[01:21] <coreymon77> nosrednaekim: hey! youre finally applying for membership
[01:21] <coreymon77> !
[01:21] <nosrednaekim> :)
[01:21] <coreymon77> Riddell: since i cant make it to the meeting tomorrow, i need my sleep
[01:21] <coreymon77> Riddell: i hereby give my 900000000% +1 to nosrednaekim, he really deserves it
[01:22] <nosrednaekim> oooooo wait.... 6am tomorrow morning? youch....
[01:22] <coreymon77> nosrednaekim: yup
[01:22] <coreymon77> nosrednaekim: id love to be there, i just cant
[01:22] <coreymon77> nosrednaekim: but i give you my +1 now
[01:22] <coreymon77> Riddell: okay?
[01:22] <nosrednaekim> I think its acceptable if you send it to the mailing list.
[01:23] <claydoh> that reminds me tu set up my wireless connection so I can join in tomorrow...
[01:23] <coreymon77> nosrednaekim: trust me, i know, i applied through the mailing list, they made an exception for me since i could never make it to the meetings
[01:23] <nosrednaekim> ^_^
[01:23] <coreymon77> man, id really like to be there for nosrednaekim, but i just cant
[01:23] <coreymon77> that really sucks
[01:24] <nosrednaekim> haha, hope I can be there....
[01:24] <nosrednaekim> claydoh: hey, would you mind asking them to consider membership after 11:30
[01:25] <coreymon77> Riddell: ping
[01:25] <coreymon77> Riddell: you there?
[01:25] <coreymon77> nosrednaekim: then i could be there for you too!
[01:25] <nosrednaekim> coreymon77: nah... its past midnight there.
[01:25] <claydoh> they should, but I will try to remember that for you :0
[01:25] <coreymon77> claydoh: where did Riddell go?
[01:26] <nosrednaekim> coreymon77: he lives in UTC time... its past midnight there
[01:26] <claydoh> coreymon77: dunno, prob asleep?
[01:26] <coreymon77> so, im on irc past midnight
[01:26] <coreymon77> just not at 6 am
[01:27] <coreymon77> claydoh: how long is the meeting expected to go
[01:27] <coreymon77> nosrednaekim: because we are in the same time zone right?
[01:27] <nosrednaekim> coreymon77: hour ussually
[01:27] <nosrednaekim> coreymon77: EST
[01:27] <coreymon77> yup
[01:27] <claydoh> dunno, usually from what I see, it is about an hour, tho some loot to have gone longer
[01:28] <coreymon77> nosrednaekim: so you are asking them to delay the member consideration for a good 4.5 hours?
[01:28] <claydoh> I have not made it in a while, many meetings are after a night shift for me, so I can't make it
[01:28] <nosrednaekim> no.... 11:30 UTC
[01:29] <coreymon77> oh
[01:29] <coreymon77> which is?
[01:30] <coreymon77> nosrednaekim: for us
[01:30] <nosrednaekim> 6:30
[01:32] <coreymon77> oh, still cant make it
[01:35] <ForgeAus> hey cory :)
[01:36]  * claydoh thinks sleep is overrated :) 5-6hrs is plenty
[09:03] <Jucato> looks like I won't be able to come to the meeting *again*... sorry :(
[09:04] <Jucato> oh wait... 11+8 = 19... 7pm... might make it after all :(
[09:05] <Jucato> er :)
[09:47] <apachelogger__> nixternal: multirow is done automagically, when space doesn't last anymore
[09:50] <apachelogger__> jpatrick: I saied merging btw, and get the debian maintainer to have a look at our changes, since they are probably as useful to them as to us
[10:19] <Hobbsee> oh, so that's why i can't go to bed yet.
[10:23]  * jpatrick waves to the channel
[10:24] <jpatrick> apachelogger__: poke pusling in #debian-qt-kde then :)
[10:54] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: you do syncs?
[10:54] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: not usually.  there's a sync script, though.  why?
[10:54] <jpatrick> bug #190320
[10:54] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 190320 in ubuntu "Please sync kde-style-domino 0.4-1  (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/190320
[10:56] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: it tends to be more effective to wait for them to us ethe proper scripts
[10:56] <Hobbsee> i'll only tend to sync things if it's something massively broken and important
[10:56] <jpatrick> I used requestsync
[10:56] <Riddell> ** Kubuntu meeting in three minutes #ubuntu-meeting
[11:01] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: Riddell can sync xwith teh proper scripts
[11:02] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: are your hands frozen or are you !leet? :D
[11:02] <Hobbsee> the latter.
[11:03] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: i don't work for canonical.
[11:03] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: didn't say you did
[11:04] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: to expand on that, using the leet scripts that work well require access on canonical machines, which only employees have.
[11:04] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: ah, I see.
[11:07] <mhb> smarter: still working on it
[11:08] <smarter> ok
[11:14] <jpatrick> kiefer: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/HelpingKubuntu
[11:14] <kiefer> Thanks mate
[11:16] <jpatrick> kiefer: take a look at that, and tell us what you'd prefer to spacialize in
[11:18] <kiefer> Okay, just finished reading it and heres my thoughts-
[11:18] <kiefer> Im currently studying for a diploma in IT (Programming and Software Dev.) So programming is a possibility, Im a pretty good Doc Writer (If I do say so) so that sounds like a good starting option, and as for artwork...well...im crap - lol :P
[11:19] <jpatrick> kiefer: nixternal is your man if you want doc work
[11:19] <kiefer> Would that be a good place for me to start?
[11:20] <jpatrick> I think the focus now is KDE 4 docs
[11:20] <kiefer> Some simple programming work would also be happily accepted, Im always willing to learn new things
[11:20] <kiefer> Ive been writing C/C++ code for about a year
[11:20] <kiefer> and Java for about 2 years
[11:21] <Jucato> re KDE 4 docs... the most important part is actually creating them afaik... but yeah, nixternal is the one you should poke about tit
[11:21] <Jucato> it*
[11:21] <Jucato> damn typo...
[11:21] <kiefer> Haha
[11:21] <jpatrick> kiefer: bzr co --lightweight http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-doc/ubuntu-doc/kubuntu-hardy
[11:21] <kiefer> How should I go about contacting him?
[11:21] <jussi01> kiefer: bug fixing is also always a good thing ;)
[11:21] <jpatrick> kiefer: he's in here, sleeping
[11:21] <kiefer> always :)
[11:21] <Jucato> kiefer: when he's awake (in a few hours), just mention his name :)
[11:22] <jpatrick> kiefer: that command will get you the lastest documentation, that you can look around at
[11:22] <kiefer> Haha will do, im in Australia, and its like 10pm here, Ill be awake till about 4am
[11:23] <kiefer> Okay sweet, ill grab it now
[11:23] <kiefer> Thanks :)
[11:25] <jpatrick> kiefer: as for programming, you could ask mhb
[11:25] <Jucato> kiefer: oh then tomorrow.. around.. um... hm.. Hobbsee what time (your time) do you usually catch nixternal?
[11:26] <Jucato> jpatrick: for python, that is
[11:26]  * Hobbsee thinks
[11:26] <Hobbsee> lunchtime or something?
[11:26] <Hobbsee> afternoon?
[11:28] <kiefer> Well im always around so i will no doubt cross paths with him soon :P
[11:28] <Jucato> he'll be awake in a few (1 or 2) hours I bet
[11:29] <kiefer> Yeah ill be around, im watching Bad Boys atm, and it only just started so, ill be around
[11:30] <kiefer> And mhb, when should he be around?
[11:32] <Jucato> he's one of our python go-to guys... he should be around around this time iirc...
[11:32] <jussi01> he was just in the meeting before
[11:32] <mhb> kiefer: no clue
[11:33] <kiefer> Lmao damn..
[11:33] <Jucato> oh yeah right... he's here
[11:33] <kiefer> mhb: Well tell him to PM when he is around :)
[11:34] <kiefer> PM me*
[11:36] <mhb> kiefer: I'll have something now, I'll PM you later today, if you don't mind
[11:37] <kiefer> No problem, Im gonna be around for a few hours anyway :)
[11:41] <mhb> I'm off, will be back later today.
[11:41] <mhb> my +1 to Mike if he appears :o)
[11:45] <kiefer> Yeah Im off to make some food (Japanese noodles ftw :P) I'll be back in an hour or two to get more indo on how I can help :)
[11:45] <kiefer> info*
[11:47] <jpatrick> nosrednaekim: !!!!!!!!
[11:48] <jpatrick> nosrednaekim: #ubuntu-meeting
[11:48] <jpatrick> :-)
[11:48] <nosrednaekim> sorry!
[11:48] <nosrednaekim> the alarm did wakemeup...lol
[12:37] <Lure> ups, forgot about meeting...
[12:37] <jpatrick> ....
[12:38] <Hobbsee> bad Lure.
[12:38]  * Hobbsee almost forgot
[12:38] <nosrednaekim> <_<
[12:38] <Lure> Hobbsee: kids need me too ;-)
[12:38]  * Lure -> lunch, bbl for plasma meeting at least
[12:39] <Hobbsee> Lure: you're very wanted, then ;)
[12:39] <jpatrick> Wed 20 23:00UTC < right date?
[12:40] <Jucato> I was about to ask.. what day would that be...
[12:40] <jpatrick> on our two-week thing, yes
[12:45] <claydoh> I might be able to make it to the next meeting too !
[12:45] <claydoh> yay
[12:45] <claydoh> i think I have that day off, usually am working
[12:45]  * Hobbsee won't be
[12:45] <Hobbsee> not that it makes much difference at this point, but still
[12:47] <Jucato> Hobbsee: it makes much difference... you're one of the very few people whose +1 is a heavyweight :)
[12:47] <Jucato> we only have +0.5 :D
[12:47] <Hobbsee> heh
[12:48] <Hobbsee> sure, but only on memberships and such now
[13:05]  * Hobbsee wonders how easy it is to get teh old kmenu back
[13:05] <nosrednaekim> Hobbsee: easy
[13:06] <nosrednaekim> if you are talking about KDE4
[13:06] <Jucato> Hobbsee: just use the Application Launcher Menu
[13:06] <Jucato> plasmoid
[13:07] <Hobbsee> ah right
[13:07] <Hobbsee> nosrednaekim: yes
[13:07] <nosrednaekim> Hobbsee: yes, there is a "traditional" menu applet
[13:07] <Jucato> it's called the.. um... hm...
[13:07] <Hobbsee> ah goody
[13:07] <Jucato> Application Launcher Menu
[13:08]  * Hobbsee would only switch back at 4.1, most likely
[13:08] <Hobbsee> set it up a lot like gnome
[13:08] <Hobbsee> assuming all the bits were there
[13:08] <nosrednaekim> Jucato: so is the other one ;)
[13:08] <Jucato> nosrednaekim: the kickoff one is "Application Launcher" only...
