[09:01] <ochosi> hi everyone, i'm back
[09:02] <Noskcaj> hey ochosi
[09:03] <ochosi> hey Noskcaj
[09:03] <ochosi> what's up?
[09:07] <Noskcaj> not much
[09:07] <Noskcaj> just trying to get the stupid devel pc to work
[09:07] <Noskcaj> you?
[09:09] <elfy> hi ochosi :)
[09:32] <ochosi> i was in the mountains
[09:32] <ochosi> hence no connectivity for a few days
[09:33] <ochosi> just saying, the upcoming week will be a bit difficult again, moving countries again
[09:33] <elfy> okeydoke
[09:34] <ochosi> anyway, saw the sru made progress, so that's good to hear
[09:34] <ochosi> thanks a bunch for that bluesabre
[09:34] <ochosi> (and everyone else involved)
[09:34] <ochosi> what else did i miss?
[09:34] <elfy> tumbleweed mostly from what I can see :)
[09:35] <elfy> I've seen about 10 lines in here since you said "just as a notice, i'll be offline from tomorrow until the weekend"
[09:36] <ochosi> heh
[09:36] <ochosi> well could be that i missed stuff on other channels
[09:36] <ochosi> or that you decided to create a channel where you can nag about me :)
[09:36] <elfy> :)
[09:36] <elfy> I'd do that in here :p
[09:39] <ochosi> heh
[10:30] <ochosi> bluesabre: reminder about the upload-rights application
[10:36] <elfy> ochosi: you got any idea when the blueprints have to be finalised and approved by -release?
[10:48] <ochosi> elfy: not really tbh
[10:48] <ochosi> knome: how did you handle that ^ ?
[10:50] <elfy> ochosi: knome is off till Monday afaik
[10:52] <ochosi> ah ok
[10:52] <ochosi> will try to figure that out asap though
[10:52] <ochosi> having said that, we don't have many workitems on our blueprints for this release anyhow
[10:58] <bluesabre> ochosi: been making steady progress on that
[10:58] <bluesabre> will finish today
[10:59] <ochosi> nice!
[10:59] <ochosi> just thought as i had been away i'd put up a reminder
[11:01] <bluesabre> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SeanDavis/DeveloperApplication
[11:01] <bluesabre> just gotta add fluff to the bottom
[11:02] <bluesabre> ochosi, elfy, want to brainstorm together today about what we want to add to the blueprints for this release
[11:02] <bluesabre> I'd be game
[11:02] <bluesabre> :)
[11:02] <bluesabre> I'll be around most of the day
[11:03] <bluesabre> brb, starbucks run
[11:06] <ochosi> bluesabre: i'll run off for lunch in a bit, but i'll also be back after that
[11:23] <ochosi> bbabl
[13:04] <Unit193> ochosi: I could use an Xubu ack from you, but not sure it's needed. :P
[14:02] <knome> i'm back
[14:02] <bluesabre> wb knome
[14:02] <knome> ta ta bluesabre
[14:03] <elfy> hi knome wb
[14:03] <knome> ochosi, technically by feature freeze, but anything that suits you
[14:03] <knome> hey elfy, and ta :)
[14:03] <elfy> bluesabre: I'm about off and on all day - when ochosi is I'm game for that
[14:04] <Unit193> knome: We should review blueprints. :(
[14:04] <knome> Unit193, yeah? who we? :P
[14:05] <bluesabre> knome, well, now we have me/ochosi/Unit193/elfy/you
[14:05] <bluesabre> :)
[14:05] <knome> basically the XPL should approve the direction
[16:29] <Unit193> knome: Okay.
[16:34] <ochosi> Unit193: what xubuntu ack where?
[16:35] <Unit193> ochosi: lp #1000416, unless I'm wrong?
[16:38] <ochosi> done
[16:38] <ochosi> thanks Unit193
[16:38] <Unit193> Thank you.
[16:38] <ochosi> wasn't aware of that bugreport
[16:40] <ochosi> bluesabre: great, that (someone having trouble with nouveau drivers) is exactly what i hate about the black-screen bug. people just think any bug with suspending is related to this one... :/
[16:40] <ochosi> thanks for debugging that though with the user
[16:46] <Unit193> Same thing for the other package I presume?
[16:47] <ochosi> other package?
[16:56] <bluesabre> ochosi: yup
[16:57] <ochosi> elfy: around?
[16:59] <elfy> for ~ 10 minutes - be about properly in an hour or so
[16:59] <ochosi> hmkay
[16:59] <ochosi> well let's start with the 10minutes then
[16:59] <ochosi> i guess we have everything bp-related on trello already?
[16:59] <elfy> afaik we have
[16:59] <ochosi> ok
[17:00] <ochosi> as i said, we don't have many blueprints at the moment
[17:01] <elfy> yep
[17:01] <ochosi> i guess the two transitions we have ahead this cycle is upower0.99 and systemd
[17:01] <ochosi> apart from that, so far we haven't really put down any features
[17:01] <elfy> not sure that systemd will be this cycle
[17:02] <ochosi> right
[17:02] <elfy> it's about and usable is all I think
[17:02] <ochosi> hm, well i guess we don't have to do much about that
[17:02] <ochosi> there are more problems with upower
[17:02] <ochosi> because xfce4-session needs to be patched
[17:03] <ochosi> the thing is: i'd want to get rid of light-locker-settings in 14.10 or 15.04 the latest
[17:03] <ochosi> include everything we need in xfce4-power-manager
[17:03] <ochosi> but then again, this will be done upstream, that's why it's not a workitem here
[17:03] <ochosi> elfy: if you wanna test the new power-manager by the way, would be great to get more feedback on it
[17:04] <ochosi> i can see that we get some ppa or something set up
[17:04] <elfy> needs to be somewhere even if it's not a workitem so the team know about what's going on
[17:04] <elfy> I'd obviously be happy to do that - better on ppa I guess
[17:04] <ochosi> Unit193: could you set up something daily for xfpm?
