[00:21] <pleia2> so, http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/261/builds/39546/testcases/1303/results could use some detail I think?
[00:21] <pleia2> "Use and execute the default applications found for the desktop enviroment being run"
[00:21] <pleia2> that's a bit vague :)
[00:22] <pleia2> and "Test-case Live Session Persistence" is an interesting part of the test case
[00:23] <knome> we should get the new application tests to the tracker asap
[00:23] <knome> i promise i'll look into that tomorrow.
[00:23] <pleia2> thank you
[00:24] <pleia2> "Test-case Live Session Persistence" makes the test considerably more involved and I am losing interest in doing this test :\
[00:24] <pleia2> thought I could just load up livecd, clicky click, ok done!
[00:24] <knome> lol
[00:24] <knome> imo the persistence test should be a separate one
[00:24] <pleia2> yeah
[00:25] <pleia2> I loved giving this livecd test to folks at events I was doing since it wouldn't touch their harddrive and was easy
[00:32] <pleia2> I found a bug in our tour!
[00:33] <knome> good!
[00:33] <pleia2> gnumeric :)
[00:33] <knome> it's a bug for what, 1.5 months?
[00:34] <pleia2> where does the xubuntu ubiquity slideshow live on launchpad?
[00:34] <pleia2> si
[00:35] <Len-nb> lp:ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu
[00:35] <pleia2> uses the same as ubuntu?
[00:35] <pleia2> ah, I see, thanks
[00:36] <Len-nb> https://code.launchpad.net/~ubiquity-slideshow/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/html
[00:36] <Len-nb> Ya I just updated Studio's
[00:36]  * pleia2 nods
[00:36] <pleia2> thanks :)
[00:36] <knome> pleia2, do you need changes on that?
[00:36] <knome> pleia2, i have push rights
[00:36] <pleia2> I want to write my bug first!
[00:36]  * knome laughs the evil, manical laugh
[00:36] <pleia2> :)
[00:36] <Len-nb> knome, push our merge :)
[00:37] <pleia2> I actually don't know how I want to words to go really and now my system is all dne installing so I lost the page, aaahh
[00:37] <knome> Len-nb, if you remind me tomorrow or send me a mail about that (pasi@shimmerproject.org), i'll look at that tomorrow.
[00:38]  * pleia2 combs through bzr
[00:38] <Len-nb> I think it has one review does it need more
[00:38] <pleia2> it's sleepytime for knome I think
[00:39] <knome> Len-nb, i don't think so. but yeah, it's late
[00:39] <Len-nb> I forget sometimes
[00:39] <Len-nb> I am -700
[00:39] <knome> no problem :)
[00:39] <Len-nb> half past midnight there?
[00:39] <knome> 2:40am
[00:39] <Len-nb> Ouch
[00:40] <knome> that's okay. i went to bed 6am last night
[00:40] <pleia2> oh dear :)
[00:40] <knome> \o/
[00:40] <knome> and yeah, i'm meeting a client 10am today
[00:49] <pleia2> ooh, I like the circle progress thingy
[00:49] <Len-nb> Better than dots for sure
[00:50] <pleia2> wasn't it just a bar going back and forth?
[00:50] <knome> yes
[00:50] <Len-nb> Not sure, I could look at my wifes netbook though
[00:50] <pleia2> didn't catch 1093015 on my 64-bit test, but ah yeah there it is
[00:50]  * pleia2 will look for on 32-bit
[00:52] <Len-nb> catfish is still not fixed/released
[00:58] <Len-nb> I am updating my xubuntu ISO now. If I have time after I do the studio test, I will do xubuntu as well. (32bit)
[00:58] <pleia2> thank you!
[00:59] <Len-nb> The version of firefox on the ISO should come with a link to the test cases
[00:59] <Len-nb> Feature request :)
[00:59] <pleia2> that would be neat
[01:00] <knome> heh
[01:02] <pleia2> hrm, 'incomplete language support' error
[01:02] <pleia2> when booting up after install
[01:02] <pleia2> where to file?
[01:04] <ochosi> i think that has been there for ages
[01:04] <ochosi> at least if you open the gnome-language-settings/dialog
[01:05] <pleia2> it was a notification on boot first time, I don't remember it :\
[01:08] <pleia2> oops, I was supposed to meet up with real life people
[01:08]  * pleia2 goes to do that
[01:09] <knome> heh
[01:09] <knome> hf! :)
[01:51] <knome> bluesabre, hello :)
[01:51] <knome> and good night everybody, i'm off
[01:51] <knome> see you tomorrow!
[01:51] <bluesabre> lol
[01:51] <bluesabre> seeya knome
[01:51] <knome> wut? :P
[01:51] <knome> my ctrl is not working!
[01:51] <knome> great.
[01:51] <knome> or then i'm not an a screen
[01:52] <knome> boo.
[01:53] <knome> humm.
[01:53] <knome> weird.
[01:54] <knome> yay finnish freenode server
[01:54] <knome> must've been some weird error in xfce4-terminal
[01:54] <knome> now ctrl works again.
[01:54] <knome> and now, night -->
[03:00] <len_live> Running xubuntu 13.04 from todays spin.
[03:02] <len_live> There seem to be a lot of things traditionally found in the System submenu that show up in the settings manager
[03:02] <len_live> Is this on purpose?
[03:05] <len_live> Some of these things I could argue either way, I think. Others just seem wrong.
[03:07] <len_live> Software installation doesn't seem to me to belong.
[03:08] <len_live> The few things left in system seem they would be better in accessories.... aside from SW centre which is a duplicate anyway.
[03:14] <len_live> The result of over zealous category tags I guess. Needs to be addressed one app at a time.
[03:40]  * len_live can't do install entire disk, he is glade someone else did
[05:48] <pleia2> Segmentation fault (core dumped)
[05:48] <pleia2> D:
[05:48] <micahg> what?
[05:48] <pleia2> usb-creator-gtk exploded
[05:49] <pleia2> going to try again, erasing usb stick first
[06:03] <pleia2> bah, happened again, but it seems to have actually done everything..
[06:03]  * pleia2 skips off to plug it into laptop
[06:09] <micahg> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTMyNDg
[06:11] <pleia2> :\
[06:11] <micahg> well, we can hope for 4.12 for the LTS I guess
[06:12]  * pleia2 nods
[06:12]  * micahg would certainly prefer a GTK3 only version, but that seems a pipe dream at this point, maybe for 16.04
[06:14] <pleia2> well, it seems to be installing from this usb stick
[06:14] <pleia2> maybe usb-creator-gtk is supposed to end with a segfault :D
[06:14] <micahg> um, no, that's still be a bug
[06:14] <pleia2> yeah, in 12.10
[06:14] <micahg> and so was that sentence...
[06:14] <pleia2> or in the image?
[06:15] <pleia2> it's late
[06:15] <micahg> usb-creator, no app should end in segfault
[06:15] <pleia2> yeah
[06:15] <micahg> now, whether or not it's a priority to fix depends on how much of an edge case + how hard it is to track down
[06:16] <micahg> maybe save the image somewhere where it can be downloaded since it seems to trigger the test case
[06:16] <pleia2> hahaha, google search for usb-creator-gtk recommends "usb-creator-gtk download" and "usb-creator-gtk segfault"
[06:16] <micahg> or, save it in case it's needed at least
[06:16]  * pleia2 nods
[06:16] <micahg> heh, quality software at work :)
[06:18]  * micahg goes to sleep
[06:18] <pleia2> good night
[06:37] <pleia2> ooh, boot time is snappy again
[06:52] <pleia2> doh, can't install google-chrome on 13.04
[06:53] <pleia2>  google-chrome-stable depends on libgconf2-4 (>= 2.27.0); however:
[06:53] <pleia2>   Package libgconf2-4 is not installed.
[06:53] <pleia2>  google-chrome-stable depends on libnss3-1d (>= 3.12.3); however:
[06:53] <pleia2>   Package libnss3-1d is not installed.
