[00:02] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: http://aplg.kollide.net/images/snapshot054.png
[00:02] <apachelogger> looks
[00:02] <apachelogger> different
[00:03] <Wubbbi> ohhh
[00:03] <Wubbbi> that was not planned xD
[00:03] <Wubbbi> let me ceck
[00:04] <Wubbbi> But is it faster now?
[00:05] <apachelogger> not really
[00:06] <Wubbbi> -_-
[00:14] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: ok bug found and fixed
[00:14] <Wubbbi> missing " sysInfo += "	"; " line
[00:21] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: ok new version sended ( with the fixed version )
[00:29] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: arived?
[00:33] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: you really should get yourself a virtual machine with intrepid
[00:33] <Wubbbi> ^^
[00:33] <emunkki> or a slave
[00:33] <Wubbbi> emunkki: sounds good :D
[00:34]  * emunkki is not volunteering
[00:34] <emunkki> talked w/ ryanakca about the kubuntu website +stuff
[00:34] <emunkki> http://emonk.fi/work/kde/kubuntu_countdown_banner_mockup.png
[00:34] <emunkki> http://emonk.fi/work/kde/kubuntu_startpage_mockup.png
[00:38] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: http://aplg.kollide.net/images/snapshot055.png
[00:38] <apachelogger> header text's color is broken
[00:38] <Wubbbi> -_-
[00:38] <Wubbbi> let me check
[00:41] <ryanakca>  /go emunkki
[00:41] <ryanakca> oops :)
[00:42]  * apachelogger starts screaming
[00:42] <apachelogger> *close gwenview*
[00:42] <apachelogger> god, why did I swear to scream whenever I see tango -.-
[00:43] <apachelogger> emunkki: that globe is an abomination :P
[00:43] <ryanakca> hehe
[00:43] <emunkki> apachelogger, ? :P
[00:43] <apachelogger> next to the searchfield
[00:43] <emunkki> apachelogger, yes?
[00:43] <apachelogger> but I like it
[00:43] <apachelogger> the mockup
[00:43] <ryanakca> apachelogger: we can always s/tango/oxygen/g when we implement... :)
[00:43] <apachelogger> not the globe
[00:43] <apachelogger> ryanakca: we have to always s/tango/oxygen/g when we implement :P
[00:44] <apachelogger> otherwise I will have to start screaming all the time
[00:44] <emunkki> apachelogger, oh my god, the page will look horrible as the icon is wrong in the first mockup
[00:44] <emunkki> ;)
[00:44]  * apachelogger starts thinking signing up to the oxygen crew wasn't the best idea
[00:44] <ryanakca> emunkki: so do I... if our website didn't already have a new theme, I'd vote for it... you should've submitted it in January when we were searching for mockups :)
[00:45] <emunkki> tbh, kubuntu.org looks like shit
[00:45] <emunkki> *oops*
[00:45]  * apachelogger senses a geekfight
[00:45]  * ryanakca mutters something about emunkki and /dev/null and forces a smile
[00:45] <emunkki> well at least the top part is way too airy
[00:45] <apachelogger> how about enhancing the current theme?
[00:46] <emunkki> too much space etc.
[00:46] <ryanakca> apachelogger: brilliant :)
[00:46] <ryanakca> emunkki: we'll be sticking in a search box... wanna implement it for us?
[00:46] <emunkki> in drupal? let me puke first
[00:46] <emunkki> i could do that some day
[00:47] <emunkki> i have a meeting w/ a client in 11 hours
[00:47] <apachelogger> yah, there is the geekfight
[00:47]  * apachelogger gets popcorn
[00:47] <emunkki> and i should have some sleep before it
[00:47] <emunkki> haha :D
[00:47] <ryanakca> haha, night night :)
[00:47] <apachelogger> nini emunkki
[00:47] <apachelogger> oh
[00:47] <emunkki> we've officially made a decision (on our it-company) that we won't use drupal in any project ;)
[00:47] <apachelogger> uh
[00:47] <apachelogger> ah
[00:48] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: not possible. there was no reason, that the colour get broken -.-
[00:48] <apachelogger> ryanakca: I think we should incorporate emunkki's mockup
[00:48] <apachelogger> and make the site dynamic
[00:48] <apachelogger> the static with can't be used for the wiki in a productive manner
[00:48] <apachelogger> IMHO
[00:48] <emunkki> ni -->
[00:49] <ryanakca> apachelogger: so do I ... but it doesn't look too good if a month after we roll out a new site, we roll out a second one... It could be used for the feature tour possibly
[00:49] <apachelogger> ryanakca: how does that not look good? :P
[00:49]  * ryanakca doesn't get to make any decisions... you'll have to poke the powers above
[00:49] <apachelogger> constant improvement
[00:49] <ryanakca> apachelogger: ah, there you go. Would work :)
[00:50] <apachelogger> besides, we could roll the theme at the same time for the wiki
[00:50]  * vorian waves
[00:50] <apachelogger> making it an "adoption for use in the wiki" kind of release ;-)
[00:50]  * apachelogger waves to vorian
[00:51] <vorian> anything on the docket?
[00:51] <vorian> i have about 4 hours to kill
[00:51] <apachelogger> vorian: backport extragear?
[00:51] <ryanakca> apachelogger: If you want to convince the powers above, I'm willing to tackle / help tackle it.
[00:51] <vorian> apachelogger: okie
[00:51] <apachelogger> vorian: or write a script for backporting l10n
[00:51] <vorian> hmm, i'll go with extragear
[00:51] <apachelogger> ryanakca: which powers are we talking about?
[00:52]  * apachelogger notes that he is a master of the universe, what greater power could ther possibly be anyway? :P
[00:52] <ryanakca> apachelogger: jr
[00:52] <apachelogger> omg
[00:53] <apachelogger> the master robot :D
[00:53] <JontheEchidna> XD
[00:53] <JontheEchidna> He's like, the Optimus prime of Kubuntu
[00:53] <apachelogger> well, let's talk about tomorrow when everyone is around
[00:53] <ryanakca> apachelogger: along with the KCC I guess :)
[00:53] <apachelogger> hm
[00:54] <apachelogger> I am kubuntu member, so technically I own that council :P
[00:54] <vorian> so when's the magic hour?
[00:54] <apachelogger> though that doesn't work out for politics either ;-)
[00:54] <apachelogger> sebas: do you already know the magic hour?
[00:55] <apachelogger> vorian: that name is pretty awkward tbh
[00:55] <apachelogger> we require a fancier name :D
[00:55] <vorian> hmm
[00:55] <apachelogger> Bathour
[00:56] <apachelogger> looks strange though
[00:56] <vorian> no, more majestic
[00:56] <JontheEchidna> bath hour?
[00:56] <JontheEchidna> oh
[00:56] <JontheEchidna> bat hour
[00:56] <JontheEchidna> yeah, very strange
[00:57] <apachelogger> well
[00:57] <apachelogger> <-- continues movie
[00:57] <JontheEchidna> have fun
[00:58] <JontheEchidna> anybody got a KAction pykde4 example I could see?
[00:58]  * JontheEchidna is having trouble with the C++-isms in the riverbankcomputing docs
[01:00]  * emunkki is back for a while w/ eeepc
[01:08] <yuriy> Riddell: the fedora tool they are working on looks great (albeit too OS-X-y (say that out loud!))
[01:09] <yuriy> Riddell: but it's _completely_ different from userconfig.  It would be great to have something like that, but that's a huge project.  Maybe once they have a backend, someone can work on a KDE frontend for Intrepid+1?
[01:11] <yuriy> Riddell: among other things, as they mention it integrates things from the aboutme and kdm/gdm config modules.  And that's great, but I'd like to see work on that upstream
[01:11] <yuriy> Riddell: meanwhile, maybe I can find some UI elements to steal from them that do apply to userconfig
[03:50] <nixternal> what is up with the silly apt-get now showing bug numbers and garbage asking if I am sure?
[03:50] <nixternal> what is this, vista?
[03:51] <ScottK> That's an extra apt bit that was probably a recommends that now gets installed by default.
[03:51] <ScottK> Is it apt-listchanges?
[03:51] <nixternal> not installed here
[03:52] <nixternal> 10apt-listbugs
[03:53] <ScottK> Yeah.
[03:53] <ScottK> My suggestion is file a bug against apt-get that it get moved from recommends to suggests.
[03:53] <nixternal> ya, just did a // to comment it out
[03:53] <ScottK> Or just uninstall it.
[05:17] <yuriy> seele: your blog calls me spam (or is it just moderating everything?)
[05:46]  * Jucato sends a spamassassin to get yuriy
[05:47] <yuriy> Jucato: yay for switching to 4.1 fully. you're only 6 months late!
[05:47] <Jucato> yuriy: read it in context :)
[05:47] <yuriy> (but of course I use kontact/kde3 and pidgin)
[05:47] <Jucato> I said "my main user"....
[05:47] <yuriy> i know i know
[05:48] <Jucato> since march or april, i've been on my kde4-user, with my main user launching "critical" apps :)
[05:48] <Jucato> but keeping track of 2-3 users on the same desktop system...pfft
[05:48] <yuriy> I'd really like to see a qt/kde version of pidgin, I've never liked kopete, though I like its eye candy and integration
[05:49] <yuriy> somebody said they were working on one almost a year ago on the pidgin mailing list but I couldn't find anything else on it
[05:49] <Jucato> I'm imagining it's probably possible to have a qt/kde app that uses libpurple...
[05:50] <Jucato> (rather than just "clone" pidgin, that is)
[05:50] <yuriy> yeah, that's what I mean
[05:50] <yuriy> but I would want pretty much a clone of pidgin, plus kde integration
[05:50] <Jucato> ok, just clarifying :)
[05:50]  * Jucato doesn't want a clone of pidgin's "Preferences" (settings) dialog setup...
[05:51] <yuriy> well, maybe not that, but I haven't touched that in years
[05:51] <Jucato> not that Kopete's entirely 100% better... but it is better, imho
[05:53]  * yuriy has a .gaim/.purple directory dating back to august 2004
[05:55] <Daskreech> Well technically if Kopete went MVC you could make a new IM with the Kopete backend
[05:55] <Daskreech> yuriy: what's better with pidgin than kopete?
[05:56] <Jucato> Daskreech: the way the notification popups are broken right now, is one major source of annoyance
[05:56] <yuriy> Daskreech: cleaner interface. also a bug with sending stuff in cyrillic that I keep forgetting to report (that's the real killer for me)
[05:57] <yuriy> Daskreech: basically pidgin has a very refined, minimal, but fully functional interface that started out better than any other client I've seen and has been slowly but noticeably improving for years
[05:58] <yuriy> the kopete/kde4 interface is much less cluttered than the kde3 version, but has still been largely stagnant and not so great IMO
[05:59] <yuriy> for example, pidgin has finally got setting the status Just Right
[06:02] <yuriy> also I think kopete still doesn't provide any custom buddy list sorting
[06:02] <Jucato> of course, that's just the UI :)
[06:02] <Jucato> not to mention the problems with the support for different protocols (which I imagine is a lot harder)
[06:03] <yuriy> yes, both libpurple and the pidgin front end are generally more mature
[06:04] <Jucato> I'm not yet going to throw the towel at kopete though... I'm taking a "wait and see" approach. in the meantime, I find myself switching between it and pidgin.
[06:05] <Jucato> and at the same time, Kopete sucking does not in anyway make KDE 4.1 suck for me :)
[06:05] <Jucato> (because I kinda expected kopete not to really satisfy me anyway...)
[06:05] <Daskreech> Jucato: Yeah I know notifications in Kopete are horrible but Ctrl+Shift+I makes up for that for me
[06:05] <Jucato> ha!!
[06:05] <Jucato> I hate that Ctrl+Shift+I
[06:05] <yuriy> Daskreech: is that that shortcut Kopete is stealing from Kate?
[06:05] <Jucato> yes!!
