[00:43] <starrats> Got a question for anyone that is available.
[00:43] <ochosi> !aks
[00:43] <ochosi> "ask
[00:43] <ochosi> meh
[00:43] <ochosi> !ask
[00:43] <ochosi> starrats: ^
[00:44] <starrats> What is better to do the daily updates/ypgrades morning or night?  I did them this morning like aLways but should I do them tonight?
[00:44] <starrats> I like to stay currnet.
[00:45] <starrats> current
[00:45] <starrats> I do the three upgrades or should back off and do the two?
[00:45] <starrats> three thing
[00:46] <starrats> update/upgrade/dist-upgrade
[00:48] <starrats> ochosi I was being polite, can you help me?
[00:50] <ochosi> sure, but !patience
[00:50] <ochosi> anyway, i don't think it makes any difference, just check for updates whenever you can/want
[00:50] <ochosi> i don't think there's a specific deploy-time for the buildbots
[00:51] <starrats> ah okay and thank you
[00:53] <ochosi> np
[00:53] <starrats> patience I do have but your 6 lines weren't patient ochosi
[00:53] <ochosi> my six lines?
[00:54] <starrats> ok 4 lines and ubooto came on, sorry
[00:54] <starrats> ubottu came in
[02:27] <ganglere> Just had apt crash after an update/reboot cycle, Bug #1296495
[02:28] <ganglere> Changed to public, Bug #1296495
[02:29] <brainwash> bug 1296495
[03:22] <chrispage1980> can I ask where the default wallpapers are stored?
[05:06] <fibz_> /usr/share/xfce4/backdrops/
[05:15] <chrispage1980> thankyou, I coldn't findit after I changed the wallpaper
[05:39] <chrispage1980> can't see it in defects summary but when I try installing .deb files with Software Center I get "The installation or removal of a software package failed."
[09:19] <elfy> knome:  I've been looking at the Settings Manager description bug, grabbed the relevant from http://git.xfce.org/xfce/xfce4-settings/ , then found where the subtitle string is and changed it - do I just attach the edited xfce-settings-manager dialog.c file to the xfce bug?
[09:20] <elfy> https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10765
[09:24] <ochosi> elfy: not sure that this is really an improvement, "system settings" and "settings manager" just seem to be too similar to me
[09:27] <elfy> ochosi: it's the subtitle which is all wrong - it's currently Customise your desktop - which is not what the settings manager does
[09:27] <elfy> it has those things in it - but it also gets populated with tools like gparted
[09:28] <elfy> gparted doesn't customise your desktop - in fact you might use it to do something not at all related to the desktop :p
[09:34] <ochosi> i know, but you can consider that a bug in gparted
[09:35] <ochosi> not sure it should show up there, there were discussions about that
[09:39] <elfy> it's not a bug ingparted - it used to land in system menu - it's a bug in whatever was changed to make it land in settings manager then :)
[09:39] <elfy> whichever it is :)
[09:41] <elfy> disks goes there as well, and software updates and updater a whole bunch of things which aren't anything to do with customising a desktop
[09:41] <elfy> settings manager now appears to actually be a settings manager area - which is fine, but either the description is wrong or we should stop dropping everything into it imo
[09:42] <ochosi> gparted's desktop file decides about that
[09:43] <ochosi> and i guess it depends on what you see as "desktop"
[09:43] <elfy> well I don't see installing gparted to work with usb's desktop related at all :)
[09:44] <elfy> anyway - bbl - panicking about a job interview for an hour now
[09:44] <ochosi> heh, ok, good luck with the interview!
[09:44] <elfy> ta
[11:10] <slickymasterWork> knome: you around?
[11:15] <slickymasterWork> knome: downloaded today's po_xubuntu_ubiquity-slideshow-xubuntu-pt.po and it's still not showing ochosi's text to the "Make the desktop your own" slide. It's just still showing the word "Stuff" as we had before ochosi made the text
[11:22] <knome> slickymasterWork, hum
[11:23] <slickymasterWork> and a good morning knome :)
[11:24] <knome> downloaded from launchpad?
[11:24]  * starrats is waiting for brainwash to arrive
[11:24] <slickymasterWork> knome: not sure if it relates but even though your https://code.launchpad.net/~knome/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/uife-bug-1294619/+merge/211707 has been merged it's still under 'Pending' status
[11:24] <slickymasterWork> yes knome, downloaded a while ago from LP
[11:25] <knome> slickymasterWork, we still need an upload
[11:25] <knome> slickymasterWork, that's the reason
[11:25] <knome> slickymasterWork, if you want to prepare the translation, you can update the .po file against the .pot
[11:26] <knome> (from the branch)
[11:26] <slickymasterWork> knome, so it's just a matter of someone poking Ubiquity Slideshow to get on with it
[11:26] <knome> yes, stgraber has promised to do an upload
[11:26] <slickymasterWork> I've the translation all done
[11:27] <slickymasterWork> to update the .po file against the .pot I'll have to make a MP, right
[11:27] <slickymasterWork> ?
[11:27] <slickymasterWork> or can I just upload it via LP?
[11:28] <knome> you should upload it via LP, but i don't know how it goes if you upload it before the pot file is uploaded
[11:28] <slickymasterWork> hmm, so it's still better to hang on a few more days
[11:29] <knome> yes
[11:29] <knome> until we have the new upload
[11:29] <knome> i hope we get it today
[11:29] <slickymasterWork> okie dokie
[11:29] <knome> because that would also mean we'd get it in for beta2
[11:29] <slickymasterWork> thanks for the heads up ;)
[11:29] <knome> won't get the *translations* to beta2 though...
[11:29] <knome> but for final, sure
[11:29] <slickymasterWork> that's what's important anyway
[11:29] <knome> https://launchpad.net/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu
[11:29] <knome> scroll down
[11:30] <knome> left bottom part
[11:30] <knome> once the trusty package says version 80, we're good to go
[11:32] <slickymasterWork> good to know that
[11:33] <starrats> may I ask what version is trusty at now?
[11:34] <knome> starrats, what about looking at the link just posted? :)
[11:37] <starrats> okay knome saw where you folks are at the moment
[11:38] <knome> mhm
[11:38] <elfy> morning knome
[11:38] <knome> hey elfy
[11:38] <starrats> will version 80 be the final package for the release next month or will there be more work?
[11:39] <knome> we will need a new upload for the translations when that freeze lands, so at least 81
[11:39] <knome> but the version number itself doesn't matter
[11:39] <knome> just that we need two more uploads
[11:41] <starrats> ah okay
[13:02] <ochosi> brainwash: can you reproduce the "greeter doesnt exit cleanly" bug?
[13:02] <brainwash> ochosi: no
[13:02] <ochosi> hmkay
[13:03] <elfy> hi brainwash
[13:03] <brainwash> hey elfy
[13:42] <ochosi> brainwash: btw, i was only able to confirm this bug after my laptop crashed on suspending: https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10605
[13:42] <ochosi> now i get it consistently, before i didn't at lal
[13:42] <ochosi> all
[13:43] <ochosi> so i'm starting to wonder whether it's solely xfdesktop's fault
[14:25] <brainwash> ochosi: it's a race condition, my session start is rather slow on a fresh boot -> theme glitch, after a quick relog -> no glitch
[15:14] <brainwash> ochosi: we could revert the "faulty" commit
[16:07]  * starrats is waiting for brainwash to arriveand finally
[16:28] <knome> slickymasterWork, ubiquity stuff should be in order now
[16:28] <slickymasterWork> ok, thanks knome
[16:29] <slickymasterWork> yeaps knome, Version 80 uploaded 1 hour ago
[16:42] <slickymasterWork> knome: the problem subsists in the file :P
[16:43] <slickymasterWork> in Version 80 file, that is
[16:44] <knome> ?
[16:48] <knome> hmm, right, i see
[16:48] <knome> weird...
[16:48] <knome> what the...
[16:52] <slickymasterWork> damn connection
[16:52] <knome> yeah, i see the issue.
[16:52] <knome> that's weird.
[16:53] <knome> because both me and stgraber updated the templates
[16:53] <slickymasterWork> it's as if your MP didn't get uploaded
[16:54] <knome> well it did, i merged it..
[16:54] <knome> but oh well
[16:54] <knome> i will have to look at it
[16:54] <knome> >__<
[16:54] <slickymasterWork> I'll keep waiting for good news ;)
[17:07] <starrats> brainwash did yo get my private message?
[17:09] <knome> bbl
[17:46] <starrats> brainwash did not want to send a ubuntu-bug report but the same tings have happened to me today as yesterday.  Those things you gave me did nothing at all.  I'm baffled why i was having so much luck on getting thru start-up that the last two have just been anirritation to me.
[18:16] <brainwash> starrats: please add all information to your bug report
[18:17] <starrats> havent'filed it yet brainwash
[18:18] <starrats> if you want me to file, it will be like the other one, ther was nothing from the term, this is way prior to term
[18:18] <brainwash> it seems to be a general hardware and/or driver issue
[18:19] <starrats> then should file this new report
[18:22] <brainwash> I suggest that you try asking in #ubuntu+1, maybe someone there could help you with debugging the bug/crash
[18:22] <starrats> ah ok will do
[18:55] <Noskcaj> Anyone who'se not given me a motu testimonial, you have 5 minutes, and it's fairly important you do
[19:08] <elfy> Noskcaj: might have been better to tell people earlier
[19:08] <Noskcaj> elfy, I woke up 5 minutes ago
[19:08] <Noskcaj> And i did
[19:08] <elfy> I meant like yesterday - though if you did you can't do more than that :)
[19:09] <elfy> good luck anyway :)
[19:10] <Noskcaj> ty
[19:10]  * elfy did do one for what it's worth a while back
[19:34] <elfy> Noskcaj: at a guess I would suggest what you've been doing package wise and what you've done to deal with their previous comments
[19:54] <micahg-work> ochosi, knome: -default-settings uplaoded
[19:57]  * elfy saw thanks micahg-work :)
[20:32] <micahg-work> woohoo, default settings update  in release pocket
[20:32] <elfy> cool
[20:41] <Noskcaj> So i know can upload catfish, gthumb, parole, and mugshot
[20:42] <micahg-work> not yet
[20:42] <micahg-work> vote needs to be finished by email
[20:44] <Noskcaj> s/know can/should be able to
[20:46] <starrats> those folks over in #ubuntu+1 were as helpful as an umbrella with holes in a down pour, lol
[20:46] <elfy> starrats: nature of IRC - if the people who can help aren't there then it get's lost
[20:47] <elfy> you just have to try again ... and again sometimes :)
[20:47] <starrats> ah ok
[20:50] <elfy> and sometimes you get idiots
[20:55] <starrats> I got some idiot over there and told me to use gentoo instead od a pre-release
[20:55] <elfy> I know I'm in the channel
[20:56] <starrats> ah okay
[20:56] <ochosi> micahg-work: thanks!
[20:57] <ochosi> congrats Noskcaj
[20:58] <micahg-work> ochosi, sorry that took so long, but it's in
[20:58] <elfy> yea - sorry Noskcaj - congrats
[20:59] <ochosi> micahg-work: well the most important thing is that it's in ;)
[20:59] <Noskcaj> thanks, although i feel letdown for only getting that
[20:59] <ochosi> micahg-work: and anyway, might not have been the last update/upload for this cycle
[20:59] <micahg-work> that's fine
[20:59] <ochosi> Noskcaj: why's that? i think it's actually pretty good, these are core apps for xubuntu
[20:59] <elfy> Noskcaj: you can do more than I can :)
[20:59] <micahg-work> we can do more post beta 2 (for a week or so)
[21:00] <elfy> micahg-work: did you have any thoughts about this ibus/keyboard issue at all?
[21:00] <Noskcaj> ochosi, yeah, but i didn't even get PPU for all of my packages from debian, let alone all of xubuntu or all of universe
[21:00] <ochosi> Noskcaj: also, that motivates me to fix bugs in parole cause i know it'll get uploaded
[21:00] <Noskcaj> :)
[21:01] <ochosi> and there are actually a few outstanding ones...
[21:01] <ochosi> micahg-work: yeah, what elfy mentions is actually one more thing we might have to do in default-settings too (disable ibus startup by default)
[21:01] <ochosi> i presume you guys have talked about this already?
