[03:03] <shadeslayer> bah
[03:03] <shadeslayer> Riddell: seems like that FUSE patch in kde4libs causes alot of issues
[03:03] <shadeslayer> see bug 313888
[03:04] <shadeslayer> erm
[03:04] <shadeslayer> kde bug 313888
[04:15] <shadeslayer> Riddell: I've removed the patch and uploaded
[06:32] <jussi> morning all
[06:45] <highvoltage> hey jussi
[06:46] <jussi> highvoltage: good morning Mr Carter
[07:43] <shadeslayer> hey jussi, highvoltage
[07:43] <shadeslayer> ssup
[07:44] <jussi> good morning shadeslayer
[07:44]  * jussi notes highvoltage went to bed
[07:45] <shadeslayer> heh
[07:50] <shadeslayer> wtf
[07:51] <shadeslayer> vlc is just skipping over 80% of the song
[07:51] <shadeslayer> so is amarok
[07:59] <shadeslayer> as does ... chrome O_O
[08:08] <jussi> shadeslayer: ahh I remember something like that in the past... on amarok
[08:09] <shadeslayer> I think that file is corrupted
[08:09] <jussi> well that would explain it...
[08:09] <jussi> lol
[08:10] <shadeslayer> yeah, playing other files works
[08:11] <jussi> iirc, it was playing files over networks last time that was the iddue
[08:12] <jussi> you know you are tired when this happens...
[08:12] <jussi> jussi@Albatross:~$ sudo apt-get upday
[08:12] <jussi> [sudo] password for jussi:
[08:14] <shadeslayer> :D
[08:14] <shadeslayer> jussi: how's elodi?
[08:14] <jussi> shadeslayer: doing well, turned 1 the other week
[08:15] <shadeslayer> oh ... Belated happy birthday to her!
[08:15] <jussi> :D
[08:35] <soee> good morning
[08:40] <shadeslayer> hi soee
[09:10] <Peace-> problem with mtp on 13.04
[09:10] <Peace-> http://wstaw.org/m/2013/01/28/plasma-desktopc29846.png
[09:10] <Peace-> and it doesn't find the package
[09:11] <Peace-> samba still doesn't work ...
[09:43] <shadeslayer> btw
[09:43] <shadeslayer> does it make sense to add a page to the installer asking the user to choose a browser?
[09:44] <shadeslayer> Peace-: what pops that question?
[09:47] <yofel_> shadeslayer: that would need a short pro/con list integrated so people can actually make an educated choice
[09:48] <shadeslayer> why? I'd say that list rekonq/chromium/firefox
[09:48] <shadeslayer> most people would know about those
[09:48] <shadeslayer> if they don't, stick with the default
[09:48] <shadeslayer> ( which will be rekonq )
[09:50] <yofel_> as microsoft got forced to add a browser choice I guess it's fair to have one
[09:50] <yofel_> question is where to put it
[09:50] <shadeslayer> after the page where we ask if the user wants to install codecs
[09:50] <yofel_> the only customization currently is the third-party checkbox at the beginning
[09:50] <shadeslayer> right
[09:50] <shadeslayer> we add 3 huge icons
[09:50] <shadeslayer> because people like huge icons
[09:50] <yofel_> hm, true. Needs to be before the installation start, which is after partitioning
[09:51] <shadeslayer> right
[09:51] <shadeslayer> it also needs to check if the user is connected to the network
[09:51] <shadeslayer> which brings us to
[09:51] <shadeslayer> wifi support in the installer
[09:52]  * shadeslayer is checking out ubiquity to check how difficult this is going to be
[09:52] <yofel> wasn't that only hanging on insufficient developer time?
[09:52] <shadeslayer> then there's also the webcam stuff that the gtk ui of ubiquity has
[09:52] <shadeslayer> yofel: dunno, but I'm compiling a list of features I want to work on next month
[09:52] <yofel> what for? user logo?
[09:52] <shadeslayer> yep
[09:53] <xnox> gtk - has wifi page. The base controller is network aware and can tell plugins/pages whether or not there are internetz.
[09:53] <shadeslayer> seems fairly trivial
[09:53] <shadeslayer> ( just from reading the webcam plugin )
[09:53] <shadeslayer> xnox: cool :)
[09:53] <shadeslayer> xnox: I'm going to need all the help I can get to implement this :P
[09:53] <shadeslayer> yofel: I'm also thinking of doing this in QML xD
[09:54] <yofel> ack
[09:54] <yofel> that's the way to go with qt5 anyway
[09:54] <shadeslayer> xnox: do you think that if I write a page to choose a browser, that's going to be accepted?
[09:54] <shadeslayer> or would that go against some sort of design or sth
[09:54] <yofel> though porting ubiquity to qml is probably something for post-14.04
[09:55] <shadeslayer> *nod*
[09:55] <shadeslayer> but I don't want to use .ui for new stuff
[09:55] <shadeslayer> better to just write it in QML
[09:56] <yofel> sure, if the looks aren't too different, go ahead
[09:56] <xnox> shadeslayer: i am really confused why one would want to choose a browser, considering that we are not forced by law (yet) and it's a waste of space on the CD (majority will pick default/first and the other one will be removed by ubiquity at cleanup)
[09:56] <yofel> i just has to fit into ubiquity overall
[09:56] <shadeslayer> yofel: right
[09:56] <shadeslayer> xnox: oh I don't plan on including the browser on the CD
[09:56] <xnox> shadeslayer: my position here is that sort of thing should be done on first-login instead.
[09:57] <shadeslayer> xnox: it's like the restricted codecs
[09:57] <shadeslayer> you can tick off "I also want to install Firefox/Chromium" and we add that to the list of things to be installed
[09:57] <xnox> shadeslayer: it's nothing like resticted codecs (which we are not allowed on the CD). Unless you are trying to offer Chrome/Opera?!
[09:58] <shadeslayer> xnox: I meant in terms of implementation
[09:58] <shadeslayer> it *would* be like that
[09:58] <xnox> shadeslayer: out of scope, make the installation longer, confusing & technical. You are free to do it in the qt frontend =)
[09:58] <shadeslayer> xnox: that's what I was asking about :P
[09:58] <xnox> but gtk frontend will not be having that ;-)
[09:58] <shadeslayer> right
[09:59] <shadeslayer> it's just that our users are asking for this
[09:59] <shadeslayer> because our current default browser is not up to the mark
[09:59] <shadeslayer> I wonder if we can switch to chromium by default
[09:59] <shadeslayer> oh wait, not in line with our cycle
[10:02] <shadeslayer> xnox: btw how do you test new stuff in ubiquity?
[10:05] <xnox> lubuntu uses chromium by default.
[10:05] <shadeslayer> I see
[10:06]  * shadeslayer will ask lubuntu devs how their experience has been
[10:06] <xnox> shadeslayer: depends, usually I boot a VM into installer. stop lightdm, stop ubiquity, pkill -9 X, download/patch individual files, and start ubiquity again.
[10:06] <shadeslayer> bah :P
[10:06] <shadeslayer> sounds like alot of work
[10:06] <xnox> (where start is literal $ start/stop are literal)
[10:07] <xnox> it's safe.
[10:07] <shadeslayer> okay
[10:12] <Riddell> shadeslayer: how much does plasma active need that fuse patch?
[10:12] <shadeslayer> I don't remember, I can't find the IRC logs I saved
[10:13] <shadeslayer> I'll ask in #active again
[10:15] <shadeslayer> Riddell: <notmart> shadeslayer: pa3 will still work..
[10:19] <shadeslayer> good thing we added it earlier in the cycle rather than later ....
[10:19] <shadeslayer> Riddell: btw I also have bodega packaging, but all of it needs descriptions and reviewing
[10:20] <shadeslayer> I can't think up of a good description ... so haven't uploaded it anywhere
[10:22] <Riddell> shadeslayer: that's the PA software shop thing?
[10:22] <shadeslayer> yep
[10:24] <Riddell> shadeslayer: there's your description :)
[10:24] <shadeslayer> bodega : "PA software shop thing"
[10:29] <sem_> shadeslayer: i have a nexus tablet 7 and when i have installed kio-mpt i was able to browse nexus with usb cable
[10:29] <sem_> shadeslayer: after that i got that pop
[10:30] <sem_> wtf i have  a different nick
[10:30] <Peace-> shadeslayer: ^ sem was me
[10:30] <shadeslayer> righto
[10:30] <shadeslayer> I see
[10:31] <shadeslayer> Peace-: check if you have kio-mtp installed?
[10:31] <Peace-> i have
[10:31] <shadeslayer> if it is, then that shouldn't pop up
[10:31] <Peace-> infact i can browse
[10:31] <Peace-> but ...when i click on a video it says that i need mtp stuff
[10:31] <shadeslayer> sounds like a bug in qapt?
