[01:59] <DarkSun88> Hi all
[04:14] <zarul> smurf
[04:15] <zarul> u there?
[09:01] <Keybuk> oops
[09:01] <Keybuk> bad fingers day
[09:01] <mdz> no issues have been brought before the technical board today
[09:01] <Keybuk> joined ubuntu-meeting on the wrong network, then joined utbuntu-meeting on this
[09:02] <mdz> is there any last-minute business to attend to?
[09:03] <mdz> good, because my wrists ache
[09:03] <mdz> mjg59: nothing to do
[09:03] <mjg59> Ok
[09:03] <mdz> mjg59: thanks for coming by
[09:03] <mjg59> No problem
[09:49] <Seveas> mdz, wow, this is much easier to summariz than the CC meetings :)
[10:33] <shawarma> win 4
[10:34] <shawarma> Yeah, that'll work.. doh.
[11:42] <effraie> @shedule Paris
[11:42] <bashelier> effraie: mwahahaha
[11:43] <effraie> bashelier: a devarit marcher?
[11:44] <bashelier> effraie: it should, looks like you have broken an other bot ^^"
[11:44] <effraie> we need effraie-proof bots
[11:45] <mc44> @schedule Paris
[11:45] <ubotu> Schedule for Europe/Paris: 06 Jun 22:00: Edubuntu | 07 Jun 22:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 12 Jun 17:00: Kernel Team | 13 Jun 14:00: Edubuntu | 14 Jun 18:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 16 Jun 19:00: Xubuntu Developers
[11:45] <bashelier> XD
[11:45] <mc44> effraie: just need to spell right :)
[11:45] <effraie> erf
[11:45] <effraie> ok
[11:45] <effraie> thanks, mc44
[11:45] <bashelier> effraie: were you looking for the next CC ? =)
[11:45] <effraie> yes :)
[11:46] <bashelier> hehe


[03:37] <Johninky> Hey I have a great question, for a change,   is there a countdown timer like for the gadget bar in vista that I can put on my desktop???
[05:19] <Amaranth> Johninky: This is a development channel
[23:32] <MacSlow> Anybody tried recording GL-apps under Hardy with xvidcap 1.1.6 yet?
[23:32] <MacSlow> Were your attempts successful?
[23:32] <popey> hi MacSlow
[23:33] <popey> not tried xvidcap 1.1.6 yet
[23:33] <MacSlow> popey, cheers Alan!
[23:33] <popey> i have used recordmydesktop and it can _just_ about keep up
[23:33] <MacSlow> popey, I wanted to make some screencast of some early face-browser code but that was a no go :/
[23:34] <popey> with xvidcap or rmd?
[23:34] <MacSlow> xvidcap... just trying out rmd
[23:34] <MacSlow> never heard of that before
[23:34] <popey> rmd is good at 3d
[23:35] <popey> http://popey.com/~alan/mark/ <- example of 3d stuff
[23:45] <MacSlow> popey, sweet... thanks for this tip -> http://people.ubuntu.com/~mmueller/gdm-face-browser-1.ogg
[23:45] <MacSlow> popey, got to tweak it  abit though
[23:54] <popey> ooo MacSlow that's really sweet!
[23:55] <MacSlow> popey, my first three days of serious coding with clutter
[23:55] <MacSlow> still much left to do
[23:55] <popey> looks good
[23:56] <MacSlow> missing mipmapping support in clutter is currently the nastiest thing... but I think to overcome that with extending ClutterActor a bit


[00:18] <owh> Is anyone else seeing a long boot delay, that is "Starting Up" shows for about 20 seconds before the splash screen shows (On a bare JEOS-gutsy install with IDE drive).
[00:19] <owh> Initially I put it down to the resume image, but adding noresume to menu.1st just removes the error, not the delay.
[01:43] <owh> Hmm, I've reread that question and it doesn't quite join the dots between line 1 and line 2, initially I thought the delay was the resume image, and the error I refer to is the kinit one, but while the noresume removes the kinit error, it does not speed up the phase between "Starting Up" and the splash screen appearing.
[01:45] <nealmcb> owh: what vm are you running jeos on?
[01:45] <owh> vmware-server
[01:46]  * owh is checking the exact version.
[01:47] <owh> 1.0.4-1gutsy2
[01:47] <nealmcb> sorry I haven't tried that.  I do love the script in development at https://code.launchpad.net/~shawarma/ubuntu-jeos/trunk - much faster and easier than the iso
[01:48]  * owh looks
[01:48] <nealmcb> a simple shell script that uses debootstrap
[01:49] <nealmcb> well - "short" shell script, with great non-simple magic inside
[01:49] <nealmcb> gotta run to hear Jon Corbet give a kernel talk :-)
[01:50] <owh> Tah
[01:50] <nealmcb> more tips on that script at http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=549222&page=4
[01:51]  * nealmcb needs to get back to properly documenting that - so many fun things to do.....
[01:51] <owh> Thank you!
[01:51] <nealmcb> :-)
[01:51]  * owh was chuffed with the https://help.ubuntu.com/community/JeOS
[04:23] <Icehawk78> What would be the easiest recommended method for setting up an extremely basic mailserver on my server? The only ability I need if for it to recieve emails and be able to forward them to a PHP script. I need absolutely *no* other features than that.
[04:28] <leonel> install nothing  and  then  apt-get install postfix  libapache2-mod-php5
[04:39] <DM|>  what is the "find" command to locate files? not used to haveing no UI
[04:42] <Icehawk78> I'm sure this is *not* the most efficient method, but I typically do this:
[04:43] <Icehawk78> cd /; sudo find | grep (search terms)
[04:44] <Icehawk78> It's probably inefficient, but it works.
[04:51] <DM|> ah thanks
[04:51] <DM|> Any of you have exp setting up a slimserver?
[06:26] <The_Kernel> Hi, I'm trying to install Ubuntu server 7.10, and it stops at 83% and tries to download the kernel, is there no kernel on the disc?! ANd how do I get it to not do that?
[06:28] <PanzerMKZ> not setup net connection
[06:28] <PanzerMKZ> til after the box is up
[06:29] <The_Kernel> I know, i already did that
[07:09] <thomas__> is there a way to configure the network settings without using ifconfig
[07:10] <owh> thomas__: Sorry to ask the obvious, but why?
