[03:27] <pitti> Good morning
[06:52] <dholbach> good morning
[06:57] <didrocks> good morning dholbach
[07:08] <dholbach> salut didrocks
[07:09] <dholbach> didrocks, how was the response so far? :)
[07:09] <didrocks> dholbach: excellent! and more than positive overall, so great to see that!
[07:09] <dholbach> :-D
[07:11] <seb128> didrocks, nice to read that!
[07:13] <pitti> stgraber: I'd appreciate if you could take a look at bug 1362224 -- that seems to break cloning and juju-local pretty thoroughly?
[07:42] <zbenjamin> cjwatson: ping, is there some API i can use to find out the writeable location of a specific app or scope ? I could use a way to find this out from the SDK launcher
[08:05] <mardy> Laney: hi! About bug 1029289, I'd like to have the fix backported to trusty as well. Should I prepare a branch of eds 3.10.4 containing the backported fix?
[08:06] <seb128> mardy, laney is on holidays
[08:07] <seb128> mardy, but yeah, having an update on top of 3.10.4-0ubuntu1.2 would be the way to go there
[08:16] <mardy> seb128: OK, I'll try to prepare it
[08:16] <seb128> mardy, thanks
[08:41] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: ping, do you know if there is any API to query app writeable locations i can use from the SDK launcher? I need a shared directory so i can communicate with the app
[08:41] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: same is required for scopes
[09:23] <pitti> wgrant: to confirm, is the RTM langpack export cron'ed now?
[09:39] <wgrant> pitti: Yup.
[09:40] <pitti> wgrant: thanks! adjusting work items in https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/qa-u-spanish-translations accordingly
[09:41] <pitti> [wgrant] Confirm that message sharing between Ubuntu and this distro will work: TODO
[09:41] <pitti> wgrant: there's still that one, FTR
[09:41] <wgrant> Oh, forgot about the blueprint.
[09:43] <wgrant> pitti: That all works fine, but let me know if anything seems off.
[09:43] <wgrant> We're on lightly tested ground here.
[09:44] <pitti> wgrant: ack, thanks; if it works in principle (i. e. stuff has translations with by and large the same numbers than ubuntu), it's fine
[09:57] <rbasak> infinity: are you available to talk about bug 1359349 please?
[09:58] <rbasak> AIUI, you had some concern about the upgrade/transition path?
[10:02] <Saviq> xnox, hey, can I bug you about a x-building conundrum?
[10:07] <doko> ScottK, please check packages before blindly removing them:  lp: #6107581 this is a normal ftbfs, and afaics has nothing to do with clang.
[10:08] <doko> bug #1346252
[10:08] <doko> xnox, no idea why you filed this one ...
[10:19] <ScottK> doko: ansgar asked me to remove it.  The documentation may have been off, but it wasn't blind.
[10:20] <Saviq> doko, maybe you'll be able to help, libqtdbusmock is a library execing python, it depends on python-dbusmock, too, the problem for x-building is that it tries to pull in build arch python-dbusmock instead of host arch, how should this be solved?
[10:40] <pete-woods> xnox: hi. do you have any time to help me with this cross-build issue I have received? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libqtdbusmock/+bug/1364842
[10:40] <pete-woods> basically libqtdbusmock is a wrapper around the python-dbusmock library
[10:40] <pete-woods> it doesn't link it it, just execs as a module
[10:41] <pete-woods> but it seems that the ubuntu-system-settings app won't cross compile due to a dependency on libqtdbusmock now
[10:43] <pete-woods> ha
[10:43] <pete-woods> hadn't realised Saviq was just asking the same thing!
[10:44] <pitti> darkxst: FYI, I just synced https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/systemd-shim/7-2 -- so you now merely need to rebuild that in your PPA against/for systemd 214
[10:55] <darkxst> pitti, great!
[11:18] <rbasak> didrocks: http://blog.didrocks.fr/post/Ubuntu-loves-Developers returns Content-Type: application/octet-stream and Firefox wants me to save a download file :-/
[11:19] <rbasak> Server: cloudflare-nginx
[11:22] <didrocks> rbasak: interesting, I don't have that with my Firefox, let me try something
[11:22] <didrocks> rbasak: mind trying again?
[11:23] <didrocks> I wonder if it's static htlm page + cloudflare doing this
[11:23] <didrocks> html*
[11:24] <didrocks> (sorry, can't really test in the same condition as my ISP doesn't allow self-dns redirection as my IP == server IP)
[11:26] <rbasak> didrocks: working now
[11:26] <didrocks> rbasak: ok, mind trying with http://<IP_ADDRESS>/post/Ubuntu-loves-Developers ?
[11:26] <didrocks> (bypassing cloudflare + static html page)
[11:27] <rbasak> didrocks: that also works in Firefox. Using wget, I no longer see a Content-Type header at all.
[11:28] <didrocks> rbasak: yeah, so it's cloudflare + static html page, thanks! that gives me a hint from where to start my investigation :)
[11:28] <rbasak> didrocks: ah, so cloudflare turns the no-content-type into a content-type=octet-stream?
[11:28] <didrocks> rbasak: that's my guess
[11:29] <rbasak> That seems a bit wrong to me.
[11:29] <didrocks> it clearly is :)
[11:46] <mdeslaur> xnox: happy birthday :)
[11:48] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: there is not yet an api to query for a writable area, though, there will be. however, the writable areas are very predictable: http://developer.ubuntu.com/apps/platform/guides/app-confinement/
[11:48] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: (see Runtime Environment)
[11:49] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: scopes are similar: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/Specifications/ScopesConfinement
[11:51] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: i saw that document, my only concern is that they might change
[11:51] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: pick the ones in .local/share/...
[11:51] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: can i somehow query if a app/scope is running in confinement or not?
[11:53] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: or going to be run in confinement, i think for the app there is some env var defined that specifies that
[11:55] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: the paths won't change any time soon (we follow XDG basedirs to be predictable)
[11:56] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: you have everything you need in the sdk to know if it will be confined
[11:56] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: if it is not click, then it won't be confined. if it is click, check the apparmor template. if it is not 'unconfined', it is confined
[11:56] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: awesome thx
[11:57] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: same for scopes i gues
[11:57] <zbenjamin> s
[11:57] <didrocks> rbasak: ok, that should be fixed now (played with my htaccess to force the content type if the file is set)
[11:58] <didrocks> rbasak: I used a static html file yesterday after popey tried to DDOS me when tweeting :)
[11:58] <popey> lolz
[11:58] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: yes. so, for apps, use the ~/.local/share/<'name from click manifest'>
[11:59] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: i'm going to put files and named pipes the helper script has to read and write into those locations , so we do not need to have access to /tmp anymore, but only the supported directories
[11:59] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: ok
[12:00] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: for scopes, if it uses the 'ubuntu-scope-network' apparmor template, use ~/.local/share/unity-scopes/leaf-net/<name in click manifest>
[12:00] <ogra_> xnox, happy birthday !!
[12:01] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: for scopes, if it uses the 'unconfined' template, use ~/.local/share/unity-scopes/unconfined/<name in click manifest>
[12:01] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: that sounds great
[12:02] <rbasak> didrocks: :)
[12:02] <didrocks> thanks again for the notice :)
[12:02] <rbasak> didrocks: I use a static generator for my blog now, just so I don't have to care.
[12:02] <rbasak> No problem.
[12:05] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: so we have real confinement in case when gdbserver is not attached (no debug policy needed), and when gdbserver is attached we can cut some more privileges from the debug policy
[12:06] <jdstrand> cool
[12:06] <jdstrand> (we could remove the user-tmp abstraction)
[12:08] <zbenjamin> jdstrand:  :)
[12:27] <vak> i use  "apt-get source --compile" to compile a huge package. Is it possible to pass "-j N" option to the underlying make utility calls?
[12:37] <rbasak> vak: the standard that Debian source packages follow is to heed the environment setting DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS="parallel=N"
[12:37] <rbasak> vak: I'm not sure if apt-get source --compile passes that through or not, but you could try it.
[12:38] <rbasak> vak: paying attention to that environment setting is up to the source package though. Helpers like debhelper support it by default, unless the packager is doing something custom.
[12:38] <vak> rbasak: thank you! will the compilation continue from its interrupted place if i CTRL-C it ?
[12:39] <rbasak> vak: no idea about apt-get source --compile; I don't use that. Usually you can resume a build if you're managing it manually only.
[12:39] <rbasak> So I'd say probably not, at a guess.
[12:40] <vak> well... not sure what you mean, because the package isn't my, and the compilation i started as 'apt-get source --compile this_damn_huge_package'
[12:40] <vak> i see ))
[12:40] <vak> gotta wait then ((
[12:55] <doko> jamespage, why is bug #1353729 a blocker? there is a workaround. the real blocker for mysql-5.6 are the failing autopkg tests, now known for months and still unfixed ...
[12:59] <jamespage> doko, that's not what's blocking transition - rbasak is working on the autopkgtests
[12:59] <jamespage> doko, what's the workaround - must have missed it
[13:04] <doko> jamespage, "works with -O1", so just build this file with lowered optimization
[13:07] <vak> rbasak: 1)the DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS is respected! 2) the compilations starts from scratch
[13:44] <mardy> seb128: hi! About bug 1029289, I created a branch (lined to the bug), tested it in a ppa (ppa:mardy/daily) and updated the bug description to make it ready for the SRU
[13:48] <seb128> mardy, thanks, did you subscribe ubuntu-sponsors to the bug?
[13:49] <mardy> seb128: no, I was trying to get someone from #ubuntu-bugs; I'll follow your advice, though
[13:49] <seb128> k
[13:56] <Lazza> Hello everyone
[14:18] <mpt> mvo, hi, update-manager just opened while I was in the middle of an apt-get upgrade. That isn’t supposed to happen. Any extra logs that might be useful for the bug report?
[14:25] <mvo> mpt: it used to check with the ubuntu-system-service, but http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/update-notifier/ubuntu/revision/788 changed this - but the change happend a long time ago. is this utopic or trusty?
[14:25] <kenvandine> bigon, i have a request related tot he folks package
[14:25] <kenvandine> bigon, i'm looking at splitting the dummy and key-file backends out of the lib package into a separate binary, so they don't get loaded everything it's used
[14:26] <mvo> mpt: if the upgrade is still running, could you run pkgexec /usr/lib/update-notifier/package-system-locked and see what that outputs?
[14:26] <kenvandine> s/everything/everytime
[14:26] <kenvandine> bigon, i think they are only used by tests
[14:26] <mpt> mvo, it’s 14.04
[14:29] <mpt> mvo, assuming you meant pkexec: “/var/lib/dpkg/lock:  22676”
[14:29] <mvo> mpt: ups, pkexec indeed . and echo $? - do you see "2" there?
[14:30] <mpt> mvo, yes
[14:31] <mvo> hm, those are the correct values, it should not have started it :/
[14:35] <mpt> Ok, just using ubuntu-bug then
[14:35] <bigon> kenvandine: hey, the key-file is used if eds is not running I think
[14:35] <bigon> the dummy one I'm not too sure
[14:36] <kenvandine> we noticed it with the address-book-service, which only needs eds
[14:36] <kenvandine> bigon, bug 1364548
[14:36] <kenvandine> bigon, i have a branch that moves them both to a libfolks-misc25 package
[14:37] <kenvandine> bigon, what do you think of that?
[14:37] <doko> jamespage, 5.5.39-0ubuntu3 re-introduces the autopkg test failures
[14:41] <doko> mlankhorst, what is the mesa/llvm status? time to update mesa?
[14:42] <jamespage> doko, I look again
[14:42]  * jamespage siggs
[14:42] <bigon> kenvandine: maybe this should be discussed with the other telepathy folks
[14:43] <bigon> are you on #telepathy?
[14:43] <kenvandine> wow... i'm not anymore :)
[14:43] <mlankhorst> doko: still waiting for someone to ack the MRE's
[14:46] <doko> mlankhorst, ok, commented
[15:06] <shadeslayer> pitti: poke
[15:08] <pitti> hello shadeslayer
[15:08] <shadeslayer> pitti: hey, so I'm sort of seeing this https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/systemd-shim/+bug/1359439 on the kubuntu-plasma5 ISO
[15:09] <pitti> yep, known issue; I think that hallyn is working on that
[15:09] <shadeslayer> pitti: trying to get to the live session from ubiquity-dm just relaunches ubiquity-dm
[15:09] <shadeslayer> http://paste.ubuntu.com/8224229/
[15:09] <shadeslayer> pitti: ok, but can someone check if it's the same issue?
