[01:36] <Hobbsee_> @now sydney
[01:36] <Ubugtu> Current time in Australia/Sydney: September 27 2006, 21:36:41 - Next meeting: Edubuntu in 8 hours 23 minutes
[01:45] <fabbione> @schedule Rome
[01:45] <Ubugtu> Schedule for Europe/Rome: 27 Sep 22:00: Edubuntu | 29 Sep 01:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 29 Sep 18:00: Ubuntu Desktop Effects Team | 03 Oct 19:00: Community Council | 04 Oct 14:00: Edubuntu | 05 Oct 09:00: Ubuntu Development Team
[01:45] <fabbione> hmm something is wrong
[01:45] <fabbione> shouldn't the Devel meeting be the 28th?
[01:45] <flint> @now
[01:45] <Ubugtu> Current time in Etc/UTC: September 27 2006, 11:45:54 - Next meeting: Edubuntu in 8 hours 14 minutes
[01:46] <Fujitsu> @schedule
[01:46] <Ubugtu> Schedule for Etc/UTC: 27 Sep 20:00: Edubuntu | 28 Sep 23:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 29 Sep 16:00: Ubuntu Desktop Effects Team | 03 Oct 17:00: Community Council | 04 Oct 12:00: Edubuntu | 05 Oct 07:00: Ubuntu Development Team
[01:46] <fabbione> hey flint !
[01:46] <Fujitsu> fabbione, there.
[01:46] <Fujitsu> fabbione, you're just in a silly timezone.
[01:47] <fabbione> hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
[05:53] <zul> @schedule montreal
[05:53] <Ubugtu> Schedule for America/Montreal: 27 Sep 16:00: Edubuntu | 28 Sep 19:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 29 Sep 12:00: Ubuntu Desktop Effects Team | 03 Oct 13:00: Community Council | 04 Oct 08:00: Edubuntu | 05 Oct 03:00: Ubuntu Development Team
[06:59] <rodarvus> @schedule Sao_Paulo
[06:59] <Ubugtu> Schedule for America/Sao_Paulo: 27 Sep 17:00: Edubuntu | 28 Sep 20:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 29 Sep 13:00: Ubuntu Desktop Effects Team | 03 Oct 14:00: Community Council | 04 Oct 09:00: Edubuntu | 05 Oct 04:00: Ubuntu Development Team
[07:36] <sharms> @schedule Chicago
[07:36] <Ubugtu> Schedule for America/Chicago: 27 Sep 15:00: Edubuntu | 28 Sep 18:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 29 Sep 11:00: Ubuntu Desktop Effects Team | 03 Oct 12:00: Community Council | 04 Oct 07:00: Edubuntu | 05 Oct 02:00: Ubuntu Development Team
[08:12] <lguerra> @calendar Bogota
[08:12] <lfittl> @schedule vienna
[08:12] <Ubugtu> Schedule for Europe/Vienna: 27 Sep 22:00: Edubuntu | 29 Sep 18:00: Ubuntu Desktop Effects Team | 03 Oct 19:00: Community Council | 04 Oct 14:00: Edubuntu | 05 Oct 09:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 10 Oct 22:00: Technical Board
[08:13] <lguerra> @schedule bogota
[08:13] <Ubugtu> Schedule for America/Bogota: 27 Sep 15:00: Edubuntu | 29 Sep 11:00: Ubuntu Desktop Effects Team | 03 Oct 12:00: Community Council | 04 Oct 07:00: Edubuntu | 05 Oct 02:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 10 Oct 15:00: Technical Board
[09:53] <sbalneav> Present
[09:59] <ogra> past
[09:59] <sbalneav> Future ahoy!
[09:59] <ogra> :)
[10:00] <rodarvus> hi there
[10:00] <ogra> so do we want to start ?
[10:01] <AliasVegas> Hi rodarvus
[10:01] <cbx33> hey RichEd
[10:01] <RichEd> hello all
[10:01] <RichEd> hey cbx33 :)
[10:01] <willvdl> Hey cbx33
[10:01] <sbalneav> Is hedgemage going to be here?
[10:01] <cbx33> I hope so
[10:01] <rodarvus> hii AliasVegas!
[10:01] <ajmitch> ooh, edubuntu
[10:02] <cbx33> hehe
[10:02] <rodarvus> (double "i" on "hii" accidental ;) )
[10:02] <willvdl> Amaranth, you can't hide from us!
[10:02] <cbx33> does it mean something different ?
[10:02] <cbx33> :p
[10:02] <willvdl> only if you have hiccups
[10:03] <cbx33> willvdl, heheh
[10:03] <ogra> sooo
[10:03] <cbx33> beta ready?
[10:03] <ogra> tech :
[10:03] <ogra> beta still in testing ...
[10:04] <ogra> i386 is golden ... apart from a bug that hangs the machine on reboots instead of restarting it properly
[10:04] <Amaranth> heh, really "golden" :)
[10:04] <cbx33> oh
[10:04] <ogra> but that might also be my amd64
[10:04] <cbx33> ogra, want me to check it out in a VM?
[10:04] <ogra> i have no real i386 around so i hope to get some more results on that bug from someone else
[10:04] <cbx33> I can start the download now if you want?
[10:04] <Amaranth> a vm is the worst place to test a potential hardware bug, it's too clean
[10:05] <ogra> powerpc finally finished rsyncing ... i'll start testing after the meeting
[10:05] <cbx33> Amaranth, true
[10:05] <ogra> amd64 the same
[10:05] <cbx33> I could possibly test on my lappie tomorrow
[10:05] <ogra> but all in all its looking very good
[10:05] <cbx33> excellent
[10:05] <ogra> actually its the first release that achieves all goals i had set myself when i started with edubuntu
[10:05] <lucasvo> hi
[10:05] <ogra> it doesnt need to hide from k12ltsp ;)
[10:05] <rodarvus> unless the bug is due to bootsplash (ie, not hardware related) it is hard to even get it on some/most i386
[10:06] <AliasVegas> hi lucasvo
[10:06] <ogra> it worked with the builds i tested with the -8 kernel
[10:06] <ogra> currently we are at -10
[10:06] <ogra> so i suspect an acpi/kernel bug
[10:06] <cbx33> ahhh
[10:06] <cbx33> would make sense
[10:06] <rodarvus> s/hardware/kernel/ on my last sentence (thinko)
[10:07] <Amaranth> -7 and -8 are the last versions that work for a lot of people on the forums, i wouldn't be surprised
[10:07] <ogra> apart from that all autoconfig is working fine ... if you install on a machine with two network cards you have a running edubuntu ltsp server after 1h with no manual work involved
[10:07] <Amaranth> ogra: hawt
[10:07] <ogra> even my mother could install it ;)
[10:07] <Amaranth> Why does it take an hour? :)
[10:07] <ogra> including printing on clients, local devices, sound etc
[10:08] <ogra> because the installer takes that long
[10:08] <cbx33> because it's so awesome you sit in awe for 30 mins ;)
[10:08] <Amaranth> daaamn
[10:08] <Amaranth> I guess I'm spoiled by the ubuntu desktop cd
[10:08] <ogra> 45mins for a usual ubuntu alternate install ... 10 mins for the ltsp setup
[10:08] <Amaranth> 20 minutes from boot to done :)
[10:08] <pips1> hi all
[10:08] <LaserJock> Amaranth: heh, it's like 2hr on my computer
[10:08] <ogra> yes, the desktop CDs are way faster
[10:09] <RichEd> hi pips1 :) thanks for the mail earlier today ...
[10:09] <cbx33> it was less than an hour on my new machine ;)
[10:09] <ogra> i'll look into the possibility of using the liveCD in edgy+1
[10:09] <Amaranth> edubuntu is really exciting  now :)
[10:09] <ogra> there are some options you can use for nfs to make it work with unionfs ...
[10:09] <ogra> so it might move into the range of possibilities
[10:09] <ollis> just wanted to say thanks to you guys; lab up an running in 2hours; great on old machines
[10:09] <ogra> i.e. liveCD with running ltsp server ...
[10:10] <ogra> ollis, thats good news :)
[10:10] <ogra> so all i can say ... test test test guys !
[10:10] <ogra> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/current/
[10:10] <ogra> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily-live/current/
[10:10] <lucasvo> will do
[10:10] <ogra> and note results here
[10:11] <ogra> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Current?action=show
[10:11] <ogra> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Current indeed
[10:11] <cbx33> ogra, will do
[10:11] <ogra> thast all from the tech side for now ... next week we should start discussing the edgy+1 specs
[10:12] <ogra> especially the liveCDs need testing ... my isos are heavily otdated and i have bandwidth probs over here
[10:12] <ogra> i have all install isos around now and wont go to sleep before i'm done with them all
[10:12] <LaserJock> I think it's also worth mentioniing cbx33's MOTU ship
[10:12] <cbx33> I'll try and test one tomorrow
[10:13] <ogra> oh, right
[10:13] <ogra> cbx33 is a motu now ;)
[10:13] <ogra> approved in yesterdays TB meeting
[10:13] <rodarvus> \o/
[10:13] <cbx33> yup was touch and go fro a while
[10:13] <ogra> cbx33, make sure thats mentioned in te meeting notes ;)
[10:13] <cbx33> ok will do
[10:13] <cbx33> I hope to have those done tomorrow this time round
[10:14] <ogra> take your time ... testing isos is more important ;)
[10:14] <cbx33> ok
[10:14] <ogra> we'll release beta tomorrow during the day
[10:14] <cbx33> I'll download live now, well after 10pm and then test tomorrow morning
[10:14] <LaserJock> ogra: any pressing non-LTSP issues that MOTU or core-dev wannabes can look at?
[10:14] <ogra> thats the time every iso should have been installed at least once
[10:14] <ogra> heh
[10:15] <ogra> someone could fix gnome-screensaver for me :)
[10:15] <ogra> no, not really ... at least i'm not aware of any
[10:15] <rodarvus> oh, I also have many bugs worth looking at! :D
[10:15] <cbx33> what's up with it?
[10:15] <rodarvus> if you're looking for fun
[10:15] <ogra> do we have any bugs on the edubuntu-bugs team list ?
[10:15] <rodarvus> not edubuntu bugs in my case, though
[10:16] <cbx33> heheh
[10:16] <ogra> cbx33, its giving me headaches :) i'll try to get rid of it in edgy+1
[10:16] <cbx33> ah ok np
[10:16] <ogra> i was always the screensaver/power-manager guy ...
