[12:00] <rjek> RhythmBox takes 2 minutes to load its whopping XML database of my MP3 collection, and doesn't actually have any queueing functionality at all that I can find.
[12:00] <osiris_22> how do i install a source file
[12:00] <sval> osiris_22 what do you mean by install a source file ?
[12:00] <rjek> Right, I've got XMMS working, ta.
[12:00] <HrdwrBoB> rjek: esd allows multiple apps to play
[12:00] <geppy> osiris_22:  tar -xvzf, then cd to the directory, and './compile && make && sudo make install' works for most things.
[12:00] <HrdwrBoB> at the same time
[12:00] <rjek> I know what esd does.
[12:00] <HrdwrBoB> yeah
[12:00] <HrdwrBoB> of course it's a problem
[12:01] <HrdwrBoB> but the basic goal of ubuntu is for the the 'supported' apps to Just Work
[12:01] <gen> just hrdwrbob eh
[12:01] <HrdwrBoB> and esd allows that to happen
[12:01] <rjek> Totem hardly works at all!
[12:01] <HrdwrBoB> true :(
[12:01] <wfx> is there any special in ubuntu to use a printer via a cups server (printer works fine from other clients)
[12:01] <rjek> It can't even redraw its window properly when playing music, and the playlisting simply does not work.
[12:01] <rjek> You add a file to the playlist, except it doesn't actually get added.
[12:02] <bob2> totem is a video player
[12:02] <geppy> wfx:  cups is an option in the printer dialog, no?
[12:02] <bob2> use a music player like rhythmbox or cplay
[12:02] <geppy> or xmms
[12:02] <geppy> or beep-media-player, or muine
[12:02] <sval> wfx, just configure the printers via the official web interface ;)
[12:02] <geppy> I would strongly advise you against both Totem and Rhythmbox
[12:02] <HrdwrBoB> I use rhythmbox
[12:02] <HrdwrBoB> it's good
[12:02] <gen> muine is a pain to install, but i like it
[12:02] <rjek> bob2: Well, it certainly claims to play sound, and even offers visualisation features for when you're playing just sound.  (Which of course, doesn't work.)
[12:02] <HrdwrBoB> but as you said, I want queuing functionality
[12:02] <rjek> RhythmBox is unforgivably awful.
[12:03] <bob2> rjek: please file bugs
[12:03] <scizzo> rjek: totem works fine for me
[12:03] <sval> wfx go to http://localhost:631
[12:03] <wfx> geppy: yes and setup one in ubuntu bit it will not print (status is alway "printer stoped")
[12:03] <scizzo> rjek: but you should understand the difference between hoary and warty also
[12:03] <bob2> and please provide constructive criticism instead subjective of blanket statements
[12:03] <rjek> scizzo: That I do.
[12:03] <geppy> bob2:  Me?  I've done so, only half an hour ago.
[12:03] <jon1012> rjek: lol rhythmbox is heaven :p
[12:04] <jon1012> arg don't kill me :p
[12:04] <bob2> geppy: ?
[12:04] <wfx> sval: is not local but ok what now
[12:04] <geppy> bob2: and please provide constructive criticism instead subjective of blanket statements
[12:04] <geppy> I'm asking who that is to refer to.
[12:05] <rjek> bob2: OK.    Its user interface makes it nigh-on impossible to find stuff in large collections, no matter how tidily organised.  It has no queuing functionality.  Resorting the main listing takes seemingly forever.  It uses more memory than the earth simulator.  There doesn't appear to be a way of setting a rating to zero stars from the list view.  There's no (at least obvious) way of rating multiple tracks at the sam
[12:05] <bob2> geppy: the person I spoke to immediately prior, rjek
[12:05] <geppy> bob2:  Alright.
[12:05] <bob2> rjek: one of those is a lie, some are subjective, and some are real bugs
[12:05] <rjek> Which is the lie?
[12:06] <geppy> bob2:  I see no lies;  they're all problems that I agree with.
[12:06] <bob2> I'm pretty sure the earth simulator doesn't run on my laptop
[12:06] <rjek> Ok, that was hyperbole, but not a lie. :)
[12:06] <bob2> define it how you like
[12:06] <bob2> but please file bugs on the rest if someone hasn't already
[12:07] <wfx> sval: what next?
[12:07] <rjek> Should I report each issue as a seperate bug?
[12:07] <bob2> well, the author is probably in a better position to decide on that
[12:08] <bob2> if each is an actual issue that has not been reported already, yes
[12:08] <scizzo> nice...just noticed that my rhythmbox does not have the radio stations anymore
[12:09] <osiris_22> guys
[12:09] <osiris_22> i cant seem to get aim installed for linux
[12:09] <osiris_22> i dotn understand like the targz file
[12:09] <osiris_22> isnt working
[12:09] <gen> osiris_22, use gaim
[12:09] <osiris_22> the dabien files arnt working
[12:09] <gen> comes with ubuntu
[12:09] <geppy> osiris_22:  Use GAIM.
[12:09] <osiris_22> no i need aim
[12:09] <osiris_22> for a reason
[12:09] <geppy> osiris_22:  Why?
[12:09] <gen> what reason
[12:09] <geppy> osiris_22:  What reason?
[12:09] <osiris_22> because of the link reasons
[12:09] <wfx> geppy: the printer is accesable via windos and linux client(gentoo) but i want work from ubuntu.
[12:09] <gen> link reasons?
[12:10] <gen> aols version of aim for linux is god awful
[12:10] <osiris_22> yes me and my dude link our screens names together
[12:10] <geppy> wfx:  how is it not accessible from Ubuntu?
[12:10] <geppy> osiris_22:  What are you talking about?
[12:10] <osiris_22> linking 2 screen names together
[12:10] <padlefot> i just cant get my resolution in XF86Config UP!
[12:10] <Quest-Master> Direct Connect.
[12:10] <geppy> osiris_22:  Right, so, since I didn't get it the first time...  Could you elaborate?
[12:10] <padlefot> anybody??
[12:10] <Quest-Master> It doesn't work in Gaim.
[12:10] <geppy> Quest-Master:  Thank-you.
[12:10] <wfx> geppy: yes i see it but it does not print anything
[12:10] <Quest-Master> Osiris_22: Live without DC.
[12:11] <gen> doesn't work in aols version either as far as i know (for linux)
[12:11] <Quest-Master> I do.
[12:11] <Quest-Master> Doesn't work in Linux's AIM.
[12:11] <geppy> wfx:  Are you sure that you've correctly identified the printer?
[12:11] <Quest-Master> You'll have to live with it.
[12:11] <geppy> wfx:  You may be using incorrect drivers, perhaps?
[12:11] <osiris_22> and with gaim
[12:11] <osiris_22> i cant seem to send any files
[12:11] <osiris_22> gaim crashes every time
[12:11] <osiris_22> and ams
[12:11] <geppy> osiris_22:  Run GAIM 1.03
[12:11] <osiris_22> amsn
[12:11] <osiris_22> isnt stable
[12:11] <gen> osoris_22, i send files fine in gaim..
[12:12] <Quest-Master> Direct Connect is different, gen
[12:12] <osiris_22> it fucken closes on me eveyrtime i try to send a file
[12:12] <Quest-Master> Dude, just use Gaim.
[12:12] <gen> Quest-Master, yeah i know
[12:12] <Quest-Master> apt-get install gaim --reinstall
[12:12] <gen> i said send files, not d-im
[12:12] <Quest-Master> k.
[12:12] <osiris_22> dude
[12:12] <osiris_22> ive reinstalled gaim before
[12:12] <osiris_22> its like the verson isnt stable or something
[12:13] <geppy> osiris_22:  Run GAIM 1.03
[12:13] <bob2> lordy
[12:13] <Hikaru79> osiris_22, GAIM is the #1 most popular item on SourceForge. If something's not working, it probably means you've got something now set up right
[12:13] <Hikaru79> Rather than GAIM being wrong >_>
[12:13] <osiris_22> synaptic set it up man
[12:13] <osiris_22> ok
[12:13] <osiris_22> if i iinstall game 1.03 ill have to do it from a source right?
[12:14] <gen> unless using hoary repos osiris
[12:14] <osiris_22> we are also trying to find a voice chat also and skype is really shitty
[12:14] <geppy> osiris_22:  Hoary has GAIM 1.0.3
[12:15] <martxel> anyone of you has installed hoary?
[12:16] <Hikaru79> I have
[12:16] <geppy> martxel:  I am running Hoary.
[12:16] <gen> martxel, of course..
[12:16] <Hikaru79> =)
[12:16] <Hikaru79> A whole bunch of people on the forums have, as well.
[12:16] <osiris_22> im not gonna reinstall ubuntu lmao
[12:16] <osiris_22> fuck that i got everything working nicely accept gaim
[12:16] <gen> stop using that language, seriously
[12:16] <bob2> please stop swearing
[12:16] <geppy> osiris_22:  No-one is asking you to.
[12:16] <osiris_22> its ok geppy
[12:16] <martxel> geppy and gen dont you have problems with the sound playing with totem, mplayer, xine?
[12:17] <martxel> playing films
[12:17] <geppy> martxel:  concurrent sound?
[12:17] <Hikaru79> martxel, I have hoary and I don't..
[12:17] <martxel> only the sound of the films
[12:17] <martxel> :S
[12:17] <bob2> and "lmao" and "lol" is not punctuation
[12:17] <bob2> and judging from os	's desciprtion of the problem, moving to hoary is not a good idea
[12:17] <geppy> martxel: I have no problems with sound in mplayer.
[12:17] <martxel> i think the problem is with the ouput device
[12:18] <fko> bye..
[12:18] <martxel> but i dont know what to do
[12:18] <geppy> martxel:  Are you still using the mplayer from the repository?
[12:18] <martxel> geppy the problem is that i dont know how to install without the apt-get
[12:19] <geppy> martxel:  I was telling you;  if you run that shell script, then it will install it from source, without you needing to do a thing, other than run it.
[12:19] <geppy> martxel:  If you'd like help installing it like that, I can help you.
[12:20] <verden01> HI
[12:20] <verden01> Does anyone run ubuntu64
[12:21] <bob2> it's best to just ask your question
[12:21] <AndyR> nite ppl
[12:21] <verden01> bob2, was that aimed at me?
[12:21] <geppy> verden01:  Yes.
[12:21] <gen> verden01, yeah it was
[12:21] <mattgirv> Howdy :D
[12:21] <bob2> verden01: yeah
[12:21] <mattgirv> Does anyone know where JAVA installs to on default?
[12:22] <mattgirv> I am trying to install Azureus
[12:22] <bob2> mattgirv: wiki.ubuntu.com/RestrictedFormats
[12:22] <bob2> it's alos in the FAQ, which is the first item in the channel topic
[12:22] <mattgirv> um, i have already installed it, but i wanted to know where it goes
[12:23] <mattgirv> becuase i need to point azureus to it
[12:23] <bob2> depends on how you installed it
[12:23] <mattgirv> bin file :/
[12:24] <verden01> ok  well i have upgraded ubuntu via apt-get and was wondering if anyone had successfuly added the debian 64 repositories and upgrade without breaking ubuntu
[12:24] <bob2> verden01: please don'tdo that
[12:24] <bob2> it's a bad idea
[12:24] <geppy> Agreed.
[12:24] <bob2> mattgirv: /usr/local/java or something I guess.  it didn't say during the install?
[12:24] <verden01> care to explain  :-)
[12:25] <sid77> mattgirv, try un "which java"
[12:25] <mattgirv> heh it might of said, in the install.. but i cannot remember
[12:25] <bob2> they can be subtly incompatible
[12:25] <sid77> s/a/un
[12:25] <mattgirv> sid77 : sorry? "which java" ?
[12:25] <bob2> and if you don't understand how, you will have problems, and no one will be able to help you
[12:25] <verden01> cool ok thought i'd ask here b4 going ahead
[12:25] <bob2> why do you want to do this, anyway?
[12:25] <sid77> mattgirv, open a terminal and write "which java"
[12:26] <verden01> because i have an AMD64 system
[12:26] <mattgirv> oh ok
[12:26] <osiris_22> ok
[12:26] <mattgirv> ahh found it :D
[12:26] <osiris_22> i just reinstalled skype
[12:26] <osiris_22> blah
[12:26] <osiris_22> amsn
[12:26] <osiris_22> blah
[12:26] <osiris_22> klmao
[12:26] <osiris_22> game
[12:26] <mattgirv> /usr/local/j2re1.4.2_05/bin
[12:26] <osiris_22> gaim
[12:26] <sid77> mattgirv, "which" command locate binaries in your $PATH
[12:26] <gen> osiris_22, shut up
[12:26] <osiris_22> lmao jesus
[12:26] <geppy> osiris_22:  Don't do that!
[12:26] <osiris_22> andy it didnt work
[12:26] <bob2> osiris_22: please stop it
[12:26] <osiris_22> i still cant send files
[12:26] <osiris_22> stop what?
[12:26] <geppy> osiris_22:  You aren't helping yourself.  Be specific, and don't be obnoxioous.
[12:26] <verden01> so what your saying is just stick with the ubuntu sources.list?
[12:26] <geppy> Being obnoxious!
[12:26] <gen> osiris_22, flooding
[12:26] <osiris_22> no im not
[12:27] <gen> don't expect to get help
[12:27] <osiris_22> i kept saying the wrong thing
[12:27] <geppy> verden01:  Yes;  use multiverse, if you want.
[12:27] <bob2> osiris_22: then perhaps consider saying nothing?
[12:27] <osiris_22> i reinstalled gaim and well it didnt fix the problem
[12:27] <TD> are there any forum admins around? is this the right place to find them, or is there an #ubuntu-devel type channel?
[12:27] <geppy> osiris_22:  How did it not fix the problem?  We can't help you if you're not specific.
[12:27] <geppy> TD: #ubuntu-devel =)
[12:27] <bob2> TD: email whichever guy runs them
[12:27] <zenwhen> the problem being?
[12:28] <bob2> no, the guy running them is not a developer
[12:28] <zenwhen> TD #ubuntuforums
[12:28] <osiris_22> every time i try to send a file
[12:28] <verden01> can i install flashplayer from Synaptic?
[12:28] <osiris_22> it crashes gaim
[12:28] <wfx> ok no printing via ubuntu.
[12:28] <TD> zenwhen: the problem being that i need to talk to somebody about some posts on it, in private
[12:28] <geppy> verden01:  No, look at the wiki.
[12:28] <verden01> k
[12:28] <gen> osiris_22, you really suck at details
[12:28] <gen> just letting you know
[12:28] <geppy> hahaha  =)
[12:28] <osiris_22> i go to send a file.. the program crashes
[12:28] <TD> zenwhen: in particular somebody who has some influence over a certain moderator
[12:28] <osiris_22> what more details do i need..
[12:28] <osiris_22> thats kinda everything there
[12:29] <geppy> osiris_22:   *sigh*
[12:29] <socomm> verden01: Can you? :^P
[12:29] <sval> osiris_22 , run gaim via a terminal and past the error messages
[12:29] <bob2> osiris_22: maybe windows is a better choice?
[12:29] <zenwhen> RD, none of the mods seem to be "online" right now. I know some mods though.
[12:29] <zenwhen> Hit me on pm.
[12:29] <geppy> osiris_22:  Try posting your console messages TO A PASTEBIN.
[12:29] <bob2> it seems linux doesn't make you happy
[12:29] <zenwhen> They are ops in my channel.
[12:29] <geppy> bob2: heh, true
[12:29] <osiris_22> gaim is the only problem im haven
[12:29] <osiris_22> and i use aim alot!
[12:29] <gen> we can tell you do
[12:29] <geppy> hahaha
[12:30] <farruinn> this is a silly question, but how do I start X?
[12:30] <geppy> farruinn: startx
[12:30] <gen> garruinn, startx
[12:30] <sval> farruinn startx
[12:30] <farruinn> startx as my own user, sudo?
[12:30] <geppy> farruinn:  Either.
[12:30] <bob2> no
[12:30] <bob2> as your user
[12:30] <geppy> farruinn:  Actually, sudo isn't a good idea.
[12:30] <bob2> but by default gdm will run anyway
[12:30] <geppy> farruinn:  But I was thinking that you could sudo to a different user.
[12:30] <farruinn> geppy, isn't that su?
[12:31] <geppy> farruinn:  Erm... right.
[12:31] <geppy> farruinn:  But you can sudo as a different user, as well.
[12:32] <farruinn> oh cool
[12:32] <farruinn> haha, I forgot, I had run startx but it was going really slow - seemed like it had frozen, so I went to dinner, but it's up now
[12:32] <farruinn> (that was a while ago)
[12:33] <farruinn> I'm trying to use different wm's with gnome
[12:33] <rjek> bob2: How long does the BTS usually take in sending confirmation emails for new accounts?
[12:33] <geppy> rjek:  I figure that if anyone knew, they'd have said something, by now.
[12:34] <farruinn> ameterus doesn't look very swell
[12:34] <geppy> rjek:  Go have some ice cream, and look for it tomorrow.  =)
[12:34] <osiris_22> does anyone know a good voice chat program?
[12:34] <rjek> I'll have lost my demented fury then, and the bug report won't be half as useful. :)
[12:35] <mjr> osiris_22, gnomemeeting perhaps
[12:35] <mjr> uses standard protocols, can interoperate with ms netmeeting and stuff
[12:36] <geppy> rjek:  heh, 'vi ~/infuriatedbugrepot'  =P
[12:36] <Q-FUNK> or linphone
[12:36] <sval> osiris_22 skype
[12:36] <rjek> geppy: I don't know what information the BTS will ask from me yet. :)
[12:37] <geppy> rjek:  Say everything that you can think of, then.  =0
[12:37] <geppy> *=)
[12:37] <sval> skype skype skype
[12:37] <rjek> Skype's not actually all that good, either.
[12:37] <sval> all depend on your needs !