[21:01] <micahg-work> elfy, I found a commit I thought might have been responsible, knome was doing some tests
[21:02] <elfy> oh d'oh - sorry - yea I saw that on thursday ...
[21:02] <brainwash> Noskcaj: gz
[21:02] <ochosi> i'm wondering though whether we really want ibus in the tray by default
[21:02] <elfy> ochosi: it did take up a chunk of the last meeting - I just forgot ...
[21:03] <ochosi> that was never the case in any previous release
[21:03] <elfy> ochosi: yea +1 to that
[21:03] <ochosi> so personally i'd go for disabling at least the trayicon, even if ibus gets fixed
[21:03] <micahg-work> ochosi, I don't like the idea of disabling ibus by default, how does that affect xubuntu in other languages
[21:03] <brainwash> how does one even disable the ibus autostart?
[21:04] <micahg-work> also, maybe there's someone who can help us with this that's more familiar with this
[21:04] <ochosi> from what i gather, ibus is needed when you have >1 input language/keyboard-layout
[21:04] <ochosi> so it doesnt affect xubuntu on other languages per se
[21:06] <ochosi> but i'm +1 on getting folks in that know more about this
[21:06] <ochosi> btw, ubuntu doesnt use ibus anymore
[21:06] <ochosi> they switched to indicator-keyboard
[21:06] <ochosi> (which we could still do)
[21:06] <elfy> micahg-work: also - we never had it in the panel previously, so why would it be an issue for anyone that it wasn't previously
[21:06] <elfy> at the moment it IS an issue when keyboard layout is fubar once you've logged in
[21:07]  * elfy just looks at this logically rather than from a packaging pov
[21:07] <ochosi> yup, i also agree with that logic
[21:07] <brainwash> maybe it was there, but the tray icon was hidden
[21:07] <ochosi> that's not impossible
[21:07] <elfy> brainwash: maybe so - but unhiding it has caused an issue :)
[21:08] <micahg-work> elfy, right, I just know it was seeded before, not sure how it was working in previous ISOs
[21:08] <ochosi> micahg-work: i think part of the problem might be that unity doesnt use it anymore, i.e. less maintenance/care about the package...
[21:08] <brainwash> ibus isn't even working for my main user account, it shows 1x de and 4x en_US
[21:09] <ochosi> one could ask around on #ubuntu-devel tomorrow about how it worked in unity and how indicator-keyboard works now
[21:10] <elfy> I'd ask but would get lost in the explanations probably lol
[21:12] <micahg-work> ochosi, that could be
[21:13] <ochosi> micahg-work: if you want i can ask, but the outcome might be that we might want to do s/ibus/indicator-keyboard/
[21:13] <ochosi> micahg-work: and i don't wanna be the one who is stuck with that change and then there's no uploader... (i guess you see where i'm going with this ;))
[21:14] <brainwash> ibus is still present on the daily ubuntu iso
[21:16] <elfy> ochosi: guy on the forum has added logs to the greeter bug he says
[21:18] <micahg-work> ochosi, if that's what we need to do, let's decide, it's getting late to make major changes, but I don'
[21:18] <micahg-work> t want to be supporting a broken package for 3 years
[21:19] <micahg-work> ibus is seeded across the board as well
[21:20] <knome> micahg-work, testing didn't really turn up as well as it could have, downgrading didn't work as expected so couldn't really do much more than confirm the bug...
[21:21] <ochosi> micahg-work: ok, i'll ask seb128 about it tomorrow, i think he'll know (and if not, he can at least point me somewhere)
[21:22] <elfy> we should put a cap on how long we try and sort this I guess - ie not too long
[21:22] <elfy> said the man ulikely to be able to help sort it ...
[21:22] <ochosi> +1
[21:22] <ochosi> i also want to know why unity doesnt use it anymore
[21:22] <ochosi> seeding it is one thing, activating it by default is another
[21:22] <micahg-work> it's still seeded on the Ubuntu ISO
[21:23] <ochosi> we can also seed it but don't let it autostart
[21:23] <micahg-work> is that what they do?
[21:23] <elfy> micahg-work: when I was looking at this it affected us, studio obviously and lubuntu
[21:23] <micahg-work> http://paste.ubuntu.com/7148322/
[21:24] <elfy> I didn;t check all of those other ones
[21:24] <ochosi> micahg-work: well they certainly don't use the ibus trayicon anymore because i fixed a bug for them in their icon-theme today and they wanted to drop the icon for ibus(!)
[21:25] <ochosi> (i actually saved them from doing so)
[21:25] <knome> i don't mind about not autostarting ibus.
[21:25] <knome> to be exact, i don't mind about not seeding it
[21:25] <knome> however, it would need to be evaluated if there are some downsides to either
[21:25] <ochosi> agreed
[21:25] <elfy> I suppose what we want - is to be back where we were before it landed in the panle
[21:25] <ochosi> and for that, we ideally ask "someone who knows" :)
[21:25] <elfy> surely?
[21:25] <micahg-work> well, everyone else is using it, so unless there's a major reason not to, I'd not like to be different in this case
[21:26] <brainwash> ochosi: maybe they just integrated ibus into indicator-keyboard
[21:26] <micahg-work> as it's in main, we're not directly on the hook for its maintenance either
[21:27] <knome> micahg-work, agreed.
[21:27] <knome> micahg-work, you happen to know any reason why we should keep https://launchpad.net/xubuntu-desktop/ ?
[21:28] <micahg-work> well, I think it was used before to track tasks related to the project per Ubuntu release
[21:29] <micahg-work> I think we're using blueprints for that now
[21:29] <knome> the last release that it had was natty
[21:29] <knome> i went and cleaned those up the other day
[21:29] <knome> i think that page is just confusing for a user if they happen to land on it
[21:30] <knome> and if it has no technical or social meaning for the developers either, we should remove it
[21:32] <elfy> micahg-work: so how soon do we need to actually make a decision on ibus by?
[21:33] <micahg-work> definitely before apr 10, the sooner the better
[21:33] <knome> ochosi, micahg-work: can you elaborate
[21:34] <knome> what's left to do in https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/xubuntu-t-features ?
[21:34] <knome> or is the last thing left to do to mark the rest DONE ?
[21:34] <elfy> micahg-work: so assuming we have weekly meetings - by next weeks? 3rd?
[21:34] <knome> elfy, that sounds fair
[21:35] <knome> "just dropping it from the seed/autorun" is pretty simple
[21:35] <ochosi> knome: what should i elaborate?
[21:35] <knome> ochosi, see the next comment
[21:35] <micahg-work> I have no idea about the gtk2 indicators, I'd have to look
[21:36] <knome> in that case, ochosi, can you elaborate on *that* with micah :)
[21:36] <knome> as you probably understand, i'd like to get all of that blueprint done ASAP
[21:36] <elfy> knome: ok - I've made a note to make sure to add it agenda if it's not decided by then
[21:36] <knome> elfy, ok, thanks
[21:36] <ochosi> micahg-work: we have to make sure that they get removed for upgraders
[21:36] <ochosi> micahg-work: otherwise the gtk3 indicators don't work
[21:37] <ochosi> because they conflict
[21:37] <brainwash> really?
[21:37] <ochosi> (at least they did before upstart)
[21:37] <knome> elfy, i've added that to the team calendar
[21:37] <elfy> ok - even better
[21:38] <micahg-work> ochosi, ok, can you file add notes about what specifically conflicts somewhere and make sure I'm subscribed (was thinking a bug against xubuntu-meta)
[21:38] <micahg-work> maybe just the whiteboard would be enough
[21:39] <ochosi> micahg-work: ok, however you prefer. i mostly noted it on the whiteboard in the first place in order not to forget it
[21:39] <ochosi> and that was weeks ago
[21:39] <brainwash> ochosi: I have them all installed (gtk2 and gtk3)
[21:40] <ochosi> brainwash: that must be the upstart transition then, it really didn't work before
[21:40] <brainwash> gtk2 due to ubuntu-studio I think
[21:40] <ochosi> micahg-work: in that ^ case, we can also skip it
[21:40] <micahg-work> ok
[21:40] <micahg-work> let me know
[21:40] <ochosi> and xscreensaver conflicting with light-locker is also not a problem anymore
[21:40] <ochosi> because light-locker comes first in xflock
[21:41] <knome> nice
[21:41] <ochosi> (although it sucks a bit to have all those useless things installed, but hey...)
[21:41] <knome> mmh
[21:41] <micahg-work> yeah, those shouldn't conflict
[21:41] <ochosi> (the price for LTS->LTS upgrading)
[21:41] <micahg-work> it would be nice if xflock can be taught with a setting which to use
[21:41] <brainwash> what about the double power indicator problem (upgraders)?
[21:42] <ochosi> micahg-work: yeah, xflock could really use an improvement (many patches in bugzilla), somehow nobody wants to touch it...
[21:42] <knome> maybe for .1
[21:42] <ochosi> brainwash: not sure what to do about that
[21:42] <knome> ochosi, describe it to micah who might
[21:43] <brainwash> ochosi: a faq entry to explain it?
[21:43] <knome> (be sure)
[21:43] <ochosi> brainwash: we can't mess with user's config, and we can't conditionally *not* install  indicator-power
[21:43] <ochosi> knome: ^
[21:43] <knome> FAQ item seems the last effort
[21:43] <ochosi> yeah, we can do that
[21:43] <knome> hmm,
[21:43] <ochosi> it's also not a given problem
[21:43] <knome> aren't there some packages which as if you want to keep the current config or replace it with the newest?
[21:44] <micahg-work> what's causing the old indicator
[21:44] <micahg-work> errr.ico
[21:44] <micahg-work> icon
[21:44] <ochosi> micahg-work: trayicon from xfce4-powermanager
[21:44] <ochosi> i disabled it in xubuntu-default-settings to resolve that for new installs
[21:44] <ochosi> but we cant do much about existing configs
[21:44] <micahg-work> the new indicator uses the power-manager?
[21:44] <ochosi> yes
[21:44] <ochosi> i patched it
[21:44] <knome> \o/
[21:44] <ochosi> the "new indicator" is indicator-power
[21:45] <ochosi> so we don't (have to) maintain it
[21:45] <ochosi> we can just use it like indicator-sound
[21:45] <micahg-work> I supposed we still want users to have a trayicon for xfce4-powermanager even if they don't have indicator-power
[21:49] <knome> brainwash, was bug 1271871 fixed by you or jackson?
[21:49] <knome> brainwash, same for bug 1284923
[21:50] <brainwash> it was fixed by the upstream people
[21:50] <knome> aha
[21:50] <knome> and jackson did the packaging work?
[21:50] <brainwash> I guess so
[21:50] <knome> ta.
[21:51] <ochosi> micahg-work: why wouldn't they have indicator-power?
[21:51] <brainwash> he just did not add the bug reports numbers to the changelog
[21:51] <knome> brainwash, ok, thanks
[21:51] <micahg-work> if someone chooses to remove it
[21:52] <brainwash> micahg-work: the problem is, that some upgraders might see both icons after upgrading to 14.04
[21:52] <micahg-work> studio and mythbuntu don't have indicator-power
[21:52] <micahg-work> brainwash, right, one of the options is to remove the trayicon, but I don't see it as viable
[21:53] <brainwash> we hide the power-manager via global config file provided by xubuntu-default-settings
[21:53] <ochosi> micahg-work: yeah, it's still there, it's just hidden (the trayicon)
[21:55] <knome> slickymaster, the .pot file seems to be okay...
[21:56] <knome> slickymaster, i wonder if the launchpad automatic translation stuff will notice that change at some point
[21:56] <knome> slickymaster, for the .po files, i guess you just need to update the catalog manually
[21:56] <knome> slickymaster, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubiquity-slideshow/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/html/view/head:/po/xubuntu/slideshow-xubuntu.pot
[22:00] <micahg-work> there should be a script to do that I would think
[22:01] <knome> yeah, i'm not worrying about it since everything looks okay in the branch
[22:01] <knome> slickymaster has just been asking about it and why old stuff appear
[22:01] <knome> and sure, would be nice to get that stuff updated to be able to run the call for translators
[22:36] <ochosi> arrr, and there i just missed elfy...
