[00:01] <rww> Juest: As you've been told in the past, constantly disconnecting and reconnecting from freenode makes it difficult for us to discuss your situation. Come back when you have a stable connection.
[00:02] <Juest> Now is stable. just lost wifi but quickly reconnected
[00:03] <Juest> yes, bazhang,  in #ubuntu....
[00:03] <bazhang> Juest, any idea why you were banned?
[00:03] <Juest> iusses with ikonia, rooted support, etc
[00:04] <Juest> i already said
[00:04] <bazhang> Juest, thats not quite correct
[00:04] <Juest> :(
[00:04] <Juest> why?
[00:04] <bazhang> issues with following the channel guidelines
[00:04] <bazhang> nothing to do with any particular individual
[00:05] <Juest> ah...
[00:06] <bazhang> Juest, seems you need to read the channel guidelines and code of conduct again.
[00:06] <bazhang> !guidelines | juest
[00:06] <bazhang> !coc | Juest
[00:06] <Juest> is there a channel for unsupported questions? like iusses with root
[00:06] <rww> no, that's what "unsupported" means
[00:06] <bazhang> ##linux
[00:07] <Juest> bazhang, the ban is from a time ago
[00:07] <bazhang> Juest, but you still are blaming others
[00:07] <bazhang> Juest, there is not a timeline for comprehending the channel guidelines
[00:08] <Juest> how's that?
[00:08] <rww> As an aside, Juest's bans were April 24th to April 30th, June 5th to June 12th, and June 12th until now.
[00:08] <Juest> the blaming
[00:08] <bazhang> Juest, if you dont understand them, and want to blame issues with others, then the ban will not be lifted
[00:09] <Juest> i do, just...
[00:09] <Juest> i am not a trouble-free guy
[00:09] <bazhang> Juest, yet the first thing you said was you had issues with someone, and not that it was your own not following channel guidelines
[00:10] <rww> Juest: The second time you were banned, you came in here and agreed to our guidelines, got unbanned, and then got banned the same day for breaking them again. Why would we want to unban you again?
[00:10] <Juest> seems my world is not compatible with everyone's world
[00:10] <bazhang> Juest, so come back when you can be trouble-free
[00:10] <Juest> i never will
[00:10] <rww> Okay. Have fun elsewhere, then.
[00:10] <Juest> ...be trouble-free
[00:10] <bazhang> Juest, then #ubuntu is not the place for you
[00:11] <popey> Juest: other support options are available like the forums and askubuntu
[00:11] <bazhang> !askubuntu
[00:11] <bazhang> whoever add that factoid, thank you
[00:11] <rww> deserved ^
[00:11] <bazhang> !-askubuntu
[00:11] <LjL> my bots <3
[00:11] <rww> LjL: have a cookie
[00:12] <LjL> nom
[00:12] <rww> anyway, back to the matter at hand
[00:12] <Juest> why?, i just want live and quick solutions....
[00:13] <bazhang> Juest, your ban will not be lifted until you can be trouble-free and follow the guidelines
[00:13] <Juest> :'(
[00:13] <rww> Juest: #ubuntu is a very busy channel. Without strict rules, it's unmanageable and confusing. Therefore, we have rules. You break those rules repeatedly. Therefore, you are banned.
[00:13] <bazhang> Juest, and as you have said that cannot be, and you will not follow them, there is not a way to move forward
[00:13] <bazhang> cyberwave, hi
[00:13] <cyberwave> hey your floodbot muted me by mistake
[00:14] <rww> The forums and AskUbuntu are different venues that are not realtime, and thus may be more suited to your psychology.
[00:14] <cyberwave> i was trying to get virus help
[00:14] <Juest> really?
[00:14] <cyberwave> yea.  my ubuntu has a virus
[00:14] <cyberwave> or somebody put on a joke program
[00:14] <rww> cyberwave: Unfortunately, you demonstrated a rather problematic lack of common sense by pasting that message in the channel. I'm with the floodbots.
[00:14] <rww> cyberwave: anyways, we're in the middle of something right now.   TROLLOLOLOLOLOL   NIGGER
[00:15] <cyberwave> especially rww
[00:15] <rww> !ops | cyberwave
[00:15] <cyberwave> LAWLZ
[00:15] <Juest> cyberwave: use pastebin nextime,
[00:16] <Juest> lol?
[00:16] <rww> moving swiftly onwards
[00:16] <rww> Juest: why do I think what?
[00:16] <bazhang> Juest, there will not be a lifting of your ban
[00:16] <Juest> what a sucka, he cannot wait..
[00:16] <Juest> why do you think that?
[00:16] <Juest> uh
[00:16] <Juest> about the forums+askubuntu
[00:16] <bazhang> yes?
[00:17] <Juest> and my pyshco
[00:17] <Juest> rww....
[00:17] <bazhang> ?
[00:17] <rww> Juest: IRC is realtime. There are a lot of people asking things all at once, and we need to sort out different people. You demonstratably do not work well with this environment and its need for strict rules.
[00:18] <rww> Juest: The forums and askubuntu have a very different dynamic, which is one of the reasons that bazhang and I are suggesting you go there for support instead.
[00:19] <Juest> well, i don't like strict rules....
[00:20] <Juest> i am not a veryy forum poster
[00:20] <Juest> and i always froget to check it
[00:20] <Juest> whatever
[00:20] <Juest> for me irc is much better
[00:20] <bazhang> Juest, thats a shame, askubuntu is very helpful
[00:21] <rww> Or, another more blunt reason: We already tried the "agree to unban and follow guidelines" route. It did not work. You're on your third time around. Therefore, we're not comfortable removing your ban at this time, so you /have/ to find somewhere else if you want support.
[00:21] <bazhang> Juest, well then join some channels suitable for your style.
[00:24] <bazhang> Juest, as our discussion is at an end, please part the channel
[00:26] <Juest> any suggestions?
[00:26] <bazhang> Juest, I made several
[00:26] <Juest> ummm
[00:26] <bazhang> good luck
[00:27] <Juest> how faster is askubuntu for answers?
[00:27] <bazhang> try it and see
[00:28] <Juest> umm
[00:28] <Juest> you guys don't know?
[00:28] <bazhang> Juest, there is not a single answer. try it and see.
[00:29] <Juest> :(
[01:08] <rww> I see I missed fun.
[01:11] <Corey> rww: Indeed.
[01:11] <rww> damnit, I just remembered I'm not in Xorg. no easy copypaste
[01:11]  * rww will fix banlist in a couple
[01:12] <Corey> rww: What needs to be fixed?
[01:13] <rww> oh, wait, /unban takes banlist numbers, nvm
[01:13] <Corey> rww: Quite.
[01:15] <rww> not for quiets, though. can someone grab those useless +q's?
[01:15] <Corey> rww: Sure.
[01:15] <rww> thanks :)
[01:22] <Corey> rww: Scripting is fun.
[01:22] <Corey> rww: Screenscrape into a file called "quiet", and then  cat quiet | awk '{ print "/mode -q "$7 }'
[01:32] <rww> !firewall =~ s/  / /
[01:48] <bazhang> rabbitear seems to be all noise, no help
[01:49] <rww> indeed
[01:50] <rww> acsalaska.net is familiar and dynamic, might want to keep an eye out
[01:50] <bazhang> wfm
[01:51] <rww> @comment 41593 unrepentant offtopic comments, backtalk when asked to stop. remove ban on review
[01:54] <bazhang> keyboard driver guy, again
[01:54] <rww> Terminal_, the guy with the capslock obsession, is back. I forget if they got banned last time
[01:55] <bazhang> * [__sephiroth] (~wizardken@unaffiliated/cwhizz): asdfjasdlkjfasd  ban dodging in -ot
[01:56] <rww> what's the BT ID for their cloak ban?
[01:59] <bazhang> 41195
[02:07] <bazhang> * [clcto] (~cdw@pool-173-48-154-64.bstnma.fios.verizon.net): cdw   <--- known?
[02:09] <rww> Terminal_'s another dynamic hostname user, btw >.>
[02:10] <bazhang> @mark #ubuntu clcto slacker-: no chitchat here. take it to offtopic when user said "hi"
[02:10] <bazhang> the @mark works fine with [, but chokes on <
[02:22] <bazhang> * [rabbitear] (~juice@209-112-185-28-rb1.nwc.dsl.dynamic.acsalaska.net): Juice just ban dodged then quit
[02:23] <bazhang> * [rabbitear] (~juice@209-112-185-28-rb1.nwc.dsl.dynamic.acsalaska.net): Juice
[02:23] <bazhang> how?
[02:26] <bazhang> ah, never removed.
[02:27] <rww> they told me to bam them, not kickbam them.
[02:28] <bazhang> yep. my bad
 i am cornholio
[02:38] <bazhang> that IP has tons of ban evaders and other unpleasantness
[02:39] <rww> yay IPv6
[03:03] <IdleOne> that is not what my sound is
[03:03] <rww> your sound isn't working fine with everything else actually?
[03:04] <IdleOne> correct
[04:25] <bazhang> why are people ignoring suggestions, and insisting on the wrong packages
[04:25] <bazhang> they have the bot on /ignore?
[04:26] <rww> summer break is awesome
[04:26] <bazhang> augh
[04:30] <bazhang> guest888etc is being deliberately obtuse?
[04:32] <rww> either way, this silliness is done as far as I'm concerned
[04:43] <rww> When #ubuntu gets very ridiculous, I often step back and stop paying attention because it annoys me. This makes me feel bad because I feel like I know what I'm doing and leaving further reduces the sanity in there. It's a no-win situation for me.
[04:48] <bazhang> yep
[04:48] <bazhang> time to take a break at that point
[04:49] <rww> I just got back from a break ;(
[04:49] <bazhang> not that kind of break
[04:49] <rww> !nickspam > h
[04:49]  * pleia2 hugs rww
[04:50] <bazhang> wow. he's nickspamming the entire alphabet
[04:50] <rww> bazhang: I think they stopped.
[04:51] <rww> or not
[04:56] <jussi> rww: don't feel bad, Its much better that you take the step back route than getting frustrated and burnt out, which often leads to errors in judgement. Also, please, if you still have the feelingthat we do not ahve enough operators in any channel, send the IRCC a mail. Ops are not just there as police peoples, but also to help keep the channel sane and safe without using operator privs. SO if you think we need more, please let us know.
[04:56] <rww> jussi: I don't think it's something we can cure by throwing more operators at it at this point, unless we want to start mandatory vacation rotations ;)
[04:57] <rww> I don't have a solution, though.
[04:58] <rww> (and it's rather likely the bug is in my firmware rather than the channel)
[04:58] <jussi> rww: yeah, its a knotty problem. But please, do keep taking a break when you need it, and don't feel bad for doing it.
[05:04] <tsimpson> bazhang: about @mark, [ is a valid character in nicks, where [foo] and foo are distinct but both valid nicks on IRC. when you @mark with a nick inside [] (like output from /whois) the bot just sees a valid nick, not a nick wrapped in square-brackets. this makes a mark no [foo]!*@* rather than foo!whatever@whatever
[05:04] <tsimpson> just thought I'd clarify how it works
[05:04] <bazhang> tsimpson, thanks, just saw the glitch with > but not [
[05:05] <tsimpson> probably down to the fact that < and > are both invalid characters for nicks
[05:06] <tsimpson> all of []`_^{}| and a-zA-Z are valid at the start of nicks
[05:07] <bazhang> heh nice
[05:07] <tsimpson> adding '-' and 0-9 after the first character
[05:07] <Flannel> A face to begin a nick!
[05:07] <tsimpson> I have seen people with "ascii-art" nicks, so yeah
[05:11] <tsimpson> oh, I forgot '\' too
[06:21] <rww> reports of on-join spam by Cindyy in #ubuntu from two people. my webchat isn't triggering it
[06:23] <bazhang> nothing here either
[06:23] <Tm_T> will try
[06:23] <rww> maybe they stopped when they got pinged in-channel, iono
[06:28] <Tm_T> nothing for me either
[06:28] <Tm_T> maybe I should have spoken something
[06:29] <rww> I spoke something :|
[06:29] <rww> and the first thing Matic`Makovec said was !kick Cindyy
[06:59] <Myrtti> rww: we lubs u ♥
[07:49] <elky> rww, be you trolling me before with your vacation roster suggestion? :P
[08:59] <Tm_T> vacation rotation...  :P
[12:12] <Myrtti> yup
[12:13] <Tm_Tr> may I raise one armhair?
[12:15] <Tm_T> no, you may not
[12:19] <knome> lol
[13:07] <bazhang> orionic onion
[13:13] <highvoltage> that's when a onion is part of a row of onions?
[13:13] <ikonia> Almtesh's question is reasonable for #ubuntu right ?