[15:09] <shadeslayer> I /think/ it's the same issue, but would be nice to get confirmation
[15:10] <shadeslayer> that paste is the ubiquity-dm debug log
[15:12] <shadeslayer> http://paste.ubuntu.com/8224245 is the dmesg log
[15:14] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: i could use some more help with this. On the launcher side i can just install the click package and inspect the apparmor file to know if the app will run in confinement. But in confinement. how does a process know if its confined or not?
[15:14] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: my small helper script that sets up the env inside needs to know that
[15:16] <pitti> most certainly not; that shim error is mostly cosmetical (or sohuld be)
[15:17] <pitti> shadeslayer: that QXcbConnection: XCB error, is that the cause or consequence of the crash?
[15:18] <shadeslayer> pitti: I /think/ that's comes from ubiquity-dm and has nothing to do with the login process
[15:23] <shadeslayer> pitti: mmmm
[15:23] <shadeslayer> pitti: [   93.207654] kactivitymanage[4339]: segfault at 7f06c56bf9c8 ip 00007f06ced5f4bd sp 00007fff471f7958 error 4 in libQt5Core.so.5.3.0[7f06cea60000+516000]
[15:23] <shadeslayer> that looks bad
[15:24] <pitti> shadeslayer: sorry, gotta run now; but seems you found something there?
[15:24] <shadeslayer> yep
[15:24] <shadeslayer> I'll have a look
[15:24] <shadeslayer> pitti: thx for your help
[15:32] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: so, there are two ways: look in /proc/self/attr/current and see the label the process. the UBUNTU_APPLICATION_ISOLATION env var is also set, but I think possibly only for apps
[15:32] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: however, there is an issue-- apps that use the 'unconfined' template apparmor template in the security manifest end up with an apparmor label that is not 'unconfined'
[15:33] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: ok, the UBUNTU_APPLICATION_ISOLATION is not set for scopes , that was my first hope ;)
[15:34] <jdstrand> so the test is imperfect in that instance
[15:34] <jdstrand> scopes actually try to readdir ~/.local/share/unity-scopes/unconfined/ to see if they are unconfined
[15:35] <jdstrand> an app could try to readdir ~/.local/share
[15:35] <jdstrand> that isn't ideal, I realize
[15:36] <jdstrand> an app could check UBUNTU_APPLICATION_ISOLATION=1, and if it is, look in its security manifest to see if it is using the unconfined template
[15:38] <jdstrand> it will be better once we have the query api in place
[15:38] <zbenjamin> hm but the app or scope will not know the name of the apparmor file :/
[15:39] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: we are just supporting click packaged apps for now
[15:39] <jdstrand> tbh, this isn't a use case that was part of the design-- we figured the app developer would know whether s/he chose to use an unconfined template
[15:40] <jdstrand> why does the app need to kinow if it is confined for your use case?
[15:41] <jdstrand> actually, the query api doesn't solve this-- you still have to ask it if a particular path is readable or writable (though it would be much cleaner than doing a readdir and checking the return code)
[15:42] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: not the app, we use a generic helper script to setup the debugging environment (inject gdbserver, redirect stderr and stdout to pipes) , the config file for that has to be in a location it can read, and it of course needs to know where to look at
[15:42] <tseliot> xnox: hi, I'm wondering what was the use case of adding support for scaling the plymouth theme for LP: #1292458
[15:42] <tseliot> *for
[15:43] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: the helper script runs, sets up what we need, and then replaces itself with the app or scope using execv
[15:43] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: I suggest this: write a small library function, eg is_confined(). have it do a readdir on $HOME. if it fails, return 0, if it succeeds, return 1. when the query api is available, you can change is_confined() to use the query api
[15:44] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: awesome :) sounds good enough for me
[15:44] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: this is to be used with the debug policy group?
[15:46] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: the goal is to make this work without the debug policy group and only use it when debugging c++ or qml (release mode vs debug mode)
[15:46] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: but with the debug policy group i can read /home right, so my library call will fail
[15:46] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: that is what I was getting at, yes
[15:47] <jdstrand> the bash abstraction which is #included in the debug policy group has: @{HOMEDIRS}                      r,
[15:47] <jdstrand> so, let's use ${HOME}/.local/share
[15:47] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: that is harder than i thought ;)
[15:49] <jdstrand> that should work fine. click user hooks do stuff in ~/.local/share/click so ~/.local/share is guaranteed to exist if you install a click
[15:49] <jdstrand> if we need to change the path at some point, we can
[15:53] <Saviq> mardy, hey, found an interesting bug in OA as trusted prompts... if I go "Cancel" in the U1 setup, I get the same UI as a standalone app...
[15:54] <Saviq> mardy, one reason seems to be that it has the --desktop_file_hint still, which it shouldn't any more
[15:54] <Saviq> mardy, the other seems to be that it respawns it
[16:16] <alexbligh1> possibly a stupid question, but what is the cleanest way for a package to get its own version number either at build time (I can copy it to an installed file) or in the postinst script?
[16:16] <infinity> rbasak: I'm around now.
[16:16] <rbasak> infinity: on a call. I will ping when done.
[16:17] <infinity> rbasak: Alrighty.
[16:22] <cjwatson> alexbligh1: grub2/debian/rules:deb_version          := $(shell dpkg-parsechangelog | sed -ne "s/^Version: \(.*\)/\1/p")
[16:22] <cjwatson> or anything roughly similar
[16:22] <cjwatson> alexbligh1: in fact, since dpkg 1.17.0, you can use $(shell dpkg-parsechangelog -SVersion)
[16:22] <cjwatson> I should convert my packages to that
[16:23] <alexbligh1> cjwatson, ah that's neater. I was using dpkg-gencontrol -O, which is yucky.
[16:23] <alexbligh1> thx
[16:41] <rbasak> infinity: ping
[16:43] <infinity> rbasak: Hai.
[16:45] <rbasak> So this thing.
[16:45] <rbasak> I found that if I dist-upgrade to my prepared packaging (in my PPA), then apt-get seems to resolve the upgrade to removing mysql-server.
[16:45] <rbasak> And not installing mysql-server-5.6.
[16:45] <rbasak> I can force it by asking for a newer mysql-server.
[16:46] <rbasak> I didn't really see a way round this. A similiar thing must have happened during 5.1->5.5 but I don't see exactly what.
[16:46] <rbasak> However, AFAICT, if apt-get has no visibility of mysql-5.5 generated binary packages, then it is happy to upgrade mysql-server and install mysql-server-5.6 to resolve the situation, which is what we want.
[16:46] <infinity> rbasak: So, this will happen if the resolver thinks the 5.5->5.6 upgrade will remove more packages than just removing mysql-server would do.
[16:46] <rbasak> So, for a one off, it seemed easier to do it that way. But if you can tell me what I should be doing instead, that's fine too.
[16:47] <rbasak> I thought it was something like that.
[16:47] <rbasak> The catch is that we have multiple binary 5.5 packages that should be removed and replaced with different name 5.6 ones.
[16:47] <infinity> This may be a subtle badness in how conflicts are forcing things off, or similar?
[16:47] <rbasak> mysql-server-5.5, mysql-server-core-5.5 off the top of my head.
[16:47] <rbasak> Those would be removed, and 5.6 equivalents would be installed.
[16:47] <infinity> If it's a 1:1 swap, that shouldn't be an issue.  If the dpkg relationships are right.
[16:48] <rbasak> Removing mysql-server is removing just one package, right?
[16:48] <rbasak> And the upgrade involves removing at least two 5.5 server packages.
[16:49] <rbasak> And I do want those two removed.
[16:49] <rbasak> So surely whatever I do, apt-get will favour removing one package over removing two packages?
[16:50] <rbasak> And then once mysql-server is removed, there's nothing to pull in 5.6 even after 5.5 disappears.
[16:53] <infinity> rbasak: You mean upgrading removes 2 net packages?
[16:53] <infinity> rbasak: (ie: install 4, remove 6?)
[16:54] <rbasak> I'm not sure. Let me check.
[16:54] <infinity> rbasak: If so, you can hint apt to DTRT with decent abuse of C/R pairs.  But I'd have to see the specifics to know what's up.
[16:57]  * rbasak digs
[17:02] <rbasak> infinity: it involves installing 5 and removing 4.
[17:03] <rbasak> dist-upgrade wants to remove mysql-server, in total removing 2, installing 1 and upgrading 2.
[17:04] <rbasak> To be complete, for the upgrade it wants to remove 4, install 5 and upgrade 1.
[17:04] <infinity> rbasak: Okay, so it sounds like this is something that package relationships might be able to get slightly more right.
[17:05] <infinity> rbasak: Fundamentally, though, unless you stage your entire transition in a devirt PPA and sync it all at once, we can't do what you're asking for (process NBS before you do the transition), as that breaks the archive.
[17:06] <rbasak> I was asking to process NBS after the new binaries arrive, but before a publisher run.
[17:06] <rbasak> (I know that's unusual, but I couldn't see any other way out)
[17:06] <rbasak> Can you help me with the package relationships please? It's not clear to me what I'm looking for.
[17:08] <rbasak> Thinking about it deeper I can understand how what I was asking for may well be impossible.
[17:09] <infinity> rbasak: Asking me to process NBS after you upload is "before the transition".
[17:09] <infinity> rbasak: As things will still depend on the old binaries, and become uninstallable.
[17:09] <rbasak> OK
[17:10] <infinity> rbasak: Unless there's no new libmysqlclient this time?  That simplifies things a lot.
[17:10] <rbasak> libmysqlclient18 stays and with the same soname. I've just switched it from being built from src:mysql-5.5 to it being built from src:mysql-5.6. So apt-get sees a packaging version bump but nothing else.
[17:11]  * rbasak hopes he checked the other reverse deps, but it was a while ago.
[17:11] <zbenjamin> jdstrand: so i can write anywhere in ~/.local/share ? or in ~/.local/share/packagename
[17:11] <infinity> rbasak: So, for package relationships, the key to apt's view of the world WRT "violent removal" versus "polite removal" is that the polite option needs a Conflict/Replace pair hint, not just a conflict.  If you have a bunch of conflicts, then it assumes all conflicting packages are "equal", and picks the path of least damage.
[17:12] <infinity> rbasak: If one package C/R another, however, it will get a precedence in the preference weights for the purpose of an upgrade calculation.
[17:12] <rbasak> I think I've got mostly B/R rather than C/R, but I do seem to have an R in most things, unless I missed something.
[17:13] <infinity> rbasak: B/R means something entirely different.
[17:13] <infinity> rbasak: B/R means "I overwrite some files from this other thing", C/R means "when I'm installed, this other packages needs to go away".
[17:14] <infinity> rbasak: mysql-5.5 and mysql-5.6 shouldn't break each other (unless, in some version combo, they're coinstallable), they should conflict.
[17:15] <infinity> rbasak: Another way to think about it is that if it's no versioned (and can't be), breaks was probably wrong, and the logical inverse, if you can version it, conflicts is probably wrong.
[17:17] <rbasak> infinity: OK, thanks. I thought Breaks was enough (and I think I inherited this from the original 5.6 packaging). I didn't realise it affected apt's resolution.
[17:17] <infinity> rbasak: Right, so.  A policy re-read might be in order.  Or some nuanced education. ;)
[17:18] <rbasak> I have it up and have been re-reading :)
[17:18] <rbasak> With your explanation I can see how I can interpret policy in the way that you say.
[17:18] <rbasak> I'm not sure it's obvious from just reading it though.
[17:19] <infinity> rbasak: Conflicts means "these two packages can't be installed together".  Breaks means "deconfigure A to install B".  Replaces means "overwrites some files".  B/R means "deconfigure and replace some files" (the best way to replace files, as it won't let you undo the process and lose files mysteriously), C/R means "can't install together and, furthermore, prefer this package always".
[17:19] <Saviq> seb128, hey, I think you've been through this before... is there a script for moving all bugs from project to ubuntu/project?
