[07:35] <Kilos> helloooo za and inetpro
[08:43] <inetpro> oh hi oom Kilos
[08:43] <inetpro> and goeiemore to everyone else
[08:47] <inetpro> Kilos: google is your friend
[08:47] <inetpro> https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/6010255?hl=en
[08:47] <Kilos> nono  google hates me
[08:48]  * inetpro thought others gave you the headstart up there yesterday
[08:49] <inetpro> google "less secure access"
[08:49] <inetpro> that ^^ is all you needed to search for
[08:50] <Kilos> yes i went to that link but cant find where to do the less secure thing
[08:50] <inetpro> read
[08:51] <Kilos> i actually hate google and was tempted a few times to just delete my account now they make that option so conspicious
[08:51] <Kilos> i read for hours
[08:51] <Kilos> grrrr
[08:51] <inetpro> there's that section with the heading "Change account access for less secure apps"
[08:52] <Kilos> i dont see that
[08:52] <Kilos> lemme see on your link
[08:52] <Kilos> ty
[08:52] <inetpro> ai!
[08:55] <inetpro> it's not something they want you to do with good reason, it is less secure
[08:59] <Kilos-> yay ty inetpro after opening that link the second time i found the less secure stuff
[08:59] <Kilos-> sigh
[09:00] <Kilos-> i havent got the energy to struggle, stuff must just work
[09:14] <inetpro> Kilos-: but they gave you the answer
[09:14] <Kilos-> yes but why did it change
[09:15] <Kilos-> it was working fine
[09:15] <inetpro> 01/21 10:55:08 <inetpro> it's not something they want you to do with good reason, it is less secure
[09:16] <Kilos-> sigh, im struggling here last few days so you gotta be patient sir
[09:16] <inetpro> Google may block sign-in attempts from some apps or devices that do not use modern security standards. Since these apps and devices are easier to break into, blocking them helps keep your account safe.
[09:17] <Kilos-> ok
[09:17] <Kilos-> now my 2 gmail acounts have the same password but only one is accepted in tbird
[09:18] <Kilos-> other one same hassle
[09:18] <Kilos-> oh
[09:18] <Kilos-> i gotta do the less secure there as well
[09:18] <Kilos-> yaya ok man
[09:18] <inetpro> haha see, you answered your own question even
[09:19] <Kilos-> hahaha
[09:33] <Kilos-> ai! now its doing like imap and downloading all my mails
[09:33] <Kilos-> sigh
[09:34] <Kilos-> will take days
[09:34] <Kilos-> over 5000 on each account
[10:20] <inetpro> Kilos-: your own fault
[10:21] <inetpro> you cleared your Thunderbird profile, if I understang correctly
[10:21] <inetpro> s/understang/understand/
[10:21] <Kilos-> yes
[10:21] <Kilos-> i fetched old .thunderbird from desktop so that might cut it down a bit
[14:02] <inetpro> Kilos-: what's with the funny tail?
[14:02] <inetpro> did you resolve your troubles?
[14:20] <Kilos-> yes ty inetpro just deleting thousands ai!
[14:20] <Kilos-> but at least its working again
[14:21] <Kilos-> ty very much
[14:21] <Kilos> this connection keeps dropping , stupid cellc and voda
[14:21] <Kilos> they got a good rate though
[14:22] <Kilos> 1k for 100gig
[14:22] <Kilos> or 1499 for 200 gig
[14:22] <Kilos> ian was using telkom 10 gig for 1k
[14:23] <Kilos> eish domdonner still downloading , already at 9000 mails
[16:21] <inetpro> So looks like Twitter decided to do a hard rename of @potus -> @potus44, and create a fresh fork at @potus ...
[16:21] <inetpro> https://twitter.com/narayanarjun/status/822669150212554753
[16:21] <inetpro> interesting decision
[17:33] <inetpro> Kilos-: raining here now after one big bang a few minutes ago
[17:36] <superfly> It's not raining here now, but it looks like it may rain later today
[17:48] <superfly> morning Kilos-
[17:48] <superfly> er, Kilos
[17:52] <superfly> Ah yes, here's the rain
[17:53] <superfly> in fact, it's hailing
[17:54] <Kilos> haha raining here as well atm
[17:54] <Kilos> big storm
[17:54] <Kilos> hows my fly
[17:55] <Kilos> and fsmily?
[17:55] <Kilos> family
[18:02] <superfly> we're all good.
[18:02] <superfly> slowly settling in with everything
[18:03] <superfly> Going to an Installfest with the AZ LoCo on the 28th
[18:26] <Kilos> hi nsnzero kulelu88
[18:26] <Kilos> thats great superfly at least you have some time on your hands now
[18:34] <nsnzero> hi kilos
[18:51] <superfly> Kilos: meh. I am not doing much, which is really frustrating me at the moment. I have a desk coming this afternoon, so from this weekend I'll be able to set up my "office" and do more stuff, which will make me feel a lot less frustrated.
[18:51] <Kilos> lol
[18:54] <nsnzero> hi superfly
[18:54] <superfly> hey nsnzero
[18:57] <nsnzero> i think i have the worlds most untidiest desk - its just files and papers everywhere
[18:58] <superfly> I've had the same from time to time
[19:00] <nsnzero> who has the time to clean nowdays - everything is just deadlines
[19:02] <Kilos> sjoe inetpro 17 or 18 thousand deleted alread on one mail account and 6 on another
[19:02] <Kilos> remind me never to delete .thunderbird everr again
[19:04] <nsnzero> thats alot Kilos
[19:06] <Kilos> yeah years of mails back to 2014 now
[19:06] <Kilos> i think i should sleep on my error
[19:07] <superfly> Kilos: um, yeah, that wasn't the cleverest thing to do
[19:07] <Kilos> hehe
[19:07] <Kilos> night all. sleep tight
[19:08] <Kilos> see ya morrow
[19:14] <nsnzero> goodnight Kilow
[19:14] <nsnzero> goodnight Kilos , my apologies
[19:18] <kulelu88> rule of thumb: never delete anything in /home/


[00:30] <ubuntuuk-planet> [Jono Bacon] VPSs, Ubuntu, and Juju - http://www.jonobacon.org/2012/11/10/vpss-ubuntu-and-juju/
[01:30] <ubuntuuk-planet> [Stuart Langridge] Practical CSS3: Develop and Design, a book review - http://kryogenix.org/days/2012/11/10/practical-css3-develop-and-design-a-book-review
[09:22] <apacheuk> morning, know its early in the morning, but I have a fresh install of 12.10 and I've noticed I seem to be using what I think is a high amount of available ram, I have firefox running 2 tabs (g+ and twitter) evolution running and xchat, I'm currently using 1.3gb of my 2gb available
[09:23] <apacheuk> does that sound normal for unity?
[09:36] <jacobw> it doesn't sound normal, but unity does uses more resources than non-compiz based desktops
[09:37] <jacobw> compiz uses more resources and performs worse than other compositors or no compositor
[09:39] <jacobw> apacheuk: my MATE desktop is currently using 800M of RAM, i can see in gnome-system-monitor that firefox is using 115M and it's plugin-container is using 200M
[09:47] <apacheuk> hmm, only thing I did differently this time was install the 64bit version, which I got by mistake but figured it was worth a try.... maybe switch back to the 32bit version
[09:48] <jacobw> RAM consumption doesn't usually worry me as long as the desktop is responsive and load is below 1
[09:49] <apacheuk> I run a Oracle database in a VM, so I need as much RAM as possible :)
[09:50] <apacheuk> soon as my current backup finishes I think I might switch back to the 32bit version, before I install the rest of the software I use daily
[10:02] <apacheuk> having said that my laptop which is running the same version is running about the same, so maybe that is normal, might have to order some more RAM
[10:03] <popey> apacheuk, how are you determining how much ram is in use?
[10:05] <apacheuk> basically using free -m on the command line
[10:06] <jacobw> available ram = used - cached
[10:09] <apacheuk> output from command line http://paste.ubuntu.com/1347335/
[10:09] <apacheuk> does that mean I'm actually using 1849-1150 ?
[10:14] <directhex> installing ubuntu on a netbook stumbles at the first hurdle: startup disk creator is an unstable POS
[10:16] <MartijnVdS> it is?
[10:16] <jacobw> apacheuk: 1849 - 669, '-/+ buffers/cache: 1150 852' shows you what's available after subtracting buffers and cache from used
[10:16] <directhex> it is.
[10:17] <directhex> the "erase" button causes a popup "org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Did not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application did not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was broken." for example
[10:17] <popey> not had that
[10:18] <popey> bug 559524
[10:18] <lubotu3`> Launchpad bug 559524 in usb-creator (Ubuntu) "org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply" [Undecided,Expired] https://launchpad.net/bugs/559524
[10:21] <directhex> had to kill my session. stray udisks processes killed it
[10:23] <directhex> dum de dum, still stuck on "installing bootloader"
[10:25] <directhex> this is a bust. i'll create the installer from windows.
[10:25] <popey> it takes a while
[10:25] <popey> progress bar lies
[10:26] <directhex> i gave it 10 minutes the first time.
[10:28] <apacheuk> jacobw, done some reading on the free -m command, think I can see a memory upgrade in my near future
[10:47] <directhex> worked first try on windows w/ pendrive linux creator
[10:57] <brobostigon> good morning everyone.
[11:21] <zleap> hi
[11:21] <zleap> AlanBell, thanks for the cd's arrived today (well picked up from post office today)
[11:36] <AlanBell> yay
[11:53] <kvarley> How on earth does Unity 3D work out of the box on Ubuntu 12.10? That's awesome!
[11:59] <popey> heh kvarley
[12:00] <kvarley> popey: 8 years on and Ubuntu is still amazing me :)
[12:01] <DJones> AlanBell: Wondered if you'd seen this? http://prupert.co.uk/2012/11/08/build-your-own-baby-monitor-revisited/
[12:10] <AlanBell> I have retired from babies
[12:13] <AlanBell> wow, he did *nothing* apart from use it in the way it is intended to be used and the BBC did an article about it
[12:17] <jacobw> it's a camera that happens to be watcing a baby
[12:20] <AlanBell> yeah
[12:21] <AlanBell> the "hack" is that he didn't purchase it from Mothercare
[12:56] <AlanBell> think I might rewrite my camera controller as a python script that serves a port directly, then run that on a raspberry pi
[14:28] <kvarley1> popey: Have you got the Steam overlay to working with Minecraft?
[14:29] <popey> the what?
[14:29] <popey> i have no idea what steam overlay is
[14:30] <kvarley1> popey: You're in the Steam beta, right? The overlay is what is brought up when you press Shift and Tab when in a Steam game
[14:32] <zleap> hi
[14:32] <popey> oh
[14:32] <directhex> kvarley1, minecraft isn't a steam game though
[14:32] <popey> but minecraft isn't a steam game
[14:33] <zleap> i have connected a raspberry pi with a static ip address to a netbook connected to a wireless lan via dhcp if i try and ssh in to the pi i get no route to host
[14:33] <kvarley1> popey: Yes, but you can add non-Steam games to your library and then the overlay works on them usually.
[14:33] <BigRedS> popey: zleap your netbook needs to have a route for the pi
[14:33] <directhex> zleap, correct.
[14:33] <zleap> yeah
[14:33] <zleap> how do i do that
[14:33] <directhex> zleap, there's no route for that to work
[14:33] <BigRedS> else it'll try to get out on the default route (normally your router), which isn;t where the pi is
[14:34] <zleap> ok
[14:34] <directhex> zleap, however, there's connection sharing support in network manager, if you go back to dhcp everywhere
[14:34] <zleap> so i need to set route to the address of the pi
[14:34] <BigRedS> what's the IP address off the pi and which interface is it plugged into?
[14:34] <zleap> <IP_ADDRESS> via eth0
[14:34] <zleap> well the network interface of the netbook
[14:35] <BigRedS> eth0?
[14:35] <zleap> yeah
[14:35] <zleap> sorry not that good with networking
[14:35] <BigRedS> Haha, nor i :)
[14:36] <BigRedS> Is the 'normal' network also 192.168.1.x?
[14:36] <zleap> yers
[14:36] <zleap> and the subnet seems the same as at home too
[14:38] <BigRedS> yeah, it's easiest if you make it different. If you do that and create a, say, 192.168.2.x network on your ethernet socket (with an IP address from that range on the pi) it might even Just Work
[14:38] <zleap>  ok
[14:38] <zleap> i have no access to the pi atm  at a lug meet
[14:39] <zleap> its just plugged in adn on,  connected via a cable
[14:40] <directhex> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Internet/ConnectionSharing
[14:43] <zleap> ty
[14:56]  * penguin42 notes http://www.ebuyer.com/395305-zoostorm-desktop-pc-7873-1071 doesn't actually have a serial port - http://www.treblig.org/pics/noserial.JPG
[14:57] <hamitron> penguin42, a lot don't now, do they?
