[00:44] <IntuitiveLeap> hello studio people.
[00:44] <Unit193> Hello Georgia person.
[00:45] <IntuitiveLeap> is there anyone on that uses a creative labs sound blaster x-fi extreme 7.1 pci-e sound card and knows how to get it to passthru from the s/pdif in to the analogue out by chance?
[00:45] <IntuitiveLeap> with ubuntu studio of course
[00:46] <IntuitiveLeap> could just be some issue between alsa and pulse i guess, they are not playing nice with this card >.<
[00:48] <Unit193> It's evening now, just sit tight and wait a while for someone other than me to show. :)
[00:50] <IntuitiveLeap> yea, thats a drill ive done a few times here :)
[00:51] <IntuitiveLeap> do you happen to know/remember how to kill pulseaudio by chance? i did it a long time ago, but i forget
[00:54] <Unit193> pulseaudio -k
[00:54] <Unit193> It'll auto-respawn though.
[00:55] <Unit193> ~/.pulse/client.conf  could have   autospawn = no   to disable that.
[01:00] <IntuitiveLeap> ty unit!
[01:00] <Unit193> Sure.
[01:00] <IntuitiveLeap> the respawn is what is getting me, i know how to kill it, it just doesnt really die lol
[01:03] <IntuitiveLeap> hmm, i dont have a .pulse folder (not hidden not at all) in my home folder
[01:09] <Unit193> Not sure if I created it or not.
[01:09] <Unit193> ~/.config/pulse/client.conf
[01:10] <Unit193> man pulse-client.conf  will tell you the correct location.
[01:13] <IntuitiveLeap> ur a big help unit, been a while since i messed with any of this.
[17:26] <raven_> hi
[17:26] <raven_> i am looking for a tool that triggers midi from incoming sounds - some kind of triggering A when giving 440hz sine to it
[17:55] <zequence> __raven: puredata
[17:56] <zequence> from where is the sine coming?
[17:56] <__raven> zequence, seems to be complex do you know an example project for that?
[17:57] <zequence> __raven: I could probably fix a patch for you pretty quickly. It's easy when you know it
[17:57] <zequence> I just need to know the practical scenario a bit
[17:57] <zequence> What kind of audio signal is it? What is producing it?
[17:57] <__raven> it would be a non complex signal
[17:58] <__raven> for example voice or piano
[17:59] <zequence> Ok, so it may be that the tone is not exactly at 440, for instance. You might need a little bit of range for it
[17:59] <__raven> yes
[18:04] <zequence> One way to do it, which probably could be done using plugins is you create an extreme notch for a note using eq, and then a gate for only letting throught the audio over a specific level
[18:04] <zequence> Next, you need something that outputs midi when receiving any audio at all
[18:04] <zequence> I'll make a patch for it in puredata.
[18:04] <__raven> ok tnx
[18:05] <zequence> __raven: You want the midi event to be a note?
[18:05] <__raven> ill try to explore puredata in the meantime
[18:05] <__raven> zequence, a gm note yes
[18:13] <zequence> __raven: Do you want note following?
[18:14] <__raven> whats that?
[18:14] <zequence> __raven: Do you want the midi note to match the audio note
[18:15] <__raven> no transposing
[18:19] <studio-user185> Hi, uh, I'm running Ubuntu Studio on a live USB but when I installed a driver and restarted my computer I lost all my files
[18:19] <zequence> studio-user185: A live image does not save anything
[18:19] <studio-user185> oh
[18:19] <zequence> It exists only on RAM, when you load the live OS
[18:20] <zequence> When you save a file, it is written to RAM only'
[18:20] <studio-user185> Any way to make it save everything>
[18:20] <zequence> unless you save it to a physical device
[18:20] <studio-user185> well ok
[18:20] <zequence> You can't install programs and stuff, and save those
[18:20] <studio-user185> I just installed it onto my hard drive anyway so bye
[18:20] <zequence> If you want that, you need to do a full installation
[18:20] <zequence> You can do that on a usb stick too..
[18:23] <zequence> __raven: I'm not only doing this for you, it's been a while since I did some puredata patching. If you can hang on for say max 30 min, I should be done
[18:23] <zequence> It's fun doing this stuff
[18:23] <__raven> im still here then tnx a lot :)
[19:11] <InsertUsername> Hi I just installed Ubuntu Studio to my computer and managed to get on and install my graphics drivers but when I restarted after that it was in the wrong resolution, causing the screen to be blue. I started in my Live USB again to edit the files, following a tutorial, but I need to save the grub for it
[19:11] <InsertUsername> How can I do this?
[19:13] <zequence> __raven: The first thing you need to do is to learn how to just get audio in/out and midi in/out working on puredata
[19:13] <zequence> __raven: did you install it?
[19:13] <wilee-nilee> InsertUsername, You have to chroot to the install to save grub, and do any changes.
[19:13] <InsertUsername> ?
[19:13] <InsertUsername> I'm nooby
[19:13] <wilee-nilee> !chroot
[19:13] <InsertUsername> explain how
[19:14] <zequence> __raven: I have the patch ready. Gonna put it somewhere..
[19:14] <wilee-nilee> InsertUsername, I would but I'm just leaving for coffee with a friend.
[19:14] <InsertUsername> Heres a better explanation: I edited operating system files and I need the changes to take place. How?
[19:16] <InsertUsername> ahh I get it
[19:17] <zequence> InsertUsername: "Operating System files" could be pretty much anything. Doesn't really specifify much, and with most of the changes you make to files, that's all you need to do. With grub, you need to create a new grub.cfg, and you don't do this manually
[19:17] <InsertUsername> so I make my Live USB beleive it is running on my hard drive
[19:17] <InsertUsername> I get it
[19:17] <zequence> Yeah
[19:17] <InsertUsername> ok
[19:17] <InsertUsername> I got it
[19:17] <wilee-nilee> you have it. ;)
[19:17] <InsertUsername> I'll look at that link from obottu
[19:18] <__raven> zequence, ok where?
[19:18] <InsertUsername> to install dchroot do I do sudo apt-get install dchroot ?
[19:19] <InsertUsername> yep
[19:22] <zequence> __raven: Here http://paste.ubuntu.com/6228041/
[19:22] <InsertUsername> right uh
[19:22] <InsertUsername> for the chroot
[19:22] <zequence> __raven: save as something ending with .pd
[19:22] <InsertUsername> what do I put in /etc/schroot/schroot.conf
[19:22] <__raven> zequence, ok
[19:22] <InsertUsername> I'm not quite sure what this link is saying:https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BasicChroot
[19:22] <zequence> __raven: First start puredata. Set audio to jack. Set midi to alsa midi. In qjackctl, you should see pd, both audio and midi
[19:23] <InsertUsername> oh wait I got it
[19:23] <zequence> __raven: Then, do an audio check, in the pd menu, Media -> Test audio and midi..
[19:23] <zequence> __raven: Make sure it's working
[19:23] <InsertUsername> wait
[19:24] <InsertUsername> when creating the chroot
[19:24] <InsertUsername> do I put this in?
[19:24] <InsertUsername> [lucid] description=Ubuntu Lucid location=/var/chroot priority=3 users=your_username groups=sbuild root-groups=root
[19:24] <zequence> __raven: Then load my patch. The patch does not enable dps processing (meaning, audio processing is not on by default), but if you did the audio check, it will be on
[19:24] <InsertUsername> what do I need to change?
[19:24] <zequence> __raven: There's a toggle for DSP on the pd main console
[19:24] <zequence> __raven: Also, you can find it under Media -> DSP On/Off
[19:25] <gdos> which desktop does ubuntu-studio use ? xfce or gnome ?
[19:25] <zequence> __raven: To get the patch working, you simply need to connect any audio that you want to trigger, using a jack control app, such as qjackctl
[19:25] <zequence> __raven: And of course, connect the pd midi out to whatever it is you want to play
[19:25] <InsertUsername> umm
[19:25] <InsertUsername> Guys?
[19:26] <zequence> __raven: Just remembered, there's no off note involved. I should fix that
[19:26] <InsertUsername> [lucid] description=Ubuntu Lucid location=/var/chroot priority=3 users=your_username groups=sbuild root-groups=root what do I need to change for creating a chroot
[19:26] <__raven> zequence, ok i have some jack troubles at the moment ill try to fix that
[19:26] <InsertUsername> actual;ly nvm all that stuff I said about chroot
[19:27] <__raven> zequence, i get canvas: no method for 'f'
[19:28] <zequence> __raven: From what?
[19:28] <__raven> pd when i load the patch
[19:29] <zequence> __raven: Sure you got the whole text? I'm redoing it anyway
[19:29] <zequence> Let me try to get the file too
[19:30] <zequence> Works here
[19:30] <zequence> I had to copy the text from the browser, as was. Not able to login to launchpad right now, in order to download the file
[19:32] <InsertUsername> Umm ok
[19:32] <InsertUsername> I'm cretaing a chroot
[19:33] <InsertUsername> and this linK:
[19:33] <InsertUsername> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BasicChroot
[19:33] <InsertUsername> says I have to put this ito terminal:
[19:33] <InsertUsername> sudo mount -o bind /proc /var/chroot/proc
[19:33] <InsertUsername> but then terminal says this:
[19:33] <InsertUsername> sudo mount -o bind /proc /var/chroot/proc
[19:33] <InsertUsername> woops wrong thing
[19:34] <InsertUsername> sudo mount -o bind /proc /var/chroot/proc
[19:34] <InsertUsername> wrng thing again
[19:34] <InsertUsername> mount: mount point /var/chroot/proc does not exist
[19:35] <InsertUsername> How can I use my chroot
[19:35] <InsertUsername> oooh nvm I know what the problem is
[19:36] <zequence> __raven: I added noteoff capability http://paste.ubuntu.com/6228089/
[19:36] <gdos> which desktop does ubuntu-studio use ? xfce or gnome ?
[19:36] <zequence> gdos: XFCE
[19:36] <__raven> zequence, ok
[19:37] <gdos> zequence: thank you.
[19:39] <InsertUsername> when I do sudo cp /etc/resolv.conf /media/ubuntu-studio/1c60ed61-cf4c-4f08-b312-4183e4b8b326 in terminal is says permission denied
[19:40] <InsertUsername> any way to make it let me do that?
[19:42] <zequence> _raven_: I realized I hadn't named everytyhing
[19:42] <InsertUsername> isn't sudo meant to let you do anything?
[19:43] <_raven_> zequence i haneed to test it with another system. ill be back in about two hours
[19:43] <InsertUsername> zequence you seem to be the expert here, when I do sudo cp /etc/resolv.conf /media/ubuntu-studio/1c60ed61-cf4c-4f08-b312-4183e4b8b326 in terminal is says permission denied
[19:43] <zequence> _raven_: Let me get you the final version first
[19:44] <zequence> _raven_: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6228122/
[19:45] <zequence> Added a couple of comments, and fixed a couple of minor things
[19:45] <_raven_> ok tnx are you still here in two hours?
[19:46] <zequence> _raven_: I'm always logging, so if you need to ask something, just ask, and I'll get back to you
[19:47] <_raven_> ok see you
[20:21] <User1234> Hi, so, I just installed Ubuntu Studio today but when I launch it y screen goes blue because it is in the wrong resolution. How can I change the resolution from the grub menu?
[20:26] <zequence> User1234: You can't
[20:26] <zequence> User1234: What kind of screen is it?
[20:34] <User1234> its an lcd 1024x768
[20:34] <User1234> I' in terminalow
[20:34] <Guest76139> Hello world !
[20:35] <User1234> when I started up and it blue screened I did Ctr+Alt+F1 to get into terminal
[20:35] <User1234> what can I do from here to fix the problem
[20:36] <Guest76139> I would to know if MOTU 828mkII is supported by Ardour ? I know that MOTU is not totally Linux friendly
[20:39] <Guest76139> I'm installing the Ubuntu 12 version
[20:46] <User1234> anyone? I' in terminal, how canI chane sreen resolution from here without using xrandr
[20:47] <User1234> sorry about the typos, this keyboard is messed up
[22:26] <_raven_> zequence, i still have "canvas: no method for 'f'"
[22:28] <zequence> _raven_: Does anything work? did you do an audio/midi check?
[22:28] <zequence> When you do that, you open a patch
[22:28] <zequence> There are examples you can try in Help -> browser
[22:29] <zequence> Under "Pure Data"
[22:29] <_raven_> i reconnected to alsa midi and now i have a input and output midi port
[22:29] <zequence> For instance, "Audio Examples"
[22:29] <_raven_> now i try to test this
[22:30] <_raven_> ok how does that work now?
[22:34] <_raven_> zequence, i see an input signal now on the fader symbol but i get no midi out of it also with testnote
[22:41] <zequence> _raven_: Make sure the testnote and the midi note match
[22:41] <zequence> 69 is 440 Hz
[22:42] <zequence> Probably not so well described
[22:43] <_raven_> zequence, does this patch autotune on frequency change?
