[05:24] <_phate_> I thought CS didn't need steam to play online
[05:24] <NobleArc> Oh it does.
[05:24] <NobleArc> CS needs Steam to play at all. :0
[05:24] <GoneBoB> _phate_: oh yes
[05:25] <GoneBoB> no steam no play
[05:25] <NobleArc> =\
[05:25] <_phate_> speaking of that CS sucks egg next to Halo 2 and Xbox Live
[05:25] <_phate_> thats just stupid
[05:25] <NobleArc> I bought a cruddy $15 (CDN) version of Blue-Shift a while back, just so I could play CS on Steam.
[05:25] <OrangeSlice> Halo 2 without xbox live isn't worth owning, however.
[05:25] <NobleArc> I've not yet played Halo 2.
[05:25] <NobleArc> I played the original Halo and loved it, but I like UT2K4 more.
[05:26] <OrangeSlice> it's too much trouble to get 16 people in a game under one roof, though we did it once :p
[05:26] <_phate_> OrangeSlice: Now thats just BS
[05:26] <hayden> Halo and UT are totally different
[05:26] <GoneBoB> I have an xbox a PC and a PS2 and I'll take the PS2 over the xbox anyday
[05:26] <GoneBoB> in any case, this is somewhat offtopic
[05:26] <NobleArc> heh, yeah.
[05:26] <OrangeSlice> there is no topic :p
[05:26] <NobleArc> It's all my fault. :0
[05:26] <hayden> GoneBoB: you must love playing with yourself alot then
[05:26] <NobleArc> The official topic is .. uh.. 'Give NobleArc money.'
[05:27] <GoneBoB> hayden: I use my PC to play multiplayer games
[05:27] <coroner> goto love the xbox's networking/modding capabilities tho
[05:27] <OrangeSlice> actually, it's "Send me a birthday present"
[05:27] <_phate_> Meh, its not like anyone was talking about anything else
[05:27] <Coily> does anyone know of a wine monitoring program. im fiddling around with some installs but the only thing i can think of is to compare with fresh wine install
[05:27] <_phate_> coroner: I concor with that
[05:28] <NobleArc> The people here can't spell.  It's like a rule or something. :0
[05:29] <OrangeSlice> I pride myself in my spelling abilities.
[05:29] <NobleArc> Well, good for you.  You're fine.
[05:29] <NobleArc> Must..do..all..I..can..to..avoid..correcting..everyone's..grammar!
[05:29] <NobleArc> Well, not everyone's.
[05:31] <hayden> is there a way to run a batch of command line things just by executing 1 file?
[05:31] <OrangeSlice> shell script
[05:31] <_phate_> I think thats called scripting? Might just be me...
[05:31] <DeFi[gsr-pro] > yea its called a batch script oddly enough :P
[05:32] <_phate_> :D
[05:32] <hayden> how do i do it
[05:34] <hayden> not too quick to answer now
[05:39] <hayden> ?
[05:41] <NobleArc> *clears throat*
[05:42] <crimsun> hayden: http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Bash-Prog-Intro-HOWTO.html
[05:44] <johnnybezak> hayden: the guide on BASH is better writen, and more thorough so check that out too (its also on tldp.org, under guides)
[05:45] <hayden> ok thanks
[05:47] <netpuppy> err... why can't rhythmbox play mp3's by default on ubuntu?
[05:47] <pvh> Hoary's giving me no love on the updates -- lots of packages with status "failed" on the download. Whut up?
[05:47] <GoneBoB> netpuppy: because mp3 is patented
[05:47] <crimsun> netpuppy: because the patent situation is ambiguous
[05:47] <pvh> netpuppy: Enable universe. I'd recommend you install amarok while you're at it.
[05:48] <pvh> netpuppy: Because amarok, if you have a biggish collection, is the best damn MP3 player I've ever used.
[05:48] <netpuppy> then how about microsoft ttf fonts?
[05:48] <NobleArc> Those were released by Microsoft. o_O
[05:50] <johnnybezak> whats amarok like?
[05:50] <crimsun> amarok has a very interesting approach to "playlists"
[05:51] <crimsun> netpuppy: enable multiverse and install msttcorefonts
[05:51] <netpuppy> multiverse? :)
[05:51] <eruin> wow
[05:51] <eruin> nautilus really loves being SLOW and eating RESOURCES when firefox is downloading alot :P
[05:52] <bob2> netpuppy: wiki.ubuntu.com/SynapticHowto
[05:53] <pvh> johnnybezak: Amarok... Well, where can I begin.
[05:53] <_phate_> how do I link to things? I have a partition (/stuff) how do I make a link to it in may home folder?
[05:53] <pvh> johnnybezak: It's a bit like iTunes in terms of immediate interface.
[05:53] <Brunellus> help--I accidentally moved the top taskbar thing to the right-hand side (gnome) and I don't know how to move it back?
[05:53] <pvh> johnnybezak: Most of the screen is taken up by the playlist that's on right now.
[05:54] <errr> how do I add another WM to my GDM list? I installed fluxbox and followed the directions here: http://fluxbox.org/docs/en/faq.php#gdm but that didnt work. any ideas what I need to do?
[05:54] <pvh> johnnybezak: The left hand side of the screen displays contextual information in a sidebar.
[05:54] <kurros> _phate_: middle click-drag in nautilus and select create link
[05:54] <netpuppy> Brunellus, gconf-editor
[05:54] <netpuppy> errr, make an entry in /usr/share/xsessions
[05:54] <pvh> johnnybezak: The "currently playing" tab has information about the song, other albums by that artist,
[05:54] <guestish> hi
[05:55] <errr> netpuppy: oh ok thanks
[05:55] <netpuppy> errr, you could use Gnome as a template
[05:55] <guestish> how similar is ubtuntu to debian?
[05:55] <pvh> johnnybezak: The best part (I think) is how tightly it's integrated into Audioscrobbler.
[05:55] <netpuppy> guestish, very
[05:55] <johnnybezak> puh: cool mb i'll have a look, i'm using rhythmbox which isnt bad
[05:55] <netpuppy> guerby, except up-to-date
[05:55] <_phate_> now how do I set permissions for a partition?
[05:55] <johnnybezak> pvh: whats Audioscrobbler?
[05:55] <guestish> more up to date then sid?
[05:55] <Brunellus> netpuppy: that doesn't help me
[05:55] <netpuppy> I think so
[05:55] <Brunellus> what am I supposed to do?
[05:55] <netpuppy> Brunellus, why not?
[05:55] <pvh> johnnybezak: It's the coolest thing in the world.
[05:55] <guestish> really? i thought ubuntu got their packages from sid
[05:56] <pvh> johnnybezak: They collect people's listening information and then predict what you'll like to listen to.
[05:56] <netpuppy> guestish, hm, I don't think GNOME 2.9 hit sid yet
[05:56] <johnnybezak> _phate_: chmod -R 755 /path/to/partition (owner read, write, execute group and other read and execute)
[05:56] <guestish> odd number GNOME releases are unstable
[05:56] <johnnybezak> pvh: ok i'll have a look
[05:56] <pvh> johnnybezak: Audioscrobbler can make playlist recommendations automatically by querying audioscrobbler against your database.
[05:56] <guestish> official releases are even
[05:56] <crimsun> errr: you don't actually have to do anything aside from selecting Fluxbox in the Session menu when you log in
[05:56] <guestish> thats why its always 2.4, 2.6, 2.8
[05:56] <guestish> etc
[05:56] <Brunellus> i can't drag it off the right side
[05:56] <netpuppy> guestish, though I have spent the last 3 years doing BSD work, so I'm not that up-to-date with the situation
[05:57] <guestish> netpuppy: ?
[05:57] <errr> crimsun: that would be nice to do if it were there :D
[05:57] <crimsun> errr: you did install fluxbox from universe, correct?
[05:57] <errr> no
[05:57] <errr> svn
[05:57] <guestish> im just wondering...people keep on telling me ubuntu basically is debian
[05:57] <pvh> johnnybezak: It's not for everyone -- depends on your listening profile. Check out the webpage.
[05:57] <crimsun> errr: ...
[05:57] <errr> current fluxbox is .9.12 not .9.9
[05:57] <johnnybezak> pvh: i'll have a look then
[05:57] <crimsun> errr: then why didn't you make a request to have it updated? :(
[05:58] <pvh> guestish: Ubuntu is basically Debian with a fast release cycle. :)
[05:58] <pvh> guestish: And an emphasis on being nice to people.
[05:58] <Brunellus> arrrgh.
[05:58] <guestish> pvh: huh?
[05:58] <Brunellus> I can't figure this out.
[05:58] <errr> crimsun: I am not worried about it I guess. dopey knows its out and there is a .deb
[05:58] <guestish> pvh: how can a distro be "nice to people"?
[05:58] <pvh> guestish: Ubuntu means "humanity to all people".
[05:58] <Brunellus> somehow this got dragged out to the side
[05:58] <guestish> uh, ok?
[05:58] <Brunellus> and now I can't undock it from the right hand side
[05:58] <pvh> guestish: Notice how nobody is flaming anyone in this channel (at the moment)
[05:58] <guestish> pvh: sure, but whats that have to do with ubuntu?
[05:58] <crimsun> errr: yes, but at least it could have been considered for universe prior to preview freeze
[05:59] <Brunellus> yaaay
[05:59] <Brunellus> found it
[05:59] <guestish> pvh: and about release cycles, does ubuntu take its packages from sid?
[05:59] <guestish> or does it have its own maintainers?
[05:59] <pvh> guestish: Both.
[05:59] <guestish> oh
[05:59] <pvh> guestish: But ubuntu is kept much more up to date than Debian.
[05:59] <Brunellus> I'll be damned.  the ****ing panel properties thing is hard to find
[05:59] <guestish> debian sid, sarge or woody?
[05:59] <pvh> guestish: Hah.
[05:59] <crimsun> guestish: please see http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTU
[06:00] <guestish> ?
[06:00] <netpuppy> mmm... gaim 2.0 kicks ass
[06:00] <guestish> pvh: why the "hah"
[06:00] <pvh> guestish: It's gotta be sid.
[06:00] <pvh> guestish: Though Crimsun is better qualified than I am to answer that.
[06:00] <guestish> pvh: so ubuntu is more up to date then sid?
[06:00] <pvh> guestish: Yes.
[06:01] <guestish> pvh: but you just said it gets many of its packages from sid
[06:01] <guestish> thats a contradiction..
[06:01] <pvh> guestish: There's no inherent conflict there, though I should have been clearer.
[06:01] <Brunellus> guestish:  many, but not all
[06:01] <guestish> pvh: please do
[06:01] <Brunellus> for those packages which it does not get from sid
[06:01] <pvh> guestish: Packages come from Sid, or are maintained by Ubuntu developers.
[06:01] <guestish> ok, so the packages that it doesnt get from sid, about how many are there that are ubunutu specific?
[06:01] <Brunellus> logically, it follows that ubuntu might be more up to date
[06:01] <guestish> ubuntu*
[06:02] <guestish> just a rough estimate
[06:02] <pvh> guestish: I don't know the answer to that.
[06:02] <guestish> all im asking
[06:02] <guestish> 1000? 2000?
[06:02] <Brunellus> guestish:  why does it matter?
[06:02] <Brunellus> if you want "up to date," why not go for gentoo?
[06:02] <guestish> i dont like compiling
[06:02] <pvh> guestish: I'm afraid I really don't know. All I know is that running Hoary I usually get major packages a couple days after they're released in source.
[06:03] <errr> hot dog!! thanks netpuppy that got me all fixed up
[06:03] <crimsun> guestish: ubuntu's universe has packages that are newer than their counterparts or simply don't exist in debian proper
[06:03] <Brunellus> guestish:  ye pays yer money or ye takes yer time
[06:03] <pvh> guestish: Evolution 2.1.6 dropped into Hoary in the past few days.
[06:03] <netpuppy> errr, you're welcome :)
[06:03] <guestish> crimsun: ok, thats cool, im just wondering exactly how many there are
[06:03] <guestish> er, about
[06:03] <crimsun> guestish: ~a dozen
[06:03] <guestish> approximately
[06:03] <guestish> a dozen packages?
[06:03] <crimsun> that are not in debian proper
[06:03] <guestish> ok
[06:04] <guestish> so 12 packages
[06:04] <crimsun> that's a rough guess
[06:04] <Brunellus> guestish:  why does it matter, again?
[06:04] <guestish> just wondering mainly
[06:04] <guestish> i've heard a lot about it and i wanna know the truth
[06:04] <crimsun> guestish: "truth"?
[06:04] <guestish> meh
[06:04] <Brunellus> ubuntu works for me.  that's true enough
[06:04] <crimsun> guestish: grab an array-6 image, burn, and boot
[06:05] <crimsun> guestish: best way to "test" the "truth"
[06:05] <guestish> im just wondering why there is ubuntu and debian if the difference between ubuntu and debian is 12 packages
[06:05] <Brunellus> it has also so far been nicer than suse...
[06:05] <guestish> heh,  iwould except i dont have the room to install
[06:05] <Brunellus> guestish:  what does it matter?
[06:05] <Brunellus> guestish:  run it livecd, if you can't/won't install
[06:05] <crimsun> guestish: a livecd is included in array-6
[06:05] <pvh> guestish: Have you run Debian much?
[06:05] <guestish> pvh: few years
[06:05] <guestish> mainly sid
[06:06] <pvh> guestish: One thing that always frustrated me about Sid was that it would often be in an inconsistent state.
[06:06] <guestish> pvh: inconsistant state?
[06:06] <crimsun> guestish: no, the "only" differences between debian and ubuntu absolutely are _not_ limited to 12 packages
[06:06] <pvh> guestish: Things would be badly broken -- I remember when perl5.8 came out, I ended up in a totally borked state.
[06:06] <guestish> crimsun: what else is there? (this isnt a challenge, just a question)
[06:06] <Brunellus> major difference:  ubuntu support is a lot friendlier!
[06:06] <guestish> pvh: and that doenst happen in ubuntu?
[06:06] <guestish> thats impressive
[06:06] <pvh> guestish: No, the up-to-date repository, in my experience, is kept clean.
[06:07] <guestish> cool, so packages are added every day?
[06:07] <pvh> guestish: Yeah.
[06:07] <crimsun> guestish: besides the focused release schedule, there's also a major commitment to a unified desktop experience, which means a bevy of kernel packages, device management, and microtuning of various configurations behind-the-scenes
[06:07] <guestish> crimsun: so its more integrated?
[06:07] <crimsun> guestish: every 30 minutes pool is updated as opposed to once per day
[06:08] <crimsun> guestish: absolutely. It's a GNOME-based desktop, for one
[06:08] <guestish> crimsun: oh, so gnome only?
[06:08] <pvh> guestish: No, KDE is in "universe"
[06:08] <crimsun> guestish: however, there has been quite a bit of work to integrate KDE neatly
[06:08] <guestish> ah, so many more gui tools
[06:09] <guestish> that makes sense
[06:09] <crimsun> (that effort is known as "Kubuntu")
[06:09] <Quest-Master> Hmm.. just upgraded to Hoary and my Firefox is dead now
[06:09] <NobleArc> *audible gasp!*
[06:09] <johnnybezak> Quest-Master: whats happened?
[06:09] <johnnybezak> Quest-Master: my firefox went wierd, but then was ok once i had compoletely finished upgrade
[06:10] <Quest-Master> It just.. isn't opening
[06:10] <Quest-Master> I'm going to try to upgrade
[06:10] <Brunellus> as a non-techie, I went to ubuntu over Debian-Sarge because it was just friendlier
[06:10] <guestish> Brunellus: you've made that clear :)
[06:10] <Brunellus> sorry.  I'm trying to get this across, as I feel it's quite important
[06:10] <guestish> yes yes, i know
[06:10] <Brunellus> Debian docs are very daunting for nontechnical people
[06:11] <Quest-Master> rm: cannot remove `/usr/lib/mozilla-firefox/defaults/pref': Is a directory <-- I get this when I try to upgrade
[06:11] <Brunellus> ubuntu is a lot less threatening.
[06:11] <guestish> ubuntu must be heavily staffed to do all this
[06:11] <Quest-Master> Should I manually remove it?
[06:11] <Quest-Master> There is nothing in there
[06:11] <johnnybezak> Quest-Master: just rm -rf it
[06:11] <Brunellus> guestish:  if you have a free partition, give it a try
[06:11] <ells> is anyone familiar on how I can get transcode and get it installed
[06:11] <guestish> unfortuately i dont
[06:12] <crimsun> guestish: it has very committed people, yes.
[06:12] <johnnybezak> how do i expand tar.gz in the command line?
[06:12] <Brunellus> try the livecd, if you can.  the livecd is pretty neat.
[06:12] <crimsun> johnnybezak: tar xfz foo.tar.gz
[06:12] <guestish> so a few, but commit people
[06:12] <guestish> er, comitted
[06:12] <johnnybezak> crimsun: thnx
[06:12] <guestish> tar -zxvf
[06:12] <crimsun> guestish: quite a bit more than just "a few"
[06:12] <guestish> crimsun: ?