[07:11] <thomas__> because I'm not to familiar with ifconfig
[07:11] <owh> thomas__: Do you have a dhcp server somewhere on your network?
[07:12] <thomas__> no
[07:12] <thomas__> I have to set it static
[07:12] <nealmcb> thomas__: Is this a static config?  I'd think you'd want /etc/network/interfaces
[07:13] <owh> thomas__: It depends, is this configuration once off, or permanent?
[07:13] <thomas__> ok
[07:13] <thomas__> I have a static IP
[07:13] <nealmcb> there is probably a dpkg-reconfigure way to do it - hmm - which package...
[07:14] <owh> thomas__: Yes, but are you just configuring your network temporarily, or permanently?
[07:14] <thomas__> it should be a permanent connection
[07:14] <thomas__> if that is what you're asking
[07:14] <thomas__> permanently
[07:15] <owh> thomas__: Then nealmcb is correct. You can set up your network in /etc/network/interfaces
[07:16] <owh> thomas__: The format is described using this command: man interfaces
[07:18] <thomas__> nice
[07:20] <owh> nealmcb: I'm thinking the delay I'm seeing between "Starting up ..." and "Loading, please wait..." is a vmware-server thing, because I'm seeing it with also with the server and desktop installs as well as a jeos install.
[07:20] <owh> s/with also/also/
[07:27] <nealmcb> owh: remember - 90 seconds to build and boot a new vm with ubuntu-jeos and kvm....
[07:29] <owh> nealmcb: It's extremely tempting but I have some hurdles. I've figured out how to check out the latest revision of the code (modified three days ago by nijaba) and I end up with a tree with stuff in it. How I make that into a package so I can install it I've not yet devined :)
[07:30] <nealmcb> it is a really simple package, and last I looked you just had to run the shell script itself, after getting the other packages you needed.
[07:30] <nealmcb> I have an older version in my ppa, but it has some vmware bugs IIRC
[07:31] <nealmcb> and then my machine melted down and I haven't gotten back to getting that up-to-date :-(
[07:31] <owh> nealmcb: Yeah, but this is going to end up on a production server and I don't really want to install 'loose scripts' if I can help it at all. I realise that this hasn't been released yet as a product, but making the tree into a .deb would be very welcome.
[07:31] <nealmcb> the server would have the script on it?
[07:32] <owh> nealmcb: Ironically the build commands are all there in the debian directory.
[07:33] <owh> nealmcb: Yup, it's going to have several VM's on it and I'd like to have the ability to generate a new VM simply. At the moment I can duplicate a VM directory and rename it, but that's pretty awful.
[07:33] <nealmcb> but yeah - installing via  packages, with man page etc, is the right way to go
[07:33] <owh> nealmcb: Mainly because of ethernet adapters and host names.
[07:34] <owh> nealmcb: I came across bzr-package, but I'm sure there is a magic incantation that I've missed.
[07:35] <nealmcb> there are several incantations.... but it may be worthwhile to figure it out for other purposes.  I'm a newb myself there....
[07:35] <owh> nealmcb: Of course googling for bzr-package helpfully removes the dash :(
[07:36] <owh> Doh, when I say bzr-package, I mean bzr-builddeb
[07:39]  * owh starts RTFM with renewed enthusiasm after nealmcb's recommendation that it's "90 seconds to build and boot a new vm with ubuntu-jeos and kvm"
[07:41] <nealmcb> well, I don't think there is a way to change /etc/network/interfaces via dpkg-reconfigure.   probably just an installer option or something under certain circumstances.  and I know the topic has come up of making it a bit easier.
[07:41] <nealmcb> anyway - time for bed!
[07:42] <owh> Cheers and thanks for your help today.
[07:42] <nealmcb> owh you do need apt-cacher and lots of memory and tmpfs to get that performance.  but still way more fun than installing isos....
[07:42] <nealmcb> and hardware virtualization for kvm
[07:43] <owh> nealmcb: That's cool, 4GB of RAM :)
[07:43] <nealmcb> :-)
[07:47] <nealmcb> hmm - I think I'm misremembering the timing - that was the time to make the vm.  booting was separate, but also quick especially assuming it is already in tmpfs memory
[07:48]  * _ruben wonders if nealmcb brought his laptop to bed or smth... ;-)
[07:49] <owh> ROTFL
[07:49] <owh> nealmcb: Hey 90 seconds for a build is just fine and dandy.
[07:50]  * owh wanders off to make some coffee.
[07:55] <nealmcb> _ruben: LOL.  ok - teeth are brushed - now to SLEEP :-)   good thing caffeine doesn't seep thru the network....
[08:05] <_ruben> hehe
[08:08]  * antdedyet yawns ... 3:08am
[08:09] <_ruben> hmm .. wonder if there's a way to get notifications when new packages (updates) are available (for those installed) and show the changelog of those as well .. guess it'll be a nice scripting challenge to add to my todo list :)
[08:19] <owh> _ruben: You know about apt-changelog?
[08:19] <owh> _ruben: Doh, apt-listchanges
[08:19] <_ruben> not untill now .. i just did an 'apt<tab><tab>' .. but that doesnt show it
[08:20] <_ruben> not installed by default i guess?
[08:20] <owh> _ruben: Nope, but it's an apt-get install away :)
[08:20] <antdedyet> _ruben: no, it's not installed by default.
[08:20] <_ruben> just making sure :)
[08:21]  * owh bangs head against the desk. How do I make a .deb from a bzr branch <url> download?
[08:22] <_ruben> hmm .. lets see how this thingie works
[08:44] <_ruben> hmm .. seems like its invoked during apt-get install .. which looks like a rather nasty hack to me .. tho maybe im not (yet) aware of more functionality
[08:45] <owh> _ruben: IIRC, you can use it in a script as well.
[08:47] <owh> _ruben: Yup, you can just give it a .deb
[08:47] <_ruben> the docs are rather limited
[08:47] <owh> man apt-listchanges seems to have lots for me.
[08:50] <_ruben> perhaps im just not awake enough for it to understand .. i want to run a nightly script that checks for updates and shows me which updates are available (apt-get upgrade -s would do so) and also the news/changelog for those
[08:51] <owh> _ruben: Well without actually doing it, IIRC you can configure apt-listchanges to email you with those details.
[08:52] <owh> _ruben: Not only that, it will track which ones it's already told you about.