[13:21] <bazhang> glenn is glda19 with the thunderbird PPA and lightning beta issues of many days
[13:21] <ikonia> yes
[13:21] <ikonia> and he agreed to stop asking about it
[13:22] <ikonia> glenn_: do you remember the conversation we had yesterday in this channel where you agreed to stop asking about unsupported software in #ubuntu ?
[13:22] <glenn_> yes
[13:22] <ikonia> ok - so why are you again asking about it in #ubuntu
[13:23] <glenn_> the only querstion is how can i add two version of tb in ubuntu noting more
[13:24] <ikonia> glenn_: did we or did we not agree that the thunderbird 5 stuff was not available in ubuntu beyond testing and the correct channel was #ubuntu-mozillateam ?
[13:24] <glenn_> yes
[13:25] <ikonia> ok - so again, why are you in #ubuntu asking about it again
[13:25] <ikonia> you know the correct channel, we spoke about it yesterday, you where also in the correct channel yesterday, so why now just ignore what we spoke about
[13:26] <glenn_> did you understand the question  what i ask
[13:27] <ikonia> yes, how can you have multiple thunderbird versions on your machine at the same time
[13:28] <ikonia> glenn_: and as one of those versions is thunderbird 5 from the PPA or from a different source, we told you "it's not supported" and gave you the correct resources to ask for help/support/advice in
[13:28] <ikonia> you agreed to stop asking about it
[13:29] <glenn_> i can ask the same question for other program why ban
[13:29] <ikonia> glenn_: are you trying to install 2 stable and supported thunderbird versions on your ubuntu machine ?
[13:30] <glenn_> yesq
[13:30] <ikonia> glenn_: really, which versions ?
[13:30] <glenn_> stop it
[13:31] <glenn_> i'm sik of it
[13:31] <ikonia> no, I'm asking a question, you've just said you're tyring to install 2 stable versions, which versions ?
[13:31] <glenn_> leav it
[13:31] <ikonia> glenn_: and I'm sick of having to ask you to stop asking about unsupported software
[13:31] <ikonia> I banned you yesterday and you agreed to stop, I removed the ban and you've just gone back to asking about it
[13:32] <glenn_> I'm tired of me having to answer for every question I ask
[13:33] <glenn_> i'm tired
[13:33] <elky> You wouldn't have to answer here now if you'd followed the directions provided previously.
[13:33] <ikonia> glenn_: I think it best you take a break from usuing #ubuntu for a while (you're welcome to use the other channels)
[13:34] <glenn_> i'm tired
[13:34] <IdleOne> glenn_: for help with thunderbird 5 on Ubuntu #ubuntu-mozillateam is the proper place to ask.
[13:34] <ikonia> glenn_: come back when you feel you agree to stop asking about unsupported software and stick to it
[13:34] <glenn_> always ban bban
[13:34] <ikonia> IdleOne: he knows, he's in there, this was explained yesteday, hence why this is now a straight ban
[13:34] <glenn_> it's supported stuf
[13:34] <ikonia> glenn_: ok - so we'll leave it there then,
[13:34] <ikonia> glenn_: it's not
[13:34] <glenn_> it is
[13:34] <glenn_> bye
[13:35] <ikonia> we've been through this, so lets not waste any more time
[13:35] <ikonia> bye
[13:35] <glenn_> go to hell
[13:35] <popey>  /106
[13:35] <popey> bah!
[13:35] <ikonia> ok
[13:35] <elky> Heh.
[13:35] <elky> I think that ban will stay for a while.
[13:36] <ikonia> I would understand the furstation if there was no where to get help, but mozilla team was great with him yesteday
[13:36] <Myrtti> sad part is that if he hadn't installed it from the ppa, the advice would be trivial to give
[13:36] <ikonia> yesterday
[13:36] <Myrtti> :->
[13:36] <Myrtti> AFAIK
[14:44] <rww> elky: it may have occured to me that that topic has come up before :P
[18:04]  * h00k facepalms
[18:04] <Pici> eh?
[18:04] <h00k> eh.
[18:55] <rww> LjL: oh. lol.
[18:55] <LjL> sorry, i have to go! bbl
[18:57] <LjL> rww: come back
[18:59] <rww> on the positive side, we're now ineligible for #ubuntu-ops ops for a while under your plan :P
[18:59] <LjL> speak for yourself sensei
[18:59] <rww> oh, boo
[20:30] <ikonia> a lot of people's friends seem to shutdown their computers in the middle of a major OS version upgrade, why is this ?
[20:30] <h00k> ikonia: mean friends :(
[20:31] <ikonia> seems to happen a massive ammount
[20:32] <rww> they then come on IRC and insult everyone
[21:16] <qin> Am I voiced?
[21:18] <knome> tota
[21:18] <knome> errmmmm
[21:18] <knome> totally wrong window...
[21:21] <Flannel> tota to you too!
[21:21] <rww> Am I voiced?
[21:25] <genii-around> Apparently
[23:37] <bazhang> why do people never understand the word "unsupported"? people say it, and they continue asking for help
[23:40] <popey> bazhang: because it has numerous meanings
[23:41] <popey> unsupported = get lost we actively refuse to support that
[23:41] <bazhang> popey, not following you
[23:41] <popey> unsupported = do that and if it breaks you get to keep the pieces
[23:41] <popey> they are different
[23:41] <bazhang> this guy wants to mix stuff from oneiric repos with natty
[23:41] <bazhang> 'help my break my system'
[23:41] <bazhang> err me
[23:41] <popey> heh
[23:42] <popey> well, it's his system ☺
[23:42] <popey> s/his/their/
[23:43] <bazhang> yep. and he's been informed he's on his own, but keeps asking for help to do it.
[23:44] <bazhang> 'where's the poisoned chalice?' 'hand it to me, please'
[23:58]  * IdleOne offers bazhang a cup of wine


[00:13] <bryceh> and maybe make the X logs in /var/log/lightdm readable by non-root
[01:45] <RAOF> Sweetshark: What architectures have you tested libreoffice on?
[03:59] <cyphermox> RAOF: had any btrfs-related issues lately?
[03:59] <cyphermox> I think it ate my data on one computer; I keep getting a kernel panic and fsck won't fix it ;)
[03:59] <RAOF> cyphermox: My filesystem no longer mounts :)
[03:59] <cyphermox> oh yay
[04:00] <cyphermox> exactly what I'm seeing
[04:00] <RAOF> On one system.
[04:00] <cyphermox> a spinning disk or SSD?
[04:00] <RAOF> The purpose of btrfs is to remind people that déjà dup has a “daily” option :)
[04:00] <RAOF> SSD.
[04:00] <cyphermox> ok
[04:01] <RAOF> My *other* btrfs filesystems haven't had (any new) problems.
[04:01] <cyphermox> remove_from_bitmap explodes, it seems
[04:01]  * cyphermox wishes for the best for the laptop
[04:01] <RAOF> This is actually a psuedo-laptop; it's my ivybridge SDP.
[04:01] <cyphermox> ok
[04:01] <cyphermox> it's my new tower.
[04:04]  * RAOF will bitch more fully once he's got a btrfs image of the dead filesystem and has posted to the mailing list.
[04:04] <cyphermox> k
[06:13] <BigWhale> Good Morning.
[07:16] <ricotz> seb128, morning, just a note for the nautilus problem, did you consider 05_desktop_menu_export.patch might trigger this?
[07:16] <seb128> hey ricotz, yes I did but nautilus didn't change and downgrading gtk makes the pb go awya
[07:16] <seb128> hey desktopers
[07:17] <didrocks> salut seb128 :)
[07:17] <ricotz> seb128, ok, right
[07:17] <RAOF> Yo seb128
[07:17] <seb128> hey didrocks, RAOF, how areyou
[07:17] <seb128> ?
[07:17] <didrocks> seb128: meeting report reminder!
[07:17] <didrocks> seb128: I'm fine, thanks, yourself?
[07:18] <seb128> didrocks, thanks, I'm good!
[07:23] <pitti> Good morning
[07:24] <didrocks> guten morgen pitti
[07:24] <pitti> seb128: g-i-theme> right
[07:24] <pitti> seb128: we could also consider dropping the split now that we have bigger images
[07:24] <seb128> pitti, hey, welcome back! had a good w.e?
[07:25] <seb128> pitti, thanks for your sms btw ;-)
[07:31] <Sweetshark> RAOF: amd64
[07:32] <Sweetshark> morning all
[07:34] <didrocks> hey Sweetshark
[07:34] <didrocks> Sweetshark: so still as well on this C++11 fun? :)
[07:35] <Sweetshark> didrocks: on the days at work an in the nights in my nightmares ...
[07:40] <pitti> seb128: it was great, indeed
[07:40] <pitti> seb128: we had some nice time with my family, and now I'm visiting a friend of mine
[07:40] <pitti> he became PhD yesterday and defended his thesis
[07:40] <seb128> nice
[08:54] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[09:00] <didrocks> hey mr Coulson, how are you? ;)
[09:06] <didrocks> do anyone knows what launches gsettings-schema-convert at session startup?
[09:06] <didrocks> I just noted it's in python, so I think I won't use a similar code for our desktop migration tool
[09:07] <didrocks> ah, it's in fact -data-convert
[09:07] <didrocks> so ok, all C ;)
[09:57] <Sweetshark> didrocks: http://gcc.gnu.org/ml/gcc/2012-07/msg00024.html \o/
[09:59] <didrocks> Sweetshark: good, that was my discussion with the gcc guys, that it was a mistake :)
[10:18] <mpt> "Replace your changes in '/etc/gnome/defaults.list' with a later version of the configuration file?"
[10:18]  * mpt hunts for the "I Don't Know" button
[10:23] <xclaesse> seb128, out of curiosity: any progress for EDS 3.5 in Quantal?
[10:32] <ricotz> cyphermox, ^ ;)
[10:54] <pitti> seb128: meh, this jockey DBus crash is a mystery to me; we have filtered out this exception since precise
[10:55] <pitti> and stopped getting dupes ever since to LP
[11:10] <topyli> mpt: iirc it says "if you don't know, say yes" :)
[11:26] <mpt> topyli, true, but not really good enough :-]
[11:27] <topyli> it's debconf legacy
[11:28] <topyli> don't you dare touch debconf legacy! the force might disrupted become
[11:28] <pitti> it's actually not debconf, but dpkg conffiles
[11:31] <mpt> Yeah, if it was debconf I would have redesigned it already
[11:33] <Laney> If you're getting spurious conffile prompts (for files you haven't modified), then it's a bug in the package.
[11:37] <topyli> good point
[12:17] <chrisccoulson> w00t, just got a new ubuntu mouse mat
[12:30] <didrocks> heh :)
[13:07] <seb128> hum, I totally forgot to reply to backlog after lunch
[13:08] <bcurtiswx> good morning
[13:10] <seb128> pitti, hum, but whoopsie said it was reported 117 times today, but in fact the exception is different, the signature matching is not clever enough to match that
[13:10] <seb128> pitti, those have
[13:10] <seb128> "File "/usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/dbus/connection.py", line 651, in call_blocking
[13:10] <seb128>     message, timeout)
[13:10] <seb128> DBusException: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name :1.68 was not provided by any .service files"
[13:10] <pitti> ah, ServiceUnknown - that's indeed a different one (but equally useless by itself)
[13:12] <seb128> pitti, i.e https://errors.ubuntu.com/oops/0001b602-9b7c-11e1-98aa-e4115b0f8a4a
[13:14] <seb128> pitti, ok, so those bugs stacktrace match https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/jockey/+bug/881992
[13:14] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 881992 in jockey "jockey-text crashed with DBusException in call_blocking(): org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name :1.75 was not provided by any .service files" [Medium,Confirmed]
[13:15] <pitti> seb128: not quite
[13:15] <pitti> seb128: but close enough, I guess
[13:16] <seb128> hum, indeed, not quite the same stacktrace
[13:16] <pitti> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/jockey/+bugs?field.searchtext=org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown
[13:17] <seb128> I hate all those dbus timeout or service issues bugs in python processes
[13:17] <pitti> right, these are just equally useless
[13:17] <pitti> unless d-bus activation itself is buggy
[13:18] <pitti> duped the other two to 881992
[13:18] <seb128> thanks
[13:19] <pitti> I wonder if these are from a live environment
[13:19] <pitti> or something which could cause activation to take more than the timeout
[13:19] <seb128> pitti, some are ... you think it's too slow and goes to timeout?
