Ling listens to the scene | Libra is at the "most dangerous moment"? Who can save the small tie? Bai Shuo, Meng Yan, Hu Jie and other 6 experts on the same stage

On November 8th, at the World Blockchain Conference·Wuzhen Summit, “Ling Listening to the Scene | Opportunities and Challenges: Libra and the Central Bank Digital Currency” round-table dialogue, six guests debated the same: Libra is the means of payment or currency ? What is the similarity and difference between Libra and the Central Bank Digital Currency (DCEP)? Why is Libra so difficult to produce? Is regulation the biggest resistance? Who can save the little Zaza? Is it necessary for China to launch the Chinese version of Libra?

Libra round table cover

The sparks on the scene and the frequent verses are one of the most enthusiastic roundtable forums for this summit. The round table was curated and hosted by Mr. Tang Xiuling, editor-in-chief of Babbitt and the promoter of the blockchain.

In order to preserve the wonderful results on the spot, the following is a live dialogue. The full text of 9,500 words, it is recommended to collect and read.

Tang Xia Ling: It is a great honor to invite six experts to discuss libra and the central bank digital currency. These two topics are the biggest hot spots today, and I think the discussion today is very exciting. First of all, please introduce yourself and share what you have been doing recently.

Chief editor

Tang Xialing

Wu Xiao: Hello everyone, my name is Wu Xiao, from the pure white matrix. In fact, our company does a very simple thing, that is, chainIDE, is to help developers save marginal costs, use cloud computing to use our system to switch between different development environments to develop on Libra.


Wu Xiao

Hu Jie: My name is Hu Jie. I am a professor at Shanghai Jiaotong University of Shanghai Jiaotong University. My teaching interests and research interests are in FinTech and blockchain. At the same time, I also made a project in the industry, using blockchain technology to solve Supply chain finance issues.

Hu Jie

Hu Jie

Meng Yan: Hello everyone, I am the vice president of the Digital Assets Research Institute, focusing on the economy.


Meng Yan

Bai Shuo: I am Bai Shuo, BAI, B is the blockchain, AI is artificial intelligence, I have involved in these two areas, in fact, artificial intelligence has a startup company, do smart investment and investment. Blockchain, I am basically single-handedly, personally to carry out the blockchain popularization, consultation, mission, thank you.

Bai Shuo

Bai Shuo

Tim Yang: Hello everyone, I am Tim Yang, Yang Weihua, from Sina Weibo. I have recently participated in Libra open source projects in some communities. I am now able to expand Libra's performance in Layer 2 performance. I am very happy to have Opportunity to communicate with you.


Tim Yang

Cai Kailong: Hello everyone, my name is Cai Kailong. I am mainly doing research in academia. The research direction is digital currency. Studying the paper is a very bitter and very depressed process. After leisure, I write articles and comments. There are more than 40 columns on my public account, including Babbitt is also one of my columns.

Cai Kailong

Cai Kailong

The original clear source definition: What is libra?

Tang Xia Ling: Today's topic is called "Opportunities and Challenges: Libra and the Central Bank's Digital and Digital Currency." The first question begins with definitions. In fact, everyone has their own understanding of Libra, if defined in accordance with the white paper: Libra's mission is to create a simple borderless currency and financial infrastructure to serve billions of people. Xiaoza has always emphasized that Libra is a means of payment in various occasions, but more people worry that Libra is a brand new currency. Everyone has a different understanding of it. Please share with you, what is Libra in your mind?

Wu Xiao: Actually, I think Libra is a set of stable currency payment system that allows smart contracts to exist.

Hu Jie: I think Libra is a new currency . Because no currency has a 1:1 correspondence with it, a Libra appears, and you can't say which currency 1:1 disappears at the same time. Of course, a particular currency will be affected to some extent by it, such as disappearing part of it, but after all, this is not a 1:1 relationship, so it is a new currency.

