[09:27] <Davidrnd> Hello, I want to use the "arm-linux-gnueabihf-g++" compiler from the click package  ( " https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/blog/2015/04/13/inner-workings-sdk/ " ) . If I compiled inside of the chroot env everything works fine. But if i use the arm-linux-gnueabihf-g++ compiler outside of the chroot enviroment i get an error: "/var/lib/schroot/chroots/click-ubuntu-sdk-15.04-armhf/usr/bin/../lib/gcc-cross/arm-linux-gnueabihf/4.9/cc1plus
[09:27] <Davidrnd> : error while loading shared libraries: libcloog-isl.so.4: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory" What did i wrong  ? :-)
[09:41] <Davidrnd> theres only a  libcloog-isl.so.4 inside the /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/ folder
[10:00] <Davidrnd> Ok, i've to set the LD_LIBRARY_PATH env..
[11:41] <kalikiana> mzanetti: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1573118 MainWindow is in staging. Testing would be appreciated, if using the branch is not too troublesome. Otherwise you can of course wait for the next landing.
[15:15] <Davidrnd> Hello, how can i debug my gtk app on a Emulator/Device ? Is there a howto / example ?
[15:24] <daker> kalikiana: hi, does the ProgressBar with indeterminate: true works for you ? using 1.3
[15:40] <Davidrnd> Hello, how do i run a app from a command line with gdb ?
[15:54] <daker> Davidrnd: gdb $YOUR_CMD
[15:54] <daker> once gdb is invoked just type : run
[15:58] <Davidrnd> ok, but i need to interact with the app.
[16:07] <daker> Davidrnd: once you launch run, gdb will launch your app


[05:01] <RoAkSoAx> does anyone know if tomorrow will the Regional Membership Boards will have a meeting?


[02:11] <flaccid> hey erichammond are you around? i found this debianzone lenny ami and wondering about it
[03:10] <flaccid> some random i guess
[03:10] <flaccid> i'm moving to us west tonight :)
[05:27] <erichammond> flaccid: I'm not familiar with many of the AMIs out there.
[07:25] <flaccid> cool
[07:48] <flaccid> erichammond: moving my personal server to us-west with debian rightimage tonight


[03:22] <robert_ancell> jamesh, if you're looking for a snapd branch to write see https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/getting-translated-snap-metadata-via-snapd/1242
[03:23] <robert_ancell> If we pass through the HTTP Accept-Language header from the client to the store then translations should be possible...
[03:23] <robert_ancell> (once the store has an appropriate infrastruture)
[03:27] <robert_ancell> There's also the local snap case, which I guess would be language keyed fields in the YAML
[03:29] <jamesh> robert_ancell: okay.  I guess I should add that to the desktop priorities thread (and update it in general)
[03:30] <jamesh> and thanks for merging the snapd-glib branch
[03:30] <robert_ancell> np, thanks for making it!
[03:30] <robert_ancell> I'm just writing a thread about the "verified developer" feature. Not sure if that's in the priorities either
[03:48] <infinity> So, on reboot, my gnome-shell segfaults.  This seems suboptimal.
[04:29] <infinity> And a fresh user session doesn't segfault.  How "exciting".
[05:22] <jibel> morning
[05:26] <duflu> Morning/good day jibel
[05:26] <duflu> and seb128
[05:28] <jibel> Hi duflu
[05:29] <didrocks> good morning
[05:32] <duflu> Morning didrocks
[05:32] <duflu> A very orange morning
[05:32] <didrocks> duflu: ahah, updated to our theme?
[05:32] <didrocks> duflu: ironically, despite having ran the theme for a week and half now, I did upgrade yesterday to -0ubuntu2 which rolled me back to no theme :p
[05:33] <didrocks> so, I upgraded the theme to everyone's but me :p
[05:33] <duflu> didrocks, yes but I need a fresh machine... my desktop is still booting with the old Ubuntu Gnome splash
[05:33] <didrocks> ah, you did install Ubuntu Gnome
[05:33] <didrocks> we can change that if you are interested
[05:34] <didrocks> it's an alternative on plymouth theming
[05:34] <duflu> didrocks, I was going to suggest the login screen be grey (with organge highlights) but haven't seen how it plays with the purple boot splash yet...
[05:34] <didrocks> duflu: yeah, better to check with the real boot splash for continuing
[05:35] <didrocks> orange on the grey didn't really work, we did try this
[05:35] <didrocks> but I bet we'll change GDM/lock screen after a while
[05:35] <didrocks> duflu: /usr/share/plymouth/themes/default.plymouth is what points you to your current plymouth theme
[05:35] <duflu> The lock screen is wallpaper you configure in Settings isn't it?
[05:35] <didrocks> (and so /etc/alternatives/default.plymouth)
[05:35] <didrocks> not really
[05:35] <didrocks> you have 2 lock screens step, correct?
[05:36] <didrocks> the first one (showing the date) is the wallpaper your configure
[05:36] <didrocks> the second one (the aubergine background) is the same than GDM
[05:36] <didrocks> and harcoded in Shell code and css
[05:36] <duflu> I forgot. Only recently disabled the password bit
[05:36] <didrocks> https://didrocks.fr/images/artful-shell-transition/default-lock-screen.png
[05:36] <didrocks> step 1 ^
[05:36] <didrocks> then, you start typing
[05:37] <didrocks> https://didrocks.fr/images/artful-shell-transition/user-unlock.png
[05:37] <didrocks> step 2 ^
[05:37] <duflu> Yes, I skip step 2
[05:37] <duflu> It's less annoying
[05:37] <duflu> Instead, I lock the door :)
[05:40] <duflu> didrocks, still the two bar transparencies are different. Do you know of any plan for that?
[05:40] <didrocks> duflu: see my blog post, we kept that one for now because we don't know what's GNOME design team is going to do
[05:40] <didrocks> duflu: they might remove the transparency
[05:41] <didrocks> if they keep it, it won't be in the current state anyway
[05:41] <didrocks> and we'll have to modify it
[05:41] <didrocks> ideally, doing something than they do, if we can, like changing transparency based on top panel one
[05:42] <duflu> didrocks, that would also affect the colour (top is black, side is Ubuntu grey)
[05:42] <seb128> good morning desktopers
[05:42] <seb128> hey duflu
[05:43] <didrocks> duflu: yeah, probably
[05:44] <duflu> Weird, the top bar flickers if I scrub the Terminal menus. What is the top bar trying to change to?
[05:44] <didrocks> I don't see this
[05:45] <duflu> Doesn't matter. We have bigger issues
[06:19] <flexiondotorg> Morning duflu didrocks seb128
[06:22] <didrocks> hey flexiondotorg
[06:38] <duflu> Morning flexiondotorg
[06:40] <seb128> hey flexiondotorg
[07:14] <duflu> Does anyone know why $WAYLAND_DISPLAY is set in a Xorg login? (yes it really is Xorg)
[07:35] <jibel> duflu, about bug 1705157 if, in gdm, you select xorg -> Ubuntu -> xorg then login do you get an xorg session ?
[07:35] <ubot5`> bug 1705157 in gnome-session (Ubuntu) ""Ubuntu" and "Ubuntu on Xorg" randomly start the same session (maybe Wayland maybe Xorg)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1705157
[07:36] <jibel> duflu, then if you select ubuntu -> xorg -> ubuntu do you get a wayland session?
[07:36] <duflu> jibel, I recall using that as a workaround in the past yes. But I haven't hit the bug myself for some time
[07:37] <jibel> anyone else hitting this bug could do this verification ^ ?
[07:40] <duflu> I actually thought it might be fixed now
[07:42] <jibel> it is not, it is reproducible on a fresh install but I cannot find a pattern in which case it starts wayland and which case it starts xorg
[07:48] <duflu> jibel, sounds like it's about time someone just looked at the code, and searched for uninitialized variables etc :)
[07:48] <duflu> Or rather found out what/where "the code" is
[07:51] <jibel> yeah
[08:01] <willcooke> morning all
[08:02] <didrocks> hey willcooke
[08:02] <Laney> moin
[08:03] <didrocks> hey Laney
[08:03] <Laney> hey didrocks!!!!
[08:03] <Laney> what is happening
[08:04] <Laney> apart from spamming of planet gnome
[08:04] <didrocks> Laney: not really spamming, unsure how the planet importer work (or rather doesn't :p)
[08:04] <didrocks> Laney: so had to repost at least :p
[08:05] <didrocks> but I think next posts will be ok, crossing fingers
[08:05] <didrocks> otherwise, I guess today is the g-c-c day :p
[08:05] <didrocks> adding a new panel, blablabla
[08:05] <didrocks> and you?
[08:10] <Laney> mmm
[08:11] <jbicha> didrocks: I think the planet importer has an algoritm to try to find an old embarassing post
[08:11] <didrocks> jbicha: clearly, hence my followup post :p
[08:11] <jbicha> I got my UOA/GOA split post a few months ago :(
[08:11] <didrocks> ahah, nice!
[08:12] <didrocks> jbicha: especially as the source of the joke (the GNOME release team announcement on the 1st April) isn't even around anymore :p
[08:12] <Laney> I wouldn't add to a new planet without using a tag specific feed
[08:12]  * Laney is scared of this kind of thing
[08:12] <Laney> :)
[08:12] <Laney> think I spammed planet debian back then
[08:12] <didrocks> Laney: it is a tag specific one
[08:12] <didrocks> things related to GNOME was tagged as such at the time :)
[08:12] <Laney> then you got what you wanted!
[08:13] <didrocks> well, 2011/2012 posts? :p
[08:13] <didrocks> knowing that I have a bunch more recents on my feed? I don't think so :p
[08:13] <didrocks> afranke asked me to add my blog to the planet for the ubuntu changes to GNOME Shell
[08:14] <didrocks> the importer should have import none or just the last ones in the feed
[08:14] <Laney> oh it missed some?
[08:14] <didrocks> yes
[08:14] <didrocks> https://didrocks.fr/tags/gnome/
[08:14] <didrocks> all the "Day X"
[08:15] <Laney> fail
[08:15] <didrocks> + feedback from GUADEC
[08:15] <didrocks> yep
[08:15] <didrocks> there is a bug apparently (said afranke) opened in 2010 about the first import doing something crazy
[08:15] <didrocks> sounds like the importer picks its posts, indeed :)
[08:15] <Laney> yeh, that's what I was referring to
[08:15] <Laney> but I never actually *wanted* to import old posts
[08:16] <Laney> oooooooooooh I'm getting a deja vu
[08:16] <Laney> brain malfunction
[08:17] <didrocks> ahah, tired already?
[08:18]  * didrocks just read Gitlab as "Glib"
[08:18] <didrocks> should go to bed as well :)
[08:19] <Laney> One theory of déjà vu attributes the feeling of having previously seen or experienced something that is currently being seen or experienced to that of having dreamt about a similar situation or place and then forgetting about it until one seems to be mysteriously reminded of the situation or the place while awake
[08:19]  * Laney dreamed about planet.gnome.org
[08:22] <didrocks> isn't that your brain and memory are asynced rather?