[17:05] <elfy> though how much testing we'd see by testers I'm not very convinced over
[17:05] <elfy> dead as a dodo - seems to be *buntu not just us though
[17:05] <ochosi> yeah, no worries
[17:06] <ochosi> the next release is no LTS
[17:06] <elfy> ochosi: I can though test it on hardware - laptop and desktop
[17:06] <ochosi> i understand that having a team is great, but as long as at least we ourselves test the things we work on a lot, that's already okayish
[17:06] <elfy> :)
[17:06] <ochosi> yes, actually for xfpm laptop+desktop would be great
[17:06] <ochosi> i only have a laptop, so..
[17:07] <elfy> yep
[17:07] <ochosi> just recently included some optimizations for desktops
[17:07] <ochosi> the other thing we could mention is the upcoming parole release that we've started working towards
[17:08] <elfy> cool
[17:08] <ochosi> bluesabre: any other ideas for blueprint items etc?
[17:08] <bluesabre> display settings?
[17:08] <ochosi> right, that too
[17:09] <bluesabre> any date yet for 4.12? still up in the air, I presume?
[17:09] <ochosi> but other than the upstream work we're doing :)
[17:09] <ochosi> i talked to NSchermer a longer while ago (~3weeks) and we're targetting october
[17:09] <ochosi> which is too late for 14.10
[17:09] <ochosi> but nvm, i'd say
[17:09] <ochosi> i'm hoping that quite a bit of hacking is going down in the summer
[17:09] <elfy> I've gtg - back in a while
[17:09] <ochosi> ok, ttyl elfy
[17:10] <ochosi> bluesabre: mind to add parole and display-settings to the trello board?
[17:10] <bluesabre> sure
[17:10] <bluesabre> oh, and keyboard overlay, I might get to that shortly
[17:10] <bluesabre> been pretty motivated lately :)
[17:10] <ochosi> and then i guess we should create daily recipes for these items and throw them at our xubuntu-dev PPA
[17:10] <ochosi> hehe, yeah, quite nice actually
[17:11] <ochosi> i've also trying to get things done
[17:11] <ochosi> +been
[17:11] <ochosi> what's the state of the display dialog btw?
[17:12] <ochosi> i haven't been able to test multihead for a few weeks now...
[17:12] <bluesabre> just some testing and minor fixes left
[17:12] <Unit193> ochosi: Is imported?
[17:12] <bluesabre> its more reliable now than its been before
[17:12] <ochosi> Unit193: please pleeeease, you have to be more verbose with me...
[17:12] <bluesabre> been using vbox to test crazy multihead (4-8 displays) setups
[17:13] <ochosi> bluesabre: awesome sauce. not sure btw if we shouldn't postpone the cairo-drawn minimal dialog a bit to get what we have out
[17:13] <Unit193> I have to English?
[17:13] <bluesabre> yeah
[17:13] <bluesabre> if you get to it, great, if not, great too :D
[17:14] <ochosi> Unit193: :) thing is 1) i haven't been around for a few days, then i always feel a bit lost in the beginning
[17:14] <ochosi> 2) i'm not a mindreader and i don't always have everything nicely organized in my head
[17:14] <ochosi> so 1) what other package and 2) daily setup for xfpm and display dialog?
[17:14] <Unit193> Heh, my brain is dead too.  Is Xfpm imported into LP somewhere?
[17:15] <ochosi> ah :)
[17:15] <ochosi> tbh i'm not sure
[17:15] <ochosi> it has been dead for so long, that i could imagine that there is some dead import somewhere
[17:15] <ochosi> but you'll see that anyhow when you try to set up the import ;)
[17:15] <Unit193> Also, I can't publish to -dev, so...
[17:15] <bluesabre> looks like vcs-imports are blocked
[17:15] <bluesabre> https://code.launchpad.net/~vcs-imports/xfce4-power-manager/trunk
[17:16] <ochosi> Unit193: can you set it up so either me or bluesabre can copy it there?
[17:16] <ochosi> i mean the recipe
[17:16] <bluesabre> recipes are easy, but that import needs to be cleared
[17:16] <Unit193> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/73117280/vcs-imports-xfce4-power-manager-trunk.log how useful.
[17:17] <Unit193> bluesabre: 0.3.0+date! :P
[17:17]  * ochosi looks
[17:17] <bluesabre> I used to do version numbers like that
[17:17] <bluesabre> until launchpad told me no
[17:17] <bluesabre> :D
[17:18] <Unit193> bluesabre: It's because they're cheating, it's annoying.  You can set it as non-native, but LP forces daily builds as 3 (native) which can't have a dash.
[17:19] <ochosi> so, err, what can we do to resolve that?
[17:19] <Unit193> Poke #launchpad?
[17:20]  * ochosi join #launchpad
[17:20] <ochosi> huhu
[17:20] <ochosi> i guess that channel won't be very active on a sunday...
[17:25] <Unit193> Well, and other pkg is xfdash. :P
[17:25] <ochosi> yeah, but frankly, i'm fine with that one in a PPA for now
[17:26] <ochosi> it's still in active development and hasn't really "settled"
[17:26] <Unit193> Alrighty-o.