[06:06] <Jucato> I already filed a bug report last year iirc
[06:06] <Jucato> they should really be more careful in choosing global shortcuts...
[06:06] <Jucato> since they're global
[06:06] <Daskreech> What does ctrl+Shift+I do for kate?
[06:06] <Jucato> of course, Ctrl+Shift+I is the global shortcut for "Read Message".. which doesn't even have an 'i' in it
[06:07] <Jucato> Daskreech: Unindent
[06:07] <Daskreech> ah
[06:07] <Jucato> the opposite of Ctrl+I, which is indent
[06:07] <Daskreech> Ahh yeah I can see why that would be annoying
[06:07] <Daskreech> What would make more sense for a Global read message shortcut?
[06:08] <Jucato> Ctrl+Shift+R or M, if those aren't taken
[06:08] <Jucato> bye! :)
[06:09] <daskreech> Bah
[06:09] <daskreech> what happened after the last thing I said?
[06:10] <Jucato> [13:06] <Daskreech> What would make more sense for a Global read message shortcut?
[06:10] <Jucato> [13:07] <Jucato> Ctrl+Shift+R or M, if those aren't taken
[06:10] <Jucato> [13:07] <-- Daskreech has left this server ("Lost terminal").
[06:10] <daskreech> Ha ha
[06:11] <daskreech> Well isn't ctrl+Shift+R in the KDE HIG?
[06:11] <daskreech> For close view ?
[06:11] <daskreech> and M is most likely taken
[06:11] <daskreech> I'll check
[06:11] <Jucato> dunno
[06:12] <daskreech> yeah me either but I'd just assume that M is taken
[06:12] <Jucato> but how does Ctrl+Shift+I mean "Read Message" anyway?
[06:12] <Jucato> how about D? or G? or S? or E?
[06:12] <Jucato> !nickspam | n8k99
[06:12] <Jucato> >:)
[06:26] <j-b> hello
[06:27] <j-b> I am looking for the Qt4 packager team
[06:29] <daskreech> Hobbsee: Hi :)
[06:29] <daskreech> Jucato: No Idea but it's pretty close to the point where I don't think about it anymore
[06:29] <daskreech> It's almost like ctrl+alt+A or F12
[06:29] <Hobbsee> heya
[06:30] <daskreech> Hobbsee: How are you?
[06:30] <daskreech> j-b: Videolan rocks!
[06:30] <ScottK> Guys j-b is a VLC upstream and they're switching to qt4 in their next release (as I understand it)
[06:30] <Hobbsee> cold!
[06:31] <j-b> ScottK: not exact, but good summary :D
[06:31] <j-b> daskreech: thanks, next release will be better and defaulted to Qt
[06:32] <ScottK> I have to get up in ~4 hours, so I'm going to bed, but it'd be nice if someone could chat with him.
[06:32] <daskreech> Hobbsee: Serious?
[06:32] <j-b> ScottK: I'll stay around, thanks
[06:32] <Hobbsee> daskreech: yes
[06:32] <daskreech> Wow :)
[06:33] <Hobbsee> it's winter here.
[06:33] <daskreech> It's summer here but Winter is stil bloody hot :(
[07:13] <daskreech> j-b: What's up?
[07:15] <j-b> daskreech: I am looking for the Qt4 packaging team in ubuntu
[07:16] <daskreech> qt-copy or qt4-dev ?
[07:16] <j-b> the one providing libqt4-dev
[07:17] <j-b> the one providing libqt4-gui, in fact
[09:59] <Riddell> for asdf in kdeaccessibility kdeadmin kdebase-runtime kdeartwork  kdebase-workspace kdebase kdeedu kdegames kdegraphics kdemultimedia kdenetwork kdepim kdeplasma-addons kdesdk kdetoys kdeutils kdewebdev-kde4; do echo ${asdf}; cd ${asdf}/; dput ubuntu *changes; cd ..; done
[09:59] <Riddell> should keep my adsl busy for a bit :)
[10:18] <Riddell> apachelogger: I don't see phonon, akonadi or automoc in k-u-t
[10:19] <smarter> Riddell: you're uploading to intrepid?
[10:20] <Riddell> smarter: yep
[10:20] <smarter> but kdelibs is still broken :/ kdelibs5-dev: Depends: libsoprano-dev (>= 2.1.0) but it is not going to be installed
[10:21] <Riddell> so I noticed, just uploaded a fix
[10:21] <smarter> ok, is it possible to rebuild packages that FTBFS'd?
[10:22] <Riddell> yes
[10:23] <smarter> no problem then :)
[10:24] <Wubbbi> hello :)
[10:25] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: I have fixed the bug with the broken colour ( missing
 in the code ) :)
[10:28] <vorian> woo hoo, kde4libs just started building again
[11:11] <Riddell> JontheEchidna: ping, where's phonon and automoc backports?
[11:13] <Nightrose> A
[11:13] <Nightrose> meh..
[11:19] <sebas> apachelogger: I guess ~1600
[11:25] <Riddell> vorian: don't suppose you know?
[11:27] <smarter> Riddell: apachelogger's PPA
[11:28] <Riddell> smarter: looks empty
[11:28] <Riddell> hmm, deleted :(
[11:28] <smarter> oh, it's in kubuntu-updates-testing now
[11:30] <Riddell> oh, but no build records so it doesn't show up when searching the build records
[11:31] <Riddell> ok I uploaded soprano with the dfsg tar to hardy, so the dependencies on that will need their version changed
[11:31] <Riddell> grr to soprano for inconsistent version length and non-free evilness
[11:32] <smarter> what's non-free in soprano?
[11:32] <Riddell> java .jar files without source
[11:48] <apachelogger> re
[11:48] <Riddell> morning apachelogger
[11:49] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: ok ich hab jetzt nochmal einen Final Fix gemacht. Wenn du willst kannst du es wieder testen. Jetzt sollte alles funktionieren :)
[11:50] <Riddell> ich bin ein scottlander
[11:50] <Wubbbi> Riddell: I know :)
[11:51]  * apachelogger got an awesome headache
[11:51] <Riddell> apachelogger: packaging does that to you :)
[11:51] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: because of me? ^^
[11:52] <apachelogger> Riddell: you should have told me before I joined the packaging forces ;-)
[11:52] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: I got to bed at 5:30
[11:53]  * emunkki is back
[11:53] <jpds> "No coffee for Harald".
[11:53] <apachelogger> jpds: supervising the hardy 4.1.0 builds :P
[11:54] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: wuhhh ... I was in bed at 23:00 ... then I wanted to finish my work. So I have token my Laptop in my bed xD ... But then the batery was emphy and I dont want to chare it. So I have turned off my light and slepp in :D
[11:54] <Wubbbi> ^^
[11:54] <Wubbbi>   kdelibs5-dev: Depends: libsoprano-dev (>= 2.1.0) but it is not installable
[11:54] <apachelogger> Riddell: ^
[11:55] <emunkki> apachelogger, shall i send you more finnish coffee? ;)
[11:55]  * apachelogger greps the hardy packages for libsoprano
[11:55] <apachelogger> emunkki: that would be kind of wesome :D
[11:55] <Wubbbi> could someone upload libsoprano-dev? without this I cant build ;)
[11:55] <emunkki> apachelogger, if you pay for the stuff + shipping, i can do ;)
[11:55] <Riddell> kdelibs is the problem, I've uploaded a fix a couple of hours ago
[11:56] <apachelogger> build queue still that long?
[11:56] <apachelogger> hppa was almost at 1000 tonight
[11:56] <apachelogger> emunkki: I could also just come visit and take some with me ;-)
[11:56] <emunkki> even better
[11:56] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: the issue is a version number change
[11:56] <emunkki> i actually met sebr yesterday
[11:57] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: when will this fix? :)
[11:57] <apachelogger> when it is built
[11:57] <Wubbbi> be fix
[11:57] <Riddell> it is built, just needs to go into the archive
[11:57] <Wubbbi> Riddell: so why dont you upload?
[11:57] <Wubbbi> :)
[11:58]  * Riddell refers the honourable gentleman to the answer he gave some moments ago
[11:58] <Riddell> apachelogger: I'll now copy the world to kubuntu-members-kde4
[11:58] <apachelogger> Riddell: already?
[11:59] <apachelogger> Riddell: sebas stated ~16:00 as ETA
[11:59] <apachelogger> + kdesdk is not built
[11:59] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: well apachelogger can you test a new version ( with some fixes ) of kio-sysinfo?
[12:00] <Riddell> yeah but it'll take a while to copy and kde4libs isn't built yet in hardy and it means we have a bit of time to fix incase something goes wrong
[12:00] <apachelogger> Riddell: well, I uploaded a fix for kdesdk
[12:00] <apachelogger> Riddell: let's wait for it to build
[12:01] <Tonio_> hi there
[12:01] <Tonio_> back from the oscon, ready to work
[12:01] <Tonio_> Riddell: currently packaging kdebluetooth4
[12:01] <emunkki> oxygen-icons.org is slow!
[12:01] <Tonio_> hum it looks like kontact needs rebuilt according to the latest kdelibs....
[12:02] <Tonio_> does kontact work for you right now ?
[12:02] <Tonio_> or kmail ?
[12:02] <Tonio_> read(3, 0x93dcc08, 2048)                = -1 EAGAIN (Resource temporarily unavailable)
[12:02] <Tonio_> this is what strace reports to me
[12:02] <Riddell> Tonio_: we're about to upload all of 4.1 shortly
[12:02] <apachelogger> https://edge.launchpad.net/~sikon/+archive/+build/611994
[12:02] <apachelogger> ppa loop of death :S
[12:02] <Tonio_> Riddell: oki
[12:04] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: I have send you an e-mail with the current version. It would be nice if you can test it. But you dont have to ... I mean if you was busy, forgett it :)
[12:09] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: text color is correct agai
[12:09] <apachelogger> n
[12:09] <apachelogger> otherwise exactly like yesterday
[12:12] <Wubbbi> ok ... so is that ok like this?
[12:12] <Wubbbi> or any things need to be changed?
[12:15] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: ok for now, but write upstream a mail
[12:15] <apachelogger> asking to make the OS stuff work
[12:16] <apachelogger> that init is awfully slow and he should use dolphin to open the common folders
[12:17] <Wubbbi> does it use knqueror?
[12:17] <apachelogger> yes
[12:17] <apachelogger> oh
[12:17] <Wubbbi> ok ... I know how to change. wait please :)
[12:18] <apachelogger> and you might suggest making it scale on widescreen ;-)
[12:18] <smarter> it should use the default explorer, it should not be hardcoded to konqueror or dolphin
[12:18] <Wubbbi> smarter: ok
[12:18] <apachelogger> is it hardcoded to konqueror now?
[12:18]  * apachelogger doubts that somehow
[12:21] <Wubbbi> hmmm ... no line found which shows me, that it is hardcoded to konqueror
[12:24] <Wubbbi> if ( KStandardDirs::exists( KGlobalSettings::documentPath() + "/" ) )
[12:25] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: now I know why. You are using konqueror right? ( I mean as browser )
[12:28] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: one can't use sysinfo otherwise
[12:28] <apachelogger> it only works in konqueror
[12:29] <Wubbbi> well ok I have done the gorund part ... so I mean i have passed it on Kubuntu ... now someone who can c++ have to fix that things ... I cant this :)
[12:29] <apachelogger> that is why you should ask upstream to do it
[12:29] <nixternal> Happy Birthday to Me!!!!! AND IT IS KDE 4.1 RELEASE DAY!!!!!!
[12:29] <Wubbbi> upstream? who is that? the creater?
[12:29] <nixternal> now give me my damn KDE 4.1 birthday present!!! :)
[12:29]  * apachelogger happy birthdays nixternal
[12:30] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: upstream == upstream developer(s)
[12:30] <emunkki> apachelogger, ryanakca, is there any preferred oxygen icon for "kubuntu gear" ?