[08:55] <_ruben> well .. i found the confirm option to ask whether or not to continue, but that forces interactive mode .. might be able to get away with piping an 'echo N' to it, but thats rather nasty id say
[08:59] <owh> _ruben: Hold on a tick...
[09:00] <owh> _ruben: You can configure it to have the front-end as mail, which is non-interactive.
[09:00] <owh> _ruben: Are you reading the man page?
[09:03] <_ruben> yeah .. also check how it 'integrates' into apt, and it seems to be 'pre-install' .. so it will be only be triggered when you're actually trying to install/upgrade .. doing apt-get upgrade -s for example doesnt trigger it
[09:04] <owh> _ruben: One mo...
[09:04] <_ruben> when enabling the confirm option in apt-listchanges, you can 'safely' do apt-get upgrade and then you're given the option to bailout .. but that introduces 2 interactive questions (asks twice to continue, one before downloading, one after listchanges)
[09:05] <_ruben> it could very well be that im missing something obvious .. i havent used apt in ages (spend the last few years in rpm land (sles9))
[09:08] <owh> _ruben: Hmm, seems there's also apticron and apt-cron :)
[09:09] <owh> _ruben: You can run cron-apt to download all updates, then use apt-listchanges to mail the changelogs/news :)
[09:09] <owh> _ruben: Note, that you won't need to install them.
[09:10] <owh> Sorry, I'm with my head completely somewhere else, so can I leave you with it for the moment?
[09:17] <_ruben> sure no problem .. i'll look into those
[09:17] <owh> Tah
[09:18] <_ruben> ah .. cron-apt and apticron ;) .. couldnt find apt-cron .. but the desc of apticron mentions cron-apt
[09:18] <_ruben> but apticron might be exactly what i want
[09:19] <owh> Doh
[09:19] <owh> As I said, my head is somewhere else :)
[09:20] <_ruben> hmm .. lets focus on my old qmail-sendonly first .. it requires an mta :p
[09:20] <owh> ROTFL
[09:21] <_ruben> before we switched to suse, we used debian woody .. ex-collegue made qmail and qmail-sendonly packages .. lets see if i can adapt those to ubuntu gutsy :)
[09:21] <owh> _ruben: Why not just install an MTA?
[09:22] <owh> _ruben: No point in re-inventing the wheel.
[09:25] <_ruben> we use qmail on our bulkmail servers .. and i prefer using the same mta everywhere
[09:30] <owh> _ruben: Here's an older guide, looks pretty sane: http://www.paralipsis.org/2006/03/ubuntu-qmail-howto/
[09:37] <_ruben> well .. the qmail-src is present in multiverse so need to download the debs anymore .. its mostly the qmail -> qmail-sendonly patch i need to look into
[09:38] <owh> _ruben: So you can then just download the source, use apt-get --build to make it :)
[09:39] <owh> _ruben: Just don't get sucked into using the builder that comes with qmail, keep using the .deb approach, that way you can uninstall and upgrade it too :)
[09:39] <owh> _ruben: What I mean with "the builder that comes with qmail" is, most likely it comes with a 'make install' option :(
[09:43] <_ruben> well .. currently the ubuntu/debian way is: apt-get source --build qmail ; dpkg -i qmail-src ; build-qmail ; dpkg -i qmail (can be done by build-qmail script) .. build-qmail is part of the qmail-src pkg
[09:44] <owh> _ruben: I'm guessing that the build-qmail makes a .deb file?
[09:44] <_ruben> yes
[09:44] <owh> All good then :)
[09:45] <_ruben> yeah .. just need to include a ton of patches .. and kill the smtp part of the installer to create qmail-sendonly
[09:46] <owh> _ruben: Perhaps this is the time to consider moving to a more supported application :)
[09:47] <_ruben> true, back in the day when we chose qmail it was by far the best performing mta available
[09:47] <_ruben> not sure if that statement still holds
[09:48] <owh> I realise that you generally stay with what you know for support reasons, but if we always did that we'd still be running VAXen :)
[09:48] <_ruben> few days ago we set a new 'personal' record .. 120k email sent in 30 mins
[09:48] <_ruben> haha
[09:49] <_ruben> our 'advertised' (what we tell managers) is 60+k email per hour
[09:49] <_ruben> +speed/performance/whatever
[09:49] <owh> Sounds like a sane margin of error :)
[09:50] <_ruben> the performance averages between 80k and 100k most of the time .. 120k in 30mins is highly exceptional :)
[09:51] <owh>  Big numbers :)
[09:52] <_ruben> ecommerce hosting company .. tons of mailinglists :)
[09:53] <_ruben> mailings of serveral 100k recipients are not that uncommon ;)
[09:54] <owh> Yeah, just because you can have 100k recipients, doesn't mean you should :)
[09:56] <_ruben> its all opt-in ... ok sure, tons of ppl check 'i want the newsletter' after ordering something and then start complaining they receive "spam" ...
[09:57] <owh> Yeah, I understood that you weren't selling viagra :)
[09:57] <_ruben> we do have some pharmacutical customers though ;)
[09:58]  * owh is doing a ubuntu-jeos-build across a 2way vSat and it's taking a little while :)
[10:01] <_ruben> vSat?
[10:02] <owh> Satellite link. I travel around Oz with my dish and fix stuff.
[10:06] <_ruben> nice
[10:07] <owh> Been doing for nearly five years, lots of fun and you meet some really interesting people in the outback :)
[10:08] <_ruben> downstream of sat isnt all that bad tho right? the upstream sucks donkeyballs afaik .. then again, that goes for all ozzie internet lines, the latter that is, the downstream of those suck as well ;)
[10:08] <_ruben> judging from ur ircname i'd have guessed u're dutch
[10:08] <owh> I've got a 1M/256K link, pretty nice.
[10:09] <owh> My parents are, I was born in Oz, but speak fluent Dutch :)
[10:09] <_ruben> ah nice :)
[10:09] <owh> The latency is hard for some people, but it's better than 300 baud :) ssh is doable :)
[10:09] <_ruben> can imagine
[10:10] <owh> These days I have a 10Gb limit per month, so I don't even notice anymore.