[14:58] <penguin42> hamitron: Indeed - but this one says it does on the ebuyer page which is why I chose it
[14:58] <hamitron> :(
[15:04] <popey> no it doesn't
[15:05] <popey> it says it has a serial port _header_
[15:05] <popey> oh, it doesnt :)
[15:05] <popey> thats bad
[15:23] <AlanBell> penguin42: if you have an old motherboard with a serial port you can probably unsolder it from that and solder it on to the header dots on the new one
[15:24] <AlanBell> or . . get a USB serial port and forget about the one that isn't really there on the motherboard
[15:31] <ali1234> noe
[15:31] <ali1234> that's an IDC header
[15:31] <ali1234> just clean out the solder and put in the header
[15:31] <ali1234> i do it all the time
[15:37] <kvarley> I have an AMD-4455M in my laptop and everything works on Ubuntu 12.10 aside from HDMI audio output. Any ideas on what I can do to diagnose the problem?
[15:40]  * popey wonders how audio would work there
[15:40] <popey> http://askubuntu.com/questions/138177/upgraded-to-12-04-now-no-audio-over-amd-hdmi
[15:40] <popey> http://askubuntu.com/questions/67113/fast-video-playback-with-no-sound
[15:41] <kvarley> popey: I'll give them a go, thanks :)
[15:43] <kvarley> popey: If this fixes it I'll be surprised. Can it really be that simple? Reboot, bye.
[15:44] <MrKrinkin> hello
[16:05] <cocoa117> anyone using bcm43xx wifi chipset on Ubuntu 12.04? is there region setting in the driver? i can't see my 5Ghz N network, i can see them in Win7 on the same machine
[16:05] <ali1234> there probably is
[16:05] <ali1234> check dmesg for entries about CRDA
[16:07] <cocoa117> ali1234, enn, can't see it in dmesg
[16:07] <ali1234> well it should be in there somewhere
[16:08] <kvarley> popey: Tried that and as soon as I play a sound via HDMI it freezes the laptop. Disabled it and rebooted and now HDMI appears in the sound settings of Ubuntu which is weird, same issue though.
[16:08] <cocoa117> ali1234, what's crda stand for?
[16:09] <ali1234> central regulatory domain agent
[16:11] <cocoa117> ali1234, should i use open source driver?
[16:11] <ali1234> don't know
[16:16] <penguin42> AlanBell: Yeh assuming it's connected
[16:22] <ali1234> it definitely will be connected
[16:23] <ali1234> don't try to use an old connector though... you'll just have problems
[16:23] <ali1234> you need either a solder sucker or a very fine (0.5mm) drill
[16:23] <ali1234> solder sucker is better
[16:24] <ali1234> plus one of these http://www.rkonlinestore.co.uk/ekmps/shops/rkeducation/images/e-row-straight-pcb-header-plug-pack-of-2-572-p.jpg
[16:24] <ali1234> and one of these http://www.lindy.co.uk/pc-back-plate-serial-adapter-9-way-d-male-11-wiring/33135.html
[16:25] <penguin42> ali1234: Yeh I've got the backplate
[16:26] <penguin42> ali1234: I'll only attack it with a soldering iron if I don't find another solution; I've asked ebuyer to send me a pci-e serial card which would seem fair
[16:26] <ali1234> yeah
[16:26] <ali1234> i do this mod on just about every piece of hardware i buy :)
[16:26] <ali1234> mainly routers
[16:27] <ali1234> AlanBell: that IP camera you have has an internal serial port on it too
[16:27] <penguin42> most things do
[16:28] <AlanBell> ali1234: yeah, it has
[16:28] <AlanBell> I was just about to order another one
[16:28] <ali1234> will be 3.3V though
[16:28] <penguin42> close enough ;-)
[16:29] <ali1234> not for PC, they are +/- 12V
[16:29]  * penguin42 notes Comet's massive stock clearance seems to just be 10% off across the board, with some 15 or 20%
[16:29] <penguin42> ali1234: Yeh, depends how fussy they feel
[16:29] <ali1234> you need a level shifter, and those often don't work with USB serial
[16:30] <penguin42> yeh, usb-serials are very hit and miss - hence why I don't want to go there
[16:59] <ali1234> how do you add/remove effects in openshot?
[16:59] <AlanBell> you put them in the timeline
[16:59] <AlanBell> or between two timelines
[17:00] <penguin42> anyone having problems in gimp - not letting you move the new toolbar window?
[17:00] <ali1234> how do you remove them though?
[17:00] <ali1234> also, how to you apple an effect only to a specific area on the video?
[17:01]  * penguin42 guesses that's apply
[17:01] <AlanBell> oh, sorry I was thinking transitions
[17:02] <AlanBell> right click the clip with the effect, go to properties, there is an effects tab
[17:02] <AlanBell> with all the effects you dropped on the clip and you can tweak them there
[17:03] <ali1234> i see
[17:03] <ali1234> how do you undo the razor tool?
[17:03] <ali1234> and hw to you do "razor at current marker?"
[17:05] <ali1234> ah you right click the marker and "slice all clips"
[17:05] <AlanBell> not sure how to rejoin clips
[17:06] <AlanBell> you can just but them up together and they will play fine
[17:08] <ali1234> yeah but then you can't do an effect over a group of clip
[17:08] <ali1234> only all or one
[17:08] <ali1234> the way i fixed it was delete the secnd clip and then adjust the length on the first
[17:08] <AlanBell> to make an effect fade in and out you can duplicate a clip and sync it on the next timeline without the effect and fade between them
[17:10] <ali1234> i don't want it to fade
[17:10] <ali1234> i want to cover up some user emails in a screen cast i just recorded
[17:10] <ali1234> but i can't find a way to just cover up part of the video with an effect
[17:13] <ali1234> ok, done it with mask
[17:13] <ali1234> why can't effects stack?
[17:14] <ali1234> like if i do mask + pixelated it should pixelate only the areas covered by the mask
[17:15] <AlanBell> I think you need to do that with multiple timelines
[17:17] <ali1234> well i've just blocked it with a black rectangle, that's good enough
[17:18] <AlanBell> probably duplicate the video, have one blurred, one normal, and use mask to show one through the other
[17:18] <cocoa117> ali1234, found crda with open source wifi driver
[17:18] <cocoa117> ali1234, what's next? how to set the region and what file should modify?
[17:19] <ali1234> you can't modify crda, that's the whole point
[17:20] <cocoa117> ali1234, so what should be done then
[17:20] <ali1234> well if it is really caused by crda, change your access point to use a channel that is allowed
[17:21] <wen234> anyone know how to create a chart in libreoffice calc from raw data
[17:22] <wen234> I have some raw data like a column of about 100 mixed, M and F answers - how can I create a chart with the results counted. I.e. 20 M and 30 F.
[17:22] <cocoa117> ali1234, so there is nothing can be done on the client side?
[17:22] <ali1234> not if the AP is misconfigured
[17:23] <ali1234> if the region is wrong in your wifi card you probablyneed some obscure windows hacking tool to fix it
[17:23] <AlanBell> ali1234: yeah, mask, inverted, plus blur on the top clip, then a duplicate clip on timeline 2 with no effects
[17:24] <ali1234> AlanBell: i see, that kinda makes sense in a weird way
[17:24] <ali1234> i'll tyr it when the video is done exporting
[17:25] <cocoa117> ali1234, en, on the same machine with win7, it can see the 5Ghz network
[17:26] <AlanBell> and you can use a transition between them to make the blur start and stop in an interesting way
[17:26] <AlanBell> star wipe \o/
[17:28] <czajkowski> AlanBell: can you ring my phone I seem to have misplaced it in the apt and cannot find  it :s
[17:28] <czajkowski> pleas
[17:28] <czajkowski> e
[17:32] <czajkowski> found it :/
[17:33] <ali1234> AlanBell: it does not work
[17:34] <ali1234> oh wait, yes it does
[17:34] <AlanBell> :)
[17:35] <AlanBell> if you apply 0.05 blur in the mask settings that softens the edges of the area too
[17:36] <ali1234> i'm using a pixelate effect
[17:36] <ali1234> so no need
[17:37] <AlanBell> ah, ok
[17:37] <AlanBell> blur is quite sweet, you can set the start and end blurriness
[17:38] <AlanBell> so you can push a region out of focus gradually
[17:45] <Laney> evening
[17:54] <popey> pip pip
[17:55] <zleap> can i hash out lines in /etc/network/interfaces ?
[17:55] <zleap> so i can keep the static ip settings in the file and use dchp at home
[17:56] <ali1234> hmm openshot still does that thing where it cuts of the last second of the video
[17:56] <Laney> I could (a) play games, (b) figure out rrdtool and get graphs going from the currentcost, (c) laze around on the sofa
[17:56] <Laney> WHICH WILL IT BE?
[17:56] <penguin42> c
[17:57] <Laney> quite likely isn't it
[17:57] <popey> Laney, i already did (b) for you
[17:58] <Laney> i already wrote a C program which parses the XML
[17:58] <popey> http://popey.com/~alan/house/scripts/
[17:58] <popey> ah okay :)
[17:58] <popey> I use perl
[17:58] <Laney> however
[17:58] <popey> reluctantly
[17:58] <Laney> that is useful because I currently don't know how rrdtool works
[17:59] <Laney> 16.9
[17:59] <Laney> 00174
[17:59] <Laney> the current temp and wattage
[18:00] <popey> http://popey.com/house/ erk
[18:00] <popey> washing machine and tumble dryer both on :S
[18:00] <popey> ~5KW
[18:00] <Laney> wow
[18:01] <Laney> the y axis on the longer term graphs is too small so i can't tell what your baseline is
[18:01] <penguin42> popey: Any idea what they each take, and does your washer heat the water or does it take hot in?
[18:02] <popey> i haven't individually checked each, no
[18:02] <penguin42> nod
[18:02] <AlanBell> my cooker can draw 52 amps
[18:03] <penguin42> heck
[18:04] <AlanBell> yeah
[18:04]  * penguin42 occasionally wonders if there is a more energy efficient way to cook rice pudding; they take about 90mins
[18:05] <AlanBell> I bought it, planning to install it myself
[18:05] <AlanBell> saw that in the manual and chickened out
[18:05] <penguin42> AlanBell: I hadn't realised they were that high - yeh I'd want someone who undestood high current stuff
[18:06] <AlanBell> induction hob
[18:06] <penguin42> ah
[18:06] <penguin42> AlanBell: So does that go on one 60A circuit or something?
[18:07] <AlanBell> yes, new fat cable back to the consumer unit
[18:07] <penguin42> through a socket or direct?
[18:07] <AlanBell> direct
[18:08] <AlanBell> there is a chunky switch too
[18:08] <penguin42> nod; I think you can get 63A commando sockets - not sure if you're allowed to use them in a home
[18:08]  * popey makes a bacon double cheeseburger for tea
[18:08] <popey> yay, we have an induction hob
[18:08] <popey> love it
[18:08] <AlanBell> the electric oven that it replaced just plugged in to a socket
[18:09]  * hamitron has one of them small induction hobs to go on the work surface, for his chip pan
[18:11] <AlanBell> czajkowski: I mentioned earlier that Laura had lost her phone, the kids said "auntie Laura, or geek Laura?"
[18:15] <czajkowski> lol
[18:16] <popey> :)
[18:18] <czajkowski> laura was a bit addled while packing up things and packed her phone :/
[18:18] <AlanBell> packing \o/
[18:19] <czajkowski> not exactly the same emotion here :)
[18:22] <popey> where you going?
[18:23]  * czajkowski is going to aldershot
[18:23] <czajkowski> same landlord as before, just moving to his other house near the train station
[18:24] <popey> oh cool
[18:24] <popey> just down the road
[18:27] <czajkowski> :)
[18:35] <popey> Daviey, another victim for co-working space :)
[18:37] <czajkowski> :)
[18:57] <christel> czajkowski: when do you move again? first week of december? :)
[18:58] <christel> popey: didnt you convert your garage? :)
[19:02] <czajkowski> christel: yup I have the keys from the 24th
[19:02] <czajkowski> of novemeber
[19:02] <christel> \o/
[19:02] <czajkowski> but that's the weekend my sister is over so may just get a zip car on the tuesday and drive down
[19:02] <popey> christel, not finished
[19:03] <christel> i went and looked at some offices in farnham the other day but they were way too large for just m e
[19:03] <christel> me*
[19:04] <AlanBell> did you see the clockhouse offices christel?
[19:04] <christel> yes
[19:04] <AlanBell> any good?
[19:05] <christel> fine (boringly dull in a magnolia kind of way but entirely clean/tidy/modern looking etc)
[19:06] <czajkowski> christel: add some graffiti art to any wall and it brightens it up
[19:06] <AlanBell> boringly dull sounds perfect to me
[19:06] <christel> :)
[19:06] <christel> you guys looking to move already?
[19:06] <AlanBell> I like an office that contrasts with my sparkling personality
[19:06] <christel> ah yes, i guess you Need More Space when you hire another alan
[19:06] <christel> haha
[19:07] <AlanBell> we just turned down a bigger suite in the Granary, we don't need it yet (and it was quite a bit more money)
[19:07] <christel> *nod*
[19:07] <AlanBell> interviewing two people next week, neither of them are called Alan.