[17:26] <ochosi> it didn't feel "ready" last time i tried it
[17:26] <Unit193> Wasn't sure if 0.2.0 was a sign or not.
[17:26] <Unit193> Then, I'll forget about that one, cool.
[17:31] <ochosi> yeah, could be, but we should get it some testing first
[17:31] <ochosi> haven't even tried it myself yet...
[17:36] <Unit193> Noskcaj: Around?  xfce4-dev-tools in Debian, I'm pretty sure the homepage isn't "foo-projects.org", whereas http://users.xfce.org/~benny/projects/xfce4-dev-tools/ might not be the best, it's sure better. :)
[17:39] <Unit193> 4.11.0 is in Debian Experimental, too.
[17:39] <ochosi> good
[17:44] <Unit193> 4.11.0 also hit exp, but that'd have to be merged.
[17:51] <elfy> ochosi: back if you need me still
[17:53] <ochosi> i guess we'll try to set up PPAs for you for parole, xfce4-power-manager, xfce4-settings
[17:53] <Unit193> >_<
[17:53] <Unit193> 4.11.0 of xfce4-session, I need sleep.
[17:53] <ochosi> we'll sort that out with Unit193 and bluesabre i guess
[17:54] <Unit193> ochosi: Didn't you already have a parole one?
[17:54] <elfy> ochosi: ok
[17:54] <ochosi> Unit193: yeah, there's one for parole already
[17:54] <elfy> ppa?
[17:54] <ochosi> but i want everything in one place when we ask people to test
[17:54] <elfy> aah - saved me typing that out :)
[17:54] <ochosi> heh
[17:54] <bluesabre> :)
[17:54] <ochosi> well, i guess i can always copy over packages manually from the daily PPA to testing
[17:55] <bluesabre> parole-daily is in my personal https://launchpad.net/~smd-seandavis/+archive/xfce-4.12-daily
[17:55] <bluesabre> (ignore that crap panel build)
[17:55] <ochosi> actually you could move your stuff to xubuntu-dev, now that you have access...
[17:56] <ochosi> doesn't really make sense to keep things too personal anymore i guess
[17:56] <ochosi> after all, you *are* the xubuntu-dev lead ;)
[17:56] <bluesabre> yeah, not sure we have anything really fitting of daily builds
[17:56] <elfy> :)
[17:58] <bluesabre> I'll consider transitioning a few over today
[17:58] <bluesabre> still working on fixing this place up :)
[17:59] <ochosi> heh sure
[17:59] <elfy> bluesabre: just keep it quiet till the XPL disappears for days again :p
[17:59]  * ochosi cuts some slack and hands it to bluesabre
[17:59] <ochosi> eeeeh, do i sense some sarcasm there? :p
[17:59] <bluesabre> :D
[18:00] <ochosi> at least i announce my disappearance
[18:00] <bluesabre> :D
[18:00]  * elfy could have just sent some slack - I've got it all packed in easy to handle quantities :)
[18:00]  * ochosi cuts himself some slack
[18:00] <elfy> ochosi: ha ha ha
[18:00]  * bluesabre has a slack sandwich
[18:00] <elfy> been cutting slack for ~40 years so have some kicking about
[18:00] <ochosi> yummy
[18:01] <elfy> I just realised that I completely screwed up the meeting this week
[18:01] <elfy> set it for the 25th :|
[18:01] <elfy> ochosi: meant to set it for tomorrow for you
[18:02] <Unit193> ochosi: Had you reviewed the proposals for Utopic?
[18:02] <elfy> and slickymaster asked me if I could move it and I STILL didn't notice
[18:02] <ochosi> elfy: oops, didn't notice that myself...
[18:02] <ochosi> i guess it's a bit late to change that now
[18:02] <elfy> I guess so
[18:02] <ochosi> i'll try to be there, but as i'm moving on friday, i can#
[18:02] <ochosi> t promise
[18:03] <elfy> yea
[18:03] <ochosi> only so few days left here..
[18:03] <elfy> you're choosing the next one
[18:03] <ochosi> Unit193: which ones?
[18:03] <ochosi> elfy: well that'll be comparably easy, as i'll be home..
[18:03] <elfy> :)
[18:03] <Unit193> ochosi: Mainly the ones that'd touch the seed, want that uploaded.  Desktop revamp/inxi/hexchat.
[18:04] <Unit193> elfy: We could actually test without the new seed, were we going to test apt-get method?
[18:04] <elfy> inxi is great - till people use it in channel
[18:04] <elfy> Unit193: remind me about that
[18:04] <Unit193> /exec - -o inxi -c0 -Gxxx | pastebinit
[18:04] <Unit193> elfy: Hmm?
[18:04] <elfy> Unit193: yes - you know, I know - not everyone does
[18:05] <Unit193> Hah. :D
[18:05] <ochosi> ok, first off, whatever happened to testing -core?
[18:05] <ochosi> then, could you link me up Unit193 ?
[18:05] <Unit193> ochosi: Was stalled on uploading seed, which was stalled on proposals.
[18:06] <Unit193> But, if we don't want to test  apt-get install --no-install-recommends  as it's not really the supported way to install...
[18:06] <elfy> oh right
[18:07] <ochosi> remind me, why was it stalled on proposals?
[18:07] <Unit193> Because inxi and hexchat would be seed changes.
[18:07] <Unit193> (If accepted, and the second one really should be. :P )
[18:08] <ochosi> right, but how does that affect core though?
[18:08] <elfy> hexchat is good - but I wonder how responsive devs are for it
[18:08] <ochosi> frankly, i have no idea how active xchat is
[18:09] <ochosi> haven't used it in sooo long...