[22:46] <zequence> _raven_: I don't know what that is
[22:46] <zequence> It just outputs a bang that is converted into a midi note, whenever the note you specify is detected
[22:47] <_raven_> oh sry i meant it should play the note it gets in via audio
[22:47] <zequence> _raven_: If you want to see what is behind the controls, right click on them
[22:47] <zequence> choose "open"
[22:48] <zequence> The square things are something called "abstractions". You can create one by adding an object, and naming it [pd]
[22:48] <zequence> usually, [pd myname]
[22:49] <zequence> They are just a way to keep stuff organized
[22:49] <zequence> The object that does the conversion from the audio signal to midi note is called [fiddle~]
[22:50] <zequence> "~" means it processes hot signals, as opposed to cold signals
[22:50] <zequence> hot signal is audio, cold is data
[22:50] <zequence> thick lines are hot, thin lines are cold
[22:51] <zequence> Getting into using puredata may take a couple of months, but once you get through that first threshold, you find you can do whatever you want with it
[22:51] <zequence> takes a bit of time, of course, but things become very flexible
[22:53] <_raven_> ok ill try to find that
[22:56] <zequence> _raven_: If you ever want to know what is coming out from a cold signal, just create a [print] object, and connect to it
[22:56] <zequence> _raven_: The data will show in the pd console window
[22:56] <zequence> That's how you do "debugging"
[23:09] <zequence> _raven_: If you want to learn puredata, I recommend something like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtgGol-I4gA
[23:09] <zequence> Just mentioning, since I know how tough it can be to get into it
[23:10] <zequence> Anyway, I'll be around if you have any more questions about the patch


 I how get the following errors.
[08:59] <ChrisWoollard> http://paste.ubuntu.com/444989/
[08:59] <ChrisWoollard> Please can you advise?
[09:51] <ubuntujenkins> ChrisWoollard: it all works for me, are the permissons ok on the branch folder? I guess they would be as it worked before
[09:53] <ubuntujenkins> ChrisWoollard: try make clean and then make
[09:53] <ubuntujenkins> brb
[10:03]  * ubuntujenkins hopes its not the ppa its self
[10:16] <ubuntujenkins> nisshh: you use the latex ppa right?
[10:16] <nisshh> ubuntujenkins: yes im getting updates for it right now
[10:17] <nisshh> 400MB's +
[10:17] <nisshh> ubuntujenkins: why?
[10:18] <ubuntujenkins> when you have the updates can you please run make on lucid-e1 . Everything works for me. but ChrisWoollard has a problem. I don't think its the ppa but I haven't heard back from him
[10:19] <nisshh> ubuntujenkins: sure but because of my slow net you will have to wait atleast 45 minutes or so
[10:19] <ubuntujenkins> thats fine I would like to know if it affects anyone else
[10:26] <nisshh> ubuntujenkins: cool, e1 is just lp:ubuntu-manual/e1 yea?
[10:26] <dutchie> lp:ubuntu-manual/lucid-e1
[10:27] <nisshh> dutchie: thanks
[10:27] <nisshh> ubuntujenkins: also, is ChrisWoollard having trouble with a translated version or the english version?
[10:28] <ubuntujenkins> as far as i can thell he is just using make (so the english version)
[10:28] <nisshh> right that makes it easy
[10:34] <nisshh> ubuntujenkins: wow, one of the largest packages is a -doc package
[10:34] <nisshh> 193MB
[10:36] <ubuntujenkins> hmm, proabbly didn't need to update that who reads them?
[10:37] <nisshh> well, when i first installed the texlive package from the ppa, it needed all the rest just to work too
[10:37] <nisshh> which is a pain
[10:38] <ChrisWoollard> hello
[10:38] <nisshh> i mean i do have 25GB's of bandwidth a month but it is really slow to download at this speed
[10:38] <nisshh> ChrisWoollard: hey
[10:39] <ubuntujenkins> hey ChrisWoollard
[10:40] <ChrisWoollard> my permissions should be fine. nothing has changed.
[10:40] <ChrisWoollard> I also deleted the whole branch and tried again.
[10:40] <ubuntujenkins> yea i guessed that would be the case.
[10:40] <ubuntujenkins> o this could not be good then
[10:41] <ubuntujenkins> are you 64bit or 32bit?
[10:41] <ChrisWoollard> I am running 32bit
[10:41] <nisshh> ubuntujenkins: so am i
[10:42] <ubuntujenkins> hmm I am 64bit. I am going to reboot again just to double check. I think there is only one package that is both 64bit and 32bit. Most are for both.
[10:42] <ubuntujenkins> brb
[10:42] <ChrisWoollard> I am going to try doing a reinstall of all packages just in case.
[10:43] <ChrisWoollard> It did report that they sucessfully installed, but I was running low on disk space. But i have fixed that anow
[10:43] <nisshh> ChrisWoollard: dont try just yet, wait for me to test out the latest ppa updates
[10:43] <ChrisWoollard> ok. I will wait.
[10:44] <ChrisWoollard> It was lp:ubuntu-manual/lucid-e2 that I was building
[10:45] <ubuntujenkins> oooooo does lucid-e1 work?
[10:45] <ChrisWoollard> I have not tried that
[10:46] <ChrisWoollard> give me a moment
[10:47] <nisshh> sure
[10:48] <ubuntujenkins> lucid-e2 works for me
[10:48] <nisshh> i *think* e2 works for me, i still havent got all these updates yet
[10:50] <nisshh> have an answer to that in about 25 minutes or less
[10:52] <ChrisWoollard> I get the same with lucid e1
[10:54] <ubuntujenkins> ouch
[10:54]  * ubuntujenkins is getting worried
[10:55] <ChrisWoollard> Should I just try that re-install of the packages
[10:55] <ChrisWoollard> just to make sure
[10:55] <ubuntujenkins> I am just setting up a virtual machine
[10:55] <nisshh> ChrisWoollard: not yet, wait anotherm minute
[10:56] <nisshh> 5 minutes and i have the updates
[10:57] <ubuntujenkins> ChrisWoollard: can you completey remove ubuntu-manual-tex package and reinstall it please . Its a dummy package
[11:08] <ChrisWoollard> Ok. It is completely removed.
[11:09] <ubuntujenkins> now install it again and see if that pulls in anything that could be missing
[11:10] <ChrisWoollard> I also did an apt-get clean. to clear the cache
[11:10] <ChrisWoollard> I wonder how long it will take to download
[11:11] <nisshh> ChrisWoollard: a freaking long time
[11:16] <ubuntujenkins> my virtual machine is jsut installing the packages
[11:17] <ChrisWoollard> Mine too.
[11:17] <ChrisWoollard> Looks like the download finished
[11:17] <nisshh> right im compiling e2 now
[11:18] <nisshh> then ill try e1 as well
[11:20] <nisshh> not knowing very much C is a huge pain when it comes to this
[11:20] <nisshh> opps wrong channe;
[11:21] <nisshh> ubuntujenkins: ok, e2 works fine for me
[11:21] <nisshh> trying e1 now
[11:22] <ubuntujenkins> hmm may not be the latex packages then
[11:22] <ubuntujenkins> the packages take ages to install
[11:22] <nisshh> ubuntujenkins: i dont think so, it may be something wrong with ChrisWoollard's setup
[11:23] <ubuntujenkins> yea thats my thinking, hoepfully reinstalling the ubuntu-manual-tex package my solve it
[11:25] <ChrisWoollard> I hope as well.
[11:25] <nisshh> we all do mate
[11:25] <ChrisWoollard> I also hope the re-install fixes the issue
[11:27] <ChrisWoollard> dpkg: error processing texlive-xetex (--configure):
[11:27] <ChrisWoollard>  subprocess installed post-installation script returned error exit status 1
[11:27] <ChrisWoollard> Setting up tipa (2:1.3-14) ...
[11:27] <ChrisWoollard> Running mktexlsr. This may take some time... done.
[11:27] <ChrisWoollard> I just spotted that error
[11:28] <nisshh> i think that does it for me too but it doesnt seem to make a difference
[11:28] <ChrisWoollard> Processing triggers for libc-bin ...
[11:28] <ChrisWoollard> ldconfig deferred processing now taking place
[11:28] <ChrisWoollard> Processing triggers for python-support ...
[11:28] <ChrisWoollard> Errors were encountered while processing:
[11:28] <ChrisWoollard>  texlive-xetex
[11:28] <ChrisWoollard>  ubuntu-manual-tex
[11:28] <ChrisWoollard> E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)
[11:28] <ChrisWoollard> it has now finished the install
[11:29] <ubuntujenkins> make works for me as well. and so did the install. hmm there is something wrong with your setup
[11:29] <nisshh> ChrisWoollard: you dont have any tex packages from the repos installed do you?
[11:30] <ChrisWoollard> There shouldn't be
[11:30] <ubuntujenkins> what does sudo dpkg --configure texlive-xetex give?
[11:30] <ubuntujenkins> I think all of the packages are superseded by my packages
[11:31] <nisshh> ubuntujenkins: even so, its worth ruling out any possibilities like that
[11:31] <ubuntujenkins> nisshh: I agree
[11:31] <ChrisWoollard> cwoollard@cwoollard-desktop-sony:~$ sudo dpkg --configure texlive-xetex
[11:31] <ChrisWoollard> [sudo] password for cwoollard:
[11:31] <ChrisWoollard> Setting up texlive-xetex (2009-10ubuntuppa1) ...
[11:31] <ChrisWoollard> Running mktexlsr. This may take some time... done.
[11:31] <ChrisWoollard> Building format(s) --all --cnffile /etc/texmf/fmt.d/10texlive-xetex.cnf.
[11:31] <ChrisWoollard> 	This may take some time... done.
[11:31] <ChrisWoollard> seemed to work
[11:32] <ubuntujenkins> try make now
[11:32] <nisshh> ubuntujenkins: does e1 work for you?
[11:32] <ubuntujenkins> yep
[11:32] <ubuntujenkins> hang on maybe not tried 32bit
[11:33] <ChrisWoollard> it still gives this error on make
[11:33] <ChrisWoollard> <use  "titlepage/title_page_letter_en.pdf" > [1
[11:33] <ChrisWoollard> ! I can't write on file `main.pdf'.
[11:33] <ChrisWoollard> (Press Enter to retry, or Control-D to exit; default file extension is `.pdf')
[11:33] <ChrisWoollard> Please type another file name for output:
[11:33] <manualbot> ChrisWoollard: Error: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
[11:33] <nisshh> hehe
[11:34] <ChrisWoollard> manualbot: Great thanks.  I have no idea what has happened to my computer
[11:44] <ubuntujenkins> ChrisWoollard: can you run dpkg -l and pastebin it please
[11:45] <ChrisWoollard> http://paste.ubuntu.com/445052/
[11:48] <nisshh> e1 works for me too
[11:57] <ubuntujenkins> nisshh: do you have texlive-full installed?
[11:58] <nisshh> ubuntujenkins: hell no, thats HUGE
[11:58] <ubuntujenkins> don't worry that doesn't matter my virtual machie doesn't and it still works
[11:58] <nisshh> yea
[11:59] <ChrisWoollard> I am going to reboot. back in a couple of minutes
[11:59] <ubuntujenkins> ok, I really don't know what it is
[11:59] <ChrisWoollard> I just did an fschk.
[11:59] <ChrisWoollard> \nyway back soon
[12:06]  * ubuntujenkins does not know whats worng
[12:17] <ChrisWoollard> Ok. I have no idea any more. It just doesn't work
[12:19] <ubuntujenkins> the only thing is file permisson error this line "! I can't write on file `main.pdf'." makes me think it. but it makes no sense why it would be that.
[12:20] <ubuntujenkins> as you have said you have a new branch
[12:21] <ubuntujenkins> your user home directory doen't have no standard permissons does it?
[12:21] <ubuntujenkins> *non
[12:21] <ChrisWoollard> Shouldn't do. I haven't changed anything
[12:22] <ChrisWoollard> Why do i get the feeling that It would be quicker to re-install.
[12:22] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk might know he may be up in a few hours.
[12:22] <ubuntujenkins> its so strange that this is happening
[12:22] <ChrisWoollard> I will wait until then.
[12:23] <ChrisWoollard> I know. It is weird
[12:23] <ubuntujenkins> I would like to know what it is if we work it out.