[13:19] <pitti> I don't know really
[13:19] <seb128> like that bug states "Using live install from USB on an Asus EEE 1015px netbook with Windows 7 starter installed"
[13:19] <pitti> the error message tells me no reason at all, just that activation failed
[13:20] <pitti> but judging by https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.searchtext=org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown I'm not alone with this
[13:20] <seb128> right, same issue that didrocks is getting with oneconf bugs
[13:20] <pitti> where "I" == jockey
[13:21] <pitti> so I don't think it's a specific bug in jockey
[13:21] <seb128> no
[13:21] <seb128> well as you said the error is useless as well
[13:21] <pitti> so we could certainly ignore those in apport
[13:21] <didrocks> +1 on hating this :)
[13:21] <seb128> you could have a real bug which makes the service hang
[13:21] <pitti> almost useless, yes
[13:21] <pitti> but the S/N ratio is ridiculously low
[13:21] <pitti> so if we want to filter it out, WFM
[13:23] <seb128> pitti, can we figure a way to get a status dump from the service in those cases?
[13:23] <pitti> seb128: what kind of status?
[13:23] <pitti> pidof perhaps
[13:23] <seb128> pitti, knowing if the service is running, hanging, using cpu, failing to start...
[13:24] <seb128> if it's installed
[13:24] <seb128> pitti, we either find a way to make those bugs useful or ignore them
[13:24] <pitti> yes, I think that's a good idea
[13:24] <seb128> the issue is that I'm concerned we do filter out some valid bugs affecting the service side by just dropping those reports
[13:24] <seb128> pitti, I will open a bug on apport for discussion, ok?
[13:24] <pitti> woudl you mind filing a bug about this with your ideas?
[13:25] <pitti> seb128: merci beaucoup
[13:25] <seb128> pitti, danke schön ;-)
[13:25] <pitti> seb128: yes, we could then file bugs for "nonexisting", "not responding", or "not running"
[13:25] <pitti> where the first and last would be actually useful
[13:26] <pitti> I'm debugging a race condition in udisks today (all day already, ugh), will look at this later in the week
[13:26] <seb128> right
[13:26] <seb128> pitti, no hurry, thanks
[13:26] <seb128> one another class of bugs I hate is "DBusException: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoServer: Failed to connect to socket /tmp/dbus-gja1frOF6L: Connection refused"
[13:27] <pitti> seb128: for the "not responding" case we could use the machinery being developed by ev for hanging apps
[13:27] <seb128> oh yeah, good idea
[13:27] <pitti> but I need to think about this, we can't ask the user about that
[13:33] <tkamppeter> pitti, hi
[13:34] <pitti> hey tkamppeter
[13:34] <tkamppeter> pitti, it is about bug 1020480
[13:34] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1020480 in cups "package cups-bsd 1.5.3-0ubuntu1 failed to install/upgrade: il sottoprocesso vecchio script di pre-removal ha restituito lo stato di errore 127" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1020480
[13:35] <tkamppeter> pitti, the update fails because the update-inetd executable is missing for the prerm script. I have checked and cups-bsd already depends on update-inetd. Is a stronger dependency needed here?
[13:37] <pitti> tkamppeter: hm, no off-hand idea about this, I'm afraid; Depends should be fine
[13:39] <pitti> tkamppeter: perhaps you can ask the guy about "which update-inetd" and whether update-inetd is installed?
[13:42] <desrt> good morning everyone
[13:42] <desrt> didrocks: i notice you have an item marked 'DONE' in daily blames.  is that actually setup with QA now?
[13:43] <tkamppeter> pitti, thank you, done.
[13:44] <didrocks> desrt: there are some unit python tests (as well as a bunch of other tests) and jibel is deploying them this week
[13:44] <desrt> sweet
[13:44] <desrt> i'll be happy to finally have those online
[13:45] <didrocks> desrt: basically, I'm getting your output, revamping it a little bit to be python unittest like :)
[13:46] <didrocks> desrt: oh, and incoming unity release doesn't write to dconf at all, even on first logging
[13:46] <desrt> sweetness
[13:46] <didrocks> login*
[13:46] <didrocks> even :)
[13:47] <desrt> i wonder if we still have that weird issue on the guest session
[13:47] <seb128> didrocks, pitti: bug #1020572
[13:47] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1020572 in apport "Deal better with DbusException errors" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1020572
[13:47] <seb128> desrt, good morning ;-)
[13:48] <didrocks> seb128: sweet, thanks!
[13:48] <didrocks> desrt: which issue?
[13:48] <desrt> seb128: hey :)
[13:48] <cyphermox> xclaesse: EDS 3.5: working on getting it to -proposed now
[13:49] <desrt> didrocks: i think the setting to disable the lock in the screensaver gets written to gconf on guest session login and then the gsettings migration reads it from gconf and writes it to dconf
[13:49] <pitti> seb128: thanks
[13:49] <desrt> it's a bit ridiculous :)
[13:49] <xclaesse> cyphermox, cool :)
[13:49] <didrocks> desrt: oh right, let's see how it goes :)
[13:49] <desrt> didrocks: now that i think about it, though, it may simply not be possible to do this in a substantially better way
[13:49] <desrt> ie: even if we get rid of the ridiculous gconf stuff, it's still a write to dconf
[13:50] <cyphermox> xclaesse: sorry, I was hoping to get to coordinate an upload of thunderbird w/ chrisccoulson too for this, but couldn't discuss it with him on Friday :)
[13:50] <didrocks> desrt: indeed, still a write to it :/
[13:50] <desrt> i don't care too much about that, though
[13:50] <desrt> guest sessions are not normal
[13:50] <desrt> and this is one case where doing that write really does make sense in a weird way
[13:50] <xclaesse> cyphermox, how is thunderbird related to EDS?
[13:50] <didrocks> the test is running on a normal fresh user session :)
[13:51] <desrt> didrocks: one other thing: were you going to be the one looking into using dconf profiles as a more flexible alternative to gsettings schema overrides?
[13:51] <desrt> (i recall this now becuase it is a way we could get the guest session to work, but i doubt that it is worth it)
[13:51] <cyphermox> xclaesse: thunderbird builds a binary that depends on some eds libraries, and to avoid breaking things I'd like to be able to land things in -proposed first then copy to -release when things are ready and pretty stable
[13:52] <didrocks> desrt: hum, I don't remember about that. I expressde interest in the past about per session dconf profile, but we don't really need it anymore, at least, for now
[13:52] <desrt> didrocks: the idea was so that we could have a more-upstream-like gnome session
[13:52] <desrt> without the overrides
[13:52] <cyphermox> xclaesse: for thunderbird, it's addressbook integration
[13:52] <xclaesse> cyphermox, ah ok, good :)
[13:53] <xclaesse> cyphermox, there is folks using new EDS as well
[13:53] <didrocks> ah, no, you didn't discuss that with me, but I can get what you mean :)
[13:53] <cyphermox> xclaesse: indeed, so kenvandine was very much looking forward to it ;)
[13:53] <didrocks> hum, not sure it worthes it now TBH, apart if we really have overriden settings not compatible at all with other non default cases
[13:53] <xclaesse> cyphermox, dunno if EDS 3.4 is parallel installable with 3.5...
[13:54] <cyphermox> xclaesse: that's why we need to go through -proposed; or more exactly why it would be better, to avoid having uninstallable binaries
[13:55] <xclaesse> ok I see :)
[13:55] <xclaesse> thanks
[13:55] <cyphermox> as soon as I figure out why sbuild disappeared from my system I'll do one last build test for eds and upload somewhere
[13:55] <kenvandine> cyphermox, :)
[13:57] <cyphermox> I was having issues with one of the addressbook tests failing to build because it didn't have -fPIC
[14:00] <desrt> didrocks: it was an idea we wanted to implement at UDS.  i just don't remember who took the item :)
[14:01] <desrt> it could have been robert
[14:01] <seb128> dobey, hey, could somebody from u1 look at trapping the error from bug #937132 for the next sso SRU?
[14:01] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 937132 in ubuntu-sso-client "ubuntu-sso-login crashed with RuntimeError in /usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/gi/overrides/Gdk.py: Gdk couldn't be initialized" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/937132
[14:02] <didrocks> desrt: won't it be a perf regression? I mean, you have to open multiple files instead of just two (the system one and the user one). Maybe negligeable, but still :)
[14:02] <desrt> didrocks: pretty small indeed
[14:03] <desrt> dconf lookups are ~hashtable speed
[14:03] <desrt> also: this other database would never be written to.  lovely :)
[14:03] <cyphermox> seb128: fyi, going to go mobile this afternoon to try and debug WPA enterprise auth issues; which require me to go to my university, so I'm likely to be offline for a little while during the time wifi is being debugged ;)
[14:03] <didrocks> indeed :)
[14:03] <seb128> cyphermox, ok, no worry, good luck with the debugging!
[14:03] <cyphermox> yeah :/
[14:04] <cyphermox> not sure how luck will play, seems to be something funky in how wpasupplicant speaks to openssl, and generally black magic
[14:04] <seb128> cyphermox, don't forgot the file up https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2012-07-03 with what you did or topic if you a minute before going ;-)
[14:04] <cyphermox> seb128: I'll only be leaving in a couple of hours, after lunch and all
[14:04] <seb128> ok
[14:04] <cyphermox> trying to finish up eds first :)
[14:05] <seb128> cool
[14:05] <mdeslaur> cyphermox: oh, what issues are those? Maybe it's related to broken openssl tls 1.1 in precise?
[14:05] <dobey> seb128: any idea why that one is happening? i started looking at it, but the correct fix requires a fairly large bit of refactoring unfortunately.
[14:06] <cyphermox> mdeslaur: somewhat related to tls 1.1 yes
[14:06] <cyphermox> mdeslaur: fortunately there is possibly an easy workaround for wpasupplicant which I can apply without breaking too many things; SSL_NO_OP_TICKET might help a lot
[14:06] <mdeslaur> cyphermox: ok, then it's a known openssl issue that I will fix soon....see #1018998
[14:06] <seb128> dobey, I would say it's noise, but if we could trap it in a try: catch: to avoid spamming users with whoopsie system errors dialogs...
[14:06] <cyphermox> mdeslaur: the issue is tentatively caused by the Session Ticket extension in TLS
[14:07] <mdeslaur> cyphermox: ah, ok, possibly unrelated then
[14:07] <seb128> dobey, by experience those are happening at session closing or for people who try to run the said command over an ssh or a vt
[14:07] <cyphermox> mdeslaur: well, kind of related. TLS is painful for everyone ;)
[14:07] <mdeslaur> hehe
[14:08] <cyphermox> ohh; actually it might be very very relevant
[14:08] <dobey> seb128: right. would just like to know what people are doing exactly, to get that
[14:08] <dobey> seb128: hard to write tests when i have no idea why things are happening :)
[14:09] <cyphermox> mdeslaur: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wpasupplicant/+bug/969343
[14:09] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 969343 in oem-priority "Unable to connect to WPA enterprise wireless" [High,In progress]
[14:09] <dobey> seb128: also, is there any way to see a report for a specific version on e.u.c? one of the issues lists "latest seen" version as being the version the issue should have been fixed in
[14:09] <dobey> which is of course, odd
[14:10] <seb128> dobey, no, it's a known issue and being worked
[14:10] <seb128> dobey, it's on ev's list
[14:10] <dobey> ok
[14:10] <seb128> dobey, that can happen because current whoopsie report the installed version at issue time, not the running version
[14:10] <dobey> ah ok
[14:10] <seb128> dobey, so if users upgraded and didn't restart and the process hit the bug you will get the wrong version reported...
[14:11] <mdeslaur> cyphermox: ah! yes, that could definitely be related...just rebuilding wpasupplicant with the release version of openssl in precise should solve the issue
[14:11] <mdeslaur> cyphermox: or, wait a couple of days until I push an openssl update to -proposed
[14:11] <cyphermox> mdeslaur: what do you mean rebuilding?
[14:11] <mdeslaur> cyphermox: no change rebuild
[14:12] <cyphermox> rebuilding shouldn't be necessary here, just starting a new wpasupplicant process should be sufficient no?
[14:12] <dobey> seb128: or if the crash already happened in precise, and then they didn't report the issue until after an upgrade to quantal that was happening during the user's session where the crash happened?
[14:12] <mdeslaur> cyphermox: no because wpasupplicant was built with openssl 1.0.0, so it disables tls v1.1 by mistake
[14:12] <mdeslaur> cyphermox: "Any package in the repo that got compiled on oneiric, or on precise before 2012-03-24 02:03:49 EDT got compiled with SSL_OP_ALL set to 0x80000FFFL, and is telling openssl on precise to disable tls v1.1."