[13:08] <Jucato> notice the word "Menu"
[13:08] <nosrednaekim> Jucato: oh excuse me... never mind :)
[13:09] <nosrednaekim> ya... it was cut off in my little add applet dialog ^_^
[13:09] <Jucato> :P
[13:13] <claydoh> wow apparently I am now the lead for my (extremely inactive)LoCo team
[13:51] <andersin> Is there a naming scheme for packages containing plasma applets (e.g. start with kde4-plasmoid-.....)
[14:24]  * mhb is back, if anyone wanted a word with him
[14:24] <mhb> kiefer: ping
[14:29] <mhb> hrm
[14:30] <mhb> is it me or has Ubuntu (again) developed an utility without looking at Kubuntu and checking for a common backend?
[14:31] <mhb> is research really the uncool thing to do?
[14:31] <mhb> or why do people totally forget it?
[14:31] <claydoh> the disk manager thing?
[14:32] <mhb> yeah
[14:32] <claydoh> I just read that now
[14:32] <claydoh> I agree
[14:35] <claydoh> is there anything better for QT/KDE?
[14:35] <smarter> link?
[14:36] <smarter> We have mountconfig in guidance
[14:36] <mhb> claydoh: we have the very same config tool
[14:36] <mhb> claydoh: for 3 releases at least
[14:37] <mhb> so the sane thing to do would be to come over and say "hi, we want that too, could we arrange for a common backend so we have to write less code"?
[14:38] <claydoh> lol sane
[14:38] <mhb> bad word... "wise" maybe
[14:39] <mhb> I'd understand if they used a different language or something... but when they use Python like us and they fail to contact us
[14:39] <mhb> it's a perfect example of a bad planning
[14:40] <claydoh> no, sane was good :)
[14:42] <mhb> I expect them to say "sorry, our code is almost finished now, we're not going to do anything for any common core, if you want it, *you* do it"
[14:44] <mhb> typisch ubuntisch ... man, one silly post and I'm so mad :o)
[14:58] <kiefer> Wow that was a great movie... Im back :)
[15:00] <mhb> kiefer: which one?
[15:00] <kiefer> Bad boys and Bad Boys II :P
[15:00]  * jpatrick considers dumping Debian development
[15:01] <mhb> why so?
[15:01] <mhb> jpatrick: I thought you've just started
[15:02] <Jucato> oh mhb, just the guy I'm looking for. do you have any recommended learning resource for Python for an intermediate C++ programmer like me?
[15:03] <mhb> Jucato: web or book?
[15:03] <mhb> I myself learned the basics from "Learning Python"
[15:03] <Jucato> web or ebook.. can't afford to buy another book at the moment :(
[15:03] <jussi01> isnt there an ebook in the repos?
[15:03] <Jucato> dive into python? is it good?
[15:04] <jussi01> !info diveintopython
[15:04] <ubotu> diveintopython (source: diveintopython): free Python book for experienced programmers. In component main, is optional. Version 5.4-2ubuntu2 (gutsy), package size 340 kB, installed size 4220 kB
[15:04] <Jucato> the part about "experienced programmers" is the one that scares me :D
[15:04] <nosrednaekim> yeah.. dive into python is good!
[15:04] <mhb> jpatrick: so what's the problem?
[15:04] <kiefer> Ive skimmed through dievintopython, and if you have done some C/C++ you should be able to comprehend most of it
[15:04] <Jucato> yeah jpatrick?
[15:04] <jussi01> where is the book once you install the package?
[15:05] <Jucato> [Notice] -jpatrick- Sorry, I'm not here (not here ...) <-- hehehe
[15:05] <Jucato> jussi01: /usr/share/doc
[15:05] <nosrednaekim> jussi01: thats the purpose of dpkg -L ;)
[15:05] <jussi01> Jucato: ahh, thanks
[15:05] <Jucato> kiefer: yeah I've done C++.. but not so extensive. only finished my book last month, so I'm still a bit green
[15:06] <kiefer> Haha ohk, it tends to use lingo/jargon from other languages and show you their pythin counterparts
[15:06] <Jucato> of course, Dive into Python is updated May 2004 according to the site :)
[15:06] <kiefer> python*
[15:06] <Jucato> pythin... nice way to pronounce it ;)
[15:07] <jussi01> Jucato: I also have a free one from the web, more aimed at beginners, but you might want to look at it - byteofpython
[15:07] <kiefer> Haha, Acer520 laptop keyboard - a little annoying
[15:07] <jussi01> Jucato: I can email it across if you like
[15:07] <jpatrick> mhb: they have some "relibtoolize all KDE packages"
[15:07] <Jucato> jussi01: if I can't find it in 5 minutes :)
[15:07] <jussi01> Jucato: kk :P
[15:08] <jpatrick> ...policy
[15:08] <jpatrick> mhb: and I've tried five different ways I've found of doing it, and it doesn't cut the cheese...
[15:08] <Jucato> jussi01: of course I found it and downloaded it already :P
[15:09] <Jucato> thanks mhb, kiefer, jussi01
[15:09] <Jucato> I actually have a python book, "Practical Python"... unfortunately it left me more bewildered than enlightened after reading it
[15:09] <Jucato> it does have some pretty nifty "practical" projects though
[15:10] <mhb> jpatrick: packaging isn't much fun anyway
[15:10] <jpatrick> http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2005/12/msg00439.html - background
[15:11] <mhb> jpatrick: I myself am trying to minimize my participation in FLOSS projects so I can kind of live the other life
[15:11] <Jucato> mhb: good luck with that...
[15:12] <jpatrick> Jucato: as for Python books, I tried many and didn't like them, coded by just fiddling with it
[15:12] <Jucato> jpatrick: although I'm wondering why they are worrying/addressing that *now*, when KDE 4 practically resolves that admin/ problem, and we're not going to have much more 3.5.x releases in the future
[15:12] <mhb> kiefer: so, you wanted to talk to me about...
[15:13] <Jucato> jpatrick: heh I'm not the tutorial type of guy I've realized... so I'm looking for good (e)books. :)
[15:13] <jpatrick> Jucato: that message is 3 years old
[15:13] <Jucato> jpatrick: lol! didn't look at the date hahaha
[15:13] <jpatrick> Jucato: and yes, cmake kills off any "relibtoolize" hell
[15:16] <kiefer> mhb: sorry i was reading something - Yeah i was interested in developing, starting with something simple, PM me maybe?
[15:16] <mhb> kiefer: I'm pretty sure we can talk here
[15:16] <mhb> it's on topic, after all
[15:16] <nosrednaekim> python bindings were just released for plasma.... ^_^
[15:16] <kiefer> Haha *Looks around the room cautiously* *whispers: you think its safe?*
[15:17] <nosrednaekim> kiefer: what languages do you know?
[15:17] <apachelogger> jpatrick: what exactly is the problem with the admin dir?
[15:18] <kiefer> Been programming C/C++ for about 1 year, and Java for 2 or so years though i havent done C/C++ for a while
[15:18] <jpatrick> apachelogger: read mail
[15:19] <kiefer> And a tiny bit of ASM, nothing very helpfull though lol
[15:19] <mhb> kiefer: I'm pretty sure it's safe... I mean I was creating sites with pornographic content even before I was of age :o)
[15:19] <mhb> makes a good reference :o)
[15:19] <kiefer> roffffl
[15:20] <apachelogger> jpatrick: "evil and unnecessary files in it" not that this would explain it :P
[15:20] <kiefer> So, I was told if i wanted to get in on developing and contributing, i would need to speak to you mhb
[15:20] <mhb> kiefer: sure
[15:21] <Jucato> hhahah I specifically mentioned python :)
[15:21] <Jucato> so don't blame me :P
[15:21] <kiefer> But, the only issue is-
[15:21] <mhb> most of the apps we do are Python/QT, because you can do more in less time with python
[15:21] <kiefer> im a native windows guy, i only migrated to kubuntu a month or so ago, still learning my way around
[15:21] <mhb> same as with any higher-level language
[15:22] <kiefer> Yah, i took a peak a some python source, didnt seem to complex
[15:22] <jpatrick> apachelogger: basically a KDE package should not Depend: on a ton of other stuff, but the things it actually needs
[15:22] <mhb> kiefer: nah, it's pretty simple, that's the beauty of it
[15:22] <kiefer> it shouldnt take me long to grasp the basics of Python
[15:22] <kiefer> Haha ^_^
[15:22] <apachelogger> jpatrick: other stuff would for example be?
[15:22] <jpatrick> apachelogger: and for some reason, admin creates a recursive dependency hell
[15:22] <apachelogger> well, recursive does mean it depends on the package eitherway, doesn't it?
[15:23] <kiefer> I was hoping to get something simple to do first off, as i dont wanna commit to something i cant do
[15:23] <mhb> kiefer: of course, if you preferred the classic way of C++, you can join the KDE upstream project (those guys who participate in KDE)
[15:23] <mhb> but I guess starting with Kubuntu is a good thing
[15:23] <mhb> then perhaps finding the thing you like most
[15:23] <mhb> we're very beginner-friendly here
[15:24] <kiefer> haha ive noticed
[15:24] <jpatrick> apachelogger: example: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55342/
[15:24] <kiefer> im rather keen to learn python
[15:24] <kiefer> ive found there are few languages that cant be grasped in a short time after learning languages like C/C++ and Java
[15:26] <apachelogger> jpatrick: well, pretty obvious it's recursive...
[15:27] <apachelogger> ...which makes it a kinda pointless issue IMHO
[15:27] <apachelogger> pointless issues should either be fixed 100% automagically or not at all
[15:27] <jpatrick> apachelogger: yep, I know, but they're so keen on it
[15:27]  * jussi01 does a hardy dance :D "its hardy time, hardy time... "
[15:27] <apachelogger> mhhh, makes me not wanna join development I guess
[15:28] <mhb> kiefer: well, the main python project we have (which sadly doesn't have much attention) is guidance
[15:28] <apachelogger> jpatrick: would be a perfect job for people which get paied for the time they invest ;-)
[15:28] <mhb> it's a set of python/kde configuration tools
[15:29] <apachelogger> mhb: is there actually any port going on right now?
[15:29]  * apachelogger is wondering whether embedding the KDE 3 version in the KDE 4 systemsettings would work
[15:29] <kiefer> mhb: Sounds cool, is there anything I can be responsible for? Im also getting into Doc writing..
