[02:47] <slangasek> vila: strange, I completely missed your ping before.  Did my answer on the bug suffice?
[09:33] <vila> slangasek: good enough for now, I'll prototype something and we can discuss refinements from there
[19:45] <slangasek> vila: ok, cheers :)
[22:49] <sanbar> I have the the directory structure /code, /code/language1, /code/language1/project1, /code/language/project2, etc.  I wish to create a repository in /code, so I used init-repository on /code
[22:50] <sanbar> However, I wish to create my branches in the project directories - do I use init-repository on /code/language, or init (to create a branch on it)?
[22:50] <sanbar> /code/language1*
[22:51] <sanbar> ie, can you have repositories within repositories?
[23:00] <jelmer> hi sanbar
[23:00] <jelmer> sanbar: you can nest repositories, but only the "closest" repository will be used
[23:00] <jelmer> i.e. if you create a repository in /code and a repository in /code/language1, and then create a branch in /code/language1/project1
[23:01] <jelmer> then all revisions will be stored in /code/language1
[23:30] <sanbar> does it do any good to have nested repositories then at all?
[23:31] <sanbar> jelmer: ^
[23:31] <sanbar> (they do seem to be "browsable" using the gui utils, so maybe that is the only benefit?
[23:33] <sanbar> Oh, I get it - you can mix branches/repositories in the "parent" repository.  That would be the benefit, then ...
[23:33] <sanbar> (since it would be "closest" for a branch immediately underneath it ...)
[23:33] <sanbar> jelmer: ^
[23:53] <jelmer> sanbar: sorry, was away for a bit
[23:54] <jelmer> sanbar: no, there isn't much use in having nested repositories


 Did anyone see this? https://www.reddit.com/r/Lubuntu/comments/soyyxj/i_created_a_better_app_menu_icon_imo/
 We could contact them and update the icon and give credits. It's a great icon imo.
[04:25] <guiverc> I saw it, but had little reaction  (aesthitics aren't really my thing)..  I'm using a different theme so don't see default anyway (mine has the ubuntu logo); I gather a lot of users change defaults too


[07:38] <kim0> Morning everyone o/
[07:48] <TeTeT> hi kim0 , all prepared for the cloud days?
[07:48] <kim0> TeTeT: Hey o/
[07:48] <kim0> Yeah should be good
[07:49] <kim0> TeTeT: did you get my email about moving ur session to Tues
[07:49] <kim0> I hope that's ok
[07:50] <TeTeT> kim0: yes, thought I even replied, fine for me
[07:50] <kim0> TeTeT: oh great .. thanks
[07:50] <kim0> I've got 1000 emails to read :)
[07:51] <TeTeT> kim0: he he, I've dug through mine 150 that accumulated last week already
[07:51] <TeTeT> I'm quite liberal with the del key though
[07:51] <kim0> hehe :)
[07:51] <kim0> TeTeT: where you off last week as well ?
[07:52] <TeTeT> kim0: yes, one week of summer vacation. I transformed the other two weeks to four weeks with 50%
[07:52] <kim0> nice!
[09:25] <koolhead11> hi all
[09:25] <kim0> koolhead11: howdy
[09:25] <koolhead11> kim0, am good. wondering if i should make a slide
[09:25] <kim0> koolhead11: hmm don't think so ..
[09:25] <kim0> It's really all irc
[09:26] <koolhead11> awesome
[09:26] <kim0> I mean you could .. but most sessions don't
[09:26] <kim0> koolhead11: does your irc nick keep changing between 11 and 17 ? :)
[09:26] <koolhead11> kim0, i have a simple openstack setup and there i will launch an instance with cloud-init
[09:27] <koolhead11> and show few examples what all happenes
[09:27] <koolhead11> happens
[09:27] <koolhead11> is that fine
[09:27] <kim0> Well absolutely .. but how will you "show"
[09:28] <kim0> koolhead11: You could launch an ec2 instance with that account you have, if that'd be helpful
[09:28] <koolhead11> kim0, i mean is there a way i can share my screen :P
[09:29] <kim0> koolhead11: the best way would be to configure a shared "screen" on some servers
[09:29] <kim0> you work from there, and people login to view only
[09:30] <kim0> there's some Ensemble formula that sets that up on ec2 .. but you could do it manually too (a few lines of screen config_
[09:30] <koolhead11> kim0, i have another idea
[09:30] <kim0> shoot
[09:31] <koolhead11> umm. but i think it wont be good. besides ssh is  blocked 4 outside world from here :(
[09:32] <kim0> koolhead11: I think the ssh server would need to be on ec2
[09:33] <kim0> you could ssh to that, setting up a reverse ssh tunnel
[09:33] <kim0> ssh -R 8888:<IP_ADDRESS>:1234
[09:33] <kim0> that's it .. you can ssh back to your own machine
[09:33] <kim0> and others can view it
[09:34] <koolhead11> kim0, okey
[09:34] <kim0> be sure to experiment with it however :)
[09:34] <kim0> to make sure it all works
[09:34] <koolhead11> let me do it
[12:30] <koolhead11> kim0,
[12:30] <kim0> koolhead11: hey
[12:31] <kim0> replying to ur msgs
[12:31] <koolhead11> cool
[13:44] <koolhead17> kim0:
[13:46] <kim0> here
[13:46] <kim0> koolhead17: do you become 17 at home ?
[13:46] <koolhead17> kim0: yeah :D
[13:46] <kim0> ah I finally understand :)
[13:46] <kim0> msg me
[15:58] <neoXsys> Can anybody point me to ready to use Ubuntu 11.04 Server Image for Open Stack?
[15:58] <kim0> Howdy folks, Ubuntu cloud days starting in #ubuntu-classroom on the hour .. see you there
[17:47] <kim0> smoser RoAkSoAx .. Ready to rock n roll the world folks .. starting in 10 mins
[17:48] <kim0> smoser: RoAkSoAx  .. Please play with classbot a bit .. this handles questions .. it goes like "/msg classbot !q" .. to see if there's any questions .. then "/msg classbot !y" to accept any question .. or !n to reject .. that's about it
[19:19] <koolhead17> obino: ping
[19:25] <obino> koolhead17: pong
[19:25] <koolhead17> obino: wassup?
[19:25] <obino> on the floor at OScon
[19:25] <obino> connection may be flacky
[19:26] <obino> how are you doing?
[19:26] <koolhead17> am good.
[19:27] <koolhead17> saw some tweet saying you guys got stall next/opposite to redhat :D


[02:58] <mup> Bug #1600539 opened: diskmanager block device list should be sorted to avoid continual "block devices changed"  <sts> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1600539>
[04:11] <mup> Bug #1600546 opened: lxd subnet setup by juju will interfere with openstack instance traffic <sts> <juju-core:New> <nova-compute (Juju Charms Collection):New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1600546>
[04:41] <mup> Bug #1532186 changed: lxd container creation fails semi - regularly <2.0-count> <juju-release-support> <lxc> <juju-core:Expired> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1532186>
[07:35] <mup> Bug #1600559 opened: agents should ignore invalid API host ports response <addressability> <agent> <api> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1600559>
[13:42] <mup> Bug #1600600 opened: Docs are incorrect for Azure bootstrap <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1600600>
[23:02] <axw> wallyworld: heya. I did initially remove authorized-keys from FakeConfig, but it broke too many things. lots of tests use that to pass into Bootstrap, which still requires it
[23:03] <wallyworld> yeah, was afraid that may be the case
[23:03] <axw> the fact that so many tests use Bootstrap is an ongoing problem :(
[23:03] <axw> wallyworld: ok for me to drop?
