[00:15] <nacc> dpb1: fyi, https://code.launchpad.net/~nacc/usd-importer/+git/usd-importer/+merge/327399
[00:17] <nacc> rbasak: i'm likely to only be working my AM tmrw and may not have access to my computer, if you review and ack something for the importer code, do you mind just pushing it yourself?
[00:17] <nacc> *access in the afternoon, that is
[00:17] <nacc> i'd like to get this pile of stuff landed :)
[00:28] <Epx998> what is the upstream kernel exactly?
[00:34] <sarnold> that usually means a tarball downloaded from kernel.org
[00:34] <sarnold> but could include a git clone and build..
[00:34] <Epx998> hmm
[00:35] <sarnold> the ubuntu kernel team has some debs of pre-built 'upstream kernels' that they offer to people when testing issues -- if it works with plain upstream, that means the patches to fix or enable something can usually be cherry-picked from the upstream git trees
[00:36] <Epx998> reason I ask is on this new hp gen10, hp is releasing stuff for kernels, mentions their stuff is added to the upstream kernel, then found the upstream kernel.ubuntu.org, date looks recent-ish, but its 3.10 vs 3.13 in repos
[00:38] <Epx998> i think answeer to my latest issue is to remove the scsi controller and toss it in the trash
[00:38] <Epx998> 6TB raid 0 shows up as 600GB in ubuntu, 63GB in centos
[00:39] <sarnold> I went out of my way to buy non-raid HBA
[00:39] <sarnold> it feels like raid cards are more trouble than they're worth
[00:41] <Epx998> yeah they are, we are trying to improve build times as best we can - so mgmt is buying all sorts of hardware
[00:41] <Epx998> this 360 g10 is nice, but i dont like the hba
[00:41] <sarnold> can you flash it with an IT mode firmware?
[00:41] <Epx998> no firmware for it yet
[00:42] <Epx998> just the sizes the drivers are seeing is weird, 63gb on centos..
[00:43] <sarnold> both 63 and 600 sound ominous
[00:43] <sarnold> something
[00:43] <sarnold> something's badly broken sort of thing
[00:43] <Epx998> im going to toss different drives in it tomorrow
[00:43] <sarnold> an ancient switch from the dark ages was flipped somewhere
[00:43] <Epx998> im wondering if im hitting 512e 4kn or whatever issue
[00:44] <Epx998> something to explore tomorrow, cheers
[01:00] <rbasak> nacc: sorry only just seen this. I gave up this evening due to connectivity issues. ack on pushing myself.
[01:17] <nacc> rbasak: ack, np!
[01:18] <nacc> rbasak: i think gu-lint (and the branch it is based off of) is good to go. I believe I have instructions in there for squashing as appropriate in each commit and I'm fine for you to do that)
[01:18] <nacc> rbasak: and/or feel free to do fixlets on top of my branch after squashing
[01:18] <rbasak> OK, thanks!
[01:19] <nacc> rbasak: if you're feeling inspired, feel free to add `git ubuntu review` (which for now can just take a mp as an argument and run `git ubuntu lint` on it)
[01:19] <rbasak> You want me to squash fixlets into your branch? Or add on top?
[01:19] <rbasak> :-)
[01:19] <nacc> rbasak: i think (for clarity) it's probably easiest to squash all of my stuff first, then put fixlets on top.  Leave as is, that's fine.
[02:05] <hehehe> rbasak:  :) I have compiled 2 versions of latest nginx stable 1 with simply configure add module modsecurity ... and one with same + 16.04 distro nginx params https://pastebin.com/0MRQgt4c
[02:05] <hehehe> version 1 works with modsecurity version 2 not
[02:06] <hehehe> I wonder if anything in configure may conflict with mod secure
[02:06] <hehehe> I double checked both configure both do find and add modsecure
[05:18] <cathode> hi i'm currently running a FreeBSD 11 system as a NAS/SAN server for a small home lab. I'm trying to downsize and considering replacing the BSD with Ubuntu Server 17.04 and using KVM to host VMs instead of a separate VM host machine
[05:19] <cathode> I'm assuming that Ubuntu server should have no problems running Samba 4.5 to host windows-compatible shares?
[05:42] <andol> cathode: Are you aware that Ubuntu 17.04 is a non-LTS release, which is only supported with security upgrades, etc for 9 month?
[05:54] <cathode> i mean, i can read, so yes i was aware of that statement. i guess I don't understand the implication?
[05:54] <cathode> does ubuntu / linux not have ways to upgrade a host to a newer release?
[05:56] <cncr04s> run 16.04
[06:07] <Seveas> cathode: sure, upgrades work fine :)
[06:07] <Seveas> cathode: I think andol just wanted to make you aware that with non-lts releases you have to do this every 6 months instead of every two years
[06:07] <lordievader> Good morning
[06:07] <Seveas> \o
[06:09] <cathode> ok gotcha
[06:09] <cathode> like i said it's a home lab so downtime is not really a big deal
[06:09] <cathode> and i wanted to go with 17.04 because it apparently has ZFS support built right in without installing anything other than zfsutils
[06:12] <Seveas> then 17.04 is an excellent choice :)
[06:17] <cpaelzer> jamespage: are you planning to up ovs to 2.7.1?
[06:18] <cpaelzer> there is a bunch of nice fixes that avoid hard fails due to use afer free, faults, ...
[06:34] <cathode> how long does 'update-grub' normally take when installing ubuntu server?
[06:38] <cpaelzer> cathode: I think it scans all partitions, but if that scanning has issues it needs a lot of timeouts
[06:38] <cpaelzer> cathode: depending on your setup and potential issues it can be quite a while, but usually not that long that you'd wonder
[06:39] <cpaelzer> cathode: do you have any I/O errors on dmesg while this hangs?
[06:40] <cathode> didn't see anything
[06:40] <cathode> theres 27 disks connected though
[06:40] <cathode> i let it sit for like 15 minutes before killing the install process
[06:40] <cathode> it sat at 66% the entire time
[06:44] <cpaelzer> cathode: any other odd devcies plugged in - a flaky usb to disk converter or sdcards or such
[06:44] <cpaelzer> that could stall the scan as well
[07:05] <cathode> can i skip installing grub and use the rescue mode to reinstall it after?
[07:20] <cpaelzer> cathode: sorry never tried that
[07:20] <Sourcey> Hello. Hope someone can help me. I have set up a A and MX record. email.example.com and want to run PostFix on my server. Im struggling with understanding the hosts and aliases
[07:20] <cpaelzer> cathode: I'd more try to check what it actually does while it appears hanging
[07:21] <Sourcey> seems like the guides online shows different things. what exactly in /etc/hosts and /etc/aliases has to be setup?
[08:11] <jamespage> cpaelzer: yup
[08:26] <cpaelzer> thanks jamespage!
[09:28] <jamespage> cpaelzer: just uploaded
[09:31] <cpaelzer> prepare to wait on armhf test ressources :-)
[09:31] <cpaelzer> thanks jamespage
[09:32] <jamespage> cpaelzer: btw happy for you todo those as well - but please push commits to the git repo on launchpad :)
[09:37] <cpaelzer> jamespage: you are right I missed that on the last fix
[09:38] <cpaelzer> I have one in the queue that I can do better as soon as it is upstream accepted :-)
[09:41] <cpaelzer> jamespage: I guess since you upload you did already clean for the ones I missed - or is there anything I can still help to complete?
[09:43] <cpaelzer> I see you added them already as I expected, thanks
[09:44] <jamespage> cpaelzer: I did no further action required for now
[09:44] <cpaelzer> you get a +1 on my "spend a beer once I see them" paper
[11:57] <alexII> hi, Software RAID is extremely slow, why?
[12:33] <lordievader> Quite fast here.... What flavour of raid?
[15:04]  * teward pokes rbasak
[15:04] <teward> you rang?
[15:09] <teward> anyone seen rbasak around?
[15:09] <teward> he pinged, but i was busy in a meeting.
[15:12] <dpb1> he's here
[15:13] <dpb1> give him a sec, I'm sure he'll reply
[15:13] <dpb1> :)
[15:13] <teward> dpb1: yep he's repkying now :)
[15:13] <teward> heck i can't type
[15:13] <dpb1> hehe
[15:13]  * teward chugs what's left of his bottle of pepsi.
[15:14] <teward> time to work on the mountain dew now.
[15:32] <cathode> hi
[15:35] <nacc> rbasak: your review for gitubuntu-submit-fixes is a bit confusing, as the first diff comment conflicts with the suggested rewrite
[15:59] <rbasak> nacc: sorry. Which bit?
[16:01] <nacc> rbasak: it's ok, i think i resolved it
[16:01] <nacc> rbasak: you gave a full replacement implementation and commented on the old one
[16:01] <nacc> rbasak: which was a bit confusing at first, but after a cup of tea, i followed
[16:02] <rbasak> Sorry, I'll try and explain better next time. The comments on the old one were the rationale for my changes, but by the time I was done it seemed easier to demonstrate what I meant with the replacement.
[16:02] <nacc> yep
[16:02] <nacc> rbasak: that's fine, i just wanted to make sure i wasn't missing something
[16:03] <nacc> rbasak: gitubuntu-submit-fixes updated
[16:04] <rbasak> ack
[16:05] <nacc> rbasak: i can rebase gu-lint on it, once you've reviewed, as they are dependent (so that i can pick up the api change to nearest_remote_branch)
[16:05] <rbasak> Thanks for the docstring corrections. I never understood how I was supposed to do that.
[16:08] <nacc> rbasak: np, I've seen it elsewhere, I'm pretty sure that's correct
[16:12] <nacc> rbasak: ok, gu-lint is ready to push whenever you are
[16:13] <nacc> rbasak: for gitubuntu-submit-fixes, i'll do those fixlets and push, if that's ok with you?
[16:20] <nacc> rbasak: done
[17:40] <Epx998> Mmm it gave me access to infoblox
[17:40] <Epx998> it = IT
[17:41] <sarnold> Epx998: did you sort out that 69gb / 600gb thing?
[17:43] <Epx998> sarnold: not yet, vendor is supposed to come onsite today - but im 99% sure its a firmware problem
[17:45] <sarnold> Epx998: hopefully they'll have some answers :)
[17:45] <Epx998> sarnold: I think in the end, my mgr wont order the G10 with any controller cards. ha.
[17:46] <sarnold> Epx998: heh, that's one way to side-step the whole thing
[17:47] <Epx998> sarnold: i hate not solving it, but i think its out of my hands
[17:50] <Epx998> sarnold: on a good note, today is all about provisioning ub14 servers
[17:50] <Epx998> slowly we are moving away from 12
[17:51] <sarnold> woot
[17:51] <sarnold> progress :)
[17:51] <Epx998> sarnold: had to, docker wasnt working on 12 appearently
[17:52] <sarnold> heh yeah 12.04's kernel predates most ofthe features docker would use
[17:52] <sarnold> the ESM HWE kernel might be new enough but don't let them hear it
[17:54] <Epx998> sarnold: yeah we need to get off of 12, wanting docker has made that happen, so im good with it
[17:54] <Epx998> note: not all of nvidia uses 12, just parts of the mobile unit :D
[18:03] <Epx998> yeah so I added ilo IP's to DNS instead of system IPs. gg me.
[18:04] <sarnold> good thing it's friday
[19:03] <jonfatino> Hello my ubuntu livecd for some reason is only running my cpus at 800mhz
[19:11] <dpb1> probably because of the powersave governor
[19:12] <jonfatino> echo performance > /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor
[19:12] <jonfatino> echo "3800000" | sudo tee /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu*/cpufreq/scaling_min_freq
[19:12] <jonfatino> echo "3800000" | sudo tee /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu*/cpufreq/scaling_max_freq
[19:12] <jonfatino> Still nothing :-(
[19:14] <sarnold> anything in dmesg?
[19:15] <sarnold> how about thermald's logs?
[19:15] <dpb1> Also, there was something about intel_pstate and a grub setting
[19:15] <dpb1> not sure if that is still applicable
[19:16] <jonfatino> [    3.096939] Intel pstate controlling: cpu 7
[19:16] <jonfatino> I see this
[22:38] <hehehe> whats the difference between using alphabetical and numerical command with chmod?
[22:38] <hehehe> if any
[22:41] <sarnold> numerical is easier to understand; alphabetical lets you say "add this permission to whatever it already has" or "remove this permission from whatever it already has"
[23:21] <cathode> i think i screwed up. i installed samba 4.6 by building from source following a guide, but then i installed winbind via 'apt install winbind'. should i have built winbind from source too?