[06:53] <Noskcaj> therefore, sudo apt-get install those things
[06:54] <knome> morning
[06:54] <pleia2> Noskcaj: they are virtual, can't ;)
[06:54] <pleia2> (I do actually do systems administration for a livint)
[06:54] <pleia2> living too
[06:54] <knome> heh :)
[06:55] <pleia2> they don't really exist in raring, having dependency fun now
[06:55] <knome> good luck!
[06:55] <pleia2> heh, libgconf-2-4 exists
[06:55] <pleia2> and libnss3
[06:55] <knome> :)
[06:56] <knome> well if you're going to build a stable, you'll need a lot of building material ;d
[06:57] <pleia2> :P
[06:57] <knome> yeah i know, the bad jokes...
[06:58] <pleia2> of course libgconf-2-4 is installed (as is libnss3)
[06:58]  * pleia2 gives no cookies to chrome
[06:58] <pleia2> heh, chromium in the repos is just as broken
[07:00] <pleia2> oh, it decided to work now?
[07:00] <pleia2> after midnight, must have fed the gremlins
[07:02] <pleia2> I suspect I may have broken things by removing conflicting packages \o/
[07:03] <knome> :)
[07:03] <knome> well done
[07:03] <knome> now report what you removed
[07:03] <knome> ;)
[07:03] <pleia2> libnss3!
[07:03] <pleia2> was conflicting with libnss3-1d
[07:03] <pleia2> who needs that
[07:06] <knome> umm
[07:06] <knome> :)
[07:08] <knome> "The proposal is to reduce the support for interim releases to 7 months, thereby providing constant support for those who stay on the latest interim release, or any supported LTS releases."
[07:09] <knome> that's probably what you wanted to read/hear
[07:09] <pleia2> oh, maybe I should read it :)
[07:09] <knome> it's the best article from mark in a long time
[07:10] <pleia2> yay Mark \o/
[07:11] <knome> it's something completely different from the reply to harald :/
[07:13] <pleia2> well, I'll reserve my excitement for when things settle
[07:14] <knome> sure, it's still not the final word
[07:15] <pleia2> I like the new update icon
[07:15] <pleia2> ooh, I also like our website links in the menu :)
[07:16] <pleia2> except they have no preferred application associated with them
[07:16] <knome> goodgood
[07:16] <knome> pleia2, they're exo-links
[07:16] <pleia2> I don't know what that means!
[07:16] <knome> they should open in the default web browser
[07:17] <pleia2> they don't
[07:17] <knome> the launchers on the bottom panel are exo-links as well
[07:17] <pleia2> i did change default to chrome though, maybe they did before
[07:17] <knome> do they work?
[07:17] <knome> (especially the "internet browser" icon)
[07:17] <pleia2> internet browser opens firefox
[07:17] <knome> ok... weird
[07:17] <pleia2> no wait
[07:17] <knome> heh :)
[07:17] <pleia2> "web browser"
[07:17] <pleia2> yeah, that opens firefox
[07:17] <knome> hmmh.
[07:18] <knome> maybe that's not perfect yet.
[07:18] <knome> 'exo-open --launch WebBrowser' ?
[07:19] <pleia2> that seems to work ok
[07:19] <knome> ok
[07:19] <knome> micahg! ^
[07:19] <knome> i'm running now
[07:20] <knome> good night and see you later :)
[07:20] <pleia2> have a nice day
[07:20] <knome> thanks, will try to
[07:20] <pleia2> oh sure, now it opens in firefox
[07:20] <knome> heh :)
[07:20] <pleia2> maybe because I set a default at one point now
[07:20] <knome> -->
[07:20] <knome> yeah.
[07:20] <pleia2> ok bye
[07:33] <pleia2> ah, so it turns out when I tell chrome "yes, I want you to become my default browser!" it actually unsets my default browser and then I have none
[07:34] <pleia2> all is well now :)
[07:34] <pleia2> (except the part where I am still awake)
[07:49] <astraljava> pleia2: I never seemed to get it working (combo with FF and Chrome).
[07:49] <astraljava> Every time I started the other browser, it was a mess again.
[08:02] <knome> pleia2, heh, good
[08:02] <knome> astraljava, in my experience at least FF stops whining if you tell it not to check if it's the default browser
[08:02] <knome> but mimetype associations generally never worked well on linux
[08:03] <knome> and that's a shame :/
[08:03] <knome> don't know if it's in the scope of xubuntu, but that definitely needed fixing.
[08:03] <knome> or a UI
[08:13] <astraljava> knome: That might be, it's been a while since I've used anything other than Chrome.
[09:33] <lderan> Hello all
[09:49] <bluesabre> knome, looks like my xubuntu-doc membership is about to expire
[10:15] <knome> bluesabre, can you renew it yourself?
[10:15] <knome> lderan, hello
[10:22] <bluesabre> "To prevent this membership from expiring, you should contact the team's administrator, Pasi Lallinaho (knome). <https://launchpad.net/~knome>"
[10:22] <knome> aha
[10:23] <knome> bluesabre, can you check if you can renew yourself now?
[10:25] <bluesabre> knome, not sure where to go to renew
[10:25] <knome> hmm
[10:26] <bluesabre> eventually this year I will get a new laptop, then this will hide in the corner as an always on shell/media center
[10:26] <knome> https://launchpad.net/~bluesabre/+expiringmembership/xubuntu-doc ?
[10:26] <knome> wait
[10:26] <knome> replace bluesabre with your lp nick :P
[10:27] <bluesabre> sweet
[10:27] <bluesabre> thanks knome
[10:27] <knome> np
[10:27] <knome> the email you got now should have a link to that in the future
[10:27] <knome> i think there was some idea behind making it "you can't renew it yourself"
[10:28] <knome> probably to get the reeeeally old "contributors" either tell ask us that they still contribute or get to kick them out :P
[10:28] <knome> -asl
[10:28] <knome> *ask
[10:28] <knome> my typing doesn't work today
[10:52] <lderan> hi knome
[10:52] <knome> hey lderan
[10:54] <lderan> new user of xubuntu and thought to see if i could lend any help with any dev work
[10:55] <knome> lderan, great! did you already look at http://xubuntu.org/contribute/ and seen something that would be interesting for you and fit your skills?
[10:55] <lderan> having a look over it as i type
[10:56] <knome> we have recently updated it, so it should be pretty accurate
[10:56] <knome> just let us know and we'll help you to get started :)
[10:56] <lderan> awesome thanks :D
[10:57] <knome> np
[11:05] <lderan> i can help with bug fixes and writing new software / documentation
[11:15] <knome> lderan, you'll want to chat with bluesabre, micahg and mr_pouit about bugs/software
[11:15] <knome> lderan, and me about documentation... though atm i'm a bit busy
[11:16] <knome> (pleia2 can help with docs too, but she's probably asleep)
[11:17] <ochosi> lderan: how would you describe your skillset or what experience do you have?
[11:17] <ochosi> (not vetting, just wondering ;))
[11:21] <lderan> i have some c, c++ experience from what i've gathered from uni and personal learnings, the bulk of my experience is in php.
[11:23] <ochosi> sounds nice
[11:23] <ochosi> most of our stuff is in c+gtk
[11:24] <lderan> shall look into that after work
[11:24] <ochosi> best way to dive into code imo is to find a bug or something small that annoys you :)
[11:25] <ochosi> read the relevant code, try to patch it and see whether you can scratch your itch
[11:27] <lderan> sounds good to me :P
[14:21] <scottbomb> Is there not a daily build for 3/12/13?
[14:22] <scottbomb> Looking for Xubuntu Desktop i386 20130312.x
[14:30] <knome> we are in the beta freeze
[14:36] <scottbomb> ok cool thanks
[14:36] <knome> np
[16:37] <pleia2> knome: can you renew me in xubuntu-doc? expiring soon
[16:46]  * pleia2 reads backlog and renewself
[17:03] <Unit193> Just a note that not much progress has been made for libdvdcss-installer or libdvdcss-pkg, still stuck in ITP.  (http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=687624)
[17:32] <scottbomb> One thing I've noticed is that at end of the installation the installer tells me that it's done and time to reboot but it doesn't say when to remove the installation media. Out of curiosity, I unplugged the USB thumb drive I was using and it caused a kernel panic. Should I file a bug against ubiquity ?