[06:12] <pvh> guestish: There's lots of information on the ubuntulinux.org site as well. :)
[06:13] <guestish> pvh: i know, im browsing it:)
[06:13] <Quest-Master> If I just close a terminal in the middle of it apt-get upgrade'ing, will I break anything? :\
[06:13] <guestish> Quest-Master: um...yes...
[06:13] <Xenguy> Quest-Master: I'm assuming that will abort
[06:13] <crimsun> Quest-Master: it will stop the apt-get operation, but you can always resume it
[06:13] <guestish> Quest-Master: it will break stuff...
[06:14] <guestish> Quest-Master: apt-get -f install
[06:14] <Quest-Master> Yeah.. it seems this upgrade has a ton to do, and I have to go to sleep and turn off the computer
[06:14] <guestish> leave it on..
[06:14] <guestish> or do apt-get -f install in the morning
[06:14] <crimsun> Quest-Master: then re-execute the apt-get operation when you awake in the morning
[06:15] <guestish> canceling it never has that good of an effect if you are past the downloading phase
[06:15] <Quest-Master> Can't go to sleep when it's on.. makes too much noise, hehe.
[06:15] <Xenguy> Quest-Master: yeah, apt-get is smart enough to resume where it left off :-)
[06:15] <Quest-Master> I'll just stay up a bit.
[06:15] <crimsun> Quest-Master: nothing's broken, just restart it when you awake
[06:15] <Xenguy> Quest-Master: you don't have to -- you can simply resume in the morning -- no time is lost :-)
[06:18] <mrproper> Do I need to install anything to get spam filtering in Evolution to work?
[06:18] <guestish> dont think so
[06:19] <mrproper> Because mine doesn't seem to effective, and spamassassin isn't in the repository.
[06:19] <guestish> you sure spamassassin isnt?
[06:19] <mrproper> Whats the package name?
[06:20] <guestish> uh, spamassassin
[06:20] <mrproper> A search in Synaptic shows nothing
[06:20] <guestish> try apt-cache
[06:20] <travisat> bob2: are you here
[06:20] <mrproper> guestish, Nope.
[06:20] <guestish> mrproper: weird
[06:20] <guestish> well im not using ubuntu
[06:20] <crimsun> mrproper: enable universe.
[06:20] <mrproper> crimsun, will that screw anything up?
[06:21] <crimsun> mrproper: no.
[06:21] <netpuppy> lol
[06:21] <guestish> yeah, i'd think spamassassin was there
[06:21] <netpuppy> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
[06:21] <netpuppy>   libapache-mod-python: Depends: python (< 2.4) but 2.4-0ubuntu6 is to be installed
[06:23] <guestish> nothing's perfect...
[06:24] <crimsun> netpuppy: pristine hoary?
[06:24] <mrproper> Thanks guys.
[06:24] <crimsun> netpuppy: i.e., no external sources
[06:26] <netpuppy> crimsun, well I just enabled universe
[06:26] <netpuppy> if that counts
[06:26] <netpuppy> but when I look at it it actually makes sense
[06:26] <crimsun> netpuppy: that's fine
[06:26] <netpuppy> it says < 2.4
[06:26] <crimsun> netpuppy: it just hasn't been rebuilt yet.
[06:26] <guestish> ?
[06:26] <guestish> what doesnt have errors...
[06:27] <netpuppy> anyways libapache2-mod-python was what I was looking for
[06:27] <crimsun> netpuppy: it's listed here, so it hasn't been transitioned yet: https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UniversePythonTransitionTODO
[06:27] <Agabus> hey has anyone else reported array 6 as after installing not booting any GUI after having problems installing packages?
[06:30] <mrproper> Does Warty come with inotify in the kernel?
[06:32] <johnnybezak> hey guys how do I add things to startup?
[06:32] <crimsun> mrproper: no, but hoary does.
[06:32] <crimsun> mrproper: it is, however, disabled even in hoary's kernel
[06:33] <mrproper> crimsun, Okay, so it's disabled.  Okay thanks.
[06:33] <ells> in hoary, since k3b wont work, what are people using to burn cds and dvds
[06:33] <Agabus> has anyone else reported array 6 as after installing not booting any GUI after having problems installing packages??
[06:33] <johnnybezak> ells: why wont k3b work>?
[06:33] <ells> I was told that it will not work in hoary
[06:34] <gteppel> What is that DateTime notation that represents the date in terms of seconds??
[06:34] <ells> actually, i had haory for a while and it did not work either
[06:34] <johnnybezak> ells: i can't see why it wouldnt work
[06:34] <ells> johnnybezak, are you running hoary
[06:34] <jeavis> hello
[06:34] <jeavis> where I can download Hoary
[06:34] <johnnybezak> ells: you'll just have to d/l the kde libs
[06:34] <johnnybezak> jeavis: distrowatch.com
[06:34] <crimsun> jeavis: hoary has not been released yet.
[06:35] <johnnybezak> woah
[06:35] <ells> johnnybezak,what are you running
[06:35] <johnnybezak> sorry hehe
[06:35] <johnnybezak> ells: i just use nautilus
[06:35] <ells> crimsun, you can still download the latest hoary
[06:35] <jeavis> crimsun: what do you recommend warty o hoary
[06:35] <johnnybezak> jeavis: you can update warty
[06:35] <bestadvocate> hey google added a cool weather thinggy
[06:35] <ells> johnnybezak, are you running warty
[06:35] <crimsun> ells: you can download a milestone (i.e., snapshot)
[06:35] <jeavis> johnnybezak: I want to downlaod de iso and burn
[06:35] <johnnybezak> ells: hoary
[06:36] <crimsun> jeavis: depends on what you want
[06:36] <ells> johnnybezak,  he will probably be better off downloading the latest iso
[06:36] <ells> johnnybezak, can you burn dvds also
[06:36] <jeavis> crimsun: I want to check
[06:36] <crimsun> jeavis: then try array-6. See the topic.
[06:36] <jeavis> crimsun: I can download and burn it
[06:36] <ells> jeavis, that is what I would do
[06:37] <Agabus> i downloaded array 6 but it didn't work
[06:37] <ells> I have downloaded both the current hoary and debian
[06:37] <ells> I am torn between the two
[06:37] <johnnybezak> jeavis: you've got to d/l warty then update it
[06:37] <ells> johnnybezak, I do not believe that is true
[06:37] <ells> hoary is available to download
[06:38] <ells> in iso
[06:38] <johnnybezak> hoary: thats news to me, it hasnt been released yet
[06:38] <johnnybezak> ells: youre probably right though
[06:38] <ells> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/hoary/current/
[06:38] <johnnybezak> ells: as far as nautilus and dvd's i think it can
[06:38] <crimsun> ells: the 6th milestone toward Hoary has been released. Hoary has _not_ been released.
[06:38] <johnnybezak> ells: but im not sure
[06:39] <ells> right, but that has all the latest changes
[06:40] <mrproper> Where can I get gtkmozembed?
[06:41] <crimsun> mrproper: enable universe.
[06:41] <mrproper> crimsun, Yeah, what package?
[06:41] <crimsun> mrproper: are you looking for the .NET binding for it?
[06:42] <mrproper> crimsun, No.
[06:42] <mrproper> I don't think so at least.
[06:42] <Xenguy> apt-cache search gtkmozembed  ???
[06:42] <crimsun> [that will return libgecko-cil]
[06:42] <Xenguy> mrproper: --^
[06:43] <mrproper> Just the .Net binding.
[06:43] <crimsun> mrproper: err, what? are you or are you not looking for the .NET binding?
[06:43] <mrproper> I guess I could go with tbird-dev.
[06:43] <crimsun> :-)
[06:43] <mrproper> crimsun, I am not looking for the bindings.
[06:44] <crimsun> mrproper: then you're probably looking for libnspr-dev, mozilla-dev, or mozilla-firefox-dev
[06:45] <mrproper> I couldn't find mozilla-firefox-dev, but I'm going to install the CIL bindings which will pull needed stuff.
[06:46] <Steve_G4> Hello
[06:46] <Steve_G4> I'm using the LiveCD of Hoary on a G4.
[06:47] <Steve_G4> Does anybody know if I can mount my HFS+ formatted drive?
[06:48] <Steve_G4> Is anybody active in here?  No messages are showing up....
[06:49] <johnnybezak> Steve_G4: you can
[06:49] <Steve_G4> How?
[06:49] <johnnybezak> 2.6 has HFS+ reading built in
[06:50] <crimsun> Steve_G4: it's very early sunday morning eastern time and daylight in europe; many people are asleep.
[06:50] <johnnybezak> mount -t hfsplus /dev/devicename /path/to/mount/point
[06:50] <crimsun> so despite it being not even 10 pm in your neck o' the woods...
[06:51] <johnnybezak> and its ten to five pm here :)
[06:51] <Steve_G4> its 9:52 pm here
[06:51] <Steve_G4> I'm in Los Angeles, CA, US
[06:51] <NobleArc> Funny, it's 9:41 PM here. :P
[06:51] <johnnybezak> hmmm youre clocks wrong :)
[06:51] <Steve_G4> according to the nearest GSM cellular tower, its 9:52
[06:52] <NobleArc> Ohh, I read it as 41, when it said 47 >.<
[06:52] <NobleArc> *moves an ethernet cable*
[06:52] <Steve_G4> haha
[06:52] <NobleArc> and my taskbar says 9:52. o_O
[06:52] <jupiter> does anyone here use the PPC version of Warty?
[06:52] <Steve_G4> I'm on the PPC LiveCD of Hoary
[06:52] <johnnybezak> i was using it updated to hoary yesterday
[06:53] <NobleArc> if I could afford a Mac, I would.
[06:53] <jupiter> oh, i didn't even know there was a LiveCD for PPC!
[06:53] <Steve_G4> I'm on a blazing fast 350mhz G4
[06:53] <johnnybezak> nice 1
[06:53] <Steve_G4> neither did I, until I saw the update on DistroWatch
[06:53] <johnnybezak> hows gnome go?
[06:53] <Steve_G4> I think gnome is a lot simpler and easier to use than kde
[06:54] <johnnybezak> i use flux
[06:54] <Steve_G4> but I've only used Knoppix and Ubuntu, so I can't really say much..
[06:54] <johnnybezak> but i like gnome too
[06:54] <mrproper> Does anyone know why Firefox is so old in Horay?
[06:54] <johnnybezak> Steve_G4: then youve used some good ones :)
[06:54] <Steve_G4> yes indeedy
[06:54] <crimsun> mrproper: "old"?
[06:54] <mrproper> 0.9.3
[06:55] <crimsun> mrproper: 1.0RC had _just_ been released when Warty was released.
[06:55] <mrproper> crimsun, But with Horay?
[06:55] <crimsun> mrproper: 1.0 is in Hoary
[06:55] <mrproper> crimsun, Wait, which is more updated, Horay or Warty?
[06:55] <crimsun> the former
[06:56] <mrproper> crimsun, I'm on Warty.  To upgrade, just change warty to horay on the sources.list file?
[06:56] <crimsun> "warty" to "hoary"
[06:56] <Steve_G4> Hoary is the newest version of Ubuntu, but Hoary is an alpha development release for now
[06:56] <crimsun> then you'll need to update && dist-upgrade
[06:56] <Steve_G4> Warty is the stable release
[06:57] <Steve_G4> I don't really know what any of the added features and enhancements on Hoary are over Warty
[06:57] <sprongie> woo just installed ubuntu and to abuse a phrase, i'm loving it :)
[06:57] <mrproper> Could someone tell me what a sources.list file from Horay should look like?>
[06:58] <Steve_G4> thats great sprongie
[06:58] <eruin> hoary alpha??
[06:58] <sprongie> detected all my nforce mobo hardware just dandy
[06:58] <eruin> arent we in feature freeze closing up on release date fast?
[06:58] <jupiter> Do the PPC users use MOL?
[06:58] <sprongie> installed with XFS partition, only minor oops when i forgot to create a ext2 /boot partition
[06:58] <Steve_G4> what?
[06:58] <crimsun> Steve_G4: https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/HoaryGoals
[06:58] <justdave_> I use MOL
[06:58] <sprongie> that should probably be fixed.  otherwise, it's a joy
[06:59] <Steve_G4> thank you crimsun
[06:59] <justdave_> is there anything special I need to do to make "detected printers" work in CUPS?
[06:59] <sprongie> mrproper: i can msg you my sources.list if you want
[07:00] <jupiter> justdave: so firewire and firewire HDs are recognized? how about the isight as a video source?
[07:00] <sprongie> mrproper: turn off flood protection and i'll msg it, or i can try dcc
[07:00] <mrproper> sprongie, I just found one.
[07:00] <sprongie> ah ok
[07:00] <justdave_> jupiter: dunno, haven't tried that stuff in MoL yet.
[07:00] <jupiter> justdave: how about in ubuntu itself?
[07:01] <justdave_> I would doubt if hotplugging a firewire device would show up in MoL...  you probably have to have it mounted already, then list it in the drives to make available to OSX in the MoL config
[07:02] <justdave_> I've got a shared printer on another computer on my LAN (advertised via zeroconf)
[07:02] <justdave_> on all the OS X boxes it just shows up on the shared printers list
[07:02] <justdave_> the printer box in Ubuntu isn't showing any detected printers
[07:02] <justdave_> (although it's claiming that it should be able to detect them)
[07:03] <justdave_> do I have to do anything special to make it work?
[07:05] <justdave_> guess it'll print now, just annoying it didn't already show up.  CUPS is supposed to be able to do zeroconf
[07:06] <mystify> i got a question
[07:07] <mystify> can anyone help me please?
[07:07] <Levander> Anybody know how to change the domain name?
[07:08] <johnnybezak> mystify: just ask :)
[07:08] <luciux> Levander: you say the DNS ip?
[07:08] <mystify> i do beleive i have installed wine right? so i want to install this game called city of heroes...nothing is happening?
[07:09] <mystify> do i need to get wine up and working before i can put the installation cd of CoH?
[07:09] <sprongie> is CoH known to work under wine?
[07:09] <Levander> luciux, on my machine when I type hostname --fqdn, I get localhost.localdomain.  Would rather this be my name on the network
[07:09] <mystify> i dont know
[07:09] <sprongie> games are a pretty tough test
[07:09] <Levander> luciux, it causes problems with mysql I'm thinking
[07:09] <mystify> where would i go to find out?
[07:10] <sprongie> mystify: personally i'd google it
[07:10] <mystify> hm...what keywords?
[07:10] <sprongie> "city of heroes" linux wine
[07:10] <mystify> gotcha, thx
[07:10] <luciux> Levander: you can alter it with hostname the_name
[07:11] <sprongie> if it does anything really graphics heavy like 3d, you're probably going to need WineX
[07:11] <Levander> luciux, no, hostname can't alter the fqdn, it can only alter the hostname
[07:11] <Cube-ness> anybody know why recent updated to hoary have made gnome very slow?
[07:11] <luciux> Levander: and the same domainname the_name
[07:11] <Levander> luciux, no, "man domainname" explicitly says u can't
[07:12] <sprongie> domainname is a NIS thing
[07:12] <sprongie> not relevant to dns
[07:12] <Levander> oh yeah, i was thinking dnsdomainname
[07:12] <Levander> i'm not using nis
[07:12] <Levander> it says it can't on it's man page under "The FQDN" section
[07:13] <luciux> Levander: i see.. what about altering your /etc/hosts?
[07:13] <sprongie> hostname
[07:13] <Levander> luciux, to what?
[07:14] <Levander> i saw that on the man page, no idea what to alter it to
[07:14] <sprongie> you don't really "have" a domain name
[07:14] <sprongie> you have a default search domain
[07:14] <luciux> Levander: to specify your right fqdn
[07:15] <Steve_G4> is it better to run a game natively in Linux, if available, than to run it through WineX?
[07:15] <Levander> sprongie, yeah I do, it's local, it's my home network, have dns set up for it
[07:15] <mystify> anyone ever heard of cedega?
[07:15] <crimsun> Steve_G4: absolutely.
[07:15] <crimsun> mystify: it's just the newer version of winex
[07:15] <mystify> where do i get it?
[07:15] <Levander> luciux, but how to I alter it to specify my right fqdn?
[07:15] <crimsun> www.transgaming.com
[07:15] <mystify> i tried transgaming.com
[07:15] <sprongie> you buy it
[07:15] <Steve_G4> I saw that the Doom 3 demo for Linux can be patched and made into the full version
[07:15] <mystify> you gotta buy it?
[07:15] <sprongie> yes
[07:15] <mystify> how much is it?
[07:16] <sprongie> cheap.  check their prices
[07:16] <mystify> hmm...
[07:16] <sprongie> personally i just dual boot
[07:16] <sprongie> i guess if you have an EQ addiction and still like to chat, winex is for you
[07:17] <luciux> Levander: if you say on /etc/hosts which is you fqdn for your ip it could work, doesn't it?
