[00:01] <cxdvty> !ipod
[00:06] <cxdvty> k1l: Know what we should do? lol
[00:20] <k1l> i dont have apple hardware but people tell one should try itunes in wine.
[00:30] <cxdvty> it doesnt work for me
[00:31] <cxdvty> k1l: will jailbreaking services (such as redsn0w) work with wine?
[00:31] <k1l> i would not flash anything with wine
[00:33] <cxdvty> ok
[00:50] <k1l> now its plymouth-start.service failing on systemd, too
[00:56] <cxdvty> k1l: Wine won't run anything on my pc it always fails
[00:56] <cxdvty> !raring
[00:57] <cxdvty> k1l: you there?
[00:58] <k1l> ?
[00:58] <cxdvty> Wine wont run any windows programs at all it just crashes
[00:59] <k1l> i dont use wine nor do i use apple hardware or itunes. and i dont know if the wine guys will support wine running on a development ubuntu
[00:59] <cxdvty> imon 14.04 rn
[01:00] <k1l> then you are wrong in this channel with that issue. 14.04 is #ubuntu supportwise. but i would suggest to talk to the #winehq guys
[01:00] <k1l> !wine | cxdvty
[01:02] <cxdvty> k1l: is it hard to setup vmbox
[01:03] <k1l> no
[01:03] <cxdvty> I dont have a installation disc tho d:
[01:04] <cxdvty> Can i setup windows vmbox without it
[01:04] <k1l> no you need some installation media.
[01:05] <cxdvty> dang can i install it from online?
[01:08] <cxdvty> ??
[01:14] <cxdvty> k1l ^^
[01:15] <k1l> i dont know what windows offers today to install their OS. ##windows will know
[04:29] <rat> keithzg: I'm running a Acer C710 Chromebook. My hangs during boot may have been due to invalid entries in fstab which were created during install. Haven't rebooted to see if that's the case yet.
[04:29] <rat> Still haven't found an explanation for why I lost HIDs on Systemd boot
[08:59] <lordievader> Good morning.
[10:21] <Dulcin> Hi, I just installed the Ubuntu vivid daily, now when I maximize my terminator window it is dimming my screen, but only when I maximize it on my second monitor (dual monitor setup). Is this a new setting or a bug?
[10:22] <igalic> so yesterday i upgraded my system to 15.04, and now my cryptsetup is hosed (again). i have to manually encrypt my disks (plural) in initramfs, and even then it only works when booting through upstart. (which is kinda funny, cuz upstart was removed , only upstart-bin is left;)
[10:29] <igalic> Setting up libwayland-egl1-mesa:amd64 (10.5.0-0ubuntu1) ... ← i want to believe.
[10:34] <k1l_> Dulcin: that sounds like the "program is hanging" dimming. and not like a monitor dimming
[10:55] <Dulcin> k1l_, hmmm, it's strange because only terminator seems to do this, when I maximize. As soon as I right click for the mouse menu, it fades in again. Or when I resize the window, or move another window on top of it.
[10:56] <Dulcin> k1l_, Also when I maximize it on my other dual monitor, this behaviour is not replicated... so a bug then?
[10:56] <k1l_> well, does terminator log errors somewhere? or start terminator from another terminal and see if it errors there.
[10:56] <k1l_> i would call this a bug, yes
[10:57] <k1l_> maybe its just some theme or glib issue
[10:58] <Dulcin> It does give an error when I run it in another terminal, but I don't think it's related
[10:58] <Dulcin> k1l_, /usr/share/terminator/terminatorlib/window.py:63: Warning: The property GtkWindow:allow-shrink is deprecated and shouldn't be used anymore. It will be removed in a future version.
[10:58] <Dulcin>   self.set_property('allow-shrink', True)
[10:59] <Dulcin> Ok let's hope it will be fixed after the stable release
[11:00] <k1l_> well, if you file the bug report now the chances are way better it gets fixed for the release.
[11:00] <k1l_> !bug
[11:00] <Dulcin> I'll do that
[12:36] <owlman> Hi all. Seeking some help with a fresh install of vivid-beta1 on new hardware
[12:37] <owlman> specifically a lenovo thinkpad Helix 2nd generation tablet with the ultrabook pro keyboard
[12:38] <owlman> Once sddm launches the keyboard dock stops working, and in tablet mode there is no virtual keyboard launched
[12:39] <owlman> grub recognises the keyboard dock, and launches a virtual keyboard in tablet mode
[12:40] <owlman> touchpad on keyboard dock and touchscreen both work
[12:43] <BluesKaj> Howdy all
[13:49] <igalic> really good to know that kernel 3.19 will fix my partner's networking issues, cuz, i upgraded my machine to test the upgrade in gernal, and her reaction was: i don't want that thing on my computer.
[13:50] <igalic> now my wifi card, which worked fine with 3.16 is breathtakingly slow and jittery it makes my eyes bleed.
[14:27] <mparillo> Is anybody having to re-connect to a WEP network with every re-boot? I opened https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=344600 I am afraid they will claim it is *buntu-specific and point to: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/1354924 because 'Everything works on Debian Unstable' according to invalid https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=340568
[14:43] <akiva-thinkpad> uhmmm, is this right: http://imgur.com/tgbHemW
[14:49] <k1l_> lol
[14:50] <k1l_> i dont use the softwarecenter, so i dont know. but it looks maybe a little too big to me :)
[17:21] <MoonUnit`> anyone had their screen go blank when updating today, got the kubuntu boot logo then 3 systemd services appeared then nothing, logged into another tty to check it finished updating then rebooted.
[17:27] <mparillo> MoonUnit`: Yes, I got a ton of TTY error messages relating to components of open-vm-tools-desktop I sent my VM an alt-ctrl-delete, forced my VM down, and Kubuntu Vivid came back.
[20:18] <keithzg> So any ideas why switching to systemd is caused root filesystems (at least mine, and apparently then some others') to initially mount read-only even thought the output of 'mount' claims rw?
[20:31] <keithzg> Guess I should pull down teh updates since yesterday and just see if that's fixed, heh.
[20:33] <elfy> I'm still pondering the non-usable state of our images
[20:36] <cxdvty> Hey all :D
[20:41] <BluesKaj> keithzg, I have 2 hdds on this pc and no trouble mounting or moving files between the two drives, running systemd on kubuntu 15.04
[20:46] <keithzg> BluesKaj: Definitely not saying it's universal, but at least myself and lordievader had our root filesystems now mounting as secretly read-only upon boot under systemd. He's using NFS, I'm using ext4 on a Chromebook, so not sure what the shared causal factor is.
[20:49] <keithzg> Damn, the latest round of updates fixed nothing.
[21:00] <keithzg> At least lightdm seems to load Plasma 5 sessions just fine now (haven't given sddm another shot yet)
[21:10] <lordievader> keithzg: Hmm, guess I'll update the other box soon.
[21:30] <keithzg> Hmm, just double checked and at least now upon boot / does indeed report that it's mounted ro


[00:08] <dutchie> ok, whoever just reviewed that ML message is disturbingly fast
[00:08] <nisshh> dutchie: i just happened to be reading my email at the time :)
[00:09] <dutchie> nisshh: :P
[00:09] <nisshh> but i like being "disturbingly fast", suits me huh? :)
[00:09] <dutchie> heh
[00:09] <nisshh> my nick could be, nisshh-da-speedy :)
[00:10] <Muscovy> Not so speedy for IRC shouts.
[00:10] <nisshh> Muscovy: why is that?
[00:11] <Muscovy> Typing nisshh-da-speedy to get your attention.
[00:11] <nisshh> lol
[00:11] <dutchie> the very purpose tab-completion was invented
[00:12] <nisshh> exactly


[04:15] <lotuspsychje> good morning to all
[04:33] <Sveta>  https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/8xzj45/someone-is-spamming-and-breaking-a-core-component-of-pgps-ecosystem
[04:33] <Sveta> i don't understand it...
[04:34] <Sveta> who cares who signed my key? if i already shared it with my friend and he knows it belongs to me, everything else doesn't matter
[04:37] <lotuspsychje> https://access.redhat.com/articles/4264021
[06:15] <lordievader> Good morning
[06:16] <lotuspsychje> hey lordievader
[06:16] <lordievader> Morning lotuspsychje , how are you doing?
[06:16] <lotuspsychje> all good lordievader tnx
[06:17] <ducasse> good morning
[06:17] <lotuspsychje> we had an interesting issue in main, tsimonq asking about spam signed gpg key
 Fun keyserver-related question that probably belongs here.
 My GPG key was signed by some spammers, and I would like to remove the spam signatures.
 I currently hold my GPG private key, so I hope this is still possible
[06:19] <lordievader> Interesting. Why would spammers sign keys though, what is in it for them to do so?
[06:21] <lotuspsychje> lordievader: this seemed interesting: https://gist.github.com/rjhansen/67ab921ffb4084c865b3618d6955275f
[06:30] <lordievader> Oh, that is quite bad.
[06:31] <lotuspsychje> not sure i understand the spammers reasons yet
[06:37] <lordievader> Reading the sks post you just gave, this might be a way to DoS a lot of things... the whole debian/ubuntu package infra comes to mind...
[06:38] <lotuspsychje> yeah this really doesnt sound good..
[06:54] <blackflow> wait, what does this mean really, that the KSK infra is effectively blown out, public keys can no longer be trusted?
[06:55] <blackflow> *SKS
[06:56] <blackflow> yeup.... boom. "stop retrieving data from the SKS keyserver network"
[06:56] <lordievader> They can still be trusted, they just might break the implementation you are running.
[07:00] <blackflow> I'd call that very much untrusted :)
[07:07] <blackflow> besides, from reading about it in detail, there's no way of knowing which signatures are legitimate and which are poisoned, so yeah, no go.
[07:35] <RikMills> lotuspsychje: wow @ Simon's GPG key!
[07:35] <lotuspsychje> RikMills: yeah its nuts
[07:46] <blackflow> After re-installing 18.04.2. from scratch, I forgot to disable STUPID, MORONIC, IDIOTIC unattended upgrades that just upgraded Firefox behind my back and the thing crashed while I was trying to send an email via webmail.
[07:46] <blackflow> "A system designed for idiots is only usable by idiots"
[07:49] <marcoagpinto> Hey
[07:50] <marcoagpinto> guys?!
[07:51] <lordievader> 👋
[07:51] <marcoagpinto> the software I am coding has the GUI showing okay on 18.04, but on versions above the panel gadget becomes bigger and the gadgets inside it go a few pixels below
[07:51] <marcoagpinto> :)
[07:51] <marcoagpinto> should I check for Linux version or GTK version to fix it
[07:52] <marcoagpinto> for example, in Ubuntu 18.10+ I want to add more pixels to the panel gadget to compensate it takes more space
[07:52] <marcoagpinto> ?
[07:56] <blackflow> Which package do I file a bug against, that pertains to default installed packages?
[07:56] <lotuspsychje> what kind of bug are you encountering blackflow
[07:58] <blackflow> unattended-upgrade being installed and enabled by default
[07:58] <RikMills> A bug in a default package? Or you disagree with the default choice?
[07:58] <RikMills> Oh, that
[07:58] <lotuspsychje> wishlist against linux perhaps?
[07:59] <blackflow> the kernel?
[08:00] <lotuspsychje> blackflow: or against unattended-upgrades itself?
[08:00] <RikMills> That fact that it is installed, would be a seed issue. So probably file against Ubuntu desktop meta package (though that change is likely in platform/core)
[08:01] <lotuspsychje> ah
[08:01] <RikMills> The fact that it's enabled by default, could be against the package itself, of perhaps a default settings package
[08:01] <blackflow> lotuspsychje: problem is unattended-upgraes is not tracked by launchpad
[08:01] <lotuspsychje> !info unattended-upgrades
[08:01] <blackflow> RikMills: yeah it can be installed by default, just not enabled.
[08:02] <lotuspsychje> blackflow: is this wish for server?
[08:02] <RikMills> blackflow: huh? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unattended-upgrades
[08:02] <blackflow> RikMills: Now add /+filebug    to that URL and hit enter
[08:02] <blackflow> "unattended-upgrades does not use Launchpad as its bug tracker. "
[08:03] <blackflow> ah, must file against the source package
[08:03] <blackflow> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unattended-upgrades/+filebug
[08:03] <RikMills> blackflow: yep
[08:08] <blackflow> bug 1836328      please mark if you agree
[08:09] <luna_> Listening to this weeks episode now: http://ubuntupodcast.org/2019/07/11/s12e14-sega-rally-championship/
[08:13] <blackflow> Changing/modifying software without direct user intervention used to be called Malware. Back in the day only compromised systems modified its own software unexpectedly. And then Ubuntu came...
[08:16] <lotuspsychje> blackflow: affected & added to -discuss team
[08:16] <blackflow> much obliged.