[15:30] <mhb> kiefer: get the source code by "apt-get source kde-guidance" and take a look at it
[15:30] <kiefer> Will do
[15:30] <mhb> kiefer: try to read the code and understand what it does
[15:30] <mhb> I think the "userconfig" module is especially good for that - it's rather simple
[15:30] <kiefer> Alright, ill get back at you in 5-10 mins
[15:30] <mhb> sure
[15:30] <mhb> apachelogger: no.
[15:30] <apachelogger> nice
[15:30]  * apachelogger goes testing
[15:31] <mhb> apachelogger: I've done some systemsettings KDE4 testing myself
[15:31] <kiefer> mhb: where will the source be DL'd to?
[15:31] <mhb> your local directory
[15:31] <kiefer> Ohk, cheers
[15:31] <apachelogger> mhb: got anywhere?
[15:31] <mhb> apachelogger: yes and no.
[15:31] <apachelogger> cool ;-)
[15:32] <mhb> apachelogger: the good thing is that systemsettings' entries are just .desktop files
[15:32] <mhb> apachelogger: the bad thing is the parser is very strict, so they must be bound with another .desktop file which must contain a link to a KDE4 KCM module
[15:33] <mhb> so you can't just create a .desktop file with a "Exec=" option and wish that it executes correctly
[15:33] <mhb> it doesn't
[15:33] <mhb> if it doesn't contain a link to the KCM library, it ignores the .desktop file
[15:33] <apachelogger> :S
[15:34] <apachelogger> mhb: could we create some wrapper libraries?
[15:34] <apachelogger> very basic code, just to invoce the actual cm
[15:34] <mhb> well, we could create a "dummy" KCM library that executes what we want it to
[15:34] <mhb> that could be possible
[15:34] <mhb> but it's not trivial
[15:34] <apachelogger> :S
[15:35] <apachelogger> so we probably should patch the parser
[15:35] <mhb> yes, that's option 2
[15:36] <mhb> I expect it to be a bit easier
[15:36] <mhb> but you'd still have to do some code digging before you hit the gold
[15:42] <kiefer> mhb: So ive skimmed through some of the source, and most of it seems pretty self explanitory - Nothing i cant cope with
[15:47] <mhb> kiefer: I guess we should start with Qt/KDE introduction
[15:48] <kiefer> If you think thats whats needed, im really following your guidance here lol
[15:48] <mhb> kiefer: well those apps need porting to a new version of Qt, Qt4 (they're written in Qt3). The first task would be to design the UI in a Qt4 GUI building tool called "Qt designer"
[15:48] <kiefer> okay
[15:48] <kiefer> do continue..
[15:49] <mhb> it has a package in Kubuntu called "qt4-designer"
[15:49] <kiefer> should i be getting that now?
[15:49] <mhb> sure
[15:50] <Jucato> btw there's also https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuTutorialsDay/PyKDE from Riddell
[15:50] <mhb> you can launch the app using the command "python userconfig.py" or "python mountconfig.py" in the respective directory
[15:51] <mhb> so I guess your first "real" job should be to open mountconfig, launch the Qt4 Designer app and recreate the UI of mountconfig in that application
[15:51] <mhb> (I've already got userconfig covered, that's why I recommend mountconfig)
[15:52] <kiefer> okie doke
[15:53] <kiefer> ill have a look at mountconfig while qt4-designer is installing
[15:53] <mhb> kiefer: the Qt designer app is really great, because you can drag and drop GUI elements pretty fast
[15:53] <mhb> you'll get to know what they are called and stuff...
[15:53] <kiefer> Haha, So it should be pretty simple? just mimic the existing interface right?
[15:53] <mhb> yeah
[15:53] <kiefer> Sounds easy
[15:54] <mhb> kiefer: actually the old "mountconfig" makes a mistake of having the UI hardcoded
[15:55] <mhb> that's not a good practice because modifying it later is hard
[15:55] <kiefer> ohk, yeah i can see where your coming from
[15:55] <mhb> using the Qt Designer you can create & edit stuff really easily, and it'll produce a file that can be used directly by your app
[15:56] <Jucato> dynamically loaded too right?
[15:56] <mhb> right
[15:56] <kiefer> wow, handy
[15:57] <kiefer> Uh-Oh...
[15:57] <mhb> trouble?
[15:57] <kiefer> Lemme paste-bin it
[16:00] <kiefer> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55347/
[16:01] <mhb> kiefer: hmm
[16:02] <mhb> kiefer: it looks like somebody started with UI porting already
[16:02] <mhb> that's good
[16:02] <kiefer> Lol. the early bird gets the worm
[16:02] <mhb> you can try opening mountconfig-qt4.ui in Qt Designer
[16:02] <kiefer> Okay, will do - its installing now
[16:05] <kiefer> would the .ui file be in the mountconfig dir?
[16:05] <mhb> hmm
[16:05] <kiefer> i only see 'fuser_ui.ui"
[16:05] <mhb> yes
[16:05] <mhb> you use Gutsy, I presume
[16:05] <kiefer> Yeah
[16:06] <mhb> okay, plan B
[16:06] <mhb> you need to fetch the most up-to-date code by:
[16:06] <mhb> svn co svn://anonsvn.kde.org/home/kde/branches/extragear/kde3/utils/guidance (it creates a guidance/ directory with the code)
[16:08] <mhb> it uses the Version Control System called SVN to check out (fetch) the most recent version of guidance in the KDE SVN server
[16:08] <kiefer> ohk, im installing svn atm :P
[16:11] <kiefer> okay done, where did it place the guidance/ dir?
[16:11] <mhb> in the current directory again
[16:11] <mhb> I hope
[16:11] <kiefer> haha ...yep it did
[16:12] <mhb> does it still produce the error when you run "python mountconfig.py" ?
[16:13] <kiefer> ...yeah, unfortunatly
[16:13] <mhb> hrm, must be some library
[16:13] <mhb> is your system fully updated?
[16:13] <kiefer> i believe so yeah
[16:14] <kiefer> though, i am rather kubuntu newb
[16:14] <mhb> strange
[16:14] <kiefer> so i wouldnt trust what i say lol
[16:14] <mhb> could you try running "sudo apt-get update" in the console
[16:14] <kiefer> sure
[16:14] <mhb> (which refreshes the list of packages)
[16:15] <kiefer> yup, a big list
[16:15] <kiefer> lol
[16:15] <mhb> then try "sudo apt-get build-dep kde-guidance"
[16:15] <kiefer> kk
[16:15] <mhb> that should update (or install) all packages that are needed to build guidance
[16:15] <mhb> I hope it helps
[16:15] <kiefer> haha i guess we'll find out soon :P
[16:16] <kiefer> my net speed is suprisingley fast tonoght...
[16:16] <kiefer> well, for wireless anyway ^_^
[16:16] <kiefer> tonight*
[16:17] <kiefer> 179kb/s isnt bad considering its a pretty weak signal, the walls in my house are rather thick
[16:26] <mhb> Riddell: out of curiousity - are we going to see an official announcement about UDS soon?
[16:27] <kiefer> mhb: okay, all guidance build packages now installed...
[16:27] <mhb> kiefer: did it help?
[16:28] <kiefer> mhb: yup, works perfectly now :P
[16:28] <mhb> thank God
[16:28] <Riddell> mhb: at some point yes, dunno when
[16:28] <kiefer> haha
[16:28] <mhb> Riddell: okay, thanks.
[16:29] <kiefer> mhb: So should I move onto building a copy of it in qt4-designer now?
[16:30] <mhb> kiefer: well, first open the "mountconfig-qt4.ui" file and check how complete it is
[16:30] <kiefer> will do
[16:31] <kiefer> where should "mountconfig-qt4.ui" be located?
[16:32] <mhb> in the mountconfig/ directory
[16:32] <mhb> in the SVN checkout
[16:32] <mhb> is it there?
[16:33] <kiefer> the only 'ui file in there is fuser_ui.ui    :S
[16:33] <kiefer> .ui*
[16:33] <mhb> hmm
[16:33] <mhb> that means only one thing
[16:33] <kiefer> the world is coming to an end?
[16:33] <jjesse> i broke it?
[16:33] <kiefer> aliens exist?
[16:33] <mhb> that I myself have tried to do it earlier
[16:34] <mhb> well
[16:34] <mhb> let me paste bin it
[16:34] <kiefer> okie
[16:35] <kiefer> though i must warn you, while i greatly appreciate all the time you spending helping me out here, its almost 3:30am here, and i need sleep soon lol
[16:35] <mhb> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55355/
[16:35] <mhb> ah, sorry
[16:36] <kiefer> Haha no problem, ive still got 15-30 mins in me
[16:37] <kiefer> with the pastebin text, i should save that as a *insert file extension here* file?
[16:37] <mhb> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55356/ for the fuser_ui-qt4.ui
[16:38] <mhb> as a .ui file
[16:38] <mhb> both of them
[16:38] <kiefer> okie doke
[16:39] <mhb> hmm
[16:39] <mhb> so I guess the best thing to do
[16:39] <mhb> would be to look at those two
[16:39] <mhb> and create a .ui file for serviceconfig
[16:39] <mhb> I haven't tried that one yet :o)
[16:39] <mhb> now you have reference examples, which is even better :o)
[16:40] <kiefer> yeah :P cheers
[16:40] <mhb> so I propose you go to sleep today and try it tomorrow or whenever you have time
[16:40] <kiefer> haha, ill poke around for a bit then head off
[16:40] <mhb> great ... I hope we'll meet again :o)
[16:40] <kiefer> me too :)
[16:42] <kiefer> So to clarify, my goals for 2moz are: *Insert goals here please :) *
[16:43] <nosrednaekim> two words "world domination"
[16:43] <kiefer> thats been a goal for a long time ^_^
[16:43] <mhb> kiefer: just try and sketch the serviceconfig UI in the Qt4 designer app
[16:44] <kiefer> okay, ill hop to it in the morning, for now i think your right - bed time *yawns*
[16:44] <mhb> once you think it behaves well (there's a Preview option there so you can check how it looks like), we'll move on
[16:44] <kiefer> Night guys
[16:44] <kiefer> okay awesome :)
[16:44] <mhb> night
[16:44] <nosrednaekim> night
[16:44] <mhb> and thanks
[16:44] <mhb> hope you don't change your mind in the morning :o)
[16:44] <Jucato> (too late)
[16:44] <nosrednaekim> heh
[16:44] <mhb> right.