[07:17] <Levander> luciux, do I assume every time I'm looking for my own machine that it's asking for the name of <IP_ADDRESS>, and change the FQDN of that ip from localhost.localdomain, to what it should be, bread.highhat.net?
[07:18] <Levander> luciux, i'm trying to figure out how to put my correct FQDN in hosts.  I don't know the format to use.
[07:18] <sprongie> you ADD that hostname.  you dont ever want to get rid of localhost
[07:18] <Levander> sprongie, cool, i'm gonna try it
[07:18] <mystify> ok, how cheap are we talking cedega?
[07:20] <mystify> it says i gotta subscribe on it for 6 months! and thats $30...i just want cedega...
[07:20] <Levander> sprongie, yes! that worked! only thing a little different than just adding an entry for bread.highhat.net was that I had to remove the bread alias for localhost.localdomain!
[07:20] <Levander> thanks sprongie
[07:20] <luciux> Levander: IP fqdn hostname
[07:20] <Levander> and thanks luciux
[07:20] <Levander> luciux, yeah, i got it, thanks for your help!
[07:20] <luciux> Levander: you're welcome
[07:20] <luciux> Levander:  :)
[07:21] <sprongie> Levander: you probably want to keep the unqualified alias.  you can stick it on a different line if it's preferring the short name and you really need the fqdn
[07:21] <Steve_G4> are there any free alternatives to Cedega?
[07:21] <sprongie> mystify: i dont think it stops working when the subscription's out
[07:22] <sprongie> mystify: you just dont get updates
[07:22] <crimsun> Steve_G4: not as fully-featured: wine
[07:22] <Levander> sprongie, hostname --fqdn didn't work until I removed the bread alias from localhost, but I think I did what your saying, I added the bread alias to bread.highhat.net
[07:22] <crimsun> Steve_G4: then again, wine is much more general-purpose than cedega
[07:22] <sprongie> dunno tho, maybe it does timebomb
[07:22] <mystify> wait, what?
[07:22] <Levander> sprongie, that what u mean?
[07:22] <sprongie> Levander: ahhh i see.  yah that'll work too
[07:23] <Steve_G4> what would happen if i ran Wine on a PPC, then used it to run a Windows app?
[07:23] <Steve_G4> would that work at all?
[07:23] <mystify> i have wine, how do i get it to work? (give me example of microsoft program taht works with wine)
[07:23] <Steve_G4> download Internet Explorer
[07:23] <sprongie> office works nice, i'm told
[07:23] <sprongie> so does IE
[07:24] <Steve_G4> how about Microsoft AntiSpyware? :-P
[07:24] <SiRrUs> crossover is the way to go :)
[07:24] <sprongie> Steve_G4: actually that might not.  scanner probably would work, the rest puts in some pretty low level hooks
[07:24] <Levander> sprongie, any idea how those system calls work?  I'm thinking it must know my hostname from /etc/hosts, which is bread.  Then it looks up the fqdn, using hosts first since that's how nsswitch.con is set up to do, and in hosts it finds that bread is *now* an alias for highhat.net? Is that prolly how it works?
[07:24] <Levander> knows hostname from /etc/hostname*
[07:24] <mystify> so is there any alternative nonpaying way of getting cedega?
[07:24] <emberly> I am trying to follow these instructions to enable japanese input in ubuntu, but the instructions say to edit my .gnomerc file... and I don't know where that file is or where it should be.   where is my .gnomerc file?
[07:25] <emberly> the instructions I'm trying to follow are here: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/JapaneseInputHowto
[07:25] <sprongie> Levander: i'm not sure what the resolution order for the hosts file is, but i think it's just the first one it hits
[07:25] <mystify> im just a kid trying to get city of heroes to work
[07:25] <Levander> sprongie, well <IP_ADDRESS> is before bread.highhat.net, so it's not just order?
[07:26] <sprongie> Levander: and they're all <IP_ADDRESS>?  not sure then
[07:26] <Levander> sprongie, no, first is <IP_ADDRESS> as localhost, then my private ip 192.168.... as bread
[07:26] <emberly> is the .gnomerc file supposed to be in my home directory?
[07:26] <sprongie> on my old box, it would prefer to resolve as ipv6 first, so i'd see a lot of connections from ::1 in my logs
[07:27] <sprongie> exposed a lot of ipv4 assumptions in my log parsing scripts ;)
[07:27] <Levander> sprongie, but you know, I'm thinking if I just took out the bread alias of localhost, then when the resolver tries to look up bread in the hosts file, it would file.  Then, as configured in nsswitch.conf, it would fall back to looking it up in DNS, and in there it would find bread.
[07:28] <Levander> sprongie, don't think I needed to add an entry for bread.highhat.net to hosts, just think I needed to remove the bread alias from localhost.localdomain
[07:28] <sprongie> Levander: that's why, because you're connecting through the 192.168 interface to get it to not show up as localhost.  it's actually going through your NIC, not the loopback
[07:29] <Levander> what's going through the 192.168 interface?  You think the hostname utility is doing that?
[07:29] <sprongie> whatever's making you see "localhost" and not "bread"
[07:29] <Levander> that was hostname (really worried about 2 other apps, but hostname is the simplest example of problem i could find)
[07:30] <Steve_G4> what is POSIX?
[07:30] <sprongie> hostname doesnt know anything about your hosts file
[07:30] <sprongie> it's set by /etc/hostname usually
[07:30] <Levander> sprongie, when I stop downloading movies off the internet, I can see if router lights flash up when I run host
[07:30] <crimsun> Steve_G4: http://www.pasc.org/#POSIX
[07:30] <Levander> but the network driver is prolly optimized to prevent that from happening, i'm guessing???
[07:30] <Steve_G4> thank you
[07:30] <sprongie> Levander: yeah it'll hit the nic's internal loopback
[07:30] <Levander> when I run hostname*
[07:31] <sprongie> it should flash the nic's blinkenlights
[07:31] <Levander> sprongie, the nic's loopback is different than some other loopback?
[07:32] <sprongie> Levander: <IP_ADDRESS> is a virtual loopback.  all software.
[07:32] <Levander> sprongie, if that's the case then, /etc/hosts is really a screwy concept then
[07:32] <sprongie> the internal loopback in the nic is a shortcut that tells it to not send a signal but just queue the packet
[07:32] <Levander> that's how a lot of programs are using to identify my machine
[07:32] <sprongie> an external loopback is an actual piece of testing hardware
[07:32] <Levander> like in the title bar of GNU emacs
[07:33] <Levander> but, if I use my real, network FQDN on my localhost, all my communications are gonna go through my NIC loopback
[07:33] <sprongie> should be just as fast
[07:34] <Levander> oh, u think the NIC loopback is as fast the the virtual software loopback? doesn't sound right, to get to the NIC loopback, u gotta go through the PCI bus
[07:34] <Levander> the software loopback is prolly all RAM and CPU which is much faster
[07:34] <sprongie> yep
[07:34] <Levander> but, i guess I don't really run anything that communications intensive
[07:35] <Levander> except X-windows??
[07:35] <mystify> where do i get winex?
[07:35] <sprongie> x shouldnt be using the network at all
[07:35] <travisat> bob2: are you here
[07:35] <sprongie> modern X servers use unix sockets and shm
[07:35] <Levander> you can run an X application on one machine and display it on another it's so networked
[07:35] <Levander> what's shm?
[07:35] <mystify> where can i download wineX?
[07:36] <Levander> unix sockets are networking
[07:36] <thr1ce> mystify, google.com
[07:36] <Levander> sprongie, not sure what u mean?
[07:36] <sprongie> unix sockets arent networking, they're a fancier version of a pipe
[07:37] <sprongie> namely a many-to-one pipe
[07:37] <Levander> in java programming, a socket is what u open for listening to  connections from other machines
[07:37] <sprongie> that's an inet socket
[07:37] <Levander> ooohhhhh
[07:38] <sprongie> there's all kinds of sockets
[07:38] <Levander> okay, this i did not know
[07:38] <sprongie> unix and inet are the only ones actually in use
[07:39] <Levander> but u can run an X application and display it on another, they just switch over and use inet socks when X is doing that?
[07:39] <Levander> display it on another machine*
[07:41] <sprongie> yah, X *can* be set up to only ever do unix sockets, but it rarely is
[07:41] <Levander> so, the way I've got my machine set up, it's possible X would be using my NIC loopback next time I restart it?
[07:42] <sprongie> X will use unix sockets if you're on the same machine as the X server
[07:42] <sprongie> er the X client ... er if they're colocated.  you get the idea
[07:42] <sprongie> unix sockets are sooper-fast
[07:42] <Levander> sprongie, so X prolly knows how to figure out the same thing that the NIC loopback does?
[07:42] <Levander> it does the same optimization?
[07:43] <sprongie> nope, if you set your display to use your hostname, it assumes nothing
[07:43] <mystify> is there any way to get winex without paying?
[07:43] <sprongie> that's why you always want to use DISPLAY=:0 and not DISPLAY=bread:0
[07:43] <goldfish_> i think you only have to pay for support mystify
[07:43] <goldfish_> winex == cedega?
[07:43] <mystify> well then where do i get it?
[07:43] <sprongie> some servers will DWIM it if you do localhost:0 and actually use a unix socket
[07:43] <sprongie> some wont
[07:43] <Levander> sprongie, ahha!
[07:44] <goldfish_> mystify: I dont know :)
[07:44] <mystify> you have to subscribe to get cedega
[07:44] <goldfish_> hrmm
[07:44] <mystify> and i dont have a credit card...
[07:44] <goldfish_> I was told u only had to subscribe for support
[07:44] <mystify> do you think you could look into it?
[07:44] <Levander> sprongie, how u know all this UNIX stuff I'd love to know, u a UNIX admin?
[07:44] <waseem> hi how do i find the process id for totem
[07:45] <thr1ce> ps aux
[07:45] <mystify> well i cant download cedega anyway unless i subscribe...so i guess im sh*t outa luck
[07:45] <Xenguy> waseem: ps aux |grep totem
[07:45] <sprongie> Levander: been doing unix of various flavors for about 12 years
[07:45] <Levander> doing? how? as an admin?
[07:45] <sprongie> off and on admin
[07:45] <goldfish_> Levander: Get a good admin book.
[07:46] <goldfish_> The O reilly, System Administration book is supposed to be good
[07:46] <mystify> so does anyone know much about cedega?
[07:46] <thr1ce> will ubuntu run significantly slower than slackware on my machine?
[07:46] <sprongie> mostly junior admin stuff, never built out a big deployment
[07:46] <goldfish_> mystify: #cedega
[07:46] <goldfish_> :)
[07:46] <sprongie> supported some tho
[07:46] <Levander> goldfish, no kidding, but I'm never gonna remember all this stuff every time I'm in a random chat room, unless I've used it for 12 years of course
[07:46] <mystify> the newest version, i guess
[07:46] <Xenguy> mystify: AFAIK cedega is a proprietary version of WINE, optimized for gamers
[07:46] <goldfish_> mystify: they have a channel on this server
[07:46] <goldfish_> yeah
[07:46] <mystify> oh i c
[07:46] <goldfish_> also known as winex
[07:46] <mystify> thx
[07:46] <sprongie> goldfish_: Unix System Administration is great.  used to call it the red book, i think it's purple now
[07:46] <thr1ce> anyone...?
[07:46] <Levander> is that what u do for living, unix admin?
[07:47] <_colin> i just installed kubuntu and i dont recall setting a root pass
[07:47] <sprongie> Levander: nope.  i kill spam for a living :)
[07:47] <Xenguy> _colin: read the FAQ
[07:47] <Levander> sprongie, Unix System Administration is an O'Reilly book, kinda generic name, be kinda hard to find without knowing publisher
[07:47] <Levander> and how do u kill spam for a living?
[07:47] <goldfish_> sprongie: cool, i am only new to linux, but id like to get into the admin scene, might give that book a try
[07:48] <sprongie> Levander: whoops, i meant "Unix System Administrator Handbook"
[07:48] <sprongie> i _think_ that's what it's called
[07:48] <sprongie> my brain is all mush
[07:48] <goldfish_> Essential Administartion
[07:48] <mystify> nobody is answering me on that server...hmm...they all must hate me
[07:48] <Levander> u remember publisher? make it easier to find
[07:48] <goldfish_> is another good one they have
[07:48] <sprongie> third edition is purple, has this goofy-ass cartoon on the front
[07:48] <waseem> does anyone here use totem that can help me out? the problem i have is whenever i go into a website that has a music video/song inside, totem pops up and then a whole bunch of the same error message pop up.
[07:48] <brandon_> hello
[07:48] <thr1ce> waseem, no plugins installed?
[07:49] <waseem> for totem, i dont think so
[07:49] <thr1ce> man...hoary seems sloooow :(]
[07:49] <Levander> sprongie, cool, i made a stick on my desktop
[07:49] <Levander> how u kill spam for a living.  U use gun? how?
[07:49] <sprongie> goldfish_: you enjoy getting woken up at 3am?  you dont really want to be a sysadmin if not ;)
[07:49] <goldfish_> lol
[07:49] <goldfish_> 3am is my awake time :)
[07:50] <sprongie> thr1ce: hoary is zooming fast for me
[07:50] <waseem> thrice, i have no plugins installed
[07:50] <sprongie> 'course i'm on an athlon64 and using kde
[07:50] <mystify> nobody is helping me on the cedega cahnnel
[07:50] <thr1ce> maybe because I'm used to slackware's speed...
[07:50] <mystify> channel*
[07:50] <goldfish_> mystify: probably a bad time
[07:50] <goldfish_> maybe try later
[07:50] <goldfish_> ?
[07:50] <mystify> hm...
[07:51] <waseem> anyone know what i can do?
[07:51] <waseem> for the problem
[07:51] <mystify> but does anybody here know of any ways of getting cedega without subscribing?
[07:51] <thr1ce> nope
[07:51] <sprongie> mystify: nope, it's a commercial product
[07:51] <thr1ce> you have to subsribe
[07:51] <waseem> are there usually any plugins?
[07:51] <mystify> ugh...
[07:51] <waseem> for totem?
[07:51] <thr1ce> codecs
[07:51] <Xenguy> mystify: I told you it is proprietary; now I'm telling you it is commercial
[07:52] <mystify> so tell me...once i enter all the information, after paying...can i cancel it after i get cedega?
[07:52] <sprongie> they do backport to wine, but it's way behind
[07:52] <Levander> sprongie, no matches at Amazon for Unix System Administrator Handbook
[07:52] <mystify> cancel the subscription i mean
[07:52] <thr1ce> mystify, no, you have to pay for it
[07:52] <thr1ce> it's commercial
[07:52] <mystify> thx, you said that
[07:52] <Xenguy> mystify: so you want to take their commercial product, then rip them off?
[07:53] <Pluk> the source is free though but lacks some things
[07:53] <mystify> no...i mean cancel my subscription so it doesnt go on and on and on...paying for nothing month after month
[07:53] <Xenguy> that is mystifying indeed
[07:53] <sprongie> Levander: s/administrator/administration
[07:53] <sprongie> Levander: http://www.admin.com/
[07:53] <thr1ce> root@24:/home/ubuntu # apt-get install Fluxbox
[07:53] <thr1ce> Reading Package Lists... Done
[07:53] <thr1ce> Building Dependency Tree... Done
[07:53] <thr1ce> E: Couldn't find package Fluxbox
[07:53] <thr1ce> :(
[07:53] <Xenguy> mystify: oh
[07:53] <bluebeard> is there a way to disable gnome's window minimizing animation
[07:53] <mystify> see what i mean?
[07:53] <Xenguy> mystify: I dunno - I just don't both with the non-free stuff
[07:53] <Xenguy> mystify: I'm not a gamer anyway, so what do I care
[07:54] <mystify> oh i c
[07:54] <mystify> lol
[07:54] <bob2> travisat: will you keep the bot out?
[07:54] <Pluk> thr1ce, fluxbox not Fluxbox
[07:54] <sprongie> thr1ce: try lowercase
[07:54] <mystify> thx anyways guys
[07:54] <thr1ce> still doesn't work
[07:54] <travisat> bob2 yes
[07:54] <sprongie> thr1ce: sure you have a full sources.list?  shows up in aptitude for me
[07:54] <membreya_> anyone here use webmin and squid?
[07:55] <Pluk> did you enable universe in /etc/apt/sources.list thr1ce ?
[07:55] <bob2> travisat: remove.
[07:55] <AnJellyCue> Webmin yes,  squid no
[07:56] <waseem> does anyone here use totem and know where to get the plugin for it?
[07:56] <streetbmx> what plugin
[07:56] <thr1ce> google
[07:56] <waseem> for mozilla firefox
[07:57] <streetbmx> oh :-/
[07:57] <goldfish_> its on ubuntuguide.org
[07:57] <goldfish_> i think
[07:58] <calamari> hi
[07:58] <goldfish_> hello
[08:00] <calamari> I'm looking for a weird piece of software.  I connect to my computer remotely via ssh, and I'd like to pop up a message (or even better, communicate) with anyone at the computer locally.  Any ideas on a piece of software for this?