[09:35] <lotuspsychje> blackflow: someone set your bug to wontfix
[09:35] <lotuspsychje> oO
[09:36] <blackflow> of course :)
[09:37] <lordievader> Wasn't this a somewhat recent change?
[09:37] <lordievader> As in the enablement by default.
[10:05] <blackflow> I think it is yes, but I can't pinpoint it. I usually install via debootstrap and never include that thing.
[10:05] <blackflow> It's now also a default in debian Buster it seems.
[10:24] <RikMills> someone = member of foundations team
[11:26] <BluesKaj> Hey folks
[11:32] <marcoagpinto> BluesKaj!!!!
[11:32] <marcoagpinto> Hello!!!
[11:32] <BluesKaj> hi marcoagpinto
[11:32] <marcoagpinto> I was doing some exercises
[13:39]  * lotuspsychje sighs
[13:43] <lotuspsychje> jelly: so wich Os would that be?
[13:43] <jelly> lotuspsychje, sorry, apparently I had reached the join channel limit and had to choose which channels to give up, to join here
[13:43] <jelly> lotuspsychje, debian
[13:43] <lotuspsychje> jelly: so you advice to eolupgrade debian to the next version, without warning the security part?
[13:44] <jelly> lotuspsychje, absolutely
[13:44] <tomreyn> hehe, reached the channel limit, that's already tough on freenode.
[13:44] <blackflow> lotuspsychje: what warning?
[13:44] <jelly> it's set to low 120 channels.
[13:44] <tomreyn> :)
[13:45] <lotuspsychje> blackflow: if the eol system has been taken over
[13:45] <blackflow> lotuspsychje: I don't follow you
[13:45] <jelly> lotuspsychje, the security issue is exactly the same whether you have, say, left an unpatched bionic for a year, or left an unpatched artful for a year
[13:46] <lotuspsychje> lets take 17.10 as example, alot of usn came out since, the system could be compromized
[13:46] <lotuspsychje> would you still trust that system?
[13:46] <jelly> that applies to 18.04 as well.
[13:46] <blackflow> "could" yes... but how likely is it.
[13:46] <lotuspsychje> blackflow: but how can one be sure?
[13:47] <blackflow> your running LTS "could" be compromised right now with a zero day nobody knows about but the attacker.
[13:47] <jelly> lotuspsychje, would you trust it LESS than an unpatched 16.04 or 18.04?
[13:47] <blackflow> you can't be sure here either.
[13:47] <blackflow> I'd just hate to jump to conclusions.
[13:47] <lotuspsychje> jelly: this is not about lts or non-lts
[13:47] <lotuspsychje> its about eol versions
[13:48] <jelly> lotuspsychje, I'm not suggesting the user to keep running an unsupported release.
[13:48] <lotuspsychje> jelly: i know, but you cant be sure its hacked or not
[13:48] <lotuspsychje> so why take the risk?
[13:48] <jelly> lotuspsychje, you can't know if your xenial has been hacked, EITHER
[13:48] <jelly> there's no functional difference.
[13:49] <lotuspsychje> thats true, but thats why we advice users to keep system up to date
[13:49] <lotuspsychje> jelly: plus, this user didnt want to update
[13:50] <jelly> lotuspsychje, does "please go from 17.10 to 18.04" not count as "keep system up to date"?
[13:50] <lotuspsychje> not much we can advice anymore
[13:50] <lotuspsychje> volunteers adviced him to eolupgrade
[13:51] <jelly> okay.  I misunderstood you as "don't eolupgrade"
[13:51] <lotuspsychje> no i did not
[13:53] <tomreyn> jelly: when someone comes to #ubuntu with an eol'd version we almost always use the !eol factoid , which also points to !eolupgrade - and we often trigger that, too.
[13:54] <BluesKaj> sometimes these cement heads just want to troll, they know they're eol, but afraid to admit it so they become aggressive
[13:54] <tomreyn> and sometimes, if the user seeks to upgrade, we also help them do so.
[13:55] <tomreyn> or they are pentesters but have no idea about what they're doing.
[13:55] <blackflow> lol.. this discusion is to teh contrary -- not recommending eolupgrade to "such old systems".
[13:56] <lotuspsychje> 60 pages of !usn since ubuntu 17.10 do i need to say more?
[13:57] <tomreyn> i think it's perfectly fine to recommend a fresh installation over an unsupported release upgrade path
[13:57] <blackflow> lotuspsychje: and how many unfixed for Bionic?  https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/main.html
[13:57] <lotuspsychje> blackflow: i never claimed a fully updated system isnt a risk neither :p
[13:58] <lotuspsychje> but that doesnt mean we cant warn users about risks
[13:59] <lotuspsychje> like tomreyn said, the !eolupgrade factoid also needs a rework
[14:01] <blackflow> !eolupgrade
[15:02] <tomreyn> launchpad is partially down. this is not a bug - at least not one you can currently file on launchpad. :-P
[15:04]  * RikMills blames swift
[15:05] <blackflow> tomreyn: aww, you defanged some nice jokes now :)
[15:05] <tomreyn> surely you mean the bank transfer system
[15:06] <blackflow> ColdFusion(tm)
[15:06] <tomreyn> maybe there'll be updates on https://twitter.com/launchpadstatus if it'll last some hours.
[15:07] <tomreyn> or here https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/launchpad-announce/2019-July/thread.html
[15:10] <blackflow> they upgraded the underlying os from Stretch to Buster? :)
[15:14] <tomreyn> rather from 12.04-PATCHED to 14.04-PATCHED
[15:17] <blackflow> oof!
[15:20] <tomreyn> i made this up, really. but i did see 12.04 version numbers on at least one of those servers while 12.04 ESM was active - which can be fine.
[15:21] <tomreyn> it's certainly not an easily maintained infrastructure.
[15:22] <blackflow> best opportunity for Canonical to dogfood their products ;)
[15:26] <tomreyn> it's already back
[15:46] <OerHeks> ohh https://store.steampowered.com/app/226840/Age_of_Wonders_III/ free to keep if you get it before the 15th
[16:13] <Eickmeyer> People need to stop reporting bugs against PPA packages.
[16:13] <Eickmeyer> !bug is <reply> If you find a bug in Ubuntu or any of its official !flavors, please report it using the command « ubuntu-bug <package> » - Please do not use this to report bugs against packages acquired from PPAs, contact that !ppa owner. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs for other ways to report bugs.
[16:14] <OerHeks> bug reporting against a snap is also fun
[16:14] <Eickmeyer> Heh
[16:15] <Eickmeyer> At least once a day I"m getting bug reports for GIMP when someone either 1) installed from a PPA, or 2) attempted to compile it themself, it fails to compile, and they file it against the version in the repo. >.<
[16:19] <blackflow> Eickmeyer: I thought launchpad was trying to become central place for more than just ubuntu main repo packages.
[16:19] <tomreyn> now (how) will they know whether their package is from a PPA, this is yet to be explained, i guess?
[16:19] <tomreyn> apt policy packagename, but it wont fit into this factoid
[16:20] <blackflow> I don't get it. Why not report bugs to LP for PPA packages?
[16:20] <Eickmeyer> blackflow: Yeah, but only if the PPA maintainer sets it up themselves. 'ubuntu-bug {package}' simply files it against the package in the repo, nowhere else.
[16:21] <blackflow> Not sure I follow
[16:21] <Eickmeyer> tomreyn: Most people add PPAs themselves for newer versions of software, so they would know they installed it from a PPA. If they don't, then they shouldn't be messing with PPAs to begin with.
[16:22] <blackflow> for example if I wanted to file a bug against nvidia-driver-430 from the graphics PPA... what would I do?
[16:22] <Eickmeyer> blackflow: using 'ubuntu-bug {package}' files it against lp:ubuntu/+source/{package}. That doesn't apply to PPAs at all.
[16:22] <Eickmeyer> blackflow: Contact the PPA owner.
[16:45] <popey_> We have looked at adapting apport type programs for snaps, for sure.
[16:46] <hggdh> blackflow: yes, the sequence is adjust apport so that it is able to deal with snap-specific BTS (at _least_ point to the user where to go)
[16:46] <hggdh> popey_: heh
[16:46] <blackflow> I'm telling you , nobody is gonna bother registering and filing bugs against dozens of different trackers. NOBODY.
[16:46] <popey_> As I said, that's already the case.
[16:47] <popey_> Statistically speaking, nobody files bugs. We know this already. What's the news here?
[16:47] <blackflow> it's also the case that users who would otherwise file a bug, won't.  like me. I file whenever I find an issue, at LP.   will I do the same for snaps? with no central place? nah. I won't bother.
[16:47] <popey_> Your loss.
[16:47] <hggdh> I agree the major risk on snaps (or flatpaks, for that matter) is publish & forget
[16:48] <blackflow> popey_: I doubt that. I just won't use the snap. it's not as if I can't get software outside of it.
[16:48] <blackflow> (in context where the snap doesn't work or something)
[16:48] <popey_> Great!
[16:48] <blackflow> hggdh: as years of docker has shown.
[16:49] <hggdh> let's move a bit, and compare with IOS/Android. Where do you file bugs for a third-party application (i.e., *not* Apple or Google)?
[16:49] <blackflow> popey_: I hope you realize that attitude toward users who would like to contrib with bug reports, is really just gonna result with the whole ecosystm becoming like windows, degrading into an unusable mess.   PPAs redux.
[16:49] <popey_> Or windows apps, or mac apps?
[16:49] <hggdh> ^
[16:49] <popey_> blackflow: which attitude?
[16:50] <blackflow> the one you're showing here.
[16:50] <popey_> I'm showing indifference because it's a monumental waste of time trying to convince you of anything, that's very clear.
[16:50] <popey_> So why should I bother?
[16:50] <hggdh> what can snapcraft do: if an application is misbehaving badly, remove if from the store. If an application does NOT provide a BTS link, warn the user, clearly, that there is NO support
[16:51] <blackflow> I'm not asking you to convince _me_. Im just telling you that without a central place for us users to file bug reports, even us who otherwise would, will NOT because nobody is gonna bother with dozens of different accounts at dozens of different trackers.
[16:51] <popey_> I completely understand your perspective, and politely disagree.
[16:51] <popey_> I think you're exaggerating for hyperbole sake.
[16:51] <popey_> Nobody signs up to "dozens of different trackers". Nobody.
[16:52] <blackflow> well that's my point.
[16:52] <popey_> People sign up to one or two here and there for specific issues that annoy them
[16:52] <popey_> Right, my point is that's already the status quo!
[16:53] <blackflow> so the takeway here is that snap store won't bother with a central place to report issues because nobody is filing them anyway, and upstreams mostly have their own?
[16:54] <popey_> No.
[16:54] <popey_> The takeaway is that developers have their own trackers, so why not use them.
[16:54] <hggdh> no, this is not it.  a distribution centre is NOT the same as development. You distribute, you do not support
[16:55] <blackflow> I think we're going in circles here....
[16:55] <popey_> The vast majority of users already do not file bugs. Enthusiasts do. You might not. This is not the end of the world.
[16:56] <hggdh> e.g., you go to (say) Best Buy and buy a laptop; if, later on, the laptop mishehaves (or -- say -- Windows misbehaves) you go to the manufacturer, not Best Buy. And yes, I know this is sort of contrived
[16:56] <blackflow> hggdh: uhhh no. Here in EU I take it to the store where I bought it as I've got warranty....
[16:56] <hggdh> blackflow: yes, we are sort of going in circles. We do not agree with you, and we are trying to show why
[16:57] <blackflow> in fact, if I tried to call the manufacturer, they would just tell me to contact the store where I bought it.
[16:57] <hggdh> blackflow: so you return your laptop to the store cuz it is BSOD-ing. What will the store do?
[16:57] <blackflow> hggdh: the stores here take it for diagnostics and repair.
[16:58] <hggdh> blackflow: so let's keep on. The disgostics come back saying it is a software failure. Then what?
[16:59] <blackflow> let's not. this is now strawman and outside of scope of the example you were trying to make.
[16:59] <hggdh> ok
[17:00] <popey_> We have written blog posts, and spoken directly to developers telling them how to optimise their store page.
[17:00] <popey_> Part of that is linking to bug trackers.
[17:00] <popey_> If we had a central tracker, we'd be middle men where their bugs go to die
[17:00] <popey_> Hello launchpad :D
[17:02] <blackflow> And now, hello "Even less people are gonna bother reporting bugs".
[17:02] <popey_> We'll see :)
[17:04] <blackflow> hggdh: the part about strawman... a snap is a whole product. there's no hardware-software dychotomy. it's all software.... there's no parts the user can install into the snap and break the warranty.
[17:06] <blackflow> ie. if you "take back the snap to the store, for repairs", the vendor can't shrug. Eithre the software in the snap is broken (vendor's responsibility), or teh snap framework is broken.
[17:06] <hggdh> blackflow: who is the warrantor?
