Best non-traditional places to find real estate talent to hire?
I work for a large national private developer based in their Atlanta division and we're expanding like most in this sector though we seem to have hit a brick wall when it comes to finding talent.  We have been looking for almost every position ranging from land development manager to builders to PM's and have not been able to find many good candidates.

We have hired some recruiters with some luck, but not interviewing enough candidates let alone filling roles as fast as we need and are even looking at people in other fields we can bring over and train. Our pay and benefits are fantastic, even prior to Covid, with an 8% 401k match, employee stock program (given to employees based on performance and not purchased by them), a 6 week paid sabbatical,  etc.. (I cannot count how many people we have with 15 to 20 plus years with the company because of everything that is done for us)...

Anyone have any ideas on where we can look or what we can do/offer to attract more candidates?  Curious to hear what others are doing or seeing out there that is working.
[{"id": "hs8e66h", "text": "Might try underwriters/portfolio managers from commercial banks in your area.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hs8fekw", "text": "Are you looking on LinkedIn? Probs an obvious spot but thought I'd ask. I am job searching now in this area and have been finding most of the companies/openings that way and it seems like most of the companies I talk to have a decent pipeline of applicants through that.\n\nOne other thing I have seen work well is to offer incentives in house, for example if an employee recommends someone and they last 3 months they get $200, if they last 6 months then another $200 etc. \n\nAlso I may be interested in applying to your company", "replies": [{"id": "hst6k6y", "text": "I work in residential mortgage. My company offers 5000, 2000 or 1000 to employees depending on role referred.", "replies": [], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hs8gflg", "text": "Have you looked for candidates in other markets who are willing to relocate?\n\nI know or some experienced guys in the NYC area that would probably find the idea of moving to Atlanta compelling.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hs8hliw", "text": "Everyone is staffing up and looking to fill mid range positions. Your good benefits might not be enough to pull experienced development talent that have the choice to go anywhere. Work life balance is king now. I work for a regional developer and we have blackout periods 3 days a week from 12-1:30, no work on Fridays after 1:30pm, unlimited PTO, food benefit, massage benefit, work from home furniture allowance, and hybrid two days a week in the office. Health care is also no contribution. I wouldn't work somewhere that is counting my PTO hours.", "replies": [{"id": "hs8xx48", "text": "I work 8-5, 5 days a week, for a private CRE investor. For nearly 7 years, I have managed all aspects of the portfolio (approx. 200,000SF of mostly retail space) and assisted on all brokerage listings. I had to threaten to leave to get a nice pay bump, more in guaranteed bonuses and performance payments, and more time off (as I am expecting a second kiddo in April) and after reading your comment, it isn't enough.", "replies": [], "depth": 2}, {"id": "hs95qbv", "text": "You hiring!?! LOL Sounds like they have it figured out. My guess is your company doesn\u2019t have any issue at least getting people interested in at least having a conversation.", "replies": [{"id": "hs9nc5e", "text": "We have a solid team but even with all that its still tough to hire an experienced multifamily development manager that is capable of running 2-3 deals a year. Pay and benefits from two years ago no longer gets it done.", "replies": [], "depth": 3}], "depth": 2}, {"id": "hsa59gn", "text": "100% this. I\u2019m in the development space for a global firm. I work from home (office I can go to if I want), have unlimited PTO, 401k match, stock options, bonus payout was almost 2x last year, etc. I\u2019m done driving into an office 5 days a week. I won\u2019t even consider roles that require it. WFH has been life changing for my overall balance. I\u2019d leave my role, but it would take something extremely compelling when it used to only take a little bit better.", "replies": [], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hs8i1xx", "text": "You aren't offering enough. \n\nI know that probably doesn't feel like its the case but it is. If you were, you'd get plenty of applicants. As a note, I just had one of my staff bring me a blind offer that was sent to her: $125k starting, $50-75k hiring bonus, up to 100% salary match bonus for hitting metrics, dental, vision, medical, 401k etc.\n\nThis was for a regular escrow officer position, not even a manager or senior closer. The CRE labor market is INSANELY tight right now. You have to offer absolutely insane salaries to pickup anyone who is currently employed. And if they aren't employed, there is likely a reason.", "replies": [{"id": "hs9569j", "text": "\ud83d\udc46is right. If your pay and benefits are \u201cfantastic,\u201d you should have no problem at least getting them into the top of the recruiting funnel to have a conversation.  If once you get them in the funnel, and you are taking weeks/months and 6+ rounds of interviews to get them to the offer stage, people won\u2019t put up with that right now.  Especially if you get to the end of the process and the \u201ccompetitive\u201d offer is 5% over what they are making.  You may have to lead with some salary range and bonus info at the start of the process to get people excited.  The days of \u201cbUT wE HaVe a GReaT CuLTUre!\u201d are gone for right now. Have your recruiters ask these candidates why they are dropping out: is it pay/bene\u2019s/they want remote/etc? People will tell you if you ask in a \u201cwe want to be competitive way.