[12:38] <rjek> The quality of call you get between copies of Skype is fairly rank, and the quality of call you get to the phone system is just shocking.
[12:38] <verden01> i can't see anything about flashplayer in the WIKI
[12:38] <wfx> is there any wiki for ubuntu an printer setup?
[12:38] <mjr> hmm, right, linphone was that sip-using thing. Well, hopefully gnomemeeting's sip support will arrive soonish
[12:39] <geppy> verden01:  Look in the proprietary formats section.  Actually, just download the flash player off of their website.
[12:39] <geppy> verden01:  Macromedia's website, that is.
[12:40] <wfx> good night
[12:40] <verden01> k
[12:41] <dont_know_what> hi all
[12:42] <dont_know_what> first time here
[12:42] <scoon> yo, yo, yo
[12:42] <dont_know_what> question: does anyone know how to setup x.org xserver?
[12:42] <scoon> what's up party people
[12:42] <scoon> dont_know_what, set up how ?
[12:42] <scoon> dont_know_what, what do you want it to do ?
[12:43] <dont_know_what> replace the normal xfree86-xserver
[12:43] <gen> going hoary would do that
[12:43] <mjr> it uses the same config file format as XFree86
[12:43] <dont_know_what> gen: i did
[12:43] <dont_know_what> mjr: i now
[12:43] <scoon> cp /etc/X11/XF86Config-4 /etc/X11/xorg.conf
[12:43] <dont_know_what> mjr: sorry i should be more specific
[12:43] <gen> oh 'setup'
[12:44] <scoon> dont_know_what, and then set fire up xorg
[12:44] <scoon> dont_know_what, they have the same config file
[12:44] <sval> dont_know_what apt-get install -t hoary xserver-xorg
[12:44] <scoon> dont_know_what, infact, xorg may read XF86Config-4 if xorg.conf does not exist.
[12:45] <Scognito> what is the page of the wiki where i can set up nvidia card?
[12:45] <Scognito> where is i mean
[12:45] <sval> dont_know_what just have to install the hoary package ... not necessery to upgrade all the distro to hoary
[12:45] <dont_know_what> scoon:  i've already added the hoary sources, replaced xfree with xorg, but.....
[12:45] <scoon> dont_know_what, but what man, i can't read minds.
[12:45] <dont_know_what> scoon: sorry, i was still typing
[12:46] <scoon> dont_know_what, that's cool, no worries.
[12:46] <scoon> dont_know_what, but i still can't read minds.
[12:46] <scoon> :0
[12:46] <dont_know_what> scoon: but startx won't give me anything more than the default X background
[12:46] <gen> the force is strong with this one
[12:46] <dont_know_what> scoon: gdm will say another X session is using the console and no machine won't connect for no obvious reason
[12:46] <sval> dont_know_what did you upgrade gdm ? maybe it can fix the problem
[12:47] <scoon> dont_know_what, how about this: /etc/init.d/gdm stop && killall gdm
[12:47] <sval> dont_know_what apt-get install -t hoary gdm
[12:47] <dont_know_what> sval: i have the latest from hoary
[12:47] <scoon> dont_know_what, just for sanity's sake.
[12:47] <scoon> dont_know_what, and then /etc/init.d/gdm start
[12:47] <mjr> if the default X background appears, there's nothing wrong with the X setup as such
[12:47] <dont_know_what> scoon: ok let me try it now
[12:47] <sid77> bye all
[12:48] <scoon> dont_know_what, that screen you are getting is xorgs window manager (think openbox kind of thing)
[12:48] <scoon> gen, what force is that, young grasshopper
[12:48] <mjr> X sessions might be screwed though :)
[12:48] <dont_know_what> mjr: yes, but it seems to mess with the text consoles (as if the resolution is incorrect) and xdm will not give me anything more either. although at least it does not complain about the console being used
[12:48] <dert> helloo
[12:49] <dont_know_what> mjr: how do i fix x sessions?
[12:49] <piyr> i want to install a more recent version of mysql than what is on synaptic -- how do i do that with ubuntu?
[12:49] <scoon> sval, neat trick.  how does that work out.
[12:50] <scoon> damn, man pages really help out.
[12:51] <sval> scoon, what do you mean by neat trick ? english is not my first langage
[12:52] <scoon> sval, sorry, i just didn't read the apt-get man pages close enough.  that is a good suggestion.
[12:52] <scoon> sval, :)
[12:52] <sval> scoon, ok no prob
[12:53] <padlefot> piyr: atp-get update mysqld?
[12:53] <padlefot> **apt
[12:53] <socomm> scoon: That's why they're there.
[12:53] <scoon> socomm, really? after 6years of running linux, you'd think i would read them more.......
[12:53] <sval> scoon, just have a look here ! http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/PinningHowto
[12:54] <piyr> padlefot: thanks
[12:54] <padlefot> let me know how it turned out
[12:54] <padlefot> :)
[12:58] <scoon> exit
[12:58] <socomm> Anyone know why highlights don't work in vim anymore.
[12:59] <geppy> socomm:  Check your vim settings?
[12:59] <socomm> geppy: I did.
[12:59] <geppy> socomm:  hmph
[12:59] <scizzo> night
[12:59] <geppy> g'night
[01:01] <geppy> Would anyone know why Rhythmbox 0.8.8 is in the Hoary repository, and 0.8.7 is current, according to rhythmbox.org?
[01:01] <socomm> geppy: cvs build maybe?
[01:02] <geppy> socomm:  That's what I was thinking.
[01:02] <carthik> geppy, it must be a dev version, prolly, there is 0.9 here -> http://rhythmbox.org/development.html
[01:02] <geppy> Oh, I missed that.  heh.  Thanks.
[01:03] <oejfap> hi all
[01:03] <oejfap> i had an nvidia card and i used nvidia kernel and nvidia binary
[01:04] <oejfap> now i'm using matrox g400
[01:04] <geppy> Why?
[01:04] <geppy> It's seriously a bad idea to run anything other than Nvidia.
[01:04] <oejfap> what i have to do to enable glx again? i got glx extension missing, but i have the module loaded on xorfg.conf (hoary)
[01:04] <funnylookinhat> He's right you know.
[01:05] <oejfap> the videocard nvidia was not mine
[01:05] <oejfap> is there a way to reconfigure X ?
[01:05] <oejfap> i tried with:
[01:05] <oejfap> dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree86
[01:05] <oejfap> /usr/sbin/dpkg-reconfigure: /usr/sbin/dpkg-reconfigure: xserver-xfree86 is broken or not fully installed
[01:06] <Ribs> oejfap: Have you tried re-installing with Synaptic?
[01:06] <Ribs> That might bring up the config
[01:06] <socomm> geppy: How you figure? Most video cards will work with X, some even with acceleration.
[01:06] <oejfap> if i try to re-install xserver-xfree86 i got:
[01:06] <oejfap> The following packages will be REMOVED:
[01:06] <oejfap>   x-window-system-core xorg-driver-synaptics xserver-xorg
[01:06] <oejfap> The following NEW packages will be installed:
[01:06] <oejfap>   xserver-xfree86
[01:06] <oejfap> is it ok?
[01:06] <Ribs> heh
[01:07] <socomm> oejfap: You'll have to reinstall xserver-xfree86.
[01:07] <geppy> socomm:  It's a pain, though, and few non-Nvidia cards work with 3d acceleration.  I don't know of any, at least.
[01:07] <Ribs> so you're using xserver-xorg now?
[01:07] <Ribs> not xfree?
[01:07] <crimsun> geppy: yep
[01:07] <socomm> oejfap: Maybe --force-all with dpkg.
[01:07] <oejfap> but xorg will be removed
[01:07] <socomm> geppy: I had an old sis card working with 3D accel a few months back.
[01:08] <geppy> socomm:  I don't doubt it, but your past tense verb worries me.  =)
[01:08] <socomm> geppy: What you probably meant was, "avoid ATi, like the plague" or something.
[01:08] <geppy> hahaha
[01:09] <geppy> For the most part, yes, but I don't know of anyone else that's actively making (and selling) any decent video cards.
[01:09] <geppy> Though I suppose that there _are_ people in this world who are willing to use older video hardware.
[01:10] <socomm> geppy: They are nice if ATi decides to support your OS, otherwise ...
[01:10] <geppy> socomm:  True.
[01:10] <Ribs> Linux support from ATI is coming...
[01:10] <geppy> Ribs: hahaha
[01:10] <Ribs> It's just a matter of time, really
[01:10] <socomm> Ribs: Not fast enough. :^P
[01:10] <Ribs> geppy: ATI have said this themselevs
[01:10] <geppy> Ribs:  They _are_ "supporting" Linux, you know.  They just don't care.
[01:10] <Ribs> They have increased the resources they're giving Linux
[01:10] <geppy> Just because we're "supported" doesn't mean that we're supported.
[01:11] <geppy> Ribs:  Really?  I'm interested.  Can you give me any links?  =)
[01:11] <Ribs> The drivers will be on par with Nvidia in around six months, I think
[01:11] <Ribs> geppy: yeah, hold on..
[01:11] <geppy> Now _that_ would be something.
[01:11] <geppy> Thanks.
[01:11] <socomm> Ribs: That's not saying much though.
[01:11] <geppy> socomm:  Do you have troubles with the nvidia drivers?
[01:11] <Ribs> http://www.rage3d.com/index.php?node=getarticle&u=content%2Finterviews%2FATIChats%2F&p=4
[01:11] <Ribs> there you, geppy
[01:11] <geppy> Thanks.
[01:12] <Ribs> That was done about a month ago
[01:12] <socomm> geppy: Other then my TTY being unusable, and having the drivers only work once my system is warm, no.
[01:12] <socomm> s/them/them fuck
[01:12] <Ribs> mjr: Actually, Nvidia have worked hard to make thier driver work well with all versions
[01:13] <Ribs> Obviously, it's not perfect
[01:13] <Ribs> but they have put a lot of effort into it
[01:13] <geppy> socomm:  Well, that's unfortunate.  I've never had trouble with the Nvidia drivers.
[01:14] <mjr> Ribs, yes, they have decided to support rather many versions, but the above is still true, which, among others, some linux/ppc users may curse
[01:14] <Ribs> mjr: They can't be all things to all people
[01:14] <socomm> geppy: Consider yourself fortunate. I've read other people having the same with the Frame Buffer being scrambled when nVidia loads up.
[01:14] <geppy> Linux/PPC users have little not to curse.
[01:14] <socomm> s/same/same problem
[01:14] <Ribs> mjr: To be honest, what use is Nvidia to PPC users?
[01:14] <socomm> Geez my grammar sucks.
[01:14] <Ribs> I can't think of a single game which has a Linux PPC release
[01:14] <geppy> socomm:  I do consider myself fortunate.  But, I will say that I've installed Linux on many Nvidia boxes at many a LAN, and they've never had problems, either.
[01:15] <socomm> Ribs: nVidia is packed in with Powerbooks and iBooks you know.
[01:15] <Ribs> I know that.
[01:15] <Ribs> It's in the latest iMac too
[01:15] <crimsun> Ribs: not even Savage? quake 3? rtcw? et?
[01:15] <Ribs> et has a PPC version?
[01:15] <mjr> they can't be all things to all people, yes, but they could at least be people to provide specs, maybe even (some) source
[01:16] <Ribs> mjr: I doubt that will ever happen.
[01:16] <mjr> "ever" is a long time, but not in the near future, no
[01:16] <mjr> which is kinda why I'm dissing them, you know
[01:16] <Ribs> Yes, I'd love to see open source, but I can't see it happening
[01:17] <Se7h> ./Mercury/Mercury: line 1554: /home/seth/Mercury/jre/bin/java: Permission denied
[01:17] <Se7h> o.0
[01:17] <socomm> geppy: Wish I would say the same.
[01:17] <mjr> of course, it's the sad situation that there are no good guys in the mainstream video card business at the moment
[01:18] <socomm> Se7h: Huh?
[01:18] <mjr> (hence I bought ATIs last card to have specs available and a working DRI driver, the 9250)
[01:19] <geppy> heh
[01:19] <geppy> I particularly like this bit of that ATI interview:
[01:19] <geppy> "Is there any focus on implementing AIW features under linux? "
[01:19] <socomm> I remember the i81* video chip had some nasty problems  before intel umm ....
[01:19] <geppy> "Currently there is no focus."
[01:19] <socomm> What is AIW?
[01:19] <geppy> As in, they don't focus on anything in their development??
[01:20] <geppy> I don't know, I just find the admission of the lack of focus amusing.  A bit of a Spoonerism, there.
[01:20] <Ribs> It's a Politician response
[01:20] <geppy> All of the responses are.
[01:21] <geppy> Which is why I doubt that ATI is going to do anything about the whole "ATI sucks on Linux" problem.
[01:21] <Ribs> geppy: Only time will tell.
[01:21] <Ribs> Personally, I found it quiet uplifting reading that interview
[01:22] <Ribs> Even tho I don't have a ATI, it's nice that people will finally have a resonable choice
[01:22] <Ribs> assuming everything pans out
[01:22] <socomm> Maybe once GNU/Linux gets bigger on the desktop.
[01:22] <karakth> Not likely to happen anytime soon.
[01:22] <Ribs> Why not?
[01:22] <geppy> Or once ATI goes out of business, which would be many Linux user's dream.
[01:23] <Ribs> Linux is growing every day
[01:23] <geppy> *users'
[01:23] <socomm> karakth: Yah.
[01:23] <Ribs> geppy: That would be a terrible thing to happen
[01:23] <Ribs> Nvidia would loose thier main competetor
[01:23] <socomm> geppy: lusers
[01:23] <karakth> Linux is growing very slowly every day. On the desktop, anyway.
[01:23] <geppy> hahaha
[01:23] <Ribs> without competetion, there is no innovation
[01:23] <geppy> I'm not saying that _I_ wish for it, only that many do.
[01:23] <Ribs> then they are idiots
[01:23] <mjr> ah well, ATI is probably not going to manufacture <=9250 cards for very long now, and after that, they're useless to the free world ;)
[01:24] <geppy> It's not as if ATI's products would disappear if they went out of business; they'd auction of their technology.
[01:24] <Ribs> geppy: Need I remind you of what happened to 3dfx?
[01:24] <socomm> geppy: Like 3Dfx?
[01:24] <geppy> Ribs:  Yes?  I'm not familiar.
[01:24] <Ribs> There was an auction of 3dfx technology?
[01:25] <Ribs> First I've heard of it
[01:28] <calc> Ribs: nvidia bought 3dfx and all of their stuff vanished overnight
[01:28] <Scognito> does someone has xorg and a matroxg400 ?
[01:28] <Scognito> i need xorg.conf
[01:30] <Ribs> It was a sad day
[01:30] <Ribs> I really loved 3dfx
[01:31] <jon1012> yup
[01:31] <jon1012> I loved them too :p
[01:32] <Ribs> I still have a Voodoo3 3000 PCI in one of my machines
[01:32] <Ribs> I dearly love that card
[01:32] <Ribs> I've actually seen a Voodoo5 play Doom3
[01:32] <Ribs> and Half Life 2
[01:32] <Ribs> was jaw dropping
[01:32] <socomm> E216: No such group or event: filetypedetect BufRead
[01:32] <socomm> Damn.
[01:34] <james> open Q: What are the differences in Debian unstable and Ubuntu unstable?
[01:34] <Ribs> erm
[01:34] <mirak> I got a weird thing with ubuntu
[01:34] <olorin> james ubuntu unstable is quite more instable ...
[01:34] <Ribs> Debian is Debian and Ubuntu is Ubuntu
[01:34] <mirak> I lost all mounts
[01:35] <mirak> spuntaneously
[01:35] <mirak> very weird
[01:35] <mirak> I was obliged to reboot
[01:36] <olorin> james , just an example ... gnome 2.8.1 is the last release in debian/sid. In Ubuntu it's the 2.9.1
[01:36] <olorin> james , but ubuntu is based essentialy on debian/sid package ...
[01:37] <james> Does ubuntu update gcc in unstable as fequently as Debian?
[01:37] <olorin> james , probably yes
[01:37] <olorin> james , if not you can always use the debian/sid package on ubuntu
[01:37] <james> If Debian updates a package it will go into Ubuntu soon after?
[01:38] <james> I like to have the latest GNOME and X, but don't like an unstable core.  Is Ubuntu good for me, if so is unstable Ubuntu good for me?
[01:40] <olorin> james , as i said, ubuntu hoary ( unstble ) is quite unstable ... more than debian/sid so if ou want have a look, just try it but you will probably have some problems
[01:40] <jon1012> james > lol... sometimes (like what happenned to me 2 hours ago :p) having an unstable core and a stable gnome can be really better :p
[01:40] <jon1012> because two hours ago my gnome was completely fucked up :p
[01:41] <Ribs> hrm
[01:41] <jon1012> and now to fix those problems I have a broken apt base, so I can't use apt-get :p
[01:41] <Ribs> Why not optimise for i586/i686?
[01:41] <jon1012> for old computers maybe ? :)
[01:41] <tahorg> Ribs: because it's just buzz ?
[01:41] <james> jon1012: Debian apt could always get me out of trouble, I'm sure its the same for Ubuntu.
[01:42] <jon1012> james: well... :(
[01:42] <jon1012> james: the thing is that the gnome-panel package which is actually there is broken
[01:42] <jon1012> so I can use it but it's ugly
[01:42] <jon1012> so to not use it I have to use version really strange of gnome stuffs :)
[01:42] <Ribs> tahorg: I dunno, taking advantage of better CPUs does bring advantages
[01:43] <james> jon1012: ya, I guess gnome 2.9 could really be a mess sometime.
[01:43] <jon1012> so my deb database is ugly now :p
[01:43] <Ribs> CPUs have come a long way in the past 15 years
[01:43] <Ribs> or whatever it is
[01:43] <nomasteryoda> Yeah! Got my 20 Ubuntu discs today!