[08:22] <didrocks> I thought it had something with the speed of memory and current time transmission
[08:22] <didrocks> and so, you think you have already experienced it because it has been store quicker in your memory than you "living/feeling" it
[08:25] <Laney> doesn't seem to be settled, from wikipedia at least
[08:26] <didrocks> ah, interesting
[08:49] <seb128> hey Laney
[08:49] <Laney> ahoy seb128
[08:49] <Laney> are you well
[08:49] <Laney> ?
[08:50] <seb128> jibel, did you see my comment from yesterday? your steps on your bug are still not clear, is the second login giving you the same as the first or is that the third?
[08:50] <seb128> Laney, yes, bit of a crazy schedule yesterday/this morning but I should be back to more quiet/normal now which is nice
[08:51] <seb128> willcooke, wb! had good holidays?
[08:51] <willcooke> hey seb128, great thanks.  Could use another week though ;)
[08:52] <Laney> oh, hi willcooke!
[08:52] <Laney> yeah all that time by the pool must have been knackering
[08:52] <willcooke> factor in the kids
[08:52] <willcooke> :)
[08:54] <Laney> fly paper
[08:54] <Laney> :P
[08:54] <Laney> it'll be ok, just give it 16(?) years
[08:55] <willcooke> :'(
[08:55] <didrocks> doesn't seem to have made the psycho effect that Laney wanted
[08:56] <willcooke> seb128, Laney -  it's my AWS meeting again today, could you run the meeting?
[08:56] <seb128> I can do
[08:56] <willcooke> merci
[08:56] <seb128> np
[08:56] <seb128> Laney sent the newsletter on friday so it's my turn to do something :-)
[08:57] <Laney> didrocks knows the score too
[08:57] <jibel> seb128, yes I saw. As I said earlier the pattern is not clear. But it seems that the session type is not set unless you go back and forth between 2 sessions.
[08:58] <didrocks> Laney: I'll give you soon a Dr Friedlander badge :)
[08:58] <jibel> seb128, like u -> x -> u then login will start a wayland session, and x -> u -> x will start an x session
[08:58] <seb128> jibel, did you try to stop the pulseaudio process to release the previous session to see if that makes a difference?
[08:59] <jibel> seb128, in the debug log when the bug happens the message "Setting session to type ..." is not displayed
[08:59] <jibel> seb128, no but it happens even if you never logged in ie first boot after a fresh installation the default session is Ubuntu but it starts an xorg session
[09:00] <jibel> i'll try to stop pulseaudio to check if it makes a difference
[09:03] <seb128> jibel, I can't confirm the new install case
[09:03] <seb128> wfm
[09:04] <seb128> I tried several installs
[09:04] <seb128> did you rule out your vm/video drivers not liking wayland?
[09:07] <jibel> seb128, yes
[09:07] <jibel> seb128, and I tried on hw
[09:19] <jamesh> yeah.  I did a fresh install on my new laptop over the weekend, and it seems to be stuck in an X session
[09:20] <jamesh> It's run of the mill Intel graphics
[09:21] <seb128> shrug
[09:21] <seb128> I can't confirm here
[09:21] <didrocks> anyway, there is really something fishy, tried in my vm yesterday to switch to the GNOME vanilla session, XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP was coming from /usr/share/wayland-sessions/gnome.desktop but Exec= line was the one from /usr/share/wayland-sessions/ubuntu.desktop
[09:21] <seb128> would be nice if somebody who has the issue could at least report it upstream
[09:21] <didrocks> so, even that it's a mix… (and ofc, I logout and log back in, no more issues…)
[09:22] <seb128> didrocks, there is at least https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=785918
[09:22] <ubot5`> Gnome bug 785918 in general "After gnome-classic session, gnome session looks like gnome-classic" [Normal,Reopened]
[09:22] <seb128> which is confirmed
[09:22] <seb128> GNOME_SHELL_SESSION_MODE is carried over between sessions because of remaining pulseaudio process
[09:22] <seb128> which keeps the old dbus env active
[09:22] <didrocks> seb128: ah, that was it!
[09:22] <seb128> I really miss lightdm :p
[09:23] <didrocks> yeah, the env variable was what I meant by "GNOME_SHELL_SESSION_MODE" env set to ubuntu
[09:30] <jamesh> logging out, picking "Ubuntu on X", logging out again, and picking Ubuntu seems to have switched me to the wayland session
[09:30] <jamesh> as jibel found
[09:35] <seb128> jamesh, that seems normal behavious?
[09:36] <seb128> ubuntu is meant to be wayland
[09:36] <jamesh> seb128: Prior to trying this, I'd left it as the default "Ubuntu"
[09:37] <jamesh> seb128: this would lead to DESKTOP_SESSION=ubuntu-xorg
[09:37] <jamesh> after switching to "Ubuntu on X" and back, it is actually starting a Wayland session
[09:38] <seb128> k
[09:38] <seb128> well dunno how you get in the buggy state
[09:38] <Laney> it'd be great if someone felt like debugging this...
[09:38] <seb128> if you have it again maybe poke to the gdm/accountsservices configs
[09:38] <jamesh> it started in the buggy state :)
[09:39] <seb128> I can't get the buggy state here
[09:39] <seb128> works fine on new install
[09:39] <seb128> and on changes
[09:52] <willcooke> I just installed the daily and "WiFi settings" isn't doing anything from the indicator.  jibel do you have a new(ish) install which you can confirm that?
[09:55] <jibel> willcooke, not new(ish) with a wifi card
[09:55] <willcooke> jibel, ack, np
[09:56] <willcooke> hummm
[09:56] <jibel> willcooke, but I can confirm it does nothing on an upgraded system
[09:56] <willcooke> If I click on VPN settings, then I get the panel up
[09:57] <jibel> and wired settings works
[09:57] <jamesh> It isn't doing anything here either (fresh install from Saturday)
[09:58] <willcooke> thanks jibel jamesh
[09:58] <jibel> willcooke, I get this error
[09:58] <jibel> sept. 05 11:57:50 herm gnome-shell[3240]: Settings panel for desktop file gnome-wifi-panel.desktop could not be loaded!
[09:58] <jibel> willcooke, you report it or do I?
[09:59] <willcooke> jibel, if you would, thank you!  I'll try and work out what's changed there
[09:59] <willcooke> I suspect it's VPN related
[10:02] <jamesh> I think gnome-wifi-panel.desktop is new
[10:03] <willcooke> ah, so could be related to the new control center
[10:03] <jamesh> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-control-center/commit/?id=016efdfac8e06a6c223e8dd8ede990bb2d49b8bd
[10:06] <jamesh> so, we've got a 3.24 release of gnome-control-center, but a 3.25 development version of gnome-shell
[10:06] <Laney> right, it's waiting for the patches to be rebased, didrocks is working on that
[10:07] <didrocks> (and seb128 ;))
[10:08] <didrocks> jibel: FYI, you also have the display panel which doesn't work with new G-S/mutter
[10:08] <didrocks> so we'll need to get the new version anyway
[10:08] <didrocks> (just a warning so that you don't inspect more there)
[10:10] <jibel> didrocks, all right
[10:10] <jibel> bug 1715117 so we don't forget :)
[10:10] <ubot5`> bug 1715117 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "Cannot launch wifi settings from wifi indicator "Settings panel for desktop file gnome-wifi-panel.desktop could not be loaded!"" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1715117
[10:10] <willcooke> thanks jamesh
[10:10] <willcooke> and thanks jibel
[10:22] <seb128> not much point opening bugs about g-c-c/g-s mismatch imho
[10:22] <seb128> but anyway, if people feel better doing it feel free
[10:23] <seb128> we are going to update for sure so they don't really need tracking
[10:26] <willcooke> jbicha, hey!  I just installed the daily and I don't see the cap. portal config file.  Is it being done via a setting instead?
[10:27] <seb128> willcooke, it should be in /usr/lib/NetworkManager/conf.d/20-connectivity-ubuntu.conf
[10:27] <willcooke> ahhh
[10:27] <willcooke> thanks seb128, I was looking in /etc/NetworkManager
[10:27] <seb128> yw
[10:28] <seb128> etc is for admin changes
[10:28] <seb128> systems default are in usr
[10:28] <willcooke> why does n-m captialise its directories I wonder
[10:28] <seb128> yeah, unsure
[10:28] <seb128> it's the same for the tarball/git repo name though
[10:28] <seb128> so at least they are consistent
[10:29] <seb128> but yeah, it's a bit uncommon and weird
[10:29] <willcooke> The best thing about standards is that there are so many different ones
[10:31] <seb128> yeah
[10:32] <seb128> changing location, be back online in 10/15min
[10:52] <amano> Can't we adjust ubuntu-dock transparency to match exactly the top bar transparency? Or vice verse? I think that those two different transparencies looks odd.
[10:53] <didrocks> amano: read my blog post, I explained why we didn't touch it yet
[11:00] <willcooke> Can anyone running Xenial proposed tell me if they have the correct G-Software icon?  i.e. the Ubuntu orange one?
[11:01]  * didrocks reboots on X as hacking on the Shell
[11:05] <seb128> willcooke, do you have ubuntu-software installed on that xenial-proposed?
[11:06] <seb128> if you opted in for some binaries you might have forgotten that one and it got uninstalled because of versions mismatches
[11:06] <willcooke> seb128, ah, that's probably what it is
[11:07] <willcooke> seb128, installed it, ran it, still have the GNOME icon, maybe I need to restart my session
[11:07] <willcooke> The name is correct in the about box
[11:07] <willcooke> The Hiri banner looks cool though
[11:08] <seb128> willcooke, yeah, you probably need to restart
[11:16] <jibel> willcooke, I've the orange case with a capital A on it
[11:17] <willcooke> thx jibel
[11:33] <jibel> is the shell slow to start for everyone or just me? On a low spec laptop it takes more than a minute between the moment I press the login button and the moment I can use the shell
[11:41] <seb128> it  takes me like 10-15s on a 6 years i5 laptop with rotational disk
[11:45] <didrocks> takes ~2s here with a 6 years i7 laptop and ssd
[11:46] <jibel> i've a g-s crash maybe that explains it
[11:46] <jibel> https://errors.ubuntu.com/bucket/?id=/usr/bin/gnome-shell%3A11%3A__GI___libc_free%3Ag_free%3Ameta_wayland_finalize%3Ameta_finalize%3Ameta_run
[11:46] <didrocks> oh probably
[11:46]  * jibel deletes the crash file and tries again
[11:50] <jibel> better, no crash but still over 30s
[11:59] <didrocks> nobody on the french forum reported this
[12:00] <didrocks> so, at least, not that widespread
[12:00] <didrocks> (and I can testify they are testing the changes)
[12:00] <didrocks> rotational disk?