[10:10] <_ruben> here at work i got a darkfiber line which is supposed to be capped at 50Mbit at the upstream router and at 20Mbit at our router (but since our migration of firewalls i havent reinstated the policy) .. but yesterday i downloaded an ubuntu-server iso with 12MB/sec .. so i guess 50mbit cap aint working either :p
[10:12] <_ruben> ah sweet .. on desktop i found a backup of my old workstation which has a backup of our old apt repository including the qmail-sendonly bin/src debs :p
[10:12] <owh> Thing is, I can setup on the side of the road with a generator :)
[10:12] <owh> And have :)
[10:12] <_ruben> with fiber thats a bit harder indeed ;)
[10:13] <_ruben> -rw-r--r-- 1 root           50   291336 Oct  9  2003 qmail-sendonly-src_1.03-24_all.deb
[10:13] <_ruben> -rw-r--r-- 1 root           50   355354 Oct  9  2003 qmail-sendonly_1.03-24_i386.deb
[10:13] <_ruben> been a while :p
[10:14] <owh> Yeah, wouldn't really want to run those today.
[10:14]  * owh needs to go and burn some fish on the BBQ. Nice meeting you.
[10:14] <_ruben> well .. qmail's still at 1.03 .. so ;)
[10:14] <_ruben> yummie .. bring me some .. its only like 15hr flight to .nl or so ? :P
[10:15] <owh> Nothing like "sta(b)le" software,
[10:15] <owh> Niet deze keer :)
[10:16] <_ruben> hehe :)
[10:17] <_ruben> well .. have a nice one .. en eet smakelijk :)
[10:46] <_ruben> hrm .. my ubuntu-server 7.10 under vmware is having some disk i/o issues .. when i try to access files under /var/log (and possibly elsewhere as well) said process (like tail) hangs
[10:47] <_ruben> top hangs as well .. odd
[10:49] <_ruben> hmm .. found the cause: qmail .. which was installed from the ubuntu repo (multiverse tho)
[10:56] <soren> _ruben: How would qmail cause top to hang?
[11:38] <_ruben> soren: im not sure .. i had syslogd in D state ..
[11:39] <soren> _ruben: Well, somehow you must have determined that it was qmail?
[11:39] <_ruben> since it was a rather clean install .. qmail was the most probable suspec .. /etc/init.d/qmail stop unfroze the system
[11:40] <_ruben> sudo didnt cache my credentials either .. so smth in the disk subsystem seemed to be screwed up
[11:50] <_ruben> hmm .. bug?
[11:50] <_ruben> Dec 12 20:30:50 ubuntu-test01 dhclient: can't create /var/lib/dhcp3/dhclient.eth0.leases: Permission denied
[11:50] <_ruben> the dir /varlib/dhcp3 is owned by root .. dhclient runs as user dhcp
[11:51] <_ruben> ignore the timestamp .. only just installed ntp on it
[11:58] <soren> _ruben: You probably ran sudo dhclient at some point?
[12:08] <CrummyGummy> Hi all, how do I map the dm-$ partitions back to my hdd for rebuilding an array?
[12:09] <soren> CrummyGummy: Look in /dev/disk/by-id/
[12:10] <CrummyGummy> That doesn't show the dm-$ it shows scsi-1ATA_HDT722516DLA380_VDBD1ATCDV6WAC-part1 -> ../../sdd1
[12:10] <CrummyGummy> I need to see which partition is indicated by the following
[12:10] <CrummyGummy> md1 : active raid1 dm-6[2]
[12:14] <_ruben> soren: nope
[12:27] <CrummyGummy> anyone? I really miss the days when it was just sda1 etc.
[12:28] <_ruben> my /proc/mdstat lists sda1, etc
[12:34] <CrummyGummy> Wow, the big cleanout...
[13:16] <_ruben> grmbl .. wondered if i could reproduce that dhclient error .. did an extra install of gutsy in vmware .. this time syslogd isnt writing to any files .. wonder if there's an issue with the disk system provided by vmware to the guest (the host is suse machine)
[14:13] <_ruben> hmm .. cant reproduce it .. dont see any diffs in rights either .. http://pastebin.ca/815908 shows some logs and ls of the dhclient stuff
[19:39] <ivoks> Burgundavia: AD and single click solution for desktops are already there
[20:24] <h4x0r7h1s> mysql on Feisty seems to not pay attention to grant tables now
[20:24] <h4x0r7h1s> I created a user foo@'%' with a password, flushed privileges, reloaded the server
[20:24] <h4x0r7h1s> user has no privs
[20:24] <h4x0r7h1s> and he logs in only with a blank passord
[20:25] <h4x0r7h1s> shit.
[20:25]  * h4x0r7h1s just deleted debian-sys-maint
[20:27] <ivoks_> bad move
[20:29] <h4x0r7h1s> by accident, not sure how to auto-recreate it
[20:29] <h4x0r7h1s> apt-get install --reinstall ???? what?  not mysql-server it seems
[20:29] <ivoks> reinstall doesn't recreate tables
[20:29] <ivoks> why don't you just add that user
[20:30] <ivoks> username and password are stored in /etc/mysql/debian.cnf
[20:31] <h4x0r7h1s> ivoks:  it has all kinds of interesting privileges
[20:32] <h4x0r7h1s> I can just grant all
[20:32] <ivoks> let me check
[20:33] <ivoks> it has y,y,y,y,y,y,y,y,y,y,y,y,y,y,y,y,y,y,y,y,y,n,n,n,n,n
[20:35] <h4x0r7h1s> ivoks:  if I add a user@'%' it gives that user no privileges, and a blank password
[20:35] <h4x0r7h1s> if I add the user@localhost it give that user ... it works right.
[20:36] <ivoks> to be honest, i never added user without password to mysql
[20:36] <h4x0r7h1s> ....
[20:36] <ivoks> not even with '%' for host
[20:37] <h4x0r7h1s> jmoser@portal:~$ mysql -u root -p
[20:37] <h4x0r7h1s> Enter password:
[20:37] <h4x0r7h1s> mysql> GRANT ALL on *.* TO testme@'%' IDENTIFIED BY 'test';
[20:37] <h4x0r7h1s> mysql> FLUSH PRIVILEGES;
[20:37] <h4x0r7h1s> I can now log in as testme, but only with a blank password.  No privileges granted at all
[20:38] <h4x0r7h1s> If  I use localhost instead of '%' it works as expected
[20:38] <ivoks> wrong
[20:38] <h4x0r7h1s> explain wrong.
