[03:51] <bazhang> an unsupported and unstable kernel, with btrfs; what could go wrong!!
 anyone knows what cwo is and in which package it can be found?
[04:37] <Jordan_U> bazhang: Hey, if they want to do it why not? Ubuntu has btrfs as an option in the installer, and btrfs upstream regularly makes it completely clear that you need to keep up with upstream if you want to use btrfs, so if you want to play with btrfs (and accept the consequences thereof) that's what you should do.
[04:37]  * Jordan_U likes playing with btrfs
[05:40] <bazhang> Jordan_U, sure. but thats with a stable kernel. he was using 39-rc8 or something
[05:41] <bazhang> not to mention he built his own btrfs-progs. thats pretty much like using a PPA for glib or such
[05:42] <bazhang> guy in #x yesterday had *53* PPA and wondered why his system was unstable
[05:47] <Jordan_U> bazhang: If you consider using btrfs reasonable at all (and I do, as long as you understand the risks), then IMHO you should consider using the latest rc kernel and btrfs progs from git reasonable for that purpose.
[05:49] <Jordan_U> It does make things a little awkward that we normally wouldn't "support" such things, but at the same time upstream doesn't support Ubuntu's old kernels (though they'd probably support the latest stable kernel, and the btrfs progs shipped in 13.04, they still might ask you to upgrade to newer if you have issues).
[06:55] <bazhang> getting hard to know what is and what is not supported these days; what with the new abbreviated release cycles support, the seeming expansion of reliance on PPA system etc
 can anyone online spare 10 mins?
 Wadie: why did you install lamp stack?
[10:48] <bazhang> <troll detected>
[21:20] <F41L> hiyo
[21:25] <F41L> Anyone around?
[21:35] <IdleOne> F41L: How can I help you?
[21:37] <F41L> You banned me from #ubuntu, I'd thought it might be temporary, but I appear to still be banned. What can I do to get +b removed?
[21:38] <IdleOne> F41L: I'll be in a few, hang tight or someone else will help you if they can.
[21:38] <F41L> ok
[21:46] <Jordan_U> F41L: To start, please read the channel guidelines.
[21:46] <Jordan_U> !guidelines | F41L
[21:48] <F41L> Alright.
[21:49] <BlueProtoman> Somebody in #ubuntu by the name of jailbitcx is trying to harass me for some reason, and I have no idea who he is or what I could have done to offend him.  This is the first time I've been in #ubuntu in weeks.  http://pastebin.com/1tBTKZeP
[21:51] <BlueProtoman> Also, he's apparently bothering at least one other person.
[21:54] <Jordan_U> F41L: Have you finished reading the channel guidelines?
[21:54] <F41L> Yes
[21:55] <Jordan_U> F41L: Do you understand that #ubuntu is only for Ubuntu related support questions, not for Mint support or offtopic comments?
[21:56] <F41L> Yeah
[21:56] <Jordan_U> F41L: And you agree to follow the channel guidelines from here on?
[21:56] <F41L> Yessir.
[21:59] <Jordan_U> F41L: Great. You should now be able to join #ubuntu. Note that if you don't follow the channel guidelines, it won't be as easy to get unbanned in the future.
[21:59] <F41L> For future reference, permanent ban for first offense is something you guys do?
[22:00] <Jordan_U> F41L: We don't remove bans without discussion with the person that was banned.
[22:00] <Jordan_U> Your ban wasn't permanent, as evidenced by it now having been removed :)
[22:01] <F41L> :P
[22:01] <F41L> I gotcha
[22:20] <Myrtti> F41L: did you need anything else?
[22:20] <F41L> No, thanks
[22:21] <Myrtti> rotating door
[22:21] <Jordan_U> madmix: Hi, how can we help you?
[22:23] <madmix> Why u start
[22:25] <madmix> Whats your problem
[22:25] <IdleOne> madmix: How can I help you?
[22:26] <madmix> Jordan_U: ban me foe no reason
[22:26] <IdleOne> There is always a reason but can you tell me what happened?
[22:27] <madmix> Not sure i wound up here was talkinng then banned
[22:28] <IdleOne> what nick were you using when this happened?
[22:28] <madmix> This one
[22:29] <madmix> Jordan_U: why
[22:29] <IdleOne> I don't believe that to be true
[22:30] <IdleOne> This will be a lot quicker if you just tell me the truth
[22:30] <LjL-Alps> such unreasonable expectations :(
[22:31] <IdleOne> indeed
[22:33] <Unit193> tophalf01: Howdy, need something?
[22:35] <IdleOne> tophalf01: If you don't need anything from the ubuntu ops.  Thats who i am
[22:43] <Myrtti> oh
[22:43] <madmix> Linus
[22:44] <madmix> Now un ban me or i will release the fleas of 1000 camels into your armpits
[22:45] <Myrtti> hej Linys, hur går det? hur mår du och Tove? Jag läste om ditt sök av Suunto människor, finn du dom?
[22:45] <Myrtti> Linus även
[22:45] <madmix> Linus had to manu barvarian beers today
[22:46] <madmix> Finnland
[22:46] <Myrtti> du skojar nu! :-P
[22:47] <madmix> Yes been their done that.
[22:48] <LjL-Alps> Myrtti: han har varit där och gjort det
[22:48] <madmix> Now un ban me. Its proven
[22:48] <Myrtti> LjL-Alps: mmmh visst
[22:49] <Myrtti> madmix: no.
[22:50] <madmix> I will mail you my broken beer botles
[22:51] <Myrtti> ok?
[22:51] <madmix> You can get money for botles
[22:52] <madmix> Ubuntu is easiest linux out there
[22:52] <madmix> But
[22:54] <madmix> You people are sweet as sandpaper
[22:56]  * LjL-Alps licks some sandpaper
[22:56] <Myrtti> puss och kram för dig också ♥
[23:34] <Flannel> Depending on the adhesive used, sandpaper might be rather tasty.  Texture is lacking, but taste might be good.
[23:56] <Jordan_U> "< ubottu> Plymouth manages the Ubuntu boot process (before the root filesystem is mounted)", that's news to me...


[08:00] <cpaelzer> moin s390x builders seem to be stuck https://launchpad.net/builders
[08:00] <cpaelzer> at least for the last 5 min 3 disabled all others cleaning
[08:00] <cpaelzer> I'll check in a bit if things recover via he script of cjwatson (not sure if that is active for s390x as well)
[08:01] <cpaelzer> but as heads the message above ...
[08:22] <cpaelzer> 20 minutes later and s390x builders are all still stuck the same way
[08:23] <cpaelzer> mabye everyone is travelling right now?
[08:25] <cpaelzer> I tihnk I'll ask in #is to reach someone to be aware of
[08:32] <cjwatson> 20 minutes> sigh, patience!
[08:36] <cjwatson> recovering now
[08:37] <jfh> tha
[08:40] <cpaelzer> thanks a lot cjwatson
[08:41] <cpaelzer> As explained in #is already, I only reached out further as I was unsure if you would be travelling
[08:41] <cpaelzer> as I mentioned a while ago, I feel bad anyway for showing up with these "stuck builders" so often :-/
[08:42] <cjwatson> Yeah, it is mostly just me this week though, so support outside UK working hours may be a bit thin on the ground
[08:42] <cjwatson> And I'm bad at mornings so usually only manage to crawl in at 9:30 :)
[08:43] <cjwatson> (well, just me in terms of people with the right kind of semi-admin access anyway)
[13:26] <dalist22> Hello guys
[13:26] <dalist22> so I had a question
[13:26] <dalist22> is launchpad able to build with python 3 ?because I got this error from build logdh clean --with python3dh: unable to load addon python3: Can't locate Debian/Debhelper/Sequence/python3.pm in @INC (you may need to install the Debian::Debhelper::Sequence::python3 module)
[13:28] <Odd_Bloke> dalist22: Yes, it is.
[13:28] <dalist22> why am I getting this ?
[13:28] <dalist22> dh clean --with python3dh: unable to load addon python3: Can't locate Debian/Debhelper/Sequence/python3.pm in @INC (you may need to install the Debian::Debhelper::Sequence::python3 module) (@INC contains: /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/perl/5.28.1 /usr/local/share/perl/5.28.1 /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/perl5/5.28 /usr/share/perl5 /usr/lib
[13:28] <dalist22> /x86_64-linux-gnu/perl/5.28 /usr/share/perl/5.28 /usr/local/lib/site_perl /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/perl-base) at (eval 11) line 1.BEGIN failed--compilation aborted at (eval 11) line 1.