[12:00] <didrocks> (as part of the low spec)
[12:00] <didrocks> we are opening some more files than barebone shell, but it's like 15 of them…
[12:03] <alexarnaud> Hello all
[12:05] <alexarnaud> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-orca/+bug/1714688
[12:05] <alexarnaud> At this time blind people couldn't use Ubuntu because Orca is broken. For me it is a RC bug because a blind person without orca can't use his computer, it is similar if the screen becomes black.
[12:05] <alexarnaud> willcooke: Do you think someone from the desktop team could take a look to this bug? I've investigated last Saturday the origin of the issue and I've find a way to figure out the issue so it's more or less a matter of uploading so.
[12:05] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1714688 in gnome-orca (Ubuntu) "orca fails to start" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[12:06] <alexarnaud> I just try to help you a little bit in this area to ensure no regression for the blind Ubuntu user-base.
[12:08] <seb128> alexarnaud, why didn't you keep using bug #1704847?
[12:08] <ubot5`> bug 1704847 in gnome-orca (Ubuntu) "orca crashes on startup" [High,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1704847
[12:08] <alexarnaud> seb128: it's the request of jbicha
[12:08] <seb128> alexarnaud, if you have changes you want to get sponsored the process is described on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
[12:09] <seb128> so you were talking to jbicha about it?
[12:09] <alexarnaud> seb128: I've added him on CC of the bug indeed.
[12:09] <alexarnaud> seb128: it's just a one-line change.
[12:10] <seb128> one line or more the sponsoring process is still the same
[12:11] <seb128> alexarnaud, that bug has no diff nor explanation of by autoreconf is needed and what the issue is
[12:18] <alexarnaud> So let me time to take a look more deeply on the sponsorship process. I could only do that on my spare time.
[12:19] <seb128> alexarnaud, looks like jbicha has been responding to you so maybe he's wanting to upload the change you suggest
[12:20] <alexarnaud> seb128: where? I've never seen the answer.
[12:21] <seb128> alexarnaud, you said he's the one who asked you to open a new bug?
[12:25] <alexarnaud> yes, you're right, here https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-orca/+bug/1704847/comments/11
[12:25] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1704847 in gnome-orca (Ubuntu) "orca crashes on startup" [High,Invalid]
[12:27] <alexarnaud> I've discovered cdbs last Saturday so I don't really understand what is the purpose of the autoconf.mk but the fact is it was included in previous release and it works.
[12:27] <alexarnaud> As I understand it takes care of new files.
[12:29] <seb128> right
[12:30] <seb128> jibel, thanks for sending that session bug upstream, I still find your descriptions confusing though, I hope upstream gets less confused
[12:30] <seb128> jibel, like the test case have ubuntu=xorg and the workaround ubuntu=wayland
[12:31] <seb128> I think it mixes descriptions from the time were xorg was default with now where wayland is default?
[12:31] <seb128> anyway let's see if they ask for details and which ones
[12:49] <jbicha> alexarnaud: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-orca/3.25.4-0ubuntu2 thank you for reporting and figuring out the issue! :)
[12:55] <alexarnaud> you're welcome.:)
[13:05] <jbicha> Laney: do you think LP: #1699216 needs a FFe? And do you think you'll have time to review the accountsservice patch? (I remember you briefly looked at an earlier version of it)
[13:05] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1699216 in gnome-initial-setup (Ubuntu) "Encrypted home support" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1699216
[13:15] <seb128> jbicha, thanks for that orca upload
[13:15] <seb128> jbicha, also on the firefox bug, did you remove the s390x from the title/description on purpose?
[13:17] <jbicha> seb128: yes, sorry for not commenting about that: firefox/s390x was already removed in yakkety or zesty
[13:18] <seb128> oh ok
[13:24] <Laney> jbicha: I dunno, it's probably fine as long as it doesn't affect any other codepaths, and I don't know if I'll have time to review.
[13:24] <Laney> I did ask around if some people would but they didn't reply to me.
[13:26] <jbicha> I can review the other packages but I felt uncomfortable with my knowledge of how libraries work to know if the accountsservice patch was ok
[13:29] <Laney> I'm not extremely happy with having to patch many things downstream for this feature FWIW
[13:30] <Laney> but unless someone wants to work on an upstreamable way to make users with encrypted home I don't see a way around it
[13:44] <jbicha> there was talk about encrypted home eventually using native ext4 encryption which should be upstreamable
[13:54] <gQuigs> IRC logs aren't updated yet... what's the blocker for encrypted home?
[13:55] <Laney> what blocker?
[13:56] <gQuigs> err.. what's "but unless someone wants to work on an upstreamable way to make users with encrypted home I don't see a way around it" talking about?
[13:57] <Laney> the patches use an ubuntu only flag to adduser
[14:03] <ricotz> hey desktopers, is there a chance to go through another poppler transition to update to 0.59.0?
[14:03] <ricotz> https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/ubuntu/staging/+sourcepub/8235372/+listing-archive-extra
[14:04] <jbicha> gQuigs: the blocker is someone reviewing the accountsservice patch from LP: #1699216 and checking that it won't cause us maintainability problems
[14:04] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1699216 in gnome-initial-setup (Ubuntu) "Encrypted home support" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1699216
[14:09] <seb128> ricotz, you need a ffe -> release team
[14:10] <Laney> why would we want to do that?
[14:10] <Laney> ricotz:
[14:10] <Laney> you should provide a strong argument otherwise I don't think so
[14:17] <gQuigs> ricotz: does it fix the jpeg regression? - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/poppler/+bug/1714596
[14:17] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1714596 in poppler (Ubuntu) "PDF images are blank" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[14:17] <jibel> seb128, I don't find a better way to describe the bug than its title. I've 2 laptop exhibiting this bug, 1 always starts xorg the other always wayland ...
[14:17]  * gQuigs testing
[14:17] <jibel> and now upstream wants a proof that it's an upstream bug, that's helpful
[14:18] <seb128> jibel, right, don't worry, the title/issue is understandable, it's the steps/testcases which are a bit confusing but I guess it's because nobody found a reliable way to hit the issue
[14:18] <seb128> bah
[14:18] <didrocks> would be good to reproduce it in like fedora with multiple sessions maybe? :p
[14:19] <seb128> the triager is annoying
[14:19] <seb128> let me reopen
[14:24] <k_alam> jibel: Is this issue related to yours? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/poppler/+bug/1714596
[14:24] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1714596 in poppler (Ubuntu) "PDF images are blank" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[14:24] <k_alam> Ah sorry this one https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdm/+bug/1714876
[14:24] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1714876 in gdm (Ubuntu) "GDM doesn't show xorg session at login (Artful)" [Undecided,Incomplete]
[14:33] <Laney> how do you think we should fix bug #1712289?
[14:33] <ubot5`> bug 1712289 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Wrong theme in ubiquity-dm and 'Install Ubuntu' " [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1712289
[14:33] <Laney> it's because the XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP isn't set there I think and now we have per-session overrides
[14:34] <Laney> presumably in bin/ubiquity-dm somehow
[14:34] <ricotz> seb128, Laney, yeah, mostly enhancements and new features, so not really a bugfix release
[14:35] <gQuigs> ricotz: nope, it doesn't fix the jpeg regression - it seems like all jpegs won't display now...
[14:35] <ricotz> gQuigs, hmm, I don't think so if is it related to the unmaintained jpx part
[14:35] <ricotz> openjpeg is what is needed as the bug already suggests
[14:35] <didrocks> Laney: yeah, now that previous ubiquity is out of proposed, someone can tackle this. I may do it after the g-c-c thing. It's a one-liner fix via XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP IMHO + creating a new mode for the Shell
[14:36] <didrocks> or you will have unmatching theme in the Shell
[14:36] <didrocks> and if you set it to "ubuntu", you will have the dock, which you don't want :p
[14:37] <gQuigs> ricotz: well it used to work with a lot more PDFs in poppler in 17.04 and now doesn't
[14:38] <Laney> didrocks: ah right, there's already a mode for ubiquity, presumably that just needs the theme
[14:38] <didrocks> Laney: hum, I didn't see it? I guess we are using the gdm one otherwise? (which might be enough)
[14:38] <Laney> it comes from ubiquity itself
[14:39] <didrocks> oh
[14:39] <didrocks> interesting
[14:39] <didrocks> bin/ubiquity-dm:                wm_cmd = ['gnome-shell', '--sm-disable', '--mode=ubiquity']
[14:39] <didrocks> yep
[14:39] <didrocks> so just need to add the theme to it
[14:39] <didrocks> Laney: I can have a look either by EOW or next one
[14:39] <didrocks> sounds easy anyway, just unsure how to test it easily
[14:39]  * gQuigs wonders if most users open PDFs in browser these days...  renders fine in Firefox..
[14:40] <didrocks> (I hope that ubiquity won't stays forever again in proposed)
[14:41] <Laney> bah
[14:41] <Laney> it's hard to hack ubiquity-dm
[14:41] <didrocks> I wonder if a persistent usb key isn't the best :p
[14:44] <jbicha> Laney: I think we need https://code.launchpad.net/~jbicha/ubiquity/adapt-to-gsd325/+merge/329902
[14:45] <Laney> sure, but that's not the same bug
[14:45] <jbicha> oh
[14:46] <Laney> hmm
[14:46] <Laney> maybe I can use a shared mount thingy in virt-manager to get at my home directory
[14:46] <Laney> probably won't work from busybox will it
[14:47] <didrocks> Laney: what do you try to do?
[14:47] <Laney> copy ubiquity-dm back in
[14:48] <didrocks> ah, yeah, from casper_bottom, you can't do much apart from trying to hack directly
[14:48] <didrocks> which is doable for tests at least
[14:49] <Laney> it's really hard to insert lines there
[14:49] <Laney> especially in python
[14:49] <didrocks> yeah, appending is easy with a cat >>, but editing…
[14:50]  * Laney optimistically tries to install vim /o\
[14:50] <Laney> huh, it seems to work
[14:50] <didrocks> when breaking at casper_bottom?
[14:50] <Laney> yeah
[14:50] <Laney> then chroot into it
[14:50] <didrocks> waow :)
[14:51] <didrocks> sounds like it's going to be easy then
[14:51] <didrocks> do you want to export the XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP unconditionnally for G-S?
[14:51] <Laney> probs
[14:51] <didrocks> so I guess in wm_cmd = ['gnome-shell'…
[14:51] <Laney> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~laney/ubiquity/1712289/revision/6552
[14:51] <didrocks> and ofc, the other change is just http://paste.ubuntu.com/25472549/
[14:51] <Laney> !!!
[14:52] <didrocks> yep!