[20:38] <ivoks> grant all privileges on *.* to 'user'@'host' identified by 'password';
[20:39] <h4x0r7h1s> '%' means all hosts
[20:39] <h4x0r7h1s> % is wildcard
[20:39] <ivoks> grant all privileges
[20:39] <h4x0r7h1s> ah ok
[20:40] <h4x0r7h1s> well
[20:40] <h4x0r7h1s> I still can't use a password.
[20:40] <h4x0r7h1s> so it's stil l broken.
[20:41] <h4x0r7h1s> If I use phpmyadmin 2.11.3 to create a user, it also doesn't work (though it shows the user properly)
[20:42] <h4x0r7h1s> jmoser@portal:~$ mysql -u testme -p
[20:42] <h4x0r7h1s> Enter password: (test)
[20:42] <h4x0r7h1s> ERROR 1045 (28000): Access denied for user 'testme'@'localhost' (using password: YES)
[20:43] <h4x0r7h1s> using a blank password lets me in with no access.
[20:43] <infinity> Do you have an entry for %@% with no privs?
[20:43] <h4x0r7h1s> yes two that I didn't create
[20:43] <infinity> Kill 'em.
[20:43] <h4x0r7h1s> (there are other super user users that work)
[20:44] <infinity> %@% can mess with other wildcard entries, IME.
[20:44] <h4x0r7h1s> ok.  No idea why that's there
[20:44] <h4x0r7h1s> stupid security wise
[20:44] <infinity> Hysterical raisins, they've always shipped those.
[20:44] <ivoks> hysterical? :)
[20:44] <infinity> ("They" being MySQL AB, not us)
[20:45] <infinity> Hysterical raisins = Historical reasons.  Sorry.  Too much nerd slang.
[20:45] <h4x0r7h1s> that works
[20:45] <ivoks> infinity: it sounded right :)
[20:45] <h4x0r7h1s> infinity:  kefka?
[20:46] <h4x0r7h1s> infinity:  r u lving 4ever, 4 no raisin?!
[20:46] <h4x0r7h1s> thanks ivoks
[20:46] <infinity> GAH.
[20:46] <h4x0r7h1s> and infinity
[20:46] <infinity> That hurts my brain.
[20:47] <h4x0r7h1s> i am not a dba :(  so I don't know quite how to figure out what those last 4 privs are to tell phpmyadmin, and don't know the command in mysql
[20:47] <h4x0r7h1s> but no matter
[20:48] <h4x0r7h1s> (no, I shouldn't be administrating something I can't control, wtf)
[20:51] <moos3> anyone wake in here
[20:52] <ivoks> yes
[20:52] <moos3> can anyone help me with openvpn?
[20:52] <ivoks> maybe
[20:53] <moos3> my client runs but server fails
[20:53] <ivoks> there's /var/log/syslog
[20:53] <ivoks> it has some info why it failed
[20:54] <moos3> yeah its about the certificate, i made those tho
[20:55] <moos3> and put them in the config like they should be
[20:55] <ivoks> ok
[20:55] <ivoks> so, what's the problem then?
[20:55] <moos3> Dec 14 13:05:20 tibby ovpn-server[7389]: Options error: Unrecognized option or missing parameter(s) in /etc/openvpn/server.conf:43: presist-key (2.0.9)
[20:55] <moos3> thats the problem, its a vaildate option
[20:56] <moos3> but it doesn't like it
[20:56] <ivoks> you have only 'persist-key' right?
[20:56] <moos3> persist-tun
[20:57] <moos3> i have both
[20:57] <ivoks> ok
[20:57] <moos3> because thats what is in the sample
[20:57] <ivoks> persist-key is a valid option
[20:58] <moos3> yeah heres my configs http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=640567
[20:59] <ivoks> you are starting both client and server?
[20:59] <ivoks> why?
[20:59] <ivoks> on server start only server
[21:00] <moos3> i'm not its doing it by default
[21:00] <ivoks> that's cause you have both configs
[21:00] <ivoks> open /etc/default/openvpn
[21:01] <ivoks> and change AUTOSTART to "server"
[21:01] <ivoks> stop openvpn before that
[21:03] <moos3> k
[21:05] <moos3> moos3@tibby:~$ sudo vi /etc/init.d/openvpn
[21:05] <moos3> moos3@tibby:~$ sudo /etc/init.d/openvpn start
[21:05] <moos3> Starting virtual private network daemon: server(FAILED).
[21:05] <ivoks> check logs
[21:06] <moos3> moos3@tibby:~$ sudo cat /etc/openvpn/openvpn
[21:06] <moos3> Fri Dec 14 16:05:05 2007 OpenVPN 2.0.9 i486-pc-linux-gnu [SSL] [LZO] [EPOLL] built on Mar  2 2007
[21:06] <moos3> Fri Dec 14 16:05:05 2007 Diffie-Hellman initialized with 2048 bit key
[21:06] <moos3> Fri Dec 14 16:05:05 2007 WARNING: file '/etc/openvpn/keys/server.key' is group or others accessible
[21:06] <moos3> Fri Dec 14 16:05:05 2007 TLS-Auth MTU parms [ L:1592 D:140 EF:40 EB:0 ET:0 EL:0 ]
[21:06] <moos3> Fri Dec 14 16:05:05 2007 TUN/TAP device tap0 opened
[21:06] <moos3> Fri Dec 14 16:05:05 2007 ifconfig tap0 <IP_ADDRESS> netmask <IP_ADDRESS> mtu 1500 broadcast <IP_ADDRESS>
[21:06] <moos3> Fri Dec 14 16:05:05 2007 Data Channel MTU parms [ L:1592 D:1450 EF:60 EB:135 ET:32 EL:0 AF:3/1 ]
[21:06] <moos3> Fri Dec 14 16:05:05 2007 failed to find GID for group nobody
[21:06] <ivoks> don't past everything
[21:06] <moos3> Fri Dec 14 16:05:05 2007 Exiting
[21:06] <moos3> k
[21:06] <ivoks> group is nogroup
[21:08] <moos3> yeah I have that set as nobody:nogroup 644
[21:08] <ivoks> in config
[21:08] <ivoks> you have nobody as a group
[21:08] <ivoks> there's no such group
[21:08] <ivoks> there's only nogroup
[21:09] <moos3> ok that working
[21:09] <moos3> ok
[21:09] <moos3> cool I knew it was something dumb but it all look right
[21:09] <moos3> thanks for the help
[21:09] <ivoks> np
[21:10] <moos3> now to rdp to my windows box to make sure its gonna work
[21:10] <moos3> thanks again
[21:14] <ivoks> dendrobates: hello
[21:14] <dendrobates> ivoks: hello
[21:31] <jetole> hey guys, I want to make some changes to my server kernel but I would like to start with the configuration used by ubuntu and reconfigure and re make from there...
