[11:10] <jphilips> Unit193: was running core in a VM with 1.5gb of ram and this is what i got from 'free -m'. does this look correct?
[11:10] <jphilips> total=1469 used=453 free=065 cache=950 available=828
[11:10] <jphilips> this is from the regular version
[11:10] <jphilips> total=1469 used=496 free=119 cache=853 available=780
[15:40] <jphilips> lotuspsychje in #ubuntu-quality said: there's a guy claiming that a latest xubuntu iso still has that fsck:md5sums% bug, think that would be the case still?
[15:45] <sorinello> Hello. is it normal if sudo do-release-upgrade does not find the 20.04 new version, even after 4 days since the release ?
[15:51] <jphilips> sorinello: if you want to quickly upgrade use 'update-manager -d'
[15:51] <jphilips> https://ubuntu.com/tutorials/tutorial-upgrading-ubuntu-desktop#3-check-for-updates
[15:51] <sorinello> yes, I was expecting the new release to be available withoug using the developer mode
[15:52] <jphilips> did you check your upgrade setting in 'software & upgrades'
[15:53] <sorinello> yes. any new version, check daily
[15:53] <jphilips> no idea. maybe check this vid for help https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pr3HA3jw1vg
[16:11] <sorinello> jphilips, it works if I try with -d, but without -d it doesn't find any new version
[16:12] <jphilips> sorinello: guess it works just like the -d for update-manager
[16:14] <sorinello> I don't understand why devel-release since it has already been released
[16:14] <brainwash> are you upgrading from 19.10?
[16:14] <sorinello> yes
[16:15] <brainwash> I assume that it's a staged rollout
[16:15] <brainwash> and maybe it has not even begun yet
[16:16] <sorinello> so many days after the release ? I was expecting it to be available the next day after the release
[16:16] <jphilips> yep a number of people on twitter have mentioned the same, so i've told them to use 'update-manager -d'
[16:16] <brainwash> the xubuntu team does not control this
[16:16] <sorinello> yes, I know this is not xubuntu related
[16:18] <sorinello> thanks for the info, I don't know and what happens behind the curtain when a new version is out
[16:19] <brainwash> I wouldn't worry too much about it
[16:19] <brainwash> it has only been 4 days
[17:00] -BottyMcBotFace:#xubuntu-devel- Reminder: Next meeting chair is Unit193


[01:10] <ubotu> New bug: #192115 in ubuntu "launchpad: shouldn't be able to add a branch for a package already in bug" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192115
[01:55] <robvdl> Hi, I've just uploaded my first package successfully after a few goes.
[01:55] <robvdl> However, it seems to be source only https://launchpad.net/~robvdl/+archive
[01:56] <robvdl> How do I get it to show the DEB? everytime I do try to upload the DEB, I get errors that it is binary only, or mixed, and it rejects it
[01:57] <robvdl> If I build with dpkg-buildpackage -S it uploads it no problem, but it's source only
[01:57] <robvdl> any ideas?
[02:21] <robvdl> ah, it's come up now, but...
[02:21] <robvdl> make: dh_pysupport: Command not found
[02:21] <robvdl> failed to build :(
[02:22] <robvdl> it builds here at home on Gutsy
[02:25] <Hobbsee> boo
[02:26] <Hobbsee> robvdl: sounds like your package is missing a build-dep on python-support - did you build in  a chroot?
[02:26] <robvdl> I don't know
[02:27] <robvdl> I will add python-support to the control file and try again
[02:27] <robvdl> it now says Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 5), python-support
[02:28] <Hobbsee> that should be more promising.
[02:42] <Hobbsee> dear launchpaders, please don't assume that people are on VAC for only a week.  thanks.
[02:55] <Hobbsee> oy, Fujitsu
[02:56] <Hobbsee> see query :)
[03:51] <Hobbsee> cprov: how'd the session go?
[04:22] <robvdl> yay, package built successfully, thanks
[11:11] <ubotu> New bug: #192349 in soyuz "Should display unapproved queue" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192349
[13:56] <pochu_> Does a team owner need to be a member of the team to be able to administer it?
[14:58] <RainCT> Hi
[14:59] <RainCT> if I want to get all the files from a bzr branch but without the bzr stuff, is there something better than   bzr checkout --lightweight ...; rm -r .bzr  ?
[15:00] <Nafallo> bzr export
[15:07] <RainCT> Nafallo: great! thanks
[17:34] <Seq> Hi, what causes a "Failed to upload"?
[17:35] <geser> Seq: different reasons, if you are the uploader you should got a mail with the reason
[17:36] <Seq> It was verifying binaries, then had an "Unhandled exception processing upload"
[17:37] <geser> Seq: can you pastebin the reason from the mail?
[17:38] <geser> or was this the complete error message?
[17:39] <Seq> geser:  http://pastebin.com/m17b4dd79
[17:39] <Seq> geser: I put the whole email in there incase I missed something
[17:40] <geser> Seq: I haven't seen this error yet so I can't help you.
[17:40] <geser> cprov: ^^^ any idea what went wrong?
[17:41] <cprov> geser: let check
[17:42] <cprov> geser: weird, linux-libc-dev_2.6.24-8.13~mactel1_amd64.deb: debExtractControl()
[19:33] <Seq> cprov: any ideas? I just rebuilt the package, and it failed again
[19:35] <cprov> Seq: no, I don't know exactly what is wrong,  processing the binary manually results in the same error, although raising a python and using apt_inst manually seems to work
[19:35] <Seq> failed to transfer again, that is
[19:35] <cprov> Seq: did you add anything to the rules file ?
[19:36] <Seq> This package built fine on my personal PPA (this is an upload to the team). The only thing I modified was having it build the 386 flavour in addition to generic on i386
[19:37] <Seq> cprov: from default, I believe I added AUTOBUILD=1 to debian/rules
[21:41] <mtaylor> kiko: is there a plan to have a team be able to add their own sprint/meeting?
[22:25] <RainCT> Hi again. Is there any other interface to Launchpad than the +rdf pages?
[22:32] <thumper> RainCT: a launchpad api is in the works
[22:32] <RainCT> ok, cool
[22:32] <thumper> RainCT: if you are after something specific right now, ask a question on the launchpad project
[22:40] <RainCT> thumper: I'll wait for the API :)
[22:40] <RainCT> thanks
[23:21] <ubotu> New bug: #192511 in launchpad "[PPA] if a superseeding package is deleted the superseeded package is not reshown" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192511
[23:35] <pixelpapst> good morning
[23:35] <pixelpapst> any launchpad admins online ?
[23:35] <pixelpapst> i have a question about registering something... (not a FAQ :-)
[23:36] <Fujitsu> pixelpapst: I'm not an admin, but there might be one around, so ask your question.
[23:37] <pixelpapst> we have been developing a CDD in-house
[23:37] <pixelpapst> and want to open it up more to the outside
[23:37] <pixelpapst> and also move over to Ubuntu (possibly gobuntu) as out base
[23:38] <geser> has somebody an idea what happend to the "ispanish" package in hardy? It's gone missing. https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/amd64/ispanish/+index shows that it got moved from universe to main but now it's gone completely.
[23:38] <pixelpapst> evaluating that right now
[23:38] <pixelpapst> a while ago, i asked sabdfl: "if we move to ubuntu, should we register as a distri in LP" ?
[23:39] <pixelpapst> and he said to give you
[23:39] <pixelpapst> and he said to give you guys (LP team) a poke when we need it
[23:40] <pixelpapst> so, with the release of 8.04 we want to switch over to ubuntu underneath
[23:40] <pixelpapst> have been evaluating it, and it looks _good_ :-)
[23:41] <pixelpapst> so i'd like to register the distri with LP now, and build up the process around LP in the coming months
[23:41] <Nafallo> weekend though
[23:42] <Nafallo> you usually have better luck during weekdays
[23:42] <pixelpapst> so my question is, should I register as a project first, and you guys change it over to a distri ?
[23:42] <geser> ilithuanian is in the same situation as ispanish
[23:42] <Fujitsu> geser: Oh good, that bug has appeared again.
[23:42] <LarstiQ> heya pixelpapst
[23:42] <pixelpapst> Nafallo: ok
[23:42] <Fujitsu> It's the same one that killed everything just after Christmas.
[23:42] <pixelpapst> hi LarstiQ
[23:42] <geser> Fujitsu: someone forgot to feed LP again?
[23:43] <Fujitsu> cprov: I believe Soyuz is eating arch: all binaries again.
[23:43] <LarstiQ> kiko: ayt?
[23:43] <pixelpapst> just wanted to get the registration finished before the Developer week :-)
[23:44] <Fujitsu> cprov: See ispanish, ilithuanian, and probably lots of others.
[23:47] <Fujitsu> geser: Have you found any non-arch-indep binaries that have been eaten?
[23:48] <geser> not yet
[23:50] <geser> Fujitsu: perhaps, but I'm not sure it's the same problem
[23:50] <geser> superm1 is missing packages from the last mythplugins build
[23:51] <superm1> yeah a fairly sizable chunk too.
[23:51] <superm1> soyuz must be really hungry
[23:51] <geser> some got published but only on amd64 and powerpc (according to packages.u.c) but i386 seems to be missing
[23:56] <Fujitsu> geser: I don't think a.u.c has been updated in a couple of days.
[23:56] <Fujitsu> Something is borked.
[23:56] <Fujitsu> Soyuz is eating things, but I don't think mythplugins is one of them.
[23:56] <Fujitsu> (mythplugins on i386 was published a couple of days after the rest)
[23:59] <geser> Fujitsu: a.u.c not being updated would explain why my sear upload didn't appear there yet. I remember a.u.c getting the newly build debs quite fast in the past.


[22:10] <qwebirc85827> How we doing guys i am getting much further on my remote but could use a little bit more help if omeone has the time.
[22:11] <qwebirc85827> I found a article online about a mce remote being recognized as a keyboard and not a remote.  He had a different remote than i do so his instructions dont really help me but i'm hoping someone else can
[22:15] <qwebirc85827> Basically when i run irw if i hit the number one i get a one on the screen and 2 is a number 2 etc.  According to the article this is how to tell if your remote is being recognized as a keyboard since instead of sending a one it should be a code like<PHONE_NUMBER>010002 00 KEY_1 devinput
[22:16] <qwebirc85827> anyone have any easy fantastic instructions on how to fix this issue?
[22:28] <qwebirc85827> ok if not easy anyone got any instructions at all
[22:32] <Kwisher> qwebirc85827: i missed your question?
[22:37] <qwebirc85827> I found a article online about a mce remote being recognized as a keyboard and not a remote.  He had a different remote than i do so his instructions dont really help me but i'm hoping someone else can [17:15] <qwebirc85827> Basically when i run irw if i hit the number one i get a one on the screen and 2 is a number 2 etc.  According to the article this is how to tell if your remote is being recognized as a keyboard since
[22:37] <qwebirc85827> like<PHONE_NUMBER>010002 00 KEY_1 devinput
[22:37] <qwebirc85827> Basically when i run irw if i hit the number one i get a one on the screen and 2 is a number 2 etc.  According to the article this is how to tell if your remote is being recognized as a keyboard since instead of sending a one it should be a code like<PHONE_NUMBER>010002 00 KEY_1 devinput
[22:45] <qwebirc85827> any ideas kwisher?
[22:45] <Kwisher> sorry
[22:48] <qwebirc85827> ok no problem thought i'd try
[23:12]  * Patrickdk just uses ps3 remotes


[21:15] <waigani> morning all
[21:19] <waigani> simple review if anyone's interested: https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/91
[21:33] <menn0> waigani: mornin'. looking at that PR now.
[21:33] <waigani> menn0: sweet, thanks. I suspect I may have to add more tests - just started with the basic one.