[17:20] <infinity> rbasak: In the case of two packages that should never coexist, Conflicts is always right.  When one should take precedence over another (ie: a version takeover, or a change or upstreams, etc), the "good" one should C/R instead of just C.
[17:20] <rbasak> OK, got it.
[17:20] <rbasak> So if I change the relevant (I think probably all, but will check) Breaks to Conflicts, apt should do the right thing.
[17:21] <rbasak> I'm >EOD now, so I'll try this tomorrow. Thank you.
[17:21] <rbasak> (and also noted that it's more correct to use Conflicts here, so I'll do that)
[17:21] <infinity> rbasak: One could make some very solid arguments for how all of these states should be different relationships instead of mysterious magic pairs, but it's what we've got to deal with today. :P
[17:21] <rbasak> :)
[17:22] <rbasak> I think I was just reading from a point of view that breaks is less invasive (in general, I see now it's probably not relevant here) and from what I read in policy that breaks would do, so I didn't consider it an issue.
[17:22] <rbasak> I didn't realise that it also affected apt's resolution.
[17:22] <rbasak> Anyway, I get it now. Thanks.
[17:24] <infinity> rbasak: It's possible that even with policy-compliant relationships, the upgrade won't do what you want.  If that end up being the case, point me at your work, and I'll argue with the tools (and mvo) instead of you. :)
[17:26] <shadeslayer> can someone help me with a weird build failiure that I absolutely do not get
[17:26] <shadeslayer> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/183945400/buildlog_ubuntu-trusty-i386.firefox_32.0%2Bbuild1-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS>~ppa1~trusty1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[17:26] <shadeslayer> it only happens on i386 on Trusty
[17:28] <shadeslayer> https://launchpad.net/~rohangarg/+archive/ubuntu/firefox/+sourcepub/4389166/+listing-archive-extra
[17:29] <sarnold> shadeslayer: on a first guess, it looks like the headers may not be protecting themselves against multiple inclusion with the usual #ifndef mangled_header_name #define mangled_header_name .... #endif   trick
[17:29] <shadeslayer> they are not
[17:29] <shadeslayer> sarnold: how would that affect amd64 btw?
[17:30] <sarnold> some projects don't do that, instead they manage their dependencies to avoid it.. dunno what firefox does..
[17:30] <shadeslayer> or for that matter, precise built fine on i386 and amd64, same patches
[17:30] <sarnold> shadeslayer: d'oh, I forgot that bit :(
[17:30] <LocutusOfBorg1> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/183614592/buildlog_ubuntu-trusty-i386.firefox_32.0%2Bbuild1-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS>_UPLOADING.txt.gz
[17:30] <LocutusOfBorg1> seems that the official build succeeded
[17:30] <shadeslayer> LocutusOfBorg1: yes, this is specific to 2 patches that I add
[17:30] <infinity> LocutusOfBorg1: Yeah, the official build lacks the KDE patches that are causing the issue. :)
[17:30] <LocutusOfBorg1> but cris reported a similar build failure https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+bug/1348333
[17:31] <shadeslayer> nah, looks like a different thing
[17:31] <LocutusOfBorg1> ah ok there is a delta :)
[17:31] <shadeslayer> LocutusOfBorg1: yeah :)
[17:32] <shadeslayer> LocutusOfBorg1: specifically these patches : http://www.rosenauer.org/hg/mozilla/file/e4fa9844604e/mozilla-kde.patch & http://www.rosenauer.org/hg/mozilla/file/e4fa9844604e/firefox-kde.patch
[17:33] <LocutusOfBorg1> mozilla-kde.patch
[17:33] <LocutusOfBorg1> firefox-kde.patch
[17:33] <LocutusOfBorg1> yes, I was already looking at them lol
[17:33] <shadeslayer> :)
[17:34] <infinity> shadeslayer: Anyhow, I'd say the class redefinition error is pretty clear.  Why it's only happening on one arch could be any number of things, but maybe that header is conditionally included, or the class conditionally defined, etc.
[17:34] <shadeslayer> that would be very weird
[17:35] <infinity> Have you read the mozilla codebase?
[17:35] <infinity> Weird doesn't begin to describe it.
[17:35] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: if confined, you can neither read nor write to ~/.local/share/, which is why I was saying do (the equivalent of) a readdir()
[17:35] <shadeslayer> infinity: I have
[17:35] <shadeslayer> infinity: unfortunately, you're right :(
[17:35] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: if confined, you can write to ~/.local/share/<name for click manifest>
[17:35] <jdstrand> ~/.local/share/<name from click manifest/*
[17:36] <jdstrand> zbenjamin: ^ (and  ~/.local/share/<name from click manifest/ itself)
[17:36] <LocutusOfBorg1> shadeslayer, mozilla-kde.patch
[17:36] <LocutusOfBorg1> +++ b/uriloader/exthandler/unix/nsCommonRegistry.h
[17:37] <LocutusOfBorg1> there is no #ifdef guard
[17:37] <shadeslayer> yeah
[17:37] <shadeslayer> I think adding ifdef guards is the best way forward here
[17:37] <LocutusOfBorg1> +++ b/uriloader/exthandler/unix/nsCommonRegistry.h
[17:37] <sarnold> shadeslayer: hmmm, http://www.rosenauer.org/hg/mozilla/file/e4fa9844604e/mozilla-kde.patch#l2579
[17:38] <LocutusOfBorg1> also in nsKDERegistry
[17:38] <shadeslayer> sarnold: that's utils
[17:38] <sarnold> this one is missing though http://www.rosenauer.org/hg/mozilla/file/e4fa9844604e/mozilla-kde.patch#l2842
[17:38] <shadeslayer> not registry
[17:38] <sarnold> shadeslayer: ahh d'oh
[17:39] <LocutusOfBorg1> I think I found it
[17:39] <LocutusOfBorg1> +++ b/uriloader/exthandler/unix/nsKDERegistry.cpp
[17:39] <LocutusOfBorg1> there is one +#include "nsKDERegistry.h"
[17:40] <LocutusOfBorg1> also done here
[17:40] <LocutusOfBorg1> +++ b/uriloader/exthandler/unix/nsCommonRegistry.cpp
[17:40] <LocutusOfBorg1> and the last one includes nsKDERegistry.h
[17:40] <LocutusOfBorg1> so it might be repeated here since there is no guard
[17:40] <LocutusOfBorg1> also nsMIMEInfoUnix.cpp includes it
[17:44] <shadeslayer> shouldn't that be fine btw?
[17:44] <shadeslayer> or well, it looks fine to me
[17:45]  * shadeslayer thinks it's a issue with the generated CPP file
[17:45] <shadeslayer> which probably has arch dependent includes and what not
[17:48] <sarnold> just fix up the includes to properly handle multiple inclusions
[17:49] <shadeslayer> sarnold: yeah
[17:50] <shadeslayer> that's what I'm doing
[17:50] <sarnold> shadeslayer: if you figure out why it only errors on x86 and not amd64, I'd be interested to know why :)
[17:50] <sarnold> shadeslayer: but if you just get it fixed that'd make sense, hehe
[17:50] <shadeslayer> sarnold: heh ok, I'll have to do a local build probably
[17:52] <shadeslayer> if I have time, I'll look into it
[18:22] <hallyn> pitti: stgraber: slangasek: tedg: so I do have a concern actually about the upstart-cgroup-phone thing.
[18:23] <hallyn> I was going to make Abandon mean that we set the cgorup remove-on-empty and try to delete it.  But I guess that actually doesn't work for upstart
[18:23] <hallyn> bc if the upstart job has a task still in the cgroup, then we can still have the same race.
[18:23] <hallyn> (alas jodh is gone)
[18:23] <hallyn> the question is can that ever happen - that an upstart job says 'pre-start' or 'start script' is done, but there are stlil tasks running thta are descendents of that job?
[18:23] <tedg> Couldn't it just set it to remove-on-empty and just make it Upstart's job to remove the PIDs?
[18:24] <hallyn> that's not the problem
[18:24] <hallyn> I have StopUnit to kill the tasks, I'm happy with that
[18:24] <hallyn> but by default we use Abandon.  So if a task remains in the upstart job's cgroup, then it could still exit - causing autoremove of the cgroup - after the post-stop has created the cgroup but before it exec'd the tasks
[18:25] <hallyn> so, until i hear from jodh (or someone else) that upstart wlil ensure that all job tasks are done at the end of pre-start etc,
[18:25] <hallyn> i wont set remove-on-empty
[18:25] <hallyn> i'll just delete, and if it wasn't empty, well, it won't be removed.
[18:26] <tedg> For the UAL case (which is the one I care about) we try and ensure that all the processes are removed.
[18:26] <tedg> I'd honestly rather just be able to set a flag that says if PIDs are left, kill them.
[18:26] <hallyn> ok, then i will do the remove-on-empty.  if you end up having trouble after al, then we can remove it
[18:26] <tedg> So it would call RemoveUnit at the end of the instance.
[18:26] <hallyn> well you have htat 'flag', only systemwide
[18:27] <hallyn> (KillUserProcesses in /etc/systemd/logind.conf)
[18:50] <hallyn> desrt_: so using /usr/share/dbus-1/system-services/org.freedesktop.systemd1.service we can register Name=org.freedesktop.systemd1 as a path for which we are started when there is activity.  can we do the same at runtime (only until reboot)?
[18:58] <seb128> Saviq, bdmurray has something for that iirc
[19:01] <Saviq> seb128, almost got there myself, thanks :)
[19:35] <bdmurray> pitti: do you have any ideas about bug 1365079?
[19:42] <bdmurray> pitti: I'm not positive how to proceed.
[21:42] <doko> cjwatson, looking at the coreutils autopkg test failures. there are now a lot more, and I don't know if just disabling these is the right thing to do. It might be better to build a coreutils-test package including the config.h and test binaries like getlimits and ginstall
[23:19] <catbus1> Hi, I don't see Ubuntu 14.04.2 release date on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TrustyTahr/ReleaseSchedule, is there a plan to update this page with the upcoming point release schedule info?


[03:59] <HacKDarK> hola...
[11:47] <popey> tsimpson: is that documented on the wiki somewhere?
[12:34] <jussi01> popey: refering to the ops question?
[12:34] <popey> yes
[12:35] <jussi01> !gudelines | popey
[12:35] <jussi01> !guidelines | popey
[12:35] <jussi01> its there
[12:36] <popey> so it is
[12:36] <popey> its always struck me as a bizarre system
[12:36] <jussi01> popey: why so?
[12:36] <popey> it's somewhat cabal-like
[12:37] <jussi01> popey: care to elaborate some?
[12:39] <popey> it lends itself to allowing a group of people to grant access to people via a closed system of selection, and if your face doesn't fit, you're not allowed in
[12:39] <popey> the whole 'dont ask for ops' has been around for years on irc (not just in Ubuntu) I appreciate that, but I feel uneasy about it in Ubuntu
[12:42] <jussi01> popey: while selection process may need review, (and imho everything should be reviewed, even if it doesnt change) - I dont think the "dont ask for ops" part of it is a problem.
[12:42] <popey> but it's an anomoly
[12:42] <popey> we don't have that policy elsewhere
[12:42] <popey> we don't say "don't ask to be an ubuntu member", "dont ask to be on the loco council", "dont ask to be a motu".. etc
[12:43] <popey> I'm of course not suggesting anyone who asks should get ops, that would be daft.
[12:43] <jussi01> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1252895
[12:44] <popey> it doesnt happen in loco channels that I'm aware of, only core channels?
[12:47] <jussi01> loco channels are free to appoint ops in their own way, as I understand it.
[12:48] <jpds> jussi01: Well, it should be: "Can I be a moderator?", "No, because of x, y, z".
[12:50] <popey> IMO an application process (akin to membership) whereby applicats can provide details of their contribution on their wiki page would be more sane than just saying "no".
[12:51] <jpds> So if someone asks: "Can I be an op" (because they're new to IRC or whatever), we review them, and then say: "No/Yes, because of c, b, a".
[12:51] <jpds> popey += 1
[12:52] <Pici> popey: Thats sane, but the procedure should be across the board then, for forums and IRC.