[12:30] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: we are downstream developers
[12:30] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: for sysinfo KDE is upstream for KDE X.org, Qt and others is upstream
[12:31] <apachelogger> emunkki: kubuntu gear?
[12:31] <emunkki> apachelogger, stuff sold by kubuntu?
[12:31] <emunkki> apachelogger, mugs, pics of nakkid Nightrose, etc.
[12:32]  * Nightrose pokes emunkki with the Long Pointy Stick Of Dooooooooooom(TM)
[12:32] <Riddell> ahem
[12:32] <emunkki> oh hi Nightrose ;)
[12:33] <Riddell> just incase :)
[12:33] <Nightrose> ;-)
[12:33] <apachelogger> emunkki: we have such a thingy Oo?
[12:33] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: so what I have to do now? to talk to who? kde-devel?
[12:33] <Wubbbi> #kde-devel
[12:33] <apachelogger> Riddell: emunkki always talks about nakkid Nightrose ;-)
[12:33] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: write upstream a mail
[12:33] <apachelogger> or post a comment on kde-apps
[12:33] <Nightrose> apachelogger: and I alwways poke him for it...
[12:33] <apachelogger> or find out where he lives and pay him a visit
[12:34] <apachelogger> Nightrose: I actually think he likes that poking :P
[12:34] <Nightrose> heh then I will need to find some other punishment
[12:34] <emunkki> ;)
[12:34] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: xD
[12:34] <emunkki> Nightrose: oh yes madame domina!
[12:35] <Nightrose> emunkki: enought now ;-)
[12:35] <emunkki> bah
[12:35] <emunkki> you're boring
[12:35] <emunkki> ;)
[12:35] <Nightrose> i know
[12:36] <Nightrose> ohhhhhhhh it's nixternal's birthday!
[12:36] <Nightrose> happy birthday nixternal \o/
[12:36] <emunkki> nixternal, don't know you, anyway HB!
[12:39] <emunkki> apachelogger, let me put it this way then: in the start page, should there be three topics: "Need Help?" "Get Involved!" and what?
[12:39] <emunkki> or anyone else who knows about this stuff can answer as well
[12:40] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: ok I will add a comment on kde-apps. Do I need to creat a new Project called "kio-sysinfo new kubuntu" or what?
[12:40] <apachelogger> emunkki: only ryanakca knows that kind of stuff I guess ;-)
[12:40]  * emunkki is uploading new draft
[12:41] <JontheEchidna> goood morning everybody! happy KDE 4.1 release day!
[12:41] <Wubbbi> sorry wrong buttom ^^
[12:41] <emunkki> apachelogger, everybody: http://emonk.fi/work/kubuntu/kubuntu_startpage_mockup_2.png
[12:42] <nixternal> emunkki: I am nobody, probably why you don't know me...i am just a happless troll who enjoys using Vista and making funny faces at the Kubuntu developers
[12:42] <JontheEchidna> cool^
[12:42] <nixternal> thanks Nightrose :)
[12:42] <JontheEchidna> oh, happy birthday
[12:43] <emunkki> JontheEchidna, thx
[12:43] <emunkki> any feedback is appreciated
[12:43] <nixternal> would have been cool if I turned 41 today, with the release of 4.1 and all, but I will stick with 34...don't want to get old like ScottK :P
[12:43] <Nightrose> :P
[12:45] <nixternal> so, my birthday plans for today are: work like a kid in a sweatshop because I am the new build master for our software now at work...that is just way to much work and I know the software doesn't work cuz I attempted to smoke test it last night
[12:46] <Nightrose> sounds like a great birthday present ;-)
[12:46] <nixternal> emunkki: that start page looks almost like one I did a few months back, but I used the plasma theme look instead
[12:46] <nixternal> looks good
[12:47] <emunkki> nixternal, thx
[12:48] <emunkki> nixternal, have a pic for your one?
[12:48] <jpds> happy birthday nixternal!
[12:54] <nixternal> emunkki: it is long gone... ryanakca may have a copy somewhere...actually wait, there should be one
[12:54]  * nixternal grabs it
[12:55] <emunkki> why was it abandoned?
[12:55] <nixternal> https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/WebsiteMockups <- thought it was there, but it isn't
[12:56] <nixternal> emunkki: cleaned off my web server
[12:56] <nixternal> thanks jpds
[12:56] <emunkki> ok
[12:56] <nixternal> time to get ready for work...everyone have a great day! happy release day!
[12:57] <apachelogger> nixternal: happy work-birth-release day!
[12:57] <apachelogger> or birth-work-release
[12:57] <apachelogger> *shrug*
[12:58] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: http://kde-apps.org/content/show.php?content=86196 is that ok like this?
[12:58] <apachelogger> ohhhhh
[12:59] <apachelogger> uhhhhhhh
[12:59] <apachelogger> ehhhhhhhhhhhhhh
[12:59] <apachelogger> meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeh
[12:59] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: that was absolutely not what I meant
[12:59] <apachelogger> Wubbbi:  I mean posting a comment to the upstream's upload
[12:59] <apachelogger> in fact I would highgly suggest to remove that one
[12:59] <apachelogger> we didn't review the package so I wouldn't want to publish it really
[13:01] <Tonio_> apachelogger: still no integration of ark in dolphin for 4.1 ?
[13:01] <Tonio_> that's really painfull
[13:04] <apachelogger> *nod*
[13:05]  * JontheEchidna blames ark for sucking
[13:06] <JontheEchidna> xarchiver has seemed to have gotten worse, though. :/
[13:06] <Tonio_> JontheEchidna: it doesn't suck that much, just that it lacks integration with dolphin
[13:06] <Tonio_> and nobody seems to care
[13:06] <apachelogger> may I introduce: DRebellion => Riddell, Riddell => DRebellion :P
[13:07] <DRebellion> lol, hi
[13:07] <Riddell> hello DRebellion
[13:07] <apachelogger> well
[13:07] <apachelogger> Tonio_, JontheEchidna: the problem really is that ark got a complete rewrite
[13:07] <DRebellion> Riddell, did you get my return email?
[13:07] <apachelogger> and as I understand it's only one guy working on it
[13:08] <apachelogger> so these features are considerable low priority
[13:08] <Tonio_> apachelogger: sure, I know that, but without integration with the file browser, it is pretty much useless
[13:08] <apachelogger> nah
[13:08] <apachelogger> without being able to open a .gz file it is pretty much useless
[13:08] <apachelogger> and that is annoying me much more ;-)
[13:08] <Tonio_> apachelogger: also, indeed :)
[13:08] <Tonio_> apachelogger: I've always felt that the lack of good archives manager in linux in general is really a shame
[13:09] <Tonio_> compare to what exists in the windows world.... even on the opensource side....
[13:09] <apachelogger> well, maybe one day ...
[13:09] <Jucato> ooooh Tonio_'s here!!
[13:09] <apachelogger> anyway, that context menu integration appears rather strange really
[13:09] <Tonio_> Jucato: yeah, back from oscon where I didn't get a decent and stable internet connection
[13:10] <Jucato> ohw was it? :)
[13:10] <apachelogger> that is like you select the cab depending on where you want to go to
[13:10] <Jucato> er.. how*
[13:10] <Tonio_> apachelogger: I dream of a winrar for linux in fact
[13:10] <Jucato> (besides not having an internet connection)
[13:10] <apachelogger> instead of getting in and telling the driver on where you want to go
[13:10] <JontheEchidna> Tonio_: wine to the rescue!
[13:10] <Tonio_> or izarc, or fillzip, or 7zip
[13:10] <Jucato> apachelogger: hm... actually that's how it works here :)
[13:10] <JontheEchidna> 7zip ftw
[13:10] <Tonio_> there is so much good tools for windows on that side
[13:10] <Jucato> (a.k.a. cabs are picky :)
[13:11] <apachelogger> Jucato: why would I use the cab then? :P
[13:11] <JontheEchidna> anyway, brb
[13:11] <Tonio_> 7zip is pretty decent in the command line side....
[13:11]  * JontheEchidna logs out/back in
[13:11] <Tonio_> I wonder how difficult would it be to write a gui for it
[13:11] <Jucato> apachelogger: coz you woldn't want to take the bus or a jeepney (wikipedia that one :P)
[13:11] <Tonio_> a 7zip based archives manager would deal with a large number of formats imho
[13:12] <Jucato> Tonio_: KDE 4 ark is getting some love lately... but the kde3 one is probably declared DOA...
[13:12] <Tonio_> and basically, you would have to deal with one tool only instead of 20 tools like ark does
[13:13] <Tonio_> Jucato: yeah, but in any case it still deals with one tool for one format, which is a bit stupid when 7zip does everything with unified commands
[13:13] <Tonio_> Jucato: ark should basically use 7zip in the first place imho
[13:13] <Tonio_> that would make it much easier to code btw
[13:22] <Tonio_> Jucato: I'd love that : http://kde-apps.org/content/show.php/aKu?content=78839&PHPSESSID=49b69a2aeab8e454b642fe766a6c475b
[13:23] <Tonio_> Jucato: but working with p7zip instead of rar in fact
[13:26] <Jucato> Tonio_: oh... looks like the new ark :)
[13:27] <Tonio_> Jucato: expect it already has integration with dolphin :)
[13:27] <Tonio_> Jucato: that with P7zip would be perfect imho
[13:27] <Jucato> Tonio_: not sure about being tied to one backend.. but whatever works! :)
[13:28] <Tonio_> Jucato: bah rar only supports rar :)
[13:28] <Tonio_> that's the problem with it
[13:28] <Tonio_> and btw is in multiverse
[13:28] <Tonio_> apachelogger: how came that libsoprano dep in kdelibs5-dev ?
[13:28] <Jucato> Tonio_: I meant if ark were to drop its multi-backend nature and adapt a single backend
[13:28] <Tonio_> apachelogger: kdelibs5-dev: Dépend: libsoprano-dev (>= 2.1.0) mais 2.1+dfsg.1-0ubuntu1
[13:29] <Tonio_> apachelogger: any idea ?
[13:29] <Tonio_> Jucato: ho yeah
[13:30] <Tonio_> apachelogger: the issue is in debian/control, I'm reuploading with a fix
[13:31] <apachelogger> Tonio_: intrepid?
[13:31] <apachelogger> Riddell already uploaded the fix
[13:31] <Tonio_> apachelogger: yeah
[13:31] <Tonio_> apachelogger: afaics riddell already fixed
[13:33] <Jucato> apachelogger: will people upgrading to 4.1 in hardy (if it's available) experience ~/.kde4 -> ~/.kde transition? or it will remain status quo?
[13:33] <apachelogger> .kde4
[13:33] <Jucato> ah thanks :)
[13:46] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: http://kde-apps.org/content/show.php added comment. better?
[13:46] <Wubbbi> :/
[13:47] <Wubbbi> omg
[13:47] <Wubbbi> wrong link wait
[13:47] <Wubbbi> http://kde-apps.org/content/show.php/New+sysinfo+1.0?content=85668
[13:47] <Wubbbi> :)
[13:53] <Jucato> apachelogger: the note at the 4.1 release page that says "There will be bugs with this release and it is recommended that you do not file bug reports against the packages in this release." really applies to 4.1?
[13:55] <apachelogger> Jucato: what release page?
[13:56] <apachelogger> KDE?
[13:56] <Jucato> apachelogger: ours
[13:56] <seele> yuriy: i'll look for your comment
[13:56] <Jucato> that one that gets posted a lot in #kubuntu-kde4 as irrefutable proof that 4.1 is released!
[13:56] <Jucato> and used as argument to "why does my upgrade epic fail?"
[13:57]  * Jucato is reminded to reload seele's blog post to see new comments
[14:00] <apachelogger> ryanakca: I guess you shouldn't publish news before hand as the news feed gets updated
[14:01] <emunkki> who is hand? :P
[14:02] <Riddell> apachelogger: oh?
