Tree of Savior Forum

A tale about an outdated Youtuber with millions of shallow content & misleading guide

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in my opinion, that tierlist is not outdated
cause it have never been right in the first place :haha:


Well the rational of his tier list is how big number you can deal, not how useful the class is to the game so uhh well?? here we are.

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even if we take a look on damage side, it still make no sence
BM as tier 1 while corsair and assin is right there…and rogue knife throw zenith art seem liek a joke to him
highlander ? hakapelle ? dragoon ? really ?
and monk, sadhu, paladin at tier 2… while diev, the most useful support class stay at bottom
i don’t know what to say about this tier list, it is hopeless
and also here is his youtube channel if anyone want to know

he also made some guides…that make literally no sense…
these action is missleading many new players into wrong builds, and wrong way to play the game. If he has such low experience with the game, he should not do those guides at all, he should rather do nothing than ruining every new player’s gameplay.

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hm ? did i ever complain about crevox ? i never complain and always support him cause he is doing RIGHT things. (please link the evidence if you have…probally not cause you made them up all the times)
i’m ok with ppl who make guides, but not the ones with low experience in the game, that keep fooling everyone into their own way

when you have wrong knowledge, making a guide will spread that wrong knowledge and fool newbies to fall into it, and i have been guiding people even before you came into this game, on the guild that you are staying, so be greatful.
how would you feel if someone call people to gather in church praying to cure corona ? that’s how i feel seeing people making false guide like this


Chill. The problem here isn’t about people making guides or not. It’s good to see a lively and volunteered community but giving the wrong information to the mass majority of the new comer is not a good thing, and that needs to be addressed.

And actually stop flagging lmao that makes no difference it still can be viewed. People can voice their opinion, they just need to suck up the consequences of it.


Oh… that guy. I watched some of their videos recently, and their tierlists (there was only Scout’s and Cleric’s when I watched) were really off.
Even if you exclude any current changes to meta/classes, placing Enchanter and Fencer that low on the list is a wild idea…

I’d strongly urge people to come to the forums to get a better consensus instead of following a single person’s ideas, regardless of whether they’re outdated or not.
A good hour or so of searching forums gives you a relatively good group collective of if something is good or not, usually anyway. If not, ask.

I’d like to know where these tierlists are to do my own, but I guess they didn’t save the templates to the Tiermaker site… :tired:


I watch this Youtuber and almost always disagree with his lists, despite being well done, he is very inconsistent and says that the class is bad but puts him in a high position and vice versa.

That’s where the problem lies kiddo. Guides are supposed to lead them into having a good grasp on what they want to do, not to subjectively shutdown some classes because of some stupid tier list, we have what we call ‘synergy’.

Do you even hear yourself? ToS are not that generous when it comes to reset. Yes your first char might have some mistakes and change it, but how about the 2nd, 3rd?

All in all, i have no hate towards the youtuber, he’ll learn from this thread. Hopefully.

Dont worry, he will. He sometimes read forum too for his video material, like his vaivora weapons video which copying this thread Lv430 Vaivora weapons (the crediting sentence part in the intro and the sequence of weapon reviewed is exact same)

Tier list is power’s personal perspective. This is not even guide.

And then you have whole governments that pay “scientists” to declare a “climate emergency” to make us pay more taxes for shait and fund inefficient energy technologies with our money.

You always have to use your own reason to access the information that is given and think about the interactions that can lead to different outcomes.

Not only this, but they are also extremely superficial the more variation comes into play. In TOS we have so many possible setups (different upgrade amounts of equipment, different equipment tiers, different set effects, different levels of attribute & art investments, different additional effects [e.g. Boruta seal influences on set effects/accessory set effects], ark effects[at least on KTOS where you can get a new source of damage on attack, reevaluating certain skills and play styles as they allow more triggers], different party and class build combinations, different buff and debuff interactions with each other and equipment,etc.).

Just listing this my head started spinning, there are so many variables that have to be taken into consideration and which can turn a single class into either a complete hero or complete trash tier experience.
To give a semi-objective perspective on class viability, you need a huge sample size of 10000 players on a test server that allows them to test all this with different tiers of investment, party and build compositions,etc., this is not a one-man show.

The only danger I see in these guides & tier lists is if someone blindly believes in these lists as fundamental truths that never change and are completely independent from any investment into the game (be it levels,equipment,attributes/arts or party/build compositions), in which case the person in question is most likely a moron and cannot be saved anyway.

The problem is more related to people being not as active in the forums as they should be for their own good and rather spend their time on you2be watching other people play the game&sharing their perspectives (and sometimes insights).

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Dude. I understand what you are trying to say. But the problem is that when someone with low experience made a guide or tier list that’s not overall correctly. Guide is supposed to teach or guide new players, but, this tier list is a personal experience, not a guide at all. Some of the class got updated and his data is outdated. What if new player come across his channel and use this outdated infomation and guide?

Thank you for sharing this… inexperienced players like me will just follow guides, not knowing our left from right. :slight_smile:

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making guide is nothig wrong, but guiding people into qrong way is very wrong. Even if he mean no harm, his action might harm others.
don’t tell me if some guys smoke infront of a children and say “hey i think this is good, i should teach others to do it too” you will just let him go heh ? maybe you will, but i won’t agree on leaking those kind of people to the economy, we already have enough of false information spreader stare at ignitor

I can’t speak of other classes but for scout he is right. BM does way more damage than Corsair but Corsair has brutality buff similar to sin they are both buff classes to BM. Themselves offer only little skill damage compare to BM. Linker is another form of self buff. Rogue has low damage overall compare to BM and has no buff (you reach max crit with electric chain, so no need for sneak hit).

  1. Linker is a party oriented class because of Lifeline and PDEF shred.
  2. Critical Resistance shred is Joint Penalty, not Electric Shock.
  3. You cant drive an engine without the wheels. While Cors is not ranked same tier as BM is just a little under-judgement. Corsair can offers a lot more when paired with BM, its like bread and butter situation.
  4. He just blantly followed some tier list made by some koreans anyway.
  5. NOT TO MENTION HIS SKIA GUIDE VIDEO IS 99% MISLEADING, but that is out of topic but im trying to get his intentions here.

actually corsair, assasin and rogue are wayyyyy more useful above BM in most of cases. you can check it out, in our sever (SEA), both top PvP/PvE scout players are rogue and assasin :haha: BM was a meta before, but it is long gone.

and yes his other guide about other classes are mostly wrong, his raid guide is missleading too. And some of his meme builds are korean meta…which require tons of investment (those with tons of investment wont need guide anyway) and unreliable cause it will come to itos after…5 months.

can’t wait till him make another “guide” about weekly boss raid and dimension collapse :haha:

outlaw damage is buffed and i think with 3 true Aoe skill this class can become new meta for scout

Bumping this for attention again before it auto-locks.

Not only does Gaming Hardcore mislead people, he does it on purpose and will also delete comments that contain any form of criticism, valid or otherwise. He’s the worst compared to other people in the past that have tried to mislead others, and everyone that is aware of how bad his videos and guides are should make an effort to make it well-known that nothing he posts should ever be followed.