First week at Marcus &amp; Millichap - need serious opinions….
Let me first start off by saying I have ZERO experience in the world of real estate (residential or commercial). My parents have owned a couple of multi-housing properties for 35+ years, but that is their story, and about as close as I can relate. I’ve made a new account just for privacy purposes - in relation to what I am about to discuss.

I came in here thinking it was a great opportunity to to be introduced into CRE. The regional manager did inform me and told me I would probably not having any income for the first year so I did appreciate the transparency. I didn’t know what to expect coming in, and I probably should’ve researched more before accepting the “job,” because now I know.

I had zero clue the entry role here is essentially a telemarketer job. Sure cold calling is apart of this real estate industry, but holy hell — I did not know you basically had to go through, at least, a year of it before progressing. And then after all that work — come to realize you’re just handing things to a senior advisor. You’re pretty much working your ass off to throw an alley oop to someone else.

My question is: is it worth staying? If anything, I may just finish their training program and bounce. Are there any CRE entry level jobs at any other firms that actually pay? I know there’s gonna be a start everywhere, but I highly doubt all entry level CRE jobs at firms are strictly cold-calling.

Basically: is there such thing as paid CRE entry-level jobs at any firm?
[{"id": "is1y8qf", "text": "I\u2019ve interviewed a couple companies and one did have a salary option. Although it started at 24k a year which isn\u2019t enough to live off where I am. Right now I am working another job part time while getting started. I have been in the business for a few months now and starting to work with my third clients and have done little to no cold calling. (I got these clients from referrals from residential agents).", "replies": [{"id": "is2kk0x", "text": "24k is better than 0.", "replies": [], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is1ybz6", "text": "Hey, I am currently in a paid, entry-level-ish job for a large production homebuilder as an acquisitions analyst. I had several internships in small CRE brokerages. When I was looking for employment out of college and applying to CRE Brokerages, I had the same issue as you, where it was expected that I would make no income for a year and spend my time cold calling. I made the decision to go the analyst route to get started, and I am very fortunate and lucky to have found the role I'm currently in as it pays well and is giving me a wealth of experience. \n\nAny kind of real estate analyst job should be relatively entry level. I am unsure how many real estate companies would be actively hiring right now though...", "replies": [{"id": "is57bdr", "text": "My entry level job in CRE was in property management. I\u2019ve seen analyst roles but never quite understood what they do. So can you explain what you do? Is there any customer interaction? Are you remote? TIA", "replies": [{"id": "is5iz50", "text": "I am currently remote, but we just leased our new, very small branch office. I have zero customer interaction, I work directly with a small team of 3 people to acquire land for my company as efficiently as possible (cost controlling on price) and forecasting predicted expenses and cashflows if a piece of land were to be bought and built on.\n\nI think of my job as being on a small brokerage team, with a single, very hungry client. We have to pitch land deals to executives and convince them it's a good idea to go forward with the purchase, as we are compensated with a yearly bonus based on the amount of land acquired. I spend a lot of my time making executive summaries to explain why and how a property is a good deal, including stuff like schools, retail nearby, any planned road improvements, demographic data, etc.", "replies": [{"id": "is6rh6p", "text": "Well heck I can do that. I do that to some degree when doing research for my own jobs. You like it? Does it get \u201cboring\u201d and you don\u2019t have to mention specifics but how is the pay? How did you find this position?", "replies": [{"id": "is6wzs4", "text": "I enjoy it personally, the team is very welcoming, kind, and understanding of my learning process. Even the executives (which I met recently) are all very down to earth and easy to talk to. Nobody looks down their nose at those with lower ranks. I even got advice on how to go about buying my first home from a VP! I don't find it boring as every day there are new parcels to pursue, or offers to make. As for pay, I get 75k base and an annual bonus consisting of a company wide performance bonus, and a bonus based on land acquired within our market. When I was hired I was told this bonus would be around 35k, but that was based on hitting all Acquisition targets for this year (which we did not, our office has been around less than a full year and thus didnt have time to create a deal flow). \n\nI found the position on LinkedIn, I mass applied to probably 200 financial analyst and real estate related positions once I graduated with my degree in finance. Leading up to graduation I was interning at a small CRE brokerage with the expectation I would be brought on as a junior broker, but they ended up not seeing sufficient demand to hire me on. Very glad I found this position instead, it has been far more financially and educationally rewarding than if I had been brought on as a broker at the company I interned with. DM me and I can share my LinkedIn!", "replies": [{"id": "is805w9", "text": "I love this!", "replies": [], "depth": 6}], "depth": 5}], "depth": 4}], "depth": 3}], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is27559", "text": "I've been a CRE broker for about 5 years now and will preface by saying that I am with a smaller