(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2] RU[Japanese]SZ[19]KM[6.50] PW[Jie Li]PB[Beomgun (Evan) Cho]WR[7d]BR[7d]DT[2013-08-03]PC[IGS-PandaNet]C[Observing game 165 (AGACL1 vs. AGACL1) : shipshape 4k Tallis 1d Found 2 observers (including 0 guests). Tallis [1d\]: Started? AGACL1: Not yet AGACL1: The players have just arrived AGACL1: Colors have not yet been decided Tallis [1d\]: Ok. TksUSGO4 [-\]: Welcome; Myungwan Kim 9P will be commenting on the AGA-Pandanet Board 1 final that was played Saturday afternoon USGO4 [-\]: Hello Everyone, I am Myungwan Kim 9p Thus [3d\]: hi Machinery [1d\]: Hi Myungwan Hobbes [2k\]: hi maggrig [3k\]: hello USGO4 [-\]: I am commenting on this game played on Saturday AGA-Pandanet city league final which was broadcasted on IGS USGO4 [-\]: Let me know if you have any questions ] ;B[cp] ;W[pp] ;B[dc] ;W[pd]C[AGACL1: Jie Li holds white AGACL1: Evan Cho holds black] ;B[nq] ;W[lq] ;B[eq]C[Observing game 165 (AGACL1 vs. AGACL1) : oren 8k shipshape 4k Tallis 1d Found 3 observers (including 0 guests).] ;W[qn] ;B[ci]C[USGO4 [-\]: Evan Cho is very strong Amateur from Korea USGO4 [-\]: He once went to Korean Insei 3rd league USGO4 [-\]: Which means he is pretty strong USGO4 [-\]: Jie Li won US Open one time USGO4 [-\]: I think it was somewhat long time ago USGO4 [-\]: Jie was Chinese Insei and very close to be a professional ] (;W[iq]TR[nq]C[USGO4 [-\]: This move is very big and solid USGO4 [-\]: now you can see black triangle is isolated USGO4 [-\]: so, J3 is not only big as having territory but also big because of both sides' attack position USGO4 [-\]: Please let me know if you need more explaination at any time ] ;B[nc] ;W[pf]C[Observing game 165 (AGACL1 vs. AGACL1) : oren 8k chosan 7k+ shipshape 4k Tallis 1d Found 4 observers (including 0 guests).] ;B[kd] (;W[ie]C[FindYoda [1d*\]: Who is playing in this game? Tallis [1d\]: CL time setting?USGO4 [-\]: This reduction seems to be good ] ;B[jf]C[AGACL1: Jie Li (W) vs Evan Cho (B). Both have 9d ratings AGACL1: 1 hr main time Tallis [1d\]: I see.josekimq [1d\]: tenuki after o3 is wrong ?? myway666 [2k\]: can this move goes deeper? ] ;W[ic]C[AGACL1: Jie Li (W) vs Evan Cho (B), Board 1 of the AGA Pandanet Finals] ;B[if]C[USGO4 [-\]: black wants to have a thick wall in the center USGO4 [-\]: but the white position on lower side is pretty solid. Black may have some dfficut time to turn his moyo to territoty Ootakamoku [2d\]: :) ] (;W[ge]C[julbla [4k\]: :) ] ;B[hf] ;W[fc]C[Observing game 165 (AGACL1 vs. AGACL1) : oren 8k chosan 7k+ shipshape 4k FindYoda 1d Tallis 1d Found 5 observers (including 0 guests).] ;B[ee] ;W[kb] ;B[gf]C[USGO4 [-\]: what do you think of this variation? USGO4 [-\]: participate on my review Ootakamoku [2d\]: very happy as black USGO4 [-\]: the more participate the more you can learn Nande [2d\]: good for whtie maggrig [3k\]: isnt the first 8 moves or black for territory, why does he make moyo ?? maggrig [3k\]: of black* Jhyn [2k\]: i