Meng Yan: Hu Jie was originally a senior economist of the Federal Reserve, so he made a definition. I can only do a little extension on his definition. First Libra is a new currency , and secondly I think Libra is a strategic weapon .

Tang Xia Ling: Your key word yesterday was called "arms race".

Meng Yan: Yes, there are no weapons, and there is an arms race. But not a country that plays a country, I think this is a strategic offensive weapon that the new digital economy is challenging the old digital economy . In addition, Libra is still a big digital economic ecology . This point just Wu Xiao also showed clues. This is the three definitions I have under.

Bai Shuo: The first is money . As a currency, Libra can be characterized by five features: 1. borderless, 2. point-to-point, 3. programmable, 4. zero commission, 5. low volatility. Of course, I also think that Libra is not just a currency. It is also an attitude or a vision . This vision is the trinity of a borderless or super-sovereign currency, a super-sovereign user base and a super-sovereign economy.

Tim Yang: I understand that Libra is the underlying architecture of a new digital currency . Although the central bank began to study digital currency three or four years ago, there are actually no precedents to see from the market. Bitcoin and Ethereum have a public chain structure. If the central bank moves it, there are actually many problem. After Libra comes out, it may bring a lot of inspiration to the central bank, to make a new digital currency, we can learn a lot from Libra.

Tang Xia Ling: You are a technical background and will be expressed in technical language.

Cai Kailong: It is a non-sovereign stable currency. At the beginning of Xiaozao's view, Libra is a global monetary and financial system. Now it is a low-paying means of payment. Why?

Tang Xia Ling: It may be under pressure.

Cai Kailong: Yes, but why did it put forward a comprehensive wish before? Let's take a look at the background of this company and Xiaozha: he is a Silicon Valley IT representative, very young, he started his business without graduation, and became one of the smartest companies in the world. In fact, he has the idealized color of Silicon Valley IT. Therefore, his non-sovereign stable currency is idealized and he wants to be a system that can cross-sovereign inclusive finance. This perfect vision is very exciting when you think about it. But the reality is that all countries are opposed, so it can only retreat to say that it is a means of payment first.

Tang Xia Ling: So he may be a staged compromise?

Cai Kailong: Right.

Tang Xia Ling: The second question is about the central bank digital currency. I want to ask Hu Jie. Do you think libra and the central bank digital currency are two completely different things?

Hu Jie: Right. Libra and DCEP are really different things. But we often talk about it because it has a connection point. For example, they are all explored after the stimulation of technological progress, but the two explorations are indeed very different. The starting point, path, and goal are different.

First of all, regarding the starting point, the exploration of DCEP started a few years ago, not only for theoretical exploration, but also for landing. So this has nothing to do with the launch of Libra, and the technical path is indeed different. It has been affected by technological progress, but in fact Libra has made it clear that it appears in the form of a coalition chain, and even proposes a public chain. The possibility of this is a pure exploration of currency issuance and circulation based on blockchain technology.

However, after some considerations in terms of technology, DCEP believes that technology is not so important. What is more important is that its application characteristics are to maintain the anonymity of money, that is, to protect the anonymity in the exchange of coins and banknotes. I know that you know that such a thing can be retained to a certain extent. As for the use of blockchain technology or which part of the blockchain technology, this is open-minded, so their path is different.

The most important thing is that their goals are completely different. Some people say that the two goals are exactly the same. This is completely a misunderstanding. Libra is to produce and manage a cross-global, cross-sovereign currency, and DCEP is definitely not. DCEP is to achieve a very limited goal, which is to replace coin banknotes. Of course, beyond this limited goal, will the future explore more far-reaching goals? This is another question.

In fact, using the digital currency terminology DCEP, there is a little misunderstanding, why? Because 95% of the renminbi has been digitized, it is already a digital currency. Now called DCEP is only a small part of the digital currency. It only solves the last corner of history, the banknote coin, by electronic means.