[19:07] <christel> yeah, the smallest office i viewed was 400/pcm (all inclusive) for about 100sqft
[19:07] <czajkowski> bah ireland were winning against SA
[19:07] <czajkowski> bah
[19:07] <christel> it was slightly smaller than yours i think but differently shaped
[19:08] <AlanBell> christel: that is not far off what we are paying, but to go bigger we would be looking at 800+vat
[19:08] <popey> outrage!
[19:09] <czajkowski> rob..
[19:09] <christel> *nod*
[19:09] <czajkowski> oh wait wrong channel
[19:09] <czajkowski> :p
[19:09] <christel> thats a pretty hefty jump
[19:09] <AlanBell> which is fine, but we can keep the one we have with three people for a bit
[19:10] <christel> *nod*
[19:12] <christel> im slightly on the fence, i want to rent an office but at the same time it would be kind of pointless for me to rent an office and go sit in an office on my own all day when my main motivator is the fact that i get dreadful cabin fever (more so since moving out in the sticks i guess)
[19:12] <christel> though i guess i could go for lunchtime wanders and STARE at people :D
[19:14] <brobostigon> migrate the office to a pub. :)
[19:14] <czajkowski> christel: could you approach a business and ask to rent a desk off them?
[19:14] <czajkowski> liek where G wrks?
[19:14] <christel> brobostigon: i sometimes do, but then i end up on the vodka ;)
[19:15] <brobostigon> christel: lol, it isnt such a bad idea, but yes, has its downsides, :)
[19:18] <SuperEngineer> 63
[19:20] <SuperEngineer> it's 6 less than 69... no point... just like the fear of moving
[19:22] <christel> czajkowski: czajkowski dunno, i dont really know any random businesses with space (gareths work is struggling for space and impractical anyway, what with being both a client of mine and a competitor) ;)
[19:23] <Yellowwinner> hi
[19:24] <AlanBell> hi Yellowwinner
[19:25] <czajkowski> christel: ah yes true
[19:26] <czajkowski> christel: guarantee though f you put and add up saying you were looking to share space/rent space youd find somewhere
[19:26] <christel> possibly, im still holding out for popeys garage collapsing so that he'll look for a coworking space with me instead ;)
[19:27] <christel> (I MIGHT OR MIGHT NOT BE PLANNING TO REMOVE STRUCTURAL ELEMENTS TO MAKE THIS HAPPEN)
[19:28] <czajkowski> lo
[19:28] <czajkowski> l
[19:29] <Yellowwinner> hey everybody I am working on a game on ubuntu and I need some help with somethings (like graphics) and I want to know if someone wants to help me.
[19:29] <Yellowwinner> thanks
[19:30] <popey> Yellowwinner, ali1234 or gord may be able to help
[19:30] <ali1234> heh
[19:30] <ali1234> i'm not much good at drawing
[19:30] <popey> well, depends on the question of course :D
[19:31] <popey> i may have misunderstood the question then :)
[19:31] <popey> ali1234, mpt or ev on irc are the people I mentioned on G+
[19:31] <AlanBell> need more details
[19:31] <Yellowwinner> just a sec I will pull up the fourm link
[19:31] <Yellowwinner> that I made
[19:34] <Yellowwinner> http://www.thatbigforum.com/post220701.html#p220701
[19:34] <ali1234> popey: yeah, already looked them up, cheers. they're not online, i guess it's the weekend, or i was looking the wrong channels.
[19:35] <popey> hmm, minecraft.net down..
[19:35] <Yellowwinner> yea i checked minecraft and it was down :C
[19:35] <popey> yeah, looking at evs facebook he's eating a delicious burger in london somewhere :)
[19:35] <czajkowski> I know
[19:35] <czajkowski> I want that burger so much
[19:35] <czajkowski> bar the cheese
[19:36] <Yellowwinner> here is my game post
[19:36] <Yellowwinner> http://www.thatbigforum.com/post220701.html#p220701
[19:50] <aaast> BLOATWARE SMELL IS KILLING ME SOFTLY
[19:50] <aaast> IKONIA IS RIGHT, MAYBE IT IS WAY TOO SMELLY TO EVEN MENTION IT.   TV claims to have one SCART socket "for input only"
[20:02] <SuperEngineer> hmmm... if you know SCART sockets you alsoknow they're 2 way!
[20:02] <SuperEngineer> TV sound now playing through surround sound sys :)
[20:03] <ali1234> well scart are always wired up different :)
[20:04] <SuperEngineer> ali1234: yup... rule 1 know your SCART... make it your friend ;)
[20:04] <AlanBell> davmor2: up for beer/food on Thursday still?
[20:04] <soreau> silly european engineering ;)
[20:08] <SuperEngineer> next step... get extra vga cable... use [so far never touched] kvm switch and switch video from monitor to TV at will ;)
[20:10] <ali1234> hmm a KVM can do that?
[20:10] <SuperEngineer> ...& leave pc output going through the sound system [tv built in audio not good]
[20:11] <SuperEngineer> ali1234: ooo yes it can... use the "v" [video] connection only... leave keyboard & mouse in control of pc
[20:11] <ali1234> yeah... you;re using it backwards too though, right?
[20:11] <ali1234> i guess VGA is analogue
[20:12] <SuperEngineer> nope.
[20:12] <ali1234> nope?
[20:12] <SuperEngineer> pc video out
[20:12] <SuperEngineer> going to monitor or tv
[20:12] <ali1234> a KVM is generally used with two PCs and one monitor though
[20:13] <ali1234> so you connect the PC video out to the output of the KVM, and then the monitor and TV to the two inputs? hence using it backwards
[20:13] <SuperEngineer> ...or oc, server etc going to 1 monitor... in that sense - you are right - I'm using it backwards ;)
[20:13] <SuperEngineer> but i *am* SuperEngineer I guess
[20:14] <AlanBell> SuperEngineer: if you have composite video out then it probably works as a dual head setup
[20:14] <ali1234> ew composite
[20:14] <AlanBell> so you can have your monitor on, and the tv as a second (low resolution) screen
[20:14] <ali1234> just get a graphics card with two VGA, or DVI+VGA
[20:15] <AlanBell> yeah, much better off using hdmi/dvi if your telly can do that
[20:15] <SuperEngineer> AlanBell: exactly that... I only want to use it to view get-iplayer'd videos of f1 races etc
[20:15] <ali1234> i was thinking VGA for the TV actually
[20:15] <ali1234> if it's scart
[20:16] <AlanBell> didn't know you could feed VGA to scart
[20:16] <AlanBell> it has RGB and it has composite
[20:16] <ali1234> RGB is low refresh rate VGA
[20:16] <SuperEngineer> AlanBell: no hdmi on pooter :(  [I'm going for near zero cost option here]
[20:16] <ali1234> you need some magic but it is possible
[20:17] <ali1234> basically a sync combiner and a graphics driver that lets you do super low res modes - they should all do it now, because i reported bugs on them all
[20:17] <ali1234> sync combiner = 1 transistor
[20:17] <ali1234> and ATI cards i think don't even need that
[20:17] <lazarus_> Python (v2.7) requires to install plugins to create media files of the following type: MPEG-1 Layer 3 (MP3) encoder how do i fix this issue on ubuntu 12.10 64bit
[20:18] <SuperEngineer> ...& the SCART bit is a separate "thing"... trhat was tonight's projext re sound
[20:19] <SuperEngineer> ... the pc to TV is not going to use the SCART... pc is sending it's own sound signal to sound sys separately
[20:19] <ali1234> http://www.nexusuk.org/projects/vga2scart/circuit
[20:19] <SuperEngineer> ooo
[20:21] <SuperEngineer> ..as in video output through vga to TV, sound output to sound sys via audio out signal to the surround sys
[20:21] <SuperEngineer> [yedh... I'm a cheap skate!] ;)
[20:23] <SuperEngineer> in fact - for cost of 1 extra vga cable [have other spare 1 required in car boot, so free]... pc to tv for £1-vga-cable
[20:24] <ali1234> if TV has VGA, by all means use it. the VGA to SCART is only really suited to old CRTs that can't do VGA native
[20:24] <SuperEngineer> ali1234: agreed
[20:25] <ali1234> and for those it is very nice eg if you use mythtv on it. te picture looks like it does with a STB. you can't get that any other way.
[20:27] <ali1234> also good for retro emulaton
[20:28] <ali1234> since it's pixel accurate... and those old 8 bit machines actually relied on that to get their full colour space
[20:29] <ali1234> eg VICE actually has PAL emulation for this reason - though you don't need it with a real CRT
[20:29] <SuperEngineer> ali1234: talking of retro emulation...
[20:30] <ali1234> yes?
[20:31] <SuperEngineer> does/is it possible to use games emulator ROMs from windoze in a linux environment - i.e Ubuntu
[20:31] <ali1234> sure
[20:32] <ali1234> they are just ROM dumps
[20:32] <Bassetts> The ROMs will work on any platform as long as you have an emulator for your platform
[20:32] <ali1234> there are standard formats for each target system and all emulators support the most common ones
[20:32] <ali1234> regardless of host platform
[20:32] <SuperEngineer> ... MAME ok I assume
[20:32] <SuperEngineer> ?
[20:32] <ali1234> yeah , fine
[20:33] <ali1234> it's the same software
[20:33] <SuperEngineer> cool, thanks
[20:34] <ali1234> the only place you might have problems is with snapshots or freeze or state files, and to a lesser extent memory card files. those usually aren't compatible between different emulators
[20:34]  * SuperEngineer downloads MAME
[20:34] <SuperEngineer> ...only 1 way to find out
[20:34] <ali1234> but if it's just a port of the same softwae even that should be ok, barring endian issues... which you won't run into going between two OS on the same hardware
[20:35] <SuperEngineer> :)
[20:36] <ali1234> hmm i think i am seeing the effect of these "delayed error reports"
[20:36] <ali1234> just got a crash message from openshot. i quit it about 2 hours ago
[20:36] <ali1234> and why does "show details" still take absolutely forever?
[20:42] <df___> jpds,ping
[20:44] <df___> I have Ubuntu running on my laptop, but currently I am dual booting
[20:45] <df___> can anyone help me set up Ubuntu on a virtual box to save room on my laptop?
[20:48] <StevenR> hrrm.. does someone here have a nexus 7?
[20:48] <AlanBell> df___: virtualbox is kind of easy, just like installing on a real machine. Not sure how it helps save room though
[20:48] <df___> jpds, are you home
[20:48] <AlanBell> !weekend
[20:48] <lubotu3`> It's a weekend. Often on weekends the paid developers and a lot of the community may not be around to answer your question. Please be patient, wait longer than you normally would or try again during the working week.
[20:49] <df___> thanks alanbell
[20:51] <df___> AlanBell: I currently have two operating systems installed on my laptop. Would running a virtual box enable me to save room by uninstalling my Ubuntu operation system
[20:52] <AlanBell> depends how much diskspace you give it really
[20:52] <df___> ah
[20:52] <AlanBell> if you have a 20gig partition for Ubuntu now, and you remove that and make a 20GB virtual machine, you haven't really made a heap of difference
[20:52] <df___> I wish there was a way to run my iTunes on Ubuntu
[20:52] <popey> StevenR, i do
[20:52] <df___> because I would then just use the one operating system
[20:53] <StevenR> popey: how do you find it? I'm considering buying one... partially for standing in my kitchen with recipies on it, also for other stuff
[20:53] <AlanBell> ask Apple to support it on Ubuntu
[20:54] <popey> StevenR, its okay :)
[20:54] <df___> AlanBell: lol.....not sure it that would happen
[20:55] <AlanBell> dunno, it happened on Windows somehow
[20:55] <AlanBell> but anyhow, it is their problem
[20:55] <popey> +1
[20:55] <popey> same for adobe photoshop
[20:56] <AlanBell> I should think it would suit Apple quite nicely to split the windows competition across two platforms
[20:57] <AlanBell> if Apple stopped supporting Windows for iTunes, and twisted Adobe's arm into doing the same and switching to Ubuntu as the compeition they wanted to compete with then that would be really interesting
[20:57] <StevenR> popey: does it behave just like a "big android phone" or is there more to it?
[20:57] <AlanBell> StevenR: we have one for the kitchen, it is quite popular
[20:58] <df___> AlanBell: Not so much a problem rather thank an inconvenience. Basically I prefer to use Ubuntu. But before my Ubuntu days I purchased all of my music and media from Apple. I recently bought a computer with windows pre installed. I just want to be able to listen to my music while I am working on Ubuntu
[20:58] <AlanBell> does recipes, music to a bluetooth music receiver plugged into some speakers, and does angry birds
[20:59] <AlanBell> <insert rant about DRM, lock in and proprietary platforms here>
[20:59] <popey> StevenR, i guess
[20:59] <popey> I am not a fan of android tbh
[21:00] <Daviey> hater!