like it for black liquescens [2d\]: not bad for white because white has sente USGO4 [-\]: OK. you're all right. Black seems to be happy for his moyo but white has good basement and sente USGO4 [-\]: looks almost even holynec [-\]: basement haha :O USGO4 [-\]: however, I wouldn't like it as white because this is what black wanted USGO4 [-\]: so no matter what actually this is good for who I would play differently USGO4 [-\]: as white ] ;W[co]C[AGACL1: Jie Li (W) vs Evan Cho (B), Board 1 of the AGA Pandanet Finals Observing game 165 (AGACL1 vs. AGACL1) : oren 8k chosan 7k+ shipshape 4k FindYoda 1d Found 4 observers (including 0 guests).] ;B[cm]C[USGO4 [-\]: But i don't mean white is bad USGO4 [-\]: yet ] ;W[dp] ;B[dq] (;W[hk]C[Observing game 165 (AGACL1 vs. AGACL1) : oren 8k chosan 7k+ shipshape 4k Tallis 1d FindYoda 1d Found 5 observers (including 0 guests).Koyou [1d\]: ...lol yet USGO4 [-\]: white's move is pretty soft and gentle USGO4 [-\]: this one is okay holynec [-\]: soft is not good? ^^ ThiGar [3k\]: where else could he invade julbla [4k\]: h7? qnine [3k\]: isnt this the best move to prepare for c9 ? ] (;B[bp] ;W[ce] ;B[ec] ;W[fb]C[AGACL1: b has 37 minutes, w 40] ;B[bd]C[AGACL1: Evan shakes his head after playing b16] ;W[ej] (;B[in]C[USGO4 [-\]: this one seems to be to vague USGO4 [-\]: it won't attack much to white USGO4 [-\]: this move is in exactly in the middle USGO4 [-\]: I can't agree to be in the middle ] ;W[eh] ;B[dg] ;W[cj] ;B[di] ;W[dj] ;B[ei] ;W[dm]C[AGACL1: b has 26 minutes, w 31 Observing game 165 (AGACL1 vs. AGACL1) : oren 8k chosan 7k+ shipshape 4k ca361 4k+ Tallis 1d FindYoda 1d Starstorm3 6d Found 7 observers (including 0 guests).] ;B[fj] ;W[fk] ;B[gj] ;W[gk] ;B[dl] ;W[el] ;B[dn] ;W[em]C[Tallis [1d\]: W is leading Observing game 165 (AGACL1 vs. AGACL1) : oren 8k chosan 7k+ shipshape 4k ca361 4k+ Tallis 1d FindYoda 1d Found 6 observers (including 0 guests).USGO4 [-\]: white is pretty well settled USGO4 [-\]: J6 is to be blamed USGO4 [-\]: it is not in the middle of nowhere ] ;B[qh]C[USGO4 [-\]: this is big but not consistance ] ;W[qj] ;B[oh] ;W[pc] ;B[oj] ;W[bi] ;B[bh] (;W[bk]C[maggrig [3k\]: why is Q3 better than p3 ? liquescens [2d\]: no sansan for sure? USGO4 [-\]: this one is not necessary ] ;B[ai] (;W[pq]C[julbla [4k\]: consistance? USGO4 [-\]: what do you guys think who's leading? arczi87 [1k\]: w better maggrig [3k\]: white i think Ootakamoku [2d\]: jubla not consistant, doesnt work well with other stones, or the plan. Jhyn [2k\]: what do you mean vy not consistent? liquescens [2d\]: W+ julbla [4k\]: thanks ootakamoku^^' Nande [2d\]: i like black Ootakamoku [2d\]: looks even to me. humblelife [-\]: cash seems close, but only w seems to have potential for more easy points USGO4 [-\]: looks okay for white maggrig [3k\]: can live in sansan ?? USGO4 [-\]: This protection is very solid USGO4 [-\]: and good ] ;B[cl]C[Ootakamoku [2d\]: could black play q3 instead of a11? ] ;W[bj] ;B[fi] (;W[hj]C[USGO4 [-\]: