed'? And should I do anything else to make sure the patch ends up in the kubuntu repositories?
[14:45] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 577560 in plasma-widget-networkmanagement (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "can't connect to WPA2 Entreprise using PEAP and MSCHAPv2 (affects: 7) (heat: 40)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/577560
[14:51] <yofel> veger: that bug should be fix released, as the snapshot in oneiric (from the nm09 branch) was taken after the fix was committed.
[14:52] <yofel> as for natty and earlier the fix needs to follow the SRU procedure
[14:55] <veger> I try to find the nm09 branch, is it this onehttps://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/oneiric/plasma-widget-networkmanagement/oneiric ?
[14:56] <veger> I'll read up on the SRU procedures now...
[14:59] <yofel> veger: a) the nm09 branch won't work in Natty b) the SRU procedure requires minimal patches that fix the issue, so you can't just SRU a new snapshot
[15:02] <veger> yes, I read about the requirements for a SRU
[15:03] <veger> I'll set the bug to fix released and leave it (no updates for natty... :( ;) )
[15:03] <yofel> I looked at that bug a few days ago actually, less than trivial SRU since the upstream patch doesn't apply on the natty package
[15:04] <veger> I tried yes, and I ended up with grabbing a snapshot
[15:05] <veger> Quite a lot of (academic) users have problems due to this bug
[15:06] <veger> for my personal understanding, were can I find the nm09 branch? So I can find it a next time in order to see whether a fix is provided or not?
[15:09] <yofel> veger: 'git clone git://anongit.kde.org/networkmanagement' -> 'git checkout nm09' or look at http://quickgit.kde.org/?p=networkmanagement.git&a=shortlog&h=refs/heads/nm09
[15:12] <yofel> veger: for the upstream one, launchpad will have whatever we have in the archive
[15:15] <veger> yofel: thanks for the info!
[15:16] <veger> http://quickgit.kde.org/ will become my friend :)
[15:23] <veger> There are quite some related reports (mostly for different encryption types), but all due to the same problem supposedly. bug 507835 is such an example, but here there is a user asking whether it is possible to backport the change for natty. Should I tell him 'no'?
[15:23] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 507835 in plasma-widget-networkmanagement (Ubuntu) "Can't connect to WPA enterprise (LEAP) (affects: 3) (heat: 21)" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/507835
[15:39] <veger> I have replied on the mentioned bug, I think it is a good reply... :)
[15:41] <veger> in bug 660970, it is mentioned that the problem is fixed in 'the current release', so it is unknown how it was fixed (for me). As I rembember the bug should be closed as Invalid, right?
[15:41] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 660970 in evolution (Ubuntu) "Mark messages as read in current folder and subfolders doesn't work (affects: 2) (heat: 17)" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/660970
[15:43] <yofel> veger: why no? it's just that nobody did it yet
[15:46] <veger> yofel: Just to be sure I rembered correctly...
[15:49] <veger> and my last question (for now), bug 698035 tells that the --help output is incomeplete. I think it is just being short and that the use should read the manual pages for the complete help. How should I handle this?
[15:49] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 698035 in evolution (Ubuntu) "evolution --help talks unhelpfully about "the specified component" (affects: 1) (heat: 20)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/698035
[16:51] <jmburgess> Is the bughelper package no longer in natty?
[16:53]  * yofel thinks we junked that a long time ago
[16:53] <yofel> what do you want to use it for?
[16:54] <jmburgess> Oh I just saw it was good for finding duplicates and such
[16:54] <jmburgess> And then doing bug patterns
[16:55] <micahg> jmburgess: take a look at bughugger
[16:55] <yofel> well, the LP ui is usable these days, if you need a more usable search go to google and use 'site:bugs.launchpad.net <searchterm>'
[16:55] <RedSingularity> jibel: any idea what this is?  :  /tmp/update-manager-XRc3zk/DistUpgradeCache.py:729: DeprecationWarning: Attribute 'Essential' of the 'apt_pkg.Package' object is deprecated, use 'essential' instead.
[16:56] <jmburgess> Can launchpad search attachments as well?
[16:56] <jibel> RedSingularity, that's a deprecation warning :)
[16:56] <RedSingularity> jibel: I have seen that a few times.  What does it mean exactly?
[17:00] <jibel> RedSingularity, it means that the code must be updated to the latest api. Is that on oneiric, it changed a while ago IIRC.
[17:01] <RedSingularity> jibel: looks like an upgrade from natty to oneiric.  That code is at the bottom of the apt.log
[17:06] <RedSingularity> jibel: I was trying to track down the culprit package.  Have a look at the log.  bug 798512
[17:06] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 798512 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "Upgrading Kubuntu to version 11.04 error at the second process (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/798512
[17:10] <RedSingularity> jibel: I had thought python-kde4 may have been it but that package seems fine....
[17:24] <jmburges> Bug 565543 can be marked as triaged I think. Importance medium
[17:24] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 565543 in linux (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Alps touchpad detected as ImPS/2 Generic Wheel Mouse(in VAIO E series) after the kernel upgrade (affects: 68) (dups: 1) (heat: 404)" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/565543
[20:25] <kamusin> eeebotu is gone hggdh :(
[20:25] <hggdh> kamusin: checking, thanks
[20:26] <kamusin> you are welcome ;)
[20:28] <hggdh> kamusin: recovered, thanks for the heads up