[14:52] <didrocks> as gnome-shell or ubiquity is supposively launching the other processes
[14:52] <didrocks> it should be good to load the correct gtk overrides
[14:52] <didrocks> (theme)
[14:55] <Laney> I think we need a dbus-update-activation-environment too
[14:56] <didrocks> oh correct
[14:58] <Laney> noooooooooooooooOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooooope not enough
[15:01] <Laney> how's this override thing supposed to work?
[15:04] <didrocks> just using the mode is enough
[15:04] <didrocks> it's either the env var or the --mode option
[15:04] <didrocks> you don't have the css taken into account?
[15:05] <didrocks> or you mean the per desktop name override?
[15:05] <didrocks> (gsettings)
[15:05] <Laney> you need the gtk theme too
[15:05] <Laney> yes
[15:05] <didrocks> for the latter, it's simply gsettings (glib) reading the correct matching key
[15:05] <didrocks> can you look if the ubiquity-gtk process has the env variable?
[15:06] <Laney> it does
[15:07] <Laney> but gsettings get gives Ambiance
[15:07] <Laney> erm
[15:07] <Laney> Adwaita
[15:08] <didrocks> gsettings get in a terminal which has the env variable?
[15:08] <Laney> yes
[15:11] <didrocks> g_variant_lookup_value was all internal to the process to me
[15:12] <didrocks> but yeah, you are right, exporting the env var and running gsettings get doesn't work
[15:14] <Laney> ._.
[15:17] <muktupavels> are you speaking about per-desktop overrides? I can use XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP=something gsettings get ... to get per desktop value...
[15:19] <seb128> jbicha, do you plan to follow up on devel to say that you opened the firefox ppc64el remove bug?
[15:20] <jbicha> seb128: maybe, the bug is still unfinished
[15:20] <seb128> right, but it's still an useful piece of discussion/follow up
[15:20] <seb128> if you don't want to I can do it
[15:20] <seb128> so at least we let other know that the intend is to go in that direction
[15:20] <seb128> we might have people who argue against before the bug is complete
[15:21] <Laney> muktupavels: do you understand this? http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/uhh.png
[15:21] <didrocks> muktupavels: that's what I thought/got as well, but I can't in my current setup
[15:21]  * Laney feels silly
[15:21] <didrocks> Laney: did you try exporting the var?
[15:21] <Laney> it is
[15:22]  * Laney whimpers
[15:22]  * Laney restarts and tries again
[15:22] <didrocks> Laney: yeah, can reproduce here
[15:22] <jbicha> seb128: go ahead, but removing firefox/ppc64el won't help us much since Chris is blocking armhf removal, right?
[15:23] <didrocks> Laney: so, indeed, I was just using XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP=GNOME gsettings, and it's indeed local
[15:23] <seb128> jbicha, it's not going to help the current situation but we had other cycles where ppc64el was the blocker
[15:23] <didrocks> Laney: I don't understand why exporting the env var doesn't work for our use case though… (and what's even different for the process)
[15:23] <Laney> haha
[15:23] <seb128> jbicha, so it's still a welcome move for the futur
[15:23] <Laney> didrocks: it is there in the process, I can see its environment
[15:23] <Laney> I copied it into that shell, that's why it's set
[15:24]  * Laney tries again from clean
[15:24] <Laney> hmm
[15:25] <Laney> ubiquity is doing stuff with gsettings earlier on
[15:25] <didrocks> Laney: ubiquity-dm doesn't spawn a separate process for ubiquity-gtk?
[15:25] <Laney> before I set XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP
[15:25] <didrocks> unnice
[15:25] <didrocks> but still, that doesn't explain the export XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP=GNOME;  gsettings get… and XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP=GNOME gsettings get… difference
[15:26] <didrocks> and I must say you really puzzled me on that one
[15:26] <Laney> wouldn't worry, I probably messed something up
[15:26] <didrocks> (even if it's not related to this issue :p)
[15:26] <didrocks> Laney: no, as told, I can reproduce
[15:26] <didrocks> in my session
[15:26] <Laney> k, got confused about what you can reproduce and not
[15:27] <seb128> weird thing
[15:27] <didrocks> I can reproduce the "export XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP=GNOME; gsettings get…" giving a different result than "XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP=GNOME gsettings get…"
[15:27] <didrocks> which, apart from the lifetime of the export, shouldn't make any difference to me
[15:28] <muktupavels> rebuild gsettings with printf line that shows what it sees?
[15:29] <didrocks> yeah, unsure we want to invest into this, apart if the gsettings binary itself fork and strip some env var not in $*…
[15:29] <didrocks> so could be binary specific
[15:29] <didrocks> Laney: on your actual fix… unsure how we can do
[15:29] <Laney> oh FFS I picked live session mode this time
[15:29]  * Laney cries
[15:29] <didrocks> Laney: the glib code is doing:
[15:29] <didrocks> +  if (g_once_init_enter (&current_desktops))
[15:29] <Laney> better write some notes
[15:29] <didrocks> to detect current desktop
[15:29] <seb128> ok, it's meeting time
[15:30] <didrocks> so, it will be on the first load…
[15:30] <seb128> didrocks, Laney, sorry, going to have to pause or move
[15:30] <didrocks> no worry ;)
[15:30] <seb128> #startmeeting Desktop Team 2017-09-05
[15:30] <meetingology> Meeting started Tue Sep  5 15:30:18 2017 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[15:30] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[15:30] <seb128> Roll call: andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks, duflu (out), jbicha, jamesh (out), jibel/heber (out), kenvandine, laney, oSoMoN (out), seb128, tkamppeter(out), trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
[15:30] <kenvandine> o/
[15:30] <jbicha> o/
[15:30] <andyrock> o/
[15:31] <seb128> we have quite some people out today
[15:31] <seb128> anyway, let's get started
[15:32] <seb128> andyrock, hey
[15:32] <andyrock> # Livepatch: updating branches
[15:32] <andyrock> # Some work to resolve G++7 issues on artful
[15:32] <andyrock> # Implementing notification bedge in ubuntu-dock (will propose the branch soon)
[15:32] <andyrock> # eow
[15:32] <didrocks> (progress support as well? :))
[15:32] <seb128> thanks andyrock
[15:33] <andyrock> didrocks: I'll do that in a different branch
[15:33] <didrocks> ok
[15:33] <seb128> one thing at the time!
[15:33] <seb128> k, next one
[15:33] <seb128> dgadomski, hey
[15:33] <dgadomski> hey
[15:34] <andyrock> it's just visul work, the backend code is done already
[15:34] <dgadomski> sadly I have nothing desktop-related to share this week
[15:34] <dgadomski> eof
[15:34] <seb128> thanks dgadomski
[15:35] <seb128> didrocks, hey
[15:35] <didrocks> Just around for 3 days (took some swap days last week) and wasn't around last week, so report for ~1.5 week:
[15:35] <didrocks> * Packaged and seeded KStatusNotifier/Appindicator extension. Wrote about it in https://didrocks.fr/2017/08/23/ubuntu-gnome-shell-in-artful-day-7/.
[15:35] <didrocks> * Fit & Finish sprint + post-post polisht by making the theme changes more consistant and maintainable.
[15:35] <didrocks> * Wrote up about those on https://didrocks.fr/2017/08/25/ubuntu-gnome-shell-in-artful-day-8/ and https://didrocks.fr/2017/09/04/ubuntu-gnome-shell-in-artful-day-9/. Track and answers comments on blog, omgubuntu and french forum.
[15:35] <didrocks> * Track the upstream incoming changes for transparency (sounds quite experimental still)
[15:35] <didrocks> * Got my GNOME foundation membership and blog added to planet GNOME
[15:35] <didrocks> * Some AA work
[15:35] <didrocks> * . ;)
[15:35] <kenvandine> didrocks, congrats
[15:35] <didrocks> thx!
[15:36] <seb128> well done indeed :-)
[15:36]  * seb128 should do the same
[15:36] <seb128> thanks didrocks
[15:37] <seb128> * Totem:
[15:37] <seb128>   - I've been deep-diving into totem performance for most of the week: https://trello.com/c/7zeMdP0S/240-fix-totem-performance
[15:37] <seb128>   - What makes it difficult is that GTK's signal-driven architecture hides cause from effect (hides callers from callees).
[15:37] <seb128>   - Finally tracked down the biggest CPU hog to clutter-gtk. Totem (and gnome-maps at least) is using 50% of its CPU time software-rendering the window background and decorations on every video frame: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=787001
[15:37] <ubot5`> Gnome bug 787001 in GtkClutterEmbed "clutter-gtk apps like totem and gnome-maps are spending 50% of their CPU time redrawing GTK widgets" [Normal,New]
[15:37] <seb128>   - I now have a patch that halves CPU of totem and gnome-maps, so if all else fails we will patch that I'm just holding off for the moment to see if I can come up with a different solution that doesn't make upstream upset. Because the issue right now is that it may cause reduced smoothness in gnome-maps on very fast machines. But that's it... slower machines would of course benefit more from the halved CPU.
[15:37] <seb128>   - Now also trying to understand how mutter and others composite such sub-surface apps so I can get the theory right before proceeding.
[15:37] <seb128> * Video acceleration:
[15:37] <seb128>   - Public announcement about out-of-box support is still blocked for the past month awaiting: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-restricted-addons/+bug/1709166
[15:37] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1709166 in ubuntu-restricted-addons (Ubuntu) "Refresh Restricted Addons" [Undecided,In progress]
[15:37] <seb128>   - Fun numbers: Totem (on Wayland) uses about 4-5x more CPU than other players, even when all are using VAAPI because:
[15:37] <seb128>     . 50% Software rendering the GTK window/widgets/decorations on every video frame
[15:37] <seb128>     . 20% VAAPI decoding the video (this part is equal to other players)
[15:37] <seb128>     . 15% GStreamer overhead including audio decoding
[15:37] <seb128>     . 10% other
[15:37] <seb128>     .  5% cogl-rendering the the video texture
[15:37] <seb128> * PulseAudio:
[15:37] <seb128>   - Xenial SRU is now blocked by crash reports of the primary "fixed" bug still happening... https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/1:8.0-0ubuntu3.4
[15:37] <seb128>   - Not sure I care about xenial enough to persue that right now given sponsors also insist on patching zesty first. Not worth the effort right now.
[15:37] <seb128> * Daily bug management across gnome-shell, gdm, ubuntu-themes, bluez, pulseaudio and mir.