[10:31] <Peace-> so i searched like it says
[10:31] <shadeslayer> 0.o
[10:31] <Peace-> and it did not find the package
[10:32] <Peace-> shadeslayer: i guess no
[10:32] <Peace-> shadeslayer: cuz dragon player can't play file from nexus
[10:32] <Peace-> instead vlc can
[10:32] <Peace-> i guess that dragon player needs some package to play file from mtp devices
[10:32] <shadeslayer> kind of
[10:32] <Peace-> but i have even tried to install mtp-tools+
[10:32] <Peace-> and nothing is changed
[10:33] <shadeslayer> Peace-: make sure you have the requisite gst plugins
[10:33] <shadeslayer> gst-{good,bad,ugly}
[10:33] <shadeslayer> Peace-: what's the video format?
[10:33] <Peace-> i guess mov ?
[10:33] <Peace-> h264 codec
[10:33] <Peace-> for sure
[10:34] <Peace-> ok shadeslayeri will try to investigate better
[10:34] <shadeslayer> install gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly
[10:34] <shadeslayer> should work after that
[10:39] <Peace-> shadeslayer: btw the idea to ask which browser user want install is good
[10:48] <Riddell> rperier: new nick?
[10:52] <rperier> Riddell: yeah it's more professional ;)
[10:53] <Peace-> shadeslayer: no it doesn't work http://wstaw.org/m/2013/01/28/plasma-desktopa29846.png
[10:54] <shadeslayer> wtf
[10:55] <Peace-> shadeslayer: i have already installed gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad gstreamer0.10-plugins-good gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly gstreamer0.10-plugins-base
[10:55] <shadeslayer> right
[10:55] <Peace-> but it seems it suck ;D
[10:55] <shadeslayer> yeah
[10:55] <shadeslayer> something else is wrong
[10:55] <Peace-> bah :D
[10:55] <Peace-> shadeslayer: but with vlc works fine
[10:56] <Peace-> dragonplayer again sucks
[10:56] <shadeslayer> yeah pgst is buggy
[10:56] <shadeslayer> Peace-: apachelogger probably has a better idea
[10:56] <Peace-> shadeslayer: well there is not a problem shadeslayer i mean i use vlc
[10:57] <Peace-> but at least you know that there is some problem  about mtp and dragonplayer and qapt
[10:57] <shadeslayer> right
[10:57] <shadeslayer> it's not about mtp, it's some weird problem between dragon and pgst and qapt
[10:57] <Peace-> ya
[10:57] <Peace-> even samba has again a problem
[10:58] <Peace-> i have tried samba on windows and nexus kuibunt can't use samba correctly
[10:58] <shadeslayer> you mean kubuntu on the nexus can't access samba?
[10:58] <Peace-> shadeslayer: look http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5sW2Xr7f5Q
[10:58] <Peace-> timeout on server
[10:59] <shadeslayer> oh lord jesus
[10:59] <Peace-> :D time to eat :D
[10:59] <Peace-> bb
[11:14] <xnox> Are Qt packagers around?
[11:14] <xnox> Or should I talk to here or on #debian-* channels?
[11:14]  * xnox is after Qt5 and not duplicating packaging work
[11:15] <xnox> (there are now a couple of Qt5 PPAs and a Debian ITP and I just want Qt5 in the archive)
[11:16] <yofel> xnox: I think you should talk to fabo
[11:16] <xnox> yofel: thanks.
[11:19] <fabo> xnox: it's going to be uploaded to experimental (today on in the next couple of days)
[11:19] <fabo> xnox: packaging is done and up-to-date on git.debian.org
[11:19] <xnox> fabo: awesome! I've now searched for you around to realise it's you doing it everywhere ;-)
[11:20] <fabo> not me, we're a team ;)
[11:20] <xnox> fabo: any help needed?
[11:20] <tsimpson> there are the PPA(s) from https://launchpad.net/~canonical-qt5-edgers too if you're impatient
[11:20] <fabo> xnox: at this point, not much. it has been well tested. we're pretty happy with the result
[11:21] <fabo> xnox: you'll need new qt4 packages to co-exist with qt5
[11:21] <xnox> tsimpson: I'm impatient to stop using that repository & start pointing people to the archive =)
[11:24] <Peace-> shadeslayer: mmm maybe samba is fixed on rarin
[11:24] <Peace-> i just checked again
[11:24] <xnox> fabo: as far as I can see, once ready. You will be able to sync/upload it everywhere in Raring, won't you?! And then i can chase up Archive Admins to fast track new binary packages through ubuntu new queue.
[11:25] <shadeslayer> Peace-: awesome
[11:25] <xnox> I'd rather not wait for Debian New Queue delay.
[11:25]  * shadeslayer rages at phonon + python being under documented
[11:25] <fabo> xnox: that's the plan
[11:25] <xnox> fabo: ;-) awesome.
[11:34] <Peace-> i need to check better this story of samba
[12:31] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: hm?
[12:31] <shadeslayer> Peace-: ^
[12:31] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: see http://wstaw.org/m/2013/01/28/plasma-desktopa29846.png
[12:32] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: Phonon has undocumented python bindings
[12:32] <shadeslayer> ( separate issue )
[12:32] <Riddell> shadeslayer: I think it has two undocumented python bindings
[12:32] <Riddell> one in pyqt and one in pykde
[12:32] <shadeslayer> the pyqt ones are somehwat documented if lacking features
[12:32] <shadeslayer> the pyKDE one is non-existent
[12:33] <yofel> apachelogger: btw. what's the status of kpythonpluginfactory in raring? or what's needed to get the kcm stuff working again?
[12:33] <shadeslayer> took me an hour to figure this much out : http://paste.kde.org/658196/
[12:33] <yofel> we're slowly nearing feature freeze and I would like to have it working before that so we can look for alternatives if needed
[12:34] <Peace-> apachelogger: i was using my nexus 7 tablet and i have installed kio-mtp , i clicked on a video and dragon player was starting then  i got http://wstaw.org/m/2013/01/28/plasma-desktopa29846.png
[12:34] <Peace-> apachelogger: and it did not find any package to install
[12:34] <Peace-> apachelogger: so i open it with vlc and it worked without problems
[12:34] <Peace-> apachelogger: btw shadeslayer has said to install gstremaer ugly betty and good ;D but i did already i t
[12:35] <shadeslayer> oh
[12:35] <shadeslayer> ohhhhh
[12:35] <shadeslayer> Peace-: *maybe* kio-mtp/libmtp just doesn't support playing video files yet?
[12:35] <shadeslayer> iirc previews didn't work either
[12:36] <Peace-> shadeslayer: mm vlc worked ?
[12:36] <shadeslayer> oh good point
[12:36] <apachelogger> Peace-: enotsupported
[12:36] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: not supported on gst?
[12:36] <apachelogger> streaming from KIO is not supported in phonon
[12:36] <apachelogger> it works sometimes
[12:36] <apachelogger> it doesn't others
[12:36] <apachelogger> that is why it is not supported
[12:36] <shadeslayer> ah
[12:37] <Peace-> apachelogger: it's ok but ... why qapt asks to find stuff ?
[12:37] <apachelogger> because you are trying to stream from KIO
[12:37] <Peace-> :D ok for me there is not problem dragon player is already removed
[12:37] <Peace-> with vlc works fine
[12:38] <shadeslayer> vlc does not use kio?
[12:38] <Peace-> i dunno i clicked on dolphin open with vlc and it worked
[12:38] <apachelogger> it copies the file
[12:38] <shadeslayer> yes, because vlc does not use kio!
[12:39] <Peace-> ah
[12:39] <apachelogger> because vlc's desktop file is not shit
[12:39] <Peace-> :D
[12:39] <shadeslayer> because vlc is not shit
[12:39] <Peace-> vlc rocks
[12:39] <shadeslayer> I can't say the same for dragon :P
[12:39] <apachelogger> dragonplayer is not shit
[12:39] <Peace-> never used
[12:40] <Peace-> i mean untill today
[12:40] <Peace-> then i even removed it :D
[13:01] <yofel> apachelogger: ping?
[13:04] <shadeslayer> xnox: question, if I read this correctly, do I just add a PageKde class to ubiquity/plugins/ubi-webcam.py along with a ui file and it'll pop up in the installer?
[13:05] <xnox> shadeslayer: it should. You will need some webcamy widget (as for gtk we wrote our own using Gtk).
[13:06] <xnox> shadeslayer: also check if webcam makes sense at all.
[13:06] <xnox> on gtk side it sets the user account avatar to that picture.
[13:06] <xnox> I don't know if KDE has user account avatars or shows them to the user at all.
[13:06] <shadeslayer> xnox: for the first, I wrote this very small program that does it : http://paste.kde.org/658238/
[13:06] <xnox> As the alternative to webcam picutre one can choose one of the stock images.