[22:38] <knome> :)
[22:40] <ochosi> anyway, commented on another t-bug that should be wontfix imo
[22:40] <knome> #?
[22:40] <ochosi> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfwm4/+bug/1271883
[22:40] <ochosi> commented upstream though
[22:40] <ochosi> as that's where it's really tracked
[22:43] <brainwash> ochosi: 100 is max for workspaces
[22:43] <ochosi> yeah, but that's still a lot
[22:44] <ochosi> doesn't really change my point
[22:44] <brainwash> but what is the drawback of enabling it?
[22:44] <ochosi> i explained that in my comment
[22:44] <ochosi> potentially lots of cpu usage, what's the benefit of enabling it?
[22:45] <brainwash> try it
[22:45] <brainwash> worked flawless for me
[22:45] <ochosi> what's the benefit of enabling it?
[22:46] <brainwash> a happy elfy
[22:46] <ochosi> HUHU
[22:46] <ochosi> sorry, uppercase wasn't intended
[22:47] <brainwash> it works, so I've attached the diff
[22:47] <brainwash> and upstream won't answer anytime soon
[22:47] <ochosi> probably not
[22:47] <ochosi> but gtkspinbuttons are editable by default
[22:48] <ochosi> so this was a conscious decision
[22:48] <brainwash> I know, it has been like this for years
[22:48] <brainwash> so it's not a regression or so
[22:48] <ochosi> that's not a reason for changing anything though
[22:49] <knome> if i could assign any (non-existing) bug importance field for that bug, it would be... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rX7wtNOkuHo
[22:49] <brainwash> no, but it works if editable
[22:50] <ochosi> probably not always. anyway, i'm tired of arguing about that dialog's spinbutton. i added my argument and upstream most likely won't change this
[22:50] <ochosi> or if they do, they hopefully have a good reason to do so
[22:50] <brainwash> why didn't you just ignore the report? :)
[22:51] <ochosi> (with that i mean, a better reason than just "make elfy happy" – no offense, elfy)
[22:51] <ochosi> it's part of xubuntu-t-bugs
[22:51] <ochosi> i went through that list right now
[22:51] <brainwash> it shouldn't be
[22:51] <ochosi> yup, i wholeheartedly agree
[22:51] <brainwash> all this minor stuff should be removed
[22:51] <ochosi> it's not even a bug
[22:51] <ochosi> i'll set it to wishlist if i can and remove it from the bp
[22:52] <brainwash> or bug 1271861
[22:52] <brainwash> easy fixable, but meh
[22:52] <brainwash> what is right and what is wrong
[22:53] <ochosi> yup
[22:53] <ochosi> knome: mind to set this to wishlist? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfwm4/+bug/1271883
[22:54] <brainwash> ochosi: new comment https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10605
[22:55] <ochosi> yup, i saw, have you tried it?
[22:55] <brainwash> once
[22:55] <brainwash> no change
[22:56] <brainwash> my session start is damn slow
[22:56] <brainwash> the first on after boot
[22:56] <brainwash> one
[22:57] <brainwash> slow session start -> race condition
[22:59] <ochosi> i'm seeing it after i had a bug with suspend
[22:59] <ochosi> so apport comes up at session start and that is seemingly enough
[22:59] <brainwash> apport pops up every time?
[23:00] <ochosi> yup
[23:00] <ochosi> fun, eh?
[23:00] <brainwash> report the bug then :D
[23:00] <ochosi> yeah, appart never finishes collecting the data
[23:00] <ochosi> so eh
[23:01] <ochosi> brb, testing that suggestion from the bugreport now
[23:01] <brainwash> ok
[23:02] <ochosi> yup, also doesnt work for me
[23:02] <ochosi> huhu, now apport finished with one of the bugs
[23:03] <ochosi> and tada! it was a bug in apport
[23:04] <brainwash> eric likes the new way of handling style changes... but we want to release something that works 100%
[23:05] <ochosi> i'd really like to get to the bottom of thise
[23:05] <ochosi> it's not very nice to just revert to *some* solution
[23:09] <ochosi> brainwash: can you confirm https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfdesktop4/+bug/1295614 ?
[23:09] <ochosi> cause i can't
[23:11] <fibz_> i have a fresh install i can let sit for a while and see what happens
[23:11] <brainwash> oh, forgot to monitor the mem usage
[23:12] <ochosi> i did that
[23:12] <ochosi> i set the change to 2secs and waited a while
[23:12] <ochosi> actually the first time i read it, i entirely overread how he changes the bg
[23:12] <ochosi> with "variety"
[23:13] <ochosi> obviously not knowing that there is a builtin wallpaper-changer
[23:13] <ochosi> or somehow not being happy about that one
[23:15] <brainwash> but still, it's xfdesktop changing the wallpaper in the end
[23:26] <knome> http://xubuntu.org/getxubuntu/requirements/
[23:26] <knome> surprise!
[23:52] <fibz_> if not already, that should be a trigger for the bot


[01:20] <psusi> hallelujah, holy shit! I finally got it figured out and working... my god what a complex package, but I think I really understand what is going on now... it builds half a dozen packages with various interdependencies and two different sets of abi versions... damn!  it's milla time!
[02:07] <paissad> is there policy for creating Unity quicklinks ?
[02:08] <paissad> for the .deb packaging
[02:21] <psusi> there's no way to make a package a dependency only if a third package is also installed is there?
[07:00] <tumbleweed> paissad: #ayatana or #ubuntu-desktop
[08:29] <paissad> tumbleweed, ok
[14:04] <pcpratts> hi! I am trying to save off config files for an upgrade
[14:05] <pcpratts> in postrm upgrade I copy the config files to a temp folder
[14:05] <pcpratts> and in postint configure I am trying to overwrite the files from the newly installed .deb package
[14:06] <pcpratts> but .dkpg-temp files are being created
[14:06] <pcpratts> and those are finally used by the installer in some way
[14:18] <Ampelbein> pcpratts: What do you want to do? dpkg by default prompts the user to overwrite/keep/examine changed configfiles.
[14:27] <pcpratts> well, my conf files are not marked it seems
[14:27] <pcpratts> Ampelbein: do you know how to tell dpkg what my config files are?
[14:28] <Ampelbein> pcpratts: see http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ap-pkg-conffiles.html
[14:29] <pcpratts> okay, thanks!
[16:52] <lfaraone> I'm attempting to mirror the Ubuntu archive with ubumirror; is there a way to exclude certain releases from the mirroring?
[16:53] <tumbleweed> never used ubumirror...
[16:53] <lfaraone> (as in, I tried to exclude maverick, natty, and precise; it didn't work and I ran out of disk space <_<;
[16:54] <lfaraone> tumbleweed: well, I need to do a two-stage sync, right?
[16:54] <lfaraone> jpds: ping ^^
[16:54] <tumbleweed> lfaraone: right, that looks like an ftpsync type thing
[16:54] <tumbleweed> you can't exclude releases, because it doesn't parse the Packages files
[16:55] <lfaraone> tumbleweed: should I use apt-mirror in the interim until I get a less sucky disk?
[16:55] <tumbleweed> yeah, or debmirror
[18:57] <Ampelbein> hyperair: Hi! Regarding bugs like 885505, it might be useful to include a short message with the status change to "Fix Released". Like "Fixed in the latest ubuntu version 0.21-1". That way, people know what happened.
[19:05] <hyperair> right, good idea.
[19:05] <hyperair> Ampelbein: thanks. i actually meant to close the bug in debian/changelog, but failed miserably when i missed out the #
[19:06] <Ampelbein> I thought so. I was a bit confused by the status change myself but checked the upload log to find out.
[19:06] <hyperair> heh
[19:07] <hyperair> sorry, i get a bit slipshod when changing a large number of bugs to fix released
[19:07] <Ampelbein> No worries ;-)
[19:07] <hyperair> i should probably make better use of the email interface for those
[21:48] <tumbleweed> ScottK, Laney, broder: do people use prevu? (Why is it still in the archive?) (re<EMAIL_ADDRESS>)
[21:48] <broder> i've never heard of people using it
[21:49]  * tumbleweed is following up to that thread
[21:51] <broder> but i know its intent was to be easier to use/setup than sbuild/pbuilder. i don't know if it actually is
[21:52] <broder> or if that's still relevant in the era of ppas
[21:59]  * ajmitch thought it was just a wrapper around pbuilder
[21:59] <ajmitch> but I haven't really used it
[21:59] <tumbleweed> question is, is it a useful one. I see very few uploads and few bug reports
[22:00] <tumbleweed> yeah, the code is tiny
[22:00] <ajmitch> it did what backportpackage is meant for
[22:02] <broder> i tihnk it can be replaced by backportpackage + pbuilder-dist with little documentation and not a whole lot of difficulty
[23:01] <ScottL> i have a bzr branch (ubuntustudio-default-settings) that i want to completely replace with another bzr branch (xubuntu-default-settings with modifications i will make)
[23:02] <ScottL> is the command i use to remove my current branch from bzr:  'bzr remove-tree'
[23:02] <ScottL> ?
[23:02] <tumbleweed> no remove-tree removes your working directory
[23:03] <tumbleweed> just rm -r
[23:03] <tumbleweed> (if I'm understanding your question correctly)
[23:03] <ScottL> tumbleweed, i'm not sure i am asking clearly
[23:04] <tumbleweed> you have a local branch that you don't want any more?
[23:04] <EvilResistance> ScottL:  you basically want to purge your ubuntusudio-default-settings branch, and have xubuntu-default-settings take its place?
[23:04] <EvilResistance> remotely/
[23:04] <EvilResistance> *
[23:04] <ScottL> EvilResistance, aye
[23:04] <EvilResistance> tumbleweed:  read my interp.
[23:04] <ScottL> sorry, was helping wife with cooking dinner
[23:04] <EvilResistance> ScottL:  remotely, or locally?
[23:04] <EvilResistance> (remotely such as on LP)
[23:04] <EvilResistance> (and locally meaning at your machine)
[23:06] <ScottL> sorry, helping with dinner again
[23:06] <ScottL> okay
[23:06] <ScottL> the bzr branch is hosted in launchpad
[23:06] <ScottL> i was checking out a version that i wanted to replace
[23:06] <ScottL> so it would be locally
[23:06] <ScottL> and then i would push back to lp
[23:07] <ScottL> EvilResistance, ^^^
[23:07] <tumbleweed> if you are replacing it remotely, it really doesn't matter what you are doing locally
[23:07] <tumbleweed> you can push anything over anything else with push --overwrite
[23:07] <tumbleweed> (use with care, of course)
[23:10] <ScottL> tumbleweed, so i could not even use 'bzr branch' for the ubuntustudio-default-settings package?
[23:11] <tumbleweed> yes
[23:11] <ScottL> just 'apt-get source xubuntu-default-settings' ?
[23:11] <ScottL> bzr add
[23:11] <ScottL> commit and then push
[23:11] <ScottL> ?
[23:11] <ScottL> push meaning pushing to ubuntustudio-default-settings with --overwrite
[23:11] <tumbleweed> assuming you want to remove the entire history for the branch
[23:12] <ScottL> oh, not sure i want to do that actually
[23:12] <ScottL> i would feel more comfortable if i had something to fall back to
[23:12] <tumbleweed> so by "completly replace" you just mean "commit a new revision"?
[23:13]  * tumbleweed thinks he understands the question now
[23:13] <tumbleweed> branch the existing branch, delete every file in it (but leave .bzr), add the stuff you want to replace it with, bzr add, commit
[23:14] <ScottL> yes, i would like to "commit a new revision" which would not include any of the old code, yes
[23:14] <ScottL> can i use 'bzr add' to add everything?
[23:14] <ScottL> or does it require a qualifier?
[23:15] <tumbleweed> no qualifier required
[23:15] <ScottL> very cool, thanks tumbleweed
[23:16] <ScottL> it was more or less like i thought it would be, but it makes me feel very, very much more comfortable to have it confirmed :)
[23:16] <tumbleweed> np
[23:17] <ScottL> although i thought that i would need to 'bzr remove' at least _something_ :?