[23:04] <wallyworld> sure
[23:13]  * redir has landed at gophercon
[23:13] <redir> off to register.


[00:56] <ahoneybun> vote in Nov?
[05:48] <ovidiu-florin> ahoneybun: what feedback section?
[06:14] <soee> good morning
[06:28] <cortex_> morning
[06:28] <cortex_> xenial is the name of the new version right?
[06:30] <cortex_> oh xenial xerus
[06:30] <cortex_> i like this name
[07:16] <soee> cortex_: hi, yes. Though i have no idea what it means :D
[07:16] <soee> Google translator can't hadle this name -.-
[07:17] <cortex_> soee: a squirrel
[07:17] <cortex_> :P
[07:18] <soee> on the pic it looks like hedgehog
[07:50] <thelionroars> well done all, 15.10 is freakin' beautiful
[08:16] <lordievader> Good morning.
[08:16] <cortex_> morning
[08:50] <vip> hi ho
[09:01] <sick_rimmit> Riddell: Well if ever there was an email to weep over, that was it
[09:01] <sick_rimmit> Oh Boy!!
[09:05] <Riddell> thanks sick_rimmit :)
[09:11] <lordievader> I hope that the roads of Kubuntu and Riddel somewhere in the future merge once more.
[09:12] <snele> Riddell: thank you for everything you have done
[09:13] <snele> I hope this is not the end for Kubuntu...
[10:14] <santa_> Mirv: good morning, do you have a stating ppa with Qt 5.5 so it could be used to do a test rebuild of KDE packages against it?
[10:15] <santa_> * staging
[10:15] <yossarianuk> congrats on 15.10 everybody !
[10:15] <yossarianuk> will these fixes for 5.4.3 be in the normal repos for 15.10 (without PPA?) -> http://blog.martin-graesslin.com/blog/2015/10/looking-at-some-crashers-fixed-this-week/
[10:15] <yossarianuk> im never sure what the policy is with kubuntu + point releases of KDE.
[10:16] <santa_> yossarianuk: if I'm not mistaken, newer point releases go to updates and major releases go to backports
[10:17] <santa_> not sure how it works for Qt
[10:19] <yossarianuk> cheers santa_:
[10:19] <yossarianuk> bit early for you to be out.....
[10:19] <yossarianuk> ps -> i've been a very good boy!
[10:21] <santa_> haha
[10:22] <santa_> the nickname actually is my family name "Santamaría" shortened
[10:22] <yossarianuk> its ok you're secret is safe .....
[10:25] <ovidiu-florin> Riddell: are you around/
[10:25] <ovidiu-florin> ?
[10:25] <Riddell> hi ovidiu-florin
[10:25] <ovidiu-florin> can I have a call with you or do you reffer writing?
[10:26] <Riddell> either way, landline number at jriddell.org/contact
[10:28] <ovidiu-florin> Riddell: tried calling both
[10:28] <ovidiu-florin> nothing
[10:28] <ovidiu-florin> both go to voicemail
[10:29] <Riddell> curious
[10:29] <Riddell> or google hangout, or just chat here
[10:29]  * clivejo smiles at Riddell's use of OSM
[10:29] <ovidiu-florin> I'll type here
[10:30] <ovidiu-florin> Riddell: please let me know if my wording comes accross to hard.
[10:30] <Riddell> clivejo: cooler use at http://whitewater.quaker.eu.org/ :)
[10:30] <ovidiu-florin> I'm sorry to see you leave the release manager position
[10:30] <ovidiu-florin> but I dissagree that we should post your letter in the Kubuntu news
[10:30] <ovidiu-florin> We can post a link to the mail list archive
[10:31] <ovidiu-florin> IMO the news should be from the project, not from a aspecific person
[10:31] <Riddell> reasonable enough to disagree, it's not what we've done before
[10:32] <ovidiu-florin> the wording in that news article should be in the plural second person, as to we, the Kubuntu project are sorry to see you go
[10:32] <Riddell> but I wanted to address the users of the project directly
[10:32] <Riddell> and that's the best way
[10:32] <Riddell> it seems unfair to leave without saying so clearly or saying why
[10:32] <ovidiu-florin> I think that should be done on your blog, not the projects
[10:32] <ovidiu-florin> I didn't say you should say that
[10:33] <ovidiu-florin> I'm only saying that the news article should come from the Kubuntu team, and formulated as such
[10:33] <ovidiu-florin> and link to your blog post and the mail archive
[10:33] <santa_> valorie: https://community.kde.org/User:Santa one of the 2 wiki pages I'm writing to apply for membership (I plan to write other one in the ubuntu wiki more focused to the application itself and my help in kubuntu)
[10:33] <santa_> good enough? suggestions?
[10:33] <ovidiu-florin> Riddell: do you dissagree?
[10:34] <clivejo> santa_: I wouldnt put "not a good place to work and not planning back"
[10:34] <clivejo> put a positive spin on it!
[10:34] <Riddell> ovidiu-florin: yes, but only because these are extraordinary situations, the project and community has been attacked from ubuntu and canonical and it seems reasonable to say so.  but do ask kubuntu council members if they would rather it was changed, I won't mind if they do
[10:36] <Riddell> but it seems disingenious (to use one of sabdfl's favourite words for me) to leave without saying that there are problems and what they are
[10:36] <ovidiu-florin> Riddell: I think the message should be there, but it should be comming from the Kubuntu team, not specifically you.
[10:36] <ovidiu-florin> since this is the Kubuntu site, it belongs to the project, not to any particular person
[10:37] <yossarianuk> riddell: can I ask what you plan to do next ? i.e are you still going to help out with kubuntu, move to debian ? (just interested really)
[10:38] <clivejo> ovidiu-florin: well it wasn’t a voluntary step down was it?
[10:39] <santa_> clivejo: I had my doubts about that statement, but the truth is, I was expelled from both projects for political reasons and I have anything except nice things to say about them. so I guess one possible approach would be skiping the statement in question
[10:39] <santa_> thanks for the suggestion
[10:40] <ovidiu-florin> clivejo: I don't see the connection between what I said and your point
[10:41] <clivejo> santa_: just suggests a case of sour grapes and that maybe you arent a team player
[10:41] <Riddell> ovidiu-florin: if the project's parent forces the project to lose out that is project news.  but as I say ask other council members and do as you wish
[10:41] <ovidiu-florin> Riddell: again, I don't want the message removed
[10:42] <ovidiu-florin> it belongs there
[10:42] <ovidiu-florin> with all the details in there
[10:42] <ovidiu-florin> but the article should be formulated as if the Kubuntu team sais it
[10:43] <ovidiu-florin> and gives quites from your email
[10:43] <ovidiu-florin> that's all
[10:43] <Riddell> ovidiu-florin: sure, redraft it and get someone on the council to aprove it then
[10:44] <santa_> clivejo: fair enough, deleted, even while I think the projects in question don't actually deserve it
[10:45] <Mirv> santa_: good afternoon. yes, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/QtTesting for wily (xenial later) PPA with Qt 5.5.1. If interested, the PPA should also already work as is for KDE as it has the required rebuilds of frameworkintegration, plasma-framework and kwin (although I haven't tested myself)
[10:45] <clivejo> santa_: maybe you could explain your reasons for leaving the project, let the reader make up their mind
[10:49] <santa_> Mirv: excellent, thanks for the information
[10:50] <clivejo> ovidiu-florin: have the KCC not got a statement prepared, I thought this was on the cards for at least a month now?