firm but a strong firm with a great reputation locally. We do a great amount of business and are small enough to be flexible in what areas of the industry we work in, projects we take on both professionally and personally, etc. \n\nMy advice for you, assuming you're willing to smash the phones and bust your ass for a year... Get out of M&amp;M. Like you said, you're going to be a telemarketer calling on warm leads for a year and anything you find isn't actually going to be yours. You're working for THEM, for zero dollars. Go find a smaller local shop that will allow you to test the waters of whatever property type(s) you want, offers some training, but ultimately lets you work for yourself. If you're making no money, but building up your contact list and pipeline for your benefit, that's worth a year of little to no money. If you're building up THEIR pipeline and contact list, then in a year you're still passing deals to a senior broker for a small fraction of the fee... you're wasting valuable time. It took me 7 full months before I got a dime in commissions. But guess who kept that check when we got paid. Here's a hint... it's me. \n\nIf you want to be a broker, go be a broker. Don't waste time with an analyst or property management role. You'll still be getting paid shit. Go eat what you kill and you'll thanks me (and yourself) in three years when you've got a healthy pipeline and nobody skimming off the top of every check you get. With all that said, anywhere you go, the company is going to take a piece so be realistic in your expectations. \n\nHope this helps!", "replies": [{"id": "is2b4r5", "text": "Coming up on my first full year in the business which I chose a small local firm. Couldn\u2019t agree with this more. Find a small that provides a bit of training. I had some leads provided for small stuff and got to do the grunt work on some bigger stuff for a piece of the action which helped me learn a lot. Other than that I am out building my contact list that is 100% mine through networking and other means but I have zero obligation to make tons of cold calls all day for someone else\u2019s benefit. I worked part time at night for the first 9 months or so to survive but have done decent enough to survive.", "replies": [{"id": "is2bso4", "text": "Fuck yeah - Keep it up!", "replies": [], "depth": 3}, {"id": "ix1631x", "text": "What prospecting techniques have worked the best for you?", "replies": [], "depth": 3}], "depth": 2}, {"id": "is2d8h6", "text": "I agree, while some people have stellar success with Marcus and millichap I agree with the sentiment that if you\u2019re going to be just cold calling for a year and not making money either way, why not spend that year cold calling for your own book of business rather than someone else\u2019s?\n\nFind a firm that will train you and hopefully give you a mentor, even if they are involved in the deal commission-wise, if they\u2019re a good mentor it is more than worth giving up a bit of the fees on deals they assist you on. You\u2019ll learn so much more with a smaller brokerage in my opinion. Cold calling is a boring, but necessary part of the work, however the more important part is being able to close the deal and work it and if you\u2019re handing everything off after contact, you\u2019ll be missing out on that vital experience.\n\nI work for a very small, but established firm and do enjoy it. I\u2019ve had the opportunity to work on deals I wouldn\u2019t have otherwise and gained years worth of knowledge by being able to see deals through from intro to completion. It\u2019s a tough business and it is uncommon to make much in your first year or so, but stick with it, work hard and it can be a very rewarding career.", "replies": [{"id": "is3so9z", "text": "No mentor, big or small firm, will give up fees to their junior for nothing......", "replies": [{"id": "is3utcb", "text": "Not quite what I said. I stated it would be worth the mentee giving up part of their fees in order to be mentored and have assistance on their deal.", "replies": [], "depth": 4}], "depth": 3}], "depth": 2}, {"id": "is2klpx", "text": "Awesome advice. I really appreciate it.", "replies": [], "depth": 2}, {"id": "is3sihh", "text": "Spent 5 years at M&amp;M. You work under a senior for good reasons, mainly this is grown up money in the millions, no client will trust a new agent with their net worth.\n\nDepending on what they can negotiate, a new agent under a senior will make around half of the commission IF THEY PROCURED THE BUSINESS.", "replies": [], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is2gbz6", "text": "OP, most sales job requires you to be on the phone. Everyone here seems to have something against Marcus &amp; Millichap but I'll bet every single one of them that no company offers the level of training and industry knowledge of your seniors at Marcus. Yeah commission split sucks and people eventually leaves but I am so confident in that if you are starting out, there is no better place to learn. I worked on deals with my seniors in the 50 million dollars range, which most of these boutique guys don't have a chance on. Marcus is how you make it, take advantage of what they teach you and choose your own path once you learned enough.