[23:18] <tumbleweed> bzr assumes that files you've deleted should be deleted
[23:28] <ScottL> even better, wasn't sure about that
[23:28] <ScottL> thanks again tumbleweed and EvilResistance
[23:33] <psusi> what's the environment variable you set to get debian/rules to use make -j?
[23:33] <tumbleweed> DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS. But the debian/rules needs to support it
[23:34] <tumbleweed> (dh has a --parallel option)
[23:34] <psusi> what do you set it to?
[23:35] <psusi> just DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=-j4 debian/rules binary?
[23:35] <tumbleweed> no
[23:35] <tumbleweed> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-source.html
[23:36] <psusi> ahh
[23:36] <psusi> pfft... silly kernel rules file told me to make mrproper before building... which then deleted the debian directory


[11:41] <BluesKaj> Hi folks
[14:42] <user|16> What is system requirements of kubuntu?
[14:49] <genii> I guess they couldn't wait around to find out
[14:50] <kirvesAxe> Too impatient, like so many others nowadays on IRC helpdesk channels...
[14:52] <BluesKaj> instant gratification generation :-)
[15:15] <mybalzitch> maybe they found the requirements online
[16:37] <Abraham> Hi


[02:05] <ibeardslee> afternoon
[22:04] <kcj> Morning.
[23:38] <ibeardslee> morning
[23:55] <ajmitch> morning


[09:52] <geekosopher> should I be fixing bug 678098 in natty, or maverick as well?
[09:52] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 678098 in kubuntu-docs (Ubuntu) "Typos that make the doc look unprofessional (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/678098


[05:54] <orpheus> does anybody know what might be running only on first boot that might overwrite the xorg.conf?


[06:24] <jono> anyone know anything about networking?
[06:25] <nigelb> depends on the definition of 'anything'
[06:56] <dholbach> good morning!
[07:09] <jono> heya dholbach
[07:09] <dholbach> hey jono
[07:10] <dholbach> I just set up an xwax daily builds - it's awesome
[07:10] <dholbach> I need to blog about this
[07:10] <dholbach> https://code.launchpad.net/~dholbach/+recipe/xwax-daily
[07:16] <jono> cool :-)
[07:16] <jono> dholbach, what is xwax though?
[07:18] <dholbach> jono, an app with which I can control the interface with which I can connect my turntables to my laptop :)
[07:18] <dholbach> http://www.xwax.co.uk/screenshot.png
[07:19] <jono> dholbach, ahhh sweet
[07:21] <czajkowski> Aloha
[07:22] <dholbach> hey czajkowski
[07:22] <dholbach> up early? :)
[07:30] <czajkowski> aye to do my xmas shopping
[07:30] <czajkowski> fun!
[07:38] <dholbach> enjoy! :)
[07:43] <jono> bed for me
[07:43] <jono> night all!
[08:52] <dholbach> jcastro, http://daniel.holba.ch/blog/?p=870 :-D
[09:15] <duanedesign> morning friends
[09:19] <duanedesign> how much do timedoded vinyls cost dholbach ?
[09:24] <dholbach> duanedesign, one is about 10€
[09:28] <duanedesign> ah, very reasonable
[09:28] <dholbach> yep
[11:19] <nisshh> oh man, we have a nice looking sunset tonight :)
[11:37] <duanedesign> sounds nice
[11:37] <duanedesign> we are still about 1 hour from sun up here
[11:39] <duanedesign> hmm. setting up testdrive didnt go so well
[14:02] <nigelb> Hello all
[14:56] <jcastro> JFo-vacation: omg hi!
[15:05] <dholbach> hey jcastro
[15:05] <jcastro> hi hi
[15:05] <jcastro> are you working today?
[15:05] <dholbach> yep, last day today
[15:05] <dholbach> Sunday: 24°C :-D
[15:06] <dholbach> jcastro, are you in holidays already
[15:06] <dholbach> ?
[15:06] <jcastro> not till monday
[15:06] <dholbach> ok
[15:06] <nhandler> dholbach: That is some hot weather
[15:06] <dholbach> I look forward to it :)
[15:07] <dholbach> jcastro, I got a daily build sorted out!
[15:07]  * dholbach is totally excited :)
[15:07] <nhandler> dholbach: Sunday we will be at a high of about -2.78C
[15:07]  * nhandler saw the blog post
[15:07] <dholbach> nhandler, here it's around 1°C around, so not too bad
[15:12] <jcastro> dholbach: I saw that
[15:12] <jcastro> spinning some wax?
[15:13] <dholbach> not at my parents' place, but as soon as I get back to Berlin I'll always be running latest xwax trunk :)
[15:13] <jcastro> heh
[15:18] <matti> :>
[15:21] <jcastro> dholbach: I am expanding my musical horizons
[15:21] <jcastro> I can't stop listening to this black eyed peas song
[15:21] <dholbach> jcastro, a new one or an older one?
[15:21] <jcastro> the new one
[15:21] <jcastro> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwQZQygg3Lk
[15:22] <nigelb> jcastro: hood one.
[15:23] <nigelb> err, good one
[15:23]  * dholbach will check it out in a bit :)
[15:23] <nigelb> tought I suspect the hood would fit in there too :p
[15:23] <jcastro> dholbach: make sure you crank it when he goes "dirty bit!"
[15:24] <dholbach> "This video is not available in your country."
[15:24] <dholbach> how is the song called?
[15:24] <jcastro> The Time
[15:24] <nigelb> jcastro: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAG39jKi0lI
[15:24] <nigelb> Epic video \o/
[15:25] <jcastro> nigelb: hahahahah
[15:25] <jcastro> awesome
[15:25] <nigelb> jcastro: watch the whole thing, lots of fun :p
[15:26]  * nhandler just got to the apple part
[15:27] <dholbach> jcastro, it's just my endless friendship to you that I didn't close the page before the "dirty bit"
[15:27] <jcastro> omg
[15:27] <jcastro> the xbox
[15:27] <jcastro> dholbach: I know I know
[15:28] <jcastro> dholbach: THEN IT GETS AWESOME
[15:28]  * nhandler should recreate that for a friend's birthday
[15:28] <nigelb> xbox totally rocked :p
[15:28] <nigelb> I was wondering how they'd show android
[15:28] <nigelb> then they came up with more awesomeseness :)
[15:30] <popey> haha, thats ace
[15:30]  * popey is looking forward to watching that on xmas day :)
[15:31] <nigelb> popey: Is it some sort of a preview that will show up on christmas day?
[15:31]  * nisshh is looking forward to relaxing in his backyard pool with a beer and steak on christmas day :)
[15:31] <popey> yes
[15:31] <popey> Do you know who the actors are?
[15:32] <nigelb> No, I don't
[15:32] <popey> The one on the left is Harry Enfield.
[15:32] <popey> The one on the right is Ronnie Corbet
[15:32] <nigelb> Don't really know any of British actors :(
[15:32] <nigelb> ooh, so that's why its' The One Ronnie'
[15:32] <popey> Ronnie Corbet used to partner with Robbie Barker (till he recently died) and they were known as "The Two Ronnies"
[15:32] <popey> ya
[15:32] <nigelb> Ah
[15:32] <popey> that sketch is a pastiche of a sketch they did which is quite famous (and funny)
[15:33] <popey> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cz2-ukrd2VQ
[15:33] <popey> that one from 1976
[15:33]  * nigelb waits for youtube to reload :|
[15:33] <popey> that's one of their best ever sketches
[15:34] <popey> in the uk if you say "four candles" people generally instantly know what you mean
[15:34] <popey> also "f u n e x" is a good sketch
[15:34] <nigelb> err, sketch?
[15:34] <popey> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkWMcRlE1mQ
[15:35] <popey> yeah, when comedians do a short thing like that we call it a sketch
[15:35] <nigelb> ah
[15:36] <nigelb> lol, finally four candles hit me :)
[15:36] <jcastro> http://stackexchange.com/sites?expand=true
[15:36] <jcastro> FEAR OUR STATS
[15:36] <jcastro> also, check out the questions per day
[15:36] <jcastro> it's a sign!
[15:37] <nigelb> jcastro: lol
[15:37] <nigelb> one day we'll beat SO :D
[16:22] <nigelb> LOL http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yX8yrOAjfKM
[16:23]  * nisshh has headphones on and is listening the the Lostprophets
[17:10] <dholbach> ok my friends - I call it a day!
[17:10] <dholbach> have some great holidays
[17:10] <dholbach> big big hugs from over here
[17:10] <dholbach> see you next week!
[17:10] <nigelb> dholbach: Merry Christmas and Happy New Year
[17:11] <dholbach> nigelb, and the same to you
[17:11] <nigelb> :)
[17:48] <nisshh> man it is hot here still, its almost 2am and im sweating :)
[17:48] <nigelb> Its 15 degrees here :/
[17:48] <nisshh> heh, its a lot hotter than that here :)
[17:49] <nisshh> nigelb, its going to be damn hot on christmas day :)
[17:49] <nigelb> oh lol, southrn hemisphere
[17:50] <nisshh> nigelb, oi! us southerners are cool! ok? :)
[17:51]  * nisshh check the weather for christmas day
[17:53] <nisshh> yep, itll max out at 34 C on christmas day :)
[17:53] <nisshh> not too hot, which is good
[17:55] <nigelb> o.O
[17:56] <nisshh> nigelb, do you consider 34 C to be stinking hot do you?
[17:56] <pleia2> it is :)
[17:58] <nisshh> pleia2, is not, its not that bad once you get used to it, i dont even use a/c in the house because im so used to it :)
[17:58] <nigelb> nisshh: I grew up around 36 C with 100% humidity
[17:58] <nigelb> nisshh: But that doesn't mean that it doesn't suck
[17:58] <nisshh> nigelb, damn, thats hot
[17:58] <nisshh> yeah
[17:58] <nisshh> we dont get humidity that high here
[17:59] <nisshh> sometimes it gets high, but never 100% i dont think
[18:42] <doctormo> hurray and wifi on the bus
[19:35] <JFo-vacation> hey jcastro!
[19:35] <JFo-vacation> sorry, was playing rip van winkle


[01:23] <kgunn> RAOF: good point...
[05:02] <RAOF> Mah, memcheck tests. Why take so long, do you?
 Because I have to virtualize every memory access as well as instructions :)
[05:50] <RAOF> And there we go. When you don't branch on uninitialised values, the memcheck tests pass. Astounding!
[05:51] <racarr__> Sure but if you dont branch on unitialized values then what fun is left in coding.
[05:51]  * duflu writes that down
[05:51] <racarr__> lol
[05:51] <duflu> I thought that if non-determinism works for the wider universe it must be the right way to code
[06:07] <alf_> duflu: it does if you can the select the resulting reality that you prefer ;)
[06:08] <duflu> alf_: Ah. So I'm running it on the wrong platform. Requires multiverse
[06:08] <alf_> lol
[06:13] <racarr__> Morning alf :)
[06:14] <alf_> racarr__: Good night :)
[06:15] <racarr__> aha any minute now...
[06:16] <racarr__> debugging a chromium crash while I wait for the daily show to appear...on...my legal video streaming site *nods*
[06:16] <racarr__> actually right now im just waiting for GDB to load symbols...
[06:16] <racarr__> THEN sleep
[06:19]  * RAOF should really file a bug about gdb SIGSEGVing everytime I try to dereference a shared_ptr<>
[06:22] <racarr__> I think our button events
[06:22] <racarr__> could be improved
[06:22] <racarr__> the thing is you get "current button state"
[06:22] <racarr__> plus is this an up or down event
[06:23] <racarr__> so everyone has to keep track of
[06:23] <racarr__> button states
[06:23] <racarr__> well in particular, what X and chromium want is "this button up/down" not "new button state"
[06:23] <racarr__> so the adapter layer has to keep track of button state
[06:23] <racarr__> and
[06:23] <racarr__> we only have a few buttons and
[06:24] <racarr__> its a disaster of a button event.
[06:43] <racarr__> lol that was un fair...but it does have room for improvement ;)
[07:13] <RAOF> racarr__: I think that all our events need to have some pretty drastic surgery done on them.