[10:51] <santa_> clivejo: haha, well, lets skip it, because if I do that I don't see a way of explaining that without being "gracefully rude" (torvalds-like)
[10:51] <ovidiu-florin> clivejo: I wasn't aware of it
[10:51] <ovidiu-florin> a mistake on my part
[10:51] <Mirv> yossarianuk: I've done most of the Ubuntu Qt uploads, but for wily SRU:s anyone can take the ball. I'd start with filing LP bug (or bugs) against the component (usually qtbase-opensource-src or qtdeclarative-opensource-src), linking to the codereview url:s with 5.4 branch commits and filling the required information of the section 3.3 at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates so it's ready for bo
[10:51] <Mirv> th xenial landing and wily SRU
[10:51] <santa_> also it's material for a short article rather than just a line in a wiki
[10:52] <clivejo> ovidiu-florin: you werent aware that Riddell was "stepping down"
[10:54] <clivejo> I thought KCC had a statement prepared to announce it and the fact yofel was "stepping up"
[10:54] <ovidiu-florin> stepping down from that specific role, now
[10:54] <clivejo> as Release Manager
[10:56] <ovidiu-florin> I knew he intends to be less and less involved in Kubuntu
[11:01] <yossarianuk> Mirv: cheers
[11:02] <clivejo> I dont think that was his intention, rather what he was forced into doing!
[11:04] <clivejo> anyways, Id like to thank Riddell for his contribution over the years and for his part in making Kubuntu the best OS out there !
[11:08] <TJ-> Same here; is there any idea of how the remaining team can fill the gap?
[11:08] <clivejo> and also Riddell's patience and willingness to help others, a trait I have noticed in yofel which helps me believe Kubuntu is in good hands going forward
[11:11] <yofel> TJ-: somewhat, he was already not contributing much back in oneiric when he worked for a different canonical team. But considering that he might not be the only one that leaves (or at least sitter will too) we'll have to see who plans to work on what in the next weeks. Then we can figure things out from there
[11:13] <TJ-> yofel: yes, that's my thoughts. I'll tell you what frustrates me most - lack of process documentation. For example, despite observing in this channel, and having both the programming and Debian/Ubuntu packaging/process skills, I still have not grasped the process - it seems to be piece-meal, with different packages using different repos (source, packaging), publishing paths, CI, etc.
[11:14] <yofel> well, I fear that you then actually have a good grasp of the.. erm.. "process"
[11:14] <TJ-> That being the case, taking some time now the release is done to actually document that for the 'standard' and 'exceptional' cases would go a long way to making me, for one, more willing to invest time in contributing. Right now, I feel I'd waste most of the time I have available in trying to grasp the process and figure out the exceptions
[11:14] <santa_> yofel: we could do a test rebuild of frameworks/plasma/apps against Qt 5.5 with an improved kubuntu automation following the design we discussed the other day
[11:14] <yofel> it's something we need to work on, and I'm glad that santa_ is helping with that
[11:15] <yofel> santa_: that would be interesting, yes. How did you guys do the test rebuilds back for gcc5? In some random PPA?
[11:16] <TJ-> My other issue is of course, the background vis-a-vis Canonical. I experienced what J.R. has to a lesser extent with the kernel team, back in 2008/9 which has always made me wary
[11:19] <santa_> yofel: I did it in a suite of siduction's kdenext, which works with the tech I told you yesterday
[11:19] <santa_> what we can do is using both the staging kubuntu ppa's
[11:20] <yofel> we could also add a new one for exactly such purposes and ask for enough space
[11:20] <santa_> ... and the suites I have in kdenext
[11:20] <clivejo> how many people currently sit on the KCC?
[11:20] <yofel> 6
[11:21] <clivejo> is that back to fully strength?
[11:21] <yofel> yes, it's always 6 with 3 elected each year for 2 years
[11:21] <santa_> yofel: sure, it would be interesting to upload in both places so we make sure the improved automation stuff is generic enough to cover both use cases
[11:21] <santa_> * both places: kdenext + ubuntu's ppas
[11:22] <yofel> santa_: right, that would indeed be a good test run
[11:22] <yofel> is qt5.5 already in a PPA?
[11:23] <santa_> yep, see above, I asked where it was
[11:23] <santa_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/QtTesting
[11:23] <yofel> aah right, thanks
[11:34] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[12:02] <BluesKaj> Konversation fails to connect using SASL, had to revert to Standaed Nickserv to keep the client from disconnecting
[12:03] <BluesKaj> checking vpn now so I'll be disconnecting for a few mins
[12:18] <santa_> yofel: so, do you work this wekend? I think I have time work on the automation thing, I would need you to include the incoming patches in kubuntu-automation + test the thing for ubuntu's ppas + of course if you want, improve my patches/design
[12:19] <yofel> sure, I should have some time over the weekend. Mostly on sunday probably
[12:20] <santa_> excellent
[12:28] <yofel> do you have those scripts somewhere public now?
[12:29] <yofel> we might also want to move the automation stuff into git while we're at it
[12:42] <santa_> yofel: I have a working do-all here: https://gitlab.com/groups/siduction-tools also I have sent a patch to improve the build depends bumping
[12:43] <yofel> thanks
[12:43] <santa_> yofel: regarding the move to git we could follow this course of action: create a git repo, put in a branch what you have in bzr put in other branch what I have for siduction and at some point we will be able to merge
[12:44] <yofel> yeah, that was the idea.. that's a lot easier with git - as you can trivially merge remote branches as well
[12:44] <santa_> yofel: and if you move to git, you could go for a) alioth -> no permissions for me there or b) somewhere else such as github or gitlab
[12:45] <santa_> depending if you want me to push commits directly or not
[12:45] <yofel> my plan was to use launchpad. The UI Part isn't quite finished, but otherwise the git support works fine
[12:45] <santa_> fantastic
[12:46] <santa_> yofel: so you you take care of creating the repo with 2 branches? (but please don't merge them yet as we need to work out that later)
[12:47] <yofel> I'll first take care of creating the repo and integrating the bzr history. Once that's done we can talk about what to put into the other branch
[12:48] <santa_> allright
[12:48] <yofel> Riddell: what's your plan regarding qa.kubuntu.co.uk? Can we just keep it as it is for now or should we look for alternatives? (IIRC you're paying for that right now?)
[13:30] <Riddell> yofel: just keep it as it is, no need to change
[13:30] <yofel> yay, thanks!
[13:46] <cortex_> lol Riddell i seen you on the news
[13:46] <cortex_> on slashdot
[13:47] <cortex_> or hacker news
[13:47] <Riddell> I made slashdot?
[13:47] <cortex_> no sry hacker news
[13:47] <cortex_> hehe
[13:47] <Riddell> oh, not today
[13:48] <cortex_> 	Jonathan Riddell Stands Down as Release Manager of Kubuntu (kubuntu.org)
[13:48] <cortex_> yes
[13:48] <cortex_> Riddell: today
[13:48] <cortex_> 1 hour ago Riddell
[13:49] <yossarianuk> do people still slashddot?
[13:51] <yofel> it *is* still the best source of random flamewars on the net
[13:51] <yofel> although phoronix comes close
[13:52] <mamarley> Yeah, there are all sorts of KDE haters on Phoronix.