[16:45] <Jucato> mhb got himself an apprentice :)
[16:45] <mhb> Jucato: well
[16:45]  * Jucato imagines mhb in a Donald Trump way :)
[16:45] <mhb> Jucato: I've lost ~3 of those real fast
[16:45] <Jucato> ok, now that Trump image fits perfectly then :P
[16:45]  * Jucato imagines mhb point... "You're fired"
[16:45] <mhb> hehe :o)
[16:46] <mhb> it's usually "thanks for the enthusiasm, I hope to hear from you soon"
[16:46] <mhb> and they never come back
[16:46] <mhb> not that I'm angry :o)
[16:46] <mhb> that's how it works
[16:46] <mhb> for every 3 of them there's one nosrednaekim that stays
[16:46] <mhb> and that counts
[16:47] <Jucato> oh nosrednaekim was your apprentice?
[16:47] <mhb> nosrednaekim: congratulations on so many +1s at the meeting
[16:47]  * Jucato stays away....
[16:47] <mhb> no, not really
[16:47]  * nosrednaekim is now a multimillion $ reality show winner....
[16:47] <Jucato> do you still need nixternal's +1? same as claydoh?
[16:47] <nosrednaekim> yeah, I think so
[16:47] <Jucato> won't be too hard :)
[16:48] <Jucato> just give nixternal a shiny holographic vista sticker and you're good to go :P
[16:48] <mhb> nosrednaekim: too bad my +1 doesn't count (yet), otherwise you'd get it :o)
[16:48] <Jucato> mhb: you'll have your chance... council changes in May :D
[16:48] <mhb> excellent
[16:49] <mhb> better start my campaign soon
[16:50] <nosrednaekim> mhb: I think you've been doing the campaign for the past two years :)
[16:51] <nosrednaekim> mhb: BTW, how is the new restricted manager going?
[16:52] <jussi01> !nixternal
[16:52] <ubotu> Oh no!  The pointy-clicky Vista lover has arrived!  He's rumoured to be giving out free money, too!
[16:53] <nosrednaekim> bwahaha
[16:53] <Jucato> mhb: what campaign? as if you had any competition around :)
[16:54]  * jussi01 goes to nominate, just so mhb can feel good when he wins...
[16:54] <Jucato> 3 months too early? :)
[16:55] <jussi01> Jucato: you can never start too early :P
[16:55]  * Jucato winds back the clock to 2006
[16:55] <Jucato> ok start now :)
[16:55] <jussi01> LOL
[16:57] <mhb> jussi01: well, there will be 2 places anyway
[16:57] <mhb> nosrednaekim: I wanted to hack on it right now, but I mentored a newcomer for a while
[16:58] <mhb> nosrednaekim: it's pretty much working, just 2 larger things to do: download progress and notification icon
[16:58] <jussi01> hehe, dont think Im really experienced enough to go for it really...
[16:58] <mhb> I guess so.
[16:58] <nosrednaekim> I thought adept_batch had download rate?
[16:58] <mhb> nosrednaekim: it does
[16:58] <mhb> nosrednaekim: but you need to download firmware, too
[16:58] <mhb> nosrednaekim: for some drivers
[16:58]  * jussi01 goes to reboot, from the live cd to hardy
[16:58] <nosrednaekim> oh.... right.
[16:58] <mhb> nosrednaekim: and that has to be done within r-m
[16:58] <Jucato> speaking of adept batch...
[16:59] <Jucato> mhb: I think there's a bug, dunno if it's really adept_batch, but looks more like language-selector-qt. since it's python, you might want to check it out or send someone to check it out :)
[17:00] <mhb> Jucato: in hardy? # ?
[17:00] <Jucato> bug 129186
[17:00] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 129186 in adept "language-selector-qt false success notification" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/129186
[17:00] <mhb> there's a bug in Kaffeine that forced me to use Totem for viewing MPFC yesterday
[17:00] <Jucato> since gutsy...
[17:01] <Jucato> I'm actually thinking it's language-selector-qt, despite my last comment. seems like Adept Batch does return a value depending on success or failure, but the selector doesn't do anything about it if the user cancels downloading
[17:02] <Jucato> er.. not my last comment, but the 2nd to the last :P
[17:04]  * Jucato will have to ask mornfall or yuriy for some small adept help next week if he still can't figure out how Installer works by then...
[17:10] <nosrednaekim> http://en.andregondim.eti.br/?p=5 << ubuntu catch-up ^_^
[17:11] <mhb> nosrednaekim: I've ranted about it a while ago
[17:11] <mhb> nosrednaekim: it's not nice of them to dismiss our implementation and hack their own backend without trying to ask us on cooperating
[17:11] <nosrednaekim> heh... was some of the code borrowed from our mount config?
[17:12] <mhb> nosrednaekim: they've never asked about sharing code
[17:12] <Jucato> maybe they just took :)
[17:12] <mhb> nosrednaekim: so unless they took it without saying, they developed their own backend
[17:12] <nosrednaekim> ouch.....
[17:13] <mhb> which means someone will have to create a common backend soon
[17:13] <mhb> or otherwise, their app will get all the fixes and we'll just bit rot
[17:13] <mhb> I'm afraid they're going to say "sorry, our backend is finished, if you want to have a common core, *you* write it"
[17:14] <nosrednaekim> which is painfully typical.
[17:14] <mhb> so some good-natured Kubuntu fellow will have to fix their incorrect approach to research
[17:20] <nosrednaekim> >.<
[17:39] <coreymon77> hi everyone
[17:39] <coreymon77> how did the meeting go
[17:40] <mhb> it was not much
[17:40] <coreymon77> did nosrednaekim get +1?
[17:41] <mhb> yes but there wasn't enough council members
[17:41] <coreymon77> he deserves it
[17:41] <coreymon77> he deserved it before i ever did
[17:42] <coreymon77> i would have been there, it was just too early for me
[17:44] <mhb> Riddell: do you think that someone would add the packaging bits to the jockey kde frontend if I managed to finish the code soon?
[17:49]  * ScottK guesses jpatrick or apachelogger_ would be all over it.
[17:50] <apachelogger_> hehe
[17:50] <ScottK> Am I wrong?
[17:50] <apachelogger_> mhb: ye can bet your keyboard on that :P
[17:53] <mhb> apachelogger_: groovy.
[17:56] <apachelogger_> mhb: finished, just need the code :P
[17:58] <mhb> apachelogger_: I'm trying
[18:10]  * apachelogger_ is branching k-d-s
[18:14] <manchicken> So, I've heard that there are going to be better Perl bindings for KDE4.
[18:18] <manchicken> Ooh: http://kde-apps.org/content/show.php/Perl+Qt4?content=69747
[18:19] <mhb> Perl?
[18:19] <mhb> hmm
[18:19] <manchicken> Yea :)
[18:19] <mhb> I love Python.
[18:19] <mhb> really.
[18:19] <manchicken> That's cool.
[18:20] <manchicken> Perl and Python know how to play nice from what I've heard :P
[18:20] <apachelogger_> I love Ruby.
[18:20] <manchicken> They're both pretty strong glue languages.
[18:20] <mhb> of course, Lisp is nice, too :o)
[18:20] <manchicken> Ruby is neat, syntactically, but its runtime is slow and buggy still.
[18:21] <manchicken> Perl has been around for 20 years now.  Python's been around at least half as long.  Ruby needs to take time to catch up.
[18:21]  * manchicken doesn't follow Python as much since it doesn't pay his bills...
[18:22] <manchicken> Woah woah woah, this guy replaced all of the Qt4 array-type classes (e.g. qvector, qlist) with Perl arrays...
[18:22] <manchicken> That's kinda stupid.
[18:22] <manchicken> Not even the Qt3 bindings did that.
[18:23] <manchicken> The Qt3 bindings had everything except for the network and filesystem classes.
[18:23] <manchicken> And threading classes.
[18:23] <manchicken> Which made them great for GUI scripts, but not so much for applications.
[18:25] <manchicken> The Perl Gnome2 libraries even give you VFS access.  That's nice.
[18:25] <jpatrick> manchicken: I'm a perl+Python+Ruby guy
[18:25] <manchicken> I'd like to see better Perl bindings for KDE.
[18:25] <manchicken> jpatrick: Cool.  I'm mostly Perl, but I've played in Python and Ruby, too.
[18:27] <manchicken> What's hilarious is that I bet I could use Qt3 libraries for the GUI and gnome2::vfs libraries for the actual asynchronous I/O and they'd work better together than just Qt3 or Qt4 bindings by themselves.
[18:27] <jpatrick> http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=132994
[18:27] <ubotu> KDE bug 132994 in general "Pluto is not a planet" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
[18:27] <manchicken> Very nice.
[18:27] <ScottK> jpatrick: Got your SRU proposal ready for that?
[18:27] <manchicken> But the fix hasn't been released yet?
[18:28] <jpatrick> ScottK: :)
[18:49]  * apachelogger_ needs a Riddell
[18:50] <apachelogger_> jpatrick: do you think splitting k-d-s in kde3 and kde4 makes all that much sense?
[18:50] <jpatrick> apachelogger_: yes, not everyone wants KDE 4
[18:51] <ScottK> Dear all KDE4 fanboys: Please don't break my existing, working KDE3 install that I use every day for actual $WORK and needs to not die.
[18:51] <apachelogger_> jpatrick: yeah
[18:51] <apachelogger_> but the paths are different anyway
[18:52] <ScottK> apachelogger_: If you want something to do, updating eric to 4.1.0 might be nice.
[18:52] <apachelogger_> also, if we split, either -kde4 needs to depend on the kde3 or we have to duplicate the data
[18:53] <apachelogger_> ScottK: eric?
[18:53] <ScottK> It's an Python IDE written in QT.  It's an alternative to Idle (thing Monty Python references).
[18:54]  * apachelogger_ raises his finger
[18:54]  * jpatrick hugs his vim
[18:54] <apachelogger_> ruby
[18:54] <jpatrick> ScottK: see what I said about Ruby and apachelogger_ ? :-)
[18:54] <ScottK> Which finger?
[18:55] <apachelogger_> the one I press the J button with :P
[18:55] <apachelogger_> s/button/key
[18:56] <ScottK> jpatrick: I'm pretty sure I'm about to advocate kde4-style-bespin if you want to be looking it over again to we might get it uploaded.
[18:56]  * apachelogger_ is wondering
[18:57] <apachelogger_> didn't I advocate?
[18:57] <apachelogger_> or did I wait for someone else, since I was ready to upload?
[18:57] <apachelogger_> *shrug*
[18:57] <jpatrick> ScottK: I thought I did
[18:57] <apachelogger_> ah
[18:57] <apachelogger_> I think I wanted an update
[18:57] <apachelogger_> so apparently I did wait for jpatrick to advocate :P
[18:58] <ScottK> jpatrick: You did, but he had some stuff to fix, so it needs it again.
[18:58] <jpatrick> ScottK: if he did +1
[18:58] <ScottK> jpatrick: Please go to REVU and mark it.