The core logical feature of a banknote coin is that you know what you know, and this is its only differential use. Can you replace paper money and coins with electronic, digital expressions while maintaining anonymity? This is the only mission of DCEP. After the exploration, the electronic and digitization process of the renminbi is over. Of course, on this basis, we will accumulate a lot of experience, for the future internationalization of the renminbi, the future Chinese version of Libra, may make some technical preparations. This is my personal opinion.

In terms of technical dimensions, what are the similarities and differences between Libra and DCEP?

Tang Xia Ling: The next one is a technical issue. Both Bai Shuo and Tim Yang have researched and thought about Libra and the central bank's digital currency. From the technical perspective, what are the similarities and differences between the two?

Bai Shuo: From the limited data analysis, Libra is a blockchain-based overall solution, especially the programmability support and decentralized architecture, which is quite clear. The central part of the central bank's system is inspired by the blockchain, but it is not entirely based on the blockchain. Its distribution and circulation are strongly consistent, and many centralized methods are used in the circulation environment. Therefore, the comparison between the two sides shows that Libra's blockchain attributes and decentralized attributes are stronger, while the centralized nature of the central bank and the realistic attributes based on regulatory requirements are stronger.

Tang Xia Ling: Thank you, Mr. Bai, for Tim Yang to share with us from a technical perspective.

Tim Yang: I am also paying attention to DCEP recently. My point is that the bottom layer of DCEP should be built with blockchain. If you don't use blockchain, this will not be fundamentally different from previous electronic payments, and you won't be able to reach the height of digital currency.

Second, can the performance of DCEP meet the requirements of China's consumer level? For example, a scene like double 11. If the bottom layer of our future becomes a digital currency, can the bottom layer support it? Some people have questioned Libra's underlying blockchain architecture, which currently can only do thousands of transactions per second. To see that the current Libra is just a beta version, it is not easy to determine the blockchain approach to the double 11 requirements. Just mentioned on the basis of Libra, some improvements in the domestic community, in the laboratory environment, with a layered architecture, can be several orders of magnitude higher than the current thousand transactions per second. So with the underlying architecture of the blockchain, you can actually achieve very good performance.

In fact Libra and DCEP are interacting with each other. DCEP's original idea was to do wholesale, but the central bank and the bank docked, not involving the final user. But recently it seems that the central bank's attitude is also swaying, saying that DCEP is also available to consumer users, and can provide a wallet to ordinary users like Libra. Of course, this wallet may also need to be licensed. In addition to the bank of the regular army, there is also a third-party wallet to do this. This is my point of view.

Tang Xia Ling: Next, I want to ask Wu Xiao a separate question. After the release of the Libra white paper on June 18, in the first week, your ChainIDE team announced the launch of the world's first integrated development environment (IDE) with integrated Move language. tool. Later, the game learning software was introduced, so that ordinary people can learn and communicate on it, helping developers to save the time of the Move language. So I would like to ask if you have any new discoveries in game development and interaction with users and developers. What is your attitude and feeling like?

Wu Xiao: After Libra came out, we did the first thing on it and made the earliest compilation of the Libra bottom layer. It takes two to three hours to understand the bottom layer of it. We find that every team in the world has to spend 2-3 hours, which is a waste of life. We use a cloud service to help you. We have done a whole set of tests, not just tutorials and tests, including the test network for writing programs, including the fact that they want to run smart contracts on Libra. We found that developers on Libra are very enthusiastic, not only to make payment systems, some people do database, some people do games, some people do decentralized finance, they do a lot of things, in the community Sharing is not the same. I think Libra can have some references, including many domestic alliance chains. The future is not necessarily called Cibra. It may be used in all the alliance chains in China. When it needs innovation, it can absorb its technology. This is very interesting, that is, it is not only a payment system, but the language exploration is very strong. Not only are we doing tutorials, but many universities and domestic universities are learning, very interesting.

Why is Libra so difficult to produce? Is it at the most dangerous moment?

