Monday, October 17, 2016

US soap opera intermission and Trump conspiracies

Sou | 2:27 PM Go to the first of 27 comments. Add a comment
I'm sorry for the gap in articles. I've been sidetracked by real life. Also WUWT seems tame compared to the soap opera that is taking place in the US election.

The Trump Conspiracy Theorists

In case you missed it, this from twitter. First of all, Donald Trump Jr, who gets his soundbites from the uber-conspiracy blog Prison Planet:

The Clinton campaign didn't comment on that as far as I know, but it did notice how Donald Trump himself gets his sound bites from another uber-conspiracist, Alex Jones:

That's when he's not being an "unwitting" dupe of Vladimir Putin:

Vote early, vote often

Yeah - that's an old joke and I'm not serious, except about the "vote" part.

I expect most readers here are repelled by Donald Trump and his supporters. I also expect a few readers here aren't big fans of Hillary Clinton despite her being the most experienced, most prepared and best candidate for decades (at least). However if you think that a protest vote will do some good, please don't be naive. Read this article by Charles M. Blow, which he directed at young voters but applies equally well no matter your age. It's called "The Folly of the Protest Vote".

Think about it. Do you want Trump as President? Can you imagine the global chaos he could cause? Do you want Putin running the USA by proxy? Do you really want to have the "leader of the free world" a man with absolutely no government experience (apart from getting his accountant to prepare his tax returns)? Do you want Trump, who is not stable, knows nothing of government in America, nothing of foreign affairs let alone government and foreign affairs, interacting with leaders of hostile and (currently) friendly nations?

If Americans elect Donald J. Trump as US President, it will have ramifications throughout the world for a very long time. While I can't vote, I can urge those of you in the USA to do so.

Yes, I know it's not my place to tell Americans how to vote. On the other hand, the choice of US President affects the world way beyond US borders and for a very long time.

Remember Brexit. Remember Tony Abbott. Remember Al Gore.


  1. Even in states where the election is a given (like California) it's still important to make sure and cast a vote to ensure the popular vote is properly registered.

  2. Seriously, if you have a Kindle, just download a copy of Jon Ronson's short, quirky, and punchy 'The Elephant in the Room: A Journey into the Trump Campaign and the "Alt-Right"'.

    Ronson feels kind of responsible for Jones because it was his idea that they both bust into the Bohemian Grove (see 'Them: Adventures with Extremists'), and that escapade transformed Jones' rather battered tinfoil hat into a shiny coronet - overnight he became the King of the Conspiracy Set!

    (To give a flavour of the whole quasi-farcical quest - after much furtive speculation Ronson just walked in to the elite gathering with a friend and saw a bunch of jaded ultra-rich guys enacting a rather silly ritual; Jones decided he didn't trust Ronson - who may well have been NWO; wake up, Sheeple! - scrambled in through the undergrowth, and later claimed what he'd seen may have been a 'real human sacrifice'. You really could not make it up; at least, not like Jones does.)

    Jones is the author of some of Trump's most egregious Stupid. The COP's chosen rolls with people every bit as crazy as the most space-cadety of the WUWT crowd! This is what 'conservatism' has become.

    Ronson is terrified that this lunatic, along with some of the Trumpster Fire's other even-more-dubious associates, may well be forming some kind of cabinet early next year.

    As we should all be.

    1. D'oh! 'COP' = 'GOP'

    2. Thanks for COP = GOP


      NWO = ???

    3. New World Order, or for the alt-right: (((New World Order))).

    4. Indeed. Ironically Ronson himelf would earn the triple brackets from the 'Alt Right', similarly to Louis Theroux, who rather seems to have taken Ronson's approach and re-packaged it for a more general audience!

      Both of them have found themselves in highly uncomfortable situations when plying their 'fish out of water' trade among 'Alt Righters', which is apparently what we call neo-fascists now, when their companions have worked out that they're Jews.

      Frankly, they're both braver than I am: those people are genuinely scary and dangerous, and are getting scarier and more dangerous every day now that Trumpism has made them feel they can be mainstream again...

  3. Alt-Right is one of the scariest movements in a long time. It's been building on the fears and concerns of people for sometime but has emerged as vile, potentially violent, hateful. We've been seeing it in the most egregious of the AGW deniers but it is bigger. It will also not go away with Trump losing either. There are issues that we need to address. People have to believe their concerns are being heard. So much to fix in this world

    1. It certainly won't go away with Trump, and it'll get worse whether he wins or loses.

      But how do you 'hear the concerns' of people who just hate Mexicans and Muslims? Think the UN is planning a totalitarian world government, that Obama and Clinton are facilitating it, and that Agenda 21 is its spearhead? Think the election is being rigged by 'International Bankers' (((hint hint))) Think the climate data is being consciously manipulated? Think that AIDs was weaponised in a CIA lab?