[13:06] <shadeslayer> and yes, we have lightdm kde which does show it
[13:06] <shadeslayer> as well as the kicker
[13:07] <xnox> awesome. lightdm on the ubuntu side doesn't show pictures =/
[13:07] <shadeslayer> heh :)
[13:07] <xnox> that phonon snippet looks good =)
[13:07] <shadeslayer> *nod* :P
[13:09] <shadeslayer> xnox: the gtk implementation seems a bit ew
[13:10] <xnox> shadeslayer: i don't think at the time there was a webcam widget at all.
[13:10] <xnox> shadeslayer: do you know if there is one now?
[13:10] <xnox> we could port it....
[13:10] <shadeslayer> not that I know of, nope
[13:10] <shadeslayer> sorry, I don't follow gtk development that closely :P
[13:11] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: note that a videoplayer is comprised of a videowidget and an audiooutput, I do not thin you'll need an audiooutput
[13:11] <shadeslayer> oic
[13:11] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: I don't think I'll be using the exact same code anyway
[13:11] <xnox> there is libcheese-gtk-dev, not sure if it has python bindings and/or available on the cd already.
[13:12] <shadeslayer> I'll probably embed the videowidget
[13:12] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: yeah, just pointing it out ;)
[13:12] <shadeslayer> into a ui file
[13:12] <shadeslayer> :)
[13:12] <xnox> usb-creator with flashing nexus7 images just got uploaded into ubuntu.
[13:12] <xnox> i am not expecting for kde frontend to break, but i didn't test it.
[13:13] <xnox> and also i didn't add the UI to the kde frontend to have support for flashing nexus7 images.
[13:13] <apachelogger> actually it has some bugs that need to be looked at anyway
[13:15] <petersaints> I just noticed that there's a newer version of rekonq 2.1. Will it reach quantal backports? Also Ktorrent is still at 4.2 in the official repos and 4.3.1 is already available. Any plans to backport it?
[13:16] <Riddell> hmm, I really need to do an upstream health script
[13:16] <Riddell> thanks petersaints, we'll get those done
[13:16] <petersaints> tks RIdell
[13:17] <xnox> Riddell: is the python3 port of usb-creator-kde complete?
[13:17] <Riddell> xnox: it's needing you to test it :)
[13:17]  * xnox , by accident, didn't upload it
[13:18] <Riddell> xnox: you accidently didn't upload it?
[13:18] <xnox> correct =)
[13:18] <xnox> Riddell: well ./bin/usb-creator-kde shebang wasn't changed to python3, but now I am installing python3-pykde4 to test it.
[13:18] <Riddell> thanks
[13:20] <xnox> Riddell: surprisingly the theming is nice. It almost looks like a GTK app.
[13:21] <xnox> I wonder if a few icons can be remapped to gtk icons and then the two would be like the same.
[13:21] <apachelogger> it's the Qt way
[13:21] <xnox> no unity integration in the doc, no icon, no progress =(
[13:22] <xnox> but i guess, usb-creator-kde doesn't care about that ;-)
[13:24] <Riddell> xnox: no surprise there, Qt put in a lot of effort to making it integrate into gtk environments
[13:24] <Riddell> shame the opposite doesn't happen
[13:25] <Riddell> xnox: oh I see you're making changes for nexus7 is usb-creator, any UI in that?
[13:25] <xnox> i think it did at one point.
[13:26] <xnox> Riddell: the gtk frontend, checks for fastboot backend and then it does some changes to the UI: updates some strings, skips showing .iso (.img only), add legal text button & poop-up. And that's about it.
[13:26] <xnox> some pointless columns are hidden in the tree view.
[13:27] <xnox> there is an upstart job to poop-up usb-creator, when nexus7 is inserted. And currently that is shipped in the -gtk package, but can move into -common when kde frontend is ready as well.
[13:28] <shadeslayer> heh
[13:29] <shadeslayer> xnox: turns out the phonon gst backend we have in the archive cannot save snapshots :P
[13:29] <shadeslayer> we need a new phonon gstreamer release
[13:29] <xnox> 8-)
[13:30] <apachelogger> nono
[13:30] <shadeslayer> ?
[13:30] <apachelogger> what we need is someone to QA a new release so that I can make that happen
[13:31] <shadeslayer> you have a new pgst release lined up?
[13:31] <apachelogger> doing the release is a no-brainer, getting it QAd is apparently a half a year task
[13:31] <shadeslayer> lol
[13:31] <apachelogger> I have releases of both bakends lined up since dec 7
[13:31] <apachelogger> I even asked kde-testing to do QA
[13:31] <apachelogger> no dice
[13:31] <shadeslayer> give me the tars, I'll make a package and someone here can test
[13:31] <apachelogger> so here we are almost 2 months later, still no release in sight :P
[13:32] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: you saw my QA document :P
[13:32] <shadeslayer> oh
[13:32] <shadeslayer> shit
[13:32] <shadeslayer> not that
[13:32] <yofel> before you do phonon q/a tell me what's needed to get python kcms working again - or where to look (i.e. KPPF or pykde)
[13:32]  * shadeslayer runs away
[13:32] <apachelogger> it is a requirement to build that crap from source and run like 300 test cases
[13:32] <apachelogger> yofel: tell  me where my pykde source is
[13:33] <yofel> pull-lp-source pykde4 raring
[13:33] <apachelogger> though I think I have those on my other pc, so I won't get to them before this evening
[13:33] <apachelogger> yofel: I have a patch
[13:33] <yofel> gimme so I can Q/A that later
[13:33] <apachelogger> CANNOT DO
[13:34]  * yofel steals patches from fedora in the meanwhile
[13:34] <apachelogger> upstream it actually
[13:34] <xnox> Riddell: installed fine using python3 \0/
[13:35] <apachelogger> that is actually why I lost it, I was looking for a way to contact upstream and then got distructed by something or someone
[13:35] <apachelogger> *distracted
[13:35] <apachelogger> trololo
[13:35] <yofel> that's what reviewboard is for?
[13:35] <apachelogger> no
[13:35] <apachelogger> reviewboard is for us to waste time
[13:35] <Riddell> xnox: awooga, will you upload at some point or shall I?
[13:35] <apachelogger> because people are afraid of gerrit
[13:36] <apachelogger> just like bugzilla is for us to waste time
[13:36] <apachelogger> becasue people are afraid of jira
[13:36] <yofel> huh, why?
[13:36] <xnox> Riddell: i'll do it, now.
[13:36] <yofel> (jira)
[13:36] <xnox> Riddell: usb-creator - the most active upstream project of today! Two new releases in a single day =)
[13:39] <apachelogger> yofel: because it is not free sofware
[13:40] <shadeslayer> xnox: does ubiquity simply copy the image to ~/.face ?
[13:40] <shadeslayer> erm
[13:40] <shadeslayer> ~/.face.icon
[13:41] <apachelogger> oh btw
[13:41] <apachelogger> kde uses .face
[13:41] <shadeslayer> nope
[13:41] <apachelogger> dude
[13:41] <shadeslayer> ~/.face.icon
[13:41] <shadeslayer> Check it for yourself
[13:42] <apachelogger> who was using .face then?
[13:42] <apachelogger> gnome?
[13:42] <apachelogger> someone was using .face
[13:42] <shadeslayer> .face is deprecated
[13:42] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: was that changed in .10 then?
[13:42] <shadeslayer> iirc xdg specified ~/.face
[13:42] <shadeslayer> nope
[13:42] <shadeslayer> iirc ~/.face.icon has been there for a couple of releases now
[13:42] <shadeslayer> before that, I didn't notice it
[13:42] <apachelogger> nono
[13:42] <apachelogger> see
[13:42] <shadeslayer> as in, I didn't bother checking
[13:43] <apachelogger> the reason in quantal lightdm does not show the nice pictures
[13:43] <BluesKaj> Hi folks
[13:43] <apachelogger> is because lightdm uses accountsservices or something which uses .face.icon
[13:43] <apachelogger> wheres all the kde stuff uses .face
[13:43] <shadeslayer> hmm
[13:43] <shadeslayer> well .. it's face.icon now
[13:43] <shadeslayer> which is all that matters
[13:43] <apachelogger> all good then
[13:43] <apachelogger> hooray for standards
[13:44] <shadeslayer> standards ftw
[13:44]  * xnox has no idea what it really does, nor have I tested that it still works.
[13:44] <shadeslayer> heh
[13:45] <shadeslayer> bbiab
[14:03] <jussi> you know, can someone make me something awesome... I want a pattern unlock as an option for my sudo password when it is used graphically  (like the unlock pattern on an android phone...)
[14:05] <apachelogger> jussi: that'd require someone to know pam, which I think no one on the team does ;)
[14:06] <jussi> apachelogger: :(
[14:50] <jussi> shadeslayer: ping
[14:50] <shadeslayer> pong
[14:50]  * jussi pms
[14:51] <shadeslayer> you pms?