[21:39] <menn0> waigani: is the description for the PR correct? You say this implements the client side of the UserInfo but this looks to be the server side.
[21:40] <menn0> waigani: ignore me...
[21:40] <menn0> waigani: I'm tired. You're right.
[21:41] <waigani> menn0: hehe, I was just composing my explanation
[21:41] <thumper> I don't particularly like the "todo, not tested" bits
[21:41] <menn0> I got my directory paths and file names mixed up
[21:41] <thumper> can we not work out how to test it?
[21:42] <menn0> that was going to be my first review comment... you should be able to mock out the API call to test the error case
[21:42] <waigani> thumper: okay, there are other places in the API with the same todo - I was being lazy and followed suit
[21:48] <menn0> waigani, thumper: I've just commented with a suggestion on how to do this.
[21:50] <waigani> menn0: yay thanks. I'll plow through these emails asap and get onto it.
[21:56] <menn0> waigani: I've added a few more comments and I'm done for now.
[21:56] <waigani> menn0: Great. Thank you!
[22:34] <thumper> argh...
[22:34] <thumper> my head hurts
[22:34] <thumper> although not boxing this time
[22:34] <thumper> lots of thinking around identities and users
[22:39] <waigani> thumper: and lack of wine?
[22:39] <thumper> not yet
[22:39] <thumper> had a drink last night
[22:39] <thumper> but it will be the last for a while
[22:39] <waigani> the rest of us will have to drink more to put up with you!
[22:40] <waigani> I'm not sure how to mock out a method, without creating a constructor for the object/struct
[22:41] <waigani> oh, haha - I just spotted NewUserManagerAPI, looks like a constructor
[22:41] <waigani> ignore me
[22:56] <waigani> thumper, menn0: I've made the server side UserInfo mockable. How do I mock it out from the client side? It is called over the wire and initialized separately from the client.
[22:56] <thumper> waigani: you shouldn't do it that way
[22:56] <waigani> oh
[22:56] <thumper> you should mock out the client's user manager
[22:56] <thumper> not the server side
[22:57] <waigani> back to the drawing board
[22:57] <thumper> at least I think...
[22:57] <thumper> are there examples of this anywhere?
[22:57] <thumper> I have vague recollections of this before
[22:58] <waigani> thumper: i get what you're saying, mock out the server endpoint on the client side
[22:58] <thumper> yeah
[22:58] <waigani> I'll give it another go after standup
[22:59] <thumper> api/client_test.go line 75
[22:59] <waigani> thumper: sweet, thanks
[22:59] <menn0> waigani, thumper: in this case it's really easy isn't it? All calls are made through a single standalone function (call()) so patch that function for tests where you'd like to create an error condition.
[22:59] <thumper> not sure how helpful it'll be
[22:59] <thumper> menn0: that seems the obvious place...
[23:20] <waigani> connection dropped, we were done right?
[23:22] <JoshStrobl> Any feedback from Juju documenters? https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/juju-dev/2014-June/002708.html
[23:23] <menn0> waigani: yep, we were done
[23:45] <thumper> JoshStrobl: we agree it needs to be updated :-)
[23:49] <menn0> bikeshedding required! when a relation hook fails should the agent info in the status output look like:
[23:49] <menn0> a) hook failed: some-relation-changed for mysql:server
[23:49] <menn0> b) hook failed: some-relation-changed with mysql:server
[23:49] <menn0> c) hook failed: some-relation-changed for wordpress:mysql to mysql:server
[23:49] <menn0> (if the error was being reported for the wordpress charm)
[23:50] <menn0> currently we get something like: hook failed: some-relation-changed
[23:50] <waigani> c
[23:50] <waigani> menn0: call is a method of Client struct. If I was to make the method mockable, I'd have to add a constructor to the struct.
[23:51] <menn0> waigani: I'm talking about the call function at usermanager/client.go:21
[23:52] <waigani> menn0: oooohhh
[23:52] <menn0> thumper: any thoughts on the colour of the bike shed?
[23:55] <menn0> waigani: to patch you'll probably need to introduce another level of indirection (i.e. a standalone function which takes st and the other args that call() takes.
[23:56] <waigani> menn0: yep, I just missed the call func in usermanager - I went looking further up the tree in api/client
[23:58] <menn0> davecheney: any preference on how relation hook failures should be displayed in status output?


[11:57] -SwissBot:#xubuntu-devel- ATTN: Xubuntu Core 20.10 - amd64 - amd64 built.
[12:04] <Unit193> ↑ No idea if that'll boot yet.
[13:16] -SwissBot:#xubuntu-devel- ATTN: Xubuntu Core 20.10 - amd64 - amd64 built.
[14:08] -SwissBot:#xubuntu-devel- ATTN: Xubuntu Core 20.10 - amd64 - amd64 built.
[14:26] -SwissBot:#xubuntu-devel- ::xfce4-announce:: ANNOUNCE: xfwm4 4.14.4 released @ http://xfce.10915.n7.nabble.com/ANNOUNCE-xfwm4-4-14-4-released-tp59338.html (by Olivier Fourdan)
[14:26] -SwissBot:#xubuntu-devel- ::xfce4-announce:: ANNOUNCE: xfwm4 4.15.0 released @ http://xfce.10915.n7.nabble.com/ANNOUNCE-xfwm4-4-15-0-released-tp59339.html (by Olivier Fourdan)
[18:33] <albinard> @unit193: afraid yoour iso from this morning didn't boot on HP p7-1010
[18:33] <albinard> xcore 20.10 iso, that is
[21:30] <Unit193> Hrm, well it's a weird one for sure, worked in KVM but that doesn't really mean anything.
[22:19] <jphilips> pleia2: i was told by the team that they didn't have a use for fosshost
[22:19] <jphilips> i applied for some hosting through them and yes the telegram-to-irc bridge is being hosted on it now
[22:20] <jphilips> 20.04.1 is to be released on the 6th, so are putting out an announcement about it?
[22:24] <jphilips> bluesabre: a number of users are facing the same issue that i faced of snap store uninstalling gnome software
[22:26] <jphilips> David Mohammed mentioned in the ubuntu flavors irc and ubuntu testers telegram group that 'Since you have gnome-software as a recommendation in your seeds, update manager will "upgrade" it to a snap. your seed needs to be adjusted to make gnome-software a dependency'
[22:26] <jphilips> Unit193: ^^^
[22:51] <Unit193> Um, no.  It does not need to be a dep.  If it can't be just gnome-software perhaps dropping it would be more useful.
[22:54] <Unit193> alynpost: Heya!  I was about to reply to your email.  I might still do that though.  So no, you shouldn't have to wait a super long time.  It boots to the try/install screen, or is supposed to.
[22:54] <Unit193> albinard: ↑  If at the grub boot screen you hit 'e', you should be able to remove the 'quiet splash' options.  But I'm about to try grml booting it.
[22:55] <Unit193> alynpost: Sorry for the ping.
[22:57] <albinard> Okay, I'll hold off for now as you try.
[23:03] <Unit193> OK, this doesn't support loopback booting at all.  Nice..
[23:04] <Unit193> Pretty sure the desktop ones no longer do either, but didn't test that.
[23:05] <alynpost> I did wonder and assume you'd got the wrong guy--we do have a kernel bug report out to Debian but couldn't figure how that would quite be related--though I was willing to accept fantastic service, lol.
[23:05] <Unit193> So a fun thing I learned last night, mkinitramfs sets the path to /usr/bin, /sbin, /bin.  The busybox initramfs hook calls a program that's in /usr/sbin/...
[23:14] <Unit193> ...I wonder if I can't just symlink loopback.cfg in or something, actually. :D
[23:15] <Unit193> albinard: Anywho, so if you can edit the boot line to see where it's going wrong, that could well be useful.
[23:26] <albinard> Sorry, out of time right now - might give it a shot tomorrow.
[23:27] <jphilips> Unit193: so what is your suggestion to stop the snap store from overwriting gnome software? or was it that you were suggesting that we not ship gnome software, which I feel wouldn't be the best solution.
[23:27] <Unit193> Yeah no problem at all!  I cracked the ISO open and fudged in a little loopback.
[23:27] <Unit193> jphilips: I never liked gnome-software so I'm biased, but I do not like the idea that xubuntu-desktop would depend on gnome-software.
[23:29] <jphilips> i don't like it as well, but for new users it is useful and we recently completed writing a whole section about it in the documentation
[23:31] <jphilips> a number of users have mentioned abandoning xubuntu as they think it comes with the snap store
[23:31] <jphilips> here is the other part of david's message on telegram - https://imgur.com/TKeQrd9.png
[23:32] <jphilips> bluesabre: ^^^
[23:37] <albinard> to Unit193: That sounds like there's now a new ISO to download with the loopback fudged in - correct?
[23:48] <Unit193> Well not quite, I sort of did that locally to test out.  Also can't use a symlink as I forgot about the scan-iso/filename=$iso_path param that needs to be there.  Anywho, booted to a desktop, xfsettingsd wasn't running so everything was a bit off.  This is wonderfully fun. :P  The last part I don't claim as my issue though.
[23:54] <Unit193> jphilips: ...I've had half a mind to remove snapd from core, but that'd be diverging based on my own preferences...


[08:49] <tjaalton> hm could xdiagnose still be split..
[08:49] <tjaalton> gui separate from the apport hooks
[08:51] <tjaalton> nvidia/fglrx bugs come flooding in
[08:55] <tjaalton> mlankhorst: I tend to just move all bugs that have fglrx/nvidia module loaded to the respective package, keeps xorg-server bug count more manageable
[08:58] <tjaalton> all the stacktraces seem useless even with open drivers
[08:59] <tjaalton> looks like the retracer is broken
[09:54] <mlankhorst> tjaalton: yeah
[09:54] <mlankhorst> which is annoying
[09:54] <mlankhorst> I do the same
[13:02] <tjaalton> mlankhorst: hmm we didn't update glamor to 0.6.0..
[13:21] <tjaalton> ooh, R9270 available right away.. could buy that and finally have something to test radeonsi on..
[13:29] <tjaalton> huh, trusty has 0.6.0 but it's not in git


[16:00] <Daviey> adam_g: Hey!
[16:01] <adam_g> o/
[16:02] <adam_g> shall we?
[16:02] <zul> we shall
[16:02] <Daviey> adam_g: All set?
[16:03] <adam_g> #startmeeting ubuntu-server-team
[16:03] <meetingology> Meeting started Tue May 21 16:03:11 2013 UTC.  The chair is adam_g. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[16:03] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[16:03] <adam_g> hey all
[16:03] <jamespage> o/
[16:03] <arosales> Hello o/
[16:03] <Daviey> \o
[16:04] <adam_g> hmm. we had no meeting last week because of UDS, correct?  last minutes i can find are @ https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/Server/20130423
[16:04] <Daviey> Correct
[16:04] <adam_g> coolio
[16:04] <adam_g> #topic Review ACTION points from previous meeting
[16:04] <Daviey> adam_g: I think use the agenda from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/Meeting
[16:05] <smoser> o/
[16:06] <adam_g> so, we have no action poitns from last
[16:06] <adam_g> Moving on?
[16:06] <Daviey> adam_g: see the 3 things in Agenda?
[16:06] <Daviey> (carried forward) arosales .. etc?
[16:07] <adam_g> Oh, sorry. I was looking at the 20130423 minutes
[16:07] <adam_g> arosales, any update: arosales to follow up with Norvald regarding SRU?
[16:08] <arosales> ugh, sorry /me still has a todo to follow up with Norvald.
[16:08] <adam_g> k
[16:08] <arosales> I thought there may be some discussion and vUDS, but I don't think norvald was there.