[14:02] <apachelogger> Riddell: I guess you shouldn't publish news beforehand as the news feed gets updated :P
[14:03] <apachelogger> Riddell: see what Jucato said
[14:03] <apachelogger> I can't imagine any other reason than people getting the news via the rss feed
[14:03] <seele> yuriy: hum, can't find it.  weird
[14:03] <Jucato> dunno where they get it though.. but then again people are good at finding out things when they're obsessed with sth :)
[14:05] <apachelogger> well, considering the news is public accessible I supposed it is status published, which causes it to show up in the feed, no matter whether it is on  the frontpage or not
[14:05] <apachelogger> just a theory though
[14:06] <Riddell> this drupal thing still confuses me
[14:06] <Jucato> lovely ain't it?
[14:06] <emunkki> drupal==shit
[14:06] <Riddell> ok, unpublished
[14:07] <Riddell> !language
[14:07] <Jucato> Riddell: but my question remains though. "There will be bugs with this release and it is recommended that you do not file bug reports against the packages in this release." <-- still applies?
[14:07] <emunkki> oh i'm so sorry dictator.
[14:08] <Riddell> Jucato: I'll remove that
[14:08] <Nightrose> emunkki...
[14:08] <Riddell> emunkki: glad to hear it :)
[14:08] <Jucato> Riddell: thanks :)
[14:08] <apachelogger> haha
[14:08]  * Riddell uploads l10n
[14:08] <emunkki> Nightrose???
[14:09] <Nightrose> emunkki: #kubuntu-devel != #rokymotion ;-)
[14:10] <emunkki> Nightrose, #kubuntu-devel is at IRC, not on TV on USA at the best kid-watching time
[14:10] <apachelogger> Riddell: korn-kde4 got removed from kdepim ... will the ppa still have it in the Packages.gz?
[14:10] <apachelogger> emunkki: we have pretty young people here
[14:11] <Riddell> apachelogger: in a normal archive it would, PPA I'm not sure
[14:11] <apachelogger> Nightrose: can you please apt-get update and run apt-cache show korn-kde4
[14:11]  * apachelogger gets something to drink meanwhile
[14:11] <apachelogger> awfully hot today
[14:11] <emunkki> apachelogger, yeah you're a kid :P
[14:11] <emunkki> ;P
[14:11] <Nightrose> ok sec
[14:12]  * Riddell just likes a positive atmosphere
[14:13] <Nightrose> apachelogger: http://pastebin.com/m2e942fce
[14:14] <Jucato> Nightrose: you have strange guys, you know that? :)
[14:14] <Nightrose> heh tell me about it ;-)
[14:16] <apachelogger> so it apparently didn't get removed
[14:17] <apachelogger> someone please file a soyuz question to remove that deb
[14:19] <SolarWar> hey apachelogger, would you be in the mood for some packaging comments? :)
[14:29] <SolarWar> apachelogger, i see I'm being too persistent,  I'm sorry  :)
[14:34] <DRebellion> Riddell, is that apple icon image going to be a problem in posterazor?
[14:37] <Riddell> oh, so that's who you are DRebellion
[14:37] <DRebellion> Riddell, ...
[14:37] <Riddell> DRebellion: it's just a question of how one would edit it
[14:37] <Riddell> is the file edited directly or is there a source file
[14:37] <DRebellion> Riddell, I believe the file is edited directly
[14:37] <DRebellion> it's just an archive of different size images with some metadata i believe
[14:38] <Riddell> DRebellion: ok, I'll accept
[14:38] <DRebellion> :)
[14:38] <DRebellion> Riddell, I was wondering why all 60 odd packages got through NEW overnight, and mine was still sitting there..
[14:39] <DRebellion> apachelogger, ^^^^ :)
[14:41] <Riddell> what makes you think there were 60 packages in New last night?
[14:42] <DRebellion> Riddell, I have a vague recollection. But my memory has never been very reliable - feel free to disregard my comment ;)
[14:42] <Riddell> if there were, it was slangasek's archive day so he'd have been the one to review them
[14:44] <apachelogger> DRebellion: congrats on your first package :)
[14:45] <DRebellion> apachelogger, thanks
[14:49] <Jucato> seele: sorry for taking over your blog :P
[14:51] <seele> haha, no worries
[14:56] <Jucato> seele: can't believe how much I've been brainwashed by alan cooper.. and I haven't even finished the book... and it's a 1995 book at that!!
[14:57] <apachelogger> and I thought I am slow at reading
[14:57] <Jucato> heh :)
[14:58] <nixternal> whew it is hot in Chicago today
[14:58] <apachelogger> upper austria as well
[14:59] <Jucato> Philippines too
[14:59] <Jucato> are we all connected? O.o
[14:59] <Jucato> meteorologically
[14:59] <apachelogger> well
[15:00] <nixternal> kubuntuologically
[15:00] <apachelogger> global warming is happening everywhere
[15:00] <apachelogger> that is the point of the word global I guess :P
[15:00] <Jucato> nixternal: kubuntulogically.. extra 'o' in there
[15:00] <nixternal> apachelogger: no more global warming from me!!!! I ride my bike everywhere
[15:00] <apachelogger> question is .... where does the power for our machines come from?
[15:01]  * Jucato will refrain from commenting on "global warming" and "natural gases that come from nixternal"...
[15:01] <nixternal> hahaha
[15:01] <nixternal> my bicycle has exhaust :P
[15:01] <Jucato> and where does it go, pray tell? :)
[15:02] <nixternal> ok, gotta build out our software this lovely morning
[15:02] <nixternal> back in a while, a very long while :(
[15:02] <Jucato> hahah! you're changing the topic :P
[15:02] <apachelogger> hm
[15:03] <apachelogger> apparently on average ~65% of the energy produced in austria is renewable one
[15:04] <apachelogger> ah
[15:04] <apachelogger> not true
[15:04] <seele> is it better to just upgrade today's kde4.1 packages or start over?
[15:04] <apachelogger> winter imports
[15:04] <apachelogger> ~45%
[15:05] <apachelogger> yeah, in 2006
[15:05] <apachelogger> not that bad either
[15:05] <apachelogger> seele: what do you mean by start over?
[15:06] <seele> apachelogger: instead of the upgrading ive been doing for the past month, uninstall everything and install what was released today?
[15:06] <seele> sometimes i notice options and stuff are different from upgrades to fresh installs
[15:06] <apachelogger> seele: that is workaroundish :P
[15:06] <apachelogger> but everything should be fine with 4.1.0
[15:07] <seele> ok
[15:12] <Jucato> seele: upgrade, then nuke ~/.kde4 :D
[15:27] <Riddell> anyone installed hardy yet and tested it?
[15:29] <Jucato> 4.1 is out :)
[15:30] <Jucato> 4.1? upgrading as we speek
[15:32] <Tm_T> Jucato: um?
[15:32] <Jucato> Tm_T: yum?
[15:32] <Tm_T> nnnnnothing, I think it was me, seeing weird things
[15:32] <apachelogger> Riddell: various people did already
[15:33] <apachelogger> HAPPY KDE RELEASE DAY EVERYONE!
[15:34]  * apachelogger hands out beer and party hats
[15:34] <jussi01> beer!
[15:34] <Jucato> yay!!
[15:34] <Jucato> I think I'm really going to buy beer
[15:35] <Tm_T> bear!
[15:36]  * apachelogger actually bought champagne yesterday :D
[15:36] <Tm_T> I have water, does it count?
[15:36] <apachelogger> Riddell: please update the topic in -kde4
[15:36] <Jucato> not unless it's alcoholic :)
[15:37] <Jucato> apachelogger: what you want changed?
[15:37] <Tm_T> Jucato: water? no it's not, I don't have alcoholic stuff here, unless some of cleaning soaps are
[15:39] <Riddell> apachelogger: in where?
[15:39] <Riddell> Happy KDE 4.1 http://dot.kde.org/1217341401/
[15:39] <Riddell> big hugs to apachelogger for coordinating the packaging
[15:39] <Arby> congratulations everybody :)
[15:39] <Jucato> woot woot!
[15:39] <Jucato> special thanks to our 4.1 packaging packagers!
[15:41] <Jucato> Riddell: is this the correct link? http://www.kubuntu.org/news/kde-4.1
[15:41] <Jucato> ok to spread it now?
[15:41] <Jucato> ok just saw apachelogger :P
[15:41] <Riddell> Jucato: yes
[15:43] <yuriy> apachelogger: really october release for amarok 2.0? http://techbase.kde.org/Schedules/Is_KDE_4.1_for_you%3F
[15:44] <Tm_T> Jucato: #kubuntu is ok?
[15:44] <yuriy> Happy 4.1 Day!!
[15:44] <Nightrose> yuriy: that is the plan yes
[15:44] <Nightrose> happy release everyone :)
[15:45] <yuriy> Nightrose: does that mean it would be possible to make it default in Intrepid? :)
[15:45] <Jucato> Tm_T: I'd remove "4.0.5 in backports" :)
[15:45] <Nightrose> yuriy: unsure
[15:45] <Nightrose> we'll have to see
[15:45] <Nightrose> at least getting rid completely of <IP_ADDRESS> is unlikely
[15:45] <yuriy> though if we still have knm and kdebluetooth that won't matter much
[15:46] <yuriy> I think having those two around nearly doubles the time it takes KDE to load
[15:47] <yuriy> though there's also scim (and not skim!) starting up for some reason and it won't go away
[15:47] <Riddell> yuriy: do you have scim-bridge-client-qt4 installed?
[15:47] <yuriy> I'll check (I'm on my hardy machine now)
[15:48] <JontheEchidna> this happens with hardy
[15:48] <yuriy> but I have kubuntu-desktop installed so I should if that's part of it
[15:48] <JontheEchidna> and has since 8.04-KDE4 remix was released
[15:48] <JontheEchidna> scim-bridge-client-qt4 is installed, btw
[15:48] <Riddell> it's not part of kubuntu-desktop, I had to remove it because it insists on starting scim and takes ages to timeout if scim isn't around
[15:49] <Riddell> unfortunately it has no maintainer
[15:49] <Riddell> I wonder what other distros do about it
[15:49] <yuriy> JontheEchidna: ah right, it did, but I removed it and don't have kubuntu-kde4-desktop installed
[15:49] <JontheEchidna> anybody know how to make it go away?
[15:49] <Riddell> apt-get remove scim-bridge-client-qt4
[15:50] <yuriy> I would even aptitude remove scim* skim*, don't need any of that stuff
[15:50] <JontheEchidna> I tried that then the apps got all butthurt about not having scim
[15:50] <JontheEchidna> and didn't start up
[15:51] <yuriy> but the problem is the people who *do* need it
[15:51] <JontheEchidna> maybe I did it wrong (tm)
[15:53] <yuriy> now that's a huge headline I like to see on kubuntu.org
[15:53] <JontheEchidna> heh
[15:59] <yuriy> ooh shipit
[16:01] <yuriy> and my python pocket reference.. it's almost like it's supposed to go with the kubuntu CD
[16:25] <Tm_T> meow
[16:27] <Tm_T> we are having some (K)Ubuntu participation with our LUG and other linux distro communities in http://www.assembly.org/summer08/asm
[16:27] <Tm_T> let's see if I manage to get something about KDE 4 for that
[16:27] <Nightrose> apachelogger: http://digg.com/linux_unix/KDE_4_1_released_4
[16:27] <Nightrose> digg it please!
[16:28] <Wubbbi> JontheEchidna: Can you help me? I want to debuild a file ... and I need a diff.gz ... I have builded it succesfull with the orig.tar.gz ... but no diff.gz ... whats the problem?
[16:28] <JontheEchidna> does it include the original source?
[16:28] <Wubbbi> what? orig.tar.gz?
[16:29] <JontheEchidna> when you debuild -S -sa, did you have the orig.tar.gz named properly and everything?