[17:34] <bluesabre_> I think only the live cd/dvds ask to remove the media, but I might be wrong
[17:36] <pleia2> yeah, I think it should just reboot when it's done with things w/o asking any questions
[17:37] <xnox> scottbomb: you riped out the installer out of the live system. you should have clicked reboot, and it would have later displayed message when to remove the usb stick.
[17:42] <scottbomb> I've been testing the daily ISO for the past few days and it never prompted me to remove the stick. I've just done it after the computer restarted and before the BIOS message. Kind of a haphazard way of doing things but that's what I've been doing up until today when I figured I should bring it up.
[17:43] <xnox> it does on ubuntu.... one gets purple screen (plymouth) ubuntu logo and a message: Please remove installation media.
[17:48] <bluesabre_> I think that is only on the live cd, and possibly live media created by unetbootin/usb-creator
[17:48] <bluesabre_> live usb in general doesn't prompt to be removed
[17:52] <knome> pleia2, good good
[17:54] <pleia2> knome: since we all know 13.04 is happening, I suppose we should do something about docs :)
[17:54] <pleia2> maybe not work on translations stuff yet (that's still up in the air when it comes to rolling and whatnot)
[17:55] <pleia2> I'm thinking we just have volunteers read the docs and submit bugs (and patches if they're comfortable with that)
[17:55] <knome> mm.
[17:55] <knome> submitting bugs sounds like a lot of overhead bureaucracy
[17:55] <knome> but fine.
[17:56] <pleia2> how else would you have them report?
[17:56] <knome> merge requests.
[17:57] <knome> that would also make people want to fix more things at once, not file a bug for every single type
[17:57] <pleia2> that's the "if they're comfortable with that" part
[17:57] <knome> *typo
[17:57] <pleia2> I suspect most aren't
[17:57] <knome> well, to be honest
[17:57] <knome> pulling the bzr branch and pushing to private repo is really easy
[17:58] <knome> i can even write instructions to that
[17:58] <pleia2> sorry, I did mean patches in the form of MPs :)
[17:58] <pleia2> ok
[17:58] <pleia2> it's bzr plus writing it in the doc format
[17:58] <knome> and you don't really need to know anything about coding to change the documentation code
[17:58] <pleia2> tends to make people go cross-eyed
[17:58] <knome> yeah, but most of that is set
[17:58] <knome> they can test-build the documentation to read it as html
[17:59] <knome> there are scripts for that
[17:59] <pleia2> ok, so maybe we write up something on how to use bzr as a doc person, but if all else fails they can submit a bug ;)
[17:59] <knome> tbh, people should just step up. we can't do all the work.
[18:00] <knome> learning how to pull/push bzr is the least they can do
[18:00] <pleia2> they won't
[18:00] <pleia2> it's intimidating
[18:00] <knome> it's different for completely random people who find a bug in the docs and then disappear
[18:00] <knome> learning bzr?
[18:00] <pleia2> pushing a merge proposal
[18:00] <pleia2> worries about doing it right, whether their change will matter
[18:00] <knome> yes, i agree that's a bit more intimidating
[18:01] <knome> and we should make sure that's as smooth as possible
[18:01] <knome> (and actually review them as they show up to clear the doubts)
[18:01] <knome> which is completely fine, because you only need to approve
[18:02] <knome> i'm not saying i won't take bug reports
[18:02] <knome> i just don't want to, and i don't think it's at all unfair to ask other people to do the bit to get a merge request for me/you
[18:03] <pleia2> ok
[18:04] <knome> but yes, i do think we need to document it well because people won't do it if we tell them to "get the branch and send us merge requests if you find bugs"
[18:04] <knome> i wouldn't
[18:05] <pleia2> me neither :)
[18:05] <knome> i'll look at the US slideshow merge request today and try to document that to us
[18:05] <knome> ultimately, this way we'll have something to strive/target for for the contributors
[18:06] <pleia2> :)
[18:06] <knome> (first they need to do merge requests, once they are doing well with that, they can start approving them)
[18:08] <knome> and i think that's also the way to make xubuntu's future look brighter, to get more contributors that are committed
[18:08] <knome> (no pun intended with "committed")
[18:08] <pleia2> :)
[18:29] <knome> bluesabre_?
[18:36] <bluesabre_> whoa
[18:36] <bluesabre_> thats a lot to read
[18:36] <bluesabre_> one sec
[18:36] <pleia2> lol
[18:36] <knome> no!
[18:36] <knome> which of these are appropriate? http://packages.qa.dev.stgraber.org/qatracker/milestones/249/builds/27871/testcases
[18:38] <bluesabre_> I guess at this point, only parole
[18:38] <bluesabre_> catfish hasn't been updated yet (unless I missed that)
[18:39] <knome> ok, i'll push that to production then
[18:39] <bluesabre_> I think we should allow bugs to be reported against xubuntu-doc.  Requiring people to pull/push and merge will keep beginners away
[18:40] <bluesabre_> like pleia2 said, its intimidating
[18:40] <knome> bluesabre_, does bug filing go with normal procedures for parole or do you need something else?
[18:40] <knome> we don't have people in the docs team who weren't around last cycle.
[18:40] <knome> it's time to step up, really
[18:41] <bluesabre_> normal bug filing (ala launchpad) should be acceptable
[18:41] <knome> (and as i said, bugs are fine if they *really* can't do merge requests)
[18:41] <bluesabre_> makes it easier: ubuntu-bug parole
[18:42] <bluesabre_> it would probably be fine for merge requests and stuff if we have an awesome "contributing to documentation" documentation
[18:43] <bluesabre_> but somebody will have to merge request that too ;)
[18:43] <knome> i can create a brief one
[18:43] <bluesabre_> I don't think it would be bad to start there then
[18:44] <bluesabre_> and we can all review and revise it to make it easy
[18:44] <bluesabre_> then do a call for documentation :)
[18:45] <skellat> Where's the branch to pull from so I can later potentially make a merge request?
[18:46] <knome> https://code.launchpad.net/xubuntu-docs
[18:46] <skellat> We're still working in the Quantal series?  There's no separate Raring series?
[18:47] <pleia2> looks like it hasn't been created yet ;)
[18:48] <pleia2> we do want to work on raring though
[18:48] <pleia2> so sounds like first step is making a raring series
[18:50] <skellat> Launchpad is saying the Quantal branch was carried over into Raring and imported as the docs package already
[18:52] <pleia2> neat
[18:52] <pleia2> knome: ^^ ?
[18:52] <knome> weird that it doesn't show up in the project though.
[18:52] <knome> i'd ask #ubuntu-docs
[19:09] <knome> Len-nb, US slideshow approved and merged
[19:15] <bluesabre_> that's just the package
[19:16] <bluesabre_> the quantal xubuntu-docs.deb is in raring since we haven't released a new one
[19:16] <bluesabre_> right?
[19:17] <knome> probably
[19:17] <knome> i think we need ubuntu docs team to create the new series
[19:19] <knome> somebody else want to work on that or will i?
[19:19] <bluesabre_> can't, still at work
[19:20] <knome> pleia2, did you ask about it already?
[19:20] <pleia2> no, in meeting
[19:20] <knome> ok
[20:47] <Len-nb> knome Thank you.
[20:47] <knome> np
[20:48] <dhrasmus> hello!
[20:48] <knome> hullo
[20:49] <dhrasmus> i dropped by to tell you all that you rock, and that Xubuntu 12.04.2 was able to make use of some hardware that lots of other Linuxes failed on
[20:49] <knome> thanks. enjoy!