[13:29] <Odd_Bloke> That is presumably an issue with the packaging of whatever you are trying to build.
[13:34] <dalist22> where do you think the error consists in ?
[13:34] <dalist22> debian/rules ?
[13:35] <dalist22> #!/usr/bin/make -f%:	dh $@ --with python3
[13:35] <dalist22> this is my rules file
[13:37] <Odd_Bloke> dalist22: If I had to guess, you aren't depending on dh-python correctly.
[13:38] <Odd_Bloke> dalist22: But this isn't really a LP issue, so you probably want to find a different channel to get assistance with packaging. :)
[14:47] <cjwatson> Indeed, that's a missing Build-Depends: dh-python in debian/control


[00:04] <shayonj> need some help with DEB_INSTALL_MANPAGES anyone here ? :)
[00:38] <lajjr> shayonj,  maybe I can help you?!?
[01:24] <shayonj> lajjr, i am currently building it again. will let you know soon.
[01:25] <shayonj> oops
[02:45] <shayonj> i am currently creating a package. my devel machine is lucid , should i also process it for 11.10 ?
[02:45] <shayonj> or can i ?
[02:52] <jbicha> shayonj: you ought to test if it builds on oneiric, but the oneiric archives will be closing soon
[02:53] <jbicha> shayonj: have you set up a pbuilder/sbuilder or similar yet?
[02:53] <shayonj> jbicha, yep i have building environment setup (pbuilder)
[02:53] <shayonj> can i have oneric on it ?
[02:53] <jbicha> shayonj: make a pbuilder for oneric then
[02:53] <shayonj> jbicha, okay
[02:54] <shayonj> and jbicha why am i getting Checksum doesn't match for i386 ? i am running a amd64 machine...i get this message when i upload to ppa
[02:57] <shayonj> or does any one else know ? :)
[03:06] <shayonj> how can i get a .deb package built?
[03:14] <shayonj> for some reason i cant get .deb package...when using debuild -S (source). any help ?
[03:15] <RAOF> You'll only get a source package when using debuild -S.  Because you're asking for only source packages, that's what -S means.  .debs are binary packages.
[03:16] <shayonj> right..but dont we have to submit . deb to revu
[03:16] <ajmitch> no
[03:16] <ajmitch> only source packages to either REVU or to launchpad PPAs
[03:16] <shayonj> ajmitch, thanks so much.. man
[03:47] <shayonj> revu is only accepting packages for oneric, so does anyone know when can i upload for lucid ?
[03:55] <RAOF> You cannot upload for lucid.  It's been released; no new packages are accepted.
[03:55] <shayonj> RAOF, oh i see. is there a way i can delete the upload then ? i cant find any :P
[03:55] <shayonj> any way to delete or revert it back
[03:55] <RAOF> And, for that matter, oneiric is frozen, so Precise Pangolin is when the next set of new packages will be accepted.
[03:55]  * ajmitch should change revu to accept 'precise' as wel
[03:56] <RAOF> You can just upload again; they'll overwrite.
[03:56] <shayonj> okay so which one should i build for oneric or pangolin ? sorry i am getting confused
[03:57] <shayonj> as in which ones are still accepting
[03:57] <shayonj> ?
[03:57] <shayonj> none?
[03:59] <ajmitch> oneiric is closed for new uploads, precise will be open in a couple of weeks, but you can still upload packages to REVU
[04:00] <ajmitch> it's preferred to get new packages in via Debian, to get a wider audience & to help more people
[04:00] <shayonj> ajmitch, i see. well thanks again ajmitch :)
[04:18] <shayonj> i get this on revu - This package could not be extracted; there's no browsable directory for it on REVU. .. whats that suppose to mean ?
[04:24] <shayonj> Annoucement : My first package upload to revu. http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=9283 . Any suggestions/comments will be appreciated.
[04:25] <shayonj> Announcement : My first package upload to revu. http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=9283 . Any suggestions/comments will be appreciated.
[07:03] <ajmitch> dholbach: morning!
[07:03] <dholbach> good morning
[07:03] <dholbach> hey ajmitch
[14:09] <ikonia> part
[14:09] <ikonia> pp[s
[14:09] <ikonia> oops


[08:01] <frankban> morning rogpeppe1
[08:01] <rogpeppe1> frankban: hiya
[08:02] <frankban> rogpeppe1: here is the new plan: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5594917/
[08:02]  * rogpeppe1 looks
[08:04] <rogpeppe1> frankban: hmm, nice idea, but i'm not sure it's guaranteed to work
[08:05] <rogpeppe1> frankban: what if the ServiceInfo delta was correct (and different to the value that the user has selected), and there's no subsequent delta?
[08:06] <rogpeppe1> frankban: ISTM that in that case you could show the wrong value for an arbitrary length of time
[08:07] <rogpeppe1> frankban: i *think* that you'd be best off just living with the slowly updating unit count for now and listing it as a bug to be fixed in juju-core
[08:13] <frankban> rogpeppe1: AFAICT, after the fact, the first delta can be 1) the one generated by the user changing the total count or 2) a previous one, no longer valid.
[08:14] <rogpeppe1> frankban: what if another user is changing the total count?
[08:16] <frankban> rogpeppe1: I suppose a race is still possible, but we narrow the window, and, anyway, it only affects that user form (for the more important parts of the GUI we still use the unitInfo delta).
[08:18] <rogpeppe1> frankban: there's another possibility too: the delta generated by the user changing the total count might arrive *before* the reply to the AddServiceUnits call
[08:20] <frankban> rogpeppe1: we can start ignoring the first delta right after the call to AddServiceUnits
[08:22] <frankban> rogpeppe1: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5594974/
[08:23] <frankban> rogpeppe1: I see the wrong state in the line 13-14 window, but I think that's acceptable from a UX perspective
[08:25]  * rogpeppe1 is thinking
[08:52] <rogpeppe1> frankban: there are other problems too
[08:53] <rogpeppe1> frankban: for example, if there are 5 units, and two clients both type "20", both clients will add 15 units, and there will eventually be 35 units, even though neither wanted that
[08:54] <rogpeppe1> frankban: i still think that the best thing to do is not to write partially-correct client code to try and paper over the problem
[08:54] <rogpeppe1> frankban: but to actually fix the underlying problem
[08:55] <rogpeppe1> frankban: or... for the time being, change the user interface to add an explicit "add units" dialog, so we don't try to pretend to the user that they're setting the total number of units
[08:55] <rogpeppe1> s/or.../and, perhaps, /
[08:58] <frankban> rogpeppe1: that's an UX change, and I don't know if it's doable, I have to ask. Re the problem you are describing, we already have that problem, and we are trying to solve another one (having the form updated with units as they arrives generates confusion and can lead the user to re-type the number he wants in the form.
[08:58] <frankban> rogpeppe1: and that story ends up with a lot more units to be created
[09:09] <rogpeppe1> frankban: here's a simpler solution, i think: don't update the displayed unit count while the call is in progress; start displaying the current unit count (from the deltas) immediately afterwards
[09:10] <rogpeppe1> frankban: no need for any changes to the current API, i think, if you do that
[09:10] <rogpeppe1> frankban: it doesn't work well with concurrent clients, but i think that's inherent to the current setup, and will be fixed when we fix juju-core in this respect
[09:12] <frankban> rogpeppe1: but when you restart displaying the unit count, that can be wrong, e.g. you have 5 units and asked for 100. you display 100 till you have a response and then you switch to the number in the delta. at this point you could have 50 units, then 60, etc... we want to avoid precisely that behavior
[09:13] <rogpeppe1> frankban: i think the unit count at that point will only be wrong for a maximum duration of the poll interval
[09:15] <frankban> rogpeppe1: so, do you think that right after the response to add/remove units arrives, the next delta is always correct?
[09:15] <rogpeppe1> frankban: the deltas are always correct :-)
[09:15] <rogpeppe1> frankban: for some value of correct...
[09:16] <frankban> rogpeppe1: :-) I mean, when addUnits returns we can be reasonably sure that the delta already sent all the added/removed units events?
[09:17] <rogpeppe1> frankban: ah, i have another idea
[09:18] <rogpeppe1> frankban: the deltas are returned in response to a Next API call, right?
[09:18] <frankban> yes
[09:20] <rogpeppe1> frankban: so, while you're waiting for the result of the AddServiceUnits call, you don't call Next; when the AddServiceUnits call returns, you call Next immediately.