[14:13] <cyphermox> ah, interesting
[14:13] <cyphermox> but then SSL_OP_NO_TICKET couldn't possibly fix anything
[14:13] <cyphermox> ... because TLS 1.1 is already disabled, so its extensions should also be ;)
[14:14] <seb128> dobey, no, versions are collected at the incident time
[14:14] <seb128> dobey, not at the report time
[14:14] <cyphermox> mdeslaur: anyway, I'll test just rebuilding it; I much rather if that fixes things than crippling wpa supplicant and EAP-FAST support
[14:15] <mdeslaur> cyphermox: I would start by simply rebuilding it and seeing if that solves it...the problem could be completely unrelated to the openssl issue though, but you'll see right away
[14:15] <dobey> seb128: ok, something is weird then, because the ubuntuone-installer issue shows the quantal version as the last seen, which has the fix for the issue :-/
[14:15] <cyphermox> mdeslaur: right
[14:18] <mpt> "Python (v2.7) requires to install plugins to play media files of the following type: text/html decoder" -- yeah, like that's ever going to work
[14:19] <seb128> dobey, well, maybe somebody was running the installer and upgrading at the same time
[14:21] <dobey> seb128: maybe
[14:25] <seb128> dobey, speaking of which, when do you plan to SRU that one? ;-)
[14:34] <dobey> seb128: not sure, it needs a bit more work, as failing apt updates from PPAs and such breaks it now
[14:35] <dobey> brb
[15:16] <didrocks> desrt: hey, I see not anymore /etc/dconf/profiles or whatever, is it intended?
[15:16] <desrt> didrocks: you'd be amazed how often i get this question :)
[15:17] <desrt> didrocks: i'm a young-earth creationist
[15:17] <didrocks> heh :)
[15:17] <desrt> i believe that files in /etc need to be created
[15:17] <desrt> and that they were not simply caused to exist from nothing
[15:18] <desrt> the default configuration is emptiness
[15:18] <desrt> some intelligent creator needs to come along to change that
[15:18] <seb128> desrt, what is we got only dumb creators?
[15:18] <seb128> if
[15:18] <didrocks> that's a valid point seb128 :)
[15:19] <didrocks> desrt: as a reminder, those profiles are stacked dconf databases, right? reading from bottom to top?
[15:19] <desrt> didrocks: or top to bottom, depending on perspective
[15:19] <desrt> the one on the top is the one that gets checked 'first'
[15:19] <desrt> ie: if you have the same setting in two databases the the first one wins
[15:19] <didrocks> and the one where writing will happen?
[15:19] <cyphermox> what's everyone's feeling re: the "Sent from Ubuntu" signature patch in Evolution?
[15:20] <didrocks> cyphermox: we can kill it
[15:20] <Laney> destroy it
[15:20] <seb128> cyphermox, kill
[15:20] <cyphermox> I'd be inclined to drop it or just merge it into the Evolution autogenerated one
[15:20] <didrocks> was an awesome hack, I liked it though, but well ;)
[15:20] <desrt> didrocks: the writing always happens in the first one
[15:20] <desrt> didrocks: it's the only way it makes sense, if you consider it
[15:21] <desrt> didrocks: if the writing happens to the bottom one and the first one has a key then you will never see the new value that you wrote
[15:21] <cyphermox> dropping it is; but if someone screams let me know and I have an idea how to fix it
[15:21] <didrocks> desrt: agreed, but prefer double checking. And so, how does this play with ${XDG_CONFIG_DIR}/dconf/user? :)
[15:21] <desrt> it does not?
[15:22] <didrocks> ah, so you are not looking for this env variable?
[15:22] <seb128> cyphermox, there will be no screaming don't worry
[15:22] <desrt> no
[15:22] <didrocks> mterry tried to trick me!
[15:22] <desrt> /etc is hardcoded, i think
[15:22] <didrocks> it's a shame :)
[15:22] <pitti> hm, very confusing; since today's upgrades, terminal windows gradually shrink themselves vertically over time
[15:22] <desrt> and there is no expansion done on variable names in the file
[15:22] <kenvandine> pitti, that sounds like fun
[15:22] <desrt> pitti: that sounds like compiz :D
[15:22] <pitti> hey kenvandine, how are you?
[15:22] <kenvandine> good
[15:23] <desrt> pitti: and almost certainly something to do with the grid sizing constraints...
[15:23] <mterry> didrocks, what did I lie about?
[15:23] <kenvandine> my terminals aren't shrinking yet, so better than you i guess :)
[15:23] <pitti> mterry: hey Mike, good morning
[15:23] <mterry> pitti, hello!
[15:23] <pitti> mterry: very happy to see the u-m autopkgtest :)
[15:23] <didrocks> desrt: ok, so the only env variable you are using is ${XDG_DATA_DIRS}/glib-2.0/schemas/gschemas.compiled, right?
[15:23] <mterry> pitti, yeah.  :) still needs more tests, but it's a start
[15:23] <desrt> didrocks: yes.  gsettings consults the XDG_DATA_DIRS
[15:24] <didrocks> mterry: XDG_CONFIG_DIR is not used for values checking, the magic happens in /etc/dconf/profile
[15:24] <desrt> didrocks: incidentally, i feel quite strongly about the way that gsettings uses paths
[15:24] <pitti> mterry: it failed, it's at least missing a python-mock dep and apparently something else
[15:24] <mterry> desrt, oh it doesn't use CONFIG_DIR ?  Well, it at least uses HOME I believe
[15:24] <desrt> didrocks: but i'm not as totally convinced about dconf
[15:24] <didrocks> desrt: ah?
[15:24] <mterry> desrt, I know I've been able to fake it to use a different location
[15:24] <pitti> desrt: ah, blaming compiz then :)
[15:24] <desrt> mterry: you can set DCONF_PROFILE=(absolute path)
[15:24] <didrocks> pitti: no compiz update from today, juts to say ;)
[15:25] <desrt> in that case it will skip looking in /etc
[15:25] <mterry> desrt, yar, but without doing that I've gotten it to use a custom database path
[15:25] <mterry> pretty sure it was just CONFIG_DIR
[15:25] <desrt> XDG_CONFIG_DIR, you mean?
[15:25] <mterry> yeah
[15:25] <desrt> i avoided using that because the default value is /etc/xdg/
[15:25] <desrt> which i consider to be just plain stupid
[15:25] <mterry> desrt, oh shit, sorry.  XDG_CONFIG_HOME?
[15:25] <mterry> The user's one
[15:25] <desrt> oh yes.  that works of course.
[15:26] <mterry> didrocks, ^ sorry, XDG_CONFIG_HOME, not _DIR
[15:26] <didrocks> ahah :)
[15:26] <desrt> that will put the user's database into a different directory
[15:26] <didrocks> so, reiterating my question
[15:26] <didrocks> desrt: I guess XDG_CONFIG_HOME is set "on top of the stack" compared to /etc/dconf/profile ?
[15:27] <mterry> pitti, :(  OK.  So I ran the tests using adt-run locally.  Is there a good way to run them in a closer environment to jenkins to hit such issues?
[15:27] <didrocks> on top meaning "where you will write"?
[15:27] <desrt> didrocks: it depends on how you setup the profile
[15:27] <pitti> mterry: I set up a kvm instance which is pretty close to jenkins'
[15:27] <pitti> mterry: hang on
[15:27] <desrt> didrocks: probably you want to do this: create a dconf profile called "unity" (ie: file in /etc/dconf/profile/unity)
[15:27] <desrt> put in it these two lines (in order):
[15:27] <desrt> user-db:user
[15:27] <desrt> system-db:unity
[15:28] <desrt> then create /etc/dconf/db/unity.d/ and put some keyfiles there
[15:28] <desrt> then 'dconf update'
[15:28] <desrt> then when you set DCONF_PROFILE=unity it will read the values from the /etc/dconf/db/unity if the user has not set their own values
[15:28] <pitti> mterry: http://jblablog.wordpress.com/2012/06/19/local-ubuntu-vm-provisioning-with-cloud-init/
[15:28] <pitti> mterry: basically, it's a standard server cloud image which I start with -snapshot
[15:28] <didrocks> desrt: user-db is matching the XDG_CONFIG_HOME value?
[15:29] <desrt> didrocks: yes
[15:29] <didrocks> desrt: do you have a doc for this profile or are there only those 2 keywords? (user-db and system-db)
[15:29] <desrt> user-db:x corresponds to a file in $XDG_CONFIG_HOME/dconf/x
[15:29] <desrt> didrocks: https://live.gnome.org/dconf/SystemAdministrators
[15:29] <didrocks> desrt: perfect, that will avoid me bothering you more! :)
[15:29] <didrocks> desrt: seems straightforward, thanks!
[15:30] <pitti> mterry: a pbuilder login might suffice as well, though
[15:30] <mterry> pitti, ah nice.  I was hoping for a one liner, but I'll take what I can get.  dep8 will be tough for people to adopt without being able to easily test
[15:30] <mterry> pitti, you don't get X with that though
[15:30] <pitti> mterry: for your case, anyway; I need an actual vm for some of the stuff I'm testing (like udisks)
[15:30] <pitti> mterry: jenkins VM are not running X
[15:30] <pitti> mterry: you need to use xvfb-run if you do
[15:31] <mterry> pitti, oh really?  I thought we had that available.  OK.  Hmm..  I think one of the u-m tests briefly displays a window
[15:31] <mterry> pitti, well that's good then.  I know pbuilder  :)
[15:36] <pitti> desrt: ah, I did get a new compiz this morning; it also seems to hang every hour, very annoying :(
[15:36] <pitti> popey: ^ am I the only one seeing this?
[15:36] <popey> news to me
[15:37] <popey> pitti, what chipset?
[15:37] <pitti> popey: Intel Arrandale
[15:38] <popey> pitti, what version do you have now?
[15:38] <pitti> popey: 1:0.9.8+bzr3249-0ubuntu2
[15:39] <popey> pitti, anything that triggers it?
[15:40]  * popey is running it here on intel sandybridge and has had no lockups
[15:40] <pitti> popey: hard to say; I have worked on udisks test suite all day, which causes quite a bit of load
[15:40] <pitti> I'll watch it more closely
[15:41] <pitti> I also got a new kernel and other stuff, all updates since Friday
[15:41] <popey> i have had my hang recently when doing vast IO on quantal
[15:41] <popey> *my laptop
[15:41] <dobey> yay a new image got built today. wonder if works any better on my system
[15:49] <chrisccoulson> we need something like this for when launchpad is offline: http://hardhat.mozilla.net/en-US/bugzilla.html
[15:54] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: heh, unfortunately, the down time is really small now :)
[15:57] <seb128> didrocks, chrisccoulson, kenvandine, tkamppeter, Laney, mlankhorst, mterry, cyphermox, Ursinha: ups, we are bit past meeting time ... did anyone had a topic to discuss (none on the wiki)?
[15:58] <didrocks> seb128: didn't you want to discuss about WI status?
[15:58] <chrisccoulson> Nothing to discuss, but I might add some stuff to the wiki in a bit
[15:59] <seb128> didrocks, good point
[15:59] <kenvandine> nope
[15:59] <seb128> not so much needed to discuss as a team
[15:59] <seb128> I've tried to talk directly to people about their items
[15:59] <didrocks> will you get killed on Friday? Should we find a backup or a volonteer to go to the meeting? :)
[16:00] <seb128> didrocks, chrisccoulson, kenvandine, tkamppeter, Laney, mlankhorst, mterry, cyphermox, Ursinha, bryceh, RAOF, TheMuso: please make sure to update your workitems regularly and start considering to drop some feature work if you are behind
[16:00] <seb128> http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-quantal/canonical-desktop-team-quantal-alpha-3
[16:00] <seb128> doesn't look good :p
[16:00] <kenvandine> indeed
[16:00] <kenvandine> i'll review them
[16:00] <Ursinha> seb128, ack
[16:01] <mterry> seb128, pre-emptively drop feature work?  I have some stuff I know I probably won't get to, but I was going to wait until post FF to officially drop them from WI.  Should I just do it now?
[16:01] <Laney> Well, I'm a bit concerned about g-s-d/g-c-c lagging
[16:02] <didrocks> Laney: gsettings compiz is coming
[16:02] <seb128> mterry, if we will not get to it yes, I started dropping some of stuff or talking to people about dropping early
[16:02] <didrocks> Laney: Normally this week, ask popey for the status
[16:02] <seb128> Laney, right, me as well
[16:02] <Laney> didrocks: we don't need to block the updates on that though, do we?
[16:02] <seb128> Laney, as didrocks says, that's blocked on compiz and should be unblocked withing a week
[16:02] <didrocks> Laney: we do
[16:03] <didrocks> Laney: the patches are intrusive, (reverting gsettings)
[16:03] <didrocks> so not easy to update them
[16:03] <didrocks> knowing it's to drop them anyway afterwards
[16:03] <didrocks> so better to update and drop the patch at the same time
[16:03] <didrocks> but for that, we need compiz understanding gsettings
[16:04] <Laney> well I did actually do the 3.5.4 update the other day but it didn't work properly
[16:05] <Laney> aha
[16:05] <Laney> the patches are already dropped in bzr
[16:07] <seb128> right
[16:07] <seb128> the vcs is ready for the new compiz
[16:07] <seb128> what didn't work properly?