[10:16] <cbx33> heheh
[10:16] <ogra> but both packages havent seen much love from my side this release ... simply because time was so short
[10:17] <cbx33> C?
[10:17] <ogra> and mdz wasnt happy about my bugcount last release already
[10:17] <ogra> if i cant cope with it i need to hand it over to someone
[10:18] <ogra> power-management is a critical part  ... it deserves someone with some time for it
[10:18] <cbx33> ogra, I'd offer to take that up
[10:18] <willvdl> and is a dark art to my mind
[10:18] <cbx33> but I know little about it at the moment
[10:18] <ogra> (not that i suspect to have as much to do next release, since we have 6 months again)
[10:19] <rodarvus> edgy was a bit hectic on this regard - the release cycle was even shorter than usual
[10:19] <cbx33> ogra, that's true
[10:19] <ogra> edgy was surely the release that got the biggest development bump in edzbuntu and ltsp yet
[10:19] <rodarvus> and a huge flux of new features was expected
[10:19] <cbx33> ogra, totally
[10:19] <ogra> but it was also the shortest one we ever did
[10:19] <cbx33> well if you guys want a hand with anything next releease instead of me looking for things to do
[10:19] <rodarvus> (but its 'edgy' after all)
[10:19] <cbx33> just shout
[10:19] <ogra> cbx33, would be nice if we could get perfection into SCP ;)
[10:20] <cbx33> ogra, it's on my To Do list
[10:20] <ogra> to make it *the* preferred admin tool at some point
[10:20] <cbx33> with 6 months I should have much more time
[10:20] <ogra> yeah
[10:20] <cbx33> w00t
[10:20] <cbx33> and I'll start earlier
[10:20] <ogra> and i expect to have some nice specs next release ...
[10:20] <cbx33> ooooh
[10:20] <ogra> more detailed than just "finish the carp"
[10:21] <LaserJock> yeah, I'm excited about the edgy+1 specs
[10:21] <cbx33> all laid out for you
[10:21] <cbx33> ;)
[10:21] <ogra> yep
[10:21] <cbx33> it's gonna be fun
[10:21] <cbx33> hope i get to UDS
[10:21] <ogra> but lest keep that for next release
[10:21] <ogra> we'll likely know next week ...
[10:21] <ogra> (who is coming etc)
[10:21] <cbx33> yeh monday apparently
[10:22] <cbx33> I overheard ajmitch and sabdfl talking yesterdya :p
[10:22] <ogra> so that should give us some time to focus on the preparation
[10:22] <rodarvus> will be nice to have this time in advance to prepare for UDS
[10:22] <ogra> right
[10:22] <rodarvus> I'll likely take the next two or three weeks preparing for UDS
[10:22] <ogra> i will likely be travelling from end of oct already ...
[10:22] <rodarvus> instead of the one or two days I had for UDS Paris :P
[10:22] <cbx33> phew always on the go eh ogra
[10:23] <ogra> and it seems i wont get home for the whole november
[10:23] <ogra> cbx33, yes, sadly :(
[10:23] <Amaranth> monday?
[10:23] <cbx33> ogra, :(
[10:23] <Amaranth> woo, the suspense is already killing me :)
[10:23] <ogra> it gets to much travelling for my taste ... but i cant help it ...
[10:24] <ogra> i'm invited by the skolelinux people to hold a talk and talk about collaboration on the weekend of oct 15th btw ...
[10:24] <LaserJock> ogra's the Edubuntu super star
[10:24] <ogra> RichEd, ^^^^
[10:24] <cbx33> I'm hoping to pop up to the linux conf in london after UDS
[10:24] <RichEd> great ...
[10:24] <ogra> the have their development lab ~300km from me
[10:24] <RichEd> that's the german branch ?
[10:25] <rodarvus> Amaranth, did you apply for sponsorhip? (couldn't find your nick on the wiki page)
[10:25] <LaserJock> ogra: is that debian jr. or debian edu?
[10:25] <mjg59> cbx33: Which linux conf in London?
[10:25] <Amaranth> rodarvus: yeah
[10:25] <ogra> and wanted me last year already, but it clashed with release
[10:25] <Amaranth> rodarvus: Travis Watkins, last one on the list
[10:25] <rodarvus> ah!
[10:25] <ogra> LaserJock, skolelinux
[10:25] <cbx33> the big one
[10:25] <ogra> the greman branch
[10:25] <cbx33> 25-26ths isnt it?
[10:25] <ogra> *german
[10:25] <rodarvus> I expected to find an email with 'amaranth' on it :)
[10:25] <Amaranth> hehe
[10:25] <mjg59> cbx33: October - that's before UDS, isn't it?
[10:25] <cbx33> oh yeh
[10:25] <cbx33> of coruse
[10:25] <cbx33> silly me
[10:25] <cbx33> I keep getting these months mixed up
[10:26] <sivang> cbx33: which linux conf in london ?
[10:26] <LaserJock> ogra: but aren't don't they come from a CDD? maybe not
[10:26] <mjg59> sivang: Linuxworldexpolala
[10:26] <RichEd> good stuff ogra : we must nework with Knut to see if we can help with more / wider relationship
[10:26] <RichEd> *network
[10:26] <ogra> LaserJock, they are a CDD of debian-edu
[10:26] <ogra> RichEd, right
[10:26] <sivang> mjg59: ohh, I should have know then I would have prepare my vacation properly, but then gf would have killed me ;-)
[10:26] <pips1> sorry, I missed the beginning of the meeting... when is beta release exactly ? (what time?) until when do we have to test the cds?
[10:26] <sbalneav> I can speak a bit to the handbook when the time comes.
[10:27] <RichEd> ogra: I'll send you his recent mail .. he had a wish list for us
[10:27] <cbx33> http://www.linuxworldexpo.co.uk/
[10:27] <ogra> sivang, i know how that feels ... i get killed frequently here
[10:27] <sivang> ogra: heh
[10:27] <ogra> RichEd, great
[10:27] <ogra> right, lets get back on track
[10:27] <ogra> DOCUMENTATION !
[10:27] <ogra> scottie
[10:27] <rodarvus> pips1, beta release is as soon as its finished. its well underway for a few days
[10:27] <ogra> tell us about your plans :)
[10:28] <rodarvus> (beta freeze is in place since last developers meeting, actually)
[10:28] <ogra> pips1, we try to release tomorrow ...
[10:28] <lucasvo> hi pips1
[10:28] <sbalneav> Well, about 3 weeks ago, I offered to HedgeMage to update/improve the LTSP section of the handbook.
[10:28] <ogra> i cant tell any time
[10:28] <ogra> everybody listen to sbalneav :)
[10:28] <cbx33> I'm listening
[10:28] <pips1> hi lucasvo
[10:29] <sbalneav> I asked jammcq, who offered to let us yank whatever was relevant from his 40+ pages of docs on ltsp.org
[10:29] <ogra> sbalneav, did you go through whats already there ?
[10:29] <sbalneav> w/ attribution, of course.
[10:29] <sbalneav> ogra: Yes, fixed up some of it.
[10:29] <ogra> (on our side i mean)
[10:29] <ogra> cool !
[10:29] <sbalneav> I'm in the process of updating the stuff.  I've got the "Theory of operation" section 1/2 done, and when ogra gets a bit of time....
[10:30] <sbalneav> I'll fully document all the lts.conf entries.
[10:30] <ogra> sbalneav, you know that we have an offer from a german group that would like to translate and release a printed version (for bookstores) ?
[10:30] <cbx33> sbalneav, if you need a proofer
[10:30] <cbx33> just ask
[10:30] <sbalneav> The ltsp section has tripled in size in the last 2 weeks.
[10:30] <ogra> they are just waiting for my go
[10:30] <ogra> WOW !
[10:31] <sbalneav> I can easily add more.  Now that most of the code stuff is done, I'm planning on put about 2 hours/day work on it.
[10:31] <ogra> yeah
[10:31] <ogra> there is a bunch
[10:31] <Amaranth> sbalneav: Rock!
[10:31] <sbalneav> But that's only the ltsp section of the book, you'd have to ask hedgemage for progress on the rest.
[10:31] <ogra> sbalneav, WOW ... not to say WOW !!!
[10:31] <ogra> right
[10:32] <ogra> we'll need docs for things like student-control-panel
[10:32] <cbx33> ogra, I'm going to work on those
[10:32] <ogra> and probably steal some parts from the ubuntu documentation
[10:32] <ogra> for the general stuff
[10:32] <rodarvus> how active is documentation on Ubuntu?
[10:32] <LaserJock> the edubuntu section of the doc team repo is still pretty scarce
[10:33] <LaserJock> I'd like to get stuff in there
[10:33] <ogra> even i'd like to just use that ubuntu parts, we'll get space probs if we ship two big -doc packages
[10:33] <pips1> what about documentation that goes onto the installer cds? (firefox greeting page? desktop help text (yelp)?)
[10:33] <ogra> right, that needs updates
[10:33] <sbalneav> At the moment, we're working off of hedgemages svn repo, and when it's done, it'll all be submitted to the master bzr doco repo.
[10:33] <ogra> but for the ff age bumping the version number is enough worst case
[10:34] <ogra> *page
[10:34] <LaserJock> well, the doc team hasn't heard anything from Edubuntu for a while, it'd be nice to see a little activity there
[10:34] <ogra> i can do that last day with the last CD build if we dont get anything better ...
[10:34] <ogra> yes
[10:35] <cbx33> willvdl, anything further on ESA?
[10:36] <willvdl> not yet. I'm out of town on NEPAD stuff at the mo
[10:36] <cbx33> ah ok
[10:36] <RichEd> cbx33: I can give you some other supporting info ...
[10:36] <cbx33> RichEd, that's fine....just I rmember you saying it was quite a tight deadline
[10:36] <willvdl> I do think we need to look closely at what happens with larger edubuntu advocacy etc.
[10:37] <cbx33> wondering when I will start having to put the hours in ;)
[10:37] <willvdl> that's the spirit :)
[10:37] <RichEd> ChrisK (Business Development) and Christina (MARketying) have promised some completed case studies this coming week. So the tempalte doc moves from a mock up to a reality.
[10:38] <willvdl> RichEd, do they have a case study template?
[10:38] <RichEd> So we will try to piggy back off their momentum.
[10:39] <RichEd> The one ChrisK showed you ... I've forwarded it on to you now ?