[23:22] <cathode> right now i'm looking at a bunch of wierd errors, like my samba deployment got reset back to defaults
[23:22] <sarnold> if you choose to use upstream for one of them you'd probably be best served by using upstream for them all
[23:23] <cathode> what would be the best way to get everything back to a clean slate?
[23:26] <sarnold> copy aside the files you know you've configured; apt-get purge the packages that you installed via the distro but want to use upstream stuff
[23:26] <sarnold> re-install all the upstream stuff
[23:26] <sarnold> and copy back your config files
[23:33] <cathode> ok thanks
[23:37] <sarnold> cathode: it's actually really good timing, https://www.samba.org/samba/security/CVE-2017-11103.html was released recently
[23:49] <cathode> ah yea


[06:57] <mazda01>  anyone know how I would integrate mythtv-status into my script that I want to run which basically checks to make sure the slave backend is running and if not, start it.
[14:04] <Essobi> Morning all.
[14:07] <read_ca> hello - can anyone help a newbie with some EPG and TV channel config for the UK?
[22:51] <Egghead> any know of a good how to for a newb to compiling for kernel module for lirc in ubuntu (mythbuntu 9.04)?
[22:56] <Seeker`> what do you need to compile it for?
[22:59] <Egghead> trying to use irgousb receiver, but it seems to stop working after awhile, i found a patch that seems like it might fix the problem
[23:02] <Egghead> been googling, but only finding how to's on recomiling the kernel itself, was thinkinh the kernal module might be tricker then just compiling a c proggie
[23:12] <Seeker`> are you sure the patch hasnt been applied somewhere already?
[23:15] <Egghead> yes
[23:16] <Egghead> there is a bug report at launchpad, #364699, but it ended up in triage :(


[08:32] <dekarl> superm1: I'm trying to build master with a patch but it appears as if the mythbuntu patches need a bump, is that correct? http://paste.ubuntu.com/802712/ when trying to build with http://code.mythtv.org/trac/attachment/ticket/7701/0001-unbreak-the-channels.conf-importer-for-DVB.patch
[08:32] <Zinn> [paste.ubuntu.com] Ubuntu Pastebin
[12:57] <rileyp> why would irexec commands collate until I close mythtv
[12:57] <rileyp> Im using lucid
[12:58] <rileyp> and then when I close myth all the commands occur
[13:01] <rileyp> 2.6.32-26-generic
[16:07] <sabhain> anyone running a HD HomeRun?  Old one, not Prime.
[16:11] <likwid--_> i use to.  didnt have any trouble with mythbuntu
[16:15] <sabhain> i've been using one for about 5 years i think.  Suddenly I have this wierd behavior where one of the tuners won't work for scheduled recordings.
[16:16] <sabhain> Works fine with live TV.  The 2nd tuner works fine for both live TV and Scheduled recordings.
[16:16] <sabhain> But Tuner 1 now doesn't record scheduled programs anymore.  Just sits there as "Tuning" when you look at th eprogram in the guide.
[16:17] <sabhain> The system thinks it's recorded, it's in the list, but returns the dreaded "file for that recording cannot be found" message.
[16:17] <sabhain> I've tried kicking the backend (don't typically reboot it regularly) and power cycling the HDHR .. but no luck.
[16:17] <sabhain> Strange to me that LiveTV would work ..
[16:18] <likwid--_> possibly could try #hdhomerun . maybe one of the devs have seen the behavior before
[16:18] <likwid--_> or #mythtv-users
[16:18] <likwid--_> i dont think its related to mythbuntu in this sense
[16:18] <likwid--_> tried applying new firmware to the prime?
[16:19] <likwid--_> or reconfiguing the prime in the mythbackend?
[16:19] <sabhain> That's my next step.  It's NOT a prime .. just the old QAM dual tuner version.
[16:19] <likwid--_> oh right not prime
[16:19] <likwid--_> but if its been that long there are definltey updates to the hdhomerun
[16:20] <likwid--_> not sure if myth tv itself has had updates concerning the hdhomerun that would affect it
[16:20] <likwid--_> it uses from what i can tell, the same settings for the prime and regular versions
[16:20] <likwid--_> so any code they added to increase the prime usage coudl affect the 2tuner version
[16:28] <superm1> dekarl: that's weird, it doesn't look like your patch is touching configure
[16:29] <superm1> dekarl: did you have another patch that was getting applied that might have been touching configure earlier on (besides the mythbuntu one)
[16:41] <superm1> dekarl: oh i just checked master bzr, there was some fuzz on the patches
[16:41] <superm1> i fixed the fuzz and pushed
[18:23] <dekarl> superm1: thanks, strangly it appears to have not changed anything. don't have time to look into it more atm
[18:23] <dekarl> will do so later or tommorow
[20:58] <superm1> dekarl: hmm, you might have to manually quilt pop -a with the way it broke
[20:58] <superm1> and/or git checkout -- .


[00:00] <collinp> I'M NOT LATE.
[00:00] <duanedesign> me too :)
[00:00] <phillw> made it with seconds to spare :)
[00:01] <collinp> Oh yes.
[00:01] <UndiFineD> o/
[00:01] <jledbetter> Howdy
[00:01] <duanedesign> #startmeeting
[00:01] <MootBot> Meeting started at 18:01. The chair is duanedesign.
[00:01] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[00:01] <duanedesign> hello everyone and thank you for coming
[00:02] <duanedesign> it is awesome to have so many new people joining the team
[00:03] <duanedesign> our mentee seeking mentor list is kinda long
[00:03] <phillw> I'm kidnapping them as fast I can :P
[00:03] <UndiFineD> funny how it turned out exactly as i predicted in august duanedesign
[00:03] <duanedesign> however I notice some of those folks I have never seen in the channel
[00:03]  * jledbetter goes to look at it.
[00:04] <UndiFineD> or was it oktober ... time flies
[00:04] <duanedesign> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Membership
[00:04] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Membership
[00:04] <duanedesign> is there anyone here who has not yet been  paired up with antone?
[00:05] <duanedesign> anyone*
[00:05] <hakimsheriff2> Sorry im late
[00:05] <phillw> duanedesign: as people on the mentor list are recommended by their TL's, it is a difficult problem. Do we turn them away are welcome them?
[00:05] <duanedesign> or should that be paired up with someone...:P
[00:05] <collinp> hakimsheriff: No problem. I was -almost- late myself.
[00:05] <jledbetter> Paired up as in 'seeking master'? Right?
[00:05] <phillw> /sare/or
[00:06] <duanedesign> jledbetter: yes a master or mentor
[00:06] <duanedesign> phillw: what is TL?
[00:06] <collinp> Team Leader?
[00:06] <phillw> Team Leader, as per the email sent out.
[00:06]  * jledbetter isn't a mentor or master but has no available time at the moment, unfortunately.
[00:07] <duanedesign> jledbetter: ok, thank you for beiing honest
[00:07] <collinp> I was here before the team was even called what it is now. I guess that classifies as enough experience :P
[00:07] <collinp> Sadly, I have no time either.
[00:07] <jledbetter> That's how I roll :) Maybe next month.
[00:08] <hakimsheriff2> I am not a full member yet so I cant
[00:08] <duanedesign> hakimsheriff2:  do you have a Beginners Team member sho is helping you out?
[00:09] <hakimsheriff2> Mohi is.my mentor
[00:09] <duanedesign> each prospective member should have someone who is helping them join the team and.or joining a team in the community
[00:09] <duanedesign> hakimsheriff2: oh great
[00:09] <duanedesign> he has been a little ill lately. he will be back soon
[00:09] <hakimsheriff2> Thats why I didnt see him
[00:10] <jledbetter> Is https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Mentors up to date? Those the only approved masters/mentors?
[00:10] <duanedesign> lets keep an eye out for the people on the mentee list and see who stops by the channel
[00:10] <MrChrisDruif> No member either....even if I was, wouldn't have much time :)
[00:10] <UndiFineD> MrChrisDruif: you are doing great :)
[00:10] <phillw> hakimsheriff if you need a bit of extra help, I'm sure that pedro would assist you, those two guys work very closely together.
[00:11] <duanedesign> yes mohi has chicken pox :( I think he is on the mends though
[00:11] <hakimsheriff2> Help in what exactly?
[00:11] <collinp> Remember that Ubuntu is purely volunteer work, you contribute only if you have the time for it, so there's no pressure if you can't due to other obligations.
[00:11] <phillw> hakimsheriff in any area.
[00:11] <duanedesign> hakimsheriff2:  anything UBuntu or BT related
[00:12] <hakimsheriff2> Mohi helps me getting involved
[00:12] <duanedesign> collinp: so true. We want this to be fun
[00:12] <hakimsheriff2> It is fun!
[00:12] <jledbetter> fun +1
[00:12] <MrChrisDruif> Suggestion: discuss this after the meeting? O:-)
[00:12] <hakimsheriff2> Sure
[00:13] <pedro3005> fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuun
[00:13] <duanedesign> also all the members of the team are your mentors.  My normal nick doesnt hav a 2 in it
[00:13] <duanedesign> jledbetter: yes that is the list
[00:14] <duanedesign> ehich is a good transition into next topic
[00:14] <jledbetter> :)
[00:14] <duanedesign> [TOPIC] more mentors
[00:14] <MootBot> New Topic:  more mentors
[00:14] <duanedesign> ok, we put into place some new requirements to be a mento.
[00:14] <duanedesign> mentor
[00:15] <collinp> Welcome seidos.
[00:15] <duanedesign> basically the community at large wanted some reassurance that our mentors knew their stuff
[00:15] <seidos> gracias collinp
[00:16] <jledbetter> Have to be a Master to be Mentor, right?
[00:16] <duanedesign> if the bug guys or the doc guys are going to send mentees to us they want to make sure we are assigning knowledgable mentors
[00:16] <duanedesign> jledbetter: yes, I think all members are masters
[00:16] <jledbetter> Great.
[00:16] <phillw> duanedesign: there was only one way I could get Manuela happy as a mentor, as she does not fit into any of the main 4 groups, but Accessibility is a vital part of ubuntu. So I put her htere.
[00:17] <phillw> *there*
[00:17] <duanedesign> that makes sense
[00:17] <duanedesign> phillw: we want to start an accessebility FG eventually
[00:17] <duanedesign> so I see no problem with that
[00:17] <jledbetter> That'd be nice.
[00:18] <duanedesign> If you all saw my email earlier today it outlined breifly the requirments to be a mentor
[00:18] <duanedesign> bug fg mentor should be a member of Bug Control
[00:18] <duanedesign> doc FG, doc contributors or wiki admin
[00:18] <phillw> as the TL for speechcontrol and dragging a dormant project back to life, she has done outstanding work.
[00:18] <UndiFineD> I talked with cprofitt on a accessibility FG , he said it would fit in with devs and support
[00:19] <duanedesign> support fg, is based on contributions since their is no community team counterpart
[00:19] <duanedesign> Development FG you should be a Contributing Developers, per-package uploaders, MOTU or Core Developers.
[00:19] <seidos> is there a particular focus group considered to have the most need right now?
[00:20] <duanedesign> hhmmm, good question
[00:20] <MrChrisDruif> Accessibility, as it's a young fg?
[00:20] <duanedesign> ill think about that
[00:21] <duanedesign> i want to encourage all members to be mentors
[00:21] <phillw> seidos: they all need help, but having missed the 10.10 docs, if you are familar with wiki and docs, that team needs a bit of help.
[00:21] <UndiFineD> if an accessibility FG would be created, the people with interest are recommended to be forwarded to #ubuntu-accessibility
[00:21] <seidos> phillw: i have done a bit of wiki
[00:21] <seidos> i was going to say bugs, but you kind of need to know dev to fix code, unless bugs need triaging
[00:22] <duanedesign> If you are already a member of one of the community teams I mentioned, or you feel like you have enough support under your belt please let me or cprofitt know
[00:22] <duanedesign> so we can add you to othe mentor list
[00:23] <jledbetter> Will do
[00:23] <duanedesign> I also wanted to ask if anyone thinks there are any good ideas for encouraging/helping each other join these teams so we can increase the number of mentors
[00:23] <hajour> i was not on the list but i been made mentor not long ago
[00:23] <phillw> duanedesign: the creation of an accessibility FG would allow more people to feel comfortable, they need not be a member of just one. There are, for example, some excellent coders on the tram. I'd ask that you check with the council
[00:24] <phillw> /s/tram/team/
[00:24] <duanedesign> right now we will probablly do the accessebility FG under another FG until it grows a bit and then we will make an official FG
[00:24] <UndiFineD> duanedesign: I have a broad interest, so I try know a bit of all
[00:25] <hakimsheriff2> Good idea
[00:25] <duanedesign> i think charlie-tca is also very interested in accessebility
[00:25] <jledbetter> duanedesign, How to get more mentors? Ask? Maybe training too?