[16:49] <Riddell> rick_timmis: hello
[16:49] <Riddell> rick_timmis: you're after a business card?
[16:49] <Riddell> Mamarok: are you going to fosdem?
[16:50] <Mamarok> Riddell: no, unfortunately not
[17:07] <Riddell> should we have kio-mtp installed by default?
[17:08] <Riddell> shadeslayer: you packaged it ^^
[17:08] <shadeslayer> yes
[17:08] <shadeslayer> Riddell: with one caveat
[17:08] <shadeslayer> we need to upload a new libmtp9 with the updated device list before feature freeze
[17:11] <Tm_T> that's only in raring?
[17:13] <shadeslayer> yeah
[17:13] <shadeslayer> you can get it from the experimental ppa
[17:14] <shadeslayer> for quantal ... I don't think I've updated the snapshot for precise
[17:17] <Tm_T> ah thanks
[17:27] <Riddell> shadeslayer, yofel: any idea what phoenix_firebrd's e-mail is?
[17:27] <Riddell> ah go it
[17:27] <shadeslayer> heh :)
[17:29] <Riddell> seeing if anyone will volunteer for the updates petersaints wanted (or maybe petersaints will volunteer :)
[17:30] <yofel> I originally planned to do rekonq, but that has no hurry and would be good for someone new
[17:31] <Riddell> always a judgement call with new people, do you nudge them into doing a task or just do the task, let's see if they reply
[17:32] <Riddell> hmm, SC 4.10 tagging this week, that might clash with me running away to fosdem
[17:33] <ScottK> libktorrent and ktorrent need updating.  New packages are in Debian experimental.
[17:33] <yofel> tagging is thursday and shouldn't be too much work, we can handle tha
[17:39] <petersaints> Riddell: I'd gladly help. And I really would like to contribute do Kubuntu. But I'm quite busy right now finishing an important assignment. Once I have some free time I really want to learn how to use PPAs (I have been postponing it :P).
[17:40] <Riddell> petersaints: great :)  just ping when you have time and chance are someone will be around
[17:42] <petersaints> ok Riddell
[17:45] <Riddell> xnox: is there a channel for nexus7 chat?
[17:46] <xnox> Riddell: #ubuntu-arm
[17:55] <vassie> hello, i've packaged cantata (kde mpd client) and uploaded it to my ppa https://launchpad.net/~vassie/+archive/ppa, i would be greatful for some feedback, thanks
[17:56] <Riddell> !testers
[17:56] <Riddell> vassie: that one sometimes helps :)
[17:58] <vassie> !testers ?
[17:58] <vassie> !testers
[18:04] <Riddell> vassie: hmm, on running it I get
[18:04] <Riddell> "You are not currently a member of the "users" group. Cantata will function better (saving of album covers, lyrics, etc. with the correct permissions) if you (or your administrator) add yourself to this group."
[18:04] <Tm_T> with "| <the target> needs testing
[18:04] <Riddell> Tm_T: for libav* ?
[18:04] <Tm_T> I mean when doing testers call, pipe it and add reason
[18:04] <Riddell> aah
[18:04] <Tm_T> so the hilight contain why people are hilighted (:
[18:05] <Riddell> well a smarty guy like you should be able to look at two lines before :)
[18:05] <Tm_T> ofcourse
[18:05] <Riddell> vassie: what's it trying to do? "Failed to send command to Default (localhost:6600) - not connected"
[18:05] <Tm_T> just something that sometimes make finding the information much quicker
[18:16] <xnox> !testers | <vassie> hello, i've packaged cantata (kde mpd client) and uploaded it to my ppa https://launchpad.net/~vassie/+archive/ppa, i would be greatful for some feedback, thanks
[18:16] <xnox> that clearly did not work +)
[18:16] <Riddell> maybe nobody tested ubottu
[18:21] <vassie> hello, it's an mpd client, you need to be using mpd https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MPD
[18:21] <vassie> Riddell: the "users" issue is weird, the dev says it was developed on kubuntu
[18:22] <Riddell> vassie: does he say why it should be run with a user added to that group?
[18:22] <vassie> Riddell: even on Arch, what has the users group, i get the same message
[18:22] <vassie> Riddell: no idea, still runs fine mind you
[18:27] <vassie> Riddell: "Cantata is developed on Kubuntu/Ubuntu." from the dev over at http://kde-apps.org/content/show.php/Cantata?content=147733
[18:28] <vassie> Riddell: i've logged an issue with the dev
[19:31] <vassie> Riddell: i've emailed the dev as i cannot find it documented anywhere why cantata wants me to be in the "users" group
[19:31] <vassie> Riddell: if cantata is insistant on us being in that group, where do I go from here?
[19:39] <vassie> Riddell: from the creator "When cantata downloads images, or lyrics, and these are saved into the MPD folders - if the user is a member of the "users" group, the files will be set to belong to this group. Therefore if you have two users, they can each save files here, etc. Likewise, when copying files from devices, the files will be set to be owned by the "users" group."
[20:30] <rick_timmis> Riddell: Hi Jonathan, sorry was away fixing dinner for the kids
[21:47] <Riddell> rick_timmis: nice dinner? :)


[00:00] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: belle-sip [arm64] (mantic-proposed/universe) [5.2.0+dfsg-2] (no packageset)
[00:37] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted belle-sip [arm64] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0+dfsg-2]
[00:37] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted belle-sip [amd64] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0+dfsg-2]
[00:37] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted belle-sip [ppc64el] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0+dfsg-2]
[00:37] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted bzrtp [amd64] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0-2]
[00:37] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted bzrtp [armhf] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0-2]
[00:37] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted bzrtp [s390x] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0-2]
[00:38] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted belle-sip [armhf] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0+dfsg-2]
[00:38] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted bzrtp [arm64] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0-2]
[00:38] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted belle-sip [s390x] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0+dfsg-2]
[00:38] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted bzrtp [riscv64] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0-2]
[05:13] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: mediastreamer2 [amd64] (mantic-proposed/universe) [1:5.2.0+dfsg-3] (kubuntu)
[05:15] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: mediastreamer2 [armhf] (mantic-proposed/universe) [1:5.2.0+dfsg-3] (kubuntu)
[05:16] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: mediastreamer2 [arm64] (mantic-proposed/universe) [1:5.2.0+dfsg-3] (kubuntu)
[05:18] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: mediastreamer2 [s390x] (mantic-proposed/universe) [1:5.2.0+dfsg-3] (kubuntu)
[05:50] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: mediastreamer2 [riscv64] (mantic-proposed/universe) [1:5.2.0+dfsg-3] (kubuntu)
[06:28] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted mediastreamer2 [amd64] (mantic-proposed) [1:5.2.0+dfsg-3]
[06:28] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted mediastreamer2 [armhf] (mantic-proposed) [1:5.2.0+dfsg-3]
[06:28] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted mediastreamer2 [s390x] (mantic-proposed) [1:5.2.0+dfsg-3]
[06:28] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted mediastreamer2 [arm64] (mantic-proposed) [1:5.2.0+dfsg-3]
[06:28] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted mediastreamer2 [riscv64] (mantic-proposed) [1:5.2.0+dfsg-3]
[06:28] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted bzrtp [amd64] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0-2ubuntu1]
[06:28] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted bzrtp [armhf] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0-2ubuntu1]
[06:28] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted bzrtp [riscv64] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0-2ubuntu1]
[06:28] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted bzrtp [arm64] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0-2ubuntu1]
[06:28] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted bzrtp [s390x] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0-2ubuntu1]
[06:28] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted bzrtp [ppc64el] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0-2ubuntu1]
[08:43] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: linphone [amd64] (mantic-proposed/universe) [5.2.0-4] (no packageset)
[08:45] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: linphone [s390x] (mantic-proposed/universe) [5.2.0-4] (no packageset)
[09:02] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: linphone [arm64] (mantic-proposed/universe) [5.2.0-4] (no packageset)
[09:05] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: linphone [armhf] (mantic-proposed/universe) [5.2.0-4] (no packageset)
[11:33] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: linphone [ppc64el] (mantic-proposed/universe) [5.2.0-4] (no packageset)
[11:43] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted linphone [amd64] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0-4]
[11:43] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted linphone [armhf] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0-4]
[11:43] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted linphone [s390x] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0-4]
[11:43] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted linphone [arm64] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0-4]
[11:43] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted linphone [ppc64el] (mantic-proposed) [5.2.0-4]
[21:39] <LocutusOfBorg> Started on 2023-07-25
[21:39] <LocutusOfBorg> Finished 10 minutes ago (took 5 days, 11 hours, 16 minutes, 48.7 seconds)
[22:55] <Eickmeyer> 😮


[00:19] <TadekMocarzzz> omg..
