How Good was Donald Trump as a real estate investor/developer? What did he contribute?
I have heard that he was really good when he first started and made a handful of really successful deals take place before things started to go bad with casino investments and the recession.

Does anyone have some insight to what he was like as a real estate investor/developer? Have you met anyone in the industry that has said Trump's reputation in CRE was good or bad? What did he do? Did he have a process?

I don't want this to turn into a political debate by any means, I am legitimately curious of his talent or lack of talent he had when he was a "real estate guy", before all the reality TV stuff.

Thanks.
[{"id": "diyxaj0", "text": "Theres a good documentary on him done sometime in the 90s that covers his RE and business dealings. His sister (who is a federal judge) had some interesting comments on her brother. I believe its on youtube here: https://youtu.be/JkWjeIu6FT8", "replies": [{"id": "diyxaom", "text": "SECTION | CONTENT\n:--|:--\nTitle | Biography : Donald Trump (Documentary)\nDescription | He is a modern Midas who has elevated the business of deal-making to an art form and came to epitomize a glitzy, greedy era, only to see his fortune and fame threatened by changing times. By the age of 40, Donald Trump was one of New York's most successful real estate developers. The epitome of '80s glamour, he had a high profile wife, a lavish lifestyle and public adulation. But as the decade ended, it seemed that his luck went with it. Here is the story of his incredible rise, decline and impr...\nLength | 0:45:53\n\n \n\n \n \n \n****\n \n^(I am a bot, this is an auto-generated reply | )^[Info](https://www.reddit.com/u/video_descriptionbot) ^| ^[Feedback](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=video_descriptionbot&amp;subject=Feedback) ^| ^(Reply STOP to opt out permanently)", "replies": [], "depth": 2}, {"id": "diyzbl2", "text": "Cool, thank you!", "replies": [], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "diz2hk6", "text": "This isn't something I'm prepared to delve into in much depth (it's late) but I've been stewing on this ever since he first announced. Donald Trump isn't any good. When you look at his accomplishments and those of his organization, even a mediocre developer would have done much better given his resources and connections in New York throughout the past three decades. He hasn't done much in way of development in the past two decades, really (licensing deals don't count) and his braggadocio suggest profound underlying insecurity about his position and the way he views his own success. His projects suggest absolutely no vision for how a city or company should operate, his projects were never remotely innovative and it should be noted that his buildings (and his gaudy apartment) are stunningly dated and tacky. \n\nI was eating dinner with a man named Blake Eagle, founder of the NCREIF index and one of the elder statesmen of institutional real estate investment, when the subject of Donald Trump came up and he mentioned that on one of the boards he served on (this one in New York) all the other members had nothing but bemused scorn and contempt for Trump, who was viewed as a carnival barking fraud. None of them had any business dealings with him, he had no formal ties to any capital markets (that now makes more sense to me given what we're learning about his ties to shady Russian capital sources) and the people who had met him socially thought he was a fraud. If Trump were half as creative, talented or rich as he says he is, he would have been running a company that would put the likes of Hines, Related or Forest City Ratner to shame. Instead, he has some golf courses, a failed gambit to sell steaks, and a fraudulent get-rich-quick scheme labelled as a \"university\". He's not interested in real estate, only self promotion. \n\n\n", "replies": [{"id": "diz2hkw", "text": "Hello, I'm a bot. I see you have mentioned Trump's golfing problem.  The current Trump golf count is at . . . **28**. . .costing US taxpayers a total of **$40,171,600** . More data about his excessive spending at my [*Trump Golf Counter*](http://www.golfwithdonald.com). The exact locations and dates of his golf trips can be seen [*here*](http://trumpgolfcount.com/displayoutings).", "replies": [], "depth": 2}, {"id": "diz375a", "text": "Right, I was kind of suspecting that. Thanks for sharing the story about your institutional colleagues, that is interesting. I have heard this before from other redditors and have heard Mark Cuban talk about attempting to talk real estate with Trump and he didn't really have much to contribute to the conversation. \n\nMy suspicion was that he was handed an enormous opportunity, his dad's company (wikipedia claims he was made president of the company at age 25, wow!) and he performed decently for a few years (perhaps being in New York and having many multi-housing properties helps your odds!) and then his real estate deals started going down and he turned more into a celebrity. Given the lack of details about his real estate strategies, I even suspect his early successes could be attributed to him deferring to senior management as he was basically just a kid out of college with a formal title. \n\nI would love to hear anybody correct me if I'm wrong, it would be kind of cool to see that he was a CRE fundamentals nerd when he was younger and understood markets, tenants, demand, etc. but I can't find any notion of that being true. \n\nLike I said, I'm totally not trying to start a political debate, I'm not a fan of Trump but would totally defend his CRE acumen if someone presents me with evidence.", "replies": [], "depth": 2}, {"id": "diza6i7", "text": "This pretty much nails it. I will say one thing though, when he built Trump tower, I don't think people thought it was unimaginative or anything other than a beautiful building. Also, I believe he does own the building in Chicago And i can tell you, it's stunning. Grabs your attention from the river like nothing else. \n\nOne other thing to add, he leaves a wake of destruction behind every project. Unpaid contractors burnt bridges with government officials and scorn from lenders. He gives us all a bad name. ", "replies": [{"id": "dj04zk3", "text": "That's the thing though, he didn't build or develop that. He just licensed his name too it.