[07:14] <anpok> yes
[07:14] <RAOF> They manage to be simultaneously verbose and not expressive enough.
[07:15] <anpok> and not capturing everything needed
[07:15] <RAOF> Right (not expressive enough)
[07:15] <anpok> oh
[07:15] <anpok> meant expressive in terms of making clear what is going on -> hint: MirEvent.motion.action & FunkyMask
[07:17] <RAOF> Oh, that too.
[07:17] <RAOF> Hm. What happened to lp:mir/devel r1544.52.1?
[07:17] <RAOF> Specifically, why can't I list its history?
[08:02] <alf_> duflu: alan_g: @1317370, is this under valgrind?
[08:02] <alan_g> alf_: no
[08:05] <duflu> alan_g: Might be a better idea to leave more specific bugs open and fix them individually. The older one would take more effort to resolve entirely. Also 1317370 is only new in v0.2.0
[08:06] <alf_> duflu: on what hardward does it take 10 seconds?
[08:06] <alan_g> duflu: I wouldn't object to that provided there are adequate cross-references
[08:06] <duflu> alf_: Haswell i7 quad core desktop :)
[08:06] <duflu> up to 20 seconds
[08:07] <alf_> duflu: hmm, on my i5 laptop it takes 3-4 max
[08:07] <duflu> Weird. Lemme check if it's a side-effect of previous ones
[08:07] <alan_g> I've seen a lot of variation in the time for that one
[08:08] <duflu> That's a bit curious that variation
[08:11]  * alan_g is suspicious of "unit" tests that take more than milliseconds
[08:12] <duflu> alf_: Yes it happens in isolation too. Up to 25.5 sec
[08:13] <duflu> Only that test BufferQueueTest.compositor_never_owns_client_buffers
[08:13] <alf_> duflu: alan_g: actually, for me, the whole BufferQueue test suite takes 3-4 secs, BufferQueueTest.compositor_never_owns_client_buffers takes about 150ms...
[08:14] <duflu> alf_: Maybe you need more speed to make it race or something?
[08:15] <alf_> alan_g: can you reproduce the slow test runtime?
[08:15] <alf_> anpok: ^^ ?
[08:15] <anpok> 10 secs to 15 secs
[08:15] <duflu> alf_: It's not a big deal. If it's just me I'll look into it later
[08:15] <alf_> anpok: what hardware?
[08:16] <alf_> duflu: I am just curious about the difference...
[08:16] <duflu> Sounds like a race. But I'm exercising discipline and not looking into it myself
[08:16] <alf_> duflu: hmm, my test builds are not optimized I see, let me try with "Release"
[08:16] <anpok> i7 quad core .. 4750
[08:17] <duflu> i7-4770 does it too
[08:17] <anpok> the BufferQueueTest.stress test usually takes about 2.6 seconds
[08:18] <alf_> anpok: is 10-15 seconds the time for the whole BufferQueueTest.* run or just for BufferQueueTest.compositor_never_owns_client_buffers ?
[08:18] <alan_g> Running repeatedly I got:
[08:18] <alan_g> terminate called after throwing an instance of 'boost::exception_detail::clone_impl<boost::exception_detail::error_info_injector<std::logic_error> >'
[08:18] <alan_g>   what():  unexpected release: buffer was not given to compositor
[08:18] <anpok> just for the never_owns_client_buffers
[08:18] <anpok> but 15 secs is like the rare max .. and 10 is the avarage
[08:19] <alan_g> Suggests there's racy code
[08:19] <duflu> alan_g: Yeah, never look too hard. You'll always find more bugs
[08:19] <alan_g> Yep
[08:20] <duflu> and helgrind says?... surely something helpful
[08:20] <duflu> But I must look away for now
[08:23] <anpok> hm there were some intersting talks about haswells performance and compiler optimizations in going native 2013
[08:24] <anpok> release binary is wors
[08:24] <anpok> e
[08:24] <anpok> 30 seconds
[08:25] <anpok> and 38s ..
[08:25] <anpok> enough testing bbiab
[08:31]  * alan_g puts on list to look at later // gives other people the chance to look first and save me from it
[08:37] <duflu> alan_g: I'm working roughly in the same area. Notice this reference looks racy (potentially used unlocked):
[08:37] <duflu>     auto const& acquired_buffer = buffer_for(current_compositor_buffer, buffers);
[08:37] <duflu>     if (buffer_to_release)
[08:37] <duflu>         release(buffer_to_release, std::move(lock));
[08:37] <duflu>     return acquired_buffer;
[08:37] <duflu> That would result in the exception you saw, I think
[08:39] <alan_g> duflu: that is plausible (needs testing of course)
[08:52] <duflu> Hah. One of those days when the algorithm was right first time and it took me hours to understand the problem thereafter
[13:01] <anpok> alan_g|lunch: yup it worked.
[13:02] <alan_g> anpok: I like it when we can fix overcomplicated code. \o/
[13:02] <anpok> me too
[13:24] <anpok> hm if no test needs a stub header..
[13:24] <anpok> should it exist then
[13:24] <anpok> or is it a warning sign that we are lacking a test
[13:49] <alan_g> anpok: or both?
[13:50] <alan_g> anpok: re-reviewed. Just nits to fix AFAICS
[13:54] <kgunn> alf__: ok, i feel goofy...i'm doing something wrong, i flashed a fresh image, installed glmark2 debs (manually) from staging ppa, did 'stop unity8', made mir socket 777 and ran glmark2-es2-mir...but got "Couldn't connect to the Mir display server"
[13:56] <kgunn> just tried with sudo and got "Failed to create Mir surface!"
[13:57] <alf__> kgunn: let me try
[13:58] <alf__> kgunn: so devel-proposed?
[13:58] <kgunn> alf__: yep
[13:59] <alan_g> kgunn: Tried setting $MIR_SERVER to the endpoint? (No need for sudo for it to be the same then)
[14:00] <alan_g> Oh, and starting the Mir server. ;)
[14:08]  * alan_g is being nagged to reboot. BRB
[14:13] <kgunn> alf__: ah-ha...i think the screen was blanked
[14:14] <kgunn> working now
[14:14] <alf__> kgunn: :)
[14:15] <AlbertA> mterry: ping
[14:16] <mterry> AlbertA, hello
[14:16] <AlbertA> mterry: got a question for the split greeter
[14:16] <AlbertA> mterry: does it only require global alpha support? not per-pixel?
[14:17] <AlbertA> mterry: I would assume global only (i.e. surface->alpha())
[14:17] <mterry> AlbertA, I'm not sure I follow the question, but it has it's background be full alpha, then it has a sliding screen on top of that
[14:19] <AlbertA> mterry: ok so the other session shows through as the screen slides?
[14:19] <mterry> AlbertA, exactly
[14:20] <AlbertA> mterry: ok thanks!
[14:22] <AlbertA> mterry: so right now the surface it uses is fullscreen with transparent background?
[14:22] <mterry> AlbertA, yeah
[14:23] <AlbertA> mterry: ok... just trying to figure out how to fix the mir GLRenderer
[14:32] <alf__> alan_g: any more thoughts on main-loop-post-actions?
[14:32] <alan_g> alf__: not yet.
[14:32] <alf__> alan_g: ok
[14:33] <alan_g> I'll take another look before standup
[14:38] <alf__> alan_g: thanks
[14:40] <alan_g> dednick: does this have everything you need from it? https://code.launchpad.net/~alan-griffiths/mir/spike-passing-out-client-fds/+merge/218629
[14:59] <alan_g> alf__: done. Are you happy with passing-out-client-fds now?
[15:01] <anpok> alan_g: all addressed - apart from compositor::Scene
[15:01] <alf__> alan_g: yes, approved
[15:16] <dednick> alan_g: seems to. i'm just trying it out now with my branch; but i'm having some linking issues
[15:16] <dednick> terminate called after throwing an instance of 'boost::exception_detail::clone_impl<boost::exception_detail::error_info_injector<std::runtime_error> >'
[15:16] <dednick>   what():  /usr/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf/mir/platformgraphics/android/libmirplatformgraphics.so: undefined symbol: _ZN3mir8graphics9GLProgramD1Ev
[15:17] <alan_g> dednick: that *sounds* like a problem AlbertA fixed on devel yesterday.
[15:17] <alan_g> You ought to be able to "cherry pick"
[15:18] <alan_g> It's -r 1609 on devel
[15:23] <dednick> alan_g: ah. ok, i'll take a look
[15:32] <alan_g> dednick: if it helps I've just sync'd the branch with devel.
[15:33] <dednick> alan_g: got it working thanks
[15:36] <dednick> alan_g: could probably do with a rpc report for new_fds_for_trusted_clients
[15:37] <dednick> alan_g: as the one i asked for in the client is returning fd=0 which sounds a bit dubious.
[15:37] <alan_g> dednick: hmm
[15:37] <dednick> alan_g: it's probably my code
[16:13] <alan_g> dednick: sorry (got distracted)
[16:13] <alan_g> $ MIR_CLIENT_RPC_REPORT=log bin/mir_acceptance_tests --gtest_filter=TrustSessionHelper.gets_fds_for_trusted_clients
[16:13] <alan_g> ...
[16:13] <alan_g> [1399565480.978169] (DD) rpc: File descriptors received: 24 25 26
[16:13] <alan_g> ...
[16:13] <alan_g> Looks sane to me
[16:27] <dednick> alan_g: hm. ok. is it normal that they're always the same when i run an app?
[16:28] <dednick> no idea how it works
[16:28] <alan_g> well, typically fds are allocated in numerical order
[16:28] <alan_g> Within the process that is
[16:29] <alan_g> So if you your clients always have the same number of files open when you run you'll see the same number
[16:44] <dednick> alan_g: but if they're the same accoss clients, then how does another client connect to the fd?
[16:45] <alan_g> dednick: child processes inherit their environment from the parent. Including (with various provisos) FDs
[16:45] <dednick> alan_g: ah. ok
[16:49] <dednick> alan_g: when i call new_fds_for_trusted_clients, i get a SessionAuthorizer::connection_is_allowed for the mir server process.
[16:50] <alan_g> dednick: that's decribed in bug 1314574
[16:50] <dednick> ah. i thought it would be the process that created the socket.
[16:50] <alan_g> Which reminds me to update the status (as I've started on it)
[16:51] <alan_g> dednick: it is the process that created the socket
[16:52] <alan_g> The socket is created on the server and then migrated to the trust helper and inherited by the client
[16:52] <alan_g> Really simple if you don't think about it. ;^)
[16:52] <dednick> presumably i have to authorise the session though :)
[16:53] <dednick> s/session/connection
[16:54] <alan_g> yes. And (until I fix the bug) that pid will get propagated to the session too.
[16:59] <alan_g> dednick: I'm getting to EOD - is there anything more you need?
[17:00] <dednick> alan_g: think i'm good for now thanks
[17:05] <anpok> alf__: hm wrt WaitObject WatchDog ..
[17:06] <anpok> when I remove the WaitObject parts from WatchDog.. can I still call it WatchDog?
[17:06] <anpok> or is WatchDog IS A WaitObject the solution hmm
[17:07] <AlbertA> anpok: there are some cases where you can just use auto_unblock_thread instead of watchdog
[17:10] <AlbertA> anpok: RAOF said they were equivalent: https://code.launchpad.net/~albaguirre/mir/cleanup-switching-bundle-unit-tests/+merge/217534/comments/517495
[17:11] <AlbertA> anpok: so perhaps just change it to AutoUnblockThread and/or AutoJoinThread instead?
[17:14] <anpok> ack
[19:17] <dandrader> are there environment variables to enable debug logging on a mir client?
[23:43] <RAOF> anpok: I'm removing WatchDog from the 1Hz-rendering branch.


[12:01] <tseng> maybe i should update my desktop to breezy
[12:01] <tseng> oh
[12:01] <Nafallo> nothing much, chatting +webdev.
[12:01] <tseng> mythtv is broken
[12:01] <Nafallo> breezy rocks!
[12:01] <tseng> well
[12:01] <tseng> mythtv rocks more
[12:02] <Nafallo> 1-day bugs and stuff :-P
[12:05] <dooglus> how does a package get changed from a debian package to a ubuntu package of the same name?