[16:29] <Wubbbi> wai
[16:29] <Wubbbi> t
[16:30] <ryanakca> happy birthday nixternal :)
[16:31] <nixternal> thank you, and for my birthday I think I will jump out of the window..these people at work will drive you up a wall
[16:31] <ryanakca> Oh?
[16:31] <Wubbbi> JontheEchidna: that is what I get http://paste.ubuntu.com/31767/
[16:32] <JontheEchidna> Wubbbi:
[16:32] <JontheEchidna> This package has a Debian revision number but there does not seem to be
[16:32] <JontheEchidna> an appropriate original tar file or .orig directory in the parent directory;
[16:32] <JontheEchidna> (expected kio-sysinfo_1.0.orig.tar.gz or kio-sysinfo-1.0.orig)
[16:32] <JontheEchidna> continue anyway? (y/n) y
[16:33] <JontheEchidna> -_-
[16:33] <JontheEchidna> Thats why
[16:33] <JontheEchidna> the orig.tar.gz isn't named properly
[16:33] <Wubbbi> oO
[16:33] <Wubbbi> what to do?
[16:33] <JontheEchidna> name it properly!
[16:33] <JontheEchidna> ;)
[16:34] <Wubbbi> like it was when I unzip the original code? (sysinfo) ?
[16:34] <JontheEchidna> it needs packagename_version.orig.tar.gz
[16:35] <Wubbbi> ???
[16:35] <Wubbbi> so it should call like?
[16:36] <JontheEchidna> whateverthepackagenameis_theversionnumber.orig.tar.gz
[16:36] <Wubbbi> kio-sysinfo-1.0-0.orig.tar.gz?
[16:36] <Wubbbi> kio-sysinfo_1.0-0.orig.tar.gz?
[16:36] <JontheEchidna> ^the second one, I htink
[16:36] <Wubbbi> ok
[16:37] <JontheEchidna> no -0 though
[16:37] <JontheEchidna> just kio-sysinfo_1.0.orig.tar.gz
[16:39] <Wubbbi> JontheEchidna: God bless you http://paste.ubuntu.com/31770/ :/
[16:39] <JontheEchidna> did you make patches for your changes?
[16:39] <Wubbbi> no
[16:40] <JontheEchidna> that's the problem, then
[16:40] <Wubbbi> oO
[16:40] <Wubbbi> why cant I change it without patches?
[16:40] <JontheEchidna> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#head-21ed4ac3719256a0ce4c5f563206591eb5448329
[16:41] <JontheEchidna> because you get errors like that
[16:41] <JontheEchidna> ;)
[16:41] <Wubbbi> OMG ... thats so stupid -.- I cant make patches -.-
[16:42] <j-b> hello
[16:42] <j-b> I am looking for the Qt4 packager team
[16:42] <JontheEchidna> that would be here
[16:42] <Tm_T> in ubuntu atleast :)
[16:43] <Wubbbi> do I realy need to patch something oO
[16:43] <j-b> well, is there any ITP QGtkStyle in Intrepid ?
[16:43] <Tm_T> Wubbbi: no, you need to do your changes as a patch
[16:43] <Wubbbi> Tm_T: hehe ... and thats to problem. -.-
[16:44] <j-b> I am a developer of VLC media player, and we are moving to Qt4, but we received a lot of complaints from ubuntu users and having QGtkStyle in ubuntu would fix it
[16:44] <Tm_T> Wubbbi: and put that patch into patches folder etc
[16:45] <JontheEchidna> !info qgtkstyle
[16:45] <JontheEchidna> !info qgtkstyle intrepid
[16:45] <Wubbbi> But I cant create patches, because I dont know how to creat some ;)
[16:45] <JontheEchidna> maybe it's called something else...
[16:46] <JontheEchidna> or it could still need to be packaged
[16:50] <Tm_T> Wubbbi: ah, I see, good reason to learn, isn't it?
[16:51] <Wubbbi> Tm_T: yes but It will take month to learn it ;)
[16:51] <Wubbbi> and till that intrepid is releaed and I can do it for 9.04 ;)
[16:52] <Tm_T> it doesn't take month to learn it
[16:52] <Tm_T> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/PatchSystems
[16:54] <Wubbbi> Tm_T: is there a German wiki? That would be helpfull  :)
[16:54] <apachelogger> !info ding
[16:54] <apachelogger> ^ is your friend
[16:55] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: what is that programm about?
[16:55] <apachelogger> it is a dictionary :P
[16:56] <Wubbbi> oO *owned* xD
[17:03] <apachelogger> oh
[17:03] <apachelogger> I won the distro blog fight
[17:03] <apachelogger> hooray
[17:03] <apachelogger> http://planetkde.org/
[17:04] <apachelogger> hm.... looking that the opensuse news
[17:04] <Wubbbi> I dont understand it.  Sorry I cant build that package for Intrepid. It would be very nice but I cant. I'm too much noob for it :( sorry
[17:04] <apachelogger> Riddell: we probably should enhance our news with a bit of screenshot magic
[17:04]  * JontheEchidna suggests we jump on the screenie bandwaggon
[17:04] <JontheEchidna> *wagon
[17:05]  * apachelogger sends JontheEchidna
[17:06] <JontheEchidna> bah, where'd I put the source code...
[17:06] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: you have 4 options - fight through it and probably learn a lot - find a mento guiding you trhough it and probably understand more - give up on kio-sysinfo and start with something easier - stop packaging
[17:06] <JontheEchidna> oh, here
[17:06] <Xand3r> apachelogger: "don't look back" nice^^
[17:06] <JontheEchidna> ~/gitrepos
[17:06] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: now, I am not much of a person who is giving up, so I would go with the first option even if it takes quite some time :)
[17:07] <apachelogger> Xand3r: not mine - go hug #oxygen
[17:07] <apachelogger> oh
[17:07] <apachelogger> that makes it mine ;-)
[17:07] <Xand3r> ^^
[17:07] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: das problem ist, Ich weiß nicht wie so ein patch aussehen soll. Glaub mir ich mach das wirklich gerne und aufgeben wäre echt das letzte für mich, aber ich weiß einfach nie wie ein patch ausgebaut ist, was rein muss und wie er funktioniert.
[17:08] <Xand3r> back in some seconds
[17:08] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: ask wikipedia what a patch is ;-)
[17:09] <apachelogger> I am quite sure most people here have one at hand so you can take a look at it
[17:09] <apachelogger> and most people know how to create patches in a productive manner
[17:09] <JontheEchidna> lol, I didn't know jr could transform
[17:09] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: I will take a look at some patches
[17:09] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: sure that is when he starts sentences with capital letters ;-)
[17:10] <JontheEchidna> heh
[17:11] <JontheEchidna> on the bright side, all of my other packages were ok besides kdesdk and kdelibs
[17:11] <JontheEchidna> :P
[17:12] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: alle änderungen die man macht werden mit einen + ( hinzufügen ) und einem - ( entfernen ) gekenntzeitchet richtig?
[17:13] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: aye
[17:13] <Wubbbi> aye?
[17:13] <apachelogger> yes
[17:13] <Wubbbi> ok ... what does that mean "@@ -75,3 +75,4 @@" ???
[17:13] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: know pirates - they say "aye, aye" ;-)
[17:13] <apachelogger> very good question
[17:13]  * apachelogger doesn't know
[17:14] <Wubbbi> xD
[17:14] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: the first number is the line where the patch starts
[17:14] <apachelogger> the second how many lines got changed
[17:14] <Wubbbi> line 75,3 ??? oO
[17:14] <Wubbbi> xD
[17:14] <apachelogger> and the second second one is the amount of lines add I guess
[17:14] <apachelogger> so the patch probably changes 3 lines and adds one, right?
[17:15] <Wubbbi> ohhh ... now I understand ok
[17:15] <apachelogger> cool
[17:15]  * apachelogger know also knows what these numbers are for :D
[17:15] <apachelogger> s/know/now
[17:18] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: 75,3 shows me, where the patch starts?
[17:19] <Wubbbi> 75 = line and the ,3 shows what additional lines?
[17:19] <apachelogger> no
[17:20] <apachelogger> -n,n +n,n
[17:20] <apachelogger> -n,n defines at which line how many following lines got removed
[17:20] <Wubbbi> removed? ... goood :D
[17:20] <apachelogger> in the example line 75, 76 and 77 got removed
[17:20] <apachelogger> +n,n defines at which line how many lines got add again
[17:21] <apachelogger> in the example line 75, 76, 77, 78
[17:21] <Wubbbi> and if I dont want to add any line I just have to say @@ -75,3 @@@ ???
[17:21] <Wubbbi> -@
[17:21] <JontheEchidna> can't you just use diff?
[17:21] <JontheEchidna> nobody types all that stuff out
[17:21] <apachelogger> that's what I wanted to say jus tnow
[17:22] <Wubbbi> I dont know. I have a example of kdebase-kde4-4.0.3/apps/kfind/kfind.desktop here
[17:23] <Wubbbi> JontheEchidna: so what you mean? use diff? oO Sorry I dont understand ^^
[17:23] <smarter> Wubbbi: just ignore the @@ thingy, it's for the computer, not you :P
[17:23] <smarter> Wubbbi: man diff && man patch
[17:24] <Wubbbi> smarter: so just type -75,3?
[17:24] <Wubbbi> tippe
[17:24] <smarter> no
[17:24] <Wubbbi> tipe
[17:24] <Wubbbi> what ever xD
[17:24] <smarter> ignore the @@ line
[17:24] <smarter> you don't have to create diff files
[17:24] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: you don't fiddle that stuff manually
[17:24] <smarter> diff create them for you!
[17:24] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: say
[17:24] <smarter> and patch applies them
[17:24] <apachelogger> you have 2 directories
[17:25] <Wubbbi> smarter: ohhh
[17:25] <apachelogger> on is th original source
[17:25] <apachelogger> one a  changed version
[17:25] <Wubbbi> smarter: so how to creat patches? xD
[17:25] <apachelogger> using diff you can create the patch
[17:25] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: diff oldthing newthing
[17:25] <Wubbbi> Konsole --- diff?
[17:25] <apachelogger> diff -urNad will give a pretty nice version ;-)
[17:25] <smarter> [18:23:21] <smarter> Wubbbi: man diff && man patch
[17:25]  * smarter uses diff -Nru
[17:26] <Wubbbi> open via konsole?
[17:26] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: you can also use man:/diff in konqueror
[17:26] <apachelogger> or man:/patch
[17:26] <smarter> it's a command, open it with whatever terminal you use
[17:26] <Riddell> vorian: going to upload extragear to intrepid?
[17:27] <smarter> apachelogger: hmm, the -d option looks interesting
[17:28] <smarter> Riddell: by the way, could you please upload guidance-power-manager 4.1.0 to intrepid from the bzr branch? It's the only thing he didn't package :P
[17:28] <Wubbbi> and what option sould I choose?
[17:28] <smarter> Wubbbi: -Nrud
[17:29] <smarter> Riddell: well, he packaged it but then gave me the package and I added some stuff
[17:29] <j-b> JontheEchidna: yes, Qgtkstyle isn't package anywhere
[17:30] <Wubbbi> diff -Nurd [file] ???
[17:32] <JontheEchidna> hmm, I don't think there's a stable release yet
[17:32] <JontheEchidna> I guess somebody could package an svn snapshot
[17:33] <Wubbbi> UHHH! thats easyer than I thought it was! xD
[17:33]  * JontheEchidna looks for other qt themes for reference
[17:34] <Riddell> smarter: this one? https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/guidance/powermanager-ubuntu
[17:34] <smarter> yep
[17:35] <Riddell> smarter: that's not been updated http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/guidance/powermanager-ubuntu/annotate/8?file_id=changelog-20080618103409-ltf4z6dvfsn7x190-3
[17:35] <smarter> hmm, I think forgot to push my changes^^'
[17:35] <smarter> *I forgot
[17:35] <smarter> Riddell: should be OK now
[17:37] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: coool ... so langsam kann ich es :D
[17:39] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: how to tell a patch, that the icons are replaced?