[16:07] <seb128> we should get g-s-d and g-c-c in a state where they work properly
[16:07] <seb128> out of keybindings changes
[16:07] <seb128> which will come with compiz
[16:08] <Laney> hum, let me see, I posted it on the bug
[16:08] <Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/1008840/comments/5
[16:08] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1008840 in gnome-settings-daemon "Update to 3.5.4" [Wishlist,Triaged]
[16:09] <seb128> shrug
[16:09] <seb128> the keyboard stuff is going to be a pain
[16:09] <seb128> not speaking about the keybindings
[16:09] <seb128> but rather their refactoring to use ibus
[16:09] <seb128> we will probably need to rewrite our indicator patch
[16:09] <Laney> who maintains that?
[16:10] <seb128> Laney, that? the keyboard indicator?
[16:10] <Laney> oh, thought you were referring to the patch I referenced there
[16:10] <Laney> but yes, that also
[16:10] <seb128> same story
[16:10] <seb128> it got done by dx by then and we "maintain" it
[16:12] <Laney> ok
[16:18] <seb128> ok, I guess that was all for the meeting, thanks guys ;-)
[16:18] <mlankhorst> seb128: hey ok, I'll update, still getting the work done that I want to get done though, :)
[16:19] <seb128> Laney, let's try to get those updates in the ubuntu-desktop ppa for extra testing
[16:19] <seb128> mlankhorst, hey, good, thanks ;-)
[16:19] <mlankhorst> it's just this item taking slightly longer.. [mlankhorst] make sure dmabuf synching framework is suitable for i915/nouveau: INPROGRESS
[17:07] <didrocks> good night everyone :)
[18:17] <desrt> seb128: you're on ecryptfs, right?
[18:24] <cyphermox> kenvandine: is folks ready?
[18:25] <desrt> anyone here has an ecryptfs home directory?
[18:25] <desrt> if so, please run this and share the output: strace -e trace=statfs df ~
[18:26] <kenvandine> cyphermox, not yet, but it can be very soon :)
[18:26] <kenvandine> cyphermox, eds in -proposed?
[18:29] <cyphermox> kenvandine: not yet, but it can be very soon ;)
[18:29] <cyphermox> I'm finishing up building evo locally; then I'll upload to my PPA just to be sure
[18:29] <kenvandine> haha
[18:30] <cyphermox> evolution-exchange will go much quicker
[18:30] <kenvandine> cyphermox, ok, just let me know when eds makes it
[18:30] <cyphermox> but at least eds, gtkhtml, evo will be ready
[18:30] <cyphermox> sure
[18:30] <kenvandine> i can have folks done quickly
[18:30] <cyphermox> it's a matter of minutes
[18:30] <kenvandine> cool
[18:30] <kenvandine> folks will be a soname change and stuff
[18:31] <kenvandine> so more than just a rebuild
[18:31] <kenvandine> i want to build it :)
[18:31] <cyphermox> chrisccoulson wants to upload thunderbird tomorrow maybe; so if it could all be in proposed by then we could promote everything tomorrow
[18:31] <kenvandine> wfm
[18:31] <cyphermox> the most annoying ones are really eds, evo, gtkhtml, gnome-contacts and folks afaict
[18:32] <kenvandine> i'll do gnome-contacts too
[18:32] <cyphermox> ok
[18:32] <kenvandine> i am knee deep in gnome-contacts right now :)
[18:32] <cyphermox> depends on folks, right?
[18:32] <kenvandine> yes
[18:32] <cyphermox> cool
[18:32] <cyphermox> kenvandine: fyi: http://people.ubuntu.com/~mathieu-tl/transitions/
[18:33] <kenvandine> SWEET
[18:33] <kenvandine> i should set that up for when i do libindicator or dbusmenu transitions :)
[18:33] <cyphermox> ah, the indicators is what I was forgetting
[18:33] <Streamstormer> desrt, http://paste.ubuntuusers.de/raw/409427/
[18:33] <cyphermox> kenvandine: normally should take into account -proposed too; but I update the files manually
[18:34] <kenvandine> cyphermox, i can do indicator-datetime as well
[18:34] <Streamstormer> desrt, in precise
[18:34] <kenvandine> unless you have that already
[18:34] <Streamstormer> desrt, *on precise
[18:34] <cyphermox> not started yet, but you don't have to take everything ;)
[18:34] <desrt> Streamstormer: i was more interested in the output of strace :)
[18:35] <kenvandine> cyphermox, you can do it :)
[18:36] <desrt> Streamstormer: ie: the contents of the statfs() line
[18:36] <Streamstormer> desrt, ? But this is the output?? There is nothing else..
[18:37] <desrt> Streamstormer: strace didn't produce any output?  very odd...
[18:49] <Streamstormer> desrt, No statfs() output on quantal too..
[18:49] <desrt> that's very odd.  i get statfs output here.
[18:49] <desrt> what command are you typing?
[18:51] <Streamstormer> desrt, strace -e trace=statfs df ~
[18:51] <desrt> i wonder why that works fo rme
[18:51] <desrt> also on precise...
[18:51] <desrt> maybe try like this: strace df ~ 2>&1 | grep statfs
[18:52] <desrt> i'd say that the different may be because of ecryptfs but in theory the statfs syscall is how it determines what fs type you have in the first place
[18:52] <Streamstormer> desrt, \o/
[18:52] <Streamstormer> desrt, statfs64("/home/benedikt", 84, {f_type=0xf15f, f_bsize=4096, f_blocks=130988792, f_bfree=63308642, f_bavail=56751830, f_files=32784384, f_ffree=32461997, f_fsid={1353147257,<PHONE_NUMBER>}, f_namelen=143, f_frsize=4096}) = 0
[18:52] <desrt> ahh... are you on i386?
[18:53] <Streamstormer> desrt, yes
[18:53] <desrt> that certainly explains it
[18:53] <desrt> thanks :)
[18:53] <Streamstormer> desrt, np :)
[18:53] <desrt> #define ECRYPTFS_SUPER_MAGIC    0xf15f
[18:53] <desrt> hm.  fascinating.
[18:58]  * desrt would have expected a single magic number for all FUSE-based filesystems
[19:54] <kenvandine> cyphermox, there is an eds <IP_ADDRESS> which contains the fixes libfolks needs
[19:54] <cyphermox> great
[19:54] <cyphermox> yeah I had to play around with evo <IP_ADDRESS> already
[19:55] <kenvandine> cyphermox, folks won't build with 3.5.3, so good.. you're going to be upload <IP_ADDRESS> then?
[19:56] <cyphermox> yes
[19:56] <kenvandine> awesome
[19:56] <kenvandine> thx
[19:56] <cyphermox> it's not that much more work once the heavy lifting is done
[19:56]  * cyphermox is downloading the tarball now
[19:56] <kenvandine> i tried to build against what you have in your ppa
[19:56] <cyphermox> oh cool
[19:56] <kenvandine> won't though :)
[19:57] <cyphermox> I think all I have to do is update the tarball now, so I'll push it again in a minute
[19:58] <kenvandine> thx
[19:58] <kenvandine> if you can do a push of your packaging branch somewhere too i can kick off a local build as well
[19:59] <cyphermox> ahh it's all there already
[19:59] <cyphermox> lp:~mathieu-tl/evolution-data-server/release-3.5.3
[19:59] <cyphermox> I'm updating it with the changelog change to <IP_ADDRESS> now
[20:00] <cyphermox> I've been pushing everything to LP quickly for fear of a filesystem crash
[20:03] <kenvandine> great
[20:04] <kenvandine> hummm... my wife just reminded me tomorrow is a holiday
[20:04] <cyphermox> kenvandine: yeah
[20:05] <cyphermox> kenvandine: do you have your stuff in a branch, I'll gladly carry on
[20:05] <kenvandine> cyphermox, not yet
[20:05] <kenvandine> cyphermox, if i can't finish it i'll point you at it
[20:05] <kenvandine> thx!
[20:06] <cyphermox> ah crap, gnome-keyring had evo fail :/
[20:10] <cyphermox> I suck; missing build-dep
[20:10] <dobey> kenvandine: heh, did you forget to take tomorrow off?
[20:15] <kenvandine> dobey, almost!
[20:15] <kenvandine> dobey, i've missed several holidays... just forget :)
[20:16] <dobey> heh
[20:16] <cyphermox> kenvandine: evolution-data-server <IP_ADDRESS> just uploaded to my ppa
[20:16] <kenvandine> cyphermox, cool
[20:45] <kenvandine> cyphermox, libedataserver1.2-dev needs to depend on libgnome-keyring-dev too
[20:46] <cyphermox> right, that's why evolution ftbfs
[20:46] <kenvandine> breaks things that build deps on eds
[20:53] <kenvandine> cyphermox, i have folks and empathy prepared
[20:54] <kenvandine> cyphermox, in fact, i can go ahead and upload them to -proposed and they'll depwait
[20:59] <cyphermox> kenvandine: cool; if that's all that was missing I'll upload e-d-s as soon as it's done building here again
[21:00] <kenvandine> cyphermox, that's it :)
[21:00] <kenvandine> just get that depends fixed
[21:00] <kenvandine> assuming you did
[21:01] <cyphermox> yup, building in the ppa now
[21:01] <cyphermox> I gave infinity a head's up about the uploads
[21:01] <kenvandine> awesome
[21:01] <kenvandine> i'll upload
[21:02] <cyphermox> ok
[21:03] <cyphermox> still hacking at evolution though, there's a segfault in /usr/lib/evolution/evolution-source-registry
[21:20] <kenvandine> cyphermox, folks and empathy uploaded and will depwait
[21:21] <kenvandine> cyphermox, i didn't get to gnome-contacts, can you do that?
[21:21] <cyphermox> thanks
[21:21] <cyphermox> yes, I'll take care of it
[21:21] <cyphermox> after dinner actually
[21:21] <cyphermox> thanks to mbarnes the evo issue got figured out; e-d-s needs to building without -Bsymbolic-functions
[21:22] <kenvandine> cyphermox, cool... thanks!
[21:22] <kenvandine> i need to head out
[21:23] <cyphermox> ok
[21:24] <seb128> cyphermox, do you know how to strip that out?
[21:24] <cyphermox> not really ;)
[21:25] <seb128> cyphermox, look to gnome-bluetooth as an example
[21:25] <cyphermox> ah, thanks
[21:25] <seb128> LDFLAGS=$(shell echo $$LDFLAGS | sed -e 's/-Wl,-Bsymbolic-functions//')
[21:25] <seb128> export LDFLAGS
[21:25] <seb128> cyphermox, in the rules
[21:25] <cyphermox> yeah
[21:25] <cyphermox> I thought there was a less hackish way :)
[21:25] <seb128> sorry I didn't see that you had that issue earlier
[21:25] <cyphermox> seb128: I only just found out
[21:25] <seb128> I read about that some days ago
[21:26] <seb128> ok, so you didn't lost too much time, good
[21:26] <seb128> fta run into it some days ago
[21:26] <cyphermox> I would never have been able to tell that that crash was caused by that flag
[21:26] <seb128> he was speaking about it on #evolution with mbarnes
[21:26] <cyphermox> ahah :)
[21:26] <seb128> they are easy to reconize once you saw one
[21:26] <seb128> the gtype warnings
[21:26] <cyphermox> ah ok
[21:26] <seb128> I guess you got some of those?
[21:26] <cyphermox> yeah, then cool
[21:27] <cyphermox> seemed unusual but I don't know enough about what that flag does to figure out the link anwyay
[21:28] <cyphermox> even then, I couldn't find what brings those in, if it's hardening flags, or default gcc flags, or what
[21:29] <cyphermox> oh, but of course I looked at the wrong places
[21:30] <seb128> cyphermox, it's in the default gcc flags
[21:30] <seb128> cyphermox, the issues is usually when a symbol is defined in 2 objects
[21:30] <cyphermox> seb128: yeah, I think my grep-fu failed me this time
[21:30] <seb128> like the bin and a .so
[21:30] <cyphermox> I was looking at gcc -dumpspecs
[21:33] <seb128> cyphermox, http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-settings-daemon/commit/?id=6cfa8efd447bcad22c67ab98a566811b62ea6765
[21:33] <seb128> that's a recent example with a bit of explanation with the fix
[21:34] <cyphermox> right
[21:34] <seb128> cyphermox, basically with the flag the objects get duplicated in each binary and you hit a conflict due to the double definition
[21:40] <cyphermox> bbl
[22:53] <jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell bryceh RAOF TheMuso meeting report reminder https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2012-07-03 please update and add agenda items.
[22:55] <TheMuso> Yep done.
[22:55] <TheMuso> Nothing from me.
[22:59] <jasoncwarner_> thanks, TheMuso
[23:08] <bryceh> no agenda items from me; taken care of via yesterday's email to list
[23:13] <robert_ancell> none from me
[23:26] <RAOF> Nor from me.


[00:01] <agrestringere> Got a question some spam has appeared in the Ubuntu-X bug mail https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/596082/comments/12 ???
