[00:00] <ikonia> not the USA
[00:00] <knome> there are other channels than those in the ubuntu namespace
[00:00] <vibhav> still I like offtopic
[00:01] <elky> vibhav, if you were let back into -offtopic, would you promise that you would neither use it as a platform to rant from, nor use it as a support channel?
[00:01] <ikonia> then you should look at how you behave in the channels
[00:01] <ikonia> ah elky
[00:01] <vibhav> Rant about what?
[00:01] <elky> anything
[00:01] <vibhav> Ok
[00:02] <elky> so no ranting, no asking support questions?
[00:02] <vibhav> OK
[00:02] <elky> i need more than "ok" here. I need you to state what you are agreeing to in full
[00:03] <vibhav> I will not use #ubuntu-offtopic as a  platform to rant from,or as a support channel
[00:05] <ikonia> vibhav: the bans been removed in #ubuntu-offtopic, please please keep in mind your behaviour and if someone asks you to do something, try to follow it
[00:05] <vibhav> thank you
[00:08] <popey> hmm, the !loco factoid should probably point to loco.ubuntu.com not that wiki page?
[00:09] <ikonia> I can update
[00:12] <ikonia> !loco
[00:15] <ikonia> !no loco is Information on Ubuntu Local Community Teams is at http://loco.ubuntu.com
[00:15] <ikonia> !loco
[00:15] <ikonia> cool
[00:17] <ikonia> time to sleep
[00:17]  * h00k reads backlog
[00:18] <Pici> !no loco is <reply> Information on Ubuntu Local Community Teams is at http://loco.ubuntu.com
[00:18] <knome> awwh, why don't people like the closing /
[00:18] <knome> that makes the url so much sexier
[00:42] <bazhang> tired of the constant stream of noise from sudokill
[00:42] <bazhang> he offers nothing of substance that I have seen. just random peanut gallery commentary.
[00:42] <popey> +1 knome
[00:43] <knome> !no loco is <reply> Information on Ubuntu Local Community Teams is at http://loco.ubuntu.com/
[00:50] <mneptok> mmmmm .... peanuts ....
[00:51] <bazhang> to you!
[00:56] <elky> ikonia, ok, so im pretty sure that was a borderline support question. it shouldn't take long until he's asking ubuntu support questions and he can be re-banned.
[01:30] <mneptok> bazhang: do you have +o in -ot? if not i can keep an eye so elky can sleep.
[01:31] <elky> i /wish/ i was sleeping...
[01:51] <mneptok> J21: hi, how can we help?
[01:51] <J21> Sorry... I guess it's the wrong channel
[01:51] <J21> I didn't know this was for abuse ans part only. Adios!
[01:52] <mneptok> ciao!
[01:52] <knome> does anybody else visit the websites from users' hosts?
[01:53] <mneptok> knome: uhhh ... was that you outside our bathroom window last night? ;)
[01:54] <knome> haha, i'll let you think about it ;)
[01:57] <bazhang> heh
[01:57] <bazhang> mneptok, will watch, and catalyze as -o there
[01:58] <mneptok> bazhang: k. i'm tootling off for couch time with the wife.
[02:00] <elky> knome, sometimes, not when im at work though. what's notable about this one?
[02:05] <knome> elky, nothing really. i was just being curious ;)
[02:05] <knome> mneptok, see you (errr... ;))
[02:07] <elky> plz to keep the creepy in non logged channels? kthx.
[02:07] <knome> sorry :)
[04:06] <Juest> hi
[04:06] <Juest> is my ban at #ubuntu infinite??
[04:07] <Juest> ...
[04:08] <elky> What's the ban for?
[04:08] <Juest> ...
[04:09] <elky> You were banned for a reason. I want to know that you understand what it is.
[04:10] <Juest> ok, can you read every #ubuntu-ops logs since May that mention me please?
[04:11] <Juest> elky..
[04:11] <h00k> ubottu: tell Juest about logs
[04:12] <Juest> -.-
[04:12] <h00k> @login
[04:12] <h00k> @btlogin
[04:12] <Pici> Juest: elky is asking not for her own benifit, we'd like to know that *you* understand why you were banned.
[04:13] <Pici> We have our own methods of tracking bans.
[04:13] <Juest> i do, it was a rooted lie...
[04:14] <Juest> and also i have a personal iusse with ikonia, he tells my truth :(
[04:14] <Juest> it does not matter here
[04:15] <Juest> just because rooted ubuntu is unsupported i lied ikonia when he asked if i left root gui
[04:16] <Juest> ....
[04:18] <Juest> hello?
[04:18] <elky> Juest, until you are willing to take responsibility for your own actions, you will remain banned.
[04:19] <Juest> i already took the responsability, just not proving it
[04:29] <Juest> elky...
[04:30] <IdleOne> Juest: the last time you were here you agreed to follow the code of conduct and guidelines and immediately started being abusive in PM towards ikonia. it was decided that you didn't appear to have any intentions on following the rules.
[04:31] <Juest> well, is wasn't related with ubuntu
[04:31] <IdleOne> abuse is abuse
[04:31] <Juest> :(
[04:32] <IdleOne> there is no reason for it. If you are unable to follow through with promises you made not 5 minutes earlier how can we trust you won't abuse other users in PM from #ubuntu or for that matter in the channel.
[04:32] <Juest> and he says that is proven that i am liar, he isn't right because not always i lie
[04:33] <Juest> you guys can trust me, i NEVER will do abusive PM's
[04:33] <IdleOne> Juest: I believe that you should take a couple of more days and think about what has been said here. Come back in 48 hours and we can see then if the ban can/should be removed.
[04:33] <Juest> should i look logs?
[04:33] <IdleOne> if you want to
[04:34] <Juest> well
[04:34] <Juest> sometimes i don't remember very well
[04:36] <elky> Juest, well you'll need to get a piece of paper and a sharpie and some tape and stick a note on your monitor that says "I MUST NOT ABUSE PEOPLE"
[04:36] <Juest> lol
[04:36] <Juest> no
[04:37] <Juest> is a basic thing i don't need to use sticky notes for that
[04:37] <elky> it's a basic thing that you're saying you "don't remember very well"
[04:38] <elky> so clearly it's not a basic thing for you and exceptional measures are needed
[04:39] <Juest> i am very clear, i just remember well the most basic things i never froget these basic things
[04:39] <IdleOne> Juest: Good. So come back in 48 hours and we can see about removing the ban then.
[04:42] <Juest> ok, but i told that sometimes i just have difficulty to explain..
[04:43] <Juest> even if i am way too smart y'all always frogets about some things,  we can't remember every hole/thing in our mind
[04:44] <Juest> it can happen to anybody
 my entire paid for music collection was eradicated the moment i accidentally enable root user
[06:13] <bazhang> this is the same fellow who claimed he was kidnapped in #ubuntu earlier
[06:18] <bazhang> anyone making sense of what fdeiam is saying?
[06:18] <bazhang> kidnapping seems the most credible so far.
[06:19] <IdleOne> heh
[06:30] <bazhang> you sure about that ? 6667 was the default last time I checked. I had to set it to 8001 manually
[06:31] <IdleOne> I am pretty sure yeah
[06:31] <IdleOne> unless I have it set in my backed up config
[06:31] <IdleOne> which is possible
[07:26] <bazhang> ?
[07:27] <Flannel> .
[08:23] <elky> seems she remembered how to change her part message in irssi
[08:53] <ikonia> I'm getting tired of the foolish complaining in #ubuntu-offtopic
[08:53] <ikonia> they mock the rules of the channel - if they don't like them, why is it such a big deal that they are there, there are many other channels that don't have those rules
[09:03] <oCean> now they're just being buch of big babies
[09:03] <oCean> *bunch
[09:03] <ikonia> it's partially my fault in that I've had enough of it, I could have ignored it
[09:04] <jussi> ikonia: I see your point, they do complain a bit. You did come across as a bit of the grumpy school teacher though.
[09:04] <ikonia> jussi: I don't care if I did
[09:05] <ikonia> it was meant grumpy as I've had enough of it
[09:05]  * hypatia hands ikonia a ruler
[09:05] <ikonia> people sat there "joking" critisisning the channel is old enough,
[09:05] <oCean> it's definitely not a first
[09:10] <elky> it's not a joke, they're pushing boundaries and expecting us to give so they can push more and erode the channel to being as bad as everywhere else
[09:10] <elky> the "just a joke" is a cover.
[09:10] <ikonia> I don't care if it was a joke or not, I'm just tired of seeing it, if that's all they need a channel to do, there are others
[10:29] <jabbathehutt> hi
[10:29] <jabbathehutt> can i please have my ban removed from ubuntu
[10:29] <jabbathehutt> i made a bad joke
[10:30] <ikonia> when did this happen ?
[10:30] <jabbathehutt> today
[10:30] <ikonia> what was the joke ?
[10:31] <jabbathehutt> someone asked a question about how to do something menial
[10:31] <jabbathehutt> and i said
[10:31] <jabbathehutt> just run ' dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/sda'
[10:31] <jabbathehutt> of course its such obvious joke
[10:31] <ikonia> not to them
[10:32] <jabbathehutt> then i was banned before can say 'haha' or 'dont do it'
[10:32] <ikonia> that could have destoryed there system
[10:32] <ikonia> destoryed
[10:32] <ikonia> you understand it would be better to not make those kind of comments at all
[10:32] <jabbathehutt> if someone is smart enough to join an irc channel and smart enough to run their computer on ubuntu im sure they wouldnt have
[10:32] <ikonia> not really
[10:32] <elky> jabbathehutt, we've seen it happen.
[10:33] <ikonia> you can run irc by installing ubuntu and opening xchat
[10:33] <ikonia> that doesn't take massive brains
[10:33] <ikonia> someone is asking for help because they don't know
[10:33] <oCean> jabbathehutt: you had a whole minute to say 'that was a joke' or 'haha'
[10:33] <ikonia> if they believe you know - and do that command....well, it would be a mess
[10:33] <ikonia> as this is oCean's ban I'll step away
[10:34] <jabbathehutt> can i have it removed?
[10:34] <jabbathehutt> i dont know who oCean is
[10:34] <oCean> jabbathehutt: I don't think you had any intention in telling it was a joke
[10:34] <oCean> I set the ban
[10:34] <jabbathehutt> ok
[10:34] <jabbathehutt> well i was just bored
[10:34] <oCean> Do you really think that justifies what you did?
[10:35] <jabbathehutt> i guess not
[10:35] <jabbathehutt> how long was the ban for
[10:36] <oCean> your answer 'if someone is smart enough to join an irc channel..' shows no proof of the right attitude
[10:37] <oCean> you ever read our guidelines?
