Free Speech at the Heartland Institute

Wed, 2008-03-05 07:36Richard Littlemore
Richard Littlemore's picture

Free Speech at the Heartland Institute



Here is the query that elicited Diane Bast's incurious response:



The Heartland Institute (right-wing "think tank" with ties to the tobacco and oil industries) is inviting scientists to a 'conference' called "The 2008 International Conference on Climate Change".








Fern Mackenzie

Al Gore spoke for free?? It's about time. His outrageous speaking fees have convinced many he is into this whole thing a lot more for the money and himself and not so much for the environment.

You just can't win with this sort of double-edged "logic".

If Gore didn't take up Heartland's invitation, then he was obviously a coward.

If Gore did take up Heartland's invitation, then he was in it just for the money.

If Gore did take up Heartland's invitation but turned away the money, then he was just doing it for show.

... Well, Gore was right in simply ignoring these idiots(*) and doing his own thing. Indeed, to turn Diane Bast's words against herself, why should Gore care one whit about what these idiots think? They'll just find some flimsy excuse to launch potshots at him regardless.

- - -

(*) um, "climate realists"

Frank Bi,







You all should consider this: If all the goals and objectives of the "enviromentalists" were fulfilled, the result would be the destruction of capitalism and western democracy. If that were to happen, you all would be out of work!

The enviros never complain much about gold, sliver, diamond, ruby, emerald and sapphire mines because they don't want to offend the silk-stocking enviormentalists and limosine liberals in New York City! Ya know, the guys who donate "pocket change" to them so they won't have to go out and get a real life job like tying re-rod on the thirteenth floor of a high rise under construction when it's 2 deg C and pouring down rain!


Yeah... I could never get this denialist "logic".

Frank Bi,

You watch your stupid mouth, young man, or I will track you down and wash it out with Grandma's Lye Soap!






To date the IPCC has produced only computational speculation and conjecture, and the results of the so-called "computer modeling experiments" are just theoretical projections. Experiments take place in the real world and not in any virtual world. The IPCC is only 90% certain that the activity of humans cause or contribute significantly contribute global warming and any climate change. Are you willing to bet the farm on a guesstimate of 90%, which might actually be only 80%?

In his "Farewell Address to the American People" and after warning of the threat of the military-indutrial complex to the body politic, the late President Eisenhower issued a more ominous warning:


HPJ says: "The most contentious hypothesis of climate models is the water vapor feedback mechanism and the feedback amplification factor. No experiment has ever demonstrated that this mechanism actually exits".


Try this paper in Science for starters:


Is this not an "experiment" in your view because it doesn't involve test tubes and foul smelling products from an organic chemist's lab?


Ian Forrester

Hello Frank!

FYI, Insect pheromones have quite fragrant aromas.

The measurements are for only 18 years and include the El Ninos of 1982-83, 1986-87, 1990-96, and 1997-98. The climate is entering a cool cycle and the upper atmosphere moisture content is slowly declining. Satellites don't directly measure humidity as radiosondes do. They monitor certain frequency bands of the IR. These data are processed by computers which relate these measurements to


Scary stuff!

That's the whole point, no? Or are you saying that the Boeing 747 is a "natural" cause and thus not "anthopogenic"?

By the way, is Naomi Oreskes fat?

Frank Bi, fact-addict and anti-lie bigot


Talk about about scare-mongering! Fern Mackenzie

Hello Fern!

Google "enviromentalists and anarchists". Don't you recall the stories last year about high-profile anarchists who were hired by "Global Exchange, an enviro outfit in San Francisco, to train Calgary city slickers in protest action and tactics for "The Showdown at Athabasca" in late summer. The anarchists were Hudema and Roselle. Google these guys. The latter was a founding member of ELF, a bunch of thugs and vandals who go around burning select properties to the ground. Fortunately, they haven't killed anyone yet. H&R are very dangerous and ruthless men. Protest didn't happen because of a stike by the workers.


Do we Lotus Landers really care about the frozen boondocks in nothern Alberta? I don't.

I'm Albertan. I care about them. But you can go to hell, Harold.

Hello VJ!


BTW, when was the last time you went hiking and camping

Vancouver's best kept secret: No mosquitos in the summertime!

VJ screeched:

"I'm Albertan. I care about them. But you can go to hell, Harold."


Your "caring", evidently, doesn't extend to the people who actually live and work there, however.

So, Harold, you found a couple of supposedly unsavory people who call themselves "environmentalists" and you extrapolate from that to conclude that I'm an anarchist bent on the destruction of the capitalist system. (Boy, my wife's gonna be mad when she hears ....)

Now I have found someone who called himself "Pierce" who was a great train robber. Can I borrow your logic and assume that you are a boastful criminal who should, perhaps be locked up just out of an abundant sense of caution?

remote and too hot for them.

What is this nonsense about Pierce the train robber?


You probably don't know that the climate modelers are using the wrong conc of carbon dioxide in their calculations. And they don't even know this. Also they have no method of taking into account the constantly fluctuating temporal and spatial distribution of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere. It never is 388 ppmv which is the conc for standard dry air, which is air at 273.15 K

If you are so certain that the climate modelers have failed to take these things into account, as you suggest here and at length in another thread, why not challenge them over at to explain themselves? Either they will slap themselves in the forehead and cry with one voice "Why didn't we think of that?" or they will give you a scientific explanation of how they arrived at their numbers.

