Anybody work at the Big Four Accounting firms in real estate advisory or valuation?
Currently work in IA at a bank, but want to get into real estate.

Would anybody be willing to talk about their experience working in one of the real estate focused Big 4 departments?
[{"id": "ik6uddp", "text": "I knew a guy who worked for Deloitte in their Real Estate consulting group (not valuations - more strategy for large public real estate owners or non-profits doing development). \n\nHe left because the pay was low relative to similar (development management in his case) roles at buy side firms and they grind you on hours and workload like any Big 4 role until you hit partnership. \n\nIf you want to be an appraiser, I'd probably chase a job at CBRE, JLL or Cushman &amp; Wakefield. The accounting firms are secondary players in the appraisal space and their reputation reflects that.", "replies": [{"id": "ik6w841", "text": "I\u2019m not totally sure i want to be an appraiser\n\nTrying to understand the difference between the real estate advisory and the valuation (i know this is mainly appraisal) groups at these firms\n\nMy other thought was to apply to financial analyst positions at CBRE, JLL, etc\n\nI live in Charlotte which seems to have a decent amount of RE jobs, but not a ton", "replies": [{"id": "ik6wu7s", "text": "If you want to learn CRE as fast as possible and have the most pivoting options, I'd go for a FA role at the major brokerages. The volume of deals, the access to market information, and the exposure to clients and brokers all add up to a massive advantage over a role of similar seniority at the Big 4. You could easily pivot to a role in asset management, finance (particularly with your banking background), or even acquisitions if you were keen. \n\nThe Big 4 are obviously very reputable and prestigious firms in general but the reality of CRE is that they don't have that much exposure outside of niche consulting cases (usually for non-CRE clients looking for guidance on a CRE project) or valuations work for their existing clients (often public companies that happen to own real estate as a function of their business).\n\nEdit: to answer your question, the Big 4 treat RE Advisory and Valuations interchangeably in my experience but in some markets they have consultants that specifically focus on non-appraisal real estate cases, usually functioning as development, portfolio trimming/restructuring or occupancy strategy consultants.", "replies": [{"id": "ik788q5", "text": "This was really helpful, appreciate the insight", "replies": [{"id": "ik807v7", "text": "B4 firms are huge and typically offer a wide range of offerings - in terms of the RE Vaulations side the practice specializes in RE valuation from the lens of M&amp;A among other things. When a company acquires another company there\u2019s typically a real estate component in the transaction (along with personal property, goodwill etc.) the RE team is responsible for valuing all of the real estate within that transaction for the company to report the fair market value on their fixed asset ledgers. \n\nWhile the b4 are not typically writing the 100 page valuation of one property. They're much more versed in valuations in varying situations and are typically brought in to validate 3rd party appraisal valuations and the assumptions they use. \n\nAnd to the point above, firms can treat staff interchangeably but once there, you have the opportunity to request the project you like to work on.", "replies": [{"id": "ika4alc", "text": "Did you work B4 RE?", "replies": [], "depth": 6}], "depth": 5}], "depth": 4}], "depth": 3}, {"id": "ika3wbh", "text": "I've worked at a Big 4 doing real estate advisory. It will differ my location and firm but my experience was mostly Purchase Price Allocations (ASC 805) or PPAs and then some advisory and consulting. The pros were travel (including international) as well as high end clients (lots of Fortune 500) great relationships and a good resume builder. The cons are that it's best as a stepping stone, for analysts all that matters is billable hours and your managers could provide little to no guidance/training. Also, your experience will depend a lot on location and luck. You could get staffed on a huge project abstracting 5,000 cell tower leases for a year and then leave out of frustration.\n\nAs you've already been advised, if you want valuation experience then go to a large brokerage and leverage those people and clients. You will absolutely get the exposure you want. Just wanted to second this and provide some first person experience.", "replies": [{"id": "ika47tq", "text": "Thanks for the insight. I am not necessarily looking to do valuation, just trying to figure out what the best path to a 150k-200k RE job is\n\nHow much traveling did you do when working at B4?", "replies": [{"id": "ika5i32", "text": "If you are that open to it then Big 4 can be a path of you were to enjoy it and stick around. The end goal is to be a Principal/Partner and essentially get paid buku buck to maintain client contacts and do as little work as possible.\n\nExperienced Managers in major cities and Senior Managers can make that salary from my experience. And the benefits are pretty awesome and depending on what team you have a lot of leeway with expensing happy hours with the team. BUT, like I said it's a lot of billable hours, administrative work having nothing to do with real estate, and a ton of politics. For me I prefer a more entrepreneurial platform and to focus on what I enjoy. Also fuck time sheets...\n\nI was working in a major west coast city and I traveled at least once or twice a month. It was fun, but got old trying to balance workload and charge-ability on 15 hour international flights. If you interview I would ask about travel because I knew someone at another firm that never traveled and only worked on confirming and supporting assumptions in client models and appraisals. If you want to live that \"Up in the Air\" lifestyle for a year or two and pad a resume it could be worthwhile, you make lots of good connections. But if you have a more specific path goal in mind like acquisitions, development you may be slowing yourself down.", "replies": [], "depth": 5}], "depth": 4}], "depth": 3}], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "ik6uujq", "text": "Accounting firms are going to grind you out for billable hours.", "replies": [{"id": "ik6vz3v", "text": "That\u2019s fine with me, just looking to jump start a real estate career", "replies": [{"id": "ik6zcwj", "text": "I wouldn't do it at an accounting firm, but that's just me.  More like slow start, but you'll learn some fundamentals.", "replies": [{"id": "ik786pr", "text": "What would you recommend?", "replies": [], "depth": 4}], "depth": 3}], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "ik76ec1", "text": "I got trained at C&amp;W worked at IRR, 2 local shops and NGKF and now at a national appraisal only company.  There\u2019s not too many Big 4 places left after Arthur Andersen got acquired. Deloitte and who else?", "replies": [{"id": "ik785un", "text": "Deloitte\nKPMG\nEY\nPWC", "replies": [], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "ik7pwi9", "text": "Why not skip that noise and join an investment firm, or any one of the reits? They have entire departments dedicated to valuation and deals.", "replies": [{"id": "ik7rerg", "text": "Definitely open to those as well", "replies": [], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "ik7tzq8", "text": "What happened to the big eight?", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "ik8v8yu", "text": "I have a coworker that just came from KPMG working on advisory RMBS and CMBS deals. They essentially just confirm and refine data that we send to them. Not very fun stuff. Now he work on the advisory side in the Transactions Analytics department of our investment bank.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}]