[17:06] <popey_> Who is the best person to tell, when the software is broken? The person who made it.
[17:06] <popey_> ergo, their bug tracker
[17:07] <blackflow> just like with real hw laptops from teh orig example: the vendor is. vendors have agreements with distributors who have agreements with stores, to cover the warranty.
[17:07] <popey_> Ooh, it's the weekend. Time for beer
[17:07] <popey_> Cheerio!
[17:07] <daftykins> enjoy, sir \o
[17:07] <hggdh> popey_: cheers
[17:09] <blackflow> I never said that bugs should not be reported to vendors. I merely questioned the _place_ where such reports -- to vendors -- are made.
[17:10] <blackflow> if you're gonna force users to hunt down upstream trackers (which'd require registering and whatnot) -- good luck with people wanting to do that. I don't think I'm being unreasonalbe or hyperbolic with that statement.
[17:12] <daftykins> TJ-: wb, happy Friday \o
[17:14] <pragmaticenigma> TJ-: ready for weekend support?
[17:17] <hggdh> blackflow: no, not forcing users to hunt down. The sore could (as said before) enforce developers to clearly indicate where to get support
[17:19] <hggdh> s/sore/store/
[17:21] <daftykins> do any of you folks have contact with debian for bug reporting an upstream bug? apcupsd has a bad default parameter in the shipping .conf that causes IRQ error spamming
[17:21] <daftykins> i just installed buster in a VM to confirm - this stems from bug 1781016
[17:22] <tomreyn> you don't stricrly need 'contact with debian' for this, other than be able to send mail to bugs.debian.org
[17:22] <daftykins> well yeah i just figured it'd be a nice shortcut
[17:22] <tomreyn> making them send that e-mail? ;)
[17:23] <tomreyn> https://www.debian.org/Bugs/Reporting
[17:23] <daftykins> yes i'm on that page right now, which is what had me thinking email was an incorrect choice to begin with
[17:23] <tomreyn> there is no other way than e-mail AFAIK
[17:23] <tomreyn> reportbug also uses email
[17:24] <tomreyn> use an e-mail address you have good spam filters on
[17:24] <daftykins> nope i'm just not going to bother, then
[17:25] <tomreyn> or that ;)
[17:25] <daftykins> just seen how many are sat open against the package as it stands...
[17:25] <blackflow> daftykins: you can file for Ubuntu too, there's a section in the bug tracker for Debian as a distro for the package
[17:26] <daftykins> are you sure there'd be any point, given it just comes from upstream and a considering reply 23 on the above? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1781016/comments/23
[17:26] <pragmaticenigma> daftykins: whta is the work around? I'd love to remove those!
[17:26] <daftykins> -a
[17:26] <daftykins> remove what?
[17:27] <daftykins> it's already described on the above bug, commenting out the serial device line
[17:27] <daftykins> so essentially the default shipping config has USB and serial enabled out of the box, which isn't too smart
[17:27] <tomreyn> comment 23 is what's to be expected whenever you file a bug against a package imported from debian (which is not in main / restricted)
[17:28] <daftykins> yes but that doesn't answer to me whether there's anything to be gained by what blackflow suggested :)
[17:28] <tomreyn> true. in my experience such bug reports will just sit there.
[17:30] <blackflow> mine got resolved in a few hours today. both for ubuntu AND debian.
[17:30] <tomreyn> though there can be exceptions. such as when it's a security bug and the security team has some time to handle it beyond handling main + restricted (which does happen).
[17:30] <blackflow> they're very fast when the solution is EWONTFIX.
[17:31] <daftykins> that's why i'm very demoralised on bug reporting in general, pretty much everything i've ever had a hand in has sat for years
[17:32] <tomreyn> can't say this for myself.
[17:32] <lordcirth> I've had widely varying experiences on that front.
[17:32] <daftykins> well i'm sure you've done a lot more than me
[17:32] <lordcirth> from less than a day to never
[17:33] <tomreyn> ^ that's my experience, too.
[17:33] <lordcirth> There's also the intermediate "someone came by and set priority, area, bug type, etc" and then nothing
[17:35] <blackflow> I've had mixed results too.
[17:35] <daftykins> if i'm honest about the above i was embarrassed not to have spotted it myself, mind you
[17:35] <tomreyn> less than a day is really rare obviously. never is not uncommon. what's in main or restricted is usually handled sooner or later, though, depending (not only) on criticality + impact
[17:35] <lordcirth> Ah, I was talking about bugs in general, not Ubuntu or whatever specifically
[17:57] <blackflow> btw.... weird that default LTS ISO installer would install you non-LTS kernel.... just occured to me.
[17:59] <tomreyn> which one's that?
[18:00] <tomreyn> and which kernel did it install?
[18:02] <daftykins> yeah what do you mean? the 18.04.2 image will install 4.15 unless you specifically select HWE from the boot menu
[18:02] <OerHeks> blackflow, on vbox ..
[18:02] <blackflow> tomreyn: I got the HWE 4.18 one, fresh new installation of 18.04.2
[18:02] <blackflow> OerHeks: yeah, saw that lol
[18:03] <blackflow> daftykins: I did not select anything special
[18:04] <tomreyn> blackflow: so you got linux-image-generic-hwe-18.04 - which will track the latest HWE kernel image until 18.04 EOL
[18:05] <tomreyn> the kernel version + abi will change though, yes
[18:05] <blackflow> yup
[18:05] <blackflow> I was just surprised to see it installed by default. That and nvidia-driver.
[18:10] <daftykins> i thought you had to specifically pick HWE from both legacy and EFI boot methods, ah well
[18:11] <lotuspsychje> bionic has now default 4.18 kernel on iso from downloads
[18:11] <tomreyn> i think you have to on a d-i installation, not on ubiquity, not sure about subiquity
[18:11] <lotuspsychje> the one that boosted my ssd's :p
[18:12] <tomreyn> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/Support?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=18.04.x+Ubuntu+Kernel+Support+Schedule.svg
[18:13] <lotuspsychje> handy tomreyn tnx
[18:14] <tomreyn> even more so, showing how things changed twice since 14.04 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/Support#A14.04.x_Ubuntu_Kernel_Support
[18:14] <tomreyn> actually they changed once only :)
[18:17] <blackflow> lotuspsychje: oh btw... I saw no difference with my boot times aftre reinstalling .2 from scratch.
[18:23]  * daftykins installs from 18.04.1 media and sticks to the stock kernel if newer hardware support isn't needed
[18:23]  * blackflow is a sucker for latest and greatest.
[18:24] <daftykins> confessed version number chaser eh? :)
[18:25] <blackflow> yeppers.
[18:29] <tomreyn> two days ago, but i missed this update: https://twitter.com/ubuntu_sec/status/1149150094836396032
[18:34] <sarnold> blackflow: in a meeting.. more in a bit
[18:34] <blackflow> sarnold: np
[18:40] <blackflow> tomreyn: this about ZFS on 5.x kernels is what's worrying me wiht HWE... I'd rather stay with 4.15 then until 20.04 and 0.8.x ZFS which I think has the , or will have, regressions fixed.
[18:41] <lordcirth> If I don't run the latest of everything, how am I supposed to know everything I can by the time it's prod-ready? XD
[18:57] <sarnold> blackflow: so.. I'm personally afraid that the kernel devs removed the fpu symbols to set a lawsuit trap
[18:58] <sarnold> blackflow: one of the other distros put together a patch to reexport those symbols and it's my own opinion that canonical is too much of a lightning rod to use that patch
[18:59] <blackflow> sarnold: gentoo is for example, yes.
[18:59] <sarnold> thanks, yes, that's the patch :) I couldn't recall who did it
[18:59] <blackflow> but I doubt the kernel devs are doing this as lawsuit bait. afaik they're very vehemently against involving courts in GPL violations.
[19:00] <sarnold> I've seen enough comments over the years in support of harald welte's lawsuit that I have drawn a different conclusion there :)
[19:00] <blackflow> That the VMWare lawsuit?
[19:01] <blackflow> huh no, that's some other lawsuit.
[19:03] <blackflow> but anways, both GHK and Linus are against GPL lawsuits. I think this is just to mess with commerical vendors that'd use ZFS as they probably wouldn't want to risk anything. Methinks the devs hate ZFS.
[19:04] <blackflow> but I think ZFS is just gonna reinvent those functions through SPL. For now, as a quick patch, they just made ZFS buildable under 5.x, but I haven't been following the dev so close in the past month or two, so I don't know what's new there.
[19:05] <sarnold> oh I *know* the devs hate zfs :)
[19:08] <blackflow> shame. it's really the best FS in the whole ecosystem, for now. btrfs is barely a shadow to zfs, and bcachefs is a joke that'll take at least 10 year to reach ZFS grade maturity, if at all.
[19:09] <lordcirth> btrfs has, afaik, exactly two advantages over ZFS. Firstly, it's easier to install to a btrfs root than a ZFS root, but that's more a matter of distro support. Secondly, it deals well with mismatched drive sizes.
[19:09] <sarnold> a few weeks ago I saw a comment like, "if you want zfs to work fast, reimplement it with a clean license, and use our framework for snapshots, raid, etc" and .. the whole point of zfs is that it's just so much *better*
[19:09] <blackflow> lordcirth: those are advantages yes, but it's instability and buggyness drowns those out
[19:10] <blackflow> *its
[19:12] <blackflow> sarnold: that's never gonna happen. OpenZFS still wants it to be cross platform which demands it not depend on any kernel features (too much).
[19:12] <blackflow> which also shows how alien ZFS is in Linux. but eh...
[19:12] <sarnold> blackflow: heh, yeah.
[19:13] <sarnold> I *really* hope we can sort out something good before 20.04. It'd be a real shame if that's 20% the speed of 18.04 zfs and five times the CPU use..
[19:13] <blackflow> sarnold: back to DKMS and patching out GPL symbols :)
[19:14] <blackflow> that does not violate GPL.
[19:15] <sarnold> blackflow: yeah, that's true. that ought to be good. it's also more complicated and brittle :(
[19:17] <blackflow> hmmm, dunno, I've got a few debian machines with root on ZFS on LUKS too and those work flawlessly. In fact, I upgraded just today one of them to Buster, it went smooth and glitchless.
[19:19] <sarnold> I'm glad to hear that :) for my new laptop I've done the root on zfs on luks route and omg I'm glad for rlaager's excellent guide
[19:20] <sarnold> I made two typos in crypttab I think that took me *hours* to track down.
[19:20] <sarnold> and the whole time I was thinking "I should just do this over with ext4 like a normal person and not hate this choice in two years" :)
[19:20] <blackflow> heh. I got one step further, custom initramfs script for remote unlocking via SSH which also does optional rollback for rpool, should an upgrade bust boot.
[19:24] <sarnold> wow :)
[22:07] <TJ-> Is ZoL really that stable? 110 open defects currently
[22:11] <OerHeks> and benchmarks are not that great either https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=freebsd-zol-april&num=1
[22:44] <sarnold> doing good benchmarks is hard; there's so many conflicting results there that don't make sense to me that I'm inclined to write off the entire article as not very informative
[22:45] <sarnold> all those results showing ext4 *slower* than zfs are a cause for concern: I would want to know what about the workload lets that make sense.
[22:46] <TJ-> copy-on-write possibly
[22:59] <EriC^^> some folks will waste precious time of volunteers on a definition saying it's misleading and cause havoc as if world war 3 broke out cause of a wrong definition, maybe you should read more, here have fun https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/346425/what-is-the-difference-between-a-hard-link-and-a-file/346575#346575 "This leads to the statement that every directory entry is actually a hardlink, and that hardlinking a file just means to create a seco
[22:59] <EriC^^> nd (or third, or fourth...) hardlink. In fact, each inode stores a counter for the number of hardlinks to that inode." enjoy blackflow but please refrain from EVER speaking to me the way you did today or  in any manner what so EVER. i wont tolerate your actions and you've taken stuff too far for too long. be warned
[22:59] <EriC^^> tfeh
[23:44] <OerHeks> https://www.gamingonlinux.com/articles/ubuntu-lts-releases-and-so-derivatives-too-to-get-updated-nvidia-drivers-without-ppas.14557


[02:41] <vubuntor623> hello
[02:42] <vubuntor623> anyone there?
[16:09] <vubuntor511> co thang cho nao o day k
[16:10] <AppleCrab> weee


[09:58] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Planet:: Ubuntu Blog: Deploy and maintain applications with Charmed Operators @ https://ubuntu.com//blog/deploy-and-maintain-applications-with-charmed-operators
[23:19] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::OMG!Ubuntu:: How to Add a ‘Shake to Find Cursor’ Feature to Ubuntu @ https://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2022/01/shake-to-find-cursor-on-ubuntu (by Joey Sneddon)


[12:25] <mjg59> Did something like http://lkml.org/lkml/2005/3/11/96 get applied?