[01:43] <jon1012> james: it is :p
[01:43] <nomasteryoda> wahoo!
[01:43] <Ribs> 20?!
[01:43] <nomasteryoda> nice
[01:43] <Ribs> wow
[01:43] <nomasteryoda> for our LUG
[01:43] <jon1012> nomasteryoda > i didn't have my 10 discs :(
[01:43] <jon1012> nomasteryoda > how much time did it take to have them ?
[01:43] <nomasteryoda> i must have got them... hehe
[01:43] <nomasteryoda> 1 month i think
[01:43] <jon1012> ok :)
[01:44] <farruinn> isn't there a way to check the status of your discs on shipit?
[01:44] <tahorg> Ribs: I've lost the url, but it has already been shown that the differences are not spectacular
[01:45] <socomm> Why does hoary still have vim 62 X^(
[01:45] <tahorg> Ribs: (not as much as a gentoo fanatic would believe)
[01:45] <james> Are Warty and Hoary binary compatible at this point (same gcc version)?
[01:45] <jon1012> who thinks that emacs is great? and this person could help me to find it great too ?
[01:45] <Ribs> tahorg: The Gentoo setup I had really showed up my Fedora Core install
[01:45] <Ribs> Then again, Fedora core is a bloated piece of shit ;)
[01:45] <jon1012> because I didn't find now how can someone wrk with it :|
[01:46] <Ribs> and no, I'm not a Gentoo fanatic
[01:46] <farruinn> jon1012, I could never remember all the keybindings
[01:46] <Ribs> I've actually migrated away from the distro
[01:46] <jon1012> farruin> that's why i can't use it :/
[01:46] <tahorg> Ribs: of course it's different when talking about soft writen to take advantages of special instruction set
[01:46] <jon1012> farruin> i use vim instead :/
[01:47] <tahorg> like 3dnow, mmx, sse for mplayer and al
[01:47] <farruinn> jon1012, same here, I love vim, you don't so much?
[01:47] <jon1012> farruin> i like it, but's it's a little bit messy compared to gedit I think :/
[01:47] <jon1012> no ?
[01:47] <jon1012> or maybe I didn't configure it well :/
[01:48] <farruinn> oh, I'd much rather work with vim, but that's me
[01:49] <jon1012> farruin, you configured it in a special way ?
[01:49] <olorin> bye all
[01:51] <farruinn> jon1012, not sure what you mean.  I just find the hjkl movement easy and I don't have to wait for my editor to load, etc.
[01:52] <james> Has anyone tried upgrading to Xorg from Warty?  Could it work or would it a dep nightmare?
[01:52] <jon1012> hjkl works, but the cursor keys works also, no ?
[01:53] <jon1012> it works, but if you have a laptop forget about it :)
[01:53] <jon1012> it's a shame :p
[01:54] <mattgirv> nn all
[01:54] <jon1012> faruinn, isn't it better to use the cursor keys to move than hjkl ?
[01:55] <jon1012> hi
[01:55] <kirt> Anyone elses gnome menu all messed up after dist-upgrading in hoary?
[01:56] <farruinn> jon1012, I don't see how that's better... kjhl were chosen because you don't have to move your hand
[01:56] <crimsun> kirt: "all messed up?"
[01:56] <jon1012> faruinn, well maybe :/ but i can't get used to it lol
[01:56] <kirt> crimsun: Well, it's like the gnome default again.. there's an applications menu and an Actions menu.. and all the stuff that used to be under Computer is under Applications.
[01:56] <farruinn> jon1012, true, it took me a while to get the hang of it
[01:57] <Ribs> kirt: simple soultion is not to use hoary
[01:57] <Ribs> hoary will break your system and eat your children!
[01:57] <Ribs> Your children, I say!
[01:57] <crimsun> kirt: note the latest changelog entry for gnome-menus (2.9.2-0ubuntu3)
[01:57] <crimsun> kirt: * debian/patches/*: - Merge the old capplet .desktop locations.
[01:57] <kirt> I'm well aware of breakage, I just wanted to know if it was a known problem yet.. since it just happened after i upgraded.
[01:58] <Ribs> when hoary is stable, how do we upgrade?
[01:58] <Ribs> download a CD and run that?
[01:58] <mjr> with apt-get/synaptic
[01:58] <Ribs> or will it be able to upgrade itself?
[01:58] <Ribs> oh good
[01:58] <crimsun> Ribs: change the sources.list entries, then apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade
[01:58] <thenuke> what does dist-upgrade do btw?
[01:58] <Ribs> updates everything
[01:58] <crimsun> Ribs: or, like mjr mentioned, modify the Synaptic entries, then update and upgrade
[01:58] <Ribs> I think
[01:59] <jon1012> kirt, I have the same problem :'(
[01:59] <kirt> crimsun: Were they planning on putting the menus back the way they were?  I liked them better that way..
[01:59] <crimsun> kirt: I have no idea what the plans are; ask them :)
[01:59] <crimsun> jon1012: it's not a problem per se; note the latest gnome-menus changelog entry as I stated earlier
[02:00] <crimsun> thenuke: dist-upgrade allows the addition/removal of packages. It's generally used to ensure smooth upgrades between major revisions, like Debian Woody->Sarge->Sid or Ubuntu Warty->Hoary
[02:00] <jon1012> crimsun: yes, yes... but to get my menus back I've hd to hack around and fuck up my deb package database :p
[02:01] <crimsun> jon1012: and if you're hacking around and mucking w/ your package db, you really shouldn't be complaining :P
[02:01] <jon1012> loool
[02:02] <GotD0t> oh joy... i
[02:02] <jon1012> I was a fedora user before :p
[02:02] <thenuke> crimsun: it's still not clear to me how it differs from apt-get upgrade
[02:02] <jon1012> but ubuntu is really great :)
[02:02] <GotD0t> i've lost my ability to right click on the desktop
[02:02] <jon1012> gotdot > nautilus is running ?
[02:03] <GotD0t> how do i check jon1012
[02:03] <jon1012> gotdot > open a console and type "killall nautilus" and telle me what it says :)
[02:03] <jon1012> lol
[02:03] <tahorg> GotD0t: ps aux | grep -i nautilus
[02:03] <jon1012> (the simplicity of an elephant :p)
[02:03] <GotD0t> didn't say anything... just removed all the crap on my desktop
[02:04] <jon1012> ok
[02:04] <tahorg> jon1012: he did it
[02:04] <jon1012> normally it should come back after a few secondes
[02:04] <jon1012> seconds
[02:04] <tahorg> jon1012: you're unfriendly
[02:04] <socomm> GotD0t: If you see crap on your desktop, there's a high chance that you have nautilus  running.
[02:04] <crimsun> thenuke: simple 'upgrade' does not add/remove
[02:04] <crimsun> thenuke: whereas 'dist-upgrade' does
[02:04] <jon1012> tahorg: why ? sometimes it helps
[02:04] <thenuke> crimsun: ok. thanks for the info :)
[02:04] <tahorg> :)
[02:05] <jon1012> tahorg: and gnome-session launches nautilus back
[02:05] <jon1012> tahorg: killing nautilus often repairs memory problems on some systems ^^
[02:05] <tahorg> yes I know, I was just kidding
[02:05] <jon1012> (as I said, the simplicity of the elephant :p)
[02:05] <jon1012> lol :p
[02:05] <socomm> You can always disable nautilus via gconf
[02:06] <socomm> gconf-editor
[02:06] <jon1012> socomm: he doesn't want to remove nautilus ! lol
[02:06] <kirt> .. but then you won't have desktop icons at all.
[02:06] <jon1012> socomm: he want to be able to right click on the desktop
[02:06] <GotD0t> how do i get nautilus back?
[02:06] <socomm> kirt: You can always use iDesk or some other icon app.
[02:07] <jon1012> gotdot > applications > run an application and then type "nautilus"
[02:07] <jon1012> and enter :p
[02:07] <socomm> GotD0t: It will respawn automagiclly
[02:07] <kirt> GotD0t: If it's not coming back, probably best to log out/log back in..   If all else fails ctrl-alt-backspace will kill X and bring up a login again.
[02:08] <GotD0t> well it was less broken up until the point you told me to kill nautilus
[02:08] <GotD0t> :-P
[02:08] <jon1012> :(
[02:09] <jon1012> he is right, ctrl-alt-backspace can help
[02:09] <jon1012> arrrr
[02:09] <jon1012> he did it lol
[02:10] <jon1012> (you are acting more like an elephant than me hey :p)
[02:10] <jon1012> is someone using a gtk2 svg theme ?
[02:10] <RuffianSoldier> i did
[02:11] <jon1012> sis you got a good performance ? (i'm seekng a good way to make my theme lol)
[02:11] <jon1012> did
[02:11] <jon1012> (on my laptop ana is runing really good)
[02:12] <RuffianSoldier> :-)
[02:13] <jon1012> so you got good performance using a gtk2 svg theme ?
[02:14] <jon1012> (i've seen ana, and I want to use librsvg the same way for my theme, but first I have to see if it works well on other computers lol :p)
[02:14] <RuffianSoldier> kinda
[02:14] <jon1012> ok :)
[02:14] <RuffianSoldier> cant tell with my fast machine
[02:14] <jon1012> ok lol
[02:19] <GotD0t> hmm
[02:19] <GotD0t> well it seems as if i have some borked packages
[02:19] <GotD0t> namely gnome-menus
[02:19] <kirt> If you're menus look different, that's normal..
[02:19] <kirt> .. or so i hear.
[02:20] <GotD0t> my menus don't exist ;-)
[02:20] <GotD0t> tells me trying to overwrite /etc/xdg/menuys/applications.menu which is also in package kdelibs-data
[02:20] <socomm> GotD0t: ...
[02:20] <GotD0t> when i try to install gnome-menus
[02:20] <kirt> Ah.  Sounds like gnome-panel isn't coming up?  Is this hoary or warty btw?
[02:20] <GotD0t> hoary
[02:21] <kirt> Probably some problem with upgrading to a newer version of gnome-panel.. Done a dist-upgrade recently?  If not, another one may very well fix your problem.
[02:22] <jon1012> gotdot > i had the same problem :)
[02:23] <jon1012> and everybody will have the same problem in... let's say... les than 2 days if the people at the ubuntu packaging don't fix this :p
[02:23] <GotD0t> so just uninstall kdelibs for now? because i kind of need my panels back
[02:23] <jon1012> looool
[02:23] <socomm> GotD0t: `apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade'
[02:24] <socomm> GotD0t: Don't add anything.
[02:24] <jon1012> socomm> won't help I think lol
[02:24] <GotD0t> no it doesnt
[02:24] <GotD0t> says gnome-panel has unmet dependencies
[02:24] <socomm> Meh forget it.
[02:24] <jon1012> yes, yes... I had the same problem :)
[02:25] <GotD0t> no i can't forget it... because my fricken menus are missing
[02:25] <socomm> GotD0t: I can, since I don't use GNOME.
[02:26] <efaistos> hi
[02:26] <jon1012> gotdot > uninstall all that kde shit :p
[02:26] <GotD0t> i want k3b
[02:26] <efaistos> i have a little problem ... i'm in warty and gdm can't start !
[02:26] <MobyTurbo> socomm, if you don't mind me asking, why are you running ubuntu, rather than vanilla Debian, if you don't use GNOME?
[02:27] <jon1012> efaistos > upgrade gdm
[02:27] <efaistos> jon1012: to hoary ?
[02:27] <efaistos> but i want to stay in warty ...
[02:27] <jon1012> efaistos, no
[02:27] <jon1012> efaistos, stay in warty
[02:28] <efaistos> gdm is already the newest
[02:28] <jon1012> efaistos, but upgrade gtk2, gdm, etc... to the latest patches
[02:28] <jon1012> efaistos, sometimes it help
[02:28] <jon1012> efaistos, ok :/
[02:28] <efaistos> jon1012: all my pkgs are updated
[02:28] <socomm> MobyTurbo: Because I can.
[02:28] <GotD0t> ok i fixed the package... how do i get my menus back?
[02:29] <efaistos> but apparently it starts two X one on the seventh console and it tries to do the same on the eight ...
[02:29] <efaistos> nobody got this message ?
[02:29] <GotD0t> ok i fixed the package... how do i get my menus back?
[02:29] <jon1012> efaistos, i had this problem on hoary some time ago
[02:29] <socomm> MobyTurbo: Plus I got too much data on this partition to nuke the whole thing and start from scratch.
[02:29] <efaistos> i dunno what to do ? i thought it was the fglrx driver and get back to the ati one but it doesnt help more ...
[02:29] <jon1012> GotD0t, hmmm...
[02:30] <efaistos> jon1012: and what did you do ?
[02:30] <jon1012> GotD0t, restart gnome-panel ?
[02:30] <jon1012> efaistos, upgraded gdm, gtk, etc... lol
[02:30] <socomm> GotD0t: I could solve this problem in like less then three minutes.
[02:30] <efaistos> is hoary quite stable ?
[02:30] <socomm> efaistos: No.
[02:30] <GotD0t> well you can go screw yourself socomm
[02:30] <jon1012> efaistos, try just reinstalling gdm on warty
[02:31] <crimsun> efaistos: it's usable, but it's certainly in development
[02:31] <jon1012> efaistos, no it's not stable at all
[02:31] <efaistos> ok i'll try to reinstall it
[02:31] <jon1012> efaistos, especially today lol
[02:31] <kirt> efaistos: It's probably going to get more unstable as time goes on, they've really just started heavy development recently.
[02:31] <efaistos> to see
[02:31] <efaistos> ok
[02:31] <socomm> efaistos: Just stick to warty unless you want to be on the bleeding edge.
[02:33] <efaistos> arghh ... i'm really going nuts with this ubuntu !!!
[02:33] <efaistos> X cant be started again ...
[02:34] <efaistos> it's annoying
[02:34] <crimsun> efaistos: back up.
[02:34] <socomm> ATi ....
[02:34] <crimsun> efaistos: first:
[02:34] <MobyTurbo> efaistos, control-alt-backspace (make sure all apps are closed before you do it)
[02:35] <crimsun> efaistos: dpkg -l gdm|grep ^ii|awk -F' ' '{print $3}'
[02:35] <crimsun> argh, I keep neglecting the long version stings
[02:35] <GotD0t> bah... i cant get my panels back
[02:35] <crimsun> strings.  efaistos, that should be COLUMNS=200 dpkg -l gdm|grep ^ii|awk -F' ' '{print $3}'
[02:35] <socomm> GotD0t: What's the error you get?
[02:36] <GotD0t> socomm: i don't get any errors
[02:36] <socomm> GotD0t: Open a terminal and run gnome-panel from there, you'll get some output there.
[02:36] <GotD0t> socomm: command not found
[02:36] <efaistos> crimsun: <IP_ADDRESS>-1ubun
[02:37] <crimsun> efaistos: no, use the second version, the one prefaced with COLUMNS=200
[02:37] <GotD0t> here we go
[02:38] <socomm> GotD0t: Ummm maybe it's not installed.
[02:38] <efaistos> crimsun: <IP_ADDRESS>-1ubuntu20
[02:38] <Pugio> testing testing
[02:38] <Pugio> hmmm, ChatZilla is weird
[02:38] <socomm> GotD0t: `apt-get install gnome-panel'
[02:38] <efaistos> crimsun: any idea ?
[02:38] <Pugio> well, anyway, is anyone here familiar with netboot installs?
[02:39] <socomm> GotD0t: Once it's re/installed issue the command again.
[02:39] <crimsun> efaistos: paste your /var/log/XFree86.0.log on a pastebin web site, please
[02:39] <socomm> GotD0t: If you ran `apt-get dist-upgrade', chances are that it got uninstalled in that procedure.
[02:40] <efaistos> crimsun: i have a ww about /dev/apm_bios
[02:40] <crimsun> efaistos: negligible.
[02:40] <efaistos> no such file or directory
[02:41] <Pugio> Does anyone know how to perform a netboot install from one local machine to another?
[02:42] <efaistos> crimsun: dont understand
[02:43] <crimsun> efaistos: use a pastebin web site to paste your /var/log/XFree86.0.log
[02:43] <usual> hi jdub_
[02:43] <efaistos>  crimsun lynx is not my speciality
[02:43] <pdaoust> quick question about 'cp' that I can't find in its manpage: does anybody know if 'cp -R' copies dotfiles as well?
[02:43] <jay> is beagle included in Hoary?
[02:43] <jdub_> morning
[02:43] <pdaoust> jay: it doesn't appear in the hoary repository
[02:44] <pdaoust> jay: I think there's an installation howto in the Ubuntu Wiki
[02:44] <jay> ok
[02:44] <kirt> pdaoust: No reason why it wouldn't.  dot files are only special to ls.
[02:44] <pdaoust> kirt: oooooo
[02:44] <pdaoust> thanks
[02:44] <pdaoust> :)
[02:44] <pdaoust> bye folks!
[02:45] <hui> i`m installing Ubuntu from an Gentoo LiveCD.... debootstrap geos ok, now i chrooted environment, installed kernel.. installed grub, but "apt-get install grub" doesn`t created /boot/grub
[02:45] <jay> i upgraded to hoary but what exactly is new here?
[02:45] <hui> i don`t have a /boot partition
[02:45] <jay> besides being a lot faster
[02:45] <Kosai> hui: Should it do?  apt-get install grub installs it, rather than running it.
[02:46] <hui> Kosai: here apt-get doenst maked that
[02:47] <hui> updatedb ; locate menu.lst just lists the examples for menu.lst
[02:49] <hui> Kosai: could u post the output from ur "ls /boot/grub", pls?
[02:49] <Pugio> jay: is Hoary really that much faster?
[02:49] <YokoZar> I need a 50x50 or larger image of the Ubuntu logo for this page: http://www.winehq.org/site/download  - where can I find one?