[18:09] <Unit193> elfy: Better than ones that haven't done a thing in years.  The maintainer is good, talked to him before.
[18:09] <elfy> I think xchat is moribund
[18:09] <ochosi> Unit193: that sounds good
[18:09] <Unit193> ochosi: Oh, I don't either, but built-in SASL?  I'm sold already.
[18:09] <ochosi> Unit193: didn't you write a proposal for hexchat before? link plz?
[18:09] <Unit193> Only reason not to is xchat-indicator, and that could be fixed with https://launchpad.net/hexchat-indicator
[18:10] <elfy> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Roadmap/Specifications/Utopic/Hexchat
[18:10] <elfy> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Roadmap/Specifications/Utopic/Inxi
[18:10] <Unit193> Sniped.
[18:10] <elfy> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Roadmap/Specifications/Utopic/DesktopLayoutProposal
[18:10] <ochosi> so xchat pulls in the indicator by default?
[18:10] <elfy> Unit193: hexchat at the moment - alt+a fails to set away
[18:11] <elfy> and ctrl+f does funky things with window sizing
[18:11] <ochosi> Unit193: so wait, does xchat actually set the default channel to #xubuntu?
[18:11] <Unit193> https://github.com/hexchat/hexchat/issues/1008
[18:11] <Unit193> ochosi: No.
[18:11] <Unit193> ochosi: That was simply a question that was answered.
[18:11] <elfy> Unit193: yes I know - bug 1328087 as well :)
[18:11] <elfy> bug 1328089
[18:12] <elfy> that last one is really annoying
[18:12] <Unit193> elfy: Figured you would, not sure if reporting to LP will help. :P
[18:12] <elfy> I know - but people installing it *here* are less likely to go looking at github ;)
[18:12] <ochosi> Unit193: hmm, blows a bit that we can't do that, but i guess since we weren't able to do that before...
[18:12] <Unit193> Indeed.  Well, TingPing is a hexchat dev, and commented stating that was indeed a bug, so there's hope.
[18:13] <Unit193> ochosi: Actually, since you know the desktop team, can you poke them about that plugin I linked to? :D
[18:14] <ochosi> Unit193: i can try to get to that tomorrow (today that channel is dead anyway)
[18:14] <ochosi> feel free to remind me though if i forget
[18:14] <Unit193> Of course, all Canonical would be.
[18:14] <Unit193> Sure, I will.
[18:17] <elfy> ochosi Unit193 - commenting in the github bug for alt+a - shall I mention we're thinking about seeding it
[18:18] <Unit193> Is there a reason to?
[18:18] <elfy> might make them think about fixing it sooner :p
[18:19] <ochosi> yeah, although some ppl take that the wrong way
[18:19] <ochosi> pressure != motivation
[18:19] <ochosi> so i'd rather not apply distro-pressure
[18:19] <ochosi> in case we get closer to the release, we can always kindly ask with reference to us seeding it
[18:20] <elfy> yea I understand that - wasn't going to say "We were thinking of seeding it but we aren't if something as simple as this doesn't work"
[18:20] <ochosi> heh
[18:20] <ochosi> ok
[18:20] <ochosi> in that case, i'm also fine with referencing our plans now
[18:21] <elfy> too late - just left a 'it's broken in xubuntu' for the moment
[18:21] <ochosi> we can always add that comment a bit later
[18:21] <elfy> yep
[18:22] <elfy> not sure what to do about the odd resizing thing though - guess I should report it there
[18:32] <ochosi> sounds like a plan
[18:32] <ochosi> Unit193: does inxi only work for graphics card?
[18:32] <ochosi> or did you just mention that as an example
[18:33] <Unit193> ochosi: Haha, no.  That was a good example because of all the problems with them.  Install it and run -h
[18:34] <ochosi> that sounds like it makes a lot of sense
[18:34] <ochosi> actually both of your specs
[18:35] <Unit193> I kind of packaged it thinking of #xubuntu. :P
[18:35] <ochosi> awesome
[18:35] <elfy> hadn't noticed that ... :p
[18:36] <ochosi> Unit193: mind to add the specs to the agenda?
[18:37] <ochosi> i personally think we should go ahead with both, but i'd like to give the team a chance to raise concerns if anybody has any
[18:37] <Unit193> I can once I make coffee, if the wiki is in a good mood.
[18:37] <ochosi> nice
[18:37] <ochosi> thanks Unit193
[18:39] <ochosi> brb
[18:42] <elfy> Unit193: https://github.com/hexchat/hexchat/issues/1030
[18:55] <elfy> well - that's refreshing ... a comment 5 minutes after I posted it
[18:58]  * Unit193 clicks again.
[19:00] <ochosi> brb
[21:03] <ochosi> bluesabre: speaking of feeling motivated, we could also look into building a UI for panel-switch by ali1234
[21:03] <ochosi> unless lderan gets to it first ;)
[21:06] <bluesabre> ochosi: got something for me to base it on/link to code?
[21:09] <ali1234> https://github.com/ali1234/panel-switch
[21:10] <ali1234> it's only a python proof of concept
[21:10] <bluesabre> ok, good, I <3 python
[21:11] <bluesabre> gotta run for a bit, bbl
[21:16] <ochosi> ok tty in a bit bluesabre
[21:17] <ochosi> Unit193: no excuse anymore now: https://code.launchpad.net/~vcs-imports/xfce4-power-manager/trunk
[21:17] <ochosi> ;)
[21:21] <Unit193> Bummer.
[21:21] <Unit193> bluesabre: ^
[21:21] <Unit193> :--D
[21:31] <Unit193> ochosi: So, the idea is to leave the patches in and hope they don't break?