[00:25] <seidos> i dabbled in accessibility
[00:25] <seidos> i couldn't get orca working
[00:25] <seidos> not sure what other tools are out there
[00:26] <duanedesign> jledbetter: i thought maybe some loose knit ggroups that help each other accomplish the requirements for membership in the team of interest
[00:26] <hajour> i am mentor accessibility duanedesign
[00:26] <phillw> duanedesign: but it is a bit difficult, as we do teaching web pages, have devs working on projects etc. They just do not know where to 'slot in'
[00:26] <UndiFineD> seidos: you can ask that in #ubuntu-accessibility
[00:26] <jledbetter> duanedesign, I can definitely see that being helpful with dev. It's a huge realm.
[00:27] <collinp> phillw: Accessibility would fit in under the dev FG.
[00:27] <duanedesign> PabloRubianes: hello
[00:27] <PabloRubianes> yes
[00:27] <collinp> Until it gets to a critical mass where it can form it's own FG.
[00:27] <duanedesign> PabloRubianes: sorry i was tryiing to respond to your PM :P
[00:27] <UndiFineD> collinp: what is considered critical mass ?
[00:27] <collinp> Enough to sustain it.
[00:27] <collinp> Probably 10+ members.
[00:28] <duanedesign> yes we have had a problem in the past of jumping the gun on FG
[00:28] <phillw> collinp: speechcontrol itself is well past that :)
[00:28] <UndiFineD> collinp: I think we reached that already
[00:28] <duanedesign> where we have focus groups that sound ggreat, we form them and they never quite sustain themselves
[00:28] <phillw> as we are under the access group, you'd be suprised :)
[00:28] <hakimsheriff2> I am using a text to speech right now
[00:29] <duanedesign> UndiFineD: thats great. we can work on that this month and put it on the agenda for next meeting
[00:29] <collinp> phillw: Consider the fact that the Dev and Wiki FGs are the only ones that have 5+ members in their IRC channels.
[00:29] <jledbetter> Accessibility helps everyone so it's good that it's a very popular group
[00:29] <MrChrisDruif> Great hakimsheriff2 :)
[00:29] <collinp> Right now, at least.
[00:29] <hajour> we have 40 members on speechcontrol team and we are attached on the accessibility program collinp
[00:29] <phillw> duanedesign: I know that fully well, but with people like hajour and pen, along with alan bell - that FG would be self sustainable.
[00:30] <collinp> Speaking of the Dev FG, at the end of the meeting duanedesign, could I make an impromptu announcement?
[00:30] <duanedesign> collinp: absolutely
[00:30] <UndiFineD> new members interested in accessibility are requested to join #ubuntu-accessibility
[00:31] <seidos> UndiFineD: already joined
[00:31] <phillw> they are also required to sign the CoC
[00:31] <duanedesign> ok so we need more mentors, so lets encourage each other and do what we can there
[00:32] <jledbetter> Sounds good
[00:32] <UndiFineD> well, I think I might be ready for a new padawan soon
[00:32] <seidos> duanedesign: i can go where i'm wanted.  people don't like hanging out in an empty and/or quiet channel
[00:32] <duanedesign> :)
[00:32] <phillw> duanedesign: I have a new lubuntueer, he's a dev person. I may be able to get him on board.
[00:32] <MrChrisDruif> UndiFineD flies through his padawan's :P
[00:33] <duanedesign> ok whho has mentee here?
[00:33] <duanedesign> who wants to give an update
[00:33] <MrChrisDruif> duanedesign: Hmm?
[00:33] <phillw> duanedesign: I have 4!
[00:33] <hajour> well there are all working on the accessibility programs seidos  because i have many in the speechcontrol team
[00:33] <UndiFineD> I have MrChrisDruif , who needs testamonials
[00:33]  * seidos flies through his master
[00:33] <seidos> d'oh
[00:34]  * seidos puts on the rock of shame and the rock of triumph
[00:34] <collinp> phillw: Wow.
[00:34] <collinp> That's quite a bit.
[00:34] <MrChrisDruif> xD
[00:34] <duanedesign> MrChrisDruif: at each meeting we like to give updates on how our mentees are doing. Mentors/Masters share the success, or disappearances of their mentees
[00:34] <duanedesign> ill go first
[00:34] <phillw> UndiFineD: MrChrisDruif is a wonderful padawan, it is joy and delight to chat to him. He has learned so much.
[00:34] <duanedesign> Daniel** has been doing well. He has been putting in the time showing up in the channel
[00:35] <duanedesign> he also is working with phillw
[00:35] <duanedesign> next
[00:35] <hajour> i think MrChrisDruif  also would be a good master
[00:35] <duanedesign> dont be shy, someone tell us how your mentee is doing...
[00:36] <jledbetter> What about mentee saying how she/he is doing if master isn't present?
[00:36] <duanedesign> that would be awesome
[00:36] <phillw> I know that two of mine have had 'issues', but they have assured me that they will not let the project that they have been assigned to down.
[00:37] <duanedesign> phillw: i think as long as they let you know what is going on
[00:37] <UndiFineD> MrChrisDruif has been my padawan for a small month, he has been around much longer than that, he is my first, but I think he is ready for his testamonials, he made great progress and is involved in the development with many common teams
[00:38] <phillw> UndiFineD: If it were a vote, he'd get a +1 from me without hesitation.
[00:38] <seidos> do you cover positive and negative aspects of mentees or padwans?
[00:38] <duanedesign> yes MrChrisDruif i see alot in the channel which is good :)
[00:38] <MrChrisDruif> duanedesign: phillw is omnipresent (or has his ways of getting the news O:-))
[00:38] <duanedesign> seidos: mostly positives and missing in actions
[00:39] <seidos> RIP MIA :(
[00:39] <UndiFineD> seidos: we tend to emphasize the positive, negative aspects can be dealt with in private hmm :)
[00:39] <collinp> Look who strolls in.
[00:39] <hajour> duanedesign, cprofitt is not here but i have JackyAlcine in my team many hours and i see him also often in ubuntu beginners team and in ubuntu-beginners helping
[00:39] <duanedesign> that way if someone is missing someone else has the opportunity to say oh [s]he is...
[00:39] <seidos> UndiFineD: always?  like festering wounds?
[00:39] <duanedesign> yes
[00:39] <duanedesign> i mean yes to hajour :)
[00:40] <seidos> i inferred \o/
[00:40] <seidos> is inference the same as assumption?  hmmm
[00:40] <collinp> Inference is guessing something missing based on what is given.
[00:40] <collinp> Assumption is guessing based on past experience.
[00:41] <jledbetter> haha
[00:41] <UndiFineD> I think JackyAlcine is ready
[00:41] <duanedesign> ok great
[00:41] <seidos> past experience isn't given?  hmmmm
[00:41] <phillw> hajour: I think JackyAlcine would make an excellent mentor, he has the patience to help and the thirst to learn.
[00:41] <hajour> collinp,  a little could you be a little more clear?
[00:41] <hajour> yes agree phillw
[00:42] <duanedesign> [ACTION] work on accessebility fg
[00:42] <MootBot> ACTION received:  work on accessebility fg
[00:42] <MrChrisDruif> Does JackyAlcine have the time? He's always busy with SpeechControl :)
[00:42] <collinp> Er. google.com -> define:inference and define:assumption
[00:42] <seidos> collinp: i don't disagree with the definitions
[00:42] <seidos> thanks :)
[00:42] <charlie-tca> i can infer from what he implied
[00:42] <jledbetter> But anyway...
[00:42] <hajour> MrChrisDruif,  a mentee can work with the project fromm his her mentor
[00:42] <duanedesign> i think that is hajour and UndiFineD. The accessebility fg
[00:42] <collinp> charlie-tca: Oh my god.
[00:43] <charlie-tca> lol
[00:43] <charlie-tca> but assume is never good
[00:43] <seidos> charlie-tca: you can, but should you ;)
[00:43] <jledbetter> Back to agenda, please :)
[00:43] <collinp> ^ good idea.
[00:43] <phillw> there are enough people on accessibilty channels to support a FG - Some quite astounding people in fact
[00:44] <duanedesign> oh and charlie-tca and hggdh have been doing a great job of being available to answer questions in our channel about bug triage
[00:44]  * hggdh hears self's name
[00:44] <duanedesign> please be aware they are there and they love to help :)
[00:44] <UndiFineD> yes, the user days was nice
[00:44] <phillw> duanedesign: and tenach has started the classroom sessions for coding web sites
[00:45] <UndiFineD> ? phillw did i miss it ?
[00:46] <phillw> UndiFineD: we have not done that one yet.... me and another are doing those sessions :D
[00:46] <duanedesign> me and cprofitt talked today about hggdh and charlie-tca becoming members of the BT. I probably dont have to tell you all they would be great members of the team
[00:46] <MrChrisDruif> I don't want to be a party pooper, but we've got about 15 mins left....
[00:47] <UndiFineD> duanedesign: totally agree-ing
[00:47] <duanedesign> and since the last thing we always cover is member votes let us vote on them being members :)
[00:47] <phillw> duanedesign: I do not know hggdh, but charlie-tca I would give a +1 to
[00:47] <collinp> There's not another meeting for a while, so we probably won't have any trouble if we go over the meeting time.
[00:47] <hajour> +1
[00:47] <hggdh> phillw: I am one of the admins for bug-control and bugsquad
[00:48] <PabloRubianes> duanedesign, good lets vote then
[00:48] <duanedesign> [VOTE] hggdh for member
[00:48] <MootBot> Please vote on:  hggdh for member.
[00:48] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[00:48] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[00:48] <duanedesign> +1
[00:48] <collinp> +1
[00:48] <MootBot> +1 received from duanedesign. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1
[00:48] <MootBot> +1 received from collinp. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2
[00:48] <phillw> hggdh: you have just gained a +1 from me, bug hunting is a neverending task
[00:48] <UndiFineD> +1
[00:48] <MootBot> +1 received from UndiFineD. 3 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 3
[00:48] <hajour> +1
[00:48] <MootBot> +1 received from hajour. 4 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 4
[00:48] <phillw> +1
[00:48] <MootBot> +1 received from phillw. 5 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 5
[00:49] <PabloRubianes> +1
[00:49] <MootBot> +1 received from PabloRubianes. 6 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 6
[00:49] <duanedesign> any other members present to vote
[00:49] <collinp> Well, that was simple.
[00:49] <duanedesign> [ENDVOTE]
[00:49] <MootBot> Final result is 6 for, 0 against. 0 abstained. Total: 6
[00:49] <duanedesign> yaa
[00:49] <hggdh> :-)
[00:49] <hggdh> thank you folks
[00:49] <jledbetter> +1 (I was reading sorry)
[00:49] <jledbetter> Grats!
[00:49] <duanedesign> welcome hggdh
[00:49] <collinp> hggdh: I think you mentioning "admin for bug-control and bugsquad" did the trick :P
[00:49] <PabloRubianes> congrats hggdh
[00:49] <charlie-tca> Congratulations, hggdh
[00:49] <hggdh> heh
[00:49] <MrChrisDruif> Congratz hggdh :)
[00:49] <duanedesign> ok now mr charlie
[00:49] <hajour> congrats hggdh and charlie-tca
[00:50] <charlie-tca> I am just an underling compared to hggdh
[00:50] <paultag> +1, late
[00:50] <duanedesign> I met charlie at UDS and I see him all over the community. He would be a great +! iin my book
[00:50] <paultag> love you guys, keep on keeping on
[00:50] <hggdh> charlie-tca: not at all
[00:50] <MrChrisDruif> hajour: I think we need to vote about it (but will prolly pass)
[00:50] <duanedesign> [VOTE] charlie-tca for member
[00:50] <MootBot> Please vote on:  charlie-tca for member.