\n\nMy fathers a developer that started with nothing, built gas stations by hand with his partner and now he builds high end multi family mixed use projects worth 30+ million after only 25 years. If he would have started with 400 million when he got going in his career he would be worth around 20 billion now. Trump has way underperformed that industry and his wealth has grown at market rate which is bad for a growing company.\n\nHe would have made the same amount of money, probably more, if he just left the money his dad gave him in index funds.", "replies": [{"id": "dj0ae9h", "text": "Ehh...Trump actually started with 14 million loan...but never-the-less. IF someone would have given me a 14 million dollar loan in 1975, i think i could do well too....", "replies": [], "depth": 4}, {"id": "dj0wwnz", "text": "No, I agree with you. I thought he owned building in Chicago. Maybe not. ", "replies": [], "depth": 4}, {"id": "dj8bms6", "text": "No he built the tower in Chicago. the trump organization didn't have particularly good returns on it - they had to work out the debt with the lenders. My understanding is that they barely made it out alive. ", "replies": [], "depth": 4}], "depth": 3}], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "dizn16y", "text": "Trump is a better marketer than he is a real estate developer. ", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "dj018mx", "text": "He has real estate assets worth billions, so yeah he's pretty successful.\n\nClaiming he's not successful because some of his projects didn't work out is pretty laughable. ", "replies": [{"id": "dj053yj", "text": "He claims he has assets worth billions. We don't know where his debt is either. He also doesn't own the buildings that bear his name.\n\nIn addition, given the context of him starting with 400 million at a very young age, he has done very poorly. For context it would be like getting handed 1 billion dollars at age 30 today.", "replies": [{"id": "dj0auoi", "text": "he didn't start with 400 million...it was a 14 million loan. But yes, i agree,...as a developer, he could have gone further (but, he also had a shitty economy and other BS happen ....SO wtf).", "replies": [], "depth": 3}, {"id": "dj38rn4", "text": "We do know where at least most of his debt is from. Business insider included the links to his 15', 16' and 17' financial disclosures. Im sure its not comprehensive and this is not granular by any means but it gives you an idea.\n\nhttp://www.businessinsider.com/trump-financial-disclosure-report-2017-6", "replies": [{"id": "dj3992k", "text": "It really doesn't give me an idea because there is no assurance those documents are accurate they aren't real legal documents. I would need an IRS tax return to know true debt and they still won't disclose his overseas debt.", "replies": [{"id": "dj3c6vi", "text": "Fair enough.", "replies": [], "depth": 5}], "depth": 4}], "depth": 3}], "depth": 2}, {"id": "dj0hn4e", "text": "Perhaps the title of my post was misleading. There is no doubt, by any comparison, that he is very wealthy. Even if he had just $10 million, as opposed to billions, he would still be extremely wealthy by most standards. \n\nMy post's objective was to crowdsource any information anyone had on Trump's real estate vocabulary, so to speak. Does he approach an investment or development with the same kind of domain expertise as someone like Warren Buffet when he looks at an investment? Perhaps, Buffet is an extreme example, very few are quite like him when it comes to the breadth of knowledge he has but I think you get my point.", "replies": [{"id": "dj0ow4f", "text": "In a word, no. Like many, I was hoping that the lynchpin of his career would mean enough to him to be conversant in the basics of what development should be about (housing policies, urban planning, finance, architecture, etc) and I've been bitterly disappointed. To me, it looks as though he hung up his spurs after the casino debacles and has played it safe on the sidelines ever since with his silly marketing ploys. His hotel company is an outgrowth of his marketing work and isn't much to be proud of. What's most disappointing to me is that with rudimentary organizational know-how (delegating to employees that aren't servile or related, for example) he could have made something great with his superior advantages. An opportunity lost. ", "replies": [{"id": "dj38vjl", "text": "The most real estate intensive interview Ive seen of him is this one...\n\nhttps://youtu.be/0-w47wgdhso\n\nHe doesnt seem like an expert but definitely somebody who knows some fundamentals. I wish I could find more info on his analytical abilitiew he had at one time.", "replies": [{"id": "dj38vlc", "text": "SECTION | CONTENT\n:--|:--\nTitle | Donald Trump 1980 Interview\nDescription | One of the earliest television appearances of Donald Trump. Predates the construction of Trump Tower.\nLength | 0:04:07\n\n \n\n \n \n \n****\n \n^(I am a bot, this is an auto-generated reply | )^[Info](https://www.reddit.com/u/video_descriptionbot) ^| ^[Feedback](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=video_descriptionbot&amp;subject=Feedback) ^| ^(Reply STOP to opt out permanently)", "replies": [], "depth": 5}], "depth": 4}], "depth": 3}], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "djplvim", "text": "He lost the GM building which I take to be a huge blow to his credibility.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}]