[12:24]  * ubuntujenkins starts revision
[12:25]  * ChrisWoollard is sorry for distracting you :)
[12:30] <ubuntujenkins> don't worry I would rather have got a fix out early so less people are affected
[15:57] <ubuntujenkins> A question to any one: Can you think of a better way of detecting the current graphics driver in use. lshw is too slow for quickshot
[16:02] <nisshh> ubuntujenkins: not off the top of my head but there MUST be another way of doing that
[16:03] <ubuntujenkins> nisshh: I figured there would be , hopefully someone will know of one
[16:04] <nisshh> linux = 20 different ways of acheiving something
[16:04] <ubuntujenkins> lol
[16:04] <shrini> lspci | grep VGA
[16:06] <ubuntujenkins> shrini: does that give the driver. I think mine is jsut the card i have
[16:09] <nisshh> yea no driver with that command
[16:10] <ubuntujenkins> it only matters as the command used to change the resolution depends on the command to be used
[16:12] <nisshh> yep
[16:12] <ubuntujenkins> it only matters as the command used to change the resolution depends on the driver in use
[16:12] <ubuntujenkins> that makes more sense :)
[16:23] <ubuntujenkins> nisshh: can you paste the output of ls /sys/module
[16:24] <nisshh> http://paste.ubuntu.com/445160/
[16:24] <nisshh> ubuntujenkins: ^^
[16:25] <ubuntujenkins> ta
[16:25] <ubuntujenkins> is your graphics a i915?
[16:26] <nisshh> something like that
[16:26] <nisshh> i9xx anyway
[16:27] <ubuntujenkins> thats ok, #ubuntu-uk are trying to think how to handle multi card setups
[16:27] <nisshh> VGA controller is an intel 946GZ
[16:28] <nisshh> ah, i dont have a multi-card setup
[16:28] <nisshh> i run inbuilt gfx
[16:28] <nisshh> really shitty unbuilt gfx...
[16:29] <ubuntujenkins> lol another way is to query runing xorg aparently
[16:29] <nisshh> yea, that might work
[16:30] <ubuntujenkins> any idea how to do it?
[16:31] <nisshh> nope :)
[16:31] <nisshh> hang on ill help you out with my google fu
[16:32] <ubuntujenkins> I am googleing but my laptop is on slow go as I am repartioning an external dirve
[16:34] <nisshh> hmm, found a command to find the amount of ram your vid chip has
[16:35] <ubuntujenkins> hmm, does the man page for it have anything of use
[16:35] <nisshh> maybe, hang on
[16:37] <nisshh> ubuntujenkins: aha! that same command also shows the current "kernel driver" in use by your gfx card
[16:37] <nisshh> its: lspci -v -s 00:02.0
[16:37] <nisshh> im apparently using the i915 driver
[16:39] <ubuntujenkins> yea lspci -v might help. I wonder how it works if someone has two graphics cards.
[16:39] <nisshh> well, both should be listed there then
[16:40] <ubuntujenkins> yea but which one are they currently using is harder to work out
[16:41] <nisshh> well, if someone had dual cards, wouldnt they most likely be using either sli of xfire?
[16:41] <nisshh> or xfire
[16:41] <ubuntujenkins> what are those?
[16:42] <nisshh> if you have two gfx cards in your machine, you just have a little, hardware "bridge" between them and then your system will use both cards
[16:43] <nisshh> let me find a pic to show you
[16:43] <ubuntujenkins> cool thanks I will look into it
[16:45] <nisshh> right, sli is what nvidia calls it, xfire is what ati calls it
[16:45] <nisshh> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scalable_Link_Interface
[16:46] <nisshh> its been around for about 5-6 years in mainstream
[16:46]  * nisshh is off to watch a movie now
[16:46] <ubuntujenkins> cool, I think i should do some more revison
[17:03] <ChrisWoollard> can you send me the paste bin  with the repository info in it.
[17:08] <shrini> godbyk: hai
[17:14] <ubuntujenkins> ChrisWoollard: do you mean the manual ppa stuff?
[17:19] <ubuntujenkins> ?mppa | ChrisWoollard
[17:19] <quickshotdevs> ChrisWoollard: The manual team has a latex PPA  you can add it by running these commands in a terminal(Applications → Accessories → Terminal):  sudo add-apt-repository ppa:ubuntu-manual/ubuntu-manual then    sudo apt-get update    sudo apt-get install ubuntu-manual-tex
[17:20] <ubuntujenkins> shrini: I guess godbyk is still a sleep
[17:20] <shrini> ubuntujenkins: oh. ok ok
[17:20] <shrini> waiting for him
[17:20] <shrini> will wait
[17:20] <shrini> no issues
[17:20] <ubuntujenkins> some of us have irc on 24 hours a day you see
[17:20] <ubuntujenkins> cool
[17:21] <shrini> yet to confirm tamil fonts from him
[17:21] <shrini> :-)
[17:21] <ubuntujenkins> I see
[17:27] <ChrisWoollard> I found the ppa
[17:27] <ChrisWoollard> thanks
[17:27] <ChrisWoollard> I had a note anyway
[17:27] <ubuntujenkins> cool, I guess you went for reinstalling then>?
[17:28] <ChrisWoollard> Well, I now have another vm. This one works
[17:28] <ubuntujenkins> very strange indeed
[17:29] <ChrisWoollard> I am just not sure if i have copied all my ssh / gpg / lp keys across.
[17:30] <ChrisWoollard> That doesn't explain why my other vm doesn't work.
[17:30] <ChrisWoollard> I will still ask godbyk when i see him
[17:31] <ubuntujenkins> yea i can't think what is is
[17:33] <ChrisWoollard> I wonder if something went wrong when I expanded the disk on the vm.
[17:34] <ChrisWoollard> I should have cloned it first before I did anything.
[17:36] <ubuntujenkins> I don't have much expeince with expanding the disk on a vm
[17:45] <thorwil> godbyk: thanks for the links!
[18:33] <shrini> team
[18:33] <shrini> need a help
[18:33] <shrini> we have uploaded 7 chapters to LP
[18:34] <shrini> how to check for the pdf output?
[18:34] <shrini> ubuntujenkins: any idea?
[18:43] <shrini> ?
[18:43] <shrini> room is so silent
[18:43] <shrini> :-)
[19:38] <shrini> anybody there?
[19:41] <thorwil> shrini: only halfway
[19:59] <shrini> thorwil: :-)
[20:05] <shrini> need help on getting new pdf
[20:05] <shrini> we updated some more in LP
[20:06] <shrini> is there any way to get latest pdf?
[20:06] <thorwil> shrini: ooh, by running "make"?
[20:06] <daker> hey @all
[20:06] <thorwil> hi daker
[20:07] <thorwil> shrini: provided you have all the tex stuff in place, which is why i don't intend to bother with that myself any time soon again :)
[20:08] <shrini> thorwil: hi
[20:08] <shrini> i have all the things
[20:08] <shrini> yesterday did a make and got a PDF
[20:08]  * thorwil switched partition/installation and would have to set it all up again
[20:08] <daker> godbyk, ping
[20:08] <shrini> today updated lot in LP
[20:08] <godbyk> daker: pong
[20:08] <shrini> how to make a updated pdf?
[20:08] <shrini> godbyk: hai
[20:09] <godbyk> Hey, shrini.
[20:09]  * vish watches ping-pong match
[20:09] <thorwil> shrini: make again?
[20:09] <godbyk> shrini: You'd just run 'make ubuntu-manual-ta.pdf' to generate the PDF.
[20:09] <godbyk> shrini: But you won't see anything new until I download the latest translations from Launchpad.
[20:09] <daker> godbyk, i am trying to make a class that read an xml file
[20:09] <shrini> it wont get today's updates
[20:09] <godbyk> (I'll do that now and regenerate the PDFs.)
[20:09] <godbyk> daker: Using php?
[20:09] <daker> yes
[20:10] <godbyk> Okay.
[20:10] <shrini> godbyk: how can I do that myself/
[20:10] <shrini> ?
[20:10] <godbyk> shrini: You can't, really.
[20:10] <shrini> as I have the bzr repo
[20:10] <shrini> with me
[20:10] <shrini> godbyk: fine.
[20:11] <shrini> what is your current time now?
[20:11] <godbyk> shrini: As soon as Launchpad emails me the translations, I'll put them in the bzr repository.  Then you can run 'bzr pull' to update your repository and 'make ubuntu-manual-ta.pdf' to regenerate the PDF.
[20:11] <shrini> how long I can trouble you?
[20:11] <daker> godbyk, http://paste.ubuntu.com/445232/
[20:11] <shrini> ok
[20:11] <godbyk> shrini: It's currently 14:00 here. So I'm going to be here for quite a while. :)
[20:11] <shrini> godbyk: ok. thanks
[20:12] <shrini> I get a new po file in mail
[20:12] <shrini> where to put that?
[20:12] <godbyk> shrini: Rename the po file to ta.po and put it in the po/ directory.  Then just rerun 'make ubuntu-manual-ta.pdf'
[20:12] <shrini> godbyk: okey
[20:12] <shrini> thats fine
[20:12] <shrini> will do now
[20:12] <godbyk> 'kay.
[20:13] <godbyk> I'm waiting for Launchpad to email me all the translations. (It usually takes five minutes or so.)
[20:13] <thorwil> daker: <e1-10.04 name="10.04"> is either ugly i or o don't understand the purpose
[20:14] <daker> it's just a presentation
[20:14] <thorwil> daker: if the element represents a revision, the revision should be an attribute and the element name would have to be neutral
[20:15] <shrini> godbyk: did that
[20:15] <daker> thorwil, it's to hard to make a code for that
[20:15] <shrini> :-)
[20:15] <shrini> font issue is there
[20:15] <thorwil> daker: the only other unclear thing is %s%.pdf
[20:16] <thorwil> daker: go and stand in a corner! ;)
[20:16] <shrini> getting only boxes
[20:16] <shrini> :-)
[20:16] <daker> with my presentation : i should just call : $oTree->element("e2-10.04", "en", "print", "mirrors", "mirror1");
[20:16] <shrini> i think your version of pdf may be good
[20:16] <shrini> waiting for your pdf version
[20:17] <daker> thorwil, to get the first mirror
[20:18] <daker> or $oTree->element("e2-10.04", "fr", "print", "mirrors");  to get an array of all the mirrors of the printed edition (e2)
[20:18] <godbyk> I don't know if you can use . in xml element names.
[20:19] <thorwil> daker: do you handle cases where the number of mirror may be = 0 or > 2 ?
[20:19] <daker> i think we can
[20:19] <daker> godbyk, the code is working for me
[20:19] <godbyk> daker: I'd change <e1-10.04 name="10.04"> to <manual id="10.04-e1">
[20:20] <daker> that's problem
[20:20] <daker> my class doesn't handle that
[20:21] <godbyk> let me start these translations real quick, then I'll come back to your xml, daker.
[20:21] <godbyk> shrini: the font issue will still be there, yeah. I haven't fixed that yet.
[20:21] <daker> take your time
[20:21] <shrini> godbyk: okok
[20:25] <shrini> http://kanchilug.wordpress.com/2010/06/04/schedule-for-ubuntu-10-04lts-release-party/
[20:25] <shrini> we have release party
[20:25] <godbyk> shrini: I saw that. It looks awesome!
[20:25] <shrini> will try best to bring the tamil pdf
[20:26] <shrini> godbyk: wow
[20:26] <shrini> saw already?
[20:26] <shrini> how?
[20:26] <godbyk> Google found the page and emailed it to me.
[20:26] <godbyk> (It tells me when it see 'ubuntu manual' on a website.)
[20:27]  * ubuntujenkins gets bored of revision
[20:27] <shrini> wow
[20:27] <shrini> great
[20:27] <thorwil> ubuntujenkins: what is this revision you keep mentioning?
[20:27] <ubuntujenkins> we are they top of google when you search "ubuntu manual"
[20:27] <godbyk> shrini: I've put all the translations in bzr now, so if you run 'bzr pull' you should get the latest.
[20:27] <ubuntujenkins> thorwil: I have end of second year uni exams
[20:27] <godbyk> I'm also building all the translated PDFs now.  It'll take about 30 minutes for them to finish.
[20:28] <shrini> godbyk: great
[20:28] <ubuntujenkins> thorwil:  heat transfer and fluid flow and electronics to finish
[20:28] <ubuntujenkins> heat transfer and fuild folw is one exam
[20:28] <shrini> godbyk: doint that
[20:28] <shrini> doing that
[20:29] <shrini> the diff only updated. right?
[20:29] <godbyk> shrini: It looks like someone may have already translated the Tamil LaTeX stuff for us<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[20:29] <thorwil> ubuntujenkins: revision is if you have to take an exam again? (there are several translations of the term that could work in this context)
[20:29] <godbyk> shrini: I'm going to see if I can track down a copy of those files.
[20:29] <shrini> godbyk: fine
[20:31] <ubuntujenkins> thorwil: revision = study in preparation for exams
[20:31] <ChrisWoollard> godbyk: ping
[20:31] <ubuntujenkins> channel: ping
[20:31]  * ubuntujenkins wishes that worked :P
[20:31] <godbyk> ChrisWoollard: pong
[20:32] <ChrisWoollard> you mean that
[20:32]  * godbyk wishes he could replace himself with a small shell script
[20:32] <ChrisWoollard> do /ping #ubuntu-manual
[20:33] <ChrisWoollard> godbyk, can you have a look at http://paste.ubuntu.com/444989/
[20:33] <ChrisWoollard> do you have any idea what might be going wrong
[20:33] <godbyk> wow.