[12:52] <popey> That would seem sane too Pici
[12:53] <Pici> (funny that the first thing I say today is sane and I havent even had my caffeine yet)
[12:54] <nalioth> Pici: so really, it's insane?
[12:54]  * nalioth runs
[12:56] <arand> Should really the #ubuntu-proxy-users kick in when using the freenode webchat?
[13:02] <Pici> arand: Is there a reason it shouldnt?
[13:05] <arand> Pici: hm, maybe not, I just guessed that with the webchat the issues of abuse would not be as severe... ?
[13:10] <Pici> arand: Using the forward ensures that if we ban someone when they aren't using the webchat that they cannot circumvent that by using it.
[13:19] <arand> Pici: Ah, ok fair enough, thnaks for the info
[18:27] <popey> what do I have to do to request a kline around here?
[18:28] <popey> specifically in -uk
[18:30] <Pici> popey: klines are network wide, is this something thats happening just in -uk and cannot be handled with just a ban?
[18:31] <popey> AIUI it happens in other channels I am not an op of
[18:31] <popey> I believe Gary is aware of it
[18:33] <Pici> popey: Can you describe what the issue is?
[18:34] <niko> xcdfgkjhgcv is the issue
[18:35] <popey> a user who was previously known as Samuel-AFK or Samuel-NotAFK has been rude, sexist and offensive in -uk for many months. He returned with a nick which was usually xcd*
[18:35] <popey> refuses to accept that he has been previously kicked/banned
[18:35] <popey> keeps coming back
[18:35] <Pici> Oh.. that guy.
[18:35] <popey> i have attempted to have normal social discourse with the person, and have even provided ubuntu related assistance to him in the recent past, but he keeps coming back and exhibiting the same behaviour
[18:36] <Pici> xcdfgkjhgcv<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[18:36] <popey> he is also on 86-159-13-3.range86-159.btcentralplus.com
[18:37] <popey> i need to pop off and bath my kids.. back in a bit.
[19:17] <ubot2> jonasbjork called the ops in #ubuntu-se ()
[19:19] <Neuromancer_> how to get an ubuntu cloak?
[19:21] <niko> !member
[19:21] <Neuromancer_> thanks
[19:53] <Pici> popey: I'm a bit busy at the moment, but the same user that you're talking about has also been a problem in the core ubuntu channels.  I've asked to see if one of the other ircc members can put something together so that we can see if freenode staff can take a look for us.
[19:58] <popey> thanks Pici
[21:37] <ikonia> popey: are you there ?
[21:41] <popey> i am
[21:41] <ikonia> hello  popey good new
[21:41] <ikonia> news
[21:41] <popey> oh?
[21:41] <ikonia> I've had samual banned from his schools network - he was using a proxy of an educational network I put in (or part of it) so I know the process to complain to the administrators
[21:42] <popey> hah
[21:42] <ikonia> I'm also in the process of writing a hand written letter to his head teacher which will be hand delivered to his school as he goes to a school which is about 5 minutes drive from one of my clients at the moment
[21:42] <ikonia> so I'll be dopping in a letter to his head teacher to share with his parents, including snippets of his comments
[21:42] <popey> that's over and abovethe call of duty ikonia
[21:42] <ikonia> well.......I like to deliver
[21:43] <popey> thats very much appreciated
[21:43] <ikonia> I'm happy to waste 30 minutes of my day to walk down to his school
[21:43] <ikonia> plus I can then speak to the head teacher and explain it's not just missuse, I'm sure his parents would be delighted to know their childs behaviour


[01:42] <rick_h> huwshimi: morning
[01:42] <rick_h> huwshimi: how goes?
[02:02] <huwshimi> rick_h: Hey good thanks. Have you travelled already?
[02:05] <rick_h> huwshimi: yea, traveled and gone out for the night and back
[02:05] <rick_h> huwshimi: I'd like to setup a time to chat. I had to pull the breadcrumb stuff in the process of trying to get the home button stuff landed for friday late.
[02:06] <rick_h> huwshimi: I think we can work on getting it back in and supported globally in a bit, but wanted to give you the heads up on why it was pulled out for now
[02:06] <huwshimi> rick_h: OK
[02:06] <rick_h> huwshimi: sorry for the quick change without discussing. Not usually how I'd like to do that kind of thing.
[02:07] <huwshimi> rick_h: It's all good.
[02:08] <rick_h> huwshimi: cool
[02:09] <huwshimi> rick_h: Well, in that I'm not the stakeholder here :)
[02:10] <rick_h> yea, I wanted to give you the heads up though and let you know that I want to help get it back in and such. Felt a bit rude in a friday rush to yank it. :P
[02:11] <huwshimi> rick_h: No, it's all fine, really.
[12:58] <gary_poster> alejandraobregon, luca, bcsaller has a demo of bars and icons on deployed services, replacing the current pie chart.  We are wondering whether to try and land that as default--without the inspector.  The downside is that it really only makes sense with the inspector as is, because unit counts are not included.  bcsaller added unit counts but they are teeny teeny tiny in the given (designed) bar size.  do you have a moment to look
[12:58] <gary_poster>  at his branch and give some thoughts on whether we should land it for OSCON (pre-inspector)?
[13:00] <hatch> Makyo, https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-gui/+bug/1201416
[13:07] <alejandraobregon> gary_poster: hi gary... we're at a meeting right now, we'll take a look once we're out (cc.luca)
[13:07] <gary_poster> cool thanks luca
[13:26] <rick_h> jujugui review please https://codereview.appspot.com/11276043 sinzui jcsackett as well
[14:17] <luca> gary_poster: Hi Gary, the bar is meant to represent an action point, it's meant to get you to the inspector. Unit counts aren't really needed at this view just now, they might come into play for us when we have a progressive zoom but it's meant to just move users on.
[14:17] <luca> bcsaller: ^
[14:18] <bcsaller> luca: its a little funny to have to open the inspector to see how many units there are, but I'm fine with it for now
[14:18] <bcsaller> turning labels on is easy enough, or including a hover state unit count some other way is fine too
[14:21] <gary_poster> luca, bcsaller +1 on what bcsaller said, though to clarify, IIUC you are saying that the bar change does not make sense to you without the inspector at least without further discussion?  If we had a unit count indicator I would feel it would be fine
[14:23] <luca> gary_poster: bcsaller the pie chart has always tested really badly, we're interested in moving on from it. It works better than the pie chart irrespective if we have the inspector or not. Unit count isn't really important, it's nice to know your unit count but generally you should know roughly how many units you have on a service in your environment (if its large, medium or small). What we want to do is direct people.
[14:23] <bcsaller> ahh, I'd also removed the unit scaling, but we could put that back in. I like it w/o but sounds like you still expect the block to scale with unit size?
[14:24] <luca> gary_poster: bcsaller It also is really hard to design solution which can handle a text input of 10 or 10,000. We need a nice big dedicated space for it, we don't really have that kind of flexibility. Not until we redesign the service block completely and look at power tools.
[14:24]  * bcsaller is eager for that
[14:24] <luca> bcsaller: we actually don't want the blocks to scale with unit...
[14:24] <bcsaller> ok, good, I thought that as well
[14:24] <bcsaller> I like it better w/o
[14:24] <luca> :)
[14:27] <gary_poster> luca, bcsaller, ok, so we want the bar + icon, without unit count and without block scaling, before the inspector?
[14:28] <bcsaller> those icons are pretty nice ;)
[14:28] <gary_poster> That's what I understand, in which case, let's get your branch reviewed and landed bcsaller :-)
[14:28] <gary_poster> agreed
[14:28] <bcsaller> its proposed
[14:28] <luca> bcsaller: gary_poster do you have the assets for the bar? etc
[14:28] <gary_poster> I saw
[14:28] <gary_poster> luca we didn't think we needed any assets :-)
[14:28] <bcsaller> luca: no, I render an animated bar with d3
[14:30] <luca> bcsaller: gary_poster ah, cool :)
[14:30] <luca> gary_poster: bcsaller Then I look forward to seeing it! hehe
[14:30] <gary_poster> cool, thanks luca.  :-) I had a few pending questions for you...lemme see if I can find them
[14:31] <gary_poster> luca, right one easy question, one hard :-)
[14:31] <gary_poster> We don't have the jujucharms.com switch of the log out
[14:31] <gary_poster> button to...what was it? Maybe we can squeeze that in, if you can
[14:31] <gary_poster> remind me of the plan.
[14:31] <gary_poster> luca ^^^ that was #1
[14:31] <gary_poster> the easy one :-)
[14:31] <gary_poster> hard one:
[14:32] <gary_poster> can you share plans for any of the following inspector bits yet:
[14:32] <gary_poster> - making a relation
[14:32] <gary_poster> - moves of expose and delete per MS
[14:33] <gary_poster> moves of constraints per MS
[14:33] <gary_poster> ?
[14:33] <gary_poster> luca ^^^ that was #2
[14:33] <gary_poster> the hard one
[14:34] <luca> gary_poster: When do you guys need them? I've been watching the user testing today. I know you'll need them asap but whens the uber cut off date?
[14:35] <gary_poster> luca, for #1, today if at all possible.  for #2, tomorrow would be ideal, wed still maybe ok
[14:35] <luca> gary_poster: #1 the button should say "Get Juju"
[14:36] <luca> gary_poster:  and link to https://juju.ubuntu.com/get-started/
[14:36] <gary_poster> awesome thanks luca
[14:36] <luca> gary_poster: no worries, I'll get to work on #2 :)
[14:37] <gary_poster> cool thanks again :-)
[14:37] <Makyo> bcsaller, lp:~makyo/juju-gui/unit-view
[14:59] <hatch> jujugui could i get a quick review on https://codereview.appspot.com/11283043/  plz
[15:50] <Makyo> jujugui call in 10 kanban now :)
[16:05] <teknico> then again, maybe not? :-)
[16:45] <luca> arosales: Am I correct in thinking that not all charms will get a charm rating?
[16:46] <luca> jcastro:
[16:46] <luca> jcastro: ^^
[16:47] <arosales> luca, correct we are just shooting for all featured, popular, and one charm/category
[16:47] <luca> arosales: I see
[16:47] <luca> arosales: I'm requesting the copy writer should write a message for it
[16:47] <jcastro> luca: they should all have one
[16:47] <jcastro> all new ones will
[16:47] <arosales> luca, I think it currently states
[16:47] <arosales> Quality Rating:
[16:47] <arosales> This charm does not have a Quality Rating
[16:47] <arosales> It will be rated soon.
[16:48] <jcastro> but like personal ones I doubt people will care about
[16:48] <arosales> jcastro, are you saying all reviewed charms will have a rating by week end
[16:48] <luca> arosales: The current message says that it will be rated soon
[16:48] <luca> arosales: It would be nicer to have it more personable
[16:48] <jcastro> arosales: no
[16:49] <arosales> luca, for "reviewed" charms it should have a rating soon
[16:49] <jcastro> all charms from now on going in should
[16:49] <arosales> jcastro, ok I was confused by, "they should all have one."
[16:49] <luca> jcastro: arosales I see, so maybe it's not so important
[16:49] <arosales> luca, so to summerize
[16:49] <jcastro> they are supposed to have one
[16:49] <jcastro> the thing is when we decided the ratings we already had like 100 some charms in the store
[16:49] <jcastro> so they should have one, but the reality backlog is different than what we really want
[16:49] <arosales> 1. all featured, popular, and one charm/category will have a rating by week end
[16:50] <jcastro> hey sinzui
[16:50] <jcastro> http://uistage.jujucharms.com:8086/fullscreen/precise/ceph-13/
[16:50] <arosales> 2. All reviewed charm ~should~ have a rating, and that is a work in progress but won't be done before OSCON
[16:50] <jcastro> do we really need the revision control in the URL?
[16:50] <jcastro> the "ceph-13"
[16:50] <arosales> luca, ^ does that make sense?
[16:51] <luca> arosales: yes :)
[16:51] <luca> arosales: thank you
[16:53] <arosales> luca: if you look at logs I also confirmed non-reviewed charms have the correct wording "Only reviewed charms have a quality rating"
[17:15] <rick_h> jcastro: yes we do
[17:21] <jcastro> rick_h: can we make something like /current then or something?