\n\nEdit: I might be biased because I am not in it to be a broker, I just want to learn.", "replies": [{"id": "is2kbb4", "text": "Don\u2019t get me wrong, I KNOW that I\u2019ll have to be on the phone\u2026 no doubt about that. But since I am new to this field, I wasn\u2019t sure if ALL firms have you solely cold-calling during the so called learning process. I would much prefer to throw in some other roles in addition to cold calling. Research, analyzing, etc \u2014 and also be paid for it (not expecting a lot but anything is better than nothing).", "replies": [{"id": "is2p4sd", "text": "As far as I know, the answer is no. Consider other careers and I\u2019m not saying this to be sarcastic or mean. This job has an 80% turnover. Chances are you won\u2019t make it. If you do, then more power to you.", "replies": [{"id": "is2simk", "text": "Don\u2019t worry, no offense taken. I expect nothing but the truth and I definitely appreciate your input.", "replies": [], "depth": 4}], "depth": 3}], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is2kobm", "text": "OP here. Half of me wants to stick it out, the other half thinks I am wasting my time. It\u2019s tough.", "replies": [{"id": "is3k8s3", "text": "Can you stick it out to make a full year and then re-evaluate?", "replies": [], "depth": 2}, {"id": "ittgr94", "text": "Stick it out. The cold calls will shape you into a fearless man that can accomplish anything", "replies": [], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is2pwby", "text": "Are you on a team?? If not make sure you join a team, just going off on your own day 1 is extremely difficult. If you're truly just hitting the phones under no direction of any team then it's worthless. If you are on a team cold calling then that's a different story and unfortunately is cutting your teeth.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is2vltz", "text": "So for a while I was in a similar boat: what I suggest is that you use every single tech/ social media thing that exists to your advantage because that will put you in the forefront and light years ahead of other brokers. There are several CRE marketplaces where you can post the deals you get from M&amp;M clients and you can find lenders that way as well, that way you can reduce calling time that holds you back.\n\nObviously this isn\u2019t a one day solution but I tell you it makes a difference", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is312am", "text": "Quit", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is344kh", "text": "You should just quit now", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is37jdn", "text": "If you can tough it out at M&amp;M for 3-4 years, you can be successful. \n\nIf are afraid of cold calling and doing work for free, you\u2019re not going to make it in this industry. \n\nMake the calls, get the leads, let your senior help you close them and get a few transactions under your belt then decide what you want to do. \n\nCold calling is the life blood of any new brokers business. All successful brokers were cold callers at one time and most still cold call. I\u2019d just get used to it and learn to love it", "replies": [{"id": "is3sujm", "text": "Incredible advice, one I followed myself with great success!", "replies": [], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is3cs0l", "text": "Take it with a grain of salt as I have no experience personally working at Marcus. But I know people who praise the training and foundation Marcus gave them before they left. Learning to work the phones is a invaluable skill. Stick it out a year if you can afford too and take advantage of the training then switch companies after a year if you still feel the same.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is3ozqe", "text": "So you\u2019re just making $0? That can\u2019t be right. What if you kill it and get the seniors you\u2019re working for a bunch of deals? You get no cut or what\u2019s the actual pay here? \n\nThat said, a lot of people work as analysts on a team to start and eventually move to the brokerage team and get draws. So there\u2019s def way to at least make some money as an entry level person. I don\u2019t work for M&amp;M or anything but I have seen people on this sub say they just use them for training then move along.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is3qcxq", "text": "OP- it\u2019s a grind and if you aren\u2019t down for this journey, why bother? There are a lot of facets of real estate, figure out how to get a salary bonus job- work at a bank and learn how to underwrite property cash flows and learn the business and figure out from there.  Brokerage is great if you are a rainmaker and sucks if you aren\u2019t.  You will see at M&amp;M real quick that it\u2019s probably 3 guys that make millions and 35 that probably live deal to deal.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is3v0o7", "text": "I work for a large CRE firm. Regardless of pay, day-to-day responsibilities, and your overall future in the business, your immediate mentor and team is the most important factor dictating your future success. If you don\u2019t admire the team you work for, and if you don\u2019t consider the lead broker to be a mentor who cares for you like family, leave and go find a better team at a different firm. If you feel what I described about your current team and mentor, stay and grind it out.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is3z7nu", "text": "I feel I owe it to myself as well as all of you to re-phrase/elaborate myself, so here it goes....\n\nIn my OP, when I said \"actually pay,\" I meant are there firms (big or small) that actually pay as in offer more than $0. Hell, I will take minimum wage or the price of flipping burgers just to get my foot into the door of CRE. Regardless of how I feel about M&amp;M, it's bound to happen. How long will it take is the real question? And I know that all falls back onto myself. I am paving my own road, if you will.  \n\n\nFrom a general standpoint, it DOES sound silly. \"Why would you grind out 8-10 hours a day just to not be paid?\" or \"that sounds like a pyramid scheme/scam\" are some of the opinions and remarks I've gotten. \n\nFortunately for myself and the time being, I can realistically afford, or live, for a year -- maybe even two -- with no income; although the latter is not ideal.