[10:39] <sbalneav> ogra: getting close to the end of the day for you.  Why don't I get a rough draft of the lts.conf doco together tonight, you can yelp the xml file tomorrow, and let me know what I'm either missing, or have mistakenly included.
[10:39] <willvdl> okie. terminology error on my part
[10:39] <ogra> me, yelp ???
[10:39] <sbalneav> yeah, the help browser
[10:39] <ogra> sbalneav, i'm doing a beta release tomorrow :)
[10:39] <RichEd> We should have a real populated one from them and not just a template in the next week or so.
[10:39] <sbalneav> ok, later in the week then :)
[10:40] <ogra> we ca go through the lts.conf parameters after the meeting
[10:40] <ogra> *can
[10:40] <sbalneav> Ah, k, if you've got the time.
[10:40] <ogra> i can do ppc testing aside ...
[10:40] <RichEd> I'll keep probing them for any actual print runs.
[10:40] <willvdl> ok, that's good news.
[10:40] <ogra> i only need this lappie for amd64 tests later this night
[10:40] <willvdl> cbx33, with that we can get artwork going nicely in the print version
[10:40] <ogra> but i have not much clue about the yelp xml format ...
[10:41] <ogra> jsgotangco would be our man there
[10:41] <ogra> or probably LaserJock
[10:41] <willvdl> and populate with info from what is there already
[10:41] <cbx33> willvdl, yup
[10:41] <sbalneav> no worries, we'll go it in irc.
[10:42] <willvdl> will also have use cases by then, or at least a template mockup
[10:43] <pips1> ogra: I got A) amd64, B) powerpc G5 and C) i386 hardware, what are the priorities for testing?
[10:44] <ogra> pips1, two NICs would be good
[10:44] <pips1> ok
[10:44] <pips1> amd64 then
[10:44] <ogra> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuKnot3LTSPTesting has a list of things to test
[10:45] <ogra> you can keep your dhcp server on the router running now ;)
[10:45] <ogra> but attach the thin clients to the second NIC
[10:45] <cbx33> ogra did you want to add to that page about the SCP bugs
[10:45] <lucasvo> ogra: btw, what if one has 3 nics?
[10:45] <pips1> \o/
[10:45] <ogra> you get a selection menu
[10:45] <lucasvo> nice
[10:45] <ogra> (that needs some improvement though)
[10:45] <lucasvo> I'll try to test tomorrow
[10:45] <ogra> keep the names of the devices in mind from the first network page in the installer
[10:46] <ogra> it oly asks about ethX, no name attached ...
[10:46] <lucasvo> it's kinda hard to determin which one is which. because they are the same model
[10:46] <ogra> the first installer net page actually says ethX (broadcom blah)
[10:46] <ogra> just keep in mind which you select in the first page ...
[10:47] <ogra> it will only offer unused devices
[10:47] <ogra> (in the second)
[10:48] <ogra> so, are we done with docs ?
[10:48] <cbx33> sounds like it
[10:49] <willvdl> bit of both
[10:49] <ogra> ok, lets keep it fr community then if someone has to say something about it
[10:50] <cbx33> ok
[10:50] <pips1> well, the current website is mostly doc, but the new website will be mostly community :)
[10:50] <ogra> artwork ...
[10:50] <RichEd> well there is technical documentation and information documentation ... maybe we should split the agenda point for future ?
[10:50] <ogra> usplash suddenly needed a 640x480 theme ...
[10:50] <ogra> RichEd, makes sense
[10:51] <ogra> so i just quickly scaled the 800x600 one we have ... which looks pretty awful
[10:51] <mjg59> ogra: It's needed one for weeks...
[10:51] <AliasVegas> i can get that done for you, when do you need it by?
[10:51] <ogra> mjg59, no other theme even has the code for it
[10:51] <ogra> edubuntu is the only one yet
[10:51] <ogra> AliasVegas, after bea
[10:51] <cbx33> w00t
[10:51] <ogra> *beta
[10:51] <AliasVegas> ok thats fine :)
[10:51] <mjg59> ogra: The code has been that way since the beginning of August
[10:51] <ogra> for beta the ugly one is fine for now
[10:52] <cbx33> is the 640x480 default?
[10:52] <ogra> mjg59, i looked into it when i cam back from detroit and didnt notice it before ...
[10:52] <mjg59> ogra: *shrug*.
[10:52] <ogra> the code is in the edubuntu artwork package now, others know about it and can grab it
[10:52] <mjg59> Since the move to svgalib, we've needed 640x480
[10:52] <mjg59> The artwork team knows that
[10:52] <ogra> right
[10:53] <ogra> but the artwork packages are lacking some lines of code to handle/convert the pngs
[10:53] <ogra> its not beta critical imho
[10:53] <cbx33> ok
[10:53] <ogra> there are still some weeks to move it in every other artwork package
[10:53] <ogra> and since the artteam knows there should be artwork as well :)
[10:54] <ogra> afaik it wasnt planned that this mode is used at all ... might be that this is the prob
[10:55] <ogra> i have also some fixes pending to change edubuntu to te right cursor afetr beta and to fix some uglyness with the progressbar on thin clients (ltsp-client isnt respected as display manager yet, so the bar onyl is a thrd of its usual length)
[10:56] <ogra> and the gdm theme screenshot in the gdmsetup review window is missing ... aslo post beta stuff
[10:56] <ogra> *preview
[10:57] <ogra> oh, and apparently gnome themes support default wallpapers now, i'll make sure they are used in the desktop theme selector as well ...
[10:57] <ogra> thats all from the tech side of artwork ...
[10:57] <cbx33> ogra, which wallpaper are we using for default
[10:57] <cbx33> the one on there was i thought the higher ed one
[10:57] <ogra> anything from the artistic side ?
[10:57] <ogra> cbx33, the others are way to saturated ...
[10:58] <cbx33> AliasVegas, has just popped out
[10:58] <ogra> the higer edu one is the least intrusive ...
[10:58] <cbx33> but she was keen to start to get together the team for edgy + 1 art
[10:58] <cbx33> ogra, ok
[10:59] <ogra> thats would be cool
[10:59] <cbx33> we were very pushed this release
[10:59] <ogra> we once had a big artteam in breezy ...
[10:59] <cbx33> albeit a short release anyway
[10:59] <ogra> in fact most contributions were art back then
[10:59] <ogra> but somehw that died out over time
[10:59] <ogra> getting that reactivated would be a major thing
[10:59] <cbx33> so please, if anyone is interested in art, let AliasVegas or join the eubuntu art...team.....do we have our own LP team?
[11:00] <cbx33> ogra, totally
[11:00] <ogra> yes
[11:00] <ogra> i think she even leads it
[11:00] <ogra> if not we should change that
[11:00] <cbx33> I'll check that now
[11:01] <AliasVegas> I'm really keen to get some people contributing to the artwork side of edgy +1
[11:01] <ogra> AliasVegas, that would be soo cool
[11:01] <cbx33> can we mail a LP group?
[11:01] <LaserJock> AliasVegas: maybe you could come up with some specific tasks, etc.
[11:01] <ogra> nope, i dont hink you can mail them
[11:01] <willvdl> what kind of contributions are the most needy
[11:02] <AliasVegas> we did have that this release..
[11:02] <cbx33> willvdl, all !
[11:02] <ogra> we need gdm theme, gnome splash, wallpapers
[11:02] <AliasVegas> but there were too few people
[11:02] <RichEd> AliasVegas: pips1 and I would also like some graphics help with web / portal / communityi
[11:02] <ogra> the icons could be anhanced
[11:02] <ogra> *en*
[11:02] <RichEd> we need to get a sub-comunity group going  ... and recruit some people to help
[11:02] <willvdl> ew, hate making icons :)
[11:02] <cbx33> willvdl, me too
[11:02] <ogra> ldm has a very low level theme (only plain colors and a logo)
[11:03] <AliasVegas> RichEd what is required?
[11:03] <ogra> well, if you make icons they should also fit into the theme ;)
[11:03] <RichEd> ? there must be people with skills who would love to have their art work on a few 100,000 installs of Edubuntu s/w or web pages.
[11:03] <willvdl> what are thoughts on leveraging ubuntu-artwork team as opposed to seperate edubuntu-art team?
[11:03] <cbx33> willvdl, we did try mailing out to the artwork, but reponse was small
[11:03] <RichEd> willvdl: there are some issues that are being thrashed out in a meeting soon around that
[11:04] <ogra> willvdl, ubuntu-artwork is the ubuntu team as the xubuntu.artwork team works focused on xubuntu etc
[11:04] <RichEd> it would be better to wait for ubuntu to get themselves sorted out ...
[11:04] <willvdl> cool.
[11:04] <ogra> willvdl, untl now every artteam has its focus and is vastly run by peope who also use the specific distro thesy desing for
[11:05] <willvdl> keeps own identity clear
[11:05] <willvdl> etc.
[11:05] <cbx33> willvdl, ++
[11:05] <ogra> i dont think that should change ... but thats my personal view
[11:05] <cbx33> ogra, I agree totally
[11:05] <willvdl> yeah, I see
[11:05] <ogra> dunno what sabdfl is planning
[11:05] <willvdl> Well, I guess regardless of structure, folks will contribute to the product of their choice
[11:06] <ogra> yep
[11:06] <LaserJock> or all of them :-)
[11:06] <cbx33> hehehe
[11:06] <ogra> and if they do so they have to bear what they submitted one release ;)
[11:06] <ogra> (if its selected)
[11:06] <RichEd> As far as I know, there is also a brand identity pesdon who looks over all of the flavours ... so their is some cohesion.
[11:06] <ogra> so the quality should better be good ;P
[11:07] <cbx33> ogra, yes
[11:09] <ogra> ok, thats all about art ?
[11:09] <cbx33> we'll get a bigger team for edgy + 1 I just know it
[11:09] <ogra> right, we need to be a bit louder ... and draw some attention ;)
[11:09] <Amaranth> is that it?
[11:09] <RichEd> I'll do a bridge topic between art & community then ... and answer AliasVegas's question above
[11:10] <RichEd> pips1 and I are working on a Community Site / Portal / User Space ... name still undecided. We're probably going to use Drupal and will need some help with colours and a site theme and a general look & feel.
[11:10] <ogra> great .. take over :) i'll go installing :)
[11:10] <RichEd> okay ... done ... g'luck
[11:10] <Amaranth> hey, before people take off
[11:10] <Amaranth> where should i send http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=1551927&postcount=1 to?