Tang Xia Ling: Thank you for your exploration. Technology and developers are very enthusiastic, but we think Libra is difficult to produce. Xiaozha has been tortured by Congress, including the withdrawal of many companies last month. Some people think that "Libra is at the most dangerous moment", so how do you see this point? ? Why is the birth of libra so difficult? Where is the difficulty? Is regulation the biggest resistance?

Hu Jie: This is not surprising. In fact, I have always been optimistic about Libra, but it was just a short time ago that I wrote an article with Yuandao , called " Achilles's Aunt of Libra: Cross-border Supervision ."

In fact, the biggest obstacle we see in it is not the logic of money, nor the technical means of it, but how it is accepted by the supervisory authorities of various countries. This is a hurdle. Therefore, everything that it has experienced now, in anticipation, will inevitably follow the development of business logic.

But going through it doesn't mean we don't look at it, it's going along the right path. Governor Zhou Xiaochuan also said that if Libra is not successful, the next Libra will come out, so I am very optimistic about it.

The exits of these institutions are very interesting. You observe that these guys are big in the payment field. They are defensive. They are vested interests. If they don't come in, they will probably be eroded by Libra. Therefore, now there is some political pressure, he will withdraw first, to keep the existing things do not get into trouble. Now there are more than a thousand queues to join in the back, and there are no such concerns in this thousand. So this matter is a partial reaction. Now I can't see if it is the "most dangerous time". Even if there is, I think it will eventually pass.

Meng Yan: I want to say that Hu Jie’s teacher basically said that he told me before, I was very disadvantaged, and I was similar to Hu Jie’s. What I want to say is that I am actually very interested in what Wu Xiao is doing. The real power of Libra is that it is simple enough. You want me to be a stable coin, I will make a basket of money as a pressure scale to make him stable. You want me to find a new application for the new Libra. Facebook says I can use Libra to accept your advertising costs. On this basis, you look at Wu Xiao, they see the open source products like sharks, and a lot of applications come out. You should not underestimate the developers, I was originally a developer, I am out of CSDN, I know the power of this group of people. I have also measured the popularity of Libra developers far beyond the digital currency and digital assets other than Bitcoin. This power cannot be underestimated. I think Libra's ecology will be very prosperous. Once this ecology is formed, there is no power to block it, because it has become a kind of Internet power and has become a confrontation between new civilization and old civilization. unstoppable.

The regulatory pressure is too great, and turning Libra into a point can work. It can be used as a collateral without a stable currency, but it is not uncomfortable to combine Libra points with many Internet companies as a commodity or service. The general economy has a lot of gameplay, anchoring the legal currency or anchoring the points, and there is design space.

Bai Shuo: Regarding the problems that Xiaoza has encountered now, I think this is a normal game. There may be many results in the game. The most eye-catching feature is that "No Borders" has not been achieved. Whether it can be compromised to "No Borders" is also accepted. This is a matter that needs to be observed. If "No Borders" is accepted and accepted, the balance will be maintained for the time being. But as Ms. Meng said, this power will continue to accumulate and wait until the next appropriate time to detonate.

Tim Yang: My understanding is that the resistance that Libra encounters is very large. Because we recently discovered that DCEP once used digital currency, it is a very big impact on the original system. Just like a centralized digital currency like DCEP, such as a merchant supporting WeChat payment, we can only pay with WeChat. However, the DCEP stipulates that if the user pays with any DCEP wallet, the merchant cannot refuse me. This is a policy change. Another change is technically, you can use a DCEP wallet to make electronic payments, because the bottom layer is open, and the balance of different wallets can also be transferred. Therefore, this is a big impact on the existing vested interests, including banks and payment institutions, and the original rules will be rewashed. So, I can imagine how big the resistance Libra has encountered.