[21:31] <jetole> does anyone know how I can install the sources with the default ubuntu setup?
[21:43] <soren> jetole: The kernel source is in linux-source-2.6.22 (assuming gutsy). The kernel config is in /boot/config-*
[21:50] <jetole> soren: thanks
[21:53] <soren> jetole: np :)
[22:41] <Burgundavia> soren: do you know if anybody from the server team has poked APOC
[22:41] <Burgundavia> ?
[22:42] <soren> sommer: I think not.
[22:48] <Burgundavia> soren: was that directed at me?
[22:49] <soren> Er.. Yes, it was. I don't know what went wrong.
[22:49] <soren> Too many channels.
[22:49] <soren> This is the current status line of my irrsi: " [5:#ubuntu-server(+cns)] [Act: 3,4,7,12,15,16,20,64,81,178,183,188,194,210]"
[22:53] <Burgundavia> right
[22:53] <infinity> You may want to kill a few of those windows.  Just a thought.
[22:54] <jetole> how the hell do you have that many open?
[22:54] <jetole> I typically find 10 irc channels a little high for me
[22:54] <jetole> 6 - 8 seems about average
[22:55] <jetole> I am waiting for a kernel compile on a dual processor quad core 2.5Ghz and the damn thing still take forever
[22:55] <soren> infinity: What? why?
[22:56] <soren> I might miss someone talking about me!
[22:57] <jetole> soren: I think he means all those channels
[22:57] <soren> jetole: So do I?
[22:59] <infinity> soren: No one talks about you anyway.
[23:01] <soren> infinity: Oh, now I'm confused.
[23:01] <soren> Saying that noone talks about me is talking about me, so... I'm confused.
[23:02] <infinity> No, no, that was talking TO you.
[23:02] <infinity> Which I only do to reassure you that no one talks ABOUT you.
[23:02] <infinity> Otherwise, I do neither.
[23:03] <soren> That's right. They're not talking about me, _because I'm watching_. If I /part the channel... sheesh!
[23:03] <nealmcb> infinity: so does soren really have 210 channels open??  or am I forgetting irssi status line syntax?
[23:03] <nealmcb> :-)
[23:03] <soren> No, that sounds accurate.
[23:03] <infinity> nealmcb: He really has that many WINDOWS... Most are probably old queries.
[23:03] <soren> Well, 211.
[23:04] <nealmcb> soren: I wasn't talking to YOU!
[23:04] <soren> And a lot are queries.
[23:04] <soren> About 50/50, I think.
[23:04] <nealmcb> :-)
[23:04] <soren> Gah.
[23:04]  * nealmcb is enlightened
[23:05] <infinity> I find myself going on "old query reaping" runs every once in a while when I get close to 100 windows.
[23:05] <infinity> Of course, my status line isn't as scary, because I don't hilight on anything but chat/msg/action
[23:05] <nealmcb> soren: what's up with ebox these days?
[23:05] <infinity> So, no hilighting on joins/parts/etc.
[23:07] <soren> infinity: Nor do I.
[23:08] <soren> nealmcb: I'm not really on top of it right now. It's mostly upstream doing the work. I'll be getting closer to it in about a month, I think.
[23:10] <soren> infinity: I ought to be doing some old query reaping, but I remember what most of the window id's are. 194 is #linux-cluster, for instance. 123 is #aalborg, #188 is #ubuntu-x... It would suck to have to relearn that.
[23:10] <nealmcb> soren:  that's what I was figured - hoping they are on schedule
[23:11] <Burgundavia> as am I
[23:12] <nealmcb> 5 years of supporting hardy without a good popular gui would mean a lot more questions and lost opportunity...
[23:12] <Burgundavia> yep
[23:30] <jetole> soren: I don't care, keep as many open as you want ;)
[23:32] <soren> jetole: Will do :)


[08:53] <ubotu> New bug: #24955 in xorg (main) "xserver-xorg: undefined colors render important apps unusable" [High,Rejected]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/24955
[09:35] <ubotu> New bug: #116768 in linux-restricted-modules-2.6.20 (restricted) "nvidia-glx should depend on it's kernel version" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/116768
[11:53] <ubotu> New bug: #86142 in xserver-xorg-video-nv (main) "Jerky rendering in Epiphany (herd4)" [Low,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86142
[11:53] <ubotu> New bug: #116793 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (main) "3d applications with compiz enabled are not usable (Intel 945GM GPU - feisty)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/116793
[11:55] <ubotu> New bug: #106836 in xorg (main) "blinking screen when on launchpad.net" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/106836
[07:01] <kylem> bryce/timo, working on merge of mesa 6.5.3 from experimenta (thank jcristau)
[07:01] <jcristau> :)
[07:02] <kylem> then i need to bisect and find which patches fix fullscreen gl on i965 for feisty 6.5.2 *cry*
[07:11] <ubotu> New bug: #85844 in linux-restricted-modules-2.6.20 (restricted) "fglrx power saving" [Undecided,Rejected]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85844
[07:30] <kylem> tepsipakki, why'd we remove lesstif-dev from build-deps in mesa?
[08:17] <ubotu> New bug: #116808 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (main) "White boxes instead of shadows on Intel 945 (-intel driver)" [Critical,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/116808
[08:18] <bryce> kylem: great
[08:18] <jcristau> kylem: maybe because you didn't build libGLw?
[08:19] <kylem> aha.
[08:19] <kylem> ok. that explains that.
[08:19] <kylem> jcristau, thanks!
[08:19] <jcristau> np
[08:20] <kylem> (i was trying to figure out how a few changelog pieces fit together...)
[09:25] <ubotu> New bug: #43317 in linux-restricted-modules-2.6.15 (restricted) "xvidtune doesn't work with latest nvidia-glx" [Medium,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/43317
[09:46] <keescook> bryce: appres 1.0.1 sponsored.  :)
[09:47] <bryce> great thanks
[09:47] <bryce> I'm almost done with beforelight, just need to test the deb
[09:47] <keescook> cool.  I'm morbidly curious to know what caused the weird paths...