[16:08] <adam_g> #action (carried forward) arosales to follow up with Norvald regarding SRU
[16:08] <meetingology> ACTION: (carried forward) arosales to follow up with Norvald regarding SRU
[16:09] <adam_g> zul, any updates on the complexity of percona packaging in Ubuntu? i know therew was discussion at UDS
[16:10] <zul> adam_g:  not really percona is giong to be working on thier stuff to get into the archive via debian and we will go from there
[16:10] <adam_g> zul, cool is there a timeframe for that or relevant workitems/blueprint?
[16:11] <Daviey> Yeah, great progress was made with percona at vUDS
[16:11] <zul> adam_g:  no but ill update the work items
[16:11] <Daviey> I feel confident enough we can remove it from the agenda.
[16:11] <adam_g> Daviey, is there an action to remove it or just do not record as a new action for next meeting?
[16:11] <Daviey> adam_g: yeah, just drop it on the floor.  No action needed, it'll be in blueprint, right zul? :)
[16:12] <zul> right
[16:12] <adam_g> k
[16:12] <adam_g> smoser to reach out to juju-core and discuss what integration with ubuntu image meta data can be done for Raring.
[16:12] <adam_g> smoser, any update? assume it didn't make it for raring, but any update on what is in store for saucy with regard to ubuntu images?
[16:13] <smoser> juju-core support for simple streams data is basically in.
[16:13] <adam_g> ah!
[16:13] <doko> smoser, adam_g: do you know if there is any work planned to integrate the no goyaml into juju-core?
[16:13] <TheLordOfTime> o/ (late sorry!)
[16:14] <smoser> i don't know.
[16:14] <adam_g> smoser, is there anything left to be done at that front that needs to be carried over?
[16:14] <smoser> no
[16:15] <adam_g> doko, i'd be surprised if they were not already using goyaml but you'd have to check with #juju-dev
[16:15] <adam_g> Moving on?
[16:15] <Daviey> adam_g: Looks good!
[16:15] <adam_g> #TOPIC Saucy Development
[16:16] <jamespage> hello saucy salamander!
[16:16] <Daviey> Still early in the cycle... and with vUDS last week.. we are getting things sorted.
[16:16] <adam_g> well, we're probably all working on merges and syncs for some time now
[16:16] <Daviey> jamespage: How are blueprints looking?
[16:16]  * hallyn hides his behind his back
[16:17] <jamespage> hands up who still has blueprints to write up from last week?
[16:17]  * jamespage puts his hand up
[16:17] <hallyn> o/
[16:17] <Daviey> We need to make good use of the Blueprint review staus
[16:17]  * zul does
[16:17] <hallyn> i'll get to it this week
[16:17] <adam_g> jamespage, is there a URL to get a list of blueprints filtered by the server team for S? was having trouble with this yesterday
[16:17] <hallyn> Daviey: what does that mean?
[16:17] <jamespage> OK _ so please can drafters sync up with session notes and document work items as well
[16:17] <hallyn> yup
[16:18] <Daviey> hallyn: see the Design field?
[16:18] <jamespage> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-server/+specs?role=assignee
[16:18] <Daviey> Lets pick on, https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/servercloud-s-mongodb
[16:18] <Daviey> See it's Defintion is marked as Review?
[16:18] <hallyn> y
[16:19] <adam_g> #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-server/+specs?role=assignee
[16:19] <hallyn> Daviey: so switch that to drafting while working, then discussion when doen?
[16:19] <Daviey> hallyn: When the blueprint is at a state where it can be moved forward, mark it as review.. So Scott, James and Myself can take a gander.
[16:20] <Daviey> hallyn: Discussion is supposed to be last week.. Drafting is the current status
[16:20] <Daviey> Review for, "Please Ack it"
[16:20] <hallyn> ok
[16:20] <Daviey> "Approved" is commence work
[16:21] <jamespage> please can folks try to get stuff into a 'Review' state by the end this week
[16:21] <jamespage> Daviey, does that sound reasonable
[16:21] <hallyn> yes, sir
[16:21] <rbasak> Is that why work items don't yet appear on my own page on status.ubuntu.com?
[16:21] <Daviey> jamespage: That sounds a super plan
[16:21] <hallyn> tsk tsk
[16:21] <Daviey> rbasak: Sounds about right.
[16:21] <jamespage> if people want some help then please ping me, smoser or Daviey
[16:22] <arosales> Daviey, do we also need a topic for servercloud on status.u.c or should work items for individuals show up?
[16:22] <jamespage> where help == guidance != write the spec for you :-)
[16:22] <Daviey> arosales: I think we do indeed need a topic
[16:22] <Daviey> arosales: I actually thought there were topics, but it looks like they are unrelated
[16:23] <arosales> #action arosales to create status.u.c topics
[16:23] <meetingology> ACTION: arosales to create status.u.c topics
[16:23] <Daviey> arosales: You sir, are a true gent.
[16:23] <adam_g> cool
[16:23] <arosales> I'll do an "ecosystem" and "overview" topic any others folks are interested in?
[16:23] <adam_g> anything else?
[16:24] <jamespage> thanks arosales
[16:24] <jamespage> oh - I had one more thing
[16:24] <adam_g> sure
[16:24] <arosales> glad to help where I can
[16:24] <jamespage> last cycle each blueprint had a individual assignee and ubuntu-server as the drafter
[16:25] <jamespage> this mean that work-items where by default owned by an individual rather than the team
[16:25] <jamespage> Daviey, we seem to have switch that this cycle
[16:25] <jamespage> so work-items are team owned unless specifically assigned
[16:25] <Daviey> jamespage: You are certain that s.u.c won't DTRT?
[16:25]  * jamespage shrugs
[16:26] <Daviey> Maybe i am going barmy, but i'd imagine Assignee to be the main person on the hook for the blueprint?
[16:26] <Daviey> ie, default owner of WI
[16:26] <jamespage> Daviey, yes - but right now that's ubuntu-server team
[16:26] <Daviey> BUT, if we do it the other way (AKA last cycle).. we get a pool of unowned work, which is ~ubuntu-server
[16:26] <Daviey> So maybe that makes more sense?
[16:27] <jamespage> no - we have a pool of unowned work with the way we have it now
[16:27] <Daviey> jamespage: Ah yes.
[16:27] <jamespage> I think that is wrong
[16:27] <Daviey> jamespage: default to unowned sounds subpar to me.. What do you think?
[16:28] <arosales> could Drafter and Assignee be switched?
[16:28] <jamespage> sounds like we agree; can people switch them around please for the blueprints they are currently assigned as drafter for
[16:28] <Daviey> jamespage: Ok, lets switch it around.  I'll do that for ones i am Approver of
[16:28] <jamespage> ta
[16:28] <Daviey> jamespage: I'll just bulk it.
[16:28] <jamespage> adam_g, OK - I think we are done on that one
[16:28] <jamespage> Daviey, ta
[16:28] <adam_g> ok
[16:29] <adam_g> i assume its too early to review release bugs, eh?
[16:29] <Daviey> #ACTION Daviey to switcheroo Assignee & Drafter for Saucy blueprints.
[16:29] <meetingology> ACTION: Daviey to switcheroo Assignee & Drafter for Saucy blueprints.
[16:29] <Daviey> arosales: yeah, i don't think we have any bugs to worry too much about.
[16:29] <Daviey> err, adam_g ^
[16:30] <jamespage> adam_g, can you action me to chase down bdmurray about the release tracking report
[16:30] <Daviey> zul seems to have identified a bunch of FTBFS and jenkins build failures with Havana on Saucy.. but not pertinent here i don't think
[16:30] <adam_g> #topic Ubuntu Server Team Events
[16:30] <jamespage> I sware its not working again
[16:30] <Daviey> jamespage: release tracking report?
[16:30] <jamespage> release bug tracking report
[16:30] <Daviey> jamespage: url?
[16:31] <jamespage> actually don't bother - its working now - http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-s-tracking-bug-tasks.html
[16:31] <Daviey> rls-s-tracking-bugs.html
[16:31] <Daviey> right
[16:31] <adam_g> is anyone attending any events worth noting here?
[16:32] <arosales> for events m_3 is at http://www.gluecon.com/2013/ this week
[16:32] <jamespage> there is an openstack and mysql meetup in london on thursday
[16:32] <arosales> I am at http://2013.texaslinuxfest.org/ at the end of the month
[16:32] <jamespage> I'm not attending but Daviey is I think
[16:32] <Daviey> I am at Openstack London meetup this Thursday
[16:32] <Daviey> I am at Mysql London meetup this Thursday
[16:32] <jamespage> :-)
[16:32] <Daviey> (same building, same time)
[16:33] <Daviey> (Say Hi, if you see me.)
[16:33] <Daviey> ..
[16:33] <adam_g> great
[16:33] <Daviey> EOF
[16:33] <adam_g> #topic Weekly Updates & Questions for the QA Team (plars)
[16:34] <adam_g> plars, hi
[16:35] <adam_g> if plars is not making it, anything else QA related?
[16:35] <plars> hi, I'm here
[16:35] <adam_g> oh! hi :)
[16:35] <Daviey> \o/
[16:35] <plars> not much, hallyn I think was looking at a bug on lxc?
[16:35] <plars> one moment, let me dig up the bug #
[16:35] <plars> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lxc/+bug/1182540
[16:36] <plars> I believe you've already talked to psivaa about that though right?
[16:36] <hallyn> uh, is that the one hementioned this morning?
[16:36] <plars> also, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1181315 is affecting the floodlight test, kernel team is aware and looking into it
[16:36] <plars> hallyn: yep
[16:36] <adam_g> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1181315
[16:36] <hallyn> i ahdn't seen the open bug
[16:37] <adam_g> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lxc/+bug/1182540
[16:37] <hallyn> couldn't reproduce with a fresh saucy install
[16:37] <Daviey> yolanda: did you send that mail to ubuntu-qa, about dep-8?
[16:37] <hallyn> plars: have him ping me if it happens again on next run pls
[16:37] <yolanda> Daviey, yes, i also had you and Jamie in CC
[16:37] <hallyn> it appeared to be hung on flock
[16:37] <plars> hallyn: yes, he's running again to get additional information
[16:37] <plars> nothing else from me
[16:37] <yolanda> i received a message from ubuntu-qa, telling that is pending of moderation
[16:37] <hallyn> plars: thanks
[16:38] <Daviey> yolanda: super
[16:38] <adam_g> #topic Weekly Updates & Questions for the Kernel Team (smb)
[16:38] <adam_g> smb, hello sir
[16:38] <Daviey> smb is away
[16:38] <adam_g> ah
[16:39] <Daviey> I think we can skip this section this week.
[16:39] <adam_g> ...and i actually had a question!
[16:39] <Daviey> Oh
[16:39] <Daviey> apw: Can you help answer a kernel question? :)
[16:39] <adam_g> i was just wondering if we knew exactly what kernel requirements are needed to do xen now.
[16:39] <apw> Daviey, ?
[16:40] <Daviey> apw: adam_g said he had a kernel question.
[16:40] <adam_g> was hoping someone could confirm whether a reboot is necessary. we touched on this at UDS but seemed nobody knew for sure
[16:40] <apw> adam_g, needed to do xen ?
[16:40] <apw> a reboot following what?
[16:40] <adam_g> apw, can the vanilla kernel shipped /w ubuntu currently support running a xen hypervisor?
[16:40] <Daviey> As far as i a aware, the primary kernel we ship is xen dom0 enabled OOTB
[16:41] <apw> the vanilla kernel can be a dom0 kernel yes, obviously you still need to reboot following selecting xen as your hypervisor so it can get underneath the kernel
[16:42] <adam_g> apw, thats what i wanted to know, thanks. someone mentioned that was no longer necessary last week.