[21:01] <df___> AlanBell: I would love to see Apple on Ubuntu but I do not think this will happen :)
[21:01] <AlanBell> if I was in charge of Apple that is the first thing I would do
[21:03] <StevenR> df___: close your laptop lid, place an apple on the closed lid. Apple on Ubuntu. DONE. :D
[21:03] <AlanBell> "people who are not our customers appear to be giving money to our competitor, lets stop that happening"
[21:06] <df___> StevenR: lol that was funny
[21:06] <df___> thanks guys
[21:06]  * StevenR makes a big sign saying "AlanBell for Apple CEO 2013"
[21:07] <AlanBell> yay
[21:08] <zleap> hi oly
[21:46] <penguin42> StevenR: Given the rate at which the Beeb are going through bosses, it might be an easier starting point
[21:51] <StevenR> penguin42: I suppose AlanBell could take over the beeb this year, and that would give him a run up to take over apple in 2013
[21:53] <penguin42> sounds easy for him
[23:28] <cocoa117> anyone know why i can see the 5ghz list in my iwlist eth1 channel, but i can't see it on my wifi network list of my 5ghz network
[23:28] <cocoa117> i mean 5ghz AP
[23:33] <xnox> cocoa117: same here with intel wifi n. I guess the card doesn't support it.
[23:34] <xnox> cause i can only connect to lower onces.
[23:34] <penguin42> yeh I've had similar behaviour
[23:34] <cocoa117> xnox, do u mean card driver don't support it? i am using propertory driver
[23:34] <penguin42> there's a bug somewhere for it
[23:34] <cocoa117> penguin42, bug in the network-manager?
[23:34] <xnox> cocoa117: no, the hardware doesn't support it.
[23:35] <cocoa117> xnox, my hardware does support it
[23:35] <cocoa117> xnox, i can access 5ghz band width with win7 on the same machine
[23:35] <xnox> cocoa117: i see.
[23:35] <cocoa117> xnox, it used to work with older version of ubuntu
[23:35] <penguin42> cocoa117: Possibly bug 974674 - but I could swear there was an olderone
[23:35] <lubotu3`> Launchpad bug 974674 in linux (Ubuntu) "8086:4229 Unable to connect to 5Ghz Wireless Network Intel 4965" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/974674
[23:36] <cocoa117> now it just don't work with 12.04
[23:36] <penguin42> oh I'd seen it on 10.04, I've not tried 12.x on that network yet


[02:34] <n-iCe> hi
[07:08] <Monisa> i am using lubuntu 18.04, system freezes randomly, any solutions please.
[07:13] <Monisa> Hello everyone, I am using Lubuntu18.04, My system gets hangs randomly. any solutions?  Systems gets very heavy but still the mouse is movable. after a minute the systems is freezed completely.
[17:20] <MrOlsen> So I just got lubuntu installed took a little bit to get sound working, but i can't get it to auto rotate the screen.
[17:21] <MrOlsen> I think it's not detecting the internal gyro and I honestly dont know what the device is.. it's a winbook so it's not well documented. I should have made notes before i removed windows :/
[20:31] <n-iCe> hi


 hi, im having trouble with Outlook Exchange Web App
[08:16] <bazhang> ubuntu got outlook
[08:16] <bazhang> sweet
[08:16] <rww> no, but it has a web browser last I checked
[08:17] <rww> and surpringly, Outlook Web App is a web app
[08:21] <Tm_T> ...which is quite IE-dependent, or was last time I checked
[08:22] <rww> nope
[08:22] <rww> iirc it works better under IE, but is fine under Firefox
[08:23] <Unit193> Correct.
[09:27] <Tm_T> works yes, I recall at some point half of the functionality wasn't there though
[14:28] <Myrtti> same ip
[14:28] <Pici> da
[14:30] <bazhang> the length of the ops list almost crashed my IRC
[14:31] <bazhang> stdin?
[14:31] <bazhang> hehe
[16:22] <Pici> 5 people use irssi.
[16:22] <Pici> also pi is exactly 3
[16:22] <bazhang> held back answer: how long is a piece of string
[17:03] <bazhang> Prezident> somsip: linux kernel is built on unix kernel.
[17:04] <bazhang> his info is getting wronger and wrongererer
 i'm not actually using ubuntu anymore. i'm on arch mainly, but i'm installing debian on another system right now and it asked me to choose a mirror
[17:15] <k1l> totally the time to join #ubuntu and start ranting
[17:17] <bazhang> better than linus owns 10% of the kernel
[17:18] <k1l> Bl4ckD34-: hi
[17:21] <bazhang> he;s trying to prove linux is simply a rewrite of unix
[17:21] <k1l> he should state that to the lkml :)
[17:21] <bazhang> heheh
[17:22] <bazhang> and PS android is LINUX
[17:22] <k1l> !guidelines > Prezident
[18:07] <io> chokoit aka snardbarfulator in -ot == bad news
[18:07] <bazhang> Prezident> You can try #ubuntu-kde fspkwon91
[18:08] <bazhang> augh
[18:08] <bazhang> super duper bad news instabannage bad news
[18:08] <io> I don't have my handy dandy scripts available to me and I can't do it manually because too forgetfull
[18:08] <io> forgetful also
[18:08] <bazhang> heh
[18:09] <bazhang> prezident is so far wrong as to almost come around to right again
[18:09] <io> phunyguy: forget the guidelines. he is a troll4life
[18:09] <io> thank you
[18:10] <phunyguy> oh, common issue?
[18:10] <bazhang> eternal
[18:11] <bazhang> tag team!
[18:11] <io> 3 way
[18:11] <bazhang> slow draw mcgraw
[18:15] <bazhang> "whonix"
[19:11] <bazhang> (it's the App Store for Ubuntu)
[19:11] <bazhang> we are doomed
[21:36] <k1l_> Hello, I am trying to dualboot Windows 98 and Lubuntu.... what?


[01:33] <someone_> I can't find kubuntu 16.04.5 on kubuntu.org although ubuntu 16.04.5 has been released .
 Looks fine to me.
 Torrent and direct link is set.
 someone_
 @someone_, https://kubuntu.org/getkubuntu/  «< it's listed here 2nd item down ???
[01:48] <someone_> I checked yesterday it was 16.04.4 now it is 16.04.05
[01:49] <someone_> Ok , which command shows version details ?
 cat /etc/os-release
[01:53] <someone_> IrcsomeBot Thank you so much .
[07:01] <anarchotaoist> Hello! I have been searching for a QT based web browser that can install Mozilla or Chrome add ons. There does not seem to be one. When the plasma integration addon comes to Kubuntu does this mean Firefox/Chrimium etc will be able to integrate with the DE like a QT browser (Falkon) does?
 @Anarcho It will do the things listed here: https://www.kde.org/announcements/plasma-5.13.0.php
 but it is not the same as plasmazilla fireofox builds
 @Anarcho Taoist, No, it does not change the UI font. If by 'dolphin layout' you mean in the file open/save dialogue etc, then again not it doesn't do that. Those require rebuilding Fireofox after patching it's source code, which is what the unnofficial plasmazilla try to do.
 plasmazilla is a 3rd party build in a ppa somewhere though, so does not have the Ubuntu update and security support the official Ubuntu or Mozilla builds of Firefox do
 some people use it and say great, but be aware of that
 @acheronuk morning lol.
 o/
[10:01] <IrcsomeBot1> <Anarcho Taoist> @tipmebchbot
 http://emosurf.com/st/00f0nipA/post/7627 … Кошки – это пушистая жидкость, есть доказательства!
[10:42] <BluesKaj> Howdy all
[14:27] <IrcsomeBot1> <Phil Linux> @ZebedeeBoss, We've all been there... 😂
[15:56] <EdgyMC_69> Hi. Does anyone else have a problem with two displays when they are on a different elevation? Sometimes notifications show on the height of the primary display instead of the one they are being shown and it looks weird.
[16:00] <EdgyMC_69> https://i.imgur.com/BDhljQD.png Looks like that
[16:02] <EdgyMC_69> Okay. I have changed the primary output to no primary output and it works as it should.
[16:02] <EdgyMC_69> Sorry for bothering.
[17:28] <IrcsomeBot1> kankan ray was added by: kankan ray
[17:28] <IrcsomeBot1> <kankan ray> E: The repository 'cdrom://Kubuntu 18.04.1 LTS _Bionic Beaver_ - Release amd64 (20180725) bionic Release' does not have a Release file. what does it mean?
[17:30] <IrcsomeBot1> <kankan ray> is anybody here?
[17:33] <BluesKaj> kankan ray, how did you burn the iso ?
[17:34] <IrcsomeBot1> <kankan ray> usb using ubuntu default writer
[17:35] <IrcsomeBot1> <kankan ray> i haven't got any update
[17:35] <BluesKaj> did you unmount the device first if you used the terminal ?
[17:36] <IrcsomeBot1> <kankan ray> but everytime run update this messege showed up
[17:36] <IrcsomeBot1> <kankan ray> @BluesKaj, no
[17:36] <BluesKaj> or was it k3b?
[17:36] <IrcsomeBot1> <kankan ray> no
[17:36] <IrcsomeBot1> <kankan ray> startup disk creator
[17:37] <BluesKaj> kankan ray, have you ever tried dd?
[17:37] <IrcsomeBot1> <kankan ray> dd means?
[17:38] <BluesKaj> !dd
[17:38] <IrcsomeBot1> <kankan ray> no
[17:38] <BluesKaj> !info dd
[17:38] <BluesKaj> hmm
[17:38] <IrcsomeBot1> <kankan ray> what does this messege means actually?
[17:39] <BluesKaj> dd is bit to bit method of copying iso and partitions etc
[17:40] <IrcsomeBot1> <kankan ray> E: The repository 'cdrom://Kubuntu 18.04.1 LTS _Bionic Beaver_ - Release amd64 (20180725) bionic Release' does not have a Release file. what to do with that? any solution?
[17:42] <IrcsomeBot1> <kankan ray> (Photo, 1280x719) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/oCCRrdWs/file_9469.jpg
[17:51] <BluesKaj> kankan ray you can use this command in the terminal  (without the quotes) "dd if=/dev/cdrom of=/home/userj/someCD.iso" , where if=inputfile and of=outputfile
[17:52] <BluesKaj> but make sure you unmount the target device (your usb stick) first


[10:05] <Scary_Guy> wow, copper?  someone needs to get the FTC to go after them like Head-On
[10:08] <Scary_Guy> greg-g I got a bluetooth OBDII thing too, two in fact.  I had it with me in the car but didn't know where the port was on the car to use it.  Was going to look at it when I got to where I was going, but where I was going was apparently the side of I-94 westbound
[10:08] <Scary_Guy> almost made it to the M-12 exit just before the stupid football bridges
[10:09] <Scary_Guy> anyway I'm hoping it works with the two offerings F-Droid has.  They're generic Chineese and a pretty blue color too (even though it isn't a fashion show, I kind of still like it to look nice)
[10:09] <Scary_Guy> the other one is for my dad's van
[10:09] <Scary_Guy> which is a year older than my car
[10:34] <cmaloney> mornng
[12:14] <Scary_Guy> hey
[12:44] <_stink_> yo


[15:18] <jo-erlend> is it possible to make changes to help.ubuntu.com/10.04/serverguide still, or is that too frozen?
[15:36] <mattgriffin> brb
[15:39] <mattgriffin> back
[15:55] <Kangarooo> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingProgramCrash what in there means ~i in aptitude search '~i' | fgrep -e '-dbg' ? i run this command and it doesnt give anything


[04:54] <desrt> smspilla1: hey
[04:54] <desrt> smspilla1: mfisch is trying to track down a bug whereby on ubuntu, gdk_beep() doesn't do anything
[04:54] <mfisch> g'day smspilla1
[04:54] <desrt> smspilla1: mutter has code that intercepts the beep and either displays it as a visual flash and/or causes libcanberra to play a beep sound
[04:54] <desrt> http://git.gnome.org/browse/mutter/tree/src/core/bell.c
[04:55] <desrt> smspilla1: does compiz have a plugin to try to do something similar?
[04:55] <mfisch> smspilla1: under ubuntu, the beep only works if a) pcspkr module is loaded and b) xset b on was run
[04:55] <desrt> he may not quite be awake yet.  he's on the west coast :)
[04:56] <desrt> or he may be at lunch.  i guess it's noon there.
[04:57] <mfisch> desrt: timezone website says 1pm
[04:57] <mfisch> desrt: that's about beer-o-clock in .au on a friday ;)
[04:58] <desrt> mfisch: it's actually 7:30 in that case
[04:58] <desrt> they hang their clocks upside down in australia
[04:58] <desrt> mfisch: could also be that he actually decided to go to school today :)
[05:01] <pitti> Good morning
[05:04] <RAOF> desrt: There's a longstanding bug on compiz for that.
[05:04] <smspilla1> desrt: yes
[05:04] <smspilla1> desrt: its not on by default
[05:04] <smspilla1> desrt: I also need to ask you something
[05:05] <smspilla1> desrt: is there any reason why, after an execvp (), writing to a pipe that is O_CLOEXEC (that I set up at the start of my main loop) on a signal causes the relevant gmain source not to have its prepare () function called ?