[20:50] <dhrasmus> I'd also like to report a few hiccups with the installer. Could somebody direct me to the best place to do that?
[20:50] <knome> which version?
[20:51] <knome> and are the bugs about the *installer* or the *installation* ?
[20:51] <dhrasmus> 12.04.2
[20:51] <dhrasmus> I did a text writeup here: https://plus.google.com/110626487457815460245/posts/j5dwGBGp3cA
[20:52] <dhrasmus> I'm still a little intimidated by Launchpad and don't quite get how that all works :-/
[20:52] <dhrasmus> Eg, if I report a bug on the Xubuntu 12.04.2 LTS installer, will that get shared with Ubuntu and its other derivatives too?
[20:52] <knome> those look like bugs in the ubiquity installer
[20:53] <knome> in this case they are shared problems, yes
[20:53] <knome> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity
[20:53] <knome> see if the bugs exist in that list
[20:57] <dhrasmus> I'll do that, thanks!
[20:58] <knome> thank you :)
[21:00] <dhrasmus> yup :)
[21:04] <micahg> bluesabre_: I think catfish will have to wait until after beta 1, sorry
[21:04] <micahg> at least we got parole in there
[21:04] <knome> micahg, bluesabre_: just ping me when other testcases are fine to be pushed to production
[22:40]  * skellat is glad he finished his training for the May 7th Primary/Special Election he may or may not be working as a substitute precinct election official


[00:25] <ubports_bot> Project daily-hammerhead build #318: SUCCESS in 11 min: http://ci.ubports.com/job/daily-hammerhead/318/
[00:27] <ubports_bot> Project ota-push build #997: SUCCESS in 1 min 49 sec: http://ci.ubports.com/job/ota-push/997/
 Is there an ubport app devel group in telegram, if yes can someone invite me ?
 Does anyone know where the manifest is for turbo? or in general how are the ubports image is built, I can only find information on the ported devices, not the official ones
 also it turns out I can't revise a sentence very well, pardon the grammar
 The official ones have no available device tree.
 Anywhere. Except maybe to Canonical.
 so are we still building the exact canonical images?
 Well, we're building with their HAL
 But it's our software
 That they made mostly. :P
 so if I wanted to fix a bug, how would I go about building the same image as the ubports server?
 Well, if it's a bug in the Android bits, you can't. But if it's a bug in the Ubuntu portion, you just need to fix and rebuild that package.
 And then install it using dpkg
 ah I see, that's awkward. Thank you
 Unless you're really sure it's a bug in the Android bits, it's probably fixable
 Is there a live image to test in a phone without installing, like LiveCD in PCs/notebooks?
 No.
[05:57] <ubports_bot> Project vivid-rootfs-armhf build #124: SUCCESS in 1 hr 30 min: http://ci.ubports.com/job/vivid-rootfs-armhf/124/
[06:05] <ubports_bot> Project ota-push build #998: SUCCESS in 7 min 59 sec: http://ci.ubports.com/job/ota-push/998/
 @Kévin, There is an app devel group but I cant get you invited, you dont have a username set ;)
[07:25] <tgBot> Matcher84 was added by: Matcher84
 @DanChapman can I deactivate automatic email recall? I do not want to get my mails automatically but I want to refresch by demand. Is this possible?
[07:51] <tgBot> <Milan Korecky> @Flohack Hi, I have seen there was new Marius uAdBlock update today including some translations, where can I find it in weblate? Thanks
[08:00] <tgBot> gennadii1981 was added by: gennadii1981
 Honor 6x?
[08:02] <tgBot> <Vijay Kumar> https://youtu.be/2k2rCl-dLfA
[08:03] <tgBot> <Vijay Kumar> Nothing related to ubuntu os... But the word is there in song ... 😁
 Ubuntu and Honor 6x?
 @gennadii1981, Nothing I can tell you about this, just I talked with a Honor guy on Gamescom, and we will get in touch with them about ideas ;)
 @bastos777, No not right now, dekkod is always on. If you disable IDLE for the account it changes to polling so you could give it a really large poll check interval. But the action to manually sync is only accessible with mouse right now. May i ask your usecase for wanting to do so?
[08:23] <ubports_bot> Project daily-fp2 build #336: SUCCESS in 13 min: http://ci.ubports.com/job/daily-fp2/336/
[08:25] <ubports_bot> Project ota-push build #999: SUCCESS in 1 min 6 sec: http://ci.ubports.com/job/ota-push/999/
 @DanChapman, My general usecase for eMails on mobile is, that I want to read eMails only when I am in the mood to do. I am a very curious guy, so if my phone or my pebble smartwatch is notifying, I interrupt what I am currently doing. This is not good neither for my health nor for my social interaction nor for focussed work.
 So just being able to stop notifications would be enough? Manually syncing will decrease the usability and proved a worse experience.
 My personal notifying is only activated for SMS, calls and messengers. But even for messengers I put some groups, e.g. this one on silent mode.
 You can disable the notifications in system settings if you don't want them.
 @DanChapman, Yes.This would be OK for me. The next enhancement could be to activate selected contacts for notifications. This would be perfect.
 @DanChapman, Ah! Thanks.Will do this for the time beeing!
 @DanChapman, This is very important and not all the people knows it.
 @UniversalSuperBox, Ahh Ryzen 1700 and its 16 cores. Glad AMD is back and giving us some alternative CPU's to pick from. Just did a BIOS update ob my motherboard the weekend. Been alot since the launch. I am sure the improvements are all in the background
 @JSJoubert, New Radeon GPU is also Great, … But for Portables...
 Nothing is there
 I have the RX 480. Performance is still great for what I use
 @Flohack, Done, thanks.
 @Ern_st added you 😊
[12:55] <ubports_bot> Project daily-mako build #111: SUCCESS in 12 min: http://ci.ubports.com/job/daily-mako/111/
[12:56] <ubports_bot> Project ota-push build #1000: SUCCESS in 49 sec: http://ci.ubports.com/job/ota-push/1000/
 @Flohack, Can you add me to this app dev group?
 Done
 Can someone port UBports to this please? :D
 (Photo, 977x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/2RURHpAM/file_490.jpg
 (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/KP5Ckidd/file_491.mp4
 (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/Toq05X06/file_492.mp4
 @popeydc, would be perfect for donald trump
 lulz
 Actually, now that I think about it... If the price is right on that, it'd make a great "Bank app phone" for all the people who need one.
 Try to type a IBAN on that
 It needs a dedicated backspace button
 haha
 If somebody would build a Smartwatch with a Fingerprint reader and a hardware password vault (no direct access from the OS)
 So i could login into banks and ssh with one swipe of my finger
 @popeydc, Which model? … Which Android version???
 @hawk_is_here, I think that may actually be Android 5
 @Lorxu, It seems to me as KitKat "4.0.4"
 It has android 7 I think
 I read about that phone today, I think it's called Jelly
 @hawk_is_here, Possible too, but I thought the top bar was still black on 4
 https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/jellyphone/jelly-the-smallest-4g-smartphone/
 @Lorxu, Well it purely depends on the OEM. … I had 2.3 long way back...  … I think some Samsung duo or something with similar UI. UI can be deceiving...
 Why is the first thing I think with any Kickstarter project "but why?"
 @hawk_is_here, The icons in the top bar look stock though
 its android 7
 Yeah, JBB showed a link, I just... did not expect that
 It just... looks old?
 I guess because everything is big these days
 @popeydc, Alright... thanks to blow off the suspense
 For this one
 Customization would be required
[14:18] <tgBot> Brian Reid was added by: Brian Reid
 Welcome :)
 does anybody have a video of UP (ubports) tested on a Nexus 5?
 Erm? You mean how it looks like?
 I can do one later maybe =)
 yeah, I just want to see if it's "usable"
 I got a N5 a couple of years ago with the sole purpose of using it with linux, but it was impossible. The battery life was like 2h and very little actually worked
 @Vijay Kumar, I think this is related much to ubuntu.  Community, people, friendly, warm, meaningful...