[16:42] <adam_g> thanks
[16:42] <Daviey> apw: so that fiddles grub config?
[16:42] <adam_g> #topic Weekly Updates & Questions regarding Ubuntu ARM Server (rbasak)
[16:42] <rbasak> Nothing to report. Any questions for me?
[16:43] <adam_g> Nothing for rbasak?
[16:44] <Daviey> None
[16:44] <adam_g> #topic Open Discussion
[16:44] <arosales> good blog post by roaksoax for maas juju set up @  http://www.roaksoax.com/2013/05/getting-started-with-maas-and-juju
[16:44] <Daviey> +1
[16:44] <rbasak> I'd like to draw attention to https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2013-May/014518.html - for those interested in ldap, sssd, etc.
[16:44] <Daviey> TheLordOfTime: Hello
[16:44] <TheLordOfTime> Daviey:  hiya!
[16:45] <TheLordOfTime> if you don't mind me stealing the floor for a few moments... :P
[16:45] <rbasak> I'm also still soliciting comments on errors.ubuntu.com on the ubuntu-server list.
[16:45] <Daviey> I need to dive out now, but TheLordOfTime wanted to discuss nginx
[16:45] <marcoceppi> yay nginx
[16:45] <TheLordOfTime> Per https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nginx/+bug/1177919/comments/3 there was an informal request to consider nginx for inclusion either on the images or as part of tasksel
[16:45] <TheLordOfTime> or some other system.
[16:45] <TheLordOfTime> the bug itself is irrelevant, but the comment is what i'm drawing attention to
[16:46] <TheLordOfTime> nginx has gotten a lot more widespread use, and it's bugfixing has been a bit faster, namely because i've unofficially adopted it on the ubuntu side
[16:46] <TheLordOfTime> i've seen other requests about whether nginx would be included on the images ever, and I've had to answer "I don't know"
[16:47] <jamespage> hmm - we did look at this during raring
[16:47] <jamespage> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/servercloud-r-webscale
[16:47] <rbasak> To be clear, are you suggesting nginx together with apache2 in main, or nginx to replace apache2 in main?
[16:47] <jamespage> utlemming, around? ^^ any comment on nginx into main
[16:47] <TheLordOfTime> rbasak:  i don't remember where the discussion of making nginx part of main went.
[16:47] <utlemming> jamespage: yeah...the problem here is that security doesn't seemed to thrilled about it
[16:47] <TheLordOfTime> it was a uds talkpoint
[16:47] <jamespage> ah - and here again - https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/servercloud-s-webscale
[16:48] <jamespage> and I'm the drafter
[16:48] <adam_g> i'm surprised nginx hasn't been promoted to main by now.
[16:48]  * jamespage faceplants
[16:48] <utlemming> jamespage: the issue is nginx has a long history of CVE's and long standing security issues
[16:48] <jamespage> utlemming, that certainly used to be the case - but is that true now?
[16:48] <rbasak> I agree that nginx is popular, mature and has widespread use now. Not sure about the security side of things.
[16:48] <TheLordOfTime> there are active CVEs.
[16:48] <TheLordOfTime> well, last i checked, at least one
[16:48]  * TheLordOfTime pulls the bug
[16:48] <rbasak> It would be nice to have a "lightweight/minimal httpd" in main.
[16:49] <TheLordOfTime> this is the last bug I saw: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nginx/+bug/1098654
[16:49] <TheLordOfTime> granted i pulled that from debian and upstream trackers
[16:49] <TheLordOfTime> it seems upstream's ignoring it though
[16:49] <rbasak> (in addition to the do-everything heavyweight httpd that is apache)
[16:49] <TheLordOfTime> rbasak:  i'm bringing it up as a talking point, not from my opinions
[16:49] <TheLordOfTime> as we're aware, a common HTTPd deployment is LAMP
[16:49] <TheLordOfTime> Apache, MySQL, and PHP
[16:50] <TheLordOfTime> nginx has zero OOTB configurations that include PHP
[16:50] <rbasak> Just reading that bug now. That seems like a really obscure case.
[16:50] <TheLordOfTime> as it depends on php5-fpm (or similar) and proxy_pass-ing to the php5 backend
[16:50] <rbasak> Who runs nginx in reverse proxy mode to an https server over an insecure network?
[16:50] <TheLordOfTime> whether that's an fcgi wrapper or a php5-fpm running
[16:50] <TheLordOfTime> rbasak:  nobody, but that's an example of a known CVE that has gotten zero upstream attention
[16:51] <TheLordOfTime> unless I missed a few commits...
[16:51] <rbasak> TheLordOfTime: yeah sure. That wasn't aimed at you - I appreciate you bringing it up.
[16:51] <TheLordOfTime> rbasak:  no problem :)
[16:51] <TheLordOfTime> but lemme go back to my initial "not a good inclusion" argument
[16:52] <TheLordOfTime> we're aware LAMP is an easy-to-deploy system because Apache has a loadable module that speaks to php5
[16:52] <rbasak> What I'm saying is that I'm not sure that should block an MIR - but I'm not as familiar with MIR policy and history as I'd like, or understand what security policy with that kind of vulnerability would be.
[16:52] <TheLordOfTime> nginx doesn't have that, it requires manual configuration to work
[16:52] <TheLordOfTime> although the sample default config *does* have a compatible clause that would allow php to work
[16:52] <TheLordOfTime> but it's commented out by default
[16:53] <rbasak> IMHO, nginx isn't necessarily supposed to have that. Even though I have put PHP behind nginx before.
[16:53] <TheLordOfTime> i'm not sure what other points need to be addressed, maybe talk to the security team about their concerns.
[16:53] <rbasak> I put some kind of fastcgi thing in the middle, IIRC.
[16:53] <TheLordOfTime> rbasak:  it isn't, but debian included a default config with samples that work with Ubuntu/Debian php5-fpm out of the box
[16:54] <TheLordOfTime> nginx debian package that is
[16:54] <rbasak> OK...so where are we with it?
[16:54] <TheLordOfTime> that's the discussion here.
[16:54] <TheLordOfTime> personally, I vote to NOT move it to main
[16:55] <TheLordOfTime> because the only person actively watching it in Ubuntu is me and maybe a few others
[16:55] <TheLordOfTime> (probably mostly me, though...)
[16:55] <TheLordOfTime> i also don't want to deal with an extra influx of "how do i configure it for [usecase]" questions
[16:55] <TheLordOfTime> as those're bound to flood into existence if we include it on the images.
[16:56] <TheLordOfTime> but my point here was to bring the discussion up again
[16:56] <TheLordOfTime> i'm curious whether anyone else here has an opinion on moving it to main and/or including on the images.
[16:56] <TheLordOfTime> and whether there's concerns from others on it.
[16:56] <rbasak> I'm not sure those last two reasons are valid - but we're running out of time.
[16:57] <TheLordOfTime> if there's anything I can answer, questions or the such, i'll answer if i can
[16:57] <adam_g> can we take this to #ubuntu-server?
[16:57] <adam_g> 2 minutes left here
[16:57] <TheLordOfTime> we can, or we can take it to the mailing list,
[16:57]  * TheLordOfTime is on both places
[16:57] <jamespage> +1 ML
[16:57] <rbasak> My concern would mainly be around whether it's suitable under main inclusion policy, who would look after it, and how much work it'd be.
[16:58] <adam_g> #topic Announce next meeting date and time
[16:58] <adam_g> May 28th 16:00 UTC
[16:58] <TheLordOfTime> last point on that last topic of nginx: we may want to discuss on the ML about this, so others who weren't here can chime in.
[16:59] <TheLordOfTime> i'd say that's the first place to bring it up
[16:59]  * TheLordOfTime is done.
[16:59] <arosales> adam_g, thanks for chairing
[16:59] <adam_g> TheLordOfTime, i agree. there are plenty of admins out there who are heavily vested that are not on IRC
[16:59] <rbasak> TheLordOfTime: will do - thanks for bringing it up
[16:59] <adam_g> till next week
[16:59] <adam_g> #endmeeting
[16:59] <meetingology> Meeting ended Tue May 21 16:59:34 2013 UTC.
[16:59] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-05-21-16.03.moin.txt
[16:59] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-05-21-16.03.html
[16:59] <TheLordOfTime> rbasak:  no problem, i brought it up because it ended up as a request on an active merge bug.
[17:00] <TheLordOfTime> (which, thanks to Daviey, has been included into Saucy)
[17:00] <jsalisbury> ##
[17:00] <meetingology> Meeting started Tue May 21 17:00:38 2013 UTC.  The chair is jsalisbury. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[17:00] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[17:00] <jsalisbury> ##
[17:00] <jsalisbury> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelTeam/ReleaseStatus/raring
[17:00] <bjf> o/
[17:00] <ppisati> o/
[17:00] <rtg_> o/
[17:00] <cking> o/
[17:00] <henrix> o/
[17:01] <sforshee> o/
[17:01] <jsalisbury> [TOPIC] ARM Status (ppisati)
[17:01] <ppisati> Q/master: lp1176977 ("XFS instability on armhf under load") - working with
[17:01] <ppisati> upstream on this one: i already backported a fix that turn the vmalloc() exhaustion
[17:01] <ppisati> and fs shutdown to an -ENOSPC error, and this second error seems to be triggered
[17:01] <ppisati> by the tiny fs used in these tests (~2GB). Still working to get it
[17:01] <ppisati> properly fixed.
[17:01] <ppisati> R/master: lp1171582("[highbank] hvc0 getty causes random hangs") -
[17:01] <ppisati> the jtag console has a 1-char producer-consumer buffer and if there's no
[17:01] <ppisati> real hw attached to the board, any subsequent write turn into an endless loop
[17:01] <ppisati> waiting for a consumer. The situation is worsened by the fact
[17:01] <ppisati> that before writing to this register a tty spinlocked is taken, and
[17:02] <ppisati> any subsequent tentative to pick this spinlock makes the thread hang -
[17:02] <ppisati> got a confirmation of the problem, some info about the hw, and i'm working on this.
[17:02] <ppisati> ..
[17:02] <jsalisbury> [TOPIC] Release Metrics and Incoming Bugs (jsalisbury)
[17:02] <jsalisbury> Release metrics and incoming bug data can be reviewed at the following link:
[17:02] <jsalisbury> [LINK] http://people.canonical.com/~kernel/reports/kt-meeting.txt
[17:02] <jsalisbury> ..
[17:02] <jsalisbury> [TOPIC] Milestone Targeted Work Items (ogasawara)
[17:02] <ogasawara> [LINK] https://launchpad.net/~canonical-kernel-distro-team/+upcomingwork
[17:02] <ogasawara> [LINK] http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-saucy/canonical-kernel-distro-team.html
[17:02] <ogasawara> The burn down charts have not yet been reset for 13.10, so disregard the
[17:02] <ogasawara> second link posted abovefor now.  I'll be cleaning up and adding work
[17:02] <ogasawara> items for 13.10 so that the +upcomingwork link will be more accurate.
[17:02] <ogasawara> Next week I'll have the usual nag table available.
[17:02] <ogasawara> ..
[17:03] <jsalisbury> [TOPIC] Status: Saucy Development Kernel (ogasawara)
[17:03] <ogasawara> For now, we'll plan on targetting the v3.10 kernel for Saucy but will
[17:03] <ogasawara> strongly re-evaluate a move to v3.11 in the coming months.  We've just
[17:03] <ogasawara> rebased Saucy to v3.10-rc2 and are still cleaning up some of the
[17:03] <ogasawara> carnage.  I don't anticipate we'll upload until a later -rc which will
[17:03] <ogasawara> hopefully provide more stability.