[15:38] <seb128>
[15:38] <seb128> would be nice if somebody could help and review the ubuntu-restricted-addons sponsoring request
[15:38] <seb128> (that comment is from me, not from his summary)
[15:38] <seb128> on that note moving on
[15:38] <seb128> jbicha, hey
[15:38] <jbicha> • GNOME Shell 3.25.91 is now in artful
[15:38] <jbicha> • Merged GNOME 3.24/3.26 packaging upstream to Debian allowing us to sync lots of packages
[15:38] <jbicha> • In particular if LP's changelog history is complete and I didn't miss something, this allowed us to sync evolution packaging from Debian for the first time since warty
[15:38] <jbicha> • Filed https://bugzilla.gnome.org/787266 I'll probably drop the installed-tests from our autopkgtests with next update
[15:39] <ubot5`> Gnome bug 787266 in general "test suite is unreliable" [Normal,New]
[15:39] <jbicha> • Added the final piece for the Captive Portal feature
[15:39] <jbicha> • Dropped onboard from default install
[15:39] <jbicha> • Uploaded Builder 3.25.91 (with terminal disabled because of the vte/pcre2 thing. Maybe that can be re-enabled later if someone rebases the 3.24 patches)
[15:39] <jbicha> • Released GNOME Tweaks 3.25.92 and blogged about recent changes there
[15:39] <jbicha> • requested & sponsored bhavi's mobile-broadband-provider-info update. He intends to work on an SRU for it too
[15:39] <jbicha> • gnome-control-center 3.25 still blocked on someone rebasing the dock settings patch
[15:39] <jbicha> eof
[15:39] <jbicha> that's evolution-data-server's autopkgtests
[15:40] <seb128> jbicha, I'm working on that atm, I should have the UI part done today and Didier is going to look at the backend then
[15:40] <seb128> that = g-c-c dock settings
[15:40] <jbicha> thanks
[15:40] <seb128> yw
[15:40] <seb128> thanks jbicha, good work as usual! :-)
[15:40] <seb128> * snapd: updated pending polkit PRs based on review feedback.  The
[15:40] <seb128> allow-interaction PR has been merged, and I think the other is likely
[15:40] <seb128> to follow this week.
[15:40] <seb128> * snapd-glib: Robert merged my matching allow-interaction PR, which is
[15:40] <seb128> included in the 1.19 release.  At this point, it looks like we will
[15:40] <seb128> have everything in place to do graphical installs of snaps without a
[15:40] <seb128> store account once snapd 2.28 is released.
[15:40] <seb128> * Got my GNOME git account reactivated to ease future work on
[15:40] <seb128> gnome-software and any other upstream work.
[15:40] <seb128> And still to do:
[15:40] <seb128> * finish off porting privacy control panel abrt code to whoopsie and
[15:40] <seb128> get it into our packages.
[15:40] <seb128> * Add host system font support to "desktop" snapd interface once the
[15:40] <seb128> corresponding core snap PR is accepted.
[15:40] <seb128> * Check on status of theming in snaps, and features required to support portals.
[15:41] <seb128>
[15:41] <seb128> - Daily triaging - errors.u.c, gnome-software, wayland, gdm/session
[15:41] <seb128> - Login session testing and test plan:
[15:41] <seb128>     https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Process/Merges/TestPlans/ubuntu-session
[15:41] <seb128> - Reviewed and merged fixes in utah for server testing
[15:41] <seb128> - SRU of gnome-software in xenial
[15:41] <seb128> - Submitted merge proposal with gnome core apps tests
[15:41] <seb128> - Results for tests running in MaaS are being reported to grafana dashboard
[15:41] <seb128> - Find out whether it is possible to introspect the login page
[15:42] <seb128>
[15:42] <seb128> kenvandine, hey
[15:42]  * kenvandine waves
[15:42] <kenvandine> * gnome-system-monitor is now available in the edge channel fully confined.  My request to auto-connect required interfaces did get two votes so should get the declaration added.
[15:42] <kenvandine> * spent time trying to figure out why thumbnails weren't working in eog, and found that if i hacked around the mimetype query it worked.  However, at some point it thumbnails started working (no idea why).  I've verified on in a clean VM I did get thumbnails from the version of eog published in the edge channel.  Would be nice if someone else could verify that as well.
[15:42] <kenvandine> * Had some more discussions related to auto-connecting of the gnome content interface and responded to that thread on the forum.  I think the best short term solution is to rename the snap as suggested and hope what they are working on in snapd will provide a more solid solution going forward.
[15:42] <kenvandine> * Created branches for all of my snaps adding the wayland interface.  Tested them all with wayland against core from edge, all good to go now.
[15:42] <kenvandine> * Working with folks from GNOME engaugement team to create some docs to help users transition from Unity to GNOME.
[15:42] <kenvandine> eof
[15:42] <seb128> kenvandine, what do you need testing with eog exactly?
[15:43] <kenvandine> install eog from edge, open an image with it
[15:43] <kenvandine> you should get the thumbnails at the bottom
[15:43] <kenvandine> oh
[15:43] <seb128> if the bottom bar is displayed?
[15:43] <kenvandine> you will probably need to check "Image Gallery" in the menu
[15:43] <seb128> right
[15:43] <kenvandine> yeah
[15:43] <seb128> k, I'm going to give it a try
[15:44] <kenvandine> thx
[15:44] <seb128> thanks kenvandine
[15:44] <seb128> Laney, hey
[15:44] <Laney> hi
[15:44] <Laney> • autopkgtest:
[15:44] <Laney> ∘ debugging ppc64el cloud-init brokenness, now reported (LP: #1715128)
[15:44] <Laney> ∘ arguing about when it's ok to force
[15:44] <Laney> ∘ s390x broke due to a firewall change, hassle people to get it working again
[15:44] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1715128 in cloud-init (Ubuntu) "Crashes in convert_ec2_metadata_network_config on ScalingStack bos01 (ppc64el)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1715128
[15:44] <Laney> ∘ try to get credentials for the new cloud to run s390x/ppc64el/arm64, let's us get rid of the special s390x setup and run on normal VMs
[15:44] <Laney> • some light sponsoring
[15:44] <Laney> • quite a few FF reviews
[15:44] <Laney> • random fixes/syncs (fwupd/evince/gnome-shell-extensions, ...)
[15:44] <Laney> • more mozjs52 armhf debugging, found a fix that was uploaded to artful & then committed to debian
[15:44] <Laney> • start working on some snap related changes we might want to do for 17.10
[15:45] <Laney> • currently looking at theme things in ubiquity-dm
[15:45] <Laney> 🏚
[15:45] <seb128> thanks laney
[15:46] <seb128> - debugged a bit/reported xwayland&kvm segfault
[15:46] <seb128> - reported xwayland/arrows key issue
[15:46] <seb128> - tested new gnome-software/snapd-glib and reported problem still existing with the gnome-shell search provider
[15:46] <seb128> - landed some indicator-session pending packaging tweaks (extra icons installed, langpack in universe)
[15:46] <seb128> - debugged/fixed missing openvpn translations
[15:46] <seb128> - debugged/fixed gnome-bluetooth translation issues
[15:46] <seb128> - reviewed/accepted some new translation templated in launchpad
[15:46] <seb128> - tried to debug gnome-session starting the wrong session issue
[15:46] <seb128> - updated n-m-openvpn
[15:46] <seb128> - look a bit at updating the dock settings g-c-c patch but it's non trivial, changed to add a new panel
[15:46] <seb128> - sponsored the new libreoffice for Olivier
[15:46] <seb128> - dealt with mailman configuration changes on the desktop list, post server maintainance

[15:46] <seb128>
[15:46] <seb128> - GSoC 2017: Final evaluations of the students
[15:46] <seb128> - cups-filters: Bug fixes, especially also on PCLm support, studied temporary alternative for PDF form printing as the QPDF changes did not get ready. Fixed a general PDF form printing bug.
[15:46] <seb128> - ghostscript: Reported upstream bug and got fix for PDF form printing.
[15:46] <seb128> - MuPDF: Reported PDF form printing bugs.
[15:46] <seb128> - Bugs
[15:47] <seb128>
[15:47] <seb128> Trevinho, hey
[15:48] <Trevinho> · More work with clutter and resource scaling:
[15:48] <Trevinho>    - Refactoring in ClutterActor and some fixes to avoid infinite loops
[15:48] <Trevinho>    - Fixed multiple ClutterText issues (all the ones I found so far) fixing positioning, offsets and mouse integration in text entries
[15:48] <Trevinho> · More checks in gcc7 build issues, blocked by missing porter box for failing architectures
[15:48] <Trevinho> EOF
[15:48] <seb128> I didn't see him today but he's not
[15:48] <seb128> oh
[15:48] <seb128> hey Trevinho :-)
[15:48] <Trevinho> Hey seb128 😀
[15:48] <Trevinho> Hiding in the cave, but here
[15:48] <jbicha> I think a separate Dock panel is probably a good idea for the new layout (& I agree about the patch being non-trivial to update)
[15:48] <seb128> Laney, do you have any idea how we could unblock Trevinho's access to porter boxes?
[15:48] <Laney> what's blocking it?
[15:49] <seb128> jbicha, :-)
[15:49] <Laney> file an RT asking for it?#
[15:49] <seb128> Trevinho, do you have a r-t stuck or something?
[15:49] <Trevinho> Laney, seb128 I've opened the ticket...
[15:49] <Trevinho> but I'm waiting
[15:50] <Laney> how long?
[15:50] <Trevinho> They replied, but still working in that...
[15:50] <Trevinho> And I followed up yesterday too
[15:50] <Laney> if it's urgent / blocking you go ping the vanguard in #is internal and maybe they'll do it right away for you
[15:51] <seb128> k, let's do that off meeting
[15:51] <seb128> Trevinho, please /msg me the rt url
[15:51] <seb128> thanks Trevinho
[15:51] <Trevinho> It wasn't urgent, but I don't want to keep it staying in that state too much
[15:51] <Trevinho> Ack
[15:51] <seb128> #topic aob
[15:51] <seb128> do we have any other topic this week?
[15:52] <seb128> jbicha, g-c-c was already mentioned but I hope that gets unblocked this week
[15:52] <jbicha> .
[15:52] <seb128> seems on track for it
[15:52] <jbicha> ooh, I'd like to figure out what's required for failsafex and what we can safely drop
[15:52] <seb128> ah
[15:52] <seb128> I didn't really follow on that topic
[15:52] <jbicha> the whole xterm issue https://bugs.debian.org/856858
[15:52] <ubot5`> Debian bug 856858 in src:xterm "xterm: Please split .desktop files into separate binary package" [Normal,Open]
[15:52] <jbicha> and xdiagnose
[15:53] <jbicha> xdiagnose doesn't work in GNOME on Wayland any way
[15:53] <seb128> does the failsafex still make sense in a wayland world?
[15:53] <seb128> right...
[15:53] <didrocks> but we still have X, however, I would agree to drop it
[15:53] <jbicha> I need to follow up with tjaalton to get his input about all that
[15:54] <jbicha> I assume he's the one most interested in X stuff around Ubuntu now
[15:54] <didrocks> indeed
[15:54] <seb128> right, I was going to suggest asking tjaalton what he thinks
[15:55] <didrocks> for the record, we might move a bunch of icons to the "utilities" subgroup in GNOME Shell
[15:55] <didrocks> that was part of the hackfest discussion
[15:55] <didrocks> just need to find time for that
[15:55] <didrocks> (the list is in trello board)
[15:55] <didrocks> https://trello.com/c/Cpt4wwRw/204-london-fit-and-finish-hackfest
[15:55] <jbicha> didrocks: I had trouble hacking gnome-menus last year when I tried
[15:55] <didrocks> jbicha: oh? we have some in it, but what's the trouble was about?