[00:19] <TadekMocarzzz> when i open text file and copy something from it, then close it
[00:19] <TadekMocarzzz> i cant paste into other file
[00:19] <TadekMocarzzz> the first need to be opened
[00:20] <TadekMocarzzz> is this real life
[00:32] <kanliot> running 12.04? TadekMocarzzz
[00:32] <TadekMocarzzz> 11.10
[00:33] <kanliot> we fixed that in 12.04
[00:33] <kanliot> and i actually think we the only ubuntu that fixed that
[00:34] <TadekMocarzzz> i cant believe what im reading
[00:34] <TadekMocarzzz> so other linux distros are having this bug and dont care
[00:34] <kanliot> well it's been documented since 1989
[00:35] <kanliot> just install a clipboard manager
[04:13] <kieppie> hi guys. I'm an ubuntu user, but don't use lubuntu much. I've just popped a new VM & trying to set the auto-login option & installed vino & set to autostart, but it looks as if these changes are not taking
[04:14] <kieppie> I've set the /etc/lxdm/default.conf autologin= to my username, rebooted, but it does not automatically log in
[04:15] <Unit193> Using 12.04?  That's because Lubuntu uses LightDM now.
[04:15] <kieppie> 12.04 - yes.
[04:15] <kieppie> ok - I'll see what I can find
[04:16] <Unit193> On the faq page.
[04:21] <kieppie> I'm finding it now, thansk
[04:22] <kieppie> what about vino - the VNC service? AFAIK there is no icon to use the .desktop to move to ~/.config/autostart
[04:24]  * kieppie thinks I found it...
[04:25] <Unit193> You can make one easily enough, but I'd think it would have one in /usr/share/applications/
[04:27] <kieppie> I'm not the biggest fan of VNC - is there a better protocol, or maybe a better daemon alternative to tightvnc?
[04:27] <kieppie> find VNC to bee fairly sluggish compared to others like even RDP
[04:32] <Unit193> RDP is pretty much going to be better, that's normal.  NX is an option.
[04:32] <kieppie> I've considered NX.....
[04:34] <kieppie> casicall, this host is a support VM - it's a box I plan on using to do my remore tupport work on (remmina, teamviewer, logmein, whatever) so that my actual desktop is not boggus down with bogus rubbish remote support stuff. I'll be remoting into this box via VNC or whatever to initiate the secondary remote session, so I wan to reduce lag however possible. support remote-X is the other option
[14:14] <zleap> what program is used to take screen shots,  it used to work when i pressed f12 or print screen ( I think it was the latter of those two)
[16:09] <bioterror> zleap, scrot and it's binded to printscreen
[16:11] <zleap> ok thanks
[16:12] <bioterror> I'm mostly doing alt+f2 and type: scrot -d 4 image_name.png
[16:12] <bioterror> and it will delay 4 seconds the screenshot ;)
[16:13] <zleap> ok
[16:13] <zleap> thanks
[16:13]  * zleap needs a soldering iron
[16:13] <zleap> for other stuff
[16:14] <bioterror> I should buy one too
[17:01] <wxl> how does one disable the guest account?
[17:24] <Unit193> wxl: /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf   allow-guest=false
[17:24] <wxl> danke Unit193
[17:25] <wxl> that didn't seem to be in the wiki
[17:25] <Unit193> I know it's in the FAQ, just don't remember if it's only in the Xubu FAQ. :P
[17:27] <Luko> hi folks, i use lubuntu becouse i love Lubuntu Software Center and PCManFM... i prefer this two apps more then default thunar and bug soft center in Xubuntu
[17:27] <wxl> i think that's the case
[17:27] <wxl> anywho danke again. prolly could have figured that out now that i think of it :/
[17:28] <Unit193> Yeah, but easier this way. :P
[17:42] <bioterror> Luko, nice to hear! ;)
[17:42] <bioterror> Luko, the lubuntu community is doing something right, at least
[17:42] <Luko> :D nice to see progress.. i love design and new features in lubuntu
[17:43] <Luko> LXDE is nice and easy.. only one think what i dont like on LXDE panel is .. problem unable to center icon in panel
[17:43] <Luko> (sorry for my badenglish)
[17:45] <bioterror> yeah, or inability to change application places on taskbar
[17:45] <Luko> the lxde panel is put icons to top of panel
[17:50] <kanliot> luko can i pm you with some questions about the software center?
[17:51] <Luko> yes
[17:51] <Luko> byt now i have booted windows
[17:51] <kanliot> i just want to ask if you have any problems
[17:51] <Luko> no
[17:52] <Luko> only slow reaction when i search apps
[17:52] <Luko> but works good
[17:53] <Luko> and i dont know for what is expert mode
[17:53] <Luko> i use only default settings
[17:56] <kanliot> luko see my private chat
[18:05] <bioterror> asking problems in private chat wont let people to help with solving ththem


[01:41] -ubottu:#ubuntu-news- ::planet:: The Fridge: Extended Security Maintenance for Ubuntu 18.04 LTS began on May 31, 2023 @ https://fridge.ubuntu.com/2023/06/17/extended-security-maintenance-for-ubuntu-18-04-lts-began-on-may-31-2023/
[01:41] -ubottu:#ubuntu-news- ::planet:: Ubuntu Blog: Is Linux secure? @ https://ubuntu.com//blog/is-linux-secure
[20:11] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::OMG!Ubuntu:: Ubuntu 22.04 Fixes Window Snapping Memory Bug @ https://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2023/06/ubuntu-22-04-window-snapping-memory-bug (by Joey Sneddon)
[20:38] <Bashing-om> UWN: Issue792 up for review and final edits: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Issue792 :D
[20:43] <krytarik> Bashing-om: I think the Ubuntu Studio review should be in the Press section instead of Other Community News.
[20:45] <krytarik> Otoh, I'm not sure what the Steam article does in the latter..
[20:46] <krytarik> Because the Press section is used for articles related to Ubuntu.
[20:47] <krytarik> Could just move the latter to the Blogosphere instead.
[20:52] <Bashing-om> krytarik: ack - move'n em :D
[21:02] <Bashing-om> UWN: Next edits ?
[22:21] <Unit193> https://ubuntu.com//blog/ubuntu-on-smartnics-drive-data-centre-efficiency is 404
[22:26] <krytarik> LOL, but the one with the misspelled "effieciency" is there to the rescue! >_<
[22:57] <Bashing-om> Thanks Unit193 :D fixed the link here also :D
[22:58] <Bashing-om> In looking ^ I ran across a new to me blog site " https://www.ubuntufree.com/ " :D but currently nothing I was not aware of.


[02:29] <micahg> len-dt: umm, it depends on how it's installed
[02:48] <Len-nb> micahg, I did a fresh precise install, then tried to remove -graphics and -video.
[03:03] <Len-nb> The two meta files were removed but none of the deps
[03:04] <micahg> yeah, on install it won't work as the depends are not marked as auto installed
[03:05] <Len-nb> Don't know what happened to our user then.
[03:05] <Len-nb> I do need to move a font out of fonts on to desktop though.
[03:07] <micahg> Len-nb: you could just add it to desktop if the fonts metapackage is useful by itself without desktop
[03:08] <Len-nb> micahg, OK, I will do that.
[03:10] <Len-nb> Still waiting for release on -settings. I don't know if it matters, but what I have done so far fixes some things in precise, What I have next is all quantal
[03:10] <micahg> ah, crud, right, that should get in for alpha3
[03:14] <micahg> Len-nb: not so sure I like adding more stuff to /etc/skel
[03:14] <Len-nb> I am not worried about the -look package so much, thought I did want to test it on install. It works fine on an allready installed system
[03:15] <Len-nb> micahg, where would I put it?
[03:15] <micahg> TBH, it sounds like a maintenance burden...I'm not sure the best way to do that
[03:15] <micahg> Len-nb: mind if I revert that for alpha3?
[03:15] <Len-nb> OK
[03:16] <micahg> Len-nb: was Exec=Exec=exo-open a typo?
[03:16] <Len-nb> It was one of the blueprint things.
[03:17] <micahg> Len-nb: I'm referring to Exec being there twice
[03:17] <Len-nb> where is the exec thing? I'll look
[03:17] <micahg> Len-nb: commit 127 in -settings
[03:18] <micahg> otherwise, I think it's fine
[03:21] <Len-nb> Thats strange... it works that way too.
[03:21] <Len-nb> Ok I will change that.
[03:21] <micahg> also, why in -look did you add a ubuntu-text.plymouth.in file?
[03:22] <micahg> (commit 138)
[03:22] <Len-nb> I was copying the way they did the vanilla ubuntu theme
[03:22] <Len-nb> I don't know why they have it either
[03:22] <micahg> right, but you should only need the Ubuntu Studio one, not the Ubuntu one
[03:26] <Len-nb> OK micahg settings typo fixed.