[10:37] <jabbathehutt> no
[10:37] <oCean> !guidelines > jabbathehutt
[10:37] <oCean> !Coc > jabbathehutt
[10:37] <jabbathehutt> no1 actually reads those
[10:37] <oCean> you think?
[10:37] <Tm_T> jabbathehutt: that belief of yours is no excuse
[10:38] <oCean> I expect you to read those, and let me know when you're finished
[10:38] <elky> jabbathehutt, correction. You are going to read those.
[10:39] <jabbathehutt> read
[10:40] <oCean> do you understand the part about 'when helping be helpful'?
[10:40] <oCean> And in that light, do you understand that you definitely were not helpful?
[10:40] <jabbathehutt> yes
[10:40] <jabbathehutt> i wasn't helpful
[10:41] <oCean> Can you promise you will follow the guidelines when I remove your ban?
[10:41] <jabbathehutt> i will. no more jokes that might be misinterpreted as help
[10:41] <oCean> Thank you.
[10:42] <oCean> I'm about to remove the ban, but Please consider that your behaviour will be watched. And that a second ban is much harder to get removed
[10:42] <oCean> jabbathehutt: do you understand what I just said?
[10:42] <jabbathehutt> yes thanks
[10:42] <Tm_T> jabbathehutt: as a sidenote, no jokes that can be harmful, being misinterpreted as help or not
[10:43] <oCean> jabbathehutt: ok, try to join #ubuntu
[10:43] <jabbathehutt> ok
[10:43] <oCean> there you go
[10:43] <jabbathehutt> works ty
[10:43] <jabbathehutt> bye
[13:35] <bazhang> Deep in the OS!!
[13:35] <bazhang> ubuntu's entire tcp/ip stack is broken
[13:36] <oCean> yes *DEEP* down
[13:40] <bazhang> waiting for the bug link "invalid new" Lars Torben
[13:48] <Tm_T> huh?
[13:48] <oCean> long story
[13:48] <jpds> bazhang: Deep down in the OS, noone can hear you scream.
[13:49] <Tm_T> ah, I see now
[13:49] <bazhang> jpds, hehe
[13:49] <oCean> bazhang: I don't think this one is lars though
[13:50] <bazhang> oCean, yep, its dk not de
[13:50] <bazhang> atheros chipset it seems
[15:34] <Pici> bleh, summer vacations.
[15:39] <jpds> Pici: Going anywhere nice?
[15:40] <jpds> Pici: Why is this guy managing servers with non cli knowledge.
[15:41] <mneptok> IdleOne: happy Canada Day!
[15:41] <IdleOne> Thank You mneptok.
[15:42] <Pici> jpds: Thats one of those 'if I had a penny' questions.
[15:42] <Tm_T> happy friday everyone!
[15:42]  * mneptok sings "O, Canada! My home for three fun years! Hockey, poutine and good domestic beers!"
[15:42] <Pici> heh
[15:42] <IdleOne> haha
[15:42] <IdleOne> our three major exports
[15:42] <IdleOne> and Alan thick.
[15:43] <mneptok> IdleOne: don't let anyone at Bombardier hear you :)
[15:43] <IdleOne> Thick*
[15:44] <IdleOne> Bombardier is a bad bad company. They continue to send jobs outside of Canada
[15:45] <mneptok> IdleOne: it's not a bad plan. if Bombardier does final assembly of aircraft in Plattsburgh, they can honestly say the goods are assembled in the USA, and get more sales to US buyers.
[15:46] <IdleOne> mneptok: I don't mind them out sourcing parts of the contracts but while threatening to close plants here :(
[15:46] <IdleOne> OT!
[15:47] <mneptok> IdleOne: 'Ostie Tabernac?
[15:47] <IdleOne> pas mal ouais
[15:48] <mneptok> bah! now i've permanently embedded that new definition of "OT"
[15:49] <IdleOne> also it's tabA not E
[16:46] <Pici> o.o
[17:19] <ikonia> it would be so much easier if there was a Linux 2.6.18+ compatible sticker,
[17:19] <ikonia> replacing .18 where applicable
[17:21] <ikonia> $20 says "wait, I want to learn, tell me what to type"
[17:22]  * Pici didn't bet
[17:29] <Pici> ikonia: theres #ayatana, but thats not a support channel.
[17:29] <ikonia> I'd have put money on something like #unity
[17:30] <ikonia> good job I didn't
[17:39] <mneptok> FYI, i have told sudokill not to use IM-speak repeatedly. next occurrence of "r" and "u" and such warrants a convo here.
[17:42] <Pici> *rolleyes*
[17:42] <IdleOne> There was some language barrier there
[17:42] <IdleOne> not excusing the bad language
[17:42] <ikonia> he knew fuck you
[17:42] <IdleOne> first words I learn in every new language is the curses
[17:43] <ikonia> the language issue never really cuts it for me if you know enough to say "fuck you" to someone in their chosen language
[17:43] <IdleOne> that is not surprising that a non English speaker knows how to curse
[17:43] <ikonia> IdleOne: yes, but I bet you don't say them to random people
[17:43] <ikonia> "I don't understand what I'm being told, I know, Fuck you, did that work?"
[17:43] <IdleOne> ikonia: that is why I said i was not excusing the bad language
[17:44] <ikonia> I didn't think you where, just ammuses me that that's the default non-native speaker approach
[17:44] <ikonia> don't understand the question, default response "fuck you" or some other abuse
[17:45] <Pici> I think the discussion in #u is getting in the way of support now...
[17:45] <ikonia> yes, hence trying to bring here
[17:45] <IdleOne> Well, I assume that new users joining to #ubuntu are already stressed and frustrated that something isn't working, then get the bot telling them not to use enter....They already don't see clear and now are being told not to use Enter key as (what is that big word? punctuwhatnow)
[17:45] <topyli> well we do learn our english from american movies and rock'n'roll :)
[17:46] <ikonia> Mike1: how can we help
[17:47] <Mike1> ikonia: hi, i only joined because sudokill in #ubuntu has been asked to join
[17:47] <ikonia> Mike1: ok - are you sudokill ?
[17:47] <Mike1> no
[17:47] <ikonia> Mike1: ok - so you where not asked to join
[17:47] <Mike1> ikonia: no, and if that’s a problem I can leave anytime
[17:48] <ikonia> Mike1: the channels used for discussing issues with the #ubuntu channels
[17:48] <mneptok> brainwave92: what's up?
[17:48] <IdleOne> Mike1: that would be appreciated, spectators make our job harder.
[17:48] <ikonia> Mike1: hence my question of how can we help, eg: if you have something to discuss/need help with,
[17:49] <Mike1> I guess I’ll leave then, see you!
[17:49] <ikonia> Mike1: thanks,
[17:49] <brainwave92> mneptok, i have a suggestion saying 'i' and 'r' and 'u' should be allowed
[17:49] <mneptok> brainwave92: your suggestion is noted.
[17:49] <brainwave92> and i want to know from the channel ops why thats wrong!
[17:49] <ikonia> brainwave92: you must have seen the level of english in the channel ?
[17:50] <ikonia> brainwave92: it varies massivly, talking in short hand is confusing and not clear to everyone
[17:50] <mneptok> brainwave92: kp? hst d dne antwrt?
[17:50] <ikonia> talking clearly is easy for everyone to understand
[17:50] <brainwave92> mneptok, i aint suggesting all shorthands
[17:50] <brainwave92> just the universal ones, which are almost used everywhere
[17:50] <ikonia> brainwave92: they are not
[17:50] <tsimpson> there is no such thing, brainwave92
[17:50] <brainwave92> ikonia, even linux technical terms are not understood by everyone.....
[17:50] <brainwave92> but thats no reason not to learn them
[17:51] <ikonia> brainwave92: no-one is talking about Linux technical terms
[17:51] <ikonia> brainwave92: why would we want to teach people bad English ?
[17:51] <brainwave92> not bad...just convinient english.....cause it saves time.
[17:51] <ikonia> it's bad
[17:51] <ikonia> and it doesn't save time
[17:51] <mneptok> brainwave92: lots of bad ideas save time. doesn't make them good ideas.
[17:51] <ikonia> I can type you as fast as u
[17:52] <IdleOne> and may possibly cause confusion to the person being helped if they are not a native English speaker
[17:52] <mneptok> brainwave92: it would save a lot of time at my destination airport to jump from the plane as it approaches the runway. good idea?
[17:53] <mneptok> convenience and expediency are factors, but never overwhelming factors.
[17:53] <brainwave92> ok...i get your point
[17:53] <mneptok> we ask *everyone* not to use IM-speak. to allow some to do it and get away with it is unfair.
[17:54] <brainwave92> mneptok, but you realise many non native speakers know it as well?
[17:54] <brainwave92> i for example
[17:54] <brainwave92> am a non native speaker.....
[17:54] <ikonia> brainwave92: many don't
[17:54] <IdleOne> brainwave92: true. many don't.
[17:54] <mneptok> many != all
[17:55] <brainwave92> can we modify the rule to say that, on being requested to speak in proper english, if one doesnt do it, then be banned
[17:55] <brainwave92> because
[17:55] <IdleOne> it is much easier to google translate "because" than it is "bcuz"
[17:55] <mneptok> brainwave92: that's exactly what is happening now.
[17:55] <brainwave92> now that is a great point
[17:55] <tsimpson> that'd just serve to over complicate it
[17:55] <brainwave92> ok but i am genuinely used to use such , and mostly might be using it without knowing it
[17:55] <tsimpson> just type out each word, it's not difficult and it saves everyone hassle
[17:55] <brainwave92> get it
[17:56] <brainwave92> i get it
[17:56] <IdleOne> also in then English language I is always capitalized
[17:56] <IdleOne> but I can live with i
[17:56] <brainwave92> Ok now 'that' should be allowed
[17:57] <mneptok> brainwave92: +1.
[17:57] <brainwave92> +1? is that a warning?
[17:57] <mneptok> brainwave92: no, agreement
[17:57] <ikonia> there is a good example of shorthand not being understood
[17:57]  * mneptok rarely capitalizes "i" on IRC
[17:57] <ikonia> mneptok: agreed, you thought it was a warning
[17:58] <brainwave92> i did indeed!
[17:58] <mneptok> but *everyone* in the Ubuntu community knows +1! it's how we vote on issues.
[17:58] <mneptok> *grin*
[17:59] <brainwave92> i know it now too......:) thanks.....i'll leave now, as i'm fully convinced!
[18:00] <IdleOne> brainwave92: Welcome to the dark side :)
[18:01] <brainwave92> dark side? now that isnt a shorthand and still didnt understand!
[18:01] <IdleOne> brainwave92: was a joke. not a funny joke but a joke never the less
[18:02] <brainwave92> Ya i would like to understand it!