[09:50] <bryce> yup, I think I figured it out, but would appreciate your doublechecking on it
[09:55] <bryce> ok, you got mail
[09:55] <ubotu> New bug: #24059 in linux-restricted-modules-2.6.15 (restricted) "hyperthreading smp not supported on NVIDA6610XL with kernel 2.6.12-9-686-smp" [Medium,Rejected]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/24059
[10:01] <ubotu> New bug: #25954 in xserver-xorg-input-keyboard (main) "random extra keys are unsupported" [Medium,Rejected]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/25954
[10:26] <ubotu> New bug: #26538 in xserver-xorg-video-sis (main) "Screen corruption and crashes with hardware acceleration" [Medium,Rejected]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/26538
[10:49] <bryce> kylem: do you know if the i810 driver on feisty supports custom modelines?
[11:23] <keescook> bryce: nice work tracking down that path bug.  :)  did your patch fix it?  (I would have expected a patch to Makefile.in too)
[11:24] <keescook> you can examine the debian contents with "dpkg-deb -c PKG.deb"
[11:24] <bryce> it seemed to prevent the creation of the extra subdirs for me, but I wasn't 100% sure
[11:24] <bryce> I didn't know if Makefile.in needed to be patched, or if that would be autogenerated
[11:24] <bryce> ok cool, I was wondering how to do that
[11:26] <ubotu> New bug: #27421 in linux-source-2.6.15 (main) "Logitech RX300 mouse extra-buttons without kernel events" [Medium,Rejected]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/27421
[11:26] <keescook> "automake" (usually run prior to tarball creation) makes Makefile.in from Makefile.am.  "configure" makes Makefile from Makefile.in, so in this case, looking at the debian/rules, it (correctly) doesn't rerun automake, so I think Makefile.in will need patching too.
[11:27] <bryce> ok yeah
[11:28] <bryce> I had initially tested with Makefile.in (and Makefile) corrected.  I tried to back out those changes to be sure
[11:32] <keescook> cool; I figured the dpkg-deb investigation tool was the missing bit.  also, the build log dumps a similar report (which is where I noticed it)
[11:46] <bryce> yeah I'm building a checklist to go through for these packages
[11:46] <bryce> in the future I hope to scriptify some of the steps, so tools that allow for detecting issues like these are handy to know about
[11:48] <jcristau> 'debdiff old.deb new.deb' is useful too, when you want to check changes in the package contents
[11:49] <keescook> bryce: also, check for useless whitespace (empty lines in 00list, or ^ +$
[11:49] <keescook> in changelogs, etc)
[11:50] <tepsipakki> gah, I didn't have the time to push the x11* changes
[11:50] <tepsipakki> hey dudes, I'm drunk
[11:51] <bryce> heh, congrats
[11:51] <tepsipakki> bryce: whoa
[11:51] <tepsipakki> anyway, I'll push the changes tomorrow
[11:52] <bryce> okidokie
[11:52] <tepsipakki> so, hopefully we all have a syncable apps-suite by Monday :)
[11:53] <bryce> what will that include?
[11:54] <bryce> (so I can avoid duplicating efforts)
[11:55] <tepsipakki> all the numerous apps
[11:55] <tepsipakki> x*
[11:55] <tepsipakki> :)
[11:56] <bryce> ah, ok, I'm working on non-x* ones
[11:56] <tepsipakki> doing xrandr merge was ok, I understood that there was an alpha release coming soon
[11:57] <tepsipakki> they should be ok, but I'm wary about it
[11:57] <bryce> it's good practice for me in any case
[11:58] <tepsipakki> of course
[11:58] <jcristau> tepsipakki: the packages will be in NEW for a while
[11:58] <jcristau> hopefully not too long
[11:58] <tepsipakki> jcristau: yeah
[11:59] <tepsipakki> today was too busy for me to commit the changes
[11:59] <tepsipakki> there could be some patches missing, but packaging itself should be _perfect_ :)
[12:00] <tepsipakki> (patches from ubuntu
[12:00] <tepsipakki> +)
[12:01] <tepsipakki> umm
[12:02] <tepsipakki> ignore me :)
[12:06] <bryce> never!


[10:43] <BluesKaj> Howdy folks
 Fwd from RikMills: https://mail.kde.org/pipermail/kde-community/2020q2/006098.html
 (Photo, 585x380) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/fBw2ecsx/file_27111.jpg
 hmmm, that's a complex problem. Companies need money to stay alive, so I can understand qt's position.
 It can have the opposite effect
 yes, exactly.
[19:46] <valorie> this threat has been on the table for awhile
[19:46] <valorie> I think that the Qt company needs to get the MBAs out of the way
[19:47] <valorie> no company survives that doesn't serve the public interest, eventually
[22:19] <mparillo> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kVb9J0frv9s


[10:44] <Sysi> newest (yesterday 19.) daily is missing nm-applet
[13:19] <ochosi> mr_pouit: yeah, pidgin is really unusable in natty
[13:20] <ochosi> mr_pouit: installing xfce4-indicator-plugin and adding it to the panel doesn't make pidgin show up
[13:20] <ochosi> mr_pouit: it doesn't seem to have any extra dependencies and only one recommend (messages)
[13:21] <mr_pouit> yeah, then you probably need indicator-messages
[13:21] <ochosi> crap, then we always have the stupid "email"-icon in the systray-region...
[13:22] <ochosi> mr_pouit: yeah, with indicator-messages it works
[13:22] <ochosi> mr_pouit: does thunderbird at least integrate with that?
[13:23] <mr_pouit> micahg might know that
[13:24] <ochosi> seems that by default it's not in the message-menu
[13:24] <mr_pouit> ochosi: is there an option in pidgin to use the systray?