[02:51] <james> YokoZar: http://shipit.ubuntulinux.org/images/ubuntu.jpg
[02:51] <YokoZar> james: Hmm, I suppose I can crop that down.  I was hoping for some omni logo I guess
[02:53] <YokoZar> I think this one's a better base: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/imagize/misc/top_left_logo1.png
[02:55] <restrex> ea
[02:55] <restrex> fabitop
[02:55] <restrex> jejeje ;)
[02:55] <fabian> :)
[02:56] <hui> i`m installing Ubuntu from an Gentoo LiveCD.... debootstrap geos ok, now i chrooted environment, installed kernel.. installed grub, but "apt-get install grub" doesn`t created /boot/grub
[02:56] <hui> i don`t have a /boot partition
[02:57] <hui> followed the steps from: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/InstallFromOtherDistroHowto
[02:57] <fabian> grub-install should do that
[02:58] <s0cks> ogra
[02:58] <s0cks> missing... :-\
[02:58] <hui> Could not find device for /boot: Not found or not a block device.
[02:58] <hui> output from grub-install /dev/hda
[03:00] <hui> fabian: any other ideas?
[03:00] <usual> how would i fsck reiserfs
[03:01] <hui> usual: fsck.reiserfs ?
[03:01] <scoon> usual, the same way you would any other fs
[03:01] <usual> k
[03:01] <scoon> fsck will do what it is supposed to
[03:02] <GotD0t> how do i mount a usb hard disk?
[03:02] <HrdwrBoB> GotD0t: plug it in
[03:02] <HrdwrBoB> it should be automounted
[03:02] <HrdwrBoB> if not
[03:02] <GotD0t> its not
[03:03] <HrdwrBoB> you can mount it with pmount /dev/sda1
[03:03] <HrdwrBoB> (most likely)
[03:03] <hui> GotD0t: mount /dev/sda1 /mnt/usb/
[03:03] <GotD0t> bah... doesn't exist
[03:04] <fabian> hui, and you in fact have a /boot directory?. Maybe create a /boot/grub/ directory and there a file named device.map whit something like "(hd0) /dev/hda" inside and rerun grub-install
[03:04] <HrdwrBoB> hui: you have to be root
[03:04] <fabian> s/whit/with
[03:04] <HrdwrBoB> pmount is for mounting removable devices when you are not root
[03:04] <hui> HrdwrBoB: yeah, i`m root
[03:04] <HrdwrBoB> hui: yes but you should not be
[03:05] <zenwhen> is it possible to go back to an old version of an app in synaptic?
[03:05] <HrdwrBoB> it's not necessary
[03:05] <hui> HrdwrBoB: i`m at livecd, just root account in it
[03:05] <HrdwrBoB> yes, however the whole point of the design is that you don't need to use root
[03:05] <HrdwrBoB> in ubuntu
[03:06] <hui> fabian: i have a /boot directory, with kernel on it. grub-install crerates the /boot/grub dir, creates just device.map and stops
[03:06] <HrdwrBoB> which, last time I checked, was the channel I'm in
[03:06] <Gwildor> how bad is it for me to install the xfce4.2 rc , from a .deb, or something, not from repo
[03:06] <HrdwrBoB> Gwildor: it's effectively the same thing
[03:06] <HrdwrBoB> just easier to install from a repository
[03:06] <hui> fabian: device.map created by grub-install have (hd0) devhda
[03:06] <Gwildor> how would updates be handled?
[03:07] <Gwildor> mannualy, or will repo take over when it catches up
[03:07] <HrdwrBoB> in the same way
[03:07] <Gwildor> kk, thnx
[03:07] <HrdwrBoB> when updating from a repository, it looks at what you have installed and what is available
[03:09] <zenwhen> is it possible to go back to an old version of an app in synaptic?
[03:09] <zenwhen> or in apt?
[03:09] <HrdwrBoB> no
[03:09] <zenwhen> So I basically have to format to get mono working now.
[03:10] <zenwhen> Thats nice.
[03:10] <HrdwrBoB> zenwhen: well
[03:10] <HrdwrBoB> is the older version in the repository
[03:10] <Gwildor> HrdwrBoB, i want to follow these instructions, is it a good idea, or a bad idea?       http://www.os-cillation.com/article.php?sid=37
[03:10] <HrdwrBoB> and the newer one installed?
[03:10] <zenwhen> the newer one is installed
[03:10] <zenwhen> yes
[03:11] <HrdwrBoB> you can use dpkg to remove the package
[03:11] <HrdwrBoB> and then apt-get the new one
[03:11] <HrdwrBoB> pr you can apt-get remove it
[03:11] <HrdwrBoB> then install it
[03:11] <HrdwrBoB> Gwildor: that should be fine
[03:11] <scoon> Gwildor, i just used the installer and installed xfce4 locally.
[03:11] <Gwildor> scoon, is that easier, im kinda a noob?
[03:12] <scoon> well, you don't need sudo to install it.
[03:12] <hui> fabian: the defaults files from grub isnt created with apt-get ?
[03:12] <scoon> Gwildor, if you don't like it, you can just throw the folder away, without worrying about a system-wide change.
[03:12] <Gwildor> scoon, just follow the howto, exactly?
[03:13] <scoon> the only thing is that you need to create a .xsession
[03:13] <fabian> hui, it should be created by the post install process, but from a livecd and other distro ... sorry, i'm out of quick ideas
[03:13] <Gwildor> hummm, ill just do the first way
[03:13] <scoon> Gwildor,  http://www.os-cillation.com/article.php?sid=42
[03:13] <hui> fabian: i`m chrooted on newly installed Ubuntu
[03:14] <hui> fabian: chroot should work identical as i booted from the chrooted distro
[03:14] <Gwildor> scoon, thnx, but ill just use apt- to get it
[03:15] <Gwildor> HrdwrBoB, should i remove the repos, after i install xfce4.2, or just uncomment them, and update using those?
[03:15] <carthik> Gwildor, /etc/apt/sources.list :)
[03:15] <Gwildor> thnx :)
[03:15] <HrdwrBoB> Gwildor: you can do whatever you like :)
[03:16] <Gwildor> HrdwrBoB, kk, i hope i make the right choice.....wish me luck
[03:16] <HrdwrBoB> good luck :
[03:16] <HrdwrBoB> :(
[03:16] <HrdwrBoB> er :)
[03:16] <HrdwrBoB> I cannot type today
[03:16] <HrdwrBoB> I need lunch
[03:16] <Gwildor> oh man.....
[03:21] <Se7h> i forgot
[03:21] <Se7h> how do i select the sound deamon to use ?
[03:23] <chet> howdy, i am looking for xfree config file to edit mouse, i did "locate xfree" but there are oodles
[03:23] <chet> any tips?
[03:24] <Gwildor> xfree86.conf.......maybe
[03:24] <|QuaD-> ok... so i need a script (in php or perl) that can load a website
[03:24] <|QuaD-> any suggestions?
[03:24] <Gwildor> xfree86-4 something
[03:24] <kirt> chet: it's /etc/X11/xorg.conf iirc.
[03:24] <chet> net@ulappy:~ $ locate xfree86.conf
[03:24] <chet> /var/lib/dpkg/info/xserver-xfree86.config
[03:24] <chet> /usr/share/xresprobe/xfree86.conf
[03:25] <chet> is it xorg, or xfree
[03:25] <kirt> oops.. unless you're using warty.
[03:25] <newbienetwork> I am getting a problem after installation, basically, grub sits there, saying "grub loading, please wait"...I wait, nothing happens.  Anyways, a quick search, and I see other people with a similiar problem, AMD64 with a K8V mobo...anyways, I am looking for a solution, and haven't found one yet.
[03:25] <newbienetwork> Anyone have any suggestions?
[03:25] <chet> yeah, im ewarty :)
[03:25] <kirt> chet: Then it's usually /etc/X11/XF86Config or /etc/X11/XF86Config-4
[03:26] <chet> so look for xfree-4?
[03:26] <kirt> chet: Er, no.  I believe there's a mouse section in /etc/X11/XF86Config-4
[03:27] <GotD0t> anybody have experience getting a Dell DJ to work in linux?
[03:27] <kirt> What are you trying to do, exactly?
[03:27] <Gwildor>  /etx/x11/xf86config-4 is what you want
[03:27] <chet> thats it i think, i need to edit the mouse button #, then xmodmap
[03:27] <chet> i have this funky trackball is lots of buttons
[03:27] <Gwildor> haha
[03:28] <Gwildor> miss my trackball
[03:28] <chet> my wrist thanks me everyday
[03:30] <kirt> chet: I've never had to muck with one of those so i couldn't tell you how to get it working.
[03:30] <Pugio> Netboot install of ubunut on local machines?
[03:31] <Pugio> hmmm ubunut
[03:31] <Pugio> sounds good
[03:31] <Pugio> Anyway, does anyone know how to perform a LOCAL netboot install from one machine to another?
[03:31] <zenpod> hm, I wish I knew if 1238/516 up/down from the dslreports.com speed test was good or not.
[03:31] <eruin> wooh
[03:31] <eruin> finally
[03:31] <Pugio> it's pretty good
[03:32] <eruin> dropped fedora altogether and I'm now only running ubuntu/hoary and gentoo ;)
[03:32] <Pugio> you must be in a college or some other similar organization?
[03:32] <zenpod> nah, home dsl
[03:32] <Pugio> weird
[03:32] <farruinn> how do you change the kde ui theme w/o kde actually being installed?
[03:33] <Pugio> then how come your up is faster than down?
[03:33] <HrdwrBoB> zenpod: that's pretty good
[03:33] <Pugio> did you list it backwards mayhaps?
[03:33] <Pugio> caue that's a really nice upload
[03:33] <zenpod> Pugio, down is 1238, up is 516
[03:33] <alka_trash> hey can someone help me out on this
[03:33] <zenpod> HrdwrBoB, ok cool
[03:33] <eruin> zenpod: that's pretty lousy
[03:34] <alka_trash> when I run dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg it doesn't let me change the monitor settings, any ideas?
[03:34] <Pugio> ah ok
[03:34] <alka_trash> I just bought a LCD and need to make a  few adjustments
[03:34] <chet> kirt, i think i have to change z axis garbage, then xmodmap for the correct buttons, took some time but it worked in mepis, i expect the same here
[03:34] <Pugio> that makes more sense
[03:34] <zenpod> Pugio, :)
[03:34] <Pugio> yes?
[03:34] <Pugio> :)
[03:35] <Pugio> reason I asked before is because a lot of college type places have faster UP than down
[03:35] <Pugio> hmmm
[03:35] <Pugio> let me test something
[03:35] <Pugio> can someone say my name?
[03:35] <thenuke> Pugio:
[03:36] <Pugio> cool
[03:36] <Pugio> so this client does have name recognition
[03:36] <Pugio> that's nice to know
[03:36] <thenuke> hilight is a must have
[03:37] <Pugio> well, it doesn't hilight, it just posts the message to the status window
[03:37] <zenpod> Pugio, at work, I have that issue.  Faster u/l than d/l
[03:38] <Pugio> it's not exactly an "issue" but it does make sense in a way
[03:39] <Pugio> Business and the like frequently have webservers and other databases that need to be uploaded
[03:40] <alka_trash> damn I still can't get it working
[03:43] <GotD0t> i cant get ubuntu to see my Dell DJ...
[03:49] <SuperQ> ok.. so this is a wierd one
[03:49] <SuperQ> my install on a TP T21 has 2 mouse cursors
[03:50] <SuperQ> whoa.. now it went away
[03:50] <zenpod> GotD0t, what is a dell dj?
[03:50] <SuperQ> that was just wierd
[03:50] <GotD0t> zenpod: its a mp3 player... hard drive based
[03:51] <zenpod> GotD0t, what fs?
[03:51] <GotD0t> zenpod: njb or something like that... the one the creative nomad uses
[03:51] <zenpod> GotD0t, that's the file system it uses..?
[03:51] <GotD0t> zenpod: one sec... lemme check
[03:52] <farruinn> how would one go about creating their own repository (for personal use)?
[03:53] <newbienetwork> Can anyone provide any assistance for installing Ubuntu on an AMD64 system?
[03:53] <nomasteryoda> nmy http://www.tuxmagazine.com/
[03:53] <nomasteryoda> nmy Marcel Gagne is over on TheLinux Show right now
[03:53] <farruinn> I'd find it a lot easier to just apt-get install package than dpkg -i filename.deb everything I have to compile
[03:53] <eruin> hum
[03:53] <zenpod> newbienetwork, dl the AMD64 iso, burn to CD, insert in drive. :)
[03:53] <eruin> irssi is pretty damn sweet stuff
[03:53] <GotD0t> zenpod: yea... NJB
[03:53] <newbienetwork> zenpod, Actually...there's more...
[03:53] <zenpod> GotD0t, well, unless your kernel supports that as a filesystem (and I've never heard of it), you won't be able to access it.
[03:53] <newbienetwork> From before: I am getting a problem after installation, basically, grub sits there, saying "grub loading, please wait"...I wait, nothing happens.  Anyways, a quick search, and I see other people with a similiar problem, AMD64 with a K8V mobo...anyways, I am looking for a solution, and haven't found one yet.
[03:54] <zenpod> newbienetwork, last time someone had that problem, they were using the i386 iso, ymmv.
[03:55] <newbienetwork> Nope, it's the AMD64 version.  I made sure of that.
[03:55] <GotD0t> zenpod: theres an app called gnomad2 which has support for all mp3 players which use the OS... but whenever i open gnomad2 it tells me it cant find the device
[03:55] <zenpod> newbienetwork, okies :)
[03:55] <zenpod> GotD0t, is it usb? and connected to /dev/sdbX ?
[03:55] <GotD0t> zenpod: it is usb... but thats what im saying... its not showing as being connected
[03:55] <newbienetwork> I've found a couple things online on the ubuntu forum site, but not much.  Was hoping someone had a solid solution.
[03:56] <zenpod> GotD0t, hmmmmmmmmm.
[03:56] <zenpod> GotD0t, not mounted, or not connected? ls /dev/sdb* and let me know if there's output
[03:56] <GotD0t> zenpod: no such file or dir
[03:57] <zenpod> GotD0t, ls /dev/sd*
[03:57] <GotD0t> zenpod: sda... but thats my flash card reader
[03:57] <zenpod> ok
[03:57] <GotD0t> zenpod: i've tried makedev but it doesn't change anything
[03:58] <zenpod> GotD0t, that is incredibly odd.  Is there a kernel module or something you may need to load for gnomad?
[03:58] <eruin_> yay
[03:59] <eruin> eruin_
[03:59] <zenpod> eruin, you have to have donated to freenode for a .user, right?
[03:59] <GotD0t> zenpod: no... from what i understand it doesn't use a kernel module because its technically not a file system, its a database so its a userspace lib, which i have installed
[04:00] <zenpod> GotD0t, hm, okay, but how the heck would it get mounted as a device?  It must not be, since you'd have to have an FS to use mount.
[04:00] <GotD0t> zenpod: it doesn't get mounted
[04:00] <zenpod> well ok.
[04:00] <zenpod> lol
[04:00] <GotD0t> zenpod: you access it through gnomad2
[04:01] <GotD0t> zenpod: and when i try to run gnomad2 it tells me it cannot find any jukeboxes on my usb bus
[04:01] <zenpod> GotD0t, is it known to work with the dell dj?
[04:01] <GotD0t> zenpod: yea
[04:02] <zenpod> GotD0t, http://forums.us.dell.com/supportforums/board/message?board.id=dce_djmusic&message.id=3170
[04:03] <zenpod> looks like you need to build the lib yourself?
[04:03] <GotD0t> zenpod: i've done all that
[04:03] <zenpod> oh., :/
[04:03] <GotD0t> it might be something wrong with my USB system in general... as my pda stopped connecting after a upgrade in hoary
[04:04] <GotD0t> because of a lack of entry in /dev
[04:04] <zenpod> GotD0t, I found a post saying it only works as root?
[04:04] <GotD0t> hmm
[04:04] <GotD0t> ill try that
[04:04] <GotD0t> zenpod: darn
[04:05] <GotD0t> zenpod: didnt work
[04:06] <Mystilleef> hile, does anyone know where I can get the Ubuntu desktop sound package?
[04:06] <zenpod> GotD0t, sucks :(
[04:06] <Mystilleef> s/hile/Hi
[04:10] <pdaous1> hey, guys, I know you probably don't know who on earth I am, and you probably don't care about my joy, but I just saved myself $1000 and I want to share my happiness ^_^
[04:10] <Quest-Master> Yay for pdaous1 :)
[04:10] <scoon> pdaous1, was she cute ?
[04:10] <pdaous1> heh heh :)
[04:10] <pdaous1> scoon: nah, not that kind :D
[04:10] <scoon> doh
[04:10] <scoon> that sux
[04:11] <pdaous1> A bad power supply toasted my hard drive a few weeks ago, when I was trying to cram on a website contract, and I lost the whole thing
[04:11] <scoon> pdaous1, to much porn, smoked out your ps
[04:11] <pdaous1> I pulled off the controller card, and a few of the chips were all crispy and melted
[04:11] <HrdwrBoB> RAID is your friend :)
[04:12] <pdaous1> HrdwrBoB: I bought a DVD burner (not enough $ for a second HD), and ironically, the PSU toasted the burner too :-(
[04:12] <ironwolf> lev? you around?
[04:12] <HrdwrBoB> ouch
[04:12] <pdaous1> but anyway, I bought the same HD off eBay for $30 (shipping included), swapped out the controller card, and -- lo and behold! -- I am now copying all my files onto my new 80-gigger.
[04:13] <HrdwrBoB> ah yep :)
[04:13] <HrdwrBoB> done that
[04:13] <pdaous1> I'm going to use the old HD for a media jukebox -- rip all the family's CDs; I figger 30 GB will hold about 450 minutes of music at 160kb/s
[04:13] <pdaous1> HrdwrBoB: you mean the controller swap thingy?
