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Everything posted by TruthSeeker0

  1. This right here is an important point. I have heard people make the argument that others are depressed because they are non believers who no longer believe in god(s). As if belief is some miraculous pill you swallow and your depression goes away. Yes I can understand that religious beliefs can offer the believer some sense of comfort and that when they are lost there's the chance that depression gets worse as the comfort has been taken away and the person needs to adapt. But there are also people, several of them on this site, including myself, who have written of how leaving their religious beliefs behind vastly improved their depression and anxiety and gave them a sense of mental clarity and freedom that just wasnt there before. @crazyguy123 I hope you are doing well in this respect and I'm glad to hear this community has helped you.
  2. Is it really not ok to just disclose that you're non religious?
  3. I've seen the documentary. If the Family is a thing it's more about power, disguised as religion. And I don't see that "downscaling", or being less of a draw - power. If I understood your point correctly.
  4. Welcome @BarnOwl! There's been lots of good advice given already so I'm just going to add, that the emotions you're experiencing are completely normal and as you stated, you've been taught not to trust yourself. What can help on this healing journey is the work by psychologist Marlene Winell, she's written a book specifically for ex Christians who have left the faith (Leaving the Fold) and how to understand what you are going through and what you can do to grow, as awareness and understanding of yourself are key. She also runs support groups online if you think that would be beneficial. https://journeyfree.org/
  5. Cool beans. You just admitted you've no interest in knowing why people here left their belief in god. As such, you shouldn't be attempting to have a conversation here where you try to understand us, because you've no desire in doing that. What you want to discuss is belief in god exclusively definined to the area of personal experience or revelation, which most people in this community will find ridiculous. Most people here are able to reason and use logic in coming to their conclusions. But as you don't want to hear about that your discussion thread will likely be short lived.
  6. I'll probably come across as rude, but we don't need your pity. I don't know if it's occurred to you that some people actually don't "get along with" or see their family because it's *better* for them, for their mental health, and because they've no desire to foster toxic relationships. Such people aren't in need of pity, they're likely thriving, while what are you doing? Being presumptuous by thinking that they need sympathy. And if you're saying this is similar to belief in god and us needing pity or sympathy because we don't believe in god(s), the same applies. The presumptuous attitude you have towards non believers is pretty apparent here. As several have said, you're a bit out of your depth and simply can't relate to such a worldview.
  7. Trust me people here have "thought about it" and more than a bit. To tell us that we should think about these things just reveals how presumptuous you are.
  8. Oh ok. So you want to discuss god(s) but you want it to be within very specific parameters of personal "revelation" of some sort. Well I'm not interested as that has nothing to do with the ultimate existence or non existence of God(s). You could tell me you had a "what just happened" moment and as a result you are willing to consider the possibility that flying monkeys control the universe - it's about as relevant as that conclusion.
  9. Oh for goodness sake. As florduh said, a wake up to what? The fact we're going to "hell", that place that Christianity invented when the old testament books of the Jewish religion wasn't enough to control people? Edit: Welcome to ex-c. Forgive my impatience but I was brainwashed for 36 years about the "precious treasure" of gods existence before I woke up. Why did I wake up? Let's quote Dan Barker again - basically, I refuse to worship evil: "I do understand what love is, and that is one of the reasons I can never again be a Christian. Love is not self denial. Love is not blood and suffering. Love is not murdering your son to appease your own vanity. Love is not hatred or wrath, consigning billions of people to eternal torture because they have offended your ego or disobeyed your rules. Love is not obedience, conformity, or submission. It is a counterfeit love that is contingent upon authority, punishment, or reward. True love is respect and admiration, compassion and kindness, freely given by a healthy, unafraid human being."
  10. I hear ya. I've thought of doing it myself just for fun.
  11. I'd say no. What they're hoping for is to influence you. And you may be hoping to influence them. They're out there actively evangelizing. People don't deconvert unless they are ready to question.