 @bastos777, listen to the #audiocast we cover this topic of how we can build an actual smart phone here instead of a crack cocacine interruption device which they mainly now are
 @JBBgameich, sweet. honestly the thing I miss most about cell phones is when they fit in my pocket.  I could use them with one hand.  The closest thing I owned was the HTC wildfire.  I told my wife the other day how I wish someone woudl drop something this size back into the market as it's perfect. … It could have been a 'tad' smaller even so this Jelly thing looks perfect for me and with UBports?  Niiiiice. …
[15:16] <tgBot> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTC_Wildfire
[15:17] <MCMic> Yeah nowadays if you take a small device you get something slow
 yeah... which need not be.  No surprise they already have 1.25 MILLION bucks behind them.  haha.  I'm tempted but not without knowing 100% it could go Ubuntu
 did you guys see https://www.armis.com/blueborne/ ?
 https://thenextweb.com/2017/09/12/google-down-gmail-youtube-maps/
 @harishsays, #audiocast another reason to avoid putting everything in the cloud
 (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/mSLCTZh5/file_493.webp
 @Josué, I'm using a N5 as daily driver with no issues at all. My battery lasts all day with a normal use (checking messages each 2 or 3 hours, a couple of daily calls, using some apps during the day). Except for not being able to record videos with the camera, I don't see any major problem.
 @wagafo, Nice! do you use any apps? like twitter or anything?
 @Josué, I'm not very social, but I use uNav (GPS navigation), the web browser, telegram, webwhatsapp, chess, you name it.
 @wagafo, Wow, I'm definitely giving it a go this week. Thank for the info, man.
 @janc13, yiiiiiiiiiiiikes... man....
 @harishsays, ironic.  the next #audiocast has this in the topic
 @Josué, Yes I think its in a g good state. Basically what I use daily (on the BQ, but does not matter): Telegram, Email, Webbrowser, Token Authenticator, Webapp for public transport, twitter Webapp. Hm what else 😆
 @Josué, Early version of Ubport : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJZXcfixLxk
 @Ern_st, Yeah, I I saw that one, but it doesn't really show much. Thank you though
 @Flohack, More than enough, hopefully notifications work. I had almost given up on UP, so happy this channel exists!
 Telegram notifications should work
 @wayneoutthere, Are your audiocasts only available over phone app or is there a link to access via browser?
 @nfsprodriver @neothethird Still have to review your PRs, sorry. Apparently I can't leave Paris as my flight has been cancelled 😂😂😂
 Silly question, how do you created the bot for irc bridge?
 It's TeleIRC.
 That's hosted on a box.
 I just saw the iPhone X... no home button, just swipe!!! Hmmm.... It sounds familiar...
 @Jujuyeh, Of course they steal, like Microsoft, look what people made, and then steal it and make a slick desing over it ^^
 Wireless charging, wow... My Nokia Lumia 920 already had that
 @Flohack, Well, you need to use the experience of other people to make your product better. :)
 my palm had that
 just found my pre3 .. I wonder if it still works
 @sverzegnassi, Oh no, airberlin? No pressure though, and good luck finding a place to sleep
 easyJet actually...  It's just that it's the second time I'm saying that I'm leaving but I don't 😂😂😂
 good luck 🍀
 @mymike00, +1
 @Flohack, hmmmm have to think about that
 @Jujuyeh, Yes but who could possibly resist a talking sh%t emoji
 @anpok, We need a few nice hosts ^^
 Congratulations to Apple on releasing the Nokia N9
[19:42] <tgBot> MCAdkins was added by: MCAdkins
 I was waiting for Nokia 9
 But they didn't launched it in my country
 😡😡😡
 Did Apple steal the gesture features from ubuntuphone?
 Weren't those gestures in Web OS 8 years ago?
 @UniversalSuperBox, See here. :)
 (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/cfLp4U4y/file_494.mp4
 @tipode_incognito, No, from BlackBerry OS10.
 @Tuxian, No, from the first book created by johannes gutenberg in the 1400s
 @neothethird, No, that's not the first book (just the first printed book). Codices date back at least another 1200 years, possibly more.
 ok, now we know who has to sue apple
 @neothethird, Well, maybe the first men used them when painting animals on the cave wall.
 Do we get to sue apple
 @Tuxian, too bad they didn't file a software patent
 @UniversalSuperBox, You could try - but I'd bet they'd find a counter sue!
 @UniversalSuperBox, Thanks!
 His does cloned SIM work though? Watch roams while phone stays home…
 How*
 Magic, I'd suppose
 @UniversalSuperBox, And if you lose your watch…
 An Apple SIM maybe
[21:02] <ubports_bot> Project daily-bacon build #267: SUCCESS in 11 min: http://ci.ubports.com/job/daily-bacon/267/
[21:03] <ubports_bot> Project ota-push build #1001: SUCCESS in 1 min 3 sec: http://ci.ubports.com/job/ota-push/1001/
 is someone urrently working on bacon?
 @bastos777, sorry.  busy day, haha … https://soundcloud.com/ubports
 let us know what you think about El Casto
 I know @Flohack loves it because we plugged his frogs
 @delijati, It's a core device... So I suppose that the ubports developers are with it.
 @wayneoutthere, Yeahhhh ❤
 I AM THE BASS PLAYER!
 How it test Ubports in a smartphone? … Just installing and see what happens? … And what about debugging info to upload to Ubports website?
 Many musicians here!
 @valx7, if you have one of the supported devices, just install it: github.com/ubports/ubports-installer …  If not, it will definitely not work out of the box, but you can go down the difficult road of porting halium.org to the device to make it work, but that's a very very very difficult process.
[21:45] <tgBot> Ziyad Yehia was added by: Ziyad Yehia
[21:45] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Hey there Ubports!
[21:45] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> I have just discovered your work and wanted to say it's AMAZING :D
 \o welcome and thank you :)
[21:47] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> I have recently dropped my phone (gravity eh?) and I am thinking of basically getting an old Nexus 5 and put ubuntu phone on it
[21:47] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Would you guys mind if I asked some questions that I have?
 Sure, ask away :)
[21:48] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Thanks :D !
 (Photo, 539x208) https://irc.ubports.com/1H0zrnzp/file_496.jpg Gasp, a time traveller
[21:48] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> haha don't worry —  the time travel code is on github XD
[21:49] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> So yeah, the first question (I have 4) is related to the updates
 @Ziyad Yehia, is it free and open source though?
 (Sticker, 477x512) https://irc.ubports.com/thnasgY4/file_497.webp
[21:49] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> On ubuntu, theres a software repo that you can just pull updates from. Since ubuntu phone is no longer maintained by canonical, is the software up to date?
 Yes, we can use all the latest packages from the repositories, as well as our own PPAs with custom phone-specific software. We're still based on Ubuntu 15.04, but we are working on switching to 16.04 at the moment
[21:53] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Thanks Jan! — That brings me beautifully on to Question number 2 — Is there an anticipated delivery date for the Ubuntu 16.04?
[21:53] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> And if I got a phone now with 15.04, how would I upgrade it to 16.04 later?
 No, we don't want to make any promises yet. We're working towards the switch from two sides. One side is installing our packages on 16.04 and making them work, another is backporting newer software versions (Qt, etc) to 15.04 and our current devices so we have a smooth sailing transition
 @Ziyad Yehia, Let's solve that problem as soon as we're there. If there are severe architectural changes, you will have to do a clean install, but we don't know if that will be the case yet. A simple upgrade might work, but as i said, it's not known yet. It also depends on factors like the future of .click packages... We'll see
[21:57] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Ok Cool...
[21:57] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> This is very helpful, thank you
[21:58] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Question 3 was regarding the nexus phones. Does The nexus 5x work too? Or just The Nexus 5?
 At the moment there's no image for the nexus 5 x.