[11:10] <ogra> i'm not going away :)
[11:10] <Amaranth> don't ignore it just because it's a forum link :)
[11:11] <RichEd> The look & feel needs to fit nicely with all of the following:
[11:11] <RichEd> ubuntu.com
[11:11] <RichEd> edubuntu software
[11:12] <ogra> Amaranth, silbs i guess ...
[11:12] <RichEd> edubuntu.org - but this can evolve forwards
[11:12] <willvdl> Amaranth, that is a bizarre post
[11:12] <ogra> define edubuntu software
[11:12] <RichEd> The desktop ... LTS & Edgy & Edgy+1
[11:12] <willvdl> ogra, colour schemes etc presumably
[11:13] <ogra> like student-control-panel or the planned ltsp-manager app ? my plans were rather to debrand them for wider usage
[11:13] <willvdl> icon styles
[11:13] <ogra> well, we wont look violet like kubuntu does
[11:13] <willvdl> ogra, are they not themeable?
[11:13] <RichEd> Well this is just broad brushstroke stuff to raise the topic, but it will probably be an item for some debate ...
[11:13] <ogra> willvdl, they are gnome apps and pick up the gnome theme
[11:14] <willvdl> exactly. not sure I understand what you mean by debranding?
[11:14] <ogra> we use the gnome theme ubuntu uses currently ... but with a different colorset
[11:14] <RichEd> The intended site / space must fit a user who runs Ebuntu and comes in for support / community but also an Education user of Ubuntu (Education Tech Services) person looking for the same sort of support.
[11:14] <ogra> student-contol-panel has a header thats a png with the edubuntu logo in it
[11:15] <cbx33> ogra, want me to remove that with my last patch?#
[11:15] <willvdl> ah. gotcha
[11:15] <ogra> i'm planning to drop that for a toolbar or a menubar later
[11:15] <ogra> cbx33, no
[11:15] <LaserJock> argg, I'm totally lost
[11:15] <ogra> as long as we dont have something in replacement it will look odd
[11:15] <cbx33> ok
[11:16] <ogra> the ui needs s lot of love still i dont like the buttons etc ... we'll need to look into that in edgy+1
[11:16] <RichEd> It needs to also be able to hive off from a landing page into a kids area look & feel ... young person support ...
[11:16] <ogra> no
[11:16] <ogra> it should work for all ages (remember its a tool for teaches)
[11:16] <ogra> *teachers)
[11:16] <RichEd> As well as a grey hair decision maker reading about Eduation Advocacy
[11:16] <ogra> right
[11:17] <RichEd> I'm talking about the user space ... with categories of areas for user types
[11:17] <willvdl> but the option could be there for different solution spaces within the product
[11:17] <RichEd> So we need a happy middle ground.
[11:17] <ogra> exactly
[11:17] <RichEd> we'll need to look into that in edgy+1 <- this is a good comment ...
[11:17] <ogra> it must work for lower grades as well as for unis
[11:17] <ogra> if that doesnt work we need an easy opportunity to change it
[11:17] <RichEd> pips1 and I said we would like to design the look & feel to look like edgy+1 when it comes out
[11:17] <ogra> and ship two or more themes
[11:18] <willvdl> by default and then themes that can be applied at wim?
[11:18] <cbx33> RichEd, sounds like you guys need to be on the artwork team
[11:18] <ogra> yep
[11:18] <RichEd> *don't forget I am talking user space*
[11:18] <ogra> thats what we do currently already btw
[11:18] <ogra> it could need improvement, but the base is there
[11:18] <RichEd> if we can get the user spaces l&f for each category agreed by consensus for the web site ... it provides a way forward for the software
[11:19] <willvdl> thought so. sorry, I'm losing the thread a bit :)
[11:19] <LaserJock> is there a relatively straightforward way to switch themes?
[11:19] <LaserJock> like young, school, uni themes
[11:19] <RichEd> cbx33: yep ... we'd like to see if we can help rectruit to expand the art team
[11:19] <LaserJock> are there tools out ther for that?
[11:20] <pips1> LaserJock: do you mean a tool for switching the edubuntu desktop theme?
[11:20] <pips1> ?
[11:20] <ogra> LaserJock, the theme selector in the desktop offers plain and default currently
[11:20] <RichEd> with AliasVegas being the coordinator :) and having lost of sub-input / sub-designs sent to her for nice finishing & wrapping
[11:20] <RichEd> *lots not lost
[11:20] <ogra> default is a tad younger ... plain should be rather for unis
[11:21] <LaserJock> ogra: that's at install?
[11:21] <LaserJock> or after?
[11:21] <AliasVegas> that sounds good
[11:21] <ogra> LaserJock, the theme selector of GNOME
[11:22] <RichEd> ogra & LaserJock : we should link the l&f theme swop to a dynamic menu swop for edgy+1 ?
[11:22] <ogra> you can also run sudo dpkg-reconfigure edubuntu-artwork ...
[11:22] <pips1> LaserJock: System > Preferences > Theme
[11:22] <pips1> ?
[11:22] <ogra> but thats rather for admins to reset the theme defaults
[11:22] <LaserJock> well, but I'm thinking you should be able to select from 2-3 themes
[11:23] <cbx33> peronsaly themes?
[11:23] <LaserJock> that change wallpaper, icons, gtk, etc.
[11:23] <cbx33> personal themes
[11:23] <LaserJock> no, I'm just saying, if I put an Edubuntu CD to show my profs they are going to laugh at the theme
[11:23] <LaserJock> we need to have a better way of dealing with the huge age range
[11:24] <pips1> ah
[11:24] <LaserJock> and  doing so as early as we can
[11:24] <pips1> are you talking about the live cd default theme?
[11:24] <LaserJock> well, we don't really use the live cd much
[11:24] <sbalneav> ogra: I have to head home for the day.  I'll go through the source tonight, and send a draft to you tomorrow.  Whenever you get done with the beta-ing, (i'll test tonight as well), let me know.
[11:25] <LaserJock> but if I were a uni sysadmin and I wanted to set up a LTSP lab
[11:25] <LaserJock> I'd be a little turned off by the default theming
[11:25] <RichEd> pips1 and I are currently profiling the User & Stakeholder sets and will soon have a short list of the significant target audience categories
[11:25] <LaserJock> now *I* know that there's more to Edubuntu and you can pretty easily change that stuff
[11:25] <LaserJock> but somebody trying it out probably won't
[11:26] <RichEd> we will create a space on the web area for each significant category of user and ask them more about what *they* want
[11:26] <ogra> sbalneav, k, thanks  ... i'll surely have some idle hours waiting for new isos tomorrow
[11:27] <RichEd> if we can then get the web area looking like a nice comfy fit for their needs, this can guide the themes / editions whatever we need to produce for the desktop
[11:28] <willvdl> market survey as such?
[11:28] <RichEd> yes ... community feedback ...
[11:29] <RichEd> pips1 told me the other day that the Ubuntu artwork goes out for a selection through a drupal driven poll
[11:29] <willvdl> Melissa Draper did some work on surveys
[11:29] <RichEd> So we can do the same thing in principle.
[11:29] <willvdl> The ubuntu-marketing team has some raw data we could use
[11:30] <RichEd> The background feeling is that we (as people with a techie bent) can only guess what the teacher / pupil / student wants ...
[11:30] <pips1> what I told RichEd is that http://art.ubuntu.com/ allows uploaded art to be rated/voted on
[11:31] <RichEd> If we want to get a better understanding, we need to ask the actual target audience, or else watch them debating with each other in end-user topic forums
[11:32] <RichEd> If anyone is interested, you can see the initial list of stakeholders / users here:
[11:32] <RichEd> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/education/planning/profiling
[11:33] <ogra> pips1, i thought that was shot down
[11:33] <RichEd> Note that this is a work in progress ... it has a huge number of categories .. and some are of little or no signifcance at the moment.
[11:33] <pips1> ogra: what do you mean by "that was shot down"? huh?
[11:34] <ogra> the artteam asked for it
[11:34] <willvdl> but the main categories are quite good
[11:35] <RichEd> We want to list all possible people who have an interest in Education and Ubuntu or Edubuntu ... and then decide how to lump them into manageable categories, and prioritise them for engagement in a community space.
[11:35] <RichEd> 1st priority is people we can satisfy now, with existing edubuntu product.
[11:36] <RichEd> 2nd priority is people we can satisfy now, with existing ubuntu product.
[11:36] <RichEd> and then we will look at who else is a significant target sector, and relate against how much work is needed to get them happy
[11:36] <ogra> pips1, the artteam asked that it should be shot down and replacesd with something different soe day
[11:36] <ogra> *some
[11:38] <RichEd> so, for example, if we added an easy way to change the "young scholar" look & feel to a "teenage student" look & feel, without much dev work, that would appear to be a good focus. Just an example for now.
[11:38] <pips1> ogra:  ah, you mean 'art.ubuntu.com' should be replaced some day?
[11:39] <LaserJock> RichEd: exactly, that's what I'm after
[11:39] <ogra> pips1, nope, they asked for it to get shot down first ... *then* later they want a replacement ...
[11:41] <RichEd> Any futher comments / questions ... anyone ?
[11:42] <RichEd> Or else I will take it offline with LaserJock ... and we can wrap in here for tonight.
[11:42] <willvdl> Drupal should be able to theme quite easily
[11:42] <willvdl> not too sure about moin moin
[11:43] <RichEd> Yep. Drupal is our first choice. We're hoping for an independent hosted box we can play on without restriction.
[11:44] <RichEd> We need web, and forums, and blog options, all able to be created on the fly ... and with pips1 as the owner of editor author permission set.
[11:44] <cbx33> I'm over and out guys
[11:44] <AliasVegas> me too
[11:44] <pips1> cu cbx33
[11:44] <RichEd> okay ... if that's all ... going once ...
[11:44] <AliasVegas> see you guys later
[11:44] <willvdl> ciao
[11:44] <RichEd> okay ... if that's all ... going twice ...
[11:44] <pips1> bYE AliasVegas willvdl
[11:44] <LaserJock> cya all
[11:45] <RichEd> done. thanks all.