Cai Kailong: I am different from Teacher Meng. I like to summarize my speech. When everyone talks about Libra, they compare it with the central bank's digital currency. We can take a step back and compare it with Bitcoin. One to the left and one to the right, the middle man is struggling. On the left is Bitcoin, which is completely decentralized. Currently, all digital currencies are decentralized to the most thorough; on the right is the central bank's digital currency, which is the centralization of sovereignty; in the middle is Facebook's Libra. Its ideal is very full, it wants to be a global cross-border alliance, in fact its soul is to the left, but its physical body can't. It is a company of such a large size in the world. Everyone has complaints about it. It monopolizes all social activities. It has privacy issues. It must be supervised. Its body can only be tilted to the right, so it is about two kinds of thinking. Mutual struggle. The dilemma that Libra is currently seeing is the conflict between its ideal and reality, so it is making various adjustments. In fact, what Ms. Meng and Mr. Bai said is to give Libra a move, lower the requirements or become a means of payment.

Tang Xia Ling: You have a trick, how to break?

Cai Kailong: I think Facebook should be more decentralized. Because everyone thinks of Libra when they think of Facebook, Facebook is a centralized organization, it is too famous. Facebook is currently having a negative impact on Libra . Assuming that this alliance is made by other companies, it can be promoted faster.

Tang Xia Ling: Because Facebook is too famous?

Cai Kailong: Yes, I think it is too famous, but it is a big move.

Bai Shuo: I think this is a paradox. Without the participation of such a large organization, it does not have Libra, but with such a large body involved, it must take care of the right side, not just to the left.

Meng Yan: 1,600 institutions are in line. If this matter is reversed, if it is more strategic, it can actually make this thing smoother.

Tang Xia Ling: Do you not set such a high threshold?

Meng Yan: Don't let the regulators be so nervous.

Tang Xialing: Can you surround the city in the countryside?

Hu Jie: I don't think this issue is crucial. The tax issue is the most critical. The issuance of any currency is actually related to the taxation of a country, which is a fundamental problem. The authorities must have sufficient confidence in your currency issuance and operating system. It must be able to get what he needs. This is a "tax" that allows a country to control the currency in circulation. In fact, Facebook itself has not caused such a big sense of evil, I also believe that the Fed, including the Congress, does not have to kill it.

Tang Xialing: So you think you have to solve the tax problem?

Hu Jie: This is a problem that must be faced. If China engages in such cross-border currencies, it will also care about this issue. Logically, we can now solve it under the traditional technology system. It is only under the new technology framework, with 100 nodes, how the supervisory authority can obtain information, which is challenging but can be solved. Once this question is answered, I think it will be over. Other technical debates, decentralization, distribution, and who is leading are not problems. Now the dollar is infiltrating all over the world. If you take the wings of Libra, it can penetrate the world more quickly. Why not? It will definitely do it. But I can't destroy my previous system, especially my tax system.

Cai Kailong: When Xiaozha responded to the Congress, he said that if you don't let me appear, everyone will use tax evasion now. He puts forward a good point: he said that cryptocurrency is widely used in the gray area, I come to a Facebook Libra, which allows the state to supervise me and help the country increase taxes. So he put forward a very good point: I am not challenging finance, it is equivalent to bringing digital currency to a place that can be regulated in disguise.

Meng Yan: The key is how to let the country accept digital currency?

Cai Kailong: Xiao Zha’s point of view is very good. It is to find a perfect combination on the left and right. It is difficult to be here, and both sides must take care of it.

Bai Shuo: I think this is like this. What I just said is how to package. The so-called packaging is that you know that it is definitely money. It is just the digitization of money, but now a more terrifying trend is the monetization of numbers . The digitization of money is still money, but if it is the monetization of numbers, the technology develops to that step, you are very difficult to prevent, is a string of numbers, I do not go through any authority, I will walk through the process, this is The most terrible. I feel that the current technology has not yet matured. On such a mature day, what regulation is white.