[17:03] <ogasawara> Importand upcoming dates:
[17:03] <ogasawara> Thurs June 20 - Alpha 1 (opt in)
[17:03] <ogasawara> ..
[17:03] <jsalisbury> [TOPIC] Status: CVE's (sconklin)
[17:04] <sconklin> == 2013-05-21 (28 days) ==
[17:04] <sconklin> Currently we have 63 CVEs on our radar, with 8 CVEs added and 17 CVEs retired in the last 28 days.
[17:04] <sconklin> See the CVE matrix for the current list:
[17:04] <sconklin> [LINK] http://people.canonical.com/~kernel/cve/pkg/ALL-linux.html
[17:04] <sconklin> Overall the backlog has decreased slightly this week:
[17:04] <sconklin> [LINK] http://people.canonical.com/~kernel/status/cve-metrics.txt
[17:04] <sconklin> [LINK] http://people.canonical.com/~kernel/cve/pkg/CVE-linux.txt
[17:04] <sconklin> ..
[17:04] <jsalisbury> [TOPIC] Status: Stable, Security, and Bugfix Kernel Updates - Raring/Quantal/Precise/Oneiric/Lucid/Hardy (bjf/henrix/sconklin)
[17:04] <sconklin> Support for Oneiric and Hardy expired on May 9th.
[17:04] <sconklin> Status for the main kernels, until today (May. 21):
[17:04] <sconklin> *   Lucid - In Testing;
[17:04] <sconklin> * Precise - In Testing; 2 upstream releases;
[17:04] <sconklin> * Quantal - In Testing; 2 upstream releases;
[17:04] <sconklin> * Raring  - In Testing; 3 upstream releases;
[17:04] <sconklin> Current opened tracking bugs details:
[17:04] <sconklin> * http://people.canonical.com/~kernel/reports/kernel-sru-workflow.html
[17:04] <sconklin> For SRUs, SRU report is a good source of information:
[17:04] <sconklin> * http://people.canonical.com/~kernel/reports/sru-report.html
[17:04] <sconklin> Future stable cadence cycles:
[17:04] <sconklin> * https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RaringRingtail/ReleaseInterlock
[17:04] <sconklin> ..
[17:05] <jsalisbury> [TOPIC] Open Discussion or Questions? Raise your hand to be recognized (o/)
[17:05] <jsalisbury> Thanks everyone
[17:05] <jsalisbury> #endmeeting
[17:05] <meetingology> Meeting ended Tue May 21 17:05:40 2013 UTC.
[17:05] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-05-21-17.00.moin.txt
[17:05] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-05-21-17.00.html
[17:05] <kamal> thanks jsalisbury


[10:01] <elkbuntu> MitchM_, the counter's awstats seem to be not updating, is there a cron or something missing?
[10:39] <Burgundavia> elkbuntu: question about the ubuntu counter
[10:39] <elkbuntu> Burgundavia, hmm?
[10:39] <Burgundavia> how is the machine total counted?
[10:39] <Burgundavia> is it clusters + machines?
[10:40] <elkbuntu> cluster population+machines, yes
[10:40] <Burgundavia> ah
[10:40] <Burgundavia> that is a little odd
[10:41] <elkbuntu> how so?
[10:41] <Burgundavia> well, to me, clusters are merely containers to put machines into
[10:41] <Burgundavia> logical grouping of machines, essentially
[10:42] <elkbuntu> yes... so machine total is the sum of the population of all the clusters, plus the number of individual machines
[10:42] <Burgundavia> basically
[10:43] <elkbuntu> thats how it's done
[10:43] <Burgundavia> but if I create a cluster of 5 machines, do I need to create 5 machiens as well?
[10:43] <elkbuntu> no, the cluster thing is so you dont have to
[10:44] <elkbuntu> that's the purpose of the clustering on the site
[10:44] <Burgundavia> right, but I think we are missing some interesting stats that could be generated be switching to the clustering as container idea
[10:45] <Burgundavia> we could ask about where the cluster is, work/home/etc.
[10:45] <elkbuntu> in what way?
[10:45] <Burgundavia> we could figure out that most large groups of computers are still on dapper, etc.
[10:45] <Burgundavia> you could watch people upgrade
[10:45] <Burgundavia> ie: do people upgrade one machine or all at once?
[10:46] <Burgundavia> I would also love to roll your stats into the hwdb
[10:46] <Burgundavia> for an uber-Ubuntu machine stat thingy
[10:46] <elkbuntu> if you could figure how to do it, sure
[10:46] <Burgundavia> not hard
[10:47] <Burgundavia> but anyway, do you see where I am coming at with my clustering thoughts?
[10:47] <elkbuntu> yeah
[10:47] <elkbuntu> however i have not the time to do this :(
[10:47] <Burgundavia> I guess I should also mention that the current way is not very clear
[10:48] <Burgundavia> that is what prompted this whole conversation
[10:48] <elkbuntu> yeah, it's been pointed out before, to a degree
[10:50] <Burgundavia> I also wonder how many double counts we have because of false assumptions
[10:53] <Burgundavia> http://ubuntucounter.geekosophical.net/faq.php <-- link to ubuntu.com on there is broken
[03:34] <MitchM_> elkbuntu, let me look
[03:46] <MitchM> elkbuntu, fixed.
[03:46] <MitchM> elkbuntu, was a cron problem :)


[01:58] <lifeless> bigjools: yo
[01:59] <bigjools> g'day
[01:59] <negronjl> hello all
[01:59] <lifeless> bigjools: meet Juan, negronjl meet Julian, dev lead for maas.
[01:59] <negronjl> hello bigjools
[02:00] <bigjools> hi
[02:00] <negronjl> bigjools: I am getting ready to do a MaaS demo @ Structure and I am having issues with TFTP
[02:01] <negronjl> bigjools: TFTP daemon ( I believe tftpd-hpa ) is not running on boot so I started it and now I get TFTP unable to locate configuration file
[02:03] <bigjools> is manage_tftpd set to 1 in /etc/cobbler/settings?
[02:03] <negronjl> bigjools: checking ...
[02:04] <negronjl> bigjools: yes
[02:04] <bigjools> ok run "cobbler sync"
[02:05] <bigjools> and it should write a config out
[02:05] <negronjl> bigjools: ok ... brb ( setup is in the other room )
[02:07] <negronjl> bigjools, lifeless:  well.... this is embarrassing, I had "cobller sync" in my restart-everything script ....
[02:07] <negronjl> bigjools, lifeless: that did it by the way
[02:07] <bigjools> nice :)
[02:07] <bigjools> great
[02:07]  * negronjl bangs his head against the wall a couple of times :/
[02:09] <lifeless> you'll be glad to know cobbler is being nuked atm
[02:09] <lifeless> so next version should have new and interesting failure modes.
[02:09] <bigjools> with extreme pleasure
[02:09] <negronjl> lifeless, bigjools: NICE!!!!!!!!
[02:10] <negronjl> less banging on head
[04:03] <negronjl> bigjools: ping
[04:47] <negronjl> has there been a resolution to but 992075
[04:47] <negronjl> sorry bug 992075
[04:47] <negronjl> cloud-init-nonet killed by TERM signal
[04:47] <negronjl> now I'm stuck there.
[04:50] <bigjools> negronjl: sorry no idea, we need smoser to look at that
[05:24] <negronjl> bigjools: thx ... I'll ping smoser tomorrow
[05:49] <lifeless> negronjl: get some sleep :P
[05:50] <negronjl> lifeless: yup. I think I will ... later all .. and thanks for the help
[10:32] <rick1> I always get "httpd does not appear to be running and proxying cobbler" when I was running maas-import-isos, is there any hints?
[12:12] <rvba> roaksoax: hi there, I've got 2 questions for you about the preseed files.
[12:14] <rvba> roaksoax: first question: where exactly is the maas-enlist.preseed used?  It's used to create an "enlist" profile in scripts/maas-import-isos but then I don't see where this profile is used.
[12:17] <rvba> roaksoax: second question.  I see you've divided the pressed files in templates and snippets and the snippets are included by the templates.  I see that most of the snippets (actually, all but one) are used only once and most of them are only one lines (or, at most, a few lines).  I was wondering if you would be against some reorganisation for these files.  The first reason, as described previously is that I
[12:17] <rvba> don't really see the point in having a snippet when it's used only once.  The second reason is that the templating language we're planning to use (tempita) support inheritance (a la Django) but not inclusion.  What do you say?
[12:18] <rvba> s/one lines/one line/
[13:39] <roaksoax> rvba: 1. /var/lib/tftpboot/pxelinux.cfg/default
[13:40] <roaksoax> rvba: when a system PXE boots, and it doesn't find itself in the PXE server, then it shows a PXE menu which the various options (cobbler profiles). The default to be run is maas-enlist
[13:42] <roaksoax> rvba: 2. uhmmm what snippets are you referrering too. I think that ideally we would like to keep the concept of snippets because each prpovide a different capability that we might not want in the preseed
[13:42] <roaksoax> rvba: smoser ^^
[13:42] <roaksoax> err
[13:42] <roaksoax> smoser: ^^ what are your thouhgts
[13:44] <rvba> roaksoax: (1.) All right, I'll need to coordinate with jtv then because he's working on tftp right now.  Thanks!
[13:45] <rvba> roaksoax: (2.)  I'm not suggesting dropping the notion of splitting up the templates into small bits.  I'd like to know if you prefer to keep the mechanism as is or move to a inheritance mechanism (a la Django templates).  I'm asking because only is supported by default by the template language we use :).
[13:46] <rvba> s/because only/because only the latter/
[13:48] <rvba> roaksoax: I'm referring to all of the snippets in contrib/snippets/.
[13:48] <roaksoax> rvba: so the thing is that the concepts of snippets are good because they keep small pieces apart to do different things that can be reused when necessary
[13:49] <smoser> i dont think anyone is specifically tied to the word "snippets"
[13:49] <rvba> roaksoax: indeed.  What I'm proposing is somewhat similar.  It allows you to do the exact same thing but uses inheritance instead of inclusion.
[13:49] <rvba> It's sort of done the other way around.
[13:50] <roaksoax> rvba: right, but would the preseed be able to say
[13:50] <smoser> without much information, i suspect that you'll still be rednering the preseed files with an object's ".preseed()" or something.
[13:50] <roaksoax> rvba: right, but would the preseed be able to say "i want to inherit this feature for XYZ?"
[13:50] <smoser> so in the end you'll have the same, dynamic result in that you can customize that stuff.
[13:50] <roaksoax> smoser: right but a snippet can not only contain a dynamic result, but a static one
[13:51] <smoser> well, foo.packages() can just return "some static package list"
[13:51] <rvba> roaksoax: definitely, it would be done in a different way though.  Let me give you an example.
[13:51] <smoser> (and then foo.packages() is used by foo.preseed())
[13:52] <smoser> an example would be good. but rvba the key element is that you need preseed files, and even kernel command line to be customizable
[13:52] <roaksoax> and "snippets" if they are kept
[13:53] <smoser> snippets are a mechanism to get runtime evaluation
[13:53] <smoser> and we need "pluggable runtime evaluation" in some mechanism.
[13:53] <smoser> i'm not willing to argue over how that is implemented.
[13:53] <smoser> s/willing/interested/
[13:54] <rvba> smoser: preseed files will be customizable.  We've added a simple way for now and we're ready to make it more complex if we need to.
[13:55] <rvba> smoser: 1. one will be able to add a new directory where templates will be looked up first before resorting to the default (maas provided) ones.
[13:56] <rvba> roaksoax: 2. We've added a (simple) look-up mechanism: for instance if MAAS is looking up the template named 'enlist' it will first see if 'enlist_$nodearch_$nodesubarch_$hostname' exists.  Then 'enlist_$nodearch_$nodesubarch"… etc… the 'enlist' and finally 'generic'.