[21:59] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> hahaha glad I learned that upfront! :P
 it's been in development at some point, but not the highest priority now, since we have so many other projects that are more urgent. you can see all current devices here: https://ubports.com/page/get-ubuntu-touch
[22:00] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> And finally, is it possible to write shell scripts to interact with phone functionalities? As a rudimentary example, could you perhaps use cron to automate an SMS message?
 you can script just like on the desktop, with the exception that the root filesystem is usually read-only, which can be changed by the user. I'm not sure if there's a straightforward commandline interface for sms, but something is definitely there. A quick startpage.com search gave me https://askubuntu.com/questions/615013/are-cli-commands-available-for-ubuntu-touch-s-sms-phone-and-camera-service-if, that should still work, but there might also be
[22:04] <tgBot> easier way utilizing a higher system level. in any case, i'm sure we'd be open for a pull request for a nice cli api for sending sms
 i should add that there's no systemd in 15.04, only upstart
[22:07] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> I wonder where one would find documentation on these things?
[22:08] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> The phone functionalities, I mean
 hey people, I just installed UP on a N5 from the stable channel. Just one question, what's the best email app?
 Documentation is a hurtful topic, an area were we have *a lot* of work to do. Searching the web for ofono might be a good place to start, if you're looking for higher levels, like the apps, it will all be available on docs.ubports.com at some point, but that's still under construction. docs.ubuntu.com, wiki.ubuntu.com and readme files inside repositories at github.com/ubports are your options
 Josué  Dekko (not in the OpenStore but in cdimage.ubports.com server) or for tester Dekko 2 in the OpenStore.
 @Josué, if your mailprovider supports a webinterface, you might want to try that. Else than that, there's a new version of dekko in development
 thanks
[22:13] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Ok, so are there any major drawbacks that I should be aware of?
[22:14] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> It seems like its a very noble work in progress, so It's fair to expect there to be some snags
 @Ziyad Yehia, drawbacks compared to what?
[22:14] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> a smartphone running android
[22:16] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Ah that reminds me, is the app store functional? I heard that it was closed?
 It sholud be an Android app that could test how compatible is a smartphone to install Ubports on it.
 @valx7, Only those listed are compatible. They are few and an app is not necessary. You can simply read the list
 @Ziyad Yehia, To be honest, yes, there are. For one, there are less apps. We have a lot of awesome app developers who programmed their respective asses off to deliver the basics you'd expect, but some stuff is still missing. If you heavily depend on WhatsApp or can't live without another closed source android app, you'll have a hard time on Ubuntu Touch. … Bugs? Yes, there are some, i'm not gonna lie. For me there's nothing so severe to stop me
[22:19] <tgBot> using my FP2 as a daily driver, though. And of course we're making constant improvements. If you're a developer, you're of course very welcome to help us shape the future of ubuntu touch and make the system better ;)
[22:21] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> I think the work you guys are doing is fantastic. People should have privacy and control over the devices they use especially the ones that are always at arms reach.
[22:21] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> I am also thinking from the pragmatic day to day use side.
[22:22] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Does Evernote work?
[22:22] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> thats one app I use often.
 @Ziyad Yehia, thank you :) that's what we're shooting for
 There's an evernote account plugin can be used by the Notes app and other apps, but I never treid that :)
 Offline reading and offline maps are weak areas but like Jan I used UT as sole phone, for a year, without major problems
 I was using it full time until my Nexus 4 died
 F
 @UniversalSuperBox, i agree
 @Stereofont, You can use OSMScout as offline map app.
 @Ziyad Yehia, You can sync Notes with Evernote. It's in the Ubuntu Store but hasn't made it into the Openstore yet. It's not fully featured compared to Evernote.
 @nfsprodriver, uNav as well
[22:25] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> As long as I can add notes to my evernote inbox its fine :)
 @nfsprodriver, True. It is there but I didn't get on with it well
 Right, but advantage for OSMScout are the map packs instead of tiles and the included way points.
 @neothethird, uNav offline?
 @Ziyad Yehia, the old one used by canonical still works, but it will be discontinued soon. we have our own (and better :D ) one at openstore.ubports.com
 @Stereofont, Yeah, my E4.5 often crashed due to less memory. Now I'm on N5 and it works much better.
 @Stereofont, yes, there's instructions on how to set it up inside the app. Not very easy, but if you need it, it can be done
 @nfsprodriver, Yes. I was spoiled by Osmand
 I never tried it, though. I'm very happy that roaming is free in the eu now, so i don't have to download so much :D
 @nfsprodriver, Ah. Interesting. Thanks. Mine was 4.5
 @neothethird, In the UK we have that at the moment … sigh
 @Stereofont, :'( don't leave
 @neothethird, Oh, yeah? Well, US carriers will give you the low low roaming rate of $20/50MB!
 Freedom.
 (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/swdzWT7j/file_498.mp4
 @neothethird, Don't want to leave.  If you have another device that didn't ship with Ubuntu Touch, it is not compatible
 @Stereofont, no.
 @UniversalSuperBox, today i learned there are #hashtags in telegram
[22:32] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> I am curious about the terminal app... Can I do anythin I want on the system with the terminal or is it slightly nerfed?
 (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/WjRyyus0/file_499.mp4
 @kz6fittycent, They're pretty neat. Help you search for topics.
 @Ziyad Yehia, you *can* do anything, but it can be finicky, since you can't do your hacking-on-two-keyboards-on-the-same-time thing. For some actions, you also have to ssh into localhost to bypass confinement, but in principle it's possible
 @UniversalSuperBox, #nooooooo
 Now click it
[22:34] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> what's confinement?
 It's apparmor rules to keep apps from doing Bad Things
 @kz6fittycent, Mee too
 @neothethird, Me too
 @UniversalSuperBox, plus some good things
 Kinda like how SElinux works on Fedora
 @neothethird, Exactly how SELinux works on Fedora
 @UniversalSuperBox, Only if people know about them and use them.
[22:37] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> I presume you can still "sudo" things, right?
[22:37] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> I am just trying to gauge my expectations of how this works before I spend £100 on a nexus 5 haha
[22:38] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> In my head, its like a linux desktop but on a phone.
 Yeah... It doesn't work that well
[22:39] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> @UniversalSuperBox sudo you mean?
 Except it is also a desktop
 That's why a lot of people were very upset at it... You can't apt-get or do other fun things unless you make the system image read-write which can potentially break future ota updates
 But yeah, you can use an HDMI adapter and use your phone as a desktop
 Works with the nexus 5
 @Ziyad Yehia, it's where we want to get, definitely. Not gonna lie, we're not there yet, but with some fiddeling, you can almost do anything
[22:41] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> I can't apt-get install?
[22:42] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> (Sticker, 280x512) https://irc.ubports.com/PwTu5nnt/file_500.webp
 @Ziyad Yehia, you can, but you have to mount your root file system writable and the installed packages get overwritten by the next update: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ImageBasedUpgrades/ If you don't want that, you can also only update your phone using apt-get, but that doesn't guarantee that it will always work
 (Sticker, 512x384) https://irc.ubports.com/Wzt9QsR3/file_501.webp
[22:47] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> By "next update", you mean the 16.04 one?
 no, we deliver regular image based upgrades, basically exchanges of the whole (usually non-writable) root filesystem. That way, you normally don't have to unpackage deb packages on slow phone hardware. It's an architecture decision canonical made
 updates on the stable channel usually come every one or two months
[22:51] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> This may be a bit of a sticking point
[22:53] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Because the root file system is not writable, does that mean I cant create files and directories?
[22:53] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> or the the non-writability for things outside the home folder?
 you can in the home folder
 that's where all the magic usually happens on ubuntu touch
 applications are also installed as .click packages in the home folder
[22:56] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> So how would one install something from the ubuntu repos?
 apt
 @neothethird, this
[22:57] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Oh man.
[22:58] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Thats dissapointing
 yeah, that's one of the points that's currently annoying. Canonicals vision was, that in a snap world, you don't have to mess with your rootfs anymore, but unfortunatelly we're not there yet
[23:00] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> a snap world? What's that?