[12:26] <zul> lemme check
[12:26] <zul> no it conflicted with the pmac_pdisk patch
[12:27] <mjg59> Ok
[12:27] <mjg59> Can you do one that just adds device_shutdown() as the first line of the PM_DISK_PLATFORM case?
[12:27] <mjg59> (Context is that without doing that, we cut power to disks before their cache has been flushed)
[12:29] <zul> sure..
[12:30] <mjg59> So just before the local_irq_save() stuff
[12:30] <zul> so like this?
[12:30] <zul>   case PM_DISK_PLATFORM:
[12:30] <zul>                 device_shutdown();
[12:30] <zul>                 local_irq_save(flags);
[12:30] <zul>                 error = pm_ops->enter(PM_SUSPEND_DISK);
[12:30] <zul>                 local_irq_restore(flags);
[12:31] <zul>                 break;
[12:33] <zul> brb
[12:37] <mjg59> Yup, that's perfect
[12:38] <zul> cool
[12:41] <mjg59> Hm. I may have this ACPI issue sidestepped.
[12:42] <zul> what acpi issue?
[12:46] <mjg59> kacpid taking all CPU time after resume from disk.
[12:47] <zul> ah ok
[12:55] <zul> mjg59: done
[01:11] <mjg59> zul: Rocking, thanks!
[01:12] <zul> np
[01:15] <dilinger> mjg59: is that related to the 0xff-after-resume problem you were having?
[01:17] <mjg59> dilinger: Nope
[01:17] <mjg59> I haven't tracked that one down yet
[03:47] <calc> update the ipw2200 driver too :)
[03:47] <calc> the one from dec doesn't work on amd64
[03:48] <zul> it was a rhetorical debate i wasnt actually going to update it
[03:48] <calc> oh :\
[03:51] <zul> fabbione: i dont think im going to make any changes to my tree so you should be able to pull it in now
[04:01] <zul> later
[04:02] <crimsun> later
[05:39] <fabbione> morning
[06:21] <fabbione> mjg59: still around?
[06:23] <fabbione> 3
[06:28] <fabbione> mjg59:
[06:28] <fabbione>   * s/CONFIG_pm/CONFIG_PM/g :
[06:28] <fabbione>     Update uninorth-agp-ppc-suspend.dpatch
[06:29] <fabbione> otherwise you don't get to build it at all :-)
[12:23] <mjg59> fabbione: Ugh. Yeah.
[12:27] <fabbione> i applied also the other patches you submitted to zul
[12:27] <fabbione> they will be in for -29
[02:21] <mjg59> fabbione: Rocking
[02:52] <zul> hey
[02:53] <zul> fabbione: the config_pm was my bad
[03:22] <mjg59> fabbione: So we're expecting -29 on Wedensday or so?
[03:51] <zul> am at meeting bbl
[04:18] <fabbione> re
[04:18] <fabbione> zul: ok.. doesn't matter.
[04:18] <fabbione> anytime tomorrow...
[04:18] <fabbione> mjg59: ^
[04:19] <fabbione> after 15:00 UTC
[04:54] <mjg59> Rock
[05:37] <svenl> fabbione: BTW, the 2.6.10 marvell gige patch worked fine on a gentoo kernel, so i wonder if there is some ubuntu-specific breakage that this causes ?
[05:40] <mjg59> svenl: What's the failure mode?
[05:40] <svenl> mjg59: failure mode ?
[05:40] <mjg59> In what way does it not work on the ubuntu kernel?
[05:40] <svenl> mjg59: wait, i need to re-image the partition to check.
[05:41] <svenl> mjg59: the module loads, the interface comes up, but you can't communicate through it.
[05:41] <mjg59> Do you get interrupts?
[05:41] <svenl> didn't check.
[05:41] <mjg59> Right. Interrupt routing is the most likely issue.
[05:41] <svenl> i will reimage the partition, and give it a try.
[05:42] <svenl> may well be that this is the issue.
[05:43] <svenl> mjg59: thanks.
[06:44] <zul> wow...that was a fun meeting...not
[07:20] <zul> hey T-Bone
[07:20] <T-Bone> howdy
[07:20] <zul> how is it going?
[07:24] <T-Bone> ermm. "couci couca" i would say in french ;P
[07:24] <zul> been better?
[07:25] <T-Bone> yeah
[07:26] <T-Bone> but it should getter better soon. I've decided to take a few non paid vacation days to unplug and "reset the hardware"
[07:26] <T-Bone> but it should getter better soon. I've decided to take a few non paid vacation days to unplug and "reset the hardware"
[07:27] <T-Bone> oops
[07:27] <T-Bone> that should have been "going to ski in the french alps between Mar 25 and Mar 29"
[07:30] <zul> cool...right before release ;)
[07:34] <T-Bone> yeah
[07:35] <T-Bone> i'm used to "run on D day" thing ;)
[07:35] <T-Bone> been pretty good at it
[08:21] <zul> fabbione: what do you want to do about the dell perc stuff?
[08:26] <zul> fabbione: never mnid
[08:28] <T-Bone> zul: i assume he didn't, anyway 8))
[08:29] <T-Bone> lol
[08:48] <zul> hah im not going crazy
hmm. Does anyone remembers what's the max number of files per directory on Linux?
[09:18] <T-Bone> (ext3)
[09:19] <T-Bone> hmm. nm, found the proc file where that value is
[09:20] <mjg59> Isn't that the maximum number of open files, not the maximum number of files per directory?
[09:21] <T-Bone> indeed
[09:21] <T-Bone> looks like i'm being confused
[10:12] <zul> right im heading home


[01:41] <Nethernet> is there any way to translate the stuff in dmesg to dates/times?
[02:03] <Ries> Overand: dmesg only happesn when the kernel starts?
[02:05] <Overand> hm
[02:05] <Overand> no
[02:05] <Overand> but
[02:05] <Overand> change of topic-
[02:05] <Overand> I'm having what I *think* are power management issues
[02:05] <Overand> are there any daemons i should be checkjugn?
[02:06] <Overand> i didn't see apmd running
[02:08] <infinity> apmd shouldn't be running on a server system, that's for sure.
[02:08] <infinity> (It's not running in our default desktop install either, for that matter)
[02:08] <infinity> What are the power management issues you think you're seeing?
[02:11] <Overand> the system is waiting to get colocated, at a friends house
[02:11] <Overand> and it's been going unreachable
[02:11] <Overand> and he can't ssh in
[02:11] <Overand> from inside the lan
[02:11] <Overand> and i can't do anything from outside
[02:12] <Overand> so hey grabs the keyboard to bring up a local console
[02:12] <Overand> and all of a sudden... everything works again
[02:12] <infinity> Sketchy...
[02:12] <Overand> yeah
[02:12] <Overand> we'd *just* gotten done stress-testing, too
[02:12] <infinity> None of the nwtwork drivers should be powering down the cards, EVER.
[02:13] <Overand> and were ready to colocate this stuff
[02:13] <Overand> well it's aTyan GT20 (S2865)
[02:13] <infinity> In fact, NICs are one of the few things that stay on even when a machine's asleep.
[02:13] <Overand> which uses some broadcom card and an nividia one
[02:13] <Overand> and we're *not* using the nvidia one
[02:13] <Overand> =]
[02:14] <infinity> Was this a server install, or a desktop install?
[02:14] <Overand> server
[02:14] <Overand> but- it was one of the RCs
[02:14] <Overand> that being said,it's vbeen updated
[02:14] <Overand> latest kernel,etc
[02:14] <infinity> Yeah, RC makes no difference if you've been updating.
[02:14] <Overand> well, latest *pacakged* kernel
[02:15] <Overand> ... packaged
[02:15] <Overand> it's AMD64 though
[02:15] <Overand> THis is waytoo weird of an issue
[02:15] <infinity> Which also makes no difference.
[02:15] <Overand> theoretically
[02:15] <Overand> just saying the drivers may be less mature in some cases
[02:15] <infinity> Not generally, no.
[02:15] <Overand> OK
[02:16] <infinity> There are a few weird issues if you run the i386 dist on amd64 hardware, but amd64-on-amd64 is quite solid.
[02:16] <Overand> yeah, i've had no problems at all
[02:16] <Overand> the system was stable for ages
[02:16] <Overand> i can't track down *when* it freaked out
[02:17] <infinity> When he hits the console, I assume the machine responds instantly?... ie: It hasn't actually put itself to sleep, doesn't do a resume cycle, etc?
[02:17] <Overand> it miiiight have been after a kernel upgrade
[02:17] <Overand> asking him
[02:17] <Overand> I might just drag his ass in here, heh
[02:18] <Overand> I'm better with ubuntu and linux in general, and slightly better with hardware, but he's OK.
[02:18] <Overand> well it's alive now
[02:18] <Overand> so i'm having him set aside the keyboard, and leave the monitor on, and we'll see if it fires down
[02:18] <Overand> I had him check the BIOS for weird config issues- nothing
[02:19] <Overand> he says the monitor doesn't fire itself down
[02:20] <Overand> k- no delay
[02:21] <infinity> Okay, so it's almost certainly not a power management thing, unless we broke the tg3 driver (we didn't) to recently start powering down NICs just for fun.
[02:23] <Overand> I'm hoping it's not hardware
[02:24] <Overand> he's gonna try a fresh install
[02:24] <Zambezi> I can find anyone who can help me with rtorrent in #ubuntu. Can anyone here help me? Cause server is without X and rtorrent runs without X, so probably somebody here knows.
[02:25] <Overand> Zambezi: there are some nicePHP base torrent clients
[02:25] <Overand> great for allowing people to get *nix ISOs and whatnot
[02:25] <Overand> very cool stuff- can't remember app napes
[02:25] <Overand> ah- torrentflux
[02:25] <Overand> check that out
[02:25] <Zambezi> Overand, But I would like to use rtorrent. But the applications isn't find in Breezy.
[02:26] <Overand> did you check in universe and multiverse?
[02:26] <Zambezi> Overand, And a packages I need doesn't work in Dapper.  I need Edgy now!
[02:26] <Overand> yeah- it's out there
[02:26] <Overand> i see it in dapper
[02:27] <Zambezi> Overand, I checked the packagesite on Linux. And rtorrent is only found in Dapper.
[02:28] <Overand> Zambezi: misread you re: dapper
[02:28] <Overand> what packagedoesn't work in dapper?
[02:28] <Overand> just curious
[02:29] <Zambezi> Overand, It's an external packages.
[02:29] <Overand> ok
[02:30] <Zambezi> And I'm starting to freak out if I can't solve this problem. :-(
[11:42] <Overand> ugh
[11:42] <Overand> so that machine I was having hte 'power management' problem with seems dead again.
[11:42] <Overand> I'm tempted to blame the issues on the 'router' it's behind- consumer NAT.
[01:24] <omarkj> Good day.
[11:05] <nihilocrat> helloooo
[11:05] <nihilocrat> I was just wondering if the LAMP server install option has any sort of accelerator pre-installed
[11:06] <nihilocrat> or various parts of the php and apache config pre-tuned to work best for a LAMP setup
[11:15] <Ries> nihilocrat: I just compile eAccelerator from scratch.... works on of the box


[02:31] <misc--> hi there.... I have the latest stable lubuntu (15.04) and followed the instructions on the lubuntu lxqt wiki to install lxqt. It installed fine but when I log out, I don't see the LXQT option to log in with. Is there something extra I need to do?
[02:31] <misc--> 15.10 I mean
[04:10] <bq> how to save/restore X session on lubuntu?
[04:10] <bq> can't find anywhere
[14:31] <lopta> In Synaptic, if I mark sylpheed for removal it wants to remove the lubuntu-desktop. Is there no clean way to remove this?
[14:31] <teward> lopta: lubuntu-desktop is a metapackage
[14:32] <teward> it refers to all the other packages that get default installed on the Lubuntu image, I believe.
[14:32] <teward> remove something that's autoinstalled by that, it pulls the lubuntu-desktop metapackage, but the rest remains installed
[14:32] <teward> (may impact future version upgrading if you try and upgrade in place though and don't have that metapackage)
[14:32] <lopta> So removing it won't break the desktop?
[14:32] <teward> It shouldn't, no, but it may impact your ability to cleanly upgrade to a newer version if you try and upgrade in place
[14:33] <teward> if that's the only thing getting removed, then it won't, but if it tries to pull out lxde core or something, then you'll break it
[14:46] <lopta> If I were deploying this to a fleet of desktops, could I script the package removals?
[14:54] <lopta> This is the first time in recent years that I've tried lubuntu. I like it.
[16:12] <freddylisbon> The Lubuntu wiki says it is Ubuntu with lighter desktop (KDE?), and does not include some intensive pre-installed apps.  Is there a detailed comparison somewhere on the differences?
[16:19] <teward> freddylisbon: LXDE, not KDE
[16:19] <teward> (KDE's not lighter :O)
[16:19] <teward> :P*
[16:41] <diffis> freddylisbon: What do you mean by 'differences'? Pre-installed applications, package list, system requirements or something else?