[09:20] <rogpeppe1> hmm, that's wrong too, both it
[09:20] <rogpeppe1> bother it
[09:21] <rogpeppe1> ah, no, i think it might make sense
[09:22] <rogpeppe1> nope
[09:22] <frankban> that's, more or less, the same as not updating the count in the form while waiting for the addUnits response.
[09:22] <rogpeppe1> frankban: yeah
[09:22] <rogpeppe1> frankban: ok, another idea :-)
[09:23] <frankban> and that idea (the old) is better IMHO: more easier to implement, and it does not prevent the rest of the GUI to react to deltas and update itself
[09:23] <rogpeppe1> frankban: only start updating the form from the deltas from 5 seconds after the AddServiceUnits call has returned
[09:25] <rogpeppe1> frankban: thus we reduce the window where the user might see an incorrect count, but we run no risk of showing an incorrect value indefinitely
[09:25] <frankban> rogpeppe1: sounds good, that way we ensure the GUI db already has the correct number of units, correct? because the mongodb is watched every 5 seconds
[09:26] <rogpeppe1> frankban: yup. maybe make it 6 seconds to account for network delay etc
[09:26] <rogpeppe1> frankban: and a big TODO to remove this hack when juju-core is changed to fix the issue
[09:31] <frankban> rogpeppe1: so, this could be the new story: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5595088/ with no changes to juju-core, right?
[09:34] <rogpeppe1> frankban: that seems good. you'll need to make sure that the number of units to add or remove is calculated with respect to the currently displayed value, not the value from the deltas
[09:34] <frankban> rogpeppe1: yes
[09:38] <frankban> rogpeppe1: I still think it could be valuable to return unitCount from ServiceGet, so that we can update that number when the user visits the service detail view. I am thinking about the user refreshing that view: we lose the state (and the 6sec sleep), we wrongly display the value from the delta.
[09:40] <rogpeppe1> frankban: if the user refreshes the view, the websocket connection is made again and everything is fetched again, right?
[09:41] <frankban> yes
[09:43] <frankban> rogpeppe1: the user adds 100 units and then refresh: the form is updated from deltas, and deltas didn't already send all the new units
[09:43] <rogpeppe1> frankban: the first delta that arrives will have all the units in
[09:44] <frankban> rogpeppe1: really? so if you add 1000 units they are all send in the same delta?
[09:45] <rogpeppe1> frankban: yup, that is true currently.
[09:45] <rogpeppe1> frankban: in the future, we may split the responses, but i think we'll always provide an indication that there's more to come.
[09:46] <rogpeppe1> frankban: otherwise you can't know when you've seen the whole environment.
[09:46] <frankban> rogpeppe1: but that delta can arrive after 6 seconds, right? so, if the user refreshes we could display the wrong value for that amount of time
[09:47] <rogpeppe1> frankban: no, that delta will arrive immediately
[09:47] <rogpeppe1> frankban: the first delta is always sent immediately
[09:48] <frankban> rogpeppe1: so, if the user does not refresh, there can be a 5 seconds delay, otherwise the delta is sent immediately.
[09:48] <rogpeppe1> frankban: yes
[09:52] <frankban> rogpeppe1: so, is this correct? http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5595128/
[09:53] <rogpeppe1> frankban: yup, looks good
[09:53] <frankban> rogpeppe1: cool, thanks a lot
[12:14] <gary_poster> hey rick_h_ you feeling better?
[12:14] <rick_h_> gary_poster: yea, thanks
[12:15] <rick_h_> gary_poster: tried to check in yesterday. wonder if we can setup some time to chat about the url/itegration bits sometime soon.
[12:15] <gary_poster> cool rick_h_, glad.  benji got the add button integration in.  he had it in landing but I just moved it to done because it worked for me, at least for a trivial experiment.  Is it good for you?
[12:16] <rick_h_> gary_poster: haven't looked yet, giong through huw's stuff from last night. I'll check it out. Thanks for getting that going.
[12:16] <benji> Telecommute awsomeness 23: Can't catch coworker crud. ;P
[12:16] <rick_h_> yea, no kidding
[12:16] <gary_poster> benji :-)
[12:16] <gary_poster> cool rick_h_
[12:16] <rick_h_> having kid/dr wife suckiness #1 - they're constantly trying to kill you
[12:16] <benji> gary_poster: when you have a chance I'd like to discuss the charm build-speeding task I'm on
[12:17] <rick_h_> and of course I work from home so I don't expose to all that stuff
[12:17] <gary_poster> rick_h_, time to chat: sounds good.  let me re-review the current UX bugs and then we can talk any time.  I'll ping when I think I have a good overview
[12:17] <gary_poster> benji, cool.  now, or in 30/45 min?
[12:17] <rick_h_> gary_poster: benji add buttons seems cool. Thanks again. First integration point check!
[12:17] <benji> gary_poster: now would be best for me, if you have the time
[12:17] <gary_poster> yay rick_h_ :-)
[12:18] <gary_poster> ok benji, to guichat we go
[12:18] <benji> k
[12:51] <frankban> gary_poster: morning, Roger and I ended up with this solution: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5595128/ Could you please take a look?
[12:52] <gary_poster> frankban, yeah I saw the conversation and that pastebin.  I was a bit concerned about it but was going to let it go and check in with you later.  I'm on a call now.  ping you later?
[12:52] <frankban> gary_poster: sure
[12:52] <gary_poster> thx
[13:16] <bac> gary_poster: i propose that i fix bug 1170468 by keying off the default value to determine whether to render a simple input field or a textarea.  i'm going to get styling help from the design guys.  follow on work will provide the expansion control you want.  The work needs to be duplicated on the service settings page, too.  are you ok with this incremental approach?
[13:16] <_mup_> Bug #1170468: Allow multi-line text input for charm configuration in the GUI <juju-gui:In Progress by bac> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1170468>
[13:16] <bac> \o/ mup, welcome back
[13:16] <gary_poster> :-)
[13:17] <gary_poster> bac, yes, as long as you discuss the expansion control with design guys now too to make sure they are on board with the expected end story
[13:17] <bac> yeppers.  writing email now.  that's what prompted this running up the flag pole
[13:17] <gary_poster> cool thanks bac
[13:53] <hatch> gary_poster: thanks for the review - sorry that prefetch_service code is just old prototype code left in for the units, that will be going away in favour of the promise stuff
[13:53] <gary_poster> oh cool hatch great
[13:53] <bac> hi jovan2 and luca____ -- just sent you an email.  would love to discuss when you have time.
[13:54] <rick_h_> hatch: you in? got a quick question for you. My medicated brain is confused
[13:54] <luca____> bac: Hi Brad, we'll read it through and get back to you asap.
[13:54] <jovan2> tiheum ping
[13:54] <bac> thanks luca____
[13:58] <hatch> rick_h yup back, just went and spent a few minutes outside - so nice out, frost, -6 sunny,,,,ahhhh
[13:59] <rick_h_> woot!
[13:59] <rick_h_> hatch: guichat for a sec? should be fast but easier to say than write
[13:59] <hatch> sure
[13:59] <rick_h_> oops, nvm. Diff one
[13:59] <rick_h_> looks like it's occupied
[14:00] <hatch> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/e7b58b173b15be49a7f0bc948e75d2521b03e375?authuser=0&hl=en
[14:00] <rick_h_> hatch: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/29e068e60e2b16c671698550d1e55971a6091ae3?authuser=0&hl=en
[14:00] <hatch> lol
[14:00] <hatch> ok joining yours
[14:10] <hatch> I figure you pythonites would enjoy this http://www.skulpt.org/
[14:11] <rick_h_> pythonistas :P
[14:11] <rick_h_> and no, use the right tool for the job. If you want to do client side then use JS. But I'm a pythonista that can write a few lines of JS when required :)
[14:21] <hatch> gary_poster: did you have a few moments to chat about the promises stuff?
[14:25] <gary_poster> hatch soon
[14:25] <gary_poster> frankban, guichat?
[14:25] <hatch> np, lemme know
[14:25] <gary_poster> thanks will do
[14:25] <frankban> gary_poster: joining
[14:25] <gary_poster> thx
[14:42] <gary_poster> rick_h_, you available for guichat?
[14:42] <rick_h_> gary_poster: sure thing
[14:42] <gary_poster> cool
[14:43] <rick_h_> umm, if my browser will let me
[14:56] <teknico> bcsaller, I'd like a quick hangout when you're around
[14:57] <frankban> rogpeppe3: do we already have a bug for the SetServiceUnits functionality? If not, do you want me to file one, so that we can track its progress?