[13:24] <ochosi> good question, i'll have a look
[13:24] <mr_pouit> then we could ship a default config in xubuntu-default-settings for that
[13:25] <ochosi> hah, yeah there is
[13:25] <ochosi> and it still works
[13:25] <ochosi> it's just deactivated by default
[13:26] <ochosi> wondering whether there are any other apps (transmission?) that use indicators by default
[13:26] <ochosi> also xchat is a possible candidate
[13:27] <ochosi> oh dear, transmission also doesn't show up in the systray
[13:28] <ochosi> i mean it still works as an application since its systray-icon is deactivated by default, so closing the window exits the app
[13:28] <ochosi> but it's still a loss of functionality, and the systray-option in transmission simply doesn't work (even with the indicator-plugin)
[13:29] <mr_pouit> now you understand the "I don't care, I'm THE ubuntu gtk desktop" attitude ;>
[13:29] <ochosi> yuck
[13:30] <ochosi> well good catch on your side though, at least we still have some (even if little) time
[13:31] <ochosi> xchat still works btw
[13:31] <ochosi> i mean: as expected
[13:32] <Sysi> side note: we still have gigolo in natty default installation, shouldn't be needed anymore
[13:32] <mr_pouit> Sysi: no, it's still useful
[13:32] <mr_pouit> because you can't bookmark remote locations in thunar
[13:33] <ochosi> mr_pouit: the resize-grip overlays the account-image in pidgin's right lower corner :)
[13:33] <Sysi> alright
[13:34] <ochosi> hm, we also still have vinagre installed even though i have no clue why
[13:34] <mr_pouit> remote desktop thing
[13:34] <ochosi> yep
[13:34] <ochosi> but: why?
[13:34] <mr_pouit> maybe we can remove it, i've no idea if someone actually uses it
[13:34] <knome> remote desktop viewer? vinagre?
[13:35] <ochosi> charlie-tca: could you make that a point of discussion in the next meeting: discussion whether to keep/remove vinagre by default?
[13:35] <knome> i do use that :)
[13:36] <knome> though, i don't see much need to install it by default
[13:37] <ochosi> yep
[13:37] <ochosi> mr_pouit: is there anything we can do to make thunar start up faster?
[13:37] <ochosi> i know we discussed this a few times already but the issue is still there
[13:37] <mr_pouit> I don't think so =[
[13:37] <ochosi> awwhh...
[13:38] <ochosi> that's really bad, because everyone will notice that
[13:38] <mr_pouit> it depends on something gvfs related
[13:38] <mr_pouit> it starts fast in a vm for me, but is very slow on my normal system
[13:38] <Sysi> deleting files is also slower now
[13:39] <Sysi> i haven't noticed that startup lag badly
[13:39] <Sysi> ..it is slow, at least some times
[13:39] <ochosi> mr_pouit: do you think it makes sense to contact jannis about it? (or have you already?)
[13:41] <mr_pouit> he's already aware of that afaik
[13:42] <ochosi> k
[13:48] <ochosi> mr_pouit: not sure what we should do, either add xfce4-indicator-plugin by default or set pidgin to use the trayicon
[13:48] <ochosi> (the fact that transmission's trayicon is gone really sucks independantly of that)
[13:58] <ochosi> mr_pouit: exo-default menu-items and launchers work and look great so far, just tested them again with a clean user
[13:58] <mr_pouit> nice, thanks for testing
[13:59] <ochosi> np
[14:59] <charlie-tca> ochosi: added to agenda
[15:00] <ochosi> charlie-tca: thanks
[15:01] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit, ochosi : I thought I read that Xfce 4.10 will use xfce4-indicator-plugin by default. If so, shouldn't we look at switching to it and get people used to that thing?
[15:01] <charlie-tca> Could be failing to remember too, though
[15:01] <ochosi> hm, if that's true then that could be a good argument to add it to the panel
[15:01] <ochosi> but i don't remember hearing anything like that
[15:02] <charlie-tca> maybe mr_pouit knows for sure. I don't want to do it if it isn't going to there.
[15:05] <mr_pouit> it's not in the 4.10 roadmap so I wouldn't count on indicator support to be added to the panel
[15:06] <charlie-tca> oh, then it is failing memory :-)
[15:06] <mr_pouit> xfce4-indicator-plugin is available anyway, and improvements/bugfixes are probably welcome
[15:21] <Sysi> we still use system-config printer gnome instead of xfprint4?
[15:21] <mr_pouit> xfprint4 is deprecated and unmaintained
[15:21] <mr_pouit> only mousepad still uses it I think
[15:22] <Sysi> ah
[15:22] <Sysi> it's pretty hard to eep track on things when distroes do everything differently
[15:28] <knome> eep eep eep!
[15:29] <knome> EEP!
[15:32] <ochosi> :)
[16:46] <micahg> ochosi: I think chrisccoulson will be working on messaging integration, but idr if that's this cycle or next cycle
[19:03] <ochosi> micahg: right, atm there doesn't seem to be ootb integration for thunderbird
[19:03] <ochosi> in fact for me that would be an argument not to integrate the indicator-plugin
[19:03] <ochosi> but we can discuss that thursday
[19:05] <charlie-tca> If we are not going to see the indicator pluin in 4.10, we are spinning our wheels debating it at all.
[19:05] <ochosi> well the plugin will be there, just (maybe) no native support in the panel
[19:06] <ochosi> tbh i prefer the plugin solution to native panel support
[19:06] <charlie-tca> Then the user can install it, right?
[19:06] <ochosi> not all distros have/use the indicators
[19:06] <ochosi> yep
[19:07] <ochosi> we can even decide to install it by default but not add it to the panel by default (much like verve or dict)
[19:07] <ochosi> that would make it easier for users who decide they want/need the indicators
[19:08] <micahg> indicator support should come next cycle as we consider moving Ubuntu to Thunderbird as a default
[19:08] <mr_pouit> charlie-tca: I don't understand what you mean. We already have several panel plugins in the default install
[19:08] <mr_pouit> and they are not part of the panel
[19:09] <charlie-tca> I am thinking way ahead, will the plugin be maintained by the time 4.10 hits? If we put it in the panel, and it doesn't keep up, what happens?
[19:10] <ochosi> that could theoretically happen to any plugin
[19:10] <charlie-tca> true
[19:10] <charlie-tca> kind of like "places", I guess
[19:11] <ochosi> yeah, much like that
[19:12] <charlie-tca> okay, if it needs discussion, add it to the agenda, otherwise, let mr_pouit decide
[19:15] <ochosi> hm, the main thing that bugs me about the indicator-plugin is that it seemingly doesn't work for stuff like transmission
[19:15] <ochosi> that suggests that other apps might just as well not work
[19:15] <ochosi> and with transmission it's really a pity, that they patched away the systray-support
[23:21]  * surreal7z is away: rolling a joint