[18:02] <Pici> Its a Star Wars reference
[18:02] <IdleOne> you would have to watch Star Wars
[18:03] <IdleOne> I am comparing Ubuntu ops to the Syth
[18:03] <IdleOne> like I said not a funny joke :)
[18:03] <brainwave92> I get it.....almost....:) thanks
[18:03] <Pici> *Sith
[18:03] <IdleOne> yeah Sith*
[18:13] <mneptok> after thinking about it, i am now in agreement with IdleOne
[18:13] <mneptok> poutine: looks terrible, tastes great!
[18:14] <IdleOne> As I recall we had a conversation about poutine a few weeks ago. I vaguely remember saying something about it looking bad...
[18:15] <IdleOne> you sir are spending way too much time thinking about poutine
[18:15] <mneptok> it's Canada Day! and i want a Dilallo fix. :/
[18:16] <IdleOne> come up for a visit
[18:16] <IdleOne> jazz fest is going on right now
[18:16] <mneptok> we should. neighbors in St-Henri keep telling us to "come home"
[18:22] <sudokill> hi
[18:22] <sudokill> whats the deal with my ban?
[18:25] <mneptok> sudokill: it was IdleOne that banned you. but the ban was placed so you could come here and discuss your use of IM-speak.
[18:25] <sudokill> mneptok, why you all so harsh though
[18:25] <sudokill> i mean, a ban?
[18:25] <sudokill> i wasnt racist, i didnt wear or spam
[18:25] <mneptok> sudokill: i understand that you see no harm in it. do you understand that it is against channel policies, and regardless of your personal opinion, you have to abide by channel policies or risk being removed?
[18:26] <mneptok> sudokill: i became harsh when i asked you to stop more than once, and your response was to repeatedly call the rule into question.
[18:26] <sudokill> i understand you have policies, but there sohuld be limits
[18:27] <sudokill> if i was causing trouble, or disturbing the channel then id understand
[18:27] <IdleOne> The reason I placed the ban is because you were asked several times not to use IM speak and then you said we should ban you which led me to believe you had no intention with following the channel guidelines concerning IM speak.
[18:27] <sudokill> or if i was being unclear to people
[18:27] <mneptok> we do have limits. that's why the first time i asked you to stop and you argued with me i did not ban you. and the reason the second time i asked you to stop and you argued with me i did not ban you.
[18:27] <mneptok> or the third. etc etc.
[18:27] <sudokill> Idle, no one reads the large terms and conditions b4 joining  a channel we are himans
[18:27] <sudokill> and afaik irc is instant messaging...
[18:28] <IdleOne> sudokill: We understand that not everybody reads the guidelines before joining but you have been in #ubuntu long enough to have seen us quote them many many times.
[18:28] <mneptok> if IRC was IM, it would be called "IM" and not "IRC"
[18:28] <sudokill> well we could argue all day, but they are "instant messages"
[18:28] <mneptok> sudokill: i pointed out the rule to you. your response was "come on."
[18:29] <mneptok> bbiab. family phone call.
[18:29] <sudokill> instant i/e its quicker to use letters such as u and r, who cares about grammar punctuation? that is for forums and blogs
[18:29] <IdleOne> sudokill: we have no intention of arguing all day with you. the rule is clear and you must follow it.
[18:30] <sudokill> IdleOne, tbh on only really lurk in #Ubuntu, i sometimes chat. but with #ubuntu being the only channel with a problem with the way i type its hard to break a habit and keep adapting just for 1 channel
[18:31] <IdleOne> in that case you should consider using channels that tolerate bad English and not #ubuntu.  He stopped doing it though, so I didn't take any action.
[18:41] <IdleOne> sudokill: So can I feel safe in unbanning you and expect you to follow our guidelines?
[18:41] <ikonia> he's had has chance then
[18:41] <sudokill> i know. i understand that you are serious in that chanel, which can be both a good thing and a bad thing. i think it just comes as a bit of a shock to people because not many channels have these levels of rules
[18:41] <sudokill> yes you can unban me, ill try to refrain from the us and rs
[18:41] <sudokill> :)
[18:42] <IdleOne> sudokill: please join #ubuntu to make sure I removed the ban
[18:42] <sudokill> yes it works, thanks
[18:42] <IdleOne> sudokill: thank you for coming here and talking with us. hope to see you helping in #ubuntu. have a good day.
[18:43] <sudokill> ok
[18:43] <sudokill> c u l8r
[18:43] <sudokill> :)
[18:44] <IdleOne> hmmm
[18:52] <mneptok> unfunny, IMO
[18:52] <mneptok> (sorry to bail. my father called.)
[19:28] <ikonia> what is wrong with people that they feel it's appropriate to talk to people using the word fuck as a general term
[19:34] <mneptok> ikonia: the problem is that it *IS* appropriate, given the context. some of my friends and i use it all the time. the trick is *knowing when to turn it off*. and a LOT of people can't master that.
[19:35] <ikonia> mneptok: I wouldn't walk into any situation with strangers and start throwing the term fuck around like it was the word cake
[19:36] <oCean> CodeMonkeyNinja has quit (Quit: $cd ~ & rm -rf *)
[19:36] <oCean> what about the quite msg?
[19:36] <oCean> *quit
[19:36] <ikonia> not great
[21:03] <bazhang> he had tons of warnings. wine for vpn?
[21:04] <oCean> troll
[21:06] <bazhang> nick: emergency
[21:07] <mneptok> bazhang: emergency + desert
[21:07] <oCean> same ip range 65.49.14
[21:07] <mneptok> =
[21:07] <bazhang> mneptok, yep. FREEDOM fighter
[21:13] <oCean> he's banned, what's he doing in the channel?
[21:14] <mneptok> evading.
[21:14] <oCean> are we waiting for something to happen, or are we letting him?
[21:15] <mneptok> not my ban
[21:15] <mneptok> i'm deferring to bazhang
[21:15] <oCean> new ban is difficult, since he also switched ident
[21:16] <bazhang> I get to be the bad guy. poor ill user from ubuntu b
[21:16] <bazhang> whoops
[21:19] <bazhang> he did in fact join #winehq
[21:39] <oCean> !vhosts is <reply> Virtual Hosts allow Apache2 to be configured for multiple sites that have separate configurations. Configfiles can be found in /etc/apache2/sites-available. See https://help.ubuntu.com/11.04/serverguide/C/httpd.html
 this lol is universal
[22:12] <bazhang> he was specifically told that vpn will not work with wine in Ubuntu, yet carried on nonetheless
[22:14] <oCean> no one said trolling is easy
[22:14] <bazhang> hehe
[22:15] <oCean> perseverance required


[00:02] <halpbatman> quit
[00:10] <duanedesign> Average_Guy: what wireless card do you have? You can get this info by running the following command in the Terminal:   lspci | grep Network
[00:11] <Average_Guy> i have :)
[00:11] <Average_Guy> broadcom bcm4312
[00:12] <Average_Guy> downloaded b43-fwcutter_012.orig.tar from launchpad and hybrid-portsrc_x86_32-v5_100_82_38.tar from broadcom
[00:13] <Average_Guy> I THINK it's the STA driver and the broadcom firmware extrector linux wants
[00:13] <Average_Guy> both tarballs are sitting in my home folder on the linux partition now /home/robert/
[00:14] <Average_Guy> I don't know it they are the right files and I don't know what to do with em
[00:17] <duanedesign> Average_Guy: ok
[00:18] <duanedesign> Average_Guy: looks like it is the STA. The good news is that I think it is in the repository
[00:19] <Average_Guy> ok.. so?
[00:19] <duanedesign> Average_Guy: could you please try the following command:   sudo apt-get update; sudo apt-get install bcmwl-kernel-source
[00:20] <Average_Guy> and it should work with no internet connection?
[00:20] <Average_Guy> I am in wondows 7 right now
[00:21] <Average_Guy> i'll reboot and go try it if ya want
[00:21] <duanedesign> Average_Guy: ahh, i see.
[00:21] <duanedesign> ok
[00:22] <duanedesign> do you have a usb thumbdrive or something you could use to transfer the package?
[00:23] <Average_Guy> i can download in windows and drag to my linux partition. i downloaded hybrid-portsrc_x86_32-v5_100_82_38.tar from launchpad which I THINK is the STA driver
[00:23] <Average_Guy> it is already in my home folder on the linux partition
[00:24] <Average_Guy> i am pretty new to linux tho and don't know what to do next
[00:25] <duanedesign> it is much easier if you can get the .deb file
[00:26] <Average_Guy> where might I look?
[00:27] <duanedesign> i am looking for it now
[00:27] <Average_Guy> THANK YOU!!!!
[00:28] <duanedesign> what version of ubuntu
[00:29] <Average_Guy> 10.04
[00:29] <duanedesign> ok
[00:29] <Juest> hi
[00:30] <duanedesign> Average_Guy: did you install 32 or 64 bit Ubuntu?
[00:30] <Juest> who can help me i am using ubuntu 10.10 i386 and sound dosen't work because of dummy driver why this??? also i use virtualbox on a winxp.
[00:30] <Average_Guy> 32
[00:30] <duanedesign> Average_Guy: ok
[00:30] <Juest> ...
[00:31] <Juest> hey
[00:32] <duanedesign> Average_Guy: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+archive/primary/+files/bcmwl-kernel-source_<IP_ADDRESS>%2Bbdcom-0ubuntu3_i386.deb
[00:33] <Average_Guy> on it..
[00:33] <duanedesign> Juest:  is it that your sound is shown as Dummy Output in Sound Preferences?
[00:34] <duanedesign> Average_Guy: to intall that deb you should be able to double-click on it once you are in Ubuntu. or run the command:  dpkg -i bcmwl-kernel-source_<IP_ADDRESS>%2Bbdcom-0ubuntu3_i386.deb
[00:36] <Average_Guy> ok. then what? this will make the wireless card work?
[00:36] <Average_Guy> i gunna reboot and go try it
[00:38] <duanedesign> Average_Guy: yes after you install it you will need to reboot
[01:02] <JuestUbuntu> hey
[05:24] <holstein> eiriksvin: youve seen http://forum1.netgear.com/showthread.php?p=226952 ?
[05:24] <eiriksvin> ohh let me try that
[05:26] <eiriksvin> my trouble is with wpn111
[05:26] <holstein> maybe you need to blacklist something
[05:26] <eiriksvin> i cant get netgear rangemax to work
[05:26] <holstein> something that is trying to talk to the device
[05:26] <eiriksvin> idk how to do that stuff
[05:26] <holstein> eiriksvin: are those different things?
[05:27] <holstein> netgeat rangemax wpn111 ?