[17:21] <jcastro> I can't expect we'd get good google juice on ceph-13
[17:21] <jcastro> and then people pass around ceph-14
[17:21] <jcastro> and so on
[17:22] <abentley> sinzui: https://code.launchpad.net/~abentley/charmworld/store-data-on-enqueue/+merge/174827
[17:23] <rick_h> jcastro: I'd think so myself, but would want to work that through the guys working on getting things to support multiple versions
[17:24] <jcastro> who would that be?
[17:25] <rick_h> jcastro: sinzui and gary_poster probably need to chat.
[17:33] <gary_poster> jcastro, I want the default urls to be without versions.  However, we will want versions to exist and work.  Right now we are in a weird in-between land in which, for instance, juju-gui-GHJGJHG takes you to the same info as juju-gui-66 and the same info as juju-gui-0; but juju-gui takes you to the same info as juju-0.  Not ideal.  I want specified versions to take you to the right info; unspecified versions to take you to the new
[17:33] <gary_poster> est info; and internal links and urls to generally use the unspecified versions.
[17:37] <rick_h> jujugui jcsackett https://codereview.appspot.com/11271045 for the home button being non-stupid :)
[17:38] <jcastro> gary_poster: yeah I am just saying when users want to share the URL etc it shouldn't care about the version
[17:38] <jcsackett> rick_h: ack.
[17:38] <gary_poster> jcastro, on the same page
[17:38] <jcastro> if we do like a /current or whatever that's fine, as long as the canonical url doesn't change
[17:38] <jcastro> I mean canonical as in the URL namespace, not our employer, heh
[17:38] <gary_poster> :-)
[17:43] <jcastro> I have all sorts of dumb URL questions but I'll just bother rick_h later since you guys are sprinting
[17:43] <jcastro> unless he's sprinting with you
[17:45]  * rick_h waves at jcastro from N.C.
[17:45] <rick_h> :P
[17:47] <jcastro> heh
[17:48] <sinzui> jcastro, as a ~charmer I believe you can do help with this. otherwise I can ask webops to helps us: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5878176/
[17:49] <jcsackett> rick_h: http://cdn.fd.uproxx.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/Oprahs-Bees.gif
[17:50] <jcastro> sinzui: what would you like me to do?
[17:51] <sinzui> I think you are one of the few that have permission to add a series. /me cannot see the URL
[17:56] <jcastro> oh
[17:56] <jcastro> ok so should I try to make one?
[17:56] <sinzui> jcastro, yes please
[17:58] <jcastro> https://launchpad.net/charms/bundles
[17:58] <jcastro> \o/
[17:59] <sinzui> thank you very much jcastro
[18:16] <bac> hazmat: can you explain relationship weights in deployer?
[18:20] <hazmat> bac no :-) that's legacy format imo. it was an  odd syntax for ordering. simpler one is just a list
[18:21] <hazmat> bac, see configs/*yaml
[18:21] <hazmat> for the altenrate forms
[18:21]  * hazmat watches juju-core test suite bring his laptop to its knees.
[18:24] <bac> hazmat: sorry, but where are these configs/*yaml?
[18:25] <hazmat> bac lp:juju-deployer/darwin
[18:25] <hazmat> configs dir in that branch
[18:25] <hazmat> bac,  what are you trying to do?
[18:27] <hazmat> bac forwarded some docs on the different forms .. its also in doc/config.rst in that branch
[18:27] <bac> hazmat: adding ability to fetch configs by url, e.g. -c http://...
[18:27] <hazmat> cool
[18:27] <bac> hazmat: so, if we're making changes to deployer should we be using darwin?
[18:28] <hazmat> bac, yeah
[18:28] <bac> good to know
[18:28] <hazmat> bac, the goal is to have it merged to trunk this week (with py compat) rather than trying to keep a separate series
[18:29] <bac> hazmat: k
[19:01] <marcoceppi> Hey guys, there's a charm that was recently promulgated, but the icon isn't showing up http://manage.jujucharms.com/charms/precise/openvpn-as
[19:01] <marcoceppi> Is this a known issue or should I open a bug?
[19:08] <jcastro> the icon was there this morning btw
[19:16] <sinzui> abentley, review? https://code.launchpad.net/~sinzui/charmworld/bundle-api-1/+merge/174837
[19:32] <rick_h> marcoceppi: icon is showing right now?
[19:37] <rick_h> hatch: https://www.google.com/search?site=imghp&tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1364&bih=659&q=w700ds&oq=w700ds&gs_l=img.3..0j0i24l6.1944.3345.0.34<IP_ADDRESS>.<IP_ADDRESS>.684.1j3j1.5.0...0.0.0..1ac.1.17.img.KQJmcASAcqQ
[19:37] <rick_h> bah, "I will shorten urls...I will shorten urls"
[20:03] <bcsaller> hatch: the wip is here: lp:~bcsaller/juju-gui/header-slot
[20:11] <sinzui> Makyo, chrome://settings/languages
[20:46] <jcsackett> jujugui: can i get two reviews on https://codereview.appspot.com/11301043
[20:47] <jcsackett> i have to run; if it's all green i'll land tonight, if it's not all good i'll address concerns before tomorrow morning.
[20:54] <BradCrittenden> hazmat: trivial merge to deployer/darwin to get tests to work: https://code.launchpad.net/~bac/juju-deployer/darwin-test-fix/+merge/174862
[20:57] <rick_h> Makyo: lp:~rharding/charmworld/icon-api
[21:18] <bac> thanks hazmat.  can you merge it in now?  :)
[21:29] <benji> hazmat: I have a small deployer branch up for review that I think you've heard rumors of ealier today: https://code.launchpad.net/~benji/juju-deployer/add-fetching-configs/+merge/174869
[21:45] <hazmat> benji, thanks
[21:45] <benji> hazmat: that branch also has bac's test fix in it, so if you want to save a merge you can just do mine ;)
[21:46] <hazmat> benji, can you propose it to the lp:juju-deployer/darwin series
[21:46] <benji> hazmat: hmm, I thought I did, let me check
[21:47] <benji> darn; resubmitting...
[21:50] <benji> hazmat: there you go
[21:51] <hazmat> benji, cool, i'll pick it up before i eod.
[21:52] <benji> awesome
[22:59] <huwshimi> Morning


[00:12] <purencool> Is there away to save the package list that is installed on my system. So when I do a reinstall I can go to that list and deploy with out trying to remembering what was installed before?
[00:14] <jea> I would start with this http://superuser.com/questions/48374/find-all-user-installed-packages
[00:17] <purencool> ta
[00:49] <purencool> dpkg --get-selections | sed 's/\t.*//' > packages-list.txt
[00:51] <jea> nice and simple
[00:53] <purencool> I only want the packages  like Apache Gimp etc.  Will this add  packages that are out of date because I mentioned them in the txt file?
[00:54] <jea> um, if you just get the package names without versions, then it will install the latest version
[00:58] <purencool> Cool that is  what I want. I am sick of trying to remember what I use in my  development chain. I am going to make bash script after a clean install  that does the bulk of the work. Opt is my next issue thanks
[06:52] <tonph> hi any one home ?
[06:52] <jea> there are some people here
[06:53] <tonph> hi... just need a help.. on setting up bluetooth in delln4010, ubuntu 14 64 bit..
[06:54] <tonph> in case you guys have some idea..!!
[06:54] <jea> I can't say I have dealt with bluetooth setup for a while
[06:55] <jea> Have you tried the people in #ubuntu at all?
[06:55] <jea> because they might know more
[06:55] <tonph> yeah I tried, but looks like nope..
[06:55] <jea> hmm
[06:56] <tonph> or may be no ppl are not yet in the room at this time... :)
[06:56] <jea> could be
[06:56] <jea> what is the issue in general?
[06:57] <tonph> its like , I have dell n4010 laptop, with ubuntu 14 64 bit. and I want to set up my bluetooth in my box..
[06:58] <tonph> my homework says, it needs windows driver to make it work.. now I dont have any windows with me and its been long time i used windows too..
[06:58] <tonph> opening my bluetooth app, says no adapter found
[06:59] <tonph> lsusb result has this entry : Bus 001 Device 008: ID 0a5c:4500 Broadcom Corp. BCM2046B1 USB 2.0 Hub (part of BCM2046 Bluetooth)
[07:00] <jea> right
[07:00] <jea> looking online, people seem to be saying a broadcom 365 chipset
[07:02] <tonph> yeah smthing like that,, i tried installing many bunches of software including reinstalling bluez-utils , but no luck
[07:04] <tonph> http://paste.ubuntu.com/8477463/, ths is my lshw
[07:05] <jea> does lsusb contain anything about Dell Wireless 365 Bluetooth?
[07:06] <tonph> http://paste.ubuntu.com/8477473/, i think 365 is not there..
[07:07] <jea> what version kernel and bluez do you have installed?
[07:08] <tonph> kernel is : Linux ayuk-Inspiron-N4010 3.13.0-36-generic #63-Ubuntu SMP Wed Sep 3 21:30:07 UTC 2014 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
[07:10] <tonph> let me try to find the bluez version, cmd not working...
[07:11] <tonph> looks like this 4.101-0ubuntu13
[07:11] <tonph> m not sure, but tried this dpkg --status bluez | grep '^Version:'
[07:12] <jea> ok
[07:12] <tonph> yeah its true, bluetoothd -v = gets me that version too
[07:14] <tonph> m checking this https://help.ubuntu.com/community/HardwareSupportComponentsWirelessNetworkCardsBroadcom, may help me..
[07:14] <jea> what does `rfkill list` show?
[07:14] <tonph> 0: phy0: Wireless LAN
[07:14] <tonph> Soft blocked: no
[07:14] <tonph> Hard blocked: no
[07:15] <tonph> 0: phy0: Wireless LAN \n Soft blocked: no \n Hard blocked: no ; this only
[07:15] <jea> right
[07:15] <jea> so nothing about bluetooth at all
[07:16] <tonph> yes .. :(
[07:16] <jea> https://ask.fedoraproject.org/en/question/34791/no-bluetooth-adapters-found-broadcom-bcm2046b1-or-dell-wireless-365-bluetooth/
[07:16] <jea> that is fedora, but they seemed to have it appear
[07:16] <tonph> lspci -vvnn | grep 14e4 => 03:00.0 Network controller [0280]: Broadcom Corporation BCM4313 802.11bgn Wireless Network Adapter [14e4:4727] (rev 01)
[07:16] <tonph> ok, let me check
[07:17] <jea> someone else mentioned that they had the bluetooth not work until they booted into windows and then enabled it
[07:17] <jea> do you have a hardware button to enable/disable bluetooth?
[07:17] <jea> or bios stuff?
[07:18] <tonph> yes- that is the thing haunting my mind, if i  dnt have windows then no chance of waking up my bluetooth, was thinking that
[07:18] <tonph> then I started searching the work around until i landed here :)
[07:21] <jea> yeah
[07:21] <jea> i am wondering if it is something to do with being disabled
[07:22] <jea> someone else managed to get it to work by making a winxp virtual machine, connecting the bluetooth device as a usb device to the VM, then installing drivers in the VM
[07:22] <jea> but that is a long way to go to get something working
[07:22] <tonph> yes - its a long way ..
[07:24] <tonph> just a trace of command bluetood - http://paste.ubuntu.com/8477541/
[07:29] <jea> not too sure what to suggest sorry
[07:30] <jea> it sort of sounds like you might have to see if it still works in windows
[07:30] <tonph> not a prob , still thanks for the time..
[07:30] <jea> a VM will probably be enough for that
[07:30] <tonph> i dnt have windows as of now, I have debian wheezy on kvm on top of my ubuntu
[07:31] <tonph> let me do some more home work and check if my hardware is pretty old to be supported or where is the bug.. thnx
[07:31] <jea> i suspect if it doesn't work in ubuntu, then it won't work in debian
[07:31] <jea> possibly something like fedora would give a different result, but I am not too sure
[07:32] <tonph> ok.. let me do some more experiments....