[04:13] <HrdwrBoB> yeah
[04:13] <pdaous1> did it work for you?
[04:13] <HrdwrBoB> yep
[04:14] <pdaous1> rockin'. I'd heard mixed results from reading around, but apparently sometimes it works
[04:14] <pdaous1> my IBM DeathStar, on the other hand... that will never live.
[04:14] <HrdwrBoB> hehehe
[04:15] <pdaous1> It's a bittersweet loss -- years of e-mails and photos, but Windows XP was also on that drive, and the loss completed my adoption of Linux as my primary OS!
[04:15] <pdaous1> anyway, I just wanted to share my happiness. Bye, folks!
[04:15] <HrdwrBoB> hehe
[04:15] <scoon> pdaous1, well the loss of XP definately makes up for all the other stuff you never looked at anyway.
[04:15] <HrdwrBoB> that's ok, thanks for popping in
[04:16] <pdaous1> scoon: heh heh
[04:16] <pdaous1> adios
[04:17] <foursti> when is the gnome panel going to be reworked back into its form?
[04:20] <Quest-Master> Where is FMod installed on Ubuntu?
[04:20] <eruin_> foursti: check the ubuntu-devel list
[04:21] <eruin_> foursti: basically what ubuntu used as a backend to their menu was dropped off gnome
[04:21] <scoon> Gwildor, coming in from xfce ?
[04:21] <eruin_> foursti: so they're reverting to the default gnome menu setup until a) the default menu setup grows sane, or b) ubuntu can rewrite their menus to accommodate the changes in gnome upstream
[04:22] <Gwildor> yeah.....but with problems :(
[04:22] <Gwildor> ill take it to #xfce
[04:22] <farruinn> gnome+xfwm4 is great
[04:23] <eruin_> if you like compositing anyway
[04:23] <eruin_> metacity has grown lame
[04:23] <eruin_> ;(
[04:23] <Quest-Master> Is XFCE great?
[04:23] <farruinn> big?
[04:23] <eruin_> xfwm is great, xfce is a bit too minimal for my taste
[04:23] <scoon> Quest-Master, it is all right.
[04:23] <defendguin> has anyone here used autopsy before?
[04:24] <eruin_> and xfce's file manager is _horrible_
[04:24] <farruinn> eruin_, yeah, that was my beef with it
[04:24] <scoon> eruin_, yes, that is def true.
[04:24] <farruinn> oh well, you can use nautilus in it
[04:24] <Quest-Master> What's the difference between the two?
[04:24] <eruin_> I used xfce as my default on fedora
[04:24] <eruin_> xfwm is xfce's window manager
[04:24] <Quest-Master> Oh.
[04:24] <eruin_> xfce is (by me anyway) considered gnome-light
[04:25] <eruin_> sort of like fluxbox meets gnome :P
[04:25] <billytwowilly> I need to remove kdelibs-data in order to fix a broken depency. How would I do this without removing the stuff kdelibs-data is depended on?
[04:25] <Quest-Master> Aww.. FMOD isn't in the Ubuntu repository
[04:25] <scoon> eruin_, but gnome isn't all that heavy tho
[04:25] <billytwowilly> the other stuff will be removed later.
[04:25] <Quest-Master> Gnome's light compared to KDE. :P
[04:25] <eruin_> scoon: not on a modern computer, no
[04:25] <eruin_> on a modern computer I'd even consider it extremely lightweight
[04:25] <scoon> eruin_, i guess.
[04:26] <scoon> eruin_, i ran gnome on an old amd k7 700 or 725
[04:26] <scoon> or k6, sorry
[04:26] <eruin_> k6-II probably
[04:26] <scoon> yea
[04:26] <Quest-Master> Nautilus needs tabs. :o!!!
[04:26] <farruinn> billytwowilly, if you remove a package, packages that depend on it *cannot* be installed
[04:26] <eruin_> or III
[04:26] <scoon> the old atari cartridge type
[04:26] <eruin_> whoa
[04:27] <billytwowilly> farruinn, no, I need to remove this one kde package so I can fix a broken gnome package.
[04:27] <scoon> b4 that i was on an old -II 400
[04:27] <eruin_> now if I could only get Point2Play to install this battlefield vietnam patch! :P
[04:27] <billytwowilly> what is the dpkg command to remove a package irrespective of the stuff it depends on?
[04:27] <eruin_> scoon: oh ye olde gnome1.x days
[04:27] <eruin_> gtk1.x is butt-ugly ;)
[04:27] <scoon> oh yes.
[04:27] <scoon> but i use it w/ gnucash
[04:27] <eruin_> you poor thing :P
[04:27] <eruin_> I use it for point2play, and it hurts my eyes
[04:28] <scoon> eruin_, what else is there to use.
[04:28] <billytwowilly> farruinn, could you please tell me the command? There are multiple things wrong here and to fix it I have to first remove kdelib-data
[04:28] <eruin_> scoon: nothing; I guess
[04:28] <eruin> bleh
[04:28] <eruin> I can't decide whether to use irssi or xchat
[04:28] <farruinn> billytwowilly, I don't know the command
[04:29] <farruinn> try searching the dpkg man page for force
[04:29] <farruinn> that's what I would do
[04:29] <Xenguy> eruin: what do you like - GUI or console ?
[04:29] <eruin_> gui
[04:29] <eruin_> but irssi is just so adorable
[04:29] <farruinn> eruin_, gui irssi?  what are you using?
[04:29] <billytwowilly> farruinn, darn, because I need to remove it to fix the gnome-panel dependcy, but I can't use apt to remove kdelibs-data without killing gnome panel..
[04:29] <Xenguy> eruin: use xchat
[04:29] <eruin_> irssi dropped gui long ago ;)
[04:30] <Xenguy> eruin: er, for the better GUI (I use irssi, very zen once you learn how :-)
[04:30] <eruin_> well, imho xchat's gui sucks monkey balls
[04:30] <farruinn> ok, I didn't think there was a gui irssi
[04:30] <Xenguy> eruin: then use irssi - sheesh
[04:30] <eruin_> xchat-gnome is an improvement but unsupported in ubuntu
[04:30] <TomT64> hmm I can't seem to add any launchers to my menus
[04:31] <Xenguy> decisions decisions ;-)
[04:31] <eruin_> ye ;)
[04:31] <TomT64> nautilus applications:///Internet  and   sudo nautilus applications:///Internet   and I say, create launcher, fill in the info, and press OK.  And there's no launcher
[04:33] <TomT64> so um what do I do
[04:33] <eruin_> why oh why does cedega have to be so retarded
[04:33] <farruinn> TomT64, I've seen that before too
[04:34] <farruinn> try loggin out then back in
[04:34] <dsr> TomT64: just log out and log back in
[04:34] <eruin_> TomT64: err, why not just open your menu from gnome-panel, goto internet, rightclick any of the launchers there and select "add new launcher" ?
[04:34] <dsr> TomT64: its a known bug
[04:34] <TomT64> ok well I'll wait then
[04:34] <eruin_> eek, nm me
[04:34] <TomT64> heh
[04:35] <dsr> I had the same problem and googling a bit got me this link http://bugzilla.ximian.com/show_bug.cgi?id=44650
[04:36] <newbienetwork> woohoo!
[04:36] <eruin_> lol
[04:37] <eruin_> yay, killing a shitload of processes finally got point2play to start my vietnam patch :D
[04:37] <TomT64> oh when I log back in will it be there, or will I have to make it again
[04:38] <eruin_> I hear "usererror" being shouted in my head as I silently cancel my post on transgaming.org :P
[04:38] <eruin_> TomT64: if everything works like it should - it'll be there :P
[04:38] <michealbolton> can someone please help me get powernowd to work?
[04:39] <michealbolton> When I try to start powernowd I get the error messages "Error writing file governor: Invalid argument" and "Couldn't get per-cpu data: Illegal seek"
[04:41] <verden01> Hi what program do i use to get pics from my digital camera?
[04:43] <billytwowilly> farruinn, in case you're interested, it's dpkg -r --force-all package name
[04:43] <moquist_> how can I see what files a certain package installed?
[04:43] <jdub> moquist_: dpkg -L <package-name>
[04:43] <TomT64> Use Synaptic
[04:43] <gpierce> hello
[04:44] <moquist_> jdub, TomT64: thx.  I'm a terminal weenie, so I'm reading the dpkg man page now...
[04:44] <jdub> moquist_: that might not actually be amazingly helpful ;)
[04:44] <farruinn> moquist_, heheh, leisure reading?
[04:44] <TomT64> well Synaptic is a GUI app that shows your packages and available packages, and so on
[04:45] <moquist_> farruinn: well, "reading" was an exaggeration, I guess.  I'm glancing over the options and reading the part about "-L".
[04:45] <farruinn> =)
[04:45] <farruinn> billytwowilly, thanks btw, that's good to know
[04:45] <verden01> so what package would i use for my digital camera?
[04:45] <moquist_> hm.  not much there.  :p
[04:45] <moquist_> verden01: just for the purpose of uploading/downloading pictures?
[04:46] <verden01> yeah to get pics offf my camera
[04:46] <verden01> onto my hard drive
[04:46] <moquist_> verden01: USB mass storage should do that.
[04:47] <moquist_> verden01: apparently your camera doesn't automatically show up as a storage device when you plug it in?
[04:47] <verden01> yeah it does but thats about it
[04:48] <verden01> i have to go to the peripherals to find it tho
[04:48] <moquist_> verden01: if it shows up as a storage device, aren't your pictures in there so you can copy them onto your computer?
[04:48] <verden01> no
[04:49] <verden01> i'll try it again
[04:49] <ironwolf> ok, vncserver... how do I get a gnome2.8 looking window under hoary the same way I did under warty?  vncserver on command line doesn't seem to give anything but a gray screen when I connect.
[04:49] <moquist_> verden01: if it shows up as a storage device, it seems odd that you couldn't get to the files...  i dunno.
[04:50] <moquist_> ironwolf: heh, I'm trying to get vncserver going as we type.  i'll let you know if I have any problems.  :)
[04:53] <Gwildor> lol...every time i launch gnome...the menues are different
[04:53] <scoon_> ?
[04:54] <Gwildor> hoary
[04:54] <Gwildor> i use xfce4
[04:54] <Gwildor> i dont use gnome too often
[04:55] <Gwildor> wow, how to launch nautalis?
[04:58] <moquist_> ironwolf: what's in your ~/.vnc/xstartup file?  that's what gets started when you launch a vncserver.
[04:58] <Gwildor> how to start a file manager in hoary?
[04:58] <Gwildor> i cant find it
[04:58] <lance> hi all
[04:58] <ironwolf> moquist_: yeah, found that... gnome-session & I think is what I need.
[04:59] <ironwolf> lance: welcome
[04:59] <stuNNed_> hi ironwolf
[04:59] <jdub> Gwildor: run application...; type 'nautilus' into the box
[04:59] <stuNNed_> ironwolf, thanks
[05:00] <Gwildor> doesnt start jdub
[05:00] <Gwildor> maybe i need to isntall it...huh
[05:00] <jdub> Gwildor: run it from a terminal and see what happens
[05:00] <Gwildor> nothing
[05:01] <Gwildor> nvm   it started now
[05:04] <stuNNed_> ironwolf, how goes?
[05:04] <moquist_> yay!  ion2 is working beautifully.  no more mousing.  :)
[05:07] <ironwolf> stuNNed_: working on vnc issue... it's being grumpy.
[05:07] <stuNNed_> ironwolf, vnc is it though if you can get it working, which variant are you using?
[05:07] <ironwolf> stuNNed_: realvnc... it's working everywhere except hoary.
[05:09] <moquist_> ironwolf: what problem are you seeing now?  i installed tightvnc and put gnome-session in the xstartup file, and it's working beautifully for me.
[05:10] <billytwowilly> holy carp, they changed the menus around.
[05:10] <Tsjoklat> billytwowilly?
[05:11] <billytwowilly> I just upgraded hoary (did it last yesterday) and they changed the menu around.
[05:11] <Tsjoklat> as in?
[05:12] <solarce> Alright, so I upgraded hoary today and gnome proceeded to shit all over itself and crash, and now all I get when I login through gdm or start up things with startx is a brown background and a cursor, nothing else
[05:12] <billytwowilly> stuff that was in the second drop down has been moved into the first and the second dropdown has become an actions menu
[05:12] <billytwowilly> solarce, I got that, I rebooted, problem solved
[05:12] <ironwolf> moquist_: gnome-session in xstartup testing currently. :)
[05:12] <stuNNed_> billytwowilly, yeah lol
[05:12] <Tsjoklat> any better billytwowilly?
[05:13] <solarce> billytwowilly: tried that, no such luck
[05:13] <stuNNed_> billytwowilly, sorting colors atm
[05:13] <billytwowilly> Tsjoklat, I miss the links to my directories..
[05:13] <billytwowilly> Tsjoklat, I haven't used it enough to complain or praise more than that yet.
[05:13] <jdub> billytwowilly: those are the standard gnome menus - we've reverted to those for the time being due to the new gnome menu system
[05:13] <Tsjoklat> billytwowilly no home dir and such?
[05:14] <jdub> billytwowilly: they will not stay that way
[05:14] <billytwowilly> Tsjoklat, no links to them in a drop down menu.
[05:14] <billytwowilly> jdub, ok, cool.
[05:14] <jdub> see ubuntu-devel for more info
[05:14] <solarce> could it be that libgnome-menu0 and libgnomevfs2.0 are being held pack?
[05:14] <billytwowilly> I don't really want to;) And here I thought I was witnessing something new and cool happening;)
[05:14] <Tsjoklat> new menu jdub?
[05:14] <jdub> Tsjoklat: new menu system implementation
[05:14] <jdub> billytwowilly: ubuntu-devel has the new structure proposal, which will be cool and new
[05:15] <Tsjoklat> jdub: tasty
[05:15] <billytwowilly> jdub, I look forward to our new ubuntu-devel structure overlords;)
[05:15] <billytwowilly> jdub, There will still be directory links though right?
[05:15] <Tsjoklat> I wish I could have been in Spain :{ missing out on all the goodies
[05:15] <jdub> billytwowilly: read the email...
[05:15] <billytwowilly> solarce, the update was also a bitch to apply because of conflicts with some kde packages I had installed.
[05:15] <billytwowilly> jdub, got a link?
[05:16] <jdub> billytwowilly: lists.ubuntu.com, follow the links
[05:16] <solarce> billytwowilly: heh, yeah, I just got rid of kdelibs*
[05:16] <Tsjoklat> jdub.. I had a friend removing gnome for kde but now she has issues with synaptic.. it's complaining about libglade and such
[05:16] <billytwowilly> solarce, I didn't catch it, then it half completed, leaving me with a borken gnome-menu package, so I had to use dpkg to kill all the kde stuff
[05:17] <solarce> well
[05:17] <solarce> I can't get gnome to start up, still
[05:17] <Tsjoklat> billytwowilly I don't think kde plays nice with ubu
[05:17] <solarce> has gnome-session been deprecated in favor of something?
[05:18] <billytwowilly> Tsjoklat, I know, it's a shame.  I actually like nautilus better
[05:19] <billytwowilly> konqueror destroys nautilus for file browsing.
[05:19] <jdub> kde and gnome are very similar in terms of ram abuse
[05:20] <Tsjoklat> billytwowilly ah you mean when you have and kde and gnome at the same time
[05:20] <jdub> this is really not the place for flaming comments about either desktop, btw
[05:20] <Tsjoklat> jdub not flaming are we? well atleast not I
[05:20] <billytwowilly> I'm not flaming.
[05:21] <billytwowilly> I'm not even really paying that much attention;)
[05:21] <jdub> billytwowilly: 'pile of crap' is not particularly polite
[05:21] <Tsjoklat> I am just wondering how one could combine kde and gnome in ubu together
[05:21] <GotD0t> what can i burn an iso with?
[05:21] <Tsjoklat> since besides nautilus burner no other burning facilities are present (gnomebaker etc.)
[05:22] <jdub> Tsjoklat: we can't fix that for warty, but we could fix that for hoary
[05:22] <stuNNed_> hal is complaining about my modem not being registered with it or something
[05:22] <jdub> (gnomebaker, coaster, etc.)
[05:22] <jdub> GotD0t: nautilus
[05:22] <billytwowilly> jdub, sorry, I didn't have time to write that it seems slow, doesn't update in a uniform way, doesn't have a good icon setup (all icons are the same)
[05:22] <Tsjoklat> jdub I didn't expect it for warty.. just hoping things will be a tad smoother in hoary when it concerns burning
[05:22] <GotD0t> jdub really? how
[05:22] <jdub> GotD0t: right click on the iso :)
[05:22] <stuNNed_> you guys using ubuntu's new xchat colors/themes?
[05:22] <jdub> Tsjoklat: someone has to step up to the plate
[05:23] <GotD0t> jdub: k
[05:23] <solarce> blargh
[05:23] <solarce> I gets no splash screen, nothing
[05:23] <farruinn> jdub, gnomebaker, coaster, etc are only maybe's then?
[05:24] <Tsjoklat> jdub I think gnomebaker looks promising, I know I would be very happy if I could just stick with 'just' gnome
[05:24] <jdub> farruinn: they're not packaged yet, so unless that happens, they won't go in
[05:24] <solarce> any ideas what might be broken from my upgrade that I need to fix?
[05:24] <jdub> solarce: install ubuntu-desktop
[05:24] <jdub> solarce: what did you upgrade from?
[05:25] <billytwowilly> solarce, a good place to start is with the held back packages.
[05:26] <billytwowilly> you said a menu thing was held back? I bet that is the problem
[05:26] <GotD0t> jdub: you sure i can burn?
[05:26] <GotD0t> jdub: doesn't give me an option to burn
[05:26] <ironwolf> GotDot: coaster works well under hoary.