[14:57] <rogpeppe3> frankban: i think there probably is one; let me check
[15:01] <bac> jovan2: bigger screenshot sent.  sorry about that.
[15:02] <rogpeppe3> frankban: i can't find one actually
[15:02] <jovan2> bac: thanks!
[15:02] <rogpeppe3> frankban: could you file one please. and please describe your particular scenario too in the report.
[15:02] <frankban> rogpeppe3: sure
[15:11] <frankban> rogpeppe3: filed bug 1171899
[15:11] <_mup_> Bug #1171899: Allow for setting a specific number of units (as opposed to add or remove them) <juju-core:New> <juju-gui:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1171899>
[15:12] <rogpeppe3> frankban: thanks!
[15:12] <hatch> oh hey mup, welcome back
[15:12] <frankban> mup is back, you only love him when he's not around
[15:13] <hatch> yeah - I wonder if he has any new tricks or if he is a one trick pony
[15:15] <bcsaller>  teknico: whats up?
[15:16] <teknico> bcsaller, I'm working on #1171508 and I'd like your opinion
[15:16] <_mup_> Bug #1171508: install-error when deploying charm <juju-gui:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1171508>
[15:16] <bcsaller> teknico: I have that fixed in a branch I'm about to propose
[15:16] <bcsaller> config_get needs --format json
[15:17] <bcsaller> and then parse using json.loads
[15:17] <teknico> bcsaller, right
[15:17] <teknico> exacgtly
[15:17] <teknico> bcsaller, why are we working on the same thing?
[15:18] <bcsaller> teknico: I ran into it testing the apache support in the charm just just hit it as a fly by
[15:18] <bcsaller> didn't know there was a bug for it
[15:19] <teknico> bcsaller, ok, while we're at it, did you also happen to fix #1171512?
[15:19] <_mup_> Bug #1171512: Failure in charm unit test <juju-gui:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1171512>
[15:20] <bcsaller> teknico: I had all the tests passing last night, I'll try to confirm they work with the revs since then, one sec
[15:20] <bcsaller> teknico: Ran 43 tests in 1.587s, seems good
[15:21] <teknico> bcsaller, great. how about #1171516?
[15:21] <_mup_> Bug #1171516: Charm needs more backend tests <juju-gui:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1171516>
[15:22] <bcsaller> teknico: I changed some of the existing tests, but haven't added more to the backend suite
[15:22] <teknico> bcsaller, ok, so I guess that one's still standing
[15:25] <bcsaller> teknico: the existing tests have been updated to work properly like I said. I also changed one of the mechanisms in test utils to be more flexible, I can push what I have now if you want to look at it
[15:26] <teknico> bcsaller, yes, please. I'll also review your branch once you propose it
[15:26] <bcsaller> teknico: awesome
[15:28] <bcsaller> teknico: lp:~bcsaller/charms/precise/juju-gui/apache-version/
[15:28] <teknico> bcsaller, getting it
[15:41] <bcsaller> teknico: https://codereview.appspot.com/8640044
[15:42] <teknico> bcsaller, the related card (no rietveld link in it though) seems to be back  in the Code lane
[15:43] <bcsaller> I did paste the link in the desc (which I see) and moved it (but it seems to have moved back)
[15:43] <teknico> weird
[15:46] <teknico> bcsaller, you want to put that link in the "Add external link" -> "URL" field, rather than in the description (I've done it already)
[15:46] <bcsaller> teknico: ahh, thanks
[15:51] <bac> gary_poster: i've got the first branch done.  the textarea looks a little funny wrt inner scrollbar and rounded corners.  i'd like to put it up for a code review now and do styling when the design guys can give me feedback.
[15:55] <gary_poster> bac ok, UX feedback during review?
[15:55] <bac> gary_poster: yeah
[15:55] <gary_poster> jujugui kanban update pls
[15:55] <gary_poster> bac cool
[15:55] <gary_poster> hatch didn't forget about you :-) talk after daily call?
[15:56] <hatch> who are you again?
[15:56] <hatch> :P
[15:56] <hatch> haha yeah sure np
[15:57] <gary_poster> :-)
[15:59] <rick_h_> hatch: https://codereview.appspot.com/8920043/ if you get some spare time :)
[16:01] <hatch> viewing
[16:02] <gary_poster> bcsaller, ping
[16:17] <hatch> rick will do the review now
[16:17] <rick_h_> hatch: thanks, I see ther's a small conflict in there I'm lokoing at. but just assume I can get my }, in the right place :)
[16:18] <rick_h_> hatch: oh, nvm. Doesn't show in reitveld, just LP it looks like
[16:39] <bac> benji: i found my problem that killed the beautifier
[16:39] <benji> what was it?
[16:40] <bac> if you use a bare "default:" (or any other keyword i suspect) as a key without quoting it, the beautifier crashes
[16:40] <bac> var x = {default: 'something'};
[16:40] <bac> the linter finds it but the beautifier crashes
[16:41] <teknico> when there's only the juju-gui service, maybe we should disable the "Build Relation" menu entry :-)
[16:41] <Makyo> Heading home, back in a few.
[16:42] <gary_poster> hatch ole buddy ole pal!
[16:42] <gary_poster> guichat?
[16:42] <hatch> sure thing
[17:39] <hazmat> gary_poster, is there a gui staging instance running against go?
[17:40] <gary_poster> no hazmat
[17:41] <hazmat> gary_poster, k, i'm trying out the api from python, and doing some of the same things that the gui is doing, but getting errors, wasn't sure if perhaps something bitrotted.
[17:41] <hazmat> this is just on EnvironmentInfo post login. result. u'Error': u'unexpected end of JSON input'
[17:42] <gary_poster> hazmat, was working last night, and was going to send announcement today.  Possibly bug 1160971
[17:42] <gary_poster> ?
[17:42] <_mup_> Bug #1160971: WebSocket disconnects when an invalid request is sent <juju-core:New> <juju-gui:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1160971>
[17:42] <gary_poster> hazmat, I mean, GUI plus Go was working last night
[17:42] <hazmat> gary_poster, cool, it could very well be my client lib doing something silly
[17:44] <hazmat> rogpeppe, around?
[17:47] <hazmat> oh.. nevermind.. empty Params struct is required
[18:44] <bac> anyone have time for a second review of https://codereview.appspot.com/8922043 ?
[18:49] <bcsaller> bac: I can look it over
[18:49] <bac> thanks bcsaller
[19:07] <rick_h_> hatch: jcsackett sinzui any of you guys up for reviews take 2 please? https://codereview.appspot.com/8923044
[19:07] <bcsaller> oh good, the CI is working on the new charm now
[19:07] <gary_poster> yay!
[19:07] <sinzui> rick_h_, I can
[19:09] <gary_poster> great job bcsaller.  Did you verify that internal links still work--apache will serve up the index.html if you go to /some/url/that/has/no/associated/file ?
[19:09] <gary_poster> I was going to check that
[19:09] <rick_h_> in a world all alone among the grey masses...is the juju gui http://uploads.mitechie.com/lp/jujugui_svg.png
[19:09] <rick_h_> bah, sorry, bet that ping'd everyone :(
[19:09]  * rick_h_ thinks about filenames better
[19:09] <gary_poster> yay!  orange!
[19:09] <bcsaller> gary_poster: I think at this time, no :( I think a 404 handler might do it though
[19:10] <benji> I've already written a 45 page guide to project-wide IRC pings that will be followed on the next project.
[19:10] <gary_poster> bcsaller, yeah, that would work.  I think the nginx thing did that--looking how...
[19:10] <rick_h_> benji: but does it have a simple to use checklist I can use to verify "should I sent this message to irc"?
[19:10] <gary_poster> rick_h_, when do we get to see the icon at http://uistage.jujucharms.com:8080/bws/sidebar/~juju-gui/precise/juju-gui-43/ ?
