Saturday, February 23, 2008

A Pondering




Anonymous said...

Me too, he makes my skin crawl.

Unknown said...

Would either of you be happy with any Democrat from the last 20 years?

No, this just sounds like the black and white binary opposition of the american political system, with only two parties, where people vote (if at all) for same flavour stooge for their whole life.

See, in other countries people have 'choice', control of the nation doesn't boil-down to either one or the other bunch of crooks.

When was the last time the balance of power in either house of US fed. gov. was controlled by someone other than the republicans or democrats?
When you have more than two viable political forces you get something other than the same old bullshit government and reactionary opposition.

For a nation that prides itself as the defender of 'democracy', a US citizen has surprisingly little power in their vote.

Anonymous said...

Hey "R"; Does that stand for Radical?
Anyway; acutually there is no binary opposition in the next pres election. There are three democrats running as of right now.
Obama(Hussein); Clinton and McCain.

Unknown said...

"Hey "R"; Does that stand for Radical?"

No. As I explained a while back, it's what the recent changes in blogger authentication has done to my RudeBoy Murphy account.

As for the 'binary opposition' it's a cultural/psychological phenomenon.

Any chance you'd ever vote for a dem, John? Or am I right to think that americans are born voting for one party, and that's a lifelong choice?
So what happens when those born voting Republican aren't convinced their candidate is 'right' enough, let me guess, it's either begrudgingly voting for the faux Republican, or abstain totally?

See John, if you were over here, and not convinced by main conservative party, you could vote for the 'country national party', 'family first' or 'one nation' all of whom I'm sure you'd love John, they are so far right they sit next to the coffee-machine in the hallway!
While you might think that sounds like a wasted vote if you can't elect someone to the highest office, but here, like most other western representational democracies based on the Westminster system, smaller parties regularly hold the balance of power in either houses of parliament, and hence effectively have more power than the Prime Minister.

I totally understand why you sound so unimpressed by not having a candidate you like... what choice is left under the US model?

Christopher Lee said...

You should head over to Hooah Wife and talk to Silke. She's supporting both Obama and McCain. I don't know which one she'll vote for tough. So there goes your argument of being born to vote for one party. Republicans vote for Democrats and Democrats vote for Republicans. They sometimes vote for Independent, Green and Reform Party candidates. America isn't a two party system. It's just that the Dems and Republicans are the two biggest parties.

Anonymous said...

I don't think you are correct in your assumption. I vote to the party or candidate that resembles my own personal core values and principles. Perhaps an unknown element in Liberalism and elitists?
I have never known a Dem that had the same values or principles and have not ever voted for one. But that does not leave me as having only The Republicans to vote for.
The are many parties and candidates to vote for; but none in this current crop are still in the actual race. I doubt if having as many choices as your country seems to have translates into having a better system. More is not always better and is confusing to the masses.
Being Conservative might make me sit by your coffee machine but here I would need to sit in an Auditorium with more than 40 million others. I guess you would be outside somewhere milling the parking lot putting greenpeace stickers on our cars.
Since there is no candidate running that shares my core values and principles I will probably not waste my vote casting it for someone who is closer than another. But; thats just me.
Maybe 40 million others too will not vote? That will be interesting to see if it happens dont you agree? I mean; since you would want to see if your vastly superior country (heh)of less than the population of one of our smaller states will untimatly be affected?
After all Not voting here is just as powerful as casting a vote here.

Unknown said...

Well boys, none of what either of you have said is at all persuasive, if anything, you've confirmed my suspicions for me.

"She's supporting both Obama and McCain."
Yes, an interpretation of a second-hand anecdote hardly kills the theory... I've been hearing a bit filter through about McCain and Republicans not wanting to support him - it's as though he's not authentic Republican

"They sometimes vote for Independent, Green and Reform Party candidates."
And OK, there are some other parties, congratulations, but are they actually viable political forces? What is the chance of any of them achieving anything? Will/have any of them ever held the 'balance of power'? Are they just 'also rans'?

"Being Conservative might make me sit by your coffee machine"
No John, I was just highlighting that we have a full spectrum of viable political parties - from Loony Left to extremely Uptight Right (I was guessing which ones you'd relate to the best, there is more 'centre right' than anything else, but given the colourful views you've shared with us about the 'turd world' reminded me of the leader of a significant political force here from about 10 years ago - I figured you'd be happier near the coffee-machine in Right side of the hall, I could be wrong, but that's the beauty of choice, you don't have to HOPE that there is someone running who shares you're views - there is a board spectrum of ideas and values, something that those of you thinking of abstaining seem to miss)

(wow you googled australia, can you point to it on a map though? It shouldn't be that hard, it's about the same land-mass as the US... but we don't need to divide it into 50 tiny states, there's nothing funnier than the phrase 'bigger than texas'.. if we have a look around we might be able to find a state smaller than texas, and as for population size [about 7% of US], well, a case in point that it is 'quality' not 'quantity').
uh, no John... couldn't give a damn . The only thing that america does that concerns me is 'bombing things', and I think it's safe to say Australia's down the bottom of the US 'to do list'.
Even the most politically unaware Aussie saw that it was time to vote-out that sycophantic PM who had his head firmly lodged in Bush's back-end. We now have a PM who shows every sign of 'being his own man' (you never can be sure with a politician though - they all have the capacity to double-cross), so now when america needs another country to support them so that they can say they 'have the support of the international community', Australia is just as likely to tell them to 'get stuffed'.

'Hanging-out with the wrong people' (ie. america) got the conservatives removed from all governments State and Territory as well as Federal - as result, american politics are just an amusing side-line, rather than an indicator of which war we're going to be dragged into - who we're going to kill next? That's one thing one had to admire about the New Zealand politics while Australia went a bit 'wrong', the Kiwis have been telling the US where to stick their nuclear powered death machines for decades.

"After all Not voting here is just as powerful as casting a vote here."
Absolutely! We agree on something John (though it sounds like the only two choices many of you are considering)...
So, you're not going to vote John? Does that mean we can expect to see you welcome a Democrat to the whitehouse? ... out there with a banner, cheering?
As that's the effect of your 'power' to abstain from voting will have is it not? All cos you you couldn't find a real republican, sorry, a candidate you like....
I can see everyone that at RWRM will be satisfied with the outcome of the next election