[00:04] <RAOF> agrestringere: I think #launchpad is where you want to be.
[00:42] <mlankhorst> happy newyear RAOF / bryce :P
[00:42] <RAOF> mlankhorst: Happy new year!


[07:51] <DJones> Aww, David Bowie has passed away
[07:52] <daftykins> mmm
[07:52] <daftykins> surprising
[07:52] <DJones> Yeah, battling cancer for 18 months according to new reports
[07:53] <DJones> I guess not the sort of thing somebody in the public eye would normally speak about
[07:53] <knightwise> Good morning everyone
[07:53] <daftykins> gm o/
[07:54] <DJones> Morning knightwise
[08:00] <daftykins> hrmm solid rain planned for the day... that makes it harder to be motivated to do much :)
[08:02] <DJones> I think I'd rather have rain and a bit of warmth, rather than just cold temperatures, saying that, I'm indoors all day, so doesn't make much difference, looks like we get the rain tomorrow
[08:03] <daftykins> it's doing a threatening sort of swirl - http://www.raintoday.co.uk/
[08:04] <knightwise> Its getting chilly here :à
[08:05] <knightwise>  looking forward to some winter, hold off on the snow Since I need to drive
[08:05] <DJones> First time ages I've had to deice the cars this morning
[08:06] <daftykins> i need to visit an electrical supplier and then ride on to a clients to get a phone socket working, blech :)
[08:08] <daftykins> hmm though i normally loathe forever speaking of the wars, there are some interesting snaps in this one - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-guernsey-34544925
[08:11] <knightwise> God .. the media will be bowie-dized for days
[08:12] <daftykins> a better fate than the star wars hype :P
[08:14] <knightwise> Haven't had time to go see the move yet
[08:15] <knightwise> Still suffering from my "JJ-abrams reboot psychosis"
[08:15] <knightwise> Looking at what he did to the star trek franchise , i look fearfully upon the white screen
[08:16] <DJones> After the recent deaths from the music world, Lemmy, Bowie, Bradbury, Weiland, Taylor etc, there's be one hell of a supergroup in the heavens now
[08:21] <knightwise> Labyrith : David Bowie at his very very best
[08:26] <MooDoo> morning all
[08:27] <knightwise> Morning MooDoo
[08:27] <daftykins> knightwise: my friends say it wasn't so much him in that film, but his crotch
[08:27] <knightwise> "May the direction of bowies fallus point you towards the end of the labyrinth"
[09:04] <popey> yo
[09:04] <daftykins> allo
[09:05] <daftykins> cor, proper hail storm just now
[09:08] <MooDoo> ello
[09:13] <knightwise> hey MooDoo
[09:13] <knightwise> hows it going buddy
[09:20] <MooDoo> knightwise: feel a bit low this morning, don't think I got enough sleep this morning :)
[09:20] <MooDoo> sleep last night even!
[09:20] <foobarry> snot
[09:20] <foobarry> bleugh
[09:21] <daftykins> gm foobarry \o
[09:22] <foobarry> o/
[09:22]  * daftykins nips off on postie watch
[09:28] <foobarry> dogs are good for that
[09:33] <foobarry> wow. just discovered a bug in lsdvd that causes all memory on the machine to be instantyly consumed
[09:35] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Monday, and happy Learn Your Name In Morse Code Day! 😃
[09:36] <MooDoo> morning JamesTait
[09:36] <MooDoo> .--. .- ..- .-.. / -- . .-.. .-.. --- .-. ...
[09:40] <Laney> .-- . .-.. .-.. / - .... .. ... / .. ... / ..-. ..- -.
[09:40] <JamesTait> Very good, MooDoo! ☺
[09:42] <JamesTait> Laney, -.-- . ... / .. - / .. ... !
[10:12] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[10:14] <knightwise> hey brobostigon
[10:14] <knightwise> how are you doing
[10:15] <MooDoo> howdy brobostigon
[10:15] <brobostigon> hi knightwise, not bad, my eczema could be better, and you?
[10:15] <brobostigon> hi MooDoo
[10:17] <davmor2> JamesTait: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoi2vx3iegw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qgG-tXyq6E
[10:19] <davmor2> JamesTait: the morse I hear as I take hold of software is ... --- ... and it just repeats all the time
[10:20] <davmor2> JamesTait: I take it that must be my name in morse right?
[11:35] <diplo> Morning all, we've been having issues with time on our servers so I'm going through setting up ntpd on our customer sites, question though as my google foo is sucking
[11:36] <diplo> Our documents are timed, I can't see how often ntpd daemon keeps up to date, just a little worried about the sync being out by minutes and then sorting itself and a credit goes through say before an invoice is created.
[11:41] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[11:41] <daftykins> hey bigcalm \o
[11:47] <daftykins> another dead disk identified, oy.
[11:47] <zmoylan-pi> remove it and hammer it in front of all the other disks as a warning... :-)
[11:48] <davmor2> daftykins: is it named Bowie they all seem to die on the days stars do
[11:49] <daftykins> too soon!
[11:51] <Myrtti> deffo too soon
[11:53] <zmoylan-pi> he may be gone but the music he left...
[11:54] <davmor2> daftykins: nothing person by it, was more meaning that I'm pretty sure you disks seem to die around the same time as a Star (mind you we lost a lot in the last 12 months)
[11:54] <daftykins> it's ok, it's just a user in #ubuntu ;)
[11:54] <daftykins> one that it took many, many tries to run a couple of commands :/
[11:55] <davmor2> zmoylan-pi: Indeed and it is wonderful Music too :)
[12:00] <daftykins> diplo: did you run it by the #ubuntu-server folks? sorry no experience with ntpd
[12:20] <diplo> I think I've worked it out daftykins
[12:20] <daftykins> \o/
[12:20] <diplo> Uses min/maxpoll, over a few days it works out how often it needs to update, between 63 seconds and 1024 seconds depending on the machine
[12:20] <diplo> You can hard code it but advice is not to
[12:21] <daftykins> i had heard installing it will only slowly begin to adjust toward the intended time, in increments
[12:21] <diplo> Ah, I've fixed each site to be correct before setting it up
[12:21] <daftykins> sounds good :)
[12:22] <diplo> Only hoping it keeps it on time, will inspect each site that I've already done and see how they are fairing before doing more :)
[13:57] <diddledan> davmor2: the second of those songs was well timed considering the news of David Bowie's passing :-(
[13:57] <diddledan> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-35278872
[13:58]  * diddledan listens to life on mars
[13:58]  * zmoylan-pi wonders how high his music goes in the charts in next few weeks
[14:09] <davmor2> there is a new album out isn't there so possibly number 1
[14:09] <daftykins> yeah
[14:10] <davmor2> I would imagine if they re-release ashes to ashes, space oddity and red shoes they would get 123 in the single charts
[14:27] <knightwise> Just installed FireSSH in Firefox.
[14:27] <knightwise> pleasantly surprised
[14:34] <knightwise> looks like putty ,feels like putty
[14:34] <knightwise> isnt putty
[14:34] <daftykins> does it do URL parsing so you can click links?
[14:34] <daftykins> i guess it *is* in a browser XD
[14:34] <diddledan> I get putty and lube confused.
[14:34] <diddledan> all my windows keep falling out
[14:35] <SuperMatt> badum *CRASH*
[14:36] <daftykins> amusing story last night that skylake CPUs have a bug which gets tripped by prime95, the intensive prime number program - causing a full freeze
[14:36] <daftykins> BIOS updates will be on the way :)
[14:37] <knightwise> daftykins: it should
[14:37] <knightwise> but it doenst refresh the screen well
[14:37] <knightwise> Hence: Switched to SecureShell in chrome
[14:38] <diddledan> yeesh, is it a bug in the cpu itself?
[14:38] <diddledan> that will be a pain to fix properly
[14:38] <daftykins> that's what microcode updates are for :)
[14:39] <daftykins> there wasn't much detail in theregister's article
[14:54] <SuperMatt> question: why is ssh in a browser window preferable to an actual terminal window?
[14:55] <davmor2> You remind me of the babe
[14:55] <diddledan> what babe?
[14:56] <bittin-> this bae
[14:56] <bittin-> :p
[14:56] <diddledan> ruined it
[14:56] <diddledan> davmor2: try again
[14:56]  * SuperMatt throws his hands up in the air in exasperation
[14:56]  * diddledan tuts
[14:57] <SuperMatt> you remind me of the babe. what babe? the babe with the power. what power? the power of voodoo. Who do? You do. Do what? Remind me of the babe
[14:57] <SuperMatt> there, we've got it all
[14:57] <diddledan> https://youtu.be/K7cFXSDN_5k
[14:57] <SuperMatt> and I don't know why I started adding caps in the middle
[14:58] <davmor2> You remind me of the Babe
[14:58] <SuperMatt> What babe?
[14:58] <davmor2> babae with the power
[14:58] <davmor2> -a
[14:58] <SuperMatt> What Power
[14:58] <davmor2> power of voodoo
[14:58] <SuperMatt> Who do?
[14:58] <davmor2> you do
[14:59] <SuperMatt> Do what?
[14:59] <davmor2> remind me of the babe
[14:59] <diddledan> \o/
[14:59] <davmor2> \o/ thanks SuperMatt
[14:59] <SuperMatt> you're welcome
[14:59] <diddledan> gotta love collaborative singing
[15:00]  * SuperMatt nods
[15:00]  * SuperMatt is dying for a little nap
[15:00] <diddledan> mmm, snoozing ftw
[15:01] <SuperMatt> I just wanna be back at the flat with the cat
[15:01] <diddledan> kittie!
[15:01] <diddledan> I want a kittie
[15:01] <MooDoo> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXsQAXx_ao0
[15:03] <SuperMatt> diddledan: we adopted a 14 year old with dietry issues, and he's just such a lovely chap
[15:03] <diddledan> awww
[15:03]  * diddledan cuddles
[15:03] <SuperMatt> https://goo.gl/photos/XAjrWrRKFsfWp4cYA
[15:03] <diddledan> soo cute with his lil teddy bear!
[15:04] <SuperMatt> https://goo.gl/photos/pjGvNHhF4iEasDW17 - here he is playing "The floor is lava" which I try to fix some ikea drawers for more stability
[15:05] <SuperMatt> *while
[15:05] <diddledan> I read a while back that geeky/engineering types prefer cats over dogs
[15:06] <SuperMatt> I prefer dogs because they're more intelligent in my eyes, but the cat is low maintenance, and it's what the girl wanted
[15:06] <diddledan> based on my sample of me, I can state that the belief is 100% accurate
[15:06] <SuperMatt> very good science, well done
[15:07] <diddledan> I do like dogs, too, though, just prefer the company of a kittie :-)
[15:11] <popey> Trying to convince wife we should get a dogy
[15:11] <popey> but she's not having any of it
[15:12] <diddledan> popey: convince the kids then the wife has to capitulate under the weight of democracy :-p
[15:12] <Myrtti> popey: why not? hair and dust?
[15:12] <popey> poo
[15:12] <Myrtti> pft.
[15:12] <diddledan> poopey :-p
[15:13] <Myrtti> I'd want a Finnish lapphund but I think it'll have to wait a bit longer
[15:16] <Myrtti> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdcTHQ6OQHk
[15:18] <SuperMatt> popey: if the missus can change a nappy, she can pick up after a dog!
[15:18] <SuperMatt> In fact, it's often less messy
[15:18] <popey> yeah, we're both capable of doing it
[15:19] <popey> changing a nappy is a matter of necessity
[15:19] <Myrtti> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Dyson-Cinetic-DC54-i-Brand-New-5-year-Dyson-guarantee-/111821945687 ♥
[15:20] <Myrtti> or rather, I love this even more than the vacuum itself http://www.dyson.co.uk/vacuum-cleaners/accessories/pet-hair/tangle-free-turbine-tool.aspx
[15:29] <foobarry> "pet hair"
[15:30] <foobarry> my wifes hair is what tangles it
[15:30] <foobarry> dog hair is tiny
[15:31] <ujjain> do most mortgage providers allow overpayment or not?
[15:31] <foobarry> hard to generalise, need to check per mortgage i expect
[15:31] <Myrtti> foobarry: yes, and my yarn.
[15:31] <foobarry> and dental floss
[15:31] <Myrtti> yarn and human hair were our reasons to get it
[15:31] <foobarry> if it doesn't go in the bin completely, it wanders out
[15:32] <foobarry> my wife has been dying her yarns lately too
[15:32] <foobarry> she has borrowed a drum carder
[15:32] <foobarry> so is getting fleeces, washing, drumming , dyeing, spinning
[15:36] <popey> ujjain, yes AIUI
[15:36] <ujjain> right, I might have a look on buying a first house.