[03:27] <micahg> Len-nb: I assume it should still work that way...
[03:27] <Len-nb> I'll remove the extra file in the other branch
[03:28] <micahg> wfm
[03:28] <micahg> ok, I'll revert the xchat thing then so I can get this uploaded and get to sleep
[03:31] <Len-nb> I'll check., ya it works
[03:34] <micahg> ok, test building and uploading, is there anything else that should be uploaded aside from a new -meta?
[03:36] <micahg> Len-nb: you also need a depends on exo-utils to use exo-open in the package
[03:37]  * micahg is adding
[03:43] <micahg> Len-nb: ok, unless there's anything else, I'll upload -settings now
[03:44] <Len-nb> Thanks. settings is done and I have done the font in desktop too
[03:44] <micahg> Len-nb: did you make any changes after the Exec fix?
[03:44] <Len-nb> in settings no
[03:45] <micahg> ok, thanks, will upload then
[03:46] <Len-nb> Thankyou micahg I will test tomorrows ISO?
[03:46] <micahg> there should be one at some point (no more dailies until after alpha3)
[03:47] <Len-nb> I didn't know we were at alpha 3
[03:48] <micahg> Len-nb: where is the theme shipped?
[03:48] <Len-nb> It has been very quiet in here
[03:48] <Len-nb> It is a depends in settings I think
[03:48] <Len-nb> murrin is the package
[03:49] <micahg> ah, so, murrine-themes needs a font?
[03:49] <micahg> is this a studio specific thing?
[03:50] <Len-nb> Nope it is not setting. You would have to ask Scott
[03:51] <micahg> ok, I'll include it like that for now, but you might want to consider moving it to -look if appropriate
[03:51] <Len-nb>  gtk2-engines-murrine, murrine-themes is dep in the -look branch
[03:52] <Len-nb> Ya both deps should be in the same place.
[03:53] <micahg> hrm, that seems like a redundent dep to begin with unless -look uses something specific from gtk2-engines-murrine
[03:55] <Len-nb> There is a lot of that so people can install studio on top of vanilla of kubuntu or whatever.
[03:55] <Len-nb> I don't know if it is the best either
[03:55] <Len-nb> I don't want to make huge changes though
[03:55] <micahg> sure, but murrine-themes depends on gtk2-engines-murrine, so, unless you're relying on something specific in there, it's an implementation detail of murrine-themes
[03:56] <Len-nb> I didn't know that... bet Scott didn't either :)
[04:00] <micahg> -meta uploaded as well
[04:00] <Len-nb> Thanks, Is look going?
[04:00] <micahg> yeah, I think so
[04:01] <micahg> your image size might balloon a little :)
[04:01] <micahg> but you're on a DVD already, so you've got room
[04:01] <Len-nb> Ya, we know.
[04:02] <micahg> sorry, I haven't had time to follow most of the threads on the ML
[04:02] <Len-nb> Thats why I'm working on post install package deal
[04:03] <Len-nb> If we try to include everything it will be a 5 DVD set
[04:05] <Len-nb> No worrys about the ML. I can be verbose.
[09:45] <ailo> len-dt: Seems like most tweaks can be done during runtime
[09:45] <ailo> But, I'd like to find out if some perhaps should not be done during runtime, for whatever reason
[09:46] <ailo> But as a starting point, I'll try make each tweak configurable during runtime, using a gui
[13:03] <len-dt> ailo, ok
[13:03] <len-dt> That would be good for testing anyway.
[13:08] <len-dt> ailo, adding stuff to /etc/skel seems to be a problem. My tweak to get xchat to open #ubuntustudio is taken out. Not sure how else to do this.
[13:13] <len-dt> I guess we could add our own *.desktop file and put it on the command line.
[13:15] <ailo> len-dt: I think better fix whatever is not working with /etc/skel
[13:15] <len-dt> Skel works, it was a policy thing, hard to maintain?
[13:16] <len-dt> Read the irc log from last night... err this morning.
[13:17] <ailo> len-dt: Where do applications usually keep their default configs?
[13:17] <ailo> There is also /etc/default
[13:17] <ailo> Er, but that won't help, I think
[13:18] <ailo> len-dt: How does Ubuntu add the default config for Firefox? The bookmarks, etc?
[13:18] <ailo> Should be done the same way?
[13:19] <len-dt> I have been looking... can't find it. But there is a package they add I think.
[13:19] <len-dt> I should look at that.
[13:21] <len-dt> xul-ext-ubufox
[13:23] <len-dt> It does a loy more than set bookmarks though
[13:25] <len-dt> xchat puts an xpm in icons and a png in pixmaps... seems backwards :)
[13:39] <ailo> I really don't like bash scripting syntax :(
[13:49] <len-dt> It's something to get used to...
[13:54] <ailo> len-dt: I've made a script that implements the hardware timers tweak. As I'm looking at it, the only thing that seems to be interesting to tweak is really just the value. Would you agree?
[13:54] <ailo> Seems like that is a tweak that should be enabled by default, during install
[13:55] <ailo> And the value should be set to 3072, but make it possible for the user to change it between the ranges of 1024 and 8192
[13:57] <len-dt> permissions too. But the permissions should be set all the time.
[13:58] <len-dt> I don't know if I would go so high as 8k though. That is higher than the midi standard it self.
[13:59] <len-dt> 3072 is an odd number, but it is about the midi port speed.
[14:00] <len-dt> I also suspect that the higher the number the more trouble it would be for a slower machine to keep up with.
[14:01] <len-dt> ailo, in the end, the hard part looks to be finding a way of testing.
[14:08] <len-dt> back in a minute
[14:13] <len-dt> Hmm, ailo, addingthe url on the commandline for xchat doesn't seem to work...
[14:15] <ailo> len-dt: I was just talking about gui implementation. It seems the general opinion is to have a range between 1024 and 8192
[14:16] <ailo> And 3072 more or less as default
[14:16] <len-dt> Ya, I saw that. I want to test the nigh numbers with audio running
[14:16] <ailo> But, that we should find out by testing, as you said
[14:17] <len-dt> I am thinking that on some machines the midi will be fine but audio may suffer.
[14:17]  * len-dt is thinking there may be more xruns
[14:17] <ailo> len-dt: I'm actually starting by making bash scripts of everything. Even for kernel building
[14:18] <ailo> Best way to do testing
[14:18] <len-dt> Speaking of kernel building, the one thing we don't have in there (aside from pre-empt) is tickless timers
[14:18] <ailo> That is why we should try different configs
[14:19] <ailo> I'd rather have uploaded kernels to PPA, but I can't bother putting time on finding out how
[14:22] <ailo> The scripts have functions that the gui would
[14:22] <ailo> So, if something is to be a variable, the scripts accepts argument(s)
[14:22] <ailo> Withouth arguments, the script just uses default values
[14:23] <len-dt> makes sense
[14:24] <ailo> These scripts are only for making the tweaks. Then, we need scripts for the actual testing too. One that collects all relevant info of the system, and creates a log of the test results
[14:25] <len-dt> You've done the easy part.
[14:25] <ailo> Question is, what do we do to test the system, exactly?
[14:26] <len-dt> Ya :)
[14:26] <len-dt> My thought is get the system to behave a bad as possible first.
[14:27] <len-dt> Then look for a way of measuring that badness
[14:27] <len-dt> Then we can see improvements that are finer than we can hear
[14:30] <ailo> counting xruns is a given parameter.
[14:30] <len-dt> Yes
[14:30] <ailo> The midi timing issue is a bit harder to automate
[14:31] <ailo> For that you need some way of measuring the timing diff
[14:32] <len-dt> Ya, It would be nice to be able to playback and record with the same app.
[14:32] <len-dt> qtracktor doesn't seem to do that well.
[14:33] <len-dt> I ended up using two instances, one to play and the other to record.
[14:35] <len-dt> I need to try the whole mess over again with my netbook though as that is where I heard problems.
[14:36] <len-dt> My desktop has been very solid, even with the USB midi port.
[14:37] <ailo> len-dt: This look promising https://github.com/koppi/alsa-midi-latency-test/
[14:38] <ailo> But that's only for inside the OS, I would think
[14:39] <ailo> Nothing related to HW
[14:41] <ailo> len-dt: Actually, seems it will test whatever it is connected to
[14:42] <len-dt> It looks to be testing latency. Midi latency, so long as it is consistent, is not a problem
[14:43] <len-dt> It can be corrected.
[14:43] <len-dt> general timing errors can't
[14:44] <ailo> len-dt: You get the diff in the form of best and wors
[14:44] <ailo> So, it does test jitter as well
[14:44] <ailo> What you do is you loop connect the HW. midi out to midi in
[14:44] <ailo> I'm going to try my roland, using usb
[14:44] <len-dt> Ya, that was what I did.
