# Talk:Save scumming
save scumming can get pretty crazy when you find the bones file of your player

If savescumming makes NetHack worse, isn't NetHack worse than other RPGs?
Isn't the following basically a value decision?  "There are many roleplaying games that allow you to avoid death by saving and restoring your game. By savescumming, a player is missing out on the true fun of the game, at which point NetHack is far less superior to any other RPG available."
Basically, if that point is valid, then that makes nethack inherently inferior to other RPG's using the following logic
1) Other RPG's give you the ability to restore from a previous saved game (in fact, MOST of them do).
2) Giving nethack the ability to restore from a saved game gives it a feature that other RPGs have (established in 1)
3) Giving nethack a feature that most other RPGs have makes it inferior to other RPGs (follows from 2 combined with the original premise statement)
4) Restoring from a previous save is a feature that most people actually like rather than dislike.
5) Adding a feature that people like to nethack makes it more inferior (4 combined with 2 and 3)
6) If adding a feature you like to nethack makes it inferior, then the game itself must be inferior.
Basically, there seems to be a "purist" or "orthodox" or "religious" view in nethack where unless you play it the way other people like to play it, you are somehow not really playing it.  I find that attitude to be annoying.  Instead, the nethack people should say something like "We feel that you will have a stronger character and enjoy the game better if you do not save scum, but we allow you the freedom to do so if that's what you want to do."
— Preceding unsigned comment added by 211.223.188.53 (talk • contribs) 

I think you're misreading the sentence you quote. The statement isn't that savescumming makes NetHack inferior to any RPG, it's that it reduces the scope of its superiority.  Instead of being vastly superior, it's "far less superior" (presumably now only a little bit superior).  Yes, the whole thing is a value judgement; and could probably be better phrased as something like "NetHack is at its best when played as the designers intended, with permanent death."--Marcmagus