[13:57] <rvba> smoser: ^
[13:58] <rvba> roaksoax: so, we would have a 'master' template: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1047323/ and then two child templates inheriting from it: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1047325/ http://paste.ubuntu.com/1047334/
[13:59] <smoser> rvba, my concern with that is that it does not appear "dynamic"
[13:59] <rvba> roaksoax: the results would be (respectively) http://paste.ubuntu.com/1047337/, http://paste.ubuntu.com/1047338/
[13:59] <rvba> smoser: what do you mean by that?
[14:00] <roaksoax> rvba: and would you be able to evaluate, within the tempaltes, whether a particular system is running precise, oneiric, or quantal? or things like that?
[14:01] <smoser> by what you show there, ti see no way for me to extend 'top' to do a lookup into a hardware database and output specific information (such as kernel command lines) for that entity.
[14:01] <smoser> (or actually do any sort of "dyanmic" nature)
[14:01] <roaksoax> we also would lose the ability to be able to remove stuff from the preseed (or master template), or momentarily comment out. We would have to create another master template and then inherit
[14:02] <roaksoax> TBH, I personally like the way how cobbler handles templating
[14:02] <rvba> roaksoax: smoser these template will have access to as much context as you want: the node itself (node.architecture will give you the architecture), the release, etc.
[14:02] <smoser> if what you have shown us there is the extent of the dynamic nature, then i think i can pretty definitively tell you it will end up not being good enough.
[14:02] <rvba> smoser: this template system supports if/loops etc.
[14:03] <rvba> And we can extend it to include python code directly even if it's rather ugly.
[14:03] <roaksoax> rvba: we currently need importing of poython code
[14:03] <smoser> i really could care less about "ugly"
[14:03] <smoser> but thats fine.
[14:04] <smoser> if we can execute loops, if, and python code, i'm fine with that.
[14:04] <rvba> smoser: by ugly I mean less easy to test.  We'd rather keep the default templates clean and testable.  But for one-off customization, fine.
[14:05] <smoser> fair
[14:05] <rvba> roaksoax: are you referring to the base64 module?
[14:05] <roaksoax> ya
[14:06] <roaksoax> rvba: in orchestra we used to have our own custom python module to do stuff
[14:06] <roaksoax> so I personally think it might be nice to have that ability in case is needed
[14:06] <rvba> No problem, that's built-in.
[14:08] <rvba> You can do that kind of stuff (http://paste.ubuntu.com/1047347/) so I'm sure there is all the flexibility we need.
[14:08] <roaksoax> rvba: so basically, we could do something like: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1047349/
[14:08] <roaksoax> ?
[14:08] <rvba> roaksoax: well, no, that's the point (or the problem ;)).
[14:10] <rvba> roaksoax: you would do something like that:http://paste.ubuntu.com/1047351/
[14:10] <rvba> The master would look like that: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1047352/
[14:11] <rvba> Basically, it defines 'slots' which are filled in by the child templates inheriting from it.
[14:11] <roaksoax> rvba: so this is what happens: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1047353/
[14:11] <roaksoax> right?
[14:11] <rvba> roaksoax: exactly
[14:12] <roaksoax> rvba: so in order for us to add/remove stuff, we have to write a lot of "code" rather than simply importing a snippet right?
[14:12] <rvba> roaksoax: which (I think – but what do I know ;)) makes sense because the most specific stuff is then written in the child template.
[14:12] <roaksoax> rvba: doesn't that make it non-easy to administer instead of having snippets that are easily plugable to the preseed?
[14:13] <rvba> roaksoax: I don't agree… hold on one sec.
[14:13] <roaksoax> rvba: because in the current approach we have. 1. a preseed. 2. we can easily plug features to the preseed. 3. don't worry about anything
[14:13] <rvba> roaksoax: We have the exact same feature here, hang on :)
[14:14] <rvba> roaksoax: so I suppose your point is that you'll ahve to write the 'preseed' bit over and over again right?
[14:14] <rvba> roaksoax: that's not the case, you'll put it in the master template.  And child templates will still be able to override it (or not).
[14:14] <roaksoax> here we are kinda like 1. inherit the preseed. 2. manually add stuff 3. create another child used 1 and 2. 4. in order to add more stuff, we either go to 2, or 4, and create 5
[14:16] <roaksoax> rvba: and that's the thing, can't we simply make all the snippet inheritable?
[14:16] <rvba> roaksoax: what do you mean by 'make all the snippet inheritable'?
[14:16] <roaksoax> rvba: that would be much easier. If we can inherit master, can't we just also inherit any other in the same file/temaplte?
[14:17] <rvba> roaksoax: 'master' is the file name.  You can inherit from whatever file you want as long as it's available on the filesystem.
[14:18] <rvba> roaksoax: in your example, the bit that is in {{def preseed}} would be put in the master because basically all child template will use this.
[14:19] <roaksoax> rvba: right, but can't we have various masters?
[14:19] <rvba> roaksoax: absolutely.
[14:20] <rvba> We can.
[14:20] <roaksoax> rvba: so we can have this then: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1047370/
[14:20] <roaksoax> rvba: simply keep the snippet code as "snippet" and in the child file we just "include" the snippet as if it was a master
[14:21] <roaksoax> rvba: so including 3 masters in a child means, 3 different parts together, right?
[14:21] <roaksoax> that way, you kind keep the same functionality
[14:21] <rvba> roaksoax: there is the problem, there is no 'include' tag.  'Inclusion' is done the other way around: by using inheritance.
[14:22] <rvba> roaksoax: you last paste describe something that is not possible.
[14:22] <roaksoax> rvba: right, but what I mean, maas.preseed --> inherit maas_proxy snippet code, inherit maas_disable_pxe snippet code
[14:22] <roaksoax> etc
[14:23] <roaksoax> rvba: what's the tag used for inheritance?
[14:23] <roaksoax> rvba: how would you write a template that will inherit
[14:23] <rvba> roaksoax: inherit
[14:23] <rvba> roaksoax: you're right, in my examples, s/include/inherit/ ;)
[14:24] <roaksoax> rvba: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1047380/
[14:24] <roaksoax> would that be possible?
[14:25] <rvba> roaksoax: yes, but snippets/maas_proxy would have to simply define something.  And that something would then have to be used in that file.
[14:26] <rvba> roaksoax: I think it would be quicker if we could have a quick chat about this.  Note that I'm not again adding the beloved 'include' tag.
[14:26] <rvba> roaksoax: can we have a quick chat in a g hangout?
[14:27] <roaksoax> rvba: sure, but can you give me say 15 mins?
[14:27] <rvba> roaksoax: sure.
[14:27] <roaksoax> rvba: and would we be able to do this? http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1047388/
[14:27] <roaksoax> rvba: specially note the last part where we are adding stuff to a late_command line, rather than adding various late_commands. and we need to be able to that
[14:28] <roaksoax> rvba: that's one of the issues that I see
[14:28] <rvba> roaksoax: let me try something and I'll be able to reply to your question.
[14:28] <roaksoax> brb
[15:08] <roaksoax> rvba: sorry, i'm back
[15:09] <rvba> roaksoax: all right, no worries.*
[15:10] <roaksoax> rvba: ok so were you able to see whether the above works?
[15:10] <rvba> roaksoax: it does not.
[15:10] <roaksoax> smoser: you wnat it?
[15:12]  * smoser reads backscroll
[15:24] <negronjl> smoser:  I modified the image as you recommended ... I am now at the point where I get the error: cloud-init-nonet main process (344) killed by TERM signal.  Should I wait it out and then try to log in or is there something else I should be doing?
[15:28] <negronjl> smoser: I'm in the node ... anything in particular I should be looking at?  While you get back to me I'll be looking around in that node
[15:35] <smoser> negronjl, log into the system now.
[15:36] <smoser> and you want to run the cloud-init code that would read the data from the server
[15:36] <smoser> so... baically
[15:36] <smoser>  /proc/cmdline has a url on it
[15:36] <smoser> cloud-init reads that, saves it into /etc/cloud/cloud.cfg.d/91-something
[15:37] <negronjl> smoser:  ok ... waiting on the system ( as I was waiting I tried it again )
[15:39] <smoser> negronjl, ok. sorry.
[15:39] <negronjl> smoser: no worries ... I appreciate you taking the time to help
[15:43] <negronjl> smoser:  I see the /proc/cmdline output as well as /etc/cloud/cloud.cfg.d/91_kernel_cmdline_url.cfg
[15:45] <negronjl> smoser:  the only thing i see out of all that that seems out of place is http://ubuntu-maas/MAAS/metadata for the metadata_url ( ubuntu-maas is resolvable to <IP_ADDRESS> )
[15:45] <negronjl> smoser: not sure if that's correct or not
[15:48] <smoser> negronjl, yeah, thats wrong.
[15:48] <smoser> :)
[15:48] <smoser> cloud-init should be more annoying in that case.
[15:48] <smoser> can i 'look at that system at all?
[15:50] <negronjl> smoser:  it's in an isolated network.  Can you give me an example of what it should look like so I can figure it out?
[15:51] <negronjl> smoser: I will also try to put this set up online somewhere where we can see it
[15:51] <smoser> h..
[15:51] <smoser> can you pastebin /var/log/cloud-init.log ?
[15:51] <smoser> and /var/log/cloud-init-output.log (if that is present)
[15:51] <negronjl> I'll give that a shot ...
[15:52] <negronjl> smoser:  it's worth mentioning that this worked fine the first two times that I tried it.
[15:53] <negronjl> smoser:  that happened yesterday .....  I then lost my cobbler configuration ( i had to run cobbler sync ) ... it has never worked after that
[16:01] <smoser> negronjl, so.
[16:02] <smoser> i think what is wrong is that you need to run dpkg-reconfigure maas
[16:02] <smoser> (which will re-set the value of the "maas-server")
[16:02] <smoser> but how is ubuntu-maas resolvable?
[16:02] <smoser> who is feeding that data, because that is what is wrong.
[16:02] <smoser> maas told cloud-init to get some data from the url http://ubuntu-maas/MAAS/metadata .
[16:02] <smoser> clearly, thats bad.
[16:02] <smoser> :)
[16:02] <negronjl> smoser: let me try that ...
[16:03] <smoser> on the node, though?
[16:03] <smoser> you said "resolvable"
[16:03] <smoser> resolvable how?
[16:03] <smoser> 'host ubuntu-maas' ?
[16:03] <negronjl> ping ubuntu-maas
[16:03] <smoser> what about 'host ubuntu-maas' ?
[16:03] <negronjl> host ubuntu-maas ( <IP_ADDRESS> )
[16:04] <negronjl> just ran dpkg-reconfigure maas ... trying again
[16:04] <smoser> k. so who is serving 'ubuntu-maas == <IP_ADDRESS>' ?
[16:04] <smoser> yo uhave that in local dns somewhere?
[16:04] <smoser> is maas serving dns ?
[16:05] <smoser> where is htat coming from. because that is bad.
[16:06] <negronjl> checking
[16:07] <negronjl> apparently the maas-server is running a dns server that is serving that address ..
[16:07] <negronjl> I believe it's via dnsmasq
[16:08] <smoser> roaksoax, ^
[16:09] <smoser> you know how that happened ?
[16:09] <smoser> negronjl's maas-server is telling nodes that 'ubuntu-maas' (itself) can be reached at <IP_ADDRESS>
[16:09] <smoser> surprisingly that doesn't work for systems other than itself :)
[16:09] <negronjl> I am grepping around to see if I find out where that is being configured
[16:11] <roaksoax> negronjl: is this a clean install? what does /etc/hosts show?