[23:00] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> haha canonical missed the point that its fun to do so XD
[23:01] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> and the repos are epic being able to do that stuff on the move would be so badass, especially with the internet of things gaining momentum.
 @Ziyad Yehia, snaps are a new kind of package, that is not unpackaged like debs, but mounted as a squashfs filesystem. Has some great potential, as it's faster and more secure: snapcraft.io
[23:07] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Thats pretty epic to be fair
[23:07] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Can it not cause bloat though? If like 10 snaps all have the same dependencies?
 especially when you consider that it also expands to the OS itself.. and gives you some nice tools to build your own
[23:08] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> @anpok How do you mean? That sounds cool
 if you run ubuntu core your bootloader would pick an os snap that contains the actual rootfs from some partition.. it will either pick the newest one .. or the last one that worked (in case of a rollback)
 @Ziyad Yehia, For very common stuff, there's something called platform snaps, where you have for example stuff that all gnome or kde apps depend on anyways. but else than that, it's not that big of a problem, since snaps are still compressed and are just mounted, not uncompressed
 so you have a pain free update process.. one of the reasons why snappy is picked by many iot vendors
 @Ziyad Yehia, Also .. think of security issues .. if there is a common library with vulnerability .. you have to rely on the people shipping the snaps to push a sec. update soon. Some organizations do integrate their CI with snappy .. i.e. inkscape releases new snaps a few times a day
[23:13] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> So are apps on the ubuntu phone, snaps?
 no .. clicks .. the predecessor..
 but the company I work for is considering to ship the linux iot stuff with it..
 @nfsprodriver, we should poll how many.... i've noticed there does seem to be a a few... I"m actually in the middle of writing a 'special something' but I forgot how long it takes to record without a band! :(
 @Lorxu, when she dropped her phone it fell at the speed of light
[23:19] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> So if I am getting this right, snaps are a way to install new software on your phone...
[23:19] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> So could I perhaps take a repo package and convert it to a snap and then it would work?
 for certain definitions of "work"
 @Ziyad Yehia, not phone yet..
 with 16.04, that will work
 @neothethird, That is quite startling, actually
 we can use all the help we can to get there. If we can pull this off, it's going to be ridiculously awesome
[23:24] <tgBot> bluff was added by: bluff
 Paradigm shift
 welcome :)
[23:25] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Well then we would have a session of converting repos to snaps.
 @Stereofont, yeah, essentially. Canonical was really close, that's why we can't give up
[23:27] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> So let me summarise this: 1) We've got privacy all good. 2) We have open app store, but its not too populated yet. 3) One cannot alter the root file system (without sacrificing updates), but everything below the home folder is fair game.  4) You cant really apt-get things (because of point 3) but after 16.04 we can convert the repos to snaps 5) Its not really a phone that you can change everything on because of point 3 again.
[23:28] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Am I in the right ball park?
 @Ziyad Yehia, No phone is 'private'
 you can apt-get install, and many people do, but it's overwritten by system upgrades. but essentially yes.
[23:30] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> Can I not just write a script of all the stuff that I install?
[23:30] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> And then everytime there is an update just run that script again?
 yep
 you might have to fiddle with the partition sizes as well, if you want to go crazy installing deb packages, but that would also be possible in a script
 A missing point is that using containers (chroot or lxc) is possible to bypass the read only file system
 See Libertine for example
 (Sticker, 512x148) https://irc.ubports.com/KoLIP9he/file_502.webp
 or the OnTheRoad app, you can find it in the OpenStore
 (Sticker, 512x148) https://irc.ubports.com/gy3bARgq/file_503.webp
 https://openstore.ubports.com/app/ontheroad.emanuelesorce
 right, it's a nifty tool
[23:41] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> haha this is confusing, not gonna lie
 WorkaroundOS 😎
[23:43] <tgBot> <Ziyad Yehia> hahaha exactly XD
 (Sticker, 512x384) https://irc.ubports.com/HUUvp1HD/file_501.webp
 According to https://github.com/ubports/ubports-touch/issues/240 Can you give me the image file so I can edit it for Nexus 5?
 All phones are tracking mechanisms
[23:48] <tgBot9> <Ziyad Yehia> @Stereofont You mentioned that no phone is "private". doesnt ubuntu phone aim to give privacy to the users of the phone?
 The point is that the core OS is not intentionally spying on you
 Some problems can be solved by hardware only, like the baseband module being connected to the chipset on most phones, but on an os level, ut is definitely better than android with google services or ios
 @neothethird, +1
[23:55] <tgBot10> <Ziyad Yehia> Hmm ...
[23:55] <tgBot10> <Ziyad Yehia> Thanks so much for your help today everyone!
[23:56] <tgBot10> <Ziyad Yehia> Its getting quite late here so I'm gonna shoot off to sleep. But I have definitely learned a lot about the OS from chatting with you all today.
 @Ziyad Yehia, sure, always happy to. Let us know if you need something else 👍
 @Ziyad Yehia, good night
[23:56] <tgBot10> <Ziyad Yehia> Bye :)


[18:25] <MarkDude> So NixiePixel is doing an Open Source challenge. http://www.nixiepixel.com/nixies-open-source-challenge/


[04:38] <Muscovy> C'mon guys, let's get stuff done!
[04:38] <Muscovy> :D
[04:44] <Muscovy> I'm goign to work on the nautilus stuff.


[09:56] <mup> PR prometheus-operator#3: Functionality to take Prometheus version (major.minor only) config params and find latest patch <Created by justinmclark> <https://github.com/canonical/prometheus-operator/pull/3>
[09:57] <mup> PR #417: Added a few doc strings to charm module <Created by balbirthomas> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/417>
[13:01] <mup> Issue operator#423 opened: Test harness unable to drop relations or remote units <Created by stub42> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/issues/423>


[14:58] <newz2000> hi cjohnston, I'm back. Give me a ping when you want to chat.
[14:58] <newz2000> (been on holiday for a while)
[14:59] <cjohnston> np
[14:59] <cjohnston> If you have time now, I'm good..
[15:00] <newz2000> hey cjohnston
[15:00] <cjohnston> How was your vacation?
[15:00] <newz2000> Great. Coming back from work may be tough. :-)
[15:00] <cjohnston> lol
[15:01] <newz2000> coming back /to/ work I mean
[15:01] <newz2000> cjohnston: we use a content management system so there's nothign to check out
[15:01] <newz2000> unless you're talking about visual / html changes to the theme
[15:02] <cjohnston> I could help out with theme stuff too possible.. I was just going off the way I interpreted something on the wiki that it seemed like you checked out a local copy
[15:02] <newz2000> You mentioned bugs, is there a particular bug you'd like to tackle?
[15:02] <cjohnston> I'm definatly interested in helping out though.. I don't know to what extent you all can let me..
[15:03] <cjohnston> There are quite a few in: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-website/+bugs that I could take care of.. They are mostly simple spelling issue type errors.. or other things such as that...
[15:05] <newz2000> I'd love help like that but give me a second to work out how helpful that will be...
[15:05] <newz2000> you see, we're about to make a major revision to the website
[15:05] <cjohnston> ic
[15:05] <newz2000> it won't go live until the spring
[15:05] <newz2000> so maybe it would be useful
[15:06] <cjohnston> Fixing stuff like: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-website/+bug/502466
[15:06] <ubot3`> Malone bug 502466 in ubuntu-website "Turkish Loco site link goes to wrong web page" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[15:06] <newz2000> ah, yeah, that would still be relevent
[15:07] <cjohnston> I assume spelling issues would still exist
[15:07] <newz2000> We'll be refreshing a good bit of the website's content (i.e. rewriting or replacing it)
[15:07] <cjohnston> ok.. cool
[15:07] <newz2000> I don't know if this sounds like a complete bore to you,
[15:08] <cjohnston> I could also help with "proofing" the writing for the new site..