[17:39] <Wubbbi> by other
[17:39] <Riddell> smarter: groovy, uploading
[17:40] <Wubbbi> Binärdateien /home/egon/Desktop/sysinfo/src/about/suse/images/nvidia.png and /home/egon/Desktop/kio-sysinfo_1.0/src/about/kubuntu/images/nvidia.png sind verschieden.
[17:40] <smarter> ach, sie sind verschieden, das ist nicht gut
[17:40] <smarter> Wubbbi: that's a bit more complicated
[17:40] <Wubbbi> smarter: the others are nonfree icons ;)
[17:41] <smarter> you should use uuencode/uudecode
[17:41] <skreechmiester> seele: ping
[17:41] <Wubbbi> now they are free GPL Oxygen icons
[17:41] <kishore> hello folks.. i just stopped by to say thank you! :)
[17:41] <Wubbbi> smarter: oO how to use that?
[17:41] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: you can't
[17:41] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: you will have to recreate the tarballs
[17:41] <apachelogger> replacing the icons
[17:41] <Riddell> kishore: what's that for?
[17:42] <apachelogger> and attaching some dfsg thingy to the version number
[17:42] <kishore> i just upgaded from kde4 RC to the final version and it all went smooth
[17:42] <apachelogger> smarter will guide you :P
[17:42] <Riddell> kishore: hardy or intrepid?
[17:42] <apachelogger> smarter: no they are non-dfsg compatible I guess
[17:42] <kishore> hardy
[17:42] <kishore> 64
[17:42] <apachelogger> smarter: thus should be removed from the tarball
[17:42] <kishore> except for one meta package kdepim
[17:42] <smarter> apachelogger: I'm learning PyQt, I can't mentor :P
[17:42] <JontheEchidna> any reason why korn-kde4 wasn't in the hardy kdepim packages?
[17:42] <Riddell> kishore: great, thanks for letting us know.  give apachelogger a hug for organising it all
[17:42]  * kishore hugs apachelogger
[17:43] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: kannst du mir das vllt auf deutsch erklären? das wäre supper :)
[17:43] <apachelogger> cool
[17:43] <apachelogger> kishore: that should be fixed by now
[17:43] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: got removed
[17:43] <smarter> und ich spreche nicht Deutsch, so ich kann nicht Wubbi geholfen :P
[17:43] <apachelogger> :)
[17:44] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: why would the remove it in the final but have it in rc1?
[17:44] <Wubbbi> smarter: oO
[17:44] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: debian hat eine ganz genau definition von regeln
[17:44] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: das ist mir im laufe der zeit auch aufgefallen ^^
[17:44] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: anyway, it seems to be causing upgrade troubles for those who have the 4.0.98 of korn installed
[17:44] <kishore> apachelogger: you also work on amarok dont you? Thanks tfor that yet another awesome application!
[17:44] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: because the quality didn't make it
[17:45] <apachelogger> kishore: I left the amarok project some weeks ago ;-)
[17:45] <apachelogger> kishore: you can thank Nightrose though
[17:45] <apachelogger> she's the new amarok release coordinator
[17:45] <kishore> Nightrose: Thank you!
[17:45] <Wubbbi> smarter: can you guid me? :(
[17:45] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: solche dateien müssen entweder entfernt oder ersetzt werden
[17:45] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: in der tarball selbst
[17:46] <Wubbbi> und das geht wie?
[17:46] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: dann ist natürlich 1.0.0 nichtmehr = 1.0.0 ... darum hängt man meistens ein .dfsg.1 an ... oder ein +dfsg1 etc
[17:46] <apachelogger> Wubbbi: das lass dir von smarter erklären ;-)
[17:46] <Wubbbi> smarty ... come here :D
[17:46] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: hm
[17:46] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: we could certainly add a replaces/conflicts to libkdepim4
[17:47] <apachelogger> but that is quite workaroundish
[17:47] <smarter> Wubbbi: useful stuff da:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#head-52a0ca99072b5072c1ff6622b30c896bea66faa1
[17:47] <apachelogger> and we all know, I hate workarounds ;-)
[17:47] <Wubbbi> smarter: again a wikiguid -.-
[17:48] <Wubbbi> Nativ or Non-Nativ?
[17:48] <apachelogger> ha
[17:48] <apachelogger> Replaces: kde-icons-oxygen
[17:48] <Xand3r> Wubbbi: read them, otherwise you stay stupid like me
[17:48] <apachelogger> in Package: libkdepim4-kde4
[17:49] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: again I am wondering how these packages work at all
[17:50] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: are you sure it is caused by the fact that kcron-kde4 is installed?
[17:50] <apachelogger> form a logical pov dpkg should be intelligent enough to remove kron in favor the 10 other apps which depend on libkdepim4
[17:50] <Artemis_Fowl> KDirWatch - Artemis_Fowl : 3-0
[17:50] <Artemis_Fowl> i was owned ....
[17:50] <apachelogger> :S
[17:50] <JontheEchidna> D:
[17:51] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: I think I am going to leave kdepim as it is
[17:51] <JontheEchidna> I'll just recommend people to remove korn-kde4
[17:51] <apachelogger> I think most people will not have korn installed
[17:52] <apachelogger> and it would be quite awful to force them again into an upgrade
[17:52] <JontheEchidna> people who installed the kdepim metapackage would
[17:52] <apachelogger> yeah
[17:52]  * JontheEchidna didn't
[17:52] <Wubbbi> smarter: hmmm ... so I do that when I debuild it?
[17:52] <apachelogger> I still think that kron will get removed and that those reports JontheEchidna got are from ppa1 where the metapkg still depends on korn
[17:53] <smarter> Wubbbi: do what?
[17:54] <smarter> Wubbbi: you have to create get-orig-source: target in debian/rules which gets the tarball, unpack it, do the changes and repack it
[17:54] <kishore> one thing i always wanted to ask about is nm0.7... is it usable and installable in hardy?
[17:54] <kishore> I look forward to using the plasma applet but it only works with 0.7
[17:54] <DRebellion> apachelogger, monkeystudio is in revu: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=monkeystudio
[17:54] <smarter> Wubbbi: and the version number should be something like 1.0.0.dfsg-0ubuntu1
[17:55] <smarter> Wubbbi: that is, you have to add a .dfsg after the version number
[17:55] <Wubbbi> ohhh ok
[17:58] <Wubbbi> smarter: and how should this get-orig-source call?
[17:59] <smarter> smarter: debian/rules get-orig-source
[18:00] <Wubbbi> hä? ... should I creat a file or type it into the konsole?
[18:00] <kishore> Riddell, apachelogger the cmake package does not contain the either the ncurses gui or qt gui
[18:00] <kishore> why is that?
[18:00] <smarter> [18:54:14] <smarter> Wubbbi: you have to create get-orig-source: target in debian/rules which gets the tarball, unpack it, do the changes and repack it
[18:00] <seele> skreechmiester: pong
[18:00] <Riddell> kishore: cmake from backports does
[18:01] <smarter> Wubbbi: debian/rules already exist, and it is called when you do dpkg-buildpackage, or debuild or whatever
[18:01] <smarter> Wubbbi: you can call it manually, for example debian/rules build
[18:01] <skreechmiester> seele: I was reading your blog. What are you thoughts on the comment that there should be a revert option that prompts for original settings or your last good settings ?
[18:01] <smarter> Wubbbi: and you can add the target get-orig-source so that something happens when you do debian/rules get-orig-source
[18:02] <kishore> Riddell: oh is that a more recent addition? i have blocked that update since i discovered that in ppa package
[18:02] <kishore> thanks for that
[18:02] <Wubbbi> smarter: ok ... what do I need to write into debian/rules ( auser das normale zeug )
[18:03] <seele> skreechmiester: you mean factory settings versus last saved session?
[18:03] <smarter> [18:47:02] <smarter> Wubbbi: useful stuff da:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#head-52a0ca99072b5072c1ff6622b30c896bea66faa1
[18:03] <Wubbbi> I allready have open it. But I dont understand it :)
[18:04] <seele> skreechmiester: are you asking which one?  or that a revert button is a good idea?
[18:04] <seele> skreechmiester: in the GNOME dialogs, or for in KDE?
[18:04] <skreechmiester> seele: KDE
[18:05] <skreechmiester> so instead of a defaults and revert have one button
[18:05] <skreechmiester> which can do both
[18:05] <smarter> Wubbbi: read again, or use a dictionary like apachelogger said :P
[18:05] <seele> skreechmiester: i don't know, because i dont think we should do it in System Settings
[18:05] <Riddell> kishore: fairly new
[18:05] <seele> skreechmiester: i think there are more applications like KNotes that we could use it for
[18:05] <skreechmiester> seele: I'm lost.
[18:05] <skreechmiester> seele: Use what?
[18:06] <seele> skreechmiester: ar eyou talking about save?
[18:06] <seele> skreechmiester: because there already is a Revert button in system settings modules
[18:06] <skreechmiester> seele: No I'm talking about undoing
[18:06] <skreechmiester> seele: Right which goes back to the state of the dialog when it was opened
[18:06] <kishore> Riddell: looks like the ncurses gui is back but the new qt4 gui is still missing :(
[18:06] <seele> actually, it is called Defaults
[18:07] <Wubbbi> smarter: ok so I have to right down ( in debian/rule ) which file he have to replace with which?
[18:07] <seele> skreechmiester: and it isn't consistent.  originally it was supposed to be factory defaults.  now i'm not sure what it does
[18:07] <smarter> Wubbbi: look at the examples
[18:07] <Riddell> kishore: in cmake-gui
[18:07] <seele> skreechmiester: i think session undo is fine, undoing individual options in a configuration dialog would be confusing
[18:08] <seele> configuring options is exploratory, so it would be hard to keep a mental history of what you did
[18:08] <kishore> Riddell: yes but that is not there in the package
[18:08] <seele> skreechmiester: because you would probably undo more than one change when you use it that way
[18:08] <Riddell> kishore: so install that package
[18:09] <Wubbbi> smarter: do I use a watch file?
[18:09] <smarter> Wubbbi: that would make things easier
[18:09] <kishore> Riddell: apologies. I thought cmake-gui was automatically installed with cmake as is ccmake
[18:10] <Wubbbi> smarter: and how to creat one?
[18:10] <smarter> Wubbbi: see the debian new maintainer's guide and ubuntu PackagingGuide
[18:10] <smarter> I'm not google
[18:12] <Wubbbi> smarter: why do you allways show me guids? Guids are heavy to understand, because you cant ask them and they dont know how much noob you are. Can't you explain me?
[18:12] <smarter> Wubbbi: because repeating what's already written in guides is useless?
[18:12] <smarter> Wubbbi: if you have a specific question, ask
[18:13] <smarter> Wubbbi: you're question is already answered in one of these guides, and better than I could answer it
[18:13] <Xand3r> apachelogger: i added the depend on kdelibs5-dbg for digikam-kde4 and i removed the watchfile
[18:13] <Xand3r> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=digikam-kde4
[18:14] <skreechmiester> seele: Right someone was making the point that Kcontrol and system settings asks you when you are leaving a dialog if you want it to save or not
[18:14] <skreechmiester> seele: He was saying that Defaults could do the same. ask if you want factory defaults or last settings before this session
[18:14] <seele> that's different
[18:15] <seele> on is asking if you want to save unsaved changes
[18:15] <seele> just like if you close a changed document
[18:15] <apachelogger> Riddell: I think we should remaster the kde4 livecd with 4.1
[18:15] <seele> Revert is saying throw away all my changes from this session
[18:15] <smarter> Wubbbi: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#head-50e9a6c8dba7adaa78d9903fa13d4513f32e290c
[18:15] <seele> Save is only saving unsaved changes
[18:15] <seele> theyre not the same
[18:15] <smarter> Wubbbi: see? I just searched "debian/watch" on this page and found that, which will  explain everything to you
[18:15] <DRebellion> apachelogger, did you get my earlier message?