[16:12] <negronjl> roaksoax, smoser: i found it on /etc/hosts on the maas server
[16:12] <negronjl> roaksoax, smoser: i just don't see how that affects the other nodes
[16:13] <smoser> negronjl, roaksoax this would seem to be a significant issue
[16:13] <roaksoax> negronjl: so when you dpkg-reconfigure maas you are using ubuntu-maas right?
[16:13] <smoser> and quite possible the root of a lot of people's issues
[16:13] <smoser> as the installer (i think) is going to write a <IP_ADDRESS> entry for 'hostname'
[16:14] <smoser> and then maas is going to
[16:14] <smoser> a.) tell other systems "talk to me by my new hostname, $HOSTNAME"
[16:14] <roaksoax> smoser: so my thinking is that negronjl used as 'network address' ubuntu-maas instead of the IP address.
[16:14] <smoser> *and*
[16:14] <smoser> b.) (via dns) my new hostname $HOSTNAME == <IP_ADDRESS>
[16:14] <smoser> what do you mean, roaksoax ?
[16:14] <roaksoax> smoser: since dnsmasq is serving on the localnode, it reads /etc/hosts and founds that ubuntu-maas is <IP_ADDRESS>, and that's why it gets serveed that way
[16:15] <negronjl> smoser, roaksoax: I commented out the offending /etc/hosts entries
[16:15] <smoser> what do you mean " negronjl used as 'network address'"
[16:15] <roaksoax> negronjl: what did you input when you did 'sudo dpkg-reconfigure maas'
[16:15] <smoser> ok..
[16:15] <smoser> so i dont know if that is going to fix your problem
[16:15] <roaksoax> smoser: on sudo dpkg-reconfigure maas, it asks for an IP address which will be the address that it iwll hand out to the clients
[16:15] <negronjl> smoser, roaksoax: dpkg-reconfigure maas =>  I used <IP_ADDRESS> ( my network address )
[16:16] <roaksoax> smoser: that address is set on /etc/maas/maas_local_settings.py
[16:16] <roaksoax> smoser: as DEFAULT_MAAS_URL
[16:16] <negronjl> checking /etc/maas/maas_local_settings.py
[16:16] <smoser> negronjl, so after you make that change
[16:17] <negronjl> that file still says http://ubuntu-maas/
[16:17] <roaksoax> smoser: if, by default, you do not set that in DEFAULT_MAAS_URL, it will try to guess the hostname/ip of the node
[16:17] <roaksoax> negronjl: that's weird
[16:17] <smoser> then the 'url=' parameter that you saw on the kernel command line should serve you data with a new-and-iproved maas_url
[16:17] <roaksoax> negronjl: can you add -x to the postinst script to see what's going on please?
[16:17] <negronjl> I can manually change the DEFAULT_MAAS_URL to the correct value but, It's worth finding out how it got that way to begin with
[16:18] <roaksoax> negronjl: ahhh I see
[16:18] <roaksoax> negronjl: is this a clena install?
[16:20] <negronjl> no idea .. i just got the hardware from the Montreal office
[16:20] <negronjl> so I don't think so
[16:21] <negronjl> smoser, roaksoax: proc_cmdline: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1047565/ 91_kernel_cmdline_url.cfg: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1047566/
[16:21] <roaksoax> negronjl: yeah
[16:21] <roaksoax> negronjl: i know that the issue is
[16:22] <roaksoax> negronjl: so they *manually* edit /etc/maas/maas_local_settings.py to use ubuntu-maas instead of the IP address because I'm guessing they also had some kind of external DNS
[16:22] <negronjl> roaksoax: what should i set that value to then ?
[16:22] <roaksoax> negronjl: the IP address
[16:22] <negronjl> roaksoax: doing it now ...
[16:22] <roaksoax> negronjl: then restart apache
[16:22] <roaksoax> negronjl: and just in case a sudo cobbler sync
[16:22] <smoser> roaksoax, well, one other option.
[16:23] <smoser> is to actually set 'ubuntu-maas' to resolve correcctly
[16:23] <smoser> which should be acheivable via editing /etc/hosts and restating dnsmasq
[16:23] <negronjl> that's what I was thinking
[16:23] <roaksoax> yes
[16:23] <roaksoax> that too
[16:23] <roaksoax> but dpkg-reconfigure maas only accepts IP addresses
[16:23] <smoser> ah
[16:23] <negronjl> roaksoax: I put the right address in dpkg-configure maas
[16:23] <smoser> (well, that is kind of silly, but roaksoax and i have argued about that before)
[16:24] <negronjl> roaksoax: It just did _not_ update the values on maas_local something or other .py
[16:24] <roaksoax> negronjl: yes, but the checking mechasnims checks for a regex that matches an IP address
[16:24] <negronjl> roaksoax: ahh .. I get it now
[16:24] <roaksoax> negronjl: and since DEFAULT_MAAS_URL = ubuntu-maas instead of DEFAULT_MAAS_URL = X.Y.Z.A , then it didn't replace it
[16:24] <negronjl> we need to change it to an IP on maas_local_???.py
[16:25] <roaksoax> negronjl: no if you set the IP in /etc/hosts
[16:25] <roaksoax> (the correct IP)
[16:27] <negronjl> roaksoax: maybe i missed something but, i thought that, when you dpkg-reconfigure maas, there was a regex that would look for an IP ( presumably in /etc/maas/maas_local_settings.py ) and change it ... that would still be broken if I were to leave "ubunt-maas" in /etc/maas/maas_local_settings.py and just have it resolve properly in /etc/hosts
[16:28] <negronjl> that would solve _my_ issue but, it wouldn't solve the root issue ... the regex is not cathing the value to change
[16:29] <negronjl> brb
[16:33] <negronjl> back
[16:34] <roaksoax> negronjl: right, becuase in the first place, there shouldn't be a hostname instead of an IP address. that hostname mas changed manually, not by packaging
[16:34] <roaksoax> negronjl: hence breaking it
[16:35] <negronjl> trying again
[16:36] <roaksoax> negronjl: packaging on a clean install sets an IP address. If we reconfigure, it will be changed correctly. However, since someone manually changed from a IP to a hostname by directly editing the config file, then dpkg-reconfigure does update the value correctly as it checks that an IP address is there
[16:37] <negronjl> roaksoax: I see ... a suggestion would be that, on reconfigure of any kind, ignore what is there and just replace it ... my two cents.
[16:37] <negronjl> roaksoax: but I understand the issue.
[16:37] <negronjl> roaksoax: and it is working correctly now
[16:37] <negronjl> roaksoax, smoser:  Thanks for all of the help.  I'll keep poking at this and hopefully won't need to bother you guys anymore
[16:40] <smoser> roaksoax, if someone edits the config file, then maas should respect that on dpkg-reconfigure
[16:40] <smoser> and if they used a dnsname, it should accept that too
[16:45] <roaksoax> negronjl: yet. could please file a bug? :)
[16:46] <roaksoax> smoser: I agree it should not specifically check for an IP to be set, but IMHO I think we shouldn't rely on DNS
[16:46] <roaksoax> smoser:becuase of the issue we just saw
[16:47] <smoser> well, it did the rigth thing.
[16:47] <smoser> (which was to do what the human told it to)
[16:47] <smoser> its fine to not use dns by default
[16:48] <roaksoax> ack
[16:50] <kurt_> Can you guys tell me if PXE boot from a kvm client to another bridged VM maas server on a separate host is supported?
[16:50] <kurt_> ie. should the kvm client PXE boot from the VM maas on another host?
[16:50] <kurt_> with the current version
[16:51] <kurt_> or is that a bigjools question?
[16:56] <smoser> kurt_, it really just depends on the networking i think.
[16:57] <smoser> i'm not an expert on pxe, but the pxe broadcast must get from the booting-system (or kvm instance, or whatever) to the pxe server, and then the traffic also get back.
[16:57] <kurt_> I have both interfaces bridged and connected via a dedicated switch
[16:57] <kurt_> so they are on the same network
[16:57] <smoser> then i would suspect it to work.
[16:58] <kurt_> but, you think that functionality for PXE boot for kvm is there then?
[16:59] <smoser> well, kvm pxe boot works, yes.
[16:59] <smoser> and if the networking is all set up correctly, then it has no way to *not* work.
[16:59] <smoser> :)
[17:00] <negronjl> smoser, roaksoax: how do I get oath token for juju to work on maas
[17:00] <smoser> i think in th emaas ui somewhere?
[17:01] <smoser> (you cna get it from the DB for your user-id)
[17:01] <negronjl> smoser: thx
[17:02] <smoser> kurt_, did i answer your question?
[17:02] <kurt_> yes, mostly…but I wasn't able to get it to work before...
[17:02] <kurt_> bigjools was having me look at vender?
[17:03] <kurt_> vendev
[17:03] <kurt_> or something like this?
[17:03] <kurt_> I was wondering why he had me going down this path - what advantage it had over straight PXE boot
[18:40] <negronjl> I have each node ( the HP microservers ) enabled for WoL, I also have them as WoL at the maas-server but they don't start up .... am I missing anything here
[18:40] <negronjl> ?
[18:42] <negronjl> smoser, Daviey, roaksoax ^^
[18:43] <smoser> you are missing something
[18:44] <smoser> specifically https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ifupdown/+bug/981461
[18:44] <smoser> wake on lan on those is not reliable unless you're really nice to the driver.
[18:46] <negronjl> smoser:  this demo will not be very impressive at all
[18:46] <smoser> you just have to be really nice, negronjl
[18:46] <negronjl> smoser: I will have to "juju bootstrap"  then, find out which machine has been allocated to it and power that machine on ...
[18:47] <smoser> in the happy path, everything is fine. Daviey or roaksoax might remember more details
[18:47] <negronjl> smoser: thx
[18:48]  * smoser wonders if negronjl was being sincere in his 'thx'
[18:48] <smoser> in the purely happy path, though, i think it is fine. but if you ever are in the point where you're hard power-offing a mchine, it ends up foobarred.
[18:49] <negronjl> smoser: of course ... it's all data that's needed ... not very happy data but, data nonetheless
[18:49] <smoser> its not actually terribly odd for wakeonlan to not really be reliable.
[18:51] <roaksoax> negronjl: they didn't get you the pdu?
[18:51] <roaksoax> i thought they were getting one
[18:51] <negronjl> i do have a pdu
[18:52] <negronjl> actually ... I have two ... none of them arrived in working condition
[18:53] <roaksoax> really? I'm thinking that 1 might be the one that didn't work at all
[18:53] <roaksoax> the other one is the new one that should be working
[18:53] <roaksoax> negronjl: you will have to configure it though
[18:53] <roaksoax> negronjl: and can't you just do this? juju bootstrap --constraints maas-name=natty
[18:54] <negronjl> i have tried with them all ... WoL is not happening
[18:55] <roaksoax> negronjl: there's a process for wol to work. 1. manually start machine and let it enlist. 2. Accept & Commission and manually start the machine and let it commission
[18:55] <negronjl> Have you guys tried the workaround on bug 981461
[18:55] <roaksoax> negronjl: 3. juju deploy will now work
[18:55] <roaksoax> err wol will now work
[18:56] <negronjl> roaksoax: i did 1 and 2 ... the machines now show up as ready
[18:56] <negronjl> but, when I try juju bootstrap ... nothing happens
[18:57] <roaksoax> negronjl: pastebin /etc/cobbler/power/power_ether_wake.template
[18:57] <negronjl> k .... give me just a sec
[18:59] <negronjl> roaksoax: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1047848/
[19:00] <roaksoax> negronjl: is that the network you are using? /usr/bin/powerwake -b <IP_ADDRESS> "$power_address"
[19:01] <negronjl> roaksoax: yes .. that is the broadcast address ( <IP_ADDRESS>/24 )
[19:02] <roaksoax> negronjl: what if you manually try to WoL a server?