[15:37] <diddledan> remember popey INAL
[15:37] <moreati> Sanity check: Ubuntu 15.10 users, when you change volume with multimedia keyboard keys, does anything appear on the screen?
[15:38] <diddledan> yes
[15:38] <SuperMatt> ujjain: basically it all depends on what your provider allows. Some will allow you to over pay, but won't let you miss a payment even if you've over paid 11 out of 12 months, others just won't let you over pay at all
[15:38] <moreati> right, I did break something then. ty diddledan
[15:38] <ujjain> right, I'll write this on my checklist, find a provider that'll allow it.
[15:38] <SuperMatt> and you definitely cannot under pay on a mortgage
[15:38] <ujjain> eh, hehe, right.
[15:38] <SuperMatt> ujjain: if it's your first buy, you'll find the number of providers is veeeeeeeeeeery slim
[15:38] <diddledan> moreati: specifically a progress-bar-like indicator on the top-right of the screen telling you the current volume level
[15:39] <ujjain> I have a good salary though and I don't need an expensive house.
[15:41] <SuperMatt> ujjain: that's what I thought, though I am in london meaning I have to jump through more hoops that most
[15:43] <diddledan> moreati: https://www.dropbox.com/s/t4zzz02q1r5bnpr/Screenshot%20from%202016-01-11%2015-41-23.png?dl=0
[15:43] <foobarry> all houses are expensive in london
[15:43] <foobarry> one of my mortgages wouldn't let me overpay within first 3 years
[15:45] <SuperMatt> tell me about it
[15:45] <SuperMatt> my two bed flat is twice the price of my borther's two up two down
[15:45] <SuperMatt> *brother
[15:46] <SuperMatt> but he now has a child to worry about, and I'm sitting pretty with my kitty
[15:52] <ujjain> I'm in London too
[15:53] <ujjain> I don't really necessarily want to overpay right now, but if interest rises to e.g. 6%
[15:53] <ujjain> I'd like the option to overpay
[15:55] <ujjain> 2% or 6% on 500k, first affordable, second one deadly
[15:59] <popey> holy cow, this year I'll have lived in this house 15 years!
[16:00] <diddledan> bovine deity!
[16:02] <ujjain> congrats! :)
[16:02] <foobarry> is that also the length of your marriage?
[16:02] <foobarry> so far
[16:09]  * zmoylan-pi wonders if popey's residence is ipv4 or ipv6 :-)
[16:10] <popey> no, 16 years
[16:10] <popey> married in 2000 so I could easily remember how many years I've been wed
[16:11] <bigcalm> popey: is it the way I have configured my phone, or does the PlusOne X have a pants battery life?
[16:11] <popey> '97 met, '98 rented together, '99 engaged, '00 house, '01-02 nuffink, '03 first child :)
[16:11] <popey> bigcalm, define pants?
[16:11] <popey> i dunno mine is often plugged in
[16:11] <popey> and i never leave the house
[16:11] <bigcalm> popey: 100% charge this morning. 25% charge now
[16:12] <popey> i often turn on android power saving
[16:12] <bigcalm> I did drive to work today, so was without wifi for about an hour
[16:12] <popey> i have bluetooth on all the time mostly, for pebble
[16:12] <bigcalm> Do you have the gestures enabled?
[16:12] <popey> yes
[16:12] <popey> circle and v?
[16:12] <bigcalm> I have bt on for my wrist band thing
[16:12] <bigcalm> popey: yes o and v
[16:12] <bigcalm> Maybe it's because I've only just got the phone and thus playing with it more
[16:13] <popey> battery thing says 88% approx 21 hrs left
[16:13] <popey> i turned off some animations and stuff
[16:13] <ujjain> you can't rent out your own home if you have a mortgage, right?
[16:13] <popey> http://imgur.com/nZIZtL5
[16:14] <popey> depends on the mortgage
[16:14] <ujjain> for me '14, didn't know eachother '15 met, '15 she got kicked out of the country,
[16:14] <popey> erk
[16:16] <bigcalm> http://imgur.com/IwfzkAe
[16:17] <bigcalm> Seems it wasn't 100% this morning but last night. Even so
[16:17] <popey> lots of screen on time
[16:17] <popey> so yeah, you're probably playing with it more than me
[16:18] <bigcalm> Aye
[16:18] <popey> like the device tho?
[16:18] <bigcalm> It'll improve over time
[16:18] <bigcalm> Very much so
[16:18] <ujjain> I used to have a Nexus 5, battery was horrid, I played too much with it I guess
[16:18] <popey> i hate that i keep pressing the power button when i pick it up
[16:18] <ujjain> @popey; too many notifications
[16:19] <ujjain> they don't bother you?
[16:19] <popey> well done
[16:19] <bigcalm> popey: slightly regretting buying the Karbon shell with my order. Didn't realise that it came with a clear jelly shell that is nicer to use.
[16:19] <popey> I wondered who would be the first to mention the notifications
[16:19] <popey> why would they bother me, it's on my desk, with the display off
[16:19] <bigcalm> popey: I haven't done that. But I do keep pressing volume down when I want to press power
[16:19] <popey> phones should have power buttons on the top, not the side
[16:19] <popey> [FACT]
[16:19] <popey> iphone 4 was the pinnacle of phone design imo :)
[16:20] <zmoylan-pi> nokia e61i to my mind
[16:20] <popey> was that symbian?
[16:20] <zmoylan-pi> yup
[16:21] <zmoylan-pi> was all downhill after the e61i
[16:23] <Myrtti> I loved my N95
[16:24] <zmoylan-pi> the n95, another classic. met a hotel porter who used the n95 to torrent movies in his pocket while he was at work
[16:25] <Myrtti> I used it for IRC, and for taking the best photos I've ever taken, and listening to audiobooks
[16:25] <SuperMatt> no way he won't be found out
[16:25] <ujjain> 11 days into the year and still no tube strike, it’s a miraccccccleee 😄
[16:25]  * ujjain opens newspaper
[16:26] <ujjain> Tuesday 26 January - Tube Strike
[16:26]  * SuperMatt nods sagely
[16:26] <SuperMatt> I don't know whether to try to work from home, or take annual leave
[16:26] <zmoylan-pi> it willen have been a tube strike if it happens... :-)
[16:27] <ujjain> work from home, that's what Mitchell and Webb'd do.
[16:28] <SuperMatt> yeah, but what about the wa...
[16:32] <bigcalm> popey: am I mad or is there no gallery app on the phone? (ignoring Google photos)
 yes
[16:32] <popey> thats the default photos app now, innit?
[16:32] <bigcalm> Is it? Didn't realise that
[16:33] <popey> i thought so
[16:33] <bigcalm> After taking a photo, one can scroll though past photos. Thought that was using a gallery app
[16:33] <popey> that used to be the case
[16:33] <popey> but Google merged them into one app i thought
[16:34] <popey> if you search play store for gallery then you'll find google photos
[16:34] <popey> thats the app i use
[16:34] <popey> i thought it was pre-installed?
[16:35] <bigcalm> It is pre-installed
[16:35] <bigcalm> On my SGS5 with CM12.1 (and now 13.0), there was a separate app for Gallery that wasn't Google photos
[16:36] <bigcalm> Hence my surprise
[16:36] <bigcalm> I'll live :)
[16:38] <ujjain> Yeah, I prefered Gallery too
[16:41] <bigcalm> The camera is nice https://twitter.com/bigcalm/status/686588390352007170
[16:43] <diddledan> bigcalm: you've got a nice pair
[16:43] <Myrtti> it's merged yeah
[16:43] <bigcalm> diddledan: they were a lovely juicy pair
[16:43] <Myrtti> bigcalm: which SW did you end up seeing?
[16:44] <bigcalm> Myrtti: imax 3d. It was okay
[16:44] <moreati> bigcalm: the 3D part or the SW part?
[16:44] <diddledan> I really need to go watch that
[16:44] <bigcalm> Myrtti: the drugs I'm on make my emotions quite muted. That said, I enjoyed the film, so that's saying something
[16:44] <Myrtti> the 3D was a lacklustre for me
[16:45] <Myrtti> bigcalm: I'm not on any drugs and it was a relatively muted affair for me, too. I cried far less than what I expected
[16:45] <bigcalm> I think that 3d shouldn't be the point of the film. An addition to it that you don't really notice but adds depth. Avatar did it well. I haven't seen it used correctly since then sadly
[16:45] <bigcalm> moreati: 2D would have been just as good
[16:46] <Myrtti> we watched Finding Nemo in 3D at home with the new telly and it was amazing
[16:47] <moreati> Myrtti: ditto, but saw Dredd
[16:48] <zmoylan-pi> the dredd movie was amazing, i would have loved to have seen that in cinema in 3d
[16:53] <bigcalm> Watched Empire Strikes Back (DVD) last night and saw that it was better than anything else, ever
[16:54] <diddledan> bigcalm: he said let there be starwars. and there was starwars. and he looked upon it and saw that it was good.
[16:54] <diddledan> day 8 of the creation story
[16:55] <zmoylan-pi> hmmm, my movie last night was ronin... and it was explody... :-)
[16:55] <bigcalm> Will likely watch Return of the Jedi at some point this week, though I know it will never live up to Empire
[16:55] <diddledan> wow, I've not seen that in forever
[16:55] <zmoylan-pi> great car chases, great shoot outs, great dialog...
[16:56] <zmoylan-pi> what colour is the boat house in hereford?!
[16:56] <zmoylan-pi> tonights movie... i went down...
[17:05] <awilkins> Dredd in 3D was pretty cool
[17:05] <awilkins> Especially the slowmo scenes
[17:06] <popey> bigcalm, yeah, I like the camera, but my previous phone camera I used was Nexus 4, so not hard to be better than that garbage
[17:06] <zmoylan-pi> unlike most movies which are just made 3d it looked like someone thought ahead with dredd and made bits of it to look spectacular in 3d
[17:22] <diddledan> just hit bug #1529146
[17:23] <diddledan> did a bit of research and posted a link to an LKML message about the issue onto the bug
[17:24] <diddledan> also added the redhat issue for the same into launchpad's tracking
[17:28] <diddledan> o_O "Bug watch updates for Red Hat Bugzilla are disabled." whyfor?
[17:28] <diddledan> silly launchpad
[20:00] <diddledan> yey for calendar reminders - I'd forgotten it was silent witness tonight
[20:34] <popey> diddledan, good work finding the patch
[20:38] <diddledan> thanks :-)
[21:22] <mapps> hi:D


[11:07] <czajkowski> Aloha
[17:39] <dholbach> all right my friends - I call it a day - see you all tomorrow!


  I have a question about ssh host keys with a nfsroot and multiple clients.
[16:07] <laga> just ask
[16:07] <ab0oo> ok, if I have a bunch of clients that all mount the same nfsroot, and they all run SSH, then they all get the same SSH host key, which is non-optimal.
[16:08] <ab0oo> is there a way (i.e. a config option to sshd) to get each host to use it's own key?
[16:09] <laga> good question :) i'll be facing the same issue soon..
[16:09] <ab0oo> I'm not sure #edubuntu is the right channel, but the project seems to have more nfsroot expertise than I can find anywhere else.
[16:09] <laga> ab0oo: there's a different problem, too: how do you make the clients keep their host keys if they reboot?
[16:09] <ab0oo> then, unless you have a bunch of identical hardware, you'll also face the xorg.conf problem, too. :)
[16:10] <ab0oo> well, X server has a slick little secret:  it will read xorg.conf.<hostname> for x configuration, so you can have per-host xorg.conf
[16:10] <laga> ab0oo: no, that'll be OK. ubuntu has lots of autoconfiguration magic and each client will have his own writeable nfs share which is merged with the root share using unionfs :)
[16:10] <laga> oh, nifty.
[16:11] <ab0oo> which is GREAT, unless you use nvidia's proprietary driver, which won't load the nvidia kernel module unless it finds nvidia in the /etc/X11/xorg.conf file.
[16:11] <laga> ab0oo: that's an ubuntu-specific hack
[16:11] <ab0oo> Ahh, I'm not smart enough to use unionfs, which I probably ought to figure out
[16:12] <laga> you can "fix" that by editing a file in /etc/modprobe.d/ or something like that
[16:12] <laga> ab0oo: i'm not smart enough either.. give me a few more hours
[16:13] <laga> unionfs on nfs didn't work well here. and aufs (another unionfS) requires a kernel patch. it also won't compile with the hardy kernel. i have had lots of fun lately with that..
[16:14] <ab0oo> what I think I really want is some kind of variable substitution in NFS or "mount", so I can have a single config section that mounts "nfsserver:/export/config-<hostname>" where hostname is dynamically filled in by each host
[16:15] <laga> we're gonna use the MAC address instead of the hostname
[16:16] <laga> (i'm currently working on a as-configless-as-possible approach for diskless clients for mythbuntu, a  HTPC distribution)
[16:17] <ab0oo> I used mythbuntu for a while, then just bought a Buffalo LinkTheater instead.  quieter, cheaper, fits in with the rest of the A/V gear better.