[15:56] <jbicha> I wanted to kill Sundry
[15:56] <seb128> they didn't drop that utility subgroup thing yet?
[15:56] <seb128> it's sort of confusing imho :-/
[15:56] <didrocks> no, if you open your overview, you will find it
[15:56] <jbicha> in Ubuntu GNOME default, dconf-editor was the only thing in Sundry
[15:56] <seb128> right, I just did
[15:56] <seb128> the g-s dash is pretty poor, make me almost miss the unity one :p
[15:56] <didrocks> from the trello board, after a review between willcooke, popey and I: Update utilities (add imagemagick, xterm, fcitx*, input method, mozc setup, onboard settings, power statistics, software & update, startup applications, xterm, uxterm)
[15:56] <didrocks> well -onboard now :p
[15:56] <seb128> seems like most of that list should go away
[15:57] <seb128> fcitx as well
[15:57] <didrocks> what I tried to argue for, but others were unsure
[15:57] <jbicha> imagemagick has the same issue as xterm in that I want to hide or not install the .desktop but having trouble getting Debian to care for my proposal
[15:57] <seb128> we should do that in Ubuntu at least
[15:57] <didrocks> will seems to think people want to have this (horrible) imagemagick UI
[15:58] <didrocks> I was just going to NoDisplay it otherwise :p
[15:58] <jbicha> I'll file a bug with my imagemagick packaging proposal for you to review
[15:58] <seb128> thanks
[15:58] <didrocks> jbicha: well, not me, talk to Will first ;)
[15:58] <seb128> I can talk to Will&review
[15:58] <didrocks> the rest is rather "let's hide them in the utility section"
[15:59] <seb128> those sections are just weird but that would be better than nothing
[15:59] <jbicha> speaking of hiding things, LP: #1696250
[15:59] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1696250 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "Please hide Start Center and Math" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1696250
[15:59] <seb128> I guess that's enough on that topic for the meeting
[15:59] <didrocks> yeah, to have a shorter list useful for our users
[15:59] <didrocks> yep
[15:59] <seb128> jbicha, ah, let's see with Olivier next week once he's back for that one
[15:59] <jbicha> ok
[15:59] <didrocks> jbicha: same, I tried to argue hiding Start
[15:59] <didrocks> I was in the minority :)
[16:00] <seb128> other topics?
[16:00] <jbicha> no aob from me today
[16:00] <kenvandine> nope
[16:00] <didrocks> nothing else!
[16:00] <seb128> k
[16:00] <seb128> btw those who have upload rights
[16:01] <seb128> didrocks, kenvandine, jbicha, Laney, if any of you want to review the ubuntu-restricted suggested changes from the list please do
[16:02] <seb128> if nobody does I'm just going to upload with libav added
[16:02] <seb128> since that's blocking duflu for weeks
[16:02] <seb128> I don't have enough opinion/context on what restricted is supposed to do to be confident uploading all the suggested changes
[16:03] <seb128> k, that was my aob for today
[16:03] <seb128> I guess we can wrap
[16:03] <seb128> thanks everybody
[16:03] <seb128> #endmeeting
[16:03] <meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Sep  5 16:03:12 2017 UTC.
[16:03] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2017/ubuntu-desktop.2017-09-05-15.30.moin.txt
[16:03] <didrocks> I guess it's fine to just upload with libav, I don't have enough opinions on codec vs code quality which is really specialize
[16:03] <didrocks> thanks
[16:03] <seb128> thanks for the input didrocks :-)
[16:03] <kenvandine> i can take  a look, but i've never really even considered ubuntu-restricted
[16:04] <Laney> is that the thing that's installed from the installer?
[16:04] <seb128> I think so?
[16:05] <seb128> as said I'm not really familiar enough with it
[16:05] <seb128> which is why I didn't upload
[16:05] <jbicha> seb128: I've done some uploads for -restricted-extras so maybe just add it my to-do list then
[16:05] <Laney> k, well, if it is then there's this comment in the seeds about the TB saying that libav isn't allowed on images
[16:05] <seb128> jbicha, thanks
[16:06] <Laney> don't know if this would have an impact there or not
[16:06] <seb128> Laney, can you reply on the list with that info maybe?
[16:06] <jbicha> oh
[16:06] <seb128> k, on that note I need to step out of a bit
[16:06] <seb128> I come back and deal with backlog etc later
[16:06] <Laney> I'll paste it into the bug
[16:06] <jbicha> I'm interested in the TB revisiting that decision since many Ubuntu flavors ship libav
[16:07] <andyrock> anyone knows if the dash-to-dock guys uses IRC
[16:07] <andyrock> and where
[16:07] <didrocks> I don't think they do, but they are responsive on github
[16:08] <andyrock> 💔
[16:10] <Laney> actually it already depends on it
[16:10] <Laney> s/depends on/recommends/
[16:11] <Laney> (for quite some times; this isn't what the debdiff is changing)
[16:12] <jbicha> oh ok
[16:13] <Laney> so yeah, no problemo from me
[16:13] <infinity> didrocks, Laney, jbicha: On my last upgrade/reboot, gnome-shell segfaults on startup.  With a fresh user, it's fine, so obviously it hates my old settings.  Who feels like helping debug this (or at least helping me log into my regular user without wiping out all my dot-dirs)?
[16:14] <infinity> As upgrade experiences go, this one's not necessarily the best. ;)
[16:14] <jbicha> infinity: I had https://bugzilla.gnome.org/786660 but couldn't find anyone to duplicate it or further debug it
[16:14] <ubot5`> Gnome bug 786660 in general "3.25.91: Unable to log in: invalid monitor configuration, Logical monitors not adjecent" [Critical,New]
[16:15] <jbicha> otherwise, I am weak in mutter/gnome-shell crash debug skills
[16:18] <infinity> jbicha: My hero.  Moving monitors.xml let me log in.
[16:19] <infinity> jbicha: I think we need to make hunting that down a priority.  We can't be the only two.
[16:20] <jbicha> infinity: can you try to provide the backtrace requested on that bug?
[16:22] <infinity> jbicha: I might be able to.  I have my Own Work(tm) to get to today first, with exciting deadlines of "a week ago".
[16:27] <jbicha> I'm thinking the issue is triggered because I copied my monitors.xml from another computer or 2, no problems with that until mutter 3.25.91
[16:28] <infinity> jbicha: Not so here.  This monitors.xml came from a fresh install (of ... wily?) on this laptop, plus years of random use.  Only external monitors ever attached would have been projectors.
[16:29] <infinity> Not exactly a complicated looking file either.  Nor does it look obviously broken.
[17:56] <willcooke> night all
[17:57] <amano> didrocks, see https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2370542&p=13683562#post13683562
[17:59] <amano> can you change the description text in ubuntu-dock to tell people that ubuntu dock has to be removed with "apt remove ubuntu dock"?
[18:10] <amano> "If you want to use another dock or run Ubuntu without a dock remove the dock with  the command "sudo apt remove ubuntu dock" in a Terminal
[18:10] <amano> "
[18:10] <amano> something like that
[18:18] <amano> or rather this: "You can remove this extension with the packaging program. Type "sudo apt remove" in the Terminal
[18:18] <amano> "
[18:20] <amano> (well: "sudo apt remove ubuntu-dock" of course
[18:20] <amano> )


[10:02] <CryptoSiD> anyone noticed that php-common can't be updated else it uninstall php7.4 and php7.4-fpm?
[10:03] <CryptoSiD> on Ubuntu 21.10
[10:03] <CryptoSiD> It's been like this for almost 1 week :)
[14:23] <athos> CryptoSiD: This may be relevant: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2021-May/041456.html
[14:35] <CryptoSiD> Ho I see! Thank you!
[14:36] <Ussat> its Php, removing it is a good thing
[14:48] <CryptoSiD> lol


[11:07] <johnny_bravo> hey guys, how can i set the hostname with cloud-init on ubuntu 16.04 so that it sends it’s new name to the dhcp server
[11:07] <johnny_bravo> this ‘send host-name = gethostname();’ in dhclient.conf gets the old name
[11:07] <johnny_bravo> once i reboot the VM the hostname is sent correctly
[11:08] <johnny_bravo> is there a way to do this?
[11:08] <johnny_bravo> im using qemu-kvm and the user-data is on a cdrom iso image
[18:01] <rharper> powersj: you poked on cloud-init snappy and package install, I noticed that if you ssh in , the config-final modules aren't done yet; so initially snap list didn't show those py-numpy and such, but after the module completes they are present
[18:12] <powersj> rharper: interesting I'll give it another round this afternoon
[18:12] <powersj> maybe I didn't wait long enough :(
[18:13] <powersj> I usually wait for /var/lib/cloud/instance/boot-finished to show up
[19:12] <rharper> powersj: ok
[19:20] <rharper> powersj: http://paste.ubuntu.com/23512996/  ; the 'ready' state of the last snap installed corresponds pretty much to the timestamp on boot-finished ;  snap install doesn't appear to be async; but I suppose it's possible that a snap install has completed, but it doesn't appear in snap list until it's ready and that may be async from cloud-init finish
[21:13] <powersj> rharper: I'm starting to wonder if all my issues are with the fact that I'm using LXD as a backend
[21:13] <powersj> is that what you are using? or VMs?
[21:19] <rharper> powersj: vms
[21:19] <rharper> it's possible there's an issue with snappy under lxd, you may need to update your host (lxd updates)
[21:19] <rharper> and/or ensure we launch with a profile that supports snappy under lxd (nested security support is needed)
[21:20] <rharper> that may be kernel (4.8 or updates to 4.4) etc
[21:20] <rharper> I suggest asking in #lxd for the right levels/config options needed


[03:54] <nhandler> I found an interesting document that Debian uses for Doc NMs. http://svn.debian.org/viewsvn/nm/trunk/nm-templates/doc-nms_howto.txt   Maybe we could base some of our ~ubuntu-core-doc requirements on it
[19:15] <mdke> please note: I'm in the process of moving some branches around at the moment, please refrain from pushing to Launchpad for the time being, and keep an eye on the mailing list!