[18:16] <apachelogger> DRebellion: monkeystudio in revu?
[18:16] <DRebellion> apachelogger, yep :)
[18:16] <apachelogger> yah
[18:16] <apachelogger> too broken too revu it though
[18:16]  * apachelogger should go to bed quite early today
[18:16] <DRebellion> apachelogger, who broke you?
[18:16] <apachelogger> 4.1.0
[18:16] <DRebellion> hehe
[18:16] <DRebellion> apachelogger, no problem
[18:17] <skreechmiester> seele: yes I understand that but part of the problems with explict save vs implicit is how do you get back to a place that's good if you have no point of reference
[18:17] <skreechmiester> and the Gnome ideas behind that are to strip out choices as it's oveall confusing and messy
[18:18] <seele> ok.. but i'm not sure what you are getting at
[18:19] <skreechmiester> Well I'm saying that the argument about implicit/explcit save are more to do with how do you deal with mistakes than how to allow the user to save
[18:19] <seele> skreechmiester: http://blogs.gnome.org/desrt/files/2007/08/prefs-apply-close-undo.png
[18:19] <seele> skreechmiester: are you talkniga bout that dialog?
[18:19] <seele> Undo is only a single change or step, not resetting the dialog to the pre-session settings
[18:19] <skreechmiester> If that's handled well then there is a much easier choice of selecting implcicit/explicit for a particualr dialof
[18:20] <skreechmiester> dialog
[18:20] <skreechmiester>  yes i read that
[18:20] <Xand3r> Riddell: may be you could revie it? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=digikam-kde4
[18:20] <Wubbbi> smarter: ok ... thank you :)
[18:21] <Xand3r> urg
[18:21] <Xand3r> i remember rubberband
[18:21] <Xand3r> uff
[18:22] <skreechmiester> seele: Ok :-) I guess what I'm asking is should we be having a disucssion on how to handle the possible cases of how to protect people from mindless/harmful changes and how to simplify that instead of should there be an apply button or not?
[18:23] <skreechmiester> It seems to me that the cases of implicit save versus explicit always bring up the same points as to where they work very well respectively
[18:24] <skreechmiester> it's the dangers of users choices or unpredicitably that is the center of problems
[18:25] <skreechmiester> maybe we should be looking at how to manage that danger then the saving method will be simpler to deal with
[18:25] <seele> skreechmiester: maybe.  the problem with using it in something like system settings is that the different module topics have different levels of control
[18:25] <seele> skreechmiester: some wont break your system, others will
[18:26] <seele> skreechmiester: being able to have an escape is one of the problems with the GNOME dialogs, but that isn't the only problem with implicit save
[18:26] <skreechmiester> seele: right and the conversation about implicit versus explcit doesn't help there
[18:26] <seele> skreechmiester: there would have to be exceptions for different types of dialogs which introduct inconsistencies
[18:26] <skreechmiester> cause if it saves instantly or you press ok you are still faced with a dead broken system
[18:26] <skreechmiester> seele: Well that's the next part of what I was thinking about
[18:27] <skreechmiester> There should be some visual way of knowing as you enter a dialog if it's implicit or explicit but if the getting back to good is taken care of it's much less of a danger and more an inconvience
[18:28] <seele> trying to figure out how the dialog works shouldnt be the burden of the user though
[18:28] <seele> they should just use it, not understand the different interaction mechanics
[18:28] <skreechmiester> seele: Yes but it's much less a pain point than breaking things and not being able to fix it
[18:29] <seele> i would rather pursue how it can be used with more ephemeral information to learn how users work with implicit save before moving on to something like system settings modules
[18:29] <Nightrose> kishore: ;-) you're welcome
[18:29] <Nightrose> though it is of course not only my work
[18:30] <kishore> Nightrose: I know... and i thank everyone of you but making it generic kinda dilutes it so... :)
[18:31] <Nightrose> kishore: ;-)
[18:31] <skreechmiester> seele: ok .. would a revertion system be able to be consistent regardless of implict or explicit save in most circumstances?
[18:32] <skreechmiester> Obviously Knotes with no buttons doesn't count :)
[18:32] <skreechmiester> but that works well as it is
[18:32] <skreechmiester> Though.. I guess you may not be able to comment on that
[18:33] <seele> skreechmiester: the problem is Revert is ambiguous, so it would have to be a better button label.
[18:34] <seele> but at the same time, you wont need revert with most ephemeral data
[18:34] <skreechmiester> Right I was putting up the idea that a choice when clicking revert between defaults and last saved session would make it much less ambigious get rid of the need for a new button
[18:35] <skreechmiester> But I suppose you will look at that
[18:38] <apachelogger> The server wiki.kde.org refused to allow this computer to make a connection.
[18:38] <apachelogger> I seriously don't like that wiki
[18:39] <apachelogger> in 9/10 times I would want to visit it's db is eithe broken it's close not responding or it is not responding
[18:47] <Wubbbi> smarter: the watch filde must be in the folder /debian right?
[18:58] <Wubbbi> smarter: ??? are you here?
[19:02] <JontheEchidna> Wubbbi: yeah, the watch file goes in debian/
[19:04] <smarter> Wubbbi: yes
[19:04] <smarter> Wubbbi: everything you do is in debian/
[19:08] <yuriy> apachelogger: great post! JontheEchidna, smarter, vorian, Arby, apachelogger and of course Riddell: thanks for your awesome work!
[19:08] <smarter> you're welcome ;)
[19:08] <Xand3r> i have here a patch, why does it not work for me? http://sources.gentoo.org/viewcvs.py/gentoo-x86/media-libs/rubberband/files/rubberband-1.2-gcc43.patch?rev=1.1&content-type=text/plain
[19:12] <Xand3r> back in some seconds
[19:16] <Wubbbi> smarter: one question. Wouln't it be easyer then I change the Icons in orig.tar.gz and "mything" direkt? I mean I just remove the non-free Icons. I dont change anything on the base files
[19:17] <smarter> mything?
[19:17] <smarter> if you change something in the orig.tar.gz, people have to know it's not the "real" orig
[19:18] <Riddell> apachelogger: remastered CD would be nice, but it's a good day's work and I don't know where we'd host it
[19:18] <Riddell> Xand3r: looking at digikam now
[19:18] <Xand3r> Riddell: thx
[19:25] <Wubbbi> smarter: but thats just icons. I mean Icons wont change the hole Program.
[19:25] <smarter> Wubbbi: say that to Debian people :P
[19:25] <smarter> you changed the source, you have to clearly indicate how and why
[19:31] <Wubbbi> -_-
[19:31] <Wubbbi> but I dont understand that with watch and the stuff
[19:32] <Riddell> ooh, nepomuk seems to have started working
[19:32] <Wubbbi> smarter: what should be in the watch file? ... how should it call?
[19:32] <yuriy> Riddell: userconfig runs with the changes you mentioned, thanks
[19:32] <smarter> Wubbbi: I sent you a link
[19:33] <smarter> [19:15:22] <smarter> Wubbbi: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#head-50e9a6c8dba7adaa78d9903fa13d4513f32e290c
[19:33] <Wubbbi> smarter: yes I know and I have read that. But I dont understand ( understand =! Read ) wath to fill in there
[19:34] <Wubbbi> ( the watch file )
[19:34] <smarter> the adresse of the latest version of the program you're packaging
[19:34] <Wubbbi> adress = download link?
[19:34] <Wubbbi> or Hoempage
[19:34] <Wubbbi> Homepage
[19:34] <smarter> download
[19:34] <smarter> debian/watch is used to download something
[19:34] <smarter> see the examples
[19:35] <Wubbbi> ahhh ok
[19:35] <smarter> have you looked at the examples?
[19:35] <Wubbbi> and version means what version?
[19:35] <Wubbbi> smarter: yes
[19:35] <smarter> look more closely, you don't have to put the version number
[19:36] <Wubbbi> why? there was a example which shows me: "version=3"
[19:36] <Wubbbi> what does that mean?
[19:37] <Wubbbi> "The very first line of the watch file must be the format version, currently 3, and then other lines can contain urls to parse." so I have to use 3?
[19:37] <smarter> yes
[19:37] <smarter> you see, everything is written :p
[19:37] <Wubbbi> :P
[19:39] <Wubbbi> but the download link of the source is a .zip. does this matter? ( http://rogozinski.org/projects/sysinfo/factory/src/sysinfo-1.0.zip )
[19:51] <Wubbbi> smarter: is that right in watch? "http://rogozinski.org/projects/sysinfo/factory/src/sysinfo-(.*)\.tar\.bz2\.zip"
[19:53] <Wubbbi> smarter???
[19:55] <Wubbbi> smarty ... :(
[19:56] <stdin> Wubbbi: "http://rogozinski.org/projects/sysinfo/factory/src/sysinfo-(.*)\.zip" would be more like it
[19:57] <stdin> unless it's a .tar.bz2.zip file ;)
[19:57] <Wubbbi> ahh ok :)
[19:58] <Wubbbi> Newest version on remote site is 1.0, local version is 1.0-0.dfsg
[19:58] <Wubbbi> ok seems to work :)
[19:58] <Wubbbi> great :D
[19:59] <Wubbbi> smarter: ok ... now I have to replace in the not Original ( with the debian folder ) the icons with the oxygen one right?
[20:01] <Wubbbi> The watch file is created.
[20:01] <Wubbbi> and now?
[20:01] <Wubbbi> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#head-52a0ca99072b5072c1ff6622b30c896bea66faa1 ahh ok :)
[20:02] <Wubbbi> smarter: hmmm ... now I need your help. what is my next step on the guid?
[20:09] <Riddell> Xand3r: dh_install: digikam-kde4 missing files (debian/xpm.d/digi*), aborting
[20:10] <Xand3r> Riddell: oh thx
[20:12] <Xand3r> Riddell: why they are missing
[20:13] <Wubbbi> smarter ? are you online?
[20:15] <allee> Xand3r: somebody removed to much from debian/rules.    rules should copy the xpm.d/* files.  dh_install is useless
[20:16] <allee> s/to/too/
[20:17] <Wubbbi> apachelogger: can you help me ... smarter seems to be offline
[20:18] <Xand3r> Wubbbi: what is your problem?
[20:18] <Xand3r> allee: dont know what you mean?
[20:18] <Wubbbi> Xand3r: I have created a watch file now ( succesfull ) ... Now I dont know what to do now.
[20:19] <Xand3r> i dont know what you have done already and i dont know what you whant to do exactly
[20:20] <apachelogger> Riddell: maybe kubuntu-de.org is interested, I figured they usually like a bit of promotion ;-)
[20:20] <allee> Xand3r: someone removed from debian/rules: install -D -p -m 0644 debian/xpm.d/digikam.xpm $(CURDIR)/debian/digikam/usr/share/pixmaps/digikam.xpm
[20:21] <Xand3r> allee: not some one. i have done it -.-
[20:21] <Xand3r> i think
[20:21] <Xand3r> thx allee
[20:21] <allee> Xand3r: not a good idea ;)
[20:21] <apachelogger> hm
[20:22] <apachelogger> either it's my KDE 4.1.0 or intrepid
[20:22] <apachelogger> but something is defenitely broken
[20:26] <apachelogger> Xand3r: you got intrepid?
[20:26] <Xand3r> only in pbuilder
[20:26] <Xand3r> apachelogger: sorry
[20:26] <apachelogger> anyone with intrepid around?
[20:26] <Xand3r> apachelogger: after a reboot system tray was good again
[20:27] <apachelogger> Xand3r: that is to be expected with trunk builds
[20:27]  * apachelogger needs someone with intrepid
[20:27] <apachelogger> Xand3r: do you have 4.1 yet?
[20:27] <Wubbbi> Do I need to copy this ( http://paste.ubuntu.com/31831/ ) into rules, or creat a new file calls xy?