[20:33] <godbyk> Um.. I'm guessing it's a file permissions problem.
[20:34] <godbyk> what's 'pwd' say?
[20:34] <godbyk> and then show me 'ls -ld .'
[20:34] <ChrisWoollard> cwoollard@cwoollard-desktop-sony:~/Projects/lucid-e2$ pwd
[20:34] <ChrisWoollard> /home/cwoollard/Projects/lucid-e2
[20:34] <thorwil> who would ever think godbyk could be replaced with a small shell script?
[20:34] <godbyk> and then try 'touch main.pdf'
[20:35] <thorwil> though then again, maybe some mysterious perl one-liner??
[20:35] <ChrisWoollard> drwxr-xr-x 21 cwoollard cwoollard 12288 2010-06-05 15:44 .
[20:35] <godbyk> thorwil: sadly, perl is probably what you'd have to use, as scatter-brained as I am most days!
[20:35] <ChrisWoollard> touch main.pdf works fine
[20:36] <godbyk> run 'make clean'
[20:36] <godbyk> then run 'xelatex main'
[20:36] <ChrisWoollard> I even tried deleting the braet and getting it again
[20:36] <ChrisWoollard> branch
[20:38] <ChrisWoollard> http://paste.ubuntu.com/445253/
[20:38] <godbyk> weird.
[20:38] <godbyk> do you have an existing main.pdf in that dir (as a file or folder)?
[20:39] <ChrisWoollard> that's what -rw-r--r--  1 cwoollard cwoollard   447 2010-06-05 20:39 main.aux
[20:39] <ChrisWoollard> -rw-r--r--  1 cwoollard cwoollard     0 2010-06-05 20:36 main.glo
[20:39] <ChrisWoollard> -rw-r--r--  1 cwoollard cwoollard     0 2010-06-05 20:36 main.idx
[20:39] <ChrisWoollard> -rw-r--r--  1 cwoollard cwoollard 43325 2010-06-05 20:39 main.log
[20:39] <ChrisWoollard> -rw-r--r--  1 cwoollard cwoollard     0 2010-06-05 20:36 main.out
[20:39] <quickshotdevs> ChrisWoollard: Error: "rw-r--r--" is not a valid command.
[20:39] <ChrisWoollard> -rw-r--r--  1 cwoollard cwoollard  1762 2010-06-05 08:55 main.tex
[20:39] <quickshotdevs> ChrisWoollard: Error: "rw-r--r--" is not a valid command.
[20:39] <quickshotdevs> ChrisWoollard: Error: "rw-r--r--" is not a valid command.
[20:39] <quickshotdevs> ChrisWoollard: Error: "rw-r--r--" is not a valid command.
[20:39] <quickshotdevs> ChrisWoollard: Error: "rw-r--r--" is not a valid command.
[20:39]  * ubuntujenkins hits quickshotdevs
[20:40] <godbyk> Bad, quickshotdevs! Bad!
[20:40]  * ubuntujenkins tries to work out why its using -
[20:40] <godbyk> ChrisWoollard: Well, obviously tex can write files to that directory, so that's not the issue..
[20:41] <ChrisWoollard> It happened after patching the ppa.
[20:42] <ubuntujenkins> but its not the ppa, as we checked it this morning
[20:42] <ChrisWoollard> And I installed a whole new vm and installed the ppa again and it was fine
[20:43] <ubuntujenkins> I checked in a vm and nissh did an update .
[20:43] <ubuntujenkins> I checked the 64bit on a real machine
[20:44] <ChrisWoollard> The only thing I could think of was that there may be a corruption in my vm.
[20:44] <ChrisWoollard> Have you any ideas?
[20:45] <godbyk> Here's what the LaTeX Companion has to say about that error:
[20:45] <godbyk> TeX is not allowed to write data to the file <main.pdf> [in our case].  It is probably read-only or you may not have writing permission for its directory.
[20:46] <godbyk> On some TeX implementations (e.g., those on the TeX Live CD), the error may be preceded by a line like the following:
[20:46] <godbyk> tex: Not writing to /texmf/tex/latex/base/latex.ltx (openout_any = p)
[20:46] <ubuntujenkins> -1
[20:46] <quickshotdevs> ubuntujenkins: Error: "1" is not a valid command.
[20:46] <godbyk> These TeX installations are by default configured to be "paranoid" (hence, "p" above) when writing to files.
[20:47] <godbyk> They allow you to write only to files below the current directory and not to any files specified with an absolute path name or starting with a dot in their name.
[20:47] <godbyk> To change that behavior, you have to modify the settings in the file texmf.cnf.
[20:47] <godbyk> --EOF--
[20:47] <quickshotdevs> godbyk: Error: "-EOF--" is not a valid command.
[20:47] <godbyk> Sadly, I don't think any of that applies.
[20:47] <godbyk> We're trying to write to main.pdf in the current directory, right?
[20:48] <ChrisWoollard> heh
[20:48] <ChrisWoollard> did you kill him?
[20:48] <godbyk> I hope so. :)
[20:48] <ubuntujenkins> yea I can';t remember how to change the settings whilst she is online
[20:49] <ChrisWoollard> yes it is in the current directory
[20:50] <godbyk> ChrisWoollard: copy main.tex to m.tex and then run 'xelatex m'
[20:51] <ubuntujenkins> -1
[20:51] <ubuntujenkins> yey sorted
[20:51] <ubuntujenkins> @
[20:51] <ubuntujenkins> @hello
[20:51] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: great!
[20:51] <manualbot> ubuntujenkins: Error: "hello" is not a valid command.
[20:51] <godbyk> thorwil: Maybe I can replace myself with an IRC bot. :)
[20:51] <ubuntujenkins> I can't think of anything that will call it by mistake now
[20:51] <ubuntujenkins> yey it is raining outside
[20:53] <shrini> hello
[20:53] <shrini> what is this commands?
[20:53] <thorwil> godbyk: would you like to talk about being replaced?
[20:53] <godbyk> shrini: commands for what?
[20:55] <shrini> godbyk: make: *** [ubuntu-manual-ta.pdf] Error 1
[20:56] <ChrisWoollard> oops, sorry. i missed that. will do it now
[20:56] <shrini> getting 8 pages only
[20:56] <godbyk> shrini: Can you paste your ubuntu-manual-ta.log file to paste.ubuntu.com for me?  I'll take a look.
[20:56] <shrini> sure
[20:56]  * ubuntujenkins races godbyk to find the error
[20:56] <godbyk> It's still building the translations here -- it's on the Ks.  Might be a while before I get to TA. :)
[20:57] <ChrisWoollard> ! I can't write on file `m.pdf'.
[20:57] <ChrisWoollard> (Press Enter to retry, or Control-D to exit; default file extension is `.pdf')
[20:57] <ChrisWoollard> Please type another file name for output:
[20:57] <manualbot> ChrisWoollard: Error: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
[20:57] <ChrisWoollard> You aren't
[20:58] <ubuntujenkins> the build error is a missing } I am just going to find it
[20:58] <godbyk> ChrisWoollard: Okay.  Last check:
[20:58] <shrini> godbyk: http://pastebin.com/52EGmQH0
[20:58] <godbyk> create a new directory (say ~/test) and create a new .tex file.
[20:58] <godbyk> in it, write:
[20:59] <godbyk>  \documentclass{article}
[20:59] <godbyk>  \usepackage{lipsum}
[20:59] <godbyk>  \begin{document}
[20:59] <godbyk>  \lipsum
[20:59] <godbyk>  \end{document}
[20:59] <godbyk> then run 'xelatex myfile'
[21:00] <godbyk> shrini: It looks like you've forgotten a }
[21:00] <godbyk> shrini: Probably around one of the \marginnote commands.
[21:00] <ubuntujenkins> I am trying to find it
[21:00] <shrini> godbyk: where?
[21:00] <shrini> ok
[21:00] <godbyk> shrini: Good question. We'll see if ubuntujenkins can find it first. :)
[21:00] <shrini> :-)
[21:02] <ChrisWoollard> ! I can't write on file `myfile.pdf'.
[21:02] <manualbot> ChrisWoollard: Error: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
[21:02] <ubuntujenkins> ok found one I am going to update the translations in luanchpad as i find them
[21:02] <godbyk> ChrisWoollard: Okay, it sounds like your TeX install might be horked.
[21:03] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: 'kay. I usually check the box that says 'this translation needs to be verified' or whatever it's called.
[21:03] <ChrisWoollard> We did do a dull remove and reinstall
[21:03] <ChrisWoollard> do
[21:03] <godbyk> that way someone can double-check and ensure I didn't screw something up.
[21:03] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: will do
[21:03] <ChrisWoollard> I'll do another remove and reinstall
[21:04] <godbyk> ChrisWoollard: I'll have to do some Googling on this one. I've never seen it before.
[21:04] <godbyk> But it seems odd that it's happy to write to .aux, .log, etc. but not .pdf.
[21:04] <ChrisWoollard> is there a library that deals with pdf
[21:05] <dutchie> almost certainly
[21:06] <godbyk> I think all the PDF stuff that tex and family deal with is internally written. they don't rely on libraries.
[21:06] <godbyk> but that's just my guess.
[21:06] <ubuntujenkins> shrini: can you check the transaltions i have marked for review on launchpad please
[21:12] <godbyk> shrini: Unfortunately, the LaTeX Tamil file I found didn't actually include the translated text I need. (Not sure why.) I've emailed you a list of the words I'll need you guys to translate for me.
[21:12] <godbyk> shrini: Then I can finish the LaTeX code and get the Tamil fonts working.
[21:14] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: I can get the tamil manual working but have no index. is that expected?
[21:16] <ubuntujenkins> shrini: http://ubuntuone.com/p/6AH/ is my build of the tamil manual
[21:16] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: yeah, the indexer doesn't know anything about Tamil right now, so it freaks.
[21:16] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: cool that explains my one error.
[21:16] <godbyk> the glossary probably freaks, too.
[21:16] <ubuntujenkins> I am impressed with only two } missing in the whole translations.
[21:17] <ubuntujenkins> yea no glossary
[21:24] <ubuntujenkins> ping me if you want me i am going to do more revision
[21:27] <shrini> godbyk: checking mail
[21:28] <daker> guys i think we should change our domain from ubuntu-manual.org to ubuntu-manuals.org
[21:29] <godbyk> daker: If someone wants to buy ubuntu-manuals.org, it could also be pointed to our site. :)
[21:29] <c7p> since it's the "ubuntu manual project" i think it's ok the current domain
[21:31] <shrini> ubuntujenkins: how to check those text in LP?
[21:31] <shrini> that you marked for review.
[21:33] <ubuntujenkins> shrini: that is one of them https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/lucid-e1/+pots/ubuntu-manual/ta/71/+translate
[21:34] <askhl_> Hi.  Consider a translatable string such as "\newglossaryentry{applet}{name={applet}, description={An applet is a small program that runs in a \gls{panel}. Applets provide useful functions such as starting a program, viewing the time, or accessing the main menu.}}".  Should the first argument of the glossaryentry ("applet") be translated?  Should 'applet' in "name={applet}" be translated?  How should a translator know what to translate?  Is there a docu
[21:34] <shrini> ubuntujenkins: awesome
[21:34] <shrini> missed a }
[21:34] <ubuntujenkins> askhl_: http://files.ubuntu-manual.org/style-guide.pdf
[21:34] <askhl_> ubuntujenkins, thanks
[21:34] <shrini> ubuntujenkins: how did you find that?
[21:34] <ubuntujenkins> there is a chapter for translators
[21:34] <ubuntujenkins> shrini: its in the /topic
[21:34]  * c7p ubuntujenkins is quick :)
[21:35] <shrini> ubuntujenkins: haha
[21:35] <ubuntujenkins> shrini: with practice there is another one but i can't work out where
[21:35] <shrini> ubuntujenkins: I asked on how did you find the missing }
[21:35] <ubuntujenkins> yea i realised. It takes practice
[21:36] <godbyk> Hey, c7p. I think it's your turn. Where did I leave off with the Greek translation?
[21:36] <shrini> ubuntujenkins: fine
[21:36] <ubuntujenkins> shrini: https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/lucid-e1/+pots/ubuntu-manual/ta/1394/+translate
[21:37] <ChrisWoollard> What gets me is that ubuntu-manual.com is still available.
[21:37] <ubuntujenkins> shrini: thats the other one if you can aprove it please
[21:37] <shrini> ubuntujenkins: approved
[21:37] <shrini> ubuntujenkins: great
[21:37] <shrini> job
[21:37] <shrini> :-)
[21:37] <godbyk> shrini: If you run 'make ubuntu-manual-ta.tex' then 'xelatex ubuntu-manual-ta', it will tell you what line number the error is near.