 windows accepts / path separator as well
 Your pp is pleasant
 @kergma, in some cases yes, but generally no, and certainly not in a form where both separators are mixed in the path string.
 it always accepts it, even in a mixed form, and it always did, since dos times
 I was surprised too when knew about this little fact
 (Photo, 677x342) https://irc.ubports.com/0SdugXe0.png mixed or not, both path delimiter are ok, the problem is that some commands use "/" as command line switch marker, for exmple "cd" does not, but "md" does, so it will not allow you to, say: md /test
 not everyone was happy that "/" was used as a command line switch, but when MSDOS came about we didn't have large storage devices and there were no directories other than rootdirectory, so the "/" symbol got adopted for command line switches, before directories got implemented, by which time it already was ambiguous, so "\" was
[04:14] <ubptgbot>  adopted for path delimiter. … https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/larryosterman/2005/06/24/why-is-the-dos-path-character/
 @dohbee just belatedly saw you linked me to @Flohack offering the enhancement of absorbing External Drives into System Settings. Cool, but no explicit confirmation that it will describe removable media storage amount/use, although the related issue about a storage indicator seems to. Again, I need to "git Git" to contribute to
[04:43] <ubptgbot>  these things at last!
 Has the anbox development ceased?
 @xreactx, No but we cant do all at the same time and we clearly said we need 16.04 working before.
 @Flohack, Clearly said it somewhere buried in this group...? Just asking because I haven't heard anything about it.
 Do you watch our webcasts?
 I used to... But they're really long. Needs to have a BLUF (bottom line up front)
 Well one hour is not that long. And we got asked in every other one and explained, thats why I sound frustrated. Anbox will come, but no ETA. First lets finish 16.04
 Ok. Well keep up the good work.
 @xreactx, We publish a resume with the main points after every Q&A For example see the last one https://ubports.com/blog/ubports-blog-1/post/ubuntu-touch-q-a-24-97
 @dohbee, So the question remains, whether the delimiter is causing the crop of install fails
[10:46] <ubptgbot> Thiago Rosa was added by: Thiago Rosa
[10:47] <ubptgbot> <Thiago Rosa> Hi, ubuntu touch is compatible with lgk10?
 @Thiago Rosa, Whats that?
 if it's not on this: https://ubports.com/page/get-ubuntu-touch … then probably not
[10:52] <ubptgbot> <Thiago Rosa> Lg k10 is smartphone
 @Thiago Rosa, No - but feel free to port to it 😉
[11:24] <ubptgbot> Tomas was added by: Tomas
 Hello
 I've wanted to get a bit more info about tablets with ubuntu-touch
 currently there's only official BQ support
 Is there anything else planned?
 There was official BQ support for Canonical Ubuntu Touch
 Just got nexus 5
 😍
 Hmm, I'm curious about the lenovo tab 4 8 plus, seems like a very good overall price/performance/feature balance
 Would even go as far as helping to port it, if I knew a thing about the hardware :|
 I've been looking for something tablet-like that runs linux and has decent specs
 Nexus 7 2013 (flo) is supported
 Look at https://docs.ubports.com/en/latest/porting/introduction.html for porting information
 Keeping in mind that I'm a dev and can follow documentation, how long might it take with a new device to get it up and running?
 @Tomas, Runs Linux, and runs Ubuntu touch, are not the same
 @Tomas, Between 1 and infinity hours
 @dohbee, Sounds about right.
 @Tomas, BQ M10 and M10 FHD but expensive
 And the hardware is a bit... meh...
 @Tomas, btw Tomas are you a Polish speaker?
 Lithuanian, so not really.
 Wow two Lithuanians 😎
 It's enough for a group
 Hmmm, I've heard rumours that some apps are properly installed by terminal apt install x, how much of that is true?
 If you do create a group, we'll fight the Polish ones!
 @libremax, @Domas
 @Tomas, None
 @libremax, [Edit] @Dohxis
 I currently own a bq e4.5 that I'll try to get under ubuntu-touch again
 I bailed it at OTA-12 or 13 and switched to android (shame on me)
 You can apt install legacy apps in libertine chtoot
 chroot
 Okay, then another question, there is a way to run google store apps on ubuntu touch now?
 No
 Anbox coming later
 Through some kind of a compatibility layer or an app... don't recall exactly
 Anbox later
 Yes! This is the kind of witchcraft I was told about https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdiIwXK2ssQ
 BQ E4.5 with its 1 Gig of RAM, anbox may not run correctly
 Honestly I enjoyed using ubuntu-touch a lot...
 Yeah... That device is not enough for "current use"
 Anbox will run fine
 Apps within might not, but eh
 Don't have anything apart for that phone, that currently has a "port"
 Wet dream would be to have this running ubuntu touch … https://www.amazon.de/dp/B072PZ2DGM
 Anbox alone not very usefull...
 just a POC
 Neither are such comments denigrating 1GB devices
 There are some efforts attempting to revive old devices for the current day. Wouldn't mind having the old E4.5 fully up and running, even after all the abuse it took from me 😁
 I like my bq E4.5 and don't see where are denigrating comments
 Do any of you own or test with a BQ M10  tablet?
 Browser youtube/netflix, terminal, VNC, maybe word processing performance is interesting to me
[12:11] <ubptgbot> Rajpratik71 was added by: Rajpratik71
 @Flohack, yes, 1 hour is not that long.  Plus you can also watch it after, or, download the audio at soundcloud.
 hey everyone, i want to ask why is sudo command asking me a password even tho i didnt set any password?
 @Flohack from the last Telegram update I'm no more able to pin the shortcut on the launcher
[13:18] <ubptgbot> Lol457 was added by: Lol457
 @Lol457, Welcoem, Nguyen! Take a look at this link to get you started! … https://ubports.com/telegram-welcome
 @Lol457, [Edit] Welcome, Nguyen! Take a look at this link to get you started! … https://ubports.com/telegram-welcome
 @c4trololo, how do you unlock the screen? with PIN?
 @dohbee, when i type in password, the screen shows nothing
 @c4trololo, when your phone screen locks, and then you go to unlock it, do you have to type in a PIN or passphrase?
 and yes, sudo password prompt does not show what you type
 @dohbee, im asking about is Ubuntu PC not Ubuntu Touch. ok thanks sir i'll try it one more time
 @c4trololo, This is not a support channel for Ubuntu on PCs. Go to #ubuntu on freenode IRC for that
 @dohbee, ok thanks sir
[13:36] <ubptgbot> lepatcoin was added by: lepatcoin
 Would be possible to have fm radio on nexus 5?😄
 @Gabriele, It does not have the hardware, so no
 An idea: would be cool to have the media preview of youtube/daily Motion linked in notification bar on audio section. This on desktop like unity 8.
 @Tomas, [Edit] I have bougth M10 FHD Ubuntu edition and now i use it with Ubports ota 3 and i no problem. The price on link you provide seems HD version and maybe android editon. i'm not go wrong on the Ubuntu version have "ubuntu Editon" written on the box. (the price for M10 FHD ubuntu editon was about 249 euro)
 The service is back online
 @Tomas, [Edit] I have bougth M10 FHD Ubuntu edition  2 years ago, and now i use it with Ubports ota 3 and i no problem. The price on link you provide seems HD version and maybe android editon. i'm not go wrong on the Ubuntu version have "ubuntu Editon" written on the box. (the price for M10 FHD ubuntu editon was about 249 e
[15:37] <ubptgbot> uro)
[15:45] <rah> how dependent on Android frameworks is UBports?
[15:45] <rah> would it be a big deal to port UBports to a GNU/Linux stack?
[15:47] <rah> by which I mean, a stack without any Android drivers
[15:48] <rah> only normal GNU/Linux drivers
 @rah, the ubuntu-touch stack is very heavily dependent on libhybris and the android HAL underneath, particularly on ARM
[15:49] <rah> for example, X or Wayland graphics, an oFono modem, etc.
 Ofono is already used afaik
 you can use the unity8-desktop-session stack though, on x86 at least
 yes, ofono is used for telephony bits
[15:50] <rah> dohbee: why x86 only and not arm?
 re: X/Wayland, no, Unity8 is extremely tightly tied to Mir, but you can run X apps with Xmir, and wayland clients should work at some point
[15:51] <rah> so it would require porting Mir
 @rah, because the packages are built that way. x86 assumption is PC, and ARM assumption is phone/tablet, right now
 @rah, i have no idea what you're trying to do, but i expect "porting mir" is not something necessary
[15:52] <rah> dohbee: I'm considering the amount of work needed to put UBports on a GNU/Linux phone
 rah, do you have such phone?
[15:53] <rah> and gauging interest in doing so
 but Mir has different backends
[15:53] <rah> NotKit: not at the moment
 @rah, "significant"
[15:53] <rah> dohbee: I see
 but you should theoretically be able to build AOSP using an upstream kernel and open source drivers, too, for such a device
[15:54] <rah> so I guess there isn't going to be much interest in making that happen
 e. g.  Android one and normal Linux DRM/KMS one
 @dohbee, At least freedreno only works with android Oreo, and libhybris has no support for it yet
 I think it'd be better to not screw with libhybris if we've got a DRM driver
 Is Ubuntu touch using any libhybris APIs directly?
[15:56] <rah> dohbee: I'm explicitly interested in avoiding Android
 sure, but if you can make true Linux phone, porting UBPorts would be least of worries
[15:56] <rah> NotKit: indeed
[15:57] <rah> so basically, in order to have UBports, a phone first needs to have Android on it
 @UniversalSuperBox, certainly, but it's not a trivial change, and one needs to rebuild stuff and create a custom rootfs
[15:57] <rah> pfft :-(
 All things which are in the realm of possibilities
 @rah, unless you want to do all the extra work to make it not need android, yes
 certainly, but people asking need to know what it will take
[15:59] <bshah> in theory... it should be easy to get mir working I think... given it have drm plugin already right?
[15:59] <bshah> (at least)
[15:59] <rah> is there anyone already working on UBports who's interested in doing the extra work to make it not need android?
 @rah, no, not all all. The ubports rootfs should just work out of the box. mir alredy has mesa DRM.
 @bshah, i mean, it's not hard to get it working, it works on x86 already
 Same way you can run our armhf rootfs in a qemu out of the box
[16:01] <rah> mariogrip: I'm not sure I understand what you're saying; you seem to be saying that UBports does not need Android first but if you're saying that, it's contradicting what other people are saying
 but getting things working as well without libhybris, as they do with, is going to be a lot of work
 you can believe him as project lead :)
 there are bits of things that rely on android properties and such
 @dohbee, yes, sure, but porting Android is going to be a lot of work as well, so why not
 Well, Ubuntu Touch works on halium which has no property service
 but we need to have such a device first anyway
 @NotKit, there are plenty of devices to build such a thing on
[16:02] <rah> mariogrip: would it be a big deal to port UBports to a GNU/Linux stack, with no Android drivers?
 raspberry pi, any x86 machine, etc
 @dohbee, they wouldn't have phone-related hardware
 @NotKit, why not?
 I mean without having a thing to use it on there is no real point to work on it
 http://www.davidhunt.ie/piphone-a-raspberry-pi-based-smartphone/
 lots of x86 laptops have SIM slots
 I guess the first thing to do would be to run the armhf rootfs on the device with your kernel
 usb modems are readily available
 You would need to add a console or debug bridge, but I'm sure you have that already
 you can use fake modems in ofono to test with
 but ofono is the part that *should* work without libhybris anyway
 (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/HFEH2nl9.png
 Any help
 🤔
 I suppose what would really need adapting are things like sensors, video decoding/camera
 @NotKit, camera works
 on RPi in UBPorts?