Wu Xiao: I want to talk (smile, raise my hand). I think that supervision may be the means of attack, the cake will never be cut, and the young people will definitely have a lot of resistance. Xiaozha said that in 2019, many people have not used the bank yet. The society is so developed, it is not convenient enough, and the conservatives say that you have to accept supervision. You will launder money. In fact, it is a matter of cutting the cake.

Tang Xia Ling: Well, young people want to go up, Wu Xiao is 90. (applause)


Tang Xia Ling: Many people say that China will launch the Chinese version of Cibra. Our WeChat and Alipay also have a sea-going strategy. We also have the opportunity to contribute China's technical strength to third-world countries. The last question is to share your views on Cibra. .

Wu Xiao: I think Libra definitely has technical innovations that can be used by everyone. This is very good, and it is also open source. I think that Facebook, Huawei, and Tencent blockchain have some innovative technologies that can be applied. To put it bluntly, it is to apply their best technology to the areas we most urgently need, to create more convenience and help blockchains. So I think it may not be called Cibra, but it has penetrated into all aspects of our technology and absorbed its best places.

Hu Jie: (Raise your hand) I want to add a sentence about Cibra.

Tang Xia Ling: Yes, the word you made, you explain.

Hu Jie: If we only want to internationalize the renminbi, the best way now is to pay through Alipay and WeChat. It is electronic, very convenient, and very expandable. Going forward is OK. But why is Alipay not far away now? It is because the RMB does not flow freely . If the supporting assets of the bottom layer are still in the renminbi, it will definitely not go far. This is the first.

Second, what does Cibra mean? Cibra is saying that we want to create a new currency. The anchor behind it is not only the renminbi, but also some others, and this basket of currencies must be freely convertible. In this process, Alipay and WeChat can also play the role of the client. So the core difference between Cibra and Alipay is what currency you support, and whether the currencies you support are all freely circulated.

Tang Xia Ling: Yes, the currency is diversified and the RMB is only part of it.

Hu Jie: Yes, just like the US dollar. If Xiaozha conceives Libra's supportive currency as a single dollar, it is a dollar vest. Internationalization will not give a good impression. Many countries will resist it for this reason. If it uses a basket of money now, it will reduce the psychological barriers and political obstacles that many countries accept when they accept it.

Tang Xia Ling: Yes, what assets are anchored behind it is very important.

Meng Yan: The point that Hu Jie said is actually quite right, but I will add one to you. In fact, WeChat and Alipay are in a state of low tide in some countries in the past two years. For example, Nepal has banned the use of WeChat and Alipay. In some cities in Japan, WeChat and Alipay were very popular two years ago, but now it has become less. what reason? As Hu Jie said, Chinese tourists went to Japan to go to the Chinese shop to pay with WeChat, Alipay, and bought Japanese goods. The flow of funds for this matter completely bypassed Japan, so the Japanese government is very unhappy. As long as an order or call is made, against the merchant's access to WeChat Alipay, the whole situation will be reversed. We have seen many friends in China have mentioned that this is a good means or opportunity for the internationalization of the RMB. At this point, I have different ideas. I think it would be difficult if you can't come up with a more inclusive, fairer, and more shared mindset and design than Libra.

Bai Shuo: If you use DCEP to go out to sea, it is a bit misplaced, giving the impression of a dollar that rose during the year. If we want globalization, it should not be DCEP, but it should be another face of globalization , it is better to play a sign with different values ​​of the dollar. On the other hand, it is better to argue with Libra and to be more global. This is my opinion. The world is so big, it is not only a matter of Libra, but two things are also possible .

Tim Yang: I think that since there is already DCEP, there is not much Cibra in China. But on the other hand, if it comes to the demand for sea, Libra itself is an open system. If a company wants to develop overseas, I think it will be much simpler to use the Libra system if it is finally going out, because Libra itself is powerful enough to bring together global power, both technical and financial. So if a company wants to make overseas payments, it may be easier to use Libra. What will happen to its ecology after three years? It may be very different from the present.