[18:37] <freddylisbon> pre-installed apps & package list (LXDE!, thank you)
[18:42] <Vlado2> hi all
[18:42] <Vlado2> i'm trying lubuntu xenial daily build and i found a bug
[18:43] <Vlado2> ubiquity is broken when trying to create encrypted partitions
[18:44] <Vlado2> Bug #1490824
[19:42] <diffis> freddylisbon: For packages, see http://askubuntu.com/questions/50077/how-to-get-a-list-of-preinstalled-packages For example lubuntu 14.04 64 bit http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/lubuntu/releases/14.04/release/lubuntu-14.04-desktop-amd64.manifest
[21:10] <freddylisbon> Diffis: thank you!


[02:47] <asarch> What is the name of software center binary?
[02:47] <asarch> In Ubutun is "software-center"
[02:49] <Andrio> apt
[02:50] <asarch> I mean, the same for the graphical environment
[02:50] <asarch> I need to reconfigure the mirror for the repository
[02:50] <asarch> And this is a blind system
[02:50] <asarch> So I can ssh -X to it
[02:51] <asarch> But I need the name of the binary file
[02:51] <asarch> In order to configure the mirror address (to pick the best one)
[02:53] <asarch> The name of the app you can find in: Applications->System->Software Sources
[02:54] <asarch> (Its binary file name)
[02:54] <krytarik> "software-properties-gtk"
[02:55] <asarch> Thank you krytarik
[02:55] <asarch> Thank you very much :-)
[02:55] <krytarik> Sure.
[10:00] <natsu> hello?
[10:02] <fiet> \o
[12:49] <dipnlik> hi, anyone has tips on how to tile windows in a 66/33 split instead of 50/50?
[14:43] <crond> Hi, should I be concerned about the script I ran to test if my system was vulnerabole to meltdown/spectre saying it still is, even after I've done all updates?
[19:21] <cicdc> Does anybody know what happened to xfce4-hamster-plugin in 17.10? It seems it's no longer in the 'Extras' PPA
[22:42] <Unit193> cicdc: You used it?  Huh.  Well there seemed to be very little interest, so we let it fade away.
[22:42] <cicdc> :(
[22:43] <Unit193> crond: I presume you ran spectre-meltdown-checker?  Meltdown should be addressed, but Spectre isn't really.
[22:43] <cicdc> Well I'll try the old fashion way and build from source
[22:43] <cicdc> Thanks for the info
[22:44] <Unit193> https://code.launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/+git/xfce4-hamster-plugin the packaging is all still there.
[22:52] <crond> Unit193, yeah
[22:53] <Unit193> You on 32bit?
[22:54] <crond> No, 64bit
[22:55] <crond> Linux 4.13.0-32-generic #35-Ubuntu SMP Thu Jan 25 09:13:46 UTC 2018
[22:56] <crond> > STATUS:  VULNERABLE  (IBRS hardware + kernel support OR kernel with retpoline are needed to mitigate the vulnerability)
[22:56] <Unit193> That's spectre.
[22:56] <crond> Looks like 1 & 3 are not vulnerable, but 2 is.
[22:57] <Unit193> Expected.
[22:57] <crond> Anything I can do, or am I waiting on a BIOS update from Dell or CPU microcode or something?
[22:58] <Unit193> That, or compiler updates and everything recompiled.
[22:58] <crond> so basically it's all upstream one way or the other, i.e. nothing else I can do at the moment
[22:58] <Unit193> Pretty much, yeah.  Intel had a microcode update, but it caused issues.
[22:59] <crond> yeah I heard about that, but had never applied it to this machine
[22:59] <crond> well, I don't even know if it was pushed out for Linux in any case
[23:00] <Unit193> (It was, Debian updated, then reverted because of the issues and recall.)
[23:01] <crond>  Ah okay
[23:01] <crond> guess I'm waiting on Intel then, 2 of 3 are patched, nothing else to be done at the moment
[23:02] <crond> thanks Unit193
[23:02] <Unit193> Sure thing.


[12:45] <elfy> if anyone with access to the tracker happens to notice this over the weekend - the upgrade tests for Vivid Final are pointing to 20150416 instead of 17.1
[14:19] <cjwatson> elfy: Upgrade tests are usually set to refer to a date rather than an image, since upgrading is about the state of the archive not the state of images.
[14:26] <elfy> cjwatson: ok cool - thanks


[17:28] <bobnvic> Hello!  Running Kubuntu 10.04 LTS on my slave backend with self-compiled 0.24-fixes and decided to switch to mythbuntu packages.  mythfrontend/backend work fine, however mythbuntu-control-centre has issues and I can't install mythplugins because of it.  I get a dbus exception error - not authorized.  Is there a way to install the plugins using the command line?
[18:12] <tgm4883> bobnvic, you can use apt-get, aptitude, synaptic, software centre
[18:19] <bobnvic> tgm4883, thanks, didn't think to check for something as simple as package names like mythvideo.


[04:52] -ubottu:#ubuntu-news- ::planet:: Ubuntu Blog: Canonical’s recipe for High Performance Computing @ https://ubuntu.com//blog/canonicals-recipe-for-high-performance-computing
[04:52] -ubottu:#ubuntu-news- ::planet:: Simos Xenitellis: How to install and use Puppeteer in an Incus container @ https://blog.simos.info/how-to-install-and-use-puppeteer-in-an-incus-container/
[18:31] -ubottu:#ubuntu-news- ::omg!ubuntu:: Linux Mint 21.3 Edge ISO Offers Newer Hardware Support @ https://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2024/01/linux-mint-21-3-edge-iso-newer-linux-kernel
[18:58] -ubottu:#ubuntu-news- ::portugal:: E283 Dia Da Protecção De Dados E Privacidade @ https://podcastubuntuportugal.org/e283/
[23:39] <tsimonq2> https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/ubucon-north-america-2024-meeting-20240125/41903
[23:39] <tsimonq2> :)


[00:06] <N0Lif3> going dual-monitor in Kubuntu on my laptop is hella wonky.
[00:07] <N0Lif3> I connected my laptop to my TV via HDMI and it rightfully showed up as a secondary monitor. Then I tried to close the lid on my laptop (with it set to just turn off the screen when you do that) and it turned off the external screen as well
[00:08] <N0Lif3> so then I set it to "do nothing" when I close the lid and it finally worked as intentioned, but then the screen on my laptop stayed shut off and now it can't dual-monitor at all.
[00:08] <N0Lif3> When I plug in HDMI, the screen on my laptop turns off completely and only projects to my tv via hdmi
[00:10] <charlie__> holla
[00:10] <N0Lif3> holler
[00:11] <charlie__> I've one question...
[00:12] <charlie__> is someone using minergate
[00:29] <oceanquake> Hey all.  I just installed 14.04.5 and updated the system.  The machine has an older nvidia chipset and nouveau was showing a lot of artifacts, so I followed the standard prompts/helpers to enable the binary drivers.  Upon rebooting, I can see that the nvidia module and x server load, but opengl support is not properly working.  KInfocenter gives "Could not initialize OpenGL" and glxinfo gives "Failed request".  What should I do here to get
[00:29] <oceanquake> OpenGL working with the proprietary nvidia driver?  The OpenGL ICD and related packages appear to be installed.
[01:35] <OutOfSpace> what is the difference between ubuntu and kubuntu
[01:35] <OutOfSpace> is it the graphic environment
[01:35] <OutOfSpace> KDE vs Gnome ?
[01:35] <sintre> yes kde
[02:25] <cjwelborn> I cannot make the `atari800` package, which is not installed, show up with `dpkg -l` or `dpkg -s`. I'm testing out a helper script with an uninstalled package, and for some reason `apt-cache show` will find it, but `dpkg -l atari800` won't. Even with the glob star `atari800\*`.
[02:26] <cjwelborn> How does apt, apt-cache, and any apt* command know about this package, but not `dpkg`?
[04:17] <valorie> cjwelborn: dpkg (I think) knows about what is on your own box
[04:17] <valorie> whereas apt goes looking for what else is available
[04:18] <valorie> but look at man dpkg
[04:39] <user|5481> Hy, I have an issue with kubuntu, I had an app freezing so I thought of killing that task. I pressed Alt + PrtScr + K instead of F, and that killed display server. Then I panicked and executed REISUB, now many of the app icons are missing and GUI is very glitchy. I am on 16.04.1 with all latest updates installed. Is there a way to fix the empty ico
[04:39] <user|5481> ns?
[04:42] <valorie> user|5481: you might try sudo dpkg --configure a (or -a)
[04:42] <DarinMiller> user|5481: try toggling between icon sets in the System Settings menu.
[04:43] <valorie> can't remember if you need the single dash
[04:43] <valorie> oh, that's easier
[04:43] <valorie> good thought, DarinMiller
[04:43] <DarinMiller> hi valorie :)
[04:44] <valorie> how are you this fine Solstice night
[04:44] <valorie> first day of winter here
[04:44] <DarinMiller> I am quite fine.  How are you?  Cold day in Seattle?
[04:45] <valorie> it's warmed up a bit and was sunny today!
[04:45] <valorie> I went out and raked leaves
[04:45] <valorie> you?
[04:46] <user|5481> sudo dpkg --configure -a and toggling icon sets didn't work :P
[04:46] <DarinMiller> 11degs here.  One more day of work before a 3 day weekend.
[04:46] <valorie> nice
[04:48] <DarinMiller> user|5481: try changing icons in the sys setting menu and restart plasma: killall plasmashell && plasmashell &
[04:50] <user|5481> WOW it worked!
[04:50] <user|5481> Thanks @DarinMiller
[04:50] <DarinMiller> cool.  You can change back if you want and restart plasmashell again. :)
[04:50] <sintre> darin saves day again :)
[04:51] <sintre> btw how yea ya doing tonight
[04:51] <DarinMiller> hey, sintre.  I am quite fine and you?
[04:52]  * DarinMiller is a little sleepy after last night-not planning on staying up as late tonight... one more day of work.
[04:52] <sintre> good , watching how to wrap present videos on utube lol
[04:52] <sintre> only have 5 i got wrap by hand
[04:52] <sintre> pain lol
[04:52] <sintre> gotta go by tape and evrything
[04:52] <sintre> no /sudo apt wrap presents
[04:53]  * DarinMiller let's his wife do all the painful stuff...
[04:54] <DarinMiller> LOL
[06:23] <grek> hi anyone know how i can setud hdd in android media center (have 4TB hdd) for sharing between android aps and home network - linux dekstops ,
[06:24] <grek> i install ftps serwer and cloud sync and everythink work but - files created by ftp have ftp permissions, cloud app - have own files
[06:24] <grek> android like i see have every app as user
[06:25] <grek> so files is 755 so is not writable if created in other app - i crfeate ext3 partitions format
[06:25] <grek> on this hdd
[06:31] <valorie> sorry, not really a Kubuntu issue
[07:25] <cmsadmin_> hi
[07:25] <hateball> Greetings
[09:55] <prabhakar> hey guys!
[10:05] <lordievader> o/
[10:30] <momken> Hello
[10:31] <momken> Currently I am using Kubuntu and have customized it to its full level to satisfy my needs
[10:31] <momken> But now I want to install Xfce and i3wm on the same system to compare them with KDE as my final step
[10:32] <momken> 1. How could I install a full xfce/i3wm desktop on my current Kubuntu
[10:32] <soee> !info xfce-desktop
[10:32] <momken> 2. If I install xfce, would it become my default desktop then? I don't want it to be
[10:32] <soee> https://wiki.debian.org/Xfce
[10:33] <momken> I only want to test it, but I want my login screen and my default desktop remain KDE
[10:33] <soee> it will probably add option to pick session in login manager
[10:33] <momken> ubottu: I am using 16.04
[10:34] <momken> soee: I know xfce can use "lightdm" as its login manager. I fear after installing xfce, lightdm become my login manager, which I don't want to
[10:37] <lordievader> !info i3
[10:38] <lordievader> That package adds only the option of i3 to the sddm menu.
[11:46] <yossarianuk>  hi everyone - I've just been given a macbookpro (work was throwing it out) from 2013 era (I think) - although I used to have experience of dual booting Linux and Windows about a decade ago (i stoped using windows then) what is the most current info for dual booting Mac OSX and Linux ?
[11:47] <yossarianuk> i.e can I just shrink existing mac partition and install as normal ?
[11:51] <chr1s> yossarianuk: these days there is way more advantage to running one of the OS in a VM inside the other OS
[11:52] <chr1s> I don't use Mac but I'm aware of Parallels and VMWare Fusion as possible solutions if you want to go that route
[12:06] <yossarianuk> chr1s: Well I run Linux generally, I would never ever pay for Mac, just thought I would leave OSX and dual boot so I could check it out..