[12:05] <Burgundavia> dooglus, most of the packages are simly rebuild automatically
[12:05] <Burgundavia> rebuilt even
[12:06] <Burgundavia> those that are -#ubuntu# have been changed by someone with ubuntu
[12:06] <dooglus> Burgundavia: for example, http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/pool/main/libc/libcurses-perl/libcurses-perl_1.12-1_i386.deb is a hundred kb of working binaries
[12:06] <Burgundavia> ok
[12:06] <dooglus> whereas http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/libc/libcurses-perl/libcurses-perl_1.12-1_i386.deb is 7 kb of nothing much
[12:07] <dooglus> wouldn't it be better to just copy the file?  less chance of messing it up that way
[12:07] <Burgundavia> ubuntu takes the debian source and rebuilds it in an Ubuntu environment
[12:07] <Burgundavia> as we have some different things, like python
[12:08] <dooglus> Burgundavia: if the rebuild process is automatic, is it visible?  I mean, can I take a look at it and see why it is failing?
[12:08] <Burgundavia> here is build logs for that deb
[12:08] <Burgundavia> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/libc/libcurses-perl/
[12:11] <dooglus> thanks
[12:19] <dooglus> Burgundavia: do you know what command that log is the output from?
[12:19] <dooglus> Burgundavia: I just tried to reproduce the problem, but it builds and packages fine locally
[12:20] <dooglus> (using "apt-get source -b libcurses-perl")
[12:21] <Burgundavia> no idea
[12:21] <dooglus> hmmm, ok.
[12:22] <dooglus> thanks for the log url anyway.
[12:50] <pepsi> hrm
[12:50] <pepsi> whats this channel for?
[12:51] <ajmitch> ubuntu, masters of the universe, we deal with all the packages in the universe component of ubuntu
[12:51] <tseng> what are topics for? :P
[12:52] <pepsi> the topic lacks a description of what the channel is
[12:52] <pepsi> masters of the universe isnt the most obvious :P
[01:11] <Unfrgiven> morning all
[01:12] <crimsun> it'd make more sense to place http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU ahead of http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Calendar :P
[01:16] <Mez> :P
[01:16] <Mez> change it yourslef you lazy bugger
[01:16] <Mez> o crimsun, I hear you'll be signing amaranth's key
[01:25] <tseng> that should cover it.
[01:27] <pepsi> thats a much better topic
[01:28] <Mez> lol
[01:29] <tseng> not that people actually read topics
[01:29] <doko> Please don't complain about anything for the next 8 weeks
[01:29] <tseng> doko: yep.
[01:30] <doko> tseng, by the way, may I complain about the mono2 bit?
[01:30] <Mez> thats better tseng
[01:30] <Mez> doko - yes, in #flood
[01:31] <tseng> doko:  i started it
[01:31] <doko> Mez: hmm, I think I like the pointer to the bug reporting system better ...
[01:31] <tseng> doko: it broke the 1.0 stuff in the process
[01:31] <doko> tseng: hmm, not nice
[01:31] <tseng> doko: so its not as easy as it initially looked
[01:31] <tseng> re splitting up 1.0 vs 2.0
[01:33] <doko> tseng: I'm doing Java in the meantime ...
[01:34] <Mez> o_O
[01:34] <Mez> hey seth
[01:36] <seth_k> ?
[04:13] <janm> hi
[04:15] <ivoks> hi
[04:17] <Mez> hey ivoks :D
[04:17] <Mez> still wiating for that apology :D
[04:17] <Mez> :P
[04:25] <ivoks> ?
[04:25] <ivoks> ah, sorry
[04:25] <ivoks> if that makes you smile ;)
[04:27] <Mez> lol
[04:27] <Mez> am just kidding around with ya :d
[04:27] <Mez> anyways L:D I did some wubbing to k3b and got it working for breezy
[04:27] <Mez> w00t
[06:43] <dooglus> Mez: you saw this, I take it?  https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11535
[06:47] <seth_k> it's 6AM for mez, he's been asleep less than 2 hours. he'll notice it eventually though
[06:47] <dooglus> sure.
[07:55] <\sh> morning
[08:07] <Unfrgiven> \sh: hey dude
[08:07] <\sh> Hey Unfrgiven
[08:08] <Unfrgiven> \sh: how goes it?
[08:08] <\sh> Unfrgiven: just came to my office and started to work :)
[08:09] <Unfrgiven> \sh: ah right... its a public holiday here today =)
[08:09] <Unfrgiven> \sh: whats the state of the transition? how much is done now? anything needing to be done ugrently?
[08:10] <\sh> Unfrgiven: i will give libflash during this day a shot and I saw some fixes from ivoks..
[08:45] <\sh> guys...if you want fun in the office: http://linux.blogweb.de/archives/31-Thx-Aseigo-Long-time-ago,-there-was-a-Balmer,-a-crazy-one,-too..html
[08:51] <DanielN> \sh: couldn't look it here at office.. fsucking proxy :/
[09:17] <ivoks> hi
[11:08] <xerox> Hi!
[11:08] <xerox> Do you know where could I get the lastest gaim=
[11:08] <xerox> '?'
[11:13] <xerox> I think I found it, but I can't find a way to add it to sources.list.  It's there: http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/g/gaim/
[11:18] <DanielN> c++ heroes here?
[11:22] <ivoks> xerox: ?
[11:24] <xerox> ivoks, which source I have to add to get that repository?
[11:25] <xerox> deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu hoary main ?
[11:25] <ivoks> deb http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu hoary-security main
[11:25] <xerox> I think I've messed up my sources.list.
[11:26] <xerox> What is "restricted" ?
[11:26] <ivoks> repository of non-free packages
[11:27] <xerox> ivoks, can you point me to an example _safe_ sources.list for hoary?
[11:28] <ivoks> ?
[11:28] <ivoks> safe sources.list would be those two lines you have 4-5 lines ago :)
[11:30] <xerox> :(
[11:31] <ivoks> problems?
[11:31] <xerox> apt doesn't let me install anything
[11:32] <ivoks> maybe you should ask in #ubuntu, not here
[11:33] <xerox> Thanks much for the help ivoks!
[11:37] <DanielN> xerox: try sudo and ten apt command
[11:39] <xerox> DanielN I know I should do it as root :)
[11:39] <xerox> But that seem a problem in the gaim package...
[11:39] <xerox> gaim: Depends: gaim-data (= 1:1.1.4-1ubuntu4.2) but 1:1.3.1-1ubuntu1 is to be installed
[11:39] <xerox> E: Broken packages
[11:39] <ivoks> you were using backports
[11:40] <xerox> nope
[11:40] <xerox> deb http://it.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu hoary main universe multiverse restricted
[11:40] <xerox> deb http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu hoary-security main universe multiverse restricted
[11:40] <ivoks> apt-get update?
[11:41] <xerox> ivoks, I've done it many many times in the last 2 minutes
[11:41] <ivoks> apt-cache show gaim-data | grep Version
[11:41] <xerox> Version: 1:1.3.1-1ubuntu1
[11:41] <xerox> Version: 1:1.1.4-1ubuntu4.2
[11:41] <xerox> Version: 1:1.1.4-1ubuntu4
[11:41] <xerox> Does that mean I have 3 gaim-data installed ? O_o
[11:42] <DanielN> yep
[11:42] <xerox> ugh.
[11:42] <ivoks> no
[11:42] <xerox> :)
[11:42] <ivoks> that means you have three sources for it
[11:42] <xerox> Better.
[11:42] <DanielN> not really
[11:42] <ivoks> sudo apt-get install gaim-data
[11:42] <DanielN> ;)
[11:42] <ivoks> you see..
[11:42] <xerox> gaim-data is already the newest version.
[11:42] <ivoks> that one 1:1.3.1-1ubuntu1 isn't from hoary
[11:42] <ivoks> you used backports
[11:42] <ivoks> period
[11:43] <xerox> $ apt-cache policy gaim-data | grep Installed
[11:43] <xerox>   Installed: 1:1.3.1-1ubuntu1
[11:43] <ivoks> you have to remove gaim-data, and then install it again
[11:43] <xerox> ??
[11:43] <xerox> But it0s here: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/g/gaim/
[11:43] <ivoks> you installed version that is NOT in ubuntu
[11:43] <ivoks> xerox: that's gaim for breezy
[11:43] <ivoks> not hoary
[11:43] <xerox> oh.
[11:44] <ivoks> remove it
[11:44] <xerox> I didn't use backports you see :( I'm not lying!
[11:44] <ivoks> yeah, you did something even worse :)
[11:44] <xerox> Removed.
[11:44] <xerox> Sorry :(
[11:45] <ivoks> now install gaim
[11:45] <xerox> apt-cache policy {gaim,gaim-data}  still show 1.3.1
[11:46] <ivoks> from where
[11:46] <xerox> I deleted the .debs and it installs 1.1.4
[11:46] <xerox> OK, now it works, but gaim is old :)
[11:47] <xerox> #ubuntu topic says "DO NOT USE BREEZY YET", so I suppose there is no way to get an update gaim.  Right?
[11:48] <ivoks> sure there is
[11:48] <ivoks> download source and compile it
[11:48] <xerox> Right.
[11:49] <xerox> ...but I would be irrespectful to your hard job in packaging ;)
[11:51] <ivoks> doko: openscenegraph and opencv should build fine now... :)
[11:54] <DanielN> \sh: wouldn't you say something to me?? :)
[12:02] <Mez> dooglus: er no i didnt notice, but - meh - it still doesnt work with that manul libdepnds changed, but - when it was build it auto lib-depends n tha
[01:14] <DanielN> has someone here a good document, to find out the main build errors with gcc4 ?
[01:14] <DanielN> or the main changes in building
[02:02] <\sh> back
[02:03] <\sh> DanielN: there is a document
[02:04] <\sh> DanielN: http://gcc.gnu.org/gcc-4.0/changes.html and http://gcc.gnu.org/gcc-3.4/changes.html#cplusplus
[02:23] <DanielN> \sh: yep, that hasn't aided (or however) me... :/
[02:28] <DanielN> error: explicit qualification in declaration
[02:28] <DanielN> that's stated (i googled already, without much helpful information)
[02:35] <\sh> DanielN: did u check the source line? paste the sourceline into jabber please :) or give me a build log
[02:37] <Riddell> what's the current recommendation on 0.6beta1 style version numbers?
[02:37] <DanielN> \sh:
[02:37] <DanielN> inline std::string SigCPerl::get_string(SV *val) throw()
[02:39] <\sh> remove the inline
[02:39] <\sh> (try it at least) ;)
[02:39] <DanielN> ;)
[02:40] <\sh> i had a similar issue with it
[02:40] <\sh> hot shot ... i don't know if this is it
[02:43] <DanielN> i hpe not, because there ar thousands of inline's :((
[02:52] <DanielN> \sh: err, but i can't remove inline.. i must replace ist with another function (which one? pah.. no idea :) )
[02:52] <\sh> DanielN: which source?
[02:54] <DanielN> hmm?
[02:54] <DanielN> source package?
[02:55] <DanielN> sigcperl (breezy of course)
[02:56] <\sh> DanielN: which file and line?
[02:57] <DanielN> argh
[02:57] <DanielN> sorry, i'm a bit scratched-off :)
[02:57] <DanielN> convert.h line 71
[02:58] <bddebian> Howdy
[02:58] <\sh> ah
[02:59] <\sh> inline std::string SigCPerl::get_string(SV *val) throw()
[02:59] <\sh> try this:
[02:59] <\sh> inline std::string get_string(SV *val) throw()
[02:59] <\sh> he was repeating the namespace identifieer
[03:00] <DanielN> ok
[03:00] <DanielN> i'll try
[03:05] <DanielN> \sh: no more errors about line 71!
[03:05] <DanielN> but several others
[03:06] <DanielN> :)
[03:09] <DanielN> WOOOHO :))
[03:09] <DanielN> it builds fine now, \sh thanks alot
[03:10] <DanielN> erm.. but i don't have too apply a patch now? simply provide the debdiff between old and new, right?