[16:06] <rah> what functionality does UBports rely on libhybris for?
 @NotKit, on x86
 ah, nice
 @Uchihaitachii, Plox
 i can scan qr codes with authenticator app using my webcam
 @Uchihaitachii, we have a welcome group where there's lots of help for things like installation. Could you join over there? bports.com/telegram-welcome
 @rah, rah, Sorry, i was in a meeting. But yes, it would work pretty much out of the box. none of the android services are needing in order for it work. It alredy works pretty nice with halium that uses none of the android bridge services. And on to of that we got unity8 and it's stack working on normal desktop sessions (like ubunt
[16:07] <ubptgbot> u bionic). All the startup scripts are made to handle different hardware.
 @rah, it's not that it necessarily relies on hybris for the functionality entirely. it's just that ubuntu touch is built around android based phones, and there are lots of assumptions in the code, and how the binaries are built
 a lot of fixes to make those assumptions be runtime loadable, instead of compile time, are necessary
[16:08] <rah> "mariogrip ... it would work pretty much out of the box"
 Most of those assumptions are in `lxc-android-config` which is one package
[16:08] <rah> "dohbee ... there are lots of assumptions in the code, and how the binaries are built"
[16:08] <rah> there's some conflicting information here :-)
 rah, I think the result is "it should work after some tinkering and fixing things", just different views
 take an ARM device, unpack the rootfs, install the stock ubuntu kernel and stuff, and see
[16:09] <rah> is there anyone interested in doing that?
 So, first thing to try would be to install https://ci.ubports.com/job/xenial-rootfs-armhf/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/out/ubports-touch.rootfs-xenial-armhf.tar.gz as your rootfs
 @rah, I could do it
 with librem phone being worked on, and postmarketos guys making progress running native, it might be maybe a year ahead?
 i mean, having a gnu/alpine linux foundation phone that basically works without libhybris / android inside?
 pmos is not native afaict
 It is
 it'll be expensive (purism) or old (pmos), but it'll exist
 @NotKit was working on making it not-native
[16:15] <opendata> uh
[16:15] <opendata> it is
 <s>devil here</s>
 @UniversalSuperBox, maybe on some devices, but on most i looked at it was "grab lineage kernel"
[16:15] <bshah> what is "native" ?
 @NotKit, Yep, sensors are not working at all, on my N5 I see that only gos, accelerometer and I think gyroscope are working. Most of sensors tests gave 'segmentation fault'. I have an idea for an app using sensors, but unfortunately I have to bring other ideas to life. A little pity
[16:15] <opendata> dohbee yeah, we use los kernels for most devices
 or well, nothing works if you don't have the propreitary bits
 i think pmos say "start with lineage, but mainline where possible"
[16:16] <opendata> but we dont use any android blobs
[16:16] <opendata> yeah
[16:16] <opendata> like castor
[16:17] <opendata> downstream had not display or anytthing, upstream does
[16:17] <opendata> oh, lol you asked the same question as i did a while
 @tydell, or find out why sensors are broken and fix them? :)
[16:19] <opendata> rah, what is your device
 Of course I will try to investigate this issue in my free time :) when my two little home terrorists are asleep :D
 @tydell, test_sensors itself?
 The libhybris test?
 Yeah, that'll fail.
 Even if you're using libhybris, the tests from the UBports libhybris packages don't work right
[16:28] <ubptgbot> <thomas ripper> Hello there, is there any way to import contacts from Sim card without getting a new contact for each number even when its the same Name?
 Hello commnuty. Someone have some problem to run Gallery app?? Today I try and not work. I clean all whit Utweak, and reinstall but nothing.
 [Edit] Hello community. Someone have some problem to run Gallery app?? Today I try and not work. I clean all whit Utweak, and reinstall but nothing.
 [Edit] Hello community. Someone have it some problem to run Gallery app?? Today I tried and It not worked. I cleaned all whit Utweak, and reinstall but nothing.
 @David_Gamiz_Jimenez, on 15.04 or 16.04?
[18:50] <ubptgbot> Junro was added by: Junro
 @UniversalSuperBox, what is this link???   I help U! … https://ubports.com/telegram-welcome
 @dohbee, Sorry. 15.04 ota 3. Bq e4.5
 @David_Gamiz_Jimenez, Seems to work OK here on nexus 4
[19:30] <ubptgbot> ilyaishere was added by: ilyaishere
 Hello :)
 Welcome
 @rogieroudshoorn, Oh, hi! Nice to see you here :)
 ZenFone? :)
 Still need to attempt on 5.1 ...
 Haha :)
 Maybe I'll have a go on Friday
 Found some bootloader references
 I have a problem with libhybris that I hope you UBPorts guys can help me with :) … I have Halium with test_hwcomposer running successfully on Ubuntu 16.04, but failing on Debian Testing rootfs
 It's all quite weird, no special logs, except for one saying that hwcomposer fails to get drm connector
 To the best of my knowledge, all of the components are basically the same...
 So what I wanted to ask is if you know whether there are any specific patches in Ubuntu that get libhybris going :)
 You'll rather want to test with a real client
 @dohbee, Last version from open store? I will try clean all photos, images and videos.
 The tests do not always work
 @UniversalSuperBox, Ok... … It's just weird for me that 2 systems that are that alike have different results in tests :)
 Our libhybris has changes for mir
 ```hwcomposer: bool IntelHWComposerDrm::detectDisplayConnection(int): detecting display 1 drm mode info... … hwcomposer: _drmModeConnector* IntelHWComposerDrm::getConnector(int): fail to get required connector … hwcomposer: bool IntelHWComposerDrm::detectDisplayConnection(int): fail to get drm connector``` … is the problem.
 @UniversalSuperBox, Libhybris itself?
 Yep, and the tests that we build don't test correctly
 I have source-built libhybris...
 Better to just try to use a client
 Ok, everyone is sleeping now, I'll ask someone about PlaMo launch command tomorrow :)
 Thanks :)
 No problem
 @UniversalSuperBox, I think the question was not about libhybris itself, but rather about the rest of the Ubuntu userspace as coming from canonical. The Halium reference rootfs works on this Intel device, but in the debian based rootfs, test_hwcomposer does not work. dmesg shows no bigger differences between debian and ubun
[19:42] <ubptgbot> tu, and libhybris is also mostly the same.
 Oh... whose libhybris is it then?
 self-built from master, in both cases, Ubuntu and debian
 Not sure if that's important, but on Debian, I also have to manually specify ld path: … `LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libhybris-egl/:/usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libhybris/:/usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/:$LD_LIBRARY_PATH`
 i386?
 Yes
 @wayneoutthere Joe, your latest audiocast rocks, love it as usual :)
 curious.   why?  one line of detail about why you liked it would be good :)
 Topic! The no-telecom company project was gold
 (and curius if any of the musicians got the little word play in the title this time ... )
 also the thing about apps in the openstore and your commencts about X
 @malditobastardo, ah.  ok cool.
 I am still listening to it
 everyone is the telecom company in that scenario
 do you think Rodney will like what I said about him???
 shh... it was mr X
 for me
 oh.... right!
 who will be the 1400th member?  :)
 hype train?
 (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/o7nKA0Hl.mp4
 wooooooah... awesome.  My TG just showed something awesome.  i"ll screenshot it
 (Photo, 1053x690) https://irc.ubports.com/6aB0Fe7w.png they must have heard us talking about member counts! :-0
 wtd
 (desktop)
 wtf
 what the duck??
 wtd??
 I dont understand
 @wayneoutthere, yes
 (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/PWSciGZQ.webp
 Wawaweewa! Gif support in the Desktop mode in Ubuntu Touch?
 and tis is what the fox
 @Jo_Led, no
 (Sticker, 494x512) https://irc.ubports.com/wOC89kRf.webp
 Oh right. Approaching 1,4k members... Got my hopes up too high for a moment there.
 And i just see that it says 2781 members in the photo. I guess that's the kwazy in the pict.
 A few days ago, my bq E4.5 with ubuntu had a bad flight, the smartphone is unusable! … I must buy a nexus 5, I installed ubuntu toch, solved the problem with mobile connection like someone described in the bug's messages but now I don't like have one allarm notification for e-mail, sms, telegram and others. What can I edit t
[21:05] <ubptgbot> o change something without upsetting the system?
 (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/eX5Bz8vi.png
 (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/gWf5RM0a.png
 The red rubbish bin  area gets waaaay to big, the longer the written SMS is. Maybe limit the horizontal width.
 (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/QMSq50Bu.png
 @Jo_Led, Please open an issue in github against ubuntu-ui-toolkit
 no need to post lots of images in here
 @Jo_Led, 🙈🙈🙈
 @Jo_Led, yeah this is happening regularly to me this week where gruop membship is changing to random numbers...
 @Jo_Led, who said these are too big?  This is prototype for Ubuntu for Seniors
 @dohbee, Sorry, monday evening after a long day. Thought I would just drop this here since it just happened to me after a long SMS and I was like "what the duck"?. Too lazy atm to open an issue at github :S
 @wayneoutthere, who said seniors need larger buttons?!
 @dohbee, what the fox.
 @dohbee, they just need larger phones 😆
 @Flohack, nah, seems the kids want those
 bring back the 12mm thick phones with small screens
 take the concept of point-and-shoot cameras and apply that design to smartphones and we have a winner
 @wayneoutthere, i have a phone that's pretty much exactly that
 nokia n81 i think it was
 i have the e71 behind me right now.  It's pretty awesome but... yeah.  really hard to go back. but... with convergence everything becmes possible again
 imagine a nice old bar phone: sturdy, feature-less, simple.  fits easily in your jean back pocket (I loved that).  NOw, you dock it at the big computer screen with bluetooth and boom.  laptop experienc.e  yeah baby.  yeah.  that's what I'm talking about
 the only question remaining is: how much screen do we need in our pocket?
 4.6" and lots of pixels
 I know we aren't allowed to agree publicly  but I agree with you on that.
 width?
 this N5 is 2.5" wide but I feel it's too wide for my hand when i'm one-handing
 I use a 5.7" phone on a daily basis but it doesn't bother me *shrug*
 @Tomas, It is very nice. Just depends on the price
 @wayneoutthere, iPhone 4s or such is about perfect size
 Going to say I agree again
 🙀🙀🙀🙀
 2 times!!! in a day??
 yeah the iPhone 4 was a comfy phone in the hand
 the Nokia N9 too, all memes aside
 @malditobastardo, i know. i know.. it's frustrating.
 @Lyokanthrope, No memes
 Only bless
 @dohbee, I think its Ubuntu.Components 1.2 … I'm not sure but it looks like it...