[08:01] <crimsun> calamari: wall, xmessage, ...
[08:01] <goldfish_> write
[08:01] <JDahl> or chat maybe?
[08:01] <calamari> crimsun: xmessage says "Error: Can't open display:"
[08:02] <Levander> sprongie, yeah, looks like a great book.  I wonder if it's companion, the Linux Administration Handbook is mroe for me though.    If yes, then you could use 'wall'
[08:03] <SuperLag> where does the firmware for a Prism54 wireless card need to be put, so Ubuntu can read it when you start the card?
[08:03] <Xenguy> calamari: that contacts all users logged in
[08:03] <calamari> write doesn't seem to pop up a message in gnome
[08:03] <calamari> thanks for the ideas tho.. think I'm getting closer :)
[08:03] <Agabus> Xenguy - wall is only for the terminal
[08:04] <Xenguy> Agabus: yep, realizing that now
[08:04] <Agabus> but its still very cool
[08:05] <calamari> it is :)
[08:05] <FlyNavy> Can anyone help with an installation display problem?
[08:06] <Agabus> i'd like to know how to send a message to users in GNOME/KDE aswell, but i gotta run to dinner, let me know if u figure it out
[08:06] <calamari> okay, thanks :)
[08:08] <AnJellyCue> FlyNavy,  Sup ?
[08:09] <FlyNavy> I installed Ubuntu without prob.  On boot, get to what should be login screen.  Screen looks segmented and cursir disappears on several parts left to right
[08:09] <goldfish_> x server is fsailing
[08:10] <goldfish_> you got an nvidia card FlyNavy ?
[08:10] <goldfish_> hi dazed_
[08:10] <FlyNavy> I have a Rage Mobility M3 on a dell laptop
[08:10] <dazed_> GOLDFISH_!
[08:11] <calamari> aha.. crimsun was right, xmessage works!  I needed to ssh -X
[08:11] <dazed_> im at my buddies house...we got like 3 laptops my nix box his winblows box linked up
[08:11] <dazed_> its sick
[08:11] <calamari> zenity also works :)
[08:12] <calamari> although.. since I'm connecting from my local machine, it could be a false positive
[08:13] <goldfish_> dazed_: cool
[08:13] <dazed_> i know right
[08:13] <mrproper> I just upgraded my copy of Ubuntu to Horay, but now the maximum resolution has shrunk.
[08:13] <dazed_> u know anything about filesharing with windows t0 linux
[08:13] <dazed_> or vice a versa
[08:13] <goldfish_> nope
[08:13] <AnJellyCue> Yup
[08:14] <dazed_> i gto it down the hard way
[08:14] <dazed_> but im thinking there has to be an easier way
[08:14] <calamari> dazed: I had samba working at one point but it's broken now, for unknown reasons.. sorry :)
[08:15] <dazed_> yeah i got samba installed
[08:15] <AnJellyCue> That is how i fileshare,   using Samba
[08:15] <dazed_> but all that is
[08:15] <AnJellyCue> easy as :)
[08:15] <dazed_> is support to get on the network
[08:15] <dazed_> its not like it has an explorer to view all comps on the network
[08:15] <dazed_> and brows
[08:15] <dazed_> i have to mount the shared folders onto my drive
[08:16] <calamari> it did when it was working for me
[08:16] <dazed_> ok
[08:16] <dazed_> well i got samba
[08:16] <dazed_> how do i run the client?
[08:16] <calamari> I opened up Network (from Computer)
[08:17] <dazed_> well that would require me to be on gnome desktop
[08:17] <dazed_> im currently on flux
[08:18] <calamari> oic :)
[08:20] <viper12> evening/morning all.
[08:20] <revildab> has anyone tried to install the amarok music player in ubuntu? if so, did you manage to get it working and how
[08:20] <viper12> that requires KDE libraries revildab
[08:21] <revildab> well, i've found the corresponding ubuntu libraries
[08:21] <revildab> but no go
[08:21] <viper12> there are some 'howto' stuff in the forums regarding that if I remember correctly, but I'm a "gnomer" and haven't so someone else is gonna havta' answer that one.
[08:22] <revildab> ahh alright, ill have a look see but thanks anyway
[08:22] <viper12> g'luck on that....its a cool player.
[08:22] <dazed_> sudo mount -t smbfs -o username=guest //<IP_ADDRESS>/MySharedFolder /share
[08:22] <dazed_> Could not resolve mount point /share
[08:22] <dazed_> anyone know what that means
[08:23] <viper12> do you have that folder created on the local machine yet?
[08:23] <dazed_> hahah
[08:23] <dazed_> there we go
[08:23] <viper12> :)
[08:23] <dazed_> idiot
[08:23] <dazed_> <---
[08:23] <viper12> nope.......I fub'd that one with NFS the first time same way. lmao
[08:23] <mrproper> How do I get scrnsaver.h?
[08:25] <dazed_> got this one now
[08:25] <dazed_> 15364: tree connect failed: ERRDOS - ERRnosuchshare (You specified an invalid share name)
[08:25] <dazed_> SMB connection failed
[08:25] <viper12> that one......gah.  I thought about smb, but with all 'ubuntu' all the time on the 4 machines here, I went NFS.
[08:26] <mrproper> Can someone tell me if they have scrnsaver.h?
[08:26] <calamari> mrproper: maybe.. where should it be?
[08:26] <mrproper> calamari, I think I may have found the bug.
[08:26] <FlyNavy> Anybody else help with display problems at boot?
[08:27] <viper12> My guess here dazed would be that one one of the machines the share isn't setup properly.......but why/how? shakes head. dont know.
[08:27] <viper12> what is the problem FlyNavy ?
[08:28] <calamari> oh yeah.. since we're on the topic of networking... is there any concept of internet connection sharing for linux?
[08:28] <FlyNavy> Viper12, have what should be login screen but divided into sections and cursor disappears and reappears at different parts of screen.
[08:28] <FlyNavy> Screen is divided into about 4 uneven vertical columns
[08:29] <viper12> nods.  is this a hoary or warty install? (xfree or xorg?), what video card as well.
[08:29] <FlyNavy> I have a Rage Mobility 128 card.  First tim eloading Ubuntu.  X11 file says XF86config-4
[08:30] <FlyNavy> Been about 5 years since playing w/ linux, so I have forgotten a lot
[08:31] <viper12> okay, so you're on the stock warty 4.10 build, and using xfree for that.  you need to use an editor to open XF86config-4 file to see what settings (specifically the monitor vertical and horizontal settings are listed.)  Just from the description, it sounds as the monitor settings are incorrect for the 'type of monitor you're using.
[08:31] <viper12> the file is located in the /etc/X11 directory. (btw.)
[08:31] <mrproper> Does Horay have the nifty shadow effects with xorg?
[08:32] <fsc> mrproper, yeah if you've got a nvidia card
[08:32] <viper12> I've got some of that enabled via my nvidia stuff mprop
[08:32] <mrproper> fsc, How do I enable it?
[08:32] <calamari> cool, think I found something on that linux ics :) http://www.unixgeeks.org/security/newbie/misc/ipmasq.html
[08:32] <FlyNavy> I opened earlier and removed all resolutions except 800X600.  Although, the log file showed this strange adjustment to 130 HZ
[08:32] <LinuxPie> join #fedora
[08:33] <fsc> mrproper, setup your xorg.conf file to use Composite extension, and then use xcompmgr
[08:33] <goldfish_> LinuxPie: why?
[08:33] <mrproper> fsc, How do I do that stuff?
[08:33] <viper12> its NOT resolutions you need to worry aobut here FlyNavy.  Its the vertical and horizontal frequency settings.  check your monitor's manual or google the monitor to get those, and then compare them to what is listed in the device section.
[08:34] <FlyNavy> Roger that.  Do I have to list range or just set specific frequency?
[08:34] <LinuxPie> :>
[08:35] <viper12> FlyNavy:  here is an example. (don't use these, just look for the similar lines.  and then compare what you have in the file to what the  monitor NEEDS.
[08:35] <viper12> Section "Monitor"
[08:35] <viper12> 	Identifier	"ENVISION"
[08:35] <viper12> 	HorizSync	30-95
[08:35] <viper12> 	VertRefresh	50-160
[08:35] <viper12> 	Option		"DPMS"
[08:35] <FlyNavy> Thanks.  Remember seeing that.  Will give it a shot.  Log file showed starting in those and then adjusting to much higher frequency.
[08:35] <viper12> I'm betting the install misidentified your monitor.  (The garbage you're looking at on bootup is typical for incorrect sync settings.)
[08:36] <viper12> and np
[08:36] <dazed_> well its time for me to pass out
[08:36] <dazed_> so niggaz
[08:36] <dazed_> keep it rteal
[08:36] <FlyNavy> I'll check dell.  this is a laptop.  Identified as Toshiba.
[08:36] <viper12> taker easy dazed.
[08:36] <mrproper> Anyone have the lines for xorg.conf to enable composting?
[08:36] <viper12> laptops can be persnickety....as are some flatpanels........
[08:37] <esher> whats the difference between latest ubuntu hoary and latest gnoppix 0.9.90b1 Hoary ?
[08:37] <viper12> mrproper, I remember seeing a mention of the compositing in the forums...you might want to put that keyword in ubuntu's web forums.
[08:37] <dazed_> i have a laptpo and a flat pannel...both work great
[08:37] <viper12> esher.........huh?
[08:37] <dazed_> but its probably the geforce fx5900 in each
[08:38] <goldfish_> i had trouble with laptop
[08:38] <viper12> dazed the issues are sometimes a combo with dell using that stupid brookdale video chipset.
[08:38] <goldfish_> geforce 5550
[08:38] <goldfish_> dell
[08:38] <dazed_> yeah
[08:38] <dazed_> dell
[08:38] <goldfish_> YES!
[08:38] <goldfish_> DELL!
[08:39] <viper12> lol.
[08:39] <mrproper> xcompmgr isn't installed by default?
[08:39] <viper12> I fixed my dell issues finally.  e17fp and dimension 2400 finally working. (Dad's happy as hell, as he got to kiss mcafee and adaware and spybot and .and.and. good bye.  lol
[08:40] <togs> having trouble getting a PC to see the internet. Can get a local IP from modem fine, but can't get onto the net. Anybody able to assist?
[08:40] <viper12> I don't believe so mrproper.......isn't that to be used with specific types of video cards?
[08:40] <viper12> togs, what type of modem?
[08:40] <viper12> cable/dsl/phone line?
[08:40] <togs> D-Link DSL300+
[08:40] <togs> ah ADSL
[08:40] <crimsun> mrproper: for hoary? no
[08:41] <goldfish_> togs: might need a firmware upgrade?
[08:41] <viper12> okay togs...is the adsl setup to give out DHCP? (assign addresses?)  If so, you need to change the network device on ubuntu's machine to dhcp and it should work.
[08:41] <goldfish_> I had that trouble on windws
[08:41] <goldfish_> with a dlink
[08:41] <togs> gets a 192 IP ok, but not the 203 IP i need for the net
[08:41] <Kly> www.otomotivshow.com
[08:42] <togs> This is on a low spec box without a GUI, going for server. Ubuntu on desktop goes OK
[08:43] <togs> DHCP works, gets local addresses OK
[08:43] <viper12> togs, do you know how to use iwconfig tools?  you can manually via iwconfig ifconfig set the device to get dhcp.
[08:43] <togs> iw is a new one
[08:43] <sockler> hey viper12 thanks for the help yesterday
[08:44] <viper12> my pleasure sockler
[08:44] <sockler> i would have your children if i was a lonely girl
[08:44] <togs> i've been ifup and ifdowning all day though :P. I'll give iwconfig a shot
[08:44] <viper12> yeah togs, just type iwconfig --help and it will give you the options, and without any comments it will list the current settings of the network devices.
[08:44] <calamari> can't run new apps for some reason.. restarting X
[08:44] <togs> thanks guys, will be back one way or the other :)
[08:44] <viper12> but yer not sockler and I'm relieved. lmao
[08:45] <viper12> take care togs.....
[08:45] <viper12> oh togs
[08:45] <Rocco> can anybody tell me what i've to do to get rights to change scaling_cur_freq?
[08:45] <viper12> there is good info in the forums on setting up via command line with those.  just put them in search in the forums or ubuntu's pages.
[08:45] <JDahl> maybe off-topic, but did anyone here try any of the ggz clients for ubuntu? Does it even work? I wanted to try it, but the client seems to freeze as soon as I try to connect to the server
[08:46] <viper12> Rocco, other than using "sudo" prefacing the command, not sure what you're looking for.
[08:47] <Rocco> viper12: watch: root@nbmini:/sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq # echo 800000 > scaling_cur_freq bash: scaling_cur_freq: Keine Berechtigung
[08:48] <viper12> nods. don't have an answer.  <<<is honest at the least. :)
[08:48] <Rocco> viper12 any idea?
[08:49] <sockler> hey anyone know how to get nmap to work on ubuntu
[08:49] <viper12> brb
[08:49] <Rocco> okay
[08:49] <crimsun> sockler: it works by default...
[08:50] <epslaptop> how do you turn off the damned new window thingy on gnome
[08:50] <epslaptop> I've changed the option in gconf-editor but it doesn't change anything
[08:50] <sockler> not for me, says i dont have the right compiler
[08:51] <sockler> i find it odd that ubuntu doesnt have gcc
[08:51] <crimsun> sockler: build-essential
[08:51] <epslaptop> mdk doesn't come with it either
[08:52] <crimsun> sockler: not everyone using a desktop-oriented Linux distribution needs a C compiler by default.
[08:52] <goldfish_> apt-get it
[08:52] <epslaptop> nautilus, how do you turn off the new window thing?
[08:52] <goldfish_> epslaptop: it's on ubuntuguide.org
[08:52] <goldfish_> in tricks section
[08:53] <Rocco> epslaptop, do you run ubuntu on a notebook?
[08:53] <viper12> back.
[08:53] <membreya_> lo viper12
[08:53] <Rocco> fine.
[08:53] <sockler> ok then how do i install nmap without a compiler?
[08:53] <Rocco> viper12: so, any idea
[08:54] <epslaptop> Rocco no, but I'm looking at doing it :P
[08:54] <epslaptop> (on 2k atm, with ubuntu on a desktop)
[08:54] <epslaptop> haven't had the best luck with ubuntu on laptops :(
[08:54] <viper12> hey mem, crimsun...........no rocco.  crimsun would be my suggestion for help on that one.
[08:54] <Agabus> calamari - so have u got the messaging working?
[08:55] <Rocco> may you answer my question please viper12
[08:55] <bestadvocate> anyone tried out graveman 3.8?
[08:55] <crimsun> sockler: apt-get install nmap nmapfe
[08:55] <bestadvocate> nothing is working in it for me
[08:55] <crimsun> sockler: you don't need a C compiler to install compiled packages.
[08:55] <togs> did somebody want to tell me soething before I plugged the plug?
[08:55] <goldfish_> apt-get install gcc
[08:55] <viper12> Rocco...just looking at the command......I'm not familiar with what you're trying to do.  it looks to be a command with re-directs to change the cpu settings, correct?
[08:56] <togs> iwconfig was no good, btw
[08:56] <viper12> what was wrong togs?
[08:56] <Rocco> viper12 right. yesterday it worked perfectly, but today i dont have the rights.....
[08:57] <epslaptop> thanks goldfish_, looks like a good guide :)
[08:57] <calamari> Agabus: don't think so
[08:57] <togs> got an ubuntu box going as a server, it DHCPs and gets 192 addresses assigned, but I can't get it out onto the net
[08:57] <sockler> crimsun: that command didnt gwork for me
[08:57] <calamari> Agabus: I used xmessage, but I suspect I was seeing the message popup though the ssh tunnel
[08:57] <goldfish_> epslaptop: it is :)
[08:57] <viper12> crimsun, could you scroll up a bit to Rocco's command line question?  I'm not completely sure why his 'rights' would change overnight.......unless something got updated.
[08:57] <togs> the crap thing is I gotta swap out cables and keyboards and monitors to try stuff :(
[08:58] <epslaptop> I just set my father up with ubuntu, second install I've done with it - so quickly learning things so I can answer his questions :P
[08:58] <Agabus> calamari - yeh i just ssh'd into my computer and got xmessage working aswell
[08:58] <viper12> togs, is the modem ALSO set up as a dhcp server?
[08:58] <togs> yeah, it's not a router or firewall, just a DHCP modem
[08:58] <Hkloser> my ALS300 sound card doesn't work on ubuntu (or any other linux distro i've tried). OSS say they support it, does it come with ubuntu?
[08:59] <Rocco> viper12 i always changed my cpufreq manually. yesterday i installad powernowd and it worked. but after rebooting it didn't work anymore, so i deleted it, bu now i can even change cpufreq manually
[08:59] <viper12> aha.  the modem is doing dhcp, and you also have a dhcp enabled server?  My bet is you need to go into the router config and turn that off there, so the server is the only machine getting the ip..