[18:59] <jpatrick> I am, it's just lagging
[18:59] <ScottK> K
[19:01] <jpatrick> ScottK: done
[19:02] <ScottK> K.  Just finished the test build here.  Let me check a few things and then I'll probably upload it.
[19:16] <Lure> Riddell: sorry for missing the meeting today - I am fine giving my +1 for nosrednaekim and claydoh
[19:16]  * Lure still needs to integrate one nosrednaekim's patch in guidance ;-)
[19:18] <Lure> Riddell: re: kmilo brightness support: I can easly give you debdiff for dcop, but problem is that gutsy testers claim that it does not help :-(
[19:23] <ScottK> jpatrick: Sadly no.  That wasn't it.  The man page error persists.
[20:01] <nixternal> Riddell: claydoh and nosrednaekim get a +1 from me
[20:04] <nixternal> mornin' by the way :)
[20:04] <jjesse> will addiotnal widgets only bereleased through the extragears package or can somoene get them from something like kde-look?
[20:04] <jjesse> its afternoon nixternal
[20:04] <nixternal> jjesse: yes
[20:04] <nixternal> :)
[20:04] <nixternal> to both actually
[20:04] <nixternal> I think widgets will be able to be pulled in from the Get Hot New Stuff stuff
[20:04] <jjesse> but not in the hardy time frame?
[20:04] <nixternal> ya, I just woke up about 30 minutes ago :)
[20:04] <nixternal> 4.1
[20:04] <nixternal> so hardy+1
[20:05] <jjesse> ok
[20:05] <jjesse> will the extragears package be installed via default
[20:08] <jjesse> also what is the name of the icon in the top right of my desktop?
[20:08] <apachelogger_> Riddell: kde4 stuff pushed sto k-d-s, please have a look at it
[20:08] <jjesse> that allows me to add packages, zoom out, etc?
[20:12] <Lure> jjesse: Plasma Toolbox
[20:12] <jjesse> thanks Lure
[20:12] <Lure> jjesse: from here http://techbase.kde.org/Projects/Plasma/FAQ
[20:24] <jjesse> ah thanks page is helping out
[20:26] <jjesse> why aren't default kde applications in spell check?
[20:26] <jjesse> such as Kopete shows up as misspelled in open office
[20:28] <ScottK> jjesse: Open Office isn't a KDE application is I would guess the reason.
[20:29] <jjesse> yeah i but i iwsh ther was a way for the kde apps to already in spell check
[20:29] <jjesse> heck the "ubuntu apps"
[20:30] <selckin> make it :)
[20:49] <smarter> iirc, there's an "ubuntu" dictionnary in the OOo shipped by ubuntu
[20:52] <ScottK> smarter: I still got the same error on your bespin package.  Let me know when you've got it shaped up and I"ll look again.
[20:55] <smarter> ScottK: that's strange, I followed what lintian said ([:u] instead of ü), I don't know if there's another way :/
[20:55] <ScottK> Hmmm
[20:57] <ScottK> Kmanpart displays it correctly, so I'm not going to worry about it then.
[20:57] <smarter> ScottK: how do you get this warning?
[20:57] <ScottK> Ran lintian -Ii against the .deb
[20:57] <ScottK> That's a big i and an little i
[20:58] <smarter> it doesn't output anything
[20:58] <ScottK> Do you have the version from gutsy-backports or Hardy?
[20:58] <smarter> I'm running hardy
[20:59] <ScottK> Hmmm
[20:59] <smarter> --help says v1.23.42
[21:00] <ScottK> Weird.  Same version I've got.
[21:00]  * ScottK is gonna go ahead and upload it.
[21:00] <smarter> hold on a sec'
[21:01] <ScottK> K
[21:02] <smarter> strange
[21:02] <smarter> I ran lintian on kde4-style-bespin_0.1\~svn080206-0ubuntu1_source.changes and got "md5sum-mismatch-in-changes-file", it disappeared after another debuild -S -sa
[21:02] <smarter> should I reupload?
[21:03] <ScottK> It probably means you changed something.
[21:03] <smarter> I'm uploading, we'll see the debdiff ;)
[21:04] <ScottK> K
[21:10] <smarter> ScottK: it is empty :o http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/diff.py?upid1=1874&upid2=1883
[21:11] <ScottK> Yeah
[21:11]  * ScottK is gonna upload unless you want another shot at it.
[21:12] <smarter> ScottK: go ahead :)
[21:13] <ScottK> Done.  Thank you for your contribution to Kubuntu.
[21:14] <smarter> thank you too (:
[21:14] <coreymon77> nosrednaekim: you around?
[21:14] <smarter> The QDevelop package is close to be ready now I think
[21:14] <smarter> I'm talking with the upstream author to get ride of the get-orig-source
[21:15] <smarter> the fact that he is french help a lot :)
[22:45] <seele> how do you know which kde project to submit a bug under in launchpad?
[22:53] <nixternal> heh, watching Jonos talk at SCALE, and the LOCO map he is showing is mine..need to tell him that I didn't copyright for him to use :p
[22:53] <nixternal> seele: you kind of need to know I guess...it can be a pita at times
[22:54] <nixternal> you need to know what apps belong to kdebase, kde* this and that
[22:54] <seele> yeah.. which i dont really know
[22:54] <mhb> launchpad is not all roses
[22:54] <nixternal> so true
[22:54] <mhb> do you know of any profound git vs. bzr article?
[22:55] <nixternal> I don't even understand it fully and I have been messing with it for a few years now
[22:55] <nixternal> mhb: there is an article out there that actually goes over quite a few of the revision control systems
[22:55] <nixternal> it is fairly recent too
[22:55] <mhb> because I thought git is harder to use, but then I read the tutorial and it seems quite easy to use
[22:55] <mhb> also "git dissect" seems awesome
[22:55] <nixternal> git is pretty nice, so is mercurial
[22:56] <mhb> there's a lot of apps adopting git
[22:56] <mhb> and you know I am very much against having two apps do the same thing
[22:57] <mhb> if git were as good as bzr, I'd say use it.
[22:57] <mhb> of course, I'm very much like Linus sometimes.
[22:58] <mhb> (w.r.t. opinions, not skill :o)
[22:58] <ScottK> If I ran into bzr anywhere but Ubuntu I'd consider it.
[22:58] <toma> quote alert
[22:58] <mhb> toma: quote alert?
[22:58] <mhb> :o)
[22:58] <nixternal> whenever I push or pull large updates with bzr, I kind of feel like I am watching a "Windows Update"...a little movement, but who knows what is going on :)
[22:59] <mhb> I meant I'm a self-centered bastard, not a good programmer
[22:59]  * nixternal goes to put on some lotion
[22:59] <mhb> nixternal: well if there was an app that does the same thing but faster (and git is by all references faster)
[22:59] <seele> it puts it on its skin, or it gets the hose again
[23:00] <ScottK> nixternal: TMI
[23:01] <mhb> what do you folks think?
[23:01] <mhb> do you have any XP with git? Bad ones, preferably?
[23:02] <selckin> git is great
[23:03] <mhb> selckin: well
[23:03] <ScottK> Both git and bzr take some mindset adjustments when coming from cvs/svn that I haven't had the spare brain cycles to get through yet.
[23:03] <nixternal> seele: hahaha, quit watching Joe Dir!
[23:03] <nixternal> err, Joe Dirt, pronounced Deertay
[23:03] <selckin> ones you get over that ScottK you'll never want to use anything but git
[23:04] <ScottK> May be.  Dunno yet.
[23:04] <nixternal> ScottK: I am with you and those brain cycles...SVN is just so much easier for me
[23:04] <mhb> selckin: I would be happy if you were right
[23:04] <mhb> selckin: however, I am a science-type guy, and I like facts
[23:04] <nixternal> ya, I heard people say the same thing about Mercurial
[23:05] <nixternal> but why is the executabled called 'hg'?
[23:05] <selckin> git is just a better mercurial
[23:05] <nixternal> hg clone http://some.where.on.the.net/
[23:07] <mhb> nixternal: you don't know?
[23:07] <mhb> nixternal: man you were bad at chemistry
[23:07] <nixternal> yup, failed it and never took it again
[23:07] <nixternal> and that was about 20 years ago too
[23:07] <mhb> nixternal: we had to take it
[23:08] <mhb> nixternal: for about 5 years
[23:08] <mhb> at high school
[23:08] <nixternal> I got around it by taking Biology and Botany
[23:08] <mhb> hg is a chemical name for mercury
[23:08] <mhb> hydrargyrum
[23:08] <ScottK> name/symbol for the pedantic in the room.
[23:09] <mhb> ScottK: me?
[23:09] <mhb> or what do you mean?
[23:10] <mhb> ah, now's the bad part - the bad old guy is going to shoot Farrell
[23:34] <ScottK> hg is a chemical symbol, not a chemical name.
[23:34] <mhb> ScottK: and I am Czech, not English.
[23:35] <ScottK> Of course.
[23:35] <ScottK> The pedantic one was me.
[23:35] <mhb> ScottK: but thanks, next time I'll try to say it correctly.
[23:50] <mhb> silent again? aww
[23:51] <seaLne> nixternal: so did you work out if the kubuntu tshirts would fit you?


[00:12] <daftykins> welcome back!
[00:12] <daftykins> any dramas delaying you?
[00:21] <Bashing-om> not drama, really .... Just got a late start on the day and catching up a bit on winterization . It is going to turn cold here this night !
[00:22] <daftykins> ah har
[00:22] <daftykins> i was that way today, took a while to get goin', then i realised there was nothing to get goin' for!
[00:22] <daftykins> free assassin's creed 3 on ubisoft's uplay right now, for any gamers
[00:23] <Bashing-om> I get out of sorts when my IRC routine is disrupted :)
[00:24] <daftykins> :D
[00:33] <Ben64> winterization?
[00:33] <daftykins> the coldening!
[00:33] <Ben64> i don't understand
[00:33] <daftykins> i suspect Bashing-om casts a spell of protection upon his abode :)
[00:34] <Ben64> i'm in southern california
[00:34] <Ben64> low of 42F tonight
[00:35] <daftykins> i die at 24 deg C and up
[00:35] <daftykins> gotta sleep, ta-ra \o
[00:36] <Ben64> 24*9/5+32....
[00:36] <Ben64> 75F ?