[07:35] <tonph> thanks jea - got to run; catch u later.. tc
[07:35] <jea> no worries
[07:35] <jea> hope you get it sorted
[07:35] <tonph> thnx - tc


[09:50] <vbaraol> hi
[20:43] <xu-irc25w> Trying to install Xubuntu 22.04 Jammy on HP Pro laptop from USB drive. When install was complete, and I was prompted to restart, I expected to see a prompt to remove USB, but instead the laptop did restart right away, and I saw there was a problem. Saw: Error in communicating with TMP chip. I did try installing again, this time removing USB drive
[20:43] <xu-irc25w> before restarting, but still saw problem. Something like: please install os on your hard drive. I was running Mint before on the laptop. Any suggestions? Thanks.
[20:47] <tomreyn> xu-irc25w: enable "tpm" or "ftpm" in bios, or disable "secure boot"
[20:47] <tomreyn> if "tpm" or "ftpm" is already enabled, then try disabling it
[20:48] <tomreyn> also consider a bios upgrade
[20:51] <xu-irc25w> Okay, thanks, tomreyn.
[20:53] <tomreyn> xu-irc25w: oh and also make sure you're using the latest 22.04.x installer
[20:54] <tomreyn> that's 22.04.2
[20:54] <tomreyn> available at https://xubuntu.org/download/
[20:57] <xu-irc25w> I believe I am using the latest. Thanks.


[03:27] <zillah> hi all
[03:28] <DoubleB> hello
[03:28] <zillah> yo
[03:28] <DoubleB> I guess we should get on irc while the gov allows us to :P
[03:29] <zillah> yes tonight i'm that guy...the one that tries to install his os 10 mins before time to get on irc
[03:29] <zillah> lol
[03:29] <zillah> they gonna shut us down eh?
[03:30] <zillah> say wikileaks three times fast
[03:30] <zillah> beastie did you forget who I am?
[03:31] <zillah> oops ww
[04:03] <DoubleB> anyone here?
[04:03] <zillah> usually az7 at least speaks up


[18:44] <dhillon-v10> hello everyone
[18:44] <dhillon-v10> Is anyone there
[18:45] <j1mc> hi dhillon-v10
[18:45] <dhillon-v10> how can I help
[18:45] <j1mc> :)
[18:45] <dhillon-v10> I am new and having trouble with navigating here
[18:45] <j1mc> sure - no problem
[18:45] <j1mc> what version of ubuntu do you use?
[18:45] <dhillon-v10> 9.04
[18:45] <dhillon-v10> I know a lot about programming
[18:46] <dhillon-v10> my stuff is in Computer Vision
[18:46] <j1mc> I'm not familiar with Computer Vision - what is it?
[18:46] <dhillon-v10> It is the art of making computer see what we humans can using solid mathematics
[18:46] <dhillon-v10> like face detection
[18:47] <j1mc> wow, cool
[18:47] <dhillon-v10> yah my question is that when  I get here do I just start typing and talking
[18:47] <j1mc> most of the ubuntu documentation is desktop-focused, would that interest you?
[18:47] <dhillon-v10> yes sure
[18:47] <dhillon-v10> I am learning about it as well
[18:47] <j1mc> or would you be interested in working on the server docs?
[18:47] <dhillon-v10> I wouldn't mind either
[18:48] <dhillon-v10> I am familiar with both
[18:48] <dhillon-v10> :)
[18:48] <j1mc> ok... are you familiar with docbook at all, or would you be willing to learn?
[18:48] <dhillon-v10> no I would like to learn thanks
[18:49] <dhillon-v10> about docbook
[18:49] <j1mc> sure - that's the xml-based markup language that we use to write the docs.
[18:49] <j1mc> have you had a look at the doc team wiki page yet?
[18:49] <dhillon-v10> Yes
[18:50] <dhillon-v10> I have learned to use most of the software from the wiki pages
[18:51] <j1mc> i'd recommend grabbing the doc team bzr branch: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/SystemDocumentation/Repository/
[18:51] <j1mc> and having a look at how things are set up.
[18:51] <dhillon-v10> alright I have bzr installed
[18:51] <j1mc> i'd also recommend sending a note to the doc team mailing list, if you haven't already
[18:52] <j1mc> just let them know that you're interested in helping out
[18:52] <dhillon-v10> Alright, I didn't know it was that easy
[18:52] <j1mc> before you do that, though, you might want to skim through some of the different topic sections...
[18:52] <j1mc> see which one interests you
[18:52] <dhillon-v10> Thanks a bunch
[18:52] <j1mc> with your background and interests, i think you might find the server docs to be most engaging
[18:53] <j1mc> as they are more technically oriented, of course
[18:53] <dhillon-v10> I also would like to know your email so I can talk to you later on
[18:53] <j1mc> dhillon-v10: sure -<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[18:53] <dhillon-v10> mine is<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[18:53] <dhillon-v10> Its easy to make friends
[18:53] <dhillon-v10> :)
[18:53] <j1mc> dhillon-v10: if you want to work on server docs, i would recommend being in touch with Adam Sommer
[18:54] <dhillon-v10> who is that?
[18:54] <j1mc> if you want to work on the desktop docs, i would recommend being in touch with Phil Bull or Matthew East
[18:54] <j1mc> Adam Sommer leads up the server docs
[18:54] <j1mc> Phil and Matthew lead up the desktop docs
[18:54] <j1mc> I work mostly on Xubuntu docs
[18:54] <dhillon-v10> how do you know so much
[18:54] <j1mc> i've been around a while :)
[18:55] <dhillon-v10> I just got to know about this irc thing yesterday
[18:55] <j1mc> :)
[18:55] <dhillon-v10> so please bear with me
[18:55] <dhillon-v10> :)
[18:56] <dhillon-v10> I have made my own project for imaging
[18:56] <dhillon-v10> procedures
[18:56] <j1mc> i think some developers think documentation is a lesser task, but it is important for users, and i think that knowing how to write good docs will make you a better developer
[18:56] <j1mc> at least knowing the basic skills, techniques, and concepts
[18:56] <dhillon-v10> Yah if you know what you are doing writing it just helps more
[18:57] <dhillon-v10> I am a teenager but I have a solid background in programming
[18:57] <j1mc> dhillon-v10: that's great
[18:58] <j1mc> nhandler is also a teenager who does development and documentation
[18:58] <dhillon-v10> hey what about all the other people in this room
[18:58] <dhillon-v10> are they all developers/
[19:00] <j1mc> no, most are just documentors, but some do development, too
[19:00] <dhillon-v10> so you would like me to download the bzr branch for documentation then change it and later push it back...
[19:01] <j1mc> dhillon-v10: no need to change it for now... and you would need to submit a patch in order to push something back.  we don't give everyone "commit" rights right away
[19:01] <j1mc> just look through it, and see what area you want to work on
[19:01] <dhillon-v10> oh I get it
[19:02] <dhillon-v10> how do I submit a patch
[19:02] <j1mc> and let us know, "hey, i'd like to work on the topics in section X"
[19:02] <j1mc> as for patches...
[19:02] <j1mc> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/SystemDocumentation/Submitting
[19:02] <j1mc> if you can't find the info you need on the wiki, let us know. :)
[19:03] <dhillon-v10> I would like to add some docs to OpenCV
[19:03] <dhillon-v10> Most people find it extremely hard to install but it is present in Synaptic
[19:03] <j1mc> what is opencv?
[19:04] <dhillon-v10> It is an amazing free set of library that lets users accomplish computer vision tasks easily and there is something that needs to be changed like OpenMP integration
[19:04] <dhillon-v10> It isn't present by defauly
[19:04] <dhillon-v10> * default
[19:05] <dhillon-v10> Can you help
[19:05] <j1mc> ok - for that kind of thing, you can contribute docs about that on the ubuntu wiki, or you can contribute directly to the documentation for that particular application
[19:06] <dhillon-v10> Oh that would be great but will that reach to most people
[19:06] <j1mc> but info on how to install one kind of obscure application wouldn't really belong in the ubuntu system docs
[19:06] <dhillon-v10> oh it isn't the installation
[19:06] <j1mc> well, install or use...
[19:06] <dhillon-v10> it is the integration of OpenMP
[19:07] <dhillon-v10> I think I understand now :)
[19:07] <j1mc> yeah, that kind of stuff would probably be best on the site for OpenCV or OpenMP
[19:07] <dhillon-v10> alright thanks
[19:07] <j1mc> sure, no problem
[19:07] <dhillon-v10> Can you give me a link for different channels
[19:08] <j1mc> #ubuntu-devel is for development
[19:08] <j1mc> #ubuntu-server is for the server and server development
[19:09] <dhillon-v10> alright
[19:09] <dhillon-v10> So what do you contribute a lot
[19:09] <dhillon-v10> to the community
[19:09] <dhillon-v10> I didn't mean to write what
[19:09] <dhillon-v10> typo
[19:10] <j1mc> i contribute a fair amount, but i've been pretty tied up with a day job lately, so not as much lately
[19:11] <dhillon-v10> Oh you work, lucky me I have my summer vacation
[19:11] <j1mc> :)
[19:11] <j1mc> i gotta run, but...
[19:12] <dhillon-v10> alright bye and thanks
[19:12] <j1mc> join the documentation team mailing list, & send a short intro after you've been able to decide what topics you might like to write about
[19:12] <dhillon-v10> alright
[21:05] <dhillon-v10> j1mc: Hi
[21:07] <dhillon-v10> hi everyone
[21:13] <starcraftman> lo' dhillon-v10
[21:14] <dhillon-v10> starcraftman: hey how are you
[21:14] <dhillon-v10> starcraftman: did I talk to you before
[21:14] <starcraftman> dhillon-v10: don't think so, I don't hang about doc so much. I'm a bt member and part of the wiki fg group.
[21:15] <dhillon-v10>  starcraftman: wiki fg group what is that
[21:15] <starcraftman> dhillon-v10: I'm ok guess, just spent a few hours reconfiguring main system after I messed it up badly.
[21:16] <dhillon-v10>  starcraftman: what happened
[21:16] <starcraftman> dhillon-v10: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/FocusGroups/Wiki < Beginners Team wiki focus group
[21:17] <Rocket2DMn> starcraftman, that makes you part of the doc team :)
[21:17] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: Ya I know, guess I just don't hang out much here. Prolly ought to.
[21:18] <dhillon-v10>  starcraftman: this seems usefule
[21:18] <dhillon-v10> *useful
[21:19] <starcraftman> dhillon-v10: As to what happened, I'm still not quite sure. Somehow I messed up the system so bad it refused to enable rendering and compositing with a 3d driver. Even after a purge of all drivers and manual install.
[21:19] <dhillon-v10>  starcraftman: oh
[21:20] <starcraftman> dhillon-v10: worst thing, I didn't have a drive image in place for my latest kubuntu install so had to reinstall and redo settings, almost back to normal. Took the oppurtunity to up to kde 4.3
[21:21] <dhillon-v10>  starcraftman: Can you even make a disk image for ubuntu if so please explain how
[21:22] <starcraftman> dhillon-v10: Oh sure, see my wiki I just updated : https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BackupYourSystem
[21:23] <starcraftman> dhillon-v10: if your not interested in dd from a terminal, best to look at the gui programs. Both are good, though I use another paid solution that's a hold over from my windows days. True Image from acronis.
[21:23] <dhillon-v10>  starcraftman: I have heard a lot about Acronis but I thought it was for servers only
[21:24] <starcraftman> dhillon-v10: nope, they make a desktop home version, works a charm. Paid though. Partimage or clonezilla do the same if your interested, just not a flashy gui.
[21:25] <dhillon-v10>  starcraftman: Can you please provide me with a link to that
[21:26] <starcraftman> links to the two free ones? Just see drive image section on the wiki ^
[21:26] <dhillon-v10>  starcraftman: nope the link to Acronis home page where you found the desktop edition
[21:26] <starcraftman> http://www.acronis.com/homecomputing/
[21:27] <starcraftman> True Image home it's name, I've a bit older copy, no real changes.
[21:28] <dhillon-v10>  starcraftman: Would you say something about clonizilla regarding its performance
[21:32] <starcraftman> dhillon-v10: can't really comment on it. Been meaning to try it. I haven't heard anything bad about performance.