[05:27] <eiriksvin> yeah
[05:27] <holstein> http://www.ubuntugeek.com/how-to-install-netgear-wg111v2-wireless-dongle-card-on-ubuntu-edgy.html
[05:28] <eiriksvin> thats not it  I have Netgear Rangemax USB Wifi Adapter WPN111
[05:28] <holstein> http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/linux-wireless-networking-41/netgear-wpn111-wireless-setup-ubuntu-8-4-a-651429/
[05:28] <holstein> i still think you just dont have the proper driver
[05:28] <holstein> *windows driver
[05:29] <holstein> but who knows
[05:29] <holstein> eiriksvin: is it netwpn11.inf ?
[05:30] <eiriksvin> 1 sec
[05:30] <holstein> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=652910
[05:30] <holstein> ^ that is old
[05:30] <holstein> so you dont need to do all of that*
[05:30] <holstein> and you have ndisgtk already installed
[05:31] <holstein> the command "ndiswrapper -l" should come in handy for you
[05:33] <eiriksvin> ok yes its netwpn111.inf
[05:34] <eiriksvin> ok so, let me try that
[05:35] <eiriksvin> this is what I got
[05:35] <eiriksvin> WARNING: All config files need .conf: /etc/modprobe.d/ndiswrapper, it will be ignored in a future release.
[05:35] <eiriksvin> netwpn111 : driver installed
[05:35] <eiriksvin> 	device (1385:5F01) present
[05:36] <holstein> cool
[05:36] <holstein> thats looking right so far
[05:37] <eiriksvin> but its not lighting up my adapter
[05:37] <eiriksvin> heh
[05:37] <holstein> eiriksvin: is it connecting?
[05:37] <eiriksvin> no
[05:37] <holstein> is it seeing AP's
[05:37] <holstein> ?
[05:38] <eiriksvin> is there a way to scan for them?
[05:38] <holstein> they just show up there
[05:38] <holstein> in the network manager
[05:38] <eiriksvin> where?
[05:38] <eiriksvin> 1 sec
[05:38] <holstein> you just click on the network manager
[05:38] <holstein> and they are there in a list
[05:39] <holstein> *if
[05:40] <eiriksvin> no  nothings there
[05:40] <holstein> seems like its still not working then
[05:40] <eiriksvin> only my eth0
[05:40] <holstein> eiriksvin: this is the XP driver right?
[05:41] <eiriksvin> well i have 2 eth0 and eth1
[05:41] <eiriksvin> i have no idea what im doing with this im so friggin cunfused.... i am a noob
[05:42] <holstein> nah, you're doing OK
[05:42] <holstein> you just got a challenging piece of hardware
[05:42] <holstein> you should contact netgear
[05:42] <holstein> so they know whats going on
[05:43] <eiriksvin> well thanks, i did manage to get ndiswrapper and the driver in, but idk if its the right one so i tryed to get the updated one...
[05:43] <holstein> eiriksvin: if you can wire it up
[05:43] <holstein> and update the machine
[05:43] <holstein> that can help
[05:43] <eiriksvin> ok, heres the next thing....
[05:44] <eiriksvin> i had a boot option it went
[05:45] <eiriksvin> to a screen when the computer started that let me choose windows 7 or ubuntu... that was fine
[05:45] <holstein> grub
[05:45] <holstein> !grub
[05:45] <ubot2> GRUB2 is the default Ubuntu boot manager since 9.10 (Karmic). Lost GRUB after installing Windows? See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RestoreGrub - For more information and troubleshooting for GRUB2 please refer to https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Grub2 - See !grub1 for releases before Karmic (9.10)
[05:46] <eiriksvin> i still have it but the top ubuntu choice give me a shpeel about having to load a kernal first... thats supposed to be the newest one... but it aint working?
[05:46] <holstein> eiriksvin: run the updates like i suggested
[05:47] <holstein> if its still not working
[05:47] <holstein> let us know
[05:48] <eiriksvin> but it happened after i updated ubuntu
[05:48] <holstein> so, you dont want to update?
[05:48] <holstein> you dont have to*
[05:48] <eiriksvin> well sure, is it easy?
[05:48] <holstein> im proposing you might get an update to that kernel
[05:51] <eiriksvin> ok, thats cool but can it be done via usb?
[05:52] <holstein> in theory you could
[05:52] <holstein> but you'd have to download the updates somehow
[05:52] <holstein> so, im going to say no
[05:52] <eiriksvin> dern, ok... i guess im stick with this for a bit
[05:52] <holstein> yeah?
[05:53] <holstein> do it how you did it last time
[05:53] <eiriksvin> yeah i got no cd
[05:53] <holstein> just plug a wire in
[05:53] <holstein> eiriksvin: a network cable
[05:53] <holstein> and update
[05:53] <eiriksvin> no i got this comp from somone that had it on there but never used ubuntu
[05:54] <holstein> you said you did an update
[05:54] <holstein> and go that kernel
[05:54] <holstein> the newer kernel
[05:54] <eiriksvin> yep, i did
[05:54] <holstein> that wont boot
[05:54] <holstein> just do that again
[05:54] <holstein> and update again
[05:54] <holstein> however you did it that time
[05:54] <eiriksvin> update from this kernel?
[05:55] <holstein> im not srue
[05:55] <holstein> sure*
[05:55] <holstein> just take all the updates that are available
[05:55] <eiriksvin> yeah cus i dont want to lose this too
[05:55] <holstein> lose what?
[05:55] <holstein> that kernel?
[05:55] <eiriksvin> my ubuntu
[05:56] <holstein> just dont remove it
[05:56] <holstein> eiriksvin: updating is usually a good idea
[05:56] <eiriksvin> oh just dont remove the older stuff button?
[05:57] <holstein> theres not a button like that
[05:57] <holstein> packages get replaced
[05:57] <holstein> but the older kernels will just stay there
[05:59] <eiriksvin> ok well im gonna bring my  computer back home and get on windows to do some studyin
[05:59] <eiriksvin> i am pretty dumb about all this and i dont want to f thing up any worse
[06:00] <holstein> just keep your data backed up
[06:00] <eiriksvin> yeah will do
[06:28] <Eiriksvin> ok, back to work...
[06:29] <Eiriksvin> im trying to get the win xp driver for Netgear Rangemax WPN111 going
[06:30] <Eiriksvin> the others recognise the device, but they dont let it work... and i cant figure out why
[06:31] <Eiriksvin> how do i get ubuntu to make sure theres nothing else going on with the device to not let it work?
[13:19] <Average_Guy> anyone running 'wbar' dock?
[13:20] <coz_> Average_Guy,  I am not sorry
[13:23] <Average_Guy> can you recommend a launcher? awn is overkill
[13:24] <coz_> Average_Guy,  well I am on the cairo dock team so I am a bit predjudiced :)
[13:24] <Average_Guy> i been eyeballin that one:)
[13:24] <coz_> Average_Guy,   cairo dock is probably the most complex in terms of configuration   and the most reliable in my opinion
[13:25] <coz_> Average_Guy,  you can install it via synaptic package manager ,, or compile it manually  from bzr  which would be the developer's versioin
[13:25] <coz_> version
[13:25] <Average_Guy> working on it
[13:25] <Daniel0108> hi coz_
[13:25] <coz_> Average_Guy,   make sure you go into synaptic package manager
[13:25] <coz_> Daniel0108,  hey guy
[13:25] <coz_> Average_Guy,   hit Search and type in cairo dock
[13:25] <coz_> Average_Guy,  there will be several packages there
[13:26] <coz_> Average_Guy,  just be sure you  install all of the cairo dock packages  not   cairo (clock) :)
[13:26] <Average_Guy> k
[13:26] <coz_> Average_Guy,  do you know w hich video card you have there?
[13:27] <Average_Guy> ati raidon
[13:27] <Average_Guy> thats all i kno off the top
[13:27] <coz_> Average_Guy,   ok  I believe that should be fine with the  opengl  options
[13:27] <coz_> Average_Guy,  after installation,, you should see the options of starting it under   Applications/system tools
[13:27] <coz_> if on gnome
[13:27] <kristian-aalborg> soo... I have a box with no cd, and I can't get it to boot from USB
[13:27] <coz_> Average_Guy,  you want to try the   opengl option first
[13:28] <coz_> kristian-aalborg,  oooo  are you sure the option to boot from usb is in the bios?
[13:28] <Average_Guy> ok
[13:28] <kristian-aalborg> I'm thinking of installing to an usb pen and then move it over... alternatively I might try to install over network
[13:29] <coz_> Average_Guy,   there are not many docks available out there and the two main ones are awn and cairo dock
[13:29] <Average_Guy> ooooooo purdy
[13:29] <coz_> Average_Guy,   oh its running now?
[13:29] <Average_Guy> got it up now :)
[13:29] <coz_> Average_Guy,  there you go
[13:30] <coz_> Average_Guy,  now right click the dock  go to Cairo dock   and then configuration
[13:30] <coz_> rather Configure
[13:30] <coz_> Average_Guy,  the  config dialog will open,, at the bottom left of that dialog is an "Advanced":   button  ,, press it
[13:31] <Average_Guy> don't c it
[13:31] <coz_> Average_Guy,  did the config window open?
[13:31] <Average_Guy> yes
[13:31] <coz_> Average_Guy,  ok hit  printscreen to create a screenshot and upload to   picpaste.com then give me the link here
[13:32] <coz_> or if you have a dropbox account
[13:32] <coz_> doesnt matter ,, I just need to see the config window
[13:33] <kristian-aalborg> ah... I guess I could simply make a floppy with grub on it, then have an entry that took me to an iso
[13:34] <coz_> kristian-aalborg,  mm I havent done that ,, h ope it works :)
[13:36] <coz_> Average_Guy,  are you having issues with picpaste?
[13:37] <Average_Guy> http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa257/Scarface-Backoff/Screenshot.png
[13:37] <coz_> oo
[13:37] <coz_> Average_Guy,  open a terminal   and type     cairo-dock --version
[13:37] <Average_Guy> k
[13:38] <Average_Guy> 2.0.9-karmic1
[13:38] <coz_> Average_Guy,  ah you are on karmic
[13:38] <coz_> Average_Guy,   is this a new install of ubuntu?
[13:39] <coz_> Average_Guy,    in that same terminal   lsb_release -a
[13:39] <Average_Guy> is say Linux Mint 8
[13:40] <coz_> ok
[13:40] <coz_> Average_Guy,   well in that config panel you can see "Position"   if you click t hat you can set  the dock at the top or sides  if you like
[13:40] <coz_> Average_Guy,  or move your panel to the top of the screen and leave the dock at the bottom
[13:41] <coz_> and I see you do not have composition on
[13:41] <coz_> compositing
[13:41] <Average_Guy> i don't?