[21:38] <ubuntujenkins> shrini: did you see my link with the manual as it is
[21:38] <ubuntujenkins> now you tell me godbyk
[21:38] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: heh. :)
[21:38] <ubuntujenkins> I have other ways :P
[21:38] <c7p> godbyk: nice my turn :). The translation and proofreading is completed if that's what you mean.
[21:38] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: Yeah, the Makefile is set to run through the compilation regardless of errors. But if you run xelatex yourself, it'll go into interactive mode and sometimes give you line numbers and useful hints.
[21:38] <askhl_> ubuntujenkins, translators normally see only the strings and comments in the Launchpad template.  I suggest that you add a link/reference to that pdf in a very visible place (the launchpad project page or something like that).
[21:39] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: On the other hand, it sometimes gets confused about what the actual problem is and leads you on wild goose chases.
[21:39] <ubuntujenkins> askhl_: we have tried to add it to launchpad but there is not a way to
[21:39] <godbyk> c7p: Okay, let me find my translation editors to do list.  See what else needs to be done. :)
[21:39] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: I will try and rember your way my way works well usually
[21:40] <askhl_> ubuntujenkins, Launchpad will linkify URLs in e.g. the project description.  If you just type it, a translator will find easily find it (it would be the first place to look when in doubt)
[21:40] <godbyk> askhl_: We can't add text to the top of the translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual page, though.
[21:40] <askhl_> ubuntujenkins, of course you may not want to add too much 'mess' on the main launchpad project page, so it's just a suggestion in order to minimize the error rate
[21:41] <godbyk> askhl_: Is there another page you think we should add the link to?
[21:41] <shrini> ubuntujenkins: 'xelatex ubuntu-manual-ta' breaks in some point
[21:41] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: Is there a link on the ubuntu-manual.org site to the style guide? If not, we should probably add one. (with the author/editor/translation instructions or something.)
[21:41] <shrini> how to find the error is on 71 and 1394?
[21:41] <askhl_> godbyk, give me a moment while I double-check that I didn't miss it in an obvious place (I looked at a few pages before asking here)
[21:42] <ubuntujenkins> shrini: best not to edit the po file manualy
[21:42] <godbyk> askhl_: sure.  I think he hasn't been posted or advertised very much, though, and we definitely need to do a better job of that.
[21:42] <shrini> ubuntujenkins: never did that
[21:42] <shrini> :-)
[21:42] <askhl_> godbyk, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual/translators <-- this would be one obvious place
[21:43] <c7p> shiri: if you want some help with bug tracking i'm here
[21:43] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: no the pdf is not on the translators section or eitors
[21:43] <godbyk> askhl_: Yeah, sadly, that's the page where we *can't* add it.
[21:43] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: we should add it there. :)
[21:43] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: yep
[21:43] <ubuntujenkins> shrini: get launchpad to e-mail the new po file
[21:44] <ubuntujenkins> we could also add the ppa godbyk
[21:44] <askhl_> godbyk, what do you mean you can't add it?  Surely you could add an URL?
[21:44] <askhl_> (to the wikipage I mean.  Don't know about adding files etc.)
[21:44] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: we can add the translators pdf to the launchpad home page
[21:44] <godbyk> askhl_: Oh! Sorry. I misread your url.
[21:45] <godbyk> askhl_: I'd love to add the link to this page, but it's not possible (yet): https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual
[21:45] <askhl_> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual <-- I also looked for something at this page (as I know it cannot be added on translations.launchpad.net, the project overview page would be another good entry point)
[21:45]  * ubuntujenkins adds it to the lauchpad hme page
[21:45] <askhl_> godbyk, right :)
[21:45] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: we should also kill the wiki stuff and have it redirect people to your website.
[21:46] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: I will do that if you like
[21:46] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: go for it! If there's stuff on the wiki that we need to add to our site, we should figure that out as well.
[21:47]  * ubuntujenkins does rm -rf wiki
[21:48] <ubuntujenkins> what branch is the website?
[21:48] <daker> ubuntujenkins,  lp:ubuntu-manual-website
[21:49] <askhl_> ubuntujenkins, godbyk: thank you very much
[21:49] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: how do we want the first page of the wiki to look? there is stuff on it thats not on the website I think make all the home page buttons link to the website. delete the "get involved" page
[21:49] <ChrisWoollard> the wiki has details of meetings
[21:50] <ubuntujenkins> askhl_: no problem what langauge do you translate out of interest
[21:50] <ubuntujenkins> I think i will keep the meetings page for now
[21:50] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: yeah, we probably need to keep the meetings page there.
[21:50] <ChrisWoollard> not that
[21:51] <ChrisWoollard> there has been a meeting for a while
[21:51] <ubuntujenkins> we could do with one
[21:51] <godbyk> we probably need to have a meeting soon, too.
[21:52] <ChrisWoollard> How difficult would it be to migrate the meetings page also?
[21:52] <ubuntujenkins> daker: can you do a button that says "Website" please or "Go to Website"
[21:53] <daker> sure :S
[21:53] <daker> sure :D
[21:53] <ubuntujenkins> thanks
[21:53] <shrini> ubuntujenkins: wow
[21:53] <shrini> thanks
[21:53] <askhl_> ubuntujenkins, Danish.  I'm the coordinator for ubuntu translations, so it's mostly other people who'll do the translations.  I'll see to it that the work runs smoothly etc.
[21:53] <shrini> got a pdf for 146 page
[21:53] <ubuntujenkins> askhl_: cool, I like to know whos who
[21:54] <ubuntujenkins> shrini: yep :P
[21:54] <shrini> :-)
[21:55] <shrini> added screenshots too
[21:55] <shrini> created a folder "ta"
[21:55] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: thoughts on putting http://paste.ubuntu.com/445286/ on the top of http://ubuntu-manual.org/getinvolved
[21:55] <shrini> copied images from en
[21:55] <shrini> awesome output
[21:56] <monkeylibre> hi, I´m trying to compile the Spanish traslation to .pdf but always I get http://paste.ubuntu.com/445283/ when I do make, the English version is compiled. What have I do before compiling the traslation? Thanks in advance.
[21:56]  * ubuntujenkins compiles spanish
[21:56] <shrini> ubuntujenkins: http://pastebin.com/x9jpgswb
[21:56] <shrini> ubuntujenkins: got this error along with pdf
[21:56] <ubuntujenkins> daker: can you e-mail me please xchat transfre never works i think its the uni internet
[21:57] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: not too bad.  fun is repeated in the last paragraph, though.  maybe the second paragraph will help clear up the 'official' label?
[21:58] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: can you submit a suggestion to it please
[21:58] <godbyk> monkeylibre: Are you using the lucid-e1 or lucid-e2 branch?
[21:58] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: sure, in just a bit.
[21:58] <ubuntujenkins> monkeylibre: run make ubuntu-manual-es.pdf
[21:58] <ubuntujenkins> thanks godbyk
[21:58] <monkeylibre> lucid-e1
[21:58] <ubuntujenkins> there are missing } in the translation i wil fix them
[22:00] <monkeylibre> so must I use the lucid-e2 branch?
[22:00] <ubuntujenkins> daker: yep tahts fine thanks
[22:00] <ubuntujenkins> monkeylibre: nope lucid-e1 is fine
[22:01] <ubuntujenkins> monkeylibre: does "make ubuntu-manual-es.pdf" work?
[22:02] <monkeylibre> no, but the others traslations also show me the same error http://paste.ubuntu.com/445283/
[22:02] <ubuntujenkins> monkeylibre: can you run make clean then make please
[22:03] <ubuntujenkins> then "make ubuntu-manual-es.pdf"
[22:04] <ubuntujenkins> monkeylibre: can you aprove https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/lucid-e1/+pots/ubuntu-manual/es/102/+translate please i have added an extra }
[22:08] <monkeylibre> I did make clean, make and make ubuntu-manual, but i have the same problem also I fixed https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/lucid-e1/+pots/ubuntu-manual/es/102/+translate
[22:08] <ubuntujenkins> monkeylibre: you need to do "make ubuntu-manual-es.pdf
[22:09] <ubuntujenkins> thansk for approving
[22:11] <monkeylibre> sorry, make clean, make and make ubuntu-manual-es.pdf and also others traslations but I still have the problem
[22:12] <ubuntujenkins> monkeylibre: hmm
[22:12]  * ubuntujenkins nudges godbyk
[22:12] <godbyk> what's up?
[22:13] <ubuntujenkins> http://paste.ubuntu.com/445283/ is monkeylibre error he ahs tried  make clean, make and make ubuntu-manual-es.pdf an
[22:13] <godbyk> Hmm..
[22:13] <godbyk> Let me look on mine real quick.
[22:14] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: mine works there are mising } errors
[22:14] <godbyk> Yeah, there are some errors there.
[22:14] <godbyk> monkeylibre: can you paste the results of 'bzr info'?
[22:14] <ubuntujenkins> I have found one but can't find the next
[22:14] <godbyk> monkeylibre: also the results of 'cat revision.tex'
[22:15] <monkeylibre> Standalone tree (format: 2a)
[22:15] <monkeylibre> Location:
[22:15] <monkeylibre>   branch root: .
[22:15] <monkeylibre> Related branches:
[22:15] <monkeylibre>   parent branch: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-manual/ubuntu-manual/lucid-e2/
[22:16] <godbyk> monkeylibre: Ah, you're trying to compile lucid-e2.
[22:16] <godbyk> monkeylibre: You need to check out lucid-e1 instead.
[22:16] <shrini> godbyk: replied for your mail with the list of tamil words
[22:16] <godbyk> shrini: great, thanks!  I'll get that code written in a bit.  that should also help with our font problem, too.
[22:16] <shrini> godbyk: thanks a lot
[22:17] <godbyk> monkeylibre: you'll need to run 'bzr branch lp:ubuntu-manual/lucid-e1' to get the lucid-e1 branch.
[22:17] <godbyk> monkeylibre: then running 'make' and 'make ubuntu-manual-es.pdf' should work.  (aside from the errors ubuntujenkins pointed out.)
[22:18] <ubuntujenkins> daker: thanks for the button
[22:19] <ubuntujenkins> I have deleted the conributors wiki page and linked to the website if ben wants it back i have a copy locally ( godbyk )
[22:20] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: works for me.
[22:28] <daker> ubuntujenkins, no problem
[22:30] <shrini> godbyk: is it possible to get a neat tamil font in pdf today?
[22:30] <godbyk> shrini: I don't know when 'today' ends for you, but I'll try to get one in during the next couple hours.
[22:31] <shrini> hahaha
[22:31] <godbyk> Right now I'm working on the Greek manual with c7p.
[22:31] <shrini> okey
[22:31] <shrini> mytime is now early morning 3
[22:31] <shrini> will be awake
[22:31]  * ubuntujenkins can't find the missing }
[22:33] <godbyk> shrini: okay.  my time is 4:30 in the afternoon.
[22:33]  * ubuntujenkins found it
[22:33] <shrini> godbyk: thats fine
[22:33] <shrini> how do you people get time to hang on IRC in your day time?
[22:33] <shrini> students?
[22:34]  * ubuntujenkins is a student but I am always busy/should be doing other things
[22:34] <godbyk> shrini: It's on a weekend here, so I'm not working.  (I'm also a student, though.)
[22:34] <godbyk> I usually work from home, so I can be on IRC then.
[22:34] <godbyk> Sometimes I have to attend meetings, though. :-(
[22:34] <shrini> great
[22:35] <shrini> you people are rocking
[22:35] <ubuntujenkins> monkeylibre: can you approve https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/lucid-e1/+pots/ubuntu-manual/es/115/+translate please changed ) to } at the end
[22:36] <ubuntujenkins> that was hard to spot in bright pink
[22:38] <ubuntujenkins> monkeylibre: this  \\keystroke{Ctrl+Alt+Flecha izquierda o \\"
[22:38] <ubuntujenkins> "keystroke{Ctrl+Alt+Flecha derecha} para cambiar de espacio rápidamente.}" in english is  \\keystroke{Ctrl+Alt+Flecha izquierda o \\"
[22:38] <ubuntujenkins> "keystroke{Ctrl+Alt+Flecha derecha} para cambiar de espacio rápidamente.}" where should the } go is it after the word "izquierda ?
[22:39]  * ubuntujenkins notes line 2607 (using irc)
[22:41] <ubuntujenkins> monkeylibre: can you also approve https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/lucid-e1/+pots/ubuntu-manual/es/494/+translate please
[22:42] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: what does this error mean http://paste.ubuntu.com/445297/ ?
[22:43] <monkeylibre> yes, \\keystroke{Ctrl+Alt+Flecha izquierda} o \\keystroke{Ctrl+Alt+Flecha derecha} para cambiar de espacio rápidamente.}
[22:43] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: there's not much context to tell, but it's probably something messed up with a \screenshot command.
[22:44] <ubuntujenkins> monkeylibre: thanks i will sort it on launch pad
[22:44] <godbyk> (given the \floatalignment command as a clue)
[22:44] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: I will check the \screenshot ones then
[22:45] <monkeylibre> also I fixed more wrong traslation but Launchpad hasn´t still imported
[22:46] <godbyk> monkeylibre: It won't import the po files. You'll have to fix the translations through Launchpad.