[00:50] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[00:50] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[00:50] <UndiFineD> +1
[00:50] <duanedesign> +1
[00:50] <hajour> +1
[00:50] <jledbetter> +1
[00:50] <MootBot> +1 received from UndiFineD. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1
[00:50] <MootBot> +1 received from duanedesign. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2
[00:50] <MootBot> +1 received from jledbetter. 3 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 3
[00:50] <collinp> 0
[00:50] <MootBot> +1 received from hajour. 4 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 4
[00:50] <paultag> +1
[00:50] <MootBot> +1 received from paultag. 5 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 5
[00:50] <collinp> er
[00:50] <collinp> +0
[00:50] <MootBot> Abstention received from collinp. 5 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 5
[00:50] <phillw> +1
[00:50] <PabloRubianes> +1
[00:50] <MootBot> +1 received from PabloRubianes. 6 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 6
[00:50] <MootBot> +1 received from phillw. 7 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 7
[00:50] <duanedesign> ok... anymore
[00:51] <hggdh> Can I vote?
[00:51] <pedro3005> seidos
[00:51] <duanedesign> ya
[00:51] <paultag> hggdh: I think so, you're a member now :)
[00:51] <duanedesign> :)
[00:51] <hggdh> +1
[00:51] <MootBot> +1 received from hggdh. 8 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 8
[00:51] <MrChrisDruif> hggdh: Your a member ;)
[00:51] <duanedesign> he catches on quick
[00:51] <paultag> duanedesign: inorite?
[00:51] <duanedesign> [ENDVOTE]
[00:51] <MootBot> Final result is 8 for, 0 against. 1 abstained. Total: 8
[00:51] <duanedesign> woo hoo
[00:51] <hggdh> charlie-tca is worth it ;-)
[00:51] <MrChrisDruif> Congratz charlie-tca :)
[00:51] <charlie-tca> Thank you
[00:51] <jledbetter> Congratulions charlie-tca :)
[00:51] <paultag> charlie-tca: 'grats
[00:52] <duanedesign> collinp: did yiu want to say something?
[00:52] <hggdh> yeee, I am not the newest member anymore
[00:52] <PabloRubianes> charlie-tca, congrats!!!
[00:52] <jledbetter> s/Congratulions/Congratulations/
[00:52] <duanedesign> charlie-tca: welcome
[00:52] <collinp> Oh, yes.
[00:52] <phillw> charlie-tca: and hggdh welcome to UBT.
[00:52] <UndiFineD> duanedesign:could we vote on JackyAlcine and / or MrChrisDruif ?
[00:52] <pedro3005> and seidos !
[00:52] <collinp> We need more members for the Dev FG. I was staving off due to the team structure changes, but I think this would be the best time to announce that, since most of the team is here.
[00:52] <MrChrisDruif> =-O
[00:52] <hajour> duanedesign,  can JackyAlcine  be next time on the list for to become ubt member ?
[00:52] <duanedesign> heh, seidos is like mohi
[00:52] <collinp> The current member list for the Dev FG, I can count on two hands.
[00:52] <duanedesign> you mean he is not a member yet!
[00:52] <collinp> The active members I could count on one hand.
[00:53] <pedro3005> duanedesign, he's been my padawan for about a year
[00:53] <duanedesign> collinp: you are rifght
[00:53] <collinp> If you're interested in joining.. well, let me get the wiki page.
[00:53] <pedro3005> i can't stand that guy anymore! make him a member already
[00:53] <MrChrisDruif> pedro3005: A year?
[00:53] <pedro3005> :P just kidding
[00:53] <pedro3005> he's cool
[00:53] <jledbetter> collinp, Aren't we a member if we're on launchpad?
[00:53] <collinp> jledbetter: You're a member if you're in the Launchpad team, yes.
[00:53] <duanedesign> i know there is a lot of interest in the Dev FG...
[00:53] <pedro3005> MrChrisDruif, he became my padawan less than a week after I became a member myself
[00:53] <collinp> But first, there's a process.
[00:54] <jledbetter> Woots
[00:54] <MrChrisDruif> pedro3005: Same with UndiFineD and me :)
[00:54] <collinp> If you want it simply put, it's me checking that you have the credentials enough to be a productive member of the team (not very much) and helping you if you don't.
[00:54] <MrChrisDruif> Maybe two weeks...didn't count O:-)
[00:54] <collinp> So apply to the Launchpad group and I'll get to you on IRC to ensure that you have the credentials for the team.
[00:55] <duanedesign> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/FocusGroups/Development
[00:55] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/FocusGroups/Development
[00:55] <jledbetter> That's a nice idea to help folks get there, collinp
[00:55] <duanedesign> dev FG is aweosme.
[00:55] <pedro3005> so, let's please consider. the poor guy will go on an existential crisis
[00:55] <phillw> MrChrisDruif: this is a marathon, not a sprint. take your time and get to know other members :)
[00:55] <duanedesign> ok seidos
[00:55] <collinp> Rage. I can't find the wiki page.
[00:55] <seidos> pedro3005: couldn't you just make a program to automagically confirm members?
[00:56] <collinp> So I'll just have to list them out manually.
[00:56] <jledbetter> collinp, Is it the one duanedesign linked?
[00:56]  * seidos laments and gnashes his teeth
[00:56] <MrChrisDruif> phillw: I didn't mention being voted upon O:-)
[00:56] <collinp> jledbetter: That's the team's Wiki page, but not the one I'm looking for.
[00:56] <jledbetter> Ah ok
[00:56] <pedro3005> seidos, but, democracy!
[00:56] <duanedesign> we will do MrChrisDruif  and JackyAlcine next meeting so if you have not met them yet take a minute to say hi
[00:56] <collinp> Ok. Knowing or be learning a programming language is the biggest one.
[00:56] <seidos> pedro3005: have everyone vote on your program ;)
[00:56] <jledbetter> Even Java? ;)
[00:56] <MrChrisDruif> Hai :D
[00:56] <collinp> Any programming language will do.
[00:56] <collinp> jledbetter: Yes, even java.
[00:57] <jledbetter> haha :D
[00:57] <pedro3005> seidos, that program exists, it's called MootBot
[00:57] <collinp> (sadly) but uh
[00:57] <collinp> No, I'm kidding.
[00:57] <pedro3005> yeah
[00:57] <pedro3005> we don't take java programmers
[00:57] <jledbetter> :'(
[00:57] <UndiFineD> alright duanedesign
[00:57] <duanedesign> ok
[00:57]  * jledbetter takes her blocks and goes home
[00:57] <seidos> i wish i knew java, heh
[00:57] <collinp> Knowing your way around bug trackers and release systems is preferred.
[00:57] <collinp> That's about all that I can think of.
[00:57] <pedro3005> jledbetter, it's okay. you can still repent your sins. haskell will show you the way to salvation
[00:58] <jledbetter> haha Haskell? hahahahaha
[00:58] <jledbetter> Yeah bug tracker, versioning (bzr/git), yep yep
[00:58]  * pedro3005 grumbles
[00:59] <pedro3005> enough dev chat?
[00:59] <duanedesign> :)
[00:59] <collinp> Typical knowledge of development tools is preferred.
[00:59] <collinp> Now I'm done.
[00:59] <jledbetter> Never! But ok.
[00:59] <pedro3005> we can diverge to -dev if necessary
[00:59] <duanedesign> anything else?
[00:59] <pedro3005> uhm... the voting...
[00:59] <duanedesign> Are we going to make seidos wait one more month
[00:59] <duanedesign> :)
[00:59] <seidos> where is confirmation recorded?
[01:00] <seidos> a wiki?
[01:00] <hakimsheriff> AM I allowed to vote?
[01:00] <seidos> i could just go and update it...
[01:00] <collinp> seidos: Hm?
[01:00] <hakimsheriff> I am not a full memebr yet
[01:00] <duanedesign> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/seidos
[01:00] <seidos> hakimsheriff: why not?
[01:00] <UndiFineD> hakimsheriff: nope
[01:00] <MrChrisDruif> Well, then you've got the same luck as me :D
[01:00] <MrChrisDruif> hakimsheriff ^
[01:01] <hakimsheriff> Mohi says soon
[01:01] <MrChrisDruif> You have the pleasure to see the rest of the members make their votes :P
[01:01] <hakimsheriff> Maybe next meeting
[01:01] <duanedesign> [VOTE] seidos for member
[01:01] <MootBot> Please vote on:  seidos for member.
[01:01] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[01:01] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[01:01] <seidos> i'll just add myself as a mentor on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Mentors
[01:01] <duanedesign> +!
[01:01]  * seidos puts on the stone of triumph
[01:01] <duanedesign> +1
[01:01] <MootBot> +1 received from duanedesign. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1
[01:01] <collinp> +1
[01:01] <MootBot> +1 received from collinp. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2
[01:01] <pedro3005> +1
[01:01] <MootBot> +1 received from pedro3005. 3 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 3
[01:01] <UndiFineD> +1
[01:01] <MootBot> +1 received from UndiFineD. 4 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 4
[01:01] <phillw> +1
[01:01] <MootBot> +1 received from phillw. 5 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 5
[01:01]  * pedro3005 pokes paultag to vote
[01:01] <duanedesign> seidos: going once
[01:01] <duanedesign> twice
[01:01] <duanedesign> three times
[01:01] <seidos> +1
[01:01] <MootBot> +1 received from seidos. 6 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 6
[01:02] <duanedesign> sold
[01:02] <MrChrisDruif> xD
[01:02] <seidos> seis
[01:02] <duanedesign> [ENDVOTE]
[01:02] <MootBot> Final result is 6 for, 0 against. 0 abstained. Total: 6
[01:02] <duanedesign> yaa
[01:02] <pedro3005> I feel like a ton has been lifted from my shoulder!
[01:02]  * pedro3005 laughs
[01:02] <MrChrisDruif> seidos: Voting on yourself ;)
[01:02] <jledbetter> lol
[01:02] <seidos> MrChrisDruif: i wanted to exercise my democratic rights
[01:02] <duanedesign> lets put the other two on the agenda for the next meeting?
[01:03] <seidos> thanks your honors
[01:03]  * seidos gives everyone a pen
[01:03] <hajour> o i missed the vote +1 from me for seidos
[01:03] <duanedesign> also if anyone wants to help with the post meeting tasks
[01:03] <duanedesign> please come to -team
[01:03] <paultag> Oh crud
[01:03] <paultag> +1
[01:03] <paultag> duh, of course
[01:03] <phillw> duanedesign: I'd back Jacky 100%, the work he is doing on speechcontrol is wonderful.
[01:03] <pedro3005> seidos, you're a cool kid now
[01:03] <paultag> seidos: +1 for sure
[01:04] <hajour> me to duanedesign
[01:04] <duanedesign> Keep BeginnersTeam/TeamReports updated.
[01:04] <duanedesign> Update Next meeting time on the wiki
[01:04] <duanedesign> Send meeting minutes to ubuntu-beginners mailing list\
[01:04] <seidos> paultag: snarky comment
[01:04] <paultag> seidos: clever retort
[01:04] <duanedesign> thank you everyone
[01:04] <seidos> the polls have closed!
[01:04]  * seidos cries
[01:04] <duanedesign> grreat meeting!
[01:04] <duanedesign> haha grrreat
[01:04] <pedro3005> we laughed, we cried
[01:04] <jledbetter>  \o/
[01:04] <duanedesign> i am tony the tiger
[01:04] <seidos> paultag: if anyone asks, it was 7 votes to 0
[01:04] <duanedesign> #endmeeting
[01:04] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 19:04.
[01:04] <pedro3005> but time is fleeting
[01:04] <jledbetter> for reals
[01:04] <hakimsheriff> Bye all
[01:04] <UndiFineD> thanks everyone
[01:05] <pedro3005> and for complex numbers too
[01:05]  * jledbetter slips back to -team
[01:05] <seidos> i am zach the zebra
[01:05] <duanedesign> congrats to the new members
[01:05] <MrChrisDruif> Yeah, congratz seidos :)
[01:05] <UndiFineD> yep congrats hggdh , charlie-tca and seidos
[01:05] <seidos> thanks MrChrisDruif
[01:05] <hajour> i have a question .we need stil 4 python and 4 C++ programmers we try to get open mary in natty
[01:05] <hggdh> UndiFineD: thank you
[01:06] <hajour> i talk further in #ubuntu-beginners-team
[01:06] <maco> hey beginners team people
[01:07] <maco> whats with the C++ class that your wiki page says happens at 15:00 on saturdays and didnt?
[01:08] <UndiFineD> dont know maco
[01:08] <hajour> collinp,  do you now it ? what maco ask
[01:08] <collinp> No idea.