[13:41] <coz_> Average_Guy,  let me check mint versions hold on
[13:41] <coz_> Average_Guy,  the current Mint is mint 10
[13:42] <coz_> Average_Guy,  let me ask,,, is there a reason you went with linux Mint instead of  Ubuntu?
[13:43] <coz_> Average_Guy,  if you notice ,, you have a black rectangle around cairo dock.,.. yes?
[13:43] <coz_> maybe not ,, it could be your wallpaper
[13:43] <Average_Guy> actually i have several versions of both distro
[13:43] <coz_> Average_Guy,   which versions of ubuntu do you have?
[13:43] <Average_Guy> yeah rectangle is there
[13:44] <Average_Guy> 10.04 and 10.10 desktop and server
[13:44] <coz_> Average_Guy,   ok  and you dont have compiz  running
[13:44] <coz_> Average_Guy,   on 10.04 and 10.10  there will be different versions of cairo dock
[13:45] <coz_> Average_Guy,  if you dont have compiz running on that mint install open a terminal and type   gconf-editor
[13:46] <Average_Guy> i also have puppy, fedora, slack, suse- all i686 and 64 but linux mint and ONLY version 8 is the only one my keyboard works on. and I cant install without it...
[13:46] <coz_> Average_Guy,  ok ,, well in mint lets get compositing running
[13:46] <coz_> Average_Guy,   open gconf-editor
[13:46] <Average_Guy> yes i have compiz
[13:47] <coz_> Average_Guy, oh!  ok
[13:47] <coz_> Average_Guy,  but it is not running?
[13:47] <Average_Guy> it is
[13:47] <Average_Guy> i believe
[13:47] <coz_> Average_Guy,  mm  are the windows wobbly?
[13:48] <Average_Guy> no, but i can make them
[13:48] <coz_> Average_Guy,  well  open ccsm  and make them wobbly just to test that it is indeed running
[13:48] <Average_Guy> in the manager now
[13:48] <coz_> Average_Guy,  ok enable  Wobbly windows
[13:48] <Average_Guy> dun
[13:49] <Average_Guy> wobbly now
[13:49] <coz_> Average_Guy,  ok are they wobbly now?
[13:49] <Average_Guy> yup
[13:49] <coz_> oh ok
[13:49] <coz_> Average_Guy,  then compositing is on
[13:49] <coz_> Average_Guy,  that black rectangle may just be that themes'  look
[13:49] <coz_> Average_Guy,  on that particular version of cairo dock the "Advanced" button is not present
[13:50] <Average_Guy> yeah, it is i think. just stands out on the background
[13:50] <coz_> Average_Guy,  you can , as I said,, move the dock via the "Position"  plugin in it's config
[13:50] <Average_Guy> yeah i raised it an inch
[13:51] <coz_> Average_Guy,  or set it to the top or sides
[13:51] <coz_> however you prefer it
[13:51] <Average_Guy> trying to theme it now.  i not really one of those ppl trying to make my puter look like a mac
[13:51] <coz_> Average_Guy,  ok cool :)
[13:51] <Average_Guy> I appreciate your help
[13:52] <Average_Guy> really just the difficulty changing the position it exactly y i deleted awn
[13:52] <coz_> Average_Guy,  no problem...if you have more questions about cairo dock you can meet me in the #cairo-dock  channel for official support :)
[13:52] <Average_Guy> sweet
[14:04] <paulskmt5> When shutting down Ubuntu (10.04.2 LTS Desktop) warns always that an "unknown" application is active. How can I troubleshoot this?
[14:22] <nlsthzn-work> sudo apt-get purge unknown (kidding)... I have no idea :/
[15:41] <japtol> hello
[15:42] <japtol> i just installed ubuntu onto a virtual box
[15:42] <japtol> how do i start learning it?
[15:54] <holstein> japtol: maybe pick a specific task
[15:54] <holstein> and go for it
[15:56] <japtol> hmm
[15:56] <japtol> im looking for a small project to work on
[15:56] <japtol> in the ubuntuforums
[15:56] <japtol> holstein: do you know about gazelle?
[15:59] <holstein> im not familiar japtol
[15:59] <holstein> http://www.turnkeylinux.org/
[15:59] <holstein> these guys make nice web appliances
[16:00] <holstein> that work great live
[16:00] <japtol> what r these for?
[16:00] <japtol> can i learn ubunto with them?
[16:00] <holstein> im not sure what you are trying to learn
[16:00] <japtol> i want to learn ubuntu
[16:01] <holstein> but im suggesting that you can learn about certain server elements
[16:01] <japtol> so i can learn how to install gazelle onto my VPS
[16:01] <holstein> that are generic to any platform
[16:01] <japtol> can i learn about them in ubuntu on my virtual box
[16:01] <holstein> http://www.filesharenews.com/2010/05/26/install-gazelle-debianubuntu/
[16:02] <holstein> japtol: you are interested in file sharing?
[16:03] <japtol> yes
[16:03] <japtol> thats what i want to install
[16:03] <holstein> in what capacity?
[16:03] <japtol> right now
[16:04] <japtol> im just interested in learning how to install it
[16:04] <holstein> its easy to set up a torrent server
[16:04] <japtol> havent thought about the torrents yet
[16:04] <japtol> or capacity
[16:04] <holstein> japtol: that link i gave seems to talk about installing gazelle
[16:04] <japtol> im reading it
[16:05] <japtol> so
[16:05] <japtol> i got a VPS
[16:05] <holstein> right
[16:05] <japtol> but im having trouble with the installation steps
[16:05] <japtol> i don't know how to execute some of them
[16:06] <japtol> this is the installation guide im using
[16:06] <japtol> http://what.cd/gazelle/wiki.php?action=article&id=4
[16:06] <japtol> u might get a 404
[16:06] <japtol> u'll have to register to view it :/
[16:07] <holstein> maybe you'd feel more comfortable installing something from the default repositories
[16:08] <japtol> default repositories? like what?
[16:09] <japtol> im using putty
[16:09] <japtol> to log into my root
[16:09] <holstein> japtol: like some other software with that functionality
[16:09] <japtol> for my VPS
[16:09] <japtol> ah..
[16:09] <holstein> something easier to deal with
[16:09] <holstein> what is the goal?
[16:10] <holstein> you can upload and download files via SSH or SFTP
[16:16] <japtol> yes
[16:16] <japtol> im using putty
[16:16] <japtol> to install the gazelle
[16:16] <japtol> my goal is to set up a site like what.cd
[16:16] <japtol> just as an experiment
[16:16] <japtol> i want to make a private website
[16:16] <holstein> putty is just a way for you to connect
[16:16] <japtol> yep im using putty to ssh
[16:17] <holstein> there are ways to do that with content management systems right?
[16:18] <holstein> maybe that would be easier, and give more funcionality as well
[16:19] <holstein> maybe something like http://www.fbloggs.com/2009/06/11/how-to-make-content-private-in-drupal/
[16:24] <japtol> ok
[16:24] <japtol> im not sure
[16:24] <japtol> ill look into it
[16:24] <holstein> japtol: im not a web guy
[16:24] <holstein> but drupal is huge
[16:25] <holstein> drupal joomla and wordpress are well known
[16:25] <holstein> and well supported
[16:25] <japtol> i c
[16:25] <holstein> ive set up test cases of each
[16:25] <japtol> well
[16:25] <holstein> this is the first mention of gazelle
[16:25] <japtol> does that help me install gazelle?
[16:25] <holstein> and by searching around
[16:25] <holstein> its seems more obscure
[16:25] <holstein> but, do-able
[16:26] <holstein> japtol: im suggesting one of those with private content as an alternative to gazelle
[16:26] <holstein> if the goal is to install gazelle
[16:26] <holstein> you'll probably have to contanct someone more envolved in that project
[16:26] <holstein> but, if you want to host private content
[16:26] <holstein> on a webserver
[16:27] <holstein> there are alternatives
[16:27] <holstein> lots of them*
[16:27] <japtol> alright
[16:27] <japtol> thx
[17:01] <paulskmt5> xawtv problem: tuner seems to run free. Some moments I hear sound from a tv channel "passing by" but no video. Was working before. Ubuntu 10.04 LTS Desktop
[19:09] <virgo> hi
[19:09] <virgo> my keyboard does not have ^ character
[19:09] <virgo> is there a way to change some settings to get in ob my keyboard
[19:33] <attackulz> I find I get the best help here
[19:33] <attackulz> anyone around?
[19:34]  * holstein is moderately available
[19:35]  * nlsthzn waves but knows nothing so just lurks
[19:35] <attackulz> ahaha you again
[19:35] <attackulz> numpad is out on my laptop. it used to work. about a month ago it went out and all I did was open the keyboard settings and it came back on.. this time its been about 2 weeks and I dont know what the problem is
[19:37] <attackulz> :(
[19:39] <holstein> attackulz: its not a hardware problem?
[19:40] <attackulz> more then likely not.   I wish that were the problem
[19:43] <virgo> anyone knows how to get ^ character from keyboard if there is no key with this?
[19:44] <attackulz> its not above the 6...
[19:44] <nlsthzn> virgo: long shot... try openoffice writer... insert character... copy and paste from there?
[19:45] <virgo> haha how do you think i did write this character to this chat
[19:46] <virgo> copy-paste
[19:46] <virgo> thats not the solution i am looking for but yeah, it may be the best
[19:47] <holstein> virgo: whats above 6 ?
[19:47] <attackulz> I have no clue if im right at all because I have not oppened this application yet to see what it does. but what about 'keyboard shortcutts'
[19:47] <virgo> &
[19:47] <holstein> attackulz: is there a numlock light?
[19:47] <attackulz> yeah there is
[19:47] <attackulz> and its not off
[19:47] <holstein> attackulz: so the light comes on
[19:48] <holstein> and it doesnt work?
[19:48] <holstein> does the light do anything?
[19:48] <attackulz> laptop
[19:48] <attackulz> no lite
[19:48] <virgo> ¬¬ these pointless characters would be good to replace with something useful
[19:49] <holstein> virgo: where are you?
[19:49] <holstein> what kind of keyboard is that?
[19:49] <nlsthzn> virgo: do you have US keyboard selected?
[19:49] <virgo> no
[19:49] <virgo> estonian
[19:49] <attackulz> odd.
[19:49] <holstein> yeah, try a US keyboard layout
[19:49] <holstein> and shift+6
[19:50] <virgo> then all the other keys will get messt up
[19:50] <attackulz> oh my fuck
[19:50] <virgo> and no üõöä that are required for my language
[19:50] <holstein> virgo: you should be able to select
[19:50] <holstein> put a shortcut in the panel
[19:50] <holstein> jump between them as needed
[19:50] <attackulz> i got this idea when u mentioned numlock that made me think that maybe the numlock key was not ingaging properly. I took it off and pressed real hard and bam.<PHONE_NUMBER>5185613
[19:51] <holstein> cool
[19:51] <holstein> seemed so much like hardware
[19:52] <attackulz> apparently
[19:53] <virgo> i had also keyboard hardware problems(wire) some weeks ago, but thats another story :)
[19:54] <virgo> got fixed easy with some soldering
[19:56] <kristian_> hi all
[19:57] <virgo> there is no english keyboard availible on the list :S
[19:57] <kristian_> can I have a wire from my (wifi-enabled) laptop to a desktop, using it as a router=
[19:57] <kristian_> ?