[19:11] <benji> rick_h_: that's coming in Volume II
[19:11] <rick_h_> gary_poster: when this branch I've put up for review lands
[19:11] <bac> cool rick_h_.  we should stand out like a beautiful orange flower growing in the asphalt
[19:11] <rick_h_> gary_poster: that's from my dev instance where I had to fix a bug
[19:11] <gary_poster> yay rick_h_ :-)
[19:11] <rick_h_> gary_poster: so the faster it's reviewed the faster you get it *hint hint* lol
[19:11] <gary_poster> lol
[19:12] <gary_poster> bcsaller, nginx just did it with a url rewrite (lines 31-33 of https://codereview.appspot.com/8640044/diff/1/config/nginx-site.template?context=10&column_width=80 ).  Probably a better approach, that could be duped in apache
[19:13] <bcsaller> gary_poster: I initially had mod_rewrite configured in, might have to add it back in then
[19:13] <gary_poster> yeah
[19:13] <bcsaller> gary_poster: however all the CI test pass w/o it, do we really need it?
[19:13] <gary_poster> bcsaller, yeah.  without it you can't pass urls to other people
[19:14] <gary_poster> bcsaller, we should add a test
[19:14] <bcsaller> fair enough
[19:14] <gary_poster> bcsaller, which you don't have to write for this fix :-)
[19:14] <gary_poster> a bug/card would be sufficient
[19:16] <benji> gary_poster: I have lots of interesting data to discuss when you get a minute
[19:17] <gary_poster> cool benji, will ping soon
[19:17] <benji> k
[19:19] <hatch> someone ding me? Sorry irc client screwed up
[19:19] <rick_h_> hatch: did here, https://codereview.appspot.com/8923044
[19:19] <hatch> alright will do
[19:20] <bac> bcsaller: regarding your comment about px vs em, i think you've got a good point but since i was just moving an existing value to another place i would like to keep it at 15px.  doesn't make sense to tackle it in just this one place IMO.
[19:20] <rick_h_> hatch: appreciate it. Nice to end the day on a landing
[19:20] <bcsaller> bac: yeah, I meant it to sound like I was fine with that happening another time
[19:20] <bac> cool
[19:21] <hatch> rick_h_: I hope you don't expect me to review that json doc :P
[19:21] <rick_h_> hatch: no, I'm expecting you to ignore it and carry on :)
[19:21] <hatch> haha
[19:21] <hatch> what does the svg+xml do?
[19:21] <hatch> never seen that before
[19:22] <rick_h_> hatch: fix the svg. It won't right right without it.
[19:22] <hatch> interesting
[19:22] <rick_h_> hatch: since we've not had any charms with icons until just recently didnt' realize it
[19:22] <hatch> I always thought it was just image/svg
[19:22] <rick_h_> hatch: you/me both :/
[19:22] <hatch> haha
[19:22] <rick_h_> hatch: but +xml makes it all worky worky
[19:26] <gary_poster> benji guichat?
[19:26] <benji> gary_poster: sure
[19:27] <hatch> rick_h_: done
[19:28] <rick_h_> hatch: ty sir
[19:36] <hatch> no problem
[19:53]  * hatch is attempting to use sublime only by keystrokes
[20:01] <gary_poster> Our charm's quality is 0/38!
[20:01]  * gary_poster is crushed
[20:02] <rick_h_> hah, need to get reviewed
[20:02] <gary_poster> :-)
[20:02] <rick_h_> http://uistage.jujucharms.com:8080/bws/sidebar/~juju-gui/precise/juju-gui-43/ icon is up
[20:02] <rick_h_> http://uistage.jujucharms.com:8080/bws/fullscreen/~juju-gui/precise/juju-gui-43/ as well :)
[20:02] <rick_h_> ok, 4 bugs is a good day. Time to run while I'm ahead.
[20:03] <gary_poster> cool, ttyl rick_h_
[20:08] <hatch> I wonder if I can dual boot this mac mini into 13.04
[20:08] <hatch> switching from osx to ubuntu is driving my finger memory nuts hah
[20:20] <bcsaller> gary_poster: turned out there was a 'new' apache directive for the 404ish thing, much simpler than it used to be.  http://httpd.apache.org/docs/2.2/mod/mod_dir.html#fallbackresource if curious
[20:39] <hatch> gary_poster: you still around?
[20:41] <benji> gary_poster: http://jujugui.wordpress.com/2013/04/23/ive-been-investigating-the-speed-of-various-things/
[20:43] <hatch> nice finds benji
[20:43] <benji> the S3 speed variability surprised me
[20:44] <hazmat> s3 is known to be variable..  cloudfront is better for this use case (s3 origin). i'd also check out google storage  as a low latency object store, boto works with it
[20:46] <benji> yeah, I figured cloudfront would smooth it out quite a bit
[20:49] <hatch> taking lunch
[20:58] <gary_poster> hatch around
[20:59] <gary_poster> bcsaller, FallbackResource: awesome
[20:59] <bcsaller> yeah, and it all still passes CI
[21:00] <gary_poster> benji, nice blog, thanks
[21:00] <gary_poster> bcsaller, heh, awesome
[21:07] <bcsaller> http://uistage.jujucharms.com:8080/bws/fullscreen/~juju-gui/precise/juju-gui-44/ picks up the icon now, sweet
[21:13] <gary_poster> Hey Makyo, if this is a quick fix, I made a card for the fact that the scroll wheel behavior is broken in Firefox (try going to http://uistage.jujucharms.com:8080/ and using the scroll wheel to zoom)
[21:13] <gary_poster> I'll file a bug
[21:14] <Makyo> gary_poster, About to head out for dogwalk, but will take a look. Hopefully it's something on our side.
[21:14] <gary_poster> cool Makyo thanks
[21:39] <rick_h_> bcsaller: :)
[22:16] <hatch> gary_poster: sorry I missed that you said you were back
[22:16] <hatch> https://code.launchpad.net/~hatch/juju-gui/set-loaded good middle branch?
[22:35] <hazmat> afaics constraints in the go api are broken, set followed by get shows no change
[22:36] <hazmat> or i can spel the key correctly and it works ..
[22:36] <hazmat> nm
[22:41] <benji> heh, I did the same thing the other day
[23:21] <gary_poster> hatch, wow, that still works?  yay for deleting code! :-)
[23:22] <gary_poster> hatch, then a later branch will move loadService and other db-related bits to the models module?
[23:22] <gary_poster> +1 so far


[02:52] <ubuntu_traveler> I'm having trouble accessing ubuntuone from the web. I keep getting OpenID authentication failed: Nonce already used or out of range
[03:57] <duanedesign> anyone know of any bugs using the web ui with Internet Explorer?
[05:45] <mikedep333> hey are other people able to access ubuntu one?
[05:48] <mikedep333> I ran into this bug
[05:48] <mikedep333> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntuone-client/+bug/510866
[05:49] <mikedep333> but there is an easy workaround
[08:07] <magatz> hi, is there a summary of the activity/decisions amda during the yersteday Ubuntuone biug day?
[08:10] <magatz> sorry for the mispelling ...
[12:58] <duanedesign> darn spammers. 'Be Gone Already'! :)
[13:17] <duanedesign> i came across a bug report and forum post in regards to Internet Explorrer and the Ubuntu One WebUI. Is this a known issue?
[13:19] <rtgz> duanedesign, depends on what the bug is
[13:19] <rtgz> duanedesign, if that is IE, then that is WONTFIX :)
[13:20] <duanedesign> rtgz: ;)
[13:20] <duanedesign> rtgz: Internet working better today?
[13:21] <duanedesign> rtgz: we had an ice storm where i am. Crossing fingers that internet and power stay on
[13:22] <rtgz> duanedesign, i had a pretty strange day yesterday. When I needed the internet most, in the evening, the ISP's ppp responded 'Access denied'. Will connect a backup one on Tuesday...
[13:25] <rtgz> duanedesign, here, in Ukraine we don't need ice storms for the internet or power outages to occur. It is a value-added feature.
[13:30] <rtgz> why do we use IRC these days if XMPP prevents ^ from happening by requiring valid users...
[14:06]  * rtgz hates local laws
[14:08] <rtgz> with banks still forced to live in 196x, where facsimile transactions are not trusted but no replacement is provided...
[14:10] <jblount> rtgz: Banks are the worst.
[14:11] <rtgz> jblount, nope, banks are all "yes, sir, sure, we will cooperate..."
[14:13] <rtgz> jblount, but then there are various government-related requirements that force the remote party to rewrite the agreement so that it can be accepted by the local authorities...
[14:13] <rtgz> grrrr
[14:14] <rtgz> so, abstracting from local laws... Has anybody checked whether couchdb is able to replicate via http proxy?
[14:15] <rtgz> i made syncdaemon work with the proxy, as I already said earlier; but this is only a part of ubuntuone. The other part is couchdb which either has it as a native capability or the same hack will be required.