[13:52] <marco-parillo> I am more likely to learn something from slashdot comments than phoronix comments
[13:53] <yossarianuk> I don't understand the hate for Phoronix... It is a good source of news for desktop Linux. The comments section I do understand (but that goes for most sites that allow comments)
[13:54] <yossarianuk> the very worst (non tech) is the independent online newspaper - its a 'liberal' paper but the commentators would fit into Germany in the 1930's.
[13:55] <mamarley> At least for a while, Phoronix took a bunch of things mgraesslin said out-of-context or something of that sort.
[13:55] <yofel> well, he suffers from the same kind of "put out news fast without doing much of investigation" illness as /. (When it comes to the technical parts I agree)
[13:56] <shadeslayer_> https://twitter.com/rohangarg/status/657556109151109124
[13:57] <mgraesslin> yossarianuk: the problem is that phoronix does click-bait to attrackt the people in the forums. Putting out stuff controversial where there is nothing controversial just to get the people go nuts in the forum
[13:57] <mamarley> Nontroversies!
[13:58] <yofel> shadeslayer_: oh? Martins kubuntu experience scared you, eh? :D
[13:58] <mgraesslin> yossarianuk: a good example for this was the blog post about the critics on Plasma 5. It was on Phoronix before I for example noticed it on planetkde. From someone who he never had reported about. Clearly only for the forums posted, the more it attrackts discussion, the better
[13:59] <yossarianuk> mgraesslin: you wrote an article rebutting that I believe ?
[13:59] <mgraesslin> yossarianuk: yes I did, but the damage is done
[14:00] <mgraesslin> yossarianuk: and phoronix is to blame for stuff like "even KDE devs say it's not good", because he didn't check whether it's a dev who wrote it and just put it there
[14:00] <yossarianuk> I do get the clickbait/ads issue - however it is also a good source of desktop linux news, other than reddit there are not many alternatives.
[14:00] <mgraesslin> no need to correct a head line like that. Oh no, that's not what Phoronix would ever do
[14:01] <yossarianuk> mgraesslin: well thats just shoddy journalism..
[14:01] <mgraesslin> well it creates problems for us
[14:01] <mgraesslin> which is the reason why we don't like it
[14:02] <mgraesslin> not to mention the "benchmarks"
[14:02] <yossarianuk> I saw the article criticising plasma's theme compared to gnome - however most complaints seemed to resolve around the theme used in Fedora.
[14:02] <yossarianuk> i.e not breeze at all.
[14:02] <shadeslayer_> Benchmarks are cool k
[14:03] <shadeslayer_> They tell you exactly nothing and are a great way to pass your time
[14:03] <yossarianuk> the phoronix-test-suite does have 'some' uses...
[14:03] <shadeslayer_> Its like watching a movie
[14:03] <mgraesslin> shadeslayer_: let's benchmark your screen against my screen
[14:03] <shadeslayer_> Only worse
[14:03] <cortex_> os x ?
[14:03] <yofel> we could benchmark crash counts... ^^
[14:03] <cortex_> :P
[14:03] <shadeslayer_> Let's benchmark benches
[14:03] <cortex_> only kubuntu for me
[14:03] <cortex_> if it works
[14:03] <yofel> oh lol, people on phoronix giving distro name proposals "I hope he starts his own distro and calls it Kufucyu."
[14:04] <shadeslayer_> Can you benchmark benchmarks?
[14:04] <cortex_> my pc is weird
[14:04] <yofel> you could benchmarks different VMs that run benchmarks..
[14:04] <mgraesslin> oh a meta-benchmark
[14:05] <yossarianuk> can you name a better benchmark app though (aside from the odd game that has the feature built in)
[14:05] <yofel> ximion: :D http://www.phoronix.com/forums/forum/phoronix/latest-phoronix-articles/830530-kubuntu-s-release-manager-calls-it-quits?p=830554#post830554
[14:05] <yossarianuk> i mean better for benchmarking games/3d really.
[14:06] <ximion> yofel: oh, the Phoronix doomsday people are there :P
[14:06]  * ximion is happy about every new Tanglu user
[14:06] <yossarianuk> Kufucyu is actually semi-funny.
[14:07] <cortex_> very weird mint works
[14:07] <cortex_> and kubuntu not
[14:07] <cortex_> based on ubuntu..
[14:07] <yossarianuk> isn't mint older ?
[14:07] <cortex_> oh maybe
[14:07] <cortex_> yes
[14:07] <yofel> it's certainly not based on the dev release, so it is older, just not sure how much
[14:07] <yossarianuk> think mint is based on 14.04 LTS.
[14:08] <cortex_> i'm talkin about the live media
[14:08] <yofel> well, the same applies for that
[14:08] <mgraesslin> yossarianuk: don't benchmark games, it's useless. That gives as good results as doing tests for VW engines
[14:08] <yossarianuk> ha
[14:09] <mgraesslin> yossarianuk: the problem is that games detect they are run in benchmark mode
[14:10] <ximion> mgraesslin: how should one do benchmarks then? They are clearly useful sometimes...
[14:10]  * yofel remembers glxgears...
[14:10] <yossarianuk> they can prove themes though - i.e that enabling 'suspend desktop effects' and disabling vblank (nvidia) has a notable difference, etc
[14:11] <yossarianuk> however that is apparent by playing the game ...
[14:11] <mamarley> Disabling vsync also causes horrible tearing artifacts though. :(
[14:11] <yofel> depending on the game that's better than dropped frames..
[14:12] <mgraesslin> ximion: start with thinking about the problem you want to benchmark, then sit down and write the code
[14:13] <yossarianuk> mamarley: well with most fps steam games on my setup (i5 cpu/nvidia 450gts) most games are actually unplayable unless I disable disable 'sync to vblank'  with Nvidia-settings
[14:13] <yossarianuk> i mean not just more sluggish, you cannot aim, etc
[14:13] <mgraesslin> the problem is that this setting results in multiple syncs
[14:14] <mgraesslin> kwin syncs, nvidia sync
[14:14] <mgraesslin> boom half the framerate
[14:14] <yossarianuk> like the controls are really laggy - disabling 'sync to vblank' and game becomes playable.
[14:14] <yossarianuk> mgraesslin: that makes sense,
[14:14] <yossarianuk> note: same thing happens in other DE's not just KDe.
[14:15] <yossarianuk> KDE seems to be just as fast as any other for gaming (gnome3 used to be the worse until about 3.8.)
[14:16] <mgraesslin> that doesn't surprise me that that is a universal problem
[14:16] <mgraesslin> in my opinion: if you run a DE and a window manager for playing games, you do it wrong(TM)
[14:16]  * mamarley doesn't play games much, but when it does, he does it wrong™.
[14:16]  * mgraesslin needs to change that in future and make it clear that it only applies to X11
[14:18] <clivejo> for some reason gtk-recordmydesktop suddenly stopped working yesterday, any ideas why?
[14:19] <yofel> not if "stopped working" is the only information you can gather.. any output on the command line? any errors in dmesg?
[14:20] <mgraesslin> the moon moved, it's obvious, isn't it?
[14:21] <yofel> wasn't that butterflies? :D
[14:21] <yossarianuk> mgraesslin: whilst this subject is being discussed - my work PC with integrated intel GPU  (Xeon E3-1200 v2/3rd Gen Core processor Graphics Controller) by default had terrible issues with kubuntu 15.04
[14:22] <yossarianuk> not just screen tearing, it was like you were watching faulty analogue video - in some ways the most spectacular of GPU errors.
[14:22]  * mgraesslin remembers having bitched about Intel driver quality this week...