[08:59] <calamari> Agabus: I'd need to connect from another computer to know for sure
[08:59] <sid77> hi
[08:59] <togs> it DHCP's ok with winXP, assigns my 203.x.x.x IP
[08:59] <crimsun> sockler: which command didn't?
[09:00] <togs> the weird thing was it picked up the 203 IP when installing
[09:00] <viper12> here crimsun:  I copied it for Rocco :   root@nbmini:/sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq # echo 800000 > scaling_cur_freq bash: scaling_cur_freq: Keine Berechtigung
[09:00] <sockler> apt-get
[09:00] <FlyNavy> Viper12,  thanks for help.  Not perfect, but got me in.  Will work more later.
[09:01] <viper12> cool FlyNavy
[09:01] <crimsun> viper12: thanks.
[09:01] <viper12> togs, did you get my 'bit' about the server AND the router using dhcp?
[09:01] <crimsun> Rocco: are you positive that's the file you're supposed to write to?
[09:02] <viper12> and sure crimsun.  my 'boggle' on the deal is the disappearing rights bit.  The ONLY thing that I can think of is that something 'updated' tween then and now that's changed the way things work, but I confess ignorance as to 'why'.
[09:02] <crimsun> Rocco: given the semantics, it doesn't make sense to write to the current frequency, which an ls -l /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_cur_freq confirms
[09:02] <togs> viper12, i did. If you mean my ADSL modem by router. So are you saying I need to turm off the dhcp server on the ubuntu box?
[09:02] <Rocco> crimsun ???
[09:02] <viper12> one or the other togs.  If the router/modem is working fine as a dhcp server, then the ubuntu box doesn't really need to.
[09:03] <crimsun> Rocco: what are you trying to do?
[09:03] <sockler> crimsun: i entered the apt-get command and it said it couldnt find package
[09:03] <goldfish_> sockler: have you added extra repositires?
[09:04] <Rocco> crimsun i always changed my cpufreq manually. yesterday i installad powernowd and it worked. but after rebooting it didn't work anymore, so i deleted it, bu now i can even change cpufreq manually
[09:04] <togs> yeah, on the ubuntu desktop, i use ipmasq to forward. So how do I turm off dhcp server on the ubuntu box?
[09:04] <crimsun> sockler: are you running warty or hoary?
[09:04] <crimsun> sockler: nmapfe is in universe
[09:04] <sockler> warty
[09:04] <crimsun> sockler: nmap is in main
[09:04] <calc> i'm running grumpy i'm from the future :)
[09:05] <crimsun> calc: you sly wench
[09:05] <sockler> thats all gibberish to me
[09:05] <goldfish_> sockler: www.ubuntuguide.org
[09:05] <the_grey_ghost> sockler use Aptitude search
[09:05] <crimsun> sockler: https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UniversePackages
[09:05] <viper12> okay, backtracking a minute here togs.  First, why do you want something other than the 'modem' to be the DHCP server?  Second, if you enabled the ubuntu box to be the dhcp server, then just 'undo' what you did.
[09:06] <the_grey_ghost> sudo aptitude search <package name> will tell you if the package is in the database
[09:06] <crimsun> Rocco: any reason you removed the powernowd package?
[09:06] <soren9580> anyone know how to run an expect script in cron?
[09:07] <togs> err. I don't need anything else to dhcp serve. And I haven't done anything (at least I think) to enable dhcp serving
[09:07] <Rocco> yes, crimsun, it didn't run any more, and i dont have the time to search the error. so i decided to remove it and controll the cpufreq manually again
[09:07] <crimsun> Rocco: I think it's probably easiest to reinstall powernowd
[09:07] <viper12> okay, so on the non-gui ubuntu 'slow' box, if you do an iwconfig, what does it report?  (is the device setup with a static address?
[09:08] <togs> reports nothing. it's not wireless
[09:08] <viper12> ifconfig then
[09:09] <Rocco> crimsun ok, i try, but i need help by installing it.... i need only a little command. wait a minute please
[09:09] <togs> ifconfig says no static IP. and if I do ifdown and ifup on the eth device, it successfully gets an IP from the ADSL modem. problem is that it still can't get to the net
[09:09] <viper12> just a minute togs.
[09:09] <togs> np
[09:10] <sockler> Package nmap is not available, but is referred to by another package.
[09:10] <sockler> This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or
[09:10] <sockler> is only available from another source
[09:10] <crimsun> sockler: is the main repository enabled?
[09:10] <Rocco> viper12, i geht following error:
[09:10] <Rocco> root@nbmini:/home/lukas # dpkg -i powernowd_0.90-3ubuntu9_i386.deb
[09:10] <Rocco> Whle vormals abgewhltes Paket powernowd.
[09:10] <Rocco> (Lese Datenbank ... 85430 Dateien und Verzeichnisse sind derzeit installiert.)
[09:10] <Rocco> Entpacke powernowd (aus powernowd_0.90-3ubuntu9_i386.deb) ...
[09:10] <Rocco> dpkg: Abhngigkeitsprobleme verhindern Konfiguration von powernowd:
[09:10] <Rocco>  powernowd hngt ab von module-init-tools (>= 3.1-rel-2ubuntu2); aber:
[09:10] <AlohaWolf> how do I edit my cron to change what time updatedb runs?
[09:10] <Rocco>   Version von module-init-tools auf dem System ist 3.1-pre2-2ubuntu3.
[09:10] <Rocco> dpkg: Fehler beim Bearbeiten von powernowd (--install):
[09:10] <Rocco>  Abhngigkeitsprobleme - lasse es unkonfiguriert
[09:10] <Rocco> Fehler traten auf beim Bearbeiten von:
[09:10] <Rocco>  powernowd
[09:10] <Rocco> uuups sorry :)
[09:10] <crimsun> Rocco: it's best to do: apt-get install powernowd
[09:10] <sockler> main restricted or unrestricted?
[09:11] <crimsun> sockler: main restricted universe
[09:11] <Rocco> crimsun this way doesn't work. he asks for the ubuntu-cd then, which i dont have
[09:11] <sockler> yeah i enabled the universe ones
[09:11] <sockler> it didnt work so i enabled them all, still doesnt work
[09:12] <crimsun> Rocco: do you have a live Internet connection on the Ubuntu machine?
[09:12] <Rocco> crimsun, there is only a little additional command, which ignores the version..... i cant find it any more. yes, i have inet
[09:12] <crimsun> sockler: are you using apt-get, aptitude, dselect, or Synaptic?
[09:12] <sockler> i used synaptic to enable
[09:12] <sockler> and aptget in command
[09:13] <crimsun> Rocco: then use Synaptic to disable the cd-rom source and to enable the Internet-based one(s), then Reload
[09:13] <crimsun> sockler: did you remember to Reload in Synaptic (or apt-get update)?
[09:14] <sockler> lol didnt do it after enabling
[09:14] <sockler> thanks
[09:15] <togs> while im here, what's pcimia, or something like that? that's laptop stuff, yeah?
[09:15] <goldfish_> think so
[09:15] <crimsun> togs: yeah, peripheral connector standard(s) for laptops
[09:15] <Rocco> root@nbmini:/home/lukas # apt-get install powernowd [bash]  Following packages doesn't perform the dependence: powernowd: depends on: module-init-tools (>= 3.1-rel-2ubuntu2) but 3.1-pre2-2ubuntu3 should be installed
[09:16] <togs> oky, so pcimia errors on desktop boxes are because they're not laptops?
[09:16] <crimsun> Rocco: please apt-get update
[09:17] <Rocco> i did already crimsun
[09:17] <azriel0184> togs, yes. and i always wondered why a desktop install included the pcmcia stuff...
[09:18] <homer2> hmm
[09:18] <goldfish_> hi
[09:18] <homer2> when setting up eggdrops in an ubuntu box, it says i need tcl 8.6.4 when i have 8.6.9 installed
[09:19] <homer2> 8.4.6 and 8.4.9 respectivly
[09:19] <viper12> afk a few minutes.
[09:19] <membreya_> anyone here have experience with configuring squid and using apt-get?
[09:20] <membreya_> just looking at my access.log it says tcp_miss meaning that the proxy isn't caching it cos the local system has it cached
[09:20] <crimsun> Rocco: do you have the warty-security line uncommented, too?
[09:20] <membreya_> but my system doesnt have it cached :|
[09:20] <crimsun> Rocco: err, you don't have to worry about that last question. Apologies.
[09:21] <Rocco> don't understand crimsun..... but i've installed module-init-tools_3.1-pre2-2ubuntu3_i386.deb now manually, still the sam error message
[09:21] <crimsun> Rocco: the problem is that you have mixed warty and hoary sources.
[09:22] <crimsun> 3.1-pre2-2ubuntu3 is from warty; 3.1-rel-2ubuntu2 is from hoary.
[09:22] <Rocco> crimsun: really!? and this means.....?
[09:22] <crimsun> Rocco: did you dist-upgrade to hoary? i.e. are you running hoary?
[09:22] <dewey> ok using live cd I could not get past here:  Entering run level 2; Saving VESA state:  ?
[09:23] <Rocco> crimsun: never heard anything about hoary and warty.... :-/
[09:23] <goldfish_> lol
[09:23] <goldfish_> poor Rocco
[09:23] <goldfish_> :/
[09:23] <Rocco> what shells :D
[09:23] <crimsun> Rocco: dpkg -l libc6|grep ^ii|awk '{print $3}'
[09:25] <Rocco> crimsun: 2.3.2.ds1-13ub
[09:25] <crimsun> ok, so that's the version of libc6 from warty
[09:25] <crimsun> now why is module-init-tools from hoary installed?
[09:26] <Rocco> ...dont know...?
[09:26] <crimsun> Rocco: please paste /etc/apt/sources.list onto http://pastebin.ca
[09:26] <Rocco> crimsun: so i need this module from warty, right?
[09:27] <Rocco> crimsun: root@nbmini:/home/lukas # /etc/apt/sources.list onto http://pastebin.ca .... bash: /etc/apt/sources.list: Keine Berechtigung
[09:29] <Rocco> crimsun: (means: no rights....the same error, when i try to change my cpufreq)
[09:29] <crimsun> Rocco: you have to open a web browser (mozilla-firefox), go to http://pastebin.ca, and copy and paste the contents of /etc/apt/sources.list
[09:29] <crimsun> Rocco: don't try to execute it
[09:30] <Benoni> Can someone confirm that openssh for Ubuntu Hoary is *not* built with GSSAPI support?
[09:31] <crimsun> Benoni: correct.
[09:31] <Benoni> OK, thanks crimsun.
[09:31] <epslaptop> welp got ubuntu working nicely :)
[09:31] <epslaptop> detected all drivers... only using vesa at the moment but no need for anything else at this stage
[09:32] <epslaptop> apart from that, impressive :P
[09:33] <membreya> can someone help me with some information on my squid config.. getting new packages via synaptic, and the packages are showing in the access.log as a miss meaning that the local machine has them cached and the proy isn't used...yet my local machine doesnt have them cached.  is there any reason for this ?
[09:33] <crimsun> that's odd terminology for a miss
[09:33] <Rocco> crimsun: http://pastebin.ca/6926
[09:33] <crimsun> usually a hit indicates that it is cached
[09:34] <crimsun> a miss indicates that it isn't and thus has to refer upstream
[09:34] <devdude> Has anyone had problems with synergy under hoary? doesnt connect to client since upgraded from warty.
[09:35] <crimsun> devdude: 1.0.14-1?
[09:35] <devdude> 1.0.14
[09:36] <crimsun> Rocco: ok, you need to comment out that first line
[09:36] <crimsun> Rocco: put a '#' at the beginning of the line
[09:36] <Rocco> crimsun.....deb cdrom....
[09:37] <crimsun> Rocco: yes.
[09:37] <Rocco> done, crimsun
[09:39] <Rocco> crimsun.... i don't understand..... powernowd workes fine after installing, but no more after rebooting,
[09:43] <jeavis> Hi
[09:43] <MyNameIsChris> Hello jeavis
[09:43] <jeavis> How to uninstall a software?
[09:44] <crimsun> Rocco: I don't know anything offhand, sorry.
[09:44] <crimsun> Rocco: have you looked at https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/CPUFreqModuleLoading
[09:45] <MyNameIsChris> jeavis: What software?
[09:46] <jeavis> mysql
[09:46] <jeavis> MyNameIsChris: mySQL
[09:46] <Rocco> crimsun thank you very much. i will have a look at it afterwards.....cu, and thanks again
[09:46] <MyNameIsChris> jeavis: apt-get remove packagename if you downloaded it as a package
[09:47] <jeavis> MyNameIsChris: Thank you very much
[09:50] <MyNameIsChris> jeavis: np
[09:50] <dims> hi
[09:51] <dims> can anyone help on setting up XFCE4 instead of Gnome on Ubuntu distribution?
[09:52] <MyNameIsChris> sudo apt-get install xfce
[09:53] <dims> I have downloaded XFCE4 from synoptic
[09:54] <MyNameIsChris> Can't help you then, apt-get does everything for you
[09:55] <_4strO> mmm
[09:55] <_4strO> i have dowloaded Enlightenment but it doesn't appear in GDM
[09:56] <dims> ok, I ll try this way, sorry I am new to this, quiet impressed with Ubuntu
[09:56] <_4strO> hi all ^^
[09:56] <jeff_> dims
[09:56] <jeff_> i can help you set up xfce my man
[09:56] <jeff_> first off, un install xfce4 from synoptic
[09:56] <jeff_> that verison is an old verison
[09:56] <MyNameIsChris> _4str0: Hello
[09:57] <steve_> can anyone give me a list of their hoary sources
[09:57] <dims> how do I uninstall?
[09:57] <jeff_> just open up synoptic and de select it
[09:57] <dims> ok, let me try
[09:57] <_4strO> :)
[09:57] <wheelbarr> I'm trying to boot from the hoary live CD on a toshiba 2210CDT and all I get is the mouse, works fine, but nothing else. Checked the web site and the 2210CDT is said to work fine. Any ideas ?
[09:57] <jeff_> once you have that done, click on this link and follow it step by step. it should have you finished in no time
[09:58] <[Zenith] > dims, or you can use apt-get remove "package"
[09:58] <steve_> can anyone give me a list of their hoary sources
[09:59] <virtuald> meew
[10:00] <viper12> gads.
[10:00] <jeff_> dims: this page should get you the newest verison. you'll need to compile from source, though
[10:00] <jeff_> but its simple step by step directions that even i could figure out.
[10:00] <jeff_> http://www.tuxme.com/node/358
[10:00] <viper12> sometimes troubleshooting via text/typing is WORSE than a friggin' game of telephone. shakes head.
[10:01] <viper12> <vent mode off.
[10:01] <dims> jeff, in synoptic I remember it install the whole lot of other stuff when I marked xfce4, how do i get rid off it all, then?
[10:01] <jeff_> dont worry about that
[10:01] <the_grey_ghost> is there a free hardware testing program on the internet
[10:02] <jeff_> see, im pretty sure the verison in synptoic is 4.0
[10:02] <jeff_> you probally want 4.2
[10:02] <jeff_> just de select all the xfce packages, the rest are probally going to be helpful when you compile the sources
[10:03] <jeff_> k once that is done, goto http://www.tuxme.com/node/358 and follow step by step
[10:03] <dims> yes 4.2, OK
[10:03] <jeff_> you'll be up and running the cholerstrol free enviroment in no time
[10:03] <the_grey_ghost> I have allot of buggy hardware to analyse. Ie where does the memory tester in Grub come from?
[10:03] <the_grey_ghost> Just Use ICE
[10:03] <the_grey_ghost> Why Xfce?
[10:03] <jeff_> if you need any help just le tme know
[10:04] <jeff_> i duno i like the feel of it
[10:04] <jeff_> use the mouse wheel to use between desktops
[10:04] <jeff_> to each his own though
[10:04] <the_grey_ghost> True
[10:05] <dims> thanks, jeff
[10:05] <jeff_> website is helping?
[10:11] <heyrhett> how do i set up the contrib repo?
[10:12] <membreya> do get apt-get to install all files including "recommended packages" is it apt-get install -f ?
[10:12] <membreya> nevermind :P
[10:12] <xinel> okies im trying to set up my epson stylus c45 usb printer, ive read through the forums but haven't been able to get it working, ive got cups and foomatic installed any ideas?
[10:14] <selinium_> hi all, anyone able to help with getting a plam os device talking to ubuntu?
[10:14] <selinium_> palm even
[10:19] <selinium_> hi all, anyone able to help with getting a palm os device talking to ubuntu?
[10:19] <MyNameIsChris> which Palm?
[10:20] <MyNameIsChris> Say z72 and I can help
[10:20] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: The ique 3600 from garmin.
[10:21] <Myrtti> could you recommend me a good sftp / scp / ftp program with a tolerable GUI?
[10:21] <MyNameIsChris> Okay, have you tried gpilot?