[19:57] <virgo> yes
[19:58] <kristian_> hi virgo
[19:58] <kristian_> what should I ask the google for instructions?
[19:58] <virgo> with latest ubuntu its very easy to share internet like this
[19:58] <kristian_> this is Lubuntu 10.10
[19:58] <virgo> same as mine
[19:59] <kristian_> actually, the laptop has no OS as we speak though
[19:59] <virgo> set LAN ipv4 settings to shared to others
[20:00] <virgo> i have one very old laptop sharing internet like this
[20:00] <virgo> it gets internet from usb stick
[20:00] <virgo> and shares to lan
[20:00] <virgo> you even dont need to install
[20:00] <virgo> just use live cd
[20:00] <kristian_> yes, I guess the router box could easily be very old
[20:00] <virgo> and on the install screen you can setup internet
[20:00] <virgo> mine even does not have HDD
[20:01] <kristian_> livecd of Lubuntu or Ubuntu... or both?
[20:01] <virgo> mine was ubuntu netbook 10.10
[20:02] <virgo> i guess any latest installer should have network setup possibilities before install
[20:03] <kristian_> virgo, something like this: http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/how-to-easily-share-your-wireless-connection-in-ubuntu-9-10/
[20:04] <virgo> yes
[20:04] <kristian_> that seems doable ;)
[20:04] <virgo> where does your wireless come?
[20:05] <kristian_> from a router
[20:05] <kristian_> my own... local WAN
[20:05] <virgo> and it doesnt have wire ports?
[20:05] <virgo> for LAN
[20:05] <kristian_> it's in another room, and I only have one short wire ;)
[20:08] <virgo> well, using working laptop as a router is kinda waste, but if you have it anyway, then you can use it
[20:09] <kristian_> it'll only be temporary... two days or so
[20:09] <virgo> ok
[20:13] <Fanshawe> Hello folks. I can't edit recurrences for specific events in Evolution's calendar anymore. What's happened?
[20:13] <kristian_> bbl
[20:26] <japtol> guys
[20:26] <japtol> how do i get into vhost /var/www
[20:26] <japtol> in my root
[20:26] <virgo> cd ..
[20:27] <virgo> 2 times
[20:27] <virgo> and then cd var/www
[20:27] <virgo> in terminal
[20:28] <stlsaint> where are you trying to get into?
[20:31] <stlsaint> virgo: ^^
[20:31] <stlsaint> opps wrong person
[20:31] <stlsaint> anyway you will want to do a /var/www instead of var/www
[20:31] <stlsaint> var/www will make the system assume that there is a var directory in the root folder
[20:32] <John__> I have been running live discs and USB drives without installing.  When I run them, I have no internet or apparent option to connect to it.  The computer's physical button is set to connect.  Any possible reasons?
[20:33] <virgo> stlsaint: there is var directory in root folder
[20:34] <John__> I am completely new at this and have no clue as to what you said.  Sorry.
[20:35] <nlsthzn> John__: hardware your using?
[20:36] <John__> I have a dell laptop studio laptop
[20:38] <nlsthzn> John__: top right there should be a network icon... have you clicked on it and can you see wireless networks being displayed?
[20:39] <John__> I don't rember it. but I should and will check again.
[20:40] <nlsthzn> John__: also, in terminal you can run "sudo ifconfig -a" should show all your network interfaces... look for wlan0... if it is there you can try "sudo ifconfig wlan0 up" if memory serves...
[20:40] <japtol> guys
[20:40] <japtol> i got a question
[20:41] <japtol> im trying to update software/ package cache
[20:41] <japtol> undrer /var/www
[20:41]  * nlsthzn is a bit of a noob :/
[20:41] <japtol> i type sudo aptitude update && sudo aptitude safe-upgrade
[20:41] <John__> thanks, I will try that
[20:41] <japtol> and ig et the message
[20:41] <japtol> sudo: aptitude: command not found
[20:41] <nlsthzn> japtol: apt0-get?
[20:41] <nlsthzn> japtol: apt-get?
[20:41] <coalwater> hello every one
[20:42] <virgo> hi
[20:42] <japtol> wut r u asking n1sthzn?
[20:42] <japtol> apt-get install aptitude doesnt work either
[20:42] <nlsthzn> why use aptitude, when you can use apt-get... or use apt-get to install aptitide
[20:42] <virgo> you wanna do apt-get update?
[20:42] <japtol> yes
[20:42] <japtol> and upgrade
[20:43] <nlsthzn> then do the above but replace aptitude with apt-get
[20:43] <japtol> thx
[20:43] <virgo> so why cant do "sudo apt-get upgrade" ?
[20:44] <japtol> ok
[20:44] <japtol> im done with both
[20:44] <japtol> apt-get upgrade, apt-get update
[20:45] <japtol> now  i assume: apt-get install build-essential gcc wget subversion automake libtool make g++ -f mysql-server mysql-client libmysqlclient15-dev libboost-date-time-dev libboost-dev libboost-filesystem-dev libboost-program-options-dev libboost-regex-dev libboost-serialization-dev zlib1g-dev libpng-dev libmcrypt-dev libxml2-dev libevent-dev libmysqld-dev
[20:46] <japtol> i get this message
[20:46] <japtol> Note, selecting libpng12-dev instead of libpng-dev
[20:46] <japtol> E: Couldn't find package libmysqld-dev
[20:46] <coalwater> any one can help me about ubuntu beginners team?
[20:47] <stlsaint> coalwater: sup what would you like to know?
[20:47] <stlsaint> japtol: means the package you wanted to install doenst exist in repo
[20:47] <coalwater> stlsaint: i did every thing in this page https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Membership but i dont know what i need to do now
[20:48] <stlsaint> coalwater: you sent a email to the team ml?
[20:48] <japtol> stlsaint, how do i fix that
[20:48] <stlsaint> japtol: grab the right package ;)
[20:48] <stlsaint> japtol: what is it that you are trying to install
[20:48] <japtol> gazelle
[20:49] <japtol> im just folllowing the installation guide directions
[20:49] <japtol> the first step
[20:49] <japtol> 1. Update software, and package cache:
[20:49] <japtol> sudo aptitude update && sudo aptitude safe-upgrade
[20:49] <japtol> i did that already
[20:49] <coalwater> stlsaint:  yea 2 days ago, and duane hinnen replied, then i sent a reply about 21 hours ago, and got another reply about 15 hours ago from the same person
[20:50] <stlsaint> coalwater: alright well the rest is up to you
[20:50] <stlsaint> coalwater: hang out here in the channel and get a feel for everyone
[20:50] <stlsaint> coalwater: eventually you would ask a current mentor to be your mentor
[20:50] <stlsaint> coalwater: if that mentor chooses to take you on then they will handle the rest of the process
[20:50] <coalwater> stlsaint: yea, i put my name on the waiting list lol
[20:51] <stlsaint> coalwater: aye
[20:51] <stlsaint> coalwater: are you currently familiar with ubuntu?
[20:51] <coalwater> yea, started using it regularly like a year ago
[20:52] <stlsaint> coalwater: good good, it would serve best if you offered some support to folks as they come in
[20:52] <stlsaint> coalwater: you do not have to be a member to give support
[20:53] <virgo> but i think you have some more responsibility about what you suggest to people
[20:53] <stlsaint> well of course, if you are found giving harmful advice im sure admin actions will follow
[20:54] <coalwater> rm -rf / lol jk
[20:54] <virgo> if you are some random person like me and tell people to screw hard drive or whatever, then nothing happens to me
[20:54] <stlsaint> virgo: on the contrary you can be quickly banned
[20:55] <stlsaint> no one is protected from the BAN hammer ;)
[20:55] <virgo> true :)
[20:55] <stlsaint> coalwater: aye, never give that ;)
[20:55] <coalwater> im kinda impatient, wish someone could just start showing me how to do some package coding
[20:55] <coalwater> lol
[20:56] <stlsaint> package coding???
[20:56] <coalwater> i mean
[20:56] <stlsaint> That is two different focus groups
[20:56] <coalwater> like packages
[20:56] <stlsaint> packaging? like MOTD?
[20:57] <coalwater> ok i don't know what that is, i just meant like debugging, developing , etc .. i thought i should start here rather than just jump into the other focus group directly
[20:58] <virgo> The Ubuntu Beginners Team exists to enhance the initial experience of new Ubuntu users and to guide existing Ubuntu users to become part of the global Ubuntu community
[20:58] <coalwater> so what are mentors for
[20:58] <coalwater> or masters
[20:58] <virgo> i would want to get to this Beginners Team too some day
[20:58] <stlsaint> mentors help you get acquainted within the team
[20:59] <coalwater> ok so let's say i have some programming experience, but not specifically in ubuntu, what am i supposed to do
[21:00] <seidos> what do you want to do?
[21:00] <virgo> coalwater: lets do some oss project
[21:00] <coalwater> whats oss
[21:01] <virgo> open-source-software
[21:01] <virgo> there are many projects
[21:01] <virgo> and sure need coders
[21:01] <stlsaint> coalwater: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam
[21:01] <virgo> or you can think something out yourself and make project
[21:02] <coalwater> ok so i should try the begginers dev?
[21:02] <stlsaint> coalwater: sure :)
[21:03] <stlsaint> coalwater: although that will still not grant you BT membership
[21:03] <stlsaint> membership comes upon voting
[21:03] <stlsaint> ol faithful digital democracy
[21:03] <coalwater> nothing comes easy huh lol
[21:03] <stlsaint> nhandler: Hello
[21:04] <stlsaint> nhandler: just saying hello since i havent spoken with ya in some months
[21:04] <coalwater> so votes come by getting recognized by people in the irc?