[11:45] <willvdl> woop
[11:45] <pips1> thanks
[11:45] <RichEd> pips1: thanks for the emails today. I am 80% done with the initial profile page, and will dig into them tomorrow
[11:45] <pips1> ok


[01:53] <wookey> infinity: trying to MA crossbuild eglibc2.17 falls over quickly with:
[01:53] <wookey> configure: error: --enable-multi-arch support requires assembler and linker support
[01:53] <wookey> which is dull
[01:56] <doko__> you should forward-port the patches from the -cross-toolchain packages, or wait until infinity does do so
[01:57] <wookey> ah. OK.
[02:10] <mrspinx> Hi
[02:11] <mrspinx> Is ubuntu going to run on the nexus 4 phone, I have been googling I have not really seen any news
[06:47] <lud> I have an M960 android tablet , its posibble to boot an image?
[07:42] <nils__> I have installed my Nexus7 fresh from here http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-preinstalled/current/ then connected to my wifi access point but cannot ssh to a second machine has anybody had this behaviour before?
[07:42] <dholbach> good morning
[07:42] <nils__> good morning
[07:42] <nils__> ssh from a different machine connected via wifi works.
[07:44] <nils__> same problem the other way round. Before the new fresh installation I had installed ssh server via apt-get install ssh and I also couldn't connect from the other machine to the Nexus7
[07:44] <dholbach> ogra_, I have /etc/initramfs/post-update.d//flash-kernel failing - what do I do?
[08:42] <Rjs> nils__: (about what you spoke about 10 hours ago) I've been using the usb gadget ethernet on nexus7 for a while, and it was very easy to setup and has worked well (just like on my openmoko gta02)
[08:42] <Rjs> nils__: I simply compiled the kernel with USB_CDC_COMPOSITE instead of USB_G_SERIAL (composite is ethernet + serial so I didn't have to touch any serial port settings at all), added a few lines to /etc/network/interfaces to configure a static IP, and installed openssh-server
[08:44] <infinity> ogra_: ^
[08:44] <infinity> ogra_: Sounds like switching from USB_G_SERIAL to USB_CDC_COMPOSITE should Just Work.  We probably should.
[08:44] <raster> Rjs: USB_CDC_COMPOSITE???? THATS the config i was looking for!
[08:44] <raster> yargh!
[08:45] <raster> thanks muchly!
[08:45] <kulve> why not g_multi while at it..
[08:45] <infinity> And Rjs is suddenly the most popular man in the channel for the next 5 minutes. :P
[08:46] <Rjs> I had no use for a usb-storage gadget so I didn't use g_multi to save myself the trouble of finding out how it should be configured :)
[08:46] <raster> who needs it
[08:46] <raster> when u have usbnet
[08:46] <raster> and can just use nfs
[08:46] <raster> :)
[08:46] <raster> or sshfs
[08:46] <raster> :)
[08:46]  * raster makes a happy dance
[08:47] <suihkulokki> usb storage standard need to die
[08:47] <raster> well for anything less dumb th an a piece of flash media
[08:47] <raster> (ie sd card at most)
[08:47] <raster> mtp isnt amazingly better
[08:48] <raster> tho its an improvement
[08:48] <ogra_> infinity, when you moved abopotimg into livecd-rootfs, did you remove the code that marks it as manually installed from ac100-tarball-installer ? or do we do it twice now ?
[08:48] <Rjs> one thing I'm not sure about is how the usb network would look like in network manager if I hadn't configured a static IP in /etc/network/interfaces (I think it's just a normal "wired" interface, but I'm not sure if it has plugged-in detection or not, so NM might think that it's always there and try DHCP or something even if it isn't plugged in)
[08:48] <infinity> ogra_: There was code marking it manually installed?  Why didn't you close the bug that said it wasn't, then? :P
[08:48] <suihkulokki> while usb-storage was convinient, it also a) effectively mandates FAT b) makes it impossible to use the media on the device itself while it is being exported over usb storage
[08:49] <Rjs> but I guess that would be easy to try... for me, setting a static IP was much easier than playing around with DHCP (then I'd also need a DHCP server on the machine I connect the nexus7 to)
[08:49] <infinity> ogra_: Ahh, I see it.  No, I didn't remove that.  Will do now.
[08:49] <suihkulokki> b meaning you can't export your root partition, and thus people have to split partitions to support usb storage, leading to inefficient use
[08:50] <infinity> ogra_: (Also, that call would have been a lot less painful if you'd used apt-mark instead of apt-get, for the next time you have to perpetrate such a hack)
[08:50] <raster> Rjs:  what device does it come up as?
[08:50] <suihkulokki> a meaning you suffer from a redmond-based patent troll
[08:50] <raster> eth0?
[08:50] <ogra_> infinity, thx, it wont help with bug #1041290 though (unless we rebuild the images for precise/quantal)
[08:50] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1041290 in livecd-rootfs (Ubuntu) "apt-get autoremove wants to remove abootimg" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1041290
[08:50] <ogra_> infinity, will do
[08:51] <ogra_> anyway, daily vet visit now ...
[08:51] <Rjs> raster: I think it was eth0 on the nexus7 and usb0 on the host computer (though that might depend on the kernel version)
[08:51]  * ogra_ is back in ~1h
[08:51] <infinity> ogra_: No, won't fix the past, no, but such is life.
[08:51] <raster> Rjs: cool
[08:51] <raster> pc-side i'm good
[08:51] <raster> just wanted to know so i can pre-configture iot while the kernel builds
[08:52] <raster> and when i boot just magically have it work (tm) :)
[08:52] <raster> as i already have all the client-side usbnet scripts around
[08:53] <Rjs> another tip for static IP configuration: I simply didn't specify any default route through the usb net, because it's easier that way and enough for ssh - if I did setup the default route, then I'd need something to switch defaultroute between wifi and usbnet (probably just have NetworkManager manage the usbnet interface as well)
[08:54] <nils__> Rjs: Great to hear. Thx.
[08:54] <raster> Rjs:  i just want usbnet for development
[08:54] <raster> so i can ssh in
[08:54] <raster> when at home i do it via wifi
[08:54] <raster> but if u travel... thats not so useful
[08:54] <raster> eg.. u're on a plane
[08:54] <raster> :)
[08:54] <raster> or in an airport
[08:54] <raster> or hotel
[08:54] <raster> or cafe...
[08:55] <raster> or fosdem...
[08:55] <raster> :)
[08:55] <infinity> Also nice to turn off the wifi and still have network access without sucking your battery dry.
[08:55] <infinity> (bonus points for network access and charging at the same time, oooo)
[08:55] <nils__> btw. this is a great communication channel. I feel honored to be able to talk to people who are working already quite some time hard on making things work better.
[08:55] <Rjs> a static IP on a private network without a default route is something you can easily keep always on and it doesn't affect any other network use (except if you happen to use the same IP address for something else by accident)... I guess the downside is that if you want to access the internet through it then you need to go through hoops (i.e., set the default route or use a http proxy as I sometimes do)
[08:56] <Rjs> yes, I'm finding this channel quite useful as well :)
[08:57] <dholbach> ogra_, hum, not sure you saw my message, but maybe let's just talk later
[08:57] <infinity> dholbach: Oh, I saw it, but viciously ignored you becasue I was watching TV.
[08:58] <infinity> dholbach: How's flash-kernel failing?  "it no workie" isn't helpful. :)
[08:58] <dholbach> flash-kernel: installing version 3.1.10-9-nexus7
[08:58] <dholbach> Couldn't find Android boot partition on /dev/mmcblk0
[08:58] <dholbach> run-parts: /etc/initramfs/post-update.d//flash-kernel exited with return code 1
[08:58] <infinity> Huh.
[08:59] <infinity> You did naughty things to your partition table?
[08:59] <Rjs> (hmm, now that I think of it, I might also want to configure sshd to listen only on the usbnet interface for a bit of added security, since I don't think I'll be needing ssh through wlan)
[09:00] <raster> meh
[09:00] <raster> if someone can attack my sshd.. go at it.. its just a tablet
[09:00] <raster> :)
[09:00] <raster> does vsync work with gl now?
[09:00] <raster> or is it still tear-heaven?
[09:00] <raster> (n7)
[09:01] <raster> i havent updated my gl drivers in fear of them turning into a steaming pile of non-workingness
[09:02] <raster> also... anyone noticed how video/audio decode is skip-city?  gst is using the hw codec it seems for mp3's .. but its skiporama land...
[09:04] <infinity> raster: Hey, to be fair to NVIDIA (which I'm not often accused of), the tegra2/3 Linux drivers have nowhere to go but up. :P
[09:04] <infinity> raster: If you think they're a steaming pile now, you should have seen them a year or two ago.
[09:04] <raster> hahahahaha
[09:05] <raster> well ... the 13.04 image when i tried ub for n7.. was all corrupted texel tile heaven
[09:05] <raster> and garbage land
[09:05] <raster> i stick to 12.10 because it worked
[09:05] <raster> :)
[09:05] <infinity> Heh.
[09:05] <infinity> I can't quite sort out why it's not just the same dudes doing all their drivers on a common codebase.
[09:05] <raster> so i already saw them take a toe and dip them in the steaming-pile pot :)
[09:05] <raster> dunno either
[09:05] <infinity> Or maybe it is, and they just have zero QA on the tegra side.
[09:06] <raster> i was hoping there would be at least a few hanign here making sure they work awesome pants ++
[09:06] <raster> :)
[09:06] <raster> so wondering who i should direct my angst and anger
[09:06] <raster> i know its not canonical/community :)
[09:08] <kulve> is there a launchpad bug about that?
[09:08] <raster> dunno
[09:08] <raster> i though i searched but didnt find anything
[09:09] <raster> but it could have been nvidias new "Soak up my cpu with vsycn swaps on desktop" fun instead
[09:09] <raster> and i go direct to nvidia for those babies
[09:09] <raster> :)
[09:11] <kulve> could you briefly explain to me how the whole vsync stuff should work with gl apps with composited window manager on top of X11?