[05:26] <solarce> jdub: I've been tracking hoary since I installed ubuntu two weeks ago, I had gnome 2.9.2 working happily this afternoon, I updated and dist-upgraded, from there gnome-terminal wouldn't launch, then my panels and launch died, and all I was left with was metacity and some windows and my desktop, so I killed X and tried to go back in, now when I login from gdm or using startx from the console, all I get is a brown desktop, no splash screen or anything
[05:27] <Tsjoklat> dist-upgrading isn't always a good thing so I read
[05:27] <solarce> man
[05:28] <solarce> it seems like most of gnome install installed now
[05:28] <solarce> wth
[05:28] <Tsjoklat> solarce, I think jdub missed your typing
[05:28] <jdub_> yeah
[05:28] <jdub_> disconnected
[05:28] <solarce> jdub: I've been tracking hoary since I installed ubuntu two weeks ago, I had gnome 2.9.2 working happily this afternoon, I updated and dist-upgraded, from there gnome-terminal wouldn't launch, then my panels and launch died, and all I was left with was metacity and some windows and my desktop, so I killed X and tried to go back in, now when I login from gdm or using startx from the console, all I get is a brown desktop, no splash screen or anything
[05:28] <gen> ..
[05:28] <Quest-Master> Have any of you guys used Codeweaver's Crossover Office?
[05:29] <Tsjoklat> jdub I read that doing a dist-upgrade is not always a good thing.. that true?
[05:29] <jdub_> solarce: log out, jump to a console, check if there are any processes owned by your user running
[05:29] <solarce> dbus and gconf2
[05:29] <jdub_> Tsjoklat: yeah, it'll add and remove packages as it sees fit to resolve the upgrade
[05:29] <billytwowilly> Quest-Master, I have it on my comp right now.
[05:29] <billytwowilly> it's quite nice.
[05:30] <jdub_> Tsjoklat: often enough it's easier to just upgrade all the time and only dist-upgrade when you need to
[05:30] <jdub_> solarce: kill them
[05:30] <solarce> done
[05:30] <jdub_> solarce: then try to log in again
[05:30] <Tsjoklat> jdub I also noticed that synaptic and apt give two different solutions to things.. most of the time when something goes bork it was synaptic that did it
[05:30] <billytwowilly> Quest-Master, Did you have a specific question about crossover office or did you just want to know if someone used it?
[05:31] <solarce> jdub_: I think apt decided to remove a bunch of my gnome-* packages
[05:31] <solarce> I'm gonna go about re-installing those and see what I can come up with
[05:31] <jdub_> solarce: try installing ubuntu-desktop
[05:31] <solarce> bbl
[05:32] <solarce> depends on nautilus-cd-burner but not going to be installed
[05:32] <jdub_> but it'll show you everything it wants to install other than that, too
[05:32] <solarce> no
[05:32] <jdub_> which means you can apt-get install that lsit
[05:33] <farruinn> this is some sort of joke - right? there is a guy named Gill Bates that leads the desktop team?
[05:33] <jdub_> farruinn: no
[05:33] <Gmail> just yesterday when ever i sudo a program in gnome it ends up with wirod widjets not even my root ones
[05:33] <farruinn> wow, that's interesting :D
[05:33] <solarce> jdub_: it gives me that wonderful message about some deps having not been moved out of incoming yet
[05:33] <Tsjoklat> synaptic might be nice but I am sticking with apt.. synaptic is too freaky for me
[05:34] <solarce> !
[05:34] <solarce> I've found a circular dep error with nautilus-cd-burner
[05:35] <jdub_> solarce: it's just an unbuilt package
[05:35] <solarce> it depends on both nautilus and libnautilus2-2, but nautilus, installs libnautilus-extensions1 which won't exist with libnautilus2-2, they conflict
[05:35] <jdub_> that's not a circular depends :)
[05:35] <jdub_> that's a lack of n-c-b update
[05:36] <solarce> n c b?
[05:36] <jdub_> nautilus-cd-burner
[05:36] <solarce> k
[05:36] <Tsjoklat> oh jdub is nautilus-media going to be standard in hoary?
[05:36] <solarce> jdub_: resolutions?
[05:36] <jdub_> (it didn't build because libnautilus-extensions is new, so it hasn't been co-opted into main yet)
[05:36] <jdub_> solarce: wait
[05:36] <solarce> and live without gnome?
[05:37] <jdub_> solarce: that won't stop you from using gnome
[05:37] <solarce> but I can't get gnome installed
[05:37] <jdub_> Tsjoklat: supported and installed by default? probably not. depends on what happens with it upstream.
[05:37] <jdub_> solarce: you can install gnome without that
[05:37] <Tsjoklat> jdub_ too bad
[05:37] <solarce> jdub_: gnome depends on gnome-desktop-environment, which depends on nautilus-cd-burner
[05:38] <jdub_> Tsjoklat: given that a) totem provides almost everything nautilus-media does and b) nautilus views are gone, there really isn't much point.
[05:38] <jdub_> solarce: don't install 'gnome'
[05:38] <jdub_> solarce: install ubuntu-desktop
[05:38] <Tsjoklat> jdub_ I like the feature that you can play audio in nautilus window... you know view as list/icons/audio
[05:38] <jdub_> Tsjoklat: yeah, nautilus views no longer exist though.
[05:39] <Tsjoklat> jdub_ what is it going to be replaced with?
[05:39] <g0d> what are the minimal requirements for ubuntu? i have another box with 598 MHz and 192 mbRAM
[05:39] <g0d> is that enough?
[05:39] <jdub_> Tsjoklat: and really, everyone is better off using a music playing app
[05:39] <solarce> jdub_: http://www.solarce.org/tmp/ubuntu-desktop.txt
[05:39] <jdub_> Tsjoklat: that remains to be seen.
[05:40] <jdub_> g0d: 192MB RAM should be okay, more would be better.
[05:40] <Tsjoklat> jdub_ alrighty ... then the hope is that there will be a music playing app such as amarok in gnome :)
[05:40] <solarce> Tsjoklat: check out muine
[05:40] <jdub_> solarce: apt-get install -u
[05:40] <jdub_> solarce: apt-get install -u ubuntu-desktop
[05:40] <Tsjoklat> solarce: heard it had issues installing.. works for you? does it do lyrics too?
[05:41] <solarce> jdub_: same error message
[05:41] <solarce> Tsjoklat: haven't tried it recently, heard good things though
[05:41] <jdub_> solarce: yes, the error is expected.
[05:41] <jdub_> solarce: what other packages does it list, due for installation?
[05:41] <Tsjoklat> solarce too bad it needs to d/l a ton of mbs which is a problem when you are on dial-up
[05:41] <solarce> jdub_: none
[05:42] <jdub_> then you've probably got all of it
[05:42] <jdub_> and something else is wrong
[05:42] <solarce> jdub_: 4 are held back and they are all mono related
[05:42] <solarce> The following packages have been kept back:
[05:42] <solarce>   libmono-dev libmono0 mono-common mono-jit
[05:42] <jdub> that's fine
[05:43] <jdub> your problem is not related to lack of software, then
[05:44] <solarce> ooooo
[05:44] <solarce> I manually installed gnome-session and panel
[05:44] <solarce> they had been removed
[05:44] <solarce> :(
[05:45] <Tsjoklat> solarce weird
[05:45] <beh> how can i use fluxbox instead of gnome?
[05:46] <solarce> oh well
[05:46] <moquist_> beh: if you click "Session" on the login screen, is fluxbox listed as an option?  (I'm assuming you have fluxbox installed already...)
[05:46] <solarce> back in business now
[05:46] <solarce> bya and thanks
[05:46] <solarce> bye*
[05:46] <beh> moquist_: ok well i didnt know if it was that easy, I just installed it but i havent tried anything yet because i thought i would have to edit files
[05:47] <beh> moquist_: but ill try right now
[05:47] <moquist_> beh: I assumed switching from gnome to ion2 was going to be hard, but ion2 was listed right there, and I clicked it, and away I went.
[05:52] <farruinn> is there any way to see what's in hoary without actually upgrading to it?
[05:53] <hyrcan> Moquist how'd you like ion2?
[05:53] <moquist_> hyrcan: working like a charm.  it's beautiful (again).
[05:54] <moquist_> hyrcan: now I have a test user running a vncserver so I can test/play with the default gnome environment as well.
[05:55] <moquist> hyrcan: or am i answering the right question - were you asking how it was working [in Ubuntu] , or how I like ion2 in general?
[05:55] <strixy> I don't suppose anyone here would be interested in chatting about mail servers and ubuntu?
[05:55] <pixelmonkey> My Rhythmbox doesn't play MP3s (complains no plugin)... how do I make this work?
[05:55] <hyrcan> in general  :)
[05:56] <moquist> hyrcan: I'm a key-combo kind of guy, so I like using the mouse as little as possible, and only when it really is the appropriate input tool.
[05:56] <YokoZar> What package do I need so I can cat file | md5 ?
[05:56] <YokoZar> ie: I want to find md5 sum spit out on command line
[05:56] <jdub> pixelmonkey: install gstreamer0.8-mad, and read the restricted formats page on the wiki
[05:56] <strixy> I'm curious which server works the best in the ubuntu environment. (qmail seems to be left out of synaptic
[05:56] <moquist> hyrcan: so I set up [patterned, chorded]  key combos to move my focus where I need to, and I can do almost everything I need to do with the keyboard.
[05:56] <pixelmonkey> jdub, I appreciate it.  BTW, I held a Linux desktop talk at my university today and handed out 10 Ubuntu CDs to eager Windows switchers :)
[05:57] <strixy> go pixel :)
[05:57] <pixelmonkey> yea, I was surprised so many people showed up around finals... 30 people came
[05:59] <hyrcan> moquist: cool, I messed with it a while back but didn't spend the time to get it to my likeing...it always looked intriguing... Thought about trying it again, but I've fallen in love with Crystal-FVWM...
[05:59] <pixelmonkey> wow, I just found a _nasty_ bug with GtkFileChooser widget
[06:00] <moquist> hyrcan: also, as I mentioned the other day, I was already an adherent to the ion2 philosophy before I knew the project existed.  at that time I was using the "lines" theme for sawfish and I had key combos to do all my window manipulations and focus changes.
[06:00] <pixelmonkey> I have this long folder name for an MP3 album, and if I enter the directory that contains it, the GtkFileChooser widget infinite loops resizing the file display area (bigger, smaller, bigger, smaller) and freezes up.
[06:01] <crimsun> pixelmonkey: dpkg -l libgtk2.0-0|grep ^ii|awk -F' ' '{print $3}'
[06:01] <pixelmonkey> crimsun, 2.4.10-1ubuntu
[06:02] <hyrcan> http://fvwm-crystal.berlios.de/
[06:02] <crimsun> ah, warty?
[06:02] <pixelmonkey> crimsun, yep
[06:02] <crimsun> I tested that myself last night and couldn't reproduce your symptoms
[06:02] <pixelmonkey> crimsun, similar issue fixed in newer libgtk?
[06:02] <hyrcan> it's a set up config files for FVWM... that transform it into something really nice... :)
[06:02] <pixelmonkey> crimsun, so bug report exists, you know the #?
[06:02] <crimsun> pixelmonkey: seems so, but I'm tracking hoary
[06:03] <crimsun> pixelmonkey: not off the top of my head, sorry
[06:03] <pixelmonkey> crimsun, no problem, I won't report it then to avoid triage...
[06:03] <pixelmonkey> crimsun, I'll try to find the bug report on gnome.org
[06:03] <crimsun> sounds good
[06:03] <pixelmonkey> what version of libgtk is on hoary?
[06:04] <crimsun> 2.5.6-0ubuntu1
[06:05] <pixelmonkey> crimsun, ah, okay, so it's very possible it was fixed in between if you can't reproduce
[06:06] <Hikaru79> Any Java developers in here? #java is being totally unhelpful >_>
[06:07] <pixelmonkey> Hikaru79, I'm not bad, what ya need?
[06:07] <Hikaru79> =)
[06:07] <Hikaru79> pixelmonkey, you've used Swing GUI, then?
[06:07] <pixelmonkey> Hikaru79, eh, not enough, I do Java web development
[06:07] <Hikaru79> =/ Hm
[06:07] <Hikaru79> Well, try and help me here anyway :P
[06:08] <pixelmonkey> Hikaru79, not sure how useful I
[06:08] <pixelmonkey> I'll be if it's SWING specific...
[06:08] <Hikaru79> According to the Java API, tutorial, and online example, the following three lines should be fine:
[06:08] <Hikaru79>     JRadioButton importFiles = new JRadioButton ("Import from File");
[06:08] <Hikaru79>     ButtonGroup group = new ButtonGroup ();
[06:08] <Hikaru79>     group.add (importFiles);
[06:08] <Hikaru79> But group.add (importFiles); is giving me a wierd error
[06:08] <Hikaru79> During compile
[06:08] <pixelmonkey> what erro?
[06:08] <pixelmonkey> god my typing's a disaster today
[06:08] <Hikaru79> Syntax error on token "importFiles", VariableDeclaratorId expected after this token
[06:08] <Hikaru79> AND
[06:08] <Hikaru79> Syntax error on token(s), misplaced construct(s)
[06:09] <Hikaru79> Yet, if we check the Java API for ButtonGroup
[06:09] <Hikaru79> We see...  void 	add(AbstractButton b)
[06:09] <Hikaru79> Is JRadioButton not a subclass of an AbstractButton?
[06:09] <Hikaru79> The tutorial says it is >_>
[06:10] <pixelmonkey> So the argument passed to JRadioButton's constructor is what, a string for the label of the radio button?
[06:10] <Hikaru79> Exactly
[06:10] <huwr> Hi.
[06:10] <TomT64> maybe you need to subclass ButtonGroup (can you do that)?
[06:10] <TomT64> probably not, btu just a thought
[06:11] <Hikaru79> Like, have the class extend ButtonGroup?
[06:11] <pixelmonkey> So ButtonGroup is like for a group of three radio buttons where the selected one can only be one of the three?
[06:11] <huwr> My little brother was wondering what the Ubuntu developers were planning on doing once they ran out of hogs to name their releases after.
[06:11] <Hikaru79> Exactly; all buttongroup does is make sure all it's members are mutually exclusive
[06:11] <Hikaru79> huwr, LMAO :P
[06:11] <huwr> Has there been any discussion into that or is it just too far away?
[06:11] <crimsun> which javac version are you using, out of curiosity?
[06:11] <pixelmonkey> huwr: toy story characters? :-P
[06:11] <huwr> Hikaru79, :p
[06:11] <Hikaru79> 1.5.0
[06:12] <pixelmonkey> huwr, oh wait, that's taken
[06:12] <huwr> What about naming them after big cats?
[06:12] <Hikaru79> huwr, they've already got about 3 or 4 more names lined up
[06:12] <Hikaru79> It's on the wiki somewhere
[06:12] <jdub> huwr: we're just using interesting animals, not necessarily hogs :)
[06:12] <TomT64> huwr, you made me ROFL
[06:12] <huwr> Yeah. GrumpyGroundhog
[06:12] <Hikaru79> Hehe
[06:12] <Hikaru79> Woah
[06:13] <Hikaru79> Warty WartHOG, Hoary HedgeHOG, Grumpy GroundHOG... I *never* noticed that xD
[06:13] <ironwolf> lest us not forget perky penguin
[06:14] <huwr> bouncy bushhog?
[06:14] <thoreauputic> wonky wombat
[06:14] <huwr> roary roadhog?
[06:14] <thoreauputic> ;)
[06:15] <huwr> Heh
[06:15] <Gwildor> grouchy grounghog
[06:15] <huwr> Gwildor, grumpygroundhog is already there. :(
[06:16] <Gwildor> stupid me
[06:16] <huwr> yes :p
[06:16] <pixelmonkey> I guess the alliteration is gonna stick
[06:19] <thoreauputic> alliteration alleviates angst awfully
[06:19] <huwr> Pointy Penguin?
[06:20] <thoreauputic> Pedantic Penguin ? *grin*
[06:21] <huwr> I still like Raunchy Roadhog
[06:21] <Hikaru79> Hahaha
[06:23] <thoreauputic> Paranoid Piglet
[06:23] <pixelmonkey> Hikaru79, doing research on this Java thing, it seems your code is okay... sure it's not a library (jar file missing?) issue?
[06:23] <Hikaru79> pixelmonkey, pretty sure; all other of my Swing components are doing fine
[06:24] <Hikaru79> JRadioButton is in the same boat as all the rest of them, I don't see why some parts of the library would be found and this one not =/
[06:24] <Hikaru79> import javax.swing.*; //imported for buttons, labels, and images
[06:24] <pixelmonkey> Hikaru79, yea, it's weird...
[06:24] <Hikaru79> :(
[06:24] <Hikaru79> I think it might have to do with me using 1.5.0
[06:24] <Hikaru79> Because it says on the java api
[06:24] <Hikaru79> Warning:  Serialized objects of this class will not be compatible with future Swing releases. The current serialization support is appropriate for short term storage or RMI between applications running the same version of Swing. As of 1.4, support for long term storage of all JavaBeansTM  has been added to the java.beans package. Please see XMLEncoder.
[06:25] <Hikaru79> On the ButtonGroup page =/
[06:25] <Hikaru79> But then, if it was changed, what was it changed *to*?
[06:25] <pixelmonkey> hmm, yea, you don't have 1.4.2 laying around?
[06:25] <Hikaru79> nope :( Besides, my teacher will be marking this on 1.5.0 =/
[06:26] <pixelmonkey> Hikaru79, nonsense... so radio buttons come up as long as you don't use the group?
[06:26] <Hikaru79> Hm, lemme try that
[06:27] <Hikaru79> oh... wow...