[14:22] <yossarianuk> I fixed that by turning 'tearing prevention' to -> never
[14:23] <yossarianuk> after that change no issues ever
[14:23] <yossarianuk> before it was random - i.e it would work for a day or so (sometimes) without issue, sometimes 5 mins after booting up...
[14:23] <clivejo> yofel: isnt stopped working a valid piece of feekback ?!?
[14:23] <yossarianuk> I have dual monitor setup also (which may be part of the cause)
[14:24] <clivejo> error 256 if that means anything to you
[14:24] <yofel> clivejo: I welcome you to triage a bug report that has "Doesn't work" as the only Text contents...
[14:24] <clivejo> LOL
[14:24] <genii> It's at times like these I wish the factoid "doesntwork" had not been deleted
[14:25] <clivejo> it did work, up until yesterday
[14:25] <clivejo> I blame the official release
[14:26] <yofel> yeah right, as if someone put code into the package that goes "if [ -n "$(lsb_release -d | grep develop") ]; then exit 256; fi"
[14:26] <yofel> does it not start at all?
[14:27] <yossarianuk> well if anyone complains about 2001 style (i.e the end sequence of the film) style GPU issues with plasma5/intel - ask them to set kde's tearing prevention to Never.
[14:28] <mamarley> I have a couple of systems with Intel GPUs running Plasma 5 and the Tearing Prevention set to "Full Scene Repaints" (the only way to completely get rid of tearing on Intel) and they don't have any problems.
[14:32] <yossarianuk> now that mesa is starting to support opengl4 with there be a opengl4 renderer ?
[14:32] <yossarianuk> (i've seen the post about vulkan - ie there is no real benefit using it for kwin)
[14:57] <palasso> Riddell: I'm with you :)
[15:07] <pursuivant> muon (master) v5.4.2-131-g4e5297a * Safa Alfulaij: notifier/MuonNotifier.cpp
[15:07] <pursuivant> Fix plural issues in notifier
[15:07] <pursuivant> There are some plural strings in notifier which are marked for translation by i18n instead of i18np.
[15:07] <pursuivant> REVIEW: 125423
[15:07] <pursuivant> http://commits.kde.org/muon/4e5297a18d649ace71b8e96d1ed2488cbe4af247
[16:20] <pursuivant> muon (master) v5.4.2-132-g94ef0ea * Aleix Pol: libmuon (17 files in 8 dirs)
[16:20] <pursuivant> Expose the resource size into the resourcesmodel
[16:20] <pursuivant> http://commits.kde.org/muon/94ef0ea1e9fcee6ef88d269b4c71adff5ede95b3
[16:20] <pursuivant> muon (master) v5.4.2-133-g44c1a9e * Aleix Pol: discover/qml (3 files)
[16:21] <pursuivant> Make it possible to sort the application list by size
[16:21] <pursuivant> Also make it the default when reviewing the installed applications
[16:21] <pursuivant> http://commits.kde.org/muon/44c1a9e51c0220378f9331164693796c929c5980
[16:52] <ahoneybun> how the heck do people use GNOME's file manager??? it's missing so many features
[16:53] <TJ-> It's a Gnome ... it is stunted growth :D
[16:57] <ahoneybun> XD
[16:57] <ahoneybun> yea I'm putting Kubuntu back on that laptop I think lol
[17:03] <ximion> ahoneybun: which feature are you mising?
[17:03] <ximion> (they're sometimes hidden nicely :P)
[17:21] <pursuivant> muon (master) v5.4.2-134-g08a4aae * Aleix Pol: discover/qml/InstalledPage.qml
[17:21] <pursuivant> Size sorting should be descending
[17:21] <pursuivant> http://commits.kde.org/muon/08a4aaebc13a19a834bad63015ec6095d5de5930
[17:51] <genii> Riddell: So where do we send you money for beer after this?
[17:59] <clivejo> send it c/o me ;)  Ill see he gets some of it :P
[17:59] <clivejo> minus a sampling and handling fee of course
[18:01] <genii> clivejo: Heh :)
[18:08] <genii> Guess I'll go with https://www.kde.org/community/donations/index.php
[18:13] <clivejo> yeah, probably best, or the rhanda sprint if you support their work
[18:15] <clivejo> oh its closed - https://www.kde.org/fundraisers/kdesprints2015/


[02:57] <anjilslaire> my local ISP just switched me from a static IP to PPoE and cut my connection from ~30mb real DL speed to ~3mb real
[02:57] <anjilslaire> and says its what all local retailers are providing, after "extensive market research"
[02:58] <anjilslaire> for $48 month
[02:58] <anjilslaire> gee, thanks  for giving me notice.
[02:58] <anjilslaire> and thats on a fiber connection
[03:00] <anjilslaire> I just called my local cable provider, and switched to their 10mb cable bundled to my TV, and it's only $32 for the internet half


[08:29] <tjaalton> 4.4.0-24.43 isn't tagged yet but already in updates?
[08:31] <apw> tjaalton, that would be an error, it is cirtainly tagged
[08:32] <apw> tjaalton, and my git repo says it is pushed
[08:32] <apw> tjaalton, though of course it is "off" the mainline because it is an emergency kernel
[08:32] <apw> tjaalton, so you need some git fetch --tags action
[08:34] <smb> apw, though that only gets me to -22
[08:35] <tjaalton> ah
[08:36] <tjaalton> yep fetch --tags shows it
[08:36] <apw> smb, that only gets you master at -22
[08:36] <apw> smb, it also gets you tags for -24
[08:36] <smb> apw, right both
[08:36] <apw> which is the new norm, that master only gets the latest released kerenl
[08:37] <apw> tjaalton, thats a limitation in the way git fetches tags, they are only automatically offered if a head you fetch points at them
[08:37] <smb> apw, oh darn. nm I fell victim to rmadisons sort order
[08:38] <smb> though xenial-updates semms to be -24
[08:38] <apw> smb, yeah they are actually in sort order
[08:38] <apw> smb, right, but also kamal has not yet merged back all the security updates, there being 40 odd packages to sort
[08:38] <apw> smb, so master is behind, but ... i did make sure the tags were pushed
[08:39] <tjaalton> apw: right, none of the current branches have that tag so it wasn't fetched
[10:06] <bdrung_work> hi apw. can you "share" launchpad bug #1233466 with your "friends"?
[10:06] <bdrung_work> ;)
[10:06] <pitti> bdrung_work, apw: so I have some objection to adding a rule like SUBSYSTEM=="cpu", ACTION=="add", DEVPATH=="/devices/system/cpu/cpu[0-9]*", TEST=="online", ATTR{online}="1"
[10:06] <pitti> this is just plain stupid
[10:06] <pitti> we woudl unconditinoally change a kernel default in userspace
[10:06] <pitti> if we actually want this, then this shuold just *be* the default
[10:06] <bdrung_work> udev upstream has the same opinion: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=78478
[10:07] <pitti> so IMHO this is a case of "change the kernel default", not "set default A here and B there"
[10:07] <pitti> (I have no strong objection for doing this as an SRU, just for devel)
[10:09] <apw> i am going to guess that upstream kernel will say exactly the same thing in inverse
[10:09] <apw> that adding memeory at the h/w level does not mean it is time to add it to the kernel pool
[10:09] <pitti> well, that's not a contradictory argument
[10:09] <apw> that that is a userspace decision, and therefore an administrator decision
[10:09] <pitti> I wasn't saying that the above behaviour is desirable/right
[10:10] <pitti> just that an unconditional rule doesn't make sense
[10:10] <pitti> we currently have this conditionalized only on Hyper-V (or some MS thing)
[10:10] <apw> i concur completely with that indeed
[10:10] <apw> this feels like a sprint kind of thing, with a handy sprint
[10:10] <pitti> so if the kernel's opinion is that hotplugged CPUs should not immediately be used, then we shoudln't add that udev rule either
[10:11] <pitti> I mean, obviously people stuff CPUs into machines because.. they don't want to use them :)
[10:11] <pitti> (j/k, there might be good reasons)
[10:12] <pitti> apw: sprint> so that we can improve our arguing by throwing candy around, clearly!