[21:33] <dhillon-v10>  starcraftman: thanks man
[21:33] <starcraftman> dhillon-v10: np
[21:33] <dhillon-v10>  starcraftman: when I go on the page mentioned above it only gives me download for exe file not linux source or installer
[21:34] <starcraftman> dhillon-v10: Oh, forgot to metnion that, it's not actually a linux program, I created the recovery CD from the program. That's platform independant cuz ya just boot it like a live CD.
[21:36] <dhillon-v10>  starcraftman: I want to contribute to Ubuntu documentation and I have downloaded the bzr branch now what...
[21:37] <starcraftman> dhillon-v10: Don't ask me about system doc stuff, I'm just a wiki editor at moment. Maybe down the line I'll do system too.
[21:37] <dhillon-v10>  starcraftman: okay :)
[21:38] <starcraftman> dhillon-v10: might wanna ping Rocket2DMn, he'd know who to ask.
[21:38] <dhillon-v10>  starcraftman: how do I do that
[21:38] <Rocket2DMn> ask about what
[21:39] <starcraftman> dhillon-v10: for the record, when ya just type someones nick in a message, it's highlighted so to draw their attention. So when I put Rocket2DMn, in this message, it gets highlighted just to his chat.
[21:39] <Rocket2DMn> somebody call?
[21:39] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: dhillon-v10 wants to know about contributing to system docs, I said you'd know who to ask about it.
[21:39] <Rocket2DMn> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/SystemDocumentation
[21:39] <dhillon-v10> Rocket2DMn: how are you
[21:39] <Rocket2DMn> im doing well, thanks dhillon-v10
[21:40] <dhillon-v10> Rocket2DMn: I have read the wiki
[21:40] <Rocket2DMn> ok, so you know how to make changes then?
[21:40] <Rocket2DMn> if you find problems with the system docs, you should open a bug report against the ubuntu-docs package - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-docs
[21:41] <Rocket2DMn> if you want to fix the bug yourself, you can attach a patch to the bug report, and somebody with commit privileges will add it to the main branch if the patch is good
[21:41] <dhillon-v10> Rocket2DMn: I wanted to add a document for installation of OpenCV because most people find it really hard to install and it is available in Synaptic, Is that possible
[21:42] <Rocket2DMn> yeah, though i have no idea what opencv is
[21:43] <dhillon-v10> Rocket2DMn: It is a collection of programs used for Computer Vision and image processing
[21:43] <dhillon-v10> Rocket2DMn: I think you can probably help me out here
[21:44] <Rocket2DMn> well, im not an expert in dealing with the system docs
[21:44] <Rocket2DMn> im not sure where such a guide needs to go
[21:44] <Rocket2DMn> I think it can be helpful to first have such content on the Community Docs wiki
[21:45] <Rocket2DMn> then it can be ported over to the system docs later
[21:45] <dhillon-v10> Rocket2DMn: Alright thanks
[21:45] <Rocket2DMn> so for instance, you would add a page here - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/OpenCV
[21:45] <Rocket2DMn> (Assuming no other page already exists for OpenCV)
[21:46] <dhillon-v10> Rocket2DMn: I am creating the page now, thanks for your help
[21:46] <Rocket2DMn> dhillon-v10, when in doubt, you can email the doc-team mailing list and ask for advice
[21:47] <dhillon-v10> Rocket2DMn: I will talk to you later, bye :)
[21:48] <Rocket2DMn> cool, i look forward to seeing your work
[21:48] <Rocket2DMn> thanks for contributing :)


[07:21] <Rhonda> ScottK, lifeless: So I wonder why it's possible to delete packages from there at all. :/
[07:22] <Rhonda> Should rather be called "hide" instead of delete then.  Giving wrong impression.
[07:26] <lifeless> Rhonda: it is a delete
[07:26] <lifeless> Rhonda: but delete != 'forget', delete is 'free resources'
[10:24] <dedunu> I want a help
[10:24] <dedunu> I want to start develop ubuntu what should i do first
[10:25] <Niraj_> I am no expert
[10:25] <Niraj_> but ubuntu dev week had few good sessions regarding paackaging and stuff
[10:25] <dedunu> I want a mentor
[10:26] <Niraj_> I can give you links to IRC logs if needed
[10:26] <dedunu> thanks
[10:26] <dedunu> give me
[10:27] <Niraj_> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/01/29/%23ubuntu-classroom.html
[10:27] <Niraj_> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/01/30/%23ubuntu-classroom.html
[10:27] <Niraj_> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/01/31/%23ubuntu-classroom.html
[10:28] <dedunu> thanks a lot
[10:28] <Niraj_> my plesure
[15:33] <ESphynx> xnox: by the way, since this conflict with eclib is resolved now, any change Ecere will be in Sid now rather than Experimental? :)
[15:33] <ESphynx> any chance*
[18:24] <alo21> hi everybody. I am trying to merge dovecot, and after I downloaded all the files with grab-merge, I applied the patches with quilt push -a. I got an error which says that a parch could not be applied because it did't find the file to patch. What should I do?
[18:42] <ESphynx> xnox: config.guess & .sub are out of date in the upstream tarball -- This is in the included but unused libffi package I think... Still latest version of that (3.0.11). The SDK itself doesn't use autoconf


[09:53] <c10ud> ow, what happened with latest unity update (5.14, precise) colors are...funny
[09:54] <c10ud> screenshot incoming
[09:56] <c10ud> here it is: http://imgur.com/uj79u
[10:00] <gord> c10ud: what looks funny about that?
[10:00] <gord> it looks normal to me
[10:00] <c10ud> gord, they're way brighter than before
[10:00] <sil2100> Looks normal to me too
[10:02] <c10ud> sil2100, if there's an easy way to temporarily revert to 5.12 i can make another screenshot
[10:02] <seb128> what's the screenshot url?
[10:02] <c10ud> gord, sil2100 http://imgur.com/uj79u
[10:05] <c10ud> let me check if i have some weird package..
[10:05] <c10ud> it surely wasn't like this yesterday with 5.12
[10:06] <sil2100> c10ud: you can try doing apt-get install unity=5.12-0ubuntu1.1 unity-common=5.12-0ubuntu1.1 unity-services=5.12-0ubuntu1.1
[10:06] <sil2100> c10ud: but for me it looks normal
[10:07] <sil2100> That's how my icons looked like since quite a long time
[10:09] <c10ud> i'll reboot and check
[10:11] <c10ud> $ sudo apt-get install unity=5.12-0ubuntu1.1 unity-common=5.12-0ubuntu1.1 unity-services=5.12-0ubuntu1.1 libunity-core-5.0-5=5.12-0ubuntu1.1
[10:16] <c10ud> sil2100, no change, it must be some other package (!)
[10:17] <c10ud> too bad i've been afk for a few days and got a load of updates
[10:19] <c10ud> more or less only libgl and unity could interfere with that..? (reading the updates i did)
[10:20] <sil2100> c10ud: phew - well, hope you'll be able to find the culprit - although as I said, those icons look rather fine to me
[10:20] <sil2100> Maybe it's something related to the color profile?
[10:21] <c10ud> i don't know how the bg is calculated, but i surely didn't touch anything
[10:21] <c10ud> most of them are acceptable though, but the teamspeak one looks rather out of place
[10:21] <c10ud> anyway, i'll live with it, i was just wondering what caused this change
[10:22] <sil2100> Reminds me of an old bug that got fixed half a year ago
[10:24] <c10ud> also the emesene icon, the green is weird
[10:24] <c10ud> how can it average to that?
[10:24] <c10ud> lol
[10:27] <c10ud> just installed ccsm and i see there are some options for that
[10:28] <c10ud> they don't look applied on the fly
[10:28] <c10ud> let's see
[10:33] <c10ud> (compiz:3507): GConf-CRITICAL **: gconf_client_add_dir: assertion `gconf_valid_key (dirname, NULL)' failed
[10:33] <c10ud> ah, interesting (relaunching unity)
[10:33] <c10ud> compiz (unityshell) - Error: GL_ARB_vertex_buffer_object not supported
[10:34] <c10ud> this is some BAD NVIDIA thing
[10:39] <sil2100> c10ud: did you get those before?
[10:39] <c10ud> sil2100, i recently updated the nvidia to the beta driver and never tried relaunching unity, sorry
[10:39] <c10ud> also i am guessing why it works when booting but not when replacing
[10:42] <sil2100> seb128: btw. I don't see the new compiz SRU in precise-updates - is there anything wrong with it?
[10:42] <sil2100> seb128: 1:<IP_ADDRESS>-0ubuntu1.2 one is the latest one rmadison shows
[10:42] <seb128> sil2100, the SRU team didn't review it yet
[10:43] <sil2100> seb128: ah, ok ;) Thought there were some problems - thanks!
[10:43] <mhr3> sil2100, hey.. you remember what did i tell you about make dist?
[10:43] <mhr3> something along the lines of never ever use that
[10:44] <sil2100> mhr3: regarding libunity? ;)
[10:44] <sil2100> mhr3: since I never made a libunity tarball before ;p
[10:44] <sil2100> seb128: hm, we actually had plans on maybe releasing a new SRU for compiz this week - won't that be a problem?
[10:45] <seb128> sil2100, what would be in the SRU? it's getting really late, the LTS .1 freeze is this week
[10:46] <c10ud> sil2100, while you're at it please include the performance fixes in unity :(
[10:46] <sil2100> seb128: we wanted to include the regionalDamage fixes
[10:47] <sil2100> seb128: which are really important performance fixes from what I know
[10:47] <mhr3> sil2100, it's not about libunity it's about any tarball
[10:48] <mhr3> non-cmake based anyway
[10:48] <seb128> sil2100, yeah, it's tricky also and require quite some testing, so maybe after .1
[10:48] <sil2100> mhr3: it is? Oh my...
[10:48] <sil2100> mhr3: so how should I do tarballs for ./autogen.sh projects?
[10:48] <sil2100> seb128: hm, ok thn
[11:28] <sil2100> mhr3: should I just do bzr export for ./autogen.sh projects?
[11:31] <mhr3> sil2100, ./autogen && make && make distcheck
[11:31] <sil2100> mhr3: ah, so a normal make is required before that?
[11:31] <sil2100> mhr3: since I tried make distcheck too and it was failing
[11:32] <sil2100> mhr3: but I wasn't running 'make' by itself
[11:32] <mhr3> it shouldn't need that, but there are lots of bugs, so it's usually needed
[11:32] <sil2100> mhr3: thanks
[11:32] <mhr3> even gtkdoc itself introduces those bugs
[11:35] <sil2100> mhr3: the ./autogen && make && make distcheck still fails on my system for libunity... I get: no rules for target test-launcher-integration.c
[11:36] <mhr3> sil2100, i might have broken that :)
[11:36] <sil2100> :O
[11:36]  * sil2100 is shocked
[11:37] <sil2100> ;)
[11:37] <mhr3> furtunately didrocks didn't see that ;)
[11:37] <mhr3> and neither did seb, yey!
[11:39] <c10ud> sil2100, it looks like it was NVIDIA's fault!
[11:39] <c10ud> i just downgraded the driver and it works
[11:39] <sil2100> c10ud: ah HA! ;) How did you find that out?
[11:39] <sil2100> Ah
[11:39] <sil2100> But strange thing indeed
[11:39] <c10ud> it is weird that it was working yesterday, probably something related to the kernel
[11:40] <c10ud> or libgl
[11:41] <c10ud> gord, sil2100 correctly looking: http://imgur.com/vvXLm before (bug): http://imgur.com/uj79u
[11:41] <c10ud> anyway, it's "fixed" now
[11:41] <c10ud> ;;)
[11:44] <sil2100> mhr3: yay \o/ :)
[11:48] <mhr3> sil2100, run `./autogen.sh --enable-integration-tests && make && ./autogen.sh && make && make distcheck`
[11:48] <sil2100> mhr3: ok, trying
[11:51] <sil2100> mhr3: works \o/
[12:25] <davmor2> gord is the block around the magnifier lens in the hud deliberate?  it isn't there in the dash just the hud
[12:27] <davmor2> gord only seems to happen when the hud overlays app windows
[12:29] <gotwig> hey
[12:29] <gotwig> Unity webapps devs here?
[12:30] <sil2100> mhr3: will you be fixing this in lp:libunity trunk, or is it fine just like this?