[22:46] <monkeylibre> ok no problems
[22:58] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: this is the output of xelatex ubuntu-manual-es any other suggestions these errors are a lot harder to find than normal http://paste.ubuntu.com/445317/
[23:01] <godbyk> For the glossary entry errors, check to make sure the right stuff is translated, make sure you have all the braces {}, commas, and equals signs in the right place.
[23:01] <ubuntujenkins> ok I will double check
[23:02] <godbyk> \newglossaryentry{notranslate}{name={translate}, description={translate}, plural={translate}}
[23:04] <c7p> I had the same sneaky problem, check also if the command (i.e the "\newglossaryentry") isn't misspelled
[23:07] <ubuntujenkins> i will do c7p
[23:10] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: the applet entry has the first parameter translated when it shouldn't be
[23:11] <ubuntujenkins> thanks godbyk which line?
[23:11] <godbyk> 12, I think.
[23:11] <godbyk> (I'm looking at the po file.)
[23:11] <ubuntujenkins> line 37 in the po file looks mor elikely
[23:12] <godbyk> same with dialup connection.
[23:12] <ubuntujenkins> now i see doh! I did not know that
[23:12] <godbyk> well, that's the line number in the po, yeah.
[23:12] <godbyk> I thought you meant the line number in the .tex file.
[23:13] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: line 128 in the po file has the Ethernet port label translated.
[23:14] <godbyk> line 191: maximize.
[23:14] <godbyk> line 218: minimize
[23:14] <godbyk> line 233: notification area
[23:14] <ubuntujenkins> these are all fixed in alunchpad atm
[23:15] <godbyk> line 249: output
[23:15] <godbyk> ah, okay.
[23:16] <ubuntujenkins> I think i will get the new po file and check it
[23:17] <ubuntujenkins> thanks godbyk
[23:17] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: I think the specific error you pointed out was related to line 408 in the po file.
[23:18] <ubuntujenkins> how do you do it its alot to find in it all
[23:19] <monkeylibre> thanks for all, tomorrow I will fix all wrongs traslations, bye
[23:19] <ubuntujenkins> bye monkeylibre I may leave some for you to aprove
[23:19] <godbyk> Goodbye, monkeylibre.
[23:40] <daker> ubuntujenkins, have you watched "Prince Of Persia The Sands Of Time" ?
[23:42] <ubuntujenkins> daker: I have not
[23:46] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: there are lots of errors in the spanish translation I have found all i can tonight
[23:46] <ubuntujenkins> we are on 72 pages so far
[23:46] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: 'kay.
[23:47] <ubuntujenkins> they are 100% translated on launchpad so you will have another one to work on :)
[23:47] <ChrisWoollard> g'night all. until tomorrow.
[23:47] <daker> ubuntujenkins, http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=1386171529097&ref=share
[23:47] <ubuntujenkins> night ChrisWoollard
[23:48] <ubuntujenkins> godbyk: its nice to see lots of translations coming out of the wood work
[23:48] <godbyk> ubuntujenkins: yeah, it's pretty awesome.
[23:49] <godbyk> I'm working with c7p to create a checklist so that we can get future translations moving faster.
[23:49] <ubuntujenkins> hopefully I can help in 10 days when i finish
[23:49] <godbyk> The first one is always the most difficult. :)
[23:49] <ubuntujenkins> o good then I might be able to help you help the translators
[23:50] <c7p> godbyk: I hope you haven't forgot that http://typewith.me/rE4pCABOXs :)
[23:50] <godbyk> c7p: Nope, I haven't forgotten!
[23:50] <godbyk> That's what I've started with.
[23:51] <c7p> godbyk: cool :d
[23:52] <godbyk> I'd like to have a huge checklist of all the niggling details I worry about so that the translation editors and I can just go down the list and check off each item.
[23:52] <godbyk> Once everything's checked off, we're ready to publish! :)
[23:52] <godbyk> I have to check with daker, too, to ensure our website is ready for translations.
[23:52] <godbyk> Lots of stuff going on in the background.
[23:53] <ubuntujenkins> daker: that film looks really cool
[23:53] <godbyk> I'm going to find something for supper. Be back in a bit.
[23:54] <ubuntujenkins> I am off to bed night all
[23:54] <daker> ubuntujenkins, this Morocco :)
[23:54] <daker> is*
[23:54] <ubuntujenkins> looks very pretty
[23:55] <c7p> wooow lots of stuff cograts godbyk for your effort
[23:59] <c7p> good night all


[06:11] <laoshi> cjohnston, good morning
[06:23] <sagaci> evening
[06:40] <dholbach> good morning
[06:44] <laoshi> cjohnston, thanks for helping me out last night. I have now updated the list of administrators of the Danish team on launchpad and find them duly reflected on the loco portal
[06:44] <laoshi> so all is well
[07:24] <dholbach> hey dpm
[07:24] <dholbach> how are you doing?
[07:24] <dholbach> dpm, did you make a decision about UADW?
[07:24] <dholbach> I guess I can remove my session from my calendar for now
[07:26] <dpm> hi dholbach, yeah, sorry. I had a chat with Jono last week and decided to postpone it to Q
[07:26] <dpm> good morning everyone
[07:27] <dholbach> ok, no worries
[08:07] <czajkowski> herrro
[09:00] <czajkowski> mhall119: https://launchpad.net/unity-buss
[10:36] <Pendulum> mhall119: I think we're getting your weather by accident today.
[10:37] <czajkowski> gimmie!
[10:37] <Pendulum> czajkowski: you can have it. It's also at 89% humidity currently and I'm not sure it's going to go down much
[10:42] <czajkowski> that is a bit of a difference from my 9 degrees here
[10:42] <Pendulum> yeah, it's currenly 14 and is supposed to hit 32
[10:43]  * czajkowski goes to look at a sun holiday
[11:03] <nigelb> czajkowski: You can switch weather with me anyday!
[11:04] <nigelb> It's 30s with low humidity.
[11:04] <nigelb> Quite hot actually :)
[11:06] <czajkowski> nice
[11:07] <Pendulum> nigelb: I'd take the low humidity part
[12:41] <mhall119> czajkowski: what about unity-buss?
[12:41] <mhall119> Pendulum: it's actually been nice here the last couple of days, but we badly need some rain
[12:42] <czajkowski> mhall119: was just one of the projects was reviewing this mornign, thought I'd bring it to your light, it was a lens
[12:42] <czajkowski> got side tracked sorting out issues
[12:42] <daker> dholbach, see what i have posted on G+
[12:46] <mhall119> czajkowski: yeah, I've been seeing it progress
[12:46] <mhall119> people are doing very innovative things with lenses
[12:46] <mhall119> I love it
[12:46] <czajkowski> aye tis really cool to see
[13:03] <Pendulum> mhall119: it's supposed to be 90 with a decent amount of humidity today. This is not normal. And for me it's not good :-/
[13:03] <czajkowski> :(
[13:04] <dholbach> daker: wow
[13:04] <mhall119> Pendulum: yeah, especially up north where people consider A/C "optional"
[13:05] <dholbach> daker: I can still remember going down that road - Marrakech to Ouazazarte
[13:05] <daker> dholbach, yep
[13:05] <Pendulum> mhall119: it's also mid-April. I can't remember it ever being this hot this early
[13:06] <dholbach> (and from there down to M'Hamid)
[13:06] <Pendulum> I'm really glad I'm not still in school
[13:06] <Pendulum> since no schools up here have a/c that I know of
[13:07] <dholbach> daker: these guys are crazy :)
[13:08] <daker> dholbach, it's called Tizi-N-Tichka, 200km of turns the most dangerous road in Morocco
[13:09] <dholbach> :-)
[13:14] <mhall119> Pendulum: yeah, it got hot early here too
[13:14] <mhall119> never really got cold either
[13:18] <czajkowski> http://www.breakingnews.ie/world/all-gatwick-flights-suspended-after-emergency-landing-547688.html  flying with virgin to UDS
[13:19] <Pendulum> mhall119: I'm brainstorming places with a/c that don't require me to stay upright (either seated or standing). We need more places in the US where it's okay to lounge ;-)
[13:23] <mhall119> Pendulum: yeah, despite having so many places called "lounges"
[13:23] <mhall119> Pendulum: you can always just go spend the day at the Mattress Factory "trying out" the beds
[13:26] <Pendulum> I was thinking of that. Not sure they'd appreciate my normal 14:30 crash where I can't wake up for a while, though ;-)
[13:57] <czajkowski> dpm: ello would you know how I could check this out or if the team should in fact be active? https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/193807
[14:19] <dpm> hi czajkowski, what I usually do in these cases is to check that they've actually contacted the current team owner, and if they can provide evidence that they have and the owner is unresponsive, I ask a LOSA to reassign ownership to the person interested in leading the team
[14:19] <czajkowski> grand
[14:19] <czajkowski> thanks
[14:20] <daker> where is jcastro ?
[14:21] <jcastro> I am here, hi
[14:25] <daker> jcastro, https://plus.google.com/101694416703170881163/posts/JFvrgR78NDJ
[14:25] <jcastro> oh cool
[14:25] <jcastro> yeah I saw that firday
[14:25] <jcastro> I thought you were working on the loco portal though?
[14:27] <daker> jcastro, the them is here if you want to deploy it https://code.launchpad.net/~cloud-portal-dev/ubuntu-cloud-portal/wp-cloud-portal
[14:28] <daker> jcastro, we can deploy it cloud.u.c, test it then switch to it when it's ready
[14:28] <jcastro> hmm I don't know what's going on with the cloud portal
[14:29] <jcastro> I thought the web team was redoing it?
[14:29] <daker> jcastro, no idea :/
[14:52] <jcastro> mhall119: hah you didn't know about the new Cosmos?
[14:53] <jcastro> hosted by Tyson and get this
[14:53] <jcastro> produced/directed by Seth McFarlane (the Family Guy guy)
[14:58] <mhall119> jcastro: no, I *have* to find this
[14:59] <mhall119> I bet my kids would love it
[14:59] <jcastro> it's not out
[14:59] <jcastro> it's what everyone is waiting for this year
[14:59] <jcastro> I don't know when it's coming out
[14:59] <mhall119> man, how did I miss all of this?
[14:59] <mhall119> this makes me so happy
[15:00] <jcastro> http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/05/arts/television/fox-plans-new-cosmos-with-seth-macfarlane-as-a-producer.html
[15:00] <jcastro> it's going to be like 13 episodes or something
[15:00] <mhall119> because I was pretty tired of seeing Michio Kaku everywhere
[15:01] <mhall119> " expected to be broadcast in 2013" awww
[15:05] <cprofitt> hello Gwaihir
[15:05] <Gwaihir> hello cprofitt!
[15:06] <cprofitt> hey jono
[15:06] <cprofitt> hope both of your days are going well
[15:07] <jono> hey cprofitt!
[15:07] <jono> good thanks, you?
[15:08] <cprofitt> A little hectic, co-worker is off who imaged a few hundred machines last week...
[15:08] <cprofitt> other than that pretty good
[15:13] <jcastro> mhall119: aha! dude, the create meeting shows up for me now
[15:13] <mhall119> jcastro: cool
[15:14] <mhall119> I forgot cjohnston made it possible to assign scheduler permissions on a per-summit basis
[15:57] <greg-g> hah, this diff really isn't very helpful at all http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~sabdfl/ubuntu-codeofconduct/v2-draft/revision/17
[16:26] <dholbach> greg-g, even a wdiff is not particularly helpful
[16:26] <dholbach> the CoC contained a lot of duplication when the LCoC got merged in
[16:33] <greg-g> dholbach: do you know if there is a summary of the changes, other than "tighten it up a bit" ? :)
[16:33] <dholbach> greg-g, the diversity statement got added and the LCoC was merged in, plus some generalisations + crispification
[16:34] <greg-g> "crispification" I'm going to use that in the future
[16:35] <cprofitt> yeah... crispification is a cool word
[16:36] <czajkowski> it had grown to over 200 lines and wasn't very easy t read now it reads a lot better
[16:36] <czajkowski> shorter sentences ++
[16:38] <greg-g> I'm all for crispification :) but like I said on the loco-contacts mailing list, comparing how things are phrased is important. Phrasing gives a document its 'feel'.
[16:40] <cprofitt> greg-g: you would rather read both the new one as a complete non-diff version?
[16:41] <cprofitt> I suspect a diff or the original vs. its current form would look a great deal like v17 that you commented on.