[12:07] <yossarianuk> and for desktops its generally a better experience to boot from baremetal rather than a vm..
[12:08] <R13ose> How do I get my wireless to show up.  I believe this on but is not allowing me to connect to the wireless networks.
[12:09] <chr1s> fair enough though I'd disagree on the experience side if you're likely to be using more than 1 OS. I much prefer having both OS available all the time and the ability to snapshot and rollback in case of a crash
[12:10] <yossarianuk> chr1s: you can always do that with LVM/BTRFS - GPU speed is always slower - unless you use KVM and passthhrough.
[12:12] <chr1s> there's a difference between snapshoting a file system and snapshotting the state of an entire running machine, plus moving to a new machine when your old one needs to be replaced is way easier, plus backups are much easier
[12:13] <chr1s> are there still some negatives? yes like GPU that you mentioned but mostly positive in my opinion. Anyway your choice, this is a channel for Kubuntu not the merits of VMs so I'll stop there :)
[12:14] <yossarianuk> sure I do under the advantages, however personally I would argue for desktop the GPU issue is reason to avoid vms for desktops - i'm fed up reading reviews of distros when the reviewer complains about GPU issues/slowness when they are running in a VM (which they wouldn't have had the issues installing on metal)
[12:14] <yossarianuk> *undersnd*
[12:14] <yossarianuk> *understand*
[12:16] <chr1s> ultimately it depends what you want to do with your machine and as I'm not a mac user either I can't comment on dual boot but I'd guess shrinking the disk would be the way to go
[12:27] <R13ose> Any thoughts on my question?
[12:34] <ibispi> R13ose: i'm somewhat new to ubuntu and such but have you tried to go to the "Network Connections" window and clicked the "Add" button? there should be a wi-fi option
[12:35] <R13ose> ibispi: yes and it is already there
[12:35] <ibispi> hmm
[12:37] <ibispi> R13ose: try something from this page maybe https://help.ubuntu.com/stable/ubuntu-help/net-wireless-troubleshooting.html
[12:37] <ibispi> (if you haven't already)
[12:40] <R13ose> ibispi: too confusing
[12:41] <ibispi> :s
[12:42] <ibispi> i don't know, really, sorry i tried to help to the best of my ability :c
[12:43] <R13ose> Thanks
[12:43] <ibispi> maybe someone else knows more about this in the chat
[12:44] <ibispi> there's one more ubuntu dedicated irc channel btw
[12:44] <ibispi> it's on freenode  #ubuntu
[12:45] <R13ose> True
[12:45] <ibispi> i mean you can ask there if you haven't
[12:46] <chr1s> R13ose: have you tried any of the steps suggested on the troubleshooting page?
[12:46] <chr1s> or not yet
[12:47] <fragensteller> Hello. Is there any way to use KDE 4 instead of KDE 5 in Kubuntu 16.04?
[12:48] <R13ose> chr1s: not yet
[12:49] <ibispi> R13ose: do you have to connect to a wireless signal right? i've never connected to it via a computer but i know that when you do this via a phone  you have to type in a password sometimes
[12:49] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[12:50] <R13ose> ibispi: I have done that before so should connect automatically
 @fragensteller, short of compiling it all yourself, no
[12:50] <ibispi> hmm, so you've done this already on this ubuntu installation? R13ose
[12:50] <ibispi> like on this system
[12:51] <ibispi> it worked before?
[12:51] <R13ose> ibispi: yes but from where I am, wireless not working
[12:51] <ibispi> hmm weird
[12:51] <ibispi> have you tried restarting the computer? :D
[12:51] <ibispi> idk
[12:52] <R13ose> Yes
[12:52] <ibispi> ok :s
[12:55] <ibispi> i asked on freenode's #ubuntu channel about your problem maybe someone there can help
[12:55] <BluesKaj> R13ose, have you mentioned that yiur crossposting in another chat and you haven't mentioned that your using wicd instead of NM
[12:55] <chr1s> R13ose: are you sure the wifi router is working (can you connect to it with another device)?
[12:56] <R13ose> I didn't know the channels were related sorry
[12:56] <R13ose> chr1s: if I am closer I can connect
[12:56] <R13ose> I want to use NM.
[12:57] <BluesKaj> the point is you haven't given all the required info to the people here. R13ose
[12:58] <R13ose> Sorry.  I will from now on.
[12:58] <ibispi> R13ose: question from freenode:  is  the wifi is connected to the wifi AP?
[12:58] <R13ose> How do I switch from wcid to nm?
[12:59] <R13ose> ibispi: how to check?
[12:59] <BluesKaj> do what the guy in #kde told you to , that long command he posted
[13:01] <ibispi> R13ose: if iwconfig show you the SSID name, you'r connected (that's what the guy from freenode said)
[13:01] <ibispi> so type  iwconfig  in your terminal
[13:03] <R13ose> ibispi: nope not showing the wireless name
[13:03] <chr1s> R13ose, if it connects when you get closer then everything is working, the issue is that something is interfering with the signal
[13:03] <ibispi> yeah that's what i was also thinking
[13:04] <R13ose> chr1s: yet others can connect from farer away
[13:04] <ibispi> maybe it's the thing that receives the connection is not as good at it as other devices
[13:04] <ibispi> idk
[13:04] <chr1s> R13ose: different wifi cards are more or less sensitive
[13:05] <R13ose> chr1s: nothing I can do?
[13:05] <chr1s> you can try to improve the signal by working out what may be interfering, moving the access point / computer closer to each other or perhaps finding a different wifi channel that gives better reception
[13:06] <chr1s> you're unlikely to solve it with some magic from us
[13:07] <R13ose> chr1s: I know
[13:08] <ibispi> R13ose: what caused this problem to appear
[13:08] <ibispi> R13ose: like was there anything you did related to the connection that happened beforehand
[13:09] <BuddyButterfly> hi
[13:09] <R13ose> ibispi: not that I know of
[13:09] <BuddyButterfly> how will dpkg behave if purging packets that are in rc state but a later packages is installed which is using same config files?
[13:09] <ibispi> R13ose: so it just randomly stopped working one day
[13:09] <ibispi> ?
[13:10] <R13ose> From thr current location yes
[13:10] <ibispi> what do you mean from the current location? do you change the locations?
[13:10] <ibispi> because that would be the cause i guess
[13:11] <R13ose> ibispi: no change.
[13:11] <ibispi> oh ok
[13:16] <chr1s> R13ose: most likely something new in your environment (microwaves interfere badly with wifi for example but that would only be while it was actually microwaving)
[13:16] <chr1s> could be a neighbour got a new device which is interfering
[13:17] <chr1s> try to check if another wifi router is transmitting on the same channel as you
[13:18] <R13ose> chr1s: how?
[13:23] <chr1s> do a scan for access points and see what comes up and on what channel
[13:24] <chr1s> your wifi router might have a feature to do that (and it has more powerful antennas so will spot more)
[13:24] <chr1s> otherwise you can do it with your wifi card
[13:40] <R13ose> chr1s: how to do this with wifi?
[13:52] <chr1s> R13ose: use the iwlist command to scan your environment and show all wifi points and associated channel
[13:53] <chr1s> something like iwlist wlan0 scan
[13:53] <chr1s> replace wlan0 with your wifi adapter device name
[13:56] <R13ose> chr1s: no results
[14:00] <Yaiyan> Is it possible to find anywhere the level of scaling KDE's applying?
[14:01] <Yaiyan> Since whilst the settings are claiming the scaling factor is only 1, my interface is clearly being scaled much higher than that
[14:06] <chr1s> R13ose: if you can't see any other access points then it might be something else harder to track down like other transmissions, sources of water, walls, basically wifi signals are pretty weak and easily interfered with :(
[14:06] <R13ose> chr1s: I see a bunch when I am close to ap
[14:07] <Yaiyan> Since a picture is worth 1000 words: http://i.imgur.com/zL9SI36.jpg
[14:07] <Yaiyan> Opening that picture in chrome, on 100% zoom, also requires a lot of scrolling up/down to see the whole thing
[14:07] <chr1s> R13ose: are any of them on the same channel as you?
[14:08] <chr1s> or an overlapping channel
[14:09] <R13ose> chr1s: not sure of the channel I am on
[14:18] <chr1s> it'll be whatever your access point is on in the list you just got from iwlist :)
[14:20] <R13ose> chr1s: the one I want is on channel 11
[14:21] <R13ose> or 149
[14:32] <chr1s> 149?
[14:32] <R13ose> Yep
[14:34] <chr1s> using 80211ac? Don't remember how many channels it has but 149 still sounds like a lot
[14:35] <chr1s> ok so 1 possibility, do you change from using wifi b/g/n to using wifi ac recently?
[14:37] <chr1s> ac runs in 5GHz instead of b/g/n in 2.4GHz, basically it has a shorter range
[14:38] <chr1s> (technically n can run in 5GHz as well)
[14:39] <R13ose> chr1s: I know.  I don't think I changed.  Says 802.11 when I do sudo lshw -c network
[14:40] <chr1s> ok, assuming it's an interference problem, check if any of the other networks are running on an overlapping band
[14:40] <chr1s> for b/g/n that would be channels between 7 and 14
[14:41] <chr1s> I don't use 802.11ac so not sure what channels overlap there (but it should be much less)
[14:41] <R13ose> chr1s: 6, 11, 149, 6
[14:42] <chr1s> ok so 2 access points using channel 6, 1 using 11 (yours) and one on 149 (yours)?
[14:43] <R13ose> chr1s: the wireless network I want to use yes
[14:44] <chr1s> not sure I understand, all of those were yours?
[14:44] <R13ose> I am not sure what you mean
[14:44] <chr1s> you need to check all the access points you can see from your scans (you said you could see several access points when you are near your router)
[14:45] <chr1s> check that none of them are using a channel that overlaps your channels
[14:46] <R13ose> chr1s: isn't sudo iwlist scanning showing me APs?
[14:46] <chr1s> yes, exactly that. it shows all the APs that you can see
[14:46] <chr1s> so nothing overlaps
[14:46] <chr1s> sorry, i'm out of ideas other than something in your environment that we can't easily isolate / detect with your operating system
[14:48] <chr1s> for example, at home in my living room I can happily connect with my laptop to a router in the office via wifi, a machine sitting under the tv a couple of metres away from me struggles
[14:48] <R13ose> Okay, why is that?
[14:49] <R13ose> chr1s: if others can connect could be this computer
[14:49] <chr1s> usually it's good enough, it just drops a few packets but as soon as some other radio source is turned on the connection is completely lossed
[14:49] <chr1s> exactly, a combination of different network card, slightly different position in the room
[14:50] <R13ose> Okay
[14:50] <chr1s> basically wifi is a very poor networking technology because it has to complete with all of the other radio technologies that use the same band plus the band used is easily stopped by concrete, water and many other things
[14:50] <R13ose> I am rebooting
[14:50] <chr1s> maybe you can reposition the router a little bit to help it
[15:22] <R13ose> chr1s: I am up and running with wireless.  The only problem is I can't use this from my room.
[15:23] <chr1s> R13ose: good to know that you are connected
[15:23] <chr1s> shame you don't have coverage where you want it
[15:24] <chr1s> you might find that certain areas in the room have coverage and others don't (like my example with my living room) so worth trying a few spots
[15:25] <R13ose> chr1s: anyway to make laptop have stronger signal?
[15:25] <chr1s> alternatively look at an external wifi card for your machine, possibly one which will accept an antenna to help capture the signal
[15:26] <chr1s> another option is to use another router to capture the signal (their radios are stronger than wifi client cards) and have it function as a repeater or connect a cable to that
[15:26] <user|31741> Hello developers, i have a problem with kmail. In summary cannot sorting by date  https://www.filepicker.io/api/file/gU3DnijZSvqtz0y8GWv6?signature=4c4cf83e3c129fd059cdfcf614e2c8861c34e3250805bb752338ac6fe9446d0d&policy=eyJleHBpcnkiOjE0ODI0MjMzNjB9
[15:30] <R13ose> chr1s: no command I can use to increase this?
[15:35] <chr1s> R13ose: on the client side, unfortunately not
[15:35] <R13ose> chr1s: okay thanks
[15:35] <chr1s> on the access point you may be able to increase the transmit power but that depends on what it allows and the maximum legal power output wherever you are
[15:36] <chr1s> no worries
[15:38] <R13ose> chr1s: thanks.  I don't want to touch the ap
[15:39] <BluesKaj> the default chan routers usually use is ch 6 , I find using a lower or higher ,like 11 works well since most users don't bother with that setting
[15:41] <chr1s> you could try to reposition the ap or if it has external antenna you could try adjusting their position
[15:42] <chr1s> it's all very hit and miss when it comes to signal propagation
[15:42] <chr1s> good luck
[15:43] <R13ose> The mode is infrastructure, is that connect?
[15:45] <chr1s> yep
[15:46] <R13ose> I believe I am using the channel 149 instead of 11.