[05:05] <smspilla1> (I'm using glibmm if there are any known issues there)
[05:06] <smspilla1> desrt: school is also finished :p
[05:06] <desrt> smspilla1: hold on a second.  it's taking me a little while to parse that sentence :)
[05:06] <smspilla1> mfisch: but yeah, you're looking for ..
[05:06] <desrt> smspilla1: so if you execvp() then you no longer get to write to your O_CLOEXEC pipe...
[05:06] <desrt> that's sort of the point
[05:07] <desrt> so i think i'm misunderstanding the question
[05:07] <smspilla1> desrt: right, well, I call pipe () as soon as I set up my main loop
[05:07] <smspilla1> so it  gets set up again no problem
[05:07] <desrt> the mainloop no longer exists after the exec...
[05:08] <desrt> the entire old process image gets blown away
[05:08] <smspilla1> oh, sorry I forgot to add
[05:08] <smspilla1> we are execvp()'ing ourselves
[05:08] <smspilla1> (apparantly you're supposed to do it on SIGHUP)
[05:08] <smspilla1> (minor detail ;-))
[05:08] <smspilla1> and if I test it with something like write (myPipeWriteEnd, "h", 1); and then do poll (myPipeWriteEnd) poll () returns and I can read data from the pipe
[05:08] <desrt> so if all your fds are O_CLOEXEC and you're exec()ing, it doesn't matter
[05:08] <desrt> it's as if you started fresh
[05:08] <smspilla1> but glib never calls the prepare function after execvp
[05:09] <desrt> smspilla1: can i see some code?
[05:09] <smspilla1> desrt: yeah, maybe I included too much irrelevant information
[05:09] <smspilla1> desrt: sure
[05:09] <desrt> smaller is better, as always :)
[05:09]  * smspilla1 snickers
[05:10]  * desrt prefers the exit-on-SIGHUP approach (and wait until dbus reactivates you)
[05:10] <smspilla1> mfisch: https://github.com/hypodermia/compiz-bell-plugin
[05:10] <smspilla1> desrt: ok, hang on
[05:11] <smspilla1> desrt: I think the SIGHUP probably comes from the X Server in this case
[05:11] <smspilla1> compiz was written before dbus really existed
[05:11] <desrt> smspilla1: you should get that plugin in the distro...
[05:11] <smspilla1> desrt: yeah I should, it keeps dropping off my stack
[05:11] <desrt> smspilla1: waiting for dbus activation isn't really appropriate for a window manager, either :)
[05:11] <desrt> mfisch: problem solved, then.... (as soon as smspillaz finds time)
[05:11] <smspilla1> desrt: and weirdly enough david was opposed to it because it was "putting too much stuff in the compiz process"
[05:11] <smspilla1> mfisch: oh on that
[05:12] <smspilla1> mfisch: you're probably going to have to remind me every day
[05:12] <smspilla1> :)
[05:12] <smspilla1> this thing has a tendency to drop off my stack
[05:12] <desrt> smspilla1: hey
[05:12] <desrt> smspilla1: did you remember about the compiz bell plugin?
[05:12] <smspilla1> desrt: what's a bell ?
[05:12] <smspilla1> successful troll is successful
[05:13] <desrt> +1 counter-troll
[05:14] <desrt> smspillaz: you have until i'm done brushing my teeth and flossing
[05:14] <desrt> then i'm going to bed :p
[05:14] <smspillaz> kk
[05:15] <smspillaz> the awkward moment where you can't find your own code
[05:17] <smspillaz> ah here we go
[05:18] <smspillaz> desrt: https://code.launchpad.net/~smspillaz/compiz-core/compiz-core.fix_894639-test
[05:18] <smspillaz> (its still pushing to it sadly)
[05:19] <smspillaz> desrt: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~smspillaz/compiz-core/compiz-core.fix_894639-test/view/head:/src/screen.cpp#L166
[05:19] <smspillaz> so if I do poll on signalPipeFds[0] it returns and says there's stuff that's ready
[05:20] <smspillaz> but the relevant source for it which is
[05:20] <smspillaz> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~smspillaz/compiz-core/compiz-core.fix_894639-test/view/head:/src/screen.cpp#L288
[05:20] <smspillaz> never actually gets called
[05:20] <smspillaz> but *only* after an execvp
[05:21] <smspillaz> so execvp -> set up pipe -> set up source -> signal -> closeDown -> write -> (prepare not called)
[05:21] <smspillaz> as opposed to the normal startup case where prepare is called
[05:21]  * mfisch is catching up...
[05:22] <smspillaz> (I am writing to it from the signal handler btw, since that's the only safe way I think think of delivering the fact that the signal happened to the main loop)
[05:22] <smspillaz> (while the main loop is still polling for events)
[05:22] <smspillaz> (whihc never actually wakes up in the case I'm testing it in because we're using a fake X server to do compiz testing)
[05:23] <desrt> closeDown() is in the signal handler?
[05:23] <smspillaz> yeah
[05:23] <desrt> asprintf supposedly because it's signal-safe?
[05:23] <smspillaz> for debugging
[05:23] <mfisch> RAOF & smspillaz: do you have a bug number for the beep issue?
[05:24] <smspillaz> mfisch: not one off the top of my head
[05:24] <mfisch> smspillaz: would it be against compiz?  I'll go look around
[05:24] <desrt> smspillaz: okay... let me get this straight
[05:24] <desrt> smspillaz: you have a pipe pair marked as O_CLOEXEC
[05:24] <smspillaz> yes
[05:24] <desrt> and you write to the write end
[05:25] <desrt> then immediately call execvp()
[05:25] <smspillaz> uh, no
[05:25] <desrt> okay.  good.
[05:25] <smspillaz> its more like
[05:26] <smspillaz> pipe -> mainloop -> SIGHUP -> closeDown -> write -> mainloop -> (signal pipe wakes up) -> g_main_loop_quit () -> execvp (ourselves) -> repeat -> SIGTERM -> write -> mainloop (source never gets prepare called)
[05:26] <RAOF> mfisch: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/301174
[05:26] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 301174 in pulseaudio "Use proper sound event instead of system beep" [Wishlist,Fix released]
[05:27] <smspillaz> (I have another question about g_main_loop_quit but I'll save that for later)
[05:27] <mfisch> RAOF: thanks.
[05:27]  * mfisch goes to bed satisfied
[05:27] <desrt> mfisch: nite
[05:28] <smspillaz> desrt: I guess if there's no obvious "no you can't do that" I should probably single step gmain.c to see what the problem is
[05:29] <smspillaz> I'm guessing its probably a problem with my code
[05:29] <smspillaz> in some very weird way
[05:29] <desrt> i just don't understand what could possibly be the difference between a normal exec and the re-exec
[05:29] <desrt> unless you foul up the argv or the environment
[05:29] <desrt> exec is pretty much a clean-start
[05:30] <smspillaz> yeah, that's whats confusing me too
[05:30] <desrt> argv, the environment or leaked file descriptors should be the only thing that goes across
[05:30] <smspillaz> ok, single stepping it is then
[05:30] <smspillaz> desrt: also meant to ask
[05:31] <smspillaz> desrt: If you have sources A, B and C, and B and C are stuck in poll () and have never been dispatched before and then A gets an event and calls g_main_loop_quit ()
[05:31] <smspillaz> is it normal that B and C remain stuck in poll and the mainloop doesn't actually quit ?
[05:31] <desrt> smspillaz: you may be interested to know that glib has unix signal watches these days
[05:31] <desrt> smspillaz: see g_unix_signal_add()
[05:31] <smspillaz> desrt: cool, I'll look into that
[05:32] <smspillaz> (the documentation says "if there are sources still waiting to be dispatched, g_main_loop waits on them)
[05:32] <smspillaz> (so right now I have this awkward workaround which immediately dispatches and force fails all sources as soon as a g_main_loop_quit happens)
[05:33] <desrt> smspillaz: it doesn't really work like that...
[05:33] <desrt> assuming you have no threads, poll() is only ever running when nothing else is running
[05:33] <smspillaz> s/stuck in poll/returns to poll/
[05:33] <desrt> so if you're calling g_main_loop_quit() then, by definition, nothing is stuck in poll
[05:33] <desrt> nah..
[05:33] <smspillaz> hm ok
[05:33] <desrt> the loop won't poll again after g_main_loop_quit()
[05:34] <smspillaz> thats at least what I've obvserved
[05:34] <desrt> there was a race about that before
[05:34] <desrt> but only when threads were involved
[05:34] <desrt> and i think the race is fixed now
[05:34] <smspillaz> hmm
[05:34] <smspillaz> ok, I'll have another look
[05:34] <smspillaz> desrt: It could be that glibmm's Glib::MainLoop::quit () is broken
[05:35] <mfisch> desrt & smspillaz: thx for the assistance
[05:35] <desrt> mfisch: no prob
[05:35] <desrt> smspillaz: imho, glibmm is not worth the trouble
[05:35] <desrt> i'd just use glib's C API directly from C++
[05:35] <smspillaz> desrt: yeah I've noticed some ... weird stuff about it
[05:35] <smspillaz> desrt: though the C API is awkward to use directly
[05:35] <smspillaz> or at least, it doesn't fit our object model that well
[05:35] <desrt> smspillaz: the C API is awkward to use from C too :)
[05:36] <smspillaz> desrt: I think glib is just awkward really
[05:36] <smspillaz> or maybe I'm awkward
[05:36] <smspillaz> and glib is really cool
[05:36] <desrt> glib is pretty good for what it is
[05:36] <smspillaz> :p
[05:36] <desrt> it's pretty hard to make C look like an object-oriented language though
[05:36] <desrt> so some awkwardness is necessarily implied :)
[05:38] <smspillaz> desrt: http://images.cheezburger.com/completestore/2011/12/1/d5fb6962-c9c0-4095-8bcb-9a9140340b66.jpg
[05:38] <smspillaz> :3
[05:39] <smspillaz> desrt: I dunno, I'd like to think that we can get nice C++ bindings to G*, but being able to do that is really hard
[05:39] <smspillaz> desrt: anyways, g'night :)
[05:40] <smspillaz> I read through the documentation for gmmproc this morning and
[05:40] <smspillaz> yeah
[05:40] <smspillaz> my brain hurt
[05:41] <broder> ugh, but gmmproc is doing so much more work than it needs to these days
[05:41] <broder> i really, really wish somebody had a tool that generated C++ bindings using GI
[05:41] <smspillaz> oh there isn't one ?
[05:41] <smspillaz> hmmmmmmmmmmm
[05:41]  * smspillaz plots
[05:41] <broder> well, there's smoke-gobject/gobject-consume/whatever it's called
[05:41] <broder> but that's not really functional
[05:42] <broder> and gmmproc requires pre-writing .hg and .ccg input files that are basically pre-processor food
[05:42] <smspillaz> yeah  Isaw
[05:42] <broder> (so with gmmproc you're basically binding everything by hand)
[05:42] <smspillaz> when I was reading the gmmproc documentation I was kind of like
[05:42] <smspillaz> oh taht
[05:42] <smspillaz> *that
[05:42] <smspillaz> "haha"
[05:44] <broder> smspillaz: anyway, have to run, but if you were to write a tool that built gobjectmm-based bindings using just GI information, that would be *so* *cool*
[05:44] <broder> and i'd be happy to try and help
[05:44] <smspillaz> I can see desrt sitting somewhere in Canada screaming "use a real language!" :p
[05:45] <broder> C++ is a real language!
[05:46] <broder> C++11 even more so!
[05:50] <pitti> broder: even more so, it's like the union of ten languages
[05:50] <pitti> if only it had a sensible way of handling ABI stability
[05:53] <smspillaz> _ZICanHaveAGoodABITooC8bp9_R3w
[05:57] <pitti> smspillaz: or the really nasty habit of putting constructors in .h files, it's insane
[05:57] <pitti> *cough* apt *cough*
[05:58] <RAOF> Well, where else are you going to put them? :)
[05:58] <pitti> RAOF: that's an obvious answer
[05:58] <pitti> "in your face" of course, everytime it blows up
[05:58] <RAOF> It's always fun when the .h file has a mixture of class declarations and inline functions.  Hello, nux!
[05:59] <pitti> having a ctor like "MyClass(): member1(0), member2(NULL)" might look nice and convenient, but it's utter insanity whenever you have to add a new private member to a class
[06:00] <pitti> with that, changing private members effectively breaks ABI
[06:00] <RAOF> Well, yes.
[06:02] <smspillaz> pitti: yeah, I usually try to keep code out of headers in compiz too
[06:02] <smspillaz> though there are still some places where it is there (left by other people that are not yours truly of course)
[06:03] <smspillaz> pitti: code out of headers and PIMPL is how I roll
[06:04] <smspillaz> pitti: I think C++11 brings a standard ABI though doesn't it ?
[06:04] <smspillaz> although, it still really easy break the ABI
[06:06] <smspillaz> pitti: C++ would also be nice if template error messages were not hundreds of lines long
[06:07] <RAOF> Heh.