what is this? liquescens [2d\]: moyo breaker? julbla [4k\]: Oo humblelife [-\]: what about k9 instead? USGO4 [-\]: it is completly in a wrong direction ] (;B[jk]C[USGO4 [-\]: this one is not good either USGO4 [-\]: this does not have a clear purpose ] (;W[fo]C[Observing game 165 (AGACL1 vs. AGACL1) : oren 8k chosan 7k+ shipshape 4k ca361 4k+ Tallis 1d FindYoda 1d Starstorm3 6d Found 7 observers (including 0 guests).USGO4 [-\]: this is not connection USGO4 [-\]: but still it's difficult to attack white ] ;B[jp] ;W[jq] ;B[kp] ;W[do] ;B[bo] ;W[lp] ;B[lo] ;W[mo]C[USGO4 [-\]: black is a bit behind so he should play somewhat aggresively ] (;B[mp]C[julbla [4k\]: so where black must play? USGO4 [-\]: he cut julbla [4k\]: oh USGO4 [-\]: takes some risks USGO4 [-\]: this is the most important moment for this game liquescens [2d\]: is n2 standard shape ? USGO4 [-\]: both sides should be extremely careful here ] ;W[mq] ;B[np]C[Observing game 165 (AGACL1 vs. AGACL1) : oren 8k chosan 7k+ shipshape 4k ca361 4k+ Tallis 1d FindYoda 1d Found 6 observers (including 0 guests).] (;W[mn] ;B[pn]C[AGACL1: w just crossed the 10:00 mark AGACL1: b has 5:15USGO4 [-\]: it's getting complicating USGO4 [-\]: let's see first what had happened maggrig [3k\]: is n15 good for white later ? ] (;W[km] ;B[qm] ;W[rn] ;B[po] ;W[qo] ;B[no]C[jusiblitz [3k\]: at the beginning of this sequence, why white n3 rather than n2? ] (;W[ko] ;B[nn] (;W[fp] ;B[rm]C[julbla [4k\]: black can trade here? USGO4 [-\]: black got a lot in the right side USGO4 [-\]: white lost on this trade ] ;W[sm] ;B[sl] ;W[sn] ;B[rl]C[USGO4 [-\]: probably white thought this would be enough USGO4 [-\]: is this enough? ] (;W[nr] ;B[or] ;W[mr] ;B[qe] ;W[qd] ;B[rd]C[AGACL1: b has 0:53 sec, w 1:40] ;W[rc] ;B[re]C[maggrig [3k\]: oki ] ;W[pe]C[AGACL1: b has entered byo-yomi] ;B[ne]C[maggrig [3k\]: i dont understand o2 USGO4 [-\]: no it is not ] ;W[qg] ;B[rg] ;W[rh] ;B[qf] ;W[pg] ;B[ri] ;W[ph] ;B[qi] ;W[pi] ;B[pj] ;W[sf] ;B[qr]C[AGACL1: b plays r2 and goes back to reading around t14USGO4 [-\]: or this is a good move ] ;W[pr] ;B[qp] ;W[qq] ;B[rp] ;W[rq] ;B[rf] ;W[sd] ;B[sh] ;W[oi] ;B[nj]TR[km][mn][ko][fp]SQ[pn]C[USGO4 [-\]: the right side was too big USGO4 [-\]: white didn't gain much as an exchange USGO4 [-\]: white has to protect at o2 which probably white didn't read when he was giving up the left side USGO4 [-\]: now the game is over maggrig [3k\]: would it be good idea to play c12 to see how black react maggrig [3k\]: ? USGO4 [-\]: those triangle moves are too loose and turned out to be losing moves USGO4 [-\]: black's rectangular move was good on the other side USGO4 [-\]: okay, that's it Hobbes [2k\]: thx USGO4 [-\]: I hope you learned something on this review maggrig [3k\]: thx USGO4 [-\]: the easier one you can learn is that the mistake of h10 USGO4 [-\]: he should connect at h5. USGO4 [-\]: it is at least better USGO4 [-\]: okay, see you guys next time USGO4 [-\]: I am myungwan kim 9p humblelife [-\]: thank