[19:02] <negronjl> roaksoax: give me a command and I'll run it.
[19:02] <roaksoax> negronjl: powerwake -B <IP_ADDRESS> <MAC> of one of the ready servers
[19:02] <negronjl> roaksoax: trying
[19:03] <roaksoax> negronjl: melmoth and alexmoldovan had the same issue last week and the "solutions" above fixed the issue. (allowing them to shutdown cleanly without disconnecting them from the power outlet at all)
[19:04] <negronjl> roaksoax: I'll try that too ... I'll report back in a few minutes ... I also have the Ubuntu Contributing Developer meeting now.
[19:04] <roaksoax> k
[19:40] <burnbrighter> negronjl: out of curiosity, why are you sending to the broadcast address - won't that broadcast that command to all nodes? I don't understand the purpose.
[19:42] <negronjl> burnbrighter: not an expert on this but, the magic packet goes out on the wire and the mac address ( included in the command ) will the pick it up and _turn itself on_
[19:43] <burnbrighter> right, but don't you want to direct it to the right IP addr?
[19:45] <negronjl> burnbrighter: i _think_ it works by putting the packet on broadcast ... haven't seen it done by direct ip
[19:50] <lifeless> burnbrighter: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wake-on-LAN#Magic_packet
[19:50] <burnbrighter> kk, thnx
[19:50] <lifeless> can't use IP
[19:51] <lifeless> IP isn't available for a powered off machine that uses DHCP, because it isn't holding a lease.
[19:51] <burnbrighter> gotcha, thnx for the clarification
[19:56] <negronjl> we need a better solution for the WoL thing ... is this an HP issue ?
[19:57] <lifeless> negronjl: have you spoken to daviey or the folk that helped mark with this setup ?
[19:58] <lifeless> negronjl: I'm worried that we're getting close to the wire, when the setup *was* working :(
[20:00] <negronjl> lifeless: I have ... I have random and intermittent issues ... it may work now and it may not .... frustrating
[20:00] <negronjl> lifeless: at this point, I am trying to get the WoL part done so I can move on to the juju part of this.
[20:03] <lifeless> negronjl: cool; let me know if you need more help from $wherever.
[20:04] <lifeless> negronjl: I presume it needed a rebuild / reconfiguration or some such ?
[20:05] <roaksoax> burnbrighter: the reasing why the  -B BCAST.address was added is because if the server has multiple network interfaces, it won't send the WoL packets through the right interface
[20:05] <negronjl> lifeless: I'm not even sure what it needs at this point.
[20:05]  * negronjl feels like a good kick is in order :)
[20:06] <roaksoax> negronjl: your best bet would try to make one of those PDU's work
[20:08] <negronjl> roaksoax: forgive me if this is a stupid question but, how would a pdu help me whith WoL
[20:08] <negronjl> s/within/with
[20:08] <roaksoax> negronjl: i meant your best bet would try to make use of the PDU so you don't worry about WoL
[20:09] <roaksoax> as WoL is unreliable
[20:09] <negronjl> roaksoax: will MaaS be able to control the PDU ?
[20:09] <roaksoax> negronjl: MAAS does not control anything in power, cobbler does
[20:10] <roaksoax> negronjl: but yes, is it an APC PDU?
[20:10] <roaksoax> it is just matter of doing a couple minor changes
[20:10] <roaksoax> negronjl: making use of a fence-agent to contorl the PDU in cobbler would be relatively easy
[20:13] <negronjl> roaksoax:  it is APC PDU
[20:14] <roaksoax> negronjl: so yeah, should be fairly easy to use with a fence-agent (from fence-agents package)
[20:15] <roaksoax> negronjl: it will just telnet the APC PDU telling it "turn on outleat where machine 'oneiric' is"
[20:16] <burnbrighter> roaksoax: is not cobbler going away.  Bigjools is making that happen now?
[20:16] <roaksoax> burnbrighter: it is
[20:16] <roaksoax> burnbrighter: the current version still uses a subset of cobbler
[20:16] <roaksoax> err, a few pieces of cobbler
[20:16] <burnbrighter> kk
[20:17] <negronjl> roaksoax: Let me try to set up the PDU first ... if the process is simple enough, would you help me out with it
[20:19] <roaksoax> negronjl: yes, of course
[20:23] <negronjl> gotta go get some food ... I'll be back in a minute
[20:28] <roaksoax> k
[21:18]  * negronjl is back
[21:18] <negronjl> trying one last time the whole WoL thing.
[21:38] <negronjl> roaksoax: if you're around .... I'll take you up on the pdu thing for maas
[21:40] <negronjl> lifeless: you around ?
[21:40] <roaksoax> negronjl: is it configured?
[21:40] <negronjl> roaksoax: all nodes are ready
[21:40] <negronjl> roaksoax: is what configured ?
[21:40] <roaksoax> negronjl: pdu
[21:41] <negronjl> roaksoax: no
[21:41] <negronjl> roaksoax: didn't want to do anything without talking with you first
[21:41] <negronjl> roaksoax: should I flush the entire environment or, is it ok to leave the nodes as they are ( Ready )
[21:42] <lifeless> negronjl: hi, yes, OTP just now, whats up ?
[21:42] <roaksoax> negronjl: leave them as they are for now. Get the PDU configured first and make sure it is in working condition
[21:42] <negronjl> lifeless: nm ... roaksoax is helping me.
[21:42] <negronjl> roaksoax: ok ... I'll ping you when done ...
[21:42] <roaksoax> negronjl: and that you can assign the outlets to specific machines
[21:43] <roaksoax> negronjl: so just for now, assign 1 outlet and call it the same name what a node in maas would be called
[21:43] <roaksoax> i.e. oneiric
[21:44] <negronjl> roaksoax: got it
[21:44] <roaksoax> negronjl: and in the meantime, sudo apt-get install fence-agents
[21:47] <roaksoax> and the command to turn on the oulet would be something like: fence_apc  -a <IP of APC> -l <user> -p <password> -n <name of outlet, or outlet ID> -o on
[21:54] <negronjl> lborda: are both of the PDUs working ?
[21:54] <lborda> negronjl, no
[21:54] <negronjl> lborda: want to make sure that I don't spin my wheels on a PDU that may not be working
[21:54] <lborda> negronjl, one is broken
[21:55] <negronjl> lborda: hmmm... why ship it then
[21:55] <negronjl> lborda:  ok
[21:55] <lborda> negronjl, no idea, I told them not to ship... :P
[21:55] <negronjl> lborda: the one that needs the adapter ... is that the one that works ?
[21:55] <lborda> negronjl, yes
[21:56] <negronjl> lborda: ok .. let's see if i can get the adapter on it ... it'b being difficult
[21:57] <lborda> negronjl, yeah... good luck
[21:58] <lborda> negronjl, we got the pdu with no adapter... do you have one?
[21:58] <negronjl> lborda: now I'm confused ...
[21:59] <negronjl> lborda:  There is a PDU with a label that say "Broken PDU" ... that one ( oddly enough ) requires no adapter for me to use
[21:59] <negronjl> lborda: the other one requires a power adapter ( it's a locking plug ).  There is an adapter here but, it doesn't fit.
[22:00] <negronjl> lborda:  Do you have any idea which one of these PDUs is the "good" one ?
[22:00] <lborda> lborda, the "broken pdu" is broken
[22:00] <negronjl> lborda: ok
[22:00] <negronjl> lborda: ... and I don't have an adapter for the "good" one.
[22:00] <negronjl> so ... no PDU then .
[22:01] <negronjl> ... and WoL is not working either ... this is just GREAT :(
[22:02] <negronjl> roaksoax: You had mentioned that there is a process by which this works.  Here is what I have done so far ( in case I am just doing this wrong ): ...
[22:02] <negronjl> - Turn machines on.
[22:02] <negronjl> - They show up on Maas Web UI as Declared
[22:02] <negronjl> - Edit the node ( change power to Wake on LAN )
[22:02] <negronjl> - Accept and Commit
[22:02] <negronjl> ---- machines do their thing and shut down
[22:02] <negronjl> - They show up as "Ready" on the MaaS Web UI
[22:03] <negronjl> roaksoax: Is that the right thing to do so far ?
[22:04] <roaksoax> negronjl: they have WoL working by defaulkt, you do not have to manually tell them so
[22:08] <negronjl> roaksoax: ok ... noted ....
[22:08] <negronjl> roaksoax: now what should I be doing ...
[22:09] <negronjl> roaksoax: I tried going to the maas ui, getting the token, putting it in envirnonments.yaml and juju bootstrap
[22:09] <negronjl> roaksoax: juju bootstrap --constraints maas-name=quantal ( my node 1 )
[22:09] <negronjl> roaksoax: according to maas, the unit get allocated to admin ( my username ) but, WoL doesn't do anything.
[22:10] <negronjl> roaksoax: if I turn the machine on manually that doesn't get me any further ... juju status still hangs.
[22:10] <negronjl> roaksoax: atm I am trying again without telling maas that the nodes are WoL ... unless you have any suggestions
[22:11] <roaksoax> negronjl: ok so isn't quantal deploying?
[22:11] <roaksoax> negronjl: it needs to install ubuntu, install juju, etc etc
[22:12] <negronjl> roaksoax: let me try this again.
[22:12] <negronjl> roaksoax: once the machines are in "Ready" status ... should I be doing anything else ?
[22:13] <roaksoax> negronjl: when a machine is in ready status it is ready to use, they do not have ubuntu on them
[22:13] <roaksoax> negronjl: so if youjuju deploy, it will take time for it to install ubuntu on it
[22:13] <negronjl> roaksoax: ok ...
[22:13] <roaksoax> after it installs, it will reboot
[22:13] <roaksoax> and continue the process as if it was a cloud image for juju purposes
[22:14] <negronjl> roaksoax: when i juju deploy --constraints maas-name=quantal the node doesn't WoL ... I have to start it up manually
[22:14] <roaksoax> that is, install juju and appropriate deps, use a charm (in case of deployment) etc
[22:14] <negronjl> roaksoax: I will see if it deploys ( even without WoL )
[22:14] <roaksoax> negronjl: ok, so that means that the machine probably wasn't shutdown cleanly
[22:15] <negronjl> roaksoax: k... how do we shut these down cleanly
[22:15] <negronjl> roaksoax: I can't log into them
[22:16] <roaksoax> negronjl: add an SSH key in juju
[22:16] <roaksoax> and you'll have to deploy again
[22:16] <roaksoax> err
[22:16] <roaksoax> SSH key in MAAS
[22:17] <negronjl> trying that ...
[22:17] <negronjl> roaksoax: am I supposed to add the SSH key _before_ I accept & commission the machines or can I do it now that the machines are "Ready"
[22:19] <roaksoax> negronjl: i can't recall TBH, as there was a bug on it, but for you to not do that, edit "/var/lib/cobbler/kicstarts/maas.preseed"
[22:19] <roaksoax> negronjl: and set a password there
[22:19] <roaksoax> for the ubuntu user
[22:20] <negronjl> roaksoax: ok ... doing that
[22:21] <negronjl> roaksoax: done ... should I cobbler sync ??
[22:22] <roaksoax> nope, not necessary
[22:22] <negronjl> roaksoax: ok ... trying this thing again ...
[22:23] <roaksoax> it will take time to deploy though
[22:23] <negronjl> roaksoax: k.  I have a monitor/keyboard attached to the node so I can see if it fails anywhere
[22:36] <roaksoax> negronjl: ok cool
[22:37] <roaksoax> brb
[22:59] <negronjl> roaksoax: the PDU is out of the question now ... I'll keep working on this and will ping you back when I get stuck again ( which I'm sure will be soon ).