[10:13] <apw> yeah, in a real machine i can see you don't want it till you are ready, there might be risk involved
[10:13]  * pitti is looking forward to next week, I'm starting to get seriously under-hopped
[10:13] <pitti> ("hop'ed"? "hoped"?)
[10:14] <pitti> apw: ah, so maybe we might want to limit that to VMs only?
[10:15]  * bdrung_work nods. Not onlinening CPU and RAM in a virtual machine make no sense.
[10:15] <pitti> well, for that we'd first need to understand why it wouldn't make sense on a real machine
[10:15] <apw> in a VM you are almost cirtainely want it now and instantly
[10:16] <apw> well there is risk that those new cpus are not good, tehy are real and /w
[10:16] <apw> h/w so ... they may go in without incident but you migt pick a quiet time to online them
[10:16] <apw> maybe
[10:16] <pitti> ok
[10:16] <pitti> so then I like https://launchpadlibrarian.net/264002433/0001-Enable-CPU-and-RAM-hotplug-on-QEMU.patch better than https://launchpadlibrarian.net/264364580/0001-Enable-CPU-and-RAM-hotplug-on-QEMU.patch
[10:16] <apw> then again opening the box is risky too, so ... its all a bit pants
[10:19] <bdrung_work> if you risk hotplugging a real CPU, you probably want to risk onlining it at the same time.
[10:32] <apw> its the probabally part, so it needs to be at least controllable
[16:17] <xnox> apw, libseccomp is crazy
[16:21] <apw> xnox, most likley, it _is_ designed by security people
[16:22] <xnox> apw, so "kernel" fixed the crazy __PNR numbers for x32/i386/x86_64
[16:23] <xnox> yet libseccomp looses it's mind between name - positive integer - fake numbers
[16:23] <xnox> doesn't round trip them
[16:24] <xnox> and expects accept4 & 364 to result in different filtering results... which are the same syscall in new world order
[16:26] <xnox> https://github.com/seccomp/libseccomp/pull/41 & https://github.com/seccomp/libseccomp/issues/40
[16:26] <apw> sounds like you ahve a whole heap of fun to deal with
[16:28] <xnox> i wonder if i'll just backout sync to "v4.5 syscall table"
[16:29] <xnox> or e.g. i need v4.5 kernel.....
[16:32] <apw> its not at all clear how that works in the real world, moving calls around the syscall
[16:32] <apw> table, sounds like an abi violation
[17:13] <jtaylor> hi, I lost sound with the -24 xenial kernel update, the -22 my old one still works, is this already known?
[17:17] <apw> jtaylor, not that i am aware of
[17:23] <jtaylor> hm I'll file a bug then
[17:23] <jtaylor> I guess ubuntu-bug linux will put in all necessary logs?
[17:23] <ali1234> there's one specifically for sound
[17:24] <ali1234> "ubuntu-bug audio"
[17:25] <jtaylor> k thanks, rebooting back to the broken kernel
[17:38] <jtaylor> weird now its working again, so nevermind I guess
[18:40] <apw> jtaylor, oddness


[00:21] <bgamari> how does one update a single module without repackaging the entire kernel
[00:22] <bgamari> I'm currently getting errors along the lines of: [    8.967377] dell_laptop: no symbol version for dcdbas_smi_request
[00:22] <bgamari> [    8.967380] dell_laptop: Unknown symbol dcdbas_smi_request
[10:20] <Kano> hi, could you disable commedi? the s626 module always locks up on my systems with saa7146 dvd card
[10:22] <Kano> 05:00.0 Multimedia controller [0480]: Philips Semiconductors SAA7146 [1131:7146]
[10:22] <Kano> alias:          pci:v00001131d00007146sv*sd*bc*sc*i*
[10:22] <Kano> is in s626
[10:22] <Kano> and that locks up the system
[10:29] <Kano> usally controlled by budget-av
[10:30] <apw> sounds bad, that sounds like it needs a bug to remind me!
[10:31] <Kano> as all my systems have got dvb cards none will boot ubuntu
[10:32] <Kano> i prefer # CONFIG_COMEDI is not set
[10:33] <apw> may well be something a lot of people hit
[10:33] <apw> let me know the bug number and i'll have a look
[10:35] <Kano> maybe there is another solution, like a complete alias with 4 ids
[10:35] <Kano> just mailed the author
[10:35] <apw> cool
[10:35] <Kano> this is definitely too generic
[10:36] <Kano> all i can do is to disable it
[10:37] <Kano> sv*sd* is generic
[10:38] <apw> yeah it does seem rather overarching
[10:52] <Kano> CONFIG_HAVE_KERNEL_LZMA=y
[10:53] <Kano> how about using that? would not hurt at all
[10:55] <Kano> so rebooting to try without comedi
[11:21] <Kano> it of course boots without s626. but how about updateing ndiswrapper to 1.54
[11:21] <Kano> still 1.53 in there
[11:23] <apw> ndiswrapper is on the list for review
[11:24] <apw> kernel LZMA would potentially affect slow machines
[11:24] <apw> a
[11:24] <apw> and would need testing on those platforms to check for regressions
[11:24] <Kano> nobody mentioned that
[11:24] <Kano> i used that for -9 kernel for kanotix and really nobody metioned that it would be slower
[11:28] <amitk> Kano: how many users does Kanotix have?
[11:28] <Kano> not that many than ubuntu, but enough for me
[11:29] <amitk> Kano: I was just curious. The larger the test base, the better.
[11:33] <Kano> 118 kernel updates in logfile
[11:35] <amitk> I bet the majority of your users are very technical.
[11:35] <Kano> no
[11:35] <Kano> they just like better support
[11:37] <Kano> i provide support for fglrx for every kernel for example
[11:38] <Kano> nvidia of course too
[11:42] <Kano> also there are test image downloads with -9 kernel: 114 - 32 bit, 20 - 64 bit, 873 - combined, nobody mentioned slow loading speed
[11:43] <Kano> it is interesting that these images are not officially announced ;)
[11:46] <Kano> but rt2500usb seems to be really problematic
[11:46] <Kano> any launchpad entries for that yet?
[11:47] <Kano> i could fix one issue with removing ids from rt2500usb to use rt73usb for some cards, but those which are only in rt2500usb are still broken it seems
[11:48] <Kano> thats the only reason that somebody would downgrade currently
[11:48] <TheMuso> /c/c
[11:52] <Kano> http://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12309
[11:53] <ubot3> bugzilla.kernel.org bug 12309 in Block Layer "Large I/O operations result in slow performance and high iowait times" [High,Resolved: insufficient_data]
[11:53] <Kano> what do you think about this bug
[12:07] <Kano> so added the cfq-ioshedul patch
[12:07] <Kano> http://kanotix.com/files/excalibur/linux-2.6.30-generic/source/
[12:07] <Kano> you find all used patches there
[12:12] <Kano> one patch seems to miss there
[12:12] <Kano> to cp ieee headers
[12:14] <Kano> so now it is there...