[06:08] <RAOF> It would be nice if templates were runtime generated code, too :)
[06:08] <smspillaz> nah
[06:08] <pitti> err, what?
[06:09] <smspillaz> pitti: nope, apparantly it doesn't, must have misread something
[06:51] <didrocks> good morning
[07:05] <pitti> hey didrocks
[07:05] <didrocks> bonjour pitti, how are you?
[07:10] <pitti> didrocks: quite fine, thanks! had some fun this morning unbreaking the archive
[07:11] <didrocks> oh? the archive broke after alpha1 unfreeze?
[07:11] <pitti> software-center was uninstallable, causing all CD builds to fail, plus nautilus-python breaking edubuntu
[07:11] <pitti> yes
[07:11] <pitti> well, that's why we have a stable+1 team :)
[07:13] <didrocks> heh, from day 2, pitti for rescussing the archive! :)
[07:13]  * didrocks hugs pitti
[07:16]  * pitti hugs back didrocks
[07:46] <tkamppeter> pitti, hi
[08:18] <pitti> hey tkamppeter
[08:19] <tkamppeter> pitti, hi
[08:20] <tkamppeter> pitti, it is about CUPS 1.5.x. The IPP backend has a lot of regressions.
[08:21] <tkamppeter> pitti, bug 881843, bug 877958, bug 879625, bug 883585
[08:21] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 881843 in cups "CUPS IPP print to Novell servers error since 11.10 upgrade" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/881843
[08:21] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 877958 in cups "After every single page on ipp: Unable to get print job status" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/877958
[08:21] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 879625 in cups "CUPS fails to request authentication when printing over IPP w/ TLS" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/879625
[08:21] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 883585 in cups "Kubuntu 11.10 -- Network/Local Printers found but cannot print - Unable to get printer status" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/883585
[08:22] <tkamppeter> pitti, a volunteer, Robert Bradley, tried to fix these and worked with the reporters to get more info.
[08:23] <tkamppeter> pitti, he also suggested to downgrade the IPP backend to the one of CUPS 1.4.x and tells that this solves the problems.
[08:24] <tkamppeter> pitti, now I am thinking about doing this in our CUPS package, especially also as an SRU for Oneiric.
[08:24] <tkamppeter> pitti, on Precise I would then return to the current backend when the bugs are fixed upstream.
[08:25] <tkamppeter> pitti WDYT?
[08:25] <pitti> tkamppeter: hm, I thought the new one implied some change in the names/URIs of the printer
[08:25] <pitti> tkamppeter: if we would go back, wouldn't we change them back and break them again?
[08:27] <tkamppeter> pitti, I did not know about that. The release notes http://www.cups.org/documentation.php/doc-1.5/whatsnew.html do not tell about that.
[08:27] <tkamppeter> pitti, from where do you know that.
[08:28] <pitti> tkamppeter: oh, I'm mixing that up with the USB backend
[08:28] <pitti> that was libusb vs. /dev/lpUSBnn
[08:28] <tkamppeter> pitti, the USB backend is fine now after 2 SRUs.
[08:29] <tkamppeter> pitti, I could quickly prepare a new CUPS SRU package and we could replace the current not-yet-approved one.
[08:30] <pitti> tkamppeter: would be interesting to see a diff of the USB backend between 1.4.6 and 1.5.0 to see the scope of teh changes
[08:31] <tkamppeter> pitti, you mean s/USB/IPP/
[08:31] <chrisccoulson> niiiiiiiiiiiiiiice http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RuIQskGD3u0
[08:31] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[08:32] <pitti> tkamppeter: yes, I have it all backwards this morning :(
[08:32] <pitti> hey chrisccoulson
[08:33] <chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
[08:33] <tkamppeter> pitti, diff is attached to bug 881843, comment #6.
[08:33] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 881843 in cups "CUPS IPP print to Novell servers error since 11.10 upgrade" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/881843
[08:41] <pitti> tkamppeter: uh, this looks like a whole rewrite indeed
[08:41] <pitti> tkamppeter: so, if you think that's best, fine for me; I don't know whether downgrading would potentially break anyone's configuration or setup
[08:42] <pitti> i. e. if they are using new features of the 1.5 backend
[08:43] <tkamppeter> pitti, as the release notes do not mention anything, it seems that this is merely only stuff to improve on Mac OS X.
[08:44] <tkamppeter> pitti, so I will apply it and tell you when the SRU package is ready for approving.
[08:44] <tkamppeter> pitti, can you already approve the HPLIP SRU? Thanks.
[08:45] <pitti> tkamppeter: will do an SRU run later today (have some urgent stuff to fix right now)
[08:45] <pitti> tkamppeter: so you want me to ignore or reject the current cups SRU upload?
[08:46] <tkamppeter> pitti, please reject the current CUPS SRU upload, I will re-upload it with the IPP backend patch.
[08:53] <pitti> tkamppeter: roger, done
[08:58] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, this is depressing - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+bugs?field.tag=test-suite
[09:01] <pitti> chrisccoulson: are these filed by a bot of your's?
[09:02] <chrisccoulson> pitti - no, i filed them manually
[09:02] <chrisccoulson> i should probably figure out a way to do that automatically though
[09:13] <rodrigo_> hello
[09:20] <pitti> hey rodrigo_, how are you?
[09:20] <didrocks> good morning rodrigo_
[09:26] <Sweetshark> moin desktop world!
[09:27] <rodrigo_> hi pitti, didrocks
[09:27] <rodrigo_> and Sweetshark :)
[09:27] <didrocks> good morning Sweetshark!
[09:30] <pitti> hey Sweetshark
[09:30] <pitti> Sweetshark: I have a bug to report
[09:30] <pitti> openoffice.org 1:3.3.0-7
[09:31] <pitti> Sweetshark: that is correctly spelled "3:1.3.3-7"!
[09:32] <tkamppeter> pitti, about bug 897309, some proprietary printer driver packages need gs-esp. Should I simply add a "Provides: gs-es" to the "ghostscript" binary package?
[09:32] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 897309 in ghostscript "Package «gs-esp» is still needed in Oneric and higher" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/897309
[09:33] <pitti> tkamppeter: depends; do they have a versioned dependency? if it's just "gs-esp", a Provides: will work fine
[09:33] <pitti> (meh, gs-esp was many, many years ago)
[09:44] <seb128> hey
[09:45] <Sweetshark> pitti: huh?
[09:50] <pitti> Sweetshark: just kidding
[09:50] <pitti> hey seb128
[09:51] <seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
[09:52] <pitti> seb128: quite fine :)
[09:52] <pitti> cleaned up after mvo and myself breaking the archive and daily builds yesterday
[09:53] <pitti> and now working on bug 897680 (ugh)
[09:53] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 897680 in ubiquity "Precise Desktop 64Bit: libc6 fails to install if "install 3rd party software" is selected" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/897680
[09:53] <pitti> stable team FTW :)
[09:55] <seb128> pitti, ;-)
[09:55] <tkamppeter> pitti, the bug does not say anything about versioned or not, so seems to be better to introduce a dummy package to assure that it works with all drivers.
[09:55] <pitti> tkamppeter: I'd start with a Provides:
[09:56] <pitti> tkamppeter: I don't like reintroducing 5 year old clutter for that :/
[09:56] <pitti> seb128: indicator-me looks obsolete, right?
[09:56] <seb128> pitti, it is, I though we dropped it in Oneiric?
[09:56] <seb128> pitti, it got merged in indicator-session
[09:56] <pitti> seb128: that was replaced with the new session plugin
[09:57] <pitti> seb128: yes, but apparently re-synced to precise; I'll remove again and blacklist
[09:57] <seb128> pitti, right, did it come back by some way?
[09:57] <seb128> oh ok
[09:57] <seb128> yes, seems about right ;-)
[09:58] <mvo> pitti: *eeeh* what did I do ?
[09:58] <pitti> mvo: software-center depended on the new plugins which were in binNEW and universe
[09:58] <mvo> aha, ok
[10:00] <tkamppeter> pitti, CUPS SRU re-uploaded.
[10:01] <tkamppeter> pitti, patch also pushed to BZR.
[10:05] <pitti> tkamppeter: current version is in testing, so I guess I better upload this
[10:05] <pitti> tkamppeter: thanks!
[10:06] <Sweetshark> pitti: /me is in deer-in-headlight-mode. Monday is release branch off.
[10:06] <Sweetshark> ;)
[10:06] <pitti> Sweetshark: oh, that's kind of "release time crunch" for LibO then?
[10:08] <Sweetshark> pitti: yes, the scheduling of LO and Ubuntu never leaves me without a 'release time crunch' ;)
[10:12] <chrisccoulson> hah, i wish i could say the same for firefox
[10:12] <chrisccoulson> 24th April - Firefox 12, 26th April - Precise ;)
[10:15] <seb128> chrisccoulson, it's like the anti-perfect schedule, end of year holidays, hard freeze...
[10:19] <rodrigo_> brb
[10:56] <seb128> pitti, help :p
[10:56] <seb128> bug #898973
[10:56] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 898973 in gtk+2.0 "package gtk2-engines-pixbuf 2.24.6-0ubuntu6 failed to install/upgrade: './usr/share/doc/gtk2-engines-pixbuf/NEWS.gz' is different from the same file on the system" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/898973
[10:56] <seb128> seems like lool broke precise as well :p
[10:56] <seb128> that got 2 bug reports today so I guess it's a real bug somewhere
[10:58] <pitti> oh dear, that sounds like bug     871083
[10:58] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 871083 in gzip "gzip -9n sometimes generates a different output file on different architectures" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/871083
[11:01] <pitti> seb128: only known workaround for that right now is to upload a package with dh_compress -XNEWS, I'm afraid
[11:01] <seb128> :-(
[11:02] <pitti> seb128: do you have time to dupe and upload the workaround, or shall I? (I'm a bit tight on time today, need to catch a train later on and finishing up something)
[11:03] <seb128> pitti, I can do it
[11:03]  * pitti hugs seb128, thanks
[11:03]  * seb128 hugs pitti back, you're welcome
[11:03] <seb128> pitti, "dupe" the bug you mean? I will rather just close it with the workaround with a note the real issue is the gzip one
[11:04] <pitti> seb128: as you prefer
[11:04] <seb128> ok
[11:04] <seb128> I'm on it ;-)
[11:04] <pitti> I'd dupe it so that we collect all the tasks on the master bug
[11:04] <pitti> and know what to revert once the real bug is fixed
[11:04] <pitti> but we can add a task without duping, too
[11:05] <seb128> pitti, ok, makes sense,  I can do that
[11:05] <htorque> pitti: hello! about above mentioned bug: i reported it too and it got duped - shouldn't apport have told me that?
[11:06] <pitti> htorque: I'm afraid we can't do that yet for package install failures
[11:06] <pitti> the log parsing isn't reliable enough yet to do that
[11:06] <htorque> ah ok, so just for crashers.
[11:06] <pitti> as many errors are followups, some are noise, etc.
[11:06] <pitti> it's not easy even as a human to spot the real root cause
[11:09] <pitti> tkamppeter: nice, Robert is already sending patches for the regressions to upstream
[11:17] <lool> seb128: you want me to upload with -XNEWS?
[11:18] <seb128> lool, if you want to feel free, I'm finishing something and was going to do that next but if you want to do it that's welcome ;-)
[11:19] <htorque> will -XNEWS also take care of README.gz and changelog.Debian.gz? because they seem to cause trouble too.
[11:20] <seb128> no, they should probably be added to the -X list
[11:20] <seb128> lool, ^
[11:20] <pitti> htorque: is that confirmed?
[11:20] <pitti> htorque: in libtasn, only NEWS was affected
[11:21] <lool> the bug and the dup only have NEWS listed
[11:22] <lool> oh it's in gtk+2.0
[11:22] <pitti> you can download both .debs, dpkg-deb -x them, and compare md5sums
[11:23] <htorque> pitti: i removed NEWS.gz and did 'install -f' and it complained about changelog.Debian.gz. removed that too, then it showed the same for README.gz. removed that one and the update worked.
[11:23] <lool> seb128: So why does it relate to me?  :-)
[11:24] <lool> hmm E: gtk2-engines-udeb udeb: udeb-contains-documentation-file usr/share/doc/gtk2-engines-udeb/
[11:24] <lool> grabing gtk+2.0
[11:24] <seb128> lool, I overlooked the -pixbuf part of the name, or rather confused it with your gtk2-engines upload from yesterday :p
[11:24] <seb128> lool, sorry :-(
[11:25] <lool> seb128: see how you blame me for everything!!1!
[11:25] <seb128> lool, (or in fact it's my secret plan to make you do desktop work ;-)
[11:25] <seb128> lool, (but sussssh)
[11:26] <lool> pitti: It's a bit ugly to add these -Xs if it also affects changelog and README  :-/
[11:28] <lool> Ah cjwatson was looking after it
[11:28] <pitti> lool: but at least we exactly know what to revert once it's fixed
[11:29] <lool> pitti: You mean we can grep Contents to find packages to revert?