[16:42] <dholbach> greg-g, http://paste.ubuntu.com/932765/ or http://paste.ubuntu.com/932767/
[16:42] <dholbach> the diff is almost useless
[16:43] <greg-g> actually, that diff is useful to me, it shows me which things weren't touched and which words were removed
[16:44] <greg-g> it is terribly messy, but, there's a ton of changes that were made
[16:45] <dholbach> whenever you rephrase a section to "crisp" it, it will look like something was removed
[16:45] <dholbach> but yeah
[16:45] <dholbach> enjoy the diff :)
[16:45] <greg-g> yeah, all I'm saying is that crisping can sometimes lose nuance (almost by definition) and nuance is sometimes important (not always). I mean, I'm coming at this with my work day hat on, which is all lawyers and politicians ;)
[16:46] <czajkowski> greg-g: remove the hat
[16:46] <czajkowski> it's been a long day have a beer
[16:46] <czajkowski> :)
[16:46] <dholbach> yeah, removing the hat will help ;-)
[16:47] <dholbach> to me it's very much the same in spirit
[16:47] <greg-g> czajkowski: it just started! ;) I really wish I could!
[16:47] <czajkowski> greg-g: go read your emails from me so :p
[16:47] <dholbach> alright my friends - I call it a day
[16:47] <dholbach> see you tomorrow *HUGS*
[16:47] <czajkowski> toodles dholbach
[16:47] <dholbach> byeeeeeee
[16:48] <greg-g> dholbach: good to know (re very much the same in spirit)
[16:48] <greg-g> g'night!
[16:48] <dholbach> :)
[16:56] <cprofitt> greg-g: I see you Monday is like mine...
[16:56] <cprofitt> your Monday I meant
[17:03] <mhall119> jono: are we still on for a call today?
[17:04] <jono> mhall119, hey, yeah, just give me one min
[17:04] <jono> wrapping up some openstack bits
[17:08] <jono> mhall119, lets go
[17:08] <jono> usual hangout
[17:10] <greg-g> btw, crispification reminds me of jono, mostly because I like my bacon crisp
[17:46] <mhall119> jono: btw, I did some work on the API pages last week: http://developer.ubuntu.com/resources/platform/api/
[17:48] <cjohnston> jono: the Leadership Summit has been scheduled
[18:08] <jcastro> jono: you still wanna hang out?
[18:09] <jcastro> jono: did "someone will come pick them up" turn into "jono come deliver these to us immediately in rush hour"?
[18:09] <jono> jcastro, totally, you still good for wed eve?
[18:09] <jono> cjohnston, cool
[18:09] <jono> jcastro, I am bringing them down for 1pm
[18:09] <jono> cjohnston, set for Tues/Thu afternoon?
[18:10] <jcastro> jono: thumbs up for wed.
[18:10] <jono> jcastro, :-)
[18:11] <jcastro> jono: in other news, I am carting a microserver with me as carry on.
[18:11] <jcastro> you know, JUST IN CASE we need it.
[18:11] <cprofitt> N40L?
[18:11] <cjohnston> jono: yes
[18:11] <jcastro> yeah
[18:11] <cprofitt> I still have not taken the plunge on one yet
[18:25] <jcastro> jono: nowish or should I hit lunch?
[18:25] <jono> jcastro, hit lunch, on calls
[18:25] <jcastro> <3
[18:28] <mhall119> it's better to just eat it
[18:41] <jcastro> mhall119: fyi, skaet can't seem to move/edit sessions either
[18:46] <mhall119> jcastro: is she a track lead?
[18:47] <mhall119> has she managed the scheduling at prior UDS's?
[18:48] <pleia2> jcastro: I live a few blocks from the openstack conference this week, are there awesome people I should be inviting out for coffee? :)
[18:49] <pleia2> I was pretty close to volunteering at the Debian booth so I could attend, but work :(
[18:50] <mhall119> pleia2: it's probably a good bet that there are some awesome people there :)
[18:51] <pleia2> I know Mark is here, looked at his IP earlier
[18:51] <pleia2> but didn't catch up online
[18:52] <jussi> sigh/grumble
[18:52] <jussi> akgraner: are you here?
[18:52] <jussi> (no, the grumble isnt at you, its at all those who arent around when I need them)
[19:20] <bodhi_zazen> OMG the mighty paultag
[19:20] <hobgoblin> hi pangolin
[19:20] <paultag> bodhi_zazen: I've missed you :)
[19:20] <hobgoblin> sorry
[19:20] <hobgoblin> hi paultag
[19:20] <paultag> heyya hobgoblin
[19:20] <paultag> bodhi_zazen: I'm just here to note my extreme protest against the new CoC :)
[19:20] <nothingspecial> hi paultag
[19:20] <paultag> waiting in here in case someone who had a hand in it shows up
[19:20] <paultag> hey nothingspecial
[19:20] <paultag> bodhi_zazen: how's things?
[19:21] <paultag> (you too, hobgoblin)
[19:21] <hobgoblin> good thanks
[19:21] <paultag> (also you nothingspecial)
[19:21] <bodhi_zazen> what new CoC ?
[19:21] <pleia2> paultag: happy birthday! (is it your real birthday or just your facebook birthday?)
[19:21] <paultag> bodhi_zazen: the new CoC that was proposed w/ Nazi-germany "Unity" clause
[19:21]  * bodhi_zazen beats paultag with CoC
[19:21] <paultag> pleia2: It's my real birthday, thanks! :)
[19:21] <pleia2> what's the "Unity" clause?
[19:21] <nothingspecial> good thanks paultag
[19:22] <paultag> pleia2: Decisiveness has value in itself
[19:22] <paultag> pleia2: where if I badmouth us having Unity by default, I'm in violation of the CoC
[19:22] <bodhi_zazen> Do you have a link paultag ?
[19:22] <paultag> pleia2: in personal or public discussion
[19:22] <paultag> bodhi_zazen: yeah, one sec
[19:22] <pleia2> paultag: I think it's more referring to the type of thing that caused Ubuntu to be created (sarge was stable for 3 years)
[19:22] <paultag> pleia2: if you read it, me saying Ubuntu was a bad decision is in violation
[19:23] <pleia2> I think we're reading it very differently
[19:23] <marcoceppi> paultag: I think you're taking that clause to the extreme a bit
[19:23] <paultag> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~dholbach/ubuntu-codeofconduct/v2-draft/view/head:/MergedCodeOfConduct.txt
[19:23] <marcoceppi> It says you can disagree, just be respectful.
[19:23] <paultag> It says if I debate the issue, it's against the CoC
[19:23] <pleia2> marcoceppi: +1
[19:23] <paultag> even if that debate is civil
[19:23] <pleia2> paultag: I don't see that part
[19:24] <paultag> hose who do the work make the decisions and we do not expect to
[19:24] <paultag> delay, debate or discuss any decision after the fact
[19:24] <pleia2> and it wouldn't make any sense anyway
[19:24] <paultag> the point remains, strictly, I'd be in violation
[19:24] <paultag> I don't take such things lightly, I'd like to be able to comply with the CoC
[19:25] <paultag> if you could modify that to add constructive or respectful, I'd be fine
[19:25] <marcoceppi> paultag: are you running around littering the internet with snide one-off remarks like "unity sucks"
[19:25] <paultag> marcoceppi: does it matter?
[19:25] <pleia2> paultag: did you send feedback to czajkowski?
[19:25] <paultag> if I did, it'd be gainst the CoC
[19:25] <marcoceppi> yes, because that's not constructive in any way
[19:25] <paultag> pleia2: yes, and I came here in the case it needed to be discussed real-time
[19:25] <pleia2> paultag: can you please tell us what portion exactly says you can't civilly disagree so I don't need to wait for her to add it to the wiki?
[19:25] <paultag> I vehemently oppose this clause, because a bunch of people made a bad decision and don't want to hear critisim anymore
[19:26] <pleia2> I am terribly confused :(
[19:26] <paultag> pleia2: Decisiveness has value in itself.
[19:26] <bodhi_zazen> hey paultag , I can see you feel passionately about this, slow down a bit, I am still reading the document ;)
[19:26] <pleia2> I have no idea how you can read so much into it
[19:26] <paultag> bodhi_zazen: :)
[19:26] <paultag> pleia2: if you read it, it's pretty clear
[19:27] <paultag> it says, don't debate it unless you debate it to a higher council
[19:27] <pleia2> "Decisiveness has value in itself." does not mean "you can never debate anything"
[19:27] <pleia2> where does it say that?
[19:27] <paultag> Those who do the work make the decisions and we do not expect to
[19:27] <paultag> delay, debate or discuss any decision after the fact, except through
[19:27] <paultag> escalation to a more senior governance body
[19:27] <paultag> it's right there, it's very clear
[19:27] <bodhi_zazen> paultag: how would you like that section to read ? pastebin a revision ;)
[19:28] <paultag> bodhi_zazen: I don't want to spend my time cleaning up a mess, I'd just like to be able to stay an Ubuntu member
[19:28] <pleia2> ok, that should be softened since "no debate ever" was not our intention
[19:28] <paultag> I didn't see an issue with the first CoC
[19:28] <bodhi_zazen> The project sort of needs to be able to discuss / debate an issue, make a decision, and move forward
[19:28] <paultag> pleia2: it should, because that reads like an edict from the third reich
[19:28] <paultag> frankly
[19:28] <pleia2> there is no need to go to that level :(
[19:28] <pleia2> it's really hurtful
[19:28] <paultag> (I could be thrown out for that comment if this passed)
[19:29] <marcoceppi> paultag: So you don't want to make it better, just tell people they're wrong? Or am I misreading your statement
[19:29] <bodhi_zazen> I sort of tire of the "Unity sucks" threads on the forums, but we do not take action unless they cross the line and read like personal insults
[19:29] <paultag> wich is part of be respectful
[19:29] <cprofitt> I am fairly 'lawerly' when it comes to looking at things paultag ... and I see that as saying... we can have disagreements, but we can not allow them to persist and fester.
[19:29] <beuno> oh yay!  comparison to the nazis has already started
[19:29] <beuno> was hoping I didn't miss it
[19:29] <marcoceppi> beuno: second time in 10 mins :)
[19:30] <paultag> marcoceppi: I've been contributing to Debian, and to Ubuntu indirectly. I don't care to come back just yet, but I have taken pride in the 4-5 years I've spent here.
[19:30] <cprofitt> the fact that this long after Unity's adoption that we are still coloring any decision by that fact is an example of 'fester'
[19:30] <paultag> pleia2: a fix to that section (or it's removal and implicit inclusion via be respectful) would be great
[19:30] <pleia2> paultag: please try to submit some better wording instead of calling the CC Nazis, I'm very upset right now :(
[19:31] <marcoceppi> Not to mention, if you don't like Unity there has been a great deal of progress on a "fallback" session that operates like Gnome 2 classic. Why not channel your energy and time into that project?
[19:31] <pleia2> like seriously, I am very very upset
[19:31] <paultag> pleia2: I didn't, I called this similar to an edict from the third reich
[19:31] <Pici> ...
[19:31] <paultag> I never insult people personally
[19:31] <beuno> I don't think it should be removed, although certainly reworded
[19:31] <beuno> it's an important message to not add to much negativity to each decision being made
[19:31] <beuno> paralyzing things more and more
[19:32] <beuno> it's not healthy
[19:32] <bodhi_zazen> paultag: you have made your point, people will listen, you willing to try to help with the wording ?
[19:32] <bodhi_zazen> If not, give them a chance
[19:32] <pleia2> we don't have some evil plan in mind to destroy the community, we truly are trying to do our best
[19:32] <beuno> we also don't want to kill 20 million people, so I don't know
[19:32] <bodhi_zazen> and come back after the next revision
[19:32] <bodhi_zazen> without guns blazing
[19:32] <paultag> pleia2: I understand that, and I respect you lots, as you know
[19:32] <paultag> pleia2: but I can't stand the idea of being thrown out because I disagree
[19:32] <paultag> In it's current form, I can not sign it.
[19:32] <Pici> I don't agree with paultag's wording of the issue, but I think that the document could use a little help in that section.
[19:33] <pleia2> paultag: please understand, we opened up discussion to make this work for the community, being so defensive and aggressive is not needed, we want discussion
[19:33] <beuno> and more importantly, it makes your point less likely to be heard
[19:33] <pleia2> suggest a change and say why it's an issue, we don't need these cruel comparisons to understand
[19:33] <nigelb> paultag: You know what, you should propose an MP with better wording.
[19:33] <paultag> pleia2: I'm really not happy! To me it looked like someone was trying to sneak a clause in to quell dislike of bad decisions
[19:33] <cprofitt> certainly the very fact that it was put out for public comment is a sign that the community is taken seriously... I look forward to suggestions on how to improve it. As communities grow they will hit hurdles... we need to get to the hurdle and jump it... not stumble and fall. As a community we can do that if we offer constructive comments and suggestions.