\u201d", "replies": [{"id": "hs9teo6", "text": "I will add another comment here. I keep an eye on job listings to keep my own salaries competitive. I don't even look at listings without a salary range because I know no one in the job market will look at them either.", "replies": [], "depth": 3}], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hs8lsor", "text": "Merger and acquisition, combine with another company and you bring over all their staff. Of course there will be culture and fit problems, but that seems like an expensive clumsy way to solve this problem. \n\nThis is brainstorming, so no wrong answers. What about lowering your standards? Do you have a training program or do you expect everyone to already know how things work? \n\nHow did you get in this situation in the first place? Did your company fire a bunch of people first chance they got at the start of the pandemic only to do a 180 six months later? \n\nGood luck,", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hs8r69x", "text": "Maybe finance or banking?", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hs8tqys", "text": "Any links to job postings? We'd be able to tell you if you're offering enough money.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hs8zaxx", "text": "I'm a recruiter for a large global developer. I do most of my recruitment in the Bay Area. It's a warzone out there right now for Analyst/Senior Analyst and equivalent level roles. I have a much easier time sourcing Director level candidates right now than Analyst/Sr Analyst level ones. Every single developer is interested in hiring right now. Candidates have tons of choices.\n\nTo be competitive you will either have to overpay, offer full remote working, or have a project to put them on that is incredibly prestigious. You might have to do all 3 in some cases. \n\nIt should also go without saying that you have to be proactive in recruiting right now - in a different market you might expect an applicant good enough to get the job but most of the time at the moment you have to go poach them/entice them directly.\n\n&amp;#x200B;\n\nCan speak on this more if you have any follow up questions, I've been doing this for about 10 years.", "replies": [{"id": "hsa8xfs", "text": "On the other side of the table, do you think analysts with a couple years of experience should take advantage of this hot job market by switching jobs now? Do you think it will cool down for analysts/senior analysts recruiting? Or will they continue to be high high demand for the next couple of years?", "replies": [{"id": "hsa9sw9", "text": "Switching companies after 3-5 years as Analyst is a great way to get a substantial raise. There are exceptions but if you stay at the same company for 15 years your wage is likely to lag behind a peer who has made 2-3 moves in that same time. \n\nUnfortunately I can\u2019t tell the future, it depends on market conditions so your guess is as good as mine.  We are hiring like crazy right now though.", "replies": [{"id": "hsajjg5", "text": "Thanks for the insight. Do you think it\u2019s more valuable to stay internal and get promoted from an analyst to a senior analyst. Then try to switch companies for a senior analyst or associate role right after? \nWould that outcome yield getting the highest salary?", "replies": [{"id": "hsat79r", "text": "Most companies won\u2019t give you the promotion to senior analyst as a new hire unless you already had the title previously. Probably best bet is to get promoted first and then make a move.", "replies": [], "depth": 5}, {"id": "hsb7a8y", "text": "I recently switched from a \u201csenior analyst\u201d role at one company to a \u201csenior multifamily specialist\u201d role at another company making over twice my previous salary. When I told my boss I was leaving, she tried to convince me to stay by saying I could move up to a management position for what would have amounted to a 40-ish % raise. Unless I were to have worked my way up to Principal or Partner, there is no way I could have gotten a similar pay bump at my previous company, and that promotion would have required far more of me than I\u2019m willing or able to give. \n\nI also disagree with that other posters comment about a new firm not giving you the higher title when they hire you. If that company really needs you, the hiring manager may have to give you the higher title that offers a salary range commensurate with what you require. My last two job changes, early-2019 and late-2021, both came with higher salaries and a more senior position. In my recent move, I even told the person who hired me that I was going to be unable to fulfill what seemed like an important bullet point on the job description. It didn\u2019t matter - stepped up the ladder and 2.5x my salary.", "replies": [{"id": "hsfgobi", "text": "It's certainly possible to get the title bump as part of the move, particularly if you are moving from a bigger/prestigious firm to a smaller/less prestigious one.\n\nBut generally speaking, its wise to get the promotion first before making the move, especially if you're less than a year away from the promotion.", "replies": [], "depth": 6}], "depth": 5}], "depth": 4}], "depth": 3}], "depth": 2}, {"id": "hsabyud", "text": "As a recruiter, what skills and attributes are you looking for specifically for in demand roles at development firms?\n\nMy background is in retail, but I\u2019m realizing the minimal advancement opportunities and lack of benefits at the boutique company I currently work at won\u2019t cut it forever. \n\nI\u2019ve assisted in sales of land for large master planned communities (100-1200 acres) and always found it interesting, however my focus was the marketing and sale of the land.", "replies": [{"id": "hsad5uz", "text": "Yeah that's not really going to set you up for a role at a developer, at least the one I work for. Our Analysts (we call them Associate Dev. Managers) are going to be working more on front-end development - entitlements, permitting, gov't affairs, some finance work around modeling and pro-forma prep.", "replies": [], "depth": 3}], "depth": 2}, {"id": "hsd0bfx", "text": "Are you guys sourcing talent from Canada as well or is it purely domestic? I've been weighing my options for director roles south of the border as the pay is significantly better, but have been unsure of where to start (manager in a big 4 real estate advisory team with a background in appraisals, portfolio management and development advisory). How would you suggest I start