[21:04] <virgo> i guess you must be pro programmer to get into ubuntu-dev team
[21:04] <stlsaint> coalwater: yep
[21:04] <stlsaint> virgo: nope
[21:04] <coalwater> virgo:  not really pro
[21:05] <stlsaint> virgo: dev membership comes by testing/voting
[21:05] <coalwater> virgo: since i spent some time doing this i could give it to someone to read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/coalwater lol
[21:06] <stlsaint> coalwater: did you put that in your letter to the mailing list? (the wiki link)
[21:06] <coalwater> yea, there's an email template in the membership page, i also put my launchpand link
[21:07] <coalwater> lauchpad*
[21:07] <virgo> haha, im trying to learn python also
[21:07] <coalwater> virgo:  python is pretty interesting, and widely used in a lot of things
[21:07] <stlsaint> as i am in python
[21:09] <coalwater> so , what do people do usually in the meetings
[21:10] <stlsaint> discuss team motions and such
[21:10] <nhandler> Howdy stlsaint
[21:15] <coalwater> ok so stlsaint there's something i need to understand a bit, am i supposed to aim at membership here first then switch to the dev focus group or should i just try to get there first, or should i get a master first lol
[21:16] <stlsaint> coalwater: meh, you can enter the dev channel the same way you did here and just get acquainted with folks
[21:16] <stlsaint> no need to put a order on things for now
[21:17] <coalwater> and how do i get the membership then, votes wont come by their selves :D
[21:18] <stlsaint> coalwater: you have to meet and great folks
[21:18] <stlsaint> spend some QT in this channel getting to know folks
[21:19] <stlsaint> your mentor will handle all the other stuff and guide you along
[21:19] <coalwater> :o the dev page has a quick start guide, cool lol
[21:21] <coalwater> that's a huge list to study, guess i know what im gonna do now lol
[21:24] <coalwater> stlsaint: what's QT by the way lol
[21:24] <stlsaint> quality time :D
[21:37] <stlsaint> japtol: sorry bout that
[21:39] <stlsaint> well i must depart for the night good folks
[21:39] <stlsaint> ttyl
[21:49] <holstein> anybody using back in time ?
[21:49] <holstein> https://launchpad.net/~bit-team/+archive/stable
[21:59] <coalwater> holstein:  what's it for?
[22:02] <holstein> backups
[22:02] <holstein> coalwater: seems like a time-machine clone
[22:02] <holstein> kinda*
[22:02] <holstein> i mean that only from the description
[22:02] <holstein> i think i'll install it though
[22:02] <coalwater> that sounds like it could come in handy, if that's what it is
[22:06] <japtol> hey
[22:06] <japtol> how do i add extension=memache.so to my php.ni (/usr/local/lib/php.ini_
[22:06] <japtol> in debian 5
[22:06] <japtol> wud appreciate if someone can help me with this
[22:06] <holstein> i would probably use nano japtol
[22:06] <japtol> i cant find the answer in google
[22:06] <holstein> you can just gedit though if you prefer
[22:06] <kristian_> hi again
[22:07] <kristian_> can't get the laptop-router thing working
[22:07] <holstein> kristian_: alborg?
[22:07] <kristian_> holstein, yeah
[22:07] <holstein> kristian_: it seemed really easy from the gnome network manager
[22:08] <kristian_> it sure did :P
[22:08] <holstein> i remember setting it up once really easily
[22:08] <holstein> i forget which way though
[22:08] <holstein> and its been a while
[22:08] <holstein> i think i was coming from wifi
[22:08] <kristian_> this is Lubuntu, so the interface is slightly different
[22:08] <holstein> and sharing the lan on the netbook
[22:08] <holstein> kristian_: the network tool is different too ?
[22:08] <holstein> right?
[22:08] <holstein> thats wicd?
[22:09] <kristian_> I have wifi here also... I want to wire it to a desktop
[22:09] <holstein> i would try downloading a live CD
[22:09] <kristian_> yes, I think it's from LXDE all of it
[22:09] <holstein> with gnome
[22:09] <holstein> 10.10
[22:09] <holstein> and try it from there
[22:09] <holstein> with the gnome network tool
[22:09] <kristian_> hmm
[22:09] <kristian_> I guess I could do that
[22:09] <holstein> *just because it worked for me, and there are guides for that
[22:09] <kristian_> yeah
[22:09] <holstein> then, i bet when you get it going once or twice
[22:09] <holstein> you can figure out how to do it with wicd
[22:10] <kristian_> the thing is that there's an equally "simple" thing for it in my DE
[22:11] <holstein> kristian_: yeah, i just cant confirm that
[22:11] <holstein> since i havet tried in wicd
[22:11] <holstein> i know i got it working once in gnome
[22:12] <holstein> it could be a 'coming soon' feature ;)
[22:12] <kristian_> yes
[22:15] <kristian_> I will look around the house... I think I might have an Ubuntu cd thingie somewhere ;)
[23:23] <kristian-livecd_> holstein, yo
[23:26] <kristian-livecd_> I'm online, wooooh!
[23:26] <holstein> kristian-livecd_: :)
[23:27] <MrChrisDruif> kristian-livecd_: Good going
[23:38] <kristian-livecd_> yeah... I'm still unsure if it's LXDE who's not ready or me who's dumb, though
[23:39]  * MrChrisDruif doesn't know...only you can kristian-livecd_
[23:39] <kristian-livecd_> btw, the "user-friendliness" of the Ubuntu livecd has gotten too far when you have to press a secret key to get to the custom settings... and those settings are necessary to even start from a 2003 high-scale laptop
[23:40] <MrChrisDruif> What custom settings?
[23:40] <kristian-livecd_> nomodeset
[23:41] <kristian-livecd_> also, the "install ubuntu" option, which it booted to halted
[23:41] <MrChrisDruif> Alright...I never needed to use that
[23:44] <charlie-tca> Xubuntu doesn't require so much effort ;-)
[23:44] <kristian-livecd_> MrChrisDruif, I've had to use it for a lot of HW
[23:44] <kristian-livecd_> including my parents' brand new super duper laptop
[23:45] <MrChrisDruif> charlie-tca: Xubuntu is a bit older, isn't it? And it's got full support of Ubuntu/Canonical ;)
[23:45] <charlie-tca> no
[23:45] <charlie-tca> 1st Ubuntu release was in 2005, 1st xubuntu release a year later
[23:46] <kristian-livecd_> it's silly... the beauty of the linux kernel is the possibility to flex around so much hardware
[23:46] <charlie-tca> but xubuntu does not use unity, and doesn't mask the cd menu
[23:46] <MrChrisDruif> charlie-tca: Yeah, and Lubuntu is like a year old?
[23:46] <charlie-tca> something like that
[23:47] <MrChrisDruif> ...and it's not an official derivate yet :)
[23:47] <charlie-tca> oh, yeah, it is older than Lubuntu
[23:47] <charlie-tca> right
[23:47] <charlie-tca> Xubuntu is official, unsupported derivative, Lubuntu is unofficial, unsupported derivative
[23:49] <MrChrisDruif> Unsupported? Alright...
[23:50] <charlie-tca> the only supported versions are Ubuntu and Kubuntu
[23:50] <MrChrisDruif> Alright
[23:50] <charlie-tca> We get help from the developers, but no money from Canonical
[23:51] <MrChrisDruif> Well...that is what I meant...support from devs :)
[23:51]  * charlie-tca has to use the disclaimer now, I am the Xubuntu Project Lead
[23:52] <charlie-tca> oh, yeah, we do get support from the devs, for which we are very thankful
[23:52] <MrChrisDruif> :)
[23:53] <seidos> "back alley support"
[23:53] <charlie-tca> We would like to possibly discuss the procedures to become official at UDS. There seems to be nothing actually written for it.
[23:53]  * MrChrisDruif is just a little admin/wiki-worker :P
[23:53] <charlie-tca> heh, I started there in 2007
[23:53]  * seidos is just a little writer
[23:54] <charlie-tca> I started by just making a few spelling corrections on the wiki


[14:34] <Brainstorm> Updates for Bangladesh: +5249 cases (now 1.5 million), +114 deaths (now 25513) since a day ago


[00:30] <Cheesehead> h00k: Say, don't we have the monthly meeting TOMORROW NIGHT AT 9 PM?
[02:23] <h00k> indeed!
[02:27] <h00k> It's snowing here.
[02:27] <h00k> Cheesehead: yeah, tomorrow!
[02:27] <h00k> I'm sending out a reminder in a bit.
[13:04] <h00k> so
[13:04] <h00k> LoCo Monthly meeting tonight
[13:05] <h00k> agenda: Becoming an official LoCo
[13:11] <h00k> uh
[13:11] <h00k> meet-and-greet
[13:17] <h00k> cool, I have 4 things.
[13:17] <h00k> http://loco.ubuntu.com/meetings/ubuntu-us-wisconsin/250/detail/
[13:24] <h00k> 5
[13:26] <h00k> there we go.
[13:26] <h00k> Hi, bigbash
[13:26] <bigbash> Hi!
[13:26] <bigbash> I didn't realize my virtual server was offline until now
[13:27] <bigbash> Nice I can actually make the meeting tonight h00k
[13:32] <h00k> sweet.
[13:32] <h00k> because it's at 9?
[13:33] <h00k> bigbash: ^
[13:34] <bigbash> yea that and v-ball is early today
[13:54] <bigbash> h00k, you guys use VMWare, right?
[13:54] <h00k> bigbash: yes
[13:55] <bigbash> Any recommendations for learning vSphere 5?  My mastering VMWare vSphere 5 book should be here today
[13:59] <h00k> bigbash: I haven't actually touched vSphere 5, I read some 'what's new'
[14:00] <h00k> but we have 4.1 on our stuff at the moment
[14:01] <bigbash> ah ok
[14:02] <h00k> bigbash: If you have the funding, I did the VMWare 4.1 setup, install, configure course for 5 days and learned a *ton*
[14:03] <bigbash> I may check with work to see if I can do that.
[14:03] <bigbash> we are going from physical to VM in like a month
[14:03] <h00k> in fact, I think they have the 5 course
[14:03] <h00k> now
[14:03] <h00k> and then you could take the exam and get cert'ed
[14:03] <bigbash> hmmm
[14:03] <bigbash> I might do that
[14:14] <h00k> It was worth it for me/work, anyway.
[14:15] <h00k> I take the 4.1 cert on Nov 11, then I'd like to do the 'what's new' course and get 5 cert'd
[14:17] <h00k> bigbash: this is the one I did: http://mylearn.vmware.com/mgrreg/courses.cfm?ui=www_edu&a=one&id_subject=19919
[14:18] <bigbash> h00k, did you do the online course?
[14:32] <h00k> bigbash: I did a physical course, actually
[14:32] <h00k> meatspace
[14:34] <bigbash> ah
[14:38] <h00k> bigbash: it was over in the Twin Cities
[14:39] <h00k> bigbash: I'm pretty sure you have to attend a physical class to get the cert
[14:39] <bigbash> darn
[15:51] <h00k> speaking of cosmicpizza, I just threw one in the oven.
[22:01] <Cheesehead> Ha! I just missed a viloin lesson becasue my spouse took *both* cars today. (She's good!)
[22:02] <h00k> Sweet.