[09:12] <raster> but even if there is a launchpad bug... its almost certainly an upstream binary blob issue... which means it just gets passed on anyway - so may as well go direct
[09:12] <raster> ummm
[09:12] <raster> i want it for my COMPOSITOR
[09:12] <raster> for apps... that's a whole different bundle of joy
[09:13] <raster> as such the regular logical way is that all apps also vsync to the blank interrupt so they effectively throttle to the refresh no matter what they try and do
[09:13] <raster> if windows are borderless the driver can drop to front/back buffer exchanges for composited gl appo windows
[09:13] <raster> and such exchanges are/can be atomic
[09:14] <raster> tho any such exchanges need to be blocked while any gpu pipeline exists anywhere with pending commands that indicate the target swap texture as a source
[09:14] <raster> to avoid mid-draw exchanges
[09:14] <raster> :)
[09:15] <raster> then u get seamless rendering
[09:15] <raster> requires windows be borderless tho (Client-side rendered frames will do - or u are in a mobile/touch ui with no frames)
[09:23] <suihkulokki> a
[11:01] <ogra_> xnox, hmm, we offer home encryption in oem-config, but until we manage to get plymouth into the initrd (which becomes more and more unlikely due to size issues) it wont work ... should we probably hide the option in the UI ?
[11:03] <xnox> true.
[11:04] <xnox> no, why?
[11:04] <xnox> home encryption in oem-config is pure ecryptfs which doesn't need plymouth or anything like that.
[11:04] <xnox> home encryption != LUKS aka full disk encryption
[11:05] <xnox> home encryption should just work =)
[11:07] <ogra_> oh, indeed, lightdm does the decrypting, silly me
[11:07] <ogra_> sorry for the noise :)
[11:08]  * xnox thought it's pam, not lightdm. but close enough =) it's way past initrds and stuff =)
[11:08] <ogra_> right
[11:09] <ogra_> well, UI wise its lightdm :) indeed there is pam
[11:09] <ogra_> hmm, so i see various uploads of upower but my nexus didnt upgrade upower since yesterday
[11:20] <kulve> anybody here used nexus7 in host-usb mode? Do I need some special cable or should I be able to use normal micro USB cable with some female-female adapter to plug in e.g. a keyboard?
[11:21] <ogra_> you neerd an adapter cable, but then it shoudl just work
[11:22] <ogra_> (a so called OTG cable)
[12:03] <ogra_> hmm
[12:03] <ogra_> while the interactive governor helps massively with powersaving, my dmesg explodes every time that thing is loaded, i wonder if one can quieten that a bit to make dmesg readable again
[12:07] <kulve> ogra_: thanks. Looks like this so called OTG cables have standard wiring so nothing special there. Unlike with OMAPs you needed to use mini-A (or was is mini-B?) cables that had pin 4 grounded and those cables were hard to obtain originally..
[12:08] <ogra_> yeah
[12:08] <ogra_> i also onyl knew OTG as the OMAP cables with the shortened grounding before
[12:08] <ogra_> and i still have a hard time calling these normal "adapters" OTG :)
[12:24] <nils__> just wanted to express my gratitude. Yesterday i had installed my ubuntu today I managed to set up a new kernel with usbnet. Great support from here! Thank you!
[12:27] <ogra_> did you by chance try with the composite gadget driver ?
[12:27] <ogra_> (if that works and someone tested it we should be able to provide both, serial and usbnet)
[12:29] <kulve> ogra_: do you need the serial login, if you have usbnet..?
[12:30] <ogra_> i would like to have the choice
[12:30] <nils__> i changed the configuration manually switched on USB_CDC_COMPOSITE and removed USB_G_SERIAL
[12:30] <ogra_> and eventually we will have to provide usbnet anyway for file transfers etc
[12:30] <ogra_> nils__, you rock, thats what i hoped
[12:31] <ogra_> (for getting some data about g_composite)
[12:32] <kulve> ogra_: I'm using g_multi with my Mer based rootfs
[12:32] <nils__> I can connect via "sudo screen /dev/ttyACM0 115200"
[12:33] <nils__> And with lsusb I can see this output "Bus 002 Device 050: ID 0525:a4aa Netchip Technology, Inc. Linux-USB CDC Composite Gadge (Ethernet and ACM)"
[12:33] <ogra_> and you can set up a usbnet connetion too ?
[12:34] <nils__> ifconfig shows usb0
[12:34] <ogra_> great !
[12:34] <nils__> but till now I haven't managed to set up the networking. But this is clearly because I have no clue yet how to do it. ;-) I am just starting.
[12:36] <hrw> kulve: OTG cable is normal USB cable with ID pin grounded
[12:36] <nils__> so I guess I will have to set up a little bit neworking stuff like ip adress, etc.
[12:37] <kulve> hrw: so it is a special cable and I can't use the cable that came with the device and a basic female-female -adapter?
[12:37] <hrw> kulve: if you have a way to configure device to switch to OTG in software you can
[12:38] <hrw> on nokia 770/n810 it was easy
[12:38] <kulve> ok. I thought that the devices could communicate with each other enough to realise who's the boss and who's the slave
[12:38] <kulve> without that ID pin
[12:39] <hrw> nope
[12:39] <hrw> usb is pull not push
[12:39] <hrw> host pulls slaves
[13:49] <janimo> ogra_, will we have onboard for 13.04 ?
[13:50] <janimo> it has so many bugs apparently
[13:51] <ogra_> i saw a workitem for Laney to get maliit into debian and ubuntu and to test it
[13:51] <ogra_> but maliit has poor layout and no modifier keys
[13:51] <Laney> I'm not doing that with the intent of it replacing onboard
[13:51] <Laney> at least not yet
[13:51] <ogra_> it might be less resource hungry but you pay with missing fuunctionality
[13:51] <ogra_> Laney, well, for comparison reasons :)
[13:52] <Laney> indeed
[13:52] <ogra_> and its no secret that we inspect maliit as alternative :)
[13:52] <ogra_> came up at UDS already
[13:52] <plars> ogra_: I wasn't able to get far with the oem-preseeding still, but I'm doing upgrade and run tests now, and have things like baseline smem and mem testing to help do comparisons between n7 and amd64
[13:53] <plars> ogra_: the baseline wakeups/sec from eventstat are *really* high by comparison on n7
[13:53] <ogra_> well, make sure to upgrade to the very latest, there qwere several fixes yesterday and tonight
[13:53] <ogra_> especially for wakeups
[13:53]  * janimo installs eventstat
[13:54] <plars>   Evnt/s PID   Task            Init Function             Callback
[13:54] <plars>   207.97     0 [kern sched]    Load balancing tick       tick_sched_timer
[13:54] <janimo> ogra_, so we have no xrotate calls or xorg rotation settings anymore by default ?
[13:54] <ogra_> janimo, only from acceld
[13:54] <plars> ogra_: I'll run again this morning
[13:55] <plars> these were from yesterday
[13:55] <janimo> ogra_, ok, I have the equivalent of acceld in g-s-d, I'll probably upload soon
[13:55] <ogra_> plars, i uploaded a bunch of cpufreq configurations today ... and a fix for getty waking up 100 times per second when used with ttyGS0
[13:55] <ogra_> that should sanitize it a bit
[13:56] <janimo> I was just wondering what messed up colin's lightdm setup (he filed a bug 20 min ago)
[13:56] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 20 in Launchpad itself "Sort translatable packages by popcon popularity and nearness to completion" [Low,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/20
[13:56] <ogra_> janimo, well, cjwatson upgraded from quantal ...
[13:56] <plars> ogra_: cool, we'll hopefully have graphs of this soon too, so that we can monitor over time
[13:56] <ogra_> janimo, probably some leftover from some hack from the demo image
[13:56] <ogra_> for me lightdm works fine
[13:56] <janimo> same here
[13:57] <janimo> always portrait btw
[13:57] <ogra_> he already had issues with the kernel upgrade ...
[13:57] <ogra_> yeah, lightdm just uses what xorg gives it as default
[13:57] <ogra_> which now is always portrait
[13:57]  * janimo checks if acceld rotated lightdm as well
[13:57] <janimo> cause g-s-d does not
[13:57] <ogra_> acceld doesnt either
[13:58] <cjwatson> I didn't really have issues with the kernel upgrade
[13:58] <janimo> ok, so this is a bug
[13:58] <cjwatson> I just needed to know to do it
[13:58] <ogra_> you would have to add acceld or g-s-d's rotation plugin  to the  lightdm session
[13:58] <ogra_> cjwatson, vs "everyone else gets it automatically" :)
[13:59] <cjwatson> Well, sure, but that was just at the apt level; I've cleaned all that up now
[13:59] <cjwatson> (I'd deliberately pinned to the PPA back when raring didn't quite work right)
[13:59] <ogra_> is your ubuntu-defaults-nexus7 at least at 0.44 ?
[13:59] <cjwatson> 0.47
[13:59] <cjwatson> All my packages are current raring now
[13:59] <ogra_> (that ships the xorg.conf.d snippets)
[13:59] <ogra_> weird
[14:00] <cjwatson> Are the xorg.conf.d snippets read dynamically, or are they built somehow?
[14:22] <plars> ogra_: I'm not using serial console, so that shouldn't be causing a problem for me, but I'm getting ~450 wakups/sec it seems on the test I just ran
[14:22] <janimo> cjwatson, we have an installed snippet at /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/21-nexus7-rotation.conf
[14:27] <ogra_> cjwatson, just plain files, no generation
[14:28] <cjwatson> Yeah, I have that file
[14:30] <janimo> ogra_, do you have other uploads queued for u-d-nexus7 ?
[14:31] <ogra_> janimo, well, i need some way to shut down usb0 on boot, i was just starting to work on an upstart job, nothing queued directly, no
[14:31] <janimo> after the g-s-d patch is landed and working we need to disable acceld and add a new udev rule. And as minor cleanups disable Z axis reading and everything rotation related in the xorgs snippet
[14:31] <janimo> ogra_, ok I'll paste you the changes so I don't step on your upload
[14:31] <ogra_> well, just upload away
[14:32] <janimo> with proposed gating I need to remember to use pull-lp-source not apt-get source as the latter can get older versions
[14:32] <ogra_> i have meetings starting in an hour and am probably not getting to the usb0 stuff until they are done
[14:52] <achiang> janimo: why did you mark this as invalid? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox/+bug/1031449
[14:52] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1031449 in rhythmbox (Ubuntu Quantal) "rhythmbox leaking memory" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[14:52] <janimo> achiang, let me check I don't recall
[14:53] <janimo> ah, invalid on the nexus product, reasoning we cannot add affects nexus7 to any bug that happens to occur there as well.
[14:53] <janimo> Or was this spotted on nexus7 only, in which case my bad?
[14:54] <janimo> I tried cleaning up some bugs at one point and there were completely unrelated issues affecting nexus7, even bugs of rarely used universe  packages
[14:54] <janimo> I am not sure that is how the project's tracker needs to be used.
