And they believe that our souls and the souls of animals and plants and every living being is eternal as well, that it's always existed. Nobody created the soul. They also believe that there is something called a jiva, which is basically matter and time and space. And they believe, Jainists do, that just like there's laws of the universe when it comes to matter, time and space, there are laws of the universe that apply to our souls. These are inescapable. There is no God that is going to save you from these natural laws that we're going to call and they're going to call karma. There is only your soul and the karma that attaches itself to your soul.