[13:00] <apw> can anyone tell me which key the sysrq tag is on on a standard keyboard?  none of mine have it marked ... BAH
[13:00] <lifeless> apw: laptop?
[13:00] <Kano> print
[13:00] <lifeless> apw: printscreen button probably
[13:00] <apw> lifeless, all and every one of my keybaords oddly
[13:00] <apw> thanks both
[13:00] <lifeless> fn-f11 for my dell laptop that is in front of me
[13:01] <apw> very odd isn't it, having no label on the keyboard, and its not something you can play with once yo uneed it
[13:06] <apw> bugger, found it ... shame i chose 'b'
[13:07] <smb> lol, yeah s might be better :)
[13:34] <ncopa> could someone please help me find the build script source for linux-headers-*-generic package?
[13:34] <ncopa> want to look how they make that nice symvers, .config and symlinks to header dirs
[13:38] <rtg> ncopa: debian/rules.d/2-binary-arch.mk in the kernel git repo
[13:48] <ncopa> thanks
[16:14] <nixternal> anyone having issues with 2.6.30-10? black screen of death here...anything I can do to help triaging let me know..haven't found a bug yet concerning what I am seeing
[16:22] <amitk> nixternal: KMS enabled?
[16:23] <amitk> what graphics card, etc."
[16:23] <amitk> ?
[16:23] <nixternal> you are on the right track :)   intel
[16:23] <nixternal> and yes it is a kms problem
[16:23] <nixternal> I just did i915.modeline=0 and it works
[16:24] <rtg_> nixternal: KMS doesn't work with PAE
[16:25] <rtg_> (yet)
[16:25] <nixternal> gotcha
[16:25] <nixternal> hopefully that is planned
[16:25] <rtg_> its in 2.6.31
[16:26] <nixternal> groovy
[16:26] <nixternal> maybe a blog post should go out to prevent frustration from people who will be upgrading in karmic in the next day or so?
[16:27] <rtg_> nixternal:  upgrades should not encounter the issue, unless you're running -server with desktop installed.
[16:28] <nixternal> I am not running -server, it is -generic
[16:28] <amitk> curious
[16:28] <rtg_> nixternal: 2.6.30-10.11 ?
[16:28] <amitk> nixternal: cat /proc/version_signature
[16:29] <nixternal> 2.6.30-10.12
[16:30] <nixternal> Ubuntu 2.6.30-10.12-generic
[16:30] <amitk> nixternal: so PAE isn't enabled
[16:31] <rtg_> amitk: but KMS _is_ now enabled by default.
[16:31] <amitk> rtg_: true, but this particular case isn't because of a PAE/KMS conflict
[16:31] <amitk> nixternal: ubuntu-bug xorg
[16:31] <rtg_> nixternal: I wonder if your Xorg package is not up to date?
[16:32] <nixternal> very well could be
[16:32] <rtg_> nixternal: they have to be in sync
[16:34] <nixternal> xorg is 7.4~5ubuntu21 from the beginning of June
[16:35] <nixternal> this issue happened right before it came time to enter my 3rd encryption password
[16:35] <nixternal> after entering the 2nd password, the screen went black
[16:35] <Unggnu> hi all
[16:36] <Unggnu> Is there a reason why the sound driver power management is enabled per default in Karmic?
[16:36] <amitk> nixternal: you are running karmic kernel and xorg on jaunty?
[16:36] <nixternal> no, this is all karmic
[16:36] <amitk> Unggnu: to save power? :)
[16:36] <Unggnu> If you use headphones you really getting deaf through the clicking noise when it is enabled again
[16:37] <amitk> nixternal: please upgrade your entire system and if it still persists, file a bug using 'ubuntu-bug xorg'
[16:37] <Unggnu> Please don't do this automatically.
[16:37] <amitk> Unggnu: please file a bug to help us fix it.
[16:38] <Unggnu> ok
[16:39] <amitk> Unggnu: you can disable it in your /etc/modprobe.d options
[16:39] <Unggnu> I have disabled it through proc
[16:39] <Unggnu> or sys
[16:41] <amitk> Unggnu: You can also disable it /etc/modprobe.d/alsa-base.conf (line saying options snd-hda-intel power_save=10)
[16:41] <nixternal> amitk: I did a dist-upgrade already, got everything that is available right now
[16:41] <Unggnu> ok
[16:41] <nixternal> I will yell at Bryce and see what he is up to
[16:41] <amitk> hehe... ok
[16:45] <amitk> bjf_afk: having trouble compiling your kernel...
[16:47] <Unggnu> amitk: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/391182
[16:47] <ubot3> Malone bug 391182 in linux "Please disable Kernel sound power saving per default [Karmic]" [Undecided,New]
[16:48] <amitk> Unggnu: do you use a laptop?
[16:48] <Unggnu> Sure
[16:48] <nixternal> hahaha, amitk and rtg_: I didn't get the new initramfs-tools
[16:48] <Unggnu> I have also tested it in the past but disabled it because of this clicking
[16:49] <amitk> Unggnu: if so, the power savings can be quite substantial. In some cases almost 30-40mins of extra battery life.
[16:49] <nixternal> I just updated and got them and everything is working, though usplash is really small :)
[16:49] <Unggnu> amitk: Because of the sound card?
[16:49] <amitk> Unggnu: yes, the amplifiers, codec, etc.
[16:49] <Unggnu> amitk: My system uses not much power but the only important parts are cpu und display.
[16:50] <Unggnu> which really have an measurable impact if I remember correctly
[16:50] <Unggnu> and wlan of course
[16:50] <nixternal> I spoke to soon, at least I can hit all 3 encryption passwords now, but x is still dead
[16:50] <Unggnu> amitk: You can test it with powertop I guess
[16:51] <amitk> Unggnu: true. But try running your battery flat with and without the sound power savings.
[16:51] <Unggnu> I give it a shot :)
[16:52] <amitk> Unggnu: please post the battery life numbers to the bug, to allow us to judge how much the impact is
[16:57] <Unggnu> amitk: Anyway my ears would be more important for me than 1 W but I am testing :)
[17:00] <Unggnu> 7.6 W with sound power saving
[17:03] <Unggnu> amitk: 7.6W with sound power saving and ~8 W without but the higher cpu usage might be also a reason
[17:04] <Unggnu> or 7.9W something around
[17:04] <amitk> cool
[17:04] <Unggnu> Everyone who needs this little difference can enabled it on his own. A gui entry would be the best of course :)
[17:05] <amitk> Unggnu: I'll leave it to dtchen to decide that. But in general if we can simply blacklist the ones that don't work that would be nice.
[17:06] <bjf> amitk, I'm trying to clear up the last of the config differences between Jaunty and Karmic w.r.t. imx51
[17:06] <Unggnu> They work but there is  a reaction coupling if it gets enabled again which is very loud with head phones
[17:06] <bjf> amitk, I have not tried building for a bit, not surprised there are problems right now
[17:09] <amitk> bjf: ack
[17:10] <amitk> bjf: what I meant was it doesn't even start building. Asks me to run 'make mrproper'. Need to figure out what got hosed.
[17:11] <bjf> amitk, have not had that problem... however
[17:11] <bjf> amitk, I wonder if this is part of the config changes that were recently implemented
[17:12] <rtg_> amitk: isn't that 'cause you have cruft in your build root ?