[14:55] <janimo> I know the rb-ubuntuone plugin was mstly nexus
[14:55] <janimo> but that was a different bug
[14:55] <ogra_> and was fixed early this cycle
[14:55] <ogra_> we never had the issue on the raring images
[14:56] <ogra_> (the -ubuntuone one)
[14:56] <janimo> ogra_, right, just mentioning an example where I thought adding affects ubuntu-nexus7 makes sense
[14:57] <janimo> I thought it is mostly an umbrella for bugs that either span multiplenexus related packages or are otherwise occuring mostly on this hw
[14:58]  * ogra_ doesnt care as long as one task stays open so someone works on  it at some point
[14:58] <janimo> I only care because filtering nexus bugs is easier if all bugs are specific to this image
[14:59] <janimo> not generic app bugs and not even ARM specific issues
[14:59] <ogra_> yah, makes sense
[15:23] <achiang> janimo: maybe my blog on memory leaks asked people to file bugs in nexus7 so we could find them easily. :)
[15:24] <achiang> janimo: it was kinda relevant due to the "optimize mobile" effort
[15:25] <janimo> achiang, I agree it is ok to get people file bugs on memeory leaks.
[15:26] <janimo> I just thought having a memleak or somesuch tag (I think we even had one initially) would be more appropriate
[15:26] <achiang> janimo: fair enough. :)
[15:26] <janimo> cause then people without nexus can join in without thinking they need specific hw to test and fixc
[15:26] <janimo> fix
[16:30] <angs> I have beagleboard that runs ubuntu-server (12.04). while it uncompress the kernel, it takes too long to wait on Starting configure network device step each time. how can I configure it to skip that step if there is no network connection on the device?
[16:30] <angs> it takes more than 2 min to wait on that step on each boot
[16:36] <Neko> do you have entries in /etc/network/interfaces besides lo ?
[16:37] <angs> yes
[16:37] <Neko> because removing any that say "dhcp" will fix it, or giving a fake static IP.. but what might be better is install network-manager and let it automatically handle everything for you
[16:37] <ogra_> on a server ?
[16:38] <Neko> network-manager has a command line :)
[16:39] <Neko> besides this isn't really a "server" if we're talking about a beagleboard with usb ethernet
[16:40] <Neko> the other alternative is write some nifty udev rule
[16:40] <Neko> network-manager just solves the problem immediately though without introducing any behavior nobody can reproduce ;)
[16:41] <ogra_> it is nontheless a bug if a server install behaves like that after installation
[16:41] <ogra_> stgraber, i though that was fixed in an SRU ?
[16:41] <angs> I have this version: Linux user 3.2.0-23-omap #36-Ubuntu Tue Apr 10 20:24:21 UTC 2012 armv7l armv7l armv7l GNU/Linux
[16:42] <Neko> not really. if I disconnect my virtual ethernet from a VMware server instance, it does the same thing on every distro I've ever used... it's partially because the networking script hangs around waiting for the device to be probed isn't it?
[16:42] <stgraber> ogra_: what bug?
[16:42] <ogra_> angs, are you fully upgraded to the latest packages ?
[16:42] <Neko> networking could be "starting" long before modules are probed, especially if dealing with drivers that do probe deferral
[16:42] <ogra_> stgraber,  60sec timeout on boot to bring up networking
[16:42] <angs> can't I skip that step without installing network-manager. I am told that network-manager has many bugs etc.
[16:43] <angs> ogra_: I havenot updated it for months. I will do that now
[16:43] <ogra_> network-manager is fine, the point is that it should work without it
[16:43] <stgraber> ogra_: if you install a non-desktop version of Ubuntu and d-i writes an entry for eth0 in /etc/network/interfaces. If that interface doesn't exist at boot time, you need to wait 90s before the system hits the fallback and boots
[16:43] <ogra_> ergh
[16:44] <ogra_> any workaround ?
[16:44] <angs> I have only lo and wlan on /etc/network/interfaces, I don't have eth interface written on that file
[16:44] <ogra_> and you actually use eth and not wlan ?
[16:45] <angs> yes, a cable is connected to the eth
[16:45] <angs> is it the reason of my problem?
[16:46] <ogra_> if you dont use the wlan i would indeed wipe it from /etc/network/interfaces ... did you use it at install time ?
[16:46] <angs> I unplugged the ethernet cable and am rebooting the device now.
[16:47] <angs> I wrote wlan0 info on that file long ago, but I am planning to use a wifi dongle soon
[16:48] <angs> btw, it still waits long even ethernet cable is unplugged, it shows Waiting up to 60 more seconds for network configuration... and before
[17:02] <Rjs> angs: maybe it waits for dhcp from the wlan? do you have "auto wlan0" or "allow-hotplug wlan0" in the interfaces file? (if you do, you can take it out and "ifup wlan0" will still work, then it's just not done automatically)
[17:03] <ogra_> thats why i suggested commenting or removing the wlan entry
[17:04] <Rjs> you can keep the entry ("iface wlan0" etc.) if you want: if you remove auto and allow-hotplug, the entry should never be used unless you run "ifup wlan0" manually (or at least that's how it works on debian without any network-managers; I don't know if ubuntu has something special there)
[17:20] <Rjs> by the way, I just tested the usbnet gadget in nexus7 without having anything related to it in /etc/network/interfaces, and it does correctly detect whether it is plugged in:
[17:20] <Rjs> I specified a static IP in the GUI ("Manual" IPv4 setting in the "Edit Connections" dialog, remembering to turn default route off in the Routes sub-dialog) and it seems to work: I get a notification about the "Wired connection" when I plug in the usb cable, and another when I plug it out
[17:21] <ogra_> yeaah
[17:21] <Rjs> so it appears to work just as it should (just like a normal wired Ethernet device)... except maybe that I noticed that the usb0 interface is always UP according to ifconfig, but only has an IP when plugged in (so I think NM sets and removes the static IP), but I don't think it matters
[17:21] <ogra_> thanks for testing
[17:22] <ogra_> yeah, we discussed NM behavior before in #ubuntu-devel
[17:22] <ogra_> it will get fixed to not annoy you with autoconnect attempts
[17:24] <Rjs> ok :) (though I don't think it annoys you with anything after you've set a static private IP, then it just thinks that it is connected whenever plugged in? and if the interface has no default route, nothing should send any packets there unless the private IP network is used?)
[17:27] <ogra_> well, would your mom want to do that ?
[17:27] <ogra_> if you plug the device in it should just be accessible but not pop up messages all the time :)
[17:28] <Rjs> hmm, ok :) so you're somehow setting networkmanager's default so that it doesn't bring up the interface at all unless configured by the user first?
[17:30] <Rjs> (I don't really know what would be a good overall default; my first idea was to automatically set a randomized static private IP, but then there's the problem of communicating the IP to the user when he wants to set it up; then I thought of setting up only the IPv6 link-level address and nothing else, but probably many users would have trouble with anything ipv6 even if on a private link)
[17:32] <Rjs> but maybe it's ok to leave it completely up to the user (if (s)he wants to use the usbnet at all), though maybe it would be good to point out somewhere (in a "Tips" page in the wiki perhaps) that if you control both ends, a static IP may be much easier to configure than setting up a DHCP server on the host computer just for this
[17:34] <Rjs> (of course, none of this is nexus7-specific but common to any device that runs ubuntu and works as an usb gadget, so it's good to have a solution that is as general-purpose as possible - but I guess you know that already)
[17:36] <ogra_> yup
[20:35] <scientes> i cant figure out why my watchpoint isn't working
[20:35] <scientes> i have a memory address that usually has a valid value in it
[20:35] <scientes> but sometimes it has null which causes a null pointer dereference
[20:35] <scientes> i did "watch 0x<fooaddr>", which is the same address as x <fooaddr> which returns a value sometime and othertimes null
[20:36] <scientes> but the hardware watchpoint never breaks
[20:36] <scientes>  i also tried watch *(int *) <address>


[08:18] <rodarvus> libxpm, libdmx, libxdamage, libxdmu built successfully
[08:18] <rodarvus> libxaw uploaded
[08:18] <rodarvus> hopefully dependency hell will be solved RSN
[08:36] <rodarvus> libxrender uploaded
[08:47] <rodarvus> libxevie uploaded
[09:08] <rodarvus> libxi uploaded
[10:02] <rodarvus> libxres uploaded
[10:02] <rodarvus> libxcursor & libxrandr are ready to be uploaded, but blocked on libxrender publish
[10:09] <rodarvus> libxcursor uploaded
[10:10] <rodarvus> libxrandr uploaded
[10:20] <rodarvus> libxvmc uploaded
[10:26] <rodarvus> libxkbfile uploaded
[10:50] <rodarvus> libxxf86dga uploaded
[10:50] <rodarvus> libxxf86misc uploaded
[10:50] <rodarvus> libxxf86vm uploaded
[10:53] <rodarvus> ok, by now, all X.Org libraries are either built/published, or at least uploaded (with exception of libxkbui, which depends on libxkbfile to be published)
[10:54] <rodarvus> hopefully later today I'll return and work some more on xorg-server (if it has no other dependencies, of course)
[10:55] <rodarvus> after that, comes mesa, drivers, apps and any packages I might have left abandoned
[10:55] <rodarvus> family time now, I'll be back later


[11:18] <[reed]> asac: buildtime requirements dropped, too
[11:18] <[reed]> :)
[11:18] <[reed]> yay
[11:18] <[reed]> well, some stuff won't work if you don't have libgnomeui
[11:18] <[reed]> some icons
[11:18] <[reed]> but not the main ones
[11:18] <[reed]> so
[11:18] <[reed]> it's all good!
[11:18] <[reed]> :)
[12:00] <asac> [reed]: sounds good
[12:03] <Ubulette> hi
[12:04] <Ubulette> [reed], we ship the 2 or 3 libs with gnome deps in a separate package (for kde users). will it still work ?
[12:05] <[reed]> yeah
[12:05] <Ubulette> i've read the code of the soft gnome dep patch, it just loads the libs and look for symbols dynamically
[12:05] <[reed]> so, we only need the gnome libs for file type icons or something like that
[12:05] <[reed]> for the normal gtk2 icons, we don't need the gnome libs
[12:05] <[reed]> though
[12:05] <Ubulette> ok
[12:06] <[reed]> I think some other parts of the tree use gnomeui
[12:06] <[reed]> like breakpad
[12:06] <[reed]> and something else
[12:06] <Ubulette> ubuntu doesn't ship breakpad
[12:07] <Ubulette> btw, i've tried system cairo 1.5.4, trunk ftbfs like in the 1.8 branch: http://paste.ubuntu.com/2546/
[12:07] <Ubulette> would be nice to have the patch landed before b2
[12:11] <Ubulette> we have the same issue with xulrunner 1.8, 1.9, seamonkey, ff2, ...