[22:02] <h00k> wait, what?
[22:02]  * Cheesehead created a new musical instrument, the viloin
[22:03] <Cheesehead> I took car #1 this morning.
[22:03] <h00k> How did she manage to take both cars?
[22:03] <Cheesehead> Later, she took car #2 and met me someplace.
[22:03] <h00k> oho.
[22:03] <Cheesehead> Together, we returned.
[22:03] <Cheesehead> Now, she took away car #1.
[22:03] <Cheesehead> And I am a pedestrian.
[22:03] <Cheesehead> We both forgot to retrieve car #2.
[22:04] <Cheesehead> But claiming "She took them both" sounds better, doesn;t it?
[22:05] <Cheesehead> Better than "I can't remeber where I park, then wander away"
[22:06] <h00k> it happens...yeah.
[22:06] <h00k> on that note, I'm leaving to _drive_ home
[22:09]  * Cheesehead shakes fist in the air "Hogan!!!!!!"
[22:10] <Cheesehead> Yeah, obscure references to 45-year-old sitcoms. That's good humor.
[23:30] <h00k> okay, and now to hack my HP Touchpad


[01:20] <Cheesehead> Aug 10 Meeting Minutes finished: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/WisconsinTeam/20110810
[01:21] <Cheesehead> Minutes link added to original meeting announcement: http://loco.ubuntu.com/meetings/ubuntu-us-wisconsin/164/detail/
[01:43] <Cheesehead> Updated the August report to reflect the Minocqua seminar, the Aug 10 meeting, and the upcoming Aug 17 meeting: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/WisconsinTeam/TeamReports/


[11:23] <rvba> bigjools: fwiw, I just got an AMT node installed using di (Trusty).  Worked fine.  Rebooted all right, I can ssh into the node now…
[11:23] <rvba> bigjools: what was your problem again?
[13:01] <jefferai> When MAAS finishes installing to a machine, should that machine then boot up to a hard disk, or should it continue to pxe boot?
[13:01] <jefferai> because when commissioning is done, the machine is unable to boot off the hard drive
[13:15] <jtv> jefferai: commissioning doesn't install.  The OS gets installed when you allocate the machine.
[13:15] <jtv> Because you get to choose the OS every time you allocate one.
[13:16] <jefferai> oh
[13:16] <jtv> It's possible for commissioning to format the disks, if you want to add a script that does that; but the default commissioning process is non-destructive.
[13:16] <jefferai> So you commission it, which does some stuff; then you allocate it, and then you boot it up ater that
[13:16] <jefferai> and when you allocate it, and then pxe boot after allocation, it runs the install
[13:16] <jefferai> that sound right?
[13:16] <jtv> Yes — and you can have multiple users on the maas that may all allocate machines for themselves.
[13:17] <jtv> So think of commissioned machines as a pool of hardware waiting for someone to come in and grab it for use.
[13:20] <jefferai> I See
[13:20] <jefferai> I gotta say, the documentation doesn't make that very clear :-/
[13:21] <jefferai> Even though it makes total sense
[13:21] <jefferai> Also, even knowing that, I don't see how you allocate nodes :-)
[13:21] <jefferai> at least not on the web; maybe it's cli only
[13:21] <jefferai> ?
[13:22] <jtv> On the web, you can go to a node's page and click "Start node."

[13:23] <jefferai> I see
[13:23] <jtv> In the API, it means "power up this node and let it do whatever its programmed action is, e.g. install it if it's allocated."
[13:23] <jefferai> :-/
[13:23] <jefferai> OK
[13:24] <jefferai> Will keep playing -- thanks!
[13:24] <jtv> A new, more high-level API call is planned, so hopefully we can forget about that difference later.
[13:24] <jtv> Thanks for pointing out the documentation deficiency — I'll make a note that that needs work.
[14:14] <jtv> jefferai: would this documentation change make it clearer? https://code.launchpad.net/~jtv/maas/doc-allocation/+merge/219540
[14:33] <jefferai> jtv: it does, yes. Also it made me realize a part of why I couldn't start up a node: I hadn't set an SSH key
[14:33] <jefferai> Start was always disabled for me
[14:33] <jefferai> so the only thing I could do was commission over and over
[14:33] <jtv> Yeah, conceptual frameworks are the most important part of documentation — and the most easily forgotten one.
[14:34] <jefferai> now to figure out why it's not toggling my vm over virsh :-)
[14:34] <jtv> We fixed a bug for that last week, actually.  Though I thought that had been released...
[14:35] <jefferai> jtv: maas user wasn't added to libvirtd group
[14:36] <jefferai> testing now to see if that's the problem
[14:36] <jefferai> but it prevented the maas user from using virsh via sudo test
[14:36] <jefferai> probably it should be added to libvirtd by default...
[14:37] <jtv> There's also the added complication there that after adding yourself to the group, you need a fresh login.
[14:38] <jtv> gmb: could I perhaps pick on you to review https://code.launchpad.net/~jtv/maas/doc-allocation/+merge/219540 ?  Yes I'm technically off today but couldn't resist.
[14:39] <jefferai> jtv: yeah -- a fresh reboot also seemed to solve my issue with postgres we talked about yesterday
[14:39] <jefferai> seems maas wants rebooting anyways
[14:39] <jefferai> :-)
[14:41] <jtv> Shouldn't really.  :/  I'm trying to pry the postgres thing loose from my memory, but not having much luck.
[14:41] <jefferai> don't worry about it
[14:41] <jefferai> sadly I have now added maas to libvirtd and rebooted, and "sudo -u maas virsh -c qemu:///system list --all" is happy
[14:41] <jefferai> but starting a node from the maas ui isn't
[14:41] <jtv> Oh, the weird "number out of range" exception?
[14:42] <jefferai> jtv: yeah, that
[14:43] <jtv> This may be a matter of tweaking the power type & power parameters just right then...
[14:43] <jefferai> well
[14:43] <jefferai> sudo -u maas virsh -c qemu:///system start base
[14:43] <jefferai> that works
[14:44] <jefferai> it's the same url as in the web ui
[14:44] <jefferai> and same name
[14:44] <jtv> And without the sudo it should work as well, right?
[14:44] <jtv> Oh wait
[14:44] <jtv> Sorry, wasn't all there.
[14:44] <jefferai> unless it's running as a user that isn't maas
[14:44] <jefferai> like www-data
[14:44] <jefferai> doesn't seem so though
[14:44] <jtv> And I guess the reboot made the group membership for maas in virsh take effect...
[14:44] <jefferai> right
[14:45] <jefferai> btw, using maas from trusty repos, is there some newer version I should be using?
[14:45] <jefferai> a ppa?
[14:45] <jtv> There's ppa:maas-maintainers/dailybuilds — which can include the latest breakage, but will also have the latest improvements; and there's the cloud archive.
[14:47] <jtv> See: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/CloudToolsArchive
[14:47] <jefferai> the cloud archive I think I trid adding but it said it was for precise only
[14:47] <jefferai> so when I hit Start on the node in the web UI, there is nothing in the libvirtd logs
[14:47] <jtv> There's the "cloud archive" and the "cloud tools archive."
[14:47] <jefferai> when I do it from the sudo line above, it's what you'd expect
[14:47] <jefferai> somewhere along the way the command never makes it to libvirtd
[14:48] <jtv> A similar command line _should_ be issued from /etc/maas/templates/power/virsh.template.
[14:48] <jtv> But the version you  have would still have that bug where it got confused about the previous state of the VM (on or off).
[14:48] <jefferai> interesting
[14:48] <jefferai> error: Failed to connect socket to '/var/run/libvirt/libvirt-sock': Permission denied
[14:48] <jtv> Ooo interesting indeed.
[14:48] <jefferai> so one bug is that when it fails to start the vm, it doesn't note that
[14:48] <jefferai> and makes the web ui think it's been started
[14:49] <jtv> Yeah.  Another thing that's scheduled for improvement: verifying that these things actually happen.
[14:49] <jefferai> so ls -al /var/run/libvirt is what you'd expect
[14:50] <jefferai> which suggests that the wrong user is being used to try to start the machine up
[14:50] <jtv> That would be interesting.
[14:50] <jefferai> I will have the script dump that out
[14:51] <jtv> The command gets run from the provisioning server's celery worker...  Better check that those actually run as the user you expect!
[14:51] <jefferai> ugh
[14:51] <jtv> And now I'm afraid I must leave.  Thanks gmb  for reviewing the  documentation branch.
[14:51] <jefferai> whoami in the script returns "maas"
[14:51] <jefferai> so this is jsut getting weirder
[14:52] <jefferai> unless it's not inheriting its groups properly
[14:52] <jefferai> or something
[14:52] <jtv> Gah.
[14:52] <jtv> BTW note that this gets run on the cluster controller.
[14:52] <jefferai> yeah
[14:52] <jefferai> it's all on one box right now
[14:53] <jtv> Ah
[14:53] <jtv> Maybe it's not the actual socket operation that gets the error.
[14:53] <jtv> Maybe it's something like "I need to read a config file which I'm not allowed to do" or something along those lines.
[14:54] <jtv> Bear in mind that "sudo" keeps using your home directory, but as a different user.
[14:54] <jtv> The maas user doesn't have a home dir, only a GPG home dir in /var/lib/maas.
[14:54] <jtv> And now I'm _really_ leaving.  Will check in later.
[14:56] <jefferai> jtv: heh, ok, thanks  :-)
[14:56] <jefferai> jtv: for when you're back, here's the output of "groups" in the template: maas root
[14:57] <jefferai> and here's the output when I run sudo -u maas groups: maas libvirtd
[14:57] <jefferai> so apparently it's running as the maas user but with a different set of groups -- and this is after a reboot
[15:06] <jefferai> jtv: the only thing I can think of is that the daemon starts as root, which is not in libvirtd; then drops privileges but when it does it doesn't then inherit any new groups
[15:06] <jefferai> and if so, then I would think it shouldn't have "root" as its current groups
[15:06] <jefferai> so I think something is very wrong here
[15:06] <jefferai> either root shouldnt' be in the current groups, or libvirtd should
[15:06] <jefferai> or both
[15:07] <jefferai> I'm going to try adding root to libvirtd
[15:10] <jefferai> jtv: that did it - adding root to libvirtd
[15:10] <jefferai> that's a really weird thing to have to do considering that root is the owner of the socket :-)
[19:38] <jtv> jefferai: turning your notes into a bug report, thanks.  Probably low priority but we have to have a note somewhere.
[21:26] <jefferai> jtv: I'm not sure the libvirt group stuff should be low priority. If you can't take an off-the-shelf maas install and use it with the virsh bits as shown in the installation guide, then something is rather wrong. Especially when it takes listing groups inside of the template to figure out what the problem is