[10:21] <membreya> Myrtti: gftp? :P
[10:21] <scolbe> heh.. did an upgrade from warty to hoary and synaptic managed to uninstall it self.. ;)
[10:21] <Myrtti> :-o
[10:22] <Myrtti> membreya: one of those programs without .desktop-file?
[10:23] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: I have but I cant get it to talk! The gpilot conduit is supposed to support the ique. it is probably a settings thing. Or it isnt detecting the cradle or soomething?
[10:23] <MyNameIsChris> I know
[10:23] <MyNameIsChris> One second
[10:23] <MyNameIsChris> Do a lsusb while I find it
[10:24] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: ANother new command learnt! CHeers
[10:25] <MyNameIsChris> Well, there is a devices.xml file somewhere. Add the vendor and device id to it. I'll keep looking for it but you try too
[10:25] <MyNameIsChris> Got it
[10:25] <MyNameIsChris> /usr/share/gnome-pilot/devices.xml
[10:25] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: LOL give me a chance! :P
[10:26] <MyNameIsChris> You should be able to work it out from what is alread in the file
[10:26] <MyNameIsChris> I am on a roll
[10:26] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: Ok one mo.
[10:28] <Echylo> how to get win32 codecs again?
[10:28] <Echylo> marillat or what was it?
[10:28] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: It is already in there, the third one down.
[10:28] <MyNameIsChris> Some Vendor and device ids?
[10:29] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: <!-- Garmin Ique 3600 -->
[10:29] <selinium_> <device vendor_id="091e" product_id="0004"
[10:30] <Echylo> deb ftp://ftp.nerim.net/debian-marillat/ unstable main
[10:30] <MyNameIsChris> What does your lsusb say?
[10:30] <Echylo> is this the corret marillat?
[10:30] <Echylo> correct*
[10:30] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: I have just got to find it again. Too many windows!
[10:30] <MyNameIsChris> Bus 001 Device 002: ID 0830:0061 Palm, Inc., vendor=0830,device=0061
[10:30] <MyNameIsChris> That is mine
[10:30] <MyNameIsChris> 0830:006 is the important part
[10:31] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: Bus 002 Device 003: ID 0403:fc82 Future Technology Devices International, Ltd
[10:31] <MyNameIsChris> Sure that is it?
[10:32] <MyNameIsChris> Add <device vendor_id="0403" product_id="fc82" />
[10:32] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: Nope but it is the only value showing on the lsusb
[10:33] <MyNameIsChris> Try adding
[10:33] <MyNameIsChris> it
[10:33] <MyNameIsChris> oops
[10:34] <selinium_> I have just moved the usb to somewhere an old usb1.1 port to see if there is any change in the lsusb
[10:34] <MyNameIsChris> Okay, I had this problem with my palmOne Zire 72
[10:34] <MyNameIsChris> Make sure it is on
[10:36] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: Bus 001 Device 002: ID 091e:0004 Garmin International looks a bit better!
[10:37] <dims> jeff?
[10:37] <MyNameIsChris> Bugger, that is not the problem
[10:37] <MyNameIsChris> usb?
[10:37] <MyNameIsChris> Oops
[10:37] <MyNameIsChris> WHat I meant to say
[10:38] <MyNameIsChris> ttyusb1?
[10:39] <dims> when i ran sudo ./xfce4-4.2.0-installer.bin I get an error that compiling installer gui is failed
[10:39] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: In the gpilot setup it have values for /dev/pilot and /dev/ttys0-3
[10:40] <MyNameIsChris> Try ttyusb1
[10:41] <heyrhett> I installed firefox 1.0.1 in /usr/local/firefox, and now i can't install the flash plugin
[10:41] <MyNameIsChris> /dev/ttyusb1
[10:41] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: Ok, doing it know
[10:41] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: now even
[10:43] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: Still no joy :(
[10:43] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: I am using the gpilot druid. Should i be doing this at  command line?
[10:44] <da_bon_bon> hi all
[10:44] <selinium_> hi da_bon_bon
[10:44] <da_bon_bon> anone here on the hoary 2.6.11 kernel got vmware running ?
[10:46] <da_bon_bon> selinium_: hello
[10:47] <MyNameIsChris> selinium_: I am out of ideas, they are the two problems I have
[10:48] <MyNameIsChris> Try creating a udev rule for /dev/pilot
[10:49] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: Now your talking like i konw what i am doing!
[10:49] <MyNameIsChris> I am not totally sure how to do it in this circumstance. Someone in this channel will know how to write one using the vendor and device ids
[10:50] <MyNameIsChris> open /etc/udev/udev.rules
[10:51] <ironwolf> anyone gotten bluetooth to work?  specifically sending a file from ubuntu to a bluetooth phone?
[10:52] <selinium_> ironwolf: there is loads of stuff on google to try.
[10:52] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: I have it open and backed up
[10:52] <MyNameIsChris> I must work it out
[10:52] <selinium_> k
[10:52] <MyNameIsChris> I have done it before
[10:53] <ironwolf> selinium_:indeed, some of it conflicting info.  Hence asking here.
[10:53] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: :)
[10:53] <selinium_> ironwolf: Which phone?
[10:54] <selinium_> ironwolf: is your bluetooth dongle
[10:54] <selinium_> ironwolf: is you bluetooth dongle
[10:54] <selinium_> ironwolf: which bluetooth dongle
[10:54] <selinium_> ironwolf: Sorry
[10:55] <ironwolf> selinium_: the belkin 100 meter adapter, and a motorola v600 phone.
[10:55] <selinium_> selinium: have you got the bluetooth working at all?
[10:56] <selinium_> ironwolf: have you got the bluetooth working at all? is it just your phone?
[10:56] <ironwolf> selinium_: nothing works yet.
[10:56] <selinium_> ironwolf: ok
[11:00] <selinium_> ironwolf: have you looked in synaptic, under bluetooth?
[11:00] <ironwolf> selinium_: I installed gnome-bluetooth... but so far that's it.
[11:01] <selinium_> ok
[11:01] <MyNameIsChris> selinium_: I cannot work it out, is /dev/ttyusb1 there when your pda is on and gone when it is off?
[11:01] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: I will look.
[11:02] <ironwolf> selinium_: synaptic gives me gnome-bluetooth
[11:02] <membreya> lo selinium_ :)
[11:03] <da_bon_bon> anyone got vmware working on the kernel 2.6.11-1-686 ?
[11:03] <selinium_> membreya: hi there!
[11:04] <selinium_> ironwolf: have you got libbluetooth1 installed?
[11:05] <Cspnico> Hi
[11:05] <da_bon_bon> anyone got vmware working on the kernel 2.6.11-1-686 ?
[11:05] <Cspnico> My Xfee86 server doesn't work how i can reeinstall them?
[11:05] <da_bon_bon> on hoary ?
[11:05] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: Strange? usb0 is there constantly, but when i click sync both 1 and 2 come up aswell
[11:05] <ironwolf> selinium_: dpkg says yes.
[11:06] <ironwolf> da_bon_bon: when did 2.6.11-1 come out?
[11:06] <MyNameIsChris> Try 1 and 2 and if they don't work I am sorry I cannot help
[11:06] <da_bon_bon> ironwolf: long back
[11:06] <MyNameIsChris> It worked fo rme
[11:06] <MyNameIsChris> for me
[11:08] <P229> is there an ETA for hoary final?
[11:08] <da_bon_bon> P229: april
[11:08] <ompaul> P229, April
[11:09] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: Cheers for the pointers. I will carry on giving it a go!
[11:09] <ironwolf> da_bon_bon: hadn't appeared on my radar yet.  Checking apt-get dist-upgrade now to see if it's automagically there.
[11:09] <MyNameIsChris> Good luck, I am sure it is something obvious
[11:09] <membreya> ooo only one month to go :)
[11:09] <P229> heh, just in time to provide relief from tax season
[11:09] <MyNameIsChris> If it is in devices.xml it should work
[11:10] <ompaul> P229, you could move to somewhere that Tax is October 31
[11:10] <MyNameIsChris> ompaul: You typed faster, it was the lag that got you
[11:10] <ompaul> MyNameIsChris, haha
[11:10] <selinium_> MyNameIsChris: Cheers for all the pointers, the missus has just put breakfast infront of me so I will let you know how I get on in abotu15 mins!
[11:10] <da_bon_bon> ompaul: :)
[11:10] <P229> ompaul: what I'd really like is for taxes to stop bleeding me dry
[11:11] <ompaul> P229, in two words value chain
[11:12] <da_bon_bon> PLEASE HELP -- quite strange -- http://rafb.net/paste/results/c8oVqc64.html
[11:12] <P229> ompaul: in my language the two words are "tax break"
[11:12] <P229> heh
[11:14] <ompaul> da_bon_bon, ooch
[11:14] <Keiw> FREE ****** www.otomotivshow.com
[11:15] <da_bon_bon> ompaul: ??
[11:15] <P229> ok, where's an op
[11:15] <ompaul> da_bon_bon, I read that post
[11:15] <ompaul> s/post/paste
[11:15] <da_bon_bon> ompaul: and whats the conclusion ?
[11:16] <ompaul> I am trying to think of something that might be helpful
[11:16] <da_bon_bon> please, ompaul, i am confused!
[11:18] <P229> da_bon_bon: do you have the source for kernel 2.6.11-1-686 installed?
[11:19] <da_bon_bon> P229: i ahve the source for 2.6.11 not 686 - there isnt one
[11:19] <ompaul> da_bon_bon, http://www.ussg.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/0007.3/0587.html  <-- this is an old reference to that issue it may explain more background to some of the problem
[11:19] <P229> da_bon_bon: but what about 2.6.11-1?
[11:20] <da_bon_bon> P229: i dont think thers something like that too
[11:21] <ompaul> da_bon_bon,  http://www.faqts.com/knowledge_base/view.phtml/aid/22369/fid/1144  <-- that was the same error with a previous version on debian
[11:22] <da_bon_bon> ompaul: thanks a lot man
[11:22] <P229> da_bon_bon: ugh... listen to ompaul
[11:23] <da_bon_bon> P229: thanks anyways :)
[11:23] <P229> heh, no problem
[11:23] <da_bon_bon> ompaul: thats vmware for windows - i am trying to install vmware on linux
[11:23] <ompaul> da_bon_bon, if you need vmware have you looked at Xen ?
[11:24] <ompaul> da_bon_bon, ahh
[11:25] <danny666> hi
[11:25] <MyNameIsChris> Hello danny
[11:25] <danny666> can somebody tell me how i can get my soundblaster live 5.1 to play 5.1?
[11:25] <Madeye> hey, I'm having problem in my internet connection, I can connect to anything except the HTTP, any idea?
[11:26] <danny666> router?
[11:26] <da_bon_bon> ompaul: whats Xen ?
[11:26] <Madeye> danny666, No, ADSL model
[11:27] <ompaul> da_bon_bon, as far as I can figure out it is FOSS xen I have not had time or opportunity to test it but I know one guy who raves about it - he has been using FOSS since the 80'2
[11:27] <ompaul> 80's even
[11:28] <danny666> sorry then i dont know
[11:28] <ompaul> back before there was a linux
[11:31] <da_bon_bon> ompaul: and who is that ?
[11:32] <ompaul> who was using it back then :-) I didn't know him then but barry flanagan the man who brought affordable internet access to Ireland
[11:32] <da_bon_bon> ompaul: Xen cant emulate windows! :P
[11:32] <ompaul> da_bon_bon, so be it :)
[11:34] <da_bon_bon> ompaul: well, i am getting the headers. maybe that will work /?
[11:34] <TPC> whats the difference between flashplayer-mozilla and flashplugin-nonfree?
[11:35] <da_bon_bon> ompaul: well, due to lag, i wont be getting ny messages. so, thanks a lot.
[11:37] <baikonur> hi, can I use the live cd to install ubuntu as you can do it with some versions of knoppix?
[11:40] <lifeAcolyte> Can I use a regular Debian unstable link in my sources.list?
[11:45] <ironwolf> baikonur: not on warty/stable, but if you have the live DVD of hoary, then yes.
[11:54] <AngryClip> if I move my /home dir into a Fat32 fs, will I run into problems? or will there be a noticable speed decrease?
[11:55] <Ribs> probabily
[11:55] <Ribs> what would posses you to do such a thing?
[11:56] <AngryClip> will there by any problems that I am not forseeing, and will it play nice if I set the windows "My documents" folder into the same place?
[11:56] <Ribs> AngryClip: backup first
[11:56] <Ribs> I can't see it working
[11:56] <Ribs> as fat32 has no concept of user ownership
[11:57] <AngryClip> oh
[11:57] <Ribs> It's the FS Windows 9x uses, right?
[11:57] <AngryClip> yeah
[11:57] <Ribs> hell, I'm not a *nix expert either :)
[11:57] <AngryClip> :P
[11:57] <Ribs> I can't see it working then
[11:57] <ompaul> Ribs, it does have a concept of ownershipi it is the anarchy concept the strongest program can do what it likes :)
[11:58] <AngryClip> never mind, it was just an idea
[11:58] <AngryClip> lol ompaul
[11:58] <Ribs> success breeds Mircosoft
[11:58] <Ribs> tsk tsk
[11:59] <ompaul> AngryClip, why are you thinking of moving your /home into a fat32 dir?
[11:59] <lunitik> ompaul: apparently so he can use it for /home/him and his personal stuff on Windows...
[12:00] <AngryClip> ompaul: because I do a lot of work in /home, and occasionly I need to use it in windows but I forget to move it to the windows partion so it can't access it
[12:00] <AngryClip> lazyness I guess
[12:00] <lunitik> ompaul: actually not a bad idea -- if there was less chance of it breaking things  :P
[12:00] <lunitik> AngryClip: you know there are free ext3 drivers for windows?
[12:01] <AngryClip> no I didn't
[12:01] <AngryClip> are they reliable?
[12:01] <AngryClip> could I point my "My Documents" folder to the /home then?
[12:01] <ompaul> AngryClip, so write a script that on shutdown copies the relevant files to fat32 or just kill off windows and do all the work from Linux :)
[12:01] <lunitik> AngryClip: I haven't seen any complaints...
[12:01] <AngryClip> or would that also bork things up a tad
[12:01] <lunitik> AngryClip: you can point it anywhere if you grab TweakUI ...
[12:01] <AngryClip> I do do most of my work in linux ompaul
[12:02] <AngryClip> it's just VB via crossover office sometimes gets unpredictible
[12:02] <AngryClip> you can point it anywhere without tweakui
[12:02] <AngryClip> just open up windows explorer, right click on it and choose the path
[12:02] <mactiny> guys this may be an idiot questioin.. but hpw do u change to root user right after an install
[12:02] <mactiny> im new
[12:02] <mactiny> to it all
[12:03] <mactiny> there didnt seem to be an option ot set the root pass during install
[12:03] <mactiny> or am i missing something
[12:03] <ompaul> mactiny, you can launch the "root terminal"
[12:03] <mactiny> u need a pass for that
[12:03] <AngryClip> you can give root a password via
[12:04] <mactiny> yeah
[12:04] <padraig> mactiny -  http://ubuntuguide.org/#gainrootmodifykernel
[12:04] <mactiny> thankyou
[12:04] <lunitik> AngryClip: one example: http://uranus.it.swin.edu.au/~jn/linux/ext2ifs.htm
[12:04] <mactiny> greatly appreciated
[12:04] <padraig> mactiny - actually STOP!
[12:04] <padraig> wrong url ;-)
[12:04] <mactiny> k
[12:04] <mactiny> hehe
[12:04] <mactiny> ok
[12:05] <AngryClip> sudo passwd root
[12:05] <AngryClip> ^^^^
[12:05] <AngryClip> then you can use the
[12:05] <AngryClip> su
[12:05] <AngryClip> as normal
[12:05] <AngryClip> ty lunitik
[12:05] <TPC> or just sudo su
[12:05] <ompaul> mactiny the concept is that you use sudo for root tasks and not give a password to root so youy can sudo su - if you really feel like being root
[12:05] <TPC> and use your normal pass
[12:05] <mactiny> you may need to explain.. im new to linux
[12:06] <mactiny> wat is sudo
[12:06] <mactiny> what*
[12:06] <P229> do as superuser
[12:06] <padraig> mactiny - its worth having a look here -> http://ubuntuguide.org/#setchangeenablerootpassword
[12:06] <ompaul> mactiny  sudo, sudoedit - execute a command as another user
[12:06] <mactiny> ok
[12:06] <AngryClip> lunitik: you can't write with that
[12:07] <AngryClip> nevermind, when I have finished this module at uni in a few months I can get rid of windows completely
[12:07] <ompaul> AngryClip, you could have another "segment" of the machine on fat32 where you put work that you "share"
[12:09] <mactiny> im not sure if developers are here, but what does the future hold for ubuntu
[12:09] <AngryClip> ompaul: that is what i am doing atm
[12:09] <tp__> hi, I have a new hoary install on an ibm t42.. I've having problems with reconnecting to my wireless router. Upon reboot wireless comes up fine. If I cycle the router then I lose wireless and can't get it back at all without a reboot?