[15:47] <rattking> Depending on the country you are in and the laws there you may be able to adjust your wifi regulatory domain and get more transmit power out of the wifi adapter
[15:47] <R13ose> How do I switch?
[15:48] <BluesKaj> in your router firmware
[15:48] <genii> Well, you can also set txpower with iwconfig, like: sudo iwconfig eth0 txpower 30mW    if mW is omitted the strength is assumed to be dBm. But for this you also need to know what your wifi card's maximum output
[15:49] <chr1s> R13ose if you're on channel 149 then you're using the 5GHz band which has a shorter propagation. Try switching to the 2.4GHz band (your connection will be slower but you may have a more stable connection in your case)
[15:50] <chr1s> assuming of course that you have an 802.11n capable adapter
[15:51] <R13ose> chr1s: how do I do all of this?
[15:52] <chr1s> I don't know, I don't have anything that runs in the 5GHz band :) Probably just a case of ensuring you connect on channel 11 or telling your card to use a particular band?
[15:53] <R13ose> Ok
[15:53] <chr1s> hopefully someone else with some experience of dual band stuff can help
[15:59] <R13ose> I checked and that is right I have 5 and 2.4 GHz
[16:03] <chr1s> cool, hope you manage to sort it out then
[16:03] <R13ose> Thanks
[16:03] <chr1s> you're welcome
[16:04] <chr1s> at least you have a few ideas to look into
[16:06] <R13ose> chr1s: right but I am not touching ap
[16:09] <genii> R13ose: Is the machine online by wired connection right now?
[16:09] <R13ose> genii: nope
[16:10] <genii> Yes, makes it problemmatic to use a pastebin :)
[16:11] <R13ose> genii: do you want me to be on wired?
[16:13] <R13ose> genii: on wired connection now
[16:14] <R13ose> genii: what do you want me to do now?
[16:17] <genii> R13ose: What name does your wifi interface have? Previously it would be automatically wlan0 but now it could be any name
[16:18] <genii> just: ifconfig     ...should say
[16:18] <hippybear> can someone tell me where the ttf-mscorefonts-installer is in the repos? There is a typo that causes multiple people the same issue if I can find the repo I can fix it
[16:18] <R13ose> genii: wlp3s0
[16:18] <hippybear> is it just pulling from the Ubuntu repos?
[16:19] <genii> R13ose: So if you can pastebin the results of:  sudo iwlist wlp3s0 scan
[16:22] <R13ose> genii: pastebin.com/wUyRQfPK
[16:26] <genii> Is RajasKingdom your AP or some other random one in the neighbourhood?
[16:27] <genii> -78dBm is pretty bad
[16:30] <R13ose> genii: the AP I use.  There is no wireless connection to that from where I am.
[16:33] <genii> Well, this is on 2.4GHz and a non-overlapping channel ( 11). And the signal strength is still pretty horrible. Try setting on the AP the channel to 1  and then run iwlist scan again, note what the dBm is, then try also channel 6 and again scan to see once more the dBm on that channel. This way we can find at least the one with most chance of connecting
[16:33] <R13ose> genii: I do see both connections as a user and 1 of them as an admin
[16:34] <genii> Ideally want a number higher than around -50dbm, like -45 to -40 would be good
[16:34] <R13ose> genii: change AP?
[16:40] <someelf> I've got an odd problem. When I boot this kubuntu 16.04 laptop I get the kubuntu logo, and then it goes to a black screen.
[16:40] <someelf> to boot into kde I have to switch to alt+shift+1 then login and run startx
[16:40] <someelf> which works fine
[16:41] <genii> R13ose: Yes, log onto the AP and in it's interface change the channel it sends on.  First to 6, then save that, and redo the iwlist scan. Tell us the dBm number from that change. Then change the channel on the AP again to 1,save,redo scan, tell us the dBm one more time
[16:41] <someelf> I've tried reinstalling kde, and trying to install kdm, but neither of those solved the problem
[16:41] <genii> someelf: Ditch kdm and install either sddm or lightdm
[16:41] <someelf> I don't know which config file or log file I should be poking to find out where the problem is
[16:41] <someelf> ok.
[16:42] <someelf> will try that
[16:42] <genii> work, afk 7-10 minutes
[16:46] <R13ose> genii: should I change the 2.4 or 5 ghz?
[16:48] <genii> R13ose: 2.4
[16:48]  * genii wanders back to work for a bit
[16:50] <AndChat|35156> genii: no scan results for channel 6.  For channel 1, -85 dBm
[16:52] <R13ose> ^ sorry used wrong nickname before.
[16:54] <genii> R13ose: At these signal strengths, it's not very likely that a stable connection can be made :(
[16:54] <R13ose> genii: switch back to 11?
[16:56] <genii> Yep, so far it's the strongest
[16:58] <R13ose> genii: anything else can be done?
[16:59] <genii> R13ose: As far as software things, or settings on the AP, not much, unfortunately.
[17:00] <R13ose> genii: well, nuts this fails in the one place I work the most
[17:02] <R13ose> genii: thanks for help
[17:03] <genii> R13ose: If your AP aerials screw on, maybe consider a range extender
[17:03] <R13ose> Just for one computer?
[17:07] <R13ose> genii: ^
[17:12] <genii> R13ose: Something like http://www.bestbuy.ca/en-ca/product/insten-insten-wi-fi-booster-antenna-205143/10556084.aspx?path=678f66080e2118ab2e03dfd487890108en02
[17:14] <genii> That particular one has a gain of 7, you might want one more in the 9 to 11 range though
[17:16] <R13ose> genii: canada?
[17:17] <genii> R13ose: I am in Canada, yes. So the BestBuy site automatically chose it's Canadian site for me.
[17:17] <R13ose> genii: I am too
[17:19] <R13ose> genii: which city?
[17:19] <genii> Toronto
[17:20] <R13ose> Me too
[17:20]  * genii slides R13ose a Maple Leafs jersey and a Timmies dark roast
[17:21] <R13ose> genii: boo.  I dislike timmies and haven't watched leafs since Rogers too over hockey coverage
[17:21] <genii> heh
[17:22] <R13ose> genii: where in Toronto?
[17:23] <genii> R13ose: For non-support talk, it's better if you come to the #kubuntu-offtopic channel
[17:24] <genii> /join #kubuntu-offtopic
[17:29] <renn0xtk9> I am on lates kubunt, the other day I installed "adwaita ' since then it turn out when I go in system settings> Workspace them, there is only the tab Mouse Cursor that is working. all other won't display
[17:29] <renn0xtk9> any idea what I could do ?
[17:32] <renn0xtk9> shall I force reinstall kde ?
[17:37] <genii> renn0xtk9: Probably that GNOME icon theme doesn't agree with KDE.
[17:37] <genii> Might try kde-style-qtcurve-qt4 (or kde-style-qtcurve-qt5)
[17:37] <renn0xtk9> genii that should not prevent kde from displaying it's own stuff ;)
[17:38] <renn0xtk9> hmm it says 0 new package to install
[17:38] <genii> If it's trying to use an incompatible theme from another DE to display it's own stuff....
[17:39] <renn0xtk9> Installing does not mean setting ;)  the them is Breeze with icon them oxygen
[17:40] <renn0xtk9> now I just sudo apt-get kubuntu-desktop and this time I don't event get into the Workspace setting menu... so don't blame gnome ...
[17:42] <renn0xtk9> I just managed to change the them by clicking randomly.. it is purely the display that is not working... a typical kubuntu bug...
[17:42] <genii> It is odd that the cursor is not displaying, yes
[17:43] <renn0xtk9> the whole frame in the window now
[17:43] <renn0xtk9> it is not the cursor
[17:43] <renn0xtk9> it is the whole QWdiget that does not refresh...
[17:44] <genii> renn0xtk9: Just curious,, is your GPU nvidia?
[17:49] <renn0xtk9> nope
[17:49] <renn0xtk9> I have a very old 32 bit intel processor with graphics comming from the chipset
[17:51] <renn0xtk9> i try to restart maybe it will do it but I don't think so. don't see why
[19:03] <renn0xtk9> still can't get kubunt systems settings working
[19:04] <BluesKaj> which part of system settings?
[19:06] <renn0xtk9> When I clikc on Workspace theme. the whole window freezes. It does not refresh anymore
[19:06] <BluesKaj> renn0xtk9,^'
[19:07] <renn0xtk9> hm ?
[19:07] <renn0xtk9> it s only the display, because If I click randomly I see the titlebar of the window changing.
[19:09] <BluesKaj> how did you install your OS, from a an iso or upgrade from an older OS via the 'net
[19:09] <renn0xtk9> Iso upgrade
[19:09] <renn0xtk9> It did work
[19:10] <renn0xtk9> than  I installed "adwaita" because silly googl-chrome said it has it as a dependency
[19:10] <renn0xtk9> and since then ..
[19:14] <BluesKaj> adwaita is gtk theme , chrome should be able to run without it
[19:14] <renn0xtk9> That is what suprised me
[19:14] <renn0xtk9> and it was not able to run with it either ^^
[19:15] <renn0xtk9> But that should not mess up the system setttings like that,
[19:15] <renn0xtk9> it is anoying
[19:15] <BluesKaj> adwaita is a default icon theme on kubuntu
[19:16] <BluesKaj> it is gtk tho
[19:22] <renn0xtk9> what piss me the most off is that I now will have to reinstall kubuntu , because of what,   because somebody has let of  c++ pointer flying in space and did not want to run any unittest on what he/she did programm
[19:23] <BluesKaj> renn0xtk9, try sudo apt remove adwaita-icon-theme
[19:25] <renn0xtk9> BluesKaj: and then : "The following package will be REMOVED : [..] kubuntu-desktop [...]plasma-desktop[...]
[19:27] <BluesKaj> ok, then that won't work
[19:29] <renn0xtk9> maybe sudo apt-get remove --purge kubuntu-desktop plasma-desktop && sudo apt-get install kubuntu-desktop plasma-destkop ?
[19:29] <BluesKaj> no
[19:30] <BluesKaj> adwaita is installed by default
[19:31] <renn0xtk9> the "system settings" stuff is it a programm /package of its own that i can reinstall? or does it has config files i can delete?
[19:31] <BluesKaj> it's insatalled on my system and i didnot choose to install it separately
[19:32] <BluesKaj> it's part of the plasma-desktop
[19:33] <BluesKaj> anyway i have to go ...sorry I couldn't help, renn0xtk9
[19:37] <renn0xtk9> no worries thks
 Someone responsible for the webpage here? The main download page still links to the old 14.04.4 iso images, while the alternative downloads section has the newer 14.04.5 images. Someone with edit rights should fix the links on the main page.
[20:40] <Dienonymous> hello
[20:40] <Dienonymous> A worm of injection of energy navigation with electric discharges can sail and make explode bombs anywhere in the universe as your intelligence power and independence only need to feed the energy of the cosmos and be a mirror real revolutionary worm that would transform it into Living energy for which it would not be so nature but if existing that makes it into a being in this family
[20:51] <mparillo> luziferius: https://bugs.launchpad.net/kubuntu-website/+bug/1652158


[02:44] <alex-weej> http://alex-weej.blogspot.com/2006/03/human-user-group.html
[02:48] <Hobbsee> alex-weej: look at the callender
[02:48] <alex-weej> Hobbsee: ?
[02:49] <alex-weej> yes i know i posted it in March, i still think it's a good idea! :P
[02:49] <Hobbsee> alex-weej: it's the day after christmas day, or still christmas day - most people arent going to be looking @ irc
[02:49] <alex-weej> oh right :P
[02:49] <alex-weej> well... you saw it, right? :P
[02:50] <Hobbsee> sure, but i dont deal in gnome
[02:52] <mjg59> alex-weej: I'm not entirely convinced by the assertion. Real users go in the 1000+ range. System users shouldn't.
[02:52] <mjg59> So why worry?
[02:53] <alex-weej> well when i setup a package
[02:53] <wasabi_> heh, did somebody just change back to spacial nautilus? :)
[02:53] <wasabi_> my naut just switched back after an update
[02:53] <alex-weej> and it creates a new user with uid=1004
[02:53] <Lathiat> it shouldnt
[02:53] <alex-weej> i don't want to see that jazz in my facebrowser!
[02:53] <alex-weej> Lathiat: that's not the point
[02:53] <mjg59> alex-weej: It shouldn't
[02:53] <Hobbsee> fix the package so it shouldnt?
[02:53] <mjg59> And that *is* the point
[02:53] <alex-weej> i don't know whether you guys realise this
[02:54] <alex-weej> but there are only 999 numbers less than 1000.
[02:54] <wasabi_> Actually there are infinity, when you consider negative values.
[02:54] <mjg59> And you're going to have over 999 system users on a single system?
[02:54] <wasabi_> Just making sure you know. ;0
[02:54] <alex-weej> mjg59: again, not the point
[02:54] <mjg59> alex-weej: ...
