AIC would like to thank Michael Lindemann and CNI News for their generous contribution of the following:

An Online Chat With Karla Turner

Second Series Part Two

(During the chat, Karla's nickname is "ThunderK"

Start log. Karla Turner - Class #7 - Session #2

4-12-95 - 8p.m. CDT ; 6p.m. PDT, 9p.m. EDT

WhteLotus1: Evening all....I have joined the class tonight.

ThunderK: Great!...

Dee777: Good to see you all found this room.

ThunderK: We'll wait a few minutes for others to arrive, and then start the regular discussion but for now does anyone have comments about the quotes in the folder? ga

WhteLotus1: Oh my. In my own experience....

ThunderK: Yes? ga

BMosley288: I liked the comment about becoming our own authorization.

WhteLotus1: I experienced first a blue tube of light then a white tube of light and then golden...each with their own level of awareness when I wrote a paper about it in 1988 someone responded to it with a sharing of Sri Aurobindo

ThunderK: Sorry to interrupt, but please remember the protocol for turns in commenting...

BMosley288: Woops

WhteLotus1: and according to Sri...the colours each represent ascending levels of awareness the blue is higher mind...according to Sri the white is universal overmind and the golden supramental consciousness. ga

ThunderK: I'll call on you next, Bob, after responding to White Lotus. I am familiar with your descriptions of the colors and the relation to awareness but can you relate your comment directly to something in the quotes? ga

WhteLotus1: only skimmed over them yesterday...

ThunderK: How does this relate to self authorization, for instance? ga

WhteLotus1: have to think about that specific question. ga

ThunderK: OK! Let us know if you want to add anything later. ga, Bob.

BMosley288: No comment. You answered it. ga

ThunderK: OK. There are enough of us here to start the session. Hello to all the recent arrivals and I want to thank you for your excellent comments in the folder so far. The quote I posted for this session deals with a spiritual aspect to the hypothetical human transformation we may be experiencing, and for tonight let's try to stick to just that aspect of our overall topic, please. It's tempting to get into other things, I know but that's what the folder and the final session will do, ok? So, who wants to start with responses or comments on this: what evidence can you offer in support of a spiritual aspect to the transformation? Jon, ga.


JONWIL: The quotes were right on for me - the higher one's consciousness becomes, the more one realizes that divinity or self-authorization comes from within.We are not separate from universal consciousness, we are manifestations of it,one with it. This is my own personal experience, & evidence enuf' for me that the transformation
is "spiritual". ga

ThunderK: All right. Do you see this in evidence around us in society in any specific way? ga

JONWIL: Yes. I see it in how people's attitudes & beliefs seems to be reflected in their personal circumstances. More & more new groups also seem to take this point of view. ga

ThunderK: Good point. Linda, ga

NEW SOL: First, I'd like to say that Rio Rita's posts were excellent concerning social spiritual transformation. There is tons of evidence. For example, I found it astonishing and wonderful that the Celestine Prophecy has been on the best seller lists for over a year. And, there are many books that everyone is reading on NDE's and the spiritual messages inherent in this experience. Plus, Mack's book is now mainstream, as well as Mutant Message and dozens more. People WANT this! ga

UFO ll: ?

ThunderK: Yes, there's lots of literature that is relevant and popular. White Lotus, can you summarize the thrust or message of this movement? ga

WhteLotus1: which movement specifically

ThunderK: Or just make your original comment? ga

WhteLotus1: pass

ThunderK: Wait...

NEW SOL: I think that if people are reading this, they are trying, wanting to spiritually transform themselves.

ThunderK: I should have said the movement to seek info about the metaphysical. So if you'd like to comment, please go ahead.

Dee777: !

NEW SOL: I agree with JONWIL, that this is an inherently personal thing, that once you "have" it, you must evolve. Sorry I had to get that in. ga

ThunderK: Toney, ga

WhteLotus1: seeking info about the metaphysical comes from the insufficient answers found in other areas such as religion.

Toneyterry: Do you think this new awareness is ,in part, responsible for our awareness of the abductions and could in some way the abductions be a corrective measure to STOP the evolution of our spritual

ThunderK: Yes, I think this *could* be a responsible factor, and that the abductors could be changing tactics in order to massively 'adjust' the population. Given the nature of many abductee accounts If we are indeed advancing spiritually, I hope that part of the change would include our having new perceptions of subtle energies and some hard science experiments recently have documented the effects of alien presence on the environmental energy field. ga, Bob.

(I'd love to know what Karla based that last remark on! It's an intrigueing comment. Ed. JV)

BMosley288: Is there any evidence that abductees become any more self sufficient or is it less? ga

ThunderK: Do you mean financially and materially? ga

BMosley288: I mean more self authorized. ga

ThunderK: It varies from person to person, of course but in many instances there is a 'flowering' of the individual in a number of ways, and for those abductees their response is one of determination and growth, not always in the same directions, however. ga, UFO 11

UFO ll: ok. i was just wondering how many of you think that you may have been abducted????