[12:09] <ompaul> AngryClip, ahh
[12:09] <AngryClip> I just thought they could of been a more elgant solution
[12:09] <Goshawk> doing ls /dev/fb* i find only fb0, where are all the others fbx?
[12:09] <AngryClip> I shall survive :D but thanks anyway
[12:10] <kratzer54847> noobs!
[12:11] <tp__> just for information - I'm a happy ubuntu user on other fixed and wireless computers in our business.
[12:12] <selinium_> aargh, I have been trying to get ubuntu to talk to my Palm OS iQue 3600 for about 2 hours now.. Help!
[12:13] <kratzer54847> noobs!
[12:13] <mactiny> i know you all would argue it is ready already, but when do you think ubuntu will reach a point of maturity whereby itll be a easy change over from xp, with no "Bugs". Lets face it, getting the basics working under windows is much easier.
[12:14] <mactiny> i really hope itll fulfill its potential
[12:14] <mactiny> where is the community heading with it
[12:14] <AngryClip> mactiny: I don't think so tbh, take my laptop for example, in windows if I plug a mouse in then I need to install drivers etc wheras in ubuntu I just plug it in and it worked
[12:14] <selinium_> mactiny: You sound like a reporter!
[12:14] <tp__> mactiny: when hardware suppliers pay a fraction of the attention to linux drivers as they do to windows drivers, it may happen
[12:14] <mactiny> im not
[12:14] <ompaul> kratzer54847 given the diversity of language finding a new and more impressive statement might be worth exploring :)
[12:15] <ompaul> doh!
[12:15] <mactiny> so u say the problem is with hardware suppliers
[12:15] <mpathy> help! got a problem with hotplug.. my pc freeezes at startup
[12:15] <tp__> ompaul: how about.. hmm.. I seem unable to answer these questions but have to say something anyway?
[12:16] <selinium_> ompaul: I think kratzer54847 has found the up arrow!
[12:16] <tp__> mactiny: I'm saying they could make the situation a lot easier
[12:16] <ompaul> tp__, yes
[12:16] <mactiny> yeah i get that
[12:16] <mactiny> so where is ubuntu heading
[12:16] <ompaul> mactiny, really the problem is with people buying from suppliers that sell hardware that does not work with linux
[12:17] <selinium_> mpathy: hotplug freezes on a few things it cant start but will continue on. Have a look at www.ubuntuguide.org for more info
[12:17] <mactiny> like winmodems
[12:17] <mactiny> for example
[12:17] <tp__> mactiny: heres a good example, I just bought a new laptop and chose an ibm t42. It worked pretty much out of the box...
[12:18] <mpathy> but i disconnected all USB things and it doesnt continue.. even if I wait a hour
[12:18] <ompaul> mactiny, well I have always insisted on serial just to make the point for over last 10 years
[12:18] <selinium_> mactiny: As a new ubuntu/linux user i have to say i am impressed with not only the stability, but also the security of linux systems. If people wake up to the fact that if they only use a pc for email and browsing , there is no point install costly microsoft software
[12:19] <mactiny> do you think it is realistic to think linux can win, considering what is against it
[12:19] <mactiny> yeah i understand that
[12:19] <tp__> it's already won.. I may be thinking of a different war though ;-)
[12:19] <mactiny> the problem is, basic things like installing software are kinda hard compared with windows
[12:19] <mactiny> haha
[12:19] <mactiny> the war of numbers*
[12:20] <_4strO> it seems to be defferent now
[12:20] <mactiny> well thats the war im thinking of
[12:20] <selinium_> mactiny: using synaptic i find is easier than installing a MS product
[12:20] <_4strO> on ubuntu u only have to launch synaptic
[12:21] <_4strO> and search ur soft
[12:21] <_4strO> and click install
[12:21] <mactiny> simply things like, the theme's. I found the main defualt theme to be the only profesional theme
[12:21] <_4strO> don't have to search on the web
[12:21] <mactiny> the others were clearly still being developed
[12:21] <ompaul> it has won - people, in particular microsoft, are going on in the same way, but the change is happening, let us examine for a moment the FireFox situation, it is now over 10% of the browser market, people are wondering is there more of this stuff out there it is happening, it just does not go the way that the Microsofts expect
[12:21] <_4strO> just search a package name
[12:21] <selinium_> mactiny: no discs to lose/corrupt. All your software gets updated if available. If a new release is out there you know about it
[12:21] <spiral> hi
[12:22] <mactiny> is there a clear line drawn between developed software, and young software
[12:22] <BeTa> that's strange... here synaptic does not show me anything in categories
[12:22] <mactiny> is it a thing of simply experience telling you which is good
[12:22] <ompaul> mactiny, only in the mind of the viewer :)
[12:22] <BeTa> I'm running warty on ppc
[12:22] <ompaul> spiral, hi
[12:23] <tp__> mactiny: although ubuntu is currently losing the 'dropped wireless connection' war
[12:23] <BeTa> that's strange, in the trail bar, synaptic says "3 packages listed, 1084 installed (...)"
[12:23] <tp__> mactiny: I think that war may be localised though
[12:23] <selinium_> mactiny: what would make you choose between mcaffee or a synaptic antivirus product?
[12:23] <ompaul> tp__, my wifes machine does wireless on warty no problems at all
[12:23] <mactiny> thats the thing, you have to play for the more "Non enthusiast  " viewpoint for what looks good
[12:24] <tp__> ompaul: I've got other machines working fine.. this one works for a while but if the wireless is interupted, it won't reconnect without a reboot
[12:24] <ompaul> mactiny, you defeat your own arguement., the non enthusiast is not going to explore themes or at least will go back to the original
[12:24] <mactiny> dont you think there should be a clear ine drawn between developed and developing software
[12:24] <tp__> ompaul.. I'm thinking it might be suspend issues...
[12:25] <mactiny> well, my point is that the defualt, may be fairly professional, but i dont think the non enthusiast will like it
[12:25] <ompaul> tp__, try sudo dhclient it might be useful
[12:25] <mactiny> its to dark
[12:25] <selinium_> mactiny: Why? Microsoft have been releasing beta software for 20 years
[12:25] <tp__> ompaul: ok... looking
[12:26] <mactiny> my point is, that for somone who doesnt know the linux ongoings, and who only has experience in the microsoft world, will find it a huge task to learn which is good and whoch isnt in the linux world dirung vchange over
[12:26] <ompaul> mactiny, the real situation here is that you are spoilt for choice - you can import your own desktop background, for instance I use nasa images
[12:26] <macewan> anyone tried poppler with evince?
[12:26] <mactiny> i think you right
[12:26] <tp__> ompaul... unfortunately not, just tried rediscovering. can't think why a hard restart would work where updown won't
[12:27] <jdub> mactiny: that's why we ship the best of the best, so they don't have to choose. :-)
[12:27] <mactiny> ahha
[12:27] <mactiny> the thing is you haev to tell people what they need to like, because they dont know themselves
[12:27] <mactiny> and finding out, takes time and effort
[12:27] <mactiny> which they may not be willing to gove
[12:27] <tp__> what does a hard restart do to networking that networking restart and ifupdowns won't
[12:27] <jdub> sure, but that's what we do
[12:29] <ompaul> mactiny, and you change car and the indicator is in a different location, the wipers too the petrol tank you adapt there is a minor price for the change - if you are not willing to pay it then maybe just maybe you need to do some more thinking about what it is you need a computer for and why it is you are using one in the first place
[12:29] <cavediver> Hi guys. Can someone confirm a broken Openoffice2 in Hoary?
[12:29] <cavediver> I can't install it-.
[12:29] <mactiny> dont you think a few more "candy" items are needed in the defualt release
[12:29] <ompaul> cavediver, I can't it worked for me last night
[12:29] <mactiny> i agree ompaul
[12:29] <spiral> cavediver: yesterday it worked... and I don't think it is updating right now
[12:29] <cavediver> Strange.
[12:30] <mactiny> my point is "non enthusiasts" dont see it that way
[12:30] <ompaul> mactiny, if you want such things document them, go to the ubuntu site get a logon, join in the ideas pool
[12:30] <cavediver> I get this:  openoffice.org2-common: Depends: openoffice.org2-core (> 1.9.76) but it is not installable
[12:30] <selinium_> aargh, I have been trying to get ubuntu to talk to my Palm OS iQue 3600 for about 2 hours now.. Help!
[12:30] <cavediver> E: Broken packages
[12:31] <tp__> selenium:what problems you having?
[12:31] <ompaul> cavediver, can you do apt-get install openoffice.org2-core
[12:31] <mactiny> well i would prefer to mouth off here :) .. i havent got the time to help with development. The truth is, and i may be wrong, but i think people like ubuntu because its heading strongly in the direction which i am talking about
[12:31] <ompaul> cavediver, sorry stop
[12:31] <mactiny> hehe
[12:32] <mactiny> but that doesnt mean i appreciate what u gusy are doing
[12:32] <ompaul> cavediver, cavediver do this first - apt-cache search openoffice.org2-core
[12:33] <selinium_> tp__ I cant get Ubuntu to discover it! I have lsusb it and it shows it has found the iQue but i cant get them to connect
[12:33] <wheelbarr> I'm trying to boot from the hoary live CD on a toshiba 2210CDT and all I get is the mouse, works fine, but nothing else. Checked the web site and the 2210CDT is said to work fine. Is this the right channel for this  ?
[12:33] <nburana> #python
[12:33] <ompaul> cavdiver that should tell you what you want to apt-get
[12:33] <wheelbarr> ok who do i have to sleep with ?
[12:34] <ompaul> wheelbarr, yourself?
[12:34] <wheelbarr> thats not what my wife thinks :/>
[12:35] <mactiny> i just hope, that ubuntu sees things from the perspective of the client, who are mostly "dumb". They need lots of pretty pictures, and nice sounds to keep their attention. But from my view, and its an unimformed one, it seems that many linux developers see things from their "ooh, do you know what under the bonnet" perspective. Am i worng in thinking that.
[12:36] <mactiny> thus the enthusiast idea
[12:36] <selinium_> tp__ The palm conduit devices.xml contians the right refeerences for the iQue. I dont know where to go from here!
[12:36] <cavediver> ompaul: strange.
[12:37] <Chipzz> mactiny: part of where you're wrong is that most distributions dont produce code
[12:37] <cavediver> ompaul: Today i can se or2-common but not org2-core
[12:37] <mactiny> the point is, linux may be a glorious beast under the bonnet, but it doesnt matter if those that never look under the bonnet are the ones that buy it.
[12:37] <ompaul> mactiny, I evangelise linux a `lot` I think that that perception is changing, after all who ever got sacked for buying $TLA :) it happens
[12:37] <mactiny> please explain? i am trying to learn something hear
[12:38] <Chipzz> if you're talking about implementing new visible features for the sake of the dumb people, that's upstreams task anyway
[12:38] <mactiny> i guess my main point in speakign with you all here, is to understadnt the linux community
[12:39] <mactiny> if i think you right, then ill evangelise with you
[12:39] <jdub> mactiny: i think it's pretty obvious by the way we're doing things that we're not solely concentrating on 'enthusiasts'
[12:39] <mactiny> yeah, i see that with ubuntu
[12:39] <mactiny> and it excites me
[12:39] <jdub> right, so you know the answer to your own question, then, by the looks of it
[12:39] <tp__> selenium: sorry... can't help :-(
[12:39] <mactiny> im trying to find out if my excitment is warranted
[12:40] <mactiny> hehe
[12:40] <ompaul> mactiny, GNU/Linux is open and a herd of cats as Linus said, so go commit yourself to it
[12:40] <danny666> i have soundblaster problems can somebody please help?
[12:40] <selinium_> mactiny: I am a PC enthusiast, not a linux enthusiast. I choose the best programs for the job. Linux has proven to be the best. No viruses, Great support from other users... Unheard of from Windows users, and above above all cost free!
[12:40] <qosmof> hola :) someone using Radeon 9200SE on hoary with xorg radeon driver? (it crash to me)
[12:40] <danny666> yes me
[12:41] <danny666> i am having a radeon 9500pro on ubuntu hoary
[12:41] <mactiny> how would u all rate the defualt theme out of 1 to 10
[12:41] <selinium_> mactiny: The cost of a new PC would be in the region of 300-500 pounds cheaper if you used linux instead of MS
[12:41] <mactiny> how many of you stick ith the defualt theme
[12:41] <danny666> 7
[12:41] <mactiny> yeah, the price factor does play a hug epart
[12:42] <qosmof> danny666, could you paste your xorg.conf in a query please?
[12:43] <mactiny> and is the theme you are using now packed into the standard ubuntu package?
[12:43] <selinium_> mactiny: I have stuck with the default theme, but there a loads of theme sites out there, the same as with windows. Just google gnome themes
[12:43] <spiral> hi
[12:43] <danny666> qosmf: use this site http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/BinaryDriverHowto
[12:43] <qosmof> maybe my problem is just about agpgart kernel module, it isn't in /etc/modules
[12:43] <danny666> it helpt me alot
[12:43] <qosmof> danny666, ok
[12:43] <ompaul> mactiny on different boxes I use slightly different themes :) so one of the boxes here is default bog standard no frills etc
[12:43] <selinium_> tp__ no worries!
[12:44] <danny666> just do everything exept for fglrxconfig
[12:44] <danny666> read the notes
[12:44] <mactiny> thx for answering my questions
[12:44] <mactiny> i appreciate it
[12:44] <danny666> if u have a nforce chipset
[12:45] <selinium_> mactiny: no problems!
[12:45] <qosmof> i don't want to use the fglrx driver (binary by ati) but the open driver included in xorg (radeon module)
[12:45] <mactiny> wish u all well with you endeavours
[12:45] <mactiny> bye
[12:45] <danny666> why that
[12:46] <danny666> fglrx driver is better then that
[12:46] <selinium_> can anyone help with connecting a palm handheld?
[12:46] <qosmof> danny666, just because 3D is important but not so much, I think I prefer a more "free" system (I don't play games)
[12:46] <danny666> is tehre noboody who can help me with my soundbladter problem?
[12:47] <danny666> then u dont need all of this
[12:47] <danny666> then just rconfigure ur xserver
[12:47] <danny666> i dont know the exact command to start that
[12:48] <deadline> hi, can i upgrade ubuntu to debian testing?
[12:48] <Chipzz> I'm wondering... how often are the ubuntu archives updated? Does ubuntu work in the same way as debian (daily dinsall runs)?
[12:48] <Chipzz> dinstall even
[12:49] <Chipzz> deadline: how would that be an UPgrade?
[12:51] <deadline> Chipzz: ok maybe a downgrade then, but is it possible or not?
[12:52] <Chipzz> in theory I guess... but do you want to downgrade your packages to the debian testing verions too?
[12:52] <deadline> yes
[12:53] <Chipzz> that's not possible, no
[12:53] <Chipzz> unless you want to put a lot of manual effort in it
[12:54] <deadline> Chipzz: ok thanks
[12:55] <Chipzz> deadline: apt will by default only install newer packages, and since the packages in debian testing are all older, it wont downgrade anything
[12:55] <njs12345> hmm
[12:55] <deadline> ok
[12:56] <deadline> what about a apt-get dist-upgrade after replacing the apt-sources with the testing ones?
[12:58] <ompaulAFK> deadline to try to understand what you are doing why not do apt-cache dump and try to undstand the complexity of the task you are asking of apt
[12:58] <ompaulAFK> understand even
[12:59] <ompaulAFK> you want all that stuff to move seamlessly, if you want to write such a program go ahead :)
[01:00] <deadline> heh ok
[01:01] <ompaul> deadline, and be aware that you need to identify all the packages on the target machine - so you need to traverse the existing tree of installed matterials hmm
[01:02] <deadline> lol
[01:02] <scognito_> hi all
[01:02] <ompaul> hi one :)
[01:03] <deadline> im just asking for a friend of mine. i use debian testing myself, thats why i ask...
[01:03] <cavediver> ompaul: can you pls do a apt-get update and an apt-search openoffice.org2-core ?
[01:03] <scognito_> which apt sources do you use for mono?
[01:03] <scognito_> i got:
[01:03] <cavediver> It doesn't seem to exist for me
[01:03] <scognito_> Err http://www.getsweaaa.com ./ Packages
[01:03] <scognito_>   500 Internal Server Error
[01:04] <ompaulAFK> scognito_, afk means away from keyboard :) and the hoary box is 3.5 miles away from me
[01:04] <deadline> whats the latest ubuntu kernel image available via apt-get? linux-image-2.6.8-5-386 ? and will installing the latest image + headers be enough for a kernel upgrade?
[01:05] <scognito_> ompaulAFK, ???
[01:10] <DeadZed> When will Hoary stable be released
[01:11] <selinium_> DeadZed: april
[01:11] <psy__> DeadZed: somewhere in april.