[00:36] <daftykins> something around there
[00:36] <Ben64> thats not hot
[00:36] <Bashing-om> Location: Heber Springs, AR ~ Temp: 37°F (3°C) ~ Cond: Overcast ~ Humid: 65% ~ Wind: 5 mph (8 km/h) ~ Time: 18:15
[00:36] <daftykins> 'tis for me
[00:36] <Ben64> 75 is slightly warmer than room temp
[00:37] <daftykins> maybe for a room over there
[00:37] <Ben64> heh
[00:37] <daftykins> but yeah i visited a friend in Houston where it was 34 but 'feels like 41' uuuuugh
[00:37] <daftykins> i barely survived
[00:42] <Ben64> houston is terrible
[04:36] <lotuspsychje> good morning guys
[04:36] <lotuspsychje> quick jumpin before work
[04:37] <Bashing-om> coffee ! 1st .. that cognitive fluid :)
[04:39] <lotuspsychje> yeah and a pslice of bread n cheese
[04:40] <Bashing-om> makes the coffee so much the better .
[05:57] <lotuspsychje> have a nice one guys, working day here
[06:13] <Bashing-om> Welp . that time again :
[07:12] <ducasse> morning all
[08:04] <lordievader> Good morning
[08:06] <ducasse> hi lordievader, how are you today?
[08:08] <lordievader> Doing okay here, got coffee at my side.
[08:08] <lordievader> How are you?
[08:09] <ducasse> good thanks. just drinking tea and waiting for activity :)
[12:32] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[12:47] <ducasse> wb BluesKaj, how's life?
[12:49] <BluesKaj> doing fine here, ducasse, and you?
[12:50] <BluesKaj> we have about 15cm snow on the ground...winter has definitely settled in
[12:55] <ducasse> i'm fine thanks, it's very much winter here too. yesterday people were encouraged not to drive here, as the ice made it too risky.
[13:00] <OerHeks> please, send us snow \0/
[13:02] <ducasse> give it a few weeks.
[13:03] <OerHeks> a.t.a. 27 december please
[13:04] <OerHeks> so the firecrackers get wet
[13:07] <ducasse> only ground-level fireworks are allowed here now, that has reduced fires a lot
[13:53] <\9> seasons are pretty screwed up over here
[13:53] <\9> we went from summer to winter to autumn
[13:54] <\9> by winter i mean we had first snow for like two weeks
[19:36] <Bashing-om> Hey, hey ,, Here I be - up and runnning on that SSD . Up for an hour and no freezes .. let's see what the haps be as I continue !
[19:37] <daftykins> :O!
[19:37] <daftykins> fingers crossed :)
[19:37] <daftykins> still running the new BIOS chip and graphics card?
[19:39] <Bashing-om> Uh Huh .! so far so good . Logs say there are no problems . BUT BUT I have the spinners disconnected .. and with them disconnected I get NO ata errors from the system ... hummmm >.. there is going to be a story here someway .
[19:40] <daftykins> O_O
[19:41] <daftykins> so it could be one mechanical was flaky?
[19:43] <Bashing-om> daftykins: Or the sata controller ??? .. have swapped out drives a couple of times and moved them around.. and what I should do is install these drives in another box .. see how those old drives then look; that I "suspect" as having issues .
[19:45] <daftykins> that's true
[19:48] <Bashing-om> If when I am sure this system is stable as is ... I reconnect the spinners .. wekk I do think the next thing is to fire up another box and install the spinners in that alternate system and "see" then . That however is a long range forcast :)
[19:50] <daftykins> hehe
[19:50] <daftykins> or hook them up now one by one and do some file operations whilst watching the logs
[19:53] <Bashing-om> daftykins: Yep ! ^ great thought ! .. I gonna run as is for a spell or so .. Make sure the system is no longer freezing . Last go araound took a few hours to freeze up - with no indications from the logs as to why .
[19:54] <daftykins> oof that's annoying
[20:06] <Bashing-om> daftykins: In systemd .. is there a better way to see what is current then tailing /var/log/syslog ?
[20:09] <daftykins> i still don't have a clue with it i'm afraid, not running any 16.04's anywhere
[20:09] <OerHeks> journalctl > journalctl --since=today > journalctl -b -0 shows messages from the current boot > journalctl -b -1 from the previous boot
[20:12] <daftykins> :o
[20:12] <daftykins> that must mean +1 is from your future boot ;)
[20:13] <OerHeks> no, journalctl -b 0 iirc
[20:13] <OerHeks> and tomorrow journalctl -b 0-
[20:14] <Bashing-om> OerHeks: K ! Leeme see what journalctl releates realtime. // what I am looking for is current events .. as generally when this system - in the past freezes - there is nothing in the logs .


[08:42] <jass_> hi
[23:21] <MikeRL> It seems Firefox 18 beta 4 is nearing release, but we only have 18 beta 2 on the Firefox Next PPA. Could someone please build a fresh one if they have time? Thanks.
[23:22] <MikeRL> See here: https://launchpad.net/~mozillateam/+archive/firefox-next
[23:24] <MikeRL> By building a newer one, I mean build 18 beta 4 when it is released by Mozilla.


[02:34] <akar> nihao
[02:34] <akar> may I speak in english?
[02:34] <akar> my irc client doesn't support hanzi
[02:42] <ypwong> akar, sure, welcome!
[03:08] <akar> haode
[03:08] <akar> tried install kylin
[03:08] <akar> booting iso using grub2 then install with clicking from desktop icon
[03:09] <akar> wait for installation so long, but seems the installation never finished
[03:09] <akar> already wait one night, but installation never finished
[03:10] <akar> any other method to install kylin?
[03:10] <akar> debootstrap?
[03:50] <JackYu> akar, you use CD or USB ?
[04:19] <akar> not CD not USB
[04:19] <akar> boot iso cd using grub2 loopback
[04:30] <akar> from grub2 console
[04:31] <akar> loopback loop (hd0,msdos10)/kylin.iso
[04:31] <akar> linux (loop)/casper/vmlinuz boot=casper toram ...
[04:31] <akar> initrd (loop)/casper/initrd.lz
[04:31] <akar> so I enter live cd environment but not burn the cd at the first place
[06:53] <akar> anyone try running kylin on qemu kvm?
[07:09] <shijing> @akar have any questions?
[07:10] <akar> shijing: have you ever tried running kylin on kvm?
[07:14] <shijing> @akar  i have ever used
[07:15] <akar> yesterday night I did install kylin on kvm.. but the display is unusable
[07:15] <akar> shijing: how you manage install kylin on kvm successfully?
[07:17] <shijing> akar:I have not used recently, I try again
[07:17] <shijing> , wait..
[07:18] <akar> will wait for shijing :)
[07:18] <akar> you may ask me as well...
[07:18] <akar> wo3shuo3han4yu3, dan4shi4 irc client not support hanzi
[07:19] <akar> i also join ubuntu-cn but terminal emulator not render the characters properly
[07:19] <akar> shijing: what irc client you use?
[07:20] <shijing> akar:Xchat
[08:06] <penghuan> akar, 你可以使用firefox的插件chatzilla
[08:27] <ypwong> akar, you can try webchat.freenode.net
[08:38] <akar> thanks
[08:39] <akar> next time I will try to reconfigure my urxvt so it can render hanzi properly
[08:39] <ypwong> akar, not many people still use rxvt now :)
[08:40] <akar> ypwong: what do you use for terminal emulator?
[08:40] <ypwong> akar, what do you mean by "unsable on kvm", what is the symptom? is it like https://launchpadlibrarian.net/187961309/disco.webm ?
[08:40] <akar> or only termminal
[08:40] <ypwong> gnome-terminal
[08:40] <akar> I use urxvt and irssi
[08:41] <ypwong> a lightweight combination :)
[08:41] <akar> ypwong: the one you send me the link is virtualbox
[08:42] <ypwong> akar, yes i know
[08:42] <akar> did you run kylin succesfully on vbox?
[08:42] <ypwong> just want to check if it's the same case
[08:42] <ypwong> yes I can
[08:42] <akar> where may I send my picture?
[08:42] <akar> sad vbox can run side by side with kvm
[08:43] <akar> ypwong: is vbox pae a must to run kylin properly?
[08:43] <ypwong> http://tinypic.com/ ?
[08:43] <akar> I have other box that run virtualbox but hardware not support PAE / x86 virtualization
[08:43] <akar> ok then will send there
[08:44] <ypwong> https://imgur.com/
[08:44] <akar> correction "sad vbox can't run side by side with kvm"
[08:53] <akar> http://i62.tinypic.com/2qb6v6u.png
[08:55] <akar> left side no launcher, top side no system bar
[08:57] <akar> background not properly displayed
[08:59] <ypwong> akar, are you using daily image?
[09:00] <ypwong> i mean, daily build image
[09:00] <ypwong> looks like unity and many other things are not running
[09:00] <ypwong> hmm, there's window title bar, have you changed to another window manager?
[09:03] <ypwong> akar, by the way, where do you live?
[09:07] <akar> no download iso ubuntukylin 14.10 iso from ubuntu.com
[09:07] <akar> ypwong: I live in jakarta, and you?
[09:29] <ypwong> akar, beijing
[09:36] <akar> xiaxue le ma?
[09:39] <ypwong> akar, not yet
[09:39] <ypwong> quite cold though
[09:46] <akar> then better stay inside, here is rainy season in jakarta
[09:50] <ypwong> akar, winter is rainy there? guess there is no real "winter" in jarkarta :)
[10:17] <akar> no snow, Indonesia tropical climate. means only 2 possibilities
[10:17] <akar> rainy and dry season
[10:18] <akar> ypwong: any qq client in kylin?
[10:28] <akar> ypwong: I am off now see you tomorrow
[10:32] <ypwong> akar, sadly no qq client :(
[10:32] <ypwong> cya


[10:40] <Otviss> Howdy I'm having tons of trouble manually installing grub. sudo apt install --reinstall grub-efi-amd64 tells me the package isnt available
[10:41] <Otviss> I've been following an installation guide for Acer-spin series since ubuntu fails to install grub, and as such you need to install it manually. But it's not working :(
[12:35] <guiverc> you've not said what release; but my system has a `grub-efi-amd64-bin` package installed for example & being precise for your release matters
[12:37] <guiverc> i also do see `grub-efi-amd64` too, eg. 2.06-2ubuntu16 for lunar/23.04
[15:15] <evgamer> O_O
[15:15] <evgamer> ???
[15:15] <evgamer> T
[15:15] <evgamer> T_T
[16:16] <adam_> Hello ?
[16:17] <adam_> Can someone explain to me what this is ?
[20:25] <nikolam> Hi seems to me that on 22.04 Xubuntu, when starting baobab (Disk usage analyzer), I can't enter path of the folder in folder path requester with Ctrl+L .. I paste the path, is but it won't open.. Maybe that is also for the other GNOME apps?..