Cai Kailong: My answer is very simple. There is only one word – impossible, absolutely impossible.

I think the essence of Libra is to challenge the entire central bank system. Why are so many central banks around the world so nervous? You think about which company can cover so many people, affecting all aspects of finance, and only Facebook's Libra, no country's central bank can give up the currency. So in China's current situation, regardless of DCEP or the central bank digital currency, I think it is impossible. why? There is one reason. If there is such a company, who will become the leader of the alliance chain? That must be a large institution such as Tencent and Ali. You can see that Tencent and Ali institutions already have Alipay, and the payment channels behind them are all managed by a network. In this environment, is it possible to have a Chinese version of CLibra? impossible things. Hu Jie: I have different opinions. Insert an example for the reference of Teacher Cai. In 1999, more than a dozen countries gave up their monetary sovereignty to form the euro. Today, more than a dozen countries are countries in the Eurozone. They outsource the issue of money to a contractor. They hang a brand called the European Central Bank.

Cai Kailong: This is national sovereignty. It is a chain of alliances with Ali Tencent. They are companies, completely different in nature.

Meng Yan: We think that you are not discussing the same thing. The Cibra we discussed is not issued by China, but is issued by China under the leadership of the “Belt and Road”.

Cai Kailong: So the Chinese version of Cibra is impossible, and I don’t know it overseas. As Meng Yan said, the international community has not developed so fast, so it is not the scope of our discussion. I have a question, Teacher Meng Yan, if Xiao Zao asks you how to save him, how to save? Don't hide and say nothing.

Meng Yan: I can't save it. I don't think it needs to be saved first. I agree with what Hu Jie said. This will eventually come out. Although many people hope that it will not come out, it will come out. This is the first. Second, if you look back, it is better to find a big Internet company to form a strategic alliance, and then provide a basic use for its Libra Internet points, called origin value. Just create a new country, you want to issue your currency, and provide a source of use for this currency, usually taxes. You accept my Libra points, and one of the origins is to pay advertising to me in the future, so people will naturally accept Libra and gradually use Libra points in various scenarios. By the time 2.7 billion people and 30 million programmers enjoy the benefits of this Internet point, what members of Congress, the regulatory level, who opposes who step down. So Xiaozha is still radical, and how to do it is how to do it.

Hu Jie: I think I can save Xiaozha. I think that all the hearings are not very important. What is important is that it will immediately come up with a technical solution, saying that the tax guarantee is OK. This article can be passed. Now everything is behind "I am out of control", especially my tax is out of control. Of course, it also includes a series of things such as anti-terrorism out of control, money laundering out of control, and others are nonsense. In fact, PayPal has already exchanged US$1:1 for points, which has been used all over the world, but Libra is now a basket of currencies, distributed management in 100 nodes around the world. As long as countries can control taxes, there is no problem at all.

Cai Kailong: I think that combining the views of Teacher Hu and Meng Yan, in fact, should be tried in a country before it can show its application scenarios, taxation and technology clusters. The supervision of each country is different, especially when the United States is so strong. But there is one country that is particularly interesting. It is possible to try it out. You see that all countries speak against it, and only one country does not speak – Japan. Japan is most likely because its bitcoin is a legal currency. It has accumulated a lot of anti-terrorism and taxation experience in bitcoin. It can be tested in Japan. If you make an effect and push it to the world, isn't it good, isn't it validating the two views?

Bai Shuo: What Mr. Hu said, the last iceberg wallet I told this morning will do this.

Cai Kailong: Today's discussion has become a rescue, and Libra.

Tang Xialing: Yes, but very regrettable, there is limited time on site today. Today's round table is very exciting, sparks are sparkling, and every time you communicate with the teacher on the stage, you will have something to gain. We carefully dismantled each of the sentences they just said, and in fact they can have some solutions, and then concatenating them together may help us improve our understanding of DCEP and Libra. Thank you all, today the round table is over.