[11:29] <pitti> lool: no, I think we should add tasks to that master bug
[11:30] <lool> oh wow, we moved from gzip 1.3.12 from *2007* to 1.4.0 from 2010
[11:30] <pitti> lool: but that wasn't it
[11:30] <lool> pitti: Ok; I hope it's not going to affect too many packages
[11:30] <pitti> lool: we just never noticed beefore multiarch
[11:30] <pitti> otherwise I had reverted it already
[11:30] <lool> pitti: Ok
[11:30] <pitti> i. e. it's not a regression
[11:31] <lool> pitti: It's just certain contents?
[11:31] <pitti> yes
[11:31] <pitti> and I never managed to reproduce it locally
[11:31] <pitti> must be something spethial on the buildds
[11:31] <pitti> different kernel, different file system, I don't know
[11:31] <pitti> PPAs are fine, local builds are fine with both lucid and precise kernel,e tc.
[11:31] <lool> oh wow
[11:31] <pitti> some buildds allegedly run the hardy kernel, I didn't try that locally
[11:32] <pitti> lool: I suppose it's something like "truncate() doesn't zero blocks under some circumstances" or "some memory pages remain uninitialized when you write the tail" or whatnot
[11:37] <lool> we don't seem to log kernel version with build logs
[11:37] <pitti> right, so I could only guess
[11:38] <lool> proposed https://code.launchpad.net/~lool/launchpad-buildd/log-kernel-version/+merge/84247
[11:40] <pitti> lool: merci
[11:42] <pitti> seb128: retracer assertion failure> will have a look on monday, -ENOTIME any more today
[11:42] <seb128> pitti, ok
[11:42] <pitti> probably a weird bug which needs to be duped, etc., but need to figure out the logic
[11:45] <tkamppeter> pitti, SRU for bug 897309 uploaded, precise package will come soon.
[11:45] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 897309 in ghostscript "Package «gs-esp» is still needed in Oneric and higher" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/897309
[11:49] <pitti> seb128: ok, worked around for now, they _should_ be back up until the next gksu crash comes in
[11:49] <seb128> pitti, danke
[11:49] <seb128> pitti, what is wrong with gksu?
[11:49] <seb128> (just curious)
[11:50] <pitti> bug 898874
[11:50] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 898874 in gksu "gksu crashed with SIGSEGV in __strlen_ia32()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/898874
[11:50] <pitti> the traces all look slightly differently
[11:50] <pitti> I don't yet have a firm idea where the duplication logic fails
[11:50] <pitti> it's rather conservative right now with lots of asserts
[11:50] <pitti> so I'd rather just let it crash again when it happens
[11:50] <seb128> ok
[11:56] <pitti> I need to run now, cu later on the train (maybe, I'll mostly work offline)
[11:56] <pitti> have a nice weekend!
[11:57] <lool> pitti: Good WE!
[12:22] <tkamppeter> pitti, all SRUs for this week are uploaded now and ready for approval: CUPS, HPLIP, Ghostscript (10 bugs).
[12:39] <seb128> ricotz, hey
[12:39] <seb128> lool, so will you handle gtk or should I have a look? it seems you started on it?
[12:40] <seb128> pedro_, ola, thanks for the sru verification ;-)
[12:42] <pedro_> seb128, hello! np, i'm reviewing the ones that need verification today
[12:43] <seb128> great
[12:45] <ricotz> seb128, hey
[12:45] <seb128> ricotz, how are you?
[12:46] <ricotz> seb128, a bit busy, but fine
[12:46] <ricotz> seb128, hoping you are fine too
[12:46] <seb128> ricotz, it would be nice to get rhythmbox updated in precise, do you want to do it? I can do the sponsoring for you
[12:46] <seb128> ricotz, I'm fine thanks ;-)
[12:47] <ricotz> seb128, i see, i think you can grab the ppa package, i dont remember making packaging changes though
[12:47] <seb128> ricotz, ok, are you fine if I sponsor that to precise then?
[12:48] <seb128> ricotz, is that version working fine for you? ;-)
[12:48] <ricotz> seb128, i am using it all day, i think the crashes i am getting arent related to rhythmbox, so feel free to sponsor it
[12:49] <seb128> ricotz, great, thank you
[12:50] <ricotz> seb128, as usual the tarball contains some patches to have a working "make dist"
[12:50] <seb128> ricotz, that's fine, did you send those in bugzilla or something?
[12:51] <seb128> ricotz, btw you should use "snapshot" rather than "release" in your changelog for git snapshots ;-)
[12:51] <ricotz> seb128, if i recall it correctly fta had an plugin issue, but nothing serious
[12:52] <seb128> ok
[12:53] <ricotz> seb128, havent sent them upstream since it is only some uncommented stuff in makefiles and a vala sample plugin problem
[12:54] <ricotz> seb128, yeah, the version string doesnt contain git so my script puts release in there
[12:58]  * ricotz needs to strip the "git" to keep the update path with the repo version ;)
[12:58] <lool> seb128: I had started it, but had started researching the gzip issue instead; doing it now
[12:59] <seb128> lool, thanks ;-)
[13:01] <ricotz> seb128, btw, how is it going with glib 2.31.x since you mentioned updating clutter/cogl which would need this newer glib
[13:02] <seb128> ricotz, today is friday so not the best day for a new glib serie, I think I will upload it early next week
[13:02] <seb128> ricotz, is the current version working fine for you?
[13:02] <seb128> i.e no surprise?
[13:03] <seb128> out of the eog patch we will ned
[13:03] <seb128> need
[13:03] <ricotz> mhh, can't think of anything currently
[13:03] <seb128> ok, that's a good sign ;-)
[13:03] <ricotz> there were mostly cairo/gtk issues
[13:04] <ricotz> seb128, did you see problems with the newer tp-mission-control version?
[13:04] <seb128> no, but I didn't watch closely, kenvandine is probably a better person to ask when he will be online
[13:05] <ricotz> ah, gnome-system-monitor has a similiar issue like eog
[13:05] <ricotz> ok
[13:05] <ricotz> if there arent any reports this tp problem might be caused by glib
[13:06] <seb128> not that I noticed but I'm not sure many people run precise yet
[13:06] <seb128> but anyway some bugs is not the end of the world for precise, I just wanted to make sure there is no known stoppers
[13:06] <seb128> we will figure what to do with issues when we hit them ;-)
[13:06] <ricotz> seb128, right
[13:07] <ricotz> better to find them early in the cycle rather than waiting with the upload
[13:33]  * rodrigo_ lunch
[13:33] <chrisccoulson> seb128, you should upload glib today. precise is boring right now ;)
[13:33] <chrisccoulson> i like living life on the edge!
[13:33] <seb128> chrisccoulson, be my guest and do it!
[13:34] <chrisccoulson> lol
[13:34] <chrisccoulson> i can't ;)
[13:34] <chrisccoulson> probably a good job!
[13:34] <seb128> you still didn't apply for upload rights?!
[13:34] <chrisccoulson> not yet. i haven't really needed to recently
[13:34] <seb128> you need them today see! ;-)
[13:34] <chrisccoulson> lol
[13:48]  * desrt yawns
[13:48] <desrt> smspillaz: get your situation sorted?
[14:16] <ockham_> hi, anyone feel like reviewing http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/unity-lens-bliss ?
[14:18] <mdeslaur> Thought of the day(tm): instead of deciding the default desktop applications based on toolkits and programming languages, we should have a valgrind faceoff
[14:19] <HOHOHaney> L
[14:19] <HOHOHaney> oops
[14:22] <seb128> didrocks, can you explain r211 in the nautilus vcs?
[14:22]  * didrocks looks
[14:23] <seb128> didrocks, it's used to get the strings translated?
[14:23] <seb128> or I'm overlooking something?
[14:23] <didrocks> seb128: hum, I would have thought that, let me check again, but I think we don't preprocess it at all
[14:24] <seb128> didrocks, we have a patch that add it to the POTFILES.in
[14:24] <seb128> debian/patches/13_translate_unity_launcher.patch:+debian/nautilus-home.desktop.in
[14:24] <seb128> didrocks, ^
[14:24] <didrocks> seb128: oh, ok, my bad then, please revert it
[14:24] <didrocks> seb128: I tried to look at debian/rules mainly
[14:24] <desrt> good morning, didrocks, seb128
[14:24] <didrocks> hey desrt :)
[14:24] <seb128> didrocks, ok, good, I prefered to check if the .desktop got deprecated and I was overlooking something
[14:24] <seb128> didrocks, thanks ;-)
[14:24] <seb128> desrt, hey, good friday to you!
[14:25] <didrocks> seb128: no no, just didn't see where it was used and thinking that we got the translation from another desktop file. Thanks for looking!
[14:25] <desrt> happy friday!
[14:31] <pitti> desrt: TGIF!
[14:31]  * desrt was quite enjoying this week, actually
[14:35] <dobey> pitti: hey
[14:35] <dobey> pitti: you wouldn't happen to have any idea why quilt would just randomly exit in the middle of applying a patch, would you?
[14:36] <pitti> dobey: urgh
[14:36] <pitti> dobey: reproducible?
[14:36] <dobey> and exit cleanly, that is
[14:36] <pitti> I see how dpatch could, but not quilt
[14:36] <dobey> pitti: sort of; it happens in the recipe build i'm trying to set up for rhythmbox daily builds
[14:36] <pitti> dobey: that's with "quilt push", or "quilt push -a", or package build?
[14:37] <pitti> ah, so during dpkg-source -x ?
[14:37] <pitti> either way, perhaps stracing reveals an error?
[14:37] <lool> seb128: Fighting local gtk+ build issue; the first one is fixed (docbook), I'm now getting another one, the first error in the log is from the testsuite, but it seems ignored; anyway, I'd rather fix it, are the new ubuntu_* functions supposed to be in the ABI or not?  they aren't in headers
[14:37] <dobey> it's quilt push -a -v i tihnk
[14:37] <dobey> think
[14:37] <lool> ubuntu_gtk_get_use_overlay_scrollbar, ubuntu_gtk_menu_shell_activate_first etc.
[14:37] <seb128> kenvandine, ^
[14:37] <dobey> hrmm, actually, maybe it is being applied, but then is failing to unapply for some reason
[14:38] <lool> kenvandine: Hey Ken, search for "FAIL: abicheck.sh" in https://launchpadlibrarian.net/86349189/buildlog_ubuntu-precise-amd64.gtk%2B2.0_2.24.8-0ubuntu1_BUILDING.txt.gz
[14:38] <seb128> lool, they are used only by overlay-scrollbar I think so I'm not sure how public we want them
[14:38] <lool> kenvandine: the lines with +es are new public symbols; either we want these to be public, then we should have them in a .h and update gtk/gtk.symbols, or we want them to be private, naming them _something should be enough to hide them
[14:39] <lool> seb128: Ok; will leave it to Ken
[14:39] <dobey> pitti: unfortunately, i can't strace, as it's on the LP server; i can't reproduce the problem locally :(
[14:39] <seb128> lool, I would not bother with cleaning for gtk2, those are probably fine to let as it
[14:40] <seb128> lool, but I'm less perfectionist than you ;-)
[14:40]  * kenvandine looks
[14:40] <dobey> pitti: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/86377740/buildlog.txt.gz
[14:42] <lool> seb128: I'll be uploading now, but I didn't manage to complete a build; I get an error and didn't verify the binaries: dpkg-buildpackage: erreur: fakeroot debian/rules binary a produit une erreur de sortie de type 2
[14:42] <lool> I think it wont happen on the buildds
[14:43] <seb128> lool, yeah, if you just changed the rules to add the -X there is no reason runtime should break, just upload ;-)
[14:43] <pitti> dobey: but I supose 04_pause_button.patch actually does apply cleanly locally?
[14:43] <pitti> dobey: did you try with bzr-builder?
[14:44] <dobey> pitti: bzr dailydeb recipe isn't working for me locally, because for some reason it seems to want the rhythmbox branch to be a source package branch with the upstream-foo tags in it :(
[14:45] <pitti> dobey: uh? well, any of the branch needs to provide a debian/ dir
[14:45] <pitti> dobey: what does your recipe look like?
[14:45] <pitti> dobey: it should work locally, otherwise there's little chance of working in LP
[14:45] <dobey> https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntuone-hackers/+recipe/rhythmbox-dailies
[14:45] <pitti> dobey: are you trying to merge against ubuntu:rhythmbox?
[14:45] <dobey> no
[14:45] <dobey> lp:rhythmbox
[14:46] <dobey> which is the import of upstream git master
[14:46] <kenvandine> lool, those have bounced around a bit between being in headers and not... agateau cleaned that stuff up quite a bit last cycle and there was some reasoning for this...
[14:46] <kenvandine> agateau, do you remember?
[14:46] <lool> kenvandine: It's inconsistent with other patches where gtk.symbols is correctly patches
[14:46] <lool> *patched
[14:46] <dobey> pitti: building manually locally works fine; i can dpkg -S -sa and then pbuilder-oneiric the .dsc and it builds
[14:46] <lool> seb128: uploaded
[14:46] <james_w> Patch 04_pause_button.patch does not remove cleanly (refresh it or enforce with -f)
[14:46] <james_w> make: *** [reverse-patches] Error 1
[14:46] <kenvandine> lool, yeah... maybe we just need to add them there
[14:47] <seb128> lool, thanks!