[03:10] <\sh> DanielN: u have to check...namespace ... { [...] } if the namespace is not closed, g++4 will raise errors for using namespace identifiers inside the function declaration
[03:28] <DanielN> \sh: ok, what about the above question (about the patch) ?
[03:44] <\sh> DanielN: no..
[03:46] <\sh> DanielN: do this: mkdir patchwork ; cd patchwork ; tar -xvzf sigcperl_0.2.0.orig.tar.gz ; mv sigcperl-0.2.0.orig sigcperl-0.2.0.orig.patched ; tar -xvzf sigcperl_0.2.0.orig.tar.gz
[03:46] <\sh> cd sigcperl-0.2.0.orig.patched
[03:46] <\sh> patch your source
[03:46] <\sh> cd ..
[03:46] <\sh> diff -ur sigcperl-0.2.0.orig sigcperl-0.2.0.orig.patched > 01_gcc4.patch
[03:46] <\sh> cd ..
[03:46] <\sh> cd sigcperl-0.2.0
[03:46] <\sh> cd debian
[03:47] <\sh> mkdir patches
[03:47] <\sh> cp ../../patchwork/01_gcc4.patch patches/
[03:47] <\sh> vi rules and add some patch targets
[03:47] <\sh> and also some unpatch targets :)
[03:48] <\sh> then u have a clean debianized source and apply the patches during buildtime
[03:49] <DanielN> yeah, thanks!
[03:49] <DanielN> Cxx trans is good for learning much i think
[03:54] <\sh> :)
[04:01] <\sh> ok..going home now
[04:44] <ivoks> DanielN: ping
[04:45] <DanielN> ivoks: pong
[04:46] <DanielN> all: if i use dpatch, it must be a build-depend, right?
[04:46] <ivoks> DanielN: is cppopt finished?
[04:46] <ivoks> i never used dpatch :)
[04:46] <DanielN> well, i think (for me it's ok)
[04:49] <ivoks> i'm pretty sure hdf5 is FTBS :)
[04:49] <ivoks> this is very dificult package...
[04:50] <ivoks> put a comment there: waiting for new debian release
[04:50] <ivoks> cause, debian will bring new release that will be buildable on amd64 with g++4
[04:52] <DanielN> ivoks: FTBS ?
[04:52] <ivoks> failed to build source
[04:52] <DanielN> ah
[04:52] <ivoks> i worked on that one
[04:52] <ivoks> very difficult
[04:52] <DanielN> argh
[04:53] <DanielN> i'll check it then
[04:53] <DanielN> and add a comment
[04:53] <ivoks> put comment - waiting for new debian release
[04:53] <DanielN> yep
[04:53] <ivoks> i talked with debian maintainer of that package
[04:53] <ivoks> he said he's working on new version
[04:53] <DanielN> ivoks: remember me tonight again, when i'm at home
[04:53] <DanielN> :)
[04:54] <ivoks> who knows will I be here
[05:04] <DanielN> ivoks: i'm sure you'll ;)
[05:04] <DanielN> so, time to go.. fscking patch has time until tomorrow :))
[05:04] <DanielN> see ya later on
[05:35] <bradb> hey uber hackers
[05:36] <bradb> malone usability question: what do you guys think about the current ordering of comments?
[05:38] <Amaranth> on a 26k connection, give me a minute to load it up
[05:39] <Amaranth> bradb: got an example of a bug with comments? :)
[05:39] <bradb> Amaranth: https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/bugs/889
[05:40] <Amaranth> you do know malone has horizontal scrollbars at 800x600, right?
[05:40] <Lathiat> it looks ugly anyway
[05:41] <Lathiat> soassumedly
[05:41] <Lathiat> theyll do something about that
[05:41] <Amaranth> hehe
[05:41] <ivoks> hi
[05:41] <Amaranth> get sgarrity to work on it for you :D
[05:42] <Amaranth> bradb: you've seen how the forums work, right?
[05:42] <Amaranth> you click the little reply button on a post to reply to it?
[05:42] <bradb> Amaranth: when, let's take this one step at a time here...
[05:42] <bradb> Amaranth: first, what do you guys think of the ordering of comments on the bug page?
[05:42] <Amaranth> i'm just talking about comments here
[05:43] <Amaranth> you have them ordered by date with the latest comment first?
[05:43] <bradb> Amaranth: yes
[05:43] <Amaranth> should be the other way around if you expect people to actually read them
[05:44] <bradb> i agree ;)
[05:44] <bradb> just wanted to make sure we're on the same page before i talk to sabdfl about it
[05:52] <bradb> Amaranth: yes, i'm aware of the horiz scrolling at 800x600. just like bugzilla, right?
[05:52] <Amaranth> let me check bugzilla
[05:53] <bradb> e.g. https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1291
[05:55] <Amaranth> i'll get back to you in a year when it finishes loading :)
[05:55] <bddebian> heh
[05:55] <Lathiat> haha
[05:55] <Amaranth> i think it stalled
[05:56] <bradb> Amaranth: 26k sounds like cruel and unusual punishment
[05:56] <Lathiat> cus you hit refresh and it only took a month?
[05:56] <Amaranth> so far though i only have a very small horiz scrollbar
[05:56] <Amaranth> bradb: it is
[05:56] <Amaranth> bradb: i'm stuck with this for a week
[05:57] <Amaranth> ok, the horizontal scrollbar with bugzilla is close to the size of the one in malone
[05:57] <Amaranth> but things aren't as squished as they are in malone :)
[05:58] <bradb> Amaranth: in your ideal world, how would the Malone bug page be improved to suit your taste?
[05:58] <Lathiat> with a dbi
[05:58] <Amaranth> bradb: I've been meaning to make a mockup of that.
[06:00] <bradb> Amaranth: a mockup? wow, that'd be some hardcore user feedback. ;) by all means. i'd love to see it.
[06:01] <Amaranth> bradb: basically it'd just look like bugzilla though :)
[06:02] <bradb> Amaranth: IOW, you don't think bugzilla's bug page can be improved?
[06:02] <Amaranth> i think it can be, but not much
[06:03] <bradb> ok
[06:05] <bradb> Amaranth: what about for people who aren't skilled hackers? would your grandma be able to use the bugzilla bug page, for example?
[06:05] <Amaranth> bradb: she couldn't use malone either :)
[06:05] <Amaranth> but that's not fair, she can't even use firefox
[06:06] <bradb> Amaranth: i agree that she couldn't use Malone either. i'd probably rather be paid by the hour to show her how to use the bugzilla bug page though. ;)
[06:07] <bradb> Amaranth: though, clearly, you like the bugzilla bug page, and a lot of skilled users like you do too. in Malone, i think we can do even better.
[06:07] <Amaranth> so basically we need something that lets hackers get things done quickly (like bugzilla now) but is still usable for users
[06:08] <bradb> that's the approach we're taking, yeah. i just landed a big patch (not yet rolled out into production), to hopefully reduce the mental burden on malone users trying to edit the status/priority/severity/etc. of a bug reported somewhere.
[06:12] <bradb> Amaranth: btw, if you want to send a mockup my way<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[06:13] <Amaranth> it'll probably be next week when i get back home
[06:13] <bradb> Amaranth: (or any other malone feedback, for that matter)
[06:39] <mitsuhiko> hi
[06:39] <bddebian> Hello mitsuhiko
[08:06] <ivoks> lol
[08:07] <ivoks> bender totally rocks!
[08:07] <ivoks> lol, i watch too much futurama :) it's bledner
[08:36] <DanielN> ivoks: i can seriously say that hdf5 builds (with warnings) .. but well, on x86
[08:44] <dooglus> Mez: I notice that k3b installs fine now in breezy.
[08:46] <ivoks> DanielN: yes, it builds on x86
[08:46] <ivoks> amd is real fun :)
[08:47] <DanielN> yeah that's wath i thought ;)
[08:51] <herve> hi there!
[08:51] <bddebian> Heya herve
[08:52] <DanielN> hello herve :)
[08:52] <herve> how's life in motuland?
[08:52] <DanielN> nais
[08:53] <herve> I take it for positive attitude ;-)
[08:53] <DanielN> :)
[08:53] <bddebian> nais?
[08:56] <herve> nothing...
[08:56] <herve> ?
[08:57] <DanielN> wooho :) my first self written patch works :))
[08:58] <herve> tell us what "nais" means first :-)
[08:58] <DanielN> nais == nice
[08:59] <bddebian> ahh
[09:00] <herve> I expected a "nice" acronym :-)
[09:00] <DanielN> mhm
[09:00] <DanielN> lett me think about that :)
[09:00] <DanielN> sounds like a nice task
[09:00] <bddebian> Not a .. ..
[09:01] <bddebian> Not An Issue Shithead
[09:01] <bddebian> nope
[09:01] <herve> not any incident so far?
[09:01] <bddebian> Nice
[09:01] <bddebian> DanielN: Congrats btw
[09:01] <herve> hmm... bad english, forget about it
[09:01] <bddebian> Not Any Issues So far
[09:01] <DanielN> to find one
[09:02] <DanielN> bddebian: cxx trans?
[09:02] <Amaranth> nice == Not an Interesting Conversation ..
[09:02] <Amaranth> can't think of a good E
[09:02] <DanielN> Amaranth: argh
[09:02] <DanielN> i thought about _recursive_ acronyms
[09:03] <Amaranth> argh == Assholes Rarely Generate Help
[09:03] <Amaranth> ;)
[09:03] <bddebian> Amaranth: :-)
[09:04] <DanielN> :)
[09:04] <DanielN> :))
[09:08] <DanielN> hm .. doesn't debdiff mark added directories in debian/ ? (i.e patches/)
[09:08] <DanielN> argh .. interdiff is the magical word :)
[09:25] <tseng> Nafallo: where you working with me on beagle/amd64?
[09:25] <tseng> were*
[09:26] <ivoks> hm... nokia, nokia, nokia
[09:27] <herve> ??
[09:27] <ivoks> i quote: "Open source software is an ideal basis for development since it enables Nokia to leverage and contribute to speedy software innovation and development."
[09:27] <ivoks> they are building new browser for series60
[09:27] <ivoks> based on KHTML
[09:27] <herve> no, webcore
[09:28] <ivoks> acctually, on apples webocre
[09:28] <ivoks> right :)
[09:28] <ivoks> and in the same time, they fight aggainst that same opensource in europe
[09:31] <DanielN>  there are smartphones from motorola around, running linux
[09:31] <DanielN> :)
[09:33] <DanielN> ah herve: as you asked for motu news: yeah, there are! when is signed off by 2 motu's, so you have just to change your entry in the wiki, and it's ready :)
[09:34] <herve> DanielN: remind me in 15 minutes
[09:35] <ivoks> i didn't sign anything :)
[09:35] <DanielN> you marked it as ok :)
[09:36] <DanielN> different meanings
[09:36] <DanielN> it think ;)
[09:37] <herve> tssssss
[09:37] <ivoks> you are too young to smoke
[09:37] <herve> :-)
[09:37] <\sh> re
[09:37] <\sh> i wanted to say that too :)
[09:37] <herve> people are either too young or too old to smoke
[09:37] <\sh> reviewing time first
[09:37] <\sh> or too dead to smoke ;)
[09:38] <ivoks> man, cigaretts really kill
[09:38] <herve> 50 million people a year, I heard
[09:38] <ivoks> i smoke one sometimes, but that's like 20 in 2 weeks :)
[09:39] <\sh> ;)
[09:39] <herve> ttt
[09:39] <ivoks> you know, there is bigger chance you will die of cigaret, than from cancer?
[09:39] <herve> hmm
[09:39] <\sh> I know there is a bigger change to die from a heart attack
[09:39] <ivoks> make that tumor, not cancer
[09:39] <herve> you don't catch a cancer by smoking?
[09:40] <ivoks> herve: you do, but not all cancers kill
[09:40] <ivoks> those from someking do, but others don't
[09:40] <\sh> but lungcancer yes
[09:41] <ivoks> even AIDS doesn't kill like that
[09:41] <ivoks> but those luckys really taste good :)
[09:42] <herve> no sorry, it just stinks
[09:42] <ivoks> :)
[09:42] <ivoks> ;...(
[09:43] <ivoks> i still can't upload
[09:43] <herve> I'll upload after my phone call
[09:43] <ivoks> btw, NM is great tool
[09:44] <ivoks> have to go now...