[14:49] <len-dt> Some applications do not use the sessions idea of default browser.
[14:51] <len-dt> non-mixer is one of these. I have default browser set to chromium, but non-mixer opens its help in firefox. wonder what it does if FF isn;t installed?
[14:53] <ailo> len-dt: Maybe it's hardcoded?
[14:53]  * micahg isn't sure what non-mixer is, but you want to check that stuff is using xdg-open generally
[14:57] <len-dt> non-mixer is part of the non-daw set of applications. Much like jack-mixer but with more stuff built in.
[15:02] <len-dt> I don't think it is in ubuntu repos ;-)  maintainer is falkTX
[15:05]  * len-dt is working on special instances of software center that only show SW related to the menu they reside in.
[15:06] <ailo> len-dt: Had to connect two different midi HW to get the loop going :). So, for you and me, we should be able to automate midi testing
[15:07] <len-dt> I have to use a MIDI through to connect output to input.
[15:08] <ailo> len-dt: I don't have a midi cable right now. At least both are usb, so it's easy to test on multiple machines
[15:09] <ailo> Couldn't get the roland to loop only using the usb connection
[15:09] <ailo> I also have a midisport 1x1 device
[15:09] <len-dt> My roland does looping to external devices but not to the USB port.
[15:14] <ailo> len-dt: I'm putting stuff here, while I'm sketching https://gitorious.org/ubuntustudio-testing/pages/Home
[15:15] <ailo> I'm just trying to get a full picture of what we are doing
[15:15] <ailo> What we should test
[15:16] <ailo> len-dt: Anything missing there?
[15:17] <len-dt> ailo, I would drop PCI latency. Using the sugested script made my machine unstable and more xruns as a result. Any newer system will have PCIe slots anyway.
[15:17] <ailo> One thing that I think we should not do, is disabling things that don't do any harm anyway
[15:17] <len-dt> blutooth?
[15:18] <ailo> len-dt: The idea is we do tests, gather results, and then figure out what to do
[15:18] <len-dt> swappiness?
[15:18] <ailo> It's there
[15:19] <ailo> Under Filesystem
[15:19] <len-dt> ok I see it now. My browser is set to a small font for that.
[15:20] <len-dt> Both of my machines gave problems with jackd when ulatency was used
[15:21] <len-dt> Jackd crashing
[15:21] <len-dt> I think that is because jack does some of the same things using different system tools or the stock ulatencyd setup conflicts.
[15:22] <ailo> len-dt: Perhaps rmlimits is preferred in that situation
[15:22] <ailo> Seems to be all about cgroups
[15:23] <ailo> rlimits, instead of PAM
[15:23] <len-dt> might be.
[15:24] <ailo> Using rlimits instead of PAM would be kind of a big change.
[15:24] <ailo> But interesting to see how that works
[15:24] <len-dt> The idea behind using ulatencyd in the first place was to set what apps should be forced to stay in ram and not get swapped out. This is turned off by default
[15:27] <len-dt> ailo, to test swappiness... run a sequence and pump it into enough sound modules to use more than 40% memory... now try to use qjackctl.
[15:28] <len-dt> I think I actually was using closer to 60% memory
[15:28] <ailo> len-dt: You mean fill up 60% of RAM with something, and then try using qjackctl?
[15:28] <ailo> Or does it have to be jack applications?
[15:29] <ailo> Why qjacktl, in particular?
[15:29] <len-dt> Probably has to be jack or at least those with memlock
[15:29] <ailo> Ok
[15:29] <len-dt> That was where I noticed the problem
[15:30] <len-dt> It was like qjackctl had froze
[15:30] <ailo> len-dt: You start qjackctl first.  Then go back to qjackctl, right?
[15:30] <len-dt> Ya.
[15:31] <len-dt> It seemed to ok to get the connections made but then after running things for a while and going back to change routing, qjackctl was pretty much not usable for a bit.
[15:31] <ailo> len-dt: And this happened when swappiness was high?
[15:32] <len-dt> swappiness was at stock setting 60
[15:32] <len-dt> This means when ram get 4o% the OS starts swaping things out
[15:32] <len-dt> Not hard swaps but if they have sat around for a bit.
[15:34] <len-dt> swappiness at 10 I can go for days with no swap at all, and if I use a lot of cache it may put some stuff there, but after that use it is stable again.
[15:34] <ailo> len-dt: And did you ever see a situation where it would be good to have more swap on Ubuntu Studio?
[15:34] <len-dt> I found no real difference from swappiness at 10 or at 0.
[15:34] <ailo> I mean, more swappiness
[15:35] <len-dt> even with swappiness at 0 the OS will swap stuff out if it has to
[15:35] <ailo> Has someone said anything about that, what graphics are concerned, etc
[15:35] <len-dt> 10 gives it a bit of time to start swapping things out before it has to just to run.
[15:36] <len-dt> I have had comments that swappiness at a low value is good for graphics as well.
[15:37] <len-dt> Also cpu frequency on full not ondemand.
[15:37] <len-dt> at least one other person has had problems with xruns at speed change with ondemand.
[15:39] <ailo> High swappiness is perhaps only suitable for servers?
[15:40] <ailo> I've never measured how the cpu freq changes
[15:40] <ailo> And how fast
[15:44] <len-dt> high swappiness is good for high disk use applications
[15:44] <len-dt> redhat now defaults to 40
[15:45] <len-dt> even in their servers I think
[15:47] <len-dt> There is a cpu throttling for jack, but from reading about it... all it does is set speed full while jack is running.
[15:49] <ailo> len-dt: Where is the cpu throttling for jack, link?
[15:50] <len-dt> http://rg42.org/oss/jackfreqd/start
[15:53] <len-dt> I found the discussion at the bottom interesting.
[15:54] <len-dt> It seems the same thing can be achieved by using ondemand and switching to performance when jack starts
[15:55] <len-dt> Note this person also seems to have had xruns when the speed switches
[15:56] <len-dt> That would make three, that I have heard of... the person he was talking to makes 4
[15:57] <len-dt> There has been a suggestion, that running at a lower speed but solid with no changes would be fine too.
[15:58] <len-dt> I think mine has 1/2, 4/6, 5/6 and full. Running at 5/6 may give less fan noise and heat but still run fine.
[15:59]  * len-dt thinks he could do a lot at half speed
[16:17] <ailo> Well, that's enough for one day. We have two things we know we can test automated: 1. xruns 2. midi latency(jitter).
[16:17] <ailo> Need to see about memlock and freezing apps tomorrow then
[16:18] <len-dt> good.
[16:18] <len-dt> I am going to work on install icons today.
[18:14] <ailo> len-dt: I was just doing some testing with the alsa-midi-latency-test
[18:15] <ailo> I adjusted max_user_freq between ranges 64 and 3072
[18:15] <ailo> No change
[18:16] <ailo> Don't know if this test app uses audio group
[18:16] <ailo> Don't know how that works, concerning the HW timers
[18:17] <ailo> Whatever I did, enabling, or disabling, had no effect
[18:17] <ailo> Latency was mostly 4ms, with only a few stray misses, between 7-9ms
[18:18] <ailo> But, then I tried with rtirq script
[18:18] <ailo> And then, nothing abobe 5 ms
[18:20] <ailo> Still, not really big jitter in either case, which is not my experience from before. So, I'll do some manual testing too, using ears and wave files
[18:21] <ailo> I guess perhaps jitter doesn't come through on this test after all. Remains to be seen
[19:48] <len-dt> ailo, That was what I found frustrating. I had heard timing all over the place, but when I tried to measure it... the problem vanished :P
[19:49] <ailo> len-dt: Did you reboot in between changes?
[19:49] <ailo> We really need to make sure to put down all possible data for automated tests to catch diffs
[19:50] <ailo> I mean, collect all possible data
[19:51] <len-dt> worse, two different machines :-)  I have to do some retesting
[19:53] <ailo> len-dt: Actually, after redoing the test with the rtirq script running, I suddenly get the same result as without, pretty much
[19:54] <ailo> Anyway, I should just create a test, and collect data to the mail list
[19:54] <ailo> It'll speak for itself after all
[19:57] <len-dt> fun fun.
[21:43] <len-dt> ailo, I tried something different, but it still looks good... Hmm, I should check I may have the timers group audio on that machine.
[21:45] <len-dt> Ran an external synth in with just a drum beat. Recorded a track. Then ran that out the port and in and recorded on the same instance of qtractor.
[21:46] <len-dt> They line up really well. I will try it with out the timers accessible by group audio.