[01:09] <pedro3005> we should probably take that off the wiki
[01:09] <pedro3005> maco, DiegoTc was going to teach it, showed up once and never again. at least that's what I saw
[01:09] <hajour> collinp,  i am become a mentor but seams me better to begin with 1 mentee
[01:10] <maco> i see
[01:11] <maco> people were in -classroom early saturday asking what timezone the 15:00 meant and so ...cue utc explanation.... and then i scrolled back and saw it didnt happen and then wondered if the wiki was just for a specific week or what
[01:12] <seidos> date -R
[01:12] <seidos> great command
[16:00] <cjwatson> hi foundations folks
[16:00] <ev> hiya
[16:01] <barry> hi
[16:01] <robbiew> o/
[16:01] <cjwatson> Robbie has a conflict, so asked me to chair
[16:04] <cjwatson> (sorry, mumble discussion :-) )
[16:04] <cjwatson> #startmeeting
[16:04] <MootBot> Meeting started at 10:04. The chair is cjwatson.
[16:04] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[16:05] <cjwatson> [TOPIC] Lightning round
[16:05] <MootBot> New Topic:  Lightning round
[16:05]  * cjwatson looks round
[16:05] <cjwatson> james_w:
[16:05] <cjwatson> oops!
[16:05] <cjwatson> ok, backwards order in the directory :)
[16:05] <cjwatson> jhunt: how's the week been?
[16:05] <james_w> hi!
[16:05] <jhunt> Out Friday+Monday. Submitted byobu merge proposal for my UTF-8
[16:05] <jhunt> notification utilities and kirkland has now accepted these. Blog post to
[16:05] <jhunt> follow with some screenshots when I get a chance. Played a bit with my
[16:05] <jhunt> interactive boot idea for Upstart (looking vaguely promising at this
[16:05] <jhunt> point :) Documented my thoughts on how we could enhance the testing for
[16:05] <jhunt> Upstart.  Most of the time spent working on unit + functional tests for
[16:06] <jhunt> Upstart visualisation (requiring unit test framework changes and lots of
[16:06] <jhunt> macros to make the test code understandable! :-) Have documented tests
[16:06] <jhunt> and am currently working through coding. Have now arranged weekly call
[16:06] <jhunt> with Keybuk. Today, more Upstart tests and started to review patches for
[16:06] <jhunt> lp:#643289.
[16:06] <jhunt> EOT
[16:06] <james_w> I'm afraid to say I haven't contributed much to foundations this week ;-)
[16:06] <cjwatson> james_w: yep, sorry ;-)
[16:07] <barry> james_w: please make sure you do better next week :)
[16:07] <cjwatson> jhunt: cool.  good news on the branch maintenance front by the looks of things too
[16:08] <jhunt> indeed - I forgot to bring that up earlier!
[16:08] <mvo> barry: just fyi, I run the python-all auto-upgrade test currently (but its a bit on the slow side, my hdd could be faster it seems)
[16:09] <barry> mvo: thanks
[16:10] <cjwatson> psurbhi1: how about you?  (Sorry I haven't got anywhere with your mdadm fixes branch - I asked mvo this afternoon if he could have a look at it)
[16:10] <psurbhi1> cjwatson, np
[16:10] <psurbhi1> * worked on nfs-util bug 709392 on thursday, friday and a little bit of today (out of curiosity)
[16:10] <psurbhi1> * worked on getting mountall in initramfs - printing and debugging - no major success yet.
[16:10] <psurbhi1> (done)
[16:10] <mvo> psurbhi1: I'm happy to have a look, haven't manged before the meeting unfortunately
[16:11] <psurbhi1> mvo, np at all.. the merges are for lucid and maverick
[16:12] <cjwatson> psurbhi1: thanks, give me a shout if you need another set of eyeballs on mountall
[16:12] <cjwatson> mvo: ?
[16:13] <mvo> apt: upload backport for apt-ftparchive --arch for soyuz, branch merges, debugging, work on lp:~mvo/apt/dpointer;
[16:13] <mvo> Auto-upgrade-tester: add simulate profile, cleanup exception, improve overview html;
[16:13] <mvo> Btfs natty test install; Gdebi: fix gio branch; Jockey: fix pkgfile parser bug lp:~mvo/jockey/fix-multiple-modules-in-packages-file;
[16:13] <mvo> software-center: work with didrocks on onecnf, add tests for the netstatus branch, review/merges branches; Soyuz: test support-timeframe-fix with bigjools; Unattended-upgrades: bug triage, add much improved matching; update-manager: improve details display, upload new version with poprted modalises code; Xserver-xorg-video-intel: backport fix for xserver-xorg-video-intel #707236
[16:13] <psurbhi1> cjwatson, ok, thanks!
[16:15] <cjwatson> mvo: have you done a btrfs test install since yesterday, or was this the previous one?
[16:15] <cjwatson> I think it should actually work now
[16:16] <psurbhi1> mvo, cjwatson, is the btrfs test install working?
[16:16] <mvo> cjwatson: that was the previous one - cool, I will do one today then
[16:16] <cjwatson> psurbhi1: it ran into some grub breakage (actually fairly small but rather fatal) - I fixed that
[16:16] <psurbhi1> cjwatson, ok, thanks!
[16:16] <mvo> \o/
[16:16] <psurbhi1> :)
[16:16]  * mvo runs rsync
[16:17] <cjwatson> the installer side was fine except that the subvolumes needed to be made world-readable
[16:17] <cjwatson> but I think today's daily build should be all working, assuming it built
[16:17] <psurbhi1> ok, i will have a look at it too
[16:18] <cjwatson> doko is on holiday
[16:18] <cjwatson> ev: ?
[16:18] <ev> Digging at the X handover in oem-config some more with advice from Scott on the correct approach, usb-creator KVM option, console-setup and xkb-data fixes, timezone widget discussions with GNOME, some bug gardening
[16:18] <ev> (done)
[16:19] <cjwatson> oh, is GNOME interested?
[16:19] <ev> indeed, it's largely going upstream
[16:19]  * ev digs up the blog post
[16:20] <cjwatson> that's very cool
[16:20] <mvo> nice
[16:20] <ev> http://blogs.gnome.org/thos/2010/07/16/date-and-time-settings/ http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-control-center/tree/?h=wip/datetime-panel
[16:20] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://blogs.gnome.org/thos/2010/07/16/date-and-time-settings/ http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-control-center/tree/?h=wip/datetime-panel
[16:21] <mvo> hm, are there missing credits in this post ?
[16:23]  * cjwatson moves on
[16:23] <cjwatson> my week (short, I was on holiday on Monday): GRUB btrfs installation fixes (#712029); OpenSSH/hardy fix for IPv6-only hosts (#713002); packaged OpenSSH 5.8p1; porting work; obscure octave3.2 failure on lucid and maverick (#546671); misc grub-install
[16:23] <cjwatson> er bugs
[16:24] <ev> mvo: credited in the source code header, which is all I care about really.
[16:24] <mvo> fair enough
[16:24] <cdbs> is this the foundation team meeting?
[16:24] <cjwatson> cdbs: yes
[16:24] <cjwatson> barry: ?
[16:25] <barry> bug 686257 (python-keyring); bug 702375 (launchpadlib); bug 712136 (pymca); bug 697792 (fuse); bug 664276 (python-numpy); python-libavg review; platform futures meeting; python27 transition analysis/work; udd docs merge into ubuntu dev guide; still need to work out the whole numpy-matplotlib-wxgtk2.8 dependency tangle; done.
[16:27] <cjwatson> ok, thanks all, I am a slow lightning-guider today
[16:27] <cjwatson> [TOPIC] Alpha-3 bugs
[16:27] <MootBot> New Topic:  Alpha-3 bugs
[16:27] <cjwatson> our beloved release manager is concerned about bug levels :-)
[16:28] <cjwatson> I'd like to ask that everyone make a habit of regularly looking at these two URLs and seeing what you can prune out of them
[16:28] <cjwatson> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReleaseTeam/Meeting/Agenda#Foundations
[16:29] <cjwatson> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.milestone=33573
[16:30] <cjwatson> perhaps we could take a quick run through critical/high in the latter now
[16:30] <cjwatson> bug 693671 - anyone have a Windows system and fancy attacking this?
[16:30] <cjwatson> bug 605042 - looks like ours, but blocked on kernel team
[16:31] <cjwatson> bug 634664
[16:31] <barry> cjwatson: i have w7 in a vm so i can at least take a look
[16:31] <cjwatson> bug 683260 - this was one of the top ISO testing bugs last time round
[16:31] <cjwatson> barry: great, let me know if you need orientation in the baroqueness of wubi
[16:31] <barry> cjwatson: will do :)
[16:31] <cjwatson> leaving out gcc bugs since doko isn't here
[16:32] <cjwatson> bug 705917
[16:32] <ev> equally available for wubi assistance
[16:32] <cjwatson> bug 712662
[16:32] <barry> ev: ack
[16:33] <cjwatson> (actually, that last is assigned to doko already)
[16:33] <ev> I'll dig at bug 683260
[16:33] <mvo> looks like 671016 is in progress, but we need to find the right words, I will see how I can improve it
[16:34] <cjwatson> I'm guessing 705917 is my fault, I'll take a look at that
[16:35] <ev> oh thanks.  I started to pick at that a bit, but got caught up in the xkb-data/console-setup stuff, so ultimately didn't get far
[16:36] <cjwatson> ah, didn't know you were on it.  yeah, it's very easy to end up yak-shaving with that stuff
[16:36] <cjwatson> ok, that's enough bugs to be getting on with, I think, but it will definitely help if as many people as possible stay on top of those lists
[16:36] <cjwatson> [TOPIC] AOB / Good news
[16:36] <MootBot> New Topic:  AOB / Good news
[16:36] <cjwatson> Debian released, in case anyone's been living under a rock ;-)
[16:37] <ev> I'm all booked for pycon
[16:37]  * barry has to do the same
[16:38] <barry> fwiw, python 3.2 final is getting another rc, so final release pushed back a week
[16:41] <cjwatson> ok, all done by the looks of things :0
[16:41] <cjwatson> :)
[16:41] <cjwatson> thanks all
[16:41] <cjwatson> #endmeeting
[16:41] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 10:41.
[16:41] <barry> thanks cjwatson
[16:41] <psurbhi1> cjwatson, thanks
[16:42] <mvo> thanks!
[16:43] <ev> thanks
[16:44] <jhunt> thx!
[18:58] <highvoltage> Howdy!
[18:58] <highvoltage> Anyone around for the Edubuntu meeting?
[18:58] <doctormo> I'm here
[18:58] <mgariepy> i am here too
[18:58] <alkisg_web> Hi all
[18:58] <hajour> you are beginning now ?
[18:59] <highvoltage> yep
[18:59]  * stgraber waves and go away for another meeting
[18:59] <hajour> i wanted only to say i am busy to get a school in netherland use edubuntu
[18:59] <highvoltage> I'll just quickly spew some updates before we talk to doctormo, he's willing to create a wallpaper for us
[19:00] <hajour> primary school
[19:00] <highvoltage> hajour: cool, I know of one school (or I think organisation) called Het Hooghuis which also does in the netherlands
[19:01] <highvoltage> Last week we release alpha 2, it was kind of nasty because of the amd64 webkit bug, but other than that it went quite well
[19:01] <hajour> i have some questions still about it where can i go for to get answers about it
[19:01] <highvoltage> and we're mostly on track so far
[19:01] <highvoltage> Some of the alpha 2 todo items were pushed out to alpha 3: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu/Devel/RoadMap
[19:01] <hajour> yes i know its a other province city there is oss
[19:01] <highvoltage> hajour: #edubuntu
[19:02] <hajour> thank you very much highvoltage
[19:02] <highvoltage> hajour: or otherwise any of the methods on http://edubuntu.org/community :)
[19:02] <highvoltage> (although except for the mailing lists it's usually the same few people active)
[19:02] <hajour> thank you sorry for the disturb
[19:02] <highvoltage> no you're welcome!
[19:03] <hajour> :)
[19:03] <highvoltage> we also have our first edubuntu-specific security vulnerability, I can't discuss the details yet publically because the fix is currently being prepared for the archives
[19:04] <highvoltage> I'll send more details about that to the edubuntu-devel list within the next 12-48 hours. we might get quite a lot of questions about that so we should be ready
[19:05] <highvoltage> over the last weekend I saw this card on doctormo's blog: http://edubuntu.org/communitydoctormo.deviantart.com/gallery/#/d38yry3
[19:05] <highvoltage> oops, http://doctormo.deviantart.com/gallery/#/d38yry3
[19:06] <highvoltage> I like the style and doctormo indicated that he's willing to put some effort into a wallpaper for us if we can commit to it
[19:06] <highvoltage> basically he doesn't want to put a lot of time into it if it's going to be wasted, which is understandable
[19:07] <highvoltage> we currently have the artwork team creating some wallpapers: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Specs/0006_Edubuntu_Natty_Wallpaper
[19:07] <highvoltage> current submissions on http://www.flickr.com/groups/uawt-6/
[19:08] <highvoltage> I'm not sure what you guys think, but personally it sounds like a good idea to go with doctormo if he can commit to see it through
[19:08] <doctormo> highvoltage: I'm trying to upload an updated version for you.