[14:47] <didrocks> ok, all unity test cases in checkbox now :) Will have to debug checkbox now though :/
[14:47] <lool> kenvandine: I had a quick look, and given these aren't in headers, I'd rather have them renamed from ubuntu_foo to _ubuntu_foo
[14:47] <pitti> dobey: can you try with: nest-part packaging lp:~ubuntuone-control-tower/rhythmbox/packaging-dailies debian debian
[14:47] <pitti> dobey: otherwise you put the *whole* branch into debian/
[14:47] <lool> kenvandine: If you look at gtk.symbols, it maps to header files
[14:47] <pitti> dobey: i. e. you'll have a debian/debian/
[14:47] <james_w> dobey, that doesn't sound like it randomly exiting cleanly in the middle of applying a patch?
[14:48] <dobey> pitti: the whole branch is only the stuff that's inside debian/
[14:48] <pitti> dobey: oh, I see
[14:48] <pitti> (that's unusual)
[14:48] <pitti> dobey: so, I'm in a train, so I can't try that recipe right now (too little bandwidth)
[14:48] <pitti> dobey: do you have the error message that it produces locally?
[14:48] <dobey> pitti: sure
[14:48] <kenvandine> lool, yeah... i want agateau to weigh in on that, i think there was a reason they need to be public
[14:48] <dobey> bzr: ERROR: No such tag: upstream-2.90.1+r7750dding file 20/25
[14:49] <dobey> that last bit is where it screwed up writing to the terminal and bzr branch output got overwritten in the shell
[14:49] <dobey> the dding.* bit
[14:49] <james_w> dobey, are you running with --allow-fallback-to-native?
[14:50] <pitti> dobey: I'm out of my wisdom then :/ but look, james_w to the rescue!
[14:50] <dobey> james_w: ah no
[14:51] <james_w> RUN ['bzr', 'dailydeb', '--safe', '--no-build', '/home/buildd/build-47ee96de33267c60c108b9c3ed958637e9ffc494/chroot-autobuild/home/buildd/work/recipe', '/home/buildd/build-47ee96de33267c60c108b9c3ed958637e9ffc494/chroot-autobuild/home/buildd/work/tree', '--manifest', '/home/buildd/build-47ee96de33267c60c108b9c3ed958637e9ffc494/chroot-autobuild/home/buildd/work/tree/manifest', '--allow-fallback-to-native', '--append-version', '~precise1']
[14:51] <dobey> trying that now
[14:52] <dobey> but just running the quilt push -a -v then quilt pop -a -R in the tree works fine for me; which is why i'm confused
[15:04] <james_w> dobey, what about with "fakeroot debian/rules clean" in between?
[15:05] <dobey> i'll try that in a minute; i've commented out all the patches in series except for one now
[15:06] <dobey> and it still fails on that one patch; which is a one-line change :(
[15:08] <dobey> james_w: debian/rules clean rmoves the patches
[15:09] <dobey> james_w: so i suppose if i run quilt pop now it will fail
[15:10] <dobey> it seems to be what is runs quilt pop anyway
[15:10] <james_w> I guess that could be the cause of quilt failing
[15:11] <dobey> well, it's failing *inside* the "fakeroot debian/rules clean" in the recipe build
[15:17] <pitti> have a nice weekend everyone!
[15:18] <dobey> cheers pitti
[15:23] <mterry> pitti, can you set https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-unity-greeter to be a precise goal?  it doesn't show up in work item tracker right now
[15:23] <seb128> haha
[15:23] <seb128> mterry, welcome to the club of the people who tried to get .symbols for cpp and gave up on it using -V ;-)
[15:24] <mterry> seb128, heh.  :)
[15:24] <didrocks> we should create a launchpad team :)
[15:24] <charles> seb128, my inbox says you are a bug triaging *machine* :)
[15:24] <mterry> seb128, I thought I had it.  I used pkg-kde to write a symbols file that had some tags in it, but not enough.  still failed on amd64
[15:24] <seb128> charles, lol
[15:24] <seb128> charles, I wish others who do a bit extra triage so I would have less to do :p
[15:25] <seb128> mterry, btw while you are here, do you want me to take over the gedit 3.2.3 sru?
[15:25]  * mterry bugs didrocks about reviewing his quickly-gtk3 branch
[15:25] <seb128> mterry, i've time today for it
[15:25] <mterry> seb128, did I sign up for that?  I didn't write it down...  sorry  :-/
[15:26] <didrocks> mterry: s/bugs/hugs rather? :)
[15:26] <mterry> didrocks, ah yes... typo...  :)
[15:26] <seb128> mterry, I'm slightly disappointed that you didn't do the compiz sru sponsoring yesterday btw :p maybe pitti will get to it on monday during his turn ;-)
[15:26] <didrocks> mterry: as you suffer from marshmalling the C++ symbols file as well, I guess it can take some time for looking at your branch!
[15:26] <mterry> seb128, oh no I do have the gedit sru in my queue
[15:27] <mterry> seb128, I'll get to it in a bit
[15:27] <seb128> mterry, no, I signed you up for it in a but comment you probably didn't read :p in fact they worked around the pygobject,snippet segfault
[15:27] <seb128> mterry, you had that pygobject bug assigned to you
[15:27] <seb128> mterry, ok, thanks
[15:27] <mterry> yup, bug
[15:27] <mterry> 863773
[15:28] <seb128> mterry, if you have other things to do that's fine, I'm not too busy today so I can do it as well, just tell me
[15:28] <mterry> seb128, no problem, you keep triaging  :)
[15:28] <seb128> lol
[15:33] <asac> heyho
[15:33] <asac> at some point there was the system -> preferences -> preferred applications thing
[15:34] <asac> nowadays that doesnt exist anymore :(
[15:34] <asac> at least i cannot find it
[15:34] <asac> where can i now switch mailto: and http: mime handler?
[15:36] <asac> me opens gnome-control-center again in hope to find it
[15:36] <didrocks> asac: it is in gnome-control-center
[15:36] <didrocks> asac: the system info
[15:36] <didrocks> then, there is preferred apps
[15:37] <asac> didrocks: guys that make absolutely no sense :)
[15:37] <didrocks> asac: I didn't say it did make sense :)
[15:37] <asac> i tried _every_ other button in control center
[15:37] <asac> this one i left out
[15:37] <didrocks> no every, see, don't lie! :)
[15:37]  * didrocks hugs asac
[15:37] <asac> oh no
[15:37] <asac> i cannot set a custom command there anymore
[15:37] <asac> i want to make desktop-webmail package work again
[15:37] <asac> guess it needs a .desktop file
[15:37] <didrocks> hum, not sure about that one apart from editing the mimeapps file :/
[15:38] <asac> hmm
[15:38] <didrocks> or yeah, creating a desktop, should be better
[15:38] <asac> it has a .desktop file
[15:38] <asac> ah
[15:38] <didrocks> hum, and the mimetype is matched?
[15:38] <asac> MimeType=x-scheme-handler/mailto
[15:39] <asac> is missing
[15:39] <asac> odd
[15:39] <asac> do i need to run something to pick this up if i try it manually?
[15:40] <didrocks> good question, I would say just put in the standard XDG directory and maybe rerun g-c-c, never tried TBH
[15:40] <didrocks> mterry: so, gesttings pick the new schemas in XDG_DATA_DIR ?
[15:41] <asac> let me see
[15:43] <dobey> for a .desktop file?
[15:44] <mterry> didrocks, yeah
[15:44] <dobey> just put the .desktop in /usr/share/applications, and i think there is a trigger that runs the desktop file cache thing
[15:44] <mterry> (at least that's my memory, it's been a while since I wrote that branch)
[15:44] <didrocks> mterry: waow, great, I was thinking it was compulsory to add the filename in /etc/dconf/profile/
[15:45] <dobey> to change the default, just put an override in the gsettings overrides dir i guess
[15:47] <asac> didrocks: just restarting it didnt help
[15:47] <asac> didrocks: i changed the .desktop file in applications
[15:48] <asac> cat /usr/share/applications/desktop-webmail.desktop  | pastebinit
[15:48] <asac> http://paste.ubuntu.com/757192/
[15:48] <dobey> asac: you need to run update-mime-database
[15:48] <didrocks> dobey: this is not about override, this is about trunk testing
[15:48] <asac> kk
[15:48] <asac> thanks dobey
[15:49] <asac> dobey: hmm. wasnte there a more convenient scrip that we call in postinst?
[15:49] <asac> this one tells me:
[15:49] <asac> sudo update-mime-database
[15:49] <asac> [sudo] password for asac:
[15:49] <asac> Usage: update-mime-database.real [-hvV] MIME-DIR
[15:49] <dobey> asac: i think there's a trigger that runs if your package has .desktop file in /usr/share/applications, so you don't have to do anything in postinst actually
[15:49]  * asac tries to think hard
[15:49] <dobey> asac: update-mime-database /usr/share/applications
[15:50] <dobey> sudo of course :)
[15:50] <asac> hmm. i am sure in the past we had a convenient script hat didnt need the dir
[15:50] <asac> but ok
[15:50] <asac> i am old anyway
[15:50]  * ogra_ agrees
[15:50] <ogra_> :P
[15:50] <asac> hehe
[15:50] <asac> sudo update-mime-database /usr/share/applications
[15:50] <asac> Directory '/usr/share/applications/packages' does not exist!
[15:50] <asac> so see
[15:50] <asac> i tell you ... we dont use that :)
[15:50] <dobey> oh
[15:50] <dobey> update-dsektop-database
[15:51] <dobey> sorry
[15:51] <dobey> got confused with fdo mixing mime and .desktop stuff :)
[15:51] <asac> yay
[15:51] <asac> and that is not in PATH
[15:51] <asac> that sounds more like what i remember
[15:51] <dobey> [dobey@lunatari:~]: which update-desktop-database
[15:51] <dobey> /usr/bin/update-desktop-database
[15:51] <asac> hmm
[15:52] <asac> well its in path
[15:52] <asac> strange
[15:52] <asac> ok thanks
[15:52] <asac> lets see
[15:52] <asac> cool
[15:53] <asac> thanks dobey
[15:53] <dobey> sure :)
[15:55] <seb128> hey asac
[15:55] <seb128> asac, did you get it working?
[15:58] <asac> seb128: yes. though send link from browser doesnt work (guess a bug)
[15:58] <asac> but thats on desktop-webmail side ... so thanks
[15:58] <asac> ok off
[15:58]  * asac sick
[15:58] <seb128> asac, take care!
[15:59] <asac> will do. thanks!
[16:00] <asac> seb128: oh ... can you tell me what wrapper/api is used when i right click on gnome-terminal and use send mail ?
[16:00] <asac> xdg-open i guess
[16:01] <seb128> chrisccoulson, ^ do you know?
[16:01] <seb128> asac, but I would guess it's gio
[16:01] <seb128> like it probably triggers the default handler for those urls
[16:01] <seb128> same story than for the browser
[16:01] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i'd imagine it's just using gio
[16:01] <chrisccoulson> nothing sane uses xdg-open
[16:02] <chrisccoulson> only chrome uses that ;)
[16:02] <seb128> chrisccoulson, not even firefox? ;-)
[16:02] <chrisccoulson> seb128, nope :)
[16:02] <seb128> good ;)
[16:02] <asac> is there a command line wrapper or just api?
[16:02] <asac> in any case xdg-open shows the same problem
[16:03] <asac> as firefox send mail
[16:03] <asac> and gnome-terminal send mail
[16:03] <asac> anyway ... will dig a bit deeper
[16:03] <chrisccoulson> asac, what's the issue?
[16:04] <asac> chrisccoulson: i am sick ... will ping you over weekend if i feel better :/
[16:04] <asac> thanks for your helP!
[16:04] <chrisccoulson> asac, ok, no worries. hope you feel better soon :)
[16:04] <asac> it is about desktop-webmail
[16:04] <asac> so most likely nothing important fo ryou :)
[16:04] <asac> bye
[17:49] <seb128> lool, it seems your DB2HTML=non-existent broke the i386 gtk2 build
[17:50] <seb128> well I assume it's that, I don't see what else would have done it
[18:23] <seb128> chrisccoulson, congrats, you won bug #865490
[18:23] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 865490 in nautilus-sendto "nautilus-sendto crashed with SIGSEGV in _start()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/865490
[18:23] <seb128> ;-)
[18:24] <chrisccoulson> yay \o/
[18:25] <chrisccoulson> right, i've got to disappear. travelling round to jo's parents house this evening
[18:25] <chrisccoulson> sigh :/
[18:25]  * didrocks waves good night and good week-end!
[18:25] <didrocks> see you on Monday everyone!
[18:26] <Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: I was tought it that way: action items always go to the guy who is not in the meeting ;)
[18:26] <Sweetshark> ... too late
[18:26]  * Sweetshark is gone for the weekend too.