[12:12] <[reed]> is there a mozilla bug filed?
[12:12] <[reed]> do you have a patch?
[12:13] <[reed]> you've got to be proactive
[12:13] <[reed]> :)
[12:15] <Ubulette> mozilla bug 344818
[12:15] <ubotu> Mozilla bug 344818 in Build Config "Linking - missing library deps" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=344818
[12:16] <[reed]> debian bug 451431
[12:16] <ubotu> Debian bug 451431 in iceape "iceape: FTBFS: Undefined reference to XFreePixmap" [Serious,Fixed] http://bugs.debian.org/451431
[12:16] <Ubulette> debian is for moz1.8
[12:17] <Ubulette> but anyway, both are impacted
[12:17] <[reed]> ok
[12:17] <[reed]> so
[12:17] <[reed]> why haven't you requested review on that patch?
[12:18] <[reed]> mh has been filing bugs lately and requesting review
[12:18] <[reed]> that gets stuff done :)
[12:19] <Ubulette> I have 3 versions of that patch in my various branches
[12:19] <asac> Ubulette: there should be one for 1.8 and one for trunk now
[12:20] <asac> why do you have 3?
[12:20] <Ubulette> because the bug has been updated many times
[12:21] <Ubulette> i've dropped my own patch in seamonkey 1 in favor of the one from ff2
[12:21] <asac> ok in ffox 2 we have attachment 264996
[12:21] <asac> which works (and is the latest attached)
[12:21] <asac> so letes request review on that one
[12:21] <Ubulette> yep, bz344818_att264996.patch is fine for sm1 too
[12:21] <asac> Ubulette: ok try that for trunk
[12:22] <asac> and if it works lets ask for review
[12:22] <asac> [reed]: which bugs did mh file?
[12:23] <[reed]> well, his latest conquer is putting the fix for mozilla bug 326245 into a patch and requesting review
[12:23] <ubotu> Mozilla bug 326245 in Printing "Print commands do not cope with spaces in printer names" [Normal,Assigned] http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=326245
[12:23] <[reed]> however, he's been working on mozilla bug 373397 a lot
[12:23] <ubotu> Mozilla bug 373397 in File Handling "nsGNOMERegistry could use the mozgnome component" [Normal,Assigned] http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=373397
[12:23] <[reed]> and has a final patch awaiting review
[12:24] <[reed]> and there are some other bugs that depend on that one
[12:24] <[reed]> that he's willing to fix
[12:24] <[reed]> and some odd-n-end bugs he's filed
[12:24] <[reed]> or either picked up to fix
[12:27] <asac> good to know that he is at least still working on mozilla business :)
[12:27] <[reed]> he comes and goes
[12:28] <[reed]> all you full-time Linux folks have a hard time driving patches through :;
[12:28] <[reed]> :p
[12:28] <Ubulette> asac, trunk needs a different patch
[12:29] <Ubulette> there's no more mozilla/layout/svg/renderer in trunk
[12:30] <asac> Ubulette: i think the directory it failed for you in should be the one that needs that patch
[12:32] <[reed]> so, it's 6:30am, and I'm heading to bed. Would appreciate it if you all would figure out what combination of those three patches is required to fix the problem on trunk and submit a new patch for review
[12:32] <[reed]> thanks :)
[12:32] <asac> hehe ... night [reed] !
[12:34] <asac> Ubulette: mozilla/gfx/thebes/src/Makefile.in ?
[12:36] <asac> http://paste.ubuntu.com/2549/
[12:39] <Ubulette> i don't get why the 3 patches are so different. only 1 touches configure
[12:40] <Ubulette> either we do the proper check in configure or we add -lXrender when we see cairo
[12:53] <Ubulette> i've adapted att242438. let's rebuild
[12:55] <asac> ok i am out ... need food ... and will try to get some fresh air
[12:55] <Ubulette> asac, could you review Bug 174739
[12:55] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 174739 in seamonkey "[upgrade] seamonkey 1.1.7" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/174739
[12:59] <asac> i confirmed
[12:59] <asac> no idea if thats the right procedure
[12:59] <asac> in the end its probably me who has to upload this anyway :(
[13:00] <asac> ... maybe ask on -motu for someone to upload
[13:00] <asac> :)
[13:00] <asac> :-P
[13:00] <Ubulette> i just did. and yesterday too. no effect
[13:00] <asac> otherwise, i will do it later today - after food, after walk, after travel
[13:00] <Ubulette> ;à
[13:00] <Ubulette> :)
[13:00] <asac> Ubulette: now you have an ack from me
[13:00] <asac> they should just produce source and upload
[13:00] <asac> :)
[13:00] <asac> not test ... not anything ;)
[13:01] <asac> but well ... as i said. .. tonight i will be on it again
[15:57] <Ubulette> back
[15:57] <Ubulette> this is enough for trunk: http://paste.ubuntu.com/2556/
[16:25] <armin76> looks like they broke sparc
[16:25] <Ubulette> ?
[16:26] <armin76> i get a bus error
[16:26] <armin76> beta1 works fine
[18:19] <Ubulette> http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=cff_1194866913
[21:04] <Ubulette> asac, i'm deeply changing mozclient
[21:04] <Ubulette> the idea is to do something like that:
[21:04] <Ubulette> include /usr/share/mozclient/nspr.mk
[21:04] <Ubulette> get-orig-source: mozclient-get-orig-source


[07:47] <doko> huehner: rbalint submitted https://launchpad.net/bugs/1823125 did you test both tomcat versions?
[07:51] <rbalint> running piuparts on the whole package set would be a good idea, imo
[07:53] <doko> rbalint: the piuparts tests apparently succeeded in unstable ...
[07:54] <rbalint> doko, ok, but the test in unstable is not valid for bionic
[07:55] <rbalint> doko, i updated the bug, cosmic and disco are fine
[07:55] <doko> rbalint: well, if you can find out what exactly went wrong ...
[07:55] <rbalint> doko, please refresh
[07:56] <rbalint> but in general we can't accept piuparts tests for one release that ran on an other
[07:58] <doko> rbalint: I know that, but somebody has to investigate
[07:59] <rbalint> doko, sure
[08:02] <doko> rbalint: strictly speaking, this is not a regression, because tomcat9 is new
[08:04] <rbalint> doko in practice it is, solr-tomcat pulls it in
[08:05] <rbalint> http://people.canonical.com/~rbalint/openjdk-11-sru/bb-upgrade-all-proposed-tomcat9-fails-1554316440.log
[08:05] <rbalint> i install everything from -updates and down that can be found in -proposed, then upgrade to proposed
[08:05] <rbalint> solr-tomcat users will see their system broken by u-u
[08:06] <huehner> doko: only tested 8.5 as we built custom images around that
[08:06] <doko> ahh, crap
[08:07] <huehner> doko: also i tested our usage (tomcat8-user,tomcat8-common with our init-script mostly) not the new systemd.service path which came in via the backport
[08:08] <huehner> doko: sorry if i didnt explain that clearly enough back then
[08:26] <huehner> doko: question about tomcat9, as far as i understood you had to add it as some common jars (servlet-api etc..) used by 8.5 now are built by 9 ?
[08:43] <huehner> doko: or did you really need to add the user-visible i.e. tomcat9.deb ?
[10:49] <rbalint> huehner, new solr-tomcat depends on tomcat9, i don't really understand the question
[10:49] <rbalint> (doko may be busy at the conference)
[10:50] <rbalint> doko, re: piuparts investigation - only failures need to be investigated if britney blocks migration for them
[10:51] <rbalint> and there are no place for packages in the archive regressing in piuparts
[11:09] <huehner> rbalint: then ignore my comment, i was raising dbout if we need tomcat9 with all binary packages really or could skip some -> apparently all needed
[11:09] <huehner> rbalint: sry for the confusion
[11:11] <rbalint> ok no problem
[17:21] <sbeattie> tdaitx: are you looking at the u-u issues?
[17:44] <tdaitx> sbeattie: yes, I am
[19:39] <rbalint> sbeattie, i could not test all package upgrades because the packages are not all coinstallable
[19:40] <rbalint> sbeattie, i's suggest at least having a piuparts run including upgrades on each source package
[19:41] <rbalint> sbeattie, if there was a run like this, tomcat9 was missed :-(
[19:48]  * sbeattie is unaware of any piuparts infrastructure that we have
[19:49] <sbeattie> It would be kind of nice if that was the default autopkgtest if there's no autopkgtest in the debian tree
[20:12] <rbalint> sbeattie, it should not be ran only in absence of tests, since autopkgtest does not cover upgrades if the package is not in the base image
[20:34] <sbeattie> sure
[23:56] <sbeattie> rbalint: tomcat9 fix looks okay to me


[11:41] <mlankhorst> can any archive admin drop xorg-server-lts-saucy? it needs to be re-uploaded, debian/patches/series is bugged
[11:41] <mlankhorst> and xserver-xorg-video-ati/intel-lts-saucy
[11:42] <cjwatson> done
[11:42] <cjwatson> those were binaries that got rejected for xorg-server-lts-saucy - I hope that's what you meant
[11:43] <mlankhorst> yeah I'll re-upload the borked stuff, debian/patches/series was emptied
[11:46] <tjaalton> minor details


[10:25] <IdleOne> !no coc is <reply> The Ubuntu Code of Conduct is a community etiquette document to which we ask all Ubuntu users to adhere | http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct/ | For information on how to electronically sign the CoC, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SigningCodeofConduct | Watch http://static.screencasts.ubuntu.com/videos/2010/12/22/004-SigningCoC.ogv
[15:13] <oCean> uh
[15:13] <oCean> !this-#ubuntu-offtopic is <reply> not that
[15:13] <oCean> @login
[15:13] <oCean> !this-#ubuntu-offtopic is <reply> not that
[23:37] <bioterror> I think I still dont have rights to @comment bans?
[23:44] <IdleOne> bioterror: message AlanBell but he might be on a plane right now.