[19:08]  * highvoltage wonders if mhall119 is around
[19:08]  * mhall119 is
[19:09] <highvoltage> mhall119: good, you usually have an opinion about this kind of thing :)
[19:09] <mhall119> I like doctormo's circuit image best
[19:09] <highvoltage> I liked that too
[19:10] <mhall119> the elephants image on flickr second best, but elephant != narwhal, and that might be confusing
[19:10] <mhall119> give that past animal wallpapers have matched the release mascot
[19:10] <doctormo> What I would like for you both to do mhall119 and highvoltage is put aside your asthetic and think about solid things you want and want to avoid.
[19:10] <doctormo> So, no clishays(sp)
[19:10] <highvoltage> clichés, yes
[19:10] <highvoltage> well, not the old boring ones at least
[19:11] <mhall119> I'd say no words (unless they're for asthetics not reading)
[19:11] <doctormo> The artwork team is coming to a consensus on the format of requests that edubuntu should be aware of
[19:11] <highvoltage> yeah we mentioned no text on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Specs/0006_Edubuntu_Natty_Wallpaper
[19:11] <mhall119> not cartoonish either
[19:12] <doctormo> Competitions are no ok for artwork unless they are designed to foster a learning experience between artists.
[19:12] <doctormo> All artwork should probably be matched up with artists who your happy to work with and who you trust and who are willing to work with you.
[19:12] <mhall119> can we trust doctormo?
[19:12] <highvoltage> I like cartoonish, but that's just me, and also why we need larger input (because I love the cartoonish style of http://doctormo.deviantart.com/gallery/#/d38yry3)
[19:13] <highvoltage> mhall119: I have no idea
[19:13] <highvoltage> mhall119: he seems sincere :)
[19:13] <mhall119> that hat makes him look shifty
[19:13] <highvoltage> it does.
[19:13] <mhall119> I'm not even sure he's really a doctor
[19:13] <highvoltage> like doctor evil?
[19:13] <doctormo> I'm a witch doctor, next question! ;-)
[19:14] <highvoltage> I'm not sure how to approach this
[19:15]  * cody-somerville has always enjoyed the abstract realism type artwork Fedora uses for their wallpaper.
[19:15] <highvoltage> if we're going to make a wiki page and spam the list/identica/etc to comment on it we're going to end up with a page with lots of contradictions and something that's not clear enough for doctormo to work from
[19:15] <doctormo> highvoltage: Imagine you needed code contributions.
[19:15] <highvoltage> costales: *nod*
[19:15] <doctormo> Definition, concept and mood. That's all I need.
[19:15] <costales> hi highvoltage
[19:16] <highvoltage> doctormo: the difference with code and artwork is that code usually has few right ways of doing it. I think there are many ways to have nice wallpapers
[19:16] <doctormo> I can make several different non-complete works and you can pick between them and then I'll finish the one you want.
[19:16]  * highvoltage makes some notes about what doctormo needs
[19:17] <highvoltage> doctormo: that sounds great
[19:18] <highvoltage> doctormo: pretty much the biggest things I can think of is that our panels are very light in colour, so having a wallpaper that's not too light would be great (the low contrast is a problem with the current wallpaper)
[19:18] <doctormo> highvoltage: Also check the updated version: http://doctormo.deviantart.com/art/Underwater-Stream-196560265
[19:19] <highvoltage> doctormo: other than ideally having no text, and avoiding the usual clichés that we've seen a million times, I don't think there's really any hard limits, I'd like to give you as much artistic license as possible
[19:19] <doctormo> Before the set of 5 concept works, I'll need those three things from you guys.
[19:20] <doctormo> As well as the rules. Which seem to consist of: no cartoons, no cliches, no text.
[19:20] <highvoltage> ok, we'll get those to you by friday. I'll spam the usual contact means and if people don't respons then they'll have to be happy with what I suggest to you :)
[19:21]  * doctormo thinks that if he really had free license, he'd make a 100% black wallpaper and you'd have to use it  ;-)
[19:22] <highvoltage> strictly speaking, that *would* fit the current criterea we gave you :)
[19:23] <highvoltage> doctormo: ok, so we'll get back to you on friday at with that information. either that or if people aren't happy with giving up on the artwork team I'll let you know
[19:23] <highvoltage> the artwork team's work is good and we'll include it on the disc, I'm just not fond of using it for a default
[19:24] <highvoltage> oh hi costales :)
[19:25] <doctormo> highvoltage: I am doing this as part of the artwork team
[19:25] <highvoltage> doctormo: ok, that's really good, do you talk to john baer at all?
[19:26] <doctormo> Consider the that there is a little bit of a fork, there is me, thorwil and the canonical people and then there is a seperate prong.
[19:26] <highvoltage> ok, that answers my question exactly
[19:27] <highvoltage> anything else for the edubuntu meeting?
[19:27] <doctormo> that consists of baer who believes in wikipedia style, mass competition style amateur art and the extensive use of flikr. Which can work...
[19:29] <highvoltage> yeah
[19:30] <highvoltage> well, I guess that's it for this meeting then, we can continue in #edubuntu then :)
[19:30] <highvoltage> *GONG*
[19:30] <doctormo> thanks highvoltage
[21:01] <poolie> hi
[21:01] <poolie> Ubuntu DistributedDevelopment meeting starting now; all welcome
[21:01] <poolie> #startmeeting
[21:01] <MootBot> Meeting started at 15:01. The chair is poolie.
[21:01] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[21:01]  * slangasek waves
[21:02] <jelmer> me
[21:02] <jelmer> hi slangasek
[21:02] <poolie> [topic] attendees
[21:02] <MootBot> New Topic:  attendees
[21:02] <poolie> hi jelmer, slangasek
[21:02] <poolie> barry sent apologies
[21:02] <wendar> listening in
[21:03] <poolie> james_w, hi?
[21:03] <james_w> hi
[21:03] <james_w> sorry I'm late :-)
[21:03] <poolie> np :)
[21:03] <poolie> agenda is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DistributedDevelopment/20110209#preview
[21:03] <jam> hi
[21:03] <poolie> [topic] action items
[21:03] <MootBot> New Topic:  action items
[21:04] <poolie> * poolie to send bzr rotation pitch to platform mailing list
[21:04] <poolie> done!
[21:04] <jam> I do believe I saw that \o/
[21:04] <poolie> actually i sent it to canonical-tech
[21:04] <poolie> want to try it?
[21:04] <poolie> i got one response already, which is good
[21:04] <poolie> perhaps i should forward it to ubuntu-platform?
[21:04] <james_w> cool
[21:04] <jam> poolie: "want to try it"? try what?
[21:04] <james_w> I would
[21:04] <poolie> working on bzr :)
[21:04] <james_w> jam, try a rotation to the bzr team?
[21:04] <poolie> ok
[21:04] <jam> ah
[21:05] <jam> sure, I'll rotate to bzr for 6 months
[21:05] <poolie> i wonder if we can send a similar invitation to non-canonical-staff?
[21:05] <poolie> just as a thing they might be interested to work on
[21:05] <poolie> perhaps a post that gets to the planet is best
[21:05] <james_w> yeah, I think that would be best
[21:05] <poolie> [action] poolie to forward to ubuntu-platform
[21:05] <MootBot> ACTION received:  poolie to forward to ubuntu-platform
[21:06] <poolie> [action] poolie to advertise udd projects to non-staff contributors
[21:06] <MootBot> ACTION received:  poolie to advertise udd projects to non-staff contributors
[21:06] <james_w> posting with things to do and ways to get started can help
[21:06] <poolie> right
[21:06] <poolie> * poolie to update hot bugs for next meeting
[21:06] <poolie> done
[21:06] <poolie> we're now using assignment to <https://bugs.launchpad.net/~canonical-bazaar/+assignedbugs> to track our short list
[21:06] <jam> poolie: is that just ~canonical-bazaar, or is there a different list of 'hot' bugs?
[21:07] <poolie> i think just that's enough
[21:07] <poolie> and that also shows up in https://devpad.canonical.com/~mbp/kanban/bzr-kanban.html
[21:07] <poolie> which i propose we use to review them in a bit
[21:07] <poolie> to review which particular bugs are listed, and whether anything else should be
[21:07] <poolie> any comments on this?
[21:08] <jelmer> poolie: So we use that to track our hot bugs list, then reassign to a specific person when we actually start hacking?
[21:08] <poolie> correct
[21:08] <poolie> the kanban shows bugs assigned to the team or its members
[21:09] <poolie> it would be nice to show this in lp itself too
[21:09] <poolie> (i wonder if there's a bug for that)
[21:09] <poolie> ok, moving on
[21:09] <james_w> poolie, is that assigned list *the* queue to work from?
[21:09] <poolie> yes, it is
[21:10] <james_w> ok
[21:10] <james_w> so we should prioritise and put the most important in that list, and drop things that aren't that important?
[21:10] <poolie> people can also take reactive/opportunistic/itch-scratching bugs of course, but they should be taking a lot of work from there
[21:10] <james_w> over time I mean
[21:10] <poolie> with the caveat that bugs they've specifically individually taken from that page won't show up
[21:10] <poolie> as i mentioned above
[21:10] <poolie> correct, we should
[21:10] <poolie> i hope during the bug review phase of this meeting we'll do some of that
[21:11] <james_w> ok
[21:11] <james_w> thanks
[21:11] <poolie> every fortnight
[21:11] <poolie> * poolie to file bug about MOTD information for out-of-date packages
[21:11] <poolie> done
[21:12] <poolie> but not assigned?
[21:12] <jelmer> there was also a very old bug by spiv, perhaps that should be marked as a dupe?
[21:12] <jelmer> bug 121201
[21:13] <poolie> it seems like we could use that to implement this
[21:14] <poolie> ok
[21:14] <poolie> https://bugs.launchpad.net/udd/+bug/609187
[21:14] <poolie> and it actually is assigned
[21:14] <poolie> and barry filed it
[21:15] <jelmer> ah, ok
[21:16] <jam> poolie: next?
[21:16] <poolie> * jam to review spiv's branch for bug 603395
[21:16] <jam> I didn't get to it, but poolie did, so still done
[21:17] <poolie> i know spiv did some of them
[21:17] <poolie> but the bug's still open?
[21:17] <poolie> anyhow, spiv seems to be progressing on it
[21:17] <poolie> * barry to file bug on debcommit/bzr commit
[21:17] <poolie> i think he did
[21:17] <jam> poolie: the line-item was about the review, not closing the bug....
[21:18] <poolie> right, it doesn't require review now anyhow
[21:18] <poolie> spiv fixed a bunch of related bugs
[21:18] <poolie> * barry to file bug on debcommit/bzr commit
[21:18] <poolie> blah
[21:18] <poolie> * jam to follow up on pristine-tar stuff
[21:18] <jam> poolie: I know barry talked about debcommit, I didn't see a bug on it
[21:18] <jam> poolie: pristine-tar was updated, many packages fixed, a small handful still failing
[21:18] <jam> so done for that level
[21:19] <jam> it is no longer the #1 failure in the importer
[21:19] <poolie> anything more to do?
[21:19] <jam> poolie: we've done what that item was meant to be. I think investigating future failing imports is just regular stuff
[21:20] <poolie> ok
[21:20] <poolie> [topic] LEP https://dev.launchpad.net/LEP/BuildFromBranchIntoPrimary
[21:20] <MootBot> New Topic:  LEP https://dev.launchpad.net/LEP/BuildFromBranchIntoPrimary
[21:20] <poolie> we have a lep proposing our major feature here
[21:20] <poolie> i have some questions from jml to fill it out a bit more
[21:20] <poolie> [action] poolie to integrate jml's feedback into lep
[21:20] <MootBot> ACTION received:  poolie to integrate jml's feedback into lep
[21:20] <poolie> [action] poolie to meet with allison re lep
[21:20] <MootBot> ACTION received:  poolie to meet with allison re lep
[21:21] <poolie> [action] poolie to meet with robbiew re lep
[21:21] <MootBot> ACTION received:  poolie to meet with robbiew re lep
[21:21] <robbiew> huh?