[12:31] <gord> davmor2: no block here
[12:31] <gord> davmor2: but i don't really work on hud anymore, so not the best person to ask
[12:32] <davmor2> gord: I'll grab a video be easier :)
[12:33] <gord> davmor2: doesn't really solve the me not being the person to ask thing though ;)
[12:34] <davmor2> gord: indeed but I thought I'd leave that till I had the video :P
[12:34] <DebolazW> gotwig: #unity-webapps
[12:37] <gotwig> there is no one present in #unity-webapps
[12:37] <DebolazW> gotwig: Sorry, I meant to write #ubuntu-webapps :)
[13:30] <mhr3> sil2100, i'll try to fix it properly when i get back, for now this will work
[13:34] <sil2100> mhr3: awesome
[16:21] <Okera> Hello, I just wanted to say I love Unity. The lot of rage against you should not hide all the users who use it everyday and love it!
[17:43] <MCR1> Trevinho: Are you here ?
[17:44] <Trevinho> MCR1: for a very little
[17:44] <MCR1> I need your approval here ;) - https://code.launchpad.net/~mc-return/unity/unity.merge-optimize-performance-and-style/+merge/117310
[17:47] <Trevinho> MCR1: that's fine...
[17:47] <Trevinho> MCR1: you could even used the range-based loops, but it's fine as well
[17:49] <MCR1> Trevinho: I was just fixing what cppcheck reported - performance is important after all
[17:50] <MCR1> Trevinho: There are some other, more complicated issues left though...
[17:50] <MCR1> Trevinho: But I'll let you go - thanks for the approval :)
[17:50] <Trevinho> yw, thank you
[18:17] <MCR1> Trevinho: Seems I forgot the commit message :( - got removed from 'ready to land'...
[18:19] <MCR1> Trevinho: So if you find some time, here the link again: https://code.launchpad.net/~mc-return/unity/unity.merge-optimize-performance-and-style/+merge/117310
[18:20] <MCR1> Trevinho: Those 2 also are waiting for approval, btw: https://code.launchpad.net/~mc-return/unity/unity.merge-reduce-png-filesizes/+merge/110978 and https://code.launchpad.net/~mc-return/unity/unity.merge-fix-typos/+merge/116216
[18:20] <MCR1> I would be happy if I would finally see some of my improvements land ;)
[18:21] <MCR1> *in Unity
[18:24] <bschaefer> MCR1, if you forgot the commit message you don't have to resubmit it :)
[18:24] <bschaefer> MCR1, but since Trevinho approved it Ill approve and merge it!
[18:24] <bschaefer> (and the changes look good :))
[18:25] <MCR1> bschaefer: Thx, the credit goes to the creator of cppcheck (more or less)
[18:26] <MCR1> bschaefer: Could you please take a look at the other 2 merge proposals I posted above also ?
[18:26] <bschaefer> MCR1, yeah, let me take a look
[18:29] <MCR1> bschaefer: They are old, but still should be good ;) The recompression of the png resources is something that's similar to what was merged into lp:compiz already today: https://code.launchpad.net/~mc-return/compiz/compiz.merge-recompress-png-resources/+merge/117155
[18:30] <bschaefer> MCR1, hmm if it deals with compiz I would be happier if sam took a look at it as well
[18:30] <bschaefer> MCR1, not that if it deals with compiz...rather that he has looked at that before
[18:31] <MCR1> bschaefer: No, it does not deal with Compiz, but does the same recompression operation for Unity's png resources :)
[18:34] <bschaefer> MCR1, yeah, hmm well with mhr3 comment I would rather have someone who knows more about compression review that :)
[18:35] <MCR1> bschaefer: It is a simple speed improvement achieved by using higher compression levels for the png files resulting in faster loading and displaying of those - recommended everywhere... but no problem
[18:35] <bschaefer> MCR1, hmm, how could it cause slow load up time then?
[18:36] <MCR1> bschaefer: Who says so ?
[18:36] <bschaefer> https://code.launchpad.net/~mc-return/unity/unity.merge-reduce-png-filesizes/+merge/110978/comments/246291
[18:38] <MCR1> bschaefer: The comment just says that there is no data for this special case (Unity), but in the web you can find that data (look at the links I've posted).
[18:40] <bschaefer> MCR1, hm yeah. It looks good to me, Ill approve it but Ill try and ping sam or mhr3 later to take a look at it as well!
[18:42] <MCR1> bschaefer: To fix the problem of having multiple small images to load a texture atlas is needed - Games use that to store multiple small icons in just one large image file...
[18:43] <MCR1> bschaefer: Thanks.
[18:43] <bschaefer> MCR1, yeah, that would be the best solution....though Im not sure how much unity is slowed by images
[18:43] <bschaefer> in general, but still good to fix :)
[18:44] <MCR1> bschaefer: example for a texture atlas: http://ufoai.git.sourceforge.net/git/gitweb.cgi?p=ufoai/ufoai;a=blob;f=base/pics/banks/pack2.png;h=0a2cdbe48df2d7244d13102e96154045cf8d61b8;hb=ded207e867f3d3d911d9b0c3ab79d1e3ef24361f
[18:44] <bschaefer> MCR1, your welcome, and thank you for these branches!
[18:44] <MCR1> bschaefer: ^^ (features a bit of my work)
[18:45] <bschaefer> MCR1, haha nice, yeah I've seen images stored like that, and that would be a good solution...though I don't deal with images much :)
[18:48] <MCR1> bschaefer: The clue here is that this special atlas (picture) and the .ufo script containing the coordinates of each is generated automatically from the small icons...
[18:48] <MCR1> *of each icon
[19:04] <MCR1> hmm, now the unity-merger failed ?
[19:14] <bschaefer> MCR1, hmm odd
[19:14] <MCR1> bschaefer: Do not get it either :)
[19:15] <bschaefer> MCR1, are you merged with trunk?
[19:16] <MCR1> bschaefer: I did test compilation and it compiled without problems here, but maybe I should rebase - but the diff is not showing any problems and the branch is new...
[19:16] <MCR1> bschaefer: One moment
[19:17] <bschaefer> MCR1, I think something went wrong with the merger haha, let me try again and see what happens
[19:17] <MCR1> bschaefer: ok, thx.
[19:17] <bschaefer> like its complaining about missing dependencies but that shouldn't be your branches fault...
[19:18] <MCR1> no, I saw the console output also - strange
[19:25] <MCR1> If anyone here is motivated to fix some more problems: http://pastebin.com/9kczh8fd
[21:25] <j-johan-edwards> Hi, is there a workaround for "package 'unity-protocol-private>=5.93.1' not found"? Per lp:1026435 I have a fully updated system; I've tried removing it from the Cmake lists, but some modules still require that header file.
[21:27] <bschaefer> j-johan-edwards, you need to download the latest libunity
[21:27] <bschaefer> j-johan-edwards, or upgrade to 12.10 (not very stable)
[21:27] <bschaefer> i think not sure haha
[21:27] <j-johan-edwards> I am on 12.10 currently
[21:27] <bschaefer> hmm really?
[21:27] <j-johan-edwards> Unless I hallucinated that
[21:28] <bschaefer> well if you compile libunity you'll be fine
[21:28] <bschaefer> bzr branch lp:libunity
[21:28] <j-johan-edwards> Thanks, I'll give that a try.
[21:28] <bschaefer> good luck!
[21:41] <j-johan-edwards> bschaefer: okay, cmake gave me the nod, thanks
[21:41] <bschaefer> j-johan-edwards, np!


[02:05] <KGB-0> libnotify tags b7d8f80 Marco Trevisan ubuntu/0.7.9-3ubuntu1 * Debian release 0.7.9-3ubuntu1 * https://deb.li/tSxj
[02:05] <KGB-2> libnotify tags 4d8fecb Marco Trevisan ubuntu/0.7.9-3ubuntu2 * Debian release 0.7.9-3ubuntu2 * https://deb.li/3r5eR
[02:05] <KGB-2> libnotify tags 90e9340 Marco Trevisan ubuntu/0.7.9-3ubuntu4 * Debian release 0.7.9-3ubuntu4 * https://deb.li/yYED
[02:05] <KGB-0> libnotify tags 1ca6068 Marco Trevisan ubuntu/0.7.9-3ubuntu5 * Debian release 0.7.9-3ubuntu5 * https://deb.li/3X30z
[02:06] <KGB-0> libnotify ubuntu/master a672cf3 Marco Trevisan * pushed 7 commits (first 5 follow) * https://deb.li/Jill
[02:06] <KGB-0> libnotify ubuntu/master f775376 Sebastien Bacher debian/ (5 files in 3 dirs) * Import Debian changes 0.7.9-3ubuntu1 * https://deb.li/3mCAI
[02:06] <KGB-0> libnotify ubuntu/master e1d68ee Sebastien Bacher debian/ changelog control control.in * Import Debian changes 0.7.9-3ubuntu2 * https://deb.li/3U7IE
[02:07] <KGB-0> libnotify ubuntu/master 4f465ed Matthias Klose debian/changelog * Import Debian changes 0.7.9-3ubuntu3 * https://deb.li/i7Yie
[02:07] <KGB-0> libnotify ubuntu/master 1fa4558 Julian Andres Klode debian/ changelog control control.in * Import Debian changes 0.7.9-3ubuntu4 * https://deb.li/3xzI
[02:07] <KGB-0> libnotify ubuntu/master 6824c87 Robie Basak debian/ changelog control control.in * Import Debian changes 0.7.9-3ubuntu5 * https://deb.li/3OJUA
[05:52] <didrocks> happy release +1day!
[05:58] <duflu> Morning didrocks
[05:58] <didrocks> hey duflu
[06:18] <jibel> Good morning
[06:18] <didrocks> salut jibel
[06:21] <duflu> Morning jibel
[06:24] <oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
[06:27] <didrocks> salut oSoMoN
[06:29] <oSoMoN> salut didrocks
[06:34] <duflu> Hi oSoMoN
[06:35] <oSoMoN> hey duflu
[07:19] <ricotz> hello :) jibel didrocks duflu oSoMoN
[07:19] <luna> heyo
[07:20] <duflu> Hi ricotz and luna
[07:20] <didrocks> hey ricotz, luna
[07:38] <oSoMoN> hey ricotz & luna
[07:40] <luna> so everyone happy with the 22.04 release ? :)
[07:47] <seb128> goood morning desktopers!
[07:47] <oSoMoN> salut seb128
[07:47] <Wimpy> Morning o/
[07:47] <seb128> congrats on a geat LTS desktop ;-)
[07:48] <Wimpy> Looks like Ubuntu 22.04 LTS has been extremely well received :-) Excellent work
[07:54] <seb128> 👍
[07:56] <duflu> Morning seb128 and Wimpy
[08:04] <seb128> hey oSoMoN Wimpy duflu, how are you?
[08:05] <duflu> seb128, still dazed from release week but OK. Preparing for another long weekend. How are you?
[08:11] <seb128> duflu, I'm alright thanks! school holidays are starting today, going to spend some time travelling and in France before travelling again the next week for the planing sprint
[09:39] <Nafallo> hmm. apt install ubuntu-desktop-minimal a ubuntu:j container gets a bunch of "Setting up network-manager (1.36.4-2ubuntu1) ...
[09:40] <Nafallo> Failed to reload daemon: Transport endpoint is not connected"
[09:40] <Nafallo> well, a bunch of Failed to reload...  not the specific package.
[09:40] <Nafallo> ideas on debug? :-)
[09:41] <Nafallo> actually, I did lxc exec jammy -- apt install ubuntu-desktop-minimal
[09:45] <blathijs> strace to see what system call is failing exactly?
[09:46] <Nafallo> I'll try the same with lxc shell, pretty sure exec might be a bit crazy for that :-)
[09:48] <Nafallo> works on bionic and focal though :-P
[09:55] <Nafallo> hmm. same with lxc shell actually :-)
[09:57] <Nafallo> need to work around it for now, but needs more testing later
[11:37] <jbicha> good morning
[12:43] <KGB-2> evolution-data-server signed tags 3f77a82 Jeremy Bicha upstream/3.44.1 * Upstream version 3.44.1 * https://deb.li/sKGI
[18:20] <ricotz> schopin, hi :), do you have a ppa with your rustc/cargo builds?