[14:17]  * dobey hates stupid CTCP bombs
[14:18]  * rtgz thinks about routing PPP via IRC...
[14:19] <rtgz> hm, this seems unrelated
[14:19] <rtgz> so
[14:19] <rtgz> nobody from couchdb/desktopcouch here?
[14:19] <dobey> have you tried to see if it Just Works (TM)?
[14:21] <dobey> i really don't understand the bot attacks on #ubuntuone
[14:33] <aquarius> rtgz, hey
[14:33] <aquarius> I don't know if couch supports proxies...I'll check.
[14:33] <rtgz> aquarius, hey
[14:34]  * aquarius asks #couchdb
[14:46] <jcastro> aquarius: happy birthday!
[14:46] <aquarius> jcastro, not until tomorrow, pal :)
[14:46] <jcastro> yeah but I won't see you tomorrow
[14:46] <aquarius> ha!
[14:46] <aquarius> cheers :)
[14:46] <aquarius> shall see you the day after, though!
[14:47] <jcastro> \m/
[14:47] <jcastro> I am getting in early
[14:48] <aquarius> I won't be there until 9pm or so
[14:49] <urbanape> good morning, everyone!
[14:50] <jblount> Morning 'ape
[14:54] <dobey> yeah
[14:54] <dobey> tomorrow man
[14:55] <dobey> i get to PDX at 10, assuming midwestern storms don't f that up
[14:55] <urbanape> gotta rebootie. I'll be right back (though I won't disappear from here)
[14:55] <dobey> sigh
[14:56] <rtgz> bug. evolution.GGGGRRRRR
[14:56] <dobey> jcastro: clearly you don't understand the significance of tomorrow :)
[14:59] <jcastro> dobey: what happens tomorrow?
[15:01] <dobey> jcastro: well it's not only aquarius's birthday
[15:01] <dobey> but also mine
[15:02] <aquarius> omg
[15:02] <jblount> Woo!
[15:02] <aquarius> u1 birthday day
[15:02] <jcastro> dobey: fill it in on facebook
[15:02] <jcastro> it's also evand's bday
[15:03] <jblount> Desktop+ MEETING BEGINS
[15:03] <jblount> Say "me" if you want to wish aq and dopey a happy birthday (or if you want to take part in the meeting)
[15:03] <aquarius> me
[15:03] <jblount> me
[15:03] <aquarius> happy birthday dobey for tomorrow :)
[15:03] <dobey> jcastro: it is on facebook
[15:03] <dobey> hrmm
[15:04] <dobey> me
[15:04] <aquarius> also, dopey. harsh by jblount
[15:05] <jblount> aquarius: I'm not good with tab completion ;)
[15:05] <jblount> I need to jump on a phone call, so I'll start it off and let everyone catch up:
[15:05] <jblount> DONE: Some code review, some work on start page stuff
[15:05] <jblount> TODO: Get start pages jiving with translations, get that up so people can review it, figure out yahoo's search stuff.
[15:06] <jblount> BLOCKED: Nope
[15:06] <aquarius> vds is afk at the moment and will fill in his stuff when he gets back
[15:06] <aquarius> ⚀ DONE:
[15:06] <aquarius> ⚁ TODO: test suite for music downloader design; cry about twisted; split library page into three, write tests, and commit;  have music library page send message to downloader daemon; make tomboy first-sync experience nicer
[15:06] <aquarius> ⚂ BLOCKED:
[15:06] <aquarius> go go gadget dobey
[15:07] <dobey> ☺ DONE: Blocked on libubuntuone mess. Got libubuntuone packages built in beta PPA, Landed branches, Fixed Makefile to allow running make test without make check
[15:07] <dobey> ☹ TODO: Fix some bugs I filed (#510351, #510353, #510348, #510355)
[15:07] <dobey> ☹ BLCK: None.
[15:07] <dobey> vds, urbanape, CardinalFang, etc... FIGHT!
[15:09] <urbanape> me!
[15:10] <urbanape> DONE: Mostly fixed the subsequent-client branch, what remains, I believe are bugs that can be filled against Bindwood in general (which I will do). Started on migration branch.
[15:10] <urbanape> TODO: Finish migration branch, write up some testing strategies, possibly some scripts to automate these tests.
[15:10] <urbanape> BLOCK: None, thank the maker.
[15:47] <Urda> is anybody having Ubuntu One connection issues this morning?
[15:48] <mhall119|work> i don't think so
[15:48] <dobey> what sort of issue?
[15:49] <Urda> well for one, one the web I get random "OpenID cannot auth" issues
[15:50] <Urda> and two of my three ubuntu clients keep prompting to be added to my account, even though they are already added
[15:51] <dobey> Urda: for the web issue, just go to one.ubuntu.com again after you get that error. there's a weird openid issue that people are looking at
[15:54] <dobey> Urda: i'm not sure why it would be reprompting you to add your account repeatedly though, what version of the client are you running on those?
[15:54] <Urda> dobey: I should be running the latest standard client, I check for aptitude updates a lot
[15:54] <Urda> dobey: seems to be behaving now that I am in IRC, must know I'm here lol
[16:21] <feutete> hello--today I have started getting a browser window popping up about every 5-10 minutes asking me if I want to add my computer to my ubuntuone account
[16:21] <feutete> the thing is that this computer has been on the account for months now
[16:22] <feutete> I see this in the syncdaemon log: http://paste.ubuntu.com/365254/
[16:22] <feutete> is there some sort of system issue on the u1 servers that is causing this?
[16:31] <dobey> feutete: what version of ubuntuone-client do you have please?
[16:33] <feutete> dobey: what's the best way to find that out?
[16:33] <dobey> dpkg -l ubuntuone-client-gnome
[16:33] <dobey> run that in a terminal
[16:34] <feutete> dobey: /msg 1.0.2-0ubuntu2
[16:34] <feutete> er... 1.0.2-0ubuntu2
[16:34] <feutete> dunno how /msg got in there :s
[16:34] <feutete> this just started this morning...I've  been running fine for months
[16:35] <dobey> feutete: ok, can you open System->Administration->Software Sources, and under the Updates tab there, enable "Proposed updates", then close the dialog, let it refresh, and update the ubuntuone packages from there?
[16:38] <feutete> dobey: done. now I'm on 1.0.3-0ubuntu1
[16:42] <dobey> feutete: ok, if you right click on the applet and choose "Quit", and then wait a few seconds, and then run Ubuntu One again from the Internet menu, and let me know if you still have the same issues please
[16:50] <feutete> dobey: will do...
[16:53] <dobey> thanks
[16:53] <dobey> i must go now. bbiab
[16:53] <feutete> thanks dobey
[17:34] <feutete> dobey: when you come back, ping me please...the original problem has cleared up, but now I have problems staying connected
[17:51] <statik> hi artir
[17:51] <statik> gah freenode
[17:51] <duanedesign> :(
[17:52] <duanedesign> darn script kiddies need to do something productive
[17:54] <dobey> feutete: hi
[17:54] <feutete> dobey: hi
[17:55] <dobey> feutete: i imagine you're still getting the errors from the server, causing the disconnect. not sure why you're getting the errors. let me poke someone
[17:55] <feutete> so, now I'll stay connected for a while, and then the applet icon will show a red X and I get this in syncdaemon.log: http://paste.ubuntu.com/365293/
[17:55] <feutete> thanks
[17:58] <dobey> feutete: ok, there should be some logs on the server about why it's doing that, so hopefully someone can figure it out soon and make it better. i doubt you're the only person that's seeing it :)
[18:03] <rtgz> okay
[18:04] <rtgz> dc replication stops on any avahi error
[18:04] <feutete> dobey: thanks
[18:08] <dobey> this is getting annoying
[18:08] <rtgz> openid failed
[18:09] <rtgz> STILL???
[19:10] <rtgz> woo-hoo, backup ISP arrives on Sunday :)
[19:12] <dobey> yay more spam
[19:13] <rtgz> ubuntu needs to provide @ubuntuone.com XMPP accounts and/or email forwarding.   I'll go look. ...
[19:34] <mandel> CardinalFang thx :D
[19:37] <CardinalFang> mandel, It's an oversight, it seems.
[19:37] <CardinalFang> mandel, I'll hack one up in a few minutes.  Want to review it?
[19:37] <mandel> sure, I'll be more than happy
[19:39] <rtgz> aquarius, dc replication while proxy in place http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/365369/
[19:39] <aquarius> rtgz, yeah. I am told by the Couch people that couch doesn't support it yet (well, the underlying erlang http thing doesn't)
[19:40] <aquarius> I need to file a ticket with CouchDB upstream about it
[19:40] <rtgz> aquarius, and 80/443 ports are not accessible for applications...