you. that was a very clear review USGO4 [-\]: hope to see you soon USGO4 [-\]: bye maggrig [3k\]: good bye ] ;W[ni] ;B[mj] ;W[il] ;B[gq] ;W[hp] ;B[qb] ;W[pb] ;B[rb] ;W[qc] ;B[ob] ;W[sb] ;B[lb] ;W[kc] ;B[lc] ;W[nf] ;B[mf] ;W[mg] ;B[ng] ;W[of] ;B[mh] ;W[lg] ;B[lf] ;W[mi] ;B[mm] ;W[ln] ;B[eb] ;W[jd] ;B[he] ;W[gd] ;B[so] ;W[cn] ;B[bn] ;W[hh] ;B[fh] ;W[fr] ;B[fq] ;W[gr] ;B[hr] ;W[hq] ;B[er] ;W[ml] ;B[je] ;W[id] ;B[nm] ;W[ll] ;B[lh] ;W[kg] ;B[kh]C[Observing game 165 (AGACL1 vs. AGACL1) : chosan 7k+ shipshape 4k Tallis 1d FindYoda 1d Starstorm3 6d Found 5 observers (including 0 guests).] ;W[nh] ;B[jg] ;W[og] ;B[oq] ;W[os] ;B[ka] ;W[ja] ;B[la] ;W[ib] ;B[ir] ;W[jr] ;B[fs] ;W[bl] ;B[bm] ;W[pa] ;B[sq] ;W[sr] ;B[ii] ;W[hi] ;B[se] ;W[nl] ;B[ol] ;W[lj] ;B[ji] ;W[ok] ;B[pk] ;W[nk] ;B[pl] ;W[sp] ;B[ro] ;W[fe] ;B[ff] ;W[ea] ;B[da] ;W[fa] ;B[hd] ;W[hc] ;B[ed] ;W[sc] ;B[sq] ;W[ke] ;B[kf] ;W[ld] ;B[md] ;W[ng] ;B[sp] ;W[rr] ;B[jl] ;W[jm] ;B[gp] ;W[go] ;B[ep] ;W[eo] ;B[le] ;W[kd] ;B[gs] ;W[aj] ;B[ah] ;W[gg] ;B[fg] ;W[oa] ;B[na] ;W[oc] ;B[nb]C[AGACL1: white has resigned Gemensis [16k*\]: Okay, thanks. AGACL1: b+Resign Gemensis [16k*\]: So, who wins the finals? Gemensis [16k*\]: Never mind, i got it]) (;W[rf] ;B[rp] ;W[qp] ;B[nr] ;W[ln] ;B[qr] ;W[pr] ;B[ps] ;W[os] ;B[rs] ;W[or] ;B[rq]C[USGO4 [-\]: there is some big aji at the corner ])) (;W[rm] ;B[ln] ;W[mm] ;B[kn] ;W[jn] ;B[jo] ;W[jm] ;B[lm] ;W[ll] ;B[ko] ;W[ml]C[USGO4 [-\]: I think white should fight USGO4 [-\]: like this ])) (;W[nn]C[USGO4 [-\]: white needs to push this one first USGO4 [-\]: if white play n2 that is kote ] ;B[on] ;W[ko] ;B[rm] ;W[pm]C[USGO4 [-\]: in this case Black can't block at s7 ])) (;W[qm]C[USGO4 [-\]: white really wants to extend on the right side USGO4 [-\]: but ] ;B[ln] ;W[mm] ;B[kq] ;W[kr] ;B[jr] ;W[lr] ;B[ir] ;W[nr] ;B[hq]C[USGO4 [-\]: but black can get the lower side ])) (;W[ln] ;B[ko] ;W[no]C[USGO4 [-\]: this is where reading skill can make a huge difference USGO4 [-\]: now the three stones are dead USGO4 [-\]: black needs to cut on lower side ] ;B[kq] ;W[kr] ;B[jr] ;W[lr] ;B[ir]C[USGO4 [-\]: then how white can play? ] ;W[ip]C[liquescens [2d\]: atari in sente USGO4 [-\]: yes, you can do that USGO4 [-\]: black is doomed here USGO4 [-\]: if Jie read it correctly ] (;B[hq] ;W[hp] ;B[gq] ;W[jn]C[USGO4 [-\]: it doesn't work for black USGO4 [-\]: white could win the game at this moment, instantly ]) (;B[io]C[liquescens [2d\]: can white play l6 first ? ] ;W[hr]C[USGO4 [-\]: this doesn't work for black either ]))) (;B[mn] ;W[no] ;B[ln]TR[hj][jk]C[USGO4 [-\]: this may not be so enough for black USGO4 [-\]: this triangle exchange still help black ] ;W[kq])) (;W[ho])) (;B[lo] ;W[mp] ;B[ql]C[USGO4 [-\]: it should be sometihng else to make it complicating ]) (;B[hp]C[USGO4 [-\]: at least cut from this side ])) (;W[ho]TR[in]SQ[nq]C[USGO4 [-\]: connect USGO4 [-\]: and seperate black USGO4 [-\]: One of the strongest go pros in Korea, Seo bong-soo, said go is to connect USGO4 [-\]: if