[00:47] <guiverc> @Maria Andrea, I'd suggest booting a 'live' media (eg. Lubuntu install media) and run it from there https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FilesystemTroubleshooting
[00:49]  * guiverc fsck is limited unless fs (file-system) is not being used; by using 'live' media it'll not be in use; it's why it tried & had to stop asking you to do it manually in your pic
[00:51] <guiverc> also note commands are NOT required; you can use KDE Partition Manager (found in modern Lubuntu's; you didn't give your release) to check file system, if you're not familiar with commands
 @SerjSev done with the installation?
 No, i chose to do it this way: First, I will get a 16gb usb and put system backup on it in case it failed, and than i will install the OS.
 @The_LoudSpeaker
 As you like.
 Btw if you are buying external disks for backup, I'd suggest buy a ssd if you can.
 No, I'm planning to buy a normal usb putting the backup in it, and than if the Lubuntu worked i will give the usb to my dad so he would use it for his stuff.
 Btw the file is downloaded, i downloaded it yesterday.
 Though I didn't know how to check if it's fully downloaded
 @SerjSev [Though I didn't know how to check if it's fully downloaded], Eagleget gives you a notification AFAIK.
 Ow so i shouldn't do that thing with the 7zip to verify if it's downloaded without any situations, but EagleGet said it was fully downloaded so it's a success on that!
 @ram
 (Photo, 234x53) https://i.imgur.com/v12RIYo.jpg is this the correct size?
 @The_LoudSpeaker
 Yup!
 yey
 Hey, look i chose to put the recovery on my usb. Do you have a software to put the iso on a cd? @The_LoudSpeaker
 Rufus?
 But i m afraid iso size would be larger than CD.
 Use usb only for installing. Recommended
 My cd is like 4gb
 The file is 1.6 gb
 @The_LoudSpeaker
 Then give it a try.
 And woah! CDs are that huge?
 I had only a 700 something mb one. Many years ago.
 Okay, but how do i do it? I cant open the cd slot while its shut down. Should i put the dvd in, than shut down and than when i go to the f12 the cd starts turning and does its thing?
 Yeah i have 700mb too
 But that wouldn't work
 Yeah put the cd in and then restart.
 Go to bios while rebooting.
 Okay
 Rufus only works with usb
 @The_LoudSpeaker
 Ill check if there's a guide online
 @SerjSev [Rufus only works with usb], Then try etcher.
 Etcher might work.
 Okay
 Things are much easier in linux with dd.
 I checked the guide on the web, it needed the windows image burner, but i dont have that so i will try with etcher
 + the recovery will take a long time lel
 But it'll be worth
 @SerjSev [+ the recovery will take a long time lel], Just recover important files. Whole system backup is not needed. You won't be returning to windows if all goes well.
 If it doesnt go well, i need the usb to recover system
 Dude Etcher isn't working, everytime it's stopping at a %
 @The_LoudSpeaker
 Then google for something else. I don't remember names off the top of my head.
 Also honestly usb is just soo much convenient. Just borrow one from someone for installation na.
 http://www.freeisoburner.com/ is this trustful?
 i dont have any other usb
 @The_LoudSpeaker
 the link i sent is like the usb one but for dvd, should I use it?
 Search gor unetbootin
 Should work mostly.
 https://unetbootin.github.io/
 ?
 @The_LoudSpeaker
 Yup!
 That's the one.
 hokie dokie
 My first google search got me that.
 Learn to search bhaiya. Very useful.
 i searched 'iso burn to dvd' the first like i said showed up
 I am a bit busy rn.
 okay
 thats for usb too?!
 Download and try for cd.
 Might work.
 download what
 @SerjSev [https://unetbootin.github.io/], This.
 i downloadd that
 Doesn't work?
[11:13] <tomreyn> i don't think unetbootin can burn dvds
 no
[11:14] <tomreyn> wodim can, but it's CLI only
 does windows have a cd burner?
 when i checked the guide it does have, but i dont
[11:15] <tomreyn> https://tutorials.ubuntu.com/tutorial/tutorial-burn-a-dvd-on-windows#0
 ywah i checked that
 i dont have that option
 Thanks! tomreyn
 'Windows Disc Image Burner'< i dont have this
[11:16] <tomreyn> which windows version is this?
 10
 https://jackstromberg.com/2018/01/windows-10-missing-windows-disc-image-burner-for-iso-files/ should i check this?
[11:17] <tomreyn> i was just about to post this link, too
[11:18] <tomreyn> so i'd say yes
 found it
 omg wtf
 im clicking burn its just ejecting the disk?!
 should i try this: https://www.imgburn.com/ or this http://www.freeisoburner.com/
[11:24] <tomreyn> you know you make linux peoples' hearts bleed by making them help you do stuff in windows, right? ;-)
 but im doing this TO USE LINUX
[11:26] <tomreyn> personally i couldn't tell which of these could or could not work. i guess they probably both can, at leats the latter one (based on the latest release date only)
 (Photo, 412x543) https://i.imgur.com/D4AJO9i.jpg should i change the settings or just click burn?
[11:27] <tomreyn> i last used optical media about 10 years ago
[11:28] <tomreyn> don't rmemeber
[11:28] <tomreyn> but i guess it could work
 agh fine whatever, i have the best choice.
 ill buy a like 4gb/6gb usb with the FreeLace that i will buy
 this dvd thing is just too complicated
 (Photo, 640x507) https://i.imgur.com/O89fPPl.jpg ahh this is almost finished
 @The_LoudSpeaker look, if lubuntu doesnt work and i have the recovery usb, how can i use the usb to go back to windows?
 @SerjSev [@The_LoudSpeaker look, if lubuntu doesnt work and i have the recovery usb, how c …], Just boot from it.
 Ow, i do the same way i did with lubuntu?
 Yup!
 I thought u do like ALT+F10/F12 and than there is an option to reinstall windows
 Won't be there when you wipe the hdd while installing lubuntu
 Aa ok, so the recovery is like an iso of windows 10 but in a usb?
 Kinda
 Kinda?
 Kind of.
 Simillar
 Well you said kinda, that means something is different 🤔
 Something is same also. :)
 So you think Lubuntu will work on my laptop?
 I am sure it will. :)
 Owh that smily face...
 A . and after that a smily face...
 @teward001 wxl : Wierd container find (more like sudo and su find but anyway) : … on `lxc exec focal-dev -- sudo --user ubuntu --login` the gui apps work.  … But they don't if I do a `lxc exec focal-dev -- su --login ubuntu`
[16:18] <theos> hi
[16:19] <theos> nautilus isnt showing thumbnails in 18.04. it used to show on my previous system. how do i fix it?
 @theos check nautilus preferences. there should be an option for that.
[16:48] <theos> The_LoudSpeaker i did but its not working
[16:49] <The_LoudSpeaker> ask in #ubuntu
[16:49] <The_LoudSpeaker> maybe someone know there
[16:49] <The_LoudSpeaker> *knows
[16:52] <theos> ok thanks
 So, The good news is that i did the recovery in my usb. The bad news is, I didnt buy the new usb for the iso file, because my dad said we'll buy it on monday.
 @The_LoudSpeaker
 there's also a catch, i will try and check the empty dvds that i have if they will work, maybe they're old and etc that's why it's not burning the iso file on it.
[17:46] <The_LoudSpeaker> thats good. I will be here only. tag me when you do the installation.
 okay
 yeah... these dvds that i have arent for burning iso files, probably ill wait for the usb.
[17:54] <Meridian> yup, intelligence outpace something
[17:56] <Meridian> merry christmas to america i'm bit belated
 Merry Christmas to you too
[18:16] <The_LoudSpeaker> they said america. :P
 my christmas was on Tuesday, 2 days ago
 well, it's yesterday
 but we do it on Tuesday midnight
 just like New Yeas
 @The_LoudSpeaker [@teward001 wxl : Wierd container find (more like sudo and su find but anyway) : …], again, `sudo` and `su` aren't the same thing
 that explains the behavior differences
[20:06] <playerone> Merry Christmas
[21:11] <Guest97800> Hello
[21:11] <Guest97800> Hello
[21:12] <wxl> !ask
[21:12] <Guest97800> I have an old computer with a single core processor and 512MB RAM memory. Is there any lubuntu distribution I could install?
[21:12] <wxl> 32 bit?
[21:13] <Guest97800> Yes, 32 bits
[21:13] <wxl> then you will need 18.04, for which support ends next april
[21:14] <wxl> and 32 bit packages are being removed from the current archive, so 32 bit in general has a limited lifespan for ubuntu derivatives
[21:15] <wxl> also with 512 you won't be able to do much on the modern web
[21:15] <Guest97800> I have tried to install Ubuntu desktop 16.04.6 i386 but it runs too slow.
[21:15] <wxl> yeah lubuntu is the lightest out of all of them, so it's going to be your best bet


[09:04] <cseslam> Yo Guys ! trying irc from termial :D really cool
[09:05] <cseslam> hazrpg: seriously, you are here all the time
[09:08] <cseslam> now i has no idea how to change between opened channels