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it was intended to do. >> host: in "the debt bomb," you have duplication in federal programs, science, technology, engineering and mathematics programs, there are 209 of those. service transportation, 100 plus. teacher quality, 82 programs. economic development, 88. transportation assistance, 80. financial literacy, 56 different programs. job training, 47 different job--training programs. homelessness prevention and assistance, 20 programs. food for the hungry, 18, and disaster response preparedness/fema, 7 different programs. >> guest: well, it's not, it's not just outlandish that we have that many programs, what is also outlandish is we don't know if they're working. because when they're passed, there's nothing that says you have to have a metric to see if it's accomplishing the goal, and the biggest defect of the congress since i've been here has been the total lack of oversight of most of the programs. >> host: you recount in "the debt bomb" a story about taking an amendment to the senate floor to get rid of some of these duplication, duplicative programs. what happened? >> guest: uh -- >> ho

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