you can connect well you can win USGO4 [-\]: and also white can isolate black's triangle USGO4 [-\]: by which black would hard time to save o3 USGO4 [-\]: do you agree? maggrig [3k\]: yes myway666 [2k\]: perfectly right USGO4 [-\]: black is not going to play at J11 or something around there ] (;B[hn] ;W[go] ;B[gn] ;W[fo] ;B[fn] ;W[en] ;B[eo] ;W[ep]C[USGO4 [-\]: it is conneceted USGO4 [-\]: good enough ]) (;B[ii]C[USGO4 [-\]: this is studip move ]))) (;W[oq] ;B[qq]C[USGO4 [-\]: P3 leave some aji at the corner ])) (;W[pq] ;B[cl] ;W[bj] ;B[fi]LB[ah:A][bl:B]TR[bj]C[qnine [3k\]: i think its more secure against r8 to play q3 USGO4 [-\]: now white can hane at A to reduce black a bit and B to make one eye USGO4 [-\]: which is pretty big difference USGO4 [-\]: do you see the difference? Ootakamoku [2d\]: yes ])) (;B[hm]C[USGO4 [-\]: this one at least would be better giving more pressure ]) (;B[el]C[liquescens [2d\]: what about pincering from k9 side ? USGO4 [-\]: I don't know it is difficult to find the right spot ]) (;B[jk]C[Ootakamoku [2d\]: does black have to attack white right away? USGO4 [-\]: this is not a good direction julbla [4k\]: hmmm, direction mistake, no? Ootakamoku [2d\]: possible to play maybe r12 or q3 first, to see how want to attack h9? USGO4 [-\]: black wants to prevent white to connect to the lower side ] ;W[hm] ;B[jm] ;W[ho]C[USGO4 [-\]: now, black has nothing to expect Jhyn [2k\]: preparing for r12? or is it too early? liquescens [2d\]: right ])) (;B[sa] ;W[cn] ;B[bp] ;W[dm]C[ricedragon [1d\]: ? USGO4 [-\]: if Black doesn't respond on B4, white can play at c6 for sente USGO4 [-\]: it's just demonstration ])) (;W[gk]C[julbla [4k\]: c5 is a probe? USGO4 [-\]: but if I want to invade here I'd like to go one line further ]) (;W[hl]TR[gf][hf][if][jf]C[USGO4 [-\]: I think at least this one is better maggrig [3k\]: why ? Ootakamoku [2d\]: the h8 looks difficult to attack USGO4 [-\]: there is no need to be close to black's wall, triangle moves ThiGar [3k\]: ok holynec [-\]: stay away from big walls, for either color :p USGO4 [-\]: right ])) (;W[fd] (;B[gf] ;W[ee]C[USGO4 [-\]: so I can't come out, preventing black's will USGO4 [-\]: F16 is faster that black couldn't block outside ]) (;B[de] ;W[hf] ;B[hg] ;W[gf] ;B[gg] ;W[fg]C[USGO4 [-\]: Black couldn't block the center USGO4 [-\]: don't be a good boy ]))) (;W[ic]C[Jhyn [2k\]: is there a good reason why it is better than reducing around e11? USGO4 [-\]: this one might be okay too. ] ;B[jc] ;W[ie] ;B[jf] ;W[hg]) (;W[ei]C[USGO4 [-\]: White can play this one USGO4 [-\]: At this time all those moves are playable and won't make much difference USGO4 [-\]: as long as white knows that he needs to reduce black's influence USGO4 [-\]: as long as he is in the same direction ])) (;W[nc] ;B[jq]TR[lq]C[USGO4 [-\]: You can see the difference. USGO4 [-\]: O17 is big but K3 is bigger USGO4 [-\]: Left lower side became a big rectangular USGO4 [-\]: and white triangle stone is being attacked ]))