[12:04] <ompaul> Burgwork, catagories and so one
[12:04] <ompaul> s/one/on
[12:04] <Burgwork> this is really about me being lazy. I get other people to do my work and then I clean it up and take credit ;)
[12:04] <ompaul> yeah we know this :-)
[12:05] <ompaul> but you put a lot of work into this lazy
[12:05] <Burgwork> I try
[12:07] <ompaul> it is noted
[12:08] <ompaul> I am now wondering what I will end up reading to get this boot options stuff and putting it in some order that makes sense - life can be fun
[12:09] <Burgwork> if you can teach someone something, you have truly mastered it
[12:10] <ompaul> Burgwork, why do you think I spend lots of time in #ubuntu :)
[12:10] <ompaul> I learn others learn and its a big happy ubuntu time
[12:10] <ompaul> well mostly
[12:49] <LaserJock> hmm, I wonder if we could ship a "From the Wiki" doc that has HTMLized or XMLized wiki pages
[12:50] <Burgwork> LaserJock, see the thread on the maling list
[12:50] <LaserJock> Burgwork: right, that's what I'm looking at
[12:50] <Burgwork> I don't see it working with our  current wiki
[12:50] <LaserJock> how hard would it be to HTMLize a wiki page?
[12:50] <Burgwork> what do you do with it once it is turned into HTML?
[12:51] <LaserJock> ship it
[12:51] <LaserJock> put it on help.ubuntu.com
[12:51] <Burgwork> that means no translation
[12:51] <Burgwork> why not have two wikis and keep it moin for help.ubuntu.com as well?
[12:51] <LaserJock> well, it seems like an oxymoron to me to have a static wiki :-)
[12:52] <Burgwork> no it is not
[12:52] <Burgwork> it is harnessing the power of hte wiki in a non-traditional way
[12:52] <LaserJock> who would get to edit it? just doc-team members?
[12:52] <Burgwork> exactly
[12:52] <LaserJock> and then we would point to it in our shipped documentation?
[12:52] <Burgwork> with an area to leave comments that doesn't require an account
[12:53] <Burgwork> the interactions of wiki <--> shipped still need to be worked out
[12:54] <LaserJock> if we do have a (more) static wiki then we should be able to have a "From the Wiki" page with links and brief summaries of what is on our wiki
[12:54] <Burgwork> yep, exactly
[12:54] <Burgwork> and we can say "this is good" in a simple way
[12:54] <LaserJock> how would we track changes in the w.u.c pages
[12:54] <Burgwork> what do you mean?'
[12:55] <LaserJock> well, once we import a page into "our" wiki we would have to keep track of the changes in the w.u.c pages and update ours as needed
[12:56] <Burgwork> no, the page would be moved, not copied
[12:56] <LaserJock> oh, I don't think that is a very good idea, but I'll have to think about that
[12:56] <Burgwork> I imagine us moving our in progress docs to doc.ubuntu.com
[12:56] <Burgwork> a redirect would be left and that page locked
[12:57] <LaserJock> but then authors (and others) can't work on their wiki pages
[12:57] <Burgwork> yes they can, because they can be granted write access to them
[12:58] <LaserJock> but then it just turns into a slightly better wiki because we would have quite a few people asking for write access
[12:58] <Burgwork> no
[12:59] <LaserJock> I would think it would turn people off of wanting to improve the doc because they can't edit it in the same way as the w.u.c pages
[12:59] <Burgwork> LaserJock, the pages we would move are pages that are unlikely to see any useful editing, such as RestrictedFormats
[12:59] <LaserJock> I suppose
[01:00] <Burgwork> and there would be an anon comment place
[01:00] <LaserJock> how many pages do you think we are talking about here?
[01:00] <Burgwork> a dozen for starters
[01:00] <LaserJock> that wouldn't be too bad
[01:00] <Burgwork> each page would be need to carefully considered
[01:00] <Burgwork> it would also provide a goal
[01:01] <Burgwork> to get your page moved to help
[01:01] <LaserJock> but then what is the advantage over just turning those into XML and putting them in the svn repo?
[01:01] <Burgwork> sorry, got to run
[01:01] <LaserJock> I agree the motivation factor whould be cool
[01:01] <Burgwork> the advantage is that they are still in the wiki
[01:02] <LaserJock> alright, I see your poing more. I'll let you go now ;-)
[01:02] <LaserJock> s/poing/point/
[02:25] <Skywind> RAYS LX 1.5 Alpha2
[02:25] <Skywind> sorry
[03:01] <mgalvin> i started reading USDF, i think i missed something... what is GWOS?
[03:02] <LaserJock> it's a ubuntuforums splitoff wiki, I think
[03:02] <Kyral> More like a stashhouse for all the HOWTOs in one place ;P
[03:03] <mgalvin> is there a link to a site?
[03:03] <mgalvin> or is this all just talk atm?
[03:04] <LaserJock> no it's very real
[03:04] <mgalvin> hmm... i have been so busy... it seems i have missed a lot :-/
[03:05] <mgalvin> link?
[03:05] <robotgeek> docs.gwos.org
[03:06] <LaserJock> yeah, I just found it
[03:06] <mgalvin> hmm.. server not found
[03:07] <mgalvin> what does the GWOS stand for?
[03:08] <robotgeek> doc.gwos.org, sorry
[03:08] <robotgeek> The Great Wyrms of Sorrow and Regret
[03:09] <robotgeek> that's what it's causing us all
[03:09] <manicka> the UDSF is not a splitoff from the Forums, it is part of the forums
[03:10] <manicka> It is the forums knowledgebase and centralised repo of data
[03:12] <LaserJock> I meant sort of a splitoff from wiki.ubuntu.com
[03:12] <manicka> although it is in the wiki format its purpose is not to be a Documentation Project like the Wiki
[03:14] <manicka> It's a place to 'store/organise ' forum data, so that it is more accessible to forum users
[03:15] <robotgeek> manicka: i've spoken to you before, and you know my views, so i will stay away from this discussion
[03:16] <manicka> ok
[03:16] <manicka> :)
[03:18] <mgalvin> first if forum users find the wiki unfriendly (understandable for noobs) how does *another* **wiki** solve the problem??
[03:21] <manicka> That would be a point if both wikis were Doc projects. The Storage Facility is not a Documentation project
[03:24] <mgalvin> its a knowledge base correct?
[03:24] <mgalvin> of sorts
[03:24] <manicka> the data entered at doc.gwos.org has been mainly completed by a handful of maintainers. Users do not generally contribute
[03:25] <manicka> yes a knowledgebase
[03:29] <LaserJock> so the forums can't handle the knowledgebase type structure?
[03:29] <mgalvin> why would that info not fit into the ubuntu wiki or h.u.c or something similar
[03:31] <mgalvin> ubuntu is all about openness, why is it necessary to have a separate knowledgebase on a separate (no obvious) site?
[03:31] <manicka> it's not as easy to store and create the knowledgebase because of license restrictions
[03:31] <mgalvin> s/no/non/
[03:32] <manicka> options were investigated to make it part of the forums site itself, but the forum software couldn't handle the task
[03:32] <mgalvin> so ultimately this is fundamentally about lic issues, correct?
[03:32] <manicka> it's all explained on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UDSF
[03:32] <mgalvin> mostly
[03:33] <mgalvin> right i started reading that, just want to make sure i am clear...
[03:33] <manicka> some of those sections are still being redrafted as we speak
[03:34] <manicka> the History and About sections are finalised
[03:35] <mgalvin> ok, at any rate, i will read what more I can find on the issue and follow in the appropriate places
[03:35] <mgalvin> manicka: thanks for filling me in a bit
[03:36] <manicka> np :)
[03:36] <LaserJock> so UDSF is Creative-Commons Public Domain which is why there could be some issues I suppose
[03:36] <manicka> feel free to add comment to the talk page
[03:37] <mgalvin> i will do
[03:38] <manicka> I'm not 100% sure on the reason for that licence. It was implemented after extensive discussions between mdke and king bahamut
[03:39] <mgalvin> how long has http://doc.gwos.org been around?
[03:41] <manicka> hmmm, online since about Oct 2005 from memory
[03:46] <manicka> bbl
[04:22] <mgalvin> most of the stuff (that i have seen so far) on doc.gwos.org is just links to other articles, not much real original content... and many of those links lead to non noob friendly material
[04:23] <mgalvin> additionally how is a noob supposed to find doc.gwos.org... i didn't find it right off the bat, i had to ask
[04:27] <_jason> Hello, who can I discuss an issue I have with help.ubuntu.com documentation with?
[04:28] <robotgeek> hey _jason , right here i guess
[04:30] <_jason> Well, someone just came into #ubuntu asking how to remove realplayer after installing it using help.ubuntu.com instructions (ch. 3, question 3).  The thing is that those instrucitons say to just run the .bin executable from real.com and don't provide either directions on removing it or a warning that it will be difficult to remove.  I haven't installed it myself, so I don't know if it provides an easy to use shortcut to remove it in
[04:33] <LaserJock> _jason: which doc was it?
[04:33] <robotgeek> _jason: usually, you can just remove the symlink, and the directory to which it was installed
[04:33] <robotgeek> http://help.ubuntu.com/starterguide/C/ch03.html
[04:33] <_jason> http://help.ubuntu.com/starterguide/C/ch03.html#id2526342
[04:34] <robotgeek> the plugins it installed can be removed by "sudo rm /usr/lib/mozilla/plugins/nphelix.*
[04:35] <_jason> robotgeek: true, I'm looking at this from the standpoint of someone brand new to ubuntu and probably to linux too if he is reading the starterguide
[04:36] <_jason> I just feel like that would improve the documentation, just thought I'd share my thoughts
[04:36] <robotgeek> _jason: yeah, true that
[05:03] <jsgotangco> i like the idea of the USDF its just about quick and simple howtos
[05:04] <jjesse> i don't know, i like it and also at times don't like, i guess i don't understand why just not use the wiki
[05:04] <jsgotangco> true
[05:05] <jsgotangco> ill add my comments on that
[05:05] <jjesse> all i know is that mdke has spent a lot of time on it
[05:10] <LaserJock> mgalvin: ping?
[05:11] <mgalvin> LaserJock: pong?
[05:12] <LaserJock> I'm running vmware-player from my Windows XP laptop
[05:13] <jsgotangco> that's pretty good
[05:13] <mgalvin> sweet :)
[05:14] <jjesse> i got a buddy to try linux thru vmplayer
[05:14] <jjesse> he "likes what he sees"
[05:14] <mgalvin> great
[05:14] <LaserJock> all I had to do was change the path to the iso
[05:14] <LaserJock> oh, and change /dev/fd0 to A:
[05:15] <mgalvin> yup
[05:15] <robotgeek> LaserJock: howz the speed? faster than a live cd?