[17:12] <bjf> amitk, in my working tree git says that I have made changes to other arch / flavour config files (I have not commited them)
[17:12] <amitk> rtg_: right. And I hard reset my tree. But no go
[17:13] <nixternal> amitk and rtg_: if I set 'nomodeset' by editing grub on bootup, everything works fine...fyi
[17:14] <rtg_> nixternal: I thought you said all worked fine after updating initramfs-tools?
[17:14] <nixternal> it started to work fine, but died when firing up X
[17:14] <nixternal> KDM
[17:27] <amitk> bjf: could you try 'debian/rules binary-generic' on your tree
[17:27] <bjf> amitk, i am having the same problem
[17:28] <jaro> Hi there. Is there any suitable channel to ask questions related to quite old (2.4) kernel? I'm fighting with waitpid() not working correctly in a multithreaded process
[17:28] <jaro> and would like to find out if there is any known solution for this
[17:28] <bjf> amitk, the way I got pat it is I did 'debian/rules editconfigs' and just answered 'yes' when exiting to saving the config
[17:28] <amitk> jaro: google would be your friend for such an old kernel
[17:29] <bjf> amitk, I could build after that
[17:29] <bjf> amitk, should I run updateconfigs?
[17:29] <jaro> amitk: i did use it and found out one discussion thread that proposes that there is no way how to fix it
[17:29] <bjf> just did that, let me commit those configs
[17:29] <jaro> amitk: I'd like to make sure that it is that way
[17:30] <bjf> amitk, ^^
[17:31] <amitk> bjf: yes, running updateconfigs is a good idea
[17:31] <bjf> amitk, ok, updates pushed
[17:31] <amitk> jaro: no one here will be able to help with a 2.4 kernel
[17:32] <bjf> amitk, wasn't expecting imx51 changes to ripple into the other config files
[17:33] <amitk> bjf: it should only touch the common arch files and common ubuntu files if it find the same options set in other arches
[17:34] <jaro> amitk: ok I thought so :-/
[17:36] <rtg_> amitk: 'missing' is also a matcvh
[17:36] <amitk> rtg_: aah, right. With apw's new patches
[17:37] <apw> whats up?
[17:37] <apw> bjf yeah if you make changes to any arch config it could trigger changes in other arch common files
[17:38] <apw> if they now collapse to the same value or the inverse
[17:39] <apw> bjf if you are worried about what its doing shove the diff into a pastebin and i can see if i think its mental
[17:39] <bjf> apw, no worries, just unexpected
[17:39] <rtg_> apw: it shouldn't make changes in other arch common configs. armel should only affect config.common.ubuntu, right?
[17:40] <apw> rtg_, no it can affect other commons, if it stops something being common to all arches
[17:41] <apw> or if something becomes common to other arches
[17:41] <apw> like turning on staging or something
[17:41] <apw> then they will drop from the commons and move up to the ubuntu, or visa versa
[17:41] <apw> all depends on the actual value
[17:41] <rtg_> apw: ah, right. I was thinking more about missing features.
[17:43] <apw> yeah its likely something more generci he has changed, rather than something imx specific, which yes should just gently slide up to ubuntu level without affecting the other arches.  if its not then its bust
[17:48] <bjf> apw, rtg_, I've emailed you both the patch just so you can see what changed
[17:49] <rtg_> bjf: I was just looking at the commit in your git repo
[17:50] <bjf> rtg_, you could do that also :-)
[17:52] <rtg_> apw: its interesting what happened to some of the configs. for example, CONFIG_CHARGER_PCF50633 was removed from config.common.ubuntu and was added to the various x86 configs. If it was missing in armel, why didn't it stay in the common config?
[17:53]  * apw waits for the email ... grrr
[17:54] <apw> it should have stayed ... which kernel is he based on?
[17:54] <apw> bjf, whats your current baseline?
[17:54] <apw> sha1 is fine
[17:55] <bjf> apw, it's off of karmic but probably a week old
[17:55] <apw> ok then you have amitk's changes and not mine so the effect will be different
[17:56] <apw> you may have trouble if you are not at the tip
[17:56] <apw> as the config split has changed
[17:56] <bjf> apw, so I'll need to rebase at some point and the another "updateconfigs"?
[17:56] <rtg_> bjf: ah, you definitely need a rebase.
[17:57] <apw> hopefully you have nice clean mods and only one updateconfigs in thee
[17:57] <apw> there
[17:57] <rtg_> yeah, drop the updateconfigs commit
[17:57] <bjf> rtg_, right
[17:57] <rtg_> before rebasing. 'rebase -i' is your friend
[17:57] <apw> if you find the rebase is a nightmare for the configs we may be able to do something clever using the generated configs
[17:58] <apw> as the configs are in the standard format in the middle of a split and we can compare those with some little mods
[18:01] <dupondje> the new kernel in Karmic is broken (2.6.30-10) ?
 dupondje: intel graphics and no /etc/X11/xorg.conf file by any chance? :D
[18:07] <dupondje> nvidia
[18:07] <dupondje> and a xorg.conf :p
[18:08] <Sarvatt> sorry, real common problem in the past hour :D whats wrong? no problems with it here
[18:09] <dupondje> well after grub2 loads
[18:09] <dupondje> it starts the kernel, and then I only get a "_" :p
[18:09] <dupondje> a blinking underscore :p
[18:11] <dupondje> brb, going to eat now :)
[18:15] <Sarvatt> i'm seeing the short flood of sleep: invalid number '0.1' on boot too
[18:16] <Sarvatt> oops wrong channel
[18:51] <bullgard4> I would like to make a proposal to improve the apport program somewhat.  --  Thank you.
[18:54] <amitk> bullgard4: i didn't mean to imply you were afraid, just that I am not completely sure. pitti is the person to talk to.
[18:54] <amitk> :)
[18:55] <bullgard4> amitk: I understood it just like this at the outset.  --  No worries.
[19:25] <dupondje> guys, initramfs-tools is broken
[19:30] <dupondje> nobody awake here ?
[19:38] <dupondje> cjwatson:  ?
[19:42] <dupondje> need him badly
[19:51] <MellowDude> hi i got a question about kernels
[19:52] <dupondje> shoot
[19:53] <MellowDude> i have a amd Athlon 64  cpu and i have ubuntu 32 bit os installed i was wondering what Kernel should i use the k7 or the k7-smp
[19:53] <ubot3> MellowDude: Error: Could not parse XML returned by Ubuntu: not well-formed (invalid token): line 378, column 84
[19:53] <dupondje> lol :)
[20:35] <maco> pdflush is going bonkers on my cpu. i hear that when this happens on ext4 it means "brace yourself for data loss" ...that true?
[21:39] <dtchen> maco: no.
[22:11] <freinhard> hi!
[22:12] <dtchen> freinhard: your best bet is to file a bug and e-mail the list
[22:13] <freinhard> dtchen: hey, didn't say anything concerning that yet ;)
[22:14] <freinhard> bug 384268, if desirable, i can take some time and do a debdiff
[22:14] <ubot3> Malone bug 384268 in linux-firmware "Firmware update for p54 and kernel >= 2.6.28 suggested" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/384268
[22:15] <Nafallo> oh hai! I think KMS got the resolution for my eeepc wrong. I guess the kernel is to blame more than X? :-)
[22:16] <dtchen> freinhard: debdiff wouldn't be as helpful as a git changeset reference; see http://kernel.ubuntu.com/git?p=ubuntu/linux-firmware-karmic.git;a=summary and http://kernel.ubuntu.com/git?p=ubuntu/linux-firmware-jaunty.git;a=summary
[22:58] <freinhard> dtchen: any suggestion where i should host the repo so you can pull from?