[16:17] <laga> depends on what you need i suppose :)
[16:20] <ab0oo> with autofs, there appears to be a way to do variable substitution to include HOSTNAME, OS, VERSION, etc.
[16:20] <laga> sounds nice
[16:21]  * laga needs to find out how ltsp/edubuntu uses sshfs
[16:51] <LaserJock> ogra: is the seed structure going to change soonish? Will ship-addon go to ship?
[16:51] <o00w> does anyone program with gcc?
[16:52] <LaserJock> depends on the question ;-)
[16:53] <o00w> well I see gcc listed in /usr/bin but it does nothing
[16:54] <o00w> I can launch it from terminal but it expects me to specify the file that I wish to open with gcc
[16:54] <LaserJock> well, gcc is the compiler
[16:54] <LaserJock> you need to write a C program first and then compile it with gcc
[16:54] <o00w> so what would be the gui I would use to write c code?>
[16:55] <LaserJock> well, any text editor would do
[16:55] <o00w> hmmm I was hoping to have something error check on the fly
[16:55] <LaserJock> but if your interested in GUI tools I think anjuta is popular
[16:56] <ab0oo> eclipse with the C extensions does something like that
[16:56] <ab0oo> also has all the syntax highlighting, etc.
[16:56] <LaserJock> yeah, eclipse would be the other one you might try. It's a Java app but has lots of extensions for other languages
[16:57] <o00w> sorry to be such a noob on this but I have seen windows compilers that let u debug and execute the code from within the application u are writing it in
[16:57] <o00w> or maybe it isn't called a compiler
[16:58] <o00w> like quincy
[16:58] <ab0oo> you're not going to find Visual Studio for Linux.  it's just not how Real Programmers program
[16:59] <o00w> well I wasn't looking to be a "Real Programmer" yet.  but is there something that like changes the text color when an int is called and things like that
[16:59] <LaserJock> o00w: there might be some tools like that in anjuta/eclipse
[16:59] <LaserJock> but to be honest, I just use a regular text editor
[17:00] <LaserJock> I don't program much but learning all the little tools takes more time then reading a tutorial/reference and just doing it, for me anyway
[17:00] <o00w> yeah... I haven't even written "hello world" yet so I just thought it would be less frustrating if I could see errors on the fly
[17:01] <o00w> thank you for the input though
[17:01] <LaserJock> well, anjuta/eclipse would at least give you syntax highlighting
[17:01] <LaserJock> and they might have some debugging stuff
[17:01] <LaserJock> you can just try them and see, they're in the repos
[17:53] <Petaris> Hi all
[18:04] <highvoltage> hey Petaris!
[18:07] <Petaris> Hi highvoltage
[18:11] <Petaris> I am having issues when I set X (on the client) to use the amd driver (for the geode2 chipset)
[18:11] <Petaris> basically all ttys come up blank and you can't kill X
[18:11] <Petaris> it does listen to ctrl+alt+del though
[18:12] <Petaris> any other driver dies too
[18:14] <Petaris> *unless I set screen_02=shell
[18:14] <Petaris> then X doesn't launch at all and I can work on the client
[18:28] <Petaris> seems that this issue is referenced here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-amd/+bug/140051
[18:29] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 140051 in xserver-xorg-video-amd "amd driver fails to autoconfigure" [High,Triaged]
[19:39] <Petaris> highvoltage: How can I install a specific version of a package from apt?
[19:39] <Petaris> or list multiple versions?
[19:40] <Petaris> I want to install the new packages listed in that bug report to see if it fixes my issues
[19:44] <Petaris> biab
[20:34] <mgb_> anyone there that could help with a vmplayer error i'm getting running client over ltsp?
[20:34] <johnny> depends
[20:35] <johnny> if it's really related to vmware, then no
[20:35] <johnny> if it's related to ltsp then perhaps
[20:36] <mgb_> ok, i'll try to explain the setup
[20:36] <mgb_> up-to-date edubuntu with two thin clients connected
[20:38] <mgb_> both thin client can execute vmplayer with a range of vm images, however when one client has the windows 2k clone open, the other starts the vm (a unique clone of the w2k vm) and gets an error like XCreateImageFailed signal 11
[20:39] <johnny> what dos w2k have to do with ltsp?
[20:39] <johnny> you mean vmware inside ltsp , not using
[20:39] <johnny> i used vmware/virtualbox to test thinclients :)
[20:39] <johnny> not to run windows :)
[20:40] <johnny> try with say virtualbox?
[20:41] <mgb_> the thin client is using ltsp in order to access vmplayer
[20:41] <mgb_> vmplayer then executes a w2k image - there are other images - w2k is just an example
[20:42] <johnny> hmm...you're prolly gonna have to go deeper
[20:42] <mgb_> does virtualbox have much in the way of cloning like vmware
[20:42] <johnny> to figure it out
[20:42] <johnny> i doubt it matches vmware completely
[20:43] <johnny> i just prefer to use open software
[20:43] <johnny> and virtualbox is good enough
[20:43] <johnny> do you have a similiar problem with any other apps that might try to do something similiar?
[20:43] <johnny> when it comes to spawning extra windows?
[20:44] <mgb_> i haven't tried any other apps. the error comes when the vm window resizes to desktop when starting up
[20:45] <johnny> hmm.. perhaps try to do the same with virtualbox, see if the problem is with vmware itself
[20:45] <mgb_> there is a bug report here https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rdesktop/+bug/104332
[20:45] <johnny> just backup some of your images
[20:45] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 104332 in rdesktop "rdesktop crashes when logging in to windows 2000 (or pressing cancel)" [High,Fix released]
[20:46] <mgb_> is the latest edubuntu a gutsy release?
[20:46] <johnny> yes
[20:46] <mgb_> if so why is this bug invalid in gutsy?
[20:46] <johnny> aha.. that bug looks like rdesktop itself had to be patched
[20:46] <johnny> to work
[20:47] <johnny> if so, that'd be similiar for vmware.. if they really were similiar
[20:48] <mgb_> cool. thanks for the help. do you think there are any performance issues with thin clients running multiple vm images over a gig network?
[20:49] <johnny> uhmm.. i don't have any experience with that
[20:49] <johnny> so i won't speculate
[20:49] <mgb_> in terms of the network not being able to cope with the remote display of an X session with multiple vms open
[20:49] <johnny> mine is still 10/100
[20:50] <johnny> some other folks here prolly run such setups tho
[20:50] <johnny> i only have 4 clients on mine atm
[20:54] <mgb_> that's for mentioning virtualbox, it seems easy to clone vm
[20:57] <mgb_> i need a system that allows the use of thin clients in order to access multiple vm images. the vms at the moment are automatically cloned, in a hackish way due to the vmware API not supporting proper cloning yet, in order to provide the users of the thin client with non-persistant vm images where changes only persist if rebooted - if the vm is shutdown the changes are lost. do you think this is achievable with virtualbox?
[21:05] <johnny> who knows
[21:05] <johnny> the point is to test if you get the same issue with
[21:05] <johnny> if you don't, then the issue is with vmware, and you'd have to complain to them
[21:06] <lns> it's probably not of much use to people right now, but I thought I'd share a wiki I started on wikidot.com - the information I'm gathering and putting on it regards UbuntuLTSP/Edubuntu specifically, and has a lot of useful URLs regarding bugtracking, forums/websites, etc... I plan on expanding the site a LOT as times passes, so hopefully it will grow to be pretty extensive. For those of you that want to see it now, check out http://lns.wikidot.com - let me kno
[21:06] <lns> w if you find it useful!
[21:07] <LaserJock> lns: why not use the Ubuntu wiki?
[21:07] <johnny> lns, did you attempt firefox 3 yet?
[21:09] <lns> LaserJock, because the LNS wiki is for tracking issues/subjects directly relating to our own clients
[21:09] <LaserJock> hmm, I see
[21:09] <lns> johnny, no... i don't want to try FF3 until it is released as stable..there are too many people using it right now
[21:09] <lns> LaserJock, there is still a lot of useful information (especially the reference url section) so feel free to duplicate it (or i can, but it's really hard for me to find the right places on the ubuntu wiki)
[21:10] <LaserJock> lns: this all applies to 7.10?
[21:10] <johnny> lns, well it's not like you couldn't just add an icon
[21:10] <johnny> and use it along side
[21:10] <lns> LaserJock, most of it, yes
[21:12] <lns> johnny, i could, but there are many more issues i have to fix/deal with first before trying more beta software..i need to re-try the XRAMPERC solution because I think the list post I followed was wrong for my setup
[21:12] <lns> that's one of the biggest reasons I started my own wiki - to track specific issues and be able to gather all information regarding it in one place
[21:13] <LaserJock> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EdubuntuFAQ is one place we house stuff
[21:13] <LaserJock> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EdubuntuRecipes
[21:14] <LaserJock> I think those are the primary wiki pages for Edubuntu help
[21:15] <lns> oo, nice.. thanks LaserJock
[21:15] <lns> I'll put that in my reference urls, already finding stuff in there that relates to issues we're having ;)
[21:15] <LaserJock> cool
[21:16] <LaserJock> seems like we should have a release-specific wiki page for issues that only hit a particular release
[21:16] <lns> LaserJock, yeah...i'm already finding it very hard to keep a solid hierarchy in my OWN wiki... heh
[21:17] <LaserJock> yeah, wiki's can quickly become very messy
[21:18] <LaserJock> hmm, I should see if I can get ltsp set up on my new laptop
[21:18] <lns> I strongly considered implementing my own wiki pages in the ubuntu/edu wikis...but man....it's just so difficult, i need more control over my specific issues
[21:19] <LaserJock> well, if you have clients or need to track your specific stuff it makes sense
[21:20] <LaserJock> but where possible it'd be nice to share since we are always looking for more documentation
[21:20] <lns> LaserJock, exactly
[21:21] <lns> i wish there was some way to link actual page text cross-wiki style (not sure if that's the right wordage)
[21:21] <lns> instead of just a link
[21:21] <LaserJock> right
[21:22] <LaserJock> I think that may be possible, but it wouldn't be feasible for Ubuntu's because I think it requires messing around with the wikis
[21:24] <lns> ahh
[21:26] <lns> well if it's ok i can always put a link to my specific wiki on the Edubuntu/UbuntuLTSP wiki for reference
[21:26] <lns> dunno if that would just clutter things up more, but at least it'd be a link to more info
[21:27] <LaserJock> hmm, I probably be for copying content over
[21:27] <LaserJock> are you gonna license your wiki? I didn't check
[21:37] <lns> LaserJock, license my wiki?
[21:38] <LaserJock> yes, copying content only works if the licenses are compatible :-)
[21:41] <lns> hmm, never thought about that ;)
[21:41] <lns> i guess i could, i have no idea howto thou
[21:43] <LaserJock> you can just add a license statement
[21:43] <lns> like gpl? (sorry i'm a license newb)
[21:44] <lns> can i copy the license statement from somewhere? ;)
[21:44] <LaserJock> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/License
[21:44] <lns> nice
[21:44] <lns> thx
[21:45] <LaserJock> notice that at the bottom of the page (and every other page on help.ubuntu.com/community) there is a link "Legal" and a little badge that says CC By-SA
[21:45] <LaserJock> the CC-By-SA is a common documentation license from Creative Commons
[21:46] <LaserJock> GFDL is also used a fair amount, it's from FSF like GPL
[21:54] <lns> LaserJock, ok cool - here we go: http://lns.wikidot.com/license
[21:54] <lns> i just dunno if i need to reference the ubuntu wiki license page to be able to have copied that info...
[21:55] <LaserJock> it looks nice
[21:56] <lns> cool..just added a ref..we should be good to go ;)
[21:56] <LaserJock> awesome
[21:57] <lns> anyway my wiki really isn't much of anything yet.. i just want to help everyone else out like they've helped me out. i hope it will become much more of a good reference in the future as i have time to gather and place information in it.
[21:59] <LaserJock> sure


[02:54] <tsimonq2> well, got a good portion of them done
[16:15] <flocculant> jjfrv8: remember the pavucontrol mute bug? here it's related to logitech webcam - same with someone else on https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=93108 - same for you? If not could you comment on it :)
[22:01] <cajuntechie> Hi everyone. Quick question: My C++ chops are really rusty (like 5-8 years old) but I want to get involved in the project. Any room for a pythong dev?
[22:12] <jjfrv8> flocculant, will try to look into the pavucontrol thing later this evening.


[01:32] <slangasek> who would like to ring in the new year by accepting libsdl1.2 from binary new and making ia32-libs-multiarch installable in precise? :)
[02:21] <doko> slangasek, done. although the year didn't end here
[15:09] <slangasek> doko: thanks :)