[01:11] <DeadZed> nice
[01:11] <DeadZed> its sooo buggy right now
[01:12] <DeadZed> well , its ok, but ... some things dont work
[01:12] <DeadZed> I discover new bugs every day
[01:12] <psy__> do you report them?
[01:13] <DeadZed> cant be bothered
[01:13] <DeadZed> I'll check into it
[01:13] <selinium_> Would anyone know how to connect a palm device?
[01:14] <psy__> selinium_: with a plug?
[01:14] <DeadZed> selinium_ hotplug recognised my mp3 player nicely
[01:15] <DeadZed> so should it rocognise a palm
[01:15] <selinium_> psy__ :) It would be funny if i hadn't spent 2 hours already!
[01:15] <DeadZed> selinium_ maybe its some specific devices that hotplug recognises
[01:15] <DeadZed> ??
[01:15] <DeadZed> maybe theres some list
[01:15] <psy__> selinium_: sorry
[01:16] <tp__> I've added an extra user as an admin user and also added them specficailly in sudoers. I can access 'sudo synaptic' but synaptic from the menu (and other admin tools) won't work - ie don't appear
[01:17] <selinium_> DeadZed: THere is gnome-pilot that is supposed to do it for you. I have checked my usb and it is definately connecting. Just not as far as transfering data
[01:17] <selinium_> psy__ no worrries!
[01:18] <psy__> selinium_ :)
[01:19] <DeadZed> selinium_ if it shows up under devices then you must be on the right path
[01:20] <DeadZed> is there a command to identify ALL devices .. like similar to  lspci
[01:21] <DeadZed> does it take forever to open terminal for everyone?? In Slack it fires up INSTANTLY , but in ubuntu it just takes forever
[01:22] <DeadZed> :(
[01:22] <apokryphos> Practically instant for me, though I use konsole.
[01:23] <DeadZed> should I get konsole instead of that standard one
[01:23] <apokryphos> It probably won't faster if you're using Gnome.
[01:23] <DeadZed> k
[01:26] <DeadZed> apokryphos are you using kde? is it ok in ubuntu?
[01:26] <apokryphos> Pretty sweet, yes.
[01:26] <DeadZed> how long does it take to install it with adsl
[01:27] <apokryphos> not long at all; you can get it from the repositories
[01:29] <neofeed> has Tuxracer always been that tough?
[01:29] <neofeed> I can't get past the 3rd lap. As I can not get beyon 32seconds evevn if I go full speed straight all the time.
[01:29] <neofeed> and 30 sec is required
[01:29] <johnnybezak> neofeed: yeah its pretty hard
[01:30] <johnnybezak> neofeed: i tried pressing left right constantly that seemed to help
[01:30] <neofeed> how is that going to help?
[01:32] <selinium_> DeadZed: it shows under devices... But stillno joy!
[01:33] <DeadZed> selinium_ maybe you must mount it manually
[01:34] <selinium_> DeadZed: Possibly i will look into it!
[01:36] <Echylo> why does k3b always gives an error 'error decoding audio tracks and fails burning?
[01:38] <thoreauputic> straight audio from a CD or mp3 audio?
[01:38] <Echylo> mp3 audio
[01:38] <thoreauputic> Echylo: you have mp3 support installed?
[01:38] <Echylo> hmm
[01:38] <Echylo> don't know
[01:38] <thoreauputic> uMkulu: restricted
[01:39] <Echylo> how to check & how to install ? :$
[01:39] <cvxb> hey google  www.otomotivshow.com  :)
[01:39] <thoreauputic> bot is off apparently
[01:39] <DeadZed> Echylo error messange mean that it cant decode for some reason
[01:39] <thoreauputic> Echylo: hang on
[01:39] <Chipzz> any vim users in here?
[01:40] <thoreauputic> Echylo: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/RestrictedFormats
[01:40] <Echylo> thanks mate
[01:40] <thoreauputic> uMkulu: keywords
[01:40] <thoreauputic> where are you. uMkulu ?
[01:41] <johnnybezak> i'm just looking at the ubuntu group on audioscrobbler (the songs you listen to are sent to their server and they do stats etc.)  After that TuxRacer ends ;)
[01:48] <deadline> thoreauputic: thanks
[01:48] <neofeed> (you won the cup - and there is no new cup to enter in )
[01:53] <thoreauputic> testing bot, please disregard the next line
[01:53] <thoreauputic> what is keywords
[01:53] <thoreauputic> uMkulu, keywords
[01:53] <thoreauputic> grrrr
[01:53] <jdub> thoreauputic: would prefer not to have bots in here thanks
[01:54] <thoreauputic> jdub: not my bot, and it was useful for anawers to standard questions
[01:54] <thoreauputic> jdub: I don't see the objection to that
[01:55] <thoreauputic> jdub: perhaps you could point out why?
[01:56] <njan> thoreauputic, as long as it doesn't wind up like #debian in here.. it has to be said, use of a bot to answer a question tends to be accompanie dby incredibly rude and arrogant behaviour.
[01:57] <thoreauputic> njan: well, so far the uMkulu bot just directs people to URLs and such
[01:58] <njan> thoreauputic, please, please don't let it get like debian. The ubuntu/#ubuntu community is one of the biggest advantages ubuntu has over plain debian :)
[01:58] <thoreauputic> restricted formats, howtos, that kind of thing
[01:59] <njan> so no !tellthispersonwhyhismisguidedassumptionmakeshimabadperson ?
[01:59] <thoreauputic> njan: I agree with you  - but wouldn't you say it's easier to type a keyword than constantly typing long URLs?
[01:59] <njan> thoreauputic, totally :)
[01:59] <njan> thoreauputic, the reason I mention it is, I get in lots of .. debates .. :p .. in #debian and with others in the debian community about this ;)
[02:00] <thoreauputic> njan: well, try /msg uMkulu keywords and see if there's anything objectionable there
[02:00] <njan> especially when the issue is something contentious and picky, like use of the word 'stable' (the english language usage vs. the debian usage)
[02:00] <njan> thoreauputic, I take your word for it; like I said I was just raising the issue because I think it's important :)
[02:00] <selinium_> Hi thoreauputic!
[02:00] <thoreauputic> hi selinium_
[02:01] <njan> thoreauputic, hmm.. I take that back
 australia
 well, australia is the place to be!
[02:01] <njan> very objectionable :p
[02:01] <thoreauputic> njan: I totally agree that #ubuntu should never become like #debian
[02:01] <selinium_> thoreauputic: I am still trying to get my palm device to work... AAAAARRGH!
[02:01] <thoreauputic> njan: hehe - well just do "forget australia" ;)
[02:01] <daniels> for what it's worth, I made the bot +q
 forget australia
 njan: I forgot australia
[02:02] <njan> always good :)
[02:02] <daniels> i personally belivee that bots don't have a plce in here
[02:02] <thoreauputic> daniels: reasoning?
[02:02] <daniels> if you need to tell people stuff, then tell them stuff
[02:02] <spiral> any idea of when we will have ooo2 beta in hoary ?
[02:02] <daniels> if you need to write long extended texts, write the on the wiki
[02:02] <johnnybezak> what if the bots one day revolt and take the channel over metropolis style?
[02:02] <daniels> if you need to write random weird stuff like !drink or whatever, do it in /msg
[02:02] <thoreauputic> daniels: umm... is this a community or do your views get precedence?
[02:02] <daniels> spiral: it's, er, already there
[02:02] <daniels> thoreauputic: it's a community, sure
[02:03] <bob2> I certainly agree with daniels
[02:03] <bob2> pointless bots are pointless
[02:03] <bob2> (fwiw)
[02:03] <spiral> daniels: hmmm... I was not speaking about release m74, but about beta version...
[02:03] <spiral> daniels: is it really in hoary ?
[02:04] <thoreauputic> bob2: agreed with the pontless aspect - but is it pointless to have keywords for common questions?
[02:04] <bob2> thoreauputic: having the bot at all encourages abuse
[02:04] <johnnybezak> thoreauputic: it might take some of the love out of the channel
[02:04] <johnnybezak> its nice being a newb and having some one help you out
[02:04] <johnnybezak> its the open source community love
[02:04] <daniels> spiral: ooo2 is in hoary, yes
[02:04] <apokryphos> Bots are good for recalling links and the like; they shouldn't be overused, and they shouldn't be getting in the way.
[02:04] <bob2> erk
[02:05] <sleon|tuX> heelp
[02:05] <apokryphos> To test your bot you really should be in another channel
[02:05] <thoreauputic> *shrug*  a link is a link
[02:05] <sleon|tuX> heeelp :D
[02:05] <bob2> and people don't read the FAQ, anyway
[02:05] <bob2> sleon|tuX: you need to actually ask a question
[02:05] <spiral> daniels: the beta2, really, not just the testing 74 release ?
[02:05] <johnnybezak> hehe we could just get a bot to say RTFFAQ! :P
[02:06] <spiral> daniels: so what is the name of the package in this case ?
[02:06] <njan> johnnybezak, then this would be #debian :p
[02:06] <spiral> daniels: I just found the testing 74 release
[02:06] <johnnybezak> njan: yeah im just jokin
[02:06] <njan> johnnybezak, likewise ;)
[02:06] <thoreauputic> OK - doesn't bother me, and I didn't bring the bot anyway - I just found it useful to answer repeated questions that pop up all the time
[02:06] <sleon|tuX> the problem is
[02:07] <sleon|tuX> when i insert cd's they are not shown on the desktop anymore
[02:07] <sleon|tuX> and then i insert audio cd's they are not played automatically anymore
[02:07] <daniels> spiral: ah, I don't know.  if it's just testing 74 or whatever, then it hasn't been updated yet
[02:07] <sleon|tuX> and now hald damon is runnins anymore
[02:07] <sleon|tuX> only dubs
[02:07] <sleon|tuX> why ?
[02:07] <sleon|tuX> and how to fix that?
[02:07] <njan> for my 2c, a bot's useful for recalling URLs and non-contentious factoids. But anything explanatory needs to be done by people or, like someone pointed out, is too lengthy to be pasted into IRC. I thoroughly dislike how bots are used in #debian.
[02:07] <spiral> daniels: all right, so I hope it will be updated :-)
[02:07] <apokryphos> I disagree that bots *shouldn't* be here. That is a little too extreme; it's pointless searching for the same link, or venturing into my bookmarks when a command can give the link to the person in question faster, and with less effort from my side.
[02:07] <pchiller> the RestrictedFormats wiki page mentions LAME but does not mention that it is only found in multiverse
[02:08] <njan> And in fact, factoids are better explained by people in any case.
[02:08] <njan> apokryphos, agreed - a lot of the time, people in here know the link is 'on the forums', but don't know where
[02:08] <apokryphos> njan: that's obviously not necessarily true. But anyhow, the "facts" explained on a wiki or done by a person, are they not?
[02:08] <apokryphos> *are done
[02:08] <bob2> njan: they're used in that like #debian because (among other reasons) people absolutely REFUSE to read the faq
[02:09] <njan> apokryphos, what's not necessarily true?
[02:09] <bob2> njan: which is in the /topic, and /notice'd to them on-join
[02:09] <help-me> greetings
[02:09] <njan> bob2, True, but like I pointed out to thoreauputic, a lot of bot use in debian is accompanied by arrogance and rudeness on the part of the user.
[02:09] <sleon|tuX> bob2, and? any suggestions from super ubuntuian?
[02:09] <apokryphos> njan: that factoids are better explained by people. Though, you'd probably have to expand on what you mean by that if we were to get technical ;-)
[02:09] <njan> bob2, I've been botted plenty of times in debian by people who obviously hadn't even bothered reading my question.
[02:09] <njan> bob2, and in a lot of instances people use the bots as weapons to bludgeon other people with, ideologically.
[02:09] <bob2> sleon|tuX: are you using hoary?
[02:10] <sleon|tuX> bob2, how to see it?
[02:10] <help-me> i have a divx file .avi but when i open it all i get is the sound on totem player
[02:10] <bob2> sleon|tuX: you don't know what version of Ubuntu you're using?
[02:10] <help-me> anyone can help me?
[02:10] <njan> apokryphos, I'm thinking about simple, one-line question answers, such as the reply to 'does ubuntu have the nvidia driver? Where can I get it?'
[02:10] <apokryphos> There shouldn't be bots responding to things without a command from another member
[02:10] <sleon|tuX> bob2, warty
[02:10] <bob2> help-me: wiki.ubuntu.com/RestrictedFormats
[02:10] <bob2> for instance, help-me obviously hasn't read the faq
[02:10] <bob2> or googled
[02:10] <thoreauputic> njan: OK, well i guess I'll have to make me a list of keywords and use those instead
[02:10] <njan> apokryphos, which is easy to respond to with 'no, go look at this link which shows you how to get it'
[02:10] <bob2> to pull someone out at random
[02:10] <sleon|tuX> bob2, deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ warty main restricted universe multiverse
[02:10] <sleon|tuX> deb-src http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ warty main restricted universe
[02:10] <help-me> i did
[02:10] <johnnybezak> bob2: but thats part of the linux learning process
[02:11] <help-me> i even read the unofficial site
[02:11] <apokryphos> njan: agreed
[02:11] <sleon|tuX> bob2, any suggestions??
[02:11] <help-me> and done what they said
[02:11] <help-me> but still i can't get it to work
[02:11] <njan> bob2, it depends how you want your community to work. No-one ever reads all available documentation, so if you want to get pedantic, you can always tell someone to RTF M/FAQ/Documentation
[02:11] <bob2> sleon|tuX: does restarted hal work?
[02:11] <bob2> sleon|tuX: or dbus?
[02:11] <sleon|tuX> bob2, nope
[02:11] <sleon|tuX> bob2, i did
[02:11] <sleon|tuX>  /etc/init.d/dbus-1 restart
[02:11] <sleon|tuX> there is now hald is running
[02:11] <sleon|tuX> after it
[02:11] <sleon|tuX> and also inserting media causes no reaction
[02:12] <njan> bob2, there are lots of instances of people obviously not putting *any* effort into reading the FAQ, but in my experience with online communities, the best way to get people like that to advance their learning is to actually talk to them rather than flaming them and making them feel unwelcome in a community they're probably only just coming to understand and have only just discovered.
[02:12] <njes> is it someone who know how too install D-link DWL-610
[02:12] <njan> bob2, discounting repeat offenders, that is :)
[02:12] <bob2> help-me: you read the page I gave you?
[02:12] <bob2> sleon|tuX: "tail -f /var/log/messages" and try putting it in again...does it print anything?
[02:13] <apokryphos> help-me: you most probably haven't installed all of the codecs required
[02:13] <njan> bob2, ftr, I've never managed a commmunity *quite* this big, so a lot of this is speculative, but I have extensive experience with smaller (10 - 100 users) IRC channels/communities
[02:13] <bob2> njan: sure, I agree about that
[02:13] <bob2> njan: right, most of my experience is from #debian
[02:13] <thoreauputic> I don't realy disagree with any of the points raised -  I just want to avoid looking for stuff people need to know, so i guess it's up to me to make my own shortcuts
[02:13] <help-me> yes i have read it bob2
[02:14] <sleon|tuX> bob2, moment
[02:14] <bob2> njan: helping people on a case-by-case is nice for them, but hugely inefficient
[02:14] <njan> bob2, yes, I appreciate that ;)
[02:14] <lukesk> anyone know what this means: hde: max request size: 128KiB
[02:14] <lukesk> hde: 234441648 sectors (120034 MB) w/8192KiB Cache, CHS=16383/255/63, BUG
[02:14] <lukesk> hde: cache flushes not supported
[02:14] <lukesk>  hde:hde: recal_intr: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error }
[02:14] <lukesk> hde: recal_intr: error=0x04 { DriveStatusError }
[02:14] <lukesk> ide: failed opcode was: unknown
[02:14] <lukesk>  hde1
[02:14] <help-me> gstreamer0.8-plugins is already the newest version.
[02:14] <bob2> lukesk: please don't paste stuff in here
[02:14] <lukesk> sorry
[02:14] <apokryphos> thoreauputic: By all means, please do. It should be obvious when a bot moves from "being helpful" to "getting in the way".
[02:14] <bob2> help-me: no, you need to install totem-xine or gxine
[02:14] <help-me> w32codecs is already the newest version.
[02:15] <help-me> hummm
[02:15] <thoreauputic> apokryphos: indeed
[02:15] <help-me> i see
[02:15] <njan> bob2, but what debian doesn't always manage is automating those cases in a human way - I have to question the motives of a lot of people who have unpleasant replies to commonly asked questions - channels on freenode inevitably attract newcomers. IRC channels are designed for newcomers. If you're not prepared to deal with the inevitable breed of people who don't read before they leap, why bother expending your effort to answer questions in the first place?
[02:15] <help-me> is there any commands that i can write in a terminal to get it
[02:15] <help-me> or maybe synaptics package?
[02:15] <njan> bob2, not a personal attack on you, but I take considerable exception with people who bother to help.. but do so in a less-than-helpful way :)
[02:15] <apokryphos> speaking of bots ;-)