[21:31] <ochosi> what patches?
[21:31] <ochosi> for xfpm?
[21:32] <ochosi> if you're referring to xfpm, the idea is to drop all ubuntu patches, because they have been taken care of upstream
[21:32] <Unit193> Oh?  Hm.
[21:32] <ochosi> which is one more reason why we want this release in xubuntu (kill the delta)
[21:38] <Noskcaj> ochosi, Should i be packaging the version in debian vcs then?
[21:40] <ochosi> not sure what the status of 1.3.0 is in debian
[21:41] <ochosi> or whether debian wants the development release
[21:41] <ochosi> i mostly wanted to enable xubuntu to do more testing
[21:42] <Noskcaj> debian will be uploading it soon because upower 0.99
[21:42] <Noskcaj> same for us
[21:44] <Unit193> Thus we wait for Debian to release, of PPA it until then.
[21:44]  * Unit193 calls not it, to panel.
[23:47] <Unit193> ochosi: Sooo, where should I dump it anywho?
[23:48] <Unit193> https://code.launchpad.net/~unit193/+archive/staging That's where I jammed it for now.
[23:48] <ochosi> i guess we should stage it in a personal PPA of yours, then test a little then move over to the xubuntu-dev PPA
[23:48] <ochosi> perfect
[23:49] <Unit193> Might be handy to keep it someplace I can upload/change it. ;)
[23:50] <ochosi> indeed, which is why you should become member of -dev
[23:51] <Unit193> But. but, but. :(
[23:52] <Unit193> You'll like this, when I went to commit changes, automatically typed `git commit` before I noticed. :D
[23:53] <ochosi> hihi


[16:01]  * slangasek waves
[16:01] <slangasek> #startmeeting
[16:01] <meetingology> Meeting started Wed Jan 16 16:01:58 2013 UTC.  The chair is slangasek. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[16:01] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[16:02] <jodh> o/
[16:03]  * stgraber waves
[16:03] <slangasek> [TOPIC] lightning round
[16:04] <slangasek> $ echo $(shuf -e barry doko stgraber jodh ev bdmurray slangasek ogra cjwatson xnox stokachu)
[16:04] <slangasek> bdmurray stokachu stgraber xnox jodh doko barry slangasek cjwatson ev ogra
[16:04] <slangasek> bdmurray: you're on :)
[16:04] <bdmurray> rolled out errors branch allowing for source package searching
[16:04] <bdmurray> pushed errors branch fixing issue with width of the frequency bar
[16:04] <bdmurray> pushed daisy branch creating a counter for release:src_package to facilitate regression detection
[16:04] <bdmurray> discussion with evan regarding error tracker and phased updates
[16:04] <bdmurray> updated https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ErrorTracker/PhasedUpdates
[16:05] <bdmurray> tested team view change to errors in canonistack
[16:05] <bdmurray> submitted an RT to have webstats for errors.ubuntu.com
[16:05] <bdmurray> discovered, researched and reported bug 1098250 regarding suspendresume crashes
[16:05] <bdmurray> investigation into inability to report distribution upgrade crashes from quantal to raring
[16:05] <bdmurray> created a test case for bug 1077253 regarding apport
[16:05] <bdmurray> ubuntu-release-upgrader branch fixing bugs 1072828, 1068874, 1093697, 1098001, 1067542
[16:05] <bdmurray> verification of Q SRU for aptdaemon bug 1060505
[16:05] <bdmurray> uploaded P,Q SRU for aptdaemon bug 1078544
[16:05] <bdmurray> uploaded udev to R and a P SRU for bug 1099278
[16:05] <bdmurray> resolved an issue with arsenal not completely removing bug tasks
[16:05] <bdmurray> ⌁ done ⌁
[16:06] <stokachu_> - Working on a lot of internal SEG projects this month, nothing public facing to report this week. done.
[16:06] <stgraber>  - Upstart (BLUEPRINT: foundations-r-upstart-user-session-enhancements)
[16:06] <stgraber>   - Working on the session socket code, going through reviews/fixes cycles now.
[16:06] <stgraber>   - Poking at a libnih bug preventing the upstart-event-bridge from working as a user.
[16:06] <stgraber>   - Talks on shutdown/reboot/logout sequence.
[16:06] <stgraber>  - Container (BLUEPRINT: servercloud-r-lxc)
[16:06] <stgraber>   - Code reviews.
[16:06] <stgraber>   - LXC upstream now supports user namespaces.
[16:06] <stgraber>   - Ported libcap to bionic, got LXC to build agsinst it.
[16:06] <stgraber>   - Re-implemented utmpx.h within LXC when building with bionic.
[16:06] <stgraber>  - Other
[16:06] <stgraber>   - Tracked down a cups-browsed bug causing a lot of upstart job respawns when avahi isn't enabled.
[16:06] <stgraber>   - Some follow-up on a weird biosdevname issue.
[16:07] <stgraber>   - Upgraded to a 3.8 kernel, helped track down a regression on ThinkPad x230/t430, fix sent upstream by Seth.
[16:07] <stgraber>   - Helped Serge track down my weird mount/loop device bug (loop devices aren't freeed under weird conditions).
[16:07] <stgraber>   - Got some new monitors with fancy DisplayPort chaining, so I've been fixing a few gnome-control-center bugs and helping debug kernel bugs.
[16:07] <stgraber>  - Networking (BLUEPRINT: foundations-r-networking)
[16:07] <stgraber>   - Some e-mails/bug activity on isc-dhcp-server-ldap not actually having LDAP support in 4.2.