[21:21] <poolie> we need to get it triaged for launchpad if we want a feature squad to work on it
[21:21] <poolie> :) hi
[21:21] <poolie> i have an action to show you https://dev.launchpad.net/LEP/BuildFromBranchIntoPrimary and see what you say :)
[21:21] <robbiew> ah..cool
[21:21] <robbiew> sorry to interrupt ;)
[21:22]  * robbiew goes back into his cave
[21:22] <poolie> np, consider yourself shown
[21:23] <poolie> can we set a time separately to look at it, or could you just mail me feedback?
[21:23] <poolie> ("i don't understand what you're talking about" is ok feedback if that's the case)
[21:24] <poolie> ok
[21:24] <poolie> [topic] Package importer progress
[21:24] <MootBot> New Topic:  Package importer progress
[21:24] <poolie> the big thing here is that we went through the wheezy release, which caused a bunch of disruption
[21:24] <poolie> including bug 715000
[21:25] <poolie> the fix for which should be deployed today
[21:25] <poolie> i think after that we can restart the importer
[21:25] <poolie> in fact, probably we could restart it now, but it might give the importer indigestion
[21:25] <james_w> is that being rolled out to jubany as well?
[21:25] <poolie> the fixed bzr?
[21:26] <jam> james_w: aiui jubany doesn't care
[21:26] <jam> lp does
[21:26] <poolie> it probably should be, but i haven't specifically seen it fail there
[21:26] <jam> package_import.py doesn't trigger that code path that was having problems with double stacking
[21:26] <james_w> yeah, the fixed bzr
[21:26] <poolie> i think it only affects log on a doubly-stacked branch
[21:26] <james_w> ok, if you've verified then I'm happy
[21:26] <poolie> i think we should just wait for it to be in 2.3.1 or 2.4b1 and then roll that out
[21:27] <james_w> it /does/ do some interrogation of branches over hpss though
[21:27] <poolie> ok
[21:27] <jam> james_w: it affects rev_id => dotted_revno code, but I don't think you hit that in importing.
[21:27] <poolie> are we ok to just fix it if it fails?
[21:27] <james_w> see get_unimported_revisions or roundabout
[21:27] <james_w> if that's how you want to do it then I'm fine with that
[21:27] <jam> poolie: I agree, I think if we see package imports failing, it just becomes a high priority to roll out the code on jubany
[21:28] <poolie> i'll add a task
[21:28] <poolie> i think the wheezy addition has caused a bump in the number of failures
[21:28] <poolie> at any rate the graph has gone up
[21:28] <poolie> hopefully once this is all done it will be back down
[21:29] <poolie> i am pleased by the increasing amount of work on the importer
[21:29] <jam> poolie: is there another bug to restack deb branches to sid?
[21:29] <jam> which is also a workaround for this ug
[21:29] <jam> bug
[21:29] <jam> since you don't end up with double-stacking
[21:29] <poolie> also under that heading, i made a plan with charlies and mthaddon that we'll move it to pepo and (if possible) give up login access on the 1st of March
[21:29] <poolie> i think there is
[21:30] <slangasek> wrt the importer... where is that code published?  I don't see any links to the code from http://package-import.ubuntu.com/status/ or https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DistributedDevelopment
[21:30] <jam> slangasek: lp:udd
[21:30] <poolie> good question
[21:30] <slangasek> ah
[21:30] <slangasek> if this could be linked more prominently, perhaps it would help with getting extra-canonical folks involved
[21:30] <poolie> excellent point
[21:30] <poolie> i'll file abug
[21:30] <jam> slangasek: tbh, I doubt it, but I'm happy for it to be more prominently linked
[21:31] <slangasek> jam: maybe it is wishful thinking... there've been a few importer bugs that I would've been keen to at least look at, if I'd been able to find the code more readily :)
[21:31] <poolie> it's true
[21:31] <jam> most of the import code itself is in bzr-builddeb, but sure
[21:32] <poolie> we can say that too
[21:32] <poolie> bug 716123, marked easy
[21:32] <poolie> any other comments on the package importer?
[21:33] <jam> poolie: I'm poking around trying to get feedback for how people want imports to look, especially wrt quilt imports
[21:34] <poolie> true
[21:34] <poolie> thanks for doing that
[21:34] <poolie> it's looking like they really should be imported to looms
[21:34] <jelmer> yeah, I think quilt imports will be important
[21:34] <jam> yeah, but that still leaves us with "and what does that actually mean" :)
[21:34] <jam> also, that wouldn't strictly block a switchover
[21:34] <jam> so i'm not 100% sure what the importance is
[21:35] <jam> The discussion has been very useful for me to start understanding what is actually going on, though.
[21:35] <james_w> (http://paste.ubuntu.com/565180/ is what the importer does over hpss, so I think it should be fine)
[21:35] <jam> james_w: it isn't strictly an hpss thing, any double-stacked branch will fail during log, etc (even purely locally)
[21:35] <jelmer> jam: Yeah :)
[21:35] <poolie> shall we add an action for next time for you to summarize where we got to?
[21:36] <jam> poolie: sure
[21:36] <james_w> jam, right, but we talk over hpss to LP, which has some double stacked branches
[21:36] <jam> sounds like a good action item
[21:36] <poolie> [topic] jam to propose/report plan for quilt imports
[21:36] <MootBot> New Topic:  jam to propose/report plan for quilt imports
[21:36] <poolie> incidentally, i'm going to be on leave 2 weeks from today
[21:36] <poolie> just for a long weekend
[21:36] <james_w> everything else is done locally with no stacking, apart from fetch, which we know is fine
[21:36] <slangasek> s/topic/action/?
[21:36] <poolie> moving on
[21:37] <poolie> you're right
[21:37] <poolie> [action] jam to propose/report plan for quilt imports
[21:37] <MootBot> ACTION received:  jam to propose/report plan for quilt imports
[21:37] <poolie> [topic] hot bug review
[21:37] <MootBot> New Topic:  hot bug review
[21:37] <poolie> should that be 'revue'? :)
[21:37] <poolie> [url] https://devpad.canonical.com/~mbp/kanban/bzr-kanban.html
[21:37] <poolie> that's a bit large to read the whole thing
[21:37] <slangasek> [link] https://devpad.canonical.com/~mbp/kanban/bzr-kanban.html
[21:37] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://devpad.canonical.com/~mbp/kanban/bzr-kanban.html
[21:38] <poolie> but i think it may be a good way to track whether we're working on the right htings
[21:38] <james_w> poolie, I'll start referring to you all as the bzr troupe
[21:38] <poolie> so let's focus on things near the top (critical/high) and in the middle (in progress etc)
[21:38] <jam> poolie: when did we start getting big red ! ?
[21:39] <jam> and what does that actually mean?
[21:39] <poolie> today, apparently
[21:39] <poolie> jamu must have added it
[21:39] <poolie> "in review for more than 3 days"
[21:39] <jelmer> jam: it looks like the time the bug has been in progress
[21:39] <poolie> or in progress for more than 7 days
[21:39] <poolie> i kind of envy landscape if it's a big (!) for something to take more than 7 days
[21:39] <poolie> but perhaps we can get there too if we reduce our wip
[21:39] <slangasek> what's the process for moving from needs testing -> verified? I was all ready to jump on testing bug #706990, I see someone has already followed up to the bug to say it's fixed
[21:40] <poolie> slangasek, there's a key at the bottom
[21:40] <slangasek> aha
[21:40] <poolie> this has been good to work on with jkakar btw
[21:41] <poolie> bug 702024 should be good for making lp rollouts less disruptive
[21:41] <poolie> so, what should we do here?
[21:41] <poolie> are there particular bugs that ought to be on here but aren't?
[21:41] <poolie> should we go back to having the meeting review ~10 top bugs?
[21:42] <poolie> perhaps we should look at the critical bugs?
[21:42] <jam> slangasek: some projects (not bzr) use Fix Committed vs Fix Released, which changes only once there is a full release, not sure that you can release packages, but you could poke the upstreams
[21:42] <poolie> i think we have a few too many bugs altogether in-process at the moment
[21:42] <poolie> but i think if we pay attention it will go down
[21:43] <slangasek> jam: oh, well, I can at least set the tag on the bugs if things prove ok in my own testing :)
[21:43] <poolie> of the bugs mentioned in the previous meeting, all of them are assigned or done, except bug 499684 is assigned to barry
[21:44] <poolie> s//assigned to canonical-bazaar
[21:45] <poolie> ok, moving on
[21:45] <poolie> [topic] any other business?
[21:45] <MootBot> New Topic:  any other business?
[21:45] <jam> poolie: there is a ton of bugs in there on projects that aren't bzr, and thus don't conform to our bug triage standards
[21:45] <jam> I'm not sure how kanban should interpret that
[21:46] <slangasek> poolie: I can share some happy news if you like
[21:46] <jam> note that *everything* in Verified is assigned to jelmer
[21:47] <poolie> yes, i think he started doing things that way after i set this up
[21:47] <poolie> perhaps to see how it works
[21:47] <poolie> i think we can fudge it
[21:47] <poolie> slangasek, please do
[21:47] <slangasek> I wrote up https://wiki.linaro.org/Platform/DevPlatform/ComponentReleasesWithBzr last week with some recipes for using UDD branches within Linaro, and am seeing some good uptake by the team
[21:47] <slangasek> the bad news is that I think I've found every single bug in bzr-git :-)
[21:47] <jelmer> yeah, I'd be happy to see Verified gone.. I was just seeing how things worked
[21:48] <slangasek> so there are now some official UDD branches in Launchpad with some very rich git history attached
[21:49] <poolie> slangasek, wow, that's great, thanks very much
[21:49] <poolie> let's make sure those bugs get escalated and addressed
[21:49] <poolie> jelmer, i wonder if it would be good for you to pair on fixing those bugs with say vila
[21:49] <poolie> to spread the love around
[21:49] <poolie> mm, i don't know -what- time zone you're in though :)
[21:49] <jelmer> poolie: the bzr-git bugs? I'd be happy to
[21:49] <poolie> maybe you overlap more with jam?
[21:50] <jam> poolie: in a month it will be the same :)
[21:50] <jelmer> slangasek: are these all related to pushing into git, or fetching as well?
[21:50] <slangasek> jelmer: fetching
[21:51] <slangasek> jelmer: 706990 is certainly one I ran into; I've also been dancing on the bleeding edge with qemu-linaro, which has submodule references upstream
[21:51] <poolie> slangasek, so if they're blocking your work on this, please make sure they're at least High
[21:51] <jelmer> slangasek: perhaps we should bump the importance of some bugs
[21:51] <poolie> and assigned to someone
[21:52] <poolie> (or if you can't actually triage/assign, just comment asking for it)
[21:52] <slangasek> nothing blocking currently as I've routed around the damage in the recipes - but I'm happy to highlight the bugs for your consideration
[21:52] <poolie> please do
[21:53] <poolie> that page is really nice
[21:53] <slangasek> who should I feed the list to? (I can't bump bug priorities myself)
[21:53] <poolie> you can mail it to ubuntu-distributed-devel or you can comment on the bugs
[21:53] <slangasek> ok
[21:53] <poolie> whichever is easier
[21:54] <poolie> you could forward a link to that page too
[21:54] <slangasek> will do
[21:54] <poolie> any other feedback from people who've used it?
[21:55] <poolie> [action] poolie forward/link to https://wiki.linaro.org/Platform/DevPlatform/ComponentReleasesWithBzr
[21:55] <MootBot> ACTION received:  poolie forward/link to https://wiki.linaro.org/Platform/DevPlatform/ComponentReleasesWithBzr
[21:55] <slangasek> I asked John Rigby to file a bug on bzr-git for his experience of "bzr branch ran for a really long time and then crashed", dunno if he's gotten around to it yet :)
[21:56] <slangasek> otherwise the feedback has been positive
[21:56] <poolie> good
[21:56] <poolie> please do get people to file bugs, especially if they can get a traceback and/or -Dhpss trace
[21:56] <poolie> we don't fix them all right away but we are fixing a lot of them
[21:56] <slangasek> ack
[21:56] <poolie> ok, i think that's it
[21:57] <poolie> happy hacking, everyone
[21:57] <poolie> i'll be on leave from the 23rd and back on the 2nd
[21:57] <poolie> #ends
[21:57] <poolie> #endmeeting
[21:57] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 15:57.