\n\n&amp;#x200B;\n\nFrom a M&amp;M standpoint, and from what I've noticed - their \"puppy mill\" mentality is a way to cut out the people who are not meant for the gig. Meaning: if you don't have the heart or mind to be hustling and making phone calls, TRYING to find work, you will not make it. Now I don't know if they necessarily dismiss people for their performance; but how many people are going to NOT notice if they are made out for it after a year, at minimum? That part itself is common sense I believe. It sounds like not many people make it through a whole year, with some leaving midway or slightly after.\n\nNow from what I've also heard and read, it seems not all M&amp;M offices are the same. Some REQUIRE senior advisors to split a fee while other offices don't require them to do so (it's entirely up to them, hopefully they have a heart -- can be rare in this industry it seems). \n\nFINALLY, in my case, my regional manager has been great. All the other \"agent candidates\" have all been friendly and helpful so far -- I really have no complaints. Most of the time I feel like reading Reddit before going into my first day sort of tainted my mindset. Fortunately, my regional manager did tell me that our senior advisors MUST give us a cut. Now whether that's 1% or 5% of what they get -- who knows?\n\n&amp;#x200B;\n\n&amp;#x200B;\n\nI honestly think I will just ride it out since I am fortunately able to do so. I just wanted to make sure that there were other entry level jobs at big firms that offered - at the least - minimum pay. I mean hell, I would do data entry or be an analyst for a firm if they did offer that and it got my foot into the door \\[of CRE\\].\n\n&amp;#x200B;\n\nThanks for the input so far everyone.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is42gvq", "text": "OP,\n\nI started at M&amp;M a couple months ago. My biggest takeaway is the the team and office you are in will be a factor in how well you do. Join a team and product type you enjoy and like being around. My time cold calling has been spent half my own book of business and half my teams. Have fun, use the people around you as resources, and soak up as information you can. Best of luck!", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is43au1", "text": "There has been a lot of discussion in this sub about M&amp;M.\n\nBut the answer to your question is yes - other shops invest in you as you invest in them. (Yes you get paid)", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is43nn6", "text": "I think the M&amp;M model is dumb. You have people calling potential clients who have no fucking idea what they are talking about. (Not their fault, since they are new.) and kicking those leads up the ladder.\n\nA far better model is a team that has more business than it can handle that needs to refer simpler business to junior broker (with supervision).", "replies": [{"id": "ismrhmt", "text": "This is the way. Find a team that needs someone to handle the deals that they don\u2019t want to work on. Do those deals (with help from the team) and work to build your own book.", "replies": [], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is45q4z", "text": "Congratz on the first lesson: this is a pyramid scheme that eats dumb young kids.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is48hfx", "text": "Fug has a perfect answer. The only thing I could chime in is that brokerages are very City/market dependent but (my anecdotal experience is that) M&amp;M is a bottom tier shop in my market (Philly) and I have seen more success come from the couple boutique brokerages rather than M&amp;M with the top shop still obviously being CBRE", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is4c0ag", "text": "So a newbie makes cold calls for a year\u2026how many deals realistically close from all this effort?", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is5oyad", "text": "The truth is there are principals that will walk in the other direction the second you tell them you\u2019re a marcus broker.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is5x0w4", "text": "Is it just me or are M&amp;M commercial real estate listings always crap deals for a buyer? Way too aggressively priced I\u2019ve always thought.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "is8k6ls", "text": "it's possible. or it WAS possible, it's a little different economic atmosphere right now.\n\nColliers is kind of like a functional MM (I'm aware this is going to upset some people haha), but they're known for being hyper lean...less support staff, not the best paying firm for salaried staff, they hire on associates heavy on commission with a low base. But there's some base and decent benefits. A lot of the associates I knew had to cold call, but anecdotally one of the guys there started at MM and said it was not as bad. A lot of the smaller \"big\" firms have this model too.\n\nI know JLL and CBRE will hire salaried fresh associates. Our team hired someone at $90k/year plus a low commission split. So you're sacrificing commission for security, and a little more balanced work life...it's more of a training program. And it's cheaper for a team of high earners. \n\nThe guys at MM I knew that did well tolerated the cold calling but did serious grinding to find connections outside. You don't make money from cold calling but I guess if you convince an entire workforce of unpaid labor to do it all day, you'll get some wins. Haha. But you're definitely going to need to grind just as hard after work if you don't have any connections.\n\nSo I guess my advice is - look for top teams. Easy \ud83d\ude02", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "itmyrfv", "text": "This is why I would never consider joining Marcus or any big shop lol \n\nOne year ago, I joined an unknown 4 person multi family advisory. They agreed to pay me a $50K salary for the first 1-2 years to help me get established. Last month I closed my first deal and my second deal is scheduled to close in two weeks. I was the lead advisor on both. All-in compensation will $150k-$180K.\n\n\n^^^That doesn\u2019t happen at Marcus or CBRE", "replies": [], "depth": 1}]