[02:54] <alex-weej> ideally, we'd be using UUIDs anyway :/
[02:55] <wasabi_> oh geeze
[02:55] <Lathiat> is that a joke?
[02:55] <alex-weej> it's a bit crack getting an ext3 file system off a mate's computer and seeing all the file permissions set to local users that makes no sense
[02:55] <wasabi_> nautilus is closing widnows behind itself now too
[02:55] <Lathiat> ahh
[02:55] <alex-weej> Lathiat: absolutely not :o)
[02:55] <Lathiat> so you mean, much longer UIDs
[02:55] <mjg59> alex-weej: Any package that creates a system user in the 1000+ range is breaking Debian policy
[02:55] <mjg59> So it's buggy
[02:55] <mjg59> So you report it and we fix it
[02:56] <mjg59> And that is *entirely* the point
[02:56] <wasabi_> If you WANT to argue about having only 999 system users, then we can certainly do so.
[02:56] <alex-weej> mjg59: but debian rules the world. you can't fix third party packages.
[02:56] <wasabi_> =)
[02:56] <alex-weej> wasabi_: i'd say a more useful argument is based on the case i suggested above
[02:56] <mjg59> alex-weej: If .debs don't conform to Debian policy, they're broken
[02:56] <wasabi_> You mean third party apps?
[02:56] <mjg59> It's not our job to fix them
[02:57] <wasabi_> If a third party app overwrites all of /usr, we're not going to fix it, either.
[02:57] <Hobbsee> alex-weej: and they dont tend to make it in the archives, either
[02:57] <alex-weej> when uid's no longer become simply sequential numbers, you CAN'T rely on it being somewhere above 1000.
[02:57] <wasabi_> Sure you can.
[02:57] <mjg59> alex-weej: When it's an issue, we'll deal with it
[02:57] <alex-weej> it is an issue now. see my example!
[02:57] <wasabi_> Wish teh third party software?
[02:57] <alex-weej> with the file system
[02:58] <wasabi_> Huh?
[02:58] <mjg59> It's an issue because you've installed some piece of shit package produced by either an incompetent or someone ignorant of the fact that it's behaving like that
[02:58] <alex-weej> uid 1003 on a foreign system does not correspond to uid 1003 on my system
[02:58] <wasabi_> That would be correct.
[02:58] <alex-weej> if they were both UUIDs, this would not be a problem
[02:58] <wasabi_> ...
[02:58] <alex-weej> as they would never match anyway
[02:58] <wasabi_> You want to fix that, go whine someplace else.
[02:58] <wasabi_> Specifically to the guys behind POSIX.
[02:58] <mjg59> uids are 32-bit numbers.
[02:58] <Lathiat> thats a much bigger issue
[02:58] <mjg59> Ubuntu can't fix that.
[02:58] <wasabi_> Yes, that issue is huge.
[02:59] <Lathiat> also, UUIDs don't guarantee that'l *never* happen
[02:59] <mjg59> A 32-bit number does not usefully identify every UNIX account on the planet
[02:59] <Lathiat> it just increases the problem space ;)
[02:59] <alex-weej> no, but they make the chances unreasonably slim
[02:59] <alex-weej> pfft
[02:59] <alex-weej> "Windows does it"
[02:59] <wasabi_> alex-weej: Don't get ME wrong anyways, I am all for UUIDs.
[02:59] <wasabi_> I have other issues which are impossible with 32 bit UIDs.
[03:00] <wasabi_> Which I am keenly interested in solving. I just know it's not something a few guys in the ubuntu channel can tackle right now. ;0
[03:00] <alex-weej> lol
[03:00] <alex-weej> i wasn't implying that it was
[03:00] <mjg59> It's not a problem that gets fixed by creating a human group
[03:00] <alex-weej> true
[03:01] <alex-weej> but the human group means that one less thing is relying on numerical sequentiality of uids
[03:01] <mjg59> In Debian-based systems, real users have UIDs that are 1000 or above. Other users don't.
[03:01] <wasabi_> Wait, what relies on numerical sequentialiy?
[03:01] <mjg59> So, given that users are already clearly defined as human or not-human, there's no need for a human group
[03:02] <wasabi_> ranges != sequentially. EVen Windows has "ranges"
[03:02] <wasabi_> Special SID prefixes which correspond to system users, etc.
[03:02] <wasabi_> There's nothing significantly different from <1000 and that.
[03:03] <alex-weej> except there are probably more than 999 different system services that might require specific well-known UID available for windows :P
[03:03] <mjg59> alex-weej: Oh, hey, if that's your concern, we only offer 100 specified UIDs
[03:03] <wasabi_> alex-weej: Nope, not really.
[03:04] <mjg59> Oh, wait
[03:04] <wasabi_> alex-weej: There's like, 30.
[03:04] <mjg59> Sorry, 4100
[03:04] <mjg59> 5100
[03:06] <alex-weej> ok
[03:07] <alex-weej> i can live with debian's policy of humans having 1000 <= UID < whatever
[03:07] <wasabi_> Anyways, there are other more worthy things to complain about.
[03:07] <wasabi_> LIke that the face browser actually ENUMERATES using getpwent from 1000 to the end. ;)
[03:07] <alex-weej> like Firefox?
[03:09] <alex-weej> tbh fuck it all
[03:09] <alex-weej> we should be logging people into ubuntu with OpenID!
[03:09] <wasabi_> No way.
[03:09] <wasabi_> But it should be an option. :)
[03:09] <alex-weej> wasabi_: that WAS a joke. :P
[03:13] <alex-weej> yeah anyway going back to the whole UID jazz just for a second
[03:14] <alex-weej> genuine question: what exactly makes stuff like sysvinit replaceable within the scope of ubuntu, but not stuff like that?
[03:16] <mjg59> Changing uid to something other than a 32-bit value would break POSIX compliance
[03:16] <mjg59> And hence NFS, NIS, LDAP, Hesiod and so on
[03:18] <alex-weej> right
[03:18] <alex-weej> that's less than good
[03:19] <alex-weej> it does seem crack when you put it that way
[03:19] <alex-weej> but still useful :F
[03:28] <wasabi_> The problem is a real world one.
[03:28] <wasabi_> Windows SIDs work, for distributed environments, you know.. Active Directory.
[03:28] <wasabi_> And they're pretty much a requirement for that line of work, imo. So, we'll fix it eventually.
[03:28] <wasabi_> Smart UID allocation or mapping policies aren't bad though.
[03:29] <wasabi_> 32 bits really is enough for a single organization. Just not for every individual on the face of the planet.
[04:01] <alex-weej> wasabi_: *nod*
[05:25] <bluefoxicy> I'm being hit up for i686 again
[05:25] <bluefoxicy> Someone wants my help swaying the devs to deprecate i586 and i486 support
[05:26] <bluefoxicy> I told him to profile archlinux against archlinux i486 instead of against Ubuntu
[05:28] <Hobbsee> why dont you do the benchmarks yourself, and then talk?
[06:05] <bluefoxicy> Hobbsee:  I did some microbenchmarks with nbench a while back and got zip.
[06:05] <bluefoxicy> I guess I could do some realistic benchmarks
[06:05] <Hobbsee> that's the only way you'll get input on it
[06:06] <bluefoxicy> maybe build libz + gzip and then compress tons of crap (random data?  The analysis that runs takes a long time to figure out it's not getting anywhere)
[06:07] <bluefoxicy> but that still leaves actually justifying dropping i486/i586 support OR adding another arch repo; I'd need some pretty impressive bench mark numbers for that, and it's just not going to happen.
[06:07] <bluefoxicy> doh.. now I'm curious as to the exact numbers I'll get :/
[06:08] <Hobbsee> haha
[06:10] <bluefoxicy> speaking of making things faster, did anyone ever pin down the firefox issue
[06:10] <bluefoxicy> it used to be that it would load in like 2 seconds (any other distro; official builds); unless you got it from Ubuntu, then it took 14-25 seconds to load
[06:11] <wasabi_> Um. When making a new package upload, what's the proper way to signify that it should be placed in multiverse?
[06:11] <wasabi_> It's been awhile.
[06:11] <bluefoxicy> I believe that goes on the first line in the changelog entry
[06:11] <wasabi_> distro should go there.
[06:12] <bluefoxicy> yer right
[06:12] <Hobbsee> wasabi_: i'm not sure.  same procedure as universe, i'd expect
[06:12] <Hobbsee> one of the distro people would know
[06:13] <wasabi_> Heh. Last time I did this there was no procedure other than asking somebody to NOT put it in universe.
[06:20] <Hobbsee> ah
[06:20] <Hobbsee> okay then
[11:51] <neutrinomass> Comments on bug 77009 ? (or should I raise this on the mailing list? )
[11:51] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 77009 in venkman "failed deps on iceweasel | iceape-browser | icedove" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/77009
[12:18] <Mithrandir> neutrinomass: looks like something which should be discussed on ubuntu-devel
[12:22] <neutrinomass> Mithrandir: ok, I'll send a mail sometime today
[12:25] <Mithrandir> Hobbsee: how's your xmas been?
[12:27] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: good :)
[02:13] <adam0509> Sorry, to distrurb, but do someone know about this package : xserver-xorg-input-joystick  ?
[02:14] <Hobbsee> adam0509: probably not today, as it's still a public holiday in most countries.  and your question is very board
[02:14] <Hobbsee> *broad
[02:15] <adam0509> ok thx
[05:38] <bddebian> Heya
[05:39] <_ion> hi
[05:40] <bddebian> Hello _ion
[05:52] <Adri2000> cjwatson, Mithrandir, any archive admin: I have just seen that the binary package homebank-data is in main, while homebank is in universe. homebank-data should be in universe too. I don't know why homebank-data landed in main, but see yourself: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/h/homebank/ :p
[05:57] <fdoving> Adri2000: confirmed. report a bug?
[05:59] <Adri2000> yeah, will do if no archive admin answers
[06:01] <bhale> Adri2000: they are on holiday and unlikely to answer until after the new year..
[06:01] <bhale> subscribe ubuntu-archive to your bug report
[06:09] <Adri2000> done, bug 77179, fdoving: you can confirm it :)
[06:09] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 77179 in homebank "homebank-data should be in universe, not in main" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/77179
[06:12] <fdoving> Adri, confirmed.
[06:13] <Adri2000> thanks
[06:17] <wasabi> Does anybody have a good overview of the plan regarding udev in the initramfs and mdadm/evms/lvm integration?
[06:18] <wasabi> And it's current state.
[06:45] <wasabi> Latest kernel is fun. Locks on boot at Checking aperture.
[06:57] <Mithrandir> wasabi: "make udev call evms_activate/vgchange/raidstart when discovering block devices".
[06:57] <wasabi> heh
[07:31] <cjwatson> wasabi: multiverse> it's Section: multiverse/whatever in debian/control; but you *can* just let an archive admin override it
[07:39] <cjwatson> wasabi: (you can also mark it non-free/blah or contrib/blah as appropriate per Debian policy, and we'll take that as a signal that it should go in multiverse)
[07:39] <wasabi> Ahh. Makes sense. So, seeing as I already uploaded it, and it's in NEW, who do I contact to make sure it gets in the right place?
[07:39] <wasabi> (i did not prefix section)
[07:40] <Mithrandir> it'll be done by hand by whoever NEWs it.
[07:57] <cjwatson> wasabi: no need
[07:57] <cjwatson> er, as Mithrandir said
[07:58] <cjwatson> wasabi: if it goes in the wrong place, you can always file a bug afterwards and subscribe ubuntu-archive to have it moved
[07:58] <wasabi> k
[07:58] <wasabi> thanks. =)
[08:18] <alex-weej> is there some kind of online ubuntu hardware compatibility database?
[08:21] <lotusleaf> alex-weej: well there's !hwdb
[08:21] <alex-weej> lotusleaf: ta
[08:21] <lotusleaf> alex-weej: and some tidbits on the wiki
[08:22] <alex-weej> hmm
[08:22] <alex-weej> dunno if hwdb is what i think it is
[08:22] <alex-weej> have you ever seen Wine's AppDB?
[08:23] <alex-weej> "Submissions Total: 441642 Today: 235416"
[08:23] <alex-weej> wtf? half the hwdb submissions submitted today?
[09:23] <Zober2> hi guys
[09:23] <Zober2> raid array in dmraid is not recognized by gparted, is there something i need to do before gparted will see the raid array?
[11:27] <_MMA_> I hope its just me but is there something in place that wont let me go to Feisty from Edgy?
[11:27] <_MMA_> I tried to put in a Feisty daily and use update-manager to upgrade but it said: "Authentication the upgrade failed. There may be a problem with the network or the server.
[11:28] <_MMA_> I was testing the -lowlatency kernels but messed up my partition and had to reinstall.
[11:36] <Adri2000> !seen mvo
[11:37] <Adri2000> thanks nickserv