[06:27] <Hikaru79> I feel *so* stupid right now
[06:28] <Hikaru79> I'd accidently put this outside of the brackets for the constructor method
[06:28] <Hikaru79> It was hanging around outside the class
[06:28] <Hikaru79> >___<
[06:28] <Hikaru79> Sorry, pixelmonkey :S
[06:28] <Hikaru79> Problem solved ^ ^;;
[06:28] <pixelmonkey> put what?
[06:28] <Hikaru79> Those three lines
[06:28] <Hikaru79> Should have been in the constructor method
[06:28] <pixelmonkey> oh
[06:28] <Hikaru79> They were in the main class header *blush*
[06:28] <pixelmonkey> I see, yea that's why the error was so lame
[06:29] <Hikaru79> =/ Yeah.
[06:29] <pixelmonkey> it was parsing all wrong, no problem, at least it's fixed
[06:30] <Hikaru79> Sorry for wasting your time, pixelmonkey :( I thought I'd been really careful; I'll be moreso next time
[06:32] <farruinn> is there some way to find out what version of gcc was used to compile a binary?
[06:44] <joshua__> im trying to compile something which compiled perfectly on hoary but now im on warty and its throwing an error
[06:46] <Gmail> hoary and warty are not always compatble
[06:46] <joshua__> it wasnt made for hoary
[06:47] <|QuaD|> Gmail: you run hoary, how is openoffice for you?
[06:47] <joshua__> |QuaD| in my hoary it works great
[06:47] <joshua__> LC_ALL=C ./intltool-merge ./po gnomad2.desktop.in gnomad2.desktop -d -u -c ./po/.intltool-merge-cache
[06:47] <Gmail> |QuaD|: i use gnome-office
[06:47] <Gmail> open office is bloatware
[06:48] <|QuaD|> joshua__: i have tried presentor
[06:48] <|QuaD|> 3 times
[06:48] <|QuaD|> all clicking from a webpage
[06:48] <|QuaD|> it takes FOREVER to open
[06:49] <joshua__> BAH!  Die error 1
[06:56] <arcadefx> bbl
[07:02] <mike_douglas> what is the name of the software in this (http://www.osnews.com/img/9097/ubuntu1.jpg) screenshot?
[07:02] <mike_douglas> the update one
[07:05] <|QuaD|> could it be synaptic?
[07:06] <|QuaD|> can someone help me with a cronjob?
[07:06] <jdub> mike_douglas: update-manager and gnome-app-install
[07:06] <mike_douglas> doesn't look like it, I heard that the ubuntu people were creating their own one
[07:06] <mike_douglas> thanks, jdub
[07:06] <|QuaD|> mike_douglas: i use apt-get :)
[07:06] <crimsun> and there you have it.
[07:07] <JDahl> |QuaD|, I am not expert, but have made some simple ones.. what's your problem?
[07:07] <|QuaD|> i have a command i want to run every 3 hours
[07:07] <|QuaD|> how would i do that
[07:07] <crimsun> use crontab
[07:07] <|QuaD|> how do i get to it?
[07:07] <crimsun> crontab -e
[07:07] <|QuaD|> it brings me to a blank screen
[07:08] <crimsun> right, now enter in the crontab syntax without the username
[07:08] <crimsun> (presuming you want to run the command as your $USER
[07:08] <crimsun> )
[07:08] <|QuaD|> yeah i do
[07:08] <|QuaD|> how do i find out the syntax?
[07:08] <crimsun> # m h dom mon dow command
[07:08] <|QuaD|> english?
[07:09] <crimsun> minute hour day_of_month month day_of_week command
[07:09] <crimsun> assuming you want it to run every 3 hours, it'd be:
[07:09] <crimsun> 0 3 * * * some_command
[07:09] <crimsun> err
[07:09] <infornography> If I delete everything in the /usr/lib/mozilla-firefox directory, and then install the new firefox to that directory, will I break anything? Or is that a suitable way to update it?
[07:10] <|QuaD|> 0 3 * * * php -r "include('somesite')";
[07:10] <JDahl> isnt that run at 00:03 every night ?
[07:10] <|QuaD|> so that would work?
[07:10] <crimsun> JDahl: yes
[07:10] <crimsun> (hence the err)
[07:10] <crimsun> actually, it'd be 3:00 every morning
[07:10] <|QuaD|> how do i change it to 3 hours?
[07:11] <jdub> * */3 * * *
[07:11] <jdub> ^ every three hours
[07:11] <crimsun> yep
[07:11] <|QuaD|> * */3 * * * php -r "include('somesite')";
[07:11] <crimsun> yep, and any output will be mailed to your $USER
[07:11] <regeya> I don't forsee using any pretty update manager.  seriously.
[07:12] <|QuaD|> ok
[07:12] <JDahl> wonders of unix...
[07:12] <|QuaD|> when does it start
[07:19] <willg> is anyone else having a problem removing gforge-ldap-openldap?
[07:22] <cef_work> |QuaD|: you mean the script above? assuming * */3, that'd be on the hours 0, 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 18 & 21
[07:23] <|QuaD|> ahh ok
[07:23] <|QuaD|> thanks
[07:25] <Adrenline> nigger stink!
[07:26] <Adrenline> use my new distro, KKK Linux, available at www.fuckthejews.com
[07:27] <willg> I love /ignore
[07:28] <|QuaD|> wtf
[07:28] <Adrenline> damn, there's more black in this channel than the chimneys at a concentration camp
[07:29] <|QuaD|> is he trolling?
[07:29] <cef_work> Adrenline: oi! just cos I wear black and hang around with the goth community, no need to get offensive!
[07:29] <Drone-Jo1dan> ...
[07:31] <Adrenline> you aint goth, yous a nigga, I see them chains, bow down
[07:32] <jdub> Adrenline: take it somewhere else please
[07:32] <huwr> So... how about that local sports team, huh?
[07:32] <Adrenline> the one with the niggers that play the sport?
[07:32] <huwr> I hear they are doing well in their specified field of excellence.
[07:32] <huwr> erk.
[07:35] <Adrenline> good bye bitches, EFNet calls, suck my ass and lick my balls!
[07:35] <Gman> dork
[07:35] <ctd> Nice character.
[07:35] <JDahl> very original
[07:36] <huwr> What a charming young man.
[07:57] <cef_work> ctd: very very sad.. *sigh*
[07:57] <joshua__> yay... all rejoice
[08:09] <EricNeon> how do you use beta gnome?
[08:12] <burner> Klowner, are you the same Klowner from #fluxbox theme glory?
[08:12] <Tsjoklat> he is burner
[08:13] <Tsjoklat> awesome one isn't it :)
[08:13] <Tsjoklat> I have Flung of Plastic on my dt
[08:13] <burner> heh
[08:13] <burner> gotta love flux
[08:13] <Tsjoklat> gotta love good skinners
[08:13] <burner> so true
[08:14] <Tsjoklat> nix wouldn't be half as fun if it wasn't for them
[08:14] <burner> kde kinda sucks... only cause it's so bright grey and silvery... a good skinner would make me like kde :)
[08:14] <Tsjoklat> well everyone of them has it's good sizes surely... you can customize gnome/kde to look anyway you would want it to be
[08:15] <burner> to an extent
[08:15] <burner> but anyway.... is anyone else having issues with nautilus lately?
[08:16] <Tsjoklat> what issues
[08:16] <burner> like it won't load
[08:16] <burner> it might just be my debian box... i'm booting ubuntu atm
[08:16] <burner> my whole gtk file selector ui makes all apps that use it crash too
[08:16] <Tsjoklat> I heard there were some problems today after upgrading
[08:16] <burner> so maybe that's what killing nautilus
[08:17] <burner> looks like ubuntu is ok so far
[08:17] <burner> time to upgrade and see if i break it :)
[08:19] <Tsjoklat> good luck :)
[08:22] <Synek> hi all
[08:22] <burner> hi
[08:26] <rory__> morning
[08:46] <rattboi> yo
[08:46] <|QuaD|> yo
[08:46] <rattboi> anyone know why there's such a big hoary update today?
[08:46] <rattboi> 183 packages?
[08:46] <burner> there is?
[08:46] <rattboi> maybe I missed 2 days
[08:46] <|QuaD|> i don't think i had that many
[08:46] <|QuaD|> even close
[08:46] <rattboi> well, it's been only 4-5 days since I've had Hoary
[08:46] <|QuaD|> i update once a day
[08:46] <|QuaD|> i did at like noon
[08:47] <|QuaD|> let me check it out
[08:47] <burner> xorg is cool... but no apps use it yet
[08:47] <rattboi> maybe I installed some other packages before I ran update
[08:47] <rattboi> what do you mean USE it?
[08:47] <rattboi> it's just there
[08:47] <rattboi> except extensions like composite
[08:48] <burner> composite is what i was referring to
[08:48] <burner> ie, only major change
[08:48] <|QuaD|> burner: 93 packages
[08:49] <burner> nevermind
[08:49] <rattboi> |Quad|, how long was noon from now where you are?
[08:49] <rattboi> wow, great sentence
[08:49] <|QuaD|> 14 hours?
[08:49] <burner> lol ;)
[08:49] <|QuaD|> maybe i updated later
[08:49] <|QuaD|> or maybe i forgot today... i usually update at noon
[08:51] <rattboi> I wonder how long 183 packages take to install...
[08:53] <alka_trash> does anyone here use a LCD
[08:53] <rattboi> like a monitor or something else?
[08:53] <alka_trash> ya
[08:53] <rattboi> ya?
[08:53] <rattboi> lol
[08:53] <rattboi> so..both?
[08:54] <|QuaD|> alka_trash: i have 2 now :)
[08:54] <alka_trash> I just bought a 19 LCD and I don't know change the settings, I did a dpkg-reconfigure xserver .. blah but it doesn't let me change the monitor settings
[08:55] <alka_trash> It's working but I know that I'm missing some settings in xorg
[08:55] <|QuaD|> i edit the config files
[08:55] <|QuaD|> i don't use scripts
[08:56] <alka_trash> did you add any options to the config file
[08:56] <|QuaD|> lcd specific? no
[08:56] <|QuaD|> i never used a script
[08:56] <|QuaD|> so i added lots of lines
[08:56] <decklin> try dpkg-reconfigure -plow
[08:57] <alka_trash> okay
[08:57] <burner> alka_trash, change what?
[08:57] <alka_trash> just a sec
[08:57] <burner> resolution?
[08:58] <rattboi> I wonder when the umount problem will be fixed
[08:58] <|QuaD|> umount problem?
[08:58] <ironwolf> rattboi: it's fixed
[08:58] <alka_trash> I just did a dpkg-reconfigure -plow xserver-xorg
[08:59] <alka_trash> and I still can't change the monitor settings
[08:59] <burner> -plow?
[08:59] <|QuaD|> what is the umount problem?
[08:59] <ironwolf> QuaD: usb thingy
[08:59] <|QuaD|> oh
[08:59] <ruebe> hi
[08:59] <alka_trash> burner: decklin help me with this one
[08:59] <rattboi> who are the devs in here?
[09:00] <rattboi> I want to be closer to the new info
[09:00] <ruebe> how works ubuntu on laptop?
[09:00] <ironwolf> rattboi: I think their sleeping. :)  Conference in Mataro Spain.
[09:01] <rattboi> cool
[09:01] <bborkk> ruebe: What questions do you have?
[09:01] <rattboi> do you guys follow the mailing list or what?
[09:01] <ironwolf> ruebe: works well.  Hardware detection is second to none that I've found.
[09:01] <ironwolf> rattboi:  irc works.
[09:02] <rattboi> huh, this channel?
[09:02] <rattboi> I haven't heard anyong talking like thery were devs here
[09:02] <ruebe> now i have kanotix installed, but acpi doesnt work fine, how is the acpi in ubuntu..sorry about my poor english
[09:03] <Gmail> OMG /boot umount ed
[09:03] <Tomcat_> ruebe: Works for me... not perfectly but okay.
[09:03] <Gmail> then /home umount AGAIN
[09:03] <Gmail> then / umount and my system crashed
[09:03] <ruebe> thx
[09:03] <Gmail> 2nd time this happened
[09:04] <ruebe> ill test it!
[09:04] <ironwolf> rattboi: lots of devs here... most are at conference, so all crash at same time, normally it's better
[09:04] <ironwolf> rattboi: this channel has logs that go back...
[09:05] <ironwolf> ruebe: acpi works for me... on my laptop, and it hasn't on other distros.
[09:05] <ironwolf> Gmail: are you running current hoary?
[09:06] <Gmail> yes
[09:06] <Gmail> OMG
[09:06] <Gmail> wtf happened to computer
[09:06] <Gmail> it became the normal action
[09:07] <Gmail> jdub_: you in charge of gnome in ubuntu to some dergree?
[09:08] <ironwolf> Gmail: to my understanding lamont got it into archive within last 10ish hours.  try apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade see if still having issues
[09:08] <rattboi> spiv: that you?
[09:08] <ruebe> ironwolf: must i use the ubuntu-packages, or can i install debian-packages?
[09:08] <spiv> Um.  Who else would I be?
[09:08] <bborkk> ruebe: You can install any package you'd like.
[09:08] <rattboi> I mean, do you know me?
[09:08] <Gmail> ironwolf: my mirror updates ever 6hrs :(
[09:09] <rattboi> if my nick isn't immediately recognizable, I don't know you
[09:09] <ironwolf> Gmail: thought daniels and fabbione were the gnome Gods.
[09:09] <ironwolf> Gmail: jdub's more like an overlord. :)
[09:09] <lamont_r> ironwolf: the unmount everything appears to be a udev thing...
[09:09] <ruebe> thank you all, and good bye!
[09:10] <Gmail> ironwolf: and jordi is just a worker
[09:10] <spiv> rattboi: That's probably a "no" then :)
[09:10] <rattboi> ok
[09:10] <ironwolf> lamont_r: didn't I see you say it was fixed though?  or was I imagining?
[09:10] <Tsjoklat> testy testy
[09:10] <lamont_r> Gmail: wrap an if [ -n "$DEVNAME" ] ; then ... fi around the bulk of /etc/dev.d/default/unmount.dev
[09:10] <rattboi> I know this gp32 guy named mr. spiv
[09:10] <lamont_r> ironwolf: I thought it was mostly understood...
[09:11] <lamont_r> bbiab
[09:11] <Gmail> lamont_r: english
[09:11] <ironwolf> Gmail: be back in a bit <-- is what lamont_r said
[09:12] <Gmail> k
[09:13] <ironwolf> Gmail: jordi is unknown to me.
[09:13] <Gmail> ironwolf: well he works for debian
[09:14] <ironwolf> Gmail: cool
[09:14] <Gmail> whats the offical ubuntu apt rep and not a mirror
[09:16] <ironwolf> Gmail: huh?
[09:16] <bborkk> yeah.  huh?
[09:17] <Gmail> what is the line you are using for the ubuntu repo?
[09:17] <Gmail> err i'll find it my self
[09:17] <bob2> Gmail: wiki.ubuntu.com/Archive
[09:18] <Gmail> thanks
[09:18] <Gmail> bob2: why not the new wiki
[09:18] <Gmail> ohh it fwds there
[09:21] <Gmail> bob2: i see no fix
[09:22] <Gmail> the debian gnome-applets leaked into ubuntu
[09:23] <bob2> erm, I doubt that
[09:24] <Keybuk> do you mean the GNOME menu reversion?
[09:24] <Gmail> bob2: well its on my system
[09:24] <Gmail> Keybuk: the menu applet is the normal one like in debian
[09:24] <Keybuk> yes, that's nothing to do with gnome-applets
[09:24] <Keybuk> GNOME uses Freedesktop.org menus now
[09:24] <Keybuk> we haven't rewritten our patches
[09:25] <Gmail> and the comand line applet is smaller
[09:25] <Gmail> Keybuk: i know
[09:25] <Keybuk> it's nothing to do with Debian, it's just the upstream changes
[09:25] <Gmail> Keybuk: its no longer "Computer" its "Actions"
[09:25] <Gmail> ^^
[09:25] <Treenaks> Gmail: it'll be changes back eventually
[09:26] <Keybuk> Gmail: yes... we haven't rewritten our patches
[09:26] <cef_work> is /etc/modutils/ actually useful in ubuntu? since ubuntu doesn't support 2.4 kernels, and everything seems to use /etc/modprobe.d/, do we need it?
[09:27] <Gmail> Keybuk: how long will it take?
[09:27] <Gmail> i want to know if i should downgrade
[09:27] <bob2> chill dude, it will be fixed soon
[09:27] <cef_work> I just spent 1 hr fiddling with module parameters for sbp2 with the wrong files because of it.. *sigh*
[09:27] <rattboi> hmm
[09:28] <rattboi> I should restart
[09:28] <Gmail> bob2: i am chills shess i was just asking a question
[09:29] <Gmail> btw the abiword entrey disapread
[09:30] <stuNNed> Gmail, under 'other' here
[09:32] <Gmail> ahh
[09:32] <Gmail> bob2: any chance of browing xfce menu editor (it suports x standard) for gnome/ubuntu ?
[09:33] <Gmail> *xfce 4.2 the new one
[09:33] <bob2> I don't know
[09:33] <rattboi> huh
[09:33] <rattboi> actions menu
[09:34] <Gmail> yes
[09:34] <Gmail> i have already complained
[09:34] <rattboi> nah, I think it's fine
[09:34] <|QuaD-> actually
[09:34] <rattboi> I dont think it's a big deal
[09:34] <bob2> complaining on irc is fairly pointless and annoying
[09:34] <Gmail> its not
[09:34] <Kamion> hm, Debian just fixed a lot of those initrd root filesystem detection problem
[09:34] <|QuaD-> i just did a dist-upgrade
[09:34] <Kamion> problems
[09:34] <bob2> it's better to check the ubuntu-devel and bug system first
[09:34] <|QuaD-> and it is installing more
[09:34] <|QuaD-> bob2: i am not that worried, could be something i did
[09:34] <|QuaD-> let me first investigate
[09:35] <|QuaD-> (unless you know of something...)