ThunderK: The question is ok, but the timing is off, UFO 11...

UFO ll: sorry

ThunderK: we're discussing a specific topic for now, and if you really are interested in those who feel they've been abducted, I'd suggest posting a message in the Electronic Cafe. ga, Dee

Dee777: I have seen more people study the metaphysical first, then found aliens second. ga

ThunderK: Do you mean they were drawn to metaphysical subjects and subsequently discovered an alien activity in their lives? ga

Dee777: Yes! Studying metaphysics gave them more awareness, then began to see a connection of sorts between what they were studying and the activities of the aliens. ga

ThunderK: OK, but have you thought about another possibility that the subliminal knowledge of their experiences might have compelled them to the study of metaphysics in an effort to understand such events. ga

Dee777: That is entirely possible. It's like asking, Who came first, the chicken or the egg. ga

ThunderK: True, but we should remember that our society gives us a limited perspective within which we can contemplate and 'answer' such mysteries since the prevalent religious atmosphere does have specific statements on some things and is silent about others. Linda, ga

ThunderK: Linda? ga

ThunderK: Let's go to White Lotus, then. ga

WhteLotus1: The words "self-authorized" threw me a bit earlier, but if I understand the meaning then I would say that within my own experience...the white light was not self-authorized and the golden light was. ga

ThunderK: Did you feel that after experiencing the golden light that you had a new perspective and a new sense of inner 'understanding' that would allow you to make internal decisions in a different way? ga

WhteLotus1: yes, in part....but it wasn't until a Tibetan Rinpoche and a Cherokee chieftaness further explained the light, that I had a greater recognition of what it was. ga

ThunderK: So in those people you found an external authorization first? ga

WhteLotus1: Perhaps a bit and I don't know how to explain that I felt "authorized" but without full understanding and there is a difference. ga

ThunderK: Okay. I think Bob is next, so please ga.

BMosley288: In NDE's there are almost always spiritual advancements, almost 100%, but not in abductions? Or am I mistaken? ga

ThunderK: No, you're not mistaken. In some cases it seems the trauma is so great that the person's integrity is shattered often resulting in degenerative behavior, i.e. drugs, alcohol, promiscuity, etc. but by and large I see that abductees cope pretty well and they can't help but become aware of a different sort of spiritual or metaphysical, which may be a more accurate term, aspect to their existence. Do you want to add more, Bob? ga

BMosley288: yes, I am having a little trouble getting from a typical abduction scene to a metaphysical advancement.

Toneyterry: ?

ThunderK: More? ga

BMosley288: NO ga

ThunderK: OK Yes, the fear and trauma of the typical abduction scene usually takes a toll and takes time to get over but a healthy individual usually tries to get past the fear since it is inhibitory to positive actions and when a person realizes that guns and cameras and security systems won't work against alien intrusions, the usual next thought is of some inner means of protection and resistance and the inner world is a part of what we've come to think of as metaphysical so perhaps you can see my point of reference here. Any comment? ga

Dee777: RioRita 88 is next.

BMosley288: I want to listen more about this. ga


RioRita 88: Whte lotus you are so fortunate to experience golden light, as you know the most sublime....

ThunderK: I want Bob to have a chance to finish, and then Jon is next, according to my list. ga, Jon.

BMosley288: No I'm fine thank you. ga

ThunderK: Jon, ga

JONWIL: I became interested in UFOs first, then discovered it bled over into metaphysics. I find I can no longer separate the two & my awareness of the phenom. has actually expanded my consciousness & sense that I am more than I appear. ga

ThunderK: Just asking could this in part have come from the knowledge that our current science is unable to deal with the phenom and that it transcends into an area we could call the para-physical? Implying that there are natural laws and energies at work but that we haven't yet mastered the power to recognize and effect them? ga?

UFO ll: ?

JONWIL: Yes, absolutely! Science & "spirituality" are actually different ends of the same stick. ga

ThunderK: OK! Rio Rita, ga

RioRita 88: of colored lite...also healing influences are in it In re what your are now discussing sorry my comment is too far back..I know of a method to stop an abduction...

ThunderK: Is there more? ga

RioRita 88: They are deterred by some cry luch as "Jesus save me" It has worked and if you think why it means the greys are anti jesus or well..all they are now saying about them ga

ThunderK: Sorry, but not in all cases. I investigated an abduction in which the grandmother prayed to Jesus for help and then a blond-haired 'Jesus beamed into the room and said, in effect, that the grays were working for him! The abduction proceeded without interruption. All methods I've heard of for stopping abductions have proven inconsistent in their effectiveness. Ga, Rita, for your reply.

Dee777: !

BMosley288: !