[19:40] <aquarius> feel free to do that instead of me if you get there first ;-)
[19:40] <rtgz> aquarius, so making UbuntuOne work behind proxy is making syncdaemon work with proxy then couchdb and then desktopcouch.
[19:41] <aquarius> yes, although desktopcouch shouldn't need to do anything new, assuming that python's urllib library supports proxies, which I'm pretty sure it does
[19:43] <dobey> aquarius: HAHAHAHA
[19:43] <dobey> aquarius: you assume too much
[19:43] <rtgz> The urlopen() function works transparently with proxies which do not require authentication
[19:43] <rtgz> Proxies which require authentication for use are not currently supported; this is considered an implementation limitation.
[19:43] <rtgz> sweet
[19:43]  * aquarius puts on his depressed-and-hard-done-by look.
[19:43] <dobey> yeah, using authed or socks proxy with urllib is a no-go
[19:44] <dobey> unless you write some funky magic, like for doing ssl validation
[19:45] <rtgz> so this leaves people in the universities w/o UbuntuOne...
[19:46] <rtgz> okay, this limitation can be worked around by running local tunnel through the proxy and have syncdaemon and couchdb connect to localhost... but it looks like it will create even more problems... I feel that it will create them
[19:47] <rtgz> first of all this is a hack
[19:47] <rtgz> second: this is a hack
[19:47] <dobey> hrmm
[19:47] <dobey> i wonder if it's just ubuntuone-client that breaks
[19:49] <rtgz> dobey, hm... basically... proxy support seems to be left as an exercise to the user...
[19:51] <dobey> rtgz: unfortunately :(
[19:51] <CardinalFang> mandel, until .remove()  is implemented for a time, I think the best way to handle deletion is to use "del foo[N]".
[19:53] <mandel> CardinalFang, thx I'll do that I noticed the problem is that I have the value and not the key, that is why I was asking and finding the key will add an overhead to the operation
[19:53] <dobey> rtgz: i'm not sure what to do about that
[19:53] <dobey> rtgz: clearly the python std libraries need to be fixed
[19:54] <dobey> and why does desktopcouch try to access *MY* keyring in the tests?
[19:57] <mandel> CardinalFang, I really do not know how would be a good implementation, maybe a double two way hash would do the trick
[20:09] <mandel> CardinalFang, a would implement the MergeableList as a modified HashBiMap by using buckets for the value->key map but not for the key->value that will allow to perform the operations as expected
[20:10] <mandel> an O(n) in both directions... I think :P
[20:29] <mandel> CardinalFang, actually I got the O(n) bad... it would be O(1) with a possible large constant in both dirs including adding and removing since if you have a bucket when removing you dont care and just remove the first element in it
[20:31] <CardinalFang> mandel, right!  This is a good idea.
[21:47] <rtgz> *WALL* Currently urllib2 does not support fetching of https locations through a proxy. This can be a problem.
[21:47] <rtgz> IT IS!
[21:47] <rtgz> grrr
[21:50] <dobey> yes  it is
[21:53]  * jblount sets fire to thunderbird
[21:58] <dobey> e-mail is so passe.
[22:15] <rtgz> Okay, happy birthday to everyone celebrating. Have great parties and have a lot of fun!
[22:16]  * rtgz is shutting down for sleeep now!
[22:29] <dobey> later


[00:01] <jrwren> is it s3 ?
[00:01] <jrwren> http api?
[00:10] <snap-l> Jesus, playing semantics on identi.ca
[00:11] <snap-l> no wonder people were knocking themselves over to hang out there. :-P
[00:58] <jcastro_> rick_h_ hey
[01:17] <rick_h_> jcastro_: yep
[01:37] <jcastro_> rick_h_ recommendation for like a laser wall thing?
[01:37] <jcastro_> for like lining things up
[01:38] <jcastro_> or does it matter
[01:38] <rick_h_> The big thing is get something that runs both ways if you can. So you put it on the wall once and have a line both directions to hang stuff
[01:39] <rick_h_> I got one with the 3M removable sticky things and works great
[01:39] <jcastro_> ok
[01:39] <rick_h_> don't know on the suction kind and I didn't want anything that made a hole
[01:39] <jcastro_> do I need a stud finder?
[01:40] <rick_h_> yea
[01:40] <rick_h_> you'll find things that need to be on studs, or to avoid the studs
[01:40] <rick_h_> especially electical
[01:48] <jrwren> you may not borrow my wife for that.
[01:59] <snap-l> jrwren: He said stud finder, not drip detector. ;)
[01:59] <snap-l> Why did that suddenly feel like a Welcome Back Kotter line?
[02:15] <jrwren> *sad trombone*
[10:52] <rick_h_> morning
[10:56] <rick_h_> ouch http://blog.cihar.com/archives/2012/09/26/compromised-sourceforge-mirror/?utm_source=rss2
[10:56] <rick_h_> finally read the stuff on that this morning
[11:17] <brousch> Interesting
[11:17] <brousch> Another rough week for poor Dave
[12:22] <snap-l> Good morning
[12:22] <snap-l> brousch: Likely not Dave's baliwick
[12:27] <snap-l> But still sucks because it takes resources away from other projects.
[12:38] <brousch> jrwren: Dreamhosts object storage is not S3, but has a S3-compatible API
[12:39] <rick_h_> *cough* openstack *cough* I think
[12:42] <brousch> Yeah
[12:43] <brousch> "Canonical Ltd’s Ubuntu Linux 12.4 powers DreamObjects"
[12:43] <brousch> http://dreamhost.com/press-releases/dreamhost-introduces-dreamobjects-cloud-storage-service/
[13:26] <jrwren> s3 compat abpi is cool.
[13:26] <jrwren> we need that in our basements.
[13:41] <snap-l> kitten has discovered the joy of paper towel
[13:41] <snap-l> and toilet paper
[14:00] <rick_h_> snap-l: hah
[14:29] <brousch> Full HD tablet from B&N for $270 http://www.barnesandnoble.com/u/Compare-NOOKs/379003181
[14:29] <brousch> I thought they would give up
[14:31] <snap-l> brousch: Nah, they still have a compelling story to tell
[14:32] <snap-l> Wonder if the nook tablet will get an upgrade
[14:32] <snap-l> Thinking htat's highly doubtful
[14:32] <brousch> Those new tablets are better specs than the Kindle fires
[14:32] <brousch> snap-l: Thise are the upgrades
[14:35] <snap-l> I hean software upgrades for current owners
[14:35] <brousch> ah, software
[14:35] <brousch> Haven't there been software updates?
[14:35] <rick_h_> right, but no amazon video, no amazon music
[14:36] <rick_h_> they've got devices without content :/
[14:36] <brousch> I remember one of them broke the Nook Color rooting hole for a while
[14:36] <brousch> rick_h_: Root and ROM
[14:36] <snap-l> from the press release, it doesn't sound like it
[14:39] <jcastro_> jrwren, yeah so the dreamhost thing is cool
[14:39] <jcastro_> because it's like 4 cents cheaper than S3 last I checked
[14:47] <brousch> What is Coderwall? http://coderwall.com/brousch/achievements/33707
[14:48] <brousch> They just wander the web stalking people and giving them badges?
[14:49] <rick_h_> http://coderwall.com/mitechie it started out as badges for github stuff
[14:49] <rick_h_> "you've got 5 python projects" etc
[14:51] <brousch> "Rick needs just 3 more endorsements to unlock ActionScript"
[14:51] <brousch> I'm so going to endorse you
[14:51] <brousch> Even better, PHP
[14:51] <jcastro_> "Git has taken over where Linux left off separating the geeks into know-nothings and know-it-alls. I didn’t really expect anyone to use it because it’s so hard to use, but that turns out to be its big appeal. No technology can ever be too arcane or complicated for the black t-shirt crowd."
[14:51] <jcastro_> linus is so awesome
[14:51] <brousch> "Rick needs just 3 more endorsements to unlock PHP"
[14:51] <jcastro_> there you go rick_h_
[14:52] <rick_h_> heh, thankfully it proves I've left my bad habits behind me...
[15:08] <snap-l> rick_h_: You're always one hit away from going back to bad habits
[15:09] <snap-l> <- king of bad habits
[15:11] <dzho> jcastro_: word is you're going to be hitting Columbus soon
[15:11] <jcastro_> yeah, friday
[15:11] <snap-l> jcastro_: No way we can convince you to stay through Saturday?