      I get the bit about the concerns of the US working class, and those in the working class who imagine they're middle class. But getting routinely shafted economically - and that's undeniably true, and by the very same elements as they've hitherto acted as useful idiots for - is not an excuse for being a virulently dangerous fool.

    2. "It's been building on the fears and concerns of people for sometime but has emerged as vile, potentially violent, hateful."

      When you look at the personnel list of who's closest to Trump, they've basically been at it for over 20 years. They're the obsessed, downright vicious Clinton haters. And, of course, they've linked up with the white supremacists and other uglies. Both groups will link up with _anyone_ they think might advance their own agenda.

      (I never put it together like this until I saw Keith Olbermann's confession that he once dated Laura Ingraham. But only once. Personally I reckon he was pretty game to go anywhere at all with her, even if it was only once.)


  4. The latest Trumpism is voter intimidation.

    "Trump said to watch your precincts. I’m going to go, for sure. I’m going to go right up behind them. I’ll do everything legally. I want to see if they are accountable. I’m not going to do anything illegal. I’m going to make them a little bit nervous."

  5. He has also started the "stolen victory" "stabbed in the back" meme

    So beloved of fascist and demagogues everywhere

  6. Do you want Putin running the USA by proxy?

    The Russians are coming, the Russians are coming. The Democrats are just using the silliness as a blunt instrument to bludgeon Trump. American conspiracy theory at its most stupid?

    Putin did make one or two throw-away comments about Trump, probably as much as a joke as anything. Americans often do not understand subtle put-downs or ironic statements.

    The problem with the fairy tale of Putin supporting Trump is that I just cannot see any upside for Russia (or Putin, personally) in supporting a mad, loose cannon like Trump.

    Can you really see Russia in favour of a US Congress and Senate in the grip of a bunch of rabid tea-bagger Republicans who think this is still 1948 without the slightly sane and moderating effect of a president other than Trump?

    I suspect that Putin and his Cabinet are sitting around the cabinet table shaking their heads in disbelief and despair at the US presidential election. They are looking at a major world power with whom they need to deal, lead by a raving idiot or a recycled Cold War warrior.

    If anything they probably prefer Hilary Clinton on the principle of 'the devil you know ...". She is a dangerous, unreconstructed Cold-War warrior but Russia and the Soviet Union before, have dealt with Cold-War warriors in the past.

    In fact the recent comments by Vladimir Zhirinovsky in support of Trump seems to suggest that the Russians would prefer Clinton.

    What is the best way for Russia to support Hilary among axenophobic American population? Why to seem to support Trump. And the idiot MSM and mad right-wing rags, etc., have fallen for it. Clearly the US education system is in crisis; it is not even teaching the Brer Rabbit story!

    1. I agree with some of what you've said jrkrideau, and probably didn't express myself well. The risk is not Putin supporting Trump (as you say, why would he?), it's Trump supporting Putin. (Putin is only interested in messing things up to support his own agenda. He would class Trump as a useful idiot, if he thought seriously of him at all.)

    2. Dubya saw the USA lose its position as leader of the free world. One might argue that the damage has already been done, but Putin can hope for a further fall in US prestige if another clown gets the Presidency.

    3. Putin / Russia have a fascinating media strategy essentially designed to simply keep people (internal and external) guessing

      the theory is that if "they" don't understand what your goal / philosophy is "they" have difficulty in attacking or countering it

      the FT ran a headline recently that read "no one understands Russia’s policy in Syria"

      this phenomenon is examined in a short video by the BBC documentary film maker Adam Curtis


      and coincidently Adam Curtis has just released a new documentary on BBC's Iplayer - called Hypernormalsiation where he tries to weave a story that explains why we are where we are


    4. @ Sou
      I cannot really see Trump supporting Putin in any serious way simply because Trump is probably incapable of any serious, sustained policy thought and action---good or bad.

      Putin is not a fool and only a fool would rely on Trump for much though he might (easily?) con Trump in some short term ploys.

    5. @ Sou

      If someone suggested that George W. Bush was an Al Quaeda agent I might consider it.

    6. I agree with you in all respects except that I could see Trump furthering Putin's interests for the very reasons you've said.

      Trump wouldn't support Putin in any *serious* aka thoughtful way because Trump doesn't think. OTOH Trump is sympathetic to Russia, knows less than nothing about foreign affairs, and unless he has very diligent minders, he could quite a bit of damage from the US (and world) perspective. He'll have a Sec of State to possibly rein him in - and ambassadors, and Congress. Just the same he could do untold harm. I linked to one Foreign Affairs article above, and there are other articles, too.

      These aren't all about Russia. (I mainly mentioned Putin because of the video in the article.)

      United States would be a 'rogue superpower' under Trump, analysis says

      Caught between China and us, what Australia has to fear from a Trump Presidency

      50 G.O.P. Officials Warn Donald Trump Would Put Nation’s Security ‘at Risk’ - The New York Times

      (I wouldn't be surprised if the last ditch strategy of some in the GOP would be the idea that Trump would be impeached or worse fairly early on, and Pence would take over. Pence would probably do whatever he was told so is likely to be a bit safer.)