  13. I agree with you completely. I posed my answer as questions so that it would make people think. I agree with you completely that it would be cruel and heartless to take away my parents comfort in their final years. I have found peace, I hope, in the fact that our relationship is now at a point where it is what it is and that I cannot have what I would consider a close relationship with them due to my non belief. However I'm only one of many who has a complicated relationship with family. What I CAN do is find and make "family" of my own in the people who love and accept me and my beliefs as they are. This can be a heartless and cruel world, it's true. And yes to me it appears us humans deal with the survival of the fittest, and this scheme and such a world is far from the ideal world that many of us would like to build. But human nature is human nature. I still have anger, plenty of it. But my anger is not a justification for taking away what is someone else's sense of security, comfort or ability to cope.
  14. So should I persuade my elderly parents that what they believe is trash? That what they've believed their entire lives is wrong. That they've brainwashed and indoctrinated their children and that there is no heaven awaiting for them that they can look forward to. Cause them untold grief when they realize yes they've damaged their children's lives in a lot of ways through the social isolation they put us through and how they taught us to relate to other people (which means we now need to deal with this on our own as adults, learn new skills and coping mechanisms). They already think they've failed as parents as several of their children left the church. So should I compound the damage by adding to it? Edit: I view this kind of behavior as selfishness. "I need you to believe this or that therefore I'm going to try persuade you of it". Or worse, manipulation.
  15. You cannot save someone from themselves nor is that your duty. Speak of why you don't believe but stay away from "you should.." even if it's "you should consider..". That puts people on the defensive.
  16. Yeah, I got mad at them in return. If there's anything I've learned after leaving religion it's that emotions are ALLOWED. I'm allowed to be angry and upset. No more of that garbage "being angry is a sin" crap. I processed my feelings on my own. They didn't know how I felt (I only told them they had hurt me). So yeah when I get "I hope you didn't have feelings" I'm like hell yes I did and there's nothing wrong with that. It's what we do and how we deal with those feelings that matters.
  17. I wouldn’t assume what people are and aren’t capable of. People are complicated. As someone who had the backs of my family turned on me in a way I never thought possible, (due to religion) I will tell you anything is possible. And yes, their own need to stick with their religious beliefs and not have them threatened was more important than understanding or trying to understand their own family member. I'm simply saying, not relying on religious people would be in your best interest.
  18. Anxiety and worry are more often related to what occurred in the past or what could occur in the future.
  19. Sounds like it could be anxiety, the preoccupation? Just saying as I have some myself and actually "living in the moment" in a mindful sense can ease it quite a bit.
  20. Yes it's harder. That's essentially what mindfulness is. Paying attention to the scent, the flavor of your tea, the scenery around you as you sip it. It's actually difficult to do. It's almost a form of meditation. But after awhile it starts to calm your mind and ground you in the present in a way that makes you appreciate it more. It slows down all the trillions of thoughts that automatically flip through our mind without effort, just because it is intentional. I suppose I don't make a distinction. Taking it in and living it with deliberate determination are the same thing.
  21. That's basically what mindfulness means for me, living in, taking in the moment. Maybe you were looking to start a more philosophical conversation about this but that's my two cents.
  22. It's not the food thats the problem. For example yes cacao beens are perfectly ok. It's the processing of everything nowadays with additives that aren't good for you. Geez, I need to even pay an overpriced fee for pure cacao powder without additives. It's ridiculous that eating healthy costs so much more. Actually it's beyond ridiculous. As pointed out yes some people can seem to be obsessed with labels but some justifiably so because theres a lot of hidden crap in most things nowadays. Take someone like my boyfriend who is sticking to a pure Wahls diet as it may improve his MS symptoms. Yes, he's going to read all the labels and even develope anxiety about social events and get togethers because the fact is that if he doesn't stick to the diet at all times it won't help him. So before judging people (not saying that was happening here ( for things like OCD we should consider that we may know very little about the reality of people's lives and circumstances and they may have very good reasons.
  23. I second this advice. Marlene's book is invaluable and she also runs an online support group for people who have left religion https://journeyfree.org/group-forum/
  24. I hope you take heed of this kind of behavior... People who pray for bad things for other people are not good people to be around and the sooner you are rid of them the better. Whether they think they are correct in doing so is completely beside the point.
  25. Agree with all of the above. Art, you know what's required - now you just need to do it. And as you say, not give a fuck for their manipulation and what they might say about you after you leave. Believers will always say that - that non believers are immoral - it serves as a way to easily write non believers off and dismiss their criticisms of the church, and somehow "justify" their manipulative treatment/hypocrisy.
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