[16:07] <stgraber>  - TODO
[16:07] <stgraber>   - Go through the isc-dhcp and resolvconf bugs.
[16:07] <stgraber>   - Try to apply redhat's fiberchannel patchset to our isc-dhcp.
[16:07] <stgraber> (DONE)
[16:07] <xnox> * usb-creator-fastboot:
[16:07] <xnox>  - made fastboot work to flash nexus7 images without sudo
[16:07] <xnox>  - made usbcreator to pop-up when nexus7 is plugged in (in a branch)
[16:07] <xnox>  - todo fastboot backend (reusing recipes from nexus7-installer)
[16:07] <xnox> * lp:~xnox/upstart/user-log-dir
[16:07] <xnox>  - user upstart logging, work in progress (some review comments to address)
[16:07] <xnox> * patch pilot tuesday (report sent)
[16:08] <xnox> * unbreak devscripts, usb-creator
[16:08] <xnox> * upload ubiquity and minor merges (dmraid, pyxdg)
[16:08] <xnox> * discussed with server team that we want to keep clustered lvm
[16:08] <xnox>   support (dropped in debian)
[16:08] <xnox> ..
[16:08] <jodh> - Blueprint:
[16:08] <jodh>   - Upstart setenv+getenv MP raised. Working on '--global' option. Further
[16:08] <jodh>     feedback appreciated:
[16:08] <jodh>     https://code.launchpad.net/~jamesodhunt/upstart/setenv+getenv/+merge/142939
[16:08] <jodh>   - Reviewed lp:~xnox/upstart/user-log-dir.
[16:08] <jodh>   - Reviewed lp:~stgraber/upstart/upstart-session-socket.
[16:08] <jodh>   - Added Shutdown details to Enhanced Sessions Spec - awaiting feedback:
[16:08] <jodh>     https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FoundationsTeam/Specs/RaringUpstartUserSessions#Shutdown_Details
[16:08] <jodh>   - Started work on preliminary shutdown code.
[16:08] <jodh> - SRU:
[16:08] <jodh>   - Investigating ARM build failure for SRU bug 980917.
[16:08] <jodh> - Other:
[16:08] <jodh>   - Investigating a customer issue.
[16:08] <jodh>   - Investigated ureadahead bug 1085766
[16:08] <jodh>   - Fixed bug 1096531 - awaiting feedback:
[16:08] <jodh>     https://code.launchpad.net/~jamesodhunt/upstart/bug-1096531/+merge/143314
[16:09] <jodh> 🀟
[16:09] <jodh>
[16:09] <doko> - OpenJDK 7 security update
[16:09] <doko> - get creduce built and packaged, using it to scale down preprocessed source files
[16:09] <doko> - got multiarch patches into the 4.6 and 4.7 gcc branches
[16:09] <doko> - GCC 4.8 update
[16:09] <doko> - buildd baby sitting
[16:09] <doko> - merged remaining GCC bits from the cross toolchains back into GCC
[16:09] <doko> - updated the armhf, arm64 and powerpc cross compilers
[16:09] <doko> (done)
[16:10] <barry> oneconf: re-enable py2 support and bug 1088536; also enabled autopkgtests. ported lazr.config to py3; released lazr.config, lazr.delegates, lazr.smtptest.  looked into bug 1097783.  python security issues.  distribute bug #349 (crash on setup.py with BOM).  done.
[16:13] <cjwatson> jodh: ARM> yeah, I've been retrying it from time to time, to no avail :-/
[16:13] <ev> Geez! Hurry up, slangasek. I want to make a tea.
[16:14] <slangasek> ev: :P
[16:14] <ogra_> just make a strong tea then :)
[16:15] <slangasek>  * travel last week through Wednesday, then was out sick over the weekend + Monday with the flu, so little to report
[16:15] <slangasek>  * have been working to help the Kylin team get oriented so they can meet alpha2 for 13.04
[16:15] <slangasek>  * recovery mode has regressed due to the recent mountall SRU, so working on fixing that (bug #1099349)
[16:15] <slangasek> (done)
[16:16] <cjwatson> Build fixes: pyparted (with Tim), sivp, gnumeric
[16:16] <cjwatson> 12.04.2: Switched to X enablement stack for relevant images; cleaned up various associated issues due to having to use metapackages.
[16:16] <cjwatson> Phased updates: Reviewed spec and discussed with ev/bdmurray/wgrant; fixed up some glitches in update-manager; started on Launchpad implementation.
[16:16] <cjwatson> Cross-building: Further work on backporting architecture qualifier support to Debian buildds; met up with Wookey for status check.
[16:16] <cjwatson> Continued work on removing nested functions from GRUB.
[16:16] <cjwatson> Hard thinking about the situation where the language and location selected during installation don't identify a valid locale (bug 1094872).
[16:16] <cjwatson> Looking at entropy pool issues at first boot (bug 1098299).
[16:16] <cjwatson> ..
[16:17] <ev> - Continued work on the prodstack error tracker deployment.
[16:17] <ev>   - I've moved my testing over to EC2 from canonistack. Between the resource
[16:17] <ev>     limits (I couldn't spawn 15+ instances) and frequently getting instances in
[16:17] <ev>     the error state, canonistack was really slowing me down.
[16:17] <ev>     We need to fix this though. EC2 is expensive ($15 for two days usage), and
[16:17] <ev>     the error tracker infrastructure now cannot fit on canonistack without
[16:17] <ev>     modifying people's resource limits, which hinders our ability to test and
[16:17] <ev>     on-ramp developers.
[16:17] <ev>   - Fixing bugs in charms along the way. Pushed one fix to jjo for Cassandra,
[16:17] <ev>     and filed bug 1099917 for the other.