Fern Mackenzie

The only slapping sound would be the strip they tear off him and then beat him with...

Hello Fern!


Carbon Dioxide in Real Air.











I believe Harold just used a whole lot of space to say basicly nothing....

Hello Tom!

My comment is just straight-forward atmospheric chemistry.

1 masl.
According to NOAA January 2007....385 ppm CO2...
Of course it's over a year out of date so I'm sure it's higher now.

Nice work, Tom! Knocked Harold's socks off!


"NOAA Earth System Research Laboratory
Global Monitoring Division
Reference Gas Preparation and Calibration
4.4 Drying System

I would take that to mean: if you don't dry it, you can't test it.
If NOAA says there is 385 ppm CO2 at works for me.
After all, it's what they do...

"you are not a scientist so what do you really know about climate science?"

I don't know that much about climate science, but I do know what bullcrap is. And you're spouting it.

Now, if you can give a specific criticism of a specific climate model which has been proposed in a specific scientific paper, then tell us about it. Otherwise, your "in-depth" criticisms only apply to the "climate models" in the alternate universe imagined in your own head.

Frank Bi,

See my reply to Fern. I'm not imaging anything. I call'em as I see'em. Did you ever get around to checking out the late John Daly's website ( and the Station Temperature Data base? Go do to your homework, then come back and tell me what you have learned. I instructed Stephen B. to this but he has yet to file his report here. Apparently, his brain probably started to burn out after he saw the temperature-time plots for Death Valley, Dodge City, and Tombstone, and turned to black toast after visiting Alice Springs, AU.

Which part of "give a specific criticism of a specific climate model which has been proposed in a specific scientific paper" do you not understand?

Frank Bi,

John Daly's site is full of "denier" claptrap that wouldn't have a prayer of passing the peer-review test. The methodology is so flawed that it is useless. I'll stick to the IPCC, NCDC, GISS, etc. for my information.


If you live in Canada, you can go to Environment Canada's website and download station temp records for FREE.
dailydata_e.html (Make sure the "D" of "Data" is in caps).
this should correlate with the increase in CO2 conc.


BTW, just how is JD's methodology flawed?

Harold Pierce, I'm going to repeat myself here:


You've done nothing other than repeatedly dodge the issue. Unless you tell us exactly which climate model in which paper by which author(s) your "results" supposedly falsify, all your "temp-time series plots" count as zilch.

- - -

By the way, since you said Al Gore is fat, I'd also like to know: Is James Hansen fat as well? What about William Connolley, is he fat too? Is Gavin Schmidt also fat? And Naomi Oreskes, is she fat?

Tell us, Harold Pierce, tell us!

Frank Bi,

I won't do this. Why would I use Osooyos? I would then be determining Osooyos warming, not GLOBAL warming. Or are you just trying to cherry-pick to the extreme? (A common tactic of the "denier" movement, by the way.) I'm also not going to waste my time on stuff that's already been done when there are more important things to do.

FYI, you should look at this site for some data:




Harold Pierce:

Why Osooyos?

And is Naomi Oreskes fat?

Frank Bi, fact-addict and anti-lie bigot


I'm not lazy, Harold. Also, your procedure may work for a thousand stations worldwide, but if one were to use only one station, they'd get absolutely no information about GLOBAL warming! That's why they call it GLOBAL WARMING and not LOCAL WARMING! Get that through your head!

Plus, I won't rely on either of the RPs for this. I'll trust the IPCC, the largest peer-reviewed scientific investigation in history (whose projections are actually likely very conservative).

Hello Stephen!

In these climate studies, you have start somewhere, someplace. There are many remote weather stations in the world whose temp records haven't been analyzed. Osooyos is one of these.


Your are not a very curious fellow, Stephen.


You really show how low the "denier" crowd will go, Harold.

This temperature record work has already been done. What's the point of doing something over again? It's a WASTE OF TIME!!!

I'm not going to climatefraudit, either, as M&M haven't done anything near what Jim Hansen or Michael Mann have done in their careers.

So, Harold, shut up. You've added NOTHING to this blog, only lied and misled the public.



Fern Mackenzie

Berg, that is. I long ago visited John Daly's site and did quite a lot of looking into his background, and reaction to his hypotheses among people qualified to critique them. His views just don't hold up. As for being whacked by Gavin, it may be that your material didn't pass the criteria for factual content &/or relevance for them to bother posting it for discussion.

Fern Mackenzie

Hello Fern!


BTW, provide some links to "...people qualified to critique them."


...and by the way, is Naomi Oreskes fat too?

Frank Bi,


Fern Mackenzie

Hello Fern!

These are freely available to anyone.

were any changes in the trends since ca 2000?





And I recall reading that there's no economy and no jobs to be had in alternative energies. Where did I read that... ah yes, I think it was from your Robworld! (And Haroldworld, might I add.)

But Robworld isn't about science, it's about hurling insults no matter what, an't it?

- - -

Given that one just can't win with the denialists' double-edged "logic" where anything Al Gore does is by definition wrong, it's little wonder that pretty much nobody listens to them anymore. And which is why the Heartland folks have to rely on cheap publicity stunts like John Coleman threatening to sue Al Gore.

Frank Bi,

To further his carbon credit scam of ripping off a gullible public, Al "Fat Al" Gore needed some scientific muscle so he hired climate hitman James "Jimmy the Enforcer" Hansen. He was paid one really nice big can of Heinz beans for services.

Is Naomi Oreskes fat too?

Frank Bi,






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