RioRita 88: Oh that is an awful story. Those little guys "screen" us all the time causing illusions ga

ThunderK: Yes, I know they do. Toney, ga, please

Toneyterry: Is this a good time for you to elaborate on the hard scientific experiments you mentioned earlier? ga

ThunderK: I can relate that a controlled experiment involved compasses which registered any electromagnetic field fluxuation, and during reported abductions the compasses did record some inexplicable fluxuations. That's off the subject, though so let's get back to the spiritual evidence and its relationship to our awareness of the abduction phenom. Linda, you're next, so ga

(Ed Note: Karla fails to mention by 'who' or 'when' this experiment was conducted. JV)

WhteLotus1: ?

NEW SOL: It's my belief (& posted in folder more depth) that often it is serious emotional/physical trauma including abductions, heartbreaks, deaths of loved ones, illnesses, catastrophes, etc. and when we get a chance to begin reflecting on the why in a deeper way, we move to a spiritual understanding and evolvement. That for me is the connection between abduction, etc and

ThunderK: I completely agree about the effects of trauma! But perhaps it's not so much the 'why' but a question of 'what do we do now?' The 'why' always seems ineffable, no matter what spiritual path one follows yet we must continue to live with whatever situation presents itself and it is in the way we choose to respond to all situations, especially adversity that our spiritual strength is important. UFO 11, you're next. ga

NEW SOL:'re right. I should have said after the "Why me?", there's the what do I do now, to ok i was saying....up there feel better. Some will eat too much, or self destruct. But others choose the higher

RioRita 88: Tough life experiences just means that good ol' Karma is kicking back atcha. Nothing more ga

UFO ll: because kodak has been making computers using thought projection....instead of keybords supposedly like the ETs do it

ThunderK: Why don't you post info on this in the Cafe? We'd all be interested! Dee, you're next.

UFO ll: ok

Dee777: I was going to reply to Rita about stopping the abductions, however, I don't have all the information at hand to help at this time. Perhaps I'll know more next time. ga

ThunderK: Thanks! Bob, ga

RioRita 88: !

BMosley288: I don't know about stopping the abductions, but I believe you can stop the fear by

ThunderK: By asking what? ga

BMosley288: Asking that they do something to relieve the fear in an abduction scenario. ga

ThunderK: I see and sometimes this has helped, I agree, but not always. White Lotus, one last comment? Our time is almost over.

WhteLotus1: Are you asking what might be forms of evidence of spiritual? or asking for reportings of already determined forms of evidence? ga

ThunderK: I was questioning the evidence we can marshall to promote the idea of a spiritual awakening generating through society. For the next class, we will look at the biological implications, for instance, as there are several aspects to the transformation question. ga

JPG9: RioRita 88, EGilson432, JONWIL are next, in that order.

ThunderK: Yes, I know. But there should be time for a reply. ga, White lotus

WhteLotus1: well...knowing that is the question, it would require some thought. ga

ThunderK: OK. Rio, ga

RioRita 88: Negative emotions like Fear will stifle or just close off telepathic ability...with the evidence of awakening is in bookstores in abundance wonderful insightful fantastic new books out these days...not til now. ga

ThunderK: But do we want telepathic connections with them? This question must be answered first. EGilson, ga

EGilson432: What about angels good and bad through out the ages. Don't the bad always bring the good? ga

ThunderK: In the sense of a balance of opposites? Does one really 'bring' the other, or is there a coexistence? ga

EGilson432: I guess I am saying the greys may bring good info we don't understand

ThunderK: That's possible, something worth discussing in its own right. Jon, please ga and let this be the closing comment after which I'll say a bit about the folder. Jon, ga

JONWIL: "What we do now" is become more conscious of the choices we make & observe the results based on our thots/beliefs. Adjust those, & we change our consciousness. ga

ThunderK: Yes, and in some cases we adjust our thoughts in a specifically spiritual manner?...

JONWIL: Yes, but also in everyday life.

ThunderK: I think the evidence in general society does show a wide interest in paraphysical matters which do affect our everyday lives, certainly and when it comes to interactions with the aliens, we often find two different spiritual components one which aligns the abductee with the abductors and one which positions them as opposites but with the abductee calling up new spiritual insights and ideas as a means of response for his/her own sake. Our next class will focus on the biological aspects of species transformation and I'll list a few new quotes for a starting point. So far, I'm very pleased with the ideas several of you have contributed to the folder and I'd like to see responses from each of you before the next session. Till then, I'll check in frequently to make my own responses! This has been an excellent session, and I hope you've enjoyed the exchanges as much as I have. Bye for now!

JONWIL: Thanx Karla - great stimulating class!

WhteLotus1: thanks....and good night.

UFO ll: bye all

Wolflady: Goodnight Karla Thanks for a great class tonight

RioRita 88: I enjoyed my first class and find the comments scrolling pretty fast!

UFO ll: thanks guys

End Log. 9:15p.m. CDT. 4-12-95