[09:44] <herve> NM?
[09:44] <ivoks> network manager
[09:44] <ivoks> i have one buggy version
[09:44] <ivoks> but does the job very good
[09:45] <ivoks> well... bye
[09:54] <DanielN> herve: time to remind you ^^
[09:54] <herve> still on the phone
[10:03] <\sh> grmpf..answered my work cell....have to go..laters dudes
[10:22] <herve> re
[10:22] <bddebian> wb her
[10:23] <bddebian> (*&&^%*&%%
[10:23] <DanielN> wb
[10:23] <bddebian> err wb herve
[10:23] <mitsuhiko> wb
[10:28] <mitsuhiko> hi
[10:28] <mitsuhiko> important question
[10:28] <mitsuhiko> maybe you know the linux day 2005 somewhere in Germany (no idea where...)
[10:28] <mitsuhiko> does ubuntu has something like a contact person where users can talk to?
[10:32] <herve> trulux, ping
[10:33] <mitsuhiko> nobody any ideas?
[10:34] <herve> ask on the devel list?
[10:34] <mitsuhiko> herve: i thought someone has any ideas
[10:34] <herve> or maybe there exists a better list
[10:34] <mitsuhiko> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/LinuxTag <== very empty
[10:35] <herve> check with the person who created/last modified the page
[10:37] <mitsuhiko> Boris Karnikowski from the Addison Wesley publishing house asked if there are any ubuntulinux members
[10:38] <DanielN> could someone tell me, what is to do if i applied a source-code patch to a transition lib ?
[10:38] <mitsuhiko> Because this publishing house has there a ubuntu book presentation
[10:39] <DanielN> mitushiko: why do you ask that just in MOTU
[10:39] <DanielN> ?
[10:39] <mitsuhiko> because I thought someone knows something about it
[10:40] <mitsuhiko> or because someone has compassion with me
[10:44] <TMM> hello
[10:44] <jbailey> TMM: =)
[10:44] <TMM> I salute you. ow MOFO's
[10:44] <mitsuhiko> good night boys
[10:44] <TMM> euih
[10:44] <mitsuhiko> cu
[10:44] <TMM> MOTU's :P
[10:44] <jbailey> Anyone around to show a potential MOTU the ropes?
[10:46] <TMM> I am interested in adding some form of bootsplash stuff to ubuntu, basically
[10:46] <TMM> for starters anyway :)
[10:46] <jbailey> TMM: sladen has been the lead on that.
[10:46] <tritium> TMM, have you looked into the usplash project that's being worked on by sladen?
[10:46] <bddebian> jbailey: You a potential MOTU??
[10:46] <TMM> ah, I've heard a lot about this sladen dude now, :)
[10:47] <TMM> didn't know about usplash
[10:47] <bddebian> Heya tritium
[10:47] <tritium> Hi there bddebian :)
[10:47] <jbailey> bddebian: I don't know if I'm considered a motu or not...
[10:47] <bddebian> :-)
[10:47] <bddebian> jbailey is just HMFIC
[10:48] <TMM> I'd like to join the ranks :)
[10:48] <jbailey> Her Majesties Finest Ice Cream?
[10:48] <TMM> or at least, do some good, with or without any form of a title, I just want some help for now ;)
[10:48] <bddebian> Head Mother Fscker In Charge
[10:48] <jbailey> *lol*
[10:48] <jbailey> Certainly that's not me.
[10:48] <bddebian> :-)
[10:48] <herve> DanielN, ping
[10:48] <TMM> YOU are the one fscking my disks? :)
[10:50] <TMM> hmm, that usplash sounds a lot like the idea I had
[10:50] <tritium> TMM, one of the documents I recommend starting from is the Debian New Maintainer's Guide.
[10:51] <TMM> tritium, universe != ubuntu sid repo's right?
[10:51] <tritium> TMM, the main wiki page, which contains many useful links is here: http://www.ubuntu.com/wiki/MOTU
[10:51] <DanielN> herve: pong
[10:51] <DanielN> :)
[10:51] <herve> DanielN, I can't access your archive so I can't review your package
[10:52] <TMM> euh... debian sid... *sigh*
[10:52] <tritium> TMM, right.  The best description of the various components is here, I believe: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/ubuntu/components/document_view
[10:53] <DanielN> http://marissa.ath.cx/daniel/archive/breezy/
[10:53] <DanielN> ??
[10:53] <DanielN> works for me
[10:53] <herve> DanielN, I hope so, it's your machine ;-)
[10:53] <herve> trulux, ping
[10:54] <trulux> herve: pong
[10:54] <trulux> herve: though I must go to bed
[10:54] <herve> quicly
[10:54] <trulux> herve: tell me
[10:54] <herve> I was talking about the libre software meeting in dijon with you?
[10:55] <DanielN> herve: so you couldn't access? or is it not reachable??
[10:55] <herve> DanielN, timeout
[10:55] <trulux> herve: yup
[10:56] <herve> trulux, bad news, I can't go there, I'm still broek
[10:56] <DanielN> hrmpf .. time to reboot the router :/
[10:56] <herve> broke
[10:56] <trulux> herve: I talked about meeting all of us (those who go there) together
[10:56] <tritium> TMM, is that a good start?  Do you have any more questions?
[10:57] <TMM> tritium, it looks like it, thanks
[10:57] <TMM> tritium, I was already reading, sorry for the delay :)
[10:58] <tritium> TMM, no problem.  :)
[10:58] <herve> DanielN, tomorrow now :-)
[10:59] <TMM> does anyone know if there is any actual code for the usplash stuff?
[10:59] <TMM> sladen? :)
[11:00] <herve> I hope he does know :-)
[11:00] <herve> night all
[11:00] <tritium> TMM, yes, there is a usplash page...let me find it
[11:01] <TMM> tritium, I'm on a wikipage, but it sounds like a lot of ideas, and very little implementation :)
[11:03] <sladen> TMM: yeah ;-)
[11:04] <TMM> well, I wanted to do some form of a framebuffer detect and setup utility anyway, might as well build it, whatever is going to be implemented, that is going to be required anyway
[11:04] <tritium> TMM, this is the only code I found:  http://www.paul.sladen.org/projects/usplash/download/.  Is that the latest for public consumption, sladen?
[11:04] <TMM> letting the user figure out weither to use vga= or some arcane video= command is pretty pointless
[11:05] <TMM> that, and that for instance, the intel cards can't do a linear framebuffer according to VESA 2.0 standards... so you need that specific driver for that
[11:05] <TMM> or be stuck in 16 colours
[11:06] <DanielN> herve: i've rebooted my router, check back please :)
[11:14] <TMM> tritium, looks good
[11:14] <tritium> TMM, cool
[11:16] <TMM> still, there's a need to configure the framebuffer correctly :)
[11:17] <TMM> I wish sladen was here :) but he's been idle for 13 minutes now, so I assume he just left
[11:19] <sladen> TMM: I'm always here, but they X hundred users who've just been down for an hoour whilst we upgrade their sat-modems are more immediate :-)
[11:20] <TMM> sladen, ahhhh yes, I can see that :)
[11:20] <TMM> sladen, I envision, pissed people ;)
[11:21] <TMM> sladen, I've got some thoughts on fading X too btw :)
[11:25] <DanielN> time to sleep
[11:25] <DanielN> see you all
[11:27] <ruhib> I use http://ubuntujava.yimports.com/
[11:38] <tritium> Good luck, TMM.  See you around...
[11:39] <TMM> tritium, thanks :)
[11:39] <tritium> :)
[11:56] <Nafallo> tseng: with bugreporting, yes :-).
[11:56] <tseng> Nafallo: hm right
[11:57] <tseng> Nafallo: do you still have that gtk-sharp exception
[11:58] <Nafallo> tseng: last time with blam today. pre-first_daily_update though.
[11:58] <tseng> um so
[11:58] <tseng> get the exception again please :)
[11:58] <tseng> and save it
[11:59] <Nafallo> tseng: hehe, I'll try :-). I haven't figured out what makes it pop :-P.


[16:16] <sabhain> anyone here using NAS w/ Raid?
[20:13] <tgm4883> My recordings are stored on my NAS with a hybrid raid
[20:38] <sabhain> is it feasible to move an mdadm Raid 0 array to a NAS box?


[13:01] <MrmappyINOF> Hello
[19:16] <arthurfiggis> hello :) i'm currently running 14.04, i enabled samba/file sharing in gnome 3 and was affected by this bug, which is still in the works upstream: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/samba/+bug/1257186 if i just remove libpam-smbpass, can i still use file sharing in gnome?
[21:21] <darkxst> arthurfiggis, yes, but your samba user passwords will be seperate from normal login passwords
[21:21] <arthurfiggis> darkxst: ahh...well that's a trivial issue compared to a memory leak, i'll just remove the package and maintain separate passwords for samba access :) thanks


[01:39] <karni> Good night #ubuntuone!
[07:20] <thechef> I set up Ubuntu One a few times on my computer now, but now I suddenly don't know anymore how it works. I go to Preferences -> Ubuntu One and there is no way to enter my credentials.
[07:20] <thechef> I have Ubuntu 10.04
[07:49] <thechef> I can't add my computer to my Ubuntu One account, because telling the computer locally to connect does nothing but grey out the button and the setup instruction don't match to the behaviour of the ubuntu one website nor the behaviour of my computer. There is no way to set it up.
[07:54] <thechef> maybe the procedure is buggy got deadlocked somewhere in the background and can't be reverted until the related processes/daemons are killed, mmh.. I will just reboot instead of following the cleanup instructions. I guess that's fine too.
[11:30] <duanedes1gn> thechef: hello
[11:32] <duanedes1gn> thechef: can you try running this command in a Terminal and let me know what it says:   u1sdtool -s
[11:34] <duanedes1gn> tntc: it looks like you are not on the broken server..AFAIK
[13:54] <jo-erlend> What do I need to do in order to replace Ubuntu One couchdb-sync with my own server?
[13:56] <jo-erlend> I'm writing some applications to make use of Ubuntu One, but I haven't been able to test it for many months now. So I need to fool Ubuntu One into using a working couchdb server so that I can test and demonstrate it.
[16:28] <kerouac__> i can't issue tokens ( https://one.ubuntu.com/developer/account_admin/issue_tokens/cloud/#get_httpsoneubuntucomoauthsso-finished-so-get-tokensemail-address ) have anybody succeeded with this and is willing to try to ghelp me?
[16:30] <kerouac__> my provided heade looks like this: {'Authorization': 'OAuth realm="", oauth_nonce="98561566", oauth_timestamp="1313729597", oauth_consumer_key="*secret*", oauth_signature_method="HMAC-SHA1", oauth_version="1.0", oauth_token="*secret*", oauth_signature="*secret*"'} anybody spot anything wrong?
[16:31] <kerouac__> ping fagan
[19:18] <duanedesign> kerouac__: if you come back on Monday their will be more developers around to help you with that.
[19:40] <kerouac__> duanedesign: thanks for the tip.
[20:54] <karni> duanedesign: pingses


[12:22] <Unit193> So it's been about a couple hours since ubottu last registered.  Yet hasn't pinged out?  ubot5 is dead too.
[13:15] <bazhang> its odd how the 'so filled with bugs' yields total silence when asked for any details whatsoever
[14:15] <k1l> !lag
[16:07] <bazhang> ubottu, lag
[18:15] <k1l> @mark #ubuntu Anastasius after offtopic/random stuff got kicked, then insults me in pm. rejoins and starts drama again. then more insults pm
 I think I'm going to make you my new personal project. :)
[18:32] <k1l> …
[20:29] <Myrtti> ah, that's why I remembered the nickname.
[20:29] <k1l> bantracker is full of him. several issues in -women
[20:30] <Myrtti> I just googled and got a log from this channel in 2011 August


[03:31] <kevin-Dell1100> Hi, I've been considering doing the laptop testing, but I'm not sure I can with the various technical items/terminology. I'm very new to Ubuntu and everything is a bit confusing at the moment. Does it even pay for me to submit a report for my old Dell Inspiron 1100 laptop?