[19:33] <pleia2> paultag: if that was the case we wouldn't have specifically asked for feedback
[19:34] <paultag> pleia2: I understand
[19:35] <mhall119> wow, welcome back paultag
[19:35] <paultag> mhall119: I didn't intend to be back, tbh
[19:35] <mhall119> you never left our hearts :)
[19:35] <paultag> mhall119: ♥
[19:36] <mhall119> even if you think we're CoC nazis
[19:36] <paultag> :)
[19:36] <paultag> the names in here have changed a bit, which is nice to see
[19:36] <mhall119> paultag: that clause, to me, reads "Don't hate people for making a decision when a decision had to be made"
[19:37] <paultag> mhall119: to me, it's if you don't agree, you'll be in violation of the CoC
[19:37] <paultag> or rather, if you don't agree and say something
[19:37] <cjohnston> I don't read it the way paultag does, but I can understand it reading that way
[19:37] <mhall119> or, read another way "JFDI is good, even when you don't specifically agree with what was JF-done"
[19:37] <paultag> mhall119: I wish it was just "Don't disrupt the community because of a descision you disagree with" or something
[19:38] <paultag> it's clearly not the sort of thing where you may not debate this in public or private (as noted as to how the CoC applies)
[19:38] <pleia2> paultag: have you seen the discussions about init on the debian lists lately (and over the past 5 years)? It's addressing that sort of thing
[19:38] <mhall119> paultag: how can the wording be changed to clarify that disagreement is okay, but complaining when decision makers make decisions is not
[19:38] <pleia2> I agree that it needs some rewording
[19:38] <paultag> mhall119: I really don't want to sit down and try to fix something I didn't think was broken, but so long as I can object and make my views known, and not get thrown out, I'm happy.
[19:38] <mhall119> paultag: to me it's there to encourage people to make decisions without worrying about being attacked for it
[19:39] <paultag> since this does apply to any interaction I have in public or private with anyone who knows I'm an Ubuntu'er
[19:41] <bodhi_zazen> I think you made your point paultag , come back after then next revision then, without guns blazing
[19:41] <paultag> I'm a bit heated, sure. I understand the way I presented this is over the line, but that's the point.
[19:41] <paultag> FWIW, I still love all y'all. ♥
[19:42] <pleia2> <3
[19:42] <pleia2> it's really not a conspiracy, the CC is still mostly community members who are doing our best
[19:43] <nigelb> except for mark :P
[19:43] <pleia2> Unity never even came up in any of the discussions I was part of regarding the CoC changes, honestly most of it was about integrating the LCoC
[19:43] <paultag> pleia2: I understand where it's coming from, but I really don't like the idea of an uninforced clause that can be selectively enforced in evil-deamon-X took over someone who made such calls
[19:44] <pleia2> I assure you this is why we opened things up for discussion :)
[19:44] <paultag> I thought most of this was implicit under be respectful
[19:44] <pleia2> obviously we didn't read it the same way you did or think it could be applied in the way you described
[19:44] <paultag> pleia2: I've been wrist deep in copyright law for the last 6 months, I'm starting to speak lawyer
[19:45] <pleia2> hah
[19:45] <nigelb> lol
[19:45] <paultag> (sadly not kidding)
[19:45] <nigelb> paultag: we can still understand you. Try harder.
[19:45] <pleia2> you know, there is a reason we don't like lawyers ;)
[19:45] <paultag> hopefully, you'll end up not liking me, but having a changed CoC ;)
[20:03] <jcastro> hey mhall119
[20:04] <mhall119> hey jcastro
[20:04] <jcastro> this totally fell of my radar, then I realized it's your radar! :)
[20:04]  * mhall119 uses sonar
[20:04] <jcastro> mhall119: stefano is back in school so the AskUbuntu lens is in limbo.
[20:04] <jcastro> markjtully had a fix for precise
[20:05] <jcastro> and that's all I remember
[20:05] <mhall119> ok
[20:05]  * popey boggles
[20:06] <jcastro> I am not sure if it works still or not
[20:06] <jcastro> but I think marcoceppi has trunk merging capabilities on launchpad?
[20:06] <mhall119> I'm adking teester now
[20:06] <jcastro> mebbe all he needs to do is merge the fixes?
[20:06] <marcoceppi> jcastro: I might
[20:06] <marcoceppi> if not I could get them pretty easily (or anyone else who needed them)
[20:13] <jcastro> marcoceppi: hey is there a way to install multiple packages via apt.ubuntu.com?
[20:13] <marcoceppi> yeah, comma-seperated
[20:13] <marcoceppi> http://apt.ubuntu.com/p/geany,geany-plugins
[20:14]  * greg-g hugs paultag
[20:14]  * paultag hugs greg-g
[20:14] <paultag> greg-g: How are you? I've missed you! ♥
[20:15] <marcoceppi> jcastro: maybe not.
[20:15]  * marcoceppi whistles, if only apturl-redirector was accepted :)
[20:15] <jcastro> yours did right?
[20:15] <mhall119> paultag: hey, while we're not on the subject, I wrote a couple of blogs along the lines of my long-running "economics of foss" ideas
[20:15] <greg-g> paultag: pretty good! things are nice out here in SF :)
[20:15] <mhall119> I'd love to get your feedback on them
[20:15] <paultag> mhall119: gladly!
[20:15] <paultag> mhall119: my inbox is always open to you, friend :)
[20:16] <paultag> greg-g: outstanding! How's the LC treating you?
[20:16] <mhall119> paultag: how about your news reader?
[20:16] <paultag> mhall119: news reader? Oh man, what did I do?
[20:16] <czajkowski> paultag: oi brat how come they get hugs and I dont and I've to deal woth you too buddy!
[20:16] <greg-g> paultag: oh you know, fun times in the LC every day. yay drama! :)
[20:16] <akgraner> jussi, looks like you aren't around now - sorry - was on calls
[20:16]  * paultag gives czajkowski a huge hug
[20:16] <paultag> greg-g: oh man, lame
[20:16] <paultag> everything was so happy when I was there … :)
[20:16] <greg-g> hahaha
[20:16] <czajkowski> paultag: drama fecker
[20:17] <jcastro> technoviking: there?
[20:17] <czajkowski> greg-g: feeling the love buddy feeling the love there
[20:18] <greg-g> czajkowski: oh, that wasn't re: you, that was re: the latest issue
[20:18] <paultag> greg-g: czajkowski: Get along. You're both good friends of mine. By the transiant property, you should be best friends!
[20:18] <greg-g> :)
[20:18] <marcoceppi> jcastro: looks like a bug in apturl - multiple packages should work with the apt-url
[20:18] <czajkowski> paultag: yes dear
[20:18] <paultag> :)
[20:19] <czajkowski> greg-g: indeed my head is royally fecked after spending a large chunk of work day trying to resolve it via lp
[20:19] <greg-g> ugh, my condoloences
[20:20] <mhall119> czajkowski: prolonged exposure to Zope has been know to cause those symptoms
[20:20] <czajkowski> hahah
[20:20] <czajkowski> mhall119:
[20:21] <mhall119> :)


[11:58] <handaxe> test
[11:59] <handaxe> test02
[13:02]  * ara -> lunch
[15:54] <ara> cr3: hey marc, quick one about checkbox, may I?
[15:55] <cr3> ara: sure, but I'm in the datacenter so my response time might not be ideal :)
[15:55] <ara> cr3: just the temporal folder where results are stored
[15:55] <ara> cr3 ^
[15:55] <ara> I said a quick one ;-)
[15:58] <cr3> ara: yep, /var/lib/checkbox
[15:59] <ara> cr3: thanks :-)
[16:00] <cr3> ara: it's tricky how it's defined in order to work both in the source tree and in the installed package
[16:00] <ara> cr3: ok, makes sense
[16:01] <cr3> ara: it is defined by the CHECKBOX_DATA environment variable, which can be specified at runtime: CHECKBOX_DATA=/tmp sudo -E checkbox-gtk
[16:01] <cr3> ara: otherwise, it is taken from the shell scripts under bin which point to "." in the source tree and replaced by /var/lib/checkbox in setup.py
[16:01] <ara> cr3, thanks, I will add that information to the checkbox documentation
[16:02] <cr3> ara: thanks!
[16:02] <cr3> ara: you might also like to mention that CHECKBOX_SHARE is another environment variable which behaves essentially the same way
[16:02] <cr3> except that DATA is for variable data such as logs and SHARE is for shared read-only data such as plugins
[16:03] <ara> cr3: ok, will do :)
[19:24] <nagappan> cr3, ping
[19:25] <nagappan> cr3, when I try to access ubuntu-desktop-testing, I get connection timed out
[19:25] <nagappan> cr3, http://pastebin.com/d76f2bf9e
[19:25] <nagappan> cr3, I'm behind proxy
[19:26] <nagappan> cr3, could you please help me ?
[19:26] <cr3> nagappan: I'll try here
[19:27] <nagappan> cr3, sure
[19:27] <cr3> nagappan: works fine here, let me see something else...
[19:27] <nagappan> cr3, sure, guess you are not using proxy ?
[19:27] <nagappan> cr3, I have the environment variable set
[19:28] <nagappan> nags@nalagappan:~/work$ echo $http_proxy
[19:28] <nagappan> http://proxy.vmware.com:3128
[19:28] <cr3> nagappan: 3128, squid? :)
[19:28] <nagappan> cr3, yes
[19:28] <cr3> nagappan: you guys rock at vmware :)
[19:28] <nagappan> cr3, :D
[19:29] <cr3> nagappan: try setting https://proxy.vmware.com:3128, I have systems behind a proxy too so I can try at the same time
[19:29] <nagappan> cr3, in VMware they use most FOSS projects, bugzilla, helpzilla, Ubuntu, mailman, squid and many more
[19:30] <nagappan> cr3, our default development platform for Linux is Ubuntu :)
[19:30] <nagappan> cr3, let me try
[19:32] <nagappan> cr3, no luck, I set like this - export http_proxy=https://proxy.vmware.com:3128
[19:32] <cr3> err, https_proxy... anyways, I tried and it doesn't work either. I'd like to see what bzr does but -v is useless and the ENVIRONMENT section doesn't provide further hints for more verbose debugging
[19:33] <nagappan> cr3, I'm using Ubuntu 8.10
[19:33] <nagappan> cr3, any other info, shall I provide ?
[19:34] <cr3> nagappan: that's good so far, I can reproduce the problem so I can work on this for a bit
[19:34] <nagappan> cr3, sure :)
[19:35] <nagappan> cr3, ara found some issue while testing seahorse and she wants me to reproduce it
[19:35] <nagappan> cr3, thought will try at work today
[19:37] <cr3> nagappan: connect(4, {sa_family=AF_INET, sin_port=htons(443), sin_addr=inet_addr("<IP_ADDRESS>")}, 16) = -1 ECONNREFUSED (Connection refused)
[19:37] <cr3> nagappan: so, it seems that bzr is still trying to connect directly... still looking
[19:37] <nagappan> cr3, ok
[19:37] <nagappan> cr3, thanks :)
[19:38] <cr3> nagappan: I know that I've had issues with some python network libraries when dealing with https over proxies, I've had to spend quite a bit of time getting it right
[19:40] <nagappan> cr3, ah ! ok :)
[19:41] <cr3> strace is the debug flag for bzr :)
[19:48] <cr3> nagappan: http_proxy=http://proxy.vmware.com:3128 bzr branch http://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu-desktop-testing/trunk
[19:48] <cr3> nagappan: there's a bug regarding python xmlrpc libs and https proxies... just what I suspected :)
[19:48] <nagappan> cr3, cool, thanks, let me try and update you
[19:49] <cr3> strace is my best friend, that's how sad my social life has become
[19:49] <nagappan> cr3, :D
[19:50] <nagappan> cr3, some message displayed like this, http://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu-desktop-testing/trunk/ is redirected to https://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu-desktop-testing/trunk/
[19:50] <nagappan> cr3, will there be any indicator of downloading files ?
[19:50] <cr3> nagappan: if it doesn't work, try https_proxy in addition to http_proxy
[19:50] <nagappan> cr3, sure
[19:51] <cr3> nagappan: worked for me
[19:51] <nagappan> cr3, no luck for me :(
[19:51] <nagappan> cr3, sorry
[19:51] <cr3> nagappan: this was my command, might be useful for you to debug as well: http_proxy=http://<IP_ADDRESS>:3128 https_proxy=https://<IP_ADDRESS>:3128 strace -e trace=connect bzr -Dhttps branch http://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu-desktop-testing/trunk
[19:51] <nagappan> cr3, it worked now
[19:51] <nagappan> cr3, after some long delay
[19:52] <cr3> nagappan: excellent, all set?
[19:52] <nagappan> cr3, https_proxy=http://proxy.vmware.com:3128 bzr branch https://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu-desktop-testing/trunk
[19:52] <nagappan> cr3, yes, everything fine
[19:52] <cr3> cool, happy testing then! :)
[19:53] <nagappan> cr3, thanks :)


[01:15] <bkerensa> hi zenlinux
[01:41] <bkero> I'll get it if I an run it in wine.
[01:42] <bkero> http://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=version&iId=25127
[01:42] <bkero> looking hopeful
[02:17] <bkerensa> bkero: That would be nice...