[05:15] <LaserJock> well, I'm using a livecd .iso at the moment so no ;-)
[05:16] <jjesse> runs fine on my buddy's laptop, so much better then through qemu
[05:17] <LaserJock> hmm, seems to be slower in Windows than it was on linux, I think the comps should be fairly equivalent
[05:19] <LaserJock> oh, I had some weird Flash thing playing in Firefox. much faster now
[05:20] <mgalvin> LaserJock: feel free to add that info to the wiki if you have time, or i can do always do it in the a.m.
[05:20] <LaserJock> mgalvin: what should I add? Just that it works in windows if you change the paths?
[05:22] <mgalvin> maybe something under managing the vms such as == Using Your Virtual Machines on Windows == or something
[05:22] <mgalvin> or maybe under additional info
[05:22] <mgalvin> not totally sure atm
[05:22] <mgalvin> i am half asleep
[05:22] <LaserJock> k, you can fix in the morning ;-)
[05:22] <mgalvin> ok :)
[05:22] <mgalvin> bed time for me... good night all
[05:43] <LaserJock> ok, I just added a little bit to mgalvin's wiki page on using VMware-Player in Windows
[07:55] <robotgeek> hey Burgundavia
[07:55] <Burgundavia> salut robotgeek
[07:55] <robotgeek> getting to work on integrating the ndiswrapper arrticles, 4 in all.
[08:01] <robotgeek> i think i'm going to work with only 2 at the moment, it's too much information
[08:19] <robotgeek> does the ubuntu moin install differ in any significant way from the default moin install?
[08:20] <rob> hello
[08:20] <robotgeek> hey rob
[08:21] <rob> wiki docs in the distro, hmm
[08:22] <robotgeek> rob: no, i wanted a install to test out some "radical" wiki editing
[08:22] <rob> you can roll back the wiki, but if its really radical, check with Burgundavia or mdke
[08:23] <rob> cause the rollback could still be painful
[08:23] <robotgeek> rob: i know, i prefer to do it locally, and then paste it. think it's a lot cleaner that ways
[08:24] <rob> I would just do it in a text editor, then edit the page and hit preview
[08:24] <rob> or just make a new page on the wiki, and not save it
[08:24] <rob> in fact, I'm sure there are several sites out there that will give you your own wiki just for signing up
[08:25] <robotgeek> hmm, yes. i use vim on the wiki stuff anyways
[08:41] <mdke> rob!
[08:41] <rob> hi mdke
[08:42] <mdke> hello
[08:42] <mdke> nice to see you
[08:42] <rob> yes, been a while
[08:42] <mdke> how are you?
[08:43] <rob> pretty good, yourself?
[08:43] <mdke> fine
[08:43] <robotgeek> hey mdke
[08:44] <mdke> we've missed your work on the desktopguide rob :0
[08:44] <mdke> hi robotgeek
[08:45] <rob> yeah I'm not had a lot of spare time lately
[08:47] <mdke> rob, will you be working on docs again/
[08:47] <mdke> -> ?
[08:48] <rob> not sure
[08:49] <mdke> ok
[08:49] <mdke> as long as you let us know :)
[08:49] <rob> the only time I've had to myself and a pc is with a laptop with no net connection
[08:51] <rob> but the upshot is I've learnt a lot of other computer related stuff
[08:51] <rob> such as python
[08:51] <mdke> cool
[08:51] <mdke> rob, it's totally understandable not to have time :) Just let us know so we can plan stuff
[08:52] <rob> most of my pc usage has been while minding my new (well 5 months old) daughter
[08:52] <mdke> heh
[08:52] <rob> so go ahead without me, I'll still poke in from time to time
[08:52] <mdke> ok
[08:54] <rob> maybe in a few weeks I'll have more time, but I'm undecided if I'll keep doing docs or look at motu or something else
[08:58] <rob> the other killer of my time has been work, I used to work shift (and solaris looks after itself pretty well), now I'm a "windows system admin" guy, its flat out
[08:59] <rob> I'm getting my glasses fixed, I haven't spent so long looking at pc screens in ages
[09:02] <mdke> that's cool
[09:02] <mdke> -> work
[09:03] <mdke> bhuvan, btw can you have a look at the gnump3d thread, I couldn't find the guide in the serverguide
[09:11] <bhuvan> mdke, yep. does he mean the desktop guide ?
[09:11] <mdke> bhuvan, no, that's a server program: it's not in the desktopguide. it was in the faqguide for 5.10
[09:16] <robotgeek> yay, finally got moin isntalled and working (from ubuntu repos)
[09:17] <mdke> robotgeek, nice work. I have never quite succeeded in that. Did you do fastcgi?
[09:17] <mdke> feel free to write a guide... ;)
[09:17] <robotgeek> mdke: less /usr/share/doc/moin/Readme.Debian :)
[09:20] <robotgeek> i'm deciding what colors to use for the wireless page, any tips
[09:21] <bhuvan> mdke, any comments on s/Server Starter Guide/Server Guide/ ?
[09:21] <mdke> bhuvan, i'll mail them
[09:21] <mdke> -> work for real
[09:22] <bhuvan> mdke, thanks
[09:22] <robotgeek> the ubuntu wiki is faster than the wiki on my local machine
[09:23] <bhuvan> robotgeek, did any customisation ? for me it was too cool when i tried long back in debian unstable
[09:24] <robotgeek> bhuvan: no customization yet, i just wanted to get it to work.
[09:24] <bhuvan> robotgeek, what is your system conf ?
[09:24] <robotgeek> heh, it's a 500 mhz machine. with 512 mb ram
[09:24] <robotgeek> i bet it will be faster on my laptop, lol
[09:25] <bhuvan> robotgeek, what are the additional apache modules you use
[09:27] <robotgeek> bhuvan: there are a lot, basically the default ubuntu apache2 instal
[09:28] <bhuvan> robotgeek, the performance may improve if you disable unused apache modules. imho, moin performance is too good compared to mediawiki
[09:29] <robotgeek> ah, yeah. i have stuff like vhost and crap, which i am not using
[09:30] <robotgeek> bhuvan: no apparently the only modules i have enabled are "cgid userdir"
[09:35] <robotgeek> okay, i think i will script this. even vim macros will take long
[09:48] <robotgeek> mdke: i'm thinking of having a color for "Works OOTB", "Works with...", "No/Need More Info"
[10:04] <mdke> robotgeek_zzz, what moin install did you do? if you use fastcgi, it should help. normal cgi is very slow
[10:04] <mdke> but fastcgi is hard to get working :)
[10:09] <robotgeek> heh, back mdke
[10:09] <robotgeek> mdke: instead of colors, can i do subpages?
[10:11] <mdke> you can do anything
[10:12] <robotgeek> HardwareSupportComponentsWirelessNetworkCards/ (WorksOutofthebox)|(WorksWithNdiswrapper)|
[10:12] <robotgeek> and get rid of the big list there.
[10:13] <robotgeek> okay, will work on a test page first
[03:03] <Belutz> jsgotangco, are you coming on feb 1st?
[03:06] <jsgotangco> Belutz, nope busy at work...will be in a trip
[03:06] <Belutz> jsgotangco, ah i see
[03:07] <jsgotangco> i guess everything is well on the upcoming jakarta event?
[03:08] <Belutz> yup, everyone is preparing
[03:09] <Belutz> someone still trying to convince the minister of telecomunication and informatics to come to the event
[03:09] <Belutz> and the minister of R&D
[03:10] <jsgotangco> heh
[03:15] <Belutz> :p
[07:50] <LaserJock> mgalvin: did you see my addition to the vmware-qemu wiki?
[07:51] <mgalvin> LaserJock: yup, great, thanks :)
[07:52] <LaserJock> mgalvin: np
[09:55] <jjesse> communit council meeting in #ubuntu-meeting
[09:55] <jjesse> just starting
[10:56] <LaserJock> mdke: so what about the Packaging Guide, which is under GPL? Can I use wiki material if it is PD?
[10:56] <mdke> yes
[10:56] <mdke> you can do whatever
[10:56] <LaserJock> if it was MIT/BSD could I?
[10:57] <Kyral> Frankly I don't give a **** as long as you say something along the lines of "This document contains material originally written by <me>" or somesuch
[10:57] <mdke> Kyral, omg, go read some licenses
[10:57] <Kyral> huh?
[10:58] <LaserJock> Kyral: I don't even care about that but we have to worry about licensing
[10:58] <Kyral> ah
[10:58] <Kyral> this is why I stay outta this stuff...makes my life hard lol
[10:58] <mdke> Kyral, the sort of non-free licenses that we are trying to exclude are those which require accreditation like that
[10:59] <Kyral> ah
[10:59] <Kyral> I just don't want someone COMPLETELY passing my work as thier own ;P
[11:00] <LaserJock> well, I'm kinda stuck to the GPL as far as I know because all the Debian developer docs are GPL
[11:00] <Kyral> yah
[11:00] <Kyral> GPL++
[11:00] <LaserJock> but GPL isn't compatible with GFDL as far as I know :(
[11:01] <Kyral> ...GNU made a license that isn't compatable with one of thier own licenses?
[11:01] <mdke> GFDL is so unfree
[11:02] <LaserJock> I don't quite understand it but according to GNU they aren't compatible
[11:23] <mdke> bustacap, welcome aboard :)
[11:24] <Kyral> hes not in yet lol
[11:24] <robotgeek> lol
[11:24] <mdke> Kyral, this is #ubuntu-doc
[11:24] <Kyral> ah lol
[11:24] <bustacap> thanks..
[11:24] <robotgeek> i think i am going to for membership soon :)
[11:24] <Kyral> like i said I don't care for procedure most of the time ;P
[11:25] <mdke> procedure?
[11:25] <Kyral> I dunno
[11:25] <Kyral> mind isn't right because I'm hungry
[11:32] <robotgeek> mdke: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/Projects does someone need to start working on the Kubuntu part, or is it done? doe dapper?
[11:32] <robotgeek> for dapper, err.
[11:33] <mdke> robotgeek, which project? the kubuntu docs are worked on by jjesse, you can talk to him
[11:34] <robotgeek> say, the Kubuntu starter guide?
[11:35] <mdke> that is pretty much on hold I think
[11:35] <robotgeek> ah, which needs most hep then?
[11:35] <Kyral> Any idea when a "prototype" of Ubuntu Express will be out?
[11:35] <mdke> Kyral, #-devel
[11:35] <robotgeek> Kubuntu Release Notes?
[11:35] <Kyral> yah yah
[11:35] <Kyral> I know
[11:35] <mdke> robotgeek, not sure, mail the list or ask jjesse
[11:35] <robotgeek> okay. will do, thanks mdke