[21:57] <slangasek> thanks, all :)
[22:00] <james_w> thanks


[02:37] <chilts> ibeardslee: figured out you _can_ install marketplace apps (or indeed any apps) within the Firefox v24 browser on Android (using my Nexus 7)
[02:37] <chilts> not sure about earlier versions, perhaps v22 and v23
[02:42] <ibeardslee> ok
[02:42] <ibeardslee> what about on ios? ;)
[02:43] <chilts> probably the same, but whoknows
[02:43] <chilts> I have no iOS devices
[02:43] <chilts> prolly in some docs somewhere though :)
[02:47] <ibeardslee> .. makes more sense to go have a look at the firefox marketplace in firefox rather than chromium
[06:38] <kcj> I, er... Morning.
[20:05] <olly> morning
[20:08] <ibeardslee> morning
[20:14] <snail> morning
[20:43] <mwhudson> heh: https://twitter.com/johnkeypm/status/382968272011816960
[22:00] <chilts> morning


[09:56] <teddy-dbear> Morning peoples, critters and everything else
[11:54] <icey> ahoy
[11:57] <teddy-dbear> o/
[15:58] <rmg51> it's almost time for me to leave to get my throat cut once again :P
[15:58] <rmg51> lucky 13 ;-)
[16:16] <rmg51> time to go
[17:53] <waltman> rmg51: Umm?
[22:24] <rmg51> waltman: vocal cord surgery
[22:24] <rmg51> just got back


[12:29] <dapal> Hello people
[12:29] <dapal> I'd like to remove a language from the "available" translations in my project (wicd)
[12:30] <dapal> I'm using LP also for translations, and I have set it up to import/export the po's from the bzr repo
[12:30] <dapal> _however_, today LP just re-added the .po's to the repo, and I had to "bzr rm" them again
[12:31] <dapal> they're practically unmaintained translations of language variants -- example es_MX, es_CL and so on. Being unmaintained, a Mexican user just sees a few messages in spanish, and the rest in english (while it would be more useful if wicd just used "es.po" there)
[12:32] <dapal> do you have any suggestions?
[12:32] <dapal> (see http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~wicd-devel/wicd/experimental/revision/773 , "files added")
[15:17] <vibhav> Why doesnt show bugs assigned to me?
[15:17] <EvilResistance> vibhav, eh?
[15:18] <vibhav> https://launchpad.net/~vibhavp
[15:18] <vibhav> Shows only 1 bug assigned to me
[15:18] <vibhav> while I have 5 other bugs assigned to me
[15:18] <EvilResistance> did you go "Advanced" and select all statuses?
[15:18] <vibhav> How do I do that/
[15:18] <vibhav> ?
[15:19] <EvilResistance> whoops
[15:19] <EvilResistance> sent via /msg :/
[15:19] <EvilResistance> https://bugs.launchpad.net/~vibhavp/+assignedbugs
[15:19] <EvilResistance> try that link there
[15:19] <EvilResistance> on my end, it shows 35 for you
[18:40] <bobweaver> Hello there today I am working blueprints that I have and would like to ask some question to all people here. Here is a link to the blueprint that I am working on https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zpanelcp/+spec/downloads  I would like too learn about trail and error of others and what you have learned from Registering Downloads. Thanks for your time and hope that you are having a great weekend :)
[19:46] <Cubox> Hi :)
[21:48] <isaacj87> hello all, I noticed my orig.tar.gz for my package on my PPA had a bunch of leftover files in it. I decided to delete the package off my PPA and start fresh. How long will it be before I can upload an updated version of my source orig.tar.gz?
[21:49] <micahg> isaacj87: you can't, you have to bump the version of it (or revert the files in patch in the packaging)
[21:58] <isaacj87> micahg, okay, i'll revert the files via patch; however, i no longer have a way to download the original tarball. I checked here: https://launchpad.net/~ikarosdev/+archive/unity-revamped/+build/3439120
[21:59] <isaacj87> but it doesn't exist
[22:01] <micahg> isaacj87: well, if you deleted it, it'll be deleted, but I think Launchpad remembers the hash to prevent uploading the same version again (maybe someone else knows if it's still available somewhere)


[09:38] <JonathanD> morning
[09:42] <rmg51> morning
[09:54] <JonathanD> Hey rmg51
[09:54] <rmg51> o/
[13:31] <JonathanD> waltman: poke.
[13:31] <waltman> JonathanD: puke
[13:31] <waltman> I've got to leave for the train in a few minutes.
[13:32] <JonathanD> waltman: you have a mac display adapter thingy, right?
[13:32] <waltman> Yes, mini-dvi2vga
[13:32] <JonathanD> I don't know if thats what this is...
[13:32] <JonathanD> I guess it's a 2008 macbook something or other.
[13:33] <JonathanD> screen goes all white. brief research indicates it may be a failed nvidia card.
[13:33] <waltman> The dongle from my old 2004-ish powerbook had a bigger connector on the mac end
[13:33] <waltman> I've got to run.
[13:33] <JonathanD> this is maybe 3/4 the width of USB
[13:33] <JonathanD> ok, catch you later.
[13:36] <InHisName1> mid morning to u all
[13:37] <JonathanD> hi
[13:52] <JonathanD> I think the disk is shot.
[13:52] <JonathanD> click click click click
[13:55] <JonathanD> disk is dead.
[13:55] <JonathanD> boots with a random linux cd in it
[14:39] <waltman> Sorry, I had the names wrong.  The dongle for my old powerbook was mini-dvi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mini-DVI).  The one on my macbook is mini-displayport ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mini_DisplayPort).
[14:39] <JonathanD> waltman: it wasnt that anyway.
[14:39] <JonathanD> It displayed the ubuntu disc well enough.
[14:39] <waltman> Oh well.
[14:39] <JonathanD> It needs a new hdd.
[14:39] <waltman> Sorry to hear about your head hd.
[14:39] <JonathanD> But if I get her one, how exactly do I go about getting OSX on it?
[14:39] <waltman> s/head/dead/
[14:40] <waltman> What is "it"?
[14:40] <JonathanD> macbook 2008, I guess
[14:40] <JonathanD> theres a 2008 in the string of copyright and patent notices.
[14:41] <waltman> OK, so you've got a 2008 macbook with a dead hd, and you want to install a new hd and put OSX on it?
[14:41] <JonathanD> That sounds reasonable to me.
[14:42] <waltman> Be warned that replacing the HD might be extremely tedious, and it might be next to impossible to put it all back together.
[14:42] <JonathanD> I already have the old one out.
[14:42] <waltman> Ah.
[14:42] <JonathanD> it was under hte battery cover.
[14:42] <JonathanD> in fact I already have a new one in.
[14:43] <waltman> You might be able to do a net install of lion.
[14:43] <waltman> Or maybe you could restore the data from time machine?
[14:43] <JonathanD> She would have had to do the time machine stuff before, though, aye?
[14:43] <JonathanD> she says she doesn't have any backups.
[14:43] <waltman> Well, yes.
[14:44] <waltman> Who is "she"?
[14:44] <JonathanD> so unless this thing has a super secret backup location, there is nothing to restore :)
[14:44] <JonathanD> the laptops owner
[14:44] <JonathanD> someone here at work's sister.
[14:44] <waltman> What version of osx was on it?
[14:44] <JonathanD> no idea :)
[14:44] <JonathanD> nobody knows anything.
[14:44] <JonathanD> including what osx actually is.
[14:44] <waltman> I believe at this point you need to find an OSX install DVD.
[14:45] <JonathanD> boss might have one.
[14:45] <JonathanD> what versions will work?
[14:45] <waltman> in 2008 it should be intel, right?
[14:45] <waltman> Lion might work, Snow Leopard almost certainly will.
[14:46] <waltman> if it was lion, there might be a recovery partition hidden somewhere. I don't really know how that works.
[14:47] <waltman> This is getting to be the limit of what I know. You might want to try asking on a mac forum...
[14:47] <JonathanD> waltman: disk looks toast
[14:47] <JonathanD> really toast.
[14:48] <JonathanD> click click click click grrrrrrrrrrrrrrr toast
[14:48] <JonathanD> waltman: I have a snow leapard disk, I shall try that.
[14:48] <waltman> sounds like a plan
[14:49] <waltman> If she paid for lion, she should be able to reinstall that from the app store in snow leopard
[14:49] <waltman> You'll need her AppleID for that.
[14:49] <JonathanD> Tried freezing the disk :P
[14:49] <JonathanD> the clicks are quieter now
[14:50] <waltman> The Snow Leopard disk? I doubt that will help. :)
[14:50] <JonathanD> no, the hdd
[14:50] <JonathanD> It's dead Jim.
[14:51] <Resistance> :O  I KNOW WHERE YOU GOT THAT FROM!
[14:51] <JonathanD> I should hope you do.
[14:51] <Resistance> indeed
[14:51] <Resistance> you forgot a comma though
[14:51] <Resistance> </grammar nazi>?
[14:51] <JonathanD> Resistance: it was lost due to data corruption.
[14:52] <Resistance> :P
[14:52] <Resistance> btw, did i mention yet that i despise ASP.NET?
[14:53] <JonathanD> waltman: I think he was using this snow lepoard disk as a coaster.
[14:53] <JonathanD> or as a target for a very underpowered gun.
[14:53] <JonathanD> hope it works :)
[14:53] <waltman> JonathanD: oh dear
[14:55] <JonathanD> people treat computers so awful
[14:57] <JonathanD> waltman: is that her itunes login info?
[14:57] <JonathanD> Or something completely different.
[14:59] <Resistance> if i had a snow leopard disk, i'd take it out to the firing range, and just shoot the thing :p
[14:59]  * Resistance is strongly against Mac OSes
[14:59] <JonathanD> Resistance: I am not a mac fan either :P
[15:00]  * Resistance pulls out his .45 and begins cleaning it
[15:00] <JonathanD> this is the first time I've tried to fix one.
[15:00] <Resistance> ugh, this thing needs cleaning badly :/
[15:07] <waltman> JonathanD: yes, but it's used for all sorts of things. It's basically your username with apple.
[15:08] <JonathanD> waltman: thanks :)
[15:08] <JonathanD> you've been quite helpful.
[15:08] <JonathanD> Why do they have to make it so hard to force eject a disk...
[15:08] <JonathanD> grrr
[15:15] <waltman> I believe you can use the pin/paperclip technique
[15:15] <JonathanD> where...
[15:15] <JonathanD> theres no hole
[15:15] <JonathanD> apparently holding down the touchpad while turning the laptop on and counting to 11 works.
[15:15] <JonathanD> I'm not sure why I had to take my left shoe off, first
[15:15] <waltman> hah
[15:16] <waltman> Speaking of which, I'm in the process of installing big system updates that hit snow leopard and lion today.
[15:16] <JonathanD> now with a fresh drive, it boots to a white screen with a blinking grey folder with a ? mark inside.
[15:17] <JonathanD> Linux errors are not cryptic. This is cryptic.
[15:17] <waltman> There's a way to view the console, but I forget how you do it. Cmd-something.
[15:17] <JonathanD> This apparently means "No operating system found"
[15:17] <JonathanD> by the way.
[15:17] <Resistance> JonathanD:  now you know why people hate the Mac OSX support :P
[15:17] <JonathanD> Which is fine, it's a blank disk.
[15:17] <Resistance> since their solution is "Bring it in to the store"
[15:17] <Resistance> :P
[15:18] <JonathanD> "No operating system found" is a lot easier to google than "the screen is white, and once a second, a grey folder with a question mark inside flashes"
[15:19] <Resistance> ;p
[15:19] <Resistance> :P *
[15:19] <waltman> I thought you were going to boot off the snow leopard disk
[15:19] <JonathanD> waltman: I'm cleaning it.
[15:19] <JonathanD> with a disc resurfacer...
[15:20] <waltman> That blinking gray folding with the ? is Apple's way of asking how you expect to boot up off a blank disk. :)
[15:20] <JonathanD> waltman: Sure, but why not just say that :P
[15:20] <JonathanD> the whole "users don't need to know about this stuff" irks me.
[15:21] <Resistance> and now you know why i routinely buy Mac OS CDs off of friends after they upgraded, then go directly from there to the gun range :P
[15:24] <waltman> Well, like I said, users *can* see the console during bootup. I just don't remember the keys that bring it up.
[15:27] <waltman> http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1533?viewlocale=en_US&locale=en_US # aha, it was cmd-v
[15:41] <ChinnoDog> bacon
[15:59] <JonathanD> that disc is not usable.
[15:59] <JonathanD> asking around hte office to see if anyone else has one, now :)
[16:10] <InHisName1> I got an ISO but may not be good enough for you.
[18:58] <JonathanD> InHisName1: aren't they rather large?
[18:58] <JonathanD> Multi-gig?
[20:10] <cythes> Any one here have issues with DVD drives not mounting?