[15:08] <newz2000> but one thing that would be extremely helpful is to weed out the bugs that are still relevant, since many are obsolete...
[15:08] <newz2000> Do you like to triage bugs?
[15:08] <cjohnston> That's what I have been doing over the past two weeks or so...
[15:08] <newz2000> oh, have you?
[15:08] <cjohnston> yes..
[15:08] <newz2000> wow, that's awesome!
[15:08] <cjohnston> I have the open bugs down to under 200..
[15:09] <cjohnston> I don't remember what it was.. but its lower now...
[15:09] <newz2000> oh, you rock!
[15:09] <newz2000> I have bug emails getting filed automatically and I haven't had the nerve to check that folder yet. :-)
[15:09] <cjohnston> I just figured if I could fix "easy" stuff like the bug above.. I could close them out too and not "bother" the "real" developers with them..
[15:10] <cjohnston> since all that but requres is a 3 character change
[15:10] <cjohnston> I will continue triaging.. and if you can't give me the access to fix bugs, thats fine.. I understand..
[15:10] <newz2000> we won't have the system in place to allow content approval (going live w/ site refresh) so we've not allowed too many people to edit in the site
[15:11] <cjohnston> ok
[15:11] <newz2000> Is there an easy way to find bugs that are simple typos?
[15:11] <cjohnston> Not that I know of.. I have just been going through the bugs one by one...
[15:12] <cjohnston> starting with the ones listed as 'new'
[15:12] <newz2000> What would be cool is if there were a way to flag bugs that are just typos
[15:12] <newz2000> but I don't know how to do this
[15:12]  * newz2000 looks at the bug queue to see what it looks like real quicki
[15:12] <cjohnston> Maybe with a tag
[15:15] <newz2000> oh, that looks good
[15:15] <newz2000> I just added two tags, typo and broken-link
[15:15] <cjohnston> ok
[15:15] <newz2000> I wonder if it's possible to mass-tag
[15:17] <newz2000> cjohnston: I'm eager for your help on this matter and want to start using the bug tracker more
[15:17] <newz2000> I can't open up access for you to edit the website at this time
[15:17] <newz2000> what would you like to do that you think would be most effective and not a waste of time?
[15:18] <cjohnston> bug 501970 I left alone because yes, the bug is correct, but I don't think its an "ubuntu" website bug, I think it would be a bug for moblinzone.com  - but I wasnt sure if maybe the page on our end had changed or something..
[15:18] <ubot3`> Malone bug 501970 in ubuntu-website "intel_moblin_ubuntu_computex  was not found" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/501970
[15:18] <newz2000> good call
[15:19] <cjohnston> newz2000: as long as someone follows up with the work I do in the bug tracker.. I don't think it would be a waste of time.. and im willing to help out with it..
[15:19] <newz2000> ok, I will make a commitment to dealing with 25 bugs per week
[15:19] <newz2000> and I am online and active here in this IRC channel from 8:30 − 5:30 Central US time (it's 9:19 for me now) to answer your questions if you need help
[15:20] <cjohnston> ok.. I am est
[15:20] <newz2000> (though I do step away now and then to eat lunch and stuff. :-))
[15:20] <cjohnston> understandable
[15:20] <newz2000> If you have any new bugs that are simple typos or broken links, if you use the tags, I'll deal with them first
[15:21] <cjohnston> so you want stuff tagged typo and broken link
[15:21] <cjohnston> ok..
[15:21] <cjohnston> that answers my question then
[15:21] <newz2000> cjohnston: where are you located?
[15:21] <cjohnston> orlando (fl)
[15:22] <newz2000> ah, sunny, warm, Orlando
[15:22] <newz2000> I lived for 10 years in the Sarasota area
[15:22] <newz2000> my son is a Florida native (one of the few!)
[15:22] <cjohnston> bug 314692 I did need someone "smart" to look at... I don't think its offered SSL... but wasnt positive.. After the yelling I took from it.. lol
[15:22] <ubot3`> Malone bug 314692 in ubuntu "Brainstorm SSL problem, site not accessible (FF3)" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/314692
[15:22] <cjohnston> unny warm 41* orlando
[15:22] <cjohnston> yup
[15:23] <newz2000> I'm currently in chilly (-9) Des Moines IA
[15:25] <cjohnston> hehehe
[15:27] <cjohnston> on the intel_moblin bug, do you agree that isnt our bug?
[15:27] <newz2000> yes, but I think I need to report it to the right person
[15:27] <newz2000> I'll deal with it, as CES is coming up and there will be a lot of visibility here
[15:28] <cjohnston> ok.. you want me to leave it as is for now then and you can edit it?
[15:30] <newz2000> yeah
[15:44] <cjohnston> newz2000: fix released on bug 437651 then?
[15:44] <ubot3`> Malone bug 437651 in ubuntu-website "file not found 404" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/437651
[15:45] <newz2000> or mark it as a dup of 501970
[15:46] <newz2000> (which is fixed)
[15:59] <cjohnston> newz2000: bug #385568 seems to be fixed to me.. do you want me to mark stuff like this fix released, or what do you want?
[15:59] <ubot3`> Malone bug 385568 in moin "Anchor links with spaces are incorrectly encoded" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/385568
[16:00] <newz2000> cjohnston: yes, if it's fixed or obsolete, it'd be awesome to have it marked accordingly
[16:00] <cjohnston> Okie..
[16:06]  * cjohnston can't change things to wishlist.. heh.. oh well
[16:14] <cjohnston> Is the US Ubuntu Store closed newz2000? Can you confirm that?
[16:14] <newz2000> cjohnston: yes, it is
[16:18] <cjohnston> newz2000: I had to.. hehe bug #503009
[16:18] <ubot3`> Malone bug 503009 in ubuntu-website "USA Store needs to be removed from shop.ubuntu.com" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/503009
[16:19] <newz2000> ok, I'll start by fixing the banner on the side then asking for a redirect from shop.ubuntu.com to shop.canonical.com
[16:19] <cjohnston> ok
[16:33] <cjohnston> newz2000: are you responsible for kubuntu.org also?
[16:33] <newz2000> cjohnston: no, not directly
[16:33] <newz2000> there's a different project in launchpad for kubuntu.org
[16:34] <cjohnston> Ok..There doesnt seem to be a way to download the LTS on Kubuntu is why I ask..
[16:36] <newz2000> I wonder when we had an LTS version last
[16:37] <cjohnston> http://ubuntu-mirror.cs.colorado.edu/releases/kubuntu/
[16:38] <cjohnston> there is an 8.04.2 - which isnt listed on the hashes page, which was a bug, which is why I started investigating
[16:49] <cjohnston> newz2000: is there a requrirement to be listed on http://www.ubuntu.com/support/local ? The reason I ask is since there is a link to the "full list of teams" I would not think every loco would be listed on that page.. There are some bugs filed against that page though since some approved teams arent listed there.. I don't want to confirm bugs if the teams for some reason dont meet a requirement.
[16:49]  * cjohnston is keeping you busy today.. lol
[16:53] <newz2000> hmm… this is an interesting question
[16:54] <newz2000> cjohnston: if you were going to guess, how many outstanding bugs refer to this? (very rough guess is fine)
[16:55] <cjohnston> so far I have found 1.. but it has two different "reports" to it... bug 324223 - for reference.. technically 2 that i have found
[16:55] <ubot3`> Malone bug 324223 in ubuntu-website "Danish team info missing from http://www.ubuntu.com/support/local" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/324223
[16:56] <newz2000> cjohnston: yeah, I say we go ahead and make these changes to the website and think about a better way to do this down the road.
[16:56] <newz2000> I'll ask jono for his opinion.
[16:57] <cjohnston> okie..
[20:51] <cjohnston> newz2000: did you see the response to bug 314692?
[20:51] <ubot3`> Malone bug 314692 in ubuntu "Brainstorm SSL problem, site not accessible (FF3)" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/314692
[20:51] <cjohnston> he doesnt seem happy
[20:51] <cjohnston> lol