[20:28] <Xand3r> apachelogger: i think so but not running right now, now i am here with nightly
[20:28] <Wubbbi> do anyone know that?
[20:32] <apachelogger> I think there is a major issue
[20:33] <apachelogger> in 4.1.0
[20:33] <yuriy> hmm? I'm on Intrepid
[20:33] <apachelogger> applications don't quit properly when using the window deco's close button
[20:33] <apachelogger> best example
[20:33] <apachelogger> start kate
[20:33] <yuriy> "don't quit properly"?
[20:33] <apachelogger> file -> quit
[20:33] <apachelogger> should quit the app
[20:33] <apachelogger> last words:
[20:33] <apachelogger> QObject: Do not delete object, 'unnamed', during its event handler!
[20:33] <apachelogger> QObject: Do not delete object, 'file_quit', during its event handler!
[20:33] <apachelogger> QFSFileEngine::open: No file name specified
[20:33] <apachelogger> QThreadStorage: Thread 0x93b87b0 exited after QThreadStorage<PHONE_NUMBER> destroyed
[20:34] <apachelogger> quitting with the close button however does exactly nothing but hide the window
[20:34] <yuriy> hmm seems so. but I'm not sure if that has something to do with having another kate window open
[20:34] <yuriy> OIC
[20:35]  * apachelogger has nothing but quassel + konsole open
[20:35] <yuriy> apachelogger: yep. that's ugly
[20:35] <apachelogger> same happens for konqueror apparently
[20:35] <yuriy> I wonder if this has anything to do with Xorg sitting there using 50% CPU for the last hour
[20:37] <apachelogger> yah, konqueror doesn't work either
[20:37] <yuriy> nope that was firefox's fault (as usual)
[20:37] <yuriy> heh when I closed firefox, as it was closing top showed it using 245% CPU
[20:37] <apachelogger> though
[20:37] <apachelogger> konqueror doesn't even exit via file - quit
[20:39] <Riddell> no such problem here in intrepid
[20:39] <apachelogger> super strange
[20:39] <apachelogger> one guy in -kde4 also reproduced this on hardy
[20:40] <yuriy> apachelogger: same thing as you for konqueror
[20:40] <apachelogger> yuriy, Riddell: what graphics driver?
[20:41] <yuriy> apachelogger: nvidia
[20:41] <Wubbbi> smarter: are you still away?
[20:42] <Riddell> apachelogger: intrepid
[20:42] <Riddell> err
[20:42] <Riddell> apachelogger: intel
[20:42] <apachelogger> ok
[20:42] <Riddell> apachelogger: I do see the problem on my hardy machine
[20:42] <apachelogger> I think this is nvidia specific
[20:42] <apachelogger> Riddell: is that one using nvidia?
[20:42] <Riddell> no, S3
[20:42] <apachelogger> hm
[20:44]  * JontheEchidna can't reproduce
[20:45] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: what driver?
[20:45] <JontheEchidna> nvidia-glx
[20:45] <JontheEchidna> the 96.x.x version
[20:45]  * apachelogger doesn't see a pattern
[20:45] <apachelogger> yuriy: which version for you?
[20:46] <yuriy> apachelogger: nvidia-glx-177
[20:46] <apachelogger> yuriy: that is the new thingy, right?
[20:47] <yuriy> apachelogger: yes, it's the newest one, I have a geforce go 7400
[20:48] <apachelogger> only one way to find out - I have to remove my nivida card
[20:49] <apachelogger> I just hope the intel driver works ;-)
[20:49] <apachelogger> oh
[20:49] <apachelogger> and who made kdesdk-scripts conflict with kdelibs5-dev?
[20:49] <apachelogger> and why
[20:49] <yuriy> hmm does qt4 designer work on intrepid? JontheEchidna iirc you had a problem with it?
[20:50] <yuriy> apachelogger: it should conflict with an older version of it because they both provide the same files
[20:50] <yuriy> apachelogger: something was moved from one to the other
[20:50] <apachelogger> kdelibs5-dev (<< 4:4.0.98a-0ubuntu2)
[20:50] <apachelogger> that is rather strange
[20:52] <apachelogger> ah
[20:52] <apachelogger> Conflicts: kdelibs5-dev (<< 4:4.1.0a-0ubuntu2)
[20:52] <apachelogger> oh
[20:52] <apachelogger> Conflicts: kdelibs5-dev (<< 4:4.1.0a-0ubuntu2)
[20:52] <apachelogger> eh
[20:53] <apachelogger> Replaces: kdelibs5-dev (<< 4:4.1.0a-0ubuntu2),
[20:53] <apachelogger> why does it replace the -dev package
[20:53] <apachelogger> that seems rather .... strange
[20:53] <apachelogger> s/strange/awkward
[20:53] <yuriy> it replaces an older version of it because it used to contain scripts
[20:53] <apachelogger> yuriy: that doesn't make it replace
[20:53] <apachelogger> that makes it conflicts
[20:53] <apachelogger> anyway
[20:54]  * apachelogger halts for graphicscard removal
[20:56] <JontheEchidna> yuriy: it worked after I deleted some qt designer plugins
[20:56] <JontheEchidna> and now it works and I can finally design stuff again! ^_^
[20:57] <jjesse> yay
[20:57]  * jjesse installed intrepid today
[20:57] <jjesse> it looks very sharp
[20:57] <apachelogger> ah
[20:59] <Wubbbi> smarter ?
[20:59] <apachelogger> it doesn't depend on the graphics driver
[21:00] <apachelogger> oh and kdesdk is screwed up
[21:07] <Wubbbi> Can anyboddy in here help me please?
[21:10] <Wubbbi> Dont seems so :(
[21:10] <smarter> Wubbbi: hmm?
[21:10] <Wubbbi> smarter: wuhuhu you are here :D
[21:11] <Wubbbi> smarter: I have created the Watch file. What to do now?
[21:11] <smarter> put a get-orig-source which use debian/watch
[21:11] <smarter> there are examples of that in the PackagingGuide
[21:11] <smarter> be back later
[21:11] <Wubbbi> smarter: wait
[21:12] <Wubbbi> where should the get-orig-source be? in /debian?
[21:12] <Wubbbi> and after what to do after that?
[21:13] <smarter> in debian/rules
[21:13] <smarter> see my previous messages
[21:14] <Wubbbi> and how should this call? the example seems to be very diffrent then my version should be
[21:17] <Wubbbi> smarter: ok done. Now I need to replace the icons? and then debuild?
[21:41] <seele> anyone else have problems with plasmoids in extragear-plasma?
[21:43] <Riddell> seele: extragear-plasma doesn't exist any more
[21:44] <reisi> good evening/anything everyone!
[21:45] <emunkki> moi koipireisi.
[21:45] <seele> Riddell: since when? today?
[21:45] <seele> Riddell: where is all the extra plasma stuff now?
[21:45] <reisi> there has been this one bug since first kde 4.0/kubuntu releases that /home and /media icons appear as questionmark (unknown) icons.. and i cannot find a bug on that on launchpad either
[21:46] <ScottK> reisi: Then file one.
[21:47] <reisi> is it not known bug or am i (plus another guy at #kubuntu) just have somehow broken setups?
[21:47] <reisi> ScottK: sorry to ask stupid questions but where exactly do i add a bug in launchpad (after being logged in)? do i need some specific permission for that?
[21:48] <ScottK> Is this in Konqueror or Dolphin?
[21:48] <reisi> dolphin
[21:49] <reisi> in konqueror also
[21:50] <reisi> packages are fresh kde 4.1, upgraded about an hour ago.. did kbuildsyscoca4 --noincremental ... user-home.pngs seem all good and so do svgzs
[21:50] <JontheEchidna> By the way, the dolphin-hover-over-avi crash is apparenly a strigi bug that was fixed 2 or 3 weeks ago in strigi trunk/
[21:50] <JontheEchidna> seele: extragear-plasmoids moved to kdeplasma-addons
[21:51] <ScottK> Launchpad is being even more slow than usual today.
[21:51] <reisi> ScottK: now that i finally found the bug filing (why couldn't i access it from kubuntu-team's bugs page? :)) should i file it under kdebase?
[21:52] <ScottK> reisi: kdelibs
[21:52] <seele> JontheEchidna: thanks
[21:52] <ScottK> If it affects both it's almost certainly in the libs.
[21:52] <ScottK> reisi: kde4libs actually.
[21:53] <ScottK> reisi: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kde4libs/+filebug
[21:57] <reisi> ScottK: thanks
[21:57] <ScottK> reisi: You're welcome.
[21:57] <reisi> is calling path "/" in dolphin as "Custom Folder" a feature or should i bug report it too?
[22:04] <yuriy> JontheEchidna: what exactly?
[22:04] <JontheEchidna> yuriy: ?
[22:04] <yuriy> what did you erase to get qt designer working?
[22:06] <reisi> ScottK: well thats now there with id 253099
[22:06] <ScottK> reisi: Great.
[22:06] <reisi> ScottK: not really much information to give
[22:07] <ScottK> That's how it starts.
[22:07] <vorian> hello!
[22:08] <vorian> congrats to all etc ... :)
[22:08] <yuriy> bug 253099
[22:09] <reisi> will the launchpad be sending me emails as does bugs.kde.org?
[22:09] <yuriy> yes
[22:09] <yuriy> and I can confirm the bug
[22:09] <vorian> ugggg
[22:09] <vorian> all these failures
[22:10] <Nightrose> apachelogger: ark still starts the kde 4 app instead of the kde 3 one :(
[22:11] <yuriy> reisi: the .directory files provided for those by kubuntu-default-settings specify system and folder_home, neither of which are in oxygen
[22:13] <yuriy> the correct one would be user-home
[22:13] <reisi> yuriy: ofc.. why didn't i dpkg -L kubuntu-default-settings.. there's folder_home for icon
[22:13] <yuriy> I don't know what the right one is for system
[22:14] <yuriy> reisi: hmm?
[22:14] <jtechidna> yuriy: don't know, libpython something or another might have been the one that fixed it
[22:14] <reisi> yuriy: nothing :) just wrote and didn't look that you had written the exact same above..
[22:18] <reisi> yuriy: could it just be computer? or computer-laptop
[22:18] <yuriy> reisi: that's the tricky part. I think it should be the same icon as the device notifier. the device notifier can determine whether it's a laptop or not, but a folder icon can't really since there's no code
[22:19] <Xand3r> hey folks, please review it, http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=rubberband
[22:19] <Xand3r> now i have to go to bed, cause i have to stand up early, c ya
[22:19] <yuriy> reisi: thanks for reporting.  in the future, see https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Bugs/Reporting and let me know if that documentation is inadequate
[22:19] <Xand3r> n8
[22:20] <Xand3r> nini apachelogger
[22:20]  * yuriy -> out
[22:22] <reisi> yuriy: you're welcome.. sorry for stupid questions. i've just became so used to bugs.kde.org launchpad always seems too weird when i visit it :)
[22:23] <Wubbbi> smarter: are you back again?
[22:25] <smarter> Wubbbi: not for long, going to sleep
[22:25] <smarter> what do you need?
[22:28] <Wubbbi> I have created a get-source bla bla bla
[22:28] <Wubbbi> can you take a look?
[22:28] <Wubbbi> on iz
[22:28] <Wubbbi> t
[22:29] <Wubbbi> in debian rules
[22:29] <Wubbbi> http://paste.ubuntu.com/31889/ is that right?
[22:32] <Wubbbi> smarter ?
[23:05] <vorian> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=874151
[23:45] <seele> who is working on adept for kde4?  (i should know this but always forget)
[23:45] <seele> nixternal?
[23:53] <Riddell> seele: mornfall
[23:53] <Riddell> (maybe)
[23:54] <seele> Riddell: does he have a ppa or wiki page for it?  i couldnt find anything in launchpad
[23:55] <Riddell> seele: ~mornfall is the ppa
[23:55] <Riddell> it hasn't been updated in a while