pursuing opportunities in the states?", "replies": [{"id": "hsdr2ie", "text": "TN visas are fairly easy to come by. I personally haven\u2019t hired a Canadian since Covid so im not certain what might have changed due to it, but if it\u2019s business as usual you can apply as your normally would.", "replies": [{"id": "hsds5nh", "text": "Appreciate the insight, I'll have to start seriously cconsidering applying down there.", "replies": [], "depth": 4}], "depth": 3}], "depth": 2}, {"id": "hst4h3l", "text": "What's the pay in recruiting/headhunting at your level and industry?", "replies": [{"id": "hsu93p0", "text": "Are you asking me how much money I make or asking me about the people I hire?", "replies": [{"id": "hsudxwc", "text": "**YOU**", "replies": [], "depth": 4}], "depth": 3}], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hs959if", "text": "Try posting on select leaders and do LinkedIn searches for credit analysts at banks. If the salary is six figures, there is a good chance the banking people will leave (at least I did).", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hs95bmm", "text": "Can almost guarantee you are drug testing indiscriminately and a large pool of professional cannabis users are simply ducking you. This is assuming your pay and benefits are in line like you said.", "replies": [{"id": "hs96uwc", "text": "I've considered this and think you are right.  I can't believe companies still do this in 2022.", "replies": [{"id": "hs9gcdi", "text": "I know OSHA positions can't skirt this requirements but your white collar jobs need to ease on the drug testing (at least for THC) so you can actually sort qualified candidates. Even very moderate users will avoid you out of fear of testing negative, and being put on some sort of \"list\"", "replies": [], "depth": 3}], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hs969e9", "text": "ACRE has a line on accelerator graduates, you could try reaching out to those people directly", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hs97xbv", "text": "What's salary+ bonus for analyst, senior analyst and associates?   If you can't find talent I'm guessing you're too low.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hs9wkt8", "text": "You should recruit at urban planning programs. irrc Georgia Tech has a good one. well-rounded for real estate / Econ dev/ housing/comm dev.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hsaay54", "text": "I am hiring for similar roles around the country and Atlanta specifically. It is hard work and we\u2019ve seen some crazy requests. There is no one answer, but we\u2019ve had some success poaching some folks from architects or contractors. They tend to see a role into development as being a move up closer to the top of the food chain and have some background that lets them jump in and be helpful even if not fully trained or experienced in development directly. Also we typically have less issues with salary demands from architects since they are normally underpaid as a profession to begin with. \n\nAlso if you find an easy answer also let me know.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hsathmv", "text": "I'm a development project manager specializing in acq, underwriting, entitlement and site plans, but I decided to quit my previous job due to unacceptable COVID policies. Now I'm doing entitlement consulting and waiting out the COVID authoritarianism; I don't want to work for a large 100+ employee company that's happily gearing up to implement unconstitutional/immoral vaccine mandates.\n\nI would consider a small company or a company that was willing to stand on principle and defend their employees' rights. Meantime I'm in no hurry. Consulting and working on starting my own business so I no longer need to depend on wage employment and its attendant HR nonsense.\n\nI'm just one person, but thought I'd give my 0.02 since I work in the exact position you're hiring for. I'd make sure to get what I'm worth too, but for me current HR stuff is paramount; there's no price at which I'll sell my dignity or my autonomy over things that are none of my employer's business (for context, I live/work under the diktats of CalOSHA).", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hscrvgq", "text": "I\u2019m not in CRE on the employment side; I\u2019m only a small time investor.  However, my industry, like most right now, has had the same problems finding experienced, quality new hires.  \n\nA true game changer for us was incentivizing current employees.   The thing is, regardless of someone\u2019s job, almost everyone knows what recruiting firms and agencies charge, so offering a current employee a few hundred bucks, or even a few thousand, when looking for a credit analyst, senior developer, or almost any $100k+ salary position is the equivalent of Taco Bell offering their people a $20 gift card, or a $0.10/hr raise; no one pays attention to it enough to matter. \n\nAll of our employees know, at least generally, what every position within our company pays, and how much we  pay outside recruiters when we hire someone.  \n\nThe game changer is we pay the referring employee (as well as our 1099 subs) $5k after the referral is there for 30 days, and 10% of the new hire\u2019s\u2019 base salary if they make it 180 days.  If the referrer quits during the aging period, we STILL pay them (so long as there was no theft/embezzlement/etc).  If the new hire quits or is fired, the referrer gets nothing. \n\nWe started this in January of 2021, and quit advertising jobs externally in august.  We went from being short staffed by about 18% to 0.  \n\nAnd yes, that absolutely means that our lowest paid employee in the company, our receptionist at our Houston office, got a check for $35k when she referred our coo to the company and they lasted 6 months.", "replies": [{"id": "hst8bhc", "text": "Give that receptionist a promotion and train her, she could clearly be doing more", "replies": [], "depth": 2}], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hujmck6", "text": "UF MSRE program or similar.", "replies": [], "depth": 1}, {"id": "hvkzgog", "text": "Are you looking at Project Managers form General Contractors for your DM positions?", "replies": [], "depth": 1}]