[09:35] <Gmail> because how are we ment to get to those programs under computer???
[09:35] <bob2> oh, not you, Gmail
[09:35] <Gmail> what?
[09:36] <rattboi> what, exactly, are you missing Gmail?
[09:36] <rattboi> it seems like most are in my Applications menu
[09:36] <Gmail> rattboi: synaptic....
[09:36] <rattboi> gmail: applications...
[09:36] <rattboi> applications -> system settings -> synaptic
[09:37] <|QuaD-> Gmail: actions menu=aplications menu?
[09:37] <Gmail> rattboi: i don't have system settings
[09:37] <Gmail> yes
[09:37] <|QuaD-> yes to me?
[09:37] <Gmail> yes
[09:38] <Kinnison> Morning
[09:38] <rattboi> gmail: no applications menu?
[09:38] <|QuaD-> i didn't break it then :)
[09:39] <Gmail> raja: there is
[09:39] <ulisse> Hi channel
[09:40] <|QuaD-> hi ulisse
[09:40] <ulisse> I'm having a little problem with warty
[09:40] <|QuaD-> awww...
[09:41] <|QuaD-> you have problems with your wart.... me with my hoar
[09:41] <ulisse> I installed warty on my friend's PC, that's equipped with al DVD reader and a DVD recorder
[09:42] <Gmail> heh
[09:42] <|QuaD-> nice
[09:42] <Gmail> did you check driver support FIRST
[09:42] <ulisse> all was ok, but since two days ago, my friend said that there was only one device
[09:42] <ulisse> there was only the recorder
[09:42] <ulisse> but after a reboot, there was only the reader...
[09:43] <ulisse> it's quite strange, no?
[09:43] <|QuaD-> that is strange
[09:43] <|QuaD-> lol
[09:43] <|QuaD-> now enough sillyness
[09:44] <|QuaD-> did she make sure it was mounted
[09:44] <ulisse> It didn't appears in /dev/
[09:44] <|QuaD-> hmm... don't know what to say then
[09:45] <ulisse> is it possible that is a problem with devices creation at startup?
[09:45] <|QuaD-> did she look through her boot logs?
[09:45] <|QuaD-> haha
[09:45] <|QuaD-> she should look for errors in her boot logs
[09:45] <Gmail> jdub: connection probblems?
[09:45] <|QuaD-> like (i am guessing) dmsg
[09:46] <ulisse> I hadn't the time to lokk into her pc
[09:46] <ulisse> look, not lokk
[09:46] <|QuaD-> maybe look into it
[09:46] <|QuaD-> if she doesn't know what she is doing
[09:46] <|QuaD-> maybe its an easy fix
[09:46] <ulisse> I think it shouldn't be a serious trouble
[09:47] <|QuaD-> i haven't heard of a problem, but i don't know too much
[09:49] <ulisse> Maybe it could be an HW trouble, I connected those devices with an 80-pin cable (the one for HD, you know?)
[09:49] <ulisse> instead of a standard 40 pin
[09:49] <Gmail> OMG look at the ubuntuforums.org thing about the computer menu
[09:49] <Gmail> its already on page 2
[09:49] <|QuaD-> hahah
[09:50] <|QuaD-> when was it started
[09:51] <zAo^> morning
[09:52] <bborkk> zAo^: Zao3!
[09:52] <|QuaD-> is this the first crippling bug like this hoary has seen?
[09:52] <Gmail> |QuaD-: Unread  Today, 05:45 AM
[09:53] <|QuaD-> Gmail: what category is it in (i hate links :))
[09:54] <Gmail> http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=21
[09:54] <Gmail> #21
[09:54] <|QuaD-> Gmail: i can't see it.... can't copy/paste from irssi
[09:54] <|QuaD-> what forum is in?
[09:55] <|QuaD-> i found it
[09:55] <|QuaD-> nm
[09:56] <colleenj> good morning
[09:56] <Ng> nice hostname :)
[09:56] <zAo^> bborkk, zao3?
[09:57] <colleenj> :)
[10:02] <|QuaD-> alright... night you all, guess i will have ot wait to fix this until tomorrow
[10:03] <|QuaD-> (or hopefully it will be fixed by then :) )
[10:04] <hwm> somebody remind me what the alternative to root is?
[10:05] <rattboi> sudo ?
[10:07] <ermo> hwm, yoda?
[10:07] <hwm> thanks
[10:07] <mattgirv> or fakeroot
[10:07] <mattgirv> but i think you will need to apt-get that
[10:09] <colleenj> so what's unbuntu like to use?  Is it like any other distro such as RH, slackware, SuSe?
[10:09] <Agrajag> it's like debian
[10:10] <colleenj> ah i see
[10:10] <colleenj> and how upto date is it, when compared to something like LibraNet?
[10:10] <Agrajag> I have no idea what that is.
[10:10] <scizzo> colleenj: all the info you need is on the website actually
[10:10] <colleenj> its another distro like debian
[10:10] <Agrajag> Warty, the stable release, is about two months old.
[10:10] <colleenj> based on the 2.4.21 kernel
[10:10] <hwm> anybody know how to reister a protocol in firefox?  IRC for example?
[10:11] <Agrajag> all the software in it is about two months old.
[10:11] <Agrajag> Hoary, the developing release, is bleeding-edge stuff, due to be released in April I think
[10:12] <thoreauputic> hwm: the easy out (I've used it) , is to install the chatzilla extension
[10:12] <thoreauputic> hwm: I also use Irssi and xchat, but for integration with Firefox, the chatzilla extension works nicely
[10:14] <hwm> just google chatzilla and follow the numbers?
[10:14] <thoreauputic> hwm: just go to tools > add extensions in firefox, and look for "chat" on the extensions site
[10:15] <thoreauputic> hwm: the 'fox extension is specific to firefox
[10:15] <colleenj> that should be from the extensions download page accessed via Tools | Extensions
[10:16] <Kamion> colleenj: Warty's based on the <IP_ADDRESS> kernel
[10:16] <thoreauputic> colleenj: I believe that's what I said above :)
[10:16] <Kamion> colleenj: oh, sorry, I totally misread and thought you were talking about Warty, not Libranet. :-)
[10:17] <lamont_r> colleenj: <IP_ADDRESS> is the default kernel in warty
[10:17] <lamont_r> Agrajag: actually, warty is up to 5.5 months old software - upstream version freeze was end of June, changes beyond that were for release critical bugs.
[10:17] <lamont_r> upstream version freeze will hit hoary sometime soon (haven't looked), and then that will get hammered on until April.
[10:17] <lamont_r> and then repeat
[10:18] <Agrajag> well, in any case it's newer than debian stable
[10:18] <hwm> thanks again
[10:18] <hwm> bye
[10:19] <colleenj> Agrajag: tvm
[10:22] <calc> lamont_r: freeze at end of dec?
[10:23] <calc> how is that going to work out with gnome 2.10 not out yet?
[10:23] <lamont_r> calc: upstream version freeze does not affect feature goals
[10:23] <calc> limited well tested additions (i guess)?
[10:23] <calc> ok
[10:24] <pisuke> heh. ubuntu has taken osnews readers by storm. it seems you're doing very well.
[10:24] <hwm> back again, can someone please remind me syntax of getting gcc?
[10:24] <Agrajag> sudo apt-get install build-essential
[10:25] <Kamion> calc: same way it worked in Warty when GNOME 2.8 wasn't out until just before thre elase
[10:25] <Kamion> er, "the release". learn to type Col
[10:26] <calc> ok :)
[10:26] <calc> i didn't know previously that warty was frozen in june
[10:26] <Kamion> yep
[10:26] <lamont_r> calc: that's the reason that sarge/sid->warty was a crossgrade.
[10:27] <calc> oh btw is gnome 2.9 not supposed to display anything on the desktop?
[10:27] <Kamion> you can see the vestiges of that better in universe; we touched a lot of main after June, since we didn't actually get started with Warty development until nearly the upstream version freeze really
[10:27] <calc> 2.8 in warty displayed things like home (iirc)
[10:27] <seb128> calc, it's supposed to display the drives
[10:27] <enntee> Does Warty get regular software updates?
[10:27] <enntee> seems like there are some older packages in it
[10:27] <Agrajag> enntee: only securitu/bugfixes
[10:27] <calc> hmm on mine its completely blank
[10:27] <Agrajag> security
[10:28] <enntee> damn.
[10:28] <calc> seb128: btw the applications.menu is going to be a fun thing to work out ;)
[10:28] <lamont_r> enntee: for security and critical data loss only
[10:28] <lamont_r> (modulo ubuntu-calendar)
[10:28] <lamont_r> but the warty archive won't change.
[10:28] <seb128> calc, no, warty doesn't display home
[10:28] <lamont_r> enntee: the next regular update of warty will be in april.  it's called hoary.
[10:28] <seb128> calc, and plug an usb key by example, it should pop on the desktop
[10:28] <calc> seb128: hmm ok, i'll have to boot up a warty box and see what it displays again
[10:29] <enntee> so it's sort of hard to stay current with warty, eh?
[10:29] <Kamion> enntee: we think that "every six months" is a pretty good compromise
[10:29] <lamont_r> warty is all about stability
[10:29] <hwm> anyone know of a good ftp client for ubuntu?  When I tried gftp it failed because it looked for gtk-config 1.2.3 or higher and couldn't
[10:29] <calc> i know it at least showed extra mounts that were mounted at boot time
[10:29] <calc> which hoary doesn't
[10:29] <Ng> hoary doesn't *today*, that doesn't mean it won't tomorrow, it might catch on fire tomorrow too ;)
[10:29] <seb128> calc, there is no difference on the desktop between warty and hoary for the moment
[10:30] <enntee> Kamion: don't get me wrong, i'm not criticizing.
[10:30] <lamont_r> enntee: there is a compromise that must be struck between bleeding-edge-new and stability
[10:30] <lamont_r> the releases target stability, with the next one being 6 months later.
[10:30] <seb128> calc, you've probably changed some user setting for your user on warty
[10:30] <calc> seb128: is there some configuration option i might need to set to get it to show the mounts on the desktop in 2.9?
[10:30] <calc> i didn't change anything on warty afaik
[10:30] <calc> i installed 3 warty boxes and they all showed the mounts on the desktop
[10:31] <seb128> like hoary does
[10:31] <calc> hoary doesn't show my mounts here
[10:31] <lamont_r> so you can choose to run 0-6 month old sw, 6-12, or 12-18.
[10:31] <calc> at least not at boot time mounts, i'll test inserting a key and see what happens
[10:31] <lamont_r> seb128: I don't see my usb key on my desktop
[10:31] <lamont_r> resonably current hoary
[10:31] <seb128> calc,  the options are in /apps/nautilus/desktop
[10:32] <enntee> and it's generally a bad idea to install debian packages on warty, correct?
[10:32] <seb128> lamont, I've just tried 5s ago here and it works
[10:32] <enntee> or hoary packages on warty?
[10:32] <lamont_r> enntee: certainly outside of the support model
[10:32] <seb128> weird
[10:32] <calc> ok key works, but it doesn't show any of the other mounts
[10:32] <lamont_r> seb128: hrm.. quite likely that I hacked over my config some way or another.
[10:32] <colleenj> well here goes.... so far the installer looks very sweet
[10:32] <enntee> lamont_r: yeah... but is it pretty do-able for someone familiar with debian?
[10:32] <seb128> lamont, probably ... do you have a ~/.gconf/apps/nautilus/desktop dir ?
[10:33] <Kamion> enntee: may work, may not, depends on the exact packages involved. for simple packages with few dependency interactions it can certainly be tried relatively straightforwardly
[10:33] <lamont_r> enntee: the preferred method (if you must grab newer versions), is to grab the source (apt-get source foo - after adding a deb-src line pointing to debian), and then dpkg-buildpackage
[10:33] <calc> seb128: i don't have that .gconf dir here
[10:33] <jdub> silbs, lulu: i have fought the wiki and won.
[10:33] <Kamion> enntee: the thing to avoid is listing both Debian and Ubuntu archives in sources.list; that confuses apt quite a bit
[10:33] <seb128> calc, and your usb pop on the desktop, that works as expecte
[10:33] <seb128> expected
[10:33] <Kamion> enntee: so if you're grabbing Debian packages, you have to do it by hand
[10:34] <lamont_r> enntee: the concern relates to library versions and such, mixed with the fact that apt/dpkg/whatever believe that all copies of foo_1.1_i386.deb are identical in the world.
[10:34] <lulu> jdub: sounds like a breakthrough!
[10:34] <calc> volumes is set to visible, so something changed between 2.8/2.9 (or in hoary) so that boot time volumes aren't shown anymore
[10:34] <enntee> Kamion, lamont_r: thanks
[10:35] <jdub> lulu: nah, just managed to get my bof changes in
[10:35] <seb128> calc, I don't think so
[10:35] <enntee> the dpkg-buildpackage method sounds good to me
[10:35] <lamont_r> enntee: yeah
[10:35] <seb128> pitti, here ?
[10:35] <calc> i can try reinstalling the system with warty again to make certain i didn't do anything odd to it
[10:35] <lamont_r> seb128: or turn around
[10:35] <calc> but it was showing boot time volumes for certain
[10:35] <seb128> pitti, is there a difference on the volume displayed on the desktop between warty and hoary ?
[10:35] <lulu> jdub:great :o)
[10:35] <calc> and hoary doesn't but it does show volumes that come up while logged in (eg usb key)
[10:36] <pitti> seb128, fabbione: <IP_ADDRESS> works fine for me on hoary, no difference to warty; 2.6.9 breaks sound, unfortunately
[10:37] <pitti> fabbione: my sound on 2.6.9 is present, but barely audible (very quiet). any idea?
[10:37] <jdub> pitti: turn up the volume
[10:37] <fabbione> pitti: did you wash your hear this mornig?
[10:37] <seb128> see, I'm not the only one to break stuff :p
[10:37] <pitti> jdub: I'm not going to comment this
[10:37] <jdub> :-)
[10:37] <calc> fabbione: btw would you happen to know why warty kernel ich5 gets loaded too late and thus can't enable dma?
[10:38] <fabbione> calc: no. i maintain only the kernel for hoary
[10:38] <pitti> fabbione: btw, it already broke on the very first 2.6.9 version, not only on yesterday's
[10:38] <enntee> lamont_r: would it be better to have a deb-src line pointed at hoary in order to get newer versions of packages?
[10:38] <calc> fabbione: ok
[10:38] <fabbione> pitti: try to check if the cable for the speakers is plugged properly
[10:39] <calc> yep i am definitely seeing boot time mounts on my desktop in warty
[10:39] <lamont_r> enntee: you could list both, and get the latest of the two...
[10:39] <calc> i'll nuke the config for that user and see if they still come back
[10:39] <enntee> lamont_r: cool, thanks
[10:41] <lamont_r> and chroot's to build things for all 3 (and others) as well...
[10:43] <intinig> hello all
[10:43] <intinig> did anyone else get screwed menus after updating hoary?
[10:44] <pisuke> I'm glad I could resist DUH
[10:46] <calc> ok on a completely up to date and cleansed home dir it still shows fs mounted at boottime on the desktop
[10:46] <calc> i nuked all config files, etc
[10:46] <calc> but that doesn't happen on hoary
[10:46] <enntee> lamont_r: anything you can do when apt says it can't satisfy build-dep's?
[10:47] <seb128> calc, you have the same options in /apps/nautilus/desktop ? and the same fstab ?
[10:48] <lamont_r> enntee: satisfy them. :-(
[10:48] <fabbione> applying patch dsdt-initrd to ./ ... ok.
[10:48] <fabbione> applying patch swsusp-userspace to ./ ... ok.
[10:48] <fabbione> applying patch wakeup_addr to ./ ... ok.
[10:48] <fabbione> applying patch wakeup_gdt to ./ ... ok.
[10:48] <fabbione> ECHAN
[10:48] <lamont_r> enntee: I generally wind up dumping Build-Depends from debian-control, and installing them one at a time to figure out which one is the problem child.
[10:49] <lamont_r> if you're trying to build on warty, you may need to down-rev some libraries to the versions in warty.
[10:49] <colleenj> I hate to sound like a total noob but how long shout it take to install the base-pacakges?  It's been sat at installing base-pacakges (205) for abot 20 mins now
[10:49] <lamont_r> hence it's easier to just run hoary (and live with the blood on the floor...)
[10:49] <colleenj> 205 = 20%
[10:50] <calc> crap i turned it off already, the nautilus should be the same, i removed it completely
[10:50] <calc> and i did not edit anything under /etc
[10:50] <calc> not sure about fstab
[10:50] <enntee> lamont_r: yeah, i'm considering just running hoary, but I'm not real wild about my workstation using experimental software.
[10:51] <lamont_r> enntee: we call it "dogfood" :-)
[10:51] <lamont_r> but I understand the concern
[10:51] <enntee> rhythmbox 0.8.8 just remembers playlist orders, that's where this madness comes from :)
[10:54] <lamont_r> I see
[10:56] <deception_uk> hi all
[10:57] <colleenj> hello
[10:57] <deception_uk> colleenj hiya how r u
[10:57] <colleenj> having fun with MyFirstInstall(tm)
[10:58] <deception_uk> ooOOoo:-D
[10:58] <deception_uk> how is it going so far?
[10:59] <colleenj> uncertain
[10:59] <Kamion> colleenj: that's probably bad; look on alt-f3 and alt-f4 to see what's happening
[11:00] <Kamion> colleenj: what exactly is the installer UI saying?
[11:01] <colleenj> well currently as i say it's seems to have 'hung' @ 20% - extracting base-files
[11:01] <calc> interesting my gnome menu seems to have reverted back to gnome default (instead of the ubuntu one)
[11:01] <colleenj> alt-f3 / alt-f4 has no effect