    7. Sou - there's no evidence that anyone can rein Trump in. Some of the alt-right around him - Bannon, eg - seem able to feed him ideas and talking points, but nobody's been able to curb his tweeting habits or prevent him from saying things that no sane person would do if they really wanted to be elected. Even in business his "style" is to do his own thing regardless of how much rational advice there is to the contrary. His new hotel in Washington DC is just the latest example.

      As for Pence, he might not get us into a nuclear war, but his beliefs would be disastrous economically and socially. "Some people say" that Trump selected Pence as insurance against impeachment by the Democrats; it seemed to me Pence almost guaranteed impeachment by the Republicans.

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  8. Speaking of parody, Australians here may be wryly amused by First Dog's poke at the ABC:


    He's even noticed the lack of impartiality displayed by HotWhopper's favourite ABC commentator, Chris Uhlmann.

    It's a dark day indeed when political interference in a national public broadcaster has reached this level of corruption of impartiality and objectiveness.

  9. @ Tadaaa


    I have not read it but it strikes me that Russia's policy in Syria is pretty clear. The Russians are out to destroy or cripple any opposition to the Assad regime and help restore a bit of stability in the country. They are not making any differentiation between ISIS and any so-called “moderate' opposition because they don't see any difference in them.

    The Russians do not want another failed state, infested with crazy jihadists in the Middle East, especially one that is practically on their border. Whatever shambles now passes for US policy in the Middle East was almost certainly going to produce a failed state if it did not actually create the promised ISIS Caliphate.

    I doubt that Putin or anyone in Moscow has a lot of affection for Assad and his thugs but Assad is as “legitimate” a head of state that one is likely to find in Syria at the moment. Given that Assad has been fighting a civil war for something like four years, he must have a fair bit of public support behind him. Said support may be a case of “Assad is utterly horrible but the jihadists are a lot worse” but it's still support.

    After Afghanistan, Iraq and Syria, it is fairly clear that sweeping away an established dictator or authoritarian regime with no clear alternative power structure prepared to step in is a good way to chaos.

  10. To paraphrase Mencken - "As Republican politics is perfected, the office of presidential candidate represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the party. On some great and glorious day the

    right wing folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright degenerate thug."
    Mencken also said "Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard." I agree.
    "Do you want Trump as President?" We deserve what we desire.
    "Can you imagine the global chaos he could cause?" We deserve it good and hard.
    "Do you want Putin running the USA by proxy?" As opposed to Mitch "We're working to insure this presiden fails" McConnell, John "Well never approve any of Hillary's Supreme Court nominees"

    McCain, Paul "Trump is a dangerous demagogue and sexual predator but I'm supporting I'm anyway" Ryan or Governor Pat "Michael Hughes or Chaz Bono have to use the women's bathroom to

    protect our women & children privacy from pedophiles and predators" McCrory running things? Putin's not likely to countenance another 50+ votes to overturn Romneycare 2.0(or as Republicans

    imagine it, "Obamacare")
    "Do you really want to have the "leader of the free world" a man with absolutely no government experience (apart from getting his accountant to prepare his tax returns)?" Well, he offered Kasich

    complete control over foreign AND domestic policy, so he knows how to delegate.

    friendly nations?" Trump famously said about gun control "I do carry, on occasion. Sometimes a lot. I like to be unpredictable". Replace his handgun with the nuclear football, and what could possibly go wrong (that we don't richly deserve)?

    I'm voting for Trump. His, and our, time has come.

    1. Yeah, Mencken's 'White House adorned by a downright moron' quote has sprung to mind rather a lot during the current presidential season.

      I hadn't seen 'deserve to get it good and hard', but I'll certainly remember it! However, not all 'the people' deserve Trump, surely?

      Mencken would be seen, in the light of current politics, as an Alt Right fellow-traveler himself, though.

      Still, the great quotes often come from unlikely sources.

      For instance, the counter to Mencken (and Plato) comes from that grand old imperialist Winston 'uncivilised tribes' Churchill; 'Democracy is the worst poltical system we have, apart from all the others'. I strongly agree.

      But I think we may be about to find out that, as it finally turned out, he was wrong about 'the Americans can be relied upon to do the right thing, after they have tried everything else'...

    2. The other quote that's never far out of mind is J.S. Mill's 'Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservative'.

    3. It is very simple. The GOP have spent twenty years making up absolute crap. They have been helped by fox news and other online mis informers.

      These low information voters have been nurtured for years only to be stolen by a demagogue like Trump.

      My prediction is that with Trumps urging the so called GOP voters will not vote all the way down the ticket.

      The Democrats may even win the Senate and the Congress. Time will tell. Bert



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