[16:17] <ev>   - Fixed bug 1100245 in juju with https://code.launchpad.net/~ev/juju/fix-1100245/+merge/143483
[16:17] <ev>   - A few bugs to iron out, but we're close. Webops is supposed to be picking
[16:17] <ev>     this up and throwing it at stagingstack, but they're firefighting.
[16:17] <ev> - Code review for Brian. Discussions on the implementation of phased updates.
[16:18] <ogra_> done ?
[16:18] <slangasek> he paused for breath
[16:18] <ogra_> doesnt sound like breath :)
[16:19] <ogra_> more like chatting :P
[16:20] <jodh> cjwatson: thanks :) We have fixed the issue in newer releases so I'll cherry-pick the relevant bits and make a .2 release for precise.
[16:20] <ev> - Code review for Brian. Discussions on the implementation of phased updates.
[16:20] <ev> - Started implementing "silent error types" after discussion with Martin:
[16:20] <ev>   https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ErrorTracker#error
[16:20] <ev> (DONE)
[16:20] <ogra_> done:
[16:20] <ogra_>  * started fiddling with porting the nx7 images to xz compression
[16:20] <ogra_>  * looked into porting update-notifier to pkexec (then only xdiagnose will keep gksu on the cd)
[16:20] <ogra_>  * started on fiddling with tegra3 gstreamer codecs, seems there is half a community port to gst 1.0 already
[16:20] <ogra_> todo:
[16:20] <ogra_>  * discuss livefs builder situation with infinity (carried over from last week)
[16:20] <ogra_>  * fix plymouth vs console-setup racing somehow (likely needs cjwatson advice) to allow initrd-less booting
[16:20] <ogra_> ..
[16:21] <slangasek> cool
[16:21] <slangasek> [TOPIC] Bugs
[16:21] <slangasek> bdmurray?
[16:22] <bdmurray> bug 1093819 looks interesting
[16:23] <bdmurray> I have not tested it myself though
[16:23] <slangasek> cjwatson: any idea about that one?  where are we running dpkg --add-architecture now?
[16:24] <cjwatson> apt-setup
[16:24] <cjwatson> generators/01setup
[16:25] <cjwatson> controlled by apt-setup/multiarch preseeding, which defaults to "i386" on amd64 and empty on all other arches
[16:25] <slangasek> is it possible preseeding isn't working right under wubi?
[16:25] <cjwatson> don't see wubi preseeding that
[16:25] <xnox> and there is dpkg maint script to add i386.
[16:25] <slangasek> ah
[16:25] <cjwatson> slangasek: it would have to be actively preseeding it *off*
[16:26] <cjwatson> should be easy to look in the preinstalled image and check, I guess
[16:26] <cjwatson> oh yes, of course, preinstalled image so it might not run apt-setup
[16:26]  * cjwatson forgets the exact details of the new setup - ev?
[16:26] <cjwatson> even so, dpkg.postinst should take care of it
[16:27] <ev> oh hi
[16:27] <ev> it's been a while for me too :), but:
[16:28] <ev> compressed disk image unpacked, then small initramfs tomfoolery
[16:28] <ev> for initial setup
[16:29] <cjwatson> how much of ubiquity does it go through, if anyy?
[16:29] <cjwatson> *any
[16:29] <ev> none
[16:29] <cjwatson> ok, so it's purely about the preinstalled image
[16:30] <ev> lupin -> scripts/local-bottom/lupin_setup
[16:30]  * cjwatson peers at cdimage
[16:30] <cjwatson> oh great, it's a tar of a root.disk so I can't easily inspect it locally ...
[16:30]  * ev whistles
[16:31] <ev> hey man, I just make the tea around this place. Any name you find in bzr blame that looks similar to mine is purely coincidental.
[16:31] <cjwatson> so, er, somebody with vaguely fast networking might like to download/unpack/loop-mount http://releases.ubuntu.com/12.10/ubuntu-12.10-wubi-amd64.tar.xz and see what its dpkg metadata looks like
[16:32] <bdmurray> so then an automatic upgrade test is failing in bug 1096022
[16:33] <slangasek> bdmurray: can you follow up on that download/unpack/loop-mount after the meeting, then?
[16:33] <bdmurray> slangasek: yes, downloading now
[16:34] <slangasek> cool
[16:34] <slangasek> bdmurray: hum, so this is a *new* upgrade failure in the jenkins autotester?
[16:34] <bdmurray> slangasek: that's the impression I got
[16:35] <slangasek> do we know what date it started happening?  Maybe we can trace it to a particular SRU's publication
[16:35] <bdmurray> hrm, actually it looks intermittent
[16:35] <bdmurray> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Precise/view/Upgrade%20Testing%20Dashboard/job/precise-upgrade-lucid-universe/ARCH=amd64,LTS=lts,PROFILE=universe,label=upgrade-test/
[16:36] <slangasek> oh, well then :P
[16:36] <bdmurray> Okay, I'll look at that in more depth.
[16:37] <bdmurray> Who could I talk to about understanding the pkgProblemResolver logs though?
[16:37]  * slangasek raises his hand
[16:37] <bdmurray> great
[16:37] <bdmurray> somebody in my timezone even!
[16:38] <bdmurray> I ran across bug 1077551 again and it seems worrisome to me
[16:39] <slangasek> something's strange about that jenkins build, though; why is Dec 27, 2012 the oldest run of the job?
[16:39] <slangasek> did we lose history?