[15:12] <jcastro_> can't
[15:12] <jcastro_> jill has an open house on saturday we have to go to
[15:12] <jcastro_> for her work
[15:12] <dzho> bummer
[15:12] <snap-l> understandable. No worries.
[15:12] <snap-l> Grateful for the bit of time we'll have.
[15:24] <snap-l> NOOK Cloud: All NOOK content is delivered via Wi-Fi and safely stored through NOOK Cloud, making NOOK Books, videos, apps and other content accessible across NOOK, personal computing and mobile devices using free NOOK Reading and NOOK Video apps.
[15:25] <snap-l> Apparently Digital Locker is now referred to as "Cloud"
[15:25] <rick_h_> online == cloud, didn't you hear?
[15:25] <rick_h_> you need to contact your cloud service provider if you can't access google
[15:26] <brousch> It's a cloud if they have more than one datacenter
[15:29] <snap-l> It's like everything being called "mainframe"
[15:33] <brousch> The cloud is mainframes!
[15:35] <brousch> I'll be at GrrCON tomorrow with Kevin Mitnick. Who wants an authograph?
[15:38] <snap-l> brousch: Too bad there's not enough time for you to grab my copy of Art of Deception
[15:41] <brousch> But there is time for you to come!
[16:15] <greg-g> snap-l / brousch that joke is almost too close to true :/
[16:15] <snap-l> greg-g: The cloud / mainframe one?
[16:15]  * greg-g nods
[16:16] <snap-l> Yeah, it's enough to make a semantic lawyer nearly apoplectic.
[16:26] <greg-g> snap-l: so, I don't know, I just have to say that in the morning, when I reading the twitter and identi.ca "scrollback" I see much more awesome discussion on identi.ca. Which, is obviously a function of  who I follow where (what else would it be a function of? medium isn't that different). Which is why I'm on a twitter following purge
[16:27] <greg-g> so, all I'm saying is, I find the (smaller number of) people I follow on identi.ca to be more interesting, generally, than the (much larger number of) people I follow on twitter, except! for getting news
[16:28] <greg-g> news is still better from twitter, my followers there tend to be more (openly) political
[16:28] <snap-l> greg-g: Oh, I've never sipped in the quality of the conversation
[16:28] <snap-l> s/sipped/dipped/
[16:29] <snap-l> if I need to know the pulse of CC or OSS, identi.ca is the place
[16:31] <greg-g> so, I think an important thing is to clarify, it isn't the medium, it is who you follow. Which is why I was careful to say "those who I follow on identi.ca versus who I follow on twitter"
[16:31] <rick_h_> right, all these tools are what you make of them
[16:32] <snap-l> Absolutely
[16:33] <snap-l> It's like the people who bitch about Mongolian having dry meat, after making a bowl of essentially meatloaf.
[16:33] <snap-l> (no veggies, no sauce, etc)
[16:34] <greg-g> so yeah, apparently I follow more interesting people (to my taste) on identi.ca than twitter, minus the news commentary on twitter, which is why I follow both
[16:38] <snap-l> The reason for the original post was to disabuse folks from seeking api freedom from Twitter.
[16:39] <snap-l> And also to explain why "muggles" aren't flocking to the OSS freedom
[16:40] <snap-l> Twitter's audience knows what they want, and identi.ca / Diaspora / etc. don't yet have that
[16:40] <snap-l> and that's the folks they follow.
[16:41] <snap-l> "I want heated leather seats in my car" does not mean I want a heated waterbottle in my pants when I drive.
[16:42] <snap-l> No matter how efficient / portable that waterbottle may be over the seat warmers
[16:44] <snap-l> People couldn't care less about Facebook or Twitter as development platforms, they care more about who they can access.
[16:44] <snap-l> And why some people still log into AIM or Yahoo chat
[16:46]  * greg-g nods
[16:47] <snap-l> WHich was the genesis of the "Conversation without an audience is meaningless" debacle.
[16:53] <jrwren> the dreamhost dreamstore says they use ceph, that is the piece i want to run myself in our datacenter.
[17:12] <jcastro_> yeah they use ceph
[17:12] <jcastro_> and you can set up something similar to what they have
[17:15] <jrwren> yeah, I think i shall
[18:03] <jcastro_> http://marathon.ubuntuonair.com/
[18:03] <jcastro_> I am doing a charity drive!
[18:03] <jcastro_> Any donations accepted!
[18:04] <jcastro_> I'm supporting music education in poor schools via littlekidsrock.org
[18:04] <jcastro_> snap-l, come on buddy, pony up
[18:04] <jcastro_> I can't lose to jono
[18:16] <snap-l> jcastro_: I will when the next check comes in
[19:44] <brousch> Is the Thinkpad x220 still a recommended laptop?
[19:51] <rick_h_> I've got the 230 and <3
[19:52] <brousch> I'm worried about downgrading to 1366x768
[19:52] <jrwren> its fine when you are on the go, and when you aren't, use an external display.
[19:53] <jrwren> and if you are on the go but need to settle in, use airdisplay and your ipad as a second monitor... oh wait...
[19:53] <brousch> I rarely use 2 monitors
[19:53] <jrwren> no dual display? wtf do you do?
[19:53] <brousch> workspaces are my thing
[19:53] <brousch> i have 10 workspaces
[19:54] <brousch> I can get 1600x900 on a thinkpad T420
[19:54] <jrwren> yeah, but its HUGE.  14" is way to big.
[19:55] <jrwren> if you go T420, at least go T420s
[19:55] <jrwren> 1440x900 would be a lot nicer on that small screen though.
[19:56] <jrwren> how often do you buy?
[19:56] <jrwren> IMO its a terrible time to buy.
[19:56] <jrwren> in 6mo to 1yr apple will put retina on mac book air, and then 6mo after that everyone else will be catching up.
[19:57] <brousch> I bought this one 4 years ago, and the MBP 2 years ago
[19:57] <brousch> So I guess every 2 years I buy something that's 2 years old
[19:57] <jrwren> so the next year or so will be a notebook display revolution IMO
[19:58] <brousch> 1280x800 on the MBP annoys me
[19:58] <brousch> I think 768 does not suit my needs
[19:59] <brousch> I buy 2 year old laptops to minimize bleeding edge issues with linux
[20:34] <brousch> Wow Asus Zenbook UX21A 11.6" screen with 1920x1080
[20:53] <jrwren> 1280x800 on an MBP? my MBA is 1440x900, how did you get such a small display?
[20:54] <greg-g> brousch: btw, I hate the x220 display size. It's about 90% of the reason I'm using my x200s 100% of the time
[20:55] <brousch> jrwren: It's from mid 2009 13.3"
[20:55] <brousch> greg-g: x200s has more pixels?
[20:56] <brousch> oh man, max of 4GB RAM?
[20:56] <greg-g> my x200s actually has 8gigs in it, and it works, but that's the *real real* max
[20:57] <greg-g> brousch: and yeah, 1440x900 instead of the stupid 768 or whatever
[20:58] <greg-g> and I hate the new aspect ratio all laptops are going to :/
[20:58] <brousch> hm, no touchpad. seems like scrolling would be hard
[20:58] <greg-g> NIPPL!
[20:58] <greg-g> +E
[20:58] <brousch> i can't scroll with the nipple
[20:58] <greg-g> yeah you can
[20:58] <brousch> e?
[20:58] <greg-g> takes two fingers, just like it would on a touchpad
[20:59] <greg-g> thumb on middle 'mouse' button, and index finger on nipple
[20:59] <brousch> hm, doesn't work on my dell
[20:59] <greg-g> well, dells suck ;)
[21:00] <greg-g> actually, it may need a fix in your synaptics config, I remember it not working OOTB on all laptop in Ubuntu
[21:01] <brousch> I don't have a proper middle mouse button
[21:01] <greg-g> well then, I have no idea how you scroll on that with out a middle mouse button nor touchpad ;)
[21:02] <brousch> pg up/pg down
[21:03] <greg-g> I guess so, and space bar
[21:03] <greg-g> install Vimperator and use vim keybindings to scroll in Fx
[21:17] <rick_h_> logoff time, see you all in VA
[21:17]  * rick_h_ starts getting the twitches
[21:18] <greg-g> for?
[21:25] <jrwren> no two finger scrolling?
[23:48] <snap-l> evening