[16:39] <bdmurray> there was a comment from glatzor regarding 'We already don't allow to remove "essential" packages by using aptdaemon, e.g ubuntu-minimal. Perhaps we should add some more to the list (e.g. unity or even ubuntu-desktop)?'
[16:41] <slangasek> I'm not sure that's something that should be a policy in aptdaemon
[16:41] <slangasek> update-manager has that kind of policy, and maybe software-center should too
[16:43] <bdmurray> so I'll follow up with the software center team then?
[16:45] <slangasek> sounds good to me
[16:46] <bdmurray> then looking at errors.ubuntu.com this has a high instance count
[16:46] <bdmurray> https://errors.ubuntu.com/bucket/?id=%2Fusr%2Fbin%2Flsb_release%3AIOError%3A%3Cmodule%3E%3Amain%3Acheck_modules_installed%3Agetoutput%3Agetstatusoutput
[16:47] <ogra_> err, what ?
[16:48]  * ogra_ gets a weird bluescreen here
[16:48] <bdmurray> hmm the instance I looked at has a ProcCmdline of /usr/bin/python -Es /usr/bin/lsb_release -a
[16:48] <ogra_> clicking it gets me to http://www.homestarrunner.com/sbemail118.html
[16:50] <ogra_> ev, is that on purpose or some bad joke i dont understand ?
[16:50] <slangasek> bdmurray: very strange; why would we start seeing failures from lsb_release in 12.04, 9 months after release?
[16:50] <ev> it means there's an error in the code
[16:50] <ev> and it's not a bad joke! :)
[16:50] <bdmurray> ogra_: it could be a great joke you don't understand.
[16:50] <ev> yeah!
[16:50] <ogra_> well, i got from the SSO page directly to that bluescreenish page
[16:50] <ogra_> pretty scary
[16:51] <ogra_> telling me i have a virus
[16:51] <cjwatson> in the past I've seen failures from lsb_release which were due to people building derivatives and misconfiguring /etc/lsb-release
[16:51] <ev> yup, digging at your error now
[16:51] <cjwatson> not sure that fits this case though
[16:51] <barry> i just get an sso page loop
[16:51] <ogra_> i get that when i try it in a second tab
[16:52] <jodh> barry: I did too until I clicked all the checkboxes :)
[16:52] <ev> yeah, you need to send your team
[16:52] <ev> I have a branch that makes this a bit more clear
[16:52] <ev> ogra_: could you try again?
[16:52] <ev> just trying to figure out which error is yours
[16:52]  * barry goes click-n-clack
[16:52] <ogra_> ev, works now
[16:53] <ev> damn, though it looks like it's unicode fun
[16:53] <cjwatson> and ECHILD is just a bizarre thing to happen there
[16:53] <cjwatson> that kind of looks like "somebody else reaped my child process before I could"
[16:54] <jodh> bdmurray: btw - have you seen bug 1100198?
[16:54] <bdmurray> jodh: no, I'll have a look
[16:57] <slangasek> bdmurray: do you want to open a bug report for the lsb_release crash, and we can add it to the stack?  It doesn't look urgent
[16:58] <bdmurray> slangasek: sounds good
[16:58] <slangasek> anything else?
[16:58] <bdmurray> there might have an apport sru that changed this
[16:58] <slangasek> hmm
[16:59] <bdmurray> anyway, that is all
[16:59] <slangasek> ok
[16:59] <slangasek> [TOPIC] AOB
[16:59] <slangasek> anything else else?
[17:00] <cjwatson> I was wondering about an idea for the build-dep-substitution problem in cross-builds
[17:00] <cjwatson> (e.g. that when you see Build-Depends: gcc-4.6, you probably actually want Build-Depends: gcc-4.6:native, gcc-4.6-$HOST_TRIPLET)
[17:01] <cjwatson> What would people (esp. doko, infinity) think about a scheme whereby packages that need this kind of substitution done have some field in their package metadata (Cross-Available: yes or something) to say so?
[17:01] <cjwatson> It would beat writing a big list into sbuild and dpkg-checkbuilddeps, having to look at the apt cache in dpkg-checkbuilddeps, or any of the other heuristics I've been able to think of
[17:02] <slangasek> cjwatson: maybe we can take that to #ubuntu-devel for follow-up?
[17:03] <slangasek> sorry, I'm being pulled into meetings for the client sprint :)
[17:03] <cjwatson> Fair enough, or I might just take it to debian-devel since I believe there's an appropriate thread there at the moment
[17:03] <slangasek> ok
[17:03] <slangasek> #endmeeting
[17:03] <meetingology> Meeting ended Wed Jan 16 17:03:39 2013 UTC.
[17:03] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-01-16-16.01.moin.txt
[17:03] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-01-16-16.01.html
[17:03] <slangasek> thanks, everyone!
[17:03] <ogra_> thanks
[17:03] <stgraber> thanks!
[17:03] <barry> thanks!
[17:06] <jodh> thanks!
[17:09] <xnox> cheers.


[15:24] <xu-help8w> Hello everybody. Any chance getting help for a complete dilletant with a "black screen after xubuntu update" problem?
[15:25] <diogenes_> xu-help8w, details.
[15:40] <xu-help8w> So far just those: Running xubuntu on a hp laptop. After last Update (don't know what was updated) screen didn't come up anymore. HDMI works. Once there was an app where I could read system information. Can't find it anymore, strange.
[15:43] <xu-help8w> It's a HP 15-dw3147ng
[15:47] <Mekaneck> The only DE i know of that has a app that shows proper system info is KDE Plasma
[15:49] <diogenes_> xu-help8w, try a new user.
[16:45] <fyr> ssh into the box to see what's wrong?